# Always wanted a protective dog..



## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Growing up I always wanted a scary big protective german shepherd because I am such a small girl. 
Now that I have my make GSD who is a protectful barky boy, it drives me nuts. 
I just wish he would ignore everything and just continue on with our walk happily, paying all attention to me. 
But no. 
I've been working on it a lot, I've also been working on obedience and tricks and running him good daily. Taking walks in dog busy areas, training around dog parks.
And sometimes he is so darn perfect, other times he just focuses and barks.
He will bark at people when he is in the house, in the yard or in the car sometimes. But out on a walk or in a pet store is unacceptable to me. 
It just gets frustrrating, I feel like I'm putting in so much effort but that he needs and deserves more than me.
I'm in a funk guys.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

I guess I'm just having doubts if I am giving him what he needs. I feel like someone else could fix his small problems and do somthing amazing with him in life. And I feel like I'm failing at it.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

pump up the training. find a trainer if need be. you
can give him everything he needs. things don't
happen overnight. be consistant. "quitters never win
and winners never quit". a freind of mine say that to me.



shilorio said:


> I guess I'm just having doubts if I am giving him what he needs. I feel like someone else could fix his small problems and do somthing amazing with him in life. And I feel like I'm failing at it.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

doggiedad said:


> pump up the training. find a trainer if need be. you
> can give him everything he needs. things don't
> happen overnight. be consistant. "quitters never win
> and winners never quit". a freind of mine say that to me.


I don't know why I all of a sudden started feeling this way. 
It may be because school has been very stressful lately (vet tech school)
But when I get these stupid thoughts in my head it's hard to forget about them. 
I love my boy and have helped him a massive amount then when I rescued him, I write new training ideas every day in a composition notebook, I want everything perfect in the world for him, I think it's a really good idea to do some sort of class or sport but with school I just don't have the money right now (and a lot of club are about 2 hours away from me it sucks)


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

It's all or nothing. By that I mean ideally he barks no where. By that I mean obsessive barking for no reason. As you have found it's not easy to change, but the dog can't on his own know when it's acceptable or not. So I would think it starts at home, then work yourself to other places. Use a combo of training methods, redirection, reward, and light corrections, etc. He'll get it. You'll get it. Sometimes you have to take a step back, re-evaluate, and start again.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

There are trainers out there you can go to to troubleshoot specific behaviors and get exercises to work on at home and then you go back whenever you have time or money to learn something new. Finding a good one is the hard part.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Does he bark at home if he's in a window and sees someone walking by?


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## Loneforce (Feb 12, 2012)

Maybe you are taking him to too many exciting place's. Maybe you need a little more one on one quiet time for him to focus on you and you only.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

do you know how to train? here are some things you
can do without going to a class.

> sit, stay, down, come, wait?.
> verbal commands and hand signals.
> heel ( on either side with or without a leash).
> back up.
> retrieve
> "find it". hide things and teach your dog to
find them.
> family hug. when you hug someone and say
"family hug" your dog walks between both
of you and sits.
> teach him not to enter or exit the car
without a command.
> "go to your or "go to" (insert place or person).
> teach him to pick something up if you drop it.
> "go through my legs". just for fun. it does come
in handy for me when i want to towel him off. he walks
back and forth between my legs while i towel him off.
> spin
> speak
> "give me your paw" and " the other one".
> teach him not to door dash or gate dash.

make up somethings to teach him.


