# Per AKC: GSD Lifespan is 7-10 Years



## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

So this surprised me, and not in a positive way. 

I don't know when this was changed, but this is on their official website. 

7-10 is an abysmal outlook for this breed, and I seriously hope this is an error. 

Seven should be a wonderful active adult age, and a ten year old is certainly older but shouldn't be the end of the spectrum.... 

If their numbers are based on stats that "some" live past ten but not many, the stats-based assumption is that a similar number are dying younger than seven, if in fact 7-10 is the average life expectancy


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

wow, I had always read 10 - 12. This is disturbing.


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## Hbx33 (Feb 6, 2018)

That’s so sad and disturbing?.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

Between the stories you see here on this forum and those I know of irl, sadly this does not surprise me much.


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

My last two lived well past 13 years... My current two are 7 years and 9 years old and unfortunately I feel like this new average is true.

I know of 10 dogs in the last two years who didn't make it to their tenth birthday. Well bred, we'll cared for GSDs... It's tremendously sad.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Not everyone's going to agree with me, but one of the first signs of too much inbreeding in plants and animals is loss of hardiness and longevity.

Something to think about, whether you agree or not...

I'm an old fart, and when I first got into the breed, the lifespan was given as about 12 to 13 years. My first dog had to be PTS at 9, but my next two made it to 14. Currently have an 11 year old that is still very healthy and active. The only sign of age she's showing is her hearing is starting to go, and it's a bit harder for her to jump into the back of the SUV than it used to be.


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

Well, don't be too disturbed yet, @car2ner; I suspect that the jury's still out. Just spent a fast 20 minutes digging and was challenged to find hard stats on GSD longevity. Most articles just give an average lifespan, but with no citations. Below is the best that I could find; BTW, stats for GSDs seem consistent with your understanding.

Longevity and Mortality of Owned Dogs in England: http://researchonline.rvc.ac.uk/7826/1/7826.pdf


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## Shane'sDad (Jul 22, 2010)

I guess this is why I don't jump on the "Read This New Study" band wagon (I hope they're wrong !! in this case )......My youngest was Shane 9 + years when he passed....oldest was Casey just under 15... mine have been from Shutzhund & show lines and any where in between...average for me has been around 12 years.
If it's accurate.....Imo what some folks call "good breeding" in these dogs...ie WL is all about "Drive"-"Hardness"-"Toughness"---in show lines.. how perfect they look when "stacked"... If in fact "good breeding" comes with the bonus of a shorter lifespan for the dog---well then the "good breeding" is really only "good " for the humans involved.....and yes I know it's been going on for years with pure bred dogs--breed for one "good" trait and sacrifice another "good " trait....This just makes me feel sad...very very sad. We've done so much over the years passing on serious health issues through breeding ---I feel very sorry for this breed !


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

Scares me to be honest. Carly is 8 now, and not an old dog by any means. It seems weird to think of her as a senior dog. Russell’s grandmother is doing great at 11, and Scarlet’s grandmother is 12 and still going for walks in the woods.


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## Dragon67155 (Oct 16, 2017)

Well this makes me sad. I was looking forward to Xena and I being together for a long time.


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

Shanes' Dad said:


> I guess this is why I don't jump on the "Read This New Study" band wagon (I hope they're wrong !! in this case )......My youngest was Shane 9 + years when he passed....oldest was Casey just under 15... mine have been from Shutzhund & show lines and any where in between...average for me has been around 12 years.


The point of linking this "New Study" was to provide some much needed data to the discussion. (Mind you, it's less a "New Study," and more the "Only Study," such as it is, that I could locate). Forum members often speak from personal experience on various topics. That approach has great value, to be sure, but extended to issues like longevity it simply falls short. One can't know what to expect (hope for?) w/regard to the lifespan of a new puppy based solely on another's experience with 5 or 6 dogs. Then too, there are a host of factors, such as consistent (quality) vet care, nutrition, daily management, longevity in the pups' antecedents, etc, all of which bear directly on an individual's lifespan. The only way to meaningfully address such factors is by obtaining a sufficiently large sample (think nationwide, for example).

My perspective may be skewed as I come from years in a breed where the average lifespan has held steady at 6.5 years. Yes, there are exceptions (my last died at 10), but they're just that. Exceptions.

Personally, I think it would be a very good idea for GSDCA (and other breed organizations) to start collecting that data if they haven't done so already.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

You don't have to be an old fart to remember when people commonly referred to 12-14. Then it dropped to 10-12, and you are something of a hero to get a dog to 14 now. 

It's not just a GSD problem. Boxers and Goldens are even worse off. The research suggests 75% of Goldens will get cancer -- 75%!!!! It's been increasing since the 1980s, esp. in US-bred Goldens. 

