# Acid Reflux/Licking - uncertain symptoms



## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

Hi everyone
My GSD Vyvyan has been suffering from a little bit of mild acid reflux - or what I think it is. We have seen our regular vet and I had said to her that we will be consulting a specialist if we decide to investigate further. This has been occurring infrequently - not at all in the past month, but more frequently before then. Basically symptoms are as follows:
- eats dinner, happy and eager to eat, moments to half hour later becomes a little distressed and licking lips and the air, drooling not a great deal but enough to wet the blanket/floor boards. 
-This can continue for 10 mins to 1 hour
-still eager to eat/play despite this. Still normal drinking of water. 
-has not happened in the past month, however has just occurred tonight after eating what is a regular meal for her. 
She is nearly 8 years old, has no other medical condition, is fed a raw meaty bones diet. This began, I would say, when I began feeding her chicken frames about 6 months ago- I believe I fed way too much. Therefore, I have cut them out entirely, in fact I've had to reduce her bone intake down to about half of what she had eaten previously, otherwise this occurs. I'm wondering if I have 'taxed' her pancreas too much. In addition, I've come across some opinions online that talk about the raw meaty bones diet being too acidic, that dogs still need an alkaline pH. I have no idea what to believe anymore. This doesn't make sense to me personally, however wondering if there's any long term impacts of just eating meat, bones and organic organs?
She receives digestive enzymes every meal which is added to her food 10-60 mins before she eats it to begin the digestion process. She is now also given half a teaspoon of manuka honey (I'm hoping this works as a pre-biotic) before every meal (about 5-10 mins prior). I'm presently trialing slippery elm tea.
I'm thinking this may be mega E or taxed pancreas and therefore we may be looking at oesophagus investigation. However I'm reluctant to put her through that given her nervous (aggression) at the vet and if there is a simple solution, we'd obviously rather that. My suspicions are that, because she also gets 3 meals a day, small ones, and her last meal is about 11pm at night sometimes (I work hospitality), perhaps this is not good when she goes to bed, stretching her stomach and working against the natural motion of food through the system? However, regardless of the time I feed her, she will generally be lying down as I am trying to avoid bloat which is supposedly linked to exercise in close proximity to eating. It is challenging figuring out how to keep her upright without exercise after eating. 
Interestingly, there is no actual vomitting, her stools are perfect also. 
I'm wondering also what the treatment for mega e is meant to be. Have others had surgery etc?
Is there anything else that should be on the list of possible causes that I should be researching also?
Looking forward to your comments:frown2:


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

My old female had the same symptoms plus a few more (sometimes she was vomiting too, and sometimes loose stool). But most often was the persistent nausea just like you describe.

We tried a few different diets to no avail. She was ultrasound ed to rule out a tumor causing the issue. Ultrasound showed inflammation of entire digestive tract.

She was treated with ulcer meds which seemed to help a little and then no longer helped at all. During that time also tried a few more prescription diets per vets with no improvement. (I had tried to put her back on home cooked and it made her much sicker) Diagnosis was IBS and ulcers

After 3 ultrasounds and a whole lot of meds that didn't work she had an endoscopy at our referral hospital, which showed nothing remarkable, which was actually good since there were some scarier possibilities and her biopsy did not show these.

She was started on prednisone which was awful I won't lie, side effects were outrageous, but we got thru it. Her nausea stopped immediately. Vet felt it was inflammation of duodenum causing her nausea (the internal medicine specialist who did her endoscopy)

We tapered her prednisone and switched her to Budesonide which acts less systemically and is supposed to have fewer side effects. we tapered the budesonide down to where she takes a very small dose every other day

She now eats honest kitchen and ziwipeak combined. She has had no symptoms in approx 8 months. She is energetic and full of life. She still harassed me to train her and do stuff with her and she is about to turn 11. 

she just had follow up bloodwork which was great.

