# UPDATE: Dilated Cardiomyopathy DCM



## JockSTAR (Dec 1, 2014)

UPDATE
Hello all,

Well the last three months since writing this post have flown by and our boy is very well indeed. He has just had a check up by the vet and she confirmed that his heart is working much better and firing on all cylinders for want of a better term.

About a week after writing the last post, he got very sick and we thought we had lost him again, but he came good with some antibiotics. The vet said we need to be careful of pneumonia. 

The medication is two x 10mg Cardisure tablets a day with two diuretics twice a day and a small dose of cortisone every two to three days. 

His breathing is almost normal, his appetite good and energy levels normal. He is on two cans of Hills Z/D wet food per day and some boiled chicken or fish, fish oil tablet and some ACV in the water. He snacks on a little bit of sardines/tuna. I have managed to get him to eat some dry food again so his teeth don't suffer with a dental chew every other day. 

He is happy, healthy and the most obedient I have ever seen him. The allergy symptoms seem to have completely disappeared and he looks stunning and smells nice. I am very confused as to why the allergy symptoms have disappeared and even a naughty snack of something I would never have given him in the past does not cause a flare up. Wondering if there was some connection between his heart and the allergies? That covers gut, skin, ears and eyes which we were always battling to sort out and could never really put a finger on what exactly was causing the issues. 

The only thing which has persisted is the crusty snotty nose which he HATES me cleaning but the vet has explained that it is due to age and the illness and to just apply Aloe Vera or Paw Paw ointment as 'allowed'.

This has not been an inexpensive exercise so have had to get more organised with online pet meds which save a huge amount - usually around half or even less.

It is hard to believe that we went from the edge of euthanising to his current state but am as grateful as ever. I do realise that he will probably not live as long as we may have expected but at least the last years of his shortened life will be much more comfortable for him. 

Thank you for all your kind words and advice. 





Hello all, Hoping someone can provide some insight/advice/experience.

My 8 year old male GSD was diagnosed with DCM about a month ago. He was coughing/gagging, very rattly when breathing during sleep and appeared quite lethargic and not interested in too much. It seemed to come over him in a few days and at first I thought he had kennel cough (though he is vaccinated against it)

Initially the vet offered to euthanise as she said he was in a bad way but said we could take him home and try the Cardisure though she did not seem very confident. Of course, we tried for the latter as he seemed a little better. He is now on his second course of Cardisure along with a diuretic. His weight seems good, he is eating well though maybe not as much as before but still interested in food. He is interested in things like moderate walks, bothering frogs, playing with the hose and generally hanging about and keeping an eye on things. He is happy to see us and wags his tail, is cheeky as ever at times. (we live in a small town with a view of the main street and not much gets past him). Occasionally, his breathing is a bit rattly but comes and goes.

He has always had issues with allergies so is on Z/D Science diet wet by Hills. I cannot get him to eat any dry food now and have had to supplement things I might not normally to keep his teeth in good condition. I also have added a little ACV to his water and a 1/4 teaspoon of psyllium husk to his food as he has been a bit constipated I am assuming due to the medication. Along with vet food, Prednisone was the only thing that seemed to control the allergy symptons (Apoquel and Cytopoint did not work) so he is on about one of those blue tablets every second day which the vet said was ok to continue.

He is a bit snotty, has been for a while. I was told this was due to the allergies but I am now wondering...it was suggested that I try some Bisolvin tablets which seem to helping a bit.

I have checked the 'quality of life' chart and he seems to be on a good level with that. The one thing that bothers me is that at rest he is about 30 breaths a minute which appears to be at the top of the range but has been consistent now since he has been on the Cardisure.

My question is, has anyone had experience of this disease and the use of Cardisure and how long did their GSD live past the diagnosis and commencement of treatment with this drug. I have friends who had a boarder collie x cattle dog who was a little older than my boy and she lasted another two years.

BTW, my boy has never had grain free food. I was always a bit sceptical and our old vet told us some years ago that issues were arising from it. This was clarified by our current vet.

Any advice welcomed and thank you.🙏


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## ksotto333 (Aug 3, 2011)

Welcome to the forum. I don't have experience with his health condition but his quality of life sound good to me. Live to his abilities. Enjoy this newest version of his life. And we love pictures! 😉


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

No experience but I encourage you to consult with a vet cardiologist as there is a lot of research on DCM underway. I always want a specialist on my team with heart issues.

