# Best Breeder in the USA ??



## Chuck9584 (Apr 6, 2018)

Hello, Im looking to buy my first german shepherd pup. Im interested in a male so I can have as a companion. I need it to be medium drive. 
I want the looks of a working line but the personality of a showline. Sable short coat preferred. I guess I want a Working line with medium drive who has great genetics. What breeder would have the dog for me? 

- $2500 budget since I plan on paying the breeder to keep the dog for early obedience/crate/potty/ training which I know will run me $1500+ more. My max out the door is $5000 and $5000 better get me the best frikkin dog with the best temperament already trained ready to protect me if need be. 

I’ve been researching and so far I have the following breeders in mind but I want to know who is the best? Im also looking to have a puppy before the year ends (the sooner the better) 
I also dont mind traveling across the country as long as I find the perfect match for me but would prefer to keep travel/shipping costs low. 
I live in Connecticut btw. 

Mybodyguard in IL
Camelot German Shepherds in TN
Wolfstraum in PA 
Warkonhaus in PA
Hollowhills in PA 

Please help me, post the best breeder in the usa or close to it. I never tought this would be this hard.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

I can’t figure out which parts of this are real, and which are a joke. Hmmm


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## Chuck9584 (Apr 6, 2018)

What do you mean?
If you have nothing helpful to comment just keep it moving. Im obviously looking for advice & help. No need for you to think im joking.


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## konathegsd (Dec 3, 2016)

5000 for a fully trained dog that will protect you? I think you mean 15000...
No puppy is going to protect you either, so are you talking about an adult dog?
It sounds like you want a golden retriever personality with a working line shepherd looks ?


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Chuck9584 said:


> Hello, Im looking to buy my first german shepherd pup. Im interested in a male so I can have as a companion. I need it to be medium drive.
> I want the looks of a working line but the personality of a showline. Sable short coat preferred. I guess I want a Working line with medium drive who has great genetics. What breeder would have the dog for me?
> 
> - $2500 budget since I plan on paying the breeder to keep the dog for early obedience/crate/potty/ training which I know will run me $1500+ more. My max out the door is $5000 and $5000 better get me the best frikkin dog with the best temperament already trained ready to protect me if need be.
> ...


I'm not very smart but I will try and help you out here, since you seem very focused on this.

Are you looking for a puppy or an older puppy or a mature trained dog? 
If you are looking for a fully trained protection dog your price is low, if you are looking for a dog with a good start you are still low, if you are looking for a well bred pup with basics out of the way (crate/potty/ obedience started) you may be able to find something.
More importantly, dogs are not plug and play. And they are not assembly line toys. It isn't as simple as I want option a, b and c make my order. My suggestion is to hang out here, talk to some breeders in your area, attend some events and see what you like and go from there. 
Dogs are probably the last thing in or lives that you can't just throw money at. It's not that simple.

Good luck in your search


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

Sabis mom said:


> My suggestion is to hang out here, talk to some breeders in your area, attend some events and see what you like and go from there.
> 
> Good luck in your search


If you can travel I would also recommend this ^. Go to an IPO field and see if they will allow you to watch training. Talk to the folks waiting their turn to use the field, not to find the best breeder but to help you see what each dog is capable of and what it took to get it there. Or you can go to an AKC rally group or herding group. The more you talk to GSD people the more likely you are to find a breeder and dog that will suit your lifestyle.


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## Chuck9584 (Apr 6, 2018)

To kona: no im not looking for a guard dog. I was a little sarcastic but $5000 better get me a healthy smart dog. Thats my realistic expectation. $5000 with basics out the way: potty, crate & obedience.


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## Chuck9584 (Apr 6, 2018)

To sabis mom
Yes im looking for a puppy that is already born or still in the womb that I can place a deposit on. $5000 budget and i want that to cover the basics, crate, potty & obedience. I spoke to one of the breeders that i listed and i was told $4500 but there’s no puppys available right now from them.