Her specialist strongly advises against trying to take her off the Budesonide entirely even tho I would like to. At her age, I am not going to rock the boat. Ithe was awful watching her go thru it and I am so grateful she is comfortable now


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I'll just add that mine started like yours and the vomiting and loose stools came later as she got worse before we got the right tx


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

thank you thecowboysgirl that is very insightful. MY god I hope that isn't what is going on with Vyv. The thing is, Vyv is so active and lively and not off her food, however when you say ulcers that does concern me because when she was 2 she had a bad reaction to her vaccine, 6 months later we diagnosed her as having an intolerance to beef (which caused ulcers inside her). Obviously she is never fed beef, however just wondering if she's developed a new food intolerance. 
Thank you for your comments
Holly


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

hollykate said:


> thank you thecowboysgirl that is very insightful. MY god I hope that isn't what is going on with Vyv. The thing is, Vyv is so active and lively and not off her food, however when you say ulcers that does concern me because when she was 2 she had a bad reaction to her vaccine, 6 months later we diagnosed her as having an intolerance to beef (which caused ulcers inside her). Obviously she is never fed beef, however just wondering if she's developed a new food intolerance.
> Thank you for your comments
> Holly


Holly

My girl remained active and never went off her food either. Even in a bout of nausea, sometimes a snack even helped her feel a little better and she would basically always eat.

The good news is---the actual treatment that worked was not even expensive. Budesonide is more expensive than prednisone, but a bottle of her pills is 60 dollars and I think the dose she is on a bottle lasts 2 months. In the end, not that big of a deal for her to be comfortable for the rest of her life.

My girl had some food issues when she was younger too, and also was diagnosed with food allergies/intolerance. Her current diet consists of meats which were novel to her. She does not seem to have a problem with grain--she eats THK keen Basically, I tried to hit it from every angle---I wanted to get her off heavily processed food/kibble, if at all possible, get her onto novel proteins in case it was a factor, plus doing the teroid tx for anti inflammatory.


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

thank you my mind is now open to other causes, I will look into what you have said


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

any more replies very much appreciated thank you


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

aid digestion by INCREASING her "digestive juices" , not by giving antacids (counter productive to body's needs)

stomach acids decline with age and with use of antacids .

you want to encourage the flow of bile and pancreatic enzymes.

when stomach acid is low there is the chance for bacterial overgrowth .

this bacterial overgrowth in the stomach and intestines could be the cause for ulcers (h pylori)

proteolytic enzymes , betaine , papain, bromelain . 

Betaine HCL , Wobenzyme . Prozyme (protease) - protein digesting enzymes .

there are products available that have all of these plus pre and probiotics -- broad range of digestive enzymes 
which help digest and absorb and broad range of probiotics to provide healthy bacterial cultures plus the proteolytic
enzymes in one .

Mentioned before Wobenzyme , Prozyme, Thorne has a good product (hcl and pork pepsin) NOW has one that has
oxbile and pancreatin .

There are many threads on this on the forum .


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

thank you carmspack this is what I'm thinking also. I have always avoided the antacids. I get confused as to what is what though. Like americans talk a lot about peptobismal/peptic something, we don't really use that here, but what is this? And I hear simethicone to releive gas also, however I've investigated a few of these products but all contain horrible excipient ingredients made in china. Not ideal, but i guess necessary if you're desperate. I will look into bromelain, papaya etc. I'm already adding enzyplex etc, I thought that would be enough but perhaps not. THANK YOU!


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Drooling and lip licking are signs of nausea. It may or may not be related to acid reflux. Best to discuss with a vet before throwing remedies at this.


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

yep definitely have gotten onto my vet and re-asked for our referral i think it expired but will ring them tomorrow thanks!


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

I'm another fan of THK's dehydrated food products. They have a calming effect on inflamed GI tracts that's pretty interesting, in my experience with them. They're processed without heat, so the natural enzymes in the ingredients are preserved, and they're pretty transparent about sourcing (no Chinese ingredients).

THK makes a product called Probloom that I bought for dog that was having occasional bouts of nausea, after ruling out disease at the vet. This product has instant goat milk, probiotics and digestive enzymes:
https://www.thehonestkitchen.com/pro-bloom

If it's not easily available, you could probably make your own with locally sourced goat milk, probiotics and digestive enzymes pretty easily!

I add a dose of bovine colostrum to it, and open up a slippery elm capsule into the mix, then add non-chloronated water. I give this milky treat up to 30 minutes before feeding time...and it solves the tummy issues this dog has, helping settle the food. 

Making the evening meal lighter, perhaps with homemade bone-broth, might be another thing to try. Bone broth would be a use for those chicken frames. You can also reconstitute the THK with bone broth, when you have it on hand. I'm thinking of easy-to-digest things that will do no harm while you are waiting for your vet to figure this out!