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## Msmaria (Mar 2, 2013)

Maybe he feels your anxiety and stress from school. Its hard to get thoughts out of your head. The more you think " stop thinking about so and so" ..the more you think about it. Having anxiety myself, when. I was younger, ive learned the best way to get rid of those negative thoughts is to replace them with happy ones. When out walking try to think of what makes you happy. For me one of them is how im going to reaarange my house. I know..im a weirdo..lol. think of a few happy thoughts before you go so you wont have a hard time trying to come up with some while your stressed. In regards to distracting your dog, ive learned so much here on this site. For example taking his favorite toy and in a high pitched voice distracting him early by dancing around with it. Okay so hes a weird too. Find what works for you. Distractions have to be early enough that hes not focusing on them yet. You need to find out what makes him nervous. For my dog its people running straight towards him and eye contact. Also strange hats, big hats, the tax lady on the corner whos green and holding a big green scary monster. I recently bought 3 books but each of them tells me the same thing others on here have told me. Look up engagement and counter conditioning on this site.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Yes I know how to train and I'm really good at it. He knows every command and trick. He is a very smart dog. All my dogs have been trained perfectly I am just having this problem now.
And I do have clinical anxiety problems as well as panic attacks, my original idea for Elios was to make him my service dog, and I think that's why I am getting to upset is because I expect more then I should. 
And I do believe he feeds off my energy when I'm really anxious. 
He is just also so unpredictable . I took him (full training vest) to a market and sat out side with all the people and dogs and he did perfect. For three hours. Didn't bark once . Doing his commands perfect. (Basic and service commands) and all of a sudden e started barking at everything. 
I think it's because he was done and tired. Needed some good play reward. But the problem was I waiting for my ride so I tried doing some fun things. 
It's just things like that that make him totally different, am I pushing him to hard? Should I not take him around dogs? 
I feel like the more he doesn't see dogs and humans the more he barks at them.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

I feel like I'm just having stress and anxiety and I just don't want to transport it to him.


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## Kaimeju (Feb 2, 2013)

What is your response to him when he barks?


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I agree he could be feeling your stress/anxiety. 

How much EXERCISE, as in running around does he get? 

His barking is not a 'protective' behavior, it sounds like frustration. Sometimes pushing to hard/to long in training, can cause a dog to shut down, they get frustrated, and need an outlet for that frustration. 

When this happens, and we (general we) are at a standstill, it's time to bring in the professionals. 

And I would ask the samething, what do YOU do when he starts barking and won't shut up?


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Well first "you" need to take a break! Yes, if you're stressing he will know it! And three hours is way to long for training.

I don't "know" if this will work but it's always easier to teach a dog to do something ,rather than to not do something!

Since it appears that he is trained, I would use that on walks..if he barks, tell him "down" the thought is he'll stop after a bit because it's screwing up his walk? Then if he barks again..."down". I think he'll figure out the pattern pretty quickly!

I've never had the need to try this because I've never had your particular problem but it might work and couldn't hurt.

And I'd say no corrections at this point corrections are just as likely to tick him off and right now he doesn't know what you want. 

And I wouldn't do treats either but I won't take a hard stance on that, I use very limited treats when I train..I'm more of a "because I say so sorta guy!


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## Colie CVT (Nov 10, 2013)

How old is he? I am curious since generally speaking most dogs who are going to be service dogs don't start doing really long sessions out in the public until they are closer to two years of age and have been handling focusing in other environments before going into public places. There really is a very special thing about dogs who end up as service animals, something that really cannot be trained. They have a certain spark, a certain way about them. 

I would recommend picking up the book, The Possibility Dogs by Susannah Charleson. I picked it up myself on a whim, and it's been a wonderful read. All about how different service dog teams work, what to look for, her experiences with training her own service dog. It was a truly wonderful read and it really has helped me understand even more about the kind of relationship that service dog partners have and the challenges for the dog themselves. 

I definitely agree with Chip in saying to take a break! Maybe just go back to the basics, go back to fun. If he is younger still, the only thing he really needs to do is work on his basic obedience. Sadly if you want him to help you with your anxiety, he needs to focus more on you and help break you out of it. It sounds more like as someone else said, that he is frustrated and potentially anxious himself and attempting to deal with what he feels from you on top of his own potential issues. You may want to find someone who actively works with psychiatric service dogs and have him evaluated to see if he actually would be a good fit for the job, or if potentially you will need to find another dog to help you. A dog who helps with anxiety/panic attacks needs to be calm, confident and collected. Not every dog can do that. It is why they specifically breed for service animals, you know?

