# Help finding relatives of our late puppy



## robbidyV (Oct 16, 2010)

My first post here and I'm sorry that it is so self serving. Recently our GSD (Loki) of 11 years passed away. My wife is hopeful to find a distant relative of our dogie for the next addition to our family. We went to the breeder that her mother had purchased Loki from as a puppy but they no longer are breeding dogs and they have lost pretty much all of their records. What we have are photocopies of Loki's lineage because my mother in law did not register her with AKC. 

I've contacted a few breeders whose names stick out but have had no success, either they have not replied back to me via e-mail or they no longer have that bloodline in their breeding program. I am hopeful that someone here might be able to look through these dated lineages and find something that they can use to point me to a breeder that is using a part of this bloodline.

I understand that all GSDs are descended from the same cloth, and a great GSD is still a great GSD, but still, my wife and I would love to find a piece of our baby out there somewhere if it's in the cards. For background the breeder that Loki was purchased from was in Lenox, Michigan.

And here is a picture of her just a few days before she passed:









Thank you anyone for your help.

*Father's Side*:

Father - Max of Thunder


Sire - Maxim Vom Haus Smokey Dawn CD
Pedigree
http://www.destructve.com/images/Grandfather-FathersSide.jpg



Dam - Lady of Thunder VII
Pedigree
http://www.destructve.com/images/Grandmother-FathersSide.jpg

*Mother's Side:*

Mother - There is no sheet for the mother and because Loki was never registered I do not have the sheet for Loki listing the Dam

Grandfather - Skeet Shooter


Sire - Rykers Shadow
Dam - Sandig Ufer's Maui
Grandmother - Scarlett's Angel


Sire - Schotze' Sir Lancerlot
Dam - Katherine Scarlett
Great Grandmother - Katherine Scarlett


Sire - Josh Von Heinle Mayes
http://www.destructve.com/images/GreatGrandfather-MothersSide.jpg


Dam - Chrysler's Shadow
http://www.destructve.com/images/GreatGrandmother-MothersSide.jpg

Any help of leads would be much appreciated, my hope is that this would be an easy task for someone here as it's pretty difficult for me to find much, after all I can't expect everyone in the world to have a web page and some of the information is 15-20 years old which in terms of breeding is a long ways back.


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## vat (Jul 23, 2010)

I wish I were better able to help but I am sure someone here will be able to shine some light on this. Good luck and welcome aboard!


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## Whiteshepherds (Aug 21, 2010)

Dog genealogy-oh fun! 

Here's a little info that might help in your search. Just bits and pieces mostly going back wards. Hope it helps some. 

*If* Max of Thunder was born on Feb 16, 1997 his *AKC registration number is: DL67797001* Registered as black and tan. 
If you go to the AKC site and register you should be able to get Max's pedigree. (10.00 for on line copy)

As far as I can tell Max was never tested for hips/elbows. He isn't listed on the OFA site. 

However....
Max's father was Maxim Vom Haus Smokey Dawn CD and he is listed on OFA.
These are some of the offspring of Maxim Vom Haus Smokey Dawn CD *http://www.offa.org/display.html?appnum=402563#animal*
*One or more of the offspring listed could be Max's brothers or sisters.* 
If you click on Maxims offspring you should be able to start to follow the line forward...maybe. 

Max's mother was Lady of Thunder VII and she is also listed on the OFA site.
OFA only shows one full sibling for Lady Thunder VII
http://www.offa.org/display.html?appnum=633626#animal

Sorry about your girl Loki. I think most of us know what it's like to lose that special dog.


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## LeftyGinger (Sep 2, 2010)

Whiteshepherds said:


> Dog genealogy-oh fun!


This was like watching a magic trick unfold. :laugh:

robbidyV - I am so sorry for the loss of your pup and really hope that your search flows smoothly!


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## Deuce (Oct 14, 2010)

LeftyGinger said:


> This was like watching a magic trick unfold. :laugh:
> 
> robbidyV - I am so sorry for the loss of your pup and really hope that your search flows smoothly!


Agreed!

Welcome to the Forum.


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## robinhuerta (Apr 21, 2007)

Whiteshepherds.....you are the GSD super sleuth!


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## robbidyV (Oct 16, 2010)

Thank you for the well wishes. I honestly didn't know I could purchase a pedigree from the AKC website without actually being the dogs owner. I really didn't even know I could purchase a pedigree from there. Loki came with my wife, she referred to Loki as her dowry so I have very little experience with pedigree and how to look them up. That being said I purchased a copy of Loki's pedigree today to fill in some of the gaps that I had such as her mother's name (Angel's Tess) and some of the further back information on her mother's side.

I would post what I purchased but I noticed the little blurb at the bottom to not reproduce it in any form so unless I'm told otherwise I'm sticking to it.

I've had a little bit of luck, the breeder for Maxium Vom Haus Smokey Dawn was Treu Schaferhaus. They have a website up and it was easy to find because they have a memorial page for Maxium. I tried several e-mails but no response so I called them up. I talked with Maxim's owner and he fondly recalled Maxim but didn't know if any of his current bloodline had Maxim's in it. He told me he would get back to me in a week but that was a month ago so I must be overdue to call him back. 

