# Schutzhund puppy video



## Stephanie17s (Jun 16, 2009)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aO0ayIefBg

This was intense to watch! She was so proud every time she got the rag! 

Is this considered normal training for a 12 week old puppy? I looked up their website too. http://www.starkepfoten.com/ Not familiar with them, but fascinated


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## angelaw (Dec 14, 2001)

The comments pretty well sum it up. Not abnormal. gets pup used to unsure footing, use to hands/sticks coming over etc.


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## GSDTrain (Apr 21, 2008)

i've seen this one before but, it is very interesting to watch!


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## Stephanie17s (Jun 16, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: GSDTraini've seen this one before but, it is very interesting to watch!


It showed up in the "recommended for me" video section so I took a look at it! I thought it was really interesting to see such a young dog have such focus. I guess thats what is meant by high drive? lol



> Originally Posted By: Angela_WThe comments pretty well sum it up. Not abnormal. gets pup used to unsure footing, use to hands/sticks coming over etc.


Very interesting. I had never seen such a young puppy in training before.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

K, noob disclaimer here, but at least from what I have seen and experienced so far, I wouldn't really call it normal or abnormal. I didn't do all that with my puppy and don't know anyone who did, but if you know what you're doing it's not going to hurt. Key phrase there being "if you know what you're doing." I didn't, so whacking my puppy or even pretending to hit it and drive it would have been just plain stupid for me to do. I didn't do a lot of ragwork either, and actually just started using tugs as rewards and for obedience (my puppy is now 12 months) because again, I didn't really know what I was doing and in that case, best to not do anything than screw up your dog's grip or accidentally give him a really bad experience.

To me, it's "normal" to take any new pup out and get it used to as many things as possible, but for me that is more broad than just SchH stuff like ragwork, getting stick hits, etc. I took my puppy all over to lots of places with lots of sounds, smells, and textures.


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## sunfluer (May 12, 2009)

<span style='font-size: 11pt'>Interesting video but not into it really. Guess I'm too soft on my dogs.







</span>


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## Virginia (Oct 2, 2008)

This is generally how the puppies that are destined for SchH are brought up at my club, it seems to build very intense drive for the rag and eventually the sleeve, as well as get them used to being touched all over and being around the sticks. I think if I ever got a pup from a breeder specifically for trialing in SchH I would put him through that at a young age too.


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## sunfluer (May 12, 2009)

<span style='font-size: 11pt'>I understand. Looking at the video it seems there were times he was stroking the pup. I have no experience with the technique, it seems harsh but it's probably not. The pup didn't seem to mind whatsoever. In fact, the pup was probably enjoying it. I can see where the idea in part is desensitizing so there's no fear.</span>


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## Crookedcreekranch (May 27, 2008)

Wow that pup has excellent focus and seems to be thoroughly enjoying himself.
My only concern is the lifting off the ground when so young because of the puppy teeth. I do see at times he supports the pups body against his leg but many times he is not and swinging...not an expert on canine canines but would seem not the best thing on developing teeth? anyone know more about that then me? chime in...

But I really liked all the conditioning that was being done on a pup so young....that should be one tough dog!


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

The reason he can do all those things with this puppy is genetics. The pedigree on all the breeding stock at that kennel is very sound. What he is doing with that puppy really has little to do with "high drive" and everything to do with solid nerves. Look at the puppy's body language, tail wagging, no stress. Nice puppy. 
In looking at the website, I noticed that their sire, Kanto is not only a high DRIVE national Sch competitor, but he SETTLES in the house real nice with the family. How is that possible when all I've been told on this forum is about these high drive dogs you can't live with.....must be a mistake!!


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## valkyriegsd (Apr 20, 2000)

> Originally Posted By: Crooked CreekWow that pup has excellent focus and seems to be thoroughly enjoying himself. My only concern is the lifting off the ground when so young because of the puppy teeth.


I am getting a DDR pup later this year and want to do SchH w/him (first time for this!) so I've been trying to learn what I can/should do to 'start' a pup. There's so many different ideas on training (BIG shock there, right?







