# Prong Collar on Puppy, Yes/No?



## Shawn & Jax (Feb 16, 2018)

Hey everyone,

I stumbled across many threads here with people praising the prong collar for correcting their GSD's and have done a fair bit of extensive research on them. My little guy is only 4 months old, 36 lbs, but he does enjoy pulling on the leash at times. He is not strong enough to overpower me but he definitely is getting strong fast! Should I hold off on getting a prong for leash training and try the old fashioned way? He has a flat buckle collar with a 26ft retractable leash. I just don't want to cause future issues by using a prong too early. I've never had to look into different collar options because all previous dogs either had very good leash manners or were too small for their bad manners to matter!

Thanks


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## JaxsMom (Dec 31, 2017)

I waited until he was an adolescent and I knew darned well that he understood and was just ignoring me lol. I'm not an expert at ALL, but since he is still so young, why not try training him to heel with treats and praise. Again, not an expert, but I have trouble justifying correcting my dog when I am not 100% sure he understands what I am asking first. 

Not sure that retractable leashes are recommended. I'm sure its fine for now but would make a change going forward. They grow fast! Cant imagine using a retractable leash with mine at this point and only 3 months ahead of you


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## Bramble (Oct 23, 2011)

Get rid of the retractable lead and get a regular leash. Unless locked retractable leashes put constant pressure on the collar which engages the dog's opposition reflex and actually makes them pull. You can not teach a dog not to pull if there is constant pressure on the collar. If you want to give your pup more freedom and do not trust them off leash then use a longline and don't expect loose leash walking when you are using it.

What method have you used to teach loose leash walking? I like to start without a leash so my puppy never even learns to pull in the first place. I'd just start wandering around and mark and reward every time my puppy comes and walks beside me. This starts building value for being near me. I know some people use the tree method and stand still until the puppy stops pulling. I've never had success with this since the puppy usually just gets frustrated and so do I You also need to decide early on what your criteria for LLW is. Do you want your dog to remain right next to you? Can your dog be ahead of you? Can your dog lag behind? Can your dog stop and sniff? Know what you want and then reinforce that. If you are unclear and sometimes want your dog next to you and sometimes let them be in front you will only make things confusing and your dog won't know what you want and will probably just make up their own rules. Be consistent.

A prong collar will not teach your puppy to LLW. It will suppress the behavior by making it unpleasant to pull so your puppy will avoid that by keeping the leash loose. If you are not also reinforcing LLW then once the prong is removed you will likely have a puppy that still pulls. 

Personally I would not use a prong collar on a young puppy. That is my choice, but I know others use punishment successfully with young puppies so it is an option if done correctly. I prefer to train motivationally with my young puppies and do not punish them for things they have not learned how to do correctly. Usually if my puppy making mistakes it it my fault as the trainer not theirs.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

No prongs on puppies. And retractable leashes are dangerous.


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

My dog knows to heel at my knee with the heel command and also she is alowed to sniff and run around with the Lets Go command, which is actually a release command. She is not required to march around like a soldier at all times. She gets more exersise, more fun that way. The close heel was inforced with a prong collar but at 18 months. First the sit command was taught, then the no pull wat taught, and then the Heel command was taught. It is a progression, like training horses. Here is how my trainer advisor Don Sullivan teaches it.

They are not expected to heel closely the whole time. They are allowed the Lets Go command, it is a release command, to sniff and roam nearby and be happy to be near us while being a dog of our pack. They get 5 times the excersise that way. But when a close control is needed they are brought to heel. It is first taught on a short line. Start out with the dog beside you. As you go, step out with the left foot and say heel. The dog notices this its time to move. If she's lagging behind, encourage them up with some kissy noises, some finger motion, then praise words as they comply.

The best thing is when the dog's head is angled up toward you and she is paying close attention.This is so when you begin to change direction, the dog is visually aware. When you want to stop, slow down a few steps so the dog knows there is something about to happen. Don wants the dog to automatically sit when the handler stops. (That is not practical to a ridden horse so I don't expect Inga to sit unless I say Sit.) To turn left (heel is on the left) you say hey girl, plant your left foot and swing your right foot across in front of their face. They have to be looking up at you, not smelling around on the ground or some distraction. Say hey girl and continue. Then praise as you keep going. If they are lagging when they know to keep up give a quick leash correction (with a mild plastic prong collar or prong for a harder dag) then praise when they comply.

For turning right, keep the hand lower and lead them around to the right if neccessary, but the line is loose. You don't want to drag the dog. You want to make her feel like its her idea. 

Then, drop the line, let them drag it. If the dog is not doing well changing dirstions, pick up the line again and walk with it some more.Try dropping the line. Once the dog has got this, practice proofing the dog under distractions.


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## Shawn & Jax (Feb 16, 2018)

Sabis mom said:


> No prongs on puppies. And retractable leashes are dangerous.


Oh really? What makes them dangerous? I have a 6 foot standard leash as well, but I have to take my dog out into a common area for potty breaks so I got the retractable to give him a bit more room to smell and explore with pulling me all over the place (there's no dangers/tangle traps that would cause problems). Is it because it's got less control in emergency situations?


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## JaxsMom (Dec 31, 2017)

Shawn & Jax said:


> Oh really? What makes them dangerous? I have a 6 foot standard leash as well, but I have to take my dog out into a common area for potty breaks so I got the retractable to give him a bit more room to smell and explore with pulling me all over the place (there's no dangers/tangle traps that would cause problems). Is it because it's got less control in emergency situations?


You will be amazed at how fast they grow and strengthen. In that situation maybe a 20' cotton training line would be better, no mechanism to break then a super thin line to cut your hand up on.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I hate retractable leashes. Look up injuries to hands from them.

You would be better off teaching your puppy to release tot he pressure of the collar. Put him on a regular collar and leash. When the puppy pulls, stop and slowing back up. You shouldn't be dragging him backwards, just putting pressure on him. When he turns to look at you, lure him back into the position you want and reward. 

If you are consistent with that, he will start looking back at you as soon as he feels any pressure from the collar.

Just remember to choose where you want him to be in position to you. You haev to consistently reward that position and keep that reward line.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Shawn & Jax said:


> Oh really? What makes them dangerous? I have a 6 foot standard leash as well, but I have to take my dog out into a common area for potty breaks so I got the retractable to give him a bit more room to smell and explore with pulling me all over the place (there's no dangers/tangle traps that would cause problems). Is it because it's got less control in emergency situations?


Aside from injuries to you, it becomes a boogey man chasing your dog if it gets dropped, there is no way to force the dog back to you in an emergency, they get wrapped around other dogs, I could go on for ever. Google it.
Get or make a 25' long line. I think Shadows cost me 5 bucks to make.


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

retractable only when pups are little. There are some times when trainers my use a flexi but those are limited specific incidences. And the kind with a wire rather than a flat leash are dangerous. 

I started prongs at 6 months with my big-boy. He was getting strong enough to drag me around. But remember young dogs don't have maturity and self control yet, so please don't crank on it. Let them "self correct", as if they pull it feels annoying. But best to train with games and rewards and use the correction of the prong for those sudden "yikes" moments.


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## Evohog (Jul 18, 2017)

Wait till your pup is 6 months before using a prong collar.
And I don't like the retractable leashes either.

I use a 6' for normal walking. When the pup starts to pull, hold pressure and start walking the other way. Don't yank.
He/she will realize real quick that a loose leash is way more comfortable. Reward as soon as there is no more pressure on the leash, i.e. he follows you. If you want to give your pup more space, use a 20' leash.

Use the time between now and 6 months to read up/watch video's on how to fit and use the prong if you never used one before.


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