# Dena had cancer



## Cassidy's Mom

I got a call from our vet yesterday afternoon. He got back the pathology report, and it turns out that she had lymphoma. He didn't check her brain or bone marrow, but it didn't matter, there was enough information from her organs. There were no signs that she was sick up until 4 weeks ago, but apparently she had been, we have no idea how long. There were small tumors in her liver, her lungs and her kidneys. At the end she developed DIC, disseminated intravascular coagulation, a clotting disorder that is a complication of some cancers, infection, liver disease, and even blood transfusions, causing internal or external bleeding. Her heart had hemorrhaged, which is what probably finally killed her. 

On an earlier visit, cancer was mentioned as a possibility – he said it’s always on the list, but it was low on the list because we had all these other symptoms that led in a different direction. And potentially obvious signs, such as enlarged lymph nodes, were not apparent. Her white cell count was on the low end of the normal range, as were her lymphocytes. He believes whatever she ate caused an insult to the digestive tract and all these other symptoms – the fever, the diarrhea, the autoimmune anemia, and because she was already sick, it overwhelmed her system. But she would have died young in any case. 

Having answers is always better than no answers, and it does help to the extent that I can let go of the regrets that we didn't do enough - more tests, more treatments, none of it would have made a difference, she was not going to recover from this. I did some reading about lymphoma last night, and although I haven't discussed it with the vet yet, it seems like it was a catch 22 situation. You need to boost the immune system to fight lymphoma, but her immune system was killing her red blood cells and platelets. You need to suppress the immune system to reverse that process, but then the lymphoma is unchecked. I don't know if that's exactly what happened, but it seems like treating one problem would hasten the progression of the other, no matter which problem we treated. 

If she hadn't gotten sick a few weeks ago, her lymphoma may have been undiagnosed awhile longer, until she started showing symptoms. Untreated, dogs typically last 4-6 weeks after diagnosis. With treatment they can go into remission for 6 months, a year, a year and a half, but most do not last much longer than that. I would have gladly taken that extra time with her, but it wasn't in the cards. 

Dr. Schuchman has spoken to an oncologist, and is waiting to hear back from another specialist. I know he wanted to save her, and is trying to find out what happened, if there was anything that he missed that should have led him in that direction. He's doing this on his own, we had actually decided not to request a necropsy, partly due to the expense - it's one thing to spend thousands of dollars to make your dog better, but another thing entirely to spend thousands of dollars only to lose her, and then spend more, but also I was afraid to find out that a decision that we made may have caused her death. So it's comforting to know that there wasn't anything more we could have done, but it makes me incredibly sad to know that she was always doomed to live such a short life. 

We need to go back to settle the bill, (although I have a feeling we won't be charged for a lot of stuff), and to pick up her bed, so I'm going to make sure that we go when Dr. Schuchman is there so we can talk with him and ask more questions. I'd like him to go over it with Tom there too because I know I missed a bunch of stuff the doctor said. I tried to take notes, but there were medical terms I'm not familiar with, and I think he'll want to ask questions of his own.


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## LJsMom

I'm glad you know what took Dena to the bridge. Its all so sad.


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## valb

Thank you for letting us know. I don't think I will ever really 
understand cancer. How a dog that is so seemingly healthy could
have been living with that hidden.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

I am glad you found out. Nina had lymphoma as well. What the internists and oncologists (along with all the other teams working on her-endicrinology was involved I've found it out as well as neurology) from Cornell said, when I decided not to do the additional testing needed to set her up for chemo (which was a hindsight wonderful decision-she would have passed away there before she could have even started chemo) was that if the prednisilone didn't give her a boost, that chemo wouldn't have worked either. 

So I hope that helps you-Dena was on steroids and got no bump from it.









Please let me know if you have any questions. I did try to do a crash course on lymphoma in the few days from her diagnosis to her passing. There are "good" lymphomas-where dogs go into remission and live a great life-there is one on IMOM right now-a lab, who has been around for a while. 

I do hope that this is something that the vet thinks about though-when you have a case that is so complicated, refer out to a facility with teams of people who do that type of work all the time. 

