# Socializing sure has changed?....



## griz (Jan 1, 2001)

I have been reading and researching socialization and while I always knew dogs needed socialization ( and have done so in the past ).. it seems that things have changed a bit over the last few years.

I planned on taking said puppy everywhere, but after reading a few things, I am not suppose to let people pet it ... or give it treats? 
So basically, I just take said puppy out and just expose it to as many people and things as I can but no touchy?
And I don't like or do dog parks, but have a few well socialized dogs that can tolerate/ignore puppy ( and put in his place if needed) but planned on doing a puppy K class. But if when do I cut off the puppy play dates ?


----------



## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

You can do whatever you like. Everyone here has very strong opinions. I let people coming into my home who I invite to throw treats. I stopped doing that in public because I don't want my dogs eating random junk. I let the vet's office feed them because I want them to love the vet.


----------



## kshadow (Oct 25, 2015)

Go with what YOU think feels right for YOU.
Socialization for MEis not about being petted by everyone and meet dogs etc... Its about making the dogs see everything around them as normal. So they can ignore everything around them and see there is nothing to it.
This works for ME because I found in the past that my dog did not always feel comfortable with random people petting him. I know I wouldn't like it. Also found that it can also create excitement and I do not want an excited dog out in public. I want a calm and confident dog. As for dogs , well I don't go to dog parks and I don't let my dogs play or greet other dogs as I do not know them. The only dogs I trust are my dogs. My bernese mountain puppy got attacked by a off leash little dog on her very first walk. She bounced back but she doesn't care for dogs. I never pushed her to either except our new pup.
As I said this works for me. And the other methods work for others and that is also fine. So whatever YOU feel comfortable with is the best way to go.


----------



## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

I try to expose my puppies to as many different places and people as I can. I don't go out of my way to ask people to pet my dogs. But if we are approached, I allow it most of the time. I just ask people to wait until I have the dogs seated before they are petted. I also take my dogs to puppy classes, if the class is led by a trainer I trust. I don't go to dog parks, however, because I can't control what goes on there. We train outside the dog park fence all the time, though. My poor dogs have to work while the others are playing. I think they like to work though.


----------



## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

It is individual. It is making sure any outing is fun for you and the pup. You should know how to read your pup's body language to make sure your pup is having fun and not overwhelmed and over stimulated.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

It's a good question and yeah I can imagine it ... can get confusing?? I flat out don't recommend "screwing around" with treats and strangers! A dog can take treats and still bite the crap of someone ... I have no desire to "prove that" theory myself. But you know if you want to dig into it ... "Michael Ellis" talks about it. I call it "tricking a dog into letting people into his space."The dog gets focused on the treat, gobbles it up and then looks up and "Holy Crap???" Where did this person come from and "Bam!" Dog bite number one on the record!

What I'd always done ... is the second link here.:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/5296377-post8.html

Except with my American and Dawg and my Boxer ... I'd "always say "yes" if asked to pet (that is always a requirement that should be strictly enforced.) Those dogs "never had people issues! But ... when I found myself with an OS WL GSD on my hands that had already made it "crystal clear "... that he was must definitely ... not a fan of people??? I found ... I had a "problem on my hands???" The "who Pets" thing is not a "H/A" dog rehab protocol but that is how I used it! With my H/A OS Wl GSD if asked to pet ... instead of saying "Yes" I said "NO!" He went behind me for awhile and I would ... "assertively keep people out of his face!" I never said a word but I made it pretty "crystal clear" don't even ask!! And it worked out fine that was many many years ago ... "Rocky" got that "Daddy" had his back! If I'm there he's good, and he has interacted with many many "strangers" to this day with "zero" issues! 

And the first time I became aware that I had a problem was the first time "Company" came over ... he greeted guest from "Place" fortunately enough ... with a "Cold Hard Stare and a Low Growl???" As he was already in down as it were .. I'm on guard and hands off it was! But I was like ... WTH is this ... I'm a "Boxer" guy so this crap was new to me???? But ... back to basics ... "leerburgh" was what I'd always done anyway ,accept instead of saying "NO" to may I pet?? I'd always said "yes!" Well ... you know ... what if instead of saying yes ... I said "NO???" That's what we did and yes ... full "Bubble Dog Protocol" at first ... use a freaking muzzle in public! 

