# 10 Month Old Male, Critique Please.



## Lucky Paw

Oh man, this pics where hard to get my dog still has ADD but I managed to get somewhat 2 good shots.


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## Meeah'sMom

Wow...I think that he is absolutely stunning! He looks noble and has such a lustrous coat! Very handsome boy!


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## Lucky Paw

he is nouble, untill i say watch it or who is there then he is at work


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## 1sttimeforgsd

Handsome! :wub:


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## Lucky Paw

Thankyou, Im going to try to get better stacks of him and my female


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## Speedy2662

The last picture is amazing!


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## wolfy dog

What a beauty and that coat! Hope you don't neuter him as the coat will lose its luster.


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## KristiM

I think overall he is a very nice dog! Maybe a tad straight in the front but hard to tell from the pictured. Very Nice feet and pasterns. Good topline, I think his croup is a little short but good angulation in the rear. He looks like a very balanced, athletic dog to me! plus he is very handsome, has a beautiful coat and I love his coloring.


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## Lucky Paw

KristiM said:


> I think overall he is a very nice dog! Maybe a tad straight in the front but hard to tell from the pictured. Very Nice feet and pasterns. Good topline, I think his croup is a little short but good angulation in the rear. He looks like a very balanced, athletic dog to me! plus he is very handsome, has a beautiful coat and I love his coloring.


i have to get better pics and stack him properly he moved on both pics the pics were good but were ment to be better



wolfy dog said:


> What a beauty and that coat! Hope you don't neuter him as the coat will lose its luster.


 not happening he is staying intact.


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## PatchonGSD

Is the dog that you bred recently?


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## msvette2u

wolfy dog said:


> What a beauty and that coat! Hope you don't neuter him as the coat will lose its luster.


This is not true. Not at all. "Luster" in the coat has more to do with diet then lack of testosterone.

Handsome dog, Lucky, what's his pedigree like?


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## Lucky Paw

PatchonGSD said:


> Is the dog that you bred recently?


 i dont understand the question.



msvette2u said:


> This is not true. Not at all. "Luster" in the coat has more to do with diet then lack of testosterone.
> 
> Handsome dog, Lucky, what's his pedigree like?


i give my dog omega vitamins for his coat, ive seen fixed dogs with a shiny coat, i think is all in the nutrition.
I got this dog without papers for 500 dollars,the Sire is 135lbs and Dam is about 75lbs, he had/has massive paws and a nice fluffy coat he was also very hyper so i picked him on the spot. i have poor pics of parents , breeder said sire's parents are both imported from germany and dam's papers were lost. the dad is 135lbs and dam is about 75lbs. i checked my dogs hips about a month ago and came back exellent, he has awesome temperament around kids and my other pets. very territorial and cats are a no


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## Lucky Paw

the add i saw when i got him is still up he is the pup on the right out of the 2 being held by the guy.
http://www.domesticsale.com/classifieds/a645859.html

my dogs parents


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## onyx'girl

Originally Posted by PatchonGSD 
Is the dog that you bred recently?


Lucky Paw said:


> *i dont understand the question*.
> 
> I got this dog without papers for 500 dollars,the Sire is 135lbs and Dam is about 75lbs, he had/has massive paws and a nice fluffy coat he was also very hyper so i picked him on the spot. i have poor pics of parents , breeder said sire's parents are both imported from germany and dam's papers were lost. the dad is 135lbs and dam is about 75lbs. i checked *my dogs hips about a month ago and came back exellent,* he has awesome temperament around kids and my other pets. very territorial and cats are a no



You posted in another thread that you bred your male(I think it was to a red sable?). Or were you posting that to stir things up? 
Who graded your dogs hip x-rays to say they are excellent?


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## Lucky Paw

onyx'girl said:


> Originally Posted by PatchonGSD
> Is the dog that you bred recently?
> 
> 
> 
> You posted in another thread that you bred your male(I think it was to a red sable?). Or were you posting that to stir things up?
> Who graded your dogs hip x-rays to say they are excellent?


My vet arranged and send for everything it was around 350$

I did bred him to a red sable female, the guy really wanted to and i liked his bitch, she is imported from Hungary and has had 2 previous litters .


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## msvette2u

> German *Shepard* pups *5 weeks* old


I'm sorry, Lucky, this smacks of poor breeding practices, right here 

Your dog is beautiful but you shouldn't be breeding him, you really have no idea about his genetics, health and temperament-wise.