I also found the Chablis breeder who bred her great great grandparents but they didn't think they had any of that line left in their bloodline. Still they asked for a copy of her pedigree but never got back to me (again I need to follow up on this). There were a couple of other instances too, but nothing has panned out yet. Like I said, there are a lot of great GSD's out there, especially rescue dogs but for the moment this is how we're searching.

Thanks for your help and support everyone.


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## Whiteshepherds (Aug 21, 2010)

Good luck in your continued search!


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## AgileGSD (Jan 17, 2006)

Your girl looked to be a combination of multiple American, German and pet lines. Many of the American kennels in her pedigree are still breeding:

T-Ho
T-Ho German Shepherd dogs

Schneiderhof
Schneiderhof's German Shepherds

Fran-Jo
Fran-Jo German Shepherds

It appears Toskey's is breeding but doesn't have a website.

This German line breeder has a Benny vam Heideloh great grandson:
Vom Waldenhaus German Shepherd Breeders - Pedigree for Sage vom Waldenhaus, german shepherd dog for sale

Posting links to these kennels in no way means I am suggesting you get a dog from them - you will need to do your own homework and research to determine what breeders match your criteria for a good breeder.

All that said, while I can understand wanting a relative of your girl understand that getting a related dog will not guarantee that your puppy will have any of the traits Loki had. Loki was the combination of many different lines so while it is easy to find a dog with one of her relatives or lines in the pedigree, it is unlikely you'll find a puppy with a very similar pedigree. And even if you could find a dog with a nearly exact pedigree, it doesn't mean the dog will be like Loki. Even within a litter you can have puppies that vary greatly in temperament. 

Often I feel that many pet owners would be best getting a different breed from the dog they just lost. Too often I have seen pet owners get the same breed (or even close relatives) of their recently departed dog and set themselves up to be disappointed when the puppy is the only thing he/she can be - an individual, not much like their old dog. There are breed characteristics that tend to be common in any given breed - that is why people like purebred dogs. But there is great individual variation even among very closely related dogs of the same breed. And no puppy is going to compare to a dog that was part of your family for years and years (and that you most strongly remember as a mature adult dog, well adjusted to your life and routine).

I'm not saying not to get another GSD or not to seek out a dog with some family ties to Loki. But be sure you are fair to the puppy and expect the puppy will be an individual who may or may not be much like Loki.


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## robbidyV (Oct 16, 2010)

Agile, thank you for your help. I understand entirely that our GSD was one of a kind and don't expect any new puppy we get to be like Loki in every way, but I do hope that the puppy would possess the aspects that we all love in the breed, intelligence, loyalty, and that beautiful smile.

Personally I wanted to give the search some time and have been doing so. My wife wanted a new puppy immediately. Different grieving processes. She decided on getting a Pembroke for now and that way we would be able to take our time with the GSD search so that we could do our homework and do it right. Although I talk like it happened just the other day, our Loki passed away in June and we've had our Pembroke since July and I don't want to rush into another GSD until our Pembroke is a little more grown up. 

When Loki passed in the yard near our garage and every morning when I go to work I tell her what a good girl she's been and to keep an eye on the house. She was one of a kind, but getting one of her closer relatives just strikes us as one of the best starting points.


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## trudy (Aug 25, 2008)

My thoughts, call/email several breeders who have dogs you like the look of adn describe the qualities your girl had that you most want and I bet even if unrelated they could tell if they have similar traits and if that is one of the things they breed for. Go ONLY to reputable kennels that xray and do health tests, your girl sounds like she lived a healthy, long life and you want the same. I'm sure with more research you could find the best dog for you, there is no time frame for when to get a new dog, sometimes we are ready immediately and sometimes we need grieving time. My condolenses, I have recently lost a great girl too and know how hard it is.


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## robbidyV (Oct 16, 2010)

Thank you everyone for your comments and answers, expecially Whiteshepherds and AgileGSD. Unfortunately most of my leads so far have not panned out. I still derive some comfort however that any GSD we do choose will have some connection to Loki no matter how faint and that no matter how bad I feel for her passing, that she would have always wanted me and my wife to be happy. That if she could be, the one place she would want to be right now is at my side, licking my hand and telling me that everything will be all right.


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## GranvilleGSD (Mar 28, 2007)

Here, now all of the pedigree information is on one page

6 gen. pedigree for Loki Pedigree - German shepherd dog


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## Stosh (Jun 26, 2010)

She'll give that to you when your next pup is by your side.


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## robbidyV (Oct 16, 2010)

Wow, did you do this shepherdmom? Thank you!


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

I know people get sick of people who have rescue dogs saying, have you looked at rescues...but...

There is something special about dogs we have lost. 

It is very difficult to see that something in a puppy. 

But an adult dog shows those things very clearly and sometimes are the ones you bond to faster - immediately. I have seen people come to meet and greets and bury their faces in the neck of an adult dog and sob because it just clicks. SO if there are reputable rescues around you, maybe check out some of the unknowns. 

Good luck and I am very sorry for your loss.


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## Andaka (Jun 29, 2003)

Sent you a PM.


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## lokigsd (Dec 28, 2011)

I know it's a bit late but Maxim was owned by Chris & Jim Morgan of Smiths Creek, Mi... Treu Schaferhaus Kennels.... you will find more info there.... good luck


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