# Need Help with Enzymes/Salmon Oil/Coconut Oil



## Ali B. (Jul 23, 2010)

I'm currently giving both my GSD's Grizzly salmon oil (6 year old and 1 year old). I just started them both on Prozyme this past Tuesday and I want to start them on coconut oil. My question is will I be overdoing it with supplementing them with all three. 

These are the amounts I have them on:


Salmon oil - two squirts per meal (fed 2x day)
Prozyme - 1/2 tsp. powder per meal
Coconut oil - just bought it last night - gave them 1/4 tsp. last night and 1/2 tsp. this morning with their meal
Any help would be appreciated.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Ali B. said:


> I'm currently giving both my GSD's Grizzly salmon oil (6 year old and 1 year old). I just started them both on Prozyme this past Tuesday and I want to start them on coconut oil. My question is will I be overdoing it with supplementing them with all three.
> 
> These are the amounts I have them on:
> 
> ...


What are you feeding this dog fellow NJersian?


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## Ali B. (Jul 23, 2010)

sable123 said:


> What are you feeding this dog fellow NJersian?


 My 6 year old gets Blue Buffalo Large Breed Adult and my one year old is still on Wellness Super5Mix Large Breed Puppy (she actually turns a year old this Saturday).


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Ali B. said:


> My 6 year old gets Blue Buffalo Large Breed Adult and my one year old is still on Wellness Super5Mix Large Breed Puppy (she actually turns a year old this Saturday).


You want my honest opinion? I think you are just wasting your money. Those are high grade foods with more nutrient than 99% of the dogs out there need.

Coconut oil is a working dog fat, like a sled or hunting dog. It is pure energy. It hardly gets digested but sent right to the liver. It will make your dogs fat. They will look and smell good though.

Why spend so much on upper class foods if they need supplementation?

Unless there is some medical condition requiring enzymes then I would return them. If you feed a consistent diet you really don't need them.

Same for fish oil. I think I would only use that for treating joint problems because to date it is the only supplement proven to help.


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## Ali B. (Jul 23, 2010)

Okay, here's what's going on. The baby, Jenna, has many health issues: panosteitis, environmental allergies, recurring yeast infections in both ears. We also have an issue with her eating our other dog's poop. After doing some research and speaking with other people going through similar problems it was recommended to supplement her.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Instead of using salmon oil in conjunction with the coconut oil, I would rotate them. And give (400iu)vitamin E as well.
Natural vitamin C is a supplement that would help with the allergies, it boosts the immune system and also is a natural antihistamine.


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## Ali B. (Jul 23, 2010)

onyx'girl said:


> Instead of using salmon oil in conjunction with the coconut oil, I would rotate them. And give (400iu)vitamin E as well.
> Natural vitamin C is a supplement that would help with the allergies, it boosts the immune system and also is a natural antihistamine.


Should I give her the vitamin E everyday or just on the days I give her the salmon oil? Also, how much vitamin C do you recommend and should it be tablet form or chewable, or doesn't it matter? Sorry for all the questions!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

E is naturally produced by dogs. When you give omega oils(whether it is fish based or the coconut) it depletes the natural supply, so supplementing with e when you give omega's is recommended.
As far as C goes...I start at 500mg and over a week or two up the dosage to 2000mg daily(split between meals). Tye dog may get runny stool with the higher dosage, so slowly getting their gut use to it is important.
If your dog is over a year EsterC is ok, but for pups it does contain calcium so not recommended.
I use human grade supplements for my dogs....

Springtime has buy 2 get 1 free thru the end of the month if you want to use canine specific supplements.


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## Ali B. (Jul 23, 2010)

onyx'girl said:


> E is naturally produced by dogs. When you give omega oils(whether it is fish based or the coconut) it depletes the natural supply, so supplementing with e when you give omega's is recommended.
> As far as C goes...I start at 500mg and over a week or two up the dosage to 2000mg daily(split between meals). Tye dog may get runny stool with the higher dosage, so slowly getting their gut use to it is important.
> If your dog is over a year EsterC is ok, but for pups it does contain calcium so not recommended.
> I use human grade supplements for my dogs....
> ...


