# Gentle leader vs. Halti?



## BandCsMom (Feb 3, 2007)

I recently had a trainer recommend a gentle leader for my GSD. I went to the store this morning to find numerous different makes and models. Is there a difference? What should I use? I am new to using this training tool, so I thought maybe some people with more experience could give me some ideas.








Thanks,
Karen NE. PA


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## MayzieGSD (Aug 28, 2006)

I would use the Easy Walk Harness instead (made by the same company as Gentle Leader). I'm not a fan of the head halter type collars as they can cause injury if your dog sees something and tries to take off... also most dogs HATE them! The Easy Walk Harness works just as well









http://www.premier.com/View.aspx?page=dogs/products/behavior/easywalk/productdescription


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## weber1b (Nov 30, 2008)

We have not used any head harnesses so I can't help you with those. We do use the Easy Walk by Gentle Leader and we think they are great. I like the fact that the control point is in front of the chest, not the neck or head. The dogs do respond to them and even if they are in high prey drive (passing squirrel?), they can be controlled.


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## AniasGSDs (Oct 18, 2004)

IMO, and not trying to be rude................. but I think that all those so called *"gentle leader"* type leads are just *a lazy way of getting out of real dog training! *

A properly trained dog, yes EVEN A GSD, can walk with out pulling on a regular leash!!!!

If your *TRAINER*







is recommending this type of lead, I would find myself a different trainer!!!!


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## MayzieGSD (Aug 28, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: AniadoubleIMO, and not trying to be rude................. but I think that all those so called *"gentle leader"* type leads are just *a lazy way of getting out of real dog training! *
> 
> A properly trained dog, yes EVEN A GSD, can walk with out pulling on a regular leash!!!!
> 
> ...


While the Gentle Leader isn't a substitute for training your dog to walk on a leash, there are times when my dog spots a deer or squirrel and forgets - the GL sure helps with control in those cases and I feel more comfortable when she is wearing a GL or a prong collar.


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## AniasGSDs (Oct 18, 2004)

> Originally Posted By: MayzieGSD
> 
> 
> > Originally Posted By: AniadoubleIMO, and not trying to be rude................. but I think that all those so called *"gentle leader"* type leads are just *a lazy way of getting out of real dog training! *
> ...



Unfortunately, most people get the GL because they are too lazy to do the proper training! 

I prefer the *prong collar *over any other collar. For me it has provides the most control PLUS you can correct with it. *You CANNOT correct with a GL!*


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## rgrim84 (May 8, 2009)

Its hard picking products when you dont know much about them, but in my opinion you get what you pay for...


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## weber1b (Nov 30, 2008)

A dog will pull on any kind of leash or harness (other than I suppose a prong) without training. I just prefer not to use the neck for control. Our dogs walk on slack leash with the harness as they should. 

We used a prong on our previous dog Sophie. I will admit I'm sure we did not use it 100% properly, nor did we have the best prong (based on some I've seen since) but I'm not a fan of them. I do see lots of folks on here using them and swear by them so I would certainly not suggest the OP should not consider them.


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## littledmc17 (Apr 9, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: Aniadouble
> 
> 
> > Originally Posted By: MayzieGSD
> ...


Totally agree find yourself a new trainer!!! 
if my trainer ever told me to get a GL, I'd be telling him/her give me my money back

A trainer is suppose to teach you how to train your dog 
I never leave the house without Brady on a prong collar not that I need to correct him but if I have too. 
Brady doesn't pull and when he does I say no and he corrects himself


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## Karin (Jan 4, 2008)

Heidi was a big puller when we first got her. We tried the Gentle Leader and she hated it, plus it started to leave an intention on her nose (and we did have it fitted correctly). What helped the most was the Easy Walk Harness. Something about the pressure on her chest made her slow down more than the pressure on her neck/head.


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## pglenn (Jun 5, 2005)

Hi Karen, How old is you dog and what training issue are you working on with the trainer? 

Is your pup pulling or are you working on him being reactive while on leash? Different kinds of equipment are appropriate depending on the age of the dog, the problem you are addressing and whether or not you wish to use positive or adversive training methods.

For pulling, I've found the front attaching harness to work very well as a training tool. My dog can be reactive to other dogs when she is leashed. All of the positive reinforcement trainers I've spoken to have recommended a head halter. The Gentle Leader head halter fits a bit more snugly around the dog's nose than the Halti and is therefore makes it harder to slip off the dog. There's another called a Snoop Loop that's similar to the Gentle Leader in style. 

I personally prefer the Halti as it lays flat on the dogs nose and has a piece that attaches to the collar as well. It been a wonderful tool for us while we worked on this problem and I've had very good results. 

