# Anyone use a "flirt pole" type toy?



## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

I was thinking of buying this toy for BiAnca but I was not sure if it was a good choice? It is similar to a "flirt pole" -- it's a fleece toy on a rope attached to a short pole. 
I'm just wondering if this type of toy might encourage her prey drive too much, and whether or not this would hold up to a German Shepherd...

This is the toy I was thinking of getting:
http://www.cleanrun.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=915&ParentCat=273


----------



## LHunter82FXRS (Oct 20, 2008)

Yes, I have one, but mine is homemade. I have about a 4ft. piece of 1/4inch PVC, and some rope through it with a rag attached at the end. Chico ABSOLUTELY loves it, and gets soooo excited when I get it out. I haven't found that using it encourages too much prey drive, but I supposed it could be possible. I don't really know, this is my first dog, so hence, first time I have ever used one. 
My only recommendation is that not to play too long at first, maybe start with 5 minutes for a couple days, and increase a little bit every few days. That activity can really wear them out, but they, well at least Chico, have a lot of fun!








If you do get it, let me know, I'm interested to see if other GSD's enjoy it as much as Chico.


----------



## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

I have this one: http://chaseitpettoys.com/ I bought it at Clean Run, but I don't see it there now. It's plenty sturdy enough, even for Keefer, who is a big strong boy. He has intense prey drive, and I got it to play off switch games with him, where he learns that giving up the toy and offering a default behavior (sit or down with eye contact) earns a release to play the game some more. So you can use it to control her prey drive by putting it within a rule structure rather than encouraging it unfettered. 

Here's a video of Leslie McDevitt (Control Unleashed) using it in training, along with the "leave it" command: http://www.youtube.com/user/LeslieMcDevitt


----------



## JKlatsky (Apr 21, 2007)

These kind of toys are used frequently by SchH people for puppies to encourage prey drive...Although usually a leather rag on some kind of line and pole, rather than fleece.

They say they use it with lions...so I would imagine it would hold up well enough, but if you're not wanting to encourage prey drive it might not be the toy for you.


----------



## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: Cassidys MomI have this one: http://chaseitpettoys.com/ I bought it at Clean Run, but I don't see it there now. It's plenty sturdy enough, even for Keefer, who is a big strong boy. He has intense prey drive, and I got it to play off switch games with him, where he learns that giving up the toy and offering a default behavior (sit or down with eye contact) earns a release to play the game some more. So you can use it to control her prey drive by putting it within a rule structure rather than encouraging it unfettered.


Oh that is a good idea! Thanks. I need to teach her a leave it. She knows drop it (aus) but not leave it...


----------



## sleachy (Aug 10, 2001)

I have the same one that Cassidy's Mom has from Chaseitpettoys.com. I don't use it with my GSD any more. She just goes at it too hard and she learned quickly to go for the rope or the pole.


----------



## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

Get a lunge whip. Tie or not something to the end. The Barker Sisters would come to the snap of the lunge whip & then we would play for a bit. (probably wont snap with something tied on. They just liked grabbing the snapper that was on the end. You can buy new snappers.


----------



## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I use a buggy whip as the lunge whip has too long a line at the end - a long dressage whip would work too for a pup....most of the equine/pet supply places will have these - as do the Tractor Supply chain stores - easy to make up yourself with a toy or rag (burlap or suede/rough out leather/chamois) 

Lee


----------



## Smithie86 (Jan 9, 2001)

Gabor does not use the pole and only/has always used leather for puppies/young dogs. On his own dogs that he has titled from a puppy to other puppies/young dogs at various clubs here and in Europe, he uses leather in his hands.

When you are teaching a puppy for protection, the puppy needs to learn body contact with the helper.

The toy always moves away from the helper on the flit pole. It is a game of catch, but nothing to do with protection work at all. Same like the ball is thrown away from you as a handler - dog goes away to get the toy.

If the leather is in your hand, the leather moves around the helper and the puppy learns body contact with the helper. More work for the helper, but it is the correct way to teach foundation work.


----------



## Betty (Aug 11, 2002)

I use a pole for young pups at times but then it is no secret then I am not and never will be in Gabor's league! 

