# crapping in the house



## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

i have a 3 year old female, and i cannot get her to stop crapping in my house. i work all day, and i come home on lunch and the dog just likes to crap when ever she pleases to. Its the same routine let her and my male out plenty of times, exercise, etc... I can leave for one hour and pow theres a gift, or while i sleep. Its not daily but enough to drive me crazy. ive done every thing i know except keep her in a create her whole life...... I paid way to much for her to be outside and that she can break out of anything.. your help is needed.


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## oranges81 (May 9, 2008)

You don't have to keep her in a crate her whole life. I'd treat her like a new puppy. 
Is she on a feeding schedule? If not, that would help.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

o ya, morning and evening, it has never changed. the only thing is where she goes, i stopped the basement she went up in the attic, i stopped that and now its on my rug in my living room. But if she breaks down the gate she will poop and pee down stairs and then my male will then pee on that. weird espically i have trained with alot of people and i cant get anything to work. but she can be inside for 12 hours and now problem, its when i do come home let them out and come back there it is, kinda like should left dad!!


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

how long have you had her? how long has she been doing this? is she spayed? what are the things you have already done ("everything i know except crate, etc.")? i'm wondering too if it's possibly a physical problem. just today on this board i read of a female who had a urinary tract infection, symptoms were pooping-related (who ever would have thought?). so first you'll have to rule out a physical/illness cause, then it would be time for a behaviorist (not to be confused with a trainer). glad you recognize that outside is not the answer. bet you will get lots of advice to utilize a crate tho. does she also have separation anxiety ("she can break out of anything"). so hey, welcome to the board. where are you in michigan?


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

you cannot have a contest of wills with these dogs, from reading your posts i feel like you are misinterpreting her behavior. these issues cannot be "trained" away. you have to find out what is causing the behavior. behavior being the key word.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Welcome from another in MI!! I hope you find a solution to this... The diet can play into how often one goes. My barely 4 month old only goes a couple times per day/raw fed. If your dog is eating fillers, then you'll get more waste. Waste of $$ too.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

ive tried to award like no other when i see her out side, not letting her see me pick it up, correct her with the nose to crap, to yelling at the top of my lungs. thats when its like several days in a row. and create her. 

she has been doing pretty much her whole life, i named her Karma thinking i am a good person and things should go good for me. opps mistake. She is a working dog, drive like no other that ive seen or work with, when i train my male. That another problem she doesnt settle down and its ball ball ball and ball. i think she forgets.

when i say break out of anything i mean it, she is something else so the separation anxiety is not being with my male.

I am in Bay city and thank you i look foward to on the board.


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

> Quote:correct her with the nose to crap


the only thing that's going to do is make your dog think you insane.

you need to catch her in the act. Say No, we don't do that firmly. Then you pick it up and take it outside where you deposit it where you want it and tell her 'Your Poop goes here!'


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

i have played around on how much i give her, but never the time since i leave to work at 8 and get home at 6. but every day come home for a hour to run them or let them out.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

i can tell you are becoming very frustrated with the situation. you've not said anything about whether you've had a thorough work-up at a good veterinary clinic.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

really, here is the funny thing catching her.. never have and probally wont. One dog perfect the other well dont need to say more...


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

work up at a veterinary clinic? please explain.


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

did you mention the problem at her last vet check up? sometimes there's a medical reason they do it. 

If she were my dog, she'd be in crated or in the kitchen when I'm not watching her. The smaller the space the better to cure the problem - they won't poop or pee where they might have to lay in it. If she has to smell it all; day, she might stop. 

Do you think maybe she's doing it for attention? Since the other dog is 'perfect', maybe she does this stuff to get some attention. Negative attention is still attention. 

Have you tried ignoring the piles infront of her, putting her outside while you clean it up? She's not going to understand it was wrong unless you catch her doing it.

They


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## Amaruq (Aug 29, 2001)

What have you used to clean the messes? If she started this from a puppy hood it has become a learned behavior. If the area in which she pooped previously have not been THOROUGHLY cleaned than the smell will remain. Keep in mind dogs have a MUCH better nose than humans so even if YOU can't smell it she probably can. If she has been doing this for three years and was never properly trained as a pup it will be harder for her to learn but not impossible. 

Rubbing her nose in it and yelling a the top of your lungs does absolutely nothing to "teach" a dog. I would also agree that she should have a full medical workup as it could be a medical issue and it could just be that she was never properly trained from the beginning.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

thats what i think its for attention, but heck the dog gets all the attention in the world she is there next to me with the ball to play.

