# Dog Park Fight



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

Yesterday the whole family was out for a walk at the park(The Judge,my wife,9 year old son,6 year old daughter, and myself). A bull terrior did not care us and lunged at us twice still on the owners lease. Third time near the kids and The Judge went into protective mode. Long story short my dog has a bloody ear tip and the other dog has some punctures on her hide quaters. The Judge's ear has been going up and down since yesterday. Hope nothing serious happened to damage it forever.


----------



## APBTLove (Feb 23, 2009)

How did your dog get on theirs if it was leashed with it's owners? Your dog was off leash, I'm guessing?


----------



## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

And another example of why you don't bring your dogs to dog parks.


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Lucy Dog said:


> *And another example of why you don't bring your dogs to dog parks*.


I take my dog to the dog park at least once a week. He has been going there since he was 6 months old, he is 16 months old now and we have never had a problem. You have to pay very close attention and watch every dogs body language, you have to be able to sense when something doesn't look or feel right.


----------



## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

LaRen616 said:


> I take my dog to the dog park at least once a week. He has been going there since he was 6 months old, he is 16 months old now and we have never had a problem. You have to pay very close attention and watch every dogs body language, you have to be able to sense when something doesn't look or feel right.


You're right, you do have to keep a very close eye on things at the park. Problem is, not all people follow that rule. A fight can break out in seconds and your dog can end up with injuries like the OP's dog and/or fear issues after just one attack or fight. 

Dog parks can be good if the right people and dogs are there, but that just isn't always the case. You can't control who comes in and out of there, so it's really a gamble.


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

The women could not hold her dog back and her husband was pushing a stroller. The dog made her run about 25ft while her husband was yelling for the dog.This all happened with in 4ft of me and my family. My first thought was to get my son out of the way because Judge was between us for the walk. The Judge heals very very well. Plus we always have dogs bark at him but never thought anything like this would happen. Luckly we always keep this 18" leash on his side just in case we run across somebody does not like dogs and wants to do some sniffing.


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

I would have left the second they started having problems. 

That is why I barely let mine interact with other dogs. Indra sometimes has playdates with dogs that are very well behaved and not a threat and so had Yukon but my bitch is only allowed around my dogs and only mine. 

I only go to the dog park when nobody else is there. As soon as somebody else is coming in I leave because I don't trust people anymore. Too much has happened already and I don't need three dog aggressive dogs. One is enough already. 


Another thing I wanted to add and that is nothing against you. But most dog parks have a policy and kids, especially young kids should not be allowed in dog parks. I've seen dogs jumping into strollers and the mom got livid. Well.. than don't bring your baby into a dog park. You are ASKING for it!

Another parent brought her two year old and she didn't care what the boy was doing. He got run over by the dogs. I was literally yelling at her to get that kid out before something worse happens.

It is NOT a playground! 

If dogs are not allowed on playgrounds than young kids shouldn't be allowed in a dog park. Especially since you never know the other dogs. 

And I hate it when there are more kids in the dog park than dogs. You can't even let your dogs run free when there are so many kids around because you always have to watch what is going on and that is another reason why I only go there when nothing is going on.


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

I still don't understand if this was at an off leash dog park or you were walking along. You made it sound BOTH ways. 

Either way, I see a lot wrong with this. If you saw such a trainwreck entering the park (assuming this was a park), you should have left, or picked up The Judge and leave. If you were walking along and this was coming towards you, you should have done the same thing. Walked away or if you had to, pick him up and walk away. 

If this was an off leash dog park, well then my next two wrong points- puppies shouldn't be there, and neither should kids. Judging from your avatar, Judge is still young, no?

I'm sorry this happened to you, but it's no more their fault than it is yours. It's a risk you take when you go to a dog park.


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

LaRen616 said:


> I take my dog to the dog park at least once a week. He has been going there since he was 6 months old, he is 16 months old now and we have never had a problem. You have to pay very close attention and watch every dogs body language, you have to be able to sense when something doesn't look or feel right.


We take Mac to the dog park. Its wonderful watching him play with dogs and run freely off leash. He runs from the larger dogs but chases after the little dogs. Eventhough there is a separate section for small breeds, people will bring tiny dogs in the large breed section. I'm always worried that Mac will play too rough so I have to watch him closely and stay close. I think its interesting that Mac only wants to play with dogs smaller than him...


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

The Judge said:


> The women could not hold her dog back and her husband was pushing a stroller. The dog made her run about 25ft while her husband was yelling for the dog.This all happened with in 4ft of me and my family. My first thought was to get my son out of the way because Judge was between us for the walk. The Judge heals very very well. Plus we always have dogs bark at him but never thought anything like this would happen. Luckly we always keep this 18" leash on his side just in case we run across somebody does not like dogs and wants to do some sniffing.


I am not sure I think its a good idea to bring a baby stroller to a dog park. Mac was chasing a dog and ran past a toddler. The little boy fell down and I panicked. The father laughed and said it was ok...the kid wasn't crying. It seems kinda risky to bring babies to a dog park. What do others think?


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Wow, you had your kid they had a baby and stroller, dogs everywhere. Owners who cannot manage their dog, even on lead???

This is EXACTLY why in those training threads supporting prong collars with the argument about a 110 pound woman with a 90 pound dog, blah blah blah. 

If you cannot control the dog without a training collar, then you should not own the dog.