Maybe I shouldn't say that. I am though because in reading this result I feel that there was nothing that a diagnosis would have done, other than prepare you better, and even with that, you are never really prepared. I am saying it so that other people can ask for referrals and also so that you know that this was something where you did everything you could, and that nothing you could have done would have changed that tragic outcome-diagnosis or not-so you are not to feel badly at all. But vets need to use the resources available to them, like we all do in our jobs. If you want this edited out, I won't be upset. 

I am so sorry that a dog that young could have such an awful version of that disease. And I feel so badly that you had to go through something like that with her. It is an awful experience.


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## GSDLoverII

At least you will have some closure now, knowing what it was that took Dena's life.
Thank you for letting us know.


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## Annikas Mom

I am glad you have closure, it doesn't bring her back but it does help to have an actual diagnosis. Lymphoma is one of the terrible cancers that take our beloved breed way too young.

I totally understand spending thousands of dollars only to lose her, I would have spent thousands more if I could have saved Annika but her frail body couldn't take anymore... We never did get a diagnosis from her necropsy which is very difficult, not knowing messes with my mind often... We had 6 different doctors woking on Annika's case at the time but one of the doctors, on her own time, spent weeks researching the necrospy results and discussing them with many specialists all over the country. I think she was as devastated as we were that we lost Annika. She has a picture of Annika on her desk. My gut tells me this is the kind of vet you have, they are priceless!!

I think of you and Tom everyday and hope that you are able to smile through your tears when the memories come flooding back at the most unexpected times. Dena took a piece of all of our hearts with her when she died but I know that piece is much bigger for you and Tom...

Hugs to you both.


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## GSD10

Debbie, 

I also am glad for you and Tom that you have some answers. I agree, knowing is better than not knowing, although still not taking away from the tragedy and sadness of it all for your loss. 

I don't know what is going on in the world of dogs were cancer is just much to common these days. 

I am thinking of you all. How is Keefer holding up?


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## LJsMom

Well said Jean.


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## Cassidy's Mom

> Originally Posted By: JeanKBBMMMAANI do hope that this is something that the vet thinks about though-when you have a case that is so complicated, refer out to a facility with teams of people who do that type of work all the time.
> 
> Maybe I shouldn't say that. I am though because in reading this result I feel that there was nothing that a diagnosis would have done, other than prepare you better, and even with that, you are never really prepared. I am saying it so that other people can ask for referrals and also so that you know that this was something where you did everything you could, and that nothing you could have done would have changed that tragic outcome-diagnosis or not-so you are not to feel badly at all. But vets need to use the resources available to them, like we all do in our jobs. If you want this edited out, I won't be upset.


No, it's fine Jean. I agree that it could be helpful for others. If it had been JUST the autoimmune anemia the prognosis would not have been great, I read on one site that the survival rate is 40-60%. And if it had been JUST lymphoma, we would have had her a bit longer, but it seems like she had the perfect storm of illness. Everything we could do to treat her could potentially cause life threatening complications. But not doing it was potentially life threatening as well. 

I know that my vet is trying to learn as much as he can about what happened, and I really appreciate his commitment. He's doing this on his own because he wants to, not because we insisted. She's gone, nothing we learn now will change that, but there may be lessons here that could help another dog at another time.


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## littledmc17

Again I am so sorry about Dena not fair she was way to you.
At least you have answers not that it brings your sweet girl back to you but it is closure. 
You did everything you possibly could for her, she knows it and loves you for it.
I hate the fact that cancer can get our babies and its not fair they can't tell us whats wrong with thing to a point.

SHe is running around in no pain now, waiting for the day she can be reunited with you. 

Hugs and we are all with you in this loss she was a beauty


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## djpohn

Deb,

I am so sorry to hear this. I am glad that your vet did the necropsy. It is very important to know what happened and what went wrong for the next dog that your vet will see with similar symptoms. Especially since Keefer is related to her. The county will usually do them for a lower fee. He might want to check with some of the hospitally studying the genetics of cancer and maybe donate some of her tissue for them to study.

My male Rainer was diagnosed with Lymphoma last year, just before his 4th birthday. He went through chemo and has been doing great for the past year. We were one month short of our 1 year anniversy of ending his chemo treatments this week when the oncolgist detected a slight increase in a lymph node and did a needle aspirit. Cancer cell were detected and we began chemo treatments on Wednseday. I know some dogs who are over 3 years in remission so if caught early enough, especially if the dog is healthy otherwise, lymphoma is treatable. 

