# Another soft poo thread - sorry



## sparkyskim (Feb 11, 2011)

Hi everyone, I'm sorry for asking yet another soft poo question but I'm kind of at my wits end and I'm not sure whether to just give up. I think I have read every thread on here on soft stools/foods and I thought if I just told my story maybe some would have specific suggestions about next steps?

Our puppy is 14 weeks this Friday. We got him when he was 9 weeks old. He has had MAYBE 1-2 "normal" stools during that time. The first loose stool was in the car on the drive home from the breeder so I thought it may have been stress induced - he was being fed Royal Canin GSD puppy.

Because of the negative reviews I read about that food, I started to switch him to a mix of Canidae ALS grain free and Orijen LBP slowly, with a small baggie of the Royal Canin the breeder gave me -only a few pieces of the Orijen at a time, but never firmed up; thought too rich? So visited a local pet store who recommended I mix Wellness LBP and Orijen LBP (since I still had it b/c some pups need a little grain to get firmer stools). 

Oh, did vet checks - he did have a roundworm egg when we first brought him home, did Panacur, was clear at his follow up, BUT b/c of the soft stools, vet put him on metronadizole just in case, even though he did not test positive for giardia. Tried the pumpkin - he loves it, it added a little bit of firmness, did it for 2 weeks probably but when I stopped, chocolate pudding again.

I have been adding Honest Kitchen perfect form - no improvement.

So, now he has been on a mix of Wellness LBP and Orijen LBP for 2-3 weeks now? I told myself let me change nothing and see if that helps. I only feed him 2-3 cups a day split in morning and breakfast and training/treats.

I've read all over that some people say wellness causes loose stools, some say Orijen causes loose stools, some say not. Do I just keep trying different foods until they look better? Any suggestions on what to try next? Should I finish what I have first? Do some dogs just have upset tummies? He eats like a champ so must not bother him.

Thanks for any help!


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## gsdraven (Jul 8, 2009)

Why are you mixing the kibbles? You need to pick one and stick with that. How much are you feeding of each per meal?


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## jkscandi50 (Nov 17, 2010)

I feel your pain - Kai had runny poop until we switched him to raw (which I was like no raw, no way for the longest time), but his system just couldn't do the kibble thing. We had him checked up and down by the vet - did the metro (I think 2 courses), did some goofy paste stuff from the vet, did vet prescribed food, and finally raw - for Kai - worked wonders (I mean overnight). Is that your pup in your avatar? He's really cute


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## GSDGunner (Feb 22, 2011)

By my count, you've mixed 5 different food in the 5 weeks you've had him.
I agree with gsdraven. Pick one food and give it a chance to work. Constantly switching foods is likely the cause of the loose stools.

Try one food for a month and see how it goes.


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## DeeMcB (Nov 28, 2010)

Is it just pudding stool or is it watery with urgency?

You might think about fasting him for a day (water only) and then start him back on boiled rice and hamburger for a day or two before reintroducing kibble just to give his GI tract a rest. 

Agree with gsdraven that picking ONE kibble and sticking with it for a while is probably a good idea. The changing in and of itself can cause upset. You might even consider continuing with what he was on at the breeder for a time. You're not going to wreck his lifetime nutrition in a few months.


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## DeeMcB (Nov 28, 2010)

And, btw, ANY food can cause upset if your dog is sensitive to it. Be wary of blanket statements about foods doing this or that. If you're comfortable with the ingredients and it works in your budget, there's no reason not to try it just because someone said it caused runny poo -- your dog may be fine on it.


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## GeorgiaJason (Jan 16, 2011)

did the vet check for coccidia (sp) we are dealing with it with our pup it can be fatal to pups. he had the same symptoms but with mixing so many foods its hard to tell what it is.


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## GSDAlphaMom (Jul 20, 2010)

If coccidia, worms and girardia are ruled out (note giardia is a different test than the others), then it may be the food. My last pup could not tolerate orijen or wellness (loose stools). I switched to Innova LBP and it firmed right up.


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## sparkyskim (Feb 11, 2011)

GSDAlphaMom said:


> If coccidia, worms and girardia are ruled out (note giardia is a different test than the others), then it may be the food. My last pup could not tolerate orijen or wellness (loose stools). I switched to Innova LBP and it firmed right up.


