# Snappy comebacks?



## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

Mr. B and I were walking in our nearby park when we stopped to see Ms. C, a friendly GSD whose back fence borders on the park. Their sniffing was interrupted by Mr. A, who lives next door to Ms. C and has the run of both his front and back yards. Mr. A started a commotion that got both Mr. B and Ms. C going pretty good. 

Mr. A's mom came over spewing venom, telling me that I caused such a commotion twice a day every day (which isn't true, Ms. C is seldom out), and she pointed to the "Beware of Dog" sign she has on her fence, which to her means that no one in the park could come near the fence. I told Mr. A's mom several times that the other dogs were fine until Mr. A weighed in. I couldn't, though, come up with anything else to say that might not have a negative impact on Mr. A.

My question, then: are there any snappy comebacks (more funny than strictly mean) that are appropriate to situations like this? I don't expect to change anyone's mind, but wouldn't mind learning a few lines that will leave someone like Mr. A's mom gasping for breath.


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## Courtney (Feb 12, 2010)

I'm boring

Spend your energy playing with your dog.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

I have a sure-fire, all-purpose, award-winning, blank look for people like that.


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## GoldenGloves (Jul 7, 2013)

I guess you're a bigger person than me... I would have just given the bird and went back to playing with my dog... 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

Tell him the jerk store called. They're running out of him.


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## FirstTimeGSD (Jul 31, 2012)

Lucy Dog said:


> Tell him the jerk store called. They're running out of him.


Best non dog related thing I've ever seen on this forum.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

do you have to walk so close to her fence? when you're dog started
barking why didn't you make him stop?


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

GSDLearner said:


> Mr. B and I were walking in our nearby park when we stopped to see Ms. C, a friendly GSD whose back fence borders on the park. Their sniffing was interrupted by Mr. A, who lives next door to Ms. C and has the run of both his front and back yards. Mr. A started a commotion that got both Mr. B and Ms. C going pretty good.
> 
> Mr. A's mom came over spewing venom, telling me that I caused such a commotion twice a day every day (which isn't true, Ms. C is seldom out), and she pointed to the "Beware of Dog" sign she has on her fence, which to her means that no one in the park could come near the fence. I told Mr. A's mom several times that the other dogs were fine until Mr. A weighed in. I couldn't, though, come up with anything else to say that might not have a negative impact on Mr. A.
> 
> My question, then: are there any snappy comebacks (more funny than strictly mean) that are appropriate to situations like this? I don't expect to change anyone's mind, but wouldn't mind learning a few lines that will leave someone like Mr. A's mom gasping for breath.


What were you doing near the fences? Walking up close to someones fence is IMO rude.


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

FirstTimeGSD said:


> Best non dog related thing I've ever seen on this forum.


Lol... I figured someone had to pick up on it.

I'm just waiting for the day I can use that one in real life and keep a straight face.


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## trcy (Mar 1, 2013)

why are you walking up to the fence? There is a gsd who lives near our local park too. When we walk on the path we can see him in his yard. It's very close to the park, but I would never walk up to their house/fence.


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## huntergreen (Jun 28, 2012)

i would just avoid going close to the fence.


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## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

shepherdmom said:


> What were you doing near the fences? Walking up close to someones fence is IMO rude.


You really think it's rude to approach a friendly dog for a sniff, even if the non-friendly dog next door can't be seen? I'm not saying that's wrong, but it sounds a little off. There's another spot along one of our routes (non-park) that has a similar situation -- three dogs that are barking machines right next door to one that's a sweetheart. Avoid them, too?


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Yes, just walk past them. They may back up to a park but their property is still private property.

I wouldn't like it if people walked up to my fence like that.

They probably have this happen fairly often if they back up to a park and that's why they have the sign.

Give them their space and enjoy your dogs and your walk. 

I used to have this problem when I boarded a horse near a park and people thought they could just walk up to the fence or even into the barn, feed and pet the horses. I'd find watermelon rinds in the stalls God knows what else people were trying to feed the horses.

No, the barn and paddocks were private and the horses were private property too. 

Abutting a public space doesn't mean inherent rights are granted to the public. 








GSDLearner said:


> You really think it's rude to approach a friendly dog for a sniff, even if the non-friendly dog next door can't be seen? I'm not saying that's wrong, but it sounds a little off. There's another spot along one of our routes (non-park) that has a similar situation -- three dogs that are barking machines right next door to one that's a sweetheart. Avoid them, too?


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## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

I'd have just ran at the fence and start barking like I was fence fighting


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

GSDLearner said:


> You really think it's rude to approach a friendly dog for a sniff, even if the non-friendly dog next door can't be seen? I'm not saying that's wrong, but it sounds a little off. There's another spot along one of our routes (non-park) that has a similar situation -- three dogs that are barking machines right next door to one that's a sweetheart. Avoid them, too?


I think its rude to approach anyone's fence with your dog. Do you like it when people walk up to your fence? It's private property and they have the right not to be disturbed just because you are walking by.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

hunterisgreat said:


> I'd have just ran at the fence and start barking like I was fence fighting


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## NTexFoster (Jul 18, 2013)

I so love people.

I live on a green belt. Kids and families play back there and take their dogs to play there too. We have several nice green belt areas. My property ends at my fence. The other side of the fence is common ground and maintained by the HOA.

Balls occasionally make their way in to my back yard. It would be rude for the person to just jump my fence to retrieve their ball. Everybody just knocks on the door and we go around back to find it. No big thing.

If a person's dog is right up on my fence Sparkles will bark and have a good time cussing at them. Does it warrant a 'Dear Abbey' letter. No.

When I walk my dogs the two boxers are free to roam around me (I don't hold their leashes) and yes they go up to greet other dogs. Yes in some cases there is much barking exchanged. I keep on moving and my dogs follow along without either falling too far behind or getting too far ahead. Generally speaking, dogs that bark more get a nice squirt of Hawk juice on their fence or whatever bushes happen to be growing there. A calling card as it were.

As for snappy come backs... I prefer awkward silences. Just look, tilt the head and raise an eyebrow and wait for them to continue. I'm sure whatever they have to say will be enlightening.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

OP is talking about a public park so it's not just neighbors, I imagine the foot traffic is higher in public parks and it's strangers.

btw- I have green space behind me, HOA and it's NOT designated as a foot path area. Still the kids like to cut through the woods to each other's houses. We put up a second fence along the back to create a buffer. I haven't complained and as long as they don't climb over the barrier fence I wont.

When they do I will say something because if one of the little muchkins gets hurt on my property it could be a problem for ME.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Just a couple of thoughts on this topic in general.

1) People have the right to peaceful enjoyment of their property. That is why we have private property rights in our country, to protect that. My dogs will bark at strangers who approach too close to my property. They're German Shepherds after all, they are supposed to alert to strangers. They aren't at fault. Yet if strangers consistently and unnecessarily approach my fence, touch my fence or attempt to touch my dogs they are not respecting my rights. 

2) A simple old timey rule; do unto others as you would have them do unto you. I don't think anyone here would like strangers consistently coming up to their fence, their dogs and trying to pet them or engage with the dogs even if it is meant in a friendly manner. I simply don't bother other people's dogs because I am respecting their space and their privacy.

This is akin to people petting your dog unexpectedly, uninvited while you are walking them. 

I don't understand this sense of entitlement *some* people have when it comes to animals in this country. People petting and feeding my horse dangerous 'treats', people who think they are somehow entitled to walk up close enough to a fence to pet someone else's dog? What if the dog is not feeling well and bites? Then the property owner is in trouble.

Not meaning to be harsh to the OP but I just don't get this attitude.


