# Dog Parks - Good? Bad? Indifferent?



## Kayos and Havoc

A poster on another thread had posted about an incident at a dog park and did not want her thread turned into a bashing thread. Perfectly understandable.

Dog Parks are a hot issue, not just for dog owners that want to socialize and exercise our dogs but also for municipalities that have them. 

I live in a small town and we do not have a dog park. Nearest park is 100 miles away, so I would not use one cause I cannot regularly use one. I have on occassion stopped in when in Tulsa and it is very quiet. 

Would I ever be a regular user? Probably not. They scare me. 

I have 3 GSD's.(would never take more than one a time if I went). They are large dogs and they have a reputation as a breed. My dogs are well socialized and very well trained as evidence by the titles in front and behind their names (not bragging). They get along with other dogs and other people. They are not aggressive. 

I think the idea behind dog parks is sound but sometimes the philosophy is not. I would be so afraid of other dogs causing issues adn my dogs getting caught up in it and thne being blamed due to breed. I would also not want to see injury if above happened - to my dog or another. 

I have always found friendly dogs for my dogs to play with. They do play with friends dogs pretty often. They also have each other and a large yard. 

I think for people that have no other options a well run park might be okay but I am not sure I want my dogs there.

Any one else??


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## PatchonGSD

I dont use them. To much risk and worry involved for me.


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## Aramis' Mummy

After my pup has all his shots I will probably take advantage of the dog park near my house for some off leash training but then I live in a very small community and it is not tourist season. Come spring and summer I won't be using it at all as it will be tourist season. My city bylaws state you can have , get ready for it , 4 ,count them, 4 dogs per person in off leash area. How crazy is that? There is no way I am going to take a chance of anything happening to my dog so I will be avoiding dog parks unless no one else is there. Luckily there are lots of trails that we can use.


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## fuzzybunny

I think it depends on the type of park. A small fenced in area is what a lot of people think of when they think dog park. In Ottawa our 2 major dog parks consist of acres of land with multiple walking trails through them. You can avoid the chaos if you choose to do so. I personally love taking my guys and will continue. If my only option was a small fenced in space where the dogs are pretty much forced to mingle then I wouldn't go. Also, for those of us who live in apartments, the dog park is the only opportunity we have to let our dogs run off leash.


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## Bear GSD

I currently use a dog park in my area that is divided into 3 areas. First area is a "come one and all" sort of area. I think people that use this area tend to be regulars that meet in groups. The other areas are for "big dogs" and "small dogs".
I will use the larger "big dog" area but I will only go very early in the am on the weekends when I know there will be virtually no one there.
For me I like this option because while I have a ton of open space and off leash trails, I don't have a backyard to train my pup in and this affords me the luxury of being able train in a confined space with safety.
I also have to say that I did not go to the dog parks at all when mine was a small pup, I did not want to risk the chance of him having a bad experience and having to undo any harm that may have come to him.
I don't think dog parks are all bad, I just think the person using them has to be responsible for their own dog because god knows that most people are not going to be as responsible as you are going to be.


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## selzer

I agree that the risks out number the benefits for me and my critters. But a lot of other people may not have the same circumstances. I have a nice fenced field. And I have other dogs that my dogs can run with when I want that to happen. If my dogs fight, it is my fault, and I will have to mop them up, pay the vet bills, and kick myself for letting it happen. I think I prefer to be in control.


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## DJEtzel

I love my dog park.  I take all of my dogs & fosters here. And I work here. 

Meadow Run Park - Home


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## CarrieJ

I've stopped going with my large dog for various reasons. In my area there are many public dog parks. Some separated by size some "all together" (stupid stupid stupid)
Number one reason is cleanliness; dirty water bowls, humans unable to bend over to pick up after their dogs; stuff like that. Secondary is the gross lack of training and lack of structure in the home (yes it shows) in many of the dogs that I see there.
I've almost lost my patience with taking Zoey, just watching the humans. 
It's actually almost amusing to go without either dog and just hang out with a book and watch, it's like Comedy Central.

I think my dog benefited more by going to a large open ended park by my house and working long line recalls, and now has very good recall so I just take the chuck-it and take her there. She even has a few "friends" there and will actually stop paying attention to the all sacred BALL for a few minutes and play.
I think that there is a need for them, I just wish there were more education.
I'd love for a private dog park like Danielle's or Boceron's (I'm really sure that I spelled that wrong) as the owners are intelligent folks that have a good understanding of dog behavior and how dogs think.


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## pfitzpa1

I live almost directly across the street from a "provisional" leash-free dog park. It's "provisional" in the sense that the city have not yet bothered to fence or provide watering facilities. The residents, quite rightly objected to fencing the area as it is a small multi use park in a quiet neighborhood and had spectacular views of the ocean. I guess the compromise was provisional status and there are certain times/days (usually weekends on little league season) where use is restricted. 
The dog owners for the most part are very attentive of their dogs and "situations" are rare. There is no small dog area, and there was an incident a few years back where a poodle was killed by another dog (not sure of the breed).
I used to bring my old dogs there and stopped after they died, but when I got my GSD pup 2 years ago, I used to bring her there twice a day (from age 9 weeks). I was very watchful and stuck with times/groups that I knew were safe. She is an extremely social dog as a result. She has never been bitten nor pinned, once.

There are other bigger parks around the city, some of them are OK but a couple of them I avoid like the plague (I have been to all of them at least twice). You can generally pick up the vibe in a dog park very quickly. If you see owners sitting around paying no attention to their dogs, then that is an immediate bad sign.

I now visit my local park only once or twice a week, for no other reason than I rather go to a different park where I can get some exercise. Instead I go to a local Island that is about 5 mins drive from home but has over 400 acres of off leash use. It typically takes me about an hour and a half to walk around the 6 mile perimeter. There is a secondary fenced area of maybe 30 acres for owners that want to keep their dogs away from traffic. I usually pass through that area on my walk. (I trained my dog the long down at the entrance to this area, it is an excellent proving ground) There is no small dog area on the island and the area is used by big and small dogs alike. I've heard of incidents of dog fights etc but never witnessed any.

I find that most people that have dogs with agression issues don't spend much time in public off leash parks, or only go very early or late in the day to avoid incidents.

I think life would be very boring for me and my dog without easy access to an off leash area.


IMO dog parks are only as good/bad as the people that frequent them. The presence of diligent and attentive owners will make or break a dog park for me.


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## Jo_in_TX

Tips:

When you first visit a dog park, take your dog to an area of the park where no other dogs are around. While playing with your dog, observe what's going on around you. Do this for several days _at the same time._ If you're lucky, you'll notice some regulars and their dogs. After you feel comfortable with what you've been observing, approach the regulars so your dog can play with the others.

If you don't like what you see, you might try another time of the day. You may find a group of regulars and their dogs that you like at this time.

Practice frequent recalls with your dog at the park. Stay vigilant. As soon as you see or hear something that doesn't seem right, recall your dog. 

Walk your dog away from any other dog playing with balls, frisbees, or other toys - even sticks. 

If you want to play fetch or frisbee with your dog, only do so when far away from other dogs.

Find dogs with whom you think your dog would play well with, and encourage play. Sure, you can't "make" a dog play with another dog, but you can still encourage it. I and two other women will walk our dogs out away from others, and our three dogs will generally play together. (All three are between nine and ten months old, and roughly the same size.) 

Don't be afraid to speak out to protect your dog's right to play in the park if it is important to you. I have been downright rude to one mother who brought in two and four year old girls who tried to "hang" on my dog. Yeah...stupid, stupid woman. I'm going to stand up for my dog's right to play in the park without me having to worry about Teddy knocking over and injuring a two year old child.

The rule is no kids under twelve years of age in our dog park, so I warned her that I would call the cops if she didn't take her kids away from my dog. 

Stay vigilant and have fun, and don't be afraid to shun the clueless woman with the aggressive dog whom she ignores while texting on her cell phone. Don't go out of your way to make this person feel welcome. 

Don't get me wrong: we are quite friendly and not cliqueish, but we don't "welcome trouble."


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## pfitzpa1

One of my pet peeves is folk who chuck a ball for their dog in the middle of a busy dog park an complain when other dogs chase their dog or steal their ball. I have seen some people get quite upset about that. 
As I say it's mostly the people that are the problem not the dogs.


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## martemchik

I've tended to stop going as much lately because my dog finally has very reliable recall and I trust him in an unfenced area to stick around me. Before I would go to the dog park but be extra vigilant for exactly the same reasons OP mentioned. The breed has a reputation, anything my dog is involved in will probably be blamed on my dog, so I don't let him get involved in anything. He's extremely social and loves other dogs but he can get into dominance issues with other dogs and then I have to call him off or make sure he doesn't do anything.

For those of you with yards, with a pack of dogs, I don't see any reason to go to the dog park. But many of you don't think about the people living in cities, that might not have a lot of friends with dogs, and if they have friends with dogs they don't have anywhere fenced to let them play. So a dog park is a wonderful thing for them.

I think the more ignorant someone is, the better dog parks are for them. There are issues...but rarely is there a death or a bloody fight. I've actually never in 2.5 years of going to various dog parks seen any dog get seriously injured. There have been scrums, there have been fights, but I've actually never even seen blood get drawn from a dog. People around here are vigilant, don't want their dogs hurt, don't want to hurt other dogs, and so they don't allow it. A person that does bring an aggressive pooch usually gets quickly shunned and judged...and trust me they care when 20 people are looking at them funny and holding their dogs back. Or even saying things to them about their dog.

If we had a thread for each time a person went to the dog park and didn't have any issues, and just had a great time with their dog, those would out number the "I had a bad experience" threads by thousands.


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## Sunflowers

I hate dog parks.


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## huntergreen

i visit our dog park at least 3 times a week and more when possible. only one person, looks to be in his eighties, doesn't bend down to clean up after his dog, we all do it for him. others are handed a plastic bag if they are unfamiliar with dog park etiquette. i am amazed at how well all dogs get along. never an incident.


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## Syaoransbear

Some are good, some are bad. It's all about space. If it's just a small area where you stand around and your dog plays with other dogs and has nothing else to do, it's probably bad. Because then dogs start to get used to each other and then they start to figure out pack order and what they can get away with. They can also start forming packs and harassing other dogs. These can start fights.

If it's a dog park that is measured in acres and you actually walk your dog around the dog park instead of stand there, then it's probably a good dog park. Dogs don't bother figuring out pack structure when they are just sniffing and moving on. Packs won't form either because you usually just walk by another dog and owner and that's it.

Ours are big, with the biggest being 150 acres. Dogs of all sizes go there. I've seen a chihuahua puppy that was about the size of a hamster there and nothing bad happened because there's no pack mentality going on with groups of dogs because there are no groups of dogs and dogs don't spend enough time with each other to start chasing games that can escalate when dogs are unfamiliar with each other.


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## DJEtzel

Syaoransbear said:


> Ours are big, with the biggest being 150 acres. Dogs of all sizes go there. I've seen a chihuahua puppy that was about the size of a hamster there and nothing bad happened because there's no pack mentality going on with groups of dogs because there are no groups of dogs and dogs don't spend enough time with each other to start chasing games that can escalate when dogs are unfamiliar with each other.


:thumbup:

I imagine this is why our park does not have incidents like the one that sparked the other thread. With 25 acres and the rule that standing and gathering is not allowed, the dogs are always moving away from each other, and the owners are always vigilant, so there are no packs to hunt down little dogs and what not.


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## CarrieJ

pfitzpa1 said:


> One of my pet peeves is folk who chuck a ball for their dog in the middle of a busy dog park an complain when other dogs chase their dog or steal their ball. I have seen some people get quite upset about that.
> As I say it's mostly the people that are the problem not the dogs.


Yeah, I mean if it's so valuable why bring it to a dog park. I would kind of thank people politely when Alice was younger if their dog took her ball and they returned it......
"No thanks, we'll find another....no value" It's probably why she doesn't get all guardy about stuff.

I do miss the socialization that Alice got from hanging out with dogs her own size. She really is a dork and likes to play.
Her meds prevent her from coming to work with me.


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## ozzymama

I'm totally indifferent, they aren't for me. If other people want to go, it's their choice. 
I think dog parks are only as good as the people running them and the people attending them. I believe they are one more thing a prudent dog owner needs to research before making an informed decision on.


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## Capone22

Our dog parks are small gated areas. Like a backyard. There's no way I would ever take my dogs. I have a pit and a german shep and I feel like if something were to ever happen mine would be to blame simply by breed. If my dog is going to play with another dog, it's going to be one I choose because I know it's a stable do with an dog-intelligent owner. 


Sent from my iPhone using PG Free


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## Blanketback

I think they're good in general. If the people pick up after their dogs, that really makes or breaks it for me. I've seen one that was just a feces-pit, so I wouldn't use that one. The vast acreage ones sound amazing, but ours is just a small fenced area.

It isn't very busy, if you pick off hours, so half of our time is spent alone playing frisbee. It's nice to use the safety of the park for doing off-leash training, and using the other dogs as a distraction. When the dogs are well matched it's a wonderful thing to watch. I love seeing dogs run and play together!

Using a dog park comes with a risk, but I never take my eyes off my puppy and I watch other dogs for signs of trouble, and stop it before it starts. Or leave, depending on what's going on. It isn't right for everyone, or for every dog either. So far it's been a great for my puppy, but I wish more people could read their dogs better, because I've seen quite a few that shouldn't be there.


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## Verivus

I go to the dog park fairly often; several times a week. Dog parks are as good as the people who go there. It does bother me when I see someone's dog take a dump while the owner is chit-chatting obliviously. I am one of those people who takes their small dogs to the big side. Uh-oh, ring the alarm.  My little one sticks to me like glue, prefers to hang out on the table, and has no interest in playing with other dogs. Plus I know all the regulars.


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## Gharrissc

I'm pretty indifferent to the dog parks now. I don't go,but I feel that they are as good as the people and dogs who are in them.


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## Jenna&Me

We don't have any where I live, it's just a small town. The stories of what has happened do scare me though so not sure what I would do.

