# Young DDR Female



## ShepLady11 (Jun 25, 2011)

Hello folks,

Mid summer, early fall I will be looking to purchase a young female to add to my group. I'm posting here as just 1 avenue to acheive my goal. I know that some breeders keep a pup from a litter to test is workability, in an effort to assure they're producing working lines and then, find it a home.

What I'm looking for:

6-16 months old, who's hips are already checked;
4 generations of stability;
Black (preferred) or VERY dark sable (that carries the black gene);
Strictly working DDR lines;
No extensive training necessary;
References;


I know some 'kennels' have several lines of dogs (ie slovak, hungarian, czech), I am not looking for a mix, I'm looking for DDR.

I am a discrete breeder in NW PA with exceptional animals (in my opinion) (Tom vom Haus Pixner daughter and Walko vom Grafental son and a Sven vom Grafental granddaughter) and soon I will be able to start working my own. These are the lines I work with right now. They're not too hard for the buyers at present, although, Tom's daughter is quite the tough bitch and several of her pups are carefully placed. She was a handful! The combination of her and my male, make such wonderful pups.

This is a work in progress, so critical emails will be ignored. I'd prefer it be another discrete breeder such as myself who has put the painstaking time, money and heart into the breed and it's standard. I've been at this 9 years and have seen/heard just about everything. I've done my homework and I know what I'm looking for.

I produce 1 quality litter per year and want to simply find another female, withouth going through the drama of raising it, only to find I cannot breed due to hips not passing. I paid 3k to get a female pup directly from Germany and then couldn't even breed her.

I can be contacted at [email protected] with anything that might be available at that time.

Thank you,
Sharon

PS - Granit (Dad left), 2 pups from a July '11 litter (center rear), Mari (Mom right) and in the forefront, Grisha (Wyatt Von Hena-C daughter), pic taken on Thanksgiving during the Packers game 

I'm getting there!


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## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

What exactly is a "discrete"breeder? I feel like I'm on an elicit dating site!


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

sorry - most responsible breeders in the will not sell you the dog you describe for the purpose of it becoming a money making breeding animal. BTW - Tom v h Pixner is NOT DDR - but then, you may be looking for the DDR female to produce mixed lines so you can get those dark sables to market for the pet market.

Make wonderful pups???? are your pups being PROVEN to be wonderful via judges and titles? Or as your post suggests, you are breeding solely for the pet market and they are wonderful pets?

Without understanding the character that comes through training a dog to the levels of IPO1-3, and having the dog evaluated by many judges and neutral parties, a breeder is merely producing puppies, marketable only on the strength of their parents or grandparents.

Discrete here in my mind is just flying under the radar.....

Lee


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

I love Tom v h Pixner, and having owned a Sven v Grafental granddaughter, I think that the haus Pixner lines compliments the Grafental lines. I have a Sid vh Pixner puppy laying at my feet. He would definitely compliment my DDR female(who happens to be a Reiko v Hena-C daughter), if she was not retired. BTW, she has produced 4 police service dogs, I don't know if that's pet quality but the officers think they have working dogs. She has no titles. Good Luck in your quest....you seem to be thinking this thing out and trying to produce solid dogs. Hope you find your right match.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

your dogs are gorgeous !! I'm a sucker for those dark dawgs
I have a Reiko v hena c granddaughter, she's alot of fun, love the lines. 
Good luck in your endeavor


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## robk (Jun 16, 2011)

I think your dogs are all demon possessed! (kidding, just love the glowing eyes).


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

I have a Reiko daughter -she's not titled either-but she gets along with all other dogs is wonderful with children-very trustworthy dog-she's a beautiful bi-color-And she is 11 and in good health -think radar would be a great name for a dog


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## ShepLady11 (Jun 25, 2011)

Thank you for all the positive feedback! I actually have 2 Wyatt von Hena-C daughters, I just haven't had the little black girls hips evaluated yet. Granit does balance out my bi-color female (Tom's daughter). It's still growing pains for me, but some of my pups are training. Not as many as I'd like 

Thank you again and I'll keep checking back!

Now for Lee...make money? That's a joke. If you're making money at this, you're doing it for all the wrong reasons and mass producing (which is exactly why I cut my losses with those 'big kennels' and have found a connection to the Grafental/Ludwigseck dogs out of Germany), but then, I knew I'd get responses like yours. I won't take it any further with you and I hope you'll do the same. Have a nice day.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

To make money off one litter a year she would need to sell the (assuming 6 pups) for like 20,000 a piece! If this was her sole job...hahaha I'm pretty sure that money isn't the purpose here.

