# "It's me or the dog"



## Innuendo (Feb 27, 2008)

Has anyone else caught this show on animal planet? I had never heard of it but was flipping around and noticed it. It seems a bit better than Cesar Millan, at least I like the methods used better she seems to use positive reinforcement and that's what I like doing with my dogs so it was nice to see it on TV.

Anyone else have opinions about it? I'm sure a lot of her methods wouldn't work on some of the dogs Cesar has to deal with and I know there are tons of forum topics on him but I couldn't find one on Victoria Stilwell.


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## littledmc17 (Apr 9, 2008)

No but I have heard about it
I'll have to check it out.
Not to keen on Cesar and DH gets mad when I watch him


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## acurajane (May 21, 2008)

I have seen it and its different.


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: acurajaneI have seen it and its different.


That is a PC way to put it.









I have seen it and I must say, she gets on my NERVES. She is also kind of a beatch!


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

She annoys me too - not unlike that you are what you eat snot on BBC. Cesar might have some strange methods but atleast he's nice to look at


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## DnP (Jul 10, 2008)

She was also a judge on CBS's Greatest American Dog this past summer.

I like to watch It's Me or the Dog. Actually, I find the show rather entertaining and I too like her positive training approach. I also like that she doesn't hold back with the owners. However, the dominatex type outfit she wears along with driving a convertible in obviously cold weather makes me roll my eyes...I know, I know, it's all for effect.


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## Maryn (Feb 15, 2008)

I don't necessarily like her...but I like the show and how she approached dog issues.

Although...why does it seem that every dog in the UK eliminates all over the house?


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

I watch the show and wonder how effective some of her techniques would be in "the real world." The show makes it appear that shaking a can of pennies will stop an aggressive dog in his tracks


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## Innuendo (Feb 27, 2008)

I got Cesar Millans season 1 & 2 on DVD as a gift so i've watched those episodes. Is it just me or do some of the dogs almost seem afraid of him? That's what I dislike about his show. I'm sure with some touch aggression cases some of his techniques might be needed but I imagine there has to be better methods of getting a dog over his obsession with a skateboard then rolling him over on his side and holding him there until he's too out of breath to move. I'd leave a skateboard alone after that too. 

I guess it's also different because Cesar is more or less rehabilitating dogs where as "it's me or the dog" is more down to basic every day dog training and reward. Cesar rarely ever gives any sort of reward on his shows.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

*Re: "It's me or the dog" tv show on AP*

I LOVE it! Really gives great tools to owner/handlers about dog behavior (and how alot of it is cause of us!). The fact she doesn't make it a 'quick fix' but deals with the time element involved is even better!


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: Innuendo
> 
> I guess it's also different because Cesar is more or less rehabilitating dogs where as "it's me or the dog" is more down to basic every day dog training and reward.


I disagree. I prefer It's Me Or the Dog because I think Cesar mis-labels dogs a LOT. Take Emily the pit bull for example. He called her red zone and aggressive. All I saw was a dog that was never properly trained and socialized who whined and pulled to get at other dogs, definitely NOT a "red zone" dog aggressive dog. Like her or not, I think Victoria is FAR more practical and doesn't use all the pop terminology mumbo jumbo like "dog psychology" etc. Sometimes she gets on my nerves, but as far as training (or rehabilitating, whatever you want to call it), I think she's better.


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## CookieTN (Sep 14, 2008)

I like her methods MUCH better than Cesar's.


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

She lost me when she said something about crates not needing and shouldnt be used.

That and she gets on my nerves. lol.

But, to each their own


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## CookieTN (Sep 14, 2008)

Crates not being needed? Ha! (Cookie doesn't need one but my other dog does.) Well, I don't agree with that.


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

I can't stand her or her holier than though attitude. I'll take Caesar any day of the week over that obnoxious broad, her judging on America's Dog was just as laughable, her rationale was borderline insane!


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## CookieTN (Sep 14, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: LARHAGEI can't stand her or her holier than though attitude. I'll take Caesar any day of the week over that obnoxious broad, her judging on America's Dog was just as laughable, her rationale was borderline insane!


I read that they misrepresented her and that while she did act like that that her and the guy she did that at became friends. Yes, she shouldn't have acted like that and it was wrong, but everyone makes mistakes. I've even acted like that at times in the past; I was a real jack







.
Besides, isn't that kind of getting the attitude mixed up with the methods? Just because her attitude may be snobby sometimes doesn't mean that her methods are bad.


