# My dog is going to kill the cats



## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

I am sure of this now. I am in tears over the situation that just occurred. I don't know what to do anymore, I feel like an absolute failure as a dog owner. I did everything right with introductions, and they never got along...doesnt help that my cats are complete idiots either. Ever since Berlin got scratched in the eye, he's been out for BLOOD. I have baby gates up, the cats have a 'safe haven' etc, I keep Berlin by me when he is upstairs, BUT these incidents still occur, because he literally is a psychopath when he sees/smells/knows where the cats are. They hide under the couch, and he frantically digs at the couch, whines, goes and checks all their spots that they might be in, he literally looks crazy. 

Well tonight, I walk upstairs, and one of the cats must have been in the kitchen hiding....Berlin was right by me, and literally in a SPLIT SECOND he is gone, into the frontroom and has chased (and apparently cornered the cat). Well, THIS time he got the cat, and really good, I had to pry the cat from his jaws, and smack berlin on the snout to stun him so he would release the cat (I feel like a monster .....) Well I get the cat, and go to take it upstairs to the gated off area, and the OTHER cat goes running out of the room and jumps OVER the gate and literally INTO the jaws of my dog. WHAT is their problems?!! He got her, but she escaped and ran to under the couch. This all happened in about 2 minutes. 

He knows THIS behavior is NOT acceptable. I seriously am at my wits end, I have tried the prong, tried to desensitize, everything, NOTHING works....

And I know tonight was my fault ultimately, for not tethering the dog to me, even though I had only planned to go upstairs for a minute....the cats never come down until we go to sleep. Even if I tether him to me, he will pull me down to chase these cats. After witnessing his behavior toward them tonight, I know he is not trying to play anymore, he wants to kill them. 

Ultimately, this cannot go on like this anymore, I cannot tether an adult GSD to me forever whenever I want to go do anything in the house. I also cannot lock him in his crate and keep him away from everyone. I can't control the cats, and confine them to one room (my mothers bedroom) because their food is in the kitchen (although they do eat at night) and their litterbox is downstairs as well. They come and go as they please, but Berlin is relentless in his attempts to get them. 

I am seriously afraid I am going to have to re-home him, as my mother WILL not give the cats up. 

Any advice, is truly appreciated.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

Doesn't your breeder require the dog back there??


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

I would look into getting an electronic collar and training on how to use it.

This type of situation is a very good use for those collars.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

msvette2u said:


> Doesn't your breeder require the dog back there??


Yes, by re-home thats what I meant. He would go back to her. I really really really do not want that to be the case though. 



Lauri & The Gang said:


> I would look into getting an electronic collar and training on how to use it.
> 
> This type of situation is a very good use for those collars.


Does he wear an e-collar all the time in the house..? Does it have any adverse effects on his behavior?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Look up Lou Castle's site and find his page on "Crittering".


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## harmony (May 30, 2002)

Sometimes we have problems because we let things happen in the first place right. It can be fixed and a dog can take down a cat. Can you get a trainer to help you?


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

Jax08 said:


> Look up Lou Castle's site and find his page on "Crittering".


Great article, thanks. Very informative about what I need to do.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

The trainer that my dog works with does not like any use of prong/ecollars. She had me try the leave it command/desensitizing etc. It hasnt been working because I cant tell WHEN he smells or sees a cat, so I cant snap him out of it before he gets to such an intense level.


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## zivagirl (Jan 5, 2013)

gsdlover91 said:


> The trainer that my dog works with does not like any use of prong/ecollars. She had me try the leave it command/desensitizing etc. It hasnt been working because I cant tell WHEN he smells or sees a cat, so I cant snap him out of it before he gets to such an intense level.


Beth has a tell. She perks her ears so far forward, she wrinkles around her eyes.


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## harmony (May 30, 2002)

what about body language, you don't have to do much to see that part. stop it, protect and serve


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## harmony (May 30, 2002)

And only one uses what works on their dog for their attention (focus), no more then that okay


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Until you can train him to leave the cats alone you absolutely need to keep him tethered to you at all times and keep him crated at least a couple of hours every single day while you are home so that the poor cats can spend time with your family without fearing for their lives.


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## angryrainbow (Jul 1, 2012)

Wow. You feel bad for smacking your dog when it got your cat? I have 4 dogs and 4 cats, if any of them looked at the cats the wrong way they would be GONE. Nope. Nuh-uh. Not allowing it.

We might be lucky cause we have streetwise cats-- dont run when the dogs approach them and stand their ground.

Get a muzzle on your dog before anything else can happen. Muzzle isn't permanent, only until you can get him trained. Have him on a leash at all times, and have something to redirect him to (bullystick, toy, bone).

Right now he is in a habit of looking for the cats and checking these spots, you need to break this habit. He goes to look for the cats? Grab that leash and make him do puppy push ups (sit down sit down sit down). He isn't listening? I don't know. I'm not into punishment but this isn't something you can mess around with because you're dealing with another animals life. A quick correction with a prong might be enough to grab his focus for a second, and then you'll have to work from there.

Please get a handle on this quickly.


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## Shep's_Shepherd (Jan 18, 2012)

Lauri & The Gang said:


> I would look into getting an electronic collar and training on how to use it.
> 
> This type of situation is a very good use for those collars.


Agreed. I looked into doing this to, but at the moment my dog is slowly learning to let the cats be, and he doesn't quite have the intensity and bad intentions as the OP's dog. 

I suggest finding a new trainer, one that specializes and experienced in e-collar training. Prong and e-collars are nothing more than tools. When used properly, with the right training, they can be very effective. In the same way a hammer isn't the right tool for every job, it seems narrow minded to say that because hammers have been used incorrectly and can cause damage that you'll never use a hammer. IMO, e-collars aren't the right tool for every situation, but if left with the alternative of giving up my dog or having it kill one of the cats, it's definitely a tool I'd consider utilizing before choosing the alternatives. JMO


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## RebelGSD (Mar 20, 2008)

I had a few fosters that developed a taste for kitties after some time. Luckily we have a trainer who fixes it with the e-collar in no time. All families were very happy with the outcome.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I hope you can break this.....sometimes this behavior is fixable...but sometimes it is not....I have had one dog whose obsession with cats could not be broken...I did not want to constantly physically punish him, and I could not allow the behavior to continue, so he went to a home with no cats....

I have other dogs who are fine with cats...I got a Bengal kitten in December and she is not mine, she decided that Csabre is her best friend...  


Good luck...if you cannot break this obsession, do not let anyone make you feel guilty about it....sometimes it just is what it is!


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## VanBuren shepherds (Dec 3, 2012)

I use an e-collar that gives an audible sound when my dogs go after the neighbors cats.
It distracts them just enough to where their focus is back on me. 
If that doesn't work (which it works 99% of the time) the e-collar also has two settings for different intensities. 
Making sure the settings are correct are very important. It needs to be set high enough to distract the dog from the heat of the moment, but not high enough to get a jerk reaction out of the dog.
I agree with Michael Ellis. Test the collar on your self before you try it on the dog. Hold it in your hand and press the buttons. After this you should have more respect for the e-collar and not reaching to push the button every-time the dog barks.
When used properly e-collars are one of the best tools available for dog trainers.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

We have 4 cats and 3 dogs. Our husky has high prey drive and has nearly killed 2 of our cats. If he could get to them, he would kill all 4. We have a 2-story house, so the dogs live downstairs with access to the outside, and the cats live upstairs exclusively. So both the dogs and cats have an entire floor to themselves. It's plenty of room. The cat's food and litter boxes are upstairs with them, so they have no reason to EVER come downstairs. They also know that Paw Paw is waiting to eat them, so they're smart enough to stay upstairs. All we have up to separate them are baby gates that the dogs don't knock down or jump over, even though they could if they wanted to. Only by accident has Paw Paw gotten to the cats, and that was because our children accidentally let him upstairs and my wife or I were on him in a heartbeat. We also have a door we can close at the bottom of the stairway landing. Not sure if you have the same option, but no cat or dog can get through a closed, secured door. Haha!

