# book to learn IPO tracking



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

I want to teach Blaze how to IPO track. Tracking is not necessarily worked on in the group I have been training with, although the TD said she has a good video I should watch, I do not know the name.

So in the meantime I was going to get a good tracking book.

I did some reading on the forum and bought the book 'Tracking Dog: Thoery and Methods' by Glen Johnson as suggested by some here. Upon receiving it flipped though it and it seems to be geared more towards akc style tracking- is this a correct assumption or am I missing something? I began to wonder if this was the right book to read and wondered if any of you have read it and does it apply to ipo tracking?

Other suggestions were Gary Patterson's 'Tracking: from the beginning' and also Gary Patterson's 'Training the Behavior'. 

I like that 'Training the behavior' encompasses all 3 phases of the sport and if this book details tracking as well as his 'Tracking: from the beginning' book than I would buy this one to gain more knowledge in all areas. Have any of you compared Patterson's 2 books I mentioned and have an opinion on which one would be better?

And then there are other books with good reviews and suggestions that I didn't even mention- like 'Schutzhund Top Working Dogs, Training Manual' by Dietmar Schellenberg, 'Schutzhund: Theory and Training Methods' by Susan Barwig and 'Advanced Schutzhund' by Ivan Balabanov.

The main thing I want the book for is tracking and if I can gain other knowledge at the same time- even better!

Knowing that what book would you suggest to me?


----------



## rgrey (Jul 30, 2013)

*raises hand* Can I ask a very, very dumb question? What does IPO stand for?


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Not dumb-

"What is IPO?IPO= Schutzhund. Due to political reasons, Germany no longer calls protection sport "Schutzhund" and since it originated in Germany, the rest of the world followed suit. 
What does IPO stand for? Internationale Prüfungs-Ordnung. 
Translation means: International auditing rules or International Exam Rules."


Schutzhund Training, Schutzhund Titling, German Shepherd Training


----------



## rgrey (Jul 30, 2013)

Love the link, thank you!


----------



## ayoitzrimz (Apr 14, 2010)

I like the Gary Patterson books (both training the behavior and his tracking book) but really there is no substitute to working with a good trainer 

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Gary Patterson's book Tracking:from the beginning, was pretty much what I started with along with some ideas out of other books in print at the time. Over the years I have figured things out on my own or picked up ideas from other people. To train for IPO tracking you really do need to have an understanding of what it should look like when finished too. Go to some trials, especially big events, and watch the dogs tracking. Then go back to the books and use them to help you figure out how to make your dog look like the dogs you saw in trials.  Yes, easier said than done. :rofl:


----------



## pfitzpa1 (Apr 26, 2011)

I trained my dog to track mostly (95%) using techniques from Glen Johnstons book. My dog trialled IPO-1 tracking a few months back and scored 91/100.

We were already past IPO-2 level tracking training at the time of the trial, mostly working 1200 meter tracks with 5 articles so the IPO-1 was easy for her.

Glenn Johnston does seem to like to track amazing distances in his book, 4,000 yard tracks are tough on a dog (stamina wise) I think, but according to his book, his dogs get to that distance fairly quickly.

The basics are the same but he does delve into AKC TD/TDX preparation quite a bit. I think AKC TD is fairly close to IPO-2 tracking.

While I continue to train IPO tracking I'm very interested in and would like to try AKC tracking some time.

I went to one local AKC tracking event and it was very well organized and the people were super nice.


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Thanks for the replies!



pfitzpa1 said:


> I trained my dog to track mostly (95%) using techniques from Glen Johnstons book. My dog trialled IPO-1 tracking a few months back and scored 91/100.


Nice work!! So you've successfully applied his methods to ipo style tracking. . .nice to know. Did you start using any food? 

In doing some more reading and searching I think I've concluded that with Patterson's books that most if not all of his info from Tracking from the beginning is in Training the behavior book so I was greatly leaning towards buying Training the behavior and was unsure at this point about returning Johnsons book.

Curious to know what word do you all use to tell the dog to track?


----------



## ayoitzrimz (Apr 14, 2010)

such (pronounced sooooch)


----------



## pfitzpa1 (Apr 26, 2011)

natalie559 said:


> Thanks for the replies!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes,  every few feet at start. My dog quickly learned to skip over the less interesting food drop in favor of the juicy treat at the article. 

I use, "go find it" 

I can't comment on the other books, but the way tracking is taught at our club is by trailing a can of wet cat food in a pantyhose behind the track layer, along with multiple food drops. The tracks are also laid in a sandy area where the layer (and dog) can easily see the steps. 
I started by myself from Johnsons book before seeing the club method and after observing a tracking session at the club, I decided to stay with the book. The club doesn't teach/discuss the importance of wind direction, humidity, track scent vs human scent and the differences in aging, track laying etc, all very important things to know when starting a dog tracking. I love all that stuff. 
In some cases you may have such a natural tracking dog that perhaps none of that matters much, but when you have to work with an unmotivated or problematic dog, all this stuff really makes a difference. 

My dog originally had very little interest in tracking, but now we regularly track 5 mornings a week, 500 to 1200 yd tracks and she really loves it. 





Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## pfitzpa1 (Apr 26, 2011)

BTW just to keep your excitement up  , here's a few (not very good quality) older videos of Maggies tracking work. 

The first is tracking on asphalt.






The second one is on a sandy field, with a transition from a plowed area to a hard packed area.


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Nice videos!! About how long after you started was she at that level- she looked good!


----------



## pfitzpa1 (Apr 26, 2011)

natalie559 said:


> Nice videos!! About how long after you started was she at that level- she looked good!



Maybe 8 months or so. 