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## ken k (Apr 3, 2006)

hold you hand up and say, "talk to the paw, cause the muzzle isn't listening"


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## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

ken k said:


> hold you hand up and say, "talk to the paw, cause the muzzle isn't listening"


I may adopt something along this line. Thanks!

I want to clarify: I don't approach the fence of the nasty dog. I go to the fence of the nice dog, a GSD who was herself rescued a couple of years ago. The owner has been out a couple of times and we've talked about our dogs. 
The noisy dog is next door. You often can't tell if he's present, because his fenced area runs to the front yard.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Here's one for property owners....

"Did YOU see a petting zoo sign here somewhere, 'cause I sure don't"


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## Galathiel (Nov 30, 2012)

I guess I'm possessive/control freak. I wouldn't like ANYONE (other than my immediate family), interacting with my dogs when I'm not out there to supervise. Not that my dogs are outside alone. However, if they were .. stay away from my fence, random neighbor!


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## Narny (Sep 8, 2010)

Galathiel said:


> I guess I'm possessive/control freak. I wouldn't like ANYONE (other than my immediate family), interacting with my dogs when I'm not out there to supervise. Not that my dogs are outside alone. However, if they were .. stay away from my fence, random neighbor!


I agree, I wouldnt want anyone there unless I am there. I understand your feelings but I would still stay away from the fences. Even if that means you cant say hello to the nice dog... unless of course the person who lives there is out.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

My house doesnt back onto a public park or greenbelt area which by the way i would expect alot of traffic and with that comes lots of people. I do however have a seniors complex and a fence line to where they all walk their small dogs who ALL bark at Gus. All these elderly people talk to Gus and have been watching him grow. I knew i could not stop their behavior so i took advantage of this and use it to train MY dog. 
Now they all come to fence to watch his progress. He is allowed to bark...abit...then stop. No need for him to go crazy for extended periods. I have used his ball drive to redirect ..lady with her maltese is trying to redirect with a ball for her dog...not working but is amusing.
Anyways.....i guess what i am getting at is these people may want privacy and will most likely not get it so why not use these situations to train their dogs so it doesnt turn nasty. I would worry about a bad encounter where something bad happens ie. Poisning etc.
My elderly neighbours have become very protective of gus....win win for everyone.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

The big difference here is the person(s) in question back up to a public space, not to a smallish community of the same people every day.

Secondly you are very dedicated to training Gus as you have very specific goals in mind for him. A lot of people aren't like that, nor should they 'have' to be when the dog is on their property.

I frequent a public park that was in fairly recent history a privately owned horse farm. The owner retired from the business, donated the property to the county which in turn created a public park.

Now the people who back up to this space have a lot of strangers walking by their back yard every day.

But even that's not the most important point. 

It's about expectations. I expect people to respect the privacy of private homeowners. They didn't give up their rights to privacy and peaceful enjoyment of their property by some sort of defacto law whether they bought a house backing up to public space OR ended up having it built in their backyard.

To expect that you have to give up your privacy and the right, basically, to enjoy your dog and your property without interference from unknown passers-by is placing an unfair and incorrect burden on the property owners.

I know that if you have a public park or walking trail behind a certain amount of this is going to happen, what I disagree with is condoning it as acceptable behavior. It is not. This is about setting boundaries and maintaining them. 

I was raised you leave people alone unless you are invited in, period.

I don't like this ever increasing sense that any joe schmoe has the right to trespass, reach out and touch, lean over my fence and pet my dog uninvited or otherwise engage with my animals without my permission. 






Saphire said:


> My house doesnt back onto a public park or greenbelt area which by the way i would expect alot of traffic and with that comes lots of people. I do however have a seniors complex and a fence line to where they all walk their small dogs who ALL bark at Gus. All these elderly people talk to Gus and have been watching him grow. I knew i could not stop their behavior so i took advantage of this and use it to train MY dog.
> Now they all come to fence to watch his progress. He is allowed to bark...abit...then stop. No need for him to go crazy for extended periods. I have used his ball drive to redirect ..lady with her maltese is trying to redirect with a ball for her dog...not working but is amusing.
> Anyways.....i guess what i am getting at is these people may want privacy and will most likely not get it so why not use these situations to train their dogs so it doesnt turn nasty. I would worry about a bad encounter where something bad happens ie. Poisning etc.
> My elderly neighbours have become very protective of gus....win win for everyone.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

the point is you don't have to stop to let your dog sniff.



GSDLearner said:


> You really think it's rude to approach a friendly dog for a sniff, even if the non-friendly dog next door can't be seen? I'm not saying that's wrong, but it sounds a little off.
> 
> >>>>> There's another spot along one of our routes (non-park) that has a similar situation -- three dogs that are barking machines right next door to one that's a sweetheart. Avoid them, too?<<<<<


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

I understand the expectations you would have and I won't say they are wrong they just will not happen wih every person.

For people living in these types of areas.....you will never stop everyone from walking closely to your fence and interacting with your dogs. 

I would rather make friends and earn their respect by working hard with my own dog. It also protects your own dog from fence fighting (big injuries can happen), close enough contact to transmit infection or disease etc.

Whether those intruding is right or wrong, we need to protect.our own dogs and the best way is through training.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Even though we bought a large lot backing up to greenspace which was NOT designated for foot traffic we still have kids running around back there. We installed a second fence on the back lot line to help keep them off our property.

If I lived backing up to a park I would do something similar to keep lookie-lous away but not everyone can afford that option.

I'm not sure if it is similar in Canada but in the U.S. leash free areas are sectioned off and fenced in.

Most walking paths, open green space areas require the dogs be on leash at all times therefore fence fighting shouldn't be an issue at all unless the passer's by walk up to the fence and allow it while their dogs are on leash.

Again the OP is talking about a public park so it's not the same people everyday so I don't think you can equate it to making friends with the seniors behind your house. That's a false equivalency you're trying to create.

Furthermore one doesn't have to be rude when establishing boundaries with a stranger. A polite but firm, "please keep away from my fence" should suffice for most people. 

People like to equate establishing boundaries with being rude or unfriendly but I contend it's the other way around. The rude or unfriendly action is intruding onto people's private property and trying to touch or interact with dogs they don't own.

You choose to let people push your boundaries that's fine but I don't think it fair to impute those of us who would rather not let strangers interact with our dogs on a daily basis are unfriendly.






Saphire said:


> I understand the expectations you would have and I won't say they are wrong they just will not happen wih every person.
> 
> For people living in these types of areas.....you will never stop everyone from walking closely to your fence and interacting with your dogs.
> 
> ...


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

...I also contend in a parallel issue that part of the reason we can't take our dogs more places in public is because we've allowed our dogs to basically become public property TOO much.

The fall out of that has been dogs must be so utterly perfectly bomb proof as to let any strange person quite literally get in their face and space. A high bar to achieve even for well trained dogs who aren't smooshy friendly labs. As a result many limitations for us and our dogs (even service dogs).

From speaking with my European friends it's not like that for them and consequently not ALL the burden is on the dog owner but also the people in public must take responsibility for their actions. The end result is less issues with dogs out in public.


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

GSDLearner said:


> ...wouldn't mind learning a few lines that will leave someone like Mr. A's mom gasping for breath.


