# Breeder is picking puppy for me. What kind of dog will it become?



## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

Hello everyone, I’m new to this forum and have a question on Working line GSD’s.
A brief history - I got with a breeder and bought a GSD. I didn’t do any research and I found out that it was a showline dog. I was very displeased from day 1. The dog had no drive whatsoever. Super smart but 0 drive. I took the dog back 5 days later. 
Fast forward- I did my due diligence and researched for almost 6 months. I bought training videos and books etc that equipped me with enough knowledge to know what I’m getting into as well as to have a good understanding of how to raise a working line GSD. I found a breeder who breeds working line GSD’s in which all the dogs in the pedigrees are titled in Shutzhund/ipo/IGP.
My question is this - I told the breeder that I wanted a dog (male) that would be my best bud. That would bond closely to me and go with me everywhere I go, other than work. But I equally want a dog that is willing and able to do IGP. (The kennel down the road from me has professional trainers that I will be training with). She told me that she is going to look for a social dog that is lower in drive but is an all around dog. So I’m wondering what that type of dog will look like as an adult? My main concern is when she says lower drive, does that mean that the dog will be like the showline dog? Won’t chase a ball or play tug? My last dog was a true American pitbull terrier and his prey drive was off the charts. That’s what we did for fun was play fetch. And he also loved to play tug. That was our bonding. Can anyone with experience shed some light on this? Thank you 🙏


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

You need to discuss this with the breeder. Nobody can answer your question without knowing the dogs, pedigree, the breeders definition of "lower drive".


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## Honey Maid (Dec 25, 2020)

Have you visited the facilities down the road and talked with the trainers?? They would be a good place to start, and they could help you find a good fit. You don't say if you want a puppy, or an adult. Having a new dog for 5 days does not give enough time for the dog to get comfortable in it's new surroundings, so you may not have seen that dogs real personality, or traits.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

Jax08 said:


> You need to discuss this with the breeder. Nobody can answer your question without knowing the dogs, pedigree, the breeders definition of "lower drive".


Is it possible for there to be a puppies in a litter that can’t do IGP? Both parents are IPO3’s but I’ve read that just because the parents can, it doesn’t mean all pups can. Is that true?


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

Snk said:


> Is it possible for there to be a puppies in a litter that can’t do IGP? Both parents are IPO3’s but I’ve read that just because the parents can, it doesn’t mean all pups can. Is that true?


Yes, it's absolutely possible. But there are many factors involved - including how the puppies are raised and what traits are nurtured and supported through training.


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## rotdocpa1 (Mar 19, 2018)

I would not assume the lower drive pup will stay that way either. Depends on the breeding. I kept the mellow male in my first litter because I was planning on getting out of schutzhund. Other males went for police. He hit about 15-18 months old and the drive went through the roof. Now I am back in schutzhund as the dog needed the structure of training. If this is a very hi drive litter than a moderate one might be best. Just don't compromise on nerves. Better nerves and less drive is a lot better than lots of drive and less nerve.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

Honey Maid said:


> Have you visited the facilities down the road and talked with the trainers?? They would be a good place to start, and they could help you find a good fit. You don't say if you want a puppy, or an adult. Having a new dog for 5 days does not give enough time for the dog to get comfortable in it's new surroundings, so you may not have seen that dogs real personality, or traits.


I have visited and they are awesome. They have been in the business for 40 years. I’m not getting a dog from them though. They are solid but their GSDs aren’t titled in protection sport so I went to a breeder who’s dogs are. And I didn’t know that about the dogs traits. I may have given up on him too soon.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Snk said:


> Is it possible for there to be a puppies in a litter that can’t do IGP? Both parents are IPO3’s but I’ve read that just because the parents can, it doesn’t mean all pups can. Is that true?
> [/QUOTE}
> 
> That can be true. Lower drive doesn't mean no drive. You've basically asked for a pet that can do club level IGP and your breeder has descrbied a dog that you requested. I don't like low drive dogs. they are harder to train. I want medium drive, balanced, with an off switch. So again, you need to express these concerns to your breeder. Go meet the dam, research the sire. And make sure what you want has been properly expressed to the breeder.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

rotdocpa1 said:


> I would not assume the lower drive pup will stay that way either. Depends on the breeding. I kept the mellow male in my first litter because I was planning on getting out of schutzhund. Other males went for police. He hit about 15-18 months old and the drive went through the roof. Now I am back in schutzhund as the dog needed the structure of training. If this is a very hi drive litter than a moderate one might be best. Just don't compromise on nerves. Better nerves and less drive is a lot better than lots of drive and less nerve.


