# Existential Sprinkling Problem



## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

Existential, as in relating to existence. If we cannot correct this, he is gone (to another home).

Our GSD just turned 8 months. He is a male, and fairly well trained. He has never had an accident in the house or in his bed. Never, not a single one. When he has to relieve himself, he lets us know and we send him out. Since we got him at 12 weeks, we have not had a problem with that.

The problem is the sprinkling. In a variety of circumstances, he will just spontaneously spray a stream of urine onto the floor. He does not squat, or anything like that. It appears to be entirely unintentional.

It mostly happens when he is exited or conflicted. For example, he wants to run out the door, and I am commanding him to get in his pen. When he pauses for that moment before obeying, he will spray a couple seconds of pee on the floor. I will not be near him, and he is not acting crazy or sullen, just standing eagerly looking out the door. 

Also happens when I hold his collar because a cat or dog is walking by, but not always. He will be standing stock still, whining just a little, and a little pee will spray out. Also happens when we first get home after being away for a few hours. I think that is just excitement.

He has not been beaten, and this is not fear. Ears and tail do not go down, and he does not crouch. It is just, I don't know, conflicted emotions.

It is exceedingly annoying, as he is about 70 lbs now and 2 seconds of pee is a real mess. It is also keeping him from developing a close relationship with the family as he cannot he loose in the house and around us for fear of this happening. We bought one of these, 



, but keeping that on him all the time is not practical, and you might get sprayed while you put it on him.

Is this something that just goes away? If so, how long does it take? If it is not gone, and soon, he will have to go. Any help is appreciated.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

Have him checked for a UTI.

Read through these links at length.
Can We Help You Keep Your Pet? Submissive Urination


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## Mary Beth (Apr 17, 2010)

If the problem has just developed recently you may want to have your vet check him over for any bladder problems. If he has been doing this since he was a puppy, then it does sound like excitement urination. Also if he is not neutered, he could be marking his territory, like when he does it when another dog goes by. I suggest you try searching the forum for threads on the topic. Hopefully you will get some good advice from other posters.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

if it's not medical, it could very well be submissive peeing, or excited peeing. He doesn't even realize he's doing it.

Will it go away ? no one can answer that if it's not a medical thing. 

It's really sad to hear that because the dog has a problem if not resolved, he's gone
But maybe he'd be much better off in another home.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

"Existential, as in relating to existence. If we cannot correct this, he is gone (to another home) " 
" and I am commanding him to get in his pen. When he pauses for that moment before obeying, he will spray a couple seconds of pee on the floor"

OUCH that is harsh. Young dog , with a handler sensitive , somewhat submissive streak , and a handler unaware, frustrated, who is using the thread to vent , not to find an answer, his fate already with a "you're out of here" for something that is ""It appears to be entirely unintentional." because it is . 
"I will not be near him, and he is not acting crazy or sullen, just standing eagerly looking out the door" .. you don't have to be . Dogs are so sensitive to subtleties , read us well -- your overbearing goes to him , he freezes, door/out not an option, freeze , sprinkle from the pressure and tension - submit, go to crate.

Conflict is fear . 
"It is also keeping him from developing a close relationship with the family as he cannot he loose in the house and around us for fear of this happening"


I would be inclined to say to you .... do rehome the dog . 

'
Let him be with someone who appreciates the good in him, who is more in tune with him - a totaly different dog may emerge. Looks like this dog and you are not a good match.

by the way I would be curious how you train / trained/ intend to train this dog. Just the wording -- you stand there and command the dog -- why not assist the dog and bring him to the crate, take the decision away from the dog, no conflict, no need to avoid, no need for you to exert so much super authority .

got to add that even your name I shoot friendlies ishootfrendlies wow.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

If you have had the dog for five months, and you can consider getting rid of him for such a minor issue, then you probably are not well matched with this dog. No bond. It is probably better for you to give the dog back to the breeder. 

The very fact that this is such a big deal to you will probably make the problem take longer to resolve. 

Excited or submissive urination is not really the dog's fault. They do outgrow it if you do not over-react and punish them for it. Even becoming frustrated will make this take longer to clear up.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

I agree rehoming is likely the best solution. He won't get better at this point, since you've already decided he's gone if it doesn't stop and also the fact you "command" him around. 

He may improve in a new environment but only if they ignore the peeing so be honest with them and direct them to the links I provided.