Mega-E _can _develop suddenly when there's a disease process causing it, but it usually manifests with regurgitating some undigested food after a meal, or water after a big drink. A weird coughing/gagging sound is also sometimes there. It's usually diagnosed by x-ray, and often they do barium testing too--they watch the barium light up as it moves through the GI tract. If there's an underlying disease causing new mega-E, it's often treatable, so that's one reason to talk with the vet about doing testing.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

all you need to do is to google FDA PPI's and you will see pages of warnings among them is one concerning C Diff

here is an excerpt from one site
proton pump inhibitors work by reducing the amount of acid in the stomach. Nexium, Dexilant, Prilosec, Zegerid, Prevacid, Protonix, Aciphex, and Vimovo are available by prescription to treat conditions such as gastroesophageal reflux disease (GERD), stomach and small intestine ulcers, and inflammation of the esophagus. Prilosec OTC, Zegerid OTC, and Prevacid 24HR are sold over-the-counter (OTC) for the treatment of frequent heartburn.

The new safety information is based on FDA's review of several epidemiological studies that reported an increased risk of fractures of the hip, wrist, and spine with proton pump inhibitor use. Some studies found that those at greatest risk for these fractures received high doses of proton pump inhibitors or used them for one year or more (see Data Summary section).The majority of the studies evaluated individuals 50 years of age or older and the increased risk of fracture primarily was observed in this age group.


here is one from the FDA specific to the C Diff

https://www.fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/ucm290510.htm


now isn't that great?

Your enzyplex is more or less prozyme ++

it does not have betaine , bromelain or papain


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

thanks magwart I have not seen any reguritated material at all. When she drinks there's no issue - leaning towards her esophagus just not pushing food down enough, perhaps her spincter is not good enough anymore to stop it coming back up, or perhaps stomach acid not acidic enough to digest food and therefore overflows. 
Thanks for the links, will check them out asap


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

wow extensive information carmen thank you! am looking into the other dig. enzymes, thanks!


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

looking at the pro-bloom, my dog has an intolerance to beef products...milk protein and goat milk protein is totally different right?


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## Momto2GSDs (Mar 22, 2012)

Hi hk!

Agree with Carmen 100%……..Try “Natural” first before the drugs!

If my senior girl has meat that is too cold, this happens to her. She’ll drool for hours! I always put hot tap water in her meat mix.

The “Meaty Raw Bones” in your dogs diet could also be the culprit.
*Is it just bones or is there some Muscle Meat and organs provided too?
*Is she eating Frozen bones/meat?
*Is she eating Cold bones/meat right out of fridge?
*Now that she’s older, bones that she has to “chew” to break down may not be her friend. You may want to get a commercially prepared food that has the meat & bone ground up.

These are all quality foods. Your choice depends on what specifics (such as organic, manufacturing practices =HACCP, GMP, or Anti-Pathogen Treatment=HPP, ect.,) are important to you AND the price per pound. 
There are even more expensive products out there.

*Darwin’s: *Home delivery: http://www.darwinspet.com/ How Much should I feed? https://www.darwinspet.com/why-raw/how-to-feed-raw/ Darwin’s also makes specifically prepared diets, called “Intelligent Design, for conditions of Kidney, Liver, Cancer, Joint Support. This line needs a vets prescription. 

*Bravo:* Discover Balance Raw Diet | Beef Frozen Raw Dog Food Diet - Bravo Pet Food Find a store: Find a Bravo Retailer - Bravo Pet Food NOTE Feeding Guide Tab on the page.


*Northwest Naturals: *Beef - Northwest Naturals Find a store: Store LocatorFeeding Calculator:Feeding Calculator - Northwest Naturals


*Primal: *Complete Raw Diets for Pets: Canine Beef Formula Find a store: Primal Pet Foods: Store LocatorPronto is smaller pieces: http://www.primalpetfoods.com/product/detail/c/15/id/58NOTE: After filling in the questions, use the reference for *POUNDS or CUPS *(this is Raw Food) in the feeding calculator: http://www.primalpetfoods.com/education/calc 

*Stella & Chewys: *https://www.stellaandchewys.com/products/dog-dinner/stella-super-beef/frozen-patties/NOTE Feeding Calculator on right side of page. All S & C is HPP.