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> I'm sorry, Lucky, this smacks of horrible breeder, right here
> 
> Your dog is beautiful but you shouldn't be breeding him, you really have no idea about his genetics, health and temperament-wise.


he didnt let the dogs go untill 8 weeks


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## msvette2u

Were the parents OFA'ed?
Does he work or show them?


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> I'm sorry, Lucky, this smacks of poor breeding practices, right here
> 
> Your dog is beautiful but you shouldn't be breeding him, you really have no idea about his genetics, health and temperament-wise.


 I understand, but i do know that the sire has champion bloodlines


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## onyx'girl

let it go, msvette2u....not worth another locked thread and you know how this will go.


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## GatorDog

Lucky Paw said:


> I understand, but i do know that the sire has champion bloodlines


Champion of what?


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## Liesje

Just about every purebred GSD on this planet has "champion bloodlines". The sire is definitely pure, but I've done all the legitimate conformation venues and I don't think that dog would get far in any one of them. I'm not saying he's not a nice dog but having a champion way back in the bloodline and actually BEING a champion are not the same thing. You can go to a pet store or puppy mill and buy a dog from "champion lines".

I actually like your dog better than either parent.

As for breeding I hope you are joking, the dog is a BABY! I mean he's not even old enough to *get* hip ratings or start competing in most dog sports let alone have certifications and titles.


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## msvette2u

Lucky Paw said:


> I understand, but i do know that the sire has champion bloodlines


Lucky, I sense you want to do things the right way, and I'd encourage you to do them the right way. If you want to be a good breeder, do that, but please use other dogs than the ones you have right now.
They are great pets, but that's all they ought to be, pets. Love them for themselves, not for what they can produce. Any run of the mill mutt can produce puppies and cute ones at that! All puppies are cute!

But please, alter your pets and go about breeding the right way. You'll like yourself much better in the long run


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> Were the parents OFA'ed?
> Does he work or show them?


mom herds and dad does personal protection


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## msvette2u

That's a great start, but I bet neither have titles...I know you want to become a breeder the _right_ way, I can tell you do care 

Right now you're going about it a bit backwards but there's time to get it straightened out :thumbup:


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> That's a great start, but I bet neither have titles...I know you want to become a breeder the _right_ way, I can tell you do care
> 
> Right now you're going about it a bit backwards but there's time to get it straightened out :thumbup:


Yea i deffenetly do, i have 2 great dogs i want to mate but i really want papers first and i need my female to hit at least 2 years before i do so anyway, I bred my male because the guy wouldnt leave me alone i think he liked my dog more then his bitch did, he saw my dog at 5 months and went nuts over him


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## Lucky Paw

**Comment has been removed by ADMIN, deleted quote**


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## msvette2u

Lucky Paw said:


> Yea i deffenetly do, i have 2 great dogs i want to mate but i really want papers first and i need my female to hit at least 2 years before i do so anyway, I bred my male because the guy wouldnt leave me alone i think he liked my dog more then his bitch did, he saw my dog at 5 months and went nuts over him


Well, your dog is very handsome and unique...but breeding for colors isn't really a great thing to do, often you get skin issues and other health issues, and even temperament issues when focusing on one trait (like color).

I'd encourage you to go to shows, see what well-bred dogs look like, and ask a breeder close to you to mentor you.
That's definitely what I'd do if I were in your shoes. I'm too busy rescuing to start a breeding program right now


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## PatchonGSD

Lucky Paw said:


> Yea i deffenetly do, i have 2 great dogs i want to mate but i really want papers first and i need my female to hit at least 2 years before i do so anyway, *I bred my male because the guy wouldnt leave me alone* i think he liked my dog more then his bitch did, he saw my dog at 5 months and went nuts over him


Thats a reason to breed a dog if there ever was one. This is so sad, there is so much information on this site about responsible breeding, why you should not just slap two dogs together to make puppies, and what the consequences are for those BYB pups. This is pure greed and irresponsibility. How much money did you make studding out your *PUPPY* that you know nothing about?

And its, "gal" not "guy" thanks.


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## Lucky Paw

PatchonGSD said:


> Thats a reason to breed a dog if there ever was one. This is so sad, there is so much information on this site about responsible breeding, why you should not just slap two dogs together to make puppies, and what the consequences are for those BYB pups. This is pure greed and irresponsibility. How much money did you make studding out your *PUPPY* that you know nothing about?
> 
> And its, "gal" not "guy" thanks.


