# Non-responsive breeders



## LenaS (Nov 7, 2016)

I have contacted Canine Concepts in Alabama a few times, and they never respond. Is it normal for a reputable breeder to just simply ignore someone who is trying to get more information on their dogs/puppies?


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

no - but giving them the benefit of the doubt - email boxes are more clogged with junk mail daily than the paper mail....not everyone is online 4-10 hours a day....and many people from the generations born before 1990 are just not computer junkies....

Calling on the phone can be the best way to really connect with any one who is not a computer junkie!   


Lee


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## zetti (May 11, 2014)

wolfstraum said:


> no - but giving them the benefit of the doubt - email boxes are more clogged with junk mail daily than the paper mail....not everyone is online 4-10 hours a day....and many people from the generations born before 1990 are just not computer junkies....
> 
> Calling on the phone can be the best way to really connect with any one who is not a computer junkie!
> 
> ...


Hey now! I was born well before 1990 and you'll have a much easier time reaching me via email than phone. Text would be second best. 

My own personal bias is that I only want to deal with breeders who are readily available if I have questions or problems after the sale. I looked at Canine Concepts website and they list their phone numbers before their email, which suggests to me they prefer a phone call. I'd try that.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

zetti said:


> Hey now! I was born well before 1990 and you'll have a much easier time reaching me via email than phone. Text would be second best.
> 
> My own personal bias is that I only want to deal with breeders who are readily available if I have questions or problems after the sale. I looked at Canine Concepts website and they list their phone numbers before their email, which suggests to me they prefer a phone call. I'd try that.


LOL I was too and I use the internet and email and reluctantly text - I hate little teeny tiny text on PM and texts.....but I know Gary and Pam don't sit on FB or anything all day


Lee


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

To be fair... I can understand e mails such as "how much are your puppies?" Or "I'm looking to add a dog in 2-3years..." being pushed aside and given less priority depending on the amount of e mails and inquiries they receive in a day. Just a thought. But I agree - if e mail isn't working, call.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

When I was searching, several good breeders never got back to me. They don't have time to give out general information. When I got more specific and I was ready to buy, I got more replies. If you want to buy and a breeder still ignores you, find another one.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

a good email (or phone call) will get you a lot farther than a general email. 
Tell them about yourself. 
Tell them why you are looking at their dogs in particular. 
Be specific in your inquiry.


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## squerly (Aug 3, 2008)

LenaS said:


> I have contacted Canine Concepts in Alabama a few times, and they never respond. Is it normal for a reputable breeder to just simply ignore someone who is trying to get more information on their dogs/puppies?


Don't you just hate that? I went through the same thing with several breeders, all of which eventually got back with me, but man, they sure did take their time. I got so frustrated that I started contacting breeders in the Netherlands (and I'm in the USA) because they were quite a bit more prompt in their reply's.

The funny thing was the kennel in the Netherlands said it would be way to expensive to ship one of his dogs to the states and referred me to a breeder (whom he said was top notch) in California. So I emailed the Calif kennel twice and left a phone message. Never hear back from him. Go figure? I actually started to wonder if I was on some kind of No Sell list or something!


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

It does look like the phone number is featured before the e-mail so maybe they prefer e-mails.always wanted to e-mail them and ask them about the sire of my current dog-they used to own him-hope you hear back from them


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

squerly said:


> Don't you just hate that? I went through the same thing with several breeders, all of which eventually got back with me, but man, they sure did take their time. I got so frustrated that I started contacting breeders in the Netherlands (and I'm in the USA) because they were quite a bit more prompt in their reply's.
> 
> The funny thing was the kennel in the Netherlands said it would be way to expensive to ship one of his dogs to the states and referred me to a breeder (whom he said was top notch) in California. So I emailed the Calif kennel twice and left a phone message. Never hear back from him. Go figure? I actually started to wonder if I was on some kind of No Sell list or something!


A lot of kennels in other countries are just that - kennels and that is their primary job. They do the dogs as their primary function and often have kennel help to deal with most of the day to day upkeep of dogs and facilities.

Here in the US, most breeders have a day job. Plus family. Plus time spent training, trialing, traveling to shows or to do a breeding and then comes their time to answer emails and inquiries from potential buyers. Time spent on getting back to potential customers is at the bottom of the list.