Thanks everyone. I appreciate the feedback. I knew I would be criticized by some for all the food switches. I guess I'm trying to listen to what too many different people are telling me to do. I was told immediately that royal canin was not the best kibble so was told by a schmancy store to immediately phase that out when I ran out of my baggie. I had myself picked a small bag of the canidae but when I consulted with said pet store again was told that origin was the best so to start phasing that in. Then when soft poos persisted was told and read that maybe a little grain was good for some puppy tummies. Again I realize that opinions are wide on this so I was just trying to find the match for my puppy. I haven't changed from the origin wellness mix for 2-3 weeks. I didn't know I wasn't supposed to be mixing. I thought I was supposed to keep the orijen a constant as I phased in the wellness? 

So gsdraven and others who said I should just pick one and stick to it do you think I should just pick the origin or wellness and go cold turkey 100%? See that seems contrary to what a lot of others have said. 

I get kind of scared to post questions sometimes cause I know people will come down on me. But I'm just trying to so whats best for my puppy. 

Thank you for the comment that my puppy is cute  we are so in love with him! He acts just fine by the way. Tons of energy and sweetness. I will have to double check on coccidia. You would think they would have checked for that with the giardia test. 

So ops on which to feed 100%? the origin or the wellness? 

I even had one pet store to tell me to rotate foods. And this IS a reputable store in my area in case u were wondering.


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## gsdraven (Jul 8, 2009)

sparkyskim said:


> So gsdraven and others who said I should just pick one and stick to it do you think I should just pick the origin or wellness and go cold turkey 100%? See that seems contrary to what a lot of others have said.
> 
> I get kind of scared to post questions sometimes cause I know people will come down on me. But I'm just trying to so whats best for my puppy.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry that you feel like people are coming down on you... we don't mean to, we're just trying to help. Please don't be afraid to post asking for advice. 

Can you answer the question about the consistency of the poop? If it's just mushy and soft, I would pick one and go with it. If it's runny and urgent (diarrhea) then I would fast her like suggested above and then do a bland diet for a few days before starting on a kibble. 

Both Orijen and Wellness are good foods and either one would be fine. I've never fed Orijen but have heard others on here say their pup never adjusted to it (pudding poo). I have fed Wellness varieties and like those.

I'm not a fan of rotating or mixing but that's my preference and it appears that it isn't working for your pup right now.


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## GSDAlphaMom (Jul 20, 2010)

You will definitely need to rule out coccidia and giardia (two different test), and be aware that coccidia doesn't always show up when the have it (depends on when they sluff off). Most vets do a fecal on first visit which would be looking for worms/coccidia. If those are ruled out with no improvement then check for giardia, it is the one that is a different test ($35) and not generally run unless there are stool issues and the other 2 have been ruled out.

I agree with one kibble, the key is finding one that works. As I mention Orijen and Wellness were too rich for my puppy and caused loose stools. It's not uncommon, though some do ok on it. If she's been on them for 2-3 weeks and no improvement I would suggest finding a high end with some grain, ie Innova or something similiar.

It can be frustrating trying to figure this out when you are in the middle of it but once you do it will be a forgotten memory.


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## sparkyskim (Feb 11, 2011)

Thanks, Jamie! Consistency is definitely just mushy not watery. Def pudding consistency. Yum. I really do appreciate the advice. I will just pick one now and stick with it! It always surprises me how sensitive doggies' tummies can be given that they eat raw meat and bones! Thanks again  



gsdraven said:


> I'm sorry that you feel like people are coming down on you... we don't mean to, we're just trying to help. Please don't be afraid to post asking for advice.
> 
> Can you answer the question about the consistency of the poop? If it's just mushy and soft, I would pick one and go with it. If it's runny and urgent (diarrhea) then I would fast her like suggested above and then do a bland diet for a few days before starting on a kibble.
> 
> ...


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## GSDGunner (Feb 22, 2011)

I'm sorry you feel that you're being criticized but that was not anyone's intention. You asked for advice and it was given with genuine intentions of helping. I didn't see anyone coming down on you because of your choices.

But 5 weeks and a lot of mixing is still what I believe to be the core of the problem.
If all the medical reasons have been cleared than I think you just need to pick one food and give it a chance.

I had a lot of issues with certain brands and it took awhile to find the right one.


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## sparkyskim (Feb 11, 2011)

Ok. I really do thank you all for the advice. I'm probably just oversensitive bc it's been kind of a long term ordeal over here. And I also need to just pick one line of advice at a time and try not to do everything at once!