WELL GAL LIKE I SAID I like the female i like that she was imported and how she is a working guide dog, i know what i have for a dog i know his temperament for the most part i know that he listens and is VERY obedient i know my dog has a great mental estability and learns things in 1 day so i know my PUPPY well. How much did i make? 0 dollars as long as there warent any damages to my dogs penis, all i asked was for pick of the litter to keep and watch grow up.


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## msvette2u

I honestly think Lucky Paw has good intentions, and wants to become a good breeder, or he'd have already left.

I think Lucky has the potential to be a good breeder, and improve now that he's had some things pointed out to him!

Lucky, stick around - read up on what makes a good breeder a good breeder, and why breeding untitled, unpapered, untested dogs isn't a great idea 

For one thing you may want to check this out - Sexually Transmitted Diseases in Dogs - VetInfo


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## PatchonGSD

Being imported means what to you? How do you even know she was imported? She's a working guide dog, huh? Was the guy that saw your puppy blind? You do not know what you have for a dog because he's still a PUPPY. There isnt a dog on this planet that cant learn simple commands....that doesnt make your dog special.


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## msvette2u

Patchon, everyone's dog is special. 
His dog is handsome, and intelligent, just like a GSD ought to be.
The point is, not everyone's dog is breeding material.


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## PatchonGSD

Excuse me, I should have clarified. Lucky-your dog is special, but not special enough to be bred. You dont even have papers.


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> I honestly think Lucky Paw has good intentions, and wants to become a good breeder, or he'd have already left.
> 
> I think Lucky has the potential to be a good breeder, and improve now that he's had some things pointed out to him!
> 
> Lucky, stick around - read up on what makes a good breeder a good breeder, and why breeding untitled, unpapered, untested dogs isn't a great idea
> 
> For one thing you may want to check this out - Sexually Transmitted Diseases in Dogs - VetInfo


 
thankyou for the info and for being cool about it, i wish people werent so stubbern and so judgemental but is ok i dont let it get to me i sleep good at night because i know that next to me i have a dog that i would call COMPLETE and that no matter what anyone says A PIECE OF PAPER DOESNT MAKE A DOG. i know what i have for a dog and i bet my dog is better then half of AKC registered dogs however like you said is irresponsible to do and i should do everything possible to find his background and pedegree. To whoever is offended... get a shotgun point it at your head tie your dogs leach to it and give the send off command


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## PatchonGSD

**Comment removed by Admin due to removed quote**


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## msvette2u

> i know what i have for a dog and i bet my dog is better then half of AKC registered dogs however like you said is irresponsible to do and i should do everything possible to find his background and pedegree.


Yes...for more than the papers, the main thing is, you can then examine the history and see what you have (other than the dog in front of you). GSDs are prone to some very serious health issues and if one or more of the ancestors has those issues, chances are, even if your dog is relatively healthy, his offspring can be afflicted.

The most difficult thing you'll have to do is give up dreams and plans of breeding the dogs you have, and look into investing in a female with all the bells and whistles...meaning, pedigree and titled/health tested parents :thumbup:

There's a few breeders on here, carmen and cliffson, who are great breeders but had to work their way up to where they are today. You might want to PM them for some suggestions of breeders local to you!


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## Lucky Paw

PatchonGSD said:


> How old are you?


old enough to tell you streight up that i dislike you i dislike the tone you came in here with and i dislike the fact you still in here talking to me . so just let it go and go read something else this forum is real big


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## msvette2u

Lucky, you can place people on ignore...


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## PatchonGSD

Comment removed by ADMIN


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## carmspack

ummmmm, guide dogs are spayed and neutered -


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> Yes...for more than the papers, the main thing is, you can then examine the history and see what you have (other than the dog in front of you). GSDs are prone to some very serious health issues and if one or more of the ancestors has those issues, chances are, even if your dog is relatively healthy, his offspring can be afflicted.
> 
> The most difficult thing you'll have to do is give up dreams and plans of breeding the dogs you have, and look into investing in a female with all the bells and whistles...meaning, pedigree and titled/health tested parents :thumbup:
> 
> There's a few breeders on here, carmen and cliffson, who are great breeders but had to work their way up to where they are today. You might want to PM them for some suggestions of breeders local to you!


