# GSD should be taken serious/ giving info to my neighbors before buying a puppy



## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

Well my new neighbors moved in they told me they saw my shepherd and they laid down a deposit for their shepherd. So I instantly asked if you ever had no they responded no. So I said im also a first time owner but I'm going to guide you the right so you won't make mistakes like I did. So we sat down for 3 hours and I'm explaining how they can be a handful. How taking care of them can be a little frustrating at times. 

I explain to them keeping them healthy will be the biggest challenge. I gave them tips on food, he invited me to see his breeder house when they go on Wednesday to check out the mom and puppy just to make sure the puppies are healthy & ask the breeder questions. I gave them so much information he started to question if he even wants a GSD. But his wife really do. So my wife told me I'm wrong and I'm scaring them but I feel like you have to know what your getting into when you get a GSD its not a lab or a golden retriever. It's one of the most complicated breeds to give care to but we love them. 

So am i wrong ? Because I told them your going to have your hands full you have to be ready. Am I wrong? I told them you HAVE to socialize them that's very important after he gets his shots. Am I wrong for scaring them ?


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I think it's a nice thing to do and it's even nicer that they are listening and absorbing so there are no surprises


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## Bella67 (Jun 22, 2014)

I really believe someone should really research the breed before even considering putting a deposit down on a puppy. Did they do their homework on finding a reputable breeder? 
If they're already questioning whether or not they can handle a GSD I don't think they should get one.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I guess I would have to know what you said exactly before I could say you were right or wrong.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

They just never had one and I don't want to ruin it for them I told them I'm willing to train him and give them any extra help they need becuase they seen how well bella is trained and behaved she doesn't need obedience class


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## Bella67 (Jun 22, 2014)

What about her crate issue? Is that solved?


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

So far so good instead of three cups a day i bump it to four cups and I went and bought her some treats so far so good


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## Persinette (Jan 31, 2015)

It's impossible to know. Some of the most book smart, prepared first time owners will still have skewed expectations and fail horribly. Some of the most underprepared people will rally and be great owners. I'd just offer support and perhaps recommend they join this forum.

Also, it depends on the dog they get. Are they getting a GSD who has a temperament the breed is known for (high drive, protective) or a pet quality dog whose breeders moved away from the standard and sell a more mellow animal? If it's the latter it might matter less.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

I guess my perspective is skewed. I have never found raising a GSD too hard. Good training, good exercise, management. It's not brain surgery. It's raising a puppy. 

I think the scariest was my first boy Ike. Who at 8 weeks humped everything is sight and challenged me with barking and biting. And then when he was 15 months challenged me on leash. Both scary to be sure. But found a good trainer and he turned into the seriously the best dog on the planet. 

Give your neighbor support and an open ear and help them get through the tough stages. And laugh with them at the obnoxiousness that all GSD provide. Support not scare. These are amazing dogs.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

I learned by trial and error when raising my first GSD back in 1973 (my first two dogs were a Cocker and then an OES) ... I wish I'd had a mentor back then, but I learned and now feel comfortable with the breed!!!


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## familydag5 (Jan 24, 2015)

I have a five month old high drive high energy puppy and am a first time owner. I feel like as long as the dog is very high on the priority list, mine falls right after kids and husband, it is not that difficult.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

gsdsar said:


> I guess my perspective is skewed. I have never found raising a GSD too hard. Good training, good exercise, management. It's not brain surgery. It's raising a puppy.
> 
> ....
> 
> Give your neighbor support and an open ear and help them get through the tough stages. And laugh with them at the obnoxiousness that all GSD provide. Support not scare. These are amazing dogs.


Agreed. I'm on my second one. They are busy. Busier than our Boxers. Busier than our Collie. But not bad puppies. They are all different. So much depends on the individual dogs.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

neighbours 

I think I would give them a few good local breeders' names and then let them make their own independent choice 

I can see so many problems that can arise from being too involved . If something goes wrong , "you" will be blamed , fodder for the Jerry Springers , Dr Phils , big time drama potential .


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## amburger16 (May 22, 2015)

Don't scare them.. Every dog is different.. No matter the breed. And I agree, getting too involved may cause some drama. Bear is my first puppy as an adult on my own, and I have had some friends really piss me off lately. Other peoples views can be dramatically different then yours. I have been very frustrated lately with people telling me how to raise my puppy.. He was house trained in 3 weeks, he comes when called (most of the time, he is only 14 weeks old its expected) and he chews on his toys, not my stuff.. I think I'm doing a fine job. A GSD is no different then any other puppy.. It depends on a dogs upbringing, personality and genetics. GSDs are incredibly intelligent dogs and love to please.. (again, depending on personality) Let the puppy choose you, don't just choose the cutest.. Bear came to me, and sat with me while all his siblings were wrestling.. The breeders even told me he was pretty much satan but I still picked him based on the fact he came to me.. and he has turned out to be perfect so far.


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## SkoobyDoo (Oct 7, 2014)

We purchased and raised them without help from the interwebs! :crazy: 
If I had come here first, I never would have gotten one!