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## squerly (Aug 3, 2008)

Dainerra said:


> A lot of kennels in other countries are just that - kennels and that is their primary job. They do the dogs as their primary function and often have kennel help to deal with most of the day to day upkeep of dogs and facilities.
> 
> Here in the US, most breeders have a day job. Plus family. Plus time spent training, trialing, traveling to shows or to do a breeding and then comes their time to answer emails and inquiries from potential buyers. Time spent on getting back to potential customers is at the bottom of the list.


I get it, really I do. But if you're selling puppies for $2,500-$3,500 apiece and you're not returning calls for several days then there's little reason for me to believe you're going to return my call later when I might need you. I mean, if service is this bad _before_ the sale, what's it going to be like _after _they have my money?


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

there is no hurry to answer a "hey I want a puppy email" in my opinion. Most have pups almost entirely sold and have waiting lists. They don't need to jump through hoops to clinch the sale. Maybe their time is spent chatting with current buyers? 

Shoot, I don't always return phone calls from friends/family within 2-3 days.


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## maxtmill (Dec 28, 2010)

Dainerra said:


> a good email (or phone call) will get you a lot farther than a general email.
> Tell them about yourself.
> Tell them why you are looking at their dogs in particular.
> Be specific in your inquiry.


I agree. When I first contacted my chosen breeder, I told her that I was not in a hurry, and wouldn't take another dog before my elderly pug passed away. My pug required almost constant care, and toward the end, I spent many nights up holding her, giving her meds, and administering subcutaneous fluids. I told the breeder about myself and the type of shepherd I was looking for. She responded promptly, and now, TWO years later, my shepherd will be arriving soon! My breeder picked the dog for me based on my wants and needs. She will be perfect, I am sure! She arrives Friday!


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## squerly (Aug 3, 2008)

Dainerra said:


> there is no hurry to answer a "hey I want a puppy email" in my opinion.


 It implies professionalism and displays courtesy to the person responding to your advertisement.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

yes but the point is, when do you consider it timely to respond? Me, it depends on the email. If it's the typical "puppy buyer" email asking questions that were actually in the ad, it gets deleted.

A detailed email that actually shows that they read the add and did at least some basic research that the breeder's dogs might be a good match, it usually gets answered when there is time. That may be a couple days. That may be in a couple weeks.

Many of the breeders I know, perhaps the majority, take at least a week or two to answer emails. Why? Because during show season they might only be home a couple days a month. It's much easier to answer emails then.


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## Galathiel (Nov 30, 2012)

My breeder was an older lady. She had a contact email on her website, but I didn't hear back that quickly. I picked up the phone and was able to talk to her immediately .. and for about half an hour at least 'grin'. Some just don't check their email as often as people who sit at the computer at work all day.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Some breeders you have to get in touch with by phone and others respond to emails. I reached out both ways you are sure to get a response and that might not be right away as other said with breeder's hectic schedules.


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

You would not believe how many times I have received emails where the only thing written is 'do you have any puppies?' No name, nothing. I always answered, usually to tell them they will have more answers if they give a little information on what they are looking for and sign their name. I know many who just delete them. The more information you gave me, the more questions you asked, the more likely I wanted you to have one of my dogs.


If you were to write and tell about yourself, your family, your yard, your plans for the dog, what you want to do with it, etc., most would get answers back. If you ask questions and show you've done your research, breeders get interested in you. I got my first dog before the days of internet when you wrote a letter. I included all about myself and my family, my experience with dogs, what I planned to do with the dog, asked questions about health tests, etc., and included my phone number. I got a call back the day they received my letter. 


If the phone number was listed first in the contact information, I'd contact them that way first.


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## creegh (Sep 12, 2014)

Try messaging on Facebook. Friends who train with him said he's very responsive there.


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## Xeph (Jun 19, 2005)

I hate it when I get back to somebody promptly (about puppies) and *they* never respond!

I typically respond within a few hours (sometimes minutes) of an email. And I far prefer email to the phone. One puppy I sold, she got shipped across the country (from PA to WA)...to this day I still haven't talked to him on the phone, and we're both totally ok with that.