Look msvette2u, when i got my boy my intentions were never to breed this dogs, 10 months later i found my female on the street, she is american showline/european mix i say this becuse her colors and her pose she stacks naturally and has a very noticible slope when stacked, she is georgeous , she is anywhere from 7-11 months and is eager to learn.
In a perfect word every lady wants a kid and every man wants some, you know lol. i dont want to become a proffessional breeder anytime soon all i wanted was to get a litter out of her ... BUT people want to me it a big deal w/o knowing they just jump in assume and play the i know it all . 
Thankyou for your advice and being cool


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## Lucky Paw

carmspack said:


> ummmmm, guide dogs are spayed and neutered -


here we go


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## msvette2u

> i dont want to become a proffessional breeder anytime soon all i wanted was to get a litter out of her .


I completely understand. 
It's just that...to be a good breeder you have to go above and beyond just wanting a litter.

You've heard of the term "bettering the breed"? There was a discussion not long ago on that topic.

Anyone can put two dogs together and make puppies. But rising to the top takes hard work and knowing what you're working _with._

I wouldn't be typing to you if I didn't think you're a bigger person than what some are making you out to be, and have the potential to become a good breeder, and not just a run-of-the-mill backyard style breeder, like thousands of others across the country.



> she is georgeous ,


So are all the others in rescue and shelters; your girl happened to wind up in your hands...but it's not a good enough reason to breed her, still 

http://www.petfinder.com/pet-search...herd+Dog&location=Florida+&startsearch=Search


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## KristiM

All I am going to say is please consider the fact that there are tons of GSDs in shelters and rescues that were purchased by idiots who bought their puppy from someone who thinks their dogs are great so they breed them. People who are truly responsible dog owners don't buy puppies from unregistered dogs with no history, no health checks and no proof of a stable temperament. People who buy puppies from byb are a lot more likely to throw their hands in the air and dump their dog when they don't act like lassie. It's a vicious cycle and it starts with people breeding when they shouldn't be. Are you prepared to keep all the puppies if you cannot find GOOD homes for them? Be aware there is a dog overpopulation issue in north america, there is no reason to breed your dog. It breaks my heart when I hear about how many good, innocent dogs are killed every year simply because there are too many of them. Please don't contribute to that.


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## msvette2u

> People who are *truly responsible dog owners* don't buy puppies from unregistered dogs with no history, no health checks and no proof of a stable temperament.


This is a very good point. We get awesome dogs in rescue all the time that come from just this scenario.


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> I completely understand.
> It's just that...to be a good breeder you have to go above and beyond just wanting a litter.
> 
> You've heard of the term "bettering the breed"? There was a discussion not long ago on that topic.
> 
> Anyone can put two dogs together and make puppies. But rising to the top takes hard work and knowing what you're working _with._
> 
> I wouldn't be typing to you if I didn't think you're a bigger person than what some are making you out to be, and have the potential to become a good breeder, and not just a run-of-the-mill backyard style breeder, like thousands of others across the country.


i see, i want more then just a litter just not right now and honestly im not going to be ready for another year for that litter i want ,my female is still too young. when i have a whole acre just to go ahead and put 10 dogs with papers in it and 2 or 3 for them to run then ill run a breeding program which is different then just wanting a litter then ill run it all the way it takes alot of money before you see a penny i know what im in for and im not in it for the money . but as a responsible human i will make sure i wait before i breed my couple and as far as studding my dog, i might keep doing depending how i feel about acquiring another puppy for the pack.


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## lhczth

*Any more personal attacks or nasty, rude, sanctimonious comments made in this thread will result in more warnings and possibly some suspensions. *

*Far better to attempt to educate than to chase the OP away. *

*Thank you,*

*ADMIN*


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## msvette2u

Lucky, do keep in mind that bitches in heat and the intact males nearby can be very VERY determined to do what nature intended. It's sad nature put females in that situation at a mere 10mos. of age, but that's how it goes. It's kind of akin to a 12yr. old human female having a baby.
If you really want to keep your girl from being bred before she's a year old, you may truly want to consider spaying her before her first heat.


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## Lucky Paw

msvette2u said:


> Lucky, do keep in mind that bitches in heat and the intact males nearby can be very VERY determined to do what nature intended. It's sad nature put females in that situation at a mere 10mos. of age, but that's how it goes. It's kind of akin to a 12yr. old human female having a baby.
> If you really want to keep your girl from being bred before she's a year old, you may truly want to consider spaying her before her first heat.


 i dont keep them together unless im home there is usually 1 in the house and one outside im careful about it because it happened to my friend with other dogs.


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