# My dog I looking for



## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Okay here is what I'm looking for in a male German shepherd. One that is 100% healthy clear of all genetic health problems, straight backs, no sloped back, solid temperaments, strong dog in mind, soul, and body, loyal, protective, active, outgoing, mellow, affectionate, cuddly, European/West German Lines, 85-100lbs 65cm/80-90lbs 65cm. I'll accept who the dog is, won't always get who I want or imagined that's life. I don't mind working/show, and there is the medium/low drive. 

Looking for in a responsible breeder recommends neauter/spay, prices range from $1400-$2500 as for deposits $200-$500, takes their dog back under any circumstances, doesn't contribute with pet overpopulation, able to stay in touch with their clients, I don't want the breed to not ever reply again, has a facebook page, shipping available, picky who to give their pups to, ask prospective owner questions, doesn't pressure prospective owners to buy ask many questions beforehand, not just in it for the money, in it for quality not quantity, 100% honest, and is able to answer my questionaire.


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## ksotto333 (Aug 3, 2011)

Then go research breeders on your own. No one else should be doing all your work for you.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

If you want 100% healthy, clear of all genetic problems, and the rest, maybe you should check these out:

https://www.google.com/search?q=Ger...7Gom3yQTlh4CIBg&ved=0CEAQsAQ&biw=1024&bih=576


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## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

I understand being worried you might pick the wrong breeder/dog, but you are ahead of many people in that you know what you want, have standards and specifics. Many breeders have been mentioned along with pics of their pups (or those who bought the pups) you can start there, or keep researching and asking questions of the breeders your interested in. 
Good luck! 
God bless, 
Misty


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Hineni7 said:


> I understand being worried you might pick the wrong breeder/dog, but you are ahead of many people in that you know what you want, have standards and specifics. Many breeders have been mentioned along with pics of their pups (or those who bought the pups) you can start there, or keep researching and asking questions of the breeders your interested in.
> Good luck!
> God bless,
> Misty


Correct very worried about choosing the wrong breeder, no matter the questions I ask. I could show you my Questionaire that breeders are required to fill out before proceeding.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

You are still too immature nor ready to have a dog of any breed. You have not listened to anyone's suggestions and I pray nobody will sell you a puppy and that includes rescue.

You are now on my official ignore list.....I can't take it anymore.


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## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

There is a point where after all your study, research, and energy has narrowed down the breeders or litters of choice, that you operate in faith that you did your homework and chosen wisely. There are no guarantees in life. Do what you can, then pick a puppy and enjoy! Otherwise, you drive yourself (and others) crazy with your worry and indecision  Everyone comes to this juncture, and either make a choice or just don't get a dog.... Most probably make the choice and are thrilled with it..


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Lobo, you and your questionnaire are going to cause you to pass or be passed on many great dogs to the point when you become frustrated in your search and then go to the first yayhoo who will sell you a pup. 

You would be better served by listening to people whose dogs appeal to you. Listen to how they talk about their dog. Listen to what they complain about. And when you find some people whose dogs you really like, not just in looks, ASK them where they got their dog. 

When you are dealing with living creatures, there are no 100%s. There are no perfect 10 breeders either. I might think someone is a perfect 10, and someone else might give that breeder an 8 or a 4. This is because what is important to me as a buyer may be different than what is important to another person as a buyer. If a breeder is responsive when contacted before or after the sale, I think that is much more important than someone doing regular checks. 

Frankly, I haven't seen your questionnaire, but my guess is that the vast majority of breeders will see it, and think: "this person will be nothing but trouble." 

You need to relax, take your time, and meet some dogs and people.


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## Natural Beauty Farm (Jun 20, 2011)

Sorry but if you find this: European/West German Lines, 85-100lbs, its not as advertised or a good breeder


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

selzer said:


> Lobo, you and your questionnaire are going to cause you to pass or be passed on many great dogs to the point when you become frustrated in your search and then go to the first yayhoo who will sell you a pup.
> 
> You would be better served by listening to people whose dogs appeal to you. Listen to how they talk about their dog. Listen to what they complain about. And when you find some people whose dogs you really like, not just in looks, ASK them where they got their dog.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the suggestion, I guess you are right. I am already stumped who to choose for a breeder, since there are many.


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## jrennie15 (May 14, 2014)

Didn't you just announce you were getting a Von Lotta pup and had a ship date and everything? I kind of lost track of that thread.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Current German shepherd breeder list:

Von Lotta (Yuliyah answered well to my questions. Great person, and she is one of the most understanding people out there. I reminded her of how she was at my age desired can't wait to get a GS.) 
Vom Buflod 
Von Der Otto (Answered my quetions, great person. Really is a knowledgeable person)
Von-Lousar (Great person answered my questions in great detail. Great breeder, main concern is dog's well being. I was born in Toronto, Ontario, alternatively in another life style getting a dog there would be a piece of candy. Our concerns are the far away distances, and well being of the puppy.)
Five Peaks GSD (Also answered my questions, called awaiting replies, leave it at that.) 
Von Rief (dogs are reserved too late. My mistake still, answered my questions great detail.)
Vom hundhaus (just researching it) 


As for rescues:

Bay Area GS Rescue (hard to get a rescue from there. My rescue volunteer place, loved the leader organizer's dog!)
Northern CA Rescue
Golden State GS
than there is a shelter down in San Bernindo need help driving down there (can drive now) but need support with extra driving long distances. There was a GS on death's list, I want to save. My parents refuse to drive all that way.
Guess should wait until 23 for a rescue 

In the meantime, get a puppy from a responsible breeder!  I know what to look for in responsible breeders. I know I'm getting myself disorganized making frusteration, despite making an excel sheet!


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

jrennie15 said:


> Didn't you just announce you were getting a Von Lotta pup and had a ship date and everything? I kind of lost track of that thread.


I was and very excited, but we decided to look around Northern CA first. was just about to pay with the enough money. However, parents interfene because they are uneducated about breeders and the German Shepherd Dog. Although, would only live here for a few more years anyways and move out. Yuliya, was very understandable and could go back to her later on. It was disappointing, but she was knew my desire of can't wait to get a dog, just like she was once.


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## MilesNY (Aug 12, 2010)

Why don't you go visit these breeders, meet the dogs, decide which you like in person and wait for a puppy from them? 

I base my dog purchases off bloodlines more than breeders. Of course I want to purchase from a decent breeder but there are lots of good breeders, it's the dogs and bloodlines I study. After all you are buying a puppy.....


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

MilesNY said:


> Why don't you go visit these breeders, meet the dogs, decide which you like in person and wait for a puppy from them?
> 
> I base my dog purchases off bloodlines more than breeders. Of course I want to purchase from a decent breeder but there are lots of good breeders, it's the dogs and bloodlines I study. After all you are buying a puppy.....


