# What would you have done?



## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

I just took my 6.5 month old to the dog park for some running and some fun.

As soon as we were trying to open the gate to get into the park we were greeted by 2 full grown dogs, a GSD and a GSD mix and a pitbull mix puppy.

The pitbull puppy kept jumping on me so I turned my back and ignored it and looked at the owner as to why she was ignoring her dogs bad behavior. Well that was hardly the problem.

Right behind me an American Bulldog puppy came in and the pitbull mix puppy would not leave that dog alone and kept grabbing that puppy by the throat. Mind you these 2 dogs were both about 5 months old. The owner of the American Bulldog was doing everything he could as was I to pull the pitbull off. The owner of the pitbull sat on the bench smiling and watching this. I called her 3x to come over and get her dog. She came at last and brought him to the bench and held him. 

After a bit she let him loose again and then he went after another dog that came in, a 4 month old german shepherd mix. I know that dog well and helped his owner get the pitbull off AGAIN. After asking the owner for help 3x again she came and took him and held him once again.

Needless to say a few minutes later he had my dog by the throat and would not let go. It took me and another to pull him off and she finally came to get him I was furious, and told her she needs to leash and discipline her dog and maybe leave the park. She smiled at me like I was crazy and it was all a joke.

She seemed to love her dog and was not abusing it in anyway, but that dog is too aggressive and is a pitbull, they latch on , they don't want to let go.

I ended up calling the police. The owner of the fully grown GSD and GSD mix said I overreacted and that was puppy play and that his dogs play like that with each other. His dogs outweighed the pitbull puppy by a good 30 pound each and they were a lot taller, so the pup did not go after his dogs.

Did I overreact?  I would like some feedback.


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## paulag1955 (Jun 29, 2010)

I would have just left after the second incident because I HATE confrontations.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I wasn't there. By what you wrote it sounds like you are a bit biased against pit bulls and are a little unused to puppy play. I think it is great that the pit bull owner has her dog out and about young, and is socializing it to other dogs. But today, you came in and did not want her dog to play with yours, so you told her to corral her dog. 

Again, I am not a fan of dog parks, and I have NEVER seen an aggressive five month old puppy. It sounds like normal puppy play and no one else's human was overly concerned. If I did not want my dog a part of that scene, I would have left.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

I hate confrontations too, and I did leave. 

There were 3 owners that had a problem with her dog, not just me.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

I actually think Pitbulls can be very nice dogs. I pet many of them at the park. In this case I think the puppy needed to learn some manners when the owners of 2 other dogs and myself did not like the pitbull holding onto the throat of their dogs.


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## paulag1955 (Jun 29, 2010)

I guess I meant I would have just left without calling the police.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Yeah, it just last week another pitbull drew blood on another dog and another pitbull before that one scarred the face of a Belgian by attacking it for no reason.


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## paulag1955 (Jun 29, 2010)

I would stop going to that dog park.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

That may have to happen. The pitbulls usually are there in the evenings and not in the mornings. I guess I will have to limit the after 5pm visits. 

I usually leave if there are more than 2 pitbulls or more in the park at any given time as they do tend to play rough even if they don't mean to.


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## tsteves (Jun 7, 2011)

As I was not there it would be hard to speculate. But as an owner of a dog that people feel as an aggressive dog (though Kona is only a puppy) I am constantly watching her interact with other dogs and if I feel it is more than just “puppy play” I break up and allow the pups to calm down. I am almost never sitting down when my dog is playing with another dog and very watchful over what is happening, both for my dogs safety as well as the other dog. I do not want to be “that owner” that just sits and lets their dog roam free causing mayhem while at the park. At the park we go to there are a few, what I will use the word loosely, “owners” that will just let their dogs roam and not pay attention (reading a book while you have two overly rowdy dogs) to what is happening and who or what their dogs are getting into. This park (West Jordan for those in Utah) is a great park and probably 98% of the people and dogs that attend are fanatic with no issues but it is the other 2% that ruin everything. 
But going back to your situation I am not sure I would have called the cops I would have either just left the park and come some other time or luckily with the park we go to just go to another part that is fenced off to interact with my dog in a more controlled area.


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## Dlilly (May 24, 2011)

I hate confrontations too, but, I think I would say something. 

I think your question is answered, but I'm curious, was your dog yelping? If she did, what did the other dogs do when she did?

When I go to the dog park, I always feel odd standing up watching my dog play while other owners are sitting down. :crazy:


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

have to be there to see it. dogs grab each other
by the throat, back off the neck, the side of the neck
and anywhere else they want during play. two people there
thought you overeacted so maybe you did. calling the police
on someone in a dog park because you don't like
or maybe understand how dogs play weel that
could be a bit much. why didn't you leave the dog park???


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

don't feel odd because you take care of your dog.
i take my dog to a dog park and i rarely sit down.

if there's only a couple of dogs there i might sit down.


Dlilly said:


> I hate confrontations too, but, I think I would say something.
> 
> I think your question is answered, but I'm curious, was your dog yelping? If she did, what did the other dogs do when she did?
> 
> When I go to the dog park, I always feel odd standing up watching my dog play while other owners are sitting down. :crazy:


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I think I would be a little more relaxed if the other owners were relaxed and not hovering over their dogs while playing. I mean, dogs take a lot of cues from us. If we are nervous, we can add tension into a situation where it did not exist. 