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## Chuck9584 (Apr 6, 2018)

I can travel to pick up the dog but i dont have the time or money to spend traveling to events and talking to people.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Yes going to events in your area will help you get connected with some breeders and give you a chance to get familiar with the breed. My advise stay away from people who tell you showlines are similar to golden retrievers or that they are the best breeder lo! Each dog has a different temperament in a litter and ranges so finding a good reputable breeder is the best chance you will get what you want. I have a pup from Hollow hills and very happy with her and would recommend Hollow hills always. Wolfstraum is another breeder who is highly recommend on here.contact the breeders and the dogs and have fun in your search.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Chuck9584 said:


> I can travel to pick up the dog but i dont have the time or money to spend traveling to events and talking to people.



First off, breeders have reservations on upcoming litters...I have one coming and have 5 people on males....will I have 5 males? Hopefully I will....hopefully I will have more than 5....as I have a couple extra showing on x-ray! 

BUT !!!!! this comment is very concerning....it is NOT about the price.....to get that pup to that level, you MIGHT be able to do it for $5000.....but that is going to take a few months and then you will HAVE to have the time for the puppy.....and it is STILL a puppy! When it leaves me, it will need intensive one on one to change it's focus from me to you....recently sold a female I had raised and the dog was stressed and distraught to have been taken away from me and her pack....it is fine now and very bonded to the new family...but the new owners had to work to get that transfer of affection to them...now I am told she is very loving and bonded to them.

Lee


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## Chip Blasiole (May 3, 2013)

Chuck9584 said:


> Hello, Im looking to buy my first german shepherd pup. Im interested in a male so I can have as a companion. I need it to be medium drive.
> I want the looks of a working line but the personality of a showline. Sable short coat preferred. I guess I want a Working line with medium drive who has great genetics. What breeder would have the dog for me?
> 
> - $2500 budget since I plan on paying the breeder to keep the dog for early obedience/crate/potty/ training which I know will run me $1500+ more. My max out the door is $5000 and $5000 better get me the best frikkin dog with the best temperament already trained ready to protect me if need be.
> ...


I think you are going about the process all wrong. If you want a companion, one of the best ways is to start with a pup. Looks of a working line and personality of a show line is so vague it is meaningless. It sounds like looks are more important to you than working ability. If you want the best dog, you really need to know how to train the dog yourself. Medium drive with great genetics seems like an oxymoron to me, but that is my bias. You might want to reevaluate.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

Chuck9584 said:


> To kona: no im not looking for a guard dog. I was a little sarcastic but $5000 better get me a healthy smart dog. Thats my realistic expectation. $5000 with basics out the way: potty, crate & obedience.


You were being sarcastic, yet I shouldn’t have assumed you were joking. You’re right, I should just keep it moving....


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I know three of the breeders on your list. One just answered you and the other two wouldn't be any more impressed with your post than she was.


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## Chip Blasiole (May 3, 2013)

Chuck9584 said:


> Hello, Im looking to buy my first german shepherd pup. Im interested in a male so I can have as a companion. I need it to be medium drive.
> I want the looks of a working line but the personality of a showline. Sable short coat preferred. I guess I want a Working line with medium drive who has great genetics. What breeder would have the dog for me?
> 
> - $2500 budget since I plan on paying the breeder to keep the dog for early obedience/crate/potty/ training which I know will run me $1500+ more. My max out the door is $5000 and $5000 better get me the best frikkin dog with the best temperament already trained ready to protect me if need be.
> ...


The other thing you mentioned was that you wanted a dog with medium drive. Again, too vague. Dogs have different drives, such as prey, defense, food, etc. One thought is to look into people promoting that they breed DDR (East German) GSDs. IMO, the vast majority are not true DDR dogs since the DDR has not been around for many years. But they tend to have nice bone, dark pigment and generally speaking, not as much prey drive as some other "lines." But they can be more reactive, sharp, defensive. I see it more as branding/marketing than actual bloodlines.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

if you want show line personality then choose a show line dog 

if you like sable then look into American show line dogs .


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## Chuck9584 (Apr 6, 2018)

wolfstraum said:


> Chuck9584 said:
> 
> 
> > I can travel to pick up the dog but i dont have the time or money to spend traveling to events and talking to people.
> ...


