# Is it ME or the WIFE or the DOG???



## Ronin864 (Dec 3, 2012)

Okay, first some info on our pup Jango. He is 9.5 months old and still intact. He is an WGSL. We got him when he was 8 weeks old. We have taken him to puppy pre-school, puppy kindergarten, and to basic obedience class. We just started a more advance OB class with a good trainer that has 2 WLGSD that she has titled in IPO. (she is the one that suggested that we wait on the bite work and focus on OB and tracking until he gets older:from a previous post) She is also the one that trained my wife and Jango in the basic OB class. I have two sons, 6 and 10 which he loves.

He is a wonderful dog, everything I had hoped for. He is friendly to other dogs, (strange and familiar), he ignores dogs that are barking at him when we go for walks, he is well behaved with strangers on the street, at parks, and when our house is filled with people. On the 4th of July I wanted to see how he would react to the loud noises. We live near a big high school and they have a big fireworks show. We can view them in front of our house. We live in a cul de sac and all the neighbors were out front watching the show, so we dared to venture out. To my surprise he did amazing. I walked him around to meet everyone (mostly strangers) he passed out kisses and sniffs. Everyone was commenting on how well he was handling the noise and how it did not phase him. We take him to all the stores with us that allow dogs. He lets people come up to him and pet him. 

The issue that we are having is when he is with my wife, without me. Sometimes...only sometimes he get either fearful or protective. (most likely fearful due to his age) There has been 3 incidents that has me worried. 

1. My wife and kids were at home (I was at work) and my son had a friend come over to our house. When the friend came over and rung the door bell, Jango does his thing to let us know when someone is here, barking and going to the door. What we do is tell him to sit and be quite. We don't open the door until he does. If he gets up then we close the door and tell him to sit again. the door doesn't open all the way until he listens. When he sits and stops barking I then open the door he will sniff them and then go back to doing whatever he was doing. Anyways when it is just him and my wife at home he will bark at the kid when the boy would get up or move suddenly. So my wife had the boys and Jango go out in the backyard and play for a bit. Jango was loving it, having fun playing with my son and his friend. But when they went back inside a few minutes later Jango started barking at the kid again. So my wife put Jango back outside. One other thing I what to mention is that this kids mom is the one that comes over during the day when we are at wok and lets Jango out and plays with him. After this happened she brought her son over to let Jango out and he did not once show aggression towards the boy.

2. This one is not a big issue with me, because it keeps my wife safe. My wife was at a park with Jango playing ball and this homeless guy walks up to my wife and Jango was having none of that. Hackles up and barking. The guy wanted to comment on how stunning Jango was. My wife was able to control Jango and the guy went on his way.

3. This one was interesting. My wife doesn't have the control over Jango that I do so she signed up for the basic OB class that I mentioned above. (Cuddos on her part for trying) She would be the only one to attend with Jango to this class. The first day of training was your typical OB class. The trainer had everyone in a big circle on a big field. She was coming up to everybody one by one to sign in, and when she approached my wife, Jango was barking and hackles up. The trainer said what any trainer would of, that we need to get better control of him before he bites some one. She immediately saw him as an aggressive dog. (Not true ) i hope. We told her how he normally behaves 
and that this had only happened a couple of other times with my wife. So the next training session she brought one of her friends that also has a lot of experience with GSDs to see what Jango would do. Well, he absolutely love her. She walked up to my wife and Jango and his tail was wagging and he was giving lots of kisses. The trainer came up next and he was happy to see her to. (weird)

When I'm around I see none of the behaviors. He is MY dog, he has bonded with me the most. I do play with him, train him, feed him the most. I do have my wife and kids feed him, we all take turns. My wife does do some training and she takes him to the park all the time when I'm at work. And so, is it me, my wife or the dog, or all of the above???

I hope all this makes sense and hope someone can give some advise on what we should try. Sorry it was so long


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Sounds like the connection is your wife and he is protecting her? So I'm going with it's your wife and the dog.


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## Ronin864 (Dec 3, 2012)

Yeah, I was leaning more towards the wife mostly and the dog. Just didn't want to point any fingers in case she reads this... Other wise I'd have a new problem


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

LOL What does your breeder say? What are his parents like?


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## Ronin864 (Dec 3, 2012)

Haven't asked the breeder yet. I will the next time we meet. She usually has us meet on the weekends every few months, we will see here this weekend. Its pretty cool, we get to see how his bros and sisters are doing. I asked the trainer and she said basically what you said. Should I have my wife do some of the more advanced training? Like... she will go one week and I'll go the next? We will try whatever it takes.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I'm not sure it's about the training. I think it's more about her taking charge of a situation when with him. I think he views his job with her as to protect her. Discuss this with your breeder and trainer.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

It sounds like the dog trusts your judgment and relies on you. When you are absent he seems insecure and shows these fear related behaviors because he doesn't get the leadership from your wife (?).


