# I do not know my dog. I am in shock.



## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

Every time I turn the bath water on, Rocky runs into the corner and lays down so I literally have to drag him until he stands up.

Today I did not even turn on the water, I said "lets take a bath" and he ran and laid down like he always does, but when I reached for him, he growled at me very quietly. 

I was in shock and thought I imagined it. I said "come on, let's go" and he growled at me and showed me the tiniest amount of teeth.

I am utterly distraught and in tears right now. I feel like I just lost my best friend.

He is laying on the bed with me like nothing ever happened but I do not even want to pet him right now.

He just saw the vet. He has all his shots, is not sick or hurt in any way. The foster dog was not in the room. We have done this exact same thing once a week for two years now. He has never growled at me.

I am at a loss for words. I don't know what to do. My heart is aching right now. I was scared to pet my own dog that has never shown any type of aggression towards me or my boyfriend in the two years we have had him.

Please be kind with your replies. I know everyone is very opinionated but negative replies would only cut the wound deeper. Please give me some constructive criticism or advice.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

He has never growled at anyone except someone trying to get in the house. Not the vet giving him shots, not the vet getting his temperature, nothing.


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## NewbieShepherdGirl (Jan 7, 2011)

I don't have a ton of advice, but I would like to say I'm sorry that happened. Sasha is also afraid of baths. She doesn't growl, but when I go to put her in she thrashes, screams, and then for hours will act terrified of me. It's heartbreaking. I'm sure others will offer advice; I just wanted to offer my sympathy.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

He didn't bite and that is a good sign Maybe re evaluate the whole situation. Did he ever have a bad experience in the bathtub? Did he just have his shots? Any in the neck area, where it could be sore? What was your reaction to him when he growled?


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

months ago, did you post something about your dog
and aggression?


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## Loneforce (Feb 12, 2012)

Have you tried to take one of his favorite toys and had him follow you to the bath? It just might take something simple like that to make it a fun experience for him. Does he like the garden hose? maby take him outside and let him play with the water for a bit, then slowly start sudsing him down. dont show him that his growls startle you, the more he knows he can do that, the more he will.


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## LifeofRiley (Oct 20, 2011)

I second what Loneforce posted. You have created a routine around something that he apparently finds a very negative experience. Try switching the routine and introducing something that is fun into it. 

I know it must feel like a betrayal to have your own dog growl at you. But, I guarantee you that is not the dog's intent. He is simply communicating that he is afraid or otherwise not comfortable with this particular routine. Do not generalize this to mean the dog doesn't love you, etc... Go back to basics here and work on making bath time more appealing - treats, toys, etc...


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## ShenzisMom (Apr 27, 2010)

Is the tub slippery? Does he have to jump in the tub? Bad experiences?


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## robk (Jun 16, 2011)

A growl is better than a bite with no warning. At least now you can decide what to do moving forward. As for the bath, I have found that many dogs are very frieghtened of slippery surfaces. Find a way to make him feel safe in the tub or find a different method of bathing him that is less scary.


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## Gilly1331 (Apr 16, 2011)

Try using a favorite toy or even maybe try feeding him his meals in the tub (without the water of course). This way he learns not only do baths come in the tub but now my food source comes from here too. This comes to mind only because we had a horse flip out of a trailer and it took several years and finally what worked was parking the trailer in the field and putting all the hay/grain inside the trailer so the horse had no choice but to choose to go in. Maybe showing him his food for a few weeks in the tub will get him to go in on his own when its bath time. 

I would also start with him in the tub before turning on the water. He sees you turn on the water...then he runs and hides and you drag him to get in..Mixing it up by having him closed in the bathroom, then climbing into the tub THEN turning the water on might help throw him off his set routine. Make bath time fun by playing and treating and praising him.