There is nothing wrong with being protective of your dog, and that is probably why most of us just do not go to dog parks. You never know when someone will come with a truly aggressive dog and make it a really bad scene. Instead of a dog park why not sign up for dog classes, that is socializing your dog to situations where there are people and their dogs in a controlled environment.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Really would depend on what your dog did when the other puppy latched on. if he wasn't upset then there was no reason for you to be esp. since they were just little puppies. Older dogs would be much more likely to escalate into a fight.

Don't forget, GSD's also play very rough sometimes and a lot of folks don't like them (and fear them as well).

That said, i don't like dog parks in general - too many not so nice owners and dogs you can run into.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Well, look at the bright side, you did not pull out your side arm and shoot the pit bull puppy. Now _that_ would be over-reacting, not that it hasn't happened before. I really hope that no other shepherd owner does something that crazy, because we're going to get a name for ourselves. Yeah, yeah I know, you cannot tarnish the whole group because of the actions of one or two. But they do it to pit bulls and pit bull owners all the time. And while I don't have a dog in that fight, it is true, that GSDs have a pretty lousy reputation too.


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## valreegrl (Nov 11, 2009)

Calling the police was a bit over the top. Each dog you mentioned was a puppy, non-threatening I am sure. 

In puppy play you need to watch the language of the play. If both puppies are practicing pinning each other, taking turns being on top, than that is great play. If one puppy seems to be dominating the other, allow it for a moment then step in and easily separate them in a friendly manner. If they decide to play again than all is well and watch again for over the top behavior.

I am not a fan of dog parks in general, but if one insists on utilizing that environment than you would need to be prepared to leave if the scenario is not what you wish. 

Did the police actually show up? I would be surprised if they were not a little on the angry side as they really wasted their time on puppies when there is most likely more pressing issues they could have been dealing with.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

I think the point here is that three people had a problem with the pup, the woman would not respond to the concerns of these people. At that time, I would consider calling whoever was in charge of the dog park. If I'd had enough foresight, I would leave before it became an issue or take a look around and not enter. 
But that is hypothetical because I wasn't there.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I always figure the more the cops are called to something, the better the chance the local government will choose to close it down. Our town sold the East Dam, a spot that many people went to fish, etc, because it cost too much to police it. I think people who use dog parks should pick up their litter, their dog's droppings, use their own baggies (not go over there and steal all the baggies), and take care of the park, because the more it costs the government, the more likely it will get scrapped as a project that did not work.


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## PaddyD (Jul 22, 2010)

I wasn't there either. I find it unusual that a pit bull pup was holding onto your dog's throat. If any size pit bull was holding onto my dog's throat it would find itself flying across the dog park, owner-be-darned. Pit bulls (and other breeds) often go for the neck but higher up and that is part of play. If I go to a dog park and a dog is harassing mine to a point that I don't like I just leave. In the past I have tried the scream-at-the-owner approach or try-to-reason-with-the-owner approach and they are usually idiots when it come to their precious pup ........ so I just leave.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

I agree with what you are saying. I always bring my own bags and clean up after my dog.
It's just that I live in an area where pit bulls are prevalent and even though the owners are basically living in surburbia, the owners see them as a status symbol to their urban coolness.
I don't have a problem with the dogs, and I don't have a problem with the owners if they are on top of their dogs behavior and want to teach them manners. But if you sit there with a smile on your face because you think your dog is one upping another breed...I have a problem.

Pitbulls are the top dogs when it comes to athleticism compared to many other breeds, but proper protocol dictates manners. You don't let your dog beat the crap out of another dog...period.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Thank You, exactly. Not just my dog, but 2 others before it that I had to help pull off. I even petted the little guy to get him to calm down, but at the end of the day...that dog needs to learn that it is not correct to fight in that aggressive manner.

My dog outweighs a lot of dogs already, she is big, but I don't let her get mean ...ever. I leash her, tell her no and wait for a new energy from her if I think she may be getting out of hand.


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## PaddyD (Jul 22, 2010)

selzer said:


> I always figure the more the cops are called to something, the better the chance the local government will choose to close it down. Our town sold the East Dam, a spot that many people went to fish, etc, because it cost too much to police it. I think people who use dog parks should pick up their litter, their dog's droppings, use their own baggies (not go over there and steal all the baggies), and take care of the park, because the more it costs the government, the more likely it will get scrapped as a project that did not work.


So true. Now if I could just get Selzer to speak to all of the irresponsible idiots in MY dog park ............


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

This was beyond puppy play. I have been going to this park for months with my dog. This was grabbing the throat with 2 adults separating the dogs and no letting go with the owner smiling thinking her dog was the alpha.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Right...that is what I did.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

GSD's are not as over the top as what I have witnessed over several months at this park. 
I know some people will not even go there due to the prevalence of pit bulls at certain times of the day.

The people that own the GSD's are all about protocol and manners, a bit different than your average pitbull owner at my park.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Stella's Mom said:


> This was beyond puppy play. I have been going to this park for months with my dog. This was grabbing the throat with 2 adults separating the dogs and no letting go with the owner smiling thinking her dog was the alpha.


