# GSDs are meant to be SLIM!



## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Those of you who are familiar with my posts know that I have a problem with fat German Shepherds, and that I’m not afraid to tell people that they need to take some weight off their dogs.

Not only does excess weight cause stress on the heart, lungs, joints, etc., but it shortens the lives of these dogs, and they already have short enough lives as it is.

The problem with excess weight is huge in modern society. We are fatter, and so are our dogs. We have been so accustomed to seeing overweight dogs, that we have lost our eye for what normal should look like.
Veterinarians, too! Because they run a business, and are aware that owners get insulted, they, sadly, do not tell clients the truth. Another cynical POV could be that fat dogs keep them in business.

Most German Shepherds should not weigh over 90 pounds. Let me repeat that: most German Shepherds should not weigh over 90 pounds!

Yet time and again, when I alert owners on this board, after sometimes consulting in private with other GSD owners, who agree with me, what I get is a lot of “the vet says he’s fine “ and many more pictures of the same dog, still looking fat. Oh, and silence from members here, who either also have chunky dogs, or are just unwilling to tell the owner of the truth.

This is frustrating to me because these dogs don’t choose their own diet, and certainly will eat if overfed. 100% of this is the owner’s doing. I am far more concerned about the health of the dogs than the owners’ delicate feelings.

A good rule of thumb is, if the head looks tiny and photoshopped on, your dog is fat!
Your dog will not suffer if he is fed less, in fact, the opposite is true.

I honestly believe you owe it to your dog to offer the best life possible, and part of it is to keep him slim and active.

Here are some vintage pictures. Most are from the 1930s. Even evil Hitler’s dog was slim, and you can bet that dog got fed only the very best.
Note that most of these dogs have some ribs showing. Remember, GSDs used to live longer, and I’m convinced that diet and exercise had a lot to do with it.

OK, I’m done. This has been bugging me for quite a long time.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)




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## NickQ (11 mo ago)

I agree the vintage photos look A+ great…. None of the humans looked like they ate out / fast food daily either back then? 

The nutrition aspect for my gsd has been so stressful for me ( as a new owner ) because of my own lifestyle choices with diet and nutrition, I wanted the best for her too.

In the end I am using common sense, my own life experience, and research…


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## cagal (Sep 3, 2013)

@Sunflowers it’s not just GSD’s. I see so many fat dogs and feel just terrible for them. The worst part is if you can’t or won’t adequately exercise your dog you are still in control of the food! The bowl gets filled by the owner and not the dog. I always laugh that I’m way better at controlling the food intake of my dogs than my own.


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

Also such nicely straight, nonroached backs.

























My own chunky monkey playing on his favorite stump.

To this day (these were taken a few days ago) I still get told he's too skinny and receive occasional threats of calling animal control because I'm not feeding my dog.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

I got this from eBay. Old book photo, showcased all breeds.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

cagal said:


> @Sunflowers it’s not just GSD’s. I see so many fat dogs and feel just terrible for them.


Yes, but for some reason, many think that GSDs are supposed to be BIG, even 100 pounds, and some owners are very proud when their dogs reach that weight!

A GSD is not a Dane.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

My first purebred was thin until she filled out around 24 months. For two years everyone we met told me I was starving her. I told them they were wrong. GSDS aren’t supposed to be fat Labs. Although I think people take English Labs to extremes by saying that breed is supposed to be fat. No dog should be fat! Even when she filled in, that dog was always slim, never over 65 lbs. Maybe because I’m not overweight either, but it’s natural for me to keep my dogs at the ideal weights for their builds. What’s good for us is good for them. This is a good thread.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Preach sister!
To be fair though, there are fat 80 pound GSD and lean 100 pounders. It's not just weight but body condition.

I agree that an in-breed-standard male GSD should not likely weigh more than 80-90 pounds.


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

Exactly! this has always been such a bother to me because even owning 5+ (8 currently) dogs at a time weve always kept them all thin and lean, its hard work but all of our dogs have lived such long lives and I truly believe that's why. It's so sad to see people calling obese dogs cute, when clearly their dog is struggling to even be a dog because they're so overweight.

Same goes for little dogs, even though they're small. Im a proud owner of an anklebiter, who is quite the little athlete😎


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

Yep, here's my girl at 18 months 55#. I'm often told that dog is skinny, I think she is Ideal, so did the vet. I think vets only push as the dog approaches obese. 

Embark panel says she'll get to 64#, not sure I want another 9 pounds on her, I'd be happy if she tops out at 60 by 3 years old


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

Apex looks like he could lose weight to me. If I cut back on food he will puke bile in the morning. Am I wrong in my thinking?

Edit: sometimes before dinner about an hour


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

while i agree with the points made… i don’t always agree with judging dogs from photos alone. age, coat length, weather, diet, conformation, muscle tone, health, can all make a difference. many dogs aren’t going to appear perfectly ideal because most dogs are going to have at least one of those factors that aren’t ideal. additionally, positioning, lighting, angle and photo quality make a difference too. 

i’m not going to expect a well bred 3yr old intact male thats raw fed and competes in sports to look the same as an 8yr old byb pet line spayed female that eats dog chow gets long walks and is in the middle of blowing her coat while finishing up a round of prednisone.

i weigh my dog every other week and while he pretty much maintains a BCS of 4.5-5/9….. he can easily photograph as a 6/9 while weighing the exact same weight. i know my dogs history and am confident in his condition, so any comments wouldn’t bother me.

if a dog is truly overweight, chances are they aren’t getting exercised enough. and the right type of exercise. if people aren’t willing to adjust their lifestyle and increase their dogs exercise, they may be tempted to simply decrease their dogs food to achieve a lower weight. this does not come without risks…. dogs need a minimum about of nutrition to function both physically and mentally.


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

I had people approach me on the street to accuse me of starving Luc. Umm, no. An old vet told me he needed 'insurance weight'. 

Luc had hypothyroid and we noticed when he gained a few lbs and took him in for testing since activity and food were the same. He quickly lost it.

And look who lived to 15.5. 

I always am arguing with Toby about keeping Neb (not a GSD, just a mutt, around 40lbs) slimmer (it's his body type, he's not actually fat) though he actually is quite slim, and he's 14 in two months. 

I don't think that's a coincidence.


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## SMcN (Feb 12, 2021)

@Sunflowers You are preaching to the choir here. My husband and I got rid of refined and processed food for ourselves years ago. I am ashamed we kept feeding our dogs at that time kibble. I will say the vet always complimented them on their weight, which we did watch.
With Ilita we decided to bite the bullet and feed her raw, human grade as much as possible. It is in the food as much, or more, than the exercise. Yes, exercise is very important but it is not just 'calories in, calories out'. If you eat ultra-processed food, and too much of it on top of that, you will be unhealthy and likely overweight to obese. Check out the current overweight and obesity records of humans. Same goes for our pets. 
The book, The Forever Dog, by Dr. Becker and Rodney Habib, preaches this philosophy and declares that how and what we feed our dogs has shortened their 'natural' lifespan tremendously. 
Whereas I understand what Fodder is saying about using photos only as a gauge, you can certainly point out where there might be a problem and ask for more photos to confirm, as many have done. I believe tact has been used in the majority of posts I have read where people have pointed out the dog could lose some weight or increase exercise. 
Keep it up!


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## Buckelke (Sep 4, 2019)

oh dear. Duke's vet says she isn't sure about his weight. She cannot tell what is dog and what is hair. He has a rather large 'caboose' but then what he's mixed with might have had the same caboose. He doesn't eat that much but he could use more exercise (are tissues fattening?) . What's a mother to do? 
But I do agree with what Sunflowers says and love the photos. Unfortunately dogs tend to eat what their oversized people eat.


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## MeishasMom (Nov 12, 2021)

Thank you Sunflowers I've had a few visitors tell me Meisha is thin. I tell them that she is a GSD and they are supposed to be lean. I get eye rolls, yet one of their dogs is obese and has mobility issues.

I also have two horses one is a Saddlebred and the other is a Gypsy Cob. My Saddlebred is a hard keeper who requires extra feed, the cob on the other hand is what is call an air fern. At one point last year she looked like she was in foal to triplets. Nope just fat. I had to limit her daily hay (which is all she gets with a mineral lick) and she was not happy. But she has lost at least 100 lbs so Spring riding will be fun. 

Obesity in animals I feel is worse than them being to thin. So many issues arise.


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## PNWBlue (Feb 27, 2021)

I see pictures of a good deal of GSD's and often wonder if mine was too thin. He looks athletic and he is.. Very quick and smooth. This does not show it but his ribs show a bit.










He primary job is to be a trail companion to me year round. So he has to stay fit.


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## CatMan900 (May 24, 2018)

I think the main reason you see fatter dogs now is due to dog food. All that processed corn meal etc. Back in the day people would just feed their dog from the table, or fresh meat and eggs etc. Especially a dog like a German shepherd where it would've been a farmers dog


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## Kathrynil (Dec 2, 2019)

Oh yah.





Like this video. Not a GSD, but similar.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


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## Mannix (12 mo ago)

Sunflowers said:


> I honestly believe you owe it to your dog to offer the best life possible, and part of it is to keep him slim and active.


Yep, also helps me keep slim and active. Mine eat as much as they want but never get fat. Can't say the same for me.
I like those vintage photos.
Devil dog and mom late 1950s.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

@Buckelke you can tell a lot when the dog is wet.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

anyone come across that meme before….. one photo, a Mal i think, says i can see your dogs ribs, the other, a chubby pit, saying i can see your dogs diabetes?

looking for it…..


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


I will.
When around 1, Rolf was looking all ribs and scary thin, so I upped his food.

Worked too well!

Before I knew it, Rolf was looking chunky.
I consulted with someone who confirmed this, and I immediately cut down by 1/2 lb. Now he is in a good place.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Apex1 said:


> Apex looks like he could lose weight to me. If I cut back on food he will puke bile in the morning. Am I wrong in my thinking?
> 
> Edit: sometimes before dinner about an hour


I have found that Hans stopped bile barfing when I changed his food. Could be something in his current food that isn't agreeing with your dog.
Additionally, feeding at the same time every day makes gastric juices begin to secrete at these times. Vary the feeding hours.
Lastly, bile barfing, occasionally, is not a big deal. If it occurs daily, see my first point.


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

@Sunflowers I do know his food agrees with him. Schedule I do believe is contributing thank you good point.

Has never been an over eater will even pass a meal or some if not hungry. His activity level has increased. I do believe he is truly hungry. If he knew how to throw his bowl at me he would lol.
I've been reading what's been said about green tripe lately. I think I should add it perhaps then adjusting on the other food side.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Sunflowers said:


> I will.
> When around 1, Rolf was looking all ribs and scary thin, so I upped his food.
> 
> Worked too well!
> ...


Note I said is fat not was.  

I've seen some really fat dogs on here and most people say "he's not fat and my vet says he's fine"
I remember one where the dog was absolutely round.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

WNGD said:


> Note I said is fat not was.
> 
> I've seen some really fat dogs on here and most people say "he's not fat and my vet says he's fine"
> I remember one where the dog was absolutely round.


Hopefully, whoever has a fat dog here will be motivated to do something about it.
It’s not fair to the dog.


