# did I get a bad breed?



## AC1 (Sep 24, 2009)

Hello,

I've been searching for months for the perfect german shepherd. I finally found one last week with the german bloodlines. I saw the parents and was very impressed. Now I have a 8 week old german shepherd for a week now and I feel like I got the dumb one.

When we brought him home, it was a 5 hour drive and he cried the entire time in my wifes arms. Now that we have him home, he lays in his crate in pee. He eats poop, even when he is out free. He is always walking around crying. When you hold him, he panics and cries and forces his way out of your arms.

He pees EVERYWHERE, every 5 minutes and sits in it or lays in it. We bought a 6 week old mini schnauzer 6 months ago and didnt have these problems.

We call him his name 200 times a day, and he still doesnt know his name. Is it because he is 8 weeks old or did I get the dumb one of the litter?

I bought this for a protection dog, but it seems he's to much of a baby. Will he grow out of this?

Thanks


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

You should call your breeder and express your concerns.

Have you taken him to a vet? Something doesn't seem right.


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

I hate to say this, but before bringing him home you should have done A LOT more research than what it seems you did.

Please contact the breeder, read through this site, talk to a vet and other experience puppy/dog owners.


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

Geesh! He's a freaking baby, in my opinion take him back, you obviously dislike him


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## Amaruq (Aug 29, 2001)

Well first off he IS a baby. Would you expect a 6 month old child to be teaching college level Physics? No. The child has to LEARN and learning takes time. 

As far as the constant crying and peeing- have you taken him to a vet? Aside from repeating his name 200 times a day how are you "teaching" him his name? You probably say I, A or the 200 times a day but those are not his name. He will associate his name over time but it does take time. I would recommend saying his name (not yelling his name if he pees or has a accident) but calling his name in a fun puppy voice and rewarding him with calm praise or treats when he comes to you or looks to you. 

Where did you buy the pup? From a reputable breeder that breeds dogs to work (protection/schutzhund)? Did you tell the breeder what you were looking for in a pup?


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## shilohsmom (Jul 14, 2003)

If you want protection take the dog back and buy a gun...I'm sorry, but he's a baby. He's going to be a baby for awhile and then he'll be the equivalant of a teen, by then he will fine tune his 'MUTE' button and won't pay any attention to you whatsoever.


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## allieg (Nov 4, 2008)

Sounds like you need to get lots more info on a puppy.First off I think a vet visit to rule out anything with the urination.You just might have to take him out every 15 minutes then move up to half hour and so on.
The crying is probably that he is lonely.You be taken away from all your family members and driven 5hrs and see how you feel.He is scared and confused.
First off get a vet appt to check him over and make sure he is healthy.
Good luck and keep us updated.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

Something doesn't seem right . . . the crying all the way home is normal for some, but the rest of the story . . . sounds like a pup that was raised with not human contact, in a dirty cage much like puppies from puppy mills . . . 

What do you mean by protection? Schutzhund? Personal Protection Dog? A dog that barks if a stranger comes to the door?

What was it about this breeder and the dogs that impressed you? A pup that is to have the correct temperament to do personal protection should have a confident, curious, responsive and outgoing personality. The breeder should know this, and should have matched you up with the right type of puppy.


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## brogers93 (Aug 23, 2009)

Crying on the way home and first few nights definitely normal. Even eating poop is somewhat common, particularly if the dog is sick and has diarrhea. Our dog is smart as can be but she went through a poop eating phase when she had coccidia.

The other issues...i'd check with a vet and follow up with the breeder. Something isn't right.


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

First of all, you should NEVER get a puppy at 6 weeks old of ANY breed. Just a future tip, any one who would let go of such a young pup shouldn't be allowed to have, much less breed dogs.

You didn't get a "bad" breed or even a dumb dog, the dog sounds like it's got something going on health wise.

You also should have done much more research on the breed you were getting. And I agree, if you want protection then get a gun. If someone broke into your house and had a gun and shot the dog then where is your protection after that? You're suppose to be your dogs protector.


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

FIrst of all, he's not going to be worth squat as a protection dog until he's at least 2. Don't encourage any behavior that looks like protection until that age becuase it's not protection, it's fear.

Second, eating poop and sitting in pee were things my pup did when he was a baby. It wasn't from lack of human contact or poor conditions - his puppy pen was in the breeders living room with their teenage daughters and friends pawing the puppies every day. When they're that little, the mother or the breeder cleans up after them so they just don't know better.

If he pees all the time, first have your vet check him out. If there's no medical reason, you'll need to restrict how much water he drinks. Otto used to drink the bowl dry and go on the floor. He didn't know better. I kept a 1 gallon jug of water i n the fridge and doled it out sparingly.

When you call his name, have a tasty treat for him. Roast beef works wonderfully for this. Get his attention with a whistle or a funny noise then say his name. Give him the roast beef. Repeat. It's happy and fun WOOHOO

Otto also wiggled out of my arms when I tried to hold him. Or he nipped. Not from lack of human contact, it was becuase he was busy and didn't want to sit still. At 16 months, Otto is a lover boy, always wanting to cuddle and hold hands with me.

Crying, can't help you with that.


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## bigboy (Sep 21, 2009)

you did not get a bad breed there is no shuch thing has a bad breed just bad breeders. i would take him to vet to see how he is, if he is fine then start housebreaking him and telling to go potty outside my puppy is 8 weeks old and still does not know his name it will take time it won't happen over night


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## Anja1Blue (Feb 27, 2008)

Your puppy sounds lonely and miserable. He is an 8 week old baby for heavens sake, and already you've got him tagged as a loser because he isn't at the door scaring away the bad guys. Puppies need lots of love and lots of patience - and visits to the vet are part of the early months whether they have health issues or not. Some more dominant puppies are squirmy when you try to pick them up, but I'm not sure that's the issue here. It is the breeders responsibilty to make sure the puppies are handled right from the get-go - if this person neglected to do that, then that might explain why this little guy is resisting. I feel sorry for him, he is not a happy camper. Firstly you MUST take him to the vet to make sure there isn't something like a UTI (urinary tract infection) going on. That can be painful, and it might also explain the crying......Secondly you need to get back to the breeder and explain the situation - a reputable person will be there with assistance for you, long after the sale. (Does this breeder have a website? I'd be interested to see where you got this pup from.......)Lastly, you need to keep things upbeat - if you are registering any kind of disapproval or anger because of what is going on with him it is only going to make matters worse. (Not saying that you are, but a lot of people lose their patience when they see a mess.......) Good luck and let us know what happens.

