# My 10 month old GS has been attacked help



## Alisova (Apr 25, 2016)

It started at 3 months at the vet a 9 month old boxer got loose from owner attacked my puppy, went to training that night told trainer she put her in pen with other puppies she cried the puppies came at her. Started to over come her fear, I have PTSD and we were accepted into a program for military and civilians with PTSD for service dog training. First evening a handler had her and a veteran did not have control of his aggressive shepherd and she attacked my puppy twice the screech and she peed on floor. Trainer new she had been attacked before did not want me to go to her she did not want me to be associated with dogs and attack. I stuck with both programs, making slow progress came into to training two weeks back my pup Bailey calm we did a great controlled entrance walked past a black GS who was laying down next to his owner. We walked past the black GS attacked but did not reach us but the bark and growl set my dog back. I reached out to a trainer who said she's damaged born that way dogs don't attack for no reason! Give her back to breeder or get rid of her! Called breeder he said she's emotionally traumatized and he would need to evaluate her then he could fix her but has no idea how or cost or length of time it would take. I also reached out to another trainer that we go to she did 2 puppy training classes beginner and advanced I then enrolled her in flex training there. One time last after her last attack she was in waiting room barking I was told she's upsetting the other dogs to wait outside. So we did and when we came in we ended up behind a dog who's owner said my dog is dog aggressive move back so we did she said further! The last time I came late so we did not have to wait once again behind a different dog who's owner said my dog is dog aggressive move back.
I take Bailey for walks, she gets upset just smelling another dog, I take her to park she's fine she will swim play ball inside closed tennis courts playing ball or frisbee. I have her work time when she has her vest on and her play time. I have a run in my back yard to play ball too. 
The breeder has cancelled our scheduled visits 4 times! I use positive reinforcement, she knows the word gentle means just that and try to use it when she sees other dogs. When I first decided to get another GS I have had 4 over the years and where all American GS. This one was a German bred and I made 5 trips to breeders the one I knew from the beginning was not the one we took home. No doubt a switch and bait he was too anxious to have us leave he never let us hold her he put her straight down on floor. After reading the papers and her behavior was not calm and passive but hyper and seemed anxious. I questioned breeder because the bitch who he kept saying was her mother was not the one on the papers. We have come a long way but her fear of dogs only started after her first attack. I'm at a loss and need some guidance
Thank you for reading this
Allison


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Some dogs can be targets. Being either fearful or fearful combined with really submissive can cause some dogs to react to her. If you plan on keeping her, I'd stay away from classes that crowd you in with other dogs and concentrate on the two of you working together at a distance from other dogs where she's just aware that other dogs are around, but she can be comfortable and pay attention to you. Over time, ideally the distance can be lessened and she can relax, but I'd always keep enough space to keep her from being targeted by some other dogs. As she relaxes you may find some other calm indifferent dogs that she'll be fine with, but I'd let that go for a while.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

where are you located at? maybe someone can recommend a trainer.


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## Alisova (Apr 25, 2016)

I'm located in Connecticut


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## Alisova (Apr 25, 2016)

Steve thank you I have tried this to but maybe not enough
She's is so sweet and wonderful and smart! I also have systemic lupus and she's so in tune to me. I will do what you suggested we have made progress in past 
Thank you


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Distance and patience will help you Allison. Never mind all the stuff about "fixing" things in an hour. Make it easy for you and give it the time you both need. That way you can relax and enjoy her while you work with it.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Well first I want to say so sorry that a "Boxer" started this cycle, obviously that owner is not on "Boxerforum" or I'd have run across them and it would not have been "good!" 

I'm not really understanding how this can be a "Breeder" problem myself?? Not say it's not just saying I don't see it. With my dogs my first puppy Stewie APBT/Boxer got "targeted" once. My American Band Dawg Gunther got targeted once, I was not on seen but no contact in both cases. And my Boxer Struddell never had a single "event." 

So that brings me to my OS WL GSD ... yeah ...he seems to be a Stray Dog Magnet??? So far 7or is it 9 "attempts" on him thus far?? I lose count thus far all have persuaded to move on without any "actual contact." It's kinda odd but what are you gonna do??

Hmmm .... that's actually a rhetorical question, here are a few things members have suggested to deal with "stray dog encounters.":
http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...-if-another-dog-attacks-your-while-leash.html

It sounds like you kinda sorta did not know this could happen?? I don't put a lot of faith in other dog owners myself, that kinda helps. 


