# OMG, what a night!



## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

OK, first I need to laugh. After raising 4 daughters, this has to be the most challenging 

Guess who didn't like her crate all night?

OMG, crying ALL NIGHT!!! 

We wrapped up the family about 11pm. Kids went to bed, pup went in her crate, and our Maltese was in her bed too 

As soon as we hit the bed, the howling and crying started. We refused to give in to her.
At about 2:30, we noticed a change in her cry, came down and took her out back. She pooped and peed.

We took her back in, put her back in her crate. She started crying again.

It's now 6:30am, here I am, and she's sitting at my feet, sleeping like a baby.

Where do I go from here? I'm exhausted, I need to go to work, and couldn't survive another night like that.


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

Very much like having a new baby in the house. Where do you have the crate?


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

I dunno. I remember a little whining and crying but mine were pretty conditioned to a crate when I got them...

Does she have a blanket from home with familiar scent on it?

When I was a kid we used to very carefully wrap up a clock (hahaha find one of those now) in an old towel and the puppy curled up against that.

Definitely remember waking up every few hours for awhile.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

The crate is in our family room, off the kitchen. 
Our bedrooms are upstairs.

No, we do not have a blanket from her breeder.

She was howling. LOL.


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## bianca (Mar 28, 2010)

Molly screamed like a banshee for the first 3 nights....and I didn't know this forum existed then!

I am sure more knowledgeable people will chime in but I have read to try the crate in your room so they don't feel so isolated...that whole part about being taken away from all they know into a brand new environment.

Wishing you all the best


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Yes, I read that putting the crate in the BR could help. However, this is something I'm trying to avoid. I want her to know HER space, and give us ours.

If I were to bring her upstairs, and let's assume she does stop.... would it be a challenge to get her back downstairs?
I really don't want her upstairs in our bedroom.


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## bianca (Mar 28, 2010)

Eeek sorry now you really will have to wait for others 

I had Molly's crate at the other end of the house until she was 1 and a bit (literally NO room in our BR), but now she has free rein and sleeps in our room if she chooses.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Dunno

I always put the puppy crate in the bedroom right next to the bed.

Never had any problem making a transition later. The crate is the crate no matter where.

(I get snuffly if they sleep in the bedroom)


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

The reason we would prefer her not to be in the BR, is because we started that with our Maltese, and now we can't get rid of her 
She refuses to be anywhere else, and as much as we love her, her squirming, and walking on our bed could be annoying to a light sleeper.

I can't imagine having both dogs eventually in our bed.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

I never slept with my dogs. (though plenty do)......... What does putting a puppy in a crate in your bedroom have to do with the puppy sleeping in bed? Or even being in your bedroom indefinitely? Even when I travel I carry a crate and the dogs are comfortable ANYWHERE we go in their home away from home.

It is, of course, your choice but I guess you should invest in earplugs for everyone........


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

Anthony8858 said:


> OK, first I need to laugh. After raising 4 daughters, this has to be the most challenging
> 
> Guess who didn't like her crate all night?
> 
> ...


Has I know the feeling. We got our girl sat and she also doesnt like the crate, but yesterday was so much better. What worked with us were some chew toys and we are trying to make it a positive experience with treats. Last night I also put one of my old pyjama shirts in her crate so it had our scent


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## stacey_eight (Sep 20, 2010)

I kept the crate right next to the bed. In my half-sleep I could put my fingers through the crate and confort him, and it made it easier to grab a leash (kept on my nightstand) and take him out a few times in the night. He transitioned to the kitchen area easily when he was older and now is loose in the house. He sleeps next to my bed or in the front hallway. Having the dog on the bed is a whole seperate issue. If you don't allow the dog on the bed, she won't be on the bed.


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

She is a baby, she just got taken away from her mom and siblings, she's in a new place and she's scared.

Both of my dogs were/are crated in my bedroom and they both slept through the night.

I would definitly crate her in your room.

As for the pottying. I know some people dont agree with me but I take water away 1-2 hours before bed. Depending on your pups age, you might need to set an alarm for every 2 hours to take her out to potty until she gets a bit older. 

I got both of my pups when they were 11 weeks old, I only set my alarm to wake me up every 2 hours for about 4-7 days and then they were able to sleep through the night with no accidents.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I agree with trying the crate in your bedroom..what can I say? I have flunked night time crate training 101 with the majority of my dogs then puppies..

They usually end up in bed with me, and sleep like logs without a peep

Masi was the only one I crated in my bedroom because at the time I had a senior dog, didn't want her bugging him all nite...first few nites didn't go well, even tho she was right next to the bed, but after that, no problems,,finally as she got a little older and I was confident she wouldn't bug my senior dog, I just let her stay out of the crate.

And also what can I say? my dogs do sleep on the bed with me, I have aking size bed, the 'girlz' sleep with me, the boy on the floor, oh and the cats are usually on the bed to, nice and cozy) sometimes not


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

jocoyn said:


> I never slept with my dogs. (though plenty do)......... What does putting a puppy in a crate in your bedroom have to do with the puppy sleeping in bed? Or even being in your bedroom indefinitely? Even when I travel I carry a crate and the dogs are comfortable ANYWHERE we go in their home away from home.
> 
> It is, of course, your choice but I guess you should invest in earplugs for everyone........


I feel that introducing her to our BR, would be the first step towards her wanting to be in our bed too.

I do understand that the dogs will eventually get comfortable in their crates, but my immediate concern, is to get her comfortable inner crate at night.

Right now, she associates her crate with removal from where she would prefer to be, as opposed to feeling secure, or safe.
She likes her freedom.