I want a good breeder.


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## stmcfred (Aug 13, 2013)

If you were ready to get a Von Lotta puppy then apparently they met all your "standards" so the point isn't whether you can find a breeder you want. It's that your parents said No. Wait until you move out and get whatever dog from whatever breed you want. Grow up and mature before you purchase a puppy.


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## jrennie15 (May 14, 2014)

If your parents don't support you getting a pup, why do you keep looking? It sounds like a puppy might end up in a bit of a messy situation.


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## Lark (Jan 27, 2014)

Can we see the questionnaire?


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

You need to go meet local dogs and breeders and go from there. In your situation I think it would be best to go with a local breeder, where you and the breeder can meet in person. Whether you like it or not, your parents also must be involved in this. You live at home and it is up to them whether they want another dog in their house. They know you better than anyone and can best determine if getting a dog is in the best interest of everyone, most especially the dog. I imagine they are the ones forking out the money for the dog. You need their support and are more likely to get it if they can meet the dogs and breeders as well. So again, look locally.

From a breeder's perspective I'll be honest... someone who slaps me with a questionnaire, which probably includes a lot of questions that the person could have gotten answers to on their own based on my website and other information that is readily available with a simple Google search, is going to turn me off. I'm happy to answer questions, but I expect them to be somewhat specific and not generic information that the person could have gotten on his own. It is up to you to do your own research, not to expect others to do it for you or to be spoon fed information that you could have gotten yourself with a little bit of effort. Someone trying to guilt trip or pressure me into selling him a puppy by "reminding me how much I wanted one at his age" is going to be a huge turn off as well.

You have a very generic list of what you want and sound like you expect to get a super dog handmade to your specifications like a widget from a factory. You also want specific things in a breeder... things which may or may not have any bearing at all on the actual quality of the dogs. And you seem to expect to find that on the internet and message boards. You won't. Go meet dogs and breeders and see which dogs you are drawn to and which breeder you feel a connection with and go from there. Get off the computer and take some road trips.


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## clark77494 (Sep 5, 2014)

selzer said:


> If you want 100% healthy, clear of all genetic problems, and the rest, maybe you should check these out:
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?q=Ger...7Gom3yQTlh4CIBg&ved=0CEAQsAQ&biw=1024&bih=576


My GSD has Arthritis of the back legs, even knowing that I got Ginger from a German Shepherd Rescue. She is a wonderful dog! If I was looking for a wife that was 100% defect free I would still be looking! I have a wonderful Wife BTW.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

stmcfred said:


> If you were ready to get a Von Lotta puppy then apparently they met all your "standards" so the point isn't whether you can find a breeder you want. It's that your parents said No. Wait until you move out and get whatever dog from whatever breed you want. Grow up and mature before you purchase a puppy.


Nope that's not it.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Chris Wild said:


> You need to go meet local dogs and breeders and go from there. In your situation I think it would be best to go with a local breeder, where you and the breeder can meet in person. Whether you like it or not, your parents also must be involved in this. You live at home and it is up to them whether they want another dog in their house. They know you better than anyone and can best determine if getting a dog is in the best interest of everyone, most especially the dog. I imagine they are the ones forking out the money for the dog. You need their support and are more likely to get it if they can meet the dogs and breeders as well. So again, look locally.
> 
> From a breeder's perspective I'll be honest... someone who slaps me with a questionnaire, which probably includes a lot of questions that the person could have gotten answers to on their own based on my website and other information that is readily available with a simple Google search, is going to turn me off. I'm happy to answer questions, but I expect them to be somewhat specific and not generic information that the person could have gotten on his own. It is up to you to do your own research, not to expect others to do it for you or to be spoon fed information that you could have gotten yourself with a little bit of effort. Someone trying to guilt trip or pressure me into selling him a puppy by "reminding me how much I wanted one at his age" is going to be a huge turn off as well.
> 
> You have a very generic list of what you want and sound like you expect to get a super dog handmade to your specifications like a widget from a factory. You also want specific things in a breeder... things which may or may not have any bearing at all on the actual quality of the dogs. And you seem to expect to find that on the internet and message boards. You won't. Go meet dogs and breeders and see which dogs you are drawn to and which breeder you feel a connection with and go from there. Get off the computer and take some road trips.


If a breeder doesn't answer my Questionaire and shows nothing on the website that's a major red flag. On top of that there are no good ones in the Bay Area.


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

Lobobear44 said:


> If a breeder doesn't answer my Questionaire and shows nothing on the website that's a major red flag. On top of that there are no good ones in the Bay Area.


I can think of at least 3 good ones in the Bay Area off the top of my head.....

As for the first part, well, good luck in your breeder search. There are many good breeders with good dogs who aren't great at updating their website or who simply prefer someone pick up the phone and call, or schedule a visit, to discuss things rather than send out generic questionnaires. Be aware that your cold, calculating, lack of personal touch, and apparent desire for a neat and easy formula and made to order puppy and decrying "red flag" at many things that are nothing of the sort is going to turn off a lot of good breeders.


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## LoveEcho (Mar 4, 2011)

Lobobear44 said:


> If a breeder doesn't answer my Questionaire and shows nothing on the website that's a major red flag. On top of that there are no good ones in the Bay Area.


Most breeders aren't going to answer your questionnaire...

Why do you continuously post these topics and then keep asking the same questions, after people give you advice? People tell you EXACTLY what to do and you don't do it.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

How many litters are bred a year?
How many times is the same female used for breeding?
What's the price?
What did you mean it depends on the situation?
How long do your dogs live?
How quickly will the new dog bond with me?
Has any of your dogs ear never stood up?
Are they show or working?

Can we visit?
How big do the dogs get is lbs and cm and height?

How affectionate and loving is the pup? 
So is the pup cuddly?
What drives are your dogs? 


How healthy are the dogs, has there ever been health problems?
What are the temperament of dogs? 
At what age do you recommend neuter/spay?
Under any circumstances would people be allowed to bring the dogs back to you?
When do you give the vaccinations to pups? 
In what ways would you not give people a German shepherd? 
What kind of facility are the German shepherds exposed to?
What kind of environment are the German shepherds exposed to?
Are you a kennel or no kennels? Why?
If there are problems would you be there for your clients? 
what typical challenges or concerns do you hear from families once they have the puppy at home?
have any of your dogs been returned to you and if so, why?
have you refused to take any dogs back, and if so, why?
Do your dogs have slanted backs?
when should the dog be neutered or spayed?

