# Overnight in Crate - No breaks?



## eckjon (Feb 23, 2012)

First time poster here (and yes, I've used the search function  )

Seems there's an infinite amount of information out there regarding crate training for the young pup. 

My wife and I brought _Luna_ home a week ago at roughly eight weeks of age. We adore her! She is our first pet together and being such, each and every experience is a new/unique one!

Our breeder recommended that we leave her in a crate overnight, apart from our bedroom. (In our case this is downstairs, next to our kitchen in a quiet area). I was under the assumption that we should be getting up every night several times to bring her outside for the first several weeks. 

HOWEVER, back to our breeder, she strongly refuted this. Saying that this would only create a dependance on us waking up in the night. That we should deal with the mess for the first several weeks and eventually she will learn not to use her crate as a restroom.

Is this counterproductive? Will this dramatically effect her crate experience? 

So really, in two parts my questions are:

1.) Is it okay to leave her in her crate over the course of the whole night, thus dealing with any "pee mess" in the morning and eventually she will be able to control her bladder for that ~8 hour timeframe?

2.) Having her kennel in a much different part of the house than us as opposed to our bedroom. Is this okay to begin with?

Thank you!


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

eckjon said:


> First time poster here (and yes, I've used the search function  )
> 
> Seems there's an infinite amount of information out there regarding crate training for the young pup.
> 
> ...


No, and no.

If they are close to you you can hear them fuss or if you are a sound sleeper then set you alarm. They need to go out every couple of hours at that age. The amount of time will increase fairly rapidly over the next couple of months.

Later on you can move the crate if you don't want them in your room for some reason.

You are teaching her to go where she sleeps. I have never heard anything so stupid recommended by a breeder.


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## sashadog (Sep 2, 2011)

Jack's Dad said:


> No, and no.
> 
> I have never heard anything so stupid recommended by a breeder.


I have never heard that recommended by anyone! I know dogs are people but you wouldn't follow that advice with a newborn would you? Listen to Jacks Dad


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## kiya (May 3, 2010)

Hi and welcome.
I prefer my pup/dogs to be in my bedroom at night. If the crate is too big you could find a mess. I never had any problems with my pups at 8wks old holding it over night. Normally my last potty trip is around 10pm and I am up by 5am. I get fully dressed & put a leash on and get right outside so there is no accidents. 
Some people leave their pups in another room overnight. All of my dogs know at night when its bedtime they go to their bed, which is in my bedroom.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

Yes and no. I have a pup (different breed) who will be 9 weeks old on Sunday. Last night was the third night in a row that he slept through the night, with no potty breaks. His choice. No messes in the crate. I do not withhold water, but leave him a small amount in his kennel at night. He has a bully stick and a rubber teething ring and I can hear him playing with it night. 

The difference is I've changed my sleep pattern to help him with his crate/potty training. Whereas I used to go to bed around 8:30 pm and up at 4:30 am - I now go to bed at 10:30 pm and up at 4:30. That means his 'night time down time' is maxed at 6 hours. This works for him. It works for me. As he gets older, I'll increase his time. 

Our last potty break is outside on a leash. We slowly walk through the yard at a pace that keeps his feet moving and doesn't allow play time, but allows him to easily hesitate when he needs to eliminate. If it take 30 minutes...it takes 30 minutes. Once he eliminates I'll continue the same thing for 5 minutes or so to make sure he doesn't have to poop as well and/or to make sure he is completely finished. 

He is in another room, but I can hear him from my bedroom. If I left him in my bedroom he'd cry when I'd move in bed. This wasn't working for either of us. When my GSD was a puppy, I could leave him in the bedroom with me. It worked for him as well as me. It depends on the puppy. You have to be flexible. 

If you can't hear your pup, you need to move her closer.


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## 4score (Nov 4, 2011)

Yes, that's nutty advice. We just got our puppy in mid-December and he was 8 weeks old. We set our alarm a couple times during the night. The trick is to take them out with as little excitement as possible. No playing, etc. Bring them right back in and straight back into the crate. We wouldn't even say much during the process. Dogs don't want to go potty in their sleeping quarters and you shouldn't put your pup in a position to have to. After a couple weeks, we moved to once per night. Then we pushed the time later and later until just recently, we found he could hold it till 1st thing in the morning (given he'd gone potty at 10:30 PM or so). A lot of people crate in the bedroom to give the pup reassurances, but our bedroom is upstairs and a far trip from the door, so we leave the crate in the family room near the back door. He was totally used to us leaving him there after a couple nights. Good luck and congrats on the new puppy!


