# Breeder referral for Working Line - Black and Tan saddle coat



## dgouge03 (Mar 28, 2016)

Hi Everyone,

I'm hoping someone can help point me in the right direction. I'm looking for a working line, black and tan saddle, short coat pup. All the working line breeders I have come across in my area have sable coats. 

Any help would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

knowing your location, lifestyle and plans for the dog would help...


----------



## dgouge03 (Mar 28, 2016)

I'm I'm Dallas-Fort Worth area. We are a very active family of 4, with 2 boys in their late teens. We're not looking for a show or competition dog, but we are wanting an active dog. One that can also be trained for protection if needed. From everything I've read, it sounds like a WL with a moderate drive would be the best fit for our family.


----------



## Shade (Feb 20, 2012)

Most of WL are sables so it'll be harder to find but not impossible. Hopefully someone can chime in with some names


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I would contact~
Van Meerhout German Shepherds
=:= Germelhaus German Shepherd Dogs =:= Breeding Top Working Schutzhund GSDs
or Weberhaus German Shepherds - Home though Weberhaus is not in TX. Stud dog Miky would be the one I suggest if you want B&T, see who is breeding to him. I know a few dogs out of him(Wildhaus has used him for a few breedings) and they are very stable, social dogs.


----------



## HOBY (Aug 12, 2013)

I have seen black and tans [also blanket backs] in the East German lines also known as DDR. I have seen washed out bi-colors looking more like black and tans or blanket backs compared to the traditional bi-colored. All East German. I don't know any breeders in your area but you should not have a hard time finding the combo you want. Good luck.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

https://www.facebook.com/warkonhaus/

staatsmacht

Welcome to Rebel Yelle

There are 3 to start that all have black and tans in their breeding stock. I would find a local IPO club and go watch the dogs. You can easily find breeders of black/tan working lines.


----------



## dgouge03 (Mar 28, 2016)

I felt confident I came to the right place to get help, and I was right. Thanks for the help everyone!


----------



## mego (Jan 27, 2013)

also was going to suggest Germelhaus . Mellodee is really nice and is fun to talk with about her dogs, she's boarded my dog before too.


----------



## Seer (May 24, 2011)

There is only a small hand full of saddleback within the east line any longer. The elusive  black sable has squashed out most of the patterns. They sell fast and are/have been the current fad. Melanistic black and tan/red are a bit more prevalent.


----------



## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

I don't have a dog from them, but I have come know some of her pups, very happy owners. They are pretty far from you in north Idaho, not sure about having saddle backs, but she does have Black and Tan.

Vom Haus Vianden


----------



## CarolinaRose (Jun 21, 2014)

*So glad I saw this!*



Nigel said:


> I don't have a dog from them, but I have come know some of her pups, very happy owners. They are pretty far from you in north Idaho, not sure about having saddle backs, but she does have Black and Tan.
> 
> Vom Haus Vianden


Thank you so much for posting this breeder! I'd been looking for a breeder with a consistent line of blank and tan(saddle-back) dogs with working ability, but I'd never found this one! She doesn't have just one or two, she has a whole kennel full! And seems to concentrate on producing black and Tans. I saved pretty much all her females to my Imgs folder, and then I clicked on her MALES and found OUTLAW! I love this dog. He's the father of a dog I found on YouTube which turned me on to the Equidus Kennel/Line. I can't believe he's HERE in the US! I also noticed that many/all of her dogs have Ch and Int.Ch by their name. I'm assuming this means they were successful in AKC/CKC championship ring? I thought that was impossible for a working-line!

I'm just so freakin excited right now! :wild:

By the way - How do you guys feel about the fact that most of her dogs don't have a Sch/IPO title? They do have titles, and most have a BH, but no other "serious" working title. They do seem to come from (as far as I can tell) pretty good working lines though. And most have pictures/videos of them doing protection work.


