# Washing out



## Lin (Jul 3, 2007)

I'm washing out Emma. 

There, I've said it. Its final now, no going back. 

I've been thinking over it for months. I was kind of unsure for the last year really, but you can't know what training can do until its done... There have been multiple things nagging me. I didn't know if I could take care of them with training. I was going to fundraise for a member here to do some professional service dog training with Emma. I thought, I'll send Emma to her and then get her opinion after the training if she thinks Emma is ready/will ever be ready.. But I've decided I just don't trust her. There are some things that even if they disappear with training, I wouldn't be able to relax in public concerned about them suddenly re-appearing. Especially since after time off due to health issues, Tessa started displaying some behaviors I hadn't seen since she was in training (like impatiently whining super softly. I'd be on hyper arousal asking the guy I was seeing "did you hear that? Did Tessa just whine?!") So, its done. 

I'm not sure where to go now... At this point I'm afraid of my ability to train a service dog myself again. I'm a perfectionist, and I have even higher standards now than with Tessa due to learning from my mistakes etc. If I start again with another prospect and they wash out, I can't have 4 dogs so I'd have to rehome... I'd prefer to go with a program dog at this point, but I've never been able to find a reputable program that would ensure I was placed with a GSD (for example some places claim they use GSDs, but most of their dogs are labs) and willing to place a SD in a home with other dogs. Especially since Emma's washed out, some will make exceptions for retired service dogs but Emma is just a pet now. 

I'll continue training her for fun and to help at home, but the trust necessary for public access just isn't there.


----------



## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

Washing a dog out is always a very hard thing to do. Even the pros with organizations with their in-house breeding programs face that same problem. That said, for an owner trainer is the additional emotional bonds that are invested. 

There are a few guide dog organizations that still use GSDs. Have you thought of getting on one of their lists for a career change dog? There you would have the temperament and health checks done and also a large bit of the obedience work completed.


----------



## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

Goldens and Labs rule that world...


----------



## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

> Goldens and Labs rule that world...


Maybe in numbers but there are some of us who would not want to use any other than a GSD.

Fidelco
http://www.fidelco.org/

The Seeing Eye
http://www.seeingeye.org/


----------



## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

I agree!
But I know from when I did shelter work they would not take GSDs, or Dobies, Rotts, anything that "looks" intimidating.
They were all over Goldens and Labs.



> There are a few guide dog organizations that still use GSDs.


Um, you said it yourself...


----------



## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

Most of the major guide dog schools have their own in-house breeding programs with limited flow from outside breeders.


----------



## Lin (Jul 3, 2007)

ILGHAUS said:


> There are a few guide dog organizations that still use GSDs. Have you thought of getting on one of their lists for a career change dog? There you would have the temperament and health checks done and also a large bit of the obedience work completed.


I thought the career change dogs were the wash outs?


----------



## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

They are wash outs for Guide Dogs but for various reasons. I heard of a few that could not get the hang of estimating heights of things to walk under. Example would be a dog that may walk someone into an overhanging limb of a tree. But if you are interested I would suggest contacting them and finding out what is or may be available.

We have a thread here of GSDs washing out from Fidelco and being career changed to SAR and Law Enforcement.


----------



## Lin (Jul 3, 2007)

Oooo I never thought of that. That a failed guide dog could end up making a great other type of service dog. Durr! Thanks  Yea, if the service task was the failure (especially considering how complicated guide work is!) and not obedience then it could turn out really well. I think of all the types of service dogs my main need is probably the "easiest." A lot of mobility tasks are like tricks. Unfortunately though thats why there are so many idiots out there claiming they train mobility service dogs.. Teach a few tasks and think thats it. 

Do you have any idea what would happen if the dog still washed out? I'm not sure what kind of contracts would be with career change dogs. 

I'm also limited by sex now, can't have another bitch in the house  (I frequently joke with my roommate about how he's in a house full of bitches. His dog is one, both mine are along with my current foster)


----------



## Rerun (Feb 27, 2006)

Lin, I'm sorry to hear about Emma. 

Concerning career change dogs and the aftermath. I'm sure it varies organization to organization. We puppy raised our coming 9 y/o female GSD for Leader Dogs for the Blind, and she was career changed at 1 y/o after they x-rayed and found she had mild hip dysplasia. That was the only reason she washed, and they adopted her back to me. I have never - not once - heard from them again. I do believe that I am supposed to give her back should an event arise that I could not keep her. I still have all her paperwork somewhere I'm sure. But they've never contacted me regarding what I have done, am doing, etc with her. As morbid as it sounds, I do think I will probably contact them after she passes and let them know she was a great dog, and lived a wonderful life. I have no idea if they would care or not, but it seems like the thing to do YKWIM?

Can ICAN not help?


----------



## Lin (Jul 3, 2007)

ICAN was not any help when I contacted them last year... Actually I was quite surprised and found some of the replies rude. I originally contacted them to ask if they would be able to help me in the same way they did with Tessa, allowing me to attend training with Emma and evaluate her for me. They said they didn't do that, I said oh ok things must have changed. So I asked if they would be able to help me public access test her whenever she's ready. But again they said no. I understand them saying no and thats not the part I found rude... It was just a strange vibe I got from the communication, which was not there at all when they assisted me in the past. I also know they don't work with GSDs at all so there wouldn't be a possibility of help there. They said their policy is to not work with dogs that have a negative public opinion such as GSDs and Dobermans.


----------



## Rerun (Feb 27, 2006)

I believe the original founder or co founder of ICAN moved to another state and hasn't been involved in a year or two (at least) so that my be why the attitude changed. Unfortunately my life just got way too hectic and busy a few years ago so I stopped volunteering puppy training and socialization, and fostering the ones who were having issues in the prison. It's too bad that things have changed, it was a great organization previously. I do know they also stopped working with the juvenile system, which is also unfortunate. I became very frustrated with them when she was moving and things were very unorganized to the point that a puppy was removed from the prison and placed with me for training (issues in the prison) and I said from the get go that she just needed to be washed and placed with an adoptive family as a pet which she was great at. She was very shy, skittish, nervy in public. Scared. Couldn't overcome it. I ended up spending 9 months trying to work with her anyway, and after a month or two of having her they basically stopped replying to my emails. Sometimes it would be two wks before I got a return email. She wasn't on my vet records, and back then I didn't know about ivomec for HW preventative, so I couldn't buy her HW meds from my vet w/out a checkup and blood draw at my cost. ICAN wouldn't reply back and get them for me, they stopped providing food after the one bag ran out so that was out of pocket as well. She got a bad paw pad cut and I had to take her to my vet - they said they'd reimburse, but never did. Finally they washed her, and put a $500 adoption fee on her which I just couldn't afford at the time. I loved her to pieces but it is what it is. She ended up in an awesome home though. They did a great job evaluating the home and I even got to take her there and dog sat for them quite a lot before they moved (with her) to North Carolina.


----------

