# German Shepherd Puppy Screaming



## pink_lemur13 (Nov 13, 2013)

Howdy all,

I have a 14 week old male German Shepherd puppy. He has been enrolled in "puppy kindergarten" class for a few weeks now, and he has always done well...until last night. 

Normally, he wiggles a little, and he may bark a few times at the other puppies in the class. We (me and my husband) have always been able to redirect his attention to the training treats we have and get him to behave while the instructor is teaching. However, last night was pretty bad. He paid attention for the first half of the class, but he soon became more interested in the other puppies than he was in learning. We tried to redirect with treats, and he ignored them. He didn't seem to be paying either my husband or me any attention. He would listen when the instructor offered him treats and gave him a command, but not even she could keep him from freaking out when she walked to another puppy. When we took him outside for a break with the other pups, he stood on his hind legs pulling on the leash to get to them, and when we wouldn't let him, he got upset and started jumping in mid air and struggling to free himself of his harness, barking and squealing the entire time. 

The worst part came at the end of class when everyone started to leave. We sat for a moment while we gathered our things, and our puppy wanted so bad to follow one dog in particular that he started screaming, literally screaming like he was dying and struggling with all his might to get at the other dog as it left the room. It was terrifying. You would have thought his very life depended on following that other dog out of the room. The instructor of the class (who is also a licensed vet) just gave him a bewildered look like she had never seen such behavior before, and then looked at me like she was wondering what I had done to cause him so much pain. It was the most ridiculous behavior I have ever seen out of him, and I don't know how to keep it from happening again. It also gives me a feeling of terror like I've never felt before, because he's getting so much bigger now, and if he keeps this behavior, there may come a time when I and my husband can no longer control him physically. Right now, it's a bit of a struggle to keep him from flopping around when he throws a tantrum on his leash in front of the other puppies, so I can't even imagine what it will be like when he finally weighs the same as I do. 

The worst part about all of this? The vet/instructor who has been training dogs and puppies for 20 years couldn't offer me any advice. She just stared at me like I had kicked my puppy or something. Has anyone else encountered this behavior? What should I do?

Thanks in advance,
Alyssa


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## Rainer (Feb 15, 2012)

Rainer shrieks like a banshee in the car when we are close to a place he knows he'll be getting out and having fun. He'll also do it if his friends are playing but he is leashed and not allowed to play.

When he does it in the car I tune him out (mostly - if he gets too bad he gets told to go lay down) until I park the car. He's allowed to carry on a little bit, but he knows once the trunk is open he has to sit and focus on me. When his friends are playing I walk away until he calms down a little bit and have him focus on me and treat. 

My friends male GSD does the screaming thing too when he's super excited - not quite as loudly or high pitched as Rainer, but I always assumed it was just a by-product of over threshold excitement. 

My best guess is to get some really, really yummy treats or toy that he loves and always re-direct his attention and excitement back to you. If you have to / can, walk away until his excitement level is manageable and then re-direct to focus on you.

ETA: I can't re-direct him while I am driving so I opt for management - he's good for the entire car ride until we are a couple minutes away from our destination so I don't mind.


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## trcy (Mar 1, 2013)

Kaleb shrieks and screams during training class too. He hates doing a sit stay in class he sound slike he's being tortured. He does it fine at home. *shrug* My trainer just walks by and says, "typical shepherd. They are very vocal. "


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

There are a number of ways to approach this issue but the number one thing to do is to avoid a tugging situation where he is trying to pull against you towards something he wants. When people are trying to build drive in a dog to want to bite or play with a toy or tug that's exactly what people in bite sports do.

So what can you do? Lots of things. First find another trainer cause one that can't help you with that isn't worth paying.

You can leash pop or redirect the pup when it starts to lock onto the other puppies. Do it early before it throws the fit. If the pup begins to pull instead of pulling against him pull directly up and keep his front legs off the ground till he sits or lays down then immediately let the pressure off. This works with a collar not so hot on a harness.

Another option is create more space between you and distractions or use higher value food rewards or just have him hungrier before you take him there.

Stop letting him play with other puppies. Allowing him to find such high value in direct interaction with other puppies is part of what creates that. Let him play with you around other puppies but not with.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

What did you do when he threw his "tantrum?"


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## pink_lemur13 (Nov 13, 2013)

Phew. Okay. I thought something was really going wrong here. I'm glad to hear he's not the only one that screams like that. If it's a shepherd thing, it's fine and I can deal with it, but I thought it was a behavioral problem that had developed out of the blue. 

Baillif, thank you for the advice. I have him in a harness at the moment, but we have slowly been transitioning him to a collar by letting him wear it and walk on a leash with it at times. He hates it, though. It chokes him like crazy because he pulls against it so hard. He used to be really good with walking on a leash and not pulling. It's just recently that he's started "acting out."