I honestly don't think you can train prey drive out of a dog, but I'm no expert. It seems like a natural instinct that's there for a reason. Not sure if your dog has prey drive like my Paw Paw. He'll catch birds out of the sky. He's fast and intense! I've never seen a dog like him. But we keep him under control, because we love our cats (almost) as much as we love our dogs. Haha!

Good luck. And I'm there with you about idiotic cats. When we had the big wire dog crate still out for overnight sleeping/training for our pup Beowulf, our rescued feral cat somehow was running from the dogs and ran into the crate's open door and got herself trapped inside with all 3 dogs attacking her. They must've gotten 30+ bites on her before I could wrestle them all out and save her. Luckily for her this time, there was not a scratch and she was fine. Whew! I'm definitely a dog lover, and these cats have a soft spot in my heart, but I'd be OK with just dogs and no cats. My wife would disagree, thus a compromise is in place.


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## Jag (Jul 27, 2012)

Can the cats just live in your mom's room? Can you move out?


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## Carriesue (Aug 13, 2012)

I'm really sorry, I hope that this can be worked out... It would so not be fair for you to lose two dogs in less then a year. 

I don't have any useful advice, Ollie is similar with my cats and small dogs except his seems to be an intense herding drive, no aggression so far.

What I've been doing so far is keeping him on lead... Letting him chase just keeps rewarding the behavior which means he will keep doing it. 

Maybe look into a private trainer who could come and observe and give their take? I know how devastating this sort of thing is. My golden has bitten all of my dogs and just recently snapped at one of my cats.

Do you do NILIF with Berlin?


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

This is going to be unpopular: The cats were there first. The dog will kill them if he gets a chance. If he were mine: The dog goes back to the breeder unless you want to live with a segregated household - and that doesn't sound like fun.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

before rehoming the dog contain the cats. put
the cats, food and water bowls, litter box and toys
behind behind closed doors. you have to make sure
the dog doesn't tear the door down or force it open.


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## Jag (Jul 27, 2012)

middleofnowhere said:


> This is going to be unpopular: The cats were there first. The dog will kill them if he gets a chance. If he were mine: The dog goes back to the breeder unless you want to live with a segregated household - and that doesn't sound like fun.


It's unpopular for a few reasons. One- the cats aren't hers. Two- do you remember what this poor young woman has gone through to date? Three- it's a dog forum, a GSD forum. I'd re-home the cats if they were mine. I realize she can't do that. We kept my cat on another floor protected by a baby gate on the stairs until my GSD was older. The cat learned, the dog learned. It took time. However, this guy may not be able to 'grow out of' what he's doing since he's so serious about it. So then, I'd put the cats in mom's bedroom with all their stuff. Keep the pup. Problem solved. Then again, I'd also be looking to move out with my pup.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Jag said:


> Can the cats just live in your mom's room? Can you move out?


Mom's house? Mom's cats? I don't think that one will fly. It wouldn't with me. It is the dog that is going to need to live in the OP's room.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

Jag said:


> It's unpopular for a few reasons. One- the cats aren't hers. Two- do you remember what this poor young woman has gone through to date? Three- it's a dog forum, a GSD forum. I'd re-home the cats if they were mine. I realize she can't do that. We kept my cat on another floor protected by a baby gate on the stairs until my GSD was older. The cat learned, the dog learned. It took time. However, this guy may not be able to 'grow out of' what he's doing since he's so serious about it. So then, I'd put the cats in mom's bedroom with all their stuff. Keep the pup. Problem solved. Then again, I'd also be looking to move out with my pup.


Thanks for this. Honestly, its hard to rehome either, I love them all. The cats are kept on another floor and are protected by a baby gate. Actually, I have 3 floors in this house, and there is a baby gate blocking each floor. The dog stays with me a majority of the time IN my room, or out and about with me as it is. I am hoping when he is older that this may become easier to manage. And as you have said "THE CAT LEARNED". The cats need to learn, but they are NOT. Last night, the cat had an escape route to his safe haven upstairs, and could have avoided being grabbed by Berlin, but the cat went and ran into a corner in the living room. Its just so frustrating...I have moved all the cats things to the third floor, including their food, water, and litterbox. I hope this STOPS any further accidents and helps me get ahold on this situation. 





middleofnowhere said:


> This is going to be unpopular: The cats were there first. The dog will kill them if he gets a chance. If he were mine: The dog goes back to the breeder unless you want to live with a segregated household - and that doesn't sound like fun.


I stated in my OP that he could potentially kill them, so I already know this.. and I also stated that I really dont want to give my dog back. I dont want a segregated house either, but I am going to at least try my hardest to make this work before I just give up my dog. I came on here to ask for advice about what to do about this situation to AVOID giving up my dog, so your post is pointless, as it offers zero advice except to GIVE UP my dog. 



Carriesue said:


> I'm really sorry, I hope that this can be worked out... It would so not be fair for you to lose two dogs in less then a year.
> 
> I don't have any useful advice, Ollie is similar with my cats and small dogs except his seems to be an intense herding drive, no aggression so far.
> 
> ...


Thank you Carrie. I cannot even fathom the thought of losing my dog. The first time was hard enough.  He is my life. I do use NILIF with Berlin. 



Jag said:


> Can the cats just live in your mom's room? Can you move out?


Moving out would be the ideal fix, but it is not possible right now, or anytime soon (maybe in about 2 years). I'm a college student and cannot afford to live on my own. 



counter said:


> We have 4 cats and 3 dogs. Our husky has high prey drive and has nearly killed 2 of our cats. If he could get to them, he would kill all 4. We have a 2-story house, so the dogs live downstairs with access to the outside, and the cats live upstairs exclusively. So both the dogs and cats have an entire floor to themselves. It's plenty of room. The cat's food and litter boxes are upstairs with them, so they have no reason to EVER come downstairs. They also know that Paw Paw is waiting to eat them, so they're smart enough to stay upstairs. All we have up to separate them are baby gates that the dogs don't knock down or jump over, even though they could if they wanted to. Only by accident has Paw Paw gotten to the cats, and that was because our children accidentally let him upstairs and my wife or I were on him in a heartbeat. We also have a door we can close at the bottom of the stairway landing. Not sure if you have the same option, but no cat or dog can get through a closed, secured door. Haha!
> 
> I honestly don't think you can train prey drive out of a dog, but I'm no expert. It seems like a natural instinct that's there for a reason. Not sure if your dog has prey drive like my Paw Paw. He'll catch birds out of the sky. He's fast and intense! I've never seen a dog like him. But we keep him under control, because we love our cats (almost) as much as we love our dogs. Haha!
> 
> Good luck. And I'm there with you about idiotic cats. When we had the big wire dog crate still out for overnight sleeping/training for our pup Beowulf, our rescued feral cat somehow was running from the dogs and ran into the crate's open door and got herself trapped inside with all 3 dogs attacking her. They must've gotten 30+ bites on her before I could wrestle them all out and save her. Luckily for her this time, there was not a scratch and she was fine. Whew! I'm definitely a dog lover, and these cats have a soft spot in my heart, but I'd be OK with just dogs and no cats. My wife would disagree, thus a compromise is in place.


