# Are all GSD's dog aggressive??



## whisperwill

As I read more and more about the aggression in German Shepherds I am getting really concerned. I have dealt with strong breeds before and have never had an issue of dog aggression (ssa or any other). My biggest concern is that Whisper is a female, and we already had 2 females (12yr old lab and almost 2 yr old schnauzer). I see all these posts about agression, but how many of you have GSD's that AREN"T aggressive? Is this something I am going to HAVE to face. Or will she normally be ok as long as she is socialized and handled correctly?

Just to say I KNOW they aren't ALL dog agressive. Just curious as to how many of yours are compared to not... does that make any sense?


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## gsdraven

No, they aren't all. There are so many factors that can play into having a dog that is dog aggressive: genetics, experience, training etc. Since I foster I take great care to make sure that my dogs don't have negative experiences with other dogs and at the very least are neutral.

Raven is completely neutral to other dogs... she is neither friendly or aggressive, she just plain doesn't care unless they get in her face. 

Kaiser is dog friendly but he is also still young. He likes to play with other dogs and is interested in checking them out when we see them. He is also incredibly patient with bad behavior.


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## LaRen616

My GSD is most definitly not dog aggressive. He has alot of doggy friends ranging from small breeds like Min Pins, Pugs and Bulldogs to large breeds like Rottweilers, Dobermans and my mom's GSD/Husky mix. His absolute best friend is a male Doberman and his girlfriend is a female Doberman. 

I would be cautious with the 3 females you have in your house, they say female/female aggression is the worst. "Males fight for breeding rights and females fight for breathing rights" fights between females tend to be more severe and they dont forgive and forget. (That's what I have heard, I have not experienced multiple females before). If your females ever do fight, then you want to crate and rotate them so they cant get to each other.


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## DJEtzel

My GSD is not dog aggressive, but will tell another young male dog off. If I left him to it it's possible he would start or end a fight between males around his age, but I keep up on his obedience so that he doesn't have that option. 

Usually GSDs that are selectively aggressive are with dogs of similar size, gender, and age. I don't know a lot of GSDs that are completely dog aggressive with everyone.


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## Mrs.K

Nope not all of them are. 

Mine with the two new fosters:










Mine with the great dane









With the Dachshund


















See, not all are dog aggressive.


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## MountainGSDs

whisperwill said:


> As I read more and more about the aggression in German Shepherds I am getting really concerned.


Drive and aggression are different. GSDs are not by nature aggressive. If your dog has drive and solid nerves training and socialization will make him a good citizen and easy to travel with.


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## Mrs.K

MountainGSDs said:


> Drive and aggression are different. GSDs are not by nature aggressive. If your dog has drive and solid nerves training and socialization will make him a good citizen and easy to travel with.


Every dog has natural aggression in them. It's dangerous to say that they are not, by nature, aggressive.


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## Backwoodz_ACO

Any dog, not just GSD's, can be aggressive if they are not properly socialized at a young age. There are different types of aggression and 9 times out of 10 the word "agressive" is taken out of context and misued. Especially with GSD's due to their size and protective instincts. Always remember to socialize your GSD and praise him for good behavior around people and other pets. 

I have heard several times from different people that think that if they allow their dog to socialize with lots of different people then their dog would not protect them or their property from danger. I can tell you from experience that this is not true. GSD's are loyal and they will protect their owner and their territory with their life.


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## Kayos and Havoc

Mrs K, humans have aggression in them too but that does not make us aggressive by nature. 

I would agree that my dogs are not aggressive by nature, however, they are protective and will act with aggression if threatened. 

Kayos is not real happy about other dogs that are out control and acting out in her space. havoc really does not care as much. I would not label that dog aggression at all.


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## WVGSD

Are your three girls spayed or going to be spayed? I have had pretty severe fights between my females and two of my males just posture (raised hackles and grumbles), but no fights. My females are much easier to live with in a pack setting once they have been spayed. 

I have seven personal dogs and two foster dogs currently (four males and five females). One male is my GSD and the others are several different breeds. At this time I have one intact female non-GSD that I still show in AKC competition and will breed one more time. She is the worst for fights now and she is usually combined with one or more of the males for company since she is challenged with the girls. Once she is spayed, I expect that she will be able to spend time with all of the other dogs.