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


I will admit my hound mix Iris is getting fat, she weighs 29.3 and would probably be good at about 26 or so, doesn't sound like a lot but it looks it when a dog is as small as she is. She has lost a lot of her waist, especially compared to how fit and skinny she's been all her previous years, cut her food down a little bit and am gonna start taking her on runs again(she loves to bikejor) once she has recovered from her spay.


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

Fodder said:


> anyone come across that meme before….. one photo, a Mal i think, says i can see your dogs ribs, the other, a chubby pit, saying i can see your dogs diabetes?
> 
> looking for it…..


ah yes, a classic lol


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

CatMan900 said:


> I think the main reason you see fatter dogs now is due to dog food. All that processed corn meal etc. Back in the day people would just feed their dog from the table, or fresh meat and eggs etc. Especially a dog like a German shepherd where it would've been a farmers dog


Dogs and people are fat because they eat too much. You can't blame the food or genetics. Maybe some medicine can cause weight gain somehow. In the past I didn't have access to great dog food, yet none of my dogs have been overweight. Most show dogs are overweight. A friend's Whippet in show shape was too fat to race and one in race shape couldn't be shown because he was too boney.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

peachygeorgia said:


> ah yes, a classic lol
> View attachment 583419


ah, nice!
the one i saw had different photos, but so so good!


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


Let's test this by posting a picture of your dog today or tomorrow (it's dark outside now)


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## NadDog24 (May 14, 2020)

Good thread. It pains me to hear people say that obese dogs are cute. In fact just today I heard a group of girls behind me talk about how much they love obese dogs and think they’re cute. 🙄


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## Hopps (Dec 5, 2021)

Owner of a fatty GSD reporting in! I was so sure that Fern was super overweight but multiple veterinarians confirmed she was not fat at all. I felt like I was being gaslighted. Came to the forums, posted pics of Fern AKA Pork Chop and got the good truth. It's been about 4/5 weeks and she has already dropped 4lbs. She has so much more energy and I even witnessed her running around. We have at least 8lbs more to lose before we get to our checkpoint (68lbs). Losing 12 lbs will land her at about 68lbs, we will probably get down to 65lbs if we dont see ribs. She is so much happier after shedding some of that weight!!!!


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## Dunkirk (May 7, 2015)

The camera is lying, I kept this photo of Nitro training his frisbee, as it made him look fat; the curve of his body, hairy belly, lots of skin, all contributed to the illusion.








leg angle all contributed.


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

None of these guys are GSDs, but...

Neb (almost 14 and not as active, though he still occasionally will put in a sprint or two)...not a great picture, because it's before 6am and I'm just not functioning (going off a med that's giving me awful insomnia and dizziness, yeah)










Xerxes (beagle with a hint of border collie)...6ish? Be darned if I can remember. He's not great at holding still, so you can't really see. He's definitely ribby, you can actually kind of see behind the first rib. Toby is convinced he is going to die, but he's muscular and active, big runner with me, so I explain to Toby he's fine and not wasting away.










Agis I think is starting to look a bit chonky, but his dog walker came yesterday. She walks him to a huuuuuge off-leash area in a big park near by - plays fetch a bunch with him - yesterday he played with a hound who was pretty evenly matched with him, in terms of speed and maneuvering, sometimes one would get to the ball first, sometimes the other. The hound's owner was shocked, said Agis was the first dog he'd ever seen match his dog and really admired his athleticism. From the side he's got a nice tuck up at the waist (however you describe that, I don't mean the waist tuck from above).

I welcome thoughts on his weight!


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## Sabre's Mom (Jul 27, 2018)

I had a discussion with my vet about Sabre's weight when I told him she was fat & he disagreed with me. He finally did say she could probably lose a few pounds. I think vets are so used to seeing overweight dogs that it's becoming the norm...and they don't want to offend the owners.

Picture of Sabre taken about a month ago. I'd still like to get a few pounds off of her.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

@Fodder - said it best.

Seeing pictures of super thin young’s dogs don’t mean to much to me. You can over feed and under exercise a young dog and for a good length of time it wouldn’t show. Don’t expect a 10 year old big boned gsd look like a 1 year old Belgian Malinois it just should not be. Field labs and English labs have different body types. It’s important for people to understand this as well especially with the high cost of food. Malnourished dogs are also a major health issue.
Keeping a very healthy , calm tempered, low energy , sedentary neutered male chihuahua in top shape that impresses me most.


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## bchevs (Oct 15, 2020)

I'm guilty of having a chunker right now. I usually try to keep them lean but I thought Whisk was getting a bit too thin and upped his food and didn't pay enough attention 🤦‍♀️ he's getting less food again now. I've attached pics, some of it is fluff but definitely not all of it lol

Nova I keep getting told is too thin. She's 10 months so I think she's okay personally but what do you all think? She's 64lbs right now.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

wolfy dog said:


> Dogs and people are fat because they eat too much. You can't blame the food or genetics. Maybe some medicine can cause weight gain somehow. In the past I didn't have access to great dog food, yet none of my dogs have been overweight.


It’s not only quantity, but quality. The modern diet contains way too much sugar and starch, which we were simply not designed process in large quantities.
Add to that our ridiculous current portion sizes, and it’s a recipe for disaster.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


Ok I will be the first lol. My schipp is hypothyroid, she is medicated but I can’t get 2lbs off her!! She’s eating 2.5oz of raw daily, gets her daily walks and hikes as well as one hour of treadmill training daily and yet she is stuck. 2lbs doesn’t sound like a lot but on a Schipperke, it’s a lot. She goes for her yearly thyroid blood panel soon so I’m guessing her dose may have to be increased.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Saphire said:


> Ok I will be the first lol. My schipp is hypothyroid, she is medicated but I can’t get 2lbs off her!! She’s eating 2.5oz of raw daily, gets her daily walks and hikes as well as one hour of treadmill training daily and yet she is stuck. 2lbs doesn’t sound like a lot but on a Schipperke, it’s a lot. She goes for her yearly thyroid blood panel soon so I’m guessing her dose may have to be increased.


You are disqualified. Your dog has a medical condition.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Sunflowers said:


> View attachment 583458
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cooking from scratch is the answer. All these fancy new kitchens are under-used.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

@bchevs, Nova is the typical lanky GSD puppy.
Don’t change a thing.
I can’t tell that much about your other dog, the hair gets in the way, but I don’t see that much chunk on him, either.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Top, fit German Shepherd.
Bottom, fat German Shepherd.


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

I will cop to being obese myself (despite having what I hope are good weight dogs) and hiking, backpacking, cross country skiing, biking and running. One of (well, more than one, but one in particular) my psych meds has been implicated in this - it causes huge appetite gain, raises insulin, changes how your metabolism works, etc, etc...I wasn't skinny before, but it got pretty bad. 

After a year and a half of asking my psychiatrist to please change it, despite how well it worked for my brain cooties. Finally he agreed, and three weeks ago we stopped it. I've lost 7.5lbs already, despite not being as active as I might like (severe insomnia, dizziness and nausea from the med change). So I'm pretty happy about that. Got a long way to go, but I'll get there!


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

@jarn, you, also, are disqualified 🙂


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Sunflowers said:


> @jarn, you, also, are disqualified 🙂


Welcome to the disqualified club 😀


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

Saphire said:


> Welcome to the disqualified club 😀


I'm in good company!


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## bchevs (Oct 15, 2020)

Sunflowers said:


> @bchevs, Nova is the typical lanky GSD puppy.
> Don’t change a thing.
> I can’t tell that much about your other dog, the hair gets in the way, but I don’t see that much chunk on him, either.


Thank you! That's what I figured too but with so many people telling me she's thin another opinion is appreciated! 

Whisk isn't too bad now but I can't feel his ribs still so I know he needs to lose some. He's got a bad leg so I try to keep him as lean as possible to minimize the pressure on his joints. It's been a few weeks since I cut his food back and I think we are on the right track again. I need to bath him soon so I can get a better look at him.


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

Sunflowers said:


> View attachment 583460
> 
> Top, fit German Shepherd.
> Bottom, fat German Shepherd.
> ...


Bottom dog is what I see a lot of and what everyone wants Sutter Cain to be. No matter what I say, show or do, I can't convince them this is NOT ideal.


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## Squidwardp (Oct 15, 2019)

Of those posting here, how often do you feed your adult dogs?

Twice a day? Three times with smaller portions?


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Sunflowers said:


> View attachment 583460
> 
> Top, fit German Shepherd.
> Bottom, fat German Shepherd.
> ...


I would hope most people recognize the bottom dog as overweight. I cringe for his heart and hips.

My daughter is super fit (a runner, works out 5 days a week minimum) and helps to keep our dogs lean. 
But she's also one that thinks her friend's super fat snuffly breathing French Bulldog is the cutest thing ever and used to like fat Pugs


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Squidwardp said:


> Of those posting here, how often do you feed your adult dogs?
> 
> Twice a day? Three times with smaller portions?


Twice a day.

What I found interesting is someone mentioning that they cut their dog's food down in Winter due to lower activity levels. I don't since they burn a lot of calories staying warm and running around outside even if the total minutes might be down. Harley's appetite is way up right now for some reason or at least his eagerness to eat is.


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

Squidwardp said:


> Of those posting here, how often do you feed your adult dogs?
> 
> Twice a day? Three times with smaller portions?


I currently free feed, but he's taken to just waiting until the end of the day to empty his bowl once and then ignore it when I refill it. Sometimes if I work him EXTRA hard he;ll eat half of the refil a few hours later. So technically he eats once a day.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Squidwardp said:


> Of those posting here, how often do you feed your adult dogs?
> 
> Twice a day? Three times with smaller portions?


Once a day here.


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

Three times a day. Neb started getting a bit too bile-y in his old age - he's fine at 3x/day. We weigh their food and portion control (what with two lab mixes and a beagle...).


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

WNGD said:


> Twice a day.
> 
> What I found interesting is someone mentioning that they cut their dog's food down in Winter due to lower activity levels. I don't since they burn a lot of calories staying warm and running around outside even if the total minutes might be down. Harley's appetite is way up right now for some reason or at least his eagerness to eat is.


We leave their food the same and up it at points when they're outside a lot for the same reason!


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

This morning's body condition. After last week's weight check at the vet, she needs to shed 3 (US) pounds. Not sure if that is happening yet.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

I used to feed twice daily until I met Carmen and Gus was no longer a puppy. She explained that aloy of resources are used to digest when a dog eats. She said “feed once a day so those resources have a chance to repair other areas of the body”. Made total sense to me so he’s fed in the evening when daily exercise is done.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

My flyball club has participated in demos at an annual dog show. Our ring was set up near where they were showing the labs and I was shocked at how chunky every one of them was. I would have expected show dogs to be in good physical condition but they were FAT! 

Having longcoats, it's very difficult to tell in photos if they're at an optimum weight, I have to go by feel. In this picture, Cava was about a month post-spay, so her belly fur hadn't grown back yet and you can really see her tuck. 










But you'll never see her ribs through that fluffy coat. Here her belly is all grown out, can't see the tuck at all but it's still there. 










