# PLEASE tell me this is normal.



## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

My puppy "Dutch" (12 weeks today) came from a very reputable breeder. We brought him home at 8 weeks and started some simple basic training recommended by "The art of raising a puppy" . started with sit then down then some basic leash training . The play biting started at around 9 weeks which ok, I was ready for it and used the "yelp" method followed by the leave the area method. (Disclaimer... I cant say I was consistent though) I did spend a lot of time on the "leave it-Take it" method to teach him to leave it rewarding each successful reaction. That seems to help but now I'm having new problems . Every time I slip his leash over his head he goes for my hands again. I worked on this yesterday by repeatedly having him sit , and holding the loop of the leash in front of his face with my left hand while holding a treat in my right. As he focused on the treat I slipped the loop over his head and said good boy and gave him the treat. I did it again (holding the treat in my right hand ) while I used my left hand to slip the loop off his head.... this is going fairly well but He still wants to grab the leash and play tug once its on .


I have been taking him for walks 3 times a day ( starting a week ago about 3/4 mile) and he will get into it (the walk) and all of a sudden start grabbing the leash , tugging , jumping up, grabbing at my pants , biting my leg, barking and growling and this morning, lunging at me because he was so mad. My response to this was to stop dead in my tracks and be quiet and ignore him until he sat down and stopped but as soon as I said heel he started again . Thank God we were almost home. I wanted so bad for our walk to end on a good note but it didn't. Today I can say I was honestly fearful of his actions. 


Other information.... We started puppy classes last week , We also did as much socialization as we could without his second set of shots.... took him to lowes, had people come over to visit him etc.
I have had 2 other GSD's but have never had a GSD puppy. 
I am a small person with a dog who will likely be 100 lbs. 
I intend to continue with obedience for a long time as its so important to me to have a well trained loving companion.
What are your thoughts on "E" collars? At what age? 


So, Please tell me this is all normal, that I have a typical GSD puppy! I welcome helpful advice. I want to make sure I'm doing the right thing here.


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

yuppers, very normal. Little cute Land Sharks and velociraptors in Fur. Use this desire to practice his biting for the power of good. Games of tug become great rewards (be gentle durning the teething times). 

Also remember these babies need naps! A human child will get whiny and cranky. Puppies become mouthy and unreasonable. Slow down on socialization. They don't need to meet lots and lots of people. It is actually better if they get to watch folks from a distance and not have to deal with huge strangers coming to touch them. 

I know that there is a place for e-collars but honestly, most dogs will never need one. They are for specialized training at distances, considering they were used on gun dogs where leashes were impracticable. At 6 months you might consider a prong collar but in the meantime a martingale is good. Easy on and they don't slip off quickly.


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## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

Yes, he sounds like a typical land-shark GSD puppy to me. Perfectly normal. Keep up your obedience work and the classes. Try to find a trainer who is experienced with working breeds, or better yet, GSDs. There are lots of threads on puppy play-biting and loose leash walking if you do a search on this site. Try to be calm, consistent, and confident when working with your pup (easier said than done, I know!)--Dogs can sense frustration and uncertainty, I think. When I am training and getting frustrated, sometimes I have to walk away for a few minutes until I feel calm and in control again. This may differ for everyone, I'm sure, but I don't get good results from my dogs when I'm agitated. For example, I was trying to clip my puppy's nails a while back, and he was wiggling and not letting me work--even though we've done that many times before and he knows better. I was getting irritated. I had to let him go for a minute, take some deep breaths, and when I tried again, feeling calm and confident, he sat there without an issue and let me clip his nails. 

I agree with Car2ner about the martingale collar. I've never used an e-collar, but I think your pup might be a little young for that. You might want to have your trainer teach you how to use a prong collar when your pup is 6-8 months old.


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## SamsontheGSD (Dec 23, 2016)

Haha. Yep, that sounds like our puppy.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

E Collar : no. You don't need one and can cause harm with one (and I like and use e collars- but I don't think there is anything in this tm situation that an e collar would be appropriate for)

What made you ask about e collars, what do you think it will help or what do you want to do with it?