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## whisperwill

WVGSD said:


> Are your three girls spayed or going to be spayed?


 
Both of my girls are spayed and this one will be to as soon as it is appropriate. After one litter of lab pups we had years ago I don't EVER wanna do that again!! My chocolate lab is old, and as much as I'd like to hope otherwise, I know we won't have her for too much longer. My schnauzer is younger. She's still young enough to play with the puppy, but smart enough to know when she is out done. She will be the first to roll on her back and admit she's outmanned. I am hoping that will help.


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## MountainGSDs

Mrs.K said:


> Every dog has natural aggression in them. It's dangerous to say that they are not, by nature, aggressive.


 
Drive or aggression. I associate aggression with weak nerves.


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## GSDAlphaMom

Five in my pack, 3 females (2 in tact) and 2 males (in tact), one being a puppy. All gsd's. Mine get along very well and I've never had any fighting. Hoping that holds true when the male puppy reaches maturity. 

My girls get along great (not the case with all bitches). I am very selective on temperament/attitude when I get my puppies, not that that guarantees anything but so far I've been very fortunate with the dogs I've acquired.


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## codmaster

MountainGSDs said:


> Drive or aggression. I associate aggression with weak nerves.


 
then, I used to know a couple of military K9's that must have had incredibly weak nerves.


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## bellamia

mine is not agressive! shes a sweet gentle gaint. i have gsd play dates with 4 other gsds 4 times a week and ALL of them are big sweet but alert fools!


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## rjvamp

Some interesting reading:

ASPCA | Position Statement on Breed-Specific Legislation <--- talks about aggression


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## Mrs.K

> Are your three girls spayed or going to be spayed? I have had pretty severe fights between my females and two of my males just posture (raised hackles and grumbles), but no fights. My females are much easier to live with in a pack setting once they have been spayed.


I've had it the other way around. Once my bitch was spayed she became so aggressive that she was barely handable (is that even a word?).


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## BlackJack

My wife was attacked by off leash pit/mix while walking Molly when she was about 6 month old. Since then Molly has been dog aggressive when the wife walks her, though with me walking her and the wife not around, she will typically ignore other dogs. She does fine around puppies and cats though.


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## doggiedad

train, train, train, and socialize, socialize, socialize.


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## doggiedad

handable, when speaking about dogs it's relevant.



Mrs.K said:


> I've had it the other way around. Once my bitch was spayed she became so aggressive that she was barely
> 
> handable (is that even a word?).


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## Mrs.K

doggiedad said:


> train, train, train, and socialize, socialize, socialize.


Not only that, if you own multiple dogs, make a wise choice which dogs you walk together. Some dogs would be the perfect, well mannered dogs in the world but if they are walked with another dog that is a tiny little bit reactive, they work each other up and all of a sudden you have two dogs on your hands that happily react towards anything that has four legs.


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## Whiteshepherds

whisperwill said:


> but how many of you have GSD's that AREN"T aggressive? Is this something I am going to HAVE to face. Or will she normally be ok as long as she is socialized and handled correctly?


We have two (male and female) and no issues with aggression. Did you get to meet the sire and dam...how were their temperaments?


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## MountainGSDs

codmaster said:


> then, I used to know a couple of military K9's that must have had incredibly weak nerves.


I really don't know a whole lot about MWD but I have a neighbor that brought his MWD home and I was not impressed. very different then police K9s that I have been fortunate enough to work around. The buyers I know look for high drive and solid nerves. Once trained it would they would not attack unprovoked without a direct command from the handler.


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## Freestep

My bitches have always gotten along with each other and other dogs, for the most part. I once had a bitch that attacked my spayed female when she was in heat, but once spayed, the aggression did not recur.

Many GSDs pups are reactive to other dogs. It's a phase you have to work them through. Socialize, go to puppy classes, socialize, train, socialize, and keep your pup out of situations where they may be threatened or attacked by other dogs.


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## codmaster

MountainGSDs said:


> I really don't know a whole lot about MWD but I have a neighbor that brought his MWD home and I was not impressed. very different then police K9s that I have been fortunate enough to work around. The buyers I know look for high drive and solid nerves. Once trained it would they would not attack unprovoked without a direct command from the handler.


Actually these were Vietnam era "Patrol" dogs - the very embodiement of a 1 man dog. VERY AGGRESSIVE dogs to everyone else! Took a good while to switch handlers when they rotated!

