# Ddr/czech breeders?



## Jwb (Jan 30, 2019)

Im interested in getting a german shepherd this year. I've been doing some research on the types of bloodlines and seem to like the working lines more than the show lines. Right now Im thinking of getting a dog from east german lines or a mix of east/czech. I would like to buy from a reputable breeder, does anyone know the average price? I've seen from 1,500 to 3,500, dont want to go over 2500.


----------



## SentinelHarts (May 7, 2011)

The first question that comes to my mind is- what makes a breeder reputable to you?

In the US, If you are looking for a pup from titled and health tested parents I think the lowest you can hope to find a puppy for would be about $1800 and depending on the pedigree, desired qualities and traits, and the reputation/competency of the breeder and their dogs you could find yourself paying up to $3000. You should be able to find something nice in the 2-2500 range


----------



## Chip Blasiole (May 3, 2013)

About $2,500 plus shipping.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

If your budget is 2500 I am sure you can find a great dog for that $$. The one thing I will say is definitely be careful with people claiming to have DDR lines. From what I have heard the true lines are far and few, though many misrepresent. Hopefully someone here who knows the DDR lines that are still around will weigh in. What qualities known to DDR are drawing you to this combo? I only ask because a lot of WGWL x Czech may posses those very qualities, and will be more available which will open up your search more to locality, timing of litters and availability, etc.


----------



## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Coming from an equine background, and especially with Arabians, the concept of geographical "lines" (Polish, Egyptian, Crabbet etc) is commonplace, acceptable and frankly very useful in my mind. There are breeders who have and use dogs whose lineage stays within families of dogs originating from a certain criteria.....and this is easy and helpful in looking at pedigrees as priorities tend to cluster for breeders the same way.

That being said.....there are straight DDR dogs around....a few breeders in Germany still do DDR dogs - Parchimerland for one....a breeder (now deceased) named Steve Lino in FL was a wealth of knowledge and source of imported DDR dogs up until a few years back. I bred to a straight DDR male from his breeding for my Q litter...so there are DDR dogs and litters that have DDR lines.

But - what are your goals? Why do you want a Czech DDR dog? Frankly, the Czech lines are fast becoming more WGRWL every day....a friend imported a "Czech" female who is technically only about a quarter Czech lines - a little Belgian and the rest WGR....but since the dog was bred in the CR, and carries a couple Czech kennel names close up, that is only evident by looking at 6-10 generations of the pedigree.

Lee


----------



## Jwb (Jan 30, 2019)

I think a reputable breeder is dedicated to improving breed who is personally involved in training and titling their dogs. I would like to get involved in IPO & SAR. I want a dog that has high/med drive, good temperament, & strong nerves. I've read that Czech/Ddr dogs have these qualities.


----------



## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Many dogs of all lines have those things....it is more important to find a breeder-litter who has produced the type of dog you are looking for regardless of what lines....I have seen nervy, poor temperament etc in WGR and in Czech lines....and good in both

Lee


----------



## Katsugsd (Jul 7, 2018)

Both of my dogs were around $2k. One is mainly Czech/DDR with a hint of WGR. The other is Czech/WGR. Same breeder. Both very stable (one a little more sensitive to things than the other) and wonderful "off" switches.


Depending on where you're buying, $2500 should cover the whole shebang or close to it (pup + shipping if you don't go to pick up).


----------



## Chip Blasiole (May 3, 2013)

You won't likely have the time to commit to IPO and SAR.


----------



## Gregc (Aug 10, 2012)

Wolfstraum is giving you good advice here. Priceless~


----------



## Jwb (Jan 30, 2019)

I agree, thanks for the info. What would be the best way to find a breeder? Should I just look up their websites or is there another place where they post litters?


----------



## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Jwb said:


> I agree, thanks for the info. What would be the best way to find a breeder? Should I just look up their websites or is there another place where they post litters?