_____________________________________________
Susan

Anja GSD
Conor GSD - adopted from this Board
Blue GSD - waiting at the Bridge


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## Mandalay (Apr 21, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: AC1 I finally found one last week with the german bloodlines. I saw the parents and was very impressed. Now I have a 8 week old german shepherd for a week now and I feel like I got the dumb one.


Did you pick out the pup or did the breeder? Did you do any reference checks on them and did they do any on you? What made you like THIS pup over others that you have seen? What was so impressive about the parents? Why did you decide to bring home a 7 week old puppy? Another week with his mom would have benefited him greatly.



> Originally Posted By: AC1When we brought him home, it was a 5 hour drive and he cried the entire time in my wifes arms.


 My dog was a litter of either 10 or 12 (I dont remember now, it was too long ago) so she cried all the way home and randomly for the first few days, too. She came from a large family and I took her away from that, brought her to my house with people she did not know and then, at night, she was put it a crate...being a puppy is hard and they whine and cry to express themselves. Much like how a baby whines and cries. 



> Originally Posted By: AC1 Now that we have him home, he lays in his crate in pee.


How long is he in the crate? Is it big enough for him to get out of the pee? Even if it is, he may still sit in the pee. Again, he is a baby. 



> Originally Posted By: AC1 When you hold him, he panics and cries and forces his way out of your arms.


 Is he panicking or trying to get away to explore? Is it possible that he is hurt and cries out of pain?



> Originally Posted By: AC1We bought a 6 week old mini schnauzer 6 months ago and didnt have these problems.


 Again with the young pups...they should stay with their moms and littermates as long as possible, 8 weeks is ideal, 9 is better. How is he with your new pup? Do they get along? This is a lot of puppy to have in the house at one time.




> Originally Posted By: AC1We call him his name 200 times a day, and he still doesnt know his name. Is it because he is 8 weeks old or did I get the dumb one of the litter?


 I bet when you were 8 weeks old your mom said your name 200 times a day and I bet you did not respond either. 



> Originally Posted By: AC1I bought this for a protection dog, but it seems he's to much of a baby. Will he grow out of this?


 That's because he IS a baby!! He's 8 weeks old, give him a break.

Not trying to sound mean, but I think a trip to the vet is in order for him. Also, you may want to consider returning him to the breeder. This breed takes a long time to grow up. They are 2, maybe 2.5 years old before they are completely mature and have a long teenage phase when they are stubborn, forgetful and difficult to live with if you are not COMPLETELY 100% understanding of them. Since he has been at your home for 1 week and you are already questioning him, I am concerned that you are going to tire of him around month 7, 8 or 9. What about when he is teething and starts being mouthy? Are you ready for that? How much research have you done on this breed? I promise you, coming from a first time GSD owner, this breed is nothing like any other. I have had Rotties, Dobes, Rat Terriers, Beardies and SCWs...They do NOT compare to the GSD in terms of mouthiness, stubborness and being in your face. Fortunately, they also do not compare in terms of loving, faithfulness, and respect. They truly are an incredible breed, but you are only going to get out what you put in.

I wish you luck. We'd love to see pictures and more important, we'd love to know what you find out at the vet.


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## Lola1969 (Mar 6, 2007)

I have a feeling you are not ready for a German Shepherd puppy. HE is a BABY. He sounds lonely, scared, and confused, and don't think for a second that he doesn't pick up on your apparent dislike for him already.

PLease take him to the vet and let us know the prognosis! Shepherds take a long time to mature. Mine is 3.5 years and I think now just barely out of the puppy/adolescent stage. They require lots of attention, training, and understanding. LOTS. If you're not ready for that, I would advise looking into an adult or perhaps another breed which is not so demanding.


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## Jason L (Mar 20, 2009)

Give the pup a break. We were all peeing on ourselves at that age.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

I agree, contact your breeder and take him back while he's still so young if it's not working out.

GSD's can be very sensitive when they are so young and just pulled from the rest of the litter, familiar home, knowing all the dogs and humans. Then suddenly all that is removed and replaced by ???

Takes alot of time, patience, calmness from us (no yelling if there are 'accidents') and some pups just frankly aren't a fit for our background and experience. Working with a good breeder to figure this out would be your best bet, for you AND the puppy.


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## jake (Sep 11, 2004)

Sorry but just the title of your post makes me think perhaps you need to return dog to breeder and maybe rethink exactly what you want in a dog.If you qualify being a foster to a GSD -or another breed might help you better understand what you want


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## CherryCola (Apr 24, 2006)

You've got some great replies. And I agree, firstly you need to get him checked over by a vet. Secondly, he is a baby. GSD's, especially GSD puppies are very demanding, and you need to be very dedicated and patient with them. They do differ from other breeds - we also have a Border Collie and she was a lot less demanding as a puppy. Your puppy won't be ready to be a 'protection' dog until he is at least two years old. GSD's don't mature until that age. 

Saying that you feel like you got 'the dumb one' sounds to me like you're already losing patience with him, and honestly, you've got a long way to go. You haven't got to the teething phase, the adolescent stage, and everything in between yet. Having a puppy is supposed to be an enjoyable experience. Poop, pee, crying and all, you work through it. You have to bond with your baby too! Having doubts about it is not going to create a great relationship. If you think you're struggling now, I would maybe consider returning the pup.


