# A GSD went after Azalea and I today



## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

My puppy Azalea and I were going for our first walk in our new neighborhood today (we just moved). It turns out that the neighbor one street over has 2 GSDs that are kept contained by a 4' chain link fence. As soon as we were on their street the male GSD jumped the fence and started coming after us. Luckily, the dog didn't get a chance to bite us, a man that happened to be driving by pulled over and pulled Azalea and I into his truck. We called animal control in the truck. It looks like animal control picked up both of the dogs, including the one that stayed in the yard. I'm now feeling a little guilty about calling animal control-the dog never actually bit us, sure he scared us and came after us but still there was no actual bite involved. I hope I made the right decision, what will animal control likely do?


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## zyppi (Jun 2, 2006)

wouldn't be too guilty.

The dogs could A) go after another dog, B) go after a child or C) get run over.

I can guarantee this isn't the first time one of the dogs has jumped that fence.

I'd never assume a 4' fence could contain a GSD...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

As long as nobody said anything that was untrue to the authorities there is nothing to be guilty of. The owners of the dogs will probably have to pay a fine for not containing their dog properly. Not sure why they snagged both of them. But, leaving a dog in a four foot fence is not too bright, and the owner needed a reality check. 

Glad no one was hurt.


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## Kaimeju (Feb 2, 2013)

Don't be guilty. Nothing bad will happen to the dogs. If this is the first report, AC will probably just give them a lecture and maybe a fine. It's for the dogs own protection that they need to be contained properly, not to mention everyone else in the neighborhood.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

It depends on the city, and what the owner does. 

In my city, if an ACO impounds dogs from a property, they'll leave a summons. The owner has 5 days to show the ACO they've secured the yard, and then go and pay a fine, plus daily "boarding" fees for each day at animal control -- with several dogs, it can be several hundred dollars. Sometimes owners can't or won't pay it. If that happens, the dogs will become the property of the public shelter. They'll then be temperament tested to determine whether they can go into the adoption program, to rescue, or be euthanized at the end of the hold period.


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## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

Seems like the guy got both of his dogs back today...and was keeping them in the same yard unattended. Oh well, I hope it doesn't take a real incident for him to learn. Yesterday could have ended up much worse.


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## Debanneball (Aug 28, 2014)

Mikki, don't walk that way, steer clear, be safe!


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Mikki said:


> Seems like the guy got both of his dogs back today...and was keeping them in the same yard unattended. Oh well, I hope it doesn't take a real incident for him to learn. Yesterday could have ended up much worse.


I had almost the same kind of issue with some people and they also had 2 not so very nice GSD's, actually the dogs were just plain scary. They lived in a corner house that backed up to a park and walking trail. They had very little to keep them contained and it made me nervous when I walked through there. It was a very busy walking area. I stopped seeing them after a while then last year when I was training my male GSD they came out walking with one. So I knew they were still there and I just avoided walking over there.


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## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

We just moved to this new neighborhood and this week we're putting up a fence in our yard (6'!). Between not being able to fence in the whole area we wanted (turns out the back 20' or so of my property is too wet to put a fence in) and having to purchase the chain link fencing in 50' rolls it looks like I'm going to have quite a bit of extra materials. I'm wondering if I should go over and offer it to them? It won't be enough to fence in there whole yard but fences aren't cheap and it would help them out a bit.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

We have neighbors whose dogs are always running loose. I told the woman someone is going to hit one of her dogs if she can't keep them out of the street. The next day they were back out there, so I gave up. I've avoided them so far. If one goes after my dog, I won't be that kind about it, though.


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## Nikitta (Nov 10, 2011)

You know. I love this breed. They are so smart. The problem is, if they are not socialized and trained, they can turn into monsters. It's the retarded owners who let these dogs get like that and the sad thing is the poor dogs pay for stupid owners.


