# Breed Ban now in affect on military post/housing



## KristinEnn (Oct 2, 2008)

So I came home from a 45 min walk with Bella to see a pamphlet like thing sitting at my front door. 
It is all the changes to policies to live here on the Military post. So alot has changed. Effective immediately you will need to remove.. yes I said remove or "It will be removed for you and your pet priviledges revoked after a fine is issued" all aggressive breeds and breed mixes this includes: Pit Bulls, Rottewielers, Dobermans, Chows and Wolf Hybrids. These Breeds are no longer allowed in or around military housing unless it is a military working dog and is boarded with his/her handler *Note that GSD not on there.... YET* 
Then it goes on to talk about "agressive dogs" 

That a dog that barks at the fence line when strangers are coming through your yard is deamed also "agressive" so If there are complaints you first.. Get a warning.. Second get a fine and finally third all pet priveledges taken away.. all pets removed and sent to local shelters. They also say that a dog is considered an "agressive dog" if prevoked it growls or snarls or raises hackles or the obvious lunges and bites.. I get the last one.. BUT my question is.. is it right to be able to "Prevoke" a dog???!! soooo under these new guidelines... does this mean that the kids that we caught throwing rocks at our boy were "prevoking"? and if so.. he barked at them and ran up and down the fence line. He didnt growl or nip. Just became adjuatated. So this means I am appearently now.. In the wrong and those kids are now protected and can prevoke the crap out of dog and if it bites.. well "it was just another agressive dog" 
wth.. I am trying to understand this. 
While I understand that a dog with a good temperment should be ok with all situations. Isnt like rock throwing and shooting squirt guns at strangers dogs a bad idea?? wouldnt that be considered prevoking? to me that is considered abuse in my book!

I pretty much am never going to let my dogs outside again. I never leave them out unnattended anyways but I will for like 15 mins go about doing other things in the house. I cant watch them all the time.. but now I will. I dont want my dogs taken away.. nor do I need a fine. Just another reason we need to buy a house in the country side some where!

PS also going to start saying Mika is a Husky/Lab mix! which could be true anyways.. who knows we rescued her from the shelter.


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## KristinEnn (Oct 2, 2008)

omg I just thought about it too my husky/ROTTIE.. yikes.. mix.. snarls when she is happy to see you.. that includes me my hubby and any stranger. She LOVES people of all kinds. She smiles and snorts. Grrrreat....


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## CookieTN (Sep 14, 2008)

So, the madness continues...


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## KCandMace (Apr 8, 2008)

It is a reason that when we move back to the states in a couple of months I refuse to live in base housing!


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## Keegan62 (Aug 17, 2008)

i didn't tell my insurance when Ernie died and I got this new puppy both GSD

they new Ernie was older and calm lol
now this Jack is a **** raiser LOL HAHAHHA

they will raise my insurance,,,,,
will just say he is a mix lol hahahha he does have a collie like face LOL HAHAHAHA

To be honest I do not trust to the fulliest ANY DOG
Any dog can bite or be aggressive in the right setting

I have seen a lot of small dogs that are plain Nasty

Its really sad all of this


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## Lakeguy929 (Jan 4, 2008)

So I suppose now we will see an influx of Pit Bulls, Rottewielers, Dobermans, Chows and Wolf Hybrids etc. at shelters near military reservations. With all the folks losing homes and moving into pet banned apartments this is not good news to an already dismal picture lately.

This is a very ignorant policy and needs to be changed.


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

Huskies & Malamutes are often among the banned breeds sooo mebbe he's a different mix...


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

> Quote: They also say that a dog is considered an "agressive dog" if prevoked it growls or snarls or raises hackles or the obvious lunges and bites..


Ok, so if someone breaks into your house or threatens you on the street and your dog PROTECTS you - does that make them aggressive??

STUPID laws!!


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## maxsmom1229 (Apr 12, 2007)

*Re: Breed Ban now in affect on military post/housi*

we live on base here in Germany. pit bulls, am. staff. terriers, and all mastiff breeds arent allowed on base at all. "dangerous breeds" like rotties, chows, dobies, some other ridiculous breeds are allowed on post, but must do mandatory assessments on their aggressiveness....its crazy but if it lets my dog live with me id rather succumb to the random assessments. i know off base, dogs are allowed on the train with you, but over a certain weight a muzzle is mandatory...i wasnt sure that a heavier dog is a meaner dog...







me and max were riding the train a few towns away and a small terrier type dog (i have nothing against these dogs mind you) tried to rip maxs face off. max was muzzled because he is over the weight limit...not that he would ever hurt a fly. and clearly the aggressive dog in this situation was not muzzled. i dont get it, if the train is your only mode of transportation for you and your dog fine, if you know your dog is a jerk (and dont want to train it), and dont have control over it muzzle it.







breed ban makes me mad and sad and every other not good emotion


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## Avamom (Sep 28, 2004)

*Re: Breed Ban now in affect on military post/housi*

That is the most insane policy with completely faulty logic, I would expect better of our military, I would at least expect logical thinking. Was this just deemed by your base in particular or is this a country wide order?