Haha, thanks for sharing your story about PawPaw. I basically am doing what you have done, and hoping the cats have ZERO reason to leave their safe haven, except for in the evening to come downstairs when they KNOW berlin is locked in my room with me sleeping. 



VanBuren shepherds said:


> I use an e-collar that gives an audible sound when my dogs go after the neighbors cats.
> It distracts them just enough to where their focus is back on me.
> If that doesn't work (which it works 99% of the time) the e-collar also has two settings for different intensities.
> Making sure the settings are correct are very important. It needs to be set high enough to distract the dog from the heat of the moment, but not high enough to get a jerk reaction out of the dog.
> ...


What e-collar do you have? Brand/type/model etc. 



angryrainbow said:


> Wow. You feel bad for smacking your dog when it got your cat? I have 4 dogs and 4 cats, if any of them looked at the cats the wrong way they would be GONE. Nope. Nuh-uh. Not allowing it.
> 
> We might be lucky cause we have streetwise cats-- dont run when the dogs approach them and stand their ground.
> 
> ...


Yes, I feel bad for smacking my dog even though he had the cat in his mouth, because hitting an animal is not okay to me. He wouldnt even look at me afterward, I would NEVER want to do anything to ever ruin our bond. On the other hand, I need to get a handle on this situation and make sure this NEVER happens again. I have been working on his focus on me, and its been improving. He will not be able to "look" for them anymore, he will be strictly focusing on me from now on. 



BowWowMeow said:


> Until you can train him to leave the cats alone you absolutely need to keep him tethered to you at all times and keep him crated at least a couple of hours every single day while you are home so that the poor cats can spend time with your family without fearing for their lives.


My mother works overnights, so she is always up at night. The cats spend time with her at night when me and Berlin go into my room. PLease dont think they are shunned to a room and get no attention. I also go and spend time with them every day as well. 


Also, please remember my dog is only 7 months old. He is a puppy still, and is in going through the phase I have been warned about..Not sure if it has ANYTHING to do with the situation, but he is still young, and he was attacked by the female cat a few weeks ago. 

Well, I am going to try and work more diligently with the prong/desensitizing methods, and having Berlin focus on me while the cats are around, before I try an e-collar. I have moved all the cats stuff upstairs, to reduce any chances of them coming into contact with each other when the situation isnt controlled. This morning, I had the prong on Berlin, and grabbed some bits of hotdog, and walked in the cat room. The cats were under the bed, and I called Berlin to me. He knows he isnt allowed in there uninvited, so he hesitated. He came to me though, I commanded him to sit in front of me, and he did, and asked for a watch me. He focused on ME despite the fact the cat was literally two feet away. I did another watch me, and walked out of the room and he followed. So, I do believe there is SOME HOPE for this situation, because he did IGNORE the cat and focused on me. He will be wearing the prong any time he is not in my room. That way, he can get corrected for this behavior immediately if anything occurs. I am going to work really hard and diligently on desensitizing them to each other, and I know I have a LONG road ahead of me. But ultimately, I would hate to give either of them up. So for now, they will be COMPLETELY separated, unless I bring them together in a controlled situation, and I will work from there. If all else fails, I will try an e-collar and a trainer at my house, as a last resort. This is extremely stressful to me, as an animal lover. I was in tears last night, because of the situation, because of the poor cats, because I smacked my dog, because I would be DEVASTATED if I had to give up my dog. I have tried so hard to make this work, but I need to try harder, and I need to have the OTHER people in this household follow the same rules because lapses in consistency when I am not home is where the problems arise from. Thanks so much for the advice.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

How do I find a trainer that could come to my house to help me work on this situation (AND teach my MOTHER HOW TO HANDLE IT?) My mother wont listen to me, and is frustrating me so MUCH!


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## Jag (Jul 27, 2012)

In my limited experience with dogs and cats, the exercise you did with Berlin seems to say that you can overcome this. He's not into an uncontrollable "KILL" mindset if he can focus on you with them there. I don't know how to find a trainer that will come to your home to work on it. As far as you mom goes.. don't even get me started.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

gsdlover91 said:


> How do I find a trainer that could come to my house to help me work on this situation (AND teach my MOTHER HOW TO HANDLE IT?) My mother wont listen to me, and is frustrating me so MUCH!


First off it is your mothers house and your mothers cats. She doesn't have to listen to you, you have to listen to her. Are you really listening to her? I know if my kids came back home and started to tell me how to run my house they would soon be looking for a new place to live.


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## Jag (Jul 27, 2012)

shepherdmom said:


> First off it is your mothers house and your mothers cats. She doesn't have to listen to you, you have to listen to her. Are you really listening to her? I know if my kids came back home and started to tell me how to run my house they would soon be looking for a new place to live.


I think both need to listen to each other. Mom allowed Berlin in the home. Daughter is trying to work things out so everyone can live in peace. That may mean mom needs to be on board, too, so that Berlin's training is consistent. I'm a parent, too... but when your kids are adults living with you everyone needs to have open communication and listen to each other. Especially in a situation like this. JMO


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## angryrainbow (Jul 1, 2012)

if your dog is able to focus on you in the presence of a cat then you are LUCKY and this will most likely be able to be worked through! congrats.
in the opening post it felt like every time he smelled a cat he went nutso, but i can see that isn't the case. my friend has a gsd that if he even smells cat, will start foaming at the mouth, whining, panting, pulling her down the street. it is horrible cause we live in the country and there are a ton of barn / stray cats, so he is constantly in this high level of stress.


when working with the prong and the cats, make sure you correct him for not listening to you "watch me", "sit", etc. and not for looking at the cats, or he will associate them with punishment and then he will really be out for blood.

i dont really know about how to get your parents to listen. mine never have lol. i told mine they either listen or don't bother the dogs.

edit:
ALSO reward for any avoidance / calming behaviors. if on his own he looks at a cat and then looks away (even if it isnt at you) jackpot him


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## Blitzkrieg1 (Jul 31, 2012)

gsdlover91 said:


> I am sure of this now. I am in tears over the situation that just occurred. I don't know what to do anymore, I feel like an absolute failure as a dog owner. I did everything right with introductions, and they never got along...doesnt help that my cats are complete idiots either. Ever since Berlin got scratched in the eye, he's been out for BLOOD. I have baby gates up, the cats have a 'safe haven' etc, I keep Berlin by me when he is upstairs, BUT these incidents still occur, because he literally is a psychopath when he sees/smells/knows where the cats are. They hide under the couch, and he frantically digs at the couch, whines, goes and checks all their spots that they might be in, he literally looks crazy.
> 
> Well tonight, I walk upstairs, and one of the cats must have been in the kitchen hiding....Berlin was right by me, and literally in a SPLIT SECOND he is gone, into the frontroom and has chased (and apparently cornered the cat). Well, THIS time he got the cat, and really good, I had to pry the cat from his jaws, and smack berlin on the snout to stun him so he would release the cat (I feel like a monster .....) Well I get the cat, and go to take it upstairs to the gated off area, and the OTHER cat goes running out of the room and jumps OVER the gate and literally INTO the jaws of my dog. WHAT is their problems?!! He got her, but she escaped and ran to under the couch. This all happened in about 2 minutes.
> 
> ...


