# Looking for a good breeder in or around PA.



## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

Hi,

Over the past 2 months I've been shopping around for a GSD puppy and have been having a hard time finding a good breeder. Was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for breeders in the PA/MD/VA/DE areas. I live in Southeast PA if the radius seems huge but the other states are pretty close to me. 

To give a little insight I've been fairly picky on what I'm looking for. I've come across some 'breeders' in the Lancaster area, but these dogs were being sold for 400-600 bucks... which to me was a red flag. After checking some of these out my suspicions were correct as these dogs weren't up to, at least, my standards.

I found a lady over in Mohnton PA who breeds BEAUTIFUL dogs but her price is at $2500 and though that is a price to be expected for such a top quality dog, it's a little to much for me to spend for a companion. My price range is $1000 - $1500. Any suggestions would be great!


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

Other than price, what are you looking for? Be specific as possible about temperament, lines, coat, goals, etc.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

vom Silbersee has a nice working litter - may be more pup than you want, but super nice pedigree on the litter!

Lee


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## wink-_-wink (Aug 12, 2012)

I would stay away from lancaster all together!! We live in Jersey and we searched and searched and everthing we found in lancaster seemed BYB or Mill.... We wound up driving nearly 7 hours from central jersey to west NY to get our puppy almost 2 weeks ago. The breeder charged us a reasonable amount for a limited (non breeding) AKC certified pup with the option to buy hte breeding rights. I dont think there are any pups left from Hero's litter but I know they are breeding again right now so if you would like to check them out, I have no complaints!! we met every dog at their place and all seemed to be good tempered and some absolutely beautiful dogs. there are pics on their page and some pics of our pup in my signature! good luck be careful and RESEARCH if your buying near lancaster

www.rjkennels.net


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## wink-_-wink (Aug 12, 2012)

wink-_-wink said:


> I would stay away from lancaster all together!! We live in Jersey and we searched and searched and everthing we found in lancaster seemed BYB or Mill.... We wound up driving nearly 7 hours from central jersey to west NY to get our puppy almost 2 weeks ago. The breeder charged us a reasonable amount for a limited (non breeding) AKC certified pup with the option to buy hte breeding rights. I dont think there are any pups left from Hero's litter but I know they are breeding again right now so if you would like to check them out, I have no complaints!! we met every dog at their place and all seemed to be good tempered and some absolutely beautiful dogs. there are pics on their page and some pics of our pup in my signature! good luck be careful and RESEARCH if your buying near lancaster
> 
> www.rjkennels.net


Also since the day we got the puppy, my wife has had almost daily contact with the breeder who answered questions comments and concerns in a very timely manner!


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

ScottyP, have you been able to really research thru this site yet ---> http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/welcome-gsd-faqs-first-time-owner/162231-how-find-puppy.html such great info to know before we start calling up the breeders.

I'm also with the ones saying you need to be very careful looking at breeders in the Lancaster area, one of the top areas for Puppy mills in the USA and the Amish are doing it too 



 
It would be a big help if you describe what 'flavor' of GSD you are looking for. Such a huge difference in our GSD breed --> http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...79460-different-flavors-german-shepherds.html


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

MaggieRoseLee said:


> I'm also with the ones saying you need to be very careful looking at breeders in the Lancaster area, one of the top areas for Puppy mills in the USA and the Amish are doing it too


I've done a lot research on the breed and breeders for about 6 months now, and I have come up with a lot of great information. The problem I have been having right now is I just can't find much.... which I'm blaming more to bad timing I think. 

The one breeder I spoke with was from MD, Country Lake Puppies, and she was great! Asking $1500 for her pups, but she won't have a litter ready to go to a home till Feb. (which is 100% ok)I just want shop around a little more if there is something available sooner before I commit somewhere else.

I, 100% plan to stay away from Lancaster. The problem there is I live close by, so google tends to always throw that in my searches. I went to a Mennonite's farm where he had a little...but sadly I pushed away when he said 400 bucks and 300 cash... I was like yea...not happening. 

The type of dog I'm looking for is what's making this tough I think haha. Ever since I was little kid I always wanted the police k9 GSD. The black and tan/red dog that was man's true best friend, the companion that would give his live for me (though I'm not gonna be putting my dog through that haha just a figure of speech). I posted a picture at the bottom of the colors I'm looking for but as far as temperament, I'm looking for a GSD that's gonna suit a 26 year guy. A guy thats gonna go fishing and all that stuff... I don't really know what else to describe haha. I guess in short...

