# How can I stop my GS from barking aggressively at my father?



## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

I have a 6 year old German Shepherd that I rescued from a pound in Broward County, Florida about 8 months ago. I live with my mother, who is 89 and my father who is 85....He was OK with my mother, but started barking very furiously at my father when ever he comes down the hallway to his bedroom....He is OK if my father enters the house and I am away....He even will go into my parent's bedroom and sit with my father and be petted by him....I can not figure out why, all of a sudden, the dog will bark at him. I had to place a gate in the hall, but he is still barking at my father at certain times. My mother just tripped over the dog and broke her hip because the dog would sit at her bedroom door and she had to climb over him. I bought the gate while she is still at the hospital for this second reason.....Someone said that if I spray water at the dog while he is barking at my father that that would stop the barking, but not cure him of this behavior.....Any advice from anyone on what I can do to stop the dog from acting like he wants to kill my old dad?


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

Give up the dog and take care of your parents.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

W.Oliver said:


> Give up the dog and take care of your parents.


I think that's a bit extreme.  and not very helpful.

What I would do is start taking the HOURS of time needed to train and socialize any of our dogs, no matter the age. How is your dog will all the hundreds of other people he meets when you take him on car rides? How is he in Petsmart? Walking down Main St. 

How are the dog classes going and what does your instructor recommend?

I'd also be finding the BEST TREATS EVER that your dog likes and start having your dad carry them around. Trying to get your dog to throw a treat, or your dog to see the treat and approach BEFORE THE BARKING STARTS. So your dog is rewarded for being quiet and near your dad by the best treats ever.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

do not spray your dog with water under any circumstances. your dad carrying the treats sounds like a good idea. you are in a difficult situation, having a rescue dog with (possible) issues and parents who are elders.

i believe it's possible to take care of your parents AND your dog as well. the first step in that direction is for you to decide where the dog can be and when, so there is no chance of your parents injuring themselves because of the dog. you cannot allow him the opportunity to sleep anywhere they can trip over him.

i live with two packs (2 dogs each), have two bitches who fight, and i have to completely control their environment (gate, crate, rotate), so i know it can be done. but it does take dedication and a fair amount of time. like, if you work full time it would be impossible to control the dog's environment if you were gone all day.

do not try to "discipline" this barking at your dad out of your dog. you will damage any bond or trust he's developed with you.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

hey w.oliver from farmington hills, youza one compassionate dude (or dudette). everybody's entitled to their opinion tho. whew.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

My name is Wayne...therefore dude. I love GSDs dearly, but come on folks what is life's priority?

This is an inexperienced owner with a dog, adopted only eight months ago, that is six years old which clearly has some behavioral baggage.

The 85 year old mother has broken a hip over the dog...which via complications, broken hips kill many seniors each year...and the dog has issues with the 89 year old father.....do we really think he is in a condition to manage an issue with an aggressive GSD if the OP isn't around?

HELLO my fellow dog lovers...where does one draw the line? If we cannot see the forest for the trees here and be pragmatic...here is another suggestion to the OP...move out, take the dog with you, and get your own place close enough to take care of your folks.

Again folks, what is life's priority?


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

MaggieRoseLee said:


> I think that's a bit extreme.  and not very helpful.


Imagine taking the high moral dog ground while looking the old woman with a broken hip in the eye and saying that.




MaggieRoseLee said:


> What I would do is start taking the HOURS of time needed to train and socialize any of our dogs, no matter the age.


Dear OP, rehome the dog and put the HOURS into taking care of your mother with the broken hip, and lets make sure your 89 year old father isn't harmed.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

katieliz said:


> hey w.oliver from farmington hills, youza one compassionate dude (or dudette). everybody's entitled to their opinion tho. whew.


....and another thing...where is compassion appropriately placed...on the adopted dog with behavioral issues or the 85 year old woman with a broken hip who will need HOURS of care to rehabilitate?

Ephesians 6:2 .......look it up.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

89 yr old mother. 85 yr old father. mother broke
her hip because the dog wouldn't move out of her
way. the dog is barking at a 89 yr old person
that lives in the same house. the OP doesn't know
he should crate the dog or secure it in another part of the house.
getting rid of the dog is harsh advice, really??? a 40 yr old to a 50 yr
man living at home. there's dark cloud all over the OP's post and when
the light shines through it's going to be sad.


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## mysweetkaos (Sep 20, 2011)

Is there any way you could wake up maybe before your parents...take the dog on a long tiring walk. Give him breakfast, crate him or secure him in a room. I'm assuming you could find 2-3 30 minute periods a day to exercise the dog. If not perhaps crate him in the house, make the backyard secure so he could spend some time out there during the day? I agree with having your dad carry treats , all the while keeping the gate up to avoid any further harm come to your parents. While I can see where W.Oliver is coming from with parents coming first. I've been in the position of being caretaker to my Grandfather and it was emotionally draining so I know that the dog probably serves as a great comfort to you. I know when caring for my Grandpa my St Bernard was my best listener when I would just be a mess, it's hard work. Best of luck. Another possibility could you get a dog walker to help exercise the dog...knowing how time consuming caretaking could be, maybe your dog is just bored and acting out. Again, best of luck


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## PaddyD (Jul 22, 2010)

First
Thank you for rescuing the dog.
Second
It's great that you live with parents that need you.
Third
Try to work HARD on 'making friends' between your dog and your father.
Maybe your father could feed him or spend some time with him?
Start out slow, but if you are going to try to maintain the current living situation you will have to mitigate their ability to co-exist.
Fourth
As stated above try to get the dog as much exercise, both mental and physical, as possible.


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## chelle (Feb 1, 2009)

katieliz said:


> do not spray your dog with water under any circumstances.


Just curious, why do you feel this way?


