# Breeders in MI??



## Sophinator (Dec 29, 2009)

I currently own one GSD...and since joining here and due to my lifelong love of GSDs, Im ready for another one! Id like a working dog, one I could do ScH or Protection work with. I know there are quite a few members here from Michigan, and I was just wondering if any of you could refer a breeder with quality dogs who would excel in these types of work (I know its a coin toss as to whether or not they will do well or not, BUT...)? I know choosing a dog for color is ridiculous and often times frowned upon, but Id prefer an all black GSD, so possibly a breeder with dogs that throw black GSDs often? 

Thanks in advance for any information! (Im not looking to buy RIGHT NOW, as Id like to do some more research on what Id like to do with the new pup, but, I need to get the ball rolling!).


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Chris and Tim Wild, and Lisa Clark are all members here and breed excellent working line dogs. I know Chris and Tim have at least two black female breeding dogs (I've seen them in person). The litter galleries on Lisa's site show some black dogs. I don't think black is all that rare among working lines.

http://www.wildhauskennels.com/

http://www.zutreuenhanden.com/


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

2nd the Wilds and Lisa(though I have a Wildhaus pup, so have personally dealt w/ them, awesome people, awesome dogs!!) Both are involved in their own SchH clubs,working/titling their own progeny,which says alot! 
Good that you aren't ready now, as usually there is a waiting list for pups! Maybe visit both of their clubs and get a feel for what you are looking for in your next companion.


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## Amaruq (Aug 29, 2001)

> Originally Posted By: LiesjeChris and Tim Wild, and Lisa Clark are all members here and breed excellent working line dogs. I know Chris and Tim have at least two black female breeding dogs (I've seen them in person). The litter galleries on Lisa's site show some black dogs. I don't think black is all that rare among working lines.
> 
> http://www.wildhauskennels.com/
> 
> http://www.zutreuenhanden.com/


Yep! Depending on where you are there might be other breeders from another state closer or you could have one shipped. But the two posted here have always been on my "short list".


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## Ruthie (Aug 25, 2009)

I train with Chris and Tim and I am very impressed with their breeding program. Their two current breeding bitches are both black and are really great dogs. 

Before we met them and started training, Chris was very helpful to us through e-mail when we were looking for a pup. It just didn't work out with the timing of their litter. Check out their web site. There is a lot of great information and pictures.


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## Sophinator (Dec 29, 2009)

Thanks everyone! I appreciate it. Im going to check out their sites!

And as far as shipping, Im one of those, I have to meet my puppy before I bring it home...call me crazy.


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

Check out Kolenda Kennels, they are in Michigan as well. I have a pup (9 months old) and I know of several other people who own a Kolenda pup, and are completely happy with their purchase. I'm beyond happy - Sigurd is super! Susan is really knowledgeable and she helps you along the way with your pup. They have several amazing dogs, with titles, imported from Germany. Not to mention their dogs are gorgeous! They ship their dogs as well, I've talked to several people via e-mail who live all over the country who own a Kolenda pup. Many from their breeding program are police K9's and into protection, etc. 

http://www.kolendakennels.com/puppies.php check out their current puppies. They do have a lot of upcoming litters, but they have 2 facilities with many workers. All dogs have individual workers to train/care for them. Their grounds are spotless and are great!

Sorry though, they don't breed black GSDs.

Good luck.


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## ellen366 (Nov 2, 2007)

check out connie krebs at http://www.spartanville.com
she's on this forum too; nice person; nice dogs


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I love Connie's Puck, still want to meet him in person some time!!
He is gorgeous!


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Sophinator, I also sent you a PM with some info and a few other breeders.


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: LiesjeSophinator, I also sent you a PM with some info and a few other breeders.


What other breeders are in MI?


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Julie at Alta-Tollhaus has beautiful showlines, no black though...
Ivey Kennels working lines, hobby breeders of police k9's


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

There's a few others I know personally but don't have huge commercial kennels and/or no website.

There are dozens of breeders in MI I can think of offhand, but probably half dozen I personally would consider.


