# Male vs Female as Police Dogs?



## llombardo

As we are sitting here having a general conversation at work about police dogs, I'm having a hard time thinking of any females doing the job. From TV shows, to demonstrations I have seen to dogs dying in the line of duty, all males.

Why is this?


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## Gwenhwyfair

I don't know about the police but I'm in a MWD group on FB and they post, honor, a lot of female dogs there, think David's Fama for example. 

So I would be surprised if (why) police would not follow suit?


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## mycobraracr

I see both male and female K9's. Majority are males, just like in sports. The saying goes, all strong females belong in the whelping room. Working females can be more difficult as well. Females hold grudges, males don't. think of it like this. I pushed a girl off a swing in kindergarten. Twenty years later she still hates me because of that one day. Where my best friend and I have punched each other in the face on many occasions but are still as close as can be. Male and female dogs are the same way. 

As in all this stuff, this is just generalizations. There are always exceptions to the rule.


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## llombardo

I just found it odd that it just hit me. I'm wracking my brain and I can't come up with one I've seen. Even military, David's is one of the only ones I can think of. 

I do understand the grudge thing


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## Slamdunc

I simply do not see a lot of females offered for sale as potential K-9 prospects. I have tested a few and one Dutch Shepherd was awesome. The vendor "claimed the dog was two, but based on her teeth and body she appeared to be about 4 and had several litters. Awesome dog, if I wanted a bitch for breeding working dogs she would have been great.

I have owned some awesome females for sport and I enjoy working a female in IPO. Hence, my new GSD pup is a female. When it comes to LE work, we do not spay or neuter dogs. Some females will get a little flaky when they come into season, it will also affect our male dogs. Not a big deal, just one reason. Males are generally larger, have more aggression and do not go into heat. 

There is the belief that females are more protective and will not leave the handler to engage someone a distance away, I do not believe this. I think a hard female will work just as a male will. We just do not see them offered for sale. I do test them occasionally and test them the same as the male dogs. The availability of good females is very low if not rare in my area. We do have a super single purpose lab in our narcotics unit and she is great. 

For patrol dogs, I like the size, aggression and working abilities of male dogs. I am testing dogs this week, if a super female was available I'd take her. But, as correctly mentioned, females like that are often held back for breeding.


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## llombardo

My first thought is that this reminds of the old days where a woman with strong hips was to be barefoot and pregnant and the male supported the family. Not saying that is bad or good but that is my first thought


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## Waldi

Need more agression in the police dog and size. Intact males may have higher agresivness and definately are a bit bigger. In this case size matter.


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## Debanneball

Waldi said:


> Need more agression in the police dog and size. Intact males may have higher agresivness and definately are a bit bigger. In this case size matter.


This is what Wikipedia said. It also said females were used mainly for rescue, tracking, drugs..


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## Gwenhwyfair

Lisa, there's plenty of female MWDs. Join a couple of military working dog groups (I'm on a couple that honor and support retiring MWDs) and you will see them in stories and pics, posted by the handlers.

Just because David's Fama (which I noted earlier) is the only you have seen it does not equal a statistical sample of what genders the military is using over all.

That doesn't mean they represent the majority but that aren't all that rare either.


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## Gwenhwyfair

Regarding size, why are a lot of departments using Malinios which tend to be smaller?




Slamdunc said:


> I simply do not see a lot of females offered for sale as potential K-9 prospects. I have tested a few and one Dutch Shepherd was awesome. The vendor "claimed the dog was two, but based on her teeth and body she appeared to be about 4 and had several litters. Awesome dog, if I wanted a bitch for breeding working dogs she would have been great.
> 
> I have owned some awesome females for sport and I enjoy working a female in IPO. Hence, my new GSD pup is a female. When it comes to LE work, we do not spay or neuter dogs. Some females will get a little flaky when they come into season, it will also affect our male dogs. Not a big deal, just one reason. Males are generally larger, have more aggression and do not go into heat.
> 
> There is the belief that females are more protective and will not leave the handler to engage someone a distance away, I do not believe this. I think a hard female will work just as a male will. We just do not see them offered for sale. I do test them occasionally and test them the same as the male dogs. The availability of good females is very low if not rare in my area. We do have a super single purpose lab in our narcotics unit and she is great.
> 
> For patrol dogs, *I like the size, *aggression and working abilities of male dogs. I am testing dogs this week, if a super female was available I'd take her. But, as correctly mentioned, females like that are often held back for breeding.


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## Gwenhwyfair

One more thought, about this grudge holding business and females in general.

If I held grudges I'd have half this forum on ignore, but I don't......

I've worked with horses more then dogs. Mares can be difficult when they are in season, depends on the mare. Same with stallions though, some are more mellow some more difficult. The difficult males tend to be difficult ALL the time though.

I know I'm know nothing nobody when it comes to police dogs, but sometimes these generalizations about females...is...well paternalistic baloney. I've known many, many graceful and forgiving females of both the 4 legged and two legged variety.

To err is human, to forgive canine. So they say.


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## llombardo

Gwenhwyfair said:


> Lisa, there's plenty of female MWDs. Join a couple of military working dog groups (I'm on a couple that honor and support retiring MWDs) and you will see them in stories and pics, posted by the handlers.
> 
> Just because David's Fama (which I noted earlier) is the only you have seen it does not equal a statistical sample of what genders the military is using over all.
> 
> That doesn't mean they represent the majority but that aren't all that rare either.