First go out to different venues and see some different dogs. Trials, training, even conformation shows. See the different dogs doing things. Meet people and their dogs to get first hand opinions. Here's one source:

https://www.germanshepherddog.com/events-new/


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

The best way to find a breeder is to go to clubs and watch the dogs. Make the contacts with the handlers and follow up with the breeders for the dogs you like. Asking on a pet dog forum won't really teach you much. 

The link Steve posted above lists the USCA clubs and events for all the regions. There are also two facebook pages tht might help
https://www.facebook.com/groups/IPOTraining/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/100827050053129/


----------



## Femfa (May 29, 2016)

Definitely second going to venues you are interested in before sourcing a dog. You may be interested in IPO, and yet there may be no IPO clubs near you or currently accepting new members. Now you have a dog with the potential to do IPO but not able to do it. Same goes for SAR - learn about it, see if it suits you. SAR is exceptionally demanding and will take a lot out of you, and I don't think you'll be able to pursue both simultaneously. They are emotionally demanding in their own way, plus they demand lots of personal time commitment and lots of your own monetary investment (training equipment, club fees, seminars, trials, etc).

This is coming from a new dog owner with a low drive working line GSD. I asked for a lower drive dog because I didn't know what I was getting into and was scared of the whole "working line" ownership title, because I didn't know what I really wanted. But because I fell in love with the sport, I still train 4x a week with my dog in the winter, not including training I do on my own time outside of my club or seminars I may choose to attend. During the summer it's far more often because I also track.

See if it suits you before diving in head first. And see if you mesh with your club or any other training venues before getting a dog with a specific purpose in mind. Putting the cart before the horse can bite you in the butt later.


----------



## MikeHayes43 (Aug 14, 2018)

We got ours at Vom Eichenhain breeders in Southern Vermont. He's 9 months old now and is the best tempered dog I have ever had. They breed working line, East German Shepherds and they are AKC registered the owners are very knowledgeable. If you google Vom Eichenhain they have a website with photos and such.


----------



## Chip Blasiole (May 3, 2013)

My bias is that the modern DDR dogs are not representative of the early DDR dogs. Todays dogs are desired mainly for their looks such as large heads, dark pigment and strong bone. They are usually not good candidates for sport due to lower prey drive. If I were to consider a DDR dog, the post above suggested a kennel that has dogs from Parchimer land, who probably has some of the best knowledge of DDR bloodlines. My understanding is the early, strong DDR dogs were valued for their confident sharpness and at times, very high dominance, which has been watered down over time. More of a defensive dog. If you are interested in sport, you might consider a breeding from West German and Czech lines, but the dogs in the pedigree are more important than the country they come from. There are West German lines that are more "sporty" and lines that have good drive and aggression. Same is true of Czech lines. Probably can find some DDR dogs with better prey drive than is typical for them as well. You have to decide what you want to do with the dog and then decide what traits you would like to see in the dog. That is just the beginning.


----------



## DorianGrayFFM (Apr 24, 2009)

Chip Blasiole said:


> You won't likely have the time to commit to IPO and SAR.


That would be the easiest of problems. In this case there's a bigger one.

I can't think of a single SAR organization (at least out West) that will allow a dog who has been through any kind of bite training to join. 

So that effectively rules out your IPO training. 

Never mind the fact that you're going to have very different ways in which you track.

It tends to me to be an either/or proposition.


----------



## Jwb (Jan 30, 2019)

Thanks for the advice! What would the difference be between training a pup and a older dog over 2 that has the same qualities?


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

2 years of work. 2 years of learning and gaining experience in training and knowledge of dog behavior.


----------



## Jwb (Jan 30, 2019)

If the dog had no training or basic obedience would it be more difficult than training a pup?


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

It depends on the dog. IME, yes it's harder because they are easier to manipulate when they are puppies. On the other hand, when you buy an young dog you pretty much know what you are getting where puppies are a crapshoot.


----------



## Nigel (Jul 10, 2012)

As has been suggested, go out and see some dogs work and talk to owners. For the dogs you find yourself interested in be sure ask what they're like off the field. I've seen a few now that are impressive to watch work, but the same cannot be said for home life. Make sure it's a dog you can live with.