I totally disagree that it's the lazy person's way of training. It's a tool like any other that if used correctly helps you train your dog.

If your problem is leash aggression, please do not use a prong. Every trainer I spoke to advised me that in reactive dogs, prongs increase aggression, as the dog associates the approaching dog with the discomfort from the prong.


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## AbbyK9 (Oct 11, 2005)

Gentle Leader and Halti are two different brand names for types of head halters (or head collars, as some people call them). The theory behind these collars is that control of the head gives you control of the dog, and therefore, prevents the dog from pulling ahead and allows you to teach the dog to walk nicely.

That is a very good theory, but I think in practice, the majority of people who purchase head halters don't learn how to use them correctly and get them in lieu of training, not to support training. I frequently see and hear people at pet stores asking employees, "My trainer told me this would stop him from pulling, can you show us how to fit it?" 

Then they put it on and their dog stops pulling - well, the dog stops pulling because pulling bends his head around, which is uncomfortable, but the dog doesn't actually learn not to pull when he's not on the head harness.

If you have a dog that lunges at other dogs or people or who will chase after a deer or rabbit, the head halters are not at all suited (IMHO) to deal with that type of behavior. Imagine an excited dog, or a dog in prey drive taking off toward the end of the lead on a head halter. The dog hits the end of the lead. Unless you're letting go of the lead, his head is going to get snapped around, which has a serious potential for injury to the neck and spine.

There is a great article on Suzanne Clothier's website, http://www.flyingdogpress.com, called The Problem with Head Halters. You have to sign up to access the articles section (it's free), but it's worth going through that to access what she has written, not just about the head halters but in general.

Like everyone else who's posted on this thread, I would prefer the front-clip harnesses or prong collars over using a head halter any day.


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## AniasGSDs (Oct 18, 2004)

Nicely written Chris!







I'm not as eloquent.....


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## ArmyGSD (Apr 27, 2009)

I have had nothing but positive results with a Gentle leader. And as KeiraGirl stated they are a training tool. This is not meant to remove any type of training, but meant to help teach the dog how to react and respond. With my previous dog Jax we had him on a GL through his training classes. (basic OB) He did very well with AND without the GL on. It acts as a correction device if the dog pulls, you give a gentle pull on the lead, and then release the pressure, thus acting like a pack leader would in putting pressure on the dogs nose. Nothing will replace proper training, but IMHO a GL is a great way to go.


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## Ucdcrush (Mar 22, 2004)

I agree with Pat that it has its uses! And I wouldn't worry about a dog breaking his neck running after something, after all these thing should be used on a SHORT leash with the dog right next to you. So a dog shouldn't get the opportunity to run at all.

As for which one to get, I bought the Halti because it has a safety leash built into it that attaches to the dog's regular collar. If the dog decides to take the harness off, then your leash is still connected to the dog via this safety leash.

I bought mine not because my dog was pulling, but because I was watching Cesar use it to redirect the attention of a dog that was aggressive towards other dogs. I have a dog that would keep staring at other dogs as we passed them, which would just get him and the other dog riled up. If I corrected him with a leash pop, he could still be staring at the other dog. A prong collar has the chance of inciting the dog to get even more riled up in these cases.


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## Myamom (Oct 10, 2005)

I'll answer for BandCsmom since I know her dog...

He is 3 and is aggressive/reactive

So..I'm confused...one post said no prong for this type of dog...another recommended it.....


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally Posted By: myamomI'll answer for BandCsmom since I know her dog...
> 
> He is 3 and is aggressive/reactive
> 
> So..I'm confused...one post said no prong for this type of dog...another recommended it.....


Her post didn't make any mention of that fact, which I think is an important consideration. I would not use a prong, or any other type of corrective collar for that type of dog. I also like the front hook harnesses, either the Easy Walk or the Sense-ation. It doesn't issue a correction like a prong, but it gives you more control than a flat collar, without any chance of damage to the neck. As others have mentioned, any collar should be used in conjunction with training, not as a substitute for it.


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## BandCsMom (Feb 3, 2007)

Maryann, you need to empty your pm box.


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## Myamom (Oct 10, 2005)

Done


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## nysirk (Apr 15, 2008)

Head halters.........I love them I hate them........

Ive had great success using a head halter on my fearful dog Libby for walking, it was a nice tool to help me gain a little control, so i could train her, and we weaned off it nicely and it was the right tool for HER. As for name brand I prefer the Gentle leader over the hati its a little easer to put on. 