 Why? It's not enough for you to disrupt someone's right to privacy and cause another person to have to come out to calm her dog and deal with you? Have you ever thought that the person maybe sick, have a broken leg, or have a migraine, or the only exercise for that dog is to be in the backyard? It's not enough for you to agitate the dog and cause noise but you also want to hurt the person's feelings and insult the person on their property.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

I didn't quite follow the scenario but if someone asked me to move quickly past their property/fence or avoid it if I could, I guess I would just do that rather than offer comebacks or insist I have a right to be there. What does it really matter? I don't like my dog getting barked at by another dog or yelled at by a person anyway. Easy enough to change my route or avoid that house.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

I've got neighbors who walks their dog down two sides of my 5 acre property... It makes me insane! This person is invading my space and my life, it makes my dogs nuts. It's also private property they are walking on. My husband has asked them to stop but they don't.... So now I just let my dogs bark at them. Their dog is usually off lead and right up on my fence. My dogs are usually within their inside pen and if so I just let them bark... However if they are out in the full yard I have to round them up and get them inside in a hurry because I know they can get through the outside fence if they wanted. It's fricking scary and a huge mess waiting to happen. I don't know how to stop these stupid idiots.


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

I have already stated I do not believe it is right for people to encroach or tresspass. You simply will never control all these people...NEVER. 

I have trained Gus to mostly ignore ALL people walking past my back 4' chain link fence regardless if they "know" him. It makes no difference if they live there....are visiting etc. He does not know all of the 400+ who live and walk about this building with or without dogs.
Why did I work so hard to train Gus to these situations? Because I cannot control the people on the other side of the fence. Now my life is easier and Gus' is safer.

I simply was stating there are alternatives to dealing with the millions of people in the world who disregard boundaries.

We can post all day about how wrong it is for people to approach private property/fences and it will continue daily as many people do not respect as we do. 

Curious....would these same people walk onto your property if there were no fence? Fences for many are the boundary line so they may feel they are not on your property thus doing nothing wrong.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

Right or wrong is not really my issue. All I'm saying if someone appears mad/frustrated and is asking (or more harshly insisting) I stay off their fence line, as a courtesy I will. Doesn't matter if I have a "right" to be on the public side of the fence or not. Why do I want to waste time yelling comebacks at that person? I have better things to do and plenty of other places I can walk my dog.

Having a GSD, many times I see people approaching on the sidewalk and looking nervous because of my dog. As a courtesy, I tend to move my dog into the street or cross to the other sidewalk. Do I HAVE to? Absolutely not. All the sidewalks are public. But why pick that battle? I have nothing to gain by provoking someone else's dog and making them frustrated and I don't need to use that situation to prove that my dog has superior training or temperament.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

It's not about controlling everyone. I think it's more of a cultural meme that we've allowed to become too invasive by being overly passive with standing firm about boundaries. 

Training is great but IMO it's not germane to this situation or the situation of many others, especially when their dog is contained properly on their private property. As you can't expect everyone to respect boundaries you can't expect everyone to be able to train their dog to a level of 100% certainty. 


As to your question, If you don't have a fence or signs you really can't fault people for trespassing, nor prosecute them really. 

We used to have the problem with hunters poaching deer on our property and put up signs to give them notice. If they then came onto the property we could call the police and have them arrested for trespassing.



Saphire said:


> I have already stated I do not believe it is right for people to encroach or tresspass. You simply will never control all these people...NEVER.
> 
> I have trained Gus to mostly ignore ALL people walking past my back 4' chain link fence regardless if they "know" him. It makes no difference if they live there....are visiting etc. He does not know all of the 400+ who live and walk about this building with or without dogs.
> Why did I work so hard to train Gus to these situations? Because I cannot control the people on the other side of the fence. Now my life is easier and Gus' is safer.
> ...


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

Liesje said:


> But why pick that battle?


 So your dog is not deprived of sniffing other dog's nose through the fence? Lies, you neglect your dog's needs because of some 'courtesy' towards people!!


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## Saphire (Apr 1, 2005)

Where I live....a "Beware of dog" sign insinuates you know your dog is aggressive (straight from Ontario Provincial Police) and a "No tresspassing" sign may not be sufficient for kids and illiterate adults. 

I wish Gus was 100%......he is not but we work daily to improve. 

Its the same ole...one ruins it for all. I already have horrid conflict with neighbour on one side...I dont need it with all sides so I chose the path I myself can control.

I would say to the OP...they did not feel they were doing anything wrong or in fact tresspassing of which is up to definition and property lines. Safe to say they may look at it differently now.


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

Living in a state where outdoors are a way of life rather than a recreational activity, I've dealt with property boundaries all my life. Unfortunately in a legal aspect, it is not illegal to cross fences on to personal property that isn't marked with noticeable means of trespassing prevention, ie signage, orange markers... If someone has posted beware of dog signage I would accept that as needing owner permission to physically interact with the k9. It's basically a sing that says I told you I have a dog if you reach over and he bites you I'm not liable. In this situation, although some people might find it offensive, I believe the op was perfectly fine. They were on public property and, I'm assuming, following city/state/local dog laws. In which they shouldn't be torn down because someone believes they aren't following their own rules of respect. Unfortunately we no longer live in a society based on merited actions, but a society that is conclusive only to being within the law or not. And technically the op could stand there as long as they want, it was the other dogs owners that would be breaking any noise or peace ordinances. 
As far as come backs, I wouldn't get to snappy. If you like the pup and don't want problems with the owner I would remain respectful. But truth be told, dogs bark. I'm sure the owner doesn't yell at squirrels standing near their property. 
Live and let live. For those of you who say you would be mad if someone walks up to your fence, I reply, "Really?" It's pretty much laughable. Do you get mad when someone looks at your car? House? Tells you your kids are cute? Says nice pooch? You are angry that someone is curious? Lmao! Good luck at the park op

Howdy from Idaho!


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Depending on the situation I would say ignorance of the law is no excuse.

However, come to think of it there are signs which use pictures with a circle and cross through it for those who can't read such as street or school crossing signs with the image of school kids crossing the street in addition the wording. I;ve also seen the beware of dog signs with dogs depicted.

BTW- in some places the 'beware of dog' sign is not a liability, that seems to vary.

I really don't worry about this in a personal sense, my dogs are trained, have a good recall and we have double fencing in the back.

What bugs me is on a macro level I don't like the responsibility being foisted *100%* onto us dog owners more and more.

That is something that can be corrected, with some push back on our parts and I think it's time to start pushing back.




Saphire said:


> Where I live....a "Beware of dog" sign insinuates you know your dog is aggressive (straight from Ontario Provincial Police) and a "No tresspassing" sign may not be sufficient for kids and illiterate adults.
> 
> I wish Gus was 100%......he is not but we work daily to improve.
> 
> ...


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Not a fair comparison.

We're talking more urban areas with parks and more population density.

I can see how anyone, after time, could become aggravated if they back up to a busy park and different strangers are stepping right up to the fence and aggravating their dog.

Live and let live is fine but it's also a two way street. We don't know how often this property owner that backs up to a busy park has had to deal with this. Perhaps they are elderly and cannot move well or as was suggested earlier they were ill. Gotta consider their side of this too ya know.



Jaythethird said:


> <snipped>
> Live and let live. For those of you who say you would be mad if someone walks up to your fence, I reply, "Really?" It's pretty much laughable. Do you get mad when someone looks at your car? House? Tells you your kids are cute? Says nice pooch? You are angry that someone is curious? Lmao! Good luck at the park op
> 
> Howdy from Idaho!


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Saphire said:


> I have trained Gus to mostly ignore ALL people walking past my back 4' chain link fence regardless if they "know" him. It makes no difference if they live there....are visiting etc. He does not know all of the 400+ who live and walk about this building with or without dogs.
> Why did I work so hard to train Gus to these situations? Because I cannot control the people on the other side of the fence. Now my life is easier and Gus' is safer.
> 
> I simply was stating there are alternatives to dealing with the millions of people in the world who disregard boundaries.