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## KristinEnn (Oct 2, 2008)

Everyone has allready said it so I won't either but.. My suggestion would be: seems to me you are not ready for a puppy if anything. Which is ok. My husabnd and I were not ready for a puppy many years ago so we adopted an adult dog first. We took steps that way. So that would be my suggestion. I would return the pup... not to say you will be a bad dog owner but your impatience ,
inexperience and possibly unwillingness to learn more about puppies and the breed is going to cause nothing but negative experiences for this pup. So take him back.. look into a rescue.. rescue an older adult dog.


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## AC1 (Sep 24, 2009)

Thanks for all the replies but I really dont agree with most of you. 

I don't see how my dog eating poop every few minutes and peeing all over the floor (which I found out was dominate toward my other dog) makes me a bad pet owner. I've had puppies before and none of them pee'd on the floor or ate their own poop. 

I don't see why everyone is offended by me saying I might have a bad breed, or I might have a dog thats not so smart. 

When looking for a german shepherd, the #1 thing I read was to find a good breed. Bad breeds have bad temperments, bad breeds have bad hips, bad breeds, both of their ears dont stand up.

There is such thing as stupid humans. There is such thing as retarded humans, there is such thing as autism. How is me saying I think I got a bad breed dog pissing you all off so much? If the dog attacked my daughter and bit her head off, couldnt that be a bad temperment from bad breeding?

I don't think the right answer is "return the dog your not ready for it" just because I am asking if its normal for him to eat poop and pee all over my floor when I take him outside 8 times a day. Besides "take him to the vet" this is some of the most stupid advise I've ever gotten.

I've been to dog shows, I've seen how some of these nuts feel the dogs balls and treat the dog like they want to have sex with them. Just because I'm not doing that with my dog doesnt mean I'm a bad dog owner. Maybe all dogs aren't perfect, maybe I did get a bad breed. There is such a thing as a bad breed.


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## allieg (Nov 4, 2008)

I'll speak for the ones suggesting the vet.You need to have the vet check him out to first rule out a UTI or maybe under developed bladder.Things like that.I don't know if other diseases can cause urination problems but the vet needs to look at the possibility.

WE just think your being too hard on the 8 week old pup.As far as playing and ball drive that will come with time.Mine didn't do anything for about a month after we got her.She still isn't ball driven or protective and she is 17 months old.

The crying is not normal if he has been with you for a week.It's normal for the first few days but not a week or more.This is why we are suggesting a vet visit.

Most people on here are very experienced at the breed they have been at it for years.I've only been at it for 1yr.I have learned a lot from these people and will learn more before my time is up.

Please start with the vet visit so you can move on to other things if he checks out healthy.
Also have you contacted the breeder for some insight?Most are willing to answer questions to but your mind at ease.


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## Myamom (Oct 10, 2005)

I have two poop eaters...both adults...always were. It's a dog thing...
The peeing thing...it's just an 8 week old....just needs training....(or there is a medical issue or it's scared). If you read down in puppy training...you will see MANY owners going through the same issues. 

While I'm not a breeder....I'm pretty sure even the best breed dogs can end up with bad hips or an ear that doesn't stand. Hip issues are a condition that GSD's are prone to. Breeders can breed to strive for conditions that will make it less likely...but it absolutely can still happen. 

Temperment....usually is a reflection on how the dog is raised. I have two badly bred GSD's.....I can assume....since one came from a puppy mill...and the other was abandoned at 8 weeks old on a porch (obviously an impulse buy or left over from a byb)....and they have the sweetest temperments ever. 

I also work in rescue...and can say that a majority of our dogs are coming from "bad breeding" and are absolutely wonderful. 

Treat your puppy with kindess and consistency and you will have a loving companion for life.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I believe it may have been the way that you phrased your question that had ppl taken aback. First, I took your question of "did I get a bad breed?" as the breed itself. Not as you intended, and explained in your second post, of the breeding that your specific puppy came from. 

Second, your frustration is very, very clear and that is a concern also. You have a puppy from one of the smartest dog breeds there is. If you take your frustration out on your puppy then you, or someone else, will have alot of fixing to do not to mention it's unfair to the puppyl

You first stop needs to be to the vet. That is the consistent answer in all the posts. You need to make a call to the breeder and express your concerns to them. I highly doubt the problems are from a bad breeding. I think, and I'm no expert just using a little common sense, that he is way to young for behavioral problems to start showing up.


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## Lola1969 (Mar 6, 2007)

Wow, "take your dog to the vet" is stupid advice, even just to rule out a health issue?


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## Jason L (Mar 20, 2009)

You just got the pup home a few days ago so you are going to take him to the vet anyway, right? So what's the big deal?

If you really think he is retarded, return him now so the breeder can find him another home (preferably with someone who doesn't think he is retarded).


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

And if you define "dumb" and/or "stupid" as having developmental problems, or Autism, then yes, people are going to get offended. 

I know of at least one board member who is high-functioning Autistic. She finished school, knows three languages, did a stint in the military, and now works with aviation technical documents for a living - in addition to training and participating in obedience and protection sports with her dogs - not exactly what I would call "dumb".









(no offense taken, but be careful about your choice of words in the future







).


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

He did not say taking the puppy to the vet was stupid advice. He said 


> Quote:Besides "take him to the vet" this is some of the most stupid advise I've ever gotten.


First, you need to give him a little more time to adjust.

Second, when are you feeding him? Are you taking him out within 15-20 minutes?

Third, Does he have water in front of him all the time?

Fourth, How long is he left in his crate?

Here is a thread with the same issues that might be helpful...

