# What would you do if someone kicked your dog?



## Panda

I'm not sure if this is the right section to post this but just needed to vent about what happened this evening. (Sorry about the long post!)

My husband and I walked our GSD to the local dog park which we do most days so he can play and socialise with other dogs. It's usually a great park and most of the people who go there are regulars so we know most people and their dogs.

Anyway we were sitting on one of the benches talking to another couple while our GSD was hovering around us (which he has been doing a lot lately not sure why) and three women arrived at the dog park who I don't think we have seen before. They had two GSD's and a Border Collie with them. They went to the opposite side of the dog park to us but their GSD's came over to our boy and they started playing. 

We let them play as they were playing nicely and as our boy has been quite shy and nervous lately we were glad he seemed relaxed and having fun.

The dogs ended up over the other side of the dog park where the three women were and we noticed after a while that one of the women was holding our dog by the collar. My husband called out our dogs name and she let him go and he came running to us. We didn't say anything to her because we thought maybe she thought it was her dog as she had 2 GSD's as well. 

About 10 mins later our boy had made his way back over and was playing with one of their GSD's. They were chasing each other around and as our dog went passed this lady she kicked him in the ribs and said "GET LOST". 

I thought I must have been seeing things because it was quite far away but the couple we were with said "omg she just kicked your dog".
before I could say anything my husband was halfway across the park screaming at this woman. They all gathered around him screaming back justifying it saying that our dog was "harassing" her dog. It all got very heated and my husband was swearing at them and screaming. They got really nasty as well.

I am so shocked and have not been able to stop thinking about it since it happened. I was a bit upset at my husband initially for letting things get so heated but now that I think about it they deserved it. What kind of person would kick someone elses dog? I'm even more upset because I think our dog might be going through a fear stage at the moment because he just hasnt been himself and i'm worried this might have traumatised him.

I just wish I had had my mobile on me as I would have called the police and made sure these women were fined and banned from the park. 

Do you think my husband over reacted? 

Again i'm sorry about the long post just really needed other views on the situation. I also really hate confrontations so all the screaming and swearing have kind of shaken me up.


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## Emoore

Honestly? There'd be a fight. Unless my dog was actually attacking their dog, child, or another person, if somebody kicked my dog things would get real ugly real fast.


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## Lin

No, I don't think your husband over reacted! If someone kicked my dog, they'd be getting a kick right back themselves as well as an earful!

If your dog was truly harassing their dog, the appropriate way to deal with the situation would be to ask you to keep your dog away, and body block if necessary as opposed to kicking the dog. The only time a kick would be justified, would be in an aggression situation with a dog fight.


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## MaggieRoseLee

> I thought I must have been seeing things because it was quite far away but the couple we were with said "omg she just kicked your dog".
> before I could say anything my husband was halfway across the park screaming at this woman. They all gathered around him screaming back justifying it saying that our dog was "harassing" her dog. It all got very heated and my husband was swearing at them and screaming. They got really nasty as well.


I'd have definitely gone over and asked what was going on and not to kick my dog.... But the screaming and other stuff would just maybe make me feel better and vent, while not really help the situation. 

There are idiots in the world, and I am not going to change them. They show up everywhere, even in dog parks. If there is some kind of dog park police I'd contact them so a record could start up for that couple and their dogs. Otherwise, I'd just make sure my dog didn't play with theirs or go over on that side, or just leave if they showed up.

Not worth getting my dog hurt. Not worth ME getting in trouble for sounding like the crazy person in the interaction and getting banned from the dogpark myself.

You do have to react to the situation. But how you react is something you can plan for better the next time cause you'll have a plan.


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## pyratemom

This is one reason why I do not take my dogs to the dog park. Too many other people that don't always think clearly. I would totally go crazy if someone kicked one of my dogs for just being there. I may even go off and kick them (probably the wrong thing to do but don't hurt my dog). There would most certainly be a confrontation - not sure if I could hold my temper and not yell at them. As far as the poster that said if there was a dog fight the kick might be necessary - that is a good way to get bit.


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## LaRen616

If I saw someone kick my dog, I would have gone over there and kicked them or worse.


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## Panda

I agree MaggieRoseLee. If my husband had not been there I would have approached them and asked them to explain themselves. I'm not the type to get loud and crazy thats why when we left the dog park I was a bit angry at my hsband for the way he handled it but I also understand how angry he was because he actually saw how hard she kicked him.

Also we had been watching him the whole time and at no time was he harassing their dog. 

My husband actually said "why didn't you come up to us and tell us if you didn't want our dog playing with your dog?" and she said "I don't have to walk all the way over to you". Ugh I just hope they don't come back again.


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## xenos56

Someone literally kicked your dog? I'm not sure what I would have done, but judging from my anger right now I think I would have charged at her. That's just so sad! I think the worst we've had is a woman picking up her little dog and saying, "Ignore that dog, he is a mean, bad, bad dog." Never seen her in my life! Meanwhile, my dog was just sitting there. He looked over at her and sighed. We walked home and he had his head down the entire time. People are just ignorant and mean sometimes - but to KICK a dog?!


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## DCluver33

there have been several occasions whee i've been walking my friends dog aggressive lab and had loose dogs come up to me. the only way to get them away from Indy was to "kick" them. I really just put my foot out and tapped them, not an actual kick I would only kick a dog if I absolutely had to and there was no other choice after I exhausted all other options. I figured they'd recover faster from my foot them being attack and hurt or worse by another dog.

now if anyone kicked my dog I'd march over there and try to be calm and ask them why they kicked my dog. if he was harassing them or got I to a fight then I'd understand, but if I thought for a minute that he'd fleet I to a fight I'd leave or not go there with him. but knowing me if you kick my dog for no reason you darn right I'll kick you back and give them an earful.


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## Whiteshepherds

You mentioned that your dog has gotten quite shy and nervous lately. You also mentioned that he might be going through a fear stage and hasn't been himself lately. Based on just that, I think you and your husband are partly to blame for this happening. 

The woman never should have kicked him, but you and your husband had a responsibility to not put him in a situation where that could happen. 

A shy, nervous or fearful dog needs close supervision and management. If you were too far away to see exactly what happened, or couldn't hear what was being said, you were too far away from your dog. Unfortunately your dog, at least for now, is the kind of dog that shouldn't be running around a dog park.


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## Panda

Thanks Whiteshepherds but we could see him at all times clearly. I wouldn't call him fearful. He has been slightly less outgoing which I meant when I said he was hovering around us and shy so I don't agree that he isn't the type of dog that should be running around a dog park. 

We also have him under control and he would have come to us if we called him but as we were watching him and they were playing nicely we saw no reason to.

EDIT** I just re read my post and saw that I did use the word nervous. That was probably the wrong word to use as he has a very stable temperment and is alwys confident and friendly to other dogs (I have never heard him growl or show any signs of agression in his life). What I was trying to say is that he has been staying around us in the dog park rather than spending the whole time playing but not hiding or shying away when other dogs approach or anything like that. Which could just be him wanting to spend time with his owners. I was only guessing that it could be a fear stage.


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## Mrs.K

Whiteshepherds said:


> You mentioned that your dog has gotten quite shy and nervous lately. You also mentioned that he might be going through a fear stage and hasn't been himself lately. Based on just that, I think you and your husband are partly to blame for this happening.
> 
> The woman never should have kicked him, but you and your husband had a responsibility to not put him in a situation where that could happen.
> 
> A shy, nervous or fearful dog needs close supervision and management. If you were too far away to see exactly what happened, or couldn't hear what was being said, you were too far away from your dog. Unfortunately your dog, at least for now, is the kind of dog that shouldn't be running around a dog park.


Urm, she said that at this point he was absolutely relaxed and actually played with the others and that is when he got kicked.


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## Whitedog404

I think it's easy to understand your husband's reaction under the circumstances. I couldn't imagine kicking a dog, but if I did, I certainly wouldn't be surprised if the dog bit me or if the owner screamed. Having said that, I'm not a big fan of dog parks either. The problem usually lies with the people.


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## Whiteshepherds

Mrs.K said:


> Urm, she said that at this point he was absolutely relaxed and actually played with the others and that is when he got kicked.


There had to be a reason the woman grabbed the dog by it's collar before this. Whether the dog was doing something wrong, or if the other woman was an idiot doesn't matter. The game was already in play.

Very few people will grab a strangers dog by the collar. At that point I would have kept my dog away from her and her dogs. I would have at least walked over and asked it there was a problem. If my dog went back to play with the other womans dogs I would have gone with him to supervise.

*The kick was unwarranted and wrong* but it probably could have been avoided. The other woman obviously thought the OP's dog was a nuisance or she was afraid of him, we don't know. Dogs usually growl before they bite. People who kick dogs usually give their own warning signs...maybe grabbing the collar was that warning sign.