Questionaire


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

LoveEcho said:


> Most breeders aren't going to answer your questionnaire...
> 
> Why do you continuously post these topics and then keep asking the same questions, after people give you advice? People tell you EXACTLY what to do and you don't do it.


Up to you to take advice or leave it. Some breeders did answer, those who didn't are red flags.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Chris Wild said:


> You need to go meet local dogs and breeders and go from there. In your situation I think it would be best to go with a local breeder, where you and the breeder can meet in person. Whether you like it or not, your parents also must be involved in this. You live at home and it is up to them whether they want another dog in their house. They know you better than anyone and can best determine if getting a dog is in the best interest of everyone, most especially the dog. I imagine they are the ones forking out the money for the dog. You need their support and are more likely to get it if they can meet the dogs and breeders as well. So again, look locally.
> 
> From a breeder's perspective I'll be honest... someone who slaps me with a questionnaire, which probably includes a lot of questions that the person could have gotten answers to on their own based on my website and other information that is readily available with a simple Google search, is going to turn me off. I'm happy to answer questions, but I expect them to be somewhat specific and not generic information that the person could have gotten on his own. It is up to you to do your own research, not to expect others to do it for you or to be spoon fed information that you could have gotten yourself with a little bit of effort. Someone trying to guilt trip or pressure me into selling him a puppy by "reminding me how much I wanted one at his age" is going to be a huge turn off as well.
> 
> You have a very generic list of what you want and sound like you expect to get a super dog handmade to your specifications like a widget from a factory. You also want specific things in a breeder... things which may or may not have any bearing at all on the actual quality of the dogs. And you seem to expect to find that on the internet and message boards. You won't. Go meet dogs and breeders and see which dogs you are drawn to and which breeder you feel a connection with and go from there. Get off the computer and take some road trips.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

Yup.... that questionnaire is going to cause a lot of breeders to just delete the email and not even respond. It shows a total lack of research on your part, gives the impression that you would be a major headache as an owner and one who appears to want a puppy that grows up to be perfect with no effort on your part, and also one who is potentially not committed due to the emphasis you put on whether or not the breeder will take the dog back... and some of the questions just make absolutely no sense at all. All of which adds up to making you a very unattractive prospective puppy owner.


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## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

ALOT of the questions I know would be answered thoroughly on most websites... Any questions that aren't Answered SHOULD you still be interested can be asked via phone call or in person. 

I can see why people are getting frustrated with your questions though, as you are continually asking the same ones despite getting answers and advice. You need to either take action and go get a dog, or wait until you have the confidence and maturity to accept your choices and the pup no matter what. Life is uncertain, NOTHING IS PERFECT (except God) and you are wasting people's time by repeatedly asking the same questions. 

Go visit a couple of breeders, then come back and post any questions or comments. Otherwise, I'm afraid you are going to alienate those people you want their help from... Just a suggestion....


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

Lobobear44 said:


> Up to you to take advice or leave it. Some breeders did answer, those who didn't are red flags.


I think you'll find that a good number of the best breeders out there are going to be "red flags" then. Personally, I think the ones who would put up with your screening process are going to be the ones who are a bit desperate to sell puppies... and there's likely a good reason they can't sell pups without feeling the need to jump through your ridiculous hoops. But carry on... clearly you are going to do what you're going to do and ignore any advice you are given by people with more experience in this area.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Lobobear44 said:


> How many litters are bred a year?
> How many times is the same female used for breeding?
> What's the price?
> What did you mean it depends on the situation?
> ...


  Oh my. Lobo, there are many very good breeders who would see this questionnaire and toss it in the trash. Some of the questions are reasonable, but many show a lack of understanding of the GSD and dog ownership written by someone who has spent far too much time on the internet. Most breeders are willing to help educate, but we also know when our time would be wasted.


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## N Smith (Aug 25, 2011)

Lobobear44 said:


> How many litters are bred a year?
> How many times is the same female used for breeding?
> What's the price?
> What did you mean it depends on the situation?
> ...


I'm sorry, I am just getting started in my breeding program, if I got the above questionnaire, I would tell you to come back when you were more educated about the German Shepherd Dog.

You ask twice about spay/neuter - what does it matter when the breeder recommends spaying/neutering? This is YOUR dog and you are the only one who can decide what is best for your situation. Its not a one size fits all question. When my puppy buyers asked me when I recommend neutering a dog, I told them how *I* operate (meaning I never spay/neuter without a medical reason to do so), but explained that just because that works for me, it may not work for them. I also explained that our super amazing, wonderful vet, recommends no earlier than 12 months, to allow growth plates to close, but that closer to 18 months is IN MY OPINION better for GSD growth rates.

I would NEVER attempt to guarantee adult weight and height on a puppy, and I would NEVER aim to breed my dogs to the size you specified. That is not a medium sized dog, nor is it within the standard.

Also, how in the heck can I know how long my dogs will live? So many factors in there LOL - A breeder can tell you at what age their dogs have passed away, but that doesn't necessarily apply to progeny?

"Do your dogs have slanted backs?" This question alone would have this questionnaire in the garbage.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> How many litters are bred a year?
> How many times is the same female used for breeding?
> What's the price?
> What did you mean it depends on the situation?
> ...


I know this is not the point at all. I understand that. But all I get from this post is that I just really really want to take a red pen and start marking. It's making me twitch.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

N Smith said:


> I'm sorry, I am just getting started in my breeding program, if I got the above questionnaire, I would tell you to come back when you were more educated about the German Shepherd Dog.
> 
> You ask twice about spay/neuter - what does it matter when the breeder recommends spaying/neutering? This is YOUR dog and you are the only one who can decide what is best for your situation. Its not a one size fits all question. When my puppy buyers asked me when I recommend neutering a dog, I told them how *I* operate (meaning I never spay/neuter without a medical reason to do so), but explained that just because that works for me, it may not work for them. I also explained that our super amazing, wonderful vet, recommends no earlier than 12 months, to allow growth plates to close, but that closer to 18 months is IN MY OPINION better for GSD growth rates.
> 
> ...


I got compliments from breeders yay. Many prospective buyers just say "I want a puppy" without educating themselves on breeders. Even von lotta filled it out, actually many of those breeders did, plus I'm young still learning.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I don't know why people continue to play along.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Some of the questions on yout list are silly.
The bonding question?
Silly- dogs bond in their own time
Are they show or working- 
Silly, do your research and learn about pedigrees
Cuddly, affectionate and loving questions ? 
Really?.
A few in between but seriously,
Do your research and bribg your best prepared self.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

I was just posting the exact same thing jax, only not quite so succinctly or politely, when my iPad suddenly self censored, lolol...

Why indeed?

Clearly, there are some "issues" here...