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1202890&page=1#Post1202890

and a continuation

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubb...&gonew=1#UNREAD


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## Doubleminttwin (Aug 21, 2009)

I can see how you might be upset w/some of the responses but what I ask is that you look at how you worded your first post. This is an online dog forum, people come on here because they love and respect dogs, so if you go around calling your 8 week old puppy dumb it rubs some nerves, especially when I think most of people thought you meant that you got a bad breed in general. 

As for the puppy crying, Baya did cry all the way home and then randomly when she got back over a few days. You have to think that this is their first time away from home and how do puppies get their moms attention? They whine, when they whine mom and siblings come find them and comfort them. All your pup is doing is trying to find its family, its how they comunicate. Eventually your pup will adjust but it takes some time! 

As for the peeing, man they seem like they go constantly dont they! Baya seemed like it but I think when it (can't remember if its a boy or a girl) relaxes and feels safe it will regulate and start to work with you, but I agree a vet visit it in order! Poop eating is common, I watched a its me or the dog episode on it once and its pretty hard to stop sometimes. What I would do is make sure your pup is getting all the nutrients it needs with its food and make sure its not eating to fast (not sure if its true but what the lady said was that if they eat too fast when it comes out the other end it has more undigested food in it and if they aren't getting enough nutrients they will eat their poo to make up for it) Don't quote me on that though







You could ask your vet also they might have some ideas for you. It could just be a puppy behavior lol Don't give up on the poor thing yet!

I don't appreciate your comment about the people touching their dogs inapropriately and looking like they want to have sex with them, thats immature and rediculous not to mention extremely rude to corrupt a respected activity such as dog showing by trying to turn it into something disgusting. Dog show people are not sexual deviants, they have a respect and love for dogs that you clearly don't understand, but I would advise you not judge others just because they have a hobby or career you no nothing about.


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## Anja1Blue (Feb 27, 2008)

What saddens me most about your response ( to replies from people who are experienced GSD owners who know what they are talking about) is that you will take nothing away from this discussion other than being offended. No-one has made more mistakes over the years with their dogs than I have - but I sucked it up when told I had screwed up, or didn't understand a certain type of behavior, and moved on, utilizing the knowledge of others and learning along the way.

If you cannot be open to this Board you are in the wrong place - people here are kind and helpful and have a lot to contribute. We put the dogs first. But you have to be willing to listen to what they are saying - and I mean LISTEN, not go off on a toot because you don't like what you are hearing. 

Your puppy needs help from you - or please find him a new home where he will be seen as a valuable family member, and not an encumbrance. 

___________________________________________
Susan

Anja GSD
Conor GSD - adopted from this Board
Blue GSD - waiting at the Brdige


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

here is another helpful thread for you.

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1203682&page=1#Post1203682


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## Lola1969 (Mar 6, 2007)

well, I read the "besides" the same as "in addition to" so I interpret that sentence as "in addition to 'take him to the vet'..." Maybe I'm wrong, if so I apologize to the OP. I don't see how else to interpret that sentence though.


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## Qyn (Jan 28, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: CastlemaidAnd if you define "dumb" and/or "stupid" as having developmental problems, or Autism, then yes, people are going to get offended.
> 
> I know of at least one board member who is high-functioning Autistic. She finished school, knows three languages, did a stint in the military, and now works with aviation technical documents for a living - in addition to training and participating in obedience and protection sports with her dogs - not exactly what I would call "dumb".
> 
> ...


Yes and I consider her to be an exceptional person in all respects. Many autistic and asperger syndrome people have a much higher (exceptional level) intelligence rating than the general population.

To the OP, you may have got a pup who is not perfect from the getgo but if you are willing to persist you may end up with the most wonderful dog you will ever own as this BREED is a wonderful breed. No "breed" is "bad" however every breed has members with differing qualities.

All the problems you have presented can be a part of a normal pup assimilation into your home or it could be a sign of a problem in breeding, socialisation or your expectations of a young animal.

You can choose to take the advice of the people on this board to get a veterinary assessment of the health of your pup or return the pup to the breeder. Everything you have posted to me is fixable but not by you if you have unreasonable expectations that an 8wo pup should readily assimilate into your home, be fully house trained and know the name you have chosen. I really do wish you the best.


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

> Originally Posted By: AC1Thanks for all the replies but I really dont agree with most of you.


Okay. You have the right to not listen to people who have more experience than you.


> Originally Posted By: AC1How is me saying I think I got a bad breed dog pissing you all off so much?


people are getting upset over your impropper use of the word breed. Breed refers to german shepherds as a whole - the whole breed. The word you are looking for is 'breeding' 'litter' etc.



> Originally Posted By: AC1I don't think the right answer is "return the dog your not ready for it" just because I am asking if its normal for him to eat poop and pee all over my floor when I take him outside 8 times a day.


Yeah it is becuase you seem to be a very unenlightened person who isn't going to listen to advice. Everyone here loves the breed - some of us to the point of it being a character fault. None of us want to see a puppy with someone who thinks it's a retard.



> Originally Posted By: AC1 Besides "take him to the vet" this is some of the most stupid advise I've ever gotten.


Peeing every 5 minutes and walking around crying all point to something being wrong with your puppy.

Have you taken this puppy to the vet at all? It's something you need to do. They have to have shots but since you know everything, I'm sure you know this too. 



> Originally Posted By: AC1I've been to dog shows, I've seen how some of these nuts feel the dogs balls and treat the dog like they want to have sex with them.


Really? I mean REALLY? I find it very perverted that someone would view an anatomical check that way.

Take your puppy back. You don't deserve him.


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## Daisy1986 (Jul 9, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: AC1I don't see how my dog eating poop every few minutes and peeing all over the floor (which I found out was dominate toward my other dog) makes me a bad pet owner.



I read your OP with a shocked look on my face. Then did not comment because I thought you were just messing with us...which sad to say I am finding out how seriously little people know when they go get a puppy. It never ceases to amaze me. 

If you cannot handle what this little puppy is doing now...the training only gets more difficult and requires more dedication from here on out. 

