# Keeping puppy from litter



## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

Not sure where to put this, sorry if this is not the correct forum for it. 

When I originally rescued Lyka, I was working on getting as many puppies away from the owner as I could. I placed a deposit on one of the puppies and planned to rehome him once I got him, as I planned on just keeping Lyka. Now I have the entire litter, and sadly, have fallen in love with little Berlin. 

I have read some info concerning keeping a puppy and the mom, and wanted to see if anyone had any personal experience? I'm still leaning towards rehoming when I listen to that pesky little thing called "common sense" but the urge is strong to keep him and just work extra hard with separate training sessions. 

Is it more difficult (seems so from what I've read) to have a puppy and adult that are related? Lyka is being spayed at the end of the month, and I plan on keeping Berlin (if I DO keep him) intact until about 18 months for health reasons. I've just fallen in love with the little guy, but don't want to keep him if it will be a less than healthy situation for both Lyka and him.

Lyka will start seeing a trainer mid August. We will be working on her fear aggression (which has seemed to have improved dramatically since getting her litter back with her) and basic skills. I could set up different training sessions for the little guy to have him worked without momma there. 

Any help/advice is much appreciated! Even if it is to tell me what an idiot I am for even considering the idea :crazy:


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## martemchik (Nov 23, 2010)

I don't think it matters at all if the dogs are related or not. I think you'll have to do a little more work to split the puppy from the mom, but the mom might lose interest anyways and their bond will be just like any older dog with a puppy in a house hold. If the older dog is trained, it shouldn't be a big deal to train them separately. I can see an issue if you need to do basic obedience/house breaking on both, but if it's just the one puppy that needs a lot of work, I don't think it makes much of a difference.

The breeder of my bitch has kept two puppies out of one of their bitches. The dogs are no different than if they brought in an outside puppy. It really just depends on the temperament of the dam and also the pups.

For your peace of mind, we'll be keeping two puppies from our current litter. So we'll have mom, a female, and a male puppy. On top of that, their aunt (sire's littermate) is also in the house.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Personally, I would not keep a puppy. Not that it can't be done, shouldn't be done and isn't done. I just would not in your situation from what you describe in your other thread. Concentrate on Lyka. You can always get a puppy down the line when things are more settled.


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## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

martemchik said:


> I don't think it matters at all if the dogs are related or not. I think you'll have to do a little more work to split the puppy from the mom, but the mom might lose interest anyways and their bond will be just like any older dog with a puppy in a house hold. If the older dog is trained, it shouldn't be a big deal to train them separately. I can see an issue if you need to do basic obedience/house breaking on both, but if it's just the one puppy that needs a lot of work, I don't think it makes much of a difference.
> 
> The breeder of my bitch has kept two puppies out of one of their bitches. The dogs are no different than if they brought in an outside puppy. It really just depends on the temperament of the dam and also the pups.
> 
> For your peace of mind, we'll be keeping two puppies from our current litter. So we'll have mom, a female, and a male puppy. On top of that, their aunt (sire's littermate) is also in the house.


Lyka is housebroken, but not socialized with humans or other animals, and shows fear aggression towards them. She does not know basic commands either. We are working on that, and she has made great strides, but to be honest, since I got the litter of puppies, training has gone by the wayside. The puppies need constant care while being nursed back to health, and constant cleaning of their pen, etc.. So Lyka's "command" training has been almost non existent lately. So she does still need basic commands, just not potty training. 

And I'm glad to hear it works out for some people, gives me a little hope  Thanks!


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## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

Jax08 said:


> Personally, I would not keep a puppy. Not that it can't be done, shouldn't be done and isn't done. I just would not in your situation from what you describe in your other thread. Concentrate on Lyka. You can always get a puppy down the line when things are more settled.


Jax, 

Could you tell me what your concerns are?


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Th only concern I would have is that the pup could take over mom's habits. I raised a litter for the shelter like that and when a situation arose that the mom couldn't handle I would have to separate her in advance so that the pups wouldn't learn from her. I kept one pup after the shelter took care of the adoptions of the litter and the mom. Never had a problem with the pup as he didn't grow up further with her.
Another issue is that you need all your time to help Lyka get over her fears and then at the same time you have to train, socialize, manage the pup, keep them separated at most times to facilitate bonding with you. Makes me tired thinking of it. I have learned for myself and seen it from others that the initial excitement of falling in love with a pup quickly dwindles when reality hits and you start to feel overwhelmed. Hard decision you face.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

jschrest said:


> Jax,
> 
> Could you tell me what your concerns are?