Temperament: Alert, Loyal, Intelligent, Courageous.
Colors: Black and Tan/red









Sorry if i'm babbling, just trying to best explain what i'm looking for. Thanks for the help.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

the problem with google searches is that you come up with the sites that all the commercial/BYB/Puppy mill/mass producers use and pay for advertising where they come up on top of the searches...petparade, puppynet, puppycom, next day pets, dogbreeders.com, etc....I recently talked to a gentleman who found a breeder within 6 hours of his home through these sites....paid $2500 for a "well bred" puppy - now 14 weeks old....puppy has heavy parasites, health issues - epi or sibo maybe, or just intestinal damage from parasites, said kennel and office were filthy, dogs in poor condition - where they saw pups was nice grassy and clean...and wife wanted puppy now, did not see the rest until they went to do paperwork and pay for puppy.....so overadvertising on these sites is a bad sign...some Amish puppy mills are advertised on these sites with a contact person doing the selling for them.

Police K9s are typically sables or blacks or bicolors - the color you posted is the typical Showline....in State College there is Eichenhalle - Silbersee in MD or VA (they were moving) and they have a really nice working litter born in July.....for an active guy you might do well with a working pup...

Lee


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## Steve-Vom-landsgut (Sep 1, 2012)

*Vom-landsgut*

** Post removed by ADMIN. Advertising of puppies and dogs is not allowed on this board.***


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## GSDGunner (Feb 22, 2011)

My breeder is in Atco NJ, which is only 15-20 minutes from Philly. I'm not sure where in PA you're located or how far that is to you.

She just had a litter in July. 
Here's her website.

Amari Puppies New Jersey


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

wolfstraum said:


> Police K9s are typically sables or blacks or bicolors - the color you posted is the typical Showline....in State College there is Eichenhalle - Silbersee in MD or VA (they were moving) and they have a really nice working litter born in July.....for an active guy you might do well with a working pup...
> 
> Lee



I was considering the working class but I am pretty much sold on the german bloodline for the colors (not my main deciding factor) I just associate the police dogs with black and tans as when I was young it was always what i saw.

And I'll call both those breeders today. Philly is 25 minutes from me. I'm in Pottstown.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

GSDGunner said:


> My breeder is in Atco NJ, which is only 15-20 minutes from Philly. I'm not sure where in PA you're located or how far that is to you.
> 
> She just had a litter in July.
> Here's her website.
> ...


Sadly all her pup's are spoken for. :hammer:


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## GSDGunner (Feb 22, 2011)

ScottyP said:


> Sadly all her pup's are spoken for. :hammer:


Aw, that sucks but I'm not surprised. She really needs to update her website more often. 
You should have asked her if she knew of any available. She's got great connections.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

Yea i was going too but she didn't seem to hot about talking at this moment in time hah.. so I'll call back in the future if necessary. Until then my search continues.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

ScottyP said:


> I was considering the working class but I am pretty much sold on the german bloodline for the colors (not my main deciding factor) I just associate the police dogs with black and tans as when I was young it was always what i saw.
> 
> And I'll call both those breeders today. Philly is 25 minutes from me. I'm in Pottstown.



I am confused.....the tan w black saddle is normally a European show line...not a working line, which - tho it CAN be black and tan - is more normally sable or black or bi..........American Show Lines come in all colors....but are more "extreme" in body type....lower rear, higher head & longer neck....

Lee


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## DunRingill (Dec 28, 2007)

I'm not sure I understand what you're looking for. The picture you posted is a show lines dog, but it sounds like you're interested in working lines? 

I know everyone starts out with color preferences, but believe me when you have a dog that becomes your best buddy, whatever color that dog is becomes your favorite!


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## wink-_-wink (Aug 12, 2012)

I see you have google searched but have you tried going onto the AKC website? They have a breeder search on there that will show u breeders within a certain milage of whatever zipcode you enter. Then you can contact whichever ones make sense to you or all of them and see what you can work out. I too wanted the sadlde back black and tan/red but decided to go with my sable and like everyone has said, the color is just cosmetics and doesn't take away from the GSD loko. EVERYWHERE Hero goes people ask me if they can pet the cutest GSD! The funny thing is that his sable coat as its coming in thicker has almost a saddleback hint to it! regardless, the color is just cosmetic.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

I meant to put German SHOW bloodline. As in I was considering the working class but more prefer the show line. I know the color is only cosmetic and I'm not honna be super picky I just want as close to that color pattern as possible.