I dont want to crate her, i never need to do that to any of my dogs. crate her all day that is, and i can use chains and ropes and she will be out of a metal/plastic crate within 15min. (no joke) 

i have tried to ignore them, and put her out side when i did and i am not going to catch her, cause when im around its play time.. not poop time..

The diet and vet thing i may try but i know i asked before but may not agreed and didnt do it.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

the cleaning thing that why i blow up sometimes and lose my temp heck i am a marine its not often but have tried it. **** she has my basement smelling like urine. That dog has been trianed but when she got older like after her second heat cycle is when she really started giving me trouble.. i worked her so good as a pup didnt do the mistakes like i did my male and he turn out great. but thanks maybe she has a issue in behavior, next ill call that dude on tv


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## Amaruq (Aug 29, 2001)

If the smells remain in the house that makes it an "acceptable" place to eliminate, in a dogs mind. Crate training might help but it sounds as if she has more issues than "just" eliminating in the house. 

If it started after her heat cycle I would definitely check to see if she has any medical issues.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

ok thanks. ya thats the first issue she has more lol....but i can work with those!! 

whats the best thing to clean with espically basement floors?


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## scannergirl (Feb 17, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: fidelis
> 
> I dont want to crate her, i never need to do that to any of my dogs.


But you say this is an issue you've not faced with any other dog. So why would you not look at options you haven't used before?
Maybe you have to do it with THIS dog, at least until you get this issue worked out. At the very least it would physically limit the area she can poop in and give you some measure of control.
Thinking about both her training and your frustration level here.
Good luck.


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

an enzyme cleaner like nature's miracle is what you need. NOthing with amonia in it becuase that smells like pee to a dog. No pinesol or anything like that.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

sorry to have to tell you this, there's nothing worse you could possibly do than loose your temper. i totally understand why you do, and from your first post here i could sense how really annoyed and frustrated and angry you are at this dog...but there is literally nothing worse you could do (short of physical harm and you're able to draw the line there, right?).

the first thing you must do if you truly want to get to the bottom of this and not just keep trying to "train" it out of her, is get her to a good competent veterinary clinic for a total, thorough examination, including bloodwork and whatever else anyone here on this thread (who has had similar problems), suggests. then you need to schedule a session with a behaviorist, not a trainer, to explore the issue of whether her behavior is "attention-seeking" or something else. thinking in terms of human-like emotional reasons for a dog's behavior is not really accurate. so many advances are being made in dog behavior, at first i thought oh, what hooey, a dog behaviorist...then i learned more and worked with one through a holistic vet and i completely changed my mind. ya gotta be willing to listen to them tho, it was hard for me to see what i was contributing to the problem.


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## gsdlove212 (Feb 3, 2006)

Here's a thought....if she is good when you first leave for work...and only goes after you return then leave again...maybe you could jsut use the crate for the second time you head to work until you get home?


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

> Quote:Its the same routine let her and my male out plenty of times, exercise, etc


Do you always let them out together? That may be the problem.

You let them out and she starts playing. Play play play ... and forgets to go. Then she comes back inside and suddenly ... "Oh, yeah - I gotta poop" and she does.

I would try taking her out - TAKING, not letting - and wait with her until she goes. Praise her and THEN let the male out so they can play.

I had a similar problem with a foster puppy - it was all about the play and would forget about the potty when outside.


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

> Quote:
> sorry to have to tell you this, there's nothing worse you could possibly do than loose your temper. i totally understand why you do, and from your first post here i could sense how really annoyed and frustrated and angry you are at this dog...but there is literally nothing worse you could do


Absolutely true. Here's why. Your dog is learning this lesson: My owner doesn't like my poop. My owner doesn't like it when I poop. 

So what does that mean? Your dog be afraid to let you see her poop. She will *not* defecate in front of you. She'll hold it, wait til you leave, THEN go. She may go in places that you're unlikely to find, like behind the draperies or in the basement. So you are actually setting your pup (and yourself) up for failure. You have to remain calm. The angrier you get, the worse you make it. 

I got a rescue that was terrified of any human seeing her potty. Sweetest dog ever, but it was a nightmare to housebreak her. Took me over a year. I'm sure that someone rubbed her nose in her excrement and yelled at her until she was terrified of anyone ever seeing her feces and urine. She would go into tiny dark corners, closets, etc and go. Be careful what you're doing. Don't do that to your dog or yourself. 