Ok, fine maybe they control the dog just fine on walks, etc. But taking kids and hubby and baby and stroller and dog or dogs to a dog park is to me kind of a recipe for disaster. 

Maybe some of our dogs do fine in such circumstances, dogs that have been brought since they were puppies. But maybe a dog who has kids to play with does not need a dog park. Maybe a family with a baby in a stroller does not have the time to spend hours and hours with the dog conditioning them to dog-park etiquette. 

Oh I don't know as I have no children. But I would take the children to kid parks without the dog, and the dog to a dog park if I absolutely thought it essential without the kids. 

There is just so much craziness at a dog park, bringing babies in strollers and little kids just does not sound like the thing to do.


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

I respect everyone's opinions...but personally I think its cool to have kids at the dog park. I love that Mac is being socialized with lots of different kids. I'm just not sure toddlers and babies should be there.


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

Mac's Mom said:


> I am not sure I think its a good idea to bring a baby stroller to a dog park. Mac was chasing a dog and ran past a toddler. The little boy fell down and I panicked. The father laughed and said it was ok...the kid wasn't crying. It seems kinda risky to bring babies to a dog park. What do others think?


Way to risky in my book. If something happens it's always the dogs & dogs owner fault. 

Some people just don't have common sense. Like I said earlier I've seen dogs jumping into strollers but the mom didn't learn from it and brought the baby back the next day. 

I went to the dog park almost every day and stopped when one of my dogs got bit and ever since Zenzy became dog reactive/aggressive. 

There are other ways to let the dogs run and thank god I don't need a dog park for that.


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

It a dog friendly park. our town bought a old golf course. Lots of cart paths and open feilds.We walk this park everyday for atleast an hour. Many freinds and many dogs. Everything but motorized vehicles.There are brooks and ponds. We left right away to clean his wound. I cant imagine anybody moving any faster than I did to control what was happening. I am sorry but I cant think of anything I did wrong besides forseeing the future. We went to day for the dog and kids to play in the brook. Their is a pic in my albaum from easter of the kids in the water with The Judge that shows how long we have been doing this.The Judge is 13 months old. We have eeven had picnics with neighbors. I know now it sounds like alot can go wrong but this is the first problem I have heard of and the first time the other dog was there. Today he played with a goodendoodle,golden ,husky and st Bernard .NOT ONE ISSUE but met some great people!!!!!!!


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

The Judge said:


> It a dog friendly park. I town but a old golf course. Lots of cart paths and open feilds.We walk this park everyday for atleast an hour. Many freinds and many dogs. Everything but motorized vehicles.There are brooks and ponds. We left right away to clean his wound. I cant imagine anybody moving any faster than I did to control what was happening. I am sorry but I cant think of anything I did wrong besides forseeing the future. We went to day for the dog and kids to play in the brook. Their is a pic in my albaum from easter of the kids in the water with The Judge that shows how long we have been doing this.


I'm glad you didn't stop going because of the incident which must have been so horrible...I'm sorry your family especially The Judge had to go through that. Your park sounds awesome. Ours doesn't have water which Mac loves.


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

We had to go today after reading an earlier post of the dog being scared. He did just fine. Thanks and I really get everybodys concerns. The people at the park are great and I have learned alot from diff. folks.


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

I know you can never trust an animal 100 % but The Judge dos not miss any midget football practices with my son unless it rains. After practice the boys always beg for him to play on the field with them. They take about four footballs and play a game called JUDGEY IN THE MIDDLE. He always plays very careful and let me tell you 9 year old boys sqeek more than my 6 year old daughter!!!!!lol I really think he thinks he is one of the boys. The only time I seen a parent upset is when one kid shared his moms water bottle.


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Mac's Mom said:


> I am not sure I think its a good idea to bring a baby stroller to a dog park. Mac was chasing a dog and ran past a toddler. The little boy fell down and I panicked. The father laughed and said it was ok...the kid wasn't crying. It seems kinda risky to bring babies to a dog park. What do others think?


I don't like kids at the park I go to. Especially since it's a rule not to have them. Of course, people bring their 1-10 year olds anyway and I have to cause a ruckus. Either because my bf is hyperventilating over Frag running too close to a baby or because there are older kids teasing dogs and running. I don't do anything differently though. If Frag jumps on (he wouldn't), licks (he would), scares (he would), or topples (he would) a toddler, it is not my fault and I wouldn't apologize, but the parents would surely be upset. Maybe they'll learn. 



The Judge said:


> It a dog friendly park. our town bought a old golf course. Lots of cart paths and open feilds.We walk this park everyday for atleast an hour. Many freinds and many dogs. Everything but motorized vehicles.There are brooks and ponds. We left right away to clean his wound. I cant imagine anybody moving any faster than I did to control what was happening. I am sorry but I cant think of anything I did wrong besides forseeing the future. We went to day for the dog and kids to play in the brook. Their is a pic in my albaum from easter of the kids in the water with The Judge that shows how long we have been doing this.The Judge is 13 months old. We have eeven had picnics with neighbors. I know now it sounds like alot can go wrong but this is the first problem I have heard of and the first time the other dog was there. Today he played with a goodendoodle,golden ,husky and st Bernard .NOT ONE ISSUE but met some great people!!!!!!!