I have the time for a dog which is why I want one, I never said I didnt. I said I didnt have time to travel to shows and talk to people. I understand that it will take time and effort to transfer that focus from you to me. I dont expect a guard dog for 5,000. I just want a nice healthy puppy in the color sable or black from a breeder who can get the process of crate,potty training, basic commands started for me. I dont need the dog to be extremely high drive so that’s why I mentioned medium drive/calm. Maybe people assumed I meant that I want a labrador personality so that I can just leave it at home all day? NO that’s not what I meant. 
I may spend a little more if I have to. Obviously the less I spend ? The better! 
tried to contact you via the facebook group but my join request was denied. How can I contact you regarding a puppy? You are very well recommended from all the posts i’ve read on this forum.


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## pam (Apr 6, 2009)

Good breeders look for buyers who are willing to listen and learn so that if a problem should occur, the new owner will listen to advice, whether it be for training, feeding, activity or anything else. Their concern is that the puppy they placed will thrive and remain in that home for its entire life and that the owner will enjoy even the more trying puppy and adolescent phases of development. A defensive or "I know what I want to the exclusion of everything else" attitude runs the risk of eliminating an individual from the buyer list of these breeders. Slow down and open yourself to the incredible amount of information that is readily available to those with an open mind and willingness to learn. You may discover options and activities that you never even considered--I did. While I have owned dogs most of my adult life, the challenge and joy of learning and advancing in training with a well bred dog has taken the pleasure of living with my dogs to a whole new level. A large part of that success was due to the ongoing support of a breeder who was willing to share her knowledge and experience so long as I was willing to listen. For the first time in my very long life, I have titled a dog. The training process was challenging and the rewards, including an incredible bond with my dogs, great. My breeder was there to offer support, guidance and advice from years of experience to smooth over the rough spots and to reassure when I was feeling a little lost. A little adjustment in your approach to this may get you where you want to be much faster. Good luck in your search. There are some very good breeders out there--I hope you end up feeling as lucky as I do.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Do more research before trying to buy a dog. Breeders look for experience, ability to train and how realistic a buyer is. They each have their own criteria, but your demands would put off most quality breeders. I have a WL dog, and I know if my breeder got a letter worded like your post, she would ignore it. Not because you can’t get what you want, but because you don’t sound like you really understand working line dogs. I am usually good at picking up humor and I didn’t see any in your post. I agree, go to IPO clubs, meet people with dogs you like and find out who they bought from. Don’t talk so much about price. Let the breeders tell you what their prices are or read their websites.

There is not one best breeder. There are many top breeders.


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## SlipperyRug (Apr 24, 2016)

So to clarify.. do you have the time to do your own training? Obedience/potty or otherwise? Dogs do take maintence. So even if you found a .. 8-12 month old that was already trained through into basic bite or obedience you would still need to continue that in either a full on training several times a week, or almost the same amont of time to maintain what you have. 

Also, if anyone tells you a dog is completely potty trained within 8-16 weeks is blowing smoke. 

You MIGHT find you a really nice puppy with a health guarantee but even then it isn’t actually 100%. 

But these are the kind of questions any breeders are going to ask if you go visit them, and if they don’t then you shouldn’t want to deal with them.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

SlipperyRug said:


> So to clarify.. do you have the time to do your own training? Obedience/potty or otherwise? Dogs do take maintence. So even if you found a .. 8-12 month old that was already trained through into basic bite or obedience you would still need to continue that in either a full on training several times a week, or almost the same amont of time to maintain what you have.
> 
> *Also, if anyone tells you a dog is completely potty trained within 8-16 weeks is blowing smoke. *
> 
> ...


If anyone can't house train by 4 months then they aren't doing it right. Potty training is time consuming day to day if done correctly but doesn't take months.


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## Ken Clean-Air System (Feb 27, 2012)

Just out of curiosity, why would you pay 1000s more dollars than you need to for something that is easy, fun and helps establish an early bond between you and the new puppy?

Good luck in your search. I'd recommend researching lines before you decide on show or working line. Either can make a great companion, but you need to know what the expectations are going in concerning temperament and drives.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

Chip Blasiole said:


> The other thing you mentioned was that you wanted a dog with medium drive. Again, too vague. Dogs have different drives, such as prey, defense, food, etc. One thought is to look into people promoting that they breed DDR (East German) GSDs. IMO, the vast majority are not true DDR dogs since the DDR has not been around for many years. But they tend to have nice bone, dark pigment and generally speaking, not as much prey drive as some other "lines." But they can be more reactive, sharp, defensive. I see it more as branding/marketing than actual bloodlines.


