# Long hair question



## PuppyKono

I was told the other day that in german shepherd shows the spilt up the long haired and the stock coat german shepherds. I was just wanting to know if that is true. Is it? its a stupid question but I wanted to know. Thanks


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## Xeph

If the dog is a true long coat (no undercoat) it is true. If it is a long stock coat (long hair with undercoat) this will not occur


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## TFleahman

Could someone post a picture of the difference in a true log coat and stock long coat with undercoat? I have a long hair pup, she is my first shepherd, and I'm curious what the difference is  


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## Xeph

It's hard to find pics of true long coats. Most coaties are long stock.

A Bearded Collie is a long coated dog that demonstrates what a true long coat GSD would look like sans undercoat. A Briard is another example


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## Liesje

In SV shows, yes they split stock coats and long stock coats into their own classes.


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## PuppyKono

Liesje said:


> In SV shows, yes they split stock coats and long stock coats into their own classes.


Thank you!


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## PuppyKono

New question are you not allowed to cut a coaties fur? Ive been reading things and I'm wondering for shows if you aren't allowed to because Kono her fur on the top of her back was black then it turned tan and now its coming in black again. Do I just keep brushing her and then that hair will come out soon and the hair on her back will be black again....


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## martemchik

In SV they have started to split. In AKC, you'd still show together. If you part your dog's outer hair, you should be able to see a shorter, thicker undercoat. If you don't then I'm pretty sure your dog would just get disqualified in the AKC ring, and if not disqualified then it wouldn't place very high among a bunch of stock coats. A long coat isn't a disqualifying fault, but it is a point fault so all else equal, a shorter haired dog will be more successful in the breed ring.

The reason you can't cut the fur is that some breeders will shave/cut their longer stock coated GSDs in order to make them look like short/medium coated GSDs. They'll cut the hair on the ears and the feet (usually the biggest give away of a long coat) so that their dogs will have a better chance in the breed ring.


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## PuppyKono

martemchik said:


> In SV they have started to split. In AKC, you'd still show together. If you part your dog's outer hair, you should be able to see a shorter, thicker undercoat. If you don't then I'm pretty sure your dog would just get disqualified in the AKC ring, and if not disqualified then it wouldn't place very high among a bunch of stock coats. A long coat isn't a disqualifying fault, but it is a point fault so all else equal, a shorter haired dog will be more successful in the breed ring.
> 
> The reason you can't cut the fur is that some breeders will shave/cut their longer stock coated GSDs in order to make them look like short/medium coated GSDs. They'll cut the hair on the ears and the feet (usually the biggest give away of a long coat) so that their dogs will have a better chance in the breed ring.


Gotcha! Thanks!


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## Andaka

You can't cut the hair for showing because natural hair has a point on the end and cut hair will have a blunt end. So if a judge looks for it, they can tell.


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## PuppyKono

Andaka said:


> You can't cut the hair for showing because natural hair has a point on the end and cut hair will have a blunt end. So if a judge looks for it, they can tell.


I didn't know that. Thanks! Thats good to know in the future!


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## codmaster

PuppyKono said:


> I didn't know that. Thanks! Thats good to know in the future!


And it is a DQ to artifially enhance a conformation dog!


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## Liesje

In UKC you can show a coated dog with the rest, they are kinder about this "fault" than AKC (I know of a coated GRCH). But you cannot overgroom, the dogs can't have any grooming "products", just a regular bath and brushing. Dogs that require certain trims can get trimmed.


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## PuppyKono

codmaster said:


> And it is a DQ to artifially enhance a conformation dog!


Oh. Hmmm... Thats not good.



Liesje said:


> In UKC you can show a coated dog with the rest, they are kinder about this "fault" than AKC (I know of a coated GRCH). But you cannot overgroom, the dogs can't have any grooming "products", just a regular bath and brushing. Dogs that require certain trims can get trimmed.


Ok so like the hair on the paws?


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## Liesje

If we're talking about a GSD, then no you don't trim them at all. I'm talking about something like a Portuguese Water Dog that is usually shown with a lion cut.


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## Xeph

> If we're talking about a GSD, then no you don't trim them at all.


Neatening up of the paw pads is allowed. It's just considered good hygiene and animal husbandry. All of my dogs have paw pads trimmed


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## Liesje

For UKC shows? I've never seen anyone trim a GSD anywhere.


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## Andaka

I have finished many champions without trimming any of them.


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## Lauri & The Gang

Cutting the hair on the bottom of the feet is allowed in UKC.

I'm not sure if they would DQ someone that cut the hair on the TOP of the feet (the floofies that coaties get between the toes).


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## Xeph

> For UKC shows? I've never seen anyone trim a GSD anywhere.


I see it in AKC constantly


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## Liesje

Ah, OK I was posting about UKC grooming. It is very minimal, no reason to trim a GSD anywhere, even a coated one. IMO it would just risk accidentally over trimming. They are also strict about what products can be used though they don't really enforce it.


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## PuppyKono

Liesje said:


> Ah, OK I was posting about UKC grooming. It is very minimal, no reason to trim a GSD anywhere, even a coated one. IMO it would just risk accidentally over trimming. They are also strict about what products can be used though they don't really enforce it.


Yeah I wouldnt want to risk over trimming :\ that would be bad. Thanks! 

Thanks everyone for the info!


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