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

I think very short leash walks and way more off leash wandering,sniffing,natural exercise will facilitate a positive change.He needs to do more doggy things and hopefully you can relax and enjoy his puppy hood as he does them.Enjoy and bond with each other


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

Well, I went and bought a padded Martingale collar. I also tried to "enhance my calm" ha ha ... Our walk just now was wonderful... I live in a neighborhood some sidewalks and some side streets that have none .. I also upped the treat quality , using cut up skim mozzarella sticks. He was so good , never freaked out once (well one little time) ... Let me put something else by you ....... This morning it was still dark 630am when we started our walk.... do you think he was a tad afraid of the dark? 


One other biggie.... I'm trying to keep him next to me on a loose leash , this afternoon he did start freaking a bit so I let him go on the grass and lo and behold , he had to go!!! jeez forgot all about that, being so focused on the leash training..... My bad! Focus Mommy, he's talking to you to!


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## islanddog (Jun 27, 2016)

I admit I've never raised a puppy, so I'm no expert, but, if I had this cutie I would definitely bring a tug toy and make some play time on the walks--like at the end of a dead end street, a quiet side street, parkette or where-ever. Leashed walks are boring, tugging is fun and can be played on leash.
Enjoy your puppy.


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

islanddog said:


> I admit I've never raised a puppy, so I'm no expert, but, if I had this cutie I would definitely bring a tug toy and make some play time on the walks--like at the end of a dead end street, a quiet side street, parkette or where-ever. Leashed walks are boring, tugging is fun and can be played on leash.
> Enjoy your puppy.


 

You are right.... At the moment , I have 2 stopping points (nice grassy empty lots) that we stop so he can lay down and roll around ... He loves the nice thick cool grass and its a great resting point to stop for a belly rub. I'm not sure I want to play with a tug toy though... as I'm trying so hard to break the habit of tugging at his leash as a tug toy, I like when he forgets about it! :wink2:


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## Kazel (Nov 29, 2016)

Stormywx said:


> You are right.... At the moment , I have 2 stopping points (nice grassy empty lots) that we stop so he can lay down and roll around ... He loves the nice thick cool grass and its a great resting point to stop for a belly rub. I'm not sure I want to play with a tug toy though... as I'm trying so hard to break the habit of tugging at his leash as a tug toy, I like when he forgets about it! :wink2:


Bringing a tug toy can redirect his focus from the leash to the toy. He's getting bored on his walk so he wants to play. He is still just a baby.


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

dogma13 said:


> I think very short leash walks and way more off leash wandering,sniffing,natural exercise will facilitate a positive change.He needs to do more doggy things and hopefully you can relax and enjoy his puppy hood as he does them.Enjoy and bond with each other


I really don't have a place for off leash wandering as I'm in an in town neighborhood and my yard is quite small. We do however have a small park in our neighborhood so I may take him over there and see how he does. Also, before I let him wander I think we need to perfect the recall... right now its iffy.


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## Squeaky (Nov 10, 2016)

Stormywx said:


> I really don't have a place for off leash wandering as I'm in an in town neighborhood and my yard is quite small. We do however have a small park in our neighborhood so I may take him over there and see how he does. Also, before I let him wander I think we need to perfect the recall... right now its iffy.


Put him on a very long rope, 15 - 20 feet, so he can wander and you still have control of him.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

I second off leash training at his age. He is too young to run off and if you can use his natural instinct to follow, you will have fewer problems. If you are in traffic or around a lot of other people or dogs, use a leash. At his age, though, he doesn't need long walks. My WL puppy ate through 3 leashes before he finally stopped chewing them. It's all normal and it takes patience and time. I worked with mine more at home at that age. Lots of house manners, putting treats in a fist so they learn to lick rather than bite. Once they have stopped biting, then I wean them from licking. 

They have short attention spans, so you don't need to spend more than five minutes at one time on different training activities. At that age, my main focus was on not biting and on housebreaking.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Stormywx said:


> I really don't have a place for off leash wandering as I'm in an in town neighborhood and my yard is quite small. We do however have a small park in our neighborhood so I may take him over there and see how he does. Also, before I let him wander I think we need to perfect the recall... right now its iffy.


You can't do a lot until he has his shots, but you can still reinforce following you in your yard and indoors. If the park has a lot of dogs, you need to think about diseases, unfortunately. There are other types of places you can use. I didn't do this and wish I had.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Stormywx said:


> I really don't have a place for off leash wandering as I'm in an in town neighborhood and my yard is quite small. We do however have a small park in our neighborhood so I may take him over there and see how he does. Also, before I let him wander I think we need to perfect the recall... right now its iffy.


