# Dealing with two sport dogs in the home and on the training field



## Tennessee (Apr 13, 2017)

Hey guys and gals, so I've got a 5ish month WLGSD im training in Schutzhund with a trainer but I'm looking to add a male Dutchie to our home also for the same purpose. Family, sport, pp dog. This should happen when the GSD is about 1 years old. 

I'm looking for any advice, hints, tools, tricks, strategies etc etc y'all use to effectively bond, train, and live with two working type dogs. 

Any advice or personal stories are totally welcome. 

Thanks


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

Crate and rotate during training. Having both dogs out at the same time while working on a skill really muddies up the process. On the other hand, working with one dog outside with the other in the house, really motivates the 2nd dog to get busy after I swap them. 

Also I suggest waiting until your Shepherd is pretty close to behaving the way you like. Your new dog will use your first dog as a role model.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Tennessee said:


> Hey guys and gals, so I've got a 5ish month WLGSD im training in Schutzhund with a trainer but I'm looking to add a male Dutchie to our home also for the same purpose. Family, sport, pp dog. This should happen when the GSD is about 1 years old.
> 
> I'm looking for any advice, hints, tools, tricks, strategies etc etc y'all use to effectively bond, train, and live with two working type dogs.
> 
> ...


I think that unless you've got a fair amount of experience you didn't mention, training wise, your going to overwhelm yourself trying to work two young dogs. I'd wait till you've gotten where you want to with the shepherd before adding another dog.


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

I'd also recommend waiting until the shepherd is fully adult and trained- around 3 years old. It's really hard to actually and productively work two dogs at once, particularly when with the Dutchie you are really going to want to build a solid foundation those first 6-8 months or so. 

It can be helpful to back tie the younger dog while you train the adult, they learn a lot that way. But you certainly are going to need to train each dog separately, meaning double the time. 

Also, I'd get a male and a female. I know people have different experiences, so that can vary, but in my experience, two male shepherds is a gamble, while my females get along, or can be easily persuaded to get along if any issues arise.


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## Pytheis (Sep 23, 2016)

Muskeg said:


> Also, I'd get a male and a female. I know people have different experiences, so that can vary, but in my experience, two male shepherds is a gamble, while my females get along, or can be easily persuaded to get along if any issues arise.


That's very interesting, Muskeg. I was going to say the exact opposite. I've actually never personally met someone who has two female dogs that get along well. I've seen two male dogs get along like best friends, but never two females. I guess that everything really does depend on the individual dogs!


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## Tennessee (Apr 13, 2017)

Muskeg said:


> I'd also recommend waiting until the shepherd is fully adult and trained- around 3 years old. It's really hard to actually and productively work two dogs at once, particularly when with the Dutchie you are really going to want to build a solid foundation those first 6-8 months or so.
> 
> It can be helpful to back tie the younger dog while you train the adult, they learn a lot that way. But you certainly are going to need to train each dog separately, meaning double the time.
> 
> Also, I'd get a male and a female. I know people have different experiences, so that can vary, but in my experience, two male shepherds is a gamble, while my females get along, or can be easily persuaded to get along if any issues arise.


Current dog is a female, that's why I want a male. 

Thanks for the advice


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I guess I am a lightweight, I am struggling to keep up with my two dogs. My 10year old wl GSD still feels and acts 3 although she is retired. She does not accept retirement.

She competes in rally in real life
cyber rally when we can't travel
and learning and earning trick dog titles because these other two don't satisfy her.

My male is 2, training and competing in rally and AKC tracking. Dock diving for fun, although I bet he could be competitive if I ever had time to make an effort.

He is a mellow ish white shepherd.

I have no kids at home. Most of the time I am pooped and they DONT get training every day, although they do get a walk every day.

Today, I took him to dock diving practice for an hour and a half so a fair workout swimming. We also ran errands together and he did some service dog training before diving. They aren't getting a walk today, i'm spent. very unusual. he is plaYing in the yard now. he will be fine. he can skip a walk every once in awhile.

Tomorrow I will track him because it is going to be a cooler day. A few days during the week this coming week I will be so busy that they will be kennelled or playing in the yard and a quick walk and they will have to cope.


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

Ah, OK. You will be fine with a male-female combo! 

It's up to you how much time you have, but I like to wait three years between working dogs unless there are extenuating circumstances.


