# Are bark collars cruel? Help please!



## ASA

I have a 7mo old female German Shepherd. I got her from a well respected breeder at 7 weeks old. Overall she is a fabulous pup - but she has a *horrible* barking issue.

She has been thru puppy training class and Obiedence 1. So again, a good puppy.

She will bark at anything and everything and nothing. Especially thunder and jets flying over (military family here). She barks at the neighbors on the other side of the fence. She barks at things we cant see or hear. She will bark inside and outside. She will bark when exhausted (after walks, runs and play) or any other time of the day. She barks alone. She barks when we are with her. There is no rhyme or reason to her barking. 

We have tried a can with pennies in it. Shed rather play with it. We have tried "no" "quiet". We have tried putting her in her kennel - she just barks more. We try and exhaust her. Still barks. She just loves the sound of herself I guess. But its becoming an issue with neighbors and my husband who has to sleep many times, during the day. She only barks at night if there is thunder. Otherwise, she sleeps fine thru the night.

We have tried everything now - except a bark collar. Ive done so much reading and read reviews from the various products - that im confused. Everyone has an opinion, of course.

If I dont get this under control SOON - my husband will make us get rid of herand this brings tears to my eyes.

My fear is that it will hurt her or scare her. Will it? Are they truly safe?

Im desparate now. I dont want to lose my Asa. I write this while under stress do to this - just had huge fight with my husband about this. After reading here for about 5 months now - I joined for a desparte cry of help!:help:

Thank you in advance.


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## JakodaCD OA

I'm not sure I'd put a bark collar on a 7mth old, but I that's your choice.

I use a bark collar on my male aussie. I kinda pride myself on being a pretty good trainer, but this dog does not shut up He barks at nothing sometimes, most times it's critters, people walking by, people coming to the house. He barks himself into a 'frenzy' and goes into the 'zone' I call it, and then that pushes him into redirected agression usually towards my other aussie..

Nothing worked, I decided to try a bark collar, and ohhhh it works) I got one at Walmart, (not hugely expensive, didn't want to spend alot of money if it didn't work!)

Anyhow, he loves the darn thing, if I get it out, he comes wiggling right up to put it on..(he's a weird dog!),,it has 3 settings..the first is an alert bing, if he doesn't stop within 15 seconds, he gets a low jolt, if he doesn't stop after that, 15 seconds the jolt is a little stronger, and so on for the 3rd time.

I swear when he has it on, he does NOT bark at all, (my husband tried it, and said it's really not a "jolt" more of a little zing to snap him out of it)...in fact, he's calmer with it on, doesn't go into his "zone of no return"..

I do NOT leave it on him unattended, and I would never suggest anyone do so. 
So hey, it works for my aussie anyhow)


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## ASA

Thank you for a quick response.
Im just not sure of it. I dont even know if 7mo is too young or not, so thank you for your opinion.

I really am at a loss and wanted to hear yall's opinions on the collar.

Again thank you.


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## MaggieRoseLee

I think this is also a training issue that would work better with the best method for your dog and situation. TIMING is everything so the dog has to be WITH the adults at all times. 

Barking itself is very satisfying, fun and rewarding. So the more they bark (are able to get away with barking) the more they LOVE to do it and will continue to do it. Be like letting me eat chocolate, learn to love chocolate, and then leave chocolate easily accessed in the house and expect me to not eat it just cause you say so......... (uh, that chocolate is getting eaten!).

Here's some sites with info that may help train away this problem:

Dog Barking,Puppy Barking,Dog Training,Puppy Training

Train Your Dog to Stop Barking

How to Stop Unwanted Barking | Karen Pryor Clickertraining





 
Dog Training - Teaching Your Dog to Stop Barking Video ? 5min.com


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## MaggieRoseLee

You are in good company! If you go to youtube and type in 'dog stop barking' you will get tons of hints!


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## AbbyK9

There are some dogs - like yours, I assume - who just like to bark. They bark when they are excited, annoyed, bored, and lonely. They bark when someone walks by the house, something flies over the house, a squirrel is in the yard. They bark when they want something. They bark when they're just playing by themselves.