We have mostly rescue/shelter dogs. We have worked with to get them to the point they are at. They will never be ok with dogs/people walking along their fence. Not happening. I'm not ok with it either. We live in the middle of nowhere with lots of open land for a reason. We don't want to be social... There is no reason for someone to be walking up on my fence line none at all. I'm at a loss to know what to do next. Maybe a hotwire on the outside??


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

How about planting some shrubbery that will not only keep them further away from your fence will also provide some visual privacy?

In our area Leyland Cypress are hardy, fast and easy to grow. They can also be treated/shaped like hedges. Further north another evergreen species that is good is Arborvitea. (in edit: oops I see you are in northern Nevada, I don't know what you can use specifically but still maybe look into plantings that will provide privacy...)


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Jaythethird said:


> .
> Live and let live. For those of you who say you would be mad if someone walks up to your fence, I reply, "Really?" It's pretty much laughable. Do you get mad when someone looks at your car? House? Tells you your kids are cute? Says nice pooch? You are angry that someone is curious?


Yeah I get mad. Its invasion of privacy and invasion of personal space and its just ignorant. Some people just don't understand boundaries. I don't walk up to a stranger and say hey your kid is cute.. that is just creepy. We had a lady at work who was pregnant and she had strangers constantly coming up to her and touching her stomach. It really gave her the creeps and added to the whole stress of the pregnancy. I just don't understand why people can't respect others personal space.


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

Population density has no effect on legality. Murder is murder whether in a city of a million people or a town of 300. I would expect, trespassing, wouldn't change as well. 

I could agree with you on some things yet the op clearly stated that it was not the dog whom she was interacting with that became vocal but the dog at a nearby property. 

I didn't say to be rude to the person requesting you to leave the dog alone. 

I did take urban areas into consideration because we have no noise ordinances other than after a set time. 

If someone got angry with me for observing something they own ie dog car house boat tree lamp... The list could go on and on, I would be more scared that I would die laughing than any repruccussions from the owner. 

So, I guess I'll end your obvious confusion of my post with this. 

I live in America. I exercise my god given rights. I don't infringe other people's rights, I am respectful and courteous to those that treat me the same. I follow within the laws. Laws are straight and narrow. I suggest to any of those who wish to live in a bubble, to do so. When I live in a country that doesn't allow a bystander to stand outside of a fence, with an animal, on public property, this will be the day I start a revolution. 

So don't take my words to heart. Don't let them upset you. None of things said before me have upset me. We are entitled to have opinions, we are entitled to express them. I have read these post before me and have taken them into consideration. But I don't agree with thread jacking and tearing down the op because you think it's rude. 



Howdy from Idaho!


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

shepherdmom said:


> Yeah I get mad. Its invasion of privacy and invasion of personal space and its just ignorant. Some people just don't understand boundaries. I don't walk up to a stranger and say hey your kid is cute.. that is just creepy. We had a lady at work who was pregnant and she had strangers constantly coming up to her and touching her stomach. It really gave her the creeps and added to the whole stress of the pregnancy. I just don't understand why people can't respect others personal space.


I would suggest a taller fence. 
And touching someone who wishes not to be touched is against the law. 

Howdy from Idaho!


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Gwenhwyfair said:


> How about planting some shrubbery that will not only keep them further away from your fence will also provide some visual privacy?
> 
> In our area Leyland Cypress are hardy, fast and easy to grow. They can also be treated/shaped like hedges. Further north another evergreen species that is good is Arborvitea. (in edit: oops I see you are in northern Nevada, I don't know what you can use specifically but still maybe look into plantings that will provide privacy...)


Thanks tried that. Doesn't really help. Too much land not enough water. Then winter comes...


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Oooo very desert-y out there! Pretty.

Love the snowman! 

Yeah, it would have to be evergreens of some sort but I've never dwelled in an arid part of the country so no clue on what grows......



shepherdmom said:


> Thanks tried that. Doesn't really help. Too much land not enough water. Then winter comes...


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Jaythethird said:


> Population density has no effect on legality. Murder is murder whether in a city of a million people or a town of 300. I would expect, trespassing, wouldn't change as well.
> 
> I could agree with you on some things yet the op clearly stated that it was not the dog whom she was interacting with that became vocal but the dog at a nearby property.
> 
> ...


OP posted in a public forum asking for opinion. We gave it to her. That is not thread jacking or tearing down the op. Several people think its wrong to be walking up to a fence and stopping with your dog. The person who was upset with her had every right to be so. Not to mention often time fences are built inside the property line so walking up to the fence she just might be trespassing. It is the same no matter what the population is however if one does live in town they might have more of an expectation of inconsiderate people than one expects living further out.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

No it doesn't but point in fact the OP mentioned the person in question did have a sign. 

Of course there's variability but we're discussing people who walk right up to the fence.

How a person may or may not react can be and often is proportional to how many times they've had to deal with the situation, that's a reasonable qualifier.

Furthermore shepherdmom is correct that often fences are set back from the property line.

I was sticking to the parameters of the primary situation. I'm not confused it's you who are mixing the metaphors here, so to speak and I responded, simple as that.





Jaythethird said:


> Population density has no effect on legality. Murder is murder whether in a city of a million people or a town of 300. I would expect, trespassing, wouldn't change as well.
> 
> I could agree with you on some things yet the op clearly stated that it was not the dog whom she was interacting with that became vocal but the dog at a nearby property.
> 
> ...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I only got half way through the responses, so I am sorry if someone said this already. 

Blame is on both sides. Someone living next to a public park should have a dog that isn't going ape over ordinary park-behavior, because it is probably happening all the time. At the same time, if you are going right up to the fence where the other dog is, a dog that this dog knows and maybe has some feeling of protectiveness for, then the dog is only a dog and it is going to bark. And its owner is only human, and she is going to become frustrated when people seem to be deliberately aggravating her dog.

The best thing to say in such a situation is, "You're right, I'm sorry, we'll move on." 

If I saw that a resident dog was being terribly agitated by my behavior near the fence of a neighboring resident dog, than for the dog's sake, I would not do whatever it was I was doing that agitated the dog.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Gwenhwyfair said:


> Oooo very desert-y out there! Pretty.
> 
> Love the snowman!
> 
> Yeah, it would have to be evergreens of some sort but I've never dwelled in an arid part of the country so no clue on what grows......


Thanks we like it.  

You can see the fence behind the snowman which is why I worry that the neighbor who walks her unleashed dog along it. It wouldn't keep a determined dog out or in. My dogs are not allowed access unless we are outside playing with them. Otherwise they have a much stronger fenced in area for them but I do like to throw the ball and play chase with them a couple of times a day on my own property. It makes me insane that I have to stop and get them all inside and wait for the idiots to go past while their dog sniffs and pee's all over my fence.


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

shepherdmom said:


> Not to mention often time fences are built inside the property line so walking up to the fence she just might be trespassing.


Obviously fences are built within your property line, you can't build a fence that I'd not on your property lol. I mean you technically could but if anyone ever questioned it, it could be forcefully removed which would result in a loss of money for the owner so it's not too smart. But unfortunately without correct signage the alleged offender is completely legal until asked by the property owner to remove themselves from said premises. Fence or not. It is completely laughable to suggest one should live their life in fear of upsetting others. Respect is not the same as fear. You cannot demand respect while showing anger. Do you beat your dog then expect him to obey you because he respects you? Or because he fears the repercussions? Getting mad is anger. Like it or not. Laughable... Like I'm not even joking I seriously lol'd. Would be a different story if the dog owner calmed their pooch and then explained decently to the op that they would appreciate if space could be created when visiting someone else's dog considering as much has been explained the owner of the dog that they were originally visiting seems to have no problem with it


Howdy from Idaho!


