# My 4 and a half months old GSD has bent front leg.. open paw (downed pasterns).



## stevanity

I didnt know about the front leg bending problem. I took him to the vet and he said his front leg is bent. I dont know how to put it in words. So I have attached an image. Please lemme know if theres a problem with my boy or not. If so what should I do?

The Vet had already warned me to keep him off slippery surfaces. My house is surrounded by parking tiles which is not very slippery but is still smooth and gets slippery when wet. Ive seen him slide when he stops running. And my house has marble flooring. Is this the problem? 

He breathes heavily always. He drinks lots of water. When he sits his legs shake in sync with his breathing. I assumed its cos of the shaking body. But now am worried if he is weak. 

I am giving him calcium tabs everyday. And also I am giving him a hip and joint food supplement. 

This is the image:









Another one:









This is Jim  









Oh and btw he weighs 20 Kgs (44 lbs).


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## Cheyanna

Sounds like the vet was a lot of help. Did the vet suggest anything? How old is Jim? Is he still growing? Are you asking if the slipping and sliding did it or will make it worse? Or is he slipping and sliding because of the bent foot?

Fiona slips and slide all the time and I have carpet and tile. If he is done growing, it may be too late. If under a year, maybe a wrap or I cannot thing of the word, not a cast, but people get them on bad knees. Kids get them to fix bow legs.

Edit: I don't think he is weak. When Fiona pants her whole body shakes. If we are in the car it shakes the car. 

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## carmspack

NO more calcium supplementation.
Pasterns are weakened . Ligament stretched . this can be helped by diet , but not by calcium.
The shaking in your dog is from the tension in the leg . Does the wrist buckle or bulge when he is sitting for a while ?

Cheyanna "When Fiona pants her whole body shakes. If we are in the car it shakes the car." that sounds like extreme distress in the car . Panting that hard is a stress reaction. Big eyes, tongue curled , short rapid breathing without physical exertion.


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## julie87

poor baby


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## Mooch

If you're worried about him slipping some "grippy' baby socks may help.
Are you in the US?


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## Castlemaid

Your pup as weak pasterns - it can correct itself with the right food and exercise. There has been some threads on the forum in the past with suggestions on how to improve this condition. Here is one with good info from Carmen, and some links to other websites:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/development-socialization/182706-correcting-down-pasterns.html

(the words "weak" and 'pasterns" are showing up in red because it shows the hits for the search I did using the search function).


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## Cheyanna

I don't mean it as always that her panting shakes the car. I was thinking about getting back in the car after we played with the chuck it for 10 minutes.

Edit: 4hours later I remembered the word ... Brace.
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## stevanity

Cheyanna said:


> Sounds like the vet was a lot of help. Did the vet suggest anything? How old is Jim? Is he still growing? Are you asking if the slipping and sliding did it or will make it worse? Or is he slipping and sliding because of the bent foot?
> 
> Fiona slips and slide all the time and I have carpet and tile. If he is done growing, it may be too late. If under a year, maybe a wrap or I cannot thing of the word, not a cast, but people get them on bad knees. Kids get them to fix bow legs.
> 
> Edit: I don't think he is weak. When Fiona pants her whole body shakes. If we are in the car it shakes the car.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Thanks. He's nearly 5 months old and is growing steadily. I dont know. I really dont know if its coz of the slipping or if slipping was because of this thing. But Ive noticed him tripping on his front leg occasionally while walking. 



> Your pup as weak pasterns - it can correct itself with the right food and exercise. There has been some threads on the forum in the past with suggestions on how to improve this condition. Here is one with good info from Carmen, and some links to other websites:
> 
> http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...-pasterns.html
> 
> (the words "weak" and 'pasterns" are showing up in red because it shows the hits for the search I did using the search function).


Thanks a lot castle maid. Ill check the posts out. I didnt know the word to describe the condition. Thanks for helping me out with that. Ill find the right diet and exercise and hope my boy will recover. 

