# Puppy has a "crypt orchid"...neutering problem



## emt1581 (Sep 5, 2008)

I went to the vet and my 15 week pup got his last series of shots. I asked about neutering and she said that between next month and two months from now is when to do it. Then she felt under the dog and said she only found one testicle. I didn't know it, but apparently if the one doesn't drop it means it might be stuck in the abdomen...and could turn into a tumor! 

It also means $300-$500 for neutering/surgery instead of $300 which I still think is high.

Anyone have this issue? I've just never heard of it.

Thanks!

-Emt1581


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## dOg (Jan 23, 2006)

Undescended testicle....which may descend over time.
Neutering before hormones tell bbone plates to stop growing can give you a taller, lankier dog. Also male heads tend get larger, but often
look feminine when fixed too young. I'd wait, it's your choice.


<span style="color: #3366FF">Many threads here on the subject</span>


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## BlackPuppy (Mar 29, 2007)

Yes. Neither of Balto's testicles descended. I did a lot of research on it and and found that in very rare cases, they could descend very late. 18 months was the longest I've heard. I waited a year before I neutered Balto because his male behavior towards my female was really annoying the both of us. 

But there's no rush to get him neutered. From what I've read, the cancer won't happen for a long time. If you are one of those people who prefer to wait until a dog is 18-24 months to neuter, that would still be okay. However, it's more difficult to find the things on a larger dog. And my vet charged by weight due to the extra drugs it takes. 

As for cost, Balto's neuter was only $15 more because my vet calls it a spay. Maybe you can ask your vet to "spay" him instead?









Oh, since it's genetic, definitely tell your breeder (if you got him from a breeder).


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

I think the latest info is that it is best to wait until your pup is 2 years old to neuter to let him reach maturity. The hormones are important for his development and proper growth. 

Vets will encourage early neutering. My pup just turned six months, and I got a cute postcard with a cute funny poem from my vets's letting me know it is time to get the "procedure" done. I'm not planning on neutering since he is a competition dog, but I would wait for him to be older if I change my mind.

I know someone who has been quoted a price of 2000$ for the surgery - I say your vet is a good deal! 

There is a risk of testicular cancer in dogs with the retained testical, but not for a few years. The difference in risk between getting the surgery now and waiting until until he is 2 years old is negligeable.


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## Maryn (Feb 15, 2008)

I'd simply wait. Give the testicle time to descend on it's own and time for the pup to finish growing.

My first vet for the dogs hounded me every visit about scheduling the procedures. I got a printed estimate every time until I finally asked them to stop wasting their paper on me.

My current vet and I spoke about getting them fixed at Sieg's last puppy visit, and he agreed with me on waiting until 18-24 mos.

I will have an added challenge, as I have a male/female combo...but I'm always home and have plenty of room to keep them separate when she's in season until the day comes.

Most vets and animal proponents push early speutering, with the pet overpopulation problem I can understand why. But if you are able to keep your dog from procreating, I definitely think it's best to wait.


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

Does anyone have links to any studies showing exactly what the risk is for retained testicles and when it becomes more dangerous? I just tried to do a search but the only promising article required a subscription I don't have. Every time this question comes up I see a lot of people saying it's safe to wait, which is great if it's true, but if it's not then that could be dangerous advice. 

I did find that retained testicles are at elevated risk of torsion, as well as cancer, so that's another concern. 

eta - I am asking this purely from a medical perspective, nothing to do with population control.


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## Maryn (Feb 15, 2008)

Well, I am seeing that Cryptorchidism is usually diagnosed if the testicle hasn't descended by 24 weeks.

I also see that some suggest neutering by sexual maturity (6-9 mos) if it hasn't dropped. 

But...other vets reject the idea that leaving it causes cancer and some dogs have lived full lives cancer free with only one having dropped.

Has your vet done an ultrasound or blood test for testosterone levels? The pup could have Monorchidism as well, in which only one testicle developed. Without testing, the vet isn't really going to know what the situation is. A lingering testicle, one that really hasn't moved from it's original position (crypto), or the absence of a 2nd testicle totally.

Bear in mind, if it doesn't descend at all it may increase the risk of cancer, it does not guarantee it.


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

no, there are no guarantees either way - either with leaving the testicle until 2 yrs or neutering at 6 months, we've just got to make the best decisions we can with the info. 

But all I'm finding online is a lot of opinion and conventional wisdom. I want the science!







Anyone find any clinical studies that looked at the risk over time? 

Whether we tell someone it's safe to wait or we tell them to neuter early, we're giving them medical advice with potentially serious consequences. I'm just wanting to have the best science possible backing either of those recommendations. If we say that early neuter is "safe" or that waiting until 2 years with an undescended testicle is a "negligible" risk, what are we basing that on?


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## dOg (Jan 23, 2006)

I got some science for ya!









<span style="color: #3366FF">Weird Science!</span> 

<span style="color: #3333FF">This guy is laughing all the way to the bank!</span> 

I posted this on the green board about a year ago, and one of the replies was from someone who witnessed a dog get DQ'd from a show after the judge found 3 balls where only 2 should be! The one that hadn't descended did, post surgery.

Ya just can't make this stuff up!


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## BlackPuppy (Mar 29, 2007)

Maybe you can find the article that this person was referring to.

"Anyone see the article by Steve Dean in Dog World about undescended testicles & surgery risks etc? Quite an interesting read as it refers to an article in the Veterinary Record which suggests that the risk of a dog developing cancer in an undescended testicle is around the same as the risk involved in the dog going through surgery to have the undescended testicle removed. I have come across a number of unilateral cryptorchids which were not operated on but went on to live normal, uneventful lives, so whilst the risk of cancer is there it's not probably as great as some vets imply."


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

I can find their reference on the forum and a lot of other articles by Steve Dean, but nothing comparing surgery risk to cancer risk with a cryptorchid dog. If anyone can find the issue number or date, that would be much appreciated.


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## emt1581 (Sep 5, 2008)

So far what's I've seen in this thread is that 1) There is NO rush to decide what to do. 2) I have between 3 more months and a year and a half to decide. 3) It definitely would be adviseable to REMOVE the testicles as opposed to just leave the dog with one testicle stuck in the lower abdomen.

I'm curious if this is currently causing the dog any pain or discomfort? Is there any lasting effects this can have on the dog in terms of health (ex. frequent urination), temperment change, etc.?

Thanks!!

-Emt1581


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## Ryder&SophieSue (Nov 25, 2008)

i had my ryder neutered at 6 months and he had a descended testicle. I bought ryder solely for campionship and wanted this done as soon as i could, they had to go in after them and it cost me $100 more. So total about $200.00. 

Now i am having my Ace done in two weeks and he is only 4 months old, but we are having some unruley humping issues with him that i am hoping this will help out with. I have bred dachshunds for 4 years and never had one hump but Ace humps anything that passes under him. 

As for temperment change i have no idea, ryder is as sweet now as the day i brought him home at 6 weeks, 
Now Ace is a different story he is alot more playful, doesn't sit still long. Barks in the house at the other dogs ( in play ). He is just a thirty pound ham. We love him though.


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