# Food Aggression help. (11 week old) Pics + VId



## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Ok just a little history. Got this pup at 7 weeks and have had her for 4 weeks. 

Breeder accidentally had these pups. Decided to part ways with one and keep one. So I had no choice with which one I got. Well, when it came to him feeding them he filled a bowl with food. Im guessing the mom, dad + pups all shared. Im not totally sure but im assuming thats what happened. He told me that the pup I got ate a lot and usually feel asleep in the bowl. SMH! 







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Well when we first got her I fed her. Went in to grab the bowl and she gave me a little growl and stare like you grab and ill bite. So over the last 4 weeks ive been working to calm her down. She still eats like shes starving though lol. What ive been doing. Making her sit/stay before I let her eat. I was putting my hands around her and her bowl then correcting if she growled or tried to bite. Its worked...well up until now. This is the first time Ive given her a knuckle bone and this is what I got. 

(I was moving my hand in slowly just to show you how aggressive she gets.)

After correcting a few times and having her sit/stay and her still doing this I took it away. Should I approach this the same way as the last time I did or what?


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Personally I don't like it! Your moving your hand in slowly basically daring her to bite you! Cute now but it won't be in a couple months.

If you have to have that bone?? Much better to demand the pup back up and then take it from her. 

Also not a fan of correcting out this type of behaviour? Stop free feeding (if your doing that) quit "correcting" her and start hand feeding her for awhile, it's a puppy not a shark.


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

well
you are teasing her in that vid and it is no wonder you are getting this reaction

please work on trading up
do not give knuckle bones or other high value treats until you get this under control
you are just making the food aggression worse

put high value treats in her kibble so she looks forward to you coming over
bits of cooked chicken or warmed hot dogs or cheese

you need to be the giver not the one who takes everything


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## boomer11 (Jun 9, 2013)

You are heading towards disaster. Correcting a dog that guards it's food from humans is not the way to go.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Chip18 said:


> Personally I don't like it! Your moving your hand in slowly basically daring her to bite you! Cute now but it won't be in a couple months.
> 
> If you have to have that bone?? Much better to demand the pup back up and then take it from her.
> 
> Also not a fan of correcting out this type of behaviour? Stop free feeding (if your doing that) quit "correcting" her and start hand feeding her for awhile, it's a puppy not a shark.


 Chip. The video is just a sample of what I got when I was close to her and when I reached to get it. I know the slow moving hand wasn't right but I wanted some visual. I think I'm going to start hand feeding soon. 







my boy diesel said:


> well
> you are teasing her in that vid and it is no wonder you are getting this reaction
> 
> please work on trading up
> ...


What do you mean trading up? 

Also, I like that idea of giving treats in her kibble. Imma had feed for a little to see how that goes. Also, how can I slow her down from eating my hand when I'm feeding ?

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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

boomer11 said:


> You are heading towards disaster. Correcting a dog that guards it's food from humans is not the way to go.


I'm looking for help not what I'm doing wrong. I know there is a problem and I want to fix it. Only looking for solutions

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## mego (Jan 27, 2013)

My puppy tried that crap with the first bone I gave her. Trading up: I went and got an even bigger bone out of the freezer and sat on the floor holding it out "want some?". She came over and chewed on the bone while I was holding it. Then I grabbed the first bone and encouraged her to chew that one. Back and forth. I added in "can I have it" when I'd pull away the first bone and if she let go I'd hold out another one

Basically teach the dog that you aren't going to take things, you're going to make them better. Like others have said, when she's eating food, walk up and in a cheery voice "here you go" plop some meat in her bowl and walk away. don't leave your fingers in there, don't stand over her. Just give a treat and leave. 

Now I'm the object holder. My dog brings valuable stuff to me and wants me to hold it for her. Never is aggressive in any way towards me.


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

Definitely, start hand feeding. Hand feed each meal. Make her work for each bite - a sit, wait, come, whatever - before she gets that handful of food. Trading up means, you exchange something of greater value for something she already has. Example: a piece of meat is higher value than a piece of kibble. If she resource guarded toys, you could trade her a new toy, for the toy she already had. Never take away. Always give. Let her see that your hand only brings good things. Once she has her food, leave her alone. You can ask her to sit and wait, but once she has obeyed and you have released her, she should be allowed to eat. You could toss a treat into her bowl as you walk by, but don't remove anything, or stick you hand in her bowl.