This doesn't sound like a good match between dog and owner.
BTW I was looking at your old posts, did you get this dog from a breeder? Do they require you return him?


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## LoveEcho (Mar 4, 2011)

Just a head's up, coming onto a forum like this and saying that "the dog is gone" if he doesn't knock off something you yourself say is unintentional is not going to get you any sort of answer you want to hear (doubly so with that user name). Judging by your post, it sounds like your dog is insecure and fearful and not sure what his place is, and it sounds like he's fearful of you. Rehome the dog; you don't have any sort of bond with him and that is the really only thing that will get him past submissive/excited urination. 

A dog doesn't need to be beaten to be fearful of someone. He does not see you as his leader or caregiver. The fact that you are jumping to rehoming without even consulting a vet to rule out a medical reason says enough about your relationship with the dog.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

It's kind of like a divorce anyway, merely saying the word and getting comfortable with it in your head is a pretty good sign it will happen.

If I hear from people (we have a rescue) that they want to get rid of the dog, it's usually a done deal with everything except the actual act. 
If it's going to happen anyway - do it sooner than later so hopefully a rescue can work with his issues


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

I was unaware the word command was such a hot button. I am telling him to do something. Not sure what I should call it. "Sit, stay, heel, leave it," etc I have always heard referred to as commands. If it would make it more comfortable, I will refer to those things as suggestions. You can read that offending line as " For example, he wants to run out the door, and I am suggesting that he get in his pen"

I like this dog a lot and would like to keep him. We get along very well, and he is happy and well adjusted. We clean up the pee and do not make a big deal. He is not afraid. He will be standing, making eye contact, with erect ears and a wagging tail, and shoot a little stream of pee. It almost always occurs when he is being "suggested" to do something he does not want to do.

An example just occurred. My 3 year old niece was here and was walking to the car. I had Chaias (daughter picked the name) outside with me as they left. He wanted to run over and play, but she is a little afraid of him so I "suggested" him to lay down beside me, which he promptly did, with a little squirt of pee. 

It is great, really. He clearly wants to go over, but with just a quiet "suggestion", he restrains himself and lays down. He actually was shivering a little as he watched her walk by, a couple feet away, he was so exited. The pee did not come then, though, but only when he had to restrain himself. By the way, we did have him checked for a UTI, and he was fine. 

Anyway, I thought I might get a little help here. I appreciate the one or two people who offered good advice. If anyone else has a dog that has been like this or has some ideas on how to minimize it, I would love to hear them.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

Zoey would "excited pee" at times, Just a little dribble. At around 1 yr old she stopped. It wasn't a big deal for us, most of my house is pergo.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

"Existential, as in relating to existence. If we cannot correct this, he is gone (to another home)" is how we are introduced to your predicament. 

"It is exceedingly annoying, as he is about 70 lbs now and 2 seconds of pee is a real mess. It is also keeping him from developing a close relationship with the family as he cannot he loose in the house and around us for fear of this happening" 

Rather contradictory then to say "
I like this dog a lot and would like to keep him. We get along very well, and he is happy and well adjusted. We clean up the pee and do not make a big deal"

Seems he is in a conflicted state enough to annoy you with his nervous expression of urine . Being banished because you are annoyed is not the picture of a cozy home.


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

Nigel said:


> Zoey would "excited pee" at times, Just a little dribble. At around 1 yr old she stopped. It wasn't a big deal for us, most of my house is pergo.


Well that is encouraging. Ours is more than a dribble though, it is a full on squirt. It is not from fear or submission, and I really don't think he knows it is happening. I guess that sounds similar to yours. Did your dog know, or do you think it was involuntary?



Mary Beth said:


> If he has been doing this since he was a puppy, then it does sound like excitement urination. Also if he is not neutered, he could be marking his territory, like when he does it when another dog goes by.


It has been going on since he was a puppy. It is less frequent now, but when he does it, it is a larger amount. How old do they have to be to mark territory? He has not shown much interest in that so far.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

msvette2u said:


> Read through these links at length.
> Can We Help You Keep Your Pet? Submissive Urination


(not sure if you checked out these links or not)


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## dazedtrucker (May 2, 2011)

selzer said:


> If you have had the dog for five months, and you can consider getting rid of him for such a minor issue, then you probably are not well matched with this dog. No bond. It is probably better for you to give the dog back to the breeder.
> 
> The very fact that this is such a big deal to you will probably make the problem take longer to resolve.
> 
> Excited or submissive urination is not really the dog's fault. They do outgrow it if you do not over-react and punish them for it. Even becoming frustrated will make this take longer to clear up.


