# switching 5 1/2 month old to grain free?



## Freddy (Apr 23, 2009)

My 5 1/2 month old pup Tango has been on Canidae's ALS since shortly after we got him. He is an import, and we had the explosive diarrhea at first due to not being able to find an exact match to Slovakian food. He also had worms 6 weeks ago, and was de wormed. 

Long story short, we've tried the pumpkin for 2 mos now, and the yogurt as well, and we still have varying consistency poops. Best case--mostly formed, worst case--impossible to get off the shovel without a hose. We are currently taking an enzyme and probiotic supplement that Kury's mom kindly gave us. 

My 3 yr female loves the Canidae and is eating like never before in her life. I've always struggled to keep weight on her so I'd like to keep feeding the same food but the poop thing is driving me crazy. I'm also concerned about the ALS version we're currently feeding vs the grain free ALS's protein content. Now we're at 24%, and the grain free is 34%. 

Any suggestions? Size and weight are what I would consider appropriate for a czech dog. He's about 50 pounds. I'd like them to eat the same food if possible. Can they grow out of this?


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## JenniferH (Oct 9, 2007)

I have no worthwhile suggestions but I wish you luck. I am still dealing with poop issues at my house and its not fun!

Oh, one thing my vet did mention is that (in my case at least) a higher protien percentage is not what I want for my pup. It is her thinking that he was getting too much protien hence the water stools.


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## phgsd (Jun 6, 2004)

Most of the grain-free foods don't have a good calcium/phos. ratio for a young puppy. I would avoid grain-free for the first year. Have you thought about raw?? Done correctly it might help him a lot!
Have you had him tested for EPI or SIBO by the vet? Unfortunately it's not uncommon with GSD's. I'm sure others can inform you about exactly which tests the vet would need to do - I haven't experienced either myself, so am not 100% sure.


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## Freddy (Apr 23, 2009)

Looks like I double posted, sorry but I had internet issues at the office and thought I was not successful. I haven't had him tested for EPI or SIBO yet. Is this a "drop off the poop" procedure?


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## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

The Canidae Grain Free ALS has calcium in line with a food appropriate for a pup

Calcium (min) 1.2 
Phosphorous (min) 0.9 

http://www.canidae.com/dogs/grain-free-als/dry.html


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Fred, I would have a giardia test run. Though sometimes it doesn't show up in tests. Or just see if your vet can put him on metronidazole to see if it helps. 
I had Karlo treated for roundworms after he was cleared for 4 weeks, they returned. Very common for pups The vet put him on Strongid @ one dose every two weeks(3 doses) so even if your dog was treated for worms, they can still be in their system, or if they are exposed again after worming.
I don't think a young pup will have EPI or SIBO issues.


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## Freddy (Apr 23, 2009)

We did the giardia med routine when I got him. After we got through the first couple days, this has been a consistent issue. I guess if he's getting tested for two, we can test for three. I'll ask about the metronidazole too. Does anyone know whether this is a "drop off the poop" deal? it will change my routine in the morning.

Thanks!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I think you can just drop off a fecal. Sometimes the met has to be double dosed to knock out the parasite. Your vet should be able to help, as this has obviously been going on far too long. Good luck!


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## Freddy (Apr 23, 2009)

Thanks, Jane!


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

Barb E. said:


> The Canidae Grain Free ALS has calcium in line with a food appropriate for a pup
> 
> Calcium (min) 1.2
> Phosphorous (min) 0.9
> ...


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## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

Hadn't noticed that - it's 1.8 in the regular ALS

Wonder if the 1.5 that's thrown around is as fed?


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

You mean in the "regular" ALS?

It is 1.2 MIN, 1.8 "as fed".

I think the 1.5 is "Joe Public" averaging it out. (The "min" and "as fed".)


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## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

> Originally Posted By: BlackGSDYou mean in the "regular" ALS?
> 
> It is 1.2 MIN, 1.8 "as fed".
> 
> I think the 1.5 is "Joe Public" averaging it out. (The "min" and "as fed".)


You callin' me Joe?







Just kidding.

I've decided this is all so







complicated that I'm just gonna feed my next pup Alpo


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

LOL Barb. 

I have thought the same thing numerous times. Things were so much less "complicated" in the "olden days" when we didn't know any better than to feed Atta Boy! So we did, and the dogs did just fine!


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## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

Someone needs to go back 30 years in time and grab all the old labels from the foods and bring them back so we can see what was in the food back then. 
I'd bet dimes to dollars that even the "cheap" foods were not that bad back in the day!

I fed my poor cats what ever was on sale in the grocery store







and though they both lived to be 18 I'm betting I would have had both well into their 20's if I had known better.


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## Freddy (Apr 23, 2009)

Update from the vet, all tests are negative but she wants to consult with another because she agrees it should be solid. She said she'd get back to me next week.


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## Freddy (Apr 23, 2009)

I returned home from a business trip last thursday to find a lethargic boy that didn't want to do anything. I took him in friday and he had a 103.7 fever. He got a couple of shots and a course of amoxicillin, and within 24 hours back to normal. While he was there I had them run a sensitivity profile along with a complete blood panel. Everything came back normal. I've not been able to talk to the vet yet about what to do next.


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