And at the same time a VERY SOLID temperament - just trained that way!

Aggression doesn't necessarilly mean a weak nerved dog. Depends on the type of aggression!

To the OP - if you get a good bred dog and raise them properly you will have a well socialised dog that you should be able to take most anywhere.

Depends a little on your definition of aggression - any ScH dog can be aggressive if by aggression you refer to biting someone, BUT many of those same dogs are real gentle and friendly dogs away from the field!

A GSD is not supposed to be a Golden Retriever type temperamented dog, after all.


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## MountainGSDs

codmaster said:


> Aggression doesn't necessarilly mean a weak nerved dog. Depends on the type of aggression!


I guess it's a matter of semantics. To me any aggression that is unprovoked would be aggression or when not on the field or working other wise you would have an unreliable dog.

I doubt the MWDs are selected like many police working dogs. I have a friend that is a buyer and will travel to Europe to evaluate and buy dogs, May evaluate 50 dogs to bring back 4 or 5 and then a couple of those still may not make it.

We are probably on the same wave length.


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## PaddyD

Mine is totally not aggressive. She is very selective about who she is friendly with. She finds small dogs interesting and is generally shy or neutral towards other dogs. If she finds a dog with a temperament similar to hers she is very playful. She is like a lot of people who lack confidence: happy to find someone that is completely non-threatening.


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## whisperwill

Whiteshepherds said:


> Did you get to meet the sire and dam...how were their temperaments?


 I did get to meet both of them, along with another pair of GSD's (male and female) that she had. They were really great. The Mom was not overly gushy friendly, but the Dad was a big ole teddy bear. They all seemed to get along really well. She said the only time they will have skirmishes is if the females are in heat. Which I would assume to be normal.


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## cliffson1

The breed has a certain amount of aggression built in. Part of the test that was instituted from the beginning to determine if the dog has acceptable temperament requires the dog to show controlled aggression against man. Fact. Now having said that, dog aggression outside of normal issues (like over food, or over sex, or over pack leadership) is often the result of lack of socialization, lack of training(which instills pack submission) and unfortunately today, insecurities from weak nerves and genetics. If your dog is very sound in nerves,(not skittish and always hackling up at something new),and you provide the training and socialization, you should be in pretty good shape.


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## Melgrj7

Nash is not dog aggressive, but he is selective who he will be friends with. He also cannot handle a group of off leash dogs, it sends his herder nerder brain into overdrive and he tries to make everyone settle down, which can start fights as it pisses off the other dogs (understandably). He can and does play one on one with dogs he likes (and who like him) and certainly doesn't go out of his way to attack or go after another dog. He will fight though in some circumstances.


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## gagsd

MountainGSDs said:


> Drive or aggression. I associate aggression with weak nerves.


What a very odd statement.


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## MountainGSDs

gagsd said:


> What a very odd statement.


I guess you could use different terms which over the last 40 years that I've been around the breed have changed. 
Unprovoked or out of control aggression I would associate with weak nerves or fear. 

Why odd? I am always willing to learn something new.


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## gagsd

Aggression is good. A German Shepherd without aggression is like a Labrador who can't swim.

Fearful dogs who react aggressively.... not good.


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## whisperwill

gagsd said:


> Aggression is good. A German Shepherd without aggression is like a Labrador who can't swim.
> 
> Fearful dogs who react aggressively.... not good.


 Let me clarify my statement... I don't want a GSD who is going to be aggressive to people... period. She needs to be able to trust that if I let someone in the house they are allowed to be there. I don't want her to fight with my other dogs, and I work really hard to make sure that everyone in my house plays nicely and behaves appropriately. Now if a stranger barges in my house... by ALL means please be aggressive. It is no more than I expect from my other dogs, and even the schnauzer delivers. 

Luckily, at this point in time she seems very stable as far as temperment. Doesn't get scared easily at all. We are working hard to build her confidence and socialize her EVERY day with kids, dogs, adults, etc. 

As far as your lab statement. How said would it be that NEITHER one of my labs would swim? Play in the sprinklers? HECK YEAH!! But not swim!!:laugh:


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## gagsd

To the OP, no, not all GSDs are "aggressive." 

There are many breeders who breed very friendly, social dogs without an aggressive bone in their bodies. 