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## Ronin864 (Dec 3, 2012)

So does him relying on me for leadership and judgement a good thing or a bad thing? It seems to be a good thing but when i'm absent he doesn't get that. And that is a bad thing, right? I want him to be confident even when I'm not there. Would you think my wife needs more training on how to be a good leader? Is there something my wife can do with him so he will trust in her to protect him. (i.e. playing tug, that would be something to see :wild:) She really isn't a dog person. Could he be feeding off of her own insecurities when I'm not there to control the dog? When Jango barked at the trainer, my wife admitted to being nervous on the first day of training. Maybe with the kids around she didn't feel confident enough with herself in controlling the situation. So Jango took charge.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

wolfy dog said:


> It sounds like the dog trusts your judgment and relies on you. When you are absent he seems insecure and shows these fear related behaviors because he doesn't get the leadership from your wife (?).


BINGO! 

Also at nine months, he is going through some adolescent/puberty thing, enough to make ordinary things confusing to him. His hormones and his brain are developing at different rates, so he is over-reacting to normal stuff. 

At core he seems like a well-balanced, sane, friendly dog with good nerve strenght. I wouldn't put too much stock into these incidents. I think it is great that your wife is getting more involved in his training - the more they work together, the more they'll mesh together.


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## Ronin864 (Dec 3, 2012)

thanks everyone for your insights,

This is also what our trainer said:


> Also at nine months, he is going through some adolescent/puberty thing, enough to make ordinary things confusing to him. His hormones and his brain are developing at different rates, so he is over-reacting to normal stuff. @Castlemaid


Yeah I thought it was pretty cool my wife did that too. good girl


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

double bingo


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Ronin864 said:


> 1. So does him relying on me for leadership and judgement a good thing or a bad thing? It seems to be a good thing but when i'm absent he doesn't get that. A good thing.
> 2. Would you think my wife needs more training on how to be a good leader? Yes
> 3. She really isn't a dog person. Then don't put her in charge of him
> 4. Could he be feeding off of her own insecurities when I'm not there to control the dog? Yes
> 5. When Jango barked at the trainer, my wife admitted to being nervous on the first day of training. Makes sense now right?


You nailed it with these details. In my family I am the only one who is in charge of the dogs and I haven't put the others in charge of WD unless I knew for sure that there weren't any unexpected circumstances. Of course they played and interacted with him because he was well loved but not in charge of him.
WD was extremely stable and I wasn't going to mess that up by letting others, who were not into dogs as much as I am, handle him outside my presence.
I would let them play and handle the others who were not such a liability (old sight hounds). If he had lived out his entire life I would have given them some slack when he would have been 4 years old as long as he would still be sound. But unfortunately, you may know the story.


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## Ronin864 (Dec 3, 2012)

Wolfie Dog, Thanks for being so thorough in responding to my questions. Much appreciated. And your advise is sound and makes perfect sense. He is my dog and my responsibility and he is not a labardoodle. (nothing against labardoddle, that's what my wife wanted, dodged that bullet )

 I am familiar with your story, I actually just found out today. I am so so sorry for your loss. I did shed a tear and my thoughts are with you.


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## Jarkko (Feb 7, 2013)

You said he's working line? I don't thing some reactions you described (some strange dude approaching etc.) are anything but perfectly normal. My dog (10 month intact male) is super reactive, and I actually like it that way. Of course he will calm down after he has seen that there's nothing to worry about, that I'll handle things. But I don't expect him to be shy when he sees something he has never seen before, I expect reactions. This is GSD, not a golden retriever!

What I've noticed is that my dog is very reactive indoors, because he cannot see or hear properly what's outside. So he starts to bark about 100 times a day . I think it's normal and it used to ~1000 times a day, so it is getting much better, lol. Just stay calm!


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Jarkko said:


> You said he's working line? I don't thing some reactions you described (some strange dude approaching etc.) are anything but perfectly normal. My dog (10 month intact male) is super reactive, and I actually like it that way. Of course he will calm down after he has seen that there's nothing to worry about, that I'll handle things. But I don't expect him to be shy when he sees something he has never seen before, I expect reactions. This is GSD, not a golden retriever!
> 
> What I've noticed is that my dog is very reactive indoors, because he cannot see or hear properly what's outside. So he starts to bark about 100 times a day . I think it's normal and it used to ~1000 times a day, so it is getting much better, lol. Just stay calm!


I think he said he is WGSL, West German Show line? 

I really think the dog needs to be able to be handled by every responsible person, which would include older kids and any adults that live there. Because the door bell rings, and you really don't want to have to crate the dog if the wife is home alone. 

So, I think it is good she is taking him to classes. It may be good if she reads up on NILIF, and starts handling the feeding and the goodies for the dog. It sounds like he is cool with your leadership, but is uncertain with the wife's. Maybe maturity will be enough to get him where he needs to be, but it is a terrible risk to just hope that. Better to do some leadership modification, so he can be more relaxed regardless to your whereabouts.