Agree. I didn't read the whole thread. My boy Axel did this..for a long time. He will be 2 in February, and it hasn't happened now for about 6 months... they do not realize they are even doing it. why on earth would you ditch your dog for this? Hes a dog. They do things like this.. maybe you shouldn't have a dog if you get so upset cleaning up a little pee... there is poo to pick up too....

(I really hope the mods dont kick me out for being blunt again... )


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## balloons (Aug 18, 2012)

my mom has a 12 y/o dachshund that has issues excitement/submissive peeing. she is also neurotic and won't walk around things or on hard/slick floors. you learn what causes it and how to avoid it. you don't just give up on your dog. 

and i don't think people here have an issue with the word 'command' as much as the phrase 'when i am commanding him'. a better phrasing would be 'when i give him a command such as sit, stay, or down...'


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

here is your proof that the dog is not incontinent " He has never had an accident in the house or in his bed. Never, not a single one. When he has to relieve himself, he lets us know and we send him out. Since we got him at 12 weeks, we have not had a problem with that."

here is your proof that it is situational - as you said when excited or conflicted " it is a full on squirt. It is not from fear or submission, and I really don't think he knows it is happening. I guess that sounds similar to yours. Did your dog know, or do you think it was involuntary?" 

sorry it is from submission out of ANXIETY . saw a program about the night fighters , WW 2 airmen that got a nervous bladder just before going out for their missions and they would have a ritual of having their nerve piss just outside the plane . No different than going out to some competitive trial and visiting the bathroom for the upteenth time.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I totally agree with Carmen's post above..

How do you "know" it's not from submission/fear ? Did he tell you? Since you don't know why it's happening I don't think you "know" that it isn't from x or x.

As suggested, get a full vet work up first..If this is a behavior you don't want to deal with maybe it's best you return him to the breeder or rehome him


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

take him out more often. you know when he pees in what
situation. take him before the situation arises or take him out
as soon as the situation arises. how long ago was the Vet check
and what did the Vet do? what test did the Vet do? did the Vet
do any blood work, check urine samples or stool samples?


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## Marc (Oct 25, 2012)

my dog has this problem, but its only when she meets new people. i am hoping she will grow out of it, but if she doesnt, i will just keep cleaning it up, i wont rehome her though.

whats reward do you offer your dog when he obey's his command? 

the reason I ask this is that GSD's very much want to please their owners. If he is faced with a situation where he wants to go outside, but he also wants to do what you say, he has an internal conflict, and may pee "oh no what do I do??? I wanna do both!!!.... oh crap... I peed.". however if you tip the scales in your favour, by offering him great rewards such as treats and praise, there will be a lot less conflict when it comes to obeying you, and he may not pee so often.


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## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

ishootfriendlies said:


> Well that is encouraging. Ours is more than a dribble though, it is a full on squirt. It is not from fear or submission, and I really don't think he knows it is happening. I guess that sounds similar to yours. Did your dog know, or do you think it was involuntary?
> 
> 
> 
> It has been going on since he was a puppy. It is less frequent now, but when he does it, it is a larger amount. How old do they have to be to mark territory? He has not shown much interest in that so far.


With Zoey, it was primarily when I came home from work. I called it a dribble, but I'm really not sure how forcefully it came out as I was usually standing above her. The amount varied, but it was much less than a " normal" outside potty break. The living room is the only main floor room with carpet and where our front door is, so I started entering through the back door. I'd let her out and have our welcome home party outside. When I started using the front door again, I would keep the attention to a minimum and go straight to letting her out back. Now she is solid no matter what level of excitement and has been since about 1 yr old.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

I think the OP wants us to tell him "yes, it's the dog, he's got poor nerves" or whatever, when we know it's the OP and how he's presenting himself to the dog.
I've owned dogs my entire life and I've never used the phrase "command them to do something". 

I "tell" my dogs, "go lay down" or whatever, but the fact you're also asking this dog to do things that make him nervous (laying down in strange/new situations is stressful to them) and he's reacting by urinating, is extremely telling.

What you've got here is a bunch of very experienced dog people telling you, you're mishandling the dog, and this is his reaction.

