# Losing my mind -need landsharking help!



## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

So Seiran was given a larger muzzle at her vet appointment on Saturday. It allows her to open her mouth quiet a bit more than her previous muzzle. She is celebrating by biting EVERYTHING. Her current favorite is toes. My step daughters keep forgetting to shut their bedroom doors, so three times she has raced down the stairs choking on panties she’s managed to swallow halfway. She’s attacking (playfully) my younger children, and biting the heck out of them, pulling off their shorts, trying to eat their hair. Basically a typical land shark, but we have no way of redirecting with toys that are okay to chew on, because she isn’t allowed. Her zoomies are through the roof too, and there is nothing I can think of to help her get that energy out. She not fully vaccinated, so walks or short distant runs are out. 

I was thinking of closing the doggie door and carrying her out back to the agility course we have setup for our husky, but modify it for her height, but it’s already 100+ and she can’t fully pant, so I’m afraid of overheating her. 

Anyone have any suggestions for a muzzled pup that can’t be given toys, treats, or anything mouth wise to help with the land sharking going on? For now I’ve just been giving her verbal commands and removing her from the room until she settles, but that’s not going to work much longer. 

We did get to see her with her muzzle off at the vets, and she is going to have a dent in that side of her face according to the vet, and her ears will always be lopsided, which means she will have permanent puppy cross ears (which I think is just adorable), but other than that, she is healing well, but we are still going weekly for checks. The vet thinks the muzzle may need to stay on for an additional 6 weeks, so I need to figure something out quick! And I’ve added a pic of her cute ears because I can’t get enough of them!


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

Why is she wearing a muzzle?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

oh man. no advice here. Typically you would redirect and play tug but she has a broken jaw so..... 

Is she allowed to chew on things? If so, maybe give her a chew toy instead?

And just a thought to your other conversation about reintroducing - many sport people do not let their dogs interact because they want the dogs to be focused on them instead of other dogs. So she should be very into you as you are her source of ALL things rather than the pack of dogs. It might actually be to your benefit.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

oh man. no advice here. Typically you would redirect and play tug but she has a broken jaw so..... 

Is she allowed to chew on things? If so, maybe give her a chew toy instead?

And just a thought to your other conversation about reintroducing - many sport people do not let their dogs interact because they want the dogs to be focused on them instead of other dogs. So she should be very into you as you are her source of ALL things rather than the pack of dogs. It might actually be to your benefit.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

This will sure give you that one on one time that can be challenging otherwise with other dogs in the house. Have you talked to the vet in what she was able to do. Some vets feel outings are much more in the pups favor then being cooped up until they get all the vaccines- not in heavily trafficked areas where dogs are of course and this is dependent upon your area though and what virus are going around. You can do some scent work with her that will keep her mind busy either by playing hind and seek or hiding something she would enjoy to drink? Like a bowl of goats milk ,bone broth ,some yogurt or a patae type of treat- I’m not sure what she is allowed to eat but along those lines. There are a lot of puppy tricks you can teach her to keep her brain busy with similar rewards mentioned. Not sure if she is able to chew on a wash cloth soaked in water then put in a freezer till frozen - supervised of course. They have some inexpensive agility equipment like a tunnel or homemade equipment that you may have fun with help her get zoomies out. Work on behaving for grooming , nail trims/dremel etc. All this I think would help keep her mind off her aching gums to a point.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Scent work sounds like a great idea, I’ll just have to make sure it’s something big enough she can’t get her mouth around. 

She isn’t allowed to use her mouth other than eating her slurry. It’s thinned out so it’s slightly thicker than water. The vet said to discourage all licking other than meal time, and absolutely no chewing. We reward her now with excited tones and good girls, she knows how to sit, stay, and look at me, but I used feeding time to teach her that. 

Parvo is an epidemic in our town, so vets advice is strictly our yard only. With her jaw healing, her immune system isn’t going to fight off anything contagious like a healthy pup would. We carry her into the vets office, they take us immediately to a private room that is reserved for her so we don’t have to wait in the lobby with the other pets. They are extremely cautious with her because of all the parvo cases they have come in on a daily basis. 

We take her to the front yard for play time in the evenings when it’s cooler, and she knows her boundaries. She tests them occasionally by putting a paw over into the neighbors yard, I tell her “far enough” and she steps right back into our yard with all paws. Other dogs have gone by, the neighbors kids have been in their front yard playing, and she will be alert and watches, but still stays in our yard.