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

You just need to be patient and make sure you go with a responsible breeder, your new dog is going to hopefully be with you for the next 12-15 years there's nothing wrong with holding out for everything you want, including color, it's important to me as well, your pup is out there, just make sure you support a responsible breeder that breeds the whole package.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

LARHAGE said:


> You just need to be patient and make sure you go with a responsible breeder, your new dog is going to hopefully be with you for the next 12-15 years there's nothing wrong with holding out for everything you want, including color, it's important to me as well, your pup is out there, just make sure you support a responsible breeder that breeds the whole package.


That's a great post.

Once you locate some good breeders, AND TALK TO THEM, even if they don't have a puppy now, they can keep you in mind or have you contact other breeders they may know.

Only if they don't think you know what you are talking about, or fit for one of their pups, they won't. Which is why it's VITAL for you to read up on everything. The more you know about the breeder, the more the better breeders will seriously consider you for their pups. And this is NOT about money (though I'd budget at least $1000 + ) for the best breeders. They want the best match of owner for puppy, and the money just weeds out the really ignorant from the mix. 

There are many breeders on this site, many of us have wonderful breeders and you can further your research by clicking on our websites or searching our dogs 'real' names if you like the way they look and what they do...

Hopefully you've been doing your homework with the following sites:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/welcome-gsd-faqs-first-time-owner/162231-how-find-puppy.html

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...79460-different-flavors-german-shepherds.html


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

LARHAGE said:


> You just need to be patient and make sure you go with a responsible breeder, your new dog is going to hopefully be with you for the next 12-15 years there's nothing wrong with holding out for everything you want, including color, it's important to me as well, your pup is out there, just make sure you support a responsible breeder that breeds the whole package.


Def some great input and information here. Appreciate everyone's input
It seems though we're trailing off the original question and I'm being pegged as an unknowledable impatient kid. 

I've done a lot of reasearch over the past 6 months in looking into owning a GSD. Been a dog owner all my life and this is will be my first GSD but not my first large active breed. Even with the amount of homework I've done I know I'll still have questions to ask which is to be expected.

Ultimately I'm just looking for breeder recommendations...I've already set a budget of $1500 and I'm doing my best to avoid mills/byb's and the such. 

I agree with the above quote, if I'm gonna spend the money and be with a dog for 12-15 years I wanna make sure it's what I want. I'm looking for the black saddle tan body German Showline breed, Male, to make a companion. 

I've checked the AKC site and found a few breeders, some which have made no contact back, and the ones that have, who seem reputable have been pegged as BYB's. I don't mind if it takes 6 months to obtain a pup, I just wanna get a breeder and get the ball rolling.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

I think that the point that people are making is - 6 months is nothing in the amount of time that it can take to find a good breeder. With my 2nd GSD, I looked at and shopped around for 2 years before deciding on a breeder.

Most good breeders have only a few puppies a year so don't be surprised if you have to wait. It's common for them to have a waiting list by the time that the pups arrive so don't limit yourself to looking at current litters. Look at their "upcoming" page and look at the litters they have planned. See what males/females you like and find out when they plan to have a litter from those dogs and if one of their pups would be a good fit for you.

You'll find the perfect pup for you, don't worry!


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

Try Kirchenwald in PA, I don't know her prices, but she has very nice dogs. Maybe she can refer you to GSL breeders in the area if she doesn't have anything.


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## cindy r. (May 30, 2010)

I am impressed by the bloodlines, working titles, and some extensive health clearances at EZ Brook as well as what I can see of conformation in their photos. I don't know the breeder, but I recognize some bloodlines I really like. I had 2 GSD's w/vom Kirschental herding (HGH) bloodlines via Wynthea Kennels in the 1980's and 1990's. Both had incredible temperaments. The second was an assistance dog who saved me from harm on a number of occasions, each in very different ways, including circumstances that could not have been specifically trained for. The intelligence and innate common sense of both dogs was spectacular.


