# Brother and Sister Breeding



## Yoshi (May 12, 2014)

So I was checking this out because I like to see what the siblings of my pup's parents are doing and I saw this. 

https://www.pedigreedatabase.com/breeding.result?father=2191249&mother=2089814

I do believe that that is a very close line breeding and I was wondering what would the result be, health and temperament wise? I think - correct me if I'm wrong - I read somewhere here that only very knowledgeable breeders do such line breedings?


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## Blitzkrieg1 (Jul 31, 2012)

Lots of Ellute (both top an bottom), Tom and Troll/Yoschy. Im no pedigree expert. 

However, what I would watch for in this breeding is hips, elbows and spine maybe 
some skin issues via Yoschy/Fado.

On the other hand I would expect a lot of prey from Yoschy/Troll, strong nerve Ellute/Tom, and some aggression/hardness coming from certain dogs that I see here and there such as Crok who comes several times through the grandsire on the top end (4-3), Mink and Fado who is seen several times.

This would be a very interesting litter for me to watch. Maybe even buy a pup if it was close and they gave a hip guarentee or I could prelim. Some beast potential for sure. Not pets, probably a lot of dog for most handlers. Or maybe a complete crapper or three . 
Are there vids of the dogs in question?


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## mharrisonjr26 (Feb 10, 2011)

Blitzkrieg1 said:


> Lots of Ellute (both top an bottom), Tom and Troll/Yoschy. Im no pedigree expert.
> 
> However, what I would watch for in this breeding is hips, elbows and spine maybe
> some skin issues via Yoschy/Fado.
> ...



Took the words right out of my mouth...


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## Yoshi (May 12, 2014)

I don't know about any videos of the dogs, but I think there are videos of their relatives. As far as I know both parents have good hip/elbow scores.  When you say crappers, do you mean bad, nervy dogs?


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

Let me say that I have seen breedings like this solidify some traits and produce some great litters/dogs.....but in general this breeding is too close unless you have right dogs in right places. With this particular breeding, the close line breeding on Ellute and Troll v Haus Malinda would jade my opinion. Troll is a dog that I have always seen nice strong dogs out of.....but he is not a dog I would linebreed on.


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## Yoshi (May 12, 2014)

cliffson1 said:


> With this particular breeding, the close line breeding on Ellute and Troll v Haus Malinda would jade my opinion. Troll is a dog that I have always seen nice strong dogs out of.....but he is not a dog I would linebreed on.


The breeder emphasized the line breeding of Ajax. But Ajax is a son of Troll I am pretty sure . . . Geez, all these names! :crazy: 

Sounds good how such a close line breeding can fix traits but wouldn't there be some concern for a loss of genetic variation? I am no breeder but if I was I would be concerned about mating sister and brother together.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Troll hM is not a dog whose traits I would want to solidify. Dogs are too sporty for me and they lack something in their temperaments.......... a real connection to their handlers or a desire to work with their handlers instead of for what's in it for them. I have trained with several sons and grandsons.


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## Yoshi (May 12, 2014)

lhczth said:


> Troll hM is not a dog whose traits I would want to solidify. Dogs are too sporty for me and they lack something in their temperaments.......... a real connection to their handlers or a desire to work with their handlers instead of for what's in it for them. I have trained with several sons and grandsons.


Do you mean that Troll and some of his progeny generally lack the willingness to please? I thought that sporty types of dogs would have to be fairly biddable if they were to excel at their sports? :shrug:


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Yes. Not anymore.


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