# Little to no bowel control....



## gsdlove212

My heart dog, Shadow is 10 years old. She will be 11 in March, she is in overall good health. However she has had some weakness in her back end as well as arthritis that she gets Metcam as needed. She does suffer from seasonal allergies as well. However, our biggest problem is that she is becoming increasingly more and more unable to control her BM's. I know she feels horrible about making a mess, even though I just clean it up while she goes outside. Is there anything out there that can help with this issue? Supplements? Anything? Oh and her poo has been a bit softer lately and that makes it even worse (harder to control).


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## cassadee7

I am interested in this as well. My (nonGSD) dog is 11 and this year has become semi-incontinent with the bowels as well. I hope someone has some ideas to help your Shadow and maybe my Speedy as well.


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## marksteven

When mine was about that age (11) and had arthritic problems the vet prescribed Tramadol which helped the pain but caused the same problem you are experiencing.


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## gsdlove212

Mark, she hasn't needed the Metcam at all in over 3 months. So I don't think that the meds have anything to do with the issue. Thanks for the thought though.


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## Raziel

I dont have an answer, but Im sorry.
I heard pumpkin works both ways.
Maybe harden up her stool?


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## rjvamp

I'm very sorry to hear you are going through this. My older shepherd / malamute, Lobo, got to where he couldn't walk on his back legs...then we changed his diet and that helped. Then we slowly started adding in Metcam, Tramadol and Gluc/Chondrotin as needed. Have you checked the side effect of Metacam? http://www.1800petmeds.com/Metacam-prod10588.html

"What are the side effects:
Side effects include loss of appetite, vomiting, diarrhea, unnaturally dark stools, and drowsiness. Symptoms of an allergic reaction to this medication can include facial swelling, hives and rash."

The days he couldn't really walk well on his own or just had an uncontrolled bowel movement I would just clean it up and then walk him outside. He did live to be 14 years and 45 days old. 

I did put towels down wherever he would lay so it would be easier to clean up. I invested in lots of Clorox bleach. Has the vet offered any advice?

Here is a video of Lobo when we celebrated his 13th birthday.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhuLSXsfChc


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## gsdlove212

AngelesVonLobos,
thank you so much for your tips. as i mentioned earlier, i do not think this is a side effect of the metacam b/c she rarely needs it...maybe 3 days out of a year, and she has not needed it in over 3 months. we jsut recently moved (well about 4 months ago) and we have not had to have her into the new vet yet, but i will at least put in a call to her old vet, and also see about scheduling her check up a little sooner than we planned. we are currently renting and the house is almost all carpet, so I don't think I will be using a whole lot of bleach, but the towels would be a great help. thank goodness i have a carpet shamppoer







, best 300 bucks i have ever spent with 4 kids and 3 dogs







.

Angel,
I will try to give her some pumpkin I always have some up in the cabinet as Duchess is prone to bouts of the squirts, but she always makes it outside (knock on wood). 


I was jsut wondering if there was anything hollistically that might help with muscle control or something...I know this is a fairly common issue in seniors, especially those with weaker rears. I never scold her for it, I jsut let her out and clean it up.


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## rjvamp

Your welcome...and the bleach is for the towels - not the carpet







Great idea with the shampooer - we did the same!

Honest Kitchen has a product called Perfect Form. That might be of interest and could help maybe firm things up some? http://www.thehonestkitchen.com/


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## LJsMom

Are you using a high quality joint health supplement? A trip to the chiropractor may help.


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## Spiritsmam

I have had the same problems that you describe with several of my seniors. The worst was poor Bonnie who started getting fecally incontinent when she was about 15 years old. Bonnie had LS disease and severe arthritis and HD. 

Bonnie was always fastidious about being clean and you could see that she was upset when she couldn't hold her poop. She would know that she needed to go, but there was some "delay" and by the time she realised she had to poop she was already doing so :-(

I attribute these changes to aging and just clean up after my pups, but do have my guys vet checked regularly to make certain that there isn't another medical problem.

wishing you and Shadow the best
Joanne


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## VectorSketcher

Well, I am dealing with the same thing here with my boy, only our situation is much different as Riddick is only four years old and his issue came from his paralysis back in March, he is still working on trying to control his BM's it is much worse when he has the runs, and with his sensitive stomach it is hard to control. However, we have been using Nutramax's Proviable-DC, it is a probiotic that helps to restore intestinal microfloral balance, now with Riddick it really has helped him with his poo not becoming runny, helps him digest his food properly, and keeps his poo nice and firm. When his poo is firm it seems like he can control it better. I know your situation is different but I thought I would let you know what we do here for Riddick. I hope things improve for you guys.


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## marksteven

I know most here are not big fans of Hills science diet however their
Perscription food avail only at a vet which is the Canine dry WD recipe should really help. it is predominintly a fiber based food with great results in dogs with digestive issues as well as BM problems. maybe your vet can get you a sample bag, just a try.


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## rjvamp

Great idea on the food suggestions Mark.

Additional food options if you are thinking that route:

the Kumpi Senior that I fed Lobo had the probiotics and prebiotics in it and that really helped keep things firm for him. for more information on it check http://www.kumpi.com

Iams Low Residue dry is another food that helps with looser stool issues too. It is a prescription food but in NC you could get it without a script so not sure about other states - but you do have to get from a Vet or online. My sister used it for years with her dogs until their systems finally straightened out.
http://www.iams.com/iams/en_US/jsp/IAMS_Page.jsp?pageID=PL&productID=24

Although to be honest, I thing just a lot of love and understanding is going to be the big thing.


