# DaKota's not so well?



## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

She is ten now & I am noticing a few things that I am not sure about. I was wondering if anyone else has these problems going on with their seniors? First is her nose. It is very dried & cracked. Almost to the point of bleeding. BF says cancer.







It's been like that for awhile now. I've been putting Triple Antibiotic Ointment on it. The other problem she has is pooping. Before our Ice Storm she has been going in the house. Just pooping & no pee. She did stay at my work for a week. My boss said she was very tidy & clean. No problems at all. She was doing pretty good for a few days here & then has started pooping again. Last night was very upsetting.
She pooped before I let her out. Just before. I kept her out for a while longer, then at 5:30 this morning I woke up to find she had messed again. Is this normal? Should I start crating her again?


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Sorry to hear about DaKota. I think a trip to the vet is in order. The nose thing is an immune system signal that something's amiss. And the pooping is a further signal. I don't think crating her is going to help--I doubt that it's a behavioral issue. And actually it would be terrible if she pooped in the crate and had to sit in it. Can you gate her in the kitchen until you figure out what's going on? 

The pooping could be because of a neurological issue (she may not even realize that she's pooping) or an intestinal issue or it could be a tumor but you can't know until you take her to the vet and get a total work-up. 

Please keep us posted!


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

I wouldn't crate her. If she has been good about not messing in thehouse for all these years, chances are she can't help it. And if that is the case and you crate her, you will have a poopy crate AND a poopy dog!
If she is pooping on carpet, it is possible to just lock her in a room that hasn't got carpet so it is easier to clean up?


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## TRex (May 6, 2006)

Could pooping in the house be her way of trying to tell you something is wrong - "please take me to the doctor"? I had a cat once that would do that. She was very good about the litter box but the few times she was sick she would poo on the carpet in front of the TV. I knew something was wrong then and would take her to the vet.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

Frankly, with my 13+ yo I am at the point where so long as the BM is well-formed and no one has snacked on it, I am happy. In the house, out of the house... that's fine. Just no diahreah and no snacks, please. 

See your vet for sure. My guess would be that it is a spinal issue - she can't help it much. Deramaxx, accupuncture, chiropractic & Bigeloil all help. Confirm with your vet. It's a health issue not a behavior issue.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

Definitely a vet visit, with a full panel, thyroid, etc. Also evaluate the diet and the supplements, it might be time for a change.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

I am getting paid on the 3rd, so that might be where my check will be going. For now, I will keep her in the kitchen at night too. I will definitely keep you all updated. It's just weird that it is happening.
I do not want to believe my BF. Everytime things go wrong, he always says it is cancer. Most times it is not. She doesn't really take any suppliments with her food. I have changed it while she was at the kennel. She was on just plain old Pro Plan. She started chewing herself really bad, so I changed it to the newer Pro Plan
Shredded Lamb & rice. That is why I asked my boss how she did at the kennel. I thought it would go right through her.



> Quote:Also evaluate the diet and the supplements, it might be time for a change.


She will only eat Pro Plan. I have tried all types of different foods on & off through the years & most of them have Flaxseed. She does not handle Flaxseed well at all.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

There must be some better foods out there that do not have flaxseed in them.

I would also get some more nutrients in her, either via supplements or real food.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

I have tried other foods w/o Flaxseed. She will not touch it.
We have tried many & she would either not touch it or got reactions from the foods. She usually does very well on Proplan. She likes it & never had problems on it before. I have been feeding this to her since I rescued her 9 1/2 yrs. ago. Trust me, I know she would starve than not to have her Pro Plan. I have talked to my Vet about her foods too. They said if she does well on Pro Plan then do not switch. Unless they tell me to, then I won't mess around with it too much.
What type of suppliments are out there? Please let me know so I can research prices? I am on a fixed income.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

If your dog likes ProPlan and eats it and does well on it, don't change the food. If she were having loose stools, that would indicate a problem with the food. Just BMs where ever is probably health or age related. 

I'm trying to resolve the nose issue here too. I think she has an external vulvular infection and her increased attention has given her nose that infection. Has she been licking herself more than usual? 

For supplements I use glucosomine/chondriton with hyrolic(?) acid - instead of buying it from the vet, I get whatever brand is on sale at the grocery. I also use a chiropractor/accupuncturist for my dog's skeletal issues +. It really helps if her problem is neurological or skeletal related. 

Crating her will not take care of the problem. She will just defecate in her crate. It's an involuntary thing. My vet's office sells a deoderizer spray with an enzyme in it that really does wonders to clear the air if you are having company or if it is particularly bad. (Even if it isn't but the spray is expensive.)


