# Got a puppy.. intoducing Jubei.



## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

Hi, ive posted over the past couple months determining what kind of things i want in a dog.. i was set on a black and tan/silver GSD female, but i saw an add with GSD's for sale so i thought i would go check it out. When i got there i saw this one. Silver Sable GSD male. hes about 8 weeks. I kinda realized i really shouldnt be looking for a particualr type of shepherd unless i intend on doing shows, but i dont. I just want a dog to become a buddy and protect the house and to follow me when i go on bike trails. I took him to get his shots this morning and he is a cry baby with the ladies. I introduced him to my cat and the cat is the one who is being stand offish. im grateful that he is not attacking the cat in a violent manor, but is trying to be playful but the cat does nto realize it. When i took him to the vet this morning he would bark at small dogs, but the big dogs he would just let them sniff him. Im having the usual issues, puppy running infront of you, crying at night.. uggh.. Anyway I named him Jubei (joo-bay), after Jubei Kibagami a character from a anime called Ninja Scroll. Thanks for everyones help over the past couple months when it came to GSD puppy advise.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Awh, he's cute. 

You got him from a backyard breeder though? Why?


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> Awh, he's cute.
> 
> You got him from a backyard breeder though? Why?


because i couldnt find a legit breeder within 100 miles of where i live. believe me i looked around alot. I found one place but they said their puppies were claimed for months in advance. Yeah i know you gotta be careful when you buy from backyard breeders, but it seemed like the conditions the puppy were in were good and like i said, it had no ticks at all and when i took it to the vet earlier they said the puppy looks like it was taken care of while in the previous owners hands. So i think i made good judgment.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Well, I guess you can't do anything about it now, but supporting a backyard breeder is never a good judgement IMO. I would wait years before purchasing a potentially unhealthy dog from a breeder that is doing so just for money or out of irresposibleness. Don't you have shelters or rescues around that you could of gone to? And I know many breeders will ship puppies, too.


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## bianca (Mar 28, 2010)

Congrats on Jubei! He is adorable :wub:


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## GSD MOM (Apr 21, 2010)

Our 1st GSD was from a backyard breeder. She is the best thing that ever happened to us. We also have another GSD we rescued. Enjoy your puppy. He is a real cuttie!


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## Lin (Jul 3, 2007)

GSD MOM said:


> Our 1st GSD was from a backyard breeder. She is the best thing that ever happened to us.


Its not the dog thats the real problem with buying from a byb. Yes, you are taking more of a risk on the health of the dog since the parents and grandparents weren't health tested. But the REAL problem with it is adding to the overpopulation problem with more GSDs that are more likely to have health or temperament problems due to breeding. When you purchase from a BYB or puppy mill, you are increasing "demand." People who are breeding for the money don't look at the dogs as living breathing beings, but much more as "stock." Increase the demand, and the supply will be increased to follow. If there aren't enough people to buy the next litter the dogs may end up in rescues and shelters. But the breeders may go ahead and breed again anyway. Or if all of the puppies from this or the next litter find homes, the breeders may decide to double the amount of litters to increase cash.

All dogs deserve a good home. But a better option would be to wait until that dog is at a shelter or rescue so you are supporting THAT instead of the irresponsible breeder. Or, go to a responsible breeder that is working towards improving the breed. Many people purchase dogs from bybs and puppy mills claiming to have "rescued" the dog from a bad situation. They may have had the best intentions when seeing a neglected puppy, but unfortunately what their action does is actually make things worse for the other puppies and the parents who are being kept purely to pump out litters.


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> *Well, I guess you can't do anything about it now*, but supporting a backyard breeder is never a good judgement IMO. I would wait years before purchasing a potentially unhealthy dog from a breeder that is doing so just for money or out of irresposibleness. Don't you have shelters or rescues around that you could of gone to? *And I know many breeders will ship puppies*, too.


Well you guess that i cant do anything about it now.. you make this sound like i bought a defective product and i should just take it back right now but i cant because i lost my receipt. I looked the place over and it didnt seem to have been a terrible environment for pups. Like i said, no fleas, ticks on the pup. The pup also looks in great health , eating good, drinking not vomiting and stool looks good and was confirmed by my vet to look in great health upon examining him. Why cant you just say congrats and move on instead of giving a lesson on the dangers of back yard breeding? I understand where your coming from but this is a happy moment for me and ur just flushing it down. After all if both our dogs ended up in a rescue no one would give a crap where they came from.


