# aggression towards another dog in the house, its pretty long.



## PhoenixGuardian (Jul 10, 2013)

Hi, its me again.
so Phoenix, my best buddy ever has over the past couple of months started building aggression towards one of my sister's senior dogs. This dog is one of our old sled dogs now retired to a life on the couch. She has lived inside for almost a year and a half, so for quite a bit of Phoenix's life. Half of the time, he snuggles with her on the couch (despite her incessant growling, she hates his guts) but then randomly, he will attack her. Let me go back just a bit.
My sister's other dog, a house-husky called Suzie lays for this dog. She used to just randomly attack her outside, and Phoenix used to help break it up, until he learned that it was more fun to help beat Fairbanks (dog getting attacked) up. Most of the time, he is fine with her, but any time he even looks at her, she snarls and snaps. Most of the time he ignores it, but if she is on the ground (I swear, 22 hours of the day she is on the couch, its where she lives) he gets much more defensive. He is very particular about where everything is, and what everything is doing on our farm, if a dog is in a different place he tries to "put it back" he does the same with the goats. He hates any of the animals in new places. But, she lives here too, and he should accept her, she's been in here most of his life! 
About ten minutes ago, she was laying on the floor, and my sister called her over to the couch. She didn't want to come and kept looking at Phoenix. She knew what he was thinking but got up anyway, I was eating dinner and wasn't paying close attention till I saw him move. He attacked her, though no harm done, and I reprimanded him and made him lay at my feet for a while. Then, about twenty minutes later, he did it again. 
Here are my theories:
He is two, and, while neutered, very protective and driven. His "boss" my mom's Shar-Pei died last winter, and ever since, his territorial aggression has been building (though in the last couple of months he has been very good). She is very nervous around him, and has always ALWAYS growled at him when he's around. I think that Suzie taught him to attack her first, just by showing him that it can be done, even though you get in BIG trouble for it. I also think that its part of his age, he's growing more into his adult brain and "trying stuff out" to see if he can be the top dog. Mr. Wrinkles (horrible name, but he came with it) my mom's shar-pei attacked Phoenix when he was a tiny baby, so he needed to go to the vet. ever since then, Wrink was hi hero, oddly enough. He was Wrink's nurse before he died when he was really sick, sleeping with him, keeping him clean, and protecting him. Fairbanks has made it clear from the get-go that they are not friends, and I do understand that it is part of the hierarchy, but he can't just attack her out of the blue, for being in the wrong spot. I also think that it is worse when I am around (he is extremily protective of me). 
Earlier today I played with him, hard from nine in the morning to about eleven, with about a twenty minute break in the middle. He was exhausted and slept in the crate for quite a while after this, and I shut him in, because We needed him to be contained for a bit. So, after sleeping hard for a long time, he was "feeling it". 
After my reprimand he was good again, but then the second time, Fairbanks had just come in from outside, and was on the ground again. It was as though he had "Unfinished business" with her and forgot what I told him.
Another thing that I have forgotten to mention is that he is EXTREMELY intuitive, and knows what I am feeling at all times, no matter how I try to hide it. I was a bit nervous the second time, just a little scared he would attack again, and sure enough, he did! I try really hard to control my emotions, let him only feel calm from me, but I suck at it.
Any suggestions on ways to get him past this? Do you think that, with continued supervision, he will just grow out of this? I look over at the couch while I am writing and, sure enough, he is fast asleep right next to her again, as though nothing happened.
I obviously don't want Fairbanks to get hurt, or to always be scared of my dog, but even more, I don't want him to be unreliable. He is fine with other dogs, he has been well socialized with dogs (thought people are still a definite work in progress) and generally loves and respects other dogs, but (I think because of her attitude towards him) he just does not like her. At all. 
On another note (though this probably has nothing or very little to do with it) he has terrible flea allergies, and we have been under heavy siege from the fleas all year. Could this be tweaking his attitude at all? Just a thought, I really try and look at every possible aspect of a problem, and just wondered if this sounded completely stupid or not. 
Do y'all think that (as I said earlier) with continued training and supervision he will just grow out of it? Or do you think that this will get worse before it gets better? 
Apart from his aggression, he is practically perfect in every way, I couldn't love him more! He is my absolute best friend.
If you made it all the way through this, you get a gold star!!!
Thanks, 
(Whoa...  thats really long!)


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## MadLab (Jan 7, 2013)

I can't understand what is going on there.



> Phoenix used to help break it up, until he learned that it was more fun to help beat Fairbanks (dog getting attacked) up.





> Fairbanks has made it clear from the get-go that they are not friends, and I do understand that it is part of the hierarchy, but he can't just attack her out of the blue,(Suzie?)