One of the things about tracking I find is that sometimes you have to be willing to step back and do a bit of a reset. I was following the schedule in Glen Johnstons book and his pace of advancement (for distance) is really fast. Way too fast at least for me and my dog. After 10 weeks by his schedule the dogs should be running 700 yard tracks. Maybe if you have a real good tracking dog, are only doing tracking and then twice per day this is achievable, but for me it was way too fast. The result was that I rushed my dog into longer distances before she was ready and the result was sloppy/missed/overrun corners and generally lack of motivation because of too much pressure on her.

At about 6 -8 weeks in I realized I was going too fast and with the help of the Problem solving section of the book and a much slower methodical progress I was able to correct all the problems. I practically went back to square one.
Having a trainer would probably have saved me a lot of the hassle but in retrospect it was a great learning experience. I was able to figure out the issues, work on solutions and get my dog back onto the path of a happy tracker.


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Thanks for the tips- I appreciate them! I am going to do some delving into Johnsons book- I'm sure to be back with more questions


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

pfitzpa1 said:


> Yes, every few feet at start. My dog quickly learned to skip over the less interesting food drop in favor of the juicy treat at the article.


I started reading Johnson's book over the weekend, maybe to pg 80 or so. Much of what he says correlates to ipo tracking- pulling the harness, step tracking, keeping nose to ground always. Now I am only to the beginning of the training program outlined, but so far he uses no food, just a motivation in finding the article. Now you said you used food. Why did you decide to use it if he didn't refer to it at all in the book? You say you use a yummy food reward at the article- why did you decide to do this and does the book speak of it?

One thing he says that I think is incorrect for the current ipo rules is that the dog can indicate the article however it pleases- looking at it, grabbing it, etc. In things I've read the dog should indicate the article by laying down with it between the front paws. Is that the ipo rules for article indication- that it should be indicated with a down between paws? If so and you trained using his methods how did you teach your dog to indicate the correct way?

Also he uses a handler and track layer- says this is much preferred but that if no other choice you may lay the track yourself. Did you do all the track laying by yourself?

And I see what you mean about the quick advancement- he has you do 3 tracks 3 times a day and by the end of week 1 it is like 400 yrds long (or something long like that I dont have the book in front of me at the moment). So you stated you shortened the length for your dog, that it was too long too soon, but did you start with 3 tracks 3 times a day? To me that seems like a lot- where does one find the time. . . 

Thanks for the info, really interested in learning how the books methods were implemented by anyone that's used them for ipo tracking. Johnson seems very good at what he did, saying 100% of dogs using his system would pass a TD within a month or so.


----------



## pfitzpa1 (Apr 26, 2011)

natalie559 said:


> I started reading Johnson's book over the weekend, maybe to pg 80 or so. Much of what he says correlates to ipo tracking- pulling the harness, step tracking, keeping nose to ground always. Now I am only to the beginning of the training program outlined, but so far he uses no food, just a motivation in finding the article. Now you said you used food. Why did you decide to use it if he didn't refer to it at all in the book? You say you use a yummy food reward at the article- why did you decide to do this and does the book speak of it?
> 
> One thing he says that I think is incorrect for the current ipo rules is that the dog can indicate the article however it pleases- looking at it, grabbing it, etc. In things I've read the dog should indicate the article by laying down with it between the front paws. Is that the ipo rules for article indication- that it should be indicated with a down between paws? If so and you trained using his methods how did you teach your dog to indicate the correct way?
> 
> ...



Around about page 128 he details what to do for "Non retrievers" i.e food motivated trackers.

IPO has several indication methods. Lie down at article, stand and bark at article or retrieve article. You must tell the judge which method you/dog will use prior to starting the track. I trained the platz because that was the indication that made most sense for me. I trained it mostly at home, I would throw an article in the grass, she would go to it, I would call platz and she would down and I would treat/reward. After a while I was just throwing the article a short distance multiple times in a straight line, each time she would run to it and platz, removing the command took about one session and after that she would auto down at the article. Note I didn't use all his methods entirely, I think I got about 80-90% from his book, the rest was from other sources.

90% of the time I lay my own tracks, mostly out of necessity as I don't have anyone who will track with me at 6:30 AM. Early on I did and my buddy and I swapped tracks after the dogs were good enough on self laid. I now run non-self laid tracks about once every 2 weeks, or whenever I can get an experienced tracklayer to help me (usually before saturday morning class). She handles non-self track just as good as self, so I don't continual think self laying is a bad thing.

Yeah, way too fast a schedule for me, 3X3 maybe when I'm retired but no way would I have the time now. I was doing 3 tracks once a day. These were mostly short tracks, varying from single leg to 2 legs initially. Eventually I just figured out one long track with multiple legs was working well for me. I will occasionally do a track with 25 turns, with fairly short 20yd legs, just to challenge the dog.


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Great info! Thanks so much!


----------



## pfitzpa1 (Apr 26, 2011)

natalie559 said:


> Great info! Thanks so much!


Here's the exact text from IPO rules, I'm not sure where I got barking from, that might have been something I heard wrong somewhere. I didn't mention sit as an indication method, that is valid too.


>>>>
As soon as the dog locates the article, he must, without any handler (HF) influence, immediately pick it up or indicate it. If he picks up, he may remain standing, sit or return to the handler (HF). If the dog picks up and returns to the handler (HF), the handler (HF) is to remain standing. Proceeding forward or picking up the article while lying down is faulty. Indication may be done sitting, standing or lying down. When the dog indicates or picks up the article, the handler (HF) drops the line and approaches his dog. By raising his arm with the article in hand, he shows that the dog has found the article.

<<<<<


----------

