# Schutzhund questions



## Kaiser2012 (Mar 12, 2012)

Here is the original thread. My apologizes for initially smooshing too many topics together 

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...-dogs-schutzhund-bh-new-trainers-methods.html

Kaiser has no papers, but I'm getting ready to start classes with a trainer (as explained in the linked thread). Its as good as I'm going to get, considering the area I'm in. The trainer does not teach bitework (she isn't allowed to, according to the terms of her conditional use permit)...bummer.

At any rate, please check out the original thread. I'm looking for advice with several things (aside from any comments you have about what I wrote initially):

-What is your experience with pursuing a BH? 

-Without a trainer to start bitework with now, what is your experience with starting down the road, even if it is in a year, or two years, or three (depending on if/where/when I move)

-What else can I do with Kaiser, even though he doesn't have papers?

-What else do you do with your schutzhund dog (ie, tricks, training, sports) and how do your training methods differ (if at all)

Thanks so much


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## phgsd (Jun 6, 2004)

You can do pretty much anything except conformation with Kaiser - you can get him an ILP through AKC for performance events such as agility, obedience, etc, and can register him as a mix with USA for schutzhund (even if he's purebred - with no papers he'll be a mix). 

I do lots of things with my dogs...my Schh1 female is also an accomplished herding and rally obedience dog, I'm sure she'd be great at agility too if I had the time. And she is awesome at dock diving (but not competitively - there are no competitions I can find locally...). Some behaviors cross over between sports and are helpful - some might cause some minor conflicts but nothing you can't work around.


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## Kaiser2012 (Mar 12, 2012)

ref the ILP, very cool! How old does he have to be to get that? I'd love to try agility too (I had so much fun with Dakota, but she's not competition-material)

How do you go about pursuing several sports at once? And how often can you train to make everything worthwhile? (Or I suppose I should ask, what is the minimum, since I don't have much to choose from around here)


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

*-What is your experience with pursuing a BH? *

I haven't really pursued a BH. I pursued a SchH1 (and am pursing higher SDA titles and possibly more SchH) with Nikon and am pursuing an IPO3 with Pan. The BH is just something we do once we're ready and have time to go to a trial.


*-Without a trainer to start bitework with now, what is your experience with starting down the road, even if it is in a year, or two years, or three (depending on if/where/when I move)*

A lot of dogs intentionally bred and purchased for SchH don't start bitework until 1-2 years old. Pan didn't seriously start until he was 17 months and even now we are just doing it as we can with the club once or twice a month since he's still maturing.


*-What else can I do with Kaiser, even though he doesn't have papers?*

Anything but conformation, really. AKC and UKC both have alternate registrations for spayed/neutered unpapered dogs. There are also other organizations that just don't care (U-fli for flyball, CPE for agility, APDT for rally...there are tons these are just the ones I've signed up for so far).


*-What else do you do with your schutzhund dog (ie, tricks, training, sports) and how do your training methods differ (if at all)*

I do flyball, agility, lots of regular obedience and silly tricks, SDA (obedience is very similar but protection is different), lure coursing, conformation, and dock diving with my Schutzhund dogs. Of course the training is tailored to the venue but my overall philosophies and tools don't change.


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## phgsd (Jun 6, 2004)

Looks like 6 months - and they need to be neutered.
If you don't want to neuter young you'll just have to wait to register him. 
http://www.akc.org/pdfs/ilpform.pdf

For herding I train at least once a week, sometimes more. A lot of agility classes meet one a week. For schutzhund a lot of clubs meet weekly but you'll need to do some work on your own too. It depends on when you start - and some dogs do best with lots of training, some with more sporadic training, when I was doing Schh I'd train at least 3-5 days a week. A lot of the sessions will be short especially with a young dog.

I trained Schh and herding separately (only because I didn't know about the herding group!), with the new puppy I will be doing both at the same time once she's a little older. With Kessy I've gone herding early in the AM and then gone straight to a rally trial and she did great. It really depends on the dog - each is an individual, they will let you know what they can handle.


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## GatorDog (Aug 17, 2011)

*-What is your experience with pursuing a BH? *
I got my dog with no intentions of Schutzhund at first. Once I visited my first club when he was about 6 months, I was hooked. We only focused on obedience and tracking for a long time, just for the experience. We moved on to the protection once he started to mature. I got his BH at 15months old and we will be trialing for his IPO1 in two months just before he turns 3 years old. 

*-Without a trainer to start bitework with now, what is your experience with starting down the road, even if it is in a year, or two years, or three (depending on if/where/when I move)
*As I said above, I didn't really do too much protection work with him before he turned about a year old. Even then, we mostly just worked on building his prey drive rather than the formal protection routine stuff.

*-What else can I do with Kaiser, even though he doesn't have papers?*
Like the others have said, pretty much anything except showing is possible even without papers.
*
-What else do you do with your schutzhund dog (ie, tricks, training, sports) and how do your training methods differ (if at all)
*I commit almost all of my outisde time to Schutzhund now. I haven't really looked in to any other sports because I got so focused on Schutzhund. Plus, Aiden is really big and not the fastest dog, so I don't think he would excel at agility or flyball, even though I'm sure he'd still have a good time. We did get his CGC very easily because it was mostly a bunch of stuff that we were working on for Schutzhund anyways.


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## FG167 (Sep 22, 2010)

My dog is in the same boat as Lies' Pan. Lots of sports. I just find the time and choose what I feel like doing or what he needs to work on at the time. He has not started protection and will not, at all, until he's almost 1.5 years old. He had mouth surgery and I am waiting. We are working on our BH right now.


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## obxterra (Jul 25, 2009)

Kaiser 2012, I am just up the road from from you on the OBX and train in Pungo Va. It is a little drive but I have really enjoyed learning and trialing. I originally had no intention of doing Schutzhund , just needed some help with obtaining more control with Jaz and tracking.

Started Jaz at 2.5 years with the obedience and tracking then went on to the protections work around 4. We were able to get her a Schuthund 1. Being my first dog we never had the "finesse" to get further. BTW her favorite was actually in Protection.

Ruger has the BH, working on his Protection work for IPO 1. Started him at 6 months.

Ciyah's breeder started imprinting at 3-4 weeks, then heeling,stand, sit, down, and focus at 5-6 weeks. I continued that from 10 - 16 weeks before taking her to Pungo. She's getting tracking, obedience, and protection work now. Last weekend we started her with running one blind.

PM me if you have any questions about the Virginia Beach club. They also do have private lessons during the week and will evaluate Kaiser for you.

BTW: Just looked at your flikr pictures, that is one really cute fuzzball. Looks like a lot of fun.


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