Flinks showed me how to do it when Pepper was a pup and I have just continued to use it. We do get a lot of body contact in a session but in all honesty I can not remember if that is something Flinks made a point out of or something I added. It is not used exclusively.

To the original poster, yes it will encourage prey drive! My pet dogs love it also and I can get some exercise in without doing too much of the work myself. Even with dogs that are not going to do protection I like using it because I find training ob with a toy or a tug a lot easier then with food.


----------



## G-burg (Nov 10, 2002)

That's the beauty of dog training, there's more than one way to reach the end goal!


----------



## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

I've known many, many trainers, including very high level ones, who use the pole when starting out with young pups. As Leesa said, there is no *one* correct way. There are many ways that work to reach the end goal.


----------



## Wildtim (Dec 13, 2001)

When starting puppies I like to use a pole. Rather than a lunge, or buggy whip though I like a bamboo pole because it is stiffer and easier to flip around quickly. The pole I use is a half inch in diameter and about 3 to four feet long with a similarly long string out of parachute cord. On the end I tie burlap, I like this better than leather or even Jute because it is very light and easy to flip around. I'm currently using the Chase-it pole with burlap and its working well, but if I hadn't found it on a great sale I could have done my usual set-up cheaper.

Its a great tool for activating prey drive in pups or dogs that are still intimidated by the close presence of a stranger. It allow you to build their drive and targeting without entering their defensive threshold and inciting a negative reaction. Often once a pup, who would be afraid of a helper holding a rag, is engaged on the end of the line and working in drive the helper can reel them in and work closely to the pup without the pup getting fearful. This allows you to build confidence in the pup and soon has the pup taking the rag from your hand. The other thing it does is teach pups to target the rag and hit it while it is still far from your easily punctureable hands, puppy teeth are sharp


----------



## Crookedcreekranch (May 27, 2008)

My puppies love this type of toy. 

I just bought a short horse whip (about 3' long) at the local co-op in town and because it has strings several inches long on the end I can change out the things I attach to chase. Sometimes just an extra leather glove or chamois or something like that. Total cost in it is less than $10.00 and it has held up well with the younger puppies. Super fun and really brings out a lot in a pup you may have otherwise thought did not have a lot of prey drive.

And as Tim Wild stated it saves your hands and fingers from those razor sharp teeth as they target something else.


----------



## Smithie86 (Jan 9, 2001)

Most of the trainers/helpers that I have seen here and in Europe (Holland Germany, Austrai and Belgium) do not use it past the initial, let's see what they do, if they do use it. Let's get them to to chase and grip. Then they transition into the work with a tug or leather with the hands pretty quickly The tug and leather work on a better grip - you feel it and the pup is close.

The pole is good for prey work, catching and chasing. Just like prey work with the ball. But for foundation work for teaching body contact with the helper (critical in protection work), you have to go to the next phase/level.

If the pup is afraid of the helper, then the helper is possibly doing something wrong. What is their stance? How are they approaching the puppy? Gabor usually ends up on the ground, puppy/young dog crawling all over him (and he is 56 ) to work with the dogs. Staying multiple feet away does not help.

And it is a lot of work for the helper.


----------



## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

I don't know if the OP is interested in Schutzhund, she's got an adult GSD and I think she might be considering it for play and exercise.


----------



## Smithie86 (Jan 9, 2001)

For play and exercise, it is great for the puppy/dog.


----------



## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

BiAnca is 4 years old she she's definitely not a puppy! She was started in Schutzhund at her previous home but she "dropped out". I was just wanting to use it for play and exercise. She tried to play with my cats' toy which is feathers attached to a string and a pole, so I thought she might like one of her own... I taught her not to go after the cat toy though because I was afraid she might ruin it and might accidentally run into the cats. If it encourages prey drive though I'm not sure I want to do that, since I have cats and small pets.


----------



## DancingCavy (Feb 19, 2001)

I know people who use flirt poles with their dogs (they make them). The only thing keeping me from using one with Risa is lack of space (no yard). I think they're wonderful!


----------