OR
As Cowboygirl suggested, you could feed The Honest Kitchen Base Mix and add your own raw, ground meat. The Honest Kitchen Dehydrated food are 100% Human Food and is the only pet food in the USA that the FDA legally allows to use the words “Human Food” on their advertising and packaging. The Honest Kitchen blends their foods in a human facility that also makes bakery mixes and breakfast cereals. For this reason, they need to abide by the same strict standards for record-keeping, safety and cleanliness that all human foods must meet. The company qualifies for the label of *human grade dog food* according to the FDA regulations, because they meet all the required standards. BASE MIX to which you add your own raw or cooked meat. https://www.thehonestkitchen.com/dog-food/base-mix


Another thought:
*Raw Goats Milk or Goat Keifer* - available at a local health food store (NOT GNC) or Whole Foods, or at ANSWERS: 
Added to her food:
From "Answers" Pet Food: "Goat milk has more buffering capacity than over the counter antacids. (The USDA and Prairie View A&M University in Texas have confirmed that goat's milk has more acid-buffering capacity than cow's milk, soy infant formula, and nonprescription antacid drugs.) Goat milk alkalinizes the digestive system. It actually contains a group of alkaline minerals, and it does not produce acid in the intestinal system. Goat milk helps to increase the pH of the blood stream because it is the dairy product highest in the amino acid L-glutamine. L-glutamine is an alkalinizing amino acid, often recommended by nutritionists." Answers also sells Raw Goats Milk: Answers Raw Pet Food Company: ADDITIONAL - Raw Goat's Milk Find a store: Answers Raw Pet Food Company: Our Products 

"According to the Journal of American Medicine, *“Goat milk is the most complete food known.”* It contains vitamins, minerals, electrolytes, trace elements, enzymes, protein, and fatty acids. In fact, the body can digest goat’s milk in 20 minutes. Having fat molecules one-fifth the size of those in cow’s milk makes it easily digestible and tolerable even for dogs with digestive issues." 
"Goats that are pastured and grass fed in a low stress environment, free of antibiotics and free of GMO feeds will produce far better quality milk. Processing, such as pasteurization or spray drying, will also lower the nutritional value of the milk." DNM

*Dr. Doug*_ Knueven _
In general, I suggest 2 oz for pets under 20 pounds, 4 oz for pets 20-50 pounds and 6 oz for pets over 50 pounds. Remember, as you add the goat’s milk probiotic supplement to your pet’s diet you are adding lots of great nutrients and bacteria but also calories. You need to decrease the food a little to compensate.

*Supplements:*
*What Is Wobenzyme N?
In Germany, Wobenzym is second in popularity only to aspirin among over-the-counter remedies. It’s also the most thoroughly researched enzyme supplement available worldwide. (The product’s proper name is Wobenzym N, but most call it Wobenzym for short.) Its blend of pancreatin, trypsin, chymotrypsin, bromelain, papain, and rutin would normally act as a digestive aid, but Wobenzym *is taken between meals on an empty stomach* and its enteric coating protects these ingredients until they are released in the small intestine. From there they move throughout the body, reducing inflammation wherever it occurs by breaking harmful proteins into smaller chains of amino acids. This type of treatment is called “systemic oral enzyme therapy.” Per WDJ 
Wobenzyme N is a Garden Of Life product available in Health Food Stores (NOT GNC), Whole Foods, and on the net. Per Dog Aware: 3 tablets once a day for dogs weighing 51-100 pounds, 2 tablets daily for dogs weighing 21 to 50 pounds.

*Sunday Sundae: (Digestive Enzyme & Pro-Biotic Combo): https://feedsentials.com/home Used Daily to establish and restore an optimized digestive function to reduce or eliminate allergies and benefit overall immune health. It has 4 direct sources of digestive enzymes and probiotics. One source is a 14 strain digestive enzyme blend plus goat whey matrix. The whey powder provides electrolytes, minerals and digestive enzymes. Probiotics are provided by an 11 strain blend plus lacto-fermented goat protein powder.


*Digestive Enzyme Drops: A Homeopathic Remedy by Professional Formulas: I used this on our first GSD many years ago when she was near death. This is given about 20 to 30 minutes before a meal, away from any food or water. You can PM me for more specific instructions on how to use a Homeopathic if this becomes a consideration for you. https://www.pureformulas.com/digestive-enzyme-drops-2-oz-by-professional-formulas.html 

Good luck and keep us posted!
Moms


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I tried home cooked diet, I tried tons of slippery elm, tons digestive enzyme and probiotic supplements. Some I did prior to vet, some intermittently with other vet treatments, like my girl did a bunch of antibiotic TX for H pylori (which she may or may not have ever had) and I'd always pound the probiotics in her after each treatment. None of that stuff was going to turn her around

My girl was on some elephant doses of antacids---both omeprazole and famotidine together at one time, all of which she has now been successfully weaned off of. 

