# Dog Joring? Scooters and bikes?



## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

I saw a video of this recently and it looked really fun! Does anyone have experience with it? Is there a good cheap scooter out there that works pretty well? Do you normally do it on a paved trail or off road? And what age would be good to start this? Ours will be a year in mid January, how long would you wait for the hips?


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

I'm going to start working my 13-month old malinois girl in harness just about now. She'll be new to pulling but I think she's going to be FAST! 

I prefer skijoring, but have done some bikejoring and canicross. 

I recommend a non-stop brand harness for shepherds, I was running my 6 year old malinois in a normal x-back harness used for sled dogs and the straps dug into her ribs- shepherds are built a bit differently. Non-stop harness works great! 

Make sure you get a line with bungee incorporated. Non-stop makes these, as do many other vendors. Just Google it. Bungee is a must- you need that give for you and the dog's safety and comfort. 

You can buy a scooter if you want or just use a bike. Depends on what you are looking for- the Diggler scooters seem to get good reviews but I prefer the bike because I already know how to handle it safely. 

I like the booklet "Training Lead Dogs", as a good primer on how to properly train a Lead Dog- which is what your dog is, if he is solo up front. You can also by "Skijor with your Dog"- it covers dryland as well as skijor. 

I almost always run dogs on dirt or soft surfaces. Pavement can be safe for short distances, depending on the dog. 

Start with very short distances with just canicross and work your way up to about 5 K- that's about as far as I'd expect even a great GSD to be able to really run all-out once trained up. I'm sure there are exceptions- and I'm talking about a gallop-sprint, not a trot. Shepherds can go for miles and miles at a trot. 

And... here's how fun it is- this is a 



of last winter, with my 3-year old, 93 lber. We have fun!


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

Muskeg said:


> I'm going to start working my 13-month old malinois girl in harness just about now. She'll be new to pulling but I think she's going to be FAST!
> 
> I prefer skijoring, but have done some bikejoring and canicross.
> 
> ...



OH MY GOSH!!! Thank you for sharing that video that is the coolest thing ever!!!!! What is the difference between skijoring ,bikejoring and canicross? Were you on a bike then in that video? Do you use some sort of safety release on the leash in case if the dog bolts for some reason?


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

They is much info on forum about harnesses and bike boring which I got on this forum. I use the bike.
You can do a little bit but not so much until he turns 16-18 months. I go on dirt paths. I started out when max was a puppy hooked onto a plastic light sled and practiced rights lefts - whoa for stop and mush for go or what you want to use and then just move over to the bike. They learn fast. Your boy sure will have fun and you will have to have him where his collar lol! This where I got my harnesses. Luna is next have to get her started. It is so much fun you can go into carting sledding anything to get through the winter and get them out! https://howlingdogalaska.com/collections/harnesses/products/wheel-dog-harness


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

Yall and your snow photos are killing me here, we're in Florida lol! I WISH we got snow! :laugh2: Where do you normally take the dogs to do this?


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

They have those light plastic sleds that can easily pull on concrete or dirt to get them used to pulling something behind them. I ran with them through a ball. Went down to the other end of the trail and called them to get him started. If you can find some trails or empty parking lots dead end streets it’s good places. Bikejorimg is really fast so I would stick to trails or somewhere with no traffic. My daughter is taking carting lesson with Luna next week!


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Muskeg! I love your video and the music all these Christmas threads and cute gsds in the xmas spirit is getting me in the spirit!!!!


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

What do you use to attach the leash to the bike or do you just hold to to the leash while you bike?


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

You attach it to the bike with a scooter post connector. there is a website I will attach. There is a noodle type thing so the lead does not get caught up in the spokes.
http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=33

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EqOJUHdBr8A


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

Jenny720 said:


> You attach it to the bike with a scooter post connector. there is a website I will attach. There is a noodle type thing so the lead does not get caught up in the spokes.
> Alpine Outfitters - Your One-Stop Shop for Quality Working Dog Gear
> 
> https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EqOJUHdBr8A


Super helpful thank you!! I can't wait to try it, maybe for his birthday :smile2:!


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

I would do this with Zelda if she didn't have bad hips.  Looks like great fun for everyone! What a great job to have! Just make sure that you dont get a harness that is going to put pressure on the hips. Because GSD's have a longer body it can fit differently than on the typical mushing dog.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Oh my, I would love to do that too. What an awesome and fun videos and pictures. What happens when life happens? (squirrels, sudden scent in their nose etc.). I have some back issues and cannot afford a good tumbling. How do you get them 'reliable'?


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## voodoolamb (Jun 21, 2015)

wolfy dog said:


> Oh my, I would love to do that too. What an awesome and fun videos and pictures. What happens when life happens? (squirrels, sudden scent in their nose etc.). I have some back issues and cannot afford a good tumbling. How do you get them 'reliable'?


The same way you get a dog reliable for anything... proof it! proof it! proof it!

When I was into urban mushing with my past dogs, we did A LOT of ground work without wheeled equipment first. Then more ground work with me walking beside the scooter. Then I stared riding.


