# PA-8WEEK WHITE FEMALE-BLIND/HEART MURMUR-FREE



## Myamom

8 week White Shepherd puppy for adoption
Reply to: [email protected]
Date: 2008-06-04, 11:24AM 

I have a sweet girl that needs a family. 
She was born blind and with a heart murmur but you would not know it watching her play. She will come home with her AKC papers, her pedigree, vaccines and worming and lots of loving behind her. She is very intelligent and well on her way to housetrained. 
I am not asking any adoption fee but I do request refrences by phone or letter. 
to call my number is 267-718-4173. Please mention about adoption puppy.


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## BowWowMeow

Someone who should not be breeding, perhaps? And should stand behind this pup and keep her!


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## Karin

This is awful. I can't believe that someone would give up a sweet, blind 8-week old pup to a stranger for FREE on Craigslist! There are a lot of unscrupulous people out there and anyone can give fake references. I am worried about this poor little pup.


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## Myamom

ME TOO!


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## skyizzy

Gosh I hope whoever get her does NOT breed her








Poor baby. I hope she gets a loving home.


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## ebrannan

I Googled the phone number and came up with several references of horses/other for sale with the number as the contact number. The number leads to an e-mail, which leads to 
http://whiteshepherd.com/jaminken/jamin.htm


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## Shepherdswatch67

And I would hope to god they make sure she is fixed. This dog really needs to go to rescue to make sure its not dumped. Anyone contact ECHO?

Susan
Long Haired German Shepherd Rescue


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## Strana1

The following is a quote from the website, interesting that they will give the pup away on craigslist.


"If you are considering owning a White German Shepherd, you must remember your dog will be devoted to you and your family heart, mind and body. He or she will be willing to give their life for you or your household. Those who acquire a puppy must understand that this is a lifelong commitment to your dog. Your White German Shepherd, if separated from you, will mourn for you, often for the remainder of its life. When you choose a White German Shepherd please do not take your commitment lightly, such selfless love is no small thing."


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## Myamom

Strana...how did you figure out a website? 

Can you send me the link or post?


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## Strana1

The link is above from ebrannan and I also googled the craigslist phone number and came up with the same website.

http://www.whiteshepherd.com/


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## Myamom

Thanks!

(missed ebrannan's post)


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## elsie

i googled the phone number and got the website for a water technology company in perkasie pa. ( herot water tech. )


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## Myamom

I did a reverse search in the white pages and it came up that it was a cell phone.......


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## shilohsmom

we have good detectives on this board!!!!


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## Strana1

They apparently are involved in many things!


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## elsie

yup, that's what i got


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## sielick

i have her on the phone....well....she has been breeding since 1969 and she says it "happens" well?? what more can i say


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## Myamom

oh...geez...can she hold off and instead of giving it away on craigslist.....accept help screening potential adopters...as she will need a special placement?


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## Myamom

can you ask her what the murmur means...is it something that may need surgery...or something she may grow out of?


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## sielick

she was vague...i asked her what grade it was and i don;t think she even knows..or cares


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## sielick

now we have to get this pup..she has a 'potential' adopter..which i thinka was b/s when i mentioned i was with rescue!!!! HOW DARE SHE


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## sielick

now we have to get this pup..she has a 'potential' adopter..which i thinka was b/s when i mentioned i was with rescue!!!! HOW DARE SHE


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## ebrannan

I am not surprised. It does sound like they are into a lot of things, and notice ...
Just pics of dogs ... no pedigree after their pics, no OFA results, no titles, just the dogs. 
Someone else needs to call, not mention anything about rescue, just give the needed references, vet references, etc. and get that pup to safety. 
Big HUGE freakin' growl ... 
Reputable breeders have a history of working w/ the rescues, I will end it at that.


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## Myamom

I have some more info...but pm me.....


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## Kaitadog

Good lord. I wish there was a way to stop these people somehow. Hopefully someone else is able to get a hold of the pup, now that we know that she's not open to rescue. She just made things that much harder. 

On a slightly more positive but less P.C. note, she won't be breeding much longer if she's been doing it for nearly 40 years.....