Im from India btw. 

Thanks guys.


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## stevanity

carmspack said:


> NO more calcium supplementation.
> Pasterns are weakened . Ligament stretched . this can be helped by diet , but not by calcium.
> The shaking in your dog is from the tension in the leg . Does the wrist buckle or bulge when he is sitting for a while ?
> 
> Cheyanna "When Fiona pants her whole body shakes. If we are in the car it shakes the car." that sounds like extreme distress in the car . Panting that hard is a stress reaction. Big eyes, tongue curled , short rapid breathing without physical exertion.


No.. I dont see any significant bulge. But a small bulge does develop. What should I do. This is his diet:

I feed him twice a day. In the morning I feed him with nearly 4 cups of Pedigree Puppy Large Breed food and in the night I feed him with rice and buttermilk (heard its good for his stomach).


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## Castlemaid

If he is not having any gastrointestinal issues, don't worry about the rice and buttermilk. The large breed puppy food is okay - but four cups in one meal is a lot of food! Calcium supplements, buttermilk and four cups dog food is too much calcium!! Large breed puppy food is specifically designed with LESS Calcium, to prevent too rapid growth of the bones, which can cause issues for normal development. 

If you have access to Royal Canin, it is better than Pedigree. Feed twice a day three or four cups, separated into two meals: so two cups in the morning, two cups in the evening. No need to feed rice or buttermilk, or any kind of milk products (cow's milk, cheese, etc). 

His low pasterns where not caused by the flooring in your house, but is a genetic issue. They are not too bad, so a good chance that they will improve with proper nutrition and exercise.


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## wolfy dog

10 minutes with the chuck it is way too much exercise. It is too hard on his young structure. Keep him active by letting him set the pace. Find a good vet asap who is specialized in this field. He is still young so you have time on your side. And stop the calcium as it will throw off the balance of the minerals he needs or may not need. You need professional advice from a good vet.


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## MaggieRoseLee

It's typical vets don't know all the complications and genetic issues of all breeds. Breeders are NOT being responsible as they should be and in the GSD this 'downed pasterns' condition is not uncommon. Make sure your breeder knows!!!!! It's why we pay all the money for the pups so they don't do a repeat breeding when clearly genetic abdormalities crop up.

Read the links posted, there is hope and you aren't crazy, your pup is not normal but can improve. He's actually not nearly as bad as some dogs.


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## stevanity

Thanks a lot for your advice guys! Ill change his diet and use only the hip and bone supplement dropping the calcium tabs. Glad to know that the flooring isnt the cause. Is his weight normal?
Thanks again!!!


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## carmspack

hey , how are you. How are you planning on changing the diet . Protein is very important for collagen development .


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## Lotus99

stevanity said:


> Is his weight normal?
> Thanks again!!!


Not sure if the chart on this page will help, but according to it, he might be about 5 pounds under, if he's 5 months old. It's based on averages of course, and doesn't have percentiles unfortunately.

But I know the chart was pretty accurate for us as ours was growing, and now, at 2 years old, she weighs 68 pounds, which is just a few pounds off, which at that weight, is only a few percent, whereas 5 pounds in 50, is like 10% off.

German Shepherd Growth Chart and Puppy Growth Rate and Weight
.
.
I was told that you should be able to feel the ribs on a GSD, but you probably don't want too much rib showing, if you're thinking he might be a bit underweight.


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## Anubis_Star

Its usually not reccomended to start supplements untik after a dog matures. 1+ yrs old. But different people have different opinions in that

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## stevanity

carmspack said:


> hey , how are you. How are you planning on changing the diet . Protein is very important for collagen development .


Why is my dog underweight. Well you guys are saying 4 cups in the morning and rice in the evening is too much food for him. 

How can I make sure he gets to the ideal weight?

is Pedigree any good or should I go for Royal Canin?