So is this place fenced in or not? And was Judge on leash, or not. I'm sorry, I'm just very confused about the place still, I guess. It's not fenced, right? Are their leash laws?


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

The Judge said:


> It a dog friendly park. our town bought a old golf course. Lots of cart paths and open feilds.We walk this park everyday for atleast an hour. Many freinds and many dogs. Everything but motorized vehicles.There are brooks and ponds. We left right away to clean his wound. I cant imagine anybody moving any faster than I did to control what was happening. I am sorry but I cant think of anything I did wrong besides forseeing the future. We went to day for the dog and kids to play in the brook. Their is a pic in my albaum from easter of the kids in the water with The Judge that shows how long we have been doing this.The Judge is 13 months old. We have eeven had picnics with neighbors. I know now it sounds like alot can go wrong but this is the first problem I have heard of and the first time the other dog was there. Today he played with a goodendoodle,golden ,husky and st Bernard .NOT ONE ISSUE but met some great people!!!!!!!



That sounds awesome. So it is not a dog park but a dog friendly park. That is a whole different story. We have them here too but the dogs usually have to be leashed because they are not fenced in.


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

no fences. very short leash.


----------



## Relayer (Apr 29, 2010)

My dog loves his dog park and I will never stop taking him there. Out of line dogs can be dealt with in our situation. It's sad that a few bad apples cause some people to shun all dog parks.


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Relayer said:


> My dog loves his dog park and I will never stop taking him there. Out of line dogs can be dealt with in our situation. It's sad that a few bad apples cause some people to shun all dog parks.


:thumbup: Agreed!


----------



## Cluemanti (Jun 25, 2010)

I can usually tell the dogs that will cause problems and try to watch them around mine. I won't stop going just will monitor other dogs/owners better. 

Now I just wish one was closer!


----------



## trish07 (Mar 5, 2010)

Lucy Dog said:


> You're right, you do have to keep a very close eye on things at the park. Problem is, not all people follow that rule. A fight can break out in seconds and your dog can end up with injuries like the OP's dog and/or fear issues after just one attack or fight.
> 
> Dog parks can be good if the right people and dogs are there, but that just isn't always the case. You can't control who comes in and out of there, so it's really a gamble.


Dog time reaction = around 3 seconds
Human time reaction = around 7 seconds

You are right when saying that you have to keep a close look on each dog in the park and you should leave as soon as you think a dog could be a danger for your dog or you.

But, the reality is that with more than 20 or 30 dogs in a dog park, it becomes hard to watch every dog. Plus, numerous dog owners come into the park with an uncontrolable dog and as soon as this dog is in the park, he attacks. I saw this numerous times in different parks.

We were always following and watching Phenix, always. But it took 2 seconds and she grabbed him by the neck, lifted him from the groud 4 or 5 times and smashed him back to the ground, never gave him a chance to escape from her mouth. It took maybe 2 minutes to brake down the fight, but my dog was already hurt and is now anxious and fearful as ****. She literaly changed my dog's attitude forever.

If I would have known, NEVER, I would have bring him to dog parks, even if we have passed 7 great months without a single problem there before.


----------



## Caledon (Nov 10, 2008)

It sounds as if this is not a dog park, but a park where many people use it for many purposes, like the ones I like to go to.

The other dog lunged at his dog three times and the owner could not control him. The GSD was on leash, and the thrid time contact was made. These things can happen very qucikly and when kids are close by they become your main concern.

Sounds like what I worry about. I'm always on the lookout for people who cannot control their dog and/or those that want to visit because their dog is pulling them over. Sometimes it is hard just to enjoy a walk.

To the OP, how did it end? Did the other owners offer to pay your vet bills or are they blaming you because their dog was hurt more?


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

I don't understand why if both dogs were on leashes and this was happening so close you didn't remove yourself from the situation with Judge, or pick him up to keep him from going after the dog if you couldn't control him on leash.  

Why would you just sit there and let it happen?


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> I don't understand why if both dogs were on leashes and this was happening so close you didn't remove yourself from the situation with Judge, or pick him up to keep him from going after the dog if you couldn't control him on leash.
> 
> Why would you just sit there and let it happen?


 
The dog ran right into a pile of my family. I pretty much pulled my son's hair to get him into my arms. This seemed like forever taken place but might of only 30 secs or so. And to be totaly honest very scary to say the least. The mouth was huge on that dog. Judges leash is a very short and was hanging on his side(18 inches). I was only trying to pull him back when they were not connected. I was scared to do him more harm. The Judge is over 90lbs would be difficult to lift with a dog biting him. I would do anything for my dog but I do not know how many people would place their arm infront a crazed dog like I saw. 

Also the onwer gave his # just in case and stated many times he was very sorry. Many bystanders ordered him to leave and never come back. After he gave his # I was checking on my family and dog.

I still can not get over the statement that I just sat there and let it happen?????????????????????

MY heart still races when I think of what could of happened to myself or my family. If it had to happen I quess we are lucky for just a couple of battle wounds. It might of been a lot worse if Judge was older and did not try to defend!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## cagirl (Apr 17, 2010)

The Judge said:


> The dog ran right into a pile of my family. I pretty much pulled my son's hair to get him into my arms. This seemed like forever taken place but might of only 30 secs or so. And to be totaly honest very scary to say the least. The mouth was huge on that dog. Judges leash is a very short and was hanging on his side(18 inches). I was only trying to pull him back when they were not connected. I was scared to do him more harm. The Judge is over 90lbs would be difficult to lift with a dog biting him. I would do anything for my dog but I do not know how many people would place their arm infront a crazed dog like I saw.
> 
> Also the onwer gave his # just in case and stated many times he was very sorry. Many bystanders ordered him to leave and never come back. After he gave his # I was checking on my family and dog.
> 
> ...


