# Haemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in GSDs



## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

I'm not a vet. This is simply a recollection of my experience. Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis (HGE) is a potentially life-threatening disease. The main risks are shock from loss of blood and dehydration. The severity of the disease may depend on factors such as the climate and the patient's overall health and well-being. I believe HGE is rare in GSDs and other large dogs.

At about 15 months of age, my young West-German Show-line GSD bitch had just finished her second "heat" season. It was the middle of a cool winter.

We had come home from our daily walk in the forest, and I dished up the evening meals. She refused to eat. This is not entirely unusual because the dogs drink from unregulated water sources, and eat raw meat and bones of various vintages from the butchers. I guess this the reason they have the occasional stomach upset which usually manifests as refusing to eat, gurgling stomachs, and a touch of diarrhoea, usually lasting 24 hours or so.

As well refusing to eat, she became increasingly restless. She tried to eat blades of grass and, unusually, began scratching small holes in the garden beds. I realised that the reason she was restless was that she had frequent diarrhoea - every one or two hours. We stayed up all night in the lounge room by the fire, with the backdoor opened.

I noted that she was not refusing to drink water, but she wouldn't take milk or other fluids. However, each time she drank water, 15 or so minutes later, she would vomit it up as frothy mass, sometimes with the blades of grass in it. She drank then vomited four or five times - maybe more. In the morning she seemed a little better and we both got some sleep. I simmered some left-over roast chicken to make some stock and tidbits, but she didn't eat and only drank a little water which she threw up. In the afternoon she didn't seem too bad and insisted on coming for the daily walk. We took a short half-hour's walk which she enjoyed - running around and playing. Back home, she again refused the evening meal, and the second night was much the same as the first. She did seem more ill than a regular stomach upset. In the morning, I noticed her very loose stools had turned from varying shades of brown to pure red, and realised that something could be serious.

Our trip to the vet did not go well. It was her first time at the vets since her puppy vaccinations, and we saw a new, unfamiliar vet at the practice. We were able to determine that her temperature was normal which ruled out some of the suspected diseases. If parvovirus, she would have been a lot sicker. If poisoning she probably would have been already dead. Perforated bowl, intestinal blockage... a lot of the more fatal ailments were ruled out.

HGE has no known cause and no specific cure. It's signature is a fowl-smelling stool that resembles in appearance a thin rasberry jam/jelly. Another member, SteveRogers86, posted a nice photo of it.










In the evening, I noticed that some of the fowl-smelling diarrhoea had stuck to the hair around her rear-end. So I took some rags and a bucket of slightly-warm, slightly-soapy water, lifted her tail and gave her a good splosh and dry. This lifted her spirits.

Gradually, she became less restless, the amount of diarrhoea became less, and she was starting to hold down her water, but still refusing to eat. After the third night she seemed a lot better. She came along on the afternoon walk again. I was ecstatic when, after the walk, she drank some warm chicken stock. I followed it up with a small amount of red meat and a bone which she readily chewed on and ate. The next day, it was everything as normal.

Three months later, it happened all over again.


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## Momto2GSDs (Mar 22, 2012)

Hi Honey's Dad!
So sorry to hear this. Very scary, i'm sure.
I don't have any experience with this but did have some notes on it that might give some insight.
*Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis*

#1: Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Dogs | VCA Animal Hospitals
*What causes HGE?*
"Stress, anxiety, and hyperactivity are thought to be possible contributing factors in many cases of canine hemorrhagic gastroenteritis." 
The exact cause of HGE remains unknown (idiopathic). It may be related to dietary indiscretion (ingesting non-food items or even dramatically different foods than what the dog is accustomed to), immune-mediated disease, toxins, or pancreatitis. Stress, anxiety, and hyperactivity are thought to be possible contributing factors in many cases. Recent research indicates that HGE may be an allergic reaction (food or inhaled). Intestinal parasites and bacteria may also be causes. Dogs who experience HGE may be more prone to developing HGE in the future.
*How is HGE diagnosed?*
The diagnosis of HGE may be challenging and may ultimately require intestinal biopsies in persistent cases. Some possible causes of HGE include stomach or intestinal ulcers, trauma, gastrointestinal tumors or obstruction, foreign bodies, infectious diseases such as canine parvovirus infection, and coagulation disorders. Evaluation usually requires a complete blood count (CBC), biochemical analysis of the blood, urinalysis, radiographs (x-rays), coagulation or clotting tests, fecal evaluation, and ultrasound or endoscopic examination of the gastrointestinal tract.
The packed cell volume (PCV) or hematocrit (HCT)—a measurement of the proportion of red blood cells—is often greater than 60% in dogs with HGE. Most dogs have a normal HCT of 37% to 55%. An elevated HCT in combination with a low or normal total solids (TS) is an important clue that a dog may have HGE. Blood bicarbonate levels, blood pH levels, and serum chemistries also give indicators that HGE may be present. Diagnosis is often a process of eliminating other causes of bloody stools and gastrointestinal distress.
*How is HGE treated?*
Dogs with HGE will appear severely ill and, if left untreated, may die. In most cases, the disorder appears to run its course in a few days *if* the dog is given appropriate supportive care. Intravenous fluid therapy with potassium and electrolyte supplementation provides the foundation of HGE therapy. Subcutaneous fluids (given under the skin) are not usually considered adequate to meet the significant fluid requirements of most dogs with HGE. Most dogs are not fed during the first 24 hours of treatment and are often given antibiotics (such as ampicillin, enrofloxacin, or metronidazole) to combat potential secondary intestinal infection. Additional therapy for HGE may include gastrointestinal protectants (sucralfate) and anti-vomiting medications. In severe cases, plasma or colloids may be needed to correct severely low blood protein levels.
If intravenous fluid therapy is not given, the dog’s red blood cell count will continue to elevate because of dehydration. In this situation, the dog is at risk for a potentially fatal clotting disorder called disseminated intravascular coagulation (DIC). Once DIC has begun, it is often irreversible and may result in death