I'd love to see how well they are going to enforce the any "aggressive" dog...I highly doubt if they would deem sweet little precious toy poodle aggressive but I bet it would growl at you if provoked....


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

*Re: Breed Ban now in affect on military post/housi*

The statement about "if provoked the dog growls etc..." is really insane. 

Calm down take a deep breath,,, and start doing some homework about who to contact and how to go about arguing against this.


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

*Re: Breed Ban now in affect on military post/housi*

This was posted on another forum.....
http://www.fortlewiscommunities.com/contents/petpolicy.asp


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

*Re: Breed Ban now in affect on military post/housi*

and from Ft. Bragg (posted on another forum)....
http://www.fortbraggmwr.com/vetservices/FBReg40_5.pdf
They also ban certain breeds and require CGCs on big dogs.
I live near Ft Benning and had no idea!


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## Daisy1986 (Jul 9, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: IluvmyBellaNKahnomg I just thought about it too my husky/ROTTIE.. yikes.. mix.. snarls when she is happy to see you.. that includes me my hubby and any stranger. She LOVES people of all kinds. She smiles and snorts. Grrrreat....


My cousins Dalmation snarls when she is happy to see you too. 

It kinda freaked me the first time I saw it. My cousin said, she is just happy. lol Their dog is in NO way aggressive. 

Bans are ignorant. 

All my dogs go at the fence. From Golden to Beagle, they are protecting their yard or excited. What's next, ban Beagle's?? 

I am starting to understand why you cannot be for all the laws. Do not know the happy med. except educate owners on training their dogs.....


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## Keisha (Aug 1, 2008)

This stuff always really scares me. What can people do to work against laws like this? Any advice would be great. I have several friends who would also love to get involved in the cause to stop this.


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## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

So.. if provoked, a dog should NOT give a warning first? Unreal. I know how difficult it can often be to obtain on-base housing. I totally understand why people seek it out. Then after all the wait and struggle to get it-- this is worse than a Homeonwer's Association, as the rules make no sense and are just plain unfair to both dog and owner.


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## TRex (May 6, 2006)

I live in military housing here. In the year and a half we have been here, Gideon and I have been charged by 2 pit bulls, a rottie, and about 6 various little yappy dogs. All at different times of course. All were off leash. All charged Gideon as if they wanted to kill him. The yappy dogs I just kick out of the way - hate to, it's not their fault they have idiot owners - but I don't want them to touch Gideon or have Gideon eat them. The pit bulls and rottie scared the crap out of me. The pit and rottie owners were all horrified/apologetic/quick to respond - which didn't stop me from yelling at them about leash laws. Most of the yappy dog owners mouth off at me and accuse Gideon of provoking their dogs - excuse me? Who's dog is walking quietly by their owner's side and who's dog is off leash growling, snapping, and charging? 

I don't know what the answer is but I don't think a good one is to ban certain breeds. I know around here, if a particular dog and owner gets I think 3 warnings, the fourth time they are kicked out of housing. Sonia


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## KristinEnn (Oct 2, 2008)

I think that this certain ban is only on Fort Lewis. I know that as stated from other whom live on military housing have a breed band or to that effect. 

OK here it is .. I found it word for word of what an "aggressive dog" is .. Defined by them: 

"A potentially dangerous dog is defined as any dog that when provoked (a) inflicts bites on a human or a domestic animal either on public or private property. (b) chases or approaches a person upon the streets, sidewalks, along fence lines and or any public grounds in a menacing fashion or apparent attitude of attack. " 


It does say that if someone is breaking or entering or of you are being hurt by the intruder and its a sign of self defense than its ok. 

this is DUMB TOO

"If your pet or animal becomes annoying, bothersome or any way a nuisance, threat to other residents, occupants, guests or to the operation of Lewis-McChord Familly Housing, then upon notice from the agent you will agree to remove the pet or animal from the premises and the Lewis-McChord Family Housing. Examples of this behavior are" (1.) unprovoked barking and or growling at people that approach the animal. (2) aggresivley running along private fence line when people are present. (3.) biting or scratching people. (4.) escaping confinement. 

Ok what annoys me about that is.. Kahn does do 2. of that when strangers walk in my back yard. I let him. He is protecting my property. If given the chance though.. if I had him outside to meet strangers in my presence he wont do anything like that. He will roll over and let you rub his belly. He did charge someone outside our house once but didnt growl and or bite just barked. It was like 11pm at night though and this person with a big hood on came out of no where. We definately now keep watch when we are moving him at night from vehicles to inside the house now and keep him on a leash to protect others. Even though he was suspicious of the person and was protecting us but I still understand and see how that would certainly freighten someone. He is uber protective of our house. When in public though he is super calm and loves everyone. Lets toddlers pet him and play with his mouth.. etc..


