# Making the switch! questions..



## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Well i read the FAQ and the links and I'm trying to decide what to order. I never dealt with a butcher but I googled "meat" and my zip code and found a few butchers in the area. Do I ask if they have "pet packages"? lol 
Or should I ask for scrap meat? 

I'm going to add variety once I get everything together like a good, reliable place with excellent prices but for now I want to stick with either chicken or beef. What parts should I order? 

I'm planning for just 1 month. I will start mixing and matching after 1 month but for the first month what should i get? I am thinking a big package of ground beef for the muscle meats, but then I don't know what else. I know you need some bones and organ meats. Should i go with beef liver and chicken legs? Any suggestions? I'm not aware of all the various meat sections. Idea would be cheap, easy to prepare (no blending or any more butchering than necessary). 

And how many pounds am I looking at ordering for 1 month for 1 dog that weighs 75lbs? I did a calculator and it said I need about 1200-1400 calories a day for my senior so not sure how to translate that into raw meat. 

Looking into get a meat freezer chest but don't want to buy too much. 


Any suggestions welcome and anyone of you on the RAW that remembers what your first month's order was like, let me know!


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

When I switched older dogs I switched them to leg quarters and backs (chicken). My dogs were already used to getting some raw scraps and field mice (I live on a farm) so the switch was easy for them. Chicken is probably the cheapest protein source you can get in the US (I am assuming you are in the USA). 

When I first started I actually had a friend who knew the butcher at our small grocery store so he introduced us and I went from there. I asked what he would be able to order. Leg quarters are always pretty easy to get. We also were raising beef so I knew that butcher and could get some scraps from him, but they were not the main food source for my dogs. Anyhow, I would probably just ask the different butchers what they might have or what they can get. If you have small grocery stores in your area see if they can order things in bulk. What's really ideal are the grocers that still cut meat and don't buy everything prepackaged. 

Depending on how active your dog is, he should eat on average 1.5# per day. Adjust from there either up or down depending on the dog. So, that would be an average of 45# of food per month. 

The Raw Dog Ranch articles cover switching your dog. 
Switching a Dog to Raw


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## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Thanks so I guess the easiest is to stick to chicken wings and ground beef or chicken breast and then add variety a little later. 

I guess I have to buy a scale too.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

I don't feed wings that often because they are very bony. Chicken breast is too meaty. What my mom does is buy whole chickens and cuts them up for her dog and then mixes the bony pieces like wings with the breast meat. 

Read the link I gave you. I started with leg quarters and then added in variety once I saw they would be fine (with my two that was after a few days from what I remember). Then I brought in more variety. Even with puppies I start with chickens and then they start to get other things. How quickly you can introduce other types of RMB depends a lot on the dog.


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## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Thanks..

Is there anyone in Orange County or LA county in California that knows of a place to get raw meat at a good price? Im also looking to buy in bulk and buying a chest freezer so I can save some money and gas. I called local butchers but some dont speak english and others say they only sell premium meats for humans. When I ask if they have spare parts for dogs I know they're on the other side of the line thinking "wtf? this is a butcher for human food".


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## Ronda (Aug 23, 2010)

Hottinger's Meat in Chino sells a petfood blend...mostly heart, assorted muscle meat trimmings, some liver and kidneys too.

Shelton's Premium Poultry in Pomona sells chicken backs, turkey necks, ground turkey, etc.

Sounds weird but try your local Albertsons. They order beef heart for me for 0.99/lb untrimmed and 1.49/lb trimmed and custom cut. They also order different kinds of fish for me too.

Kings Market (there is one in OC I think) is an ethnic store that carries lots of organs and non traditional types of meat. 

If you are interested in feeding fresh green tripe, I can give you a lead on where to buy it although you will have to cut it up yourself and its NASTY, but worth it.

Hope this helps!


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## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Ronda said:


> Hottinger's Meat in Chino sells a petfood blend...mostly heart, assorted muscle meat trimmings, some liver and kidneys too.
> 
> Shelton's Premium Poultry in Pomona sells chicken backs, turkey necks, ground turkey, etc.
> 
> ...