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## Andy-jr. (Mar 1, 2010)

I agree, this is a happy moment for you and congrats on that. I also bought my first GSD 17 years ago from a BYB and she was the best dog. I think your pup is very cute and enjoy him. Take lots of pictures they grow fast.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Because I don't think it's suiting to congratulate somebody for supporting a byb? Obviously some people have ignorance to blame and didn't know what they were doing was bad, but purposely supporting a byb is just upsetting IMO. I'm glad your pup is healthy, and I hope he stays that way, but I know a lot of people who have gotten pups from backyard breeders that looked great, but they ended up with parvo or heartworm, or later on had hip dysplasia or seizures. This can happen with breeders' dogs too, of course, but I've seen it SO much more from bybs, both the 'bad' and the 'good'. 

I give a lesson on the dangers of backyard breeding because nobody thinks it's a big deal otherwise, but it is.


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## Holmeshx2 (Apr 25, 2010)

I'm sorry but I agree with DJEtzel. Your pup is adorable and I'm glad you are happy with him but because the pup wasn't neglected in horrible conditions covered with fleas and ticks does NOT make the situation any better. It does not make them a good breeder or anything else.

I was stupid and bought from a BYB many years ago I didn't realize they were a BYB the dog had police dogs and title dogs all the way back in their pedigree and were AKC registered figured they must have been good and thought I was so great for getting such a great find for such a good price. They were in great health, vets all said great things. The father was sociable although the owner seemed a bit uneasy when he came out and the mother was going crazy inside the kennel. I figured this was simply training or her upset we were with her pups and paid no attention. Guess what dog was great and healthy for most of his life but no matter how much training and how much socialization we did with him there were certain traits we could not get out of him because of poor breeding. Certain things are genetic and no work will completely get rid of it. He was not steady nerve wise. With lots of conditioning he became ok but because tolerable and being steady are 2 totally different things and as I got older and looked more into it I figured where I all went wrong.

Plus the whole arguement of supporting these people is very valid because they sell to anyone which just causes issues for shelters and rescues not to mention the thousands of pups put to sleep every year because of them.

I dont wish you harm and don't want you to regret getting your pup I hope he has great nerve and temperment as he gets older and that he doesn't develop hidden health issues down the road.

This is meant simply to inform you for the future so that you can never claim ignorance on a subject. The excuse you wanted a good breeder but settled for less because they weren't next to you or didn't have pups right then and there doesn't seem very informed at all IMO thats an impulse buy you wanted one right then found someone that had pups right then and got them. Not all cases but a lot of cases when people get a dog right there and then because they want it they generally don't stick it out in the long run and do whatever the dog needs for his long life.

Also you're line of you were researching the lines for what kind you wanted then decided not to care anymore because you weren't doing shows and just wanted a buddy absolutely drives me insane. You were doing something great, came on a forum with lots of others experience, realized there were multiple lines tried figuring out what would suit you best then just decided screw it this was more conveniant for you. The purpose of lines isn't to just show them it's to prove they are solid dogs so you can be better assured you will have a solid pup even if it is to just be your buddy. Just to be your buddy you still need him properly trained which is lots of work and if you couldn't even do the work to research him or wait a few months for a litter to be born why would you think you have the patience to raise a puppy and do all the training the need. BTW training never ends even when they are "perfect" you have to continue it daily for their life. Also, you may train him great and he may be your best buddy but that doesn't mean he'll genetically have the nerve to be others best buddy and wont go after the mailman or something because he was startled and didn't have the solid nerve that is genetic that a good breeder could have given you. 

I do wish you the best and as I said this is more to inform then to criticize so you know otherwise in the future of why finding a good breeder or good dog is more then making sure there are no ticks. regardless he is a cutie pie and I wish you both the best.


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> Because I don't think it's suiting to congratulate somebody for supporting a byb? Obviously some people have ignorance to blame and didn't know what they were doing was bad, but purposely supporting a byb is just upsetting IMO. I'm glad your pup is healthy, and I hope he stays that way, but I know a lot of people who have gotten pups from backyard breeders that looked great, but they ended up with parvo or heartworm, or later on had hip dysplasia or seizures. This can happen with breeders' dogs too, of course, but I've seen it SO much more from bybs, both the 'bad' and the 'good'.
> 
> I give a lesson on the dangers of backyard breeding because nobody thinks it's a big deal otherwise, but it is.


