# correct GSD head



## GSD07

I've started looking closer into a GSD structure, and as I understand, the size and shape of head is an important part of the correct breed standard. Could you please elaborate on this abit and maybe show some examples (adult dogs) with comments? I have my own opinion, but I would love to hear what experts have to say. Thank you!


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## Freestep

I'm not an expert, and the standard leaves much up to interpretation. For example, ASL's tend to have narrower, needlenose heads, and GSL's tend to have broader heads. My own, personal, non-expert preference is for a broader head with good substance, especially in males. I don't like the greyhoundy-heads I've seen on some ASLs. However, some people find them "refined" and "aristocratic".


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## Freestep

Meant to add... the heads on ASL's are improving, and I see more and more of them with nice heads lately. Back in the 80's and early 90's I used to see a lot of needlenose GSDs at AKC shows, but nowadays I have a hard time even finding a photo to describe what I'm talking about.


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## GSDAlphaMom

I always called it a banana nose (not meaning to be offense, just descriptive). I agree they are changing. You can probably find some examples on Jimmy Moses' site.

Kaleef German Shepherds - Geneva, Genuine Risk, Pacino, Manhattan, Valle -


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## Freestep

Interesting how that site lists all the dogs' show wins and winning progeny, but there is barely a mention of temperament anywhere.

I don't like this head type (or the rest of her body type, for that matter), though seems its fairly common in ASL's and some people seem to think it's "noble".


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## PaddyD

Female head, same dog, different angles.
Too feminine? Needle nose? You decide.
The ears could be more upright but she saves the upright position for rabbits, squirrels and deer.


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## Emoore

There seems to be a pretty wide range of what's considered acceptable in GSD heads. Some like the big blocky heads, some prefer the more refined ones. IMHO the extremes at both ends look bad, but so long as it's not super-extreme they look nice.


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## carmspack

list of males with excellent GSD male heads
V Jago von der Lindenhalle - German Shepherd Dog jago lindenhalle 
V Ingo von Rudingen - German Shepherd Dog ingo rudingen 
this dog who because he is moving you can see full head all angles 



Carmspack Kilo - German Shepherd Dog -- hey , how'd he get in there (shown here at 10 months - my rear end was 30-something) Kilo featured in many BrownTrout publications 
SG Grando Mecklenburger Buffel - German Shepherd Dog
that's a start


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## GSDAlphaMom

Totally agree on the extremes. I like a nice head but have seen some so blocky they don't even look like gsd's....more like akita heads. There is such a thing as too much and it isn't attractive IMHO.


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## Freestep

PaddyD said:


> Female head, same dog, different angles.
> Too feminine? Needle nose? You decide.


Her head is definitely feminine, but she does not have that greyhoundy, needlenose look I am talking about. I have seen dogs whose heads were so narrow that their eyes seemed large and protruding. Yuck.


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## carmspack

more - Sando haus Iris V Sando vom Haus Iris - German Shepherd Dog


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## GSD07

GSDAlphaMom, could you find an example of a GSD head looking like akita? I keep hearing about it and have a hard time picturing. 

Carmspack, thanks so much for the great examples. All those dogs are working lines, and their heads are beautiful and look very similar to my dog's. What I love is that they have pretty long muzzles and nice stops.


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## elisabeth_00117

I personally LOVE Stark's head. 

I believe he has substance, not overly broad at all.


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## cassadee7

I read somewhere that the parallel planes of the head are being lost, but that it is correct for the forehead slope to be parallel to the nose slope, if that makes sense.

I love Saber's head. I think she is feminine but not over the top. She is young though. 13 months.


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## lhczth

To me an incorrect male head would be one where the stop (forehead) is extremely pronounced, the muzzle shortened and the dog has very loose lips like a Newfie or St Bernard. I trained with a Czech dog (a zPS dog) that had a head like this, have seen some DDR dogs like this and far too many show lines. I am also seeing Goldens and Labs (my aunt had one. He looked like a darn Mastiff) so not just a problem in our breed. 

I want masculine, but not overbuilt and in proportion to the body. The head should also not be overly refined. I don't want to have to check the plumbing to know the sex of the dog. Of course I say that, but then don't mind having to check on a female. LOL










I like a nice head on a female too. They can look a bit masculine until put next to a male.


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## LARHAGE

I like a feminine head on a female and a masculine, but not heavy or coarse head on a male, I don't like the big blocky heads, I actually love my dogs head and ear set, he's my ideal.


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## elisabeth_00117

I tend to like a more masculine female as well but Zefra is pretty dang adorable! I actually like her little head.. her mother has more of the masculine head though.


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## DunRingill

carmspack said:


> list of males with excellent GSD male heads
> V Jago von der Lindenhalle - German Shepherd Dog jago lindenhalle



Here's a pic of my guys, taken last weekend. I think they have nice heads! The old girl in the center is a Jago von der Lindenhalle daughter, she's over 13.5 years old.


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## BR870

I know I'll probably get some disagreement, but I really like this dogs head...










Canto vom Haus Endrikat - German Shepherd Dog

Actually I just like the look of this dog in general, but I have not developed my eye for conformation, so thats really just my general opinion...


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## Emoore

GSD07 said:


> GSDAlphaMom, could you find an example of a GSD head looking like akita? I keep hearing about it and have a hard time picturing.


Stud Dog: DDR semen (id: 146402) - German Shepherd Dog


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## mjbgsd

I like my youngest male's head, big and blocky:wub:


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## Freestep

BR870 said:


> I know I'll probably get some disagreement, but I really like this dogs head...
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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> 
> 
> Canto vom Haus Endrikat - German Shepherd Dog


No disagreement here! He's lovely.


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## Freestep

Emoore said:


> Stud Dog: DDR semen (id: 146402) - German Shepherd Dog


That muzzle looks really weird--almost like he got stung by a bee. Maybe it's just a bad photo?


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## onyx'girl

my three noggins....








I think the one in the middle has the nicest head, earset.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

It seems like people can't stay away from extremes in anything. 

People who like a more refined head, turn it into collie head. People who like something more, before you know it they look like they are panda bears with upright ears. Then the "why the long face" faces where they are long from eye down to jaw or eye to nose. The big flews - that is a real strange interpretation. I like this topic because I like looking and have some really strong preferences that I think are just reactions to these extremes. Most important of course, is what is in those heads! 

Of course then posting likes and dislikes more specifically image wise can get to people personally so...I will just read.


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## GSD07

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> I like this topic because I like looking and have some really strong preferences that I think are just reactions to these extremes. Most important of course, is what is in those heads!
> 
> Of course then posting likes and dislikes more specifically image wise can get to people personally so...I will just read.


Jean, you said it best! This topic is not for critiques of member's dogs, but for examples and explanations and looking. Thanks so much for posting your replies!

Here's my dog, and I believe his head is perfectly balanced (and contains some good stuff between those ears  )


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## GSD07

Freestep said:


> That muzzle looks really weird--almost like he got stung by a bee. Maybe it's just a bad photo?


 I agree, looks very weird . The dog also looks to be very old.


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## Xeph

Part of the problem is that people are only showing side shots. A head can look great from the side, and not so much from the front!

I love this head:









And this one:









From the side:


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## GSD07

Side shots show the length of the muzzle, the lips and the forehead. I also do not like the wet loose lips on a GSD. 

Here's a front photo of my dog. Merry Christmas from Anton and the Cats!!!


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## carmspack

what you are describing are the dolicocephalic for the long collie type , and brachycephalic for the rounded heavy type. Each is supposed to enable different performance. The former runners, the latter fighters.
Here is an analysis which includes heads.
THE ILLUSTRATED STANDARD OF THE GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG
I think dog "B" describes the dog Regalhaus Quest - German Shepherd Dog but is he much different than SG7 2009 SRB qu-seizer de Auringis - German Shepherd Dog or Cello aus der Burgenstadt - German Shepherd Dog VA1 Ursus von Batu - German Shepherd Dog BAXJ di CA' SAN MARCO - German Shepherd Dog
V1 ALEX Alexander the Great - German Shepherd Dog

Kwai vom Klostermoor - German Shepherd Dog
VA1 Ursus von Batu - German Shepherd Dog
Naro vom Mutzbach - German Shepherd Dog 
VA3 (US) Jaguar von der Mäusespitz - German Shepherd Dog

so , are they heading more into the mastiff type ?
Visual History of Bull and Mastiff Dogs Midgard Kennels -- 
which is definitely indicated on the canine genome
in my opinion not correct .