I would recommend you vet looking into the blood and tissue tests available so you can monitor Keefer. There is a genetic predisposition in some dogs for the cancer cells to develop similar to people. Looking back I can definately see how the lymphoma snuck up on us, subtle and not so subtle signs.

One of our rescue dogs who was being treated for low grade lymphoma came down with some of the symptoms Dena had. He had chem in the spring and was doing really well until he had a nose bleed, then has swelling in his legs and belly a few weeks later. He ran into the same immune issues with his blood and was forming clots in his organs etc. While there are treatments for the individual problems, when the system is failing, usually there isn't anything to be done. Dino went home with his foster mom and died peacefully in his sleep as well.

Losing a dog is never easy, but one so young is tragic. I am glad you found out what happened, even if it doesn't change things for her, maybe it will save a life in the futer. I hope time eases the pain of your loss.


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## maxismom

Deb, I am so so sorry! I was not aware that Dena had even been ill. My heart goes out to you, your DH and your furkids. Having recently lost 2 of my own girls, I know the pain you are all going through < HUGS > to you all.







Sweet Dena


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## marylou

I'm so sorry.


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## WiscTiger

Deb, I am so sorry but at least you know what caused her to spiral down so fast. 

Jean I am glad you posted about Nina.

Val


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## Cassidy's Mom

> Originally Posted By: valbHow a dog that is so seemingly healthy could
> have been living with that hidden.


I know, when he told me that yesterday, I was very surprised. Up until her birthday she was the same happy playful dog she always was. Even in retrospect, there was no indication of a problem. It's possible that she hadn't had it long, it can be very aggressive. It's also unusual in such a young dog.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Nina went to the vet almost monthly for checkups-to make sure her pyoderma was under control. The only thing that I had noticed, that I had them check, was a puffiness in her trunk. But at the same time, her weight had gone up-so...

So she had bloodwork done in JUNE (3 months), monthly checkups, and until her rear legs began to weaken, she seemed totally healthy. In fact, I went through pictures like a maniac, trying to see if there was something I could have seen-and she looked great. She had been running through the back yard with the others right up until she had trouble with the stairs. 

I hope this helps. 

I had a feeling that an infection was in the works when that started, but it was lymphoma. Did they know if it was T cell-I am guessing it was?


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## luanne

Well, I'm glad that you did get answers. I would want answers if it was me.

Hang in there....

Lu


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## elsie




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## 3K9Mom

Dena. Didn't want to worry you by being sick. So like her.

I'm glad you have the information you needed. I hope you find peace with that. 








Deb, Tom and Keefer.


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## chuckstar158

Hugs to your family. i'm sure it helps a little to know what took her but probably not enough...


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## mspiker03

> Originally Posted By: 3K9MomI'm glad you have the information you needed. I hope you find peace with that.
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Ditto!








to you all


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## Kayla's Dad

> Originally Posted By: mspiker03
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> Originally Posted By: 3K9MomI'm glad you have the information you needed. I hope you find peace with that.
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Click to expand...

I'll third the above. Glad you were able to get some information to ease this some.


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## Superpup

I am so sorry to hear that, but like you said, at least you know this was more or less inevitable..(sp)







that is so scary, one day our dogs look like they are in perfect health, next day you are spending thousands of dollars trying to get them better and then in a couple of weeks, they may not be there. SO scary. I always get scared when my animals get sick. My Odin -Bengal cat- has had some crystals in his urine and I have taken him to the vet and he is eating special diet, but I always fear the worst, what if it is not working etc etc...







The same when Cody just recently had a stomach flu, or something similar.. he refused to eat, refused to drink water, this is a dog that has never missed a meal, infact he tries to make everyone believe that he is constantly STARVING.. but not a few weeks ago, he was totally depressed, not eating.. he pulled through, but all the hand feeding and vomiting, diarrhea made me really scared...
Rest in peace Dena!! Hugs to you and your family! ARe you gonna have Keefer tested, or are there tests that you can take him?


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## Prinzsalpha

Is the cancer also genetic? Will you get your remaining gorgeous boy tested now since they are from the same breeder?
You did the absolute best with the symptoms presented. She knew you loved her and were trying to help!


