# Guard Dog in the making...



## Sherman the German

He's almost 6 months old and Sherman loves to look out the windows and guard his domain! :laugh: He sits as if to just "check things out." If he sees someone, he'll do his "alert" bark... that deep bark that says, "mom/dad come check this out." I LOVE it! 

I take it this is normal GSD behavior.


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## DaniFani

eh, at 6 months it's not really guarding. It's usually prey, excitement, or "I"m scared of that, come and scare it away or I'll try to with my bark." I work on being quiet in the house. I hate nuisance barking, and barking at any little thing that goes by I consider nuisance barking. Besides, I think the "GSD stare" is much more intimidating .


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## Stonevintage

Mine is a little over 1.5 years old. This morning 5:00 am she woke me up with her first deep long low growl. She was standing in my bedroom doorway facing out toward the living room. I got up very quietly and stood behind her. She walked over to one of the windows and barked two or three times really deep. 

The little night light in that room had burned out and she was alerting to a small tree shadow moving in the wind. Full moon so it made a big scary moving shadow. Pheww! Gooood Girl Summer!


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## Sherman the German

Dani: I was joking... Ha Ha. I know it's not really guarding. That's why I titled it with guard dog in the making.  Luckily for me we don't have too many people go by so it's not a nuisance at all. It lets me know there is someone behind my house on the path back there. I love it. 

The funny thing is that when he's in the back yard and someone goes by back there he doesn't bark at all. He just stops what he is doing and stares/watches them. It's only when he's in the house that he gives me that deep bark if someone is back there. 

Stone: Good girl! Doing her job protecting her Mama.  I bet you were a little frightening though until you found out what it was.


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## Stonevintage

Ha!, yea - it was a pretty interesting way to wake up It is important though IMO even though at 6 mos it is more alerting than anything that you work with it and decide what you want and don't want in that behavior. 

I had to tone mine up a little because she was making such good buddies with every bum that walked down the alley Now she "watches" but no bark unless it's after dark - then I let her "move them along". 

The one thing I've been working on for months is when she alerts to get her to be quite, stay with me and "listen" with me. That means by my side and we are very quiet, then I will release her and let her go to the door or wherever and bark for a few seconds. She used to just lose her head and run around the house barking at air and I had zero control. 

I'm picturing if any boogy men did come into the yard - Summer and I would exit stage left out the door furthest away from the noise. So, I want her by my side. The way I'm trying to silent train this is by placing 2 fingers on her neck. That means stay alert but quiet and follow me. We do "drills" I'll go thru the house and pause and "listen", maybe look out a window or two. She's getting good at it. Sometimes she'll let the tiniest little woof out and I'l put the two fingers on her neck to quiet her. Of course, who knows what would happen in a real situation. At least it's not such a chicken little scene now


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## Sherman the German

Thank you StoneV for the advice. I love the 2 fingers on the neck to get her to be quiet and listen by your side. So, if I want to practice that with Sherman... what should I do first? In other words, how did you begin to train that? Is this something that I could practice/do at his age? Sorry, I am asking so many questions; I'm just intrigued/interested by this and would love to teach Sherman!


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## Stonevintage

Well, it started with her. When we go to bed at night and I read - things are very quiet - she listens and hears stuff going on all around the neighborhood. I started with "who's that" and tilt my head and listen too and she would bark and I would say good girl (I initially had to bark to show her, then she got it). That routine got to be a habit. Then when she would hear something, I would put my hand on her neck and hold it there and say stay, "it's ok - hush" and she would. (that took a while). 

From then on, it was a game, when she alerts her head snaps up and she looks at me to make sure I'm hearing it too (I stop reading and tilt my head to show intense interest in the sound) - lol must look like an idiot and she looks to me for which way to respond. I can say "who's that" and she will go into full barks right at the window or I can put my fingers on her neck and say "listen" and she will stay quiet but still be on alert. Later on I just expanded this out to have her follow me thru the house as I made the rounds "checking". That's when I ended up using the two fingers on her neck (as we are moving thru the house) to keep her quiet.

I always "release" her with lots of good girl and scratches.


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## Sherman the German

Awe thanks! We are on the right track for that then. When we hear something we say something similar to you, we say: "what is it." We say it in a strange, whisper voice ~ hard to explain and like you, we must sound like an idiot. :laugh::wild: He will tilt his head and sometimes go to investigate, sometimes he'll let out a bark or two. I'm going to work on the bark and then quiet fingers. Thanks Stone. I love it. Great idea to teach them not only to listen to your commands but to remain calm and receptive for your next command (impulse control).