Moving on ... the PO thing yeah that mostly would have worked out fine, still can ...but now your dog has "issues" and trainers with that particular bend ... are not going to be to much help to you?? Right now you need to restore your dogs faith in you and cookies and treats ...aren't going to get it.

Trainers that can help you look more like this:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/7589889-post13.html

Not in conflict with "Steve's" advice just gonna expand on it. And to be "clear" your dog does not have to associate with other dogs, he only has to learn to be "civil" around them. "Sit on the Dog" and "The Place Command" would be how you would get there, you do "Sit on the Dog" and "Train" the "Place Command." Eventually your dog will be able to do those things in the "Presence" of other dogs without "losing his cookies" as it were. At some point after lots of work on them ... out could start to do them "Outside" the confines of a Dog Park, if you want to "Proof" him. Or don't that's your call.  

In anycase see here:
Fearful, Anxious or Flat Crazy "The Place CommanD - Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums

That would be the "foundation work" and for more on "teaching your dog to ignore other dogs ..." see here:
Teach your Dog to ignore other dogs.  - Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums

I don't think you need to contact the "Breeder" for this?? You only need a plan and now "I think" you have one?? As always ask questions and welcome aboard ... sorry it's been a bumpy ride thus far.


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## Alisova (Apr 25, 2016)

Thank you everyone 
One trainer told me that there is something wrong with her to be constantly attacked.
She is a very smart puppy 
She has good skills , she knows a control entrance, sit, down, heel, leave it, and when I say with me she is right there. Being her first spring lots of new sites and sounds and she has done very well. 
Today I took her out with her service training gear, we went to stores, a walk, as soon as she saw a dog she would get upset, barking pulling. Instead of having her walk past these dogs who were pulling their owners I gave her correction had her sit, leave it and let them walk past. After about 5 dogs she started to just sit but being on guard but the barking, hair up stopped. Her reward was service dog training gear off and off to lake for a swim. I have a 20ft lead, when we first got there tons of ducks and geese but again command leave it, good watch. They all left she went swimming. Coming home a dog in car next to us she started barking growling - gave her correction and to leave it. We made strides before to point we could go to dog park, after 3rd attack we would pull in to a dog park and she was out of control. I would like her to play with other dogs never fear them. We have been to stores, malls and restaurants and she was fine. Even leavng the children who were in mall play area. Initially the mannequins were something she wanted to touch smell and realized not human left them. 
I have workers at my house power washing doing outside repairs at first she started barking took her out she met workers smelled the machines etc and was fine. So why can't it be like that with dogs?
I have her playtime and service dog work time but to see her at the park playing with other dogs or not always in fear, 
The breeder said she's emotionally traumatized and the one trainer said she was damaged at birth 
Thank you again
Best


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Your dog does not "need" to play with other dogs, she only needs "you." In anycase the same process would help her get over her issues but you can't control other dogs, if you put in her in a Dog Park surrounded by unknow dogs ...you have no control, crap happens.

Two articles here "Dog Park" warning and "Three Dogs Who Should Not Be At A Dog Park" why look for trouble??

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/5296377-post8.html

And for the record ...sigh I have to state also ... "that most attacks occur close to home" Rocky and I ...yep sure enough all 7 or 9 close to home??? Still ... why look for trouble.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I'm really sorry you and your dog have gone through all this. I hate to be a party pooper but you really should not be using this dog in a harness (working capacity as a SD) if she is not stable around other dogs.

If I were you I would not allow this dog to work if she loses her head when she sees a other dog. If you encountered another working team you could endanger that person if your dog acts out at the other dog. Service dogs have a much higher standard of behavior they have to adhere to, and if she acts like that in harness she is making service dogs look bad & potentially scaring people.

Pull her off duty and work on the problem with a competent trainer who has a neutral dog to work off of at a distance. If she recovers and overcomes this put her back to work.

Again very sorry this happened, I know what a blow it is not to be able to use your working partner, I am retiring mine


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

PS as far as multiple attacks, well...after the first one she was probably scared and the other dogs were picking up on it. Repeat victimization, canine edition


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## Alisova (Apr 25, 2016)

She does not attack other dogs she fears them. At mutts mending heroes they take shelter/abused dogs. When we are in training she is fine she's on guard and at my feet, we can do a meet and great, she's fine! When we are on the trails or parks or if a dog is barking in a car next to us is when she has issues. She's been evaluated by two certified service dog trainers for PTSD and they feel she can overcome this in time. Again we have made progress and then out of no where another dog attacks her, so we end up stepping back and starting all over! A trainer told me she was damaged from birth and that's why dogs attack her! 
I believe Steve and Chips advice along with an eval from breeder are the steps I need to take!


