# Board and train with Ivan Balabanov. Am I making the right decision?



## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

So I've been in contact with Ivan's wife (I think it's his wife?) Natalia. I'm going to send my puppy to him for 4 weeks for an advanced board and train (on-leash training for now). I haven't had Sarge for that long, so I guess I just need some reassurance that I'm doing the right thing... 4 weeks is a long time to be away from my boy!

If given the chance would you guys jump at this opportunity? I hope I'm making the best choice.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

I'm no expert, but I do know I could not do it even if it was the right thing. Once I HAD the pup. However, the pup I have right now was reared in a "puppy raising family" who trains and socialized dogs intended to work (SDs etc). So he had his basics and was used to kids, noises, traffic, other animals, (and getting tapped on the nose with a pen for some odd reason according to the log) 

It was nice, and we still have a lot of training to do, but I will admit I did not mind not having to housebreak or to teach sit stay down and here. Had I had him though, I would not have been able to send him away even for a weekend during the bonding period lol


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## thegooseman90 (Feb 24, 2017)

I'll likely be going this route soon myself. Waiting to hear back from Natalia. I last spoke to her just after Christmas and they were out of country. There's a lot of people who would love to train with Ivan. Everyone I've spoken to is jealous that I'm close enough to train with them. So absolutely you're right to do this. Ivan is one of the best in the entire country

ETA: just noticed you're in brooksville. Finally someone that can fully understand my frustrations with finding a good trainer


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

If I had the option to train WITH Ivan Balabanov, I would jump at the chance. I’m curious why you are choosing a board and train option, though. Is this for sport foundation?


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## voodoolamb (Jun 21, 2015)

Nope. I'd save my money. 

I think you might be getting a little starry eyed with Mr. Balabanov's, well-deserved, reputation. 

But what can you actually get out of sending a 4 1/2 month old pup to a board and train for basic leash work, even if it is with a world class trainer? 

This is prime bonding time for your puppy, I don't get sending him off for a month when you just got him. Basic obedience isn't difficult. I'd look into lessons where you work your own puppy under the guide of a trainer. You'll create a better bond with your dog and save quite a bit of money. 

When you pup is older, and if you want to get involved in sport or have killer off leash obedience or something, then I might consider paying a premium price for a premium trainer. 

But I am firmly in the bond with your pup, have fun, and learn things together camp.


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## voodoolamb (Jun 21, 2015)

Also... another question...

When dealing with very popular trainers... especially in a board and train situation... Are these trainers actually going to work your dogs themselves? Or is it their staff that does the basic pet manners stuff while the big guy works the dogs their for sports training or major behavioral issue cases?


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## Armistice (Oct 12, 2017)

You've only had your pup for 3wks and going to send him off for 4?

I'm with voodoo on this. You need to bond with your pup. You've taken him out of where he knows, and now he's finally settling in and you're pushing him elsewhere where he'll have to adjust and settle in only to then take him from there and resettle in with you? Seems like a lot of hassle

What is the specific reason he needs to be trained? It seems you mentioned basic leash training. Why spend the money when you can do that yourself? A lot of good info out there

At the same time, that training you do with your pup is great for forming trust and loyalty


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

GypsyGhost said:


> If I had the option to train WITH Ivan Balabanov, I would jump at the chance. I’m curious why you are choosing a board and train option, though. Is this for sport foundation?


For now it's a straight obedience board and train. I'm not having much luck doing things on my own and he's too rough with my daughter (realistically not really, but that's a whole other thing...). After the board and train I will be doing one on one's with Ivan for a sport foundation, not entirely sure what I want to do just yet though.


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

voodoolamb said:


> Nope. I'd save my money.
> 
> I think you might be getting a little starry eyed with Mr. Balabanov's, well-deserved, reputation.


Maybe a bit 



voodoolamb said:


> But what can you actually get out of sending a 4 1/2 month old pup to a board and train for basic leash work, even if it is with a world class trainer?