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

Thank you MONW for ypur suggestions. 
Has she been licking herself more than usual? Yes, she was. To the point of chewing her self very raw. I had to put an e-collar on her.
That is why I switched her to the shredded Lamb & rice. Her skin is almost back to normal now. I did think that it could be, that her nose was similar to a rug burn from chewing. It's not healing though. This is the 2nd time we had to deal with the itchyness.
She chewed last year too, but not as bad. I did leave her in the kitchen last night. I gave her regular food (not wet down) & not treats after that. The floor is clean with no poops.


> Quote: glucosomine/chondriton with hyrolic(?) acid


What is this stuff used for?
Please bare with me? I never had a senior dog before. It is all new to me.
She still acts like a 5 yr. old dog in the snow. She loves to chase & search for the snowballs.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

My daughter helped me take some pictures of what DaKota's nose looks like:

















Still doing good on not pooping.


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## Vinnie (Sep 4, 2001)

I'd get her to the vet if you can. 

Her nose looks somewhat like discoid lupus which my Dalton has but it looks kind of different. No real cure for discoid lupus but it's also not a life threatening problem. We keep Vit. E on his nose (applied directly to the sores and not supplemented in his food) which helps heal the sores and limit his outdoor activities during the middle of the day when the sun is the highest. A vet can take a biopsy from one of the lesions on DaKota’s nose and tell you for sure if this is the problem.

We haven’t had the lupus cause any problems with Dalton pooping in the house though so there might be something else going on with that. He tires easily, but no messing in the house.

Do keep us posted Yvette.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

I disagree with the advice about Pro Plan. Dogs who eat the same foods their entire lives often develop allergies to one or more ingredients in those foods. Just because she has done well on it in the past does not mean that it is currently good for her. A good way to get her to eat better quality foods is to add fresh food like chicken, salmon, non-fat yogurt, cottage cheese or high quality canned food into the kibble. 

You definitely want her on a good quality supplement for her joints. I like Springtime's Inc's Longevity because it has other supplements in it that are good for the gut and for the skin. I've got Chama on a senior vitamin that I really like called Canine Plus Senior. Vetriscience makes it. 

Also, the nose looks like an auto-immune disorder. You really need to get her into the vet. Before you change food or add supplements you really need to figure out what is wrong with her.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

Sometimes those nose issues are fungal or bacterial from rooting in the ground. My vet and I both have a dog for which this is true.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

I would just ask for a dermatology referral and skip the regular vet, in most cases anyway. I think it's cheaper, easier, better. Are you close enough to Tuft's? They may be less expensive than the specialty clinics in your area (which seems to have some pretty high vetting costs). http://tuftsvets.org/
http://tuftsvets.org/derma_allergies.php They do take Care Credit. 

Here at Cornell a regular appointment with the dermatologist was $98 I think. BUT, in one visit, he took care of everything. 

I had all the biopsies already done, so I am not sure how much that would have cost, but they were wrong (read by a pathology lab-not my vet) and he looked at them as part of that fee and got the right diagnosis. 

So you could maybe work with your vet and figure out the least expensive way to get to a dermatologist in terms of testing (sometimes the teaching hospitals are cheaper though than even regular vet clinics-so that's why I'd price compare) and see if you can get her to a dermatologist ASAP. 

Oh-Bella pooped in the house when she had a urinary tract infection. Never peed in the house-very weird! 

But they have all the people there at Tufts you would ever want or need to see from nose to butt. You just have to let them know you have a budget, and can they work with you. Otherwise, some places will test out the yin yang!

I am sorry that she's having these problems.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

Sorry, but tuft's is way to expensive for me.








They maybe a teaching vet school, but to get just an appointment
alone you'd have to get a 2nd mortage on your house. I know of alot of people who go there. My sister went to them only once also.
Her Bull Dog had an emergency spay. $500.00 just to walk in the door! Another $1000 for the spay & stay. There was no sympathy for her being broke at the time. Luckily she has some good friends & a nice lanlord, who all like her Bull Dog & lent her the money. I am going to see our town vet early this week. Luckily my boy friend explained my situation. He bargined them down to $100 for an examination & blood work.


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## pamlarouge (Dec 17, 2008)

Poor baby







That looks like it hurts!


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

The nose is a least of my worries with her. Get some liquid vitamin online or from the health food store (Solaray and Country Life are two brands that carry it), and apply to her nose. It is safe to be licked.

When is the last time this dog was at the vet and had bloodwork?


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

The nose is a sign that something else is going on. Calendula ointment would be great for that nose. Not expensive either! 

Any updates?


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

> Quote:When is the last time this dog was at the vet and had bloodwork?


Last spring. I bring my pets in every spring for complete check ups.

