# Schutzhund Training Evaluation



## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I have contacted someone today about an evaluation for my dog to see if she can do this. They are going to evaluate her, but I would like to know what they should do as part of the evaluation and what questions I can ask. I do know that during my conversation with them they said that they do tracking, bite work and obedience...the obedience comes in later and the tracking can be done every 3-4 weeks and the bite work will be done weekly. Does this sound like a good schedule? I did inform them that she has already had quite a bit of obedience training and they said that during the obedience training we in sense train them not to bite and some dogs come out of this and some don't..is that true? I have spent the last 7 months training my dog not to bite and now I am training her to do so...I know its on command but I can't help but to think that I'm confusing her. Also, what equipment will I need to purchase? What are the costs involved with that? They have invited both of us to come and watch the training which is done one on one, so no other dogs are allowed in the field when another dog is working. I do plan on making a couple visits along with the evaluation.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

Different clubs do things differently Most likely they will bring the dog on the field See how she is around you/others Have you play with her and maybe begin some obedience -I think what they mean about the obedience -is that some believe that too much obedience reduces drive -You should ask what ever questions that you have


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

holland said:


> Different clubs do things differently Most likely they will bring the dog on the field See how she is around you/others Have you play with her and maybe begin some obedience -I think what they mean about the obedience -is that some believe that too much obedience reduces drive -You should ask what ever questions that you have


Great she'll kiss them to death


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

holland said:


> Different clubs do things differently Most likely they will bring the dog on the field See how she is around you/others Have you play with her and maybe begin some obedience -I think what they mean about the obedience -is that some believe that too much obedience reduces drive -You should ask what ever questions that you have


I'll be honest here, I don't have a clue about this kind of training and stayed away from it until now, but I want my dog to be happy and I love working with her. What are some signs that a dog might do well with this training? I really don't know what questions to ask But I'm willing to learn and usually when I take on something I finish it


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## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

They will probably flick a rag in front of her to test her prey drive. They will ask you to hold her back and build some frustration to see what she does. 
They will ask you what you have done with her, any accomplishments, previous training, experience with other training activities. 

They will probably discuss the amount of time and investment this sport is. Will describe a lot about the history and why's and because's. 
Keep in mind about 70% of the people who show up at a club never come back because they don't want to invest the time. Some will even say they will stick with it and go for a couple of weeks, even months before giving up. 

This makes for a slight attitude in clubs that I've noticed with newbies. They don't attach themselves or help as much because they're burned out with all the people they help who just leave. Don't be offended its nothing against you directly.

Don't correct your dog for barking at other people working their dogs, in the beginning this big of an interest is a good thing. If you plan on doing Schutzhund you can quiet the dog down later. But the more control and obedience you apply on your dog in this situation the less likely they will be to express themselves and enjoy the game and evaluation and want to try and work.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

4TheDawgies said:


> They will probably flick a rag in front of her to test her prey drive. They will ask you to hold her back and build some frustration to see what she does.
> They will ask you what you have done with her, any accomplishments, previous training, experience with other training activities.
> 
> They will probably discuss the amount of time and investment this sport is. Will describe a lot about the history and why's and because's.
> ...


I can understand all of this. So I won't be confusing my dog when she does stuff that I normally would not allow....I won't confuse her? I can almost bet she will be excited and she will bark. She got very excited doing a small agility course. Is it possible to have a dog do this training and do agility too? Or is it usually one or the other?


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I plan on getting her hips tested when she is a year, just for my own knowledge and because originally I was going to get her into agility at about a year old. Is it okay to do this training with her before I do the testing? I don't want her to hurt herself or make anything that might be wrong worse.


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## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

llombardo said:


> I can understand all of this. So I won't be confusing my dog when she does stuff that I normally would not allow....I won't confuse her? I can almost bet she will be excited and she will bark. She got very excited doing a small agility course. Is it possible to have a dog do this training and do agility too? Or is it usually one or the other?


Absolutely not! 

All of my dogs are pets and companions, travel everywhere with me, play on agility equipment, play with young children, hang out at the retail store I work at, show, herd, assist me with training etc.

I don't actively compete in anything else (just too busy), but many of the members of the Schutzhund clubs I attend and have been to, also dabble in other sports including agility. 

This will be a very different environment than the ones she is normally in and she will recognize the difference. The only time she will be confused is if you are not consistent and create a grey area. Don't question yourself on telling her no outside of the field if she does something you don't like. Don't be harsh on her and shut her down, but don't be afraid to use discipline with her. 
A dog without discipline makes a roudy bully of a dog with too much confidence, lack of self control, and lack of respect for the handler.


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## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

llombardo said:


> I plan on getting her hips tested when she is a year, just for my own knowledge and because originally I was going to get her into agility at about a year old. Is it okay to do this training with her before I do the testing? I don't want her to hurt herself or make anything that might be wrong worse.