This helps alot. Thanks, I appreciate it.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

You are just going to dramatically imbalance the dog's diet in probably the worst way by messing with fat intake.

If you want to go down this road, buy Nupro and see if that helps. Coconut oil will do nothing for the dog's problems. It is used as an quick energy source and for bulking up.

And those enzymes will do nothing for the problems you stated. I think you are confusing enzymes with probiotics, this is common. A good probiotic like Berte's could actually help the ear infections over time.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

I am going to take issue with some comments made about oils and coconut oil .
This is something that I have been using for over 20 , in the last 10 or so was fortunate to be able to upgrade from a culinary coconut oil to a therapeutic form, thanks to Tropical Traditions , Gold Label , the highest lauric acid content available.
This is the oil that I use in my formula for Sh-Emp.

Just the other day when I was making deliveries I was grabbed and gabbed , all the excitement about "coconut oil" . Apparently , (I was told) there had been a seminar with Dr Jean Dodds who was all excited about coconut oil , saying it is the "new" salmon oil.

There are of course different qualities . Organic, hand pressed is much better than expeller and that is better than a chemical extraction.

Coconut oil does not make you fat or bulk you up, quite the opposite as it stimulates metabolism .
Do nothing for problems -- not so . 
Coconut oil does indeed bypass digestion . It does enter the liver through a portal vein, where it is immediately metabolised, sending energy to tired muscles , and to the thyroid, adrenal glands , and liver , of course. So it is a glandular support . One of the reasons Dr Dodds got excited was because of cases of thyroid problems which resolved with adding virgin coconut oil . check it out for yourself. I know this from personal experiene because people have been told of changes experienced with liver enzyme levels in dogs that were put on my supplements. Vet veriable.

Coconut oil is anti microbial , anti fungal , anti bacterial , anti viral and anti diarrheal. It assists in the digestion and absorption of food. 

vitamin C was isolated by Szent Gyorgi in the 1930's . This was the heyday of the new science of food chemistry . We still aren't all the way there but getting better in the understanding. A group of subjects was divided into two groups. Common denominator was bleeding gums, early scurvy , vitamin c difficiency. 
Group one got isolate crystaline vitamin c, group two got vitamin c as part of the total fruit in a dry and brown powder state. Group one did get some healing , enough to make note. Group two had much better results, total healing of gum tissue.
The difference was that the brown powder had rutin and flavinoids , comprising of over 200 compounds. We don't yet fully understand what those compounds contribute or how they support C -- but it made a difference. As I said we are understanding more every year. 

Fish oil -- good --- coconut oil -- good . My formula also has hemp oil -- 

Carmen


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

I should have added that Dr Jean Dodds prescribes it , recommends coocnut oil.
Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

carmspack said:


> I should have added that Dr Jean Dodds prescribes it , recommends coocnut oil.
> Carmen
> Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


Coconut oil does not go directly to muscles. It is converted to glycogen and stored in the liver. This is why it is used for hard working dogs because this is rather short process compared to say long-chain fatty acids which can take a day or so until they are processed. Hunting and sled dogs are given coconut oil with the evening meal so glycogen stores are ready the next day.

In dogs coconut oil does a variety of things but the common application is in supplements for endurance. Horses are fed coconut oil as well.

It is often prescribed for pancreatic deficient dogs because it does not require enzymes for digestion.

It may be anti-microbial if used topically but not fed.