Thank you this is good info


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

rotdocpa1 said:


> I would not assume the lower drive pup will stay that way either. Depends on the breeding. I kept the mellow male in my first litter because I was planning on getting out of schutzhund. Other males went for police. He hit about 15-18 months old and the drive went through the roof. Now I am back in schutzhund as the dog needed the structure of training. If this is a very hi drive litter than a moderate one might be best. Just don't compromise on nerves. Better nerves and less drive is a lot better than lots of drive and less nerve.



Funny story - in every repeat litter of my male's breeding there was the "best pet puppy" or the Sleeper as we came to call them. Because they woke up at 9 months and were the best working dog with the biggest grip and the highest drive. 

OP- it's all a crap shoot. So trust your breeder. If you don't trust your breeder then you should keep looking. If the puppy has drive, then it's up to you develop it. How the dog will be as an adult is not just genetics. Environment is a large piece.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

Jax08 said:


> Funny story - in every repeat litter of my male's breeding there was the "best pet puppy" or the Sleeper as we came to call them. Because they woke up at 9 months and were the best working dog with the biggest grip and the highest drive.
> 
> OP- it's all a crap shoot. So trust your breeder. If you don't trust your breeder then you should keep looking. If the puppy has drive, then it's up to you develop it. How the dog will be as an adult is not just genetics. Environment is a large piece.


This is good to know. I’ll def talk to my breeder. I basically just want a best bud that can chill when it’s time to chill but that also will love to go swimming with me, hiking and do IGP. I can’t stand a lazy dog that doesn’t like to get after it or a dog that wouldn’t have my back. This is why I went with a working line GSD. Everything I’ve read said that they are basically a badass dog lol


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I don't know any healthy lazy GSD, no matter what lines. A new pup is not even adjusted after 5 days. It might be good to see how that pup turned out from a learning point of view.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

wolfy dog said:


> I don't know any healthy lazy GSD, no matter what lines. A new pup is not even adjusted after 5 days. It might be good to see how that pup turned out from a learning point of view.


I agree 💯 Unfortunately at the time I didn’t know that. The breeder even told me that but I figured they were trying to rip me off so I gave him back. He was a west German showline mixed with west German working line. It was their #1 pick got police k9 they said. I bet they weren’t lying but I didn’t know better and didn’t want to get ripped off. I was just used to my pitbull that I had. He was a savage from day 1. He chased balls and hung on to rags to the point where I could pick him off the ground. We had to quit playing fetch in the house with him because he put his face through the wall lol. I did learn though that GSD develop a lot slower and that was my mistake.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

I was going to write the same as Wolfy dog and felt it was your mistake - but seems like it was meant to be as the pup sure got a chance to shine.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Snk said:


> This is good to know. I’ll def talk to my breeder. I basically just want a best bud that can chill when it’s time to chill but that also will love to go swimming with me, hiking and do IGP. I can’t stand a lazy dog that doesn’t like to get after it or a dog that wouldn’t have my back. This is why I went with a working line GSD. Everything I’ve read said that they are basically a badass dog lol



First - there is zero comparison between a pit bull and a GSD. And there is a big difference between game and prey drive. Between drive and energy. These two breeds aren't anything alike. 

"badass dog" I don't know what your definition of "badass" is but the dog is a living breathing creature and you should look for the threads on "will my dog protect me" - because most dogs won't without training. And the IGP training does not teach them protection. It teaches them to bite a sleeve. So maybe take a step back and focus on what your expectations are vs what is most likely the reality of the situation. Because out of all my dogs, the one that would most likely bite you defending me was a rough coat collie and you returned a puppy after 5 days based on your expectations not the reality of what the puppy actually was.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

Jax08 said:


> First - there is zero comparison between a pit bull and a GSD. And there is a big difference between game and prey drive. Between drive and energy. These two breeds aren't anything alike.
> 
> "badass dog" I don't know what your definition of "badass" is but the dog is a living breathing creature and you should look for the threads on "will my dog protect me" - because most dogs won't without training. And the IGP training does not teach them protection. It teaches them to bite a sleeve. So maybe take a step back and focus on what your expectations are vs what is most likely the reality of the situation. Because out of all my dogs, the one that would most likely bite you defending me was a rough coat collie and you returned a puppy after 5 days based on your expectations not the reality of what the puppy actually was.