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

I agree with those saying not to get too involved. Maybe encourage them to find a good trainer.


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## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

If I were going to be involved I think the best thing you can do is tell them to know what type of GSD they want. Many people do not realize that there are major differences between german vs american lines, working vs. show etc. I have a West German Show Line and a North American Show Line. The WGSL I would not recommend for a first time dog owner, the NASL I would in a heartbeat.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

Yeah I will help them out let them know there's different type of GSD lines im going to teach them how to train their pup the basic commands


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

leave the training for a class - someone that is not yourself.


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## maxtmill (Dec 28, 2010)

I think it was good of you to give them the info. I am in no way a new dog owner, and have had a GSD in the past. But I had to return my last GSD to her breeder, which just about killed me. I do intend to own a GSD again, but I will change the circumstances under which I choose a pup. Your neighbors should appreciate your input.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

carmspack said:


> leave the training for a class - someone that is not yourself.


Teaching sit stay lay speak and relax can be done by anyone they seen the way my puppy behaved and want the same thing


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

maxtmill said:


> I think it was good of you to give them the info. I am in no way a new dog owner, and have had a GSD in the past. But I had to return my last GSD to her breeder, which just about killed me. I do intend to own a GSD again, but I will change the circumstances under which I choose a pup. Your neighbors should appreciate your input.


Thanks my wife said im doing to much and I'm scaring them. I said well they have to be ready for anything im going to evaluate the puppy on Wednesday with my neighbors


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## CWhitney (Oct 14, 2013)

Personally I would've loved someone who told me a lot about the breed. I'm a first time GSD parent and learned alot this past year and a half. I research a ton and had a trainer lined up, but doesn't prepare you quite like experienced tips do. And of course nothing prepares you like the real deal.
I was scared too, I think it's natural. I was worried about raising this life all wrong. It's like when you have a baby for the first time. You are scared and nervous. I don't know what you said, but if it was advice and tips I don't think you were harsh in offering that. I wanted to know everything about the breed.
I wouldn't train the dog. Because you're neighbors and close personally if the dog has behavioral problems (like all dogs do) they may try to blame you or there may be some tension if for some reason you don't have time to help them.


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## CWhitney (Oct 14, 2013)

If you're anything like what I do, sounds like you're just passionate and want to share your love and knowledge for the breed.



ILoveBella478 said:


> Thanks my wife said im doing to much and I'm scaring them. I said well they have to be ready for anything im going to evaluate the puppy on Wednesday with my neighbors


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## Longfisher (Feb 28, 2013)

ILoveBella478 said:


> So am i wrong ? Because I told them your going to have your hands full you have to be ready. Am I wrong? I told them you HAVE to socialize them that's very important after he gets his shots. Am I wrong for scaring them ?


IMHO, you did exactly the right thing but the 3 hour bit might be too much.

I have people come up to me all the time on the street and marvel at how beautiful and well-trained our Zeus is. I accept a lot of compliments and move on.

But once in a while someone compliments the dog and then wants to know where they can get one like him. I alwasy ask if they've ever owned a big dog before and they say yes I ask if they've owned a GSD.

If they say no, I warn them that the well-behaved animal next to me took two years of very hard work, a lot of understanding, plenty of reversals and trying anew and that GSDs just aren't a starter type of dog.

I add that the puppy biting drives most people batty and that if they tended to wear anything that they favor they'd best box it up for the first 12 months and never wear it. 

I add that these dogs are incredibly strong and need more exercise than any other breed I've owned and that includes some very big dogs.

I also say that they're smart, smart, smart and can figure out things like latches, potty lids and cupboards pretty fast. And, that left alone all day they have a tendency to tear the place up, including the crate they've been in.

Finally, I say that if they stick with it for at least two years there's a little bit of heaven on the other side as they'll never cease getting compliments from their neighbors.

LF


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

Giving advice...especially to neighbors and friends can be a tricky proposition at times....definitely when it involves dogs, kids, relationships etc...much easier when it's cars, boats and airplanes.

Best to give one's opinion when asked in the particular situation you described and maybe treat it differently than this forum where opining is the rule... being upfront that your advice worked for you and your dog since we all know there is variance amongst the breed and their " attitudes" would leave one some wiggle room I guess. Plus, the biggest factor is the unknown regarding how much they will truly work with their dog compared to your efforts.



Tread lightly and wisely.


SuperG


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## amburger16 (May 22, 2015)

You are not wrong for helping them, you may just want to leave it at going to the breeder with them, sharing experiences and sharing useful information. After a while I would maybe just wait for them to ask, and allowing the puppy to play with your dog will teach him a lot, bad behaviours and good behaviours can be picked up by older dogs. I believe training a dog is also bonding with a dog, so maybe train them to train their dog, don't do it for them.


