# Second Session in Protection; Vid



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

Janka and I carpooled with our trainer and another handler to San Diego over the weekend to train with another club. 

This is her second time being worked in protection, and my first as a handler. She was tethered to a tree the first time, so I am still trying to find my immovable frame - all 4'11" of thunder and lightning - and looking far from graceful. 

Any suggestions?

I am finding out as I go, that there are a lot of new skills to learn as a handler. 

It takes some strength lifting your dog by her collar, then kicking the wedge back out while making sure she doesn't pull free and cause you to face plant. I also had rope burn from the nylon leash while deliberately letting her out. I got corrected for just letting all 6 feet of the leash go at once. Oops. :crazy:

I think this was the second to last bite she got. She had a good time, and I picked up a lot of useful information from the TD and other members.






Gah. This is so fun! I thought tracking was addicting, but this is just bonkers mad fun!


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

Get a deeper stance. Put the anchor hand (your right in this video) now under your butt cheek like you're repelling. The left hand is there to guide the line *only*. Deeper stance, and you can not get moved so easily. Thats why the dog got a grip it wasn't supposed to get.

Stand like this. Theres a reason its done in Martial Arts... stability


----------



## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Yeah, keep your weight on your back foot. Lean away from her. Get a longer line too, more like 12'. Its easier if you aren't right up close to her, back just a little bit from where you are.

Are you cradling her before you out & kick the wedge?


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

Steve Strom said:


> Yeah, keep your weight on your back foot. Lean away from her. Get a longer line too, more like 12'. Its easier if you aren't right up close to her, back just a little bit from where you are.
> 
> Are you cradling her before you out & kick the wedge?


I wouldn't recommend the longer line. Folks tend to show up with way too long a line and the dog can get way too much space to roam, back up and charge, etc.


----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

Thanks for the picture, will keep that in mind the next time. Is my weight more on the back leg then, or should it be equally distributed in both feet? I think I was trying to keep my weight in the back, but I kept leaning forwards.

I was told that I was gripping too much with the left hand too after I put my dog away, but I had totally forgotten about it. Thank you for reminding me. They suggested it should closer towards my body as well.


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

The Stig said:


> Thanks for the picture, will keep that in mind the next time. Is my weight more on the back leg then, or should it be equally distributed in both feet? I think I was trying to keep my weight in the back, but I kept leaning forwards.
> 
> I was told that I was gripping too much with the left hand too after I put my dog away, but I had totally forgotten about it. Thank you for reminding me. They suggested it should closer towards my body as well.


I tell people to make a circle with their guide hand so the leash can freely move in it, or even just put your palm towards the sky

I was looking for a good pic for you but found this one. As you can see, with proper technique, you can one-hand it like me  Frees up the other hand for other purposes


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

As you can see here, I've got a deep stance, and I often use my guide hand to lift up or push down on the leash to act as a spring to absorb the shock of the dog hitting the end of the leash. Note the anchor hand is low and under my butt.. super important. Note my rear leg is weighted


----------



## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

It just seems like most folks with a 6' leash seem to end up out of leash and off balance. I'm not talking about those 30' lines. Just 12' or so.


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

Steve Strom said:


> It just seems like most folks with a 6' leash seem to end up out of leash and off balance. I'm not talking about those 30' lines. Just 12' or so.


I go as much as a 10 foot as you can see, but nothing is needed above that... and in both pics above you can see I'm not even using all the leash


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

*caveat, I'm left handed so most folks would be a mirror image of my stance*


----------



## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Lol, ok. 10 it is.


----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

Steve Strom said:


> Yeah, keep your weight on your back foot. Lean away from her. Get a longer line too, more like 12'. Its easier if you aren't right up close to her, back just a little bit from where you are.
> 
> Are you cradling her before you out & kick the wedge?


Hi Steve,

I actually learned cradling that day, but I may be doing it wrong because every time we stopped, she tried to whip the wedge side to side, like she is shaking & killing a rabbit.. if that makes sense. He said my cradling looked more like a BJJ choke, and to put my hand under her chin rather than putting my arm around her throat/neck. 

[what is the purpose of cradling?]

I am trying to recall... the first couple of bites, after she got the wedge, I jogged in a circle with her (and I had to jog fast, because she wanted to do that side to side whipping motion), then outed it. The trainer instructed me to cradle my dog the 4th time, but for 5th one we just jogged a circle and right her back to the crate with the wedge in her mouth.


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

The Stig said:


> Hi Steve,
> 
> I actually learned cradling that day, but I may be doing it wrong because every time we stopped, she tried to whip the wedge side to side, like she is shaking & killing a rabbit.. if that makes sense. He said my cradling looked more like a BJJ choke, and to put my hand under her chin rather than putting my arm around her throat/neck.
> 
> ...