#2: C.J. Puotinen Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Dogs - Whole Dog Journal Article
*Looking for culprits*
So far, the cause of hemorrhagic gastroenteritis has eluded everyone, but the search goes on.
Enterotoxigenic Clostridium perfringens is the most commonly suspected agent in HGE cases because specific strains of Clostridium have been associated with hemorrhagic gastroenteritis in both dogs and cats. This common inhabitant of soil, air, dust, and manure is found in the water of lakes, streams, and rivers, and it is a contaminant in many types of commercially prepared foods.
Toxins associated with Clostridium bind to the intestinal epithelial cells of infected animals, increasing membrane permeability. However, since Clostridium is a normal inhabitant of the intestinal tract, no one knows whether it’s involved. Some veterinarians suspect that allergies may play a role, but no one has been able to find a specific allergen that has caused HGE in any patient.
According to Small Animal Clinical Nutrition, a veterinary textbook edited by Michael S. Hand, et al, the best foods for patients with acute vomiting and diarrhea are those that do not produce “excess dietary acid load.” Foods that normally produce alkaline urine are less likely to be associated with acidosis than foods that produce acid urine. Grains are alkalizing foods, while meat is acidifying. As a result, according to this theory, foods that are high in grain may be more comfortable than meat-based diets for dogs with gastrointestinal distress.
Another theory is that high-fiber foods, such as canned foods prescribed for dogs with diabetes, may be helpful during the acute phase of HGE. Dr. Wampler give us four cans of a high-fiber prescription food to help Chloe make a comfortable transition back to solid food.


Good luck and keep up posted.

Moms


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

Momto2GSDs

Thanks for that. I hope my real-life story wasn't half as scary as your notes. 

Our first bout was very worrisome indeed, and what a relief when it finally ran its course without medical intervention. The second bout was less of an ordeal, but I'm dreading another occurence.


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## Momto2GSDs (Mar 22, 2012)

honeysdad said:


> Momto2GSDs
> 
> Thanks for that. I hope my real-life story wasn't half as scary as your notes.
> 
> Our first bout was very worrisome indeed, and what a relief when it finally ran its course without medical intervention. The second bout was less of an ordeal, but I'm dreading another occurence.


I'm SO sorry! I never meant to scare you anymore than you already are, just meant to post some items to be aware of if you weren't already. :blush:


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

*Hge*

I strongly encourage you to search as below in the forums to see other threads about this. 








Search word: hemorrhagic 
Search area: health issues

If not caught quickly, and vetted well, dogs can and do die. It is a medical emergency, meaning get your dog to the vet, call the vet as soon as you see symptoms. 

Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis (HGE): A Cause of Bloody Diarrhea in Dogs

Hemorrhagic GastroEnteritis (HGE)

Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Small Animals: Diseases of the Stomach and Intestines in Small Animals: Merck Veterinary Manual

My dog (non-GSD) has had it 2x. The first time was the worst episode. Now, anytime she starts to have any issues with vomiting or diarrhea (2 additional times), I get some flagyl in her, Cerenia if needed, and it seems to help. The whole susceptible thing is certainly true in her case, and sounds as if it will be with your dog, who has started this as a youngster. Depending on your lifestyle and how many people will ever be in charge of taking care of her, going to daycare, whatever, I would be sure to have this noted wherever she goes, and consider a medic alert tag on her collar as well.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> ... I get some flagyl in her, Cerenia if needed, and it seems to help.


EEK! I hope you read the warning labels on any drugs you give to your poor dogs. I seriously doubt that those drugs would have any effect whatsoever on HGE. Bad advice. Bad. Bad. Bad.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

My last make Ike,RIP, had a singular bout if HGE when he was 4. Started as vomiting through the night. Took him to work with me the next day and on the way up the steps to the clinic he vomitted frank blood. Then kept committing blood all day. 

I was terrified. He was immediately started on IV fluids, flagyl and famotidine. Because I am a tech, I took him home and continued IV fluids and meds at home. He made a full recovery. But it was very scary. And he felt worse afterwards than he ever had in the past or future, including after a splenectomy. 

Take it seriously. 


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

honeysdad said:


> EEK! I hope you read the warning labels on any drugs you give to your poor dogs. I seriously doubt that those drugs would have any effect whatsoever on HGE. Bad advice. Bad. Bad. Bad.


My post was a very diplomatic attempt to point people to alternative information due to what I saw as the very casual treatment of HGE by yourself and apparently your vet. Three days, and nothing within your post for anyone who found this thread by google search indicating that anything was done. 

HGE can kill a dog. A dog suspected of having HGE should be taken to the vet, blood work should be done immediately, and more than likely, the dog will need to be hospitalized and placed on fluids. 

In addition, the veterinarian may administer a shot of Cerenia, and start the dog on antibiotics (of which Flagyl is one). While not all agree on the efficacy of using an abx, the way I get the drugs I mentioned is by speedily vetting my dog. Those medications were given to my dog by a veterinarian - my dog was under their care. 

The blog I linked to tells the story of a dog not vetted - owners very strong people to post that. 



> *Treatment and Prognosis*
> 
> Aggressive IV fluid therapy is the mainstay of treatment. The rate of isotonic fluid administration is based on patient perfusion, degree of dehydration, and ongoing losses. Dogs that are markedly hypoproteinemic or in shock may benefit from synthetic or natural colloid (stored or fresh frozen plasma) therapy. Parenteral antibiotics effective against Clostridium spp (eg, ampicillin 22 mg/kg, IV, tid-qid) and to decrease the potential for sepsis secondary to intestinal bacterial translocation are indicated. Depending on serum potassium concentration, maintenance fluids should be supplemented with potassium chloride at 20–40 mEq/L to prevent development of hypokalemia. Hypoglycemic dogs require dextrose supplementation (2.5–5%) of maintenance IV fluids. Additional supportive care, including antiemetic therapy and dietary management, are as described above (_see_canine parvovirus, see Diseases of the Stomach and Intestines in Small Animals: Canine Parvovirus, and acute gastritis, see Diseases of the Stomach and Intestines in Small Animals: Acute Gastritis).
> 
> ...


From: Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Small Animals: Diseases of the Stomach and Intestines in Small Animals: Merck Veterinary Manual

Also, depending on your location, dogs have been getting hit with an unknown illness. New virus suspected in Tri-State dog deaths News Page 2 - Track Infections


> Three dogs from the Cincinnati area and one outside Akron all died within days of exhibiting a series of unnerving symptoms that included vomiting, bloody diarrhea, weight loss, and lethargy.


So people googling should also check into that.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> Now, anytime she starts to have any issues with vomiting or diarrhea (2 additional times), I get some flagyl in her, Cerenia if needed, and it seems to help.





JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> ... A dog suspected of having HGE should be taken to the vet, blood work should be done immediately, and more than likely, the dog will need to be hospitalized and placed on fluids.
> 
> In addition, the veterinarian may administer a shot of Cerenia, and start the dog on antibiotics (of which Flagyl is one). While not all agree on the efficacy of using an abx, the way I get the drugs I mentioned is by speedily vetting my dog. Those medications were given to my dog by a veterinarian - my dog was under their care.
> ...


JeanKBBMMMAAN, You're changing your story. Every time your dog has issues with vomiting or diarrhoea, you take it to the vet for immediate blood-work, and more than likely hospitalization and IV-fluids. OMG! You're vet must love you.

I took my GSD to the vet immediately that I saw that the diarrhoea was pure blood. My GSD's temperature was normal, and she was physically assessed. All other serious life-threatening ailments were ruled out, and we left the vets. Perhaps with a small-breed, frail, or elderly dog, or a dog that was showing signs of dehydration, stress, etc, the vet might have given further treatment.

As for vomiting blood, as in gsdsar' case, I have not heard that as a symptom of HGE, and I certainly didn't experience it. It's a long way for the blood to get from the bowels to the mouth, and it must have been extremely distressing for the dog.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

Yes, the 2 additional times, I caught it right away, called the vet, they have a note in her record that if it is early onset, that I can come in, right away, pick up those meds, and get them in her, without her coming into the vet office, because they know if it does not immediately improve/stop, I will bring her right in. The first 2 times she had it (approximately 2.5 years apart), I took her right in. 

I hope this clarifies it - the bottom line for anyone who reads this, is to call their vet, know that HGE is a thing, and that HGE needs to be treated seriously. 

The way that the disease is diagnosed is through the blood work. 

Vomiting blood is a symptom of HGE - but also of other things, so I will leave it that, bottom line, owners should call their vets ASAP and err on the side of caution - knowing that there are treatment options that should be and can be utilized to prevent even worse things like DIC from happening.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> ... if it is early onset, that I can come in, right away, pick up those meds, and get them in her, without her coming into the vet office, because they know if it does not immediately improve/stop, I will bring her right in....


Please. You need to get the story straight because we are talking about a potentially life-threatening disease.

Every time your dog has vomiting or diarrhoea issues, you go to the vet and pick up some Flagyl and Cerenia. The vet allows you to administer these drugs. You always get some Flagyl into her, and inject the Cerenia if necessary. If [something] doesn't stop immediately from the Flagyl and Cerenia, you take her into the vets for blood-work, hospitalization and IV fluids. Still sounds like very dubious advice to me.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

So please explain to me how just letting nature take its course is the better solution for a "potentially life-threatening disease?" 

Your dog has suffered two times with some kind of illness - perhaps HGE - how would you know if a physical exam and temperature was taken and no blood work - and nothing was given to her for treatment at all?

When you see the Merck manual - linked here twice - recommends what my vets have done for my dog, a friend's dog (that was hospitalized for 2 days), and other dogs I have seen on forums have all been treated in similar ways. 

And the poor dog in the linked blog passed away with no treatment. Again, the owners very strong for posting it. 

Yet what I am saying is somehow off? This has happened 4 times total to my dog. 2 times to the vet. 2 times, as soon as she vomited foam, or had had diarrhea (one of each) she was medicated. Yes, it is as I have said - they make Cerenia in a tablet as well. Is this so preposterous as to not be believable? That someone would vet their sick dog? 




And dubious advice how? What would you recommend?


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I think nature letting it take it's course is a really bad suggestion when it comes to HGE.. Maybe, honeysdad you were "lucky" unfortunately maybe the dog won't be next time without medical intervention..Maybe your dog didn't have HGE? 

My female was very ill this past spring, it could have been HGE, she had all the signs, if she had not had medical intervention, she would have died. Whatever she had traveled to her lungs and THAT almost killed her as well. 

I do not take my dogs to the vet everytime they vomit or get diarhea, but I know a serious medical problem when I see it and I know doing 'nothing' could kill them..

Nice of you to share your experience, but letting nature take it's course especially when there is blood involved , is a really bad idea.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

My only experience with HGE was my friend's GSD. He was hospitalized at the vet for a WEEK. We didn't think he would make it an in fact she went to go put him down and when she got there he had perked up. No idea what brought it on. He absolutely would have died without being in vet care and nearly died even with it. He was on fluids for a long time. I think they even did an exploratory surgery to rule out other causes (initially thought he had some blockage). This was in August and he is still on a special diet that is allowing his digestive system to heal and balance out again.

In the past I've had instances where my dogs have had some diarrhea, even a little bloody and I haven't taken them to the vet as long as I can get it under control within 24 hours and they are not getting worse or dehydrated. Usually I put them on a special diet for several days and monitor them carefully. However this is *not* HGE.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

honeysdad said:


> I took my GSD to the vet immediately that I saw that the diarrhoea was pure blood. My GSD's temperature was normal, and she was physically assessed. All other serious life-threatening ailments were ruled out, and we left the vets.


Personally, I would have found another vet. Any vet that allows a dog passing that much blood in their stools to just leave without any further test, drugs, etc. is not a vet I would want to continue to use.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

I am wondering if there is a relation between HGE and parvo vaccination. Given the almost exact same presentation of symptoms.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> 2 times, as soon as she vomited foam, or had had diarrhea (one of each) she was medicated.
> 
> ...
> 
> And dubious advice how? What would you recommend?


*JeanKBBMMMAAN*
Apart from your dubious claims, *there is no evidence that antibiotic therapy is beneficial to HGE*. Get it? If your dog felt better after shoving Flagyl down its throat, then it was not HGE. To suggest otherwise is totally irresponsible on your part. As I have said numerous times before, THIS IS A POTENTIALLY LIFE-THREATENING DISEASE!

On the other hand, there are countless studies and articles about the over-prescription, abuse and inappropriate use of antibiotics.

Unlike you, *JeanKBBMMMAAN*, I would not make any recommendations for prescription drugs because I'm not pretending to be some expert or vet.




Lauri & The Gang said:


> Personally, I would have found another vet. Any vet that allows a dog passing that much blood in their stools to just leave without any further test, *drugs*, etc. is not a vet I would want to continue to use.


ehh. And what *drugs* would you recommend, *Lauri & The Gang*? Just another drug-pushing online "vet"!? My GSD survived HGE. What about yours?





JakodaCD OA said:


> Nice of you to share your experience, but letting nature take it's course especially when there is blood involved , is a really bad idea.


