# New puppy and the cats



## mistysms (Nov 19, 2014)

I'm just wondering what to do and how to go about dealing with the puppy and the cats. I have 2 cats and now 2 dogs. My lab mix loves the cats and my German Shepherd Puppy (almost 10 weeks old) seems to want to play with them. The cats are very used to dogs. What ends up happening is the cats will walk by and she will run over to them and start biting their necks. (it all really just seems playful) I normally let them go because she is only trying to play the cats normally lay their and take it but sometimes will sit up and slap at her a little (with out using claws) and then she will lay down and bark at them. What I have been trying to do is call her to me and have her sit and she gets a treat. Then do a 3-5 min training session. Is this a good idea? My BF thinks I'm rewarding her for being mean to the cats but I'm rewarding her for sitting. Does she understand that? The cats do have their own room that they can get way from her and it has everything they need food,water, toys and litter box. Am I doing things right or what else should I try? Thanks for the help


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## Mary Beth (Apr 17, 2010)

When I adopted a kitten, that first day, my husky kept trying to chase her. Suddenly before I could stop the dog, the kitten stopped, turned and scratched my husky's nose. End of games and that afternoon they were both curled up on the rug taking a nap together. Looking back, it was fortunate that it worked out. But if you are concerned, like I was when Sting was a puppy and I had a senior cat who was good with dogs but very gentle so I was afraid she would get hurt. So I kept Sting on a leash inside the house and would immediately stop any chasing and redirect him with his toy and praising him for taking the toy and biting it. So if you decide to redirect, I would suggest right at the beginning when she is starting not after she has made contact with the cats.


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## Casto (Jun 18, 2016)

My GSD Jupiter and Calico Cat Cosmo kennel up together... on command. It's a sight. All night long too. Crazy. I've never had any cat/dog pet issues but these 2 are best friends. It started out pawing and mouth play. Never a hard scratch from the kitten but she stands her ground. They are 2 weeks apart so it prolly helps the bond.


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## Bramble (Oct 23, 2011)

I would not be allowing any sort of kitty biting at this stage. All it will take is one good bite and shake once your puppy in larger, and they grow very fast, and a cat could be killed or badly injured. The training is a good idea, but I'd start before she goes after a cat not after. Work on rewarding her for ignoring a cat when it comes into the room vs allowing her to bite and bark until you call her away. You could be setting up a behavior chain of in order to be good and get attention she has to do something bad. Same concept as a dog that jumps on people, gets told to sit, then gets rewarded. Don't allow any unsupervised interaction with the cats until she has learned to interact appropriately, if she starts biting or barking removed her from the room or pop her into a crate or ex-pen for a few minutes so that she learns that behavior will not be allowed.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

mistysms said:


> she will run over to them and start biting their necks. (it all really just seems playful)


Right there ... is your problem. There is only rule in Cat v Dog relationships ... *The Dog/Puppy Never Chases The Cat!* There are lots of ways to get there. But it's a "puppy" so the easiest way to train "The Place Command." Indoors the puppy goes to "Place" the cats are free to engage if they chose to do so ... the puppy is free to move in "Place" but he is not free to leave it!

Keep a "drag leash" on the puppy indoors a short leash with no handle to get caught up on furniture. You use that to "guide" the puppy back to "Place" as required. 

"The Place Command" and other stuff are in this thread:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/7837361-post12.html

And I am not an expert ... but I have lived with up to five dogs and 18 cats for over 15 years and in all that time ... I have "NEVER" had a single Cat v Dog, "situation." The "Cats" are "Pack Members" and they are to be "Respected!" My dogs also "never" place a tooth on my ctas either ... so I'd put a stop to that crap also but ... "Place" is the first step.

Get a handle on this now ... and you won't have "issues" down the line. As always ask questions and Welcome aboard. 

Oh other Cat v Dog, stuff :
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/7410522-post2.html


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## Casto (Jun 18, 2016)

Chip18 said:


> Right there ... is your problem. There is only rule in Cat v Dog relationships.*[[/COLOR]*There are lots of ways to get there. But it's a "puppy" so the easiest way to train "The Place Command." Indoors the puppy goes to "Place" the cats are free to engage if they chose to do so ... the puppy is free to move in "Place" but he is not free to leave it!
> 
> Keep a "drag leash" on the puppy indoors a short leash with no handle to get caught up on furniture. You use that to "guide" the puppy back to "Place" as required.
> 
> ...


