# Hernias in Puppies



## Jazzyo (May 14, 2008)

Hi, I am in the process of finding a puppy to breed back to some old lines (frozen semen) and have a question regarding hernias in puppies. I felt as though I found the right breeder and perhaps I have, to purchase a female from in the upcoming litter. I have been fortunate to make contact with previous buyers from the same pairing and while all seem to love their pups and rave about their temperaments, which is great, two of the pups have hernias. So, my question is, even if I purchase a pup from the next breeding of the same sire and dam, without a hernia, am I risking more hernia's developing when I breed my puppy once she passes all of her health testing etc.? Or am I better off avoiding altogether? And I will also ask, should this sire and dam be bred together again having produced two pups with hernias. It seems to me possibly not but I would like opinions on this as well. The dogs are fully health tested. Thank you for any input.


----------



## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

Off hand I would have thought it wasn't genetic, and in humans it isn't. But according to an article I read on dogs and hernias at









Hernias in Dogs: Everything You Need to Know | Purina


Hernias in dogs can be quite common, especially in puppies. Read our guide to find out the five most common types and possible treatment options.




www.purina.co.uk




.

"Over 90% of hernia cases are due to genetics, as puppies are most commonly born with them. However, hernias can also develop as a result of trauma, such as being hit by a car."

So, I guess I'd want to know how many puppies there were in the litter. And how many there are in this litter. From there it would be a judgement call. Hopefully an experienced breeder will chime in!


----------



## Hendrix&&Karma (Apr 13, 2021)

not an expert. But my 1 year old Hendrix has a hernia that was found at his first vet appt. they said it’s not anything major and just monitor it and they usually repair when neutering.


----------



## Jazzyo (May 14, 2008)

tim_s_adams said:


> Off hand I would have thought it wasn't genetic, and in humans it isn't. But according to an article I read on dogs and hernias at
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I believe there were 6-7 puppies and 2 had hernias


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Well, an umbilical hernia isn't a big deal. Maybe you produce some. Ok, there are so many problems, health/genetic issues with this breed. If you are going throw out this breeder because she produced some umbilical hernias, you will probably go with someone who's just not telling you what they have in their lines. They don't have to. Excellent hips can produce dysplasia, and good hips. They aren't going to tell you about the pup they decided to put down because the hips were so bad at age 1. They will show you that three puppies out of this litter had OFA good. Wow, kool. But what about the other 4? Well, their owners chose not to get them x-ray'd. 

And HD, in most cases can be managed without surgery, and the dogs can live a regular lifespan with no intervention. What about MEGA-E and EPI? It's like throwing out a dog that produced a puppy with allergies, and landing with a bitch that has MEGA-E or EPI. It's like turning out a possible pup because some of the pups had Pano, and landing with a bitch whose sire and dam have produced dysplasia. There are no perfect dogs out there. Some are healthier, and we should not breed dogs that have or throw serious health problems. But if we throw out every dog that has a problem, yes; and every dog that has produced a problem, yes; then what is left is the dogs that have all that crap hidden. These are live creatures and subject to genetic problems and environmental problems. 

An umbilical hernia is a little bubble on the belly that will often close on its own. It is where the umbilical cord connected the puppy with nourishment while incubating. The dam uses her teeth to tear the cord that is attached to the intestines (think feeding tube), she tears it off. Some bitches worry that until they dry up and fall off. Yes, what should happen is that the hole closes on its own, but sometimes it doesn't and is easily repaired by a vet when they are around 6 months, or not. Only a significant hernia can cause any issues at all. 

We want to make the best breeding decisions that we can. And if all other things were equal -- temperament, health, longevity of the lines, structure, etc., if all other things are equal then choose the bitch pup whose dam did not produce hernias. The problem of course, is finding such perfectly matched prospects. 

Here's a question: If you have another prospect who previously produced 2 puppies whose ears never went up -- which pup would you choose? The one is clearly just an aesthetic issue. Or is it? Would you rather produce a puppy with an umbilical hernia that the new owners can have repaired during the spay, or ears that never go up and there is nothing they can do about it? When people go to bring home a shepherd, they have a picture in their mind about what the dog will look like. If it's ears do not go up, they may always be disappointed in the dog. Isn't that worse if it affects how the owners feel about the dog? So you are going to say, no way, I wouldn't be breeding to a dog that is throwing ears that don't go up. How do you know? The breeder is only posting pictures of their successes. 

If everything else is looking good out of this paring. If the lines you are looking are showing good general health and longevity as far as you can see. Then I wouldn't give an umbilical hernia another thought. If there was a relationship between umbilical hernias and bloat or EPI or MegaE, than yeah I wouldn't touch that litter with a ten foot pole, but that just isn't the case, not that anyone has found.


