# 4 year old male suddenly aggressive



## Emilie (Apr 22, 2016)

We have a male Shepherd that has suddenly become aggressive. We took him to breed (something he is use to) and he came back a different dog. He has attacked our female 4 times in the 2 days he has been back home. He is aggressive toward our 5 year old now as well. He has never shown any aggressive behavior toward our child and its very concerning. She is very good with him and was actively involved in his training but now every time she tries to pet him he growls at her, no food,toys,ect involved. My husband has tried holding him and letting her pet him but he still growls. Its strange because like I said he has never shown any signs of aggression in the past but he is aggressive toward our female Shepherd but not out female pug. He is aggressive toward our daughter but not us or other children.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

Is he in pain?


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

That was my guess. Were you present wherever he was bred -- doesn't the bitch usually go to the dog? He might need to see a vet and see if he has something going on. He may have been injured...


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

How well do you know the other dog owner? Have you asked exactly what happened?


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Yes did you talk to the person who was caring for your dog? Was the breeding successful? Did a fight break out? Sounds like the dog is in discomfort/pain.


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## Emilie (Apr 22, 2016)

The breeder is a friend. The female could not come to us because we don't have the room and we don't want our daughter seeing them mate. We thought it could be pain but we have rubbed on him and played with him to try to get a reaction and nothing. Klaus is pushing 115lbs so not much is getting the best of him and the breeder said that no serious scuffles broke out. He has calmed down towards our female but not our daughter. He isn't showing his teeth or snapping at her but still growls every time she tries to touch him. The same dog that was jumping on the trampoline with her 6 days ago


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## Emilie (Apr 22, 2016)

Also he is purposely avoiding her. When she comes in the room he growls. He would usually follow her everywhere and sleep in the bed with her. Now he wants nothing to do with her


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Emilie said:


> Also he is purposely avoiding her. When she comes in the room he growls. He would usually follow her everywhere and sleep in the bed with her. Now he wants nothing to do with her


Hmm OK well "friends" are not something happened??

Time for different management, lot's of info here:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...essive-our-5-year-old-smaller-dog-help-5.html

Train the Place Command institute a "No free roaming in the house policy" and I would just start over with your dog, see the first link here:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/5296377-post8.html

In the home Crate or Place no free roaming, I would not allow the dog to be in contact with the child without supervision.

If you need to find a trainer see here:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/7589889-post13.html

Dealing with the situation is step one (management) figuring out the how and why it happened ... kinda like good luck with that ... sorry.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Does the breeder have young children? Are you possibly overlooking something that happened that would cause him to associate your daughter with a bad experience. Have you taken him to the vet?


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Klaus is pushing 115lbs 
The same dog that was jumping on the trampoline with her 
5 year old -----was actively involved in his training 
husband has tried holding him and letting her pet him but he still growls
he is aggressive toward our female Shepherd
and a pug 

all of the above (and other comments) could have lead to an entirely different thread

time for immediate changes in management before something happens to the 5 year old

take dog to the vet 

"We took him to breed (something he is use to)"
I take it that his breeding experience was to your own female GSD -
so that would have been in your home.

best advice -- get the dog to the vet 
prevent harm to the child

** leave breeding to those that are set up to do it properly --
on many levels of properly **

can't say what I am thinking ---


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## Emilie (Apr 22, 2016)

My family bred dogs as did my husbands. The breeder we took him to has 30+ years experience and is known and respected in our area. We don't have the facilities to breed yet, hence why we took him there. Our female got sick and had to be fixed before we had the chance to breed them. I'm confident that between us and the breeder we have the experience and know how when it comes to breeding. He was NOT aggressive toward our pug and was excited to see her. He has an appointment with the vet today. I am looking for suggestions as to what could be causing this behavior and I appreciate everyones input.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

My best guess Emilie, is you may have misread his interactions with your daughter in the past. They weren't what you thought they were and what your seeing now are just a kind of natural escalation. I'd keep him away from her.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

How many facilities do you need to breed a dog? My sight hound sired several litters successfully in a small back yard. If someone can watch your daughter for an hour you should be fine and the dogs too. Something must have happened in combination with the family dynamics that, like Storm said, could have escalated.
By the way, an animal breeding is good sex-ed. My 5 year old son saw a horse breeding and asked what happened so I told him that the stallion was putting sperm (seeds) into the mare so she could have a foal next year. He replied "That is so sweet that he wants to do that for her". :smile2:


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

How long was the dog away from your home for?


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## Emilie (Apr 22, 2016)

We attempted to bring another female in to breed once and our female was having none of it. By facilities I mean a kennel to put them or her in. We as parents were just uncomfortable with her seeing or knowing what was going on. He was away for 4 days. It takes him a day or so to warm up to the females in that way.


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Emilie said:


> We attempted to bring another female in to breed once and our female was having none of it. By facilities I mean a kennel to put them or her in. We as parents were just uncomfortable with her seeing or knowing what was going on. He was away for 4 days. It takes him a day or so to warm up to the females in that way.


It takes your experienced dog a day or so to decide if he wants to breed?


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I am inclined to agree that previous warning signs may have been missed.

I don't know much about breeding dogs. Prev. Experience breeding horses. Stallions can certainly act different when they are actively breeding than when they have not for awhile.

You said dog growls "every time she tries to touch him". if it were me 1 growl would be the end of it & there would not bs a other chance for these two to interact until

1. Vet visit
2. Trainer brought in to evaluate
3. Muzzle train the dog
4. Wait until he seems "himself" again

Start over reintroducing them w/muzzle after above.