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## carmspack

Sherman the German said:


> Dani: I was joking... Ha Ha. I know it's not really guarding. That's why I titled it with guard dog in the making.  Luckily for me we don't have too many people go by so it's not a nuisance at all. It lets me know there is someone behind my house on the path back there. I love it.
> 
> The funny thing is that when he's in the back yard and someone goes by back there he doesn't bark at all. He just stops what he is doing and stares/watches them. It's only when he's in the house that he gives me that deep bark if someone is back there.
> 
> Stone: Good girl! Doing her job protecting her Mama.  I bet you were a little frightening though until you found out what it was.


yeah , well , this does not sound like you were joking. 

Quote:
(He's almost 6 months old and Sherman loves to look out the windows and guard his domain! :laugh: He sits as if to just "check things out." If he sees someone, he'll do his "alert" bark... that deep bark that says, "mom/dad come check this out." I LOVE it! 

I take it this is normal GSD behavior.)


You want to stop that behaviour otherwise it will develop into a problem.

Looks like the dog is lofting a little in the hackles.


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## Stonevintage

Yea, when my pup was that young, she never acted like that. I did teach her to "speak" but did stop her when she barked at anybody in the yard until she was about 14 mos old. Then I only allowed her to bark at night if somebody was in the alley. She's 19 mos old now and I'm being very careful with this. 

Your pup is maybe the equivalent of a young child and mine a teenager. It would be very hard to reverse an aggressive issue with such a young pup.


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## Sherman the German

carmspack said:


> yeah , well , this does not sound like you were joking.
> 
> You want to stop that behaviour otherwise it will develop into a problem.
> 
> Looks like the dog is lofting a little in the hackles.


carm: I put a silly title AND a laughing emoji after the sentence. I know that tone, intonation and expression do not convey in forums such as this but I was just being silly. I know he's not actually guarding... he's a puppy. Tough crowd! :crazy:. 

As I stated earlier, I want him to let me know when someone is behind my house so nah, I'm not going to "stop" the behavior. I am going to work on what StoneV did with her dog. Its not like he sits at the window *all* day and watches but when he does go I find it interesting and almost always there is someone back there. As far as "hackles," he's a puppy and from what I read and been taught by my trainer a leaf blowing can raise them up.


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## Sherman the German

Stonevintage said:


> Yea, when my pup was that young, she never acted like that. I did teach her to "speak" but did stop her when she barked at anybody in the yard until she was about 14 mos old. Then I only allowed her to bark at night if somebody was in the alley. She's 19 mos old now and I'm being very careful with this.
> 
> Your pup is maybe the equivalent of a young child and mine a teenager. It would be very hard to reverse an aggressive issue with such a young pup.


Yeah, if he was acting like a wild man and barking like a loon, I'd be nipping that in the "bud" right away. He's not being aggressive. He will let out a deep bark if he sees someone. My trainer told me that is his way of saying, "hey, I'm unsure of this come check this out." Trainer says you should go investigate as it reassures him. That's where I think that the 2 finger training will come in handy. You are responding to his "call" of concern but also telling him to be quiet while you both listen.


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## Stonevintage

I get it. Last week I had a couple of tree surgeons in front of my house. I pulled back the curtain so Summer could watch. At first she barked. I told her it was ok and they were good and there to help. 

She spent the next half hour at the window watching the goings on. (another good learning opportunity for her.) She barked when the guy went up in the bucket lift but I just told her "it's ok" and "hush" and she settled right down. 

I think your trainer is right about going to investigate to reassure them. A bark is after all nothing more than communication. If we ignored or simply stifled repeated communication, we would be sending a message that their concern/question and decision how to react will have to be resolved by them. With most likely a less than desirable outcome.


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## Sherman the German

Thanks, Stone.  Sherman sometimes watches things going on too. When our front door is open (we have a storm door) and he can see out he will sometimes go have a look. If someone goes by, he may or may not give a quick bark (not sure what causes him to do it sometimes and not always) and then he'll often come to find us. When he does we go with him and we say, "show me." Then, we tell him the same thing... "it's ok." He's still a pup and has a LOT to learn but we think that consistent training this way will help it not become nuisance barking or lead to aggressive dominance in the house. 