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## ToFree24

Bumping this pup up


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## BowWowMeow

I HATE bailing out breeders. It makes me sick. Yes, I realize that pup needs a really special home but so does every animal. She should pay the vet bills for a rescue to take the pup. That would be the responsible thing to do. Grrr....


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## Marshmallows

I am a little lost as I don't really see the evil here? 
What is wrong with placing an add on craiglist? how is that any different than placing an add in a paper or anywere else on the internet. Why can some one not place their own special needs puppy. She is not charging anything for this puppy, it sounds to me like she wants to find her a good home. And even says on the add that you must references before she is going to give the puppy away. Why must a breeder work with a rescue who calls them up about a puppy they are taking care of. Personally I think less of a breeder that dump their problem dogs onto rescues.

As a person who as only dealt with rescue a little bit I would have to say that I have become wary of the over zealousness that I have seen. 
Not pointing any finger at anyone here, it something I am dealing with at home too; with a cat I am trying to get spayed. but I do have to say that some of the assumptions about this breeder are a little premature.


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## Myamom

actually...they are not...but I didn't want to discuss on an open forum.

and let me ask you Marshmallows...shouldn't a new owner be totally informed before considering this dog? She doesn't know the grade of the murmur? Wouldn't you ask your vet that so you can let a prospective owner know what they are facing? She's been to a vet.......but when asked questions about the murmur...she didn't know...really?


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## BowWowMeow

The issue is not Craigslist v. some other advertising venue. A dog that she bred has a (possibly serious) health issue. As a breeder, I think it is her responsibility to care (financially) for that dog.

Let's compare to a reputable rescue. If a reputable rescue takes in a litter of puppies and one has a serious health condition they get the appropriate vet care and all of the information about the condition before adopting the dog out. In some cases they will even set up a fund to continue to help care for the dog if it is a chronic condition. That's what I think this breeder should do.


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## Myamom

Thank you Bowwow...for articulating better for me.........


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## Kaitadog

The issue isn't so much craigslist v. other means. My biggest peeve is her being a crappy backyard breeder. The fact that she doesn't prove anywhere that her dogs are qualified to be breeding, by way of titles, OFA results, etc, just shows me that she has no business breeding. 

I am upset that she is breeding dogs that have contributed to this pup being blind and having a supposed heart murmur. I may be wrong, but if she was doing thorough health examinations of her dogs, I would think this wouldn't happen. She is probably going to continue breeding the particular sire and dam, possibly passing on these issues to more pups. Plus, she has no idea how extensive this heart issue is. She wasn't able to tell the caller anything. 

Now she wants to pawn off this dog to anyone with a vet reference. Is that how she screens the families that buy her dogs?

Sorry, not mad at anyone here, just furious that this happened.


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## Marshmallows

My comments on what was wrong with posting on craiglist came from a couple of the comments on here are previous post that I have seen where people are trying to place there pets and the only complaint seem to be that it was on craiglist.

When ever I am dealing with other people and their dogs, I always tell myself that not everyone treats or sees their dogs the same way I do. There are going to be people out there who have a different standards. Some do more some do less. And just because they do less does not necessarily make them bad. 

The puppy has been to the vet. All I know is that the breeder didn't seem to know what grade of mummer this puppy has, maybe her vet didn't give her a grade, I don't know. As far as we can tell the puppy is being loved and taken care off. It has still received its shots and wormer. The breeder has informed any potential adopter that it has a heart murmur. we were not giving the rest of the phone conversation as to what else the vet told her about the puppy's condition but I would assume that since the breeder was upfront about the condition that she would pass all of that on to the new owners. The breeder is screening potential adopter and not just handing this puppy over to the first person who calls. I don't think it is the breeder's responsibility to fix or be forever financially responsible for this dog. I do think that it is the breeder's responsibility to make sure the puppy is not suffering;make a quality of life decision and see that it goes to a good home for the rest of its life, for ever how long that is.