That is why you should take it back, so this puppy has a chance at a better more committed home. 

Your committment is so little, that you refuse to take good advice. 

Pardon me, I am a little angry at owners like you right now, I have a GSD puppy, 7 months old in my home right now that we got out of a kill shelter, she was going to die because she knocked over a toddler. 
You seem to have the same mentality. 
But the puppy to me seems pretty doggone smart to me, if it can pee to show dominace at 8 wks.


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## FredD (Jul 5, 2009)

Ac1, people here are giving you good advice. I see you have a bad "attitude" on advice.. You asked, they answered. Listen, learn.
"Watch"
Watch your thoughts:
they become "WORDS"
Watch your words:
they become "ACTIONS"
Watch your actions:
they become "HABITS"
Watch your habits:
they become "CHARACTER"
Watch your character:
it becomes your "DESTINY"


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: AC1
> I don't see how my dog eating poop every few minutes and peeing all over the floor (which I found out was dominate toward my other dog) makes me a bad pet owner. I've had puppies before and none of them pee'd on the floor or ate their own poop.


I missed this the first time I read your post. If you really believe that 8 week old puppy is doing this to dominate your other dog then please, please, please call the breeder and take him back. That is just not possible at that age and the dumbest thing I've ever heard.


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: FredDAc1, people here are giving you good advice. I see you have a bad "attitude" on advice.. You asked, they answered. Listen, learn.
> "Watch"
> Watch your thoughts:
> they become "WORDS"
> ...










Great post....


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## BlackPuppy (Mar 29, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: AC1Thanks for all the replies but I really dont agree with most of you.


You are talking to people who are intimate with the breed. I would take their advice here seriously.



> Originally Posted By: AC1peeing all over the floor (which I found out was dominate toward my other dog)


And who told you this? I find it very unlikely.



> Originally Posted By: AC1I've had puppies before and none of them pee'd on the floor or ate their own poop.


Sorry, but there are a lot of puppies that do. My female is 4 years old and still must eat all the poop she can find. She learned it from her mother. She also is a little attention deficit, so it was really hard to potty train her. I finally succeeded when she was 12 months old. 

All puppies are different, but if your breeder didn't tell you to take the puppy to the vet in your first week of ownership, you have a bad breeder and maybe you did get a substandard puppy who is going to need more work. But most likely it's just a typical puppy.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally Posted By: AC1I don't see how my dog eating poop every few minutes and peeing all over the floor (which I found out was dominate toward my other dog) makes me a bad pet owner. I've had puppies before and none of them pee'd on the floor or ate their own poop.


Keefer has finally stopped dining on poop, (took him a couple of years) but Halo is still very much a connoisseur of excrement at 10-1/2 months old. She loves food and doesn't much care if it's fresh or pre-digested and coming out the other end. Gross, yes, but poop eating is extremely common in dogs. Just because you haven't had a dog that did that before doesn't mean it's strange behavior. 

And you've had this 8 week old puppy for a week and he's peeing on the floor? Well yeah, he's not housebroken yet. He'll pee wherever he is whenever he needs to go until you teach him where he SHOULD be going. Babies are in diapers up to two years or more, why would you expect that a baby puppy will already have enough bowel and bladder control and understand where it is and is not appropriate to eliminate after just a week in his new home? And if he's peeing excessively, that can indicate a urinary tract infection. If he does have a UTI he should be on antibiotics - he'll feel better and won't be peeing constantly, which will make your life better too, yes? BTW, your breeder should have required that you take him to your vet and have him checked out within a few days of bringing him home. Have you taken him to the vet yet? I have to agree with the others about him laying in his pee. Dogs won't generally do that unless they've been confined in a small area and had no choice, they tend to be averse to eating and sleeping near where they eliminate. It looks like that may have been the case here and he's become accustomed to it, which will likely complicate the housebreaking process. 



> Quote:When we brought him home, it was a 5 hour drive and he cried the entire time in my wifes arms.


He was just taken away from his mom and littermates, of course he cried. Again, perfectly normal - he's a BABY. We had a 10 hour drive home with Dena, and almost the entire time she wasn't sleeping she was crying. She cried in the car for quite a while after that too, but she eventually stopped and learned to love car trips.



> Quote:We call him his name 200 times a day, and he still doesnt know his name. Is it because he is 8 weeks old or did I get the dumb one of the litter?


How exactly have you tried to teach him what his name is? Saying it 200 times a day won't do it, the word doesn't have any relevance for him. For one thing, hearing it that often with nothing to make it mean anything to the puppy is pretty much going to guarantee that he's going to tune it out, just like all the other words he hear you say each day that have nothing to do with him. Try sitting near him, saying his name, and giving him a tiny treat (size of a pea). Do this 5 or 10 times in a row several times a day. It won't take long for him to respond to that name, because now it has meaning to him. Don't use the name in anger, and never call him to you for punishment of any kind. You want him to learn that his name means good things, and that coming to you is good - a treat, some praise, being petted, playtime, not a bath or a nail trim or some other potentially unpleasant thing. 



> Quote:I don't see why everyone is offended by me saying I might have a bad breed, or I might have a dog thats not so smart.


It's not that people are offended by that, it's the fact that you don't seem to understand that he's acting exactly like a 9 week old baby puppy acts that people are reacting to. If you don't even know the most basic things about raising a puppy it shows that you may be completely unprepared for this, and your adversarial attitude about it isn't exactly endearing you to the people you've come to for advice. It's possible you do indeed have a badly bred puppy, and you're absolutely right that there are plenty of those out there. But nothing in your initial post shows any indication of that, and at his age and the amount of time you've had him, it would be impossible to know anyway. Yet you seem to have already written him off as a bad puppy, and stupid to boot, so the advice that maybe this isn't the breed for you and you should return him is spot on. If you are committed to keeping this puppy, you're going to have to be patient and TRAIN him. No puppy is born knowing where to pee and poop, or the difference between his own toys and your shoes or your furniture, not to bark excessively, not to use you or your child as a chew toy, not to dig up your yard, he will have to be taught all those things. Kids don't pop out of the womb knowing how to walk, talk, and read, and yet time and time again people come here wondering why their puppy just doesn't seem to get it. What have you tried to teach him so far? How much do you know about dog training? Have you signed him up for a puppy class?