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## carmspack

nice female heads Resi vom Nesselbach - German Shepherd Dog
Dolly von der Hohen Metze - German Shepherd Dog


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## MustLoveGSDs

This is a dog from Heidelberg Kennels in Spring, TX. I can pick a Heidelberg GSD out of a crowd from a mile away. Their heads are just awful, along with everything else...


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## wolfstraum

Masculine correct black male....Xito v d Maineiche of course! 
Side shot








head shot









Female - with Ingo Rudigen in pedigree










She was linebred on Lord 2-5,5,and had at least 2 other sources of Ingo - so backmassed on Ingo...thanks for that video Carmen- I had never seen it!

Puppy from these two 









Daughter of the above two - strong yet feminine ~

















My "Ghost" - from the first male


















Lee


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## cliffson1

I think heads are, "Difficult to define, unmistakeable when present"


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## GSDGunner

Gunner is an ASL and I think he has a very masculine head.


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## Mrs.K

ugh, I really don't like the Czech Heads... don't know what it is about those heads but they are just too much. 



carmspack said:


> list of males with excellent GSD male heads
> V Jago von der Lindenhalle - German Shepherd Dog jago lindenhalle
> V Ingo von Rudingen - German Shepherd Dog ingo rudingen
> this dog who because he is moving you can see full head all angles Czech me out in Prague.wmv - YouTube
> Carmspack Kilo - German Shepherd Dog -- hey , how'd he get in there (shown here at 10 months - my rear end was 30-something) Kilo featured in many BrownTrout publications
> SG Grando Mecklenburger Buffel - German Shepherd Dog
> that's a start


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## Mrs.K

Indra has a very nice head for a female (except for her ear). 
She's not the prettiest dog but I always loved her head. 


















I loved Orry's head. He was an awesome dog. 
Orry vom Gehrenmoos - working-dog.eu

Yoschi ... it can't get more masculine than him
Yoschy von der Döllenwiese - working-dog.eu


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## fuzzybunny

I'm in love :wub:. Just gorgeous.




GSD07 said:


> Jean, you said it best! This topic is not for critiques of member's dogs, but for examples and explanations and looking. Thanks so much for posting your replies!
> 
> Here's my dog, and I believe his head is perfectly balanced (and contains some good stuff between those ears  )


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## wolfstraum

I guess everyone likes what they are conditioned to like or grow up with.....people with ASLs think their heads are great....when I started, I saw all types of GSDs and thought Xito was the most gorgeous - and he is WGWL...

but some people think Egyptian Arabian horses are ugly and Polish pretty.... 


Lee


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## BR870

Mrs.K said:


> Yoschi ... it can't get more masculine than him
> Yoschy von der Döllenwiese - working-dog.eu


So what in your opinion is the difference between the heads on the Czech dogs that you think are too much, and the heads on Yoschy or the dog I posted, Canto vom Haus Endrikat?


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## Mrs.K

BR870 said:


> So what in your opinion is the difference between the heads on the Czech dogs that you think are too much, and the heads on Yoschy or the dog I posted, Canto vom Haus Endrikat?


The forehead is different. There is a weird thing about the forehead with the czech dogs that makes them so distinctive and why you can tell them apart.


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## cliffson1

I think this is a very balanced head, but of course I'm biased.


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## wolfstraum

so here is one that is a bit of everything - you don't think this is masculine either?


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## Mrs.K

What about Yukons?


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## Barb E

I wish I had noted the name of the dog I saw a picture of, WGSL, and his profile was very close to an L.
I remember people going on and on about how great his head was while I was thinking that it just wasn't to my liking in any way.

The forehead on the dog was very steep and straight.


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## lhczth

DunRingill said:


> The old girl in the center is a Jago von der Lindenhalle daughter, she's over 13.5 years old.


She looks so much like the Bi's I have produced that go back on Jago's sister, Jenni.  Nice strong heads.


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## Xeph

Lee, Love the heads on the dogs you posted.

GSD07, I don't like "wet" heads either, and I've noticed MANY dogs from all lines with really loose flews as of late.

I'm really not a fan of the heads of most American dogs, but Capi and Ike have nice male heads. I am generally hard pressed to find a correct head on an AmLine bitch. I've also noticed, however, that skulls are generally properly proportioned, and it's the muzzle that has really gone weak.


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## Mrs.K

> GSD07, I don't like "wet" heads either, and I've noticed MANY dogs from all lines with really loose flews as of late.


What do you mean with "wet"?


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## Freestep

As much as I like broad, blocky heads, I do NOT like loose flews--a GSD should be tight-lipped and dry-mouthed. I think breeding for strong heads with tight lips will automatically select for a head type that is not so big and blocky as to be extreme.

I have to say, the pictures everyone has posted of their own dogs, are lovely examples of good heads!


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## nitemares

I like this females head, for me it's perfect. But I'm a bit biased since she's my pups dam.
SG Niki ze Stribrneho kamene - German Shepherd Dog
more pics here
Niki ze Stribrneho kamene CS - working-dog.eu

As for males I like heads like this
VYBORNY Ox z Jirkova dvora - German Shepherd Dog
more here
Ox z Jirkova dvora CS - working-dog.eu

Since i'm no expert I'm wondering if any of these are "correct"? I think for the male it might be a bit bulkier than the standard, but it goes with the rest of his body.


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## Catu

From the pictures I've seen of american lines I don't like the weak muzzles either, but the droopy eyes and position of the ears are what throws me back.

As Cliff, I'm biased, but I think Akela's head would be just perfect if his lips were a bit tighter, though if I compare pictures of him at 9 month old he seems to look more dry than since then. (He also has a slight dip over his right eye, but that is because of an accident at 2 m/0)



















And Akela's next to Diabla's head. Beyond all her structure faults, including lack of pigmentation, I love her head, who is strong without lose femininity.


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## Xeph

For me, Akela's head is far too coarse, but I think Diabla's head is lovely.

Mrs K, a wet head is loose flews, droopy eyes, and loose skin around the neck. Almost houndy.


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## Mrs.K

Xeph said:


> For me, Akela's head is far too coarse, but I think Diabla's head is lovely.
> 
> Mrs K, a wet head is loose flews, droopy eyes, and loose skin around the neck. Almost houndy.


Ah, yes. I agree. Don't like that either.


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## Freestep

I don't think Akela's head is too coarse, but I see what you mean about the loose lips... it makes his muzzle look bigger than it actually is.


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## DunRingill

Here's a pic of Logan, aka The Face. He knew how to use The Face to get something he wanted! Pretty boy, tho I would have preferred tighter lips. 










This pic was taken when he was 9.5 years old:









Once upon a time we were at a herding instinct test put on by a herding breeds conformation club. Ulf Kintzel was the evaluator. I had the only 2 GSDs there, and Ulf tested my dogs in the tending style. As Logan (conformation dog, Am and German show lines) trotted back and forth outside the fence, Ulf said to the AKC breed judge from the club "SO Mr. Breed Judge, how do you like THIS dog?" The judge struck a judge-like pose (hand on chin) and said "Well he's clean coming and going, and has a nice side gate....but his HEAD is entirely TOO COARSE." Ulf just looked at me and shook his head. I said to Ulf later "And that's EXACTLY why I stopped showing Logan in AKC shows!" In my eyes, Logan's head was beautiful and certainly not a problem area! (he had OTHER problem areas!)

Now this was in 1999.....around that time the heads were VERY snipey. Things have definitely improved since then!!


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## DunRingill

lhczth said:


> She looks so much like the Bi's I have produced that go back on Jago's sister, Jenni.  Nice strong heads.


I LOVE that look!! and love Bi's. Ianna has a personality that matches that look, when she's focused and determined LOOK OUT


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## DunRingill

I know what you mean about the chow/akita look....afraid to post any pictures because for sure someone will get offended. I have a friend who has a dog with that style of head, she thinks he's gorgeous......I keep thinking he's over-done.


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## Wolfgeist

I really don't like to see a feminine head on a male. I like the West German heads... and I am not a fan of the ASL heads - but I personally know one male (Liz's Stark, she posted pictures on this thread) that has the perfect head!

