# Why do you recommend Orijen and Acana over other LBP food?



## yoleska (Nov 6, 2014)

So I've been doing a lot of research lately. I've read hundreds of forum posts that list Orijen or Acana much better for large breed puppies (LBP) versus TOTW Puppy Kibble. I've studied the kibble Google doc here (crap, can't link it yet) titled "Dog Food Nutrition".

However, the nutritional breakdown doesn't make sense to me WHY they're being recommended as they're values exceed what should be in range for a LBP. 

The recommended nutritional values are:

Calcium 0.7-1.2%
Protein 15-27%
Fat 9-12%

Orijen Large Breed Puppy Food has
Calcium 1.5-1.7%
Protein 38%
Fat 16%

Acana Large Breed Puppy Food
Calcium 1.6%
Protein 32%
Fat 15%

Compare that with TOTW Puppy (non-Large Breed) which is closer to the recommended values:
Calcium 1.4%
Protein 28%
Fat 17%

But TOTW has been posted many times about not being recommended for LBP due to the calcium levels. But it's lower than the 2 most recommended brands.

What's the deal here? What am I missing?

I have a 3 month old working puppy whom I'm training for Schutzhund if that helps any. He currently is on TOTW puppy (breeder choice), but he's itching a lot, so I'm looking for a more healthier food.


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## amburger16 (May 22, 2015)

I chose Fromm Prairie Gold Large Breed Puppy (Which is grain free)
The levels in that are as follows: (I had to email them for calcium and phosphorus).

Calcium--1.04% As-Is Basis; 1.12% Dry-Matter Basis
Phosphorus--0.97% As-Is Basis; 1.04% Dry-Matter Basis
Which is Ca ratio of 1.07 to 1.
Fat 14%
Protein 26%

Bear loves it and is doing great on it.


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## Galathiel (Nov 30, 2012)

Did you look at the list of ingredients involved in their nutritional breakdown? Big difference. I'm not saying I recommend Origen/Acana .. I don't. I've never used either. But the ingredient list IS quite different. You want to check that first and not just which one has the best cal/pho ratios.


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## amburger16 (May 22, 2015)

People can recommend whatever, but when it comes down to it, its how the dog likes it.. Orijen and Acana are great foods, I just don't see the need for all that protein.. A puppies body is most likely not going to be able to absorb all of it at once.. Also, too much protein can cause calcium to leach out of bones.. I still recommend Fromm, it may have a few more red ingredients on dogfoodadvisor.com, but my diet also consists of a few things that should be black flagged and I'm alive and well..


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## Nikitta (Nov 10, 2011)

I feed **** van Patten's Natural Balance Lamb and rice kibble and meat rolls. My dogs love it.


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

I actually prefer to feed Fromm, my dogs have not loved the Origen and at that price it's not worth it to feed if they don't love it, I recently bought a bag of the All Life Stage Grain Free Victor Super Premium and they love it, which is perfect since I have multiple dogs of many breeds and sizes and 2 puppies.


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## yoleska (Nov 6, 2014)

hmm, my second post didn't get approved it seems. Let me try again. 

My question wasn't about the ingredients. I totally understand that both Orijen and Acana have excellent ingredients. I was more concerned with why people are recommending those two brands when the suggested limits (%s) are higher in those two brands than some of the the other LBP food. 

And I'm not knocking either one - in fact a couple days ago, I just bought my first bag of Orijen. Surprising it was actually $20 less than what I had priced it online when I bought it at a local pet supply store. $70 for 28lb bag.


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## Narny (Sep 8, 2010)

After trying raw and having some issues I needed to switch to a high end dog kibble. I personally decided to go with Orijen large breed puppy. I made that decision because right before then was the MAJOR Diamond plant recall (Diamond makes TOTW). Hundreds of animals were dying and I completely lost trust in their ability to process foods properly. I will NEVER purchase another Diamond processed kibble. After she out grew Orijen we went to Acana Pacifica. She stopped being excited about food so now my dog eats Fromm's a la Salmon.

I search every dog food and where its made before I switch.


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## amburger16 (May 22, 2015)

yoleska said:


> hmm, my second post didn't get approved it seems. Let me try again.
> 
> My question wasn't about the ingredients. I totally understand that both Orijen and Acana have excellent ingredients. I was more concerned with why people are recommending those two brands when the suggested limits (%s) are higher in those two brands than some of the the other LBP food.
> 
> And I'm not knocking either one - in fact a couple days ago, I just bought my first bag of Orijen. Surprising it was actually $20 less than what I had priced it online when I bought it at a local pet supply store. $70 for 28lb bag.



I've never understood why its recommended either, but I'm sure there are things I don't know, but others do. I don't have a large amount of dog experience when it comes to nutrition, etc. As an adult I would consider feeding Acana or Orijen, but for LBP definitely Fromm for me. Fromm Prairie Gold LBP is on the lower side of the recommended max ratios/percentages, and that makes me happy along with the ingredients in it.


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## KPK (Jan 28, 2015)

I know Orijen is priced more however I think you are getting what you pay for.I would look at the ingredients a little closer over the values you have listed and also factor in that 10% more protein is a huge difference. 

The chicken, turkey, and eggs are all cage free or fresh from a nest. Most meat and fish sources are also free range grass fed beef, or wild caught fish, for human quality consumption along with the fact they never outsource their ingredients.