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

I just wanted to add that I do not let the dogs sleep in bed with me, they do sleep in my room but they have their own beds, the puppy is in her crate and my 2.5 year old has a doggy bed on the floor. He is too big to sleep with me.

If you dont allow them on furniture and teach them not to be on it, then they wont jump onto your bed.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

and these dogs are velcro dogs, so they don't like to be separated from their humans, and yep get kinda vocal about it ..

I'd try leaving a radio on low , maybe get her something she can chew on, that is ok if she's alone with it. 

Work on crating her for short periods of time during the day,,but gotta say, MINE anyhow when puppies, if I crated them during the day and still hung out in the house, they would also get pretty peeved...so crate , go outside for 5 minutes or so.

this will pass, but right now, she's a big baby who doesn't want to be alone

I also FED my puppies in their crate, to get them to associate the crate with good things..


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

OK, I'll try the crate in the BR tonight.

I wouldn't have a problem if she eventually slept in our BR, at the foot of the bed.
Years ago, my GSD was a PIA... He used to wait until I fell asleep, and would tip toe and every so sneakily, creep up to the foot of the bed, and climb into bed with me.
He used to drive me nuts. 
If I locked the BR door, he used to moan and scratch the door to come in.

So I guess you could say that I'm trying to avoid that scenario again.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

JakodaCD OA said:


> and these dogs are velcro dogs, so they don't like to be separated from their humans, and yep get kinda vocal about it ..
> 
> I'd try leaving a radio on low , maybe get her something she can chew on, that is ok if she's alone with it.
> 
> ...



She loves her crate at other times. If the door is left open, she'll go in there and hang out. She does eat in there, and I make it my business to put her chew toys in there. She gets them one at a time, and plays with them when she wants to.

It's the "closed door" that freaks her out.


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Teach her not to go on furniture and she wont.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

LaRen616 said:


> Teach her not to go on furniture and she wont.


Understood.


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## Stosh (Jun 26, 2010)

I kept Stosh in a crate by the bed for the first 3 weeks then moved the crate out to the kitchen area. He's not allowed on carpeting or furniture and has never made any attempt to go back in the bedroom. Make sure you get the puppy out a few times during the night until she can hold it all night. Good luck!!


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## Sigurd's Mom (May 12, 2009)

Sigurd's crate was in our bedroom until he could be trusted not to destroy the house. Now the crate is in the living room and he usually prefers to sleep in the crate, not our bedroom. I took his water away when he was crate training about 2 hours before bed. Not once did we have an accident. Sigurd is not allowed on our bed either, and he knows this by training. He sleeps on a bed in our room, or he goes down to his crate in the living room.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Anthony8858 said:


> I feel that introducing her to our BR, would be the first step towards her wanting to be in our bed too.


Not necessarily. Keefer has never been a "bed dog". He'll jump up there if I tell him to, and he'll go up there if he's chasing Halo around during play, but other than that he has no interest. He just never has. Halo IS a bed dog, but she's perfectly happy in her crate at night. But the first thing she does when I let her out in the morning is jump on the bed and roll around. 



> I do understand that the dogs will eventually get comfortable in their crates, but my immediate concern, is to get her comfortable inner crate at night.
> 
> *Right now, she associates her crate with removal from where she would prefer to be, as opposed to feeling secure, or safe*.


This is exactly why you should try having the crate in your bedroom. She wants to be with her pack, and if she's with all of you she will feel safe and secure and the crate won't be the thing that takes her away from that. 

If there's room to keep a crate there permanently you can eventually buy one that's nice looking and she can learn to sleep there, even with the door open. Cassidy loved her crate so much that we didn't want to take it away, even though I would have loved to get it out of our bedroom. But we didn't need to close the door at night so we just removed it, and the crate was her den, her special place to hang out.


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## nitemares (Dec 15, 2005)

How about you sleep in the living room, if you dont want puppy to sleep in the bedroom, just for a couple of nights. that's what i did. No animals are allowed in the bedroom (husband rule, not mine  )


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## Sunstreaked (Oct 26, 2010)

We wouldn't have minded Eva sleeping with us at all (California king bed!), but as she grew older, she would come up for a snuggle and then off the bed onto the floor (or her bed) for sleep. She will come at times during the night, and always in the morning, but that's ok for us. 

She was only 6 weeks old when we got her and we put a plastic sheet over our mattress and she slept with us starting the very first night. Never an accident and we did get up every few hours for a few days. 

Everyone has their own rules, of course, but these dogs want to be thisclose to us. 

Maybe see how she does with the crate in the room where she's with you. Her entire world has just changed, so be patient  and give her a chance to adjust.

Congratulations on your new pup!


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Loads of GREAT advice here, and ALL from experience.. Thanks.

I'll allow her to sleep in her crate,... in our BR tonight. 


The "be with her pack" analogy makes perfect sense.


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## dosovm (May 1, 2011)

GSD's have a very thick skin and that is hard to understand for most owners.
I see them as United States Marine Corps grunts who love to sleep in the field, tired, dirty, hungry, and miserable; walking for days on end with 100 lb packs. That is when we were the happiest. You get us back on base to sit around and we started trouble buy getting to drunk and repelling off of our bedroom windows and getting into fights. You want a happy GSD, you need to treat them as a GSD. In my personal opinion, which might not be right because i associate everything to the military, GSD are warriors and are happiest when they have rules and guidelines and most importantly great leaders that they can follow and respect. so pretty much what i'm saying is dont let him on the bed, and he will not get on the bed that is if you are a leader in your pack.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

dosovm said:


> GSD's have a very thick skin and that is hard to understand for most owners.
> I see them as United States Marine Corps grunts who love to sleep in the field, tired, dirty, hungry, and miserable; walking for days on end with 100 lb packs. That is when we were the happiest. You get us back on base to sit around and we started trouble buy getting to drunk and repelling off of our bedroom windows and getting into fights. You want a happy GSD, you need to treat them as a GSD. In my personal opinion, which might not be right because i associate everything to the military, GSD are warriors and are happiest when they have rules and guidelines and most importantly great leaders that they can follow and respect. so pretty much what i'm saying is dont let him on the bed, and he will not get on the bed that is if you are a leader in your pack.