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

I really do not let my dogs sniff at other dogs through fences, friendly or not. 

Can you go to the house and ask for a play date instead and let the dogs play ina fenced area? 

I can understand the other dog's owner being upset when her dog is agitated and barks. She does not want the dog agitated.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

hmmmm I don't what you can do since you said your hubby already asked them politely to stay away from the fence.

Usually when people feel they are in the position of authority like that (they blow off requests and warning signs) the only conclusion is to escalate via reporting them to police if they trespass.

But...

That could lead to backlash from the neighbor and that's not good either.






shepherdmom said:


> Thanks we like it.
> 
> You can see the fence behind the snowman which is why I worry that the neighbor who walks her unleashed dog along it. It wouldn't keep a determined dog out or in. My dogs are not allowed access unless we are outside playing with them. Otherwise they have a much stronger fenced in area for them but I do like to throw the ball and play chase with them a couple of times a day on my own property. It makes me insane that I have to stop and get them all inside and wait for the idiots to go past while their dog sniffs and pee's all over my fence.


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## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

Original poster checking in. The strawmen are legion:

Again, this had _nothing_ to do with the unpleasant person's fence or property. There was no petting, no reaching, no lingering. The fence and dog I approach are next door, and I "know" the woman who lives there from talking about our dogs.

The unpleasant person who approached me is younger than me, and seemed quite healthy. The nice lady I speak to seems older than me, and seems to enjoy a little conversation about dogs. 

Again, the unpleasant woman accused me of cruising her fence twice a day, every day. That's bizarrely wrong. It is the closest park to my house, but we use four dog parks and at least seven different parks to walk in, plus a couple of neighborhood street routes. If this lady is getting such a ruckus twice a day, every day, it's because her dog is into it with a variety of dogs.

As I've mentioned in other threads, I have a newly adopted dog that's proved to be very (friendly) reactive. I'm working on that, and I've gained a lot of control (not a final solution), by having my guy carry some water in a pack. He was in his pack, and quiet until the noisy dog broke the peace. 

My dog never goes ballistic at my fence, for the simple reason that he's not out there alone. He does bark out the window, but I see the responsibility to calm him down to be mine, not of the people who have their dogs on the sidewalk.

Very seriously, I would be curious to know how much land one untrained dog is allowed to control? As I said, this one is behind a fence that goes from front sidewalk to back property line. Many here are telling me that he also has the right to stop people from approaching the next fence down, even though that's someone else's property. On the other side of the yard is a park entrance, and he will bark at any dog coming in there, so does everyone with a dog have to go the long way around? He begins barking at any dog on the far side of the tennis court nearest his yard. If this dog's barking is the test of where people can go, then an 8-10 acre park has been reduced to about two acres. 

Also, I can assure you pretty certainly that these fences (all in a line) are on the actual property line. To do otherwise would create the possibility of the county claiming the property. 

As I indicated, all I could come up with to say to this person was to point out that the first two dogs were quietly getting along. I didn't want to say anything more specific because she seemed the type who would be more likely to gas her dog than to train it. The thread did give me a couple of snappy comebacks, so thanks for that!


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

"Snappy comebacks" aren't going to solve the problem. She may have an even 'snappier' comeback for you. :shrug: This is, I think, is why a lot of people responded to just stay away from her fence and to mention giving her and her dog their space.

Getting snarky with her probably will just make the lady in question angrier and what purpose will that serve? 

It would be one thing if you and she were out in public walking dogs and she approached you giving you grief but she's not doing that. She and her dog are on her property.

You don't know what her situation *really*is either, as you don't know her.

I just don't walk up to people's fences when walking my dogs, for a lot of reasons. If they happen to say something I'll just wave and say hello and keep on walking .... but that's just me.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

There is a time and a place for snappy comeback. I think you have answered this yourself about whether or not this is one of them. Not everyone can just pick up and move because their dog doesn't do well living next to the park. 

And if she is more likely to gas her dog than train it, then fueling the fire isn't really what you want to do. 

The best way to shut someone up is to agree with them. They want to argue, you don't. "You're right." 

The choice is really on you, here. You can be the person who starts or continues a verbal war that will do neither party any good whatsoever. Or you can understand that her dog lives there next to the park, and coming close to the fence and interacting with a neighboring dog is likely to create agitation. 

I would hope that anyone who realized they were agitating my dog, would try to limit that to what was absolutely necessary. Going through the gate. That may be necessary. But going up to the gate and playing with a dog on the other side through the fence, I am sorry, but that is totally unnecessary. 

It isn't your problem that her dog doesn't do well living next to the park. There is no reason you should feel like you have any responsibility to fix that. I guess I probably wouldn't want to do anything to make it worse for the lady, and that includes snotty/snappy comebacks.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

:thumbup::thumbup:

(btw not to be unkind to you GSDlearner....but if you gotta ask for snappy comebacks after the fact then you probably shouldn't start a verbal sword fight with someone to begin with....just sayin')



selzer said:


> There is a time and a place for snappy comeback. I think you have answered this yourself about whether or not this is one of them. Not everyone can just pick up and move because their dog doesn't do well living next to the park.
> 
> And if she is more likely to gas her dog than train it, then fueling the fire isn't really what you want to do.
> 
> ...


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Gwenhwyfair said:


> hmmmm I don't what you can do since you said your hubby already asked them politely to stay away from the fence.
> 
> Usually when people feel they are in the position of authority like that (they blow off requests and warning signs) the only conclusion is to escalate via reporting them to police if they trespass.
> 
> ...


No local police, just an overworked county sheriff's substation which has previously told people to just shoot the dog if its on your property. I have neighbors that have and do shot dogs so I expect just one day this poor guy will disappear and I won't have to worry about it anymore. (BTW I use the the term neighbors really loosely... Its not like a neighborhood where there is a lot of people) It's just frustrating. I don't understand why people have to be such butt heads. If there is a dog barking at you turn and go the other way. Don't walk along someones fence stay back a ways and be courteous of others.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

That's what I do, if a dog is really agitated I'll move away. I don't have anything to prove by staying there.

Not all people, but some people just have this sense of authority that they are entitled. My FIL is like that. To the point he's challenged police officers in the past thinking HE is the law or above the law. He feels like he knows better then everyone else. In his case it displays as lacking courtesy for others. They don't like to be told what they can and cannot do. Perhaps that is the case with the person in your situation. There's varying degrees of it but when you asked someone to stay off your property and they don't that can be an underlying reason. (btw for the record I am NOT saying that is the case with GSDlearner...I think that situation is different) 

In blue, that's sad but it's what happens sometimes and the owners are putting their dog in danger....




shepherdmom said:


> No local police, just an overworked county sheriff's substation which has previously told people to just shoot the dog if its on your property. I have neighbors that have and do shot dogs so I expect just one day this poor guy will disappear and I won't have to worry about it anymore. (BTW I use the the term neighbors really loosely... Its not like a neighborhood where there is a lot of people) It's just frustrating. I don't understand why people have to be such butt heads. If there is a dog barking at you turn and go the other way. Don't walk along someones fence stay back a ways and be courteous of others.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

GSDLearner said:


> Original poster checking in.
> 
> Very seriously, I would be curious to know how much land one untrained dog is allowed to control? As I said, this one is behind a fence that goes from front sidewalk to back property line. Many here are telling me that he also has the right to stop people from approaching the next fence down, even though that's someone else's property. On the other side of the yard is a park entrance, and he will bark at any dog coming in there, so does everyone with a dog have to go the long way around? He begins barking at any dog on the far side of the tennis court nearest his yard. If this dog's barking is the test of where people can go, then an 8-10 acre park has been reduced to about two acres.