The agility course is separated from the main area of the backyard, and fenced in, so it’s always one on one when I am working with Crios. Hubs stays with Seiran inside and cuddles with her. I suppose I can try her out on it in the evenings when it cools, I’ll just take down the dog walk and teeter totter, I’m afraid she smack her face and make her injury worse. Everything else can be adjusted to her size. It’s just a pain in the butt to size and then resize for Crios, but it’s just my laziness and lack of energy in the evenings preventing me from having tried it already. 

I asked the vet for recommendations, and he said he was great at fixing animals, but not great at training them, so the only thing he could come up with was hubs and I rolling a ball back and forth on the ground, without letting Seiran get it, as an altered form of fetch. As you can imagine, that didn’t go over well. She would chase it a few times, then start jumping and biting at our hair and clothes.

I honestly hope she doesn’t have to go another 6 weeks muzzled, because I’m already fraying at the edges! Lyka is still my main focus when the hubs is home, and when he is at work, I just feel guilty all the time because Seiran is time consuming, and I don’t get to spend as much time with Lyka as I want to be.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Heidigsd said:


> Why is she wearing a muzzle?


She fractured her jaw in a freak accident with the doggie door.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Jchrest said:


> She fractured her jaw in a freak accident with the doggie door.


That happened to a pup in the past. He developed a crooked jaw due to damage to the growth area on one side and needed extensive dental work. His permanent teeth were damaged even before teething started and some of them were broken and had to be surgically removed.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Rewards with praise maybe enough for now especially the real boasted praise that make them melt I think Luna prefers that and she loves her treats. She may really enjoy playing hind n seek with her people. Observe how she responds to lavish rewards of praise and hugs in this game if she enjoys that it may be enough for now. This will pass it will. Soon you both with be making up for lost time before you know it.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

wolfy dog said:


> Jchrest said:
> 
> 
> > She fractured her jaw in a freak accident with the doggie door.
> ...


Fingers crossed this doesn’t happen to Seiran! Regardless, we will do what is medically necessary with each stage of her recovery. 

Just curious, what was the quality of life like as that pup aged?


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## Heartandsoul (Jan 5, 2012)

Any chance you could put her slurry in an oversized Kong, freeze that and let her work at licking it and rolling it around w/o worrying about her getting her mouth around it and biting due to the size. I can't think of any cons to this but others may. If not, it might give you some breathing time. Too bad that little muzzle doesn't come with a soft semi rigid rubber webbed capping at the front. 

Guys, who was that design engineer that was looking for ideas.

Edit: Had to add that she is adorable!


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Heartandsoul said:


> Any chance you could put her slurry in an oversized Kong, freeze that and let her work at licking it and rolling it around w/o worrying about her getting her mouth around it and biting due to the size. I can't think of any cons to this but others may. If not, it might give you some breathing time. Too bad that little muzzle doesn't come with a soft semi rigid rubber webbed capping at the front.
> 
> Guys, who was that design engineer that was looking for ideas.
> 
> Edit: Had to add that she is adorable!


Yes. The constant motion of the jaw to lick would be an issue. When my husband broke his jaw it was liquids thru a straw only and suck gently.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Jchrest said:


> Fingers crossed this doesn’t happen to Seiran! Regardless, we will do what is medically necessary with each stage of her recovery.
> 
> Just curious, what was the quality of life like as that pup aged?


Thankfully his bite remained scissored and was able to eat his raw chicken backs. He misses one large molar and two smaller ones though.


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## Dunkirk (May 7, 2015)

When my dog was recovering from elbow surgery at 9 months, we would take him for drives in the car. He got an outing, and gave his nose a workout. My dog kicks balls with his front paws, maybe work on that?


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

I have a very lightweight, cheap, tennis ball sized ball that I talk Shadow to play "soccer" with. The object of the game is that she is only allowed to use her feet, not her mouth. It is light weight enough that it is safe in the house, or a motel room, lol. 
Shadow will wack that thing around for long enough to wear her out and since it squeaks I can use it to interrupt behaviors I don't like and get her attention.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

We’ve made some progress on the zoomies. She LOVES swimming! Hubs kept his hand on her belly for assistance, but eventually she wanted nothing to do with his hand, and took off on her own. He did this on his own while me and my older daughter were down and out with a stomach bug yesterday. So of course I panicked like an idiot when I saw the pictures, and called the on call vet. Got full swimming approval! He just had to run to the vets and pickup another muzzle so we can swap them out when she gets one wet. 

Hubs said after about 20 minutes of pool time (a lot of it happily splashing away on the highest step) that she came in and conked out in her kennel immediately. 

So win for us, at least I know what to do now when she gets the worst of her zoomies!


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## Springbrz (Aug 13, 2013)

After I read through this thread last night I thought of swimming. It is great exercise for 4 legged and 2 legged alike. So happy you found a safe outlet for all that puppy energy and the weather is right for it. 
Adorable pup btw!