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## LadyHawk (Jan 19, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: RuthieI train with Chris and Tim and I am very impressed with their breeding program. Their two current breeding bitches are both black and are really great dogs.
> ...................... Check out their web site. There is a lot of great information and pictures.


They are also very responsible breeders - 

Whomever you purchase a pup from, PLEASE do your homework!!! 
Chris and Tim have been members here for gosh eons longer than myself- 
They seem very particular and are so knowledgeable as well.... 
Congrats on your decision and best of luck !!!! 
Let us know what you decide!!!!


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## spartshep (Feb 20, 2008)

Ellen~~thanks for your nice comments.

Jane~~thank you, too. I have told you in past that you are welcome here anytime...just let me know


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## Sophinator (Dec 29, 2009)

Thanks everyone again! I appreciate the input so much!

I just talked to Steve Robinson about training for Sophie so Im going to work with her and get her to a point where I feel like introducing a pup would be a good thing, in the meantime, Im going to be checking out these breeders!!









Thanks so much!!


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: SophinatorThanks everyone again! I appreciate the input so much!
> 
> I just talked to Steve Robinson about training for Sophie so Im going to work with her and get her to a point where I feel like introducing a pup would be a good thing, in the meantime, Im going to be checking out these breeders!!
> 
> ...


Let us know who you go with.


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## heritige (Jul 28, 2008)

I would also check out ** removed by admin** They have Kolenda and Fleischerheim bloodlines. very nice dogs!


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: heritageI would also check out ** removed by admin** They have Kolenda and Fleischerheim bloodlines. very nice dogs!


How is naming a kennel advertising?


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

It is advertising, and thus against board rules, when the kennel you are naming is your own, especially when done in a manner that tries to hide the fact that you're recommending yourself.


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: Chris WildIt is advertising, and thus against board rules, when the kennel you are naming is your own, especially when done in a manner that tries to hide the fact that you're recommending yourself.


Isn't it advertising to post a link to your kennel in your signature? I don't see the difference :-/. Not trying to start something, just curious really.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

I don't see the difference either


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## jesusica (Jan 13, 2006)

You really don't see the difference between recommending yourself as a breeder in a manner that implies you are not the breeder but instead a happy puppy buyer or perhaps a fellow breeder endorsing the kennel, and putting a link to your own kennel's web page in your signature that allows visitors to the site to form their opinion on your breeding program? The two aren't even close to the same thing.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Its advertising and everyone knows it - no matter where, when, why, or how your link is posted. It is displayed in order for folks to link directly to a site - i.e. internet advertising. IMO, any link on this form is an advertisement.

In here it appears that it just depends on who is doing it and what is acceptable under some oddly interpreted "rules". I am speaking from experience so don't try to convince me or try to debate with me, I know otherwise. If advertising is not acceptable in here, then rules should state that at no times will a poster or member of this forum place a link to their web-site. But that makes too much sense doesn't it? And you wonder why people are flocking out of here?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

Per the board rules, there is a difference.

People can always post links to their websites, any sort of website whether it has something "for sale", even if that thing is not dog related, in their signatures. Though even here, only links are allowed. People cannot put "For sale go here" in their signature either.

People are not allowed to post threads or replys advertising anything for sale, dog related or no. So saying "I have pups for sale" is not allowed. 

Saying "go check out this kennel, they have very nice dogs for sale" is fine, if it is a true recommendation. It is not fine if it is the person with something to sell, using annonymity to advertise under the guise of a recommendation.

If the new ownership of the board wants to allow blatant advertising, that is their call. Until then, the old rules stay in place and that is that signature links are fine, but blatant advertising is not.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Let's hope the new owner rewrites the rules! rules, rules rules ..... it's the rule, it's in the rules ..... read the rules. read the rules .... 

What happened to common sense?


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

> Originally Posted By: DocIts advertising and everyone knows it - no matter where, when, why, or how your link is posted. It is displayed in order for folks to link directly to a site - i.e. internet advertising. IMO, any link on this form is an advertisement.


Indeed in a way it can be a form of advertising, though a far more benign and subtle one than a for sale post. 

The big difference, and why signature links are allowed, is that a link in a signature, even if that person occasionally has something to sell, serves many purposes other than advertising.

