# Back to back breeding vs



## lytrefry (Oct 20, 2016)

So I know there is probably a thread somewhere here that says opinions on this, but I can't seem to find it. 
I'm just wondering what you do and what you think is the best for your breeding program AND WHY.. Just out of curiosity.
Would you rather breed 3, possibly 4 times in a row? Retire your bitch young? 
Or breed 3, 4 or maybe even more but space each breeding out a year from each?


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## Xeph (Jun 19, 2005)

I'd rather do a back to back, skip at least one season, do back to back (if I want four litters) and retire.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

It would depend totally on the female. Does she recover easily or does she get down in weight when nursing? Does she come into heat every 6-9 months (or more) or does she come into heat every 4-5 months? Is she competing? For the health of the female, they are better off being bred 4 times in a row and retired, but ........... It is very hard to evaluate her pups in that short of a time frame and often you will have no time to get prelims on hips and elbows done. It also has a lot to do with her age. No reason to breed a very young female back to back to back...... unless your goals for her are to only be a puppy factory. If your goals are to work the female then breeding them so many times when young would mean they go into competition or start working when they are older. That isn't ideal either.


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## Dracovich (Feb 24, 2017)

I think more recovery time is better, in the least 1 cycle between breeding. No younger than 2 years old and retire at 8, no more than 4 litters, but that's just my personal preference, some will breed a dog until it dies.

Training is also a factor, for WL dogs upkeep can be difficult when a dog is bred back to back, unless you work her through her pregnancy and nursing, it's just not something I would do. The last part of pregnancy and during nursing can physically drain a dog, so that's a couple months out of activity if it were my dog.

I'm not a breeder, just applying what I look for in a breeder.


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## lytrefry (Oct 20, 2016)

Thank you all for your input.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I have done back to back, but then gave a break. It really does depend soley on your bitch, and her current health. 

Here again, we liken pregnancy and whelping to human pregnancy and childbirth and get into trouble. A bitch is pregnant for 9 weeks, a woman for 9 months -- see the difference. A bitch nurses her puppies from 4-8 weeks, women nurse their babies for upwards to a year, and in some instances even longer, when they breastfeed. A bitch generally is done with her job of parenting at 8 weeks. A woman is a parent for the rest of her life, but you could give it a cutoff of adulthood, 18-21 years, or marriage, or finishing of college, or moving out of the home. Evenso, you can see the difference in stress and energy requirements. 

Also a dog generally has a litter of 1-12 puppies all at once; whereas a woman has one or possibly two and in rare instances more. The thing is, the body only has enough room for a certain number of pounds in there. So a bitch might have 10 pounds of puppy in there, but each pup probably weighs 13 - 24 ounces. And even when they have just one big puppy it is usually about 24 ounces, maybe 2 pounds. When women generally have a baby that weights 6-10 pounds. If she has two, they maybe 3-4 pounds each. Even there we run into difficulties comparing. A bitch is 1/2 to 1/3 the weight/size of her human counterpart. So a human having a 7.5 pound baby would be like a bitch having a 3.75 pound puppy or even a 2.5 pound puppy -- that's huge for a whelp, never had any puppy near that size. 

So it's comparing apples to oranges. 

A dog's lifespan is 12-14 years at most, a human's is 65-90 years. 
Humans often have kids 1-2 years apart. 

Let's go with two years apart just because I think it is more common. She is pregnant for 9 months, breastfeeds for 8 months, then 7 months later she is pregnant again. 

This is compared to a bitch bred back to back. She is pregnant for just over 2 months. She breastfeeds for 2 months, and then has 2-4 months off before going into heat again, depending on her cycle. 

A woman would have to be pregnant for 9 months, then breast feed for 9 months, and then have 9 months off before becoming pregnant again. That would be having a kid every 27 months. Which is not uncommon at all. 

Let's see, we were born 5/63, 1/65, 10/66, 11/68, 9/75, 7/79, so that would have been 20 months, 21 months, 25 months, and those other two are outlighers anyway. That's like back to back to back to back. 

Physiologically, the bitch's uterine horns are attacked with progesterone whether she is bred or not. Some go through false pregnancies, because of the spikes in hormones. Others grow cysts. In the wild, these bitches would be bred every cycle, if the climate and food sources were sufficient. 

As for raising puppies, some bitches seem to revel in having puppies. 

I recently sold Jenna's last two puppies. They were almost three years old and certainly they did not need to be kenneled with their dam. They are doing fine and adjusted to their new homes without issue. Jenna on the other hand, became depressed. I moved her into the house, and promised to give her a puppy to raise. And a week later, I presented her with Kojak. She became happy as a lark again. Would she have anyway? Probably. Maybe. Jenna is a great mother, and loves her puppies. She loves to play with them. She is very gentle with them. I think having a puppy or two around makes life less boring when I am not there, and even when I am. Jenna is eleven and a half years old. I can't really breed her again. But I was able to give her a puppy to be in with her for a while, probably for the rest of her life, save heat cycles. 

I had her at the vet yesterday, for a follow up appointment on an ear infection. 74 pounds -- ideal weight. She kept climbing up on the exam table, likes to be up there. She jumped all the way down and I yelled at her and told her to use the chair. She did after that. She is still athletic -- hangs out on the counter in her area -- likes it up there (yes there is a chair). I think having puppies kept her young. She was bread back to back the first time, puppies born in July 26 (Joy will be eight), and then the following March (Bear just turned 7). So about 8 months between litters. The next litter the following March, Hepsi just turned 6, then I skipped a full year, and then the next January. Cujo and Karma are 4. And then the following April -- Nikki and Nina who just went to their new homes just turned 3. 5 litters, 10, 7, 8, 7, and 7, 39 puppies. She is Momma Jenna to Kojak. She passes to him high value food items, like raw chicken legs, like she did to her whelps, and waits for hers.


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