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## volcano (Jan 14, 2013)

Socialized and trained only goes so far. I went to a german shepherd club for training- the funny thing was that none of the trainers dogs were stable? my dog couldnt come near ANY of them without me getting scolded for allowing my happy go lucky dog nearby. All the dogs were mean, except the one trainers pitbull who was a good example for us beginners.
I even went to a showline shutz trainer who had the same crap- I saw him scold a guy who had recently got a bh for having his dog out of the crate while the trainer and his dog walked by, the trainers dog freaked out seeing a dog off the shutz field. Later I walked past the crate and got scolded? He related a story of his dog fence fighting for years after a dog walked past his house? And this dog was also described as a great stud, "clear in the head"? He thought all dogs would en up like his mental case just because they saw a dog.

The fact is genetics plays a bigger part than socialization. You cant undo genetics. Its also a fact there are dangerous pit bull lines, the story of my dog was nice until it ate my 5 year old isnt too uncommon and its the genetics and lack of temperament testing. In gsd its less of dogs that snap out of the blue and more of mental cases and dogs who are acting out of fear- and get bred to other sketchy dogs for generations.


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## volcano (Jan 14, 2013)

I havent met a nice gsd other than mine. its almost 2 years ive owned her so if I see one somewhere ill make some effort to make contact.
None of them are nice.
It took alot of effort to get my girl so nice, I remember she didnt sleep in my presence for over a year! Now she lays over for belly rubs and all the fun stuff youd hope for from a nice dog.


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## CarlyNine (Apr 17, 2013)

volcano said:


> I havent met a nice gsd other than mine. its almost 2 years ive owned her so if I see one somewhere ill make some effort to make contact.
> None of them are nice.
> It took alot of effort to get my girl so nice, I remember she didnt sleep in my presence for over a year! Now she lays over for belly rubs and all the fun stuff youd hope for from a nice dog.



I've met dozens of nice gsd's, not including my own...


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## Syaoransbear (Sep 25, 2008)

All the german shepherds I've met so far have been nice :shrug:.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I have nice GSDs. Today I had a stranger come to my house. I released Joy in her presence and crated her, and then let her in the kennel with Bear and puppies. Bear was enthusiastic, and happy to see a new person. 

I then let her come in and meet Cujo and Moofie. Cujo came up to her sniffed her and barked at her. But he did not try to be nasty to her. Moofie was his goofy self and never a cross emotion coming across. 

Good dogs are good dogs. They are out there. They exist in our breed. There may be regions where what is out and about are bloodlines that are reactive, etc, and you will see mostly that type of dog because the local breeders are all breeding the same bloodlines.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

"went after us" What does that mean? Dogs can look scary to humans and cause no harm. Let me say very strongly that I do not like or condone loose dogs and have a tendency to report dogs that charge me and mine. (This was a huge issue in Arkansas and to a certain extent in Wyoming). On the other hand, I do not consider the loose dogs "bad" dogs or "mean" or "not nice." I consider the human gate keepers to be rather inconsiderate.


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## PMRonan (Mar 29, 2014)

You did right, if a dog charged Jager and I when he was young I would have shot the dog, not because it was a bad dog, but because I would not gamble my dogs life or my ability to work on someone else's negligence. I have children, we need to eat and we need our dog. No chances taken. Take from that what you will. If it makes me look like a bad person so be it.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

PMRonan said:


> You did right, if a dog charged Jager and I when he was young I would have shot the dog, not because it was a bad dog, but because I would not gamble my dogs life or my ability to work on someone else's negligence. I have children, we need to eat and we need our dog. No chances taken. Take from that what you will. If it makes me look like a bad person so be it.


Because most people take their 45 with them when they walk their puppy just in case. 

Ever wonder what the other 99.999% of the population manage to do when they walk their pup. 

It's just shocking that the majority of people on this forum are still kicking.


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## MamaofLEO (Aug 8, 2014)

selzer said:


> Because most people take their 45 with them when they walk their puppy just in case...Ever wonder what the other 99.999% of the population manage to do when they walk their pup.