@Sunflowers: When he started throwing a tantrum on his leash on break when we were all outside, I tried to redirect his attention with a treat, and when that didn't work, I simply stood there like a tree and let him holler and jump around until he stopped. When he stopped and sat for a few seconds, we would move forward. He almost always immediately started pulling and jumping and screaming again, though. I think if we had the chance to practice it a little more, he may have learned "sitting and being quite gets me going in the direction I want to go." However, puppy kindergarten is only 1 hour long, and there really isn't much time to focus on one thing in particular. 

When he threw a fit while still in the classroom, the instructor said to pet him to calm him down while she talked. I didn't want to do that, because it would reinforce his behavior and let him know he gets attention when he pulls and barks, so I kept trying to redirect his attention with treats and commands, which didn't work this time. 

At the end of class, when he really flipped his lid, my husband had a hold of him, and I told him to wait until he quit to take him out. However, the instructor was ushering us all from the room, so my pup got what he wanted (to follow the other dog) by throwing a fit. Since I reinforced a bad behavior, I'm going to have to try to correct it now. It's frustrating, but it's my fault for not sticking to my guns. 

On that note, has anyone ever experienced negativity from other people while training their shepherd? Has anyone ever accused you of being "cruel" when you were training?

Thanks again!


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

I've never had anyone say anything I matter of factly pull a pulling dog up until he stops trying to pull forward then let the pressure off as soon as he quits. The dog is going to choke himself the same way or worse on a collar if you just refuse to give into the direction he is going at least this way you prevent him from gaining speed and lunging and getting himself really good. Don't even say anything to the dog don't say sit or down just praise when he gives in. 

The problem kind of comes from the way most people think you should socialize a dog, letting them play together. So people get puppies that are strangers to each other to meet up and have fun, or go to dog parks to have fun and play with strange dogs. People do this because they don't want their dog aggressively lunging at other dogs out of fear or aggression. 

However if that's the highlight of the puppies day and he doesn't get that same fun from you he gets super excited when the opportunity to play with another pup presents itself Then goes lunging wildly for strange dogs because he want to play. It basically creates the same behavior you were trying to avoid in the first place, and if that excitement triggers a fight and a few negative experiences guess what? You have a dog aggressive dog that is a lunger. 

What most people really want is a dog that minds them listens to them and will ignore strangers or strange dogs. You get that by having a dog engage with you in the presence of strangers and strange dogs, not directly with them.


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## pink_lemur13 (Nov 13, 2013)

That's a really good point. I've never heard it put that way before. You're right about wanting a dog that focuses only on me. I am eventually going to either train him myself or have him trained to be my service dog, so focus on me is terribly important. The instructor made me believe that interaction with other puppies was one of the most important things. She was having us let our leashes go, let our pups interact, and then go get their leashes and bring them back to our area to give them a treat. She said it lets them know that being pulled away from interaction with other dogs is just as rewarding as being let loose to play with them. 

However, it does seem to be my pup's only interest now. He doesn't want to be pulled back and treated anymore. He spent half the class time barking at the puppy next to him and not paying any attention to me. 

I will try training him the way you have suggested and see if he improves. Thank you for your advice.


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## ken k (Apr 3, 2006)

pink_lemur13 said:


> On that note, has anyone ever experienced negativity from other people while training their shepherd? Has anyone ever accused you of being "cruel" when you were training?


yes, my teaching`s are the same as the military, we "jerk towards the negative", I used to get a lot of dirty looks, but if done correctly, no harm to the dog what so ever, neither mentaly or physically, if your dog is going on a nut at the end of class, then a down or sit stay is in order, my 2 cents if your instructor cant or has not advised you in this situation, i`d look for another trainer


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## Abby142 (Oct 16, 2012)

You might also want to try using a toy instead of treats occasionally. My girl has extreme ball drive, nothing makes her happier than playing with her ball. I have a special ball on a handle (chuck-it brand from petsmart) that I use for training. I keep it in my back pocket and pull it out during breaks in class or when the instructor is talking and we have little tug sessions. Nothing to crazy, just enough to keep her focus on me while we are not actively doing anything. The only problem I have ever had was in one class there was a dog that was getting incredibly distracted by seeing the ball in my pocket and whined the whole class. I made sure to stay around from that dog after that and we had no more issues. 

