# Questions about arthritis



## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

So, I wrote this in the health portion with the Tylan, but I guess seniors would be more appropriate.
My 8 1/2 y/o GSD was crying and ducking his head when I brush his neck. I was wondering if it could be a side effect of the Tylan. Turns out, it's arthritis. His left hip was tender to the touch also at his check up this weekend, as were both elbows. He is currently on an oral glucosamine suppliment and the vet and I were discussing possibly doing an injection if he gets worse. We also discussed possibly a chiropractor (though he did smile at the suggestion). What would you guys recommend? He does not take any pain medications, because it only really seems tender to palpation, but not petting or playing.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

I assume you're talking about Adequan injections? People on this board have had great results from those. 

This was Chama's regime, adjusted with lots of trial and error. Chama had severe arthritis in her knees (and torn ligaments) and front shoulder. 

Double dose of Springtime Inc's Longevity
Loading dose of Cetyl M Joint Support
2000mg/day Ester C
In acute situations I also used Arnicalm Arthritis, a homeopathic remedy from Boiron
At night I used Get up and Go from Only Natural Pet
Sometimes I also used a product called Tasha's Herbspirin 

I also gave her senior vitamins from VetriScience


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## Alto (Nov 18, 2008)

I'd start with injections (they should give faster relief) & look at joint support products (in addition to just the glucosamine) - keep a journal so that you can relate his behavior & activity levels to the various things you try.
Is there chiro or accupunture (not for every dog) available?

If he's a few pounds overweight, try to get him leaner with low impact exercise (swimming, frequent short walks).

Have you & your vet discussed Xrays to assess the severity of his condition?


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I read about the Springtime Inc's Longevity and was planning on ordering that this week. I am not sure what the name of the injections are. The vet just mentioned that we could try that next. He was off of his glucosamine for awhile while we were trying to get his GI issues in check, so we were taking the wait and see approach over the next few weeks because he just restarted them last week. I will definately look at the others you posted and see about trying those. I just have to add one at a time to make sure I don't upset his belly.


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## Alto (Nov 18, 2008)

It seems that more horse people (than dog folk) are using this company's products but I'd definitely give them a go - especially if he's having GI issues with the straight glucosamine, 
Silver Lining Herbs


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

I used the Arnicalm Arthritis, the Get Up and Go and the Tasha's Herbsperin when Chama was having major digestive issues.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

The glucosamine isn't giving him the upset. He has a pretty good case of SIBO that he's had for a few years. But, his belly is very sensitive and I am only going to risk one addition per week, lol. I think I have a harder time handling the "symptoms" than he does. Thanks for the advice. I am looking into them.


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## GSD10 (May 20, 2007)

Wonder if the injections are cartophen?!?! I get those for Mas and it really seems to help his arthritiis. I have also found that using a magnetic bed and accupuncture have really helped Mas cope with arthritis. 

Hope your boy feels better soon


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I am looking into accupuncture. Can you tell me about the magnetic bed?


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## GSD10 (May 20, 2007)

Here is a link to a company that sells magnetic beds: http://www.magnetictherapymagnets.com/magneticpetpad.html

My vet has a hand held magnetic device that he lent me and it made significant changes in Mas's posture and his back end so I decided to go with the bed. You can probably find a mag bed on ebay or maybe even in your local community's sell and trade site.

My vet things that Mas's is reponding to a combination of treatments such as the cartrophen, accupunture, elecrode magnetic therapy, mag bed and massage therapy. I tend to agree.