I take my 9mm---and my CCL.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

volcano said:


> Socialized and trained only goes so far. I went to a german shepherd club for training- the funny thing was that none of the trainers dogs were stable? my dog couldnt come near ANY of them without me getting scolded for allowing my happy go lucky dog nearby. All the dogs were mean, except the one trainers pitbull who was a good example for us beginners.
> I even went to a showline shutz trainer who had the same crap- I saw him scold a guy who had recently got a bh for having his dog out of the crate while the trainer and his dog walked by, the trainers dog freaked out seeing a dog off the shutz field. Later I walked past the crate and got scolded? He related a story of his dog fence fighting for years after a dog walked past his house? And this dog was also described as a great stud, "clear in the head"? He thought all dogs would en up like his mental case just because they saw a dog.
> 
> The fact is genetics plays a bigger part than socialization. You cant undo genetics. Its also a fact there are dangerous pit bull lines, the story of my dog was nice until it ate my 5 year old isnt too uncommon and its the genetics and lack of temperament testing. In gsd its less of dogs that snap out of the blue and more of mental cases and dogs who are acting out of fear- and get bred to other sketchy dogs for generations.


Out of curiosity, which GSD club were you at with the trainers dogs that weren't stable?


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## Longfisher (Feb 28, 2013)

*Walking Defenses*

When I walked my Zeus as a puppy he was regularly harassed by other dogs and often charged. We dealt with it by using a four step program 1) charge in return, 2) spray pepper spray, 3) shoot the dog, 4) keep enough ammo in reserve to deal immediately with any irate and assaulting dog owner.

I carry a .45 and CCL. Wife carries a 9mm. All ammo is hollow-point. Just a matter of the size of the hand, I guess.

We're not going to be run over or have our dog mauled just because someone is irresponsible.

Good news is that Zeus is so huge now that almost no dog even considers attacking him or me. Same goes for most passerbys too. 


Works for me.

LF


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Longfisher said:


> When I walked my Zeus as a puppy he was regularly harassed by other dogs and often charged. We dealt with it by using a four step program 1) charge in return, 2) spray pepper spray, 3) shoot the dog, 4) keep enough ammo in reserve to deal immediately with any irate and assaulting dog owner.
> 
> I carry a .45 and CCL. Wife carries a 9mm. All ammo is hollow-point. Just a matter of the size of the hand, I guess.
> 
> ...



And what to do when the other person pulls out a shot gun on you? I don't think people consider what people get killed over everywhere every day.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

Because a GSD doesn't want to be a happy fluff ball and have tea parties with other dogs does not mean that they are mean or untrained and have 'retarded' owners. (Gee...I HATE that term!)


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I am so sick of people who claim that they will shoot dogs that come after theirs while they are walking. Usually these are guys who are wimps. Women manage to deal with dogs rushing their pups and dogs without shooting them, and they are supposed to be the weaker sex. What a bunch of crap. Most of the people who are afraid of my dogs are men, not women. And most of the guys here claiming they would shoot a dog coming toward them, or the irate dog owner, are full of hot air and need to grow up. And as for the dog being big enough now that other dogs don't bother him, well, that just proves you haven't a clue about dog behavior at all. It isn't the size of the dog that matters, it is all attitude. A dog doesn't size up the competition by comparing the height and weight of their possible opponents. Doesn't work that way.


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## MamaofLEO (Aug 8, 2014)

That is your prerogative, Selzer.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

MamaofLEO said:


> That is your prerogative, Selzer.


Somehow I made it 46 years without once having to shoot a dog. I walk dogs. I have been charged by loose dogs, even pit bulls, and somehow, I have managed to keep myself and my dogs safe. 

Actually, my dogs have NEVER bitten a dog during a walk that has come charging at us. And they and I have NEVER been bitten by one. So had I started blasting away at the dogs that came charging up, it would have been an unnecessary slaughter. 

And these young punks are going to shoot any dog that looks cross-eyed at their mutt, just because they can. They have a CCP, they can shoot a dog. What a bunch of heros we have on a dog site.


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## sourdough44 (Oct 26, 2013)

I'm not big with the talk about shooting dogs, that would be only an extreme last resort. I recently read about a guy that shot himself in the hand. I don't recall the details, but thought it was while dealing with an aggressive/'attacking' dog. Things are moving around pretty good with a close in dog fight.

I defer back to pepper spray in most cases, where something is needed.

'Dog people' should be able to handle most short of shooting. I've stood off aggressive pit bulls at 6' or so. I didn't have a gun, but the dog knew he shouldn't come closer.