I understand how stressful schooling for vet tech can be, but I should also warn you the job itself is just as stressful and often heartbreaking. I am a Certified Veterinary Technician myself who has been out of school now nearly 7 years and it is not an easy job. The clients, the patients, your coworkers, your boss, the job it is all a ton of stress. There is a reason that compassion fatigue and burn out is such an issue in our field. I myself have been facing some dangerous depression a few times on and off in my career, and there are times I question why I keep going. I thankfully have worked through them, but it was by the skin of my teeth in some cases. Physically I am getting worn down and I am only 30 years of age. 

If you want any help, you can feel free to message me about school related things. I actually have helped with teaching different vet tech courses on and off, and I do continuing ed things for the other techs in my area.  You can even feel free to vent to me if need be too, believe me I have been around the block and then some!  Others likely can give better training advice, but I figure an offer to help with the professional side of things if you would like!

One thing though. Take a deep breath and let it out slowly.  Some times just trying to take a moment and appreciate the fact you can breathe can be more helpful than you'd believe.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

He is almost two now. When I barks I usually do a light pop on the prong and say quiet or leave it. Or I'll try to have him sit wait and touch my hand and do other commands. 
I think partially he is afraid. Especially on leash, like he is traped of corse. 
Because when I have okay dates he plays rough and has fun, but on leash he acts like either "get the **** away from me" or somthing. Today I went on a walk with a bunch of dogs and humans around and he was of course barky because he had that built up energy because I didn't run him well before hand (usually I run him until he is pretty tired with the chuck it) then I go do things and he is pretty good. 
It's just some days he can handle it and others he can't i guess. 
I run him with the chucked one to two times a day. Then we have a indoor training session and outdoor(sometimes around a dog or two at the track) and other times I go to the lake (a lot of people and dogs walkin!!) or a dog park and train around the dog park. 
So he calmed down a bit today and then a person was walking towards us and he started barking, then he just barked at everything. I was upset of course. 
I think he did this because me and my dad were talking about somthing upsetting and frustrating so he was feeding off me?


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Thank you guys for talking to me like this and all 
I rescued this dog because he was being treated like dirt. And he has changed so much it's incredible. I have gotten him evaluated and they said he should be able to do it. I just have to put on the 100% effort and it's hard while won so busy, this dog isn't stable without me. And I'm not stable with out him. But we are both anxious goons. Trying to find out way! Haha


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## Deno (Apr 3, 2013)

In my opinion the fact that a small girl has the command and the respect of a 

male of this breed says a lot about the girl, and a rescue to boot. It's one thing 

to start with a pup and I would imagine quite another to correct someone else's 

mistakes. It sounds like you are doing everything right. I don't claim to be an 

expert of any kind, but I do have dogs that will do whatever I tell them.

I know I will get a lot of %$# for what I am about to tell you, but I also know 

it worked perfect for the one Alpha male I trained this way. I would put a 

"shock" collar on him and tweak him in the areas he needs tweaking. Success 

would be short and painless from my experience. As you know, attitude and 

your mood are very important. You are capable and responsible for training 

your dog, no one can do it better, and no one loves your dog more than you. 

It's all in print or on the web.


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## Colie CVT (Nov 10, 2013)

Two is still not too old in the case of most large breed dogs.  When my golden hit about three, it was like something happened and he became this totally different creature in a very good way. He sounded like he was kind of young and probably still getting used to the idea of Public Access. It is usually the hardest part for the dogs to deal with, and it really is the time you want them to be quiet, focused and very well mannered. Maybe try to take the que from him if this is a good day/time to be doing training in PA or if you should maybe just practice heeling and play with the chuck it somewhere nice and open instead? 