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

hi wayne, good to meet you. i might even agree with you if i knew more about the circumstances of the op, but since i don't...i'll go with giving the benefit of the doubt to the rescue dog, and to the op trying to work it out so no one has to suffer any more than they already have, and that includes the rescue dog whose future doesn't bode well if he's returned to a shelter. i'm hoping the op will see and understand that they (i'm not clear if the op is a male or female, maybe i missed something), have made some mistakes in not protecting BOTH their parents and the dog (from getting himself in more trouble). why can't this be a win-win situation for both the parents and the dog and shouldn't we at least go down that road before we judge the op's life(style), and toss the dog's future under the bus?

and gosh wayne, about the quoting scripture stuff...you just gotta recognize that on a board of this size there are lots of different spiritual beliefs and lots of people who don't share belief systems.


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## chelle (Feb 1, 2009)

katieliz said:


> and gosh wayne, about the quoting scripture stuff...you just gotta recognize that on a board of this size there are lots of different spiritual beliefs and lots of people who don't share belief systems.


You don't have to go look it up if you don't want to?!?

But I'm really curious as to why you say no squirting with water? Sorry to be a pain, I'd just like to hear your view on that.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

chelle, i don't think it's effective and i do think it can cause a problem with trust, and i also think it's disrespectful and kind of a crutch for wanting a quick solution to a behavioral issue. it should go the way of the alpha roll imho. everything i say, of course, is jmho.

chelle, i'd have no WAY to look it up, lolol...

also, want to add bout the water stuff, i don't do anything to my kidz that i wouldn't do to a human kid. oh, man, i'm gonna get killed here for sayin' that...!!!lolol...


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

the OP's parents are 85 yrs old and 89 yrs old. some real
concern should be given to that fact.

as far as the scripture stuff if you have a different
spiritual belief system or no spiritual belief system
you're not effected by a verse being suggested to read.
besides you don't have to read it. 



katieliz said:


> hi wayne, good to meet you. i might even agree with you if i knew more about the circumstances of the op, but since i don't...i'll go with giving the benefit of the doubt to the rescue dog, and to the op trying to work it out so no one has to suffer any more than they already have, and that includes the rescue dog whose future doesn't bode well if he's returned to a shelter. i'm hoping the op will see and understand that they (i'm not clear if the op is a male or female, maybe i missed something), have made some mistakes in not protecting BOTH their parents and the dog (from getting himself in more trouble). why can't this be a win-win situation for both the parents and the dog and shouldn't we at least go down that road before we judge the op's life(style), and toss the dog's future under the bus?
> 
> and gosh wayne, about the quoting scripture stuff...you just gotta recognize that on a board of this size there are lots of different spiritual beliefs and lots of people who don't share belief systems.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

only reason i responded
doggiedad 
was cause the post 
was directed
at me
(i think)


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## KZoppa (Aug 14, 2010)

OP, you say the dog is fine when you arent home. But starts in barking when you are home. THAT sounds like resource guarding which requires a great deal of training to work on. Considering the age of your parents and the issues with your dog... well its not easy dealing with a resource guarder and working on training. If you wish to keep the dog, you need to involve a private trainer who understands GSDs and has positive methods to work with. The dog is not respecting those who are above him in status. If he had moved like he should have, your mother would not be healing from her injury. 

Unfortunately you are in a tough place. You can get with a trainer and work heavily with your dog, or you can choose to rehome the dog to a shepherd experienced home that has the time and resources to manage him. IMHO, given your parents ages and the fact the dog has been the cause of a pretty serious injury by not respecting the boundaries and moving out of the way when necessary, it might be best to rehome the dog. If you have the time and resources to work heavily on training with him and confining him when necessary, then by all means give it a shot. Definitely make your parents room an off limits zone. He is not welcome in that room. Set rules and boundaries and enforce them at all times.


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

I'm with Wayne. I cannot believe that the main concern is not for those older parents.
My wife's parents are in their eighty's and her dad is on dyalisis. The last thing they need is any kind of GSD in their home.

And for all of you who treat your dogs as or equal to children you need to take a look at your values.

If you hate kids don't hang around them and by all means don't ever have them. 

In civilized society kids and dogs are not equal. 

Wayne is also right about broken hips in the elderly. Most usually die within a year. Yes they could have died anyway but recent studies show a direct correlation between the two.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

katieliz said:


> ...why can't this be a win-win situation for both the parents and the dog....


Win-win...come on...is this forum about dog zealots or is there room for common sense? The woman has a broken hip.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

katieliz said:


> and gosh wayne, about the quoting scripture stuff...you just gotta recognize that on a board of this size there are lots of different spiritual beliefs and lots of people who don't share belief systems.


Christian: Ephesians 6:2 
Judasim: _Tanakh_, Torah, Exodus 20:12 
Islam: _Qur'an _2.083 
Hinduism: _The Laws of Manu_, 2:226

Regardless the religion, the common theme is to care for your parents first....for you atheists and agnostics, you'll just have to rely on common sense...more than has been demonstrated here by some.


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## sashadog (Sep 2, 2011)

Would is really be impossible to simply crate the dog or put him in a separate room when you're not around? This would be the ONLY way to guarantee that your parents are not hurt again. Also, find a trainer and start working with him if possible. I agree that your parents should be first priority but I also agree that a dog could be a huge stress relief for you after having to care for your aging parents.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

i understand, for some people their way of thinking is the only way. not a problem for me, i acknowledge and respect everyone's right to their opinion (and their definition of common sense).


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

katieliz said:


> hey w.oliver from farmington hills, youza one compassionate dude (or dudette). everybody's entitled to their opinion tho. whew.


Youza opened the door katieliz on my compassion, and I was entertained to walk through.


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## chelle (Feb 1, 2009)

katieliz said:


> chelle, i don't think it's effective and i do think it can cause a problem with trust, and i also think it's disrespectful and kind of a crutch for wanting a quick solution to a behavioral issue. it should go the way of the alpha roll imho. everything i say, of course, is jmho.
> 
> chelle, i'd have no WAY to look it up, lolol...
> 
> also, want to add bout the water stuff, i don't do anything to my kidz that i wouldn't do to a human kid. oh, man, i'm gonna get killed here for sayin' that...!!!lolol...