I am happy to have found an internal medicine specialist who was supportive of trying an alternative diet for her-- he was supportive of trying home cooked again and was going to hook me up with a veterinary nurtritionist to help formulate but THK worked and it's easier and honestly there is so much else going on in my life, easier less labor intensive food for her is a big deal plus not having to worry if I've created a balanced diet

Trust me, I did not want my dog on steroids, especially not for the rest of her life. But the bottom line is, she is way better off now than she was before. Her quality of life is 100% better. That's all that matters, not my opinion of the drugs. I have always tried to keep it balanced and not rule out either side---diet, natural remedies, or traditional veterinary medicine. She still takes all the enzyme and probiotic supplements, too.

The last time I asked him couldn't we try taking her off the budesonide he said we could, but if her symptoms returned we would probably have to start over with the prednisone taper which was awful...she was incontinent on prednisone, had to wear diapers...other issues too. I just feel like why risk it at this point. She's almost eleven, she is having a great life. She is taking the lowest possible dose of the least troublesome steroid, getting good nutrition. I have a local vet and a specialist who are monitoring her and who are both people who don't want to just throw drugs at her like some previous vets were doing...SO grateful for that


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

So I have booked my dog in for an appointment with our internal med. specialist, unforunately it's nearly 1 week away. However in this time I guess I have to ability to monitor the situation further and go in with more information. Vyvyan was bright, happy and bouncing around today, although a little flat in the morning. I've got some kefir, natural yogurt, papaya and her slippery elm tea with manuka honey it made up, also putting it into kongs which may help her stay upright when she resumes eating - I'm presently giving her a gut rest. What I'm confused about though is should I feed her some yogurt, tea, honey, kefir, papaya etc, to support her tummy while she is gut resting - because that's not really resting. Or should I wait a bit longer until she actually resumes eating? Any thoughts? Much appreciated...


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

ask your vet for cerenia. It works wonders on a nauseas dog. Just to get the dog some relief while you wait to see the specialist.

If you feel comfortable giving a shot, it can be given that way even to a dog who feels nasty. Or give a pill at the point that the dog can still swallow a pill down


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

thanks the cowboysgirl i will look into that and potentially keep that handy. I believe my dog is feeling really good now, whatever it is has 'passed' for now until next time of course. I'm just a bit confused about what to do with a gut rest when potentially I could still give her some herbal tea like slippery elm, or manuka honey? I have already done so, because she was really looking for something, however still wanted to rest her from the major protein/fats in her normal food. I think i will be just feeding small frequent meals of her raw meat and a small amount of steam pumpkin until we see the vet. Long wait!!


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

cerenia -- skin sensitivity as a side effect , meaning what , sensitive to what ?

ginger is a good , safe, inexpensive anti nausea aid .


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

I've used a lot of cerenia. On different dogs. none had any side effects with it and it is fantastic for relieving nausea. So I am just guessing prevalence of side effects not that high. You can't use it too often, I think no more than 3 consecutive days. 

They even used it on my old male to help ease his pain with cancer.

However my girl no longer needs it and has not had a shot in nearly 8 months, woo hoo!!


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Cerenia works. At some point you have to consider the comfort of the animal while you figure out how, or if, it can be handled naturally.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

Jax08 said:


> Cerenia works. At some point you have to consider the comfort of the animal while you figure out how, or if, it can be handled naturally.


agree and I will just add I tried ginger too. It was not helpful for my girl.

I also tried licorice extract of some sort...after reading that it might have anti inflammatory properties. 

There was another one too, that can't remember now. Nothing worked. Nothing gave her relief. After a shot of cerenia, she would get some relief within 30 minutes and be her total self again within an hr, where if I had not given the shot she would be stressed and drool puddles doing these exaggerated swallowing motions. she could not lay her head down and sleep during these episodes. It was clear in her face she was miserable. Once the Cerenia kicked in she could sleep peacefully.


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

hollykate said:


> thanks the cowboysgirl i will look into that and potentially keep that handy. I believe my dog is feeling really good now, whatever it is has 'passed' for now until next time of course. I'm just a bit confused about what to do with a gut rest when potentially I could still give her some herbal tea like slippery elm, or manuka honey? I have already done so, because she was really looking for something, however still wanted to rest her from the major protein/fats in her normal food. I think i will be just feeding small frequent meals of her raw meat and a small amount of steam pumpkin until we see the vet. Long wait!!


Sorry to re-direct, does anyone have any comments on this in terms of gut resting??


