# Aggression over high value food and bones.



## BGSD

So I've been working on my 4 month old on the whole food aggression issue. Overall, I would say he's normally not aggressive when eating - I can get near him, pet him, take the food bowl and all that and he doesn't growl or anything. However, when it comes to things such as soup bones, it's a different story. He seems very protective of the bones. About a week ago he would growl and bark if I was getting close to him. I followed some suggestions online (throwing treats and such while he's in the crate) and now he doesn't seem to growl or anything anymore when I'm right next to him. But if I touch him he still growls, barks, and tries to bite. Should I just leave him alone and not touch him when he has the bones or is this a problem that I should continue to work on more? If so, anyone have any suggested methods?


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## Elaine

This can become a huge problem as he gets older. If any puppy of mine ever tried that, I would have been all over him and he would never try it again. Putting a stop to this when they are young is much better than when they are older and used to being able to back you off.


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## BGSD

Elaine said:


> This can become a huge problem as he gets older. If any puppy of mine ever tried that, I would have been all over him and he would never try it again. Putting a stop to this when they are young is much better than when they are older and used to being able to back you off.


Any suggestions though? Should I leash him and pull him away from the food when he growls?


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## Elaine

The second he even eyeballed me, I would be as loud and make myself appear as large as possible, grab him by the collar and lift his front feet off the ground, and yell in his face, until he looks away with his eyes - you will see his eyes flick to the side and that's enough. Then I would take the bone away from him and send him to his crate for a time out. Give him several minutes to calm down, and then call him to you sort of like you are still a bit mad, but are going to forgive him. Give him a very quick pat on the head and a good boy, then walk away. You want him to feel like he did a very bad thing and you didn't like it. 

If he's good the next time with his bone, praise him quietly and then either play with him if he wants or just leave him be.

I don't like having to give such a severe correction to a puppy, but this is one of the few instances that I would do this. Letting your dog growl or try to back you off for any reason at this age, will lead to much worse aggression and most likely a dog bite in the future.


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## DJEtzel

Elaine, your methods are very aversive (if not abusive) and are the type that teach dogs TO bite, or completely ruin their confidence around their people. 

OP, I don't suggest following ANYTHING that Elaine said unless you want to teach your dog to be afraid of you and people in general, or teach him that warning (growling) isn't okay so that he goes straight to the bite in the future.

Use another bone and work on trading with your pup. If he has a soup bone, use another new soup bone, and approach him and offer the new bone for the old one. Most dogs (food aggressive dogs too) accept this if it is an better reward for them. If he drops the one he had, take it while giving him the new bone, and try to switch back. If he doesn't want the old bone don't pressure, and work on it again when he has an old bone and you have a new bone, or you can cycle through a bunch of new bones!


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## CLARKE-DUNCAN

Sometimes you need to get things away from dogs mouths very quickly and it is always useful if your dog lets you do this!! I have never had this problem with my dog, I can quite happily sit by him and even hold his bone for him when hes chewing it. Try having some yummy ckicken in your hand and when his attention is on the chicken slyly take his bone. When he has eaten the chicken, offer him his bone back but try and hold on to it while he has a nibble at it. He needs to learn that you are in charge of giving and taking away of his food.. Best of luck!... Also give him some praise when he is letting you hold his treats and bones...


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## BGSD

So I guess the general approach is to constantly trade between bones/treats/etc. until he's used to having my hand near his food?


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## JakodaCD OA

I'm on the fence here,,I can see both sides..

I'm figuring it this way,,if YOU had say, a pb&j sandwich and someone took it from you, it probably would'nt tick you off as much as if you had filet mignon

I don't mess with my dogs at meal times, tho I have no problem taking anything including food away from them. When it comes to bones, well those are high value and frankly a 'privelage' to have in my book.

If trading isn't working, I wouldn't be giving him any of those 'privelaged' bones. 

The growling is a warning and a prelude to a bite. Tho some dogs will grumble and growl , sound verocious and it's all a bluff..(I have a male aussie who does this, sounds like Cujo if you go near him with a bone, but I just walk up and take it and he's like 'oh ok"***not saying YOUR dog will do this tho)

My concern would be, you giving him say a bone, having a kid in the house and the kid knows no better and goes for his bone..What is the dog going to do? Rip his face off? You don't want to get rid of the growling, as you don't want a dog who will give no warning, and just go for the bite. YET you don't want the dog to BITE over a bone.

What happens if YOU hold the bone, and let him gnaw on it? Don't let him have it, but HOLD IT. 

I do certainly agree with Elaine as well, if one of my dogs did it and MEANT IT, they'd be getting a good correction and NO BONES.

One thing I will not tolerate is one of MY dogs, even thinking about biting me. Thankfully, none have, but they'd sure 'get it' if they did. 