I gave you the links to help you get a new mindset about your dog.
Without that new mindset and change of how you're interacting with your dog, this dog will be one that "sprinkles" his entire life.

I know this because we got a Dachshund that, at 6yrs., still urinated then cowered. It was obvious his owners had mishandled the excited/submissive peeing from the moment he did it, and when he passed at 10yrs. old, if he ever thought he was in trouble, he'd still pee a bit. We let him out frequently so his bladder would be less full...but he still did it.

So you've got to understand that it's you, and how you're dealing with this dog, _how_ you're asking him to do things, if you're asking him to do things that are making him nervous and uncomfortable - I suspect a combo of both - and you've got to rearrange that and do things differently or else give up the dog.

Since you're arguing and saying it's nothing you're doing, this is looking a bit grim.

Hire a good trainer to show you how to work with the dog, as others suggested. Or return him to the breeder or find a rescue for him. A rescue can assess him and get him in a home where he'll feel less conflicted.


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## Manny6575 (Sep 30, 2012)

Im not an expert and might not be much help but here goes anyways.

You said that you would want him to go in his cage and he would want to go out. Then he would pee a little then get in the cage.What I would do in this situation is. Leash him up and take him out right before you want to cage him. When out wait for him to potty and when he does reward him with a treat and praise him. Then take him back in still on a leash to his cage and lure him in with a treat and only give it when he goes in.

The other time he got excited when the girl was walking by to get in the car. I would have him down and then drop a bunch of treats in front of him so it takes awile to eat all of them. If the girl is not in the car and he shifts his focus back to her drop more treats down until she is in and leaving.

I just think this would work because he would want the treat and he wouldnt be so conflicted.


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## jae (Jul 17, 2012)

msvette2u said:


> I think the OP wants us to tell him "yes, it's the dog, he's got poor nerves" or whatever, when we know it's the OP and how he's presenting himself to the dog.
> I've owned dogs my entire life and I've never used the phrase "command them to do something".


that is very unfair of you to assume what we (over the internet nonetheless) will tell a person what they want of their dog. "command" is the same as "tell" what is the difference one way or another the dog does what you ask of it? 

Main Entry: *tell*  [tel]
Part of Speech: _verb _ Definition: communicate Synonyms: acquaint, advise, announce, apprise, authorize, bid, break the news, call upon, clue in, *command *...

why argue semantics anyway, the issue at hand is the peeing. OP has gotten very good advice. ignore the dog, increase bond, and build confidence, that is what he needs to be told, whether or not he wants to get rid of the dog is his own accord.


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## RocketDog (Sep 25, 2011)

I'm sorry, but I really have to say that Carmen's posts (carmspack for the OP) are spot on. Spot.freaking.on.

So many times people unintentionally send off vibes--they are completely unaware of how they affect their dog. I have a good friend with a fear-aggressive dalmation mix. She is a highly educated person, and loves her dog very much. But the signals she sends to this dog......woweee. Seriously. If you talk to her, she has a rational conversation about all the right things to do, but it's a completely different world when she's actually with and around the dog. To the point that the dog has already bit several people. It's too bad she won't rehome the dog, because she doesn't see the problems, and is a liability just waiting. It's not a question of if, it's when. 

Please, please, please--just for a second, consider that carmen might be right. You want a resolution, right? If what you're doing isn't working, consider listening to someone with years of experience.


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

jae said:


> that is very unfair of you to assume what we (over the internet nonetheless) will tell a person what they want of their dog. "command" is the same as "tell" what is the difference one way or another the dog does what you ask of it?
> 
> Main Entry: *tell*  [tel]
> Part of Speech: _verb _ Definition: communicate Synonyms: acquaint, advise, announce, apprise, authorize, bid, break the news, call upon, clue in, *command *...
> ...


Appreciate it, but don't worry about it. I learned long ago the internet is full of amateur psychologists. When I see a post that tells me what I am thinking, I just skip it and move on. You may get 50 of those posts, and 5 with good advice. Usually those 5 good ones give you everything you need. I just focus on the good advice.

It's funny, wherever you post you find the mindreaders, always there to help you and tell you what you really want or are really saying. It does not matter what the subject is. Post in a cooking forum, same thing. Post in a auto repair forum, same thing. Post in a professional forum, same thing. Something about the internet...



msvette2u said:


> (not sure if you checked out these links or not)


I did, thank you. They were good.



