# Our Dogs Menus



## Lauri & The Gang

Since we've had so much interest in raw diets in the last few weeks I thought it might be helpful, for those new to the idea, to see what the more experienced people do.

So - let's see the details. You can list all your dogs or just one or two. List the dogs age, current weight, activity level and then tell us what you are feeding. List the type of item (RMB, MM, OM, veggies, etc.), how much of each item (say whether you estimate or weigh everything) and any supplements (and why).

I'll start. This covers what they were eating last month. I weigh everything.


Riggs - 10 yr old neutered German Shepherd, 75 pounds, average activity level.
AM - 9 ounces RMBs, PM 8 ounces MM & 1 ounce OM
RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, tilapia, pork rib tips, canned mackerel, turkey necks, pork necks, lamb necks
MM - beef heart, ground turkey, pork hearts, lamb trim
OM - liver, kidney
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
Limitations - None


Tazer - 8 yr old neutered Cocker Spaniel, 25 pounds, above average activity level (especially during coursing season)
AM - 5 ounces RBMs (day after coursing - 6.5 ounces)
PM - 5 ounces MM (day after coursing - 6 ounces) & .5 ounce OM
RMBs - same as Riggs but large items are chopped into smaller pieces
MM - beef and pork hearts 90% of the time (for the taurine - he's epileptic), lamb trim (especially after coursing days)
OM - liver (he doesn't like kidney)
Misc - green tripe, eggs
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s), multi-vitamin (because of his seizures)
Limitations - NO large amounts of grains (he can have treats)
Special Note - Tazer sometimes has trouble keeping weight on during coursing season - even when he's not running


Winnie - 8 yr old spayed Corgi mix, 25 pounds, average activity level
AM - 4.5 ounces RBMs 
PM - 4 ounces MM & .5 ounce OM
RMBs - same as above but NO turkey necks and everything has to be chopped tiny (she's a gulper)
MM - Same as Riggs
OM - liver & kidney
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
Limitations - none
Special Note - Winnie puts on weight just LOOKING at food so we monitor her very closely


----------



## big_dog7777

Zeus - 9 yr old neutered German Shepherd, 90 pounds, low activity level.
AM - 8 oz RMBs & 4 oz MM, 1/2 Banana, Tablespoon plain yogurt. 
PM 8 oz RMBs & 4 oz MM, 1/2 can veggies
RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, tilapia, canned mackerel, 
MM - ground wild game (mixture of rabbit, venison, bear, ostrich, etc.)
Misc - eggs, cottage cheese (small amounts)
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s), vitamin C, vitamin E, Glucosamine (Grand Flex)
Veggies - No salt added canned green beans, carrots, peas, beats (to make him feel full, it's a constant battle keeping him lean).
Limitations - None

My 50 pound female pup Lowen is on the same plan but without the Grand Flex. Her amounts will be increasing soon (she is LEAN and high energy).


----------



## tracyc

Great idea!

Here's what mine are eating this month. Our menu changes every couple of months, always rotating in a new protein or two. The only consistent item that's usually on the list is chicken. It's just too cheap not to be a staple. I also weigh every meal. 

Luca: 2 yr old neutered GSD, 100 lbs. average activity level. 13 oz. meals, twice a day. Luca tends to be pudgy, so his meal sizes have been gradually reduced from 17 oz. meals when he was a puppy. 

Fanny: 1 yr. old spayed Cardigan Corgi, 29 lbs. average activity level. 5 oz. meals, twice a day. Fanny gulps, so bone-in stuff gets pre-chewed a bit with the meat cleaver. 

RMB: 
• chicken leg quarters
• turkey necks
• duck necks
MM:
• ground lamb
• pork hearts
OM:
• chicken livers
OTHER:
• canned mackerel - 1 can a week split between the two dogs
• canned sardines - 1 can a week split between the two dogs
• 2-3 eggs per week (with all the necks lately, I haven't been giving the shells right now--usually they do get the shells)
• yogurt--bedtime snack (Luca 3 tablespoons, Fanny 1 tablespoon)

SUPPLEMENTS: these powders get mixed into their yogurt
Fanny 1/3 teaspoon total, Luca 1 teaspoon total
• brewers yeast
• Glucosamine/Chondroitin/MSM/Vit C - Luca only
• Veggie powder that includes powdered kelp, wheatgrass, barley grass, carrot, garlic.

TREATS: small quantities, couple of times a week. 
frozen veggies, including sliced carrots, zuchinni, blueberries, strawberries, green beans. 

Plus the occasional taste of whatever we're eating! And always the last lick of the ice cream bowl.


----------



## jesusica

I weigh everything. 

Pancho is a 15 month old 70lb GSD, average activity level (daily walks and lots of fetch), no restrictions. 1 lb RMB in the morning and 10.6 oz MM, 1.8oz OM, and 3.6 oz RMB for dinner. 

Cheyenne is 4.5y/o 35 lb mix., below average activity level (she's a lazy bum that doesn't play with toys, only enjoys her walks), she can't handle carbs at all (big time allergies). 6oz RMB for breakfast and .6 oz OM, 1.2oz RMB, and 4.2oz MM for dinner.

RMB-chicken backs, chicken quarters, turkey necks, pork neck bones

MM-beef heart, sardines, ground meat (turkey and beef), canned mackeral, tilapia

OM-beef liver and kidney, chicken liver

Other-yogurt and omega3 supplement daily and oysters, eggs and pig feet with eggs being most frequent

I know I'm forgetting a lot. That list is really short compared to other lists I've made!


----------



## suebon

I feed 6 shelties (weights are from 22 - 27 lbs), and 1 growing GSD (15 months). All dogs are very active, and compete/train in agility and obedience.

RMB's are fed 4 - 5 mornings a week and consist of turkey necks. Shelties get 4 - 6 oz, and GSD gets 18 - 20 oz.

Meat meals are fed the remaining 9 - 10 meals a week and consist of ground meat (beef or turkey), sweet potato, beef heart, squash, eggs, ground veggies (romaine, celery, spinach). Shelties get 2 - 3 oz ground meat, 2 oz beef heart, 2 - 3 oz sweet potato, 1 TBS squash and veggies and eggs 3 times a week. The GSD gets 8-10 oz ground meat, 4 - 6 oz beef heart, 6 - 8 oz sweet potato,3 TBS veggies, 2 TBS squash, and an egg each day.
Extras - 1 - 2 times per week - beef liver, tripe, canned salmon, cooked tilapia or whiting filets, and I will occasionally add oysters, sardines or jack mackerel.
Supplements - daily - vit e (shelties vit e 100 iu, GSD 400 iu) oil (rotate between salmon oil, sardine oil, evening primrose or flax), and all get either Glyco Flex I or II (older ones get II).
Several times a week they get a green blend, a vitamin B complex, and antioxidant supplement and once a week they get a multi-vitamin/mineral.
I will feed kibble meals once or twice a week (rotate between proteins I don't normally feed, and will add canned food that is mostly meat).
I am sure I am forgetting something!


----------



## KJandBravo

Here's what I feed my 75 lb neutered male GSD, age estimated at 8, low activity level. Could probably stand to gain a couple pounds. Just started raw a couple weeks ago, so variety will increase gradually.

am: about 14 oz RMBs. Chicken backs are the staple, canned or whole frozen/thawed mackeral once a week or so.

pm: 8 oz of MM. Staples are ground beef and chicken hearts & lungs; he'll get chicken liver occasionally. 

Other stuff:
- eggs once or twice a week
- veggie mush with the pm MM a few times a week. With the veggie mush, I mix yogurt, apple cider vinegar and cod liver oil.
- our leftover cooked eggs and meat... just as a treat.
- pig ears and chicken breast jerky are his other treats.

I can pretty much eyeball weights based on what it says on the package, but I 'spot check' sometimes. I do that with my own food, too! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/01_smile.gif


----------



## DancingCavy

Ris is a 45-lb spayed mutt and is pretty active. She gets 1-1.5 lbs of food a day fed in one meal.

Though she is currently being treated for SIBO (and thus her normal routine has been altered) I'll post what 'normal' was for her before she got sick.

When I bring the meat home, I divide it up into one meal portions to make it easier to serve later. Most of her portions are eyeballed but I generally weigh muscle meat and pork neck before I freeze it.

RMBs:
Chicken quarters, pork neck, pork ribs, chicken breast (bone-in), chicken drumsticks, chicken thighs, chicken wings, turkey quarters, turkey wings, turkey drumsticks, Cornish game hens.

MM:
Beef heart, ground turkey, ground beef, chicken breast, cannned Jack Mackeral, Tilapia (we'll be trying this soon), turkey gizzards, chicken heart, chicken gizzards, ground bison.

OM:
Beef liver, chicken liver, beef kidney.

Supplements:
None.

Treats:
Hot dogs, string cheese, Natural Balance Lamb and Rice roll, meat baby food, Zuke's Salmon Treats, carrots, ice cubes, apple, banana.

Most meals I don't need to alter in any way. But if she is having chicken quarters or drumsticks, I have to smash the ankle joint with a rubber mallet first. If I don't, I usually see it again on my carpet the next day.


----------



## BritneyP

I am really looking forward to this thread! Thanks Lauri! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/18_thumb.gif

Hopefully within the next week or so, I'll be able to make my addition to it as well. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/05_biggrin.gif


----------



## Amaruq

Chimo is roughly 83 pounds (good weight) and eats about 2 pounds of food per day. He only gets chicken maybe once a week so his RMB are right now pork necks and ribs and turkey necks, legs, and wings. He gets Mackerel once a week or Sardines 2-3 times a week. MM is ground turkey, beef heart, occasionally chicken if it is cheap enough and venison (I get a massive amount of venny during hunting season and package it to be used the rest of the year). He gets eggs 1-3 times a week and yogurt about the same. 

The girls eat about 1.25 to 1.5 pounds a day range from 65-75 pounds and are active. They get the same as Chimo except they get chicken 2-4 times a week. Either backs or quarters or legs/thighs.

As my guys are getting older I am going to start adding mustard powder, ginger and raw garlic to their diet on a more regular basis. All three are anti-inflamatories. 

The Huskies are both about 50 pounds and are normal active (for any dog not for Huskies). They each eat about a pound a day same stuff as the Sheps just smaller portions. 

I also feed duck, rabbit and venison RMB throughout the year and anything else that we can find. Our day in and out staples are pork, turkey, venison and chicken.

Phoenix is currently on an alternate diet.


----------



## ksuri

This is a great thread! I'm a total newbie to this RAW biz...and it helps me get an idea of what to do in a 'real world' setting!

What is funny-is that I believe many of us are taking better care of our dogs' diets than we do our own!!!! Crazy!!


----------



## candibrite

I feed raw to my GSD Marley (15 months 75lbs intact male medium-high activity level) and my Cavalier Paris (2 1/2yrs 13lbs spayed female low-medium activity level) I don't weigh each individual thing, but thier meals as a whole. Both my dogs have ate raw since they same home (Marley 8 weeks, Paris 10 weeks) 

Marley
eats just over 1 lbs per meal, as long as its in the 18-20 ounces area its fine, his natural build is long and narrow and he doesn't over eat, so its easy to keep him at his weight. Never more then 2 1/2lbs a day, eats AM & PM
RMBs - chicken leg quarters or whole chickens cut into pieces, duck cut into pieces and occasionally pheasant. gets a beef knuckle type bone at least once a week to chew on
MM - buffalo, deer, beef and pork (various cuts.. the first two I get free from relatives who hunt, so its what was left over from the year before or things they wont use) fish; canned salmon, mackeral and sardines and raw Alaskan pollok, trout, walleye and occasionally salmon (again the last three I get from my dad when he goes fishing and gets more then he needs)
OM - liver, and whatever comes attached to the birds he gets
Misc - pumpkin and rice added if upset tummy, canned food (use about 1 can per week ) just to add a little extra (I only use Natural Balance, Merrick and Natures Variety)
Supplements - Salmon oil & fish oil w/ omega 3, organic keifer a few times a week
Limitations - we tried goose and he said NO WAY, other then that hes ate everything we've tried.. where I'm at I can't get alot of the cool things that some people can like heart meat and decently priced lamb ect.. but I have found people are envious of my access to buffalo, deer and pheasant /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/06_cool.gif

Paris (just to give an idea to those people with small dogs) eats once a day in PM, never more then 4 ounces or she gets fat 
RMBs - chicken necks, pork neck bones, cornish game hen, duck (small chunks cut from Marleys), beef ribs 
MM - buffalo, deer, beef, pork, chicken hearts (if shes lucky!)
OM - liver.. and whatevers attached to her birds
Misc - tiny half spoon of canned if Marley is getting it. I will occasionally (ie once every 4-5 months) buy a bag of the Natures Variety Lamb or Rabbit and give it to her for some meals, since this actually has ground bone in it I feed it as a meal
Supplements - Salmon oil & fish oil w/ omega 3s, organic keifer a few times a week
Limitations - WILL NOT eat fish of any kind. or pheasant. Haven't found anything that gives her upset tummy tho.
If Paris gets a pork neck bone or a larger chicken neck the next/or previous meal is all meat to make up for the extra boney meal

I saw I forgot treats! Both get bully sticks, Paris always has one in her kennel, Marley gets one a week he will eat it all up. "crunchy treats" any of the quality kibble made treats: Wellness, Solid Gold, Natural Balance. Also any other crunchy treats I find that have good ingredients. Dehydrated chicken and duck breast strips (chicken for Marley, duck for Paris) Marley gets one and Paris 1/2 at bedtime. Dehydrated salmon treats are Marleys bait for show stacking. I use jerky treats (Solid Gold, Wellness and Real Meat Treats) for "gooood dog treats" (getting nails clipped, brushing hair and other "horrible" things) and of course peanut butter.. I buy a big jar of the cheapest stuff I can find for Kongs a few times a week.


----------



## Amaruq

I forgot my guys all get organ meat 2-4 times a week which consists of chicken liver, beef liver & kidney and venison liver.