Nah, I won't attempt to murder you.  I've found a good water squirt to be incredibly effective. It is only water, delivered at the shoulder and sure gets attention. I save this for certain things. Only certain things. May be a crutch, but I get the desired effect immediately. I use it in conjunction with a command word, so I'm trying to wean away the squirts and only use the word and it is working. Bailey has seemed to figure out that word = a water squirt on his shoulders. (Word is "easy" and is usually used when he's grabbing the Shiba by the collar.) So, anymore, I usually only have to say "easy" and the collar pulling stops. Anyway, the squirting has really worked for me. 



doggiedad said:


> the OP's parents are 85 yrs old and 89 yrs old. some real concern should be given to that fact.
> 
> as far as the scripture stuff if you have a different
> spiritual belief system or no spiritual belief system
> ...


Yes, these folks are in danger of what a dog, even a well meaning dog, can do. 



Jack's Dad said:


> I'm with Wayne. I cannot believe that the main concern is not for those older parents.
> My wife's parents are in their eighty's and her dad is on dyalisis. The last thing they need is any kind of GSD in their home.
> 
> And for all of you who treat your dogs as or equal to children you need to take a look at your values.
> ...


A broken hip due to a dog is a huge red flag. The parents must come before the dog. If you can't contain the dog to ENSURE the elderly parents' welfare, the dog must go. I hate to say that, but you must put the humans' health ahead of any dog.



W.Oliver said:


> Win-win...come on...is this forum about dog zealots or is there room for common sense? The woman has a broken hip.


Yes. As much as I love dogs, the parents must, must, must come first, especially at their advanced ages. Must.


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## NewbieShepherdGirl (Jan 7, 2011)

I agree with what has been said above. If there is any way you could give the dog to a trusted friend/family member or find a GSD rescue, that would be ideal. My grandma is in her late 70s and I rarely bring Sasha by (to be fair I rarely go by lol) and if I do, she is right next to me whenever my grandma is around, because like people on here have already said, broken bones in elderly people can lead to complications (pneumonia probably being one of the most dangerous, but bed sores, and other things can cause problems as well.).

If you're set on keeping him I would definitely say he should not be allowed around your parents if you aren't there, and when you are there he needs to be right next to you at all times. As far as growling, barking, whatever, at your dad: if it's typically only happening when you're there it may be resource guarding (you being the resource). I went through this with Sasha. Since the idea was that she wanted me all to herself, when she acted out she got exactly the opposite of what she wanted. I would give her one chance (I'd tell her no) if she continued she got to go in the garage, or my bedroom, or wherever (the idea mainly being she was someplace without me). She'd be out there for a little bit (Not more than a min or two) and then she'd get to come back in. If it started up again she automatically went back out. Also she got rewarded heavily for showing interest/friendliness to the people I allowed in our home. 

If you're keeping the dog, keep it on a leash next to you at all times. When you can't be right there with it for any reason, put it in a crate. Don't allow it any access to your parents until it earns the right, and that may take quite some time.

Oh and I have used the squirt bottle with some effectiveness. I used it on Sasha when she'd jump or when she'd bark at dogs walking down the hall. Worked with the barking, worked somewhat with the jumping.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

why can't it be common sense to control the dog's environment so harm cannot come to the elders? and i just have to say, there are lots of details left out here about the exact circumstances and, in taking that into account, i thought maybe we should go a little further in trying to help the op change their situation without telling them to get rid of their dog. the suggestion that a newly rescued dog would somehow understand "boundaries" and "getting out of the way", is not realistic, but it would be pretty easy to manage one dog's environment (gate, crate, rotate). since i do four, one seems very realistic and do-able to me. i just think there is way too much info missing to come to an accurate conclusion about any of this. so much depends on so many different things. i don't think there is enough info here to know that it's not possible for the op to make some changes and reverse this to a win-win situation, when it might not be difficult to do that. there are times when you are caretaking an elder parent that a companion animal can be very important, and can even be important to the elder parents. but first the op will have to be the one to use the common sense. who knows what this situation really is?


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

The recovery and rehab from a broken hip in an 89 yr. old is long and extremely risky. 
No one can guarantee that a gate, crate won't accidentally be left open or some other thing may happen. 
When your parents are gone they are gone forever.
The risk to their health and safety is not worth it.
Once again it appears you are giving equal status to a 6yr. old GSD that the OP has had for eight months.
I grew up in a generation that respected the elderly above all else.
Particullarly your parents. Except in cases of abuse or something like that.
I can't fathom the idea of even the slightest risk to the OP's elderly parents.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

katieliz said:


> why can't it be common sense to control the dog's environment so harm cannot come to the elders?


The mother has a broken hip...life threatening harm has already come to the elders...what don't you get about that?

Controlling/training the dog certainly could be accomplished under different circumstances than what have been identified. Lets say the OP and the dog in question lived independently from the elderly parents, or if the parents weren't 85/89, but rather 45/49. Or if the owner was more experienced than what has been conveyed, and the dog had only modest issues that posed less risk. Then I would subscribe to the notion that training with a behaviorist could benefit as there would be less to no risk to the parents. But were not discussing ideals, we talking about a woman who has a broken hip at age 85...It can kill her.

So again, in the case as presented, life threatening harm has already occurred to the mother. Does the father also have to experience trauma for the notion of rehoming the dog to become reasonable?

Rather than treats in the pocket of the old man, why don't we just tell the OP to keep the dog, and get his dad a meat poncho!