Can I give him meat? (chicken / beef)

Should I give him veggies?

Help me out with a diet..

Thanks in advance


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## K.Creek

@stevanity...I would switch food to Royal Canin German Shepherd Puppy 30. The amount fed is kind of discretionary I feel like. My dog came with a suggested feeding and for a dog your age it suggests: 1.5 cups dry food and the 1/2 lb of Vital Essentials raw (if no raw supplement an extra cup of dry) feed 2x daily. So if you opt out of raw it would essentially be 4 cups of dry. Now my dog is SUPER active so I have always fed her more just to maintain weight because she burns it sooooo fast, let that play a factor in your amount as well. 
My vet also gave me Platinum Performance supplement to mix with her food and its recommended to add 1 tablespoon for every 30lbs of dog. The supplement was given to me to help with a large breed dog, who grows rapidly, my vet said it would help her joints, growth, coat, etc. It has tons of great stuff including glucosamine, fiber, all the vitamins you can think of! 
I hope some of this helps, I would try some new food, and a new vet...good luck and keep us updated!


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## MaggieRoseLee

stevanity said:


> *Why is my dog underweight. *Well you guys are saying 4 cups in the morning and rice in the evening is too much food for him.
> 
> How can I make sure he gets to the ideal weight?
> 
> Thanks in advance


NONE OF US CAN tell if your dog is too fat OR too skinny without seeing him in person

All of the charts and lists are just GENERAL guidelines!!! So don't get too freaked out by seeing your dog is lighter or heavier. All our pups are different, they can grow at different rates and end up different sizes. It's GENETICS that will give them their ideal weight, we just need to supply the proper food.

Photos of your pup standing from the side, and with him standing and looking down from above, may help us see him a bit. But frankly it's hard to tell with a black dog and they grow in spurts so one week may be plump and the next a bit skinny and BOTH are normal.


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## Cheyanna

Yes, you can feed him meat. You can feed him bones, just do not cook them. Not even a little bit.


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## stevanity

Should I reduce protein in the diet like many sources suggest? I really wanna help my puppy.. 

Changing to a high quality food like RoyalCanin will increase protein levels right? Should I do it now? Wouldnt it put more pressure on the pasterns? 

Is there any specific dietary suggestion that I can follow for a period of time to help him recover? I dont care about his weight or height. I just want him to be pain free and happy. 
Please help.


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## TANDB

Try the royal canin adult instead of the puppy formula. I've always switched my dogs off puppy formulas to adult around this age. NO excessive running, let him set the pace.


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## Pooky44

He doesn't look too bad but he should be up a little more on the pasterns. Use moderate exercise daily, don't push him too hard but make sure he gets some trotting in. High quality food (not Pedigree) and no extra vitamins or glucosamine. His nails are too long and long nails are not good for the paws, causes the toes to spread. Clip them at least once a month.


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## stevanity

Pooky44 said:


> He doesn't look too bad but he should be up a little more on the pasterns. Use moderate exercise daily, don't push him too hard but make sure he gets some trotting in. High quality food (not Pedigree) and no extra vitamins or glucosamine. His nails are too long and long nails are not good for the paws, causes the toes to spread. Clip them at least once a month.


Thank you  okay. Ill switch to RoyalCanin over a week. And Ill take him to the groomers. Wow vets here dont say anything about this stuff.


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## stevanity

Guys. Its getting worse I think. I havent changed to high quality food coz itll be increasing his weight. So I decided to stick with Pedigree large breed puppy food till he becomes alright. But he is growing rapidly. 

Should I lower the amount of food he takes?? Im worried.

My food says 32% Min Protein and 13% Fat. Is this too much?

Shall I switch him to rice and curd? till he becomes normal??


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## carmspack

those kibble products aren't particularly good .

Pedigree Dog Food Reviews, Ratings and Analysis

the diet needs an overhaul. Quality protein.


