# Fox and puppy



## WolfieWolf (Oct 4, 2012)

Do you think an adult grey fox poses a threat to an 8-week old GSD puppy?

We do not have the puppy yet. The grey fox (and also a red one) haunts the neighborhood. Grey fox spent an afternoon sunning on our deck with no fear of us. It is a gorgeous exquisite creature, looks quite healthy, I don't think it is rabid. Same fox has been seen in someone else's back yard playing with the dog's toys! Both times he acted like he owned the place! After the sunning incident, I did some research and found that foxes will take small pets like cats, small dogs. This makes me wonder about putting an 8-week old puppy out there to go to the bathroom, especially in the middle of the night, which of course will be a requirement at that age. I will stay out there with him, but wouldn't be nearly fast enough if a fox came in and went after him. Am I going to have to get a large wire pen with door and wire top to put out there for the bathroom training period until the dog gets big enough? I'm concerned if I don't, he'll go off in a corner of the yard and... fox could get him. Am I being overly paranoid? 

Thanks, I'm new here and really am getting a lot out of the many posts and all the information.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Keep the puppy on a leash when you take him out and you won't have a problem. Plus, if you are out there with him, you'll know he went and you can praise him to make housebreaking that much easier.


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## Bear GSD (Apr 12, 2012)

I have lots of fox and coyote in my area. The coyote are especially bad. 
I would definitely make sure that you are with your pup when you take him out at night. I don't belive that they will approach if you are with your pup (unless maybe rabid).
I have walked in my area and have come across coyote when my pup was small but I was the deterant so they wouldn't bother us.
Definitely no alone time until he's bigger!


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

Worry about rabies as much as anything.
Foxes are a rabies vector.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

Something tells me that rabies isn't a worry since most would snatch a small animal and kill/eat it. Don't know how much luck you'd have getting it back alive.

I'm assuming you don't have a fence by the fact the animal seemed to be on what I'd guess is a BACK deck? I'm also going to assume you're in a neighborhood like setting? I wouldn't be letting a puppy that young off leash in a populated area that isn't fenced in anyways. Keep it leashed, a flexi-leash or a regular 10-20ft leash will give plenty of space for the dog to roam/potty and still be safe.

Though with as "friendly" as the foxes sound, I wonder if they weren't someones pet at one point. :thinking:


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## Beau (Feb 12, 2012)

You could always try to trap it and release it elsewhere. 

Foxes and skunks are a problem here and we have a pretty high incidence of rabies both species. I won't allow either of them to take up residence.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

Yes, I would worry with an unleashed puppy re: foxes.

Foxes can be rabid without appearing sick, in the early stages. They can also carry mange mites (had a dog who got in a little tussle with one and ended up with mange probably from the fox)..

I have two foxy brothers here, have been hanging around since babies, if my yard wasn't fenced, they most likely would have come on up on the deck as well..They are pretty brazen, and now that they've matured, well, the neighbors lost a couple chickens to one, I saw one of them trying to run down a squirrel behind the fence (squirrel won

I have hawks, as well, any type of wildlife can hurt/kill a puppy if they are determined enough..

here's the two boys behind my fence









I have pics of one of them eating WITH my woodchuck (yep have a couple of those


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

A fox that is not acting afraid could be in a stage of rabies. It is displaying behavior that is not typical, or opposite of what it should normally shows, and that can be a symptom of rabies. Also, rabies can be transmitted through saliva, so playing with the toys, I do not know how long it can live without a host, I mean, if the fox slobbered all over the dog toys last night, and your pup played with them the next day, I really don't know if it could be transmitted that way. But I wouldn't want to find out either.

An eight week old puppy is susceptible to rabies. Also parvo, distemper, lepto, which wild animals might have. Also, fleas and mites and worms. Yes, there are a lot of concerns with fox and and a little puppy. 

I would be tempted to buy a few x-pens and set them up around the back door where you can put together a small area that the puppy can be taken to potty and keep its toys in. If an x-pen has 8 2' panels and you get two of them, and then use the side of your house as one side, you can have an 8'x16' area for your pup. I would get the 48" high pens and not put any food out there, so the fox will be unlikely to try and get into it. 

