# Changing Kibble, Suggestions Anyone?



## yvonneglen (Sep 20, 2008)

I have just recently returned to posting here after a long hiatus (due to new baby, a human one ) and am in the process of trying to get Bacchus squared away with his ailments, food problems, etc. that we have been experiencing over the last several months.

If any of you have read my other posts about Bacchus you know that there may be a problem with his thyroid (waiting for his panel results) or some type of digestive/malabsorption problem and are in the process of getting him the correct help after much in-fighting with our current vet (who will be former very soon).

I have for the most part used whatever the breeder uses on their dogs and have never had a problem. My last two GSD that I had were on Abady (that horrible dirt-like food w/the raw meat) because that is what that specific breeder used and I have never experienced any problems with Kodiak and Image during their lifetime when eating it. We changed breeders and this specific breeder uses Royal Canin, so we went with that.

Bacchus thrived on the R.C. puppy maxi food and once he turned 15 months I switched him over to R.C. G.S. 24 (did think twice). Around March. He was not crazy about the food but I kept watched and figure he was just a picky eater. He would eat it but not with any kind of zest.

Since we are having problems at the moment I have decided to take a serious look at what he eats, what it's made of and even put him on part raw supplement snacks. I did a review on R.C. G.S. 24 and found several bad reviews, one that really bothered me about how his dog had a hearty appetite after R.C. changed their ingredients (which I had no clue because by the time they had changed it I had just started using it) he found his dog had lost weight, the lackluster eye sparkle, diarrhea, etc. and ended up in the hospital, etc. So I am thinking perhaps it's time to do a change of his dry food and am looking for suggestions.

Evidently (Use of corn, wheat, or soy which cause *skin irritation, hair loss*, fever, ear infections, kidney failure, liver failure. dental disease, obesity, *chronic digestive problems*, bloat, heart disease, *IBD*, Cushings Syndrome, and *hyperthyroidism*.) which royal canin has. It's my fault that I did not research his food properly and should have done so more efficiently but with a 4 yr. old and a baby I trusted our breeders choice (not that it's her fault either). I think the G.S. 24 just does not agree with Bacchus. He loved the R.C. puppy food and when I switched over I noticed a change in him...over the months. Now I am not saying R.C. is the total cause but what I am reading on this product I an *NOT* liking. And am going to change it tomorrow (weaning him off R.C. G.S. 24) so I need suggestions. Any help or suggestions are welcomed. Please keep in mind though that there maybe a thyroid and/or digestive/malabsorption problem with my furry son when giving me recommendations.

Thank you so much...


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

I agree on wheat and soy, I wouldn't use a food with them but corn is a different story so long as its used a source of carbs and not protein. Non GMO human grade corn gelatinized properly is a good ingredient. The corn myth will just not go away. If you really do work your dogs, I mean work them then corn is a very supportive ingredient. 

There is no scientific evidence whatsoever that corn is more allergenic than rice.

Moreover, if you have a hard keeper a little corn will keep them in good weight.


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

Orijen - It's the flat out best food as far as kibbles go. No corn, no soy, no junk, and plenty of meat. 

It's a little pricey, but it's the best.

Orijen


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

Lucy Dog said:


> Orijen - It's the flat out best food as far as kibbles go. No corn, no soy, no junk, and plenty of meat.
> 
> It's a little pricey, but it's the best.
> 
> Orijen


Agreed. I switched to Orijen a couple of weeks ago. In Germany we pay over 70 Euros for the big bag but it's worth the money. 

Also, you don't have to feed as much as with other brands and in the end you are paying the same money. 

Before I switched to grainfree food I used to feed Pedigree and their big bag didn't last a week and I had to get four or five bags in a month. With Orijen it's only two big bags per month and it's the same money I'd spent for five bags of Pedigree. 

That is something a lot of people don't think about. They only see the price and decide to go for the cheaper food but at the end of the month you sometimes pay more for cheaper food than for the more expensive high quality food.