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## rgollar

All I can say is I would have lost it. And I can guarantee me or my wife would have kicked some one back. I know its not the mature way to handle the situation but my dogs are everything to us. Them people dont know how lucky they are that you guys just yelled at them, Because I believe most would have done far worse to them. Sorry to hear about your dog.


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## DharmasMom

Oh man. I don't even want to think about how ugly it would get because it takes quite a bit for me to lose my temper but when I do- stand back. And that would pretty much send my temper well into the red zone. 

GSDs like to play rough. Dharma has a couple of doggy friends at our dog park that she regularly wrestles, chases, and growls with. Her bff Maggie likes to chase her around the park and grab at her tail, Maggie will get mouthfuls of Dharma fur in her mouth while they run. To people who aren't use to that kind of play, the other owner and I will always get the question "are they hurting each other, are they fighting" and we always tell them "nope, they are having a blast, they love each other to death". Maybe she just misinterpreted some rough play for your dog being a pain. Still doesn't excuse her for kicking your dog. She just should have asked you to keep your dog away from hers. But her comment about not wanting to walk across the park shows she is not just mean and stupid, she is lazy as well.


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## Sigurd's Mom

I don't think your husband overreacted, at all. 

Last summer we were visiting a family cottage where Sigurd is always welcome. It's on the lake. My SO's father has an inflatable boat (we have the same one and Sigurd's actually gone on it with no popping issues). His father is always so protective and always says, for no reason, "Sigurd will pop my boat by attacking it" "His nails will destroy it" "He will bite it for no reason and destroy my boat." Well obviously when he says that I think to myself "Yeah whatever", so I always made sure Sigurd wasn't near his dang boat. Well one afternoon Sigurd was swimming in the lake with my SOs little sisters, his Dad comes to shore and Sigurd was happy, wagging his tail and wanted to greet him... but oh no! He went near the boat. Didn't even touch it. You know what he did? He took his ore and smacked him so hard I could have killed him. Of course with little kids around I didn't want to get too mouthy, so I said to him, "Don't you ever, EVER touch my dog again. He will NOT damage your **** boat. You are a cruel cruel man!" and I haven't really talked to him since, just polite when at their house. A couple hours later after that he said "Well Sigurd was goinh to destroy my boat, I had no other choice"... UGH. I was soooo mad and still am writing this. Poor Sigurd was SO happy, and then he got hit so hard, and then was totally confused... you could totally see it.


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## Panda

Looking back I probably should have gone to see why she was holding him by the collar but I was watching and she didn't grab him, she was loosely holding his collar while having a conversation and laughing with the two others she was with. When we called him over she let go and looked back at her GS and kind of laughed which is why we thought maybe she wasnt paying attention and thought she was holding her GS (they were VERY similar in colour and size) but now that I think about it it would be hard to mistake your dog for someone elses. 

I guess I thought I was pretty good at reading people's body language and she didnt seem like she was bothered by him until she kicked him. We were also close enough that if she had spoken loudly we could hear her easily so she could have told us if he was bothering her.


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## aprofetto

I don't think its fair to point fingers as to who's fault it was that the dog got kicked.

The bottom line here is that her dog was indeed kicked by a few strangers. Like others have mentioned, if the dog was attacking another dog, child or adult, then yes, maybe a kick would've been warranted. However, by the sounds of it, the kick was not warranted at all.

Everything is easier to analyze in hindsight, "you shouldn't have been there", "you shouldn't have done that" (NOTE: I'm not quoting anyone, these are just generic comments to prove my point).

At the end of the day, the kick happened and maybe your husband did or didn't overreact. It's alot easier said then done to say you should handle things alot more calmly, but when someone see's their own dog get kicked by a stranger for no reason, I'm sure we would all react a bit differently than how we would imagine.

I feel bad your dog was kicked, and I in no way blame you guys for your dog being in that position. If your husband did overreact, I'm sure he was not wrong for doing so. It's sad there is people out there that would actually do such a thing and kick someone else's dog.


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## Panda

Sigurd's Mom said:


> I don't think your husband overreacted, at all.
> 
> Last summer we were visiting a family cottage where Sigurd is always welcome. It's on the lake. My SO's father has an inflatable boat (we have the same one and Sigurd's actually gone on it with no popping issues). His father is always so protective and always says, for no reason, "Sigurd will pop my boat by attacking it" "His nails will destroy it" "He will bite it for no reason and destroy my boat." Well obviously when he says that I think to myself "Yeah whatever", so I always made sure Sigurd wasn't near his dang boat. Well one afternoon Sigurd was swimming in the lake with my SOs little sisters, his Dad comes to shore and Sigurd was happy, wagging his tail and wanted to greet him... but oh no! He went near the boat. Didn't even touch it. You know what he did? He took his ore and smacked him so hard I could have killed him. Of course with little kids around I didn't want to get too mouthy, so I said to him, "Don't you ever, EVER touch my dog again. He will NOT damage your **** boat. You are a cruel cruel man!" and I haven't really talked to him since, just polite when at their house. A couple hours later after that he said "Well Sigurd was goinh to destroy my boat, I had no other choice"... UGH. I was soooo mad and still am writing this. Poor Sigurd was SO happy, and then he got hit so hard, and then was totally confused... you could totally see it.


Oh my gosh your poor dog!  It's so sad when innocent dogs are hurt by ignorant people like this.


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## Lin

Sigurd's Mom said:


> A couple hours later after that he said "Well Sigurd was goinh to destroy my boat, I had no other choice"... UGH. I was soooo mad and still am writing this. Poor Sigurd was SO happy, and then he got hit so hard, and then was totally confused... you could totally see it.


I would have used a string (few strings actually..) of words that I cannot repeat on this site. But the gist of it would be that your boat is replaceable, my dog is not. If my dog damages your boat I will buy another one but if you touch my dog again you're going to need life insurance.


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## DharmasMom

Sigurd's Mom said:


> I don't think your husband overreacted, at all.
> 
> Last summer we were visiting a family cottage where Sigurd is always welcome. It's on the lake. My SO's father has an inflatable boat (we have the same one and Sigurd's actually gone on it with no popping issues). His father is always so protective and always says, for no reason, "Sigurd will pop my boat by attacking it" "His nails will destroy it" "He will bite it for no reason and destroy my boat." Well obviously when he says that I think to myself "Yeah whatever", so I always made sure Sigurd wasn't near his dang boat. Well one afternoon Sigurd was swimming in the lake with my SOs little sisters, his Dad comes to shore and Sigurd was happy, wagging his tail and wanted to greet him... but oh no! He went near the boat. Didn't even touch it. You know what he did? He took his ore and smacked him so hard I could have killed him. Of course with little kids around I didn't want to get too mouthy, so I said to him, "Don't you ever, EVER touch my dog again. He will NOT damage your **** boat. You are a cruel cruel man!" and I haven't really talked to him since, just polite when at their house. A couple hours later after that he said "Well Sigurd was goinh to destroy my boat, I had no other choice"... UGH. I was soooo mad and still am writing this. Poor Sigurd was SO happy, and then he got hit so hard, and then was totally confused... you could totally see it.



You are a better woman than I am because I wouldn't have cared that there were 2 kids there, I would have called him every name I could come up with (and when I want to I can make a sailor blush) and told him if he ever touched my dog again he would be needing a trip to the ER to have an oar removed from his rectum!


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## Sunstreaked

Sigurd's Mom said:


> I don't think your husband overreacted, at all.
> 
> Last summer we were visiting a family cottage where Sigurd is always welcome. It's on the lake. My SO's father has an inflatable boat (we have the same one and Sigurd's actually gone on it with no popping issues). His father is always so protective and always says, for no reason, "Sigurd will pop my boat by attacking it" "His nails will destroy it" "He will bite it for no reason and destroy my boat." Well obviously when he says that I think to myself "Yeah whatever", so I always made sure Sigurd wasn't near his dang boat. Well one afternoon Sigurd was swimming in the lake with my SOs little sisters, his Dad comes to shore and Sigurd was happy, wagging his tail and wanted to greet him... but oh no! He went near the boat. Didn't even touch it. You know what he did? He took his ore and smacked him so hard I could have killed him. Of course with little kids around I didn't want to get too mouthy, so I said to him, "Don't you ever, EVER touch my dog again. He will NOT damage your **** boat. You are a cruel cruel man!" and I haven't really talked to him since, just polite when at their house. A couple hours later after that he said "Well Sigurd was goinh to destroy my boat, I had no other choice"... UGH. I was soooo mad and still am writing this. Poor Sigurd was SO happy, and then he got hit so hard, and then was totally confused... you could totally see it.



O.M.G.

My blood is boiling right now just reading about this. I never cease to be surprised at what people will do. 

Gotta ask, what about the popsicle stick?!?!?!?