 
She will NOT be on my bed. I can assure that.

She WILL be in her crate. next to the bed, until she "gets it". Then I'll work her way back downstairs.


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## sweetdude (Sep 16, 2011)

Congratulations with the new arrival in you're family.

My pup is 8 weeks old, and sleeping in his crate peacefully. We all sleep upstairs he's in the kitchen. First 2 nights he was crying and whining not giving anyone any sleep, this is what I done.

First 2 nights I slept downstairs with him and when ever he cried I let him outside to do his business (no playtime) after waking up every 2 hours crying ingot literally only 3 hours sleep first night.

But second night was better I placed a couple of my old clothes and only let him out at 10pm, 1am and 5am, now he is used to these times and I can finally sleep in my own bedroom, just get a structured time schedule when to let him out and hopefully she will get used to it.

Hope this helps I got my pup 6 dAys ago


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Night 2:

Last night she was OK.... Until she cried about 2am. I woke up, took her for a pee, put her back in her crate, then she cried the rest of the night.

Oh well... The weekend is almost here, and I usually stay up all night anyway


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## UConnGSD (May 19, 2008)

I remember when Wolfie cried in the beginning, I would stick my hand in the crate, so he could sniff it. It helped comfort him and he did quiet down after that. Plus, he could sit up and see us anytime he wanted, so that probably helped too.


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## DanielleOttoMom (May 11, 2010)

I had the same problem with Otto when I brought him home. He too screamed in cryed all night even when I put him in my room. It was like having a colicy baby (no sleep). Crate training is really beneficial in the long run so don't give up . Try a blanet over her crate.... I know this is silly but they have a heart beat bear that might be soothing to her. It would be what she is use too hearing when she was with her mother. I highly suggest leaving it out side her crate. You can order it online for about $25.00. Might be worth a try? It took Otto about a 10 days to finally be ok with sleeping in his crate (was in our room). I did wake him about every 2 hrs to go potty. I didn't talk to him just out side to potty and back in his crate. Now Otto sleeps on the floor in our room each night. Then crated while I'm at work for 6 hrs. Good luck with your little girl. Keep us posted. 

Oh yeah I forgot to tell you... Try and not let her have a nap before bed time. Play, Play, Play. This will help her sleep well. It's fun for her and you too.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

She's much better.

Right now, she's sleeping in her crate. I just left the house, and snuck back into the basement  

Yesterday, she cried all afternoon too.

Last night wasn't so bad. She was good until pee time. It was a half night. I think she'll be fine.

Tonight, I'll run her for a while, and try to knock her out.


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## Holmeshx2 (Apr 25, 2010)

just curious are you working on crate training during the day? If you are just putting her in when you leave or go to bed of course she's mad it means shes stuck for a period of time all alone. Make sure all of her meals are fed in the crate if she's food motivated and loves her meals have her run in her crate put the food in shut the door. When she's done open the door let her back out then as she gets used to it make her wait for a little while after the meal before opening the crate. Have her go in her crate shut the door open it and give her a treat but only open it once she is quiet and calm. It makes her crate a great place and she learns that the door shut isn't the end of the world she gets nothing from throwing a temper tantrum and that the crate is a good thing. Make sure when you are home that she gets short naps in her crate to help prevent seperation anxiety as she gets older.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Holmeshx2 said:


> just curious are you working on crate training during the day? If you are just putting her in when you leave or go to bed of course she's mad it means shes stuck for a period of time all alone. Make sure all of her meals are fed in the crate if she's food motivated and loves her meals have her run in her crate put the food in shut the door. When she's done open the door let her back out then as she gets used to it make her wait for a little while after the meal before opening the crate. Have her go in her crate shut the door open it and give her a treat but only open it once she is quiet and calm. It makes her crate a great place and she learns that the door shut isn't the end of the world she gets nothing from throwing a temper tantrum and that the crate is a good thing. Make sure when you are home that she gets short naps in her crate to help prevent seperation anxiety as she gets older.


She made the connection that going in the crate, means locking it.
So her food motivation is gone at the moment. She knows that going to get her food means staying there. I left her door open, and wouldn't even touch her food this morning.

I have her on a "crate schedule" as follows:

My wife works from 8am to 3pm.
I workd from 10-5
My teenage daughter gets home from school at 12 noon.

Keeping that in mind, Kira is in her crate from 10-12 noon. Then my daughter takes her out to pee and play. She feeds her her afternnoon meal in her crate at 1pm.
Kira (for the most part) is free until evening, with some timeouts in her crate throughout the day to allow homework for my children, without distractions.

I'd say she spends no more than 3 hours in her crate per day. Of course, not counting evening hours.


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## CarrieJ (Feb 22, 2011)

If that's the girl in your profile pic, she's very cute.
Keep on keeping on as they say. Sorry, I popped in late to this but can offer this mantra to chant.

If I'm not causing you harm....Too Bad.
GSDs are kings and queens of the overly dramatic.