Side note: I started the 2 finger quiet training today!  He did his low, deep bark and I went and said, "what is it" and placed two fingers on his neck as I said, "shhh." He did bark again after a few seconds but I said, shhh again keeping my fingers there. When he quieted, I said, "yes." I think starting it with the verbal (shhh) and then hand gesture (fingers) simultaneously may be the right technique for us. He already does several commands with just hand gestures and no verbal... lots of practice. Thanks again for your idea. :wub:


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## wolfy dog

Most likely he is insecure if he barks at "stuff" at this age and you need to get him more flexible by exposing him to various situations while working with him at the same time. I would not let him practice this behavior. You may find it funny and joke about it but a barking 6 month old could be a problem in the make (think fear aggression). Stable , socialized dogs bark at a much later age. Deja not before she was about 18 months. She was alert, when the bell rang but looked at me for guidance. Now she will bark but quiets when I tell her "It's OK".
So get to work: as soon as you see that he sees something that might worry him (his first cue could be hackles up, an intense stare, muzzle puffing up etc., I would redirect him by happily calling his name, then start with training, play or treats to make him more secure about whatever worries him.


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## Sherman the German

Thank you Wolfy dog for your advice... I have not heard of puppies not barking until they are much older and if they do they are unstable. Hmmm? I get that he is unsure as that's what my trainer told me he is doing if he does bark ~ that is, he wants me to check it out. I always do, if he barks and I reassure him that it is ok. 

He gets tons of socialization... obedience class, parks/trails, our neighborhood, the boardwalk, and my husband's work (military base), etc. He gets along well with both people and other dogs. It's just that sometimes he will alert up if he sees someone or another dog out of our windows. He doesn't even do it all the time (not sure why he does sometimes). So, you are saying that as a puppy he should NEVER bark or do that growl? Just trying to understand as I've never heard that before. 

I wish I would have never posted the pics or started this thread. I was just kidding around about him being a guard dog in the making and I took the pic of him staring out the window. I thought it was cute and funny ~ still do.


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## Waldi

Stonevintage said:


> Mine is a little over 1.5 years old. This morning 5:00 am she woke me up with her first deep long low growl. She was standing in my bedroom doorway facing out toward the living room. I got up very quietly and stood behind her. She walked over to one of the windows and barked two or three times really deep.
> 
> The little night light in that room had burned out and she was alerting to a small tree shadow moving in the wind. Full moon so it made a big scary moving shadow. Pheww! Gooood Girl Summer!


well, at 2:20 AM my girl started "alerting" us to the point that I was ready to "kill her" but after looking outside in the direction she was pointing I noticed large coyote 20 yards out, so had to tell her she was "goo" and took her to our bedromm to stop from "guard" duty rest of the night.


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## wolfy dog

Of course puppies bark, no puppy is completely silent. But it is his general response to everything out there at this age and his behavior because of it, that made me think this. Again, this is the internet and it is always a guess if you don't see it in person.


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## carmspack

agree with the above comments made by Woolfy.

Sherman said "He gets tons of socialization... obedience class, parks/trails, our neighborhood, the boardwalk, and my husband's work (military base), etc. He gets along well with both people and other dogs. It's just that sometimes he will alert up if he sees someone or another dog out of our windows."

Socialization continues IN the home , which is probably where the majority of the dog's life will be spent .

Whatever you want your dog to be as an adult needs to be guided now, during this formative time frame .


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## Jenny720

If your pup is barking at everything or anyone and seems to be problematic then there is an issue. I think pups also need to find their voice. The pup is finding about their heighten senses -yes they all need guidance but alerting you to whats outside i think not abnormal. We did have a german shepherd that would stare and never barked he would loom down the stairs of whomever was at the door. He was hard not to miss. He would be ready to go i felt he did not want to waste his energy in barking. Whomever was invited in he would go lie down always to the same spot. Otherwise he would just watch and wait. I do have no doubt this dog was all action but it would of been nice if he barked sometimes -not that i would ever complain about his guarding capabilities. Max our shepherd now has a bark is deep and off putting enough and would let whom ever is lurking outside think twice before attempting to come in. Last week we heard max barking in the middle of the night it. He has a deep deep bark but this was even deeper. My husband checked it out and saw max standing in the foyer looking at the front door. It was the kind of bark you knew there was something out there. What or whom ever it was i hope they dont come back. It was definately was different then a feral cat or animal on the porch. At first my husband thought not much of it but then he could not go to sleep after that. We do not let him bark at passer by but things that go thump in the night -go for it!


