# Really new to RAW



## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

So I've heard of RAW diets before, my mother in law was recommended from her vet to switch her dog to RAW because she gets bladder infections, our dog that just passed away we had on kibble, and he was always SO itchy and shed so much, our house is still covered in his hair, even after vacuuming, sweeping, mopping, ect. 

Anyway, we are getting our puppy in 3 weeks, and I've been reading on this forum, and checking out some of the resources that have been linked, but I am still just kind of filled with questions.

Some of these questions may seem dumb, but I just want to make sure.

1. It is safe to feed a small puppy, who hasn't had all of their shots a raw diet?
2. How do you take your dog on trips with you, if you have a raw diet?
3. Is it safe to feed cats the same way, right now we have 2 cats who we feed a high quality cat food, they love it, and they look healthy, their coats are shiny and soft, but it may just be easier to feed them both the same type of food.
4. How do you know how much food to feed a puppy, in order for him to grow correctly?
5. Is, in your own opinion, feeding RAW cheaper than kibble? I know that it will take some time to find the right suppliers, so it may not seem like it at first, so I want some experienced RAW feeders' opinions on this.
6. What are your most invaluable resources when you went to start the RAW diet?
and finally,
7. How do you know you are doing it right?

Thank you to anybody on this forum who can even give me a little more insight into feeding RAW.


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

We recently switched both of our dogs to a raw diet. After making the switch, I personally wouldn't feed kibble to a dog again (no judgement to anyone out there that feeds kibble). The differences in my dogs after switching to raw have been astounding. No doggy smell, more energy, clearer heads, beautiful coats... the list goes on and on! So while I am new(ish) to raw feeding myself, I will try to answer your questions. 

1. I know lots of puppies are weaned directly on to raw, so I don't think it matters if they're vaccinated yet or not.

2. Lots of people use a pre-made raw for traveling. There are some that are freeze dried, which would make things easier. We just load up a cooler with what they need and plenty of ice and we haven't had any problems.

3. Cats can also eat raw, but as I don't have cats, I have no idea if they need the same ratios as dogs do.

4. When we switched Bash to raw at 7 months old, we fed him 3% of his estimated adult weight. He's 14 months now, and we feed him between 2.5-3% of his actual weight. Maybe someone who has fed a tiny baby puppy raw will chime in on exactly how much to feed.

5. Raw has not been less expensive for us than kibble, but that is mostly because Bash can't eat a lot of the cheaper proteins. Emu and alpaca aren't cheap! He does eat pork and chicken, which are both cheap. Our other dog eats chicken, turkey, beef, rabbit... you name it. She is cheaper to feed because of the variety of food she can eat. Get a dedicated dog freezer and shop sales/buy in bulk. It does lower the cost quite a bit. I will say that even with Bash's expensive proteins, it isn't astronomically more expensive than kibble.

6. rawdogranch.com is great. The raw feeding section on this forum is also full of great information. If you can find another raw feeder near you to help, that is great, too. We have a good group of raw feeders and we all let eachother know when we find a good sale. We're also there to help with questions others may have.

7. If you're concerned that you aren't going to be doing it right, I would suggest starting with a pre-made commercial raw, or suppliers like My Pet Carnivore. It takes the guess work out of raw feeding, which may be better until your pup grows up a bit. That would give you more time to research, as well.

The best advice I got was to start one protein at a time, stick with just that protein for two weeks, then add another. Do the same thing with each new protein until you have a nice rotation going. This is called an inclusion diet and it will really help you figure out how your pup handles each new protein. Once you have a rotation going, aim for 3-4 proteins every week. Make sure to include red meat in the rotation!

Good luck!