A for sale post has no purpose other than advertising.


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

The rules really aren't rocket science. They are pretty consistent, as is for the most part the interpretation and enforcement by those in charge of doing that. No one makes any one participate on an internet board. If people don't like the rules, they are free to go elsewhere with rules more to their liking.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Chris, it is advertising. Whether it be dogs for sale or a place to find information. It is used to get people to visit your site. Period. 

What other purpose does a link in the signature serve other than to get people to come to your site? To promote your site? A site that may or may not have dogs for sale, a site that may be full of educational material, a site that discusses and or defines a certain type of German shepherd. I am not being combative - I just want to understand the difference?


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

And they have and will continue to do so as long as the rules are used to against some and not others.


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## G-burg (Nov 10, 2002)

The way I see it... this person can also add his/her kennel name to their signature.. problem solved!


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Personally, IMO, I see a huge difference between putting the link to your kennel in your signature (which anyone can do so it is NOT a matter of "the rules are used to against some and not others") and posting on a thread to direct someone to your site as if you don't have a direct link to that kennel.



> Quote:I would also check out ** removed by admin** They have Kolenda and Fleischerheim bloodlines. very nice dogs!


"They" have nice dogs...not "We" have nice dogs. It was posted as if the person did not have anything to do with the kennel which is fundamentally dishonest.

If you think that posting when a litter is born from a well known kennel is advertising, then I would partially buy that. That is saying "Hey We have puppies!!" However, most of the kennels on this board have a waiting list and the puppies are already spoken for. So that is NOT advertising because there are NOT any puppies available.

As far as the links in the signature...anyone can do that and I see Heritage has done that. Yes. That is advertising. However, it is fair and across the board in that anyone can do it.


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## larrydee33 (Feb 25, 2007)

I agree with Doc. it is advertising. This is a breeder influenced and most times breeder controlled forum.
Not one negative word may one say about a breeder buyer after buyer is on this forum seeking information on breeders it is a one way street on this forum.
Please don't tell me to PM the OP. 
You can praise a breeder to the high heavens on this forum. All breeders on this forum don't wear halos there are more than a few snakes in the grass on here. 
So therefore links to a breeders website are allowed.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

I guess a direct link to a web-cam showing the birth of puppies - that are not all sold - isn't advertising then. To say that all kennels have their litters sold before they are born may be stretching things a bit. Or perhaps the advertising of a kennel has increased the traffic to that site and resulted in the owner selling litters before they are born. It is advertising how ever you color it.

I thought the purpose of this forum was educational based - not selling pups or advertising. If so, then all advertising of any kennel should be banned. If this is a place to advertise your kennel - be it by links, pictures of your dogs on the home page, links in signatures, testimonials from owners of your pups, etc. then it shouldn't matter who, what, when, where, or how the message gets out.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: DocI guess a direct link to a web-cam showing the birth of puppies - that are not all sold - isn't advertising then. To say that all kennels have their litters sold before they are born may be stretching things a bit. Or perhaps the advertising of a kennel has increased the traffic to that site and resulted in the owner selling litters before they are born. It is advertising how ever you color it.


That is *not *what I said. <u>Please read my post before being snarky with me.</u> *I did not say* "all kennels have their litters sold before they are born" *I did not say* having a web-cam to the puppies was not advertising.

I was, in fact, partially agreeing with you. Sorry I made that mistake...


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

Actually, a web cam link to pups would be fine. Just as litter pictures are fine.








Adding in text that says "still got 4 available for sale!" would not be fine.

As far as links in signatures, as I said while in some ways it's certainly advertising, they provide other things that a for sale post does not, and that is the difference.

What do they provide? Well, education for one thing. Many many of the links to people on this board have a wealth of educational material on them. And links to more interesting and educational sites as well.

And they also provide credibility for the poster. They are a way for the member to say "here is who I am, what I've accomplished, and the basis of experience and knowledge I have". 

On an educational forum, people are often presented with vastly disenting opinions. It can help tremendously to be able to verify the source of the information. When a bunch of people with years of training experience, which can easily be verified by following the links to their website, say one thing, and a bunch of people with no demonstrable experience say another, this can very much help someone sort out who to listen to. 