----------



## lhczth

All of my dogs eat the same things. I just adjust amounts depending on their weight. All are active in the winter and VERY active in the spring/summer/fall. I don't weigh foods. Just give a bit more to a dog that needs it and less (Vala thinks I am starving her right now) to a dog that is getting chunky.
Vala, 2.5 years, GSD, 68# training in SchH. VERY easy dog to keep weight on. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/10_eek.gif
Brazen, 19 months, GSD, 59#, training in SchH
Nike, almost 7 years, GSD, 68#, spayed, retired though she trains helpers.
Alexis, almost 4, GSD, 79#, spayed, active pet.

I feed chicken backs, leg quarters, split fryers or whole chickens when on sale. Whole turkeys, necks, thighs, wings, backs. Pork riblets (these can be boney or very meaty depending on the part being sold), neck. Veal neck and knuckle bones. Very rarely lamb (too expensive), venison, duck and rabbit. MM consists of beef or pork, beef heart or lamb's heart. Offal is almost always beef liver. My guys don't care for poultry offal unless partially frozen though will usually eat the hearts. Also either free ranging farm eggs or I spend the money on the eggland's best. Canned sardines or mackerel when I can get them and canned oysters at times. They all also feast on field mice and other things they can catch in the summer when I mow the fields. And they do share veggies with me a few times per week and maybe some other table scraps. Veggies will be cooked. Vala also loves fruit. I feed MM and offal in separate meals instead of having RMB, MM and offal, supplements, etc all fed in every meal. 

Wednesday morning they all had chicken backs (little meat, soft bone, some offal, fat).

Dinner was 4 eggs, 6000 mg of salmon oils, vit-E, 1/2 can each oysters (a bit more going to Brazen and Vala), and approximately 1/2 # of ground beef (less to Vala).

Thursday breakfast and dinner will be pork riblets (described above). 

Tomorrow maybe turkey and another MM/offal meal. 

I have fed this way for 8 years and raised two litter and several other pups. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/01_smile.gif


----------



## lhczth

Oops, forgot that I also feed tripe on occasion.


----------



## mcavan

I have been feeding raw for going on 6 years now and for a variety of reasons feed my crew mainly ground meat/bone. In our area (MI) I have 3 main sources of a HUGE variety of meat/bones mixed (with or without) veggies, tripe, offals.
Typical meals are ground turkey necks, ground chicken frames, ground lamb/bones, ground beef/bones, ground duck/bones, ground pork/bones and some of these have offal mixed in and some do not. Also for muscle meat meals ground heart of both beef and lamb are available. Check out for Bravo distributors near where you live. I also have 
a monthly delivery right to my door by Taylor Pond Farms and we have a group of us that coordinate a delivery about every month too from Natural Concepts in OH. These sources
all also have a wide sections of RMB, dog treats and more!
I try and vary the selection and so far all the dogs are thriving..Like Lisa ours get some leftover, some veggies, some fruit..we also use B-Naturals Immume Blend daily and salmon oil daily.

Unfortunately our oldest GSD's now has some health issues making home cooking a better option for her though until this developed she excelled on a raw diet. She ate about 
1# and a little more a day and is a very easy keeper.

Navarre is 2.5 years old, VERY active, about 85 pounds and 
was eating just over 2# a day but with agility season and 
SchH season getting into full swing I wanted to get him a little leaner so he is getting just under 2# a day now and is fine with that...

We also have a little mixed breed that can put on weight looking at food and she gets 2-3 oz. twice a day...


----------



## ozzymama

I do kibble and one RAW meal a day. Ozzy is about 100lbs and Sandi is 45lbs, she has not gained or lost weight for the last three or four years. Actually she has been around 45lbs within one or two her whole adult life, but the vet was amazed that for three years her weight has been exact lb and oz consistent.
My dogs get three cups of kibble in their bowl each day and most days they finish it.
Three days a week they get RMB, this can be beef bones, chicken bones etc.
Once a week they get fish, usually salmon or shrimp because it is cheap where I live.
Once a week we do organ meat, this is heart, once a month is liver, tongue, gizzard (I know it's not really an organ but it's gross so it gets lumped in there!)
Other than that it's round steaks, round roasts, Ozzy gets about a lb and Sandi half a lb. I'm a farm girl and I take a cleaver to the chickens and other fowl, just hack apart old fryer hens. Ground turkey and beef. Basically when we get a cattlebeast we give them anything we wouldn't eat, for instance a round roast, too tough, round steaks too tough, ground beef, too gross LOL, stewing beef, too cheap a cut of meat and so on.
On the weekend they gets a couple eggs while we have our breakfast. Sometimes a pancake if I'm making pancakes.
Ozzy loves raw veggies and will eat carrots, broccoli, usually whatever I am preparing, (dh and I eat 30% of our meals protein and starches, the remaining 70% is vegetables) Ozzy will eat. Including brussel sprouts!
They always get to lick our plates.
I supplement most meals with shark cartilage, yucca root and beta carotene. The dogs drink distilled water the same as we do, the tap water in this city is truly disgusting, besides it's so hard, every tap in our house with the exception of the outside ones is connected to the softener.
Where I have to give a pill or such I feed them canned Holistic Blend (brand name) their favorite is the vegan one with fruit and veggies. For treats they get seameal biscuits, although I did pick up some caribou bisquits recently from another canadian manufacturer. (Wheat Free! Thank Goodness!)
I don't feed pork, because I will not eat it. To me it is a dirty meat. Generally I don't even like it in my house, but dh does eat it and does enjoy it. That is the only instance the dogs are not permitted to lick the plate. But lots of others feed pork with great success.


----------



## JakeN

WOW this is a great thread. 

Here is mine. Anika 11 month old female GSD (she will be 1 year old next month woo hoo!! ). She weigh about 55 LBS right now will be 75lbs at the ideal weight. I feed her 2 lbs a day. 1 lb in the morning and 1 lb at night. Her activity level is normal to active. Each meal is consist of 10oz RMB 5oz MM 1oz OM Plus supplements

RMB: Chicken leg quarters, back, necks, and wings (but rarely because they are pricey). Duck wings and duck heads. Rabbits.

MM: Beef Heart, Chicken Heart, Chicken Breast, Pig hearts, pork shoulders.

OM: Beef liver, chicken liver, chicken gizzard, duck gizzard, pork liver.

Supplements: Vitamin C 400iu per day, Salmon Oil 3 pumps a day, Daily Multi-Vitamin as a treat. Eggs 3-4 a week. K-9 Glucosamine 2 teaspoon each meal. Green tripe on occasion.

Please advice if anybody think there is something I can improve. I go to the market about once a month to buy everything. I put each of her meal in a sandwhich bag and freeze it and feed it to her frozen. I weigh each bag exactly 10oz RMB 5oz MM 1oz OM with my digital kitchen scale. I hope this help somebody /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcornSmiley.gif


----------



## JanH

Am new to this but...mainly feeding a young fox terrier but also giving some to a young GSD and a couple days a week border collies. Costs keeps it at just the FT for now. I've been able to keep it under 70 cents shopping around but have limited freezer space. Can usually find meats 59cents to 79 cents a pound by looking mid week at the marked down meats section. From that - 
typically chicken leg quarters; beef stew meat, ground beef/turkey; the other day there was some beef rib (although I think DH might hijack that!); salmon; mackrel (he didn't like that); sardines; chicken livers; gizzards. Finding a lot of tips of stuff to add on here. Sometimes rice or oatmeal (small amounts). 
Still rely on kibble for the others and part timers. When we can get on some land to raise it they'll all be switched and will get beef, pork, poultry, rabbit, lamb, venison etc.


----------



## Bdsalt

Since this recall I have been struggling with food options for my 3 GSD's. I have a 6 year old female who has a big problem with eating raw, and my other two, 4 year old male has a big problem with gaining weight as does my other 5 year old female.

I desided to try dehydrated raw, so I looked into Honest Kitchen. My dogs love it, and their stools are firm. The package says to feed 2 1/2 cups a day. Now comes the other problem, The calories percup is 640!!!! I was feeding 2 cups of kibble before this (Nutro Lamb and RICE ) and my male still was NOT losing weight. No he is not hypothyroid,
but lots of snow here over the winter so hard for them to get the proper exercize.I am still feeding a good kibble also, So Fritz needs to ger approx 1100 calories a day and the girls get 944, just to maintain their weight.That would only amount to 1 cup of kibble at 463 calories and 12 cuo dehydrated at 320, and 1/2 cup meat at 172 calories.Which totals 955. I cannot feed Hilke poultry as two cannot tolerate it. So beef or venison, lamb,a small amount of turkey (not raw).

This seemd like it is not enough for them somehow ??? Anyone else figured out the caleries ??


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

Are the calories listed per a cup of REhydrated or DEhydrated food? Big difference in volume there.


----------



## GSD_NY

Hello All, 

I apologize if this has been asked already, but I'm new to this. 

We have a 8-9 week old GSD who is currently eating Solid Gold WolfPup kibble, but I am wondering if we should just feed her what we eat and get her off "dog food". My wife is actually the one who raised the question. Are there certain foods to start with to help with the weening process? How can we introduce apples and carrots, do dogs really eat that? I thought canines were 99.9% carnivorous. I can understand cheese or eggs, but if she can/will eat fruits and veggies in addition to all that I am reading on this thread, sounds good to me.









Thanks for the help/advice! 

GSD_NY


----------



## tracyc

Hi. 

All good questions. Let me tackle them separately. 

Exploring the idea of a homemade diet for your pup is fine. It can be a healthful way to feed. (but so can good kibble--one isn't necessarily better than the other.) There are lots of resources on line. The one we often send people to is http://www.rawdogranch.com which is the personal website of one of the moderators of this forum, Lauri. It's a good step-by-step how to for those already commited to feeding a raw diet. 

But a home-prepared canine diet is MUCH different than just "feeding her what we eat." Dogs arent' people, of course, so their nutritional needs are very different. While a vegetable-based diet can actually be very healthy for people, it's not what dogs need. Your instinct about the diet being mostly meat is closer to the right thinking. But think whole raw carcasses of meat AND bone, rather than just meat. 

Fruits and vegetables can be added to a canine diet, but not raw. Dogs don't have the digestive enzymes to break down cellulose, so you either need to cook, puree, or freeze vegetables to make them digestible to dogs. Of course, if you're just giving the dog a bite of raw carrot or apple as a treat, that's cool. But don't count that as part of his overall nutrition. It'll just pass through largely unused. 

Hope this helps. You can tell from my moderator tag that I personally am a fan of raw diets for dogs. But it does take a bit of doing, at least at first, to understand what constitutes a healthy, balanced, species-appropriate diet for dogs. But there's no reason that a pup as young as yours can start eating his first raw foods immediately. 

Good luck. Keep those questions coming.


----------



## AniasGSDs

My 2 GSDs have been on 100% RAW diet for almost 2 years and they love it.

I usually buy in bulk and just picked up my RAW order on Friday. I usually get enough for 2 months. I have an extra freezer just for dog food.

My average ratio for feeding is:

60% RMB
25% MM
5% OM
10% Green Tripe

They also get eggs (1-2 a week), pureed vegetables when I have some that are not as fresh anymore, oil supplements (mostly in winter), and whatever else I have around. 

When I first started out, I weighed everything, but now that I’m more comfortable with it, I don’t have to.

Gretchen is 3 y/o female, high energy weighs about 70-73lbs. 
Rorie is 2.5 y/o male, medium energy, weighs about 75-78lbs. 

Both dogs do obedience training, Schutzhund, daily runs in the park, and weekend hikes in the woods.

Both get about a 1.25 - 1.5 lbs of food a day (see above percentages). This changes depending on their activity level – more in the summer, less in the winter. I watch their weight and if they are gaining or loosing, I adjust the amounts. 

This is what I picked up on Friday (this also changes from month to month to provide variety):

RMB – Chicken ¼ (80#), Tilapia (40#), pork neck bones (30#), turkey drums (40#)
MM – Beef Hearts (60#)
OM – Sliced Beer liver (10#)

<u>That’s 260# of food and I paid $200.00</u>

Green Tripe – I buy it canned by the case because I can’t stand the smell! It costs a little more, but its worth it to me!


----------



## cherokee2001

Hi, I am interested in learning about raw feeding - can someone please explain the abbreviations MM, RMB & OM - that way I can understand the menus you have listed in this thread. I have a 6-year-old GSD who has severe skin problems that have always been associated with food allergies. We've tried everything else so I'm very close to giving up & "going raw." Cherokee is between 75-80 lbs - approximately how many pounds of meat per day will I be feeding him? Thanks!! Chaya


----------



## tracyc

MM = Muscle Meat
RMB = Raw Meaty Bones
OM = Organ Meat

Cherokee would eat approximately 1.5 pounds of raw food per day. 

Please check out the BARF Resources thread for lots of links for information about raw feeding. A good starting point is http://www.rawdogranch.com the personal website of one of this forum's moderators.


----------



## surfcaster

i to am going to try feeding raw, and this thread gave me alot of ideas on what to buy,, my noah has had porterhouse, cornish hens, chicken legs and thighs, he loves vegetables,,but i really would like to start weighing and freezing, and buying only raw for him,,Thankyou so much,,i do need help on how much to feed at a time and how many times a day,,Noah is seven months,average energy, about eighty pounds or more,,,can any one tell me what to feed and how much?


----------



## tracyc

A standard size male GSD would eat about 2 pounds of raw food a day. 

I feed twice a day...so one pound for each meal. 

That amount is just to get you in the ballpark. Your dog might need a little more or a little less depending on how much exercise he gets and his individual metabolism. If he starts to look fat, cut back the meal size by a few ounces. If he looks too thin, add a few ounces. 

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7786&page=1&fpart=2

check out that thread in the raw section---it includes lots of links for more info about raw feeding.


----------



## surfcaster

thankyou very much, i appreciate your advice


----------



## k9ma

Feeding raw to varying degrees for the last 7 years, and the menu has been revamped many times. Here's the latest version...

Simon, 9yr old altered male 
fluctuates bet 94 & 98 lbs
activity level: +/- 45 min of exercise twice a day - lounges the rest of the time, more active on weekends
fasts 1-4x a month

1 meal a day @ ~1.5lbs

ground pork or beef
small side of liver or kidney w/ heart (chicken or beef)
1/2 can tripe 
chicken frame

OR

1 can tripe* 
RMBs
usually chicken quarters, drumsticks, or a turkey leg

less often he'll get:
lamb breast, beef or pork ribs, whole dressed rabbit, cornish hen, duck/chicken/pig feet, beef tendons, pork shoulder...