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## RebelGSD (Mar 20, 2008)

Show line puppies typically go for $2500 and up, so your price range may be somewhat limiting the choices. Maybe you can find some older dogs that were returned to the breeder. Good luck in your search!


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

In Pittsburgh - yes, showlines from breeder mentioned that is here are $2500-3000....

If you are willing to travel, I think Wilmothhaus or Drachefeld do price companion pups for much less than that....

As far as breeders listed on AKC site - anyone with BYB pups can advertise there for $35 ? $50......is no guarantee of quality - just revenue for AKC....not saying there are not quality breeders advertising there...just that is open advertising with no criteria other than AKC registered litter.

Lee


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

So i came across this breeder.

Litters

Spoke with her on the phone for a good 45 minutes and I got a real good vibe. She has a litter that is 2 weeks old priced at $750 for limited registration and $1000+ for unlimited registration and the parents are OFA: Good (a1).

Here is the pedigree's of the parents:
Female:Winnie vom Landsgut - German Shepherd Dog

Male:Baron von dem Kellerhaus - German Shepherd Dog


She said has been breeding for 15+ years and claims to only breed each female once a year.

I scheduled to take a ride down when the pups are 5 weeks old to take a look at them and see how they are. She offered for me to hang out for a couple hours and really get a feel for them. She has the parents and one of the grandparent(i forget which gender) on location.

Does anyone see anything wrong here, and please, again I'm looking for a companion. I want the showline traits but doesn't need to be a $2500 breed.


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## phgsd (Jun 6, 2004)

I don't see much in the way of health clearances. Their male has OFA hips - but no elbows. Big red flag. Most people will do elbows and hips at the same time...did they do the elbows - maybe they just didn't pass so they aren't listing them? 

I also only see one or two females with any hip/elbow clearances. 
No titles, either. 
That'd be a dealbreaker for me. You can do a lot better within your budget.
Have you looked into the breeders suggested?? Even if they don't have puppies RIGHT NOW, it'd be worth it to wait...


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## SpookyShepherd (Oct 12, 2010)

Vom Eichenluft is in PA, Molly breeds both working and show lines. Her Bandit (working line) is my girl's sire and those show line pups are awfully gorgeous! Might be outside your price range at the moment, but also might be worth taking a look to see if you'd want to save up for an E-pup.


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## VTcoach (Jun 28, 2005)

RebelGSD said:


> Show line puppies typically go for $2500 and up, so your price range may be somewhat limiting the choices. Maybe you can find some older dogs that were returned to the breeder. Good luck in your search!


 
Thats not true ($2500 for a puppy). You just need to look beyond the big name kennels. There are plenty of really nice puppies available for less from small hobby breeders.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

phgsd said:


> I don't see much in the way of health clearances. Their male has OFA hips - but no elbows. Big red flag. Most people will do elbows and hips at the same time...did they do the elbows - maybe they just didn't pass so they aren't listing them?
> 
> I also only see one or two females with any hip/elbow clearances.
> No titles, either.
> ...


I forgot about the elbows. I'll have to call and see if she has them checked and any proof for it. She doesn't seem to stay up to date with her website, as she had a lot more information then provided on the site.

I've also checked out 90% of the breeders suggested. Either working class, have not returned a phone call, or when I asked would say they do not have puppies at this time and basically dismiss me... and imo if they wont even talk to me about up coming litters, then I'm not wasting my time.


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## GSDGunner (Feb 22, 2011)

Are you willing to have a pup shipped? There are some great breeders that will ship if desired.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

GSDGunner said:


> Are you willing to have a pup shipped? There are some great breeders that will ship if desired.


I dunno..haven't really looked in shipping... some how it seems unethical to have a dog 'shipped'

I got a hold of Kirchenwald Shepherds, she was very helpful but all her pups are spoken for and is priced at $3k and up. She recommended me to someone whom did not answer. I'm also waiting a return call from Vom-Landsgut to ask for more information on titles/elbows/etc.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I think you need to have a little more patience when expecting an answer. You did start this thread on the Friday before a major 3 day weekend. Many people are out with family, last minute vacations before school, dog trials and events. I wouldn't expect a reply before this coming weekend, IMO.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

Jax08 said:


> I think you need to have a little more patience when expecting an answer. You did start this thread on the Friday before a major 3 day weekend. Many people are out with family, last minute vacations before school, dog trials and events. I wouldn't expect a reply before this coming weekend, IMO.