You did more then I would have honestly if a dog is charging into my family to get to the dog I am going to drop his leash and grab the kids and get them to safety then I will deal with the dog. Picking up a dog that is being charged is a horrid idea you and your dog can get much more hurt and your dog cant defend itself while having his rear exposed for an attack.


----------



## The Judge (Mar 26, 2010)

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

I almost felt like it was a bad idea to bring up here. But if it helps somebody its worth it. I was just trying to vent.


----------



## cagirl (Apr 17, 2010)

The Judge said:


> Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I almost felt like it was a bad idea to bring up here. But if it helps somebody its worth it. I was just trying to vent.


lol yeah I am quickly learning what to talk about here and what not too by watching the beatings  Dont get down on yourself you did fine, the dog is fine and most important the kids are safe. Last thing you want is a stroller in the middle of a dog fight or to have a dog redirect on you or your family


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

The Judge said:


> The dog ran right into a pile of my family. I pretty much pulled my son's hair to get him into my arms. ... The mouth was huge on that dog. Judges leash is a very short and was hanging on his side(18 inches). I was only trying to pull him back when they were not connected. I was scared to do him more harm. The Judge is over 90lbs would be difficult to lift with a dog biting him. ...
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


I can imagine this all happened quite quickly. We can't control another dog, especially when we have small children involved. The other dog was not being controlled. The Judge was under control and with his family. 

As a parent, I too am going to grab my 6 year old and get him out of the way of the charging dog. My German Shepherd is better able to fight back whereas my 6 year old is going to get badly hurt quickly without any tools (teeth) to fight back as well as being outweighed by the charging dog. Get the kids out of the way...go back for the dog. Was the other dog going for my dog or my kid? I"m not going to stop to analyze.

*I would think The Judge did exactly what this breed is supposed to do...he protected his family from a threat.*

How many people say they got their German Shepherd for protection? Well....isn't this protection?


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

Jax08 said:


> I can imagine this all happened quite quickly. We can't control another dog, especially when we have small children involved. The other dog was not being controlled. The Judge was under control and with his family.
> 
> As a parent, I too am going to grab my 6 year old and get him out of the way of the charging dog. My German Shepherd is better able to fight back whereas my 6 year old is going to get badly hurt quickly without any tools (teeth) to fight back as well as being outweighed by the charging dog. Get the kids out of the way...go back for the dog. Was the other dog going for my dog or my kid? I"m not going to stop to analyze.
> 
> ...


Exactly!


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

The Judge said:


> Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I almost felt like it was a bad idea to bring up here. But if it helps somebody its worth it. I was just trying to vent.


Putting the negative replies aside, I hope you felt the support from the rest of us. I agree with Cagirl and the other supportive replies from other members. I cannot imagine what I would have done in your situation. 

Thank you for posting this and I am sure you have helped many people. And again, I'm sorry your family experienced this.


----------



## Jessiewessie99 (Mar 6, 2009)

I hope the dog and everyone else is alright. You never know at a dog park. I wouldn't mind going to a dog park, but my mother won't let me, because of what happened with Molly(vet bills are NOT fun!)


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Jessiewessie99 said:


> I hope the dog and everyone else is alright. You never know at a dog park. I wouldn't mind going to a dog park, but my mother won't let me, because of what happened with Molly(vet bills are NOT fun!)


I thought you had a dogpark nearby that you went to all the time? Did something recently happen to Molly!?


----------



## Jessiewessie99 (Mar 6, 2009)

DJEtzel said:


> I thought you had a dogpark nearby that you went to all the time? Did something recently happen to Molly!?


It was a year ago, the only one near us. She got Kennel Cough.


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Oooooh. Yeah, Kennel Cough's a pain.


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Interesting discussion - one thing to keep in mind is that NOONE knows what they would really do in an emergency (like say for example a dog charges at you and your child while you are walking your dog!) UNTIL it really happens. (although we of course hope that something like that never happens!).

In that instance the first choice must be to protect the family member and let the dog fend for himself until your family is safe THEN fight for the dog.

By the way, in case anyone is interested, it is VERY SCARY to witness your first real dog fight if you have never seen an all out fight with dogs that are trying to kill each other. And it takes a LOT of courage (stupidity?) to jump into a dog fight to break it up.


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

DJEtzel said:


> ...............If Frag jumps on (he wouldn't), licks (he would), scares (he would), or topples (he would) a toddler, *it is not my fault and I wouldn't apologize,* but the parents would surely be upset. Maybe they'll learn..............


Actually it is and you should! No matter where it happens.


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

The Judge said:


> Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I almost felt like it was a bad idea to bring up here. But if it helps somebody its worth it. I was just trying to vent.


 
As well you should vent! I think you acted very reasonably with a terrible situation!

BTW, everyone can be a hero after the incident is over. There are very many internet heros!


----------



## Mac's Mom (Jun 7, 2010)

codmaster said:


> As well you should vent! I think you acted very reasonably with a terrible situation!
> 
> BTW, everyone can be a hero after the incident is over. There are very many internet heros!