This list of issues of increasing incidence in our breed is also pretty sobering:
German shepherd | University of Prince Edward Island

I wish that longevity within a pedigree were part of the score in dog show judging -- to give credit for breeding a beautiful dog with a strong foundation of healthy, long-lived dogs behind it.


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

Coffee's kicking in, I found a couple of more studies providing longevity data:

Demography and Disorders of GSDs in Britain: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5532765/

UK Kennel Club Breed Health Survey: https://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/media/749383/german_shepherd_dog.pdf


ETA: 

_I wish that longevity within a pedigree were part of the score in dog show judging -- to give credit for breeding a beautiful dog with a strong foundation of healthy, long-lived dogs behind it._

@Magwart, years ago I knew a breeder selecting breeding pairs primarily (but not exclusively) for longevity in their antecedents. Though we're not in close touch, I know she's had some success and, based on that, is still pursuing her goal. It's an interesting and apparently productive (if somewhat fatalistic) approach....

Aly


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Wow. We've definitely skewed that average lower with our crew. Sneaker lived to 14-1/2, Cassidy to 4 (discospondylis), Dena to 4 (lymphoma), Keefer to 12-1/2 (and still going strong), and Halo turned 9 in November. She has longevity in her pedigree - her grand-sire lived to 13 or 14 and both parents I think were at least in the 12-13 range too. Halo would still be in her prime except that she has DM and will not make it to 10. A year ago she was racing full time in flyball but she can no longer walk.


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## JBjunior (Feb 8, 2018)

If we make the assumption it is accurate, otherwise they are using false or inaccurate date, what are the factors shortening life? What specific health factors have been impacted such as cardiovascular, respiratory, etc.? There is plenty of anecdotal evidence of "my dog lived to be 14" but there is also plenty of anecdotal evidence on this website alone just over the last few weeks/months of my dog died at 5 from ______ and my dog died at 7 of _________ with there usually being a cancer relation.

I know I would be very concerned to add a new family member, investing time and energy, that may only live to be 7.


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## Springbrz (Aug 13, 2013)

Another sad factor in this breed is the BYB. The number of pure GSD's in rescue seems to be higher than I would have imagined. How many times on this site alone have we read posts of owners getting a GSD from a "supposed" good breeder only to delve deeper to realize that the breeder wasn't all that great and actually turned out to be what many hear would define a byb. Any one who puts two dogs together has bred dogs and by definition makes them a breeder. The term breeder in of itself is deceptive. 
These breedings alone are severely effecting the health and overall longevity of the breed. 
Like myself, many don't find out the pit falls of the byb until they have made that mistake. IMHO the average consumer sees AKC registered and believes they must be good dogs with good health. Most don't understand that all AKC means in the dog is pure bred and has absolutely nothing to do with temperament or health. With all the resources we now have in the internet the information far too often comes after the fact...not before. In the end these poorly bred dogs with absolutely no regard for health or longevity have undoubtedly skewed the overall lifespan data.
I have one. She will not live long I know. Her health issues are mind boggling. She has so many food sensitivities. Feeding her a healthy well balanced diet is a monumental challenge daily. Her immune system tends to be crap even with all I try to do to improve it. She has plasmoma and early signs of pannus. Her spay was complicated as her ovaries were not in the normal location and under developed at 19 months (she never had a heat). She was also confirmed by x-ray with moderate HD at 19 months. We suspected she had bad hips long before. She is prone to skin issues, easily picks up hook worms... because well...her immune system is just cruddy as hard as we try to make it better. 
End of the day...I already have resolved myself to the fact that she will succumb to either hemangiosarcoma or DM or have to be PTS to relieve debilitating hip pain. We just can't afford bilateral FHO since it's already costing us over $300 a month to feed her a specific protein raw diet and supplements to balance because her food issues are so bad. Add in all her other vetting and....
We love her and will do all we can for her but I have no hopes she will be long lived. She just turned 5. I will be thrilled with 2-3 more years as I feel that's all we are going to get with her.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Springbrz said:


> Another sad factor in this breed is the BYB. The number of pure GSD's in rescue seems to be higher than I would have imagined. How many times on this site alone have we read posts of owners getting a GSD from a "supposed" good breeder only to delve deeper to realize that the breeder wasn't all that great and actually turned out to be what many hear would define a byb. Any one who puts two dogs together has bred dogs and by definition makes them a breeder. The term breeder in of itself is deceptive.
> These breedings alone are severely effecting the health and overall longevity of the breed.
> Like myself, many don't find out the pit falls of the byb until they have made that mistake. IMHO the average consumer sees AKC registered and believes they must be good dogs with good health. Most don't understand that all AKC means in the dog is pure bred and has absolutely nothing to do with temperament or health. With all the resources we now have in the internet the information far too often comes after the fact...not before. In the end these poorly bred dogs with absolutely no regard for health or longevity have undoubtedly skewed the overall lifespan data.
> I have one. She will not live long I know. Her health issues are mind boggling. She has so many food sensitivities. Feeding her a healthy well balanced diet is a monumental challenge daily. Her immune system tends to be crap even with all I try to do to improve it. She has plasmoma and early signs of pannus. Her spay was complicated as her ovaries were not in the normal location and under developed at 19 months (she never had a heat). She was also confirmed by x-ray with moderate HD at 19 months. We suspected she had bad hips long before. She is prone to skin issues, easily picks up hook worms... because well...her immune system is just cruddy as hard as we try to make it better.
> ...