> Quote:I've been to dog shows, I've seen how some of these nuts feel the dogs balls and treat the dog like they want to have sex with them. Just because I'm not doing that with my dog doesnt mean I'm a bad dog owner.


Only intact dogs are eligible to be shown. Nobody is feeling up the dogs for kicks and jollies, the judge needs to make sure that the testicles are present and descended or the dog will be disqualified. All dogs are not perfect, but even the most well trained, well behaved dogs did not get that way by accident or magic. A dedicated owner educated himself/herself about the breed, about training techniques, they took some classes or hired a trainer, they socialized the heck out of him/her, maybe read some books - and they put a LOT of time and effort into making that puppy as perfect a dog as they possibly could. With a small dog you can perhaps get away with not doing much training, but with a smart active breed like this that will get big and strong at a relatively young age, you do not have that luxury. 



> Originally Posted By: Anja1BlueWhat saddens me most about your response ( to replies from people who are experienced GSD owners who know what they are talking about) is that you will take nothing away from this discussion other than being offended. No-one has made more mistakes over the years with their dogs than I have - but I sucked it up when told I had screwed up, or didn't understand a certain type of behavior, and moved on, utilizing the knowledge of others and learning along the way.
> 
> If you cannot be open to this Board you are in the wrong place - people here are kind and helpful and have a lot to contribute. We put the dogs first. But you have to be willing to listen to what they are saying - and I mean LISTEN, not go off on a toot because you don't like what you are hearing.
> 
> Your puppy needs help from you - or please find him a new home where he will be seen as a valuable family member, and not an encumbrance.


What she said.


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## CherryCola (Apr 24, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: AC1
> I don't see how my dog eating poop every few minutes and peeing all over the floor (which I found out was dominate toward my other dog) makes me a bad pet owner. I've had puppies before and none of them pee'd on the floor or ate their own poop.
> 
> There is such thing as stupid humans. There is such thing as retarded humans, there is such thing as autism. How is me saying I think I got a bad breed dog pissing you all off so much?


First of all, my pup ate poop. Still does, she's almost 3. A lot of them do it. Secondly, owning a GSD pup can be quite different to other breeds as other people have already pointed out. He's just a baby, when he starts teething you'll find him very chewy. Are you gonna find that stupid too, when he starts chewing your stuff? I just think you're making a big deal, when all your puppy is doing, is being a puppy..

And that second paragraph... I have autism myself, so maybe you just hit a raw nerve, but I can't help but feel that it was a little unnecessary. Because I have autism I am the human equivalent of a badly bred dog?


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

Kim, I think this is troll just looking to push buttons.

If not a troll, I'm quite sure he's wacking his dog with a rolled up newspaper while he's pushing the pups nose in it's own poop. Then he's frustrated the puppy isn't getting it and walks around crying. 

AC1, if you are for real, I feel bad for your puppy.


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## Daisy (Jan 4, 2009)

That was my first thought after reading the original post and reply ... troll.... If not a troll, then one unlucky pup.


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## Minnieski (Jan 27, 2009)

There have been some really good replies here, but I just have to say that 8 times a day is NOT enough to take out a pup of that age. Of course he's peeing all over, he has a TINY bladder. I think we took our pup out every 20 minutes when she was that age and wake, and every time she woke up after a nap. 

Seriously, take him back to the breeder. He knows you don't like him, it's not going to get any better if you don't want to care for him with love. He knows you're disgusted and upset and angry with him for not being perfect. Take him back before you mess him up for someone else.


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## Anja1Blue (Feb 27, 2008)

The Troll idea occurred to me too - a bit late, admittedly. Hope that's what it is, or I fear for the future of that little guy.

_________________________________________
Susan

Anja GSD
Conor GSD - adopted from this Board
Blue GSD - waiting at the Bridge


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## Brian22 (Sep 20, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: MinnieskiThere have been some really good replies here, but I just have to say that 8 times a day is NOT enough to take out a pup of that age. Of course he's peeing all over, he has a TINY bladder. I think we took our pup out every 20 minutes when she was that age and wake, and every time she woke up after a nap.
> 
> Seriously, take him back to the breeder. He knows you don't like him, it's not going to get any better if you don't want to care for him with love. He knows you're disgusted and upset and angry with him for not being perfect. Take him back before you mess him up for someone else.


X2 I am in the process of training a puppy, he is currently 11 weeks (give or take a few days) and he is potty trained, but he does still have an occasional accident. I still have to take him out between 10-12 times per day. Simply because he doesn't have bladder control to hold it like an adult dog, that and his bladder is small. And just so you know, it took Gunner about 2 weeks to learn his name. The poop eating is completely normal. Sitting in pee, again normal.

I also agree that you should take him back to the breeder, If I know anything about dogs... they are absolute experts at reading body language. Even at his age, he knows how you feel about him already. The dog picking up on your signals that he is unwanted and inferior are doing a lot more damage that you can ever realize. His confidence level is taking a SERIOUS hit and is going to take a lot of work to repair the current damage. If it continues like this, don't be surprised if the dog turns on you, Just like people, dogs don't like being abused and the do have their breaking points.

I do not consider myself to be an experienced person as far as the GSD, but I have had a lot of experience with large breed dogs. The absolute best thing you can do to help the dog is is to realize he is a puppy, he is going to make mistakes, and believe me, you will make them to. When he has an accident or chews on something he is supposed to, just remember to stay calm and stay consistent.

