# Petsmart Puppy Classes???



## Tihannah (Dec 27, 2009)

I have been working with Kaiya for about 2 weeks now in basic obedience and she has been doing very well. We're up to 9 commands right now and I work with her in and outside various areas of our home. Well, today I took her to both Petland and Petsmart, and well! All those commands were basically non-existent. When we walked up to Petland and she saw her reflection in the doors, she went into a barking frenzy. Once I got her into the store, she started barking at the tiny puppies they have in the glass displays. One of their employees happens to bring her dog with her to work, and happened to be one of the sweetest pit bulls I've ever seen, and she brought her from the back. Kaiya, of course, barked at her until the pit came up and gave her a few kisses and calmed her down. However, just the smells and environment had her all in a frenzy, so I took my time shopping and letting her explore around the store and letting various people talk and rub on her. We went to Petsmart afterwards where she only barked as we were first entering the store, and then quieted down. It wasn't until we were getting ready to leave that she could put minimal focus back on me.
So now I'd like to get her into the Puppy Classes at Petsmart more for socialization than anything. I feel like What good is it for me to teach her all these things at home, and then when we go out somewhere, its complete chaos? Has anyone taken these puppy classes and what do you think about them? Or is there a cheaper alternative for me to get her better socialized around other dogs?? I haven't been able to find a dog park in my area yet. She does well with people and is very "puppy" friendly. We do have 2 other dogs at home, which I thought would help her socialization skills, but apparently it hasn't. Any suggestions??


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

How old is she? Sounds like typical puppy behavior to me.

I would be VERY careful about dog parks - a lot of puppies have been traumitized at them by being bullied by other older not socialized dogs whose owners have no clue.

how about puppy training classes where all the dogs in it are young puppies (I am assuming that she is a puppy)


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## Tihannah (Dec 27, 2009)

She's 16wks. That's why I was looking into with the Petsmart puppy classes. I just would like to work on this behavior now while she's somewhat small as opposed to when she's 80 lbs and more difficult to get under control.


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## SouthernThistle (Nov 16, 2005)

Usually...puppy training classes ARE classes in which all "students" are young puppies







PetCo and PetSmart type of training programs really vary from store to store. Some stores have several trainers, some have one trainer, and they're all different.

My cousin was required to take her puppy to puppy classes before they were allowed to use the school's dog park (and puppy area







) I can tell you right now, that's the best darn 5 mths old Lab I've ever seen - so well-mannered, and Lauren said she got a lot of socialization with big dogs, small dogs, proper greeting, basic obedience, etc. 

I would recommend puppy classes over dog parks for socialization without a doubt.


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

She is so normal!

It is important to teach your dog in a non-distracting environment at first. When you step out into the world, you will want to work at a distance where she can still concentrate and you will have to "retrain" the behaviors. Because a dog understands sit in the living room doesn't mean it does in the busy store. It takes training in many places before a dog will generalize those behaviors to all places.

For your little pup, that was like taking a kid to Disney World and asking them to work on their algebra while in line at Space Mtn!!

Keep working with her. It is a gradual bringing up of pups just like kids. The work is months and months and going many places etc. Don't be discouraged at all! You are doing fine! It all pays off in the end.


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## Tihannah (Dec 27, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: SambaShe is so normal!
> 
> It is important to teach your dog in a non-distracting environment at first. When you step out into the world, you will want to work at a distance where she can still concentrate and you will have to "retrain" the behaviors. Because a dog understands sit in the living room doesn't mean it does in the busy store. It takes training in many places before a dog will generalize those behaviors to all places.
> 
> ...


Lol, Thanks!! I feel so much better now!!


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

Petsmart is way often German Shepherd Puppy Barkfest!!


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## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

I would definitely say get her into a puppy class of some sort, whether it's Petsmart or a training facility. Puppy classes are very very helpful with socialization and acclimation to different environments/animals/surfaces/noises/etc...


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Samba is absolutely right, what's easy at home is completely different out in the real world. Start slow by working with her in your backyard on behaviors that are reliable in the house, then in front of your house, or even IN the house with the front door open. (Yes, I've actually had to do that because outside was SO distracting that we needed an interim step!) Very very gradually work up to more distracting environments, and as you do you may find that you need to up the rate of reinforcement again, and even go back to using a lure at first. That's fine. 

Puppy classes are great socialization, so even if all you've got available is a Petsmart class I'd be inclined to take it. The "trainers" I've seen at my local Petsmart have not impressed me, and I doubt they even know as much about training as I do, but fortunately I have better choices around here. And don't be surprised if the first week is chaos and she's all over the place. It should get better each week as she becomes accustomed to the new environment. Halo was NOT good her first week in puppy classes, but by week two she was so much better, and even more focused each week after that.