I understand the difference between energy and drive. Like I said I’ve been studying and talking with trainers for 6 months now. And the more I learn the more I realize I know nothing. But I have a basic understanding. I’ll define what I mean by badass - not a *****. Lol not a dog that’s scared of everything. A dog with solid nerves and balanced drives that is cable of doing bitework. I understand the difference between a pitbull and German shepherd. A pitbull would be a terrible candidate to teach bitework IMO. My dog literally had 0 on the threshold scale of say 1-10. But my pitbull was a great dog. Driven like a malinois, very handler sensitive but confident. Extreme prey drive. But This is why I want a GSD. To train in IGP and if he has what it takes, graduate to a bite suit. A badass dog by definition 😉🤙


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Op, why would you switch from a Pit to a GSD if your Pit was everything you were looking for?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Snk said:


> I understand the difference between energy and drive. Like I said I’ve been studying and talking with trainers for 6 months now. And the more I learn the more I realize I know nothing. But I have a basic understanding. I’ll define what I mean by badass - not a ***. Lol not a dog that’s scared of everything. A dog with solid nerves and balanced drives that is cable of doing bitework. I understand the difference between a pitbull and German shepherd. A pitbull would be a terrible candidate to teach bitework IMO. My dog literally had 0 on the threshold scale of say 1-10. But my pitbull was a great dog. Driven like a malinois, very handler sensitive but confident. Extreme prey drive. But This is why I want a GSD. To train in IGP and if he has what it takes, graduate to a bite suit. A badass dog by definition 😉🤙



Oh well. Studying for 6 months. Sounds like you have this all under control then. Good luck with your puppy.


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

wolfy dog said:


> Op, why would you switch from a Pit to a GSD if your Pit was everything you were looking for?


My pit was an awesome dog but I want to get into sport. German shepherds are awesome and I do t ever want to get another pit. Just because I want my dog to have that place forever. If that makes sense


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## Snk (Jul 14, 2021)

Jax08 said:


> Oh well. Studying for 6 months. Sounds like you have this all under control then. Good luck with your puppy.


Thanks 🙏


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## Arrow-the-GSD (Aug 26, 2021)

The breeder strongly suggested a puppy for me from what I told her I wanted. When I first got her I was like Ahhhh this is a horrible match how can I do this I can’t handle this dog???!!!!! But now she is getting closer to five months old and I am REALLY starting to like her, insane drive and all. I’m actually planning to do protection work with her and she has shown a lot of potential already, even at the breeders she was rather possessive of her. Which isn’t necessarily the best but she’s turned out fine she just had zero boundaries there and here it took a bit but she is great. 
Anyways,bottom line is the breeder knows their puppies best, but you also have to trustyour breedee enough to choose for you. If you don’t trust them don’t get a puppy from them.


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## gsdsteve (Apr 24, 2010)

Arrow-the-GSD said:


> The breeder strongly suggested a puppy for me from what I told her I wanted. When I first got her I was like Ahhhh this is a horrible match how can I do this I can’t handle this dog???!!!!! But now she is getting closer to five months old and I am REALLY starting to like her, insane drive and all. I’m actually planning to do protection work with her and she has shown a lot of potential already, even at the breeders she was rather possessive of her. Which isn’t necessarily the best but she’s turned out fine she just had zero boundaries there and here it took a bit but she is great.
> Anyways,bottom line is the breeder knows their puppies best, but you also have to trustyour breedee enough to choose for you. If you don’t trust them don’t get a puppy from them.


And, of course, this is what reputable breeders do. You tell them what you're looking for and they pick the pup best suited for you.


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## Arrow-the-GSD (Aug 26, 2021)

gsdsteve said:


> And, of course, this is what reputable breeders do. You tell them what you're looking for and they pick the pup best suited for you.


Yes! I definitely chose a nice breeder this time around after my Aussie died of genetic issues at the age of two. Arrow’s breeder wasn’t like super duper high end registered parents (though her grandparents are all registered) bc I can’t afford a several thousand dollar dog, but she bred just as nice pups and cared just as much about the breed, doing all the health checks and hip checks, definitely wasn’t doing it for the money! And I didn’t have to break my bank to get a really nice pup, which meant I could buy her a grooming tub! 😁


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

There are several components drive and temperament. Read this article. Temperament

We found a Breeder we trusted and asked for medium drives, biddable, good nerves, clear headed with an off switch. After 8 months she called and said her current litter had two matches for us to pick from.

She didn’t make that determination until they were 7.5 weeks old. Her pups are regularly outside in a yard playing with mom, litter mates and other adult GSDs from her kennel. Our girl had great bite inhibition, loves to work and train.


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