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## Cassidy's Mom

I don't know if there's any kind of testing, but I will be asking the vet about it. Keefer is her half sibling, so if there's a genetic predisposition that's definitely a concern. I emailed the breeder and gave her all the info, and she asked the same question.


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## kshort

Cancer is such a horrible disease and so unpredictable. My dad was 83, selling real estate part-time, having a great time and feeling terrific. Three weeks later he was gone. I know he lived a full life, but it was shocking to not have seen any signs at all except in those last few weeks. 

Debbie, I hope it has given you some peace of mind knowing the cause. It certainly doesn't help your broken heart, I know... She was such a special girl and made a huge impact on all of us. I think of you all every day and hope that it's getting a little easier. How is Keefer doing?

You continue to be in my thoughts and prayers...


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## djpohn

> Originally Posted By: Cassidys MomI don't know if there's any kind of testing, but I will be asking the vet about it. Keefer is her half sibling, so if there's a genetic predisposition that's definitely a concern. I emailed the breeder and gave her all the info, and she asked the same question.


Here is a link screening info. It also has links to other information on cancer and also weblinks to the different hospitals that have studies, trials, and labs that have testing available.


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## 3K9Mom

I was just doing some poking around on the internet. They don't know definitively what causes lymphoma -- somewhat genetic, somewhat environment, somewhat luck of the draw. 

Like most cancers it seems. 

Deb, Camper and I were at Barnes and Noble yesterday, and there was a book that caught my eye, esp since we have a little senior to think of. I just cracked it last night. I'll finish it this weekend and send it to you. I liked the prevention part of the title: Preventing and Treating Cancer in Dogs by Shawn Messonnier, DVM. I have no idea if it's worth reading yet. 

But when I saw the book, I got to thinking that a prevention regimen would be a nice thing to do for everyone from my senior to my puppy -- not to mention their owners.


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## Fodder

debbie this thread actually helps me out alot too. "lymphoma" was that magical L word that i couldnt remember when i was telling you about my late Sierras cancer - the only difference was not only were sierra's masses spreading rapidly, they were growing, and the one on her neck ruptured which is what aggravated her illness and put things into full gear.

looking back we'll always say one more day, or week, or months even - but in all honesty - we gave them the best lives possible already! weeks wont change that.

i'm glad you got this news from the doctor... because i could see how much it hurt you guys to think not only that there may have been something you could have done to prevent this and/or help her... i wanted to kick myself a couple times when i was telling you about the last days of my previous dogs, but the point i was trying to get across is that we make the best decisions that we're capable of and its coming from an extremely loving place... thats what matters. there will always be more more more - but even then "more" is just a "what if"... in the grand scheme of things - life is never up to us.


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## Halen

I'm so sorry about Dena. And thank you for telling us what was wrong with her. 

God bless you & your husband. And give Keefer a big hug for me. I've always thought your dogs were so beautiful.


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## Barb E

Debbie - As hard as the answer is, I'm so glad you have it, no more what if or if only's. You all know you did the best you could.

My heart is still broken for you and Tom (and Keefer and the kitties of course) and I think of you all very often.


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## schatzi14

> Quote: Debbie, I hope it has given you some *peace of mind knowing the cause. It certainly doesn't help your broken heart*, I know.*.. She was such a special girl and made a huge impact on all of us. I think of you all every day and hope that it's getting a little easier.* How is Keefer doing?
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Ditto to the above.

I feel so bad about this, my heart goes out to you.


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## valleydog

I think about your loss often and it makes me so sad. She was really the poster dog for this site. I remember all we wrote when you were thinking of getting Keefer. And since Molly is about the same age, I feel as if they grew up together, even though we've never met. Wishing you strength, but you have always sounded like a very strong person.


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## Karin

Thanks for letting us know what was wrong with Dena. I was very surprised to hear that it was cancer. That's the one thing that never crossed my mind. 

You, Tom, and Keefer have been in our thoughts a lot lately, especially over the past weekend.

Like Calone and others have said, I'm glad that you found out what the cause was. It will not make you miss her any less, but hopefully it will help bring you both some closure. Take care of yourselves and remember that you have a lot of people who are still thinking of you and your beautiful girl.


