# dog park rough play



## imod (Nov 5, 2009)

I have a 10 months old neutered gsd and he is really sweet. He's a big pup, weighing 85 pounds. I take him to an off-leash dog park almost everyday. He's good-natured and plays well with most of the dogs at the park. Small dog owners around me are shocked to see how well he plays with theirs. He chases them around and when they realize he's too close, they start going into their defensive mode.. snapping and biting all while he's trying hard to avoid their teeth by moving his face away. Then they do the chasing all over again. He's good with big dogs too. He can get a little rough and fortunately for me, I often meet owners who are able to acknowledge that they're just kids and like to play rough. But, I'm not always that fortunate.. I've had two or three instances where the owners are vigorously shoving my dog's face away after what it seems to me as a mere rough play among big dogs, then telling me to control my dog and get him away from theirs. They look at my dog as if he's a monster about to bite his dog's head off. I've been going to the dog park everyday now and I can usually tell aggression from rough play. I know that some people might not like to watch their dogs engage in playing that requires nipping and jumping and etc., it's hard... but there wasn't any snarling growling or yelping, and my dog's always backing up the minute he has the upper hand (which is almost never). I'm sure of this because I'm always keeping an eye on my dog, ready to intervene in case things get out of hand. It's hard because this is an off-leash dog park and when this happens, I have to hold onto my dog by the collar, keeping him by my side while he watches all the other dogs roaming around free. I wait until the other party leaves or is far enough so I can let my dog free again. When I apologize, they give me the most displeased look like i should've known better. When this happened for the first time, I pretty much dismissed it as an owner just being way too protective over their dog. After another episode, I'm starting to question if my dog's behavior in the park needs fixing. Am I being bad mannered by letting my dog engage in rough play with other dogs? Can it be mistaken for aggression? Should I pull my dog away the minute I see that? I Need answers.. advices on what I should do and what is being a considerate fellow dog park go-fer.


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## imod (Nov 5, 2009)

I'm sorry. I think this should've been in the good or bad behavior section.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

yes, lots of people don't know rough play from aggression. I would find owners who don't mind the horse play and try to meet them there. that way, the other people are left alone and your dog can have his fun.

I know when we had our lab, it would sound like WWIII going on. growling, shoving, racing, crashing into things and each other. then one of them would call "time out", they'd flop side by side and catch their breath. then one of them would jump up and it started all over again.

I can see where someone who didn't know, or who had had previous bad experiences, would be nervous. but as long as your dog has the manners and sense to back off before it gets too rough and to read the body language of the dogs that he is playing with, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

as I said, you've already met people who don't mind the horseplay, so try to go at the same times.


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

Yes it some times hard for some people to tell the difference and many of them assume GSD and rough play must = aggression. 

Now I have to ask this question...... why in tarnation are small dogs in playing with big dogs?? VERY bad idea. 

"Small dog owners around me are shocked to see how well he plays with theirs. He chases them around and when they realize he's too close, they start going into their defensive mode.. snapping and biting all while he's trying hard to avoid their teeth by moving his face away. Then they do the chasing all over again. "


I am waiting to hear about the big dog (not neceassrily yours) that decides they have had enough of small dog defensive mode and gets a little serious. Small dog loses and then so does big dog. 

A good dog park should separate small from big. 

When I rarely use a dog park I go with folks I know with known friendly dogs and supervise very carefully that way I know my dog can have a good time without being accused of poor behavior.


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## DrDoom (Nov 7, 2007)

This is very hard to diagnose, AND is subjective. I can tell you that Bear and I go to the park once a week, and when we do his FAVORITE game is to chase other dogs. Dogs playing fetch, dogs playing keep away, he doesn't care, he JUST wants to chase. When they get to the ball sometimes they drop it or back away because he's coming so fast, and all he does is stop and wait for them to run. Most people have ZERO problem with it. When he does this, however, he sometimes engages in "back nipping", the herding bite that GSD's will use when chasing something. If a dog has a problem with this (They RARELY do.) they will turn and nip at him, and he stops, btu usually, they ignore him and keep running. SOME owners, however, have a HUGE problem with this, and his chasing behavior in general, especially those owners who come to spend time with their dogs, NOT have their dogs spend time with other dogs. Even if he never nips at them, some people get EXTREMELY frustrated that he's following their dogs around. There are some people who go even further, and absolutely get upset with the nipping and chasing. Others laugh and act like they shouldn't be bothered, it REALLY IS just play, but you can't change how people feel.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

GSD type play is different than say a lab, because they are herders by nature. My dogs play really rough and know the dynamics of each other/when to back off. 
You are keeping an eye on your dog, which is good, but as he matures, things may escalate to more aggressive behavior w/ strange dogs(the strange dog may be the initiator). 
If you want your dog to get exercise and play, maybe ask someone who regularly goes there for playdates for the dogs, that way the dogs know each other. 
I agree w/ Kathy, small dogs & big dogs shouldn't interact, it is an accident waiting to happen.
Maybe get him into an agility class or some type of sport instead of dog park for his energy release.


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## HeidiW (Apr 9, 2009)

I really enjoy watching my two GSDs play. It does at tiome seem a bit rough and sometimes one get a little ticked at the other but they communicate that and it stops. Once is a while I yell HEY, and they know to stop, it is funny. 

However the play with my 18 pound JRT seems different. I don't think it is play but herding. When she runs after balls in the yard Bo chases her and barks at her and tries to nip her neck or back. It is very annoying as he gets so close and barks. Bella chases her to but no barking and no nipping. She will nudge her with her muzzle. It is interesting how they are different. Now and then JRT get ticked and lounges at Bo lips quick and backs off.