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

GypsyGhost said:


> We recently switched both of our dogs to a raw diet. After making the switch, I personally wouldn't feed kibble to a dog again (no judgement to anyone out there that feeds kibble). The differences in my dogs after switching to raw have been astounding. No doggy smell, more energy, clearer heads, beautiful coats... the list goes on and on! So while I am new(ish) to raw feeding myself, I will try to answer your questions.
> 
> 1. I know lots of puppies are weaned directly on to raw, so I don't think it matters if they're vaccinated yet or not.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this information! I found a facebook group that is a RAW feeder support group of sorts, and I messaged them and asked for questions, and local supplier information, and they really helped and gave me some more information. I am reading a lot. For now I think we will probably start the puppy on his kibble, just for a week or so, and then switch to RAW. I am just scared about the stress of him moving from his litter to living with us and switching his diet all at once will be too much for him.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I also recently switched to raw. Raw Feeding Miami is a very educational site. I can't get my cats to eat raw. I feed 2-3% to maintain weight. Lots of people feed it to puppies. For me it is cheaper then kibble. Biggest thing is balance and to make sure they get variety. 

This is a good read...
How to get started feeding a Prey Model Raw Diet - Raw Chat - PMR Articles - articles - Prey Model Raw


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

llombardo said:


> I also recently switched to raw. Raw Feeding Miami is a very educational site. I can't get my cats to eat raw. I feed 2-3% to maintain weight. Lots of people feed it to puppies. For me it is cheaper then kibble. Biggest thing is balance and to make sure they get variety.
> 
> This is a good read...
> How to get started feeding a Prey Model Raw Diet - Raw Chat - PMR Articles - articles - Prey Model Raw


Yes! That PMR site is pretty great!


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

Wags said:


> Thank you for this information! I found a facebook group that is a RAW feeder support group of sorts, and I messaged them and asked for questions, and local supplier information, and they really helped and gave me some more information. I am reading a lot. For now I think we will probably start the puppy on his kibble, just for a week or so, and then switch to RAW. I am just scared about the stress of him moving from his litter to living with us and switching his diet all at once will be too much for him.


Probably not a bad idea to wait a bit to switch his food. I agree that it's better to let him settle in first, then make the switch.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> I also recently switched to raw. Raw Feeding Miami is a very educational site. I can't get my cats to eat raw. I feed 2-3% to maintain weight. Lots of people feed it to puppies. For me it is cheaper then kibble. Biggest thing is balance and to make sure they get variety.
> 
> This is a good read...
> How to get started feeding a Prey Model Raw Diet - Raw Chat - PMR Articles - articles - Prey Model Raw


This is one of the articles that I got from the facebook page! Along with this PDF link:
http://www.chanceslittlewebsite.com...rv._6.1_beginners_guide_to_prey_model_raw.pdf


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Wags said:


> This is one of the articles that I got from the facebook page! Along with this PDF link:
> http://www.chanceslittlewebsite.com...rv._6.1_beginners_guide_to_prey_model_raw.pdf


I glanced over if and its a decent article.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> I glanced over if and its a decent article.


I'm looking over it now. I'm kind of looking over each article, while also glancing over websites that ship raw food, to see what I can find.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Wags said:


> I'm looking over it now. I'm kind of looking over each article, while also glancing over websites that ship raw food, to see what I can find.


My pet carnivore
Rawfeedingmiami
Hate today gone tomorrow
Reel Raw


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> My pet carnivore
> Rawfeedingmiami
> Hate today gone tomorrow
> Reel Raw


Thank you, I found a website which is a blog, which has a list of a bunch of different retails and if they ship internationally or locally. Sadly, in my state there aren't any listed, just a coop.


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## brandydan (May 7, 2015)

My Shiloh came home with me at 8 weeks, and from the moment he stepped out of the crate, he's been on raw (though he was weaned on a decent kibble). 

I switched over my Horde (5 cats, 2 dogs and the puppy) to raw because one of my cats has kitty-type IBD, and my sheltie has spent his life with skin issues. Since the raw diet, it's like I have a new batch of pets; clear skin, the nightmare of a chronically-poo-covered cat gone.

Expense-wise, for me not more expensive than the Blue Buffalo I had the group on, but since I'm pretty limited as to what I by for my Horde, I have to rely on the local walmart, HEB and a smallish market for meats. 

I grind most of what I feed. All of my cats refuse to eat bone, and it's easier for me to make sure everyone gets their share of RMBs, organs, etc. And I add a few chicken quarters for my Shiloh, who is going through a major growth spurt. Into my trusty grinder, I add whole chicken, pork (mostly pork shoulder, which at this time of year is really cheap), beef heart and sweetbreads, chicken liver, maybe even a fish or two if on sale.