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## mycobraracr (Dec 4, 2011)

I'm on the 'wait until the first one is older and more trained' wagon. At a year old, training is really just starting to get serious. Again your own experience level will have something to do with this. 

I have four working/sport dogs in my house. Three females 9 1/2 years, almost 4 years, and 8 months of age and one male 3 years old. We make it work. We do crate/kennel rotations and everyone gets people, dog and freedom time. For the most part they all get along except for my old grumpy female. She only likes our pet dog. Two are handled by me and two by my wife and our pet dog handles us lol.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

could you clarify -- you said "im training in Schutzhund with a trainer but "

do you mean you are taking her to a club and you are handling her , training in the sport , OR

she is being trained by someone else , a trainer , in the sport -- there are people who buy training and titles 

what ever the case I would wait - better for the dogs and you


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## cloudpump (Oct 20, 2015)

I've got a 20-21 mos old male and a 4 mos old female. I'm curretly crate and rotating for the most part. My male is too rough with her. 
I train them separately. I also let her watch when I train. Dogs learn by seeing. 
It really comes down to how much time you want to devote to training. 
I'm a big believer in less is more with a young puppy. So i m not really teaching her too much too fast.


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## Bentwings1 (May 29, 2017)

I don't think you quite realizes just how much work it is to train a good Schutzhund/IPO dog. You have three separate areas to train. Tracking, obedience and protection. It's nearly a full time job. Once my last GSD was reasonably proficient at tracking I began laying tracks before work in the morning then running them in the evening. Often 3 thousand yard tracks with multiple articles on each. Fortunately I had several tracking fields fairly close together but it still was nearly dark in the summer before we were done. All weather BTW. Then two nights a week we did obedience, again until dark. We didn't enter a trial until my dog could do SCH III level obedience.

Then two nights a week a friend and I got together for protection work. Since there was two of us we worked both our dogs well past dark with light trees that I built. We had four big truck batteries to lug out on the field. I usually took one night a week to bicycle about 12 miles to build stamina in the dog...and me. Sat were for group protection training and obedience proofing. Again it was nearly an all day event. Sun we usually went for long walks and did house work. 

Oh yes, my ex wife didn't especially like the SCH work and made me bring the two boys both in diapers along. I changed lots of diapers on the tailgate. As it turns out it's one of the few things they remember from that age.

I really don't know how I had the energy to do this. I guess I was much younger and more driven.

Most people back then bought dogs with at least one title so it wasn't quite as hard as starting from a pup. 

Keep in mind that not every GSD. Has the genetics, hardness and nerves for protection work. Very few American dogs. You need a very well bred dog or he simply will not be able to do the work. 

I'd spend time having both dogs carefully evaluated for protection work. They may show promise at an early age and fail as they become adults. Poor handling and helper work can stop you dead so be careful in the early times. Make sure you have a good understanding of the rules for each event and how they change as you advance. It will be necessary to join USCoA and get a score book for each dog.

Please don't start with the idea of fun and games. It's a lot of very hard work.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I have two males I work(one is retired from trialing, but we still train as I can't give him up to couch yet)
If I had a do over, I would have isolated the younger male from the older one. 
I have seen some issues that I could have avoided if I had done so. Instead, younger male isn't as powerful in protection due to my older dog showing subtle dominance. Example, younger dog won't lift leg to pee, that doesn't sound like a big deal, but it carries over to the whole world of older males influence.
Our obedience could be much better when it comes to engagement with me. Older male is younger males 'role model' instead of me being his focus, world.
Tracking is fine, as both have it genetically. As tracking is more individual with the dogs natural instinct taking over, the older males influence has no effect on that phase...whew.


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

I have a 6 year old female I am training and trialing in IPO currently and will be bringing our new pup home before the end of the year if all goes well with the breeding.

My current girl is pushy, very strong and likes things to go her way no matter what she is doing. She is very social though and enjoys puppies and playmates.

However, puppy and my current girl will be separate unless we can directly supervise and for limited time. My male is a complete push over with the girls so if pup is a female then I will allow more interactions with him. 

Both my current dogs are more interested in me than each other so I am hoping to continue this.


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## cdwoodcox (Jul 4, 2015)

Bentwings1 said:


> Please don't start with the idea of fun and games. It's a lot of very hard work.