Geez thnkx, knowing is half the battle.. GI JOE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

DJEtzel said:


> Because I don't think it's suiting to congratulate somebody for supporting a byb? Obviously some people have ignorance to blame and didn't know what they were doing was bad, but purposely supporting a byb is just upsetting IMO. I'm glad your pup is healthy, and I hope he stays that way, but I know a lot of people who have gotten pups from backyard breeders that looked great, but they ended up with parvo or heartworm, or later on had hip dysplasia or seizures. This can happen with breeders' dogs too, of course, but I've seen it SO much more from bybs, both the 'bad' and the 'good'.
> 
> I give a lesson on the dangers of backyard breeding because nobody thinks it's a big deal otherwise, but it is.


Then, for gods sake ignore the topic!

I love this forum, I really really love it, but sometimes I want to shake some of you because you can't QUIT! 
All this lecturing, over and over and over again. There is a time and place for lectures and this is NOT the right time!

Just leave the OP alone and let him/her be happy! He/She knows what he/she's gotten into and is obviously willed to live with the consiquences. 


*MenTaLPiRacY* congratz for your new puppy. I hope you will have many happy years with your new dog. :wub:


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

Mrs.K said:


> Then, for gods sake ignore the topic!
> 
> I love this forum, I really really love it, but sometimes I want to shake some of you because you can't QUIT!
> All this lecturing, over and over and over again. There is a time and place for lectures and this is NOT the right time!
> ...


im a dude.. and i dunno if im gonna post on this forum anymore. If this is the start of me and my GSD on this forum its not a good one. Me and my defective dog might go some where else. Thanks tho Mrs.k.


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## Amoux (Apr 27, 2010)

What a sweetheart. I hope he feels more comfortable and stops crying soon. 

I have always felt how much I'd want to be able to see the parents, the breeder, where the puppy was raised and the puppies themselves rather than have one ordered, picked out for me and shipped.


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

MenTaLPiRacY said:


> im a dude.. and i dunno if im gonna post on this forum anymore. If this is the start of me and my GSD on this forum its not a good one. Me and my defective dog might go some where else. Thanks tho Mrs.k.


Don't leave.  There are many pretty good people on here that can give you tons of advise in raising a puppy without lecturing at all. Even though I am somewhat experienced I've learned a lot just by reading and searching the forums. There is a lot of knowledge on here. 

I'd love to see your puppy grow. :wub:


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## Holmeshx2 (Apr 25, 2010)

Mrs.K said:


> Then, for gods sake ignore the topic!
> 
> I love this forum, I really really love it, but sometimes I want to shake some of you because you can't QUIT!
> All this lecturing, over and over and over again. There is a time and place for lectures and this is NOT the right time!
> ...


I completely agree that if you don't like something to ignore it and the fact that there is a time and a place for the lectures. This is one of those situations for the lecture because there is a big difference if he said I know I got a dog from a BYB but thats just what it was now I need to work on making the best dog from what/who he is, but that wasn't the case.

He tried to learn and knew there was so much more to a good solid shepherd then seems to have just fallen into the "hype" and convenience of a BYB while it may have been a "good" byb where they weren't neglected their dogs that doesn't make them good. No one was or is trying to specifically take away anything from his ne wpup or the joy he has simply not allow misinformation to be put out there and then leave it there for others to learn thinking it's right then they go out on ignorance and make a poor decision that can end badly for everyone human and animal.

yes differences of opinions on certain things should just be left alone if you don't like what the other person has to say. For example if one person believes in using punishment for correction in training and the other person believes in using treats and positive reinforcement to train obviously it gets nowhere to debate over who is right so it can be left alone.

Completely different if a person says if you just want a pet you don't need to train them at all because you aren't planning on taking them anywhere and no one comes to your house or something equally absurd. Theres a difference between differing opinions and a lack of knowledge or completely ignoring it and quite honestly everyones main focus here should be on the animals and feel obligated to at least inform someone or direct them where to go to learn proper information to be a well informed consumer and pet owner. It is those who are not informed or just don't care that leads to the largest portion of the need for shelters and rescues and animals being put down.

Personally if someone don't want to learn and are not open to at least hearing information to learn and better themself then there is no reason to be on a forum to connect with other good owners and people who raise, train and try to better the breed of animal. If you just want to post pictures and have someone ohh and ahh over your pet because they are pretty take them to the store or post pictures on facebook. Sorry I know this sounds really harsh and I don't mean it to be it's the simple truth. The purpose of these forums is mainly for education either to learn or to help others learn so to be upset when someone tries to inform others is just absurd.

However lecturing simple difference of opinions on how to do something isn't right and just nit picking and a waste of everyones time so I do agree with that part.