So while I do agree with trying to trade up, hold it yourself, if he can't control his possessiveness over a 'privelaged' item, he just doesn't get one


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## Cassidy's Mom

This is a 4 month old puppy! If you'd rather not scare the crap out of him as Elaine suggests, there are other ways to prevent resource guarding, such as teaching him that he can trust you around his food and other valued resources, and now is the time to start working on it. Many people believe that taking away and messing with a dog's food can actually create problems. Better to teach him that when you're around and he's eating or enjoying a bone, good things will happen.

I posted about some things I like to do in this thread (I linked to both of my posts):

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...-way-prevent-food-aggression.html#post1976481

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...-way-prevent-food-aggression.html#post1976710

I'd have no problem correcting my adult dogs if they growled at me, but because I did all this foundation stuff with them from the time they were puppies they are much less likely to ever do that in the first place. And I'd much rather have them respect me because they trust me than to have them obey me because they fear me. Bad behavior prevented is doesn't need to be corrected.


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## JKlatsky

See to me what you do depends on WHY he's growling. Since he's 4 months old...my guess would not be dominance. 

If it was dominance there's a pretty serious problem there and you'd probably need to completely rehaul your approach to leadership in the house. If one of my dogs started to display this behavior at say 18-24 months...well that's an adolescent jerk and you better believe there might be a world of hurt in store for the dog in my house that is challenging me...Corrections and Prison Like Lockdown until he got himself under control again. 

As a pup I would more likely be betting on insecurity. And heavy corrections will likely only increase insecurity- maybe he won't ever try you over the bone again but you also really haven't addressed the underlying issue. He wants to keep the bone...he's afraid that maybe you will be taking it from him. He does not trust you to give it back and be a benevolent leader- so he feels the need to warn you off. And you're slowly increasing the zone where he can tolerate you. Who knows, maybe he was the puppy in the litter who had to fight for resources? Regardless the trade/treat program is more in line with what I would be doing with a pup. Word of caution though...CONSTANTLY working on this can actually make the situation have more anxiety rather than less. Trade him maybe once or twice and then let him have it. And always try and trade him for something even better than the bone. If possible structure the time you want him to have the bone to be long enough that it won't be too difficult to trade him. Many of my pups would lose interest in their chews in 30-40 minutes.


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## Cassidy's Mom

JKlatsky said:


> See to me what you do depends on WHY he's growling. Since he's 4 months old...my guess would not be dominance.
> 
> If it was dominance there's a pretty serious problem there and you'd probably need to completely rehaul your approach to leadership in the house. If one of my dogs started to display this behavior at say 18-24 months...well that's an adolescent jerk and you better believe there might be a world of hurt in store for the dog in my house that is challenging me...Corrections and Prison Like Lockdown until he got himself under control again.


Exactly - that would be a whole different situation.


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## BGSD

A lot of good info here. I guess I'll start by holding the bone and letting him chew on it like that....hopefully I won't lose a finger. I already make him sit and stay or go down before I put the bone in his mouth.


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## beowolf

I'm no expert but I've had dogs for over thirty years and I can tell you that to fix this problem you need to take away all of the dogs toys. Put them away somewhere out of sight, then prepare to spend some time consistently drilling basic obedience drills around the yard with your dog. Get some treats ready if you have to, but rely on them minimally once your dog gets the idea. Sit means sit. Stay means stay. The basic stuff. Put a treat at the other end of the yard and don't let him break his stay to go get it until you give the command. A dog needs to have this structure before you can hope to get a ball away from him. I've taken several overly possessive dogs into a perfect calm state of obedience using this method, simple and effective way to get some basic structure you can then build upon, like not letting the dog go fetch the ball until you give him the command to go get it after you've thrown it. Basic stuff. But, don't re-introduce the toy too early, really get down to business with the obedience commands. Once your dog REALLY understands what stay means, you'll be able to pick his toy up without him moving a muscle.


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## Francine

My 10 month old has just recently become food aggressive but only with the other dogs not me fortunately I can take his food but he hates if one of the other dogs takes something he was given even if he dose not want it?


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## RMF

Deezul was fine with the food & toys. He sits for his food & water until he's allowed to go eat or drink. 

It was a different story with the pig ears, he growled & snapped if you got near it. Last time was about a month or so ago he did it. He wound up backing himself into a corner when I went over to 'talk' to him, he knew he did wrong. Gave him a little finger smack on the nose & made him drop it. He got the message loud & clear. He wouldn't take it even when I offered it to him. He eventually came over & took it, layed down & started eating it. I started petting him under his chin, touching the pig ear, the message got across to him.

It may or may not have been the best method, but it worked & haven't had a problem since.


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## Rott-n-GSDs

Sounds like you're constantly messing with his food... that's the problem! If he's always worried about you taking food/treats, he's going to start to guard them.


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## Anthony8858

This EXACT episode was on Dog Whisperer last night.
What Cesar did, was "claim some space" around the bone, until the dog submitted.

If there's a way to find his episodes, look up the one about food aggression and the English Lab


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## Germanshepherdlova

Rott-n-GSDs said:


> Sounds like you're constantly messing with his food... that's the problem! If he's always worried about you taking food/treats, he's going to start to guard them.


