# Science Diet, good or bad?



## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

My vet recommended I feed my GSD Science Diet Large Breed. It's about the best you can by in the small town I live in. I have to say my GSD and boxer both seem to be doing very well on it. I haven't noticed any health problems with my GSD. I'm just worried that he isn't getting all the nutrition he needs. 

I have thought about mixing a little raw diet with his kibble. I don't want to put him on an all raw diet. I'm not sure about changing anything because he is doing well with what he is eating now. I have thought about chopping up some chicken and adding it each day so he gets more meet, since there is grain in his kibble. Any thoughts? Is he getting everything he needs? Should I just leave well enough alone?


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## mego (Jan 27, 2013)

Not a good food. Has corn etc. If its the best in your area have you considered ordering online? I order from chewy.com. Check out dogfoodadvisor.com for a breakdown on why it's not that great to feed

I would add some raw if you do it properly  Lots of people here are very knowledgeable about it and can help you.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

I also am not a fan of the corn in it. Not all GSDs do poorly with corn, but enough of them do (and develop food allergies) that I wouldn't mess with it again. I've been down the food allergy road with a dog, and it's hard on the dog. 

It's a 2.5 star food according to DFA, and the analysis might be interesting reading for you:
Hill's Science Diet Adult Dog Food | Review and Rating

Personally, I would food order online if that's all you can get. Set up an automatic shipment of a better food to not be limited by your local selection, and you'll never run out. Also, you might find a local feed store willing to special order several bags at a time for you, once a month, of whatever brand you prefer.


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## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

What about changing him over to Diamond? I had planned on starting him on Diamond Natural but my vet assured me Science Diet was better. After looking it up I'm starting to really rethink what my vet said. 


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

I thought I've read on this site, that SD is peddled to vets as a business deal, like big pharma does with doctors.


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## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

Nigel said:


> I thought I've read on this site, that SD is peddled to vets as a business deal, like big pharma does with doctors.


I would believe that. 


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## x11 (Jan 1, 2012)

i think popular with many millitary and police dog units?

not generally considered a premium kibble as far as i can tell.


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## Carriesue (Aug 13, 2012)

I wouldn't feed it and also I wouldn't trust most vets opinion about nutrition. They only have a small course on it in vet school and guess who usually sponsors it, yep Science Diet. I had one vet tell me to take my puppy off Honest Kitchen and put him on Science diet... I just had to smile and nod.

I'm lucky that I have several small specialty stores close to me though I'm getting ready to switch to home made and raw only but if I didn't have access to better food I would just Order online, sometimes you can get better deals that way too.


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## Neko (Dec 13, 2012)

Most vets recommend a food because when they graduate a company offers to pay their student loan if they recommend their product. Yep, sadly it's true.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

OUbrat79 said:


> What about changing him over to Diamond? I had planned on starting him on Diamond Natural but my vet assured me Science Diet was better. After looking it up I'm starting to really rethink what my vet said.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


My 11 year old shepherd was fed Science Diet from the time he was a puppy up until last year, when I switched to Natures Recipe. He did just fine on it. I switched because I wanted a food I could feed all the dogs (vrs. puppy, adult and senior forumulas) and natures recipe had one for all ages... I tried Diamond Natural's mixing in slowly and with two different bags but it just gave everyone the runs. I won't try Diamond again.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

Do you have access to a Costco in the nearest larger town? Diamond makes the Kirkland brand for Costco -- and it's very economical for the quality. I think they introduced a grain-free option last year too.

The regular version: http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/kirkland-signature-dog-food/
The grain-free version: http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/natures-domain-dog-food/


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## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

Is Diamond Natural a good feed? I think the local feed store carries it. 