There isn't a single breed of dog in existence that will respond to belligerent yelling and scolding as a form of training. The only thing that will teach him is that you are unstable and he will be afraid of you.


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## Technostorm (May 24, 2009)

Troll or not! I'm going to agree that YOU have a "Bad Puppy!".. Here's the deal!

1. I will take him off your hands for you and save you the time, efforts and money. I will even pay for the air fare to transport your "Bad Puppy" to me if he's in the USA. 

2. I will promised you that I will PUNISH him for being a "Bad Puppy" by making him go to the vet with me and putting him on the COLD VET table so he can be thoroughly molested by the loving VET.

3. I will further PUNISH your "Bad Puppy" by giving him lots of Love, giving him tons of treats and and a decent home.

4. He will get PUNISHED by being taken outside to a designated potty area every 1 hour, and 5 minutes after meal and drinks. I promised to make your "Dumb puppy" miserable by praising him each and every time he goes potty in the designated area and I will make sure his punishment includes treats and lots of love.

5. If he ever pees in his crate or lays on his pee, I will be so upset with him that I will simply move him to a different area and then thoroughly clean up his crate without him even knowing! 

6. If he ever shows dominance by peeing everywhere, I will Punish him by encouraging him to go to the designated area. He will be very miserable as you can see. 

7. If he cries or whines, I will make him feel miserable by calmly talking to him or holding him in my arms with a nice fuzzy blanket. I will further punish him by placing a small radio next to the crate. If he continues to whine and cry, fear not!, I will put him on my bed and offer him tasty treats.

8. I will make sure he never gets to munch on his poop as a punishment by cleaning it within the same time he poops. This ought to show him who's boss! He wouldn't stand a chance of eating his own poop haha! <evilgrin> This is my ultimate punishment for that "Dumb Puppy". 

9. This will totally put the hurt on this "Dumb Puppy" for being a bad breed. He will work his butts off when he is 4 months old after he gets all his shots. I will work him so hard with basic OB training that he will understand how "Bad" he have been for eating his own poop, laying on his pee, crying and whining all the time and not knowing his name!. 

10. In fact, I will make sure he never hears his name "Dumb Puppy" be called EVER again just so he knows I've punished him for not knowing his name! He will be called something else that has 2 syllabels in it and easy to to catch on so REST ASSURE! I will help you accomplish your feat by taking him away.. 

So please, if you think I'm the right candidate to own this puppy, please let me know. I'll be here waiting for his arrival. Thanks. 

Dan


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## Chantell (May 29, 2009)

Dan!! Well said!


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## SpeedBump (Dec 29, 2008)

I'll help pay the airfare to Dan.


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## JenniferH (Oct 9, 2007)

Hopefully we have a troll here...My puppy is almost 4 months od. Doing great with potty training. But he's still deaf when he wants to be! Its normal stuff...


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## mysheba (Sep 26, 2009)

I feel so sorry for your puppy. You should own fish instead of dogs.


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## LadyHawk (Jan 19, 2005)

**Noticed that he never bothered to check back in***

I say this with respect and in fairness to all. Without the intention of ticking anyone off......
I do not believe he chose the right breed ....a stuffed animal might better suit him.


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## AusGSD (Aug 23, 2009)

When I first read this thread I also had my mouth open in shock. 

If you ask for help from ppl that clearly know more than you do with regard to the breed, than perhaps you need to listen to it even if its not to your liking. 

My first reaction to your attitude is your poor puppy, you need to nurture it, teach it and love it if you are going to get anywhere. Its not dumb, it needs your help to learn what is acceptable and whats not.

It will make mistakes, it will do things you really wish it wouldn't. 

You need to make a decision, can you help the puppy become what you want from it, will you devote the time it needs to grow? You need some more realistic expectations also.

If you cannot do the above- take it back, save both you and the puppy from a really poor ending.


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

http://www.pet-comfort-products.com/why-dogs-eat-poop.html



coprophagia- aka poop eating to those less versed in dog behavior, is very common in dogs. Please see above for ideas to help a dog.

You are hopefully an open-minded, open-hearted person who wants to learn how to best care for a GSD dog. A red flag for problems is when a puppy owner starts off assuming that the dog has a problem. This is especially of concern when the behaviors listed are normal and not of concern to those who have owned countless numbers of dogs of this breed.

To be sure, the GSD is not a dog for everyone. In fact, it is probably not a breed for most people. Do not be upset if you decide the breed is not for you. Another home could be a perfect fit and all would be happier.

German Shepherd pups are a lot of work. I have one and I think several toddlers would be easier. AFter all the peeing and pooing in the house, now I am to the holes in yard. ripped clothes, bleeding skin, always grabbing a taboo object, dragging cat around and generally destroying anything is sight stage.

All of these things do not disturb me. In fact they give me lots of smiles. This hellion who keeps me on the hop both day and night is just the type of thing I love. My mother calls it masochism.

A good doggie friend who has rescued many young dogs over the years just rescued her first GSD pup. She saw me outside and came running out asking me "how do you GSD people do this?!!"
She is a dog person from way back but was having her hands full and was shocked how different the GSD was in her experience.

Unless you are just trying to rankle well-meaning people on the internet, please open your mind to the idea that the issues may be more because of what you think you know and what you don't realize you don't know.

After my first GSD, I thought I should get a PhD in dog awarded! The dog pushed me beyond what I knew and who I was. It is not easy. You have to be humble and willing to learn fast! That is the key.

The GSD is certainly not for everyone and there is no shame in deciding it is not a match.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

While the OP may be a troll, (and we can all hope so for the sake of a real pup) I am really glad to hear all the responsible replies. They'll be here, visible to new members and lurkers, for some time.
Good work!


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

Is this NORMAL???!!! Bad breeding??

