# Can't leave the dog at home alone...



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

We just got back from my aunt's house, we spent maybe 7 hours there (including transport time). We got back and two things. 1) he got out of his crate. 2) we got a note from one of our neighbours.

Problem 1) The crate door was locked on both ends. He managed to pry to crate away from its little connector things and get out through the gap. Of course, along with all the bad things he could've possibly done, I have a rabbit who lives upstairs in my room. I'm thinking that I can zip tie the crate and solve that. Definitely still worrying though. 

Problem 2) The note from my neighbour read, "_Every time you go out your dog barks constantly. Of course when you come back you have no idea what it's like". _There is no name signed with it. But I know which neighbour it is (they already don't like us). We try everything to get Bailey to settle before we leave - took him to the dog park for 30 minutes, played with him for ages, made sure he had been to the toilet, gave him one of his "kennel sticks", turn the tv on for him. We haven't left him alone (aside from short training sessions up to two hours - where we can still hear him if he barks) more than five times before, but I do understand their side. 

Anyway, my point is that the cry it out method likely isn't going to work for him. Does anyone have any tips or advice that I can take? There is also a guy in my neighbourhood who trains dogs for fun, and said he'd be interested in training Bailey and helping with his reactivity and all that. Is that worth it? Do I need to bring in a professional trainer or can it be something I can work on?

Thanks in advance, 
Malaya


----------



## 44eyes (May 17, 2021)

How much time does he spend in the crate while you are home?


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

He sleeps through the crate all night. And then naps, for at least four hours, spread across the day. Both when he chooses to go in, and when we put him in.


----------



## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Is it possible for you to somehow record Bailey when you're gone?The neighbor may be exaggerating. A half hour of barking becomes non-stop for seven hours....


----------



## 44eyes (May 17, 2021)

Our dog (same age as Bailey) used to do the same thing. He would bark and howl nonstop. Danny also slept and napped in his crate, even voluntarily, so I had no idea why he would always bark and whine like that. 

I don’t have any real advice but I can share how our pup has gotten better and what I think helped.

We recently moved so we were going in and out the house A LOT. We put Danny in the crate so we wouldn’t trip over him. Not gone for long, but leaving his sight at all was a problem. So we also would put a raw soup bone in the crate with him, it takes him a while to get through it and it distracts him. Be careful with this, we noticed Danny will resource guard the bone so when I drop it I don’t try to pick it up again unless he’s walked away and it’s done with it.

I think the association of the yummy bone in his crate + us constantly leaving but returning before he knew it, has really calmed his nerves. Now when we leave he doesn’t bark at all, but he does make a huge fuss when we get back lol.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

dogma13 said:


> Is it possible for you to somehow record Bailey when you're gone?The neighbor may be exaggerating. A half hour of barking becomes non-stop for seven hours....


It is very possible that the neighbour is exaggerating. The person I think it is is an older man, and is very grumpy (he also doesn't like my family for whatever reason). I have asked my mum if we could look into getting a camera for him, and she said she will try. So hopefully we will be able to get that sorted. When we got into the house, he was quiet, just ran down the stairs to greet us (although, yes, he did escape the crate).


----------



## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Leave your cell phone home on recording for an hour to get an idea


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

44eyes said:


> Our dog (same age as Bailey) used to do the same thing. He would bark and howl nonstop. Danny also slept and napped in his crate, even voluntarily, so I had no idea why he would always bark and whine like that.
> 
> I don’t have any real advice but I can share how our pup has gotten better and what I think helped.
> 
> ...


Thank you. I will have to try that! He does get what we call a "kennel stick", which is just a chew stick that he only gets when _we_ put him in his crate. I might also try making him a kong and freezing it before we leave. I'm just worried that the neighbours would involve the authorities over it. As it is something that they have done before (over something silly).