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

Amoux said:


> What a sweetheart. I hope he feels more comfortable and stops crying soon.
> 
> I have always felt how much I'd want to be able to see the parents, the breeder, where the puppy was raised and the puppies themselves rather than have one ordered, picked out for me and shipped.


Im not the type that likes to buy "big" things over the net. I sure as **** wouldnt buy a puppy online, just seems so wrong to me when you order something online that lives and breathes and has feelings. But thats just my opinion. BTW, i saw the parents. Both of the parents were walking around unleashed and were nice. 



Mrs.K said:


> Don't leave.  There are many pretty good people on here that can give you tons of advise in raising a puppy without lecturing at all. Even though I am somewhat experienced I've learned a lot just by reading and searching the forums. There is a lot of knowledge on here.
> 
> I'd love to see your puppy grow. :wub:


I know there is alot of info on here.. ive learned alot so far.



Holmeshx2 said:


> I completely agree that if you don't like something to ignore it and the fact that there is a time and a place for the lectures. This is one of those situations for the lecture because there is a big difference if he said I know I got a dog from a BYB but thats just what it was now I need to work on making the best dog from what/who he is, but that wasn't the case.
> 
> He tried to learn and knew there was so much more to a good solid shepherd then seems to have just fallen into the "hype" and convenience of a BYB while it may have been a "good" byb where they weren't neglected their dogs that doesn't make them good. No one was or is trying to specifically take away anything from his ne wpup or the joy he has simply not allow misinformation to be put out there and then leave it there for others to learn thinking it's right then they go out on ignorance and make a poor decision that can end badly for everyone human and animal.
> 
> ...


Thank you.


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## bianca (Mar 28, 2010)

Mentalpiracy - I am not going to comment either way on all the above but I would just like to say...IMO, you should stick around for your and your puppies sake! There is so much knowledge on this forum and whilst you have had a rocky (  ) start, there is just so much info here. I must admit at times reading some things I think gosh to put it politely but I figure I can learn so much. Anyway....again I say your new guy is a sweety and I look forward to seeing lots of photo's please!!!!


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## Lin (Jul 3, 2007)

Holmeshx2 said:


> No one was or is trying to specifically take away anything from his ne wpup or the joy he has simply not allow misinformation to be put out there and then *leave it there for others to learn thinking it's right then they go out on ignorance *and make a poor decision that can end badly for everyone human and animal.


I think this is very important for people to remember. How many members here have mentioned that they read posts for ages before joining? How many members are there on this forum? How many people do you think read here to learn but never register? 

On an online forum whatever you are saying is being put out there for all to see. Its not just a small closed conversation among friends. If no one steps up and says something then others could come across it and think things that aren't ok are. An example that is not as emotional as getting a puppy: forum member recommends ol' roy dog food. Has fed their dogs this food for years, has had healthy dogs. On a forum this size it could result in SO many people blindly believing ol' roy is a good food. But on a forum this size, many people are more experienced with more knowledge and point out that ol' roy is severely lacking as a diet for many reasons and explains why. People suggest high quality foods and suggest why. Instead of people (most of whom will probably never register here) going out and buying ol' roy, they go out and buy Orijen. 

Obviously everyone here means the best for their dog- if they didn't they wouldn't be here! Its such a sensitive topic and people can get hurt easily. But if everyone could take a breath now and then and look at the big picture I think we would all get along better instead of so many arguments. With the recent purchase of the forum and advertising there has been a HUGE influx of new members. I don't think that anything has changed in the advice being offered by the experienced (except for losing so many of them...) but we see these sensitive issues being discussed a lot more. When there was a smaller supply of newer members, topics such as byb/puppymills/food/etc had already been hashed out by people in the past.

I completely disagree that people "attack" too much here, or are too nit picky... Compared to most of the forums I've been on people are much gentler here!


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

while I may not agree with his purchase, I can also congratulate him on his new puppy!

While we are all passionate about not supporting BYB's, unfortunately they will NEVER wipe them out, they will always be there. 

I am totally for 'educating', and if this poster had come on here before he got this puppy, maybe he could have been steered in a different direction, however, the puppy is here, he is cute as a button, and what's done is done.

I also think the poster should stay and be made 'welcome', and not feel like he can't ask ANYTHING or BRAG about anything regarding his new puppy.

Soo with that,,congrats on your new puppy, may he have a long happy healthy life, (love the name!) and please post updated pictures,,we all love seeing puppies grow:


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## BlackPuppy (Mar 29, 2007)

Congratulations on the new puppy! Stick around because there are a lot of people here that will help you went you can't figure stuff out. 