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## techinstructor (Nov 15, 2014)

Wow. How lucky for you that you have a pool. That's great exercise for her and it will help immensely. I wondered if you could use a large ball with her in the yard, like a soccer ball or schoolyard kickball. You could kick it or roll it around and she could chase it. Of course I don't know how fragile her muzzle is, and it would be hard to keep her from trying to bite it. This is a difficult dilemma because about everything I can think of for mental stimulation involves giving treat for rewards. Good luck. It will be a hard 6 weeks but I know you'll have fun when it's over. Cute puppy!


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## LRP (May 8, 2019)

Jchrest said:


> We’ve made some progress on the zoomies. She LOVES swimming! Hubs kept his hand on her belly for assistance, but eventually she wanted nothing to do with his hand, and took off on her own. He did this on his own while me and my older daughter were down and out with a stomach bug yesterday. So of course I panicked like an idiot when I saw the pictures, and called the on call vet. Got full swimming approval! He just had to run to the vets and pickup another muzzle so we can swap them out when she gets one wet.
> 
> Hubs said after about 20 minutes of pool time (a lot of it happily splashing away on the highest step) that she came in and conked out in her kennel immediately.
> 
> So win for us, at least I know what to do now when she gets the worst of her zoomies!


GREAT JOB! I have been watching your thread to see how she has been doing and I am so happy you have a happy swimmer. Good luck with further progress!


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## Dunkirk (May 7, 2015)

techinstructor said:


> Wow. How lucky for you that you have a pool. That's great exercise for her and it will help immensely. I wondered if you could use a large ball with her in the yard, like a soccer ball or schoolyard kickball. You could kick it or roll it around and she could chase it. Of course I don't know how fragile her muzzle is, and it would be hard to keep her from trying to bite it. This is a difficult dilemma because about everything I can think of for mental stimulation involves giving treat for rewards. Good luck. It will be a hard 6 weeks but I know you'll have fun when it's over. Cute puppy!



This reminded me of ball herding.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

The ball herding looks awesome, I’ll have to try that out for my Husky too, he would love it! 

Hubs was kind enough to take down the dog walk and teeter, and resized all the jumps for her height, as replaced the wire in the tunnel so it’s open on both ends. He’s going to TRY 10 minutes of agility introduction, and 10 minutes of swim time tonight while I’m recouping. I say try, because he’s never run the course with Crios, just watched me running him through everything. So it should be fun to see how much I have to train him AND the puppy ?


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

She loves the ball herding, so thank you so much for that tip! Hubs did horrible on the agility course, so I told him to stop messing with my dogs. Lmao. They are mine when they are being well behaved and listening, and his when they are being derps. He just doesn’t have a training bone in his body, and just wants to love on them, he would fail so hard if he raised one on his own, but he has a huge heart for them, so we make a great balanced team. But if he keeps taking her to the agility section of our back yard, she’s going to be ruined from agility forever. He praised her nonstop, and at one point, she was chewing on one of the jumps, and he was oblivious! Lol

I tried scent work, but the big dogs went crazy, and the Husky jumped the baby gate and came barreling in to get to the bottles. I used sardines because someone here suggested it for Lyka when I first got her, and it worked wonderfully. But now the Husky thinks it’s his time to work when he smells them. Any suggestions on anything less smelly that Seiran would be able to smell, and maybe not entice the big dogs at the same time?

And let me just say, thank good we crate her in our room upstairs at night. The bestfriend didn’t latch one of the baby gates all the way on his way to work (he leaves at 3am), and the big dogs and the other pup were all in our living room this morning. His pup chewed a corner off my leather ottoman, and I know it was his, because he was still doing it when I walked downstairs. Clean panties had the crotch chewed out of every pair, and I’m thinking the pup too, because neither of mine have been panty chewers, but I can see the Husky joining in on the fun if the pup was chewing. It was a basket of clean laundry for me to fold this morning, and they knocked it over, and there are clothes strewn in every room of the house (downstairs). Broken glass from some decor we have on shelves, poop, you name it, it was done. Sigh. No one was hurt on the glass shards thankfully. 

And Seiran got an upgrade on her muzzle. She went from a medium to and intermediate size, and it’s black, and blend in with her coloring so well it’s almost unnoticeable. 

When we got her, so was 16 pounds. When she was first brought to the vet for her jaw, she was 19 pounds. At her second weekly checkup, while tube feeding per vet instructions (amount of dilution, ml’s per feeding, and number of feeds per day) she has dropped down to 14lbs. She is now up to 27lbs, and has grown so much! 

