# Possession Aggression & relentless biting/mouthing



## pilipauskasf (Apr 3, 2018)

Hey everyone! I am the first time owner of a German Shepherd, and this is going to be a pretty long post. I truly appreciate everyone who takes the time to read this and help me out as I am losing all hope.

Generally speaking he is typically a well behaved dog but when he starts to bite and mouth for attention he is absolutely relentless. This is a HUGE issue, but the other real main factor driving me to write this is his possession aggression issues that are very sporadic and just his random bipolar episodes. He has only shown signs twice of possession aggression, and typically he'll let me take toys, food, whatever out of his mouth. The first time he ever did this was when he was a little over 3 months(when we first got him). I don't think he ever played with a toy, because he jumped the first time we threw a ball to him. When we got him a yellow fuzzy duck, he would not let my girlfriend near this and growled and snapped at her. We punished him by yelling, smacking on the snoot, and crating him for a brief time. 

We never had this issue again up until yesterday, and around 9 months of age. We got him a pork rawhide bone and this is the first time hes ever had this type of bone. It was the first time hes ever growled at me, and after I took it away we wanted to test the waters again after punishing him(again smacking on snoot) and saying NO. He lunged at my girlfriend this time and i had to restrain him and throw him in the crate and smack him again. We have not given him the bone back since this occurrence as I truly do not know how to handle the situation.The other random act of aggression was against my room mate, who he is typically very fond of. I was in our office room, and my room mate came out of his room and pet the dog(around 7 months of age at the time) when he was laying down. He left to go back in his room for 10ish minutes, to return to pet him again and he lunged at him. My room mate backed up, and our dog rushed forward again and bite/clawed him on the hand. This is my biggest worry as he is typically well behaved, but its as if he forgets who people are or is just randomly bipolar. Any steps to curve this is greatly appreciated!

The next biggest issue is the constant mouthing, chewing, biting of the flesh. My girlfriend loves German shepherds, but she says she has never had one as stubborn and as mean as our current one. She is the sweetest person to him, but he will non stop go for her hands, feed. He will put her entire elbow, arm, leg, whatever he can fit in his mouth and bite. He thinks he is being playful, but by now at 9 months of age he is close to 90 lbs and he has razor sharp teeth. He made her cry this morning and I am honestly at a loss of what to do because I feel like we've tried everything to correct this.My girlfriend is not the only one he does this to, he does this to me and my room mate as well but with her it is the worse. Nothing can stop him, if you smack him on the snoot he just turns into the hulk and is more nippy. If i put a prong collar on and tug to correct him, he will stop for a moment and then he goes right back. If i redirect him with a toy, he will drop the toy and continue going for the flesh. If we ignore him and turn our back he will proceed by jumping on your back and nipping your legs or back of the arm or go infront of you.If we go to crate him when hes being bad, he just accepts it and lays down with his tongue laying out like nothing happened. We've even gone as far as getting an e-collar, which I've initially felt i would never do but he ended up stealing the remote and busting it when my girlfriend wasn't watching it. It did not have much affect anyhow, although we only used the vibrate function and never really shocked him. I can tell its typically for attention so we play with him, but even if we do he will still sometimes do it. He is the absolute worst when we are laying on the couch or in bed. One thing that semi works is if i close his mouth shut and say No, but it takes 2-3 times every time he does it for him to stop and anytime i let go he instantly snap at the air and show me is teeth.He shows us his teeth quite a bit when we say No. 

How can we regain the Alpha status, and is there any hope with this unbelievably stubborn dog? I am at my wits end and I truly don't know what to do. If he does not listen when we tell him NO, i do not know how to punish him so he knows we mean business and that we are not playing. We originally took him to obedience classes soon after we got him, but the biting has only gotten worse and if he listen to commands like sit, stay, lay is totally based on the day and if hes excited or not. If hes distracted there is not a thing that will get through to him. Thank you all for reading, I know this was a novel.


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## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

You need to hire a good, balanced trainer with GSD experience! And please, put away the e-collar for now, and stop smacking your dog in the snoot. That's not only ineffective, it can injure the dog. It is clear from your description of the dog's behavior that there is a respect/trust/leadership problem here. A good trainer can help you sort through these things, but honestly, it's going to take someone who can work with you, your gf, and your dog in person. Just please don't let it go because this situation WON'T resolve itself. Good Luck, and let us know how it goes with the trainer! And, Welcome to the forum too!