* The tripe is occasionally replaced with canned mackeral or sardines, or a can of some exotic meat based dog food

1 or 2 raw eggs 2-3 times a week, yogurt when I have it & supplements daily

Supplements:
Arthrimaxx
Vit C & E
B complex (when I feel I'm not giving enough OM)
ACV
Bert's Green Blend
Salmon Oil
Prozyme

Treats:
PB stuffed apples
Bully Sticks or C.E.T chews (after the occassional boneless meal)


----------



## k9ma

Thought I'd add what I feed the kitties. They alternate between RMB and mm/om days. Also one meal a day.

RMB
1 quail or
1/4 cornish game hen or 
1 chicken drumstick or
rabbit

OM/MM
ground beef or pork + liver & heart (chicken or beef)
tbsp canned tripe

every 10 days or so they'll get a canned mackeral or sardine meal instead of the om/mm

1 egg 2-3 days a week

Supplements:
Salmon oil 2-3x a week
WellTabs (Wellness brand Multivitamin) once in a while


----------



## natalie559

Dog food is formulated based on specific needs that were researched over time and I wanted that research to apply to my homemade diet as well.

So to create my dogs menu's I use the National Research Council’s guidelines for the ‘Nutrient Requirements of Dogs’. Their past recommendations from 1985 are available for free online. After much new research, time and testing they published updated 2006 guidelines which are the ones I now use. The new guidelines are not yet available for free, but Monica Segal had special permission to publish them in her latest book, Optimal Nutrition.

Now you have the info that tells you what your dogs need and you need to find the nutrients in the foods you feed. The foods I feed are based on individual tolerance/taste, availability and cost. I have chosen to feed and balance the dog’s diets with turkey necks, chicken quarters, beef heart, ground beef, ground turkey, beef liver, white potatoes, eggs, canned salmon, canned mackerel and supplements.

All the nutrient profiles of these ingredients (excluding bones) are available online for free on the USDA database, http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/ I search for nutrients per ounce.

The analysis for the ingredients that include bone can be found in either/both of Monica Segal’s books. The book K 9 Kitchen had the turkey neck analysis and Optimal Nutrition has the chicken quarter analysis. She includes lab analysis of other raw meaty bones also.

Now you need to create a spreadsheet. I list the vitamins, minerals, etc on the left going down and the foods I feed across the top. I list out the nutrients per ounce and leave a box where the number of ounces that are fed can be changed and automatically calculated. Once I see the comparison of what the dog needs (calculated based on weight) vs. what the foods are providing I can then tweak the amount of each ingredient and supplement when necessary.

The supplements I have found that I needed are manganese, magnesium, zinc, cod liver oil, kelp, vitamin e and fish oil. The supplements are dependent on diet, i.e. Sasha cannot handle much ground beef so she needs a zinc supplement, Penny doesn’t get as many potatoes so she needs a magnesium supplement.

The mineral ratios I goal for are calcium/phosphorus 1.3:1, zinc/iron 2:1 and zinc/copper 10:1.

That’s it. The hardest part is creating the spreadsheet and entering in the information. I weirdly love Excel so this was the program I used.


----------



## Timber1

Your are right on, for those that feed BARF diets, the dog is probably better off then most of us. In most cases I find the same thing regarding health care.

For those of us that are just thinking about the BARF diet check out Leerburg Kennels on the web. There is a recommended 7 day diet that might be helpful.


----------



## RomydeVenecia

I have a 2 month old GSD and he eats approx. 9 oz of "Common Sense" B.A.R.F.", twice a day. When I read the amount you are feeding your 70 - 100 lb GSDs, I have to wonder if I am feeding the puppy too much or maybe I am not reading your posts correctly.

It seems like my 2 month old is eating almost as much as some of your dogs and in some instnaces more than your fully grown dogs. We have had him for two weeks and his weight has not gone up drastically, physically he appears to be in good shape.

BTW - The amount we are feeding him is based on our breeders recommendation.

Any comments?


----------



## tracyc

In general, raw-fed puppies DO eat as much or more than a full-grown dog. Amazing but true! 

There are several different ways of calculating the amount to feed, but the easiest one is simply to feed the dog 2-3% of the ideal expected adult weight in food per day--regardless of the dog's age. 

Puppies have a very high metabolism, and they need lots of calories every day to grow as quickly as they do. As they grow, their needs decrease proportionally. So by feeding the same amount as the dog grows, you're also slightly decreasing the amount fed each day as a percentage of the growing dog's weight. 

Fer instance: 

20 pound pup - 2 pounds of food (that's 10% of the pup's weight)

40 pound pup - 2 pounds of food (that's 5% of the pup's weight) 

100 pound dog - 2 pounds of food (now it's only 2% of the dog's weight) 


Food stays the same, dog gets bigger. 

My dog Luca actually eats less now as a nearly 100-pound adult than he did as a puppy. As a pup he was eating 17 ounce meals twice a day. He's now getting 13 ounce meals.


----------



## Timber1

I am a newbie to BARF, but have a few questions and I suspect will have many more. Here goes.

What do you think of a mixed diet, part high end dry food with yogurt and some mixed meat, and then a total BARF diet for his evening meal.

My dog does not like veggies and fruit, for example if I mix them with raw meat, he removes the meat and eats it. The fruit and veggies are left untouched.

Until I started him on a partial BARF diet it was one meal a day. If I switch to 100 percent BARF is one meal a day sufficient. If it helps, I have a male GSD that weights 88 pounds and his weight has been very consistent.


----------



## Amaruq

My guys eat 100% raw and only eat one meal a day. Many people do well with feeding a high end kibble and raw.


----------



## The Stig

Hi Timber,

I have an 11-week old Alsatian, and she is fed TWO's a few meals each week. Her primary diet is all natural (BARF) and is doing very well with this mix. Same with my cat.

It's said not to mix raw with the dry, unless transitioning the pup although some dogs do better with a complete switch. I sometimes flash-boil mince meat (so it's a wee cooked) to add to her kibble, along with 1/2 cup of the 'broth' and I have not experienced any problem. She loves it for her breakfast, it is like warm porridge on a chilly morning. ) I see it like, if I can eat sushi w/o any problem, my pup will probably do fine as well.

The reason I still feed kibble occasionally is, if we are out of town, she could switch to dry without too much ill-effects for a few days if the baby-sitter is uncomfortable with handling raw, or if we are holed up in a hotel. 

Good luck!


----------



## Calipso

So what would be a good starting diet for a 10week gsd puppy? She's 18 lbs right now. I would think bones would be out of the question since she only has baby teeth.

Currently, I'm feeding her a mix of kibbles and canned. I've found she quickly tires of her food and that I have to keep rotating brands to keep her interested in her food.


----------



## tracyc

A 10-week old GSD pup would have no problems at all with raw chicken bones, fish bones, some turkey bones, rabbit bones...only the hardest of beef or pork bones would perhaps be too much. Those little 'gator teeth can do more than you think! 

The first place to start for any new raw feeder is at http://www.rawdogranch.com it has all the info you need if you're interested in pursuing a home-made raw diet for your pup. The basics of the diet are identical for puppies or adult dogs.


----------



## Jazzyj1

Solomon is a 2.5 yr old unneutered GSD average activity level and about 90 to 100 lbs (thanks luca for the break down of acronyms) 

I feed him 4 to 5 chicken thighs 4 times a week in the evening about 6pm which I cook for about 3 minutes on each side salt and pepper to taste. I cut off the bone to separate from the meat but it's all in one bowl. He gets great pleasure watching me cook for him and for some reason he always eat the bones first.

4 cans (about 5 in a can) of sardines in natural oil 2 to 3 times a week

occasional meatballs and spaghetti or some pasta and meat dish Italian of course

natures variety raw food frozen food diet about once a week just in case I have missed some think. 

Reading all the replies I have learned so much and found out that Solomon is missing much to but any help is greatly, I mean greatly appreciated in reference to his diet, thanks guys


----------



## tracyc

There's no reason to cook the chicken thighs. But if you prefer to do this, please don't cook them with the bones in. Cooked bones are dangerous to feed. The bones must be raw. 

Do not salt and pepper the dog's food. He doesn't need the flavor, or the sodium. 

The sardines are great. 

Spaghetti and meatballs aren't going to hurt him any in small amounts, but this shouldn't be a major part of his diet. The sauces in these Italian dishes probably contain onions and spices that aren't the best idea for dogs. 

Check out http://www.rawdogranch.com again, and look at the recommendations there for the appropriate ratio of Raw Meaty Bones, Muscle Meat and Organ Meat. It doesn't look like your diet contains any organ meat at all, and the only muscle meat listed here are the Italian Meatballs. 

Homemade raw diets are great--I'm a big believer in them. But you need to have a good understanding of what makes an appropriate, balanced canine diet. Dogs aren't people. So don't make the mistake of thinking that foods or flavors that are good for you are necessarily good for him.


----------



## Jazzyj1

Thanks Tracy, I well check out that website to better balance Solomons diet, The chix thighs I cook for a very short time, I tried to give it to him raw but turned his nose up at it, I feed him once a day and some days he doesn't want to eat, He would rather run outside until he falls out and even then when he comes inside he won't eat. I will leave it out for about 30 minutes then back into the frig. He has always been very stubborn when it comes to his feeding. There were times where he didn't eat for about 2.5 days before I gave in. When he was a young pup I started him with science diet for about 8 months, then royal canine for shepherds 2 months, eucanuba 1 month. I mean this guy will wait you out. So I started with chix thighs, like yesterday he ate the bones and left the meat it just baffles me...oh by the way I do give him marrow bones before I go to work in the morning and he loves it, He will gnaw on it for hours at a time. I am seriously considering taking him bike riding (I need it more than him) with me to build his appetite, please advise


----------



## JohnnyB

Where are you guys finding lamb meat at a reasonable price???


----------



## tracyc

I don't find it at a reasonable price.







It's a luxury food that I sometimes splurge on for the dogs. Even so, if you can find a lamb farmer (check local farmer's markets) and see what he can save for you. There are lots of parts of a lamb that don't make it to the grocery store---lamb necks, shanks, hearts, tongues--those are the parts that will be reasonable. 

http://www.hare-today.com/

This is a web-based raw food supplier that I have purchased from many times. They sell the kinds of stuff I can't find locally--ground rabbit, mutton and goat are the things I've bought from this place. It's kind of expensive--and you have to pay for shipping. So buying a whole case of something will end up being cheaper. 

I sort of justify buying these items for the dogs (as well as the more expensive things I buy locally) because when I average it with the super-cheap chicken quarters that make up half the diet, I'm still feeding them for what I consider a reasonable price. I try to average $1 per pound of food. Prices on everything except chicken quarters have gone up in the last year or so...but I'm still able to stick close to my budget by shopping for things on sale and stocking up when I find bargains.


----------



## Brightelf

After a month plus on raw. here's the general, flexible menu plan for Grimm. Grimm is 20 months old, medium energy, 84 lbs and slow to mature lines, so a growing/developing youngster still. He eats about 4 lbs of food per day. His RMB ratio is a lot lower than I expected, at about 30%.

In his bowl twice a day:
(2) 1000mg salmon oil capsules
(1) Vitamin E natural capsule, 200 IU
(1 tsp) brewer's yeast
(1 tablespoon) plain yogurt
(1 tiny piece, size of almond) turkey liver
(1 chunk, size of Oreo cookie) fresh frozen green tripe

In his bowl once a day:
(1 tsp) olive oil(5 days/week) or organic coconut oil (2 days/week)

Once - twice per week:
An egg, whole in shell

2 - 3 times per week:
1/4 teaspoon dried kelp flakes

3 - 4 times per week:
A handful of frozen blueberries, a small cookie-sized chunk of frozen spinach, a 1" hunk of fresh banana.... sometimes a tiny bit of nectarine, apple, whatever i am having, mashed up. (blender on the fritz) Some very finely grated/mashed fresh carrot, about a tablespoon.

Mealtimes:
I toss in a chicken thing (could be a drumstick, a chicken back, or a couple wings)... OR a 2-3" long hunk of turkey neck. Grimm does best on not much bone. (constipation concern) The weight of the RMB ends up being about 100 gramm - 250 gramms.

I then throw in the remainder of the weight-- until the scale reads about 800 gramms-- of whatever MM I have on hand that day. It can be: turkey hearts, turkey stomach, beef meat I slice from off-cuts. (I also save the fat on the off-cuts to add to meals when the MM is turkey hearts or stomachs.. cos they low fat)

A few finger-sized fresh frozen Baltic Herring or Capelin get tossed atop.

Note: Sometimes, Grimm will rarely get a meal of almost all Baltic Herring. Or, the Baltic Herring will comprise 1/3 of his meal, the rest being a tiny RMB chunk, and whatever MM there is that day.

I'm still so new. How's it look?


----------



## mhawker

Since it's been mentioned in this thread, anyone know when the rawdogranch site will be back up. It's a shame it's been down so long as it was a great resource.


----------



## JohnnyB

7 month old GSD

He gets the following on a regular basis. Sometimes, he gets something extra like bear meat or other when we get freebies!

chicken quarters
turkery necks
pork neck bones
turkey
venison
beef heart
pork heart
chicken heart
venison heart
ground beef w/ground organ & fat
beef liver
chicken liver
venison liver
venison lung
chicken gizzard
eggs (w/shell)
cottage cheese
yogurt (plain)
and now some fruits & vegies


----------



## Annemarie

So as a newbie to this, let me know how I'm doing.

Thorai, 86lbs - couch potato! I had started feeding him 12oz twice a day but have cut back to 8oz twice a day. He was up to 93lbs!

AM - 8oz RMB (whole chicken or turkey, chicken leg quarters, pork ribs)

PM - 6oz MM (ground beef or turkey, venison, fish fillets, beef heart, pork roast), 2oz Organ Meat.


Chara, 84lbs - duracell bunny! She gets 1lb twice a day.

AM - 16oz RMB

PM - 13oz MM and 3oz Organ Meat.

They also get eggs two or three times a week. They get fruit or veggie mush almost daily.


----------



## JerzeyGSD

The rawdogranch link isn't working.