Its nice to get support from elite members. Speaking for myself, I'm here to learn and share...not be judged.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Ok, the only dog park around here has about 1/4 acre fenced in for large dogs, and a fenced area about 1/2 the size for small dogs. Wood chips cover the ground. There is no shade, a rail road with trains running along the back of it and a picnic table in the large dog area. 

I see no reason for babies or children in such an area. Leave the kids home bring the dog if want to risk it. 

It sounds like your park is much different. If it is a dog friendly park, I can understand there being babies and children there. 

However, some people just have too many things going on at once. One under control dog and one medium sized kid sounds manageable. A large DA dog, a baby in a stroller? Two or three dogs and 1-3 kids all mostly out of control??? When I am out with my critter(s), I look for an avoid groups of people that look like they might be trouble. It is not fool proof by any means, but you almost always have to be hyper vigilent with any of the more interesting breeds of dogs or mixes.


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

codmaster said:


> By the way, in case anyone is interested, it is VERY SCARY to witness your first real dog fight if you have never seen an all out fight with dogs that are trying to kill each other. And it takes a LOT of courage (stupidity?) to jump into a dog fight to break it up.


Yes, it is. I witnessed many a dog fight as a child, but had to break up my first dog fight a few weeks ago at work. Between a rottweiler and an american bulldog. Only had to have 3 stitches and I didn't jump into anything. 



codmaster said:


> Actually it is and you should! No matter where it happens.


Well, in your opinion it may be, but I'm fairly sure it is not my fault that my dog licked a child, or my fault if he scares a child or the child gets in his way and he runs him over. Just like it's not my fault that small dogs come into the big dog park and my dog accidentally runs them over. It's what happens when people break the rules and it's their fault for having their child or dog there, not mine. So, no... I wouldn't apologize. If it happened anywhere besides the dog park, I of course would.


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

codmaster said:


> Interesting discussion - one thing to keep in mind is that NOONE knows what they would really do in an emergency (like say for example a dog charges at you and your child while you are walking your dog!) UNTIL it really happens. (although we of course hope that something like that never happens!).
> 
> In that instance the first choice must be to protect the family member and let the dog fend for himself until your family is safe *THEN fight for the dog.*
> 
> By the way, in case anyone is interested, it is VERY SCARY to witness your first real dog fight if you have never seen an all out fight with dogs that are trying to kill each other. And it takes a LOT of courage (stupidity?) to jump into a dog fight to break it up.



I highly advise... NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER EVER try to grab a fighting dog except you know exactly what you are doing. It can end really bad for anyone that is trying to break up two fighting dogs by walking into it. You can even hit them with a shovel and they don't care at that point. Once they fight, they don't look left or right and don't recognize you either. 

We've always used a strong waterhose to separate them if we had a fight. 

If us teenagers were home and the two strongest male dogs got into a fight we threw chairs, shovels... everything at them to separate them and the only thing that worked was the waterhose.


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Usually the best way to break up a dog fight is for two people to grab each dog by the hind legs so that they cannot turn around and redirect aggression, but get startled and usually do let go to try to turn around. If they aren't letting go like that, a quick jab in the butt (hole) usually stops it. 

If they're genuinely fighting with intent to kill, a water hose usually won't work. My experience and research, anyway.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

If you have the luxury of having two people, you can grab a tail or the back legs. If you have one person and the dogs are large, no collars. you are pretty well stuck. 

I heard that thowing a blanket over them might make a difference, but in the heat of the battle who is going inside for a blanket? If you can get them separated by a chair or something, and get one on its own and back it into a door way, you can usually sub the door for the chair and get them apart. 

Otherwise grab a tail and drag the dog backwards until both are within a gate way, and then try to put the gate in between shutting the gate while trying to get them to pull apart. It is nerve racking, heart racing, with no injuries at all I felt like I had gone through the wringer. 

One time, with two dogs I no longer have, I had them running loose in a field. No fences, male and female, no food no reason for a problem. The young dog plowed into the older bitch and she turned to give him what for. He decided he was the king of the mountain and wasn't taking a correction from her and it was on. With them both wearing collars, I shoved my hand in there to grab the collars and go a nasty wound -- not their fault, but I was miles away from anything to separate them with. I was out in a field, an empty field. 

My hand dripping blood, I stepped away from the situation, and walked to my SUV, got in turned it on and went right for the two of them. They were so surprised that they separated, I stopped, one went underneat -- she was ready to stop the fight -- I was lucky. In a fluid motion I had the back open and the dog crated before the surprise of me barreling toward them lifted. In a few more seconds the bitch was kenneled next to him. 

If you can safely get a leash around one of their necks and pull it back and hook it to a fence post or something. Then you can get the tail of the other and drag it away. 

But it is true, you need to get them apart fast if you do not want them to lose an ear or an eye, have to have surgeries to put drains in, etc. It is dangerous and terrifying. This is the main reason I am ALWAYS wary when I see people walking two or more dogs. 

I mean, you know your dogs, how they will react in most situations, but if a dog barrels into your two dogs and starts a fight, and the dog's owners pull their dog out of the fray, sometimes the remaining dogs will fight with each other -- transferred aggression. 

And dog fights are not something you want any child to witness. They are gruesome. 