Since I have had zero experience with aggressive five month old puppies, I have no advice.


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## Rodeo. (Feb 25, 2011)

Different breeds play differently. I wasn't there, I didn't see a thing so I can't make a judgement call. My 8 month old girl weighs 40 pounds, my friends (oversized) Aussie weighs about 60... when they play? It can look pretty rough. His favorite moves are to swing his butt at her or grab at her throat. He doesn't ever hurt her but it looks pretty rough. 

It sounds like you have seen some uncontrolled pitties and that's sad. For a breed so misunderstood, I wish more people did something to fight the bad image. If you aren't going to train your dog, don't get a pit bull breed. Just my opinion. They were bred to fight, as much as I love them, there is no denying that. But with proper training and socialization most of them are perfectly fine interacting with other dogs. Rodeo was bit by a pit once at the park. I don't really go there very often because there are too many people there who can't control their dogs. He didn't draw any blood or leave a mark at all, and I could tell very easily that the guy was only there to show off his "big bad pit". I really can't stand people like that.


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## Rodeo. (Feb 25, 2011)

Stella's Mom said:


> This was beyond puppy play. I have been going to this park for months with my dog. This was grabbing the throat with 2 adults separating the dogs and no letting go with the owner smiling thinking her dog was the alpha.



THIS right here says that she is one of the people who should NOT own a pittie. The kind of people that are going to help get the breed banned all across the USA.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Exactly...you know what I am talking about when it comes to certain owners basically seeing who has the bigger you know what when it comes to the dog.


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## PaddyD (Jul 22, 2010)

Pitbulls CAN be great dogs. Some by nature, some through training. Unfortunately, the average IQ of most pit bull owners is about the melting temperature of ice.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

So sorry this happened, definately not fun. Confrontation probably will not 'fix' the offending dog owner either. Human beans are stubborn in their habits. 

I've witnessed a bit too much craziness (plus heard enough bad stories like yours) at off leash areas in dog parks so I'm in the don't go there category.


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## dazedtrucker (May 2, 2011)

I'm really starting to appreciate the dog park here. In 3 weeks, I've only seen 2 other dogs there. And a nice big sign on the gate: NO PIT BULLS.  Quite peaceful.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Wow no pitbulls at a dog park?

I do get what you are saying, but will the next one on the sign be NO German Shepherds? 

We just had a community pass breed specific legislation and German Shepherds were on the list, too. 






dazedtrucker said:


> I'm really starting to appreciate the dog park here. In 3 weeks, I've only seen 2 other dogs there. And a nice big sign on the gate: NO PIT BULLS.  Quite peaceful.


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## Gracie's My Girl (May 27, 2011)

Yesterday, in puppy class, the trainer allowed the puppies to play together. It was an eye opening experience for me. When dogs play, they are having a blast, but it is rough. It is not gentle. 

I imagine that if you do not have experience watching puppies playing together, you can get the wrong impression quickly. I know I did until I was corrected. I can't imagine that the Pit Bull puppy was being aggressive. However, it would have been nice if the puppy's owner had noticed that the play was bothering you and stepped in to end it. I would have been annoyed by the owner's unresponsiveness too.


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## Rodeo. (Feb 25, 2011)

dazedtrucker said:


> I'm really starting to appreciate the dog park here. In 3 weeks, I've only seen 2 other dogs there. And a nice big sign on the gate: NO PIT BULLS.  Quite peaceful.


That's absolutely DISGUSTING. 

You've only seen two other dogs there, that's why it's peaceful. The only dog I've had any real problem with at the dog park here was an over weight lab. The little dogs are the worst but lucky for us, they have all been too small to cause much of a problem. But a no pit bull sign? That makes me sick. :thumbsdown:


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## WarrantsWifey (Dec 18, 2010)

The pit bull was playing, at least that is what you portrayed it to be, it sounds like you have a problem with pits to me.... Sorry. I have no problem with confrontation.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

I would NOT go to a park that said no pit bulls. Ever. YOUR dog is JUST as dangerous as any other. German Shepherds are a HIGHLY dangerous breed. If you disagree, you're an idiot and you need to look in your dogs mouth again. Maybe take a look at some of the deadly maulings caused by our breed. It's not the dogs, it's the people. Regardless of breed. You can say "oh well it's genetics", yeah well did we humans not create every breed by manually selecting the dogs we put together to gain certain characteristics? Again, WE the PEOPLE are the PROBLEM. Not to mention one of our own breeds traits is to be...*gasp* ALOOF!!! Your dog isn't suppose to be out going and friendly like say a Golden Retriever.

And it's sad that the police would be called on puppy because it's a Pit Bull. But I'm sure if you saw my little Pomeranian/Sheltie/Whatever the **** Eevee is doing the same thing (Which she does, sometimes I DO have to pull her off other dogs physically. It's a work in progress. Though that's why I don't take her around dogs I don't know to play. It's not aggression, it's just that she's PLAYING and she's a PUPPY so she has to LEARN how to CONTROL HER BITE!!) that people would have left peacefully, maybe a little annoyed, but without a call to the cops I'm sure.