This thread is really great! I want to attempt to integrate raw style feeding into my dogs daily meals. Perhaps as a small lunch between her breakfast and dinner meals of kibble? I'm a college student and cannot afford, at the moment, to go completely raw but I would love to know if integrating pieces of the raw system into my dogs weekly meals would be worthwhile? (Or would an all or nothing approach later in life be better?) If I do begin to integrat parts of this into my dogs diet, what would be the most bang for my buck? 

Oh, my pup is a 7 month old spayed female around 60 lbs.


----------



## JerzeyGSD

Another question, when you all say that you feed raw chicken (such a legs, wings, etc) do you just, like, buy a package of chicken legs an just throw one into their bowl? Can they just eat it like that? Well, I'm assuming so but I just want to know if you just buy any brand from the store or if you go to a butcher or what... I'm extremely curious and interested!


----------



## DianaM

Yup! When I go to WalMart to grab the big bags of chicken quarters, I buy a couple, stuff them in the freezer, then thaw them out when I need them, bag three or four in ziplocs, freeze what I won't use immediately, then one quarter goes in the bowl at each meal if that's my main RMB (raw meaty bone). Skin, meat, fat, bone and all.







I still feed them if they smell a little "interesting;" our dogs eat poop and roadkill after all, so a little "seasoning" won't hurt them if they're otherwise healthy. Sometimes I do feed them completely frozen- it occupies him longer.

I have bought food from Publix, Wal Mart, Sweetbay, any place that sells stuff for us is where I get his goodies. There is nothing he eats that we cannot eat, aside from bone. He's even had catfish heads, and you haven't heard anything until you've heard a dog crunch up a catfish head.


----------



## JerzeyGSD

Wow, great. Thanks!


----------



## Little Red

This thread has been very helpful as I have had many questions concerning the raw diet. I started supplementing their kibble with raw meats with the intention of switching over to BARF almost completely. Here are the questions that I still have:

1. Is there anything wrong with feeding just once a day? Due to the disinfecting clean up operations associated with the raw meats, of course it would be easier on me just to have to do that once a day.

2. Clarification on a cooking term: "puree"....(as in carrots, apples) does that mean you can leave those foods raw if you pulverize it in a vita-mix?
(I add in some water and yougurt to order to facilitate the process)

3. I have been feeding each of my dogs an egg a day (raw), it this too much for them? 

4. the controversy about whether raw meats are likely to have E coli or salmonella, is this a concern? I would rather not have to cook the meats.

5. Why is it that when I give my dogs the eggshell along with their meal that that is the only thing they leave behind, but let them find an eggshell in the trash or in the compost and they slurp up every speck of it? (LOL)

Thank you everyone for the great guidance, questions and answers in this thread!!!!


----------



## Little Red

The canned sardines and canned mackeral has bones,(cooked?) I am assuming that those bones are safe for the dogs to eat?


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

> Quote:
> 1. Is there anything wrong with feeding just once a day? Due to the disinfecting clean up operations associated with the raw meats, of course it would be easier on me just to have to do that once a day.


I prefer to split up my dogs food over the course of the day to lessen the chances of bloat AND to keep them from having the 'Empty Stomach Bile' urps.



> Quote:2. Clarification on a cooking term: "puree"....(as in carrots, apples) does that mean you can leave those foods raw if you pulverize it in a vita-mix?
> (I add in some water and yougurt to order to facilitate the process)


Puree is NOT cooking. It IS mushing up the items into a liquid or semi-liquid form. The idea is to break down the cell walls so the dogs will benefit from whatever you are giving them.

Ever give your dog a whole carrot? If you do you will, most likely, find big chunks of carrot in their stools. It didn't get digested and, as such, didn't contribute anything to the dog other than just bulk.



> Quote:3. I have been feeding each of my dogs an egg a day (raw), it this too much for them?


As long as they are WHOLE eggs it shouldn't be too much.



> Quote:4. the controversy about whether raw meats are likely to have E coli or salmonella, is this a concern? I would rather not have to cook the meats.


In the 10+ years I have been feeding raw I've handled and fed over 10 THOUSAND pounds of raw meat. Never once got sick. And I am not always very careful about it, either. I do some basic clean up with hot water and a towel.



> Quote:
> 5. Why is it that when I give my dogs the eggshell along with their meal that that is the only thing they leave behind, but let them find an eggshell in the trash or in the compost and they slurp up every speck of it? (LOL)


It's the lure of the forbidden!!


----------



## angelaw

fish bones are fine, some members feed fresh fish fillets


----------



## Little Red

Oh thanks for the answers! That really helps so much. Since I am new to the raw diet I just wanted to make sure. I have already noticed a big difference in their coats, vitality, teeth, and it has just been a little over a month since they have been eating some raw.


----------



## Little Red

> Quote:4. the controversy about whether raw meats are likely to have E coli or salmonella, is this a concern? I would rather not have to cook the meats.
> 
> In the 10+ years I have been feeding raw I've handled and fed over 10 THOUSAND pounds of raw meat. Never once got sick. And I am not always very careful about it, either. I do some basic clean up with hot water and a towel.


That is good to know. I wasn't that worried about myself becoming sick, But what I meant to ask is the health concern of Ecoli and salmonella for the animals. A friend showed me a book that raises some concern over animals becoming sick or dying from tainted meats. I rinse off the meats before serving, is this enough?
Thank you so much for your quick and enlightening answers. It is all valuable advice that I plan to use.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

> Originally Posted By: little redThat is good to know. I wasn't that worried about myself becoming sick, But what I meant to ask is the health concern of Ecoli and salmonella for the animals. A friend showed me a book that raises some concern over animals becoming sick or dying from tainted meats. I rinse off the meats before serving, is this enough?
> Thank you so much for your quick and enlightening answers. It is all valuable advice that I plan to use.


Back when we raised chickens we would lose a few to the local hawks. About a month after we got rid of all the chickens I found the dogs eating the remains of one. A hawk had caught it, killed it, ate what it want and left the carcass somewhere in our field. The dog found that carcass - which was at least 20 days old - and finished it off.

No problems.

Also, think about all the dogs that eat poop and survive!


----------



## matildacroley

I love menus, they give me new ideas sometimes.


----------



## Little Red

> Originally Posted By: Lauri & The Gang
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted By: little redThat is good to know. I wasn't that worried about myself becoming sick, But what I meant to ask is the health concern of Ecoli and salmonella for the animals. A friend showed me a book that raises some concern over animals becoming sick or dying from tainted meats. I rinse off the meats before serving, is this enough?
> Thank you so much for your quick and enlightening answers. It is all valuable advice that I plan to use.
> 
> 
> 
> Back when we raised chickens we would lose a few to the local hawks. About a month after we got rid of all the chickens I found the dogs eating the remains of one. A hawk had caught it, killed it, ate what it want and left the carcass somewhere in our field. The dog found that carcass - which was at least 20 days old - and finished it off.
> 
> No problems.
> 
> Also, think about all the dogs that eat poop and survive!
Click to expand...

Oh I know! Aren't they amazing. Thanks for taking the time to reply.


----------



## Sweet Mammy

So I want to know WHERE does everyone shop?
I am not sure I could get 260# of various meats for $200 like one post stated.... I really want to do this but its about 5# a day for me with 2 dogs..... Please let me know.... also is there a GOOD way to get free meat at hunting season if you dont knwo hunters?


----------



## GSD in ATL

My GSD and my Manchester Terrier eat:

Ground Turkey with veggies ground in a food processor mixed in;
Turkey necks;
Chicken Backs;
Chicken Necks;
Raw eggs mixed in on occasion;
Chicken hearts and gizzards (MT doesn't like liver!);
A bit of what I eat sometimes as a treat.

Been feeding raw for almost 10 years to my dogs. Its the best.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

Update:

Winnie - 10 yr old Corgi mix, slowing down alot
AM - 4 ounces RBMs
PM - 4 ounces MM & .5 ounce OM
RMBs - Chicken backs, leg quarter pieces, necks
MM - beef and pork heart, ground turkey/beef
OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM)
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (when I forget to defrost things)
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
Limitations - RMBs have to be either small enough for her to swallow whole without choking or big enough so that she HAS to chew (she's a gulper)
Special Note - Winnie puts on weight just LOOKING at food so we monitor her very closely


Tazer - 10 yr old Cocker, slowing down some
AM - 5.25 ounces RBMs (day after coursing - 6.5 ounces)
PM - 5 ounces MM (day after coursing - 6 ounces) & .5 ounce OM
RMBs - same as Winnie
MM - beef and pork hearts 90% of the time (for the taurine - he's epileptic), ground beef or turkey
OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM) 
Misc - green tripe, eggs
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s), multi-vitamin (because of his seizures)
Limitations - NO large amounts of grains as they trigger seizures (he can have treats)
Special Note - Tazer sometimes has trouble keeping weight on during coursing season - even when he's not running (he gets worked up in the house listening to the other dogs run)


Sasha - 21 month old GSD mix, not super active
AM - 6 ounces RMBs
PM - 6 ounces MM & .75 ounce OM
RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, tilapia, pork rib tips, canned mackerel, turkey necks, pork necks, lamb necks
MM - beef heart, ground turkey, pork hearts, lamb trim
OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM)
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
Limitations - None


Kaynya - 2.5 year old Chinese Crested, very active about 50% of the time
AM - 4 ounces RMBs
PM - 4 ounces MM & .5 ounce OM
RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks cut into manageable pieces, tilapia, canned mackerel
MM - beef and pork heart, ground turkey/beef
OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM)
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
Limitations - None


Mauser - 9 month old GSD, very active about 50% of the time
AM - 16 ounces RMBs
PM - 16 ounces MM & 1.5 ounce OM
RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, canned mackerel, turkey necks
MM - beef and pork heart, ground turkey/beef
OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM)
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)
Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
Limitations - None


I'll get current weights on everyone today or tomorrow.


----------



## Krusty1231

> Originally Posted By: Lauri & The Gang
> Mauser - 9 month old GSD, very active about 50% of the time
> AM - 16 ounces RMBs
> PM - 16 ounces MM & 1.5 ounce OM
> RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, canned mackerel, turkey necks
> MM - beef and pork heart, ground turkey/beef
> OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM)
> Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)
> Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
> Limitations - None


Awesome. Thank you for posting this.


----------



## Nerrej

I still consider myself very new to this. Here is what we do

RMB: Chicken Leg Quarters, Turkey wings, Pork Neck Bones, Duck Necks

MM: Chicken Gizzards, Pork Butt, Ground beef

OM: Chicken Liver

Supplement: Salmon Oil

Treats: Natrual Balance dog food rolls

After looking over this thread, I realize its probably time to add a little variety in there.


----------



## aubie

Mine are on a 50/50 diet:

*Anna:* 10 mo. GSD, average-high Activity
A.M: 1 C Blue buff fish/sweet potato kibble mixed with either egg, yogurt, tripe or raw ground turkey (if not in p.m.)

P.M: Chicken quarter w/1-.5 oz beef liver, ground turkey

*Duncan:* 9-10 yo, Shep/Mix, average-slow activity
A.M: .5 C kibble mixed with either egg, tripe or ground turkey (if not in p.m.)

P.M: chicken quarter w/ 1-.5 oz beef liver, ground turkey

Sometimes they get a pork neck bone and a chicken wing instead of the chicken quarter.


----------



## sunfluer

I<span style='font-size: 11pt'> want to learn more about raw diet. Are there any concerned with uncooked meats and bacteria? I buy marrow bones for my dogs but feel compelled to cook before giving to my dogs in case of bacteria.

How do you prepare the meat? And, is the transition from dry to raw gradual? Recently, my GSD ate a baby bird (not intended) with no digestive consequences.</span>


----------



## Amaruq

Cooking bones makes then more brittle and thus unsafe for dogs to eat. They can splinter and cause MAJOR internal damage. 

As far as bacteria, dogs digestive track is MUCH different from humans. Dogs are from the same species as wolves and coyotes, which eat meat in the wild and have survived for 1,000's of years on such a diet.


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: AmaruqCooking bones makes then more brittle and thus unsafe for dogs to eat. They can splinter and cause MAJOR internal damage.
> 
> As far as bacteria, dogs digestive track is MUCH different from humans. Dogs are from the same species as wolves and coyotes, which eat meat in the wild and have survived for 1,000's of years on such a diet.


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>Thanks for the reply. The beef marrow bones don't splinter. I buy Merricks canned dog food as a supplement to the dry. It's human grade and one recipe has 2 cooked chicken wings in the can. The wings are cooked so well, they are very soft - no splinters.

So am I to understand raw chicken wings, backs, etc are given to dogs and it's ok? I will try offering my dogs the raw marrow bones next time I buy it.

Is a raw diet more cost effective?</span>


----------



## Amaruq

> Originally Posted By: 3dogs
> So am I to understand raw chicken wings, backs, etc are given to dogs and it's ok? I will try offering my dogs the raw marrow bones next time I buy it.


Yes. My guys have eaten all of the above AND pork necks,feet, ribs; venison rib, necks, backs and some legs, turkey necks, legs, wings; ducks.....



> Originally Posted By: 3dogsIs a raw diet more cost effective?


This depends on what all you would have access to and if you can buy in bulk and store, etc. For me it is WAY more cost effective to feed raw but I have over the years been able to find good suppliers and when one dissipates I have been lucky to have another become available. Most people feel they are doing great finding sources for $1/# or less. My average seems to be closer to $.75/# and that is not averaging in all of the FREE venison and other meats I get from local hunters and people cleaning out their freezers.


----------



## sunfluer

> Quote: It depends on what all you would have access to and if you can buy in bulk and store, etc. For me it is WAY more cost effective to feed raw but I have over the years been able to find good suppliers and when one dissipates I have been lucky to have another become available. Most people feel they are doing great finding sources for $1/# or less. My average seems to be closer to $.75/# and that is not averaging in all of the FREE venison and other meats I get from local hunters and people cleaning out their freezers.


Are you ever concerned about the length of time meat has been in someone's freezer? As for the free venison, is this from personal connections? I live out in the country side. I know my neighbor hunts but would feel awkward asking for raw meat for my dogs. And, do you ask the butcher at the super market for meats that might otherwise get tossed? Just wondering.