In recent years among my dogs I have been careful, usually I notice if someone is starting something and I can quickly difuse it and get them separated before there is an incident. One day the vet techs were all laughing hysterically when one of my girls said something to the other and I whipped muzzles out of my pocket and muzzled them both in seconds. But usually just a serious tone cut that out, will stop them in their tracks.


----------



## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

I always love the bucket of water or hose advice. If that works, that is no real dog fight. I'd call that a scuffle!


----------



## StellaSquash (Apr 22, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> Usually the best way to break up a dog fight is for two people to grab each dog by the hind legs so that they cannot turn around and redirect aggression, but get startled and usually do let go to try to turn around. If they aren't letting go like that, a* quick jab in the butt (hole) usually stops it. *
> 
> If they're genuinely fighting with intent to kill, a water hose usually won't work. My experience and research, anyway.


I feel bad about the situation and glad things didn't turn out worse but this comment had me laughing. I'm picturing myself in the midst of a dog fight dancing about trying to poke one of them in the asterisks with my finger. :crazy:

to the OP: sounds like you did the best you could given the situation and probably a lot better than most would have done.


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

DJEtzel said:


> Yes, it is. I witnessed many a dog fight as a child, but had to break up my first dog fight a few weeks ago at work. Between a rottweiler and an american bulldog. Only had to have 3 stitches and I didn't jump into anything.
> 
> *Very fortunate!*
> 
> ...


What if your dog *deliberately* ran over a child (or for that matter an adult who is legal to be in the dog park) - would you accept responsibility for that?

Or perhaps runs over a dog who is big enough to be in the big dog park? Responsibility yours?

And along with that thought, how would one distinguish when a dog deliberately or accidently does something?

Just wondering?


----------



## cagirl (Apr 17, 2010)

codmaster said:


> Actually it is and you should! No matter where it happens.


Agree if your dog is so out of control that it cant go around a human then maybe it needs to be taught that children are people and people are above dogs.



DJEtzel said:


> Usually the best way to break up a dog fight is for two people to grab each dog by the hind legs so that they cannot turn around and redirect aggression, but get startled and usually do let go to try to turn around. If they aren't letting go like that, a quick jab in the butt (hole) usually stops it.
> 
> If they're genuinely fighting with intent to kill, a water hose usually won't work. My experience and research, anyway.



none of the methods will work for bully breeds, if a bully breed gets ahold of your dog this is the best way to get them off. Pit Bull Rescue Central You can use any sturdy wedged stick you dont really need to buy one.


----------



## Dawn (Jun 23, 2010)

I am not found of dogparks...to many people with to dogs running loose.....this always is going to be trouble at some point and time.
Did the dog that bit your dog have vaccines?
My mind races in instances like this.


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

StellaSquash said:


> I feel bad about the situation and glad things didn't turn out worse but this comment had me laughing. I'm picturing myself in the midst of a dog fight dancing about trying to poke one of them in the asterisks with my finger. :crazy:


Haha, right? 



codmaster said:


> What if your dog *deliberately* ran over a child (or for that matter an adult who is legal to be in the dog park) - would you accept responsibility for that?
> 
> Or perhaps runs over a dog who is big enough to be in the big dog park? Responsibility yours?
> 
> ...


Well, first of all, my dog cannot run over an adult. They are tall and stronger than him and he would actually notice him. But if he did deliberately run over a child, I would. I just don't believe he ever would deliberately knock them down. He does great with kids indoors, but when he's playing with a pack of dogs outside and chasing balls, he cannot be held accountable (nor can I) for most of his actions.

And it's kind of the same thing for running over a bigger dog- I doubt he ever would or could. It's more of him not being aware that they're THERE because they're so much smaller, so he doesn't realize it and runs into them, over them, or knocks into them. If he did run over or hurt a larger dog I would apologize, but I don't think it'd be as much of an issue as if he ran over a small dog like he has. 

The way I distinguish deliberately or accidentally just goes by common sense. My dog doesn't run after dogs and run them down. He chases another dog in play or chases a ball and small dogs that he doesn't see get in his way and he hits them or runs them over when he can't react quick enough to jump over. This has also happened when both the small dog and my dog were chasing balls going in perpendicular directions, they just happened to meet right in the middle and the small dog got spun around and kicked up into the air.  Likewise, my dog wouldn't run up to a child and run into it on purpose, but if he's playing and gets pushed into a kid, is chasing a dog or a ball and runs by, knocking him down because he doesn't see him and is concentrated on the target, he didn't do it deliberately. If he did run up to child and jump/scratch/knock down, I would apologize, but would not remove my dog from the park. The child should not be there. 



cagirl said:


> Agree if your dog is so out of control that it cant go around a human then maybe it needs to be taught that children are people and people are above dogs.


Like I said, my dog isn't out of control, but children do get startled by dogs being near them that are bigger than then, licking them, sniffing them, and sometimes knocking them down while playing with other dogs. That's not my dogs problem or fault. He gets along with kids and people just fine. 



> none of the methods will work for bully breeds, if a bully breed gets ahold of your dog this is the best way to get them off. Pit Bull Rescue Central You can use any sturdy wedged stick you dont really need to buy one.


Uhm, yes, these methods do work with bully breeds. Pulling their back legs is how I've watched all of the fights my pitbull has been in be broken up, and this is how the dog fight I was bit during was broken up, with and american bulldog and rottweiler. 