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## Alto (Nov 18, 2008)

> Quote:We do have 2 other dogs at home, which I thought would help her socialization skills


This is such a common misheld belief - your home environment is just that, HOME, it is everything safe & familiar, stuff that puppy knows inside & out - but unless home is also a shop where there are loads of new people & dogs arriving/departing daily, it's not much for "socialization"; even if you take your pup to work with you everyday & you work in a doggy daycare, your pup may be very confident with strange dogs (except most doggy daycares have alot of 'regulars' so it becomes an extended 'pack') in THAT PLACE & still have issues if you were to go to a Petsmart or dog park etc.

*Socialization = NEW *places, NEW things, NEW people etc etc so taking your pup to the same coffee shop, the same dog park, the same school playground is NOT equivalent to going to different coffee shops, different pet shops, different ____'s every week/month 
Your pup needs to meet *more than just one* man with a beard, a hat, a cane etc etc




> Quote: Or is there a cheaper alternative for me to get her better socialized around other dogs


Usually big box puppy classes are aong the cheapest, before deciding on which one, ask to meet the trainers, or at least get an outline of their course material & training method - some BB shops have professional trainers working for them & running the classes, others have an employee that's taken the company course, run the classes ... so YMMV (dramatically).
Doing classes with your pup is one of the best investments you make in your dog & your relationship with your dog - don't expect 1 set of puppy classes to provide a socialized dog: you need to continue socializing at least though the first year (even better, into the second year but with less need for repetition at intervals).

There are many great articles here or linked through this site
http://www.4pawsu.com/articles.htm
(I believe you need to register now for access to Suzanne Clothier's site but it's quick & free)

Sorry for repeating this again, but it's such a convenient, printable list: 
_An article from Pets.ca 

*Socialization*

Until they reach 16 to 18 weeks of age, a puppy will be in a socialization period. This period is the most important and critical in its life. Every effort should be made to socialize your puppy; meaning to expose him or her to a variety of positive and pleasant meetings. The greater the exposure you can give to your dog during this period, the more it will lead to improved social flexibility, emotional stability and trainability. 

You must socialize you puppy to a number of different things; people, adults and children of various ages, animals and environments. Use the socialization table for ideas or for tracking your progress. Place a check mark beside the experience that your puppy has had the opportunity to add to his repertoire. Notice which spaces are blank and take you puppy out! The more experiences in its repertoire, the better equipped the puppy will be to socially to deal with new situations. Take advantage of puppyhood, because after this period, socializing your dog will take longer and be much more difficult...

Remember that before the puppy has its second shot, the puppy's immunity won't be as strong. Exposure to only vaccinated dogs at this time is highly recommended.

An unsocialized puppy is likely to fear some people or situations. 
Fearful reactions are too often related to biting...

You have everything in your hands to prevent these alarming reactions...

Below is a socialization checklist for your puppy - Puppies should be exposed to all the items on this list with your direct supervision at the following frequency; 6-7 weeks, 7-8 weeks, 8-9 weeks, 10-11 weeks, 13-14 weeks, 15-16 weeks, 4-6 months, 6-9 months and 9-12 months.

*HUMANS: *<u>women and men</u> 
young adults / adults 
elderly people 
disabled / infirm 
loud, confident people 
shy, timid people 
joggers 
delivery / wearing uniforms 
people wearing hats 
people with beards 
people wearing glasses 

*CHILDREN * (girls & boys)
babies 
toddlers 
juniors 
teenagers 

*ANIMALS *
adult dogs 
puppies 
cats 
small pets / birds 
livestock / horses 

*ENVIRONMENTS *
friend's house 
shopping centre 
park 
school / play grounds 
day care 
country walks 
party 
slippery floor 
bus 
bridges 
tunnels 
elevators 
stairs 
veterinary practice 
groomer 
boarding kennels 

*OTHERS *
motorbikes 
bicycles 
breed related stimuli 
wheel chairs 
traffic 

Julie Sansregret
AHT, Dog trainer
Guides Canins 
1313, rue PineRidge, 
St-Lazare-de-Vaudreuil, Qué._

Note that socialization involves alot of repetition as your pup ages, it's not enough to do all this when your pup is 3-6months & then stop on the assumption that your pup will remain 'socialized' through adulthood.


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## KG K9 (Dec 8, 2009)

I've got Deebo in a class at my local PetSmart. The trainer is great! It is not a puppy class, but a beginner course, and he is doing well so far. I say go for it. It is $109 here for 8 weeks.