Well thanks. You must have missed this - I took my dog to the vet as soon as I saw she was passing pure blood. There is a nice photo in the first post showing exactly what I saw.

It's up to your vet what treatment to give, and I knew that I could be back at the vets within ten minutes, any time of day or night.

It's rare to find cases of HGE in GSDs and other large breeds. Here is an account of "Chloe", a Labrador Retriever.

Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Dogs - Whole Dog Journal Article
"Not all HGE patients are hospitalized and not all of them need IV or subcutaneous fluids. Dr. Wampler sent Chloe home with medication and instructions to call during the night if she continued to vomit or if her symptoms grew worse. In her favor, Chloe was five years old, athletic, and otherwise healthy."

I'm assuming that the "medication" was anti-vomiting because that is what the vet seemed concerned about.

My only recommendation would be to keep your dog fit and healthy.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I did see that you took her in the first time, but not the second?

And I did read the article you posted, where the majority of the article talked about IV fluids, meds. maybe Chloe didn't have a real severe case so was treated accordingly..

I don't know how 'rare' it is to find it in GSD's, since I've certainly read about this with other gsd's on this forum..

Me personally, when I see blood coming out one end or the other of my dogs, I'm not going to wait around and treat it myself, and yep, I'll race that dog to my drug pushing vet, which certainly saved the life of my otherwise, very healthy,dog.

I hope your dog continues to do well with no more episodes.


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

honeysdad, you have really no idea about which you speak. you are attacking other people without basis and i'm sorry but it's really out of line for you to do so.

Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Dogs | VCA Animal Hospitals 
*Dogs with HGE will appear severely ill and, if left untreated, may die. In most cases, the disorder appears to run its course in a few days if the dog is given appropriate supportive care. Intravenous fluid therapy with potassium and electrolyte supplementation provides the foundation of HGE therapy. Subcutaneous fluids (given under the skin) are not usually considered adequate to meet the significant fluid requirements of most dogs with HGE. Most dogs are not fed during the first 24 hours of treatment and are often given antibiotics (such as ampicillin, enrofloxacin, or metronidazole) to combat potential secondary intestinal infection. Additional therapy for HGE may include gastrointestinal protectants (sucralfate) and anti-vomiting medications. In severe cases, plasma or colloids may be needed to correct severely low blood protein levels.*

Bloody Diarrhea - Hemorrhagic GastroEnteritis (HGE) in Dogs antibiotics *are* recommended

*The mainstay of treatment is aggressive supportive care -- no food or water by mouth for 1-4 days (while on IV fluid therapy), and intravenous (IV) fluid therapy with Potassium added to the fluids. Antibiotics are also recommended (IV, subcutaneous). *

even 'whole dog journal' Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Dogs - Whole Dog Journal Article

*Although HGE has not been shown to be caused by bacterial infections, parasites, fungal infections, viruses, or any other specific pathogens, many veterinarians prescribe medications that address these agents. In addition, patients may be given medications that treat ulcers, soothe the gastrointestinal tract, or prevent nausea, vomiting, or pain.*

Tails of Seattle | Veterinary Q&A: Bloody diarrhea Part 2 -- hemorrhagic gastroenteritis | Seattle Times Newspaper

*Question: How is HGE treated?

Answer: Some type of fluid treatment, antibiotics and gastrointestinal protectant drugs (such as antacids) are commonly used.*

i'm responding because my dog had HGE last year and the same drugs were prescribed --- anti-nausea, pepcid/zantac, carafate and metronidazole = flagyl. 

if your vet booted you out the door with no meds or fluids you are indeed lucky your dog survived. if its truly hge she may not survive the next round with no meds and no hospitalization as nearly every educational site recommends.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JakodaCD OA said:


> I don't know how 'rare' it is to find it in GSD's, since I've certainly read about this with other gsd's on this forum..


Oh? I couldn't find any. Do you have any links, or do you recall some name or term that I could search. I'd like to read of any other GSDs who have experienced HGE.

That's right. I didn't take her to the vets the second time, but I didn't make a point of it, because I understand that there are readers of this forum who might not be able to monitor their dog as closely as I could.

I'm sorry to hear that you've had so many episodes of blood coming out your dogs' orifices. I can see how you can develop a dependency on your drug-pushing vet.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Are you just skipping over my posts?!?! LOL my friend's GSD just survived this in August. He was at the vet for a week! He looks normal now but is still in recovery mode as far as his diet and what is going through his GI system.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

Liesje said:


> Are you just skipping over my posts?!?! LOL my friend's GSD just survived this in August. He was at the vet for a week! He looks normal now but is still in recovery mode as far as his diet and what is going through his GI system.


OK. I wasn't skipping over your posts. Just being bombarded by all the "google vets". LOL. They love a rare disease.

In my case, recovery was just as rapid as the onset of HGE. She was back to normal after about 72 hours. Is there a complete account of your friend's GSD that I've missed.




my boy diesel said:


> *Although HGE has not been shown to be caused by bacterial infections, parasites, fungal infections, viruses, or any other specific pathogens, many veterinarians prescribe medications that address these agents.*


I read that as a criticism, not a recommendation.


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

HGE simply means there is blood in the stool. it could be from any causative agent. therefore it is critical to treat in broadspectrum manner. 
because there's probably some ulceration that allows blood to seep into the digestive tract, there's bacteria flowing into the bloodstream - it is a two way street.
antibiotics are critical to counteract bacteria and keep it from becoming a systemic infection. from jeans post about the akita, what probably killed that dog is the bacteria flooding the bloodstream, since it seemed fine one moment and the next it was dead.



honeysdad said:


> I'm not a vet.


then why are you questioning standard treatment for hge??


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

my boy diesel said:


> hge simply means there is blood in the stool. It could be from any causative agent. Therefore it is critical to treat in broadspectrum manner.


wrong!



my boy diesel said:


> because there's probably some ulceration that allows blood to seep into the digestive tract, there's bacteria flowing into the bloodstream - it is a two way street.


wrong!



my boy diesel said:


> antibiotics are critical to counteract bacteria and keep it from becoming a systemic infection.


and wrong!


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

honeysdad said:


> wrong!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I would like your references to back up your statement please. Or is it your opinion? 


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

honeysdad said:


> OK. I wasn't skipping over your posts. Just being bombarded by all the "google vets". LOL. They love a rare disease.
> 
> In my case, recovery was just as rapid as the onset of HGE. She was back to normal after about 72 hours. Is there a complete account of your friend's GSD that I've missed.