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## Fluffypants

I just read your post and wanted to say that I'm so sorry about Dena. I lost my Stormy almost 2 years ago and still think of him all the time and when I read when others loose their babies - it breaks my heart. I'm glad you were able to find out what was wrong. It's hard enough loosing them and then not knowing.

She was a beautiful girl and I'm she will always be with you in spirit!

Tanja


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## Tula

I'm so sorry to hear that Dena had cancer. But I am so thankful for you that you know you did everything you could for her. I can't even begin to imagine how difficult this all is. My thoughts and prayers are with you.


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## DancingCavy

Wow. That's shocking considering how young she was. Sounds like you did all that you could.


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## LuvourGSDs

Thank you so much for sharing the info with us all.







This was very scary thinking she might have got ahold of some critter that could have caused her death. Made me worry more since we have some many of them running around here.









I'm so sorry you had to go through this with your beautiful girl at such a young age.









At least you know you did a great job & all you could have done.









So scary when they can't detect cancer till it's too late most of the time. I asked recently about finding it in bloodwork, but no you can't. I wonder about what's going on with our Golden right now when all bloodwork is fine.









I'm sending warm thoughts your way & this case just broke my heart.

Take Care..............


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## DianaM

Now that's something unexpected and surprising. There is way too much cancer going around. It seems like every week (and sometimes every day) I hear of someone who found out they have cancer or that someone died from it or someone's pet. Is it just me or does it seem like it's getting more prevalent across the board?

Thank you for sharing the information. My heart still wrenched reading this, thinking of such a beautiful life cut way too short.


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## BowWowMeow

I'm sure knowing she had cancer is little comfort but at least may make closure a bit easier. This explains why she wasn't responding the way she should have to aggressive treatment. My ex lost her sheltie at age 6.5 to lymphoma. I discovered his lymph nodes were swollen and then 6 weeks later he was dead.







It is a very aggressive disease and causes the immune system to run amuck. 


Btw, every dog I have lost in the past 10 years (except Kai) has been to cancer.









Ugh, I still miss Dena.


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## Cassidy's Mom

> Originally Posted By: DianaMNow that's something unexpected and surprising. There is way too much cancer going around. It seems like every week (and sometimes every day) I hear of someone who found out they have cancer or that someone died from it or someone's pet.


A good friend of ours died of Hodgkin's Lymphoma a couple of years ago. She was in her mid-40's, and a true animal lover. She sold her chiropractic practice and became a certified animal chiropractor. Cassidy was one of her patients. Prior to that I was one of her patients.


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## Sean Rescue Mom

> Originally Posted By: JeanKBBMMMAANDid they know if it was T cell-I am guessing it was?


I think T-Cells can also be dependent on a B-Cell immune response. Between my daughter and Sean's autoimmune illnesses I have all this info. that fills my brain and sometimes it can be overwhelming. Regardless, I understand how helpless you feel knowing there's nothing you could have done to prevent Dena's lymphoma. But you were a dedicated mom, rushed her to the vet and from everything you indicated in your posts, Dr. Schuchman, was a devoted vet. 

My heart goes out to you, every time I read about Dena I want to cry along with you. I'm so sorry for Tom, Keefer and you.


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## Cassidy's Mom

> Originally Posted By: GS MomHere is a link screening info. It also has links to other information on cancer and also weblinks to the different hospitals that have studies, trials, and labs that have testing available.


Thank you for the link GS Mom. I don't know if there are any tissue samples left, but I will ask when we go in. The California hospital in the link is Davis, which is good, since it's about and hour and a half from me. I'll talk to my vet about screening Keefer, I don't know what I'd do if I lost them both. 

Thanks again to all of you - we truly appreciate all your thoughts. Dena was such a special girl, and while it hurts so much that she's gone I am so proud to have had her in our lives for the short time we did. And the impact that she had on those of you who met her, and those of you who only knew her through the stories and pictures that I posted on the board....it truly means the world to us. She would have loved you all.


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## BJDimock

Thank you for having the strength to write to us and explaine Dena's crossing. I have been a CVT for 10 years and have never seen lymphoma present in that way. Dena's case seemed much closer to my own girls Lupus. It will be something that I will always keep in my mind. Pehaps I will be of some help when another patient walks through the door with the same symtoms. In any case, Dena will remain with me. I'm glad you have an answer, and I am sorry again, for the loss your family is feeling.