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

lhczth said:


> Oh my. Lobo, there are many very good breeders who would see this questionnaire and toss it in the trash. Some of the questions are reasonable, but many show a lack of understanding of the GSD and dog ownership written by someone who has spent far too much time on the internet. Most breeders are willing to help educate, but we also know when our time would be wasted.


I do best written instead of verbal.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

Jax08 said:


> I don't know why people continue to play along.


I know I'm feeding into it by even commenting above, I'll just acknowledge that now.

Anyway, I'm not even here all that much and I've noticed this seems to be something that the OP is really fixated on. What I would wonder is if when he matures a bit - it's my understanding that he's a teenager - and is in a better position to have a dog of his own and has educated himself on the breed, some of these breeders he's contacting now will remember him and not take him seriously. In short, I wonder if he's burning his bridges.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

katieliz said:


> I was just posting the exact same thing jax, only not quite so succinctly or politely, when my iPad suddenly self censored, lolol...
> 
> Why indeed?
> 
> Clearly, there are some "issues" here...


Some serious issues that go beyond just maturing.


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## Andaka (Jun 29, 2003)

What dog sports have you acquainted yourself with personally --not just on the internet?


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## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

OK... Done playing... Obviously previous posts of myself and many others with very good advice, stated kindly and succinctly is not being acknowledged, let alone taken... My lesson learned, not wasting anymore time...


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

lobo, lets be honest. you know there is a good chance that you will want to return the dog due to the challenges of raising a puppy at your age. contact a rescue and offer to foster a rescue. this will give you more an idea on the hardships of dog GSD ownership. a foster prolly won't be trained and will have different challenges as a puppy but will have challenges nonetheless. you can easily return the foster to the resuce. it's a jerk off move to return a puppy 4 months later 'cause it's too much work. it's wrong to the breeder'cause now they have to sell a 6 months old pup with no training. they will have to sell it at half price due to your ignorance. please don't think you might want to return a pup 'cause it might be too much work. if that's the case please don't get one. you have to commit or not...or get fishtank.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

your stipulation that the breeded has to take the pup back no matter what is a red flag to the breeder. breeders want to sell to who is committed. we don't take pups on 4 month test drives then decide if we want to keep it. that isn't how it works!


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

scarfish said:


> lobo, lets be honest. you know there is a good chance that you will want to return the dog due to the challenges of raising a puppy at your age. contact a rescue and offer to foster a rescue. this will give you more an idea on the hardships of dog GSD ownership. a foster prolly won't be trained and will have different challenges as a puppy but will have challenges nonetheless. you can easily return the foster to the resuce. it's a jerk off move to return a puppy 4 months later 'cause it's too much work. it's wrong to the breeder'cause now they have to sell a 6 months old pup with no training. they will have to sell it at half price due to your ignorance. please don't think you might want to return a pup 'cause it might be too much work. if that's the case please don't get one. you have to commit or not...or get fishtank.


You are quite ignorant yourself. Thanks for the judgemental comment. Von Lotta complimented me on my questions you know and agreed with a pup, without hesitation.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

scarfish said:


> *your stipulation that the breeded has to take the pup back no matter what is a red flag to the breeder.* breeders want to sell to who is committed. we don't take pups on 4 month test drives then decide if we want to keep it. that isn't how it works!



Actually, it is not a red flag. It's the only think I asked for. If something happens to me, take this dog back and place him appropriately. My breeder was very happy agreeing to that. They want the dogs brought back so they know what happened to them.


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## stmcfred (Aug 13, 2013)

How many breeders have you actually went and visited?


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

so what happens when getting a woman pregnant, ask god to take it back if the going gets rough?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

scarfish said:


> so what happens when getting a woman pregnant, ask god to take it back if the going gets rough?


A good breeder wants their dog back. It's why there is a first right of refusal clause in contracts. They want their dog back so when the going gets rough the dog isn't dumped in a kill shelter.

Wanting the dog back is NOT a reflection on the breeder.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

scarfish said:


> so what happens when getting a woman pregnant, ask god to take it back if the going gets rough?


My dog client taught me that's the first thing you look for in a breeder.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

Jax08 said:


> Actually, it is not a red flag. It's the only think I asked for. If something happens to me, take this dog back and place him appropriately. My breeder was very happy agreeing to that. They want the dogs brought back so they know what happened to them.


jax, you're not helping. the kid needs to commit. it's all or nothing. this is best for a pup. we don't need a pup being shipped back 4 months later then shipped out to a new owner. the pup will never be the ame as it would've being plced with the right person in the first place.

puppies are a pain. even with a wife helping, working seperate shifts, it was still hard the last 2 pups we raised. if there's a doubt in his head now, maybe he should try fostering first. i'm only thinking of the best for the pup.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

scarfish said:


> jax, you're not helping. the kid needs to commit. it's all or nothing. this is best for a pup. we don't need a pup being shipped back 4 months later then shipped out to a new owner. the pup will never be the ame as it would've being plced with the right person in the first place.
> 
> puppies are a pain. even with a wife helping, working seperate shifts, it was still hard the last 2 pups we raised. if there's a doubt in his head now, maybe he should try fostering first. i'm only thinking of the best for the pup.


When I get my puppy and raise him, you'll be sorry that you disrespected me. I won't sympathize with you.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> My dog client taught me that's the first thing you look for in a breeder.


if returning is a main concern maybe you should wait.

if i was a breeder and had one lastpup, 2 people wanted it. one with many pup experiences, much dog experience and sounded more than committed and another person that lived with his mom and didn't know if they could raise it. guess who i'm selling to.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I'm not helping? You think making things up about breeders that take their puppies back being a red flag, that is helping him?

The kid needs to not have a dog at all but it's not because he can't commit.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

Jax08 said:


> I'm not helping? You think making things up about breeders that take their puppies back being a red flag, that is helping him?
> 
> The kid needs to not have a dog at all but it's not because he can't commit.


there's many reasons he shouldn't have a dog. i just want him to think it through some more if the idea of not being able to handle raising a pup and returning it is strongly in his head.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

scarfish said:


> if returning is a main concern maybe you should wait.
> 
> if i was a breeder and had one lastpup, 2 people wanted it. one with many pup experiences, much dog experience and sounded more than committed and another person that lived with his mom and didn't know if they could raise it. guess who i'm selling to.


My main concern is the dogs well being. I don't like your attitude bud, your being blocked. If I was a breeder wouldn't sell you a pup because you aren't asking questions.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

lol


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

scarfish said:


> there's many reasons he shouldn't have a dog. i just want him to think it through some more if the idea of not being able to handle raising a pup and returning it is strongly in his head.


Agreed on that. If your first thought is on returning hte puppy, and not for the primary welfare of the puppy, then you shouldn't have one. 