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

Holmeshx2 said:


> just curious are you working on crate training during the day? If you are just putting her in when you leave or go to bed of course she's mad it means shes stuck for a period of time all alone. Make sure all of her meals are fed in the crate if she's food motivated and loves her meals have her run in her crate put the food in shut the door. When she's done open the door let her back out then as she gets used to it make her wait for a little while after the meal before opening the crate. Have her go in her crate shut the door open it and give her a treat but only open it once she is quiet and calm. It makes her crate a great place and she learns that the door shut isn't the end of the world she gets nothing from throwing a temper tantrum and that the crate is a good thing. Make sure when you are home that she gets short naps in her crate to help prevent seperation anxiety as she gets older.


Love this thread. Im going to try feeding isis in the crate for dinner today. May help.


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

Anthony didnt want to start a new thread so if its ok im going to ask a question in here as well. 
Isis has only been home since saturday, and im not sure what to do about our situation. Hubby is on shift work, and comes home at 3 am, then other weeks 6 am. When isis hears him she hollers. We have her crate on the main floors near the kitchen. The bedroom is not an option as hubby needs his sleep for work and if I need to leave her in her crate she will cry and wake him. We have decided to ignore her cries when he comes home, but yesterday was so bad that hubby moved her and her crate to the basement. I gave him crap for that one. Anyways should we be ignoring these cries or should hubby take her out to pee and than keep her up until he is going back to bed, than crate her again? And at what age can they hold in there pee for at least 6to8 hrs? Isis soaks her crate at night even if we take her water away and make sure shes let everything out. Today I went out for three hrs and when I came home her crate was wet again.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

GSD84 said:


> Anthony didnt want to start a new thread so if its ok im going to ask a question in here as well.
> Isis has only been home since saturday, and im not sure what to do about our situation. Hubby is on shift work, and comes home at 3 am, then other weeks 6 am. When isis hears him she hollers. We have her crate on the main floors near the kitchen. The bedroom is not an option as hubby needs his sleep for work and if I need to leave her in her crate she will cry and wake him. We have decided to ignore her cries when he comes home, but yesterday was so bad that hubby moved her and her crate to the basement. I gave him crap for that one. Anyways should we be ignoring these cries or should hubby take her out to pee and than keep her up until he is going back to bed, than crate her again? And at what age can they hold in there pee for at least 6to8 hrs? Isis soaks her crate at night even if we take her water away and make sure shes let everything out. Today I went out for three hrs and when I came home her crate was wet again.


 
First keep in mind that there's an abundnace of experience here on this forum, but since you're asking me, I'll do my best to answer.

IMHO, I feel that the dogs should get used to being alone. I would have no problem putting her into the basement.. THEN, the soft side tells me that keeping her near me (as I would a child), can do no harm. 

You need to realize that Isis probably cries because there's a good chance she has to pee at 3am.

From what I understand, a pup can hold their pee for their age (in months, converted to hours), + 1 hour.
So a 2 month pup probably needs to pee every 3 hours.

My breeder suggested that we take her out to pee during the night, put her back in her crate, and attempt to go back to sleep. He suggested keeping her wherever we need her to be, kitchen, etc... 

Since hubby is on shift work, why don't you take on the chore?
Can you spend some time getting close to her, so she doesn't feel the loss of his presence?


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Anthony8858 said:


> IMHO, I feel that the dogs should get used to being alone.





Anthony8858 said:


> THEN, the soft side tells me that keeping her near me (as I would a child), can do no harm.


I agree with both these statements, and I don't think they're mutually exclusive. I do - always have and always will, have my dogs sleep in our bedroom at night (in crates, not on the bed), and I think that especially with a new puppy, it helps with the bonding experience and makes it easier for them to settle into a new home. Lots of big changes for a puppy, being away from their mom and littermates and everything that's familiar to them up to that point in their life, so minimizing that as much as possible can only be a good thing as far as I'm concerned. Imagine what a traumatic adjustment they're having to make, why not make it as easy as you can? 

BUT, you definitely do need to teach a puppy that it's okay to be alone too! I do that by crating for naps during the day (I cover the crate and close the bedroom door so it's less obvious that I'm there and puppy is missing out on anything) and using the garage pen, which is where the dogs go when we're not home. Not only have I never had a dog with separation anxiety, when I go to leave for work in the morning, my dogs RUN to the door to the garage and then into the pen. They each sit for their biscuit, which they get every single time we leave them at home when we go somewhere, even at 6 years old and nearly 3 years old. And when I close the door and walk away, nobody ever fusses.


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

Anthony8858 said:


> First keep in mind that there's an abundnace of experience here on this forum, but since you're asking me, I'll do my best to answer.
> 
> IMHO, I feel that the dogs should get used to being alone. I would have no problem putting her into the basement.. THEN, the soft side tells me that keeping her near me (as I would a child), can do no harm.
> 
> ...


Well im a stay at home mom, so isis is always with me. But since he comes home at those times on specific weeks im wondering if he shouldnt be ignoring the cries and just take her out and than let her sit with him till he goes to bed, than crate her again, or would that confuse her. We are pretty busy so I also dont keep a consistant bedtime with her, since I want her to get used to our schedule.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

GSD84, I think if you want your puppy to eventually sleep through the night no matter what's going on, you need to start working on that from the very beginning by setting a schedule and sticking to it. She's too young to be able to hold it all night so definitely take her out for a potty break, but rather than having your husband keep her up for awhile afterwards I think it would be better to put her right back in her crate. 

