# Shaved!!!!



## RebelGSD

My gorgeous longhair foster arrived on Thursday night. He was pretty neglected and blowing his coat, so I spent some time brushing him. Brushed out the top and part of the sides. The dog was great, just enjoyed the brushing. Then I thought why not leave it to the pros, they have better equipment and a stand and know better what they are doing. Dropped him off at the vet, they have two groomers. The groomer calls me telling me that he is a matted. I said I know, cut out the mats and try to blend the bold spots in as much as possible. She said she will try. Second call, the dog is crying and the rear is so matted that she cannot brush it out. He did not cry when I was brushing him. So I said she can shave the rear where it is matted (it was his butt and part of his thigh). 

I almost passed out when I picked up the dog. I almost passed out when I saw him. She shaved him up to the shoulders. Apparently for fome people the rear starts at the shoulders. Left a half inch fluff on the tip of his tail. The poor dog looks like a giant rat with a fluffy head. I am furious! She turned a gorgeous longhair into a rat. 

To top it he was supposed to get adopted, we had a family waiting for a longhair and they were totally enthusiastic about getting their longhair. I wanted to get him clean to meet his family. Now he is a clean rat and the family said no thank you, this is not the look we had in mind.

It will be months until he starts looking like a Shepherd again. So a wonderful, dog will be taking up space in a foster home for months because of the stupidity and arrogance of the dog shaver who calls herself a groomer.

I feel like going there and shaving her. Is there a groomer association where I can file a complaint against this woman?


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## Sunflowers

Oh, no. No! That's terrible. 

Can we see a pic? Maybe it's not that bad ? Poor thing...


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## RebelGSD

Believe me, it is horrible. I have never seen anything like this. It is pouring rain so we went into the petsmart with the family. everybody was around my dog because he looked so bizarre. Any ideas how I can get a revenge on the "groomer"? I really feel vindictive.
She should not do this to others. I explained it to her over and over that this is a rescue dog and that his looks matter. Nobody will adopt a naked dog that they have no idea what the dog is going to look like in the end.


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## GsdLoverr729

I think you should be able to file a complaint through the vet office the groomer was working at. 

I know that our groomer would be fired for that sort of thing. What an awful thing for her to do >.<


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## selzer

I don't know. I suppose you told her she could shave the dog in parts, and that would probably look just as bad. So, I guess now you know, if you want it done right, you really need to do it yourself.

I am not going to suggest methods of getting revenge.


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## RebelGSD

They were laughing when I picked him up, they said that it will grow back in. Some liked it. It is not their problem, they don't have to find him a home. They offered to shave the neck and head too. They plain don't get it. He is not dying of cancer and they cannot take this seriously.


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## RebelGSD

If she shaved parts, people would have had an idea what the dog would look like. 
I think that I will post negative reviews wherever reviews can be posted, on google, yellow pages, etc.


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## PatchonGSD

Well, maybe it was all just "meant to be." If that family passed him by just because he was shaved, (obviously knowing it will grow back) maybe they weren't the right family for him anyway.


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## GsdLoverr729

PatchonGSD said:


> Well, maybe it was all just "meant to be." If that family passed him by just because he was shaved, (obviously knowing it will grow back) maybe they weren't the right family for him anyway.


 :thumbup: Very, very true. I find it pretty shallow that they walked away due to him being shaved oddly.


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## doggiedad

i understand your frustration. i think you should bare with it
untill his new coat grows in. his new coat is going to be very
nice.


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## RebelGSD

Well, in a perfect world looks would not matter. In the real world looks matter very much. First choice of people is the appearance of the dog, dark sable seems to be a fashion color, for example. Try telling someone who wants a dark sable or black and red that they will find out about the color of their dog in a couple of months. I don't know many that would adopt/buy a shave dog without having any idea what the dog will look like one day.


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## RebelGSD

doggiedad said:


> i understand your frustration. i think you should bare with it
> untill his new coat grows in. his new coat is going to be very
> nice.


It is not that I have a choice. The sad thing is that we have three dogs in kill shelters on our waitlist right now. This dog, that was highly adoptable before grooming, will be in rescue for months, until his hair grows back in and he start looking like a dog. Several dogs on the waitlist will die as a conseqence.

Yes, most people are shallow and go by the looks. They want to know what the companion they select for the next 12 years looks like before they commit.


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## Nigel

PatchonGSD said:


> Well, maybe it was all just "meant to be." If that family passed him by just because he was shaved, (obviously knowing it will grow back) maybe they weren't the right family for him anyway.


That's what I was thinking, it's temporary, why would someone pass over an otherwise great dog? Not that I would waste time with people that shallow, but does he have a picture from Before? He may look odd, but I bet he feels better without the mats.


