# ofa prelim xray (please say what you think)



## GSD07

Could you please take a look at this film and tell your opinion? Also I would really like to know if the positioning is good since this is a new vet I used, and he's very expensive. This is a preliminary hip xray taken at 11 months, with the reversible sedation (they gave him a shot and then brought him back to me in 15 min). 

There are so many experienced in reading xray people here and I would truly appreciate your input!!!


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## Chris Wild

Positioning is fine. As are the hips. There's a tiny bit of flattening on the R femoral head and it's not as round as ideal, or as round as the L one, but it's seated deep enough in the socket to not be of any major concern.


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## GSD07

Chris, thank you! You made me feel a little better. OFA prelim report came back with mild hip displasia, unilateral pathology right, and they marked subluxation. I felt so bad for my puppy and started looking for any signs of pain or discomfort but I don't see any. I think his hips cause more discomfort to me than to him at this point







Is this flattening means the arthritis is already setting in??


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## OkieAmazon

Are you submitting to OFA? I agree with Chris that the R femoral head a bit flattened. It's a crap shoot what OFA will say, however.


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## Chris Wild

I don't see anything I'd consider excess sublaxation for a dog of that age. There are some gaps, but that is normal in young dogs before the ligaments tighten, and also normal when a dog is sedated. Still over 50% of the femoral head is in the socket, and I've seen looser hips than those pass OFA. The R femoral head is the concern I have. I'm not good at seeing arthritis on an x-ray so can't say if there's any there or not, but if the femoral head isn't sufficiently round arthritis can develop due to excess wear and tear of moving a square peg in a round hole. I'd say from an OFA standpoint, the hips are on the cusp of what they'd pass and what they wouldn't. So in terms of a potential breeding candidate, the jury is out on what OFA will say at 2 years old and whether they'll change their minds or not.

But Pass or Fail from an OFA standpoint, the important thing is that from the quality of life/ability to work standpoint, the hips are fine. He should never have any problems or need serious intervention.


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## Chicagocanine

The right one does look poor. I don't really see arthritis but then again I have only seen severe arthritis on x-rays so I might not be able to see it if it is mild... My terrier had severe hip dysplasia in one hip with bone chips and arthritis, both the ball and socket were mostly flat.


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## GSD07

> Originally Posted By: Chris Wild But Pass or Fail from an OFA standpoint, the important thing is that from the quality of life/ability to work standpoint, the hips are fine. He should never have any problems or need serious intervention.


Thanks again for the detailed explanation Chris. That's what I wanted to hear because I don't care so much if he can be a breeding prospect (it takes much more than just good hips) but I do care if he can have an active life and be able to work. I do tracking with him and take it seriously, and I wanted to do scootering with him when he's a bit older (dogs pulling me on a scooter). 

Displasia is such a dreaded word, and when I recieved the report I was pretty devastated and told my husband that we need to start putting money aside for a THR. I also thought that I would need to limit the excercise and turn him into a couch potato but my vet told me that keeping him in a top physical shape is the best thing that I can do for him. I am going to xray his hips and elbows again in a year.


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## GSD07

Chicagocanine, thank you for your input! I hope that his hips won't develop the severe problem, I hope that keeping him lean and giving supplements will help. He's a medium male and probably be only 80lb at the most when mature so it should help his hips too.


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## WiscTiger

My Cheyenne is mild DH on the left side. Keeping her lean and fit does wonders for her. Early this winter she slipped on the ice, so she hasn't wanted to go out as much plus she did have some soft tissue damage from that, but this is the first time in 7 years that I have seen her limp. I am starting her on supplements and would have earlier but with her extra senstive tummy I was hesitant to add any stress. But she is stable now, so I will just be giving a supplement without Chrondionitn (sp).

Val


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## wolfstraum

I am surprised they gave these a fail as well - I have seen worse pass - again, not a radiologist, but they have decent coverage, necks and are pretty decent in position...the spacing in the sockets is not the greatest, but these are far far from the worst hips I have seen.

Start supplements, keep him lean and exercised to build muscle - redo at 2 years to be sure and to see if there are changes.

