# Best feed or supplement to firm up soft stool?



## vfrank (Sep 12, 2016)

We have a 10 week old White Swiss Shepherd (Berger Blanc Suisse) that we got two weeks ago from a very respected breeder. She's generally a happy bright lovely puppy, but her stool has been loose since the second day after we brought her home, and she went through a brief phase when she lost her appetite for about 12 hours. We have been feeding her Fromm Heartland Gold Large breed puppy kibble, the same feed she was on at her breeders (she sent us home with five pounds) She was checked by our vet a few days after we brought her home and then three days later on the day she lost her appetite. She was negative for parasites, parvo, and giardia. The vet thought she might have a mild bacterial infection and prescribed metronizidale, and recommended adding in Hills prescription ZD canned food. She's still on the antibiotics and her appetite is fine, but her stool is still somewhat soft. She's been perfect about house training and hasn't had any accidents and has bm's 3-4 times a day. Any suggestions on feed or additives? Do we just need to wait it out?


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

were antibiotics really necessary?


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## Gers4lyfe (Aug 3, 2016)

She seems young to be teething. 

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## Gers4lyfe (Aug 3, 2016)

Gers4lyfe said:


> She seems young to be teething. That would be the first thing I rule out. I would also rule out chews such as raw hides or faux bones. From experience I find even with older dogs and across breeds they can impact stool rigidity. On the same note calcium from real bones will harden them right up. So.
> With a pup however I would consider, is he/She teething, am I supplementing her duet with threats or chess I can rule out as a cause by eliminating them for 2 to 3 days.
> 
> 
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## Gers4lyfe (Aug 3, 2016)

I hate auto correct. 
Duet- meals
Threats- treats
chess- chew s 


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Seems random to prescribe antibiotics and of course nothing is better than the vet's own food. Maybe it is just stress from the move from mom and sibs to new home. Give her some rest and let her adjust a bit. You have to finish antibiotics to prevent resistance to the meds.
I have said it so many times that some may find this irritating but I always start with raw green tripe if they have something wrong with their gut, given that the fecals came back negative. That stuff is amazing and works like medicine.


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## CarrieJo (Oct 1, 2016)

can pumpkin


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/health-issues/666578-post-antibiotic-age.html 

don't be surprised if the dog has loose stool after the course of (unnecessary) antibiotic treatment .

then the vet will recommend another course - till you have a chronic situation with other immune challenges
because at that point you will have significantly altered the gut flora, a customer for life for the vet.

you could have given pumpkin, slippery elm, probiotic rich food such as yogurt , KEFIR, supplement ,
even rice water , or time for the pup to adjust .

and while you are at it have a read on vaccinations - vaccinosis - Dr Jean Dodd's protocol etc

there are "hundreds" of posts on this forum


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## CarrieJo (Oct 1, 2016)

I would think more parasites or there is other things than giardia A lot of test can give false positives and false negatives. . I hope she didn't get a blockage. Our puppy went through so much and the vet said her poo she was having could be one of 4 things. The vet started treating her for them one at a time. She also had hookworms and roundworms too. Took me forever to get rid of her worms and what ever else it was she had. But the vet did tell me to also give her can pumpkin to help her digestive tract. She doesn't have any trouble now but I have plans on buying up canned pumpkin when they go on sale real cheap during thanksgiving. IF anyone has a reason why I should not give pumpkin to my dogs please let me know and why. I believe what finally worked for my baby was being put on a dormer for several days (more than normal) but can't remember which the vet was suspecting at that time. If you want to know what it was message me and I will look it up in her files. I was very very careful to keep records from the shelter so I could not only know what all was done but to give to the regular vet if needed after the adoption was complete.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

canned pumpkin is a bit of a band-aide .

okay to give in addition to whatever else you are feeding , no harm , but probiotics would be much much better especially for a rescued shelter dog (thanks for that) who may have had intestinal damage from the parasites .

this might have set up permeability of the intestines setting the stage for food sensitivities.

there are some probiotic preparations which will firm stool -- but not heal a leaky gut .


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I still don't understand the hype about pumpkin. Hasn't that started a life of its own here?


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

um , it's the great pumpkin , Charlie Brown ?

pumpkin will affect the motility by binding up and slowing down the peristaltic action of the bowel.


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## vfrank (Sep 12, 2016)

Well, we've now finished the course of metronizadole and it's made no real difference. She's been on pumpkin and probiotics, neither of which have made a difference either. Now we are trying adding rice. She had two fecal exams, the first the day we did the wellness check and the other three days later, both of which were negative. She was dewormed once at the breeders before we got her. The next thing we'll probably try is eliminating chicken, since her breeder mentioned that her sire was allergic to chicken. She has been getting the same Fromm Gold large breed puppy kibble that she was fed at the breeder, but she was still nursing a bit when we got her at 8 weeks. We'v never given her cheese or people food, and we've primarily been using her kibble as treats, although she got a little bit of freeze dried pure beef liver a few days ago as a high value treat. Other than the loose stool she is happy, energetic, and has a tremendous appetite, and she's growing like a weed.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

"She's been on pumpkin and probiotics, neither of which have made a difference either"

the dog has been on antibiotics which made no difference except alter the gut flora .
the dog has been on pumpkin which is a binder to slow down digested food in the bowel so that fluid can be withdrawn and recycled = formed stool 

the dog has been on probiotics -- what , when , and how matters -- and it takes time for the necessary bacteria to colonize --- synbiotic --- not just a probiotic on its own -- prebiotics to feed the bacteria 

what is special about this loose stool. colour, smell , volume ?

regarding stool examination you said "She had two fecal exams, the first the day we did the wellness check and the other three days later, both of which were negative. She was dewormed once at the breeders before we got her"

generally a single deworming is not adequate .

if the breeder did a deworming relatively close to your bringing the pup home the stool should have shown as negative .

that is good management . 

checking the stool again 3 days later would show up negative , a useless test . It takes 10 to 12 days for any parasite eggs to hatch and show up in stool . Generally you do successive dewormings at least 2 or 3 times spaced 10 to 12 days apart.


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## vfrank (Sep 12, 2016)

I just wanted to loop back and say that this issue has finally resolved, right before we were going to put her on an allergy elimination diet. We did a third fecal test at the vet's this morning just to be safe, but all three have been negative so I don't think she has parasites. She didn't show signs of parasites before the first deworming, but the breeder did the initial deworming because one of the other dogs had an empty egg case on their fecal test. She's 22'2 this morning so she's certainly eating well and gaining weight. Who knows, maybe the probiotics just needed time to work, and the antibiotics were probably unnecessary, but we were a little worried when she stopped eating. Since we have horses and other animals on the property we have a fairly bacteria rich environment, but in the future I will probably lean against using the antibiotics unless she actually tests positive for something. Thanks for all the advice!


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