Her perfect adult weight is around 57/58 pounds. Embark predicted she'd be 66 pounds but she definitely needs to be no more than 60. She's much smaller than all her littermates though. They're fit and athletic too, just quite a bit bigger.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> My flyball club has participated in demos at an annual dog show. Our ring was set up near where they were showing the labs and I was shocked at how chunky every one of them was. I would have expected show dogs to be in good physical condition but they were FAT!
> 
> Having longcoats, it's very difficult to tell in photos if they're at an optimum weight, I have to go by feel. In this picture, Cava was about a month post-spay, so her belly fur hadn't grown back yet and you can really see her tuck.
> 
> ...


I have shown Katie when she was quite heavy and she had no problem taking points. Seems conformation judges don’t mind.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

Squidwardp said:


> Of those posting here, how often do you feed your adult dogs?
> 
> Twice a day? Three times with smaller portions?


1-3x usually 2


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Once a day. I think three times a day is overstimulating the digestive system. They were designed to gorge and fast.
Feeding so many meals stimulates everything again and again, and keeps things running constantly.
Since Hans is neutered and his metabolism is slow, he gets a fast once a week. Many GSD owners do fast their dogs.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Saphire said:


> I have shown Katie when she was quite heavy and she had no problem taking points. Seems conformation judges don’t mind.


On the contrary. I went to a dog show and to my eye, most of them were fat!


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


LOL. Are they afraid to admit it or do we all keep our dogs trim?


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Sunflowers said:


> View attachment 583458
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That is so true! I found medium sized plates which I use most of the time. Although I never eat 800 calories at a single meal. That would be too much. Portion control is very difficult when you look at the correct amounts of food on a huge plate and feel deprived. This is a good size if someone can find them. It looks like Target has them. Not only is it healthier to maintain the right weights it’s much harder to exercise and feel well. I know so many people who had to get joint replacements due to weight.









Corelle 8.5" 6pk Glass Lunch Plates White


Read reviews and buy Corelle 8.5" 6pk Glass Lunch Plates White at Target. Choose from contactless Same Day Delivery, Drive Up and more.




www.target.com


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

I don't know if these pictures are good enough. 5 years old. Apex is 27" at the withers about. I don't know what he weighs. Fed 2x per day 2.5 lbs raw pre-made. He looks skinnier in the pictures 🤷‍♀️


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

Zephyr who is 24" at the withers about. About 14-15 months old. Weight 63 pounds. I think is to skinny. I can feel and see his spine and see his hips to well. Eating 2lbs raw total







fed 2x per day.


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## cagal (Sep 3, 2013)

I’m still feeding 2x a day. You certainly need to feed a minimum to ensure health, but I think too often people forget about treats, especially if used for training in addition to regular meals. You also do need to be flexible. I know when Django has had a heavier day and needs more to eat. The bowl gets bashed around pretty good if he’s really hungry. CICO works scientifically no matter what as long as you don’t eat below the minimum needed for health to be maintained. I exercise a lot but eat over what I should should so I stay heavier than I should. It’s the “treats” that do me in so I’m very conscious of it with Django. I sadly don’t have that willpower for myself.

Edit: I also just noticed I’m”registered” in my vacation destination - sorry, random observation.


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## Hopps (Dec 5, 2021)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> My flyball club has participated in demos at an annual dog show. Our ring was set up near where they were showing the labs and I was shocked at how chunky every one of them was. I would have expected show dogs to be in good physical condition but they were FAT!
> 
> Having longcoats, it's very difficult to tell in photos if they're at an optimum weight, I have to go by feel. In this picture, Cava was about a month post-spay, so her belly fur hadn't grown back yet and you can really see her tuck.
> 
> ...


Cava is so cute! I like the pink and purple. 

Also I saw an English show lab and he was so fat. When he walked his entire body fat jiggled around and had to stop walking every few minutes. I asked the owner why the dogs was so big. He said “oh yeah this is a bench lab. They’re supposed to be really large and sturdy. This guy is 3 years old, he finally calmed down!” People believe in the weirdest things


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Saphire said:


> I used to feed twice daily until I met Carmen and Gus was no longer a puppy. She explained that aloy of resources are used to digest when a dog eats. She said “feed once a day so those resources have a chance to repair other areas of the body”. Made total sense to me so he’s fed in the evening when daily exercise is done.


I won't feed Rogan what he eats (6c kibble plus a few tblsp wet) in one sitting. So I won't feed Harley just once (doesn't seem fair) and 2c X 2 for him is still a fair bit at once.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

LuvShepherds said:


> LOL. Are they afraid to admit it or do we all keep our dogs trim?


First of all they don't believe it, I've seen them argue about it. 
I have seen several instances of very fat GSD on this site but I'm too scared to call it out. I've gently suggested a few times that the dog could use a bit less time in the bowl but try to say it humorously


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

WNGD said:


> First of all they don't believe it, I've seen them argue about it.
> I have seen several instances of very fat GSD on this site but I'm too scared to call it out. I've gently suggested a few times that the dog could use a bit less time in the bowl but try to say it humorously


When I had my skinny German Shepherd, some acquaintances had two extremely obese dogs. Mine ran around until she passed away. Theirs were around age 6 and could barely waddle. They kept them outside on bark collars because they smelled. The dogs looked like overstuffed sausages on stick legs. I tried everything I could think of to get them to exercise their dogs but they said his parents were from Germany and knew better now to raise dogs. The dogs belonged to the parents but lived with their son and DIL.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

A couple of you mentioned that there isn't one size fits all, you are correct. But that is no excuse for letting your dog become overweight. So here are a couple of examples: 

The first example is Kai. She is almost one year old and weighs in at 59lbs. She may gain a little as she fills out, but I can't see her becoming much heavier. She is not just leaner on the fat side but she has and will continue to build muscle as well.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Here’s Hunty, he’s near 2 yo and 26 in. I have no idea about weight, probably 76lb. I hope to see some muscles on that rib cage and rear legs next year. Dogs can be skinny fat too.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

My second example is Maya. She is a shepherd mix (maybe lab and more? I never DNA tested her). She is around 61/62lbs and is somewhere between 12-14 years old. Due to age and underlying health issues she has lost A LOT of muscle and her body shape has drastically changed around the middle. Yet, and there is a yet, I can feel her bones under her fur and I still get her up and moving on hikes and walks for as long as she is capable of going (and as long as she is enjoying them). Keeping her in an ideal weight for her age is much more difficult to gauge than Kai but the point is, I am actively trying. Especially since excess weight on her is even more detrimental to her mobility with her current issues.


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

Apex used to look like Kia and Hunty. Shoot maybe he is getting chunky 🤔.
His body has changed alot in the last year which I thought had to be reaching full maturity. I'm finding it difficult to determine now.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

Apex1 said:


> I'm finding it difficult to determine now.


Do you have other fit shepherds around you? I usually use the other stock coat shepherds at my club as examples to compare Kai's body shape to when I am not sure about her condition.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

I think it’s unrealistic to expect the same tuck in older dogs as they used to have in their younger days. They do fill out and become stockier, and abdominal muscles weaker with age.


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## CatMan900 (May 24, 2018)

My dude is 3 1/2 and weighed 79lb last year at the vet. It’s hard to tell with him Bc his coat is so poofy. He runs sprints every single day so I know he’s in top shape. He has a lot of muscle on him. I feed him 3 times a day. Intact. I think whether they are spayed/neutered can affect it as well. After I got my cat spayed she got really fat.Vet said that's a normal thing apparently....


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

GSD07 said:


> I think it’s unrealistic to expect the same tuck in older dogs as they used to have in their younger days. They do fill out and become stockier, and abdominal muscles weaker with age.


That is so true. My senior dog is still muscular but her shape has changed. We keep thinking she’s gained weight because she looks thicker from the side but she hasn’t. Everything has settled, kind of like with people and her chest is deeper with less tuck toward the rear.


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## Dunkirk (May 7, 2015)

Squidwardp said:


> Of those posting here, how often do you feed your adult dogs?
> 
> Twice a day? Three times with smaller portions?


Because of Nitro's medications, twice a day. When he's been very unwell and off his food, it has happened that he's been served breakfast in bed.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Bodies are always changing from and should not be expected to be the same as their young teen skinny all rib years into there senior years. Weight is a battle for many as pets age as with people for various reasons. Last week - max almost 7.5 and Luna almost 5.5 years of age. They both eat 3 cups once a day. A snack or two. There is much more exercise in fall , spring and summer for myself and the dogs.


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

I agree that excess weight is a definite health issue and many people I know that love their dogs to death literally do it.







have no idea how much my dog weighs but I try to keep him fairly lean.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

GSD07 said:


> I think it’s unrealistic to expect the same tuck in older dogs as they used to have in their younger days. They do fill out and become stockier, and abdominal muscles weaker with age.


Absolutely. They simply just won't look the same and they withstand the same level of exercise. What that means though is we then need to adjust our fitness and weight goals/expectations accordingly. I dislike hearing people use their elderly dogs' age as an excuse for why the dog is obese. Not factoring in health issues that may cause a bloated appearance, they can still adjust their calorie intake and (for the dogs who can still move around) get them moving. Why make age anymore difficult than it already is by strapping them down with weight?

Editing to add that I believe this is why weighing your dog semi-regularly is a good idea, especially with elderly dogs. It can be harder to track what is age changing their body, what is muscle loss, and what is weight gain.


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

@Jenny720 thank you for the pictures and post. I see more of Apex's structure in Max and Luna (who look lovely BTW 😍). It is difficult getting used to how they fill out and become solid. Not a skinny teen any more.


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## Gwyllgi (Aug 16, 2017)

I had reduced my 4 year old bitch's diet as she was having morning diarrhoea. She ended up going to the vets and had blood work done, she was low in B12 and folate. 

I increased her food to get her weight back up but now I need to reduce it slightly, because a little porker just walked passed me. She could do with losing a couple of pounds.

She is 25" at the withers and weighs approximately 66-68lb































Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Apex1 said:


> Zephyr who is 24" at the withers about. About 14-15 months old. Weight 63 pounds. I think is to skinny. I can feel and see his spine and see his hips to well. Eating 2lbs raw total
> View attachment 583481
> fed 2x per day.


I can't see ribs or spine. He looks athletic. Is he intact? He will fill out more the next two years.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Apex1 said:


> @Jenny720 thank you for the pictures and post. I see more of Apex's structure in Max and Luna (who look lovely BTW 😍). It is difficult getting used to how they fill out and become solid. Not a skinny teen any more.


Thank you. Your boys are very handsome. I like seeing the different structures and all the differences. I like the filling out phase it should not be rushed but it’s my favorite phase! It can take a 3 years for a dog to fill out.


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

@wolfy dog it's not the best picture I should have tried harder. In better lighting you can really see his ribs, spine and hip bones. They are starting to show less. We have had him about 4 months. I can't believe how much he has grown. Gained some good muscle too. 

He is super athletic very agile. Wish i was more experienced he would be awesome at just about anything. Fun easy dog, biddable handler sensitive, settles very easy and learns really fast. Can you tell I adore him? Lol 

He is intact. 

I'll eventually cut him back on food once he gets a bit more coverage on those bones.


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## Saintgsdny (11 mo ago)

Sunflowers said:


> Those of you who are familiar with my posts know that I have a problem with fat German Shepherds, and that I’m not afraid to tell people that they need to take some weight off their dogs.
> 
> Not only does excess weight cause stress on the heart, lungs, joints, etc., but it shortens the lives of these dogs, and they already have short enough lives as it is.
> 
> ...