Even at the local markets on the weekend a woman let her dog say hello to Jenna. The OH had her at the time and this bigger dog growled and lunged at her. The owner just said to her dog "I told you to be nice".
I roused on the OH cos at 12 weeks and already an issue with barking dogs she did not need that. I am very protective of her at this early stage in her life so not sure what my reaction would be if bigger dogs were to harrass her.

She does need puppies her own size to play with though, our other puppy is a maltese shizhu cross and too small to tolerate a shepherd puppies play.


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## Kyleigh

Now I know why people get upset about dog parks, and some people are adamant about not going. I live in Ottawa, and fuzzybunny and I attend the same off leash park - it's huge! Lots of trails, trees, sand pits (yes, that means mud, dirt, mess!)

I can definitely say that if our dog parks were that small I would NEVER attend them either. 

I brought Kyleigh to the park as a puppy and she got to play with all the other dogs. Yes, I watched her like a hawk, but I was also watching the people and their dogs. Once she got a bit older (4 months) we started walking around the park and exploring the whole environment. It was my going to the off leash park that Ky met four of her best friends. 

Now when I go there, I always meet up with one of her friends and we walk the park together. It is so funny to watch her playing with her friend and then see another "friend" that she hasn't seen in a while and just bound over to say hello. 

Ky's "friends" with all types of dogs - there's a fluffy little white dog that she lets walk all over her - he jumps at her face and barks and licks, and hangs from her jowls and she just LOVES it. They wrestle, and chase and have a blast. 

I've seen some serious dog fights and loads of scraps, but never seen a dog get killed. I am SUPER vigilant when I am there. My eyes are constantly scanning the environment. There are some dogs and their owners that I know are idiots, so I avoid them. When there is a scrap / fight, I always call Kyleigh to me, and she comes instantly, and sits beside me. She has no desire to get in that melee!

Ky's never been "attacked" ... she was bit by a little dog (I posted about this in a different thread), but she didn't even react (I did LOL to the little dog owner!)

I have a number of pet peeves about the dog park:

1 - don't bring a freaking toy and wonder why you lost it
2 - don't bring a freaking toy and wonder why a fight broke out over it ... 1 toy, 30 dogs - you figure it out
3 - CLEAN UP after your dog - it's disgusting
4 - to the newbies - educate yourself ... hang around longer than 20 minutes ... walk with someone who has a well behaved dog and LEARN about your dog
5 - don't freak out b/c a dog tried to hump your dog ... I agree it's not always nice, but it is not a cause for world war 3 (I witnessed one woman punch another woman in the face b/c her dane got mounted by another dane! The police had to be called to split these women up ... it was quite the evening!)
6 - dogs can form a pack mentality if all you do is stand there ... and this is how other dogs get hurt
7 - learn the real definition of the word "attack" - I am sick to death of hearing about how some owners small dog got "attacked" by a GSD / Rottie, etc. whatever ... really? I'm pretty sure your 5-10 pound dog would be dead if it was really "attacked". Chased, pounced, jumped on / at, pinned, bit sure ... anything can happen to one dog by another dog, regardless of breed. I despise the word attack (unless it really is a true attack)


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## jae

I will go fairly often, but keep a hawk eye on every thing happening. If play gets way rough between the group, or any dog has its tail tucked during play, my boy comes back to me and waits until my clear.


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## TommyB681

Abbi loves playing with other dogs and we have only been in a few rare instances where her and another dog have had issues. Sometimes dogs just dont mix but for the most part she enjoys the company and has a good time


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## SueDoNimm

There is a small dog park just a few minutes walk from my mother's house and I have taken Jerry a few times when I've been visiting her. It's about two acres total, with one side for large dogs over 30 pounds and one side for small dogs under 30. It's very nicely shaded with lots of trees, has some agility equipment like jumps and weave poles, is very clean, and outside the fence is a dog water fountain, instead of buckets of gross water sitting around.

The first few times we went, there were no other dogs there and we wouldn't have entered if there had been. We left when other dogs showed up. The last time we went, there were three females around 40-50 pounds, two adults and a puppy, one a boxer and the other two mixed breeds. I watched them for a little while outside the fence and then we entered and I stood with Jerry leashed while the dogs greeted him and I talked to the owners. Once everyone seemed comfortable, I let him loose and would call him back every few minutes. He had a great time playing.

Jerry loves to play with other dogs more than anything. He wants to play with every dog he meets and he adjusts his play style to the dog. If it's an older or smaller dog, he runs slowly and is very gentle. If it's a large, young dog, he is faster and more rambunctious. If a dog is tired of playing, he will back off very quickly and leave them alone. I feel like he can be trusted with almost any dog, but I still wouldn't just turn him loose with a strange dog without monitoring the situation.

I think dog parks can be really great, but there are certain things I would never do. I would never bring out a toy around a bunch of strange dogs. I wouldn't just turn my dog loose without observing the other dogs first. I wouldn't take him into the park if there were more than 4 or 5 dogs there. And of course I would never take my 10 pound dog into the large dog park.

There isn't a dog park in my town, but there is a nice trail alongside a river where I can take my dog and let him off leash. He loves to run up and down the trail in front of me, stopping to smell and pee on everything. He even stops and digs a little, which is something I'd never seen him do until we went down there. He always comes back to me when I call or gets back on the trail if I think he's going too far off the side and tell him no. It's really fun just watching him be a dog, in a way that I don't get to see when we're walking on leash or playing fetch or training.


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## Jo_in_TX

If I suddenly stopped taking Teddy to the dog park, I think she would ask to be adopted by another family.


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## Scarlettsmom

PatchonGSD said:


> I dont use them. To much risk and worry involved for me.


Ditto


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## codmaster

DJEtzel said:


> I love my dog park.  I take all of my dogs & fosters here. And I work here.
> 
> Meadow Run Park - Home


 
Interesting place.

I like the requirement listed on the site about dogs *"must be non-aggressive to other dogs and obedient to owner".*

My question would be --- How are these things tested before the dog is allowed to run free in the park?


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## codmaster

jae said:


> I will go fairly often, but keep a hawk eye on every thing happening. If play gets way rough between the group, or* any dog has its tail tucked during play,* my boy comes back to me and waits until my clear.


 
What an observant dog! What does he do after you "clear"?


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## Lilie

My GSD isn't a social dog, therefore wouldn't enjoy running around with other dogs.


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## cassadee7

Saber loves dog parks! We make a point of going to different ones whenever we travel, but I am very selective and look up any info or reviews on the parks before we go. I prefer BIG parks with lots of space so we have an easy out for getting distance from any weird people. It's a nice way to relax and play off leash without getting a ticket (yep they do that around here!) Saber has a lot of dog park reviews with pictures on her blog


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## kitmcd

I like the concept of dog parks but our experience in reality was not so good. We did have some great days and enjoyed them tremendously but the 3 bad experiences turned me off for good.

My dog was attacked (can't think of a better word, though only small amount of blood involved) three times by three different dogs. One dog was permanently banned from park after the incident (took 4 adults to pull this pit off of her). One incident was with a golden retriever. Don't know what set her off, but she beelined 40 yards or so from across park and jumped on Isa, snarling biting and growling. Isa was not doing anything but standing near me. Those people (I hear) never came back again and they were very apologetic. It was so weird, they had been in park together before and the golden had never even looked cross-eyed at her. The other time was a pit again whose owner did pull her away and went outside the fence until we left....though as I was leaving just a few minutes later, came over and told me that my dog needed to "toughen up".

Our park does not have separate area for small dogs and people bring all kinds of balls, frisbees and tugs. Made me a nervous wreck. It only takes a few seconds for something tragic to happen. 

We will never go back again. Isa has some playmates where they can play safely in fenced yards and she lives with other dogs, so that will have to be her free play time.


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## sunsets

My favorite "dog park" here is probably most posters' worst nightmare. It's only about 7000 sq feet, the footing is wood chips, large and small dogs mix together, and it's nearly always packed. BUT, it's also a beer and wine bar :laugh:.Boneyard Dog Park & Drinkery, Houston's First Dog Park Beer and Wine Bar Hence its popularity! Owners grab a beer at the bar and head out back to the fenced in park and sit and chat at the picnic tables scattered about. Rules are pretty standard, and I really like the ones listed below:


Owners are liable for damage or injury inflicted by their dog(s). This means owners are legally and financially responsible for their dog’s behavior.
No dog or people food is allowed in the Dog Park.


(though I'll admit to breaking this one as I sneak in a few treats in a pocket so that I can reward my dog for a really good recall now and again)



NO CHILDREN are allowed in the Dog Park. No exceptions.
Owners must be in verbal and sight control of their dogs at all times and prevent aggressive behavior, biting, fighting, and aggressive barking. Never leave your dog(s) unattended.
Dogs must be unleashed in the transition corridor upon entering Park. ONLY ONE GATE OPEN AT A TIME. Owners must have a visible leash for each dog at all times.

Heinz and I visit about once every 2 weeks or so. He loves a good romp with other canines now and again, and I like that I can enjoy a pint while he blows off some steam. He's a smart dog, and gets out of scrums before they escalate. He'll trot over to me and wait until things calm down before jumping into the fray again. He also LOVES standing on the picnic tables - "I'm the King of the World!" and I let him get away with it there - it is the dog park, after all. 

The majority of patrons are great, and since most of us are fairly regular, a lot of self-policing goes on. Fights get stopped quickly and aggressive dogs are usually promptly removed. On our last visit, a Corgi snarled at Heinz, who immediately backed down, and I didn't worry about it. His owner came running over to apologize for "Winston Churchill"  and take him back to her table, which was super nice of her, but really, he was fine.


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## codmaster

A big problem of dog parks was clearly shown by the last post - a dog "snarled' at another one. If the dog being snarled at was not a seeming wuss - FIGHT ON!

if a dog that my guy considered credible (i.e. not a usual female or a puppy or clearly a small dog - he would react defensively and "IT'S ON". And he doesn't fool around if he does take such an aggressive move by another dog as serious!


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## sunsets

Wow. I was under the impression that a snarl was dog language for "Buddy, I mean it, GO AWAY before I use my teeth". So my "seeming wuss" of a GSD is in fact correctly interpreting that he'd be better off going to play with another dog. Which he does, and everyone's romp at the park continues without bloodshed. 

Obviously, if a dog responds to the canine equivalent of a verbal warning with instant escalation, he's not going to do real well in a crowded dog park.


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## Blanketback

I want to go to the Boneyard! What a cool place - and what a wonderful bunch of dog lovers they must be to have the adoption events, and the wall. Lucky you, sunsets.


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## Bubbles

I take bubbles when the park is empty. I go to the small side. I let her wander and play . She loves when this lady brings her basset hound. Bubbles likes to crawl all over the basset hound and sit next to the basset. When people start coming and there's a lot of dogs. Bubbles sits in my lap and watches all the Chihuahuas play. After 15 minutes of watching Chihuahuas we go home BC the park gets to crowded.


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## codmaster

sunsets said:


> Wow. I was under the impression that a snarl was dog language for "Buddy, I mean it, GO AWAY before I use my teeth". So my "seeming wuss" of a GSD is in fact correctly interpreting that he'd be better off going to play with another dog. Which he does, and everyone's romp at the park continues without bloodshed.
> 
> Obviously, if a dog responds to the canine equivalent of a verbal warning with instant escalation, he's not going to do real well in a crowded dog park.


 
Wonder where you got that impression of a "snarl", your dog tell you? 

But if that is what you want to believe, by all means do so. 

What do you think your dog might do if someone challenges you in that same manner when he is with you? Go and play with another dog?

If he wouldn't stand up for himself when challenged, you think he would do so for you?

Or maybe your guy just thought that he must have been doing something wrong himself when the other dog "snarled" at him so figured he would just back down from whatever he was doing wrong and "go play with another dog"?

Of course, if you are happy with him, then by all means that is good.

Personally my dog is not "dog park" material, as he *will* respond to a physical challenge from another dog. And I have seen too many not very social dogs in the few dog parks that we have visited. 

Although he is very good with most dogs and esp. with female dogs and young dogs.

I do think, however, that dog parks make very good training environments and use them frequently from the outside by walking around the outside from a distance and using the common rushes from dogs inside the fence to set great distractions while we are training.


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## briantw

I'm of the opinion that any time you go to a dog park, regardless of how well your dog is trained, there's a risk. Dogs are animals, and as such there's always the chance there could be a scuffle or a fight or just a freak accident. It happens. 

That said, there's a dog park attached to my apartment complex and I love it. I know most of the people and their dogs, and I know exactly which dogs that my two dogs love to play with or don't particularly get along with. Granted, my Boxer gets along with everyone, so he's not really an issue. If another dog tries to start something with him, he'll just back off. 

My Shepherd, on the other hand, isn't opposed to accepting a challenge from another dog, but I'm at the point now that it's easy for me to recognize when things are getting snippy and quickly recall him. He automatically sits and waits when a dog enters the park, and that helps immensely in avoiding problems. I've even got him to a training point where he will actively avoid playing with little dogs and dogs he doesn't particularly care for, thus eliminating problems before they start.

Really, though, the park is just great for burning off excess energy, especially after I've been at work all day. I can take my dogs on a long walk or jog, but nothing tires them out quite as well as thirty minutes of hard running in the park. It's actually kind of nice letting the Shepherd (he's still got that puppy energy) get a nice run in at the park before taking him on a long walk. He behaves so much better after fifteen minutes of running around like a jackass.


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## GSD mum

Dog parks are for other people as far as I'm concerned. My dogs are socialized with dogs we know (friends and or in classes) we don't need them to meet exercise requirements, get attacked, disease or learn obnoxious behaviors. Yeah, you could say I'm fully against them. lol


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## volcano

I brought apache for our 4th visit today, she still prefers me to all the dogs. And she hasnt started a fight yet, and meets every human in the park. Horrible, right codmaster? She may not protect me since shes not dominant over adult dogs... Thats ok though, I dont need my dog to protect me, if she ever did bite someone shed be put down after 2 strikes, thats something to consider when you train a so called attack dog to be unstable.


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## volcano

Ill also add, today was gsd day at the park. I think there were 6 at once and around 9 in the few hours I was there. Gsd arent super social from what I see, I can barely get one to stop and let me pet them. But my girl is the exception, she meets and loves everyone. I hope she stays this way.