You stay away from her fence... If the neighbor doesn't mind you approaching her dog then do so from as far away from the first person as possible and as others have said no snappy comeback needed. Unless your looking for a war?


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Ya know it is possible that a dog could be that reactive to start and continuously bark as to limit a 8 plus acre park to 2 acres....but that sounds pretty extreme.

It seems like the dog would eventually be desensitized, unless there's something seriously wrong with it.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Gwenhwyfair said:


> Ya know it is possible that a dog could be that reactive to start and continuously bark as to limit a 8 plus acre park to 2 acres....but that sounds pretty extreme.
> 
> It seems like the dog would eventually be desensitized, unless there's something seriously wrong with it.


I think that dogs that live next to parks generally do become desensitized to the ordinary stuff going on in them. But that does not mean they will not bark if someone approaches the property that they deem to be within their territory. 

I know our old shepherd Mix adopted the little old lady across the street. This lady never said a word to the dog. They never had any contact. But Princess would bark like crazy when someone went up onto her porch. She did not do this with the neighbors next door, who were closer, or the neighbors across the street who were also elderly but a couple. The little old lady across the street lived alone and walked up town every day. She was in her nineties. Princess never barked at her. But she felt she should bark at anyone going over there. 

The point is, that it is not always we who determine the boundaries our dogs have. The dog may see the neighbor's dog as part of his pack. And having people from the park approaching his pack member, probably does get him going, much moreso than people minding their own business playing tennis.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

Oh I agree.. 

...but I do think there's a bit of a 'strawman' being hoisted on the other side of the fence. 

(btw -my dogs don't bark at neighbors but they do at strangers. They know who lives around us and who does not. However, how they would react being exposed to strangers day in and day out? I stop to get a hamburger sometimes at a local fast food place from time to time. There's a house with a lab in the back yard right behind the restuarant. Strange people walk by and he doesn't bark at them unless they get close, like a few feet, away from his fence) 





selzer said:


> I think that dogs that live next to parks generally do become desensitized to the ordinary stuff going on in them. But that does not mean they will not bark if someone approaches the property that they deem to be within their territory.
> 
> I know our old shepherd Mix adopted the little old lady across the street. This lady never said a word to the dog. They never had any contact. But Princess would bark like crazy when someone went up onto her porch. She did not do this with the neighbors next door, who were closer, or the neighbors across the street who were also elderly but a couple. The little old lady across the street lived alone and walked up town every day. She was in her nineties. Princess never barked at her. But she felt she should bark at anyone going over there.
> 
> The point is, that it is not always we who determine the boundaries our dogs have. The dog may see the neighbor's dog as part of his pack. And having people from the park approaching his pack member, probably does get him going, much moreso than people minding their own business playing tennis.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Ah, while I agree, labs are bird dogs. I know we had one here in town trained and certified as a police k9, but they really aren't in the same category as herding and guardian breeds. But a dog is a dog, and every dog has some instincts left to it. 

I think it really depends on the dog. A dog that is seriously reactive in that situation is going to draw more fire as well. Kids in a park are not always kind, and if the dog is barking it is not necessarily out of sight out of mind. So it is possible that a dog will not be desensitized if it has been poorly treated, goaded, barked at or shouted at by people in the park. 

And if the owners had any inkling that that sort of crap was going on, their front and back fenced yards would probably have a divider and the dog would probably be kept on the side away from the park. 

It is hard to think that the dog owner is going to say something on a person whose dog was visiting with the neighbor's dog through the fence, if the the dog aggresses toward anything in six out of eight acres of the park.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

True but labs can also be decent watch dogs, at least as far as alerting. I work with some chocolate labs that put up quite the fuss when strangers approach their house. 

It is variable though, I agree! I had pondered the goading/teasing aspect too. It really is conjecture on our (and the OPs) part too because we/she don't know the lady in question. I can imagine, however, if she had caught people teasing her dog that she would be more easily angered if people got too close to her fence. 

What got me involved in this thread was the 'snappy comeback' after the fact business. Best to let the lady and her dog be, especially since they are on their property, which is what lead to follow on discussions about the legality/property lines and such too.

I used to have this problem with my horses. After awhile I got pretty fed up with people just walking up to the fence or even into the barn and feeding or otherwise messing with them. When I would catch them at it I got angry and I wasn't all Ms nicey-nice to them either. Even if it wasn't my horse but one of the other boarders. If the people thought I was overreacting too bad. I even caught some kids trying to hit a horse with a stick (not mine) and I let them have it!

Stable bordered on a public area. 

This lady may have been dealing with several situations over time and it gets aggravating and people loose their patience and I think that's understandable.



selzer said:


> Ah, while I agree, labs are bird dogs. I know we had one here in town trained and certified as a police k9, but they really aren't in the same category as herding and guardian breeds. But a dog is a dog, and every dog has some instincts left to it.
> 
> I think it really depends on the dog. A dog that is seriously reactive in that situation is going to draw more fire as well. Kids in a park are not always kind, and if the dog is barking it is not necessarily out of sight out of mind. So it is possible that a dog will not be desensitized if it has been poorly treated, goaded, barked at or shouted at by people in the park.
> 
> ...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Yup, the only dogs to charge at me in the many, many dog classes were both chocolate labs. 

Why is that?

Do they know how much I like chocolate? 

Ah well... Kind of off topic.


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

selzer said:


> Yup, the only dogs to charge at me in the many, many dog classes were both chocolate labs.
> 
> Why is that?
> 
> ...


Lmao¡! Someone with a sense of humor! I love it. Labs I have dealt with often show aggression or vocalizations when first approached. But I've never been bit by any of them. They are like the drunk guy at the bar who doesn't do much except talk smack unless his buddies are around. Good dogs though, a bit too much for me but good dogs none the less 

Howdy from Idaho!


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

LOL....did you get in on the dessert thread in the chat room?  



selzer said:


> Yup, the only dogs to charge at me in the many, many dog classes were both chocolate labs.
> 
> Why is that?
> 
> ...


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## Cheyanna (Aug 18, 2012)

Wow! She asked for snappy comebacks and boy did she get them. I think that she wanted them to go the other way though. I am MIA for a while and we lose the snappy comeback war.

Only because I have not been able to use my smartmouth in a while, here are a few:

Sorry, I cannot hear you over your dog barking like a nut

We come by 4 times a day and he only barks half the time. What a lazy mutt.

Your dog is all bark and no manners... the apple doesn't fall far from the tree does it?

Use these at your own risk.:wild:


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

none of those comebacks works. the OP's dog is barking also.




Cheyanna said:


> Wow! She asked for snappy comebacks and boy did she get them. I think that she wanted them to go the other way though. I am MIA for a while and we lose the snappy comeback war.
> 
> Only because I have not been able to use my smartmouth in a while, here are a few:
> 
> ...


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

Very dry in here 

Howdy from Idaho!


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## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

Cheyanna said:


> Sorry, I cannot hear you over your dog barking like a nut


I like this one, but I think it works better as, "I cannot hear your dog over your barking like a nut." It may work even better if said while looking at the dog.

Thank you!


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

That whole living in glass house dealie comes to mind.

BUT Cheyanna did warn to 'use them at your own risk'. 




doggiedad said:


> none of those comebacks works. the OP's dog is barking also.


