# Ruby (almost 18mo) and Leo (1yr)



## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

And I am really, really sorry because the stacks arent great...especially Leo's which is more of a free stand...but the best picture of him that I have so far. 










Here are a couple of movement pictures of her



















And an Expression Shot 










Aaaand for Leo










(terrible, terrible stack!!!!) This one was the only decent stack shot...but there is butt in the way.










Movement : 



















Expression : 










Thanks!!!

~Cate


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## elsie (Aug 22, 2001)

i can only comment on expression: two smiley faced wgsd, both gorgeous and happy. sorry that's all i can give you


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## littledmc17 (Apr 9, 2008)

Yeah they are smiling that is all that matters
beautiful and who cares about the stacks I love the faces


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

Being a DDR lover, I don't know jack about conformation! Your girl has a very nice gate, a happy smile and I love her pantaloons.


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## mkennels (Feb 12, 2008)

where was you at, looks like the WV fairgrounds

great photos of your dogs


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

I'm not a "critiquer" but I will say they look great. And BRAVO to you for having them in great condition and not FAT and "mushy" like a lot of dogs that are shown in conformation. (Though this might not be as much of a problem with the whites as it is with some others.)


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## GSDTrain (Apr 21, 2008)

they are beautiful


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## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

It was in Fowlerville MI  That was one hec of a trip...lol.
I would have LOVED for it to be in WV...considering I probably drove through the entire state of WV to get there and back 

Weight normally isnt such an issue with the WSD folks....alot of us competed in a herding trial prior to showing on Friday...and I can say for at least Ruby she doesnt put on weight...she puts on fur....but I also work them both pretty frequrntly...which burns alot. Leo would probably turn into a little sausage if I let him 

Thanks for the comments


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

Is Ruby the one that is doing Schutzhund? (Or am I thinking of someone else?)


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## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

lol, they both do









Ruby actually is a little better at herding, whereas Leo is a little better at SchH -- she has very little if any defense...works completley out of prey...where he has more defense and a ton of prey on top of that as well.

~Cate


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## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

Both have balanced movement and suspend while trotting, I like that. I also think both dogs are a little long in loin, and I know you plan to breed them together but I think you should reconsider. They would both do better with dogs of correct length. Long + long = a choo-choo of white GSD.

At this point, Leo has the better overall conformation and movement. His topline is level, back straight and firm. Ruby roaches in movement which is not correct. Leo is finer boned than Ruby. Ruby has a better head than Leo. Leo is still young, though. Leo could use a bit more rear angulation, I think Ruby could as well but Leo needs more of it. Overall, and I give you my dirt-honest opinion based on photos alone, if these dogs were mine I do not think I would breed Ruby, I may breed Leo if everything I wanted in his health and working ability were there. Ruby would have to be a heck of a worker for me to breed her but I think just the stud dog alone would be tough to hunt down as she would have to have a certain match to balance her conformation. These two just don't look like good matches for each other. But then again, I don't breed! I just know what I like in a GSD/BBS.









They are very nice, though. I love seeing pics of them.


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## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

Egads--lol, no, not breeding those two together. I think that would be a train wreck 

For Ruby I am looking specifically at European Males who have produced awsome working and healthy pups when bred to her lines. Her back irks me in the ring...because it's not something she does while she is herding














































And Herding : (almost doesnt look like the same dog







)


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Cate, Look at Ruby's head position when she is herding, now look at her ring movement pictures. I think with her head being held where it is, is interferring with her shoulder movement with will make her bridge like she is.

This maybe one reason why German Ring does movement with the dog out infront of the handler, so the handler isn't influencing the movement as much as AKC or UKC.

I like Ruby a bit better than Leo, but he needs to mature a bit more. She has a nice long top and bottom line. In the first picture her fone legs need to be under her a bit more, that will give you a better picture of the shoulder angle. Once you would reset the fron you would also have to reset her back legs or she would bridge just like in the ring movement pictures.

Leo is cute, he is at the cute stage. Actually I think he may have a better front shoulder giving him a bit better extension.

Val


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## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

Thanks Val....lol, I think alot of the problem is I am a pretty gawd awful handler  Any advice in that arena is very much welcome!

Leo initially started to show alot of early signs of maturing...and then we hit this stage....and it stopped  lol, I think cute is the nice word for it...we call it dopey.

~Cate


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Cate, as far as stacking I know Andrew posted a great piece on stacking your dog. I think if you got her front legs under her just a tad more, that would improve the look of the chest and shoulder. Also go look at tons of pictures on the pedigree database, pay attention to the front end part of the stack. Then work on the back once you get the front.

I like to see the dog moving out infront of the handler, so the handler isn't interfering with the movement. If you have a dog that wants to surge, then you have to LOL hold them up like you are doing with Ruby and that stops her from being able to get that fluid forward movement. She is bridging because the rearend is still in full extension. I think the German ring is good because the dogs gate out infront of the handler.

For the surging the only thing that I can think of is to work on a lot of direction and speed changes so she starts to pay more attention to you. Also maybe try to let her get out infront of you just a tad, that way your restraint is more back than up. You are actually in the pictures holding up her neck and head which is sorta jamming up the forward movement. If that makes any sense.

Val


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## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

Geez who knew that neck position could make all the difference in the world. In the herding shots, Ruby looks WORLDS better. I really love her head and bone and wish Leo had a better head and thicker bone. But it's good to know that Ruby's topline problem is simply from her neck being held up too high. 

Next time you go into the showring, bring a sheep. They'll let you do that, right?


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## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

lol - I wish. It's been a point of contention between myself and her pretty much since we started showing and herding 

WiscTiger -- thanks so much for the advice







I need to find a place to get some more pictures of her...I think I am going to wait until it is a little longer and her coat comes in a little more, but we'll work on putting the front legs in more....and cutting her nails shorter -- I think that was also a bit of the problem....we've recently been introduced to the grinder which is used in concert with the guillotine (sounds like a torture session? That's because it is)

I think I need to run faster and find a bigger ring 

As far as Leo -- I think he has a long way to go....at first we thought he was maturing out earlier...and then he hit this stage...and I realized we were wrong.

~Cate


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

LOL Cate I feel your pain. I have one and her name is Cheyenne.... I had a trainer tell me once that she wasn't paying attention to me and I said yes she is and I proved my point by doing a right turn and Chey was right with me. She works off my knee instead of looking up at my face and she is a bit to far infront of me. Left had turns are interesting with her, so I just taught her when I turn left she does a cirle and comes back to heel. It is really kinda fun, not so correct in some OB rings. But she will back up really nice, go figure.


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## Ceph (Mar 28, 2007)

Haha - I wish I could actually show the judges...lol....after gaiting her and her looking awful, I can go..."LOOK! Look, there's my handy dandy sheep on the side of the ring, go fetch!"

I wish 

Weeeell -- in retrospect, it is probably better to have a dog that gaits well when working sheep but terribly in the ring, then the other way around....so there is a bright side 

~Cate


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