Lee


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## windwalker718

Also remember that "dysplasia" doesn't necessarily mean crippled, nor in pain. I've seen a Shepherd with the WORSE displasia (she had NO heads on either hip) who could clear a 6' wall from a standstill... I'd curtail excessive jumping especially as she's still growing. BUT a mild displasia doesn't mean the dog's going to be in pain automatically... Just that it shouldn't be bred. Our Golden/shepherd cross even raced on a sled team despite severe displasia.

As Lee says, keep his weight down, keep him exercised... swimming is better than jumping for a dog with ?? hips. Supliments are good. 
Positioning looks quite good. As others have said the questionable hip is her right, the head is not well rounded, and if you look with magnifying glass you can see it more clearly.


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## Chicagocanine

> Originally Posted By: GSD07Chicagocanine, thank you for your input! I hope that his hips won't develop the severe problem, I hope that keeping him lean and giving supplements will help. He's a medium male and probably be only 80lb at the most when mature so it should help his hips too.


I also wanted to add, my terrier was still able to run and walk easily with the severe HD although he did bunny-hop when he ran and put more weight on the "good" leg. We did an FHO surgery and after that he could run, jump, and play and usually went on long walks/hikes and even ran with my bike (vet OK'd it.)
My Golden also had DJD in her hips, arthritis in her hips and wrists, and bridging spinal spondylosis which was diagnosed at about 6-7 years old. The best thing I did for her was to keep her lean and keep her moving/exercising. Good muscle provides support for the joints which is very important. Between that and her supplements and physical therapy, she was able to run, jump, hike and go on long walks despite the worsening spondylosis. When we went to a new vet they were shocked at the extent and severity of her spondylosis, it was down most of her back. They were shocked because they_ couldn't tell _she had spondylosis until they saw the x-rays! If they had asked her to turn around they would've been able to tell, the only real "issue" she had with the spondylosis is that the bridging fusing much of her back made it impossible for her to curve around tightly.
Here is a photo of her lure coursing at 10 years old: 
http://www.chicagocanine.com/dogcamp/coursegin1.JPG 

The joint supplements I used for both dogs included Syn-Flex (liquid supplement with Glucosamine and others), vitamin C and E, salmon oil, Duralactin, and DLPA for Ginger. I also used an enzyme and probiotic supplement. The treatments I used included at different times acupuncture, chiropractic and water treadmill hydrotherapy. Swimming is another good activity for dogs with joint problems.


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## JenM66

Gracie got MILD HD with her prelims, stating sublation also. I started her immediately on cosequin ds. At her 2 year old OFAs she passed with FAIR but now the orthopedist I go to says she has DJD. She shows no symptoms and as long as she is happy and has normal activity, I don't worry too much about it. Who knows what you'll get with OFA. As people have said, it's a "crap shoot". Depends on the readers and what else they've seen that day.


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## GSD07

Thank you again for your comments! For some reason I was under impression that dysplasia does mean 'crippled dog'. I'm glad that this is not always the case. My new vet, actually, said the same thing after I asked him about his prognosis. He said to keep Anton in good shape, give him supplements and pay attention to the dog, not the xray film. 

Jen, I'll try not to worry. I'll deal with the problems if they become too obvious and will require action. I will continue supplements and exercise.

I still ask myself rhetorical question why if a dog has a super nice temperament than the dog has to have bad hips, and if a dog has good hips than something is not wired right in his head? Why doesn't everything come in one package??


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## Chris Wild

> Originally Posted By: GSD07Thank you again for your comments! For some reason I was under impression that dysplasia does mean 'crippled dog'. I'm glad that this is not always the case.


This is a very common misconception. The truth is that the vast majority of dogs rated as having HD by OFA, etc... are not likely to be crippled or significantly affected by it. Especially if managed properly. Truly severe HD is pretty uncommon and most dogs who are diagnosed with HD are mild to moderate.


This dog was rated moderate HD in both hips by OFA. And considering how bad they are I think moderate is a conservative rating and wouldn't have been surprised if they'd rated it severe. As you can see by the x-ray, her hips are a LOT worse than Anton's. Shallow sockets, lots of sublaxation, very flattened and pointed femoral heads, thickening of the femoral shaft, and arthritis already present... the works! 

She's now 9.5 years old and thanks too good management and joint supplements she has never had any symptoms.