I'm on two sides of the "wrong" dogs. I have little dogs so they're automatically labeled "ankle biters". I've owned and fostered MANY Pit Bulls in the past (They're one of my favorite breeds and I have a huge place in my heart for them!) and they're automatically labeled killers. I wish people would get to know my dogs and see the training I put into them before they automatically assume things about them. It hurts no less than when someone crosses the street when you're out walking your GSD or whatever and tells the person they're with "that dog is going to hurt someone, kill someone, needs to be on a muzzle, is aggressive, ect ect ect" just because of how your dog looks and what breed it is. Which sadly, I often came across with Chance too.  Not to mention the fact NOBODY would rent to me because they were terrified of my 22in, 50lb dog because he looked a certain way. I even had vet records labeling him as a purebred Australian Kelpie but was turned away because he "looks like a small German Shepherd".

People ruin everything. Stupid people shouldn't own dogs, regardless of breed. It just so happens that some breeds are more sought out by the more stupid variety of people. Doesn't make all the dogs bad! Did you know that Boston Terriers were bred to fight? So why are we allowing them into parks any faster than a Pit Bull if we're basing our bans JUST on history of the general breed and not by the individual dog?


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## Rodeo. (Feb 25, 2011)

ChancetheGSD said:


> I would NOT go to a park that said no pit bulls. Ever. YOUR dog is JUST as dangerous as any other. German Shepherds are a HIGHLY dangerous breed. If you disagree, you're an idiot and you need to look in your dogs mouth again. Maybe take a look at some of the deadly maulings caused by our breed. It's not the dogs, it's the people. Regardless of breed. You can say "oh well it's genetics", yeah well did we humans not create every breed by manually selecting the dogs we put together to gain certain characteristics? Again, WE the PEOPLE are the PROBLEM. Not to mention one of our own breeds traits is to be...*gasp* ALOOF!!! Your dog isn't suppose to be out going and friendly like say a Golden Retriever.
> 
> And it's sad that the police would be called on puppy because it's a Pit Bull. But I'm sure if you saw my little Pomeranian/Sheltie/Whatever the **** Eevee is doing the same thing (Which she does, sometimes I DO have to pull her off other dogs physically. It's a work in progress. Though that's why I don't take her around dogs I don't know to play. It's not aggression, it's just that she's PLAYING and she's a PUPPY so she has to LEARN how to CONTROL HER BITE!!) that people would have left peacefully, maybe a little annoyed, but without a call to the cops I'm sure.
> 
> ...


This. Post. Is. Perfect.


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## Mom2Shaman (Jun 17, 2011)

I don't do dog parks. I live in an area where people like their dog (any breed) to beat up others and encourage it. We do other activities.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Yes my dog was yelping and the 2 other dogs that got pinned down by this dog and held by the throat were yelping.

My dog and at least one of the other dogs in question play together all the time. They wrestle around and it can look rough. I am not referring to regular puppy play here. This was latch onto the throat and not let go with 2 adults pulling the dogs apart.

The other person who thought it may have been over the top did not have his 2 dogs who weighed 80 and 100 plus pounds respectively pinned down and throat latched onto. So as the saying goes....He did not have a dog in the fight.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

We will go to the park again this morning and Stella will play with her usual gang. If an aggressive dog shows up there again today we will leave.


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## valreegrl (Nov 11, 2009)

I currently have a bumper magnet, it reads "Ban STUPID people NOT dogs". 

I get the your dog yelped, and possibly another as well, but thinking that this wasn't play due to that is ludicrous. Have you seen 2 Shepherds play? They immediately go for the throat and pin each other down to the ground. Many a times my two have yelped because the play has escalated which is where the HUMAN steps in and controls the situation. 

Just because the HUMAN in this instance didn't step in properly, doesn't mean it's a great day when the dog park sign read NO PITBULLS! 

Here is an eye opener for everyone: A town over is currently trying to enact a muzzle law for all bully's and bully mixes. I have been to all of these meetings and demanded they state their plan on how they will tell what is or is not a bully. They couldn't, so they have started to amend the law to muzzle all dogs over 25 pounds! Imagine your GSD having to wear a muzzle in your town when off your property! 
That is what BSL does and it is ridiculous. 

And this thread is why it happens, especially calling the police about a bully puppy!


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

Pit Bull Rescue Central


> PBRC does not recommend dog parks or dog daycares. There are a number of reasons why: (see link)


Pet Pit Bull - Breed Information

Pit Bulls & Dog Parks

Our Pack Pit Bull Rescue

http://www.badrap.org/rescue/dogpark.html

http://www.nhpbr.org/dog_parks.html

I would defer to the breed experts.


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## kiya (May 3, 2010)

I don't go to dog parks. When I take Lakota to visit her brother or my friends dog I am always watching the dogs. Everyone always says sit down relax, they'll be fine. Thats ok I feel better watching them. I just couldn't imagine letting my dog loose in a "pack" of dogs that I don't know. As my trainer says "you just don't know". 
I don't particularly like pitt bulls, I have met a few very friendly ones but never more than a breif meeting. So I can't really judge them I have never owned one or had a long enough experience with one. I agree 100% its the people and not the dogs fault. 
I have 3 dogs, and let me tell you individually they are fine, put them together and you definately see that pack mentality come right out.
BSL scares me, Shepherds, Dobies, Rotties they are all right up there. So every time I hear bans on Pitt's aka Bully Breed's I cringe.
If anyone wants more info on the fights with BSL this website usually publishes all current events K9BSL.COM - K9BSL.COM ~ Home


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Hey...seriously, of course I have seen 2 Shepherds play. My dog plays at the park all the time. This was not an instance of puppy play. Pitbulls naturally go for the throat and do not let go. I don't want to see my dog in distress as did the other owners not want their dogs pinned and their throats in a vise grip.