And, how much to feed? Do you measure by weight of the meat. Right now, my GSD gets 4 cups of kibble each day. At what age is a raw food diet started? Are there guidelines? Sirius is 6 mos old.








Thanks for the helpful info.


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: GSD in ATLMy GSD and my Manchester Terrier eat:
> 
> Ground Turkey with veggies ground in a food processor mixed in;
> Turkey necks;
> Chicken Backs;
> Chicken Necks;
> Raw eggs mixed in on occasion;
> Chicken hearts and gizzards (MT doesn't like liver!);
> A bit of what I eat sometimes as a treat.
> 
> Been feeding raw for almost 10 years to my dogs. Its the best.


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>At what age did you begin the raw feeding or does it even matter? My GSD is 6 mos. I would like to introduce the diet. My guess is I would need to gradually add it in so his body adjusts to it?

Also, how much to feed? Do you feed 1x or 2x per day? </span>


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: aubieMine are on a 50/50 diet:
> 
> *Anna:* 10 mo. GSD, average-high Activity
> A.M: 1 C Blue buff fish/sweet potato kibble mixed with either egg, yogurt, tripe or raw ground turkey (if not in p.m.)
> 
> P.M: Chicken quarter w/1-.5 oz beef liver, ground turkey
> 
> *Duncan:* 9-10 yo, Shep/Mix, average-slow activity
> A.M: .5 C kibble mixed with either egg, tripe or ground turkey (if not in p.m.)
> 
> P.M: chicken quarter w/ 1-.5 oz beef liver, ground turkey
> 
> Sometimes they get a pork neck bone and a chicken wing instead of the chicken quarter.


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>This thread is so interesting. Right now, both dogs get the Blue Buff for large breed exclusively. I do add in a large tablespoon of plain yogurt w/ live culture to the AM feeding. I like the idea of using blue buff with raw as well.

Have you experienced any diarrhea when introducing the raw diet?</span>


----------



## mspiker03

You can start a dog at any age...many pups are weaned onto raw food. Mine started at 2 years of age. We started (pun intended) cold turkey. One day, no more kibble. I feed 2x/day. You should feed your dog approx 2-3% of his/her EXPECTED adult weight. My dogs eat approx 2.5-3% (sometimes a little more if we are having a very active day). It will depend on your dog and how active he/she is and you may have to adjust as they grow, especially with a puppy.


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: mspiker03You can start a dog at any age...many pups are weaned onto raw food. Mine started at 2 years of age. We started (pun intended) cold turkey. One day, no more kibble. I feed 2x/day. You should feed your dog approx 2-3% of his/her EXPECTED adult weight. My dogs eat approx 2.5-3% (sometimes a little more if we are having a very active day). It will depend on your dog and how active he/she is and you may have to adjust as they grow, especially with a puppy.


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>At the last vet check a couple of weeks ago, Sirius weighed in at 53.3 lbs and he's 6 mos old. I'm not sure what he'll weigh at full growth. My Lab, Moon weighs 50 lbs.

Today, I took out a couple of raw marrow bones from the freezer (it's hot here today) and gave it to both dogs. Well, they seemed pretty darn happy to get it!









So if I switch off to a complete raw diet, there will be no stomach upset? As for portion size, would you say one chicken leg quarter or .5 lb of chopped meat per meal? Do you throw in some vegs also?</span>


----------



## aubie

there's an excel sheet on Lauri's site (www.rawdogranch.com) that you can plug you dogs weight into, the percentage range (right now Anna's on 2.5%), the percentages of OM, MM, RMB (she's at 65/35/5). Then it tells you in ounces how much of each you should feed. 

I'd suggest a cheap food scale (I got one at Target for like $10) to help you get used to weights/measures.


----------



## mspiker03

Some dogs get upset stomachs when they switch (mine did not). The best thing to do is pick one protein source (say chicken) and stick to ONLY that for at least a week (that can include chicken quarters, drums, gizzards, hearts, breast meat, etc) and hold off on any organ meat (liver, kidnet, etc) until your dog has switched successfully (organ meat is rich and can cause the runs if you give too much). Then, add in new protein sources one at a time until you have a good variety going. I weigh my food - I can't say that my dog always gets one chicken quarter because it depends on the size of the quarter (I've fed some that are barely .5 lbs and some are over a pound). I'd also keep track (until you get the hang of it) what you are feeding and in what amounts so if there are any problems, you can post and people can help out and give you some ideas. Over feeding can also cause the runs, so it is good to know the amounts fed. Other tips - too dry off poop, add more muscle meat (MM, meat without bones)...too soft, add more bone (RMB's).

As for your pups weight - do you know the size of his parents, specifically his dad? That might help give you a ball park figure of weight. If not, I'd start out with mid breed standard (I don't know, or remember how his current weight relates to other dogs his age...but if he is on the high side, maybe go a little more) and adjust from there - if he gains too much and is looking fat, decrease the food and if he is getting too skinny, add more back in.

I sometimes feed veggies - when I have cooked some and have leftovers. Mine aren't huge veggie fans. Some people do, some don't.

Marrow bones are more recreational than an actual RMB that the dog would eat as part of a meal.


----------



## sunfluer

<span style='font-size: 11pt'>All this info is great and I thank you so much for sharing it. With the raw marrow bone today, I just wanted to see how the dogs would like it. And, of course they do! Sirius and Moon give me all paws up







Previously, I would boil the marrow bones and use the broth in their food. Nothing got wasted.

My next question is - how well does a dog handle an all protein diet? I wonder if it's hard on the kidneys. In the wild, wolves would eat the stomachs of their prey benefitting from vegetation. My dogs will eat some cooked vegs if I give it to them.

I think I'm going to start gradually, mixing it in. It would not be fun if my dogs got the hershey squirts.










The butcher in the Stop & Shop are very good at getting marrow bones for me when I tell them it's for my dogs. Will have to see if I can get some scrap meat at a discount price. Has anyone tried that?</span>


----------



## mspiker03

You can find greed tripe to feed the dogs (basically, unbleached tripe)... greentripe.com or there are some other places. I think you can get canned too. Quite stinky.


----------



## sunfluer

<span style='font-size: 11pt'>So there's no clean way to feed raw. Dogs will gnaw on the quarter chicken leg, etc., on the floor like they would on a bone. In which case, if not confined, they may drag it into the living room and eat on the rug - right?

Do you confine your dog to the kitchen. Or, do you feed them outside?</span>


----------



## mspiker03

Tripe is outside for sure! The rest I feed inside. But, I just watch my dogs and they have learned to eat where I feed them. You can buy a plastic tablecloth (like a picnic one), put it down and when your dog tries to go off with the food, you take it and put it back on the cloth/mat. Some people use cookie sheets.


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: mspiker03Tripe is outside for sure! The rest I feed inside. But, I just watch my dogs and they have learned to eat where I feed them. You can buy a plastic tablecloth (like a picnic one), put it down and when your dog tries to go off with the food, you take it and put it back on the cloth/mat. Some people use cookie sheets.


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>Ah, this is very good information. Thank you.







</span>


----------



## aubie

We used the can tripe, I mix it with their morning meals (right now kibble since I'm doing 50/50 till we get our freezer) in bowls. Evening is the raw meat, Anna takes her to her "place" or a mat and Duncan has one spot he always goes to.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

> Originally Posted By: 3dogsSo there's no clean way to feed raw.


Sure there is - teach your dogs to eat AT their bowls.

I feed 5 dogs in my kitchen and they only leave their bowl when they are finished eating.

Because I TRAINED them to stay at their bowls while eating.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

> Originally Posted By: 3dogsMy next question is - how well does a dog handle an all protein diet? I wonder if it's hard on the kidneys.


My girl Neke lived to 14.5 before cancer got her. She was raw fed for more than half her life. Never had a kidney problem.

I have a friend how has an 11 year old Irish Wolfhound. 11 years is AMAZING for a Wolfhound!! The dog has been raw fed since birth.



> Quote:My dogs will eat some cooked vegs if I give it to them.


My dogs eat cat litter but it doesn't mean they NEED it or that it's good for them.









My dogs have been without significant vegetation for the majority of their lives. They get green tripe every now and then but overall I would say it accounts for less then 5% of their total diet.

They are all very healthy.


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: Lauri & The Gang
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted By: 3dogsSo there's no clean way to feed raw.
> 
> 
> 
> Sure there is - teach your dogs to eat AT their bowls.
> 
> I feed 5 dogs in my kitchen and they only leave their bowl when they are finished eating.
> 
> Because I TRAINED them to stay at their bowls while eating.
Click to expand...

<span style='font-size: 11pt'>
With large pieces, like chicken leg quarters; do your dogs eat it on the floor like they would a bone? Do you put down a mat as someone suggested or a cookie sheet? Or, do you cut up the pieces w/ bone and feed it that way? Otherwise, how would the dog keep the large piece in the bowl?</span>


----------



## Jason L

You either stand there like you are their busboy and wait for finish and then clean up or you crate them.

I crate them.


----------



## sunfluer

> Originally Posted By: Jason LinYou either stand there like you are their busboy and wait for finish and then clean up or you crate them.
> 
> I crate them.


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>Thanks. I can crate my GSD but I no longer crate my Lab so I have some challenges w/ feeding.

Right now, I've been training them to eat their kibble side by side and it's sucessful - no fighting or snarling. I see switching to raw as another learning curve for me and the dogs. I guess I can feed them separately but would rather they eat together if at all possible.</span>


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

> Originally Posted By: 3dogsWith large pieces, like chicken leg quarters; do your dogs eat it on the floor like they would a bone?


I usually cut the quarters apart - separate the leg and thigh. That way the dogs just pick up one piece and eat - they don't even put it back down.

Remember - dogs don't "chew". They break up their food just enough to get it down their throats and then swallow.











> Quote:You either stand there like you are their busboy and wait for finish and then clean up or you crate them.


I don't stand over them, watching. While they are eating I am putting away any leftovers, rinsing off the scissors/knife and washing up. By that time everyone is finished. And I don't bother 'cleaning up' since there is nothing to clean up!


----------



## rjvamp

Quick Question. With the leg quarters (bones included) my vet was saying my dog's teeth were wearing too much so I stopped giving him the marrow bone treats (raw frozen). Are the bones going to be the same density with leg quarters where he would rub his teeth down? In that case, would it be better to just have the bone ground up or leave the bone out? If the bones is left out, would that mean he would be missing nutrients the bones provide?

And, what about pre and pro biotics? I saw some folks added yogurts, i'm assuming for the probiotics? What about prebiotics or is probiotics good enough?

I am very impressed with those pics of Grimm so it really has questions running through my mind  Plus the costs Lauri & the Raw Fed Gang put up on the website made a ton of sense with the DIY....the cost was less than most kibble! I know I've priced out the already made stuff and I would go broke if I ever went RAW Fed with that stuff...even though convenient for sure. Just don't have a freezer but I don't think those are too expensive. I plan on buying one for us anyway.

Thanks!

Robert


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

Robert - check out Craigslist for freezers. Many people GIVE them away.

Bones ARE necessary in the diet, for nutritional reasons. The bones in chickens and such are much easier to chew than the hard recerational bones. My guys have been eating raw with whole bones for years and have no teeth wearing issues.


----------



## Semperfly82

I'm completely blown away by the raw diet and as much as i want to start have no idea on how to structure a menu for my 4 1/2 mo old shepherd. I'm looking at the rawdogranch to try to get going and any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. It seems like there isnt much to go off of for puppies on her page she's got it started but hasn't included anything into the sections yet..

Off tangent question: eggs (hardboiled, raw with shell, or scrambled?)


----------



## aubie

Raw with the shell is fine for the eggs. Sorry, I'm not too up on the puppy advice!


----------



## aubie

Figured I needed to update since going full raw:

Anna: 13 mo. GSD, average-high Activity, 68-70lbs
A.M: 13.4 oz MM/1.6 oz OM (plus salmon oil)
P.M: 18.5 oz RMB (plus an extra every other day)

Duncan: 9-11 yo, Shep/Mix, average-slow activity, 68lbs (trying to get weight down to about 62-65lbs)
A.M: 7.9 oz MM/1 oz OM (plus salmon oil)
P.M: 11 oz RMB (plus an extra every other day)

MM's: ground turkey, ground beef, mackrel, ground quail, beef heart, turkey heart, ground venison, ground duck

OM: Beef kidney, beef liver, lamb organ mix

RMB: Turkey necks, chicken necks, chicken backs, chicken quarters, pork necks

Other items: yogurt, tripe, eggs


----------



## ch3ckpo1nt

I have a 13 week old Male GSD, activity level is probably average, maybe a bit below during the week. I'm switching from Eukenuba to TOTW this weekend. I don't want to do 100% RAW feeding, but I wanted to know of the best stuff I can just add in his kibble every once in awhile? If I chose eggs, do I just drop an egg in there with his food? Any recommendations you guys may have, let me know please!

Thank you!


----------



## IslandStorm62

I noticed that you Feed the RMB in the mornings; the MM and OM in the evening. I assume this is by design?

I downloaded your spreadsheet and strated trying to figure out how much to feed my 2.5YO Male GSD. He is going to be fairly active so I am estimating about 2.5lbs - 3lbs per day. I really want to feed him just once a day and was wondering what the thoughts are in regards to feeding schedules.

He will be most active in the AM (mornign jog with me) and Mid-Day (Fetching and/or training); Evenings will be milder with Walks and Training).

Also in regars to OM - I am still having a hard time thinking of the Heart as a MM as opposed to OM. I don't know, just a mental thing with me. Also everyone gives tripe, is this supposed to be consiered an OM? What about the intestines (chitlings)? I have not seen any mention of these. I assume they fall in the same category as tripe and other OM?...Comments?


----------



## IslandStorm62

I remeber once I gave my dog a whole turkey neck (raw) and the next day one ofthe Vertebra came out the back end "whole". Have any of you experienced this? Is this an indication that he may have been getting too much RMB?

In one of the other posts I mentiond that I Clip the ends of the chicken leg and thigh and discard the main bone shaft. Since there is only the small "joint / knuckle" end of the bone, would I be more accurate if I count this as MM instead of RMB. He still gets the back, hips, neck and breast bone (minus the wishbone). The wish bone looks dangerous so I take that out as well. It's proabably a lot more work for me, cause I buy the whole chicken and cut them up myself. Back then this was the cheapest way I could buy the chicken, since I haven't shopped in a year, I have no idea how expensive everythin is in todays economy.


