# Please Help - Puppy Urinating For Attention?



## JonFromNJ (Apr 1, 2014)

I have a 5 month old GSD who recently starting urinating for what seems like attention or to show displeasure. I'm looking for help on what I can do different to stop this behavior. I have already ruled out a UTI or other medical problem with my vet. I got the puppy at 12 weeks old from a breeder and began crate training. Crate training went well and within a few weeks my boy was holding it overnight and having maybe 1 accident a week in the house, totally expected for a puppy that age. Since hitting the 4 month mark, he yearns for attention all day long. I work from home and make sure I'm giving him attention in the morning, go for our morning walk, and throughout my day. When I can't give him the attention, he begins doing things he knows he's not supposed to do - like putting his paws up on the counter, jumping on the couch - and he stares at me while he does it. I get up, get him off, go back to work, and he does it right again. To show my displeasure, I will usually just quietly get up and leave the room. Then BAM - he urinates, and then lays down in it. There are times when I've walked him literally 15 minutes before, but he will still squeeze out whatever he can and lay in it. He's now peeing in the crate as well - every time he's in there, regardless of how long. Today I walked him, needed to put him in the crate for 15 mins to shower, and by the time I got out, he already urinated. The fact that I've ruled out medical conditions and ensure he was walked immediately before going in the crate leads me to believe he is urinating to convey a feeling - whether it's displeasure, wanting for attention, or something different. I've tried showing my displeasure when he does this, tried ignoring it and only rewarding positive behavior, but nothing has worked. Any help would be appreciated. This is taking a heavy toll on my marriage and pretty soon I may be forced to find a new home for him. My wife is tired of the urine in the house and I can't bathe the dog 5-6 times a day anymore. I have small children and the bacteria from the urine is also a concern. I obviously clean it up, but it gets tracked everyone on paws and feet.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Get a second vet opinion. Have another urine sample taken. I've never heard of behavior like that. It sounds like a medical issue to me.


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

Puppies / Dogs don't urinate to convey displeasure or spite or for attention. They just aren't wired that way. As humans, WE'D do it....but not dogs. 

If you are 100% sure that it's not a medical condition (and I'm not sure it isn't, they don't squeeze out a little bit for spite) then I'd have to take a deep look into what it is YOU are doing to set the pup up to succeed. If there is a lot of emotions running around your home, that could cause adverse conditioning on your pup too. 

The idea is to figure out what the trigger is and to disregard any thoughts you might have that the pup is doing it on purpose for attention.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

you can not cater to a dog 24 hours a day.

when you are home trying to work the dog doesn't know what to do with itself , so goes about investigating the counters , looking back expecting or at least checking out what your reaction will be . 

the urination may be involuntary , a response which is submissive .

the household atmosphere can't be good . The dog is picking up on this . The dog will also be sensitive to you not being happy with the pissing and bathing 5 or 6 times a day . 

a healthy relationship includes structured togetherness AND the ability to be comfortable with time and distance away . Can you provide the dog with a safe outdoor enclosure --- 12 X 12 
Dog Kennels for Sale, Kennel Cages, Canine Kennels, AKC Kennels, Dog Runs | K9 Kennel Home . Costco has welded wire kennels which are easy to assemble AKC Welded Wire Box Kennel

that way you can crate your pup overnight . bring him out on a good note, take him for his walk , take care of his needs . You pop him into the outdoor kennel . When you are able to dedicate time and attention bring him into the house so that he is socialized to appropriate behaviour indoors , and when you need to go back to work - out he goes.

dog may be feeling the tension and displeasure and submissive urinating


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## TigervTeMar (Jan 4, 2014)

not sure if the urinating is for attention but if he does anything bad to get your attention you should put him in his crate for a short period of time. hopefully he'll learn with repetition that he can behave around you properly even if you aren't loving him all the time, or he can misbehave and not be around you.

if you have limited time try exercising him a bit more, he might be more inclined to hang out with you quietly instead of looking for naughty ways to behave.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

Another vet opinion please. And what Carmen says.


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## JonFromNJ (Apr 1, 2014)

Thanks for all the replies so far. I've had 2 vet opinions (albeit at the same center - which is one of the best in NJ, the Belle Mead Animal Hospital). And I know dogs are not "wired" to convey emotions like that, I just can't figure out the reason / trigger. Yes, there's definitely a lot of emotions that run through the house. I have 5 young children and both my wife and I work during the day, through we both work from the house, and we're both stressed about the urination. I have an acre yard that I cannot use....yet. My neighbor feeds the deer and about 12 deer live in my yard and there are feces and possibly ticks everywhere. I have a company coming in a week to install a fence so I can clean up all the feces and let my GSD have the yard to play in. But I also know GSDs are not loners and the yard may only hold his attention by himself for so long.