He definitely could be picking up your anxiety. The leash is like a live wire I swear. When you are nervous or anxious about something, they pick up on it and they often start to wonder what to be concerned about. He should focus on you I would imagine when you get anxious rather than look toward the external environment. He should start blocking you or nudging at your hands/legs, something to try and bring your focus down to him and off of whatever is bothering you. Somebody who is familiar with the training near you could probably be the best kind of help for evaluating what could be going on and helping you with good solutions for it. 

I really do recommend that book, especially since you rescued your boy! The dog she trains in it is a rescue from a pretty nasty situation and I just loved reading about their adventures, how she helped others find their dogs and just the stories she has about success of dog-handler teams. It's kind of a whole different world when you have a dog that has a job. It takes time to train them up and the kind of partnership you get is pretty awesome. Good luck to you guys!


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Thank you guys so much, I feel like I get such a confident boost when reading these. He is such a good boy, what I always said was " I'd rather have a difficult dog with a personality, then one with out! "


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

I would recommend ending the training session before he has the opportunity to start acting up. Try and remove the possibility of him practicing the behavior. I would shorten the exposure times and up the focus criteria while you are out. If you have a trained focus command, use it, and wait longer durations before engaging him with fun OB stuff. Make the wait times variable, but be sure not to go over his limit. His attention span will grow, as will his ability to ignore other stimulus.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

OK trying to think this over, So far between you and your dog both we have,bark,bark,bark,stress,stress,stress,school,school,school and train,train,train, It maybe an oversimplification but I don't hear,see any down time?

Do you and your dog ever just relax together, others have suggested it also? Not a run or training around other dogs to see if he needs more training...just take a break?

I don't think the problem is exercise because , I'm exhausted reading about all the stuff you guys do! :laugh: So I doubt he's bored and that's why he barks.

So why does he bark? In it's simplest terms, you can't fix something if you don't know what's wrong. It doesn't strike me that it's fear based barking? But you "think it's fear based? You know your dog not us, but maybe a third opinion is needed?

My thought is, you did say he was a shelter dog. Most likely barking is how he got attention in the shelter? How is it you chose him, was he the dog barking the loudest? He doesn't need to do that now but he doesn't seem to know that. 

If it's fear based barking that is one thing, if it's a learned behavior that's another! Maybe it's time to get a second option from a dog behaviorist? You can ask for a consolidation.

I did with my first dog, (BullMastiff/Pit mix) I thought he was a Dominate Aggressive Male, the guy checked Gunther out and told me your dogs a Dominate Male but not Aggressive...he's just an A Hole!  I could work with that! 

Anyway just something to think about, you and your dog also need to have some time to decompress, dogs are suppose to be a joy not a chore. 

Just a thought.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Chip18 said:


> OK trying to think this over, So far between you and your dog both we have,bark,bark,bark,stress,stress,stress,school,school,school and train,train,train, It maybe an oversimplification but I don't hear,see any down time?
> 
> Do you and your dog ever just relax together, others have suggested it also? Not a run or training around other dogs to see if he needs more training...just take a break?
> 
> ...


He was found as a stray in california. And pulled from a rescue to come up here to wa. 
A lady got him an Gave up on him, going him to
My old dog trainer. Who kept him in a kennel with a shock colar, beat him, and never let him out. 
I told her I wanted him. 
The dog wouldn't let me touch him. Wouldn't play fetch, couldn't run. Affair of stairs. Everything was scary to him, 
Then he had a phase of barking at peopke. Every one that walked by. (He only barks at people now of they are ataring at him and walking towards him or of it's on my property or really dark and knows I'm scared) 
So he started shapin into a dog, I started taking himore places, service dog training, then I though "he needs training just to grow up" so I slowed down the vest training and started working on tricks and basics. 
And I go to this field and sometimes there is a dog there and I'll train around them and he will do really good! It's just other days.. 
But I've noticed the more I work with basics just me and him and take a break from the out side world, he gets more barky and anxious. 
So I really do wonder what is causeing it.. 
If a dog is off leash or a owner let's there dog come up to him with him unexpecting it (with out me making him wait and say hi for a short sniff) he will growl and try to bite them. 
Is he having the leash problem ( that he feels volnirable and left out when on the leash?) because off leash he plays with dogs unless they are puppies or little ones then he is too tough. 