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## littledmc17 (Apr 9, 2008)

Please don't use their pet classes they are idiots IMO 
I over heard a trainer saying something to another person with a pup and I kept my mouth shut so wrong
try to find a real trainer


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## KG K9 (Dec 8, 2009)

It depends on the person. I know someone with a 1 year old GSD who paid way more for a "professional" trainer and like 80% of the dogs failed a K9 good citizen course for basic things. It depends on the trainer of course...but also the owner.

Don't tell ppl to NOT go to PetSmart because you overheard one bad piece of advice.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I wouldn't go as far as to say they are idiots. BUT many good, great trainers will have their own place or belong to a training club...a petsmart trainer is a steppingstone and you get the beginner trainers. If you have other options, then investigate them.


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## Jason L (Mar 20, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: Alto
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Great post!


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## cindy_s (Jun 14, 2009)

Only go to Petsmart classes if you already know what you are doing. I took my puppy for socialization. I was already working her at home. The "trainer" was a complete idiot. They take employees and put them through a basic training course, and cut them loose on poor pet owners. Some may be better than others. Over a few weeks, I saw this girl completely frustrate 2 owners. The worst was an older couple. This was their first dog. The "trainer" recommended puppy training pads to house break. The poor folks couldn't understand why the puppy was not going outside, and only in the house. Then, the next lesson was stay. The "trainer" took this fantasic, natural focus little dog, told it to stay. The little puppy sat for about 3 step back (fantastic!), and then followed the trainer. Basically the trainer kept backing up until the puppy followed her. Then the trainer got frustrated with the puppy. The puppy then shut down, and wouldn't do even sit at that point. DUH! Now, my puppy knew stay. The "trainer" had me put her on a sit-stay, and walk away. She then took a ball and started bouncing it while walking around the puppy. My girl was only 14 weeks old. She was not ready for proofing a stay at 14 weeks old! Luckily, she didn't break. I never went back. I would say use only for socialization, and NOT for training.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Why was the trainer working with the pup instead of the owner? I would have not been able to hold my tongue.


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

The quality of training at Petsmart does depend on the trainer, but if it is ll you have it is all you have. 

I would be more concerned with socialization than learning obedience commands right now. This pup is nearing the end of her socializition window and I would get on it pretty quickly. 

I would try the Petsmart class, just go in with good info and expectations and do something with your pup or let the trainer do something with your pup that you are not comfortable with.


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## Tihannah (Dec 27, 2009)

Well, I have already been working with her on a lot of basic obedience commands and she has been doing well. Socialization is my main concern after our last outing. However, I'm still not sure if I want to enroll her in a training class that is going to confuse what she has already learned either. I currently use the clicker/reward method and she has been responding well to it. But I'm wondering if they will say something if I'm using the clicker with her at Petsmart?
My other question, for anyone that is still following this thread is, "How do you make these commands stick if you don't have a clicker and treat in your hands?" For instance, there are times, of course, when she gets really riled up and I just want her to "sit" or "down". If I don't have a reward for her, these commands seem to mean absolutely nothing, or if she does do them, they are very brief since she realizes she's not getting a treat for doing them. I've tried to use praise in these instances, but as of now it has very little effect. Will this come with age as she grows older and I continue to work with her?


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

You start by weaning her off the clicker and reward by pairing those with verbal praise and intersperse that with a bit of play or tug or fetch. 

Then you occassionally don't click and treat you just praise or play. You eventually drop the clicker slowly- click every other time and then every third time or forth time and so on. Be variable by sometimes clickng twice in arow, and then skip 5 and then click once and then skip 2 reps, etc. Mix it up and vary the rewards. 

The obedience is great but don't forget the socialization, you want an obedient dog but you need a dog you can take places too.


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## Tihannah (Dec 27, 2009)

I enrolled her tonight and we start on Sunday. They spent a good 20 minutes explaining the class to me and asked several questions about my pup. They also said that they use the clicker training method, so it was good that she was already started on it. They explained some of the commands we would work on and there were a couple that I haven't covered, so that is good, including jumping up on people, which she is really bad about. They also explained that the focus of this class was going to be socialization and working on the basic commands with all the distractions. They also explained that since I have been working with her so much at home, that after that class, I could skip the beginners class and go straight to intermediate with her. Sounds good so far and looking forward to getting her out and around some new things. Wish us luck!


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## srfd44-2 (May 20, 2004)

You may want to start her in the beginner's class so that she is around pups close to her own age. The intermediate may have larger puppies and they may be too rough with her and this may scare her. Socializing is just as important as the training. Good Luck !


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## Tihannah (Dec 27, 2009)

You're probably right, but I guess I'll wait and see how this class goes before I make a decision and learn more about the trainer. Its an 8 week class which is not bad for $109. Roughly $14 a session.


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