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

ILoveBella478 said:


> Teaching sit stay lay speak and relax can be done by anyone they seen the way my puppy behaved and want the same thing


That isn't enough. I taught my puppy, Shelby, all of her commands. I still put her in obedience class. In obedience class, we do things the way the trainer says. In obedience class, there are distractions with new people and new dogs. Shelby must learn to focus on me, in this environment. Graduation is on Thursday. To graduate, Shelby must do a 1 minute sit/stay, 1 minute stand/stay and 3 minute down/stay. She can not move, when I walk out to the end of the leash to face her. She cannot move while I circle around her back into heel position. She cannot look at other dogs, when she is supposed to look at me. She has to heel at normal and slow pace, following directions given by the trainer. We might be asked to do an about face, a sit, or a come. To pass come, Shelby must come to me and sit directly in front of me, making eye contact. She nails it.

In other words, if you are telling your neighbor he/she doesn't need obedience class - you are already giving bad advice.


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

SkoobyDoo said:


> We purchased and raised them without help from the interwebs! :crazy:
> *If I had come here first, I never would have gotten one!*


So true. My Annie was 8 years old, by the time I found this site. I think I would have been scared off from GSDs too. Guess it's good I got Annie first. LOL!


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

I


Stevenzachsmom said:


> ILoveBella478 said:
> 
> 
> > Teaching sit stay lay speak and relax can be done by anyone they seen the way my puppy behaved and want the same thing
> ...


Never have I ever told them they don't need obedience classes that would speaking out of ignorance. I don't know how their puppy will be. Every dog is different. I told them
I don't need it probably won't need it. They ask how did I get my puppy so well behaved I told them consistent working and commands I told them I show you all the commands I taught bella simple as that nothing wrong with that


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

SuperG said:


> Giving advice...especially to neighbors and friends can be a tricky proposition at times....definitely when it involves dogs, kids, relationships etc...much easier when it's cars, boats and airplanes.
> 
> Best to give one's opinion when asked in the particular situation you described and maybe treat it differently than this forum where opining is the rule... being upfront that your advice worked for you and your dog since we all know there is variance amongst the breed and their " attitudes" would leave one some wiggle room I guess. Plus, the biggest factor is the unknown regarding how much they will truly work with their dog compared to your efforts.
> 
> ...


I agree


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

amburger16 said:


> You are not wrong for helping them, you may just want to leave it at going to the breeder with them, sharing experiences and sharing useful information. After a while I would maybe just wait for them to ask, and allowing the puppy to play with your dog will teach him a lot, bad behaviours and good behaviours can be picked up by older dogs. I believe training a dog is also bonding with a dog, so maybe train them to train their dog, don't do it for them.


I don't want to fully train him I just want to get the pup and the owners on the right path. I'm still reading on trainning, there's so much to it. I'm not saying I'm trainning this dog through every step no just getting the puppy started. I did the same thing with my friend GSD puppy and she is doing great so are they. All I did was get them started.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

amburger16 said:


> You are not wrong for helping them, you may just want to leave it at going to the breeder with them, sharing experiences and sharing useful information. After a while I would maybe just wait for them to ask, and allowing the puppy to play with your dog will teach him a lot, bad behaviours and good behaviours can be picked up by older dogs. I believe training a dog is also bonding with a dog, so maybe train them to train their dog, don't do it for them.


Yeah maybe waiting for them to ask would be a good thing it's just they really wanted to know how I did it so I offered


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## ksotto333 (Aug 3, 2011)

gsdsar said:


> I guess my perspective is skewed. I have never found raising a GSD too hard. Good training, good exercise, management. It's not brain surgery. It's raising a puppy.
> 
> .


This is what I was thinking. Ours have not been difficult, just puppies. I think it helped that they are smarter than other breeds.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

ksotto333 said:


> gsdsar said:
> 
> 
> > I guess my perspective is skewed. I have never found raising a GSD too hard. Good training, good exercise, management. It's not brain surgery. It's raising a puppy.
> ...


Mines wasn't difficult although I have delt with others that were difficult


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

My general policy is just say NO. I have no problem with "scare tactics" if folks, hear the down side and they are "still" interested in a GSD?? And they are willing to do whatever it takes to make work?? That's different most (pet) folks in my view are lazy, they don't want to put in the work!

Then that is bit different, I had many years of raising "real dogs under my belt (yes a Boxer is a real dog. ) and none of it meant crap!

Well he never turned on family so I got that right! But mine was dog # three...two Dominate male dogs in my three pack...uh oh!!!

I did "zero" research! Just another dog??? Yeah not so much! My next GSD will be much easier for me I'm sure! I learned a lot with my guy but recommend one by and large NO not by me for most people! 



Get a Bulldog or a Pug and call it a day!


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

I guess it would depend on how much help they really want from you. Where they trying to be nice new neighbors and listened to you out of being polite? Did they even ask for advice or help? Or was in one of those "we don't really want to say no and start off on the wrong foot" type of deals.

Without being there it's hard to say.

I don't think you really have to go as far as you have..or want to. Not unless they specifically ask for it. Offer your help and support and leave it at that. If they come to you, fine, if they don't, take that as your sign that pushing isn't wanted.

I know for myself, just because I say I am going to do something or get something doesn't mean I want someones advice. Like wise, I'm not going to give my advice unless someone wants it, or it's directly effecting me somehow.

