# Breeders overstating red flag or good sign?



## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

If breeders overstate is that a red flag? For ex, asking ppl their perspectives or seem to be looking for references etc. It doesn't always seem to be the case though if it is. Why don't people like overstatements? They can be true or false depends though I think.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

How can an overstatement be true? By definition it is a false statement due to inflation of facts.

David Winners


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Can you give some examples? I have no idea what this means.


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## vomlittlehaus (Aug 24, 2010)

I am not quite sure I understand the question either.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Oh, good, glad I am not alone.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

i think what they mean is for example if a breeder says a puppy fearless and likes cats, then you get it home and its scarred of everything and hates your cat. behaviors change in a new environment so maybe it was fearless while living with the breeder and liked their cat. i don't really thing that's a red flag. you can't tell at 6 weeks how a dogs personality is going to be and stay.

that's the only thing i can think of. what else can they really overstate? if the color or size is other than the breeder stated, that's a flat out lie.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

maybe a breeder tells people all the puppies they sell grow real big and you check with some other people that used that breeder and their dogs never grew past 50lbs. that could be an overstatement and would be a red flag for me.


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

I fully understand this thread.....or is that an overstatement?


SuperG


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## Sarah~ (Apr 30, 2012)

Lobobear44 said:


> For ex, asking ppl their perspectives or seem to be looking for references etc.


Is it possible you are talking about testimonials? Like asking for a good review for their website? 

I'm lost too...


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Sarah~ said:


> Is it possible you are talking about testimonials? Like asking for a good review for their website?
> 
> I'm lost too...


Yes, the breeder is constantly looking for good reviews. Wants the desire to feel amazing at what they do.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

Reputable breeders rely on facts. Titles, show ratings, actual work, and other accomplishments speak for themselves. I would be wary of any breeder who uses a lot of superlatives and very few facts. For example, if a breeder uses words like "Fantastic", "excellent", "ultimate", "superior", etc. but the dogs have no titles and no accomplishments, I would steer clear.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Lobobear44 said:


> Yes, the breeder is constantly looking for good reviews. Wants the desire to feel amazing at what they do.


If you know the breeder personally you might come to that conclusion, but if you do not it would be unfair to psychoanalyze them. I would like to see a breeder list accomplishments of their dogs and of their dog's offspring. It gives me an idea of the focus of their breeding program.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Freestep said:


> Reputable breeders rely on facts. Titles, show ratings, actual work, and other accomplishments speak for themselves. I would be wary of any breeder who uses a lot of superlatives and very few facts. For example, if a breeder uses words like "Fantastic", "excellent", "ultimate", "superior", etc. but the dogs have no titles and no accomplishments, I would steer clear.


I was trying to think of a response, but this is great. I'm more interested in what is already known about the breeding dogs and their lineage than what a breeder might wager to guess about their puppies. I buy a puppy because I can make some pretty good assumptions about that puppy based on things that are already known about the parents, not based on how the breeder tries to sell me said puppy. Also I don't care what people are training to do or going to do with their dog, let me see what you've actually done. That's not to say I'm against breeding dogs without titles or don't respect people who are still in the process of training and titling, but the more someone tries to market a dog based on fancy describing words and their own infatuation with their dog, the more red-flaggy it becomes. I'd rather have a breeder tell me "this dog has hips and elbows OFA'd and will hopefully trial for IPO1 in June" than go on and on and on about how awesome the dog is with nothing to really show for it.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Im not getting you. A over statement to me would be like wearing a cocktail dress to a pta meeting. 

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## vomlittlehaus (Aug 24, 2010)

I now understand what you where asking. So a breeder that tries to give you a resume of accomplishments (if any) to make themselves appear in a possitive light in your eyes. If they are stating facts, then to a degree they are just giving information already available by research. If they are trying to make themselves look good because they really have nothing to show, then that would be a 'red flag'.


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## Smithie86 (Jan 9, 2001)

And make sure your can verify those accomplishments via real documentation. Not a statement, not an inference. Real, on the field.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Well, it is sales. 

A good salesman can sell. They do not sell by minimizing their product. A lot of people could care less what a dog can do in a show or "on the field." They are looking for a pet, and they tell you that right out of the box. Spending the next ten minutes discussing your exploits on the field with your dog is not only not going to impress, but it shows that you are not listening to your potential customer.

Personally, I would suggest looking for a breeder that isn't monopolizing the conversation talking up their dogs. When asked they should be able to cite some of their dogs' accomplishments and or the dogs' accomplishments/positives that they have produced, but what you should look for is someone that is listening. 

What are they listening for? 

They are listening, and encouraging you to tell them about yourself, your dogs, your experience, your needs and wants with respect to a dog. They are listening for their own set of flags. They are listening, in order to make the right choice for one of their dogs. And that choice may be not to sell to you at all. 

A person who is willing to take the time to listen to you, may be better at listening to problems down the line, hearing the whole of the situation, and making good recommendations.


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

misslesleedavis1 said:


> Im not getting you. A over statement to me would be like wearing a cocktail dress to a pta meeting.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App



Not if you wore tennis shoes or hiking boots with the cocktail dress.