Some pups can hold it all night long from a very young age, others can't. Dena only got me up twice from 9 weeks old on, Halo got me up at least once a night and sometimes twice, for a couple of weeks. The more you allow your pup to pee in her crate, the harder it will be to teach her not to. Err on the side of too frequent potty breaks than too few.


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> GSD84, I think if you want your puppy to eventually sleep through the night no matter what's going on, you need to start working on that from the very beginning by setting a schedule and sticking to it. She's too young to be able to hold it all night so definitely take her out for a potty break, but rather than having your husband keep her up for awhile afterwards I think it would be better to put her right back in her crate.
> 
> Some pups can hold it all night long from a very young age, others can't. Dena only got me up twice from 9 weeks old on, Halo got me up at least once a night and sometimes twice, for a couple of weeks. The more you allow your pup to pee in her crate, the harder it will be to teach her not to. Err on the side of too frequent potty breaks than too few.


Thanks. I'm going to remember that last sentence!


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## Pattycakes (Sep 8, 2010)

I definitely agree with keeping the crate in your bedroom, especially for the first month or so. GSD's love being with their family and it helps them settle in easier. I know with my puppy, I kept her in the bedroom for a couple of months, then I moved her to the living room at night. During the day while I was at work, I kept her in a crate in the family room. Definitely exercise/play with her before bedtime so she will be tired....it does help.  

As for not having your dog sleep in bed with you...I agree with the others...teach her not too. My dog isn't allowed on the bed at all. But she can sleep on the couch or recliner in the family room. But most nights she will sleep in my room on the floor and then later move to the family room.


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

Lots of really good advice here. I just wanted to add that the "stick a finger in the crate" advice did not work for me. I nearly lost a finger. Kopper too "landshark" to a whole new level.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Well.... my insistence to keep her in the kitchen isn't working. I had another night from h*ll last night. 3 nights without sleep, and I'm wiped out.

Last night, she actually went into her crate at about 11pm (on her own), and went to sleep. i closed the door behind her, and went to bed.
At 2:30, she had to go out, and let me know. She did her potty, but cried her guts out the rest of the night.
Tonight, i may have no choice, but to bring her upstairs. I have to take off from work today, because of exhaustion.


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

I dont understand why you are so against having her in your room? 

I do not live in a good neighborhood, both my dog and my puppy sleep in my room with the door shut. Nothing makes me feel more safe then knowing that Sinister is laying next to my bed. As soon as Sinister hears something he will let me know.

Maybe I am paranoid because I live alone but I wouldn't be able to sleep if he wasn't in the room with me.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

LaRen616 said:


> I dont understand why you are so against having her in your room?
> 
> I do not live in a good neighborhood, both my dog and my puppy sleep in my room with the door shut. Nothing makes me feel more safe then knowing that Sinister is laying next to my bed. As soon as Sinister hears something he will let me know.
> 
> Maybe I am paranoid because I live alone but I wouldn't be able to sleep if he wasn't in the room with me.


It's not so much as being against it. I feel that the BR is MY space, just like my children sleep in their rooms, I'm treating the pup as I would treat my children. I feel that the pup should learn not to be clingy, and learning to be alone is a good thing. (That is just my opinion, but it may not be the right approach, I acknowledge that).

It's 8am, she just had a nice walk, played with the kids, went into her crate, and went to sleep.

The nights are OK, until she does that 2am pee. It's afterwards, she freaks.

I commend her for waking us up at potty time. I guess we can't have the best of both worlds yet.


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Anthony8858 said:


> It's not so much as being against it. I feel that the BR is MY space, just like my children sleep in their rooms, I'm treating the pup as I would treat my children. I feel that the pup should learn not to be clingy, and learning to be alone is a good thing. (That is just my opinion, but it may not be the right approach, I acknowledge that).


I understand that, GSDs are velcro dogs though, they want to be where you are at all times, when you move they move, where you go they go, where you sleep they want to sleep. 

It's what the breed does, when you decided to get a GSD you gave up your freedom to move about your house on your own. You will find that you wont be able to go to the bathroom by yourself.

She just got taken away from her home with her mom and siblings, she's freaked out and she wants to be with you. 

Better get used to it.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

LaRen616 said:


> I understand that, GSDs are velcro dogs though, they want to be where you are at all times, when you move they move, where you go they go, where you sleep they want to sleep.
> 
> It's what the breed does, when you decided to get a GSD you gave up your freedom to move about your house on your own. You will find that you wont be able to go to the bathroom by yourself.
> 
> ...


Yes, I agree 100%.

I'll put her crate in our BR tonight, and see what happens.


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Anthony8858 said:


> Yes, I agree 100%.
> 
> I'll put her crate in our BR tonight, and see what happens.


I think she will quiet down when she's in your room with you.

The first and second night I had Malice, she cried for a little while but she got over it because my male laid beside her crate on his bed and I talked to her for a little while. 

She goes into her crate at night without a fuss, she sleeps through the night without a peep.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

The first night Singe was home, the NEIGHBORS could hear him howling. The second night, didn't last as long. The 3rd night, just a few minutes of fussing. 
Every dog is different of course and some will settle in faster than others.

For the pottying in the crate, you are going to have to get her on a schedule and stick with it. Avoid any future accidents in the crate at all costs. She has learned that she can potty where she sleeps and it can become a habit. 

As for waking up at 2am and then not wanting to go back to bed... How is it handled? Since she is in another room, downstairs, I bet it's a big production, right?? She has to whine and whine until you hear her and wake up. Then you've got to turn on lights to get through the house. And then find your shoes. And then a leash. So, by the time she has done her business, she's wide awake.