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## Daisy1986 (Jul 9, 2008)

I feel Kahn is safe with this. 

He better be. 

If someone cannot tell that he is protecting his property than they are ubber idoits!!!









The neighborhood should be grateful to have an alert GSD around!!


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## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

""A potentially dangerous dog is defined as any dog that when <s>provoked</s> *UN*provoked (a) inflicts bites on a human or a domestic animal either on public or private property. (b) chases or approaches a person upon the streets, sidewalks, along fence lines and or any public grounds in a menacing fashion or apparent attitude of attack. " "

They made a mistake on the rule. I fixed it for them. A provoked dog SHOULD BE ABLE to bite to defend itself within reason, especially if "provoked" includes "being poked repeatedly in the belly with a large stick by a stranger" or "having rocks tossed at it." As to the rest, if the dog is unconfined and uncontrolled, I agree. If the dog is within its safely fenced territory, then it's just being a dog. But a dog that bites without provocation is a potentially dangerous dog.

What is their definition of "provoked," anyway?

What in the world do these people expect of dogs?! That they're all various sizes of Aibos?! Good grief, when did these morons forget that dogs are still animals? Sigh...


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## KristinEnn (Oct 2, 2008)

ugh its all so annoying.. They have also changed the height of fences. They can only be 4' high and if the dog is able to "jump as high as the fence.. then they must ALSO be tied/chained inside of the enclosed fencing!!?!?? 

This is sooo rediculous... THIS IS ALOT WORSE THAN LIVING IN NEIGHBORHOOD WITH A HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIAITION!! I need to makes sure my weeds are pulled at all times, I cant put up any signs in my windows without approval.. not even my GSD signs!!







!?!?!? what about my "Beware of Dog" sign.. thats not approved... they gonna fine me for that too????!!
also.. All "Halloween Decorations are to come down by no later than November the 10th! you will receive a warning than a fine if not removed in 42-48 hours"


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## KristinEnn (Oct 2, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: DianaM""A potentially dangerous dog is defined as any dog that when <s>provoked</s> *UN*provoked (a) inflicts bites on a human or a domestic animal either on public or private property. (b) chases or approaches a person upon the streets, sidewalks, along fence lines and or any public grounds in a menacing fashion or apparent attitude of attack. " "
> 
> They made a mistake on the rule. I fixed it for them. A provoked dog SHOULD BE ABLE to bite to defend itself within reason, especially if "provoked" includes "being poked repeatedly in the belly with a large stick by a stranger" or "having rocks tossed at it." As to the rest, if the dog is unconfined and uncontrolled, I agree. If the dog is within its safely fenced territory, then it's just being a dog. But a dog that bites without provocation is a potentially dangerous dog.
> 
> ...




basically what this all says to me is now ... and excuse me this is NOT all military brats and military families but all the military families that I have experienced that have boarder line abused MY DOG.. with these awful kids can get away with anything now.. Thats what it says to me. 
Those brats are more important than dogs I guess. The father figure is not around and the wives around me dont work and just sit around.. let their kids do anything and everything. I cant stand that! I KNOW that if IF I caught my child throwing rocks or sticks at a strangers dog or kicking a dogs fence or kicking a dog.. I would have said.. "That dog should have bit you!" My children.. when and if I have them will most definately know how to respect all dogs. I am going to educate them because no one here does.


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## AbbyK9 (Oct 11, 2005)

There are many good reasons why we do not live in military housing. One of them is the fact that there is a two pet limit on base, and we have three. Not to mention all the stupid little rules.

Is there any place off base you could or would want to move to? I would seriously consider that over living on base and being subject to ridiculous rules. We currently have a 13 miles each way commute, but we live in an area that is pretty pet friendly, in a nice house with a big yard and a nice landlady.

I think A LOT of the rules the military is instituting are due to the idiots that came before. You know who they are. The people who need to have a big, tough dog that acts aggressive. The people who just leave their dogs in the yard all the time. Those people. And yes, those people ruin it for everything.

Our local base banned any breed that is considered to be in the category of Pit Bull or Pit Bull mix. Has nothing to do with them bad dogs. Had everything to do with morons on base training their dogs to fight.


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

I'm guessing this is why most military people based here at Maxwell rent. The landlords are pretty laid back around here because there are just so many military families that rent housing in the surrounding areas. 

Those rules are just stupid...a four foot fence? What's the point??


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## pstewart00 (Jan 25, 2009)

Marine Corps is instituting a breed ban, after a 3 year old was killed by a pit in family housing last summer. Banning an entire breed is pretty harsh, of course it punishes a lot of innocents and doesn't weed out all the bad seeds. Overall I don't support breed bans but I'm very sympathetic to those who are responsible for public safety on base and who have to write and enforce rules.


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