# Went RAW and now a bile problem despite midnight snacks :o(



## kam214 (Mar 3, 2012)

Sasha is a year and a half old. She has a MAJOR fish allergy. I have had her on pretty much every high end kibble there is. I have done an elimination diet as prescribed by her dermatologist...that was how it was determined fish was a major culprit. However, even in kibble without fish or even fish oils, she still has moderate itching, indicating another milder allergy to something in processed kibble She also has bad and very overactive anal glands on kibble. Poops were fine but her anal glands were seemingly always full and would empty out on their own in the house 

So, I wanted to give raw a try...I went with premade raw and bought SOJOS Complete Turkey. The protein is a bit low even in the "Complete" formula so I also toss in anywhere between a 1/4-1/2 cup of raw MM in each feeding. She is fed twice a day.

She is THRIVING on this diet. Great coat, little poops, NO anal gland issues and NO itching or scratching.

HOWEVER...3-4 times per week in the AM, she vomits bile. I know it is because her tummy is empty and that raw digests faster. Initially, I upped her food intake but that did nothing. Then I made sure to give her a few treats or cookies before bed (At about 1 or 2 AM) and also at her 5:00 AM "Mommy, I have to go potty" wake up call. I usually get up at about 8 or 9 AM and feed her the Sojos.

Now she is vomiting bile in the AM even with this regime. So she essentially eats breakfast at 8 or 9 AM, gets a few treats throughout the day, then fed dinner at 8 or 9 PM, gets more treats anywhere from midnight-2 AM, a few more treats at 5 or 6 AM, then breakfast at 8 or 9 AM. STILL we have bile vomit at around 7 AM a few days per week. Then, if I try to feed her earlier than her normal 8 or 9 AM to avoid the bile vomiting, she will vomit bile in the EVENING as well before her dinner. 

I am at a loss as I do NOT want to go back to kibble since she is miserable on it.

Even on Acana Singles without fish, she is still itchy with anal gland problems. I have also used Instinct Limited Ingredient and same story...Now, if she is on ANY Orijen or Acana food with the slightest amount of fish, she will lick her paws bloody. I have also used Fromm duck and potato without fish, same thing anal gland problems.

The Sojos is the FIRST food she had not had issues with other than this bile issue. 

Do you think changing the midnight treats/cookies to dried lamb lung fillets would help? Would a more protein based treat hold her belly over better than Wet Noses cookies she has been getting?

Or should I try a different Raw option like Bravo rolls?? I imagine they digest the same but perhaps the Sojos just does not work for her.


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I think giving her a pm meal with *bone-in* that she has to chew will help slow the digestion some...so a turkey neck chunk or a chicken leg/thigh instead of ground pre-mix may stop the bile barf. Worth trying?


----------



## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Rafi had this same problem so I switched him over to 3 meals/day. Now, after 4 years, he still occasionally vomits bile but it's like once every few months.


----------



## 4score (Nov 4, 2011)

Interesting topic. Our dog Walter has the occasional bile vomit as well. He's on a 2xday feeding and I started feeding him 2 to 3 oz before bed (around 10:30). The vomit has reduced in frequency, but sometimes he still does (like last night!). I'm going to try switching the before bed snack to a little chunk of RMB to see if it helps. Anyone else having this issue?


----------



## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Karlo use to do it often when he was younger, seldom does it now, but he'll still barf now and then. And when he does barf bile in the am, he's not real keen on eating breakfast(he usually has fairly high food drive!)


----------



## kam214 (Mar 3, 2012)

Thanks for the tip onyx...definitely worth trying. Sasha can puke and she is immediately ready for breakfast, LOL. Like this AM...I was dead asleep and I hear the "hack, hack, hack, retch, retch, gag, gag" BARF. Then she looks at me like, "Ok, can I have breakfast now??"

Bless her heart though...she NEVER (other than this AM, ironically) barfs anywhere other than her bed. She always goes to her bed to bile vomit. Even today, she barfed half on her bed and half on the carpet. It is like she knows it is going to stain the heck out of our berber carpets! I would rather wash a removable dog bed cover than pay for professional carpet cleaning every couple of weeks. Poor little honey 

I had gone to the pet store prior to reading onyx's suggestion and noticed they have a new raw premade called Tucker's?? Looks pretty new as there are no reviews but the girl at the store said her dog was doing very well on it.

I don't have any RMBs, just MM so I need to go to the store, but I made up a late night snack for her of a little bit of Sojos with Bravo pieces in it to see if it holds her down till AM feeding. I have a thought that the dog cookies are just not enough sustenance perhaps?


----------



## Tankin (Feb 7, 2012)

I had the same issue with Tank. I used to feed him at 8:30 am and 9:00 pm and he would puke bile almost every day. He now eats at 9:30am and 11:00-11:30pm depending on when I get home from work and he has had no problems since.


----------