And last but not least in my long winded post (I’m a very wordy person if you couldn’t tell), I’m a horrible person on the inside. I think Seiran is the most adorable puppy ever, and I think her brother looks like a drowned rat. I know, I know, I’m biased, but still, if I think he’s not a cute pup, and I think Seiran is gorgeous, maybe she looks like a drowned rat and I just look at her with rose colored glasses. Seiran is in the first pic and second pic, her brother in the third and fourth. I realize the pups are almost impossible to see, but again, I still think Seiran is the cutest ?


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Well color me stupid. The friend didn’t leave the gate unlatched, Lyka has learned how to work the latch. When she was younger, she knew how to open regular doors with regular round knobs, but with her health going downhill, it didn’t even cross my mind that she would even have the energy to do it, but I caught her red pawed. We built our own baby gates, because we wanted something that wasn’t available on the market, and the latches are standard gate latches for fences. Sneaky sneaky girl!


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## Heartandsoul (Jan 5, 2012)

I'm really sorry for laughing at all the very bad antics but since it doesn't sound like anyone was hurt, Couldn't help it. I just read the portion of your Dh's adventures with the agility course to my Dh as it sounds soooo much like us. We both got a chuckle out of that one. Dh will give the hand signal for down while saying sit etc. I learned to ignor how Dh does what he does as my guy loves him and has figured it out and it's just a lot of fun watching both interact.

The updates are great to read and I'm sure you take precautions to previously unrealized dangers as they arise. And good for Lyka for still having the brain power and motivation to work out new puzzling problems at her age even if it is a pain in the neck.


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Heartandsoul said:


> I'm really sorry for laughing at all the very bad antics but since it doesn't sound like anyone was hurt, Couldn't help it. I just read the portion of your Dh's adventures with the agility course to my Dh as it sounds soooo much like us. We both got a chuckle out of that one. Dh will give the hand signal for down while saying sit etc. I learned to ignor how Dh does what he does as my guy loves him and has figured it out and it's just a lot of fun watching both interact.
> 
> The updates are great to read and I'm sure you take precautions to previously unrealized dangers as they arise. And good for Lyka for still having the brain power and motivation to work out new puzzling problems at her age even if it is a pain in the neck.


Oh, I laugh at DH allllll the time when he’s flubbering the commands. He still insist to this day that down is the perfect command for getting them off anything they have their paws on. I use “off” if they are on anything they shouldn’t be on, and “down” for laying down. So imagine the dogs surprise when he keeps saying down, and they lay down and he wants them to just get their front paws off the couches Then he doesn’t give them the release command, and tries to play with them, so the dogs are like “wtf is wrong with this dude, we are supposed to be laying down.” He makes me laugh often with the dogs. 

And I’m sure one day, I look back on the trashed living room, and the need for new panties for my kids, and a new ottoman for me, but for now, I’m stomping my feet like a baby having to clean it all up.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Jchrest our husbands are 'brothers from different mothers.'Stay down,sit down,stay here....plus they have destroyed many things while he was supposed to be keeping an eye on them:headbang:


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## Clare (Feb 6, 2005)

I look at the pup's pictures - there is something about seiran's eyes that just melt you


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Thanks for the compliments, and for sharing your DH/dog training sagas, it’s nice to know I’m not alone! lol 

Lyka has seemed like her old self today. Opening the gate multiple times, climbing the stairs to my room, play fighting with Crios, so I decided to let her have some front yard time on a lead while I was out front planting some new flowers. It makes me sad and happy at the same time. She’s getting FAT too, no matter how much we cut her diet. We’ve got a vet visit for her tomorrow, so hopefully the vet can give us some pointers on what else we can do. Probably switch to a diet kibble I would assume, but need to make sure it doesn’t affect her health negatively. Here’s a pic of my heart, Lyka. Sorry, it’s a crappy camera phone pic, like all the others, so the quality sucks!


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

You are so lucky to have a inground pool!!!! That’s really good exercise! Best idea! Your pup will really get tired out. Just make sure not swallowing to much pool water and have some fresh water available. They have those scamp ramps to help dogs get in and out pools. So much fun for everyone!
https://www.amazon.com/Skamper-Ramp-Super-Large-Size/dp/B00BUFWC3M


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

The deep end of the pool has steps, and a ledge all the way around. The rest of the pool is what they call a walk in pool, it gradually gets deeper the further you walk in (basically a ramp the entire width of the pool). We don’t let Seiran in without an adult in the pool because she is so small, but our Husky takes a swim multiple times a day on his own, and has never had a problem realizing one end has steps and a ledge, and the other side will be an easier way to get out because he doesn’t have to find stairs and doesn’t have to jump to get up them. Trust me, I know how lucky I am to have an in ground pool! In AZ with normal summer temps reaching 115, it’s not only perfect for the dogs to exercise and cool off, but keeps my kids busy all summer too! Lol. 