People need to use and understand the conept of a drag leash.... I see you always promoting it and you can see my dog with a drag leash in EVERY photo ive ever posted of him... lol He is going on 18 weeks.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Casto said:


> People need to use and understand the concept of a drag leash.... I see you always promoting it and you can see my dog with a drag leash in EVERY photo i've ever posted of him... lol He is going on 18 weeks.


Aw so your gonna make me "search" and look?? 

But yes ... hard lesson learned! Drag leash, Place and No Free Roaming especially, in multi dog households!! 

Those "policies" keep crap from happening ... hard lessons learned after the fact! My guy was 116 lbs of OS Wl GSD before he started acting a fool. Free Roaming, No Place, No Drag leash, No Crate and Dominate Male dog One and Dominate Male Dog Two = Stitches for me ... breaking up Dog Fights!!

It's a lot easier to get it "right" from the start! Heck I actually ... DE-Crate, my OS WL GSD!  

I'd never used one in the past ...why should I use one now ... now I "know!"

"School of hard knocks" ... worked out fine for me in any case but I'd just as soon others not have to attend! 

In anycase ... you should post clips of your Dog/Puppy, I think "newbies" with "puppies" tend to think ... well my "puppy" is not so bad ... so little value to posting what I'm doing??

But we have a new member on Boxerforum and he's been doing just that! He really screwed with peoples head here:

PLEASE HELP! Dog behaving abnormally. - Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums 

He "almost" had me fooled but I was like "wait what??" Boxer people 
... tend to be as nutty as our dogs!

But back on pointe ... little bit baby Boxer Puppy and this is what he shows ... 




I "missed" my opportunity "to show my work" with my H/A OS Wl GSD.  

I figured "no big deal" "everybody knows/does this??" Apparently ... not so much?? But there are lessons to be learned by members "getting it right" from the beginning! 

So don't "under value" what your doing. And welcome aboard .. in case I have not said it already??


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Chip18 said:


> Right there ... is your problem. There is only rule in Cat v Dog relationships ... *The Dog/Puppy Never Chases The Cat!* There are lots of ways to get there. But it's a "puppy" so the easiest way to train "The Place Command." Indoors the puppy goes to "Place" the cats are free to engage if they chose to do so ... the puppy is free to move in "Place" but he is not free to leave it!
> 
> Keep a "drag leash" on the puppy indoors a short leash with no handle to get caught up on furniture. You use that to "guide" the puppy back to "Place" as required.
> 
> ...


How long does it take a puppy to learn place and to hold it for any significant amount of time, and then proof it around a playful kitten?

What do you do with the kitten and puppy in the meantime before a reliable, bullet proof place is mastered?

What do you do with the puppy and kitten when the puppy is not in a place command or does the puppy stay there indefinitely?


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## Casto (Jun 18, 2016)

Chip18 said:


> Aw so your gonna make me "search" and look??
> 
> But yes ... hard lesson learned! Drag leash, Place and No Free Roaming especially, in multi dog households!!
> 
> ...



Thank you!!!! I have a lot to learn but this forum is worth is weight for sure... and here are some photos ranging from both ears down to yesterday.


edit: it put the oldest photo last and as you can see his drag leash is everywhere he goes!!!! It's the quickest difference for a good pup, i think.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> How long does it take a puppy to learn place and to hold it for any significant amount of time, and then proof it around a playful kitten?


Well for "me" ... "Place" means ...you stay "here" and you "Don't freaking move until" ... I say so ..."Period" end of story!

I used place for my H/A GSD and had he moved ...he'd have had to get past "me" first before he got to company! And had he done that ..even once ... then well he does not understand what "Place" means well enough! So we'd have a "conversation" until he does!

"We" never needed to have that "discussion" my dog makes "Good Choices." 

An "effective" trainer will tell people with Cat/Dog issues to train "Place" and call it a day. Cats, Dogs, Fireworks, Squirrels, People etc if your dogs stays in "Place" none of that "crap" makes a difference! If people can't do that because they can't train "Place" ... then get an E-Collar and go for "behaviour modification" and "Avoidance" or do the whole "Crittering" thing?? But this is a "puppy" so all of that is a bit of overkill! The "Place Command" is not. 

I did look once at Victoria Stillwells site ... just for giggles to see what she advised as regards Cat V Dog. Her advise ... "consult a "Trainer!" "My advice" train "Place" and call it day.