Again, there was a statement above "they don't squeeze out a little bit for spite" - then what is it? If I don't leave the room, there's no pee. If I leave, he'll pee, even if he's been walked in the last 15 minutes. So...I stay in the room, he holds it no problem. I leave or put him in the crate for a few mins, he pees. I've ruled out medical. He's squeezing it out to tell me SOMETHING, I just don't know what it is. Someone suggested the crate, but that doesn't work because he now pees in there too. Yesterday, I took him out, about 10 mins later he was yearning for attention. He wouldn't stop jumping on me, so I put him in the crate for a time out...as soon as I put him in, he turned and looked at me, and peed. He was in there less than 10 seconds when he did it. I was sick last week...took him out and laid down. 30 minutes I come back to find him laying in his pee on the kitchen floor (no crate that time). He's already getting more time and attention from me than all my children are combined right now, I do not have more time than I currently do to spend with him. I don't have to be a vet or behavioral specialist to know that he's urinating to convey SOMETHING, I just don't know what it is or how to make it stop.


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## graciesmom (Jun 10, 2006)

GSDs are very sensitive. They pick up on all our "human" emotions, happy, sad, angry, scared, etc. whether we realize it or not. If a medical issue has been ruled out, then I would tend to go with submissive or nervous peeing. This is not "squeezing out a bit for spite". At 5 months, he is still a puppy and I think he's reacting to the emotions in the house. I understand it is very frustrating, but IMHO I think you need to be very careful with this guy, he sounds unsure of himself, hence the submissive pee. Ramp up the positive reinforcements to build up his confidence and remain calm, calm, calm. I know, easier said than done. Sometime you need to take a deep breath, all the way down from your big toe to find the calmness. Maybe keep a log of each time he pees both inside and out. That way you will get an idea of what his threshold is and you can time it to take him out just before the end of his threshold. The more successes he has, the more confident he will be in that he is doing what you want, less nervous for him, less frustrating for you.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I really think this is more psychological and the pup is peeing submissively. Even a raised voice can be enough to trigger insecurity in a pup.

Have you talked to your breeder? Did you get this guy from a known reputable breeder or from a newspaper ad, networked friend of a friend type situation? 

Perhaps the timing is not right for you to have a puppy ..... resentment, anger, frustration can be subtly communicated to a sensitive pup, and this one certainly seems to be getting some triggers from you...

Lee


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

I wouldn't wait till you can fence your property . Put down some drainage , patio slabs, get some straw or wood shavings bedding , a dog igloo , a water bucket and put the dog outside . He needs peace and quiet.
With two people working from the home -- you can not afford to have the quality of your "work" compromised , or upset other family members who will look to the dog as a burden and inconvenience , and get none of the positives that dog ownership can provide.

maybe this is not the time for you to have a dog --- seems like a lot on your plate !


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## JonFromNJ (Apr 1, 2014)

I know he's not "squeezing it out" in spite - he's trying to convey something to me that I'm failing to pick up on. I know it's not his fault, he's doing the best he can to express himself. It unfortunately creates a cycle - I walk him, put in the crate to take a shower. I come down 20 minutes later, he's peed in the crate. Now the time I was going to spend playing and exercising with him is spent bathing and cleaning the crate, then I need to work, and he didn't get the exercise and attention I intended to give him. Other times, I don't have time to bathe him right that second, and he needs to stay in the crate for an additional hour or two until I can bathe him - instead of the 15-20 minutes I originally intended.

Yes, I got him from a reputable breeder - Carlos Rojas of Jagermeister German Shepherds (he's pretty well known in NJ). He will going to Carlos' boarding obedience class in a couple of weeks, I'm hoping that will give me some things to work on with him that will give me both physical and mental stimulation. 

I do take him out often - at least every 2 hours unless he's napping. In the morning, I tend to take him out even more often as he's working off his energy after a nights sleep.

I tend to agree with psychological. This is the 4th dog I've raised, including 2 others were Shepherd / Lab mixes, and this one is by far the neediest and most sensitive (BTW - the other dogs I raised are no longer alive, my last died about 2 years ago). Yes, I have a lot going on, but I'm not ready to give up on the little guy either. I'm not a quitter and that doesn't send the right message to my children. We accepted him as part of our family, we need to be there for him.

