# Another what breeder intro



## dimag333 (12 mo ago)

Hey y’all! Our last dog Reese left us in October and we are finally looking for a new doggy in the next few months. Reese was a love pup from a farm near us in Indiana, lived until 15, rot/shep mix.

I have been in 2 conversations with breeders, one in MN and Alta in mi.

both are great, the Mn breeder is working lines while everyone knows altas dogs.

I thought i had it figured out, but then I saw panda Shepard’s, and my world flipped upside down.

however I understand that sometimes dogs like this are bred for coat rather than temp.

what’s the stories with the pandas? We are leaning towards the a med drive girl from working lines early may.

I know there are many more variables choosing a pup (we have had many dogs) more curious about pandas and if they should be avoided

pic of Reese



steve


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## dimag333 (12 mo ago)

Reese was a super happy dog with a guilty face!


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Sorry for the loss of your Reese.
Looking for a new pup can be a daunting task, some breeders are really good at making themselves look good. 
There are no reputable breeders breeding Pandas, and half the ones that you see advertised aren't purebred. All known pandas trace back to one dog. 
Lewcinka's Franka Von Phenom (pedigreedatabase.com) 
Now there is a chance that Pandas born previous to Frankie were culled to save breeder reputation, and there is also a chance that the same genetic mutation that happened to produce her has happened again but no breeder has stepped up with DNA proof.
If you post a location and your goals for a dog you will get recommendations. But do your own research.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Breeding dogs is a fine art - a juggling act. A good knowledgeable breeder has many things to consider: structure and related health, character and related temperament while still maintaining the inherent abilities which were the blueprint of development and purpose of the breed as it was developed over 120 years ago! For a passionate breeder, this is a constant balancing act to keep all these factors in proportion - it is HARD to do!!!!! I look at dozens of pedigrees a week, analyzing combinations for character and temperament.....look at videos of dogs working, travel to events to watch them, watch training, talk to Europeans here at events and trials to learn about the dogs they own, they see as well as network with people in different parts of this country learning about dogs they see and observe regularly....Little is put into writing, it is all word of mouth - you cannot pick up a magazine or a book....I cannot "prove" that Judge A talked about how many pups from "superdog 1" were euthanized when x-rayed because of bad hips/elbows, that Judge B easily rolled up a sleeve and then lifted shirt to show scars from "superdog 2" handler aggression, that "wonderdog 3" was taken to and from a trial field in a muzzle - including onto podiums, etc. Having information helps a responsible breeder avoid or attempt to balance a breeding when these names show up...these examples are are all about well known, competitive dogs that are rife throughout modern working pedigrees. Setting up breedings is not just throw two dogs in a pen and cash out 4 months later. 


Any time an animal is bred for a singular characteristic, especially a MUTANT or freak one off, without regard to ANYTHING!!!!! else - you have a 110% caca shoot for temperament and health. Any "breeder" - in the very loosest sense of the word! - who breeds for "rare color" -Panda, blue, liver -and to some extent, white- is not ethical. If you want a tricolor dog - get an Aussie or a Berner, if your only desire is for straight back and a giant sized dogs - get a Great Dane! Heck you can even get blue and brindles there! A real trifecta for the person looking for something "rare" and "different"...Don't go to a breeder who ignores what the breed is supposed to be.

Pandas are just the latest get rich quick variation that commercial and "backyard" breeders have embraced.....No - do not get a Panda. 

Lee


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## dimag333 (12 mo ago)

Yeah I though that the panda thing was a big stay away from, particularly since what we are looking for as a family is med drive working line dog. Gonna roll with my folks at Hansen, they have great referrals and Denise has been awesome. Glad I didn’t run out and just grab a Mali like I was gonna!

steve


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## Buckelke (Sep 4, 2019)

Welcome Steve. Thanks for the pic of Reese, I am one of those who sees the grace of age in their faces when they gray. He looks like he was One of The Great Ones and I'm sorry for your loss.
I can't help much with your search but I would advise you go for a dog that meets your needs without regard to appearance. All our dogs are or have been from shelters so I would suggest you check in your area. What you find may pleasantly surprise you. Sadly now, people who ran out and bought Covid dogs are now returning to work and the poor dogs are being dumped in shelters through no fault of their own. Just a reminder and suggestion.