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## kiya

Even though I know it's best to handle situations calmly, I would have flipped out. I don't go to dog parks. Whenever I bring Lakota for a playdate at a friends house, I stay outside to watch them. It only takes a second for something to happen. My friend will always say come on inside let them play, no, sorry I can't I have to watch. If I go inside I stand at the window watching this way I know what happens. 
Unfortunately you don't know what happened and who knows what they will say happened. I would probably make some sort of complaint about it with the owners of the park. If there was an issue they should have called over to you to call your dog.


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## Sigurd's Mom

Lin said:


> I would have used a string (few strings actually..) of words that I cannot repeat on this site. But the gist of it would be that your boat is replaceable, my dog is not. If my dog damages your boat I will buy another one but if you touch my dog again you're going to need life insurance.


Oh I so wanted to...he said that right in front of everyone at the dinner table. I left the table and called my Mom, I told her the story and spitted off a million strings of bad words about him... how I wanted to beat him with an ore. I wish I would have told him just that, his boat is replaceable, Sigurds not. I was thinking of saying that to him, I just didn't want to start a large fight since we were there for another week.


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## ba1614

I honestly don't know how I would react Panda, but I'm sure some kind of confrontation would take place. I can certainly relate to your husbands response.
Without my dog making an aggressive move, I can't wrap my head around someone booting one of them, without at least hollering at me first.

Yes, you probably should have looked closer after she had him by the collar, but a boot is over way the top if it was only a matter of her not wanting them to play. A very rude, arrogant, and self centered biatch, but that's jmo.


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## psdontario

This is one of the many reasons that I do not take dogs to the dog park and instruct my training clients to avoid it as well.
You really do not know what went on over there, which is a lack of management on your part, however, this is a public area where dogs are knowingly running free and interactions, both good and bad, need to be expected. The individual in question could have called out to you to collect your dog, however, they opted to boldly take it upon themselves. I have had a similar incident on my own property where clients using the agility fields had their dogs off lead outside of the fenced area and they approached one of my service dogs. The dogs (Jack Russels) took turns attacking him while he was in a down position until I punted one, at which time they retreated. Owner (who is a good friend of mine) was not happy, however, I spared my dog the experience of a full on attack and a potential issue with dogs in future by stepping in. 
On the other hand, I have had one of my own dogs kicked by a relative who did not like my dog dropping a ball at his feet and pestering him with it (she was wet and getting him wet). Had I been watching closely I could have avoided this. Unfortunately it lead to a huge family conflict that is still unresolved (yes, I responded negatively as I felt his response was a bit over the top).
Perhaps the owner that kicked your dog saw something escalating or perhaps they were just over reacting. One can never tell, but I can tell you this... I hope they never close the dog parks in my area because they make me so much money in the form of behavioral problems!


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## Panda

Thanks everyone for the comments.  I might look for somewhere else to take him from now on but the dog park is the only place I know of where he can run around off leash. 

I could walk him around the neighbourhood but there are no footpaths so we have to walk on the road and there are so many stupid drivers around our area who speed and drive on the wrong side of the road. I just feel like i'm putting him and myself in danger when I do that. 

Thanks again for everyones comments. I should get to bed as its 3am here and I think I have finally calmed down enough to sleep.
xx


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## CHawkins

Cap 'em!


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## Mrs.K

I kick loose dogs away whenever I have all of mine on the leash and they approach us and I can the disaster already see happening. But that is more for their safety than ours...however I wouldn't even dare to touch a strange dog for no reason if the owner was close by. 

There is always another way to handle situations. 

And to hit a dog over a stupid boat? Really? That's what insurance is there for. I could have probably not restrained myself either.


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## Panda

I just have one more thing to add before I go lol sorry. They weren't wrestling or even making contact with each other. THey were running together, taking turns chasing each other. So it wasn't rough play. 

I know my dog and he has NEVER shown any aggression. He doesn't even growl if another dog steals his food or toys. He doesn't growl or react if another dog growls o snaps at him. I have never even heard him growl. So I know he wasn't being aggressive.

Maybe she interpreted it as aggression (although I don't see how) and if you consider two dogs running together in a dog park a nuisance then I think she's the one who shouldn't be ina dog park.


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## Panda

Mrs.K said:


> I kick loose dogs away whenever I have all of mine on the leash and they approach us and I can the disaster already see happening. But that is more for their safety than ours...however I wouldn't even dare to touch a strange dog for no reason if the owner was close by.
> 
> There is always another way to handle situations.
> 
> And to hit a dog over a stupid boat? Really? That's what insurance is there for. I could have probably not restrained myself either.


Yeah I can understand someone using there foot to push anothr dog away to keep their dog or another dog safe but this lady actually balanced on one leg and did a hard side kick to mydogs ribs. Like a karate kick almost.


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## DharmasMom

If all they were doing was chasing each other then she is an even bigger moron then I originally thought. Dogs do that. They chase each other. Usually they love nothing more at the dog park than a good game of tag. I have said countless times- there needs to be a sign at our dog park "If you don't understand dog behavior, then STAY OUT!" 

If you are able to contact the people who are run the park and are in charge I would report her and the incident. I don't know if you got her name or not but hopefully you did or hopefully someone else there knows her. She shouldn't be allowed back in.


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## KZoppa

i dont have time right now to read everyone's response's so here is mine. Someone kicks my dog, they can expect a hellion in their face and possibly some serious bruising. NOBODY messes with ANY member of my family. I agree with someone who said that the ONLY reason a kick could be justified is if the dogs were fighting. I always wore my steel toe boots when i took Riley and Zena to the dog park because it was effective but i didnt break any of my toes if a kick was warranted. AND if the dog in the fight turned to bite the kicker, they'd hit the boot and not be able to hurt me in the process. I would have been absolutely livid if someone kicked my dog without a darn good reason. NOBODY touches my dogs. Plain and simple. She should have simply gotten off her butt and asked you to keep your dog away from hers or she shouldnt have had her dogs there. There have been times when we went to the dog park and a fight broke out, people would either rush in to break it up or people would gather up their dog(s) and leave and let everyone else deal with it. I've had people tell me to just start kicking because the dogs would be moving so fast, getting a hold of their back legs was next to impossible. I honestly dont blame your husband for getting in her face and just all out nasty about it. I hope other experiences are pleasant.


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## Good_Karma

I'm so sorry your dog got kicked, that is just so sad. I hope he's not going to have any long-standing issues from this incident.

I think I would have gone nuclear if it had been me. 

Give your dog a gentle snuggle and a kiss from me, I hope he's doing okay today.


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## Whiteshepherds

Panda said:


> I
> Maybe she interpreted it as aggression (although I don't see how) and if you consider two dogs running together in a dog park a nuisance then I think she's the one who shouldn't be in a dog park.


I agree, but that's the problem with dog parks, you don't get to control who can a can't be there.


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## Lin

psdontario said:


> and they approached one of my service dogs. The dogs (Jack Russels) took turns attacking him while he was in a down position until I punted one, at which time they retreated.


This is quite off topic, but I was a bit confused by your use of the term "service dog" here and in another thread. Are you just using the term to refer to a working dog? I read your intro that you train police dogs?


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## cassadee7

Holy crap. What would I do?? I'd probably call 911 and tell the cops she assaulted my dog!


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## Chowgal

I HAVE done the same thing your husband did. A friend mine and I took my chow and chow X to the dog park a while back(before I got Dixie) and my girl, Tippsy, was playing with my boy, Jasper, and they play rough I admit. It's a chow thing, they do look like they're fighting... But this guy stepped between them and kicked Tippsy in the chest! I cleared the 100 yards between me and them yelling at the guy "Why the f*** did you kick my dog!? She was PLAYING with MY other dog! YOU had no f***ing right to do that!" and so on and so forth... I was beyond mad at this man. And all he had to say is "It LOOKED like she was hurting him." Well, if he wasn't yelping, he's not hurt. I wanted to kick that guy in the chest and see how he felt about it. This guy was stupid to mess with me, I carry a LARGE pocket knife, pepper spray, and a tazer with me at all times. And I did call the cops and they told me that they couldn't do anything.

So honestly, your husband did what he felt he needed to do, and I don't blame him.


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## Salem

If it were me, I think I would have given that woman an ear-full!

My Leader Dog puppy, Kaya, and I used to go to a local elementary school for an internship in order to socialize her with fifth grade students and CI (cognitively impaired) children.

On my way out one day, there were some parents bringing an autistic girl in through the back (Kaya had met her once since she was in the separate autisitc room). It was a small space so there was no way that Kaya could walk by without attempting to plant a kiss on her. The little girl then turned and kicked her in the ribs! Her teacher and parent quickly apologized, but for a moment I was at a loss for words. Of course, she did not know better, and neither Kaya or myself held it against her.

In fact, Kaya took it as if the girl attempted to pet her with her foot. She in turn wagged her tail as if to say, "Opps! You tried to pet me with your foot, but it didn't really work! Next time try with your hand and I will be very happy!"


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## Chowgal

> Dogs usually growl before they bite. People who kick dogs usually give their own warning signs...maybe grabbing the collar was that warning sign.


