# Stupid question about feeding



## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

I’ve been doing some research on puppy food vs all age foods, as well as adult food for large breeds. Most of the dogs I’ve had have been adult behavioral rescues, so I’m new to this whole puppy thing. Trying to research on my own is making my head spin. Every article I read contradicts the article before it.

We are currently feeding Fromm puppy (not grain free) for Seiran and Floki, and Crios and Lyka get Fromm adult (not grain free). Lyka is fat, she’s slowed down big time on exercise at her age, she was recently spayed, and was switched to a diet kibble from the vets office. She’s still fat. So we went back to the Fromm for her, and reduced the amount. She gets 2 1/2 cups per day. Crios gets 5 cups per day, and that’s just to maintain. He is two years old, and in some of my research, I found that keeping him on puppy food until he is three would be better for him because he isn’t fully developed, and has super high energy levels, and is always going going going. Then naps, wakes up, and is go go go again. 

But then during my research, it was recommend to mix adult with the puppy kibble to avoid too fast of a growth rate, which can cause joint and hip issues. 

So I’m just lost now. Should I do a mix or adult/puppy for both Crios and Seiran, keep Seiran strictly on puppy food, and keep Crios strictly on adult food? Crios is SKINNY at 5 cups of Fromm a day. Would mixing the puppy food in be helpful? Or should I switch to a completely different brand made for high energy dogs? 

All advice welcome. I’m swimming in articles that just lead to more questions and more confusion. Thanks!


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

I switched my WL to adult Fromm around 6-7 months old due to allergies. He still has allergies, though, which is a whole different issue. A lot of us think puppy food is a racket. It’s up to you, though.

How many calories are in the food? To gain weight, maybe switch to a higher density caloric food or add other things. 5 cups a day should be enough for nutrients.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

The first pic is the puppy food, second is the adult food.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

The puppy food is 3,993 calories a kcup.


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## LRP (May 8, 2019)

What made you spay Lyka? I thought you had said before you had no spayed females, did something change to make you spay her? 

Everything I have read said to switch from puppy to adult by the 1st year. Both my puppies (_7 and 8 months_) are on adult now though but getting 4 cups a day of dry and they split a can of wet food at dinner time. We feed the Kirkland brand as its more in our cost range with how much they go through. Its a good range of food for calories and nutrient and has the extra support for the hips/joints so I don't stress feeding it to them. They love it. 

https://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/kirkland-signature-dog-food/

They are both in a healthy body shape, even our female who has been spayed recently and just went through her health issue with the bug bite is super fit under all her fluff. 
Both dogs are extremely active. We feed to there body shape and activity level - if they are lazy and look thick, they will get less food. For now the 4 cups with added extra covers them and keeps them going.


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## Saco (Oct 23, 2018)

I feed Canidae. 468 kcal per cup, so quite calorie dense. They offer a breeder/performance home program so for every 5 bags I get one free. Affordable, quality, and no recalls ever that I am aware of.. good company. My dogs are very active. 

https://www.canidae.com/dog-food/products/canidae-all-life-stages-dry-formula/


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

LRP said:


> What made you spay Lyka? I thought you had said before you had no spayed females, did something change to make you spay her?
> 
> Everything I have read said to switch from puppy to adult by the 1st year. Both my puppies (_7 and 8 months_) are on adult now though but getting 4 cups a day of dry and they split a can of wet food at dinner time. We feed the Kirkland brand as its more in our cost range with how much they go through. Its a good range of food for calories and nutrient and has the extra support for the hips/joints so I don't stress feeding it to them. They love it.
> 
> ...


She had to have surgery for a vaginal prolapse, and she had a mammary tumor that my previous vet was hesitant on spaying her for fear of the tumor being opened to air and infecting her whole body with cancerous tumors. But the tumor had gotten so large that Lyka was in pain anytime she tried to lay down. Our current vet was confident she could do both the spay and the tumor removal at the same time, and it worked out wonderfully. We had her spayed because her uterus wasn’t in top shape from multiple litters, and we didn’t want to go into another surgery down the road of issues popped up with her uterus.


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## Quinnsmom (Dec 27, 2008)

Jchrest said:


> The puppy food is 3,993 calories a kcup.



I think you mean per Kilogram :wink2: It should run around 400 kcal per cup.


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## LRP (May 8, 2019)

Jchrest said:


> She had to have surgery for a vaginal prolapse, and she had a mammary tumor that my previous vet was hesitant on spaying her for fear of the tumor being opened to air and infecting her whole body with cancerous tumors. But the tumor had gotten so large that Lyka was in pain anytime she tried to lay down. Our current vet was confident she could do both the spay and the tumor removal at the same time, and it worked out wonderfully. We had her spayed because her uterus wasn’t in top shape from multiple litters, and we didn’t want to go into another surgery down the road of issues popped up with her uterus.


Oh that is wonderful you were able to find a vet that could take on the challenge successfully. Do they think the mammary tumor was from not spaying her earlier or breeding her?


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Quinnsmom said:


> Jchrest said:
> 
> 
> > The puppy food is 3,993 calories a kcup.
> ...


Yes, thanks for catching that for me!


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

When I got Lyka, she had just had a litter, and the tumor was already noticeable by then, so they couldn’t even hazard a guess. My current vet said the size of the tumor and rate of growth pointed towards it being more likely from feeding pups, but also couldn’t tell me exactly. Another of the mystery things about getting a rescue, you will never know the dogs full medical history. She’s more than worth it though. Not a “mistake” I would hesitate taking on again.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

It looks like there is no difference in the two ingredients lists you posted.Unless you for the bags mixed upThe second picture says 382 calories per cup.
I'm no expert by any means,but usually puppy food contains a little more protein than the adult food,and maybe fat also(don't remember).The last three puppies I raised I fed them adult food and added some extra protein myself-eggs,chicken,or beef in their evening meal.It just seemed easier when there are multiple dogs.Anyway that's one option that might work for you.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Let me try again. I never know what order screen shots come in!