Coconut oil will do nothing for this dog except make it fat, and smell good.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

by directly to the muscles I was saying it by passes the digestive system. 
I was involved with 52 racing sled dogs that did race the Iditarod and the Yukon Quest , and there was a panel of vets as part of the management team. Coconut oil was used for muscle food during high exertion and not getting bloody diarrhea.
It is anti mircrobial when fed because it is used for human dysentry -- .
My horses also enjoy coconut oil.
Show me the study that says the dog will get fat .
Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

carmspack said:


> *Show me the study* that says the dog will get fat .
> http://www.carmspack.com


Don't hold your breathe on that one.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Carmen - How much naturally extracted vitamin C would be equivalent to synthetic C?

If we take 2000 mg of synthetic C, would we use LESS natural C to achieve the same benefits (or benefits we think we're acheiving) ?


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Jax08 said:


> Don't hold your breathe on that one.


No study is required. This is a companion animal we are talking about, not one running 15 miles a day training. Just a normal dog.

What amazes me is that many of you without any formal training or professional experience tell people how much vitamin A,C,E to give dogs that you have never seen.

All the junk you use and tell people to use have virtually no proven benefit.

Dogs are rather easy creatures to feed. They evolved eating very little, not everyday and things both dead and rotting or something they were lucky to kill or forage.

Next time you tell someone how much Vitamin E to give a dog, I want to see your professional qualifications to give that prescription.

What you don't realize is how much money and time you waste on useless supplements, like Vitamin C.

Any decent 30/20 will have more nutrition than 99% of dogs on this planet need. More sled teams are feeding kibbles now because the results are the same.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Coconut Oil benefits Bodybuilders Massively When Eaten Post Workout

Lauric Acid - Antiviral properties of Virgin Coconut Oil

Coconut Oil And Fitness Benefits

Coconut oil was the major topic of Whole Dog Journal How Coconut Oil Benefits Your Dog's Health - Whole Dog Journal Article I have the original article in my filing case "Foods" folder . I believe one article is about 8 years old.

Is Cancer Prevention for Dogs Possible? - Whole Dog Journal Article I have his book on the epidemic of allergies as one of my reference materials. 

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

I will make sure that I tell the animals who have bettered their health with all the junk that I use that there are no known benefits. Study required -- 
show me.
I never prescribed vitamin E . I did point out that synthetic vitamin E and food sourced are not the same Is Your Vitamin E Natural? You want value , use something that the body recognizes 

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

Sable can I ask why you assume everyone has a lazy companion animal that doesn't get exercise?

A good majority of the people on the forum have dogs out doing herding, schutzhund, agility, ect multiple times a week. Plus walking, running, swimming, ect. My own dog personally runs a farm ALL DAY. Plus we go biking, walking, go to the dog park, play fetch/frisbee and he swims. When I lived in the city I exercised him daily with 6-10 mile bike runs, swimming and 2 hours of walking EVERY DAY. He never had a specific "job" but he wasn't sitting around all day. I highly doubt a little bit of coconut oil would pack the pounds on him.


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## Gmthrust (Mar 3, 2010)

Carmen has it correct, in my non-expert opinion. My husband and I adopted an older overweight female White Shepherd, whom was neither neglected nor abused. It was solely a case of Life Happens. We switched up her nutrition, which included Orijen and Coconut Oil (except we then switched over to Coconut Butter) at 2 tbsp per feeding, and also Salmon Oil 2 squirts per feeding, and human-grade natural-source vitamins, organic grade home-pureed vegs only-as needed, raw, rotated and mixed, along with exercise (both mental and physical), music therapy, DAP, too, regular chiropractor visits, all kinds of training classes, etc., etc.....(Gmthrust and I do all sorts of crazy dog stuff)....anyway...the point is... <3.....Cris has lost thirty-two pounds! Woooohoo! So, yes, I believe Carmen is very right!

On a side note or two: Keek (our nearly 2½ years old female white shepherd rescue, who seems to have a dollop of Siberian in her genes), also has Coconut Oil most of her life with us, gets what Cris gets more or less; altho, gotta insert again as a reminder that we switched to coconut butter a couple of months ago===just seems meatier===Keek is not fat at all. She is young, beautiful and athletic, just like Cris (except Cris is six, and almost a half years).