Check the sticky thread in this section "Tips for Seniors" it has a lot of great contributions from other members here who have had success with various products and treatments.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

GSD10, thank you so much! I was actually contemplating getting him a new bed, so this is perfect timing. He has taken to liking my bed too much, lol. I like that they have magnetic collars also. I think I will order both.
He actually has alot more energy since we changed his diet and started him on Tylan (he has SIBO). His next check up is mid August and if his pain isn't any better, then we are going to start the injections. I will find out what kind and post it.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

GSD10, thanks for the link. Zappa's new bed and magnetic collar will be here this week.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

Ruth and Alto,
I just finished talking to the vet (yes, he works Sundays which is awesome!) and he is ordering the Adequan injections for Zappa. We will be starting of 2 X a week for 4 weeks, then 1 X a week for 4 weeks. After that, we will see how he is doing and go from there. Plus, his new magnetic bed will be here Tuesday or Wednesday as well as a new magnetic collar for his arthritis in his neck. We will be doing x-rays on him, but it is going to wait until he gains a few more pounds. For his comfort, he will need to be sedated and I am going to have the vet do that when he goes in for his dental so he only gets sedated/anesthesia once.
If any other members have experience with the adequan, please let me know the regimen and how it all worked!


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

I hope all of his new stuff works well! I know of at least 6 seniors on this board who have had amazing results with the Adequan injections. 

And how lucky you are that your vet works on Sunday!


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

Here's LJ's post on adequan. She's one of the few that experience blow out diarrhea. We got through it. Adequan is great stuff. The vet just upped LJ's dose a bit - she had been on the low end of dosing.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I am amazingly lucky about Sundays. The vet is starting him on 0.75 mL, 75mg per dose 2 X a week for 4 weeks. Joanne, were you trying to put an old post thread on here? As far as the blow out diarrhea, I hope not. We have finally managed to get normal stools with the food switch and Tylan lol.


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: LJsMomHere's LJ's post on adequan. She's one of the few that experience blow out diarrhea. We got through it. Adequan is great stuff. The vet just upped LJ's dose a bit - she had been on the low end of dosing.


Once again, senility strikes









http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1042573&page=1#Post1042573


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=758048&page=3#Post758048

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=697677&page=3#Post697677

Joanne









http://www.caberfeidh.com/Adequan.htm
Check out the other articles she too. http://www.caberfeidh.com/HHC.htm


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

Thank you guys so much! I don't know what I would do without the help you all have given me over the past 2 weeks!


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## geokon_2000 (Jan 25, 2005)

Those links helped me too. Once I bounce back from the $240 vet bill, I'm gonna look into the injections. I hate using Nsaids on my old man.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

http://www.1800petmeds.com/product.jsp?id=prod10721&sku=10721

Best price I have found so far. It is $35 per injection at my vet and $99 for what will be 13 injections to do myself. The vet is doing a script for me lol


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

Pssst...
http://www.entirelypets.com/adequank9.html
I am not sure how the shipping costs would add up though.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

It turns out cheaper at the first. There is a $5 discount as well as free shipping, so the total is $94. Thanks Jean. I will be digging through that site, though.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

Max just had adequan injections into a couple of acupuncture points for his neck problem. Seems to have really loosened the area up. 

He did throw up once after that (also Mr. Sensitive), but has been fine since.


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

That's interesting Lisa. I assumed that adequan was only injected into the rump area. I will have to ask my vet if this would be good for LJ - when her neck is good - so is her rear.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

How long did your dogs have to stay on it for? I will be doing the rump injections because the vet will be teaching me the placement at our next appointment. I so hope this helps him. We have the food issues and SIBO under control now and he has WAY more energy, its just the limping from his hips and the neck pain now.


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

After the loading phase, LJ has been getting her IM injection every 3 weeks.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I don't know exactly what the vet wants to do after the first 2 months. Do dogs normally have to stay on it permanently?


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## GSD10 (May 20, 2007)

Oh you will have to update us when the mag bed and collar arrive and your boy does the comsumer test with them







I only learned about the collars when I looked up that link for you. I am have to get some for my guys.

*Question*: is adequan the American vesion of cartophen?? I think I have seen that here some where, just can't remember if it is the same product. 

If it is then after the 2 months of start up Mas went to every 2 months and now as needed...which I need to get him in for next weekend


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I will definately update as we begin the treatments. I'm hoping the mag collar helps becouse he does have pain right where his collar lies. 
It sounds like the cartophen is similar to the adequan. I just looked it up and read about is. However, the active ingredients are different.
I will post more as we add things to his treatment regime.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

I hope that all of this stuff gives him some relief! 

