# 4 Health Grain free



## A_selders (Jul 19, 2010)

Anybody get the email about this. Tractor Supply has 3 new grain free foods.

4health Grain Free Whitefish & Potato Formula for Adult Dogs, 30 lb. Bag - 1046159 | Tractor Supply Company 

If any of you Grain free food gurus get a chance I would love to hear some feedback on the quality of this food.


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## Kaleb f (Jan 11, 2013)

I'm not an expert but it looks pretty good. They sell diamond also I wonder the price difference 


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## Kaleb f (Jan 11, 2013)

Diamond natural 40 lb bag is $36 this 4 health is $37 dollars for 30 lb


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## justducky (Feb 7, 2013)

I got that email from TSC as well. I just don't like the fact that it's made by Diamond, because of that I personally wouldn't feed it.


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## justducky (Feb 7, 2013)

Just because of the frequent Diamond recalls, they scare me. I had a cat die several years ago from diamond food, back when they did the massive recalls.


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## Ken Clean-Air System (Feb 27, 2012)

Well, the second ingredient is an unnamed "fish" meal, the the third and fourth ingredients are both peas. There is only one named meat ingredient that I see. It is quite low in caloric content which means your are going to be feeding quite a bit of food to meet the average GSD's daily caloric needs. All in all, it looks like a pretty poor food to me.


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## A_selders (Jul 19, 2010)

Thank you Ken that is what I was looking for. I am trying to learn about the ingredients in a food and not just feed a "grain free" food because it's grain free.


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## vukc (Dec 22, 2009)

Looking at the ingredient list I must say that the meat content in this grain free food is most likely less than 30%. The rest is all peas and potatoes. I am not sure how would animal process Sunflower Oil...Also there is 0% of any fruit in this food. Low Glucosamine and Chondroitin levels, low Omega-3 level (but apparently this is fish based food?). Personally I would stay away from this food. I would only considered it I was not able to afford better type food (little more expensive).

Personally I would rate this type of food with max 3 starts out of 5.
IMHO this food needs more meet content to be considered good.


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## 3ToesTonyismydog (Dec 27, 2009)

These ingredients make up the "majority" of whats in this food. 2 types of peas back to back say this product contains peas as the largest ingredient. Is that bad, not really, but I am not a fan of any vegetable protein. It is a pretty clean dog food. Finding out who supplies their fish meal would be nice. I would send an email to them asking about ethoxyquin . A lot of fish meal contains this and it is faily toxic stuff.

*Whitefish, Fish Meal, Pea Protein, Dried Peas, Tapioca, Whole Potato, Sunflower Oil
*
What is Pea Protein?

Fish Meal 
AAFCO: The clean, rendered, dried ground tissue of undecomposed whole fish or fish cuttings, either or both, with or without the extraction of part of the oil. 
Like with all other animal sources, if a type isn't specified, you never know what type or quality of fish is used.
According to US Coast Guard regulations, all fish meal not destined for human consumption must be conserved with Ethoxyquin (unless the manufacturer has a special permit). *This preservative is banned from use in foods for human consumption* except for the use of very small quantities as a color preservative for spices. So unless the manufacturer either presents a permit or states "human grade" fish or fish meal is used, you can be pretty sure Ethoxyquin is present in the food even if it is not listed. 



The Dog Food Project - Ingredients to avoid


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## Zookeep (May 17, 2012)

vukc said:


> I am not sure how would animal process Sunflower Oil.


What does this mean? I am an animal and I process sunflower oil quite well. Sunflower oil is mostly oleic and linoleic acid, the same fats found in chicken. They are unsaturated fatty acids and are quite healthy.


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## vukc (Dec 22, 2009)

Zookeep said:


> What does this mean? I am an animal and I process sunflower oil quite well. Sunflower oil is mostly oleic and linoleic acid, the same fats found in chicken. They are unsaturated fatty acids and are quite healthy.


Where do carnivore animals (human is omnivore) such as wolf or dog for that matter get the plant based oils from in the wild?

I prefer seeing only animal based oils in dog food, as plant based oil taken by dogs must be first converted by dogs metabolic to be utilized. Only 10-15% of the actual intake of these plaint based fatty acids are actually used and utilized by dogs.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Sunflower is high in linoleic acid with *is* an essential fatty acid for dogs (and humans etc) - they are pretty simple in structure - how do you mean they are not used and utilized?