Dog was vomiting and had diarrhea, both bloody. They initially suspected a blockage (even though there were no toys or anything weird missing) so were x-raying to try to find the cause....nothing. He kept getting worse so they cut him open thinking a perforated bowel....no perforation, no blockage, no torsion, nothing like that. He was nearly dead, still not keeping anything in either end so the vet called it HGE and he was touch and go, not expected to make it. His intestines were OK but stomach was a bruised and bleeding mess. He was vomiting blood for 5 days straight and also having trouble absorbing the IV fluids. He was on fluids and at the vet for a week. Now two months later he is still on a prescription food so that his stomach and GI tract can develop the *right* balance of bacteria (his owner normally feeds raw or high quality kibble).

I've had my dogs have really runny diarrhea with a little blood before and I treat that at home, usually takes 2-3 days to completely return to normal. I've never heard of that being HGE though. Usually I think of HGE on the same level as bloat as far as being a veterinary emergency.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

Thanks for that account, Liesje. Graphic and terrifying. I can understand why, after two or three months, he is still in the recovery phase.

You're right that HGE does not "simply mean there is blood in the stool" as stated by some two-poster above. To my knowledge, the signature of the disease is diarhhoea that really looks like pure blood. There does seem to be significant variation in the severity of the disease which, I guess, would depend on factors such as the amount of blood lost into gastro-intestinal tract. Only a qualified vet can give a proper evaluation of the severity and the treatment required for HGE. I would hope that most people can detect an emergency and respond appropriately.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

honeysdad said:


> *JeanKBBMMMAAN*
> Apart from your dubious claims, *there is no evidence that antibiotic therapy is beneficial to HGE*. Get it? If your dog felt better after shoving Flagyl down its throat, then it was not HGE. To suggest otherwise is totally irresponsible on your part. As I have said numerous times before, THIS IS A POTENTIALLY LIFE-THREATENING DISEASE!
> 
> On the other hand, there are countless studies and articles about the over-prescription, abuse and inappropriate use of antibiotics.
> ...


There is _debate_ on the abx, that does not mean that it is decided and never used, as many, many people and sources point to. I am posting safe protocols because your heading is going to be leading people here via Google search - their own vet will decide - people need to know that they need to call the vet and not rely on a random post on the internet. 

You can use the search function on this website, on google, on other GSD forums, to find cases of GSDs with HGE. GSDs are GI illness prone dogs. They can have a bloody colitis episode, but again, different than HGE, which is diagnosable. 

Yes, keep your dog fit and healthy, until they get sick, and then vet them carefully. As to the vaccine, my dog had not been vaccinated for anything anywhere near the times of her illnesses. 

I wonder what your dog's PCV and total protein were at the time of her symptoms. I am betting that would tell the story in terms of HGE.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

Jean is right, all you have to do is scan the health section of this board to see the many many GI illnesses GSD's are prone to/have.

And WOW, I wonder how your vet would feel about your "drug pushing anti-vet" statements? 

Someday those "drugs" may save your dogs life.

You say your not a vet, so what makes you so "right", just because your dog is ok without treatment? How do you even 'know for sure" your dog had HGE?? 

Mine would have been dead as in D-E-A-D without treatment. 

Your information to someone new reading this that doesn't know any better could leave them with a dead dog..


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

I don't get the drug pushing comment either. My friend's dog survived because he was on fluids and getting round-the-clock care. They stopped giving him any food and water by mouth because of the condition of his stomach. I don't know if he was even given any drugs. The main thing was not feeding him for several days but getting him fluids and nutrients via IV.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Years ago Tasha had something that when I got home from work it looked like a mass murder had occurred in my bedroom ... like gallons of raspberry jelly had been splattered all over. It was just before I started hearing rumors of the Parvo epidemic, however, after reading about HGE I'm wondering if that's what she had? Whatever it was almost killed her ... many trips to the vet, and a vet tech's misunderstanding my vet's instruction probably saved her life because I gave her an overdose of the antidiarrheal medication instead of the dosage the vet prescribed.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

This is about Parvo, however a bleeding GI system is a bleeding GI system...


Medications may be given to decrease severe vomiting. Corticosteroids may be given to combat endotoxic shock. *Anti-diarrheal drugs* are not commonly used, as this *may increase endotoxin absorption from damaged intestines*.

Now in defence of the use of abx., and I am mostly on the side of Our Dogs are being over-prescribed and will try to find an alternate solution...but in this case...

*Antibiotics are given to help prevent or control bacterial sepsis and endotoxin release into the bloodstream.* If the CPV dog is vomiting, and the intestine is damaged and unable to absorb medications given by mouth, broad-spectrum antibiotics (often a combination of an aminoglycoside and a synthetic penicillin) must be given intramuscularly or by intravenous line to counter blood infection and shock caused by intestinal bacterial and bacterial endotoxins.

My friends mother suffered a bowel problem (damage likely due to meds. she was on), however, she ended up septic and nearly died...she had most of her intestines removed in emerg. surgery, her kidneys failed and she is on dialysis for life now. She was having diarrhea, back pain and vomiting but opted out of going to hospital for few hrs. Had her son not been home she would have died had she not got in when she did. Had she gone sooner, she may have saved her kidneys

http://www.borzoiclubofamerica.org/health/parvo.html


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

when i said "blood in the stool", i meant the definition of hemorrhagic gastroenteritis is blood in the stool and vomit. i didn't mean that's "all" it is. but that's the definition. once that's happening, a vet needs to diagnose *why *there's blood in the stool and vomit.

Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Dogs | VCA Animal Hospitals
*characterized by vomiting and bloody diarrhea.*

antibiotics are given because the gut is now changed, it is permeable, allowing blood to go into the gut. whether it's inflammation or ulcerations and the permeability can allow toxins and bacteria which is even normal in the gut, to leak into the bloodstream. basically things like blood and bacteria are going places they shouldn't be. that's the most basic definition of hge.

abx treatment is standard even in parvo even though it's a virus, because the gut bacteria, which e.coli is one, will leak back into the bloodstream. septic shock can kill them as fast or faster than fluid loss can


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## marbury (Apr 3, 2012)

At the clinic where I work, we have a lot of HGE 'diagnoses', especially on smaller dogs like Yorkies and such that present with violent, frank, bloody diarrhea with or without vomiting. Our USUAL treatment regimen is IV cath with cerenia & B12 in the bag, metro, sucralfate, and no food for the first 12 hours.