As for me "personally" well yeah, that'd be like people watching "Cesar" to learn how to walk a Dog. Most of my personal dogs I got as puppies and none of my numerous cat's had "Escape Routes." They had "nothing" to escape from. My puppies "never" chased my Cats from day one! Rocky (my problem child) was the biggest "puppy" I ever brought in, 7 months and 57 pounds, rescue/failed foster (by me). I do remember him looking at one of the cats ... once and maybe thinking things over??? He made a "good choice" I'll stay where I am, never had an "issue" with him in regards to cats. 

Beyond that "me" cats and dogs ... it's pretty transparent, there is "simply" "No Issues." Not much learned to share there from my first experiance ... sorry ... but the "Pro's" say ... train "Place Command" and call it a day. 




MineAreWorkingline said:


> What do you do with the kitten and puppy in the meantime before a reliable, bulletproof place is mastered?


 I trust that "most" people can chew gum and walk at the same time?? Train the "Place Command" and if your dealing with a "Puppy"... you keep the puppy from "Chasing" the freaking the Cat, in the meantime! It's a "puppy" put a "Drag leash" on him and guide him back to "Place." If the "puppy" does not actually "chase" the cats ... then there is "no problem." If he does ... then he needs to stop! I'd used a "verbal" maker "NO!" If that does not work a "Puppy Bunker" a single rolled up sock ... throw it at the "puppy" and hit them and say "NO!" And realize that "this" particular "puppy" is not a candidate to be "allowed" to roam free so ... "Place" it is!

My puppies, indoors were "always" eyes on ... no "Place Command" needed but what they "did not do" was "chase the cats!" And judging from our newest member on "BoxerForum, Smokieandthebandit" ... it takes one week to properly "train" a puppy the "Place Command" if a "Boxer" can figure it out in a week, then for a GSD puppy with a "competent" owner ... I'd say training "Place" is no big deal??? 




MineAreWorkingline said:


> What do you do with the puppy and kitten when the puppy is not in a place command or does the puppy stay there indefinitely?


People need to use a little common sense, it's a "puppy" so it should not be allowed to be unsupervised in anycase?? Use an X Pen, if you can't have eyes on. Keep a drag leash on the "puppy" as required and eyes on the puppy, if he is free roaming in the living room. 

If people are struggling with a "puppy" chasing cats ... the time to get there act together is "now." They are raising a "Dog" and if he won't listen "now" with "distractions" ... he is less inclined to do so at 75 lbs or more. 

The time to get it "right" ... is "now."


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Casto said:


> Thank you!!!! I have a lot to learn but this forum is worth is weight for sure... and here are some photos ranging from both ears down to yesterday.
> 
> 
> edit: it put the oldest photo last and as you can see his drag leash is everywhere he goes!!!! It's the quickest difference for a good pup, i think.


Hmm nothing but photos of getting it right. 

What's the deal with the last photo?? Who's the furry guy??


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Chip18 said:


> Well for "me" ... "Place" means ...you stay "here" and you "Don't freaking move until" ... I say so ..."Period" end of story!
> 
> I used place for my H/A GSD and had he moved ...he'd have had to get past "me" first before he got to company! And had he done that ..even once ... then well he does not understand what "Place" means well enough! So we'd have a "conversation" until he does!
> 
> ...


So to put it succinctly, you are saying that you can train a 10 week old puppy to place and hold the place command indefinitely while under distractions?


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> So to put it succinctly, you are saying that you can train a 10 week old puppy to place and hold the place command indefinitely while under distractions?


 LOL ... I very much doubt I ever put "anything" succinctly??? Not really my thing. 

People are of course free to take "anything" to an "extreme??" But what I did "try" and say, was that right now on "BoxerForum" "Smokeyandthebandit" has his currently 16week old Boxer trained in "Place" and he started 4 weeks ago and he "shows his work." 

His latest, clip the "Puppy" was "off leash in place" with "Fireworks" as distractions. Then "walking off leash in circles" with Fireworks as distractions! Pretty sure if one were to ask him ... "well what about cats???" He'd say "No big Deal" ... "Place means Place??"

I've seen clips from "Pirates Lair" of "puppies" doing some pretty incredible things!! Unfortunately I lost track of the links.  

But gun fire, swimming and climbing rope bridges the puppies were no older than 16 weeks. I don't know that he (Pirate's Lair) specifically trains "Place??" But if he does ... I'd bet those "puppies" would hold "Place" regardless of "distractions???" 