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## EquusAmor (Apr 2, 2013)

I have a golden retriever, but we got a free bag of science diet when we adopted him and I ended up throwing it out mainly because my dog wouldn't even touch the stuff. Plus he had really bad food allergies and after having him on ol'Roy ( I know it is go awful for them, but it was what I could afford at the time) we switched to blue buffalo and within a week all food allergies were gone. Anyway, sorry for rambling, I would take everyone else's advice and order it online. Save them from developing food allergies because it is not fun when they have it


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## mandiah89 (Jan 18, 2013)

I have yet to run across a vet that did NOT push to feed Science Diet. Every vet I have had told me to switch off of the high quality food I only feed to put them on SD. Sorry but the top three ingredients in SD are Corn and corn meal, there is no nutrients in that, I only feed grain free no wheat/corn/soy and meat has to be the first ingredient. Just like humans dogs cannot digest corn and has no nutrient value.. Diamond is an OK brand I think its better than SD, but if you can afford it I would order food online to get the best quality.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I feed Diamond Naturals, my dogs do very well on it,


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## Okin (Feb 27, 2013)

I have had vets in the past that tried to tell me it was the only conscious food to feed a dog. My current vet doesn't even sell the stuff. I mention different higher end kibbles like Fromm, Innova, Evo, Acana and she knew about all of them, where they were made etc. I went with Fromm Large Breed Puppy for now. She says raw is good but has seen too many puppies were the owner did raw without any real knowledge of how to do it and gave their dogs far to much protein when they were developing.


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

I feed Diamond too. 

If you have a tractor supply you may also have 4Health which is grain free. I feed one dog 4Health Salmon and Potato and the others get Diamond plus I supplement with Kefir and Flax Seed Oil, etc. 

However, Diamond is a reasonable food for a reasonable price, especially when you go through a 150 pounds of food like I do


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## Pooky44 (Feb 10, 2013)

I agree about the vet connection with Science Diet.
You can go online to Chewy.com and order food at a reasonable
price and orders over $50 have free shipping.


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## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

I went out and got Ammo Diamond Naturals Lamb and Rice formula. I wanted to get Extreme Athlete formula but they were out at the time. I will probably change him over to the other formula later. I kind of want to do some more research on that formula anyway. Does anyone on here feed Extreme Athlete?


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

I am feeding Science Diet. I hate it. My pup came to me from a shelter, where he had been eating the Science Diet. He was fighting Demodex and has just finished up Heartworm treatment. My vet did not want me to switch his food, until he was well. I can't wait to switch him. His poo is always soft on the Science Diet. Not only is it not a quality food, it is not cheap either. Hopefully, we can switch over in a few more weeks.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

OUbrat79 said:


> Does anyone on here feed Extreme Athlete?
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I feed Extreme Athlete. I feed it to four different breed dogs. Each one does very well on it. I'm just very careful with the amount I feed. I also feed raw chicken in the morning.


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## TankGrrl66 (Jun 29, 2010)

Science Diet isn't that bad, guys. I'm not crazy about their maint. diets, but heir specialty stuff is alright. 

There is a lot of misinformation out there (and a big grain free bandwagon) regarding dog food. 

You know what the most common food allergen we find at our hospital is? Beef. 2nd is Wheat, 3rd is chicken. So wheat is your super bad guy, not corn. Corn doesn't hold a candle.

We feed some SD at our hospital. There i/d, w/d diets do wonders for soft stool/diarrhea, and their a/d is decent too.

I'm sick of this hatred without the facts bandwagon regarding science diet or anything that dares to have a grain (your kibbles with potato fillers are less digestible btw). I feed this stuff to patients on a daily basis, it isn't THAT bad, chill out!


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## I_LOVE_MY_MIKKO (Oct 4, 2006)

TankGrrl66 said:


> Science Diet isn't that bad, guys. I'm not crazy about their maint. diets, but heir specialty stuff is alright.
> 
> There is a lot of misinformation out there (and a big grain free bandwagon) regarding dog food.
> 
> ...


I am not jumping on a bandwagon, I am perfectly capable of reading ingredients myself. I personally believe the ingredients are disgusting. I had a foster on the k/d, which is especially gross and didn't contain a single ingredient that I would feed. She smelled and her poops were gross and larger than my GSD's, even though she weighed 15 pounds. The person who adopted her cooks her a special kidney diet- how great is that! Knowing what I know now about inflammation, I'll never feed kibble again, but a filler-filled diet like what SD sells is just inflammation in a bag.