Just gonna have to wait and see how it plays out from here.


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## DaniFani (Jan 24, 2013)

GSDolch said:


> I guess it would depend on how much help they really want from you. Where they trying to be nice new neighbors and listened to you out of being polite? Did they even ask for advice or help? Or was in one of those "we don't really want to say no and start off on the wrong foot" type of deals.
> 
> Without being there it's hard to say.
> 
> ...


This...wasn't there, don't know the reactions, but man would you annoy the absolute crap outta me. You're on your first GSD (and from your the few previous posts of yours that I've read, you had some struggles and issues), they aren't one-size-fits-all for training, they are NOT rocket science, and I don't believe in the "scare tactic" when it comes to teaching people about any breed you love and promote. According to GSD founder/standard, whatever...they *should be one of the easiest dogs in integrate into a family lifestyle. 

I agree with the above post, I'd leave it here. I wouldn't push anything, I wouldn't comment, etc...If they come to you? Great! If not, take that as a sign. Of course this is my opinion, from my perspective, and what I'd think if MY neighbor acted like this. 

I'm more private, prefer to get life advice (on any topic) from people with lots and lots of experience, and am not intimidated by someone's singular experience. I think your intentions are well meaning, but you asked, and my opinion is that I think you went a little overboard and were a little more hysterical on the "difficulty" of raising a GSD than need be. 

Just because it was hard for you, with your one dog, doesn't mean it will be for them. Just like just because you got your one dog to behave and act a certain way, does not mean you will be able to get their's to be the same. Just my .02. I'd recommend a few breeders and some trainers and leave it at that. You shouldn't have to visit a breeder to get a good idea if they are "ethical" or a "byb" just based on a website and a few questions. Good luck. And remember this is your neighbor....you're probably going to live next to them for awhile. Be careful there.


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## Arlene/Archer (Mar 7, 2013)

I did a good bit of research before I got Archer, and I was glad that I did as he was a 'busy' pup, but I knew what to expect. He has grown into a pretty mellow dog and when I'm asked about owning one- which is frequently- I try to explain that they're a working breed, intelligent, curious and keen to be with you. 
I don't scare people per se, but I do suggest people do their research and are 'set up' for the demands of owning a shepherd. 
Archer's three now; an intact male, full of personality, eager to go, but gentle and placid in the house. The one thing I try advise new GSD owners on is exercise. To me exercise is the absolute key to good behaviour. I'm with Stonnie Dennis on this, a tired dog is generally a good dog, and I think a lot of dogs, of all breeds, are under exercised.
I'm very lucky that I work from home which means I've got a dog who is out about about for roughly 2-3 hours a day ( 90 min off lead hike 6/7 mornings a week is the base). I found being present to correct his behaviour- or rather redirect him- as a pup cut down on a lot of unwanted behaviour too. Not possible for everyone I know, but just my experience.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I don't think the OP went to them. They saw his dog and decided they wanted one. Yes they based getting one by seeing one. The OP probably saw an issue with this(and it probably is an issue because it's s case of oh look at that cute pup I want one) and is giving them advice on what he has experienced as a first time owner. He isn't claiming to know everything and admits that mistakes have been made and is learning from them. He is trying to help. Over and over people say on here that GSD are not for first time owners or couch potatoes. There is nothing wrong with telling people about land shark phases, socializing and exercising the dog. If this stuff scares them then maybe it's a good thing the OP is around because on 6 months he might have another GSD


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

gsdsar said:


> I guess my perspective is skewed. I have never found raising a GSD too hard. Good training, good exercise, management. It's not brain surgery. It's raising a puppy.
> 
> I think the scariest was my first boy Ike. Who at 8 weeks humped everything is sight and challenged me with barking and biting. And then when he was 15 months challenged me on leash. Both scary to be sure. But found a good trainer and he turned into the seriously the best dog on the planet.
> 
> Give your neighbor support and an open ear and help them get through the tough stages. And laugh with them at the obnoxiousness that all GSD provide. Support not scare. These are amazing dogs.


 Agree with Sam.


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## Moriah (May 20, 2014)

Dogs can take a back seat once a couple has their first baby. I have told two different friends that are working on getting pregnant with their first child that they might want to wait on getting a GSD. I explain that a GSD will not tolerate being ignored and they might have 2 kids on their hands.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

Moriah said:


> Dogs can take a back seat once a couple has their first baby. I have told two different friends that are working on getting pregnant with their first child that they might want to wait on getting a GSD. I explain that a GSD will not tolerate being ignored and they might have 2 kids on their hands.


This family has a ten month old baby


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## WolfsOwner (Jan 16, 2015)

Wolf has been just as difficult as any other puppy. The two main differences are exercises needs and intelligence. My family didn't realize the CONSISTENT exercise Wolf would need, and I took it upon myself to get up early EVERY single morning, except when very ill, and give her exercise as well as more exercise throughout the day when I am home (another walk, sprints in the backyard, ball play, etc.). Wolf does not behave best when full of energy . The intelligence factor can be difficult because she needs a lot of mental stimulation, so play time also needs to incorporate that (find-it games, practicing her commands, etc.). However, I have completely fallen in love with Wolf and would do it all over again. I think anyone with patience and enough down time to offer a GSD ample exercise can do it, if they truly want it.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

ILoveBella478 said:


> This family has a ten month old baby


If they have a ten month old baby...then yeah I say you did good!