I started with one of these for my pup Dexter and I regret it!!! This was NOT the right tool for him. He was a Reactive leash aggressive, barrier frustrated pup. The GL was very uncomfortable for him, he was not my happy little guy when that thing was on. He was constantly trying to get it off by rubbing at it, itching it, summer salts and most embarrassing of all rubbing his nose in people groins, trying to get it off. 

There is nothing natural about controlling a dogs head and forcing it to the side. Not to mention no where in the packaging or video dose it warn you of the spine damage you can cause. If it is a dog that is reactive hes going to lunge and pull, When a dog lunges its easy for us to Jerk the leash, The G.L. is not meant for correction and you can really hurt a dog badly by jerking on your leash with one on, its more dangerous then a prong. I finally realized the G.L. was prob causing more harm then good, so we went to the easy walk front clip harness. I loved that tool for walking he was very comfortable in it, but it still wasn't the right tool for our issue the feeling of being held back with a barrier frustrated pup was not helping either. 

Finally we realized we may need something more adverse but we were not about to experiment with any of that on our own. We found an Amazing trainer /behaviorist who was able to really help us. She was able to read our dog and let us know what he was really feeling, and what tool is going to work best. he wasn't looking for a fight, he wouldn't act like this off leash in play so he wasn't really fearful of the other dogs, he just liked to act this way when he was behind a barrier or when he felt "Safe" therefore a prong ended up being the right tool we needed. The prong works like another dogs teeth. Other dogs correct each other all the time, its dog psychology it makes sense to the dog. I was finally able to speak to him in a manner he understood and respected. The progress we are making is UNBELIEVABLE.

I think it all boils down to what will work best for YOUR dog. 



> Originally Posted By: KeiraGirl
> If your problem is leash aggression, please do not use a prong. Every trainer I spoke to advised me that in reactive dogs, prongs increase aggression, as the dog associates the approaching dog with the discomfort from the prong.


 Yes this may be the case, but not always a prong can work with a barrier frustrated "leash aggressive" dog but the only way to know is to have them read by a professional.


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## Riley's Mom (Jun 7, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: myamomSo..I'm confused...one post said no prong for this type of dog...another recommended it.....


That's probably because everyone has their own favorite methods, their own reasons for training how they train, backed up by information they've gathered over the years that either worked or didn't work for them. No matter where you go, you will never see a group of people on a forum board such as this to agree 100% on anything. That would go against human nature.

No matter what the topic, alot of finding the correct answer for each owner lies in the individual dog and owner. What works for one dog will not work for every dog, training, equipment you name it. I have come to the belief that there is no one right answer, it's what works for your dog and you. 

Some of the people in this thread pretty strongly accused people using the gentle leader type of collar as being lazy. For some people this might be their first dog, their first big dog, their first problem dog .. whatever. They may not know any better and are trying their hardest to find something that works and they may be very frustrated by the time they post for help here. 

I find it pretty harsh and arrogant to call people lazy for trying to find the right answer and doing what their trainer told them. If this is their first experience with a dog trainer, how are they to know that perhaps this trainer isn't all that good and maybe shouldn't even call him/herself a trainer? We all haven't been born with the skills that have been attained by some of the people on these boards. I'm guessing at least some were not born with all their knowledge and experience and that took years to build to where they are at now. Some of the people here may have started their dog learning in their own childhood and even you had to start somewhere.

I myself tried the GL type head collar and the Easy Walker because my dogs pulled and I could not stop them no matter what I tried, which by the way includes spending almost four THOUSAND dollars on a trainer which did absolutely nothing for my dog. I did NOT consider trying the GL and the Easy Walk as me being lazy in any way shape or form and I resent being lumped into that category when I worked my butt off, spent a literal fortune on a trainer, have spent more money on training equipment and training this or that than most sane people would spend no matter how dog crazy you might be and tried many of the options suggested on the boards here. 

Not every trainer is good at what they do, not every piece of equipment works 100% for every dog, a prong collar is not right for every dog, a GL head collar is not right for every dog. Some dogs actually DO learn on equipment such as the GL or Easy Walk and believe it or not, people are not all lazy if they use something other than your idea of training.


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## Riley's Mom (Jun 7, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: KeiraGirlIf your problem is leash aggression, please do not use a prong. Every trainer I spoke to advised me that in reactive dogs, prongs increase aggression, as the dog associates the approaching dog with the discomfort from the prong.


My male had been highly reactive to other dogs, from my other post you'll see I tried quite a number of different things not only for pulling when walking but my efforts also included trying to fix other issues. 

What actually *is* working is a *small* prong collar and a different way of using it that I learned from a new trainer. We see very little aggression now and what we do see is triggered by a yappy excited dog, dogs approaching improperly, and just plain small dogs sometimes kicks in the prey drive. 