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## GatorBytes

RebelGSD said:


> It is not that I have a choice. The sad thing is that we have three dogs in kill shelters on our waitlist right now. This dog, that was highly adoptable before grooming, will be in rescue for months, until his hair grows back in and he start looking like a dog. Several dogs on the waitlist will die as a conseqence.
> 
> Yes, most people are shallow and go by the looks. They want to know what the companion they select for the next 12 years looks like before they commit.


Perhaps someone will take him before his hair grows back because of this story.  Many good souls will take a hard luck story as much as a vanity reason.
I understand why you'r angry...it seems like blatant lazyness to me.
And I have to laugh at the comment about shaving her:laugh:

I had an aquaintance, had a pom. Groomer shaved dog so close to skin, fur never came back, looked like a mini lion with tiny sprigs of hair sprouting out here and there, I thought it ws diseased until I heard story, hair just wouldn't grow back.


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## Jax08

Did you complain to her boss? You can put reviews for businesses online! People do searches and will find it.


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## RebelGSD

She is apparently a visiting groomer at my vet's office. I like the vet, I don't want to hurt their business. The vet who is the owner is not at the office today, I will take the dog in tomorrow so that he can see the dog. I will file complaints over the Internet about her and her grooming business. Maybe somebody reads those.


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## Jax08

That's what I would do, Rebel. I would also send a letter to her directly stating the consequences of her actions and how long it will take for the hair to grow back. At the very least, she should refund your money.


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## LaneyB

I really really would love to see a picture of the dog if you have one.


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## wyoung2153

I'd love to see a picture too.. and it's unfortunate that it happened, but maybe that was some sort of divine intervention.. the right family for this dog may not be ready to have him yet and God needed to stall!


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## kr16

The BBB better business bureau is amazing to file a complaint to. Do it online. People take those complaints very seriously and the BBB reacts. I just did one last week on LA Fitness. You would be amazed how people react to those complaints.


Where is the dog located? How old is he? Shouldnt be to hard to find another home.


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## deldridge72

Really shaving is not the end of the world-the people were pretty shallow to pass on looks-I've had both of my coated girls shaved in the pass and the coats grew in quickly--now I did go with a lion's cut=leaving the long hair on head & front & rear quarters with a full tail.
But I do understand the need for space for the two waiting in the shelter.


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## Rerun

My personal opinion is that if he was matted, he should have been shaved not spend hours being brushed out. If you spent hours brushing him and he didn't look perfect, then he was matted. Especially since after hours of brushing and you still thought a pro needed to deal with his coat condition. I have known a lot of groomers, and none have shaved a dog just for the heck of it. A llot of people do not realize they aren't getting down to the skin on a long coated dog like that and don't realize how badly matted the dog it. 

In regards to the family passing on him, if all they were concerned about is the fact that his coat was shaved (and obviously shaved, so they knew it would grow back) then they shouldn't have a dog. They should have been placing importance on his temperament and factors such as gender, age, even size/structure. But coat length? Knowing the dogs coat would grow back...yeah. I think it's best they moved on!


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## Freestep

Rerun said:


> My personal opinion is that if he was matted, he should have been shaved not spend hours being brushed out. If you spent hours brushing him and he didn't look perfect, then he was matted. Especially since after hours of brushing and you still thought a pro needed to deal with his coat condition. I have known a lot of groomers, and none have shaved a dog just for the heck of it. A llot of people do not realize they aren't getting down to the skin on a long coated dog like that and don't realize how badly matted the dog it.


Thank you, you took the words right out of my mouth!

And I'm shocked that the family wouldn't take him because she was SHAVED... wow... IMO, the dog and the rescue dodged a bullet there. Anyone so shallow as to not take a dog because he TEMPORARILY looked different that he did when they met him... well, I'll reserve what I really think of that family, I'm just glad they didn't get their hands on him.

As to shaving the dog: I, as a professional groomer, am NOT going to de-mat a dog if it hurts him to do so. The brushing OP did was the easiest part--obviously--she didn't want to finish the job when things started getting tough, and left that part up to the professionals.

Now, if it were me grooming the dog, I'd *try* to demat him with the tools that I have, and I'd bust out every trick in the book to do it--IF and only IF the dog will tolerate it and the client will pay for it. Dematting is hours of labor-intensive, back-breaking, wrist-wrenching work for the groomer, and can be painful for the dog. *I* will take the pain if the client is willing to pay, but I will *NOT* force the dog to take the pain, for any amount of money.

So, if I was dematting this dog and he started to yelp and cry, I'd call the owner and tell them something like this: "I have attempted to demat this dog in every possible way, but it is becoming painful for him at this point, so I'm not going to continue dematting. The only humane way to groom this dog is to shave him. I can shave him for you for $xx, or you can pick him up now and finish the de-matting yourself, if you think you can do it."