Marc said:


> whats reward do you offer your dog when he obey's his command?
> 
> the reason I ask this is that GSD's very much want to please their owners. If he is faced with a situation where he wants to go outside, but he also wants to do what you say, he has an internal conflict, and may pee "oh no what do I do??? I wanna do both!!!.... oh crap... I peed.". however if you tip the scales in your favour, by offering him great rewards such as treats and praise, there will be a lot less conflict when it comes to obeying you, and he may not pee so often.


Ha! I like your narrative of his thinking. That is exactly how I have thought of it. I think that is exactly what is happening, except maybe him knowing he squirted. Would that be excited peeing?

What you say is good. If I "Suggest" (for the sensitive) him to get in his cage, and he obeys but does a little squirt, do I still reward him? Should the reward be just for obedience whether he squirts or not? I have been on the fence about this, as I believe he does not know he is doing it.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

How have you handled the situation when he pees?

Have you given him any indication that you are displeased with him?


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

Sunflowers said:


> How have you handled the situation when he pees?
> 
> Have you given him any indication that you are displeased with him?



No. I am afraid that might exacerbate the problem. Usually I just clean it up after he has moved away from it.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

ishootfriendlies said:


> No. I am afraid that might exacerbate the problem. Usually I just clean it up after he has moved away from it.


Well, that is the correct way to handle it. 

We had this, too, handled it the same way, and I would casually say, "Let's go outside" so that someone could clean it up.
I would also take a deep breath and think about the good things Hans does. Just in case he could perceive that I was not thrilled that he was doing this 

He did it mostly with my husband and, believe it or not, my 9-year-old son. My son is not overbearing in the least, so I decided it was excited peeing. 

At 11 months, I have not seen it anymore. 

I have no advice -- I can only say how it was for us, because I do not know you, your dog, you vibes or your situation.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

sorry, it is not at all unfair. The very first sentence tells you that this person is very upset with the dog doing this and his welcome in this home is wearing out - there is an ultimatum - he's out of here , if he doesn't shape up . Boy there's no tension there. 
Later he goes on to say that they are so upset with the dog that he is pretty well banished "to Coventry". So do you think that there is not emotion so thick it is palpable and the dog cannot feel it . Dogs by the way are very sensitive . This is avoidance. The dog is afraid to make a wrong decision so freezes , feels the pressure, voids.
But what is the owner doing all this time? Voice getting sterner, staring at dog , pointing to crate, when dog slinks in , door slams? How is that going to change behaviour. The dog is cowed.

Instead , go an get the dog. Be pleasant about it . Show him what you want, and praise .

Sometimes relationships go sideways and there is no getting into the good.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

carmspack said:


> But what is the owner doing all this time? Voice getting sterner, staring at dog , pointing to crate, when dog slinks in , door slams? .


No idea.
It's what I thought, too, but OP is saying he is not giving any indication of displeasure, so I don't know what to advise.


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## Marc (Oct 25, 2012)

ishootfriendlies said:


> What you say is good. If I "Suggest" (for the sensitive) him to get in his cage, and he obeys but does a little squirt, do I still reward him? Should the reward be just for obedience whether he squirts or not? I have been on the fence about this, as I believe he does not know he is doing it.


I would definitely reward. remember you are rewarding the obedience, not the urination. if you are consistent, with your rewarding the obedience whether he urinates or not, he will definitely make the connection of being rewarded for the obedience, rather than for the urination.

Also remember that although your dog is an older puppy, he is still a puppy and may still be struggling to "hold it", remember that even humans struggle with having 'weak' bladders and although the dog may be able to consciously hold it, when his mind is focused on other things (that thing he really REALLY wants to do), that focus may go.


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## Ageizm (Nov 11, 2012)

Funny how so many Dog experts suck at communicating with people.

The guy is on the forum looking for help, which would indicate that he does want to keep his dog, but he's nearing his wits end and expressing it to us (humans). It's good to vent on the internet and not on the dog; which is what the OP is doing.

Lol at everyone that got on the OP's case for using the word "Commanding"...I mean really? Leading, Commanding, Telling, Ordering... straw man BS.

At least the OP has the right attitude find the 5 or 6 helpful post and move on as I'm sure he won't be re homing his dog because some self proclaimed dog experts say so on the internet with a condescending attitude.