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## Nikkia (Jul 27, 2008)

I will tell you from experience that it is probably your wife. Nikkia does the same thing with my Mom. When the leash is in my hands Nikkia is fine, When I open the door she is fine, etc... But when the leash is in my Mom's hands she becomes very protective. She is fine when my brother's or sister hold her leash sometimes she reacts but it's usually only to the downright scary people. And like you said I don't mind when she reacts to them. They can just stay away.

German Shepherds are very intelligent dogs and they are very in tuned with their owners. Some of trainers would describe this as your dog responding to your energies. Some people think this is a weird concept but scientifically I think it has basis. Although it's probably not about tiny energy waves being read by your dog our body language and pheromones can change quickly depending on how we are feeling and our dogs specialized traits are likely to allow them to pick up on these signals. 

In terms of leadership our dogs are looking for strong leaders if you are giving off signals telling him that you are in a strong calm authoritative state he will happily let you fill that role. But because of the German Shepherds naturally protective instinct he is ready to step up and take that role of leader and protector when he feels you are in a weakened state. Whether it be because you are scared, anxious, injured, sick or even frustrated. My Mom and I both believe that Nikkia acts this way with her because she has struggled with an anxiety disorder. It seems that the days she feels most anxious coordinate with the days that Nikkia feels she needs to be the most protective with her. This is also why when I am sick and my body is weak I choose to leave her home or put her away when people come to visit because she always becomes more protective.

Maybe this is what is happening with your wife. Did she feel nervous when that homeless guy walked up to her? A scary dude walked up to me to ask for money one time and I felt pretty nervous about it resulting in Nikkia hackling up and warning him that he should move on. Was she nervous during dog class? I know sometimes the first day of school, whether its for your kids or animals can be nerve racking. And her feelings may have caused him to react.

As women we are unfortunately naturally more emotional and our pheromones and scents fluctuate far more, this can be confusing to our dogs. I also used to struggle with an anxiety disorder but living with Nikkia has taught me to keep a check on my emotions and be sure that I am portraying myself in a clam, confident manner when I am around her. When I do she is the sweetest most obedient dog but when I'm not she'll push my buttons and show those more protective qualities. 

Maybe over the next little while have her stop and think about how she is feeling at the times when he has these reactions. And over time try to make sure she is always acting in a calm confident manner when handling him. Even if it is hard at first focusing on body language will help immensely as this TED Talk shows changing you body language can actually change your whole physiological response. 




You should also always be present while she is handling him until he stops having these reactions so that he does not become habitually like this with her. If you are not around he needs to be in his crate or run or where ever it is that he is contained. When I train my dogs they are in their crate, by me or I am right there while the rest of my family members are handling/playing with them to ensure that things are kept consistent until he is fully trained.

He is also still a puppy and most dogs go through this weird stage in puppyhood (up until about 2yrs of age) which is comparable to teenagers in the sense that one day they'll like someone, and another they won't, and then all of a sudden they'll like them again. The important thing is that in this stage you correct him when he acts aggressively towards people (unless their scary people then I don't usually correct), ignore him when he is fearful (so as not to re-enforce) and ALWAYS reward him only for acting in confident, calm, friendly and stable manner to help guide him into a confident adult. 

Also if he ever growls or barks at children give him a harsh correction. By harsh correction I don't mean be brutal but for some people it comes off that way. Just think of it like if your kid did something hazardous, you would not yell and scream and force them into submission but you would make sure that they understood that this is serious and should NEVER be done. With that said never allow your dog to show aggression towards children as there is no absolutely reason for him to (you don't need to be protected from a child). Also to protect him and the children ALWAYS make them ask to pet him, even if he is nice. Whether you are at the park or even in your home do not be afraid to say "Excuse me did you ask to pet my dog?" if a child comes running up. Make them walk away, approach calmly, ask, then instruct them on how to gently pet him so that he learns not to get riled up and overly excited with them and they learn to be soft with dogs. By doing this you are teaching him how to interact with new children and you are teaching the children how to not get bitten by someone else's dog who may not be as nice as yours.

Hopefully this helps I lean more towards this thinking since it seems like by all other means she has been striving to be his leader. It sounds like you guys are doing a fantastic job with him and he is turning out to be a great boy! :wild:


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Nikkia said:


> As women we are unfortunately naturally more emotional and* our pheromones and scents fluctuate far more,* this can be confusing to our dogs. I also used to struggle with an anxiety disorder but living with Nikkia has taught me to keep a check on my emotions and be sure that I am portraying myself in a clam, confident manner when I am around her. When I do she is the sweetest most obedient dog but when I'm not she'll push my buttons and show those more protective qualities.


Thank you. I never gave the scents we give off a thought in relation to our own dogs. How very interesting.


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