I guess where the groomer made the mistake was not telling the OP right straight out that he needed to be shaved over his whole body.

Now, the OP and I can argue all day long about how the dog was enjoying his brushing and why couldn't the groomer just brush out the rest of the mats? I see this every day: people who *say* "oh, he's easy to brush, he likes it, I brush out his mats all the time", and I find something very different when I get the dog on the table. Not saying the owner is lying, just saying they haven't gotten to the sensitive parts, or the worst parts, or they stopped when the dog started yelping, and called the groomer. Leaving the painful part for someone else to do.

Sometimes, I can pull magic out of my hat and get those mats out without undue stress to the dog. I have products and equipment most dog owners don't, and sometimes that's all it takes. Other times, it is way beyond anything a human can do, and the only humane option is to shave.

Since I didn't see the dog, I can't say whether the groomer *should* have been able to get the mats out, but I will say that if the dog was crying, she was right to stop. I think she could have been better at communicating what needed to happen.

So, OP, don't take "revenge" on the groomer, for God's sake--groomers are there to HELP the dog, we don't get into this business because we want to make money hurting dogs. That groomer probably spent hours of blood, sweat & tears trying to groom that dog, only to have the OP get mad. It's a cruel world.

I understand it's frustrating because the prospective adopters changed their minds once seeing the dog shaved, but again, I say, you dodged a bullet with that.


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## RebelGSD

I think that people who want a GSD want a dog that looks like a GSD when they first meet the dog. This dog could be any other generic dog breed. While I would take in a shaved dog myself, not everybody is capable of visualizing a shepherd in a huge rat-looking white animal. Considering that there are maybe 100+ normal and gorgeous looking shepherds with good temperament in area rescues they can chose from, the chances are really that they are going to adopt a dog that looks nothing like the dog they are looking for and they don't know what he is going to look like in a couple months. Regardless how shallow it is, people first go by the looks when they pick a dog they want to meet. These days normal looking dogs with good structure and temperament are hard enough to place.

It is completely different when one does it with their own dog from adopting a dog they have never seen and that looks like a freak. 

I have brushed out successfully many a matted dog and never regretted it. Other groomers have done too for our rescues and I have never ever had anyone do this to our rescues. I glad to hear thet shaved dogs that look nothing like a shepherd are easy adoptions everywhere else, they are scertainly not easy adoptions around here. And it is worth the brushing to save the dog months of waiting in a foster home until he starts looking reasonably normal. 

Shaving him was easier and faster for the groomer than brushing. She shave the parts that I have already brushed out, his back and the sides, which was totally unnecessary.

I will certainly never allow this dog shaver anywhere near my dogs and I would have done it myself if I had the vaguest notion what she would do to him.

I think it is everybody's right to shave or not shave their own dogs, the rescues have hard enough time finding homes when they look normal - with the current economy.


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## RebelGSD

Freestep said:


> Thank you, you took the words right out of my mouth!
> 
> And I'm shocked that the family wouldn't take him because she was SHAVED... wow... IMO, the dog and the rescue dodged a bullet there. Anyone so shallow as to not take a dog because he TEMPORARILY looked different that he did when they met him... well, I'll reserve what I really think of that family, I'm just glad they didn't get their hands on him.
> 
> As to shaving the dog: I, as a professional groomer, am NOT going to de-mat a dog if it hurts him to do so. The brushing OP did was the easiest part--obviously--she didn't want to finish the job when things started getting tough, and left that part up to the professionals.
> 
> Now, if it were me grooming the dog, I'd *try* to demat him with the tools that I have, and I'd bust out every trick in the book to do it--IF and only IF the dog will tolerate it and the client will pay for it. Dematting is hours of labor-intensive, back-breaking, wrist-wrenching work for the groomer, and can be painful for the dog. *I* will take the pain if the client is willing to pay, but I will *NOT* force the dog to take the pain, for any amount of money.
> 
> So, if I was dematting this dog and he started to yelp and cry, I'd call the owner and tell them something like this: "I have attempted to demat this dog in every possible way, but it is becoming painful for him at this point, so I'm not going to continue dematting. The only humane way to groom this dog is to shave him. I can shave him for you for $xx, or you can pick him up now and finish the de-matting yourself, if you think you can do it."
> 
> I guess where the groomer made the mistake was not telling the OP right straight out that he needed to be shaved over his whole body.
> 
> Now, the OP and I can argue all day long about how the dog was enjoying his brushing and why couldn't the groomer just brush out the rest of the mats? I see this every day: people who *say* "oh, he's easy to brush, he likes it, I brush out his mats all the time", and I find something very different when I get the dog on the table. Not saying the owner is lying, just saying they haven't gotten to the sensitive parts, or the worst parts, or they stopped when the dog started yelping, and called the groomer. Leaving the painful part for someone else to do.
> 
> Sometimes, I can pull magic out of my hat and get those mats out without undue stress to the dog. I have products and equipment most dog owners don't, and sometimes that's all it takes. Other times, it is way beyond anything a human can do, and the only humane option is to shave.
> 
> Since I didn't see the dog, I can't say whether the groomer *should* have been able to get the mats out, but I will say that if the dog was crying, she was right to stop. I think she could have been better at communicating what needed to happen.
> 
> So, OP, don't take "revenge" on the groomer, for God's sake--groomers are there to HELP the dog, we don't get into this business because we want to make money hurting dogs. That groomer probably spent hours of blood, sweat & tears trying to groom that dog, only to have the OP get mad. It's a cruel world.
> 
> I understand it's frustrating because the prospective adopters changed their minds once seeing the dog shaved, but again, I say, you dodged a bullet with that.