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## codmaster

volcano said:


> Ill also add, today was gsd day at the park. I think there were 6 at once and around 9 in the few hours I was there. *Gsd arent super social from what I see*, I can barely get one to stop and let me pet them. But *my girl is the exception*, she meets and loves everyone. I hope she stays this way.


 

Heh! Heh! Heh!

Just Great luck for you to have one of the social GSD's.


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## codmaster

volcano said:


> I brought apache for our 4th visit today, she still prefers me to all the dogs. And she hasnt started a fight yet, and meets every human in the park. Horrible, right codmaster? She may not protect me since shes not dominant over adult dogs... Thats ok though, I dont need my dog to protect me, if she ever did bite someone shed be put down after 2 strikes, thats something to consider when *you train a so called attack dog to be unstable.*


 
Also great for you not to "*train a so called attack dog to be unstable*".

One small thing - can you explain how you go about training a dog to be "unstable"? What do you mean by "unstable"?

And while you are at it - what is a "*so called attack dog*"?


Why would your dog have to be "*dominant over adult dogs*" to try to protect you if you were attacked? I can't see a connection - unless you are referring to you being attacked only by adult dogs?

Interesting post.


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## llombardo

volcano said:


> And she hasnt started a fight yet, and meets every human in the park.


Its not her starting a fight that you have to worry about. A fight can break out in a split second, I know this because my dog was attacked at a dog park. And do you know what my dog was doing when he was attacked? Walking past a group of dogs, he didn't stop to say hi, he was just walking and that Rott was on him in seconds, there was nothing to stop because it happened so fast and getting that dog off mine seemed like it took hours. He never started a fight and he loves people to, but the other dog had other ideas and sadly my dog paid for it


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## Mrs.K

fuzzybunny said:


> I think it depends on the type of park. A small fenced in area is what a lot of people think of when they think dog park. In Ottawa our 2 major dog parks consist of acres of land with multiple walking trails through them. You can avoid the chaos if you choose to do so. I personally love taking my guys and will continue. If my only option was a small fenced in space where the dogs are pretty much forced to mingle then I wouldn't go. Also, for those of us who live in apartments, the dog park is the only opportunity we have to let our dogs run off leash.


Where in ottawa are they?

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## trcy

We go to the dog park rarely. Maybe 4 times a year if that. I don't really have issues with the other dogs. I have issues with their owners. They don't train their dogs and let them do whatever....

If we go, we try to go very early and when the idiots start showing up we leave.


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## Shaolin

I like dog parks for what they are; a prime socialization spot. When we were in Pgh, not many people in our social group had dogs. One friend had four, but past that, none. I knew early socialization was key and since we couldn't do puppy classes, dog parks were the next best thing. We stopped going on a regular basis once Finn turned three just simply because our social circle opened up a bit more to include more dogs and we were getting involved in other dog oriented things. 

I don't mind dog parks at all.


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## yote54

I agree, I go when the idiots are not there. Early. Our dog parks are not monitored and the same thing happens at ours that I read about elsewhere. Owners not being responsible for their dogs and if there is a problem, it's YOUR dog's fault, never theirs. They don't pick up after their dogs, they bring small children and strollers, a disaster waiting to happen. 

I found that day care centers, you have to be careful there as well. If they don't have enough staff, or poorly trained staff, you may arrive to pick up your dog and find out there's been trouble and no one bothers to call to let you know this until you arrive. My dog still HATES boxers because of this, an older one and he got into a fight. It takes two, though. The day care I take my dogs to now is wonderful.


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## martinaa

Dog parks are just like any other playground. Good, bad, or anything in between depending on who is playing. Only an ignorant person would consider all dog parks bad. Only a naive person would assume they are safe.

I've been to a dog park where the regulars policed the community better than a paid professional could. And I've been to a dog park where the regulars thought it was funny when their dogs formed packs to gang up on other dogs (even their own). Neither park was anything out of the ordinary when the regulars weren't there.


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## volcano

I agree with the post below this one. I was anti dogpark, my breeders told me to keep her out of there and petstores. But I also dont have alot of friends with dogs Id want her around. I started with petsmart after her 2nd shots and it was apparent that small dogs could scare her. I didnt like that so I decided she needed socialization but at the petstore the dogs are evil. Thats where the untrained owners congregate.
At the dogpark it can be good or bad. I see alot of almost fights, and alot of dumb owners. But it has been a posotive so far. We probably wont keep doing it but as a puppy I want her to get used to all kinds of stuff.


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## Anubis_Star

I hate crowded busy dog parks. Too many fights, unvaccinated animals, etc....

I like the open space dog parks out in west arvada. Multiple acres, several different areas fenced in, never busy. I could even take my fear aggressive boy there off leash for some exercise without having to worry about bumping into another dog.


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## Mrs.K

Thankfully ours are more deserted than used on Drum. So we are constantly using them.


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## AngelaA6

if there's a few dogs at the park but enough to give each animal respectable space i'd let him go play and as long as the owners are all in view and watching their dogs. Luckily the first time i went there were only four other dogs so I was able to learn whether or not they were up on vaccs and flea treatments


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## volcano

I did a bit more research and it looks like its ok for my girl so far. I was concerned at her "fear" she like hanging with me vs joining the pack who are trying to figure out whos boss. 
Thats because she knows Im the boss, she has no need to try to boss the confused dogs who think they are in charge. I can do that for her.


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## RiverDan

We tried two dog parks today. Didn't like either. We sat very far away from everything, just to slowly introduce Baron to it. We watched too many fights happen over a very short period. Just not interested in that scene.
We meet a lot of dogs on our forest hikes, and everyone seems nicer. The parks felt like a soap opera.
Plus, of the 100+ dogs we saw today, only one was a GSD.


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## curedba

We live in Calgary and have some great dog parks however you of course need to be a responsible owner meaning your dog should have an Awsome recall or be leashed at the park as not all dogs are friendly ( which in my opinions and they shouldn't be there) and then there are also people who are afraid of breed me being one of them
Actually however I am ok with mine because I know he is properly trained and socialized how we this is not the case for most GSD in my area we are very experienced with strong breeds ie: Dobermann, Rottweiler, Pitbull Etc... But I still feel very strongly that the GS breed is far stronger as smarter than those breeds and therefore can understand why people are scared of them they are used as police dogs I love the breed and would not choose another for our family as a companion and as a helper foru daughter they are strong, magestic and loving and all around best breed as log as thy are socialized and trained properly.


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## ocie

Well,

I adopted my GSD for a little over 8 weeks ago. She's very sweet and likes to play with all dogs, big and small. In this short time, she's learned to come when I recall her, sit, stay, won't bother another dog when I use corrective language, etc. 

She's now been bit twice in a little over two weeks at the dog park I've been frequenting. Each incident involved a different dog. The first bite was on her side and required 9 staples to close. The owners of the other dog paid for the vet bill, were very cooperative and apologetic. I figured it was just a "wrong place, wrong time" situation, as the dog had been playing well with the others. When my dog wanted to join the fun, she was bit. I had been watching the entire situation and didn't see any behavior that could have provoked the bite. The owners said they were not going to bring their dog to the park again.

Today, she was playing with another dog for about 6 or 7 minutes and no signs were hinting that things were getting hostile. While Maggie was giving (playful) chase, the dog bit Maggie's ear and a chunk was taken out. I should have known better after the first bite, but my pup loves the dog park and enjoys playing with others. She did not retaliate or show any aggression towards either of the dogs who bit her, before or after said bite.

I'm not bringing Maggie there again. 

But, martinaa said it best:



martinaa said:


> Dog parks are just like any other playground. Good, bad, or anything in between depending on who is playing. Only an ignorant person would consider all dog parks bad. Only a naive person would assume they are safe.


This park is enclosed and is claimed to be 2.17 acres. It's a come one, come all type park. For as many good owners, there are just as many bad ones. I'm just happy that my pup is going to be ok and will recover soon.


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## Bridget

I think dog parks are good for "dog-park dogs." But if your dog isn't a dog-park dog, give up quick.


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## lorihd

the dog park was good when lexie was young, now that she is older and less social with other dogs, especially the small ones, we don't go anymore. I really don't miss having to pick up other dogs droppings, its blows my mind how lazy dog owners can be.


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## pets4life

i wish we could organize things with certain dogs or something but the park is too risky, my dog will get along with only certain dogs, not the pushy in your face ones, 

She loves to play chuck it, I use to take her in dog parks to play that but its still not a good idea because other dogs can come pick a fight and we will get in trouble.


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## Tiffseagles

Nope. Don't like them at all. I know a dog that was killed at the dog park in an incident. I know many others that have either been brought to the dog park when the owners KNOW the dog has issues with other dogs and others that were victims of dogs owned by these types of people. 

I also know quite a few that picked up infections from other dogs brought there (when the owners knew they were sick). I also don't like that so many get shut down for being unsanitary or having disease outbreaks.


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## lauren.theos

I think dog parks are a great concept, I really do, but just not executed in the right way. The main problem? No restrictions as far as neuter and spay go. I work as a dog behaviorist and I know and have experienced first hand that most aggression and dog fights come as a result of an un-neutered dog. There are many examples of this. 
First, If you have a pack of neutered male dogs and introduce a non neutered dog it causes a tricky reaction. As soon as the other dogs sense that there is an un- neutered dog in the pack, many times they quickly start to gang up on him, singling him out and it often ends up in an attack. (Keep in mind that this reaction typically only happens in a large pack after the dog that is not neutered is about 6 months or older). 

Like every other being on this planet dogs are primarily motivated by the drive to reproduce. Sex is a big thing. When you take two un-neutered males and introduce a female that is not spayed it causes extreme aggression in the 2 male dogs, more times than not this results in a fight. (usually when the female is in heat.) Similarly, if you have a neutered male with an un-neutered male and introduce that same female, you are likely to see aggression stemming from the un- neutered dog, once again resulting in a fight. Meshing all of these dogs together in one dog park can defiantly have some very adverse reactions and outcomes.

Another aspect that concerns me about dog parks is the lack of knowledge that most dog owners have about dog behavior. Many people have a hard time distinguishing when dogs are playing normally then when the play is starting to get to rough to the point of it escalating to a full blown fight. Not many people know how to read a dogs body language. A trained eye is able to tell if a dog is becoming to dominate, if they're becoming irritated, if they're fearful ect... Keep in mind, just because a tail is wagging, doesn't necessarily mean the dog is happy.

Lastly, most people that take their dogs to the dog park are inexperienced on how to properly break up a dog fight, should one occur. I understand that if someones dog gets in a fight they want to do anything thing they can to break it up as quickly as possible. However, if a person doesn't know how to do this properly it can result in serious bodily injury. If you are ever in a position where you need to break up a dog fight remember these tips:

If you ever need to break up a fight pinch the area of skin that connects from the front of the back thighs to the torso. Since this is a pressure point more times than not it'll cause the dog to release it's bite. Your risk of getting bit is decreased ten fold because of the difficulty it is for a dog to reach that area standing up. 

If a dog has another dog by the throat NEVER try to tear the biting dog off. This can cause the skin to tear and rip, possibly making the injury even worse!

NEVER BREAK UP A FIGHT BY GRABBING A DOG BY THE COLLAR OR BY THE SCRUFF this is way to close to both of the dogs mouths for comfort. 

If you or your dog does end up getting punctured (even if it doesn't seem that bad) seek medical attention immediately! Dog bites get infected very easily and you or your pup will most likely need to be put on antibiotics.

So in a nutshell I think there are far to many risks involved with dog parks. If they had supervisors that were trained in dog behavior and a rule that states the dog must be fixed after 6 months of age then I would be all for it. Unfortunately that just isn't the case. If you want dog to dog socialization maybe try a reputable doggy daycare instead. Just be sure that it's one that offers supervised group play and specializes in socialization.


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## FirefighterGSD

I don't attend dog parks, nor will I ever. Just too many "what iffs" associated along with the concept and then the people add to the fiasco.


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## LaRen616

I love the idea of dog parks and I really enjoyed them when I used to take Sin there but after a while other dogs started picking on him. He is a very submissive dog and the other dogs picked up on that. It became really annoying when other people didn't pay attention to their dogs and didn't correct their dogs when they were acting out so we stopped going.

So I like them but they are not for me or my pack.


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## Michele Maxcy

Not a fan


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## Wolfgeist

I took my puppy a few times already to a local puppy socialization group with at an accredited training facility.... that is as far as I go with large groups of unfamiliar dogs. They screen the puppies coming up for vaccines and temperament... all the puppies are happy, friendly, and play well.


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## martemchik

lauren.theos said:


> So in a nutshell I think there are far to many risks involved with dog parks. If they had supervisors that were trained in dog behavior and a rule that states the dog must be fixed after 6 months of age then I would be all for it. Unfortunately that just isn't the case. If you want dog to dog socialization maybe try a reputable doggy daycare instead. Just be sure that it's one that offers supervised group play and specializes in socialization.


No offense, but I find this really funny...

Don't go to the dog park where YOU are in control of your dog's interactions. Instead, take them to a doggy day care that's staffed by high school teenagers and let them control your dog's interactions. Sorry, I'm yet to find a single dog day care that is day in and day out run by someone that knows more about dog behavior or has had more experience than your "involved" pet owner or sport person (but generally sport people aren't taking their dog to day care anyways).

Generally, the owner, or possibly the manager do know more. They've probably been trainers of some sort at one point or another. But the people that are actually watching your dogs? High school, maybe college, probably working for minimum wage. Sorry...but that's the type of work it is and the wage the market calls for.

The only good thing about dog day care is that they generally just kick out "aggressive" or dominant dogs and so the group stays safe. I know this because my boy got kicked out of one at the ripe old age of 4 months old after being "too aggressive" for the other large dogs at the day care...a bunch of 100lbs+ labs and hunting dogs.

I've already said this in another thread...a good trainer costs anywhere from $50 to $100 an hour. Why in the world do you expect to get that same person watching your dog for 8 hours after paying just $20 for the day?


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## martemchik

Wild Wolf said:


> I took my puppy a few times already to a local puppy socialization group with at an accredited training facility.... that is as far as I go with large groups of unfamiliar dogs. They screen the puppies coming up for vaccines and temperament... all the puppies are happy, friendly, and play well.