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## Marshmallows

> Originally Posted By: KaitadogThe issue isn't so much craigslist v. other means. My biggest peeve is her being a crappy backyard breeder. The fact that she doesn't prove anywhere that her dogs are qualified to be breeding, by way of titles, OFA results, etc, just shows me that she has no business breeding.
> 
> I am upset that she is breeding dogs that have contributed to this pup being blind and having a supposed heart murmur. I may be wrong, but if she was doing thorough health examinations of her dogs, I would think this wouldn't happen. She is probably going to continue breeding the particular sire and dam, possibly passing on these issues to more pups. Plus, she has no idea how extensive this heart issue is. She wasn't able to tell the caller anything.
> 
> Now she wants to pawn off this dog to anyone with a vet reference. Is that how she screens the families that buy her dogs?
> 
> Sorry, not mad at anyone here, just furious that this happened.


Wow lots of assumptions there, Oh and you can rest your mind about one issue, she does OFA her dogs. How do I know? My male goes back to her kennel on both sides. She has a awesome male who was used in a lot of the top White show lines.

I will give you that her website really lacks, And I will give you that she doesn't do any titling. I got to say though; until the last 10 years Whites weren't really welcome in any of the tittling areas. It can still be an uphill battle to do Schutzhund with them, depending on the clubs that are around you.
but all of that is a long way form not caring about her dogs or what she is breeding. Even in the best kennels crap pops up, I don't care how much testing you do. GSD have one long list of genetic disorders that plague the breed. One could not test for everything

And you last line about pawning off the puppy that is a judgment based on 2nd hand information. Where you did not hear both sides of the conversation.


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## LandosMom

At least the breeder is trying to screen and find a home for the pup. It would not be unusual for a breeder to euth a blind pup with a heart murmur. I know this because one day about 15 years ago my mother brought home a deaf dobie pup that a vet refused to euth for a breeder. the vet placed the 3 pups in good homes. he told my mom it was not an uncommon practice for some breeders.


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## elsie

> Originally Posted By: LandosMom he told my mom it was not an uncommon practice for some breeders.


what, like junking defective goods ?


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## Kaitadog

Maybe, but I just don't see them as GOOD breeders. Just my opinion, coming from a rescue-based background. Sorry for getting this off-topic.


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## Maryn

> Originally Posted By: elsie
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted By: LandosMom he told my mom it was not an uncommon practice for some breeders.
> 
> 
> 
> what, like junking defective goods ?
Click to expand...

It's all culling.

The pups that aren't seen as breeding stock or have health issues are culled. This can mean placed in a pet home, or -as barbaric as it seems- putting them down.


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## kathyb

I know the Monks of New Skete PTS pups that are not perfect. Someone I know breed his male with one of their's and a pup had an overbite, he was going to take that one as his payment. He was too late they had already PTS the pup. He no longer has anything to do with them. I use to think I would like to live there, GS dogs, cheese cake, and ham what more could I want. I would not last long as I am not perfect. At least they are trying to find a home.


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## Karin

Any word on this girl?


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## romeosmom

poor lil girl...I hope she gets a good forever home!


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## romeosmom

> Originally Posted By: BowWowMeowI HATE bailing out breeders. It makes me sick. Yes, I realize that pup needs a really special home but so does every animal. She should pay the vet bills for a rescue to take the pup. That would be the responsible thing to do. Grrr....


I agree!


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## ToFree24

Bumping this little angel up and hoping someone can give her a home 


Please







an







!!


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## Prinzsalpha

White Paws will take this baby. Can someone help us????????????


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## moei

> Originally Posted By: MyoungWhite Paws will take this baby. Can someone help us????????????


whatcha need?


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## Prinzsalpha

I called to speak with her but got an answering machine. I called the breeder number. Left my message but no answer so far.


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## sielick

well the dog is RIGHT BACK ON THERE...Week old White German Shepherd Blind female puppy (Perkasie)

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Reply to: [email protected]
Date: 2008-06-09, 8:45AM EDT


I am looking for a life long home for a sweet, family oriented AKC white shepherd puppy with special needs. She was born blind but does very well with that handicap, she also has a heart murmer but it does not seem to affect her ability to play or grow. She is very well mannered and even pees on command. Vet references required. Please call to come and meet her. 
267-718-4173 




Location: Perkasie 
it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests

PostingID: 713193335


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Copyright © 2008 craigslist, inc. terms of use privacy !!!!!