See these 2 quotes. The first one says Fairbanks is the dog getting attacked by Phoenix and another dog? but the second quote makes out like Fairbanks is attacking another dog Suzie.

I think your problem is the second scenario? Fairbanks attacking Suzie.?

You need to simplify the whole story first introducing the dogs, name, gender and age and simply explain the issues between them. Leave out the deceased dog for now.

Generally each dog needs to be taught that no growling or aggression is allowed. Even a stink eye is the start of aggression. I would instruct Fairbanks to go to a place instead of allowing him direct other dogs as he likes.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

IMHO, you need to be the protector of Fairbanks. If fairbanks doesn't like Phoenix, she shouldn't have to put up with him being a jerk. Her growling is just her way of voicing her displeasure. She is telling Phoenix to give her some space, and he is not listening. It is your job as a leader to listen to the dogs and use your brain to see a way for everyone to get along.

You need to catch Phoenix building up to attacking Fairbanks and stop it there, before he moves. Redirect him or give him a small leash correction to keep him from focusing on Fairbanks. He is being a bully and needs to give Fairbanks her space. I would keep Phoenix on a drag line in the house and train him to leave Fairbanks alone. Create a "no-fly-zone" around Fairbanks that Phoenix is not allowed into. No laying on the couch next to her because it obviously makes her uncomfortable. No attention towards Fairbanks at all, including laying on the floor staring at her. He needs to respect her space.

There should be consequences for bad behavior, especially bad pack behavior. You didn't mention what type of correction or reward system you have in place. Do you use a -R marker? Do you utilize corrections in training? I would manage the situation right away to keep Phoenix from practicing the bad behavior and possibly injuring Fairbanks. Then, when you have 100% attention on the dogs, you can allow them to be together and work on the problem. Phoenix doesn't get to decide when to attack Fairbanks because you are the leader.

Very often problems like these go away by implementing a leadership program, like NILIF. They show the dog that you are in charge and that you make all the decisions. Do you currently practice NILIF? Are you familiar with it's principles?

It sounds like you have a pretty nice dog with a case of weak leadership, allowing him to bully a weaker dog. It shouldn't take much to set him straight and show him that he doesn't get to pick on Fairbanks.

Looking forward to your replies!


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## Myah's Mom (Mar 25, 2013)

Crate them alternately, to prevent further incidents (which will make the situation worse and more difficult to train out of). They are only both out when supervised with your 100% attention. Tether your boy to you and teach him some manners.

Miss Fairbanks (if I have the story correct?) is a senior sled dog, used to a dog pack and not amused at this youngin'. She deserves space, but she also needs correction.


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## PhoenixGuardian (Jul 10, 2013)

MadLab said:


> I can't understand what is going on there.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Apologies, I wrote this entire thing quite quickly and didn't have time to edit as well as I should have. Fairbanks snarls, snaps and growls at all of our other dogs, warning them to stay away from her, but our other dogs take this as a challenge. Suzie is the instigator, but now, Phoenix has begun to take a more dominant roll in the situation. 
This all really began when my Mom's dog died, Phoenix was very attached to him and began to grow more defensive aggressive as time went on. I hope that explained the issue a bit more. 

I employ NILIF methods with practically everything; Phoenix gets nothing for free, and if I tell him to knock it off, he almost always does. Its just when I am there, but busy with something, and she goes somewhere that he thinks she shouldn't be that he goes after her. 
I am very much his boss. He understands this and is extremely receptive to me.


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## Twyla (Sep 18, 2011)

PG, you have had issues with Phoenix and aggression in the not so distant past. While the aggression may have been directed differently before, this may be another facet of it. In the past he acted up more with you present, and I believe you said something similar in this thread. Resource guarding? Pack dynamics have changed and it sounds like it has been left up to the dogs to work it out. As David said in the above post, step up on your leadership role. Phoenix shouldn't be making any decisions on his own. If you aren't able to keep your attention on him because you are busy (how dare life get in the way lol) tether him to you or crate him.

The senior has earned her right to a peaceful retirement and not have to deal with dogs attacking her. Manage it. 

If you haven't gotten a trainer involved yet, now is a very good time to. You have 3 dogs who aren't friends mixing it up, it could turn ugly real fast. A trainer would be able to observe first hand what is happening and advise you.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Something more is going on amongst all of them.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

PhoenixGuardian said:


> Apologies, I wrote this entire thing quite quickly and didn't have time to edit as well as I should have. Fairbanks snarls, snaps and growls at all of our other dogs, warning them to stay away from her, but our other dogs take this as a challenge. Suzie is the instigator, but now, Phoenix has begun to take a more dominant roll in the situation.
> This all really began when my Mom's dog died, Phoenix was very attached to him and began to grow more defensive aggressive as time went on. I hope that explained the issue a bit more.
> 
> I employ NILIF methods with practically everything; Phoenix gets nothing for free, and if I tell him to knock it off, he almost always does. Its just when I am there, but busy with something, and she goes somewhere that he thinks she shouldn't be that he goes after her.
> I am very much his boss. He understands this and is extremely receptive to me.


