# Aggression triggered by injury



## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

I have got a rather wierd problem with my dog and im wondering if there is someone out there with similar expriences and maybe some suggestions on how to solve it.

Some months ago, when my male german shepherd was 3 and a half years old, it suddenly got an infected toe, wich was painful for him. It got treated by a vet with anitbiotics, and in a week the pain seemed to be gone, and he hasent had any more problems with the toe.

But after his injury he got very sceptical and afraid of me, not liking it when I touch his feet or even touch any part of the rear part of his body. He seemes to be protecting himself, is afraid that I am going to hurt him, like he some how is relating the pain he had to me. Sometimes when I just want to pet him a little on the head he can get so scared that he snarls at me for several minutes and his whole body is shaking with fear. I have no doubt that he is able to become dangerous to me when he gets like that, a scared dog is a dangerous dog. Ive seen a vet after this behavior started to rule out that he didn’t have any pain in his foot, and ive been to a private dog trainer that gave advice on how to get rid of it, but that didn’t help.

Ive lived with german shepherd all my life, and ive seen aggressive behaviour in dogs befor, but not like this. Until he got the injury he was a a fine dog, socialy and physically. He can be a bit of a sissy, scared of noises, things falling over and things like that, but not of people or other dogs. And he has never previously displayed any aggression, never snarling over food, bones or things like that. Ive had him since he was a puppy, and he has been humainly trained. He has NEVER been punished physically, so he has no reason to fear me inflicting any pain on him.

Now I am trying to get him to trust me touching him again by giving him a snack while handeling his feet several times a day. When he snarls and trembles with fear I stay calm, tell him to lay down and waits besides him till it goes over so that he doesn’t learn that snarling makes me go away. He gets more walks than usual, and we do some excersices to make him work more with his nose, getting more stimulation.

Anyone have any thoughs on this? Can it be latent genetical disposition to aggression triggerd by the injury he got? Can it be something I am doing comletely wrong it trying to train it away? Im very afarid I might have to have him put down, because I cant have a dog I don’t trust and suspect might bite, and he isnt very happy being afraid and sceptical of his own owner.

Sorry if my english is full of errors


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

What was the name of the Antibiotic they gave.

Has the dog had any other Vaccinations or shots?

PS you English is fine.

Val


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

Thanks for quick response, Val

I do not know what kind of antibiotic he got, but it helped in a mather of days, and he had no reaction to it i could see. Anyways, if it was a reaction to teh antibiotic it would be out of his system a long time ago, dont you think?

He has been regularly vaccinated every year, not had any reaction to those either.


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

There can be some reactions that Medicines that you don't really see.

When and what were the last vaccinations?

Val


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## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

I know in Europe, you get charged for *each* thing the vet examines during a check-up, including looking in ears, eyes, listening to heart/lung sounds, etc. Therefore, most of us do NOT get a full check-up each time we go in to the vet's for a problem. (if the toe hurts, the vet checks only the toe, etc.)

I would ask my vet to do a VERY thorough exam, and just understand that this will be expensive. But, it may tell you of a NEW problem that you did not know about, such as joint pain, weak eyesight, etc.

Example: About a year ago, my snuggly, cuddly dog suddenly got a FURIOUS look in his eyes if I tried to pet his head. He had no injury, he just had a vet exam for something else, and he was "fine," I thought. I took him to the vet-- he had a horrible deep ear infection, and his ears were not even red or smelly. No obvious signs except the angry expressions and stiffening if my hands were near his head.


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

The last vaccination was about a little over a year ago, long before the changed behaviour. I havent really asked whats in the vaccination but i found on the vets website the standard yearly vaccine. I think these are latin names, probably the same everywhere









canine parvo virus
canine distemper virus
canine adeno virus
parainfluensa virus


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

When he got the toe infection he had a partial checkup, cause it seemed quite obvious what the problem was. About a month later he had a complete check to rule out any physical things that could cause the changes in the dog. And yes, it was expensive, but the vet found nothing. The dog was so scared and out of balance during the check that the vetrinarian didnt believe me when i said that he had never displayed any aggression previously. Very sad thing, cause he used to be such a fine dog. Most of the time is is now also, playful, seeks my contact, but then i can se him suddenly stiffen up, be on alert, very affraid of me.


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

No one with similar experiences? Im getting desperate here, and this cant go on any longer. It doesnt make sense to me that a dog who has seemed fine and balanced till the age of almost 4 years has such a change in behaviour, and that he having a foot injury can trigger aggression against owner. When he was a puppy and until the injury, me and my mother (who also kept german shepherds) often talked about how lucky i was to get a dog with so good disposition. I cant recognize the dog i have now. By seeing the fear and how he reacts towards me, he looks like he is used to being beaten and hurt. This morning, just looking and talking to him made him snarl at me. The training of him to get used to me touching him again by giving snacks while doing it, doesnt work, maybe its even making it worse. Ive been told that being strict with a genuinly scared dog is the worst i can do, but can it work? If every time he snarls i tell him 'no!' and send him away from me? Rather than teaching him 'being with me is not scary, its fun, and you get a snack', i teach him 'if you snarl, i dont like you'? Does that make any sence? Any thoughts on this i'd appreciate very much!!


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Has he gotten a clean bill of health after the infection. Blood work done to make sure the infection didn't clear up in the toe and move some place else? There could also be a chance that what appeared to be an infection was just a precursor to bone cancer. Something just doesn't sound right with this dog like there is an underlying Medical problem.