I just wonder how many shaved dogs all of you proponents of shaving have placed. If you find a good home for this dog the way he looks now, I will be more than happy to send him to you. I know I won't be able to for several months - because normal looking dogs are nearly impossible to place.

NO, SHE HAS NO RIGHT TO SHAVE THE DOG WITHOUT MY PERMISSION!!!

I neither want nor need this kind of "help". I dodged the bullet with the crazy groomer and I made it clear to that vet's office that the woman is never to go near any of our rescue dogs again.


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## LuvShepherds

I would feel the same way you do, however, you left it up to her and she made the decision. Had you been clearer and said shave as little as possible in these areas and listed them, you would be in the right. But you said to shave where it was matted. She may not have known what was matted and what wasn't, or else the mats were more extensive than you realized and the partial shaving wasn't working out. 

I also agree with the family and don't think they are shallow at all. What if the hair doesn't grow back in or what if you were lying to them. Obviously you weren't, but they don't know you and they don't know what the dog looked like before. So, they made the best decision at the time given the circumstances. How many time have people adopted a dog from a rescue that swore it was one thing and it was another? It's happened to people I know, more often than you can imagine. Either not the breed they said it was, or didn't have the background. One of my fosters was supposed to be a sweet, gentle puppy in need of a temporary home. When I picked up the dog, she was full grown and one of the most aggressive and temperamental dogs I've ever had in my house (not a GSD but another large breed). I had her for over a month, and found out later that someone in the rescue knew she was full grown and had been abused, but didn't get that information to my contact or to me. So, from my perspective and experience, the family who turned her down did nothing wrong. 

Would I be furious over all of this? Yes, I would. But I wouldn't do a thing to damage the groomer's business unless she physically harmed the dog, which she didn't.


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## Konotashi

So you would rather the dog endure hours of pain while the groomer meticulously tries to brush out the matts? I imagine that would do more harm than good. Yeah, the dog might look better, but if he had to sit there and endure HOURS of his skin being yanked at, I would imagine that to make him wary or distrustful of getting brushed. Which isn't a good thing if you're going to own a long coat GSD (or any other breed).
Yes, the groomer should have told you that they needed to shave him, but honestly, I think that shaving him was the most humane option, as someone has already stated. 
Or, they could have cut each matt out separately, but then he probably would have looked like a choppy, hacked up mess. 
Do you have before and after pics?


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## wildo

RebelGSD said:


> NO, SHE HAS NO RIGHT TO SHAVE THE DOG WITHOUT MY PERMISSION!!!





RebelGSD said:


> So I said she can shave the rear where it is matted (it was his butt and part of his thigh).


I understand that you're frustrated. However... you gave her permission to shave the dog, at least part of it. And part of it was shaved. Maybe you weren't as clear as you thought over the phone about how much permission you were agreeing to.



RebelGSD said:


> Yes, most people are shallow and go by the looks. They want to know what the companion they select for the next 12 years looks like before they commit.


What is so shallow about wanting to appreciate what you find visually appealing if you are stuck with looking at it every single day for the next 12 or so years? Welcome to reality.

It's just like a recent thread about about personality vs looks. There are plenty of good dogs out there. There's no reason I can't get both, and certainly no reason to think I'm shallow for wanting both. I'm not following that logic train at all...


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## GatorBytes

The point of Rebel is, she did not give full permission, specified what the groomer could cut off based on what the groomer advised. Had the groomer confered with the "paying customer" properly as in "my thoughts are he should be buzzed off - it's too far gone" before making the executive decision this may have been averted - now it's too late and was down and out wrong. Implying that animal cruelty was in question from brushing and did the right thing - no way, not a chance. Communication was in order. It was up to Rebel to decide if this was necessary.