----------



## mspiker03 (Dec 7, 2006)

Christina Clay (vom Donau Ries) in San Jose Ca has some Black and Tan working lines. I have met a few dogs from her and thought they were nice (the ones I know best are just in an active pet home). I know some people on this board have pups from her too.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Doesn't Anne Kent have black and tan?
Adler-Stein-Kennels-Los-Angeles-German-Shepherds


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

> By the way - How do you guys feel about the fact that most of her dogs don't have a Sch/IPO title? They do have titles, and most have a BH, but no other "serious" working title. They do seem to come from (as far as I can tell) pretty good working lines though. And most have pictures/videos of them doing protection work.


ask them why they aren't titling in IPO. I don't think asking on this or any board is going to be helpful, because we all have our own opinions. RN, BH isn't what I would consider to be for breedworthy assessment. Especially for a stud dog, though the studs listed seem to be titled(but not by the people using them for breeding?) If you are impressed with the kennel, visit them, and decide for yourself. Do they match pedigrees well, and are the pups they are producing proving their program is worthy? That would be more telling to me...what they are breeding should be proof of their program.


----------



## CarolinaRose (Jun 21, 2014)

Here are some breeders I've found that seem to consistantly have black and tan dogs. I don't have one from any of them (actually, right now I don't have one at all), but based on what I've heard about most of them, I feel pretty safe in suggesting them. 

Lucescu Kennels - Canada 

Hena-C Kennels - NH

Blackthorn Kennel - VA

Schraderhaus K9 - WA - There are LOTS of dogs here, mostly sable, but there are still a few Black and tans here.

Boomeracers - Canada - This breeder doesn't put sch/ipo titles on her dogs, but they are worked, and some dogs have lines that go back through KIRSCHENTAL in Germany. In fact, her newest male is likely one of the last Kirschental sons, as I believe the kennel closed down recently. 

I'd like to recommend Ryanhaus Kennels - MA  - but their website has been down for about a month. I'll leave the link for future reference. I'm assuming she just forgot to renew her website. (same thing happened with boomeracres around the beginning of the year, but it's back now). The one downside to this breeder is she will not ship pups, so you'd have to pick up in person.

And of corse, van Meerhout has already been recommended. 

*However, I'd like to ask everyone's opinion on the following breeder:*
Nocturne Acres Kennels - IN - I believe you'd classify this breeder as an ASL breeder, but she focuses on working her dogs, many of them SCH titles and german show ratings in addition to AKC show and sport titles. I found this kennel when I saw a picture of her male, Nocturne's Navigator, who was not only an AKC G.Ch but also had a SCH3 and KK1(life). My brain kinda exploded.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

CarolinaRose said:


> *However, I'd like to ask everyone's opinion on the following breeder:*
> Nocturne Acres Kennels - IN - I believe you'd classify this breeder as an ASL breeder, but she focuses on working her dogs, many of them SCH titles and german show ratings in addition to AKC show and sport titles. I found this kennel when I saw a picture of her male, Nocturne's Navigator, who was not only an AKC G.Ch but also had a SCH3 and KK1(life). My brain kinda exploded.


1/2 ASL
1/2 WGSL

But still very impressive.  Good for her! that's a nice looking dog.


----------



## dgouge03 (Mar 28, 2016)

Thanks again for everyone's response, this is great information! Does anyone think it would be worth looking at show lines for saddleback coat and train with WL's? Do show lines have enough drive for protection training?


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

dgouge03 said:


> Thanks again for everyone's response, this is great information! Does anyone think it would be worth looking at show lines for saddleback coat and train with WL's? Do show lines have enough drive for protection training?


Some show lines do. You'll want West German Show Lines.

It's more than the drive for protection though. They'll need hunt drive for tracking. Nice grips for bite work. Balanced drives for all phases.

So you look for a show line breeder that works and titles their breeding stock.


----------



## mego (Jan 27, 2013)

Look for breeders titling or training in what you want to do. Personally for me with my ipo prospeCT I only considered dogs out of parents titled in ipo or another protection sport. Can some untitled parents produce prospects ? Yes, but I feel like the likelihood is higher on parents that actually do ...and you get a breeder doing the same sport as you so you have another resource


----------



## dgouge03 (Mar 28, 2016)

Once again, thank you!


----------



## Trudys mom (May 26, 2015)

My girl Trudy is from Nocturne Acres 
Mom is Nocturne Kim and dad is Queen 
The web site list the litters pedigree and I think it's very nice with lots of working titles 
Check the litters page and you can see pedigrees from Helens lines.
Trudy is a medium size


----------