Anyone can go on the internet and claim to have a bunch of knowledge and experience on something. Some are more willing than others to show proof of it. When someone is giving advice about training, health, breeding, specific sport activities, whatever... it can be invaluable for other's to be able to verify if the person has any experience in that area to back it up.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

However, most of the kennels on this board have a waiting list and the puppies are already spoken for. So that is NOT advertising because there are NOT any puppies available. Your words.

And I am not being "snarky"

I didn't say you said anything about web-cams. I said that. 

If you agreed partially with me, then it wasn't a mistake.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Then that information should be on another web-site - not one advertising your dogs and any pups that may be available. Otherwise, you are still advertising your dogs/pups along with adding some educational information.

Some folks don't feel a "need" to prove their existence/knowledge to other folks. different strokes for different folks.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

And your words were



> Quote:To say that all kennels have their litters sold before they are born may be stretching things a bit.


Do you see the differences in the two sentences? I did not say "All kennels" I said "most" which is true of the well known kennels on this board.

You are twisting my words to prove your point.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

I click on sig links all the time and I have no interest in trying to buy anyone else's dog nor am I in the market for a puppy.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Most in here - all in here? Are we hung on a word choice? How many kennels are in here that you are referring to? And what is "most" over 50%? 75%? Or are you refering to one kennel? You are speaking in vague terms.

I don't need to twist any words to "prove" any point. I'm not trying to "prove" anything - I am just stating my thoughts on what constitute advertising in here.

Some on here have a different take on what advertising consist of - I just want to see/hear there side of the dialogue.

I stopped trying to "prove" things many years ago. Age has a way of doing that to you.


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

> Originally Posted By: LiesjeI click on sig links all the time and I have no interest in trying to buy anyone else's dog nor am I in the market for a puppy.


So do I. I've found loads of training tips, new equipment suppliers, info about other sports, trainers, clubs and events, a whole lot of dog and bloodline info, and lots of other interesting stuff, some not even dog related, just by following links. And I do enjoy getting to know more about the people I converse with a lot, and their backgrounds.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Next you will tell me that you don't look at the dogs or pups either. Kind of like the kid with the r-rated magazine - he doesn't look at the pictures.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: DocMost in here - all in here? Are we hung on a word choice?


Why yes. I guess I am. When you insert words that have completely different meanings and implications therefore changing the implication of MY sentence and what I'm saying...then yes..I guess I am.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

OK, Chris and Lies, you both are right again. It's not advertising. You gain a lot of information from web-sites. It a wonderful information gathering tool. It may on occasion, sometimes, slightly, appear that a pup or two is for sale and may be sold by an internet site but it's real purpose is to get to know folks better and find informative information. I got it now. I'm was so off on this one. I must of doubled up on my depression meds this morn. roflmoao

I'll try to better next time. I love both your sites. For the information you supply of course.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: DocNext you will tell me that you don't look at the dogs or pups either. Kind of like the kid with the r-rated magazine - he doesn't look at the pictures.


Of course I look at them, but not because I *want* them. If I was in the market for buying a dog, clicking sig links is not how I would "shop". Most often I am looking for links to training pictures. Many breeder sites have links to the training clubs they belong to. I like to see different clubs and look at their training albums or videos of the dogs working.

I've also found great training articles, info on diet and nutrition, links to upcoming events, good equipment for sale....

Do I care if the site has puppies for sale? No, not really. I don't see why we are so hung up on it. Anyone here can put links, URLs, dogs and titles, etc in their sig.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

OK, so why not answer the rest of post. 

I am sorry I didn't state your words exactly. I was wrong.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Because no matter what I say you have your mind set and will only pick out what you want and ignore the rest as you did when I originally posted...so what is the point of even trying to have a conversation?

Have a good day!!


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

I will have a good day. Thanks. IN my world, everyday is Friday if it's not Christmas.


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## Ruthie (Aug 25, 2009)

I really don't see how a link in a signature line is advertising. It is a signature. My work e-mail signature has my company name, my credentials, and many include their company web page. It is not advertising their company; it is telling who they are. It is a very well known and accepted practice in the business world.