Just a note about the collar: Chama wore a harness only for the last 2 years of her life. That worked out much better for her. I got her this really lightweight one. It is padded and it also worked to help me assist her getting up and down. 

http://www.pawlickers.com/products/gear/harnesses/comfortflex-sport

Other people use this one for their senior dogs:

http://www.pawlickers.com/products/gear/harnesses/web-master-harness


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

Thanks Ruth! I normally don't use a harness on him except when we go camping. I use a long tye-out when we are sitting around the campsite eating or whatever and have only used a harness for that. He can still get up well and walk around on his own right now, but there is a difference when we are outside. He has started limping with his left hip. I guess I am trying to start all the preventative stuff prior to him having more mobility issues because he is definately teder when his hip and neck are palpated or brushed. I am going to add a pic of him sitting so you can see the difference in how his hips sit.




















Yes, he was shaved. He has grown his fur about halfway back now and no I am not shaving him again. But the second pic really shows how different his hips sit. I will get new pics soon so I can update how he is looking (he has started to gain back some weight).


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Ah--looks painful.









The harness seems to be much more comfortable and also gives them a sense of security. Chama would wait for me to get the handle to help her up and down stairs. I also used it to get her up from a lying down position. She started wearing well before she needed an assist so she got quite used to it. 

I don't think it's healthy for a dog with neck/back issues to have something pulling on their neck though so I would really encourage you to switch over to the harness.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I will order it now. I like the first one you recommended, especially for Texas because it is so hot here. What is the difference on the matching collar, do you know?


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: jaggirl47I will order it now. I like the first one you recommended, especially for Texas because it is so hot here. What is the difference on the matching collar, do you know?


It was very cool and also dried off very quickly. It's also super easy to get on and off but for the last 6 months of her life she wore it 24/7. Plus it's reflective! And it looks like there are now lots of color choices.









I didn't get the collar, just the harness.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I went with the mariner blue. I think my boy looks good in blue and he likes to look handsome, lol


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

Seeing those pictures makes me think chiropractor.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I have discussed the chiropractor idea with my vet and I may try that. However, he doesn't have the constant movement or energy that alot of people on here described that he would need to keep the alignment in place. So, would it do him good or could it cause him pain?


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

LJ isn't active and she does well with chiropractic. She's more active since starting the chiro.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

Hmmmm, might be good then. He had alot more energy before he started losing weight and having more issues with SIBO. Now that I have his diet issues worked out and he is actually able to absorb the nutrients, his activity level has started creeping back up. Maybe that would help him be able to almost be back to his normal self....
I will keep you all informed. Thankyou.
Just a question also, he had xrays at 1 1/2 years but the displaysia was pretty noticable so it was never sent to OFA (he was neutered anyways so it didn't really matter). How bad does it look to you just by the picture, no xrays?


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## GSD10 (May 20, 2007)

Oh I should have added that Mas has a harness as well that I use to give him just a little extra support. I think the mag collar will be a great addition to the harness as it should provide some comfort for the arthrisit in his neck. Besides...you need somethig to hand his tags off of









Lisa will likely be able to answer the question about chiro. I am gong to get a referal from my vet today to get Mas in for chiro.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

****
Question: is adequan the American vesion of cartophen?? I think I have seen that here some where, just can't remember if it is the same product. 
****

As mentioned above, similar, supposed to do the same thing. Funny, when I had a consult with Indy at UCD, the orthopedist was from Canada (cartophen is only available in Canada, Australia, and I think the UK, at least back then), and he raved about cartophen saying he would use it right away on Indy. However, if she didn't get better down the road, he would use Adequan on her. For some reason, he considered the cartrophen superior.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

Zappa will be getting new xrays on Sept 6 (he is getting a dental and a tooth pulled then) and I will post them after.


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