# Is grain free bad for dogs?



## kat12510 (Dec 18, 2016)

My vet told me that grain free dog food is worse for dogs because they need grains to maintain digestion, and that GF foods are too rich and high in protein. She mentioned that dogs are natural omnivores and need both grains and protein in their diet. She brought this up after I said I'm using a GF puppy good for my 10 week old GSD. I have a 6yo pointer who's been eating GF for years and does great. What do you all think?


----------



## kekipi (Oct 31, 2016)

There are many other folks more qualified than me to explain all the details of it, but my opinion and understanding based on the research I've seen is that your vet is incorrect. Dogs certainly do not need grains to maintain digestion- and definitely not the type and quantity of grain in most commercial dog food. As for the richness and protein content, if the food is designed to be a complete, nutritionally balanced option (for a large breed puppy at this point, given your GSD's age) and it works for your dog I see no reason to be concerned. If you share what brand/variety you're feeding I'm sure others on the forum will have additional input on it.

If you're looking for more info on grain free, or just talking points for your vet, I believe Dr. Becker has some YouTube videos on the topic. The archives on this forum might also be useful.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk


----------



## LJak007 (Aug 22, 2016)

Hi, this is a rather sore spot for me and I have done lots of research on prepared food for animals. It has been my experience with my previous vet that most vets are completely clueless about nutrition, imo, anyone that can peddle that Science Diet crap with a straight face has no business telling you what is best for your dog to eat. Now I have changed vets but have yet to discuss food with them as I no longer have any pets but I fed all my previous dogs grain free for almost 15 years and they have all done fine on it, adding chicken, veggies and fruits if they will eat them. Since you have fed your older doggie the grain free food for years with much success I would follow feeding your puppy the same way. Good luck


----------



## CarrieJo (Oct 1, 2016)

LJak007 said:


> Hi, this is a rather sore spot for me and I have done lots of research on prepared food for animals. It has been my experience with my previous vet that most vets are completely clueless about nutrition, imo, anyone that can peddle that Science Diet crap with a straight face has no business telling you what is best for your dog to eat. Now I have changed vets but have yet to discuss food with them as I no longer have any pets but I fed all my previous dogs grain free for almost 15 years and they have all done fine on it, adding chicken, veggies and fruits if they will eat them. Since you have fed your older doggie the grain free food for years with much success I would follow feeding your puppy the same way. Good luck



I have come to the same conclusion about doctors including specialist and nutritionist for people after 16 years of researching stuff about cancer. I actually had a nutritionist tell me of all people that juicing would not make any difference in my husband's health. As soon as we walked out of there my husband looked at me and said, "you know more than she does." I said yup. Total waste of our time and parking fee. 

When the doctor books finally stop being written by the pharmaceutical companies maybe our country will have a chance to start to heal. The only doctors I ever like are the older ones they have been around too long to not open their eyes on what they are doing. 

I also tell people the same thing about bird pellets being as bad as dog food. fresh veggies and fruit, sprouting, etc are the way to go.


----------



## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)




----------



## CatChandler (Jul 25, 2016)

The grain-free foods on the market meet AAFCO nutrition standards, which is the "complete and balanced" seal of approval for kibble. Omnivores can DIGEST both meat and plant foods. It means they CAN consume either, not that they need both(!). Also, grains are not the only plant-based food.

Some medical conditions require that dogs eat grain-free food. I wonder how your vet treats those dogs?


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Grain free does not mean vegetation free. It means the grains have been replaced with peas, chick peas, potatoes and various other vegetables. It does not mean the food is higher in protein. It means there are no grains in there. 

If you want to settle this argument with your vet, look at the percentage of protein in your food and compare it to the percentage in the food your vet wants you to use. Also compare the amount of protein that comes from plant source vs meat source in that food.


----------



## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

There are also differences in protein...


----------



## scarfish (Apr 9, 2013)

i had a dog that was allergic to some grain, never figure out what. she used to get belly rashes all the time 'till i switched to grain free natures variety and never got another rash so i stuck with it. unless there is a specific reason like that to feed grain free i wouldn't bother spending the few extra bucks a bag for it.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

scarfish said:


> unless there is a specific reason like that to feed grain free i wouldn't bother spending the few extra bucks a bag for it.


I agree. Personally, I think the grain free thing is the newest fad with no scientific data to back it up. they replace corn with peas. Wheat with potatoes. What have you really gained? What nutrients have you improved on?


----------



## Galathiel (Nov 30, 2012)

I don't think I would label dogs as omnivores.

Here were some points given at a conference (you can see the whole article if you google it:

*Dogs have adapted well… but that doesn’t make them carnivores. *In the fifteen thousand years it’s now believed dogs have lived beside humans, they’ve evolved. So, too, have humans. We’ve shifted from that Paleolithic, hunter-gatherer diet to one that reflects an agrarian condition.
In the case of dogs, we’ve found a few genes that reflect this adaptation. So, too, have we found genes that indicate a neurologic adaptation to cohabitation with humans. But just a few genes’ difference is regarded as an adaptive shift to a condition. These alone can’t possibly alter the entire digestive evolution of a species.
Indeed, dogs still have plenty of traits that are 100 percent carnivorous:

Dogs’ teeth are adapted to a carnivorous diet (for tearing muscle and crunching bone to extract marrow).
Many of their innate behaviors are carnivorous in nature. Consider digging, for example. Like wolves, dogs dig to hide parts of meals for future ingestion.
Dogs, like many large mammalian carnivores, are metabolically able to survive for long periods of time between meals.
Dogs have a lot of flexibility in metabolic pathways to help make up for a feast-or-famine lifestyle and a wide range of possible prey.
The result of these findings, argues Dr. Hendriks, is that the dog is undeniably a true carnivore. The dog just happens to have an adaptive metabolism as a result of living with humans for millennia. That’s why the dog is perfectly capable of eating a grain-based diet, as most commercially fed dogs do.


----------



## dz0qp5 (Oct 12, 2004)

My dogs seem to do better with grains in their diet.


----------



## dz0qp5 (Oct 12, 2004)

My dogs do better on foods with grains in them, much less digestive upset.


----------



## kat12510 (Dec 18, 2016)

Both of them are on Taste of the Wild, the puppy version for my GSD. It's just frustrating that vets like to peddle the garbage food out there. When I asked for a recommendation on a puppy food that included grains (so I could do my research at home) she said "honestly I just go with the classics. Always have. Iams, Purina, Eukanuba, all good foods, you can't go wrong." Like .... okay....... no thanks. Lol


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Iams, Purina and Eukanuba? Really?

If you want a grain food, I would look into Victor. Not sure if they have LBP food though. Victor also has grain free food.


----------



## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Vets depend on what Purina or Hills tells them. That's generally the limit on their nutritional studies. For the most part I think we all just depend on our experience with the different foods. My dogs do well on Taste of The Wild, they don't on Orijin. My dog was good on Abady and raw. I'd just stick with whatever works for your dogs and ignore the vet except for treating illness or injuries. She may not be the best person to ask about training either.


----------



## ronracer (Dec 27, 2016)

Well your Vets technically right. Dogs do need a little grain in their diets for digestion. The problem comes with the definition of grains in the market. When food says "grain free" what they mean is without fillers. Things like soy meal and wheat gluten do not have any real nutritional value and are more binding agents than food. But when you look high quality grain in brands like Canidae, Natutres logic or Fromm where it says whole grain rice or millet its actually a part of the diet.


----------