I'd stop and talk as required "Rocky" behind me ... don't even ask to pet him!! Rocky after a while got that and became pretty "bored" with the whole deal! If he were off leash and I'd stop and talk to someone ... he steps five feet away and lays down and waits. Kinda like ... sigh ... this old bit again??? After a short bit I dropped the use of the muzzle ... as it was no longer required ... I now better under the "this old bit look!"  

There is no requirement for a dog to like "anyone" (in public) but if a dog is out in public ... there is a requirement/responsibility for the dog to be civil!! Had I done the exact thing with "Rocky" that I did with "Struddell" meet and greet uh .... "everyone!" I don't think that would have worked out well??? So I "adapted and worked with the dog in front of me" and it became a "firm" NO instead of a YES ... "to may I pet??"

Hope that helps some ... as it's not really a yes or no kind of answer??


----------



## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

Some dogs don't mind neither by strangers, and others are more picky.. My girl expects manners from people.. They ask to pet and I have them stand and do nothing, allow her to greet them, sniff (basically shake hands as a human) and if she is comfortable then they can pet her (which to a dog would be like some stranger hugging you.. It's personal).. If she isn't comfortable with it, I just say 'no' it isn't the person's right to pet my dog... And she has an opinion and right to not be infringed upon.. She doesn't have the right to growl, snap or be inappropriate (which she doesn't) but if I see she is uncomfortable with the situation I know how I feel if told to hug someone or accept a hug from someone I don't know.. 

As to socializing, exposure is very important.. But I agree, everyone has their own way of doing things and you need to find what works for you and your dog


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Just make sure the puppy feels confident with you, then take him where you want. I am not a fan of dog parks, doggy daycare or puppy kindergarten if they allow puppies to romp and play with each other. 

I am picky who offers my dogs treats or pets them. If a harassed mother with 3-4 kids in tow comes up and some of the kids reach to pet the puppy, I will say no. If a polite, calm parent or child comes up and asks permission to pet the puppy, I will usually say yes, or I will qualify it: one at a time, or he has to sit. 

Socialization is an opportunity for you to set your puppy up for good experiences. Watch your pup, and if he seems to have had enough, either backing away or getting hyper, then tone it down, go home for today. Like any type of training, keep it light, keep it fun, and quit when the puppy still wants more.


----------



## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

I expose mine to everything I can. She went to Lowes, to Festivals, to the pumpkin patch, to craft fairs to a Christmas Walk through the woods at night to see the lights. If people wanted to pet her I left it up to her. I'd tell her to day 'hi'. If she didn't move I'd tell them maybe another day. As a young pup she didn't want to be petted. That was fine. When she hit about four months she decided she loved to meet people. At five months she still does. I expect when she is an adult she'll go back to not wanting to be petted, and that's all right with me. It's her choice.


----------



## JunYue97 (Aug 17, 2016)

I would definitely avoid allowing the dog to go up to someone and then get petting everytime the pup feels like it unless the pup is timid with people and you guys are counter-conditioning. My dog develops this problem of crazily needing to jump on everyone to pet her I think because of this.


----------



## Caroline5 (Mar 18, 2016)

Correct me if I am wrong, but instead of using the word "socializing" it seems to me that a new word is in order for the new definition. It is causing to much confusion. Most people when they think of socializing most likely equate it with going out in public, interacting with others and having fun. Now all of a sudden someone comes along and decides to change the definition, well it doesn't work that way. If you have a new method of training a dog how to behave in public then you need to give it a new name. In horse language it would be called bombproofing or desensitizing.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Caroline5 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong, but instead of using the word "socializing" it seems to me that a new word is in order for the new definition. It is causing to much confusion. Most people when they think of socializing most likely equate it with going out in public, interacting with others and having fun. Now all of a sudden someone comes along and decides to change the definition, well it doesn't work that way. If you have a new method of training a dog how to behave in public then you need to give it a new name. In horse language it would be called bombproofing or desensitizing.


Actually there is term and it was what I did and what some of the old timers still do and advocate. 

Socialization vs Exposure typically people tend to do "Socialization" ie contact with people because you know "everybody" wants a people friendly dog! But some dogs just can't handle that crap hence ... plan B ... "Exposure," in it's purest form ... no touch, no talk, no eye contact! 