I also don't like to make major purchases if I can't go in person to check it (online). Not everybody has the time to spend months or years building relationships with breeders that "might" have a puppy you can afford. And there are a lot of nice websites out there that represent more BYBs and puppy mills.


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## trish07 (Mar 5, 2010)

What a beatifull puppy! Congratulation.

As for the "where he comes from"...well, byb is sure not a good place...but...look, you took the right decision I think.

You may be have a very healthy pup or you may be have some health issues...but who knows? I got Phenix from a very highly recommanded place and I have a LOT of health issues. 

Just enjoy moments with your pup, do what is the best for him. Care and love, that's all.


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## strayhare (May 15, 2010)

I think the dog is beautiful. I don't agree with most of these comments. You said right from the start you wanted a dog for the love not to show or such. I think if you were showing all of this fluff would apply. But you buying is not going to stop the BYB from having more or less puppies because that is how it works. I know a breeder that claims to do it to further the breed but her price keeps going up and she had alot of liters in the year. Not what I would call doing it for the breed. She sales on the internet, every free classified in the area. I think YOU just need to enjoy the dog and the love it will give you. There are problems with dogs every day and some have lines and titles after them and it will not be any better when they get sick, or hurt. Do the responsible thing by your dog like taking it to the vet, dog liscense and socializing. maybe people can mind their own business. I am happy for you and the love you have coming. Good Luck


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## Lexi (May 12, 2010)

Gorgeous puppy! I really want a sable one day myself. They make beautiful GSDs.


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## chevysmom (Feb 15, 2008)

Wow, not a very warm welcome huh? 

Anyways, I think your pup is absolutely adorable! Many congratulations to you MenTaLPiRacY


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## FuryanGoddess (Dec 26, 2009)

chevysmom said:


> Wow, not a very warm welcome huh?
> 
> Anyways, I think your pup is absolutely adorable! Many congratulations to you MenTaLPiRacY


I know, I feel bad. I sent him a PM, hope he stays. I'd love to see the pup grow. 

A lot of ppl disagree w/ a lot of things ppl do and say... but he's still a person and that puppy has already been born and is living, breathing and healthy. And as of right now... does not need rescued or massive amounts of money to save it from neglect... can't we all be just a little bit happy about that? That the pup will never have to suffer because it has a good home?


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

Thanks everyone. Like i said, i came in here to introduce my pup to yall, not to get a lecture. I know buying from breeders is the best way to go when buying a high quality dog. But like i said, with the area im in i could not find one that is not a road trip away. The closest one was i could find was 90 miles and they said they wont be having puppies i could buy for months because they said they dont breed during the summer and almost all their litter is claimed for the next few litters. Money is not the issue. i had $800 set aside for pup purchase, but when i visited these pups i just felt this one was the right one for me. Anyway il stick around because im going to need help with this. Thanks.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

I just don't understand how you expected not to get a lecture when you did something purposely that was not in good taste. You wanted to support a backyard breeder and you think people will be okay with that? I just don't understand your reasoning. 90 miles is a couple hours drive. I make that weekly for fun, and you couldn't wait a little while to get a good quality puppy? I know people that wait years for theirs, and you had the money. 

Sorry, you just don't make any sense to me. I hope you have a good life with your pup and you don't have any aggression, resource, reactivity, nerve, or hip problems with him, but I agree, I think you're going to need help with him. Good luck.


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> I just don't understand how you expected not to get a lecture when you did something purposely that was not in good taste. You wanted to support a backyard breeder and you think people will be okay with that? I just don't understand your reasoning. 90 miles is a couple hours drive. I make that weekly for fun, and you couldn't wait a little while to get a good quality puppy? I know people that wait years for theirs, and you had the money.
> 
> Sorry, you just don't make any sense to me. I hope you have a good life with your pup and you don't have any aggression, resource, reactivity, nerve, or hip problems with him, but I agree, I think you're going to need help with him. Good luck.


Now i just think that your trolling me so i will no longer respond to you. thanks.


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## FLyMuSLiMa (Apr 25, 2010)

Welcome to the forum! (You and your beautiful puppy!) He's such a cutie! Anyways; sorry for the hard time you had introducing yourself; I hope you find the info here useful; and make sure you post more pics; we loovvveee to see the puppies grow!


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## longhairshepmom (Apr 7, 2003)

good god, some people just can't let it go !!!

This is a beautiful pup and there is NO reason why it shouldn't grow up to be a healthy and delightful dog.