First is the puppy food, second is the adult food.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Makes sense now,lol!One thing I forgot - excess calcium is what is problematic for bone growth.Some puppy food has way too much.That's all of the tiny bit of wisdom I have about dog nutrition


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

dogma13 said:


> Makes sense now,lol!


I’ll get it down one of these days ?. 

In my dream world, I’d just mix a bag of puppy kibble with adult kibble, and feed it to all of them that way. But my dream world doesn’t include an overweight senior ?.


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## 4K9Mom (Jun 19, 2019)

Generally, the advice is to stick with puppy food for puppies. Adult food may lack calories, protein or fat that the puppy needs. If the pup eats more adult food to compensate for this, she may end up consuming more calcium than is healthy and you may end up doing exactly what you’re trying to avoid orthopedically.

Right now, I actually have four dogs (including a puppy) and each eats a different food —and one of those is a mix of two foods because she doesn’t like either of the ultra low fat foods much but together, she thinks they’re fine. 

Pain in the neck? Yep. My dog gear room looks like a Vegas buffet. 

Best for them? Absolutely.


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## 4K9Mom (Jun 19, 2019)

dogma13 said:


> Makes sense now,lol!One thing I forgot - excess calcium is what is problematic for bone growth.Some puppy food has way too much.That's all of the tiny bit of wisdom I have about dog nutrition


That’s why we choose large breed puppy food.

Oh, for the OP, there are some pretty good low fat foods out there.

Fromm makes one if you want a grain based diet.

https://frommfamily.com/products/dog/gold/dry/weight-management-gold/

This is an excellent food. I don’t like legumes based food, but if your goal is to get the dog down to a decent weight then reintroduce (or mix with) her regular food, I think the food is fine for a short while. 

http://www.annamaet.com/products/Lean_Formula


If we simply decrease the quantity of food an overweight dog is getting, then we’re also shorting her all those nutrients she should be receiving. Best to put her on a low fat diet, get her moving more and go from there.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

@4K9Mom, I appreciate the info! I’ll keep the pups on the pup formula. Do you have any recommendations about what to do with the 2yr old? He’s 75% GSD, 25% Husky. He acts and looks like a husky. Energy levels through the roof, and is always on the move. He’s the only one I can’t pin down diet wise. He gets 5 cups a day, which is “excessive” according to the vet. But she also thinks Lyka doesn’t have a weight problem ?. Vets aren’t the best at recommending healthy diets. 

Should I switch him to a different food altogether that is more calorie dense? A sports food? Or leave him on the Fromm and do add ins? I know no one can say for sure what is best for each individual dog, but any advice that would help make it stop looking like we starve him and overfeed Lyka would be appreciated! He has a healthy coat, we keep him groomed, but we still get those looks when people see him in public. He looks like a skinny street dog. Added pics of my fatty and Crios. I can’t get Crios to stay still long enough to get a great pic though. And every standing pic I have of him has him standing over Lyka.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

4K9Mom said:


> dogma13 said:
> 
> 
> > Makes sense now,lol!One thing I forgot - excess calcium is what is problematic for bone growth.Some puppy food has way too much.That's all of the tiny bit of wisdom I have about dog nutrition
> ...


At the 2 1/2 cups, she isn’t underfed by the chart recommendations. Her normal weight has always been between 50-55lbs. She’s at 67 now. We recently started the Adequin(sp) injections for her hips, so we are hoping her activity level will increase soon. On the diet kibble, we were feeding so much more per day than what she gets on the Fromm because of the lower calorie levels. So the recommendations on the diet food had her eating twice as much, and she rarely finished any of it.


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## 4K9Mom (Jun 19, 2019)

Oh, I never feed what the bag says to feed. I swear those guides are just there to sell more dog food! 

Anyhow, I hope your girl is on her way to a healthy svelte body soon!


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## Mvp (Oct 21, 2018)

Just wanted to share a formula my vet told me for growing puppies for total daily calories. Weight in kilograms x 30 + 70 x growth factor of 1.4= daily calories 

Also a link on dog food. https://cbsloc.al/2xl4pEP


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## crittersitter (Mar 31, 2011)

I would not keep a dog on puppy food up to age 3. Even Fromm only has feeding recommendations on their large breed puppy food up until 24 months. Most have mine don't stay on large breed puppy beyond 18 months if that. Just watch the calcium/phosphorus levels on whatever you feed while they are growing.


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## Femfa (May 29, 2016)

The food I feed is all life stages, and in comparison to its puppy-focused kibble, there’s only about four differences: 20 calories more a cup, 7% more protein, 2% more fat, and slightly higher levels of added glucosamine and chondroitin in the puppy food. The calcium and phosphorous levels are almost identical, with one being 1.1:0.91 and the other being 1.1:0.8. 

So I think it just depends on the formulas and what works for you and your dog. I don’t think my puppy needs 35% protein, and the extra 20 calories aren’t going to make a huge difference. Everything else is so minor it isn’t going to be life altering. With Ryka, I switched to an all-life stages food at 6 months. Currently the food I feed now is so similar in quality between all-life stages and puppy I just didn’t see a reason to buy a completely different bag for almost identical product.


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