----------



## aubie

I feed twice a day with MM/OM in the morning (although sometimes Mrs. Diva doesn't eat it or all of it and she gets the rest of that at night with her RMB). I've fed RMBs in the mornings too sometimes if I didn't have any MM thawed out out--I think it's a personal preference thing. I like two meals a day, just because I know I'd like to have two meals a day instead of one big ol' meal.

Think of the heart this way, the heart is the most powerful muscle in the body. That's all it is--pure muscle therefore it's a MM. I tend to think of OM's as things that are gladular like or serve a specific biological function. Where the heart just makes muscular contractions, the liver and kidney's control things like enzymes and serve as filters.

I use tripe as an extra--I don't calculate it as MM or OM. Most chitlings you see in stores are bleached white, removing all the nutritional value so they're basically worthless. Green tripe still has the digested plant matter and other enzymes that dogs can utilize.


----------



## UConnGSD

I feed a bit of everything (RMB, MM, OM, green tripe) at every meal (2 meals a day -- simply because I have a mental block about how one huge meal would actually fit in his stomach). I would treat all squishy organs as OM and the muscular ones like hearts as MM. In fact, we don't treat skin as OM but that's our largest organ! Finally, I think of green tripe as veggies!


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

> Originally Posted By: MochaI noticed that you Feed the RMB in the mornings; the MM and OM in the evening. I assume this is by design?


Yes. When I was working I liked the dogs to have all day to lay around and digest the bones.



> Quote:He is going to be fairly active so I am estimating about 2.5lbs - 3lbs per day. I really want to feed him just once a day and was wondering what the thoughts are in regards to feeding schedules.


That's alot to feed in just one meal. If you are set on that I would go with an evening feeding. But - watch out for the Empty Tummy Urps. Raw is digested faster than kibble and even with two meals a day some dogs get ETUs after being switched to raw.



> Quote: Also everyone gives tripe, is this supposed to be consiered an OM? What about the intestines (chitlings)? I have not seen any mention of these. I assume they fall in the same category as tripe and other OM?...Comments?


Tripe - GREEN tripe (not available in grocery stores) I feed as muscle meat. It's the stomach (a muscle) with some green matter still included.

Chitlings (the ones at the grocery stores) are usually pig intestines, cleaned. Those would be a muscle meat but not worth buying as there's no great reason to.


----------



## Quiksilver

What does OM and MM stand for? Thanks


----------



## Martie

> Originally Posted By: QuiksilverWhat does OM and MM stand for? Thanks


OM is Organ Meat - http://www.rawdogranch.com/OrganMeat.htm

MM is Muscle Meat - http://www.rawdogranch.com/MuscleMeat.htm

RBM is Raw Meaty Bones - http://www.rawdogranch.com/RawMeatyBones.htm


----------



## Quiksilver

> Originally Posted By: Martie
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted By: QuiksilverWhat does OM and MM stand for? Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> OM is Organ Meat - http://www.rawdogranch.com/OrganMeat.htm
> 
> MM is Muscle Meat - http://www.rawdogranch.com/MuscleMeat.htm
> 
> RBM is Raw Meaty Bones - http://www.rawdogranch.com/RawMeatyBones.htm
Click to expand...


It all makes sense now! Thanks a lot! =D


----------



## KG K9

About how much are you all spending per month on food?

I believe right now I am spending about $50 on a 35lb or so bag of Innova LBP.

I figure my pup, 40 lbs and 3 months could eat about 16 oz RMB, 8oz MM, and 2oz of OM per DAY

Here is the prices I've found locally, NOT bulk.


RMB:
Bf Shank 16oz $2
11pc Chicken drum bag $4.50
Bf Soup Bone Meaty 16oz $1.59
Bf Neckbone 16oz. $2.39


MM:
Ground Bf 80 oz =5lbs $10
Canned Herring...small possibly 2 meals $1.09

OM:
Bf Liver 16oz $1.49
Bf Marrow Guts 16oz $0.99
Chk Liver 16oz $2.39

Throw in the cost of eggs here and there, along with other ok scraps.

I come to about $3.20/day and $90-95/month.

That is about DOUBLE what I am spending now.

Doesn't sound good to me. And I don't have room to store bulk frozen products.


----------



## GSDSunshine

> Originally Posted By: KG K9About how much are you all spending per month on food?
> 
> I believe right now I am spending about $50 on a 35lb or so bag of Innova LBP.
> 
> I figure my pup, 40 lbs and 3 months could eat about 16 oz RMB, 8oz MM, and 2oz of OM per DAY
> 
> Here is the prices I've found locally, NOT bulk.
> 
> 
> RMB:
> Bf Shank 16oz $2
> 11pc Chicken drum bag $4.50
> Bf Soup Bone Meaty 16oz $1.59
> Bf Neckbone 16oz. $2.39
> 
> 
> MM:
> Ground Bf 80 oz =5lbs $10
> Canned Herring...small possibly 2 meals $1.09
> 
> OM:
> Bf Liver 16oz $1.49
> Bf Marrow Guts 16oz $0.99
> Chk Liver 16oz $2.39
> 
> Throw in the cost of eggs here and there, along with other ok scraps.
> 
> I come to about $3.20/day and $90-95/month.
> 
> That is about DOUBLE what I am spending now.
> 
> Doesn't sound good to me. And I don't have room to store bulk frozen products.


First, some of your RMBs are either not really practical for a pup his age/size or are not BMBs at all. The beef neck bones are going to be pretty hard, my 2 y/o can eat veal necks, but not beef, they are too dense, so a 3 month puppy will have problems. Also, the soup bones are recreational bones. Most of the beef bones are going to be too hard, and dense for eating. These animals weigh a ton (literally). When compared to a 6 pound bird....it is very different.

I just started buying in bulk, and before that I could find pretty good prices on meat at grocery stores and Walmart, Sams club...etc. You have to know where to look... and what to feed. Ground beef is going to be expensive, so is beef shank. Poultry is much cheaper.

Also take into account how much bone is actually in the product. Chicken wings and turkey necks are very bony. So you would feed those in smaller amounts than say a chicken quarter that is very meaty. 

Here are some pricey that I have found in different stores. 

RMB: 
Chicken quarter $0.49/lb (Walmart)
Cornish Hens $1.49/lb (Sams Club)
Turkey necks $1.29/lb (Publix)
Chicken wings 10 lbs for $14.98 (Sams Club)
Chicken backs are usually cheap too

MM:
Ground Turkey 1 lb chub for $1.50
Beef Heart $1.18/lb (Publix)
Canned Mackerel 1.29 for a can
Chicken gizzards (not sure of exact price, but cheap)

Also....While I haven't bought it, you can also get chicken breast when they are on sale (saw 1.79/lb at Publix), and pork roasts (found on sale once for $0.99 a pound)

When I fed chicken quarters and Cornish hens, that was usually his meal, since the 1/4 i get are pretty meaty already. 

For a week he could have meals like this. I use a 50/45/5 ratio when preparing diets that have very bony RMBs, instead of 60/35/5. My guy also does better with less bone so you can vary between the 2 ratios to find out what he does best on. Your amount also seems kinda low on the total amount. I calculated just a little over a pound and a half. If he weighs 30 ponds now, I would guess his 8 week weight would be around 20 pounds at least. So you would feed 10% of his weight then, which would be closer to 2 pounds of food. Unless you know his parents weight and can estimate how big he will get and then base the amount off of that. Obviously the amounts would change with the whatever weight he actually has and how much bone he needs in his diet, since it varies with each dog.


So with 50/45/5 and a total of 2 pounds of food daily, and only getting a week of food at one time. RMB= 16 oz, MM= 14.5 oz, OM= 1.5 oz 

Meal ideas

1. Chicken wings, Chicken gizzards, chicken liver
2. Chicken Quarters (very meaty), beef liver
3. Turkey necks, ground turkey, Chicken liver
4. Turkey necks, beef heart, beef liver
5. Chicken backs, canned mackerel, beef liver 

Since I don't have prices for everything, I will calculate the prices for the meals I do have prices for.


1. 1.50, 1.40, .14 = 3.05
2. 0.94, 0.14 = 1.08
3. 0.99, 1.36, .14 = 2.49
4. 0.99, 1.07, .14 = 2.20
5. 0.99, 0.84, .14 = 1.97

If you fed all meals equally, you would spend about 65 bucks a month. That is assuming you feed more food than calculated....However you notice some meals cost more than others. I would feed more chicken meals and less expensive meals.

Since you only have a small amount of room for storing food, I assume you dont want to keep all 5 meals in the fridge at one time, especailly since packages will vary by size and things like that. 

If you fed a 5 days of food and say 2 days was meal 2, and 2 days he had meal 4, and 1 day was meal 5, it would cost you approximately 8.50 to feed. In 30 days it would cost you approx 51 bucks.









Granted you would add in extras and treats, but that was also for 2 pounds per day.... at your amount to feed per day it would come to about 42, then add in eggs (say 4 per 5 days...or 2 dozen per month for an additional say 5 dollars a month) and you total out to 56 or 47 per month depending on the amount you feed.







Hope this helps a little. Sorry it was SOOOOO long.


----------



## GSDSunshine

And my calculations were for 30 day months, not 28 day months.


----------



## mockbam5

So my puppy weights 25 pounds and is 10 weeks old. The father was almost 90 pounds and the mom 73 pounds. How much raw food should I be feeding my puppy? Right now I'm feeding him 1/2 a pound per meal, 3 times a day.


----------



## H8Rain

Question, for the fruits and veggies, to make things easy, could I use baby food? Nothing with additives (like onion powder which is a big no-no) just straight pureed fruits and veggies. 

Thanks.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

If you feel the need to add fruits and veggies, baby food would work. Just watch out for added sugar.

Instead of F&V (which dog's do not really need) why not try fresh green tripe? It is much closer to the type of green stuff they would naturally eat.


----------



## H8Rain

Two more questions please:

1. I see this posted alot "&amp" .... what does that mean?

2. How often would you feed the Green Tripe?

Thanks!


----------



## Samba

*Starting new puppy*

My new pup is not much on the kibble idea. That is fine. My other dogs are only supplemented with raw, so this little one is going to require more effort on my part to create the raw diet.

I started her on ground beef as I wanted the fat and calories. When I read the sticky with menus listed, I noted a number of people used ground beef for meat meals. I was wondering what other meat meals people might suggest for a pup starting out. 

After a few days of beef, I added some raw chicken. Haven't gotten to any organs yet.

We don't seem to have much variety of meats or organs in my area so it has to be basic grocery store type items at this point.

How much to feed? What percentage of weight would you feed a pup that needs to grow? She is 25lbs at 4 months, so is really pretty small. I had read somewhere that for gaining feeding up to 8% of weight might be needed. It seems a lot.


----------



## DanielleKeith

Can someone help me understand the raw diet? I don't know the acronyms for the different meal categories. I have a 12 week old longhair shepherd puppy. He is extremely itchy which the vet recommends safflower oil or thistle oil in his German brand kibble. I am becoming increasingly interested in the raw diet or homecooked foods. Can someone explain the benefit and exactly how to do it? Thanks, Danielle


----------



## Domenic

Danielle,good morning.I will only say this,If your pup is itching as you describe then it would be my guess that he is probably allergic or intolerant of the food he is eating.I have one of my GSD's that is allergic to just about every protein source out there(chicken,duck,turkey,pork,fish)and also has some problems with gluten grains such as wheat,barley,oats,rye etc.I think that the easiest way for you is to try a different food with LIMITED INGREDIENTS and for sure a DIFFERENT protein source than what is in the food he is on.I would guess that his food is chicken based as is most food.Some dogs just dont do well on chicken or fishmeal etc.If you are dealing with this (allergies),it can be easy or it can become hard to deal with.I would think about changing his food to a LID and go from there.You will hopefully see that once you go to a different food say the Natural Balance-Lamb-Rice or Bison and Sweet Patatoe,or Venison-Rice or Duck-Patatoe he will stop itching.I really doubt that adding saffflower oil or thistle oil will stop the itching.As a matter of fact ,the increased Omega 6 may cause MORE inflamation.I hope this helps as I know first hand how difficult dealing with allergies can be.Good luck and please let me know how it goes if you should decide to try the food change to a different protein and Limited Ingredient Diet.


----------



## EMarie59

DanielleKeith said:


> Can someone help me understand the raw diet? I don't know the acronyms for the different meal categories. I have a 12 week old longhair shepherd puppy. He is extremely itchy which the vet recommends safflower oil or thistle oil in his German brand kibble. I am becoming increasingly interested in the raw diet or homecooked foods. Can someone explain the benefit and exactly how to do it? Thanks, Danielle


 I am with Danielle here. I was JUST about to post the same question.
I SO do not understand what was written here in the original post.
AM - 9 ounces RMBs, PM 8 ounces MM & 1 ounce OM
RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, tilapia, pork rib tips, canned mackerel, turkey necks, pork necks, lamb necks
MM - beef heart, ground turkey, pork hearts, lamb trim
OM - liver, kidney
Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)


----------



## enzosmama

I have a 10 week old male GSD. We are currently very interested in a raw diet. Where do we start? How much do I feed him? WHAT do I feed him?? HELP!


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

A good place to start learning about the diet is my website:

http://www.rawdogranch.com


----------



## Miss Molly May

Lauri & The Gang said:


> A good place to start learning about the diet is my website:
> 
> http://www.rawdogranch.com


 
I had no clue this was your website! Great job and thanks a million!!


----------



## Dejavu

IslandStorm62 said:


> I remeber once I gave my dog a whole turkey neck (raw) and the next day one ofthe Vertebra came out the back end "whole". Have any of you experienced this? Is this an indication that he may have been getting too much RMB?


I was wondering the same thing too. This morning one of mine pooped a semi-digested part of what I think is a "knee" from a chicken drumstick. Like 3-4 cms. long (around an inch and a half).

Too much RMB perhaps? Or what could it be?


----------



## lanaw13

Can someone post a link directly to the spreadsheet on Lauri's website? I can't seem to find it…


----------



## jprice103

lanaw13 said:


> Can someone post a link directly to the spreadsheet on Lauri's website? I can't seem to find it…


I know! I was looking for it too!! Hopefully someone has it so they can post it!


