# What is the "out" command?



## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

I have taught Place, Leave It, Wait, Off, Go, Back and a lot of other words. I keep seeing people talking about an Out command and I have no idea what that is. How did I miss it? I wonder if it's the same behavior I've taught using a different command and why none of our trainers either private or in classes, ever use it.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

If you have something in your mouth spit it out. Could be a ball, could be a frisbee, could be a tug, could be a person.


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## HappyGoLucky (Apr 7, 2016)

I use it for him to literally get out of something, such as out of the car, out of the closet, "lets go OUT" accompanied by me putting shoes on. When I just put the shoes on without "out", he knows it's tough sh!tsky :laugh2: he stays to guard the house and looks at me with betrayed look behind the glass door... it's heartbreaking..  lol. For things like that.
He also knows "out" to let something out of the mouth when we play (or it's something he shouldn't have) and I have my hand on the object to let it go. 

"Leave" I use when he just goes for something out on walks, or get's distracted and stares at something. Just to shift his attention away from the object.

Maybe I'm doing it all wrong though.. haha. But it seems to me the most fitting commands for situations. I was worried a little at first that he may be confusing "out" with too many meanings, but he is pretty clever boy and definitely uses other cues to figure out what want him to do at the time.


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## DobbyDad (Jan 28, 2014)

Baillif said:


> If you have something in your mouth spit it out. Could be a ball, could be a frisbee, could be a tug, could be a person.


This is the one most people are referring to.


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

Yes, "out" means release what is in your mouth. Usually used with bite work as the command to let go of the sleeve, suit or person. Also, it can be used to release a ball, toy or what ever else is in the dog's mouth. 

In German it is "aus", in Dutch it is "Los", the translation to english is "out."


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Baillif said:


> If you have something in your mouth spit it out. Could be a ball, could be a frisbee, could be a tug, could be a person.


Thank you.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Slamdunc said:


> Yes, "out" means release what is in your mouth. Usually used with bite work as the command to let go of the sleeve, suit or person. Also, it can be used to release a ball, toy or what ever else is in the dog's mouth.
> 
> In German it is "aus", in Dutch it is "Los", the translation to english is "out."


That is simpler than Drop it. By the time I say that, he has already moved on to something else. I'm using Leave it when I want him to ignore or not pick something up. This makes more sense.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

I have a drop it for non sport stuff because out needs to happen instantly or its wrong. It's a non formal command I nag them for. I also just no and correct a dog for picking up stuff I never want them messing with or at least not messing with unless told otherwise. Rolls of toilet paper/shoes/clothing items/etc. There is no point in continuing to tell a dog to drop stuff they shouldn't be picking up in the first place. Just correct them for picking it up.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Baillif said:


> I have a drop it for non sport stuff because out needs to happen instantly or its wrong. It's a non formal command I nag them for. I also just no and correct a dog for picking up stuff I never want them messing with or at least not messing with unless told otherwise. Rolls of toilet paper/shoes/clothing items/etc. There is no point in continuing to tell a dog to drop stuff they shouldn't be picking up in the first place. Just correct them for picking it up.


Good point. I've been using drop it for toys when I throw them in the yard. It's just for play. I use leave it when I want to pull away their attention in advance, but my older dog will drop anything for the leave it command. I'm not going to change commands for her. The puppy is just now learning. I rarely use No, because I save that for very important things. My negative marker word is uh-uh when they almost have something right but not quite. It means try again.

My biggest challenge is getting other people to use the words I use. I have used Ok for a release word, but I need to remember to use something else because people say Ok all the time in regular conversation and release my dog accidentally when I don't want to.


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

I use the two balls on a rope game to teach the out from a pup. I use "out" to get the dogs to drop toys or "out" a bite. I teach it with toys and proof it with a person in a sleeve or suit. It's all the same thing to me. 

I do use "leave it" if the dog is going to pick up something it shouldn't. I also use "leave it" if the dog is about to pick up a toy I just told it to out. In sport or work, I have no issues with my dogs cleanly outing a suit, sleeve or a "live bite" if the suspect is relatively compliant. But, I rarely out my dog off a suspect that is not compliant or still combative. 