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## boomer11 (Jun 9, 2013)

TheDakotaShow said:


> I'm looking for help not what I'm doing wrong. I know there is a problem and I want to fix it. Only looking for solutions
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Can't fix something if you don't realize what you're doing is part of the problem


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Stevenzachsmom said:


> *Definitely, start hand feeding. Hand feed each meal. Make her work for each bite - a sit, wait, come, whatever - before she gets that handful of food. *Trading up means, you exchange something of greater value for something she already has. Example: a piece of meat is higher value than a piece of kibble. If she resource guarded toys, you could trade her a new toy, for the toy she already had.* Never take away. Always give. Let her see that your hand only brings good things. Once she has her food, leave her alone.* You can ask her to sit and wait, but once she has obeyed and you have released her, she should be allowed to eat.* You could toss a treat into her bowl as you walk by, but don't remove anything, or stick you hand in her bowl.*



This! ^^^^^ What you are doing now is causing the food aggression. You need to modify how she THINKS about you coming near her food. Not punish her for a natural survival instinct.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

boomer11 said:


> Can't fix something if you don't realize what you're doing is part of the problem


I do realize. I wouldn't be here if I thought I was doing everything right. 

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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

Wouldn't it be nice, if we could always do everything right? It is always a learning process. We learn something new with each dog. Many of the things I did growing up were wrong. My dogs are good teachers and I am learning better ways of doing things. Be patient and consistent with your little guy. My shelter pup was a terrible resource guarder. I learned to recognize his thresholds and not push him. He is awesome now. This really is easily correctable.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Was busy all day but have been watching this thread.

You're conditioning the dog to get worse not better and fostering distrust between you and the dog. How would you react if you didn't really know me that well and I went over to you while you were eating and yanked your food away as you were eating it and then when you protested I told you to shut up and shoved you back down into your chair? Think about that for a second.

First off. Stop allowing the dog to practice the resource aggression. Manage the dog better.

Keep a leash on him at all times and if you want to take an item from him pick up the leash and remove the puppy from the item not the other way around.

Second. Get rid of the food bowls. Start hand feeding the puppy everything. Good things come from your hands. Later you can drop a little food into the bowl. The pup eats it your hand approaches and drops a little more. It conditions the puppy to see your hand as a bringer of good things not a taker and something to be fought.

It might bleed over into toys. Just teach things like fetch and tug and cooperative style games and that goes away on its own. Keep toys put up unless you're going to interactively play with them and the puppy.

Most important thing is you stop putting the puppy into a situation where it practices that behavior.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

I get the "demo" video but you also mentioned corrections. Good advice has been given. 

Don't know what else your doing but less training (the food thing is conditioning) and more bonding! A dog/puppy that is dedicated to "you' is a lot easier to work with. 

You can find "slow feed dog bowls" online but if you do the free feeding thing for awhile it might not be necessary. He most likely fought hard to eat before but now he doesn't need to. You need to show him that is the case, time and patience.


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## coulter (Oct 13, 2012)

Can't even see the video link


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

Probably too late to employ this tactic and perhaps not the proper approach ( probably breaks all the rules regarding feeding a pup ) but it has worked very well for me with 3 GSDs over the decades....maybe I was lucky ????

The very first meals all of my pups have ever had, once they were in our house was offered in the same fashion. I would "eat" from the bowl first and then put the bowl down allowing the pup to have their turn....I didn't do this for any pecking order BS but simply did it because a pup growing up with FA and a distorted right of ownership was not something I wanted to deal with, especially when they become 80 pounds and have a bite force which would rip my face off. I may have done this practice for a week or so and then it evolved to a level where I wouldn't "eat" first from their bowl but at any given time I could put my face right next to theirs in the bowl and there was no conflict in the slightest....no hurried eating...no change in demeanor....no nothing. Ultimately, it resulted in being able to take anything from their mouths whenever I chose...my biggest concern was wanting to have the ability to take something they might pick up and start eating which they shouldn't....like mushrooms in the backyard for example....as well as having a dog with absolutely no FA.