I see signatures on the board the same way. When a breeder puts their kennel link in the sig, it tells me more about WHO they are. I sometimes click on their links to view what type of dogs they breed so I get a better understanding of where they are coming from in their posts. To me it is about identity.

Clearly, the person who had their kennel name removed from their post on this thread was misrepresenting themselves. To me, that is the bigger issue.









I see information about breeders being a big part of this board and I would be very disappointed if that were removed. It was very helpful to us when we were searching for a pup, and it wasn't all positive. We got some PMs with the negative stuff too. I feel there was a balanced view of the breeders we asked about.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally Posted By: DocWhat other purpose does a link in the signature serve other than to get people to come to your site? To promote your site? A site that may or may not have dogs for sale, a site that may be full of educational material, a site that discusses and or defines a certain type of German shepherd. I am not being combative - I just want to understand the difference?


It really doesn't matter what the difference is or if there even is one. The rules state that it's okay to put a website link in your signature, period. Chris is a breeder and has a link to her website in her signature, as do some other breeders. I have a link to my dogster pages in my signature. People have links to all sorts of other things in their signatures - photo galleries, blogs, sites that sell some kind of product. So what.











> Originally Posted By: DocAnd they have and will continue to do so as long as the rules are used to against some and not others.


ANYONE can put a link to a website in their signature. How is that unfair? How is that being used against someone when everyone can do it if they want to? You have chosen not to, nobody else has told you you can't. 

I really don't get what the problem is here. The board has defined "advertsing" as a thread saying basically, I have a nice litter available (or a planned litter coming up), contact me if you're interested in buying a puppy, not a website link that may or may not even have any puppies or anything else for sale. Whether you or anyone personally agrees with that definition is beside the point. Those are the rules.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

> Quote:What other breeders are in MI?


This question can be answered by links to kennels thru users signatures. No, not advertising, but information. I asked heritage their kennel name, as I was interested in their program and what lines they had. 
Some people have no idea the amount of breeders in their area, and it is great to have the resource here of sharing information.

Still waiting to see your kennel information, Doc!


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

It will never be on this forum again - ever. I learned my lesson. I told you that. LOL

I meant what other breeders are in MI BESIDES the ones that advertise in here?


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

I agree with Doc...what's good for the goose is good for the gander...and I'm off to spend time with the geese...literally


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: Doc
> 
> I meant what other breeders are in MI BESIDES the ones that advertise in here?


I have a list on my home computer so I can post it when I get home from work. There are more than what's on the list, the list is just ones that have web sites, but still has way more choices than those who post here.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Thanks, Lies.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Doc, that question was from Sigurd's mom on page 1 of this thread, I didn't realize you asked it too. I looked on PDB for your lines and my search was no good, Can you pm me a link to it, pretty please?


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Do a search on PDB - type in Long Worth, then find Vol of Long Worth or any of the dogs in the "D" litter.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/402123.html
Thanks Doc