Puppy or no puppy, the owner is responsible for teaching their dog what is and is not acceptable. What happens when that dog is fully grown and they have never been corrected for that behavior???


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

Your links acknowledge how to raise a pit bull correctly. Piitties are beautiful and great athletes, and there are good owners and not. This morning a guy came in with a well behaved pitbull and was watching to make sure that his dog was playing nice with others.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> Pit Bull Rescue Central
> Pet Pit Bull - Breed Information
> 
> Pit Bulls & Dog Parks
> ...


Your links are very informative and enlightening.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Stella's Mom said:


> Yes my dog was yelping and the 2 other dogs that got pinned down by this dog and held by the throat were yelping.
> 
> My dog and at least one of the other dogs in question play together all the time. They wrestle around and it can look rough. I am not referring to regular puppy play here. This was latch onto the throat and not let go with 2 adults pulling the dogs apart.
> 
> The other person who thought it may have been over the top did not have his 2 dogs who weighed 80 and 100 plus pounds respectively pinned down and throat latched onto. So as the saying goes....He did not have a dog in the fight.


 
Then you were fully justified in protecting your puppy!


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## fuzzybunny (Apr 29, 2011)

For me personally I wouldn't have called the cops but I certainly think you're justified in being concerned and intervening. If another dog caused my dog distress and made him yelp I would be intervening immediately. It's my job to protect my dog. I would have either left the park or found another area away from that dog if it was big enough.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Her puppy is a month and a half older and larger than the pitt. But whatever. If you are so fired up sure you did not over-react, why ask? Other people who were there and witnessed this said you did, from your initial post, you did. You did not initially post that people came up to you and said "thanks." 

You have a thing against pits or people in your neighborhood or both. 

Let's see, if you are in the dog park playing with your 6.5 month old GSD, and someone comes in with a Scottie puppy, and your dog runs toward it to say "hi" and the scottie owner immediately gets defensive calling over to you to get your beast, before you are over there, the dogs start playing, and you think it is ok, it is just play, and she pulls your dog away from hers and then calls the cops on you -- that's ok??? You should leave because your dog is large and a mean breed and a potential killer??? When you were doing fine, and everyone was having a good time. But because some over-protective scottie owner comes, the cops are called and you should leave the park. 

Well bully for you. Now a five month old puppy is pinning dogs on the ground going for their throats. Now the dogs are yelping too. Next post there will be a break stick involved. Their vise-like grip, well I heard that GSDs have MORE power in their jaws. But who cares. Another rotten pit bull dog is a big bad villian. A puppy that still might have its puppy-license -- terror in the streets! 

And we are all just assuming that the owner of the pittie is sitting back there proud of her dog being the baddest. See we can believe that is what she is thinking, because that is the only reason to have one of those dogs, ya know. Well unless you are actually fighting them, but we all know that _these people_ get these dogs because they want to look _bad. _

If your dog is anything else, it can act like a puppy at five months old, but a pit bull puppy should be perfectly behaved and have manners before it can walk or someone is going to call the cops. I am really shocked this is coming out of a board of shepherd owners. 

Let's muzzle everything above 25 pounds, indeed!

Ya know when you have a bouncy, pulling, barky 12 month old GSD pup, it is hard to find people willing to subject their toddlers and children so you can socialize the dog. I know Cujo knocked my sister's babies over a couple of times, herded them away from my mother, barked at them, and even put his giant paw on Elena holding her down, he was two, t hey were ten months old and a year old in the beginning. But she kept on bringing them back, and he learned how to be gentle with the babies. Now those girls are his best buddies, and my little sister's one year old toddles around the house with him. I wonder how pit bull dog owners manage to socialize their puppies to small children and dogs without having the cops called.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

No we are not assuming that the owner is sitting back. The owner was sitting back even though myself and 2 other dog owners asked her to get her dog off their dogs too.

As for myself, I watch my dog carefully. Her main game is to run ,play fetch and keep away. She is NOT dog aggressive. She is submissive and does her best to let the other dog know she is not threat.


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## Rodeo. (Feb 25, 2011)

selzer said:


> *If your dog is anything else, it can act like a puppy at five months old, but a pit bull puppy should be perfectly behaved and have manners before it can walk or someone is going to call the cops.*


I get your point in this, really I do. But it's true. Is it fair? No. But bully breeds come under so much fire that no, they cannot be out in public acting like normal 5 month old puppies. If a lab puppy jumps on a passerby, it might be annoying but eh, it's a pup. People don't view the EXACT same behavior the same when it's a pit bull. That's just the way it is. So when the lab is the spastic out of control dog and the pit bull of the same age is a model citizen... people will start to notice.

Oh.. and some of us do socialize with the pitties


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

BSL scares anyone with a brain!!!!!! GSDs are not immune to it - or being lumped into what ever facade is erected by PETA to 'protect' pets....