It is a lot of hard work. But , if it's not fun why the **** do it. Me and my dogs have a blast training. If it wasn't fun for me and my dogs, I just wouldn't do it.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

If you plan on training to the point of trialing in IPO Tennessee, this was how things went for me. I've had some overlap with a more or less finished dog a couple of times when I started a new pup, and I had one period with 2 young dogs overlap. I never got any benefit from the one watching the other. All I got was one frustrated dog or pup that was more like a competitive feeling with the two. Nothing worth while.

I never tried using the older one to teach anything to a younger one. All I've ever done is made sure they got along. I think I'd worry about a pup being dependent on the older dog in the context of training, so I don't see myself ever doing that.

Something thats maybe a little different with IPO then some other things, its not like you just go to a class and then test what you've done there and paid someone to teach you. Even with paying a trainer, generally to get to trialing you do some things, especially tracking with other members. Its more like friends giving their time to help each other. If its going to be everyone just having to help with your dogs, you may have a tough time. As your pup now gets experience and succeeds at all these different things, she's going to want to do more and more. At 1yr to 2.5-3yrs, its tough to satisfy that and put the effort in with a puppy. I'd worry about it being a competitive situation that's hard to manage.

When your girls 4 or 5, its just easier to go into almost a maintenance kind of training with her and just put in a little extra work before a trial. She's more likely to be settled down by then and satisfied with that while you start a puppy. The other thing, you want a Dutch Shepherd. There's reasons why they're aren't a whole ton of them around or doing sport. I think its a different skill set to succeed with one. I don't think they're the breed for someone who's going to work and raise a family, try to train and trial a German Shepherd, and do it all at once and that doesn't even consider whether or not you have access to the right helpers. I know you said you're not looking to be talked out of anything and you have your reasons, but you're getting the comments you are for a lot of different reasons.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

While I have worked 2 dogs at the same time (actually at one point, 3) and had young dogs up and coming, I have never put the time into the young dog or the second dog as I put into my primary dog. You will find yourself comparing and putting the most time into the one you like the most, the one that is the most fun to work. I have found over the years that having a titled dog and then the up and coming puppy the best situation. I was trialing 3 dogs at a time for several years and, except for Vala who was just doing her tracking titles, the younger dogs showed the divided focus. I, personally, would wait until the older dog, at the minimum, is ready for its IPO1 before getting a puppy. 

As far as living situation. My dogs are crated while another dogs is working and, for the most part, don't run with other dogs (but I have bitches and there is a reason they are called "bitches"). I rotate who hangs with me while I am outside or in the house or who sleeps with me. I have sold all of my young dogs and am concentrating on my current dog, LB, and will keep a puppy from her litter late this year. There will be 4.5 years between them and LB will be almost done with being titled and ready to essentially retire before the pup is ready to even think about titling (in 2.5 years).


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

lhczth said:


> While I have worked 2 dogs at the same time (actually at one point, 3) and had young dogs up and coming, I have never put the time into the young dog or the second dog as I put into my primary dog. You will find yourself comparing and putting the most time into the one you like the most, the one that is the most fun to work. I have found over the years that having a titled dog and then the up and coming puppy the best situation. I was trialing 3 dogs at a time for several years and, except for Vala who was just doing her tracking titles, the younger dogs showed the divided focus. I, personally, would wait until the older dog, at the minimum, is ready for its IPO1 before getting a puppy.
> 
> As far as living situation. My dogs are crated while another dogs is working and, for the most part, don't run with other dogs (but I have bitches and there is a reason they are called "bitches"). I rotate who hangs with me while I am outside or in the house or who sleeps with me. I have sold all of my young dogs and am concentrating on my current dog, LB, and will keep a puppy from her litter late this year. There will be 4.5 years between them and LB will be almost done with being titled and ready to essentially retire before the pup is ready to even think about titling (in 2.5 years).



I think this is ideal.

My girl is 6 years, has her BH and going for her IPO1 in October, puppy is due home in December. My older girl will be done and retired by the time puppy is ready to really start hardcore training. 

I like being able to have my attention focused on one dog, the sport (IPO) is hard enough with one, I can't imagine doing it with multiple dogs.


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## Tennessee (Apr 13, 2017)

Thanks for the advice everyone!

Given me lot to think about, I'll re read this thread a couple times and glean the relevant info from it.


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