For what its worth, 2 of the best dogs I've EVER had (that includes healthy) were from BYB. Both times the owners cared a great deal about the dogs. There is a difference between a 

1. puppymill
2. bad backyard breeder
3. good backyard breeder.

I don't care one bit how much I get flamed, but I've me so called backyard breeders that cared MORE about their dogs , then some of the "big" professional breeders. Perhaps thats because they care about the dogs, not titles and prestige.

I've met some dogs that won many titles that had the most atrocious temperaments. Terrible. Yet, the breeders bred with them and showed them. Why ? Cause they won. They had the looks. I would NEVER EVER breed dogs with such bad temperament.

And health, hah, 2 of the most UNHEALTHY dogs I've ever had were from "good" breeders. Yeah, the problems were past the guarantee.

My current shepherd was from a "once in a lifetime" breeding. Couldn't be any better on paper. He's always had weak nerves, despite turning out to be my love.

And I agree, this is not the place for all that superiour "houlier then thou" attitude. This is about a new pup and its proud owner showing him off. We can discuss the what if's and where from's for other threads in other folders.

I've been to enough top dog shows to be quite wary to purchase from "top" breeders. Say what you want, this is my opinion based on my experiences and knowledge. Feel free to have your own.

To the OP...CONGRATULATIONS on your beautiful puppy. Don't let anyone ruin your excitement with their doom and gloom talk.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

MenTaLPiRacY said:


> im a dude.. and i dunno if im gonna post on this forum anymore. If this is the start of me and my GSD on this forum its not a good one. Me and my defective dog might go some where else. Thanks tho Mrs.k.


Most of us are congratulating you on your new adorable puppy, why not address those posts and not the others. What's done is done, and when we know better we do better.

In the mean time, your puppy looks like a sweetie pie and hoping he's the best dog ever for you!! :wub:


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## kt67 (Apr 10, 2004)

Welcome to the board! Your puppy is adorable! Congratulations on finding your new best friend.

To everyone else...

Chill out! How do you know that the pups parents have not been health tested? Did I miss that post? How dare you just assume that there will be problems because someone happened to have a litter at home. Although I personally would go to an established breeder.. there are perfectly good dogs, from perfectly good even _/GASP _titled parents who are born in peoples dining room.


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## patti (Apr 7, 2010)

I love him! He is so precious! Many people get rescued dogs, and never know anything about the breeder. Most of mine have just been strays, and they are all such good dogs. Enjoy him. They grow up so fast!


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## kaiapup (Jul 1, 2005)

DJEtzel said:


> Well, I guess you can't do anything about it now, but supporting a backyard breeder is never a good judgement IMO. I would wait years before purchasing a potentially unhealthy dog from a breeder that is doing so just for money or out of irresposibleness. Don't you have shelters or rescues around that you could of gone to? And I know many breeders will ship puppies, too.


Wow!!!!! 
Very big hypocritical statment coming from someone who bought their dog from a BYB.


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## kaiapup (Jul 1, 2005)

Congrats on the new pup!! I hope you stick around. I have been around here for 6 years now and it really is a good place with a ton of helpful people. 
Pay no attention to DJEtzel, she's just a kid who likes to criticize a lot. Just skip over her lectures


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

kaiapup said:


> Congrats on the new pup!! I hope you stick around. I have been around here for 6 years now and it really is a good place with a ton of helpful people.
> Pay no attention to DJEtzel, she's just a kid who likes to criticize a lot. Just skip over her lectures


sounds very trollish.


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## spiritsmom (Mar 1, 2003)

What a cute pupper! You're going to have fun watching that pup change colors as he gets older, I love the sables!


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## StryderPup (May 16, 2009)

HI JUBEI! Welcome to the forum. We need more pics to see how cute this pupster is.


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## MenTaLPiRacY (Mar 10, 2010)

spiritsmom said:


> What a cute pupper! You're going to have fun watching that pup change colors as he gets older, I love the sables!


Yeah i heard the sables go through coat changes as they get older.


StryderPup said:


> HI JUBEI! Welcome to the forum. We need more pics to see how cute this pupster is.


i need a camera instead of my phone haha.


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## Hunther's Dad (Mar 13, 2010)

Here's the take away from all this: Never let a human come between you and your dog.

Your puppy is adorable! He will be your best friend, no matter what anyone here says about how you got him.


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## retta666 (Sep 19, 2009)

You were supporting the life and happiness of the pup you purchased, not the supposedly "irresponsable" back yard breeder.