The other side note is that we're raising up another female white shepherd the same way. So far so good. She is very bright-eyed and bushy tailed...meaning very, very, very wonderfully and beautifully healthy.

About those mushers.....I was bred, born, and raised in Alaska (Keek is Eskimo for white hair), used to live in Nome.....dogs all over everywhere, and all my life up there... it's the same ol' thing ....rarely did two dog-peoples ever agree about anything that the other did, except that the third dog-people was wrong.:wild:


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## PaddyD (Jul 22, 2010)

I agree with the above about high quality food containing all a dog needs. ( IMHO )
I give Abby one fish oil pill a day only because she stole mine once and it has become a game ... she expects it ... and I think she may benefit from it.
I add a little Prozyme to her food because it has proven to reduce her gas and
'improve' and reduce her stools. When I forget to add it for a few days, I am given
rude reminders to stick with the program.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

One of my sources for information , was Mary Enig, who has a Ph D in Nutritional Sciences and is respected as being an expert in lipid biochemistry . She was head of a number of studies concerning trans fatty acids, authoring over 60 technical papers. One study available is Fats: The Complete Primer .... Amazon.com: Know Your Fats : The Complete Primer for Understanding the Nutrition of Fats, Oils and Cholesterol (9780967812601): Mary G. Enig: Books

if you visit this site you will see multiple other books available pairing healthy oil = weight loss . My other source is the Udo Erasmus tome Fats that Heal , Amazon.com: Fats That Heal, Fats That Kill: The Complete Guide to Fats, Oils, Cholesterol and Human Health (9780920470381): Udo Erasmus: Books

Every Saturday I have a registered nutritionist and friend to ask any burning questions , or a Master Herbalist who is a university professor who is keen to answer questions , goes on the lecture circuit and is very supportive .

Jax08 I will get an answer for you .

The OP was on the right track. Fish oil, coconut oil and Prozyme for the basic 4 digestive enzymes , amylase, protease, lipase and cellulase. 
This was designed for dog use.

Some people recommend Jarrow which is a human formula and is short one of the enzymes that Pro zyme has , but does have an enzyme whose function is to digest legumes ( kidney beans, black eyed beans , navy beans - you get the type) which a dog just would not have as part of its diet unless you use a kibble that includes Pea flour as a binder.

Coconut butter is a staple of the human raw eaters and vegan/vegetarian cooks and bakers that I share my time and space with every Saturday at an Organics Market . It is delicious. It is "meatier" because it is the coconut flesh that has been creamed.

One plus with coconut oil is that it is very shelf stable. 

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs 

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## Gmthrust (Mar 3, 2010)

Ack! I made a mistake in my post....where it reads 2 tblsp of coconut butter per feeding...that was wrong. What I meant was One Tablespoon per feeding (just twice a day feeding). I'm so sorry for writing it wrongly<---that's a word, right?!--- Was just too happy to write about Cris' weight loss:hammer:

Carmen thanks for letting me know a little more about it:wub:


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

ChancetheGSD said:


> Sable can I ask why you assume everyone has a lazy companion animal that doesn't get exercise?
> 
> A good majority of the people on the forum have dogs out doing herding, schutzhund, agility, ect multiple times a week. Plus walking, running, swimming, ect. My own dog personally runs a farm ALL DAY. Plus we go biking, walking, go to the dog park, play fetch/frisbee and he swims. When I lived in the city I exercised him daily with 6-10 mile bike runs, swimming and 2 hours of walking EVERY DAY. He never had a specific "job" but he wasn't sitting around all day. I highly doubt a little bit of coconut oil would pack the pounds on him.


My comment has to do with the OP. Coconut oil is a great fat but the vast majority of dogs don't need it. It is not cheap either. 

Moreover, the vast majority of supplements for otherwise healthy normal dogs are a complete waste of money at best, and at worst harmful for the animal.