OP-where do you buy the SD? What stores are near you?


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## Jordan1017 (May 9, 2013)

I actually used to work for Science Diet as a food rep. and while not a bad food, if you're going to use that, I'd go with Kirklands large breed (Costco,) instead at half the price. It's made by Diamond btw. We actually had a rescue GSD who was a struggle to find a food that gave solid stools. SD left them soft and she had gas all the time, and no real difference on other higher end brands. Kirkland we noticed an improvement pretty quickly. 
As for the corn myth. Yes, not prepared correctly it isn't very nutritional and goes right through them. SD actually puts a lot of care into their food. They have nutritionists working year long on formulas, and their food is made in their own facilities along with facilities where they test their foods in trials. And no, not horrible lab settings. Dogs are taken in, raised with handlers who's jobs are to interact with them, regular vet care etc and kept for their life vs discarded (can't remember if they ever adopt out.) Frankly it would be a dream to work there imo, kinda like a doggy hotel spa. The way they prepare the corn is it is ground up into a flour, cook at a certain temperature for a certain amount of time to make it an excellent source of protein. Meaning you won't see flecks of corn in poo like you would see in grocery store foods. 
Honestly, when it comes to foods, even "healthy" one's may work for some but not others. Just because one does not fit one dog doesn't mean it is necessarily a bad food, just not a match for your pup.


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## Jordan1017 (May 9, 2013)

I should add, ant dissatisfaction with their food you can bring the bag back with receipt, it can be full or 100% empty and get a full refund. If you have issues with the store there is a # on the side of the bag you can call. While it is a business, they do want their costumers to be happy with their food. Meaning they're not just money motivated. Also, their track record is pretty good. They test all batches before they leave the facilities and keep samples.


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## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

I_LOVE_MY_MIKKO said:


> OP-where do you buy the SD? What stores are near you?


I bought it at an Atwoods store. I found better food at a feed store and will be buying his food there from now on. 


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## NormanF (Apr 14, 2013)

Jordan1017 said:


> I actually used to work for Science Diet as a food rep. and while not a bad food, if you're going to use that, I'd go with Kirklands large breed (Costco,) instead at half the price. It's made by Diamond btw. We actually had a rescue GSD who was a struggle to find a food that gave solid stools. SD left them soft and she had gas all the time, and no real difference on other higher end brands. Kirkland we noticed an improvement pretty quickly.
> As for the corn myth. Yes, not prepared correctly it isn't very nutritional and goes right through them. SD actually puts a lot of care into their food. They have nutritionists working year long on formulas, and their food is made in their own facilities along with facilities where they test their foods in trials. And no, not horrible lab settings. Dogs are taken in, raised with handlers who's jobs are to interact with them, regular vet care etc and kept for their life vs discarded (can't remember if they ever adopt out.) Frankly it would be a dream to work there imo, kinda like a doggy hotel spa. The way they prepare the corn is it is ground up into a flour, cook at a certain temperature for a certain amount of time to make it an excellent source of protein. Meaning you won't see flecks of corn in poo like you would see in grocery store foods.
> Honestly, when it comes to foods, even "healthy" one's may work for some but not others. Just because one does not fit one dog doesn't mean it is necessarily a bad food, just not a match for your pup.


If you don't have a Costco nearby, you can just get Diamond's Natural. Its a great value for the money costs less for its 40 lb bag what many other premium dog food manufacturers charge for their 15 lb bags. If you are in luck, Costco's house brand is definitely the way to go when you're on a budget!


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## NormanF (Apr 14, 2013)

OUbrat79 said:


> I went out and got Ammo Diamond Naturals Lamb and Rice formula. I wanted to get Extreme Athlete formula but they were out at the time. I will probably change him over to the other formula later. I kind of want to do some more research on that formula anyway. Does anyone on here feed Extreme Athlete?
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Dogfoodadviser rates Diamond's Extreme Athlete as a five star food. The budget minded would be happy with Diamond Natural, which is rated as a four star food.