He'll be about 7 months when he goes for the board and train.



voodoolamb said:


> This is prime bonding time for your puppy, I don't get sending him off for a month when you just got him. Basic obedience isn't difficult. I'd look into lessons where you work your own puppy under the guide of a trainer. You'll create a better bond with your dog and save quite a bit of money.
> 
> When you pup is older, and if you want to get involved in sport or have killer off leash obedience or something, then I might consider paying a premium price for a premium trainer.
> 
> But I am firmly in the bond with your pup, have fun, and learn things together camp.


I just feel like I'm completely failing at training him. He's been regressing over the last 2 weeks even on the basics we've been doing since the day we got him.

I contacted off-leash K9 to do one on one lessons so I could learn along with him. I paid and went to schedule the first session and they told me that I should send them to a 2 week board and train for $2800 (Ivan is only $1800 for 4 weeks) because they needed to socialize him more.

I don't know what other trainers around here I would trust. The others I've talked to just rubbed me the wrong way.

I know I'm being reactionary, it's why I posted this. I've tried all the things I've read to stop him from biting and jumping while he plays. I can deal with it until he gets it down but my 5 year old daughter apparently cannot. So she's basically got a complex about it and I'm constantly holding the poor dogs collar while she's around.

I bit off a little more than I can chew lately I guess lol. Bought an old house (tons of repairs so far), got married (mixed household, my two boys and her daughter), and a high drive dog lol.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

Don't listen to the naysayers. Sending your dog off to get training and then learning how to maintain it is the way to go unless you are a trainer yourself. Just be sure to ask plenty of questions at the end when they do go homes about anything you aren't sure of. It is way more likely Natalia will work with the dog than Ivan, but Natalia is better at training than pretty much anyone that frequents this board.

Having not had your dog that long and then sending the dog away to learn a language of agreement and disagreement is not a disadvantage. You'll be able to get a better start with the dog and that will carry on to the rest of your life with the dog. It is much harder to deal with a dog that has (gone the wrong way for years) and then you sent the dog off to board and train than it would be to send the dog off fairly early and then knowing how to deal with the issues as they come up, be able to get the dog on the right path and keep him there.


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

Baillif said:


> Just be sure to ask plenty of questions at the end when they do go homes about anything you aren't sure of.


One of the reasons I liked what they offered was (3) 1-hr one-on-one sessions after the 4 weeks is up to go over what was done and how to continue.


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

thegooseman90 said:


> I'll likely be going this route soon myself. Waiting to hear back from Natalia. I last spoke to her just after Christmas and they were out of country. There's a lot of people who would love to train with Ivan. Everyone I've spoken to is jealous that I'm close enough to train with them. So absolutely you're right to do this. Ivan is one of the best in the entire country
> 
> ETA: just noticed you're in brooksville. Finally someone that can fully understand my frustrations with finding a good trainer


You should email her. She told me they could get Sarge in mid-way through February. Our dogs could go together haha.

Are you located in/around Brooksville?


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## thegooseman90 (Feb 24, 2017)

Grew up in brooksville and now I'm living in Spring Hill. So basically still the same area. I'm going to email her again and just make sure they haven't forgot about me.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

brandon. said:


> I don't know what other trainers around here I would trust. The others I've talked to just rubbed me the wrong way.
> 
> I know I'm being reactionary, it's why I posted this. I've tried all the things I've read to stop him from biting and jumping while he plays. I can deal with it until he gets it down but my 5 year old daughter apparently cannot. So she's basically got a complex about it and I'm constantly holding the poor dogs collar while she's around.
> 
> I bit off a little more than I can chew lately I guess lol. Bought an old house (tons of repairs so far), got married (mixed household, my two boys and her daughter), and a high drive dog lol.


Is there a dearth of trainers in your area? That would be a tough situation. Some areas really don't have much for choices.

That being said, my preference is to learn my dog and work my dog myself, with the regular guidance of a trainer, but if you don't have a good option for that, I can understand why you'd do a board and train. If you get some sessions with Ivan or qualified staff to walk you through what they did and how to maintain it, that would be helpful.


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## ausdland (Oct 21, 2015)

brandon. said:


> Maybe a bit
> 
> 
> 
> ...