SuperG


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I think one can go overboard, talking about their many titles and show ratings, etc. When the person on the other end is not hearing or comprehending. 

I don't think it has to be untrue to be an over-statement. I mean, I can start off with how 3 of the seven dogs in my first litter went to families with babies, and 4 out of 8 in the second litter went to families with babies and then in my forth litter 6 out of 10 went to families with babies, and in my... could be perfectly true, but it could also be an over-statement -- though I am not sure of what that really implies. 

If the potential customer wanted to know if the puppies are good with children, you could just say that several of my dogs' are in homes with babies and small children, and are doing fine. Going on and on could be indicative of being weak in an area and trying to over-compensate. 

A breeder should answer your questions. They all have different personalities and some will talk about those things that they feel comfortable, or have special interest in. So you kind of have to listen and gauge their knowledge. And if the breeder is getting you to talk, listen to what you are saying. Listen to the questions they are asking. Listen to what is important to them.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

jocoyn said:


> If you know the breeder personally you might come to that conclusion, but if you do not it would be unfair to psychoanalyze them. I would like to see a breeder list accomplishments of their dogs and of their dog's offspring. It gives me an idea of the focus of their breeding program.


Don't get the wrong idea not getting a new dog any time soon. I'm waiting until after college. However, it doesn't hurt to be educated on and by breeders. I am learning every time whether they are red flags or responsible breeders. There are some breeders that seem suspicious such as someone who has odd reviews. For example, ones that seem amazing from 2 years ago on Google + cannot click for replies, or the icons at the top. All, but one say google user only. Yelp also seems odd too as if related to Google +.


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

The real good breeders are unlikely to have google+ reviews. The majority of people that know the breed and are working dogs, aren't posting reviews of breeders either. Many times, the dogs, titles, show rankings, speak for themselves. The only way to find those out is to visit clubs, watch training sessions, make friends with people that know what they're talking about and what makes for a proper GSD.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

This ***** guy sounds like an overstatement person. All breeders will say they are the best and differences. Yet from I here this ***** guy is a well known breeder crook. There are other breeders I'm suspicious about. I already posted them on my last posts, nobody commented tho.


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## Sarah~ (Apr 30, 2012)

Lobobear44 said:


> This ***** sounds like an overstatement person. All breeders will say they are the best and differences. Yet from I here this *****uy is a well known breeder crook. There are other breeders I'm suspicious about. I already posted them on my last posts, nobody commented tho.


I would be careful calling breeders crooks just from things that you hear, if you haven't dealt with them personally.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Sarah~ said:


> I would be careful calling breeders crooks just from things that you hear, if you haven't dealt with them personally.


^^This. Honestly Lobobear, if I were a breeder and I saw ANY of your posts on breeders, I would say "no thanks" because of the constant looking for issues and posting about them. I would be scared that if your dog had an issue, either genetic or of your own making, the whole world would hear about it.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

martemchik said:


> The real good breeders are unlikely to have google+ reviews. The majority of people that know the breed and are working dogs, aren't posting reviews of breeders either. Many times, the dogs, titles, show rankings, speak for themselves. The only way to find those out is to visit clubs, watch training sessions, make friends with people that know what they're talking about and what makes for a proper GSD.


^^^^This


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

Also agree..Now YOUR overstating, calling bashing this breeder since you have no first hand knowledge of it..

I think you are overstating, alot about yourself as well..


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## alexg (Mar 22, 2013)

jocoyn said:


> If you know the breeder personally you might come to that conclusion, but if you do not it would be unfair to psychoanalyze them. I would like to see a breeder list accomplishments of their dogs and of their dog's offspring. It gives me an idea of the focus of their breeding program.


But... but, is it OK to humanize them? Yes, I am talking about the breeders, these soulless creatures who sell little adorable puppies.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

an overstatement to me would be the numerous web sites where you see "we breed the best dogs in the world " "they are capable of being police, guide , sar, therapy" on and on - without any evidence to base such a claim. Essentially what they are doing is riding on the coat tails of the "legend" of the dog. 

Then again every person that you meet at the park , or during casual conversation HAS such a doggy at home.


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

carmspack said:


> an overstatement to me would be the numerous web sites where you see "we breed the best dogs in the world " "they are capable of being police, guide , sar, therapy" on and on - without any evidence to base such a claim. Essentially what they are doing is riding on the coat tails of the "legend" of the dog.
> 
> Then again every person that you meet at the park , or during casual conversation HAS such a doggy at home.



Valid point...claimed potential versus real world results.

Which reminds me...a bit of a parallel...I have always been amused but never impressed by the line I hear all too often...." I could do it IF I wanted to"...

SuperG


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

SuperG said:


> Valid point...claimed potential versus real world results.
> 
> Which reminds me...a bit of a parallel...I have always been amused but never impressed by the line I hear all too often...." I could do it IF I wanted to"...
> 
> SuperG


Thats code for 
"I dont want to do it" like "try" is basically "no effort" 


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## asja (Mar 22, 2011)

Well, I could breed a dog if I wanted to, but I don't, and never will.


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