Also can you try bathing him outside at the hose or in a large kiddie pool? We ended up running hot water as well to all of our hose nozzles so we could do bath time outside when the weather was nicer. My guys love this version much better then the tub. The tub gets slippery and hard to stand sometimes tweaking their legs which may hurt and pull his muscles from slipping and sliding.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

You said "just went to the vet." Did he get a rabies or other shots? Neurotic behaviors, fearful behaviors, aggression, etc. can all be side effects of a rabies vac, as rabies is a neurological disease. Even the AKC has finally admitted that this can happen.


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## rooandtree (May 13, 2012)

you said he saw the vet and had shots..was that today or yesterday? could he be sore from the shots?


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## GSDAlphaMom (Jul 20, 2010)

Bathing once a week is way too often. Try cutting back, once a quater is plenty.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

In regards to the question about aggression a few months ago---

Rocky started a habit of barking at strangers that came into the bedroom, and circling them and having his hackles up. I became worried that he was fearful aggressive and took him to petsmart and the river every day and met with strangers to train.

It turned out that the only time he barks is when a stranger comes in the house. On walks, men and women, fat and skinny, tall and short, with or without a dog, he will not bark or growl or care. At petsmart, he can walk within millimeters of children who grab at his fur, he does not care. At the river he will take treats from everyone. But he doesn't like people in the house.

For example---today his favorite maintenance guy was outside and Rocky was in his lap, cuddling and licking his face and rubbing all over him. We start walking towards the apartment and when we reach the door, Rocky gets nervous (licking his lips and his eyes really wide). He stops playing with his friend and although he does not bark or growl or have hackles up, I can tell he is nervous and afraid of our friend being in the apartment. 

-----------------------------

Anyways, after taking a long bubble bath, I think it is my fault---I have made a routine that Rocky is scared of and he finally let me know. When he rolls on his back, I always say jokingly "come on you want to take a bath dont you?" and he will put his ears back and raise his back leg. I always thought he was doing it for "show" and he wasn't actually afraid (just trying to get out of a bath).

I put the water on after my bath and said "lets take a bath" and he did his roll over thing. Instead of approaching him, I pointed at the bathroom and said "lets go buddy" and he went straight into the bathroom and jumped in the bath.

He never used to make ANY noises until I got the foster dog...now he barks, growls (playingly), yelps, groans, moans, and makes EVERY noise you can think of. I noticed her growl at him when he approached her to take his toy (which she as scolded for and stopped doing). 

Is it possible that he is more "in tune" with his instincts after being with her? Maybe he just learned it from her? He also started kicking the grass with both legs after he poops, and he NEVER did that in two years until he watched her do it twice.

??


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## Wolfgeist (Dec 4, 2010)

Unless you are bathing him for a medical reason, I would definitely stop bathing him that often. There really is no need.

Please don't take his reaction so deeply personally. He has only one way of communicating, growling is part of that communication. He is just trying to stop you from putting him through something he hates. Just because he growled at you doesn't mean your relationship is destroyed... please don't feel so bad about this.

Take everyone else's advice about making the bath tub a fun place. Encourage him with praise and affection while he's behaving properly in the tub. Feed him in the tub. Train him to get in the bath tub on his own, praise him big time when he does so without struggle.

Don't take it to heart. He loves you, he doesn't mean what you think he means with a growl. Don't shut him out for doing what comes naturally to him.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

No, he only had kennel cough and canine influenze, and that was two weeks ago. Could those be the reason?


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

I bathe full body once a month with anti-itch shampoo in the summer because he gets so itchy, but i have to bathe his legs once a week because the apartment puts insecticide in the grass on tuesdays that makes the dogs lick, bite, and itch their legs every tuesday-friday and if I wash their legs tuesday night, they don't itch the rest of the week. (maybe it goes away by wednesday in the grass or disolves?)


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## meldleistikow (Oct 24, 2011)

Does he have allergies? Is this why he gets itchy skin? My older GSD has allergies, but bathing doesn't usually help, in fact it usually dries out her skin and makes it worse. She takes some very inexpensive allergy meds to keep her from itching and fish oil to keep her skin and coat from drying out. Luckily her allergies are only seasonal and we can back off the allergy meds in the winter. I rarely bath her. Only if she is really dirty.