I really appreciate all of your comments and feedback. I know there's no silver bullet, I'm willing to try anything to help him and the family. I am going to try my hardest to let the urination roll off my back (not literally of course!) and focus on positive reinforcement for good behavior and taking a deep breath when I start to feel frustrated. I will keep everyone here updated on progress. My wife just took him out for an hour run, and he's definitely pooped now....took some water and went right to sleep.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Wait he is peeing when you leave the room not when you enter it? Experts wouldn't that be separation anxiety not submissive urination?


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## JonFromNJ (Apr 1, 2014)

Yes, when I leave the room, not when I enter. He doesn't ever pee when greeting people or when I or others walk in the room. Sounds like separation anxiety, but I could leave for 10 minutes and he'll pee! It's like he needs me to be in the same room with him ALL the time. If I stayed in the room with him all the time, he won't pee. And he never - NEVER - is left alone for long periods of time during the day, he never has been.

A quick recap of today's schedule:

6:00 AM - Out of the crate. He urinated in the crate, so I had to bathe him, then fed him

7:00 AM - Walk for an hour

8:00 AM - Let him relieve himself, let him play by himself in the house (with me in the room)

9:00 AM - I take him outside to relieve himself, which he does. He goes in the crate so I can shower

9:20 AM - Come back from my shower, he peed in the crate. No time to bathe him, I have work to do. He unfortunately has to stay in the crate, which is what I DIDN'T want. I wanted to take him out to relieve himself again, so I could work in peace for a few hours.

12:00 PM - Out of the crate for a bathe, my wife take him for an hour walk.

2:19 PM - napping on the floor.

I'll let you know how the rest of the day goes.

I'm unfortunately feeling like a hostage in my own house caught in a 20/20 situation. I k now it's not healthy for me to stay with him all the time, but if I don't he pees - and that means a ton of time is spent cleaning the house and him. So to prevent the urination, that part of me wants to stay with him. But I know that's not healthy and I need to separate myself, but then he pees, and the quality of HIS day is deteriorated as he gets less play time and attention, and spends the time bathing instead. I feel like it's a downward spiral


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Dog Separation Anxiety Symptoms, Causes, Medications


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

put a thick towel in the crate and don't bathe him
ignore the pee for a few days and exercise as usual
see if that helps


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## JonFromNJ (Apr 1, 2014)

Thanks again to ALL to who responded. Although obviously the problem hasn't gone away in a few hours, I do feel a lot better. My boy woke up just before 4:00, took him out, played with him until 4:50, then took him out again. He's currently resting on the floor.

I would appreciate any advice for one particular time of the day - eating. My GSD is always looking for the most attention when we try to eat. He will jump on counter, my children's high chairs, stoves, couches, whine at the door as if he has to go out (even if I literally just came back in) - anything to get the attention on him. I started putting him in the crate while we ate (after taking him out before he went in), but he urinates in the crate before the meal is over 20-30 minutes. Then the family and I stopped eating in our kitchen and moved to our dining room. Again, I would take him out before we sat down, and he'll be laying in pee by the time we're done. Mind you the the dining room is clearly visible from the kitchen, and he can still be 4 feet away in the kitchen only separated by a baby gate. So we've resorted to the family eating in the dining room and me eating in the kitchen alone. I know that's not healthy and it's not the right solution, I just don't know what else to do and I can't be bathing the dog every day after dinner. At the same time, I can't let him stay with urine on him, as I mentioned I have small children who play all over the floor of the house and cannot have my GSD running around and laying on floors, contaminating them. So to prevent the urine, prevent the bath, and to allow my family to eat in peace, I am where I am. Does anyone have any ideas on other approaches I could take? As I mentioned in a previous post, he's starting obedience training in a few weeks (specifically the first entry on this page - German Shepherd Breeder in New Jersey. AKC Registered Puppies and trained German Shepherd Dogs for sale.), so I'm hoping as he learns stay, lay down, etc, it will help.


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## my boy diesel (Mar 9, 2013)

a towel to absorb the pee
then u r not obsessing about the pee??


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Gosh, it's a little pee. 

You are going to let a little pee take a toll on your marriage?

In the civil war, urine was used to sterilize and wash things, hands, etc. Urine, in and of itself is not terrible. Of course we do not want it in the house, it smells. But it is not going to give your kids cooties. 