Thanks!! Weird albertsons, huh. I'll give them a try. I have one 5 minutes away but I'm not sure what to ask for. I guess I can for beef heart or any organ meats under $1.50-1.60 to start with and also ask for chicken necks, quarters or anything else. 

I'll also look up Kings Market. 

Btw what did you mean by untrimmed and uncut? Like they are not little pieces but just a big fat piece of heart? Is it hard to cut yourself? Can I just cut an appropriate amount of the heart and allow my dog to do the cutting and chewing or is it better if it's precut into chunks so my dog can eat it easier? 
Looks like I'm going to have to learn some body parts and names. 

What is "green tripe"? Isn't tripe the stomach? Is this the stomach of grass fresh cows? I'd be interested for sure! But maybe you could explain the process of preparation a little bit?  I heard tripe is really good for dogs.


EDIT: There's a Super king's market in Anaheim which isn't too far from me, maybe 20 minutes. They have boned chicken breast for $.99/lb in their weekly ad. When I call up these places, am I asking for specials like for dogs/pets and asking for scraps (I.E. Specifically for chicken neck, back, etc.) or should I just swing by and look at what they have available for humans? Some of the sale items aren't too pricey at $.99lb.


I also haven't read anything about giving whole fish. Can dogs eat whole fish with the bones and head? I wasn't sure about this. They have whole Tilapia for $.89/lb too.


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## Ronda (Aug 23, 2010)

pancake said:


> Thanks!! Weird albertsons, huh. I'll give them a try. I have one 5 minutes away but I'm not sure what to ask for. I guess I can for beef heart or any organ meats under $1.50-1.60 to start with and also ask for chicken necks, quarters or anything else.
> 
> I buy the chicken backs and turkey necks from Shelton's Poultry for my RMB. Talk to the butcher at Albertson's and they can give you prices and help you learn about different cuts of meat. It used to emabarrass my husband that I would ask all these weird questions at the grocery store but hey, it turned out that my local Albertson's doesn't mind ordering beef heart or cases of fish for me and they will even store it in their freezer and I can buy only as much as I want at a time.
> 
> ...


Yup, the bones are tiny and soft (and my dog loves to eat the head first, if an eye drops out she sucks it up faster than a hoover!). However you need to educate yourself on what fish are safe to feed, a general rule is small, oily ocean fish (mackeral, sardine, smelt, whiting, anchovy)...you need to stay away from fish with a high mercury level, generally the bigger the fish, the higher the level.


A very good resource is Laurie's Raw Dog Ranch, she has tons of info on there and explains it very clearly and gives examples of what meats you can feed. That is how I started feeding raw about 7/8 months ago, I had flirted with the idea and given some here and there but when I switched cold turkey I started with her website and went from there. Plus I used to post "Am I going to Kill my Dog with this _____?" food type of questions here and the members were very kind about sharing knowledge and easing my fears. 

Its not as hard as it looked and once you get into it for a bit, it becomes second nature and aside from a prep day (I bag everything into single servings of RMB, Organ, and MM so I can just grab a bag of each and go) its not much harder than kibble. I thaw only a few days at a time and if I forget well then she eats it frozen and we pretend she's really a rare black artic wolf who's living on the tundras of Alaska and her kill has already frozen solid thanks to the frigid weather.  The germ factor doesn't bother me as I just wash my hands, clean counters, whatever just like I do when I prepare meat for us. EXCEPT for the cutting up of the tripe...that is done OUTSIDE only and is fed frozen so it stinks less. I guess you could thaw it inside like 5 sealed ziplocs and it might not stink but I'm not risking the smell in my fridge.

Good luck!