Bite sticks to come in handy though.


----------



## Rafi's Dad (Jan 25, 2008)

*Another dog park near-fight*

:help:Our first trip to a dog park almost became our last today. There is a lake where dogs can swim, and we were looking forward to have our 3 1/2 y/o Neutered Male GSD swim. Unfortuneatly the lake had a dock that the dogs jumped of off, and had to return by way of only 3 ramps back up to the dock. Being dog aggressive when any dog gets within 2-3 feet of him we were very careful. We wound up throwing his ball into the water from a tiny beach like area where he could wade into the water. Anyway, when he was coming out from the water, ball in his mouth, a Husky came over to him who was off leash-our Rafi still had his 6 ft lead attached but he was free. Anyway, it was the second time in about 30 minutes that this unattended dog came over to him-first was while he was pooping and I had to shoo the dog away. The owner causually walked up the first time chuckling how her dog doesn't listen. When the dog approached again in a different location once again the owner was out of sight and Rafi went ballistic. Rafi (116 lbs.) outweighed the Huskey by at least 2:1. He tried to attack the Huskey, and because the waters edge was slippery I fell,still holding him. Then the owner showed up and watched as her dog tried repeatedly to get near Rafi. Never once did she try to correct her off leash dog. Instead she was lecturing me during the the brewing confrontation about my aggressive dog (who was under my leash control at the time, even though it is an off lead park). "Maybe you shouldn't bring him here anymore!"
Rafi is fine with people, kids, meddling with his food, rough housing, Schutzhund training, as long as dogs don't get in his face. 
I guess I am wondering if I should bring him there again or not. Most of the people I know from my training had told me never go to a dog park. On the other hand, is is aggression at dogs that get in his face bad?


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

If it is an off-lead park and your dog will attack another dog, then it is probably not a good idea to go there. 

Sometimes having a dog on lead is a problem, if the dog is fear aggressive of other dogs, they are either guarding what they are leashed to, you, or they know they cannot run, so one of their two options is removed, flight or fight, leaves them to fight. So they will bark and lunge and carry on. 

But I would certainly not consider letting him off-lead, so I think that you should not take him where it is likely there will be off-lead dogs.


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

Samba said:


> I always love the bucket of water or hose advice. If that works, that is no real dog fight. I'd call that a scuffle!


It depends if there is enough pressure on the hose. The hose we have downstairs wouldn't work either but the one we had at that place... dang that thing did hurt.


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

I went yesterday to the dog park because I was invited. It reminded me why I don't bring my dogs there. I took my puppy and left the moment the 'pack' of dogs wanted to chase her.


----------



## goatdude (Mar 3, 2009)

Mrs.K said:


> If dogs are not allowed on playgrounds than young kids shouldn't be allowed in a dog park. Especially since you never know the other dogs.
> 
> And I hate it when there are more kids in the dog park than dogs. You can't even let your dogs run free when there are so many kids around because you always have to watch what is going on and that is another reason why I only go there when nothing is going on.


Sounds like a Rodney Dangerfield joke "I don't get no respect.... and on top of that I was an ugly kid, I tell you I was ugly... I'd ask my mom to take me out to the playground..... she took me to a dog park"


----------



## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

Rafi's Dad said:


> :help:Our first trip to a dog park almost became our last today. There is a lake where dogs can swim, and we were looking forward to have our 3 1/2 y/o Neutered Male GSD swim. Unfortuneatly the lake had a dock that the dogs jumped of off, and had to return by way of only 3 ramps back up to the dock. Being dog aggressive when any dog gets within 2-3 feet of him we were very careful. We wound up throwing his ball into the water from a tiny beach like area where he could wade into the water. Anyway, when he was coming out from the water, ball in his mouth, a Husky came over to him who was off leash-our Rafi still had his 6 ft lead attached but he was free. Anyway, it was the second time in about 30 minutes that this unattended dog came over to him-first was while he was pooping and I had to shoo the dog away. The owner causually walked up the first time chuckling how her dog doesn't listen. When the dog approached again in a different location once again the owner was out of sight and Rafi went ballistic. Rafi (116 lbs.) outweighed the Huskey by at least 2:1. He tried to attack the Huskey, and because the waters edge was slippery I fell,still holding him. Then the owner showed up and watched as her dog tried repeatedly to get near Rafi. Never once did she try to correct her off leash dog. Instead she was lecturing me during the the brewing confrontation about my aggressive dog (who was under my leash control at the time, even though it is an off lead park). "Maybe you shouldn't bring him here anymore!"
> Rafi is fine with people, kids, meddling with his food, rough housing, Schutzhund training, as long as dogs don't get in his face.
> I guess I am wondering if I should bring him there again or not. Most of the people I know from my training had told me never go to a dog park. On the other hand, is is aggression at dogs that get in his face bad?


If you know your dog is aggressive then he should not be off leash ever (you had it dragging- same thing) or at a dog park ever. The other owner did very little (if anything) wrong, it was you in the wrong. People like you are why our innocent dogs get attacked at dog parks and we don't go anymore.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Rafi's Dad said:


> Never once did she try to correct her off leash dog. Instead she was lecturing me during the the brewing confrontation about my aggressive dog (who was under my leash control at the time, even though it is an off lead park). "Maybe you shouldn't bring him here anymore!"