Actually that's false. Dogs do NOT always growl before biting. Sometimes they don't give the warning.


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## Shadow's mum

This whole story has left me feeling a little sick. I probably would have done what your hubby did, however if it me, as soon as the lady grabbed my dogs collar I would have been over there (prabably exchanging rude words then!) I hate to think what my son would do if anyone kicked Shadow.

Perhaps this lady knows her dogs aren't well under her control and can turn nasty quickly, maybe she didn't want a dog fight. Either way she should have asked you to keep your dog away from her's or simply removed her own dogs.

Sigrud's mom, I don't know how you stayed there for one second longer, there is no way I would have anything to do with someone who did that to my dog, over a dam blow up boat! He obviously cared more for the boat than the kids because Sigrud could have scratched one of the kids he was swimming with just as easily. 

Seriously I think it shows a lot about someones character by the way they treat animals.


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## MikeyMerciless

"Overreacted"? I think he under-reacted! I would have kicked them back!


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## Sigurd's Mom

Shadow's mum said:


> Sigrud's mom, I don't know how you stayed there for one second longer, there is no way I would have anything to do with someone who did that to my dog, over a dam blow up boat! He obviously cared more for the boat than the kids because Sigrud could have scratched one of the kids he was swimming with just as easily.
> 
> Seriously I think it shows a lot about someones character by the way they treat animals.


I don't know how I did it either. The remainder of the time I stayed in our room, and took Sigurd out hiking/swimming with my SO far far away from the cabin where he was staying. It was so hard being around him, so close, under the same roof.  I agree, peoples characters shine through when you see how they treat animals.


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## DharmasMom

Sigurd's Mom said:


> I don't know how I did it either. The remainder of the time I stayed in our room, and took Sigurd out hiking/swimming with my SO far far away from the cabin where he was staying. It was so hard being around him, so close, under the same roof.  I agree, peoples characters shine through when you see how they treat animals.



I would have left as well. With or with out my SO. I don't know how you did it either cuz I would have packed up my things and my dog and been out of there and not gone back. And you are right, how people treat animals speaks volumes about them as a person.


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## doreenf

I would kick them back and then call my husband and let him know where to bring the bail money too!!!!


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## Syaoransbear

In this scenario, I would have been like 'what the ****' at the lady and then ask why she kicked my dog. The fact that she kicked your dog because she was too lazy to come over to the other side of the dog park would have made me even more mad. I'm not really a yelling kind of person though, I'm more of a 'brood-quietly-and-plot-their-death' person. 

But I know that if someone were to kick my dog(unless they did it really, really hard), it would probably backfire and he'd assume that the person who kicked him was initiating rough play, and then they'd have this ginormous dog galloping towards them about to ram them. I don't think he thinks people are even capable of being malicious towards him .


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## mroutdoorsman

I would beat them into a pulp and let my dog lick their wounds just for good measure and added insult.


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## JakodaCD OA

this kinda makes me sick to, that some fool would do this for no reason

First I don't do dog parks, but if someone did that to my dog, I would lose it as well, and they would be lucky if my husband wasn't there


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## Mrs.K

Lin said:


> This is quite off topic, but I was a bit confused by your use of the term "service dog" here and in another thread. Are you just using the term to refer to a working dog? I read your intro that you train police dogs?


I think he might just refer to a police dogs. Service dog in terms that they serve their country. I've heard a couple of people refer to police dogs as service dogs before.


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## westallkennel

Some people can be complete A#$es. The most important thing right now for your dog is that you do not let this effect you from this point on. If you allow your self to remain upset it will effect your dog, and if your say he is in a fear stage at this time your negative feelings can transfer to him. example if you go to the park again and you are waiting for something to happen he will sense this and become more fearful. Relax and enjoy the park. If any thing does happen keep your cool and take your dog from the area and then go back and kick thier butt.


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## selzer

So, you are in a fenced in, off lead park and your dog is with you. 

Other people enter the area with their dogs. Your dog goes over, and starts playing.

They grab a hold of your dog. FOUL! 

You call the dog. It comes -- obviously under control.

You allow the dog to roam about some more -- after all, this is what you are there for, and were there first by your statement.

The dog migrates their way and starts playing again. 

They KICK your dog and say Get Lost!

*************************************'

If I got all that right, oh how I would be in someone's face,

You have heard the statement, Forget the Dog, Beware of Owner!

Why if they found the area occupied, and they were not comfortable being there with dogs they did not know, did they not LEAVE? 

I do not go to dog parks. I did once upon a time with Babs and Jenna, and I never had any gruesome stories, but I find it something where way too much could possibly go wrong. And people like those people are a good reason why.

After a heated argument, I think my first impulse would be to leave and slash all four of their tires before driving off. 

But of course, that would probably run you into some serious trouble. I guess it is a good thing we do not act on our first impulses. 

I would not say your husband over-reacted. 

Now, if he knocked her down and rubbed her nose in some dog poo -- that _might_ be over-reacting.


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## vat

This is why I think dog parks are a bad thing. Not because of the dogs but because so many people are a-holes!. Your husband was in his right, had it been me...well I hate to say 

I really wonder how they treat their own dogs if they would do this to another!


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## lisgje

I stopped taking Shane to the park and don't take Chance either because of the following:

We were walking away from the general area that the dogs apparently run loose (this is an illegal dog park inside a local park, so Shane was on his leash-I did not know this at the time) three little dogs (can't recall the name of the breed, but the same as the dog on Frasier) came charging over from over 200 ft away and started nipping at Shane and me. I yelled for whomever the owner was to get their dogs. She came over and said "they are just playing" I responded with "my dog is on a leash and yours are not, and Shane is not interested in playing and your dogs are nipping at both of us, you are breaking the law". She laughed and walked away, not taking the **** dogs. They kept at us and we were trying to get away. The dogs kept following and nipping. A few others saw what was happening and how Shane was being harrassed and started yelling at the woman, still she did not call her dogs. Strangers came up and grabbed the dogs and pulled them away from us, yelled at her and she said, well this is the doggie play area. I never brought him back. This is a park where it is TOTALLY ILLEGAL to have your dogs off leash. I was not doing anything wrong. This was the first and last time I took him there. By the way, when I took him there I was not aware of this area of the park being an "illegal dog park". This happened 8 years ago. It is still an illegal dog park, but they are now trying to fence off an area and make a dog park within the park. Very frustrating that I can't take my current dog for a walk in the park for fear of numerous loose dogs running up to us with the owners way too far away and thinking it is cute. It is not cute!


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## angelas

I can't say what I would do. I know what my dad did. He broke the guys nose & glasses and gave him two black eyes. The guy was aiming for the dog and got dad in the shin. 

Of course, if I was a drunk man, standing on someone's lawn at 3AM taking a wiz with all my junk hanging out I'D be worried about the charging, barking dog too.

After the year long internal affairs investigation (the sgt took the guy home instead of the drunk tank and didn't even give him a breathalyzer and the guy complained to IA about his poor broken nose) dad still says it was worth it.


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## frillint1

I dont think he overreacted at all. My uncle kicked my dog once. My uncle is not liked in my family at all except by his wife my aunt. My dog peed on his mustangs tire and he kicked the crap out of my dog. I was only 8 or 9 I ran screaming to my dad. Boy my uncle got it handed to him. I dont think you could overreact if some one did something like that to your dog unless your dog was attacking someone.


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## JazzNScout

The only public "fights" I have ever gotten into were over my dogs -- years ago, back in the day when I used to take them to dog parks and off-leash parks. . . and they were heated, angry "fights," unlike anything I have gotten into over anything else. 

I would go crazy if someone kicked one of my dogs. I am not sure I wouldn't jump on the person. So, no, I don't think your husband overreacted. 

And this is another reason I stay out of dog parks/off-leash parks.


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## LARHAGE

I'm very embarassed to admit one of my not so better moments was in a fight at a dog park. The dog park is around the corner from where my sister lives, she has a Westie the same age as my Cairn, so she asked me to go with her to the park, the thing I realized about my dog though is he only has 3 interests in life, chasing and killing varmints, eating, and me. These wacky people were having a birthday party for a Boston Terrier and there was a pack of 8, they were all sitting around this table when they popped out a bucket of Kentucky Fried Chicken, well, my dog smelled it and went meandering over to them, I called him back but not before one of the Bostons attacked him, than another , my Cairn transformed into the Tasmanian Devil and pinned one down , this *b#&*%tch from the group jumps up and kicks my dog so hard he gets airborne, he's only 14 pounds, I went absolutely apes sh&t and ran and pushed her as she was going after my dog again, as she was falling from my shove, she grabbed my leg and knocked me down, we started to grabble as expletives were flying, yes, I'm embarassed about that , than bless his little brave heart, my Cairn grabbed her by her pant leg and tore her pants, people seperated us and we were banned from the dog park, I could care less though, because I realized my dog liked that place a little less than I did, and I walked away with a realization how stupid and ridiculous some people are, and why I hate dog parks, I have a couple of acres so my dogs don't need to be exposed to idiocy, we have enough room at home to run and play, did I say how much I love my Cairn? :wub: I still can't live that day down to my sister, almost 3 years later.