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## Carriesue (Aug 13, 2012)

Science diet isn't that bad huh? The Truth About Pet Food: Bad Ingredients - K9 Instinct - Dog Nutritionist and Dog Trainer in Kitchener, Ontario, Canada. K9 Instinct Blog!

Why would I feed it when there are so many other better options. And no I'm not on the grain free bandwagon.


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## NormanF (Apr 14, 2013)

OUbrat79 said:


> Is Diamond Natural a good feed? I think the local feed store carries it.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Every feed store should carry it. Its unbelievable just how much you get for a 40 lb bag and when you do the math that comes out like to $8.50 per week of feeding and you'll still have 20 lbs left over after a month (with a single dog) so its a pretty good value!


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## NormanF (Apr 14, 2013)

Mrs.K said:


> I feed Diamond too.
> 
> If you have a tractor supply you may also have 4Health which is grain free. I feed one dog 4Health Salmon and Potato and the others get Diamond plus I supplement with Kefir and Flax Seed Oil, etc.
> 
> However, Diamond is a reasonable food for a reasonable price, especially when you go through a 150 pounds of food like I do


Diamond is the pet food company that manufactures dog food for most of the premium or house brand labels. Its good for what it is and while not a super premium dog food, its high quality compared to the grocery store or mass store dog food brands. You can feed your dog better food for about the same or less than you can get with cheaper food.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

TankGrrl66 said:


> Science Diet isn't that bad, guys. I'm not crazy about their maint. diets, but heir specialty stuff is alright.
> 
> There is a lot of misinformation out there (and a big grain free bandwagon) regarding dog food.


As I've said before Buddy was on it for many years and he is a healthy 11 yrs. old. I know a lot of people like to bash it, but my dogs did just fine. Only reason I switched is because I wanted one for all ages. I got tired of buying senior for one dog and puppy for another. However the one I switched too keeps raising their prices so I think I'm considering going back. I tried two bags of diamond naturals both bags gave my dogs the runs. 

I'm going to try Authority first though and see what they think of that one. Several people have recommended it.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

TankGrrl66 said:


> Science Diet isn't that bad, guys. I'm not crazy about their maint. diets, but heir specialty stuff is alright.
> 
> There is a lot of misinformation out there (and a big grain free bandwagon) regarding dog food.


Here's the list of ingredients in the SD Adult Dry small breed kibble:



> Chicken Meal, Whole Grain Wheat, Brewers Rice, Whole Grain Sorghum, Soybean Meal, Cracked Pearled Barley, Animal Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Liver Flavor, Soybean Oil, Flaxseed, Lactic Acid, Dried Carrots, Dried Spinach, Dried Grape Pomace, Dried Tomato Pomace, Dried Citrus Pulp, Iodized Salt, Oat Fiber, Choline Chloride, vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of Vitamin C), Niacin Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin Supplement, Folic Acid, Vitamin D3 Supplement), minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), Taurine, Potassium Chloride, Mixed Tocopherols added to retain freshness, Citric Acid added to retain freshness, Phosphoric Acid, Beta-Carotene, Rosemary Extract.


The first ingredient is great - chicken meal. Then it goes down hill.

The next 5 ingredients are some type of starch. You are paying for a food that does NOT have meat as the #1 ingredient by percentage.

Then you have "animal fat". Since it doesn't list the actual animal used it could be ANY animal or animals. Road kill, downed and diseased animals that were rejected from slaughter houses, euthanized animals, etc.

Although I am a raw feeder and I believe it's the best diet for dogs I am not anti-kibble.

I'm anti-CRAPPY kibble and SD (IMO) is one.