----------



## Jazzyo (May 14, 2008)

selzer said:


> Well, an umbilical hernia isn't a big deal. Maybe you produce some. Ok, there are so many problems, health/genetic issues with this breed. If you are going throw out this breeder because she produced some umbilical hernias, you will probably go with someone who's just not telling you what they have in their lines. They don't have to. Excellent hips can produce dysplasia, and good hips. They aren't going to tell you about the pup they decided to put down because the hips were so bad at age 1. They will show you that three puppies out of this litter had OFA good. Wow, kool. But what about the other 4? Well, their owners chose not to get them x-ray'd.
> 
> And HD, in most cases can be managed without surgery, and the dogs can live a regular lifespan with no intervention. What about MEGA-E and EPI? It's like throwing out a dog that produced a puppy with allergies, and landing with a bitch that has MEGA-E or EPI. It's like turning out a possible pup because some of the pups had Pano, and landing with a bitch whose sire and dam have produced dysplasia. There are no perfect dogs out there. Some are healthier, and we should not breed dogs that have or throw serious health problems. But if we throw out every dog that has a problem, yes; and every dog that has produced a problem, yes; then what is left is the dogs that have all that crap hidden. These are live creatures and subject to genetic problems and environmental problems.
> 
> ...


Wow that was a long answer, LOL! I realize a hernia isn't a big deal if you are spaying your pup but I was more inquiring as to breeding a dog with a hernia. I am well aware of the potential health problems in GSD's. Thank you for responding, appreciate your input.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

A vet told me that it is fine to breed a bitch, she suggested that fixing the hernia at six months or so, whenever you would otherwise spay her. A breeder who had been breeding more than 50 years, said to leave them alone, that it will not cause any problems. I agree with her, unless the hernia is seriously large.


----------



## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

re reading your original post, the concern is over the impact on your female if she has a hernia and is bred? not so much her off spring developing them or the ethics behind the breedings, correct?

if that’s the case, assuming you’re talking about umbilical hernias, and you select a female without a hernia to start..... no, the risk of her developing one during pregnancy wouldn’t be greater because of her parents previously throwing pups with hernias. 

my understanding is that once the wall closes behind an umbilical hernia, it’s closed. one of my males had one, never needed repairing, never caused problems... just a thumb sized bump on his belly.


----------



## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Max has a hernia the vet told us to massage when he was a young pup but it never closed. It looks like a belly button. It has not caused him and issue the vet decided to leave it alone.


----------



## Jazzyo (May 14, 2008)

Jazzyo said:


> I believe there were 6-7 puppies and 2 had hernias





Fodder said:


> re reading your original post, the concern is over the impact on your female if she has a hernia and is bred? not so much her off spring developing them or the ethics behind the breedings, correct?
> 
> if that’s the case, assuming you’re talking about umbilical hernias, and you select a female without a hernia to start..... no, the risk of her developing one during pregnancy wouldn’t be greater because of her parents previously throwing pups with hernias.
> 
> my understanding is that once the wall closes behind an umbilical hernia, it’s closed. one of my males had one, never needed repairing, never caused problems... just a thumb sized bump on his belly.


Of course I am concerned about the ethics behind the breeding! If I didn't care I wouldn't care enough to ask this question and I could reword my post to include that but I don't think it is necessary. But now that you mention ethics, from what I am reading, it appears most think hernias are not a big deal but I would prefer not to produce more of them in a breeding. I like everything else about the sire and dam at this point which is why I would like further input on whether to go forward with this or not.


----------



## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

Jazzyo said:


> Of course I am concerned about the ethics behind the breeding! If I didn't care I wouldn't care enough to ask *this question* and I could reword my post to include that but I don't think it is necessary. But now that you mention ethics, from what I am reading, it appears most think hernias are not a big deal but I would prefer not to produce more of them in a breeding. I like everything else about the sire and dam at this point which is why I would like further input on whether to go forward with this or not.


right, and your question is what i was seeking clarification on.
anyway, seems you've gotten your answer......but as the link tim posted suggests, there are different types and all hernia's aren't created equal so hopefully the ones that_ most seem to think arent a big deal_, are the same type that you're referring to.


----------



## Jazzyo (May 14, 2008)

They are umbilical hernias.


----------



## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

It sounds like you have already made a decision. If it bothers you that much, find another dog to breed. At some point a breeder needs to make a decision, realizing there are no perfect pairings or offspring, or give up breeding. If you are striving for perfection, you will be disappointed if something else shows up unexpectedly while you are worrying about hernias.


----------



## SMari (Nov 28, 2020)

I think you might have missed the point of selzer’s thorough response, which boils down to the fact that there are many other very serious genetic problems to consider, and that in the absence of any of those, a few umbilical hernias would not be a deterrent to breeding.


----------



## Jazzyo (May 14, 2008)

SMari said:


> I think you might have missed the point of selzer’s thorough response, which boils down to the fact that there are many other very serious genetic problems to consider, and that in the absence of any of those, a few umbilical hernias would not be a deterrent to breeding.


I actually agree with this I just wanted some input on it from other's who've experienced it. I've never bred a dog with a hernia nor do I know if doing so produces puppies with hernias or not. I'm just very careful in doing it right which is why I posted the question.


----------