I LOVE Boy: Boy von Zorra - German Shepherd Dog

Definitely want my next pup from him.


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## Catu

DunRingill said:


> Once upon a time we were at a herding instinct test put on by a herding breeds conformation club. Ulf Kintzel was the evaluator. I had the only 2 GSDs there, and Ulf tested my dogs in the tending style. As Logan (conformation dog, Am and German show lines) trotted back and forth outside the fence, Ulf said to the AKC breed judge from the club "SO Mr. Breed Judge, how do you like THIS dog?" The judge struck a judge-like pose (hand on chin) and said "Well he's clean coming and going, and has a nice side gate....but his HEAD is entirely TOO COARSE." Ulf just looked at me and shook his head. I said to Ulf later "And that's EXACTLY why I stopped showing Logan in AKC shows!" In my eyes, Logan's head was beautiful and certainly not a problem area! (he had OTHER problem areas!)


Then I'll take coarse as a compliment :thumbup:

Now, talking specifically about heads: What you mean with "coarse"?


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## carmspack

Mrs K -- those were not even Czech dogs that I posted . 
The heads with the wet flews are like a modern St Bernard .

I provided show line dogs that were moving over to a St Bernard type head , BUT here is a poster with some very nice heads -- show lines (female) http://www.vom-spessartblick.de/html/poster_0.htm


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## Debbieg

I think Benny has a nice masculine head.


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## Rei

I always thought that if Trent's lips were dryer (too "flewy"), he'd have a lovely, strong head... for a bitch :rofl:





































No, I don't like overdone heads, but I prefer those that are distinctly masculine. And frankly, I like his head just fine... just never saw it as "correct".


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## robinhuerta

I have a personal like for strong head pieces.....
I love the head "type" of these particular dogs (that I own)..








Female WL








Female WL








Female SL under 12mos.








Male SL over 12mos








Male SL 6 1/2 mos.

_*I like good cheek bone, clear expression, balanced stop & strong under jaws.....but all people have different preferences...this is just my "type".*_


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## GatorDog

I think that depending on who you ask, the definition of a "correct" head is going to vary drastically. I don't know any good technical terms to describe it, but I personally do not care for dogs with very wide heads with snouts that look sort of pushed up and Akita-like. I think many people are looking for shepherds with heads build like a mastiff's, and that's just personally not my kinda thing.

I am really pleased with Aiden's head (of course). He has very masculine structure, but it's not over the top.

From the front.









Kind of a profile.









Some miscellaneous ones.


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## carmspack

V12 Vello von der Niddereiche - German Shepherd Dog
G Caro vom Allerswald - German Shepherd Dog

Yoncalla's Mike GV CH. ROM Yoncallas Mike - German Shepherd Dog

female "american bred" Dawnhill's Carli

SEL CAN & AM CH Winning Ways Chimo - German Shepherd Dog


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## robk

This is my favorite dog's head....Hope to acquire a pup one day by him.
SG, ED NORMAL ZW 78 Kinski vom Heidhof - German Shepherd Dog


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## Catu

robk said:


> This is my favorite dog's head....Hope to acquire a pup one day by him.
> SG, ED NORMAL ZW 78 Kinski vom Heidhof - German Shepherd Dog


Nice head overall, but just like my dog, lips are to loose to my taste.


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## Mrs.K

carmspack said:


> Mrs K -- those were not even Czech dogs that I posted .
> The heads with the wet flews are like a modern St Bernard .
> 
> I provided show line dogs that were moving over to a St Bernard type head , BUT here is a poster with some very nice heads -- show lines (female) Poster


The link of the video was Czech Dogs, wasn't it and I thought you posted them because you thought they were excellent heads or did I quote the wrong post? 



> list of males with excellent GSD male heads


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## robk

Catu said:


> Nice head overall, but just like my dog, lips are to loose to my taste.


I can see what you are talking about with the lips.


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## PaddyD

I think this is where some of those ASL refined heads came from.
This guy was a MAJOR ASL producer.

SEL CH (US & CAN) Stuttgart's Sundance Kid - German Shepherd Dog


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## Debbieg

The sire and dam of my childhood GSD I think they have some of the same bloolines as One of the dogs Carmen linked too "Yoncalla's Mike"


CH (US) Falko von Celler Schloss - German Shepherd Dog

Robin of Nikral - German Shepherd Dog


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## wolfstraum

Mrs.K said:


> The link of the video was Czech Dogs, wasn't it and I thought you posted them because you thought they were excellent heads or did I quote the wrong post?


You don't think those are good looking heads????????????  I think alot of the stuff coming out of Germany is snipey headed, weak headed....even Herr Scheld remarked that the working line breeders are losing the strength in the headpiece (along with color/pigment)....

Lee


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## Mrs.K

wolfstraum said:


> You don't think those are good looking heads????????????  I think alot of the stuff coming out of Germany is snipey headed, weak headed....even Herr Scheld remarked that the working line breeders are losing the strength in the headpiece (along with color/pigment)....
> 
> Lee


No, the Czech dogs, to me, have a weird looking head. It's the forehead that makes it weird, like it was said before, almost Akita looking. I like a strong head but not over the top and most Czech dogs, to me have a very distinctive head that is just too much for my personal taste.


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## PaddyD

carmspack said:


> SEL CAN & AM CH Winning Ways Chimo - German Shepherd Dog


Really like Chimo. A lot in common with Abby: Black Jack; Nike; Sundance.


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## Freestep

Here's an ASL female, what I would call "needlenose".


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## Mrs.K

The "mask" doesn't help the dog. 

Nala has a very feminine head and from a certain angle you could almost say needlenose. I like her head, it fits the rest of her body. She's compact, small, a bundle of drive and energy and muscles.


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## Freestep

Mrs.K said:


> Nala has a very feminine head and from a certain angle you could almost say needlenose.


I don't think so! She's beautiful, with a feminine head. In the last photo, the tip of her muzzle looks a bit narrower, but not so much as to be what I would call "needlenose". Her head is very proportionate.


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## Mrs.K

Freestep said:


> I don't think so! She's beautiful, with a feminine head. In the last photo, the tip of her muzzle looks a bit narrower, but not so much as to be what I would call "needlenose". Her head is very proportionate.


yeah, she is beautiful and has a beautiful head. 

Maybe it would help if we would make a list of all those terms (needlenose, wet...etc) and just give it a definition. Makes it hard to understand sometimes.


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## Freestep

Mrs.K said:


> Maybe it would help if we would make a list of all those terms (needlenose, wet...etc) and just give it a definition. Makes it hard to understand sometimes.


But these terms are so subjective, and open to interpretation. Kind of like the standard itself! 

Personally I hadn't heard the term "wet", but I assumed it to be the opposite of "dry" (which in itself needs a bit more description). I think the more correct term for "needlenose" is "snipey", I just like saying "needlenose" because it's descriptive, and it's a fun word to say.


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## phgsd

When Djenga was young she got a lot of comments about her snipey head. And yes - for a long time it was!!









But in the end, she grew a nice head - not overdone but correct and very pretty.


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## lhczth

IMO both Nala and Djenga have very nice feminine heads. Nothing snipey about them. 

Some of the heads shown are over done. Too much stop and brow that makes the eyes look squishy/squinty like one would see in an Akita or Sharpei.


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## lhczth

Freestep, yes that is a very narrow snipey muzzle. Reminds me of the old saying that the dog could suck a peanut out of a bottle (or something like that).


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## lhczth

3 yr old Male









5 yr old Female 









6 yr old Female w/ 9 yr old female behind









Female puppy









Male puppy 










One last male puppy


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## Freestep

It looks like Djenga's head took a little while to catch up to the rest of her body--but she has a lovely head now, very feminine, and refined, without being narrow or snipey.


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## doggiedad

as all of you can see my dog has the quintessential
GSD head by all standards. as stated in the SV he has
the complete head, 2 eyes, a mouth, teeth (upper and lower),
head and body the same color, nose, ears, a tongue that hangs
to the right (the correct side for tongue hanging), nostrils that
are open. i'm not bragging, look at my avatar and you'll see it.