5 year old daughter>puppy. WL puppies can be a total handful, mine was. I'd do whatever it took to make sure my child was comfortable with my puppy and keep it positive where I didn't have to rehome the pup.


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

WateryTart said:


> Is there a dearth of trainers in your area? That would be a tough situation. Some areas really don't have much for choices.
> 
> That being said, my preference is to learn my dog and work my dog myself, with the regular guidance of a trainer, but if you don't have a good option for that, I can understand why you'd do a board and train. If you get some sessions with Ivan or qualified staff to walk you through what they did and how to maintain it, that would be helpful.


There really aren't many trainers around here that I've found that looked competent, especially working with a high drive dog.

I'd be getting 3 one-on-one sessions after the board and train to get up to speed on continuing to work with my dog afterwards.


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

ausdland said:


> 5 year old daughter>puppy. WL puppies can be a total handful, mine was. I'd do whatever it took to make sure my child was comfortable with my puppy and keep it positive where I didn't have to rehome the pup.


That's exactly the reason I jumped towards board and train. I have all the time in the world to try, fail, try again, etc but I don't ever want my kids to be scared of dogs. Especially her dog!!


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

brandon. said:


> That's exactly the reason I jumped towards board and train. I have all the time in the world to try, fail, try again, etc but I don't ever want my kids to be scared of dogs. Especially her dog!!


I suppose it would be frowned upon to rehome the child.

I kid, but for real, this is just one reason why I don't have children. I'd probably lose patience with the kid and tell the kid to suck it up and deal and don't you remember what it was like when you didn't know better?? (Parent of the Year, right there. :grin2: )


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## brandon. (Dec 19, 2017)

WateryTart said:


> I suppose it would be frowned upon to rehome the child.
> 
> I kid, but for real, this is just one reason why I don't have children. I'd probably lose patience with the kid and tell the kid to suck it up and deal and don't you remember what it was like when you didn't know better?? (Parent of the Year, right there. :grin2: )


I'd be a liar if I said the thought didn't cross my mind. Telling her to suck it up... not rehoming her! lol But I can't imagine growing up being scared of dogs. They were such a big part of my childhood. I want her to feel the same way (or at least not deathly scared) about our dog.


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## IllinoisNative (Feb 2, 2010)

I'm glad you brought this topic up. I'm thinking of doing the same thing. I would go to Ivan for one on one training, but he's about three hours away from me. That's too far with my work schedule. So I was going to use my tax refund to send him to a board and train. He needs more training than I can provide alone. There is no other trainer close to me that I would feel comfortable with. I want my dog to have the best start. 

I love him to death. He's loving, snuggly, playful, sweet, and fun...but he has a few quirks. He air snapped at his last trainer when she tried to lead him away from me. Granted, he was eight months old then and hasn't done it since them...but I wan to have him evaluated anyway. Also, he's become fearful of other dogs because another dog attacked him in dog class. The other dog broke out of crate while we were in the middle of an agility routine and went after him. It was not good. 

And $1800 for four weeks is a good deal. Although it's going to be torture for me to be away from him that long.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

IllinoisNative said:


> I'm glad you brought this topic up. I'm thinking of doing the same thing. I would go to Ivan for one on one training, but he's about three hours away from me. That's too far with my work schedule. So I was going to use my tax refund to send him to a board and train. He needs more training than I can provide alone. There is no other trainer close to me that I would feel comfortable with. I want my dog to have the best start.
> 
> I love him to death. He's loving, snuggly, playful, sweet, and fun...but he has a few quirks. He air snapped at his last trainer when she tried to lead him away from me. Granted, he was eight months old then and hasn't done it since them...but I wan to have him evaluated anyway. Also, he's become fearful of other dogs because another dog attacked him in dog class. The other dog broke out of crate while we were in the middle of an agility routine and went after him. It was not good.
> *
> And $1800 for four weeks is a good deal. *Although it's going to be torture for me to be away from him that long.


Sounds like a much better price than what the nobodies around here charge and your pup will actually be trained. Most the board and trains around here are a fraud.