While the DDR is gone - there are DDR bloodlines that have been protected and used to continue forward with dogs who are therefore pure DDR in background.....it is a "type" or a "subtype" of specific lines....horse people do this all the time yet no one gets offended or ticked off when a pure Egyptian or Polish Arabian is bred or sold....

Yes - there are plenty of people who jump on the bandwagon without a clue and market DDR dogs to John Q Public who find the black sable, big headed, strong boned dog attractive.....I have plenty of DDR lines within my dogs and even get the occasional black sable! There are pure DDR lines out there..

Lee


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## konathegsd (Dec 3, 2016)

Is black sable only in DDR dogs ?


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## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

Hello OP and welcome to the forum. There's lots of info here to help you pick a responsible and top-quality breeder who has stable and healthy puppies. The "best" breeder is hard to quantify. The best breeder for me may not be the best for you. There is nothing wrong with wanting to get an older puppy who has had some foundation training, but you still have to be knowledgeable enough to implement and maintain that training when the puppy or dog comes home. 

More important than looks is temperament. Could you elaborate on what you mean when you said you wanted a working line GSD with a showline temperment. If you like showline temperament (have you met any?) then I would recommend looking for a showline breeder who has dogs with moderate structure. There are both German (WGSL) and American showlines (ASL). 

Why do you want a GSD? What do you intend to do with the dog? What dog-experience do you have? Have you ever trained a dog? Do you have other pets, young kids? What is your living situation like? I think that answering some of these questions will help others to advise you on breeders.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

sebrench said:


> Why do you want a GSD? What do you intend to do with the dog? What dog-experience do you have? Have you ever trained a dog? Do you have other pets, young kids? What is your living situation like? I think that answering some of these questions will help others to advise you on breeders.


I agree, and answering those questions will make it more likely that a breeder would be to consider your for one of their puppies. It's really the bare minimum information I'd be providing when I approach a breeder.

There is no one best breeder. There isn't even one best breeder of working lines, or show lines, or herding lines, etc. Rather than trying to narrow your list to one breeder, it might be helpful to be more specific about all the things that that sebrench mentions - who you are, what your prior dog experience has been, what your level of behavior and training knowledge is, what your plans are for this dog and what local training resources are available to you in order to get there, what your level of commitment is with regards to training, and of course your living situation. 

I wouldn't expect any breeder to give me the time of day if the only things they knew about me was what gender puppy I wanted, how much I was willing to spend, what I wanted it to look like, and that I expected it to be crate trained, housebroken, and have some basic obedience before I got it. That's why you're getting the responses you are.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

konathegsd said:


> Is black sable only in DDR dogs ?


Genetically - sable is sable is sable is sable....


Depth of pigment can differ in sables just like in black and tans....thus the "red" "silver" and "black" sables....

There are very very very very few TRUE black sables! There are more very dark sables, routinely called "black sable" by buyers and sellers....a TRUE black sable is nearly indistinguishable from a black dog, showing the agouti/banded hair shaft when ruffled, and very very little tan elsewhere....but for the sake of common usage, lets call the dark ones "black" sables...

No - they are not limited to DDR lines....more common there, but I have had some from DDR/Belgian/Czech/WGR combinations.....some very attractive ones! My first were in my C litter - half WGR and nearly half DDR lines....


Lee


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## Whiteshepherds (Aug 21, 2010)

Sabis mom said:


> If anyone can't house train by 4 months then they aren't doing it right. Potty training is time consuming day to day if done correctly but doesn't take months.


I agree but you can't train the dog's bladder (etc) to be larger than it is, so while a pup may learn relatively quickly to let you know when he has to go out, there has to be someone home to receive the message. 

To the OP I hope you understand that even if the pup comes home potty trained at 4 mths old (that would be 8 extra weeks with the breeder...that's a long time) it's still a puppy and most puppies can't hold their bladder for 8-12 hours during the day so you'd still need someone to let the dog out if you work during the day. (They seem to do better at night by that age)


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

Whiteshepherds said:


> I agree but you can't train the dog's bladder (etc) to be larger than it is, so while a pup may learn relatively quickly to let you know when he has to go out, there has to be someone home to receive the message.
> 
> )


the same can be said whether a dog is 4 months or 4 years old. It doesn't mean that the dog isn't fully potty trained. It means that the human didn't make it home in the time that the dog was able to hold it.