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## eckjon (Feb 23, 2012)

4score said:


> Yes, that's nutty advice. We just got our puppy in mid-December and he was 8 weeks old. We set our alarm a couple times during the night. The trick is to take them out with as little excitement as possible. No playing, etc. Bring them right back in and straight back into the crate. We wouldn't even say much during the process. Dogs don't want to go potty in their sleeping quarters and you shouldn't put your pup in a position to have to. After a couple weeks, we moved to once per night. Then we pushed the time later and later until just recently, we found he could hold it till 1st thing in the morning (given he'd gone potty at 10:30 PM or so). A lot of people crate in the bedroom to give the pup reassurances, but our bedroom is upstairs and a far trip from the door, so we leave the crate in the family room near the back door. He was totally used to us leaving him there after a couple nights. Good luck and congrats on the new puppy!


 
Regarding the crate location - that's the issue we are facing as well. 

Is getting up in the middle of the night a few times sufficient, or should we go through the process of keeping her in our crate, in our bedroom, bringing her downstairs, outside and the opposite again to go back to bed?

Given the small sample size of the past week, she seems to do okay apart from us. She'll whine the first ten minutes or so, than presumably fall asleep (or at least quiet down). I suppose by the time she does wake up again in the middle of the night either my snoring :blush: or our fan covers the noise.


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## phgsd (Jun 6, 2004)

I would not let the puppy out of its crate if she's barking; however to me the first priority is that puppies don't have accidents in their crate. Then they learn it's okay to have accidents in the crate and it may be very difficult to break that habit.
I prefer to crate where I can't hear the puppy throw a fit, until it has learned to be quiet, since it might be barking for a long time. But when we lived in an apartment building that wasn't an option because it would have disturbed the neighbors, so I had the crate in the bedroom with us initially. With Kira I was able to crate on the other end of the house which was nice - because she was one determined barker!!! A month later she is much better and is able to hold it thru the night.


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## bocron (Mar 15, 2009)

Like many others here, I have housebroken/crate trained a zillion dogs over the years. To the point where I don't even think about it anymore. We've had 4 puppies in the last 2 years not to mention how many client puppies in our training/daycare/boarding facility. 
We keep pups crate in the bedroom. This is not a hard, fast rule, just what works for us. I have clients who don't have the room in the bedroom or just have an issue with it, and they keep the crate elsewhere in the house, maybe a mudroom or laundry, whatever. If that is the case I advise them to get a baby monitor or set an alarm. It is not a forever thing, maybe 3-4 weeks at most.
First I will say that for us the crate we use in the bedroom is a puppy sized crate, not the huge one for an adult GSD. Since we generally get ours trained (at least for overnight in the bedroom) by about 5 mos we don't bother with a big crate for this purpose.
I absolutely get up in the night and take the puppy out. Especially if they make noise in the middle of the night. Now if I get up and stumble outside half asleep, that pup better go potty! Also, when the pup is very young I carry them outside during those nighttime trips. I don't want the pup to have the opportunity to go before we get out the door! 
Usually most pups don't need the middle of the night potty break after 11-12 weeks at the latest. By then you should have a good idea of their potty habits (do they have to go immediately after a meal or do they take a while, that type of thing). 
Then they need to go potty immediately upon waking in the morning. Our alarms start going off around 6:45 around here, and kids start getting up to get ready for school, so a sleeping puppy will get woken no matter what. I make sure as soon as the household starts getting noisy that I carry the pup outside again to go again (usually for this trip another 2-3 GSDs will be going out as well so it's pretty easy to get them to go). While we get the kids fed and to the bus the pup is put back in the crate with a special chew thing(a kong filled with cheese or biljac) and then goes out again when I get back from the bus stop trip. (we have to drive, if we walked I might take the pup on leash for practice). Puppy gets supervised play time with DH and me and usually another dog or two. Then while I take my shower pup gets put back in crate with breakfast. Usually they will eat and then take a nap. Then I load up all the dogs and head to work(the dogs all go with me).
This structured way of doing it may seem a bit OCD to some, but I will say that of the last half a dozen pups we trained we only had 2 accidents in the house, EVER. Both of those were due to an issue that required a vet visit, so I'd love to think that we would have had none otherwise LOL.
I will also add that all of our pups come with me to work at our kennel everyday so they are very tired at night and sleep VERY well. To me, if they wake up when they are that pooped, then there is a reason. And just like with kids, you will wake up one morning and realize you didn't get woken up. 
Once ours outgrow the puppy crate they sleep loose in the bedroom on a dog bed. We have a big crate in the basement for when we need to leave them unsupervised during the day, but they are fine sleeping loose in the bedroom with a few select chew toys around if needed.