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## jafo220 (Mar 16, 2013)

I'm confused here. Thought the OP was approaching the property next to the unpleasant person. If they have permission to approach then whats the problem with the unpleasant person other than thier dogs cause alot of commotion? It's not that the OP is approaching the unpleasant persons yard and teasing thier dogs. The OP is simply conversing with someone and visiting thier dog and the unpleasant persons dogs are causing an upheaval.

I mean, they are living directly behind a public park. Don't you think that maybe some of this should be expected? It sounds to me like the OP is not the only one comming close the the unpleasant persons yard setting thier dogs off. It kind of reminds me of someone buying a house out in the country and complaining about the hog lot next door. The one they knew was there when they bought the property. Same thing, you buy property joining a public place and your going to have strangers approach your yard at times, and more times if you have dogs outside. It's a given. Maybe they should have bought a house away from a public area.???

Oh and to the OP......be careful with snappy comebacks. Like what has been said, they may have better ones than you. Comebacks can also escalate into physical altercations too. So be careful. 

I won't offer any as the ones I use would get me banned. Also, I found the best way to react is to not react at all. Ignoring seems to work better than any sarcastic whit I've ever seen. Your basically telling them your opinion doesn't count without saying a word. Just go about your buisness, stay away from thier fence and dogs and just ignore.


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## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

jafo220 said:


> I'm confused here. Thought the OP was approaching the property next to the unpleasant person. If they have permission to approach then whats the problem with the unpleasant person other than thier dogs cause alot of commotion? It's not that the OP is approaching the unpleasant persons yard and teasing thier dogs. The OP is simply conversing with someone and visiting thier dog and the unpleasant persons dogs are causing an upheaval.


This is correct, except that the owner of the friendly dog is not outside talking to me on that occasion. We've done that on other occasions.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

your dog is barking also.



GSDLearner said:


> I like this one, but I think it works better as, "I cannot hear your dog over your barking like a nut." It may work even better if said while looking at the dog.
> 
> Thank you!


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## NTexFoster (Jul 18, 2013)

8 blasted pages of this? Wow.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

8 pages is nuthin' on this site, relatively speaking.

Anyhoo most people saying leave the lady alone.

doggiedad is being his usual succinct self.

Sue chiming in with her usually fair and balanced POV.

One person saying we were tearing the OP down, while the OP contemplates how to handle future confrontations with this lady... 

A couple of folks egging GSDlearner on (probably somewhat tongue in cheek).... though Hunterisgreat's suggestion probably was the funniest. 

...and in the end it's her Karma because she's making a choice. :shrug:

Reader's digest version, Welcome to the Forum. 





NTexFoster said:


> 8 blasted pages of this? Wow.


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## wdkiser (May 7, 2013)

NTexFoster said:


> My property ends at my fence.


This was my thought too. How big of a space do people expect to get on the *other side* of their property? If you want that "buffer zone" for your fence then build it 10 feet inside your property line.


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

Apparently at least 8 acres. At the least! 
I would really love to meet some of the people that are angered by passerbys, gawkers, bystanders and trolls. 
This reminds me of a story I once was told by an ol' Indian fella. He ended it with "you are always welcome in my teepee but don't you dare look at my fence" 

Howdy from Idaho!


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

No, No.

The park is 8-10 acres and the dog takes up only 6-8 acres of it.


LOL!


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## GSDLearner (Aug 3, 2013)

Gwenhwyfair said:


> One person saying we were tearing the OP down, while the OP contemplates how to handle future confrontations with this lady...


This is a misrepresentation of what I actually said:

"My question, then: are there any snappy comebacks (more funny than strictly mean) that are appropriate to situations _like this_? I don't expect to change anyone's mind, but wouldn't mind learning a few lines that will leave someone _like Mr. A's mom_ gasping for breath." (Emphasis added)

30 posts or so I asked a simple question: "I would be curious to know how much land one untrained dog is allowed to control?" Anyone actually have an opinion on that, or is it really just everything in his line of sight?


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## Loneforce (Feb 12, 2012)

Sometimes the best thing to say is *Nothing* Silence gets them every time


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

GSDLearner said:


> This is a misrepresentation of what I actually said:
> 
> "My question, then: are there any snappy comebacks (more funny than strictly mean) that are appropriate to situations _like this_? I don't expect to change anyone's mind, but wouldn't mind learning a few lines that will leave someone _like Mr. A's mom_ gasping for breath." (Emphasis added)
> 
> 30 posts or so I asked a simple question: "I would be curious to know how much land one untrained dog is allowed to control?" Anyone actually have an opinion on that, or is it really just everything in his line of sight?


I agree with Gwenhwyfair, who I believe is the one who said that if you need to ask for help on snappy comebacks, you are probably better off not using any. 

Don't take that ill. I personally am the one who NEVER has the right words to say in the thick of any situation. 10 minutes later the witty retort shows up in my mind and I feel bad for the rest of the day for the missed opportunity. Then, I usually agree that it is probably better having not said anything. I am one who doesn't believe in burning bridges. 

Instead of answering the question about the dog's territory, I have a question for you. How much of your energy do you want to give to a complete stranger? This thread is many hours old. You are letting what a complete stranger has said to you effect you for hours. We really can't control other people's opinions about ourselves or our behavior, but we can certainly control our outward reaction to their comments, and we have the ability to not allow their comments to effect us on a personal level either. 

Consider the source. 

When someone is telling you how you are training your dog wrong, consider the source, and then move on. 

When someone comes out and tells you that your dog is bothering theirs, consider the source and then move on. 

When you consider the source and then move on, if the source is someone you care about, friend or family member, or if the source is someone you respect, someone who has knowledge, you can weigh those comments differently than someone you barely know, or someone who has trouble with lots of people, or someone who is competing against you. Consider the source -- you do not have to say anything. 

Besides considering the source, another piece of related but unsolicited advice, is to kill them with kindness. They want to argue, don't, agree with them -- that usually shuts people up. Apologize, that is free, and it can put the other person into a better frame of mind. The bully might take it as a sign of weakness, but don't give them a chance, just "You're right, I'm sorry." and move on. 

You do not have to be a very big guy to pick a fight, but you have to be a big person to choose not to.

Don't let them get to you. Really. That is you giving your power to them. SMILE, and let them feel they have won. What does that cost you? Really?


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## Beckch (May 23, 2013)

we had a chain link fence that backed up to an alley and there was an older gentleman who walked his adult GSD by every day and would stop and say hi to my dogs (9 yr old Golden and GSD puppy) all spring and summer long. I know he had the best intentions, but he would get my puppy all excited (and his dog would bark too) and then give him treats when he was hyper, barking and jumping at the fence. I tried to explain to him that giving the puppy a treat when he is in this state of mind is only rewarding unwanted behavior but his response was to "let him be a dog." I know he means well, but I'm really trying hard to train my dog not to jump on people as a greeting so it's frustrating. We ended up getting a 6 ft privacy fence installed though  Not because of him - we had planned on this for over a year, but whew! hee hee.


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

Don't have any comebacks for you, I'd probably just ignore the lady and ignore her dog. Its not my issue if she can't control her dog. As someone said, her property ends at her fence. If the lady you are talking to has no issues with you being there, and you are at HER fence and not this other ladies fence then I would just leave her be. 

My guess is she is just looking for something to complain about and if its not you, then it'll be someone else, or something else. It sounds more like she wants to blame other people for her lack of training.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

What Sue said....

AND....

Leave her alone. Most of the people on this board have given you that advice, ignore her, stay away from the private backyard(s), don't escalate and various versions of that. The reason is there is likely nothing to be gained and far more potential negatives to bothering/arguing with someone who is standing on their private property.