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## rshkr (Feb 9, 2012)

wolfstraum said:


> While the DDR is gone - there are DDR bloodlines that have been protected and used to continue forward with dogs who are therefore pure DDR in background.....it is a "type" or a "subtype" of specific lines....horse people do this all the time yet no one gets offended or ticked off when a pure Egyptian or Polish Arabian is bred or sold....
> 
> Yes - there are plenty of people who jump on the bandwagon without a clue and market DDR dogs to John Q Public who find the black sable, big headed, strong boned dog attractive.....I have plenty of DDR lines within my dogs and even get the occasional black sable! There are pure DDR lines out there..
> 
> Lee


right on!
german shepherds that are bred,born and raised in the usa and never stepped foot in germany should be called american shepherds. lol

am so happy to have a DDR dog and the naysayers can suck it and i will post "DDR" every chance i get to aggravate them.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

rshkr said:


> right on!
> german shepherds that are bred,born and raised in the usa and never stepped foot in germany should be called american shepherds. lol
> 
> am so happy to have a DDR dog and the naysayers can suck it and i will post "DDR" every chance i get to aggravate them.



It never ceases to amaze me when people argue over things like that! I did horses for well over 30 years....Arabs, TBs, Warmbloods, Apps, Morgans and even QH.....horse people don't argue about type like dog people.....It is not a shame or a reason for a person doing Ranch or Hunter or Reining to heckle/treat badly a person doing halter horses ....it is just a fact that they are bred for type and different purpose...warmbloods are very split in type/lines for jumper/hunter and dressage...it is a fact and there is no resentment or jealously of a halter horse owner by a cutting horse....

really puzzles me to see the enemity between fanciers of different type in the GSD


Lee


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## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

Forget everything except the puppy in front of you...then you never go wrong! Love him/her even when it's challenging, then love them some more..it'll all work out in the end, if you have that sort of mentality it's all good! If not, why did you get a puppy?


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

wolfstraum said:


> I did horses for well over 30 years....Arabs, TBs, Warmbloods, Apps, Morgans and even QH.....horse people don't argue about type like dog people....really puzzles me to see the enemity between fanciers of different type in the GSD


We must have travelled in different circles because I've seen and heard the exact same prejudices among horsepeople --- in pretty much every discipline. Enter the dressage ring on an Arab or an Appendix (especially if it's colored) and the railbirds start flapping their jaws. And, warmbloods were often called 'dumbbloods' in the h/j and eventing worlds --- until they started winning.

Some people will always seek out ways to seem or feel better than others, almost always at the others expense (e.g., "my dog/horse is bigger/badder/better than yours"). Says more about them and their needs than it does about the dog or horse...

Aly


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

SlipperyRug said:


> So to clarify.. do you have the time to do your own training? Obedience/potty or otherwise? Dogs do take maintence. So even if you found a .. 8-12 month old that was already trained through into basic bite or obedience you would still need to continue that in either a full on training several times a week, or almost the same amont of time to maintain what you have.
> 
> Also, if anyone tells you a dog is completely potty trained within 8-16 weeks is blowing smoke.
> 
> ...


I think we differ on completely potty train by 16 weeks. I got a 8-10 week puppy for 9 consecutive years, the longest it took me to potty train was 5 days, two of the pups never had accident in house, and two only one. If you put the time in and read the signs, they pick it up very early. ( and I mean by five days all were going all night with not accidents) 
I see prolonged potty training as usually something owner is doing wrong or not understanding how.


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

rshkr said:


> right on!
> german shepherds that are bred,born and raised in the usa and never stepped foot in germany should be called american shepherds. lol
> 
> am so happy to have a DDR dog and the naysayers can suck it and i will post "DDR" every chance i get to aggravate them.


