# At Some Point--Just FORGET the Pedigree!



## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

Let's say someone has chosen a breeder for pet/fun/active companion: one that the majority of people you talk think it's a great breeder who pairs puppies wonderfully with their owners, stands by their dogs, and is extremely knowledgable about what their dogs produce.

Then the person posts the pedigree (or maybe a few pedigrees)....and suddenly they have talked to people on the forum and decided the pedigree is going to A. Produce idiots. B. Produce children eating beasts. C. You get the idea--something is wrong with this pedigree. Suddenly it's off and they are going somewhere else for a dog.

Now, I am the first to admit that I had my own set of anxiety about picking a litter and breeder...another story for another thread.

However...at what point do people just stop nitpicking every pedigree and every breeder's decision? I personally think it is RIDICULOUS for people to discourage someone from getting a puppy from a specific litter for a pet from a breeder who has a great reputation and knows what their own dogs are producing based on a pedigree.

I like looking at pedigrees as much as the next person. Am all for bashing the people throwing 2 dogs together with no knowledge. But sometimes the "opinions" seem to be a bit overboard.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

:thumbup:


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

Yes/No which probably makes no sense but have seen dogs that I like and if I get another GSD would like to get one from dogs that I actually know. I am really sick of when ever a pedigree get posted and people go on an on ad nauseum about Fero and Mink and how they have been bred too much and they don't want them in their pedigrees and their pedigrees are unique-yep my dog is Fero/Mink -nope don't care what they think...don't care what their dogs pedigrees are. I am just sick of reading it over and over again come up with something more original..and please please don't explain to me what the problem is again -I live with her its not a problem to me


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## robinhuerta (Apr 21, 2007)

I always remember...in the end...the only opinion that really matters...is your own.


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## damaya (Feb 1, 2011)

I posted my dogs pedigree months ago. Got well over 100 looks and not one comment. Would that be good or bad?


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

GSDElsa said:


> Let's say someone has chosen a breeder for pet/fun/active companion: one that the majority of people you talk think it's a great breeder who pairs puppies wonderfully with their owners, stands by their dogs, and is extremely knowledgable about what their dogs produce.
> 
> Then the person posts the pedigree (or maybe a few pedigrees)....and suddenly they have talked to people on the forum and decided the pedigree is going to A. Produce idiots. B. Produce children eating beasts. C. You get the idea--something is wrong with this pedigree. Suddenly it's off and they are going somewhere else for a dog.


It seems that if the first paragraph is true--if the breeder is extremely knowledgable about what their dogs produce, I don't think they would be putting together a pedigree that would produce idiots or maneaters. I suppose some might see a couple of names they don't like and judge the entire pedigree by that, but if the breeder knows what they're doing, and consistently produces good dogs, I'd have to trust the breeder.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

damaya said:


> I posted my dogs pedigree months ago. Got well over 100 looks and not one comment. Would that be good or bad?


I would assume that people simply don't know enough to comment. I posted a pedigree a few days ago and it hasn't gotten any comments either.


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## Kaity (Nov 18, 2009)

personal preference, we all want a professionals opinion though but the decision ultimately lies with ourselves to pick a breeder


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

As long as the breeder knows the pedigree, it's all good, 
Onxy's 'breeder' didn't even have that....I wish I had some background on her to understand her a bit better. 
And now Onyx's sister is being bred with no pedigree/papers but *registered* with the CKC... CKC should be done with.


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## lemans (Jun 18, 2005)

I choose to focus on the dog in question, regardless of the pedigree.


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## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

And at what point should the other "professionals" realize there are lots of breeders out there that might not have the same lines they do or pair dogs the same way, but they are still GOOD BREEDERS and there is no reason to nitpick all the things they view as negatives?

There isn't one breeder out there that is "all-knowing"...and certainly a lot feel the way they run their breeding program is the ONLY way to do it.


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## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

robinhuerta said:


> I always remember...in the end...the only opinion that really matters...is your own.


Yes, but sometimes when certain individuals are put on a pedestal they have a way of influencing people who might not be ask knowledgable...even when the breeder they had chosen would be a fantastic fit and they coudn't do better. One or two people bashing what they don't feel is an acceptable pedigree and changing their mind. 

I guess it crazy to me that people would be that influenced by folks on the internet.....and just as crazy that people need to find things to criticize for basically a matter of preference.


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## robinhuerta (Apr 21, 2007)

Justine....I really do understand your point.
I *live* some of the controversy...because I breed SL's....which are "constantly" scrutinized.
I've learned to let it roll off my back......dogs that are capable of going what they were bred for speak for themselves....breeders that produce good dogs, speak for themselves.....ALL the "opinions" on any forum, will not change the facts.
My advice to others would always be......find a breeder that you are comfortable with and trust....and make your decision based on your own opinion...