I would not leave the pup in this area on its own. But I would continue to use this area until the puppy has completed its shots. With luck the pup will continue to only poop in that area of the yard even after you let him farther abroad.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

actually I should have added, I would discourage the fox from hanging around, if the ones that are here start looking a little bold, I just let my aussie out, (My gsd thinks they are all her friends He'll chase/bark, and they take off like a bullet, which is what they should do..


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## sitstay (Jan 20, 2003)

I don't think proximity to a human will give a puppy any safety. I was walking through a barn yard in the evening not too soon after moving to Idaho and a red fox sprang out and grabbed the barn cat within 5 feet of where I was standing. The fox wasn't rabid. It was habituated to humans.
Sheilah


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

Beau said:


> You could always try to trap it and release it elsewhere.
> 
> Foxes and skunks are a problem here and we have a pretty high incidence of rabies both species. I won't allow either of them to take up residence.


I don't know about the laws there, but here, that'd be considered illegal, or you'd need a permit to trap.
Once trapped, it must be killed due to the rabies vector aspect.
It is illegal to trap and release it elsewhere.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I don't know about foxes, but I know raccoons and skunks here cannot be trapped and released. 

Frankly, I think it is bad policy anyway. You have to release it somewhere, and most areas around here have people living in and around them. Animals who live near humans find getting food from their leavings, garbage, pets, etc, are much easier than wrangling it up for themselves. They won't stay in the woods, they will go to where people are.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

I agree.
It is kinder, _if legal_, to kill the fox, although if it was me, I'd wait a bit until it's winter coat is in, and preserve the skin/fur. That way it's not a total waste of a beautiful animal.


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## jae (Jul 17, 2012)

I agree with selzer, that fox may well be rabid if it is just hanging around plain sight of larger beings especially loudmouths like humans. Critters should really be afraid of humans unless some fools are feeding them straight up, like the rodents that come up to people in many touristy national parks. 

I'd keep a mace on me. Not the spray mace, the medieval mace on a chain  but seriously, you need some thing to fend that animal off and kill it if it decides to go for your pup. Injuring it won't deter it for long. What the authorities don't know won't get you fined.

Aare you totally sure about that fox, Sheilah? foxes are one of the more skittish animals I have seen in my presence.


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## Beau (Feb 12, 2012)

msvette2u said:


> I don't know about the laws there, but here, that'd be considered illegal, or you'd need a permit to trap.
> Once trapped, it must be killed due to the rabies vector aspect.
> It is illegal to trap and release it elsewhere.


It's not illegal here, we trap and relocate all of the time. And since I live in a pretty rural area, fairly close to a number of National Parks, we don't have to worry about it becoming a nuisance for someone else (assuming someone takes the time to relocate in an isolated area). 

If there is any indication, however slight, that it may be a rabies related issue, we just shoot them. Also not illegal in my area.


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## Beau (Feb 12, 2012)

Beau said:


> It's not illegal here, we trap and relocate all of the time. And since I live in a pretty rural area, fairly close to a number of National Parks, we don't have to worry about it becoming a nuisance for someone else (assuming someone takes the time to relocate in an isolated area).
> 
> If there is any indication, however slight, that it may be a rabies related issue, we just shoot them. Also not illegal in my area.


Well, I stand corrected. I just looked up the regulations and it appears that with foxes, it does require a permit to trap and you cannot relocate them.  

Skunks, coyotes and possums are another story.

I love this forum....I learn something new every day!


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## WolfieWolf (Oct 4, 2012)

Hello again everyone and thank you so much for the wealth of info. I'm sorry I haven't gotten back until now -- we have been totally dog-occupied (trying to find the right one.) Then I forgot which forum I'd posted this in!

Anyway, to answer some questions, we do have a fenced back yard but part of it (the part looking out onto the wild area) is wrought iron, and the fox can slip between the bars. My husband saw it leave that way. We are going to put mesh up and seal any cracks under the wooden part of the fence, and hopefully that will keep anything out. 

I really appreciate the advice, and what I take from this is that I need to be with a puppy at every moment when he's outside, and take steps to keep other critters out of the yard. 

Thanks everyone!


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