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

Well, I am glad you are making progress and I genuinely hope that you do completely overcome it but based on your description, I completely stand by my opinion that this dog should not be working right now.

Only about two months ago a dog lunged at mine while she was working in harness. We were walking into a building. I successfully intercepted the other dog, dropping my dog's leash in the process. She stood perfectly still, did not even bark or posture, waited while the other owner came and got that dog from me and waited for me to pick back up her leash and harness handle. I basically threw myself at the other dog to protect mine. Luckily I did not get bitten. I didn't handle it especially well, my dog however did.

I have had a bichon that I strongky suspect was a fake service dog lunge at mine yapping. I asked for that dog to be removed since it was violating service dog ettiquette but the business was too afraid to intervene so my dog had to turn the other cheek as it yapped.

I totally understand that your dog is afraid and not attacking, but a german shepherd putting on a barking display is a sight to see (fearful or not) & is not acceptable behavior for a service dog or service dog candidate.

What woukd your dog do under these circumstances? These are things that we encounter, along with well behaved legitimate working teams.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

And by the way I totally understand the predicament and how hard it is, because coincidentally I also have a 10 month old sd candidate who is currently not practicing in his vest because he barked inappropriately. He was not wearing his vest when it happened, he was just being a pet, but nonetheless I know that the environmental trigger that brought it on could easily happen when he is vested and training and that's not a chance I am willing to take.

A couple more months of good behavior out of him I may reconsider. But as hard as it is, I am still retiring my old gal because she is having health issues and it is time. The youngster is currently shelved due to the barking. 

I am working very hard with him, take him out as frequently as I can and dealing with the issue but not in his vest and not using public access accommodation.

GSDs aren't always the easiest to train for this type of work...but I do believe blow the others out of the water when they make it.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Alisova try not to get offended. 

Thecowboysgirl, has some very outstanding insight here ... obviously from the been there done that perspective as I see it. I know there are others on here that do "service dog stuff" and most likely they would fully agree with her. Your plan going forward would still be the same "Place and Sit on the Dog" work on closing the distance to other dogs. Your dog needs to have her confidence in you restored and that will take some time.

Recognizing good information when you see it also a part of the process, those things I outlined ... I learned on here (Baillif) I just "packaged them" up for folks. 

We all want you and your dog to succeed!


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Thecowboysgirl said:


> Well, I am glad you are making progress and I genuinely hope that you do completely overcome it but based on your description, I completely stand by my opinion that this dog should not be working right now.
> 
> Only about two months ago a dog lunged at mine while she was working in harness. We were walking into a building. I successfully intercepted the other dog, dropping my dog's leash in the process. She stood perfectly still, did not even bark or posture, waited while the other owner came and got that dog from me and waited for me to pick back up her leash and harness handle. I basically threw myself at the other dog to protect mine. Luckily I did not get bitten. I didn't handle it especially well, my dog however did.
> 
> ...


Well I'll say ... outstanding job! :laugh2:

Seems to be the year of the rouge little dogs?? Rocky and I have had to counter a suicidal ****z Tzu twice and the same rough ill behaved Poodles three freaking times!!! 

I should get a T-Shirt that says *"Control Your Freaking Dog A-Hole!!"* Preemptive strike as it were. 

At anyrate Job Well Done there.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Chip18 said:


> Thecowboysgirl said:
> 
> 
> > Well, I am glad you are making progress and I genuinely hope that you do completely overcome it but based on your description, I completely stand by my opinion that this dog should not be working right now.
> ...