I think you sound like a reputable breeder from your original post.

Are your puppies sold to pet homes, working homes, or a mix of both?


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

ShepLady, it's a pity you are so rude to Lee who is one of only few in this thread who could actually help you. I don't think she will bother now and I don't blame her. Enjoy your positive feedback


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

ShepLady11 said:


> (which is exactly why I cut my losses with those 'big kennels' and have found a connection to the Grafental/Ludwigseck dogs out of Germany),


Honest question here: I always thought Grafental/Ludwigseck _was_ a big kennel. If they're not. . . who is?


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Emoore said:


> Honest question here: I always thought Grafental/Ludwigseck _was_ a big kennel. If they're not. . . who is?


Yeah... I kind of thought so too.

Although their website doesn't seem to indicate that they are that large... Meine Homepage - Home


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

I was just going by the number of dogs with that kennel name.


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Well, I've always wondered if the reason for the dual naming (Ludwigseck/Grafental) was so they could register more than permitted number of litters a year.... But that is just speculation. They've certainly been breeding for a long, long time and have produced some very famous dogs over the years.


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

Aren't they father/daughter?


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

gagsd said:


> Aren't they father/daughter?


I believe so. Ludwigseck is the daughter and lives in the States, Grafental is the father who lives in Germany.


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Emoore said:


> I believe so. Ludwigseck is the daughter and lives in the States, Grafental is the father who lives in Germany.


She lived in Germany last year--did she move?


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

BlackthornGSD said:


> She lived in Germany last year--did she move?


I don't know. I'm merely repeating what someone told me on PDB, and you know how reliable that is. :blush::blush: I should have qualified that sentence more, something like "I heard from an unreliable source that. . ."


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

GSD07 said:


> ShepLady, it's a pity you are so rude to Lee who is one of only few in this thread who could actually help you. I don't think she will bother now and I don't blame her. Enjoy your positive feedback


 
Funny it didn't sound to me as if Lee was going to sell her a dog:laugh::laugh:


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## lafalce (Jan 16, 2001)

Checked out the web-site. Beautiful dogs!!! Now only if I could read German!!!


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## ShepLady11 (Jun 25, 2011)

Thanks, Miroxy~ They currently have gone to several working homes, but most are sold as pet, at this point. As I mentioned, it's still a work in progress. Plus, despite the rude remarks here, I work another full-time job, to support myself and the dogs. So you are right 

GSD07, it didn't sound like help at all. It was rude, judgemental and assuming. He/she knows nothing about me, my lifestyle, my finances, etc. I will not acknowledge or respond to any more posts like that or yours ;-)

For the other posts about the Kennel in Germany, as of last year Claudia was in Germany. My connection is a K9 officer in the states. But, since I have 2 females from them (K9 officer and a friend of his), I was trying to explore other options.

Thanks all!


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

I don't know, when someone is looking for a breeding prospect, and one of the requirements is that they be dark sable . . . what does that have to do with health, temperament, and working ability? Everybody loves dark sables, no doubt about it, and as the standard calls for dark pigments, the darkness of the sable is a consideration, but as a specific requirement . . . I can see how that does make you loose credibility (not saying that you don't have any, just the way the list of requirements is presented). 

You are right we don't know anything about your breeding program, the only thing that we did know for sure from your first post is that you are looking for a specific line, and a specific colour - you as a breeder, I'm sure gets turned off by buyers who just email and phone and say: I want a big mean-looking dark one. You wouldn't be falling all over yourself to sell a dog to such a person. 

It sounds like you are working at preserving the working heritage of the breed, but so many BYB's who breed for pets and have not background knowledge of experience in breeding and training often push their dog's colour and famous blood-lines as selling points, so that alone does not indicate anything about the focus and experience of the breeder.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

When I was looking for a dog I did have a color preference-obviously temperment was the most important thing to me but I had a color preference-luckily the entire litter except for one was that color. I like sables too. But I agree with shep lady. When I made one of my first post to the board Lee took time to educate me too-it was not helpful I considered it rude and judemental -not much has changed over the years. And because I guess she is passionate about the breed then its ok And I don't consider her the only person who can educate me


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

Lots of people here would love to educate you holland, so glad you appreciate the effort.  

BIG difference between a puppy buyer having a certain colour preference, and a breeder making breeding decision based on colour.