GSDGunner said:


> I'm sorry you feel that you're being criticized but that was not anyone's intention. You asked for advice and it was given with genuine intentions of helping. I didn't see anyone coming down on you because of your choices.
> 
> But 5 weeks and a lot of mixing is still what I believe to be the core of the problem.
> If all the medical reasons have been cleared than I think you just need to pick one food and give it a chance.
> ...


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## gsdraven (Jul 8, 2009)

sparkyskim said:


> And I also need to just pick one line of advice at a time and try not to do everything at once!


I think the best approach is read it all and determine which advice makes sense to you and that you feel comfortable with given your situation.

I may have missed it but did the vet definitely rule out coccidia and giardia?

Another reason why getting on one food is important is because it may help determine if it's the food or something going on internally.


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## sparkyskim (Feb 11, 2011)

Hi, the vet at the last visit said he tested neg for giardia but went ahead and gave him the 10 day course of metronidazole in case he had the antigen. I cant tell u 100% about coccidia though I specifically mentioned it and would be stunned if they didn't look for it in the fecal? He was cleared for worms in the second fecal. I will have to check on the coccidia. 



gsdraven said:


> I think the best approach is read it all and determine which advice makes sense to you and that you feel comfortable with given your situation.
> 
> I may have missed it but did the vet definitely rule out coccidia and giardia?
> 
> Another reason why getting on one food is important is because it may help determine if it's the food or something going on internally.


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## GSDGunner (Feb 22, 2011)

sparkyskim said:


> Ok. I really do thank you all for the advice. I'm probably just oversensitive bc it's been kind of a long term ordeal over here. And I also need to just pick one line of advice at a time and try not to do everything at once!


Absolutely! There is no one size fits all. You pick what you feel is best and go with it.
I struggled for almost a year, off and on, trying to find the right food. That's not to say it will take you that long. What works for one dog, doesn't necessarily work the next.

Give any food a chance to work. Try a bland boiled chicken and rice diet for a few days and then start adding in the kibble of your choice slowly. Increasing the kibble until the chicken and rice is completely phased out.

I don't know if 14 weeks is to young, and maybe someone can confirm or deny, but I would try adding some Forti Flora into the kibble. This has worked wonders for Gunner who has a very sensitive belly. You can get it through your vet or online.


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## unloader (Feb 16, 2010)

I'll echo what most have posted. 

If you have picked one food, and your pup is still having issues after a period of time, I would start to wonder about reinfection and/or a small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. If the loose stools don't resolve, I would put the dog on a temporary home cooked diet, something like overcooked brown rice and boiled chicken or beef. Do that for 2-3 days if you can, so the GI tract calms down. This would also give you a good baseline to start with.

After the baseline, only add one thing at a time (a small amount), wait and monitor for 2-3 days if possible.

The antibiotics and de-wormers remove ALL organisms, good and bad, so I would suggest a vegan probiotic and possibly one with a prebiotic. I have had good luck with this product, it's one of the few that my pup can tolerate. Only Natural Pet Probiotic Blend Dog & Cat Supplement
It's available at petco online also, and maybe in the store.

Probiotic tolerance varies by dog, so this product may not work for your pup.

Good luck with your puppy, I know how hard and frustrating these issues can be. If you stick to the rule of only adding one thing at a time, wait and monitor, then you will be better off in the end. I know this from not following that rule.


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## DeeMcB (Nov 28, 2010)

YIKES! Hope I didn't seem like I was coming down on you! I went through WEEKS of pudding poo with Ezra when he first came home and changed something every time I heard a new opinion. And he wasn't fully house trained yet! Nothing like cleaning up poop day after day to put you in a bad mood.

I ultimately landed at raw feeding. This way I know EXACTLY what's going in to every meal and it's easy to tell if something isn't sitting right what it is (ie, it'll be the chicken...not one of 50 possible ingredients). Call me a control freak


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## sparkyskim (Feb 11, 2011)

DeeMcB, no you didn't. And THANK YOU for understanding. I'm just hypersensitive I guess because I HAVE been trying everything (too much apparently - haha). It's tough to get tone across with writing sometimes. But in fairness, I DID come here to ask experienced people's advice and I know everyone who writes is just trying to help and I am grateful for that.  It just helps sometimes to have support and know others went through the same thing. It sounds like I am doing the same thing you did and trying out everyone's different opinions - too quickly it looks like.  

Thanks again! I love this forum!


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## GeorgiaJason (Jan 16, 2011)

my experience was that they did not check for coccidia in the initial stool sample but each vet may be different it may not hurt to call and ask if they can pull his record and see


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