By and large "most" people have pretty low "expectations" of puppies?? And that is ... where "issues" start. Pretty much that simple in my view. 

But if "Place" is to much for people ... there is always "Zak George!" I'm pretty sure he is full of useless information for "Cat v Dog/Puppy" issues??? 

Most likely he to would advise people ... to find a "Trainer."


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

So actually you are saying that if the puppy were older, it could take up to four weeks to teach an indefinite place? If that is the case, then that permits plenty of time for a bad behavior to become a bad habit, no?

Personally, I would not consider fireworks a distraction. I don't know what kind of prey drive or energy levels are found in Boxers, but the levels can run quite high in many GSD pups. Many GSDs would not be phased by fireworks but a cat or a kitten could be a different story. Do you think a Boxer ignoring fireworks is a fair comparison to a GSD ignoring a kitten batting his nose? I really just don't know enough about Boxers to make that comparison is why I ask.

I would think that the PiratesLair videos are demonstrating exposure, imprinting, confidence building and some foundation work for future training. I would doubt that the PiratesLair pups would hold a place under distraction at the ages shown in the videos.

Don't get me wrong, I am not dismissing the Place command. I am just trying to establish realistic timelines to understand your suggestions.




Chip18 said:


> LOL ... I very much doubt I ever put "anything" succinctly??? Not really my thing.
> 
> People are of course free to take "anything" to an "extreme??" But what I did "try" and say, was that right now on "BoxerForum" "Smokeyandthebandit" has his currently 16week old Boxer trained in "Place" and he started 4 weeks ago and he "shows his work."
> 
> ...


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> So actually you are saying that if the puppy were older, it could take up to four weeks to teach an indefinite place? If that is the case, then that permits plenty of time for a bad behavior to become a bad habit, no?
> 
> Personally, I would not consider fireworks a distraction. I don't know what kind of prey drive or energy levels are found in Boxers, but the levels can run quite high in many GSD pups. Many GSDs would not be phased by fireworks but a cat or a kitten could be a different story. Do you think a Boxer ignoring fireworks is a fair comparison to a GSD ignoring a kitten batting his nose? I really just don't know enough about Boxers to make that comparison is why I ask.


"Breed" does not matter. "Place" means "Place!" There is "nothing" for a Dog/Puppy to think about. If they break "Place" as a "Puppy" you guide them back with a "Drag Leash." And do it again ... repeat as "necessary" if they break "Place" as a Dog, once it is clear the "Dog" understands the command ... you "Correct" them and yet again use the "Drag Leash" to guide them back to "Place!" Repeat as necessary ... Cats, Dogs, Fireworks, People in Wheelchairs, Firetrucks and or freaking Elephants! "Place" means ... you don't freaking move! Until I say so ..."Breed" doesn't matter. But ... if a "Boxer" can figure it out in a week?? By implication a GSD can figure it out ... three times faster. 

And for "me" the whole of my front lawn, is a "Place Cot." "The command to "train" that was "On The Lawn." A "variation of "Place."I put my dogs out front "On The Lawn" and that is where they stay! They are free to move about the whole of the "Lawn" they are not free to leave it! Works out fine. 




MineAreWorkingline said:


> I would think that the PiratesLair videos are demonstrating exposure, imprinting, confidence building and some foundation work for future training. I would doubt that the PiratesLair pups would hold a place under distraction at the ages shown in the videos.


 Well what he was "showing" would be for him to say. My take away was that "puppy" are capable of some pretty "impressive" stuff! The "puppies" I saw were certainly no older than 16 weeks?? 



MineAreWorkingline said:


> Don't get me wrong, I am not dismissing the Place command. I am just trying to establish realistic timelines to understand your suggestions.


People need to train "Place" for the long game, in the interm ... they need to keep the "puppy" from chasing the cat.

If that means "Crate" the "puppy" while the cats roam ... then that is what they need to do. Keep a drag leash on the puppy while he is out if that is what they need to do?? It's a "puppy" not a dog ... if you can't control a puppy ... good luck controlling a "Dog!" 

The "Place Command" is the long game, if people choose to let "Chaos" reign in the meantime??? Well that's on them, if that's how they choose to proceed ... then as folks are want to say on here ... "find a trainer." And I'll add for most that go that route ... "good luck with that!" I'm sure said "Trainer" will roll up with a bag of cookies, in hand. 