You won't be doing enough high impact training in the beginning stages of Schutzhund anyways. So playing with her at the club for a while until you test her should he fine. Unless she's walking around with a limp and appears to be in pain.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I'm excited to see if she will do well in the evaluation. I'm sure it will be an experience If all else fails at least I know she likes and can do agility


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## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

Even if she can't do protection you can still do tracking and obedience. Which are both fantastic learning experiences! Tracking is so fascinating to learn and put that nose you hear all about, to work. 
The obedience is awesome IMO. Learning how to not only teach your dog obedience, but to have them do it in drive. To learn how to work a dog in drive is like going from a golf cart to a car, even a race car if you have the right dog. It's very exhilarating and I can't get enough of obedience because of it now. The way it teaches you engagement in dog training makes the possibilities endless. You can take what you learned there and apply it anywhere. The possibilities are endless. 

Good luck! I look forward to hearing how it goes for you!


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

Right now, all I'm doing is obedience since I don't have the Club and money to go to weekly protection training. It's just too far away and too expensive in our part of the woods. 

The obedience however, is pretty much playing a huge role in Schutzhund and it does transfer into protection. So even if you can't do protection, the first thing your next dog will learn (if you stick to it, get hooked and a dog for that later on down the road) is obedience and it will be so much easier for you to get into the protection part. 

sometimes it's not a bad thing to learn the ropes on one thing before you move to another and Schutzhund Competition Obedience is much different from what I've seen in AKC style Obedience here in town.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

She really excelled in her previous obedience classes and she loves to learn. I adore her and want to spend as much time with her as possible. I'm guessing the bonding that goes with this training is strong. I think she would do well in tracking, when we go for walks she has her nose to the ground quite a bit, especially in an area where their is wildlife and I always assumed that she smelled the ducks and geese. Does anyone know what equipment I will need? What is the average cost to purchase everything that I will need?


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Mrs.K said:


> Right now, all I'm doing is obedience since I don't have the Club and money to go to weekly protection training. It's just too far away and too expensive in our part of the woods.


What is the average price of this training? If I do all three sessions in one day(bite work, tracking, and obedience) it comes to $60.00 a week. I won't necessarily do all three every week. Is that the average price, too expensive, or on the lower end?


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

llombardo said:


> What is the average price of this training? If I do all three sessions in one day(bite work, tracking, and obedience) it comes to $60.00 a week. I won't necessarily do all three every week. Is that the average price, too expensive, or on the lower end?


It really depends on the Club. Each Club has it's own price. 

The closest Schutzhund Club to me charges 700 Dollars a year and right now they don't have a helper. You pay for the helper once he's there on top of that. 

My personal lessons are 80 Dollars for an hour. The other Club, which is four-five hours away charges 400 Dollars a year. 

The closest Club is a Ringsport Club that also does SchH work. They charge five dollars per session. That club is only one and a half hour away. 

On top of that goes time and gas and in our current situation I'm actually trying to build an Obedience Training Group right here in Watertown. We can use State Land right opposite the place I'm working. Today we meet for the first time and I'm hoping to get them more into the drivier and competition style obedience. Just having people to train with and to meet regularly makes a huge difference instead of constantly working on your own and I'm sick and tired to drive all those distances, which is why I'm hoping to get something started out here.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Mrs.K said:


> It really depends on the Club. Each Club has it's own price.
> 
> The closest Schutzhund Club to me charges 700 Dollars a year and right now they don't have a helper. You pay for the helper once he's there on top of that.
> 
> ...



Are these prices strictly for bite work or do they include tracking and obedience too?


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

llombardo said:


> Are these prices strictly for bite work or do they include tracking and obedience too?


They are for all three phases. However, with one Club, you pay for the protection when they bring the helper out since they don't have a helper. 

Ask these questions once your dog gets evaluated. I think NY is actually one of the more expensive places when it comes up to Schutzhund. 

I know a Club in Florida that only charges 250 Dollars per year for all three phases and other members on this forum who do it don't pay close to any of the prices we pay up here. It is why I don't have a club. I refuse to pay that much money and go bankrupt over a sport. Just can't afford it up here in NY.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Mrs.K said:


> They are for all three phases. However, with one Club, you pay for the protection when they bring the helper out since they don't have a helper.
> 
> Ask these questions once your dog gets evaluated. I think NY is actually one of the more expensive places when it comes up to Schutzhund.
> 
> I know a Club in Florida that only charges 250 Dollars per year for all three phases and other members who do it don't pay close to any of the prices we pay up here.


I'm thinking that I'll be paying $3000.00 or close to it a year, if I go this route and do all three every week. I don't think the place I'm looking at has a membership yearly price. Its per session kinda thing. Maybe I should keep looking? There aren't too many around me either


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

llombardo said:


> I'm thinking that I'll be paying $3000.00 or close to it a year, if I go this route and do all three every week. I don't think the place I'm looking at has a membership yearly price. Its per session kinda thing. Maybe I should keep looking? There aren't too many around me either


That is very expensive. Ask them if they have a yearly club membership instead of you having to pay for each session. 

They might want to see some commitment first before you get the club membership. It's one of the things I can't give a Club. I can't commit to a Club that is so **** far away. I know others can, I can't. Everybody has his own personal reasons why they can or can't do it. 

