# Starting Raw, have some questions



## shaner (Oct 17, 2010)

I'm going to be starting Titan on a raw diet. He's had a chicken quarter so far and did really well, so I'm going to jump right in. I've read a ton, but still have some questions. 

Is heart a muscle meat or organ? I've read it's a MM. Does that apply to all heart, or are certain animal hearts MM and some organs? I've read a lot of raw recipes and diets and never see chicken hearts mentioned. Are chicken hearts okay to feed, are they MM or organ?

Is all meat with bone in it considered RMB? In my fridge is a chicken quarter with a ton of raw chicken on it. It's got a fair bit of bone too, but it's a large piece with a lot of chicken. Is that entire thing considered a RMB, or do I need to carve off some of the chicken? If I need to carve off some, how do I know how much to remove? 

I read that chicken thighs have a very sharp, needle like bone in them that should be removed, but have never seen that mentioned here. Anyone know anything about this? 

Lastly, I'm wondering if you guys would mind helping me to develop my diet. For RMB, MM and organ, can you please list some of the things you feed your dog, preferably in order of how often you feed it. I'm still trying to figure out what my dogs diet is going to look like. I want to have this written down on paper before I start messing with my dogs nutrition. Sometimes I think about what I'm going to feed, and I kind of draw a blank. I know the obvious ones, but I want to make sure I get lots of variety, I'm just not sure what all to feed, and I'm not sure how much and how often variety is needed.


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## Verivus (Nov 7, 2010)

Heart, no matter the source, is always considered MM. Chicken hearts are fine, they're just rather small for a GSD compared to say... cow hearts. All meats with a fair amount of bone is considered an RMB. A chicken leg 1/4 is an RMB. No need to cut off any of the meat just because it's meaty. I've never heard of removing a bone from chicken thighs. My dogs chomp it down with no problems.

What I typically feed:

MM: beef, pork, lamb, bison, elk (ground & whole)
RMB: chicken, beef, pork, lamb (backs, ribs, etc)
OM: a variety of thymus, liver, kidney & spleen from chicken, beef and pork

with some variation in between depending on what I can get. I don't like giving beef bones as RMBs, but my GSD does not like chicken very much and it's not worth the fight. Once in a rare while I'll add fish, but I'll typically supplement wild salmon oil instead.


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## shaner (Oct 17, 2010)

Verivus said:


> Heart, no matter the source, is always considered MM. Chicken hearts are fine, they're just rather small for a GSD compared to say... cow hearts. All meats with a fair amount of bone is considered an RMB. A chicken leg 1/4 is an RMB. No need to cut off any of the meat just because it's meaty. I've never heard of removing a bone from chicken thighs. My dogs chomp it down with no problems.
> 
> What I typically feed:
> 
> ...


Thanks. Can you tell me exactly which RMB's you use from beef, pork and lamb? I'm just curious what to feed for RMB's other than chicken. I'm not about to give my dog a T-bone steak, that is way too expensive. What beef is good for a RMB, and why don't you like using beef for RMB's?


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## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

I'm going to be starting Titan on a raw diet. He's had a chicken quarter so far and did really well, so I'm going to jump right in. I'm a huge advocate of raw but I would not suggest jumping right in. I did a lot of reading like you but did not have a balanced plan and my poor boy ended up with loose stool then constipation and actually puked a couple times. My bad. I've read a ton, but still have some questions. 

Is heart a muscle meat or organ? I've read it's a MM. You are correct, heart is Muscle Meat. Does that apply to all heart, or are certain animal hearts MM and some organs?All I've read a lot of raw recipes and diets and never see chicken hearts mentioned. Are chicken hearts okay to feed, are they MM or organ? Yes chicken hearts are ok. But organ meat is good too...just in moderation. In my plan its 5% of the diet. I overfed OM in the beginning and it caused severe diarrhea.

Is all meat with bone in it considered RMB? It depends. Because IMO its important to provide a balanced diet of RMB, MM & OM, you should familiarize yourself with what is considered MM & RMB. In my fridge is a chicken quarter with a ton of raw chicken on it. It's got a fair bit of bone too, but it's a large piece with a lot of chicken. Is that entire thing considered a RMB, or do I need to carve off some of the chicken? If I need to carve off some, how do I know how much to remove? Thats a tough question for me. Chicken quarters are what we feed most. If I give the dogs a chicken quarter then I feed less MM. If I feed legs, thighs or necks then I add more MM. Does that make sense? 

I read that chicken thighs have a very sharp, needle like bone in them that should be removed, but have never seen that mentioned here. Anyone know anything about this? No I have not heard about this. We feed thighs a lot. I'm interested to hear more about this from others. 

Lastly, I'm wondering if you guys would mind helping me to develop my diet. For RMB, MM and organ, can you please list some of the things you feed your dog, preferably in order of how often you feed it. I'm still trying to figure out what my dogs diet is going to look like. I want to have this written down on paper before I start messing with my dogs nutrition. Sometimes I think about what I'm going to feed, and I kind of draw a blank. I know the obvious ones, but I want to make sure I get lots of variety, I'm just not sure what all to feed, and I'm not sure how much and how often variety is needed. You are going about this a lot better than I did. I asked for help after I screwed up  Anyway, I strongly suggest you visit this site. Welcome to the Raw Dog Ranch

Good luck!


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## Verivus (Nov 7, 2010)

Beef bones are typically much harder then pork/lamb/chicken which means it's harder on their teeth. Harder, denser bones means a higher chance for tooth fractures which are not fun for the dog or the pocketbook. I typically stick with the softer parts such as pork/lamb ribs or necks, but my co-op has a cheap meat program with a local butcher who provides fresh cuts (beef, pork, chicken) that they can't sell (ie customer wants 3 lbs of a 4 lb roast, that extra 1 lb if not sold gets tossed in the cheap meat pile). Can't pass it up for the price ($0.25/lb), and some of the cuts do have pretty big pieces of bone, so I just let him chew on them.


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## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

oh also I just wanted to add...it may seem complicated at first but it really isn't. The poop will guide you


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

shaner said:


> I'm going to be starting Titan on a raw diet. He's had a chicken quarter so far and did really well, so I'm going to jump right in. I've read a ton, but still have some questions.


Good for you (and Titan)! It's not really all that difficult - just a few simple guidelines to follow.

Heart is a muscle, no matter what animal it comes from. I have a much easier time finding beef and pork hearts than chicken - don't know why.



> Is all meat with bone in it considered RMB?


The key is - is it EDIBLE bone? All chicken parts are edible bones for GSDs so they would all be RMBs. My Chinese Cresteds can't handle chicken legs - those would be recreational bones for them.


In my fridge is a chicken quarter with a ton of raw chicken on it. It's got a fair bit of bone too, but it's a large piece with a lot of chicken. Is that entire thing considered a RMB, or do I need to carve off some of the chicken? If I need to carve off some, how do I know how much to remove? 

I read that chicken thighs have a very sharp, needle like bone in them that should be removed, but have never seen that mentioned here. Anyone know anything about this? 

How much to feed depends on the dogs age, current weight and activity level. There are basic guidelines but they are GUIDELINES because each dog is different.

My 3 adult Cresteds all weigh about the same but they eat VERY different amounts. Kaynya, my girl, only gets about 3.5 - 4 ounces at each meal. The boys get 4.5 - 5 ounces each meal. They burn alot more calories than she does.

Check out my website for the basic info on how to plan your dogs diet.


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