So glad you posted this. I started comparing my 67lb (13 months) with the other Gsd in my neighborhood and thought my dog was too slim. My 9 month old neighbor's gsd is already 90lbs! And folks kept saying he needs to eat more. But he always stops when he's done. And I don't give him junk. This was refreshing. I think my do looks great


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

Saintgsdny said:


> So glad you posted this. I started comparing my 67lb (13 months) with the other Gsd in my neighborhood and thought my dog was too slim. My 9 month old neighbor's gsd is already 90lbs! And folks kept saying he needs to eat more. But he always stops when he's done. And I don't give him junk. This was refreshing. I think my do looks great
> View attachment 583515


he’s a very pretty dog and his body appears age appropriate for his build. he’s a fine boned dog and will not carry excess weight as “well” as a more solidly built dog. so i’d keep a close eye. mine is the same. for being close to 70lbs…. he must be very tall? neutered?

love his coloring.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

CEMC said:


> I agree that excess weight is a definite health issue and many people I know that love their dogs to death literally do it.
> View attachment 583506
> have no idea how much my dog weighs but I try to keep him fairly lean.


Without trying to step on toes, he looks kinda pudgy, too round 🧐


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Saintgsdny said:


> So glad you posted this. I started comparing my 67lb (13 months) with the other Gsd in my neighborhood and thought my dog was too slim. My 9 month old neighbor's gsd is already 90lbs! And folks kept saying he needs to eat more. But he always stops when he's done. And I don't give him junk. This was refreshing. I think my do looks great
> View attachment 583515


Your dog looks fantastic.
Don’t listen to the “feeders.”
I wouldn’t change a thing.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

wolfy dog said:


> Without trying to step on toes, he looks kinda pudgy, too round 🧐


Sorry CEMC, I thought the same when I saw the pic


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

Im doing all I can to keep my 2 yr old GSD on the lean side. I don't know his weight but I think he's good right where he is at. Two meals/day raw meat mixed with some kibble.


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## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

I think Bailey can be very so-so when it comes to his weight/looks. He was last weighed in January, at 86lb. All these pictures were taken in the last two weeks. He’s a year old.


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## cagal (Sep 3, 2013)

Baileyshuman said:


> I think Bailey can be very so-so when it comes to his weight/looks. He was last weighed in January, at 86lb. All these pictures were taken in the last two weeks. He’s a year old


It can also be body type - my trainer said Django could lose a few then touched him and changed her mind as you can clearly feel ribs. He’s a bit fluffy and a “big German block” in the rib cage as she put it lol. But he’s only about 72 lbs.


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

WNGD said:


> Sorry CEMC, I thought the same when I saw the pic


Not a problem at all. Perhaps the picture isn't the best angle to show his tuck but I wouldn't call him "pudgy" like the other poster (the one that claims he/she doesn't like to step on toes, but does anyway, lol) . We all have our idea of what a slim dog looks like. Some think he could lose some more weight but personally I wouldn't want him any slimmer. Maybe a better picture will help my case.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

CEMC said:


> Not a problem at all. Perhaps the picture isn't the best angle to show his tuck but I wouldn't call him "pudgy" like the other poster (the one that claims he/she doesn't like to step on toes, but does anyway, lol) . We all have our idea of what a slim dog looks like. Some think he could lose some more weight but personally I wouldn't want him any slimmer. Maybe a better picture will help my case.


As long as you're conscious of it and happy with his body condition it's all good. If they have tons of energy and eating well it's all good.

My vet is a bit of a "granola" and would be brutally honest with me about my dogs. I'll be interested in hearing what she has to say about Rogan if we ever get in person again.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

CEMC said:


> Perhaps the picture isn't the best angle to show his tuck but I wouldn't call him "pudgy" like the other poster (the one that claims he/she doesn't like to step on toes, but does anyway, lol) . We all have our idea of what a slim dog looks like. Some think he could lose some more weight but personally I wouldn't want him any slimmer. Maybe a better picture will help my case.


I'm going to be that person for a moment to defend the other poster. This is, in fact, a thread about dogs being slim. So posting a photo of your dog (or any of us posting photos of our dogs) is an invitation for discussion about the fitness of the dog in the photo. So I would not really call their comment stepping on your toes. I would agree from the photo that I would want the dog a little slimmer but that's my own preference and I will fully admit that there is no real way to fairly judge based on one photo alone. Especially a far away photo and of a dog with a nice dark coat like yours has. You know your dog best


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## Hopps (Dec 5, 2021)

For reference here is Fern the pork chop dog. She is very well known for her incredible magic trick, she can make her neck disappear. She is reach a more normal size as of late. We care approaching -5lbs. And obviously for comical effect I picked the worst pictures. They’re hilarious.

Edit: Before anyone freaks out, Fern was adopted from a high kill shelter. When she came into my home she was hitting almost 80lbs. Last time we weighed her about a week ago, she was at 76~lbs or so. She is on her way to losing all the weight.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

Just for general conversation, I tend towards categorizing weight into 4 areas

1. Underweight
2. Athlete (lean with muscle)
3. Pet weight (maybe muscle, not really lean, maybe a little extra padding but nothing concerning. It varies with the pet and the home)
4. Overweight

There are shades of grey within that but when it comes to fitness, I tend to give some grace when it comes to the two middle categories. Just as I don't expect myself to be in the same shape compared to my triathlon brother, I don't expect a typical household pet to be the same shape as a sport/working dog or a dog living in a high intensity home (or with someone who really prioritizes pet fitness).


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

Wunderwhy6 said:


> So I would not really call their comment stepping on your toes.


Hey, I'm good all around with all of this but I don't think the other poster needs your defense because I did not offend them. Secondly please be aware that the person that described their comment as "stepping on toes" was the original poster, not me. I was merely repeating it as part of my response. Finally I have no problem at all with critiques as long as they are cordial and constructive. Calling someone's dog "pudgy" is a little offensive and the original poster knew it which is why right from the start described their comment as "stepping on toes".


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

CEMC said:


> Finally I have no problem at all with critiques as long as they are cordial and constructive. Calling someone's dog "pudgy" is a little offensive and the original poster knew it which is why right from the start described their comment as "stepping on toes".


Hi, it's the"offending" poster here. I agree with WW6. I am surprised that I offended you by an honest opinion based on the picture you posted. The "stepping on toes" comment was meant with a 😉, and I never could have thought that it would be offensive. How else should I have worded it without you being upset? Geez, nowadays every difference of opinion seems to be offensive.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

CEMC said:


> . Calling someone's dog "pudgy" is a little offensive and the original poster knew it which is why right from the start described their comment as "stepping on toes".


Oh, for cryin’ out loud.
Really?
Really?
This is a forum about DOGS.
We post because we try to do what’s best for them.
That means, sometimes, putting your sensitivity aside.

This is why people are reluctant to call it out. 
And this is why I started this thread in the first place.


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

_throws a tennis ball in a distraction attempt_ Fetch!


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

CEMC said:


> Hey, I'm good all around with all of this but I don't think the other poster needs your defense because I did not offend them. Secondly please be aware that the person that described their comment as "stepping on toes" was the original poster, not me. I was merely repeating it as part of my response. Finally I have no problem at all with critiques as long as they are cordial and constructive. Calling someone's dog "pudgy" is a little offensive and the original poster knew it which is why right from the start described their comment as "stepping on toes".


And this is what and why the OP started this thread.

“Yet time and again, when I alert owners on this board, after sometimes consulting in private with other GSD owners, who agree with me, what I get is a lot of “the vet says he’s fine “ and many more pictures of the same dog, still looking fat. Oh, and silence from members here, who either also have chunky dogs, or are just unwilling to tell the owner of the truth.”


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

People are more likely to take helpful criticism when it's delivered with kindness as opposed to hostility.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

dogma13 said:


> People are more likely to take helpful criticism when it's delivered with kindness as opposed to hostility.


It’s ironic though don’t you think? I don’t see any hostility, just “to the point” comments.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

dogma13 said:


> People are more likely to take helpful criticism when it's delivered with kindness as opposed to hostility.


Correct.
It becomes a problem, however, when any criticism is considered “hostility.”


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Don't let it become a problem by hitting back.You all are intelligent and articulate enough to be diplomatic and take the high road.
There are 2k hits on the thread.The information is getting out there.


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## Ringhram (Sep 4, 2021)

We need input on this topic. Please feel free to be blunt. 

Thena is apparently going through the 9 month old "food is yucky" phase. We considered supplementing (_not _replacing) her food with a freeze dried brand to give her a bit more enjoyment, but I later discovered through this forum that reduced food consumption is a fairly typical event when the rapid puppy growth slows. I have noticed that she is also starting to fill out a bit. She still has a defined waist, and we can still feel ribs, but notwithstanding the reduced food consumption her shape is changing. 

What do you all think? Is this normal development, or are we headed in the wrong direction? Hare are a few pictures. If they are not sufficient or are too blurry from Thena's perpetual motion, I would be happy to try to obtain better snapshots.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

@Ringhram , she looks great.


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## Ringhram (Sep 4, 2021)

THANK YOU!!! That is a relief! 😅


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## Ringhram (Sep 4, 2021)

We tremendously appreciate this forum and all your collective wisdom. 😁


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


Haha, you should go back and read in the conformation forum the embarrassing story of Scarlet being a fat girl at the dog show. Ooooops.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

dogfaeries said:


> Haha, you should go back and read in the conformation forum the embarrassing story of Scarlet being a fat girl at the dog show. Ooooops.


lol for a second i thought you wrote confrontation forum 🤣


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

Fodder said:


> lol for a second i thought you wrote confrontation forum


Confrontation. Conformation. Sometimes it feels like the same thing, lol.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

Sunflowers said:


> It becomes a problem, however, when any criticism is considered “hostility.”


Building off of this topic... It seems that as a general population, people tend to project their own insecurities and feelings onto their dogs. So much so that for many people, criticism towards their dog feels like criticism towards them as a person. Especially if it is an often-times more touchy topic like weight. I have met a LOT of people lately who seem to have forgotten that no matter how much they love their dog and incorporate it into their life, their dog is still a dog.

Edit to add another thought: Not to mention that if we as people can't seem to figure out how to discuss non-personal matters without it often turning contentious, how much more difficult will it be to discuss and constructively criticize on more personal matters?


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## davewis (Jan 7, 2020)

This seems like a weird thread....

I know people mean well, but how much can you really tell about a German Shepherd from a photo in winter. My boy doubles in size when the snow starts to fall. It is like trying to guess if a person is skinny, fit, or fat when they are wearing a puffy jacket and snow pants.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Motivation never comes with the words of fat or chubby. Especially when used and in one photo in the winter brings to mind something else. 

My friend showed Dobermans they always had to be on top condition before a dog show no exceptions. Another shows swissies in shows they are always in top shape a very well muscled powerful dog as they mature. Labrador and another gsds - all incredibly fit and in best of shape. A good show handler would not have it any other way.


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## ksotto333 (Aug 3, 2011)

WNGD said:


> Notice there's not a single person on this thread saying their dog is fat


oh Della is, we had gotten her down before but she's edged back up. We had already started cutting her back. She just has never been as active as Tessa was or Becca is.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

wolfy dog said:


> Hi, it's the"offending" poster here. I agree with WW6. I am surprised that I offended you by an honest opinion based on the picture you posted. The "stepping on toes" comment was meant with a 😉, and I never could have thought that it would be offensive. How else should I have worded it without you being upset? Geez, nowadays every difference of opinion seems to be offensive.