Keep it low-key. Use a covered/dimmed flashlight or put some small children's nightlights along your path until she's sleeping through the night. When she starts to first, just calmly gather her up (I always kept the leash beside/on the crate) and go to the door. Slip on your shoes (crocs or flip flops are awesome) and take her out to do her business. Tell her she's a good girl (still lowkey) and then quietly walk back in and put her in the crate. She might fuss a bit, but just calmly say "no. go to sleep" and she will quickly get the idea that it's time to go back to bed.

Same concept as when you're kids were babies and needed a 3am feeding  Dark, calm and quiet and they'll fall back to sleep.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Dainerra said:


> The first night Singe was home, the NEIGHBORS could hear him howling. The second night, didn't last as long. The 3rd night, just a few minutes of fussing.
> Every dog is different of course and some will settle in faster than others.
> 
> *For the pottying in the crate, you are going to have to get her on a schedule and stick with it. Avoid any future accidents in the crate at all costs. She has learned that she can potty where she sleeps and it can become a habit. *
> ...


 
She doesn't do her business in her crate, she cries when she has to go, and waits for me to get her. I then, quiety remove her, put on her leash, and walk her into the yard. She immediately does her thing, then I quietly put her back inher crate.

AS SOON AS MY HEAD HITS THE PILLOW, SHE STARTS HOWLING!!! lol :wild:


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

For her confined time can you give her a stuffed kong? It may distract her and get her past the howling when the door is shut. Only give it to her when the door is shut? Something special?


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Two words: ear plugs. 

I understand your wanting her to be okay alone and not clingy, but the thing is, not having her in your bedroom at night is making it hard on YOU, and I don't think it's doing anything at all towards your end goal. 

As I said before, my dogs have always slept in my bedroom but have absolutely no problem being left alone. As as far as clinginess - she's either going to be that way or not, and there's probably not a lot you could do to influence that one way or the other. When I'm home Keefer is always within sight of me. Or I guess I should say that *I'M* always in sight of him! He doesn't freak out when I'm gone, but when I'm here he seems to think it's his life mission to keep an eye on me. That's just his nature - if I leave a room he gets up and follows. Halo is cuddly and affectionate, but she's more independent, and doesn't need to always be in the same room as us, she'll go nap in her crate or slump in her favorite corner in the entry by the front door. That's HER nature. 

Puppies are hard enough, and I'm totally with you on the lack of sleep, for me that's the worst part of puppyhood. So if I can do anything to make it easier for the pup to settle down and sleep, I am all for that! And honestly, I have never seen any negative behaviors arise from having my dogs in the same room as me at night and I can't even imagine not having a puppy right next to the bed, where I can hear them stir at night if they need to go outside (yes, even wearing ear plugs).


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## Pattycakes (Sep 8, 2010)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> I understand your wanting her to be okay alone and not clingy, but the thing is, not having her in your bedroom at night is making it hard on YOU, and I don't think it's doing anything at all towards your end goal.
> 
> As I said before, my dogs have always slept in my bedroom but have absolutely no problem being left alone. As as far as clinginess - she's either going to be that way or not, and there's probably not a lot you could do to influence that one way or the other. When I'm home Keefer is always within sight of me. Or I guess I should say that *I'M* always in sight of him! He doesn't freak out when I'm gone, but when I'm here he seems to think it's his life mission to keep an eye on me. That's just his nature - if I leave a room he gets up and follows. Halo is cuddly and affectionate, but she's more independent, and doesn't need to always be in the same room as us, she'll go nap in her crate or slump in her favorite corner in the entry by the front door. That's HER nature.
> 
> Puppies are hard enough, and I'm totally with you on the lack of sleep, for me that's the worst part of puppyhood. So if I can do anything to make it easier for the pup to settle down and sleep, I am all for that! And honestly, I have never seen any negative behaviors arise from having my dogs in the same room as me at night and I can't even imagine not having a puppy right next to the bed, where I can hear them stir at night if they need to go outside (yes, even wearing ear plugs).


Ditto! :thumbup:


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Ok, I've already agreed to putting her crate in the BR. I can live with that. 

I can pick up a Kong for her today, and stuff it with something good 

I see a pattern here....

She figured out that being outside the crate is better..

When the kids are home, she's out. Her usual routine is to get her chew bone, and lay on the rug, and quiety chew her bone. She didn't move for 2 hrs yesterday, while chewing on her bone. My wife cooked, cleaned, and the kids all did their homework, while she layed there.
If I didn't know that puppies do get possessed, I would have no problem throwing away her crate, and letting her roam the kitchen area.
But I know that as soon as she's alone, she'll turn our leather couch into rawhide heaven.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Anthony8858 said:


> But I know that as soon as she's alone, she'll turn our leather couch into rawide heaven.


Oh, you know it!!! :rofl:


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Just by getting to know her, I suspect that I have to put her in her crate more often than I wanted to.
I say this because she's getting used to sleeping, playing, and roaming outside her crate at will.
I really don't want her taking naps outside the crate, so I instructed my kids to put her in her crate as soon as she flops down somewhere to nap.

They could walk her, play her, and let her play with our other dog. When she's tired and wants to nap, I feel that's a perfect opportunity to crate her.

Problem is... My kids love to snuggle with her on the floor 

You know ... any day now, I'll be labeled the "bad daddy" that won't let his kids play with the puppy.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Puppies need a lot of sleep. Putting her away in her crate when she's ready for a nap is perfect. When I did that I covered it so Halo couldn't see out, and I'd close the door so she couldn't hear what was going on in the rest of the house. We have speakers throughout the house, which helped too. 