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## sielick

PRETEND TO WANT HER...THAT;S THE ONLY WAY I SENT HER AN EMAIL STATING SHE SHOULD OWN UP TO ANY MEDICAL BILLS...AND STOP BREEDING


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## sielick

bump


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## mmackey

Myoung,

pm'd you


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## Kaitadog

Removed by request 
Patsy, Moderator


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## Kaitadog

Removed by request 
Patsy, Moderator


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## Karin

Bump for this poor little girl.


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## sravictor

Don't know the whole situation with this pup, but if Maureen said WP will take her, she must have gotten it cleared.


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## Marshmallows

**Removed by Admin***


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## BowWowMeow

I think it's great that White Paws is willing and able to take this pup. I assume that the breeder will be giving them a donation for her care.


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## Myamom

I am sorry...I was only trying to help. I thought if we could find out the extent of the murmur..it would help someone in their decision to take the pup.


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## Marshmallows

> Originally Posted By: BowWowMeowI think it's great that White Paws is willing and able to take this pup. I assume that the breeder will be giving them a donation for her care.


Since the breeder does not seem to want to work with a rescue, hence the need to lie to her to try to "adopt" the puppy from her I would say thats a no.


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## Myamom

I have asked the mods to remove my posting. Thank you for sound advice.


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## BowWowMeow

> Originally Posted By: Marshmallows
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted By: BowWowMeowI think it's great that White Paws is willing and able to take this pup. I assume that the breeder will be giving them a donation for her care.
> 
> 
> 
> Since the breeder does not seem to want to work with a rescue, hence the need to lie to her to try to "adopt" the puppy from her I would say thats a no.
Click to expand...

I saw that White Paws contacted the breeder directly. I do not support lying to "adopt" a puppy, especially in a circumstance like this. I support the breeder trying to find the pup a good home. It is too bad she is not willing to work with a white rescue because they are much better placed to find a special needs home. There are many breeders who support rescue financially and in other ways.


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## Karin

Bumping in the hopes that someone might want this little girl.


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## Karin

Was this girl ever taken in by White Paws?


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## GSDTrain

any updates?


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## Prinzsalpha

They never got back to us so I am assuming they did not want her to go to rescue.


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## ToFree24

Any updates?


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## Aussiegal

I happend to stumble on this board while looking for German Shepherd info in PA, and I am able to give an update so I registered here as a user.

The puppy is fine. I responded to the ad in Craigslist and brought her home with me. She is settling in nicely. She has been taken in for vaccinations and deworming. She is scheduled to be microchipped and spayed when she is 16 weeks old. She is in a training class and has learned sit and down in one session; she is a natural on-leash. She gets along with everyone she meets and loves my two Aussies. 

I am taking her out about three times a week to the park, pet store, or just for a car ride. I'm trying to expose her to a variety of different noises, places, and people. She sleeps in a crate at night but is out and about during the day. I am working from home this summer. In the fall, someone will be home 4 days a week, and I come home on my lunchbreaks to let the dogs out and to take them for a quick walk. 

This is my first experience with a german shepherd; I have worked with Australian Shepherds for years and have done rally, therapy work, and limited conformation showing (though both of my dogs are now altered). I have been in contact with a local rescue for german shepherd info; I am trying to learn all that I can. If anyone here has advice, please feel free to share it.

For her eyes, I will be contacting a canine opthamologist for an exam; s/he can assess the extent of her blindness, but I believe that she is completely blind. I am told that she has optic nerve hypoplasia. She has an ultrasound scheduled on the 26th of June for her heart. 

I have named her Cotton.


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## gsdcentral

Thanks for the update and it sounds like she's in good hands. Blind dogs are amazing to watch. They adapt very well.


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## elsie

hi aussiegal








i am so very happy to know "Cotton" has a home, and, a wonderful one at that








bless your heart for taking her


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## Karin

This is great news!!! Thanks for taking in this girl and giving her a really nice home!









And welcome--this is a great source of support and information.


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## kathyb

Thank you for giving this girl such a good home.


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## artisgsd

Welcome Aussiegirl...

I'm in PA, may be close to you...and I also volunteer with a couple of rescues (see my signature). If you need help, please email me...

[email protected]


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## sravictor

What an unexpected extremely happy ending!


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