# Is this normal procedure?



## mom23sweetgirlies (Jan 5, 2009)

A breeder I contacted told me that they don't have any stock coat pups in my price range, but they would sell me a long coat or a pup with an testicle that hadn't dropped yet for my price. I was just wondering if this is common, seems like it would be. 
Also what is the effects from having a testicle that doesn't descend? My sister's boxer had that happen and the vet recommended surgery to find the testicle and neuter the pup A.S.A.P. to prevent cancer. I was definitely going to get the dog neutered but I wasn't planning on doing it until around 2 or so because I heard it was better for them. What is an idea of the costs involved in such a surgery? Just curious, thanks!


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## GunnerJones (Jul 30, 2005)

shop elsewhere


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## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

It's common to discount long coated pups and pups with one or two undescended testicles. You can still neuter your dog around two, it'll just be a more invasive surgery (I think more like a spay). You don't need to neuter ASAP as in "the second you get your pup home." I think it only gets cancerous if it stays in the body for most of the dog's life. 

I would not "shop elsewhere" if the breeder otherwise was just fine. Coats and retained testicles just happen; the dog shouldn't be bred, but it still needs a good home. If the parents have been thoroughly health tested/cleared and have undergone training and titling to determine that they are sound, true GSDs worthy of being bred, I'd take a pup like this. It's a great way to get lines that you like but for a better price.


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

It's very common for breeders to discount dogs with breed faults such as long coat or undescended testicles. Particularly amongst show line breeders, which is what I'm guessing your looking at based on what sounds like a rather high price for a standard pup.

On the testicle, it depends on whether he is a cryptorchid (retained testicle) or monorchid (only has 1). If there is a retained testicle, yes it should be removed via surgery. And I do agree with you on waiting for the dog to mature before neutering. So the options there are leave it in until he's mature and you neuter, or do 2 surgeries, one to remove the retained testicle and another later to complete the neuter and remove the other one. I've heard different opinions on the actual risk factors involved in leaving it in until the dog has matured so that would be something to discuss with a vet and perhaps post in the health forum asking advice from people who have experienced dogs with retained testicles. 

It WILL be more expensive to neuter him with the retained testicle. And of course the 2 surgery option would be even more expensive. How much more expensive varies widely from vet to vet, so that's another something you'd have to ask the vets in your area about.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

I think that is pretty normal procedure. Reputable breeders will often discount pups with "faults" like a long coat or an undescended testicle.

I know someone who has a pup with an undescended testicle, and he was quoted $2000 for the operation. This seems ridiculously high to me. It only cost me about 200$ to get my big girl spayed, and I have heard that removing a retained testicle is about the same complexity as a spay. But I really don't know. I'm sure there are people on the board who could tell you what is reasonable.

There is a greater risk for testicular cancer in the retained testicle, but there is no need to have it removed ASAP waiting until the pup is two years old won't make any difference, and that is what the person I know will be doing with his pup.


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## mom23sweetgirlies (Jan 5, 2009)

I figured it was a pretty common thing to do and the breeder actually came very highly recommended. I'll have to call the local vet and see how much a surgery would cost. The breeder doesn't actually know if any of the pups have this problem yet or not, they are only 3 weeks old. It was just something for me to think about in case one of the standard coat pups has this issue. Thanks for your replies!


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## RebelGSD (Mar 20, 2008)

I asked vets how common it is that the undescended testicle is cancerous. They could not give me stats. In humans it may be 2% higher percentage for the undecended testicle to turn cancerous than the descended one - obviously it is a very small difference. I paid $350 for the surgery for the undescended testicle, another vet charges $150 extra. I think that $2000 is a ripoff.


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## GunnerJones (Jul 30, 2005)

That is one of the reasons I suggested shopping elsewhere, if I wanted to deal with a dog that issues of whatever, I'd go to a rescue, if I'm laying out a grand or better I want Rin freaking TinTin not a "second"


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: MaxGunnarThat is one of the reasons I suggested shopping elsewhere, if I wanted to deal with a dog that issues of whatever, I'd go to a rescue, if I'm laying out a grand or better I want Rin freaking TinTin not a "second"


What "issues"? You don't need testicles if it's not a stud dog, and there are plenty of people that prefer coated dogs. The coat does not affect temperament or training.

I think it is common and acceptable. The only thing is the neuter could cost more but it sounds like the OP is already aware of this.


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## jimmym1981 (Dec 5, 2008)

i agree. Almost every breeder I know of discount coated pups and testicales also. I wouldnt run from that. If its a reputable breeder and you feel good about it, go for it.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Ditto - if and when I have a monorchid, (knock on wood,none yet!) he would be discounted. Coats, only in one litter, were discounted and all went to super pet homes who had no problem with the coat. 

But paying 2000 for a coat is a bit ludicrious as you can get a stock coated pup for that from many many many breeders.

Lee


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## rokanhaus (Mar 20, 2006)

Coats I also discount, although coat type does not keep them from working by any means. Testicles, yeah, in 8 litters only had that issue once, naughty puppy sucked back up after he was shipped and I and the owner confirmed it was there..oh well, "was" there, so I simply refunded her a portion of the sale price.

I would be a bit leery as she made it sound like, going by your words, that she had these issues ALL the time. Coats I often have, because I don't have a problem getting a couple in a litter, although I don't purposely set out to produce them. I simply don't discount a good mating simply because I might get a couple if in every other way the match seems ideal.

But testicle issues, overbites, etc...to have these crop up enough to have them readily available to supply the "discounted puppy" demand...yikes!


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

$2000 is a ripoff for a monorchid neuter. Rocky was monorchid and his neuter cost me right around $250. . . this was back in 2003. Prices may have gone up since then, but not by that much.


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## mom23sweetgirlies (Jan 5, 2009)

I didn't mean to make it sound like she has these type of pups readily available, I'm pretty certain she doesn't. I think she mentioned the long coats being that price because her current litter does have a few. As far as the undescended testicle goes she said IF she had a pup like that she would sale it for the same as a long coat. I think the long coats are beautiful but it rains all the time here so I want a stock coat, but not for any more than $1,000


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## sprzybyl (May 15, 2008)

There are different types of long coats. I paid less for riley because she was older and was a bit coated. I say she is a "bit" coated because all of her fur isn't long- just behind her ears, her "pants" and along her belly. So don't necessarily think long coat is bad because of the rain!!


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: sprzybylThere are different types of long coats. I paid less for riley because she was older and was a bit coated. I say she is a "bit" coated because all of her fur isn't long- just behind her ears, her "pants" and along her belly. So don't necessarily think long coat is bad because of the rain!!


Unfortunately when dealing with a baby puppy, you have NO WAY of knowing if they will have a HUGE coat or be a "bit" coated. I have had 3 long stock coats, they all "seemed" the same as far as coat thickness and length at 8 weeks, but they all had very different coats as adults.


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