# How can a breeder tell?



## Debbieg (Jun 7, 2009)

I was looking at websites of various German Shepherd Breeders last night while Benny and Annie were happily playing at my feet and DH was incessantly channel surfing. I noticed a few sites that rate the pups in the same litter with words like as "pet, show, exceptional or ultimate" quality and price them accordingly Most did not list prices but a few sites went from $1500 - $2000 for pet, all the way up to $7500 for ultimate.

My questions is how can a breeder tell in the pups first 8 weeks of life? What do you look for?


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Pet quality would be something like a long coat or little to no drive.

Show quality would be a pup that has the correct structural build and gait. You can see that at 8 weeks but it doesn't always mean it STAYS that way. And some pups that were 'pet' at 8 weeks can go on to become awesome breed ring dogs.

If a breeder really KNOWS their lines and has produced several litters and followed them to maturity, they should know, at 8 weeks, what to expect.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Forgot to add - SOME breeders will just guess or lie, just to get more money from people.


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## rokanhaus (Mar 20, 2006)

IMO, you really can't. Too much of the pup's future success depends upon the owner. 

Some pups yes, you can tell by temperament, drive, dominance level if they are more suited for pet or a show/working home. But even then, that can change as the pup matures. I have too often kept back the "middle" pup as far as potential, only to have them surpass the "pick" simply because I am an experienced handler.

All my pups are the same price unless they have a fault.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: Debbieg I noticed a few sites that rate the pups in the same litter with words like as "pet, show, exceptional or ultimate" quality and price them accordingly Most did not list prices but a few sites went from $1500 - $2000 for pet, all the way up to $7500 for ultimate.
> 
> My questions is how can a breeder tell in the pups first 8 weeks of life?


The breeder is looking for people who feel they did a wise choice by getting a pup at a lower price for a minor flaw that does not matter to them, and also for people who want something better and superior, and will gain bragging rights for having such a pup due to the amount of money they had to pay for it. 

I think it is good marketing. One way to appeal to different people and what they are looking for, but they are playing on people's feelings and egos more than on the pup's potential, because puppies can change so much. Even with working lines, a pup that started out as lazy and mellow and better suited to a pet home as opposed to a working/competition home may still develop later on to be a more serious, high-energy dog more suited for real work than just lounging around the house. At eight weeks, the same amount of work and effort and planning and care was put into each pup in the litter, their potential is just that, potential. Hard for me to see how some breeders can justify such massive price differences.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally Posted By: CastlemaidThe breeder is looking for people who feel they did a wise choice by getting a pup at a lower price for a minor flaw that does not matter to them, and also for *people who want something better and superior, and will gain bragging rights for having such a pup due to the amount of money they had to pay for it.*


Debbie, I know who you're referring to, I've seen that site too. Actually there are several sites, but they're all affiliated with each other - you can tell because they have the same pricing structure and use the same words to describe the pricing categories. And I agree with Lucia, especially the second part, that I put in bold. Some people think more expensive must be better and that's who they're targeting.

Although some breeders may have a small range of prices within the litter, particularly showline breeders (discount for longcoats who can't be shown, a slightly higher price for show worthy pups vs those more suitable as companions, or "pets"), at that age it's not much more than a guess. There is really NO justification for pricing one puppy at 3 times more than another other than people are willing to pay it. 

I know someone who is a friend of a friend that bought a puppy from there a few months ago and ended up returning it, a very expensive lesson. The friend said a co-worker was looking for a shepherd puppy and wanted some breeder recommendations. She has dalmations, so she asked me. I gave her a list, and also some things to look out for, but they went with this place instead. The puppy was shipped from Texas to California, and his structure was so bad that he was walking on his hocks, making them bleed. They only had him for a couple of weeks, just long enough for the family to fall in love with him, but decided they were too concerned about potential health problems to keep him. At first the breeder was not returning their emails, but they did finally get in touch with her and made arrangements to ship him back. I haven't talked to my friend since then, so I have no idea if they got their money back or have found another puppy or are even looking for one. Pretty sour experience.


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