# Service Dog



## Suddenly

We are considering adopting Laika as our Service Dog for mobility. My husband has spinal stenosis. She was born in 2005. Do you think her age is an issue. Her health is perfect!!
















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## Wolfgeist

Can we have information on pedigree and temperament? I imagine a dog acting as a service dog for a mobility/spinal condition will need to have strict temperament guidelines... I can't imagine the pain of having a dog outdoors with your husband and suddenly get excited over another dog or a squirrel while attached to him somehow... please give more details on the dog?


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## carmspack

8 could be middle age , with long life ahead in some lines and in others it could be pretty geriatric and nearing the end. 
You have to know the background for longevity within the line , within the family .
I see from your other thread that you have not seen the dog yet , so the question is how old is she in the picture . 
You want her for a service dog - is she trained and certified for this ? 
You have to question the circumstances around her being offered at this age . Was she someones service dog and she was retired because of some issue , or did her person decline in healthy or even decease? If your husband needs physical assistance you don't want to take on a dog that soon will require assistance herself .


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## Magwart

Also, how physically demanding is the service work involved? (E.g., any jumping? pulling heavy objects?) And for how many hours a day will she be doing any physically taxing service work, as opposed to just being good company and doing small tasks? 

And by "healthy," have they confirmed her hips and elbows are sound, without arthritis?


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## Suddenly

Thanks for everyone's concerns and questions. My husband needs for her are to be there with him for balance, he does not fall but finds it hard to walk long distances, and also if he drops something she would be able to pick it up and place it in his hand. He works full time so she would be with me during the days and with him when home from work. When he is working he is sitting during the day. Alittle history there so you have an idea.
She is mobility assistant trained, has her canine citizen title as well as her therapy Dog title. She doe not pull and has fabulous breeding, and in great health. So my question is she was born in 2005 and I was wondering if her age should be an issue? 
Happy Néw Year to All.
Any feedback would be great.
Many thanks,
Susan


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## Loneforce

You never know what is going to happen. She could be 1 year old and pass away. I dont see why age would be an issue. If she is a trained service dog for what you need her for, Im sure she will do her duty. Untill she can't perform it anymore. GSD is a very loyal dog.


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## SFGSSD

Seems to be some red flags here. 1. The dogs age 2. Service Dogs that are professionally trained are usually retired when they are no longer working for the person they were teamed with. 3. The dog is also a Therapy Dog? Oh boy... 

Typical standard procedure form good Service Dog orgs is once the dog can no longer function for it's original disabled partner it is retired and either goes back to the facility that trained them to be rehomed AS A PET or there is a pre-arranged provision in place for what happens to the dog if it can no longer be with it's original partner. In most cases a family member agrees to take continue to care for the dog as a pet. Selling it to someone else as a Service Dog is something that is frowned upon for a lot of reasons. 

I second what camspack said as well: "You have to question the circumstances around her being offered at this age . Was she someones service dog and she was retired because of some issue , or did her person decline in healthy or even decease?"


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## Loneforce

I am glad you jumped in on this one Terry


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## Lilie

I'm curious. If the OP is adopting the dog as a PET dog, but would also like to utilize it's ability to assist her husband at night (when he is home from work) as an added benefit to having a PET at home, would there be a problem?

I understood the post to read the husband wasn't looking for an official service dog, as in a dog for full time usage, but a dog that could assist while he was at home after work. While still enjoying having a PET at home. 

I really don't know, I'm asking a question. I've taught my GSD to pick things up for me and hand them to me. Just as something to teach him. He'll also stand still and allow me to 'pretend' to use him for leverage. He isn't a service dog, he just likes to have a job. But wouldn't it be an added benefit if I really needed him to pick something up (say I break my leg, God forbid)?


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## msvette2u

Our last GSD passed at age 8 due to an FCE (Fibrocartilaginous Embolism), and at that time they found spinal stenosis in _him._ 
I would be concerned enough to x-ray an 8 yr. old before attempting to use it as a therapy dog expected to help bear a human's weight, as our dog would often be stiff and (presumably) sore in the mornings and after naps.


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## FlyAway

I can't answer the age question, but a friend of mine has mobility issues. She bought a Malinois puppy and trained her as her service dog. The dog wears a harness with a large handle attached. Poor girl has been bit twice now by other dogs while working, but she understands her job and does not move an inch! 

The harness is very similar to this. Leather Service Dog Harness with rigid handle


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## JakodaCD OA

I agree with Lillie 

If the dog is in need of a home, not being sold for an exhorbitant amount of money and is physically still in good shape, I don't see the harm in taking her.

However, if she IS being sold as an SD, the age would be a concern for me, because face it, our gsd's at age 8 start to go downhill/and or may have age related health issues popping up. And I would also wonder why the dog is in need of a new home?