One funny thing that I noticed yesterday was Boru, my new dog who is KNOV titled and trained in Dutch, dropped his toy when I said "out." It is progress as he was toy possessive and handler aggressive. I have been using "Los" with him, but Dutch is my third dog training language. My other dogs have always been English and / or German. Tonight, Boru was bringing his toy back, dropping it on the "out" and calmly allowing me to pick it up and continue the game. Sounds silly and trivial, but it is progress. I still haven't gotten bit yet, not hard at least. 

*"My biggest challenge is getting other people to use the words I use. I have used Ok for a release word, but I need to remember to use something else because people say Ok all the time in regular conversation and release my dog accidentally when I don't want to."*

I use "OK" for a release, I had to remove that word from my vocabulary when I am working with my dogs. My dogs will not listen to anyone else, so that is not a problem. Your dog should be released by anyone but you, except maybe a family member. Certainly, not friends or strangers.


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Baillif said:


> I have a drop it for non sport stuff because out needs to happen instantly or its wrong. It's a non formal command I nag them for. I also just no and correct a dog for picking up stuff I never want them messing with or at least not messing with unless told otherwise. Rolls of toilet paper/shoes/clothing items/etc. There is no point in continuing to tell a dog to drop stuff they shouldn't be picking up in the first place. Just correct them for picking it up.


Dang! What is with them and that toilet paper?


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Slamdunc said:


> I use the two balls on a rope game to teach the out from a pup. I use "out" to get the dogs to drop toys or "out" a bite. I teach it with toys and proof it with a person in a sleeve or suit. It's all the same thing to me.
> 
> I do use "leave it" if the dog is going to pick up something it shouldn't. I also use "leave it" if the dog is about to pick up a toy I just told it to out. In sport or work, I have no issues with my dogs cleanly outing a suit, sleeve or a "live bite" if the suspect is relatively compliant. But, I rarely out my dog off a suspect that is not compliant or still combative.
> 
> ...


How do you teach them to drop something immediately if they want to hold onto it? My 7 month old doesn't like to give up toys. He will spit out a throw toy (I use various tug toys as throwing toys) if I have another one in my hand. But when I am ready to take the toys away and end the session, he will jump up and grab them out of my hand to keep playing. I'm working on how to correct that when he is unleashed in the yard and haven't come up with a solution.

How do you teach your dogs only to respond to a release command from family members or just from you? People always want to ask my dog to sit or shake or lie down, and then reward him for doing so in ways I wouldn't do myself. If he won't respond, then how do I leave him with someone else if we go on vacation?


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Dang! What is with them and that toilet paper?


You mean they aren't supposed to grab a corner and unroll it all the way into the next room?


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

LuvShepherds said:


> You mean they aren't supposed to grab a corner and unroll it all the way into the next room?


Mine run around the house with them in their mouths, better than toys!


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

LuvShepherds said:


> How do you teach them to drop something immediately if they want to hold onto it? My 7 month old doesn't like to give up toys. He will spit out a throw toy (I use various tug toys as throwing toys) if I have another one in my hand. But when I am ready to take the toys away and end the session, he will jump up and grab them out of my hand to keep playing. I'm working on how to correct that when he is unleashed in the yard and haven't come up with a solution.
> 
> How do you teach your dogs only to respond to a release command from family members or just from you? People always want to ask my dog to sit or shake or lie down, and then reward him for doing so in ways I wouldn't do myself. If he won't respond, then how do I leave him with someone else if we go on vacation?


I do not let anyone give my dogs commands. My wife can give commands in English, but she does not use the dog's German commands. 

I do it in my obedience and teach my dog to ignore other people. I will set up an exercise with my dog in the "down stay" for example. I will then have some one else give him his release commands or call the dog. If the dog breaks, he is corrected for breaking the down stay. Opposition training works very well for this. Before I progress to other people trying to give my dogs commands, I proof the down stay by throwing toys and enticing him to break. Or working a second dog directly in front of the other dog in a down and letting the second dog literally run over the first dog chasing a toy. If your dog can handle those distractions and temptations then other people giving commands is easy for the dog to ignore.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Slamdunc said:


> I do not let anyone give my dogs commands. My wife can give commands in English, but she does not use the dog's German commands.
> 
> I do it in my obedience and teach my dog to ignore other people. I will set up an exercise with my dog in the "down stay" for example. I will then have some one else give him his release commands or call the dog. If the dog breaks, he is corrected for breaking the down stay. * Opposition training works very well for this.*


Uh oh time to call ... dumb it down (Baillif) used to hear that a lot from me. :laugh2:

What is "Opposition training??"