 
Easy fix put on an E Collar (collar condition him first) and go to continuous Stim on high if he even starts to go after a cat. It starts with the stare and progresses from there. I would put a cat in a carrier put it in the middle of the floor any time he tries to get at the cat stim. Lots of people are going to disagree with me (not that I care) but lives are at stake here like you said.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

Blitzkrieg1 said:


> Easy fix put on an E Collar (collar condition him first) and go to continuous Stim on high if he even starts to go after a cat. It starts with the stare and progresses from there. I would put a cat in a carrier put it in the middle of the floor any time he tries to get at the cat stim. Lots of people are going to disagree with me (not that I care) but lives are at stake here like you said.


Blitzkrieg, can I do this same method with the prong? I was planning on doing that, putting the cat (one at a time) in their carrier, and setting it FAR away from him, putting him on a leash/prong, and work with him FAR away at first, getting him to do commands for me etc, and gradually move closer (by gradually I mean days/weeks). If he would not focus on me and listen to me, he'd get corrected. 



angryrainbow said:


> if your dog is able to focus on you in the presence of a cat then you are LUCKY and this will most likely be able to be worked through! congrats.
> in the opening post it felt like every time he smelled a cat he went nutso, but i can see that isn't the case. my friend has a gsd that if he even smells cat, will start foaming at the mouth, whining, panting, pulling her down the street. it is horrible cause we live in the country and there are a ton of barn / stray cats, so he is constantly in this high level of stress.
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for this advice. Im very happy to hear I can most likely work through this with him!  Well, he does go nutzo if no one is there to work with him like I was doing earlier. Sometimes if a cat is under the couch, and he comes upstairs, he will go crazy trying to get it. I cannot let him get to that point anymore. Glad he isnt as bad as your friends GSD. phew! And thanks, dont want him to associate the kitties with bad things, only GOOD things like GOOD treats and LOTS of praise. Thats why when I work on desensitizing, and the kitties are in my room while he is crated, he gets LOT of treats and praise when he is a good boy. 



Jag said:


> I think both need to listen to each other. Mom allowed Berlin in the home. Daughter is trying to work things out so everyone can live in peace. That may mean mom needs to be on board, too, so that Berlin's training is consistent. I'm a parent, too... but when your kids are adults living with you everyone needs to have open communication and listen to each other. Especially in a situation like this. JMO





shepherdmom said:


> First off it is your mothers house and your mothers cats. She doesn't have to listen to you, you have to listen to her. Are you really listening to her? I know if my kids came back home and started to tell me how to run my house they would soon be looking for a new place to live.


Words of wisdom Jag! Shepherdmom, it is my mothers house, and her cats (but I care for them so technically they are also mine...) but if she cares for the well being of the cats, and the dog (whom she LOVES) she has to help me out. When I am at work/school, she is the primary caretaker of my dog. If i set up certain limitations/rules for him, she needs to follow them so there are NO lapses in consistency. If he is going good for a month, and then one day ACCIDENTALLY is able to chase a kitty, everything is back to square one, as I have learned. I respect my mother very much, and listen to her, but for the sake of OUR animals, we have to listen to each other and help each other out to make this work! Jag, what you said is 100% what I meant, and what needs to happen. My mother loves Berlin, and would NOT want me to give him up, so we just need to work on this together. 



Jag said:


> In my limited experience with dogs and cats, the exercise you did with Berlin seems to say that you can overcome this. He's not into an uncontrollable "KILL" mindset if he can focus on you with them there. I don't know how to find a trainer that will come to your home to work on it. As far as you mom goes.. don't even get me started.


I am so happy to hear this.  I was so happy to see that the work with watch me I have been doing has really been paying off. I did this exercise again, and this time the kitty was OUT, on the cat tree...Berlin looked at him, knew he was there, but listened to my commands of come, sit, WATCH (and watched me for 10 seconds). I did about 3 repetitions of watch and then told him to come with me and we left. No uncontrollable behavior. Nothing. I am just going to practice this exercise as much as I can, and have him focus on me for longer periods of time, and as they get more comfortable, hopefully the cats will eventually walk past him etc.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Jag said:


> I think both need to listen to each other. Mom allowed Berlin in the home. Daughter is trying to work things out so everyone can live in peace. That may mean mom needs to be on board, too, so that Berlin's training is consistent. I'm a parent, too... but when your kids are adults living with you everyone needs to have open communication and listen to each other. Especially in a situation like this. JMO


If my kids needed to come home, then of course I would be willing to take them in but I would expect them to train, raise, vet and keep control of any animals they bring with them. If op's mom had wanted a puppy, she would have gotten one, obviously she didn't. It is not fair for adult children to come home and then expect mom to follow directions on training a dog she didn't want in the first place. Mom has opened her home so daughter has a place to live now daughter has to do her very best to avoid disrupting mom's life and to not put the lives of her mom's cats at risk. It is simple common courtesy.


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## Blitzkrieg1 (Jul 31, 2012)

gsdlover91 said:


> Blitzkrieg, can I do this same method with the prong? I was planning on doing that, putting the cat (one at a time) in their carrier, and setting it FAR away from him, putting him on a leash/prong, and work with him FAR away at first, getting him to do commands for me etc, and gradually move closer (by gradually I mean days/weeks). If he would not focus on me and listen to me, he'd get corrected.
> 
> 
> Thank you for this advice. Im very happy to hear I can most likely work through this with him!  Well, he does go nutzo if no one is there to work with him like I was doing earlier. Sometimes if a cat is under the couch, and he comes upstairs, he will go crazy trying to get it. I cannot let him get to that point anymore. Glad he isnt as bad as your friends GSD. phew! And thanks, dont want him to associate the kitties with bad things, only GOOD things like GOOD treats and LOTS of praise. Thats why when I work on desensitizing, and the kitties are in my room while he is crated, he gets LOT of treats and praise when he is a good boy.
> ...


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

gsdlover91 said:


> Shepherdmom, it is my mothers house, and her cats (but I care for them so technically they are also mine...) but if she cares for the well being of the cats, and the dog (whom she LOVES) she has to help me out. When I am at work/school, she is the primary caretaker of my dog.


Well all I can say is this would not happen at my house.  I wouldn't agree to be caretaker while you are at work/school I flat wouldn't have the time. I have my own work and my own school and my own animals to care for. My kids could come home but they would have to find their own pet sitters or do it themselves.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

I would think that a pro trainer (a good one!) should be able to convince a 7mo puppy that he cannot even look at your cats!


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Do you want /need to train him to leave them alone while you are with him OR the much more difficult job of training him to leave them alone while he is home with them without you there? (Not advised!)


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## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

gsdlover91 said:


> How do I find a trainer that could come to my house to help me work on this situation (AND teach my MOTHER HOW TO HANDLE IT?) My mother wont listen to me, and is frustrating me so MUCH!


