# New to raw - Diarrhea, lethargy, tons of pee!



## atticus_finch (Jun 7, 2015)

I know there is already a lot about starting raw and getting diarrhea, but I haven't seen anything about lethargy.

I started Atticus (10 weeks old) on 1.5# chicken (3 meals per day at 0.5# per meal) 3 days ago. Been feeding all parts of the chicken (minus organs and skin), trying to add in as much bone per meal as possible. Well, ever since the first night he's been going back and forth between watery/slippery dark diarrhea and slippery hard stools (looks like he's straining). Maybe I should be just feeding wings and backs for now?

He's also been peeing all the time! Tons on quantity and its a lot more clear than when I had him on kibble. He's been peeing in the house without warning, which he didn't do before. Even when I take him outside, he'll usually pee twice before we go back in. Where before, he would only have to pee once.

So, the past few days he's been super energetic and normal and extremely excited to eat his meals. Today, not so much. He's still eating, but with significantly less gusto than the last couple days. He usually has one ear up too, and today it's down. That, accompanied by his naps all day today makes me think he's getting sick. He even threw up a little bit earlier today, it was just chicken chunks and some bone pieces. I let him eat it since I read that I should do that somewhere else on this forum.

Oh, and I tried feeding pumpkin with his meal this morning, but I think it made him not want to eat his food. He just ended up dragging the chicken through the dirt till i eventually ripped it up more and hand fed him.

If anyone can help me figure out whats going on, it would be appreciated. I know it's still early and maybe he just needs time to acclimate to the new diet, i'm just not sure if this is something I should bring to the vet's attention, or if I should just wait it out.


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

He should see a veterinarian!


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Take him to the vet. A young pup can easily get dehydrated. With raw you have to give a balanced diet, not just chicken without fat and organs. He needs all these too. Your vet will most likely put him on a Royal Canine or Science Diet kibble, which you can do to get him back on track. Then start a balanced raw after studying what you should give him. There is plenty of info on this forum. 
Do not self-vet or diagnose with a young pup.


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## atticus_finch (Jun 7, 2015)

wolfy dog said:


> Take him to the vet. A young pup can easily get dehydrated. With raw you have to give a balanced diet, not just chicken without fat and organs. He needs all these too. Your vet will most likely put him on a Royal Canine or Science Diet kibble, which you can do to get him back on track. Then start a balanced raw after studying what you should give him. There is plenty of info on this forum.
> Do not self-vet or diagnose with a young pup.


Okay, I will take him to the vet in the morning if he is still acting weird. I have been doing my research for a while now and everywhere I've read, it has said to start with just chicken without the skin or organs till they acclimate to the diet. This is the first time I'm hearing something different.

When I take him to the vet should I ask them to check his hydration? Anything else in particular they should check out? I take him to Banfield, and they tend to just throw random medicines and tests at the problem rather than trying to find the underlying issue using critical thinking methods. I would just like to go in with an idea of what tests I would like them to run.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Maybe put him back on his old diet in the meantime. Regarding the vet visit: ask them for what you want to know, like if he is dehydrated, bring the questions with you on paper so you don't get overwhelmed. I would not let them sell me antibiotics without a clear diagnoses by way of a physical and a fecal sample to test for parasites esp. giardia. Bring some fresh poop from your pup with you.
I have found that many vets put animals on antibiotics" for "just in case".


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Banfield is terrible. Find a real vet. However, vets need to run tests in order to find issues. 

Please, if you are going to feed a growing puppy raw and you have no prior experience, at least find a commercial raw that is balanced and subject to the same bacterial testing that kibble is. If you do this wrong and mess up his growing bones, you OWN that. Bravo Balance is a decent food at a decent price.

1. RAW has more water in it. He should be peeing more. The food itself has higher fluid content.
2. Ears up and down have nothing to do with it. They go up and down until they stay up. They'll probably go down again when he's teething.
3. The diarrhea is the concerning part. It could be the change in diet. it could be not enough bone. It could be to much food. It could be a build up of bacteria. It could be a partial obstruction.

Feed him cooked rice (boiled in 2x the water), a cooked lean meat and a bit of ginger to soothe his stomach.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

you need to transition a young pup --- the digestive system is still incompetent --- he will have inherited his mother's bacterial culture at time of vaginal birth which gives him his immunity .

his mother will have a bacterial culture which was ideal for what HER diet was -- so if she was kibble fed , that pro biotic gut flora adjusted to her internal environment.

this pup needs to establish his own gut flora -- which takes a bit of time 

IF the female had any form of anti biotics prior to breeding that bacterial culture would have been vastly diminished , making less beneficial bacteria available for the pups .
In the past some breeders did this as a routine to clear any bacteria that may prevent fertilization and implantation of eggs.
I don't believe this is as prevalent nowadays.

sounds like a by-product of largesse -- too much food - too rich 

cut back and start off with chicken necks , something where he puts in time and effort 

"He just ended up dragging the chicken through the dirt till i eventually ripped it up more and hand fed him."

sign of too much . I would have picked it up and put it away .


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

atticus_finch said:


> When I take him to the vet should I ask them to check his hydration? Anything else in particular they should check out? I take him to Banfield, and they tend to just throw random medicines and tests at the problem rather than trying to find the underlying issue using critical thinking methods. I would just like to go in with an idea of what tests I would like them to run.


If you can, take him to a different vet if you are not happy with Banfield. You just need to be honest with the vet that you are feeding him raw chicken. Chicken has lots of nasty bacteria that could be making him sick. It may be unrelated to his diet and a competent vet will know what tests to run, our vet likes to use this diarrhea panel from IDEXX: https://www.idexx.com/corporate/news/press-releases/20090116pr.html


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## zudnic (May 23, 2015)

Any updates? 

Just in case this pops up on searches in the future. Having diarrhea and vomiting together, you should see a vet or at least call them.


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

Jax08 said:


> Banfield is terrible. Find a real vet.



LOLOLOL...... I did a free "wellness" exam there....somehow ...even though the dog had wonderful "wellness"...there were many suggestions on how I could spend some $$$ there. I got some free pens and fridge magnets which were nice as well. I just took her there out of curiosity and thought it would be a good place to proof her.


Superg


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## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

atticus,

Some advice has been given which suggests the raw diet you are feeding your pup might be inadequate, I would heed that advice.....but it could be many factors, so ruling out any medical causes is wise as you are choosing.


SuperG


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