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## carmspack

PaddyD said:


> Really like Chimo. A lot in common with Abby: Black Jack; Nike; Sundance.


well actually, Lanting , after judging Chimo spoke with me and asked me the dogs deep background because he spotted the "Mike - Judd" head , and he was right. The cross in this combination is taking a female who as a Ned of Edgetowne (Hollamar Judd son of Yoncalla Mike) to a male with you was from 
Bel-Vista's Hooligan
son of Mike's brother Wilhelm a.d. Winterzeit
setting stage - later introduced again through CH (US) Caralon's Phantom v LeBarland - German Shepherd Dog and CH (AKC) Peddacres Uno - German Shepherd Dog
(Joe Kuhn , good friend, would get a kick on having his dog on this pedigree -Gisa) also
bringing in CH (AKC) Peddacres Uno - German Shepherd Dog for fronts and sire GV CH (US) Baobab's Chaz - German Shepherd Dog


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## Rahrah

> Male puppy


I like his head a lot (from what I can tell from this photo) What does it look like now?


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## lhczth

Rahrah, that was taken when he was 5 or so months and now he is only 7 months.  Probably not much different.


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## Rahrah

lol -fair enough.


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## horsegirl

GSDGunner said:


> Gunner is an ASL and I think he has a very masculine head.


handsome!!


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## horsegirl

carmspack said:


> V12 Vello von der Niddereiche - German Shepherd Dog
> G Caro vom Allerswald - German Shepherd Dog
> 
> Yoncalla's Mike GV CH. ROM Yoncallas Mike - German Shepherd Dog
> 
> female "american bred" Dawnhill's Carli
> 
> SEL CAN & AM CH Winning Ways Chimo - German Shepherd Dog


here is another in my opinion great asl male headhttp://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=620407http://cdn.pedigreedatabase.com/pictures/620407.jpg


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## Liesje

I think Kenya has a nice head. I think it is feminine without being too pointy or too anything and it matches her body. She is small but in pictures I think she looks strong. She is too light for my taste but I love the color and shape of her eyes and her ears. Personally I like a strong head, even a doggy head on a bitch, and I like a good stop, but I also think that what I like is not always correct.

6 yrs









5 yrs


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## horsegirl

http://cdn.pedigreedatabase.com/pictures/620407.jpg


gv ch eli , this is my kind of head


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## doggiedad

that's the complete package.



horsegirl said:


> http://cdn.pedigreedatabase.com/pictures/620407.jpg
> 
> 
> gv ch eli , this is my kind of head


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## horsegirl

wolfstraum said:


> Masculine correct black male....Xito v d Maineiche of course!
> Side shot
> 
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> 
> Female - with Ingo Rudigen in pedigree
> 
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> 
> She was linebred on Lord 2-5,5,and had at least 2 other sources of Ingo - so backmassed on Ingo...thanks for that video Carmen- I had never seen it!
> 
> Puppy from these two
> 
> 
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> 
> Daughter of the above two - strong yet feminine ~
> 
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> My "Ghost" - from the first male
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> Lee


nice heads on the first couple of black gsd's, but I think those light eyes are really distracting from the total look.


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## Mrs.K

lhczth said:


> IMO both Nala and Djenga have very nice feminine heads. Nothing snipey about them.
> 
> Some of the heads shown are over done. Too much stop and brow that makes the eyes look squishy/squinty like one would see in an Akita or Sharpei.


Yes, I agree. That is why I said, that it almost looks like it from a certain angle. And I agree with the eyes, I like to see clear eyes, not squishy like an Akita or Sharpey. And the stop is a little too much too in some dogs. That is the one thing I don't like about the Czech Dogs (if it is what I think you mean. ).


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## Rahrah

This is taken from our (Australian) standard.

HEAD
The head is wedge-shaped, proportionate in size to the body, (length of head about 40% of
height of withers) without being coarse or too elongated, in overall appearance dry and
moderately broad between the ears. The forehead is only slightly domed when viewed from
front and the side and without any or only slightly indicated central furrow.
The proportion of the skull to muzzle is 50%:50%. The breadth of the skull corresponds
approximately to its length. The skull (viewed from above) tapers evenly from the ears to the
nose with a sloping, not sharply defined stop, into the wedge shaped foreface (muzzle).
Upper and lower jaws are strongly developed. The top of the muzzle is straight, a dish faced
or convex curve is not desired. The lips are tight, well fitted and of a dark colour.
The nose must be black.
The dentition must be strong, healthy and complete (42 teeth conforming to the dentition
formula) the German Shepherd Dog has a scissor bite that is, the incisors must fit scissor-like
to each other so that the incisors of the upper jaw overlap those of the lower jaw in a scissor
fashion. Level, over or undershot bites are faulty, as well as large gaps between the teeth. It is
a fault when the incisors are placed in a straight line in the gums. The jawbones must be
strongly developed so that the teeth are embedded deeply in the gum line.
The eyes are of medium size, almond shaped, slightly oblique and not protruding. The colour
of the eyes should be as dark as possible. Light piercing eyes are not desirable as they detract
from the expression of the dog.
EARS
The German Shepherd Dog has erect ears of medium size that are carried upright and almost
parallel (not tilted inwards). They taper to a point and are set with the orifice to the front.
Tipped ears and drop ears are faulty. Ears carried laid back, during gaiting or when at rest are
not faulty.
NECK
The neck should be strong, and well muscled and free from throatiness (dewlap) the angle to
the body (horizontal) is approximately 45 degrees.


----------



## Freestep

horsegirl said:


> nice heads on the first couple of black gsd's, but I think those light eyes are really distracting from the total look.


Oh, I disagree! I know the standard calls for a dark eye, but the look of an amber-colored eye in a dark face is so striking, almost wolfish... not saying we ought to breed in that direction, but if it's a fault, it's not one I get my panties in a wad over.


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## carmspack

the lips of the gsd are to be taut, loose lips, flews being a fault. 
some DDR dogs have a well developed zygomatic arch , bands of muscle at the back of the jaw which gives them a powerful grip.


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## carmspack

I also disagree, which is agreeing with Freestep -- put that eye on any other colour dog and you would have less contrast . That is a good dark amber colour . Besides it is what is INSIDE the head that counts. 
The broad between the ears provides for a brain case.


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## horsegirl

carmspack said:


> I also disagree, which is agreeing with Freestep -- put that eye on any other colour dog and you would have less contrast . That is a good dark amber colour . Besides it is what is INSIDE the head that counts.
> The broad between the ears provides for a brain case.


I respectfully disagree , It may be the light or the way the picture is taken , but the second dog (in my opinion ) does not have even close to a dark amber eye. I do agree that what is inside of the head is what really counts, however , this thread is about structure and the standard.


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## wolfstraum

horsegirl said:


> nice heads on the first couple of black gsd's, but I think those light eyes are really distracting from the total look.



Xitos eyes were not really quite that amber in person....I think some photoshopping for contrast due to his being black...

In my C litter - all had very dark eyes except Csabre - when I asked Scheld about it - he said - look at the rest of her, who cares about the eye color...it would fix itself...her black sons have very very dark eyes, as do her sable daughters...I see the amber show up some in other dogs with Xento Maineiche...and in a lighter dog, it is NOT even a factor that you would notice...

Lee


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## holland

Scheld must have been right look at Xito's son-what is his name-does not have those light eyes and has a beautiful head must have had something to do with the female that Xito was bred to-guess soimetimes the female does matter can fix those little faults


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## carmspack

Xito has a V rating -- Wolfstraum can you provide his koer report .

Horsegirl you provided a link to a dog , which I think you thought ideal, but cannot open your link. Could you re do this please.

Carmen


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## Freestep

horsegirl said:


> I respectfully disagree , It may be the light or the way the picture is taken , but the second dog (in my opinion ) does not have even close to a dark amber eye. I do agree that what is inside of the head is what really counts, however , this thread is about structure and the standard.


I think the concern with lighter colored eyes is that it shows the dog has less pigment, and black dogs can "hide" poor pigment. Nonetheless, I think the lighter colored eyes are stunning and so expressive on a black face. Or even a white face--my Akbash dog is white with amber eyes, and I know exactly what he's thinking just by looking at his eyes. You can't see the pupils as well in dogs with very dark eyes.

But like I said, personal preference shouldn't take precedence over the standard.