But hey ... I'm not a Pro ... people are free to ask "Jeff" , themselves what he would do. I already know myself as I have heard him he say it numerous time on his twice weekly youtube channel, Train "The Place Command" ... the Current show:





or FB at Solidk9training.:
https://www.facebook.com/Solid-K9-Training-140229622668254/


And the "Place Command" and for people that "whine about" "not a GSD" ... here you go ... "Place and his two "RV Touring" WL girls in uh ... action??

https://www.instagram.com/p/BGZV6KeMkPS/?taken-by=solidk9training

He will also tell people "Breed" does not matter a "Dog" with "issues" is a "Dog" with issues.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Hmm, Jeff has so much stuff out there I get lost but this is what I was shooting for ... live clip not static. A properly Cat "proofed" or "Place": Trainied dog ... is pretty boring to look at. :

https://www.instagram.com/p/BGZDIzoMkDg/?taken-by=solidk9training


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Chip18 said:


> "Breed" does not matter.


Breed absolutely does matter as do lines within a breed before looking at the dog in front of you. 






I don't need an explanation of how place works. I understand the concept. It is not much different from the commands, go, go lay down, bed, kennel, etc., that other people have been training their dogs for years.



Chip18 said:


> "Place" means "Place!" There is "nothing" for a Dog/Puppy to think about. If they break "Place" as a "Puppy" you guide them back with a "Drag Leash." And do it again ... repeat as "necessary" if they break "Place" as a Dog, once it is clear the "Dog" understands the command ... you "Correct" them and yet again use the "Drag Leash" to guide them back to "Place!" Repeat as necessary ... *Cats, Dogs, Fireworks, People in Wheelchairs, Firetrucks and or freaking Elephants!* "Place" means ... you don't freaking move! Until I say so ..."Breed" doesn't matter. But ... if a "Boxer" can figure it out in a week?? By implication a GSD can figure it out ... three times faster.  .


You can't say breed doesn't matter nor that wheelchairs, firetrucks, people in wheelchairs, or freaking elephants or other distractions don't matter when comparing two different breeds as some dogs have next to no prey drive or other traits that would not be distracted by the same things that would distract another dog. The command and its purpose does not change, but distractions, and the level of those distractions do change with breeds. My GSDs could not care less about birds in the bush but try to convince somebody that owns a field Irish Setter that birds are not a distraction. This is why I asked you about your comparison of GSDs to Boxers as I am not all the familiar with the breed.



Chip18 said:


> People need to train "Place" for the long game, in the interm ... they need to keep the "puppy" from chasing the cat.


Don't you think in the time that it would take to train an effective place, considering that this is a puppy, that the actions taken in the interim would / could not be effective enough to stop the puppy from chasing cats?



Chip18 said:


> He will also tell people "Breed" does not matter a "Dog" with "issues" is a "Dog" with issues.


As stated earlier, Gellman is full of baloney if he thinks breed does not matter. If that were true, I would own some breeds of dogs that I find very attractive but choose not to own because they don't mesh with what I am looking for in a dog because...... breed matters. LE would be using Greyhounds, people in need of personal protection dogs would be using Collies, IPO competitors would be using Gordon Setters, and I could go on, but you get the picture, breed matters.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Breed absolutely does matter as do lines within a breed before looking at the dog in front of you.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9r7EOFRkDp4
> 
> ...


Oh "please" Strawman argument, I don't hang out in the IPO, Sport Dog, LE or Protection dog sections??

I do "family pets" ie "Dogs" behaving badly! No one "stated" that "Breeds" were not "created" to do "specialized "jobs???" That pretty much goes without saying ... because I didn't?? 

I know how to train "Dogs" and I "expect" the exact same behaviour in "Family Pet" world from all of them ... regardless of "Breed." If "Breed" matters for that ... "I'd" have had to have found, as "issues" cropped up a Trainer for American Band Dawgs (which I now understand is a job description, not a Breed.  ) and a Trainer for APBT/Boxers a Boxer guy and finally a GSD guy! 

Good luck to "me" when I finally get an American Bulldog and or my Dogo or maybe a MAL ... hmm I'll have to rule out a GSD/Mal cross casue well "Breed" matters and stuff?? So no way can a GSD guy train one of those!! I guess I better break out the "Yellow Pages" and start looking now for a "breed" specific trainer for the last three??? 