And should Shepherds born, bred, and raised in China be called Chinese shepherds.....smh&#55358;&#56616;


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Aly said:


> We must have travelled in different circles because I've seen and heard the exact same prejudices among horsepeople --- in pretty much every discipline. Enter the dressage ring on an Arab or an Appendix (especially if it's colored) and the railbirds start flapping their jaws. And, warmbloods were often called 'dumbbloods' in the h/j and eventing worlds --- until they started winning.
> 
> Some people will always seek out ways to seem or feel better than others, almost always at the others expense (e.g., "my dog/horse is bigger/badder/better than yours"). Says more about them and their needs than it does about the dog or horse...
> 
> Aly


Yup, not sure what reason the gossips at the barn found for backstabbing me: probably because they were mainly h/j eventing people, and my horse was a 15 h. grade Arab with a stag neck that I'd literally gotten for nothing, because her former owner knew she'd get a good home! She pulled like a train, and I was told I'd never control her, not without a curb bit or at least a twisted snaffle. The girl who told me this had a daddy with bottomless pockets, who paid one of the barn hands to trailer two of his kid's horses to Spruce Meadows, and allowed the barn hand's horse to ride along for free...

Excuse me, if some of us don't have that sort of money, and are making do with what we can afford on lowly office worker's salary! 

Oh, and about that bit? It took me awhile, but with the help of my instructor, I eventually got her head down, her neck flexed,and rode her on the bit with just a regular snaffle...


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

cliffson1 said:


> I think we differ on completely potty train by 16 weeks. I got a 8-10 week puppy for 9 consecutive years, the longest it took me to potty train was 5 days, two of the pups never had accident in house, and two only one. If you put the time in and read the signs, they pick it up very early. ( and I mean by five days all were going all night with not accidents)
> I see prolonged potty training as usually something owner is doing wrong or not understanding how.


Cliff - I want you to potty break all my puppies!!!! 

LOL LOL I know it is me....I always screw this one up because of a failure to communicate....ie patience!!!

Lee


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

cliffson1 said:


> And should Shepherds born, bred, and raised in China be called Chinese shepherds.....smh��


Cliff, I'm afraid that's a whole 'nother can of worms! If they look like the dog below, YES, they SHOULD!! :surprise:

This is NOT photoshopped, unfortunately. There are videos on the web showing these dogs in action. There have been several threads on the PDB discussing these monstrosities:
oh my lord, i will never speak ill of an ASL again after seeing this - Page 1


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

To me getting a chihuahua pup to potty outside during the dead of winter and never uses wee pads-is a brag ! Lol!


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Sunsilver said:


> Aly said:
> 
> 
> > We must have travelled in different circles because I've seen and heard the exact same prejudices among horsepeople --- in pretty much every discipline. Enter the dressage ring on an Arab or an Appendix (especially if it's colored) and the railbirds start flapping their jaws. And, warmbloods were often called 'dumbbloods' in the h/j and eventing worlds --- until they started winning.
> ...


Can you imagine if people did not even realize what they sounded like!


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

Jenny720 said:


> Can you imagine if people did not even realize what they sounded like!


Don't think they would care; competition doesn't always bring out the best in people...

Aly


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

Sunsilver said:


> It took me awhile, but with the help of my instructor, I eventually got her head down, her neck flexed,and rode her on the bit with just a regular snaffle...


[With apologies to the originator], whether it's dogs or horses, "living well is the best revenge." You improved the horse and it's way of going, and probably picked up some useful skills along the way. I believe it's the same principle with dogs too. 

Good on you!

Aly


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Aly said:


> Jenny720 said:
> 
> 
> > Can you imagine if people did not even realize what they sounded like!
> ...


Lol! No competition does not always bring out the best in people for sure!


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

cliffson1 said:


> I think we differ on completely potty train by 16 weeks. I got a 8-10 week puppy for 9 consecutive years, the longest it took me to potty train was 5 days, two of the pups never had accident in house, and two only one. If you put the time in and read the signs, they pick it up very early. ( and I mean by five days all were going all night with not accidents)
> I see prolonged potty training as usually something owner is doing wrong or not understanding how.


Do you limit water at night so they sleep through?


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## Misha111 (Oct 31, 2016)

Of course when you are looking for a GSD, you should look for the best breeder possible. BUT if you have expectations, so does a good breeder. When I have bought a puppy, I have found that my list of questions and needs have been tiny compared to the strict screening the breeder has put me through. 