Year of the rouge little dogs- well titled. Last summer we all at the beach there was tiny maltipoo- I'm not sure whAt it was (size of a small Guinea pig) cute though looked like a crazed dust ball -shoot out of tent unleashed heading right for max. Who he kind of laughed at this little guy as I veerd him off with a sneeze. The owners still laying down on their stomachs and just laughed at their little monster. I might just get that t shirt it may head off any trouble. I understand things happen but to watch and laugh and do nothing about it people are nuts.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

It must be a geographic thing. I don't remember coming across any loose, red dogs.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

It sad your dog had these bad experiences with other dogs. I hope you can overcome the issues time will tell but agree with the cowboys girl. My dog had one bad experience as a pup with a dog which I don't think caused his dog reactiveness but mostly genetics- he is not dog aggressive -he barely nipped by moms dogs Nose once to keep her away. He has the ability to put on a huge show. I do worry though if he had a bad experience with another dog he may become dog aggressive. My friends shepherd growing up -was mauled by our neighbors three legged dog as a puppy . it was pretty bad. She was always good with dogs though after that.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Steve Strom said:


> It must be a geographic thing. I don't remember coming across any loose, red dogs.



I think so we have plenty of woods in our areasand people may be lax. At of all the years though of having dogs there only has been a few times but last summer/fall - has been the most and with small dogs whom the owners just seem very laxed and unconcerned- even entertained.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I live in a very dog friendly part of New England. The dog I threw myself at had gotten away from its owner, and was a bully mix to boot. I was ready to take one for the team.

I second everything Chip said about wanting you and your dog to succeed, and hoping you aren't offended. My saying I don't think the dog should be out in "harness" (it is too young for harness but you know what I mean). Is not a judgment on your ownership, handling, intelligence or anything else. Unless you have ten years studying service dog training, laws, public access rules and etiquette and working with many different dogs during that time, partnered with my own dog for 8 yrs, which is my story (and I am light years away from what I would call an extremely experienced service dog trainer or anything of the sort). I know a little about it. But unless you happened to have that background some of the possibilities might not occur to you, that's all.

If I came off nasty I honestly apologize, it wasn't intended that way.

And just for good measure something I DIDN'T say for fear of sounding like a know it all or lecturing (too late, whatever might as welk take the plunge)...some of the things you stated your previous trainers said or did really made me wonder how competent they were? Maybe it isn't a fair representation of them and maybe I am just wrong, either is entirely possible.

Finally, if I seem overly passionate about it, I am, because people parading fake service dogs around is causing quite a disturbance right now. That isn't what you are doing, but unfortunately the burden is on us legitimate folks to conduct ourself above reproach, perhaps even more so those of us with invisible disabilities whcih make us targets for people assuming our dog is "fake". The ADA was designed the way it is to make it easier for a disabled person to get much needed help but since selfish, ignorant pet owners (NoT YOU, OP!) Are abusing the loophole, the rest of us are soon going to have to adhere to stricter rules, national certifications ect which just makes life harder for us.

So, sincere best of luck to you, I hope you get your dog straightened out and have a terrific partner for many years.


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## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

Not knowing where everyone who has been posting is located I will speak from the U.S. side.

A ten month old GSD should still be considered a Service Dog Candidate or at the most a Service Dog-In-Training. At ten months they are still going through the training that a well-trained companion GSD goes through. They are working on obedience -- foundation through advanced. They are learning to behave on leash around other dogs. Handlers need to stay very alert and make sure that unknown leashed dogs are not allowed to approach.

In an obedience class dogs are there to learn obedience and handlers should be aware and keep space between their dog and others. Class instructors have an obligation to make sure that all handlers are aware that they must keep dogs properly distanced from each other. They also have an obligation to make sure that aggressive dogs are not allowed near other dogs. Some instructors have special classes (private) for aggressive dogs and some will require a muzzle on that dog before it leaves its car and until it is back inside of its car.

So much that I read really makes me wonder about the quality of knowledge in those trainers that you went to. As to "certified" SD trainers I would want to know who did the cetification on these trainers. In most cases these are trainers who may have been trained working with pet dogs and certified through some organization at that level. Others may have been "certified" through their employers which is what ever their in-house requirements are. So don't let them stating they are "certified SD trainers" sway you in choosing a trainer. 

At this point, out in public I would only be working my pup as you would any pet dog. Don't put the added stress on him or yourself in trying to prepare him in public for a career as a SD. Those lessons should only be done at home for now. 

Take baby steps. Work on enjoying the two of you going on short walks together. If possible have another adult walk with you for a time or two that is willing to help head off any loose dogs that you may encounter. 

There is so many things going on with a 10 month old GSD. A good trainer or canine behavorist would be wonderful at this time. Again, I'm sorry, but those who were not on top of things at training don't sound like the quality that you need. 

As someone already posted -- your dog doesn't need to be friends/friendly with other dogs, he needs to be civil and have proper manners to work for you.


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