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## Buckelke (Sep 4, 2019)

I just checked two of my local shelter and posted 3 beautiful dogs that need homes. They are showing in the rescue info section:








Non-Urgent GSD Rescue & Adoption


(Pure Bred GSD postings only)




www.germanshepherds.com


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## dimag333 (12 mo ago)

Been checking around me actually, have to be careful with young kids.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Sometimes it is best to get another dog that does not resemble the first as a panda might, especially if the loss is recent. I am sorry for your loss. Working line or show it just depends on what you are looking for in a pup/in a dog really, because puppies do grow up. I am not a fan of breeding dogs for rare colors or uniqueness.


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## dimag333 (12 mo ago)

Appreciate all the responses, I was looking for confirmation on my thoughts and you all have confirmed 

steve


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I would look a bit further at litters.....while the info is a bit outdated on the one website - based on it, I would look farther afield. And if you have young children and no GSD experience, I would also recommend a European showline dog over a working line.....NOT that WL cannot be good with kids - alot of my pups, and progeny of mine are in homes with babies,toddlers and youngster........but that is not as easy to come by as commercial breeders want you to think....my lines are a bit less "high profile" and go back differently than the most common sport dog lines.....I don't think you will have good odds for what you want with a Euro WL from most litters.

Lee


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## rotdocpa1 (Mar 19, 2018)

I second the above suggestion and rec considering some of the showlines. At my office I have seen some super sweet long coats also from the German showlines. I have only had a few litters(workingline) and many of them are in homes with children or grandchildren but perhaps I have been lucky as the owners have been thrilled. However I have seen some very serious aggression and nerve issues in some of the dogs I have trained with. It is also important to evaluate the pups carefully. As an example my first litter all but one are very social but there is one that is quite serious-he is currently in the police and that is a suitable fit. Tread carefully.


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## dimag333 (12 mo ago)

I ended up with the working line breeder from originally inquiring about a Belgian or Dutch. From there I have found my way to a med drive working dog. I have plenty of time on my hands to work with her and my wife is great also at training dogs. This would be our fourth as a married couple.

a reputable breeder with many working lines pups in houses that limits her breeding and only does one litter at a time makes puts me in a comfortable place risk temp wise.

I have owned a gsd mix, Reese was borderline high drive from what I have gathered. The only thing holding me back from a dog at Alta from Julie is the hair length, and still getting wife on board lol


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## Leah00 (12 mo ago)

I can’t be of any help to you since I’m new to Shepherds but I wanted to say that I used to have a rottie/shepherd mix named Reese too!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Since you want a Working line and are near MI, I would suggest looking at Wildhaus and Auf der Marquis. I know dogs from both breeders. Wildhaus has a confirmed breeding due in a month. Auf der Marquis has a 3-4 week old litter now.


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## Joelucy (Dec 28, 2021)

Searching internet seems to be a waste of time because breeders do not include their addresses. I recently wrote to the two recommended breeders weeks have passed no reply. Carol Hudson was associated with Engle watcher she was locate in central CT.
She isn’t active since 2011 my black shepherd just passed and ready to purchase another. I have owned four Shepard’s my only regret is their life expectancy. I stoped using premium dog food and cooked my dogs meals with meat and selected produce. Looking for a black German Shepherd breeder within 150 miles of north granby CT…Recommendations are welcome..


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## gsdsteve (Apr 24, 2010)

Joelucy said:


> Searching internet seems to be a waste of time because breeders do not include their addresses. I recently wrote to the two recommended breeders weeks have passed no reply. Carol Hudson was associated with Engle watcher she was locate in central CT.
> She isn’t active since 2011 my black shepherd just passed and ready to purchase another. I have owned four Shepard’s my only regret is their life expectancy. I stoped using premium dog food and cooked my dogs meals with meat and selected produce. Looking for a black German Shepherd breeder within 150 miles of north granby CT…Recommendations are welcome..


Did you check the PM I sent you?


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