I will say, that when you consider the purpose of the breed, pit bulls do alarm me....too many have made unprovoked attacks on kids and other dogs, too many stupid owners who do not understand what genetics mean...I know...but still, I just don't care for them - even though I will defend people's rights to have them.

Bottom line - keep your dog out of the dog park if you don't like who is there. I will not take mine to a dog park, and even in my contract state that pups are NOT to go to dog parks. Least problematic - dog picks up worms, worst case scenario - Some stupid person could claim foul and the dog would end up seized or dead. 

Guess I have a pretty strong opinion on this....based on experience of friends and puppy owners (who took pups to park, against my advice!, and got really sick and one almost died!)

Lee


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

Sadly any dog park story is a "you had to be there" story. I do think that calling the cops was way over the top and I'd be surprised if they even showed up. Just because a dog makes your dog yelp isn't any reason to get the police involved, it will just get your park shut down over useless phone calls to the police. I don't believe there is a ticket for "made other person's dog yelp."

There is nothing you can do about other people's aggressive dogs or the way they treat them. Everyone has a different idea of how dogs play and if you don't like it then its up to you to remove your dog from that situation.

I, like Selzer, have a very hard time believing a 5 month old puppy can make another dog yelp with a vice-like grip. When my GSD was 5 months old he played with pits older then him and smaller then him, and even as klutzy as he was they could never pin him down. He would wrestle with puppies (including pits) his age and never once did I see him pin one down for a prolonged period of time.

Don't take this the wrong way but if you were to call the cops on me because my dog was playing rough it wouldn't teach me anything and just label you as the person that calls the cops at every small situation. And you will soon realize how huge "dog park politics" are and you don't want any kinds of labels. You'd rather have the person with that pit bull labled as a non caring one with an aggressive dog and just stay out of the whole situtation.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

selzer said:


> Her puppy is a month and a half older and larger than the pitt. But whatever. If you are so fired up sure you did not over-react, why ask? Other people who were there and witnessed this said you did, from your initial post, you did. You did not initially post that people came up to you and said "thanks."
> 
> You have a thing against pits or people in your neighborhood or both.
> 
> ...


Wow!


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## wyominggrandma (Jan 2, 2011)

OP, its just sad that you keep saying it was a Pit bull and naturally went for the throat. Come on, all dogs play that way.
I have a 126 lb Bernese Mountain dog who is 22 months old and my GSD who is 10 months old. the berner is as dumb as a rock and love to play and he would grab the GSD by the throat. The GSd who is about 60 lbs grabs the Berner by the throat, they growl, wrestle and throw each other around. Its called playtime. When the berner was 5 months old he already weighed 60 lbs and could knock me over. He still played rough.... would you have called the cops on me? 
Just because its a Pit Bull doesn't mean it "naturally goes for the throat". That is silly. 
I admit, some Pits make me nervous. But we have Pits come in the clinic all the time and as yet have never met a nasty one. Yet, my neighbor's lab tries to attack my GSD through our fence, she is vicious and nasty. 
You are afraid of Pits and whether the owner was not paying attention or whatever happened, you should not have called the cops. You should have left with your dog. the other owners obviously did not leave, so must not have had a problem. Sounds like you think the park should only allow dogs you approve of how they play.
That is not how it works, its a PUBLIC park. You were wrong.


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

wyominggrandma said:


> OP, its just sad that you keep saying it was a Pit bull and naturally went for the throat. *Come on, all dogs play that way.*
> I have a 126 lb Bernese Mountain dog who is 22 months old and my GSD who is 10 months old. the berner is as dumb as a rock and love to play and he would grab the GSD by the throat. The GSd who is about 60 lbs grabs the Berner by the throat, they growl, wrestle and throw each other around. Its called playtime. When the berner was 5 months old he already weighed 60 lbs and could knock me over. He still played rough.... would you have called the cops on me?
> Just because its a Pit Bull doesn't mean it "naturally goes for the throat". That is silly.
> I admit, some Pits make me nervous. But we have Pits come in the clinic all the time and as yet have never met a nasty one. Yet, my neighbor's lab tries to attack my GSD through our fence, she is vicious and nasty.
> ...



Bold A: I have NEVER seen any puppies HOLD onto another dogs throat and REFUSE to let go. Even if they do bite/nip.grab in that area its never a hold you down i will NOT let go even if I have three people pulling me off.

HOW can anyone miss that? I am sorry but the fact that the owner did NOTHING and thought it was funny tells me that the owner does not care what the dog does, which is going to end up being really bad for the dog in the end. And it will be all the owners fault.

Bold B: It sounds like you think a dog owner should not control their dog in public. You are wrong.



To the OP: While I would not have called the police, I would have had a few choice words about her controlling her dog. Hindsight is 20/20, next time I would leave and go at different times, hopefully when that person is not there.


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## vomlittlehaus (Aug 24, 2010)

I would not have called the police. I would have just left. You cant fix stupid. After you realized you had an irresponsible owner there (doesnt matter the breed), you should have left. I would not have put my dog in harms way by staying. At dog shows, if I am near a person that allows their dog to misbehave, I move away. I dont put my dog in harms way. I am the responsible one, I have to look out for my dog. I dont put my dog in harms way.