We talk almost daily


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## LenaS (Nov 7, 2016)

Thank you for the responses, its actually nice to get responses here  Well, a lot of responses here automatically assumed that my inquires were ...how do I say it...not very "professional". However,
- I contacted CC by phone/email/Facebook;
- In addition to my general inquires, I contacted them about a specific posting on their Facebook page - they have a puppy available and the posting actually said "Please inquire" (the posting have been there for some time and was actually re-posted, so that made me think that the puppy was still available and they were still looking for a home for him) - well, still, no response;
- When I contact someone, I usually introduce myself/family, state when we are planning to add a puppy to the family, our plans for the puppy, ask if there is a waiting list, etc, so no, its not just "Hi, how much are your puppies" type of email/call/etc;
- I understand that breeders are busy, so I usually do not expect an immediate response, however, eventually, it would be nice to get something to the extent "We are placing with working homes only/pet only; contact us later, we don't have any puppies at the time," etc.
- Just a basic courtesy of a response would be greatly appreciated.


Plus, some people respond to some questions, but then disappear when I ask about the price....is it wrong to ask about the price? I think its a legitimate question, isn't it, since I am the one who is going to be paying it...? 


Just to sum up, I always thought that reputable breeders would at least get back to you with a short response, and there are some wonderful breeders I have contacted that responded and answered my questions, and even if you don't have puppies or looking for a different type of home for your puppy, its still nice to hear something in return to your inquiry.


I also completely agree with Squerly: "But if you're selling puppies for $2,500-$3,500 apiece and you're not returning calls for several days then there's little reason for me to believe you're going to return my call later when I might need you. I mean, if service is this bad _before_ the sale, what's it going to be like _after _they have my money?"


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## Springbrz (Aug 13, 2013)

Just some thoughts: 
Don't discount that your email may have gone directly to the breeders junk mail folder by no fault of yours or theirs and they never saw it. It happens I'm sure. Especially if you have a yahoo, hotmail, aol type email address. If more than a week has passed I would try giving them a call. 
I think specific subject lines with emails would be more likely to get a response as well. IE: Serious inquiry for Z litter pup or Serious inquiry abc x cdf breeding as opposed to looking for a puppy or other generic/vague lines or worse no subject at all.


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## Blitzkrieg1 (Jul 31, 2012)

Once you have been doing business for a while you get a feel for time wasters and trouble. If you sound like a time waster (someone that wants to talk about a puppy they want a decade from now for example) or someone that's asking a thousand inane questions then I know I don't generally bother to respond and neither do many others.


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## melissajancie (Dec 22, 2016)

squerly said:


> It implies professionalism and displays courtesy to the person responding to your advertisement.



I couldn't agree more! Yes, we are all busy with our lives but if breeding is your livelihood then you should respond to all potential customers. People asking for a price do so for a reason. They may not be able to afford a $3K to $4K puppy but they have no idea what your pricing is if you don't list it on your website.

In researching breeders and trainers I found many websites that did not list pricing at all and instead would indicate "Please contact for pricing" As buyers we have no idea if your pricing is going to be $500 or $3K. Don't assume that because someone asks about pricing that they can't afford a higher priced puppy. There are many first time GSD owners that are not familiar with the specific breeding lines so they have no idea how much the puppies are going for and let's face it - most of the websites use pretty fancy names so they may not be able to determine an approximate cost for the litter pups.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

I agree with both sides of the answers. It's a bit weird. 

As a buyer, we are a consumer. We are trying to purchase a product that someone has created. The seller should want to engage and at least be courteous enough to give some sort of response. 

As a breeder, they are busy. Good breeders get a lot of interest and communications from potential buyers, they may have the ability to be picky and not worry about responding to every email. They make have something else going big on in their life that is precluding the ability to return an email. Who knows. Maybe they just didn't like the ilk of your email and opted to not respond. 

Go somewhere else. Quit trying so hard to get their attention. There are plenty of very good even great breeders out there that will be happy to talk with you. While I am sure that this breeder has great dogs, they are obviously not giving you the communication that you want, so walk away. Just walk away. Quit worrying about they why. It just is.


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## sass (Jun 22, 2016)

Hi there! I'm the friend that trains with him. He does not run the CC page - someone else does. When I mentioned Facebook, I meant his personal page. He generally stays on his working-dog.eu account and his personal Facebook when he navigates a computer. What generally happens lately is if the puppy is at their place, I'll post a picture to my account and the person who runs the CC page will grab it from there and post it. It is comical to listen to him and his wife argue over why a picture that she sent hasn't gotten to his phone or computer.

If you'd like me to get a message to him, I'm going up there today. If you'd rather go somewhere else, I understand too! If you don't mind me asking, which litter are you referring to? That'll help.