I took him out last night and relaxed with him aroun the house. Before we went to bed, and he was being a good boy.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Maybe he just get so over whelmed and full of anxiety he can't help but act ip?


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I'd suggest doing the LAT and BAT exercises. Your dog is still immature mentally and his threshold level is playing into his reactivity(genetic). If you do more to let him know that you have his back, he can let go and the burden of being 'on' all the time is lifted...so his reactivity level is lessened. 
google for more info on LAT/ BAT...there are plenty of links.


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## David Taggart (Nov 25, 2012)

His behaviour is typical of dogs who were chained or locked away from outside world since they were puppies. His barking is a territorial barking, the only thing a chained dog can afford to enjoy. If he didn't bark before - that is only because he was busy adjusting his senses to new owner and new environment and didn't mind them as his own property. Unlike some others, who suggest you to give him a break, I propose to provide him intensive training, as much as you can, use as many methods as you can, do not pity him exercising, a busy life is a life away from his inner self. But that would solve only half of the trouble, because it is connected to his frustrating and boring past. The other half is a continuation of the past on his new territory. Appearance of strangers and unknown dogs on his territory daily continue building a new stereotype which you can destroy rather easily: you should install an impression into him that their presence brings him pleasure. Keep him hungry before walks and feed him in the park, not everything at once, but when you notice that some stranger caught his attention.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Okay thanks guys. I will look that up and work on those ASAP .thanks so mix for all your help guys.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

onyx'girl said:


> I'd suggest doing the LAT and BAT exercises. Your dog is still immature mentally and his threshold level is playing into his reactivity(genetic). If you do more to let him know that you have his back, he can let go and the burden of being 'on' all the time is lifted...so his reactivity level is lessened.
> google for more info on LAT/ BAT...there are plenty of links.


This ^^^:thumbup::thumbup: !!!!! This is what is currently happening between you and your dog:

Dog: Whoo Hoo! I love walks with my person! I love her!:wub:

Person: Oh...I know he's going to start barking. I know he will. I've got to do something to stop him.....

Dog: Hey! Why you stressing?? It's all rainbows and unicorns here!!!

Person: Oh great. Here comes someone. Great. He's going to go nuts!

Dog: Why is she stress...wait!?! What's that??? She's stressing and here comes a dog and person!!! What am I supposed to do?

Person: OH NO! He's noticed them! "Look, fido!" "Leave it!" "Sit!" "Crap! Come'on! I look like an idiot! They think I don't know what I'm doing here!"

Dog: It must be a monster! She's falling apart! I don't know what I'm supposed to do! I'll keep barking - maybe they'll stay away! This must be serious! She's all over the place! I don't know what is expected of me! I must make a HUGE show and they'll stay away from us!!!

Person: "It's all right, Fido. Good boy. Calm down. They're gone."

Dog: She's loving on me. I must have done a good job. I'll make sure I keep everyone away.


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## shilorio (Mar 21, 2010)

Lilie said:


> This ^^^:thumbup::thumbup: !!!!! This is what is currently happening between you and your dog:
> 
> Dog: Whoo Hoo! I love walks with my person! I love her!:wub:
> 
> ...


Oh my goodness that made me laugh out loud in my lecture class. 
It is almost spot on! But I do not praise for it. 
I only praise when he is quiet and actually leaves it. 
Then it's a party  hahaha


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

shilorio said:


> Oh my goodness that made me laugh out loud in my lecture class.
> It is almost spot on! But I do not praise for it.
> I only praise when he is quiet and actually leaves it.
> Then it's a party  hahaha


I only knew because we've ALL been there, done that!


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