# Pulling on walks



## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

Our GSD is now 17 months old and we've had mixed training on the leash during his growing up phase, but in the last few months I've started to nail the heel work or at least stop the pulling.

However when my wife comes out for a walk, he turns into a pulling machine, both if I take the leash or she does. I use ham as a treat as normal but he won't listen or respond as well. 

Problem is, she needs him to be able to walk and she is starting to hate taking him out.


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## annabirdie (Jul 3, 2015)

What kind of collar/leash are you using? 17 months is pretty strong. I used a gentle leader with my first for pulling, but I know the prong collar is the collar of choice for many GSD owners- havent tried one yet myself.


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## cdwoodcox (Jul 4, 2015)

rosko was only 6 months old but he would act the exact Same way. Would walk decent if it was just him and me. If my son or wife was with me, or if a squirrel was visible, or even blowing leaves he would pull and not listen. I took him to a trainer and she put a prong collar on him and within a half hour had him walking on heel dependably. Just took a couple corrections actually. I think she had more work with me than the dog.


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

cdwoodcox said:


> rosko was only 6 months old but he would act the exact Same way. Would walk decent if it was just him and me. If my son or wife was with me, or if a squirrel was visible, or even blowing leaves he would pull and not listen. I took him to a trainer and she put a prong collar on him and within a half hour had him walking on heel dependably. Just took a couple corrections actually. I think she had more work with me than the dog.


Pretty much sums up my walks. If he sees another dog or a squirrel or bird, he'll do the same thing. Occasionally he sees it as a game to pounce at cars too.

He wears a body hardness which has two clips for a double ended Halti lead which I use. 

I've not tried a prong collar, I thought people say these are cruel. He certainly doesn't listen as much when my wife is with me though, I guess he is acting as leader.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Once you try the prong you wonder why you waited so long. Check the Leerburg websites on proper use. I am a convert as well. I learned to adjust my tools to the dog I have in front of me. Haltis and harnesses are just feel-good tools for owners, not so much for dogs.


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## annabirdie (Jul 3, 2015)

Thanks, I might try that, my 6 month old is a puller and it is not fun - I think my older dog was better than her by this age. Rosie walks on "high alert" and notices everything from very far away.


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## Kane's World (Mar 24, 2015)

We tried the prong at 7 months at the suggestion of our trainer. Kane was far too sensitive and went over the top (jumping, crying, complete loss of focus). There were a couple of months that walking him was hard because he pulled so hard & as much as he tried to behave he couldn't for more than 2-3 minutes. It was all stop and go & really frustrating for all of us. At 9 months, I tried the prong again and he responded perfectly! You could just tell he finally understood what we wanted. It doesn't hurt him at all & the only actual correction he got was the first time when he lunged at a squirrel and corrected himself. After that, the most gentle guidance from the leash is all he needs....knock on wood. Now, we can walk for hours & every 10 minutes or so I tell him "okay" and let him go sniff around; I say 'heel' and he's right there...I didn't even teach him that but I'll take it.


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## Findlay (Jan 8, 2015)

Before Finn's 1st obedience class at 5 months, his trainer fitted him for a prong collar and showed me how to use for walking and training.

Finn was one of maybe 5 GSDs in the 1st obedience class and all were wearing prong collars.

Even now in Adv. Obedience Class, the GSDs wear prongs and some of the other larger breed dogs wear them as well.

Out trainer sells the H Sprenger Prong Collar.


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

I'm looking at stuff about Prong collars and it appears in the UK they don't really sell them as they are deemed cruel. Infact it is very much frowned upon and I don't think I'd feel comfortable walking him with one on for training with others judging.


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## Findlay (Jan 8, 2015)

robrymond said:


> I'm looking at stuff about Prong collars and it appears in the UK they don't really sell them as they are deemed cruel. Infact it is very much frowned upon and I don't think I'd feel comfortable walking him with one on for training with others judging.


I'm sorry. You are absolutely right to feel that way. I knew that prongs are banned in some countries. Sorry about that.