Good dog trainers can fix behavioral problems, excellent dog trainers never allow the problems to occur.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

wayne, don't be mean, it's just a difference in opinion and you can't make the assumptions you're making 'cause you don't know the real deal. and neither do i. only person who knows the complete real deal is the op, and all the judgement and wierd conclusions thrown around here have apparently driven the op away. i could say what don't you get about that, or point out how unkind you've been to someone who came here with a problem and a question and got chastised and a lecture, but instead i'm gonna say again, you have a right to your opinion...all those in society who cannot care for or speak for themselves, elders, children, animals...all are deserving of an advocate.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

AND, and...as an elder myself, i find your comment referring to the op's father as an old man, and suggesting a meat poncho, to be particularly tasteless and really offensive and disrespectful to the op.


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## Jessiewessie99 (Mar 6, 2009)

KZoppa said:


> OP, you say the dog is fine when you arent home. But starts in barking when you are home. THAT sounds like resource guarding which requires a great deal of training to work on. Considering the age of your parents and the issues with your dog... well its not easy dealing with a resource guarder and working on training. If you wish to keep the dog, you need to involve a private trainer who understands GSDs and has positive methods to work with. The dog is not respecting those who are above him in status. If he had moved like he should have, your mother would not be healing from her injury.
> 
> Unfortunately you are in a tough place. You can get with a trainer and work heavily with your dog, or you can choose to rehome the dog to a shepherd experienced home that has the time and resources to manage him. IMHO, given your parents ages and the fact the dog has been the cause of a pretty serious injury by not respecting the boundaries and moving out of the way when necessary, it might be best to rehome the dog. If you have the time and resources to work heavily on training with him and confining him when necessary, then by all means give it a shot. Definitely make your parents room an off limits zone. He is not welcome in that room. Set rules and boundaries and enforce them at all times.



I agree completely. 

My grandfather(who was 88 when he passed last year) was able to come to our house and get around just fine. Never had any issues. My great grandmother(who passed at 101) was able to get around our house just fine as well. We had both dogs, obviously our dogs are well trained enough to not be in the way. I agree with Krystal, try some training and see how it works, then think about rehoming the dog.


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## sparra (Jun 27, 2011)

W.Oliver said:


> My name is Wayne...therefore dude. I love GSDs dearly, but come on folks what is life's priority?
> 
> This is an inexperienced owner with a dog, adopted only eight months ago, that is six years old which clearly has some behavioral baggage.
> 
> ...


Great post!!

I just feel so sorry for this elderly couple.....imagine...you have lived a long life and then when you should be taking it easy you have an ill mannered dog take over your house, barking at you, trips you over and you break your hip....so sad.

Re-home the dog!!


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

Thanks for all of the suggestions....First of all, I own the house and am a male age 64.
I previously owned a Golden Retriever who died a year ago at ten years old. I never had
a problem with him and my folks....The GD I love greatly and have had no problem with him and my folks for the past 7 months. The barking at my father only began a few weeks ago....I think the dog gets spooked which causes the barking. Just today I went out of the house to walk him and when I came back inside my father had just come into the house from the garage. The dog then went nuts and began barking at him. A few hours before my father and I were in the kitchen talking and the dog was fine sitting on the floor....So the dog only barks at him at certain times....If the dog ever bites me or my dad I will have to return the dog to the shelter I found him. Another thing, the dog does not bark if my mother is with my dad.....Yes I know that my folks come first, but it would kill me inside if I had to give up the dog....Also, the dog barks at all other dogs and birds and rabbits when I walk him....I have arthritis in both of my knees but there is little pain because of a herbal tea I drink every day....but because I love this dog I walk him around a long block 4 times a day in a gated community where my house is....I am retired, so I am with the dog all of the time.....Has anyone used those herbal dog tranquilizers to calm your dog when you take him to the vet? Maybe the dog needs them to quiet him down....


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## KZoppa (Aug 14, 2010)

Op first, a golden and a GSD... the only thing they have in common is they're dog and they bark. Temperments are entirely different. 

You have an obvious problem with your dog. Have his eyes checked for one thing. Tranqs will NOT treat the problem so you need to treat the problem with the help of a trainer/behaviorist who has experience with GSDs. The dog obviously has an issue with your father, whatever that issue is, has yet to be determined but you could very possibly have a dangerous situation on your hands if you dont work on training and figuring out WHY he behaves the way he does towards your father.


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## marshies (May 18, 2011)

NoRinyNo said:


> Thanks for all of the suggestions....First of all, I own the house and am a male age 64.
> I previously owned a Golden Retriever who died a year ago at ten years old. I never had
> a problem with him and my folks....The GD I love greatly and have had no problem with him and my folks for the past 7 months. The barking at my father only began a few weeks ago....I think the dog gets spooked which causes the barking. Just today I went out of the house to walk him and when I came back inside my father had just come into the house from the garage. The dog then went nuts and began barking at him. A few hours before my father and I were in the kitchen talking and the dog was fine sitting on the floor....So the dog only barks at him at certain times....If the dog ever bites me or my dad I will have to return the dog to the shelter I found him. Another thing, the dog does not bark if my mother is with my dad.....Yes I know that my folks come first, but it would kill me inside if I had to give up the dog....Also, the dog barks at all other dogs and birds and rabbits when I walk him....I have arthritis in both of my knees but there is little pain because of a herbal tea I drink every day....but because I love this dog I walk him around a long block 4 times a day in a gated community where my house is....I am retired, so I am with the dog all of the time.....Has anyone used those herbal dog tranquilizers to calm your dog when you take him to the vet? Maybe the dog needs them to quiet him down....


I can't pretend to understand what the dog means to you since it's been with you all these months all day every day, but I do want to say, I feel that getting rid of the dog AFTER the bite is too late. 

If it were me, I would not risk it at all. Your parents must feel pretty uncomfortable in your home with the dog. They know it's your home and try to respect your lifestyle choices with the dog...but I feel since you've shared your home with them, you need to look out for their well-being instead. 