No difference than shopping for grass fed beef, wild fish, or cage free poultry for yourself. I only purchase wild caught or grass fed for my personnel consumption and it makes a huge difference in taste and quality. Over 80% of Human beef or poultry comes from ranches that feed unnatural diets.They will try to fatten them up to pack on the most pounds in the shortest amount of time for a faster turnover profit. They keep them confined in a tight space without any movement and are fed an unnatural diet mostly consisting of corn, soy protein, along with added hormones.


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## DTS (Oct 19, 2010)

I feed Origen 6 fish. I've fed multiple Acana formulas to my female and she only was itchy on the grasslands. But each dog is different.
When Titan was a puppy he was on Origen LBP. He did well on it, but his coat was a little oily near his tail head. But he is extremely good sensitive.
I tried switching to Victor a few months ago. My female to the Yukon fish formula, and my male to their athlete one which had a small amount of grain but high calories which he needs. She did fine his skin became inflamed and itchy and he got a staph infection. 
They are both back on Orijen 6 fish. Both are fine. I might eventually switch back to Acana just because it cost me $86 a bag for the Orijen and it lasts about 3 weeks
I haven't tried Fromm but I'm not against the ingredients either.


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## voodoolamb (Jun 21, 2015)

I really want to like Orijen and Acana. I've contacted Champion pet food and they really care about the quality of their product. However their philosophy for what is the best nutrition for dogs just does not fit my own. I actually plan on having the Orijen freeze dried in my rotation but as far as their kibble is concerned I'm just to worried about the Phytic Acid and Lectin content from lentils. Especially considering all the Digestive issues that German Shepherds are prone to I just wouldn't feel comfortable feeding it long term. I am sure for 99% of the dog's out there the anti nutrients aren't a problem but with my luck I'll get that 1% 

Personally I want to stay away from all legumes, night shades, pseudo grains and grain in my guys food. Compounds in the aforementioned items have anti-nutrient and inflamatory properties. There are a lot of studies out there linking them with leaky gut, IBS, obesity, arthritis, poor absorbtion of minerals, leptin resistance, dermatitis, poor immune response, allergies, etc etc. I mean I even avoid eating too much of this stuff myself (and I feel a heck of a lot better from doing it!). In small amounts it's not bad. So I wouldn't freak about giving my dog a bite of wheat pizza crust with tomato sauce on it. But the way dog food is intended to be used. Same food every day for weeks on end... I prefer to leave those things out of the dish. 

That said it is HARD to find kibble that doesn't include those ingredients! I'll be feeding my pup Ziwipeak air dried kibble as the main processed food stuff. But dang it is going to take a huge bite from my wallet. I also like The Great Life's Formulas and they are very reasonably priced! The Dr E's, Great Life Grain & Potato Free, and Pioneer Naturals. They're all life stages formulas and the calcium for most are in the safe range for large breed puppies. If you like to stay on the low side, Dr E's Buffalo is at 1.16% calcium and 1.07% phosphorus which put's it at 1.1:1. 27% protein and comes in at around $60 for 30lbs too (Prices for their other formulas range from $40 to $75)

The things I like that is of course the ingredient list (None of my no - nos!) But it also has enzymes and probiotics added. Uses freeze dried ingredients with the kibble. The buffalo is pasture raised - It could have higher meat content for my liking, but I like to mix kibble with canned so it paired with one of the high quality just meat canned foods is a good starting point for me. I'll probably be feeding it every so often to keep the pup used to it in case of unforseeable circumstances where my primary plan of feeding ziwipeak and raw become unfeasible.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Big factor is non USA ingredients. So hopefully the meats are not tainted with antibiotics, hormones and the other poisons the FDA allows in all our foods. No GMO veggies and fruits.

People in this country need to start looking at what they eat not just what the dogs eat. Our foods are banned every where. Yesterday Europe banned our Apples.

Raw feeders need to no where the meats come from.


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## Keisha1 (Aug 28, 2013)

One thing I know about Orijen LBP is not only are the ingredients superior, the calcium and phosphorus come from the bone and cartilage in the ingredients- it is not added as a supplement- therefore it is better and more naturally absorbed and processed by puppies. Much better for them.


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## Blondi's Revenge (Jan 31, 2015)

I feed FROMM and Acana as an additional supplement to Raw . . I also give supplements


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## Stonevintage (Aug 26, 2014)

I thought fish was an inferior source of protein? For people - I've always read in survival guides that relying on fish for your meat/protein source actually drains the body of other vital nutrients over a fairly short period of time.

Any other meat source is acceptable, but not fish. Anyone know why and how that relates to dog food?


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## 115pounds (Aug 27, 2015)

Stonevintage said:


> I thought fish was an inferior source of protein? For people - I've always read in survival guides that relying on fish for your meat/protein source actually drains the body of other vital nutrients over a fairly short period of time.
> 
> Any other meat source is acceptable, but not fish. Anyone know why and how that relates to dog food?


I have never heard that, but I don't feed that much fish. I have heard you should be careful how much fish you eat, because of the mercury levels.

The high glucosamine levels in Orijen is a great advantage to their products.


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## s14roller (Nov 18, 2010)

I fall into this too, but sometimes I wonder if we fall into the marketing of the product and how it appeals to us (as if we would be the ones eating it) vs. the nutritional value for our dog (ie, livers/hearts/kidneys vs. free range chicken breast).


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