----------



## lanaw13

Raw pork is ok? Saw pork tails at the store today, but passed them up because DH questioned the safety….. He is also uncomfortable with fish…. Any advice?


----------



## Verivus

Human-grade raw pork is perfectly fine. If it's trichinosis you're worried about it's not common in human-grade meat anymore. Just don't feed any wild hog. My dog's been eating pork practically since she started raw and she's had zero problems.


----------



## Kevin W

I'm finally done reading 123 posts!

This is all great info!


----------



## Superhero

It's funny... I went to my vet when Nyx turned one year and ever vet remarked that sher had some of the most beautiful teeth she's ever seen. Then she was like "wow and her coast is so glossy and she is perfectly healthy" blah blah. I said thank you and she asked which food I am feeding. I told her she eats a mostly raw diet. She frowned and said that she thought it was a bad idea and that her health would suffer. Then she said "well just make sure you don't let her east any chicken bones." I told her that in fact chicken is a staple of her diet, bones and all. I wish I had a picture of her face. How ironic eh?


----------



## Andy Assur

Hi I'm a long time reader, first time poster here. I am currently feeding my 13 week GSD weighing 27 pounds, 3 chicken necks and a handful of ground veggies (broccoli, carrots, capsicum) per meal 3 times a day. it equals to about a pound and a half per day. I also feed him about 3 eggs a week and a few table spoons of youghurt once a week. Could someone please tell me if this is a satisfactory diet in the long run or am I missing something. p.s. more often than not he swallows the chicken necks after 2-3 bites.


----------



## Josie/Zeus

Andy Assur said:


> Hi I'm a long time reader, first time poster here. I am currently feeding my 13 week GSD weighing 27 pounds, 3 chicken necks and a handful of ground veggies (broccoli, carrots, capsicum) per meal 3 times a day. it equals to about a pound and a half per day. I also feed him about 3 eggs a week and a few table spoons of youghurt once a week. Could someone please tell me if this is a satisfactory diet in the long run or am I missing something. p.s. more often than not he swallows the chicken necks after 2-3 bites.


I suggest giving him variety, how about beef, turkey, pork, kangaroo meat even?

My own puppy gets chicken, turkey, venison, green tripe and beef. I don't feed vegetables and I only give eggs when I remember. I used to give yogurt as well but he doesn't like it as much so he doesn't get it anymore.


----------



## Andy Assur

Thanks for your reply Josie. I stick to chicken necks because it's very inexpensive, as I have a very low budget at the moment, and I believe it is still healthier than kibble. But I am not very knowledgeable when it comes to raw food, so if you could tell me how crucial it is to maintain a variety of meat? If it is very important I will make the changes.


----------



## SitUbuSit

*spreadsheet*



lanaw13 said:


> Can someone post a link directly to the spreadsheet on Lauri's website? I can't seem to find it…


I couldn't find it either, so I made my own. I use Dr. Becker's ratios, so you'll have to change the percentages in the spreadsheet if you want it to match Laurie's. Link and instructions in this thread: http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...barf-portion-calculator-budget-worksheet.html 

I really recommend Laurie's site, btw. It made raw feeding seem much less intimidating, and I learned a lot from it. (Thank you, Laurie!)


----------



## Ayarian

*Recipe*

Hello,

I have a 7 month old my GSD, and I has recently decided to switch a raw diet. I have been feed him Nature's Variety lamb patties but I want to start my own mix. Can anyone help? Need some help getting started.


----------



## wyoung2153

I have been reading this thread over the last couple days and has been a great amount of help in determining if I am going to do the raw diet. I have researched out the you know what trying to find guidelines on getting started. There is SO much information out there and it's beginning to get overwhelming, haha. In researching I calculated he should be getting about 2.5 lbs of raw food a day, but that seems like a whole lot when I read some of your menus. So instead of driving myself crazy, I thought I would go straight to the source...

Can someone help me get started on switching my GSD to a raw diet. He is 2 years old, 98 lbs of solid muscle, and high energy (he is home while I am at work, goes for 2 long walks a day and plays TONS of fetch and "find," weekends are much more active for him to include dog parks and much socialization.)

Any help getting started would be AMAZING. Thanks guys.


----------



## Hades11

Hi I am new too the GSD website! And I had recently got a sable shepherd myself, he is on a raw diet, consisting of beef/pork meaty neck bones and a leg/thigh/back quarter of chicken a day. With some eggs, for a 11 week old pup is this a good diet or do I need to change it up any? Any tips would be welcomed!


----------



## jae

This thread needs a little gettin' on track! It's really a good one. I try to feed ~2.5lbs a day, fed twice a day.

After beef only for the first 3 weeks (necks, trim, liver, and hearts), #1 and #2 has been the main-stay diet for the past 2 weeks, everything else is starting in the near future. As always the list isn't solid, so if something needs to change, please let me know!

#1
20oz turkey/chicken grind; if no organ in the grind, ~1oz beef liver.

#2
~12oz beef trim, 8oz green tripe or 8oz beef grind, ~1oz beef liver

#3
1 chicken back, 4 turkey hearts, ~1oz beef liver

#4
1 turkey back, ~1oz beef liver

#5
12oz beef heart, 8oz shank

#6
~20oz chicken quarter (taken a whole 7lb chicken and chop it into quarters)

+eggs, eggshell, seaweed calcium supplement, carrots, green beans, yogurt, at my discretion.


----------



## Kaasuti

Charlie has been on 100% raw for only a week. But the differences are amazing already.

He gets minced meat (can be either lamb,beef,chicken,turkey,rabbit,fish or green tripe) mixed with some veggies twice a day and he has an egg with shell in his food at least three times a week. He gets some yoghurt as well mixed in usually at night time.

How often should i give him oily fish or raw meaty bones?. I'm out and about today and was hoping to get some in.​


----------



## SFGSSD

I also use Vitamin E 400IU gel caps squeezed out and sometimes (once a week) 500mg Vitamin C anyone else use these supplements to the diet?


----------



## SFGSSD

Superhero said:


> It's funny... I went to my vet when Nyx turned one year and ever vet remarked that sher had some of the most beautiful teeth she's ever seen. Then she was like "wow and her coast is so glossy and she is perfectly healthy" blah blah. I said thank you and she asked which food I am feeding. I told her she eats a mostly raw diet. She frowned and said that she thought it was a bad idea and that her health would suffer. Then she said "well just make sure you don't let her east any chicken bones." I told her that in fact chicken is a staple of her diet, bones and all. I wish I had a picture of her face. How ironic eh?


Yeah I have seen that face before:laugh: When I see it all I think to myself is "sorry your not going to make a killing off my dog from the Science Diet the manufactuer gives you a kickback on":laugh:


----------



## Chief123

*Raw diets*

I have a 5 year old GS who is a great dog but he has recently been diagnosed with anal fistullas. The vet suggested I put him on a LID which I did but he it hasnt gotten much better. He sheds terribly and now the vet has put him on prescription hypoallergenic food which is very expensive. I'veread some things on raw diets and I'm wondering if that will help him heal as well as get rid of his allergies (he constantly licks his paws). Is there an easy guide on how to feed a dog a raw diet and how much to feed him. Chief weighs 94 pounds


----------



## WirelessG

Great thread here. Thanks, Laura, for rawdogranch.

My 11 year old lab struggles with licking, so I am gonna start a BARF diet. The only question that I have that does not seem to be answered is what do you do with the eggs? Do you simply crack them on top of whatever else you're putting in the dog bowl along with the shell? Do you blend them with other ingredients? Thanks.


----------



## WirelessG

Bump

Still wondering about you serve the eggs and the shells.


----------



## JackandMattie

Over the weekend, my neighbors driving by said hello and I see you're spoiling those babies!

I was standing out on the patio with a carton of brown eggs and all three of my dogs sitting waiting for their "treat!" Oh, who can sit soonest, who can sit stillest, who is squirming in his seat now?

I just put the whole egg in their eager mouths, they drop it on the pavement and it cracks and they lap it up. Except for old girl. She just starts chewing as soon as it hits her tongue, haha!! And if the younger two don't eat their shells, you can count on her to make quick of those, as well. Sound like tater chips for dogs!


----------



## WirelessG

Thanks for the info, J&M. I ended up putting the egg between meat and pressing it so that it breaks. Flint eats it all up and then tries to drag the shell off and I have to tell him to keep it in the bowl. 

He sure likes his new diet and he's no longer licking his front legs. In fact, I gave him some of his dry food (Nutro Senior) on Wednesday morning and by that evening, he was back to licking away.


----------



## WirelessG

I have a 9 week old GSD that will be getting next weekend. I see a lot of posts saying that any puppy 8 weeks and old can get on BARF right away. Is there any restriction on bones for a puppy? 

I didn't see any comments on this and the Raw Dog Ranch site didn't comment either. Thanks.


----------



## Rodimus80

I just started my boy (11 months) on a RAW diet last week consisting of chicken quarters and some liver spread throughout. He also gets marrow bones here and there and I will be introducing him to some turkey necks. So far it's been great. His coat is looking good, his energy is great and the bad breath is gone. Not too mention that the poop that comes from a RAW feed dog is so easy during clean-up time. I will never be going back to kibble!


----------



## Odie

I am thinking about getting back into feeding RAW to my 100 lb 7 year old neutered GSD. My old formula was:
put 4 apples, 4 bananas, medium sized box of blueberries (1 lb), 3 pounds heart meat, 8 eggs (shell and all), 8 cloves of garlic, 3 large cooked yams, 1 head of romaine lettuce, alfalfa sprouts, 1 large tub of low sugar plain yogurt into a food processor and blend all together. Then mix with with lean ground hamburger at a ration of 65% hamburger and 35% mixture. I then separated into 1 lb freezer bags and froze until needed. I also cut up fresh chicken back / necks into 1 pound freezer bags and froze. He would then get a pound of the hamburger mixture in the morning and a pound of the chicken back / necks at night.

Does anyone see any problems with this formula???? Any help would be appreciated.


----------



## Staci

*starting my 2 on a raw diet*

I see a lot of you feed chicken necks, back and turkey necks etc. Where are you finding something like that? My local grocer can only get leg quarters and thighs with backs. I wasn't sure where else I needed to be looking


Also is chicken ok to be a main staple if I add other proteins in for mm and om?


----------



## hexakosioi

I try too feed my 2 year GSD 3 lbs/day once a day in the afternoon and a RMB at night just something to chew on.
His main protein is Goat or Lamb meat, but his menu usually looks like this (everything is fresh):
1. goat/lamb meat + rmb
2. fresh cow green tripe (a must for my. no more loose tools)
3. cow heart
4. cow liver
+
5. a beef rib at night

Roy just loves goat/lamb meat. Today I wanted to change his menu a bit and got a fresh turkey. He did not like it at all. Since he also doesn't like chicken, I think it is safe to say he doesn't like poultry.

On the weekends I try to get whole rabbits (the entire thing unsliced with the organs in it) for him and he loves it.


----------



## Serbrider

I feed a variety of proteins to my two animals, primarily based on what is on sale/what I can get for free from local butchers/processors/farmers/friends/whatever. Sometimes I have more venison, sometimes more chicken, sometimes more pork, sometimes more beef, etc. But whatever I have, I have a variety.

Tasha (50-ish lbs, 9 years old, not extremely active) gets an amount approximately the size of a whole chicken leg quarter once a day. She gets something bone in almost every single time, because if I don't she gets loose stool. Every 7th day or so she gets a meal of organ meats.

Master (15-ish lbs SLIM, 1.5 years old, a domestic shorthair cat) gets approximately 1/2 lb worth of food per day (I weigh his out) divided into two meals a day. Every other meal has something with bone... usually a chicken wing because it's easy, and every 7th or 8th meal he gets organs. So twice a week generally, occasionally a little more often.


And my plan with my new puppy Arya is to start with 3x a day. Same protein variety, bone-in morning and evening, whether she finishes the bone or not. Organs three times a week for lunch-time meal, adjusting based on poop and how she starts feeling. And as she gets older decrease down to 2x a day at about 6-8 months, and probably always stay at 2x a day, potentially decreasing to main meal at night and a small meal of an egg and a chewing bone for during the day.


----------



## LoveDogs

Odie said:


> I am thinking about getting back into feeding RAW to my 100 lb 7 year old neutered GSD. My old formula was:
> put 4 apples, 4 bananas, medium sized box of blueberries (1 lb), 3 pounds heart meat, 8 eggs (shell and all), 8 cloves of garlic, 3 large cooked yams, 1 head of romaine lettuce, alfalfa sprouts, 1 large tub of low sugar plain yogurt into a food processor and blend all together. Then mix with with lean ground hamburger at a ration of 65% hamburger and 35% mixture. I then separated into 1 lb freezer bags and froze until needed. I also cut up fresh chicken back / necks into 1 pound freezer bags and froze. He would then get a pound of the hamburger mixture in the morning and a pound of the chicken back / necks at night.
> 
> Does anyone see any problems with this formula???? Any help would be appreciated.


 I thought garlic is toxic to dogs.


----------



## lola2010

when feeding raw do you have to use supplements ? or can you strictly do just meat?


----------



## WirelessG

My vet recommended a vitamin supplement. I use Cosequin advanced.


----------



## Sealdoc

I was thinking about getting into RAW with my pup who just turned 5 months old. We actually have a few butchers that sell pre-made raw mixes and a raw dog food business here in Arizona. All their food is ground. Which I like, it makes feed really simple. I know for the "puritans" grinding may be a complete faux paw, but I have an old #12 grinder that I used to use when I hunted back east. It has a 50 lb mixer bin attachment.

I was thinking of making a 30 lb mix I would do: 
2 bags of chicken quarters - 20lbs (65% is 19.5)
9 lbs of veggies
1.5 lbs of organs (chicken livers + I'll source other)
Plus yogurt and coconut oil etc

I was going to buy a hamburger patty maker that has this adjustable thickness and get it to where I can have it thick enough for exactly 1 or 2 patties per meal

Then supplement a few times a week some real RMB's for chewing.

This would allow me to pre make 2 weeks or more worth of food and have it prepared in away that would allow my wife to feed when i am away for a few days etc.