It's really the only thing I asked of my breeder. However, it was because my husband is not a dog person, he thinks they are couch ornaments, and having a working line dog left to him is going to be a disaster for the dog. 

So the OP needs to think about why he is asking this question.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

i thought you were a dude this whole time.


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## jrennie15 (May 14, 2014)

Jax08 said:


> I'm not helping? You think making things up about breeders that take their puppies back being a red flag, that is helping him?
> 
> The kid needs to not have a dog at all but it's not because he can't commit.



I agree with you Jax, I also look at this when speaking with breeders. Not because I have plans on giving a puppy back or that I'm not committed but it demonstrates to me that the breeder cares and has an interest in their puppies and I know that if something were to happen to me that my puppy would be looked after and placed in a good home again.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

scarfish said:


> i thought you were a dude this whole time.


Who says I'm not?


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

A lot of good breeders would prefer you NOT neuter, particularly a male, and be able to manage the dog properly. 

My own actually said the hip warranty was null and void if the dog was neutered before the age of 2.

There are a lot of contradictions in your requirements. Physique sounds like working line but size does not. Cuddly? well not really a breed thing. Some are. Medium/Low drive..you might find one in those lines but it will be harder........the questions? Odd.


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## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

(can't believe I'm engaging again...) Lobobear, why is it that the only person who you respond to is in defense of yourself and a puppy being returned.. You don't respond to all the other commentary and answer their questions or do what is suggested.... Or even say you will do what is suggested... This is why you are getting negative posts from people. You aren't doing what is suggested but keep asking the same questions over and over... You are setting yourself up continually for negative responses. Pretty soon people will just stop engaging with you... 

I know you want a dog, but you HAVE to do some work and show us that you have heard the comments, advice and used it. Then you will find people willingly help you out...


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> When I get my puppy and raise him, you'll be sorry that you disrespected me. I won't sympathize with you.


Is anyone else picturing this being said in a very high squeaky voice? Like Alpha from the movie Up?

...just me?


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

Jax08 said:


> Who says I'm not?


nobody said you were either way or another but jax is a mans name. i just always thought you were a dude. doesn't really make a difference. your user name and avatar just kinda yells male to me. sorry i messed up. i blew it!

not to hijack, OP put me on ignore. i tried to be as nise as possible to him. i really don't think he needs a puppy. all his previous threads and posts have told us all why. i tried to be nice to him and offer a foster alternative. for the sake of a puppy somebody please knock some sense into him. he should wait 'till he's done living with his mom, found a girl and lives on his own.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

So my female dog's name and a picture of a puppy imply a male person? How utterly interesting.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

WateryTart said:


> Is anyone else picturing this being said in a very high squeaky voice? Like Alpha from the movie Up?
> 
> ...just me?


:rofl:


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Lobobear44 said:


> . On top of that there are no good ones in the Bay Area.


If only you knew........ You don't know enough about selecting a GSD to really tell a good one from a bad one..... There are some very nice GSDs being bred in the bay area but the people doing the breeding won't meet your criteria because they behave more like Europeans and don't give the warranties that Americans have come to expect.

The suggestion to get out to do events in the area and MEET flesh and blood people with their dogs is still valid. How many GSD events and what kind have you been to in the past year? How many local breeders have you actually visited?


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## stmcfred (Aug 13, 2013)

You never answered my question LoboBear44. How many breeders have you actually wen out and visited?? 

I've only been on this board since last august and every time you post its always the same questions with the same response. 

If you haven't visited any why not? If it's because your parents won't take you go get a license (aren't you 19 or something?) and take yourself!


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> My main concern is the dogs well being. I don't like your attitude bud, your being blocked. If I was a breeder wouldn't sell you a pup because you aren't asking questions.




Scar has to very happy well cared for GSD's
I am sure he has a relationship with the breeders.

You cant honestly say you expect a breeder to take you seriously when you do nothing but hound them on taking there pup back.


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## d4lilbitz (Dec 30, 2013)

Chris Wild said:


> Yup.... that questionnaire is going to cause a lot of breeders to just delete the email and not even respond. It shows a total lack of research on your part, gives the impression that you would be a major headache as an owner and one who appears to want a puppy that grows up to be perfect with no effort on your part, and also one who is potentially not committed due to the emphasis you put on whether or not the breeder will take the dog back... and some of the questions just make absolutely no sense at all. All of which adds up to making you a very unattractive prospective puppy owner.


 
Exactly...I'm not even a breeder. I don't want to waste my time, I can only imagine what a breeder goes through when looking at this. Lobo...you are not ready for a dog. You keep posting the same thing over and over and over and over and over...See how annoying that is. I feel like your going in circles never getting to a point with your search. People have been trying to help you, you ignore them, wait a couple days, then repost a similar question just worded differently. Most breeders under each dog's profile describe the dog's personality, health and titles, what drives they have/pass on to their progeny, etc. Not to mention most breeders tell you about themselves, how the dogs are housed and what their goals are. You're extremely indecisive in this process. Quit wasting everyone's time, especially the breeders if you're going to continue to go down this path.


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## alexg (Mar 22, 2013)

Hard to resist and I've tried ...

YOU ARE A HUGE RED FLAG!


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

The only type of breeder who would sell you a puppy would be one who spells Shepherd "Shepard."


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## ShenzisMom (Apr 27, 2010)

Everyone has a 'checklist' when looking for a dog or puppy however most look at the website to look for the answers. You show a remarkable lack of manners and respect by your questionnaire. The only questions I ask breeders are info not commonly found on websites, like instances of bloat in a particular line, what the goal of the breeding is, contract spécifications(if not found on site) and finally, if THEY have a questionnaire I can fill out to see if we are a match, do you like my situation enough to trust me with a puppy that represents a lot of time and effort you put into the program.
being as it is, due to my health issues a gsd breeder would laugh in my face if I put in an application. So do yourself a favour a fix your attitude because that I something you can change. I cant change the reason reputable breeders wouldnt consider me, YOU CAN. I dont want to be mean but you need a wake up call


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## Kaimeju (Feb 2, 2013)

As someone who works in education, I think the OP may have a learning disability and probably ADD as well. This may explain the content of some of the posts.

To Lobo, you need to get your parents on board with having a dog first. Researching breeders is great, but the GSD you described could be found in rescue. I don't think your needs are specific enough or your knowledge extensive enough to warrant going to a breeder right now. In the future, maybe. Keep learning and try to get firsthand experience.

Get your parents on board first. I cannot stress this enough. Even if you disagree with them on some things, for the dog's sake your family needs to agree on his care.