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## squerly (Aug 3, 2008)

Wow, has anyone looked at the videos on their web page? Unbelievably well trained dogs. Check out Satoris Puma at 12 months. Really looking sharp!


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## sass (Jun 22, 2016)

squerly - that's not one of his dogs, that's a Bolle daughter in Germany with a phenomenal trainer.







The page generally shares dogs from his breedings, but it will occasionally share dogs out of his current stock, like Puma.


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## squerly (Aug 3, 2008)

sass said:


> squerly - that's not one of his dogs, that's a Bolle daughter in Germany with a phenomenal trainer.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh, my mistake. But yes, a phenomenal trainer for sure. I would love to have that gift, must be really fulfilling to be responsible for results of that nature.


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## Femfa (May 29, 2016)

That's a great video. Beautifully trained and very inclined to do work, which is always a pleasure to see. 

As for timely responses from breeders... I've never been in contact with a good breeder who had the ability to respond immediately. Even when it came to my parrots, the breeders who contacted me immediately I ended up walking away from because they seemed desperate to make the sale rather than evaluate how suitable I was. A lot of breeders have also moved to web pages where you have to fill out an "Adoption Form" of sorts, and you have to spend a minimum of 15-20 minutes answering questions to the best of your ability so the breeder can quickly see how suitable you are and decide whether or not to get in contact with you. When I was directing my SIL in finding a great Golden Retriever breeder, the breeder's page was set up like that and her puppies were in high demand. Many were spoken for previously and so my SIL was on a wait list, unable to actually get a pup until basically the third litter.

IMO, if it's a breeding you're very interested in it should come across to the breeder and they will generally take interest in you to see how suitable you are. Alternatively, don't be surprised if you have to wait a long time for a specific breeder if that's the route you go. There are several talented lines out there and many experienced breeders that produce excellent dogs. My short list has about 6 breeders on it, all of which I would be more than thrilled to have a pup from.


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## LTL King (Jan 22, 2017)

You shouldn't get a response only if I'm ready to fork over $1000 for a puppy. 
So your saying you will only talk with me if I have money.
I contacted 20+ breeders 15 of them got back with me within 2 days. 
I asked if I could come over and look at the parents and puppies. 
When I did go over. Some just walk you by everything and ok fork it it over. 
I've had 1-2 walk around everywhere then say here are our puppies and let you play a little. 
Do you have any questions. 
Have you decided. 
Which would you like. 
Here's our contract and so on. 

A good breeder should always want to see you in person. Even the ones selling at 1500 or one even less. 
They SHOULD be scrutinizing you as well. 
Are you just interested in family member or just looking for a dog you can abuse. 

Ask some questions in the email or text as well as. 
Am I able to come over and see your dogs. 
(What I'm actually saying is can I come over and see your facilities. Do you keep them in you 500 sqft backyard or do you have some space. Are you letting them run and whoever ends up pregnant is the lucky girl and guy.)
If your breeding a reasonable amount of litters per year. You shouldn't have a day job unless you have someone there to keep the place clean and interact with the dogs throughout the day.)


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## Xeph (Jun 19, 2005)

*A good breeder should always want to see you in person. Even the ones selling at 1500 or one even less. *
Meh, seeing in person is not always necessary, nor is it realistic. I live in Western PA and shipped a dog to Washington state. Owner and I haven't met. Dog is in a great home.

A person I did see in person and considered a friend had a puppy of mine and almost starved him to death, so, y'know.

I'm pretty forthright about my animals and my setup, though. People are welcome to come by (with an appointment) and see the crew. They shouldn't be expecting anything state of the art. I'm small time, living in the suburbs. But the dogs are well cared for, in proper condition, they show and do performance work.

I spend lots of time trying to weed out the good buyers from the bad, but there are certain things that aren't particularly necessary and are kinda silly when it comes to "Good breeder/bad breeder" lists.


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## Galathiel (Nov 30, 2012)

I'm not sure a lot of good breeders would want someone who was making the rounds doing a bunch of 'window shopping' exposing their pups to every place they have been.


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## zetti (May 11, 2014)

Galathiel said:


> I'm not sure a lot of good breeders would want someone who was making the rounds doing a bunch of 'window shopping' exposing their pups to every place they have been.


I totally agree with you. Many breeders are very cautious about who they allow on their property due to the Parvo risk. It could be a disaster.

It also limits you to local breeders. I bought my Raff out of state, sight unseen. Not my first time. I'm deleriously happy with him.


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