The troubles described by the OP will not be cured by a concoction of Prozyme, fish oil and coconut oil. Pano is what it is, a growth related issue that almost always passes with no side effects. Ear infections might respond to Probiotics not Enzymes.

The pet food and supplementation business is generally on par with the baby formula business ethically speaking.

If you feel the need to add fat, it is far better and cheaper to ask your butcher for chunks of trimmed beef, lamb & pork fat.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Pano, Environmental Allergies, Yeast Infections

It's not just pano the OP is dealing with.


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## Rerun (Feb 27, 2006)

ChancetheGSD said:


> Sable can I ask why you assume everyone has a lazy companion animal that doesn't get exercise?
> 
> A good majority of the people on the forum have dogs out doing herding, schutzhund, agility, ect multiple times a week. Plus walking, running, swimming, ect. My own dog personally runs a farm ALL DAY. Plus we go biking, walking, go to the dog park, play fetch/frisbee and he swims. When I lived in the city I exercised him daily with 6-10 mile bike runs, swimming and 2 hours of walking EVERY DAY. He never had a specific "job" but he wasn't sitting around all day. I highly doubt a little bit of coconut oil would pack the pounds on him.


Because the vast majority of pets don't get exercise like that. And the reality is still that playing fetch and going herding a few times a week doesn't compare to what a sled dog does.

Even schutzhund....most work 1 - 2 x's a week with a club and then do some obedience and maybe tracking at home.


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## Ali B. (Jul 23, 2010)

I brought Jenna to the vet this morning for a wellness checkup. I discussed everything with him and he is encouraging me to continue with the salmon oil and enzyme supplement. He agrees this will help with her allergies and recurring yeast infections in her ears. He wants to see how she does over the next month or so rather than giving her a cortisone injection. He couldn't offer much advice on the coconut oil but said he has heard of many people using it. He said he would check into it. 

I appreciate everyone's comments. Carmen - I was especially hoping for you to respond. Thank you.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

I realize most dogs don't do as much as we do but there are dogs out there who do. I've seen post from many people here though who DO get out and do something for a good 1-2+ hours a day with their dog, that's not including the training they do. Yes, I totally realize that is NOTHING compared to running the Iditarod or any other sled competition, but I wouldn't exactly call that a lazy dog. But at the same time, if someone hasn't specifically said "my dog only gets out 20-30min a day of simple walking" then why should we assume that is all they get IF that? Maybe I'm just used to people who actually work/exercise their working/hunting breeds and feed according to the exercise they get regardless of what is being fed. :shrug:

Maybe Sables had a different experience than me or maybe they've had NO experience with supplements. I don't know but *MY* experience is supplements are helpful in keeping my dogs healthy and going. Just as Sable isn't a fan of feeding "extras", I and my family have had dogs (from hunting/working dogs running all day to simple companions who get "normal" (ie. 30-60min/day typically) amounts of exercise a day) who have lived well past their life expectancy, kept good weight, good health and died of old age eating kibble, left overs and grease/fats/oils daily.

I guess I'll just keep my *******, back in the woods way of raising my dogs to myself and enjoy their long and healthy lifespans.  And they'll continue to enjoy their southern meals.


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## Rerun (Feb 27, 2006)

It doesn't mean it's a lazy dog, but a normal diet feeds the average pet and even ACTIVE PET more than sufficiently to not have to supplement with all sorts of things.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Rerun said:


> It doesn't mean it's a lazy dog, but a normal diet feeds the average pet and even ACTIVE PET more than sufficiently to not have to supplement with all sorts of things.


That is my point. I cannot understand why people spend $75 - $90 bag for food, claim it is the best thing since sliced bread and then spend even more money on snake-oil supplements.

The truth is that 99% of the dogs on the planet will thrive on a mid-grade 25/15 food. Running in the park for an hour everyday is NOT heavy work.