Good luck with the submissive/excitement urination, my baby boy sprays all over when he meets new people, I don't sweat it as I'm sure he'll grow out of it. He is after all just a baby! =)


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## Mary Beth (Apr 17, 2010)

Well,he is old enough to mark his territory, but after your explained his behavior, that isn't what he is doing. I am sure it is frustrating to deal with, but from the other posts, I have gotten the impression that he will outgrow it if there is no stress put on him when he does it and you ignore the behavior. I do think that the suggestions that he be taken out to relieve himself more frequently especially before having him do something that triggers the peeing and also to diffuse the tension with treats for good behavior for promptly sitting, or whatever you told him to do. You may want to look into clicker training (there are some excellent threads on it) as that is low stress and totally positive.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

> So many times people unintentionally send off vibes--they are completely unaware of how they affect their dog.


This exactly.
Folks, I don't care that he used the word command. It's that he sees it as commanding the dog around, when you should be teaching the dog what you want, as carmen has said.

He could say "telecommunicate" for all I care - but it's the fact he does, indeed, "command" the dog, and apparently this dog is not a dog that can tolerate that, or there would not be a problem.

We can set aside all the arguments in the book about what words were used, and _look at the dog._
The dog is having issues, _because of how the owner is interacting with the dog. _



> The very first sentence tells you that this person is very upset with the dog doing this and his welcome in this home is wearing out - there is an ultimatum - he's out of here , if he doesn't shape up . Boy there's no tension there.


Exactly this.


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

Lets see, words don't matter. 

Except the OP has been judged tried and convicted based on the words in the first statement. Hmmmm?

No one asked what kind of flooring the OP has or maybe I missed it.

It did occur to me though, their are people that may not want thousands of dollars worth of flooring/carpeting ruined.

Oh yeah, they shouldn't have dogs.

How about just helping with the peeing issue and forget about the personality assessment.

Just a thought.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

> If we cannot correct this, he is gone (to another home).





> If it is not gone, and soon, he will have to go.


The quotes above are what rather irritates me not his/her use of the word "command".

Not every dog is perfect, my feeling is, if someone is willing to get rid of their dog because he has a submissive peeing issue, then it is in the best interest of the dog that he is placed in a new home or returned to the breeder


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Ageizm said:


> Funny how so many Dog experts suck at communicating with people.
> I'm sure he won't be re homing his dog because some self proclaimed dog experts say so on the internet with a condescending attitude.


You might want to check the credentials of some of these posters, who have literally decades of owning, training and even breeding these dogs, before you go the condescending route yourself.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

To help the dog's peeing issue, we need to face the fact it's an owner problem and _not the dog._

Get rid of the dog, fine. But the next dog is likely to have the same issues. 

And yes, if you want a pristine home, and a carpet with no vomit, urine or poo stains, you might not want to get a dog. Or have a kid.

Should you want those things, you can either get a real nice carpet cleaner or tear the carpet out, like we did, ages ago 

ETA - it's a dog problem, nearly universal to dogs (puppies actually)...but it becomes an owner problem if not dealt with correctly...when people say things like "If this problem doesn't go away the dog goes" it's usually of the belief the dog is defective/wrong/a problem, when, in reality, the owner has likely caused it, inadvertently, probably, but still.


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## Ageizm (Nov 11, 2012)

Sunflowers said:


> You might want to check the credentials of some of these posters, who have literally decades of owning, training and even breeding these dogs, before you go the condescending route yourself.


I haven't called into question any of their respective expertise when it comes to "owning, training, or even breeding" Dogs (see what I did there? =) ), simply pointing out their lack of interpersonal skills, when dealing with people is all.

It's like they've spent so long learning all this dog stuff, that they've lost a bit of sensitivity towards their fellow man.... I mean I love my dog and everything but I still like to talk/hang out/spend time with people too. After all no ones dog has ever told me a cool story about when "he went for a walk with his handler this one time...."

Granted the OP was being a bit dramatic in his initial post, but some of the responses seemed less than helpful, and I'd wager they talk to their dogs better than they treated him. 

In my opinion that sucks.

Hope you had a great weekend Sunflower! =)


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## x11 (Jan 1, 2012)

my dogs eat healthier than most people do, is that like what yr saying.


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## Ageizm (Nov 11, 2012)

Not at all (god knows Barack eats better than I do as well lol)... but I don't wish to derail the thread trying to explain any further.

Have great evening!