If one needs a reminder, just look at news stories when someone shoots a "pet" without just cause. Depending on the circumstances it can cause a lot of grief, and expense.


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## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

middleofnowhere said:


> "went after us" What does that mean? Dogs can look scary to humans and cause no harm. Let me say very strongly that I do not like or condone loose dogs and have a tendency to report dogs that charge me and mine. (This was a huge issue in Arkansas and to a certain extent in Wyoming). On the other hand, I do not consider the loose dogs "bad" dogs or "mean" or "not nice." I consider the human gate keepers to be rather inconsiderate.


I am 110% positive that this particular dog would have bit us had the stranger with the truck not shown up. While we were sitting in the truck the dog was still scratching at the truck, growling, etc. He was aggressive with the animal control officers when they showed up as well. Nowhere did I call the dog "bad", "mean" or "not nice". It was a bad situation that could have been a lot worse, but also could have been avoided had the owner either had a fence/yard that was escape proof or not left the dogs outside alone while they were not home.


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## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

selzer said:


> Somehow I made it 46 years without once having to shoot a dog. I walk dogs. I have been charged by loose dogs, even pit bulls, and somehow, I have managed to keep myself and my dogs safe.
> 
> Actually, my dogs have NEVER bitten a dog during a walk that has come charging at us. And they and I have NEVER been bitten by one. So had I started blasting away at the dogs that came charging up, it would have been an unnecessary slaughter.
> 
> And these young punks are going to shoot any dog that looks cross-eyed at their mutt, just because they can. They have a CCP, they can shoot a dog. What a bunch of heros we have on a dog site.


Selzer,
Can you please explain to us the proper way to avoid a dog fight? If a similar incident were to happen again (hopefully not!), how would one go about avoiding a fight?


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## Debanneball (Aug 28, 2014)

Mikki said:


> Selzer,
> ..... If a similar incident were to happen again (hopefully not!), how would one go about avoiding a fight?


Simply stay away from that house so it would not/could not happen again... IMO


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

There are so many different scenarios and different things to do depending on what is going on in that moment. I was out with two of my dogs and two huge pits came at us. The only injury was to the owner of the pits who couldn't control both dogs. I have never had to even get physical with any charging dogs. My goal is to protect my dog and I will take a bite versus letting my dog, but it's never gotten to that point. I will avoid areas if I know there are problem dogs and I always watch my surroundings, as well as listen to what is going on.


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## Mikki (Aug 17, 2014)

I agree that avoiding known problem houses such as this one is the obvious and best choice. I think it would be nice to get some more info from those experienced on how to avoid a dog bite in this thread. Would be good info to have in case I myself ended up in another situation with another dog, or for any of the people reading the thread.


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## Debanneball (Aug 28, 2014)

Mikki said:


> I agree that avoiding known problem houses such as this one is the obvious and best choice. I think it would be nice to get some more info from those experienced on how to avoid a dog bite in this thread. Would be good info to have in case I myself ended up in another situation with another dog, or for any of the people reading the thread.


Years ago, I was talking to my neighbour, she had a yorkshire terrier, two stray dogs came charging at us, I turned around and without thinking, threw up my arms and screamed GO HOME as loud as I could.. They ran away. I didn't have a dog with me at that moment....


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## Kyleigh (Oct 16, 2012)

I've had five incidences happen with Ky and I (in my post - back after two years) ... Some of the things I've learned:

Yes, you can avoid certain areas, but let's face it, there are lots of dogs out there, and you never know when / where / what's going to happen.

On days when I am just walking my dog around the neighbourhood, I carry a tall walking stick (about 4 feet long), or an umbrella (weather dependant!) In the winter it will probably be a ski pole!

If a dog is running at you / your dog, put your dog behind you and walk towards the dog, saying in a very loud, firm voice - NO NO NO - GO AWAY - don't yell or scream, this only adds excitement to the dog ... you can use the stick / umbrella / ski pole to keep the dog from getting to you / your dog. 

I've found this to be the most helpful - most dogs will back down when you are walking towards them, especially if you are being strong / not intimidated. 

It also helps if you can keep your dog calm (or at least not lunging / snapping / at the other dog). This is very important because if your dog is reacting to that dog, you will likely have a harder time getting that dog to leave you alone. 