IMO, I have been patient. I was just stating that I have not received a phone call yet from some of the breeders. I'm 100% aware that its a major holiday and people are with their families. I'm talking about that breeders that dont have current litters that dont want to talk about upcoming litters.

Most the people here have been very helpful....If your going to leave comments about my patience or anything and not reply to the original question with a helpful answer then please don't comment at all.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

ummm...think you are taking my comment a little personally. I was just pointing out the time frame because I know how anxious and exciting it can be when you are looking for a new puppy and you repeatedly said the breeders had not responded. Good luck with your search.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

I may or may not be taking that personally but I'm getting tired of getting chastised for my search in a puppy. I'm just explaining that I HAVE contacted most of the breeders recommended and I am just awaiting a return call. Whether I get one or not is a different story. Until then I'm acting on the leads that I currently have. 

As far as patience, I dont care if it takes till january or later to obtain a pup. I just want to find a reputable breeder, get the ball rolling and start preparing for the other stuff.


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## Xeph (Jun 19, 2005)

Molly is much faster to answer through email than a phone call. She does have litters coming up, including a show line litter, but her dogs are out of the price range for the OP


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)




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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

Xeph said:


> Molly is much faster to answer through email than a phone call. She does have litters coming up, including a show line litter, but her dogs are out of the price range for the OP


Yea i checked in to her. She has a great site and beautiful dogs. They are just little out of my price range.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

I don't know any WGSL breeders in that price range that don't have litters booked in advance, sorry. Most are booked 6-12 months out. People do back out for various reasons though so if you see a litter or breeder you like I'd still contact them.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

This period of waiting is a good time to meet the potential breeding dogs before they are mothers. Make sure you meet the sire as well if you can. Then you can see their true temperament.
It will protect you from buying the "whatever " puppy once you see them. All pups are adorable and it is tough to leave your brain in charge if you sit down with a litter.
I have been searching for about 20 years until I found my current GSD. In the meantime I have had other dogs but was always on the look out for the one I have now. He was above budget but so worth it.
To me travel distance wouldn't have been a factor to find him but he happened to be close by while I was checking out Europe already.
Have you considered a rescue dog or a retired breeding dog? Then you can immediately see what they are like.
Good luck on your search. Take your time to find your soul mate.


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

ScottyP said:


> I dunno..haven't really looked in shipping... some how it seems unethical to have a dog 'shipped'
> I:hug:
> I got a hold of Kirchenwald Shepherds, she was very helpful but all her pups are spoken for and is priced at $3k and up. She recommended me to someone whom did not answer. I'm also waiting a return call from Vom-Landsgut to ask for more information on titles/elbows/etc.



Don't be quick to dismiss shipping a puppy, a lot of people on this board, including me, have shipped with no problems, I never laid a hand on my puppy till I picked him up from the airport, and still, he was EXACTLY what I wanted, and more, don't limit your search to just driving distance, you miss out on some top notch kennels that way.


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## ScottyP (Aug 31, 2012)

LARHAGE said:


> Don't be quick to dismiss shipping a puppy, a lot of people on this board, including me, have shipped with no problems, I never laid a hand on my puppy till I picked him up from the airport, and still, he was EXACTLY what I wanted, and more, don't limit your search to just driving distance, you miss out on some top notch kennels that way.


hmm this something interesting to consider. I'll have to look into this.


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## skew12 (Aug 28, 2012)

Shipping can make things easier some times. A family friend use to breed labs (years ago) and shipped pups all over with barely any issues.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I have also had puppies shipped and never had a problem.

The only thing with shipping is, you have to put your complete faith in a breeder that will select the best puppy for you.

Masi (avatar) went from KY to TX to east coast and on to CT when she was 8.5 weeks old, in transit for gosh, atleast 8 hours, she was fine and full of it when she arrived


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

I had Bretta shipped to me and it worked out just fine. 

Point is WAY more the one that JakodaCD made with having to have complete faith and trust in the breeder. So if I didn't do my research on the front end and got a crap puppy from the breeder, that would be my fault in the mix. 

aw:


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## rshkr (Feb 9, 2012)

i had my pup shipped too. from tornado alley to hurricane country  from kansas to florida no problem.


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