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## Sherman the German

Jenny, I bet that was scary especially if that's not something that he usually does. When it's late at night like that you want a guard dog for sure with that deep bark. If there was someone out there, I bet they WON'T be back! I'm with ya... I don't want my dog barking at every one who passes by. I'm still trying to figure out why he will bark sometimes with that deep bark but most of the time just look out the window. I do not mind when he does bark though. I just go take a look and reassure him. 

Carm, Yeah, I get what you are saying about them being a certain way as an adult. Sherman will be exactly how we want him to be as we are putting so much time into him now during these young years. Everyone has their own way.


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## wolfy dog

Sherman the German said:


> Sherman will be exactly how we want him to be as we are putting so much time into him now during these young years. Everyone has their own way.


I have never dared to make a statement like that. Let's see in a year from now.


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## MineAreWorkingline

Sherman the German said:


> Jenny, I bet that was scary especially if that's not something that he usually does. When it's late at night like that you want a guard dog for sure with that deep bark. If there was someone out there, I bet they WON'T be back! I'm with ya... I don't want my dog barking at every one who passes by. I'm still trying to figure out why he will bark sometimes with that deep bark but most of the time just look out the window. I do not mind when he does bark though. I just go take a look and reassure him.
> 
> Carm, Yeah, I get what you are saying about them being a certain way as an adult. *Sherman will be exactly how we want him to be as we are putting so much time into him now during these young years. Everyone has their own way. *


I can really respect this. You know what you want your dog to do, and you stood your ground despite what other people were telling you they would have the dog do if it were there dog. Now, this is not to disrespect those that gave you input concerning problems that may appear down the road doing what you are doing and the way you are doing it, but it is so seldom that you see somebody come on here and say but "I want my dog to do that" or "I don't want my dog to do that".

Hats off to you!


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## Sherman the German

wolfy dog... well, I guess the word "exactly" may have not been the appropriate word. LOL. :laugh:


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## Sherman the German

MineAreWorkingline said:


> I can really respect this. You know what you want your dog to do, and you stood your ground despite what other people were telling you they would have the dog do if it were there dog. Now, this is not to disrespect those that gave you input concerning problems that may appear down the road doing what you are doing and the way you are doing it, but it is so seldom that you see somebody come on here and say but "I want my dog to do that" or "I don't want my dog to do that".
> 
> Hats off to you!


Thank you for the kudos. I really do respect this forum and ALL of the experience. This post didn't go as I intended. I meant it to be lighthearted and cute... I wasn't looking for anyone telling me how to train my GSD and that I was going to have potential problems. So, it caught me off guard but I did feel compelled to stand my ground as I know what we are doing here to train Sherman to be the best that we can and for our own needs. Thanks again for seeing and respecting that!


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## Thecowboysgirl

My 7 month old pup is pretty barky lately. Random noises in the home. Last week at group class everyone left and I was talking to the trainer. I man walked in and leaned in the doorway. Pup went over and I saw the guy make some strange movement with his leg the pup didn't like and he retreated and barked.

I just said no, you don't need to act like that, I don't want to be too punitive because really, the kid's feeling insecure. But I let him know I didn't want him to do that.

When he barks in the house I shut him down as firmly as I can.

He barked at an old dog at the vet today, seemed like just a silly bored puppy on prednisone to me. I body blocked him and told him to stop and he did.

My older shepherds bark a lot in the yard, often just to hear their own voices I swear. Neither is fearful or aggressive, they just do it for fun. But they don't bark in the house unless there is really something to bark about. I still think the pup is somewhat getting it from the older dogs.

So I agree in not letting the youngsters go nuts barking....

But I am curious how others discourage it?


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## Stonevintage

Sherman the German said:


> Thank you for the kudos. I really do respect this forum and ALL of the experience. This post didn't go as I intended. I meant it to be lighthearted and cute... I wasn't looking for anyone telling me how to train my GSD and that I was going to have potential problems. So, it caught me off guard but I did feel compelled to stand my ground as I know what we are doing here to train Sherman to be the best that we can and for our own needs. Thanks again for seeing and respecting that!