After the incidences I had with Kyleigh, we had some major behaviour modification to do (with both of us). I had to get her to trust me again - trust that I would take care of the situation, and that she didn't need to get involved. It took about 6 months of LONG HARD work to get Kyleigh to understand that I have it under control. (The behaviourist that I worked with has perfectly trained dogs - she would have them run towards us and at the very last second would call them off - meanwhile, I would work with Kyleigh in getting her behind me, and standing tall and saying NO NO NO, GO AWAY.) This set Ky up to see that I can be the one in charge / can protect her. 

Then we took it to real life! There is one house in my neighbourhood and they have two dogs on tie outs. These tie outs go to the middle of the street (how these dogs haven't been hit by a car, I've yet to figure out). We walked on the sidewalk on the other side of the street (where they couldn't reach us) and we practiced this. IT WORKED! I was really surprised (and felt awesome, by the way!) 

Living in Canada, carrying a gun is not in my arsenal of options. (well, unless I'm not a law-abiding citizen!) I cringe when I read posts from people who say they would simply shoot the dog ... even when I got bit by the two dogs while I was riding my bike, I can't see how I would have been able to pull out a gun, while biking with Ky running beside me and shoot two dogs before they had a chance to bite me.

The biggest element in these instances I've learned - show no fear, stand your ground, and be FIRM and CALM. 

Good luck!


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

I was at a feed store with Hondo (on a leash). Three large, off leash (and no collars) dogs came in to the store, a GSD, a Husky, their offspring, with their owner. I left the store to wait for my husband who was purchasing horse feed. I was standing on the loading dock when all three dogs came after us. I put my dog behind me, against the wall. My intent was to block his view of the dogs so he doesn't engage and to protect him. I was saying loudly and sternly, NO! GET BACK! When the male dog attempted to jump onto the dock, I clobbered it and it fell back off the dock. It wasn't watching me, it was watching my dog. 

My husband and the dog's owner (and the employees) heard me. They all came running. NONE of the dogs were barking (including mine). It was me they heard. The owner was able to call off his dogs. 

If I was unable to keep those dogs off my dog by using my voice & becoming physical, I would have gone to phase three. When my husband came around the corner and saw me battering off three large dogs, he instantly went to phase 3. Luckily the owner was able to control his dogs. 

The store created a new policy that all dogs need to be on a leash because of this. I've never seen the owner and his dogs again.

I have livestock. When stray dogs come on my property I shoot them with rat shot. It doesn't injure the stray but it gives them something to remember and they don't come back. 

I have shot and killed a dog on my property before. It attacked my horse and I as we were working in the round pen. I blame the owner of the dog, not the dog. But I wasn't going to allow that dog to provide a single scratch to my horse. That is my commitment to my animals. To protect them.


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## PMRonan (Mar 29, 2014)

selzer said:


> Because most people take their 45 with them when they walk their puppy just in case.
> 
> Ever wonder what the other 99.999% of the population manage to do when they walk their pup.
> 
> It's just shocking that the majority of people on this forum are still kicking.


Did I ever say I carry a 45? No. And I don't. I carry a .38 snub nose. And I never once said "this is what anyone would do" Because it isn't. I put my personal input about what I would do. Not one time did i recommend that action to anyone else.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Mikki said:


> Selzer,
> Can you please explain to us the proper way to avoid a dog fight? If a similar incident were to happen again (hopefully not!), how would one go about avoiding a fight?



It does depend on the situation. First, you have to be aware of your surroundings. Dogs don't just appear out of nowhere, we need to be paying attention to the environment, not texting an essay to our buddy. 

Secondly, we have to learn to stand tall and not be afraid. It is difficult. But fake it until you make it. You stand up straight and tell the marauding dogs firmly, "GO HOME!" Most of the time, that actually has worked. It helps also to tell your own dog to LEAVE IT, or HEEL, maybe both. 

If strongly telling the dog or dogs to go home, doesn't work, then stamping at them, sometimes works. Usually, I go with my gut. I've grabbed a collar on the dog and held it until it's owner could take over. But I wouldn't do that all the time. 