For quite a while ... I did the latter with "Rocky" big as he was ... "strangers could only get a brief view of him becasue Daddy took point! The eye contact thing ... interesting there ... I only saw that as a possible issue once?? I got caught in a crowd "Rocky off leash and was the center of attention by and large he was good with folks, off leash and free to interact or not as he saw fit. He accepted affection from a few folks just fine. Frankly I wanted to get him and me out there but I was trapped. One women however knelled down and just kept staring hard at him??? I could see something in "Rocky" I'd not seen before and I was concerned!! I'm getting ready to intercede ...but then while she continues to pet him ... she breaks eye contact and "Rocky" is once again just fine?? I'd not seen that happen before and have not seen it since?? But I remember it happening ... I'm not sure what that was about???


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Socializing was the term used a number of years ago, but people went nuts and made socialization almost into flooding. 100people, 100places, 100 things, by 100 days old. And you already should have missed out on the first 56 days, so you have 44 days to make 300 positive associations. And most people work, and maybe they can only do it on the weekends. I think it is more like 16 weeks, so you have 56 days or 16 week-end days to get your dog out there and meet a host of everything.

What you end up with are over-tired puppies, over whelmed puppies, and owners who are less confident than when they began the process, and a pup that has less confidence in its owner to protect him than he had when he first came home. 

Socialization is a period when the puppy carries forward experiences and can feel comfortable down the line because this was ok during this period. Of course if this wasn't ok during this period it can also become much worse down the line. It is also a time when most dogs honor the puppies' puppy license so puppies are less likely to have a negative response to other dogs. And, this is generally a time when puppies do not have as much suspicion of strangers. So it is a great time to take your puppy out and expose the puppy to strangers, and with care, other dogs, and such. 

But you also have to have common sense. The puppy is a baby, and gets tired quickly and can more is not better as the puppy starts getting tired. The pups's signs of having had enough are too often met with pushing the pup forward into yet another situation, and the puppy can become over-whelmed, frightened, what have you. It may even growl or snap. Which frightens the object, frightens the owners, and that frightens the puppy even more, and congratulations, you just knocked yourself back to zero on socialization. And maybe some trainer down the line will recommend flooding to deal with the problem. 

Puppies do not become acclimated to the big bad world by staying at home and being comfortable in his own little world. But that would be better for the pup than for someone who has little experience and no confidence to parade the puppy everywhere. Socialization is great, but if the puppy doesn't trust you, than it isn't worth a hill of beans. Relax when you get your new puppy, practice being calm, and not flying off the handle about a little urine or a chewed up rug. Give your pup a few days to acclimate to his new surroundings and then a few more days. Then go out and have fun with him. Pay little attention to things and strangers. Your pup is an antenna. He notices people and cars and carts and other dogs, but if you aren't worried about them, and he trusts you, then he can just file them away as ordinary, nothing to worry about, stuff. Go home before the two of you are tired. 

It IS socialization. And yes, some people will want to pet the puppy. Let them if they aren't crazy or if they are not likely to ignore instructions. All within reason of course. If he meets one set of people per outing, that's enough. If he doesn't meet people on half the outtings. Fine. Quantity is less important than your reaction to what is going on. 

If some lady asks you what kind of dog it is, and you tell her, and she wrinkles her nose and says, "That's a Nazi-dog!" or "It's going to kill your child." And it really pisses you off, you are creating a negative socialization experience. Instead, thank her for her kind remarks, and take your puppy home, and play with him. Then come on here and tell all about it. It is our reaction and our confidence that can shake a puppy. 

Think of it this way. You step on your dog's foot, break her toe. And you say, "whoops, sorry, pup" and keep moving, yes the toe is still going to be broken, and you might have to get it looked at by the vet. But the dog is not going to be afraid of you or your feet forever. But if you bend down and check the foot all over, and lavish pity and sympathy all over your dog, you are creating a major incident, you are drawing it out. So maybe the broken toe is a bad example. If a kid runs and screams from your puppy, instead of getting worked up and worried about what this is going to do, just say, matter of factly, "yep, kids run and scream" and move on. The pup will take his cues from you. Your reactions are far more important than strangers. Every stranger is a blank sheet to a puppy, but if you tense up the lead and worry about his response whenever you come across a stranger, you are teaching your puppy to be scared.

