# How to train for Constant Eye Contact during Heel? (And to hug my leg during heel?)



## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

Best ways to train constant eye contact during heels? 
*How did YOU train it?* I am sure there are million ways to get to it, wondering what different ways people have, to see if one works for Zelda an me.

I'm not looking to do competition with her. But training our heel can be frustrating. Right now she can ONLY have her kibble, and its not high value enough for outside or even inside training sessions. So it has to be through praise and also chest rubs for rewards. 

When she does a heel, she knows she has to stay next to me with her not going ahead of me.. HOWEVER, she still doesn't get that i want her to hug my leg. My timing must be off? She typical will walk with her head in front of her, sometimes looking away or sniffing things during heel, which i dont want. Also sometimes she will walk a couple feet away from me, same line. And if i move to the left she doesn't. (if that makes sense) I also have a loose leash walking which she can do everything, except put pressure on the leash. I never ask Heel for very long. 

I'm guessing the eye contact and hugging my leg might have something in common that i'm missing. 

I want a really good solid heel, full concentration on me. Because of her FA with strangers. For safety reasons.


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## joneser (Jun 9, 2014)

This is part of my issue too. :help:


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

You don't do either. You train them to look up at you but if you train them to look at your eyes they'll twist around you. They shoudl be looking at your shoulder. 

And you dont' want them on your leg touching it. Next to your leg. With her legs in line with yours.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

I would pay someone to just come to my house and train tyson. Last I checked you,
Started rewarding them for looking at you.
Then added a command in like "here" and then you rewarded them,
Then you dropped hot dogs out of your mouth while they sat infront of you, then you put them in a heel and started wkth the here command and dropping hotdogs. I have not done this yet but I will start at some point.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

Well i imagine it this way. When someone comes walking near. i put her into a heel, i look at her and she looks at me, concentrates on me. I can multitask, she doesn't have to worry about that. And if touching my leg gives her more incentive and understand i want her as close as possible ill take it. I just figured it would be easier for her in that way but i dont really know. But if i am not looking at her, makes sense to have her look at my shoulder as opposed to my eyes since i would looking straight ahead, i never thought of that part. 

But ya, Its not for competition, its for reality and everyday situations with a FA dog. 



What if you cannot use food rewards misslesleedavis? I know she loves her flirtpole. But she doesnt care for any other toy enough to work for it.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

I dont know. It took me hours of questions to find someone that would tell me the pointers. 
Tyson will not work for toy rewards, he will occasionally work for food rewards so its hard to find what drives him. I am not in the boat with focused heeling people yet. Tyson heals and he has nailed the "here" command. Other then that I am having trouble with him transitioning.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

misslesleedavis1 said:


> I dont know. It took me hours of questions to find someone that would tell me the pointers.
> Tyson will not work for toy rewards, he will occasionally work for food rewards so its hard to find what drives him. I am not in the boat with focused heeling people yet. Tyson heals and he has nailed the "here" command. Other then that I am having trouble with him transitioning.


Ah okay, well thanks for the input!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

When I'm doing the transport, I want that leg touch, but only then. I try to get the dog to do contact heeling only during that time, and there is no 'focus on me' but on the helper. 
It can be hard to train, but many dogs 'get it' and know they need to be in that place before they are rewarded(for us it is the helper coming into us for a nice bite)
Focus is a couple steps at a time, reward when the dogs looking at you and in position(food usually works best) I didn't push that on my dog til he was older and it was hard to get after the poor foundation I put on him. We ended up doing it with corrections...I bailed on him with a collar pop after I left him, he'd come into heel position with focus and get rewarded. I never corrected in the position, let him know the safe spot is right next to me, looking at me.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

onyx'girl said:


> *When I'm doing the transport, I want that leg touch, but only then. I try to get the dog to do contact heeling only during that time, and there is no 'focus on me' but on the helper. *
> It can be hard to train, but many dogs 'get it' and know they need to be in that place before they are rewarded(for us it is the helper coming into us for a nice bite)
> Focus is a couple steps at a time, reward when the dogs looking at you and in position(food usually works best) I didn't push that on my dog til he was older and it was hard to get after the poor foundation I put on him. *We ended up doing it with corrections...I bailed on him with a collar pop after I left him, he'd come into heel position with focus and get rewarded. I never corrected in the position, let him know the safe spot is right next to me, looking at me.*


Ah thanks for this onyxgirl. I can put that to use in our training, once i can bring treats back into the game, it will be a lot smoother for the reward part.


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## gsdlover91 (Jul 21, 2012)

My dog is far from being good at competition heeling... Yet he can focus on me and heel when i ask. I put a decent foundation on him of focusing on me in the stationary heel position and worked up from there.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

gsdlover91 said:


> My dog is far from being good at competition heeling... Yet he can focus on me and heel when i ask. I put a decent foundation on him of focusing on me in the stationary heel position and worked up from there.


Can you describe in further detail of what you mean by stationary heel?


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## Mister C (Jan 14, 2014)

VTGirlT said:


> ...training our heel can be frustrating. Right now she can ONLY have her kibble, and its not high value enough for outside or even inside training sessions. So it has to be through praise and also chest rubs for rewards.


Why not use toys? 

I'm no expert but I have been having more success getting Linus to focus heel with toys as compared with food. I started off using food rewards and still use them, particularly for better positioning, but he drives much harder and gives me much better focus with a toy.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

Mister C said:


> Why not use toys?
> 
> I'm no expert but I have been having more success getting Linus to focus heel with toys as compared with food. I started off using food rewards and still use them, particularly for better positioning, but he drives much harder and gives me much better focus with a toy.