If you are persistent about keeping the dog, training and crating when you're not home are absolute necessities. I would not allow parents and dog to be in the same environment ever. If parents are out and about downstairs, dogs should not be. Dogs move quickly, and GSDs are strong. It doesn't take much for them to knock over an elderly fragile person.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

W.Oliver said:


> Give up the dog and take care of your parents.





katieliz said:


> .......or point out how unkind you've been to someone who came here with a problem and a question and got chastised and a lecture......


That simple sentence was my response to the OP, which is hardly chastised or lectured. The rest of my writing has be largely in response to your zealot responses after you wrote the following editorial.....



katieliz said:


> hey w.oliver from farmington hills, youza one compassionate dude (or dudette). everybody's entitled to their opinion tho. whew.





katieliz said:


> wayne, don't be mean, it's just a difference in opinion....


Really? Then I would suggest you limit your critiques of expressed opinion in the future, and stick to expounding on your own....less likely to be made to look foolish.



katieliz said:


> ..........i find your comment referring to the op's father as an old man, and suggesting a meat poncho, to be particularly tasteless and really offensive and disrespectful to the op.


I find it offensive and disrespectful that you lost focus on the OP's question and didn't just limit your response to him, but rather critiqued my view, and in addition, the fact that your writing seems to put the dog above the parents in priority is simply bizarre to me.

Before we wrap-up our debate, which I have really enjoyed, any further comments on my religious quotes...ya know, the faiths quoted represent 84% of the worlds beliefs, and if you need more, I would have a good time pulling some of the more obscure religions....the interesting thing there is the common aspects of all faiths...it is ignorance that causes folks to focus on the differences between peoples.

Thanks again...this has been fun.


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## gsdraven (Jul 8, 2009)

NoRinyNo said:


> Has anyone used those herbal dog tranquilizers to calm your dog when you take him to the vet? Maybe the dog needs them to quiet him down....


I have been using Springtime Inc's Stress Free Complex on a foster for the last week and I have seen a great improvement in her ability to relax and not be so jumpy.

Is there a trainer that you can contact to come in and assess the situation? If both the dog and your parents are important to you, you really need to manage the household very carefully. That means the dog has no access to your parents when you aren't supervising closely. Your mother should not have to walk over the dog, she should be able to tell the dog to move. 

If you don't already, you should do NILIF (Nothing in Life is Free) with your dog. Has the dog been to the vet for a checkup? Are his eyes okay? I don't mean to offend, but does your Dad walk slow and maybe stare at him? I'm willing to bet that there is something in your Dad's demeanor that is setting your dog off.

We all love our dogs here and I understand how hard it can be to even think of giving one up but your priority needs to be the safety and health of your parents. If managing the environment makes that happen and lets you keep your dog, then yay! If not, you might have to bite the bullet and find a more suitable home for the dog.


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## Twyla (Sep 18, 2011)

NoRinyNo said:


> Thanks for all of the suggestions....First of all, I own the house and am a male age 64.
> I previously owned a Golden Retriever who died a year ago at ten years old. I never had
> a problem with him and my folks....The GD I love greatly and have had no problem with him and my folks for the past 7 months. The barking at my father only began a few weeks ago....I think the dog gets spooked which causes the barking. Just today I went out of the house to walk him and when I came back inside my father had just come into the house from the garage. The dog then went nuts and began barking at him. A few hours before my father and I were in the kitchen talking and the dog was fine sitting on the floor....So the dog only barks at him at certain times....If the dog ever bites me or my dad I will have to return the dog to the shelter I found him. Another thing, the dog does not bark if my mother is with my dad.....Yes I know that my folks come first, but it would kill me inside if I had to give up the dog....Also, the dog barks at all other dogs and birds and rabbits when I walk him....I have arthritis in both of my knees but there is little pain because of a herbal tea I drink every day....but because I love this dog I walk him around a long block 4 times a day in a gated community where my house is....I am retired, so I am with the dog all of the time.....Has anyone used those herbal dog tranquilizers to calm your dog when you take him to the vet? Maybe the dog needs them to quiet him down....


You need a trainer asap. Either classes or private sessions at your home. Classes would give the advantage of seeing how your dog reacts to the other dogs present, the private lessons would involve your parents and hopefully how to manage the dog around them.

Has your Dad's health changed recently? Maybe stumbling or shuffling his feet? Seniors sometimes get a focused look when they are concentrating on walking without stumbling. Perhaps the focus is on the dog and it is interpreted as a stare by the dog. With the relationship between your dad and the dog already questionable, maybe the dog is seeing this as a challenge?

Please don't wait for a bite to happen. If your dog jumps at your Dad, he can easily knock him down and it would be even worse..


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

I find it interesting that the dog was fine with your father for 7 months and only just started reacting to your dad within the last week or so. What has changed? Has your dad started a different medication? As stated above, has your dad's health changed any? 

When did your Mom break her hip?


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

Lilie said:


> I find it interesting that the dog was fine with your father for 7 months and only just started reacting to your dad within the last week or so. What has changed? Has your dad started a different medication? As stated above, has your dad's health changed any?
> 
> When did your Mom break her hip?


My mom broke part of her hip 9 days ago. She told me in the hospital that she asked the dog to move about 4 times so she could get through the doorway and just as she was climbing over him he decided to get up. That is why she lost her footing. I told her many times not to try and climb over the dog. But she thinks she is still 60 years old. She doesn't even look 89 years old. She looks like she is 70. Even her doctors do not believe it. I may have to give the dog away to a shelter before she gets back from the hospital....I can not take the chance she will fall again. You know, I noticed that the dog's aggressive behavior only started after I began giving him vanilla ice cream. The hormones in the ice cream may have something to do with it...Or maybe it is the fact that he considers my dad as lower in status than him....Would you happen to know of any good "You Tube" videos on correcting dog aggression? And thanks for your help....


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

yup wayne, you're right. i should have sent my "editorial" to you via pm. 

i apologize to the op and to everyone else on this thread for derailing it. 

compassion is not entertainment to me and i always try to understand everyone's point of view and look for a solution where everyone's needs and feelings are considered, including the animal. 

thank you too to everyone here who has given the op some good suggestions. thanks to the op for not being offended at our bickering in the face of his genuine problem.

take care all.