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## yvonneglen (Sep 20, 2008)

Mrs.K said:


> That is something a lot of people don't think about. They only see the price and decide to go for the cheaper food but at the end of the month you sometimes pay more for cheaper food than for the more expensive high quality food.


Cheapers brand may cost even more in the long run after the medicine, vet visits due to the poor quality of the food. I'd wish I had done my homework after switching Bacchus from his R.C. puppy food to the G.S. 24 especially after they changed the ingedrients. If I had done a 10 minute search I would have found this out.

Orijen received 5 scoops on Dogfoodcoop.com as well as dogware.com and dogfoodproject.com. Thanks for the recommendation. Are they any other sites that you would recommend for as a "watchdog (no pun intended) for dog food products. I had just read California Natural which I heard was great was brought over by Proctor and Gamble I believe and its 5 scoop rating went down to 2 immediately. So much to follow. :crazy:


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

*canidae*

If you wanna stay with kibble, I would feed Canidae, it is half the price of Orijen. With the $60 you save every month you can buy mountains of high quaility raw products to supplement. 

Orijen is a good product, but the cost is outrageous for a dry food. It is also kind of a gimic, IMO.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

sable123 said:


> If you wanna stay with kibble, I would feed Canidae, it is half the price of Orijen. With the $60 you save every month you can buy mountains of high quaility raw products to supplement.
> 
> Orijen is a good product, but the cost is outrageous for a dry food. It is also kind of a gimic, IMO.


i get orijen for $68 for a 30 lb bag. canidae would have to be $8 a 30 lb bag to save me $60 a month....since either last my one dog a little over a month...and i think she is talking about one dog.

canidae grain inclusive is just a typical average protein grain heavy food with nowhere near the meat content as orijen.......i think canidae grain free is a decent food for its price and comes closer to being comparable with orijen, but it certainly isnt 1/2 the price of orijen


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## GSD MOM (Apr 21, 2010)

I just changed my two over to Taste of the Wild. They are doing great on it. I know it's not the "best" grain free out there but it is a lot better then what they were getting. They both LOVE it.


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## rjvamp (Aug 23, 2008)

I recommended Kumpi to Selzer when her dogs had issues and hers did great on the food and the issues she had resolved. I've been using it for the most part since the recalls. 

I happened upon Nutrisource PureVita and got some samples as snack treats for them (you know training and stuff) and they went hog wild over it. So I'm slowly switching them since that is what they want now and the ingredients are very good (it is not a high protein food like an Orijen or Acana) but still very good. My cats also went crazy over the grain-free chicken from Purevita. And so far my cats have done a cold switch - very unusual for them and they have not thrown up! It is agreeing very well with them and I have some sensitive tummy cats! My dogs same way - I've been trying to slowly switch but they keep eating the PureVita out of the bowl first. Poop is good :wild:

Hopefully you will find out what the blood work says and you can figure out the best route. 

Congrats on the baby!


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## GSDSunshine (Sep 7, 2009)

My vote is Acana  (seems to be what I have been harping lately! lol)

Why I like Acana:

1. It is a very high quality, highly digestible kibble. 
2. If it grainfree, and high in protein. 
3. I only need to feed 3 cups daily instead of 4 on Orijen. (idk why)
4. A 29.7 lb (13.5 kg) bag of High Prairie costs 49.99 and last over a month. 
5. If I pay a bit more (54.99 or 58.99) I can switch up flavors with fish or Lamb.
6. Dakota loves meal times. 
7. I like a little extra cash in my pockets.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

roxy84 said:


> i get orijen for $68 for a 30 lb bag. canidae would have to be $8 a 30 lb bag to save me $60 a month....since either last my one dog a little over a month...and i think she is talking about one dog.
> 
> canidae grain inclusive is just a typical average protein grain heavy food with nowhere near the meat content as orijen.......i think canidae grain free is a decent food for its price and comes closer to being comparable with orijen, but it certainly isnt 1/2 the price of orijen


 
Canidae is 75 cents a lb with the frequent buyers program Orijen is $2.30 a lb. I assumed more would be fed. I guess my point which is still valid is that price differential can be used on green tripe, hearts, yadadaddadad to mix in. Canidae ALS Grain Free is $1.15lb where I live.