Because my "Dog" training experiance is limited to training* "well behaved family pets!" * Regardless of "Breed." So if I switch "Breeds" again, I guess ... I'm outta luck?? So sad ....


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Chip18 said:


> Oh "please" Strawman argument, I don't hang out in the IPO, Sport Dog, LE or Protection dog sections??
> 
> I do "family pets" ie "Dogs" behaving badly! No one "stated" that "Breeds" were not "created" to do "specialized "jobs???" That pretty much goes without saying ... because I didn't??
> 
> ...


Straw man argument? Maybe you are looking for an argument but I am only looking for clarification. Clarification, training not to chase cats, or a place command, has nothing to do with IPO, LE, etc., training. What's your point?

You seem to have quite a problem with answering the questions I asked as it pertains to the place command, training a puppy not to chase cats, and the breed comparison that YOU made.

I am still waiting for an answer to the question: "Do you think a Boxer ignoring fireworks is a fair comparison to a GSD ignoring a kitten batting his nose? I really just don't know enough about Boxers to make that comparison is why I ask."

When you say breed does not matter, you are leaving the impression that most breeds aren't bred to perform specialized functions. This leaves a bad impression for newbies researching German Shepherds. I can see where it would easily lead them to believe that it is all in in how you raise and train them regardless of genetics. There are too many threads by first time GSD owners on this forum who are here because they are at wit's end when their GSD exhibits typical GSD behavior, especially aggression. It is just not fair to encourage that breed does not matter when it does.

Nobody is saying that you should not want all your dogs to behave the same. The problem comes in when you lead others to believe that all dogs can be trained with the same set of tools. I won't even touch the comment that since you trained one bandog, one Boxer and one WL GSD with ataxia that you expect the same methods to work on all dogs. 

What do trainers who are experienced with specific breeds have to do with this topic or anything that I have asked? 

Now back to my question, if it is going to take 4 weeks to train a puppy an extended place under distractions, why not use other methods during that four week period and just train the puppy up front not to chase or mouth cats?


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Straw man argument? Maybe you are looking for an argument but I am only looking for clarification. Clarification, training not to chase cats, or a place command, has nothing to do with IPO, LE, etc., training. What's your point?
> 
> You seem to have quite a problem with answering the questions I asked as it pertains to the place command, training a puppy not to chase cats, and the breed comparison that YOU made.
> 
> ...


Oh by and large I don't need to look for arguments ... they seem to find me?? 

If "other means" were as "effective" for Cat V Dog "issues" ... then members would not keep constantly posting questions about "how do I stop my dog from chasing the cat???":

If "other means" were as effective ... then I could not do this:

https://www.google.com/search?q=how...NAhVp54MKHTjDDtoQrQIILSgEMAA&biw=1366&bih=681

I could say ... well "people" could do what I do ... "don't let it happen!" Works for me ... not much help to others???

I gave the "specs" and contact for a member with a "Boxer Puppy" trained in "Place" with distractions. Pretty sure I said "one week" to train Place but I don't know?? As I say a lot of stuff?? But ... I gave his name and said where he hangs out, those that are that curious ... can ask him themselves. I will say, it did not him a month to train The Place Command! His first clip was labeled week two. And the puppy was already more controlled, than any puppy I've ever seen let alone a Boxer! 

For me "Place" is "Place" regardless of "distractions" "you" threw the kitten batting a dog in the face bit out there ... not me. But as the video clip "showed" a "properly trained" dog can handle that.

And for the record, and it's in those threads, I linked somewhere, but I'll state it here directly. "I don't care what the Cat/Kitten does." It's the Dog/Puppies "job" to stay in "Place." If a dog/puppy is full of "adrenalized energy" a Cat certainly will not go near him. 

And who knows what "Kittens will do??" People need to "exercise" some kind of common sense. Place is a global solution, train a Dog/Puppy to chill and you can also solve "Breed" specific, my dog does not care much for company?? Problems before they happen, "Flank the Dog" address issues before they happen, address them "indirectly" ... so that they don't! Or ... yeah work on the Cat thing first, then the other dog thing, then the people thing etc, etc. 

People that "know what they are doing" don't have those "issues" so I'm not really addressing them, those that can ... do, those that can't ... ask questions. 

And to answer your question as to Fireworks or Kittens as a "distraction??" Thought I'd said it but to be clear for "ME" they are both the same! For me ... "I don't care, what the distraction is." Place means Place! Pretty much that simple. 