I have a dog from a byb and she is amazing. I'm not ashamed of my purchase. She may not be as pedigreed or papered as some here, but she probably has better temperament and better health than most. She is an amazing dog.

Good luck with your pup!


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## MariD (May 12, 2010)

Jubei is adorable! Congratulations - I know you two will make a great team. My Rolf is 18 weeks and a sable - it's been so fun watching his colors change. 

Enjoy that sweet boy!


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

Your pup is gorgeous, congratulations.


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## Afrancis (May 26, 2010)

Congrats on the new puppy. I cant wait to pick mine up on the 5th. Just out of curisoty, what do you guys consider a backyard breeder?


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

I would start another topic for that ? Cute pup


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## FuryanGoddess (Dec 26, 2009)

Personally, I wouldn't even touch that one here at all. It's safer that way


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## Wolfiesmom (Apr 10, 2010)

AWWW... He is adorable!!!! Congratulations!


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Congrats on your new baby!!

I got my boy from a BYB and even though I dont agree with her or her breeding, my boy is the best dog ever and I would totally buy him all over again. I'm sure your dog is going to be wonderful


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## trish07 (Mar 5, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> I just don't understand how you expected not to get a lecture when you did something purposely that was not in good taste. You wanted to support a backyard breeder and you think people will be okay with that? I just don't understand your reasoning. 90 miles is a couple hours drive. I make that weekly for fun, and you couldn't wait a little while to get a good quality puppy? I know people that wait years for theirs, and you had the money.
> 
> Sorry, you just don't make any sense to me. I hope you have a good life with your pup and you don't have any aggression, resource, reactivity, nerve, or hip problems with him, but I agree, I think you're going to need help with him. Good luck.


I find you harsh.

He wanted a GSD, he found this one, which is, I think, absolutly gorgeous, but unfortunately, this puppy didn't came from an "authorized" breeder.

I understand your point when you are saying that buying puppies from byb or puppy mills is not a good thing at all because i) you encourage them and ii) you may have issues (health and/or mentaly), but try to be more "ground to earth", if it was a perfect world, puppy mills wouldn't exist, but even, even if this guy hadn't bought his puppy there, somebody else would. 

This is the reality. Period. This guy should be proud for saving a good looking dog. Onwers and futur owners of dogs aren't the only responsible for puppy mills, *autorities, government et other organizations should do more to make puppy mills illegal*. For sure, if you have the choice between 2 dogs, you should always take the one that come from a known breeder, but here, this guy felt in love with a poor puppy that came from a byb, what would you have done??? Kill this puppy and all other one? we, as citizen, couldn't do all the work ourselves.

As for the mental/health issues, PLEASE, I DO have a LOT of mental/health issues with my GSD, and he comes from a very highly recommanded place in Quebec, a place known as probably the best breeder in the Province of Quebec. This means nothing. You have more chances to have health and mental issues from a byb, but having a dog from a well known breeder didn't mean your dog will be perfect.


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## Afrancis (May 26, 2010)

From what I can understand most people consider it a BYB if the dog dont come from a line of show dogs and have a stack of papers. If you dont plan on showing your dog and can save hundreds of dollars, buying from a so called "backyard breeder" is perfectly fine. Now dont get my comment confused with a puppymill. That is a totally different thing that I dont like either.


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## unloader (Feb 16, 2010)

Afrancis said:


> From what I can understand most people consider it a BYB if the dog dont come from a line of show dogs and have a stack of papers. If you dont plan on showing your dog and can save hundreds of dollars, buying from a so called "backyard breeder" is perfectly fine. Now dont get my comment confused with a puppymill. That is a totally different thing that I dont like either.


Anyone who cares about the breed would never agree with these statements. Backyard Breeders don't care about genetics, they care about money. How does this help the breed?

Congrats on your new puppy!


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## trish07 (Mar 5, 2010)

Afrancis said:


> From what I can understand most people consider it a BYB if the dog dont come from a line of show dogs and have a stack of papers. If you dont plan on showing your dog and can save hundreds of dollars, buying from a so called "backyard breeder" is perfectly fine. Now dont get my comment confused with a puppymill. That is a totally different thing that I dont like either.


I have to disagree with you. Like previously said, it is not about having a "High class line dog" just for showing, it's about physic health and mental health.

Byb do not care about the health of their dogs, they want to do money.

I think you mistunderstand what is a byb. It is not a person who, one time or so, decide to make his dog has babies. Byb use any type of dogs and many times a year to produce more and more puppies. They are not, in all cases, puppy mills, but they do not care for health issues or genetic problems which could cause big problems for the dogs.