Puppies are perfect for this...they can't really hurt each other until they get to about 6 or 7 months old. As long as the pups are all around the same age...and not 6 month olds playing with 2 month olds, its a great way to socialize.


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## wyoung2153

I think if Titan was different I wouldn't like them. I can absolutely see why people don't like them I witness it all the time when I am there. I guess I just luck out in the fact that Titan is AWESOME when we are there. He doesn't want to play with the other dogs at all.. and because he literally ignores them they tend to do the same. We just play fetch. I don't go frequently but enough that I have knowledge of the certain dogs that are there that I like and don't like (more the owners that I like/dislike) My saving grace is I'm right there and I REALLY pay attention to who's there, who comes in, what the dog's behavior is displaying, etc. If for a second I see a potential problem, I leave. No question. I also am not afraid at all to confront other owners if their dog is acting out.. which I have noticed seems to be more of an issue for people.


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## Eiros

I'm sure many dogs do great, and Warden would too as he loves to play, but it's just too unpredictable for me. We do doggie daycare at our training club, and I trust the handlers and the other dogs that they put Warden with for play. I wouldn't trust a most of the "chain" places, as I've heard plenty of horror stories about those too! 

I realize that people use daycare to avoid crating their dog all the time (that's why I use it), and I think that's great if you can find a place that does it right. I don't really see the point of dog parks though... if you have time to sit and watch your dog play, you have time to play with him yourself, or socialize him in a more secure environment. Just my opinion, though Im sure playing with other dogs wears them out faster lol.


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## Shepnut

"Dog parks"?

Bad fad at taxpayers' expense.

Footnote- to the one from Ottawa, yes the park is very large and not fenced but even there, there have been issues of dog to dog aggression and dog to human aggression. Locals who like to jog and ski in the adjacent parkland have complained about feces and being chased by dogs. It would seem that at a minimum fences would be in order just like any other city- and time will tell.


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## Harry and Lola

Eiros said:


> I realize that people use daycare to avoid crating their dog all the time


Sorry to change the subject, but why do people need to crate their dogs all day when away from the house? 

The only time I use a crate is when I have a puppy and I feed puppy and older dog in the same room but put puppy in crate to eat until old enough to know not to go near older dogs food and to respect each others food bowl. Other than that, I trained them not to eat the pillows or the coffee table legs, also the side of our sofa! So I am able to leave 2 dogs together with the run of the house for hours. Wouldn't it be better to spend some time training your dog to respect your house?


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## DJEtzel

Shepnut said:


> "Dog parks"?
> 
> Bad fad at taxpayers' expense.
> 
> Footnote- to the one from Ottawa, yes the park is very large and not fenced but even there, there have been issues of dog to dog aggression and dog to human aggression. Locals who like to jog and ski in the adjacent parkland have complained about feces and being chased by dogs. It would seem that at a minimum fences would be in order just like any other city- and time will tell.


Taxtpayers' expense? I don't pay taxes for the dog park I use...


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## wyoung2153

Harry and Lola said:


> Sorry to change the subject, but why do people need to crate their dogs all day when away from the house?
> 
> The only time I use a crate is when I have a puppy and I feed puppy and older dog in the same room but put puppy in crate to eat until old enough to know not to go near older dogs food and to respect each others food bowl. Other than that, I trained them not to eat the pillows or the coffee table legs, also the side of our sofa! So I am able to leave 2 dogs together with the run of the house for hours. Wouldn't it be better to spend some time training your dog to respect your house?


While this is not MY case as I don't crate Titan often anymore, I do know many many people that have dogs that just can't be trusted outside their crate. They get into things, the make a mess, they destroy things, etc. It's not due to lack of training, I truly believe that some dogs just can't have the run of the house.


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## martemchik

Dog owners are taxpayers as well...should we not have any say in what we want? Should all county/city land just be allocated to "people parks" that get used WAY less than dog parks do?

As far as cost/benefit, I guarantee that dog parks are the cheapest way to give the biggest part of a population a benefit. You need a fence, and a mowing once in a while. On top of that, most municipalities charge either a daily fee or a yearly fee, which although many people don't pay, some do and help to off-set any cost.

Bringing taxes into the discussion is like me saying we shouldn't build play grounds for children anymore because I don't have any kids and therefore have no use for the play ground.


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## Shepnut

martemchik said:


> Dog owners are taxpayers as well...should we not have any say in what we want? Should all county/city land just be allocated to "people parks" that get used WAY less than dog parks do?
> 
> As far as cost/benefit, I guarantee that dog parks are the cheapest way to give the biggest part of a population a benefit. You need a fence, and a mowing once in a while. On top of that, most municipalities charge either a daily fee or a yearly fee, which although many people don't pay, some do and help to off-set any cost.
> 
> Bringing taxes into the discussion is like me saying we shouldn't build play grounds for children anymore because I don't have any kids and therefore have no use for the play ground.


Government shouldn't be in the position of grabbing capital from citizens/dwellers in order to bestow random "benefits" to a portion of the populace, for non-essential services. 

Additionally, there is no moral equivalency between providing amenities for children and spending community funds on dogs.

Taxes enter this discussion as most dog parks are community dog parks and not private.


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## martemchik

Shepnut said:


> Government shouldn't be in the position of grabbing capital from citizens/dwellers in order to bestow random "benefits" to a portion of the populace, for non-essential services.
> 
> Additionally, there is no moral equivalency between providing amenities for children and spending community funds on dogs.
> 
> Taxes enter this discussion as most dog parks are community dog parks and not private.


So...government shouldn't take care of any parks? Shouldn't take care of roads?


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## Shepnut

martemchik said:


> So...government shouldn't take care of any parks? Shouldn't take care of roads?


Noooooo, martemchik, this is not what I am saying. This is one endeavor government should stay out of- dog parks.

I am pro-dog, obviously.

These are not two contrary points of view.


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## GrammaD

To get the topic back on subject after the nifty little political diversion....

Dog parks are as good or bad as the users make them, for the most part. Of course a deficient structure (not having separate areas for large and small dogs as an example) will lead to problems too. But in the main I would say it's the owners who make or break the park where safety is concerned.

I won't use the one in my community. Too many inattentive owners. But I really wish I could because I'd be able to walk to it instead of having to drive out to club land for really good off leash play.


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## lauren.theos

martemchik said:


> No offense, but I find this really funny...
> 
> Don't go to the dog park where YOU are in control of your dog's interactions. Instead, take them to a doggy day care that's staffed by high school teenagers and let them control your dog's interactions. Sorry, I'm yet to find a single dog day care that is day in and day out run by someone that knows more about dog behavior or has had more experience than your "involved" pet owner or sport person (but generally sport people aren't taking their dog to day care anyways).
> 
> 
> 
> None offense taken and thanks for the input!
> 
> I got my start working at a "minimum wage" doggy daycare and you have your info all mixed up. In REPUTABLE daycare facilities everyone on staff has some sort of certification in dog behavior as well as first aid and CPR. Also, one thing that you have to understand is the owners of these facilities are there to make money, sure they have the bare minimum qualifications in dog behavior but they don't interact with the dogs one on one. The staff get to know, and treat these dogs like their own. You'd be lucky if an owner or manager even knows your dog by name.
> 
> To think a dog owner that has no history in dog behavior knows more about pack mentality, body language ect... than a certified behaviorist is just plain arrogant. Sure maybe one owns 5 or 6 dogs at a time and they know these dogs very well. But high end daycare's see tons of different dogs everyday. It is really frustrating working in the dog business. Everyone is so convinced that their dog(s) are the best most well behaved dogs in the world, and if anything wrong ever happens its always whoever else was involved fault. Sometimes its best to see a dog through eyes that are not biased from the fact that it's their "baby".
> 
> You are right about one thing though. I worked at a daycare in my early twenties and many of my coworkers were around my same age. We didn't make as low as minimum wage but it wasn't the highest paying job in the world. But what people have to understand is that the employees are so passionate about what they do, they love these dogs like their own. You have to be a special breed of person to work with so many different types of dogs day in and day out. I honestly believe I learned more from working at a daycare then I did going to school for my line of work. I hope people don't decide to pass up daycare as an option on false pretenses or assumptions. DO YOUR HOMEWORK. Ask to see the facility, ask what sort of certification is required for employees, be an "involved" dog owner. Because in my opinion you can still be an "involved" dog owner and have a full time job. And maybe that "involved" dog owner doesn't want to leave their dogs alone all day.
Click to expand...


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## FirefighterGSD

FirefighterGSD said:


> I don't attend dog parks, nor will I ever. Just too many "what iffs" associated along with the concept and then the people add to the fiasco.


I want to clarify on my earlier post above. I did go to the dog park once, 2 years ago, with our now deceased GSD. He was attacked by a Pitt and sustained an injury to his left eye that took forever to heal. Not only did I end up with an injured dog but I never received an apology from the other dogs owner and several requests for vaccines records went unanswered. Hence my comment earlier today about people adding to the fiasco. Just wanted to be clear on my opinion :smirk:


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## David Taggart

People who take their dogs to the doggy park tend to kill two birds with one stone: let the pets to exercise without much effort on the part of their owners, and to have a good unbiased yack, being free from wives and daytime pressure rememberings. People stand in a group, they laugh, talk, bring food and alcohol with them sometimes, enjoy themselves freely in a way they would never enjoy in any other circumstance. If anyone would ever come for the sake of his dog - he would stay away from the group just throwing the ball. The dogs come as a secondary issue, despite the fact that the main topic of their owners' discussions are dogs and everything about the dogs' etiquette, socialization and good training, people exchange good advises. People stand in a close circle facing each other, some dogs are clinging to their legs (just breething fresh air is good enough for them) because they would never come to the place themselves, while younger dogs together with puppies are running around and barking. Sometimes that or the other owner starts to call his dog - he didn't notice that his dog has run away. If there's any fight - the majority of people wouldn't know the reason, because they didn't watch how it started. Puppies watch, puppies learn. Sometimes some idiot decides to make his way through the area and immediately attacked by dogs. 
If you think you can learn something professional, or your dog pick good habits - you are wrong. But you can find friends for life, or for many years at least, and nowhere else you can watch different dogs of a different age behaving in the most natural way.


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## Gwenhwyfair

In the context that it depends on whose ox is being gored, no they are not contrary. 

Dog ownership rates are very high in this country and most dog parks are created and maintained at the local level, city/county. The people of the community get together and petition their local representatives to have a dog park and it is agreed to via the public meetings, zoning, council or county board members the tax payers have asked for and gotten what they wanted. 

Personally I don't like dog parks and I don't use them but I support the process by which they are brought into existence. 

If people don't want to have dogs parks they are free to utilize the same process to try to block them. It has happened in a small town near me. 

It's not controlled by some over bearing macro ideology, it's just local folks deciding what is important to them in their communities.



Shepnut said:


> Noooooo, martemchik, this is not what I am saying. This is one endeavor government should stay out of- dog parks.
> 
> I am pro-dog, obviously.
> 
> These are not two contrary points of view.


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## Blanketback

I don't understand why people can't agree that for some dogs, dog parks are great. And that the people who use them are what makes them a particularly good one or a bad one. If the feces aren't picked up, and the dogs are ignored, and people bring in anti-social dogs, then of course it's a terrible idea. But for the most part they're a great idea - we just have to know if they're suitable for _our own_ dogs. Nobody else can determine that but us.


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## DJEtzel

Blanketback said:


> I don't understand why people can't agree that for some dogs, dog parks are great. And that the people who use them are what makes them a particularly good one or a bad one. If the feces aren't picked up, and the dogs are ignored, and people bring in anti-social dogs, then of course it's a terrible idea. But for the most part they're a great idea - we just have to know if they're suitable for _our own_ dogs. Nobody else can determine that but us.


Exactly! 

to lighten the mood, here is Patton relaxing in the office at our dog park last week. 


At the office by DJetzel, on Flickr


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## martemchik

Blanketback said:


> I don't understand why people can't agree that for some dogs, dog parks are great. And that the people who use them are what makes them a particularly good one or a bad one. If the feces aren't picked up, and the dogs are ignored, and people bring in anti-social dogs, then of course it's a terrible idea. But for the most part they're a great idea - we just have to know if they're suitable for _our own_ dogs. Nobody else can determine that but us.


Because...in America you are free to make the life choices you want, as long as the majority (and in some cases the minority) agrees with those choices. And for all you Canadians...don't even get me started...

When it comes to the forum...dog parks are a no-no, so anyone that uses one is in the wrong. BTW...we all use the same dog park and so one person's bad experience is 100% guaranteed to repeat itself when one of the other members visits that dog park.


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## Blanketback

LOL martemchik  and oh how cruel DJ, that pup looks miserable!  

My biggest worry (since my dog is social - otherwise that would be my _main_ worry, lol) is other possibly unhealthy dogs, and my pup potentially picking something up from them. That's why my vet told me not to use the nearest dog park to me, because it's such a small area - it's really puny, under 2 acres. When I did use it, I wouldn't let my pup drink from the communal water bowls for that reason.


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## SiegersMom

I take my dog to the dog park from time to time. Normally since he goes with me while waiting for my daughter to get out of dance we normally walk downtown on leash but I know he loves the freedom of running around a new place from time to time. Ours is fenced in, not tiny but not huge either. When I go it is normally empty and only a few will come during that time. I will leave if too many show up. I wish we had a large park with trails. *DJEtzel *I think it is great you have a large park with people working there to keep it nice. Do people pay to go there? Ours is just a city park with no supervision. They mow it...and have tried to plant trees. Just keeping grass up around the entrance has been a challenge. When I look at how much space could have been dedicated to the dag park it is kinda sad. They could have gone way bigger but I guess that take more fence and more money


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## DJEtzel

SiegersMom said:


> I take my dog to the dog park from time to time. Normally since he goes with me while waiting for my daughter to get out of dance we normally walk downtown on leash but I know he loves the freedom of running around a new place from time to time. Ours is fenced in, not tiny but not huge either. When I go it is normally empty and only a few will come during that time. I will leave if too many show up. I wish we had a large park with trails. *DJEtzel *I think it is great you have a large park with people working there to keep it nice. Do people pay to go there? Ours is just a city park with no supervision. They mow it...and have tried to plant trees. Just keeping grass up around the entrance has been a challenge. When I look at how much space could have been dedicated to the dag park it is kinda sad. They could have gone way bigger but I guess that take more fence and more money


 Yes, it is membership-based. A year membership (unlimited access) for one dog is $365. Dogs must have proof of vaccinations and must be friendly towards temperament test dogs and employees to visit/join.