Put a long line on him.A length of clothes line is fine.You can step on it if need be.Gsds tend to stay fairly close and check in with you regularly.A good boy! whenever he looks at you and a treat when he comes close to you voluntarily will further cement this tendency.Run away from him occasionally and call him w he least expects it.I'll bet you he'll come flying back to you asap!
There really a lot of natural areas around if you think about it.School yards,sports fields,fields behind strip malls and industrial areas....
Please give it try and give him the opportunity to be a dog and give yourself the opportunity to enjoy being with him.I'm totally 100% sure you will see a positive change!


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

And yes, I didn't say it but what you are seeing is perfectly typical for this breed and age! Search this forum for "puppy biting." You will find a lot of previous posts.


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## cdwoodcox (Jul 4, 2015)

Great advice already posted. I second not trying to do too much at once. Play tug play as much tug as you can. It will direct his efforts to his toys and not the leash. As far as wanting to chew on you. Just try and enjoy it. That means he wants to play and interact with you. Just grab a rope or another tug toy and play with him. recall can be worked inside easily. With my pups we would go on opposite sides of the room and take turns calling his name followed by come. So "spot come" while waving his favorite treat. He should come running reach out touch his neck then YES and treat. As he gets the hang of it you can lengthen the distance. To eventually outside with distractions. Long line could be used at first if need but I don't think you will. Only call him with come if you have a treat. Eventually muscle memory will replace the need to treat every time and you can wean him off treats. Enjoy


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## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

Some people in my training class had success putting bitter-apple spray on their leashes to stop leash-biting. I didn't try it, so I have no idea if it works with GSDs, but it probably couldn't hurt to try as long as the spray was non-toxic (I've never really looked into it). 

I love playing tug with my dogs (as long as it's an appropriate toy in an appropriate time and place). I think it provides a good outlet for all those crazy puppy chomps. 

If my pup was acting obnoxious on a walk (biting clothes, jumping ect), I would probably say "no" and give a little leash correction. Also, when a dog jumps up, you can kind of walk into them or step into their space so they go back on all fours. Make sure they have "all four on the floor" when you or anyone else gives them attention so that the jumping isn't reinforced. In our training classes, dogs must be sitting when they get pets from anyone. If they stand or jump, stop giving them pets. 

How are your classes going?--they should be a big help. (BTW, the puppy in your avatar is adorable!)


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

sebrench said:


> Some people in my training class had success putting bitter-apple spray on their leashes to stop leash-biting. I didn't try it, so I have no idea if it works with GSDs, but it probably couldn't hurt to try as long as the spray was non-toxic (I've never really looked into it).
> 
> I love playing tug with my dogs (as long as it's an appropriate toy in an appropriate time and place). I think it provides a good outlet for all those crazy puppy chomps.
> 
> ...


Bitter apple comes off on your hands and if you touch your lips or mouth, you taste it. It takes a while to get rid of the taste. My dogs have never minded it.


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

sebrench said:


> Some people in my training class had success putting bitter-apple spray on their leashes to stop leash-biting. I didn't try it, so I have no idea if it works with GSDs, but it probably couldn't hurt to try as long as the spray was non-toxic (I've never really looked into it).
> 
> I love playing tug with my dogs (as long as it's an appropriate toy in an appropriate time and place). I think it provides a good outlet for all those crazy puppy chomps.
> 
> ...




Ha... Thank you! I wish I could post a video but guess I haven't made enough posts yet.... took him to our neighborhood park and he was so good.!


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

Thanks to the advise, I took him to our Neighborhood park with a long retractable leash so he could explore... He had a wonderful time ... we will start going daily... he was calm and loved meeting people and dogs.... If you would like ... check my photo album for photos of him being happy here.


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

LuvShepherds said:


> You can't do a lot until he has his shots, but you can still reinforce following you in your yard and indoors. If the park has a lot of dogs, you need to think about diseases, unfortunately. There are other types of places you can use. I didn't do this and wish I had.


 He had his 2nd round last week so safe...


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Stormywx said:


> He had his 2nd round last week so safe...


My vet wouldn't let us out until we were done with everything. If there isn't a lot of diseases in your area, he should be alright if you go to places where there aren't a lot of dogs. We were having bad parvo, according to the vet, although I couldn't find any actual proof.