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## x11 (Jan 1, 2012)

i think you bring out a good point tho some genuine well meaning people who may be less internet savvy can really get off on the wrong foot just by a few poorly chosen words and it all goes downhill from there. i have certainly been that person many times but i think i have more productive approaches to it now. still that guys username indicates something quiet sinister and less innocent. "ishootfriendlies" really, surprised the mods let that stand given the current state of things around the world.


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## marshies (May 18, 2011)

Puppy did something like this when she was younger. I classified it as excited peeing be cause it usually happens when she gets to play with my mother (rare), or when there were many new guests over who were greeting her. She would be so excited to get to them, and then pee a little. She wasn't submitting...the only conflicted feeling she might have experienced is that she was taught to greet calmly, and sometimes can't restrain herself. 

It stopped when she got a bit older. She is 16 months now and has LONG since not had this problem...so far away in fact, I couldn't put an age to it.

I'm a first time dog owner too, and certainly no expert. But what you might have successes with:

1. Carmspack's suggestion of leading your dog to the crate instead of creating the conflicting feeling for your dog. This will set your dog up for success since it ensures that your dog won't experience the feelings that make him want to pee. 

I do this myself. I've trained Puppy to go into her crate on command, but rarely use this command in the real situation of wanting to put her away. I don't want her to associate the command with being removed from people and fun.

2. Have your dog pee first, and then introduce your dog to something that you know excites the dog/makes the dog want to sprinkle, maybe while you're outside still. Maybe more exposure to the family might make at least this less exciting, and the dog more enjoyable at home. I think keeping the dog away from the family will only make it more exciting for the dog when it does get an opportunity to interact.

3. Tarp the carpet. When I first got pup, I tarped my bedroom and the living room of my aparment, which is where the dog would be spending most of her time. I knew she was going to have accidents (which you know too) and wanted to not strain our relationship by making the cleanup as easy for me as possible. Tarp was all of 10 dollars. I duck taped it to the base of the wall/carpet, and kept it there until she was completely reliable in the house. You might want to try the tarp and keep it there until the peeing isn't such an issue anymore.

When Puppy was growing up, I felt frustrated with her alot (for different reasons, not peeing), and that strained our relationship because she and I both felt it. Your dog can probably feel your emotions too, even if you don't show it when he pees.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

Just going to go in a different direction just in case this is medical that is being exacerbated by an emotional conflict and/or simply the age of the dog - perhaps confused a bit. 

Natural Dog Incontinence Remedies | Herbal and Homeopathic Remedies for Canine Urinary Incontinence

*Pulsatilla* 

Your dog needs this remedy if she has a very weak urethral sphincter muscle (a sphincter is a circular muscle at the end of the urethra. It restricts urine flow.). 

Dogs with weak sphincter muscles spill urine easily, especially when they are excited, or when they are sleeping or resting. 

*Kreosotum* 

If you suspect that your dog's leaky problem is due to stress or emotional problems, try this remedy. 

Urinary Incontinence in Dogs: Causes, Treatments

On another note, How much exercise is the dog getting? Is he walked 2-3x per day, or is it an a.m. - out of the crate, back yard, do his business, couple sniffs and back in, people off to work, get home, let the dog out in backyard, people put dinner on, flick on the t.v - see what's happening in the news...weekend is here - lets go for a walk, or to the dog park. 

How much interaction is this dog getting with the outside world? Dog friends, hikes, sports...

Questions are rehtoricle...just putting out something to consider to strengthen the bond if there is fear there, exercise/training will help, if excitement, exercise will help burn him out as well as mental stimulation...some members have great ideas for indoor training like hide and seek (people or things).

Using treats as one mentioned to help take the risk out of asking the dog to offer a sit or down...do you smile when you talk to your dog? Try smiling, trick I read about talking on the phone to someone you never met and don't want to come across rude or angry, if you smile while you are talking, asking, commanding then your emotions/tone will too


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Lets look at why puppies pee. 

Puppies pee because they have a small bladder and they drink so they need to go out frequently -- that is not the problem here. 

Puppies pee to mark territory, often times pups at this age do not lift legs yet. Marking can start this early, but dogs are definitely aware of what they are doing when they mark. A mark is done when the dog sniffs another dog, either male or female, and he wants to cover that mark with his own. That simply isn't happening here. 