There are breeders who breed very stable dogs, that have differing levels of aggression, and it might take more to set them off.

There are breeders who breed nervy/shy/fearful dogs with aggression.... that is a nightmare.

And there are some dogs bred that are known for strong aggression-- that are good dogs-- just not suitable for the average home.

Dog aggression can be an issue. Most DA is caused by insecurity (whether genetics or leadership). Very few dogs are aggressive through dominance. It can be a problem, and is very upseting to the owner. Paying close attention to the temperament of the mother (and father if possible) helps. Buying from a breeder who knows there lines and what they produce is even better.


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## cliffson1

Sounds like less than stellar nerves to me.....a dog is what it is not what you think it should be...you can train new behavoirs, but inherent characteristics are not going to change. I don't understand the fuss unless she is exhibiting unwarranted aggression and if so I think people have identified the sources in previous posts.


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## Whiteshepherds

I think most pet owners not involved with breeding or Sch (or other protection work) and people that haven't had a lot of experience with GSD's hear the word aggression and *we think of a mean dog that can't be controlled, bites for no reason, attacks without provocation.* But when people like Cliff and others say the breed should have some aggression that's not what they're referring to. 

Can someone with experience and knowledge about the subject maybe give a few examples of the type of aggression we want to see in the breed and how it presents itself differently than the aggression none of us want? (see bold above)


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## MountainGSDs

gagsd said:


> Aggression is good. A German Shepherd without aggression is like a Labrador who can't swim.
> 
> Fearful dogs who react aggressively.... not good.


I agree sort of. The difference in our description is semantics. If you tell a lay person GSDs should be aggressive they get the wrong impression. I prefer to call it drive and confidence.


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## gagsd

And I prefer to call it what it is.... a rose by any other name......


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## MountainGSDs

gagsd said:


> And I prefer to call it what it is.... a rose by any other name......


If you look up aggression in almost any dictionary it will almost always say unprovoked. Not a big deal but when dealing with the general public, words have meaning. I went through the years when GSDs were the Pit Bull of the dog world. Then it was Rotties and Dobbies and now it's the bully breeds.

Merriam-Webster
1
*:* a forceful action or procedure (as an unprovoked attack) especially when intended to dominate or master 
2
*:* the practice of making attacks or encroachments; _especially_ *:* unprovoked violation by one country of the territorial integrity of another 
3
*:* hostile, injurious, or destructive behavior or outlook especially when caused by frustration


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## whisperwill

cliffson1 said:


> Sounds like less than stellar nerves to me.....a dog is what it is not what you think it should be...you can train new behavoirs, but inherent characteristics are not going to change. I don't understand the fuss unless she is exhibiting unwarranted aggression and if so I think people have identified the sources in previous posts.




I have not had any issues with her whatsever. I was just doing some reading here and it seemed like alot of people were having problems with aggression (unprovoked human or dog) in one form or another, so I was curious how many DIDN"T have aggresion problems. 



In my last post I was just making a comment as to what "I" want in a dog, wether it be a GSD or a schnauzer or a lab. Granted, they will all have different breed related behaviors, but I still want a well behaved, socialized "DOG". 

I don't plan on her doing schutzand (sp?) or anything to that extent. I understand that those dogs are showing "aggression/drive". We are actually planning agility with her and the schnauzer.


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## gsdraven

whisperwill said:


> I was just doing some reading here and it seemed like alot of people were having problems with aggression (unprovoked human or dog) in one form or another, so I was curious how many DIDN"T have aggresion problems.


Here's the thing... most people complain or ask advice when they are having problems so the population on here might be skewed. There over 23,000 members on this site but only 1,000 threads in the aggression section and not all of which are true aggression problems. Hopefully that helps put things into perspective.


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## HeidiW

My Male Bo hates other dogs, I always keep him on leash and he barks loudly at them and fierce like he wants to kill them, so does my female Jack Russel Terrier. Both love people though. Also my female GSD pays no attention to other dogs much, so she acts normal around them and mostly ignores them.


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## PaddyD

IMHO, the word aggression has a very negative connotation. Once again IMHO I think that aggressiveness is much less negative because it borders on 'pushy' or extroverted. I think some aggressiveness is desirable in a GSD where aggression is not. Semantics can cause a lot of arguments.


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