Don't be so quick on the meat content in Orijen, the company does not publish the amount of protein from animal sources and potatos, sweet potatos and peas add something to the total.

It is a good food but I could take any number of solid kibbles and make a better food easily by adding some fresh meat for way less money.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

sable123 said:


> Don't be so quick on the meat content in Orijen, the company does not publish the amount of protein from animal sources and potatos, sweet potatos and peas add something to the total.
> 
> It is a good food but I could take any number of solid kibbles and make a better food easily by adding some fresh meat for way less money.


orijen does state what % of their product is meat source. others have posted correspondence from orijen stating the % of total protein that comes from animal sources (dont remember the number, but it was a high majority).

heck, even canidae grain free states that "80% of the total protein is derived from meat". most of the high protein, grainless kibbles are going to be in that neighborhood.

nevertheless, i completely agree that using a less well regarded kibble and adding fresh animal products will always be a better canine diet than any kibble alone.......as long as the feeder knows how to balance things out if the kibble is no longer the majority of the diet. i most definitely dont pretend that my dogs are getting anything akin to fresh meat from eating kibble, which is why a large portion of my dogs diet is raw.


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

sable123 said:


> *Don't be so quick on the meat content in Orijen, the company does not publish the amount of protein from animal sources* and potatos, sweet potatos and peas add something to the total.
> 
> It is a good food but I could take any number of solid kibbles and make a better food easily by adding some fresh meat for way less money.


You couldn't be more wrong. It says directly on the front of the bag exactly how much meat content there is. 70% meat, 30% fruits and veggies, and 0% grains.

Canidae (which i used to feed a while ago before they changed their formula without letting anyone know) is very grain heavy. It does start with a few meat meals, but is followed by about 8 grains. It is a very grain heavy food. Canidae on the otherhand, does not publish their meat and grain percentage on their regular ALS formula for, in my opinion, obvious reasons.


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## Gib Laut (Feb 21, 2010)

Lucy Dog said:


> Orijen - It's the flat out best food as far as kibbles go. No corn, no soy, no junk, and plenty of meat.
> 
> It's a little pricey, but it's the best.
> 
> Orijen


Yes, what she said!!lol.....and no GMO or ethoxyquin...

To me, the company, it's beliefs, standards and location of food sources, is of equal importance. There is no comparison between this company and large scale conglomerates who manufacture anything from diapers, toothpaste, soap and bottled water, along with their dog food. There is a reason why it costs more and it is true, you get what you pay for. If you are going to supplement with fresh food, you will use even less of the Orijen and I feel it would be worth the benefit. 

My two cents.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Lucy Dog said:


> You couldn't be more wrong. It says directly on the front of the bag exactly how much meat content there is. 70% meat, 30% fruits and veggies, and 0% grains.
> 
> Canidae (which i used to feed a while ago before they changed their formula without letting anyone know) is very grain heavy. It does start with a few meat meals, but is followed by about 8 grains. It is a very grain heavy food. Canidae on the otherhand, does not publish their meat and grain percentage on their regular ALS formula for, in my opinion, obvious reasons.


 
No you are wrong. That is the percentage by weight. The veggies do contribute protein and the company does not break out protein by animal source vs plant.


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## rjvamp (Aug 23, 2008)

GSDSunshine said:


> My vote is Acana  (seems to be what I have been harping lately! lol)
> 
> Why I like Acana:
> 
> ...


Extra cash is ALWAYS nice!

I like that they give the % on the bags - there is NO guessing. I don't need to know the exact % per meat, but I like seeing the % of OVER ALL meat. That is very cool. There is nothing to hide when they are that open. 

