# Does anyone own a Working Line AND and West German Showline German Shepherd?



## AnthonyBrown (Jan 5, 2015)

I am coming from owning a couple of Border Collies over the years and now am considering owning a German Shepherd.

To all those that own both Working and West German Showlines, how do your dogs differ? I know this is a very difficult question to answer as it depends on individual personalities, lines etc. But I would like to know about your dog.

Also are Working lines bigger than West German Showlines or vice versa? I have a dog park near my house where I have seen a bunch of German Shepherds and the amount of variation is size is astonishing. 

Any pictures to show size difference? Preferably ones of the same sex.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

I have one that's half and half. Does that count? XD


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

from what I see at training, WL's are usually smaller in structure than the SL's. 
Personality always depends on the individual dog and the pedigree behind it.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Yes, I did for 4 years. My first GSD was a WL female and my second was a WGSL male. Then I also had a WL male for two years (while still having the WGSL male). Now I also have a WGSL/WL cross (son of my WGSL male).

How they differ is more about the individual dogs than sweeping generalizations of lines. On the whole, I much prefer my WGSL to either of the WLs and overall prefer his temperament to that of his son (but I love them both for different reasons), but I still love WLs and always look to them first because there are more people breeding quality WLs IMO (if temperament and nerve are top priority). My female WL was nuts though a very special dog. My male WL had good drive, was a very fun dog to work and train, but in a home setting was a spazz and a little low threshold. My WGSL/WL cross is a nice dog in the home so far (more settled than his father was at this age which is a good thing, because his father is a fabulous house dog now), but his temperament on the whole doesn't have the same level of courage and hardness that his father has (I don't particularly like his dam's pedigree and to be honest never intended to get a puppy from this litter, but kept one to raise for a while and now I'm way too attached to him!). Which lines are "better" really depend on what you want. I like dogs that have a lot of natural hardness and aggression but a higher threshold. Dogs that are aloof but calm and safe being family pets, off leash at family reunions and that sort of thing. I like drive but I find that even a medium-high drive GSD can be very fun to train and willing to do all the sports and training I like; I do not need the "extreme drive!!!!" dogs or extreme anything in my house.

Size-wise I can only tell you what I've seen in my own dogs and the dogs I know. My WL female was 21" and 51lbs. The male was about 70lbs and 25.5" when I sold him, more like 80lbs now that he is mature and more filled out. My WGSL male is 24.5" and hovers near or slightly above 70lbs but looks a lot thicker than he really is. The WGSL/WL cross is the same height as his father but 60lbs, he has matured very slowly physically (like his father) and has filling out to do but will be a normal sized male. From the dogs I know and have trained with, the WL dogs tend to be bigger than the WGSL, probably because the WGSL dogs I know and train with do SV shows and breed surveys so they are more picky about size relative to the standard and in the past several shows I've entered, some of the judges have pretty harshly critiqued over-sized dogs. The WGSL dogs tend to have more coat, some lines are bred for blockier heads or heavy bone, so they tend to look larger than they are (my male is an example and he doesn't even have a blocky heavy). I've seen some pint sized WL GSDs that can pack a punch but most of the WLs I know especially the males are taller and considerably heavier than my WGSL and others of his type.


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## AnthonyBrown (Jan 5, 2015)

Liesje said:


> Yes, I did for 4 years. My first GSD was a WL female and my second was a WGSL male. Then I also had a WL male for two years (while still having the WGSL male). Now I also have a WGSL/WL cross (son of my WGSL male).
> 
> How they differ is more about the individual dogs than sweeping generalizations of lines. On the whole, I much prefer my WGSL to either of the WLs and overall prefer his temperament to that of his son (but I love them both for different reasons), but I still love WLs and always look to them first because there are more people breeding quality WLs IMO (if temperament and nerve are top priority). My female WL was nuts though a very special dog. My male WL had good drive, was a very fun dog to work and train, but in a home setting was a spazz and a little low threshold. My WGSL/WL cross is a nice dog in the home so far (more settled than his father was at this age which is a good thing, because his father is a fabulous house dog now), but his temperament on the whole doesn't have the same level of courage and hardness that his father has (I don't particularly like his dam's pedigree and to be honest never intended to get a puppy from this litter, but kept one to raise for a while and now I'm way too attached to him!). Which lines are "better" really depend on what you want. I like dogs that have a lot of natural hardness and aggression but a higher threshold. Dogs that are aloof but calm and safe being family pets, off leash at family reunions and that sort of thing. I like drive but I find that even a medium-high drive GSD can be very fun to train and willing to do all the sports and training I like; I do not need the "extreme drive!!!!" dogs or extreme anything in my house.
> 
> Size-wise I can only tell you what I've seen in my own dogs and the dogs I know. My WL female was 21" and 51lbs. The male was about 70lbs and 25.5" when I sold him, more like 80lbs now that he is mature and more filled out. My WGSL male is 24.5" and hovers near or slightly above 70lbs but looks a lot thicker than he really is. The WGSL/WL cross is the same height as his father but 60lbs, he has matured very slowly physically (like his father) and has filling out to do but will be a normal sized male. From the dogs I know and have trained with, the WL dogs tend to be bigger than the WGSL, probably because the WGSL dogs I know and train with do SV shows and breed surveys so they are more picky about size relative to the standard and in the past several shows I've entered, some of the judges have pretty harshly critiqued over-sized dogs. The WGSL dogs tend to have more coat, some lines are bred for blockier heads or heavy bone, so they tend to look larger than they are (my male is an example and he doesn't even have a blocky heavy). I've seen some pint sized WL GSDs that can pack a punch but most of the WLs I know especially the males are taller and considerably heavier than my WGSL and others of his type.