From our experience, trainers usually have a facility or space that they train in, so we'd have to go to them. We hired a behaviorist and she wanted to come to our house to see the exact situation/environment that was creating the problems that needed correction. She understood that, if we met elsewhere, the problem might not be replicated exactly the same, so the solution wouldn't help when Nara was back at home acting up. I'd look for a behaviorist instead of a trainer, and you can always ask around for recommendations on who is good and who you should stay away from. People, from experience, might also know who makes house calls and who doesn't. Good luck!


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## zivagirl (Jan 5, 2013)

shepherdmom said:


> If my kids needed to come home, then of course I would be willing to take them in but I would expect them to train, raise, vet and keep control of any animals they bring with them. If op's mom had wanted a puppy, she would have gotten one, obviously she didn't. It is not fair for adult children to come home and then expect mom to follow directions on training a dog she didn't want in the first place. Mom has opened her home so daughter has a place to live now daughter has to do her very best to avoid disrupting mom's life and to not put the lives of her mom's cats at risk. It is simple common courtesy.


Different people, different rules. All we can do is suggest ways to help make things work. A far, I think there have been a lot of helpful suggestions.


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## harmony (May 30, 2002)

Do you crate your dog when you are not there? Does he get the right amount of exercise and something to chase an fetch when being played with? You know what he can and can not put his mouth on. I know I am not a real big cat person but I don't believe it is always the dogs fault. Trainers end up training people as much if not more then the dog . A no means no, and a reward means good, I have no inbetween. I really hope you can get this worked out. How old is your dog?


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

harmony said:


> Do you crate your dog when you are not there? Does he get the right amount of exercise and something to chase an fetch when being played with? You know what he can and can not put his mouth on. I know I am not a real big cat person but I don't believe it is always the dogs fault. Trainers end up training people as much if not more then the dog . A no means no, and a reward means good, I have no inbetween. I really hope you can get this worked out. How old is your dog?


Yes, he is always crated when I am not home, or no one is able to watch him. He gets the right amount of exercise, and he has PLENTY of toys to chase and what not. Ordered him a flirt pole yesterday also, so that should help. This is not 100% the dogs fault, it is mine first and foremost, and somewhat the cats fault too. They know where their safe spot is...I have NO idea why the cat instead chose to run himself into a corner, when he ran RIGHT past the stairs that lead to the safe spot. Mieko just wants the dog to love him, and I wish they'd get along..We had good progress today, all I can do is take it one day at a time for now. 



counter said:


> From our experience, trainers usually have a facility or space that they train in, so we'd have to go to them. We hired a behaviorist and she wanted to come to our house to see the exact situation/environment that was creating the problems that needed correction. She understood that, if we met elsewhere, the problem might not be replicated exactly the same, so the solution wouldn't help when Nara was back at home acting up. I'd look for a behaviorist instead of a trainer, and you can always ask around for recommendations on who is good and who you should stay away from. People, from experience, might also know who makes house calls and who doesn't. Good luck!


Thank you! I'll look into behaviorists in the area. 



codmaster said:


> Do you want /need to train him to leave them alone while you are with him OR the much more difficult job of training him to leave them alone while he is home with them without you there? (Not advised!)
> 
> I would think that a pro trainer (a good one!) should be able to convince a 7mo puppy that he cannot even look at your cats!


I want him trained when I AM with him, lol, he will always be in his crate when no one is home..or atleast until I have my own place and he is much older. 



shepherdmom said:


> Well all I can say is this would not happen at my house.  I wouldn't agree to be caretaker while you are at work/school I flat wouldn't have the time. I have my own work and my own school and my own animals to care for. My kids could come home but they would have to find their own pet sitters or do it themselves.





shepherdmom said:


> If my kids needed to come home, then of course I would be willing to take them in but I would expect them to train, raise, vet and keep control of any animals they bring with them. If op's mom had wanted a puppy, she would have gotten one, obviously she didn't. It is not fair for adult children to come home and then expect mom to follow directions on training a dog she didn't want in the first place. Mom has opened her home so daughter has a place to live now daughter has to do her very best to avoid disrupting mom's life and to not put the lives of her mom's cats at risk. It is simple common courtesy.


Shepherdmom, I appreciate your input, but it is a tad unfair to make assumptions about my home/personal life. When me getting a dog was in talks, I had planned on taking him to daycare when I was gone, but she offered to watch him. She actually loves him, and its HER choice to watch him. She has even joked (i hope) about wanting me to leave him with her when I move out. So dont assume that I got a dog and pushed this training and responsibility to watch him on to her. At any point, I could take him to day care. She really doesnt mind watching him, she enjoys having him around, and training him and what not. My mother does want a puppy, BUT, she does not have enough time to fully raise one. So she actually enjoys the fact that she gets to help raise mine.. And as for her training a dog she didnt want in the first place, she DID want him. I did not just go get a dog and bring him home without her permission, as it is her house. She allowed me to get a dog, and offered to help me out with him. I never asked her. As zivagirl said, different household different rules. If my mother did not want a dog, or allow me to have one, I wouldnt have my dog right now. If she didnt want to watch him while I was gone, he'd be in doggie daycare. 



Blitzkrieg1 said:


> Honestly I wouldnt use the prong because he associates the correction with you. You want to erradicate the behavior, therefor you want the correction to be more environmental in nature. He merely learns any kind of aggression or intensity towards the cat = Stim. You can even put the cat in a carrier down in the middle of the room go hide in the next room or pretend to ignore him and stim on any kind of neg behavior. For now him avoiding the cat is good enough for your purposes.
> 
> Interesting study I once read on leerburg about training with treat vs prongs vs E collar. The goal was to prevent the dog from rushing the helper even when he was agitating at a distance and stay at the handlers side until verbally sent. This is obviously difficult for highly driven young dogs that view the decoy as prey.
> 
> ...


Interesting study. Well, I will hold off on that then. I am going to try and work this out, but if it comes down to it, I will be getting an e-collar. Thanks for the advice on the e-collar.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

gsdlover91 said:


> Shepherdmom, I appreciate your input, but it is a tad unfair to make assumptions about my home/personal life. When me getting a dog was in talks, I had planned on taking him to daycare when I was gone, but she offered to watch him...


Actually you brought it up.... 

"How do I find a trainer that could come to my house to help me work on this situation (AND teach my MOTHER HOW TO HANDLE IT?) My mother wont listen to me, and is frustrating me so MUCH!"

Rather than get frustrated at your mom then, it is time to try something different. Maybe a daycare you trust to follow your rules would be a better fit for your dog and for the cats?


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## RocketDog (Sep 25, 2011)

Katie, while my dog didn't want to "eat" our cats, it's been a struggle for me to get him to behave appropriately, mostly because when he was a wee pup, and smaller than this particular cat (who is a poly dactyl btw), he played rough with the kitty, and the kitty didn't care. Now that he's so big, the cat DOES care, but refuses to correct really. (He has meowed and Rocket immediately backed off but goes right back in). Because the cat won't "take care of it", it was very very very frustrating for me. (Rocket is respectful of cats who stand their ground and show him their claws). 

I have been working with the ecollar and I did try the prong a couple of times. The response with the prong was not nearly as good as the ecollar. He actually barked and was more ramped up and I think, would've been much more frustrated or he was seeing the cat as somehow causing the "correction". I much prefer the ecollar, and I barely have to turn it past 14-15. If we're outside, and there's more enticing behavior, it might be much higher. 

