# Pit Bull as a playmate for my GSD?



## billsharp (May 3, 2011)

For those of you with experience with Pit Bulls, please let me know your thoughts on whether I should let Liesl have play dates with this dog.

We have a PB living behind us. He is 2 years old, named Bruno, and is an unfixed male. He lives with a nice family, they treat him well but probably don't spend quite as much time training him as they should. He and Liesl actually dug out a space under the fence we share, just big enough for him to put his head through. They whine and lick faces and wag tails with each other there almost daily.

I contacted the owners and discussed this and made a play date for them in our back yard. I picked up Bruno and walked him over to our house. He pulled a little on the leash, but was very sweet and good natured with me, obeying my heel and sit commands, and not aggressive or nervous at all. 

He has been over twice to play with Liesl now. They spend about 45 minutes in unbelievably active play. It is all chasing, jumping, mouthing, mouthing at the legs, rolling over, etc. There has been no growling, no aggression, just typical big dog play. They seem to take turns dominating each other--they'll both jump on the other's back, and then flop down with belly up as if daring the other to jump on them. They'll spontaneously take breaks and stand there panting, licking each other's mouths, and simultaneously drink deeply from the same water dish, again with no rivalry at all. Then they'll go at it again, romping and tussling. There have been no bites and no yelps, other than a couple of times when one came down particularly hard on the other's hind quarters. I've thrown one and two balls with them, and they are not possessive and almost seem to take turns fetching it. From my observation they just really get along great and enjoy each other's company. Of course, I stay with them 100% of the time, sitting in a chair in the yard with them or actually playing a bit throwing balls, etc. with them. 

HOWEVER, like everyone I've heard the horror stories of PBs who turn suddenly--"He was such a sweet dog, he'd never done anything like that before"--and I do have some concern/questions, since I have no prior experience with the breed.

So, for those of you with PB experience--does this sound ok? Should I be worried? Based on what I've observed, the only basis for worry would be the idea that PBs just can't be trusted, they're ticking time bombs. I don't think this is true, but is probably a reputation resulting from the PBs that are raised to be aggressive by irresponsible owners. Your comments and advice would be appreciated.

PS: sorry, forgot: The PB looks like it might have a little Boxer mixed in.


----------



## wildo (Jul 27, 2006)

billsharp said:


> HOWEVER, like everyone *I've heard the horror stories of PBs who turn suddenly*--"He was such a sweet dog, he'd never done anything like that before"--and I do have some concern/questions, since I have no prior experience with the breed.


I volunteer fairly regularly with a local pitbull organization and do have experience with my dog playing with them. However- the thing that stuck out the most about your story is the bolded statement above. Fact is- it's 100% untrue!! The reality is that people simply don't know "canine language" which is to say, they don't know how to read the dog. I completely disagree with statements about *any breed* "turning suddenly." I think it's entirely false.

Sounds like your dog has found a fun playmate! Enjoy it!


----------



## CarrieJ (Feb 22, 2011)

I would supervise the play, but other than that I would and in fact, do let my girl play with a Pit Bull/Bull Terrier mix. 
Both of those breeds are known for dog on dog D/A issues. And, Lord knows that female GSDs aren't exactly known to be all sweetness and light....
We just make sure that toys aren't available (they are both females---competition etc.)
I have to agree, it's pretty rowdy but it's nice to have another dog Alice's size to play with and blow off a little steam. She likes to bonk Cali (the terrier) in the head with her paws and they both have a lot to say while playing.....it's like a union meeting.

Dog's don't "just suddenly turn" nor do they "just unexplicably explode into aggression".....there is always a catalyst and a warning. Sometimes it's very still body language and extended eye contact, a lip curl, something to let you know things will turn bad.
Sounds like you have a good play session going on there.


----------



## sashadog (Sep 2, 2011)

It sounds like a wonderful time for your girl!! I would just make sure you don't get lax about supervising the play time. Also, make sure that neither dog gets too ramped up while playing and be prepared to give them a little break if needed. That is where most problems I've observed occur, just like little kids who play and play until the play gets too intense and they lose their cool. If you start to see any symptoms of them getting tired of each other then reevaluate the situation but until then, have fun!!


----------



## Dakotasmom23 (Jan 11, 2012)

I have fostered pitbulls for years and I totally agree, there is always a sign before a dog attacks/fights. Pits are wonderful, loyal, sweet, smart, playful dogs that unfortunately are apparently the official mascot of the ghetto and that has harmed the breed terribly. My only concern with this dog is that is is unaltered but since you have a female, it should be fine. Everything about his behavior sounds appropriate as does their play style. What nice match.


----------



## CarrieJ (Feb 22, 2011)

I may have to add that it's not necessarily a "breed" but a type. Terriers: tenacious, "don't back down from any challenge" I've seen it in Bostons, Jack Russells, Cairns, Westies, and yes even Yorkies. 
Wheatons are probably the most spazzy of the terriers that I've seen.