I own one to. Shadow is now 7.5 and I am thankful when she wakes up in the morning. I knew she wasn't from any kind of a breeder, so I carry the blame for that. Every single day I get, and have had, with her is a gift.
Sabi overcame bad breeding to make it to nearly 13, but those last few years cost both of us dearly. Bud came from solid, if not exemplary breeding and was solid and unstoppable for 13 years, although he visibly slowed somewhere around 12. He almost made 14, and I will give him credit for it. He was a fighter to the bitter end. His aunt, my lovely Lex, was 14 when she died. He had another relative make 17. In general the girls made 15, the boys 14 in his line. One of the many reasons I wish it had been carried forward. 
Someone on this forum commented that if your dogs made 10 you should be grateful and anything beyond that was a bonus. 
I don't know why this study would shock anyone, since a study a few years back claimed the current generation of children may actually not outlive their parents. Why should our dogs be different?


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## crittersitter (Mar 31, 2011)

Boy this makes me angry to read this. Our dogs should be living a LOT longer than that! I just lost a GSD rescue at age 11 in January. I'd had her since she was 4. I thought she'd be with me much longer than that. I have another 11 1/2 year old GSD, also a rescue, I've had for 7 years. She's very frail but she's doing OK. Then I have a 13 1/2 old GSD/Husky? mix. He is healthy as a horse! The last one to join us is a 2 yo American Lines GSD from a reputable show breeder. I had wanted another West German but no local breeders. I love GSDs so much I can't imagine having another breed now but the fear of losing them at such a young age is terrifying. I don't know what we can do other than try to buy from a reputable breeder, avoid over-vaccination and pesticides, feed the healthiest diet you can afford and give them plenty of love and exercise.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Wow. We've definitely skewed that average lower with our crew. Sneaker lived to 14-1/2, Cassidy to 4 (discospondylis), Dena to 4 (lymphoma), Keefer to 12-1/2 (and still going strong), and Halo turned 9 in November. She has longevity in her pedigree - her grand-sire lived to 13 or 14 and both parents I think were at least in the 12-13 range too. Halo would still be in her prime except that she has DM and will not make it to 10. A year ago she was racing full time in flyball but she can no longer walk.


Sorry to hear about Halo.


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

I didn't realize Halo was not well... I remember you bringing her home... I'm really sorry to hear this.. She and Stark and a few others all came home around the same time...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I think we are "loving" our dogs to death. You can blame BYBs, but fact is, they were doing pretty much the same things when the lifespan was 12-14. What HAS changed in the past couple decades? 

How about blood carried monthly flea-tick-heartworm preventatives, pediatric spay/neuter surgeries, ultra-concentrated high protein kibbles, aggressive vaccinations. $800+ in well-puppy visits WITHOUT a spay surgery in two months.

Maybe dogs are spending too much time indoors and not enough times outdoors in the sun/elements.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

I am also sorry to hear about Halo


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## JBjunior (Feb 8, 2018)

selzer said:


> I think we are "loving" our dogs to death. You can blame BYBs, but fact is, they were doing pretty much the same things when the lifespan was 12-14. What HAS changed in the past couple decades?
> 
> How about blood carried monthly flea-tick-heartworm preventatives, pediatric spay/neuter surgeries, ultra-concentrated high protein kibbles, aggressive vaccinations. $800+ in well-puppy visits WITHOUT a spay surgery in two months.
> 
> Maybe dogs are spending too much time indoors and not enough times outdoors in the sun/elements.


Maybe this is true, my initial thought was you were right. Then I compared it to humans. Almost everything you have said has a human comparison (increased medicine use, additional access to health care, higher quality/more food, etc.) with the exception of the spay/neuter. Humans are animals too and we have found every way to does less and be outside less than we ever have before but as quality of life increases so does lifespan. 