I know what you mean. It's good that you hung in there and kept at it while remaining firm with your decision. There is some really great help here - just need to build up a few mental calluses to the mind flossing that you can feel sometimes. I like to call it "Trumping" just to stay up with current events. 

In the way of a very small excuse..... just to let you know.... there were several back to back posts last month. All involved young GSD's that had a few things in common. They were a little too nippy, a little too barky, growly and "maybe" aggressive. Their owners came here for last chance advise. Their dogs are no longer with them and in all probability no longer alive. Shocked me but is nothing new to the old timers here. 

A couple were rescues where no real background was known about the pup. Brought in to households with single parent with no previous GSD experience and very young children. Because we go through this with OP's and because we know that most of the problem is the inability or unwillingness to get any help, these dogs end up in a shelter and ultimately many are put to sleep. 

These are the thoughts that run thru some of our our minds when certain questions come up. These are just posts and no one can judge an OP, but - too many people just throw their hands up and dump the dog when the problems the dog developed over time and were almost preventable. It's just sad and we are pretty much a group of very avid GSD fans.


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## Sherman the German

Thecowboysgirl said:


> My 7 month old pup is pretty barky lately. Random noises in the home. Last week at group class everyone left and I was talking to the trainer. I man walked in and leaned in the doorway. Pup went over and I saw the guy make some strange movement with his leg the pup didn't like and he retreated and barked.
> 
> I just said no, you don't need to act like that, I don't want to be too punitive because really, the kid's feeling insecure. But I let him know I didn't want him to do that.
> 
> When he barks in the house I shut him down as firmly as I can.
> 
> He barked at an old dog at the vet today, seemed like just a silly bored puppy on prednisone to me. I body blocked him and told him to stop and he did.
> 
> My older shepherds bark a lot in the yard, often just to hear their own voices I swear. Neither is fearful or aggressive, they just do it for fun. But they don't bark in the house unless there is really something to bark about. I still think the pup is somewhat getting it from the older dogs.
> 
> So I agree in not letting the youngsters go nuts barking....
> 
> But I am curious how others discourage it?


I think you are doing what is right for you. You aren't letting them go crazy like loons barking and jumping. I do something similar if Sherman lets out a bark. I will usually go check it out on the first bark to reassure him. If he does it again, I'll use a firm no, or say "it's ok." I'll call him to me. That seems to work. I'm with you... I think he is just finding his "voice" kind of like yours barking just to hear themselves. It's my job to teach him when to use it.  I, too, am curious how others would discourage a puppy from barking other than the firm no or reassurance by checking it out for them.


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## Sherman the German

Stonevintage said:


> I know what you mean. It's good that you hung in there and kept at it while remaining firm with your decision. There is some really great help here - just need to build up a few mental calluses to the mind flossing that you can feel sometimes. I like to call it "Trumping" just to stay up with current events.
> 
> In the way of a very small excuse..... just to let you know.... there were several back to back posts last month. All involved young GSD's that had a few things in common. They were a little too nippy, a little too barky, growly and "maybe" aggressive. Their owners came here for last chance advise. Their dogs are no longer with them and in all probability no longer alive. Shocked me but is nothing new to the old timers here.


Love the "Trumping" analogy.  Yeah, I had to build up a mental callous really quickly with this post. Thank you for letting me know why it may have come across in a negative way to people who have been here for awhile. I certainly didn't mean for it to go that way but I can see why now. 

Rest assured everyone... Sherman isn't going anywhere. He pulls at my heartstrings everyday (hubby's too). We love that boy and he's in good hands. We have been researching and asking questions to both breeders and owners for years before bringing him home. He was even named for about 3 years before we even got him.


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## Steve Strom

I like to Cruz in and comment here and there, but trying to helpful, not give anyone a hard time or trump anyone.


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## Sherman the German

Steve Strom said:


> I like to Cruz in and comment here and there, but trying to helpful, not give anyone a hard time or trump anyone.


Love it! Thanks for the chuckle.  You should have capitalized trump! Ha Ha. :laugh:


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## Steve Strom

Sherman the German said:


> Love it! Thanks for the chuckle.  You should have capitalized trump! Ha Ha. :laugh:


Ok. Trump How's that?


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## Sherman the German

Nice and almost invisible... is that what you were going for?


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