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## AdamConnell

Not to bring up a dead thread (I know... bad first post move :blush: ) but my puppy will be able to go to the dog park starting next week and I have been researching religiously about everything GSD related. She's 50% GSD, 25% Ridgeback and 25% black lab. She's basically a GSD with a mohawk haha!

Anyways back on topic: this is MY first puppy. I have lived with dogs my entire life, but Valentine is my first personal dog. I have been to the dog parks in our area with girlfriends, roommates, and friends over the past couple of years and have seen all sorts of things. I never understood some of the absolute nutcase owners until now... Just reading this thread makes me angry, so I already know exactly how I would react.

My real question is, how do the larger dogs react to owner fights? Ever since I realized that my behavior directly effects Valentine's behavior, I am very aware of my actions when she's around. I've got a very "loyal" combination with GSD and Ridgeback in the mix, and Im worried that in that situation she would attack whoever was being aggressive towards me. If she attacks someone because she thinks I am in danger, I do not know how the legal side of the situation would play out, but I doubt it would end well. She doesn't have an aggressive bone in her body, but she's got some fire when playing with other dogs.


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## Heagler870

Wow, that is crap! And at a dog park? People are just stupid. I have had to kick a dog but it bit my dog while I was walking mine on leash and he ran up behind us and I was going in circles trying to get my dog away and the dog's owner was half a foot ball field away yelling "Come back "name" come back." That sort of stuff shouldn't be expected at a dog park because you should expect the least expected and deal with it in a more appropriate manner.


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## elisabeth_00117

Emoore said:


> Honestly? There'd be a fight. Unless my dog was actually attacking their dog, child, or another person, if somebody kicked my dog things would get real ugly real fast.


This.


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## krystyne73

yea, I didn't read all the posts but umm if that lady had kicked my dog, I would have stomped her so hard her grandchildren would feel it!


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## codmaster

LARHAGE said:


> I'm very embarassed to admit one of my not so better moments was in a fight at a dog park. The dog park is around the corner from where my sister lives, she has a Westie the same age as my Cairn, so she asked me to go with her to the park, the thing I realized about my dog though is he only has 3 interests in life, chasing and killing varmints, eating, and me. These wacky people were having a birthday party for a Boston Terrier and there was a pack of 8, they were all sitting around this table when they popped out a bucket of Kentucky Fried Chicken, well, my dog smelled it and went meandering over to them, I called him back but not before one of the Bostons attacked him, than another , my Cairn transformed into the Tasmanian Devil and pinned one down , this *b#&*%tch from the group jumps up and kicks my dog so hard he gets airborne, he's only 14 pounds, I went absolutely apes sh&t and ran and pushed her as she was going after my dog again, as she was falling from my shove, she grabbed my leg and knocked me down, we started to grabble as expletives were flying, yes, I'm embarassed about that , than bless his little brave heart, my Cairn grabbed her by her pant leg and tore her pants, people seperated us and we were banned from the dog park, I could care less though, because I realized my dog liked that place a little less than I did, and I walked away with a realization how stupid and ridiculous some people are, and why I hate dog parks, I have a couple of acres so my dogs don't need to be exposed to idiocy, we have enough room at home to run and play, did I say how much I love my Cairn? :wub: I still can't live that day down to my sister, almost 3 years later.


 
Pictures????? Heh! Heh!


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## codmaster

If someone tried to kick my current dog, he/she had better have very fast feet!

If they did it when he was a puppy, whole different story - we would probably both be in the tank after that!


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## TitonsDad

Titon is my best friend. I loath the day that he'll be gone from me but anyways. 

If someone so much as smack, hit or kick my dog, there would be assault charges on me and I'll sit in solitary confinement for the rest of my life if I have to. Just like I would if someone so much as hit my 2 boys or wife.


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## TitonsDad

krystyne73 said:


> yea, I didn't read all the posts but umm if that lady had kicked my dog, I would have stomped her so hard her grandchildren would feel it!


Are you married? :wub:


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## CarrieJ

First of all, bringing food to a dog park is just beyond stupid. Aside from the cleanliness factor of people who don't pick up after their dogs and then let them jump up on the tables....*yuck! KFC with a hint of fecal matter* 
I don't even bring toys from home to the dog park. If I bring a ball it stays when we leave.

It's hard to say...at one point in my life, a guy brought a Malamute in heat to the dogpark and she promptly attacked the first dog who came in (20 lbs terrier X). Both owners were stupid, the one in heat, no explanation needed and the small dog owner ignoring the separate field for small dogs.
The malamute's owner was about thirty yards away not even looking at his dog pinning and shaking another dog, so I ran up shouting "Hey! Hey! Hey!" The Mal didn't even twitch an ear and kept doing what she was doing so I kept running and ran into her with my knee. It most undoubtably looked like a kick. But, she did stop what she was doing and back down after a little growling. The little dog's owner just stood there frozen in shock watching the whole incident unravel before her eyes.
I just couldn't stand there and watch a mauling; which is what would have ended up happening. Yeah, there's laws and ACOs to deal with it but it wouldn't have brought the little dog back if it died. Chances are the Mal's owner would have split without giving info.
Only good thing is Alice did a spectacular "Leave it" and didn't help me.

When Alice was younger; about a year a smaller terrier sniffed her and latched onto her neck and she went off on him. I pinned my own dog and went into the small dog side (empty at the time) as she wasn't in trouble she was responding to a challenge. Albeit a bit on the snotty side, but having a JRT hanging from my neck would probably piss me off too.

I went today and saw a fight between a female pitty and an American bulldog and I've now gotten to the point of: I've seen how they both entered the park...let the owner's deal with it.


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## beaderdog

If all your husband did was scream & swear at them he took the High Road AFAIC. I'd have taken names & tried to get them banned from the park. That sort of abuse would get one banned from our dog park.


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## martemchik

The more I go to dog parks, the more people piss me off and the less I want to come back. Sadly with no other outlets available we keep going. But the previous post mentioned laws associated with dog attacks, are there really laws? I mean how do you prove your dog wasn't provoked by another dog? I'm sure most of us have noticed that little dogs tend to be more aggressive at dog parks, and what if one of those little dogs goes after a GSD and the GSD does what one does, how would the GSD owner be liable?


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## GSDolch

While, I think that this women should not have kicked the dog, I also think that the OP holds some responsibility with their dog. Just because the dog has calmed down, does not mean that its going to stay that way, just because two dogs are fine one minute, doesnt mean its going to stay that way, and from reading the OP, they were not close enough to their dog it seems to really know what happened, other than they were running and their dog got kicked. They could have misread something, the dog could have growled, or made a noise like a growl, or something of the like.

The women grabbed your dog by the collar..you had to call your dog to you, so that tells me that you were not close enough at that time either. 

I personally think all people involved are at fault. And i'll say it, if I think a dog is about to attack mine, your darn right im gonna kick it! If you are not close enough to know what happened, you arent close enough to your dog.


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## gracieGSD

Sigurd's Mom said:


> Oh I so wanted to...he said that right in front of everyone at the dinner table. I left the table and called my Mom, I told her the story and spitted off a million strings of bad words about him... how I wanted to beat him with an ore. I wish I would have told him just that, his boat is replaceable, Sigurds not. I was thinking of saying that to him, I just didn't want to start a large fight since we were there for another week.


 
I'm guessing you are quite young, and when I was that young I would have reacted as you did. We wait so long for summer in MichIigan and for you to have to put up with the jerk is awful. I Hope that stupid boat springs a leak after the dropoff. 

Now that I am older, I would have told him he was a moron with no decency or common sense, and I would have left. No lake is worth the stress you must have suffered for the remainder of the trip. May I ask which lake?


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## pyratemom

AdamConnell said:


> Not to bring up a dead thread (I know... bad first post move :blush: ) but my puppy will be able to go to the dog park starting next week and I have been researching religiously about everything GSD related. She's 50% GSD, 25% Ridgeback and 25% black lab. She's basically a GSD with a mohawk haha!
> 
> Anyways back on topic: this is MY first puppy. I have lived with dogs my entire life, but Valentine is my first personal dog. I have been to the dog parks in our area with girlfriends, roommates, and friends over the past couple of years and have seen all sorts of things. I never understood some of the absolute nutcase owners until now... Just reading this thread makes me angry, so I already know exactly how I would react.
> 
> My real question is, how do the larger dogs react to owner fights? Ever since I realized that my behavior directly effects Valentine's behavior, I am very aware of my actions when she's around. I've got a very "loyal" combination with GSD and Ridgeback in the mix, and Im worried that in that situation she would attack whoever was being aggressive towards me. If she attacks someone because she thinks I am in danger, I do not know how the legal side of the situation would play out, but I doubt it would end well. She doesn't have an aggressive bone in her body, but she's got some fire when playing with other dogs.



