# Schutzhund gone wrong?



## xsaysayx (Feb 14, 2010)

I know a couple of people who have told me about incidents in schH trials and whatnot where the dogs have actually attacked their handler or even a bystander. Have any of you ever heard of this happening, and if so, what was your experience?

It just popped up in my mind. I'm sick at home and bored so asking all the queer questions my mind comes up with


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## Josie/Zeus (Nov 6, 2000)

Some dogs do that out of frustration.


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## Anubis_Star (Jul 25, 2012)

I was at a doberman trial once where they had a large mounted camera on a tripod near the last blind to film everything. Saw a dog come around the blind and go after the camerman instead of the decoy. Decoy stepped out, vocalized and redirected the dog, and he ended up going into a good bark and hold and finished his run decently.

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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

At a trial, I've never seen a dog bite anyone but the helper/decoy.


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

I've seen a dog break a long down and go after the dog currently on the field. Rarely do the dogs go after other people...and I don't think any go after bystanders or you'd really hear it on the media. Usually they're behind fencing and the dogs (hopefully) have enough control to not jump a fence just go attack some random people.


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## Merciel (Apr 25, 2013)

Liesje said:


> At a trial, I've never seen a dog bite anyone but the helper/decoy.


Same, although I'll readily admit I've only been to a handful of trials (and one of those was the WUSV championships, where one would _hope_ the dogs would know better!).

My feeling is that by the time you're actually trialing and not training, you should be past the point of having the dog go up the leash. I've certainly heard plenty of stories about it happening in training, though.

re: dogs attacking other dogs, that happens in regular obedience too. Not often, but enough that it's a thing (and a reason that some competitors won't trial in AKC Open). One of the obedience discussion lists I'm on right now is blowing up because of an(other) incident between two dogs during the out-of-sight Stays in Open.


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

I've never seen a dog at a SchH trial, or any other trial, go after a person with the exception of a couple veering toward the judge on the long bite, but that was just a case of mistaken identity and the helper was able to get the dog refocused on the correct target without too much trouble. I have only ever heard of a couple of incidents over the many years I've been doing this, and they involved others involved in the trial (tracklayer, judge) not spectators. In both cases the dogs were banned from further competition.

Dogs going after the other dogs is more likely. It's still not a common occurrence, but if a dog is going to go after anything it's most likely going to be another dog, not a human. We've unfortunately had our dogs on the receiving end of that a couple of times. 

But as others mentioned, that isn't a SchH specific thing it's something that can and does happen in all venues where you have a bunch of unknown dogs together. I've seen it more in AKC events than I have in SchH, even though I've attended fewer AKC events. Greater number of dogs crammed into smaller space just raises the risks. One of the reasons I haven't finished Heidi's Open titles is a fear of the other dogs she'd be in the ring with during the stays. She's bombproof for the most part... but I don't know about the other dogs......


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Not into Schutzhund at all, but I was at an AKC trial when an Akita turned on its handler and bit her. My guess is you have unstable or nervous dogs/poor handling in any venue.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

There was a male at the 2010 NASS, someone I knew was a photographer...she was stalked by the dog that was supposed to be doing the 'courage' test. Handler had no clue or control of the situation and it went on forever. Of course that dog wasn't aggressive, but probably would have done a dirty cheap shot and bailed if the photographer got up and left the field. There was video on it, but it was set to private.


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## Packen (Sep 14, 2008)

I have seen a couple of judges get bit in trials. There are rules/penalties for this and the reason is to encourage better control of the dog and to discourage people from entering unstable animals.

But just as an FYI, there is a much higher chance of live bites in training as compared to trials.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I saw a judge get pee'd on at a BH a pittie left the group after the leash was removed, went over to the judge and lifted his leg...Judge wanted to kick that dog so bad, nice self control!


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## LPLIV (Oct 8, 2013)

Not sure my two cents worth really means a lot because I have only been working my dogs for a little over a year or so but... Take it for what it's worth. One work out day I was working my dog out and my son came along to watch. We were watching as the handler was working out another dog. The handler came and sat down between us and started a conversation with us while the dog was running from blind to blind. The dog then arrived at the handler and did a bark and hold right in front of us. The dog then bit and released several times with out giving us so much of a look. 
Most all the dogs at this club were very focused on the handler when their time for bite work came and bystanders never felt threatened in any way. After work they were very friendly and would quickly warm up to who ever paid attention to them.. 
Recently I was working out my 1 year old and when he was done and was carrying the sleeve off the field a newbie (who was intimidated by the bite work) passed us on the walkway back to his crate. She gave us a wide berth obviously afraid but I stopped her and invited her to pet my dog and she was surprised that after showing so much aggression before hand was more than happy to receive a head scratch..
Just my 2 cents worth... 

Phil


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

selzer said:


> Not into Schutzhund at all, but I was at an AKC trial when an Akita turned on its handler and bit her. My guess is you have unstable or nervous dogs/poor handling in any venue.


Was the Akita disqualified? I hope so.


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