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## konathegsd (Dec 3, 2016)

I was looking into “the good dog” and it was like 3200 or something for 3 weeks


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

Ivan has earned his reputation. I think it's a good plan if you don't have time or interest in training him yourself.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

brandon. said:


> I'd be a liar if I said the thought didn't cross my mind. Telling her to suck it up... not rehoming her! lol But I can't imagine growing up being scared of dogs. They were such a big part of my childhood. I want her to feel the same way (or at least not deathly scared) about our dog.


Some dogs can be reassuring to a little girl, but it doesn't necessarily come from obedience or even manners. Be realistic about what a dog trainer can actually accomplish and pay attention to what the actual relationship between the two of them is. She may not be comfortable with him, or him with her even when he sits or downs. Don't try to force it and be prepared for maybe a little indifference and slight separation in your home.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

I know a lady who used to train her dogs for schutzhund, but is now pretty much wheelchair bound. She went to Ivan and Ivan helped her train her dog for personal protection.

Not many high level sport trainers would know how to do that, or have the patience to do it. 

I am not a fan of board and train - I am the one that needs to be given the lessons when it comes to training my dog. but after reading about your daughter, I understand your circumstances.

Is there any way you can involve your daughter in the follow up sessions? That would seem pretty important.


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

One of the biggest criticisms you always hear about board and trains is some variation of the following argument- I need to learn how to train my dog because it should be me training the dog. No. Just no.

A good board and train will teach the dog behaviors that need to be taught to the dog and then teach you how to maintain an already learned behavior. They will also teach the dogs a language of agreement vs disagreement then teach the owner their end of that language and then it is off to the races from there.

Most of you have no clue how hard it can be to teach someone just to maintain a known behavior and hold dogs accountable. It can be a real challenge to teach a person, even over the course of 5 days, on a dog that ALREADY KNOWS ITS END OF THE DEAL. To try to teach someone how to actually train that behavior as they train the behavior and then maintain it would be very time consuming, inefficient, and costly. To be done in a way that is up to my standards for dog training, or to even come close to the standard for which I set in my own board and train would be very very very costly and could be comparable to college tuition costs. Michael Ellis School for dog trainers if you want to take the entire curriculum is 20k or around about that. 

1,800 for 4 weeks is a bargain. To send one to me for 4 weeks is 2,500.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

...what about going with the dog and training with Ivan-I've heard that is pretty reasonable


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

...1800 for 4 weeks is probably also pretty reasonable-but for me that's a lot of $


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## IllinoisNative (Feb 2, 2010)

holland said:


> ...what about going with the dog and training with Ivan-I've heard that is pretty reasonable


Speaking for myself only, it's three hours one way to train with Ivan. That's essentially 6 hours just for travel, and that's if I can get consistent weekend appointments because I work during the week. I also have balance issues due to cancer treatment side effects. If I train myself, I would need someone closer to work with on a consistent basis. There is no trainer closer that has the qualifications Ivan has. In addition, I have another dog to look after and a mother I help with. I have plenty of time to spend with my dog, I just don't have that type of time just for travel. And I need more direction than the trainers near me can offer.

I would love nothing more than to train with Ivan myself. Right now, I'm hoping to have a foundation built with the board and train, and then to learn how to maintain the behaviors the dog is taught. Given the quirks my dog has now, he's young enough to have them corrected. Plus it's daily training for consistency and a faster process. I need him over his reactivity of other dogs sooner rather than later. I basically just need him to ignore other dogs on lead. I don't want this behavior ingrained. I'm doing what I can now...keeping him at a distance, treating him when he's around other dogs, being pro-active by getting his attention before he becomes focused on another dog, remaining calm, etc. I just need more help.


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## thegooseman90 (Feb 24, 2017)

holland said:


> ...what about going with the dog and training with Ivan-I've heard that is pretty reasonable


Baillifs post just before yours explains that perfectly. It's going to be easier for them to train your dog and get a good foundation without you, or in this case op, in the picture. Then spend a few days teaching you how to handle the dog. It's going to be easier on your pocket book as well honestly if you don't know how to train the dog. Each private session with them is $80 and as baillif also mentioned in another post it's going to take longer because it's not as efficient to train the handler how to train the dog. In this case what I'm imagining is a new trainer/handler going home and undoing what they've taught the dog in session one or not being committed enough to keep it up and then session two is only really session 1.25 because you're going back retraining or undoing.