Someone also mentioned in a prior post that the lower the % of protein then the higher the grain or other ingredient than meat. So you can't have mostly meat in a bag if the % of protein is low. I mean 33% protein based on meat ingredients is more meat than 23% protein based on meat ingredients.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

roxy84 said:


> orijen does state what % of their product is meat source. others have posted correspondence from orijen stating the % of total protein that comes from animal sources (dont remember the number, but it was a high majority).
> 
> heck, even canidae grain free states that "80% of the total protein is derived from meat". most of the high protein, grainless kibbles are going to be in that neighborhood.
> 
> nevertheless, i completely agree that using a less well regarded kibble and adding fresh animal products will always be a better canine diet than any kibble alone.......as long as the feeder knows how to balance things out if the kibble is no longer the majority of the diet. i most definitely dont pretend that my dogs are getting anything akin to fresh meat from eating kibble, which is why a large portion of my dogs diet is raw.


 
If you wanna see shiny coat and muscle tone, as well as bone white teeth, feed Green Tripe.


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## rjvamp (Aug 23, 2008)

From Champion Pet Foods website: Champion Petfoods | F.A.Q

While there are many differences between ACANA and ORIJEN, both diets reflect our belief in “Biologically Appropriateness, and “Fresh Regional Ingredients”.

Five of the main points of difference are summarized below:


*MEAT CONCENTRATION*: ORIJEN is made with 70-75% meat ingredients while ACANA has between 40 to 65%, depending on the formula.
*AMOUNT* OF PROTEIN: ORIJEN diets range between 38% and 42% protein, while ACANA features protein levels of 29-34%.
*AMOUNT* OF CARBOHYDRATE: ORIJEN diets range from 18-22% of carbohydrate, while ACANA diets are typically in the 28-30% carbohydrate range.
*AMOUNT* OF FRESH MEAT: ORIJEN is made with 28-35% of fresh meats, compared with ACANA which ranges from 9-15% of fresh meats.
*VARIETY* OF FRESH MEAT: ORIJEN contains a minimum of 5 fresh meats, compared to ACANA which contains 3 different fresh meat ingredients.
Put simply, we believe ORIJEN is the best dry dog or cat food available worldwide. Although lower in protein and total fresh meat content than ORIJEN, ACANA provides unbeatable value and a price point that makes Biologically Appropriate pet foods accessible to a wide range of pet lovers.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

rjvamp said:


> From Champion Pet Foods website: Champion Petfoods | F.A.Q
> 
> While there are many differences between ACANA and ORIJEN, both diets reflect our belief in “Biologically Appropriateness, and “Fresh Regional Ingredients”.
> 
> ...


 
The fresh regional ingredients don't contribute much protein. The Meals do and they come mainly from the US, Kentucky actually. The fresh meats dont contribute much protein at all as they are 75% water as counted on the list of ingredients.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

sable123 said:


> If you wanna see shiny coat and muscle tone, as well as bone white teeth, feed Green Tripe.


already do:thumbup:

quite honestly, muscle tone and coat were excellent on just orijen, but i still knew that wasnt the optimal diet.


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## rjvamp (Aug 23, 2008)

sable123 said:


> The fresh regional ingredients don't contribute much protein. The Meals do and they come mainly from the US, Kentucky actually. The fresh meats dont contribute much protein at all as they are 75% water as counted on the list of ingredients.


Where did you find that information about Kentucky? I couldn't find it on their website?


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

sable123 said:


> The fresh regional ingredients don't contribute much protein. The Meals do and they come mainly from the US, Kentucky actually. The fresh meats dont contribute much protein at all as they are 75% water as counted on the list of ingredients.


all the high protein, grainless foods achieve high meat by using named meat meals...no way around it. people should get over the idea that kibble is a source for fresh meat. manufacturers arent going to start out with enough fresh meats such that they make up much of the food....if they did, EVO, Orijen, etc...would run $150 per bag.

as i stated on another forum, people might feel good about seeing the named meats on the ingredients label, but they are mostly window dressing. named meat meals constitute a vast majority of the meat content of any high meat kibble. those first few listed meals are where the meat is.

just like with everything, there are all different quality levels ov named meat meals. i stilll think orijen is the best kibble out there, as the named meat meals they use (according to what they have written) are made primarily from muscle meat)....