This morning, so far well before 11a.m., my pup has been on a tear.
He grabbed my bath towel and took it over to the Catahoula innocently resting in his wire crate. The next you know, the Catahola has half the towel in the crate and with 5 month old pup on the outside a tug of war has ensued. THEN, 55lb Catahoula and large wire crate in its entirety are being dragged acrosss the living room by the GSD pupper! 

While I am replacing the Catahoula and crate to proper spot in domicile, the pup notices entire box of Diet Coke in kitchen. The box is immediately dragged and riipped and 12 cans of soda roll around living room. I gather the cans quickly already knowing the spew that will be created when the pup bites one. Its a big laugh watching the death of the box!

THEN, I notice poo on the floor! Whatever.... we will blame the cat. I get toilet paper and take it to the toilet. Just as I am about to flush, the pup runs into bathroom and dives in. Yup, he grabs it and its the entire deal..TP and all eaten while I pursue.

Is this normal? Probably. Am I? Not a chance in the world!

I didn't make any of this up. Time to think about what's for lunch.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

Samba, Great post!!









LOL these dogs are a lot of work, but just can't beat the non-stop fun! I have to say that many of the puppy posts on this board really went a long way to prepare me for my first puppy!


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## travclay (Sep 6, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: Chance's MomI agree, if you want protection then get a gun. If someone broke into your house and had a gun and shot the dog then where is your protection after that? You're suppose to be your dogs protector.


Amen to that.

My pup is 16 weeks old and he cried just about the whole way home when he wasn't busy barfing in my truck. And it took him bout a week or two to learn his name, like every one said, he's a baby, i know it's hard an with him being a GSD you expect more, just give him time. He'll get better and when he does, he'll improve quickly. 

As far as the poop eating goes Ive heard of people putting red pepper flakes or meat tenderizer in the poop. I guess pups don't like tender spicy poo







Not sure if that's the best advice for that but I know a few people who have tried that and said it worked. 

I agree with the general consensus though, make a vet appointment and see what they have to say.

Good luck!


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

My little Djiboti read Dan's post & leaned in to tell me, 'Marry that man, NOW.' He then read this by Samba, _"THEN, I notice poo on the floor! Whatever.... we will blame the cat._" Djibouti immediately batted his bee-you-tee-full brown eyes & begged me, 'Marry that one too. Pleeeease' 

TG I'm done with this thread & its excellent responses or Djibouti might find me a harem.


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## Sashmom (Jun 5, 2002)

> Originally Posted By: Jason LinGive the pup a break. We were all peeing on ourselves at that age.


LOL how true but we expect an 8 wk old puppy to know right away to go outside. They have to be taught, with love and encouragement. 
They are smart dogs


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## Josiebear (Oct 16, 2006)

I agree with others, you're expecting way too much from an 8 week old pup. First take it to the vet to rule out any health issues especially UTI. 2ndly buy a crate and start crate training, at that age the pup will need to go potty every 2 hours and tether the puppy to you if you cannot keep an eye on it. 

If you force that poor puppy to grow up too soon that puppy will not have that bond/trust with you as an adult. Give the puppy a break and maybe start finding a trainer to help you out otherwise give it to someone that knows what they're doing before you send this poor baby to the shelter.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

funiture chewed, magazines shredded, remote destroyed,
glasses filled tail-swiped off the coffee table, pillows destroyed while in crate (crate to close to sofa), his bedding destroyed (more than once), on the 11th day i had him he peed in the house 5 times
(never went in the house after that, yahoo). my GF thought everything our dog did as a puppy was a Kodak moment. 

i found the stuff my puppy did was annoying and funny at the same time.

pups are a bunch of laughs.


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## Chantell (May 29, 2009)

I agree with doggiedad.. at the end of the night, It is a night full of smiles... never blame the pup, blame yourself, YOU are the one teaching the dog!!!


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## Doggydog (May 12, 2009)

Taking your 8 wk old pup out 8 times a day is not nearly enough. 8 trips out is probably 8 times too little. Physically the puppy should be able to hold it about 2 hours, but it doesn't yet know it should hold it. 
Sometimes a pup will potty in the kennel if the kennel is too big. You can put a divider in to take away the excess room until it grows. The kennel should only be large enough for the puppy to stand, lie down, and turn around. Some puppies come from places where the kennels are not kept clean, so they have been used to sitting in pee and don't realize it isn't good to do. I wouldn't give this puppy bedding until this is corrected. Maybe line with newspaper, or paper towel, or nothing at all. It's very important after cleaning the urine, that the area be nuetralized with an enzyme treatment or vinegar. If this isn't done, you will have a very difficult time training this puppy. Even if you can't smell the pee, the puppy can - and even the best of pups will pee where nature calls for them to pee. There's a lot of threads here related to housetraining, you should search them for useful tips. Some pups catch on quickly, some are painfully slow. It has little to do with breed. I had a GSD puppy that was housebroken at 10 wks, and another that wasn't fully trained until nearly 6 months. It isn't related to intelligence. But it is frustrating. However, your frustration, anger, disappointment are not going to help your puppy and in fact can make it more difficult. 
My GSD puppy was not affectionate until around 5-6 months. Now she's a love bug. That's just mine, they're all different. But the fact that yours doesn't want to be held is not abnormal. 
I doubt that any of the puppy's "problems" are caused by breeding. Perhaps it simply didn't match your expectations. You should take whatever steps are sensible and necessary to alleviate your concerns regarding the breeding. Do some research and determine if your ideas about the breeder are valid. I think you may just need to accept that the experience isn't what you anticipated and either resolve to raise this baby properly, or have it re-homed. I highly doubt you have a dumby. More likely the puppy doesn't yet understand what's expected of it, or may be sick. But I would bet you have an infant who is very intelligent and full of potential - although it may take a while to reach it. Many large breed dogs require a lot of patience, not only GSD's! 
I hope you will find resolution or resolve. Please let us know how things go. Post a photo of the puppy - I would love to see it. Even if it's driving you nuts, I bet it's cute! Good luck


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