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## Katey (Aug 11, 2010)

What do you think you'll gain from having a GSD that you can't gain from your doodle? Why don't you focus on the dog you already have? Take classes, learn from others, get some exposure to dog sports, and gain some maturity, experience, and independence before looking into a second dog.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Why do you keep dismissing what I say? Just because you people are adults and I'm a 19-year-old you think you can always be right and I'm always wrong. I'm tired of repeating myself. I don't give a care in the world what you say because you people are disrespecting me.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I think people here are tired of repeating 'themselves' as well. 

I also think your on your own when it comes to getting a dog.


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## DobbyDad (Jan 28, 2014)

Your 19? I would have guessed a lot younger. It seems you still want to be treated as a child. At 19 your an adult.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm way more mature than all of you stronger too.


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## DTS (Oct 19, 2010)

1- don't ask if the dogs are "cuddly". A 4 year old would ask that. And we are all adults here. A dog is what you make it. Yes, genetics play a role, but it's about what you put into them. 

2- no one can promise you 100% healthy for life dog. Health is a crap shoot. You can have parents who are health tested to the nine's and issues may still arise. It happens. 

3- yes, having the breeder there for you is important. But once you receive the pup, you're on your own. It's yours, you have to deal with things that arise. 

4- bonding. Each pup is an individual and will do things their own way. Don't smother the pup. No one likes that, why would a dog. If you provide adequate support, direction, and leadership the pup will love you. How is the breeder supposed to know how the dog will bond to you? They can't read the dog's mind of how it feels abut you. 

5- every good breeder has a contract. That will give you everything you need to know. Every contract I've read is pretty self explanatory. If you can't understand it, and have to ask a question about every single guideline they have, you have no business owning a dog. 

6- if you can't do simple research on your own, like an adult, because you're either too lazy or just don't want to, you have no business owning this breed. If you can't listen to people, you can't listen to a trainer, if you don't get a trainer, you aren't going to have a great dog. Because you won't be able to train this dog on your own due to he fact of you won't be able to make a decision of what training method to use. Therefore, you dog will not be obedient and will end up being returned because he isn't bonded with you because he doesn't listen.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> I'm way more mature than all of you stronger too.


I disagree.

I've seen a lot of people take the time to be kind and generously offer advice to you on multiple threads. I've observed you posting erratically and in ways that don't add up (e.g., the puppy you were having shipped to you, only to apparently change your mind just days before). I've observed you lashing out at the people who have tried to help you.

Those behaviors aren't exactly markers of maturity. I wish you well, but I think maybe some help and other (healthier) outlets might benefit you.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> If a breeder doesn't answer my Questionaire and shows nothing on the website that's a major red flag. On top of that there are no good ones in the Bay Area.


I'm in the Bay Area too, what did you see that made you think that?


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## ShenzisMom (Apr 27, 2010)

Im 25...not that far off. When I originally joined these forums at 18 I was called on my... innocence. Check out my first posts. these forums do not coddle on the fact you are young. Pull up your bootstraps, you have a lot to learn grasshopper


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## Katey (Aug 11, 2010)

I didn't mean to be dismissive or repetitive. I didn't see the answers to my questions elsewhere in the thread, and I was (and still am) genuinely curious. 

There are a variety of ages and experiences on this board, so I wouldn't necessarily say age is the primary factor in the responses you receive. I'm not that many years older than you. I actually found the site when I was nineteen and joined later on, and I learned a lot just from following along and using the search function for more specific questions. I think you'd be surprised how much you can learn just from reading with an open mind, and accepting advice from the many experienced members. I know I still have a lot to learn. 

My parents weren't interested in dogs, and we didn't have pets growing up, so I can relate to being impatient for the opportunity to have a dog. The difference is, you actually DO already have a dog, so I wanted to understand why you so urgently want to add a second when you have such a great opportunity to learn and grow with your current dog. 

If your parents don't want a GSD right now, it is not fair for you to continue to push the issue while you are living in their house. I waited until I moved out on my own (and had a good deal of stability and financial security) before I contacted and visited breeders. Yes, it took time, but I spent that time focusing on my education and learning more about the breed, and I wouldn't have it any other way.


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## kburrow11 (Jan 31, 2014)

Lobobear44 said:


> Why do you keep dismissing what I say? Just because you people are adults and I'm a 19-year-old you think you can always be right and I'm always wrong. I'm tired of repeating myself. I don't give a care in the world what you say because you people are disrespecting me.


Look, listen to these people. I just turned 21, was 20 when I got Vida. I've been called out before on this forums due to my naivety and inexperience. But guess what? Because I've taken the advice of the experienced owners and breeders on this forum, I've been told by my vet that she's never seen a healthier puppy, nor a better behaved/trained 8 month old. All because I listened to the experience of others. Take a step back, get rid of your ego, and listen for once in your life.


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## glowingtoadfly (Feb 28, 2014)

I can't say, over the internet, whether or not Lobo should get a dog. In his favor, he has walked dogs, German Shepherds, for others, and done well with it, if he is a bit overenthusiastic about the care of one. He has also worked with a rescue. I think this is a case of overthinking things over the internet, anxiety, mixed with poor grammar making him seem younger than he is. I'm sure that a puppy or dog could help him grow up a bit.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Lobo did you question your doodles breeder?


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> I'm way more mature than all of you stronger too.



Thats over the top.


Everyone answers your questions lobo. Everyone.


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## glowingtoadfly (Feb 28, 2014)

I'm sure a nice dog will be on death row near you soon, or already is. It's California...


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

glowingtoadfly said:


> I can't say, over the internet, whether or not Lobo should get a dog. In his favor, he has walked dogs, German Shepherds, for others, and done well with it, if he is a bit overenthusiastic about the care of one. He has also worked with a rescue. I think this is a case of overthinking things over the internet, anxiety, mixed with poor grammar making him seem younger than he is. I'm sure that a puppy or dog could help him grow up a bit.




Yes but walking A gs is alot different then owning one, 
Heck. If i did not have a firm grip on my situation shiggs would be waltzing around snacking on little dogs and ty would have long eaten jackson by now lol

I think the best dog for lobo is the "dope doodle" at the moment, a nice dog will cure alot of anxiety


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## glowingtoadfly (Feb 28, 2014)

Yeah, I suppose without our trainer Skadi would still be biting me. It's a tough call.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

WateryTart said:


> I disagree.
> 
> I've seen a lot of people take the time to be kind and generously offer advice to you on multiple threads. I've observed you posting erratically and in ways that don't add up (e.g., the puppy you were having shipped to you, only to apparently change your mind just days before). I've observed you lashing out at the people who have tried to help you.
> 
> Those behaviors aren't exactly markers of maturity. I wish you well, but I think maybe some help and other (healthier) outlets might benefit you.