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## Dakotasmom23 (Jan 11, 2012)

I agree with the others. I've btdt with countless dogs. The puppy/new dogs are always in a crate in my bedroom. And I always get up with a new puppy several times in the middle of the night. Always; its just part of the deal for several weeks, then the puppy stops waking in the middle of the night. Your instincts are right, so follow them and forget the useless info you received from a breeder.


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## Fedfire37 (Feb 23, 2012)

Hello, new guy here. I just brought home an 8 week old GSD yesterday. This is my second GSD. I got my last one when she was 5 years old and she was already housebroken and obedience trained. My wife and I are new to the puppy world. I bought a crate with a partition and made it just big enough for the pup to lay down, turn around etc. We keep the crate in our bedroom where the dog can see us and I can see her if I peek my head over the side of the bed. She had to go pretty much every hour on the hour last night. She pooped twice in her crate and peed 4 or 5 times. I'm a light sleeper and would wake to the sound of her licking or eating the mess. She was in lousy conditions when we got her. She had feces stuck in her fur and between her toes. I was glad to get her away from that awful breeder but I'm afraid he created a monster. It seems as though I have 2 problems here. The first being that she goes in her crate and gets covered in it, the second being that she is eating it. How should I go about working with her on this? I got up probably 4 or 5 times and brought her outside after she had already gone. She just wants to go right back in. I'm at work getting reports from my wife that she's doing a little better. Only a couple potties in the house today. Is it normal for her to have to go so many times throughout the night? We gave her last water around 7:00 pm and we were in bed by 10:00.


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## Angelina03 (Jan 9, 2012)

I got up to take Rocco out several times a night the first week and then it slowly became less and less times a night. With Rocco though, he had to be with us in the room. Once Rocco was able to hold it all night, he would still cry a few times a night and wake us up (we had him on the other side if the house). I noticed this because he wasn't needing to go potty. As soon as I put his crate in the bedroom, bingo!! Slept like a baby ALL night long.


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## [email protected] (Feb 7, 2012)

Fedfire37 said:


> Hello, new guy here. I just brought home an 8 week old GSD yesterday. This is my second GSD. I got my last one when she was 5 years old and she was already housebroken and obedience trained. My wife and I are new to the puppy world. I bought a crate with a partition and made it just big enough for the pup to lay down, turn around etc. We keep the crate in our bedroom where the dog can see us and I can see her if I peek my head over the side of the bed. She had to go pretty much every hour on the hour last night. She pooped twice in her crate and peed 4 or 5 times. I'm a light sleeper and would wake to the sound of her licking or eating the mess. She was in lousy conditions when we got her. She had feces stuck in her fur and between her toes. I was glad to get her away from that awful breeder but I'm afraid he created a monster. It seems as though I have 2 problems here. The first being that she goes in her crate and gets covered in it, the second being that she is eating it. How should I go about working with her on this? I got up probably 4 or 5 times and brought her outside after she had already gone. She just wants to go right back in. I'm at work getting reports from my wife that she's doing a little better. Only a couple potties in the house today. Is it normal for her to have to go so many times throughout the night? We gave her last water around 7:00 pm and we were in bed by 10:00.


We have an 11 week old pup that we have had since she was 6 weeks old. It's been about 9 years since I have had a puppy and I had forgotten how much energy and patience they require. We have a 3 story house and a crate with a divider like the one you described in our basement. I put the puppy in the crate and we went to bed about 10:00. Our bedroom is on the 3rd floor so I couldn't hear anything. I set the alarm and took her out 3 times during the night. At 6:00 the next morning I woke up to hear her BAWLING. I ran down stairs and she had pooed in her crate. I felt horrible.... 
She had it all over her and she looked at me so disappointed, I felt worthless. I ended up moving a spare bed to our basement and I have been sleeping down there with her while my husband is still in our bedroom. (It's a sacrifice but it is worth it). She doesn't cry at all when I put her in her crate and she is sleeping thru the night now. I take her out before bed around 10 and then first thing in the am at around 6:00 or so. I'm a lite sleeper so if she makes a peep during the night I wake up and take her out. So far she has only had the one accident the first night. 
It's hard work but the payoff is priceless. Good Luck with your puppy.
P.S. I'm going to try to sleep in my bedroom this weekend and see how it goes so wish me luck. ;-)