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

Actually I have people in real life to educate me On this board the theme seems to be if it is believed that the person is a byb you can be rude and judgemental to them-


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

I think initially the OP said they were looking for a DDR, young dog, black or dark sable....that did not raise any red flags with me because MOST of the DDR dogs I know are black or dark sable....kinda made a lot of sense to me if its a DDR dog you are seeking. 
I carefully read the OP post and came away with the feeling that the person has some solid dogs and is trying to continue to develop solid dogs.....why would I not help them????? They don't don't have to do it my way....as long as it appears they are earnestly trying to do good for the breed. I try not to assume anything, but read carefully what is written before I open my mouth. Many(and this is not directed at any one person) are constantly making assumptions before they have any knowledge of the depth or understanding of the OP. (Of course some people come on here with outright silly beliefs or desires), But the OP had nothing in the first post that was any different from the way I started many years ago in trying to learn and find better resources. I think I turned out alright. I hope the OP stays with us because it appears she or he is really trying to breed good dogs....and God knows we can always use those people.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Cliff, please point me to a single post where you displayed a 'I will ignore all critical opinions' attitude. I just can't imagine you being so full of yourself when you were at the beginning and looked for knowledge while getting experience. I could be wrong, though


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

@gsd07....I perceived the OP was coming on here looking for some help in acquiring a young dog of the type she needs for her goals. I saw the part about critical info would be ignored. I kinda ignored that piece. Its not like the person was being presumptous in thinking if she posted a specific question on this forum, she would get as many posts back telling her WHAT she ought to be doing as opposed to trying to help her with her request. The OP indicated 9 years in the breed, only one litter a year, and basic knowledge of what she wanted(that happened to make sense). I could easily see she wasn't some looney without a clue that needed to be chastised. 
I figure those that can help would volunteer, and those that couldn't would leave it alone. 
Look, I don't know the person from Adam's housecat, but I do see why some people would feel the need to preface their request with they are not interested in going to school ABOUT what they didn't ask about. Specially, if they have some basic knowledge and let us know up front that they do. 
Believe it or not I still feel I have a lot to learn....and cherish sitting under people with more knowledge than me, where I shut up and learn.....unfortunately today, the art of recognizing when you don't know as much as you talk seems to be lost.:laugh:
Take care GSD07....no harm no foul!


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

cliffson1 said:


> Believe it or not I still feel I have a lot to learn....and cherish sitting under people with more knowledge than me, where I shut up and learn.....unfortunately today, the art of recognizing when you don't know as much as you talk seems to be lost.:laugh:


:thumbup:

The attacks against anyone even mentioning breeding on this board have become ridiculous. Yes, there are some where I know I would love to reach through my monitor and strangle them, but there are others that truly have their hearts in the right place and want to learn. If all we do is attack everyone from our sanctimonious high horses that says they want to breed then we lose our chances at educating them. Grumble and complain all you want to those around you, but keep the attacks away from the board.

ADMIN Lisa


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

OK, this is a little off-topic but I've been wondering about it for two days now. 

Did you mean a discrete breeder, as in one that stands apart or separate from others; or a discreet breeder, as in one who is circumspect and careful? I can see how both would work is why I ask. . . 

I know the grammar police on forums are annoying, and I always try not to be "that guy" who corrects the person who comes looking for a Sheppard even though it's like nails on a chalk board, but I'm slightly OCD about language and this makes me wonder every time I open this thread. Sorry. 

By the way, from your short description I like the sounds of what you're doing. I also love these East German dogs and I hate the fact that people are starting to produce dark sables for pets without much thought to temperament or working ability. It sounds like you're trying to straddle that line of what these dogs are supposed to be-- pets that can work well, or working dogs that can make great pets.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I totally agree with Lisa,,some posters jump the gun, and "assume" ALOT, or start firing questions, firing "you should do this and not do that"..

We have alot of "experts" on the board (and I'm being rather sarcastic with that word) and alot of knowledgeable (and I'm not being sarcastic with that word people and we can always use more, knowledgeable, that is

People need to stop "assuming" , ask some questions if your interested, and if your not, well don't say anything

I for one, am interested in the OP's dogs, they are my "type" of dog and I'm always willing to learn as well.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

I ain't saying nothing ... except that my DDR dog is being trained as a guide dog. I like them and what they bring to the table.


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## MicheleMarie (Mar 29, 2011)

Emoore said:


> OK, this is a little off-topic but I've been wondering about it for two days now.
> 
> Did you mean a discrete breeder, as in one that stands apart or separate from others; or a discreet breeder, as in one who is circumspect and careful? I can see how both would work is why I ask. . .
> 
> ...



...


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