# Backmassing... What is normal?



## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

I hope I get some response to this because it took me FOREVER to count
I went back 11 generations on one of my boys and counted the times certain dogs showed up on the pedigree.

Bernd/Bodo Lierberg: 17
Rolf/Rosel Osnabrucker Land: 24
Troll Ritterbach:13

Also dogs that I did not count but were seen multiple times:
Ali Granert
Axel von der Peltztierfarm
Marko Cellerland
Valet Busecker Schloss
Ex Riedstern

This is not a perfect count because there were several holes in the pedigree and to be honest... my eyes were getting tired!

I would like to know if this is pretty normal for most of our dogs?
In this example, what would you expect to see in this dog? Anything from looking at the backmassing?
What is your opinion on this amount of backmassing? Is it enough to make a difference?

Thanks!
Mary


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

OK guys... I thought surely someone else would start counting at least for comparison?
Mary


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

I have gone back and counted the Lierbergs in my dogs and I also look for what I consider a negative, Canto Wienerau. I haven't counted the rest of the dogs you mention.

Vala goes back on:
Bernd 24 times
Bodo 2 times
Dolf 1 time
Gin 1 time
No crosses to Canto

My current litter:
Bernd 47 times
Bodo 7 times
Gin 3 times
Dolf twice
Dix once
Fello once
Aro vom Worringer Reitweg (full brother) 3 times
Canto Wienerau 3 times


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## Andaka (Jun 29, 2003)

IMHO, backmassing is only significant in the first 7 generations. After that, it is too hard to say what kind of influence a dog has that appears even 10+ times out of 250+ ancestors positions in a 7 generation pedigree.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Yeah, but it is fun to look at on a cold, nasty, snowy day.


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

Does that mean you are going to look Lisa?
Mary


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

Ooops! Somehow missed your previous post!
That is a LOT of B Lierberg!! As a breeder, do you take much stock in this kind of thing before breeding?
I hear a lot abot the different groups our dogs come from, swabian, thuringian, etc. Do you know where the B Lierberg dogs fall?
Mary


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

I do like to see a lot of influence coming down from the Lierbergs. So, yes, I guess I do pay attention to it. I also like to trace the female lines back to their foundation. I try to keep a balance between the types as they are found in this day and age especially maintaining the strong work ethics through the females. This is how the breed was founded and maintained through most of its history. 

I would have to find my notes on the Lierbergs.


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