> Quote:
> You let them out and she starts playing. Play play play ... and forgets to go. Then she comes back inside and suddenly ... "Oh, yeah - I gotta poop" and she does.


Yup. I have a 13 month old that IS housebroken, and she does exactly this. When I let her out, she has a blast. She runs around, plays, etc. Then she comes in. All of a sudden, she zips to the back door and scratches at it. I better be quick because all of that play got her bowels moving. 

The other day, my husband was in the front room. I was in the back room. I came upon an "accident." I asked him if the dog had been at the door. Yes, he said, but she was just outside, so I figured she didn't need to go out again.







Oh, yes, she did. My pup is still rather young, and she's of a breed that doesn't housebreak quickly. So I keep a close eye on her. But my GSD would do this too. He'd go out and play, then come in, then stand by the door and look at me with a goofy face. "Uh, Mom?"









Your girl is still rather young, and housebreaking was never complete with her. I would basically start all over with her. Start with a vet work up. Then get your carpets professionally cleaned (your floors too wherever possible). Start crating her. Train her to use Potty Bells. http://www.howtodothings.com/pets-and-animals/a4691-how-to-potty-bell-train-your-puppy.html Watch her like a hawk when you're home. Any time she moves for the perimeter of a room, take her outside and do as Lauri suggests. 

Adult dogs can be housebroken, even adult dogs that have learned some bad habits. But it takes patience, consistency and calm. You can't do it with just one or two of those. You need all three. She will have accidents. Buy the 1.5 gallon container of Nature's Miracle and have some old towels nearby. Put your dog in another room and clean up calmly. 

You two can get through this. Assuming that there is no medical cause for this, you can get through this. You're a Marine. You know how to keep your composure to accomplish a long-term goal, and you clearly love your dog. I'm sure you can get through this. But no two dogs are alike. Stop comparing her to your other dog. Take a different approach. Get a crate, and let's get both of you on the path toward success.


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

Great post Lori!







I could not agree more. I too have had to housebreak adult dogs that other people had terrorized to the point that they were afraid to potty in front of humans. It is incredibly difficult! Whereas housebreaking normally is actually quite straightforward with your three ingredients. 

I do NOT think this dog is doing this for attention. One, I don't think dogs think like that but two, if she did it for attention - wouldn't she be doing it in front of you? The fact that you never see her do it says that she's misunderstood some of the rules of housebreaking. She's learned not to potty in front of you but not that she's not supposed to potty in the house. Two different things.









I suggest letting the dogs outside separately. Stand outside with her, no toys, no balls, wait for her to go and when she does tell her what a wonderful girl she is. If there's a pattern of going out, coming in, and then going to the bathroom experiment with letting her out, back in, and then immediately back out again. Again, LOTs of praise and approval when she goes where she's supposed to. She sounds like a smart dog and she'll get it, she just needs the right feedback.


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## meisha98 (Aug 27, 2008)

I have Lainey and Booker outside seperately before they are allowed to play together both first thing and last thing during the day for this very reason. Lainey is only eight months old and just wants to play with her new big brother. They play, he does his "stuff" but she doesn't always do hers. It takes a few extra minutes but time better spent avoiding an accident then cleaning one up- less frustrating too.


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

thanks well spoken, i will take new actions but must say i dont get that mad i am not that stupid!

Crate, unless its made of steel she is out. I put a 6x10 welded cage down stairs and out she comes, she is amazing but i laugh at that problem. I noticed today it maybe something that scares her. Today fireworks were going off and she will not go out! i only ask couple times and not force her, and when i let her out by her self she just stands at the door. She cannot be without Bohica. Today was a good day no mess, she will do this be good for weeks and then her we go agian.

I made a vet appt. thanks


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

other problem, she cant be with out him, she broke out of crate during a search and rescue training, then jump out of the truck and track us almost one mile to be next to him. The Instuctors were amazed at her ability which inturn she wont track with out him. One big family but thats a good problem.

i need all this advise to get me back on track since i havnt trained in awhile....thanks


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## fidelis (Jul 1, 2009)

i do let her see me award Bohica when i watch him, hopeing she is thinking hay if i do that maybe i get the same.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

3k9mom and pupresq...OUTSTANDING posts, hope it all helps fidelis!


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