I use the low stim/training method with this, and reward good behavior and appropriate choices (turn back to me and come to me) with American Cheese, which is now proving to be more enticing that even the CAT!! I started with leash to show him what I wanted. It is a work in progress, but the cat can now hang out inside a bit, and Rocket is very good about not chasing him outside. He has not progressed to being outside without the ecollar and not chasing the cat, although we've had a couple of unplanned episodes and he HAS responded to me and come to me instead of chasing; I don't think that is cause to believe he's "done" though by any means. I would say that shows a bit of progress, is all. 

The other day, though, he was outside on the back deck and hanging out. My daughter realized he wasn't laying there anymore so she got up to look and he was laying on the walkway from the main deck to my bedroom deck, and this cat (the one he LOVES) was laying calmly on the railing above him. They were both just hanging out.  

Here is a picture from last night, Rocket is enjoying a small marrow bone as a treat for good "cat" behavior.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

zivagirl said:


> Different people, different rules. All we can do is suggest ways to help make things work. A far, I think there have been a lot of helpful suggestions.


Just trying to give a mom's perspective on it. I know if my 21 year old was trying to tell me how to raise a dog after my many years of experience I would be a tad on the miffed side.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

RocketDog said:


> Katie, while my dog didn't want to "eat" our cats, it's been a struggle for me to get him to behave appropriately, mostly because when he was a wee pup, and smaller than this particular cat (who is a poly dactyl btw), he played rough with the kitty, and the kitty didn't care. Now that he's so big, the cat DOES care, but refuses to correct really. (He has meowed and Rocket immediately backed off but goes right back in). Because the cat won't "take care of it", it was very very very frustrating for me. (Rocket is respectful of cats who stand their ground and show him their claws).
> 
> I have been working with the ecollar and I did try the prong a couple of times. The response with the prong was not nearly as good as the ecollar. He actually barked and was more ramped up and I think, would've been much more frustrated or he was seeing the cat as somehow causing the "correction". I much prefer the ecollar, and I barely have to turn it past 14-15. If we're outside, and there's more enticing behavior, it might be much higher.
> 
> ...


Glad Rocket is making progress! It helps to know I am not the only one who is in this situation. What type of e-collar do you have? I looked some up but there are SO many and they are so expensive. I wish Berlin would respect the kitties who show their claws, because he has been whacked in the eyeball by a paw full of claws already...Thanks for the advice, I guess the e-collar doesnt sound as bad as I thought. I'll admit, the thought of using one on my baby terrified me at first! How long have you been working with Rocket and the cats?... Btw, that picture is too cute!



shepherdmom said:


> Actually you brought it up....
> 
> "How do I find a trainer that could come to my house to help me work on this situation (AND teach my MOTHER HOW TO HANDLE IT?) My mother wont listen to me, and is frustrating me so MUCH!"
> 
> ...


The reason I said that was because she doesnt listen to me, when I'm the one who takes Berlin to the trainer and asks her for advice, and i'm the one who does hours and hours of research.  I am going to be putting him in daycare once a week once he is neutered, to help her out and help this cat situation out. Just gotta find a good daycare...I've read horror stories about some!  Anyways, I DO appreciate your mom perspective, and by no means am I trying to tell her how to do anything, I merely am trying to teach her what I learn through the trainer/researching, so we can both fix this situation.


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## robinhuerta (Apr 21, 2007)

Katie.....
I have multiple dogs and a cat....we even have "outside cats".
Some of my dogs could care less about the cats, and a couple would LOVE to "invite her for dinner".
We find the use of an E-collar a very effective tool in our "tool box". One must learn the proper way to "use" it, so that it is effective and FAIR.
Your dog is still very young.....he is a puppy still. He should be able to be taught what is APPROPRIATE behavior around the cat, and what is UNACCEPTABLE.
This is your job as the owner.
When you are not "in control" of the situation......put the dog/puppy away.
When you are not home.......put the dog/puppy away.
There are videos available on the use of the E-collar.....buy one and educate yourself.
Your mother has cats, and you have dogs...to live in the family home...there must be boundaries for your dogs.

YOU CAN DO THIS. Do not jump to the conclusion that you need to re-home your puppy......
I don't know where in Chicago you are located....but you can also call a training facility by the name of TOPS Kennel in Grayslake, Illinois. Ask to speak or leave a message for Jody, a very good friend of mine. Perhaps she can also help you.....there may be a class or personal training available.

Best of luck to you.


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## RocketDog (Sep 25, 2011)

I have a new model Dogtra Sure Stim. The handheld remote vibrates if you choose, to let you know when you're delivering the stim. I prefer that, because it helps with the timing in my opinion. Also he wears the collar only for training. It doesn't matter to me if he becomes collar smart, because I'm working on teaching him the behavior and using rewards. And the two times I've had good success with him outside unplanned, he wasn't wearing the collar so that tells me it IS working. Also, he is a happy dog. He runs to it when I put it on because he knows its training time! 

Patience and consistency!


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## Blitzkrieg1 (Jul 31, 2012)

Pretty inspiring actually I assumed all sorts would jump all over me for even suggesting the dreaded torture device E Collar!! Your getting some good advice on the potential benifits to the collar.
Just an fyi my first ever E Collar was a chinese knock off purchased online for $50. Worked quite well until the plastic part that holds the reciever to the collar snapped off not that I would recommend you get one if you can afford better. I know there are some mid range ones on amazon SportDog brand I believe for about $100-150. The reviews on them are decent.


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## zyppi (Jun 2, 2006)

Didn't read all the posts, but some dogs just do not "do" with some cats...

I have similar situation so have the Invisible Fence solution. 
No more dog gates - Avoidance Areas, Indoor Dog Fence - Invisible Fence® Brand

It works! The cat now has her dog free area.

Good luck


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## zivagirl (Jan 5, 2013)

gsdlover91 said:


> The reason I said that was because she doesnt listen to me, when I'm the one who takes Berlin to the trainer and asks her for advice, and i'm the one who does hours and hours of research.  I am going to be putting him in daycare once a week once he is neutered, to help her out and help this cat situation out. Just gotta find a good daycare...I've read horror stories about some!  Anyways, I DO appreciate your mom perspective, and by no means am I trying to tell her how to do anything, I merely am trying to teach her what I learn through the trainer/researching, so we can both fix this situation.


My mother was just like yours. Wont take my word on ANYTHING until she consults with her sisters. LOL

It's wonderful that your mom loves your dog, btw.


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## Muneraven (Sep 4, 2012)

When I had my first dog I was laid off and moved home with my parents. Then I decided to go to school and my parents said they would keep my dog for me. That dog meant SO much to my Mom. She talked about him until the day she died. He was my dog, but he also was her dog. His heart was big enough for more than one person. And that she didn't treat him like I did was a joke between us. I trained him and then she got him and spoiled him rotten. I used to make her laugh by telling her she was ruining MY dog. But she wasn't really. He was always obedient and well-mannered . . .he just got to eat a piece of buttered toast in the morning when she had him, lol.

It's okay for parents to care for a person's dog as long as they WANT to do it. Sometimes I think people who would talk themselves out of having a dog end up having a dog and loving it because they can say it is their kid's dog, lol.