First tho, I think you really should go meet the dog, she may not take to you or your husband and vice versa


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## Suddenly

Just to let you know she is not 8yrs. She is 6yrs. She is being donated to us. She is in perfect health and we will take insurance for her. She will help with balance and just in case of a fall. We will have all her health certificates.


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## Andaka

If she was born in 2005 then she is at least 7 years old. Why is she being rehomed at this age?

I have an 11 year old dog that doesn't look a day over 7. Her litter sister looks and acts like an old dog. You just don't know how she will age. Balance work is hard on a dog's body.


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## SFGSSD

Suddenly said:


> Just to let you know she is not 8yrs. She is 6yrs. She is being donated to us. She is in perfect health and we will take insurance for her. She will help with balance and just in case of a fall. We will have all her health certificates.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App


To me, the dogs health is not a as much of a concern as her actual level of competency as a Service Dog at this point. If you do not ever plan to take the dog in public and want the dog as "Just a Pet" that may help at home without big expectation from this dog, that’s one thing, especially if they are donating this dog to you. But I have a feeling you may have more aspirations for this dog. With everything you told us, it is very concerning if you have your hopes up that this dog will function as a Service Dog for you at home as well as in a public access capacity. Rehoming this dog does not follow normal/usual Service Dog facility protocol. I would use extreme caution. 



JakodaCD OA is giving great advice in regards to meeting the dog first before you commit to it. Not only to screen bonding or has separation anxiety issued but also to evaluate her actual competency. If possible bring and experienced Service or Working dog trainer with you when you check her out.


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## SFGSSD

Loneforce said:


> I am glad you jumped in on this one Terry


 Thanks Jerry. :blush:


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## SFGSSD

SFGSSD said:


> To me, the dogs health is not a as much of a concern as her actual level of competency as a Service Dog at this point. If you do not ever plan to take the dog in public and want the dog as "Just a Pet" that may help at home without big expectation from this dog, that’s one thing, especially if they are donating this dog to you. But I have a feeling you may have more aspirations for this dog. With everything you told us, it is very concerning if you have your hopes up that this dog will function as a Service Dog for you at home as well as in a public access capacity. Rehoming this dog does not follow normal/usual Service Dog facility protocol. I would use extreme caution.
> 
> JakodaCD OA is giving great advice in regards to meeting the dog first before you commit to it. Not only to screen bonding or has separation anxiety issued but also to evaluate her actual competency. If possible bring and experienced Service or Working dog trainer with you when you check her out.


 Sorry for the typo's my post should read:
To me, the dogs health is not a as much of a concern as her actual level of competency as a Service Dog at this point. If you do not ever plan to take the dog in public and want the dog as "Just a Pet" that may help at home, without big expectation from this dog, that’s one thing, especially if they are donating this dog to you. But I have a feeling you may have more aspirations for this dog. With everything you told us, it is very concerning if you have your hopes up that this dog will function as a Service Dog for you at home as well as in a public access capacity. Rehoming this dog does not follow normal/usual Service Dog facility protocol. I would use extreme caution. 



JakodaCD OA is giving great advice in regards to meeting the dog first before you commit to it. Not only to screen bonding or if the dog has separation anxiety issues but also to evaluate her actual competency. If possible bring an experienced Service or Working dog trainer with you when you check her out.


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## Lauri & The Gang

Suddenly said:


> My husband needs for her are to be there with him for balance, he does not fall but finds it hard to walk long distances, and also if he drops something she would be able to pick it up and place it in his hand. He works full time so she would be with me during the days and with him when home from work.http://www.petguide.com/mobile


The type of work (and amount of time spent working) doesn't sound like too much to expect from a dog this age.


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## Lauri & The Gang

SFGSSD said:


> 2. Service Dogs that are professionally trained are usually retired when they are no longer working for the person they were teamed with. 3. The dog is also a Therapy Dog? Oh boy...


2 - Unless their person can no longer use them. Maybe the person died, or their disabilities changed in such a way that the dog no longer met their needs.

3 - What is wrong with a dog being a Service Dog AND a Therapy Dog??


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## ILGHAUS

> 3 - What is wrong with a dog being a Service Dog AND a Therapy Dog??


Nothing. Earlier this past year I posted of one of the larger national organizations changing their long standing policy of allowing SD to test and be registered with their organization as a therapy dog. 

Warning to anyone posting on this .... this could become a hot topic. So I'm giving a heads up to remember our rules.


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## SFGSSD

ILGHAUS said:


> Nothing. Earlier this past year I posted of one of the larger national organizations changing their long standing policy of allowing SD to test and be registered with their organization as a therapy dog.
> 
> Warning to anyone posting on this .... this could become a hot topic. So I'm giving a heads up to remember our rules.