If that is not enough, then the best course of action is to get a better grade of food (not price) like a 30/20 performance. This way you keep the balance in the diet that over the course of the dog's life is important, and you save money.

Even sled dog racers are using dry foods more and more these days, some teams exclusively now, because the quality is so good.

Hunting Trial Dogs eat relatively low-grade foods and endure unbelievable amounts of stress and work.

Certainly, the household Shepherd can live a long happy life on any number of mid-priced, quality diets, formulated by experts not internet bloggers.

I am sorry but Hemp Oil does nothing for dogs.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

sable123 said:


> If you feel the need to add fat, it is far better and cheaper to ask your butcher for chunks of trimmed beef, lamb & pork fat.


Not for dogs with digestive issues that have trouble digesting fats. Coconut oil is ideal for that, and as Carmen pointed out there are other benefits to it as well that I don't believe you get with animal fats.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Not for dogs with digestive issues that have trouble digesting fats. Coconut oil is ideal for that, and as Carmen pointed out there are other benefits to it as well that I don't believe you get with animal fats.


Yes I know that. I am commenting on a normal, otherwise healthy dog. The OP's dog does not have a pancreatic deficiency that coconut oil would address.

All these benefits of Coconut Oil are largely fabricated, except energy for heavily worked animals. Any number of much cheaper oils are good for skin & coat.

I find it puzzling that the same people that advocate raw feeding, grain-free diets, ancestral diets, etc, would even care about Coconut Oil. Do wolves have access to Coconuts?


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

Rerun said:


> It doesn't mean it's a lazy dog, but a normal diet feeds the average pet and even ACTIVE PET more than sufficiently to not have to supplement with all sorts of things.


Again, I guess I'll just keep up with the way I feed my dogs since it's always produced nothing but healthy, active, lean and long lived dogs. And I'm not basing my judgment on 2 or 3 dogs, I'm going by the 17 I've owned and the 30+ my grandparents have had. Your choice if you feed plain ol' kibble for the dogs life but it doesn't make me or anyone else who chooses real foods and vitamins to supplement with, wrong.


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## Gmthrust (Mar 3, 2010)

Pretty sure wolves do not eat a mono-diet. I believe neither should dogs eat a mono-diet, and whole-heartedly feed my girls the best of everything suited for mind, body and soul.

Back in memories, this was up in Alaska, many of us had no other choices besides leftover scraps, and Purina dog chow. The scraps were usually very grand choices (many hunters and fishers up there). My dog brought home a moose leg once! I'm chuckling now, that's such a good memory. She had all the great things in life up there.

Then, I married a military man, and my dog and I were suddenly whisked away Outside, meaning the Lower Forty-Eight (a term of endearment). We eventually added another dog to our family, beloved Shawn. Shawn passed away at only eight, Andi lived to be nearly sixteen. Both were fed mono-diet but Andi had a way much better foundation because of her variety foods from the past. After a few years of not having the those varieties, I began to notice Andifur (from Alaska) physical deterioration in increments, and that Shawn (from North Carolina) never reached the glorious heights that Andi did in healthy living.

Fast forward to now-a-days. Keek was not reaching the heights Andi did. So, I began feeding her Andi-like, and BOOM! Keek-asaurus-rex came ALIVE! Next came Cris, and she is still in the middle of booming. Our newest family member Trin, holy cow, she is crazy with the boom! lol.

I think it was already posted, about organic apple cider vinegar. That is one supplement that really, really, really helped address Cris' ear issues she had. Clean as whistle from the inside out.

All the things I add are done by slow inclusion, then to therapeutic level, then backed off to maintenance, and sometimes only as necessary.