Sorry but she is 100% correct.

First, an off leash dog park is for dogs that are OFF LEASH. Keeping a dog on leash (whether the dog is aggressive or not) is going to cause problems.

Second, it's an OFF leash dog park. Dogs are going to be running around getting in each others faces. If your dog is not ok with that then they should NOT be where it can happen.

Find a regular lake and take your dog with a long line to allow him to go in the water.


----------



## Mrs.K (Jul 14, 2009)

I have to agree with Laurie here. 

However, one thing I really don't like about dog parks is that a lot of people don't interfere. The dogs are waiting at the gate already and you can't even get in without having to go through a bunch of strangers. The people don't call them back so you can't get in and introduce the dog properly to the dogs in the park is impossible. 

That is why I, after I gave it one last chance, am going to stay away for good. I won't even go there if nobody is there, especially since it's also a health risk. 

We've had parvo cases around here and I sure don't bring a dog to a park where parvo is going around, doesn't matter if vaccinated or not, we drag it around anyway but it's a melting pot for parvo, kennel cough and all other kind of deseases.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Mrs.K said:


> The dogs are waiting at the gate already and you can't even get in without having to go through a bunch of strangers. The people don't call them back so you can't get in and introduce the dog properly to the dogs in the park is impossible.


The dog park by me has a double gate. I make my guys Sit and Wait, Open Gate #1, release them, go in after them, close Gate #1, tell them to Sit and Wait then look to see if there area outside Gate #2 (which leads into the field) is clear. I won't open the gate until it is.

Most people that see me standing there, waiting, get the idea and call their dogs away from the gate.

Even if my guys have to sit and wait for 5 minutes it's good training for them. 

ALL dog parks should be required to have double gates.


----------



## Blazer707 (Jun 13, 2010)

DJEtzel said:


> I don't like kids at the park I go to. Especially since it's a rule not to have them. Of course, people bring their 1-10 year olds anyway and I have to cause a ruckus. Either because my bf is hyperventilating over Frag running too close to a baby or because there are older kids teasing dogs and running. I don't do anything differently though. If Frag jumps on (he wouldn't), licks (he would), scares (he would), or topples (he would) *a toddler, it is not my fault and I wouldn't apologize, but the parents would surely be upset. Maybe they'll learn*.


 

I just read the whole thread and thought this was kind of harsh. If i was at a park and had a child there with my dog and your dog walked by with yourself and somehow my child got close and our dog "toppled" my child and you said maybe ill learn after this we would have more problems then just my child being hurt.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Well it IS a rule not to have children there. If the dog walks by a toddler who is not supposed to be there, well, oops.

People go to dog parks with their dogs to socialize them to other dogs and to let them blow off steam. 

Children run and scream, really they are super distraction. Having other people and dogs and a wide field to run in or water to jump in, and someone throwing a stick or ball around is really pretty stimulating all in itself. 

If you have children, and your dog is raised with children, then it is NOTHING to you or your dog to see children running and screaming and pushing and pulling and toddling and staring. It is in fact, normal. 

For those of us without children, there are very few people who are happy to lend you theirs to socialize you crazy half-grown land shark to, so many of our dogs, live primarily away from children. Most encounters with children are under extremely controlled conditions, like in the pet store where the dog is on a short leash, and the child asks to pet the dog and I am right there supervising. 

My dogs are NEVER out and about running amok around kids of any age. 

When I want to socialize a litter to children, the puppies are out front while the dogs are kenneled in the back yard. I do this so that the kids are not overwhelmed by the dogs too. My point is having the children pet the puppies, not be herded by my adults.

If someone wants to meet the mom, she is on lead comes in meets the family and then I take her back outside if there are kids. If it is just adults I might let her hang around. Because I do not have kids and they generally make me nervous. 

So if you are going to a dog park where there is a rule saying no children, and people blatantly ignore it, well I would not go so far as say oh well if the dog jumped on the child, but barks at, scares, licks, or accidently topples a child, well, oh well. 

But if I did go to dog parks (been twice I think), I would not enter if there were kids there because their idiot owners are already breaking the rules. If people are breaking that rule, how much control, and how many rules will they break with their dogs. So I would simply leave.


----------



## Melodie A (Aug 13, 2008)

selzer said:


> But if I did go to dog parks (been twice I think), I would not enter if there were *kids there because their idiot owners *are already breaking the rules.


LOL... they are called Parents, not owners! Don't know why but that just struck me as FUNNY! Sorry, it is kinda late and I am a little punch drunk!

We haven't taken Riot to any dog parks, mostly because I just am not sure how he would act. He goes to daycare at least once per week because we don't have any friends with bigger dogs that we are able to socialize him with and I really think he needs that interaction. They say he does great at daycare, but it is a very controlled environment with people/animals he is comfortable with so the thought of the unknown just makes me nervous. I also think that he is more aggressive when I am present, he doesn't seem to be that way around my husband but he really doesn't like anything that he feels is even slightly threatening to me. I do agree that children don't belong in the fenced in dogpark with a no kids rule. Especially toddlers, they are easily bowled over by bigger dogs even if they don't mean to hurt the child, it isnt' worth the risk to the safety of the child.


----------



## Jessiewessie99 (Mar 6, 2009)

How is The Judge doing?Has he had any issues?like behavorial issues?


----------