) but what I've heard that makes sense to me is to work with the bite early, and STOP while they're teething so you don't turn them off to it because of the sore gums. I'm sure some of the pups would work through ANYTHING to get the tug, but I wouldn't want to chance that it would set them back.

I had worked an adult in PP, and he broke (well, _shattered_, really) a tooth, and the vet didn't get all the pieces removed. He wasn't biting as well after it 'healed', and I finally figured out there were pieces of tooth working their way out!!







So, even though he still wanted to work, and did, it did effect his bite.

As far as lifting the pup, he was being gentle in how he lifted, no harsh jerking or bouncing from what I could see. And pups that size don't weigh much, so their small teeth can hold them up!







I don't know that I'll try ALL of that with my new pup, but I think getting them used to as much as possible as YOUNG as possible is great!


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## Chris Wild (Dec 14, 2001)

Seems pretty normal to me. We do this type of thing with pups in all of our litters. Though it's not really about training with a pup this young. Some imprinting/desensitizing, yes, but mainly it's about testing the pup's genetics. With young pups, more of what you see is the result of nature than nurture. And it's important to evaluate the different facets of a pup's genetic temperament.

What you see in this video isn't so much about drive. It's about nerve, as Cliff said. Sure, drive is a component of the pup chasing and biting in the first place, but how the pup reacts (or doesn't react) to the different challenges tells a LOT about it's nerve. IMO, this is the single most important component to evaluate in a pup, regardless of it's intended purpose. Not doing this sort of thing, or something similar, with pups (at least those planned for work/sport) means missing out on a huge opportunity to evaluate the pup's temperament.

As for damage to teeth, really no worry there. First, at that age the pup just has his milk teeth. It would be highly unlikely for the puppy teeth to be damaged by this, but even if by some weird chance one was, it'll be falling out in another month or two anyway. So this sort of thing can do nothing do damage adult teeth. Second, damage to teeth isn't an issue, but damage to a pup from a fall could be. So no one with half a brain would be swinging around or picking up a pup unless that person already had a good idea of the pup's bite and knew things would go fine. This wouldn't be the pup's first bitework session. A lot would have been doing previously to make sure the pup had the physical and mental abilities to move onto this sort of work. Puppies that age have *plenty* of bite strength to hold up their weight if they want to. They are perfectly capable. And the pup's willingness to do so, especially under different stressors, again says a lot about it's nerve. So while it isn't appropriate for every pup, with a good pup it's perfectly safe so long as the person is smart and doesn't go overboard. 

I see absolutely no concerns with what is being done with that pup in that video. The work is physically safe for that pup, and a lot is being showcased about the pup's genetic temperament.


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## Catu (Sep 6, 2007)

Similar video with a true maligator pup.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNYlgMt1DpA&feature=channel_page


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## Jason L (Mar 20, 2009)

freaking crazy malinois with their one track minds


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: Chris WildSeems pretty normal to me. We do this type of thing with pups in all of our litters. Though it's not really about training with a pup this young. Some imprinting/desensitizing, yes, but mainly it's about testing the pup's genetics. With young pups, more of what you see is the result of nature than nurture. And it's important to evaluate the different facets of a pup's genetic temperament.
> 
> What you see in this video isn't so much about drive. It's about nerve, as Cliff said. Sure, drive is a component of the pup chasing and biting in the first place, but how the pup reacts (or doesn't react) to the different challenges tells a LOT about it's nerve. IMO, this is the single most important component to evaluate in a pup, regardless of it's intended purpose. Not doing this sort of thing, or something similar, with pups (at least those planned for work/sport) means missing out on a huge opportunity to evaluate the pup's temperament.
> 
> ...


My breeder does a similar evaluation as the one in the video as well. I was there one day when she was showing me what was done to Stark. Very interesting.

If they know what they are doing I see no problems.


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## elisabeth_00117 (May 17, 2009)

> Originally Posted By: LicanAntaiSimilar video with a true maligator pup.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNYlgMt1DpA&feature=channel_page


WOAH! Crazy!

Amazing little critters!


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