# Reverse Pedigree Search



## laughaha (Apr 13, 2011)

Hi, new to this forum. Grew up with WGSD's who had alot of drive and were, well, perfect (for us). Extremely sound in mind and body. I have been trying for a long time to figure out how to see if anyone has our old bloodline and is breeding great wgsds. I've seen alot of nice looking WGSD's, but all were either very neurotic or very soft tempered. Our foundation bitch= AKC#D799744, "Christy" was born Jan 3, 89 in HI. Is there any way to find this info out? Any help would be greatly greatly appreciated. 

I didn't have any luck searching the pedigreedatabase nor the akc website. 

Also, what are some great working lines of WGSD's? I'm interested in schutzhund/advanced obedience/herding lines. I do know the difference between pet/show/working lines and I want the working temperament.


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## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

I can't help much in your search...but I don't know if there are really considered schutzhund/ob/herding lines in WGSD's. In generally, I don't know how consistently these dogs are working in those venues that you would have specific lines to go to.

But someone else might have another suggestion.


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## laughaha (Apr 13, 2011)

Thanks for responding so quickly!! That would explain why I'm having so much trouble finding a WGSD that isn't a lab in a gsd body. Nothing wrong with an outgoing friendly dog, but I want the drive and temperament of my beloved Fugi- My soulmate who passed away a couple years ago. Her AKC name was Jasmine's Little Fugi, but her papers are buried in a tote somewhere. Christy was her mother. Father's name was Ono Ke Aloha Keiki Kane (a red and black as there were NO other white GSD's in PA that we knew of and liked). I think Fugi was born Oct 18th, 1995. The day/month is correct but the year may be off a little.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

What about considering working lines if you want the working temperament?


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

You might search on Swiss Shepherds--the European white GSDs have been "re-grouped" under this name and you might be able to find some more dogs with working backgrounds.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

LOL my apologies - I was thinking West German Showlines not white GSD. Its late.


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## Whiteshepherds (Aug 21, 2010)

laughaha said:


> I have been trying for a long time to figure out how to see if anyone has our old bloodline and is breeding great wgsds. I've seen alot of nice looking WGSD's, but all were either very neurotic or very soft tempered. *Our foundation bitch*= AKC#D799744, "Christy" was born Jan 3, 89 in HI. Is there any way to find this info out? Any help would be greatly greatly appreciated.


Did you breed Christy? (Koppen's Frosted Crystal Bear) I noticed you called her your foundation bitch.


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## KLCecil (Jul 1, 2010)

My bitch is a cross between German show and German working lines. With training she could achieve a Sch title and she has been tested on sheep and will excel in that venue also. Right now she is a bit on the "friendly side" but I think it’s a maturity thing.


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## laughaha (Apr 13, 2011)

Yes, we did breed Christy 4 times (I think). Once in Hawaii, and three times in PA. 

I've thought about getting another color, but I grew up with White GSD's and I really love them and would prefer to find a white working temperament GSD. While I know that I'll never get Fugi back, I do want her drive, energy level and temperament in my next GSD. She was only limited by my inexperience and age (I was 15 when she was born). She knew over well over 50 commands- verbal, hand signal and some in whistles; could track, do agility (homemade), ran 5 miles almost daily, had incredible ball drive, actually had a herding instinct and would help get the neighbors cows back in the fence when they got out. Now that I'm older and can afford trainers (and the gas to drive a few hours to get to a really good one) I want to do everything I could never afford to do with her. Oh and she was drop dead gorgeous. I know she would never have been show worthy, but she was definitely a working dog. I'll have to try to figure out a way to get some of her pics on my laptop.


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## laughaha (Apr 13, 2011)

Had'nt thought about looking up European working lines of wgsd's. That would make sense due to Christy's parents were working protection dogs. I don't know if they were schutzhund trained or personal protection trained but they were working dogs owned by a couple on Oahu. 

Will definitely start searching European lines. Any known lines in US?


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

It will be nearly impossible to find WGSD amongst the European lines. They're pretty much non existant due to generations of culling because the color isn't just a DQ it can't be registered. Therefore the genetics for white masking just don't exist in the modern Euro show lines or working lines. Not those still considered GSDs and registered as such anyway. As someone mentioned, white fanciers in Europe split WGSDs into a new breed, the Berger Blanc Suisse/White Swiss Shepherd. Many of the BBS do maintain working traits.

I'm not aware of any BBS breeders in the US, mainly because over here they aren't different breeds. WGSDs are still GSDs, even though still a DQ under the AKC standard and thus prohibited from conformation showing, they can be registered so no need to call it a different breed. And of course they can be shown in performance. And in conformation under other registries like UKC. But these WGSDs are based on American lines, which as a whole are more often than not lacking in working temperament, like the ones you've experienced. 

You might be able to find one, but it would be a needle in a haystack. If you really want a WGSD with working temperament on par with working lines, it might require importing a BBS from Europe. But then there is the problem that since it would be registered as a BBS under the FCI, and AKC doesn't acknowledge any such thing, you couldn't register an imported BBS here and that would somewhat limit what events you could participate in with the dog.


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## Andaka (Jun 29, 2003)

Wasn't there a thread here about working whites? Maybe a search of the forum could start your journey.


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## Whiteshepherds (Aug 21, 2010)

You might want to check SCH clubs in your area before you start looking for a pup to see if they'll take a white shepherd, some won't. 

The link below has a listing of White Shepherd clubs around the world, you may find something here. (Clubs outside of the US are further down the page) You'll probably also need to use the translator unless you can read German, Spanish etc. 

http://www.awsaclub.com/links.htm

I don't know much about her (Christy) line but I don't see any titles in her pedigree. There are some black and tans, black and black and red on her dams side, other than that it's white as far as the eye can see.  Oh, there' is one CH, black and tan, back in the 70's. 
If the breeders were doing Schutzhund or Personal Protection work with their dogs I'm guessing they weren't interested in clubs or titles. (it's possible) On the other hand, the dog you had may have been a diamond in the rough rather than a continuation of SCH quality dogs. Have you tried to contact her breeders in Hawaii to see if they're still breeding?

Mind if I ask why you never kept track of Christy's progeny?


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## laughaha (Apr 13, 2011)

Hello all- thanks for all the responses and suggestions!!! I never kept track of the progeny cuz I was 9yrs old when Christy was born and as a teenager my mom was the one doing the breeding- I took care of the dogs, trained them, etc. No clue why she didn't keep track. We didn't show or do anything like that as we couldn't afford real trainers, etc. I have enough money to do it right (great trainers/traveling/competitions) now and I am very interested in this. As I grew up with wgsd's, that's what I'm in love with and would like to find another special, driven dog to share it with. 

Will definitely search the forums for the working wgsd thread, thanks for that suggestion. 

White Shepards- I'm glad that you were able to check out her pedigree. Thank you very much for taking the time to do that. I'll talk to mom and see if it's possible to track down Christy's breeders. 

Fugi's brilliance may have been a fluke, Christy wasn't as driven as Fugi was.


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