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## Rerun (Feb 27, 2006)

Gmthrust said:


> Pretty sure wolves do not eat a mono-diet. I believe neither should dogs eat a mono-diet, and whole-heartedly feed my girls the best of everything suited for mind, body and soul.
> 
> Back in memories, this was up in Alaska, many of us had no other choices besides leftover scraps, and Purina dog chow. The scraps were usually very grand choices (many hunters and fishers up there). My dog brought home a moose leg once! I'm chuckling now, that's such a good memory. She had all the great things in life up there.
> 
> ...


How did you feed ACV? Water? With food? How much and how often?


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## Gmthrust (Mar 3, 2010)

Rerun,

I bought a set of stainless steel measuring spoons, and began with a one-eighth (or maybe it was the sixteenth) teaspoon size. I chose Bragg's organic apple cider vinegar, because it seemed to have the most 'gunk' at the bottom of the bottle; shake up super duper well before each serving. I mixed that with regular feeding and added maybe 3 to 6 ounces of already filtered water to help dilute the taste of it. Over time, I think a couple of weeks---built up to three, as in 3 times of, three-quarters teaspoon (a total of 1.5 teaspoon) added, per feeding twice a day. I do it that way because that's the measuring spoon that fits into the narrow neck of the bottle, making less messy to measure.

Every dog is different....so maybe more or less might be needed. We hadn't had Cris that long, so decided a slow cautious any additionals to be best. Her dental didn't look very strong at the time, so that's another reason for going slow and careful.

It worked, and I think we will continue with it for a while longer as it seems to be helping address the callouses of her elbows---and the pink stains on her fur are clearing too.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Never mind Ali B , your doing the right thing !

Go to the link for Whole Dog Journal "Crazy about Coconut" 1995 . I have this magazine in my filing cabinet. I used to copy it and provide it to resellers of my oil blend -- now it's not so crazy anymore Healthy Dogs Use Nutiva Organic Coconut Oil

If your dog has an adrenal gland, a thyroid, a liver , a digestive system , then coconut oil can be beneficial. Coconut Oil a Natural Alternative to Thyroid Therapy and More

Coconut oil is also excellent to clean out those ears. Put a little bit in and massage . Cleans out wax , is a miticide, and fungicide, all the while not burning or drying the skin. How to Cure Your Dogs Ears Infection Naturally | eHow.com Home Remedy for Microbial Infections in Dogs | eHow.com

Sable 123 how can you say the benefits are fabricated . You are critical of experts in the field of lipids and triglycerides . Once again , please, one study or something to validate or support your statements.

No Wolves do not eat coconuts .Wolves don't eat kibble. Don't eat corn , don't get vaccinations, don't live with prolonged daylight hours (artificial lights) , etc. Dogs are not wolves . 9,000 years of domestication and sharing lives with humans has changed the dog . The mapping of the canine genome demonstrates this from a genetic standpoint. Anyway , wolves are in decline because they are highly specialized, have difficulties in adapting. Dogs are masters in exploiting opportunities as are coyotes, which are growing in leaps and bounds 
Amazon.com: Eastern Coyote (9781551091112): Gerry Parker: Books

No benefit from hemp oil. Lets start with it being a rich source of anti inflammatory omega 3 , then add the benefits of chlorophyll Hemp Seed oil for health benefits, a source of minerals , a hormone regulator The Health Benefits of Hemp Oil , specific to dogs Hemp Oil News - Natures Perfect Oil - Hemp Products

Braggs apple cider vinegar "with mother" (the gunk) is very good. 

as to the question about vitamin C -- sorry, when dr Victoria visited with me today we got carried away continuing a discussion on S N P s , single nucleotide polymorphisms which is the cutting edge biomedical research being done on disease prediction, prevention and cure -- the new field of pharmacogenomics . 

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs who has lucky dogs that do get fish oil, hemp oil and coconut oil -- and more !!!


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Never mind Ali B , your doing the right thing !