Saphire said:


> And this is what and why the OP started this thread.
> 
> “Yet time and again, when I alert owners on this board, after sometimes consulting in private with other GSD owners, who agree with me, what I get is a lot of “the vet says he’s fine “ and many more pictures of the same dog, still looking fat. Oh, and silence from members here, who either also have chunky dogs, or are just unwilling to tell the owner of the truth.”


There’s a couple things here. First, there’s the fact that someone may not want nor care for your opinion on something. I tend towards not offering advice or opinions on things not asked. That’s a personal preference. The same way an opinion can be offered, it can be disregarded. This thread sounds like a lot of “I’m offended because these people don’t listen to what I say or care for what I have to say.” The next two, which kind of go together are you can’t say something blatantly offensive and try to pass it off as well meaning, and often times people here don’t have the relationships they think they do to say certain things. If a good friend you work with says something, it will come off very different than some random person walking up to you and saying it. That other part, saying something offensive and trying to pass it off as well meaning doesn’t make it not offensive. If I called you or your child pudgy, you wouldn’t like it. A lot of people throw rocks and hide their hands. You can’t take shots and be surprised when someone fires back.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

davewis said:


> I know people mean well, but how much can you really tell about a German Shepherd from a photo in winter.


If you go back to the original post, I believe the intention was to discuss why we are seeing so many overweight GSDs, as well as the angry responses often given when someone points out that their GSD is overweight (and the major health implications of it). The issue is not limited to this forum alone but to any time you see an overweight GSD. You are right though, one photo on a forum can't do anything justice. That is why it is up to the individual whether or not to post a photo, what photo to post, and whether or not to accept or ignore criticism (or provide a better photo).


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

Bearshandler said:


> You can’t take shots and be surprised when someone fires back.


That's very fair. Part of the issue (at least for myself) is that I tend not to realize that what I said could be described as taking a shot until I get a reaction 💀 Especially in topics like these, where everyone's experience is so different. I grew up with the idea that weight (while a big part of overall health) is just a number, not any sort of a reflection on myself as a person. Consequently, hearing my dog (or me haha) is underweight or overweight is more of a "huh, better take a second look at them and double-check"


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Then imagine that you struggle with your weight, from childhood, and finally lost some and feel so good in your your body and a person comments ‘Oh, dont want to offend you but you look pudgy on that Xmas card of your family you sent us this year, you need to do something about it, more exercise maybe, eat less for sure’. If you get overjoyed and thank the person profusely for drawing attention to your pudgy body and expert advice then you are a much better person than I am.

Same with dogs. CEMC handled it well, said he’s trying all he can and is happy with his dogs condition (I actually agree with him, big bone solid dog with plush coat) but ppl came back with “How dare you are offended, your dog is so pudgy, Think about the dogs! We only want to help your dog because dogs are not people so you should not feel anything when we judge your dog otherwise you are a fur dad. ” Constructive criticism indeed.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

GSD07 said:


> ..... Constructive criticism indeed.



I understand what you are saying, and I am going to add that for going forward, I am trying to take the conversation off of CEMC. I already acknowledged that they know their dog best vs me seeing a photo. 

The point of the general thread though seems to be finding ground between saying "your dog is great!" when they aren't to spare feelings vs telling someone "your dog is too fat" (which I would be fine with but obviously that will rattle people). At some point, someone needs to say something, otherwise I believe we are just enabling an unhealthy state. Even vets won't always mention weight to spare 'feelings'. Again this has nothing to do with CEMC or their pup, its a general statement.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

Wunderwhy6 said:


> I understand what you are saying, and I am going to add that for going forward, I am trying to take the conversation off of CEMC. I already acknowledged that they know their dog best vs me seeing a photo.
> 
> The point of the general thread though seems to be finding ground between saying "your dog is great!" when they aren't to spare feelings vs telling someone "your dog is too fat" (which I would be fine with but obviously that will rattle people). At some point, someone needs to say something, otherwise I believe we are just enabling an unhealthy state. Even vets won't always mention weight to spare 'feelings'. Again this has nothing to do with CEMC or their pup, its a general statement.


I don’t believe we “need” to say anything. Keeping someone’s dog healthy is the vet’s job. They get paid by that person to keep the dog healthy. You don’t have to say you like something you don’t. Take me for example. There are plenty of times here I let things go. You can just say nothing. You all also need to consider the venue. Public shaming rarely comes off well to anyone.


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## Finn'sLegacy (Oct 14, 2021)

This was such a helpful post. Our dog Asher has been very thin (with ribs showing). We had a time with giardia and trying to get his digestion stable, so we were worried that it was affecting his ability to gain weight. Also my husband kept telling me he's too skinny and to increase his food. I kept telling him GSD"s are supposed to be skinny. I just showed him the vintage pictures and read him the post. He agreed the dogs looked great.
But, now Asher has a shoulder injury. He's been forced to rest and he is filling out. So I think he was more active than we realized with all the fetch and runs and walks before he got hurt. Currently he's 8 months old and 55 lbs. I was worried because charts say he should weigh about 67. But he's a small framed dog, so I think he's perfect now. At least he seems to be in good place weight wise. I really want to keep him at this (fa-zeek) (blanked out on the spelling here's the pronuciation). I hope his shoulder heals well so he can get back out there. In the meantime I wont panic if I have to reduce his food to maintain his body structure.
I


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Wunderwhy6 said:


> Building off of this topic... It seems that as a general population, people tend to project their own insecurities and feelings onto their dogs. So much so that for many people, criticism towards their dog feels like criticism towards them as a person. Especially if it is an often-times more touchy topic like weight.


I will also add that people get defensive because they do not want to hear, “You are not taking good care of your dog.”


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

I guess it comes down to the person I am. I’m open to criticism so I can improve whatever that criticism is. I’ve had people I respect and/or love tell me I’ve done something I could or should have done differently. My circle of people are comfortable calling me out, it’s made me a better person. I don’t get offended, I make the changes needed.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Saphire said:


> I’ve had people I respect and/or love


I don't think random people on the internet giving unsolicited advice are the same as 'ppl I respect and love'.



Sunflowers said:


> I will also add that people get defensive because they do not want to hear, “You are not taking good care of your dog.”


 Of course they don't and they shouldn't because this is judgemental and very often not true so it's hurtful. 

I often run into a guy with his dogs on my walks. His dog is a shepherd/beagle mix I think, very nice. In the last year I have noticed the dog started getting bigger and bigger and became very obese. I said nothing, just pet the dog, told her how sweet she was. After a couple months the owner shared that he had spinal surgeries, one after another, with difficult recovery, it's hard for him to walk but he does it for the dog. He goes to the dog park so she could run. He said he took her to the vet and they found no health problems that can cause her gain weight.

He asked what food I feed my dog that he stays thin. I told him my feeding regimen, the food name, the place I buy it from - Petco, he wrote down the food name. He shared he feeds Natural balance Fat dogs food, and mixes chicken breast into the food. I mentioned that he may skip the chicken breast. I showed the treats I give my dog and gave him some to try for his dog. I pet his dog every time I see her, my dog also loves to meet the guy and his dog. She's looking a little better, I tell the guy his a great owner. Because he is. 

That's how I interact with fat dogs and their owners I encounter.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

OK, this thread went from “GSDs are supposed to be slim” to “don’t tell me my dog is fat, it hurts my FEELINGS.”

I can’t tell you how frustrating this is for me.

We are here to exchange information on how to best care for our dogs, not to tiptoe around each other and be afraid to give advice.

All sorts of people post here.
Take the advice or don’t, but I strongly disagree with being afraid to post something because someone will get offended.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

I hope those people who decide others are not taking care of their dogs are actually taking care extremely good care of themselves, otherwise it’s most interesting. I suppose it takes great skill to help someone without criticizing. If they want to actually help make a difference- this is key.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Jenny720 said:


> I hope those people who decide others are not taking care of their dogs are actually taking care extremely good care of themselves, otherwise it’s most interesting.


I think many of us take better care of our dogs than we do of ourselves.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

It is just as important.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Jenny720 said:


> It is just as important.


This has nothing to do with this thread.
I don’t understand the point you’re trying to make.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Then many of those become ill and the dog goes to the shelter.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

GSD07 said:


> I don't think random people on the internet giving unsolicited advice are the same as 'ppl I respect and love'.
> 
> Of course they don't and they shouldn't because this is judgemental and very often not true so it's hurtful.
> 
> ...


I think it’s the opposite, people I don’t know or care about can say anything to me, I will listen but it definitely doesn’t hurt my feelings. It’s the people I respect and love that could easily hurt me, not the opposite. That’s just me.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

GSD07 said:


> Then many of those become ill and the dog goes to the shelter.
> View attachment 583637


I see two creatures eating convenience food.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Exactly - it happens all the time.


GSD07 said:


> Then many of those become ill and the dog goes to the shelter.
> 
> exactly my point -
> View attachment 583637


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

GSD07 said:


> Then imagine that you struggle with your weight, from childhood, and finally lost some and feel so good in your your body and a person comments ‘Oh, dont want to offend you but you look pudgy on that Xmas card of your family you sent us this year, you need to do something about it, more exercise maybe, eat less for sure’. If you get overjoyed and thank the person profusely for drawing attention to your pudgy body and expert advice then you are a much better person than I am.
> 
> Same with dogs. CEMC handled it well, said he’s trying all he can and is happy with his dogs condition (I actually agree with him, big bone solid dog with plush coat) but ppl came back with “How dare you are offended, your dog is so pudgy, Think about the dogs! We only want to help your dog because dogs are not people so you should not feel anything when we judge your dog otherwise you are a fur dad. ” Constructive criticism indeed.


How does this apply? We can’t compare human emotions to that of our dogs. Are we now saying our dogs feelings get hurt when someone gives criticism?


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

I have said all I wanted to say.
If this thread continues the way it’s going, I’m sure it will be closed.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Sigh... Yes, I have as well. Leaving to take my dog somewhere so he stays fit. Thank you.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Sunflowers said:


> I think many of us take better care of our dogs than we do of ourselves.


That is true for meMy dog's diet and exercise is prioritized above my own.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

dogma13 said:


> That is true for meMy dog's diet and exercise is prioritized above my own.


Yep same here


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Sunflowers said:


> I see two creatures eating convenience food.


Now that was just funny.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

WNGD said:


> Now that was just funny.


Is it wrong that now I want some ramen noodles?


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

I think if we posted a bunch of stickies on how to tell if your dog is skinny, over weight or just right.

Then we could post a link and say "remember to make sure you know were your dog is at and feed accordingly"

That then leaves it up to person to eval the dog in front of them and we haven't said one way or the other what we think of their dogs weight.

Also if someone asks about their dogs weight or what do you think, they should not get offended at honest answers.