There's plenty of time for your kids to play and snuggle with her when she's not tired and ready for a nap, and actually right before you put her to bed at night is the perfect time for them to wear her out! Just explain to the kids that she gets tired just like they do, and she needs a break.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Puppies need a lot of sleep. Putting her away in her crate when she's ready for a nap is perfect. When I did that I covered it so Halo couldn't see out, and I'd close the door so she couldn't hear what was going on in the rest of the house. We have speakers throughout the house, which helped too.
> 
> There's plenty of time for your kids to play and snuggle with her when she's not tired and ready for a nap, and actually right before you put her to bed at night is the perfect time for them to wear her out! Just explain to the kids that she gets tired just like they do, and she needs a break.


 
That's a great idea. I'll cover the crate while she naps.

Now I need to obedience train my kids :crazy:


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

UPDATE!!!

What a brat!!! That's all I can say.

Chronological order of events:

10pm: I decide to outsmart the fox by taking her for a long walk.
11pm: Kira can't be bothered. Comes home, flops down and tries to nap at my feet. I gently show her the crate, and she goes in without hesitation.
2am: Kira starts squirming in her crate... It's pee time.
2:10 back in crate, out like a light. Peaceful.
** I sit in the family room, and make sure she's conked out.**
2:30am: I tiptoe upstairs to bed.
2:45am: The HOWLING begins!!! LOL

I go downstairs, and wait until she calms down. After she calms down, I remove her from the crate, and bring the crate into the BR. My wife brings Kira upstairs, and puts her in the crate by 3am.
Didn't hear a peep the rest of the night 

8am, I had to wake her, because I was going downstairs, and I wanted her on a schedule.

Verdict: The little brat wants to be with us at night.

KUDOS to all those that had her figured out.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

keep crate training. don't give in to the cries of the night.
it won't take long for her to settle down at night. how
often do you take her out over night???


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

doggiedad said:


> keep crate training. don't give in to the cries of the night.
> it won't take long for her to settle down at night. how
> often do you take her out over night???


I'm not allowing her to nap outside the crate. Whenever I see that she wants to nap, I walk her to her crate.
I'm hoping that sooner or later, she'll associate resting and her crate.

As far as going out at night, ... She gets a walk at 10pm, and then again at about 2:30am. (she wakes us up).
Then she's good until morning.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I feed pups in their crates too....you can put a crate in the kitchen/family room for feeding as well as the one in your room - eventually she will use either for sleeping...but really, dogs & pups really do best sleeping where you are.

Lee


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

wolfstraum said:


> I feed pups in their crates too....you can put a crate in the kitchen/family room for feeding as well as the one in your room - eventually she will use either for sleeping...but really, dogs & pups really do best sleeping where you are.
> 
> Lee


Yes, I see this.
I agree


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## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

Dante slept in my room as a pup (though he was almost 5 months old when I got him so it wasn't in a crate) and never got on the bed until I invited him up at about 2 years old.

He never gets on the bed without invitation and some nights is not invited at all. Some nights he sleeps all night on the bed, other nights he sleeps on his bed on the floor and in the really hot weather he sleeps in the hall in front of the fan.

So as others have said, dog in bedroom doesn't have to mean dog on bed
 

Congratulations on your new addition


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## Stosh (Jun 26, 2010)

I had Stosh's crate next to our bed at night for the first three or four weeks, then moved it out to the kitchen area when he was sleeping through the night. Once Kira learns that it's 'her room' you can pretty much put it anywhere and she'll be fine. I bet the kids just love snuggling with her! Have you tried putting a t-shirt you've worn in the crate with her and a stuffed toy?


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Anthony8858 said:


> Verdict: The little brat wants to be with us at night.


No kidding? Imagine that! oke: :rofl:


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

Anthony8858 said:


> Just by getting to know her, I suspect that I have to put her in her crate more often than I wanted to.
> I say this because she's getting used to sleeping, playing, and roaming outside her crate at will.
> I really don't want her taking naps outside the crate, so I instructed my kids to put her in her crate as soon as she flops down somewhere to nap.
> 
> ...


When my pup was small enough, we took naps together with him lying on my chest. I wouldn't trade those memories, or those pics, for anything. :wub:


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## JulieBays (Jun 26, 2011)

Okay, I'll come clean. :blush: I got Sasha when she was 7 weeks old. I was very concerned about her adapting so I put her in my bed the first week home. Admittedly, I stayed home that first week too and got up every hour. She never once cried. EVER. I transitioned her slowly to her crate and she was fine. At 4.5 or so months old she now sleeps out of her crate at night. During the day, while at work, she still has to be in the crate. But, at night, she now chooses to sleep on her bed next to mine. She does get up in my bed sometimes but she prefers her own. It's nice. 

Like others have said, GSD's just want to be near you. They need to be. I don't think Sasha knows what clingy is. Yes, she's a velcro dog but she's also very independent.


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## Stosh (Jun 26, 2010)

What Emoore said...now's the time to snuggle, there's plenty of time to train. She's just a baby and you'll never get back those naps on the floor with the kids. Enjoy!


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

Stosh said:


> What Emoore said...now's the time to snuggle, there's plenty of time to train. She's just a baby and you'll never get back those naps on the floor with the kids. Enjoy!


Look at what a horrible trainer I am:








I just can't help but think this kind of thing helps to strengthen the bond. Let your pup nap with the kids.


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## JulieBays (Jun 26, 2011)

Emoore said:


> Look at what a horrible trainer I am:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Exactly!! I don't understand why people think that their dogs will be untrainable if you treat them well. *Sigh* That pic is exactly what that pup needed to bond with you. Pups that have that kind of affection, grow up to be big dogs that have confidence.