Our vets refer to HGE as a catch-all, not a specific disease (using the term to mean a known disorder) or a causation of symptoms. It just means that the pet is having profuse bloody diarrhea. They believe that HGE is not a 'cause' nor is it disorder; it is a SYMPTOM of something else. It can be a consequence of pancreatits, stress, overuse of NSAIDS, improper diet, bacterial growth in the intestines... a lot of things. I haven't gone to vet school myself, but all five of them have. Perhaps they were all taught incorrectly. I'm just passing along what they've taught their staff in the course of treating that patients we see.

Gator, there is no known link to parvovirus. They present slightly differently in the bloodwork, plus HGE is not contagious. The mechanics in the bowels are also different, although the visible results can be similar. I haven't seek such frank blood in the stool of a parvo case PERSONALLY, but I'm sure it's happened!


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JakodaCD OA said:


> I don't know how 'rare' it is to find it in GSD's, since I've certainly read about this with other gsd's on this forum..



*JakodaCD*

You are a moderator of this forum! I didn't notice that earlier when you joined the pack of abuse toward my vet and the treatment given. OMG! You have access to information not available to the public. You should be ashamed.

In any event, you have not provided any links or names or terms that I could search to locate the topics on these forums involving all the GSDs with HGE. Still waiting.

Nice to see that there is some reasonable discussion going on.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

Are you nuts? What the heck does me being a moderator have anything to do with your topic? And I have information not available to the public?? OMG< what do you think I"m with the FBI or something??? 

I did NOT bash your vet, show me where I did..and POST IT..I said how would your "vet" feel if he saw your "anti vet/drug pushers" statements..I also question why YOU think letting nature take it's course when a dog who's vomiting and pooping blood is dangerous advice to give to someone. Just cause it worked for you doesn't mean it would work for others.

I don't see you providing any links to back up your statements that not going the medical route works for HGE..and I don't see you posting any 'proof' that your dog even had it..

Do a freakin google search on GSD's with HGE..

Since you know it all, find the threads yourself Have a good day


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JakodaCD OA said:


> Are you nuts? What the heck does me being a moderator have anything to do with your topic? And I have information not available to the public?? OMG< what do you think I"m with the FBI or something???
> 
> I did NOT bash your vet, show me where I did..and POST IT..I said how would your "vet" feel if he saw your "anti vet/drug pushers" statements..I also question why YOU think letting nature take it's course when a dog who's vomiting and pooping blood is dangerous advice to give to someone. Just cause it worked for you doesn't mean it would work for others.
> 
> ...



Well, I guess you were never going to provide the links, names or terms.

As for me bashing the drug-pushing *online* "vets", I'm sure my *real* vet would approve.

I never advised anyone, I simply gave a recollection of my experience with HGE in a GSD, and I never used the term "let nature take its course". When questioned, you said you were aware that I took my GSD to a real vet as soon as I saw the bloody diarrhoea. What is _your_ problem?

It's rather disconcerting when a moderator turns savage. LOL.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

what is yours?? 

You can't do a search? 

I have more important things to do than go back and forth with you, your comments about me having 'access to information that is not public',,is pretty off the wall.

With that, I'm not going to clog up this thread bantering with you..


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

whoa, seems to be lotsa guys goin off the deep end here lately...

...can I say that, lolol...not to be bashin guys or anything...


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JakodaCD OA said:


> I think nature letting it take it's course is a really bad suggestion when it comes to HGE.. Maybe, honeysdad you were "lucky" unfortunately maybe the dog won't be next time without medical intervention..Maybe your dog didn't have HGE?
> ...
> 
> Nice of you to share your experience, but letting nature take it's course especially when there is blood involved , is a really bad idea.





JakodaCD OA said:


> Are you nuts? What the heck does me being a moderator have anything to do with your topic?


Firstly, as a moderator, you are in a position of trust. You have implied that administrators have restricted your access to information not available to the public. Let's hope!

Secondly, and more importantly, you completely misrepresented the position taken by me and my vet. You took the opportunity to have a cheap shot at the wisdom of my vet and the the decision taken with regard to treatment. 

I understand "pack mentality" very well, but certainly wouldn't abide by it when a moderator joins the throng.

I don't like having to repeat myself, but I explained to you that I had searched the forum, and didn't find any cases of GSDs with HGE. Perhaps someone with a more _moderate_ attitude can assist.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I have implied 'nothing'..I don't get where you think we have information not available to the public? Where "THAT" came from is beyond me.. 

I said NOTHING about your vet, again.

What I am saying is, when a dog has blood in it's vomit or bloody diarhea, GO TO THE VET. 

Hopefully someone else can assist you in searching for whatever your looking for


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

honeysdad said:


> *JakodaCD*
> 
> You are a moderator of this forum! I didn't notice that earlier when you joined the pack of abuse toward my vet and the treatment given. OMG! *You have access to information not available to the public.*


:thinking: Not sure what kind of "information" you're referring to, but no, moderators do not. 



> In any event, you have not provided any links or names or terms that I could search to locate the topics on these forums involving all the GSDs with HGE.


Perhaps you don't understand the role of moderators here.  While we may from time to time, at our discretion and if we have time, search out previous threads and provide links to aid board members, we are under absolutely no obligation to do so on demand. We are unpaid volunteers. 



honeysdad said:


> You have implied that administrators have restricted your access to information not available to the public.


Where exactly did she imply that?


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

JakodaCD OA said:


> Hopefully someone else can assist you in searching for *whatever your looking for*





JakodaCD OA said:


> I don't know how 'rare' it is to find it in GSD's, since *I've certainly read about this with other gsd's on this forum*..





honeysdad said:


> Oh? I couldn't find any. Do you have any links, or do you recall some name or term that I could search. I'd like to read of any other GSDs who have experienced HGE.


It wasn't a demand. It was a simple request. One would expect a moderator to be capable of contributing something useful particularly when it is the moderator who is making the suggestion. I guess not in this case.

Cassidy's Mom, I did know a moderator on another forum who did have access to information that was not available to the general public. However, he may also have been an administrator which gives even greater privileges. When I was a moderator on that same forum, I certainly had greater access than regular members. I take at your word "moderators do not" on this forum. End of "off-topic"?


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Administrators - yes, moderators - no. 

