# Agression towards small dogs.... really bad.



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

We adopted Hannah on Friday, and were told she had agression issues towards other dogs... I have introduced her to other GSD and she growled a little bit, but never jumped or went nutso...the other GSD just stood there or sniffed. 
Today she went to the groomer and the groomer even let her run loose with the other GSD. No problems...

Back at home she went bonkers towards the shitzu neighbor dog, knocking me down and scaring the crap out of my neighbor. The shitzu broke her collar and wouldn't get out of Hannah's space. By the end the owner picked up the shitzu and I did manage to get hannah to sit with praise while the other dog was still in site...

the other neighbor comes over with his small dog and hannah went bonkers again...jumping, lunging, growling, barking etc.... I walked her by, and she was still barking... this other dog was not on a leash so when i did calm hannah down, the other dog would come in her space.

What do I do?
Will she always be agressive? I am trying to walk by and reward her for her settling down... how long do you think this will take? 

Any suggestions? I am worried... our cat does not come out hiding because of hannah, and I am a little worried about that as well, but I think it will pass.... 

Is this normal and what do I do?


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

You need to get with a behaviorist or qualified trainer that will help you with this issue. Did the rescue/shelter have anyone they could recommend?
If you post your general location, some on here may know of a good one to help you get thru this. Otherwise, my suggestion would be to get the book Control Unleashed it is for reactive dogs and really helpful, but you do need to have someone with a dog that is not reactive to help you and Hannah get thru this. Positive re-enforcement and clicker training works much better in this type situation than corrections. I would go with a trainer that practices these methods only, for this kind of behavior.


----------



## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

I'd also go to a trainer and have some private lessons to work on this... Cause the dog generally gets along with other dogs, may just be a training issue, and you can teach her to do better.

Really wouldn't waste any time figuring it out yourself at this point, the time wasted may get some silly puppy injured. I've found the best time to teach 'new' rules is when a 'new' dog enters the home. So getting good instruction right away should help alot.


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

I am in Greencastle PA, right on the border of Maryland, near Hagerstown. I would be up for any help in pointing me in the right direction! 

the shelter suggested a school, but they use negative reinforcement....  Like spraying water in their face etc... I don't like that idea...but is that the way I should be going?

Note: The dog is awesome with my kids and other adults...it's just dogs...


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

You can practice NILIF(nothing in life is free~google it) but no compulsion right now,she needs to bond with and trust you. If you go to your profile, you can put your location in it. I'd start a thread in the looking for a trainer section on this issue. I did a search for your locale, you can decifer which may be best for the situation if you don't want to start a thread:
Greencastle PA, CPDT trainers - Google Search


----------



## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

Julz_e said:


> I have introduced her to other GSD and she growled a little bit, but never jumped or went nutso...the other GSD just stood there or sniffed.
> Today she went to the groomer and the groomer even let her run loose with the other GSD. No problems...
> 
> [..]
> ...


What I'm reading here is your new dog does fine with other dogs that are respectful of her space. 

She doesn't like little yappy dogs running around off leash and charging at her. It's an easy fix, don't let little dogs run around her. 

You can express this to your neighbors without being rude, simply say there's a pretty big size difference here and I'm worried your dog might get hurt. Let them form their own conclusions about what might happen. Hopefully they have a touch of common sense.

You also need to not tense up. Not saying you did at the second incident but not knowing your girl that well, after the first incident, I could see that happening. If she feels you're tense, she's tense. 

Think about how you could control the situation so your dog doesn't feel she has to.

My female is 8 1/2, she's not putting up with some little dog running around loose yapping at her. I don't blame her, don't like it myself. 

We have little black poodles across the street. When those things yap at her, she barks back. I know her very well and know she's fake lunging trying to scare them and they do back off but no doubt if one of them made a run for her ankle, she'd toss them. 

Interesting observation the black poodle owner scoops her dogs up and in they go when Morgan comes walking along. My male is young, exuberant and just barely able to control himself. He doesn't bark at the poodles so I ALWAYS have to remind the poodle people to please please please keep them back becuase I don't know he's going to do.


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

thanks...I wasn't even sure what to look for in a trainer... I will call Good Dog school tom. morning first thing... they have one on one sessions... I need to know what to do.. I don't feel comfortable if she will be like this forever...but if it can be fixed...which i feel like it could be then i will be more relaxed.


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

Thank you Jenn, it's good to know that there is hope. I was really getting worried after the second one today, but in the back of my head I feel like Hannah is such a good dog otherwise that this has to be something that we can fix...your post is postive and makes me feel like we are not the only ones that don't like the yappy dogs.  I will post an update as soon as I get one. We love her to death.....I work from home, so she has been with me constantly, and I really don't know what I would do if there was no hope for her. I scare my self, because I am not worried at all that she would harm me... which is kinda dumb... but she follows me everywhere and has really bonded in the short time we have been together... I want to help her... Fingers crossed!