Sometime I just say loudly and matter-of-factly, "GET CHER DOG!" People will come out and get their dog.


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## JJSMargo (Jul 3, 2014)

I walk with a nice stick. I have my 3 GSDs on a leash, though they ok with other dogs, but once in a blue moon there is one that they can't stand for whatever reason. If I don't see any new dogs around or their friends are there then it is ok for me to let them loose to run and play, but my head keeps turning around to observe the area. What I really can't stand is when somebody lets their dog loose and this dog runs a football field of a distance with the owner slowly walking behind talking to a buddy or texting. You can yell "GET YOU DOG!!!" all you want, but the stupid does not hear you anyway, that is when the stick comes in handy. Another great situation is when the owner of the other dog believes that all dogs love each other, especially 2 intact large, competitive males, especially when the female is present. I yell, and if that is not working, the stick goes to use again. Trained my entire neighborhood out of stupidity and into common sense and what is most important got rid of cell phone preoccupation! Sign of progress in our times, I think


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## Longfisher (Feb 28, 2013)

*Expert marksman*



llombardo said:


> And what to do when the other person pulls out a shot gun on you? I don't think people consider what people get killed over everywhere every day.


I'd move like the Devil, of course, for cover. Then I'd fire on him to kill.

I'm an expert pistol shot as I was a Marine infantry officer and pistol marksmanship instructor at the tail end of the Vietnam war. And, I keep at it.

It's a fair bet I'd come out ahead even when going up against a shotgun.

LF


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## Longfisher (Feb 28, 2013)

*Ummm*



selzer said:


> I am so sick of people who claim that they will shoot dogs that come after theirs while they are walking. Usually these are guys who are wimps. Women manage to deal with dogs rushing their pups and dogs without shooting them, and they are supposed to be the weaker sex. What a bunch of crap. Most of the people who are afraid of my dogs are men, not women. And most of the guys here claiming they would shoot a dog coming toward them, or the irate dog owner, are full of hot air and need to grow up. And as for the dog being big enough now that other dogs don't bother him, well, that just proves you haven't a clue about dog behavior at all. It isn't the size of the dog that matters, it is all attitude. A dog doesn't size up the competition by comparing the height and weight of their possible opponents. Doesn't work that way.


Ex-Marine infantry office of Vietnam vintage and expert pistol shot during and since. I think that qualifies me as something other than wimp.

And, believe me I would shoot a dog that savaged my dog or me, without a second's hesitation but for checking my back stop and lining up the sights. Furthermore, I wouldn't care one bit what you thought of it.

LF


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

selzer said:


> Sometime I just say loudly and matter-of-factly, "GET CHER DOG!" People will come out and get their dog.


My husband tried this once. He was walking our pup down the sidewalk (aka not in someone's yard or in a privately owned space) when a small dog charged up and made as if to attack PuppyGirl.

He called to the owner, who was outside, to come and get the dog. Owner did nothing. He told the owner, "If you don't get this dog away from mine before it attacks her, I will punt it."

That worked. I kind of winced when he told me the story because it's more aggressive than I'd like to be in a face to face encounter, but better than having to break anything up.


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## pets4life (Feb 22, 2011)

selzer said:


> I am so sick of people who claim that they will shoot dogs that come after theirs while they are walking. Usually these are guys who are wimps. Women manage to deal with dogs rushing their pups and dogs without shooting them, and they are supposed to be the weaker sex. What a bunch of crap. Most of the people who are afraid of my dogs are men, not women. And most of the guys here claiming they would shoot a dog coming toward them, or the irate dog owner, are full of hot air and need to grow up. And as for the dog being big enough now that other dogs don't bother him, well, that just proves you haven't a clue about dog behavior at all. It isn't the size of the dog that matters, it is all attitude. A dog doesn't size up the competition by comparing the height and weight of their possible opponents. Doesn't work that way.



One of the best posts I have read here in a while. Thank you. Most of the woman here can just yell at the dog and make him go away if you get enough time. They don't need no gun while out on a walk lol Can we sticky your post? I have been attacked by large dogs a few times. I just have to worry about saving the other dog so mine does not get in trouble.


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