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## Keisha (Aug 1, 2008)

I like her much more than Cesar. I've never heard her say anything about crates not being needed (I may have missed it). The only bad thing about crates I've heard her say is that the one a man put his German Shepherd in was MUCH too small (and it was, it looked sooo uncomfortable). 
I agree that Cesar tends to label dogs as "red zone" way too often. These dogs have usually been poorly socialized and I tend to think that rolling a dog, or using some of his other methods may work for the moment, but it doesn't seem like that would work long term to correct the behavior. Victoria rewards dogs for good behavior and she has dealt with some pretty aggressive dogs. True, a lot of them have been small dogs, but not all. 
I prefer positive training techniques and taking the TIME and lost of patience to completely correct and change the behavior, before ever having to resort to some of the techniques that Cesar uses. I know that every dog is different and that in some cases those techniques could be needed to stop a dog that is being aggressive towards you at the time, but I still think that she would be able to make a dog safer long term in a much more positive way. That's just my personal opinion though.


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## Kayla's Dad (Jul 2, 2007)

I have watched her and think she's great. The problem with both shows, IMO, are that both Victoria and Cesar seem to mostly be dealing with people who just seem to have no business having a dog(s) in their homes. Which is why Victoria's eye-rolls and facial expressions during her "evaluation" period can hit home one way ofr the other - anyone with relative dog handling skills is probably thinking similar thoughts at that point.

I haven't seen methods used by her that I would dismiss as I have with Cesar's show. She just seems more realistic with her techniques.


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## littledmc17 (Apr 9, 2008)

You know what I totally agree with taht these people should not be dog owners!!!


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## Manfred (Sep 15, 2008)

I don't put a whole lot of stock in either show , but I do watch them both from time to time , they do have some good pointers and teaching tricks , I like Cesar better , that Britsh broad drives me nuts.

I have always wondered what Cesar's actuall sucess rate really is , they edit those shows pretty well , I always figured for each one success story they can show on TV there's probably five failed attempts that Cesar couldn't help that end up on the cutting room floor that we'll never see.


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## midnight804 (Jun 13, 2008)

I like about british chick more than milan because she focuses more on positive re enforcement. Also she seems to have no problem telling the people when they're the cause of whatever problem brough her there. The one with the two Old english Shepdogs is a pretty good one re: dominant dogs and submissive owners.


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

I dont know when it is but they are doing Cesar's 100th episode and all the dogs are supose to be there. From season 1, 2 and 3

From the preview it was ALOT of dogs and people, lol.

As far as people not needing to own the dogs...um. I dont think I would go that far. If someone looks deep enough we could probably say that about anyone.

At least the people are doing something about the issues unlike some people who dont.


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## AbbyK9 (Oct 11, 2005)

I prefer Victoria over Cesar. Granted, I think her outfits are ridiculous, but I think they help reinforce the whole mind set of being in control during training to the people she works with. I like that she tells people in no uncertain terms what it is they are doing wrong and that she addresses the problems in a positive manner, rather than throwing a choke on the dog and forcing it to comply and submit.

There are things Victoria says and does that I don't agree with, but I think that's every trainer. Some folks feel that crates aren't needed, some folks think they're absolutely necessary. Some folks feel that dogs need to be manhandled or that the only good training collar is a head halter. Doesn't mean I have to agree or use all their methods. I think the best we can do is take away from any show and trainer what works for us, and leave the rest. (And have the intelligence to know what methods are downright stupid and will hurt the relationship we have with our dogs.)


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## CookieTN (Sep 14, 2008)

Very well said.


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## Skye'sMom (Jul 11, 2004)

I much prefer Victoria's methods and love it that she doesn't hide what she thinks of the owners. The show also makes it clear that she goes back and has follow up sessions and keeps track of the dogs.

I have never seen any dog manhandled on her show - including a dog that would not let anyone in the house previously. She and the family worked quite well and patiently with the dog to get the preferred behavior,

I'm hoping that now that she has moved to the US her clothing style will change, but to each his/her own. Her looks have nothing to do with her training methods or results.


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## Keisha (Aug 1, 2008)

I don't think that she picks out those clothes. That's probably just a production thing. I've seen her on many, many talk shows and she never wears the "dominatrix" like clothes. I hope she doesn't wear them on the US version either so people won't get hung up on that.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I like Victoria. I think the people/problems she has are insane. It always makes me feel better about my pack. They (my pups) look like calm, obedient, nice companions in comparison. 

I have a question, is the term "broad" for a woman making a comeback, and are any other women put-off by that? I guess I cannot come up with a male equivalent to that term to call Cesar. 

With Cesar, people either like him or dislike him and his methods. I read his book, and do not dislike him, but watching the glimpses of his show that I have seen, I find some of his stuff unsettling. 

With Victoria, I think that I am hearing more about her mannerisms, clothing, and her being female is more of a problem from the people that dislike her than what she says or does with the dogs. Save only the bit about the crates. 

I did not see the clip so I wonder if it is taken out of context or if it was meant for a particular type of dog, like an adult dog as opposed to a puppy. For safety, I think crating a puppy is the way to go. For adult dogs, unless you have a pack, and some of them are likely to fight, crates really shouldn't be necessary. I think it is kind of like training collars. People get to rely on them and do not put them up when they are no longer necessary. 