There is a lot of information out there, and on this forum. It's not a scary thing to do for your pet. But you can make it as complicated or as easy as you want. As long as you maintain an eye on how much you feed your puppy (who will eat a surprisingly large amount for a smallish puppy), and how he grows, you'll be okay.

And the fact that you won't have to deal with MOUNDS of doggydoo is a major plus.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

brandydan said:


> My Shiloh came home with me at 8 weeks, and from the moment he stepped out of the crate, he's been on raw (though he was weaned on a decent kibble).
> 
> I switched over my Horde (5 cats, 2 dogs and the puppy) to raw because one of my cats has kitty-type IBD, and my sheltie has spent his life with skin issues. Since the raw diet, it's like I have a new batch of pets; clear skin, the nightmare of a chronically-poo-covered cat gone.
> 
> ...


Ok, you say that you fed your pup RAW from once you got him, so I have a question about that. I have read two different methods as to predict how much to feed a puppy, either 10% of their weight, until they get to where it would be 2-3% of their adult weight, or just start with 2-3% adult weight. I am guessing that this is so that they aren't eating too much right away, and you aren't trying to get them to overeat (although I also read it should be 4 meals a day until they are at least 4 months old). What method did you use for your pup?

And also, since you feed your cats raw as well, I hope you don't mind if I ask about that as well. I have 2 cats, I don't know their exact weight, but I would guess about 8 lbs for the male and 10 lbs for the female (she is a little chubby) how much do you feed your cats? Do you use the same 2-3% body weight, one of my cats is much more active than the other (hence one not being overweight). And do you use the same formula for RMB, MM, OM?

Thank you very much for this information!


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## brandydan (May 7, 2015)

Wags said:


> Ok, you say that you fed your pup RAW from once you got him, so I have a question about that. I have read two different methods as to predict how much to feed a puppy, either 10% of their weight, until they get to where it would be 2-3% of their adult weight, or just start with 2-3% adult weight. I am guessing that this is so that they aren't eating too much right away, and you aren't trying to get them to overeat (although I also read it should be 4 meals a day until they are at least 4 months old). What method did you use for your pup?
> 
> And also, since you feed your cats raw as well, I hope you don't mind if I ask about that as well. I have 2 cats, I don't know their exact weight, but I would guess about 8 lbs for the male and 10 lbs for the female (she is a little chubby) how much do you feed your cats? Do you use the same 2-3% body weight, one of my cats is much more active than the other (hence one not being overweight). And do you use the same formula for RMB, MM, OM?
> 
> Thank you very much for this information!


My version of feeding raw is following the Frankenprey model, or putting together different parts (chicken and beef heart, pork, chicken, and beef meat, organs from chicken and beef, chicken bones). I don't follow the BARF/added vegetable models, which is just a preference. 

We've probably bookmarked the same pages for calcuating amount of food. Shilohs are way larger than GSDs (I stay on this site because 1) one day we will have a GSD, and 2) people here are honest and helpful), and his projected adult weight is 100#+/-. When he first came home, he was 15 pounds, and I just eyeballed his food intake. I wanted to be sure that the raw didn't 'shock' his system. I was also very VERY hesitant to simply hand him a chicken neck (he's graduated to turkey necks, his best treat in the world)...hearing a small puppy methodically chomp the bones, switching from one side of his jaw to the other, kept me a bit nervous. Note, he did have a touch of the runs for a day or two later, which cleared up easily (also, I realized I didn't give him enough bone, which can also cause loose stools)

I kept him on the 10% of his body weight until he reached about 30#, which pretty much was within a month. I started adding a bit more each meal, watching his weight, how he moved (he's my first real large breed dog, and I read too many articles that pointed out the issues of too fast a growth spurt or putting too much weight on growing bones), and now, at 6 months, gets about 4 pounds of food a day. That includes (mostly rough ground) bones, meats, organs, maybe an entire egg tossed in the mixture. And I'm probably a bad petmom, but because I work full time, he would get a 'breakfast' of a piece of chicken with bone, another smallish bowl of ground when I came home, and since my two older dogs were fed late at night, the remainder of his 'ration' at the same time. Though he's still a puppy, he's fed once a day, same time as the other two, and will easily tuck into his meal.

