# Fat and pancreatitis?



## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

I am occasionally using for MM "soup meat"-- tough, chewy, unattractive beef meat that nobody wants to buy. The chunks of beef have bone (I cut the meat away from the bone and chuck the bone out) and fat. Not a lot of fat, as I cut some away.. but I was wondering, can the raw fat make a dog's pancreas have pancreatitis? 

He is doing SPLENDIDLY on the raw diet!







No loose stools, calmer energy, thicker, glossier coat, cleaner teeth-- and you should hear him YODEL for his food now!


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_canine_pancreatitis.html

http://www.judithstock.com/Speaking_of_Animals/Pancreatitis_in_Dogs/pancreatitis_in_dogs.html

http://www.vetinfo.com/dencyclopedia/depancrea.html

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/23402.htm

http://digestive.niddk.nih.gov/ddiseases/pubs/pancreatitis/ (I like human info when our bodies work similar to theirs).

Basically, as far as I can see, there's no definitive answer. And the question, of course, is what is "too much" fat? Some premium foods have a very high percentage of fat. I know my raw diet doesn't have nearly that much fat. I think a moderate amount of fat is ok. I cut off visible fat to avoid SIBO symptoms, but I do feed fatty meats like lamb, and oily fish like salmon a lot.


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Lakota will have bouts of Pancreatitis if I don't watch his fat intake. He isn't on raw but kibble. His dam towards the end of her life had severe Pancreatitis, which I found out after Lakota had had a few minor flares.


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## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

Wow.. then this is hard to guage, cos since raw isn't kibble, there's no definite "percentage" to know if I am feeding an amount of fat that could set off pancreatis.

I am off to peruse those links. Thanks Val and Lori!


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

It all depends on the dog. 

A lot of cases of pancreatitis aren't caused by a high intake of fat. It can be from parasites, to tick diseases, food allergies, autoimmune issues, etc. Chronic pancreatitis has been an issue with Indy.

Like Wisc. Tiger, you will learn what your dog can and can't handle. If you think there is a bit too much fat and you don't want to or can't take it off, you can always give a digestive enzyme (containing lipase) with the bone. This is what I do for Indy, and I've never had a flair up giving her a somewhat fatty bone.


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## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

Actually, I add an Oreo-cookie-sized blob of defrosting fresh, frozen green tripe. That has lots of enzymes, or?


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## tracyc (Feb 23, 2005)

How does pancreatitis present? How would one know if a dog had it or not? 

When I am feeding something really fatty (whole ducks come to mind), I attempt to divide up the fat so that it is rationed out more or less evenly--i.e. not one meal of all fat. But the only thing I've ever pitched in the trash was the turkey tail--that gob of fat/bone/feather end. I didn't know what to do with that.


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## kallie (Sep 3, 2001)

> Originally Posted By: Luca_stl*How does pancreatitis present? How would one know if a dog had it or not? *
> When I am feeding something really fatty (whole ducks come to mind), I attempt to divide up the fat so that it is rationed out more or less evenly--i.e. not one meal of all fat. But the only thing I've ever pitched in the trash was the turkey tail--that gob of fat/bone/feather end. I didn't know what to do with that.


My sisters dog just got over an attack of pancreatitis. She had vomiting, tired, and would not eat..They will also get some swelling and tenderness in their gut area..

A few other symptoms..



> Quote: Common symptoms of the acute form of pancreatitis in dogs include a very painful abdomen, abdominal distention, lack of appetite, depression, dehydration, a 'hunched up' posture, vomiting, diarrhea and yellow, greasy stool.


I just watch my dogs fat intake, for instance I would not feed pork feet or pig tails without trimming some of that fat off first. I do pull "some" of the fat off of duck also, as that is some thick fat...

Some dogs may never have problems with it, but most people don't feed tons of fat daily anyway...However the dogs that do have attacks of pancreatitis do get very sick from it. Max has also had an attack of this in the past, and it took awhile for him to get over it..


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

Well, there's actute pancreatitis (the *sudden* "Thanksgiving Day" type attack that we often hear about) and there's chronic "long term" pancreatitis.

Do they look the same, from a symptoms point of view? I understand that the acute pancreatitis is really obvious and would cause most of us to go rushing off to the emergency vet asap, but the chronic? Does it just sort of sneak up on you, looking like so many other ailments that we're used to dealing with?


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: 3K9MomWell, there's actute pancreatitis (the *sudden* "Thanksgiving Day" type attack that we often hear about) and there's chronic "long term" pancreatitis.
> 
> Do they look the same, from a symptoms point of view? I understand that the acute pancreatitis is really obvious and would cause most of us to go rushing off to the emergency vet asap, but the chronic? Does it just sort of sneak up on you, looking like so many other ailments that we're used to dealing with?


The chronic one is sneaky -- Indy had that, and when it went to the acute form, the only thing different is that she stopped eating.

In her chronic form, she had inconsistent stools -- often very loose, sometimes slimy. She never vomited, but her abdominal area would be very hard and firm -- I'm told that was the inflammation. So I frequently monitor her abdominal area as a check. In her bloodwork, she always has high lipase values -- in an acute flair-up, both her lipase and amylase would spike up pretty high. After her first acute flair-up, I had her bloodwork checked about every 6 months because there weren't any good outward signs.

The acute flair-up was most likely caused by a switched to Innova (lots of ingredients she was unknowingly allergic to), and the addition of salmon oil. I suspect that before that she had a chronic case (due to other things), but those changes made her very very ill.


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

Poor Indy.









Thanks Lisa. Good to have this info.


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