I feel your pain on the screaming though. My girl does it in the car whenever we get somewhere "fun". She just sits there and howls. I have gotten some pretty strange looks :crazy:


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## Rainer (Feb 15, 2012)

Abby142 said:


> I feel your pain on the screaming though. My girl does it in the car whenever we get somewhere "fun". She just sits there and howls. I have gotten some pretty strange looks :crazy:



HAHA yes! It sounds like he's being murdered in the car


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

At some point when you get a strong recall you can let your dog play with other dogs recall him treat and let him go back, but until you get to that point where your relationship is super strong and he sees you as the most interesting and entertaining thing there is and you have that recall in place it is best to dial back his direct interaction with other dogs. Or you can stack the odds and play with him in a super exciting way then pair him up with a boring as **** dog like a fat low energy Bassett hound or something that isn't hard to compete with.

Building drive for food rewards and toy rewards and creating value for yourself and interactions with you in the eyes of the dog is where you should focus your dog training research. Once you can motivate the rest of it comes a lot easier. 

There are competing motivators with rewards and you just learned that if a dog finds more value in play with another dog than he does in a food reward he's going to blow off the food and go for the dog. That exercise was kind of like pulling a 5 year old kid away from a plate of chocolate but oh hey it's ok because here's a box of raisins as a consolation prize it's just as good and rewarding right!? Wrong. Like I said you're better off finding a new trainer because that one is clueless. That kind of exercise would maybe work with a hungry highly food motivated dog, but less likely to work on high play motivated breeds like sheps.

Gsds especially as they become older tend to be more toy and play motivated than food motivated. You can tilt the balance of course by doing things like offering steak instead of kibble or by not feeding the dog for a few days to make the dog value the food more, but it is best to experiment and find what your dog prefers or to take measures to create value in toys or food.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Google Michael Ellis, Ivan balabanov, or Susan Garett. Look into some of their systems. I'm sure some of the people on here could suggest others as well. They are very good at what they do and also very good at teaching it.


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## Harry and Lola (Oct 26, 2013)

Some shepherds are real 'talkers'. My male is a talker, right from when we got him at 8 weeks he would always make a 'sigh' sound and then he discovered the screaming/howling noise - joy!

He still to this day at 2 1/2 is a screamer, such as in the car going to the park, but not if we are just going up the road or anywhere else, he also screams when he is rough housing with my GSD bitch and there have been a couple of occasions when he has clearly been upset (his best friend GSD male 3 years older than him got into a fight and my son tells me he howled once when I left with my GSD bitch).

We just accept it as his personalty and we too have gotten strange looks, my husband and I just laugh and explain he likes to talk.

Congratulations on getting a 'talker'


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## Apple (Jun 21, 2013)

River is 6 months old and talks. And talks. And talks. In the morning, when I let her our of her crate and she comes for a cuddle and a pat she whining and howling as if lamenting that she was in her crate until now. When she's waiting for food in a sit stay she whines, yesterday with our tether training she grumbled at me then rolled onto her back, wanting a tummy rub. She whines and howls when we get to the vets, when my other half gets home, when people visit. She is a talker. Lol

River was doing terribly on her leash and collar for a while, but I didn't swap out what I was using for something different. A harness can be worse for pulling dogs, as a lot of the time it goes across their chest allowing for them to really dig in and pull against it. Before River got better on her walks to where I can say "slow it" and she comes back to loose leash, I used to pop her collar as the leash started to get tension, if she did t respond to that I'd just stop. Took me ages to get anywhere, but it paid off.  


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## pink_lemur13 (Nov 13, 2013)

Thank you, everyone, for your advice and relatable stories. My pup is slowly learning not to pull on his leash, and his screaming has completely stopped now that I redirect his attention with a toy. Walks are much more enjoyable now, though my new problem is other people not keeping their dogs on leashes in my neighborhood. Then they want to get all scared like my dog may be aggressive when theirs is the one that just comes right up to him, ignoring their recall commands. I have turned around and walked away from so many people because of this. There is a leash law in my town, and I just want to scream at them to get their dogs on leashes when I see them. The funny thing is, most of them have a leash in their hands, but they aren't using it.


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## Apple (Jun 21, 2013)

I asked my trainer regarding this problem, as its a situation I can't really control, her biggest suggestion, generally you have treats with you on walks. She said, grab a handful, and just throw it at the other dog or in its path, and then walk away. Like a magicians "POOF" but with food  lol


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## ken k (Apr 3, 2006)

screaming GSD puppy?, naw, check out the screaming Afghan puppy, this episode of hers was not too bad this time, she has done this out in public a few times, and the GF has warned the neighbors, before she brought home the puppy about the screaming, you can hear her, with doors and windows closed all the way to the next house

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=jZ8X4g5hXpA


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## pink_lemur13 (Nov 13, 2013)

@Apple: that's an excellent idea! Thanks for the suggestion. I will try that next time, as I'm sure there's bound to be one. 

@ken k: Yes! My pup sounded just like that, but at a higher pitch and probably not as loud. It was crazy! Though, that Afghan definitely takes the cake hahaha.


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