As for my cats, maybe I've been lucky, but I feed them the same ground mixture as the dogs. I used to run their ground through the grinder twice, the second time in a smaller grind, but they seem to prefer the thicker grind. I used this site to get a start on what to feed the cats: Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition :: healthy cat diet, making cat food, litter box, cat food, cat nutrition, cat urinary tract health. I know I should encourage them more to try chomping on bones, but to a one they refuse; so the coarse grind is the only way I can get them to chew on them for their teeth. I also add in some chunks of pork shoulder meat; the tendons tend to be chewy, and they have to work to eat them.

As for what to feed my cats, I pretty much spend about 15 minutes setting out their plates (flat works better than bowls, and ceramic clean easier than plastic), dole out teaspoonfuls, and watch them. Sometimes they go through one TSP, other times up to 3. While I weigh my dogs' food, I don't for the cats, since those stinkers will also go from plate to plate and pick up food. After 15 minutes, whatever food is left either goes to The Cleaner (puppy), or saved for the next day.

You're lucky that you have a vet that is open to a raw diet; mine (an otherwise fantastic vet who has taken great care of my pets) pretty much threatened to 'fire' me as a client if I fed my pets raw since she's convinced that there is no way anyone can duplicate the 'complete' diet of pre-made kibble and wet, and that I risk exposing my pets to a slew of poisons and other bad issues. Plus she reiterated the whole 'can't duplicate the important taurine issue for cats' mantra...taurine is present in heart tissue; my cats LOVE sliced chicken hearts. 

Is kibble okay? Sure. I just prefer to feed my guys raw. And somehow, ALL 8 of them look forward to mealtime.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Do research taurine for cats. They need this to live and from what I've researched it needs to be added as a supplement.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> Do research taurine for cats. They need this to live and from what I've researched it needs to be added as a supplement.


Yes, I've heard about this before, I knew somebody who was a vegan and decided their cat needed to be a vegan also (I didn't support their decision, I thought it was dumb since cats are CARNIVORES) and their cat ended up getting REALLY sick, thousands in vet bills because it wasn't getting enough taurine. I hear fish and chicken are both rich in it? I figured a cat would need more of a fish/chicken rich diet, because that is probably closer to what they would eat in the wild, small fish, and small birds, rabbit, squirrels, that sort of thing. A cat isn't going to be taking down a pig, or a cow, or an elk. So those are more dog specific, because wolves CAN do that sort of thing in a pack. That's something I was interested in as well. There is SO much information available for feeding your dog a raw diet, but not as much available for feeding cats one as well.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Duck hearts seem to be a favorite for cats. Fish is not as popular as some would think. Taurine can be added in powder form. I dont think they can over dose on it.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

My new mackerel blend cat food is selling faster than I can make it. Cats are going nuts for it.
I joined a raw fed cat group and talked to the owners who had been feeding for many years. I received amazing info from them. Some add taurine and some don't. Some said my blend had enough, and some disagreed lol so I do recommend that people add taurine to make sure their cat is getting enough. A little extra certainly does not harm them but a little less than what they need can harm them.


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## Augustine (Nov 22, 2014)

Too much fish is bad for cats, and all of the feline-raw feeders I know supplement taurine via.. well.. supplements. I'm guessing powder or something.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

Saphire said:


> My new mackerel blend cat food is selling faster than I can make it. Cats are going nuts for it.
> I joined a raw fed cat group and talked to the owners who had been feeding for many years. I received amazing info from them. Some add taurine and some don't. Some said my blend had enough, and some disagreed lol so I do recommend that people add taurine to make sure their cat is getting enough. A little extra certainly does not harm them but a little less than what they need can harm them.


Hmm this is some interesting information. I think raw is the way to go, and is better for your pets, but I want to do some more research before I commit to it, to ensure I am doing it right.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Augustine said:


> Too much fish is bad for cats, and all of the feline-raw feeders I know supplement taurine via.. well.. supplements. I'm guessing powder or something.


I have 4 different blends they rotate through. Fresh Atlantic Mackerel is very low for Mercury.