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## Afrancis (May 26, 2010)

Thanks for clearing that up. I was confused on exactly what a BYB is.


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## Jessiewessie99 (Mar 6, 2009)

Welcome & Congrats!! Your puppy is super super cute!!

My dog came a supposed byb,even though I don't find them a byb at all. And she is one best dogs I have ever had! She is healthy, happy and very athletic. We paid $25 for her, she is worth every penny! 

Don't listen to DJEtzel, I had many runs with that user, I don't like the "i know it all" attitude. 

All that matters is that your puppy is happy, healthy and loves you and you love him.

Can't wait to see this little guy grow!!


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## retta666 (Sep 19, 2009)

unloader said:


> Anyone who cares about the breed would never agree with these statements. Backyard Breeders don't care about genetics, they care about money. How does this help the breed?
> 
> Congrats on your new puppy!


Now that's stereotyping. _Anyone_ who's actively breeding and selling animals has an obvious interest in making money. 
You mean to tell me that "reputable" breeder isn't concerned with turning a profit? He cares more about the welfare and promotion of the breed, right? Why is he selling his pups for $1400?
Genetics? Look what selective breeding has done to the GSD!


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

retta666 said:


> Now that's stereotyping. _Anyone_ who's actively breeding and selling animals has an obvious interest in making money.
> You mean to tell me that "reputable" breeder isn't concerned with turning a profit? He cares more about the welfare and promotion of the breed, right? Why is he selling his pups for $1400?
> Genetics? Look what selective breeding has done to the GSD!


Because that $1400 supports his/her breeding program. X-rays, vet bills, dog food, resources, titling, transportation, etc, etc are not free.


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## sagelfn (Aug 13, 2009)

i'm sure there are plenty of threads to search and reopen to discuss BYBs or start a new one. 

I think this thread should get back on topic 

To the OP :welcome: cute pup


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

Jessiewessie99 said:


> My dog came a supposed byb,even though I don't find them a byb at all. And she is one best dogs I have ever had! She is healthy, happy and very athletic. We paid $25 for her, she is worth every penny!


Wow... $25?? Really? That's a weird price to charge for a dog. What's the point of even charging anything at all if theyre only going to charge $25? If you don't mind me asking, where did you get her from? Rescue, breeder, side of the road? 

Not putting you down or anything, i just find only $25 a strange price for a dog. Usually BYB will charge something like $300, not $25. Just curious.


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## Betty (Aug 11, 2002)

Congrats on your new pup and welcome to the board!


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## Jessiewessie99 (Mar 6, 2009)

Lucy Dog said:


> Wow... $25?? Really? That's a weird price to charge for a dog. What's the point of even charging anything at all if theyre only going to charge $25? If you don't mind me asking, where did you get her from? Rescue, breeder, side of the road?
> 
> Not putting you down or anything, i just find only $25 a strange price for a dog. Usually BYB will charge something like $300, not $25. Just curious.


Yes $25.lol. No joke. We got her from a couple who thought they could keep 2 intact GSDs(male and female) Big mistake. So they sold all the puppies for $25. We got her health records, she was dewormed and had the other proper puppy shots when they are born. They gave us pictures of the puppies to decide which one we wanted, we almost got her brother, they gave us pictures of the parents, they also let us visit the parents. They even contacted a shelter in case any of the puppies were not sold, but all were sold.

They were very nice people, after all the puppies were sold they got both of the parents fixed. yes it is a very strange price for bybs.lol. I don't even consider them bybs 1. the price 2. the way they handled the situation 3. they took responsibility for what they did. They told us if we had any questions we could call them. But apparently they are still bybs.

Yes, if anyone wants to discuss BYBs it should be another thread not this one.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Jessiewessie99 said:


> Welcome & Congrats!! Your puppy is super super cute!!
> 
> My dog came a supposed byb,even though I don't find them a byb at all. And she is one best dogs I have ever had! She is healthy, happy and very athletic. We paid $25 for her, she is worth every penny!
> 
> ...


I'm a know it all because I don't support or condone supporting backyard breeders? That doesn't make any sense. 

Please don't insult me for no reason on a public forum, especially when I wasn't even talking to you. It's quite rude and childish.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

ENOUGH!! Let the OP share their joy about getting a new puppy. If you want to start a new topic in the appropriate forum than do so, but no more lectures in this thread. 

Thank you,

ADMIN Lisa

*****


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