The pup in the video almost is scary having that behavior at such a young age and I can see why you are concerned about correcting it. The cast of characters who offered advice already are folks who have helped me with my current GSD and I put faith in their words as they have yet to steer me wrong....they know their "stuff". I have a very strong belief if you follow their advice you and your pup will be ever so much better off in the days to come.

SuperG


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Did you chew up his food and pretend to regurgitate it into his mouth too?


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## coulter (Oct 13, 2012)

Baillif said:


> Did you chew up his food and pretend to regurgitate it into his mouth too?


Wait, you sound sarcastic. Isn't that how everyone should feed there dog till the age of two? You can't expect a GSD of less than two years old to chew his own food.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Depends on what day of the week you ask me.


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## TwoBigEars (May 11, 2013)

You've already had good advice about hand feeding and adding higher value items instead of taking things away. I just want to ask, am I the only one worried about seeing such aggression in an 11 week old puppy? Regardless of whether the aggression was accidentally encouraged, seeing it in such a young puppy makes me think there is something not quite right with her and that I wouldn't be surprised to see further behavior issues as she gets older.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

TwoBigEars said:


> You've already had good advice about hand feeding and adding higher value items instead of taking things away. I just want to ask, am I the only one worried about seeing such aggression in an 11 week old puppy? Regardless of whether the aggression was accidentally encouraged, seeing it in such a young puppy makes me think there is something not quite right with her and that I wouldn't be surprised to see further behavior issues as she gets older.


Or something very right with her! I'd take that dog! 

OP if you don't handle that "pup" right it could very easily be a "up the leash dog"!


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

twobig it is normal hardwired behavior
it is a survival instinct
he or she who has the most lives
if they dont guard their food they could die
i would not worry about it even
however one should strive to not make it worse but relieve the dogs fears that the _humans _are going to take the food


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

Baillif said:


> Did you chew up his food and pretend to regurgitate it into his mouth too?



No...that is what I did with my pet penguin.

SuperG


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## TwoBigEars (May 11, 2013)

I know it's a normal behavior. I've dealt with resource guarding in one of my own dogs. My concern is seeing it in an 11 week old puppy.


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## boomer11 (Jun 9, 2013)

I don't think it's normal behavior at all. While environmental factors can cause it, I think it's mainly genetic. It's from dogs that are unsure of themselves. They are nervous about losing food so they defend. I remember my 10 week pup growled at me when I touched his side while eating. Grew up to be a nervy not very well bred dog. Came from a byb. This pup also came from a byb. Coincidence? 

A good solid dog isn't nervous about going hungry. It doesn't need to guard.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Nah there are some badass dogs out there that do it. It's genetic but not a sign of weak temperament at all. In the OPs case it's probably stemming more from a disconnect in the dog handler relationship than anything.


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## boomer11 (Jun 9, 2013)

Baillif said:


> Nah there are some badass dogs out there that do it. It's genetic but not a sign of weak temperament at all. In the OPs case it's probably stemming more from a disconnect in the dog handler relationship than anything.


While I'm sure there are some badass dogs out there that guard food just because I do think the majority of cases come from less confident dogs. Pups shouldn't come home growling just like pups shouldn't come home afraid of people. 

Btw badass and biting a sleeve like a monster doesn't always mean good temperament.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

When I get off work ill reply to everyone I can. I do believe there is a temperment issue with her,when I got her I was told she's mean like her mom. But Ive noticed my training has not benefited her so I need a new approach. 

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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

boomer11 said:


> While I'm sure there are some badass dogs out there that guard food just because I do think the majority of cases come from less confident dogs. Pups shouldn't come home growling just like pups shouldn't come home afraid of people.
> 
> Btw badass and biting a sleeve like a monster doesn't always mean good temperament.


And pups shouldn't come home to owners jerking their meals out of their mouths.