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

NoRinyNo said:


> ...Or maybe it is the fact that he considers my dad as lower in status than him....Would you happen to know of any good "You Tube" videos on correcting dog aggression? And thanks for your help....


To tell you the truth, dog-human aggression is *almost* never a status/dominance thing. Dogs have been bred for 10,000 to 100,000 years (depending on which experts you listen to) to be submissive to humans. Cesar Millan has made his living with the few that are, but when they start showing hammers on TV, pretty soon everything looks like a nail. 

This isn't something you can correct with a youtube video because nobody on this forum can tell you _why_ your dog is acting aggressively towards your dad. If it stems from fear/anxiety you'd treat it one way, but if it's protection or resource guarding you'd treat it a different way and the training for one could be a disaster if it's the other. I'd strongly suggest bringing in a professional who can help you assess the situation.

Also, if you do decide you need to get rid of the dog, please don't take it to the shelter. A 6-year old dog won't make it out alive. See if you can contact a German Shepherd rescue group.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

I agree with Emoore, you need a professional. Youtube isn't going to be able to help you that much in a case like this. And if you DO end up rehoming, please please please go through a GSD rescue!!

And as for her telling him to move 4 times, does the dog even know what that command means? If you haven't taught the dog to move when you give the command, then of course the dog isn't going to understand what she is asking him to do. I think this dog needs some TRAINING. Just because someone is older doesn't mean they can't live happily with a dog. I just had a family member die at the age of 96, he lived in a 3 story house BY HIMSELF until he was *93 years old*. No, that isn't a typo. 3 story house at 93 years old. Want to talk about how many elderly people break their hips/die falling down stairs?


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

The points about very active older people, 80's and 90's are not really helpful since the vast majority of people don't even live to be those ages. Many of those who do are not in good shape.

The average life span of a male person born in 1940 was 60.5 yrs. Someone born today it is approx. 78 yrs.. We had a man in his 90's in our area who was still doing marathons. So what. The reason he was news was because of how unusual his feats were. He was not the norm. 
Even if his mother is a very healthy 89 yr. old, her recovery from a broken hip will be very difficult.
It's entirely up to the OP what he chooses to do with the situation but I just hope his elderly parents come first. 
Let them have some peace in their elder years.


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## Kaz (Nov 21, 2011)

Have you considered an electric shock collar ?


[ame]http://www.amazon.com/SportDOG-Rechargeable-NoBark-Control-Collar/dp/B00173CWDW/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1322590776&sr=8-2[/ame]

I have heard they work really well.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

NoRinyNo said:


> My mom broke part of her hip 9 days ago. She told me in the hospital that she asked the dog to move about 4 times so she could get through the doorway and just as she was climbing over him he decided to get up.


Your mom broke her hip about the same time your dog started barking at your dad? Is this all happening within the same time frame? Does your pop hold ill feelings towards the dog because of what happened to your mom? Certainly could understand if he did, but just curious all the same.


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## SusiQ (Jul 27, 2007)

Jack's Dad - I agree with you re: the elderly and a broken hip. My mom broke her hip and was gone withing several weeks. Bones don't heal as quickly at that age, rehab is extremely difficult, often leading to depression and the older folks are more susceptible to pneumonia from being bed-ridden. Sorry to get off track, but just wanted to add my two cents worth.


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

Lilie said:


> Your mom broke her hip about the same time your dog started barking at your dad? Is this all happening within the same time frame? Does your pop hold ill feelings towards the dog because of what happened to your mom? Certainly could understand if he did, but just curious all the same.


The dog was barking at my dad before my mom broke her hip. But right now I am about to give the dog away to a neighbor who lives a few miles away. He told me if ever I wanted to give the dog up, to call him. He once owned 3 GS. I am waiting for him to reply. If he does not take the dog, I am checking for a GS rescue place. I also have a woman who owns "Pet Haven Rescue," here in Florida who is right now checking to see if someone she knows will take the dog. She wants a picture of the dog first by way of a cell phone upload.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

norinyno, you can disregard my pm, looks like you've got the situation in hand.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

NoRinyNo said:


> The dog was barking at my dad before my mom broke her hip. But right now I am about to give the dog away to a neighbor who lives a few miles away. He told me if ever I wanted to give the dog up, to call him. He once owned 3 GS. I am waiting for him to reply. If he does not take the dog, I am checking for a GS rescue place. I also have a woman who owns "Pet Haven Rescue," here in Florida who is right now checking to see if someone she knows will take the dog. She wants a picture of the dog first by way of a cell phone upload.


 
I hate to see it didn't work out. Sounds like the dog is a great dog. But, I think you've got your hands full right now. I hope all the best for you and your family.


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## Stella's Mom (Mar 8, 2011)

That sounds like a good plan. I hope it works out.


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

NoRinyNo, 

I appreciate the difficult situation you're in and respect how noble you are, both in caring for your parents in your home, as well as opening your home to a rescue GSD. Although I stand by my initial post on this thread, I wish only the best for you in whatever decision you come to.

My apologies for allowing myself to be entertained by debating with dog zealots on your thread.

God bless and keep you and your family.

Wayne


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

I wish the best for you, your parents and your dog.


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## Good_Karma (Jun 28, 2009)

NoRinyNo wow, what a tough situation, I'm glad you found a solution (hopefully!). I'm sure your parents will be glad to have one less thing to worry about when your mom comes home, and they can focus on getting your mom back to health. Sending my best wishes and healing thoughts to her.


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

Good_Karma said:


> NoRinyNo wow, what a tough situation, I'm glad you found a solution (hopefully!). I'm sure your parents will be glad to have one less thing to worry about when your mom comes home, and they can focus on getting your mom back to health. Sending my best wishes and healing thoughts to her.