Does anyone see any issues with my plan? I would appreciate input.

Oh BTW, I am currently feeding Natures Variety Instinct Raw Chicken for past 3 weeks and he is doing well and transition off of kibbel completely.

Thank you


----------



## StingRay

Sorry to dig up such an old thread, but the information here is pretty awesome!


----------



## garynjohna

*RAW Cooked?*

Quick question please... I am starting the RAW diet for my 8yo Male & 2yo Female. Some sites I have read has said to blend the veggies, others have said to feed them unblended. Which do I do? And do you mix the veggies & fruits together?
I was thinking of yogurt & fruits in the mornings & Meat w/veggies at night? Are 2 chicken legs (for the meat portion of dinner) for a 110lb male & 90lb female enough? Any suggestions? Thank you


----------



## Shade

garynjohna said:


> Quick question please... I am starting the RAW diet for my 8yo Male & 2yo Female. Some sites I have read has said to blend the veggies, others have said to feed them unblended. Which do I do? And do you mix the veggies & fruits together?
> I was thinking of yogurt & fruits in the mornings & Meat w/veggies at night? Are 2 chicken legs (for the meat portion of dinner) for a 110lb male & 90lb female enough? Any suggestions? Thank you


You need to research a proper Raw diet, veggies should only be a small portion and most of us don't feed them at all only meat. You need 2% of their body weight to maintain for most dogs which would equal 2.2 lbs daily for your male alone, he may need more or less depending on his exercise regime and metabolism. Two chicken legs is not going to be enough, not to mention you need to balance out your portions. Again, most do a 85% muscle meat, 10% bone, and 5% organ mix. 

I highly recommend Raw but only when it's properly balanced, otherwise your dog is missing out on nutrition it needs to survive and thrive. 

Read through the Raw section on the forum, research websites, and talk to people who feed it. What works for one may not work for another, but it's a start on the right path


----------



## garynjohna

*Thanks!*



Shade said:


> You need to research a proper Raw diet, veggies should only be a small portion and most of us don't feed them at all only meat. You need 2% of their body weight to maintain for most dogs which would equal 2.2 lbs daily for your male alone, he may need more or less depending on his exercise regime and metabolism. Two chicken legs is not going to be enough, not to mention you need to balance out your portions. Again, most do a 85% muscle meat, 10% bone, and 5% organ mix.
> 
> I highly recommend Raw but only when it's properly balanced, otherwise your dog is missing out on nutrition it needs to survive and thrive.
> 
> Read through the Raw section on the forum, research websites, and talk to people who feed it. What works for one may not work for another, but it's a start on the right path


Thanks so much! I have been reading about it & will continue to. I certainly do not want my dogs lacking any part of nutrition. I appreciate your response.


----------



## BMF_Racing

Thank you everyone for sharing all this great info. Moose started his raw diet today and so far so good. He had a Duck neck and Turkey neck this morning. He is normally such a picky eater, I have never seen him eat so fast as he did today lol! 

All the info is appreciated.


----------



## Saphire

BMF_Racing said:


> Thank you everyone for sharing all this great info. Moose started his raw diet today and so far so good. He had a Duck neck and Turkey neck this morning. He is normally such a picky eater, I have never seen him eat so fast as he did today lol!
> 
> All the info is appreciated.


Be careful with your bone content. Necks are very heavy in bone so 2 meals of necks in 1 day may cause constipation. It's good to read up on how to balance. Huge section here on the forum that is loaded with great info on raw feeding.


----------



## voodoolamb

Saphire said:


> Be careful with your bone content. Necks are very heavy in bone so 2 meals of necks in 1 day may cause constipation. It's good to read up on how to balance. Huge section here on the forum that is loaded with great info on raw feeding.


In addition to concerns about the higher bone content, necks also contain thyroid tissue which when fed too often or in too high amounts can cause dietary hyperthyroidism as evidenced by studies done in 2012, 2013 and 2014.

I know a lot of people feed necks frequently with no problem but I personally am not comfortable feeding them more then a few times a month. That's also why I do complete blood panels at each wellness visit.


----------



## BMF_Racing

Saphire said:


> Be careful with your bone content. Necks are very heavy in bone so 2 meals of necks in 1 day may cause constipation. It's good to read up on how to balance. Huge section here on the forum that is loaded with great info on raw feeding.


Thanks for the info, he had beef heart, ground turkey, and a lamb veggie mix for MM the PM meal. I was planning on feeding necks 2-3 times a week for RMB and chicken quarters/backs the other times. Are you guys saying 2-3 times is too much (was hoping to keep some variety of RMBs)? 

He's currently getting 1 lb meals 2x day (3 eggs a week and a TB yogurt each night not counted in that weight).


----------



## Saphire

I do think necks x 3 weekly is way to much. I feed once a week at most. I would have no issues with feeding carcass x 3-5 times a week.


----------



## BMF_Racing

voodoolamb said:


> In addition to concerns about the higher bone content, necks also contain thyroid tissue which when fed too often or in too high amounts can cause dietary hyperthyroidism as evidenced by studies done in 2012, 2013 and 2014.
> 
> I know a lot of people feed necks frequently with no problem but I personally am not comfortable feeding them more then a few times a month. That's also why I do complete blood panels at each wellness visit.



Thank you for the link, I will re-think the diet plan now as I was unaware.


----------



## BMF_Racing

Saphire said:


> I do think necks x 3 weekly is way to much. I feed once a week at most. I would have no issues with feeding carcass x 3-5 times a week.


When you say carcass, you mean like the chicken backs (sorry just want to make sure I understand)?


----------



## Saphire

I feed full chicken carcass, rib cage and all. Much bigger than the typical backs and mine have alot of meat with skin. Average just over 1lb


----------



## BMF_Racing

Saphire said:


> I feed full chicken carcass, rib cage and all. Much bigger than the typical backs and mine have alot of meat with skin. Average just over 1lb


Got it, thank you for the clarification.


----------



## Saphire

What are your bone-MM-OM ratios?


----------



## BMF_Racing

Saphire said:


> What are your bone-MM-OM ratios?


Based on all the reading I figured I'd start out at the below ratios and adjust accordingly as needed. Spool appears to be close at these levels right now but was going to see how the next couple weeks go to see how he doing.

45% Raw Meaty Bones
50% Muscle Meat
5% Organ Meat

thoughts?


----------



## lweber1215

Is anybody using green tripe as a staple MM? It doesn't seem like it, and I am curious to know if that has to do with the mineral ratios...


----------



## amburger16

What cuts of meat does everyone use for pork, beef, lamb and whatever else besides chicken and turkey? Currently feeding a commercial while I try to stock up to start doing it myself. Going to contact my butcher in the next few days to make a deal on an order. They provide freezer orders for awesome prices.. and I clearly don't need t bone steak, so I'm hoping we can make a decent deal


----------



## GSDKIMBER

Hello. Quick question. Kimber is on a raw diet and Im currently feeding her turkey as for her protein. Can i mix in a little beef tripe for a treat? Wasn't sure if i could mix different proteins in the same serving. Thank you


----------



## joeinca

Interested in learning about RAW diet.


----------



## Tulip

Just started feeding my yorkie raw, but I'll add to this thread!

8 yr old spayed Yorkshire Terrier
Low/Average activity level
She's had pancreatitis twice so I try to keep her on a low fat diet

First 9 days on raw:
PM: 3.2 oz chicken MM
A few small chicken bones mixed in with MM
Half of a chicken wing RMB around Day 5

Day 10:
PM: 2.4 oz chicken MM and 1.8 oz turkey MM
Chicken leg RMB

Days 11 to now (I think we're on day 13):
PM: 3.2 oz turkey MM
Half


----------



## Coco's mum

Lauri & The Gang said:


> Update
> 
> Mauser - 9 month old GSD, very active about 50% of the time
> AM - 16 ounces RMBs
> PM - 16 ounces MM & 1.5 ounce OM
> RMBs - chicken leg quarters/backs/necks, canned mackerel, turkey necks
> MM - beef and pork heart, ground turkey/beef
> OM - Bison mixture (liver, kidney and some MM)
> Misc - green tripe, eggs, oatmeal (if I forget to defrost something)
> Supplements - Salmon oil (Omega 3s)
> Limitations - None


I know this is an old post, but this is extremely helpful!


----------



## shooter8571

Hello all,

I have a Labradoodle (13 years old) who weighs about 55 lbs and GSD (4 years old) who weighs between 105-110:
I will be starting my dogs on the raw food diet Saturday night or Sunday morning, after doing my research my plan is to start with chicken, I'm thinking for the doodle:

For breakfast
1/2 chicken breast with bones 
1 tsp ACV
1/4 tsp garlic powder 
1-2 fish oil pills ( I'm thinking of just opening them on the food) and 
1/4 tsp probiotic 

For dinner
boneless 1/2 breast or boneless thigh or ground chicken 
1 egg for dinner


For our GSD:

For breakfast
Maybe some thighs with bones or breast with bones
1 tsp ACV
1/4 tsp garlic powder, 
2 fish oil pills for breakfast 

For dinner
boneless breast or some boneless thighs or ground chicken 
1 egg 
1/4 tsp garlic powder 
2 fish oil pills for dinner

I will try a chicken neck and back maybe a couple two or three times during this first week in place of their breakfast protein. I will also use alfalfa powder as soon as I can order some.

I will incorporate some fruits and veggies after a week of this diet (as long as it goes well) still using chicken as my protein, then after another week I will change the protein to either pork or beef.

If anyone sees any issues or has any recommendations please let me know, any and all advice is welcome.

Thanks
Jack


----------



## shooter8571

*update*

So today (Sunday we started our dogs on the raw diet.

In keeping with what I've been reading I'm going simple with just chicken.
The menu that I put in the previous post has been changed based on what they would and would not eat.

The doodle tried to eat some boneless skinless thigh meat but chewed it a couple of time and spit it out.
So of course panic set in and I was thinking she won't eat the raw diet so now what. But I fed her a neck and she ate eight of them and we gave her about 1-1.5 Tbs yogurt and 1 egg (no shell).

The GSD surprised me very much because she did eat 4 oz of boneless skinless thigh meat but only nibble and chewed on a whole leg. I was planning on giving her 2 legs and the thigh meat but she barely ate and of the one leg and none of the other. She seemed very picky and didn't seem to like chewing and breaking the bones (again which surprised me very much). She did eat 5 necks but that was it. I'm hoping she will come around and start chowing down on the legs (bone and all) soon.

My dinner plans for them now is:

GSD- Chicken necks and backs so she gets enough bone and more thigh meat or breast meat.

Labradoodle- 2-3 necks and chopped up thigh meat or breast meat

I am planning on buying a grinder to make things easier and help organize their packets of food.

I did not give e any ACV or probiotic or fish oil with breakfast I will try to incorporate them into dinner.

Jack


----------



## Coco's mum

shooter8571 said:


> So today (Sunday we started our dogs on the raw diet.
> 
> In keeping with what I've been reading I'm going simple with just chicken.
> The menu that I put in the previous post has been changed based on what they would and would not eat.
> 
> The doodle tried to eat some boneless skinless thigh meat but chewed it a couple of time and spit it out.
> So of course panic set in and I was thinking she won't eat the raw diet so now what. But I fed her a neck and she ate eight of them and we gave her about 1-1.5 Tbs yogurt and 1 egg (no shell).
> 
> The GSD surprised me very much because she did eat 4 oz of boneless skinless thigh meat but only nibble and chewed on a whole leg. I was planning on giving her 2 legs and the thigh meat but she barely ate and of the one leg and none of the other. She seemed very picky and didn't seem to like chewing and breaking the bones (again which surprised me very much). She did eat 5 necks but that was it. I'm hoping she will come around and start chowing down on the legs (bone and all) soon.
> 
> My dinner plans for them now is:
> 
> GSD- Chicken necks and backs so she gets enough bone and more thigh meat or breast meat.
> 
> Labradoodle- 2-3 necks and chopped up thigh meat or breast meat
> 
> I am planning on buying a grinder to make things easier and help organize their packets of food.
> 
> I did not give e any ACV or probiotic or fish oil with breakfast I will try to incorporate them into dinner.
> 
> Jack


Hi Jack,

I've just started too and I'm feeding a 10 month old GSD. I'm using the Prey model along with a bit of veg. 

I'm basing what I'm feeding her on a 70 adult dog... 
That works out to a total of 28 oz per day
22.4 oz muscle meat
2.8 oz bone
1.4 oz liver
1.4 oz other organ meats

Because I feed her twice a day, I divide those amounts in half. 
She's not doing well on liver yet so she's getting a teaspoon every two days (I know that's not enough but I've got to get her acclimated to it first, and over time it will balance out) and I'm giving her other organs every other day - she had a gizzard this morning. She also gets about an ounce and a half of Kefir twice a day. 

Necks are 75% bone, so several necks a day might be too much bone… I'd keep trying with the muscle meat, they might be a little confused at first but they'll get the hang of it.

* Please be aware I have only read a couple books, websites, and forums about raw feeding - so I'm no authority, I'm not a vet, I didn't even stay in a Holiday Inn last night. I'm just a beginner too. *


----------



## shooter8571

Coco's mum, thanks for the response. 

I hear ya about being a beginner, it's certainly a learning experience.

Starting tomorrow I am going to cut back on the neck bones for the doodle and add more meat.

This AM the doodle ate
4 neck bones 
4 oz thigh meat (no bone)
1 packet of probiotic
1 egg

The GSD ate
12 oz of chopped up chicken legs with bones
4 oz thigh meat (no bone)
1 1/4 packet probiotics
1 egg


I found a meat market near my work and they will grind up anything you want (or at least their web site says so), my plan is to grind up legs and buy ground up breast or boneless thighs. I'm stopping there after work to day. I thought I bought liver but I couldn't find any in my fridge so I will pick up some today and incorporate about 1/4 tsp into their dinner tonight.
I will try to keep everyone posted or at least up date once in a while.


----------



## Beauxrowdy17

*Raw Food*

Interested in learning about the RAW food diet. How does it align price wise with the top line of dog kibble? I am paying 56 dollars for 30 lb bag of Taste of the Wild. 

If this Raw food ends up being less expensive AND better for the dog in the long run... I'm going to look into it. 

Just a beginner on this site!


----------