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## lhczth

Light eyes don't make the dog, but, IMO, there is nothing worse than very light eyes on a black dog. It is like looking at headlights. YUCK. 

I like Alexis' and Elena's eyes. Very dark eyes on very dark faces. Yes, a personal preference. I remember a horse breeder once saying to me that you may not ride the head, but you do have to look at it every day.


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## horsegirl

wolfstraum said:


> Xitos eyes were not really quite that amber in person....I think some photoshopping for contrast due to his being black...
> 
> In my C litter - all had very dark eyes except Csabre - when I asked Scheld about it - he said - look at the rest of her, who cares about the eye color...it would fix itself...her black sons have very very dark eyes, as do her sable daughters...I see the amber show up some in other dogs with Xento Maineiche...and in a lighter dog, it is NOT even a factor that you would notice...
> 
> Lee


I notice


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## horsegirl

carmspack said:


> Xito has a V rating -- Wolfstraum can you provide his koer report .
> 
> Horsegirl you provided a link to a dog , which I think you thought ideal, but cannot open your link. Could you re do this please.
> 
> Carmen


sorry , I am not good at copying links , but in the post below I did get the picture linked (I think) if you click on that you can see the pic.


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## GSD07

Here's the links of ideal GSD head that horsegirl posted, I'll put it here so people don't need to look for it:

GV.MV.AM.CH.SEL.EX. EJM N' EKO-LAN'S ELI - German Shepherd Dog

and the pic:


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## GSD07

lhczth said:


> It is like looking at headlights. YUCK.


 :wild::rofl: 

I like Xitos eyes. They are like liquid amber, with the same spark. I know the darker the eyes the better but I do like the dark amber better than solid dark brown.


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## carmspack

Eli is okay, pretty loose lips on the underjaw though.


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## JakodaCD OA

correct or not, I think we all have our head preference..when I look at a male, I want to say to myself "that is a male" same with female.

I like Masi's head, "I" look at her and say "that's a girl",,(but I know some think she's more masculine looking I also like nice tight ear sets but that's me (oops don't mind the sand in her mouth she was beaching it")










I like alot of the 'heads' I've seen in this thread..one I haven't seen, and he is not my dog so I won't post him, is Kim's (justk9's) Rookie,,he in my opinion, has a gorgeous head


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## Freestep

Here is a neutered male GSD I am watching. He is probably American "pet" lines. This head to me is too narrow for a male. Nice dark eye though.


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## Freestep

And here are my girls, I think they have nice heads, although Luka doesn't have any teeth left in hers.


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## trudy




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## trudy

this is my male Ty, Am/Can show lines, 3 years old, and his 2 year old full sister



















the two of them together, he is definitely masculine and her feminine with out being weak


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## horsegirl

carmspack said:


> Eli is okay, pretty loose lips on the underjaw though.


I agree with your lip comment.


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## horsegirl

GSD07 said:


> Here's the links of ideal GSD head that horsegirl posted, I'll put it here so people don't need to look for it:
> 
> GV.MV.AM.CH.SEL.EX. EJM N' EKO-LAN'S ELI - German Shepherd Dog
> 
> and the pic:


thanks ! not saying his head is perfect , but I find it very masculine and attractive.


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## horsegirl

wolfstraum said:


> Xitos eyes were not really quite that amber in person....I think some photoshopping for contrast due to his being black...
> 
> In my C litter - all had very dark eyes except Csabre - when I asked Scheld about it - he said - look at the rest of her, who cares about the eye color...it would fix itself...her black sons have very very dark eyes, as do her sable daughters...I see the amber show up some in other dogs with Xento Maineiche...and in a lighter dog, it is NOT even a factor that you would notice...
> 
> Lee


I have seen your dogs many times on the forum , they are very beautiful/handsome and talented.


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## robinhuerta

Horsegirl...that is a very nice looking AM bred dog....a nice head (side profile) indeed!


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## Debbieg

very nice variety heads on this thread. I love looking at them and seeing the variety of lines.

The head needs to fit the body though. I can't imagine some of those big blocky heads on streamlined bodies or the more slender heads on the big muscular frames. 

Like I would not want to see a quarter horse head on an Arabian, or a Thoroughbred or vice versa. The head has to fit the body.

Mostly I agree that it is what's inside the head that counts. Keep trying to tell my daughter that when she bring home guys that are "tall dark, handsome" but irresponsible :crazy:


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## scuba_bob

Here's my boy, photos were taken when he was about 6 months old.


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## GSD07

I went through the old pictures a few days ago, and I noticed that my current dog's head changed within the last year to fully match his body. I have heard from my breeder that shepherds can keep growing until 4 years of age but now I have a first hand experience. 

The dogs posted are beautiful, and so different!


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## Mrs.K

GSD07 said:


> I went through the old pictures a few days ago, and I noticed that my current dog's head changed within the last year to fully match his body. I have heard from my breeder that shepherds can keep growing until 4 years of age but now I have a first hand experience.
> 
> The dogs posted are beautiful, and so different!


Yes. Also, the maturity level varies between the dogs and it can take not only up to four years for them to grow but also to mature. And with some males you can see a significant change from puppyhood, to one year, four years and seven years of age. When I got Yukon he was five. Now with seven he looks much more masculine than with five years. And you can almost see that with every dog, just like with people.


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## Liesje

GSD07 said:


> I went through the old pictures a few days ago, and I noticed that my current dog's head changed within the last year to fully match his body. I have heard from my breeder that shepherds can keep growing until 4 years of age but now I have a first hand experience.


Definitely. I took some pics of Nikon yesterday and then was petting his head and petting Pan's head and noticed that Nikon's head has changed in the past few months. He is 3.5 yrs. Breeder always told me he was from slow maturing (physically) lines. He's also gained almost 10 pounds in the past 8 months and I can still see his ribs.


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## Wolfiesmom

Wolfie has a big blocky head that I hear is typical of DDR lines. Chief was ASL and he had a big head, but his nose was longer and he had a thinner face than Wolfie.


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## Rahrah

I may be _slightly_(lol) biased, but I really like how the head on our 20 week old female pup is turning out.
Fenrir- (new camera- still getting used to the different settings, so is washed out)








Who I found out (_thanks qbchottu!_) is half GSL and half German working lines.


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## PaddyD

There is a trend in this thread. Everyone seems to like their dog's head.
What could be better?


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## Debbieg

PaddyD said:


> There is a trend in this thread. Everyone seems to like their dog's head.
> What could be better?



Hope Benny likes my head!


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## Rahrah

debbieg said:


> hope benny likes my head!


lol!!!


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## Cassidy's Mom

My dogs' head AND eyes have changed as they matured! Dena had beautiful dark brown eyes from the beginning, but Keefer (her half brother) had much lighter eyes that have become darker. Halo's eyes were fairly light when she was young, but have grown darker over time too. 

Keef always had a masculine "big boy" head, even when he was young, but it was never out of proportion to his body, which is broad and big boned. Halo has a thinner muzzle than he does, but thank goodness her head finally grew into her body. For awhile there we thought she might always be a pinhead, lol! 

Here's Keefer at 10 months old










And 5-1/2 years


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## Freestep

PaddyD said:


> There is a trend in this thread. Everyone seems to like their dog's head.


That's because everyone has dogs with nice heads!  I haven't seen a single one posted that I don't like. Maybe the people with narrow-headed GSDs are hiding out, too embarrassed to post their dogs' picture! 

But really, it only matters from a breeding standpoint. If yours is the best dog you've ever had, and you love him, who cares about the shape of his head? It's what's inside that counts.


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## Whiteshepherds

Debbieg said:


> Hope Benny likes my head!


There's probably a forum called ourhumans.com that can only be accessed by dogs in the middle of the night when we're all sleeping. Our dogs sneak on, talk about us, and then post pictures so other dogs can critique us. (scary thought, lol) They're probably wondering why humans have no breed standard.


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## PaddyD

The topic now includes eyes, which makes sense, being a part of the head.