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## Sunflowers

stevanity said:


> Guys. Its getting worse I think. I havent changed to high quality food coz itll be increasing his weight. So I decided to stick with Pedigree large breed puppy food till he becomes alright. But he is growing rapidly.
> 
> Should I lower the amount of food he takes?? Im worried.
> 
> My food says 32% Min Protein and 13% Fat. Is this too much?
> 
> Shall I switch him to rice and curd? till he becomes normal??


No rice and curds.. Dogs need meat.
High-quality protein won't make him gain weight. It is junk food that makes a dog gain weight. Pedegree is a very poor quality food.Royal Canin isn't so much better, either.
It would probably be cheaper for you and better for the dog if you want to give him a raw diet. Cut a whole raw chicken into four pieces and give him a piece.


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## stevanity

carmspack said:


> those kibble products aren't particularly good .
> 
> Pedigree Dog Food Reviews, Ratings and Analysis
> 
> the diet needs an overhaul. Quality protein.


So what do I do. Can you suggest a brand that I can get in India. Or shall I follow the other advice? Raw Chicken. Please temme.. thank you in advance.

btw these are the brands available here:

1) Pedigree
2) Royal Canin
3) Eukanuba
4) Propac
5) Iams
6) Propet


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## Gwenhwyfair

If you are going to switch to raw please read up about it in the Raw Feeding section of this forum.

Given that you are in India with limited choices try the Royal Canin. Switch the food slowly though so as to avoid stomach upset. Add a little bit of the Royal Canin to the Pedigree and slowly increase the proportion of RC.

In the meantime check out the raw feeding subforum here for help learning about it and if it will help your puppy.

I wish you good luck with your puppy!



stevanity said:


> So what do I do. Can you suggest a brand that I can get in India. Or shall I follow the other advice? Raw Chicken. Please temme.. thank you in advance.
> 
> btw these are the brands available here:
> 
> 1) Pedigree
> 2) Royal Canin
> 3) Eukanuba
> 4) Propac
> 5) Iams
> 6) Propet


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## stevanity

Gwenhwyfair said:


> If you are going to switch to raw please read up about it in the Raw Feeding section of this forum.
> 
> Given that you are in India with limited choices try the Royal Canin. Switch the food slowly though so as to avoid stomach upset. Add a little bit of the Royal Canin to the Pedigree and slowly increase the proportion of RC.
> 
> In the meantime check out the raw feeding subforum here for help learning about it and if it will help your puppy.
> 
> I wish you good luck with your puppy!


Thank you. I'll switch to royal canin I guess.


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## Gwenhwyfair

It's hard to help you fully as the conditions and availibilty of resources is so different in India. 

We have a member on the board who is originally from India and is very knowledgeable about GSDs, perhaps she can help you as she will better understand what resources you do and do not have in India. Here is a link to her profile from there you can send her a Private Message.

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/members/54473-qbchottu.html





stevanity said:


> Thank you. I'll switch to royal canin I guess.


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## Avinash96

stevanity said:


> Thank you  okay. Ill switch to RoyalCanin over a week. And Ill take him to the groomers. Wow vets here dont say anything about this stuff.


Same problem arise in my 4.5 month german Shepherd front legs joints is totally bent....Please help me out. I am providing him multivitamin and calcium from 1 month. Now his legs is totally bent from joints.


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## Shadow Shep

Avinash96 said:


> Same problem arise in my 4.5 month german Shepherd front legs joints is totally bent....Please help me out. I am providing him multivitamin and calcium from 1 month. Now his legs is totally bent from joints.


This thread is old. Please start a new one.


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## wolfy dog

Avinash96 said:


> Same problem arise in my 4.5 month german Shepherd front legs joints is totally bent....Please help me out. I am providing him multivitamin and calcium from 1 month. Now his legs is totally bent from joints.


Stop the supplements and feed him a good puppy food for large breed dogs. Keep him lean.


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