Check out this list of ingredients:



> Bison, lamb meal, chicken meal, sweet potatoes, peas, potatoes, canola oil, egg product, roasted bison, roasted venison, natural flavor, tomato pomace, ocean fish meal, potato protein, salt, choline chloride, dried chicory root, tomatoes, blueberries, raspberries, yucca schidigera extract, dried Enterococcus faecium fermentation product, dried Lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried Lactobacillus casei fermentation product, dried Lactobacillus plantarum fermentation product,dried Trichoderma longibrachiatum fermentation extract, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin (vitamin B2), vitamin D supplement, folic acid.


The first THREE ingredients are meat. The next three ingredients are starch. There are three more meat ingredients and one more starch before you get to the little stuff.

You are paying for a food that could be as high as 50% meat by volume.


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## JackandMattie (Feb 4, 2013)

Had my dogs on Science Diet. Couldn't keep any weight on Jack as he was not motivated to eat when he came to foster at eleven months, so I needed something different.

Lots of research later, put all three dogs on prey model raw. Had no idea what we'd been missing. Stools became firm and compact and less frequent, earjunk gone, bad breath gone, appetites normal, itchies gone, teeth cleaner.

Two weeks ago, switched back to kibble because I need to hand feed for training purposes. Chose Wellness CORE (had to drive 45 mins into town, didn't want to wait to order online because of training schedule, best available of the recommended premiums). Poops have softened a little but are still firm enough to scoop easily (though they are about 2-3x as big as the raw poops were). The weim broke out in hives a few days ago...have not determined whether it's related to the change in diet. I think not since it wasn't more immediate. But they all love the Wellness, which surprised me going from raw. For a kibble, I'm impressed.

With the Science Diet, I was Not impressed. Just my personal experience.


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## ugavet2012 (Apr 15, 2010)

Neko said:


> Most vets recommend a food because when they graduate a company offers to pay their student loan if they recommend their product. Yep, sadly it's true.


WHAT????!!! Where in the world did you hear this??? LOLOLOLOL as much as I would LOVE to have someone else pay off my $160,000 in student loans, that's not one of the options. I just graduated vet school last may so I am "up to date" on what goes on, many misconceptions in this thread. Science diet did not "sponsor" my nutrition course, it was not "short', and I actually consider myself fairly well versed in the subject. Vets don't get any more "kickbacks" on selling science diet than they would any other brand out there. Yes they make money off of selling it, LOL how else could you afford to stock And sell it? You think your pet store doesn't make money off the food they sell you? I can get a discount on it for my own pets, but no one else's. 
for the record I do not recommend science diet except for the prescription diets.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I'll also have to ask my vet that above question? Mine pushes Cal Natural, I wonder if they paid off her loans, frankly I think "I" paid off her loans

I'm not a fan of SD , but am using the canned gastro/health right now with Masi, it's working for her and I'm rather grateful that it has.


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## RidgeWalker (Feb 28, 2013)

NormanF said:


> Dogfoodadviser rates Diamond's Extreme Athlete as a five star food. The budget minded would be happy with Diamond Natural, which is rated as a four star food.


I've had my pup on diamond large breed pup before she got sick; as soon as she gets off of the i/d canned stuff I'll put her onto the diamond naturals. Not much more expensive and good food. My older boxer mix is on the diamond senior 8+ and loves it.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Lauri & The Gang said:


> Here's the list of ingredients in the SD Adult Dry small breed kibble:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I get that you think starch is bad, but when the meat ones give your dogs diarrhea and the starch ones don't.... Well you give your dog what works. 

Diamond Naturals Extreme Athlete the 5 star food didn't work. Gave every single one of my dog the runs. So did the Diamond Naturals lamb and rice. I tried mixing, I even tried just giving a little of the Diamond Naturals on top of there regular food. Nothing worked.. Gave them the most horrible stinky farts too. 

I really like Natures Recipe easy to digest formula. Unfortunately they keep raising the price. It went from around $30 a bag to now I'm paying almost $50.00 so I'm trying different foods again seeing what works. Authority is mixing well with the Natures Recipe and the dogs seem to like it so I may keep mixing the two or I may go back to the science diet but it looks like they've raised prices too.


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