Kinda like herding dogs want to circle and bark and run the party....


----------



## billsharp (May 3, 2011)

Thanks, I appreciate the input and valuable suggestions!


----------



## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

Depends on the individual dog. 

My 8 month old female Shepherd and my 3 year old pitbull are BESSSSST friends! They NEVER stop playing together! 
My pitbull is a great playmate with all of my German Shepherds. Her play style is different but all of my shepherds love it. 

I say if the dog has a good history of playing well with dogs then go for it. But I would say that for any breed of dog not just pitbulls.


----------



## ponyfarm (Apr 11, 2010)

My mix plays with a pitbull and they have tons of rough fun. We always supervise. I really beleive that if you are aware you would notice any problems before they would arise.


----------



## GoofyCooper (Apr 5, 2014)

i've been browsing this topic.

i have the same debate.


----------



## HarleyTheGSD (Feb 13, 2012)

Just like with any dog, could even be a golden retriever, they could get upset if the other dog plays too rough. If they are getting along, I think it's a great idea to let them play together. Two high energy dogs. 
A few months ago, I saw my neighbors' pit bull playing with a stray dog. Absolutely adorable.


----------



## Harry and Lola (Oct 26, 2013)

I'm not experienced with pittbulls as they are a dangerous breed here in Australia so you don't see them often if at all (as least this is the case for me). However we do have American Staffys which I think are genetically linked to pittbulls? Lola was attacked by an AmStaff, so she doesn't like them, however Harry has had good play with one about a year ago, they both like rough play. When things got too rough, it was Harry that lost it, the AmStaff had more stamina and I suppose pain threshold. My only concern would be their ability to lock jaw.


----------



## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

Harry and Lola said:


> I'm not experienced with pittbulls as they are a dangerous breed here in Australia so you don't see them often if at all (as least this is the case for me). However we do have American Staffys which I think are genetically linked to pittbulls? Lola was attacked by an AmStaff, so she doesn't like them, however Harry has had good play with one about a year ago, they both like rough play. When things got too rough, it was Harry that lost it, the AmStaff had more stamina and I suppose pain threshold. My only concern would be their ability to lock jaw.


Their jaws don't lock. 

The problem with bulldogs is their lack of ability, in some dogs, to read and respond to calming behaviors. They don't know, or maybe don't care, when enough is enough and they continue to escalate until it's no longer a play but a fight.

If the particular dog responds to calming signals and plays in an appropriate behavior for your dog, I think it's fine to let them play as long as you supervise.

David Winners


----------



## Harry and Lola (Oct 26, 2013)

I always thought their jaws did lock?

I once saw an AmStaff lock its jaw onto another dog during a fight at a dog park, the jaw wouldn't open and the owners had to lift the 2 dogs together, put them in a car to take to the vet where the vet gave them a tranquilliser and was then able to ply open the AmStaff's jaw.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

BullMastiff/APBT very dog aggressive but was taught to ignore and he did fine when unexpected dogs popped up out of nowhere. He just stood and stared and looked at me like WTH???

Boxer mixes better, my Boxer mix still mine was still trained but very laid back anyway If your girl got pass a day one dog to dog intro...your good to go! 

I would suspect they either did a lot of work with this dog before hand or the Boxer part just makes for a less dog aggressive dog.

That's my take on it and I've had all of them.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Harry and Lola said:


> I always thought their jaws did lock?
> 
> I once saw an AmStaff lock its jaw onto another dog during a fight at a dog park, the jaw wouldn't open and the owners had to lift the 2 dogs together, put them in a car to take to the vet where the vet gave them a tranquilliser and was then able to ply open the AmStaff's jaw.


Pitts are banned but AmStaff are allowed?? 

Dual registry it's a thing.


----------



## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

Harry and Lola said:


> I always thought their jaws did lock?
> 
> I once saw an AmStaff lock its jaw onto another dog during a fight at a dog park, the jaw wouldn't open and the owners had to lift the 2 dogs together, put them in a car to take to the vet where the vet gave them a tranquilliser and was then able to ply open the AmStaff's jaw.


There is nothing different about the musculoskeletal structure of the jaw of a bulldog and any other breed. If it wouldn't let go, it wouldn't let go. 

David Winners


----------



## Harry and Lola (Oct 26, 2013)

Pittbulls are a restricted breed in Oz which means they can no longer be bought, sold or given away. Those who already own such a dog must register them with the City. Owners of restricted breeds and dogs that are declared dangerous must adhere to the following rules.

- The dog must be desexed, microchipped and registered
- At home, the dog must be kept inside a purpose built enclosure and warning signs must be displayed on the property.
- The dog must wear a securely fitted muzzle when outside its enclosure (at home or in a public place).
- When outside the enclosure, the dog must wear a distinctive red and yellow striped collar and be walked on a secure chain or lead.
-The dog can never be walked off its leash, even in a designated off-leash park.