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## brandydan (May 7, 2015)

Taurine is present in most meats, from what I've gleaned from websites, and the highest percentage is the heart. I can get chicken hearts by the literal pound, as well as beef heart. Some of it I add into the ground mixture, but most of the chicken hearts gets sliced thin and served as treats for my cats (I guess it stays 'more intact'(?). As I also understand it, taurine is water-soluble, so anything cats don't need gets excreted. I'm reluctant to add supplements since I (maybe misread a report online) that mentioned that some taurine supplements are not only synthetic, but not made *here*

So far my cats are doing well, but if I can find a supplement that doesn't give me the willies, I will gladly add it to their food.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

brandydan said:


> Taurine is present in most meats, from what I've gleaned from websites, and the highest percentage is the heart. I can get chicken hearts by the literal pound, as well as beef heart. Some of it I add into the ground mixture, but most of the chicken hearts gets sliced thin and served as treats for my cats (I guess it stays 'more intact'(?). As I also understand it, taurine is water-soluble, so anything cats don't need gets excreted. I'm reluctant to add supplements since I (maybe misread a report online) that mentioned that some taurine supplements are not only synthetic, but not made *here*
> 
> So far my cats are doing well, but if I can find a supplement that doesn't give me the willies, I will gladly add it to their food.


Thanks for this information, chicken heart is easy and cheap to get here (we have some ethnic markets here that sell that kind of stuff cheap) So I will for sure be looking into that. We are really considering doing this for our pup, we've decided it probably will be more expensive than kibble (about twice) but if we are able to get it on sale it will get cheaper, we are probably just going to get a freezer, and stock up for the beginning, then later we can shop around for sales.


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## Dewayne (Sep 30, 2015)

Honestly the price for me switching to raw from kibble is close to the same price most of the time . Other than the dedicated freezer purchase . Just got the 5 cubic ft one for the dogs . The kibble figured out to $1.35 a pound from my local feed store . The most exspensive raw so far is the hamburger $2.28 a pound when not on sale . I buy whole turkey's .73-1.09 a pound . Chicken leg quarters .48 a pound everyday . Watch for quick sale sale items because of close dates . Their pork is everything shoulder ,butt roasts ,spare ribs ,neck bones , chops and steaks .
Beef from hamburger (in the 8# tubes)to steaks and liver . They love calf liver but it's a little high unless on sale $3.69# regular is $1.89#
Chicken is all parts leg quarters mostly but sometimes the whole chicken is on sale cheaper . Neither one really like chicken livers. 
So I have to stick with beef 
Venison trimmings .(free) 
Whole turkeys .
After I get home from the store I spend maybe an hour deboneing the roasts and cutting the chicken leg quarters into 1/3's and portioning up . If I get whole chickens or turkeys it's a little longer . While they are eating I am taking the next evenings meal out of the freezer to put in fridge .
The hardest thing is keeping thier stool in good shape . They do fine for a while and I mess it up too much one way or the other . When they have the ribs I put a little extra venison in to soften the stools .


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## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

Wags said:


> Yes, I've heard about this before, I knew somebody who was a vegan and decided their cat needed to be a vegan also (I didn't support their decision, I thought it was dumb since cats are CARNIVORES) and their cat ended up getting REALLY sick, thousands in vet bills because it wasn't getting enough taurine. I hear fish and chicken are both rich in it? I figured a cat would need more of a fish/chicken rich diet, because that is probably closer to what they would eat in the wild, small fish, and small birds, rabbit, squirrels, that sort of thing. A cat isn't going to be taking down a pig, or a cow, or an elk. So those are more dog specific, because wolves CAN do that sort of thing in a pack. That's something I was interested in as well. There is SO much information available for feeding your dog a raw diet, but not as much available for feeding cats one as well.


I'm vegan/strict vegetarian (for over 20 years), as is my wife and 3 (soon to be 4) children. Our 4 dogs and 5 cats ALL EAT MEAT! Our dogs have been raw fed for over 6 years now. I tried our cats on raw and they were so excited to get fed that they started attacking my hands as I was putting down their food. It wasn't fun. I had to start wearing thick leather gloves to protect my hands. Our dogs get super excited at meal time too, but they don't lose their minds. Needless to say, our cats went back to a grain-free high end kibble. Ha! I give them raw meat and sometimes squirt salmon oil over their kibble just as a treat, and especially when their fur is dry from this high plains Idaho desert air. 