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

Well after calling Good Dog, they told me to give the dog back! Without even evaulating her...I was not happy, nor will I ever reccomend them to anyone! So I called another trainer that my friend had reccomended: Home

Mike has worked with police dogs for quite some time,and knew right away that we had to figure out what kind of agresssion Hannah has...prey, fear, etc... We have our first session that is 1 1/2 hours long on Monday! I can't wait. He thinks that Hannah can learn some confidence so that she won't freak out. I am so excited!!!


----------



## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

Julz_e said:


> Thank you Jenn, it's good to know that there is hope. I was really getting worried after the second one today, but in the back of my head I feel like Hannah is such a good dog otherwise that this has to be something that we can fix...your post is postive and makes me feel like we are not the only ones that don't like the yappy dogs.  I will post an update as soon as I get one. We love her to death.....I work from home, so she has been with me constantly, and I really don't know what I would do if there was no hope for her. I scare my self, because I am not worried at all that she would harm me... which is kinda dumb... but she follows me everywhere and has really bonded in the short time we have been together... I want to help her... Fingers crossed!


It really sounds like this can be fixed with some great classes and managing the meetings while you are working out the issues. Most of our dogs don't like the overwhelming puppy greetings OR the 'rude' meetings that some dogs that haven't learned their manners may do, but we can ask that our dogs at least put up with it and act 'polite' while we figure out how to manage the situation and make it acceptable. Just cause my dogs don't like a dog, they know I WON'T put up with them taking that dog down. My rules take over and they have to hold on while I make things better.

I got the skills to do this thru TONS of meetings with TONS of dogs, and dog classes are a great place to start cause they are a somewhat controlled environment. Specially if I'm able to meet with and have the instructor and I come up with 'a plan' on how to proceed.


----------



## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

Hannah is still a puppy, your other thread says she's 1 or 2. In this picture from your other thread, she still looks very puppy, looks to me like she's younger than my 22 month old male.










I'm still dealing with training issues with my Otto, refining his behavior and perfecting the dog I know he can grow up to be. Hannah just came to you, she's still figuring out what you expect from her behavior-wise.

Definitely read up on how to be an effective leader for her. Firm but loving, kind but in control. You've got a wonderful opportunity to get right in her head about how to be a good dog. Whoever had her lost her in the parking lot of a walmart so that right there says they probably didn't do everything right with her as a baby... 

She's young, she's not an adult yet so you've got plenty of time to make her the perfect dog you want! She already does well with your family and has bonded with you quickly. All great skills to build up. Good luck with her, still think she's gorgeous.


----------



## Karin (Jan 4, 2008)

Wow, she's beautiful! She looks like my Heidi's twin!

Heidi was very dog reactive too when we first got her. She would lunge and growl at dogs of any size when we went on walks. One time, she tangled my legs in the leash, causing me to fall really hard on a cement sidewalk because she was trying to get to some little dogs. After we had her for three months, we thought we'd made a huge mistake by adopting her.

But by that time it was too late, because we were so attached to her... What really helped her was a reactive dog class, private sessions with the behaviorist who taught the class, and us learning how to handle Heidi and be in more of a leadership role. She still doesn't like it when dogs get in her face (especially while she's on leash), but she is SOOOO much improved. Now we can go for walks and I just have to say "Yes" and she'll look up at me (because she knows she'll get a tasty treat) instead of focusing on the dog. And she can be around other dogs in daycare with no problems. She does much better with other dogs when we're not around for some reason.

So, hang in there. It will take some time and effort, but this can be managed. Just remember that it takes a while for you to see her total personality. It took about three months for the "true Heidi" to come out. So, make sure you establish yourselves as the leaders right away (not in a harsh way, but a firm, fair way) and keep a close watch over her for those first months so she doesn't have too much freedom to get into trouble.

Good luck! It's not easy having a reactive dog, but there are a lot of really knowledgeable people on this site who have gone through similar issues with their dogs. This forum is one of the biggest assets that we had in dealing with Heidi's issues. People sharing their experiences, advice, and support helped us immensely.


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Julz - have faith! A good behaviorist/trainer should be ablw to help you get your dog at least to tolerate other dogs, if not like them!


----------



## DensterNY (Feb 1, 2010)

Good feedback and insight on this post. I've been working on this same situation with my Heidi (9 months old) who can be reactive with strange dogs and I was perplexed by why she snapped in two separate incidences where dogs approached. 