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## SiegersMom

DJEtzel said:


> Yes, it is membership-based. A year membership (unlimited access) for one dog is $365. Dogs must have proof of vaccinations and must be friendly towards temperament test dogs and employees to visit/join.


It is hard to compare a park like yours to the standard dump em out and let em run parks. I would be much more comfortable at a park like that. Too bad there are not more!!!!


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## DJEtzel

SiegersMom said:


> It is hard to compare a park like yours to the standard dump em out and let em run parks. I would be much more comfortable at a park like that. Too bad there are not more!!!!


I say this all the time! I wish there were more.


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## wyoung2153

DJEtzel said:


> Yes, it is membership-based. A year membership (unlimited access) for one dog is $365. Dogs must have proof of vaccinations and must be friendly towards temperament test dogs and employees to visit/join.


I can say this... I am VERY VERY jealous of your situation. Lol.. I would love a place like this.. in fact I would like someplace like that to then tack on some sort of basic OB requirement or CGC..


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## DJEtzel

wyoung2153 said:


> I can say this... I am VERY VERY jealous of your situation. Lol.. I would love a place like this.. in fact I would like someplace like that to then tack on some sort of basic OB requirement or CGC..


We do have a basic OB requirement, though it is loosely regulated. We will kick out dogs if they are not under verbal control and it becomes a problem because of dogs harassing another, etc. We have CGC evaluators come into the office frequently to test dogs as well, so we do encourage owners to be active in training!


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## Curtis

We are not allowed anymore since Empire is intact. But we have been dozens of times and only had positive experiences. If there was an undersocialized dog that looked shy or frightened, we left it alone. 

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## Gwenhwyfair

Last time I was at the dog park (training outside of the fenced areas) a man had a full grown pittie in the small dog section.

He was working on his OB with distractions it looked like. :wild:

People brought their little doggies in and seemed a bit unnerved by the presence of a large adult dog in 'their' area.

Woo hoo!

One thing I can say about the dog parks around me (public, half grass, half dirt, all kinds of people and dogs most not trained) they do provide interesting scenarios to observe. :blush: :crazy: Every time I go I get to see something new of the SMH kind.


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## wyoung2153

DJEtzel said:


> We do have a basic OB requirement, though it is loosely regulated. We will kick out dogs if they are not under verbal control and it becomes a problem because of dogs harassing another, etc. We have CGC evaluators come into the office frequently to test dogs as well, so we do encourage owners to be active in training!


Lucky you  I can only dream! This further tacs on to my dream (that keeps growing the more on on here) of my large breed dog rescue, daycare, and now dog park :wild:


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## Cassidy's Mom

David Taggart said:


> People who take their dogs to the doggy park tend to kill two birds with one stone: let the pets to exercise without much effort on the part of their owners, and to have a good unbiased yack, being free from wives and daytime pressure rememberings. People stand in a group, they laugh, talk, bring food and alcohol with them sometimes, enjoy themselves freely in a way they would never enjoy in any other circumstance. If anyone would ever come for the sake of his dog - he would stay away from the group just throwing the ball. The dogs come as a secondary issue, despite the fact that the main topic of their owners' discussions are dogs and everything about the dogs' etiquette, socialization and good training, people exchange good advises. People stand in a close circle facing each other, some dogs are clinging to their legs (just breething fresh air is good enough for them) because they would never come to the place themselves, while younger dogs together with puppies are running around and barking. Sometimes that or the other owner starts to call his dog - he didn't notice that his dog has run away. If there's any fight - the majority of people wouldn't know the reason, because they didn't watch how it started.


This is nothing like any park I've ever been to. What country do you live in, and is that the norm there?


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## IllinoisNative

I'm lucky, I'm near one of the best in my state. Of course, you have to pay. You have to have a pass to be in there, you can't bring more than two dogs, and your dogs have to be current on their shots. It's also patrolled at random.

It's huge and not fenced. Open water/lakes for the dogs to swim. They have a Newfoundland dog group that goes there to teach water rescue to their dogs.

What I like about it is that there are NO park benches. You do not sit there and watch your dogs. You WALK with your dogs...lots of trails, etc. Not many fights since everyone is walking. I also chose to go at non peak times...never on weekends. Too many inexperienced people show up on weekends. Of course, it's not as bad as it was on weekends when it was free...lol. 

The most down time owners have is when the dogs are swimming. I also know my dogs. If I don't like the vibe, we leave. I scope out the place before I even let my dog out of the car. Mostly it's just us regulars who walk together. 

I also know it only takes one bad experience to scar a dog...so I'm more leery than I used to be. I haven't been to one in a while since my dog who loved the park passed away. My other one is a chow mix...and while very friendly with other dogs, doesn't really care for exercise. :crazy:


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## Benny Boo's Mommy

*Another Two Cents' Worth*

I'll just leave this here and hope for the best.









My husband and I take our one year old GSD, Ben, to the dog park every day. It's February and we've been going every day since October, when we got Ben. We don't have a fenced yard (apartment dwellers), so this is what we do to keep him active and well-exercised. I won't say there haven't been some incidents, because there will always be issues with using a public access park--he did get a bad bite once, but luckily, the owner of the other dog paid for his vet bill! However, for how often we go (every single day, probably have missed five days total in the 4 months we've had our dog), the usual situation is a pleasant time for Ben. He doesn't always play with other dogs (he loves the chuck-it), but there are usually friendly dogs to play with when he does want for company. He LOVES the dog park and can't wait to go every morning. We probably spend at least two hours there every day. (Like I said, no yard at home).

The dog park we go to is a small (one acre) neighborhood park and we know most of the dogs by now. The "regular" crowd has been very friendly and supportive of us "newbie" dog owners and, maybe because they are regulars, their dogs are mostly well-socialized dogs. It _is_ usually busy on the weekends, but we can go early or later in the evening and avoid the "sunny afternoon" crowds. Typically on weekdays, Ben arrives at the dog park right after school drop-off for my son. At 7:45 a.m., probably only the diehards are hanging out anyway. It may be an atypical park in the sense that it is very community-strong, with dog parkers doing the maintenance in the park (light grounds upkeep, mulch spreading, clearing paths, etc) and many of the people who go there are really invested in keeping it clean and safe.

My family loves our local dog park very much. It's dear to our hearts because it's been a place where our dog, who is a rescue and needed some serious rehabilitation, has flourished. He's gone from a sad, emaciated stray (a very "average size" 9 month old male GSD, about six feet long, 25 inches at the shoulder, but only weighing 54 lbs!!) from the local pound, a guy who could barely move around, to a strong, confident, happy boy (73 lbs at one year old!) who is friendly and loves to run and play for hours. Most people who take their dogs to our dog park know Ben and, as I said, have been very encouraging of our efforts to bring him back to health. He's been happy, he socializes with people and dogs every day, and he's put on some good weight and muscle. The dog park is where we've bonded with him over games of chuck-it, frisbee, and the flirt pole. It's a pretty little place too, with lots of soft mulch in the running area and even a small "trail" to walk.

That said, it's been becoming clear to me over the past few weeks that Ben is starting to outgrow the dog park. Not that he doesn't still love it...he does--it's "his" space and he is always super excited to go--but things are changing. 

Ben is just over a year old now. Although he is not overly demonstrative (he doesn't mind being petted, but he'd rather lie close by, than ON us), he is a healthy, strong, and confident dog who is even-tempered and passionately devoted to our family. 

So, the dog park. It's obvious to me (and other park-goers have commented) that Ben is a whole lot more than your average "just there to wrestle and dig" or "fetch a few times" doggy. 

[Note: I'm going to out myself right now as a new dog owner and first time GSD owner. I'm also that idiot who emo-adopted a large, very sick animal because it was obvious he was going to die in the pound. I had no real idea what "a Shepherd" was or could be. He could have been a terrible, neurotic, or vicious animal (the city animal control does not temperament test at all). Luckily, it worked out anyway.]

Why Ben might be outgrowing our favorite little dog park:

1. Having never been to an obedience class, Ben is, and always was, easily the best dog park dog with commands: sit/down/turn around/come/bring it/look, etc...SO MUCH BETTER than the other dogs at our dog park. I don't say this out of smugness, but to illustrate what I saw as the difference between Ben (the only "dog park regular" who is a GSD) and many other breeds and mixes. Where some pet parents struggled with basic commands, all we had to do was ask Ben a few times and give some snacks and he'd usually get it. He likes to learn new things all the time. ALL THE TIME. (My husband is trying to teach him "smile" right now.) Since my husband and I are both new dog owners, we could not attribute his awesome grasp of commands to our own abilities. 

[I don't mean to say he's some kind of perfect dog--Ben still has the stray forager mentality and can't be trusted with counter tops or the garbage. He's just "awake" in a way that a lot of dogs don't seem to be.]

Okay, Ben likes to learn. Nice as they are, no one else at our dog park does much training there. Mostly the playtime at the dog park, if there are a lot of others, is unstructured roughhousing, which Ben isn't very interested in. I don't think anyone participates in training clubs, that I know of, either. We get a lot of good info on nutrition and dog toys, even cold weather gear, from our chummy dog park friends (and I do love them). But it's kind of a dead end in terms of more advanced training knowledge. [Pardon me if this is all old hat; I'm a newbie with no yard. So the dog park is my main source of experience.)

2. Ben is a sociable guy--he likes other dogs, large and small, but he is not the dog to "go mill around" while Mommy and Daddy chat and drink coffees. He will play and run for fifteen to twenty minutes when we arrive (longer if there's only one or two dogs and he knows them well, he's not into the dog-mob wrestling AT ALL), but once we start a game, he is "on"--this guy wants the chuck-it and training games for a solid hour or more. He doesn't want to play with other dogs during that time; he just wants specific, structured, playtime and a lot of it. 

It's getting to be a problem because he gets annoyed if another dog horns in on his game. He doesn't attack them, but he does chase them away. Given that this is a small space, it's hard to do a lot of chuck-it or training without other dogs coming to find out what's going on. So lately we can't even take out the chuck-it unless the park is nearly empty or the other dogs are uninterested in fetching games. If we can't do games, it's hard to get him the level of exercise he needs (a LOT now), because he _doesn't_ _and won't _"just run around", and then he's restive at home. 

Like I said, I'm a new GSD owner, but I can see that Ben's needs have shifted from rehabilitation to something more. I don't think I have it in me (or that Ben has it in him--he's still building confidence) to do something really serious, like bite work. However, I'm looking into maybe rally, or tracking, maybe even herding classes--something that will give him a job he loves and where he can realize his full potential. I view this as akin to putting my kid in soccer and baseball to keep him active and stimulated. I know the AKC holds a lot of these classes and I hope to get Ben enrolled in something like this. Because he's a rescue, he doesn't have papers, but we think we can get him into the "pure breed alternative listing" (PAL?) or whatever that is, that allows him to participate in their rally and obedience classes.

I've also thought about training him to run beside a bicycle, but I have heard that he shouldn't go for long runs until he's older than two. Also, I'm not sure jog/runs are as mentally stimulating as training classes of some kind.

I still love our dog park and want to continue spending time there. We must, as long as we live in this apartment (again, no yard). But I want to shift it to a supplemental "social" outlet rather than Ben's main outlet. I still think that socialization is so important, especially living in a big city environment. I want him to cheerfully greet people who want to say hi on the street or at the cafe or restaurant (and because we live in the dog-tastic city of Atlanta and he's turned into a beautiful guy, a LOT of people want to say hi), to be able to sit quietly through an outdoor poetry reading (which he has done admirably), and behave himself with other dogs in public. So, yes, dog parks, especially if they are situated in cafe/restaurant areas like ours, can help with that (I think), but it is clear lately that my dog needs more than the morning roll in the mud.

I'm only a four-month owner and this is only my experience. Take from it what you will. Also, if anyone has advice on fun classes/etc, I would love to hear it. My husband and I newbies, but we are passionate about our good-good boy.


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## Harry and Lola

Benny boos mum -- your situation IMO is normal, once they hit that 1 yo mark they change and don't really enjoy other dog company. You sound like an excellent owner and your gsd will thrive under your care. Def try OB or rallying as they love having a job to do and often do very well in training. If you are worried about him not getting the exercise he got with the chuck kit you could fit a weighted back back on him during walks. Best of luck and he is a lucky boy to end up with your family


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## Okin

There is one near me with a swimming pool, all the dogs have to pass a temperment test and they get kicked out if they act up. It is pretty expensive but the dogs act well. I would take her to that one no problem. 

There are others around here were people sit on their iPhones while their dogs hump every other dog in the park and never look at them. 

There was one here last year were a guy ended up shooting a pitbull that was attacking his dog. He asked the lady multiple times to keep the dog away from his dog then it latched on his dog's throat.


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## Benny Boo's Mommy

Harry and Lola--thank you very much for your kind words. I'm so glad to hear this is pretty normal for Ben's age. I have to say this site and all the forums have really helped a lot! This is how I found out about PAL and stuff like rally. I don't post a lot because I am not an "expert" on anything, but I do read many of the threads here and the the information is so valuable! Thanks again!


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## Mandarigma

I'll pass when it comes to dog parks. To me a dog park is basically a good place to get your dog villainized for clobbering some other dog that has no manners. My dog pretty much tries to ignore other dogs but doesn't take to well to the ones that run up in his face or try to hump him.


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## kshadow

Never went, never will. 
Chaotic situation I don't want to be part of.


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## newlie

No for me. Newlie can be reactive, although not always. I think it has something to do if he feels challenged or not. But even if he wasn't, I don't think I would take him. It seems to me that things are always fine and everybody has a good time until suddenly, one day, it's not. And there is no going back once something happens, whether your dog is the aggressor or the other dog. And it won't matter if a smaller dog is biting your dog's face off, if your dog reacts, he will get the blame.