Really? I am the one standing up for myself, anyone who words don't match me at all is disrespect. If anyone talks me down I put them in their place. However, if you like Let's agree to disagree, see you are also dismissing me. Hypocritically, all of you are lashing out at me just because of a Questionaire, just because my ideas are different and throws you all off. All of you put me down with "he is mental", "he shouldn't have a dog". That's advice? Thank you for the suggestions, doesn't mean I listen doesn't mean I'll agree and take it in. My parents, clients, even responsible breeders, and I have no clue what you are talking about. Plus my parents think all of you have issues, my parents agreed to pay for half and I pay for half. My parents are letting me get a GS. From there, I will make my commitment quality stronger because as of now it's a weakness. Life is all about being stronger or getting stronger, not staying weak because life is miserable full of regrets that way. 

Where I get my dog I am very careful because you don't know nor does the breeder know who they are dealing with. I had a nice long chat with a breeder who truly understood me. It's great to ask questions breeders should want that. If breeders don't answer my questions whether they are on their website or not, that's a red flag. We chatted about my Questionnaire because there has never been a rule stating "a prospective buyer can't have a questionnaire because that's a red flag". It is none of your business what, where, how, who, when, I get my dog. 

I am optimistic, life is so incredibly amazing anything can happen. I am strong because I always keep walking, also have my own motto "I don't go back on my word". I do what I daydream and make it a reality. I'm a black belt, have a Labradoodle, did drama an epic last performance, have no public speaking fears, have my own dog walking business, go for day hikes, volunteer at rescue organizations, the SPCA, made friends, fight my problems, understand where anxiety comes from, opened to learn, drive, going to get a GSD, becoming a writer for my life story and fantasy, training in public speaking classes, am an Animal Rights Activists belong to an organization, speak out against specism, befriended wolves, bulls, owls, Canadian Geese, cats, a feral cat, chickens, and dogs. I have no fear of anything what's so ever. In order to follow your dreams, goals, ambitions you must have confidence to achieve them. 

My dreams are:

World Peace for humans and animals
Speak in front of thousands of people like MLK did makes me smile
Be seen in the world because I feel my existence is ignored
Get a GSD
Train all my GSDs by myself with my own creative ideas
Always be creative 
Solve all my own life problems
Listen to music the rest of my life
Hike and backpack in all places on the planet
Go on all the difficult hikes and backpack in North America with my GSD
Become a writer for my life story and fantasy 
Travel to Africa, Japan, Europe, Alaska
Live life everyday to the fullest
Have a meaningful life
Become stronger everyday until I die
Learn everyday until I die
Have my own ideas instead of scientific facts
Help people without hesitation
Save animals without hesitation
Go to anime conventions
Work out everyday to gain a 6 pack
Meet African animals in person
Get married have children and teach them importance of life and how to become strong
Explore all areas of hiking with my dog, Dante, and people friends
Have a forever best friendship with a person
Become a stronger martial artists

Dreams accomplished:
Overcame my learning challenges
Have close bonds with people at HS
Have my own dog walking business 
A black belt
Befriended wolves, and bulls
Joined an animal rights group
Spoken at animal rights actions with "we have a dream"
Became a strong person
Walk German shepherds (working lines) 
Won a Motherlode competition with teamwork meaning with a group of friends
Gone to Costa Rica to help poor people in a community build something
Going to intern at an animal sanctuary for two months than another one where I can take my GS pup with me  
Help animals 
Volunteer at the SPCA and rescue organizations 
My favorite anime ended
A stronger martial artist


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

misslesleedavis1 said:


> Lobo did you question your doodles breeder?


Back then I was uneducated, so nope. However, if I knew as much as I did back than yes I would've asked questions. Besides, the breeder never replied back to see how my dog is doing, even posted on FB on her page, and I do not want that again.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

kburrow11 said:


> Look, listen to these people. I just turned 21, was 20 when I got Vida. I've been called out before on this forums due to my naivety and inexperience. But guess what? Because I've taken the advice of the experienced owners and breeders on this forum, I've been told by my vet that she's never seen a healthier puppy, nor a better behaved/trained 8 month old. All because I listened to the experience of others. Take a step back, get rid of your ego, and listen for once in your life.


That's great for you, kind of weird though you don't create your own ideas.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> WateryTart said:
> 
> 
> > I disagree.
> ...


Okay.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Katey said:


> I didn't mean to be dismissive or repetitive. I didn't see the answers to my questions elsewhere in the thread, and I was (and still am) genuinely curious.
> 
> There are a variety of ages and experiences on this board, so I wouldn't necessarily say age is the primary factor in the responses you receive. I'm not that many years older than you. I actually found the site when I was nineteen and joined later on, and I learned a lot just from following along and using the search function for more specific questions. I think you'd be surprised how much you can learn just from reading with an open mind, and accepting advice from the many experienced members. I know I still have a lot to learn.
> 
> ...


My parents said I can have another dog now. I'm not doing college next semester too busy with AR stuff and a new dog. Plus my dog is in my room as we speak, to add I train him, hike him, drive him places.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

glowingtoadfly said:


> I can't say, over the internet, whether or not Lobo should get a dog. In his favor, he has walked dogs, German Shepherds, for others, and done well with it, if he is a bit overenthusiastic about the care of one. He has also worked with a rescue. I think this is a case of overthinking things over the internet, anxiety, mixed with poor grammar making him seem younger than he is. I'm sure that a puppy or dog could help him grow up a bit.


I take an English class in college, my teacher actually acknowledge if I was the person today two months ago than my grades would be higher. Yes I know a GSD pup or dog can help me grow better. I agree with what you said above.


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## Galathiel (Nov 30, 2012)

If you don't like what people say when you post, then why do you continue to post? I guess I find that a little .. unusual. Of course, I could be misreading what you're TRYING to say since many of your sentences are disjointed and lack punctuation. You might think you're 'putting people in their place', but you aren't really, since your syntax is so very confusing.

Do what you want to do .. you don't need our permission. I don't know why you keep trotting out the same posts over and over.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

Here's a suggestion, and I'm not saying this to be mean/disrespectful or negative. 

The majority of your postings here end up like this. My suggestion, stop asking others for recommendations. Stop asking for opinions when you end up not liking the answers. 

If you want a dog make a decision and be done with it.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

Galathiel said:


> If you don't like what people say when you post, then why do you continue to post? I guess I find that a little .. unusual. Of course, I could be misreading what you're TRYING to say since many of your sentences are disjointed and lack punctuation. You might think you're 'putting people in their place', but you aren't really, since your syntax is so very confusing.
> 
> Do what you want to do .. you don't need our permission. I don't know why you keep trotting out the same posts over and over.


