# Liver question.



## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Ringer had his physical yesterday. He passed his bloodtests EXCEPT his iron is low and he needs to start eating liver. I HATE liver. I HATE to look at it. I HATE to touch it. I HATE to smell it. I HATE to be around it. I just HATE it. Do you all think I could give him the freeze dried beef liver in lieu of fresh cooked chicken livers?

He was really having a bad day yesterday. Needed help waking into the vets and out. She lent me a cart for him if I can figure out how to use it. When he got home he couldn't get up the ramp without a lot of help. Funny, he slept thru the night without moving. He woke up when I got up a few times but was asleep again seconds after I got back. I was really worried about this AM - but GOOD NEWS - he got up and walked outside under his own power!!!

I hate Pred yet I know it has a place in medical practice. And sadly the time has come where the Medacam is no longer working and it's time to start him on Pred. I'm to stop the Medacam for five days and then start the Pred on Saturday. I hate doing it but it's better than allowing him to continue like he has been going. Keep your fingers crossed that it works for him.


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## VALIUM (Nov 15, 2007)

Why do u hate this much.????


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## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

If the point is to get as much iron out of the food as possible I would choose the food with the most iron. You can look at the USDA database for raw and cooked foods and perhaps you can get an analysis on a commercial freeze dried product to compare. 

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

It says:

Chicken, liver, all classes, cooked, simmered= 3.26mg per 28 grams
Beef, variety meats and by-products, liver, cooked, braised= 1.83mg per 28 grams

Based on the above I would venture to say cooked chicken livers would be a better source of iron over the beef.

Could you cook a big batch, freeze portions and feed them frozen? This way you would only have to smell it occasionally. . .


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## Skye'sMom (Jul 11, 2004)

Gayle, we all have our limits and it sounds like the look, feel and smell of liver is your stopper.









Do you have a friend who would be willing to cook liver in large batches for you in exchange for something you could do for them? 

Alternately, maybe someone here can advise a good iron supplement that would do the trick.

Good luck to you.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

I seem to remember giving Bruno canned fish stuff when he was anemic when I got him? Like sardines, Tuna (now realize that was probably a little mercury rich), salmon? And I think I gave him a vitamin with extra iron? It was 5 years ago and I am having a hard time remembering why I did the fish! 

PS-Won't be around much this week due to a laptop being "hospitalized" and a desktop slower than...the Democratic primary process.







I hope he keeps getting better.


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## djpohn (Jun 27, 2003)

We used lixotinic for the horses and you can use it for dogs and cats as well. this may be goo for you. Also if you are going back on pred I would suggest adding a supplement to protect his liver function - I personally like DMG (I use the GLuta-DMG), milk thistle, or SAM E all support liver function.


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## Ewilliams (Oct 17, 2007)

Gayle- I am sorry to hear this. Bonnie had a great idea. If I was closer I would do it for you and maybe you could dust my living room or something that I truly hate! 

I hate livers, too, but could cook them if I needed to. I do cook turkey liver, heart and gizzards at Thanksgiving. My little boy actually likes them. Eww. What is a gizzard anyway? My aversion is not as strong as yours, I guess. 

Good luck with everything.


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

If the smell of boiled chicken livers is upsetting, you can broil them. I think they actually smell pretty good.


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

The dehydrated stuff works in a pinch. Canz sells lamb liver too, and their stuff is more wholesome than the tub o' beef liver that you can get at big box stores. I do use that to supplement my dog's "real" liver intake. 

Here's what I do though. I buy chicken liver in the little containers. (Beef liver is so much worse than chicken liver.







). Start a pot of boiling water. Empty the containers into the water (you never even have to touch it!) and boil. You don't have to boil it too long. Just til the meat turns pasty brown. 

Then, spoon the meat out and stick into zip loc containers or something similar. Once the water/broth is cooled, let Mr. Ring-Dinger drink the water too. 

Then, once the cooked liver has cooled, you can cut it into pieces. If it isn't cool, it will be really crumbly, so make sure it's cool.

You do know to feed teeny tiny pieces at a time, right? Or you'll have a dog with really nasty blobby runny poop. 

Here is a website that gives you Iron-rich foods that aren't liver. 
http://www.whfoods.org/genpage.php?tname=nutrient&dbid=70

I sprinke thyme, parsley, and basil on all my dogs' meat. I cook up pork chops with cinnamon. I make a veggie stew out of mustard greens, turnip greens, kale, chard, Brussels sprouts, and romaine. (If you steam these, then stir in cooked sweet potato -- also high in iron -- or pumpkin -- add honey if he has a sweet tooth, he'll likely eat it). In other words, there are ways to supplement iron. Plant-based vitamins are harder for dogs' bodies to absorb, but it can be done -- at least so that you don't have to feed _ as much _ liver. 

You'll note that shrimp and venison (if you can afford it) are just as good sources of liver as calf liver.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Thanks for all the links and suggestions. I ordered some freeze dried liver and am contacting the manufacturer to see how many pieces will equal the iron content of one chicken liver.

It's funny that I have a liver phobia. When I was small I loved liver but somehow developed an irrational dislike for anything dealing with the meat. I can recall as a little girl my big Thanksgiving Day treat was when my Mom let me have the liver and heart.

And yes,







I know giving the Hooligans too much liver will definitely result in the world's worst case of diarrhea.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: VALIUMWhy do u hate this much.????


The Pred? IMHO Pred can be a lifesaver, in fact when Ringer was 3 years old he had to have his immune system shut down then "kick started"by giving him massive doses of Pred to try to correct his Lupus Mediated Polyarthritis ... it worked. I've had other dogs on longterm courses of Pred that would have died without it. In fact, my mother took Pred for many years to give her a quality life and to stay alive (she had asthma and emphysema).

BUT long term use of Pred has a lot of serious side effects which you can't take lightly and IMHO should only be used as a drug of last resort. 
http://ibdcrohns.about.com/cs/prescriptiondrugs/p/medprednisone.htm


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

Oh, Gayle, I hate pred too. When the vet suggests prednisone, I always say "no. What else do you have?" Then, if there's nothing else, or if we've exhausted all other options, I'll THINK about it. I think I've had one or two shots given to one dog in all my years. 

There's often a better or at least, equally good answer if we just think hard and creatively. Often, vets jump to pred first. Yes, Mr. Ringer might need it eventually, but til then...I'm with you.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: 3K9Mom...
> Yes, Mr. Ringer might need it eventually, but til then...I'm with you.


Sadly the time has come. He's being taken off his Metacam for five days (today is day two), and he'll start Pred on Saturday. I'm praying it will give him more time.


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## Qyn (Jan 28, 2005)

I, too, hope it makes him feel much better. 

In some of the supermarkets here they have liver (beef or lamb) already chopped up in a kind of vaccuum pack. If that is available, or if your butcher would do it for you, you could drop the whole package into gently simmering water and simmer until it is all cooked - squeezing the pack to ensure it is heated all the way through. When suitably cooked, it could re repackaged by slitting the pack and squeezing into smaller servings then freeze and defrost as required ..... without ever having to touch it and the smell would be minimal. Just another idea anyway.





























to you and Ringer.


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: Arycrest
> 
> 
> > Originally Posted By: 3K9Mom...
> ...


Beagle hugs







and GSD slurpy kisses







to Ringer. 
And he's in my prayers as well. Not that he ever left them. 

And all of us send our love to the Whole Hooligan Bunch.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

The Canine Plus multivitamins by vetriscience are pretty high in iron.


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