I suppose if i got a flirt pole with a shorter stick it would be doable. I just try not to use her flirt pole very often, not the best for her hips! But the other toys she really couldnt care less for. I mean they are fun once in a while, she mainly likes to play the come and chase me game with toys or tug in the house on her own terms.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

If you don't have the book Control Unleashed I'd suggest you buy it. Many of the exercises in the book are for dogs with reactivity and they teach the dog to look to the handler for direction.
Not correcting the dog for the looking at the other dog(or whatever), but correcting for NOT doing a command when asked is the key. The dog learns to look to the handler when in doubt, instead of taking the 'control' of the situation.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

onyx'girl said:


> If you don't have the book Control Unleashed I'd suggest you buy it. Many of the exercises in the book are for dogs with reactivity and they teach the dog to look to the handler for direction.
> Not correcting the dog for the looking at the other dog(or whatever), but correcting for NOT doing a command when asked is the key. The dog learns to look to the handler when in doubt, instead of taking the 'control' of the situation.


Yes, i do believe i have that somewhere after someone referring me to it, probably with my other books i intend to read! (i never have been a reader of books..) lol

But i agree 100% that is what i want Zelda to do.  And thats what i tell her to keep myself in the right mind set. "It's no big deal, you don't even need to worry about it one bit."


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

VTGirlT said:


> Can you describe in further detail of what you mean by stationary heel?


Heel is a position. A stationary heel would be him in heel position while you're standing still.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

VTGirlT said:


> Yes, i do believe i have that somewhere after someone referring me to it, probably with my other books i intend to read! (i never have been a reader of books..) lol


No worries, she has DVDs too, which are supposed to be excellent. Clean Run: Control Unleashed: A Foundation Seminar 4-DVD Set


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Heel is a position. A stationary heel would be him in heel position while you're standing still.


High jacking here but how do i get my guy to walk with my after i have told him to heel, his heel looks like him sitting beside me looking at me but i cant get him to walk with me unless i say OK! then he is like "awesome" breaks eye contact and goes on his merry way.

Oh and i dont know what the heck happened to him in the past but he hates touching, so he always sits about a foot away from me, not nice and close.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Sorry, can't help you! I don't require an attention heel since my sports are flyball, dock diving, and as of this Saturday, hopefully lure racing. I have very specific criteria for a loose leash walk, but I'm okay with the dog only looking at me occasionally.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Heel is a position. A stationary heel would be him in heel position while you're standing still.


Thanks for this.



Cassidy's Mom said:


> No worries, she has DVDs too, which are supposed to be excellent. Clean Run: Control Unleashed: A Foundation Seminar 4-DVD Set


Ah sweet! A bit pricey, but i watch DVDs! I am much better hands on, but even better watching than reading something.. looks like i got something to add to my birthday list since people aren't creative anymore haha


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Heel is a position. A stationary heel would be him in heel position while you're standing still.



Yes!!! Heel should be taught without motion. It's not a movement it's a body position. Start in a area where she is comfortable. Your living room. When she is in proper position reward. Moving comes later, much later. Get her used to moving herself around you to stay in correct position.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

There's this set too: Clean Run: Control Unleashed: Game Demonstrations 3-DVD Set

A list of the games, and what problem each is used for: http://www.cleanrun.com/images/productfiles/CU Game Demos List.pdf


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

gsdsar said:


> Yes!!! Heel should be taught without motion. It's not a movement it's a body position. Start in a area where she is comfortable. Your living room. When she is in proper position reward. Moving comes later, much later. Get her used to moving herself around you to stay in correct position.


:crazy: I was taught by my trainer to teach her heel while in motion. And pull back on leash with tap until back in position. 
So i been doing it wrong all along! 
Do you think i can still use the word heel and start from the beginning stages?



Cassidy's Mom said:


> There's this set too: Clean Run: Control Unleashed: Game Demonstrations 3-DVD Set
> 
> A list of the games, and what problem each is used for: http://www.cleanrun.com/images/productfiles/CU Game Demos List.pdf


Sweet thanks for the resource the off and matt are things we have been working on pretty much already, would be cool to see how she does it too. This is exciting!


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

I think perhaps my trainer is not looking for the same heel i have in mind, and the heel that i think a lot of the people on this forums have in mind. I think its a sloppy heel. I want a crisp, 100% focus, reliable and tight heel. Because when i asked her about it, she basically told me what we were doing. And she thought it looked good when we went over and did it in a parking lot. 
So i am glad i asked now.
So starting the stationary heel i guess is where we will start!


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

A real short, cliff notes version VT, move her into a quick sit, YOU move into correct heel position next to her, hold the toy on the outside of your left shoulder with your right hand. Drop it to her while she's looking at it. Shape her head position like that. You need a certain amount of focus in that position before you start moving.


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## VTGirlT (May 23, 2013)

Steve Strom said:


> A real short, cliff notes version VT, move her into a quick sit, YOU move into correct heel position next to her, _*hold the toy on the outside of your left shoulder with your right hand.*_ *Drop it to her while she's looking at it.* Shape her head position like that. You need a certain amount of focus in that position before you start moving.


That would make sense. I am going to buy a shorter stick flirt pole, we can just use it as tug, i'm sure she will still have the drive for it. 

Thanks for this!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Or maybe get a ball on a string and tease her up with it....pop it under your arm. The stick may be cumbersome when you work her so close.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Yeah, a ball on a string would probably be an easy transition from the flirt pole. You stepping into correct position is an easy way to avoid teaching her incorrect position with a toy. Her finding heel position comes later.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

Before I got my 1 yo I would have thought I could tell you how to do this. We have focus for nano seconds - longer if I have the toy or anything to eat (and I had to build prey drive in this dog!! -a first for me) At least she still values kibble. Healing works but only with a handfull of kibble and the focus is on the hand with the kibble, not the face..... So - best of luck! That's all I got because this snot has shown me that _every dog is different_ and this one is way different...


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