Although if my wife asks about her hair cut I know to ease into my honest opinion instead of just being brutally honesty to start 😳

There are a lot of "is my dog to skinny posts", I even question it myself at times since my girl will skip meals.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

This is actually a really good thread. It's just that people that need to rethink about what is a healthy weight for their dogs won't rethink if it's demanded of them.Encouragement is more effective.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

My last two cents: I responded to the picture based on the topic of the thread. In it I suggested we all post a picture of our dogs to see if we can get feedback of their body condition. I posted a picture of Deja, acknowledging that she needed to shed about three pounds. So I assumed that every picture posted was to get honest feedback from the poster. No where in my mind did I expect the thread to to derail like it did.
The tail of this thread sure has made me hesitant to offer advice. I guess we are all winners.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

If a person lives a healthy lifestyle often the dog lives one as well or at least they are aware when their dogs are not at the best weight, shape.

i just remember someone coming up to me once and told me my King Charles was fat. This lady said lady your dog is Fat made pig sounds at her. Said it was real unhealthy she was concerned. Some stranger off the street - and yes bella was for many reasons overweight. Many people feeding her treats, she was a low energy dog , thyroid etc and it was a struggle trying to get weight off her but it was a constant goal. I was out walking with her in the town to get her exercise with the kids. It was rude and that’s all it was. She was in no position -If I turned around and told her the same thing just using the same words as if I was “trying to help her” I wonder what she would of said - would she have said thank you” lol. It was weird but amusing at the same time. This thread reminded me of it.

Encouragement is always more effective if wanted.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Jenny720 said:


> If a person lives a healthy lifestyle often the dog lives one as well or at least they are aware when their dogs are not at the best weight, shape.
> 
> i just remember someone coming up to me once and told me my King Charles was fat. This lady said lady your dog is Fat made pig sounds at her. Said it was real unhealthy she was concerned. Some stranger off the street - and yes bella was for many reasons overweight. Many people feeding her treats, she was a low energy dog , thyroid etc and it was a struggle trying to get weight off her but it was a constant goal. I was out walking with her in the town to get her exercise with the kids. It was rude and that’s all it was. She was in no position -If I turned around and told her the same thing just using the same words as if I was “trying to help her” I wonder what she would of said - would she have said thank you” lol. It was weird but amusing at the same time. This thread reminded me of it.
> 
> Encouragement is always more effective if wanted.


My Schipperke is fat right now. Yes she is hypothyroid and getting the right dose of meds has been up and down. I know I’ve got it under control and will get there. I’ve heard multiple times from people “wow she doesn’t miss any treats does she?”, “oh my she must be older eh?”, blah blah. I agree with them and carry on. I mean I really don’t care if they comment, I’m not hurt not upset.
Seems I’m in the minority with this subject and that’s also ok. I will simply go back to not taking part in threads where my opinion could be taken as hurtful.

Perhaps there we have the answer to the title of this thread Sunflowers.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

@Saphire The advise is Saphire - if your going to give advise- at all- do it in a way that is actually helpful. I really don’t think walking up to someone’s pet just because you feel they need to hear your opinion is conductive. Take that advise however you want.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

Saphire said:


> I think it’s the opposite, people I don’t know or care about can say anything to me, I will listen but it definitely doesn’t hurt my feelings. It’s the people I respect and love that could easily hurt me, not the opposite. That’s just me.


i’m the same way, but the internet is a big place… so i think we have to remind ourselves that online relationships are all some people have and wether we agree or not, people come here seeking that community, acceptance, validation, etc. i’m sure i’ve pointed out things that i’ve found alarming before (a few lbs isn’t enough to step out of my lane), and especially being aware that it’s unsolicited, i try to be tactful about it. if i get a ton of justification and push back, i have no problem leaving it alone. what i don’t agree with is “welcome to the forum, btw your dog is fat”.


dogma13 said:


> Is it wrong that now I want some ramen noodles?


do it!
toss the seasoning packet and add 1tsp crunchy peanut butter, 1tsp brown sugar, 1tsp soy sauce, 1tsp chili paste… garnish with chopped green onions and a squeeze of lime.
you’re welcome 😂


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Chili paste,hmmm.....here's a pic from my pantry.I'm not that creative,usually just throw in random veggies. When my son was stationed in South Korea he sent me a photo of an entire aisle of Ramen in the local grocery store.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

dogma13 said:


> Chili paste,hmmm.....here's a pic from my pantry.I'm not that creative,usually just throw in random veggies. When my son was stationed in South Korea he sent me a photo of an entire aisle of Ramen in the local grocery store.


i came across it as a joke while discussing CA housing prices… saying the most googled phrase in the bay area is probably “top ramen hacks”. but then i actually made it!


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

I think people often hide rude comments behind the word “honesty.” I’m a firm believer in the statement if you start by or end by saying I don’t mean this to be rude or disrespectful, you’re saying something you know is rude and disrespectful. It’s like people want it both ways. They want free reign to say whatever they want to people, but they don’t want people say anything back or have any type of negative feelings about it. If I had some tough advice for someone, I wouldn’t choose a public forum as the first place to say something like that.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

This thread is fascinating. It’s made me think even more about what I want for my dogs and their health. I don’t seem to get too upset at random comments by anyone, unless someone is trying to manipulate me into doing something I don’t want to do. That is more likely to happen in person than on a forum. So in some ways, I don’t understand being hypersensitive about a dog’s weight. The most obese dogs I’ve known weren’t fat because their owners didn’t care. It was more that they didn’t understand feeding, nutrition and exercise for their breeds. A few cups a day of dry kibble doesn’t seem like much and neither do treats to a dog from the kitchen when fixing meals, but either or both can cause obesity.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Jenny720 said:


> @Saphire The advise is Saphire - if your going to give advise- at all- do it in a way that is actually helpful. I really don’t think walking up to someone’s pet just because you feel they need to hear your opinion is conductive. Take that advise however you want.


I’ve not ever said we should be walking up to people in the streets to give advice. As I said, I from here in out will pick and choose what threads I participate in so as not to hurt feelings.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

I have a rule. Don't ask me questions unless you want an answer. So if someone comes on a public forum and asks a question, I just naturally assume they want an answer. 
But further to that, I like dogs. People not so much. So if I need to hurt your feelings to give your dog a chance, so be it.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Saphire said:


> I’ve not ever said we should be walking up to people in the streets to give advice. As I said, I from here in out will pick and choose what threads I participate in so as not to hurt feelings.


I have always liked your advice. Please don’t stop!


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## Hopps (Dec 5, 2021)

Bearshandler said:


> I think people often hide rude comments behind the word “honesty.” I’m a firm believer in the statement if you start by or end by saying I don’t mean this to be rude or disrespectful, you’re saying something you know is rude and disrespectful. It’s like people want it both ways. They want free reign to say whatever they want to people, but they don’t want people say anything back or have any type of negative feelings about it. If I had some tough advice for someone, I wouldn’t choose a public forum as the first place to say something like that.


I used to be exactly like this when I was younger. Chronic "honestly..." or "im not trying to be mean BUT" advice giver. I quickly learned that I was not "keeping it real" or whatever. I was just being tactless, undiplomatic and severely lacked the proper communication skills. Even though I had valuable insight and things to say, my peers found it difficult to see the message past my awful communication style. It took a long time for me to understand that the quality of information does not matter if you can't properly communicate it. 

Then there was another issue of not being able to take it when I dish it. There were often times where I was right but if someone provided feedback or matched my style of talking, I got pissed and upset. Lots of headbutting and arguments later, I sincerely learned that I was not entitled to a good response, especially if I was being a jackass. And if I spoke in that manner despite being right, it just makes me look aggressive, unprofessional and quite frankly very ignorable.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

Hopps said:


> I used to be exactly like this when I was younger. Chronic "honestly..." or "im not trying to be mean BUT" advice giver. I quickly learned that I was not "keeping it real" or whatever. I was just being tactless, undiplomatic and severely lacked the proper communication skills. Even though I had valuable insight and things to say, my peers found it difficult to see the message past my awful communication style. It took a long time for me to understand that the quality of information does not matter if you can't properly communicate it.
> 
> Then there was another issue of not being able to take it when I dish it. There were often times where I was right but if someone provided feedback or matched my style of talking, I got pissed and upset. Lots of headbutting and arguments later, I sincerely learned that I was not entitled to a good response, especially if I was being a jackass. And if I spoke in that manner despite being right, it just makes me look aggressive, unprofessional and quite frankly very ignorable.


This is truly the lesson I see in this thread.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Saphire said:


> I’ve not ever said we should be walking up to people in the streets to give advice. As I said, I from here in out will pick and choose what threads I participate in so as not to hurt feelings.


Saphire whose feelings do you think you hurt exactly and what have you said to make you think this. My response was answering your comment as to what this thread is about. As I was referring to the the poster who started this thread which is about telling strangers that their dog is fat. They seem to think this is some grand act of generosity as if something grand is being accomplished. This how the thread started. This is what the entire conversation has been about in the last few pages. I suppose I hurt your feelings in my response to the thread.


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## kigers24 (May 24, 2016)

davewis said:


> This seems like a weird thread....
> 
> I know people mean well, but how much can you really tell about a German Shepherd from a photo in winter. My boy doubles in size when the snow starts to fall. It is like trying to guess if a person is skinny, fit, or fat when they are wearing a puffy jacket and snow pants.


Mine does this also in the snow. Nashoba looks very different in the snow about 3 weeks ago. He really puffs out. But the indoor top view with his coat flat last week he looks very different. Also a top view verses a side view is different. 
He is a large boned 30" tall blocky built GS which is perfect for my needs. He is my Mobility assistance Service Dog.
He is a 6 year old raw fed intact male.
I can feel his ribs when running my hands down his sides but I don't want to be able to see them. 🐾🐕‍🦺


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

If someone asks me their opinion or for advice, I'll give it to them. I don't go out of my way to comment on other dogs in a negative way. We go to a lot of dog parks and meet a lot of dogs. I always try and find something nice to say back if someone compliments Valor. I don't lie, but I'll say she's a sweet girl or something if the dog is fat.

A couple times, people have said that if Valor is what a GSD should look like, their dog is fat. I just said that I feel he's a healthy weight and that I have a working dog background.


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## SMcN (Feb 12, 2021)

Bearshandler said:


> I don’t believe we “need” to say anything. *Keeping someone’s dog healthy is the vet’s job.* They get paid by that person to keep the dog healthy. You don’t have to say you like something you don’t. Take me for example. There are plenty of times here I let things go. You can just say nothing. You all also need to consider the venue. Public shaming rarely comes off well to anyone.


Oh, Bearshandler, I sooooo disagree with that statement. I am late to the party here and got seriously behind in reading, so haven't finished the thread yet. Maybe somebody else has said something here. But there is no way that we consider our vet to be in charge of our dog's health, weight, care or feeding. Yes, there may be and are exceptions to what I am about to say, BUT these (vets) are people who push vaccines, push kibble and canned food products, and do not necessarily know anything about nutrition. Our vet and her clinic are wonderful people, but I do not/would not trust their word as final say on many topics. My neighbor has an absolute horror story re care of her dog when he ingested something that became a blockage. If she had not stood her ground, against the recommendations of *three* vets, her dog would be dead.
We are responsible for our health and weight. WE are responsible for the health and weight of our dogs.


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

I have skipped over a few pages of this thread. I find that if people don't ask for advice they don't want to hear it. If they do ask for advice, sometimes it is just to confirm what they already thought. Sometimes they are ready to listen. Jesus had a parable about that. In His story I think one out of 4 people actually took to heart the message he was preaching. So this is an issue that spans the centuries. 