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

rjvamp said:


> Where did you find that information about Kentucky? I couldn't find it on their website?


 
I called a while back. I know that part of Canada and there is no commercial production of any kind of meat meal, nor much at all anywhere in Canada.

The meals get the protein levels up to where they are and they are not regional Canadian ingredients.

Listen, its still a good food, we can argue about the cost, whether its worth twice Canadae ALS Grain Free, but no one could afford to pay the price of the food if it was 100% from little farms in Canada and they couldn't make enough food to fill demand.

The video is cute and heart warming but the reality is what makes Orijen tick is good old industrial chicken farming in the US.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

rjvamp said:


> Where did you find that information about Kentucky? I couldn't find it on their website?


i got some of this from champion via correspondence. while the email doesnt mention kentucky, i recall her saying KY was where they procured most of their chicken meal

_Derek, _

_Chicken meal is a good example. Although there are producers of chicken meal in Canada, none are capable of producing from chickens passed fit for human consumption and as such no Canadian chicken meal meets the European Union Pet Food Regulation 1774. At present, Canadian chicken meal is made with spent hens (from egg laying operations) as well as chickens that have died, but are not processed in a federally inspected facility, or were not passed as ‘fit for human consumption’ by the Government of Canada. _

_So, while our focus is “fresh and regional” our primary objective is always to achieve the highest standard in nutrition, palatability and food safety. Until chicken meal from human grade chickens is available in Canada, Champion will source its chicken meal from one of 2 USA chicken processors, whose chickens and facility are USDA certified, and who have the appropriate European Union qualifications (EU 1774)._

_ORIJEN is made with special 'low ash' chicken meal. This ingredient is prepared by removing the bones before cooking, which creates a very high protein and low ash ingredient. The result is a moderated amount of calcium and phosphorus in the final ORIJEN kibble. There are definitely different qualities of meat meals out there, just as there are many different grades of meat for you to choose from at your local grocers. If you start with ingredients that are mostly muscle meat (as is the case with our meat meals), this results in a quality meal that is very high in protein. most of the content of our meals will be muscle meat._

_Best Regards,_

*Bonnie*
Customer Care
Champion Petfoods LP
p 780.939.6888
f 780.939.6858


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## rjvamp (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks Derek and Sable123


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

roxy84 said:


> i got some of this from champion via correspondence. while the email doesnt mention kentucky, i recall her saying KY was where they procured most of their chicken meal
> 
> _Derek, _
> 
> ...


 
The grade Champion uses no different than Canidae or Annamaet or other kibbles in that price range. This is because both Canidae and Annamaet are made in EU Certified plants. There is nothing special about it, seriously. Everyone says special this and special that but trust me its the same stuff. Ash guidlines are very similar in premium foods. I would bet it is a Tyson plant as well.


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## sagelfn (Aug 13, 2009)

*whoa whoa whoa everyone time out....*

Before you start suggesting someone feed fresh green tripe warn them about the smell first


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## rjvamp (Aug 23, 2008)

sagelfn said:


> *whoa whoa whoa everyone time out....*
> 
> Before you start suggesting someone feed fresh green tripe warn them about the smell first


 
Yeah - I had to feed that outside - thought I was going to PUKE!!!!! ROFL

:help::help::help:


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## Gib Laut (Feb 21, 2010)

sable123 said:


> The grade Champion uses no different than Canidae or Annamaet or other kibbles in that price range. This is because both Canidae and Annamaet are made in EU Certified plants. There is nothing special about it, seriously. Everyone says special this and special that but trust me its the same stuff. Ash guidlines are very similar in premium foods. I would bet it is a Tyson plant as well.