Who governs the dog park? What are the dog park rules? Who enforces these rules? That is who I would be contacting. If the answer to the questions is no one. I would not put my dog in harms way by going there.

We have a real nice dog facility nearby, pay for play time. The play time is overseen by dog trainers. The dog trainer rules and if you are asked to leave, you leave. It is a very nice place for the pups to socialize. Play time is divided by ages too at this place, you cant do that a the local dog park, unless you have multiple areas.


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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

I think you overreacted. Stupid people are at dogs parks all the time. If you don't like them, don't go. Pit bulls don't even belong in dog parks so it's sad to hear that you're having so many issues there with them. It's more sad to hear that despite them, you're putting your dog in danger by taking her. 

That said, I highly doubt that the puppy was trying to hurt any of the dogs there if none of the dogs tried telling him off. If dogs play with a dog and the other dog doesn't like it, they growl or snap. Then the dog backs off or there's a dog fight. None of that happened, which makes me think either the puppy wasn't hurting anyone, or the other dogs there don't know how to speak dog and definitely shouldn't be in a dog park!


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## wyominggrandma (Jan 2, 2011)

No, what I said was"*Sounds like you think the park should only allow dogs you approve of how they play.
That is not how it works, its a PUBLIC park. You were wrong*."
there is nothing in my comment that says "It sounds like you think a dog owner should not control their dog in public. You are wrong". 
 I said exactly what I meant to say, its a public park and therefore a person can't go around telling other people how to handleTHEIR dogs. If the OP doesn't like how the owner was handling her dog, then the OP should leave, not call the cops. Since it is a PUBLIC PARK, then it is not up to her to police others dogs, its up to whom ever takes care of the park.
 There was never any part of my comment that said: a dog owner should not control their dogs. PERIOD. 
 It is your responsibility to control your dog at a public place, whether a park, beach, whatever. Because it is public, then there are going to be idiots who just turn them loose to do whatever while they pay no attention. But, it is your choice at that point to either leave or deal with whatever happens. If you leave, you don't have to deal with the problem, if you choose to stay, then you still don't have the right to call the police because another persons puppy is playing too rough with yours. 
Like most everyone has said, maybe the pit puppy was grabbing on, but not because it was a pit bull, because it was a puppy that was being pulled away from its playtime. No training, no manners, no respect in the puppy's attitude, but not because it was a pit bull, because it was an unmannered brat. 
 I have been to public areas to let my dogs run and if there is a problem dog fighting or whatever, I make the decision to leave for my dogs sake. Not stay and argue with the idiot owners.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Dominant pup, submisive pup, spectator pup, sleeping pup:









Body language:









What da ya think, should I go for the throat?









Eyeball is better:









Stop! Stop! it tickles!!!









Going for the neck, pinning:









Pinned:









For the throat:









Joy and Matilda -- future dog park terrorists:








Actually they are two now, and they still play like this -- I met Matilda at dog class about two months ago, and the two of them were playing like she never left home. 

Mom needs a little mouth to mouth:









I love you Mamma!


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## dazedtrucker (May 2, 2011)

Rodeo. said:


> That's absolutely DISGUSTING.
> 
> You've only seen two other dogs there, that's why it's peaceful. The only dog I've had any real problem with at the dog park here was an over weight lab. The little dogs are the worst but lucky for us, they have all been too small to cause much of a problem. But a no pit bull sign? That makes me sick. :thumbsdown:


This whole  town is disgusting. There's little to no dog activities, or folks at the dog park. The pound is full of Chihuahuas. At least we get to go play ball and run around there (gotta count blessings in a place like this, though sometimes it's hard.) I'm not Pit fan, whether it be the people or the dogs there is so often problems with them, especially in an place like this. Difficult animals should not be handled by just anyone, especially in public. I've not heard about a "pack of GSDs running the streets attacking people". Guess if that starts happening I will have to stop taking my dog to the park too...oh well. We'll find something else to do, and I'll love him all the more. Luckily most of the idiots around here have Chihuahuas... smaller teeth.
I know I'm not winning the popularity contest here, but I'm honest.
I'll take a picture of the sign tonight just to annoy everyone  Then theres the fine print that lists every bully breed, and says "any dog resembling a pit is not allowed"


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

Great pictures Selzer. Love the headings.

The dog park thing is a no brainer to me. If there is anything about the dogs or their owners that is off, meaning I'm not comfortable with, then I leave. It's not worth it.


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## Scarlettsmom (Jul 12, 2011)

I will never take Scarlett to a dog park. Sorry, too many poorly behaved dogs with equally poorly behaved owners. We live in an area with loads of other places to go, so we take that route.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

Stella's Mom said:


> Hey...seriously, of course I have seen 2 Shepherds play. My dog plays at the park all the time. This was not an instance of puppy play. Pitbulls naturally go for the throat and do not let go. I don't want to see my dog in distress as did the other owners not want their dogs pinned and their throats in a vise grip.
> 
> Puppy or no puppy, the owner is responsible for teaching their dog what is and is not acceptable. What happens when that dog is fully grown and they have never been corrected for that behavior???


That's with ANY breed though. Would you have the balls to call the cops if this was a 5 month old GSD puppy? Encourage BSL to your OWN breed?