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## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

My only criticism of a board and train is that they typically don't train the people well enough at the end to maintain the training the dog has received. IME a high percentage of these folks are repeat board and train customers, because they don't entirely understand, or aren't prepared or willing, to maintain their dog's training afterward. Ballif said:



> Most of you have no clue how hard it can be to teach someone just to maintain a known behavior and hold dogs accountable. It can be a real challenge to teach a person, even over the course of 5 days, on a dog that ALREADY KNOWS ITS END OF THE DEAL


OP, and others, if you do a board and train ask questions and take maintenance of that training seriously, it can save $$$ in the future! Just an FYI...


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

What Baliff said Is fact, even if you go to a training class/school with the dog. At least with Ivan the dog will have proper foundation, and hopefully the people can catch up. 
I have had training classes for many many years, and the owners/handler’s are almost always more frustrating or behind the dog; in learning their part. Fact!


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

I suppose it is like sending an unbroken or green broke colt or filly to a professional trainer. They train the colt, usually for at least 60 days. Then they have you come and they teach you to ride the horse properly according to it's training. Here is one the Arabian ladies, a mother and daughter who ride like Godesses, trained for me. Then they taught me to ride properly. I could never had done that by myself.

*oversized photo removed by moderator*


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## cdwoodcox (Jul 4, 2015)

Each situation is different. Would I send my dog off to a board and train? No. But, I plan on doing IPO for years to come so I need to know how to do things myself. If it wasn't for club this may not happen. So if OP is cool with it and that is what is best for him right now, then why not. Ivan is certainly qualified.
There is some downside to training your dog when your new to it. Take my female Athena. She will be two in April and has a BH, she will have an IPO 1 this spring. If an experienced trainer had her she could be an IPO 3 dog right now. So definitely a slower process. OP, I say let Ivan Jumpstart things for you. And for you to also challenge yourself to learn as much as possible so next dog you may not need to board and train.


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## thegooseman90 (Feb 24, 2017)

opcorn:


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## Baillif (Jun 26, 2013)

If you're good at what you do don't do it for free. ***REMOVED BY MODERATOR***


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

I know he is very good at hunting wild hogs with dogs.


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## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

Nurse Bishop said:


> I know he is very good at hunting wild hogs with dogs.


Didn't know you Californiators did that hog huntin thing Steve, but that's what I love about this forum, I learn something new every day!


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## IllinoisNative (Feb 2, 2010)

I understand both sides of this argument. If Ivan was closer, I'd choose to train with him...because I really do enjoy the training process and the bonding with my dog that goes with it. I've done Obedience 1 and 2 AND Agility 1 and 2 with my dog and he's ten months old now. But I don't think I got the best training. Doesn't really matter because the couple that owned the training center sold the land at the end of 2017. So I'm without a trainer and not good prospects in close proximity. 

I guess I figure I'm doing the best I can with my options. I want the foundation with Ivan's training center, and I will ensure that the training continues.


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

I definitely don’t see a problem with a board and train, as long as it is with a reputable trainer. I personally want to know the how and why of the process. I learn better seeing things in real time. I understand that I would probably be frustrating for some trainers. That’s ok, I just won’t go to them. To the OP and others looking to send your dogs to Ivan and his wife, I’m sure you’ll be pleased with the results! I completely understand that fixing the dog first or putting an obedience foundation on the dog and then training the owners is a more efficient way to do things. And I’m sure a lot of people get more bang for their buck using this method. You’ll get no flack for me over it. Different things work better for different people.