When you're cradling, lean your head back or look away... if the dog thrashes your face will thank me


----------



## Wolfgeist (Dec 4, 2010)

hunterisgreat said:


> As you can see here, I've got a deep stance, and I often use my guide hand to lift up or push down on the leash to act as a spring to absorb the shock of the dog hitting the end of the leash. Note the anchor hand is low and under my butt.. super important. Note my rear leg is weighted


This is close to how I stand, too.

I hear you, though... I have bad carpal tunnel in both wrists and my hand/wrist strength is terrible so I maintain a deep stance and put most of my weight on the half farthest from the helper, I really push weight down on my farthest leg and the hip, and practically sit on the line.


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

Wild Wolf said:


> This is close to how I stand, too.
> 
> I hear you, though... I have bad carpal tunnel in both wrists and my hand/wrist strength is terrible so I maintain a deep stance and put most of my weight on the half farthest from the helper, I really push weight down on my farthest leg and the hip, and practically sit on the line.


Thats the idea. Thats why repellers do it that way.


----------



## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

Cradling, just like carrying, prevents the "kill shake" it teaches the dog to be calm on the sleeve and prevents an early out while moving away from prey mode.

Your helper should be re-engaging with the bite wedge, pulling back on it while you provide tension on the leash. That way, the dog knows if it loosens the grip...it loses the wedge. While you're doing this (essentially playing tug with the dog as the rope), you slowly come up and cradle the dog. This calms her and also prevents the kill shake. This will also prevent an early out. You want the dog to hold the wedge until you say.

If you notice the dog mouthing as you're cradling...you want to choke the dog off the wedge so that it learns that if it starts to mouth it, it loses the toy.


----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

Thanks for the suggestions. I will definitely be more mindful of anchoring the leash securely under my butt cheek and keep my head away when I cradle her. I could totally see that being a noob mistake. :crazy:


----------



## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Yeah, like Hunter said. Watch your face. One thing you can do, take another lap. You want to ease into the cradle as best you can and its not always easy on a harness if she's thrashing it while she's moving, but move out again and try and ease her into it. Maybe just pet her a little. Maybe the helper will keep her on the bite and have you calmly walk in and cradle to help you. Practice with a toy away from the field.

In real general terms, cradling is to settle her down.


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

To be perfectly honest, I don't cradle either of mine (got too tired of looking like I was getting beat up every day). If they hold it calmly, they may keep it. If they get chewing or back off of it, I make them out it. Simple, no bruised face, same end result.


----------



## bill (Nov 8, 2013)

Try this same stance as hunter" except you let the line run around your butt" your rear end and hip on the side you are holding holds the dog " doesn't take much hand strength " run your fingers through the leash make a fist thumb on top! Bill

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

bill said:


> Try this same stance as hunter" except you let the line run around your butt" your rear end and hip on the side you are holding holds the dog " doesn't take much hand strength " run your fingers through the leash make a fist thumb on top! Bill
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


exactly... make a loop and put your thumb through it like so


----------



## bill (Nov 8, 2013)

Yup!:thumbup:

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

Don't use a lightning cable though. They aren't that tough and the legit Apple ones are kinda pricey


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

You are in good hands training with Kris! It is hard to be a post even with the low stance when you don't weigh much more than your dog!
Bills advice is spot on. 
Janka looks just as addicted to protection as you


----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

So... that thumb thing that Bill describe (thank you for the pic follow-up, HunterIsGreat) is how I hold with the anchor hand, right? Do I loop my hand through the loop and then do that?


----------



## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

The Stig said:


> So... that thumb thing that Bill describe (thank you for the pic follow-up, HunterIsGreat) is how I hold with the anchor hand, right? Do I loop my hand through the loop and then do that?


Only your thumb. Just like the picture


----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

onyx'girl said:


> You are in good hands training with Kris! It is hard to be a post even with the low stance when you don't weigh much more than your dog!
> Bills advice is spot on.
> Janka looks just as addicted to protection as you


Thanks, Jane! This is such a fun sport, isn't it?  I like the camaraderie among my group as well as online. Most are very helpful and supportive.


----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

So my hand isn't through the handle of the leash? Sorry if I wasn't too clear.... I just reread my reply and it was confusing. 

I don't know if I would trust me (yet) to be a secure pillar for my dog with just the leash just looped over my thumb and down the palm, and no 'backup' for a 'just in case'.


----------



## bill (Nov 8, 2013)

Just your thumb.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## bill (Nov 8, 2013)

My fault I said fingers instead of thumb" sorry Bill

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------