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## Kayos and Havoc

Wow Chris!!! I wish Kayos hips were that good!! Hers truly were severe and of course we had the right replaced in Sept. 

Oksana I see no evidence of arthritis in Anton's hips. They do not look shallow to me, just loose and a bit flat on one head. I think and that may be age. I think with continued moderate exercise, joint supplements and weight control he will be fine even if they don't tighten up by 2 years.


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## Chris Wild

Kathy,

Oh, yes, I know they can get much worse than Nara's. Worst hips I ever saw was an Airedale Terrier where the femoral heads were completely flat and sat well outside the sockets. There was actually nearly an inch of space between the sockets and the femoral heads on the x-ray.

Just showing Nara's as an example of how bad the x-ray can look but the dog is still fine. Her's are probably the worst I've seen where no surgery was needed and quality of life was unaffected. We did stop doing SchH with her when she was about 2yo (though that was more due to temperament and nerve issues than hips) but even with that she's led a pretty active life.. mainly because she's still a hyperactive nutjob who is constantly in motion even at 9.5 years old!


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## Chicagocanine

Here is Pooch's x-ray. If you look closely you can see the bone fragments around the joint and if you compare the left and right you can see that the left hip basically had no "ball" left.











Here is Ginger's x-ray from around when she was first diagnosed with spondylosis and DJD. Sorry about the poor quality, I didn't have a lightbox available when I took this photo... If I can find one I'll post a photo of one of the later x-rays where you can see the progression but I am not sure I have one.


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## BJDimock

I so wish that I had Ilan's hip films on disc. I'm sure you would all gasp in horror.
GSD07, I agree with everyone. The positioning is nice on the film and the right hip shows a square head. There is small evidence of arthritis but who in this world doesn't walk around with some?
Ilan's right hip on xray is completely luxated, and the left shows definate signs or arthrtic changes. This is why, at just over a year, she was removed from the Fidelco guide dog program.
At just under 3, she has never had a lame day in my house. I keep her very trim, and haven't had to supplement her in any way. For my own peice of mind, I re-xrayed her about 6 months ago, and there was no significant changes in her hips.
She may go through life very nicely, and she continues to clear my couches in a single leap.
This certainly doesn't mean that you will have a crippled dog.


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## BowWowMeow

I like looking at all of these x-rays--I'm getting pretty good at reading them! Massie's hips basically had no sockets so I think these all look pretty good!









I would definitely recommend a good supplement and Ester C for any dog with hip problems, even if they just show up on x-ray and aren't showing symptoms. That is a very important part of "proper management" and has worked wonders for Rafi who came to me with a very obvious problem and is now doing great!


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## Scarlett

I'm posting a couple of x-rays, just for more information and input. The first one is a prelim (not sent to OFA) at about 10-11 months of age. This was a large puppy, fast growing and ended up being a mature 90 pounds lean at 3. The second is the submission to OFA at 4 years. You can see the changes that took place during that time as far as finishing growth, the shape and seating of the femoral head in the socket, and less laxicity in the joint. The dog was anesthetized for both procedures. OFA Good at 4 years. (sorry they are kind of dark, but viewable).









10 Months









4 Years

This dog will be 13 years old in April. Never limped a day in his life and still doesn't, he is on no medications, supplements or painkillers. He is able to get on the bed, into the van and run around the yard chasing a stick as long as you throw it. If he does have any arthritic changes he doesn't let on and is in great shape for a very old dog. It would be interesting to see a picture of his hips at this advanced age but I don't think I would bother to subject him to an x-ray just for that. 

In the case of larger, late maturing puppies unless there are very obvious signs of poor joint conformation, re-xray over 2 years of age for a better final evaluation.


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## BJDimock

The op's concern, I think, was that of early signs of Djd, of which there is evidence of in the prelim. There is a flattening of the femoral head on the right, (if you look closely, you'll see the jagged outline), which suggests some arthritic changes, a concern for a dog this young. Your prelim shows normal pup laxity, without the slight changes near the joint. The final film is hard to see so I'll have to take your word for it. The hips appear to be well seated. The right may be squarer, but that could be positional.
To reiterate what I said before though, it does not mean that this dog will end up lame. Excercise, proper weight, and muscle strength can do wonders for anyone.


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