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## IllinoisNative (Feb 2, 2010)

GypsyGhost said:


> I definitely don’t see a problem with a board and train, as long as it is with a reputable trainer. I personally want to know the how and why of the process. I learn better seeing things in real time. I understand that I would probably be frustrating for some trainers. That’s ok, I just won’t go to them. To the OP and others looking to send your dogs to Ivan and his wife, I’m sure you’ll be pleased with the results! I completely understand that fixing the dog first or putting an obedience foundation on the dog and then training the owners is a more efficient way to do things. And I’m sure a lot of people get more bang for their buck using this method. You’ll get no flack for me over it. Different things work better for different people.


I agree. I also learn better in real time. That's why it's hard for me to not have a trainer close by. I really enjoy training with my dog, and I'm a visual and hands-on learner. What I do like is I get three hands-on training sessions with them after the board and train so I can play "catch up" as someone else said. Ivan's center also offers free obedience classes for anyone who's done their board and train. So If I need a refresher or more hands-on instruction, I can go free of charge. On their website, it states that Ivan and his wife teach these classes for free all around the Tampa area.

I don't think anyone likes spending $1,800 on training. Could I use the money elsewhere? Absolutely. But I consider this an investment that will hopefully pay off in the end.

I'm not opposed to training my own dog or the work involved (even though it's probably a longer process than a board and train). I'm opposed to the consistent travel of one on one ongoing classes. Once in a while, I can handle. LOL


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

IllinoisNative said:


> I agree. I also learn better in real time. That's why it's hard for me to not have a trainer close by. I really enjoy training with my dog, and I'm a visual and hands-on learner. What I do like is I get three hands-on training sessions with them after the board and train so I can play "catch up" as someone else said. Ivan's center also offers free obedience classes for anyone who's done their board and train. So If I need a refresher or more hands-on instruction, I can go free of charge. On their website, it states that Ivan and his wife teach these classes for free all around the Tampa area.
> 
> I don't think anyone likes spending $1,800 on training. Could I use the money elsewhere? Absolutely. But I consider this an investment that will hopefully pay off in the end.
> 
> I'm not opposed to training my own dog or the work involved (even though it's probably a longer process than a board and train). I'm opposed to the consistent travel of one on one ongoing classes. Once in a while, I can handle. LOL


In your situation, b&t totally makes sense!


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

.............MOD WARNING............
No more snarky comments back and forth whatsoever.Time outs for those who don't comply.Air your grievances PRIVATELY.


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

Nurse Bishop said:


> I suppose it is like sending an unbroken or green broke colt or filly to a professional trainer. They train the colt, usually for at least 60 days. Then they have you come and they teach you to ride the horse properly according to it's training. Here is one the Arabian ladies, a mother and daughter who ride like Godesses, trained for me. Then they taught me to ride properly. I could never had done that by myself.
> 
> *oversized photo removed by moderator*


Ok I resized this on tinypic it said for message board. Maybe they are still too big.










Apparently there is some kind of size limit on pictures here. Here is a 5 gaited Saddlebred that was board and trained. She was there for 60 days, total bill $800. That was 20 years ago. I train my own dog and Inga does pretty good but a horse is different since they carry you on their backs. Professional trainers teach them signals I never would have even thought of. Then they teach the rider. This is ideal. I've had horses for almost 50 years. I wish I could continue with riding lessons but can't afford it. Riding is something you never stop learning.


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

Again? The removed picture has been resized twice *for message boards* by Tinypic.com. It was a beautiful picture of a palomino mare standing in a redwood forest with rays of sun shining through the mist.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Nurse Bishop said:


> Again? The removed picture has been resized twice *for message boards* by Tinypic.com. It was a beautiful picture of a palomino mare standing in a redwood forest with rays of sun shining through the mist.


Sorry, but it was still way over the maximum photo size of 800 x 600 pixels. Your second picture is fine.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Nurse Bishop, here's a tip re. resizing photos. Do you have Paint on your computer? Most PCs do. 

Open the picture in Paint. Look for the 'Resize' option in the top menu. Select 'pixels' rather than percentage, then choose a size that is within the allowed limits. If you want to save the original picture, (the big one) give the resized picture a new name, so it won't overwrite the original.

Hope this helps - I love horses, too, and would like to see your picture!


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