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## Mrs.K

Cassidy's Mom said:


> My dogs' head AND eyes have changed as they matured! Dena had beautiful dark brown eyes from the beginning, but Keefer (her half brother) had much lighter eyes that have become darker. Halo's eyes were fairly light when she was young, but have grown darker over time too.
> 
> Keef always had a masculine "big boy" head, even when he was young, but it was never out of proportion to his body, which is broad and big boned. Halo has a thinner muzzle than he does, but thank goodness her head finally grew into her body. For awhile there we thought she might always be a pinhead, lol!
> 
> Here's Keefer at 10 months old
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And 5-1/2 years


Okay, don't take that the wrong way. Please don't, I think it's rather funny... but your dog looks like as if he needs glasses in the upper picture. :rofl:


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## Rahrah

PaddyD said:


> The topic now includes eyes, which makes sense, being a part of the head.
> View attachment 13878


Is her ear set always outwards? it reminds me of the Siamese that we used to have-








Who we dearly loved btw!

It's hard to tell what sort of eye shape your dog actually has, but the standards call for almond shaped, set slightly slanting of medium size, not protruding. 

But as someone else said- who cares, if your dog is just a pet- you love her anyway. The standard is what all breeders should look to when _breeding_.


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## onyx'girl

For a shelter dog this one has a very nice head:


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## Freestep

onyx'girl said:


> For a shelter dog this one has a very nice head:


It might just be this picture, but his ears look proportionately small for his head.


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## onyx'girl

all that coat.... be nice, he's in a shelter waiting for his forever home!


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## Castlemaid

A couple of weeks ago we met a lady that is a CKC (Canadian) Conformation Judge and a GSD breeder. She loved Gryff and said that I could finish him if I showed him. She really liked his head:










I always thought that Gryff's head was too refined for a male, but he does have well-proportioned, and well-set ears.


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## Castlemaid

Whiteshepherds said:


> There's probably a forum called ourhumans.com that can only be accessed by dogs in the middle of the night when we're all sleeping. Our dogs sneak on, talk about us, and then post pictures so other dogs can critique us. (scary thought, lol) They're probably wondering why humans have no breed standard.


LOL, it's a good thing there is no human breed standard, I would have been culled long ago, or put down for bad nerves and serious behavioural issues. :wild:


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## Rahrah

IMO not fine at all- he's very handsome. Lovely looking dog!


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## carmspack

well there is a bit of a standard - we like things to be balanced between left and right side


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## onyx'girl

No, Lucia....you would have been carefully placed with an experienced handler to bring out all of your talents! 
Gryff has a great head, IMO. :wub:


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## Debbieg

Castlemaid said:


> LOL, it's a good thing there is no human breed standard, I would have been culled long ago, or put down for bad nerves and serious behavioural issues. :wild:



This :rofl:


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## trudy

lets all be honest...we ALL have dogs with beautiful heads...they show love, devotion, and alertness when needed, and they don't care what we look like! I have seen many beautiful heads and beautiful dogs, and a few I personally didn't like, yet to their owners, they were perfect..and I know when to keep my mouth shut and not say a negative...people start looking at their dogs differently if they are critiqued unfavorably...And yes my 2 have perfect heads, eyes, ears, bodies, tails, feet, personality, etc...


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## Debbieg

Castlemaid said:


> LOL, it's a good thing there is no human breed standard, I would have been culled long ago, or put down for bad nerves and serious behavioural issues. :wild:


Benny would be posting stuff like "My human has low thresholds and is a bit reactive. It is genetic because both her parents are Italian?


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## Xeph

Mirada has a head that I find incorrect. I've mentioned it on several occasions. Is she pretty? Yes. But her head is too refined (at least I think so).

From the side:









A couple of frontal views:


















15 months:









7-8 months









When she was ickle bitty:


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## nitemares

Gorgeous dog, looks like a standard Am line to me. yes her head could be a bit wider but she looks very regal and Lady like especially the first picture


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## carmspack

pretty but disproportionate to body size . nice body !


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## Xeph

Really, my issue isn't with her skull. I like her skull. But her muzzle is too weak for me.

I've never found her head to small for her body, though. But she is bathed and blown out in all pictures shown, so I can see how it would like that way (with the ruff blown up, her head does look even smaller compared to her body).

Thanks for the compliment on her body  I love it


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## carmspack

check the picture 7-8 months . very pretty female , bright intelligent expression - head set small - we are talking about the correct GSD standard head .


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## Xeph

When I look at her old 7-8 month picture, generally I tend to think "Man, her ears were HUGE!" LOL!

She's a good lil worker bee at least.


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## carmspack

absolutely -- and there are many many people who would give their arm and leg for a good companion GSD -- oh , yeah.


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## bunchoberrys

I think Kane has a handsome head, but has some big ol' lips.lol:wub: (more to kiss).










Also he has what I call a "Barbara Streisand nose", maybe its due to his overbite (mild). Nevertheless, he's all mine. :wub:


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## Xeph

I think Kane has a beautiful head! Really nice earset, too! IMO, earset makes a big difference as to how the head of the dog is viewed.


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## PaddyD

Rahrah said:


> Is her ear set always outwards? it reminds me of the Siamese that we used to have-


Nope, her ears go up but not as straight up as I would like.


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## sparra

I can't help but join in....:blush:

My boy is only 10months so not sure if his head will change much as he gets older ?? But I like his head and his dark eyes but maybe you do just like what you are used to.....
Oh.....and i had to throw the other in......my two most favorite heads in the whole world......:wub:

PaddyD......are you a grandfather yet?


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## PaddyD

sparra said:


> I can't help but join in....:blush:
> 
> My boy is only 10months so not sure if his head will change much as he gets older ?? But I like his head and his dark eyes but maybe you do just like what you are used to.....
> Oh.....and i had to throw the other in......my two most favorite heads in the whole world......:wub:
> 
> PaddyD......are you a grandfather yet?


Why YES I am thank you for asking.
Christmas baby girl !

Your boy has a very nice head and earset, will only get better with maturity.
If only we could ALL get better with maturity.

:crazy: :crazy:


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## sparra

That is wonderful news.....babies really are such a blessing....especially grand babies.....you can give them back when they cry 

Oh and thanks for the compliment on Luther's head.....I think he is pretty spunky.....


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## TankGrrl66

Xeph said:


> Mirada has a head that I find incorrect. I've mentioned it on several occasions. Is she pretty? Yes. But her head is too refined (at least I think so).
> 
> From the side:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A couple of frontal views:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 15 months:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 7-8 months
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When she was ickle bitty:



Sorry Xeph, but I was in tears over those ears LOL...in the 7-8mo photo. Oh my! 

She is very pretty...I love that smokey color on her tan. Her head is very refined though...it makes her neck look very long.


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## Vaks

Here is my male champion, which I gave to a friend.










My young male (9 months)



















and my female, 2 years










And the star of family










Oups!! not a GSD... lolll but he don't know!!!


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## cliffson1

I think a head should connote strength, nobility, and character. It should look incorruptible. It should fit the body and not have a look of worriedness or stress. When you see it, it looks right when it doesn't look right....welllllll.


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## horsegirl

cliffson1 said:


> I think a head should connote strength, nobility, and character. It should look incorruptible. It should fit the body and not have a look of worriedness or stress. When you see it, it looks right when it doesn't look right....welllllll.


like


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## PaddyD

cliffson1 said:


> I think a head should connote strength, nobility, and character. It should look incorruptible. It should fit the body and not have a look of worriedness or stress. When you see it, it looks right when it doesn't look right....welllllll.


Like squared


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## wolfstraum

well said Cliff!

and Welcome Vaks - love the black dog!

Lee


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## Vaks

wolfstraum said:


> well said Cliff!
> 
> and Welcome Vaks - love the black dog!
> 
> Lee


 Thank you!


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## JanaeUlva

Minka - 13 months old 
IMO nice, feminine head


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## lhczth

Minka has a very pretty and, yes, feminine head.


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## carmspack

Vaks , please who is your black 9 month male and that black female -- by the way I love the heads of all your dogs . The eye tells it all . There is self confidence and power there.

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## marshies

I am extremely biased and know absolutely NOTHING about structure or how heads are SUPPOSED to look, but I think Amaretto has a pretty head. Maybe y'all can give me some thoughts.


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## PaddyD

Would have to see it from different angles to tell but looks pretty nice from here.


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## horsegirl

marshies said:


> I am extremely biased and know absolutely NOTHING about structure or how heads are SUPPOSED to look, but I think Amaretto has a pretty head. Maybe y'all can give me some thoughts.