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## debbiebrown (Apr 13, 2002)

funny i never had any real problems with the cats and dogs in my house. although the dogs usually came to my home as young pups and the cats were already here. not saying it didn't have to teach a few of them to leave the cats alone. had a few that would play or herd the cats or chase if the cat ran, but when they caught up with the cat they would just nose them never nip or bite. and one of the highest prey drive dogs i ever had never even bothered with the cat, he knew the cat was part of the pack, the only thing he ever did once in a while was put his paw on her as to say i like you. it might be different if the cats came after the dogs were already in the house, but they should understand high prey drive or not that the cats are part of the pack. sometimes i think if people separate them from the beginning the dogs don't understand the cats are part of the pack. unfortunately this happened to a friend of mine, she had separated the cats from the dogs, the cats lived in the basement. one day the cat came into the kitchen and both dogs went after it before she could get there they had killed it....................very very sad.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

debbiebrown said:


> funny i never had any real problems with the cats and dogs in my house. although the dogs usually came to my home as young pups and the cats were already here.


I got Berlin at 9.5 weeks old, and the cats were already here and over a year old. :crazy:



Muneraven said:


> When I had my first dog I was laid off and moved home with my parents. Then I decided to go to school and my parents said they would keep my dog for me. That dog meant SO much to my Mom. She talked about him until the day she died. He was my dog, but he also was her dog. His heart was big enough for more than one person. And that she didn't treat him like I did was a joke between us. I trained him and then she got him and spoiled him rotten. I used to make her laugh by telling her she was ruining MY dog. But she wasn't really. He was always obedient and well-mannered . . .he just got to eat a piece of buttered toast in the morning when she had him, lol.
> 
> It's okay for parents to care for a person's dog as long as they WANT to do it. Sometimes I think people who would talk themselves out of having a dog end up having a dog and loving it because they can say it is their kid's dog, lol.


Aw, thanks for sharing this. Thats how my mother is, spoiling him with the 'goodies' and what not...and I'm the enforcer of the rules, all health conscious about what he eats and what not! I think my mom enjoys his company, but also enjoys the fact that its MY dog, so she doesnt have 100% responsibility! LOL! It works out..



zivagirl said:


> It's wonderful that your mom loves your dog, btw.


It is! I'm glad she does, it would suck if he was crated all day instead of out with her and my little brother enjoying his family!



zyppi said:


> Didn't read all the posts, but some dogs just do not "do" with some cats...
> 
> I have similar situation so have the Invisible Fence solution.
> No more dog gates - Avoidance Areas, Indoor Dog Fence - Invisible Fence® Brand
> ...


Very interesting, didnt know you could have one of those in the house! Thanks!




RocketDog said:


> I have a new model Dogtra Sure Stim. The handheld remote vibrates if you choose, to let you know when you're delivering the stim. I prefer that, because it helps with the timing in my opinion. Also he wears the collar only for training. It doesn't matter to me if he becomes collar smart, because I'm working on teaching him the behavior and using rewards. And the two times I've had good success with him outside unplanned, he wasn't wearing the collar so that tells me it IS working. Also, he is a happy dog. He runs to it when I put it on because he knows its training time!
> 
> Patience and consistency!


Glad to know it doesnt have to be on all the time, and still teaches. Ill have to check out the Dogtra, thanks for all the info!



robinhuerta said:


> Katie.....
> I have multiple dogs and a cat....we even have "outside cats".
> Some of my dogs could care less about the cats, and a couple would LOVE to "invite her for dinner".
> We find the use of an E-collar a very effective tool in our "tool box". One must learn the proper way to "use" it, so that it is effective and FAIR.
> ...


Thanks Robin!  He is always crated when im not home, or when he cannot be watched. Just sometimes random accidents happen in a split second when he is with me. And actually, TOPS is like 15 minutes away from me. I was planning on taking him there for his obedience training. I will definitely call there and talk to her, and see if she can help. And I will most definitely watch some videos on how to use an e-collar before I ever use one!


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## debbiebrown (Apr 13, 2002)

with alot of work and the right help, hopefully you can solve this. i think some dogs especially dogs with high prey drive need to be taught self control., and house rules. takes persistance and doesn't happen over night.


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## Justaguy (Nov 20, 2012)

My dog trainer had told me the best thing to do is look for the signals and snap him out of it. Once they are locked in its very difficult to snap that drive.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

tough situation for sure..

I would consider the e collar.

I would also do this, (cats don't think like dogs!),,I would have all your 'cat stuff in ONE room, kitty litter box, feeding station, block the room off and give it a few days so the cats "know" where food is, where litter is..a 'safe' room

I've told my 'aussie' story a few times but here goes again. I got Jag at 12 weeks old, a rescue,,I had 2 cats at the time (indoors)..the first few days he left the cats alone, probably just settling in..He then started charging them, and would pin them, get in their face and go 'off' on them..This happened maybe 3 times..The first time, I tried the 'soft' approach, the second time I amped it up,,the 3rd time,,(won't be popular but oh well ), I hauled his butt off that cat, had him by the scruff of the neck on his back legs and got in his face GOOD. He KNEW I was VERY PO'd and wasn't going to tolerate it one more time .. He's never bothered them again..

I didn't "beat" him, But I wasn't going to go 'easy' on him either..He's a tough dog who's now 13 and STILL can be a real pain with the other dogs..BUT he doesn't touch my cats..If he did, he'd be gone, they were here first. 

So, management, a safe room for the cats with food/litter..and you can definitely try the prong collar, putting a cat in a carrier, and work that,,or an e collar..He's young, some dogs will overcome it, some won't.

All my gsd's have been fine with my cats, but I am positive they would go after one and possibly kill it if they came across one outside my house..

Good luck


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## SiegersMom (Apr 19, 2011)

So much depends on how the cats treat and act with the dog. My GSD is almost 3 and raised with our cats. A new 5-week-old kitten we adopted/found was a worry to me becasue Sieger was so big and gets rough but they get along great now. But we had a stray half grown tom decide to move into the garage. Sieger goes crazy barking at strays and nieghbor cats through the fence...I trust him with mine but he would go after a cat he does not know. THis new cat had been around long enough I decided it was time to do the meet and greet. Sieger was nicely sniffing and this cat out of no where the cat turned on him jumped on his head and took 3 whacks at his nose. Sieger just hit the floor with this look of shock on his face. It was literaly a one second attack and I was standing there. Now he takes a wide berth of that cat. They only see one another in passing...as Sieger goes from the yard and through the garage into the house. He barks at that cat through the gate constantly. I could not leave them together. THe cat is calm one minute and whacks at him the next. My son said they had a little spat a few days ago and they had been getting along for months. THis time the dog did not cower back...he is getting fed up too. I just hope that cat does not ruin Sieger for all cats in the future. My daughter is the only person in the house that likes the cat and I feel bad about just taking it to the pound so I just keep them apart and someone is always there when they pass another to make sure Sieger does not decide to go after the cat. So far Sieger should get an award for his patience with that cat!!!


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## RocketDog (Sep 25, 2011)

SiegersMom's post is very true. My white and black cat, in the photo I posted earlier, will not defend himself in the least. Now, I don't want him to attack my dog, but if he'd shown him a little bit of correction when Rocket was a small puppy, things would be very different. Unfortunately, he won't raise paw ever. Grrrrr. Frustrating.