I'm sorry but I can't imagine even a 5 month old Pit Bull being able to take down an 80-100lb dog by themselves without any willingness on the adult dogs part. That sounds like submissive play. While Zoey is only 14lb, even when Eevee was only 2.5lb she was rolling her and grabbing her neck and NOT letting go. Even making her yelp! (Pits DO still have those sharp baby teeth just as any other breed!)

Speaking of bites, there was actually a study (I'd have to find it, I don't have it on hand) where they found a Rottweiler AND German Shepherd have a harder bite than a Pit Bull.

Too many dogs are mislabeled Pit Bulls to give an accurate statistic on how many REAL Pits actually cause bites/deaths each year. Even some English Labs have been mistaken by the average Joe as Pit Bulls and mixes because of their blocky heads and stocky build.

I agree that the OWNER of the dog was in the wrong but sadly, the dog will be the only one punished if anything ever goes wrong. The owner wont be jailed for allowing her dog to bite someone, but the dog would be. Pit Bulls don't get 3 strikes in most cases. 

Oh and also, here are some cases of German Shepherd attacks.

http://www.understand-a-bull.com/Articles/OtherBreedBites/2007/May/gsd0507.pdf

German shepherd Congo euthanized after another attack | NJ.com

German shepherd attacks toddler in Olney - Philly.com

http://sanantonio.injuryboard.com/m...rd-attacks-nine-year-old.aspx?googleid=233648

Unleashed German shepherd attacks 3 - UPI.com

German shepherds attack Ridgefield man and pup on stroll - NewsTimes

http://www.understand-a-bull.com/BSL/Flyers/AllDogsBite.pdf

Need I go on?

Your dog is NO less dangerous than any other. Even small breeds are a risk! Maybe not so much to ADULTS but to small children and other small animals. Shoot, those cute little weiner dogs known as Dachshunds are a good example. "Dachshund" is Badger Dog in German. Know why they named them Badger Dogs? Because they're bred to hunt and take down badgers. Would YOU take on a badger?! I sure as heck wouldn't, they're vicious. Imagine what it takes for something else to take on something that aggressive.

A *CAT* actually sent my mom to the hospital years ago after viciously attacking her. She was holding our small Siberian Husky puppy at my cousins house and the cat came literally flying out of the house and wouldn't get off of her or the dog. The puppy was ok but my mom still bears the scars over her body of where she was tore up to the point of needing several stitches due to large open wounds. They said it was the worst domestic cat attack they'd ever seen at the ER. Should we ban kitties too? I know my mom who used to LOVE cats has quite the fear of them now. This was a cat who'd been in my cousins family for many years and had never done anything like that.

All creatures can attack. Humans are a good example of that. When we compare the attacks/killings that come from all dog breeds combined to the those we people commit, I think we have more to fear in ourselves than we do our dogs. Saddest part of that is our dogs do it based on instinct, we have the capability of thinking of the consequences that come with murder.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

GSDolch said:


> Bold A: I have NEVER seen any puppies HOLD onto another dogs throat and REFUSE to let go. Even if they do bite/nip.grab in that area its never a hold you down i will NOT let go even if I have three people pulling me off.
> .



Singe grabs Rayden by the throat and "won't let go" all the time. They will actually walk across the yard that way. 
Here is a short video of the 2 playing. My neighbors are all convinced that one of them is going to die at any time.

Singe and Rayden - YouTube


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## Thru the Viewfinder (Aug 8, 2011)

A dog by any other name, still bites just the same. 

har har har

BSL sucks. If you support it for one breed, you might as well support it for your own GSD's. Its only a matter of time. 

BSL is racism for dogs. Any dog can bite. And lots of them do. Do you see poodles, poms, or beagles in the news? Perhaps not as much, but that's because they aren't a popular breed to target.

I've been bit by a pit completely unprovoked. Do I think that means all pits (or any bully breed) are menaces? ABSOLUTELY NOT.


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## rjThor (Mar 27, 2011)

I'm always standing around the dogs at the park, I follow Thor around, i've taken him since he was 8weeks, and some of the dogs do play rough with him, but now that he's bigger n heavier he tends to play just as rough with them, I did have a owner of a pitbull pup get upset with Thor, his pup wouldn't leave Thor alone, and Thor kept getting the best of his pup, I would separate them, and walk Thor away, his pup would follow us and would start again, and again the same results, for me pups will be pups, and as long as they are not getting over aggressive or start yelping they are learning from it. For me I wasn't their, but you might have over reacted by calling the police on a puppy, if it had been a full grown pit that was being over aggressive and kids were around, and the owner wouldn't take him out I might have, but not on a puppy. That's just my opinion, not saying you were wrong...I love the dog park for Thor.


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## spidermilk (Mar 18, 2010)

I just want to echo the people who say "We don't go to the dog park". 

Many people at the dog park do not know or care what is going on with their dog. Most people are not dog body language, behavior, and training experts! I'm not either! Not all dogs are appropriate for dog parks. My dog is certainly not. Even if he was, I would leave at the first sign of trouble. And by the first sign of trouble I mean things like more than 5 dogs, dogs rushing the gate when a new dog comes in, an overly excited dog coming in, a puppy who looks about 8 weeks old coming in, an incredibly fearful dog being pushed in, a person bringing a bunch of toys in, people letting their toddlers roam the park freely, etc.


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