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

I use "Out" as described, something in your mouth drop it. And since I was a "Boxer" guy ... I also used "NO" a lot! Struddell heard "NO" so often ... I was worried she thought it was her name! 

For us it meant "not now, not ever," she was always doing something new and different, that she ought not to be doing, worked out fine. My form of "crittering." ,


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Slamdunc said:


> I do not let anyone give my dogs commands. My wife can give commands in English, but she does not use the dog's German commands.
> 
> I do it in my obedience and teach my dog to ignore other people. I will set up an exercise with my dog in the "down stay" for example. I will then have some one else give him his release commands or call the dog. If the dog breaks, he is corrected for breaking the down stay. Opposition training works very well for this. Before I progress to other people trying to give my dogs commands, I proof the down stay by throwing toys and enticing him to break. Or working a second dog directly in front of the other dog in a down and letting the second dog literally run over the first dog chasing a toy. If your dog can handle those distractions and temptations then other people giving commands is easy for the dog to ignore.


Same here. In addition, I use a board so there are clear boundaries for the dog on placement. He knows not to come off the board.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

> How do you teach them to drop something immediately if they want to hold onto it? My 7 month old doesn't like to give up toys. He will spit out a throw toy (I use various tug toys as throwing toys) if I have another one in my hand. But when I am ready to take the toys away and end the session, he will jump up and grab them out of my hand to keep playing. I'm working on how to correct that when he is unleashed in the yard and haven't come up with a solution.


You have to do a lot of repetitions with them so that the command itself is clear. If you've been using two toys, its probably better if you lose one for now. You can keep a leash on him and let him move around with the toy in a circle. Stop, tell him out and if he doesn't drop it, correct him.

If he's ignoring you at a distance like your describing in the yard, have a leash handy, calmly go to him, put the leash on so you can correct him, then take it off again. Make him think you can always leash him just like you can always reward him. 

Don't end anything off leash right now. When he brings the toy to you, leash him, move around a little so you don't cause any conflict with him coming to you, and then out him and end it. Keep it all calm and relaxed.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Slamdunc said:


> I do not let anyone give my dogs commands. My wife can give commands in English, but she does not use the dog's German commands.
> 
> I do it in my obedience and teach my dog to ignore other people. I will set up an exercise with my dog in the "down stay" for example. I will then have some one else give him his release commands or call the dog. If the dog breaks, he is corrected for breaking the down stay. Opposition training works very well for this. Before I progress to other people trying to give my dogs commands, I proof the down stay by throwing toys and enticing him to break. Or working a second dog directly in front of the other dog in a down and letting the second dog literally run over the first dog chasing a toy. If your dog can handle those distractions and temptations then other people giving commands is easy for the dog to ignore.


I can try that. We are still far from working successfully with distractions, other than the dogs in his obedience class.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Steve Strom said:


> You have to do a lot of repetitions with them so that the command itself is clear. If you've been using two toys, its probably better if you lose one for now. You can keep a leash on him and let him move around with the toy in a circle. Stop, tell him out and if he doesn't drop it, correct him.
> 
> If he's ignoring you at a distance like your describing in the yard, have a leash handy, calmly go to him, put the leash on so you can correct him, then take it off again. Make him think you can always leash him just like you can always reward him.
> 
> Don't end anything off leash right now. When he brings the toy to you, leash him, move around a little so you don't cause any conflict with him coming to you, and then out him and end it. Keep it all calm and relaxed.


I'll do that. I got a long line to do distance work and haven't started using it yet. He would be able to catch a toy on that line but still feel a correction from a distance.

He is pretty good about letting me leash him, unless he is really worked up and then he wants to go where the toy is and not be tied down. But I worked on grabbing his collar when he comes to me so that isn't too much of a problem.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Chip18 said:


> Uh oh time to call ... dumb it down (Baillif) used to hear that a lot from me. :laugh2:
> 
> What is "Opposition training??"


He pretty much described a procedure for you. The dog is trained to take a command only from him, by correcting him for taking the command from anyone else. A form of it is used sometimes in personal protection. A dog that understands the world no or out from his handler is sent to attack a person screaming no no no or out out out but cracking a whip or firing off a starter pistol to really jazz the dog up and the handler encourages the attack or the pressing of the attack despite what the decoy or helper says. The dog learns the decoy or helper commands or voice means absolutely nothing and to carry on until the handler says stop.