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

I agree. Hire a trainer and stop smacking your dog. How much exercise is he getting? Do you do anything to mentally tire him out during the day? Any training? He sounds like a dog that perhaps isn’t getting what he needs.


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## fionapup (Mar 22, 2018)

For general playful mouthiness and biting as a puppy, what worked for me was giving her once chance ("no"), and if she continued biting, I immediately put her back in her crate until she chilled out. After a few times, she got it. None of the usual other methods worked for my pup's mouthing, because she was also relentless and would only get angry and bite harder with physical correction. This was solved using crating ^ when she was 2-3 months old though.

Smacking (especially with your hand) will just make some GSD's mad and act worse, as it sounds like yours does too. Corrections work for some things, but not everything for every dog can be solved with smacking and punishment. 

Definitely find a trainer that utilizes balanced methods ("balanced methods/training" being the term) for your dog. You may want to ditch the physical dominance mindset, because it seems to be clearly hurting the relationship between you and your dog. Improper corrections (like the smacking) also causes further confusion and frustration in the dog.


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

Smacking your dog, throwing him in the crate, and shocking him with an e collar when he doesn't even know what he is doing wrong because you have never even properly shown him is just not right. Stop beating your dog and forget the "alpha" mentality. Dogs learn to respect you out of trust and understanding. Be patient and also be respectful of your dog. You need the help of a good trainer (not some board and train, not some trainer who promises instant results but rather someone experienced with the breed and preferably positive reinforcement). There is too much going on wrong here.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

There is no good advice to give here except get a breed experienced trainer. I am not saying this to be mean or snarky, but to illustrate why a trainer is only option- you are doing everything wrong I'm afraid. Where are you located? Maybe do a new post asking for trainer recommendations in your area?


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## pilipauskasf (Apr 3, 2018)

Thank you all for the replies. He does get a good amount of exercise, but i would agree he probably needs more since hes so high energy. Well go on runs, play fetch, fug of war, and he loves playing hide and seek in the house.

For those that say im beating my dog, i am most certaintly not. Ive smacked him on the snoot when hes tried to do real damage to us the few times in his life. What should you do when he tries to really hurt you? Im all for positive reinforcement, but there needs to be consequences too.Ive never shocked my dog, and have only tried the vibrate function to avert hos attention when biting.

With that said, i am looking into trainers. He acts like an angel in public, so would it more benefical to bring someone in the home instead of going to a trainer? How many sessions does it typically take to curve this type of behavior. Im looking for a ballpark of realistic expectations.


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## pilipauskasf (Apr 3, 2018)

Also any reccomendations for trainers would be wonderful. I am in the chicagoland region


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## Evohog (Jul 18, 2017)

Like others said, you will have to get in touch with a balanced trainer, experienced with GS.
And you'll have to start from scratch, like it was the first day you brought him into your house. This means on leash ALL THE TIME when he's not crated, preferably tied to you so he has to follow you and stay close. He needs to accept you as his pack leader and he needs to know that your gf and roommate are higher in hierarchy. Right now he clearly runs the show. 
I don't think it's a good idea to take food away from a dog. It's not going to help him to respect and trust you. The only exception would be when you offer something exciting to replace, let's say he's chewing on the rawhide and it's time to go for a walk. But have your gear ready so he knows why you're taking it.
Your hands are only providing good things so stop smacking him but use them to give him treats. Corrections are done through the prong collar. Speaking of, how much experience do you have with prongs and is it fitted right? In the last three weeks I met two people who slipped the prong over their dogs head. They came to us because they "didn't have control over the dog".

The sessions it will take to fix this depends on how easy it will be to transform YOU, your pup won't take too long.
Again, find a good trainer and get to work. You can do this.


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## [email protected] (Jan 16, 2018)

Dogs only know their natural way of dealing with things unless you teach them alternative ways. If another dog came to take their toy/treat/food, they'd react in a manner based on their social status. That's all they know. You, however, as a human, can do things like trade an item for what you want to take from your dog. If you need to take his rawhide, trade him a dog biscuit for it. You have to aim to be fair when dealing with him. 

I try like heck to avoid smacking my pup on the snoot when he bites too hard (but I have done it). I try to remember that 1) it just gets him more excited and out of control, 2) it undermines his trust in me because _I'm_ out of control, acting emotionally and thus not a good/reliable leader, and 3) it can make them head-shy. When the pup is too bitey he gets a crate time-out or is tied/secured elsewhere. Play time ends. I have also been training "leave it", and this has begun to work as a cue to stop biting. "Get your toy" is also starting to work. I can say that and he will go find one of his tugs to bite on, which is much more appropriate.