I wouldn't bath him unless you really need to. Just wash the insecticides off his paws, but not in the tub. In the meantime make the bathroom and the tub a positive experience with treats and toys. 

I know it is hard, but he really doesn't mean anything by it. He is just telling you he doesn't want to take a bath. He tried to tell you before by rolling over on his back and looking unhappy, but it didn't work for him so he growled. Try to live in the moment just like he does and give him love later on when he is being a good.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

Thanks for all the advice everyone! We did some basic obedience, fetch, and now he is cuddled sleeping with his head on my chest. Wow, I was completely shocked and upset but realized that I had it coming and misinterpreted his behavior.

I will look into the fish oil and allergy medicine as well...he had fleas two months ago (even on flea medicine!) and the flea shampoo made him get even more itchy (only used it once, back then)

I think we are not going to take any baths in the bathtub for a month or two as suggested. I will clean his legs with a wet rag.

Perhaps he will get to eat breakfast and dinner in there lol. He will fetch toys out of the bathtub, but only if the water isn't running.

I recently bought the "bubble" stuff you put on the bottom of your tub to not slip because I noticed he was slipping a lot...as many of you said this may have creatd a negative issue for him.

He is smart...he knows if I am in the bath he is not taking one. While I took my bubble bath, he half sat/half laid down with his head on the edge of the bathtub to make sure the water didn't kill me


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

You can make bath time fun.
1. get some significant mats for the tub. I got two rubber door mats (with big holes in them like a grid) to take care of that issue with the late Barker Sisters (who loved baths but didn't like them with this house.) 
2. Get lots of towels. Cover everything you don't want wet. 
3.If you are shy put on a bathing suit. 
4. Get really good treats. 
5. Draw the bath water. 
6. call the dog into the bathroom (you may want to condition the "come into the bathroom" thing before attempting this by calling him in and giving him treats while in there etc.) 
7. lather the dry dog up with wet soapy water and a wash cloth or sponge. Make this like play. (remember the thing about a lot of towels?) 
6, Get into the tub & lure the dog in. Let the dog jump in and jump out - (I had one dog that really loved that side of the bath) - remember you have plenty of towels... gradually rinse the dog well, and 
7. drain the bth water & towel dry the dog (this IS a lot of fun for a dog). 
8. Boot the dog out of the bathroom. Take a shower to rinse off the dog hair. Dry yourself, get dressed and clean the bathroom. 

No pressure, no anger, no force. All trickery and evilness. All fun. A big mess. But like people said, you don't need to bath your dog that often... And remember lots of towels...


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

Thanks! I like the advice about the bathing suit lol. What is crazy is that if there is a river/lake/puddle he can't keep himself out of it. I have obviously made this into a negative situation.

I was hoping I was not "making an excuse" for his behavior by blaming myself for creating this 2 minute routine every time he needs a bath. Since this has never happened, even for shots (way worse), and after reading your posts, I truly believe I am not making an excuse by saying this was my fault.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

x0emiroxy0x said:


> What is crazy is that if there is a river/lake/puddle he can't keep himself out of it. I.


Mine is the complete opposite, she flies to the bathroom when she hears the water but won't go near a river/lake/puddle


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Veterinary dermatologists do recommend regular bathing to help any dog who is dealing with environmental allergies. Bathing once a week is frequent, but not necessarily too frequent.

What you've described in his behavior is that he is telling you that he is afraid--and then he was cornered and afraid and felt he had no option but to defend himself. It's not him playing around "trying to get out of the bath" -- it's actual fear. And yes, I agree--your routine only built up his anticipation of a negative event.

I would definitely change up your routine and see if you can help him be less fearful about upcoming bathtime. Maybe it's not even the bath that he is afraid of, but some part of your routine (picking him up?).

Also, if he had recently been vaccinated, he might have been feeling a bit unwell and may have even had a sore/achey area where the vaccines went in--this could have made him feel that much more unsure and thus like he needed even more than usual to protect himself.


