# Too much to ask of a service dog?



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

My sister has a daughter with Down Syndrome. Katie is a high functioning kid, goes to a regular school (but is in a special ed class).

The currently have a dog but it is old and has never really sought Katie out. The dog is very attached to the husband.

My sister wants a dog that will bond with Katie. The dog won't be a true service dog - not in the official sense of the word.

Just a dog that helps Katie in any way it can.

The problem is that Katie sometimes hugs their current dog really hard. Their dog puts up with it or will emit a very low growl if she does it too long. And Katie tends to grab the dogs collar to lead her around.

Would this 'roughness' be too much to ask of a service dog?


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Lauri that would depend on the dog. You haven't meet my Lakota but he would be one that would handle that. He was imprinted at his whelping place by a little girl who had heart problems so the pups learned they could play with her but she set the rules. That training and his temperament stuck. I watched him with my niece one day and I was so busy watchig him I didn't see that she was swinging a rope tug right in front of her face. He loves to play tugs, but he wouldn't move to take the end of the tug until she got it on the floor and then he took it and played little baby tugs with her. ME he will drag around the yard, but her he played, butt up in the air oh so cute. He also will play gentle with DeeDee.


Lakota has layed down and let kids use him as a drum. He will let them think they are leading him around by the collar. 

So is it to much to ask, yes from some dogs but no from the right ones.

Val


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

Will he perform tasks? Will he be an actual service dog for her? Or would he just hang out at home and wait for her to get home from school and eventually, a job, and therefore be a pet? 

Just curious...









I agree with Val. The right dog could be socialized to tolerate all sorts of "excess loving." Seems to me that some breeds are more inclined than others, of course.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Their main concern is having a close 'friend' for her.

But, Katie tends to run off at times. I thought maybe the dog could be trained to either just stay with her when she ran off or maybe even bring her back?


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## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

Before beginning a search for a possible dog, it's best to really consider:

1.The child. How responsive is she to being told to stop doing certain behaviors to a dog? How's her memory after being reminded a few times? Even the very easygoing, "bland" dogs who come from an agency specificly for working with challenged children are still dogs.. and absolutely ALL dogs have limits-- even the dogs we had as kids who we "could do anything to." A challenged child may find that limit much sooner. A child who grasps, hugs, and won't let a dog get away is a concern. SDs get undiagnosed raging ear infections too, have unexpected joint pain or injuries from playing, etc. This shouldn't deter the parents-- but they need to consider how responsive the child is to "Don't pull Molly's ears/tail/hug her too hard" etc.

2.The parents: They need to be watching and supervising. SD and child is still a DOG and a child. While Mom is in the shower, a crayon can be wedged into a SD's ear by a child (I know someone who's child did this to their working Golden), the dog can be ridden like a pony, etc. Parents need to never see the dog as a babysitter, but rather a canine therapist needing their active involvement.

I bet this little girl would blossom with her own dog. But, as to what degree this assignment may be too much to ask of a SD: So much depends on to what degree the parents are willing to guide and correct the child and supervise interactions, and upon how responsive the child is to learning limits regarding treating/handling the dog.


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## BJDimock (Sep 14, 2008)

I brought Fenna into Ana's school last year for an "enrichment" program. I talked to a lot of 3rd graders about what my family does to raise guide dogs, and had a bunch of normal, overexcited kids, trying to crowd Fenna. (13 weeks at the time) 
What blew me away.
Fenna (at her young age, amid many hyper kids) chose the autistic boy in Ana's class to "attend" to.
She sought him out and behaved like she was a grown, working dog. She sat with him, she let him pull her ears, she got up and "guided" him.
I have never witnessed anything like it. 
I don't think she's ever been as happy as she was that day. (I might even make that career suggestion for her.)
I think that a dog is a great companion and help. Be sure they find one like Fenna. She knows who the alpha is in the house, but will completly adopt anyone else. (The pack babysitter)


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

I'm no expert on Service Dogs but you HAVE met my Coke and he would put up with that. He really puts up with TOO much from little kids and Nikon at times. So it would really depend on the dog. I know every dog can bite and there's no guarantee, but Coke is one of those dogs we could inherently trust with kids, people, and other dogs very quickly after we got him. I'm not sure how to describe it, but his body language and the way he acts is so non confrontational and things that Kenya would consider abusive or totally inappropriate are all in good fun for Coke.


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## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

I think what you are asking about is what is sometimes called a trained companion dog for a child. These dogs are obedience trained and then usually taught a task or two to assist the child. They are used mostly in the home to be a well loved companion (pet) for the child but with a little more training to work more for the child. These special dogs are not taken out into the public as "service dogs" but only with the same owner rights as any other well behaved pet. 



> Quote:But, Katie tends to run off at times. I thought maybe the dog could be trained to either just stay with her when she ran off or maybe even bring her back?


It would take very intensive training to have any reliance on the dog staying with Katie. That would call for a professional trainer and tons of proofing under many circumstances. And then who knows for sure that the dog would not follow for awhile and then go off to chase a cat or follow an interesting smell. 

As for using a dog to bring a child back? This is something that I would never recommend. I use the example of looking how a dog brings/herds a living creature back to the person in charge. Herding dogs may try to gently circle some sheep that stray from the flock but if a gentle nudge doesn't work they then go into a more persuasive mode. If the sheep continue going in the wrong direction the dog will then grab a leg or knock the sheep to the ground. Once the sheep stop the dog will then herd the animal back with nips or even harder bites. 

Even by some miracle you could find a "Lassie" type herder you have now trained the dog to be in charge. With a dog as you know they are pack animals and find their position in the pack and don't easily change. A dog that is trained to be in charge of a child on any matter will then in it's mind be in charge of the child all of the time. To them the child will be beneath them in ranking and as such the dog will believe that it has been given the authority to dish out corrections. The dog wants to sleep in a certain place or play with a certain toy and the child says "no" would be like a pup or lower dog telling a higher up "No". The dog may give a puppy license to the child on some things but not others. Or one day it may decide that the child has been given enough leeway and today is the day to teach the child its proper place and the proper way to act. Corrections may start with a glare or even a small growl but if the child doesn't follow directions then harsher corrections may follow. 

Dogs can be protective of young charges or tend to and work for individuals who from time to time are helpless. Service Dogs in many cases are stronger then their handlers but they are never above their handler in status. They may from time to time have to take over a situation and work out the solution but they still know they are performing a trained task that was assigned by the handler for these circumstances. They never look at this temporary situation as putting them higher in the pack and as such they never are given the authority to correct the handler. 

Now the idea of tracking is something the parents may want to look into. They could have someone help them train the dog to track Katie and work with the parents on how to follow. This would be to search for Katie in the house or yard or immediate area only. In the case that she went further, then the parents should be calling 911 and asking for immediate assistance. A call out for a missing young child or a disabled child of any age will bring professional help very quickly. 

Getting back to a special dog for Katie, I would highly recommend looking into a dog that was being trained by a reputable organization for use as a Service Dog and for some reason washed out of the program. Such dogs have had the regular medical work and many extras completed on them, they have been evaluated for temperament from puppyhood up, and the organization knows their strenghts and weaknesses. Some dogs are washed out of a SD program just because they want to be friends with everyone they meet which would be great for a young child and all the children that would be coming into this child's life. Maybe the dog is afraid of loud noises such a fireworks or cars backfiring -- not good for a Service Dog but not that big of a deal for a companion for a child. Maybe the dog is not the personalilty to keep working in high gear for hours on end as would be required of a SD, but is fine for playing around the house and visiting with friends, going for walks and family outings, and great with the obedience that would be required of it with a child.


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