How about if your wife takes your pup to basic obedience class?
The trainer will know the best approach to correct your GSDs pulling.
It's no fun to walk a dog that pulls.

Good luck and take care.
Ps. my pup could pull a sled across Alaska at 5 months so I can only imagine what it's like to walk a 17 month old GSD that pulls. Yikes!! : )


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

Findlay said:


> I'm sorry. You are absolutely right to feel that way. I knew that prongs are banned in some countries. Sorry about that.
> 
> How about if your wife takes your pup to basic obedience class?
> The trainer will know the best approach to correct your GSDs pulling.
> ...


Yeah I think we'll be heading back to classes in the New Year. We did classes when he was a few months old which was mainly basics but also meeting and greeting dogs and recall.


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## Factor (Oct 9, 2015)

I have had some problems with pulling also, nowadays its pretty good but it is occasions when she pulls much more and one of them is when someone else is around or taking her out. The best method I have used for pulling on walks is to stop when she pulls, but she is still trying to get away with it sometimes and tries to pull. She knows what I want but the excitement and the thing that she may get away with it is stronger at some times. 

I have come to that point that I will try the prong collar for a little while, just for correcting the pulling (and also a firm new correction when passing other dogs, because she is NOT listening to my "leave it" command as good as before). The prong collar is also banned in the country I live in, but we still use it in the ipo protection training anyway and I think it is not that cruel equipment when used right. You just tell the dog that it isnt ok to do what its doing.. if the dog doesnt otherwise listen to you but know what you want, then you have to correct it. I know my dog is a strong headed and not sensitive one and I think this will do it for us. Not gonna use it forever, just until she gets that she gotta listen to me. I also dont want people here to judge me, so I will get another one with the fabric cover.. hopefully people wont recognize it that its actually a prong collar..and always so dark here in winter times 

Of course you have to do what feels best for you, but I dont think prong collars are that cruel though, if used right, as our countries says it is. Choke chains are told to be far more worse and those are allowed =S


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## Findlay (Jan 8, 2015)

Factor. One good thing about the ban on prong collars, is at least your country has the best interest of dogs at heart.

We do a lot of practicing the passing other dogs at obedience class. And of course at class Finn is rock solid, but outside he is a little more defiant with the leave it.
He's

But what has worked better for me this week is that as soon as he locks eyes with another dog, I say Leave It and if he doesn't look away, I give him a strong leash correction and tell him NO. 
I don't repeat the Leave it command. And saying No seems to be working...along with the leash correction. If he even attempts to look I say Eh.

My trainer said not to correct him if he just casually glances at another dog, it's the locking of eyes that is what we want to avoid.

My pup will be 16 months and he is being very stubborn these days.
Good luck.


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## Findlay (Jan 8, 2015)

robrymond said:


> Yeah I think we'll be heading back to classes in the New Year. We did classes when he was a few months old which was mainly basics but also meeting and greeting dogs and recall.


I definitely need the support of a structured class and having the trainer close by to answer questions is also a help.
Finn has been move up to advanced obedience but we still pop in to the basic obedience class now and then.

I like the basic ob. class a lot better.


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## brucebourdon (Jun 2, 2010)

I opened this thread in hopes of learning answers to this; my Kyra was a very strong puller most of the time, could be very frustrating.

There were days we're it was so bad that my arm would fatigue from constantly holding her back, and I had to wrap the leash behind me and hold it on the opposite side, using my tired arm to push away to the side so she wouldn't be walking ontop of me.

I think this was most common on walks that she was very familiar with (around the neighborhood, for example), and maybe not as bad when on some new trail.

We tried a prong collar with only slight improvement. She could still pull a sled while wearing one.

Note that when she wore a prong, I'd put another loose fitting collar on her as well (usually a choker chain), as I believed the *prong collar could come apart - leaving the dog untethered and free to chase whatever grabbed their focus* 

One thing I read recently was to try very high value treats, to train them to not lose focus on you. It was more for when things came up that amped up the dog, such as a strange dog/person approaching, etc., as opposed to anything continuous. But I wonder if it might help?