Scare the crap of them! If a person is "serious" and must have a GSD! Then what someone else says would be of no consequence!

And yes for the folks that have lived with and owned GSD forever, they are 'NO' big deal!

For first timers however a dog that has the "potential" for human aggression???Is indeed a very big deal! Those of us that truly love the breed service the GSD best by keeping them out of the hands of "fools!"


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

ILoveBella478 said:


> Well my new neighbors moved in they told me they saw my shepherd and they laid down a deposit for their shepherd. So I instantly asked if you ever had no they responded no. So I said im also a first time owner but I'm going to guide you the right so you won't make mistakes like I did. So we sat down for 3 hours and I'm explaining how they can be a handful. How taking care of them can be a little frustrating at times.
> 
> I explain to them keeping them healthy will be the biggest challenge. I gave them tips on food, he invited me to see his breeder house when they go on Wednesday to check out the mom and puppy just to make sure the puppies are healthy & ask the breeder questions. I gave them so much information he started to question if he even wants a GSD. But his wife really do. So my wife told me I'm wrong and I'm scaring them but I feel like you have to know what your getting into when you get a GSD its not a lab or a golden retriever. It's one of the most complicated breeds to give care to but we love them.
> 
> So am i wrong ? Because I told them your going to have your hands full you have to be ready. Am I wrong? I told them you HAVE to socialize them that's very important after he gets his shots. Am I wrong for scaring them ?


I've only read your OP.

I am all about offering info if it's solicited. If someone came to me and asked me questions about finding and raising a good shepherd puppy, I'd share everything I thought would be helpful (most of it would be pointing them to people whose knowledge I trusted and respected). But one thing I learned through the process of deciding on a dog and later a breeder was that everyone has an opinion but there's no one right way. Sometimes people pull things off despite all the signs pointing to no, and even if they don't, it's not my place or responsibility to stop them from failing unless they ask me for help.

We got so much unsolicited commentary and "advice" during that time. Everyone thought they knew better than we did whether we could manage any dog, and everyone was convinced a shepherd was a terrible idea. The stuff we heard ranged from mildly irritating to outright insulting. I even got some really condescending PMs on this forum from people who wanted me to "be sure to remember" this or that about the GSD. Both online and off, I just tried to stay polite and say thanks for thinking of me or thanks for the info.

If I were your neighbor, I'd appreciate the opportunity to learn, but I would also be really irritated by you informing me that you were going to show me the right way to do things. If you offered to point me in the direction of a club, or someone I could talk to, or mentioned that you'd found XYZ to be a really helpful resource? Awesome, and I'd be really grateful for that. Telling me that you were going to "guide me in the right way" would just annoy me and I'd probably try to avoid you and your dog lest I have to sit through commentary on how I was doing it wrong with mine. On an objective level, your neighbor's questioning of his decision isn't necessarily a bad thing - it can be really helpful to do that - but from the stance of observing boundaries, I think you should've kept out of it unless asked.


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## wick (Mar 7, 2015)

I might be a loner in this opinion, but I wish that someone had explained exactly how difficult it would be to raise a GSD and warn me and tell me all the quirks. I would have probably still done it but at least it wouldn't have been such a shock! Also maybe since they have a baby this may help them consider it longer, I honestly don't think people realize how hard it can be sometimes (ie if the puppy gets sick or is reactive etc).

That being said I don't reccommend the OP get involved because since it is a neighbor you may end up butting heads about it or something else that could ruin an important relationship/ make living next to them hard. Give them resources/contacts to look into and leave it at that.


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## wick (Mar 7, 2015)

I just read through all the posts and I feel like everyone is giving such great information and examples for all sides of this issue.


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

WateryTart said:


> I've only read your OP.
> 
> I am all about offering info if it's solicited. If someone came to me and asked me questions about finding and raising a good shepherd puppy, I'd share everything I thought would be helpful (most of it would be pointing them to people whose knowledge I trusted and respected). But one thing I learned through the process of deciding on a dog and later a breeder was that everyone has an opinion but there's no one right way. Sometimes people pull things off despite all the signs pointing to no, and even if they don't, it's not my place or responsibility to stop them from failing unless they ask me for help.
> 
> ...



I've come back to give a reply, oh, about six or seven times now and I've back spaced on all of them because I felt anything I said was to harsh or just not getting my point across properly. 

You've said it in a way I could not. 