None of my dogs were on raw as young puppies, so I can't offer much advice there. Other than Nara, all other pets were rescued when they were a bit older. Nara was 8 weeks old and my first dog ever, so she was on kibble for her first 2 years of life until I learned more about nutrition for pets. Either way, good luck. Try to find a yahoo raw group in your area. That's what I did to save money when I was new to raw. They get a large group of people to buy in bulk to drive down the price per pound. I did the math of how much my kibble and supplements cost per lb, and just made it work to buy bulk raw meat for that same amount or less per lb. I get most of what I need at my local grocery stores every 2 weeks, and I bought a freezer specifically to store raw meat separate from our vegan fridge/freezer. Also, when we go camping, I have a cooler of frozen/thawing meat that I bring for the pups. Never had an issue.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I went and got all my chicken(gizzards, hearts and necks)yesterday. I will be sorting today. I sort and bag once a month, theN just take out of the freezer to thaw and serve(saves a ton of refrigerator room)Once I'm done I'll post a picture and tell you how much it costs for 7 dogs on raw for a month. I use about 13 pounds of meat a day(10% bone in there) and I sort the organs separately. So I use about 390 pounds a month of meat(210 pounds of that is leg quarters which supplies the bone and part of the meat), 20 pounds of liver, 10 pounds of kidney, 5 pounds pancreas, 5 pounds spleen, 5 pounds of brain, sweet breads and testes. I always give liver and kidney and rotate the rest of the organs. Now off to sort


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> I went and got all my chicken(gizzards, hearts and necks)yesterday. I will be sorting today. I sort and bag once a month, theN just take out of the freezer to thaw and serve(saves a ton of refrigerator room)Once I'm done I'll post a picture and tell you how much it costs for 7 dogs on raw for a month. I use about 13 pounds of meat a day(10% bone in there) and I sort the organs separately. So I use about 390 pounds a month of meat(210 pounds of that is leg quarters which supplies the bone and part of the meat), 20 pounds of liver, 10 pounds of kidney, 5 pounds pancreas, 5 pounds spleen, 5 pounds of brain, sweet breads and testes. I always give liver and kidney and rotate the rest of the organs. Now off to sort


Wow that sounds exciting! I think we are going to have to commit to doing this. Like I said, we'll probably wait until Bruce is about 12 weeks old, just so we can get him settled in, then switch to a premade (Bravo/Northwest Naturals/Primal, all of them are sold locally) just to make sure he takes to us, and we aren't messing anything up, and then we will go in and buy the food (well, we will be checking out ethnic stores and butchers during this time to get price ideas) I decided this week I'm going to get an ~estimate~ of how much a month worth of meat would cost. Just to get an idea, see who will work with me the best in buying in bulk, ect. I found a facebook page that is dedicated to the Omaha area raw feeders so I may post on there and see if they have any sort of co-ops to get prices cheaper.

@counter - That's amazing! My cats already get really excited over their kibble, will start knocking it out of my hands when I go to feed it to them, dump it all over the floor, then I'll make them eat that because I get mad... but yeah, I don't know what they'd do if I started feeding them raw. Maybe if that is how they act now about the dry kibble I shouldn't do it. I give them dry kibble most of the time, but also give them a wet meal sometimes to help them get extra water in, although they like drinking water, more than any other cats I've owned, but only out of the dog's bowl, it's really weird.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Someone sent me a spreadsheet that all you do is input the numbers to give you an idea on ratios. It is the most valuable tool I have to date. 

Check it out
http://www.packlunchraw.com/spreadsheet/


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> Someone sent me a spreadsheet that all you do is input the numbers to give you an idea on ratios. It is the most valuable tool I have to date.
> 
> Check it out
> SPREADSHEET | Pack Lunch


Haha, I have that spreadsheet bookmarked as well!


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Wags said:


> Haha, I have that spreadsheet bookmarked as well!


Seriously follow that and you can't go wrong. I've had no issues and I'm confident they get what they need.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> Seriously follow that and you can't go wrong. I've had no issues and I'm confident they get what they need.


