# Watertown Sturmfalken Breeder?



## Rumpelstielzchen (May 13, 2014)

does anyone have information on sturmfaklen breeder in watertown new york? 
i heard good things from people that have boarderd there dogs with them and would like to get some more information.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Sandra grew up in one of the top breeding kennels in Germany...she has only had one small litter and the female is going back to Germany so her parents can pick up on their breeding with some of their own lines again....

She seems to be able to handle dogs pretty well in a pack setting....

Lee


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## Rumpelstielzchen (May 13, 2014)

she wants another litter, from what i herd. do you think it is a good choice for a schutzenhund beginner? i always wanted to do it.


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## Xeph (Jun 19, 2005)

She's planning a repeat, and a breeding with Drago Patriot down the line


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

If you are able, you should go see the dogs work. What's right for one person is wrong for another. Go see if you like how they work.


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## Rumpelstielzchen (May 13, 2014)

whaat breeding would you recommend for a beginner handler?
i am not new to the breed but i am new to schutzenhund.
can you explain the lines she is planning to brede.

there is no titled on the dogs so are there questions i should ask?


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

you should be asking HER these questions as she knows what she's breeding, the reasoning and what she should get out of them.


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## LoveEcho (Mar 4, 2011)

Ask Sandra these questions. She knows the breed and knows her dogs... She will be the one with the best idea of what to expect and who they would be a good fit for. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

Yup...ask the person that's done the breeding and is trying to sell you the dogs. It's the most objective and unbiased opinion you can get.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Everyone seems to be tip toeing around this because people know Sandra thru the internet. So I'll say what everyone would be saying if she were an unknown.

Here is a link for a responsible breeder.
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/choosing-breeder/137533-things-look-responsible-breeder.html

Personally, the child of a person who has experience doesn't really impress me. I'm a plumber's stepdaughter. Doesn't mean I should be fixing your toilet. And anyone can tell you I'm not a fan of Sandra's but I'm trying to give you an unbiased opinion.

I believe Sandra has her parents input on this breeding so there is some decades of experience behind it. There was some thought behind this breeding by people with decades of experience in breeding.

When I was looking for a breeder for sport, I went and watched the dogs. I found a dogs I really liked, some I didn't, and some I loved. I highly suggest you go meet these dogs. Go meet the breeding pair. They are both on site so won't be hard. Watch them work. That's the best advice anyone can give you. Go see what you like and ask questions.

As far as I know, not a single person on this forum has seen her dogs work so I don't think anyone can answer your question on whether they would be good Schutzhund dogs. 

You may get more input by asking for the pedigrees and having Cliff give an opinion on what the breeding may produce. And Marcus Hampton used to work Nala so you may get some information on her working ability from him. Talk to the people on her SAR team on Nala's ability in that venue.


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## Rumpelstielzchen (May 13, 2014)

i hoped i would get more informaton than that. you can send a message what you think about her and her breading? i thought people on this forun are experts with bloodlines or is this the wrong forum to ask this questions when chosing a breeder? 

from what i hear she has a good reputation for bordering and training. 
i talked to people in the akc and they saw the moother last week and one of the puppies. i can go there and see the dogs myself.


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

There’s nothing to tell…no one knows anything. There has only been one litter, out of unproven parents. There is no history of success with anything and because this is the first litter no one can really give you any firsthand experience with the breeder and how their dogs turn out.

If you’re looking to get into Schutzhund, head to a club, watch the dogs work. See what you like/what you don’t like. Talk to those people and see where they got their dogs and head on over to that breeder. A piece of paper can only tell you so much about a dog, the real test is watching it work, watching it interact with strangers and in different situations.

Many times I look at dogs as risk/reward in a very efficient market place. There is a lot of information and with the internet, it is very readily available. So…not knowing what the price of the potential puppy is, I can’t tell you if it’s a worthwhile purchase or not. Think of it this way, in most areas, a good WL puppy out of IPO3 titles parents runs around $1200 + $300 if you’re in a more “affluent” area. So for everything that’s less than that, you start decreasing price (and the breeders generally know this too). So…a puppy out of IPO3 titled grandparents, with a good bloodline, but neither parent was worked in IPO but possibly worked in something else and are health checked…$700ish. No titles? AKC registered? No health checks? $300ish?

So all things equal…if the breeder in question is charging $1200+, I’d look elsewhere because I can get a puppy out of proven/titled parents that probably have close to that same bloodline. On top of that, the exact bloodline doesn’t matter much to a novice as who the dog is linebred on 4 or 5 generations ago isn’t really going to tell the end user much as they don’t know much in the first place.

You wouldn't pay the same amount for a Toyota that you would for a BMW right? Even though both cars will get you from point A to point B.


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## lau333 (May 15, 2014)

I personally know Sandra. She is my "go to" person if I have any questions on pedigrees. She has been around the breeding of quality German Shepherd Dogs her entire life. If you ask her a question she will answer you honestly and give you good advice. She is not the typical "I know it all" breeder.


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

lau333 said:


> I personally know Sandra. She is my "go to" person if I have any questions on pedigrees. She has been around the breeding of quality German Shepherd Dogs her entire life. If you ask her a question she will answer you honestly and give you good advice. She is not the typical "I know it all" breeder.


Can you speak anything of the current dogs working ability? Since you know her personally I'd imagine you have gotten a chance to watch the dogs work. Not sure how being around the breeding of quality GSDs her whole life says anything about the current breeding pair and the future puppies ability to perform in various venues...


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## lau333 (May 15, 2014)

Yes, I have observed her female, Nala, work. She is very impressive! Solid, stable temperament, high drive and just a phenomenal dog. Sometimes life gets in the way of pursuing titles. I would LOVE a puppy out of that breeding. Good thing for me that the 1st litter was small as I have two young dogs now. Need a little more time before I consider another. Yukon is great also. He is a classic: working dog and family pet!


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

What venue have you watched them work in?


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

first of all "breading" should be "breeding"
"bordering" = "board"

What do you want people to say? They've already told you talk to her, talk to people she deals with directly, you want information on someone/kennel, ask HER for references and check them out. 

You've gotten a couple of responses from people here who know her personally, there ya go. 

If your looking for something 'specific', say schutzhund, you should be going to a breeder who DOES schutzund, if your looking for obedience competition, go to someone who does obedience with their dogs..etc..


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## Rumpelstielzchen (May 13, 2014)

> So all things equal…if the breeder in question is charging $1200+, I’d look elsewhere because I can get a puppy out of proven/titled parents that probably have close to that same bloodline. On top of that, the exact bloodline doesn’t matter much to a novice as who the dog is linebred on 4 or 5 generations ago isn’t really going to tell the end user much as they don’t know much in  the first place.
> 
> You wouldn't pay the same amount for a Toyota that you would for a BMW right? Even though both cars will get you from point A to point B.


she takes $1000 with $300 deposit. 
with last littr she gave option of returning the deposit or to apply to next litter. she said it was only fair because it was not there fault that female only had two pupis. 

she says they have german helper coming in june and invited me to see the dogs work.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Then you should go. I would suggest that you visit more than one club to get a feel for the type of dog you like.


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