However, reading SunCzarina's post I realized that my GSD was only responding naturally to having strange dogs charging up to her directly and they were also poodles to boot. The next time I see them and their overly excited dog I'll ask them not to approach - probably the best solution.


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

Update on Danika... we changed her name to Hannah, Danika didn't really roll of the tounge... We took her to the trainer yesterday. She has fear aggression. We started the desensitizing training and I saw huge results yesterday alone! He told me she was ready for regular class, and that will help as well since she will have to socialize. She starts April 10th in the next class. Mike the trainer had lots of great information and I think we are going to have him come to the house for more training... he suggested giving her a SPOT to go to when I am answering the door... etc... He is really big on not having a rude dog. Which ...I don't want to have. I am so excited. I fell like I can now train her and make progress... I am so happy! We will continue to use Mike for quite some time... there are several levels to his classes. I would highly reccomend him to anyone in the PA/MD/WV line... awesome trainer... The Good Dog training told me to give Hannah back to the shleter... I was not happy with them at all.. this was before even meeting Hannah. I wanted them to evaulate her... Not a great place in my opnion. 

The trainer agreed...she is not 2, he said more like 15 months tops...she is severerly underweight and he suggested evo? So I need to go get her some of that. I had to drop her off yesterday to the Humane Soc. for her spaying....only to call today to check and see how she was doing and they told me once they shaved her they realized she was already spayed...so I got to bring her home today, vs tomorrow.


----------



## GSDSunshine (Sep 7, 2009)

Yay!!! Good luck with sweet Hannah! This new guy sounds like he knows what he is doing. She is so lucky to have you.


----------



## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

> Update on Danika... we changed her name to Hannah, Danika didn't really roll of the tounge... We took her to the trainer yesterday. She has fear aggression. We started the desensitizing training and I saw huge results yesterday alone! He told me she was ready for regular class, and that will help as well since she will have to socialize. She starts April 10th in the next class. Mike the trainer had lots of great information and I think we are going to have him come to the house for more training... he suggested giving her a SPOT to go to when I am answering the door... etc... He is really big on not having a rude dog. Which ...I don't want to have. I am so excited. I fell like I can now train her and make progress... I am so happy! We will continue to use Mike for quite some time... there are several levels to his classes. I would highly reccomend him to anyone in the PA/MD/WV line... awesome trainer... The Good Dog training told me to give Hannah back to the shleter... I was not happy with them at all.. this was before even meeting Hannah. I wanted them to evaulate her... Not a great place in my opnion.


WHOOHOO and GOOD FOR YOU!!! 

Immediately being proactive on this and finding someone who seems like he will be a great help with this is amazing! Keep up the good work, take the training classes forever if you need to...

And keep us updated! :wild:


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

I plan on taking this class plus advance, and possibly moving on from there... I know we are going to have Mike come out to the house to help too... I just think it's awesome to have someone show you how to do things effectively. 

I have a feeling we will have a small agility course out back before summer is over!

Here is our trainers info, incase anyone else is in the area and needs him: http://www.greystonekennel.com/index.html


----------



## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

That's awesome! Glad you found a great trainer! Also glad Hannah is doing so well with your kids!

I can't believe the other school told you to take the dog back to the shelter. What kind of 'd up thinking is that??


----------



## chickastang (Mar 26, 2010)

*SAME problem!!!*

That is so great you found a good trainer! I am having the EXACT same issue with my Shepherd and I am going to call the place you recommended. He is almost 2 years old and we got him as a puppy. I did not realize how bad his aggression is towards little dogs until we start dog sitting a Schnauzer (sp?) puppy! He will not stop snapping at her and it has gotten to the point that we have to kepe them completely separated. We have a Lab too and the Lab is fine with the Schnauzer. I want to be able to take Bo (our GS) anywhere we go and that is not possible with how he is with other dogs.

Can you give me any advice on the Greystone place you recommended in Greencastle?

Thanks! 

Laurie


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

Mike at Greystone is awesome! He can even come to your home, we can't say enough about him. Give him a call!!


----------



## 679622 (Apr 8, 2010)

I know how you feel, I can't even take my gsd to the dog park anymore, the last time we went he went after a little puppy. I hope you find a good trainer ..


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

679622 said:


> I know how you feel, I can't even take my gsd to the dog park anymore, the last time we went he went after a little puppy. I hope you find a good trainer ..


In this area, Northern CA, I can not take Baron (our 2+ yo male GSD), because he is not neutered and cannot go to most parks after 6 months old.


----------



## Julz_e (Mar 13, 2010)

*update: week 4 of training*

and we are weaving in and out of other dogs. We had to upgrade to a pronge collar, but we are making progress!


----------