We are going tomorrow morning to the vet. Someone here mentioned Lupus?
My Boy Friend researched it more & talked to one of the head vets at Harvard. He (my Boy Friend) Pre paid for the visit tomorrow.
I also was looking to buy the suppliments MONW suggested.
I came across some stuff. It's by Naturvet. It was at 2 places near by. One places was asking $23 for an 8 oz. bottle. The same stuff was being sold at our farm & tractor store. Same size bottle for $12. 99

Does this stuff sound right?
ArthriSoothe®-Gold Liquid

Product Discription:
Veterinarian formulated and recommended to support healthy hip and joint function. Helps to maintain joint flexibility and alleviate aches and discomfort associated with exercise. AthriSoothe-GOLD helps to support synovial fluid that lubricates the joints, and helps maintain cartilage and connective tissue. ArthrSoothe-GOLD contains important antioxidants that help remove free radicals that cause cellular damage.

Time Released Formula

Contains MSM & Hyaluronic Acid

Active Ingredients 
per 1 tsp. liquid Glucosamine HCl 500 mg 
Chondroitin Sulfate 60 mg 
Yucca Schidigera 90 mg 
Vitamin C 90 mg 
Vitamin E 3.3 IU 


Inactive Ingredients 
Corn Syrup, Deionized Water, Gelatin, Natural Flavoring, Potassium Sorbate, Rice Powder, Sodium Ascorbate, Sodium Benzoate and Xanthan Gum.


Directions 


Weight Daily Amount 
Cats 1/2 teaspoon 
up to 30 lbs. 1/2 teaspoon 
31 to 60 lbs. 1-1/2 teaspoons 
61 to 100 lbs. 2 teaspoons 
101 lbs. and over 3 teaspoons 

I'll be back tomorrow.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

Oops, for the liquid vitamin post above, I omitted the *vitamin E *from it!!

I agree BWM about the nose showing that something is happening on the inside. Max's nose, if I didn't treat it, would look something like that -- there seems to be a lot of this nose stuff going around. It could be fungal also. I guess I'm more concerned about the bowel movements and urination. That would typically mean that something is going on, or it's the food.

Yvette -- was everything normal with the bloodwork last year? I would definitely have a panel run this year, including a thyroid test.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

I never ever had any real issues with DaKota's health til now.
She only peed one time in the house. The pooping was her problem.
I stopped wetting her food, I stopped putting the ointment on her nose & I don't give her anymore "night time" treats. I also enclose her in the kitchen (with her bed in there) at night. I also put down newspaper by the back door, where she was pooping. For three nights the house is poop free. The vet will do all she needs to do tomorrow morning.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

> Quote:LisaT
> Oops, for the liquid vitamin post above, I omitted the vitamin E from it!!


Huh? What does that mean?


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

HER FOOD IS NOT THE PROBLEM YET. I seriously do not think it is.
I CAN NOT SWITCH. Would you starve your dog or let it get sick from feeding it "High Quality"? Or would you let it eat something that makes it healthy? I've tried EVO, Neutro, Chicken Soup, etc.
Everyone of those made her sick! When I got her at 1 1/2 yrs old at 33 lbs & refuse to eat "high Quality" & still does. This dog was on her death bed when I got her. My boss is actually the one that tried the Pro Plan on her & she has done well on it. You have your choice to feed & I have mine! If my vet says to change her diet & she has no side effects from it, then I will switch. I am not going to make my girl skinny again & I will not force her to be sick.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

We jusy got back from the vet's office. She ruled out DaKota's diet right away. Because of DaKota's age & sensitivities with the vet (and my finances right now),
She sugestted that we take things very slowly.She looked at DaKota's nose, skin, coat & weight & so forth. She didn't take blood work yet. My bad, I think, for forgetting DaKota's muzzle.
As of right now she wants us to try some meds. Cipro something?
She said she has seen this on one other GSD not too long ago & the meds did work. She said it is some deep seeded infection that some GSDs get. They barely remember that pup that came in in 2000 that got hit by a car & the one that got spayed. They said, other than her nose that she was looking really great for her age.
They also mentioned about how great her teeth looked for a ten yr. old that never had dental work done. The meds that they gave me are both Cipro something. I can not make out the rest of the writing.
So far she is acting the same ole same ole. I brought her home & went right to my daughter prancing with her happy face. No that she was told she was a good girl by both of us. She is layng down eating her treat I picked up on our way home.
Oh & the pooping? I was told, no more petroleum (sp?) based products on her nose. That is why she was pooping. That sounds about right.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

Yvette, the supplement you posted has corn syrup in it. If you have a problem with loose stools, corn syrup will make it worse. Just use the cheapest pill form you can get from the grocery.

I am glad that the vet visit helped out. I hope the nose clears up now.


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## Yvette (Jan 29, 2001)

We went for DaKota's follow up this morning. The vet said it looked about between 50% & 75% better. We are keeping her on the Ciprofloxacin for another 3 weeks. She (the vet) cleaned the scabs of DaKota's nose. She also recommends putting 2% Muricin Ointment on her nose twice a day. The ointment should be loads of fun to put on.


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Well that is good news. I hope that Dakota continues to improve.

Val


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## Amaruq (Aug 29, 2001)

I too hope that Dakota continues to improve.


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