As long as I don't get an American Showline I should be fine in regards to getting a healthy dog with minimal health issues correct?


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

I don't really understand the question? If health is a concern then you need to examine the health of the lines regardless of whether you are getting a WL or WGSL. It's WAY too broad to generalize saying all WGSL or all WL have minimal health issues. Unfortunately the breed as a whole is not very healthy and is prone to a number of health issues.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

We have a 2 yr old wl and an eleven month old wgsl, both male. Our wl is a bit more aloof, strong herding instinct, and could use a bit more self preservation. Our wgsl is a clown, hyper, and doesn't settle in the house as easy, but he's young so we'll see. Both are vocal, intelligent and easy to train.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

AnthonyBrown said:


> To all those that own both Working and West German Showlines, how do your dogs differ? I know this is a very difficult question to answer as it depends on individual personalities, lines etc. But I would like to know about your dog.
> 
> Also are Working lines bigger than West German Showlines or vice versa? I have a dog park near my house where I have seen a bunch of German Shepherds and the amount of variation is size is astonishing.
> 
> Any pictures to show size difference? Preferably ones of the same sex.


I had both. Buddy passed away a short while ago. So I had to go back and look for old pictures. Here they are making a mess  










Tasha the female (WGSL) is about 90lbs Buddy the male (Czech working lines) was about about 100 lbs in his heyday.

Buddy was far more intense. Tasha is a much more mellow dog has a better off switch although both had off switches. 

Health wise Buddy lived to be 13 with very few vet visits needed over the years. The biggest health problem he had was his ears. He had one ear that just always would get infected. At the end he had arthritis in his back and that is why we had him put down. He just couldn't move around much anymore and he was in a lot of pain. Tasha is around 9 and is still going strong. I'm not sure of her younger years as we got her as an older lady but her teeth are worn down worse than Buddies. She has had no health problems since we got her she is missing a tail that was amputated due to infection before we got her. 

I hope this helps. Feel free to ask any questions.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

AnthonyBrown said:


> As long as I don't get an American Showline I should be fine in regards to getting a healthy dog with minimal health issues correct?


Oh no German Shepherds tend to have a lot of issues across the board. HD, DM, Pannus, come to mind right away. I don't think it matters show line, working line, they are all susceptible.


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## Wolfiesmom (Apr 10, 2010)

I've had both but at different times. My WGSL was more mellow. He was smart and had a sweet, quiet personality. He was tall and slender. He had more health issues, but that could have been that particular dog. 
My DDR WL dog is more intense. He has a huge personality and is by far the smarter dog. He's short and stocky and is more barrel chested. No health issues so far. He is 5 years old. 
I prefer the challenge of my WL dog, but if you are looking for a more mellow guy, I would go with the SL.


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## KZoppa (Aug 14, 2010)

You should contact Robin. She has both lines and breeds. She can tell you a bunch.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

I do. Keefer is WGSL and Halo is WGWL. There are some similarities and some differences. But actually Keefer is more like Halo in terms of energy and activity levels than his half sister Dena (also WGSL), who was much calmer and more low key.


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

Having owned working farm Border Collies, I can tell you my Working Line Shepherd is basically an 85lb working Border Collie as far as drive, energy, intelligence, and need for mental stimulation.


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## huntergreen (Jun 28, 2012)

just thought i would throw this out there. a respected breeder on the forum told me via pm, you can get the type of gsd you want from any line. just be honest with the breeder and tell them what you are looking for. if they cant supply or breed for the characteristics you want they can usually refer you to someone who can.


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