I'm not one for being told that someone is going to lead me in the right direction or show me how it's done. Especially if I never really asked in the first place. Without being there and knowing the whole convo, it is hard to tell, but a part of me wonders if they were trying to be the nice new neighbor and not start off on the wrong foot.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

wick said:


> I might be a loner in this opinion, but *I wish that someone had explained exactly how difficult it would be to raise a GSD and warn me and tell me all the quirks*. I would have probably still done it but at least it wouldn't have been such a shock! Also maybe since they have a baby this may help them consider it longer, I honestly don't think people realize how hard it can be sometimes (ie if the puppy gets sick or is reactive etc).
> 
> That being said I don't reccommend the OP get involved because since it is a neighbor you may end up butting heads about it or something else that could ruin an important relationship/ make living next to them hard. Give them resources/contacts to look into and leave it at that.


That was what my breeder was for, though. I got incredible support from her. Same from our obedience instructor. These people don't micromanage but they were open and honest about possible challenges based on their experience with many many dogs and puppies. I think the "how to raise and train" stuff is really up to the owner, and the people whose place it is to offer guidance are the breeder and an obedience instructor or private trainer - someone who has a solid, credible background with dogs and ideally with the breed. 

For me, the take home message from this situation is "know your place." If you just know enough to be dangerous - and I put myself squarely in this category too, so I'm not trying to pick on anyone - know that your place is not to advise very far if at all. If asked, it's cool to refer someone to a resource you found helpful, or to share something that worked for you couched with the disclaimer that no two puppies are identical, but otherwise I think your place is to just let them do their thing. A breeder or trainer is equipped to note and address a potential issue, or to instruct a new owner, and it would be their place to speak up if they felt it was warranted.


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## wick (Mar 7, 2015)

GSDolch said:


> WateryTart said:
> 
> 
> > I've only read your OP.
> ...


Yeah it's really hard to tell without being there whether it's welcomed advice or if the neighbor feels offended/uncomfortable. There is a fine line so I totally agree with you guys in this even though I said I would have liked some warning... Kind warning, not "this is what you need to do". That's why it seems better to avoid it altogether! 

Also some people (like myself) are people pleasers and try to be nice in all situations so it is even harder to tell if they are just being nice when advice is offered or if they actually wanted it. I find myself listening to people tell me what to do often just because I accidentally encourage the individual while just trying to be polite.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

It's not telling them what to do its not literally guiding them and making decision for them. It's more of whenever they have a question or little tips im willingly to help. The fact they have a that's ten month old is what made me really show them the ugly and good side. I feel as though I did the right thing because it would suck for you to get a puppy and then get rid of him because you couldn't handle him and the kid. I'm just saying, I feel like no GSD should be abandoned. If you knew you couldn't handle one from the start why get one? So I told them basically straight up,

As of the breeder I was told that she feeds her adult female pedigree that was a big red flag for me that stuff was bad for bella and I heard it was bad overall but I did not tell them it's bad for their puppy. I told them it was bad for mines


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

ILoveBella478 said:


> It's not telling them what to do its not literally guiding them and making decision for them. It's more of whenever they have a question or little tips im willingly to help. *The fact they have a that's ten month old is what made me really show them the ugly and good side. I feel as though I did the right thing because it would suck for you to get a puppy and then get rid of him because you couldn't handle him and the kid. I'm just saying, I feel like no GSD should be abandoned. If you knew you couldn't handle one from the start why get one? So I told them basically straight up,*
> 
> As of the breeder I was told that she feeds her adult female pedigree that was a big red flag for me that stuff was bad for bella and I heard it was bad overall but I did not tell them it's bad for their puppy. I told them it was bad for mines


You know what, though? I don't think that was your place. The breeder should be assessing whether s/he thinks they're a good fit for one of his/her dogs.

Friends of mine just rescued a dog and are planning on having a baby, like, yesterday. Frankly, I think that was a bad idea to get a large, energetic dog and have a baby right away given additional information that I won't share for privacy reasons. But you know what? It isn't my business. It's theirs. It's their choice to make. It was up to the rescue to take what my friends tell them in terms of their current lifestyle and future plans, and match a dog or not. They have a dog, so clearly the rescue felt this was fine.

So the best way I can help? I can answer anything they do ask while refraining from expressing judgment, and I can refrain from offering advice they don't want in the name of "doing the right thing for the dog." That's really not my responsibility, and trying to scare your neighbor wasn't yours either. It's my opinion that you didn't do the right thing here. But it's already been done, so my hope is that you would refrain going forward unless invited to share your opinion...however, refraining or not is of course ultimately up to you.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

But it is my business if they ask what to expect. It is my business if they ask to share as much info as I can. It is my business if they ask is this breed good with kids. I think the fact he kept asking me questions makes it my buisness. The fact he WANTS me to ride to the breeder house with him tomorrow just to check out the puppy makes it my buisness. No I didn't ask him he asked me to come. 

What if they breeder is a bad breeder? Have you consider that ? Because so far this breeder doesn't sound like a good breeder. The breeder told them they got rid of the father dog right away. She said she feeds her adult female pedigree food. Which isn't a good food for GSD from my experience. They also told me the environment that the pups are in is disgusting they say the house is disgusting. 


So your telling me after been told all that you wouldn't have done what Ive done ?