Just wanted everyone to know that my GS, Riny, had a brain tumor. This was the reason he was trying to attack my dad. Riny associated the pain in his brain, when it occurred, with the appearance of dad....I had a confirmation my dog had a brain tumor with a woman who had a Saint-Bernard dog of 6 and a half years old who had a brain tumor as well.. She said that her dog first had a pain in its ears and then attacked her later. Riny had the same pain in his ears that did not diminish even after I put "Wally's Ear Oil," in his ears for a week....I had to put the dog to sleep. But now I found out from a friend of mine, that if I had started the dog on "Magic Mineral Solution," that it would have cured the dog in 2 weeks. She knows this is true because a friend of hers gave her dog the solution for a brain tumor and it cured her dog....There is also a cancer cure for dogs called: "Tissue Tone," that is made up of certain cancer killing herbs that might have saved Riny, but I acted too fast to put him down for fear Riny would have killed my dad, or even me, when the next brain tumor pain occurred.


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## gsdraven (Jul 8, 2009)

You didn't get a vet diagnosis?!

:rip: RIP Riny. May you be pain free and at peace. :halogsd:


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## Snarly (Sep 7, 2011)

gsdraven said:


> You didn't get a vet diagnosis?!


???
I can't imagine putting a down dog just by assuming that is what the dog had without a vet diagnosis.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

I have no idea what just happend.


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## sashadog (Sep 2, 2011)

You put your dog down because a friend told you some story about her dog and something about a friends dog and cancer? What!? I'm sorry for your loss... I'm sure it was a painful decision but... what? I'm at a loss. 

p.s. "magic cures for cancer" don't exist IMO. If they did, there wouldn't be a billion dollar drug industry devoting years and resources to figuring out how to cure it. Oh, and no body would have cancer. Sorry... soap box moment.


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## chelle (Feb 1, 2009)

The dog was put to sleep without an official vet diagnosis - only the "word" of some woman.? How sad. What did you tell the vet? You surely didn't tell the vet that put him down that he had a brain tumor diagnosed by the neighbor lady?

What a sad situation.


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## Good_Karma (Jun 28, 2009)

There's no cure for cancer. What you are describing as cures are modern day snake oils Snake oil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia That would be nice if they work though. It would save a lot of lives.

Kind of not sure how the dog connected the pain he was in with your father, because he was probably in pain all the time if he indeed had a brain tumor. So why just your dad? That seems odd to me.

I'm sorry for the loss of your dog.


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## sparra (Jun 27, 2011)

I am sorry that you felt you had to put your dog down.

How is your mum doing with her hip? Is she recovering OK?


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

*The Facts*



sashadog said:


> You put your dog down because a friend told you some story about her dog and something about a friends dog and cancer? What!? I'm sorry for your loss... I'm sure it was a painful decision but... what? I'm at a loss.
> 
> p.s. "magic cures for cancer" don't exist IMO. If they did, there wouldn't be a billion dollar drug industry devoting years and resources to figuring out how to cure it. Oh, and no body would have cancer. Sorry... soap box moment.


You got it all wrong. I had given the dog to the Animal Control Center in my county 3 days before my friend told me of this.... . I was told that my dog would be adopted if it showed no aggression. But the dog had become very aggressive and bit the vet there. They then had no choice but to put him to sleep. If I had known they were going to do that I would have never taken him there in the first place.....And you should be aware that the FDA is run by past presidents of the drug companies. The present one was the head of Monsanto, the company making the GMO crops and spraying the sky's with the poisonous "Chem Trails." The FDA is protecting the drug companies from all competition from natural cancer cures. Check out "You Tube" and Jim Humble and MMS before you make up your mind.. Even the Germans have a machine that cures cancer. Many famous people have used it to cure themselves. Look up in Google: "German Cancer Breakthrough," for the details.


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## chelle (Feb 1, 2009)

NoRinyNo said:


> You got it all wrong. I had given the dog to the Animal Control Center in my county 3 days before my friend told me of this.... .


But we didn't have this info. Last I'd read, he was headed to a neighbor's house?

I am glad there is a breakthrough for cancer. 

All told, I am very sorry for the outcome of the whole thing, for the dog and for your mom. Hope she's recooperating well.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

well when you're a rescue dog zealot like i am there is no end to the foolish, foolish things you witness people do, and no end to the many, many ways these dogs are failed by their human guardians. i too believe that there are alternatives to conventional cancer treatment, but FIRST YOU HAVE TO HAVE A DIAGNOSIS OF CANCER FROM A MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL, CONFIRMED BY SOME KIND OF DIAGNOSTIC IMAGING OR TESTING. no sense in discussing this ANY MORE because the dog is dead. taking a dog to animal control when you have already had aggression problems is a death sentence, you knew that.

ps...sashadog, there is a billion dollar drug industry devoting years and resources to figuring out how to NOT cure cancer, they have a vested interest in not curing it so they can invent more meds (many times more dangerious than the cancer itself), to SELL to people. the more people who have cancer the better it is for the drug companies. just another example of the greed which is rampant everywhere.

ugh.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

oh and btw jack's dad, in a truly civilized society all creatures are shown compassion. compassion, in the world today (as well as on this board at times), is in very short supply. there are many who speak for children and elders, and frankly many times children and elders can speak for themselves. i do not put animals BEFORE elders and children but i have CHOSEN to SPEAK FOR THE ANIMALS and if that makes me a zealot, then hear me when i say I AM PROUD TO BE ONE.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I read these threads and am saddened. My mom tripped over Cujo once -- they do climb over him, I climb over him, and Cujo barks at my Dad every time he comes home. I never realized how close he was to being put down. 

I can understand it, maybe if the dog bit your elderly parent, but tripping over the dog -- that is on the person not the dog in my opinion. 

Since my parents just celebrated their fiftieth, they are getting up there in years.

I feel for the critter in this case, the one who has no voice. I am sorry that people felt they needed to put the dog down.


