# OFA again or Penn Hip



## spiritsmom (Mar 1, 2003)

I had Berlin x-rayed hips and elbows back in July when she was 5 months old. I did not send them in to OFA because they looked bad just from looking at them - no sense paying them to tell me they looked bad. The vet felt she might get better at a later age because alot of what made the hips look bad was cartilage and that it might go away some as she got older. She is almost 9 months old now so I was wondering what to do. Should I take her back soon to get OFA films done again to see if there was any improvement whatsoever or should I just do Penn Hip and see how high those numbers are? 

I would like to get one or the other done now because of several reasons. Her breeder is planning to repeat the breeding soon and I would like to think she would want to be aware of the combo having produced bad hips and/or elbows. She may still do the breeding regardless but at least I would have informed her. Another breeder is planning a litter from Berlin's sister from the previous breeding (Berlin's came from a repeat mating) and also I would think she would like information. 

Plus Berlin has not yet been in heat at almost 9 mos of age. I believe her dam had her first heat at close to 1 yr of age and you don't want to x-ray around that time so I feel like doing it now would be better to avoid x-raying her close to a heat cycle. 

Lastly, I would be having her spayed asap if the films still showed bad hips and/or elbows and I would like to have that done before her first heat if I had to spay. 

So she would be 1 yr in mid February but waiting till then would result in her likely being in heat or very close to it and either breeder (or both) already having bred their litters. Now I know both may just continue on about their breedings regardless of Berlin's hips/elbows but in case they use info like that I would like to provide it. 

So which should I do - OFA or Penn?


----------



## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

All the info you can get from OFA xrays, you will also get from the PennHip xrays--but the PH evaluation will give you further information.

The problem, in my opinion, is the amount of "false positives" you can get from PH--they are more likely to negatively judge hips that OFA would approve.

However, it also seems to me that the information you are looking for isn't that complicated--if her hips were obviously "not good" at an earlier age, they are likely to be obviously better or obviously worse now. So, what would you do if the OFA view looks significantly better, even good, and the PH score is low?


----------



## spiritsmom (Mar 1, 2003)

Still spay her. I knew a Shiloh Shepherd who tested OFA Fair and they were all set to stud him, but went ahead and did PH as well and he was above .60 on each side so they neutered him. 

The cost of each is roughly the same, I just have to travel a bit farther to get the PH done versus the OFA. So I was leaning towards doing the OFA since it would be the same vet who x-rayed her at 5 mos so he still has those on file and we could compare. Plus I know he would be totally honest with me about his opinion of her hips since he does tons of films. He just felt at 5 mos that I should give her some more time and not give up (spay) based on what he saw in those films - wish I had taken a copy of hers but I didn't since even I could tell they didn't look so hot. He was iffy on the elbows since they are not something he studies all that often but he said they didn't look perfect to him either.


----------



## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

You can't do the ofa until 2, so I would do the Pennhip if I am going to do anything right now....gives a better indepth look. Having said that, one dog in a litter does not preclude a person from doing a repeat breeding, unless the one puppy is graded severe or worse. And if the puppy was graded severe in the first prelim, then there isn't a reason to re-xray again anyway.


----------



## spiritsmom (Mar 1, 2003)

I didn't send her first films in to OFA so I have no idea what OFA would have graded them - I just knew they didn't look right. I'm meaning to do another OFA prelim, not certify - you can prelim anytime from age 4 mos to age 23 mos. 24 mos is when they certify and get evaluated by 3 different vets, prelims are just read by 1 vet I believe. 

And I am not assuming by any means that Berlin being dysplastic would make either breeder rethink their breeding plans - I think both would go right ahead but I would like to supply information so that they would know. And I don't know why Berlin's breeder would repeat the litter a 3rd time other than that it's convenient, but if Berlin were to have HD then maybe she could use a different stud dog this time.


----------



## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

Understood....but reading hip x-rays in terms of moderate or worse is not that difficult. Actually reading hip x-rays for any degree isn't that difficult. I could see a person repeating a breeding three times if the results were super the first two times. Heck, you can have first litter all good second litter one bad, third litter all good. Then the same two dogs can produce all three litters with one bad and rest good. Or the same two dogs can have first litter with all good, seconf litter with two bad and third litter with all good. What I am saying is the breeding being repeated is often based on the quality of the total dogs produced and not the hips unless the hips are disastrous. JMO


----------



## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

Personally I wouldn't waste my money doing another set of xrays right now. It has only been 4 months since the last ones.
If they looked bad then, I would imagine they still do. If you want to get an OFA "opinion", just send in the ones you already have.


----------

