# Shepherd Ark Kennels. Any opinions?



## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

We are looking for a reputable breeder for a pet. One we are looking at is Shepherd Ark Kennels. They can be found at Shepherd Ark Kennels - Home.

They have a few litters right now, which makes it look as though they have more than they do. They appear to average 8 litters per year. They also have a program where you can take a female but agree to bring her back for breeding 3-5 times called "Guardian Home Program."

I have never seen that before, and it seems odd. Is this a normal practice that reputable breeders do? Any other opinions on this breeder?

Thanks for any help you can offer.


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

> Lilah & Mavi
> 
> Spring 2019
> 
> ...


There are a lot of off-standard colors being deliberately produced. No one really knows what an 8 week old puppy will grow into, and whether or not s/he will be suitable to breed in the future. 

A co-ownership is one thing, if you have terms that are fair and benefit everyone (including the dog!). But promising to bring a bitch puppy back for "three to five" litters? I would not. YMMV.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

I would pass. There is much off standard stuff going on here beyond color. Also zero mention of hips and elbow testing/rating..


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

Yes, breeders like to have their bitches in homes between litters. It can have advantages such as the home can take a six week vacation if it coincides with welping and not worry about boarding the animal. It can also include (this varies and is uncertain) other vet care, all boarding if you want to go on vacation and feed. It's a bit of a responsibility and uncertainty as the dog isn't yours, You do not control when she is bred, with whom she is bred or how often she is bred. If you are attempting to work the dog at all, it can be very disruptive.


Haven't looked at their website yet. Just did. Found a lot of OFA info including a recently returned bitch with an excellent rating but very funky colors and no consistency in I guess what I'd call "type". Saw no reference to working titles in the bitches that I looked at. So not exactly someone I'd want a pup from.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

I mean they have an HD guarantee of 2 years with money back. But, usually they list the parents as being cleared. It's just...different.


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

Great info all, thanks. It just seemed a little off to me. I think I will pass and keep looking.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

ishootfriendlies said:


> Great info all, thanks. It just seemed a little off to me. I think I will pass and keep looking.


Where are you located and what are you looking to do with your dog? Work? Sport? Pet only? People here can make good recommendations!


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

CometDog said:


> Where are you located and what are you looking to do with your dog? Work? Sport? Pet only? People here can make good recommendations!


We are in New Milford, CT. We could travel up to 5 or six hours for the correct animal. Budget is $1500 or less. We are looking for a pet who can be trained to do some sport, but not competitively.

The problem with buying a dog in CT is many of the breeders in CT or anywhere near NYC or NJ sell their dogs like they have gold-tipped fur. We have many quotes of $5-8K for puppies near us.

I would love any help finding a good dog in a reasonable price range. Thanks for taking an interest.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Working line puppies range from 1800-2500. If you increase your budget a little you can get a very nice dog in that range.

1500 or less is most likely not going to be a reputable breeder.

3k and above are typically show lines

IMO, a pet needs to be able to be a top puppy in temperament. So don't look for one thinking you "only" want a pet. Ask for one with solid nerve and balanced drives and an off switch.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Definitely do yourself a favor and tweak your budget a little North. Then talk to breeders that have a great reputation and tell them what you expect and what your life is like. They will endeavor to give you the right dog or let you know if they do not have or generally produce what you need. There are plenty of decent breeders in a 5 hour circle of the Tristate area. But, definitely plan on that 1800 to 2500 range. With known proven ancestry and health testing and documentation..it is well worth the extra 500 bucks or so. If that is doable, I'm sure you will get people talking about great breeders in your area here.


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

Jax08 said:


> Working line puppies range from 1800-2500. If you increase your budget a little you can get a very nice dog in that range.
> 
> 1500 or less is most likely not going to be a reputable breeder.
> 
> ...





CometDog said:


> Definitely do yourself a favor and tweak your budget a little North. Then talk to breeders that have a great reputation and tell them what you expect and what your life is like. They will endeavor to give you the right dog or let you know if they do not have or generally produce what you need. There are plenty of decent breeders in a 5 hour circle of the Tristate area. But, definitely plan on that 1800 to 2500 range. With known proven ancestry and health testing and documentation..it is well worth the extra 500 bucks or so. If that is doable, I'm sure you will get people talking about great breeders in your area here.