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## Kaiser2012 (Mar 12, 2012)

Do you have another dog who is fine with baths? Kaiser was a squirmer/fighter at first, but when I would wash Dakota (who is an absolute GEM), he got super curious and would stand to my side and watch. He was so curious, in fact, that if I happened to move into his line of sight, he would reposition himself to my opposite side so that he could continue to watch what was going on. Now, he will stand for me to bathe him, more or less relatively still. I think he's also realized that the water feels good, and that it isn't as scary as he first thought, but I also think him watching another dog behave appropriately (along with me teaching him "hold it/wait/stay" helped too.

Another comment...I would start over and try to make bathtime exciting. Is Rocky food motivated? Maybe wait until he is super duper hungry, and then feed in the bathroom...working your way up to feeding him in the tub. Or, use a super awesome yummy treat to do the same thing. And praise praise praise. Work up to actually bathing him.

I think he might have bared teeth because the corner is his "safe zone" and you literally reached into it. You might want to try tethering him to you and just running the water (don't put him) to see how he reacts. Praise and treat when he seems relaxed.


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## stealthq (May 1, 2011)

Another option IF you have one, is to bathe him in a stand-alone shower or get one of those shower heads you connect to the tub faucet (I have no idea how well these work). My dog seems to prefer the spray from the shower head over getting water dumped on him in the bath. It probably doesn't hurt that I am in the shower getting wet with him.


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## kiya (May 3, 2010)

Lakota is the only dog I have that wouldn't get into the tub on her own. If I try to pick her up she will wiggle & worm her way out and fight me all the way. What I started doing is putting her leash on, take her into the bathroom, close the door and patiently work with her to get her front legs up and into the tub.
I definately think the growl came from you picking him up and putting him into the tub. You could even try luring him into the tub, treat and no bath. Lakota has gotten much better about getting in the tub but I still put the leash on. Once that leash is on things are a little different at least with her they are.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

x0emiroxy0x said:


> Every time I turn the bath water on, Rocky runs into the corner and lays down so I literally *have to drag him until he* *stands up*.


If it were me, I'd start here. Forget about the bath until you've worked through this issue. This is the point he gave you a warning. 

You should never, ever have to drag your dog to get him to comply to a command. 

I'd start by giving him your bath command and working through this issue before actually taking him to the bath room. When he was solid with coming to the bathroom happily, I'd add turning on the water to the equation. When he follows through (going all the way to the tub with running water) with out being stressed out, then I'd slowling incorporate bathing. Maybe a small amount of water in the tub, not washing him at all, just providing high value treats while in the tub and then calling it quits. 

Personally, I'd take one of my dogs giving me a warning very seriously. But I'd take it as a failure on my part to create a solid foundation in the area that I'm working through.


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## FlyAway (Jul 17, 2012)

When I bath my dog myself, I hose down everything but the head. Maybe you got soap in his eye or water in his ear and he's remembering that. You can start desensitizing him to the tub with cookies (or some raw meat) with out out of the room and gradually working with being in the room and letting him sit in the (dry) tub for cookies. When you do get around to adding water and soap, just do his butt. My dog happens to like a nice soapy cleaning of his back end where he tends to get poopy.


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## Bear GSD (Apr 12, 2012)

x0emiroxy0x said:


> I bathe full body once a month with anti-itch shampoo in the summer because he gets so itchy, but i have to bathe his legs once a week because the apartment puts insecticide in the grass on tuesdays that makes the dogs lick, bite, and itch their legs every tuesday-friday and if I wash their legs tuesday night, they don't itch the rest of the week. (maybe it goes away by wednesday in the grass or disolves?)


