# Reality check on vaccinations



## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Beau started out with the regular puppy shots and had his last DHPP at 18 weeks, and his rabies at 16 weeks. The vet at the time did not administer separate combos and the best I could do was keep the rabies separated in time from the DHPP.

Now we are at holistic vet. At 1 year from puppy shots he got his rabies, then his distemper (single vaccine) three weeks later followed by a parvo (single vaccine) three weeks later. No additional adenovirus. Does that sound right.

The Dodds site does not mention CAV-2 in the protocol but I know it is considered core by AAHA due to the immunity it confers for hepatitis.

My gameplan was to do titers in three years from now.
For lepto she is looking into preventive nosodes for me.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

The vet that did Jax's titers does not bother with adenovirus. He only does distemper and parvo. I think he told me that the adenovirus was no more than a common cold but he talks so fast it's hard to keep up sometimes.


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## Momto2GSDs (Mar 22, 2012)

jocoyn said:


> Beau started out with the regular puppy shots and had his last DHPP at 18 weeks, and his rabies at 16 weeks. The vet at the time did not administer separate combos and the best I could do was keep the rabies separated in time from the DHPP.
> 
> Now we are at holistic vet. At 1 year from puppy shots he got his rabies, then his distemper (single vaccine) three weeks later followed by a parvo (single vaccine) three weeks later. No additional adenovirus. Does that sound right.
> 
> ...


Hi Jocoyn
There is a lepto nosode that can be purchased from Roger at naturalrearing.com....much better way to go if he really needs it for your location!

My dogs have only had 1 parvo, and 1 distemper in their life of 5 & 4 years old and will probably never have another unless the titer shows different, per my holistic vet. 

AAHA is very different from AHVMA 
Regards, Moms


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Did you do the one year or three years shots? There is a very small difference between the two and the vet recommended the three year to me.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

I have not heard of three year shotsfor anything but rabies. I was doing every three years with tyicla vets since I got Cyra in 2003. The immunity is actually known to be 5-7 years for all of them though, and probably lifetime.

The only reason I ask about CAV-2 (adenovirus) is because it immunizes against a dog version of hepatitis (CAV-1) without the risk of eye damage. But he did have that as a puppy. I believe Dr Dodds feels it is uncommon. 

We are in a lepto area - well, that is sort of - are we? since it is not a CDCreportable and the info that some lepto shots can cause it and nobody actually tests for it etc..

Being a cadaver dog, he is exposed to the kind of environment that harbors lepto. Do realize the organizations are different for sure. This has been a hard call but I know that one of the servovars, bratislava, that has come in with Czech dogs is not even in the shot.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

When I spoke to my vet about the "3 year" vs "1 year", he agreed with me that the only difference is that the company that has the "3 year" has done the testing. There really is no such thing as a 3 year. The shots are all good for at least 5-7 years, most likely life of the dog.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

When you say "1 year vs 3 year" - what TYPE of shots are you talking about?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Who are you talking to, Lauri? If it's me, I'm referring to the distemper and parvo.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

What's a "lepto nosode"? I'm in a heavy lepto area, unfortunately, so the vet strongly recommends the vac. I'm curious what the alternative is.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Jax08 said:


> Who are you talking to, Lauri? If it's me, I'm referring to the distemper and parvo.


I've never heard of any shots other than rabies being 3 yr vs 1 yr. Do you know the manufacturer?


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## Seer (May 24, 2011)

Intervet Inc, 29160 Intervet Lane, PO Box 318, Millsboro, DE 19966, USA.

A challenge-of-immunity study was conducted to demonstrate immunity in dogs 3 years after their second vaccination with a new multivalent, modified-live vaccine containing canine adenovirus type 2 (CAV-2), canine parvovirus (CPV), and canine distemper virus (CDV). Twenty-three seronegative pups were vaccinated at 7 and 11 weeks of age. Eighteen seronegative pups, randomized into groups of six dogs, served as challenge controls. Dogs were kept in strict isolation for 3 years following the vaccination and then challenged sequentially with virulent canine adenovirus type 1 (CAV-1), CPV, and CDV. For each viral challenge, a separate group of six control dogs was also challenged. Clinical signs of CAV-1, CPV, and CDV infections were prevented in 100% of vaccinated dogs, demonstrating that the multivalent, modified-live test vaccine provided protection against virulent CAV-1, CPV, and CDV challenge in dogs 7 weeks of age or older for a minimum of 3 years following second vaccination.
By failing to make a statement of the known science, by failing to require longer DOI data from manufacturers, and by failing to remove one-year vaccines from the market, the VMD is facilitating the unethical practice of annual vaccination. 

The WSAVA guidelines recommend: “We should aim to vaccinate every animal, and to vaccinate each individual less frequently.” These international guidelines also recommend that, “we should aim to reduce the ‘vaccine load’ on individual animals in order to minimise the potential for adverse reactions to vaccine products”.


More Documentation Of Over-Vaccination Risks


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

I think several years ago a company made, and supported a three year claim on a distemper vaccine but it was the same vaccine as ever; it just proved it with a study and was able to put it on the label. [oh we cross posted on that; thanks for more info]

The nosodes are basically a homeopathic preparation of the infectious agent; therefore no actual material but its "energy" based on homeopathic constructs. Well, I just don't know. I am an educated person and realize that things we poo-poo'd not so many years ago have a basis in science so my construct of homeopathy is "it cannot hurt if it is "nothing" so be open minded about it. ..... I have seen a few cases where it has appeared to help. 

I had already, after much struggle, came to the conclusion that we really do not know how extensive lepto is because the diagnosis is typically one of assumption and just as often as not, immunized dogs come ill. The Pfizer study has no claim of preventing the disease from I can see, just driving it to a sublinical chronic state. None of them have bratislava which is coming in from Europe (I don't have the article from a police magazine discussing this, though)

Please direct me to studies showing it is truly effective......I figure that, perhaps, the best approach is to be keenly aware of the dog's health status and do what is possible to maintain a strong immune systems


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Just opened the new issue of Whole Dog Journal.

Re-emergence of CAV-1 (Hepatitis)

An Old Infectious Disease Is New Again - Whole Dog Journal Article


Beau's annuals did not include CAV-2 though he had it in his puppy shots. Also had to have kennel cough intranasal at about 6 months for a puppy class. I am going to ask the vet to titer for CAV-1 immunity. Dodds is reconsidering and Schultz is for.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Lauri & The Gang said:


> When you say "1 year vs 3 year" - what TYPE of shots are you talking about?


If it was me...I was referring to distemper and rabies. I do the 3 year for both. When they hit 7 or so I stop the distemper, so they would have a total of 2 distempers in their adult lifetime. Rabies have to be done, its the law.


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