Much better to expose the puppy from a distance or not at all, than to transmit your anxiety to the pup. But it is all socialization. Sorry the word was mutilated in the past decade or two. The answer is not to change the word, but to educate people on what socialization ought to be.


----------



## labX (Dec 7, 2016)

It all depends on how you want the dog to behave in conditions that the dog will be exposed in its life living as your pet. Then you exposed to most of it so the dog full fills its role as your pet and feel comfortable with what you want to do .
Example
My dog has to spend extended time living in the camper in campgrounds with 2 small kids and us . She needs to be able to be handled by other day care. We camped at Hersey park after the poconos wilderness camping. So. Enjoyed the wilderness ,lake and hikes .But when we went to Hersey theme park off she went to day care she has never seen before.i used Yelp to get a good one. 
She goes to alot beaches ,swims in oceans.
She definitely has to handle dog parks not only the neighbourhood one but also the one in all the campground so we can chill and she gets a workout .
So we have exposed so we can be a part of out travels and be with us.
Kids take her for walks and kids in campground pet her .

So for me it is getting her ready to live with our lifestyle .

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk


----------



## zetti (May 11, 2014)

Chip18 said:


> Actually there is term and it was what I did and what some of the old timers still do and advocate.
> 
> Socialization vs Exposure typically people tend to do "Socialization" ie contact with people because you know "everybody" wants a people friendly dog! But some dogs just can't handle that crap hence ... plan B ... "Exposure," in it's purest form ... no touch, no talk, no eye contact!
> 
> For quite a while ... I did the latter with "Rocky" big as he was ... "strangers could only get a brief view of him becasue Daddy took point! The eye contact thing ... interesting there ... I only saw that as a possible issue once?? I got caught in a crowd "Rocky off leash and was the center of attention by and large he was good with folks, off leash and free to interact or not as he saw fit. He accepted affection from a few folks just fine. Frankly I wanted to get him and me out there but I was trapped. One women however knelled down and just kept staring hard at him??? I could see something in "Rocky" I'd not seen before and I was concerned!! I'm getting ready to intercede ...but then while she continues to pet him ... she breaks eye contact and "Rocky" is once again just fine?? I'd not seen that happen before and have not seen it since?? But I remember it happening ... I'm not sure what that was about???


He perceived the stupid woman as challenging him. By looking away first, she signaled her submission. And possibly avoided a messy incident.

Direct, sustained hard eye contact is a display of dominance and a challenge. And an incredibly moronic thing to do with an unknown GSD.


----------



## griz (Jan 1, 2001)

I appreciate the reply's, they all make very good points. 
This is not my first rodeo, just the first one in 17 years! As i thought about the dogs I have owned in the past, I realized i did lots of exposure, socializing and desensitization . it just wasn't really broken down that way ( i'm talking 27 years now).


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

labX said:


> It all depends on how you want the dog to behave in conditions that the dog will be exposed in its life living as your pet. Then you exposed to most of it so the dog full fills its role as your pet and feel comfortable with what you want to do .
> Example
> My dog has to spend extended time living in the camper in campgrounds with 2 small kids and us . She needs to be able to be handled by other day care. We camped at Hersey park after the poconos wilderness camping. So. Enjoyed the wilderness ,lake and hikes .But when we went to Hersey theme park off she went to day care she has never seen before.i used Yelp to get a good one.
> She goes to alot beaches ,swims in oceans.
> ...


Is this a labX or a GSD? 

GSDs are not bird dogs. A bird dog has been bred for a thousand years to be non-aggressive. When a lab or golden bites, then that's a serious temperament issue. And unfortunately, bites in both breeds are increasing with popularity. But evenso, it is comparing apples to oranges when considering doggy day-care and dog parks, and kids walking the dog around campgrounds, letting other kids pet it. 

Even with awesome GSDs that have never come close to biting anyone, and that are good with kids, there are not many owners who would allow a couple of children to take the GSD on walks around a campsite. Not with people and other dogs being so unpredictable, and people being so quick to sue. A child is no match for a GSD. If a Yorkie came running up and bit your GSD dog, what's a kid going to do? If your dog bites the Yorkie, that's nothing any kid should see. I don't hear about these incidents with labs. Do the upright ears and stature of a GSD make them a likelier target to little punk terriers? 