Crios and Seiran went swimming with hubs last night together, and it was perfect. Crios was happy to be swimming and catching and fetching balls, so he couldn’t care less that Seiran was in the pool, so I think we’ve lucked into the reintroduction answer. It will be much easier than trying to walk them together in this weather! Even the evenings stay above 100, so it would be 3-4 months before we would be able to do that. The muzzle prevents her from being able to fully pant, so we don’t want to overheat her. 

He did this after I was in bed for the night, without telling me. When he told me this morning, he said he knew I would have said no, and he wanted his dogs to have fun together. Even though Crios was initially “my dog,” when we bought our house, Crios became “his dog.” I’m much more bonded with Lyka than Crios, and he’s more bonded with Crios over Lyka. Not to say we don’t love all our dogs, it’s more of a form of favoritism towards each. I have Lyka, Seiran, and Crios, and he has Crios, Seiran, and Lyka. Until it comes to training and poo clean up, then he disappears like we don’t have any dogs ??‍♀?


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

*Losing my mind -UPDATE help!*

Seiran had her second to (hopefully) last appt for her jaw. The vet said she is healing amazingly well, and to go ahead and start giving her small soft treats with training, and any soft toys she can drag around but not small enough to fit in her mouth. 

We are dropping her off this coming Friday for final X-rays and evaluations, and as long as those look good (vet gave us about 85% chance) that we will be picking up a muzzle free pup!

I’m excited and terrified at the same time. A puppy being muzzled for 6 weeks and then given back free reign of her mouth, I can hardly imagine the amount of crap she’s going to get into! Lol.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

Walk in pool nice! Such good news! Glad she is healing. It’s hard to not think of your story when someone mentions a doggy door! Fun times ahead brace yourself lol!


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

*Seiran UPDATE*

Dropped her off at 8 this morning, vet just called and said I can come in a 3 to pick her up. Said everything went well, they are just keeping her for observation since she had to be anesthetized for the X-rays. Didn’t say whether the muzzle will be coming off or what the result of the X-rays are, but I’m looking forward to picking her up and hitting the road at 3!


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Full bill of health! No more muzzle. They said I can start easing her into kibble, which is awesome, because the smell of blending up all her meals had turned me away from all forms of beef for the moment, because the canned food we mixed with her dry kibble, added water, and blended, smelled so much like roast beef but in a super bad way. Maybe I’ll be able to eat pot roast and stews and steaks soon! Lol

She looks so unsure of herself now. I think she had gotten used to the muzzle being an extension of her, she’s probably feeling naked without it! Grabbing bags and kids now and hitting the road. Vacation here we come!


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

Had to add a picture of her adorableness! She does have a patch on her muzzle that is hairless, but should grow back in soon! We will have to wait to start our vacation tomorrow though, so is very sore and whimpering quite a bit, and I don’t want to be so far from the vets if this gets worse.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

So happy to hear she is muzzle free. I hope the discomfort is short lived. Enjoy your vacation.


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## Heartandsoul (Jan 5, 2012)

What a beautiful full face! Thanks for adding the pic!


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

After her initial down time from the vet, she stopped whining and whimpering, and started the worst case of zoomies I’ve ever seen ?. 

She then figured out she had full control of her mouth, so I’ll be picking up a ton of toys on my way out. She is in full blown shark mode, and bit my chin so hard you can still see the teeth marks this morning, and when I talk or smile, it starts to bleed again.

I’m so glad we are going to a place that’s fenced off, but still has 10 acres inside the fenced area, and just my sisters R.V. inside. She’s going to need lots of training and lots of space to run and get her zoomies out. It will be a great place to work on her recall! Right now she stays in our front yard perimeter with no issues, but a long distance recall hasn’t been trained yet. I’m excited.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

So glad she is feeling better. Sounds like kids and pup all will be exhausted at the same time!!! Have fun!


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## Jchrest (Jun 5, 2019)

*Bonding time!!!!*

Drove my girls to San Diego for breakfast and beach time, but it’s been an amazing vacation so far! Lyka is back in love with Seiran now that she doesn’t have any muzzle or cones, no open feeding tube, etc. Crios is still an ahole with her, so I’m crating and rotating while we are here. And yes, I make sure Lyka and Seiran are watched like hawks when together! But they are so adorable together I had to share before I drive back out and lose signal again.


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