As mentioned by Freestep, she should have been called back as to the status and given the option to retrieve the dog. She showed to p/u and it's bald!

Now what is even more upsetting is that a placed dog is now taking up space when there are two more on death row, that is a travisty
perhaps she can be featured as the dog who almost had a chance but people wanted an accessory, not a pet. make her out to be the little dog that almost got a home until an unruly groomer scalped her (was probably time for lunch)
The groomer was 100% in the wrong.


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## wildo

GatorBytes said:


> perhaps she can be featured as the dog who almost had a chance but people wanted an accessory, not a pet.


That's a pretty extreme view. Once again I ask why you think it's so out of line for someone to know before hand what their getting into when making a long term commitment. I wouldn't own a poodle. Not because they're one of the smartest breeds out there- but because I think they are ugly; can't stand the looks of them. Am I shallow because of my reason for not wanting a poodle? Come on... There's no reason someone can't have an opinion about physical appearance without being called shallow or "wanting an accessory," ESPECIALLY when it comes to a long term commitment. Hmmmmmmmmmm...... I wonder if women ever do this when picking a boyfriend/husband. You bunch of shallow ladies you!


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## Konotashi

I must be shallow, then. When searching for GSD breeders, first thing I do is go look at their dogs' pics and see if I like how they look. If I like that, then I look for everything else (titles, health tests, etc). 
When people are on Petfinder, what's the first thing they're looking for? A photo of an animal that they like the look of. 
When walking through a shelter, what's the first thing adopters look for? A dog they like the look of. 

I don't think the groomer was in the wrong, EXCEPT for the communication factor. Why force a dog to sit through hours of pain just so he looks prettier? Surely you could show them a before pic (if you have one) and say that's what his coat length will grow back out to - only it won't be a matted mess.


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## wildo

Couldn't agree more, Konotashi! Yeah, it sucks the dog is now shaved. But let's not attack the former potential adopters... That's silly.


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## GatorBytes

wildo said:


> That's a pretty extreme view. Once again I ask why you think it's so out of line for someone to know before hand what their getting into when making a long term commitment. I wouldn't own a poodle. Not because they're one of the smartest breeds out there- but because I think they are ugly; can't stand the looks of them. Am I shallow because of my reason for not wanting a poodle? Come on... There's no reason someone can't have an opinion about physical appearance without being called shallow or "wanting an accessory," ESPECIALLY when it comes to a long term commitment. Hmmmmmmmmmm...... I wonder if women ever do this when picking a boyfriend/husband. You bunch of shallow ladies you!


It's my understanding in this world of digital technology, they knew what she looked like, they changed their mind after the damage was done. The intent was to open their heart and home to a dog in need, no? 
THey couldn't/wouldn't ride it out for a few months. Then yeah, they were looking for an accessory. Snobery:shocked:


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## Bear L

Are you going to post a picture of this dog? I want to see how bad it is. It might be adorably weird.


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## Freestep

wildo said:


> What is so shallow about wanting to appreciate what you find visually appealing if you are stuck with looking at it every single day for the next 12 or so years? Welcome to reality.


The dog's HAIR was clipped off... hair grows back! It's only a temporary change, not 12 years!

Yeah, people are shallow, I know. But every time I think I've seen and heard it all, some things still manage to shock me. I stand by what I said about those people who decided they didn't want the dog because he was shaved. I would never, ever, EVER adopt a dog out to a person who would abandon it for cosmetic reasons, especially if the cosmetic condition is only temporary. What happens if, a few years down the line, the dog has a skin condition and loses his hair? "Sorry, we want a long haired GSD, not a bald rat-like thing. Since he doesn't have hair, we don't want him anymore."


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## Freestep

GatorBytes said:


> make her out to be the little dog that almost got a home until an unruly groomer scalped her (was probably time for lunch)
> The groomer was 100% in the wrong.


The groomer was certainly at fault for not communicating better, but it's NOT the groomer's fault that the shallow, vain people turned around and rejected the dog for being shaved.

I think it's unfair to use words like "unruly" and "scalped" regarding the groomer, as though she didn't care about the dog or just wanted the easy way out. Yes, she failed to communicate effectively (some dog-people are not good people-people), but she did what she thought was in the DOG's best interest. The groomer had no way of knowing that this dog's adopters would bail on the poor dog if he was shaved... and even if she did, was she then supposed to hurt the dog in order to make him beautiful for these people? These people that will reject the dog for the stupidest of reasons?


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## Konotashi

Would it be easier to adopt out a dog that's shaved and looks hairless temporarily, or a gorgeous, long coat GSD that is traumatized from a grooming and may become aggressive when it needs to be brushed? And that's something you have to do for any breed with hair like that. And you've obviously seen what happens when this basic need is neglected.
Hours of trauma (yanking/pulling hair and skin) can do that to a dog.