Of course, in the old days, I took Princess, our shepherd/hound cross wherever. We never thought, in those days, "what if?" What if she bites a kid? What if she attacks another dog? What if another dog attacks her. I am not saying stuff didn't happen. My little brother had her loose on the porch, and they both fell asleep, and some Dominos man was passing out fliers ran up the steps, and Princess jumped up and bit him once in the chest. Not bad, and he was understanding, my dad came running out onto the porch and thrust the dog inside. But the fact remains, she did bite someone, however understandable it might have been. And my little sister was bitten by a friend's Rottie and she needed a drain put in her chest and stitches. No one was sued. 

It just seems that nowadays, you can't get homeowner's insurance and the whole nine yards if your dog scratches someone. I expect lab owners aren't as likely to worry about these things like shepherd, rotty, pit owners do.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

zetti said:


> He perceived the stupid woman as challenging him. By looking away first, she signaled her submission. And possibly avoided a messy incident.
> 
> Direct, sustained hard eye contact is a display of dominance and a challenge. And an incredibly moronic thing to do with an unknown GSD.


Looking away is good, but yawning is another thing you can do to difuse a situation. I had a gal from work come and take pictures of Arwen with a 3 week old litter, and she was worried about Arwen. She was looking at her, and Arwen was looking back, and she was in momma-bear mode. I told the lady, "yawn." And she did, and that was all there was to it, Arwen was fine, and the lady was surprised. It's a calming signal. 

When you see your dog licking its lips, yawning, etc, you have to pay attention. Dogs do body language big time. That's why when we give the signal for DOWN and say, SIT, they generally go down. So now, everyone, go and confuse your dog, so you can prove me wrong on that. LOL!


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

griz said:


> I have been reading and researching socialization and while I always knew dogs needed socialization ( and have done so in the past ).. it seems that things have changed a bit over the last few years.
> 
> I planned on taking said puppy everywhere, but after reading a few things, I am not suppose to let people pet it ... or give it treats?
> So basically, I just take said puppy out and just expose it to as many people and things as I can but no touchy?
> And I don't like or do dog parks, but have a few well socialized dogs that can tolerate/ignore puppy ( and put in his place if needed) but planned on doing a puppy K class. But if when do I cut off the puppy play dates ?


It all just gets confusing, doesn't it? I think people took socialization to mean flood the puppy with as many people and other dogs as possible.

Yes, let people give your puppy treats. Just don't force it on him and overwhelm him. Yes, let him meet other dogs. Safe dogs that will teach him, not terrorize him. Safe dogs you know. Not every strange dog out there. Definitely do puppy class! Cut off puppy play dates if they aren't working for you and your dog! Not because someone said you had to.

This is my favorite blog on socializing a puppy
(don't follow it verbatim, just read the intent behind the exercises)
Socializing Your Puppy: how it should look | Naughty Dogge - Monique Anstee


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

zetti said:


> He perceived the stupid woman as challenging him. By looking away first, she signaled her submission. And possibly avoided a messy incident.
> 
> Direct, sustained hard eye contact is a display of dominance and a challenge. And an incredibly moronic thing to do with an unknown GSD.


Stupid. Just stupid. A woman did this to Jax when she was young and Jax wanted to eat her.

And the woman says "oh I did that on purpose to see what would happen because I got bit last month"

Thanks. Can I get your address to send you the training bill? So appreciate your asshattery.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

selzer said:


> Socializing was the term used a number of years ago, but people went nuts and made socialization almost into flooding. 100people, 100places, 100 things, by 100 days old. And you already should have missed out on the first 56 days, so you have 44 days to make 300 positive associations. And most people work, and maybe they can only do it on the weekends. I think it is more like 16 weeks, so you have 56 days or 16 week-end days to get your dog out there and meet a host of everything.
> 
> What you end up with are over-tired puppies, over whelmed puppies, and owners who are less confident than when they began the process, and a pup that has less confidence in its owner to protect him than he had when he first came home.
> 
> ...


 Thank You ... and well said I may add. And speaking for myself ... 16 years ago ... that is exactly what I thought and what I did with my first dogs! And it worked out fine ... for them! but you know ... that was those "puppies" I seem to be a pretty good "puppy" picker ... although it retro spec it always seem to be the "Dominant" males and "Struddell" fooled me ...she just climbed into my lap and "Sat" and her "Mom" sat next to me?? 