IF you go down near enough to her fence to engage in some sort of verbal altercation, which is what 'snappy comebacks' often lead to (human nature 101) then you are indeed the one instigating a confrontation.

We've only gotten one small slice of this story, yours. 

As to your question, I'm sorry but I'm going to be blunt, it's a silly question as you seek to justify your actions/reaction to this lady. I simply find it hard to believe that her dog is that obnoxious as to limit access to the park that severely and I'm sure of that (because I go to a park with similar situations/private property/barking dogs) I and the others walking by just keep on walking and ignore the barking dog in the backyard. As long as you are on designated walk ways/green spaces you are free to enjoy the park, her dog is not actually controlling the space he's ...just....barking, like your dog was doing.

We don't know anything about this lady or her dog. She is on her property and not breaking any laws.

Leave her alone.

Else....go there with the snappy comebacks a couple of people have supplied and let us know how that works out. Usually it'll just piss people off more, start a real shouting match, result in a call to the police or even damage the relationship she has with her neighbor whom you visit with. Many different negative outcomes given, again, basic human nature 101.


Maybe, if you insist on getting near her fence and want to be friends with her neighbor you could try calming her down by validating her concerns 

"I'm sorry, I don't mean to bother you, I enjoy visiting this dog. Has something bad happened that makes you feel worried?" MAYBE she'll calm down and be able to share what's really bothering her and then she'll feel more trusting of your presence. Which is sort of what Saphire was suggesting but putting the responsibility of reaching out on you, which is fair since YOU are the one approaching (and possibly crossing onto) private property. If she still reacts badly then at least you tried to be kind AND then.....

Leave her alone, she is on her property and she is not breaking any laws where as you *may* be, the potential is greater that you would be in the wrong. There is no justification for aggravating this person.







GSDLearner said:


> This is a misrepresentation of what I actually said:
> 
> "My question, then: are there any snappy comebacks (more funny than strictly mean) that are appropriate to situations _like this_? I don't expect to change anyone's mind, but wouldn't mind learning a few lines that will leave someone _like Mr. A's mom_ gasping for breath." (Emphasis added)
> 
> 30 posts or so I asked a simple question: "I would be curious to know how much land one untrained dog is allowed to control?" Anyone actually have an opinion on that, or is it really just everything in his line of sight?


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

No way of knowing without looking at plats (which are public record)...but really IMO it's just better to enjoy the park and leave people be, it's not worth the hassle. 

:shrug:



GSDolch said:


> Don't have any comebacks for you, I'd probably just ignore the lady and ignore her dog. Its not my issue if she can't control her dog. As someone said, her property ends at her fence. If the lady you are talking to has no issues with you being there, and you are at HER fence and not this other ladies fence then I would just leave her be.
> 
> My guess is she is just looking for something to complain about and if its not you, then it'll be someone else, or something else. It sounds more like she wants to blame other people for her lack of training.


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## GSDolch (May 15, 2006)

Gwenhwyfair said:


> No way of knowing without looking at plats (which are public record)...but really IMO it's just better to enjoy the park and leave people be, it's not worth the hassle.
> 
> :shrug:



On one hand I can see that, but if I am talking to a friend, someone what _wants_ me talking to them at their fence and I'm not at the neighbors fence, I'm not going to stop talking to my friend just because someone is upset. I'm not one for changing my life because it upsets someone. Maybe if she is right there by that fence to, I could see, otherwise it's no hassle for me, I'd just ignore them. She needs to take responsibility for her own dog barking. Personal responsibility isn't a punishment. In this case IMO its on the woman with the dog barking. The OP is doing nothing wrong and shouldn't be punished for it. I see it the same way when I dealt with my sister. I didn't give into her demands just because she said she would cut herself. If we gave it to everyones demands because something upset them, no one would be able to do anything.

The OP enjoys talking to this woman, she shouldn't be punished for that because someone is upset. 


It does make me wonder how much that neighbor complains about to the woman who does live next to her. I'd be putting up a big 'ol fence in between her house and mine, lol.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

I don't know how well they know each other. I *gathered* they chit chat occasionally at the fence but if they are better friends then why not meet and walk their dogs together in designated areas in the park?

On a more technical note - peaceful enjoyment of property isn't limited by physical boundaries, hence you can call the police if a neighbor is playing loud music or has dog which is barking all the time even though you aren't physically on their property. It could also be considered harassment if GSDlearner gets close enough to get in a verbal argument with the lady. If the lady is standing on her property she gets more consideration....

Another point is I'm giving the other lady the benefit of the doubt because we don't know her side of the story. Her dog may be a rescue with some behavioural issues, she may have had people teasing her dog, she may just be nervous of strangers approaching closely to the private backyards because of privacy/safety.

We don't know these details and to be honest, my reaction would be to keep away from this lady's back yard because technically I, as a stranger, encroaching or possibly crossing onto a private easement to access the backyards, there is more *potential* for me being in the wrong. It's just not worth the hassle.

If GSDlearner wants to be friends with the other lady she can 1) try to talk to the lady who is upset as I suggested earlier 2) exchange phone numbers and arrange meet ups with the lady she chats with and they can enjoy walks in the park together.

I've had people cross boundaries with me/my property and feel strongly about respecting people's privacy and property. Call me conservative on that point.  It's just not a battle I would pick.

Good mornin' btw. 




GSDolch said:


> On one hand I can see that, but if I am talking to a friend, someone what _wants_ me talking to them at their fence and I'm not at the neighbors fence, I'm not going to stop talking to my friend just because someone is upset. I'm not one for changing my life because it upsets someone. Maybe if she is right there by that fence to, I could see, otherwise it's no hassle for me, I'd just ignore them. She needs to take responsibility for her own dog barking. Personal responsibility isn't a punishment. In this case IMO its on the woman with the dog barking. The OP is doing nothing wrong and shouldn't be punished for it. I see it the same way when I dealt with my sister. I didn't give into her demands just because she said she would cut herself. If we gave it to everyones demands because something upset them, no one would be able to do anything.
> 
> The OP enjoys talking to this woman, she shouldn't be punished for that because someone is upset.
> 
> ...


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## GSD07 (Feb 23, 2007)

GSDolch said:


> The OP enjoys talking to this woman, she shouldn't be punished for that because someone is upset.


 The only thing is that the OP is not talking to any woman. She approaches the yard to let her dog meet with the neighbor's dog while no people are present in either yards.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

I think GSDLearner said she has chatted with the dog's owner in the past but you're right, when the other neighbor got upset my understanding was no one was present, initially.



GSD07 said:


> The only thing is that the OP is not talking to any woman. She approaches the yard to let her dog meet with the neighbor's dog while no people are present in either yards.


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

OP, thanks for giving more detail. Since you have spoken with and somewhat friended the lady that owns the dog that your dog is sniffing, I would say you ar not doing anything wrong. 

In the dogs mind (the reactive barker from the other yard) anything he or she can see is in his or her domain. That is a dog. I would imagine many dogs pass by that yard and cause the dog to bark, but you stopped, the owner saw you and challenged you. She may not realize that you only pass by every now and then. 

I imagine her dog's barking may upset her and you were her available target. 

I still don't let my dogs sniff others through fences and don't advise it but you seem to have tacit permission and your dog and the friendly dog are okay with it. I think if you want to continue doing that you might consider breaking it off as soon as you see the unfriendly neighbor dog get agitated. 

There really is nothing you can say that won't upset the person more. I would just move on when you see him start to react.


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## Jaythethird (Jul 1, 2013)

And like the sand in an hour glass..... 

Howdy from Idaho!


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