Puppies pee to calm the raging beast. In the pack puppies run about, play, walk all over the other elder pack members. And at some point, Momma or Papa or some other pack member may decide that Pup is a pest and needs to cool his jets. They do not give time-outs. They will punish Pup. But Pup has the cool stuff in his urine that actually calms other animals. When a dog charges up to Pup, and starts to give him what for, Pup can spray (involuntarily) a little pee and the charging dog will smell the pharamone or whatever it is, and realize, "Oh, this is just a youngin'." and generally it will go on it way realizing it is no threat whatsoever, and it has the message. 

Now, I really don't buy into all the alpha theory stuff, but I do buy into puppies and their pee. And they do translate this to their humans. If I have a puppy leaking when I give it a command or try to get it from here to there, I realize that I need to back down a little. 

Critters do not all cower and cringe or slink when they feel fear. In fact, some bark and lunge, and people think they are dominant or aggressive. Still others shut down, and refuse to try to do what is desired, and people think they are stubborn. Fear manifests itself in many ways, and submissive (or excited) urination is one of them. I think the term anxious urination is a better description, because it is ALWAYS due to a lack of confidence in the situation.

This DOES NOT mean your pup is defective. It simply means he needs to become more comfortable in the situation. Maybe that means you need to back down in your training and how you command your puppy to do what you want. For example, I personally would not open my front door and order a pup of this age to lie there and wait -- too dangerous. I would put a lead on the pup, tell him to sit and then wait, and then open the door. If he does not bounce through at the first opportunity, reward. But I would not let be at the point where I would trust the pup to lay at my feet while the perils and people in the front yard were open to him. 

To save your floors, why not take the pup out the back door, where there hopefully is a fence and fewer distractions. Front door is off limits totally. Then if you want to leave the yard to go for a walk into the crazyness of the front, which is causing some anxiety in the pup -- you call it excitement, go into the front from the back yard. Then if he squirts a little it will be outside, no harm, no foul. 

After all that, tell me what this is:

3.5 year old dog, Canine Good Citizen, Therapy Dog, AKC titles, never any problem with submissive or inappropriate urination. I took the boy over to his breeder's home so they could see him. He peed all over the woman's foot. Talk about embarrassed.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

I actually think more dogs would do it except they have indeed developed some sphincter control.
We have a few boys who, when you pick them up to do their nails or something, will sniff their "boy parts" when you put them back down.
THEY think they did, but they didn't.

The thing to keep in mind is urine is, to us, a mess to clean.
To dogs, it's wayyy more. 
To dogs, it's communication.
Unfortunately, people get too irritated about the mess to listen


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## Mary Beth (Apr 17, 2010)

I don't have this problem, but it could happen with another pup. So, I am learning, what great tips. Marshies, tarping down the carpet - now, this is smart - why didn't I think of that- I will do that next time I puppy train. Selzer - you gave me a much needed dog's point of view on the urine issue and a laugh on this cold blue Monday.


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

Well, I think that about wraps it up. Thanks for the all good advice. I appreciate the input.


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## ishootfriendlies (Jun 27, 2012)

So this is an old thread I started, and here we are almost 8 months later with the same problem.

I took a lot of the advice from this thread:
1. Ignore the involuntary peeing
2. Make the situation more familiar
3. Reward calm behavior
4. Have the vet check him
5. Pee before an exciting situation

The problem has not subsided. He is now 15 months, and he still does a little squirt of pee meeting people (even people he has met dozens of times), at the door, and whenever you put his leash on or take it off. Every time.

Even if I take him out and he empties his bladder, 30 seconds later when I take off his leash will do a healthy squirt of pee. He has never been hurt by a stranger or when he was getting his leash attached, so this is really baffling.

The only thing that has changed is the amount (more now than before) and he actually squats a little now, which he did not do before.

Any additional suggestions? Has anyone had a dog with this behavior this late in life that spontaneously cleared up later? Any help is appreciated.


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## NNorthern (Aug 2, 2013)

I had a rescue dog that was 4 years old at the time I adopted him. He would do this every time I came home, or when people came to the door. He also did it when I leashed him. He was abused by his previous family and suffered abandonment issues.

I don't know if you have tried this or not but I would kneel to get on his level to greet him, leash him, and do it as calmly as possible. Very little talking, maybe soft "encouraging" words at times.

I instructed any visitors people in unfamiliar situations to do the same. It stopped within a few weeks completely. Hope that helps.


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