I did so want the boy that was standing on top of his pile of siblings barking his head off but he was chosen only the girls left?? I wanted/needed a "Boxer" so sigh ... this bundle of "nothing it is." In retrospect ... yeah she must've been exhausted from being a "Shrew" all day. 

But back on pointe ... that "100 people in 100" days thing can work ... it depends on the dog/puppy?? Some Dogs/Puppies can handle that crap out the gate and do just fine! Some dogs/puppies not so much???

"Some" of the ones that "can't" handle "over socialization" out the gate" can ... learn to "cope" with careful "Exposure" some dogs/puppies simply need "time" to adjust and it's up to the "owners" to understand and work with the dog/puppy in front of them ... "Paws on the Ground!" Pretty much that simple. 

Rocky ... I got at 7 months ... and frankly I "felt" that being a rescue he should have been used to being around people?? But apparently as it turned out ...yeah not so much?? What I got "right" was simply the ability to recognize ..." that this dog is different??" And make adjsutments ... had I done with him "What I'd always done ... it would have been a "Fail!" So I did not! ultimately he's proved to be" temperamentally sound!" But he needed time and I gave it to him ... "worked out fine."  

But had ... I bailed on him when "issues" cropped up ... I have no doubt his butt would have been "PTS!" In lesser hands, he'd have been put to sleep, no doubt ... the less skilled/willing/foolish would have run for cover!!! He "Scared the living Crap out of Marilyn me ... he ticked off!" 

Aww well these days he's great in "Public" and "still" not a fan of "company" in his home ... but he stays in "Place" and "few" may touch! "we'er" good with that ... he's not a "Boxer."


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

zetti said:


> He perceived the stupid woman as challenging him. By looking away first, she signaled her submission. And possibly avoided a messy incident.
> 
> Direct, sustained hard eye contact is a display of dominance and a challenge. And an incredibly moronic thing to do with an unknown GSD.


"Thank You!" To be fair ... he happened to be using his "Walking Wheelchair" that day. He does not need it per se, but it helps! And at 112 lbs WL and Blk ... he was quite the thing! He was typically off leash and I got trapped answering questions ... I seriously wanted to get the heck out of "Dodge" but as I said I was trapped and he was "off leash." So yeah "fake being cool. 

A "Vet" stopped us first and "Rocky luv'd that guy ... "Rocky" seems to have a thing for "Vet's??" Zero issues there and a few others some he acknowledged others he ignored. That women however ...knelled down and just kept staring at him???" And I saw "something" different in Rocky??? Been 7 years at that time and I was more or less use to no problems?? I was most likely within a tenth of sa ec of doing something?? When she although still kneeling and in his face ... broke "direct eye" contact and Rocky relaxed! 

I'd "never" seen that happen before??? Aww well he is still a formerly H/A dog, so yeah ... you gotta "always" stay on your toes in public!


----------



## zetti (May 11, 2014)

Jax08 said:


> Stupid. Just stupid. A woman did this to Jax when she was young and Jax wanted to eat her.
> 
> And the woman says "oh I did that on purpose to see what would happen because I got bit last month"
> 
> Thanks. Can I get your address to send you the training bill? So appreciate your asshattery.


Darwin Award nominee.


----------



## zetti (May 11, 2014)

Jax08 said:


> It all just gets confusing, doesn't it? I think people took socialization to mean flood the puppy with as many people and other dogs as possible.
> 
> Yes, let people give your puppy treats. Just don't force it on him and overwhelm him. Yes, let him meet other dogs. Safe dogs that will teach him, not terrorize him. Safe dogs you know. Not every strange dog out there. Definitely do puppy class! Cut off puppy play dates if they aren't working for you and your dog! Not because someone said you had to.
> 
> ...


If you're raising your pup for a protection sport or PPD, you have to be even more careful. Take him around people who won't take it upon themselves to punish your dog for jumping up and mouthing. Other dogs are to be observed and tolerated. You can't risk allowing another dog to dominate yours.

One of the best social experiences one of my WGWL pups had at ten weeks was at K9 trainer's facility. The trainer was testing him.

There were a number of officers sitting on the grass. As soon as I let my pup out of the car, he flew over to them and jumped on one who was kneeling. The officer immediately fell over backwards. Perfect! Big strong puppy!

