# Breeding Again!! How much is too much?



## My2shepherds (Jun 10, 2014)

I just found out one of my pups' breeders is preparing to breed her female again and wanted some opinions and some facts about frequency of breeding... 

She was bred the heat before my pup then for my litter (born March of this year) and now she is breeding again in October... 

Is this too much on the female? I have heard of back to back litters but I have always heard you should rest them for a heat before breeding again... What is the general concensus/recommendation on this?


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Well - 3 litters then spay is what some vets recommend......some believe this means breed every heat until they come up empty a few times....

It is as much an ethical and moral question as it is a health question.

Lee


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## My2shepherds (Jun 10, 2014)

wolfstraum said:


> Well - 3 litters then spay is what some vets recommend......some believe this means breed every heat until they come up empty a few times....
> 
> It is as much an ethical and moral question as it is a health question.
> 
> Lee


Maybe I am looking at it from too much of a personal perspective but it upsets me not giving her more of a rest between. IMPO it seems more like money driven than anything else...


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## Ace GSD (May 30, 2014)

I agree with both of you... it doesnt feel right and kinda look like money driven


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## readmeli (Feb 28, 2013)

I agree, I am even not pleased my breeder bred my pup's mom Oct 2012, Nov 2013 and now again just in July! In future purchases (if there are any!) - I will be researching how often people are breeding in-depth. It doesnt seem right and and feels like it is for the $$.


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## N Smith (Aug 25, 2011)

I think it truly depends on the breeders goal, and I agree that breeding them back to back, then spay is ok to do as long as the breedings are still purposeful.

I bred my Shepherd this spring - won't breed her again for 2-3 years, but only because I am new and want to see this litter grow out BEFORE I breed my female again and decide if I want to do a repeat breeding or use another male.

I bred my Pom this spring as well - so far I am over the moon with what her and my male have produced, however the best puppy from this litter is a male (I wanted to keep back a female), so I will sell them all and try again this fall. I will breed her one more time next fall to another male, assuming I get a nice female to keep back from my fall breeding. Then she will be spayed regardless if I get what I want or not - I don't see a reason to go over 2-3 litters, you either get what you want, or you don't. But that is my opinion, another breeder may have a good reason for breeding a female more than that.

I only breed when I want to produce something for myself, I always aim to breed for a better generation than the last and really, producing my litters always costs so much, even with my puppies priced at fair market value, I walk away with very little and all of it goes back into my dogs.

I am not sure just because someone produces 3 litters back to back it always means they are in it for the money. Some things I consider: Are they repeat breedings between the only two dogs they own? Or are they doing maybe a repeat breeding followed by using another stud? Are the dogs health tested? Titled? Working? Are they keeping back anything they breed? What are their goals with the multiple breedings, what are they hoping to achieve? Do they have deposits for puppies from those parents? Depending on how those are answered, is what I base my decision on as far as allowing the repeat breeding debate to affect my decision to choose them as a breeder.

Just MHO.


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## My2shepherds (Jun 10, 2014)

N Smith said:


> I think it truly depends on the breeders goal, and I agree that breeding them back to back, then spay is ok to do as long as the breedings are still purposeful.
> 
> I bred my Shepherd this spring - won't breed her again for 2-3 years, but only because I am new and want to see this litter grow out BEFORE I breed my female again and decide if I want to do a repeat breeding or use another male.
> 
> ...


I know that the first two breedings were with a male with all health checks, fantastic ob training and a really good lineage. The third breeding however is with a male that has not had health checks and I am not sure what it means but this new male has 21% inline breeding??? Whereas the first male (my pups daddy had none) does that matter? I am just so disappointed that she would push her female like this.... maybe I am too sensitive about it but my girls "if" they are bred one day will not be in this scenario...


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## My2shepherds (Jun 10, 2014)

I know this is a "moral" based question for the most part but I really would like to know does this have an ill effect on the female? How "should" you breed?

Grrr... Meant to say:

How *often* should you breed not how....


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## lauren43 (Jun 14, 2014)

What do you think of this? Breeder I follow: 1st litter-3 pups. This is a large breed dog. Then two false pregnancies (not sure if they were reabsorbed or just falsies)...

Then most current litter: 4 on ultrasound, 2 on X-ray. Pups born: one is normal sized, the other weighs 1lb less...

I personally think I'd throw in the towel, but I guess that maybe just me..


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## My2shepherds (Jun 10, 2014)

lauren43 said:


> What do you think of this? Breeder I follow: 1st litter-3 pups. This is a large breed dog. Then two false pregnancies (not sure if they were reabsorbed or just falsies)...
> 
> Then most current litter: 4 on ultrasound, 2 on X-ray. Pups born: one is normal sized, the other weighs 1lb less...
> 
> ...


Yeah I think I would too... why keep putting the dog through it all for unproductive (or unhealthy) pregnancies.


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## lauren43 (Jun 14, 2014)

I just think if a dog isn't a brood bitch then she's not a brood bitch...let's not force the issue.

This current litter was in-vitro with fresh swimmers...


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## readmeli (Feb 28, 2013)

Great insight from N Smith. Thank you!

Breedings I am speaking of are to "top notch" males. Everybody has health clearances, etc. The late 2013 was to a male I know the like a lot because they have used him in the past, but not with this bitch. 

This bitch produces small litters, too. 1, then 4, 5 and now 3. I guess they just really like this girl, but I wont be going back to them.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

A bitch's uterus is meant to be pregnant. There is damage done no matter if they are pregnant or not. IF the female comes back from a pregnancy quickly and easily than breeding her back to back will not hurt her. Also it can depend on how long the bitch waits between litters to come back into heat. Nike went almost 9 months so I did consider doing a back to back with her. Deja went 8.5 months, whelped very easily, came back from it quickly so a back to back with her would not have taxed her. I, personally, hate seeing females bred back to back to back until they can no longer produce. 

The female that had issues conceiving and carrying a viable litter, IMO, should not be bred and her daughters should not be kept back for breeding. No female is that good that her reproductive issues should be continued in the breed.


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## KZoppa (Aug 14, 2010)

lhczth said:


> A bitch's uterus is meant to be pregnant. There is damage done no matter if they are pregnant or not. IF the female comes back from a pregnancy quickly and easily than breeding her back to back will not hurt her. Also it can depend on how long the bitch waits between litters to come back into heat. Nike went almost 9 months so I did consider doing a back to back with her. Deja went 8.5 months, whelped very easily, came back from it quickly so a back to back with her would not have taxed her. I, personally, hate seeing females bred back to back to back until they can no longer produce.
> 
> The female that had issues conceiving and carrying a viable litter, IMO, should not be bred and her daughters should not be kept back for breeding. No female is that good that her reproductive issues should be continued in the breed.




:thumbup::thumbup:


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