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

To get them reliable, you have to make the running and pulling a reward in itself. It's a tricky concept. Reading the booklet "Training Lead Dogs" takes you through the process. In a pinch, I can holler "on-by" and the dog knows to continue straight ahead. But that is generally just understood, the dog knows she needs to run by distractions, that's the job.

You know how you can make certain behaviors self rewarding? Pulling is something most dogs enjoy, but you can build their drive for pulling in a few different ways. 

Also, with our shepherdy dogs, you've got to make sure you aren't building up frustration in harness to go after the wrong thing- because if done incorrectly, whoops, that can happen. 

I'll try to get some videos as I work through the process with my yearling. I like to start with the basic concept of line-out and then go from there.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

If your dog is wanting to drag you through through the woods on a leash if they see a squirrel or a deer then obedience needs to be worked on. It’s in many steps as voodoolamb mentioned. The book muskeg mentioned is good and tons of YouTube videos.
When bikejoring max would want to stop if he smelled Something on a trail so I had to watch him and made sure he kept moving before he stopped to get a whiff of something- it didn’t matter if we were flying down the trail he seemed to think it was easy not to run him over. When I go on a regular bike ride and use the dog walky there is no confusion as to what is expected. The harness I posted the wheel dog harness from howling dog Alaska does not put pressure on the back or hips.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

This was another video I liked if you use a bike. She talk about some different harnesses and how to put them on and talks about equipment and such. 
https://youtu.be/jgKwEdkCOUU


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Deja walks/runs nicely next to my bike off leash and is consistent. So there is hope I guess.


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

Wolfy- there's a ton of hope! I like to start really short, kind of like for focused heeling, you start with the position and 'feel'- keeping the line tight in front of the person. Reinforce that and make sure the dog understands her job. Then run them for super short, like 400 meters, make sure that is perfect, and gradually increase distance, and distractions. If you break it down into steps, like with any training, it becomes more manageable. 

I see some dogs that just hook up and go. And if your dog does that, great, you have a winner. But with a more thinking breed, like a shepherd, it really makes a difference to actually take the effort to train them, so they know their job, and to treat it just like any trained skill.


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

Gandalf is great on leash, we run into distractions all the time walking like squirrels jumping out right in front of us and crazy dogs on the other side of the street. He never lunges or pulls and definitely respects the leash. Off leash he has tried my patience a few times  but has made significant improvements since then. I wonder when you start biking with them though and learning to pull how does that effect their on leash walking? I feel like he is probably smart enough to know the difference. So far he has no interest in stopping to smell things or mark but this might change as he matures?


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

They seem to know the difference once hooked up to bike , sled , scooter etc. in the woods lots of wild cats, deer, turkeys and who knows what else and I have not had any issues. This was a video of max when he was little pup getting used to pulling something light behind him then added weight gradually. 
https://youtu.be/O98c-wfZsTM

This is the link to the book muskeg mentioned 
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003GGTQ50/


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## Solamar (Jan 25, 2017)

I thought I had posted on this thread back in November, guess not. But I was definitely inspired!

I called Alpine Outfitters and spoke with a very helpful and knowledgeable lady that got me all setup for BikeJoring for under $100 (not with the bike of course), wrapped it all up for my GSD's Christmas present.

X-Back harness
Scooter noodle
6' Bungee line

We have been having an absolute blast! I optimistically hooked her up to my mtn bike for the first attempt, we had a few exciting moments, she instinctively wanted to pull, but we were truly a hot mess... Over the past few weeks we have been practicing on foot, fast walking, and a bit of jogging. Amazing how fast Gee, Haw and Hike! make perfect sense to a dog, must be sounds that they can easily identify with. Stopping to smell yummy things has been a bit of a struggle, her "Leave It" was pretty good, but she has realized that on a harness with me 6' behind, she has a few extra moments to sniff before leaving it. In fact that disconnect has been one of the more rewarding parts of this journey, it is ALL voice command. Over the past year (teaching her NOT to pull) the combination of verbal commands and leash pressure has worked well, now we get to proof it all without the leash pressure. 

I was worried that teaching to pull would mess up her leash manners. So far thats not an issue, I think the sensation of the harness on her chest is soo different to a regular leash and collar that she understands these are two different activities.

An added bonus is a couple miles of her pulling wipes her out, nap time for the rest of the day. Looking forward to becoming a smoother team on the mtn bike soon!


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Solamar- yes they seem to know what they need to do. It is great exercise for everyone quite exhilarating and fun. I took one cart lesson with Luna just to get to know how to use the cart and what equipment to get -which is something we want to get into also have to look for a cart they can be expensive. Luna did really well and have to practice cart pulling when we get a cart. I have a video of max and Luna just pulling a light sled together I was just missing the jingle bells. Which I did get at a later date lol! I was going for the Santa’s reindeer look! It’s been way to cold out though to go sledding this last snow. 
https://youtu.be/3Vtp-cB4_go


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