That very well may be true with respect to the chicken meal and it is a very valid point. Everyone has an opinion, that is what this board is about. Personally my dog is raw fed, but as a young pup he ate some Orijen and I researched for months before hand. I have looked at grain free Canidae and there is no real meat, only meat meals. I am well versed at the weight differences in fresh vs meal, however the fact that Orijen has several sources of REAL meats included is what will drive the cost up. Kibble is kibble, not meat.


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## jakeandrenee (Apr 30, 2010)

Is canned tripe ok? I don't have resource near me to get fresh and I'd like Jake to try it.....


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Canned tripe is kind of a waste of money, go raw and YES IT STINKS, but its great. Omas Pride dealers carry a good brand of green tripe in 2 and 5lb chubs.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Gib Laut said:


> That very well may be true with respect to the chicken meal and it is a very valid point. Everyone has an opinion, that is what this board is about. Personally my dog is raw fed, but as a young pup he ate some Orijen and I researched for months before hand. I have looked at grain free Canidae and there is no real meat, only meat meals. I am well versed at the weight differences in fresh vs meal, however the fact that Orijen has several sources of REAL meats included is what will drive the cost up. Kibble is kibble, not meat.


 
The contribution of fresh meat to Orijen is rather insignificant, seriously. At 40% total protein the meals have to be the vast vast majority of the protein.


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## jakeandrenee (Apr 30, 2010)

Thanks Sable123....since I only supplement raw, is this something I add RMB to? What category does tripe fall under????


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

www.maryannland.com/Green_tripe.pdf

That's a good question. Where does green tripe fit in?

It doesn't have any of the drawbacks of just plain meat, but its high in protein and fat. I use it to add to a commercial diet but it could easily be a compliment to chicken necks.

Its the kind of well balanced product that fits in easily anywhere. I once had a conversation with a scientist at Penn that was convinced its stimulated muscle growth unlike regular meat protein.

It has an amazing ability to whiten teeth too.

Warning though, stay clear of a dog eating tripe it makes them a little anxious and if you have two dogs separate them.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

gib laut said:


> kibble is kibble, not meat.


 
yup.


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## The Cats Mother (Jul 26, 2010)

roxy84 said:


> i got some of this from champion via correspondence. while the email doesnt mention kentucky, i recall her saying KY was where they procured most of their chicken meal
> 
> _Derek, _
> 
> ...


Hello all
I am one of the cat mums whose cats were affected by irradiated Orijen cat food in Australia. In an effort to get to the bottom of how much Champion knew about the irradiation in advance (they said they didn't), documents were obtained under the Freedom of Information Act. These documents can be accessed here:
https://www.box.net/shared/nbzrdmzxyk

File 2 is the one that will tell you about the meal supplier

The docs show that (in 2007/2008 anyway) they sourced their kibble from Griffin Industries in Kentucky (page 34 of pdf in file 2)

Page 26 shows that the meal is of US origin. 

So much for "locally produced fresh products" spruiking

The ingredients list shows chicken meal, turkey meal and russet potatoes as the first three ingredients. So the other posters are correct in saying the fresh meat would be of low proportion once you remove the water content.

The documents go on to show on pages 52,53 and 54 that Champion's Australian importer WAS told about the irradiation being necessary, WAS told about the level to be used, and that the importer DID tell Champion and DID obtain their go-ahead within a few working days of his telling them about it. Hardly enough time for them to research its suitability for their product as they were advised to do. Their importer refused a trial run and a batch test through the irradiation facility according to the irradiation provider, Steritech.

Almost all along the way, Champion maintained they were not told about the irradiation in advance then much later sheepishly admitted they were told it would need irradiation but did not realise it would be at such a high level.

Around 100 cats were seriously neurologically impaired as a result of eating the irradiated diet, over 30 died or were euthanised. Around 50 made a good to very good recovery, and 7 still remain paralysed, my own cat being one of those still paralysed.