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

chelle said:


> But we didn't have this info. Last I'd read, he was headed to a neighbor's house?
> 
> I am glad there is a breakthrough for cancer.
> 
> All told, I am very sorry for the outcome of the whole thing, for the dog and for your mom. Hope she's recooperating well.


My neighbor was the mother of the man who I was going to give my dog. He lived a few blocks away. When he showed up at my house he had his 10 year old daughter with him. I told him to get her a puppy. My dog was too big for her and was having aggressive problems. He also told me he had another young daughter and 2 cats. I told him forget about taking my dog. He didn't even have a fenced off back yard. My mom is due to come home on Sunday in a wheel chair....Thanks for your kind comments....


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## NoRinyNo (Oct 24, 2011)

katieliz said:


> well when you're a rescue dog zealot like i am there is no end to the foolish, foolish things you witness people do, and no end to the many, many ways these dogs are failed by their human guardians. i too believe that there are alternatives to conventional cancer treatment, but FIRST YOU HAVE TO HAVE A DIAGNOSIS OF CANCER FROM A MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL, CONFIRMED BY SOME KIND OF DIAGNOSTIC IMAGING OR TESTING. no sense in discussing this ANY MORE because the dog is dead. taking a dog to animal control when you have already had aggression problems is a death sentence, you knew that.
> 
> ps...sashadog, there is a billion dollar drug industry devoting years and resources to figuring out how to NOT cure cancer, they have a vested interest in not curing it so they can invent more meds (many times more dangerious than the cancer itself), to SELL to people. the more people who have cancer the better it is for the drug companies. just another example of the greed which is rampant everywhere.
> 
> ugh.


Do you know how much money it costs to get an MRI for your dog? About a 800-1000 dollars. Radiation treatment would have cost $7,000 dollars. And then another MRI to see if then radiation treatment worked.....And even if I had the money for all this, my dad and mom would still be in danger of the dog attacking them until the dog was cured of his brain tumor. And remember that I had a very experienced woman dog trainer come to see my dog before I took him to the Animal Control Center. She said the dog was psycho and may have a brain tumor. She herself had dogs with brain tumors, so she recognized the symptoms when the dog tried to attack my dad right in front of her. And it was only a matter of time before the dog would have attacked me. This was my second dog I owned in 7 years. My first was a Golden who I had for 6 out of his 10 years. He died from lymphfoma cancer within 2 days. There were no symptoms except that he could not swallow on the first day. The vet gave him chemo and he died that night from suffocation.


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## chelle (Feb 1, 2009)

Well it is what it is. I'm sorry for everyone involved. It could not have been easy. I'm glad your mother is coming home soon. Honestly, who knows if it was actually a brain tumor, but it doesn't matter now. RIP to the dog and even more importantly, your mom can come home without the stress and worry.


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## sparra (Jun 27, 2011)

chelle said:


> Well it is what it is. I'm sorry for everyone involved. It could not have been easy. I'm glad your mother is coming home soon. Honestly, who knows if it was actually a brain tumor, but it doesn't matter now. RIP to the dog and even more importantly, your mom can come home without the stress and worry.


Yeah...well said chelle


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## Jack's Dad (Jun 7, 2011)

katieliz said:


> oh and btw jack's dad, in a truly civilized society all creatures are shown compassion. compassion, in the world today (as well as on this board at times), is in very short supply. there are many who speak for children and elders, and frankly many times children and elders can speak for themselves. i do not put animals BEFORE elders and children but i have CHOSEN to SPEAK FOR THE ANIMALS and if that makes me a zealot, then hear me when i say I AM PROUD TO BE ONE.


Well katieliz maybe you can show a little compassion for me for sticking up for an eighty nine year old woman. She will now have to suffer through rehab of a broken hip for what I believe should never have happened. Frankly the whole situation is sad and there are no winners here.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Amen!


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

andy compassion is sorrow for the sufferings of another. i have compassion for all who have suffered here, animal and human alike, but although i do respect your right to your opinions, i'm not sure how i would show compassion for you, since i can't see how you've suffered here. i respect everyone's right to their opinion and you will never, ever see me here calling names or disrespecting others. 

and i also agree that the broken hip should never have happened. the responsibility lies with the owner who could have protected both the dog and his parents. trip and falls are incredibly common in the elder population, when you are the caretaker of an elder you have to assume the responsibility of managing animals and balls and toys and really everything in your home environment to assure that accidents don't happen. everyone was so quick to assume that the owner was some ner do well that was sponging off his parents and that turned out to be completely wrong, this was his home and his environment and animal to responsibly manage. up to and including a humane trip to the bridge, if indeed the aggression was genuine and/or a physiologic health issue. i do even show compassion for the op in that regard tho, some people cannot face the euthanasia of an animal and need to believe that turning it in to a facility will somehow spare it's life, when in fact it is almost certainly a death sentence, most times in cruel and unspeakable ways. most people don't even know there are still gas chambers or what heartstick euth is. i am allowing myself to believe that wherever this dog was euth'd they were more humane. bless his heart.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Some folks have very different opinions vis a vis humans vs animals. 

A very very sad story with someone having to make a MOST difficult choice. Hopefully no one should have to make this type of choice.


Sort of like that oft repeated choice in an ethics class - if you can only save one? - would it be your wife or your mother, first child or second one, etc. etc.

Impossible choice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

i reply here again in hopes that it might help someone prevent the injury to a human or the death of an animal in the future.

please. this is not an issue of either/or, or of impossible choice, or of what has more value a human or an animal. this is an issue of personal responsibility.

it's much, much less likely that anyone will have to make this choice if they manage their animals responsibly, in all situations possible, taking into account their personal situation and lifestyle, particularly when the environment is somewhere they have total control over. the responsibility for the fall was not the dog's. 

accidents do happen. much less often if thought is given to possible consequences and care is taken to assure that they don't.


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