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## Anja1Blue (Feb 27, 2008)

GSD's play rough, that's just the way they are. The dog park I go to is divided into two parts, separated by a fence - that way, if people aren't comfortable with what's going on on the one side they can move over. I only take Conor with friends I know who also have GSD's (2 girls). They will be fine together, as well as play with others there - they are all highly social with both large and small dogs, and we have never had a real problem: a couple of times a dog hasn't settled in well, and the owners have either gone to the other area or taken their dogs home......it's a very nice crowd.

I can see however where the kind of behavior you are describing might be misinterpreted and highly irritating to some people - so I would go with onyx'girl's suggestion to burn off some of that excess energy before you go to the park. It shouldn't be your dog's only outlet for exercise, he needs long walks and OB as well.. (Have you ever taken him to obedience classes? Using commands and reinforcing training on a regular basis - i.e. every day - gives your dog mental stimulation, which is as important as the physical.) Sooner or later you are going to come up against either another dog (which will "sort yours out") - or an owner that is going to object more forcefully than you have experienced thus far. A lot of people will excuse behavior in a puppy - but that will change dramatically once he becomes an adult, and that playful nipping will be seen as biting, and therefore aggression. 

________________________________________
Susan

Anja GSD
Conor GSD - adopted from this Board
Blue GSD - waiting at the Bridge


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

My mom freaks out when she sees Anna and Rebel (her sheltie) play, but I'm like it's fine they are just rough-housing. She would have a holly crap fit if she would see the way they've been playing at my house the last week. Anna doesn't make noise, but that little buggar does. We have to watch him more than Anna, and can tell when they need to break it up for a bit. 

I once had a neighbor ask about Anna and Duncan, said "we heard this noise and thought they were fighting!" Nope, Duncan just rolling Anna around on the ground...she gets up, runs around like a spaz and goes back for more.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

My neighbors can't see in my back yard do to the privacy fence.
I wonder what they think when they hear my dogs playing! Onyx and Karlo are very vocal! My DH is always telling me to quiet them down!


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

It does sound like they're killing each other...and it's mostly the other dog, Anna doesn't make noise. I did have a lady trying to invite us to a church or something stop by while I was out back, she saw Duncan have Ann down on the ground, mouths wide and grunting and was like "OMG are they okay???" I was like "yes, they really do love each other, it's just play"

That's why I love big dogs.


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## Kayla's Dad (Jul 2, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: imodI have a 10 months old neutered gsd and he is really sweet. He's a big pup, weighing 85 pounds. I take him to an off-leash dog park almost everyday. He's good-natured and plays well with most of the dogs at the park. Small dog owners around me are shocked to see how well he plays with theirs. He chases them around and when they realize he's too close, they start going into their defensive mode.. snapping and biting all while he's trying hard to avoid their teeth by moving his face away. Then they do the chasing all over again. He's good with big dogs too. *He can get a little rough* and fortunately for me, I often meet owners who are able to acknowledge that they're just kids and like to play rough. But, I'm not always that fortunate.. *I've had two or three instances where the owners are vigorously shoving my dog's face away after what it seems to me as a mere rough play *among big dogs, then telling me to control my dog and get him away from theirs. They look at my dog as if he's a monster about to bite his dog's head off.


I spend a lot of time at off leash areas with my dogs. You need to look at this from the perspective of the other owner. Lancer and Kayla can get into play and encounters with one another that to others looks and sounds like WWII is breaking. That happens at home in the house or yard. I will never allow it to happen at a park-with the two of them or other dogs because most owners can not recognize it for what it is and with other dogs it can quickly escalate to something else-especially when another owner intervenes with apprehension. At a public place with other dogs you should keep the dogs in a lower level of play or keep their focus away from the other dogs-by retrieving, hiking and exploring or just training/teaching to maintain a calmer way of interaction. 



> Originally Posted By: imod I've been going to the dog park everyday now and *I can usually tell aggression from rough play.* I know that some people might not like to watch their dogs engage in playing that requires nipping and jumping and etc., it's hard... but there wasn't any snarling growling or yelping, and my dog's always backing up the minute he has the upper hand (which is almost never). I'm sure of this because I'm always keeping an eye on my dog, ready to intervene in case things get out of hand.


You may be able to tell rough play from aggression-that is probably not going to be the case with the others at the park. They will see the rough play as aggression-you must assume that to be the case and step in immediately when the play gets rough.



> Originally Posted By: imod *It's hard because this is an off-leash dog park and when this happens*, I have to hold onto my dog by the collar, keeping him by my side while he watches all the other dogs roaming around free. I wait until the other party leaves or is far enough so I can let my dog free again. When I apologize, they give me the most displeased look like i should've known better. When this happened for the first time, I pretty much dismissed it as an owner just being way too protective over their dog. *After another episode, I'm starting to question if my dog's behavior in the park needs fixing. **Am I being bad mannered by letting my dog engage in rough play with other dogs? Can it be mistaken for aggression? *Should I pull my dog away the minute I see that? I Need answers.. advices on what I should do and what is being a considerate fellow dog park go-fer.



Are you being bad mannered letting your dog engage in rough play with other dogs? If you haven't gotten approval/permission from the other owner before it begins, then yes you are. You absolutely can not assume it is okay with the other owner just because they are there with their dogs running free. Just becasue it is an off-leash park don't assume that other owners want their dogs engaged to play in the manner your dogs do.

You need to be pro active here-especially since you spend so much time at the park. Engage the owners, watch the dogs for a while, find out about their dogs and which ones you can allow your pup to engage freely with and the ones where you may need to manage more carefully--or avoid all together. DO NOT - just assume that it's all right for your dog to engage in rough play at the park with another dog that you've not have interaction with, that will lead to the perceptions and views you've come to see.


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