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

wolfy dog said:


> Leave your cell phone home on recording for an hour to get an idea


ah yes, I will do that. thank you


----------



## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

We had this issue when Agis was a puppy. He eventually got to the point that he'd bark when we left but be quiet by the time when we came home or the dog walker came, so he quieted down at some point. Then he'd be quiet at both points but apparently bark in the middle. One of our neighbours would text me regularly to tell me he was barking. 

What worked was time (going in and out a lot more, eventually he got used to it). We tried anti-anxiety supplements, anti-anxiety sprays, pheromone diffusers, chews, puzzle toys, frozen kongs to chew on - thundershirts - time is what worked. I am very careful as I work from home (edit: due to COVID, I will go back to the office for at least part of the time at some point) to make sure we still leave the boys alone for at least part of every day.

I get it's stressful though, the neighbour upstairs (two floors up) loves dogs (she also hates noise though and has tried to involve us in her campaign to get the people between us kicked out) so that helped a bit, but she said some stuff that got us stressed she'd work to have us kicked out too - stuff like 'I hope you don't have to give him up'. She is home all day doing nothing so even though the noise would happen midday, she'd be upset.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

jarn said:


> We had this issue when Agis was a puppy. He eventually got to the point that he'd bark when we left but be quiet by the time when we came home or the dog walker came, so he quieted down at some point. Then he'd be quiet at both points but apparently bark in the middle. One of our neighbours would text me regularly to tell me he was barking.
> 
> What worked was time (going in and out a lot more, eventually he got used to it). We tried anti-anxiety supplements, anti-anxiety sprays, pheromone diffusers, chews, puzzle toys, frozen kongs to chew on - thundershirts - time is what worked. I am very careful as I work from home (edit: due to COVID, I will go back to the office for at least part of the time at some point) to make sure we still leave the boys alone for at least part of every day.
> 
> I get it's stressful though, the neighbour upstairs (two floors up) loves dogs (she also hates noise though and has tried to involve us in her campaign to get the people between us kicked out) so that helped a bit, but she said some stuff that got us stressed she'd work to have us kicked out too - stuff like 'I hope you don't have to give him up'. She is home all day doing nothing so even though the noise would happen midday, she'd be upset.


Thank you. It seems that I just need to leave the house *more *often - might be time to write a letter to the neighbours on my street about what's going on, and that it should only be a short time longer. 
It is definitely stressful but I suppose just another thing we need to work through. If it is the neighbours that I think it is (we share a wall), I did make an effort to let them know that we are aware of the barking, he's still young, and we're training every minute of the day to make him a good canine citizen once he's an adult, about a month ago now.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

We had to go out to church this morning so left a quick note to the neighbours explaining that we were running out quickly, sorry about the barking, and he'll be left home more so it might be a little annoying but will get better. We recorded him while we were out. 

He barked for 10-15m after 40m of us being gone.
Then again for about 5m after an 1h 30m.
Again for about 10m at 2h 5m.

So it is quite a lot of barking. 

We did get a card from the neighbours which just said that they weren't complaining but they just thought they'd let us know, and a little story about how her mums dog, and how her mum didn't know that her dog was barking until the neighbour said. This is a much nicer card - the wife is a lot sweeter than her husband 😅


----------



## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

When I had to deal with young dogs I often dropped of a gift card or a bottle of wine for close neighbors, along with a quick note that there may be whining or barking or howling but we were crate training to make the future more peaceful. You would be amazed at how often I got offers of help. 
Sometimes communication goes a long way.


----------



## Davycc (Jun 16, 2021)

Amazon or eBay do cheap cameras, we got one for Zac early on and was great for peace of mind (you can view on your phone from anywhere.) Basic models even have alerts for movement or sound if you need that. You can also subscribe to a cloud based storage provider to store the recordings.

£25 will get you one that will do enough for what you need. and around £1.00 a month for the cloud ... paid monthly so you can cancel when no longer required.