Just ask these questions. It sucks that Schutzhund Sport is so darn expensive over here. There is no reason why it should be THAT expensive. Not 3000 Dollars a year just for the training itself. That is ridiculous.


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## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

That might be a guest fee. If you become a member you would pay an annual fee. Depending on the skill of the members and experience it can range between $150-$300 on average. 
Some of the top clubs in the area pay their helpers for their work so their fees can be higher.
The guest fee at my club is $15 per visit.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Mrs.K said:


> That is very expensive. Ask them if they have a yearly club membership instead of you having to pay for each session.
> 
> They might want to see some commitment first before you get the club membership. It's one of the things I can't give a Club. I can't commit to a Club that is so **** far away. I know others can, I can't. Everybody has his own personal reasons why they can or can't do it.
> 
> Just ask these questions. It sucks that Schutzhund Sport is so darn expensive over here. There is no reason why it should be THAT expensive. Not 3000 Dollars a year just for the training itself. That is ridiculous.


They do not have a yearly membership..it is a pay as you go I've found another one that is about the same distance the other way, but its on a Tues, which means I would be cutting it very close getting there after work The second one I can become a member for a small yearly fee and training is discounted. They are asking $35.00(if a non member) for obedience/protection work every week, I don't know if the obedience includes tracking. Waiting on a call back from them. I prefer the Saturday training, is this the kind of sport that I have to do weekly or can it be every other week/once a month kind of thing? I'm not doing it to get into competitions or anything, just for fun.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

> the obedience comes in later and the tracking can be done every 3-4 weeks and the bite work will be done weekly


This is the opposite schedule from the places I've trained. Tracking and obedience are done often(every time we train we first do tracking then obedience) and protection depends on the age of the dog. 


> I prefer the Saturday training, is this the kind of sport that I have to do weekly or can it be every other week/once a month kind of thing? I'm not doing it to get into competitions or anything, just for fu


Just for fun is great, but most clubs want commitment from their members to have goals set(trials/titles) and getting together weekly at the least is normal. But also training/tracking during the week on your own is important. You won't gain any progress if you just go once a week and work with the club. 
Many clubs have to keep a cap on the member numbers and someone that is just part time may not be as welcome as someone who is committed to training and helping the club.
It does all depend on the group and the dog of course. 
And many of the pay to plays will just charge a session fee(10 sessions for x amount of $ as an example) and you can go as much or as little as you like.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I talked to the club that was my second choice(she talked to me for over an hour). This is the club that I brought her too one time for obedience and felt uncomfortable with the other dogs barking, lunging, and wearing muzzles. She told me to try that again this week(different dogs there all the time) and next week I can come and get her evaluated. They are much more reasonable and I wouldn't mind becoming a member of the club in general. I liked the atmosphere, not to happy with the dogs. The trainer is a young police officer with lots of experience. He won't push my dog or cause any problems...this I like. I explained that I would do this for fun and they are fine with that. I don't mind taking it further if my dog enjoys it. I'm still not sure she will do okay with it, but I will wait and see what they say. It was explained that most of the work will be up to me and I have no problems with working with my dog at home..we even get homework I don't know if it will be something I enjoy, but in general if I like something I stick with it. I might be in the wrong ball park all together, I might have a dog I could train for therapy. She is great with kids and she was very good/gentle with my mom. I'm going to try different things and see what she likes, even if she doesn't do well, at least I tried. I'm excited


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## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

I agree with Jane. Obedience IS the most important part about the Sport. Without Obedience you should not even start doing the protection phase. Work on Obedience first, start the tracking and then protection. I know everyone wants to rush protection because it's "coolest" part but without Obedience on the dog, you'll be stuck after a while.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Mrs.K said:


> I agree with Jane. Obedience IS the most important part about the Sport. Without Obedience you should not even start doing the protection phase. Work on Obedience first, start the tracking and then protection. I know everyone wants to rush protection because it's "coolest" part but without Obedience on the dog, you'll be stuck after a while.


I don't have a problem with this at all. I am doing what they tell me, did I just write that She has already gone through 3 levels of obedience and received her CGC. I know the obedience in this training is more intense and I have no problems moving forward. The obedience part is from 6:30-8 and the protection work is from 8-10. We are allowed to come in earlier(which will be difficult for me) so that we can do tracking. They will show us what to do and then we work the dogs on our own there and at home. They do hold group tracking meets every so often and are available at any time to answer questions. I'm positive they will guide me and if I have any questions I know I can get the answers here. The first step is to find out if she has what it takes. I'm not even sure what they are looking for. What I think are solid nerves might not be too solid to them. For example today we were outside and someone set off a M80 about 25 ft from her, but around the corner, she kinda jumped(so did I), then she immediately looked around and continued her business within a 5 second span. It didn't seem to phase her, but yet if I hang clothes on the door, she thinks they are bad and barks and backs up(until I show her it is just a shirt) She is still a puppy so I don't expect her to be perfect YET


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