I cringe when I see an over weight dog, especially a young one. Sometimes older dogs are harder to keep fit. One of my old gals, many years ago, put on extra weight even though I walked her and she actually was eating less. Most likely she might have had something else going on besides just fat. She's the only one who had trouble with weight and that was at the end.


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

David Winners said:


> If someone asks me their opinion or for advice, I'll give it to them. I don't go out of my way to comment on other dogs in a negative way. We go to a lot of dog parks and meet a lot of dogs. I always try and find something nice to say back if someone compliments Valor. I don't lie, but I'll say she's a sweet girl or something if the dog is fat.
> 
> A couple times, people have said that if Valor is what a GSD should look like, their dog is fat. I just said that I feel he's a healthy weight and that I have a working dog background.
> 
> View attachment 583682


Oh my goodness, it would be very hard for me to not come up to you with a "Mr, Can I Pet Your Dog" even though I know better.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

SMcN said:


> Oh, Bearshandler, I sooooo disagree with that statement. I am late to the party here and got seriously behind in reading, so haven't finished the thread yet. Maybe somebody else has said something here. But there is no way that we consider our vet to be in charge of our dog's health, weight, care or feeding. Yes, there may be and are exceptions to what I am about to say, BUT these (vets) are people who push vaccines, push kibble and canned food products, and do not necessarily know anything about nutrition. Our vet and her clinic are wonderful people, but I do not/would not trust their word as final say on many topics. My neighbor has an absolute horror story re care of her dog when he ingested something that became a blockage. If she had not stood her ground, against the recommendations of *three* vets, her dog would be dead.
> We are responsible for our health and weight. WE are responsible for the health and weight of our dogs.


That’s a straw man argument. I never said you weren’t responsible for your dog’s health. That’s asinine. I don’t even know how you made that jump. If you don’t think a vet’s job, their career, is to keep animals healthy, then I don’t think we have enough in common to have the conversation.


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## SMcN (Feb 12, 2021)

Bearshandler said:


> I don’t believe we “need” to say anything. Keeping someone’s dog healthy is the vet’s job. They get paid by that person to keep the dog healthy. You don’t have to say you like something you don’t. Take me for example. There are plenty of times here I let things go. You can just say nothing. You all also need to consider the venue. Public shaming rarely comes off well to anyone.


Bearshandler, I have read many of your posts and gained insight through them. Maybe I misinterpreted what you meant by "Keeping someone's dog healthy is the vet's job." To me, in that statement, you were bypassing the owner's responsibility as the main and sometimes sole caregiver. How and what they are fed is not the vet's job. How and what they are fed directly correlates to their health. There have been many examples by posters where evidently the vet said something like "he/she's fine" or "when they are neutered/spayed they are going to gain weight". Neither one of those statements may be or is true.
This whole thread was started as a way of getting a message out there over the chronic situation of overweight dogs, specific to GSDs. It is a valid point to make. Overweight and obesity, both for humans and animals, directly affects their health.
It was further suggested to post pictures of posters' dogs. By doing so, *IMHO*, this was inviting critique. Sometimes that means opening yourself up to something you don't want to hear. But by posting the picture, you are accepting that possibility. This is called 'discussion' and what forums are all about. When posting it IS difficult to not come across blunt. But I will say anyone who has participated in forums should know that and try to take that into account.

Personally, I may not want to hear something, but I sure as heck hope if somebody sees something in one of my posts that is questionable, be it in health or training, I hope they don't hold back and at least ask about it.


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

SMcN said:


> There have been many examples by posters where evidently the vet said something like "he/she's fine" or* "when they are neutered/spayed they are going to gain weight".* Neither one of those statements may be or is true.


This is, admittedly, anecdotal, but I've noticed that a dog is much more likely to balloon out after being "fixed" even when on the same amount of food and exercise as before. It's not something that happens EVERY time but nearly in my personal experience. So it makes sense for a vet, who likely sees this happen even more than I do, to give said advice.

What I took the statement that vets are paid to keep a dog healthy is not that the vet is directly responsible for the dog's care but more is meant to tell the OWNER how to keep their dog healthy and warn them when something is wrong, then tell the owner how to fix it. Obviously no vet is going to come to my house every day to pour the food in my boy's bowl. But the vet should tell me what foods or types of food to avoid, what kind of exercise my boy needs, whether there's any kinds of activities I need to AVOID with him due to some health concern or other. Whether to feed him more or less food. Etc...


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

I think it is also building a relationship with a vet. A vet is less likely to be direct with new unknown customer and much more likely with known customer who except advice, asks question and doesn't get testy. 

We used the same vet for many years with multiple dogs. During one visit he said, she's putting on weight you need to work on that. It happened slowly over time and I hadn't noticed until he said that. It was 3 to 4 pounds over ideal on a 42 pound dog.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

SMcN said:


> Bearshandler, I have read many of your posts and gained insight through them. Maybe I misinterpreted what you meant by "Keeping someone's dog healthy is the vet's job." To me, in that statement, you were bypassing the owner's responsibility as the main and sometimes sole caregiver. How and what they are fed is not the vet's job. How and what they are fed directly correlates to their health. There have been many examples by posters where evidently the vet said something like "he/she's fine" or "when they are neutered/spayed they are going to gain weight". Neither one of those statements may be or is true.
> This whole thread was started as a way of getting a message out there over the chronic situation of overweight dogs, specific to GSDs. It is a valid point to make. Overweight and obesity, both for humans and animals, directly affects their health.
> It was further suggested to post pictures of posters' dogs. By doing so, *IMHO*, this was inviting critique. Sometimes that means opening yourself up to something you don't want to hear. But by posting the picture, you are accepting that possibility. This is called 'discussion' and what forums are all about. When posting it IS difficult to not come across blunt. But I will say anyone who has participated in forums should know that and try to take that into account.
> 
> Personally, I may not want to hear something, but I sure as heck hope if somebody sees something in one of my posts that is questionable, be it in health or training, I hope they don't hold back and at least ask about it.


It’s not answering questions that are asked that is the issue here. It’s about the delivery. “Is my dog overweight?” “Yes, your dog is overweight.” That is a reasonable answer. “Your dog is pretty porky. You should definitely cut back on food. If you cared about your dog, you’d never let them get like that. It’s ridiculous.” That is an answer that goes way overboard, but is in line with what I see here. Both of those answers can come off as rude when the question was never asked. I knew wolf was being cheeky about it. It’s not that I had a problem with her comment. My point is if I saw something going on with someone’s dog that concerned me, I would address it in private, not try to publicly shame them. It’s not the message that I have a problem with, it’s the delivery. It’s also the fact that some of the posters here are the same ones that take criticism and disagreements well. I will leave that at that because I don’t want to make it too personal. As for your comment, I don’t like when people take my words out of context or try to extrapolate some meaning that has nothing to do with what I said. I understand you probably didn’t mean to do that. I didn’t take responsibility from the owner. I did say strangers on the internet weren’t responsible. If it was ever that bad, animal control is a phone call away in most places.


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## Honey Maid (Dec 25, 2020)

Since 1983 when I got my first dog as a 'real' adult, all my dogs and cats have been spayed/neutered, none of them have become overweight. Let me count.............15 dogs and 14 cats, of those 15 dogs I currently have 4, and the 14 cats I have 2. The ones I no longer have all died of old age, or old age related diseases, except the male Great Dane, who passed away at 6 years old of an Autoimmune disease, actually it was the meds he was on I believe, for the autoimmune problem. I had a Grand Doggie I ended up with, a female Great Dane, she lived to be 13, never had any medical problems. Mr Oskar will be getting snipped middle of March.

All of them ate the CostCo brand dog/cat food, with some canned Pedigree mixed in with the dogs food. Now, that I refuse _*to pay*_ CostCo for the _privilege_ of shopping there, all my dogs get Diamond Naturals All Life Stages Chicken, that's what Oskar's breeder recommended, and it's available at the local feed store, and it's cheaper than Chewy, which surprised me, as I had been purchasing it from Chewy. Since I've always had a 'pack' of dogs, except when I had just my female Chesapeake, but I took her out on the trail with me when I rode my horse, maybe that keeps them in better shape, they romp and play with each other, and, I've plenty of property for them to run their little hearts out.

We have some friends that have severely obese dogs, it's heartbreaking. They had 3 JRT's, or JRT mixes, that were severely obese, that all passed away. They went to a local rescue and got a JRT mix and a Mini Pin mix, dogs looked great when they first got them, now those dogs are severely obese. No amount of talking to these people does anything, and I'm sure their Vet has spoken to them also, but it falls on deaf ears.

Just my 2 cents


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

car2ner said:


> Oh my goodness, it would be very hard for me to not come up to you with a "Mr, Can I Pet Your Dog" even though I know better.


A lot of people ask, and I let most of them. He could really care less most of the time. He does give an occasional kiss to little kids. 

Hank the Cane Corso gets most of the attention though.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

I usually do not come over to random dogs asking to pet but there was one dog that I just could not help myself and had problem letting the dog and owner go lol This was a standard hairless xolo (xoloitzcuintli.) named Hank! I still remember that dog, years later. Sorry for the off top…


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

GSD07 said:


> I usually do not come over to random dogs asking to pet but there was one dog that I just could not help myself and had problem letting the dog and owner go lol This was a standard hairless xolo (xoloitzcuintli.) named Hank! I still remember that dog, years later. Sorry for the off top…


I love the look of those dogs, I did look for breeders one afternoon but only saw what I call BYB in cali. Here's the pic that got me looking.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Their skin is like smooth velvet to the touch, and hot! The dog I met had red skin, like this one. He was slim and fit, aloof but approachable just like a shepherd.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Imagine checking in at 2 AM, expecting GSD pics, and seeing this face 😂


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

I stumbled upon this old thread.
Lots of great pics there.
@David Winners ’s photos can’t be seen, unfortunately.









Anyone have photos of fit/muscular GSDs?


I am looking for photos of German Shepherds who are very fit/muscular. Does anyone have a photos of dogs that are in great shape or know where I can find some photos? I am trying to show what it looks like when a GSD is in very good body condition (lean/muscular) versus "regular" or "average"...




www.germanshepherds.com


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## Honey Maid (Dec 25, 2020)

GSD07 said:


> I usually do not come over to random dogs asking to pet but there was one dog that I just could not help myself and had problem letting the dog and owner go lol This was a standard hairless xolo (xoloitzcuintli.) named Hank! I still remember that dog, years later. Sorry for the off top…


Interesting, I'd only seen, and known about, the 'toy' variety, didn't know there were 3 different sizes.


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## Honey Maid (Dec 25, 2020)

Saw this pic, with hair on the tail, almost seems like they have an alopecia


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

Name means Dog of the gods, blood line dates back to the Aztecs. Some have the Mohawk, some are completely hairless. The standard full size has less hereditary health issues than the smaller ones. I could not find what I thought was good breeder north of the border.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

I just can't....looks like a bigger Chinese Crested. My son's MIL breeds these monstrosities


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

@drparker151 I have contact info to a good breeder if you are interested. I met them a few years back at a dog show so not sure if they are still in business. Loved the dogs, incredibly stable and friendly and beautiful as well.


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## MeishasMom (Nov 12, 2021)

Meisha had a vet appointment yesterday and weighed in at 61.1lbs at almost 8 months. Vet said she looked good at the weight. What do you guys think? Trying to get a good topline picture was a little difficult as the coyotes were yipping so she wouldn't stand still very well. I will say on a sidenote she tested positve for Lyme Disease so is being treated with antibiotics.