Only thing we use it foe now is catching Zac sneaking onto the sofa when we are out.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Sabis mom said:


> When I had to deal with young dogs I often dropped of a gift card or a bottle of wine for close neighbors, along with a quick note that there may be whining or barking or howling but we were crate training to make the future more peaceful. You would be amazed at how often I got offers of help.
> Sometimes communication goes a long way.


definitely! had i had something on hand, I'd give them but I'll have to pick something up sometime soon 



Davycc said:


> Amazon or eBay do cheap cameras, we got one for Zac early on and was great for peace of mind (you can view on your phone from anywhere.) Basic models even have alerts for movement or sound if you need that. You can also subscribe to a cloud based storage provider to store the recordings.
> 
> £25 will get you one that will do enough for what you need. and around £1.00 a month for the cloud ... paid monthly so you can cancel when no longer required.
> 
> Only thing we use it foe now is catching Zac sneaking onto the sofa when we are out.


yeah, we have one for our chow but thought that because bailey was crated, we wouldn't need one. will definitely pick one up though. he's a bit of a trouble pup 😅


----------



## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

This is a common COVID issue and most knowledgeable dog owners knew it would be when people who had been home for months started heading back to work - separation anxiety, boredom, barking.

We started leaving the house regularly for just a few minutes and returning, several times a day for a few days. Up the amount of time away and number of times per day. Listen from the driveway or down the road before taking the car out.

Oh, and no excited play when returning, just calmly taking them outside for a pee, no big desal, we're home, of course we were coming home.

They are both pros (no destruction, no barking/whining, no counter surfing, no furniture climbing) even when at a strange new place like the first weeks at our cottage.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Thank you. My family has worked from home for years, and generally, we tend not to leave too much - not full-day trips at least. Maybe just a few hours spread across the week (shopping, sports, after-school stuff) and usually at least one person is home. Which is probably the issue. 

I'll definitely try leaving for just a few minutes, a few times a day. I don't think he barks immediately, as by the time we get to the car, he's quiet - probably because he thinks he'll be let out. 

@WNGD how long did it take your dogs to get to where they are?


----------



## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Baileyshuman said:


> Thank you. My family has worked from home for years, and generally, we tend not to leave too much - not full-day trips at least. Maybe just a few hours spread across the week (shopping, sports, after-school stuff) and usually at least one person is home. Which is probably the issue.
> 
> I'll definitely try leaving for just a few minutes, a few times a day. I don't think he barks immediately, as by the time we get to the car, he's quiet - probably because he thinks he'll be let out.
> 
> @WNGD how long did it take your dogs to get to where they are?


I don't think there was a how long, we always did it this way. Same applies for car rides and being left out of the crate; short introductions, no big deal and continually ramping it up until it's a normal part of potentially every day. The ramp up is dog-specific.

But my dogs have slept with the crate open at 4-5 months, no crate shortly after but limited to the bedroom and hallway. Left alone in the crate for short periods from 3-4 months on and progressively longer until freedom of the entire house.

I think a big part of it (as well as curbing excited jumping) is not to make a big deal about arriving home and we head straight out to inspect the yard/woods. Every time.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

So you have a young dog with reactivity issues and now possibly seperation anxiety? Get a trainer. 

A dog should not be barking nonstop and breaking out of crates (I assume a wire crate). So first I would get a better crate so he can't hurt himself and make sure he never, ever, has a collar left on him while in a crate. Second, I would start Crate Games from Susan Garrett which you can get online now. And get a professional trainer. it sounds like you have nerve issues with this dog which is genetic. It can be overcome to some extent but the sooner you start with professional, sound and balanced, training, the better.


----------



## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

WNGD said:


> I think a big part of it (as well as curbing excited jumping) is not to make a big deal about arriving home and we head straight out to inspect the yard/woods. Every time.