My take is, the food is MINE because I am the one supplying it. I can take it if I want, he is the dog-I am the human here. I have trained my dogs, even the one with aggression issues that I can take his bone, treat, toy, or food anytime I want and so can my DH or my kids. This is important for the dog to know and respect so that if he ever gets a hold of something that he shouldn't have, I can easily take it away. Or if a small child is over visiting and grabs something from one of my dogs-I don't have to worry about my dogs biting the child.


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## Rott-n-GSDs

My dogs are all wonderful with allowing food to be taken from them by anyone and its because I didn't mess with them. If Apollo steals Nova's raw meal (very high value) I can reach in his mouth and take it with zero issues.

I don't subscribe to the "I am human, hear me roar" *insert chest beating* method of training.


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## Germanshepherdlova

Rott-n-GSDs said:


> My dogs are all wonderful with allowing food to be taken from them by anyone and its because I didn't mess with them. If Apollo steals Nova's raw meal (very high value) I can reach in his mouth and take it with zero issues.
> 
> I don't subscribe to the "I am human, hear me roar" *insert chest beating* method of training.


It's probably not because you didn't mess with them-it's probably just because they don't have dominance aggression issues. One of my dogs does, one doesn't. Really doesn't matter because neither of them will react if I take their food. One had to be taught, one didn't-it came naturally to him. If one has never dealt with aggression issues-it is hard to pass judgement on how others have dealt with it. If I had only dealt with my dog that never had aggression, I probably would feel the same as you, and talk as you do. But I know what it's like to have a dog like this, I know what a challenge it presents to the owner, and most of all what I have learned from my own experience is how much support a person going through this with their dog needs.

To the OP, it's not your fault that your dog has these issues. But you are the only person he has to help him overcome them, and you can help him to grow up to be an awesome dog. Good luck.


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## Rott-n-GSDs

Well, I don't subscribe to dominance theory, but I have dealt with food/resource guarding, aggression, and dogs with strong personalities.


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## Germanshepherdlova

Rott-n-GSDs said:


> Well, I don't subscribe to dominance theory, but I have dealt with food/resource guarding, aggression, and dogs with strong personalities.


And that is fine, I respect your preference. But what works for one dog doesn't always work for the next. There is always more than one approach, and that doesn't mean that another trainer or person's approach is wrong just because one doesn't like it.


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## Rott-n-GSDs

I definitely agree with you there. Dogs aren't cookie cutter easy, that's for sure! That's why its great to be on a forum with a wide variety of opinions/ideas.


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## Germanshepherdlova

Rott-n-GSDs said:


> I definitely agree with you there. Dogs aren't cookie cutter easy, that's for sure! That's why its great to be on a forum with a wide variety of opinions/ideas.









There is definitely a great deal to learn with so many diverse ideas and methods.


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## Cassidy's Mom

Rott-n-GSDs said:


> My dogs are all wonderful with allowing food to be taken from them by anyone and its because I didn't mess with them. If Apollo steals Nova's raw meal (very high value) I can reach in his mouth and take it with zero issues.
> 
> I don't subscribe to the "I am human, hear me roar" *insert chest beating* method of training.





Germanshepherdlova said:


> It's probably not because you didn't mess with them-it's probably just because they don't have dominance aggression issues. One of my dogs does, one doesn't. Really doesn't matter because _neither of them will react if I take their food. One had to be taught, one didn't-it came naturally to him_.


But the point is that there are different ways of teaching a dog that it's okay for you to take stuff away from them, and as you said, some work better for a particular dog than others. Some dogs might be fine with you (the general "you", not necessarily YOU) messing with their food when they eat, and taking away bones and toys all the time. Others are going to be stressed out about it, and for those dogs that method may actually exacerbate or even create a problem where one might not have existed in the first place if the situation had been handled differently from the very beginning. 

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure - if I can avoid problem behavior from cropping up in the first place, I never have to worry about how I'm going to fix it later. And it's much easier to teach your dog that you being around when they have food or other valued resources is a _good_ thing, so there's no reason to guard it from you, than it is to deal with resource guarding issues down the road, after the trust is already broken. That's why I like to teach a new puppy that I can be trusted, that I'm fair and consistent. I don't take food away for no reason, just because I'm the boss and I can, and that's why I spend so much time on trading games with other things like toys and bones. I could teach them that they have to let me take anything from them at any time, _or else_, or I can teach them to _want_ to give me anything at any time, willingly, without any fuss. See the difference?


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## NancyJ

So here is a related question.

I have noticed that 14 week old Beau will react if one of the other dogs comes near his crate while he is eating and bark at them. Me, no issues. I would just as soon not have any food agression develop concerning the other dogs even though I do always feed them in their crates.

I can give them treats sitting next to each other and he does not get snarky about it though I am watching ....... 

Good suggesstions for preventive excercises with other dogs?


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