Now I'm not an expert on this breed, but from my understanding American Staffys is the same type of dog as the Pittbull but is breed for different purposes and size? 

Also, I researched the 'lock jaw' of pitts and staffies and apparently it is an urban myth. I think these dogs get a bad rap, just like GSDs. I have an unfounded fear of Pitts and Staffies which I think has been born from urban myths and seeing their power and strength. This makes me realise how other people may perceive our breed and explain why so many people are frightened of GSDS - perhaps urban myths?


----------



## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

Pit Bull is a type of dog not a breed. The definition varies depending on who you ask. There are a lot of different breeds that look similar and are branded pit bull by those that look at them. If you dig a little, you will find a subculture split into several categories, similar to WL/SL GSDs.

The term Pit Bull means a dog that was bred to fight in a pit. Just like sled dogs are bred to mush, herders to herd, sight hounds to run. If the dog was not bred to fight, it is a bull dog according to most breeders. I only use the term on my dog because I want people to know he is a mix of the dreaded pit bull breeds, and is a very well behaved dog.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Harry and Lola said:


> Pittbulls are a restricted breed in Oz which means they can no longer be bought, sold or given away. Those who already own such a dog must register them with the City. Owners of restricted breeds and dogs that are declared dangerous must adhere to the following rules.
> 
> - The dog must be desexed, microchipped and registered
> - At home, the dog must be kept inside a purpose built enclosure and warning signs must be displayed on the property.
> ...


Old thread but here you go. 


UKC Forums - Dual-registering AKC AmStaffs as UKC APBTs

You go buy a "Pitt" on Cragislist for Free and $20 bucks on up to $2500.
So the entry point is a low. And that's how Pitts get to be such a problem in America .

Pitts would have to be handle after a fight ,they have no human aggression breed into them..people do that. They do come with Dog to Dog aggression "pre installed" as it were. That can be trained and conditioned out... that take work most likely someone that pays $20 bucks for a dog is not up to that task??

My guy Gunther loved people and kids and kittens. None of my dogs were ever allowed around kids unsupervised, even my anything on twos legs is 
a good time, Boxer that was my policy.

But my BullMastiff/APBT/Lab mix without my intervention much different story without my intervention! He would have happily fought with any dog that came his way!

My work save the life of at least two dogs when they came into range unexpectedly. A hole neighbor, the first dog popped through the fence in the back yard, my guys stood their ground and I retrieved the dog and returned her. Then in the front yard while I was under the car a little piece of crap dog got right in Gunthers face barking at him!

Gunther stood his ground stared hard but didn't strike, I got the little A hole away from him . 

So bottom line is training, simple as that.


----------



## cltyus (Feb 8, 2014)

I've had pit bulls for years. They are terriers, and were originally bred to fight, but the pit bulls nowadays are not like the hardcore fighting dogs from back in the day usually. With that being said, they can play really rough with other dogs and sometimes have quick scuffles. They don't literally lock, but their jaws are extremely strong and when they are determined to bite and hold, those bad boys bite and hold. If you can read dogs you will know if it's ok. I've had many play dates with pit bulls, and little fights have broken out, but just normal dog fights, growling trying to pin each other. One will come out on top, then they'll continue playing, now two dogs that won't submit could be bad....and I've seen some girls get really nasty! Make sure to monitor them because they could get really rough and blood can be drawn. And watch signs, for a potential fight and if it does break out, have a plan to break it up. Just like gsds, some are more dog aggressive and shouldn't play with other dogs because that could be bad.


----------



## Sarah~ (Apr 30, 2012)

I own an American Pit Bull Terrier mix and a GSD. David had a good point about the not responding to calming behaviors Xena (pit mix) often takes much longer to settle down and will keep nipping at Eko (GSD) after he is laying down and ignoring her. I do sometimes have to step in and put her in a down or run her through some commands or something to switch her from OMG OMG PLAY PLAY PLAY mode to being relaxed. With pits they are often getting even more ramped up when other dogs are tiring out. And the more excited they are, the more rough they get, until you have a fight.

That said I love the combination when they have the right personalities. Pit bulls are often DA, usually shows up around maturity, so I would be careful having any dog around a pit. Xena is dog friendly, Eko is not but he is friendly to Xena. Even so they are never in the same room or outside alone! I also keep a break stick close 24/7. David is right the jaws do not lock but they do not let go if they do not WANT to let go. 

My definition of pit bull is American Pit Bull terrier, nothing else. I don't like that pit bull is used as a type of dog, since only one breed of dog has it in their name. I use "bully breeds" to describe pits, bulldogs, staffies, American bullies, etc.


----------



## Sarah~ (Apr 30, 2012)

Here is Xena and Eko playing nicely


----------