It's just something they try against their siblings and it works. They turn around and try it on others. It really has nothing to do with temperament. And by bad ass dog I mean bad ass all the way around as far as complete package.

My last resource (severe) guarding case was an awesome dog that when he came to us did not display any of those behaviors the entire time he was with us for 5 weeks. He went back home and immediately reverted until the family worked with him to form a relationship. Now what does that tell you? It was a conditioned behavior. It was also a distrust thing.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

Some of the best dogs I have ever worked are possessive. I don't think it is indicative of weak nerves at all. Lots of trainers like a degree of possessiveness. It goes away when they learn to trust you.

You have some good advice in this thread OP. Classical conditioning works wonders.


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

Here's a good read on resource guarding.....hits on many of the subjects debated in this thread....causes, genetics, dealing with it..etc...

Resource Guarding: Treatment and Prevention


SuperG


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

TheDakotaShow said:


> I do believe there is a temperment issue with her,*when I got her I was told she's mean like her mom*.


Yikes, that would be a big red flag for me! Definitely agree with all the advice you've been given so far. What I did when Halo was a puppy was hand feed part of her meals as training treats. I used this game for a portion of her lunch kibble every day - it teaches impulse control around food as a default behavior (no cues, just wait for the behavior you want): 






It's not a "leave it", which I do also train, it's training that ignoring food is implied. I like to add in eye contact as well, so the puppy has to ignore the food in my hand and look at me before I start feeding. I also did tons of trading games with her toys and bones. Rather than try to take them away from her, I kept possession by holding onto the other end the entire time, and when she let go she either got a treat and the toy or bone back or she got something different. She learned early on that she could bring me things and exchange them for a treat, and she also learned to trust me because once I gave her something it was hers and I wasn't going to randomly take it back for no reason. She's now 5 years old, and she still brings me bones to hold for her while she chews them, and will bring me a prized Orbee ball to take away and give back. For some reason she really enjoys these games!

We brought her home at 10 weeks old, and I trained her at home for 3 weeks before she started puppy class. This picture is from week 2, at 14 weeks old - she's off leash in a room full of other people and puppies, staring at me with a treat on the floor in front of her:










And here I'm holding food in both hands, and she's giving me great focus:










I also train my dogs to hold a sit while I set their food bowls on the floor, and then they have to look at me before I release them to eat. She's 15 weeks old in this picture: 










My husband has the bowl closer to him than her, so he can pick it up if she breaks the sit and tries to eat before being released, but I work up to being able to put the bowl right under the dog's nose, with me walking several feet away.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Baillif said:


> Did you chew up his food and pretend to regurgitate it into his mouth too?


Nooooooo it's David Taggart who says we should mouth feed our dogs.

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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

This is a good video to demonstrate teaching impulse control and calm behavior around food.






David Winners


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

David Winners said:


> This is a good video to demonstrate teaching impulse control and calm behavior around food.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAQFnsO7Os0
> 
> David Winners


This is the exact way I got her off of the food aggression. But I'm guessing it was wrong? But with the high value treats she's really aggressive. 



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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

boomer11 said:


> I don't think it's normal behavior at all. While environmental factors can cause it, I think it's mainly genetic. It's from dogs that are unsure of themselves. They are nervous about losing food so they defend. I remember my 10 week pup growled at me when I touched his side while eating. Grew up to be a nervy not very well bred dog. Came from a byb. This pup also came from a byb. Coincidence?
> 
> A good solid dog isn't nervous about going hungry. It doesn't need to guard.


Byb?

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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

TheDakotaShow said:


> Byb?
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Backyard breeder. Less than reputable.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

IMO, there is nothing wrong in that video at all. If that is how you are working with the dog you are on the right track.

Most of the time possession isn't a one time quick fix thing. It takes some patience and consistency to change the dog's mind about interacting with you and food together. The higher value the dog places on the object, the harder it is going to be for the dog to trust you if there are competing motivators in it's head.




TheDakotaShow said:


> This is the exact way I got her off of the food aggression. But I'm guessing it was wrong? But with the high value treats she's really aggressive.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

DJEtzel said:


> Backyard breeder. Less than reputable.


Thanks. 