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## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Ronda said:


> Yup, the bones are tiny and soft (and my dog loves to eat the head first, if an eye drops out she sucks it up faster than a hoover!). However you need to educate yourself on what fish are safe to feed, a general rule is small, oily ocean fish (mackeral, sardine, smelt, whiting, anchovy)...you need to stay away from fish with a high mercury level, generally the bigger the fish, the higher the level.
> 
> 
> A very good resource is Laurie's Raw Dog Ranch, she has tons of info on there and explains it very clearly and gives examples of what meats you can feed. That is how I started feeding raw about 7/8 months ago, I had flirted with the idea and given some here and there but when I switched cold turkey I started with her website and went from there. Plus I used to post "Am I going to Kill my Dog with this _____?" food type of questions here and the members were very kind about sharing knowledge and easing my fears.
> ...


Thanks! I just saw a video and tripe does look pretty gross. I'll add that one once I get the hang of the routine since that's one more thing to worry about cutting and preparing. 

How do you freeze and bag your meats? I'm looking into buying a refrigerator full sized. I thought about a deep chest freezer, found a 4.5cu ft for $80 but I found a 24cu ft fridge for around $100 and I could use the extra refrigerator space for my home pretty badly and I'll need it to thaw the meat. 

I don't want to buy 40lbs of meat, freeze it all and then have it all turn into one big chunk of frozen meat cause that would be impossible to separate into daily portions. And thawing that big 40lbs piece of meat, refreezing, rethawing is not good for bacteria. I was thinking if I buy 40lbs of meat, I take that day to cut everything up into stripes and then re-bag into separate "weekly, 7-day" bags. I can bag with the right bone/meat/organ ratio into these weekly bags. And at the beginning of every week, I can take 1 bag out of the freezer and store this "immediate" bag in the refrigerator. That way, whenever I fed my dog, I can just open the fridge, open this bag, grab the necessary contents that are already thawed and feed in instantly. Towards the end of the week, I'll take another "weekly" bag and put it into the fridge to start thawing so it'll be ready for the next week. 
Is it okay to store meat in the fridge for 7 days after it's been thawed? I dont want it to go rancid. Should I cut this down to 5 day bags? 5 day bags is a little bit more work but not by much. it's just easier to keep track of it if it's a perfect 7-day as it coincides with weekly routines.


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## Bear L (Feb 9, 2012)

when I was in south OC, I went to a local butcher that sells meat without all the additives and hormones and shots. They were reasonably priced. I also get the free range organic chicken from Trader Joe's. If you're more in north OC or LA then the south OC butcher shop may be too far for you.


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## Verivus (Nov 7, 2010)

I would look for a raw-feeding co-op. I believe there is also a guy who sells unique proteins at a good price in your area... I will see if I have him bookmarked on my laptop when I get home. I'm jealous; wish I still lived in the OC. 

Here you go, a co-op:

http://www.socalbarf.com/SoCal_BARF/SoCal_BARF.html

Also, I would hit up the asian/mexican markets. Many are cheaper and you can find interesting cuts and proteins that are unavailable at white markets.


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## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Verivus said:


> I would look for a raw-feeding co-op. I believe there is also a guy who sells unique proteins at a good price in your area... I will see if I have him bookmarked on my laptop when I get home. I'm jealous; wish I still lived in the OC.
> 
> Here you go, a co-op:
> 
> ...


Oh my!
So cheap, at least for the chicken backs and neck! Thank you so much for the link!


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## pancake (Oct 2, 2012)

Bear L said:


> when I was in south OC, I went to a local butcher that sells meat without all the additives and hormones and shots. They were reasonably priced. I also get the free range organic chicken from Trader Joe's. If you're more in north OC or LA then the south OC butcher shop may be too far for you.



Ah yeah I appreciate it but it may be a bit too far. What city is it in? If it's off the 405 or 5, I could also arrange to go there once in a blue moon and freeze everything but probably only if prices were good too. I also get free range chicken at trader joes but I have to check what the price per pound would be. I get it to eat myself but after learning about RAW, I may just double up for my dog.


Anyone reading, I just want to make sure and double check. I just pulled some raw liver out of a raw chicken, slimy and everything. Just toss it out to my dog and she will be okay? Should I wean especially when there's organ meat involved so she doesn't get diarrhea?


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