If you are there while all the barking happens, then in most cases you can train your dog not to bark. This is a long process that requires a lot of consistency and patience on your part until you get to a reliable "quiet" and your dog understands when it's okay to bark and when it isn't.

Because it's a long road to train a very "bark-ative" dog not to bark, it's sometimes not possible for people to go that route. Folks who have neighbors complaining about their dog's barking, for example. Or if your dog also barks when you are not home to correct her and train her not to bark.

If that's the case, a no bark color is what I would recommend. As a matter of fact, a no bark collar is exactly what I bought for Abby who would bark ONLY in her crate and only when we were away from home. We never heard this dog bark ourselves and it took a long time for her to even offer a bark in play with other dogs. But the neighbors sure heard her when we lived in an apartment in Virginia. 

After trying everything to deal with separation anxiety (which we thought at first was causing all the barking), from exercise to leaving the TV on to giving her things to play with while crated, we went to addressing the barking itself because none of the other stuff made any difference at all.

A no-bark collar is not cruel. There are two types of no-bark collars - the ones that start with a neutral "warning" and then go up through various levels of correction, and the ones where you can set the level yourself. There are also tons of different brands.

If you are going to get one, I would recommend going with a quality brand. I have tried the PetSafe brand ones they sell at Petsmart and that thing was a piece of JUNK. It didn't work at all. I ended up emailing the company and they sent me a tester to see if it worked and also a replacement unit. It still didn't work when Abby barked. We now have a TriTronics Bark Limiter XS and have been very happy with it. Dogtra also makes one called the Yapper Stopper that is also great.


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## ASA

Thanks for the additional responses. I will check out the links/vids provided. Will also further consider the collars recommended.

I really appreciate you taking the time to respond. Will show my husband these responses too.


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## Heidigsd

What about a citronella collar, like this one: Dog Training: Bark Control - AboiStop Citronella Spray Anti-Bark Collar

Michaela


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## bianca

I tried a citronella collar for my old girl (R.I.P) and it worked but only for a few days then she would bark anyway. I then tried an electronic one lent to me by a dog trainer for the police, and she became very aggressive toward my other dog. I should add that she had behavioral issues to start with. So I put a stop to using it straight away.


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## holland

I have used a bark collar on my older dog She loves to bark. It worked and its a better solution than having an angry neighbour and having to get rid of the dog


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## selzer

I think that it is if you think it is. I think that if you approach it with a guilty feeling, you should probably try something else instead. 

I agree that annoyed neighbors could be a bigger issue. 

I personally do not like to put something on my dog's neck that will punish him for something. Have you considered a no-bark zone. This is a sensor that provides a tone if the dog barks that the dog does not like. I have not tried one, but I would think that if done right, it provides negative punishment for a behavior with proper timing and may do ok. 

The barking for thunder storms, etc, may be due to fear and if you punish a dog for a fear reaction, that could increase the fear. I never had a thunder sensitive dog though, so I do not know. 

Again, I think that a lot of training methods depend on how we actually feel about the method. If we think it is cruel, than we can make the whole situation worse by going forward with it and allowing our attitudes and feelings be interpreted by the dog.


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## AliciaMaria

We have to use a bark collar on Sammi when she's in the office with us.. doesnt help to have her barking when potential customers or delivery guys come in.. She knows she has it on, and it totally changes her entire attitude. She doesnt get 'into the zone' because she has a corrective measure that prevents her from going that far..

We use a tritronics on her, and have it set to 3. It works beautifully. I used to be so upset about it, but after having talked to trainers AND behaviorists, and them suggesting using this as well, it has really helped us come to terms with it. She's gotten much better too. Eventually, we'll get a dummy one so she just thinks she has it on.


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## ASA

So an update. Use the citronella collar. It works a tiny bit.
However, Asa is clearly afraid of thunder and we have had storms for a few days straight. Today the storm is bad. Tons of thunder. She has barked for 4 hours straight. Nothing helps. Nothing. I have spent that 4 hrs doing research and asking people how to make her stop. Not one thing is working. I made an emergency appt with the Vet to see if she needs anxiety meds.