Good luck, and please post if you find methods that work for you.


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## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

Softouch Concepts, Inc - Softouch Concepts, Inc Homepage

My recommendation is to look into the Softouch Concepts Sensible and/or Sensation anti-pull harness. We hired a positive reinforcement behaviorist to work with Nara and Paw Paw, as I wanted to transition them away from prong collars and never used a choke chain. She recommended these harnesses and they fixed everything for us. Bye-bye prongs! I was able to walk 2 dogs at once, one on each side, with a combination of the harness and a 12" traffic lead (which is basically just the handle from one end and the clip from the other end of a normal nylon 4' or 6' leash).



















I will say, that when we transitioned from flat collar to prong, the pulling stopped instantly, and I never had a problem with the prong breaking or coming apart. They were made with tough, strong, tight-fitting metal with each prong forcefully locked into place by pressure. I don't see how one of those could ever come undone. I never worried about it. But we usually do our research and ensure we are buying top of the line products in place of cheap no-name brand ripoffs that are much lesser quality. I've stuck with Herm Sprenger for years now. The generic prongs you buy at pet stores are usually sharp and can hurt, whereas the HS prongs are smooth and rounded.


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## CindyMDBecker (Feb 22, 2013)

I used the "leash trick" method (search on Google) with Garrison & it worked wonders. Every once in a while we have to use it again to "remind" him but for the most part it was a quick & easy ( and cheap ) fix.


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## cdwoodcox (Jul 4, 2015)

I would think people would judge you worse for walking an I'll mannered dog. Or having the dog walk you, rather than a well mannered dog wearing a prong collar. If a prong isn't your thing or the dog doesn't work maybe you could attach an e-collar along with regular collar. When he/she pulls or gets out of heel give a zap then vocally and leash correct.


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## zyppi (Jun 2, 2006)

at 6 months, I'd hold off on prong.

But try this... start walk and when dog gets out in front of you - if dogs shoulder passes you leg - say (I use "with me") a command as you execute a 180° turn and keep going. Dog will likely repeat the forge ahead again and, again repeat command and turn. Don't give up before your dog does.

You'll get a bit dizzy for a couple of days, but pup will understand that he cannot walk ahead - and if pup can't go ahead he cannot pull.

It's a bit of a pain, but the reward is worth it. 

Best


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## Factor (Oct 9, 2015)

Findlay said:


> Factor. One good thing about the ban on prong collars, is at least your country has the best interest of dogs at heart.
> 
> We do a lot of practicing the passing other dogs at obedience class. And of course at class Finn is rock solid, but outside he is a little more defiant with the leave it.
> He's
> ...


Thats true, our country has the best interest in dogs at heart, and thats great (even though I think full choke chains wouldnt be allowed either if prong collars arent, but..).

I will try on our next walk to tell the "No!" also after correction. My girl is 13 months now and has been very good at the "leave it" command for a good while now when passing other dogs. Lately I have notices changes though, maybe due to her age and testing me again. I always tell her the "leave it" immediately when she is locked up on the other dog (ears standing forward), I give a quick leash correction if shes not listening. Here and then at last she use to look at me and start to focusing at me but nowadays she dont. Feels like she thinks she will go away with it and somehow she actually does. I will try our thing and also got interested in the "leash trick" method that was mentioned here. If it isnt working Im trying the prong collar just to show her Im seriuous.


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## Factor (Oct 9, 2015)

CindyMDBecker said:


> I used the "leash trick" method (search on Google) with Garrison & it worked wonders. Every once in a while we have to use it again to "remind" him but for the most part it was a quick & easy ( and cheap ) fix.


I will try this :laugh:


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

Thanks for all the advice so far. Thought I'd update on the situation. 

I've amended my walking time in the morning this week to around 8.10am, when everyone is leaving for school or work. I never walked at this time as I thought there would be too many distractions and other dogs being walked.