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## Elmo's Mom

Knowing there was nothing more that could be done is probably a relief at some level. It was time for Dena to leave your life. She left so many wonderful memories for all of you. Even though she had a very short life, she had a happy and loving life. 

As you cry, remember that she is not far from you. I'm sure her spirit is still living in your house.


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## momtoduke

I'm so sorry to hear about Dena







i just joined this board not long ago but I already know how much everyone on here loves there Babies! As much as I do! I seen that you lost Cassidy on 10-4-04 and lost Dena on 10-4-08, maybe cassidy was ready for one of her own (you can always look at it that way) they are now playing together in doggie heaven









I also know what your going through very much so! Dusty was 12 years when he was diagnosed with cancer, he was a beagle/husky mix and was a wonderful boy! He was born to me and he was the first thing I ever gave my husband (when we were dating). I nursed him from parvo at the age of 6 months and we had a bond!

He was out in the yard one day while we were working on something, and my husband said thats getting on my nerves and i said what? and he said Dusty coughing. I said well i havent heard it yet, and about that time i heard him do it.

I came in immediatly and called the vet, and he said that it could be one of two things either conjestive heart failure, or cancer. and wanted me to bring him in right away.

We got there (its 8pm) and he checked him and didnt see anything, he tried to open his mouth and i was helping him (he wouldnt open) finally we pried it open and as soon as we did i seen it









there was a tumor in the ruth of his mouth, and the next day i dropped him off and the vet went into his mouth with a scope and when i went to pick him up he said that he was ate up with it, it had went into his sinus cavity eating up to his brain. we let him go like that for 3 or 4 weeks and then we had to put him down (the hardest thing i have ever done, i still cry) and thats been since dec. 18, 2007. he was diagnosed on nov. 5, 2007. He was on steroids and something else but it didnt help.

The morning that we had to do it, he got up and was very disoriented and didnt know anything. we actually had to call a friend to take him and have him put down we couldnt do it. 

He is now buried in our yard and i go out and talk to him still to this day







he was one of the best dogs we have ever had! and i miss him dearly.

Someone said in 10 years he will just be another dog and i said NO IN 10 YEARS HE WILL STILL BE OUR BABY!

so good luck with the healing i know it hurts! and remember it is not your fault and there is nothing you could have done! it was God's will and thats the way it was going to be with or without medical treatment! you done everything you could do and most of all SHE NOW KNOWS THAT!

Now that i look back on Dusty, i see that we were being selfish, we should have let him go way before the time we did. we didnt want to loose him but we were letting him go through the pain. that was very selfish of us to want to hold on to him, when all he wanted to do was go fly in the sky! I MISS HIM SO MUCH!!

SORRY SO LONG EVERYONE! this just brings back to many memories...


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## kelso

Debbie,

Thinking of you, Dena, Tom, Keefer and family lots.

Glad you have some closure..and like I said before hope there is much comfort found in one another at this time

Thanks again, for sharing Dena here, especially during a difficult time.

Dena had the best life with you as shown by the many many beautiful and happy pictures you shared. You could tell she had a beautiful spirit as well. 


Take care


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## Qyn

Thank you for sharing the cause of Dena's illness. While the pain of her loss is not eased by learning that her life was destined to be shortened, knowing the reason for her illness does give some understanding and indicates just how hard you tried.

Take care.


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## Kayos and Havoc

It is still so hard to fathom this. I keep thinking the bad nightmare will stop and we will all wake up and see pictures of D and K at Ft. Funston. 

I know understanding what happened will never ease your sorrow but at least you can put aside the fear that you may have contributed to her illness. You guys did more to save her than the vast majority of people would have done. She truly had the best family in the world to love her and care for her. She passed in her sleep on her bed in her home with her family with a terrible disease you could not have prevented or stopped.

I know Dena was your once in a lifetime heart dog. Kayos is mine. I cannot fathom losing her. It makes me feel ill and sick in my heart. I know you are feeling this acutely now.

Hug Keefer.


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## LisaT

Wow. I guess you didn't expect hearing that. I didn't. 

I can't add anything to the great words that everyone else has already said -- you did great Cassidy's Mom, you couldn't have done anything better.


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