100 % adorable cuteness!!!!


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## elisabeth_00117

I am actually VERY curious what everyone thinks about Zefra's head.

I personally find it a bit small at this point for her structure (she is only 9 months - almost).


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## Xeph

> Sorry Xeph, but I was in tears over those ears LOL...in the 7-8mo photo. Oh my!


I know, right? LOL!

Her neck is long, and I like her long neck  I find many dogs necks are far too short these days. You don't want a giraffe neck, but it shouldn't be a rhinoceros neck either.


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## Ponypip123

I've been reading this thread with great interest! All these pups are gorgeous.... This is my Amy, and please critique, as while I think her head is very pretty, I'm really trying to learn about GSDs...!

P.S. I hope I did the insert image thing correctly....here goes


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## Debbieg

Amy has beautiful coloring!


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## Xeph

I like Amy's head! Feminine, but strong IMO


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## robinhuerta

These pics depict *strong masculine heads IMO*...I *LOVE* this type....
Here is Rookie & son....(father & brother of my Izzy).
































_*VERY serious expression for a small puppy of 10 1/2 weeks. You can see the intensity in his face.* My kind of dogs!_


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## PaddyD

robinhuerta said:


> These pics depict *strong masculine heads IMO*...I *LOVE* this type....
> Here is Rookie & son....(father & brother of my Izzy).
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> _*VERY serious expression for a small puppy of 10 1/2 weeks. You can see the intensity in his face.* My kind of dogs!_


Very masculine head, bordering on Akita but still GSD. JMHO


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## robinhuerta

Marshies.....your puppy has a very beautiful, strong feminine head.....she will be very beautiful when she grows up!


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## robinhuerta

Paddy...sorry...but please go look at an Akita's head......those dogs have no resemblance to an Akita.....they have strong DDR features, but ALL GSD.


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## PaddyD

robinhuerta said:


> Paddy...sorry...but please go look at an Akita's head......those dogs have no resemblance to an Akita.....they have strong DDR features, but ALL GSD.


That is why I said JMHO and bordering on Akita. We all have opinions, that was mine.
Happy New Year


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## robinhuerta

Yes...Thank God we all have opinions.....and I will refrain from more at this time.LOL!
Give me a strong, pronounced expression over a dog that has a depressed expression and look of a hound any day....and there are some that look like such...
What a great breed we all have.....they should always look as intelligent as they actually are.
Happy New Year!


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## Vaks

robinhuerta said:


> These pics depict *strong masculine heads IMO*...I *LOVE* this type....
> Here is Rookie & son....(father & brother of my Izzy).


Wow!!!! :wild::wild:


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## onyx'girl

I like/love the looks of Rookie, Puck and the DDR....though I don't necessarily like the rest of the body/stout/stocky. Are they agile? I almost went for a Puck/Jamba pup, but wasn't sure the structure was good for working ability. Love that expressiveness, intense look, hope the body goes with it. I'm sure the mind does.


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## carmspack

Robin --- I love a dog that screams masculine (if it is) and has power in a look. Those dogs you posted --- wow -- they remind me of my Iwan Poppitz son Como vom Parchimer Land - German Shepherd Dog

agile -- oh yeah .

so what is the back ground of your dogs that you posted .



Carmen 
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## robinhuerta

Carmen,
The puppy is now a dual purpose Police K9 for Illinois.....AND he placed VP1 & VP2 in the conformation ring (in front) of SL dogs.
Here is his pedigree and my Izzy's.....they have the same father....Just ***an/aka...Rookie.
VP1 Jayare von Kistha Haus - German Shepherd Dog

Izzy at 9mos old....bald & gangly! LOL!...she matured into a beautiful, strong female!
Just IsAdorable Vom Kistha Haus - German Shepherd Dog


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## windwalker718

Definite Male head, no guessing... Eyes are actually almost black when he's not bein' the devil... LOL (Csabre Von Wolfstraum 2 year old son, Ikon)


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## wolfstraum

windwalker718 said:


> Definite Male head, no guessing... Eyes are actually almost black when he's not bein' the devil... LOL (Csabre Von Wolfstraum 2 year old son, Ikon)












here is a good profile of him....


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## marshies

robinhuerta said:


> Marshies.....your puppy has a very beautiful, strong feminine head.....she will be very beautiful when she grows up!


LOL Robin, you can't comment either. You're just as biased as me!! 
But she is purrty. :wub:


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## GSD07

DDR dogs are very agile. I really, really don't understand why people look at the DDR dog's headshot and assume he only moves in slow motion with intimidating stare frozen on his face. When you look at a tiger, do you think it's a stocky animal with big bone, blocky head and good expression? Now, do you think that the tiger's body is lacking in agility and speed?


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## cliffson1

@gsd07....because many people have limited exposure to the breed and make comments based on their exposure and what they feel.


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## Debbieg

I have met this boy in person and he is very agile and my town is much safer because of him.

Czar "Bass" vom Banach

www.modestopdk9.com


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## elisabeth_00117

Debbie, he is stunning!


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## onyx'girl

GSD07 said:


> DDR dogs are very agile. I really, really don't understand why people look at the DDR dog's headshot and assume he only moves in slow motion with intimidating stare frozen on his face. When you look at a tiger, do you think it's a stocky animal with big bone, blocky head and good expression? Now, do you think that the tiger's body is lacking in agility and speed?


If this is in regards to what I posted, the DDR breeding I was interested in had a stocky/blocky build. Wasn't from just a headshot.
That is where my comment came from...I don't think that structure would be as agile. And the breeder wasn't training in any venues to show the dogs abilities. If I'd seen the dogs working, I would have seen for myself whether or not they were agile.


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## GSD07

Jane, your comment made Cliff's above statement sound so right on! Please don't take any offense. I just don't like seeing propagating of the false stereotypes. 

Debbie, I believe this is Bass's pedigree cazar vom banach - German Shepherd Dog


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## holland

:laugh::laugh:


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## onyx'girl

Sorry if that is how my post came across. I really don't think my question was propegating a false stereotype. Just because the dog has a blocky head doesn't mean it isn't agile. The blocky/stocky structure on the other hand? Regardless of lines, I just don't see it. I know most DDR's are not stocky like the ones I was writing about.


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## carmspack

can you post the picture of the dog being discussed again


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## onyx'girl

holland said:


> :laugh::laugh:


nice contribution once again holland


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## BlackthornGSD

I love Oda's head -- in person, it's very strong but still feminine, although in these pictures, it can tend toward the masculine...


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## onyx'girl

Her color is beautiful too! What a gorgeous girl Oda is!


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## Liesje

The DDR or heavily DDR blood dogs I've seen in person have had substantial heads and solid bone but overall I found them to actually be smaller and more compact in size than, say, most WGSL, ASL and many WGWL GSDs I've seen. I think that the head, bone, and the fact that the ones I've seen were all solid black or dark sable lead to the appearance in a 2D photograph of a very formidable dog but in person that has not been my experience. They didn't seem to have any extra length to their body and while I know it's not "correct" I prefer a dog that is more square over a dog that is too long, and I do agility and flyball so structure and size is important to me.


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## robinhuerta

Christine...really nice looking girlie!


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## Chicagocanine

I like the somewhat "blocky" heads on some DDR dogs but not with loose flews. 


What do you guys think of Bianca's head? (She was supposed to be a breeding/show quality dog btw...)


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## Kev

Not gonna lie.
I like this boys head LOL
http://cdn.pedigreedatabase.com/pictures/1208.jpg


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## Freestep

Chicagocanine said:


> What do you guys think of Bianca's head? (She was supposed to be a breeding/show quality dog btw...)


Very pretty! Strong, but still feminine.


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## BlackthornGSD

robinhuerta said:


> Christine...really nice looking girlie!


Thanks!


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## guddu

This is not my dog...but a favorite head.
VÝBORNÝ, 2X CAC, Oskar z Milberku


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## elisabeth_00117

Agreed. VERY nice!

For a female, I believe Zefra (19 months) has a nice strong, yet feminine head.























































This is a male (left) of similar age (1 month younger) - he is pure WG lines, and Zefra is 1/2 Czech, 1/4 DDR, 1/4 WG working.


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## elisabeth_00117

Christine! STUNNING! Be still my beating heart...