If you are "very much his boss," show him this behavior is not allowed, along with showing Fairbanks that she doesn't run the show either. If this was the case, and he was very receptive to you, there wouldn't be a problem in the first place. It's not up to him where she goes if he's not the one making decisions. He almost always listens when you tell him to knock it off, so just when he feels like it. 

You failed to answer how you train your dog, so it's pretty difficult to offer suggestions, except to write out all the possibilities.

Just trying to help you see what is going on.

David Winners


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

It sounds to me like you have allowed your dogs, all of them, to practice inter dog aggression for a long time. 

These are retired sled dogs? They used to live outside, in a pack? Or on chains in a sled dog yard? 

The dynamics if a sled dog pack are very different than house dogs. As I am sure you know. You can't expect a sled dog to all of a sudden not practice the same behavior towards your pup. 

The retired dog " growls constantly" at you boy because she hates his guts??? She is obviously uncomfortable living and sharing close space with another dog. And TBH, if I was getting constantly growled at, I would lash out as well. 

So either you have not been able to train your pup to respect the other dogs signals, or you have not taken the time to retrain the sled dog that good things happen when the pup is around. Or both. 

You pup also learned aggression on other dogs when in an excited mode. Hence the 2 dog on one weaker dog scenario you described. Your pup LEARNED this behavior as an outlet. 

For now he should be tethered to you. When you come in the room with the retired dog, he should be out in a down, and the retired dog should be given treats when she is not growling. 

They need to learn to occupy the same space and respect each other. 




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## sarah1366 (Nov 3, 2013)

Sounds like hes trying to ascert pack leadership over her with gsd even thougj humans are pack leader you tend find there is a natural pecking order between themselves especially with packs of shepherds maybe same with yours but you do have let him know your pack leader therefore you listen to me ive also seen it happen in younger dogs that have known the older one is ill without the older one showing signs 

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## Alwaysaworkingdog (Feb 27, 2013)

If you didn't want to have to deal with pack dynamics, you shouldn't have created a pack in the first place.

You can only discourage this behaviour so much. If these dogs are not separated when you're not around, then this behaviour is just going to continue behind closed doors.

Dominance aggression is something that most owners of multiple dogs will encounter, in one degree or another. It may be a harsh realisation but a situation like this will mean that you have to make some tough decisions. 

The best solution would be to segregate when you're not there to supervise, if it is getting worse.


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## PhoenixGuardian (Jul 10, 2013)

The reason I posted here in the first place was because I want to deal with this problem, I have dealt with it before, but not with Phoenix. I was mainly looking for suggestions, different training techniques and so forth.
I have a trainer, but this was very recent, last night, so I didn't want to call her at night. I am not saying I haven't noticed this, I know he has aggression issues. How would YOU guys say that I should reprimand him? What would you do in this scenario?
THis pack that my family and I have created is not an unruly mess of dogs, as this may sound to some of you. They are very good dogs, the best! I have dealt with pack dynamics my whole life, I am not a novice with dogs, but am relatively new to the shepherd breed and wanted to ask you how you, many of whom have had Shepherds for many many years, would do in this situation.


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## MadLab (Jan 7, 2013)

> Phoenix gets nothing for free, and if I tell him to knock it off, *he almost always does*


The almost suggests you don't follow through with you commands. Your 'love' of the dogs is out weighting your responsibility to ensure a calm existance for each dog. Discipline is better than love for dogs in the long run. To me love is respect each dog and allowing them each to have no pressure from another dog in the pack.



> Fairbanks snarls, snaps and growls at all of our other dogs, warning them to stay away from her, but our other dogs take this as a challenge. Suzie is the instigator, but now, Phoenix has begun to take a more dominant roll in the situation.


Am I right in thinking the 3 indoors dogs you have is.

Fairbanks, female, age ?, breed ?
Phoenix, male, 1 year old, GSD
Suzie ,female, 7-8 year old, husky

In my mind each dog needs to know that the adults are in control and not the dogs. No dog is allowed to snarl or show teeth in my house and I have 5 dogs here with sometimes more. No posturing, resource guarding, stealing position or food, no intimidation or bullying. No dog has any preference and each

It is the only way to have a pack of dogs without any tension if you want them free roaming around the house.


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## PhoenixGuardian (Jul 10, 2013)

Hey, talked to my trainer and she's helping me resolve the issue, thank you for your replies!
(We have four dogs in the house, a mastiff, my shepherd, and the two husky girls). Things are going much better today, but thank you all.


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