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## selzer

I think there is a tendency to make a standard of behavior that is acceptable with respect to our dogs and if dogs fall on the other side of that standard, then there is a flaw in them. This is not necessarily so. 

Not every GSD dislikes dog parks, some can do very well running and playing with other dogs. But, that does not mean those that just do not care for the ramped up activity with strange dogs are flawed. It is kind of like me saying that if you do not like roller coasters, or bicycling, or roller skating you are flawed. But I am not flawed if I don't like running or playing basketball or tennis. Some dogs just don't care for that scene, just like I don't like night clubs. 

And then there is the rest of it where you can't tell about other owners, and their dogs and all that.


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## yuriy

A local animal control officer told me in no uncertain terms that most dog parks are full of idiots that can't control their dogs, and suggested that it's in my own best interest to walk my dog elsewhere.

There are times I go to dog-friendly parks (ie. trails), beaches and the like, but never again to an enclosed "dog park."


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## MineAreWorkingline

The dog parks I go to are full of mostly wonderful people with very well trained and socialized dogs. We have professional dog trainers, people who train their dogs in IPO and PPD and people that just have good dogs that are well behaved and well disciplined frequenting the local dog parks. People who don't watch their dogs or have dogs that are wild and out of control are a near myth in my area regarding dog parks. The dogs have a great time and are well exercised. Anytime there is a problem, it can normally be traced back to toys, treats or Pit Bulls.

After many years of successfully frequenting many different dog parks, I would not hesitate to recommend them. I would not pay much attention to all the negative responses of people who have never used dog parks vs the many who actually have extensive experience with them.


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## Findlay

*Dog Parks - Good? Bad? Indifferent?

BAD!!!!!!!!
*


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## selzer

yuriy said:


> A local animal control officer told me in no uncertain terms that most dog parks are full of idiots that can't control their dogs, and suggested that it's in my own best interest to walk my dog elsewhere.
> 
> There are times I go to dog-friendly parks (ie. trails), beaches and the like, but never again to an enclosed "dog park."





MineAreWorkingline said:


> The dog parks I go to are full of mostly wonderful people with very well trained and socialized dogs. We have professional dog trainers, people who train their dogs in IPO and PPD and people that just have good dogs that are well behaved and well disciplined frequenting the local dog parks. People who don't watch their dogs or have dogs that are wild and out of control are a near myth in my area regarding dog parks. The dogs have a great time and are well exercised. Anytime there is a problem, it can normally be traced back to toys, treats or Pit Bulls.
> 
> After many years of successfully frequenting many different dog parks, I would not hesitate to recommend them. I would not pay much attention to all the negative responses of people who have never used dog parks vs the many who actually have extensive experience with them.


 I think these things have to do a lot with your location. In our location, an animal control officer does not need any education or experience with anything save our county alone. Our county doesn't even have a dog park. So, listening to an animal control officer here really doesn't mean you have someone who knows what they are talking about on the subject. But if they do, it could be just for the area they are familiar with. We do not even have any government subsidized shelter here.

Other places have parks and recreation that put money into dog parks, and shelters and probably have requirements for an animal control officer, like some police training, conflict resolution, animal behavior, etc. You may also have parks that have stricter controls on who uses them and what behaviors will get you removed, and then they may actually enforce that. 

I think it just depends, neighborhood to neighborhood.


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## yuriy

selzer said:


> I think these things have to do a lot with your location. In our location, an animal control officer does not need any education or experience with anything save our county alone. Our county doesn't even have a dog park. So, listening to an animal control officer here really doesn't mean you have someone who knows what they are talking about on the subject. But if they do, it could be just for the area they are familiar with. We do not even have any government subsidized shelter here.


The AC's opinion was one I've heard from a hundred people, and hold myself. I posted that to make a point that even the 'authorities' (or at least some of them) share that point of view. 

I did try dog parks when my dog was smaller, have been to a half-dozen different ones for short periods of time, and pass by my neighbourhood's dog park every day on our usual dog walk. Just about every time I see problems in what's going on there, and I won't put my dog into those situations.

The simple fact is that the average dog owner is clueless, and statistically speaking, 50% of dog owners are going to be worse than that. Group these people and their dogs together in a small, enclosed space, and you're not likely to get anything positive out of it. Sounds like some places are much better, but not so where I live.


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## MineAreWorkingline

selzer said:


> I think these things have to do a lot with your location. In our location, an animal control officer does not need any education or experience with anything save our county alone. Our county doesn't even have a dog park. So, listening to an animal control officer here really doesn't mean you have someone who knows what they are talking about on the subject. But if they do, it could be just for the area they are familiar with. We do not even have any government subsidized shelter here.
> 
> Other places have parks and recreation that put money into dog parks, and shelters and probably have requirements for an animal control officer, like some police training, conflict resolution, animal behavior, etc. You may also have parks that have stricter controls on who uses them and what behaviors will get you removed, and then they may actually enforce that.
> 
> I think it just depends, neighborhood to neighborhood.


:thumbup:

I find far more problems in leashed areas of parks and walking in neighborhoods.


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## Mavi

*Good*

Where I live they are good, ours covers many acres and has different pens...small, big and huge! Water and in the trees. Blessed really.


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## huntergreen

my experience at dog parks have been positive. people clean up after their dog, no disease traced to dog park and have seen a nice variety of breeds. no issues in close to 15 years. feel free to google wantage nj dog park. as for the article, most every neg listed can happen on a dog walk.


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## Chip18

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Cesar recommends dog parks? On what basis?


Millions of folks watch his show! I don't know that he has actually "endorsed" Dog Parks! At the end of most episodes they conclude with the now friendly rehabbed dog running in the Dog Park and happily playing with other dogs! 

*"Kinda like "Monkey see Monkey do,"* Alpha Rolling anybody??

For the record I did hear he regrets having endorsed that technique, although most likely he not endorse it for his followers to do themselves?? (note the disclaimer.) Still they have to put stickers on hair dryers so people dont use them in bath tubs!

But what happens when the next bad owner comes in with an equally out of controlled dog and get's into with one of Cesar's rehabs?? Does he make a return call to them if the rehabbed dogs has a relapse?? Am I the only one in America (the world??) that ask that question?? To both I have to say ... I don't know???



MineAreWorkingline said:


> If you base your opinion on dog parks on the ability of JQP to control their dogs, then please explain to me the difference between JQP taking their dog to a dog park or JQP allowing their dog to run free or walk their dog on the streets? If JPQ can't control their dog at a dog park, then surely they lack that ability when in home territory, even if it is going out to get the mail and the dog slipping out the door as you walk by. A dog attack is a dog attack regardless of where it occurs.


 Yes ... I would luv to see me make that argument also??? Unfortunately I cannot.

JQP is nothing if not consistent, in there "inability" to control "problem dogs!" My utter content for the "ignorant" is well founded! My second puppy Stewie Boxer/APBT 12 weeks at the time, was on leash on the sidewalk to my right. We were walking along and I was doing what I do scan forward and behind, look for open garage doors and people in there front yard and keep my ears open, I am actively looking for loose dogs! Oh yeah and two houses from home!

We were walking by another house, when I "hear" people yelling and a front screen door slam open?? I turn and I see a 90 lb APBT making a beeline for my puppy! In one smooth motion I sung my puppy behind me and faced that dog down! He was not getting to my puppy without a fight!! He paused confused not really seeing me, he was locked on my puppy, and I blocked his target! That gave his "clueless" owners a chance to scoop him up!

I think the guy kicked the dog as he got him back into the house?? Most likely that guy and that dog were regulars at the Dog Park in San Jose??? I have no idea, I did not know where any local Dog Parks were??

I'll grant that perhaps that author is doing a bit of an over reach?? 
But by and large most of the "hard core" no Dog Parks no "unknown dogs" folks are primarily concerned with aggression in unstable dogs being owned by unstable clueless dog owners, who do take those dogs to "Dog Parks." 

Dog Parks are an avoidable situation. A dog out of the blue on a local walk may or may not be?? The price to keep your dog safe is "constant vigilance!" And "not" putting them at risk of the ignorant helps out in that regard. I have no problem with that myself.



MineAreWorkingline said:


> In the past year, I have had three attacks on my dogs, one right in front of my house, one in a dog park, and one in an ON leash area in a park. I know it is deeper than that, but based on those attacks, two out of three did NOT occur in a dog park but in other areas being portrayed in this article as safe. I think not and to say so is not just misleading but potentially dangerous. It gives people a false sense of security.


 Think I just covered that??
Anyone that has a false sense of security ...won't now! 



MineAreWorkingline said:


> Besides, what makes you so sure that another dog is determined to bite your dog unless the dog is a) possibly dog aggressive so is not a dog park candidate (among many other possibilities, of course), or b) my biggest concern would be a problem owner.


 I have no idea what the other dogs intent is?? Not really my concern, my intent is that they don't reach my dogs without my "assessment" first. The "other" dog is what determines my response.

And of course a Dog Aggressive dog should not be at a dog park! I posted a link to "Three Dogs who should not be at a Dog Park" most likely the people that most need to know it, only discover it, after a problem, if they care at all! The victims will look for solutions the habitual perpetrators won't! My dogs are not going to be stepping stones on someone's path to self awareness!

By default if a dog is out of control and being put in a position where he can practice bad behaviors the "owner is "unaware." My "goal" is to help others avoid them. Staying out of Dog Parks is a pretty good first step. 



MineAreWorkingline said:


> It is no secret among dog park enthusiasts that a leashed dog in an unleashed area is usually attached to a problem owner, not the other way around.


 No doubt and depending on where you live those would likely be owners with Concealed Carry Permits?? Dogs aren't the only danger in Dog Parks!



MineAreWorkingline said:


> Out of the Boxer encounters you mention"We" shattered that! : ed, I would be very curious about the circumstances. Where there treats involved? How about toys? Seriously, how did a dog come to lose both eyes in a dog fight?


 The dog that was blinded was at a Dog Park. I know because she said so! I remember that one because it happened before "I" posted my warning! I hesitated for a day or so because I did not want to be a PIA! I went to post it, and I saw what had happened! I took that one personally! 

The second one I just saw on face book! A go fund me to raise the funds for the surgery. One eye lost and skull damage! No details, other than a dog attacked her puppy. Don't know if it was a Dog Park a Stray or a "I thought my dog was friendly" encounter gone horribly wrong?? 

When people have had there dogs maimed they don't really want to talk about it. 



_ *** Post over 3000 words long!! Truncated by ADMIN *** _


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## MineAreWorkingline

Chip18 said:


> Millions of folks watch his show! I don't know that he has actually "endorsed" Dog Parks! At the end of most episodes they conclude with the now friendly rehabbed dog running in the Dog Park and happily playing with other dogs!
> 
> *"Kinda like "Monkey see Monkey do,"* Alpha Rolling anybody??
> 
> For the record I did hear he regrets having endorsed that technique, although most likely he not endorse it for his followers to do themselves?? (note the disclaimer.) Still they have to put stickers on hair dryers so people dont use them in bath tubs!
> 
> But what happens when the next bad owner comes in with an equally out of controlled dog and get's into with one of Cesar's rehabs?? Does he make a return call to them if the rehabbed dogs has a relapse?? Am I the only one in America (the world??) that ask that question?? To both I have to say ... I don't know???
> 
> Yes ... I would luv to see me make that argument also??? Unfortunately I cannot.
> 
> JQP is nothing if not consistent, in there "inability" to control "problem dogs!" My utter content for the "ignorant" is well founded! My second puppy Stewie Boxer/APBT 12 weeks at the time, was on leash on the sidewalk to my right. We were walking along and I was doing what I do scan forward and behind, look for open garage doors and people in there front yard and keep my ears open, I am actively looking for loose dogs! Oh yeah and two houses from home!
> 
> We were walking by another house, when I "hear" people yelling and a front screen door slam open?? I turn and I see a 90 lb APBT making a beeline for my puppy! In one smooth motion I sung my puppy behind me and faced that dog down! He was not getting to my puppy without a fight!! He paused confused not really seeing me, he was locked on my puppy, and I blocked his target! That gave his "clueless" owners a chance to scoop him up!
> 
> I think the guy kicked the dog as he got him back into the house?? Most likely that guy and that dog were regulars at the Dog Park in San Jose??? I have no idea, I did not know where any local Dog Parks were??
> 
> I'll grant that perhaps that author is doing a bit of an over reach??
> But by and large most of the "hard core" no Dog Parks no "unknown dogs" folks are primarily concerned with aggression in unstable dogs being owned by unstable clueless dog owners, who do take those dogs to "Dog Parks."
> 
> Dog Parks are an avoidable situation. A dog out of the blue on a local walk may or may not be?? The price to keep your dog safe is "constant vigilance!" And "not" putting them at risk of the ignorant helps out in that regard. I have no problem with that myself.
> 
> Think I just covered that??
> Anyone that has a false sense of security ...won't now!
> 
> I have no idea what the other dogs intent is?? Not really my concern, my intent is that they don't reach my dogs without my "assessment" first. The "other" dog is what determines my response.
> 
> And of course a Dog Aggressive dog should not be at a dog park! I posted a link to "Three Dogs who should not be at a Dog Park" most likely the people that most need to know it, only discover it, after a problem, if they care at all! The victims will look for solutions the habitual perpetrators won't! My dogs are not going to be stepping stones on someone's path to self awareness!
> 
> By default if a dog is out of control and being put in a position where he can practice bad behaviors the "owner is "unaware." My "goal" is to help others avoid them. Staying out of Dog Parks is a pretty good first step.
> 
> No doubt and depending on where you live those would likely be owners with Concealed Carry Permits?? Dogs aren't the only danger in Dog Parks!
> 
> The dog that was blinded was at a Dog Park. I know because she said so! I remember that one because it happened before "I" posted my warning! I hesitated for a day or so because I did not want to be a PIA! I went to post it, and I saw what had happened! I took that one personally!
> 
> The second one I just saw on face book! A go fund me to raise the funds for the surgery. One eye lost and skull damage! No details, other than a dog attacked her puppy. Don't know if it was a Dog Park a Stray or a "I thought my dog was friendly" encounter gone horribly wrong??
> 
> When people have had there dogs maimed they don't really want to talk about it.