But hey if people are eager to take the one trick pony approach ... here you go.:

Leerburg | Introducing Dogs or Puppies into Homes with Cats

That will solve the Cat issues and then they can deal with the "Company" coming over thing as a "separate issue." 

And as regards "Boxers and GSD's, well they "both" do the same jobs. People may have there "preferences" but the record is pretty clear on that one! 

But ... again for the record ... if people are looking to perform a "specific task" then of course chose a "Breed" for that job! To state the apparently "not so obvious??" 

However ... for the "members" I tend to address" ... there goals are more modest. They simply want to be able to take there dogs with them about town and not worry about breaking a hip or having there dog bite the crap out of someone ... "unexpectedly??" Or being made to look like a fool by trying to walk an ill behaved cur. And to accomplish that, Breed does not matter. A good Trainer is a good Trainer. Pretty much that simple in "my" view.


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## Casto (Jun 18, 2016)

Chip18 said:


> Hmm nothing but photos of getting it right.
> 
> What's the deal with the last photo?? Who's the furry guy??


That's Kiera! Our 8 year old poodle about 18 lbs at all times! Great dog! Very smart and she is a great role model for Jupiter. lol
Ill post some photos of the rest of my pack.

A walk we took last weekend. Wife, son, daughter, and 2 dogs. Jupiter and Kiera! you can see the dogs up and to the left.
View attachment 374650

Kiera swimming back. A lake we lived by in Boulder, Co.
View attachment 374658

Chloe Flying! same lake
View attachment 374666

Chloe, Atom and Kiera. Fun times!
View attachment 374674


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Chip18 said:


> Oh by and large I don't need to look for arguments ... they seem to find me??
> 
> If "other means" were as "effective" for Cat V Dog "issues" ... then members would not keep constantly posting questions about "how do I stop my dog from chasing the cat???":
> 
> ...


You don't think that a family with kids that entertain a lot and like to go to dog parks, outdoor flea markets, parades and take their dog with them should choose breed based on appearance and not behavior? Maybe most do and that is why shelters are polluted with failed family dogs.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

LOL the last pic .... X-Pen for everybody! 

So "furry" guy is a Poodle??? I find "Poodle's" hard to recognize without "funny" hair cuts! I had some clients, I'm a PCA, with a Miniature Poodle, the dog was so well behaved with company that my guys were an embarrassment by comparison!That would have been Gunther (Band Dawg) and Struddell (Boxer), they luv'd people! Sorta off the hook with company ... pre "Place" days. 

Rock,y OS WL GSD not a problem with him, he's more like ..."nice to see you, when you leaving ??" Good enough for me.


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## mistysms (Nov 19, 2014)

I haven't read thru all of the comments yet because I just got home from work so all eyes on the puppy. I have started keeping a leash on her inside and then I walk her around outside on the leash until she goes potty then I normally let her off to do some running around in the yard. What do I do when she starts to chew on the leash inside? I normally say "achach" and redirect her with a toy. I have never taught a dog "place" before. Do I need to get a blanket or something and put it in a certain place in the living room? How do I go about starting teaching her place? Also is it ok if she goes up to the cats and sniffs them? Then if I think it may get to rough should I call her away? I guess it doesn't help I hate the cats lol they are my BF's and they are annoying and I would want to bite them too if I was a dog. If she just walks right by the cats and doesn't even acknowledge them should I give her a treat? will she understand why? Sorry all of the questions I have never had a dog chase my cats growing up and the BF gets upset when the puppy goes after the cats so we gotta get it under control now before she is to big.


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## mistysms (Nov 19, 2014)

Also people talk about attaching the leash to you but I don't see that every fair that she has to just play right next to me and can't play with my other dog or run around the living room. With that being said she can't leave the living room so I always have eyes on her.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> You don't think that a family with kids that entertain a lot and like to go to dog parks, outdoor flea markets, parades and take their dog with them should choose breed based on appearance and not behavior? Maybe most do and that is why shelters are polluted with failed family dogs.


Ok well "this" is a bit different??

I thought I said "for training" a "Dog" "Breed does not matter, if you can train a "Dog" you can train a "Dog." Yes subtle "nuances" in behaviour but a "competent Trainer ... would know what to look for. 

Speaking from experience, I can make progress faster with a Boxer than I can with a "Pit." Same techniques but yeah different "Breeds" no biggie.  