I do think pediatric spay/neuter is a big issue.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

selzer said:


> I think we are "loving" our dogs to death. You can blame BYBs, but fact is, they were doing pretty much the same things when the lifespan was 12-14. What HAS changed in the past couple decades?
> 
> How about blood carried monthly flea-tick-heartworm preventatives, pediatric spay/neuter surgeries, ultra-concentrated high protein kibbles, aggressive vaccinations. $800+ in well-puppy visits WITHOUT a spay surgery in two months.
> 
> Maybe dogs are spending too much time indoors and not enough times outdoors in the sun/elements.


What about RF or microwave transmission? Our homes have been increasingly filled with electronics. It's thought to be harmless and perhaps they are, but roof tops "antennas" or dishes on high rise buildings have exposure limits when working around them. Can lower level signals used in our homes have a cumulative effect?


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

If the reasons for our breed's shortened lifespan are environmental, wouldn't that decrease the life expectancy of other breeds too?

Here are more stats posted by the same source (AKC). Note the Malinois, and other dogs from the herding/working groups.... no other breed similar in size or function has such a low life expectancy*

(*According to AKC)


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

WIBackpacker said:


> If the reasons for our breed's shortened lifespan are environmental, wouldn't that decrease the life expectancy of other breeds too?
> 
> Here are more stats posted by the same source (AKC). Note the Malinois, and other dogs from the herding/working groups.... no other breed similar in size or function has such a low life expectancy*
> 
> (*According to AKC)


Genetic susceptibility?


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

Genetics has to be a piece of the puzzle.

When you stack "7-10 years" against those numbers above, they are terribly terribly low. The threshold (7) is even lower than some giant breeds, Danes and Wolfhounds (8).


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## JBjunior (Feb 8, 2018)

WIBackpacker said:


> Genetics has to be a piece of the puzzle.
> 
> When you stack "7-10 years" against those numbers above, they are terribly terribly low. The threshold (7) is even lower than some giant breeds, Danes and Wolfhounds (8).


Since I have a Mal, that was the first thing I checked when this thread was started. Just recently the AKC age range was 12-14 and I was surprised to see the increase to a 14-16 average. I agree if it were environmental factors alone there would decreases across the board. My earlier post talked about what specifically are the ailments impacting the breed and at what prevalence? I know that is hard to determine but may whittle down the factors that are genetic predispositions and while we know there are outliers, with life expectancy being driven down, there seems to be a huge increase of occurrence. Even if these diseases have always been there at 12-14, they seem to be hitting a significant number of dogs much earlier.


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## camperbc (Sep 19, 2017)

Or perhaps it could just be that the AKC got it wrong. Seems strange to me that out of infinite online sources, we are suddenly freaked out because _one_ source says something different than all the rest. I just noticed that the AKC lists the lifespan of a Newfoundland dog at 10-12 years, when the rest of the entire planet says 8-10. (and even 10 is really pushing it) Personally, I have never seen a Newfoundland live for longer than 9 years, so I'm not buying that 10-12 years claim any more than I am about the GSD numbers. 

Let's just enjoy our pets for as long as we have them, and continue to give them the best life possible. 

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

Looking at some the dogs used often in the past some were very short lived, canto and Zamp off the top of my head.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

I think maybe someone made some mistakes. Danes used to be 6-8 so if that has in fact improved, fantastic, but I don't think so. I don't think Newfs at 10-12 is realistic, and I believe they were at 8-10 and I don't think I have ever seen one older then 10.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

There are so many studies and next thing you know another one contradicts the previous one. I think there are too many variables to rely on studies in this. Did they take into account: the food, the breed practices, daily exercise, stress levels, time of weaning, access to vet care etc.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

Err, WD, regression analysis in statistics actually _can _control for all sorts of independent variables to isolate them (through techniques like multiple regression). That's pretty much how statistics works. It's also why knowing the p-value in any study is incredibly important.

For those who think reading abstracts = reading studies, the reason we look to the studies is actually to look at the study design, and yes, the reliability (p-value and correlation coefficient). To get access to actual studies without paying for copies, one can often get them by going to your local library where the librarians can usually get behind the journal paywall.

Further reading, for anyone interested in how scientific research works:
http://www.statisticshowto.com/probability-and-statistics/regression-analysis/


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## Springbrz (Aug 13, 2013)

selzer said:


> I think we are "loving" our dogs to death.
> 
> Maybe dogs are spending too much time indoors and not enough times outdoors in the sun/elements.


There may a good amount of truth to this^^^

My bil had a shepherd that was just a pet. Didn't eat anything special for food. Got table scraps. Minimal vetting. Spent the day outside playing in the yard and with the kids. I don't know anything of his pedigree but I'm pretty confident he was not the product of a "reputable breeder". He lived to 17.