Funnily enough I've passed just one dog all week whilst on this circuit, yet we have plenty of other distractions which have been a good test.

There are lots of cars leaving and pulling off houses, people walking by or entering cars on the path where we are. There have been several dogs in houses barking through windows and so far we've been good.

My wife walked him this week in the evening and managed 45 minutes with some pulling (she gave it a 7/10 so mustn't have been too bad). I've been sticking to pavements though rather than paths through grassy areas. I did notice when we went into a wider grass land area with a path through it, he started pulling more and his sniff factor went crazy.

Quite happy so far anyway, we're not perfect but when I look at other dogs walking there owners and they are way smaller I smugly think that considering he is nearly 40kg even if I go tight on him, he's not forcibly dragging me like he used to be. I can tell things are better as I'm not getting the strains on my knee like I was or my arm.

Still a long way to go though particularly with other dogs. He still lunges and we've still had a few issues with lunging at cars, but I'm hoping with a much busier walking route in terms of vehicles, he'll get bored of that. He did great with the refuse truck this week, ignoring it and the guys doing the bins.


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## Factor (Oct 9, 2015)

robrymond said:


> Thanks for all the advice so far. Thought I'd update on the situation.
> 
> I've amended my walking time in the morning this week to around 8.10am, when everyone is leaving for school or work. I never walked at this time as I thought there would be too many distractions and other dogs being walked.
> 
> ...


Do you use clicker? My problems has gotten better to click and reward the dog everytime (at leas in the beginning) the dog is looking at you. Keeps more focus on me and pulls less.

Tried the leash trick btw, and I dont think its suitable for us. The dog cant pull, but its still always in the very end of the leash.. stop when pulling and the click and reward works better in our case.


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

I need to dig out the clicker. I stopped using it as I found it difficult to use a clicker, walk him and reward at the same time, particularly when there were other distractions around. That said I perhaps need to reintroduce it as he is stubborn at times and doesn't listen.


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

Factor said:


> Do you use clicker? My problems has gotten better to click and reward the dog everytime (at leas in the beginning) the dog is looking at you. Keeps more focus on me and pulls less.
> 
> Tried the leash trick btw, and I dont think its suitable for us. The dog cant pull, but its still always in the very end of the leash.. stop when pulling and the click and reward works better in our case.


I need to dig out the clicker. I stopped using it as I found it difficult to use a clicker, walk him and reward at the same time, particularly when there were other distractions around. That said I perhaps need to reintroduce it as he is stubborn at times and doesn't listen.

Today was not a great morning (he was in overdrive sniffing) so instead of walking far and being pulled along I did some training on the kerbside. We did sit and wait and the kerb and as I crossed the road alone telling him to wait, I then called him across. It went pretty well considering we haven't done it for a while due to poor weather.


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## joeinca (Mar 19, 2015)

cdwoodcox said:


> rosko was only 6 months old but he would act the exact Same way. Would walk decent if it was just him and me. If my son or wife was with me, or if a squirrel was visible, or even blowing leaves he would pull and not listen. I took him to a trainer and she put a prong collar on him and within a half hour had him walking on heel dependably. Just took a couple corrections actually. I think she had more work with me than the dog.


My pup walks okay just her and I...a few corrections here and there but nothing too crazy. However, she was a lunatic when I had my 6 yr old son with me. He tried walking ahead of us and she was pulling like crazy trying to walk in front of him. Not sure if it was a herding thing or what but at 6mo old she's very strong. I will be starting group obedience with her in a few weeks.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Oh well I'm always the odd guy out! I get a "Prong" and I have no problem with them but my tool of choice is a Slip Lead Leash.

Details here:
Slip Lead leash - Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums


Works just fine for me.


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## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

robrymond said:


> ... I did some training on the kerbside. We did sit and wait and the kerb and...