The new trainer, training method, equipment and finding out our dog has hypothyroidism and is now on meds has made a huge very welcome difference. I never did like the idea of using a prong collar, but I am ok with what we are using now.


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## Qyn (Jan 28, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: BandCsMomI recently had a trainer recommend a gentle leader for my GSD. I went to the store this morning to find numerous different makes and models. Is there a difference? What should I use? I am new to using this training tool, so I thought maybe some people with more experience could give me some ideas.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


As your question only concerns GLs or Haltis, I have used both. I prefer the halti for my GSD as it fits looser around the muzzle, yet her muzzle is long enough that it does not come off. My partner used a GL on our Maltese as his muzzle was shorter and where the halti would slip off him, the GL fit his muzzle better. Both dogs walked on loose lead with these and also without them but we had more control with them, if it was required. 

BTW, I have never used a prong. They are not readily available here and are frowned upon by our RSPCA in Victoria, Au (possibly from uninformed bias) despite many representations indicating prongs are more humane than many other corrective training tools. The GL and/or Halti work for what we need but if I needed a different tool I could consider getting a prong if it was a good quality herm-springer one and if I could ensure it was fitted correctly.

All the best.

Neither the GL or the Halti are very expensive so you could get one of each and see which one you prefer. I would stick to these versions of this tool as they tend to be of better quality than the "knock-offs".


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## mle (May 21, 2009)

I love my GL. I have trained a Rott mix that had no prveious training to walk on a leash (and he was already one or two years old) and my aunts GSD that has has previous training but was really, REALLY wound up. Jake (my aunts dog) decided he would forget his training when they went on walks. I have also trained my Australian Shepherd to walk off lead when were at our obedience shows with the GL. Do, I always recomend GLs; if you put them on right, they are comfortable and they don't even notice it is there. Now, my Aussie is the only neutered one here (all the rest are intact males) and I can walk them around local breeders with bitched in heat and they kind of hesitate, but they keep on walking with me.

Prong collars. Hmmm, everbody has their own opinion about them. The prongs simulate the mother dog's teeth when they was younger. When they would do something bad, the mother would nip them with her teeth. Now, I recomend using these for a while when they're young and don't just introduce them here and now if they are already over two years old.


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## mel hunter (May 15, 2009)

What actually *is* working is a *small* prong collar and a different way of using it that I learned from a new trainer. We see very little aggression now and what we do see is triggered by a yappy excited dog, dogs approaching improperly, and just plain small dogs sometimes kicks in the prey drive. 


My dog has similar problems with leash aggression that seems to be related to frustration at not being able to greet the other dog and/or maybe some prey drive as he crouches when they approach.
I'm not sure how to correct this behavior...all his training has been with a prong collar and that has worked well but am wondering what is a "different way of using it"? Any advice on this would be appreciated.


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## mel hunter (May 15, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: Riley's Mom
> What actually *is* working is a *small* prong collar and a different way of using it that I learned from a new trainer. We see very little aggression now and what we do see is triggered by a yappy excited dog, dogs approaching improperly, and just plain small dogs sometimes kicks in the prey drive.


(Sorry about the bad post above. Still trying to learn...)

My dog has similar problems with leash aggression that seems to be related to frustration at not being able to greet the other dog and/or maybe some prey drive as he crouches when they approach.
I'm not sure how to correct this behavior...all his training has been with a prong collar and that has worked well but am wondering what is a "different way of using it"? Any advice on this would be appreciated. 

Thanks,
Melinda


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## Ucdcrush (Mar 22, 2004)

Riley's Mom, along with mtngirl, I'd also like to hear about how you're using the prong collar with your dog.


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## mel hunter (May 15, 2009)

I started with a prong collar on the advice of my trainer and it has worked well. Buddy is pretty well trained now so I rarely have to give a correction and if I do it is just a slight tug on the leash close to the collar and just the noise of the metal clanking is enough to have him respond. I don't even pull it tight on his neck. So I give a command, if I don't get the correct response I say "nah"-tug (almost simultaneously)and if needed may repeat the command. Usually he has already responded following the correction and then receives praise and/or treat. 

The frustration/leash aggression is a fairly new problem and I was looking for suggestions on how others have handled it. If he is heeling (like in group class) he is not allowed to sniff or make contact with the other dogs but on regular walks I sometimes let him sniff and greet other dogs if the other owner is ok with it and he is very friendly. If he is unable to greet the other dog he seems to get frustrated and lunges and barks. Any ideas??
Thanks, Melinda


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