This. As well, for Agis, he doesn't get out of 'his' bedroom (there's a gate) until he sits or downs calmly and quietly. Same with the other two (master bedroom with a gate; Xerxes has a fondness for chewing computer wires - Neb's just there for company).

We were both working when Agis was younger (COVID hit around 6 months old), so he had us, his dog walker, coming and going - oddly enough, as I've been working at home due to COVID and my husband was laid off for periods off and on - he's improved so much at being left alone. But we do that every day. Even if it's just running out to the store for 10 minutes, he practices being alone. Some days we're gone for hours, but other days it's just a quick little trip.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

WNGD said:


> I don't think there was a how long, we always did it this way. Same applies for car rides and being left out of the crate; short introductions, no big deal and continually ramping it up until it's a normal part of potentially every day. The ramp up is dog-specific.
> 
> But my dogs have slept with the crate open at 4-5 months, no crate shortly after but limited to the bedroom and hallway. Left alone in the crate for short periods from 3-4 months on and progressively longer until freedom of the entire house.
> 
> I think a big part of it (as well as curbing excited jumping) is not to make a big deal about arriving home and we head straight out to inspect the yard/woods. Every time.





jarn said:


> This. As well, for Agis, he doesn't get out of 'his' bedroom (there's a gate) until he sits or downs calmly and quietly. Same with the other two (master bedroom with a gate; Xerxes has a fondness for chewing computer wires - Neb's just there for company).
> 
> We were both working when Agis was younger (COVID hit around 6 months old), so he had us, his dog walker, coming and going - oddly enough, as I've been working at home due to COVID and my husband was laid off for periods off and on - he's improved so much at being left alone. But we do that every day. Even if it's just running out to the store for 10 minutes, he practices being alone. Some days we're gone for hours, but other days it's just a quick little trip.


Thank you. Bailey is crated through the night, but does fine when he's not in the crate too - he just sleeps lol. We've also been trying not to make it a big deal when we arrive and generally is going well. He gets really excited when we come back (pawing on the crate door to be let out and a little bit of crying) but he's always put into a sit/down and wait before we open the door. He's also expected to wait while the crate door is open until I tell him to come out - which is also going good. I crated him for five minutes today - while I just stood at the front door, and he did okay, I guess. He didn't have enough time to start barking before I came back in but still had the same excited reaction. I took him into the garden, just as I would if I were gone for hours. Of course, he didn't need to go but I thought I'd get into the habit of it. I'll keep doing it and I'm sure it'll get better soon


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Jax08 said:


> So you have a young dog with reactivity issues and now possibly seperation anxiety? Get a trainer.
> 
> A dog should not be barking nonstop and breaking out of crates (I assume a wire crate). So first I would get a better crate so he can't hurt himself and make sure he never, ever, has a collar left on him while in a crate. Second, I would start Crate Games from Susan Garrett which you can get online now. And get a professional trainer. it sounds like you have nerve issues with this dog which is genetic. It can be overcome to some extent but the sooner you start with professional, sound and balanced, training, the better.


Thank you. What would be a better crate? I've only really seen wire crates or the plastic airport ones. He doesn't wear a collar in the crate, at all. We have done the Crate Games before, when he was younger but will start doing them again. 

Is this something to let the breeder know about - as he was a pretty expensive dog to have genetic problems if that is what these are. Would it still be a genetic nerve problem if his reactivity isn't fear-based? 
We have inquired to a few dog trainers this weekend, but I'm just waiting to hear back from them. Thank you for the help.