 I know the US and England spell words differently, but I learned something today. I never saw curb spelled kerb. Funny, my spell checker on this forum is even telling me kerb is not a word. Never knew that's the correct spelling across the water. Thank you for teaching me something today. And I say this with sincerity. I'm not joking or looking to make fun of who speaks more "proper" English. Ha! Respect.


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## robrymond (Sep 7, 2014)

counter said:


> I know the US and England spell words differently, but I learned something today. I never saw curb spelled kerb. Funny, my spell checker on this forum is even telling me kerb is not a word. Never knew that's the correct spelling across the water. Thank you for teaching me something today. And I say this with sincerity. I'm not joking or looking to make fun of who speaks more "proper" English. Ha! Respect.


With pleasure. Funnily enough in my job I have to spell using US English as I deal with US clients, so sometimes I get my words muddled up!

A little dog ran out its house yesterday right in front of us. Max was pretty calm despite the growling of the little dog and they both had a sniff, then Max wanted to play.

The owner called him a 'big softie' and petted him and went to catch her dog. Apart from being a little excited, he was quite good. I also got him to sit outside a house with a distracting dog jumping at the front gate.

Alas we then passed two other dogs together and he started to bark at them. I don't understand why he is fine with dogs in houses or off the leash but has issues with those attached to there owners; it makes me look like a bad dog owner.


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## JLLNet (Oct 22, 2015)

zyppi said:


> at 6 months, I'd hold off on prong.
> 
> But try this... start walk and when dog gets out in front of you - if dogs shoulder passes you leg - say (I use "with me") a command as you execute a 180° turn and keep going. Dog will likely repeat the forge ahead again and, again repeat command and turn. Don't give up before your dog does.
> 
> ...


My Female is 6 month old and she walks fine with me on the streets, sidewalks, etc. But she tends to outpace me a little bit, usually half her body is always past my left leg, but doesn't pull.

Is that okay or she shouldn't be ahead of my left leg not even her head ? 

Sometimes I jerk on the slip-leash hard when she tries to get too ahead of me.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

JLLNet said:


> My Female is 6 month old and she walks fine with me on the streets, sidewalks, etc. But she tends to outpace me a little bit, usually half her body is always past my left leg, but doesn't pull.
> 
> Is that okay or she shouldn't be ahead of my left leg not even her head ?
> 
> Sometimes I jerk on the slip-leash hard when she tries to get too ahead of me.


 Oh SLL. 

See my link in this thread but the jerk think?? Maybe that's a terminology issue?? 

You position the leash high and snug and use gentle "pressure" sideways to get the dog slightly "off balance" to correct. Other suggestions are in this thread: 

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...611193-leash-reactive-getting-worse-time.html


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## 9mmmac (Dec 28, 2015)

robrymond said:


> I need to dig out the clicker. I stopped using it as I found it difficult to use a clicker, walk him and reward at the same time, particularly when there were other distractions around. That said I perhaps need to reintroduce it as he is stubborn at times and doesn't listen.


 
I did this a couple of times when I first had the prong collar. The best benefit was to be proactive and never get in a situation where the dog would get excited and pull away. When I noticed Grendel starting to focus on something (or when I spotted something) I would stop. Just stop. 90% of the time my dog would stop as well. If we stop for a long time, sometimes he would sit. And I'd crouch down right beside him and we'd both watch- guy on riding lawnmower, other dogs, trash truck, whatever. We'd stop, watch, crouch, *click* and when Grendel hers that *click* he knows he's gonna get a treat, so he would turn to me and get his reward. 

Then we'd just watch some more until it wasn't interesting or had moved away and then we'd resume our walk.

We still do the same thing, but the clicker doesn't need to be used any more. But I will move me and my dog to defuse a dog-on-dog situation- sometimes I really think other people don't see us! They are supposed to be "walking" their dog but they are chatting on the phone, texting, whatever. 

Get him used to the clicker, and keep it as reinforcement. Might take a week, maybe a month. Also try getting down beside your dog- they might focus on you, but it seemed to reassure Grendel a lot when I was eye to eye, right beside him.


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