# W German show lines



## snakeman (Dec 24, 2009)

Hi, I was wondering what the concensus was on W German show line dogs competeing in Sch?
I'm interested in getting involved in the sport, and many people have suggested that I look for a dog from working lines instead. 
The shepherds I've had in the past have always been of the black/red "showline" variety, and I would prefer to stay with that type of dog. The pups I'm considering come from generations of SchIII & II dogs and bitches, so I'm wondering why they wouldn't be suitable for the sport?
I'm new and would be very interested in what you folks have to say on the matter.
Thanks!


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

I say find a breeder with the dogs you like, that do Schutzhund, and they'll do what you want/need! 

For all of us, it's all about finding 'the' breeder who's breeding for the type of dog you want. If you want a red/black W German showline dog to work with, than go for those breeders with top Schutzund dogs....


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Along the same thought of MaggieRoseLee, any line you decide on, the breeder working their own dogs in the sport/getting titles says sooo much. 
If you purchase from a breeder whose dogs/bitches have titles but they do not participate in the sport, then the chances are good that they've just purchased the dog already titled. 
I'd much rather go with the breeder that is active in the sport.
Maybe go out to clubs and watch dogs work, if you see something you like check out the breeder of the dog.


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## snakeman (Dec 24, 2009)

MaggieRoseLee said:


> If you want a red/black W German showline dog to work with, than go for those breeders with top Schutzund dogs....


 
Thank you both for the feedback.
Do any reputable breeders of red/black Sch dogs come to mind?


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

There is one that is local to me, www.24kgsd.com Alta-Tollhaus. If you go to the site and click on the long dangerous tails tab, there should be some video and pics of the progeny. Beautiful black & reds. Also there is a link on the site to the working dog club, where there are videos loaded.
I have seen some of the pups working in SchH and they do have what it takes. Working on titles still, as they are all young.


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## Anja1Blue (Feb 27, 2008)

My late GSD Blue was a LH showline - I started him in SchH when he was 6 years old, and he did very well. His tracking, and especially his OB were excellent, and while he didn't have quite the intensity in the bitework that many of the working line dogs have, he did everything asked of him and then some. I don't recommend waiting this long to begin LOL, but we didn't adopt him until he was 3-1/2, and it took me a while to "discover" the sport. I agree with the suggestion that you look carefully at the breeder - Blue's breeder was the late Susan Barwig, who was one of the pioneers in introducing SchH to the USA back in the 70's. While she bred show and working lines, her show dogs could also work, a reflection of her background (she had competed at the International level) and primary interest. Good luck to you!

_____________________________________________
Susan

Anja SchH3 GSD
Conor GSD
Blue BH WH T1 - waiting at the Bridge


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

i have a West German show dog (blk&red).
he's from a long line of Schutzhund trained dogs.
my dog is our pet/companion.

there's a lot of titles in his linage. i think you
can do well in Schutzhund with a show dog.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

You have to just be realistic. Yes these dogs are titled but having the title does not mean the dog was trained correctly or really has top drives and work ethic for the sport. If you want a showline, you should get a showline and do SchH, but you will have to be more picky than just looking at the titles on the pedigrees if you want the dog to work well. Talk to the person who actually put the titles on the dog, watch the sire/dam train and work, talk to good trainers/TDs and get their opinion. 

It also depends on your goals. If you intend to be competitive in the sport, looking at good working lines will stack the deck in your favor. If you want to do SchH more recreationally, a good show line should suffice.


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## srfd44-2 (May 20, 2004)

I purchased my Blk/Red Showline shepherd from Heidi Theis of Theishof Shepherds. She does Schutzhund with her males and her females and is in the process of titling a female now. Talk to her and explain what you are looking for and she will work with you to help you get the dog that you want. Good luck !


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## W.Oliver (Aug 26, 2007)

snakeman said:


> .....wondering what the concensus was on W German show line dogs competeing in Sch?


I think folks here have provided very accurate advice and insight....but for me the key is your word, "competeing" in SchH.

I train a Black & Red WGSL in SchH & SDA....I never expect to "compete" with her, but that isn't important to me in our relationship. we simply want to be on the field working. Titles accomplished are a measure of progress. Our bond is something I am very proud of, and the training facilitates that.

At the same time, I have come to enjoy the training so much, I would like to take it to the next level. I am still not sure I want to "compete", but I would like to take what I have learned and push further....to do that, I feel I need a second dog, and it will be a working line.

For me, this works-out just fine, as I have wanted two GSDs for the past 14 years, and eventually, I will get a Wildhaus working line pup.

So, if by "compete" in SchH you mean train and enjoy, then everything said on this thread is spot-on, however, if by "compete" you mean high scores competitive regionally or even nationally, then you may want to look more at working line dogs.

Goodluck, God bless with whatever you decide....as long as it is a GSD, then it is not just a dog.

Wayne


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## snakeman (Dec 24, 2009)

Thanks for all the great advice and recommendations too. 
Anja, I'm familiar with the late Susan Barwig. I bought her Schutzhund book many years ago and still thumb through it from time to time.
Perhaps "participating" could've been used rather than "competeing", though SchH is a sport and one does compete in sports.
I'm looking to enjoy the sport and bond with a dog who would enjoy it as much as I will. I'm not looking to go to the nationals, just something for the dog and I to enjoy together.
It's nice to hear from folks who are training WGSL's, thanks again to all for the input!


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

Having had both lines, if I had schutzhund as a goal and wanted to be competitive in it... I would try to increase my chances at such success and get a working line dog.

If you would like to show your dog in German type shows and do well at, then a show line dog is would probably be the ticket.

The designation of the lines as "show" and "working" are not misnomers.


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## snakeman (Dec 24, 2009)

Samba said:


> The designation of the lines as "show" and "working" are not misnomers.


I realize that, and thank you for the advice.
First and foremost, the dog will be a family companion, though I would also like to get involved in SchH. It is not my intention to compete at a national level, just enjoy the sport with the type of GSD that I prefer.
This may come across as somewhat vain, but it's the looks of the WSGL's that I've always preferred. If I was a K-9 officer or using the dog in some other professional capacity, perhaps I'd look toward the working lines.
As long as I could get a WSGL dog with the drive to enjoy the sport, I think we'd both be happy.
Thanks again.


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

I am the same. It is a hobby and not a Nationals events competitor here!. I have had both lines and seen both on many fields. When pursuing it as a hobby, after several years of owning and observation, I would still make the recommendation. My working line dogs are great great family dogs. They are as perfect kid and house dogs as the show dogs we had. 

It is possible to find a showline that is a dog of the capability where the work is rewarding to dog and handler,but it is a harder go.

Here is an article describing the situation we all find ourselves in the breed with the giant split..

German Shepherd Dogs


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## snakeman (Dec 24, 2009)

Great article, thank you for posting that.
You may have to do your homework to find the right red/black WSGL dog that can do the work, but it is possible as some of the previous posters in this thread have cited.


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## JustDSM (Aug 22, 2009)

Samba said:


> I am the same. It is a hobby and not a Nationals events competitor here!. I have had both lines and seen both on many fields. When pursuing it as a hobby, after several years of owning and observation, I would still make the recommendation. My working line dogs are great great family dogs. They are as perfect kid and house dogs as the show dogs we had.
> 
> It is possible to find a showline that is a dog of the capability where the work is rewarding to dog and handler,but it is a harder go.
> 
> ...


I found that interesting! Thanks for posting that up. It's bookmarked..


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## Samba (Apr 23, 2001)

Yes, you should definitely get the dog that you want! That is the most important part, because they will mostly be your pet throughout their life.


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