----------



## eanderson (May 17, 2021)

I had a friend tell me a story once about how his neighbor would leave their dog out in the back yard all day while they were at work. Unfortunately, my friend worked nights (police officer). He went and bought one of those anti-bark boxes (the ultrasonic ones i think) and stuck it up on the eave of his home facing directly into the neighbors back yard. Next day, a couple barks, but then nothing. Worked that quick for him. Didn't have to leave any notes, or start any issues with his neighbor...They just never knew about the little box hanging there... Dog quit barking all day. After the batteries died on the thing, the dog would bark a couple times throughout the day (probably at the mail man, or other people/animals getting walked down the sidewalk) but that was it. That was last year, and the dog learned from it. Maybe try getting a cheap one and sticking it on the wall directly across from the crate and record and see if the problem corrects itself.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

eanderson said:


> I had a friend tell me a story once about how his neighbor would leave their dog out in the back yard all day while they were at work. Unfortunately, my friend worked nights (police officer). He went and bought one of those anti-bark boxes (the ultrasonic ones i think) and stuck it up on the eave of his home facing directly into the neighbors back yard. Next day, a couple barks, but then nothing. Worked that quick for him. Didn't have to leave any notes, or start any issues with his neighbor...They just never knew about the little box hanging there... Dog quit barking all day. After the batteries died on the thing, the dog would bark a couple times throughout the day (probably at the mail man, or other people/animals getting walked down the sidewalk) but that was it. That was last year, and the dog learned from it. Maybe try getting a cheap one and sticking it on the wall directly across from the crate and record and see if the problem corrects itself.


Thank you. I'll look for one and try it out


----------



## Squidwardp (Oct 15, 2019)

I have not had a dog get out of a Ruffland/Rufftough that is properly latched. 

While we rarely crate them at home, on training days they might be crated for hours. 

Negative side, maybe... Rufflands do not seem quite as spacious as some other kennels. I put our female in a Ruffland large or X large, the latter I think.
Our male goes in a larger more generic Pet Smart type crate.


----------



## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

The neighbor may NOT be exaggerating either-- please keep that in mind. I board dogs and some of them definitely will bark for hours and hours non stop. (I screen for this and don't allow them back if they fool me on the trial day, but I've seen enough of them do it) It's obnoxious. I would hate to be the neighbor. The only thing that will really shut one up who is in that feedback loop is a good bark collar.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Squidwardp said:


> I have not had a dog get out of a Ruffland/Rufftough that is properly latched.
> 
> While we rarely crate them at home, on training days they might be crated for hours.
> 
> ...


 Do you know if they sell these in the UK or what the type of kennel is called? Thank you. x


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Thecowboysgirl said:


> The neighbor may NOT be exaggerating either-- please keep that in mind. I board dogs and some of them definitely will bark for hours and hours non stop. (I screen for this and don't allow them back if they fool me on the trial day, but I've seen enough of them do it) It's obnoxious. I would hate to be the neighbor. The only thing that will really shut one up who is in that feedback loop is a good bark collar.


definitely. I did record him, and it is a lot of barking - I thought I had mentioned it before but I might not have. I've been leaving him more often for short amounts of time many times throughout the day. But I tell the neighbours when I'm training. As of now, I'm just closing the door, leaving Bailey in the living room, and standing out the front door. At least 40 times a day. We're up to about 15 minutes now  x


----------



## Davycc (Jun 16, 2021)

Baileyshuman said:


> definitely. I did record him, and it is a lot of barking - I thought I had mentioned it before but I might not have. I've been leaving him more often for short amounts of time many times throughout the day. But I tell the neighbours when I'm training. As of now, I'm just closing the door, leaving Bailey in the living room, and standing out the front door. At least 40 times a day. We're up to about 15 minutes now  x


Small steps. Just be sure he doesn't know your out there. Go for a walk away from the house.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Thank you. I'm close enough that I can keep coming back in, and able to hear him but I don't believe he knows I'm there. It's getting pretty tiring, and I'm sure my neighbours find me pretty strange sitting in my driveway watching Netflix every day... It's for the greater good. I hope 😅


----------



## 44eyes (May 17, 2021)

I too recommend walking farther away from the house when you can. Around the block or even all the way across the street. When/if it’s safe to do so. Both my dogs can hear when my wife or I are at the end of driveway, and my mother’s dogs can even tell who came through the door before they see them—so long as Bailey knows you’re near you might get a false sense of security.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Thank you! Yeah, it's probably best that I go a bit farther now, i guess.