----------



## Jwb (Jan 30, 2019)

Any info on these pedigrees?


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

I don't know enough about how pedigrees compliment each other in my current dog, but I can say Drago Eqidius is his grand sire on his sire's side, and he is linebred 3-5 on Nike Eqidius. 

Strong dog. Large dog. I'd say would thrive best with an experienced handler (I'm becoming one because of him lol) Definitely has some of the ...IDK .."old world" qualities you seem to be fishing for. He is neutral, forward defensive if pushed or asked, loyal to the death to my kids and safe around them, does fantasticlally with my two hyper autisc boys aged 7 and 10, neutral to strange people and dogs but has strong pack drive. Will never be a dog a stranger can hug lol. Probably would have made an awesome police dog. We love him, and I feel safe at night when he is in the house. GREAT off switch. Can beat the $%^& out of me playing tug, but it down right dainty playing it with my daughter.

For IPO- he does it, he is a thinker, and his protection is great. Not "flashy" will never be a high points dog..but he will definitely be able to get his titles if I don't screw up lol. He definitely has the ability to earn some high 80s low 90s..Id not be surprised for our high score hopefully in the 90s to come from protection. He takes correction from his handler well, does not notice a hard correction, but has a a type of handler focus where he cares if he is doing what you want. I can not transfer him to another handler and let them deliver a hard correction. Not a great idea lol

I know his sire directly and attend club training with him and his handler. Classic old world tough but stable GSD ..and I can see the attributes that have been passed down to my dog from him. I do not know how the other dogs play into his (my dog's)tendencies. His sire at age 10 just earned IPO 1..even though he has SVV3 and is a retired PD with tons of apprehensions under his belt. That is impressive.

He is not a DDR or Czech dog. He is a WGWL mostly, some Czech dogs in there, sire imported from Slovakia, excellent prolific police dog. Dam was just a nice lovely dog. 

Hope that helps as far as input goes.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

The club I go to has a lot of dogs that go back to Equidis lines. So far I've loved everything I've seen. The range of civil to prey does vary per dog, even within the same breeding, but the balance of drives is there. They are more independent dogs but no handler aggression.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Any suspicion? My dog is suspicious but not fearful (outwardly). He is not a dog you are going to run off easily. However, he is, without guidance, defaulting to being wary of people. Dead stare. Dead. However, sensitive to me enough when even going "ahem" get his focus on me where it needs to be. To be honest I'd call him wonderfully odd, but serious. He'll be 2 in June. Watching all development carefully and trying to make good training and exposure decisions with him. 

There is a lot more Eqidius in the OPs posted pedigree than my dog too, for sure.


----------



## ausdland (Oct 21, 2015)

DorianGrayFFM said:


> That would be the easiest of problems. In this case there's a bigger one.
> 
> I can't think of a single SAR organization (at least out West) that will allow a dog who has been through any kind of bite training to join.
> 
> ...


The largest SAR organization out West, CARDA, does :wink2:


----------



## Laura (Mar 23, 2010)

Kim Haegely, Kistha Haus GSDs in Lower Lake, CA. She has DDR shepherds. Black, black sable, sable....Stable, beautiful and solid dogs. We have two and they are the best GSDs that have ever been a part of our family. She has several available now and is on Facebook. She posts many photos. Her dogs are reasonably priced and she will always take back any dog or puppy when a family is not happy or has hardships.....no questions asked. Best of luck in your search!


----------



## Laura (Mar 23, 2010)

Please check out Kim Haegely, Kistha Haus Just K9's. I want to tell all GSD lovers about these wonderful dogs. We have two, plan to have more in the future but only from Kim. She is reasonably priced and will always take back a dog at any time, no questions asked. She is on Facebook also. Ours are DDR, black sables. Brilliant, beautiful.....the perfect family, sport or working dogs. Good luck!


----------