I am not sure why you feel the need to pay more for crate, house and basic training. Those things help you build a bond and understand your puppy and it doesn't always work anyway. My rescue girl was crate trained and house trained by her foster mum. Yes, my girl was happy in a crate but we still had to go through the house training process again because we were a different household and I had to teach her what was expected of her and I also had to learn my girls signals.

The pups I have had are usually house trained by 9 to 10 weeks. (I think the term housetraining overcomplicates it, I call it saving my carpets haha) but that doesn't mean it's done and dusted, it just means that we have reached an understanding, I still have to be vigilant.

I never take up water because I don't agree with it, but that's just my opinion.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

I think most people can house break a puppy in their home and have them accustomed to their schedule relatively soon / easily.

To put a young puppy in a new environment, on a different schedule... in my opinion, not as reliable, and that’s where I take my hat off to those who say they can do it in a couple weeks w/ a young pup.

A pup who holds it in their crate and is taken outside immediately, then refrains from going in the house thereafter might be considered potty trained within that system. I would not look to that as having the same reliability as me being able to leave my adult dogs inside all day and not have any messes.

Seems like a lot of ppl are going back and forth about something that can be subjective, depending on a difference in both interpretation and expectation.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Fodder -completely agree!!!


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

LuvShepherds said:


> Do you limit water at night so they sleep through?


They are done eating by six and no water after eight. Potties at 10 and potties at 12 for last time. Let out to potty at 6 am. Also, keep pup in crate in room with me, so that if they become restless in middle of night, another trip outside. 5 days of extreme vigilance on my part equals pups 7nderstanding to wait until 6 am in about 5 days or less.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I did exactly as Cliff did. It took no time at all to sleep thru the night.


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## gsdluvr (Jun 26, 2012)

cliffson1 said:


> I think we differ on completely potty train by 16 weeks. I got a 8-10 week puppy for 9 consecutive years, the longest it took me to potty train was 5 days, two of the pups never had accident in house, and two only one. If you put the time in and read the signs, they pick it up very early. ( and I mean by five days all were going all night with not accidents)
> I see prolonged potty training as usually something owner is doing wrong or not understanding how.


 @cliffson1, I am with you!! I think potty training is the easiest part of all! Never had a problem, it goes VERY fast. The rest is more challenging for sure!


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## Courtney (Feb 12, 2010)

Jax08 said:


> I did exactly as Cliff did. It took no time at all to sleep thru the night.


Agree! I was kind of a zombie for a week or two, but we just got it done. I would keep my rain boots & jacket by the door. So we could get outside quickly. His crate was next to my bed - when he really started to stir, out we went. He was potty trained pretty fast and this was the task I was the most worried about.


He peed in the house twice, pooped once. My fault for not watching him and picking up on his signs.


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## Shepdad (Oct 24, 2017)

The way the OP wrote his first post, I would not recommend any breeder.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

cliffson1 said:


> They are done eating by six and no water after eight. Potties at 10 and potties at 12 for last time. Let out to potty at 6 am. Also, keep pup in crate in room with me, so that if they become restless in middle of night, another trip outside. 5 days of extreme vigilance on my part equals pups 7nderstanding to wait until 6 am in about 5 days or less.


I’m going to try that next time. It took me weeks with the last one.


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

I’m with Cliff on this one. I do the same thing. All four of my GSDs have been the easiest and fastest dogs ever to housetrain.


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## SlipperyRug (Apr 24, 2016)

Y’all nit pick the weirdest stuff, lol. 

I consider potty training as part of the whole “house breaking”. Which house breaking for me means trusting the dog out in the house for maybe .. 14 hrs (had an outpatient surgery w/complications).


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

SlipperyRug said:


> Y’all nit pick the weirdest stuff, lol.
> 
> I consider potty training as part of the whole “house breaking”. Which house breaking for me means trusting the dog out in the house for maybe .. 14 hrs (had an outpatient surgery w/complications).




Hmmmm. I can’t go 14 hours without having to pee. I wouldn’t expect my dog to do that either. When my adult Dobe couldn’t hold it all day when I was gone at work, I installed a dog door. Problem solved.


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