I would personally avoid the dog park. I don't take either of my GSD's to the dog park that I personally worked with a group of people to get. We were successful at getting the park built and made enough money at fundraisers to support improvements, but I won't take my dogs there for all the reasons listed in this entire thread. There are stupid people there and I couldn't take the chance that I wouldn't have to whip up on someone and then Raina would have my back while Pyrate circled us. We would all be in trouble I'm sure. Raina is protective of me as I am of my dogs. I always said I would shoot to protect my dogs or my daughter, just like Raina would bite to protect me. :gsdhead:


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## NancyJ

One question.......and I am not fond of dog parks..........

When you say kick........she used her foot, not her calf - correct. I guess the question I have is did she literally take the point of her foot or even her foot and literally kick the dog or did she bump the dog with her leg to control his movement?

I think it is a difference but the fact that your dog went over there once and was grabbed for some reason then allowed to go back puts some of the responsibility on you, JMO

Like I said-no excuse to ever literally KICK a dog unless it was a true fight and you were defening your dog. But one thing with strangers and your dog is a lot of folks cannot read what a dog is doing and there are nuances between play and agression.


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## krystyne73

TitonsDad said:


> Are you married? :wub:


Yes LoL he sleeps in a crate next to my bed


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## cuttingedge

I know that this is probably not the proper response but everyone that knows me knows that the things that I care the most about in this world are my Family, my Dogs which are my Kids, Friends and my Brother Firefighters. If anything were to happen to them as a result of someone intentionally harming them it's "Game On". I am not a violent person by nature but if someone harmed them physically in any way I would be in jail and they would for sure be in the hospital. Same goes for someone intentionally harming any animal. I see all of these posts about animal cruelty and people torturing dogs. Guess what, if I saw that it would not be pretty for that other person.


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## wolfstraum

Dog Parks are one of the most dangerous places for your dog. Stupid people with dogs they can't control. People with dogs not vaccinated or wormed properly. Stupid people who know NOTHING about dogs. yada yada yada.....

I have no problem using a foot to BREAK UP A FIGHT! Better than your hands to get bitten! But anyone who takes a dog into a park and lets it loose with other dogs needs to take responsibility for what ever happens - to other dogs by their dogs, to their dogs by other dogs or people....most of the fights I hear about are terrier or pittie instigated. Knowledgeable people who understand the dynamics of their own dogs behavior generally will NOT frequent these parks. 

To the poster who thinks his pup is "old enough next week" and plans on taking her to the park???? DON"T!!!!!!!!! The risks of picking up worms, or getting hurt by a bigger, bullying dog are very high.

Stupid places.

And if I was in one for some reason, and someone kicked MY dog for no reason - believe me, they would hear about it just as strongly as your husband expressed his displeasure - if not more strongly!

And the dog hit by the oar - well that relationship may not have survived the firestorm.

Lee


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## Courtney

I'm sorry this happened to your dog

This is honestly why I will NEVER go to a dog park. Dogs are pack animals and will NOT get along with all dogs. There maybe reasons we will never know. They are not like children, we can't force them to play or get along with another dog.

While intentions are good for most dog owners that go to dog parks it just seems to go bad. GSD just don't seem cut out for these types of situations. 

I will only let mine around trusted dogs on my terms. To be honest the trusted dogs are a grand total of 2. I just don't feel the need to find friends for my dog to play with.


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## NancyJ

Lee - I am 100%

Even walking in the woods with a friends dog we saw some chasing behavior that was just too real and we cut it off at the pass.

Three dogs-one dog driving, one dog flanking, and one dog being chased. Play, perhaps but enough for us to both say at the same time "something could happen here"

Dogs playing within their own pack........fine...........(though honestly my two don't really play with each other). Playing with owners wonderful. TO me the ideal is that a dog is "dog neutral" to strange dogs -- it sure solves a lot of problems. 

I would go to a dog park if it was a big park where you could go with your dog offlead and interact with your dog and not have to deal with everyone else's dogs.....but that ain't the case.


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## rebelsgirl

I don't take my dogs to the Dog Park. First it's too far away. My newest rescue used to go and I heard he loves it, but we've got an acre and a half so we just let them run together out here (the 3 GSD's) I hate to say it but I'm afraid of dog parks, just the potential of what could happen.

And as for what I'd do if someone kicked my dog.. I'd probably cuss them out and maybe try to get a kick or two in myself on them.

I think I'd have talked to her when she first grabbed the dogs collar.


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## 4TheDawgies

this is why we do not go to the dog park. I agree with others. The responsibility is partly on the OP for not controlling their own dog more when it was witnessed their dog was being held by a collar. 

If it were me, I would have talked to the people grabbing my dogs collar.... NO ONE and I mean NO ONE corrects or holds back or reprimands my dogs. And they will know full and well all of those details if they dare try. 

As the bumper sticker says 
"dog friendly, beware of owner"


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## 3ToesTonyismydog

Years ago I saw a guy beat another man for kicking his dog. I don't mean a punch, I mean he took the guy down to the ground and smashed his face in. The guy ended up going to the hospital and no one said one thing (to the cops), nor did the guy press charges. The kick was witnessed by 20 people in a Tavern and this dog was owned by regular and everyone loved that dog. The dog was just laying under a table doing nothing.


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## webzpinner

I'm soooooooooooo picky on who I let Jake play with. He's got a "girlfriend" 
(husky Aussie mix) that he flirts and acts like a total dork around.


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## TheNamesNelson

I didn't witness this incident, so I can't really take sides but I would say that kicking a dog would be a last resort in the case of something serious happening.

To speak on the opposing side of most people here though... I have been at the dog park and witnessed dogs harassing other peoples dogs while their owners are far away chatting up and not paying attention. 

I actually saw a dog forcefully trying to mount and hump a female dog while the females owner was pushing it away. This went on for 5 minutes and I went over there and grabbed the dogs collar myself and removed him. Of course that didnt stop anything, its kept happening until I chased the dog off. I watched it run about 200 yards away where its owners were just standing around shooting the breeze, not watching their dog. Behavior like that is a real problem and its common at the local park.

If the dog is just pestering and playing, but not being inappropriate then I would have called the police on that woman. I've taken my 1 year old GSD to the park and sometimes he will be fixated on certain dogs. There was a man who was at the park trying to just play 1 on 1 ball fetch with his dog (if you are trying to play 1 on 1 with your dog, dont take it to a dog park). Everytime his dog would chase the ball, my dog would chase after him, but once he caught up he would turn around, never making contact with the other dog but he was crowding the game this man was trying to play. I could tell the man was slightly annoyed but my dog wasn't doing anything inappropriate so I didnt stop him.

The lady shouldnt have kicked your dog, but the incident could have been prevented had you kept a better eye on your dog and kept it away from her after you noticed it was disturbing her the first time.

Managing your dog at a dog park is like driving defensively. Everyone is doing their own thing and you cant control how they behave, so you have to keep your wits about you and always be taking preventative measures to keep yourself and your pet safe.


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## codmaster

I never did take our male GSD to the local dog park but a couple of times so I am not a real dog park experienced person but it sure seems that if you can't control your dog then he shouldn't be in an unleashed dog park! From the little I have seen of dog parks, that is certainly the case with most people in the dog park!

If any dog was seriously harassing my dog and the owners were either ineffective or unwilling to control their dog; I would not have any problem in protecting him (if he needed it) anyway necessary up to and including persuading the other dog that it is in his best interest to leave him alone right now!


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## Floppy

I would have been irate. This is why I don't go to dog parks. If someone touched my dog we would have exchanged words at least. Also randomly kicking a dog you don't know sounds like all kinds of stupid.


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## Zisso

I too have not read all the posts here, but will say this...

There are very few people that are allowed near my dogs for several reasons. The ones that are allowed to be around them are because I trust them. We do not go to dog parks. We go to training every Sunday and my dogs are fine with the distance we keep between them all, as we are there to train, not socialize. However, I do have some nasty neighbors and they can not so much as speak to my dogs without me going ballistic! A couple weeks ago one of these nasty neighbors said 'hey puppy puppy' to my dogs...I was around the corner and could not see what they were doing as they spoke to them, but due to the fact that they have made it clear they do not like my dogs, I very quickly stepped around the corner and told them to leave my dogs alone. They could have been poking sticks through the fence for all I knew. If anyone ever dared to try to touch my dogs in any way without my permission, I would be quick to put a stop to it, and probably not too nice. Kick my dogs and it is game on! They probably would have had to have the cops come pull me off the one who kicked them! One of my dogs was abused before I got her, and I swear, if anyone so much as touched her, they would have to deal with my fury!


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## Skirita

Sorry to resurrect an old thread on my first post, but I had something similar to the OP's situation happen to my GSD/Doberman puppy recently and, looking at this from the perspective of a defense attorney and former military prosecutor, I think some people here are missing the point.