 If this doesnt work - my husband said we have to get rid of her. Nothing will stop her barking. And the thunder is making it worse. I would think after 4 hrs of barking she would be tired. But she is relentless. Im waiting for cops or someone to show up at the door - because Im sure its annoying to everyone.

Thanks for all the responses.


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## Castlemaid

I do think that in your case a regular (shock) bark-collar is worth trying. I've never heard of the spray-type collars being all that effective for hard-core barkers like your pup. I've never used one (bark collar), but I have friends who do, and they work very well. The surprise is that instead of stressing out their dogs (because they get shocked each time they bark), it actually calms them because it stops them from working themselves into a barking frenzy in the first place. It went so far that just having the collar on them, not even turned on, had a calming effect on their dogs. 

AbbyK9 above gave some good advice, and some good insights. I think that between having to get rid of you puppy, and putting a bark collar on that can _teach_ her to stay calm, the bark collar is the better option of the two, and will allow you to keep her and work with her to teach her coping skills for anxiety propducing stimuli, like loud noises.

At this point, I would not discount meds either. Some will help you reach her, and again, use training and behaviour modification to change her habits. The way you describe her behaviour though, it is possible that she has an anxiety disorder, at which meds and a bark collar should not be anything to feel guilty about, but simply tools to help her adjust to this big scary world. 

Don't get the cheap bark collars from the petshops - they are highly unreliable - look at the Tritonic that AbbyK9 mentioned, or the Dogtra brand. You might find those in sporting good stores (where they sell gear for hunting dogs), or on-line. 

Don't give up yet!!! Give it a try, and good luck!


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## AliciaMaria

Agreed.. you havent tried the tritronics yet! Remember, it needs to fit snuggly too in order for it to work. Dont give up on her.. it's a characteristic of the breed! If you havent tried all the options then youre giving up.  What will you do if you have to get rid of her?? Out of curiosity..


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## Elaine

I have never heard of the citronella collars being actually effective. Before I put a collar on a dog like yours, I would be seriously upping her exercise. Bored dogs bark and bark and bark. If that doesn't work, then I would put a shock barking collar on; one that works from throat vibration as the ones that work from sound can go off from other things. You might want to consider medicating and crating her during thunderstorms.

I have used the shock kind in the past for my previous dogs that liked to bark at the neighbors when I had them in the yard and I have never been so happy to see them get corrected and silence begin. I had tried everything and it got to the point where I couldn't let them out for even a few minutes before the barking started. It was a good thing.


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## AbbyK9

As far as anxiety with the thunder storms goes, have you tried the DAP (dog appeasing pheromone) diffuser to help calm her? I would try that before going to anxiety meds.


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## selzer

I have heard that there is a body wrap you can use to calm the anxiety for thunderstorms. Also meds. I have no experience though.


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## ASA

I wanted to give a brief update since yall were nice enough to respond to my thread 

I took Asa to the vet and they prescribed her anti-anxiety meds (25mg of Amitriptyline). The vet said to hold off on the collar for now - and use that as a last resort.

The meds seem to be helping. She barks now and then (for a reason), but it is not excessive and not barking at "nothing" and will stop when we tell her too. Obviously, I didnt want her to stop barking all together.

The meds have not affected her personality, so that is good. I was a bit worried about that.

The real test will be the next storm that rolls in. Im hoping the meds will help her get thru that. I will update again - after we get another storm. I hope it is with good news.

Thanks again for all the suggestions!!
Here are a couple of pics of her from today


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## Sri

Have you tried essential oils? Lavender oil is very calming to my dog. There is also Rescue Remedy that helps I beleive.


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## Chip18

Thundershirts someone on here was going to try one a few weeks ago. Don't know if they tried it but heres some info:
Severe Dog Anxiety and Stress Burdens Dogs Affected by Recent Tornadoes, Severe Storm Systems


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