# Disclosure



## Six (Oct 16, 2011)

Don't know the exact section to put this in, but I was wondering what some of your opinions are on disclosing everything you know about a puppy to a potential buyer. If a puppy had something like an umbilical hernia and you knew before the buyer picked it up would you let them know? Would you offer the puppy or a future puppy if they didn't want to proceed? 
As a buyer, how would you feel? If you wouldn't disclose, how important to you would an issue have to be to disclose?
Just a little frustrated, looking for opinions and some perspective.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

A small umbilical hernia is pretty common, sometimes caused by the dam pulling too hard on the cord when cleaning up the puppy and is not considered a major issue. Sometimes you don't even notice those until the puppy is older than when they were sold.

Testicles are another thing that you may not know what is going to happen at 8 weeks. There, most breeders do offer some refund or replacement options as a retained testicle should be surgically removed.

To me, the best hip warranty is a good breeding program. You are buying a puppy not a car. 

IF I were a breeder and a customer wanted a replacement for something so minor as a small hernia, I think I would be asking them to look elsewhere.


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## BlackPuppy (Mar 29, 2007)

I was told my puppy had a small heart murmur. Knowing that these can be common with puppies, I bought him anyway. No heart murmur has been found since he came home. 

Better to be honest than to get a reputation as a dishonest breeder.


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## Six (Oct 16, 2011)

Thanks. I understand this position and when I discovered it I thought to myself, this sucks but what can I do.
However, when I did what I thought was right and informed the breeder so they were aware I was told that they already knew. 
My question is should the breeder have disclosed before taking possession of the puppy that the puppy had an umbilical hernia? Assuming the breeder knew full well that the hernia existed, would it be the right thing to disclose it and let the buyer decide?
What may not be an issue at 6 weeks may an issue later. While it may be no problem for some people, maybe it is for someone else. I just feel that I should have had the option to say "hey, I can deal with that" or "its something I'd rather not deal with, could I wait for the next litter".


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

If the breeder knew, they probably should have told you but it is such a minor problem (and it sounds very small as you describe it), such a common problem that it probably did not cross their mind. Often they close up on their own.

I am just saying it does not sound deceptive or misleading. I think you are too concerned about it-puppies are animals and they are all going to have some or another flaw. If it is that small the dog may go the rest of his life without any impact and if you get him neutered later you can just get a stich put in. 

In the scope of things there are many many far more serious things to be concerned about.....I *would* expect the breeder to tell me about a heart murmur or sypmptoms of a congenital disorder.


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## Six (Oct 16, 2011)

jocoyn said:


> If the breeder knew, they probably should have told you but it is such a minor problem (and it sounds very small as you describe it), such a common problem that it probably did not cross their mind. Often they close up on their own.
> 
> I am just saying it does not sound deceptive or misleading. I think you are too concerned about it-puppies are animals and they are all going to have some or another flaw. If it is that small the dog may go the rest of his life without any impact and if you get him neutered later you can just get a stich put in.
> 
> In the scope of things there are many many far more serious things to be concerned about.....I *would* expect the breeder to tell me about a heart murmur or sypmptoms of a congenital disorder.


Thanks. It's at least a dime size so I don't know. I don't plan on neutering anytime soon, it may or may not need surgery, I'll find out soon. I also think it may be the cause for his discomfort, I dont know. What's important to everyone is different. Where is the line drawn? Broken ear cartilage? An underbite? While these things won't generally affect a dog, they are very important to some people. I understand things happen and plan to deal with problems that arise throughout the dogs life, I guess I feel that something like this that may or may not be complicated should be disclosed before going to a home...especially since it was found by a vet beforehand. It may not have been misleading intentionally but still, I think a buyer spending good money should be able to make an informed decision based off a complete history of the puppy especially being such an large and important purchase.
I appreciate your view on the issue though, it helps.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

A dime sounds fairly large. Your first post on it led me to believe it was much smaller-just a typical small hernia that would close on its own. Something that big, possibly requiring surgery should be discolsed......I would agree to that even though it still is a fairly minor issue.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

They should have told you. It may have slipped their mind. Tori had an umbilical hernia. Still does I think, haven't checked it out recently. They said to fix it when she is spayed or before she has a litter, but as I am not spaying and not breeding her, I left it alone. It isn't hurting anything. 

I did offer her to someone as a replacement puppy. The fellow whose sister was watching the puppy when he went down south to visit an ailing relative. The sister let the puppies out, the bus hit the one pup and not the other. But the owner of the dog did take him to training, got him neutered, worked with him, brought him to see me, and I felt that if they wanted a replacement (for free) I would do so. 

I disclosed the small umbilical hernea, with the write up from the vet and everything. Well, they decided no, they would take the other puppy. Well, that is just fine. Tori went to my brother, he gave her back to me five weeks later saying she was defiant, and I took her put a CGC on her and placed twice on her RN. The umbilical hernea has not stopped her or slowed her down at all. 

Should they have disclosed it? Yes.


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## Six (Oct 16, 2011)

Yeah, based off what I found on the internet at the time I thought it was considered small. I would say that if there weren't tissue and organs on the other side the soft spot is definitely bigger than the tip of my finger, the diameter extends out around it, and one would be able to slide a finger in. I would guess as large as a dime, smaller than a quarter at this point maybe. I don't think any intestine would become trapped right now, but as he grows who can say. Who knew everything on the internets wasn't true


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## Six (Oct 16, 2011)

selzer said:


> They should have told you. It may have slipped their mind. Tori had an umbilical hernia. Still does I think, haven't checked it out recently. They said to fix it when she is spayed or before she has a litter, but as I am not spaying and not breeding her, I left it alone. It isn't hurting anything.
> 
> I did offer her to someone as a replacement puppy. The fellow whose sister was watching the puppy when he went down south to visit an ailing relative. The sister let the puppies out, the bus hit the one pup and not the other. But the owner of the dog did take him to training, got him neutered, worked with him, brought him to see me, and I felt that if they wanted a replacement (for free) I would do so.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I don't have any recourse or anything so its something I'll just have to deal with. Doesn't make it any less frustrating though  If it were disclosed beforehand I would've opted to wait for another litter. Even now, and it may sound heartless, I would most likely take a replacement, but that's not an option.
Just wanted to gather other opinions, maybe some differing perspectives to help ease said frustration.


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## RebelGSD (Mar 20, 2008)

I just hope and wish that this be the worst health issue that you will encounter with your pup. If this was so important to you, you could have checked it out at the time you picked the puppy up. If I were the breeder, I would take the puppy back and refund the money. In the future you should seek a breeder with a purchase contract that includes issues like this (although I have never heard of it).


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## Josie/Zeus (Nov 6, 2000)

My Zeus had u hernia - didn't bother him at all nor me.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

I've had two dogs with umbilical hernias. It's not a big deal, but I would definitely expect the breeder to disclose it, and with each of these dogs we were told about it.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

I would expect a good breeder to disclose any known current health issues on a puppy to a prospective buyer. Let the buyer make an informed decision. To me, it wouldn't matter how serious the breeder felt the medical issue to be. 

I just can't think of any reason a good breeder would withhold any information from a buyer that could result in required care for the puppy. 

In this case, the breeder should have disclosed it. Even if the breeder felt that the hernia wasn't large enough to cause any medical issues.


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