I tried typing "HGE" into the Google Custom Search box above, )which any board member can do), and got these results: Welcome to the official home of the German Shepherd Dog, a dog respected and admired throughout the world for its versatility, loyalty and intelligence. - Search Results for HGE

Whether it was a demand or a request doesn't really matter, doing searches for board members isn't a requirement of our "jobs".


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

Thanks, but that's not particularly helpful. The problem with that search is that it turns up a number of non-GSDs, a large number of posts with "online vets" diagnosing or suspecting HGE, cases where symptoms clearly do not match HGE, etc. Admittedly, there are one or two cases of GSDs with HGE, but it takes along time to identify them, and the details are sketchy.

I was simply asking if the moderator, JakodaCD, could give specific names or terms to search, and she refused to answer - which is her right, but undermines her credibility, especially when coupled with her dogged determination to misrepresent me and my vet.


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

maybe this would help the op?

Let me google that for you


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> I strongly encourage you to search as below in the forums to see other threads about this.
> *
> 
> 
> ...


There was that post on how to search the forum. You can also search other German Shepherd forums for more cases. 

Of course, unless blood work was done - can it truly be diagnosed? Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis in Small Animals: Diseases of the Stomach and Intestines in Small Animals: Merck Veterinary Manual 

At this point I am not sure what you are looking for. I would talk to vets at a teaching hospital, where they should be up on this. 

Gayle - I would bet...


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

honeysdad said:


> Thanks, but that's not particularly helpful. The problem with that search is that it turns up a number of non-GSDs, a large number of posts with "online vets" diagnosing or suspecting HGE, cases where symptoms clearly do not match HGE, etc. Admittedly, there are one or two cases of GSDs with HGE, but it takes along time to identify them, and the details are sketchy.
> 
> I was simply asking if the moderator, JakodaCD, could give specific names or terms to search, and she refused to answer - which is her right, but undermines her credibility, especially when coupled with her dogged determination to misrepresent me and my vet.


It's not Jakoda that looks bad here. Get over yourself and move on.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

"-huge hge gsd site:germanshepherds.com"

That's the terms of my search


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Judging from comments I've read here and on another thread, IMHO the poster needs to start using a little common courtesy instead of making snarky/rude remarks when someone is attempting to help him or posts a message that he may not agree with. Sometimes it's better to use the good ole Thumper philosophy, “If you can't say something nice, don't say nothin' at all.”


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

The OP is probably still upset that he was kicked out from the "other forum" where he was an omnipowerful moderator LOL What an inappropriate behavior in a health topic.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

GSD07 said:


> The OP is probably still upset that he was kicked out from the "other forum" where he was an omnipowerful moderator LOL What an inappropriate behavior in a health topic.


No, *GSD07*. I was genuinely hoping to receive a few intelligent responses - not some off-the-cuff, false and misleading claims by the resident "experts" - because I was talking about a serious disease. Out of luck here. SMH

*GSD07* - for you specifically - if ever your dog starts squirting blood, make sure you look it up on these forums first - you're obviously a big fan. Follow all the "helpful" links provided above. By the time you've finished sorting the trash, you might as well start digging the grave.

(Hoping I'm not being too presumptuous in assuming you do own a dog. Do you? We wouldn't want to presume anything, now would we?)


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

the "move on" suggestion was a good one.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

*katieliz* Don't you think you're one post too late?

I have simply responded to a post by *GSD07* that even the most unintelligent reader would see as nothing other than a straight-out personal attack. At least I am still trying to remain on-topic. I'm sure you would agree that reporting just flagrant abuse to the "moderators" would be seen as a joke.

Hopefully my recognition of bad advice and calling it for what it is might save a dog's life.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

nope. the suggestion stands, lolol...

take care, hope your dog's doin' good!


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

honeysdad said:


> *katieliz*
> 
> Hopefully my recognition of bad advice and calling it for what it is might save a dog's life.


So now I am confused. What advice would have considered "good"? 

In you first post about your experience you call HGE a potentially life threatening disease that can cause blood loss and shock. 

But when other members, myself included, jumped in with our stories and how we felt going to the vet for fluids, to prevent shock and dehydration, you got angry and pretty much called us all dumb and blind followers of our money hungry vets. 

If I read your story correctly you did nothing to actually treat your dog. You let it run it's course. Even though you state it's a potentially life threatening disease. It seems as if you went to Vet, they ran tests, and then you went home. 

Sorry but I hope that no one reads that and thinks that's actually GOOD advice. Cause it's not. It's dangerous advice. 




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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

katieliz said:


> nope. the suggestion stands, lolol...
> 
> take care, hope your dog's doin' good!


Well thank you. She's doing fine at the moment, but there is this dark cloud hanging over our heads.


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## honeysdad (Oct 12, 2013)

gsdsar said:


> It seems as if you went to Vet, they ran tests, and then you went home.
> 
> Sorry but I hope that no one reads that and thinks that's actually GOOD advice. Cause it's not. It's dangerous advice.
> 
> ...


You have missed the point. I did not give advice, I simply related my story. I'm sorry if it was a good story with a happy ending, and not something out of a horror movie. That's just the way it is. Read Chloe, the Labrador's story published in a magazine - not some anecdotal story heard from a friend of a friend. A fit healthy active dog like mine. She went home without IV too.

If you think that getting Flagyl into your dog every time it has vomiting or diarrhoea issues and waiting aroud to see if it gets better is good advice then that is your opinion and you are entitled to it. I have a very different opinion and I expressed it, but I didn't give advice.


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## gagsd (Apr 24, 2003)

Oh good grief. Be nice or be quiet please. Read the board rules if necessary.
Mary as Moderator


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

gagsd said:


> Oh good grief. Be nice or be quiet please. Read the board rules if necessary.
> Mary as Moderator


And MRL as moderator. My gosh this thread has certainly gotten a miserable tone to it, specially as people were trying to help.


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## OUbrat79 (Jan 21, 2013)

Wow! Aren't we all just a bag of freakin sunshine! I have read over most of this and still have very little understanding of whether the OP thinks taking the dog to the vet is good or bad. He seems to have claimed both. He claims he didn't but says we are idiots if we don't. I'm so confused. 

Oh well guess I will stay that way. Got to go feed my kid and the dog for now. Have fun all, lol. 