Another thing I wanted to being up was. Could there be any issue with the pup being a offspring of a brother and sister which were only 11 months? 

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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

TheDakotaShow said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Another thing I wanted to being up was. Could there be any issue with the pup being a offspring of a brother and sister which were only 11 months?
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I think there is an old saying amongst breeders.....when it works out, you call it line breeding/inbreeding...when it doesn't, you call it incest"

Hopefully, some of the breeders in here will give you a good answer.....

SuperG


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

SuperG said:


> I think there is an old saying amongst breeders.....when it works out, you call it line breeding/inbreeding...when it doesn't, you call it incest"
> 
> Hopefully, some of the breeders in here will give you a good answer.....
> 
> SuperG


LOL ok.







David Winners said:


> IMO, there is nothing wrong in that video at all. If that is how you are working with the dog you are on the right track.
> 
> Most of the time possession isn't a one time quick fix thing. It takes some patience and consistency to change the dog's mind about interacting with you and food together. The higher value the dog places on the object, the harder it is going to be for the dog to trust you if there are competing motivators in it's head.


I wasn't doing any training in that video. It was just a sample of the type of attitude I was getting from her when I even got my body close. I think were having bonding issues

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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

We were talking about different videos. I was talking about the one I posted LOL. Sorry for the miscommunication.

Yes, I see some definite trust issues with the puppy. I think it's going to require some patience and understanding to get around them.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

David Winners said:


> We were talking about different videos. I was talking about the one I posted LOL. Sorry for the miscommunication.
> 
> Yes, I see some definite trust issues with the puppy. I think it's going to require some patience and understanding to get around them.


Haha ok. I'm working on the trust issues with hand feeding and trading up. Gonna be a long process. 

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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Won't be as bad as you might think. If it goes long you're doing it wrong.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Baillif said:


> Won't be as bad as you might think. If it goes long you're doing it wrong.


Need some pointers. One thing I notice is she doesn't sit next to us and doesn't use her crate as a safety place. 

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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

I have an outline of how I deal with food guarding. Having a website dedicated to teaching people about raw feeding I get ALOT of people asking about food guarding and why their dog suddenly feels the need to guard their raw food when they never guarded their kibble.

I have used this outline on my own dogs (mainly fosters), used it to train other peoples dogs and recommended it for people to use on their own with their own dogs.

Food Guarding


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

TheDakotaShow said:


> Need some pointers. One thing I notice is she doesn't sit next to us and doesn't use her crate as a safety place.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Just hand feed and play interactive games with the puppy. Play is the quickest way to build a relationship with a puppy or a dog. Food can act as a wedge to gain a dogs interest and focus but it doesn't really help build relationship.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Lauri & The Gang said:


> I have an outline of how I deal with food guarding. Having a website dedicated to teaching people about raw feeding I get ALOT of people asking about food guarding and why their dog suddenly feels the need to guard their raw food when they never guarded their kibble.
> 
> I have used this outline on my own dogs (mainly fosters), used it to train other peoples dogs and recommended it for people to use on their own with their own dogs.
> 
> Food Guarding


Thanks for the info, I have never had it as an issue but if you stay in the dog biz you never know.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Baillif said:


> Just hand feed and play interactive games with the puppy. Play is the quickest way to build a relationship with a puppy or a dog. Food can act as a wedge to gain a dogs interest and focus but it doesn't really help build relationship.


What type of games do you recommend. 

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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Retrieves should be the first thing you should focus on trying to create


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Baillif said:


> Retrieves should be the first thing you should focus on trying to create


I have done that a few times. What I do is get her interested in a ball. Give it a roll she usually chases it either chews it or loses interest in it. How do I get her to bring it back? When should I treat?

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## gurlonfire2004 (Jan 15, 2014)

My 5 month old still doesn't want to bring the ball sometimes. What works for me is to run up to her with the ball in her mouth, call her name, and run from her. She usually chases me with the ball in her mouth and then I can turn around and ask her to give me the ball. If she drops the ball when chasing me, I go back to the ball and tell her to get it and then run away again after she has it.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

gurlonfire2004 said:


> My 5 month old still doesn't want to bring the ball sometimes. What works for me is to run up to her with the ball in her mouth, call her name, and run from her. She usually chases me with the ball in her mouth and then I can turn around and ask her to give me the ball. If she drops the ball when chasing me, I go back to the ball and tell her to get it and then run away again after she has it.