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

A lot has to do with HOW people got to the pedestal. If they put themselves on the pedestal.....that's one thing, if others put them on the pedestal that's another....there is a difference. The difference being that self appointed people are often very opinionated and self-centered based on their sphere of the breed. Often you hear and see things come from these people that really don't jive with what you are seeing or experiencing in the real world. Others on a pedestal are there because people have consistently found the information to be useful and apropo to what they are experiencing. I'm not saying a pedestal is good or bad.....just commenting on the ascenion of some of the people on them. 
Also, you have to realize, if you don't already, that many dog people are some of the most negative, hateful, opinionated, spiteful people you will meet. They love to tear down instead of build. Many dog people(I mean trainers and breeders) are very limited in social skills in terms of working and getting along with other people. So although there are ten ways to train a dog and all can be successful, THEIR way becomes the ONLY successful way regardless of the results of the other way. They just tear down those results with negatives. The same applies to breeders and the same applies to people on the internet. 
If you are new to the breed you have to just get out there and see dogs, breeders, and training, to see what fits.....for new people the internet is just too overwhelming in many cases.JMO


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## robinhuerta (Apr 21, 2007)

Cliff....you know as well as I...the internet can be a helpful tool, as well as a hinderance. Many posts can become very impersonal because of the lack of actual "human contact".....this is one of the reasons that I just read many times and move on......rather just "read" a post than take it to a personal level.
Lots of quality people around with quality advice....but advice and dictatorship can often come accross the same on the internet....
Off to work...


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

Robin, I agree!!!There is good and bad everywhere....but people still need a point of reference for the information from the internet.....and I don't think the internet is good at giving the point of reference.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

cliffson1 said:


> A
> Also, you have to realize, if you don't already, that many dog people are some of the most negative, hateful, opinionated, spiteful people you will meet. They love to tear down instead of build.


How many horse people have you met? They are a pretty rough crowd too.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

When I was taking a show handling class the instructor said that when people start to talk badly about your dog its a good thing-kinda sad-but then I guess you gave them something to talk about


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## sddeadeye (Apr 5, 2011)

I feel like this thread is directed at my recent pedigree question. For the record, nothing that was said by any member swayed me against the breeder. I already was having some doubts about suitability that I had already been discussing with the breeder. She has given me additional options and agreed with my concern about the one litter being too much dog for my household.

It is all well and good when someone is in the states and has access to breed events, breeders, etc to learn from. I live in North Dakota. There is nothing there. There are no breed clubs, no ScH clubs, and no reputable breeders.

Apart from that, I am currently stationed in Afghanistan and have been gone since May. To state that I am stressed is a gross understatement. I'm trying to make an informed decision about a dog that I have been wanting to purchase for three years. It feels like a daunting task. I'm sorry, but I don't want to rely solely on the breeder's opinion and was asking for third party, neutral input. The breeder's opinion is important of course, but I don't want to feel pressured into a decision.

I feel like I am being judged for asking for honest opinions. I apologize and will probably refrain from doing so in the future. A dog is a long term commitment and one I am not taking lightly.

I am using all the information I've gathered for my decision. This includes the breeder's evaluation and input, previous puppy buyers, people's input who know the breeder and her dogs personally, and pedigree critiques. I certainly do not rely on just one piece of the puzzle.


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## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

sddeadeye said:


> I feel like this thread is directed at my recent pedigree question.


Nope, culmination of a lot of things


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

I guess if you ask for a pedigree critique then you can weigh the pluses with the negatives. If you don't want to hear, then don't put the pedigree up. 

I'm more concerned with who and what the breeder is and has accomplished than the specific pedigree but I'm an amateur. 
So far that has worked for me.

I think on this forum people need to remember that despite the size of the membership (registered people) which is huge. At any given time there are probably less than a hundred or so people who post almost daily and of those only a handfull of breeders. So while their input can be valuable it must be taken with a grain of salt.
There is a whole world of breeders that are not members of this forum.
If people do their homework and are happy with their choice then I wouldn't worry about a few negative comments.


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

The problem is that you can destroy a dog and a breeder by talking bad about the dogs and the pedigrees. It always happens. 

The litter isn't even born and people are downtalking the pedigrees as a recipe for handler aggressivness already. Really? Come on! Those pups are not born and they are labeled as handler aggressive and that is all a novice handler sees. They don't see that it's just a tendency, they see the word "Handler Aggressive" and back away without taking a second look. 

And then having breeders say that they have never produced anything bad themselves? Not a single dog that had any kind of issues in twenty or thirty years of breeding? It happens to the best breeders in the world, it's an open secret but there is a difference in "not talking about it" and claiming that "it never happened".

I don't know everything. But there are a few things I know and I know the practices of breeders, trainers and handlers and I've seen it first hand how dogs reputation were destroyed by downtalking them. One man was really good with that. And he's now a legend everybody is running to. That he has destroyed quite a few handler carreers doesn't matter...


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