Point taken. But I'm more interested in the police dogs, because that was the conversation. I don't need to confuse the people I'm discussing these things with any more then necessary


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## Cheyanna

I had the same thought. All the dogs on k9 cops are male. Alaska state troopers. Male dogs. Fiona's mom is a certified narcotics dog, but she made puppies. I think the thought that female hold grudges is likely as well as they make better police dog mommies.

I also can't help but notice that none of the police dogs appear to be fixed.


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## GatorDog

Most police dogs are intact and I don't think the departments I've worked with feel like dealing with spaying females before putting them out for work, and I don't think females in heat are all that acceptable for use in public. And if they are kept intact, they're used for breeding, not active working duty.

That said, I know a few female working dogs whose handlers love them. Most that I know are used for scent detection.


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## canada.k9

I believe males are more common, but not the only.
As females are more protective of the person/household when a male, is more protective of the territory (so ive heard)
I'm really not sure!


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## llombardo

So if they don't work the females, how do they know the capabilities of them producing strong working males? A female can be certified but never works and that certification is what is used?


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## Gwenhwyfair

Understood. 

However, if the use of females is more accepted in the military, a _logical_ follow up question is, why not the police? 


(And a really good question you posted above. . )




llombardo said:


> Point taken. But I'm more interested in the police dogs, because that was the conversation. I don't need to confuse the people I'm discussing these things with any more then necessary


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## ladylaw203

over the years I have handled and trained both and certified some female patrol dogs as NNDDA official. for a dual purpose patrol dog,most are males for various reasons. mostly they are imported more often than females by the vendors. for single pupose however(scent detection) either are used. Its about the hunt drive ☺


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## pets4life

in pp ive noticed the females usually seem more aggressive than any of the males but its just my personal experience for the past five years, the really good males probbably go to patrol and a lot of flakey ones end up as pets?

Males do seem stronger though

i think if a female is good enough to be a k9 she should be bred if health is good, probably why they keep back a lot of females? I also noticed tho males learn to work side by side a lot of the females just start fighting till one is dead.


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## Findlay

Cheyanna said:


> I had the same thought. All the dogs on k9 cops are male. Alaska state troopers. Male dogs. Fiona's mom is a certified narcotics dog, but she made puppies. I think the thought that female hold grudges is likely as well as they make better police dog mommies.
> 
> Funny you should say that about female K9s and grudges.
> I did hear that part of the reason that females are not the best dogs for police work is cuz they're difficult to call off a bite. LOL
> But seriously, I did hear that.


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## Moriah

My boy's maternal grandfather came from parents that were both police dogs in narcotics detection.


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## Susan_GSD_mom

Cheyanna said:


> I had the same thought. All the dogs on k9 cops are male. Alaska state troopers. Male dogs. Fiona's mom is a certified narcotics dog, but she made puppies. I think the thought that female hold grudges is likely as well as they make better police dog mommies.
> 
> I also can't help but notice that none of the police dogs appear to be fixed.


In 2000 I bought a female puppy from a breeder in Washington State who bred primarily for LE work--the only reason I got her is because she had an umbilical hernia, and the breeder hadn't sold her yet, I got her relatively cheap. I became friends with the breeder, and she told me that in her sales contract she stated that the males couldn't be neutered until they were at least 3 years old. She sold her pups mostly to PDs, but for the occasional males that ended up in pet homes or sport homes, if the dog didn't work out for them for whatever reason, she wanted them back. She said that if the male was still entire, she had a chance of placing them in LE, but PDs wouldn't take them if they were neutered.

Susan


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## SkoobyDoo

Interesting discussion! I can't help but notice in the aggression, good, bad, ugly forum, males being intact is flatly denied as being a potential cause for aggression!


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## Sabis mom

I think there have been females here, not sure anymore. I don't know any of the K9 guys anymore.
Back home I recall that my one uncles first dog was female, and I think his second one as well. 
I don't know about police dogs, but I can tell you that in my experience my female took threats toward me very personally, and would hold a grudge forever. Get on her bad side and you were there for life. The boys were great and certainly did the job, but it was a job that's it.


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## llombardo

Anyone notice how many police dogs are dying of dancer now? At least the last 6-7 that I have seen.


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## RZZNSTR

llombardo said:


> Anyone notice how many police dogs are dying of dancer now? At least the last 6-7 that I have seen.


Mine did!


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## Susan_GSD_mom

Locally, our PD had one die of cancer, but it was felt that the cancer was due to the fact that handler and dog volunteered at Ground Zero in searching for remains. The dog, a GSD, was tested as well as other dogs and first responders for a particular type of cancer, I don't remember the details.

Susan


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## kr16

llombardo said:


> Anyone notice how many police dogs are dying of dancer now? At least the last 6-7 that I have seen.


Wouldn't that be most dogs not just police dogs? To many humans as well. Bad food is killing us all. 

Sorry this may make this go off topic.

A great page on facebook to like is, very informative on foods. 

https://www.facebook.com/MarchAgainstMonstanto?fref=nf

Everyone should throw out anything with high fructose in the house.

Raw feeders be aware of most USA meats and what is injected in them. Our meats and most foods are banned everywhere in the world even in China.


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## zudnic

Interesting. My cousin's fiancé is a dog handler with the RCMP. The RCMP have their own breeding program. He said they have had female k9's, but rarely do females get selected to become K9's with the RCMP. He didn't know why exactly. He'll ask and get back with us.


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## angelas

A good female can contribute more from the whelping box than from the back of a patrol car. I, personally, believe that is why there are more males in operation. Females go through heat and can get stupid twice a year as well, but if you spay her her futurity potential is lost for good.


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## zudnic

Since the RCMP has its own breeding program. They tend to keep the females that qualify to be police dogs to their criteria as breeding stock. A rare few work the streets.


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