But to your point ... being a "Family Pet" is also a job and yes for that job ... of course "Breed" matters! Generally speaking "WL" dogs are the one most prone to getting people in trouble. Especially, if there is intent is as you outlined. 

I'd not recommend either of my "preferences" to the clueless and the lazy. Potential "people" issues with GSD's and pretty much guaranteed craziness with a Boxer! 

If the items you listed are on someones "things, I'll do" list ... then yes ... they should consider "Breed" "characteristics" first over "appearance." 


A lab or a Golden is a good "Breed" for the lazy and the clueless! Hmm ...no disrespect intended to owners of those "Breeds" but they do have a higher, "margin of error" built into there "DNA."


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Chip18 said:


> Ok well "this" is a bit different??
> 
> I thought I said "for training" a "Dog" "Breed does not matter, if you can train a "Dog" you can train a "Dog." Yes subtle "nuances" in behaviour but a "competent Trainer ... would know what to look for.
> 
> ...


I don't think Goldens or Labs have a higher margin of error built in, it is just that they are not bred for aggression.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

MineAreWorkingline said:


> I don't think Goldens or Labs have a higher margin of error built in, it is just that they are not bred for aggression.


LOL ... well ... I count that "as" a higher margin for error. 

Aggression scares the heck out of JQP, and Crazy makes them pull there hair out.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Hm ... Chloe, is that the Chi "flying" into the water?? I did not know Chi's like to or uh could swim! Mostly, all one tends to see are Chi's behaving badly?? I amost adopted/rescued a Chi myself. she was real sweetheart the owners were "Dog Hoarders!!" They would not let me take her .. it ended badly for her shortly there after ... broke my heart.


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## Casto (Jun 18, 2016)

Chip18 said:


> Hm ... Chloe, is that the Chi "flying" into the water?? I did not know Chi's like to or uh could swim! Mostly, all one tends to see are Chi's behaving badly?? I amost adopted/rescued a Chi myself. she was real sweetheart the owners were "Dog Hoarders!!" They would not let me take her .. it ended badly for her shortly there after ... broke my heart.


yeah that is chloe the Chi mix and she loves water actually. We rescued her in Boulder, Co and she was a troubled dog who was abused by an adult male human. Terrified. They really dislike putting dogs down there and she was close to it. It took a year of me being pretty consistent with her, but she is good. Off leash and everything. Kiera the poodle has been an undistracted off leash dog for years and really sets a good tone for first Chloe and now Jupiter on how to be a good dog. In the photo of my family you can see Kiera and Jupiter up ahead. With a drag leash, and I gaurantee Jupiter will have my trust to be off leash on our walks. Of coarse, I train a little differently than most people talk about on here, such as Jupiter has never gotten a treat from me BUT he gets praised when he gets released from his command. I'll start posting vids of training sessions. He can sit, down, stay, come and down from distance right now as well as not jump on people or my kids and has not nipped a hand, lip, ear or anything since he was 15 weeks. Going on 18 weeks now so those last 2 were the most important for my wife, who does our training with me. Her only concern was big dog/small children, but she has his trust now. I'll figure out the way of the forum soon and get everything figured out on sharing post, formatting and what not. lol Thanks for the interest btw.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Casto said:


> yeah that is chloe the Chi mix and she loves water actually. We rescued her in Boulder, Co and she was a troubled dog who was abused by an adult male human. Terrified. They really dislike putting dogs down there and she was close to it. It took a year of me being pretty consistent with her, but she is good. Off leash and everything. Kiera the poodle has been an undistracted off leash dog for years and really sets a good tone for first Chloe and now Jupiter on how to be a good dog. In the photo of my family you can see Kiera and Jupiter up ahead. With a drag leash, and I gaurantee Jupiter will have my trust to be off leash on our walks. Of coarse, I train a little differently than most people talk about on here, such as Jupiter has never gotten a treat from me BUT he gets praised when he gets released from his command. I'll start posting vids of training sessions. He can sit, down, stay, come and down from distance right now as well as not jump on people or my kids and has not nipped a hand, lip, ear or anything since he was 15 weeks. Going on 18 weeks now so those last 2 were the most important for my wife, who does our training with me. Her only concern was big dog/small children, but she has his trust now. I'll figure out the way of the forum soon and get everything figured out on sharing post, formatting and what not. lol Thanks for the interest btw.


PM sent.


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