My mom had a GSDxLab/Newfoundland mix (litter of 13). Got him at 8 weeks from a local farm. He got parvo before there was a vaccine. Spent a fortune keeping him alive. He ate Purina Dog Chow. Drink coffee and eat donuts. Had a bowl of cornflakes and milk for breakfast almost every morning of his life. He ate table scraps on the regular including onions cooked with the meat. He occasionally enjoyed a chocolate or chocolate chip cookie. If we ate it the dog ate it 98% of the time. He didn't like green beans...lol! He was mildly over weight most of his adult life at 120 lbs. (he was big and tall). Went to work on construction sites. Got loose and wondered the streets often and was known to be brought home in a police car :surprise: Yet that big, lovable wondering lug lived to 16 or 17. 

I don't know what has changed but I don't believe the shortening of lifespans is specific to just the GSD. However there might be some truth to the fact we are loving them to much and causing changes in their genetics. 

Growing up I knew many people who never bought a bag of kibble. They didn't feed a fancy raw diet either. They simply fed table scraps. After all if it was good enough for the humans it should be well good enough for the dog. Dogs seemed healthy and if they were lucky enough not get run over by a car they tended to live long lives.


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## JBjunior (Feb 8, 2018)

wolfy dog said:


> There are so many studies and next thing you know another one contradicts the previous one. I think there are too many variables to rely on studies in this. Did they take into account: the food, the breed practices, daily exercise, stress levels, time of weaning, access to vet care etc.


This isn't that "kind" of study. This is very simple in that they aren't trying to figure out all of those things and there is very little to contradict. This is simply data: X number of dogs lived to be X number of years and averaged out. 

I am not saying AKC is right, but there shouldn't be contradictory studies about an average age of life, if they actually did a study with an adequately sized representative sample.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

JBjunior said:


> I am not saying AKC is right, but there shouldn't be contradictory studies about an average age of life, if they actually did a study with an adequately sized representative sample.


Sample bias is also a concern. I also don't know how good the researchers at the AKC are. Do they have PhD statisticians on staff? Or maybe they just handed a project off to interns to make a spreadsheet? :|

The AKC *probably* is using their own registration records. They own a microchip registry that gives them more data. I don't know enough about their capturing of the purebred dog world to have an opinion on sample bias -- my guess (and it's only a guess) is their sample will include as many BYBs and puppy mills as show dogs, since AKC takes money indiscriminately. The puppy mill cohort likely isn't a small component, either. That could make it a particularly _accurate_ sample (in the sense of reflective of the current overall state of the breed)...but I don't know that.

The data comparison from forty years ago would be a lot harder -- culling, drowning unsold pups, parvo/distemper deaths, etc. all would have gone unreported probably, and so the deaths in the first month of life that skew lifespans down might not have been recorded _anywhere.

_Instead of the AKC, I think better research is being done in breed cancer surveys that are being published by university researchers in Europe, Canada, and the US. They're isolating cancers that appear to be genetic, based on over representation *by breed -- *and they're finding some of those are going up. The best research is being done on Goldens. Some of the researchers are even working on identifying breed-specific genes involved in the disease processes. That data they've been publishing honestly makes it really hard to keep blaming cancer on modern vet care and/or food -- unless you want to argue some breeds are so fragile and illness-prone that the slightest thing turns their cancer genes on, while other breeds can happily live in the modern world without any of these problems....but that just leads to the same place.


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

Didn't Zamp von Thermados die of bloat?

Why freak out about lifespans of ourselves or others? Every day is full and precious. The rug of mortality could be pulled out from under us at any time. 

Why worry Be happy. And take as best care of your dog, creatures and family as you can. I used to look at my Tamar, the first and best of all my horses, and feel sad because she was was so old. But then I thought why be sad for the future while the creature stands before me, bright eyed, breathing and alive? She lived to be 40.


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## dOg (Jan 23, 2006)

so the standard weights seem to have moved up too 
of the full breds i've had, one lived 8 yrs, one 4.5, another almost 11 years. the mixes 12,13

it's a crap shoot, and we know it from the get go. 

but life is better with, or we wouldn't bother!

So hope for the best, prevent what you can, roll with it when it gets hard.

Enjoy This Day Folks!


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

dOg said:


> so the standard weights seem to have moved up too
> of the full breds i've had, one lived 8 yrs, one 4.5, another almost 11 years. the mixes 12,13
> 
> it's a crap shoot, and we know it from the get go.
> ...


Thats right. Seems like the larger the breed the less the lifespan. Maybe their giant breed's body is too big for normal canid physiology. What about all these over standard GSDs these days, 120lb males, etc?


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

Re: Size, the study that seems to be cited the most in different articles is the one by Kraus et al.

Link here: 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/23535614/ 

I am pretty sure that Kraus's work was where the statistic originated that with each 4.4lb increase in a dog's weight, the life expectancy is lowered by one month. 

Studies resulting in understanding markers/genetic predisposition to cancer would be an incredible guiding light for everyone making dog breeding decisions.