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Not obeying a stranger's commands used to be a part of the first 8 week course of basic obedience.


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## cloudpump (Oct 20, 2015)

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MineAreWorkingline said:


> Not obeying a stranger's commands used to be a part of the first 8 week course of basic obedience.


I'm sick of people trying to give my dog commands....


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

cloudpump said:


> ```
> 
> ```
> I'm sick of people trying to give my dog commands....


Train in a different language.


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## LittleBear (Apr 1, 2016)

cloudpump said:


> ```
> 
> ```
> I'm sick of people trying to give my dog commands....


Although I have to admit I feel badly for my young 9 year of nephew who tries to call Phoenix to him unsuccessfully. It's a bit of....Phoenix, come...while patting his legs, then repeat, but nothing. I'll go stand beside my nephew, then say Phoenix, come, and Phoenix comes. Ya, I'm a bit of a show-off lol


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

I see "guys!" Makes perfect sense in that realm. Not sure it's anything I need to worry about?? But it would come in handy for proofing a down/stay. Thanks all.


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

Chip18 said:


> Uh oh time to call ... dumb it down (Baillif) used to hear that a lot from me. :laugh2:
> 
> What is "Opposition training??"


It is actually Oppositional Reflex training. Ok, the easiest way to explain this that must pet owners can relate to is waking your dog on a choke collar. Animals have "opposition reflex," most :wink2: humans do not. So, you take your dog out for a walk on a flat or choke collar and the dog begins to pull really hard, almost choking itself out. Many people can relate to this and their dogs. Why do dogs pull so hard, when it clearly is uncomfortable and choking? Because, they are kinda hard wired for this. This is why we train our dogs to walk on a loose leash, or a leash with a loop in the slack. 

Once a dog starts pulling and hits tension it pulls harder. It is the same thing that causes draft horses to pull a cart. You pull back and the horse goes forward, opposition reflex, they pull into the back pressure. 

There are several ways to use this to our advantage in our dog training. We put the dog into a "sit or down stay" and pull the dog forward with constant tensions. The dog by "reflex" pulls back against the tension and uses it's muscles to stay locked in place. It is a phenomenal way to teach a rock solid sit or down stay. Since the dog is locked in place, muscles tensed so as to not be moved, we can easily teach the dog to ignore other people, food etc. 

I have an old video of Boomer doing this to illustrate the concept.


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

:wub:Boomer!


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

Another video of Boomer in the down stay:







You have to build up slowly to that kind of leash pressure. Trust me, I was pulling pretty hard. If I had better camera work you would see Boomer flexing his muscles to stay locked in the down. With tension, you get a friend to give commands and the dog will not break. If the dog does break, no big deal. Simply, go directly to the dog and scoop him up and place him back in the exact starting point. No corrections or harsh verbal commands, more matter of fact. Your dog will break the first few times, until you both get the hang of it. Start out close, a foot or two and build distance and pressure. Always maintain the pressure as you go back. Slack or uneven pressure with throw the dog off balance or cause it to break.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Slamdunc said:


> It is actually Oppositional Reflex training. Ok, the easiest way to explain this that must pet owners can relate to is waking your dog on a choke collar. Animals have "opposition reflex," most :wink2: humans do not. So, you take your dog out for a walk on a flat or choke collar and the dog begins to pull really hard, almost choking itself out. Many people can relate to this and their dogs. Why do dogs pull so hard, when it clearly is uncomfortable and choking? Because, they are kinda hard wired for this. This is why we train our dogs to walk on a loose leash, or a leash with a loop in the slack.
> 
> Once a dog starts pulling and hits tension it pulls harder. It is the same thing that causes draft horses to pull a cart. You pull back and the horse goes forward, opposition reflex, they pull into the back pressure.
> 
> ...


Thats a good, clear answer explaining another reason for walking a dog on a loose leash. I'm the first to say that I'm not a trainer because I don't know if I can ever teach someone to do something. This is a good example Jim, of someone like yourself being able to teach others. I'm of the firm belief none of this is rocket science or anything secret, but knowing how to explain and adapt things is a real skill.


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## Slamdunc (Dec 6, 2007)

Thank you, Steve.


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