Just a thought but you might want to try an herbal calming supplement. I have tried Tranquil Tabs recently with my one female that has severe issues with wind and storm with good success. http://www.entirelypets.com/tranquil60.html


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I am sorry for your situation. Unfortunately, it does not seem as if anyone has had a similar experience. 

A couple of thoughts come to mind - 

Although you state the dogs temperament was fine, perhaps he never was stressed enough to exhibit this weaker nerved, fearful side. 

OR

He has another medical problem not physically obvious such as a brain tumor , a blood flow problem where his brain is not receiving sufficient blood to function normally - I saw a horse which had a problem like this who went beserk while tied after being ridden - a condition which affects his brain, therefore altering his behavior

An enzyme imbalance which causes disorientation

None of these would be easy or inexpensive to diagonose unfortunately - but as bizarre as your dog's behavior is, the cause must be bizarre as well.

I am very sorry for your poor dog and your pain in dealing wiht his problems.

Lee


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## Parsifal (Feb 1, 2006)

Thyroid problems can also cause sudden changes in behaviour ( http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/bizarre_behavior.htm ) It may be coincidental to the antibiotic/infection. 

Also -- quinolone antibiotics (cipro, levaquin) can cause intense and long-lasting joint/tendon pain in humans. There are several on-going lawsuits about it. So find out what antibiotic was used, and if it was a quinolone, suspect that your pup is in real pain.


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: Wisc.TigerHas he gotten a clean bill of health after the infection. Blood work done to make sure the infection didn't clear up in the toe and move some place else? There could also be a chance that what appeared to be an infection was just a precursor to bone cancer. Something just doesn't sound right with this dog like there is an underlying Medical problem.
> 
> Just a thought but you might want to try an herbal calming supplement. I have tried Tranquil Tabs recently with my one female that has severe issues with wind and storm with good success. http://www.entirelypets.com/tranquil60.html


It has been given a clean bill of health. No signs of infection anywhere else in the dog. Acctually, the vet wasnt completely sure the toe even was infected. It had no swelling, no open wounds, nothing wrong with his claw. But the dog was in pain, and walked on three legs. The vet guessed infection cause the toe felt warm. Can this be consistent to bone canser, and what other symptoms shoud i look for?


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: WolfstraumI am sorry for your situation. Unfortunately, it does not seem as if anyone has had a similar experience.
> 
> A couple of thoughts come to mind -
> 
> ...


On the enzyme inballance, the dog has no signs of disorientation. Only sympthom is that he is afraid of me.

If he had a brain tumor, or a blood flow problm wouldnt that cause a variety of problems?

As to the dog never being stressed enough to throw him out of ballance, i have been thinking of it myself. From early on i saw his small signs of nervousness for objects, sounds etc, so we worked alot on making him safe. He has never been in any dog fights, never had any real injury or pain. Maybe this behaviour would show itself earlier if he had.


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: ParsifalThyroid problems can also cause sudden changes in behaviour ( http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/bizarre_behavior.htm ) It may be coincidental to the antibiotic/infection.
> 
> Also -- quinolone antibiotics (cipro, levaquin) can cause intense and long-lasting joint/tendon pain in humans. There are several on-going lawsuits about it. So find out what antibiotic was used, and if it was a quinolone, suspect that your pup is in real pain.


From what ive read about Thyroid problems, i understand that I should ecpect more sympthoms, the dog being more overall stressed?

The vet checked his joints, bending and stretching them, looking for signs of pain, but found none.


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

I really appreciate all your inputs!

One thing i have not mentioned is that only one of his testicles has come down. The other one is still up in his belly (if thats the right word for it). Can that in some way be painfull for the dog, and would the pain be spotted by the vet checking him? The vet looked for anything painfull, and ruled out that his testicle was a problem, but could it be?


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

I don't know if your Vet does Xrays or Ultra sound, but you might want to look into the cost of that. I fear that your dog may have a bone cancer or some other type of cancer. Bone cancer is extremely painful for the dog. The Xray or Ultra sound may tell you what is going on inside the dog. 

Barring more in your situation very expensive testing I am not sure what information we can give to help you. 

With the retained testical there have been studies that showed an increase chance of cancer on the retained testical.

I wish there was more we could do for you and your dog.

Val


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

When i went to the vet the first time, when his toe was infected, there were taken xrays of his foot. Do you think bone cancer would be detected from that, or do you have to specifically look for it, or xray some perticular part of the body?


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

OK, another thought is that the ABX did not clear the infection it just moved some place else and it is a Staph Infection which generally requires pretty long term treatment to kill all the wasty Staph germs. 

There are some posts in the health section on Cancer and Staph infections. Lots of good information there.

Val


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## [email protected] (Feb 8, 2009)

Thanks







Taking him to the vet again after the weekend to have them do blood tests and check for Thyroid problems and signs of infection again. Hope they can give me some answers.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

It does sound like there is something systemic going on. 

If you have the thyroid checked, if you can run a TgAA (thyroglobulin antibodies) to check for autoimmune thyroid problems -- that will typically be the first thing to show abnormalities, as early thyroid disease doesn't always show in that T4 tests that are typically run. Fear is a symptom of thyroid imbalance.

Is there any chance of a tick infection where you are at?

An xray should show cancer, unless it's very very early, and then I would think you wouldn't see that level of pain.

I don't know much about retained testicles though.


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