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

I have some reservations about what’s shown on the AKC website. First, the website shows _ranges_, described as the “average lifespan” for small to giant dogs, by breed. This is not how life span is typically calculated and/or presented. Typically, average life span is presented as a single statistic (a single number), not a range, representing the average age at death. (COD or cause of death may/may not be factored in depending on the availability and verifiability of that information, sample size, etc.). The best studies (IMO) also show distribution indices to give the reader some sense of whether the average life span for a given breed is skewed towards younger vs. older ages at death. Means/averages simply don’t tell you that. So, from a purely statistical standpoint, one can’t tell what the numbers shown actually are or represent, and the AKC website doesn’t tell you. 

Second, because one can’t tell what the AKC longevity ranges actually are or represent, they are (IMO) misleading. Any reader could easily believe that the odds of having her GSD puppy live to at least 7 years are fairly high. Yet, simply skimming the _In Loving Memory_ posts suggest that such assumptions would be insupportable.

Third and most annoying, the AKC website provides no information regarding the source of these ranges (i.e., longevity studies with conventionally presented data). 

My fourth concern goes to the accuracy of the ranges shown on the AKC website. For example, the range shown for IWs isn’t consistent with the IW longevity findings with which I’m familiar. Best known of these is Gretchen Bernard’s landmark study: https://www.iwclubofamerica.org/longevityBernardi. A few years ago, I had the opportunity to look at more recent (unpublished at the time) data in order to compare sex differences in IW longevity. (Females lived longer than males, but not by much). Notably, overall IW longevity mapped onto the Bernardi findings almost exactly. Mean age at death was 6.5/7 years, with a skew towards younger rather than older ages at death. That’s a shorter life span than what’s implied by the AKC website for IWs (8-10 years) — notwithstanding questions about what their range actually represents.

Finally, I started to wonder how much we’ve actually_ known_ about canine longevity until fairly recently. My impression (and it’s only that) is that, with rare exception, the systematic collection of longevity data didn’t happen years ago — never mind COD. If that impression is correct, I wonder if we haven’t been misled by what are essentially folk tales about the average GSD life span or, worse, misleading representations by some breeders. I don’t think that we can lay this at the feet of BYBs; there are too many well-known (but perhaps not universally well-regarded) breeders who are often overly optimistic about their lines. 

Aly


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## Armistice (Oct 12, 2017)

Didn't read much of other's posts

Here's my take. Bad line breeding way back when that is now coming to the forefront

I hate the AKC. More dachshunds are having back issues due to being bred longer for ribbons. Pugs and the like are getting increasingly worse breathing problems for flatter faces. Bully breeds bred for wide stances that don't look healthy at all (blown shoulders anyone?)

AKC should reward health, not aesthetics, as health betters the breed


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## hoytn (Oct 1, 2017)

My girl lived for 10.5 yrs. That being said if you look at ages of different breeds a decade ago the ages are different i know for golden retrievers it was the norm to have a dog live til 14 or 15 and they didnt have the cancer issue they have now. I would imagine if you looked did some research you would find a similar pattern.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

I have not read all this but wonder if a miss print. 

grew up with listening abouts gsds and hip dysplasia so far so good non issues. My first gsd lives till 12 and our mixed breeds 
did not make it past 7. All our pure breeds - 12-18 and puppy mill bred. My gsds now can see for see a long healthy life - met there grandsires grand dams healthy and long living. Time will tell. 

Many years ago I worked at vet cancer was a rarity in dogs. Something is going on and cancer seems rampant in any breed mixed or not. You never know what the day will bring so just make sure you enjoy your dogs everyday- whatever that is you enjoy with them. 

Photos of dogs having fun is why I enjoy them watching them so much. It is most painful to watch a gsd slow down. Max at park searching for cameron amongst the picnic tables. Luna is now a year and a half and faster then Max. She is wicked fast such a speed demon. 




















































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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

selzer said:


> I think we are "loving" our dogs to death. You can blame BYBs, but fact is, they were doing pretty much the same things when the lifespan was 12-14. What HAS changed in the past couple decades?
> 
> How about blood carried monthly flea-tick-heartworm preventatives, pediatric spay/neuter surgeries, ultra-concentrated high protein kibbles, aggressive vaccinations. $800+ in well-puppy visits WITHOUT a spay surgery in two months.
> 
> Maybe dogs are spending too much time indoors and not enough times outdoors in the sun/elements.


Thank you, Selzer!


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

I have never lost a dog younger than age 13 and one lived until age 16. My older one now had cancer and recovered, so I’m not sure how long we will have her with us, but so far she is still active and content. Other than one mystery ilness a few months ago, she is very healthy. I think exercise and diet have a lot to do with it, along with genetics and luck. My dogs have been from quality breeders and rescues, so they were not all from good breeders.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

I did the math last night, and realized one of my dogs made it to 15, not 14! She was a stray that had been dumped, probably due to some aggression issues. No idea how she was bred, but the ASL people thought she was a mix because 'her head was nearly as high as her butt'. 