_
*** Original Truncated by ADMIN *** _


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## Chip18

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Where did I say any of that on this thread?


Yes I know!!!

When I closed my browser I found where I wanted to be!:crazy:

I need a mod to move this:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/7363962-post118.html

to here:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/general-information/595722-great-article-about-dog-parks.html










:hammer:


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## zudnic

Depends on the park and size of area. The smaller area ones with lots of dogs can be a real problem. Too many loose dogs unsupervised can lead to dog fights. Fights can turn into dog aggression problems with your dog. They can be bad. I forget the parks names now, but the Mississauga area had several large parks that you could be off leash at. One near the lakeshore was huge and fully fenced. It was spread out maybe 100 acres. You could be alone and let the dogs run around. You might bump into a dog or two loose, but it wasn't a dangerous pack. A big park that allows off leash dogs can be good. I just don't like small areas with packs of dogs.


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## AaronG

Always, always depends on the park, people certain people (and types of people) gravitate towards certain parks. There is one that is probably 1/4 mile from one of the interstates that I have to pass often and I always see about 20-30 dogs in a 1 acre area. While the location sounds terrible, the spacing sounds terrible, from the looks of it (I've never been inside this particular one myself) people just keep everybody leashed up and it's mostly just a spot for people to go and talk among themselves and dogs are kept close to their owners, everybody always looks relaxed (or so it seems from a distance), and it's really not a place to run around and play, just, meet.

Then you have a couple other parks that are huuuuuuuuge around here, if your dog took off like a shot, even though there are tall fences, there are spots where you will probably be searching for him/her because of all the brush. You see people bring their dogs in, unleash them, the person sits down and the dog takes off like a shot; and to no surprise there are some aggressors in there and the big dog is more likely the one they will blame something happens.

Yeah, there are some good ones, even good small ones. There are just some places that I will avoid. Do you research, act accordingly.


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## kauffmds

Like everyone else has said, it all depends on the park. We have a dog park at a state park that's near by. It's actually 2 fairly large spaces, with tall chain link fencing around it. It's subdivided by a chain fence, with small dogs (under 40 pounds) to one side, and everyone else to the other side. Fresh water is provided on each side. The people I meet respect the park and keep it clean. 

Also, the park behind my house welcomes leashed dogs and provides doggie poo bags and receptacles for disposal. Dog training is conducted every Tuesday at the pavilion. They're currently setting up the drive through Christmas decorations, but we walk it every year with our dogs. The people taking donations at the exit always have doggie cookies for our guys.


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## Orson

I know this is going to sound bitter but I personally hate going to dog parks for the social aspect of it. There are some great parks that I have found where everyone is in the same boat as me and just wants to enjoy watching their dog play and work on their socialization all I am saying is be prepared to meet some nut bars and bad dogs. 

I can't go to one park because of a regular who brings his little Boston Terrier mix who goes after my dog every single time.

I also have encountered a lot of dog walkers who bring dog's into the park they don't really know and on top of it all will try to promote their business by schmoozing with you. The same applies to some dog trainers, some are really cool and will give you tips but others will just be there to show off their work and tell you whats wrong with your dog but give you no insight on how to fix the problem. It's just a matter of finding the right park that works for you and your dog. Good luck!


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## Drewbacca

there's one a few blocks away thats more of a touristy dog park, i tend to keep mine out of there unless there's less than 5 dogs in there. also not a fan of community water bowls. twice i've had expensive vet visits, 1 for catching roundworm and the other for coccidia. roya seems to be more interested in me playing with her than other dogs playing with her anyway.


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## kat1

*
*

*I love this article posted on Leeburg.com
*

*Using Dog Parks to Proof Obedience with Michael Ellis*

Dog parks can be dangerous but they can serve a purpose. We use dog parks as distractions in order to proof our obedience exercises. In this video, Michael Ellis demonstrates how to utilize dog parks for this without putting his dog in harm's way. Watch as Michael works his dog, Pi, on positions and heeling while 2 dogs are running and fence fighting right inside the park. Michael never goes inside the dog park, instead he stays outside the fence and uses the other dogs to proof his obedience through distractions.​ *Introduction*

This article will detail three topics concerning dog parks:


The original purpose of dog parks
The problems and dangers of taking your dog to a dog park.
How to prepare for a dog park
How to handle and protect your dog while in the dog park

*The Purpose Of A Dog Park*

It would seem pretty obvious that a dog park is a place for people who don't have a lot of personal space to take their dog for exercise. The perfect example would be apartment dwellers or people who live in big cities.
The second and possible more common reason (which I disagree with) is that a dog park is a place for a dog to socialize with other dogs.
*The Dangers of Dog Parks *

Every couple of days I get an email from someone asking about problems with their dogs being attacked when they are on walks or running loose at one of the local parks that many cities setup.
People also question me on how to deal with overly aggressive dogs that belong to other pet owners. They also question me about their own dogs not trying to defend themselves when approached by a seemingly aggressive dog. Some people want to know if they should just let the dogs work these problems out themselves.
I want to go on record as saying that the concept of "Dog Parks" was well intended but a bad idea, especially when dogs are allowed to run off-leash. The main problems all stem from people who don't understand and have not established pack structure with their dogs. This means their dogs are out of control.
The average dog owner does not take the time to understand much less install pack structure. They don't know how strong the pack instincts are in their family pets. These drives can and often do click into high gear when a dog is taken into a park with strange dogs.
When a new dog comes into a park that other dogs visit every day the new visitor is often seen an an intruder into "the personal territory" of the regular visitor. More often than not they are not seen as new found friend. This often leads to either to territorial aggression, dominance aggression or fear aggression. 



Leeburg.com


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## Chip18

Hey some new "anti" Dog Park stuff I have not seen! THe trainer thing is pretty hysterical.
And rather off putting I would imagine??

Never thought about the water bowl, thing and I have not seen that Leerburg article before?? Nice observations and advise there.

I have nothing to add Dog Park wise, clearly they vary by location but as MAWL so accurately pointed out most "situations" occur close to home! 

So far for me it's been seven in total (non contact) they don't get past me thus far. But "Rocky" seems to be a stray dog magnetic?? 5 attempts in the last few years and four "attempts" in the last eight months!

The last one was my neighbors dog who ran across the street and got in Rockys face! Non conflict, the dog was just poorly trained and judging by the look on her face when she got "really" close?? She questioned her "choices" as "Rocky" must have looked a lot smaller from across the street??  

But that was today and a two week ago's a ****zu made a suicide run at Rocky! Door dasher, I tried to spin Rocky to the outside towards the street but at 116 lbs that did not happen! But at some point that dog rethought its choices and slowed enough for the owners to scoop him up! As usual "Rocky" was like no big deal but I don't like being charged by strays!

Long way of saying ... keep your guard up near home!


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## MineAreWorkingline

Leerburg wrote: "The main problems all stem from people who don't understand and have not established pack structure with their dogs. This means their dogs are out of control."

Despite his experience and his videos dedicated to establishing pack structure and dog training, I actually find it amusing that Leerburg also states that his personal dogs very rarely ever let loose and when they are, they always have an e collar on.

It would appear that some of Leerburg's philosophies are fundamentally flawed.


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## 45acpguy

not a fan of dog parks myself... most around my area are not maintained properly. Sad!


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## AlphaTango

I like dog parks myself. But I admit, a lot of them are not maintained very well. As long as the dogs that go there are pretty friendly, it's a great place to let your pup socialize. Just wish some owners that do have aggressive dogs would keep a better eye on their own to better help prevent some of the fights you see.


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## zyppi

not a fan.


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## Michael W

Bad. Too many handlers disconnected from their dogs.


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## InControlK9

I took my GSD there that I use to have some years ago... it was a good experience

no complaints from me.. I would go again


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## Concetta Parsons

Awesome thread..


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## Orson

Love this thread. I don't go to the dog park anymore because of two reasons. The first being the amount of horribly trained dogs with owners who are just as bad. If my dog gets attacked by one more little fart of a dog I'm going to loooooose it. The other reason I stopped going is because of this weird open invitation to come up to other owners and talk their faces off. I don't mean to be rude, but I have just finished a long day of work and I just want to enjoy my coffee and watching my dog have the time of his life - Telling me about how you discovered your gluten allergy for an hour instead of letting me enjoy my dogs company only makes me hope that you eventually end up eating gluten. 


We don't go to the park anymore...


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## karladupler

We only go to one dog park...cause i know most of people there and their dogs are in control....i have tried different ones but we only like ONE in particular other ones are way "to trashy" to be 100% honest.


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## zetti

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Leerburg wrote: "The main problems all stem from people who don't understand and have not established pack structure with their dogs. This means their dogs are out of control."
> 
> Despite his experience and his videos dedicated to establishing pack structure and dog training, I actually find it amusing that Leerburg also states that his personal dogs very rarely ever let loose and when they are, they always have an e collar on.
> 
> It would appear that some of Leerburg's philosophies are fundamentally flawed.


LAPD trains their K9s pretty well and they are all required to be wearing e collars due to the litigious nature of our society.

Working dog trainers use e collars a lot. I don't know why Ed's personal dogs wear them, but I don't think that alone is an indictment of his training methods. There are plenty of other reasons to be critical of Ed, but I don't think the e collars are evidence of failure.


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## MineAreWorkingline

zetti said:


> LAPD trains their K9s pretty well and they are all required to be wearing e collars due to the litigious nature of our society.
> 
> Working dog trainers use e collars a lot. I don't know why Ed's personal dogs wear them, but I don't think that alone is an indictment of his training methods. There are plenty of other reasons to be critical of Ed, but I don't think the e collars are evidence of failure.


No where am I faulting the use of e collars. I think to better understand my statement you also need to realize that not all of Frawley's dogs are "police style" but some are lapdogs to which he applies the same mistrust in his own methods. Somewhere it was written or on a video that he has a @ 50 x 100 foot pen for his dogs for exercise with the balance of exercise deriving from being very slowly walked (from a dog's perspective) on leash. He openly admits that his dogs are very rarely given any freedom to run. When they do, it is with an e collar, but that is just a mere incidental to my point which was commenting on his lack of faith of his own training with him being in the dog training business.


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## DeadEye

I honestly don't believe there are any nearby dog parks around me  but my GSD has a Golden/Lab mix friend


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## Chip18

DeadEye said:


> I honestly don't believe there are any nearby dog parks around me  but my GSD has a Golden/Lab mix friend


Known safe dogs only ... is a good policy.


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## Nurse Bishop

I take my 10 month old GSD bitch to a dog park a couple times a week but only when at least one of the two fenced areas is empty. I use it for off leash training under heavy distraction. She knows 22 commands and it is a great place to put her through her paces and to generalize commands. Generalize means obeys no matter what in all situations. 

No way would I let her possibly be attacked by the out of control pit bulls and curs I see there. Nor would I let her be exposed to the running and screaming small children I see there. Its just not a good idea. I do not have children and live on a cattle ranch. To socialize her to small children I take her on leash to various big box stores where there are families and make her heel and down. Children come running up and want to hug her but are not allowed to approach and I politely say she is being trained. I watch her like a hawk. 

Inga does not need to 'play' with other dogs. She plays with her humans. She does visit three dogs that live on a neighboring ranch and is not dog aggressive. She rides in the back of my truck in a wire kennel and used to bark at strange dogs. But now this is not allowed by use of the Enough command.

It is such a joy to live with and train such an intelligent dog. This is my first German Shepherd and is unlike any dog I have ever had in my life.


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## HeavyMetal

Personally, I don't like them. Not saying they aren't a good thing, but I don't really like my dogs running around with other dogs I don't really know. My dogs always socialize whenever we are out for are daily walks.


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## Akita Inu

We used to take my last GSD there all the time. WE also took my GSD Lab mix before her there all the time. We also take my mom's little dog there too. I don't know if I for sure am gonna take my puppy there though...


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## car2ner

a little while ago it was a gorgeous long weekend. The dog park was very crowded. Most of the dogs weren't even playing, they were just milling around. We don't bring our dogs into the dog park, we walk them around the park's ball fields and along the disc golf course. We started away from the dog park and circled back around, so that by the time we passed the dog park fence, our dogs were calm, cool and collected. Then someone decided to "walk" their doberman off leash in the large park and it was happily bouncing around. The owners saw us and yelled at their dog to lay down, which it did and flinched. "hey, it is a beautiful day and we are here to play...why are you yelling at me?" We gave him grief for having his dog off leash (if he had calmly called the dog to his side we probably wouldn't have said anything). 

With all the other people walking dogs on leash in the park, all the people playing disc golf, etc, running at large outside the dog park was a poor choice. They should have off leashed in the dog park, IF their dog was the right temperament.


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## Lanky

Not a fan at all. I rather have more control over who my boy socializes with instead of the khaos of a canine wrestlemania.


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## Bentwings1

We have a football field size private dog park at our appartment group. It was custom designed by idiots. LOL. I voted strongly against it even though I'm the only dog owner training dogs. We have at least 75 dogs in residence at any time.

There are already plenty of negatives posted so I won't get on my phantom soap box about the dog parks.

Many of you have high drive GSDs or at least very active dogs. An attack or even a close call while your dog is young or even a new rescue can be a life long issue with these dogs. Many think a dog's attention span is very short. If that were true it would be pointless to train. Many dogs have memories as long as we do. Well some people. 

When a built in feature, maybe call it instinct gets violated, a dog will,probably never forget it. For example his drive to protect himself. He gets beat up at the dog park by a pack or a bigger stronger dog. He is not going to like being in the same situation ever again. He also will associate even similar situations elsewhere. Read by us now as reactive. Some dogs on the other hand, plain and simple don't have the mental capacity to see they almost lost their life in the encounter. They willingly come back for more. We don't even think about this. The dog is having " fun". Play dates continue......

I don't follow this play thing with dogs. My own dogs have only training class socialization and we meet only trained dogs and their owners. The dogs do not sniff tails or noses. They sit,stand or down in heel,position or close by while we people, converse. If this can't be done then we go on our way. Classes provide a way of controlled close contact with other dogs and people. 