I'm putting people in their places, which means standing up for myself.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

sigh. is anybody familiar with the old song, "too much time on my hands". spend time giving advice to someone who will/can benefit. long history here. better not to continue to encourage maybe??? just a thought.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

You are not putting anyone in their place lobo.
That's not a healthy way to think.


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## tottie86 (Aug 23, 2013)

Lobo, sometimes the not so perfect dog turns out to be the perfect dog.


Personally lobo I think you are over thinking picker a puppy/breeder way to much. Not one single breeder is going to meet your standards 100 percent. You find one that 99 percent meets your needs and stick to that one.


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## Katey (Aug 11, 2010)

Lobo, if you think you know better than everyone else here, why do you bother posting at all?


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

^^^because it gets attention^^^ and as long as it does it will continue.


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## ugavet2012 (Apr 15, 2010)

katieliz said:


> ^^^because it gets attention^^^ and as long as it does it will continue.


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

So that I'm noticed.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Lobobear44 said:


> So that I'm noticed.


Its been 11 pages of the same breeder feedback now.
Post any more and it will most likely be the same feedback.


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## misslesleedavis1 (Dec 5, 2013)

Plus as someone pointed out to me,
Look who has responded - well known breeders,


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

not good to "get noticed" for all the wrong reasons. that's all.


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

katieliz said:


> not good to "get noticed" for all the wrong reasons. that's all.


save your breath. we all have tried to talk sense into the kid in an attempt to help. he doesn't listen. he does things lobo's way! all we know for sure is an innocent pup is going to have a tramtic beginning at life 'cause a 19 year old can't just get a fishtank.


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

scarfish said:


> save your breath. we all have tried to talk sense into the kid in an attempt to help. he doesn't listen. he does things lobo's way! all we know for sure is an innocent pup is going to have a tramtic beginning at life 'cause a 19 year old can't just get a fishtank.


This is good advice? You are not listening yourself, you are wrong my pup will be happy. You got my word on that.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

you just noticin' that scarfish, I'm the one who's sayin'...oh, never mind. carry on...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

l can see both sides. I think we want to see a breeder who will take a pup back at any time during their life and for any reason, because it indicates that the breeder cares deeply about each pup and wants the best for them.

A breeder expressing to a buyer that they will take the dog back at any time, gives us a nice, fuzzy, warn feeling.

A buyer who insists that a breeder tell him that they will take any dog back, would make me wonder. Is this someone who is seriously expecting to be done with the dog within a few months, or is this someone who has read way too much on the internet.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

I have a very nice antique porcelain gsd that I will sell you for a lot less than $2k. He is from very reputable lines. And he needs very little care other than occasional dusting. I think he is just what you are looking for!


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

selzer said:


> l can see both sides. I think we want to see a breeder who will take a pup back at any time during their life and for any reason, because it indicates that the breeder cares deeply about each pup and wants the best for them.
> 
> A breeder expressing to a buyer that they will take the dog back at any time, gives us a nice, fuzzy, warn feeling.
> 
> A buyer who insists that a breeder tell him that they will take any dog back, would make me wonder. Is this someone who is seriously expecting to be done with the dog within a few months, or is this someone who has read way too much on the internet.


No I wouldn't give the dog back unless something happened to me. Anyways, that's the first clue so they aren't responsible for dogs put into shelters or rescues.


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## Pax8 (Apr 8, 2014)

BowWowMeow said:


> I have a very nice antique porcelain gsd that I will sell you for a lot less than $2k. He is from very reputable lines. And he needs very little care other than occasional dusting. I think he is just what you are looking for!


:rofl:


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

*OK, guys. Enough with the sarcasm. *

*ADMIN*


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

BowWowMeow said:


> I have a very nice antique porcelain gsd that I will sell you for a lot less than $2k. He is from very reputable lines. And he needs very little care other than occasional dusting. I think he is just what you are looking for!


Got a problem miserable life?


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## Lobobear44 (Jan 28, 2013)

lhczth said:


> *OK, guys. Enough with the sarcasm. *
> 
> *ADMIN*


You can lock the thread now


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## tottie86 (Aug 23, 2013)

Lobo I sent you a pm


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## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

no, lolo. take this seriously. nobody is out to get you. everybody just wants the best for dogs in general. dogs are not a rolls royce, you can't get them from the factory with every custom option pre planned. like i said before, get a fishtank.


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## Pax8 (Apr 8, 2014)

What I basically don't understand is why you refuse to listen to the advice of those who offer it. There are many many people on here with years of blood, sweat, and tears under their collars from working with the type of dog you want. People who have experience with them as companions, as family members, as diligent sport competitors, unbreakable partners in K9 and SAR work. Why wouldn't you want to listen and absorb their feedback instead of asking the same things over and over and asserting that you are already above them all. You may have some experience, but the great thing about this board is that there are an infinite amount of years of experience gathered here, to the point that I doubt anyone, no matter their experience level, leaves without learning at least one thing.

I know you feel people are attacking you because you're young, but that is simply not true. I was in a similar situation when I first wanted my own GSD. I was in college and mainly living at my parents' house. After reading through this forum for months and learning from the experiences and advice for others, I analyzed my situation and was brutally honest with myself about whether it was the right time for me, and it was not. So as hard as it was, I waited for three years before getting my dog. And the entire time I was waiting, I was researching, reading, and taking advice - not only advice that I agreed with, but advice that I didn't agree with. In fact, the advice you don't agree with can be the most important because it makes you analyze what it is about it that makes you oppose it and makes you truly think about your own views and why they are logically better to you. 

It also seems odd that you wouldn't want to take as much advice as possible. You say you want to be a trainer. And you compare your idea of training to being like Galileo, being a person who comes up with things no one has thought of before. Well, all intellectual advancements are made with an understanding of other's views. Galileo made his great discovery because he spent years studying mathematics, physics, the arts, astrology, religion, and many other subjects. In fact, his views about the heliocentric theory was based on the arguments from the Augustinian's interpretation of the Bible. Why reject all previous knowledge when it is so important to understand it in order to progress? If you have an open mind and you put effort into listening to everyone's views and opinions, you really understand at a base level what everyone feels about a subject now, such as dog training, you give yourself keys to advance the study. It's counterproductive to block everyone out just because you don't agree with them.

I hope you take a chance to step back and analyze yourself and your situation. To really make logical judgments about not only yourself and your situation, but what others have said about it. No matter how nasty, there is a motivation behind the comment, one that should be addressed and analyzed. You just need to rise above the impulse to defend yourself and every turn and instead discuss comments with calm intelligence and logic. UNDERSTAND, TRANSFORM, CREATE. That has been the process for the entirety of human evolution. Without understanding, you can never progress anywhere.


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