This is unacceptable both from the legal definition of a Service Dog (ADA)and from a working dog training and conditioning standpoint. If you would like to start a new thread on this I would be happy to get into this in detail.


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## Xeph

Are you agreeing that a service dog can not also do therapy work, or that the organization in question is violating law by disallowing SDs to do therapy work?

Sorry, your wording left me a bit confused


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## SFGSSD

Xeph said:


> Are you agreeing that a service dog can not also do therapy work, or that the organization in question is violating law by disallowing SDs to do therapy work?
> 
> Sorry, your wording left me a bit confused


I do not agree that Service Dogs should be allowed to ALSO do Therapy Dog work while active as a Service Dog teamed with a disabled partner. I do not agree that TDI's decision to not allow the dual role is clearly violating the law in this regard.

Sorry ILGHAUS, the suggestion of allowing a duel role is contradictory on multiple levels.


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## JakodaCD OA

while I don't understand really the "whys" of this being a hot topic..I honestly don't see the problem with an SD dog going into a hospital/retirement home/whatever, and be a Therapy dog? Is it a presumption that doing Therapy work will mess up the dog for the handler ?


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## Xeph

I must say, I also disagree with an SD not being able to do therapy work. Do you think that SDs shouldn't be allowed to participate in sports either? Because I disagree there, too, if that's the case.



> Is it a presumption that doing Therapy work will mess up the dog for the handler ?


It is for the therapy group that says SDs can't do both.

I think it largely depends on what the dog is for.

My handicap is neurological. My dog needn't be "on" when I am sitting down. I am in no danger. I don't see how it's contradictory or conflicting to my dog to lay on a bed or sit on the floor next to somebody while somebody pets him.

He doesn't solicit attention out in public, and knows the difference (and acts entirely different) between his vest being on and off.


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## SFGSSD

Xeph said:


> I must say, I also disagree with an SD not being able to do therapy work. Do you think that SDs shouldn't be allowed to participate in sports either? Because I disagree there, too, if that's the case.
> 
> 
> It is for the therapy group that says SDs can't do both.
> 
> I think it largely depends on what the dog is for.
> 
> My handicap is neurological. My dog needn't be "on" when I am sitting down. I am in no danger. I don't see how it's contradictory or conflicting to my dog to lay on a bed or sit on the floor next to somebody while somebody pets him.
> 
> He doesn't solicit attention out in public, and knows the difference (and acts entirely different) between his vest being on and off.


So, do you think it is ok for your SD to act and be treated like a pet in public by strangers or others? Did you train your own SD? 
1. There are associative behaviors that can result in this and it can be dangerous for the SD handler.
2. By definition it is a conflict in terms legally.
I will start another thread on this when I got time.


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## carmspack

every organization that I have dealt with - is pretty clear cut on the difference between pet and working . 
Confusion from the dog may mean that the dog is retired , or does not pass certification.


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## SFGSSD

carmspack said:


> every organization that i have dealt with - is pretty clear cut on the difference between pet and working .
> Confusion from the dog may mean that the dog is retired , or does not pass certification.


 exactly!


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## JakodaCD OA

I can see the difference between 'pet' and 'working'..I guess I don't understand why an SD in work mode who isn't soliciting attention or deviates from it's "work"..cannot have some 'off' time to do therapy dog interaction?

To me it's like saying, the dog doesn't know the difference between doing obedience and doing agility? (just as an example)


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## Xeph

> So, do you think it is ok for your SD to act and be treated like a pet in public by strangers or others? Did you train your own SD?


I do not, and yes I did.



> 2. By definition it is a conflict in terms legally.


Conflict in terms, yes, but that's an issue of terminology, not of what the dog is able to do.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

But for a dog, who already has a job, do they really need a job-hobby? Wouldn't it be nice to find something more fun for them to do? Not that therapy work isn't fun for a dog, but dang, that's a lot. 

If that were a person they'd be talking about burn out! 

I would want to find some other hobby to do that can give to the dog.


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## Xeph

> I would want to find some other hobby to do that can give to the dog.


For some dogs, I'm sure unbridled affection without being scolded is ideal. For others, not so much.

I actually don't even participate in therapy work. I just think it's a silly notion that a dog that works in service is incapable, or would be confused by, laying on a bed or near somebody and being touched.

Mostly I find the logic that it would confuse the dog flawed, because to me it implies that nobody should ever interact with my SD EVER but me. And I totally reject that idea. I mean, should I not allow friends that come into my home to pet my working dog, lest he be confused in public?

Just seems a bit silly to me. Just my opinion.


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## ILGHAUS

> If you would like to start a new thread on this I would be happy to get into this in detail.


I see you have started another thread.


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