A German immigrant, who bred working line dogs said she reminded him of the police dogs he'd worked with in Germany after the war. She certainly had a true GSD temperament, and was a faithful protector of our home and car.

I have a degree in biology, and it really bothers me to see the amount of close linebreeding (read: INBREEDING) in many German shepherds, especially the German and American showlines. You just can't get away with that, and expect your animals to be healthy and long-lived!

Even the German working lines are getting a lot of backmassing on Fero, Troll, Timmy and Yoshcy. Not good... :crying:

Tasha at 2 years old. My husband and i were celebrating our first wedding anniversary at the Highland Games in Fergus, Ontario, and of course, the dog had to come along!

Second photo: Going gray together. Tasha at 13, half way through a very strenuous hike in Algonquin Park. The lookout we are sitting on required the humans to get down on all fours to reach it safely!


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Not being a biology whiz it does not take much to realize dogs being bred carrying specific genes whether that being causing cancer or any other predisposition of a gene regardless of the line will have increase in health risks and add in stress, environmental factors, diet, vaccines etc. and at the same time it’s all luck of the draw.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

What a unique set of pictures!


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Thanks, Wolfy! Still miss her, but am grateful she died in her sleep so I didn't have to make the horrible decision to have her euthanized, just 9 month after losing my husband to cancer.

Jenny, let me give you a really quick crash course in genetics. Genes (and chromosomes) come in pairs. Most harmful genes are recessive, meaning two of them have to be present in order for the harmful trait to show up. ALL animals carry at least some harmful recessive genes. (There are GOOD recessive genes too, of course.) As long as there is one dominant gene present to mask the faulty recessive one, you're okay.

Once you start breeding really closely, the chances of both recessive genes popping up in the offspring greatly increases. One of the worst things that happens to purebred dog gene pools is the gene pool becoming dominated by a popular sire. (Of course, this happens with other domestic animals, too!) When almost all the dogs in a particular gene pool go back to the same ancestors, there is nowhere you can go to get away from the harmful genes carried by the sire and his offspring.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Yes and this happens often in all lines I dont need to remind you it sounds like I need to and will. Lol!


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

selzer said:


> I think we are "loving" our dogs to death. You can blame BYBs, but fact is, they were doing pretty much the same things when the lifespan was 12-14. What HAS changed in the past couple decades?
> 
> How about blood carried monthly flea-tick-heartworm preventatives, pediatric spay/neuter surgeries, ultra-concentrated high protein kibbles, aggressive vaccinations. $800+ in well-puppy visits WITHOUT a spay surgery in two months.
> 
> Maybe dogs are spending too much time indoors and not enough times outdoors in the sun/elements.


Agree. 

I think exercise and no stress is huge. Keeping them thin and active. A decent diet, minimal vaccines, as little chemical as possible. I don't even clean with chemicals anymore. The yard is laded with weeds and I don't care.


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

I was just looking through some pedigrees, and when ages were listed was disappointed to see the dogs dying anywhere from just 8 to around 10-11. This was very anecdotal. One lived to 14. My female's sire is now 14.5, but it does seem living into the mid-late teens is highly unusual. 

While exercise is good, do you think there is correlation between working as a police dog or titling multiple times in protection sport and a shorter lifespan? The dogs I was looking at were titled in ring or PH-1 (KNPV). The PH-1 titled dog were working K9s.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Muskeg said:


> I was just looking through some pedigrees, and when ages were listed was disappointed to see the dogs dying anywhere from just 8 to around 10-11. This was very anecdotal. One lived to 14. My female's sire is now 14.5, but it does seem living into the mid-late teens is highly unusual.
> 
> While exercise is good, do you think there is correlation between working as a police dog or titling multiple times in protection sport and a shorter lifespan? The dogs I was looking at were titled in ring or PH-1 (KNPV). The PH-1 titled dog were working K9s.


I've saw quite a few police dogs die from Hemo lately. All different ages, working and retired.


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

Muskeg said:


> I was just looking through some pedigrees, and when ages were listed was disappointed to see the dogs dying anywhere from just 8 to around 10-11. This was very anecdotal. One lived to 14. My female's sire is now 14.5, but it does seem living into the mid-late teens is highly unusual.
> 
> While exercise is good, do you think there is correlation between working as a police dog or titling multiple times in protection sport and a shorter lifespan? The dogs I was looking at were titled in ring or PH-1 (KNPV). The PH-1 titled dog were working K9s.


Usually professional athletes have knee and joint issues as they get older............