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## GypsyGhost (Dec 29, 2014)

I get what you're saying, I do. It's hard to not offer lots of opinions on something we're passionate about. I still wouldn't have offered as much of an opinion as you did, but that's just me. I would have directed their questions/concerns back to the breeder or given them the name of a good trainer because those people know far more than a first time GSD owner does. I'm not trying to be rude... I am also a first time GSD owner. 

It doesn't sound like they've chosen a good breeder, but they already put a deposit down knowing the dogs were living in filth, so I don't really know what you going to check out the puppies is really going to do for these people. Maybe they'll walk away, maybe not. Either way, it's THEIR choice to make, not yours.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

ILoveBella478 said:


> But it is my business if they ask what to expect. It is my business if they ask to share as much info as I can. It is my business if they ask is this breed good with kids. I think the fact he kept asking me questions makes it my buisness. The fact he WANTS me to ride to the breeder house with him tomorrow just to check out the puppy makes it my buisness. No I didn't ask him he asked me to come.
> 
> What if they breeder is a bad breeder? Have you consider that ? Because so far this breeder doesn't sound like a good breeder. The breeder told them they got rid of the father dog right away. She said she feeds her adult female pedigree food. Which isn't a good food for GSD from my experience. They also told me the environment that the pups are in is disgusting they say the house is disgusting.
> 
> ...


If I were in your shoes, I would express my concerns about the breeder _if asked._ I would leave it at that. If they asked further questions, I'd tell them honestly that I'd be glad to give them the contact info of a breeder or trainer or someone whose knowledge I trusted, because I am still learning myself. (This gives them a fair picture of my knowledge on the subject - incomplete - and has the added benefit of putting them in contact with someone they could choose to reach out to if they decided they wanted to get another perspective.)

Their child, their family, their decision. I just think you maybe made this your problem when it didn't need to be and really shouldn't be.

We can agree to disagree.


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

WateryTart said:


> ILoveBella478 said:
> 
> 
> > But it is my business if they ask what to expect. It is my business if they ask to share as much info as I can. It is my business if they ask is this breed good with kids. I think the fact he kept asking me questions makes it my buisness. The fact he WANTS me to ride to the breeder house with him tomorrow just to check out the puppy makes it my buisness. No I didn't ask him he asked me to come.
> ...


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

ILoveBella478 said:


> WateryTart said:
> 
> 
> > If I were in your shoes, I would express my concerns about the breeder _if asked._ I would leave it at that. If they asked further questions, I'd tell them honestly that I'd be glad to give them the contact info of a breeder or trainer or someone whose knowledge I trusted, because I am still learning myself. (This gives them a fair picture of my knowledge on the subject - incomplete - and has the added benefit of putting them in contact with someone they could choose to reach out to if they decided they wanted to get another perspective.)
> ...


Nah, not if it's done casually, at least not in my opinion. I'd have just said, "Hey, so on that subject, I don't really know the answer to that but I've found the trainer at X club to be really helpful, if you want to check them out you can Google." Or, "If you've got questions about your breeder and you wanted to meet some others, you could try Googling the breed club and seeing what else is out there." I'm not asking them to discuss it further with me, I'm not saying this is the best way or claiming knowledge I don't actually have, I'm just saying this is something that's out there and they can check it out if they want.

I mean...a three hour discussion? I sure hope they weren't just sitting through it to be a good/inoffensive neighbor!


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## ILoveBella478 (Mar 13, 2015)

WateryTart said:


> ILoveBella478 said:
> 
> 
> > WateryTart said:
> ...


Oh no I don't have that much knowledge on the breed lol it was basic knowledge and stories and shared stories


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## wildwolf60 (Apr 13, 2001)

I have found that raising German shepherds has been pretty easy, really. Since they are very intelligent, no real issues, you just have to take in account each dogs temperament. I have never thought they were more difficult than other breeds. Giving advice is nice, as long as they understand how to raise a puppy, in general. I dont know what was said, so do not want to assume.


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## Ruger Monster (Jan 29, 2015)

Raising Ruger has been an experience. He is my first ever puppy (the BF has raised a few puppies though, so I had in-person guidance/reassurance to go along with all my puppy books & researching!), and he's my 2nd GSD. I truly believe they are all different. Reading on here about other people's experiences with their puppies has proven that they are definitely all not cut from the same cloth! 

Giving advice is great if they asked (and it is awesome that they DID ask, rather than jump in completely blind to it). I love sharing my experiences with Ruger when people ask about him. But the neighbors also need to know that if something worked for Bella, it may not work for their pup. People ask me about his training all the time, and I refer them to my trainer - he has much more experience handling different temperaments, ages, breeds, and does it for a living. There is a line when it comes to advice, I think. As long as you don't force yourself over the line, or act like a professional, I see no problem with answering their questions and offering suggestions, with the note to them that it is based on your experience and is not a 1-size-fits-all. 



Moriah said:


> Dogs can take a back seat once a couple has their first baby. I have told two different friends that are working on getting pregnant with their first child that they might want to wait on getting a GSD. I explain that a GSD will not tolerate being ignored and they might have 2 kids on their hands.