I would definitely try some of the methods that are being suggested to desensitize him to getting a bath, but I would also try to lessen his baths. It does seem like your bathing him an awful lot.
I know that you mentioned it was because of the insecticides that they are applying. I would try and keep a bucket of sudsy water and then maybe wipe down his legs before he comes in the house when you need to.
I had to do this with my last dog that was very sensitive to anything that they would apply to the lawns around my neighborhood.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

Well, Rocky just went in and out of the bathtub without the slightest fuss. I did not say any of the usual words like "bath" "do you wanna take a bath" etc. Just no fuss, pointed in the bathroom and used "up", which I never use in regards to the bath.

He did hit his head on the faucet, as you can hear me say "oops" in the video, but I rubbed his head and he got a rawhide and now he is laying happily on the wood floor in the bathroom.

Here is the video:

Rocky in the bathtub, no problem! - YouTube


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## Loneforce (Feb 12, 2012)

Woot!!! Great job!!!


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## Shaina (Apr 2, 2011)

Yaaay!


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## KentuckyGSDLover (Nov 17, 2011)

Bear GSD said:


> I would definitely try some of the methods that are being suggested to desensitize him to getting a bath, but I would also try to lessen his baths. It does seem like your bathing him an awful lot.
> I know that you mentioned it was because of the insecticides that they are applying. I would try and keep a bucket of sudsy water and then maybe wipe down his legs before he comes in the house when you need to.
> I had to do this with my last dog that was very sensitive to anything that they would apply to the lawns around my neighborhood.


I was thinking that's an awful lot of baths, too. I only give my dogs baths seasonally (or when they just get too stinky for me to stand) because they seem to need their natural oils to keep from getting too itchy. Summertime, it's baths in the baby pool! I think your idea of toweling the feet and legs may be a good idea.


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## DCluver33 (May 27, 2010)

yay!!!!! good boy Rocky!!!

I just want to point out on the itchy skin thing. it could also be the weather. I know here in California, as a groomer, I'm seeing a lot of dogs that will get hotspots or get very itchy dry skin, even those who have never had a hotspot or itchy dry skin, due to the weather going from hot to cold constantly and not staying at a steady temp. that may also be causing Rocky's itchies. Dodger has never had dry itchy skin before until this summer, Molly has never had hotspots before either and within the past four months has had 6 and now has to be permenatly in a cone until we can get prescription meds.they only get bathed every couple of months and both get fish oil. just something to think about.


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## fuzzybunny (Apr 29, 2011)

After reading this thread I went out and bought a bath mat. Jazz has always been problematic in the bath. He fights me, slips, and continually tries to jump out. Well the bath mat made a huge difference! I just finished giving him a bath and he was very cooperative. After 15 minutes he did jump out but I think he had just had enough of me and I was done anyhow. I still made him get back in the tub because I hadn't released him and I don't want him to think he can get away with doing whatever he pleases. Overall, bath time was so much easier today.


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## misterW (Jan 25, 2011)

If there is something you want your dog to do, and you get a sense the dog is scared, forcing the dog to do it is not a good choice. As irrational as it is, the dog's fear is real to the dog. And if you keep forcing the dog to do whatever it is, the dog's fear can build until it becomes a real problem, as you have seen. And it is a lot harder to force a struggling 80 lb shepherd to do something than it is to use your brain and find a way to get the dog to willingly cooperate. Seems like more work in the short run, but in the long run it pays off. 

I took weeks to gradually desensitize my girl to getting her nails dremmeled. Touching her with a dremmel that is off. Letting her sniff it. Turning it on and just holding it near her. Touching her with it, but just with the handle. Finally just touching one claw for a split second. etc. etc. All rewarded with treats. But now she'll hold her foot up while I grind down her nails, knowing a treat is on the way. 

For baths, I first got her used to simply being in the tub for a few seconds with no water. Then once that was no problem, just enough to wet her toes. A bit more and so on. Each time rewarded with treats. She learned the tub was a pretty good place for her to be. As it is, I very rarely bathe her anyway. 

Anticipating these problems in advance is much easier than trying to deal with them later. ie, easy to get a pup who hasn't formed an opinion of the tub yet to like it, than one who has learned to be terrified of it.


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