When out in public we simply don't get close to other dogs, especially dogs showing problems. My Aussie is remarkable in large groups encounters. It's like a giant training class for her. She has " fun" and good things happen in class so she is well behaved out and about. The exception is our appartment. Here she was attacked by a loose dog and bitten. She has not forgotten this for a minute. Believe me the other dog (Rotty ) will not forget me nor will the owner. It's been a challenging effort to get " tolerance" of other dogs. She looks to me when she first sees a dog and gets a reward. It visually and mentally calms her. There are no hackles or barking or lunging. It's been a long course of conditioning and training. I had never had a reactive dog. Even the serious protection dogs were rather reserved but gentle in the presence of even idiot dogs....and owners.

We had multiple dogs at times but even so tolerance was the exercise asked for. Not all dogs like other dogs just as people don't always like each other. We had German Shepherds and Boxers. The big male Boxer and male GSD hated each other. However We walked these dogs side by side, following and leading as well as switching heel sides. They each looked to me or wife whoever was handling them at the time for guidance. They were perfect gentlemen in public or with our kids. But alone they would probably have fought to death.

We as people at least try to get along but sometimes we just have to go the other way to avoid those we don't like. Dogs don't always have that choice.
Byron


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## Cassidy's Mom

Bentwings1 said:


> Many think a dog's attention span is very short. If that were true it would be pointless to train. Many dogs have memories as long as we do.


Attention span and memory are not the same thing.  Puppies DO have very short attention spans, but that does not mean they don't remember things, particularly traumatic experiences. It just means they're easily distracted and you can't expect them to pay attention for long periods of time, so training sessions with a puppy or young dog should be shorter than with an adult dog that is capable of focusing for longer. Several very brief training sessions a day are better than one longer session.


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## Bentwings1

You are right. I should have simply left that out. Our language is easy to misuse and take out of context.


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## Tiptx4

*Dog Parks good or bad?*

I'm not sure why people are so surprised at the way some dogs behave at dog parks. People are idiots as it's no different then seeing people take their kids to the park and play while the parents are busy on their cell phones, and not paying close attention to their kids. Dogs are not the blame it's the owners. I'm not against them but lately there has been a big problem when they get over populated as then it can become an issue with fights breaking out.


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## Jackal

I dont go inside. But use them for proofing my dogs. By going ever closer to the dog park fence n noise of them barking at us.
From my perspective. A dog is a pack (family) animal that does not need, nor is it natural to be with dogs or humans outside of its pack (family). I dont want my dog to be friendly to humans or dogs. I want neutral. Plenty of socialising near/around others at dog sports club. Also: ive been (mis)using dog parks n the out of handlers control dogs for over a decade. Seriously foolish ignorant owners. Who believe "he's really friendly" ignorant of what your dog is, is only 1/3 of equation of my risk assessment. 1/3 is whats my dogs reaction n final 1/3 whats on the other end of the leash of the human species. I have large breeds that would be reported as aggressor when their small white fluffy gets bitten for humping my dog. "But it was only being friendly". Way too many ignorant people. I prefer to select human and k9 meet up potential mates that i know well. And are under control.


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## Beau's Mom

I don’t like dog parks much but unfortunately I need them right now. No other place for Beau to run. He loves to fetch, and at the park he tends to greet most of the dogs but otherwise stick to fetch. He has only actually played there with another dog 2x in 2.5 years. If we go at dawn there’s usually only 1 or 2 other dogs there, so that’s when I try to go. We go maybe 1x a week, now.

At the park I go to, the early people are all pretty good about watching their dogs. Went later in the day during cooler weather, and there were a lot of people there who would not control their dogs. One guy told me I didn’t belong there because Beau wouldn’t “play” with his dog. His very big maybe malamute mix? kept trying to mount Beau, and got aggressive when Beau would scramble away. After the 4th or 5th time Beau turned on him, snarling and making his point more firmly, but not actually biting. That was when the idiot owner told me we didn’t belong there because my dog wouldn’t “play”.


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## Kazel

One thing people might not think about is the risk of disease. There's a town by me and my whole state really that had an outbreak of Canine Influenza but in the one town nearly everybody uses the dog parks to excercise their dogs and I think dang near every dog in there got sick. All the vets (Probably 6+ different vet offices in a town of 50,000 or so) were seeing multiple dogs everyday that came down with it. I don't know how many died but some did, it was a different and aggressive strain. So if you get an outbreak of anything in your area it would be a good idea to avoid dog parks as well as other public places people take dogs. Also be aware of parasites and pests such as fleas and worms.


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## tim_s_adams

One of the primary reasons people give for avoiding dog parks in general is that you have no control over the environment, and at any time someone can bring in a dog aggressive, out of control dog. Well, the other day this very thing happened to me! My dog and I were enjoying playing fetch with mostly regulars, and everything was fine until a guy I had never seen before showed up with a DA, 3 yr old Rotty who had never been around other dogs, or to a dog park (got this from talking to one of the guys who brought him). First thing this dog did was attack my pup just after entering the park. The owner got him off of her immediately, but it was too late...my dog was clearly smitten and followed this Rotty everywhere until they left just a few minutes later LOL! Poor Nyx!


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## Annageckos

I've taken my guys to dog parks from time to time in the past without issue. But I am very hesitant to go anymore. My last three dogs (a GSD, Basset Hound and a Lab/pointer mix) were very good off lead and we would take walks in the woods, by the river and other isolated areas. Now I only have a Great Dane, she is pretty good of lead but gets really worked up running. She does listen but can easily cover a lot of distance very fast. We are still working on it and she is getting better. But back to the dog park. 
I don't like to take my dane because while she is very friendly to all animals and people other dogs go after her. She thinks it is all a game and will keep running back and forth while they snarl, snap and rush at her. There are some dogs that are friendly, but it seems she intimidates most and I don't want to take a chance of her getting bit and then being blamed because of her size. Plus if she did try to defend herself she is so much bigger and could do some damage quickly. The biggest reason I stopped going to the dog park is that my Basset Hound was attacked, full on attacked at a dog park. He was standing next to me and another dog lunged at him grabbing a hold of his neck. The attack was really quiet and quick, I didn't see any signs before it happened. I really thought he was going to kill my boy. There were three of us beating on the attacking dog trying to get him off. He switched his grip to my dogs throat getting mostly collar which really saved him. I was able to get the collar off him and pull him away. The owner of the other dog pulled her dog back then. It was really horrifying. But luckily the damage was minimal, a couple of punctures I think due to all the loose skin he had. He was probably about ten when this happened, we haven't been to a park since then.
I know the chances are slim, for the most part but it was very scary. And some of the people are dumb and have no dog sense. There was a guy with a boarder collie throwing a ball, the dog was very toy aggressive and would snap at the other dogs running around it. People would bring in treats and hand them out to the dogs.
I do wish I had a place to let my girl run, I have no fenced in yard and I don't know anyone with one either. So we do long walks but it is just not the same and getting out and running.


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## GSDchoice

My childhood dog was a Great Dane and she was the sweetest dog ever! She loved all dogs, all people. 
That's why I had a big shock with my shepherd/husky's temperament ... I had literally never heard a growl out of my Dane for her entire life. 

Well, back to dog parks. Bad experiences here...

One dog kept trying to mount mine. Rumo kept growling at him. I stood up to leave. Owner said, "Let them work it out. They're just trying to work out who's boss." 

A little dog (who for some mysterious reason was on the big dogs side) kept walking right under Rumo and licking his private parts. Owner nowhere in sight. Rumo was surprisingly patient, and kept trying to walk away, but then began growling. So we left.

Owner with chuckit and ONE ball. Had every dog in the park running for that ONE ball...lots of growling heard. We got out of there, too!

Then, I gave up!! We never go in unless there are zero or one dogs in the park...

As for "free running", the closest we come is a 30 foot lead in big deserted fields behind schools, in the woods, etc.


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## dogfaeries

I’d love a dog park that you could rent out for an hour at a time, lol, so you could have it all to yourself. 

Dog parks are actually kind of fun if you have a lab that just wants to swim in the pond, or little dogs that you can take into the small dog area. We used to have huge play dates for our Italian Greyhounds back in the day. Maybe 20-25 of them all in the small dog area. They had a great time. I think you are asking for trouble taking a GSD to a dog park. Mine wouldn’t put up with rude behavior from rowdy young dogs. Way too many people pay zero attention to what their dogs are doing, and have no clue about dog behavior.


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## wolfy dog

tim_s_adams said:


> One of the primary reasons people give for avoiding dog parks in general is that you have no control over the environment, and at any time someone can bring in a dog aggressive, out of control dog. Well, the other day this very thing happened to me! My dog and I were enjoying playing fetch with mostly regulars, and everything was fine until a guy I had never seen before showed up with a DA, 3 yr old Rotty who had never been around other dogs, or to a dog park (got this from talking to one of the guys who brought him).  First thing this dog did was attack my pup just after entering the park. The owner got him off of her immediately, but it was too late...my dog was clearly smitten and followed this Rotty everywhere until they left just a few minutes later LOL! Poor Nyx!


Tim, aren't you the one who let's them deal with this themselves? Forgive me if you are not. Even though (s)he may seem OK now, DA can surface later on as a result.


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## Dee Dee Armstrong

Its not always your own dogs I have seen dog fights at the dog park that I have gone to and I think it depends on the owner. I used to take my other dog all the time, but the GSD I have now is very dog aggressive and can't take her there yet.


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## tim_s_adams

wolfy dog said:


> Tim, aren't you the one who let's them deal with this themselves? Forgive me if you are not. Even though (s)he may seem OK now, DA can surface later on as a result.


I do not allow my dog to fight with other dogs, if that's what you're asking. But I do let dogs be dogs and work out most issues for themselves. 

For example, there was a Mal that used to come to the dog park frequently, and her and Nyx would play sometimes. But this particular Mal either had a mean streak, or didn't know her own strength, because she'd bite Nyx in the shoulder hard enough to hurt her. Nyx would just avoid her for awhile then usually. But after a couple months of this, Nyx got tired of it and ran her off. It wasn't a fight, the Mal realized instantly that she had no chance and hastily retreated! From then on they were fine...no fighting, no further problems. Nyx is not DA, and in fact quite the opposite! She's very gentle with puppies and little dogs, and friendly with most other dogs. If she can't read a dog, or gets a bad vibe from them, she's happy to just avoid them.


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## mkculs

It depends on the dog park. My first exposure was a relatively small, pick-up-after-your-dog kind of place with a lot of regulars. The "trouble makers" were well known--usually unneutered males of some "macho" breed with a man who acted like his dog could do no wrong. These were dog-aggressive dogs that were allowed to attack other dogs. Folks quickly learned to avoid the time those few folks might show up. I always wondered what happened if those types ended up in the DP together. 

At the other end have been a couple of very large parks with trails and a lot of untended brush, grassland, etc. You could not even see if your dog went potty off trail. 

Enforcing licensing is so important so everyone knows dogs are vaccinated. Bringing your own water, avoiding the most favored areas (usually where the walking is easiest for the humans). My biggest concern has always been parasites, but I've never had a dog get sick in 20+ years of using DPs. Maybe that is just pure, dumb luck. 

I don't rely on DPs for anything but love having access when it fits our mood.


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## Judy Untamed

I'm way too paranoid to use a dog park if there are other dogs already in there. We have a small local park that I will try to keep an eye on and figure out when it's most likely to be empty, though. It'd be nice to have that kind of large, fenced in area with a few interesting obstacles to play on and train around. But I have no interest in allowing my dog to be exposed to so many unleashed and unknown dogs. Scary!


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## Sabis mom

I am not a fan, but I have been making use of them to give Shadow some much needed time off her rope. She is accustom to having a yard to play in so these last couple of months have been tough with me having her on a rope all the time.
I have found some really lovely dog parks in some fairly small towns. I make sure they are empty and let her go. As soon as I see a car approaching I leash up and leave. It really has been a great thing for us. Under normal circumstances I would never risk it.


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## tim_s_adams

You all would have LOVED the DP I visited in a neighboring town last week then LOL! It was at least a couple acres, but there were easily 70 or 80 dogs in there! Hard to find a lane to throw a ball...

Nyx enjoyed all the new smells though, and had to visit every remote corner, so I don't think she minded not playing fetch so much...


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## Bentwings1

I’m not an advocate of dog parks at all. The three training centers I go to all do not recommend using dog parks.
Our apt group has a private dog park. They spent a lot of money upgrading it putting round river rock in the middle then wrecked it by adding wood chips all around on the inside. These harbor ticks and other parasites and provide a place for the inconsiderate to allow their dogs to poop then don’t pick it up. Even though there is a convent poop bag dispenser and trash can.

There are 75-100 dogs in our building alone with four building in the group, so you can imagine how many dogs there are here. In 8 years I have only seen two trained dogs besides mine. One is a Mal detection dog the other is a couch potato lab that never strays more than a couple feet from the owner.

The dog park Has nice features, an elevated dog walk, a big tier run thru, teeter tot, and a short weave pole. It would be fun to use but the people just turn their dogs loose and go play on their phones and smoke cigs. 

I tried it once with my new rescue Aussie even though it was against my experience. Sometimes you just don’t learn. She had fun and did really well for a new dog with only a week of leash training . I use a 30 or 60 foot leash even here. I saw the Rotty coming and we promptly left. We were about a block away and Sam turned to look back. I follow her gaze and saw the Rotty coming full tilt towards us off leash. The dog was fat and probably well over 100 pounds. I turned to face him off but he came right at us. I grabbed his collar and yanked him up off his front feet. Twisting the collar as hard as I could I managed to throttle him. The owner came waddling up and started to yell but I drowned him out and told him to get his dog out of here immediately or I was calling the cops. This is an on leash only city and I knew the cops don’t take kindly to off leash problems. The guy didn’t even have a leash with him. Needless to say I was furious. I told the guy I was reporting this to the office, which I did.

A short time later I was getting the mail and a lady said she heard I had a run in with the Rotty and the guy. She said I was the first to ever stand up to him as he abuses everyone. I told her I wasn’t happy about it and that I just don’t take kindly to off leash dogs charging me. I’ll do what I have to do to protect my dog and my self. 

So I simply don’t like dog parks.


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