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

JulieBays said:


> Exactly!! I don't understand why people think that their dogs will be untrainable if you treat them well. *Sigh* That pic is exactly what that pup needed to bond with you. Pups that have that kind of affection, grow up to be big dogs that have confidence.


In OP's defense, he's a new GSD owner who asked for advice, and he's getting a lot of differing opinions. Just like with kids, you have to know when to hold a firm line and when to "spoil" them a little. And like with kids, it's difficult to know which is which with your first. 

Also understand that when she's been napping with the kids and she wakes up, the *very first* thing she'll need to do is potty, so keep an eye open for when she starts stirring so you can whisk her out the door. If she's napping in her crate she'll hold it until you let her out, but if she's napping on a blanket with the kids you're in for a soggy blanket if you don't watch carefully.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

I'm guilty. She's crashed on my lap... as we speak


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

On this topic, hubby brought Isis into our room when he got home at 4:30 am and she slept by our bed till 8 am!! I was shocked! i am tempted to allow her to sleep in our room now just at night, outside of her crate. my only concern is will she tear our room apart if she happens to wake up ?


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

OK, I had a FULL night''s sleep. 

Kira came up about midnight. Put her in her crate, next to our bed.

Woke up at 7am for her walk.

Much needed for all of us.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

GSD84 said:


> On this topic, hubby brought Isis into our room when he got home at 4:30 am and she slept by our bed till 8 am!! I was shocked! i am tempted to allow her to sleep in our room now just at night, outside of her crate. my only concern is will she tear our room apart if she happens to wake up ?


Can you put a second crate in your bedroom? I usually have two crates for fosters (my own dogs are no longer crated), one downstairs and one in my bedroom.


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## GSD84 (Apr 27, 2011)

BowWowMeow said:


> Can you put a second crate in your bedroom? I usually have two crates for fosters (my own dogs are no longer crated), one downstairs and one in my bedroom.


i may just do that....maybe i can find a used one online.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

She's been sleeping every night in our room. We don't even know she's there.

+1 on the crate in the BR trick.


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## Stosh (Jun 26, 2010)

See how easy that was??!


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## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

That's great!


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## bianca (Mar 28, 2010)

Great to hear!


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

I also bring the crate downstairs for the daytime. She stays in there for as long as we need her be, without incident. SO far, so good.  She moans when it's potty time.

I'm also working on her "ringing a bell", when it's time to go out 

I'm placing a hanging bell of some sort near the back door, and when it's potty time, I want her to ring the bell.
Currently, she just sits there, and waits to get noticed. Sometimes, she'll scratch the back door, but I don't want to encourage that.


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## Emoore (Oct 9, 2002)

Anthony8858, I've never met you but I hate you. Every time this thread gets bumped to the top, I spend the next couple hours with that stupid Franki Valli and the Four Seasons song in my head.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Emoore said:


> Anthony8858, I've never met you but I hate you. Every time this thread gets bumped to the top, I spend the next couple hours with that stupid Franki Valli and the Four Seasons song in my head.
> 
> The Four Seasons - December, 1963 (Oh, What a Night) - YouTube


LMAO!!!

Gee thanks.
Now I'm singing it LOL


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Anthony8858 said:


> I'm also working on her "ringing a bell", when it's time to go out
> 
> I'm placing a hanging bell of some sort near the back door, and when it's potty time, I want her to ring the bell.
> Currently, she just sits there, and waits to get noticed. Sometimes, she'll scratch the back door, but I don't want to encourage that.


Cassidy used to sit and wait to be noticed too, which is why we started using a bell. Couple ways you can teach it - some people train the dog to target the bells with a nose bump. I do teach my dogs to target my hand, but I've never used targeting with the bells. I'd just walk up to the door, ring the bells and say "let's go _outside_", and then open the door. So the word outside and the sound of the bells become associated with the door opening. Eventually I could say "do you want to go outside?" and the dog will bump the bells themselves.


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## Anthony8858 (Sep 18, 2011)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> Cassidy used to sit and wait to be noticed too, which is why we started using a bell. Couple ways you can teach it - some people train the dog to target the bells with a nose bump. I do teach my dogs to target my hand, but I've never used targeting with the bells. I'd just walk up to the door, ring the bells and say "let's go _outside_", and then open the door. So the word outside and the sound of the bells become associated with the door opening. Eventually I could say "do you want to go outside?" and the dog will bump the bells themselves.


 
Thanks for the info. I was watching some Youtube, and some people actually taking the paws or nose bump, and ringing the bell with it.

I'll try your approach first.

I like this place


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## CarrieJ (Feb 22, 2011)

Emoore, I think that you're right....I knew there was something about this thread.


Anyhoo, I'm glad that the crate in the bedroom worked for you. Hooray!


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Have you seen these? Poochie-Bells, The Trusted Dog Potty Training and Housebreaking Tool

I know some people use them, although I haven't. The nice thing about these is that they're long enough to use with a puppy. Cassidy was already a year and a half or so when I got some bells, and mine are much shorter. But because she was older and scary smart she picked it up in literally, two days. I ordered my bells online, I got home from work on a Wednesday evening and started training her to use the bells. That Friday she rang them on her own for the first time. 

These are mine: 










Because they don't hang down that low, it took longer to teach Dena, Keefer, and Halo to use them as puppies. Dena at first would put her paws up on the door to ring the bells and then I had to reteach her that it was the sound of the bells, NOT jumping on the door that made it open! It didn't take that long for her to get it, but it was one additional step of training that wouldn't have been necessary if she could have reached the bells with her nose in the first place.


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