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## kiya (May 3, 2010)

This is our story http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/aggression-good-bad-ugly/170990-nipped-kitty.html
I had a problem with Kiya and our new kitty, she tried to bite him, I don't know about kill but she definately wanted to taste him with her teeth. It took almost 6 months to work it out. I can tell you any time I had her on a leash, used a muzzle or tried to hold her back it made it worse.
You need a lot of patience and time. I would concider the ecollar. Now you know never ever let the kitties get into that kind of situation. 
Good luck.


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## zivagirl (Jan 5, 2013)

Beth is now beta to our smallest cat's alpha. lol.


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## pets4life (Feb 22, 2011)

you seem to soft for the situation, your dog is eating your cats literally has them in his mouth and is chewing them up. 

You need to get rid of one or the other or get really hard and tough on your dog but i dont htink you have it in you, if you feel bad for smacking your dog when he was swallowing your cat alive. A gsd can kill a cat in seconds.


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## SiegersMom (Apr 19, 2011)

Cats that run are a big trigger. IF they do not run he has little interest in them. I would never worry about cats if I knew they would stay still and greet him but stray cats run...that is what their instinct tells them to do. When around dogs that are cat killers they are better off that way but my dog would never hurt or mess with a cat that just walks up to him. But I know that when the chase/prey drive kicks in even a good dog could hurt or kill a cat...even if by accident.


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## Blanketback (Apr 27, 2012)

I've always had dogs and cats living together for my whole life. With this particular puppy and this particular cat right now, I have to tell them both off, lol. I was only telling the puppy, "Leave it" but after I caught them fooling around without knowing I was watching, I found out that my cat is teasing the bejeezus out of my puppy. So now it's, "Leave the cat alone! Stop teasing the dog!" quite a mouthful, lol. But the cat races around trying to get a game going. I even caught her on the laminate flooring, scratching away with all her paws in one spot, making tons of noise to get the puppy's attention. That was funny!

I have a separate cat room, and I also have a massive cat tree. When I'm not looking, the cat hangs out on the bottom of the tree and lets my puppy poke her and gum her. As soon as she knows I'm there, she hisses and frantically climbs her tree. Same with her room - she can be lying on one of her beds (spoiled, lol) and let the puppy drool all over her, but as soon as I'm within her view, she jumps up hissing and acting like she's being mauled. I wonder if your mom's cats are up to the same tricks?


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## FrankieC (Aug 15, 2012)

My kitten laid the groundwork right from the get go. Poke the bull, you get the horns...err paws 






Katie, I know you will get this sorted with Berlin. Just a matter of time. Best of luck!


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## pets4life (Feb 22, 2011)

A cat does not need keep still or fight a gsd, this is not the same situation if the gsd wants to take a cat out it will take the cat out, i think a lot of posters just dont understand or have seen a gsd that really wants to kill a cat it does not care if the cat fights back or runs it will just go after the cats head and snap and shake it and try to tear it off. If you have not seen it first hand you are in for a suprise.

A cat is not going to fight a serious gsd if the gsd wants to kill it, no cat is going to put a gsd in its place if the gsd has blood on its mind. 

Don't know what fantasy world some people live in. The only thing that can help the cat is the dogs owner. You think the cat is doing it. The dog is only listening to the cat because of its respect for YOU.

THe dog doesnt have much respect for you, or the dog is just wayy too cat aggressive you are going to have issues. ALso some gsds are naturally better safer and less aggressive with cats than others.


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## DollBaby (Oct 31, 2012)

[/QUOTE]Yes, I feel bad for smacking my dog even though he had the cat in his mouth, because hitting an animal is not okay to me. He wouldnt even look at me afterward, I would NEVER want to do anything to ever ruin our bond. On the other hand, I need to get a handle on this situation and make sure this NEVER happens again. I have been working on his focus on me, and its been improving. He will not be able to "look" for them anymore, he will be strictly focusing on me from now on.


> Don't. You did no less than the momma dog would have done, only with your hand instead of teeth. You won't ruin your bond by being alpha and correcting bad, unacceptable behavior.


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## pets4life (Feb 22, 2011)

hitting an animal to save another animals life or to save another animal from harm like if your mauling another dog is okay IF your dog is not responding to your command.

If you hit your dog for not listening to a command or just in general for being a goof or a bad dog or breaking stuff yeah that is wrong and sick but to protect another animal from harm or death yes you can hit your dog and do anything possible to save that animals life. 


There is a huge diff between abuse bad ownership and keeping other animals safe from your dog. If your dog gets upset over it you did a good job dont cuddle him he needs to know how bad he was. Lock him up in his crate after he felt bad about it. Give him something to think about. Don't blame the cats blame him. Gsd's are the smartest dogs they know what they are doing.

As he gets older he will run that house with an iron paw lol


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## Mikelia (Aug 29, 2012)

My experience. I adopted a 2 year old american pit bull terrier 7 years ago. She had been owned by a guy that owned a smoke shop and was busted for drugs. She had been through 5 foster homes and no one could handle her. She was an animal killer amongst other problems she had. I lived in a one bedroom apartment with four cats, and she definately wanted to (and would have, given opportunity) kill my cats. I was determined. My cats are very dog friendly and one is very very stupid and does not understand that any one could cause harm. He will not move out of a dogs way. Sweetie (she came with the name) spent the first month muzzled, on leash with a pinch collar and tethered to me at ALL times. She slept in the bedroom with us so she got a good 6-8 hours free everyday but otherwise was on a four foot leash. Her kennel was placed in the livingroom and at first I had to cover it with blankets. I made no effort to keep the cats separated from the dog, aside from night time in the bedroom. She responds very well to a squirt bottle (she is terrified of it for whatever reason) and we used it similar to one would use an e collar. She perks her ears at a cat and tenses, she got a squirt in the bum. By the time she looked back at me I would try my best to have hidden the squirt bottle. Once she relaxed she would be praised. 
I had my hands full with her as she had many other issues than killing animals so she received a LOT of training, excercise, structure, stimulation and socialization. It was about a month before I could have her in the house without a muzzle, then she progressed to dragging the leash, then eventually no leash but always kept the squirt bottle present. It would stop her in her tracks but I had to step in right away to redirect her or she would go right back at them. I structured her time out with the cats in a way that she did not have a chance to get them into her mouth before I could correct her. If I had not have been so diligent I would be minus a few cats by now. Onceshe got ahold of one of their tails, I don't know how she didn't break it. She had the tip of it with her front teeth and it took me a minute or two to choke her off until she let go. 
It took about a year before I could trust her with them and relax with her out with them, no muzzle or lead. I kept a squirt bottle around though for probably 2 years. She is now awesome with the cats and accepts any new cats that come into the house. Cats outside are fair game and I am fine with that (in fact I think every gsd I own would kill stray cats given opportunity, but they understand cats in the house are pack members and respect that) but she is not to lunge or act aggressively. She sleeps with them, they groom her, they sit on her, everyone gets along wonderfully. And she also lives with 3 other dogs  I do not however leave her unattended with the cats. If I am not home, she is put in the bedroom. Prey instinct could spike at any time and I would hate myself if she killed one of my cats. 
I would keep your hopes up for your dog. 7 months old is quite young still and considering Berlin has picked up a cat and not damaged it and you can do focus training around the cats, I would say these are very hopeful signs. I believe it is how dedicated you are to turning the dog around, and it sounds as if you are dedicated 
If a 2 year old, out of control, owned by a drug dealer pit bull can be retrained I would think a busy, pushy, rotten gsd puppy can too  Sweetie sends thoughts and strength your way.


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