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

GSD07 said:


> @drparker151 I have contact info to a good breeder if you are interested. I met them a few years back at a dog show so not sure if they are still in business. Loved the dogs, incredibly stable and friendly and beautiful as well.


Thanks we moved on to GSDs, our girl is 20 months now and we will picking up a male pup at the end of the month. We were only interested in the full size version, there were a lot more breeders of the smaller ones.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

MeishasMom said:


> I will say on a sidenote she tested positve for Lyme Disease so is being treated with antibiotics.


Ugh health issues coming up are never fun. Hopefully the treatment goes well 

From above she looks good to me. Is there anyway you could get a photo of her standing from the side? And can you feel her hip bones or is that just my tired eyes?


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

On a related note to this all...for anyone reading through this thread, feed the dog what it needs based on the dog in front of you, not based solely on the amount recommended on the back of the bag.


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## MeishasMom (Nov 12, 2021)

Wunderwhy6 said:


> Ugh health issues coming up are never fun. Hopefully the treatment goes well
> 
> From above she looks good to me. Is there anyway you could get a photo of her standing from the side? And can you feel her hip bones or is that just my tired eyes?


Her fur is kind of odd that it doesn't lay flat all the time which gives the illusion that things stick out. If you stand over her and run your hands down either side with a little bit of pressure you make out her ribs and her hips, but nothing protrudes out. After having to deal with an obese horse I am constantly looking Meisha over to make sure she doesn't get overweight, but is being feed correctly so she isn't underweight either. I'll take better pictures tonight.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

MeishasMom said:


> Her fur is kind of odd that it doesn't lay flat all the time which gives the illusion that things stick out. If you stand over her and run your hands down either side with a little bit of pressure you make out her ribs and her hips, but nothing protrudes out. After having to deal with an obese horse I am constantly looking Meisha over to make sure she doesn't get overweight, but is being feed correctly so she isn't underweight either. I'll take better pictures tonight.


While not terrible, it does sound like she could lose some weight and be fine. It sounds like what I would describe as pet weight. You’re not killing her or anything, but if she’s active she’d probably be better off a little smaller.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

MeishasMom said:


> Meisha had a vet appointment yesterday and weighed in at 61.1lbs at almost 8 months. Vet said she looked good at the weight. What do you guys think? Trying to get a good topline picture was a little difficult as the coyotes were yipping so she wouldn't stand still very well. I will say on a sidenote she tested positve for Lyme Disease so is being treated with antibiotics.
> 
> View attachment 583742


this dog looks perfectly fine and very age appropriate.
good for your vet!


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## MeishasMom (Nov 12, 2021)

Bearshandler said:


> While not terrible, it does sound like she could lose some weight and be fine. It sounds like what I would describe as pet weight. You’re not killing her or anything, but if she’s active she’d probably be better off a little smaller.


Thank you Bearshandler. She is the first GSD I have owned and I want what is best for her. She is active daily and I know my husband wants to dabble in agility this Summer.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Super difficult to take pictures of black GSDs.
Here is 2 1/2 year old Rolf. Has a shadow of rib happening.

This boy eats 2 lbs of raw per day 😳


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## Réa538 (Mar 25, 2021)

Kathrynil said:


> Oh yah.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've seen that video and it's good overall. One of the dogs in the video is noticeably too thin. You shouldn't be able to see a dog's ribs when the are walking around. Yes, there are a lot of fat dogs that should lose some weight...but if you can see a dog's ribs from far away when it's walking....he needs to put on a few pounds. #feel the ribs without much effort, but they shouldn't be prominent.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Yeah, you shouldn’t see a xylophone 😃
A slight shadow of rib is ok.


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

As of right now, all 8 of our dogs are at a good weight, except out little hound mix Iris, she got pudgy before her spay so now we have to take it easy, plan to start bikejoring with her again to help her lose a couple pounds.

Charlie is probably our most fit, mostly due to the fact he's so big and because he'll be doing some intense sports in the future. He lacks a lot of muscle mass still because he's so young, but i'm quite happy with his condition right now, trying to keep him light as possible.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

David Winners said:


> A lot of people ask, and I let most of them. He could really care less most of the time. He does give an occasional kiss to little kids.
> 
> Hank the Cane Corso gets most of the attention though.


He’s getting smooshy kisses from me


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## ArkAngel (Jan 5, 2011)

1 year old intact male, 24.5” 60lbs, thoughts?


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

He could stand a couple pounds IMO, don't wanna see obvious spine or ribs, especially just walking around, other than that he looks really nice, beautiful dog.


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## ArkAngel (Jan 5, 2011)

peachygeorgia said:


> He could stand a couple pounds IMO, don't wanna see obvious spine or ribs, especially just walking around, other than that he looks really nice, beautiful dog.


Having a hard time getting him to put on weight, hes been on Orijen Amazing Grains for 2 months 2450kcal/day


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

In my personal experience, it's really hard to get intact dogs to put/keep on weight for the first few years, especially if they're active.


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## ArkAngel (Jan 5, 2011)

Rabidwolfie said:


> In my personal experience, it's really hard to get intact dogs to put/keep on weight for the first few years, especially if they're active.


30 min per day of sprinting about 250’ back and forth

Gonna try a mid grade food, same one breeder feeds the adult dogs and see how he does.


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

Here nice shot of our 22 month old with her shaved belly after a spay. Really shows what is meant by tummy tucks up on slim athetic dog without that long belly hair to get in the way.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

ArkAngel said:


> 1 year old intact male, 24.5” 60lbs, thoughts?
> 
> View attachment 587401
> 
> ...


I don't mind those ribs from the side at that young age and the view from above is good but I don't like the spine profile, dog could use a few pounds but you're already feeding significant calories. Either find a more calorie dense food or cut down on the calorie outlay (while still being active). Sometimes it takes 18 months to fill out, been there with my last male but he was 100 pounds by a year


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

I just yesterday posted a video on here of my 11.5 year old, intact female who has multiple health issues. While she lacks a bit in the muscle tone department she is fit and active and a decent weight. To my mind she is a bit heavy but people keep disagreeing. 
I on the other hand am the heaviest I have ever been and for the first time since I was about 10, I cannot run a mile.


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## ArkAngel (Jan 5, 2011)

WNGD said:


> I don't mind those ribs from the side at that young age and the view from above is good but I don't like the spine profile, dog could use a few pounds but you're already feeding significant calories. Either find a more calorie dense food or cut down on the calorie outlay (while still being active). Sometimes it takes 18 months to fill out, been there with my last male but he was 100 pounds by a year


What do you mean by the calorie outlay?

I thought the Orijen was high at 490/c x 5c

Switching to Kirkland Lamb/Rice at 393/c prob gonna shoot for 6c


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

I know I've heard some good things about InukShuk, it's pretty calorie dense so you don't have to feed as much.

I have the same struggles with my super active intact male, finally got his spine not to show, now only his last couple ribs are visible.


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

peachygeorgia said:


> I know I've heard some good things about InukShuk, it's pretty calorie dense so you don't have to feed as much.
> 
> I have the same struggles with my super active intact male, just finally got rid of his spin showing, now only his last couple ribs show.


Feeding that to my girl who is a picky eater and would skip meals. It is 578 kcal per cup.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

I don’t see a spine, I see wavy hair…. @ArkAngel can you confirm one way or another?


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## ArkAngel (Jan 5, 2011)

Fodder said:


> I don’t see a spine, I see wavy hair…. @ArkAngel can you confirm one way or another?


Wavy hair for sure, can feel spine though


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## Donkenall (2 mo ago)

Went to a Mondioring competition last weekend. OMG! The Belgian Malinois dogs were super fit! Lean and strong, Healthy and happy.


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## WVNed (4 mo ago)

What a sickly anemic looking bunch of dogs


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

WVNed said:


> What a sickly anemic looking bunch of dogs


Sarcasm right?


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## WVNed (4 mo ago)

not sure I want my dog to make me look fat when I walk him


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

I was an athlete in very serious competition most of my youth and I can tell you without any doubt that there is a huge difference between a body that is slim and lean as result of a lot of activity and one that is slim and lean as result of lack of food. 

I do not condone starving a dog in order to make him look like one that is truly worked and exercised. It is not the same and does not generate the same health benefits.


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## Shefali (Aug 12, 2020)

My dog weighs 120 pounds. YIKES! Except, he is at most a few pounds overweight. Here is a photo of him:










I think he needs to lose a few pounds. That means diet more than exercise.


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## Rabidwolfie (Apr 9, 2021)

I freefeed this handsome stud. Everyone else I know with dogs only feeds them once a day and they're all fat. They tell me I need to feed him MORE. Going on 3 years of this nonsense. He even gets a tin of sardines once a week. I don't think he's underfed, I think he's still perfect.


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

Shefali said:


> I think he needs to lose a few pounds.


I think he looks great!


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## SMcN (Feb 12, 2021)

CEMC said:


> ... there is a huge difference between a body that is slim and lean as result of a lot of activity and one that is slim and lean as result of lack of food.
> 
> I do not condone starving a dog in order to make him look like one that is truly worked and exercised. It is not the same and does not generate the same health benefits.


I don't believe you can starve a dog and make him look like one that is "truly worked and exercised". Emaciation looks entirely different than fit and lean, as you stated.

I have not seen pictures of the Malinois in question. Will have to "go Google". I love seeing a fit animal perform at their best.


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## SMcN (Feb 12, 2021)

Rabidwolfie said:


> I freefeed this handsome stud. Everyone else I know with dogs only feeds them once a day and they're all fat. They tell me I need to feed him MORE. Going on 3 years of this nonsense. He even gets a tin of sardines once a week. I don't think he's underfed, I think he's still perfect.


He certainly looks great to me. Just can detect a few ribs and distinct muscling. Beautiful lad!


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## SMcN (Feb 12, 2021)

Shefali said:


> My dog weighs 120 pounds. YIKES! Except, he is at most a few pounds overweight. Here is a photo of him:
> 
> View attachment 594253
> 
> ...


I agree with @CEMC . At least from the angle of this picture your pup looks wonderful.


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## WVNed (4 mo ago)

I think I would ask my vet if my dog was overweight before having people judge from pictures on the internet.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Shefali said:


> My dog weighs 120 pounds. YIKES! Except, he is at most a few pounds overweight. Here is a photo of him:
> 
> View attachment 594253
> 
> ...


Snowy is it? Must be quite tall becuase he doesn't appear over weight at all. Is he a cross, I forget.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

WVNed said:


> I think I would ask my vet if my dog was overweight before having people judge from pictures on the internet.


But where's the fun in that?


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## Shefali (Aug 12, 2020)

WNGD said:


> Snowy is it? Must be quite tall becuase he doesn't appear over weight at all. Is he a cross, I forget.


No, according to his papers he is a pure bred white GSD. However, his sire was about 110 pounds.


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## Shefali (Aug 12, 2020)

WNGD said:


> Snowy is it? Must be quite tall becuase he doesn't appear over weight at all. Is he a cross, I forget.


Oh, and he IS quite tall! I think he's beautiful but because of the risks of stress to his joints, I am going to follow my vet's advice and have him lose a few pounds.


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