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## Kaleb f (Jan 11, 2013)

Is this better than diamond naturals? I don't have a big selection in my small town. We have a tsc but no pet stores. 


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## Zookeep (May 17, 2012)

vukc said:


> Where do carnivore animals (human is omnivore) such as wolf or dog for that matter get the plant based oils from in the wild?
> 
> I prefer seeing only animal based oils in dog food, as plant based oil taken by dogs must be first converted by dogs metabolic to be utilized. Only 10-15% of the actual intake of these plaint based fatty acids are actually used and utilized by dogs.


Alright, now you are just making stuff up. 

Linoleic and oleic fatty acids are the same whether the come from plants or animals. The dog's digestive system cannot tell the difference.


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## Zookeep (May 17, 2012)

Kaleb f said:


> Is this better than diamond naturals? I don't have a big selection in my small town. We have a tsc but no pet stores.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Both the Diamond Naturals and the 4Health (with grain) are two good choices available at Tractor Supply. The Dog Food Advisor rates them both at 4 stars. The 4Health Grain Free isn't yet rated there, but would probably come in at 3.5 stars. The main difference I see is that the 4Health Grain Free includes pea protein, which allows for less meat to be used.


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## DollBaby (Oct 31, 2012)

I fed 4 Health for a while. My girl just looked to thin on it despite top dressing it with canned just to get her to eat it. I switched to Halo. She loves it, gained weight and looks great. TSC doesn't sell Halo unfortunately so have to get it elsewhere.

4 Health is made by Diamond... I just don't trust Diamond anymore, and when I found out 4 Health is made by them I made the switch immediately.. PLUS - I don't remember all of the details as it's just been to long ago, but a Veterinarian in Oklahoma told me Diamond adds silicone in their food for something. I wish I could remember what for. A substitution for something.


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## Kaleb f (Jan 11, 2013)

I feed diamond naturals my dogs like it. It's better than ole Roy lol... I guess I'll stick with it. 


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## vukc (Dec 22, 2009)

Zookeep said:


> Alright, now you are just making stuff up.
> 
> Linoleic and oleic fatty acids are the same whether the come from plants or animals. The dog's digestive system cannot tell the difference.


I am just going to say this in the case that we are talking about different things....Plant-based omega-3 fatty acids, such as those found in flax seed, must be converted by your dog's body prior to use. This conversion is very inefficient and may result in as little as 5 % - 15 % of the fatty acids being actually metabolized.


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## Zookeep (May 17, 2012)

vukc said:


> I am just going to say this in the case that we are talking about different things....Plant-based omega-3 fatty acids, such as those found in flax seed, must be converted by your dog's body prior to use. This conversion is very inefficient and may result in as little as 5 % - 15 % of the fatty acids being actually metabolized.


Okay, I understand what you are saying. You are talking about the conversion of ALA to DHA and EPA. You are correct that only a small percentage of ALA is converted to DHA and EPA. This is true for dogs as well as humans. However ALA has benefits of its own when not converted. It accumulates in the skin and fur of mammals. That is about all I know on the subject. I will leave it up to the biochemists among us to provide more information if they want.


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## barnyard (Jun 21, 2012)

I called Tractor Supply about this food to see if Diamond manufactures it. It is not a Diamond product. It is made by Ainsworth/Dad's. Anyone know anything about them?


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## Ken Clean-Air System (Feb 27, 2012)

Yes, Ainsworth Pet Nutrition is a very good manufacturer. They are family owned, and have been around for around 75 years. As far as I know, they produce out of just one facility and have never had a recall.

They produce Dad's, and do outsourcing for others such as supermarket brands like Wegmans brand pet foods. They also produce some very good foods like their Back to Basics line.


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## Zookeep (May 17, 2012)

barnyard said:


> I called Tractor Supply about this food to see if Diamond manufactures it. It is not a Diamond product. It is made by Ainsworth/Dad's. Anyone know anything about them?


Did you ask about all 4Health varieties or just the grain free?


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## barnyard (Jun 21, 2012)

Zookeep said:


> Did you ask about all 4Health varieties or just the grain free?


 Just the grain free.


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