There has to be a video out there on how to train a pup to fetch and leave it. 

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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

Oh mercy, stop taking stuff away from her. You're creating this little monster here. Hand feed her. I wouldn't give her anything to eat that doesn't come from your hand.


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

SunCzarina said:


> Oh mercy, stop taking stuff away from her. You're creating this little monster here. Hand feed her. I wouldn't give her anything to eat that doesn't come from your hand.


You're a little late to the party. 

Been hand feeding since. Did you not read the replies?

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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Hope this shows up. Feeding her by hand with food in cup. Focused!



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## KZoppa (Aug 14, 2010)

Stevenzachsmom said:


> Definitely, start hand feeding. Hand feed each meal. Make her work for each bite - a sit, wait, come, whatever - before she gets that handful of food. Trading up means, you exchange something of greater value for something she already has. Example: a piece of meat is higher value than a piece of kibble. If she resource guarded toys, you could trade her a new toy, for the toy she already had. Never take away. Always give. Let her see that your hand only brings good things. Once she has her food, leave her alone. You can ask her to sit and wait, but once she has obeyed and you have released her, she should be allowed to eat. You could toss a treat into her bowl as you walk by, but don't remove anything, or stick you hand in her bowl.




Jan gave you some excellent advice. You want to bond with your puppy. That cant be done if your puppy views you as the taker of all things good. 

Also, remember, by correcting a growl, you teach the dog not to give a warning and to instead just act. A growl is a warning. They are giving you the chance to back off and stop making them uncomfortable. By correcting the growl, you teach them to take away their warning to you and others and just react. That's not something you want. 

You want to be the bringer of all things good and awesome. Once you give your puppy something, it's theirs. You, the great and powerful leader, have bestowed upon them something awesome and amazing. When you take it away without a darned good reason, you are abusing their view of you. Trade. Always trade. 

I can walk over and take a bone away from my dogs without them reacting in any way other than to give me a sad confused look but they also know by allowing me to take away a high value item, something else that's awesome is coming *usually in the form of chicken mixed with their kibble or a walk or trip to a pet store*. My kids can take things away from the dogs. I never take something away unless I absolutely have to. You have to be able to take something away from your dog if necessary and do so safely in case they get something they shouldn't have. This is where trading and teaching the dog to trade comes into play in a big way. Downside of this is once you teach the dog to trade for higher value, watch your dinner plate lol. 

Don't aggravate the problem. Correct it. Bonding with your puppy will also help. Good luck.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

What a cutie-pie! :wub:


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> What a cutie-pie! :wub:


Don't let them fool you. Haha. 


Anyone know when or if I should try the knuckle bone again? Weeks, months, year?

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## Diesel7602 (Mar 12, 2014)

If this was my dog, I would take the food away for a few minutes if she growled and try again tell she got the idea. Food should be given kinda on a schedule, not just laying around to eat when ever. Every thing my pup gets I.e.. Food , treats I make him work for it by sitting or shake. But water is all ways free, and always fresh. And I teach my pup that what I give I can take back or what she has I can take from her with out a fight. I think maybe your pup is doing this growling , eating fast because she is used to eating with her litter mates and trying to eat up fast and being protective of the food before it's eaten all up by her mates. This is just my opinion, I could be wrong. But I would do what others have said and hand feed. Maybe not all her food but some and then put it in a bowl and have her eat. maybe once while eating I would take the food for a sec then give it back. Even try waving your hand over the bowl while she eats or pick some up and put back down. But I wouldn't do to much because it can stress her out and make her more protective .just enough for her to know she can trust ya. Good luck =) 

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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Diesel7602 said:


> If this was my dog, I would take the food away for a few minutes if she growled http://www.petguide.com/mobile


This makes it worse, as it confirms her fear and she learns that your presence is bad news.
You can try the opposite: when she is eating from a bowl call her name so she knows where you are and give her a piece of meat (something better than kibble) from your hand and leave her alone to finish eating. Do this a few times every meal. Get your hand with the meat closer as she is doing well until you can stick your hand in her bowl. Then you can touch the bowl while you give her the meat until you can lift the bowl etc.
Take your time.
Although my dogs don't have FA I still do this once in while to keep it up.
BTW you have a cute, clever looking puppy, brace yourself for that little smartie!