You need to back up. Number 1, you need to not be frustrated with pee. You need to supervise the puppy 100% Or crate the puppy in a small crate when you cannot supervise. If the dog is peeing in response to your displeasure -- if you yell about something and the puppy pees and lays down, that is called submissive urination. You need to adjust your tone of voice and start training the dog with very positive voice and lots of praise, lots of fun. Build a bond with your puppy and drop the irritated, frustrated, angry voices. 

If the puppy is taking a toll on your marriage, contact your breeder and GIVE the dog back to the breeder. Do not expect them to buy the dog back. Give it back to your breeder because that is not the breeder's fault. Marital problems is something she has no control over, and the puppy is not defective, it is simply displaying normal puppy behavior, and perhaps some symptoms of what is going on in the home.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

Have you tried feeding him at the same time you eat dinner? Put him in crate stick his bowl in there with him, then go sit down with your family. I really wouldn't worry about a little puppy pee. My kids grew up with dogs. I caught them more than once sharing lollipops and other goodies with the dog, one lick for them, one for the dog. (shudder). It didn't kill them.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

You are going to do a board and train with this puppy? Is this where you bought the puppy?

Training by someone else in their home may not solve any problems you have in YOUR home....

Lee


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## JonFromNJ (Apr 1, 2014)

Thanks for the additional feedback. I know it seems like it's only pee, but when the dog lays in it - and then is soaked - and then runs and lays on floors and carpet. That kind of thing was fine when I was in college and my early 20's raising dogs, but cannot fly in my home now. So I bathe him. It's hard not to be frustrated...the time I set aside to interact with my puppy is consumed with bathing and cleaning. It'd be a little different if he urinated on the floor and walked away - but he purposefully lays in it. Which is much different from when he has a legitimate accident, which is more like outside - do your business, move on.

The crate isn't working because he urinates in there too now. I've made sure his space in the crate is confined to what he needs but that he also has enough room to stretch out a bit. I'm taking him on long walks, playing fetch, and will be incorporating the obedience lessons in my daily routine to continue to build the bond. I've started to not negatively reprimand him for unwanted behavior; I try to ignore unwanted behavior and praise wanted/good behaviors 

My intention is to NOT give up on him, but if it came to that, I would never expect the breeder to buy him back. That's why I'm here, seeking advise as a first step. I'm willing to change MY behavior to get the desired behavior from my pup. If I need to go as far as getting a certified behavioral therapist to come to my house, to work with my dog in my environment, I will.

I have tried having him eat at the same time; he finishes his meal in about 30 seconds and then starts the attention seeking routine.

Yes, I'm having him trained by the breeder I got him from (Carlos Rojas). Carlos is well known and great as what he does. I've watched work him work with his dogs and others, spoken to past clients, he is truly amazing. I found out my vet even does work with him with her own dogs (I found this out during my first visit). Yes it's board and train, but I will be spending 2 or 3 weekend working directly with Carlos and my pup. With my job, I can literally be called any time 24 hours a day and have to work at that moment. It's difficult to schedule things like obedience class every Wednesday night - I will probably miss half of the classes. But because I work from home, I do have the flexibility to get away during the day multiple times for 15, 20, or 30 minutes, just at what points during the day may vary.


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## nktigger99 (Aug 22, 2006)

I would start back at the basics....go back like your pup is a 8 week old pup.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Change your attitude about your puppy. Your puppy is a baby. He is not defiant. He is not purposefully lying in his pee. It is happening, no doubt, but it isn't so that you can bathe him again or to put his pee stink everywhere. 

It sounds like he is having some problems when it comes to his toilet behavior. He may be feeling nervous the moment he piddles and quickly lies down in submission. Exactly what you do not want him to do. 

So we have to outwit the dog. The way to do this is to forget about the dog doing this on purpose. Because then you approach it angrily. That is unhelpful. If you can keep him on lead, then the puppy starts to piddle, pick him up or get him outside quick. Then crate him to give you time to clean the spot with an enzyme type cleaner, and then back to keeping him on lead.

A rolled newspaper can be very helpful in house-training a puppy. This is how you do this: If you see that your puppy pottied in the house, 
1. put your puppy in its crate in the other room and shut the door;
2. clean up the accident;
3. take the rolled newspaper and smack yourself with it several times in the head repeating, "I will watch my puppy."

The rolled newspaper technique can be used effectively for other things that pottying.


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

selzer said:


> .
> 
> A rolled newspaper can be very helpful in house-training a puppy. This is how you do this: If you see that your puppy pottied in the house,
> 1. put your puppy in its crate in the other room and shut the door;
> ...


haha printing this out and sticking on my fridge. Puppy is potty trained but he is heading into the chewing phase.....


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