Just like Animal Cops, or Cops, or Animal ER, or any reality-type show -- they are zeroing in on the abnormal or the extreme. 

What bothers me about both is that while it may be that Gloria goes away and comes back in a week, it just seems that they can manage major issues in no time. People want results right now. I think that some of these shows should stress that while you can see progress overnight, it is a lot of work and will take time to get the problem dog where you want him to be. 

Now if Gloria can take on the pups that required gourmet meals, etc., I think she SHOULD be able to fix Rushie's stand-stay in time for Sunday's run-through. 

And if Cesar could get that little white dog groomed, he can get Tori through Supervised Separation in minutes. 

Ah well.


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## thaliasmom (May 3, 2007)

What I like about the show is that it usually demonstrates solutions that *many* (not all) dog owners could attempt to replicate without harming their dogs. I think CM has really really excellent timing. He does things (that work!) with dogs that I could never ever do, because I'm not a professional.

The me or the dog lady a) puts the responsibility on the owner b) uses a *ton* of patience (remember the episode when they had someone try to enter the door for, like, an hour before the dog stopped going nuts? No pressure, just patience, and it worked! happy dog!) and c) will say that something isn't working and they need to try something else.


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## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

She's awesome. I'm right there with Everett and I am rolling my eyes and thinking "oh geez" right along with her.







Love her mannerisms, I think her clothing is cute and funny, and though I may not agree with everything I do think she's light years ahead of Cesar. I still do like some of what Cesar does but as time goes by and I learn more, less and less.



> Quote: I think that some of these shows should stress that while you can see progress overnight, it is a lot of work and will take time to get the problem dog where you want him to be.


Selzer, this cannot be stressed enough. People think after one class their dog should be fine but they need to know that it can take months and THEY must put in the brunt of the work.


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## Lisa&Diesel (Jun 8, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: ReichsmomI don't necessarily like her...but I like the show and how she approached dog issues.
> 
> Although...why does it seem that every dog in the UK eliminates all over the house?


Mine don't!!


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

I only get three channels (PBS had a tower fall and their new one doesn't allow me to get good reception - like you all care about that!) so I have seen neither show. 

Based on the comments here:

Crates not needed -- well, Bill Campbell concurs with that. I'll just admit that I use them for pups and young dogs. They are probably a crutch but as someone with an "out of the house" job, that "crutch" has made raising two pups possible. 

There used to be (years years years ago) a BBC show (I think it was BBC) by Barbara Woodhouse. I never watched it but it appeared to be positive reinforcement coupled with a no nonsense approach.


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## nitetrane98 (Feb 23, 2008)

I don't get cable or satellite here in the sticks but is this the same old gal that was on some of the talk shows years ago and parade the little ankle biters around saying, "Walkie, Walkie, Walkie"?


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## Maryn (Feb 15, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: Lisa&Diesel
> 
> 
> > Originally Posted By: ReichsmomI don't necessarily like her...but I like the show and how she approached dog issues.
> ...


Well that's good! lol

I probably worded that badly.

Watching 'It's me or the dog', I swear every home she goes into has a pup going all over the house. Just struck me as odd.


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## Guest (Sep 21, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: Chris08I don't get cable or satellite here in the sticks but is this the same old gal that was on some of the talk shows years ago and parade the little ankle biters around saying, "Walkie, Walkie, Walkie"?


Um, no.

This is Victoria Stilwell.










You can checkout the show online here:

http://animal.discovery.com/convergence/its-me-or-the-dog/its-me-or-the-dog.html

BTW, I like her too. She's different alright but I approve of her methods much more so than Cesar Milan's.


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## GSDOwner2008 (Jan 19, 2008)

I like her and Cesar. I've read his book, and reading another one, but his books are completely different than his show IMO. I don't enforce training and daily life with "touch" because my dogs are pups, and aren't head cases, I use positive reinforcement. I DO like his pack mentality thought, but I don't like alpha rolling at all. He must be doing something right though, he has 40 dogs together of various breeds and their all alive and doing well.

I don't know too much of Victoria Stilwell, I do like her show, and of what I have seen (which is very little) I like her. I didn't like her as the judge of the greatest american dog though.


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## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

Love her show and I really like her as a trainer. I haven't seen the episode with her crate comment so I cannot opine on that but overall, I think she is awesome and loads better than Cesar Millan. Truthfully, now that I am working with a REAL trainer and experiencing for myself what true "dog psychology" is, I find myself liking Cesar less and less. One thing that's always irked me is as soon as he needs to correct Daddy, even if it's a small vocal reprimand, Daddy collapses to the ground and rolls over. I'm not sure that I want a training program that would yield a dog that submits to such an extreme in response to such a minor correction. That's a little strange for such a strong dog like Daddy.