So that is your main source of information? Ok cool. I will keep it saved! I just found it by googling something weird, and I was like oh cool, look at this, looks like it could be useful, but I wasn't sure how accurate it was. But that's great that it is a good resource, so now I can feel more confident in feeding what I think Bruce needs, and he'll be a healthy happy pup! I'm really excited to start feeding him raw, even though we don't even have him yet :wild:


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Wags said:


> So that is your main source of information? Ok cool. I will keep it saved! I just found it by googling something weird, and I was like oh cool, look at this, looks like it could be useful, but I wasn't sure how accurate it was. But that's great that it is a good resource, so now I can feel more confident in feeding what I think Bruce needs, and he'll be a healthy happy pup! I'm really excited to start feeding him raw, even though we don't even have him yet :wild:


I am not a shopper and when I switched to raw all of the sudden I became a competitive shopper. Always looking for deals, researching different sources. It took me about 4 months to decide on what sources I would stick with and where I could get the best deal. People actually laughed at me, it was a challenge for me. I spend a lot less in raw then kibble, but not at first. I cut expenses in half to date. A plus was that I already had an extra freezer. You know those extreme couponers? I'm an extreme raw feeder. I embraced it and ran with it


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

llombardo said:


> I am not a shopper and when I switched to raw all of the sudden I became a competitive shopper. Always looking for deals, researching different sources. It took me about 4 months to decide on what sources I would stick with and where I could get the best deal. People actually laughed at me, it was a challenge for me. I spend a lot less in raw then kibble, but not at first. I cut expenses in half to date. A plus was that I already had an extra freezer. You know those extreme couponers? I'm an extreme raw feeder. I embraced it and ran with it


*cough* deal shopping runs in the family. I always have to run around to check out the best deals. I want to get a camera, but not until I've checked out every single place to decide who is offering the best deals on the one I want. My mom was an extreme shopper for a while haha, we had a whole room in our house dedicated to my mom's ccouponing goods, 96 cans of green beans she got for free, ect. So I've pretty much been raised that way, to always shop for the best deal. I told my husband, it will probably be more expensive in the beginning, when we first start, but as soon as we get going and getting a stock pile built up, it will be worth it. It is always expensive to start off with, because you NEED certain things, you can't wait for them to go on sale, but once we get a good stock pile going, it will be worth it, because we'll be able to really negotiate prices since WE don't NEED it. It's always better business to be the person who doesn't need it, and can wait out for a good sale =). Currently I am thinking I will be purchasing a lot of goods from Simply Rawsome. They deliver locally to Omaha, from MN so they are who I will go to, they seem reasonably priced compared to other sellers, so we will probably be going there for most of our "stocking" needs, then once we get more going, we'll be able to be a little more picky with our costs.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I checked out the Simply Rawsome--I seen that they have denatured meats. Some people don't have a problem with that but most do. I wouldn't touch it no matter how cheap after I researched it some more.

I finished my sorting. There is 6 pounds in each bag, enough for 30 days. This month I used a base of chicken hearts and gizzards. Each day they get an additional protein(lots of pork this month). This month I used boneless pork, pork tails, beef riblets, pork heart, goat heart, turkey gizzards, venison and duck hearts. 


I paid a total of $205. The organs run about $30, chicken with bone $82. It was slightly higher this month because I actually put a 1/2 pound more in each bag-I always like to be prepared for a pup that might need more


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

Wags- You are completely correct in that it will be expensive to start, but the cost definitely goes down once you can buy in bulk and shop sales. I finally divvied up the cost for just Roxy (the dog without expensive food intolerances) and it is way cheaper to feed her raw than kibble. Bash will always be expensive to feed unless his food intolerances disappear, but at least he's healthy now! Every month when we do are shopping, I'm so grateful that he can at least eat chicken and pork!

llombardo- It's like we're the same person, lol. I never used to be one for comparison shopping, but it's a huge part of my life now! I do think you're finding better prices than I am, though.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

GypsyGhost said:


> Wags- You are completely correct in that it will be expensive to start, but the cost definitely goes down once you can buy in bulk and shop sales. I finally divvied up the cost for just Roxy (the dog without expensive food intolerances) and it is way cheaper to feed her raw than kibble. Bash will always be expensive to feed unless his food intolerances disappear, but at least he's healthy now! Every month when we do are shopping, I'm so grateful that he can at least eat chicken and pork!
> 
> llombardo- It's like we're the same person, lol. I never used to be one for comparison shopping, but it's a huge part of my life now! I do think you're finding better prices than I am, though.