Go to the link for Whole Dog Journal "Crazy about Coconut" 1995 . I have this magazine in my filing cabinet. I used to copy it and provide it to resellers of my oil blend -- now it's not so crazy anymore Healthy Dogs Use Nutiva Organic Coconut Oil

If your dog has an adrenal gland, a thyroid, a liver , a digestive system , then coconut oil can be beneficial. Coconut Oil a Natural Alternative to Thyroid Therapy and More

Coconut oil is also excellent to clean out those ears. Put a little bit in and massage . Cleans out wax , is a miticide, and fungicide, all the while not burning or drying the skin. How to Cure Your Dogs Ears Infection Naturally | eHow.com Home Remedy for Microbial Infections in Dogs | eHow.com

Sable 123 how can you say the benefits are fabricated . You are critical of experts in the field of lipids and triglycerides . Once again , please, one study or something to validate or support your statements.

No Wolves do not eat coconuts .Wolves don't eat kibble. Don't eat corn , don't get vaccinations, don't live with prolonged daylight hours (artificial lights) , etc. Dogs are not wolves . 9,000 years of domestication and sharing lives with humans has changed the dog . The mapping of the canine genome demonstrates this from a genetic standpoint. Anyway , wolves are in decline because they are highly specialized, have difficulties in adapting. Dogs are masters in exploiting opportunities as are coyotes, which are growing in leaps and bounds 







Amazon.com: Eastern Coyote (9781551091112): Gerry Parker: Books

No benefit from hemp oil. Lets start with it being a rich source of anti inflammatory omega 3 , then add the benefits of chlorophyll Hemp Seed oil for health benefits, a source of minerals , a hormone regulator The Health Benefits of Hemp Oil , specific to dogs Hemp Oil News - Natures Perfect Oil - Hemp Products

Braggs apple cider vinegar "with mother" (the gunk) is very good. 

as to the question about vitamin C -- sorry, when dr Victoria visited with me today we got carried away continuing a discussion on S N P s , single nucleotide polymorphisms which is the cutting edge biomedical research being done on disease prediction, prevention and cure -- the new field of pharmacogenomics . 

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs who has lucky dogs that do get fish oil, hemp oil and coconut oil -- and more !!!


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## Toffifay (Feb 10, 2007)

I just thought I'd add that the woman that started the Bragg's apple cider vinegar company was a client of the dog grooming shop that I used to work for. She was kind of an eccentric old gal, but sharp as a tack! She had a medium sized schnauzery/poodley looking mutt that she claimed was 21 or 22 years old and she fed him ACV daily! 

That was a good 8 or more years ago, though, so I don't have any recent information as to how long her dog actually lived.

Mrs. Bragg used to give the shop lots of free samples, though..


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

*need help with enzymes/salmon/coconut oil*



Rerun said:


> It doesn't mean it's a lazy dog, but a normal diet feeds the average pet and even ACTIVE PET more than sufficiently to not have to supplement with all sorts of things.


 
Being active or inactive has no bearing on a dog needing or benefiting from enzymes or probiotics -- nor on minerals , especially since most food stuffs are woefully deficient Empty Harvest: Amazon.ca: Bernard Jensen: Books. Minerals are the spark plugs of life without which not even enzymes can work. This is cellular energy . Are you saying that a dog , which is not active so no great stresses may not have inflammation , arthritis , and not need or benefit from life enhancing, life prolonging antioxidants.

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Is that the same Braggs that sells the liquid aminos?

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A great book to also read which I think has applicability to all creatures is "Younger Next Year"

A body kept in motion repairs istelf ........ the best cure for arthritis other than keeping down biochemical inflammation is excercise


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

yes it is -- Nancy , reading off the label of my one gallon container it is

Bragg Organic Raw Unfiltered Apple Cider Vinegar with the Mother 

ingredients: Certified Organic Bragg Raw Apple Cider Vinegar is unfiltered unheated unpasteurized and 5% acidity . Contains the Mother Enzyme of Vinegar that occurs naturally as strand like chains of connected protein molecule.

www.bragg.com

Carmen
now smelling like apple cider vinegar !


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