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## Mrs.K

guddu said:


> This is not my dog...but a favorite head.
> VÝBORNÝ, 2X CAC, Oskar z Milberku


that is too much head for my taste. It's almost Mastiff looking...


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## Liesje

I love this one Carmen posted in another thread, Carmspack Beau









In fact I also really like this one on her site, Carmspack Petro









I do like a good bit of stop and a strong muzzle but the head itself doesn't have to be giant, should be proportionate to the body. I don't necessarily care that the entire face/mask is all black, but I like strong black pigment on the muzzle and some mantel (or whatever it's called) as these two dogs above illustrate. For me the heads and the overall look/conformation is very "classic", would love to have a clone of either dog


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## robk

Ruger's Head. Slightly wide set ears but very dark mask. I think he looks very west german working line.


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## BlackthornGSD

There's something about Zefra's head that makes me think of some of the Belgian GSDs I've seen. I think it's the "high 'n' tight" ears and that the hair around her neck is fairly short, so she doesn't have much of a ruff.


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## BlackthornGSD

I love Coal's head, although he could be slightly broader through the muzzle.










When he was a young dog (3 years old), his lips were all tight and firm:


















And as a 9 year old:










Note that his eye color is a pretty dark mahogany--in all the pictures but the last one, the sun is highlighting his eyes, which allows them to be seen in the pictures. I think the last picture best represents his "real life" eye color.


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## BlackthornGSD

Xita's head is probably a bit too coarse for a bitch--typical DDR type, though, and I have to admit I love it. She's the mother to the sable bitch I posted before (Oda)--who has a different head shape than her mother.










Profile from the airport, the day I got her:









Although, mostly, she's just a big cutehead:










Dorkface:


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## Xeph

Friggin love Xixi


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## PatchonGSD

I'm not an expert, but I'm going to stick my 2 cents in anyway. 

This is Robin Huerta's VP1 Paris von Huerta Hof.

















This is the perfect GSD head IMO. I think this particular female is feminine but just as strong and formidable looking as any male. Her head is not overdone, or lacking in anything. :wub:

Hope you dont mind me using your girl as my example, Robin.


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## kelina

elisabeth_00117 said:


> agreed. Very nice!
> 
> For a female, i believe zefra (19 months) has a nice strong, yet feminine head.



beaaaaautiful


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## Debbieg

I am biased but think Benny has a great head; probably his best feature.


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## elisabeth_00117

ADORABLE Christine! :wub:


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## kelina

IMO Apollo has the cutest head and body ever  
He is hot


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## kelina

Debbieg said:


> I am biased but think Benny has a great head; probably his best feature.


he is huge and gorgeous!


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## RocketDog

I think Rocket has a nice, masculine head. Of course, I don't know what I'm looking for, heh!


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## dylano

I like kais structure


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## Justaguy

Now Rocket is what I call a good looking GSD. Long hair have always been my favorite..


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## Debbieg

Rocket is gorgeous! Love his coat!:wub:


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## RocketDog

Honestly, his head is my favorite part of him. It's funny, I have always loved other long-coat dogs, but that is my least favorite part of Rocket. I never thought I would have one, it's just the way it worked out.


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## KristiM

RocketDog said:


> I think Rocket has a nice, masculine head. Of course, I don't know what I'm looking for, heh!


I'm not normally a fan of long coats.... But I would take rocket in a heartbeat:wub:


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## PatchonGSD

kristim said:


> i'm not normally a fan of long coats.... But i would take rocket in a heartbeat:wub:


ditto!


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## msvette2u

Rocket is awesome! I'd steal him if you were closer


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## 4TheDawgies

While he is only 14 months old so his head is still actually growing. I think my male Apollo has a very nice head. 










His brother has a nicer head.



I also really like my showlines head













**Oversized photos removed by Admin. Photos can not be over 800X600. Sorry. You may resize the photos and post them again**


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## ksotto333

PaddyD said:


> Female head, same dog, different angles.
> Too feminine? Needle nose? You decide.
> The ears could be more upright but she saves the upright position for rabbits, squirrels and deer.
> 
> View attachment 13754
> 
> 
> View attachment 13755
> 
> 
> View attachment 13756


I absolutely love her first picture..:wub:.what a nice looking dog..


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## GatorDog

I like Aiden's head, although I would like a little bit of a tighter lip. I think his head is strong and masculine without looking mastiff-ish.


599 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr


001 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr


_MG_5763 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr

And I like Izah's head too. She's my first female and it's hard for me to get used to not having the big block head smashing into me all the time. 


izah21 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr


izah8 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr


izah9 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr


izah13 by Gator_Dog, on Flickr


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## Piper'sgrl

I like my girls head, shes only just 10 months and still growing but its femanine and fits her body. I dont know what kind of lines she has in her though, can anyone take a guess?


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## RocketDog

I could look at this thread all day! 

And it's shown me I need to get a real photographer with a real camera, instead of just me and my iPhone LOL


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## Liesje

I think Rocket's head is very typical of Ursus; Ursus produced those large, broad heads. I know another coated dog from Ursus line (different breeder) and he could be a littermate to Rocket.


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## RocketDog

I don't even know if that's a good thing--. I do like his head, though. It seems very masculine. I am not very well versed in whether Ursus' head is desirable, however.


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## Liesje

I like it. I mean, if I was a breeder I wouldn't say I like it enough to keep linebreeding on Ursus specifically for this trait, but all things equal I personally prefer big, wide head, maybe even what some would say is too big/wide (neither of my males have heads like this though, hence why I say "all thing equal" I'd take the nice head). I'm picky about ears too and I like Rocket's better than Nikon's.


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## hattifattener

which Ursus are you talking about? 

Ursus von Batu?


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## lhczth

For female heads I always loved Nike's head. 

At 2.5.









And at 9










I never liked Vala's as much. Her muzzle is a bit narrower than her mother's. 

At 2









and at 6










But then Deja's head reminds me of both (mom and grandma).


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## lhczth

And for a boy, Mr. Handsome (Navarre, Vala's brother) who I always felt had a very masculine without being too big boy head.




























And it fit his body. 










And he is just a really cool dog.


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## RocketDog

I love that second picture of him!


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## Sunflowers

Hans's head keeps changing. 
Here is the latest version.


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## Catu

Months ago I said on this same thread that the only thing I didn't like of Akela's head was the loose lips, but someone about then told me he may outfrow those. Luckily he did.

Really I don't know how "correct" his head is according the standard, I just love it as it is and I can't ask for better.


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## GrammaD

Saw the pictures Lisa posted, followed her link, and all I can say is be still my heart regarding Donovan zu Treuen Händen TR1 AD who should definitely have his head shot here, imo. 

My fellow has droopy flews at the moment- and I do hope we have the same outcome as Catu in that regard. But I love Huxley's head - he has almost finished growing into his ears 










He had this noble look to his face even as a silly puppy


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## marshies

I really love Puppy's head. I am tremendously biased, but she has grown to be such a beautiful girl. Her head, in my completely biased opinion, is girly, expressive, but has that broader, blockier shape that I like. Her eyes are always soft, and she always has a sappy expression for me when we cuddle.

Almost a year old:










A little past a year old:










15 months:










Capable of a multitude of expressions, always feminine, always pretty. Please ignore the light nose...her nose is dark, but she has been rubbing the ground with it lately. She does it in the winter for some strange reason.

From the side:


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## lhczth

GrammaD, I actually think I posted Donovan on here earlier in the thread (this is an older thread), but here he is again. 

With all of his bling. 










From the front. I don't like his ear set. Too much like his mom's. 










Ball?










And with his brother Drigon who has the better ear set.


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## Andaka

Jag's head










Tag and Kizzy (1/2 brother and sister)


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## Catu

lhczth said:


> And with his brother Drigon who has the better ear set.


I can't help to love broad heads. Drigon head is super!


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## Cassidy's Mom

I don't have too many pictures with both dogs together where they both look good (and are DRY!), but here's one I like:










The lighting isn't perfect, but I cropped it down to show their heads. I don't know how technically correct it is, but I always thought Dena had a beautiful head:


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## RocketDog

Keefer is the reddest dog I've ever seen!! 

And I love Halo's little blond long hair on each side...such a girl!


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