I am giving Midnite more if the stuff that he isn't very tolerant of, but I follow up with stuff he can have. So far he has done well with everything on the iffy list. I won't even attempt the no list(which is rabbit and tuna for meat/fish) We just stick with herring.


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

Wow you guys that is amazing! We are pretty much set on feeding Bruce raw, we are going to start with some premade mixes just so we can make sure he has no intolerance to anything, before we go buy in bulk. However, I have read that puppies adjust a lot better, and the sooner you start a dog, the better they adjust. Although we still don't want to rush into it.

Yes, the Simply Rawsome does sell some denatured beef, but they also sell human-grade. We are only going to feed human grade to Bruce, at least until I can do research and come into an educated decision that denatured food is ok. But until then, only human grade for him! Even still, with human-grade, it is a lot cheaper than most places that ship online, although I guess they "deliver" they don't ship. They deliver to our area, so that is at least where we are planning on doing most of our "stock piling" until I can score some better more local deals.


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## brandydan (May 7, 2015)

Wags, I could be wrong here, but premade mixes would honestly confuse me if I was wondering if my pup would have any intolerances. <again, I also admit that I started this raw journey with premade patties since I wasn't sure if my older, raised-on-kibble dogs would tolerate raw...seriously, don't know why I worried since they look at the cats' litterboxes as snack bars.... Most raw feeding sites will suggest starting out with chicken, then slowly add in other meats. This way you could see which part or animal could affect your pup's system in a negative way.

So far, my horde has to settle for a large portion of chicken, then pork, and when we can find some decent deals, beef (although all the organs, from liver, sweetbreads, and heart, are beef). We simply don't have the space to order meats. Anything else, from venison to goat/lamb...pretty much nonexistent where we live. 

I don't buy and prepare more than a weeks' worth at a time simply because my cats prefer their food fairly fresh. I prepare the ground that I feel both my cats and dogs from fresh-from-the-market meats, then freeze them in bags before packing them in our drop-down freezer. For their RMBs, it's all chicken, and my Boys (dogs) look forward to their daily chicken wings and leg quarters.

Be prepared, though, for weird looks from your supermarket cashier; my husband and I eat fairly healthy, yet along with our baskets of vegetables and fish, we almost always include a mound of sweetbreads and beef heart, then head for the local ethnic grocery store for about 15-20 pounds of whole chickens at least once a week.

Like I mentioned earlier, my puppy didn't need to be transistioned to raw...I handed him a piece of raw chicken breast and he slurped that down like candy. Since he had been on puppy kibble, I did have to deal with about a day of runny poo, then I had to watch for the bone content I was feeding him. (Hint: chicken necks are favorites, and it's almost mesmerizing watching a puppy instinctively know how to crunch down the bone).

I have found that my pets all look forward to mealtime, though I don't have cats that will attack me for food...


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## Wags (Dec 17, 2015)

brandydan said:


> Wags, I could be wrong here, but premade mixes would honestly confuse me if I was wondering if my pup would have any intolerances. <again, I also admit that I started this raw journey with premade patties since I wasn't sure if my older, raised-on-kibble dogs would tolerate raw...seriously, don't know why I worried since they look at the cats' litterboxes as snack bars.... Most raw feeding sites will suggest starting out with chicken, then slowly add in other meats. This way you could see which part or animal could affect your pup's system in a negative way.
> 
> So far, my horde has to settle for a large portion of chicken, then pork, and when we can find some decent deals, beef (although all the organs, from liver, sweetbreads, and heart, are beef). We simply don't have the space to order meats. Anything else, from venison to goat/lamb...pretty much nonexistent where we live.
> 
> ...


Haha, it's also just so we know we aren't messing anything up in the first few weeks. This will be our first time feeding raw, so I want to make sure that we are doing everything right.


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