The only issue of any real importance in the OP's scenario is whether the kick was _necessary_. If it wasn't necessary, then there is a good chance that the woman could have been held criminally liable.

Every state will have a series of animal cruelty statutes. In mine (FL), the relevant statute (Fla. Stat. § 828.12 para 2) reads as follows:

*"*A person who intentionally commits an act to any animal which results in the cruel death, or excessive or repeated infliction of unnecessary pain or suffering, or causes the same to be done, is guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or by a fine of not more than $10,000, or both."

Most state statutes will be along these lines.

Using FL law as an example, whether the kick was _necessary_ logically establishes whether the force the woman used on the OP's dog was _excessive_ (generally, any force that the average, reasonable person wouldn't find necessary under the circumstances is excessive).

Nothing else really matters here, legally speaking, so there is no point making smug remarks about, say, how the OP was asking for it by taking his dog to a dog park. The fact that a dog is poorly trained or its owner is inattentive at the park does not justify cruelty to animals. Likewise, just because a person is ignorant about dog behavior (esp. aggression vs. play-fighting) or scared of big dogs does not mean that it is reasonable for her to kick other people's pets.

Bottom line: if someone hits, kicks or otherwise hurts your dog for no good reason (i.e. your dog is not threatening or attacking someone or something), you should immediately report him to the police for animal cruelty. Even if the charges are dropped, she might think twice next time she wants to abuse an animal. If your dog requires medical attention, you will almost certainly have a civil case against her, too.

The guy who tried to kick my dog the other day is **** lucky he missed.

Obligatory disclaimer: this is not to be construed as legal advice; consult your attorney for advice tailored to your state and situation, blah blah.


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## pyratemom

Zisso said:


> I too have not read all the posts here, but will say this...
> 
> There are very few people that are allowed near my dogs for several reasons. The ones that are allowed to be around them are because I trust them. We do not go to dog parks. We go to training every Sunday and my dogs are fine with the distance we keep between them all, as we are there to train, not socialize. However, I do have some nasty neighbors and they can not so much as speak to my dogs without me going ballistic! A couple weeks ago one of these nasty neighbors said 'hey puppy puppy' to my dogs...I was around the corner and could not see what they were doing as they spoke to them, but due to the fact that they have made it clear they do not like my dogs, I very quickly stepped around the corner and told them to leave my dogs alone. They could have been poking sticks through the fence for all I knew. If anyone ever dared to try to touch my dogs in any way without my permission, I would be quick to put a stop to it, and probably not too nice. Kick my dogs and it is game on! They probably would have had to have the cops come pull me off the one who kicked them! One of my dogs was abused before I got her, and I swear, if anyone so much as touched her, they would have to deal with my fury!



I totally feel you on this. I don't let people I don't know get close to my dog without invitation. I will stand in front of the local hardware store and pick certain people who seem friendly to greet her and give her a treat which I provide just to socialize her with different looking people and different sounds. I don't go to dog parks. If any one kicked my dog I'm pretty sure I would have my hands full - first controlling my fury and then at the same time controlling Raina's fury as she would not take kindly to being kicked. I did have a guy that lived down the street that actually did pepper spray Pyrate through the fence causing him to go blind in one eye. If I could have proven it was him he would have never made it long enough to move to Virginia. He may have been swimming with the fishies instead. I protect my dog like I would protect my daughter. Even heard that song, "Cleaning this gun"?


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## holland

LARHAGE said:


> I'm very embarassed to admit one of my not so better moments was in a fight at a dog park. The dog park is around the corner from where my sister lives, she has a Westie the same age as my Cairn, so she asked me to go with her to the park, the thing I realized about my dog though is he only has 3 interests in life, chasing and killing varmints, eating, and me. These wacky people were having a birthday party for a Boston Terrier and there was a pack of 8, they were all sitting around this table when they popped out a bucket of Kentucky Fried Chicken, well, my dog smelled it and went meandering over to them, I called him back but not before one of the Bostons attacked him, than another , my Cairn transformed into the Tasmanian Devil and pinned one down , this *b#&*%tch from the group jumps up and kicks my dog so hard he gets airborne, he's only 14 pounds, I went absolutely apes sh&t and ran and pushed her as she was going after my dog again, as she was falling from my shove, she grabbed my leg and knocked me down, we started to grabble as expletives were flying, yes, I'm embarassed about that , than bless his little brave heart, my Cairn grabbed her by her pant leg and tore her pants, people seperated us and we were banned from the dog park, I could care less though, because I realized my dog liked that place a little less than I did, and I walked away with a realization how stupid and ridiculous some people are, and why I hate dog parks, I have a couple of acres so my dogs don't need to be exposed to idiocy, we have enough room at home to run and play, did I say how much I love my Cairn? :wub: I still can't live that day down to my sister, almost 3 years later.


 
this story is hysterical-it could be a reality show-i want a terrier


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## GSDolch

Skirita said:


> Sorry to resurrect an old thread on my first post, but I had something similar to the OP's situation happen to my GSD/Doberman puppy recently and, looking at this from the perspective of a defense attorney and former military prosecutor, I think some people here are missing the point.
> 
> The only issue of any real importance in the OP's scenario is whether the kick was _necessary_. If it wasn't necessary, then there is a good chance that the woman could have been held criminally liable.
> 
> Every state will have a series of animal cruelty statutes. In mine (FL), the relevant statute (Fla. Stat. § 828.12 para 2) reads as follows:
> 
> *"*A person who intentionally commits an act to any animal which results in the cruel death, or excessive or repeated infliction of unnecessary pain or suffering, or causes the same to be done, is guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or by a fine of not more than $10,000, or both."
> 
> Most state statutes will be along these lines.
> 
> Using FL law as an example, whether the kick was _necessary_ logically establishes whether the force the woman used on the OP's dog was _excessive_ (generally, any force that the average, reasonable person wouldn't find necessary under the circumstances is excessive).
> 
> Nothing else really matters here, legally speaking, so there is no point making smug remarks about, say, how the OP was asking for it by taking his dog to a dog park. The fact that a dog is poorly trained or its owner is inattentive at the park does not justify cruelty to animals. Likewise, just because a person is ignorant about dog behavior (esp. aggression vs. play-fighting) or scared of big dogs does not mean that it is reasonable for her to kick other people's pets.
> 
> Bottom line: if someone hits, kicks or otherwise hurts your dog *for no good reason (i.e. your dog is not threatening or attacking someone or something), *you should immediately report him to the police for animal cruelty. Even if the charges are dropped, she might think twice next time she wants to abuse an animal. If your dog requires medical attention, you will almost certainly have a civil case against her, too.
> 
> The guy who tried to kick my dog the other day is **** lucky he missed.
> 
> Obligatory disclaimer: this is not to be construed as legal advice; consult your attorney for advice tailored to your state and situation, blah blah.



The laws are very vague in most parts and "for no good reason" can be subjective. IE: It is perfectly acceptable for me to kick someones dog away from me if they wont get it. Now, it starts to get blurring in some cases, like dog parks and other peoples homes, but there are also laws in many states in regards to dogs that are *nuisances*, dangerous or destroying property.


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## PatchonGSD

GSDolch said:


> And i'll say it, if I think a dog is about to attack mine, your darn right im gonna kick it! If you are not close enough to know what happened, you arent close enough to your dog.


THIS A THOUSAND TIMES OVER.



But I will say, if someone was to hit or kick my dog and it was unjustified, it would be no different than if I saw someone abusing a child (and God help you if it was my child) I would turn into King Kong and whoop some ***. I mean seriously, I would loose my mind.


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## robfromga

Dog Parks, I avoid them. While you may have many good experiences, it only takes one moron to ruin it. It's not worth it. I understand the need they fill, but I just don't do it.


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## Wolfgeist

Hahahaha. Somebody kicks my dog for no good reason and they get to see the very dark, very angry side of me I reserve for evil people. 

Unless my dog attacked their dog. Which I'd kick him myself. (Just kidding)


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## Zisso

I didn't read all of this thread but there are a few things I think I would have done differently. 

First I would not have let my dog play with theirs unless I had spoken to them first to be sure they were okay with it. Never hurts to be on the same page as others. 

Next, when someone else grabbed my dogs collar I would have been over there having a chat with them to find out what the problem was, and make it right. Again, it never hurts to be on the same page as others. 

I know dog parks are looked at as a place to socialize your dogs in a way, but I honestly feel that they are a place where a responsible owner has to be extra vigilant about their dogs behavior. I also feel that if your dog doesn't have 100% recall and good doggie manners, the dog park is asking for trouble.

That said, if someone kicked my dog, there would be H*** to pay.