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

llombardo said:


> Agree.
> 
> I think exercise and no stress is huge. Keeping them thin and active. A decent diet, minimal vaccines, as little chemical as possible. I don't even clean with chemicals anymore. The yard is laded with weeds and I don't care.



Your yard, too? I don't call them weeds, I call it all "ground cover". With our dogs running around the yard and sometimes digging up voles, trying to have the perfect lawn is a waste of time and money. 

Now if we would take care of ourselves as well as we take care of our dogs.


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## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

This I should really sad if true. I always figured I'd have much GSD to at least age 11-12. Unfortunately I lost her to HSA at 8 years old so that estimate would sadly be correct.


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

Besides the 13 Club (GSDCA), are there any other acknowledgements for dogs that demonstrate longevity?

Obviously word of mouth and personal observation is superb, but this is a huge country and pockets of dogs can be pretty spread out.


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## GSDMom93 (May 13, 2018)

We just lost our gorgeous girl to bloat at 7.5yrs. I’m still in shock. But I’m wondering if that plays into the lower life expectancy. Our last GSD we lost at 10.5 due to hemsngiocarcinoma. So we’re right in that range, sadly. 

I just can’t get a different breed, though.


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## GandalfTheShepherd (May 1, 2017)

How come the white shepherd lifespan is listed as longer? 12-14 years.


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## Mareesey (Aug 25, 2016)

Sunsilver said:


> One of the worst things that happens to purebred dog gene pools is the gene pool becoming dominated by a popular sire.



I was wondering what is considered a popular sire? I was looking at pedigrees because I was bored earlier today and clicked on a puppy who was claimed to be "puppy royalty", clicked on the sire, and low and behold he had 594 listed offspring... I was amazed, to me that is ridiculous, but maybe because I don't breed it sounds like a lot to me but isn't all that bad?


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## Mareesey (Aug 25, 2016)

GSDMom93 said:


> We just lost our gorgeous girl to bloat at 7.5yrs. I’m still in shock. But I’m wondering if that plays into the lower life expectancy. Our last GSD we lost at 10.5 due to hemsngiocarcinoma.


I wonder too if it isn't a lot more outliers. We had a girl make it to 12, a male make it to 12 1/2, and another male only make it to 9 1/2 (brain tumor). My last girl only made it to 22 months because she got leukemia. Our vet said they had just had a 2 1/2 year old female GSD who died from leukemia a few months before ours did.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Longevity is an inheritable characteristic. A good breeder will actually select for it. Eska's breeder has two females that are in AKC's 13 club. One of them is Eska's grandmother.

I've been very lucky. Two of my GSDs have made it to 14, and my current senior is 11 and in excellent health, aside from being a bit deaf. My first GSD had to be euthanized at the age of 9 due to ankylosing spondylitis in her spine, which gradually robbed her of the ability to walk.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

I have lost my last 3 to hemangiosarcoma

Toby 11
Cyra 9
Grim 8 

Before that

Linus lived to 15

Beau is currently 7 in July


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Mareesey said:


> I was wondering what is considered a popular sire? I was looking at pedigrees because I was bored earlier today and clicked on a puppy who was claimed to be "puppy royalty", clicked on the sire, and low and behold he had 594 listed offspring... I was amazed, to me that is ridiculous, but maybe because I don't breed it sounds like a lot to me but isn't all that bad?


Mareesey, it becomes a bad thing when the whole gene pool of a breed becomes dominated by just a couple of sires. The best example of this is probably Lance of Fran-Jo, and they way he dominated the ASL gene pool. The problem with it is all animals carry some harmful recessive genes, and when one sire dominates, there is nowhere breeders can go to get away from those genes.

The best explanation of it I've come across is this one:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...crease-longevity-your-dogs-3.html#post8825178


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## El_rex (Jan 14, 2016)

Another biologist here, doing lots of genome wide stuff, unfortunately not in dogs. Dog data are scarce and for obvious reasons this specie is not being studied anywhere near as needed to draw meaningful conclusions but I fear genetic component, too (nature usually beats nurture). There are things called "single nucleotide polymorphisms" and it is well known these can be linked to disease predisposition. It is easy to imagine that in a limited gene pool "bad s.n.p s" get widespread and then, given suboptimal environment, lead to disease manifestation.


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## [email protected] (Dec 13, 2017)

Don’t worry. I had my boy Solito from very little puppy to old man. At 7 years old, he was in the prime of his life. Still acting like a puppy, strong, funny, devoted. I loved him so much. After 10 years old, I thought, “ I will have this guy well into his 14th year, i just know it”. As he went beyond 10 I watched as age affected him. I knew our time together was growing shorter. I lost him at 12 years old, just a little past his 12th bday. The best 12 years of my life. So here’s to 12-14 more with Regalo!


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