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

Our day at the park.... but the biting continues...working hard with the off command as he's biting like there is no tomorrow.... had a leg bite yesterday up above the knee.... before they were at the ankle so he's definitely growing! I'm going to get that canned air " pet corrector" anybody use that?


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## Julian G (Apr 4, 2016)

The biting always gets better, I keep a soft a chewy toy in my pocket and give a firm "NO" with a short pause to stop everything and then redirect to the toy, when he bites the toy give a high pitched happy "YES". As for him biting you when you put the collar over his head, its a simple fix. You need a clicker and treats, heres a good video to get the idea...






By the way, he's adorable, and I guarantee the biting will get better as he matures. He simply doesnt know yet that what he's doing is hurting you. He'll soon chomp on his own tail and realize that biting hurts 
Stick with it, it usually stops at around the 6 month old age.


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## NorthWoodsForest (Feb 11, 2017)

Hello! I can't help you with the biting, because my 9 week old is relentless. Like a few people suggested I stay consistent with redirecting him to a chew toy, but he loves hands and feet especially taking the leash off. I am with you and I really hope it improves. Your Shepherd has a lot of similarities to my puppy and I was wondering if you can tell me how similar mine looks to yours at this age? Is yours pure because mine is adopted and I'm not sure if he's mixed or not. Hoping his ears will rise but of course we love him anyway!


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## Stormywx (Apr 26, 2015)

NorthWoodsForest said:


> Hello! I can't help you with the biting, because my 9 week old is relentless. Like a few people suggested I stay consistent with redirecting him to a chew toy, but he loves hands and feet especially taking the leash off. I am with you and I really hope it improves. Your Shepherd has a lot of similarities to my puppy and I was wondering if you can tell me how similar mine looks to yours at this age? Is yours pure because mine is adopted and I'm not sure if he's mixed or not. Hoping his ears will rise but of course we love him anyway!


Hi there, Your puppy is adorable... Dutch was a bit fluffier than yours ... Dutch is a long haired German shepherd .


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## KaiserAus (Dec 16, 2016)

I think it gets to a point where you are just about to crack and then they suddenly get better with the biting.

Our little guy is now nearing 4 months old and his biting has gotten much better in the last 2 weeks. 

I don't know if I would have survived the first 14 weeks without a tug toy though... I would carry it around constantly and redirect him whenever he started biting.


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## KaiserAus (Dec 16, 2016)

Stormywx said:


> *I have been taking him for walks 3 times a day* ( starting a week ago about 3/4 mile) and he will get into it (the walk) and all of a sudden start grabbing the leash , tugging , jumping up, grabbing at my pants , biting my leg, barking and growling and this morning, lunging at me because *he was so mad*. My response to this was to stop dead in my tracks and be quiet and ignore him until he sat down and stopped but as soon as I said heel he started again . Thank God we were almost home. I wanted so bad for our walk to end on a good note but it didn't. Today I can say I was honestly fearful of his actions.
> 
> 
> Other information.... We started puppy classes last week , We also did as much socialization as we could without his second set of shots.... took him to lowes, had people come over to visit him etc.
> ...


I think 3 walks a day is quite a lot for a little puppy... he needs to nap or he is going to be tired and grumpy. 
You also need to make sure that he learns to entertain himself and learns that there are times to be quiet. You are not there to be his full time entertainment.

Do you mean mad as in angry or mad as in acting crazy. I find myself reminding myself a lot that my guy is still just a little baby, he doesn't know any better and he certainly isn't angry with me, he might get crazy and over excited but that is cos he doesn't know how to control himself yet. But never angry and aggressive. 

Big no to the e collar at this stage... I always see an e collar as something that will help with behavioral issues, he is a puppy, he doesn't have any issues yet, he is just being a puppy.


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## kast2L (Aug 23, 2016)

I am not telling you anything someone hasn't already been telling you and I have a Malinois so I know where you are coming from with the biting. He would first start nipping at your heel (herding people) and at times would just sprint and bite your hand if you had it on the floor. So like others said I always, always had a toy and as soon as he made the decision to not go after my hand but instead the toy, bunch of praising and a treat if I had it on me. Just gotta be consistent and make sure others are consistent too!


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