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

yes
do not take the food bowl and play with it repeatedly
the goal is to make her more secure not less secure

*I can walk over and take a bone away from my dogs without them reacting in any way other than to give me a sad confused look but they also know by allowing me to take away a high value item, something else that's awesome is coming *usually in the form of chicken mixed with their kibble or a walk or trip to a pet store*.*
a dog does not have the reasoning skills to know if you take a delicious bone that a trip to the pet store is its reward 

the trade up game is done immediately 
that is the dog is eating boring old kibble and you drop chicken bits into the bowl 
but taking away a bone and then at meal time (later) giving it chicken is not going to do the trick 

with high value treats you better be sure what you are trading for is a darn sight better _immediately _than what it has now
so a piece of cooked chicken or hot dog over the bone but not a trip to a pet store an hour from now 

an alternative in any case is to allow the bone in the crate and when the dogs comes out of the crate to leave of course leave the bone in the crate


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## wyoung2153 (Feb 28, 2010)

Curious if there is an update?


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## Diesel7602 (Mar 12, 2014)

wolfy dog said:


> This makes it worse, as it confirms her fear and she learns that your presence is bad news.
> You can try the opposite: when she is eating from a bowl call her name so she knows where you are and give her a piece of meat (something better than kibble) from your hand and leave her alone to finish eating. Do this a few times every meal. Get your hand with the meat closer as she is doing well until you can stick your hand in her bowl. Then you can touch the bowl while you give her the meat until you can lift the bowl etc.
> Take your time.
> Although my dogs don't have FA I still do this once in while to keep it up.
> BTW you have a cute, clever looking puppy, brace yourself for that little smartie!


That's why I said if it was my dog. Luckily I don't have to worry about a food aggressor, but right when I brought my puppy home I did this and never had a problem, either it worked, or I just have a really good pup =) but yes, there is always 2 sides of the fence =) either way you choose , you always have a plan B  

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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

wyoung2153 said:


> Curious if there is an update?


Was so tempted to try the knuckle bone today but will have to give it a shot either tomorrow or next week. But I will record it to show progression or not. 

Dakota 1/16/14


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

TheDakotaShow said:


> Was so tempted to try the knuckle bone today but will have to give it a shot either tomorrow or next week. But I will record it to show progression or not.
> 
> Dakota 1/16/14


Make sure she can handle it. A knuckle bone is one of the most valuable treat to take away. Did you try her with less tempting possessions?


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## TheDakotaShow (Mar 9, 2014)

wolfy dog said:


> Make sure she can handle it. A knuckle bone is one of the most valuable treat to take away. Did you try her with less tempting possessions?


What other medium treats I can try before brining out the knuckle bone. 

Dakota 1/16/14


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

I buy meat on sale and cut it into candy bar sized strips, then freeze it. 

When it comes time to take away the knuckle bone, I give him the frozen meat and take the bone.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

TheDakotaShow said:


> What other medium treats I can try before brining out the knuckle bone.
> 
> Dakota 1/16/14


I would start with stuff she does not have a problem with like a low interest toy. Give it to her and then hold a treat in front of her. As soon as she drops the toy, you say, "Trade?" and give her the treat. Then return the toy and ignore her. She will learn that giving up something is not always a bad thing.Then you gradually increase the value of the toys, treats you give and trade her with. I would make the treats more valuable (to her) than the item you want to take. 
Example: if I want to take away a piece of paper, I can get away with a kibble. But if I need to take away a raw bone, I have to come up with something tasty and aromatic like smoked ham.
DDog is only 5 months old so I am still working with treats for giving up something. As he gets older I can skip these gradually. These same techniques goes for her food dish.


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