Lastly, I have known my dogs to hide their stress when we have had company in the house, and as soon as they leave the dogs act out and growl at each other whe they are ordinarily find together. Just like humans get nasty at each other when they are stressed. Has he ever been away from home before? Stress & testosterone got him ramped up? He didn't sleep well while away? I'm sure plenty of dogs would still not growl at the child under all those same circumstances so it is still something you have to know about your dog.

The dog has given you it sounds like multiple warnings about the kid. I wouldn't take it lightly.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Take the dog to the vet. 

Get him neutered. 

Find him a pet home with no children and explain that he is not necessarily good with children. 

Your dog is over-sized, either fat or out of standard -- shouldn't be bred. 
Your dog is displaying concerning behavior. Nick his nads and protect your daughter by rehoming him.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> It takes your experienced dog a day or so to decide if he wants to breed?


maybe he is just as embarrassed as his owners and doesn't want anyone to see....:grin2:
(Just kidding of course, couldn't resist)


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## Suzy25 (Mar 3, 2016)

thats very interesting, how has he acted before after breeding? and 115 pounds for a shepherd is awfully big, 
keep your child away from him, leave him for a few days away from the child and other female shepherd, give him lots of exercise and training, maybe keep him interacting with your pug too because he likes her. bring a professional trainer to evaluate him. good job bringing him in to the vet, dogs are very good at hiding pain, he might not yelp when you touch him but even him tensing up will be a sign of discomfort. ask the breeder to tell you exactly what went on when he was there, might have been very stressed out while there and it is effecting him even when he's home. could you take a video of him interacting with the female shepherd and pug, and child? not all at once but i'd like too see him interacting and how bad his aggression is, obviously in a controlled environment, but if you think it would put your child or dogs in danger then obviously don't, maybe at least post some pictures of him? i'd like to see what he looks like, not for the aggression but just curious


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

should any of these dogs be bred?


I mean , breeding dogs should have a goal of improvement , which requires knowledge and experience of the finer points of the breed .


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

Oh good call on the neuter, I agree with that.

I mean, I MIGHT forgive the growl at the child under some pretty specific circumstances. We adopted a dog years ago who growled at both of my kids once within a week of coming home. Once was a resource guarding a bone. Another was where he was laying in bed with my husband and me during the day. Our daughter burst in waving a kite over her head. 

We got VERY strict with him with access to the kids. The youngest was 8. We involved them in the decision of whether to keep him and work with him. As in, were they willing to be very careful following rules about this dog, they were gung ho. 

I worked super hard with him about all his issues. I was so careful with him with the kids. But he also let me know real early on that he really wasn't looking for trouble. He was a much loved family member until he died of cancer this year. He never hurt a human in his life.

He was super stressed moving into our home, didn't know us and had been througn approximately 6 homes in about 3 years and I don't think anyone ever explained anything to him in a way he could understand.

However, the whole holding him to daughter can pet after he has growled makes me think you guys would need intensive professional intervention to make it safe for your kids with this dog.

Maybe he was injured and the first time the daughter pet him she touched that spot or something, idk...


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

On second thought about the kid, I'd want to know how many times and under what circumstances was he growling at this kid. I mean, was the kid chasing him around...anything extenuating in the dog's favor.

Was he sleeping?


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Either something happened at the breeder's home, he's not feeling well, or something set him off in your home. Dogs don't suddenly change behaviors without a good reason. You need to figure out what it is. 

This isn't meant to be critical. I'm trying to figure out why a dog that oversized would be used as a stud by an experienced and respected breeder of 30 years.


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

LuvShepherds said:


> Either something happened at the breeder's home, he's not feeling well, or something set him off in your home. Dogs don't suddenly change behaviors without a good reason. You need to figure out what it is.
> 
> *This isn't meant to be critical. I'm trying to figure out why a dog that oversized would be used as a stud by an experienced and respected breeder of 30 years*.


A "respected" breeder of 30 years wouldn't use this oversized dog as a stud.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Slamdunc said:


> A "respected" breeder of 30 years wouldn't use this oversized dog as a stud.


Which makes me think something else happened there. Maybe the breeder wasn't even present and doesn't know.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I have heard of dogs copping an attitude after being used for breeding. I haven't experienced this though. 

I suppose if the people using him as a stud, had him chase down a less than compliant bitch, and be, rather brutish, to get the job done, then that might make a dog more likely to act more brutish. 

It is concerning that the attitude change is toward a child. I would neuter such a dog. I might do more than that, it would depend on the level of intensity toward the child. I have no use for a dog that is aggressive toward children, and I see no reason someone else might want one. I understand this dog is probably mostly a pet though. Neutering and leadership boot camp might bring him back to himself, and careful interaction with the child to determine whether it makes any sense at all to try to keep the dog in the home. 

The dog should not be bred again. OS is one thing, yes there is a market for big dogs, and there are worse things to eliminate a dog from the gene pool for. But temperament issues regarding aggression with family members, children, well, that is something we don't want bred.


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

LuvShepherds said:


> Which makes me think something else happened there. Maybe the breeder wasn't even present and doesn't know.


I was being facetious when I said "respected." A respected GSD breeder wouldn't breed a 115 lb GSD unless it had some other fantastic qualities besides being too large.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Thecowboysgirl said:


> However, the whole holding him to daughter can pet after he has growled makes me think you guys would need intensive professional intervention to make it safe for your kids with this dog.


This ^^^ yes agreed, not a recommended approach.


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