You just did  



jschrest said:


> Lyka is housebroken, but not socialized with humans or other animals, and shows fear aggression towards them. She does not know basic commands either. We are working on that, and she has made great strides, but to be honest, since I got the litter of puppies, training has gone by the wayside. The puppies need constant care while being nursed back to health, and constant cleaning of their pen, etc.. So Lyka's "command" training has been almost non existent lately. So she does still need basic commands, just not potty training.
> 
> And I'm glad to hear it works out for some people, gives me a little hope  Thanks!


This is a lot to deal with. Lyka needs your full attention right now. A fear aggressive dog is a lot of work. You have children, you work full time. Now you have to train Lyka. Add a puppy to all that chaos.

Not to mention that fearfulness and fear aggression can be genetic. Do you want two dogs like that to work with?

Concentrate on Lyka. There will be another puppy someday.


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## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

Jax, you're completely right. It wouldn't be fair to Lyka. The kids and I just fell in love, and the girls loving having a puppy they can cuddle and hug and play with. I still keep the separated from Lyka, and don't allow them to cuddle or play with her. She's never shown aggression towards them, but I know a fearful dog can't ever be fully trusted around children. I'm letting my heart overrule my common sense, and that rarely ends well.

I will be moving to California next summer onto a huge property, and I'm sure I can find a great breeder there if we are still having puppy fever. It will be in the country, with lots of fenced property for them to run and play on. I know that would be a much better time. And give Lyka more time to be trained properly and get more comfortable with us. And while I know I have time now for a puppy (most of my work can be done from home) I'm not sure what my schedule will look like when I transfer to the new area, so it would probably be better to wait and get settled before I add more chaos to the mix of moving and getting used to a new office and whatnot.

I think I was really just looking for someone to tell me it's a bad idea, because I already know it would be but didn't want to admit it! Lol


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

I have a mother and son (Carly & Russell). We had a few issues when he started maturing (both are dominate), but it's fine now. While they hang out together constantly, they aren't overly concerned about being away from each other. However, Carly is a stable girl with a good temperament. No people or dog aggression issues. I'd be concerned about keeping a puppy if the mother has temperament problems.


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## MacD (Feb 8, 2014)

OK jschrest, I think you are a clone - joke - honestly, you set a high bar for many of us .. you went above and beyond in your actions with the crazy lady and your rescue of Lyka and her pups .. and now you are open to not giving into your heart (not head) and keeping the pup. 

I really admire you. You go girl. The right pup will be something special and you will be happy you waited. 

In the meantime, please continue to post photos of your momma dog and her pups .. makes me smile.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

jschrest said:


> but I know a fearful dog can't ever be fully trusted around children. Lol


Not true.  There are different kinds of fear. Different aggression.

Our last Boxer would take out any adult that came thru the door. But she loved kids. LOVED them. 

Our current Boxer is dog aggressive and has high anxiety/fear issues. LOVES people.

Jax is dog aggressive from fear not genetics. But weak nerved. LOVES people.

And 6 months from you, you may see a completely different dog in Lyka. It might just take time, training and proper socialization.


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## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

She practices major advoidance with the little ones. Well, she does with all the kids, but the teenagers know what to look for and stop with the attention. The little girls just think she is being cute and will continue on if I'm not there to intervene, and I think it's unwise to leave them or Lyka in a situation that can turn into a bite quickly when they don't heed her warning/avoidance signs. They are just too little. 

At this point, Lyka is still only comfortable with me, and even I can only pet her for no more than a minute without her having enough, and that's with her coming to me to be pet. So for me, I won't trust her alone with the girls. For both their sakes. I honestly can't wait to see what she is like a year from now!!!!


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## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

Thank you MacD!!!


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## jschrest (Jun 16, 2015)

I got permission to post the puppies on a reputable breeder website with their story to get the info out that I am trying to rehome 2 out of the litter, so I can hopefully find a good home for the female I refused to home with the guy planning on breeding her, and little Berlin. Bittersweet. I know it's the best thing to do, but it's still depressing. 

While I love helping the puppies, I do have to admit, I'm very much looking forward to a puppy free home in the near future! It was so much calmer around here when I just had Lyka to concentrate on. 

I'm a little worried she will lose it when all the puppies are gone again, but hopefully healing from her spay, and starting training sessions after she is healed, will help distract her. Or she may be as happy for some peace and quiet as I am! ?


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I would also focus on Lyka, she is at this time, not easy to assess temperament. Once her hormones settle down and she is without her pups, you will know who she is. 
Dealing with a pup during that time may be fine, but it also could create stress for you and Lyka...and if these pups end up with health or temperament issues due to the irresponsible breeding then you'd have two dogs with issues. 

I hope they don't and are great pets for their families.
Thank you for your intelligence and care in this whole situation. You rock!


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