----------



## Squidwardp (Oct 15, 2019)

Baileyshuman said:


> Do you know if they sell these in the UK or what the type of kennel is called?


 Not sure if they sell them in the UK.

I believe they were originally called RuffTuff, then switched names to Ruffland. 

The PetMate plastic carriers with wire door from the Petsmart chainstores have also worked well for containment for us.


----------



## Squidwardp (Oct 15, 2019)

Ruffland's shipping page. . .They mention international shipping, but I would not be surprised if the rate is pretty steep. 



https://rufflandkennels.com/shipping/


----------



## Davycc (Jun 16, 2021)

As I've mentioned before I've never used a crate before so borrowed one to see how it went. I know it was bought at Pets At Home which sometimes don't get a good name but honestly it did the job for Zac.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Squidwardp said:


> Not sure if they sell them in the UK.
> 
> I believe they were originally called RuffTuff, then switched names to Ruffland.
> 
> The PetMate plastic carriers with wire door from the Petsmart chainstores have also worked well for containment for us.


Thank you. I think I'll have to find a UK equivalent for it or I can definitely get a plastic one.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Davycc said:


> As I've mentioned before I've never used a crate before so borrowed one to see how it went. I know it was bought at Pets At Home which sometimes don't get a good name but honestly it did the job for Zac.


Yeah, we have the PetsAtHome XL crate. It is pretty good, and we haven't had a problem with it until he broke out. But it's still working now, so i'm not in a massive rush to get a new one. But it doesn't hurt to keep an eye out


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

As an update, Bailey was left alone for just under nine hours yesterday, as I had to go to a funeral. He barked for seventeen minutes in total. He barked for seven minutes as soon as we left, three minutes after two hours and four minutes after seven hours. A lot better than before, and fairly tolerable, hopefully


----------



## ldmpku (Jul 5, 2021)

Baileyshuman said:


> We just got back from my aunt's house, we spent maybe 7 hours there (including transport time). We got back and two things. 1) he got out of his crate. 2) we got a note from one of our neighbours.
> 
> Problem 1) The crate door was locked on both ends. He managed to pry to crate away from its little connector things and get out through the gap. Of course, along with all the bad things he could've possibly done, I have a rabbit who lives upstairs in my room. I'm thinking that I can zip tie the crate and solve that. Definitely still worrying though.
> 
> ...


I got a similar neighbor before. When I was in an apartment before, they were reporting me for my dog wagging tail on the floor.............


----------



## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

WNGD said:


> This is a common COVID issue and most knowledgeable dog owners knew it would be when people who had been home for months started heading back to work - separation anxiety, boredom, barking.
> 
> We started leaving the house regularly for just a few minutes and returning, several times a day for a few days. Up the amount of time away and number of times per day. Listen from the driveway or down the road before taking the car out.
> 
> ...


Not just COVID dogs. I remember getting a hard scolding from Carmen when I booked 2 weeks off work for when Gus came home with me. Her exact words were “you WILL cancel those holidays so Gus learns what normal life is from day 1”.


----------



## ldmpku (Jul 5, 2021)

Saphire said:


> Not just COVID dogs. I remember getting a hard scolding from Carmen when I booked 2 weeks off work for when Gus came home with me. Her exact words were “you WILL cancel those holidays so Gus learns what normal life is from day 1”.


When I took the new pup and I worked from home, I intentionally left home with the dog alone here and there every single day. Going to the gym, dining outside, or whatever reason. Now, she is much better in the crate without me on site. Also, don't forget to teach them it is rewarding resting in the crate even you are in the same room.


----------



## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

my family have worked from home/homeschooled for nine years. I’ll be going to sixth form next year, so he will have to learn to be left alone for longer by that point, which it seems like he will be able to


----------