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## Jo_in_TX (Feb 14, 2012)

If you don't want to wake up during the night and you don't think your pup can get more than a couple of hours, you can set up your pup in a confined area like the laundry room with layers of newspaper on the floor. Just make sure the area is PUPPY PROOFED! Continue taking your pup outside during the day, and right before bed, and first thing in the morning.

Within just a couple of weeks, you will notice that your pup's bladder has gotten stronger, and you can then begin crate training in earnest and achieve success pretty quickly.

Good luck.


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## 1sttimeforgsd (Jul 29, 2010)

My pup was kept in the bedroom with me and I am a very light sleeper. He was not crated I just had his bed next to mine and every time that I heard him stirring I would pick him up and carry him outside to go potty. He was confined to my bedroom but I would put him back in his bed next to mine and tell him to go night-night. Maybe I was just lucky but my lab was trained the same way, whenever they stirred out they went no matter how many times it took. Everyone just have patience, it is so nice after they get through the housebreaking stage. 

The only time I used a crate was if we had to go somewhere, it was for his safety and ours.


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## 4score (Nov 4, 2011)

eckjon said:


> Regarding the crate location - that's the issue we are facing as well.
> 
> Is getting up in the middle of the night a few times sufficient, or should we go through the process of keeping her in our crate, in our bedroom, bringing her downstairs, outside and the opposite again to go back to bed?
> 
> Given the small sample size of the past week, she seems to do okay apart from us. She'll whine the first ten minutes or so, than presumably fall asleep (or at least quiet down). I suppose by the time she does wake up again in the middle of the night either my snoring :blush: or our fan covers the noise.


Every dog is different. Some require frequent breaks outside and some can make the transition to "all night in the crate" faster than others. I'd suggest picking a pattern and stick to it for a few weeks. Try 2 times at night with limiting how much water they get after 7 or 8 PM. I bring a flashlight with me and note how much the pup is going (relatively speaking). If he's only going lightly, then maybe back it down to only once per night. We did the once/night until 4.5 months when we tried 7 or 7.5 hours and it's working. 

I like having the crate right by the back door. It's real fast and easy to get him out of the crate and outside.


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## kidkhmer (Jul 14, 2010)

Both my dogs took to crating very quickly and in less than two weeks I was down to maybe only two wake-ups a night maximum. They also seem to learn real quick to whine if in a crate or paw you if sleeping next to you. Neither of them fouled their crates.

i suppose you have to ask yourself the question - how would you feel if you were temporarily bed bound for a week or so, were busting to go to the loo and your nurse rather than taking a moment to help you to the "zone",just let you piss yourself in the bed 

Not cool.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

we got our pup when he was 9 weeks old.
his crate was in the livingroom because
that was my way of teaching him independence.
during the night one of us got up every 2 hours to take him out.
when he was out of his crate and sleeping in our bedroom (door closed)
he would wake one of us up at 4:00 am to go out. that went on untill
he was 8 months old. we never denied him when he wanted to go out.


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## 1337f0x (Feb 21, 2012)

RE: Crating over night and not withholding water.

My puppy is a bit clumsy and likes to knock over his water bowl at least once a day. Can I put one of these on his crate at night?


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## bocron (Mar 15, 2009)

They don't need water over night. This will just make for a peeing nightmare!
When I take a pup out in the middle of the night I let them stop and get a drink before going back to the crate. Not a huge amount, just enough to wet their whistle. 
Of course you need to make sure they are not sleeping in a super warm situation, they shouldn't be panting all night.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

i took my pups water bowl away around 7:00 pm. having access
to water over night will make him pee more. pups like too
tip the water bowl and the food bowl. you're lucky, your
dog only tips the bowl once a day.



1337f0x said:


> RE: Crating over night and not withholding water.
> 
> My puppy is a >>>>bit clumsy and likes to knock over his water bowl at least once a day<<<<.
> 
> Can I put one of these on his crate at night?


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