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## GatorBytes

Freestep said:


> The groomer was certainly at fault for not communicating better, but it's NOT the groomer's fault that the shallow, vain people turned around and rejected the dog for being shaved.
> 
> I think it's unfair to use words like "unruly" and "scalped" regarding the groomer, as though she didn't care about the dog or just wanted the easy way out. Yes, she failed to communicate effectively (some dog-people are not good people-people), but she did what she thought was in the DOG's best interest. The groomer had no way of knowing that this dog's adopters would bail on the poor dog if he was shaved... and even if she did, was she then supposed to hurt the dog in order to make him beautiful for these people? These people that will reject the dog for the stupidest of reasons?


unruly and scalped are just metaphors...got tired of "shaved"...didn't mean to offend given the proffesion you are in. The thread has gone to the opinion of whether or not it is o.k. to judge dog on looks. Rebel says unfortunately it is that way, others say well if it were me I'd do the same. 
This was about a groomer who took it upon herself to decide what was right for whatever agenda there was - lunch, get it over with, stress on the dog or whatever.
She had NO right to make that decision when Rebel was clear that she could cut "parts" out and she would work w/that....I'd say the groomer was pretty arrogent...the rest was a consequence of what the groomer did. the people well who can speculate, unless Rebel has and explaination from them. I do think the dog isn't doomed, it's all how you market her, which brings back to the metaphors...just to lighten things up a (tiny) bit.


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## Loneforce

I used to get Ginger shaved for the hot summers. She thought she was beautiful, and people always asked me how old my puppy was. As others stated.... Hair grows back.
View attachment 20000
*before*

View attachment 20001
*After*


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## LuvShepherds

Keep this in perspective. I've spent time recently with a small breed rescue group to help out a friend and they always shave a dog that has any mats at all, everything but the head and the tail. Always. Those dogs are adopted out shaved with the Before pictures, so people can see what they looked like, and usually, what a mess they were. It's possible she's never had to deal with a matted GSD, since the stock coats don't mat. How many people have matted long coats?


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## Freestep

GatorBytes said:


> She had NO right to make that decision when Rebel was clear that she could cut "parts" out and she would work w/that....I'd say the groomer was pretty arrogent...the rest was a consequence of what the groomer did.


Again, I think it was a blessing in disguise. Still not an excuse for not communicating effectively, though. Since I wasn't there and I don't know what was said by whom, there could be a bizillion things that caused the miscommunication, and I can't throw blame around without knowing what actually transpired.

But I have known some groomers who I could definitely describe as "arrogant". It's entirely possible that the groomer just made a bad judgment call, or said "To heck with it, I'm just gonna shave the poor dog." I've certainly been at that point a time or two.

Early on in my career, a woman brought her Samoyed to the grooming shop where I worked. The dog was obese, incontinent, and matted all over, to the skin, with poop-encrusted hair. Of course, his owner insisted he MUST NOT be shaved,  but said we could shave his rear end where most of the poop was getting stuck.

I spent hours on that poor dog. He was so obese he couldn't stand up, so I was trying to get him to lie on his side and relax, but he kept snapping at me. I pulled out all the tricks I knew--I slobbered that dog up with conditioner, combing out bit by bit while wet, using the blow dryer to try pushing the mats out, getting it done slowly but surely, with the dog lying there like a snapping turtle, and he did manage to bite me while I was dematting behind an ear.

FINALLY the dog was finished, clean, fluffy, and mat-free. He looked beautiful. The owner was a bit taken aback by the price, but was very happy with the way he looked. I was exhausted, wet, hairy, bloody, and frazzled after having spent most of the afternoon on the dog.

A few days later, the client called and said the dog's skin was red, irritated and bruised-looking. She took him to the vet and the vet called me to ask about his grooming. All I could tell her was exactly how the grooming went--long, difficult, and uncomfortable. Apparently, the owner was mad and blaming us, thinking we'd burned the dog or something, and was talking about suing.

Eventually, the vet diagnosed an infection in the subcutaneous fat layer, which had probably been going on for some time, but now was visible through the skin, because it was no longer covered with dirt, poop, and matted hair. She didn't think it had anything to do with his grooming, other than the fact that it made the problem visible. But I'd never even heard of a fat infection. All I could think was that the dog's skin had been bruised from all the dematting, and I felt absolutely awful about it. Even though I was "officially" cleared, I still felt awful. Obviously the dog must have been in pain, or he wouldn't have kept snapping at me. But since he hadn't been crying or yelping, I passed it off, figuring he was just a grumpy old dog. I'd only been grooming about a year at the time, and had a lot to learn yet.