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

OU...the OP, and the whole thread actually, is quite confusing...reminded me of someone else I know who just likes to debate and will switch positions just to keep the debate going.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

People on this forum give advice, kinda the point. The extent to which other people follow the advice or care is entirely up to them. If we want "stories", we can read blogs or Facebook feeds, or you know the "Stories" section of this forum.

opcorn:


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

katieliz said:


> OU...the OP, and the whole thread actually, is quite confusing...reminded me of someone else I know who just likes to debate and will switch positions just to keep the debate going.


I am guilty of this sometimes, not in this thread. But I enjoy a debate and often take the position of Devils Advocate. Just to force a discussion. If we all agree on everything then this board would get very boring. 


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## mydogs (May 4, 2012)

Anyone here who is questioning HGE and "waiting it out" don't be stupid! My golden almost passed away yesterday from this. Blood pouring out his rear. If I waited it out he would've passed away. He was dehydrated and about to go into shock from loss of blood. His levels were at 60 which is fatal. Normal levels are 37-55 I believe. Here's a photo of what I experienced when I took him into the vet whoever here says they throw flagyl in the dog when they see this is making a huge mistake.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

I am very glad you took your dog to the vet - as any person should when there is blood coming from the mouth and/or anus. I am glad that the dog is doing better. This is a serious, potentially fatal disease and the first step (unlike the post in the original) is to call the vet and take the dog right in. Immediately. As fast as bloat, if not faster. 

But for crying out loud - again? I am the person who throws flagyl into my dog and then watches - I do it well before what you saw with your dog, and do it after having that experience of the clotting blood coming out of both ends one time and having her go in under emergency on a Sunday. The second time, also on a Sunday, I got her in before that started - frothy pink vomit was the only sign and she was treated briefly at the vet and went home from the visit, and the third time, on a weekday, there was only frothy white vomit, called, ran over and started flagyl and no further issues. I was able to sit and watch her - and that is literally what I did - to make sure it did not progress. I am acutely aware of what can happen, and do everything I can to make sure this little dog is okay. 

So when people pick and choose what you read, please note that I repeatedly said dogs need to be vetted immediately, but with and under the supervision of my vet, for this one particular dog, this is our TREATMENT PLAN. That means we have determined that this is the course of action we will take, because they know I will monitor her and bring her back immediately as needed, and that I will call well before the disease process has advanced, and if it has advanced, she goes in and stays in with fluids, and all meds on board. If your dog repeats, you may need to develop a plan as well - we felt it was in her best interest to intercede quickly, and try to prevent a full blown episode, but you and your vet may develop a different plan.


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## Linda1270 (Sep 7, 2012)

arycrest said:


> Judging from comments I've read here and on another thread, IMHO the poster needs to start using a little common courtesy instead of making snarky/rude remarks when someone is attempting to help him or posts a message that he may not agree with. Sometimes it's better to use the good ole Thumper philosophy, “If you can't say something nice, don't say nothin' at all.”


Totally agree, it seems that the OP is not taking the time to actually read what other's are try to say to him. I see only help being offered from those who have had issues or know someone who has with HGE.


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## manda.pleasee (Jun 15, 2020)

Hi everyone! 
Our german shepherd had HGE this weekend, and I wanted to share our experience with it so far (she's still healing up). I googled the crap out of her symptoms (that's how I found this thread) and came to parvovirus, bloat, HGE but the vet finally diagnosed her with HGE. We recently adopted her (~2 weeks ago) and the poor girl has been through a lot. She came from Arkansas as a stray 10-month old, she'd had a litter of puppies this year, and she was covered in ticks. We've been VERY actively treating her physical and emotional problems because of the trauma, and we love her SO much. This Saturday, we took her for a car ride to a local park for a walk. She had some diarrhea at the park, but we thought nothing of it at the time. She resisted any treats during the car ride and while at the park, which we found strange but attributed to fear of the car/motion sickness. After a couple hours at the park, she then began digging a hole and puked into it. Again, we didn't know if it could be anxiety from the 30-minute car ride (or motion sickness). She was acting a bit out of it though. We brought her home, and she puked and had diarrhea several more times in the span of ~2 hours. Our vet was closed, so we called a pet hospital and immediately drove her there once we saw what appeared to be blood in her vomit. The vet ended up injecting fluids under her skin and giving her an anti-nausea pill. He couldn't really tell us a cause but told us to keep an eye on symptoms, and then he let us take her home. When we got home, and then she had bright red bloody diarrhea. Naturally we freaked out and called the vet. He told us that the symptoms sounded exactly like HGE and that further treatment was not necessary because she had the fluids already inserted. My husband didn't sleep at all that night because he kept an eye on our dog and let her outside any time she needed to relieve herself. The vomiting did stop after the visit to the pet hospital. She wasn't responsive to our voices, which was scary.

The next day, she would not eat and would only drink small amounts of water. She was lethargic and slept much of the day, but she was able to walk around on her own (the previous night, she could barely stand/walk and my husband had to help her). I did my best to clean her up, hoping that would give her some morale boost (poor thing was covered in poop/blood). By Sunday evening (~24 hours since start of symptoms), she was moving a lot more and even barking with her ears/tail up! She even greeted my husband at the door excitedly, when he returned from a golf outing. She still wouldn't eat - I tried following her around with little bowls of water (added some salt) and canned food provided by the vet. We also followed her around with towels, so anytime she laid down there was one there in case she had an accident. She seemed to be able to control her bowels though that day, so we were better able to manage taking her outside when she had to poop. Her diarrhea was still a bit bloody. She started to respond more to our voices and commands.

Today, she has improved further. She has been drinking water (still added salt for electrolytes because she won't drink broth). She whimpered and followed my husband around before he left for work (which she usually does haha). She even wanted to go for a walk, so I took her on our normal route. She was sniffing everything and hunting squirrels, like she usually does. Her pace was slower though, so I cut the walk short and brought her home to rest after. I actually got her to eat some food today! She will not eat the canned food from the vet, so I gave her some plain rice and ground chicken.

We are hoping that she continues to improve, so we can get back to caring for her and giving her the best life possible. We just wish we knew the cause. Was it the car (fear/motion sickness)? Was it just getting used to being a pet instead of a stray (the food, etc.)? Was it an allergy to a food we gave her? We hope we can figure it out so that it doesn't happen again.

I just wanted to say thanks to everyone who shared their dog's symptoms/vet treatments/etc. It gave me some peace of mind to hear other people's experiences with this. I know every dog isn't the same and will require different methods to get better, but all that matters is that they heal up!


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