# Thoughts on this WGWL AND WGSL?



## Espo4442 (Nov 1, 2012)

Looking for some opinions on an up coming litter of VA-Ulka v Lastal (VA(A)V47 BSZS 2010 Ulka vom Lastal) and V Bandi Vom Wolfheim (V Bandit vom Wolfsheim)?
Thoughts on what type of pigmentation one would expect and temperaments?


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## PatchonGSD (Jun 27, 2012)

You might want to check out this thread, lol. http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/bloodlines-pedigrees/193797-showline-workingline-crosses.html

I'm no expert, but I will say, I do not like the female just by looking at her.


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## qbchottu (Jul 10, 2011)

To be fair, Ulka is completely out of coat and pregnant (?) in that picture. 

Here she is in coat and in show condition:
Landesgruppezuchtschau Bayern Nord/Eschenbach 18 luglio 2010/ulka-vom-lastal-V17-ghkl-h
Landesgruppezuchtschau Bayern Nord/Eschenbach 18 luglio 2010/ulka-vom-lastal-03

She will always have a tight coat for a SL, but she is not a bad female by any means.

Email Molly Graf (the owner of the female and breeder) and ask her for an honest answer. She would be able to offer insight into why she paired these two and what she expects as far as conformation and temperament.


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## Espo4442 (Nov 1, 2012)

I have spoken to Molly but was looking to see what some outside opinions were. I'm not a huge fan of the Dam either but I think with the mix she might deliver some good looking sables, but then again I could be completely wrong.


qbchottu said:


> To be fair, Ulka is completely out of coat and pregnant (?) in that picture.
> 
> Here she is in coat and in show condition:
> Landesgruppezuchtschau Bayern Nord/Eschenbach 18 luglio 2010/ulka-vom-lastal-V17-ghkl-h
> ...


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

4-4 on Eros and 5-5 on Cello is good SL breeding, but mixing with Bandit?....very, very, interesting.


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## PatchonGSD (Jun 27, 2012)

qbchottu said:


> To be fair, Ulka is completely out of coat and pregnant (?) in that picture.
> 
> Here she is in coat and in show condition:
> Landesgruppezuchtschau Bayern Nord/Eschenbach 18 luglio 2010/ulka-vom-lastal-V17-ghkl-h
> ...


LOL well thats why I am not an expert. I cant believe she looks so different "in coat."


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## qbchottu (Jul 10, 2011)

Espo4442 said:


> I have spoken to Molly


If you don't mind, what was her reasoning and expectations for the breeding?


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## Espo4442 (Nov 1, 2012)

qbchottu said:


> If you don't mind, what was her reasoning and expectations for the breeding?


I haven't asked her outright yet but her website states "high drives and outgoing, forward stable temperaments" I'm guessing for Good looks and solid nerves?

Cliffson- Since I'm new the pedigree reading could you tell me what you mean by good SL breeding? (4-4 on Eros and 5-5 on Cello is good SL breeding, but mixing with Bandit?....very, very, interesting)

I originally when to visit her to see another litter of all WGSL's and she stated that even tho they were show line they were very capable working dogs as well. My question is, is that possible?


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Hmmm I actually like the female, not that particular picture of her but don't see anything I can't stand as far as her overall structure and I kind of like the pedigree.


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## Espo4442 (Nov 1, 2012)

Molly stated that she's had very good results with crossing Bandit to several show-line dogs. Nice temperaments and drives. "With out the too-high drives for some people who want an active family dog or one to do agility with.


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

Espo4442 said:


> I originally when to visit her to see another litter of all WGSL's and she stated that even tho they were show line they were very capable working dogs as well. My question is, is that possible?


Of course that's possible. You're not going to be competing on the same level as some working dogs but there is no question a show line dog can do the work.

What is your expectation from this litter? What do you plan on doing with the puppy? I think that will give people a better idea of what your goals are and if this dog would fit those goals.


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## Espo4442 (Nov 1, 2012)

My expectations are that I want a large "stallion" like red patterned sable male with great bone, athletic with a big head, good nerve and balanced drives. Should have a good defensive instinct that can discern threats from friendly or hostile. I know that socializing goes a long way but the dog needs to be able to be taken out in public and trusted when welcomed guests come into the house. The dog will primarily serve has family pet/protector but I'm also possibly interested in doing schutzhund training, tracking, and protection work


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

Cello and Eros both have strong paths to Quanto vd Wienerau and Mutz v d Peltzierferm. Both of these dogs provided stronger working temperament than the Canto based progeny. With Cello you often got smaller males, but good aptitude.this is a necessity when mixing the WG working lines that are strong in Troll/ Timmy vd Narbarschaft. The nerve has to be able to "cap" the drive or aggression. It's takes a strong SL dog with three or four generations of good strength. Not saying this is good or bad.........definitely interesting.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

** This needs to be made in private. Thank you. ADMIN Lisa**


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