Some DCM appears to be food-related, according to the researchers, but they don’t know why. I’m sure your vet is familiar with the U.S. news about that. Not all of the cases were grain-free — most were, not all, but when you look at the data it ssems a little more complicated—-and they still haven’t figured it out. So I would do some sleuthing and talk to a cardiologist about what to test. We have a massive thread about it, discussing the research papers, if you want to dig in.


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## cagal (Sep 3, 2013)

Try a cardiologist but I can say my last GSD lived 3 years with DCM after his diagnosis and he passed from bloat in the end. He was on 2 meds twice a day and lived quite comfortably (can’t recall them at this point but was was for blood pressure the other had something to do with the heart muscle). I let him exercise as much as wanted I.e. he controlled what he did so he didn’t get over stressed. He was diagnosed at quite an early stage. My vet suggested it was possibly related to food - he ate Acana for about 5 years of his life but who really knows if that was a factor.


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## JockSTAR (Dec 1, 2014)

ksotto333 said:


> Enjoy this newest version of his life.


Yes, that is a great way of looking at it. And I guess I have to get on with it and stop being over vigilant all the time. I think he is spooked by me 'observing' him so often and takes off after a while


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## JockSTAR (Dec 1, 2014)

Magwart said:


> We have a massive thread about it, discussing the research papers, if you want to dig in.


Thanks I will check that out. Grain - free is still a bit of an unknown. It can be a bit off putting when you say your dog has food sensitivities and people immediately jump on 'he should be eating grain-free'. Pet supply 'mega stores' are the worst I find and yet that is where most people get their food and advice instead of the vets. 

We are lucky in that we live rurally so our vet has fantastic facilities so we were able to get a good diagnosis very quickly with their equipment.. I am going back later this week to let the vet see how she is going and we will speak about Cardiac practitioner then. Thank you


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## JockSTAR (Dec 1, 2014)

cagal said:


> Try a cardiologist but I can say my last GSD lived 3 years with DCM after his diagnosis and he passed from bloat in the end. He was on 2 meds twice a day and lived quite comfortably (can’t recall them at this point but was was for blood pressure the other had something to do with the heart muscle). I let him exercise as much as wanted I.e. he controlled what he did so he didn’t get over stressed. He was diagnosed at quite an early stage. My vet suggested it was possibly related to food - he ate Acana for about 5 years of his life but who really knows if that was a factor.


Thank you, 3 years would be wonderful, though I have a gut feeling of between 1 and 2, have no idea why. Yes, it can be caused by a few things - even genetics, I have been told. I guess you could grill the breeder right down for all little things/indications the parents or g-parents have had but then would you send your pup back? Hardly! As one old trainer told me once when the youngster was being a bit of a brat and the other dogs in the training line were being angels: its all the luck of the litter! (I am not sure I entirely agree, but will for this exercise and it made me feel better at the time!) I feel privileged to have had him in my life and for what he has taught me. Could go with no other breed now!


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

If you're far away from a cardiologist, it's becoming increasingly common for the specialists to offer tele-vet-medicine consultations in which they interpret echocardiograms, ECGs, thoracic radiographs, Holters and event monitoring performed by a regular vet. It is a way to use technology to get an expert set of eyes on the diagnostics and an additional opinion on treatment options, from the other side of the country. I'm a huge fan of tele-consultations with specialists -- they're money-saving and very convenient.


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## cagal (Sep 3, 2013)

JockSTAR said:


> Thank you, 3 years would be wonderful, though I have a gut feeling of between 1 and 2, have no idea why. Yes, it can be caused by a few things - even genetics, I have been told. I guess you could grill the breeder right down for all little things/indications the parents or g-parents have had but then would you send your pup back? Hardly! As one old trainer told me once when the youngster was being a bit of a brat and the other dogs in the training line were being angels: its all the luck of the litter! (I am not sure I entirely agree, but will for this exercise and it made me feel better at the time!) I feel privileged to have had him in my life and for what he has taught me. Could go with no other breed now!


Enjoy your dog for as long as he’s around. That’s what we did even though we knew about the inevitable outcome. Fortunately Hunter lived a reasonable life as he just turned 11 before he passed away. There’s not much more you can do as DCM can’t be cured but only managed. I wish you the very best of luck and hope you can manage the condition successfully with medication as long as possible. And I agree about the breed - we have another GSD now.


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