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## Woodreb

When Rica started having the same poop problems, I used the puppy pee pads for her. I'd just have her lay on the pad when she was on her bed and when she pooped it was a very easy cleanup.

I was also very careful with her diet and made changes very slowly to avoid loose stool problems.


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## LisaT

As with any other dog, senior or not, I would look at foods that have no corn, no sorghum, and no by-products....did you mention what you are feeding now?

I would definitely look into acupuncture and chiropractic.


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## gsdlove212

Lisa, I feed primarily RAW, but I do use TOTW every once in a while. 

Is there a site that would show acupuncture or chiopractic centers in the area? I have not heard of any down here that do pets.


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## LJsMom

Acupuncture
http://www.aava.org/php/aava_blog/aava-directory/

Chiropractic
http://www.avcadoctors.com/


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

For the softer poop, I had Kramer put on Tylan after he had some soft stool (the kind that if they do it laying down, sticks to the feathers and that would tick him off-the cleaning process), and so when he did poop in the house, it would be as he was walking and it would just bounce out, nice and firm. He didn't even notice (or pretended he didn't) and it was so easy to clean up. I also liked having him on it because I felt like it was nice to have a low dose antibiotic, and it seemed to help his belly. He was old enough that I didn't worry about any long-term effects, if there are any, of a low, long-term dose of tylan. I just watched to make sure he didn't get constipated. Had it not worked so well, I would have had him trimmed there so it would have been easier to clean. 

The stuff in metamucil also helps to firm up (psyllium). 

Hope all your old babies have a wonderful holiday!


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## LisaT

The folks that have been through this with a senior are probably your best resources. 


That being said, a few random thoughts that may or may not be useful. 

When was the last blood test to check for liver function, etc?

have you considered things like chiro, acupuncture, other bodywork? Are any joint supplements being used now?

When KathyW's senior was doing this, I think they found that Cushings was contributing. 

Perhaps, there is some intestinal overgrowth making it even harder to control the BM's, and perhaps some tylan or other abx (not flagyl) would help. I wouldn't use flagyl/metronidazole in a dog with a shaky hind end unless, by previous use, you knnew there wasn't an issue that drug. It can have some neuro side effects.


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## rjvamp

> Originally Posted By: LisaTAs with any other dog, senior or not, I would look at foods that have no corn, no sorghum, and no by-products....did you mention what you are feeding now?
> 
> I would definitely look into acupuncture and chiropractic.


Funny thing is the product that contained corn meal in it provided the most benefit for Lobo in his senior years....because it was the formula as a whole. He would not have lived as long if it hadn't been for his Kumpi.


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## LisaT

If you fed a primarily corn based food, like Purina, then Kumpi is an improvement over that, because in addition to corn, it balances it with other stuff. So, from my point of view, it really would depend on what you were feeding before. 

Now if you're going from a balanced raw, homecooked, or most of the non-corn kibbles, I don't think folks would see any improvement, and in most, probably a decline. 

I suspect that kumpi's largest market comes from the purina and pedigree crowd? That's the perfect market for that food.


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## rjvamp

He did have Pedigree most of his life.

However, in 2006 he was eating Nutro Ultra Holistic http://www.ultraholistic.com/senior-dog-food-kibble.html

and then also tried the Pro Plan right after - they just stopped eating Nutro for some reason but next I went to the Kumpi in 2007 right at the beginning of the recalls.

I did also try and switch him to Orijen in 2008 when I started reading about the grain-free stuff, and even though it had glucosamine and all in it he did not do as well on it when compared to the Kumpi. So we went back to Kumpi.

If I'm any indication of their market they have the "lower end" foods and what some would call the "higher end" foods coming over to them and finding it just might be the "right food" they are looking for. My own personal budget is starting to improve some so I am hoping to buy again real soon. I still haven't found a kibble that can compare in consistency and quality in every bag.


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## LisaT

Yep, consistency is important.


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## gsdlove212

On a brighter note, we have not had a reoccurrance of the issue...yet since I first posted! I broke down her two meals into three smaller ones, and also added in a tad bit of pumpkin. She seems to have firmed up a bit, and for now that seems to be addressing the issue. 

Lisa, I would consider Chiro/Accupuncture, however I would need to do some more research on it as well as locating. Thanks to who posted the links









She was last seen by the vet about 7 or so months ago. Vet did blood work and an senior exam. He was very impressed with all of her numbers as well as sounds and all the other stuff too. He told me, if he didn't know any better he would think her to be much younger. I was planning to take her in around her birthday for another work up, but if there is a real need to do it before March, I will. 

She does get supplements every day with ehr feedings (the pretty standard ones...Gluc/Chond., Vit. E, Fish oil, etc)


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## LisaT

I'm glad that it appears to be resolving


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## rjvamp

Good news!!!!


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## Katerlena

Glad to hear Shadow is doing better!

My senior GSD had periodic bouts of diarrhea from ages 12-14. After ruling out everything else after a barrage of tests my vet thought it was an immune system issue and had her on a low dose of Baytril helped when the pumpkin did not for us


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## Qyn

I'm glad to read that there has been an improvement - just firming up the stool means the the clean up is easier and sometimes means the dog can even "feel" the motion and then has more time to react.

All the best .. Alison


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