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## kimbale (Mar 7, 2017)

hollykate said:


> Hi everyone
> Basically symptoms are as follows:
> - eats dinner, happy and eager to eat, moments to half hour later becomes a little distressed and licking lips and the air, drooling not a great deal but enough to wet the blanket/floor boards.
> -This can continue for 10 mins to 1 hour
> ...


So this sounds exactly like what my WL girl has dealt with for years. What she has is called complex partial seizures. It's very common in dogs and sounds worse than it is. It's basically a seizure/spasm of the throat and can be set off by eating. Look up "complex partial seizure in dogs licking" online and watch videos to see if it looks similar, then get a second opinion from a vet who deals with neuro issues and seizures. 


Symptoms can include:

Uncontrolled licking or chewing.
Continual swallowing/gulping
Drooling
Backwards sneezing
Easily set off by eating

It can sometimes cause vomiting and dogs have been known to try to eat things to make them throw up and stop the reflexes. If it is a type of complex partial seizure, then the dog will not be bloated or gassy as it has nothing to do with the gut (although, if an episode goes on long enough the dog can swallow enough air to become bloated). That's something to look for next time the dog has an episode.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

Kimbale what is the treatment for your dog's problem?

OP your vet ought to be able to easily tell the difference because they will probably want to ultrasound your dog. Not that expensive and not invasive and they will be able to see the inflammation.

I don't know anything about gut rest...

at one time it definitely seemed like mine would be worse when she was too hungry. I was really worried about her fasting for the endoscopy but she handled it fine.

one vet told me to feed her more smaller meals. Which didn't make an appreciable difference. She is not back to 2 meals a day after about a year of 3 meals a day.


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## kimbale (Mar 7, 2017)

No treatment. I have heard of some people needing to put their dogs on anti-seizure meds because the episodes would cause the dog to swallow too much air, and the dog would make itself vomit, but for your average case of CPS you don't really need treatment. Big things are to keep the dog from eating stuff during, keep the dog settled and keep an eye on it.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Nov 30, 2006)

Kimbale how does your vet distinguish...how do they diagnose it as seizure activity vs actual gi distress like my dog had?


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

Thank you so much everyone for your contributions, whilst it is scary to think my Vyvyan would be suffering from any of these, it is excellent to get these other ideas which will hopefully help us pin point what exactly is the problem. Vyv has been pretty well all fine today (as far as I can tell). I hope I can keep her comfortable until Wednesday. As for possible partial seizures - I have NEVER thought of this, however this is something very much worth investigating. THANK YOU. I have seen a few videos - it does look similar for Vyv. And what else would support this possibility is the fact that Vyv has ZERO runs or upset stomach to go with it. She simply experiences some sort of reflux/hipccup/uncontrolled licking, but there are no whirly noises coming from her gut, her stools are A1 ok, she has no vomitting, she did eat a bit of grass about 1-2 weeks ago and chucked that up, however there was none before nor since. She appears to have perfect digestion otherwise. I've become a paranoid today thinking it could be another intolerance, so I'm switching her over to a relatively novel protein (pork) until our vet app, however I think if this was another intolerance she would have an upset stomach the entire way through (like last time, about 5 years ago when she became intolerant to beef at her 2 year vaccine - no longer has vaxes). Surely other causes - like ulcerated stomach - would cause further issues downstream as food is not digested properly from the beginning. So I'm thinking this partial seizure and esophagitis or mega e are certainly on the table. 
Thank you all so much for your insights!!


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## hollykate (Aug 3, 2017)

Hi everyone
I thought I'd just post 2 video which demonstrate what I'm talking about. I apologise for the red tone, I guess the floor boards make everything look amber, however you can still see that it's this constant licking in the first video (bear in mind her bed was covered drool over the course of 1 hour) and the second is after she had her last meal, although she wasn't obsessively licking, there is this uncontrolled spasm in her chest/oesophagus which I do not believe to be hiccups but could be wrong. Notice there is never any gulping. Have sent the videos to our vet who we will see on wednesday. 
The second video really doesn't portray what I could see in prson very well and I need to account for the lighting next time. However whenever you see her paw go up (I think at about 8 seconds and 1 min 26 sec) her throat is also contracting and relaxing just above her shoulder. Sorry for poor quality, perhaps I can adjust the lighting on the video. 
The key points I'm talking about are 8 secs, 1.26, 1.29, 2.04. Beyond 3 mins there's virtually nothing I should trim it.


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