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Name	Location	Site
Alta-Tollhaus	Marshall	http://24kgsd.com/
Becks	Lansing	http://becksgermanshepherds.com/
Boeselager	Fennville	http://www.boeselagerkennel.com/
Briarwood	Port Huron	http://www.briarwoodshepherds.com/
Browning Haus	Gaylord	http://www.browninghausgermanshepherds.com/
CherCar	St. Johns	http://www.chercarkennels.net/
East German Shepherds	Fairgrove	http://www.eastgermanshepherdpups.com/
Greters	Manton	http://www.gretersgsd.com/
Guardian	Twining	http://www.guardiangermanshepherds.com/
Hess Haus	Adrian	http://www.hesshausshepherds.com/
Hi Lite	Rockford	http://hilitekennels.com/
Ivey Kennel	Marshall	N
Joli's/Whistledown	Algonac	http://www.german-shepherd.com/
K9 International	Lowell	http://www.k9academyinternational.com/
Kolenda Kennels	Dorr	http://www.kolendakennels.com/
Laramie	Port Huron	http://www.laramiegermanshepherds.com/
Michigan GSDs	Coldwater	http://www.migsds.9f.com/
MondouCu	Allegan	http://www.mondoucu.info/
Neuer Monde	Lake Ann	http://www.neuermondeshepherds.com/
Noble	Clifford	http://www.noblegermanshepherds.com/
Pine View	Caro	
Royale Shepherds	Lakeport	http://www.royale.org/
Sandhill	Scotts	http://www.sandhillgermanshepherds.com/
Shadowland	Jerome	http://www.gsdzonesls.myeweb.net/
Spartanville	Jerome	http://www.spartanville.com/
Steppenwolf	Constantine	http://www.steppenwolf-kennel.com/
Stolz Sein Auf	Otsego	
Stroudhaus	Jerome	http://stroudhausshepherds.homestead.com/
Sym-Rae	Ludington	
To The Standard	Higgins Lake	http://www.ttsgermanshepherds.com/
VIP Protection Dogs	Ann Arbor	http://www.vip-protection-dogs.com/
vom Heiss	Interlochen	http://vomheiss.com/index.html
Vom Wayard	Parma	http://www.advancedk9academy.com/
Vom Windlied	Big Rapids	http://windlied.tripod.com/
von Hintz	Grant	http://www.vonhintzgermanshepherds.com/
Von Lakes	Newaygo	http://germanshepherdsbyvonlakes.com/
Von Ochs Stellt	Iron Mountain	http://vosgsd.blogspot.com/
Von Schaubs	Crystal	http://german-shepherddog.com/
Von Witte	Grant	http://vonwitte.homestead.com/home.html
Whitside	Sault Ste. Marie	http://www.whitside.net/
Wildhaus	Ann Arbor	http://www.wildhauskennels.com/
Willimar	Avoca	http://www.willimarshepherds.com/
Wind Dancer	Lexington	http://www.winddancerkennels.com/
Wyman	Midland	http://wymankennel.com/
zu Treuen Haenden	Manchester	http://www.zutreuenhanden.com/


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Wowsa Lies!!!


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Doesn't really copy/paste very nicely so....

http://www.dutchbingo.net/personal/MIBreedersSites.xlsx


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## lcordova (Jun 4, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: Ruthie
> 
> Clearly, the person who had their kennel name removed from their post on this thread was misrepresenting themselves. To me, that is the bigger issue.


I dont know why this went in another direction, but THIS WAS the breaking point. For me, that Im a regular reader of this forum looking to learn & learn 
& learn...), when a person like this lady writes "I have a 9 month old puppy...Im very happy with it...bla..bla..bla..", then she is NOT acting like the breeder of that dog. She is acting like a customer who is giving a reference.

If she is the breeder of that dog, then in a very malicious way, she is deceiving the original poster of the question and everybody who reads this forum under the assumption that recommendations and comments and everything in this forum is done with good faith.

Its the first time in this forum that Ive read somebody that lacks so much transparency. For me this lady is NOT self-advertising, she is LYING to everyone of us and this makes me very upset. 

I needed to share this...because if this forum allows this then it will lost the INTEGRITY that has make me an avid reader.

Luis


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## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

Doc - If you disagree with so much of what this board does, I'm curious why you maintain your membership here.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

I just state my opinion like everyone else. I can not sit back and agree with everything just because it is popular. I feel like I have something to contribute even if it goes against the majority of folks in here.

Why do you stay around here Barb? To ask members mean spirited questions?


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

OK, be nice and let's try not to get personal.









Admin

********


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)




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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

So, the point is that you should only post to this board if you agree with what's being said. Sounds kind of boring to me


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I think the point was that you can disagree all you want but personal attacks are not tolerated per the forum rules.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally Posted By: kingstonSo, the point is that you should only post to this board if you agree with what's being said. Sounds kind of boring to me


No. Well, unless it's impossible for you to disagree with someone and still treat them with courtesy and respect, to avoid attacking their character, to not make defamatory statements about them. Most people manage to express themselves, even when they disagree with others on some pretty inflammatory topics, without running afoul of the board rules. It's actually not that hard to do, and yet there are always a few people that can't manage to control themselves. 

*this is not directed at anyone in particular or even this thread, it's just a general response to kingston's question*


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