Australian quarantine no longer irradiates cat food. After very pressured lobbying from me and other owners together with evidence from the veterinary neurologist in charge of the cats and peer-reviewed published studies from Ireland and Wisconsin about the neurological effects on cats of feeding gamma irradiated diet, the Minister of Agriculture banned the process for cat food.

Some imported dog food and treats are still irradiated upon entry to Australia.

Orijen is not irradiated anywhere else in the world.

As kibbles go Orijen is one of the better ones. 

It is the company, Champion Petfoods, who lied to me on the phone and in writing to all the owners, that I take issue with, and I go online to every forum where this subject arises to set the record straight. 

I will never forgive them for the part they played in paralysing my cat and I will never let our government and quarantine forget it either, I'm in their ear almost every week. Until we have clear and truthful pet food labelling and no pet food irradiation in our country I won't rest and I've told them so.

Thank you for reading.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

The Cats Mother said:


> The ingredients list shows chicken meal, turkey meal and russet potatoes as the first three ingredients. So the other posters are correct in saying the fresh meat would be of low proportion once you remove the water content.
> 
> .


im sorry for the loss of your cat.

imo, the whole situation was handled poorly by both champion and the Ausssie government.

on some other points, fresh meat wont make up any significant portion of the meat content of any kibble. it has been previously discussed several times that champion procures it chicken meal from kentucky, as no plant in canada that produce chicken meal are EU certified.

if anyone know of a kibble where fresh meat makes up a high percentage of the meat content, PLEASE let us know.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

jakeandrenee said:


> Is canned tripe ok? I don't have resource near me to get fresh and I'd like Jake to try it.....


canned tripe is not worth the money..try Blue Ridge Beef or Omas Pride. There must be a distributor down there.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

roxy84 said:


> im sorry for the loss of your cat.
> 
> imo, the whole situation was handled poorly by both champion and the Ausssie government.
> 
> ...


Whats the point of spending the money on fresh meat in kibble when its going to get cooked anyway?

Buy a less expensive food and add fresh meat and organs.


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## jakeandrenee (Apr 30, 2010)

No distributors with in a two hour drive, very frustrating!


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

For the heck of it I am going to say

Blue Buffalo Blue Wilderness.

All 3 of my cats and my GSD are on it and they are doing wonderfully.

I feed my GSD 3 cups of BB BW a day, 1 1/2 at 5am and 1 1/2 at 5pm

I feed 2 cups of BB BW a day for the cats (they share the 2 cups) they get fed 1 cup at 5am and 1 cup at 5pm


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

have it shipped


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## The Cats Mother (Jul 26, 2010)

roxy84 said:


> im sorry for the loss of your cat.
> 
> imo, the whole situation was handled poorly by both champion and the Ausssie government.
> 
> ...


Thank you. My cat is still alive, she was one of the ''lucky ones'' - she is paralysed in the rear legs though, she can walk if held up, but cannot balance properly.

I really don't see how any kibble could contain a high percentage of fresh meat content. And the amount of processing and extrusion drying it would go through would surely remove any nutritive benefit? 

I just feed her human-grade butchers meat and chicken and fish now, appropriately supplemented, as before, without additional kibble of any variety.


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

The Cats Mother said:


> Thank you. My cat is still alive, she was one of the ''lucky ones'' - she is paralysed in the rear legs though, she can walk if held up, but cannot balance properly.
> 
> I really don't see how any kibble could contain a high percentage of fresh meat content.
> 
> I just feed her human-grade butchers meat and chicken and fish now, appropriately supplemented, as before, without additional kibble of any variety.


hopefully your cat has adjusted to her new limitations.

you are right, no kibble can contain a high percentage of fresh meat. even orijen and evo achieve their stated high meat content by using named meat meals.

what you are doing is the only way to get fresh meat into our furry friends bellies.


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