Good advice. I don't mind going up a little. No way I am paying $5k, though. That is about the average for the people around me I have talked to.


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## dojoson41 (Oct 14, 2018)

*off colors*

Help please, but I was always informed that some of those colors are connected to health/genic problems, is it true or is it just color bias and that they can’tbe registered with most if not all dog registries. Thank you


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

ishootfriendlies said:


> Good advice. I don't mind going up a little. No way I am paying $5k, though. That is about the average for the people around me I have talked to.


I have no idea who you talked to..champion showlines maybe? You can get a German Shepherd with a fantastic pedigree for 1800 to 2500. I can't think of any names off the top of my head that may have litters..but others here have mentioned a few in the tristate area.

Don't limit to where you can drive either. I am having a puppy shipped from Houston next week. He has a well established pedigree, extensive health check in his lineage, and he is in the mentioned price range even with shipping (shipping was under 400- United Airlines) Plenty of people especially those who do work or sport have dogs flown in to them. There are also reputable ground transport companies. Again usually under 400. A few days on the road with a reputable transport company wont hurt a pup, and you can live track them to see where they are


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

dojoson41 said:


> Help please, but I was always informed that some of those colors are connected to health/genic problems, is it true or is it just color bias and that they can’tbe registered with most if not all dog registries. Thank you



With AKC registered parents, A pink GSD with blue stripes and orange spots can be registered. It will not do well in the conformation ring. You can compete in obedience and other performance events. You COULD compete in conformation but the dog would not do well unless the standard changed. And the change to the standard is up to the GSD Club of America as I understand it.


I don't know if there is a connection to health issues or not. White horses can be prone to develop skin cancers because they have less UV protection than a dark horse.


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## gsdsteve (Apr 24, 2010)

First you should research the difference between German show lines and working lines. The prices you're talking about must be show line pups! If you want a working line pup I would contact Donna Bonney-Hirten Bray Hugel in Orwell, NY. She has a new litter on the ground!


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## LeoRose (Jan 10, 2013)

Four litters currently on the ground and five more planned doesn't say "small breeder" to me. 

The first time I ever saw anything like the "Guardian Home" scheme was with a well known commercial breeder of Dobermans and Rottweilers in Pennsylvania. You raise the bitch, they breed her to one of their males for X amount of liters (in this case 3-5!), they get all the 
puppies to sell, and until the bitch has produced the required amount of puppies, she is registered in the breeder's name (so you technically don't even own her). Just the mere mention of something like this is enough to make me pass on a breeder.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I know where there is a nice female puppy available in NH


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

dojoson41 said:


> Help please, but I was always informed that some of those colors are connected to health/genic problems, is it true or is it just color bias and that they can’tbe registered with most if not all dog registries. Thank you


There really aren't any issues specifically related to the dilutes and out-of-standard colors in GSDs, no increased risk of deafness, skin issues etc such as you find in many other breeds.
However, you will find an increased risk of issues simply because of poor breeding practices. A good responsible breeder follows the standard and works to improve the breed. In most cases, specifically working to produce "rare" colors involves a lot of breeding for recessive traits that aren't common in the breed. So they aren't going to be worried about over-all health and temperament as much as using whatever dogs they can find that give them "rare" colors.


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## Vonmoyerhaus (Apr 30, 2019)

I as well place in breeding homes and most call them guardian homes. I will place the pup and as long as when the pup is old enough to breed and health testing done as well as being breed quality I will use this dog. Color dogs does not mean bad dog. Health testing done, etc. I have some colors and will breed when that is what families are looking for. Most people just look for companions and love the colors. I also have German import dogs that yes you pay good money for. Even though have great pedigrees you need to find that breeder that would screw you. I have been screwed on a fake paperd dog and he was neutered. Would not breed because I would not lie about a pedigree. I have found one breeder that I have gotten 5 imports for and is one of the few I trust. 

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I personally know Shepherd Ark Kennels and they care for all their dogs and yes they have color and some standard colors. Nothing wrong as she health tests all. If any issues they are not bred. Her Guardian home pups also will not be bred unless they pass all health testing. They are also a state licensed and inspected kennel. So depends what you want and if you don't want color that's your opinion and I respect that. Color dogs are not for everyone. My placed dogs they are placed free and I get the first litter back and they get the sale or a pup from first litter then split litters after. The families are also able to raise the litter if they wish. Everyone runs their guardian homes differently.


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