I saw a post on FB recently where someone was giving away their 7-month old Black GSD because they didn't want an infant and a puppy :/


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## WesS (Apr 10, 2015)

WateryTart said:


> You know what, though? I don't think that was your place. The breeder should be assessing whether s/he thinks they're a good fit for one of his/her dogs.
> 
> Friends of mine just rescued a dog and are planning on having a baby, like, yesterday. Frankly, I think that was a bad idea to get a large, energetic dog and have a baby right away given additional information that I won't share for privacy reasons. But you know what? It isn't my business. It's theirs. It's their choice to make. It was up to the rescue to take what my friends tell them in terms of their current lifestyle and future plans, and match a dog or not. They have a dog, so clearly the rescue felt this was fine.
> 
> So the best way I can help? I can answer anything they do ask while refraining from expressing judgment, and I can refrain from offering advice they don't want in the name of "doing the right thing for the dog." That's really not my responsibility, and trying to scare your neighbor wasn't yours either. It's my opinion that you didn't do the right thing here. But it's already been done, so my hope is that you would refrain going forward unless invited to share your opinion...however, refraining or not is of course ultimately up to you.


Oh no.. This I think is bad advice. We already had discussions about how hard it is to chose responsible breeders and what that may entail. Now you want an individual who sells dogs to give them all the nitty gritty?

I think helping a friend and discussing something they have experience on is great. That's what good friends do. They help out. Keeping mouth shut is a disservice to friend. Friend will make his own decision. But information and other opinions can help.


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## Chai (Dec 11, 2014)

I get people gushing over Tchai all the time, and it nearly always ends up being "Honey, we should get one!" or "Mum, can we have one just like this!?". Which is often preceded by questions about his price and breeder (sometimes even about when I'm going to breed him! :s). These questions bother me when they are asked before "What is his temperament like?", "How much training do they require?" or "How is his health?". I never give much information or opinions, but always offer something like "They're wonderful, but they're not so much a pet as they are a lifestyle". This may or may not be true for all (it is for me), but regardless, I don't think they're the type of dog you can stick in the back yard with no training and little interaction, but still end up with the majestic and noble GSD that they probably have in mind. I think it's important to let people know that in order to get that GSD, a lot of time, effort, love and money has to be spent. I also then encourage them to do extensive research and offer my email address if they want more info. 

I think it's good that you wanted to offer your experiences as information to them, I relied on that too when I was getting ready for my pup, but I think people should be encouraged (and perhaps guided to sources) to independently research and become as informed as possible of their own initiative.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

WesS said:


> Oh no.. This I think is bad advice. We already had discussions about how hard it is to chose responsible breeders and what that may entail. Now you want an individual who sells dogs to give them all the nitty gritty?
> 
> I think helping a friend and discussing something they have experience on is great. That's what good friends do. They help out. Keeping mouth shut is a disservice to friend. Friend will make his own decision. But information and other opinions can help.


Okay then.


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## XindisMom (Jun 14, 2015)

I think that raising any dog, should only be undertaken if a person is committed to learning about dogs in general, as well as learning breed-specific info. 

That being said, I was raised in a home in which my father had been raising AKC certified GSDs since before I was born. 

I'm in my 30's and recently became a puppy mom for the first time. Woah! Was I taken aback by the amount of work required to live with and train a gsd puppy. You'd think I'd know already because of my father, but no. It was foreign to me. If not for this board, plus Ceasar Milan, I dont know how we would have made it this far! 

I thin you're right to counsel your neighbors. Just know that they may not listen. 

GSDs are special dogs. Mine is Bred from working class stock, so she's smart, busy, feisty, but honestly a quick learn! 

She's 6 months old now and I don't think we'd have made it this far successfully without support and my commitment to working with her natural, genetic tendencies.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

How much experience do you actually have with dogs period? I know that this is your first GSD. The neighbor's dog is a completely separate individual and the tips that worked for Bella may not work. The tricks that are all wrong for Bella may be exactly what this puppy needs. 
The attitude that works for you may not be a dynamic that works in their home. Honestly, unless you've had a lot of dogs and real life experience with training, you're probably not going to be able to give them any advice. 

on going to the breeder, I would go along if they asked. Give them some info to look up on what makes a responsible breeder and what things to beware of. After that, you should be out of it. You don't have the experience to help match a puppy to their needs. You don't have the experience to tell which puppy is high drive or which is mellow (you can't base it on one meeting or even a couple meetings). 

I'd give advice. Refer them to a trainer. Yes, some people can do ok without a trainer but until you've worked with a good trainer, you don't know how much better your dog can be. You don't know how much quicker they can learn and how you were doing things the hard way.
Every dog is different and every thing you teach may need a slightly different approach. That is where a trainer comes in handy during those early puppy days. After that, a class is good because it gets you and your dog used to working around distractions, very important if you plan to go in public with your dog.


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## ksotto333 (Aug 3, 2011)

I think I read somewhere that this puppy next door passed away.


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## Stonevintage (Aug 26, 2014)

ksotto333 said:


> I think I read somewhere that this puppy next door passed away.


Yes, died of Parvo in the last two weeks if I remember correctly.


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