After that episode, I swore to myself that I would never, EVER demat a dog like that again. And I've kept that promise.

The moral of the story is... you can do everything the client wants, make the dog look like a million bucks, and it can *still* be the wrong thing to do. Some situations just suck all the way around, but it's the groomer that usually takes the blame.


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## GatorBytes

Freestep, well said. and your story, sad, but funny (visual w/the wet, furry, bloodied:laugh::laugh and moral.


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## dogfaeries

Freestep said:


> The moral of the story is... you can do everything the client wants, make the dog look like a million bucks, and it can *still* be the wrong thing to do. Some situations just suck all the way around, but it's the groomer that usually takes the blame.


I've been grooming for 35 years, and absolutely agree with you. 

I can demat just about anything, given enough time, but _should_ I?? I have no qualms about calling up an owner and telling them that I won't demat their dog, that it's too hard on them. They can either let me shave it, or they take it home and brush it out themselves (which they can't/wont do). If I can't get ahold of someone (and it's a new customer) I just stop. I won't shave a dog without permission (for the exact reason this thread has been started in the first place). If it's a regular dog that is chronically matted, I let the owners know that I _will_ shave their dog if it's matted. 

I do get pretty irritated when the customer is concerned with how their dog looks, at the expense of their dog.


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## starburst

Freestep said:


> The dog's HAIR was clipped off... hair grows back! It's only a temporary change, not 12 years!
> 
> Yeah, people are shallow, I know. But every time I think I've seen and heard it all, some things still manage to shock me. I stand by what I said about those people who decided they didn't want the dog because he was shaved. I* would never, ever, EVER adopt a dog out to a person who would abandon it for cosmetic reasons*, especially if the cosmetic condition is only temporary. What happens if, a few years down the line, the dog has a skin condition and loses his hair? "Sorry, we want a long haired GSD, not a bald rat-like thing. Since he doesn't have hair, we don't want him anymore."


I have to agree with you... anyone who is this shallow doesn't deserve the dog or any dog for that matter.


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## Freestep

dogfaeries said:


> They can either let me shave it, or they take it home and brush it out themselves (which they can't/wont do). If I can't get ahold of someone (and it's a new customer) I just stop. I won't shave a dog without permission (for the exact reason this thread has been started in the first place). If it's a regular dog that is chronically matted, I let the owners know that I _will_ shave their dog if it's matted.


Yep, my policy is exactly the same. 

Sometimes it breaks my heart to shave a dog, but if it's the only thing that can be done, so be it. One of the hardest things I ever had to do was shave the head and ears on an Afghan Hound, making him look like a poodle as he grew out.  Oh, how I wanted to comb that dog's hair out, but there was just no way. He's a tolerant boy up to a point, but his ears are very sensitive.



> I do get pretty irritated when the customer is concerned with how their dog looks, at the expense of their dog.


Yeah. I used to work with a guy who groomed this lady's Cocker, and the dog had to have mats stripped out EVERY time. I'd have to stand there and listen to the dog yelp and cry as he dematted him, and I couldn't stand it.

When I bought out the business, the lady brought her Cocker to me expecting me to do the same. I told her I wouldn't--that it was hurting her dog and I didn't have the heart to do it to him. She said "Well, the other groomer never told me anything about it!" And it took every nerve and fiber of my being not to unload about this groomer, but I simply said "I am telling you about it, and I can't hurt him like that."

It took a long time to convince this lady that I couldn't "just" brush him out. The only thing I could humanely do was shave him, but if she just wanted him clean and dry, I could give him a bath and not brush him. I think that's what I ended up doing. She was going to call around and see if she could find a groomer that would demat him. I'm not sure if she ever did.

Her parting words were "Well now, we all have to suffer a little bit for beauty, don't we?"


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## GatorBytes

Freestep said:


> Her parting words were "Well now, we all have to suffer a little bit for beauty, don't we?"


Holy cow...sounds like that woman needed a wire brush shoved up her


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## PatchonGSD

Freestep said:


> The dog's HAIR was clipped off... hair grows back! It's only a temporary change, not 12 years!
> 
> Yeah, people are shallow, I know. But every time I think I've seen and heard it all, some things still manage to shock me. I stand by what I said about those people who decided they didn't want the dog because he was shaved. I would never, ever, EVER adopt a dog out to a person who would abandon it for cosmetic reasons, especially if the cosmetic condition is only temporary. What happens if, a few years down the line, the dog has a skin condition and loses his hair? "Sorry, we want a long haired GSD, not a bald rat-like thing. Since he doesn't have hair, we don't want him anymore."



:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## Rerun

In regards to all the "who would adopt an ugly bald dog." Thank goodness I didn't feel that way when I adopted my Audrey over 6 years ago who had demodectic mange so bad she was nearly bald and WAS bald on many places, including most of her face. She also had many open wounds from skin infections that seeped goo and nastiness. She was a yucky icky stinky mess but I knew her fur would grow back and she'd be beautiful.

So yeah, I still think it's shallow what they did. Especially since they dog was a LC and clearly would grow the fur back in a few months. My Audrey actually had to sluff off what little she had left before it grew back, and it did all grow back.


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## PatchonGSD

Agreed with the above.....its not like you promised them a dog with 2 ears and he only had one....or a dog with half a tail......Maybe you should post the picture.....who knows, maybe someone with an imagination on this board will fall in love with him!


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## RebelGSD

Just to clarify that nobody abandoned the dog because he is shaved. The applicants were looking at different dogs and this one particularly caught their eye. They were very enthusiastic and the plan was that he would go home with them if things go well. They just felt that they would like to see what the dog looks like before making a lifelong commitment. And it is their right. People shop around when they pick a dog to adopt and the appearance does matter to them. They emailed the next day and said that they would consider him in a couple of months when they can see better what he is like - if they don't find another dog in the meantime. There are many gorgous, sweet dogs out there and while there may be people who pick.a dog out of pity, those are far and between. 

There is a huge difference between abandoning their own pet because of appearance and not picking one that does not display breed characteristics in appearance.

The rescue has three dogs in boarding, awaiting an open foster home, at $300/month/dog. They have decided that, since this dog will be unadoptable for at least two months, to move him into boarding and bring a dog that is adoptable into the foster home instead. No sense in two or more losing a chance of getting into a home for several months for this. The cost of the "miscommunication" is $600-900 in boarding and $150 in transport costs for paid transport to bring the dog back. Sad overall, as with normal appearance he would be highly adoptable. The rescue certainly cannot afford this type of miscommunication financially and there will be a change of policy - no more external grooming. We have groomed and and cleaned up countless dogs, never had to do a a complete shave on one. In all the too many rescue years this is the first time I a see a shaved shepherd live. I have seen a few photos of shaved shepherds on line. So it does not seem to be too common.

To add another consideration, the two dogs that are on our wait list currently - and one of them we won't be able to take because of this - are in gassing shelters. While there is discomfort for the dog during grooming, the discomfort of a dog dying in a gas chamber gets more sympathy from me than the grooming.


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## Shaina

I work at a vet where a badly matted dog was brought in for matts. Poor thing was bleeding from us trying to dematt, and eventually just took off the hair. Sorry, it grows back, and its not our fault the dog was in such poor condition. I dont believe hes unadoptable now, thats just ridiculous and overreacting. Someone would still adopt him if effort was put into it.


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## RebelGSD

Our volunteers had dematted countless dogs without the dog crying and bleeding and will continue to do so in the future. It can be done, with little discomfort to the dog, if the effort is put into it. Bringing the dog to a professional was a mistake which we and a dog are paying for. Obviously, best is to take a dog to a groomer or a vet or a trainer when they don't need it, that will make the professionals happy. 

The fact that a dog is theoretically adoptable does not mean that the dog will get adopted. Thousands of perfectly looking perfectly adoptable dogs die every day in this country because they are not picked by the adopters. And thousands of very adoptable dogs wait in shelters and rescues for months and years because they don't have the flashy look, the age or the breed to make them appealing in the eyes of the adopters. Once in a blue moon it happens that someone takes pity on an old dog or decides to take a chance on a dog with a medical condition or an unattractive looking dog, usually after many months of waiting. Petfinder is a fancy color catalog where people pick by the looks first, and potential adopters never even read the description if they don't find the looks appealing. The fact that those who shaved the dog think it does not affect the dog's chances of getting a home does not change the taste of the public that adopts the dog. Beating the public into adopting a dog they don't like just does not work.

What is done is done, in a couple of months we will be able to place him. It is just sad for the dog that he is stuck for months for something as trivial as matted hair. He is posted on the web page and will be updated as his hair grows in. Lesson learned. I'll make sure to brush out, demat, and bathe a dog before taking the animal to the groomer to avoid getting my dog shaved. Just, kidding, I will skip just the groomer and do it myself.


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## Freestep

People love dogs with a sad story behind them. I'd market this dog with a sad story--though I don't know the particulars, something like this:

This dog came to us in miserably neglected condition. His long, beautiful coat had become so matted that he had to be shaved, and now no one wants him, simply because his hair is shorn! Isn't that sad? His hair will certainly grow back in a few months, but we don't want him to remain homeless until then! Look at his sweet face, he deserves a forever home with a family that loves him no matter what he looks like. Won't you take this wonderful boy home with you today?


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