In any case, I love when Victoria rolls her eyes and tells it like it is when the owners are clearly clueless. As Everett said, many of us are rolling our eyes and thinking "oh jeez" right along with her.


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## sitstay (Jan 20, 2003)

Animal Planet will be airing new episodes starting next month that take place here in the U.S. 
I enjoy watching the show, but I also enjoy watching Cesar Milan, too. I think it is wonderful that there are shows out there that go beyond the traditional obedience class type deal, and look at real dogs living in real homes with real people. 
I think that Milan's techniques can be misused by someone who doesn't know what they are doing, and I have noticed as the seasons have progressed with his show that the disclaimer is now more prominent then it had been in the beginning. That is what getting sued will do, though.
I also think that someone can misuse Stillwell's methods as well. Can you see some idiot blasting their poor dog with an air horn constantly? I can.
Sheilah


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

MiddleofNowhere -- yeah, the "Walkies!" lady. I liked her. Old gal, I think from England. Believed in No Bad Dogs. That's about all I can remember though.


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## AbbyK9 (Oct 11, 2005)

> Quote:and I have noticed as the seasons have progressed with his show that the disclaimer is now more prominent then it had been in the beginning.


I have also noticed that in more recent seasons, the approach is "gentler" than in the original couple of seasons.


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## sitstay (Jan 20, 2003)

> Originally Posted By: selzerMiddleofNowhere -- yeah, the "Walkies!" lady. I liked her. Old gal, I think from England. Believed in No Bad Dogs. That's about all I can remember though.


That would be Barbara Woodhouse. What a hoot. I watched her show way back in the 80's on PBS. 
I really appreciated how she would tell the owners of little dogs that the little ones needed training just like the big ones. 
I can still hear her say "Walkies"! Kind of Julia Child meets Victoria Stillwell, as channeled by Cesar Milan.
Sheilah


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## debbiebrown (Apr 13, 2002)

i also like her.! she is extremely honest with the owners, and i think she has alot of good approaches to make people see and understand the error of their ways with the dogs. i like that she is straight forward.

debbie


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## herno1 (Sep 10, 2008)

I watch that program when i can, you never know if you can learn something from it. She is annoying though. but the best for me is the dog whisperer Cesar Millan. Hes methods are pretty good. I also bought the Don Sullivan's DVD, which is pretty good.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

I've seen a few where the people shouldn't even be owning dogs. Such as the woman on It's Me or the Dog who had cats for years and years and after losing a special one decided to get a dog instead thinking the dog would be just like a cat.







Needless to say the dog was a nervous wreak with problems.

I've watched many many episodes of both shows. I'm a bigger fan of It's Me or the Dog. Though I must say, I've NEVER heard her say anything bad about crates? With the aggressive German Shepherd she asked the man to take the dog out of the crate and was very disgusted with the crate but so was I and I'm a BIG supporter of crates...But that crate was WAY too small for that poor dog, he couldn't properly lay down or hold up his head.


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## Ursa Lunar (Jul 11, 2003)

Much prefer Victoria over Cesar. I like her significantly more positive methods, and I like that on her show they have said (paraphrasing) "it seemed like a success at the time, but later the family did not follow thru and the issues remain."

I also like that she does NOT take the animals away from the owners to rehabilitate; she makes the owners do the rehab after showing them what needs to be done. IMO taking a dog away from their home situation leaves the owners too far out of the "this is how to train your dog" loop. 

She also doesn't [censored]-foot around how the owners need to correct their own behavior to help the dog, some of these people shouldn't own a dog but she seems to help them become much better owners. There was a recent episode with a punk couple, and their daughter who was afraid of English Bull Terrier (that dog also humped _everything_). I thought this couple was one of those that shouldn't own a dog because of it's behavior, but they really put effort into the dog, got him neutered, and made him into a beloved family member and their daughter's best buddy - nice!









edited to say: wow, the censored icon pops up when you didn't expect it too, LOL!


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## DanL (Jun 30, 2005)

Cesar is pretty up front with the owners too. He also follows up with them to see how they are doing. I think both shows are good- certainly not the be all end all of dog training in either case, but good for the general public to learn from- and as a dog owner, you can learn from both methods. Like my one trainer said, your training knowledge is like a big soup pot. You put everything in and take it out a spoonful at a time as you need it. Even if it's a method you don't like, at least you've experienced it and can form an opinion on it. 

As the viewer, we have no idea how long they are taking with each case. People seem to think Cesar is doing things in a day and then leaving, but I really can't see that happening. I also think he only takes the most severe cases back to his place, it's not common that he removes dogs from their homes. I really haven't seen any dogs on Victoria's show that are as hard cases as some of Cesars.


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