Obviously, he was a very experienced K9 handler.

Just as an aside, the trainer found my pup to be excellent and capable of any type of work. 

The bulk of Raff's early socialization will happen at our trainer's facility and the club. Both controlled environments with people who know how to react to high drive puppy antics and how to control their own dogs.


----------



## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

I let my pup observe all kinds of people and took her to many places with different types of surfaces and smells. I never forced her to meet people and never made a big deal about them. She was never upset with sudden loud noises, gun shot or thunder or fireworks...but I did make the mistake of moving a big plastic trash bin when I had her on leash. She was so brave about other noises, I failed to notice that she was getting scared. It took a few months to get her to see other people's trash bins as no-big-deal. Our own bin is still scary. 

I will say that somewhere between her first and second heat she started acting shy. My goal now is to teach her to check in with me when she meets people who make eye contact with her. I can take her in a crowd, no problem. But if someone looks straight at her she barks. I don't know where that came from since strangers have never been threatening, in my eyes at least. It may be hormonal.

These are examples of meaning to do well socializing, taking care to do it right, and still ending up with a few issues to work through. 

My boy is more resilient. He's a good confident level headed fellow. We lived in a different neighborhood and he was an only dog. I wonder how much is nature and how much is nurture when it comes to "socializing".


----------



## Shefali (Aug 12, 2020)

Deb said:


> I expose mine to everything I can. She went to Lowes, to Festivals, to the pumpkin patch, to craft fairs to a Christmas Walk through the woods at night to see the lights. If people wanted to pet her I left it up to her. I'd tell her to day 'hi'. If she didn't move I'd tell them maybe another day. As a young pup she didn't want to be petted. That was fine. When she hit about four months she decided she loved to meet people. At five months she still does. I expect when she is an adult she'll go back to not wanting to be petted, and that's all right with me. It's her choice.


This is what I do. I take my dog as many places I can, if people want to pet her I tell them it's fine if he is OK with it. I know he won't be aggressive, but he doesn't always allow them to pet him. Sometimes he does, other times he doesn't. As long as he's not aggressive, it's all good. I he looks uncomfortable or fearful though (he hasn't so far, but if he did) then I would take him away from the situation.


----------



## coolgsd (May 1, 2010)

griz said:


> I have been reading and researching socialization and while I always knew dogs needed socialization ( and have done so in the past ).. it seems that things have changed a bit over the last few years.
> 
> I planned on taking said puppy everywhere, but after reading a few things, I am not suppose to let people pet it ... or give it treats?
> So basically, I just take said puppy out and just expose it to as many people and things as I can but no touchy?
> And I don't like or do dog parks, but have a few well socialized dogs that can tolerate/ignore puppy ( and put in his place if needed) but planned on doing a puppy K class. But if when do I cut off the puppy play dates ?


I don't know about "puppy" dates but I don't think socialization ever ends. It is training early on that if you are OK then they are OK. As a puppy, just warn them about the little needle teeth and do not allow treats from anyone. That is for the dog's safety. Even well socialized, a good GSD can sense something wrong. I opened the door for a carpet installer that rushed right on in. It was as though he were on a methamphetamine and it was good that he had a very heavy coat on. Our girl sensed something was wrong with him because of the way he behaved but when I told her it was OK, it became OK with her. She will allow any "normal" person pet her but it is still a great deal in my hands and how I am behaving. 
If your personality is hyper, your dog may get mixed signals and never know when something is wrong.


----------



## CactusWren (Nov 4, 2018)

I took Jupiter out every day from the time I got him (being careful until he had all his shots). I think this accounts for him being comfortable with almost all situations or things. He is fine with strangers on walks, he can walk next to six lanes of traffic, he is fine with people in wheelchairs or men in hats... He is not the friendliest dog toward other dogs, but definitely above average--at least by the low bar of my neighborhood, where 50% of the dogs are reactive.

At the German shepherd club last night, several dogs were barking and reacting to other dogs. Jupiter ignored them. The leader told me I should get his Good Citizenship Cert. 

I do sometimes wonder if he would be more protective if I hadn't socialized him so much. I hear about all these dogs who jump in front of their owners and scare off strangers, and I'm really not sure if Jupiter would do that at all.


----------