I would recommend, among other things, to start hand-feeding your dog his meals when you can and use the time to start focus training. Have the dog make eye contact with you before you feed him a handful of food. A second of eye contact at first, building up time. And find a trainer to work with. Bad, uncontrolled aggression and possessiveness can become serious quickly with a big dog.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Definitely find a trainer experienced with Gsds.A trainer can explain and help you to show your dog what you want him to do.He needs to be taught and rewarded for the behavior you want.
Please stop taking his food and treats away.You will only make him anxious and defensive.Give him his meals and treats and leave him be.A trainer can explain how to trade up for higher value items.For right now he probably feels anything that is important to him is about to be snatched away.
There are many threads on this board about landsharking,biting,and resource guarding that will help.
Is he getting plenty of exercise?He needs an outlet for his puppy exuberance.Gsds want to work closely and happily with their owners when it's made clear to them how to do it.


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

I’m not anti-correction at all. But smacking is not the way to do it. You could end up making your dog hand-shy. I would contact a Schutzhund club if I were you. OG Edgerton meets in northern Illinois.

https://www.germanshepherddog.com/region-events/?cy=2018&cm=04&re=nc


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

pilipauskasf said:


> Ive smacked him on the snoot when hes tried to do real damage to us the few times in his life. What should you do when he tries to really hurt you?


I only have a moment to reply. I’m at work, and coincidentally just got bitten by a new dog (who I promptly sent home) - I’m a groomer. 

I have a young VERY feisty dog, and can tell you if I had smacked Scarlet on the nose when she was biting, it would’ve amped her up big time. No hitting! It’s a game to them. Just shoving a toy in their face when they are biting isn’t enough for a lot of puppies. You need to make the toy MOVE and be exciting. More exciting than your hands. Your dog may also need time just to relax in his crate, take a nap. When puppies get over tired, they can get wild and bitey. 

Also no more taking stuff from your dog. You’ve created a resource guarding problem. Taking the rawhide from your dog, punishing him for biting at you, then doing it all over again? No. Just no. It may have seemed logical to you, but it creates the problem you’re trying to avoid. There are lots of threads on here explaining how to deal with it, or avoid it.


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## pilipauskasf (Apr 3, 2018)

Thanks for the replies all. Truly appreciate everyones input


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

pilipauskasf said:


> Thanks for the replies all. Truly appreciate everyones input




Everyone wants you to be successful and have a great relationship with your dog. It’s a lot of work, but so worth it. It’s hard to hear criticism, but I think if you get a knowledgeable trainer with GSD experience, you’ll be fine. 

Hey, how about a photo?! We love photos.


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## [email protected] (Jan 16, 2018)

*Hint: The dog owns NOTHING*

I'll add too that I have all my dog's toys and equipment in a sturdy plastic bin with lid, and everything is kept there because really, it's all MY STUFF. My dog owns nothing. All the toys and such are mine and he just gets to borrow them. I take out different toys and different times, rotating them so nothing gets boring, lost or too destroyed too quickly. The "mindset" or attitude I am aiming to establish in my dog is "Trace lets me chew on these things," like it's a privilege, not a right.

Lead dogs let their pack members do certain things based on rules; eating sooner rather than later in the order, sleeping in certain places, etc. I let my pup chew on rope toys and squeakies, not the chair legs and carpets. Certainly not my arms and feet (unless it is mouthing gently, which I tolerate.) If he is good at our mealtime and does not beg, whine and jump up, he gets a morsel of appropriate people food (steak fat, green bean..) in his dish after we've eaten as a treat.

Everything is a training opportunity.

These dogs are definitely not what my husband calls "accessories" or "decorative dogs". They needs lots of appropriate interaction and I feel like it really will pay off to spend time thinking about the dog you want to wind up with and how to get him from where he is now, behaviorally, to where you want him to be, and then do the necessary training consistently. Nothing worthwhile is easy but you can do it. If your dog trusts you he will work with you. German Shepherds are so smart and so loving, but they do need things to do, and they need to know what the rules are. Everyone does. People do much better with structure in their lives.


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## pilipauskasf (Apr 3, 2018)

Heres a few photos ?


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Aww!You can't possibly mean that fuzzy little angel,lol!


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