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## Nikitta

I'd be really mad if someone kicked my dog but I'd never take my dog to a place that had dogs or people I didn't know and trust. I understand you probably live in a bigger city where it is harder to find places to exercise your dogs. I have more options here but I wouldn't risk my dog in those places. I'd probably react harshly to people mistreating my dogs though. I have caught a neighbor boy throwing rocks at my dogs when they were in the outdoor kennel and gotten very angry. (But I get angry at any cruelty I see. ) I watched 2 guys kicking a black bird with a broken wing back and forth under a pickup one day when I was walking my dog. It was the first time I understood the meaning of the words being so angry you see red. Black birds are not my favorite kind of bird to be honest but cruelty is cruelty. I went up and chewed them out. They never said a word. They just left. So they knew they were being cruel. The dumb woman at the park will never learn. I would be careful where I took my dog.


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## Skirita

GSDolch said:


> The laws are very vague in most parts and "for no good reason" can be subjective. IE: It is perfectly acceptable for me to kick someones dog away from me if they wont get it.


Actually, the legal standard is _objective_ (what the average, reasonable person would think if they watched everything unfold from the sidelines), not subjective (what you personally think is acceptable). 

Also, there is a difference between reasonable and _excessive_ force. When I say "kick" I am not talking about using your foot to _push_ away an annoying dog that is jumping up on you or whatever. That's probably reasonable. 

I am talking about excessive force, i.e. drop-kicking a dog "because its owner won't come get it," hitting a swimming dog with an oar, or otherwise trying to _hurt_ a dog out of uncontrolled, _unjustified_ anger or fear. That's animal abuse, plain and simple. 

Bottom line is that you all should know what the animal cruelty laws are in your state and not be afraid to call the authorities when someone steps over the line. Whether the responding officer will react appropriately, or whether the prosecutor will file charges, is another matter entirely.

FWIW, we don't take our dog to dog parks anymore, either, for the same reasons as most people here.


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## Mrs.K

As a matter of fact, there is just a case in Germany where a drunk guy kicked a dog to death in Frankfurt, on the middle of the Sidewalk and no one interfered... if I had seen that... not sure if I could have held myself back.


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## Skirita

By contrast, if the dog is attacking or about to attack you or your dog, then you would be justified in using that level of force on the dog. I doubt anyone would disagree in that scenario, but that wasn't the case in the OP or some of the other stories here, nor was that the case in my own situation.

On a side note, in most jurisdictions you are justified to use reasonable force to protect property (dogs, for better or worse, fall under "property").
However, _generally_, you can't use deadly force to protect property (some states have exceptions, but they are usually very narrow).

Another interesting thought, legally, is that many jurisdictions allow the reasonable use of force to prevent or stop a felony. Animal cruelty is usually a felony. Therefore, you might be justified using force against someone who is abusing an animal. It would really depend on the circumstances and the laws in your area.

Hmm, I might have just found a new niche ("Dog Law") for my private practice!


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## PatchonGSD

Mrs.K said:


> As a matter of fact, there is just a case in Germany where a drunk guy kicked a dog to death in Frankfurt, on the middle of the Sidewalk and no one interfered... if I had seen that... not sure if I could have held myself back.


HOW could someone _not_ stop him??


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## huntergreen

at the dog park i frequent, the regular crowd would have invited them to leave.


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## Shepnut

Dog parks are disasters waiting to happen, daily.

My advice to you is stop using dog parks.

Dog parks are full of people who do not know much about dog handling. Many of these people are in the park for their own socialization and would be better off hanging out at the local starbucks sans fur baby.

For example people bring their dogs to the park who are fearful and what do you think will happen? Another good example of dog park stupidity is the owner that loses track of their dog. But what really takes the cake is that people think their dogs need to "bond" with other dogs to feel whole. I guess the 10000 plus years of canis familiaris integrating with homosapiens has been a small anachronism in what their true natures demand.

What I really find intriguing is why more city governments are not sued to oblivion for these ridiculously dangerous "services" they provide with our tax dollars.


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## RileyMay

If somebody kicked my dog, because she was playing with their dog (not aggressively etc.) I would of screamed at the owner, called the police, and asked her if she'd like it if I kicked the crap out of her dog because I don't like her! I can't stand that and I get really pissed off when people do so to my dogs' for no absolute reason. I am so sorry that this happened to you and your dog!


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## Samba

Oh, what would I do if someone kicked my dog....get arrested, I imagine! Ridiculous.


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## Lilie

Samba said:


> Oh, what would I do if someone kicked my dog....get arrested, I imagine! Ridiculous.


Exact same thing crossed my mind. If someone kicked my dog, I'd have to post bail.


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## chelle

This post is quite old, so I was ignoring it, but I have to admit that I'm with Whiteshepherds and GSDolch on this one.

The owner was far away from the dog, and allowed the dog to return _after_ the woman had grabbed the dog's collar once already.

Whether the dog was misbehaving or not, that would've sure been my cue to be *right* next to my dog. That way, had she attempted to kick my dog, she would've first encountered *my* body and my leg knows how to kick also.


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## Tarheel

If it is a public dog park, I would have called and reported it to the ranger. I have seen a couple of young men trying to get their leashed pit to fight with other dogs, and the ranger told them, go and do not come back. Also, if you're going to kick someone go for the side of their knee, so they won't get up again.:smirk:


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## Elektra2167

Samba said:


> Oh, what would I do if someone kicked my dog....get arrested, I imagine! Ridiculous.


This.
Providing my dog hadn't already removed their leg.


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## pyratemom

Elektra2167 said:


> This.
> Providing my dog hadn't already removed their leg.


I know I should not be laughing as this is serious but I had to LOL at this one as I was thinking the same thing about Raina.


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## GSDolch

Skirita said:


> Actually, the legal standard is _objective_ (what the average, reasonable person would think if they watched everything unfold from the sidelines), not subjective (what you personally think is acceptable).
> 
> Also, there is a difference between reasonable and _excessive_ force. When I say "kick" I am not talking about using your foot to _push_ away an annoying dog that is jumping up on you or whatever. That's probably reasonable.
> 
> I am talking about excessive force, i.e. drop-kicking a dog "because its owner won't come get it," hitting a swimming dog with an oar, or otherwise trying to _hurt_ a dog out of uncontrolled, _unjustified_ anger or fear. That's animal abuse, plain and simple.
> 
> *Bottom line is that you all should know what the animal cruelty laws are in your state* and not be afraid to call the authorities when someone steps over the line. Whether the responding officer will react appropriately, or whether the prosecutor will file charges, is another matter entirely.
> 
> FWIW, we don't take our dog to dog parks anymore, either, for the same reasons as most people here.



And this is my point. I am sorry, but what you say in regards to the laws are going to be DIFFERENT. You talk about excessive force. What is and is not considered that is going to depend GREATLY on where an individual lives. 

A good example my uncle use to raise cattle, he came out to find a dog running around in his field with his cattle. He wasn't doing anything to the cattle, but he shot it, because he wasn't going to take that risk. He had some pregnant heifers and they were getting stressed out. He then called AC to come out and get the dog because he didn't want to bury it. What he did was LEGAL for around here. Not only was it legal, if any of his cows had come to any harm, (even if the dog didn't actively do anything) he could sue the owners for damages (IE: if one of the heifers got hurt or lost an unborn calf because of the dog being in the field)

I understand what you are tying to do, but its not so black and white and there are lots of different people on this site, not just from different states in the US, but from different countries as well.


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## Dainerra

GSDolch, what you describe your Uncle doing is legal in almost every state. The only difference is at what point it become legal to shoot the dog. Some, you only have to suspect that the dog will harm the birds. In others, you have to catch the dog in the act and there must be physical harm. Here in AR, all that is required is that I believe the dog caused harm before and I'm allowed to shoot it. 

I dont' remember if I posted in this the first time and I don't feel like re-reading the 11 pages to see. Honestly, though, if they had made motions and statements that they didn't want my dog around their dog, then it would be MY fault that something happened to my dog. Just because it's an off-leash area doesn't mean that you can allow your dog to act obnoxiously. In our training club, the OP is the person who might have been told to teach her dog some manners or go home. Part of allowing your dog off-leash is being able to tell them to leave other dogs/people alone. If you can't do that, then your dog isn't allowed in our off-leash area. And if you are on the other side of the area from your dog, then you aren't going to be able to control your dog, simple as that. 
Sitting on the bench and letting your dog go where ever is a big no-no.


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## GSDolch

Dainerra said:


> *GSDolch, what you describe your Uncle doing is legal in almost every state. The only difference is at what point it become legal to shoot the dog. Some, you only have to suspect that the dog will harm the birds. In others, you have to catch the dog in the act and there must be physical harm. Here in AR, all that is required is that I believe the dog caused harm before and I'm allowed to shoot it. *



*nods* yup. I don't live where my uncle lived at that time, but where I do live, with the same situation what he did would be illegal. The dog would have had to have actively done damage to his cattle for it to be legal for him to shoot it.

Heck, unless its changed since last hunting season, around here a hunter can shoot a dog out in the woods if he sees it running deer.


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