# Breeder/Buyer agreement



## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

OK everyone I need some help with the situation I find myself in

When I purchased my puppy this summer from a local breeder
I signed an agreement with this party.This agreement went missing we believe at a recent visit by said breeder. I have knowledge this party has retrieved two siblings from people who purchased them, claiming they were not cared for in the manner covered in the agreement and then resold to new homes.
I am told this agreement states we are also unable to give away, gift or sell our dog. Should this occur, the registration and animal immediately revert back to being owned by the breeder and must be returned immediately at our expense to the breeder for disposal as breeder sees fit. After hearing about this situation myself and my SO are gravely concerned about our dog should we try any of the above. Or for some unseen reason be taken back like the other two without justification.
My question to any breeders on the board, would this be considered a normal clause and if not would you think it to be binding legally. Like does this person have the right to do something like this without doing it legally. Like you come home one day and your dog is gone or you let it out to potty and it disappears. 
I shudder now each time I let him out and can't sleep at night over this.
Little one replaced a heart dog I lost unexpectedly this summer and I don't think I could handle the loss of another one. 
I look forward to any feedback on this situation. 
PS I am up in Canada if that helps any


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I do not know anything about dog laws in Canada.

If you signed an agreement that said dog cannot be chained in the yard. If the breeder sees the dog chained in the yard, then they can sue for breach of contract and get the dog back. 

I really doubt that most breeders would try this, but it is better to be safe than sorry. If you agreed to do certain things, do those things. To take you to court and take your dog, she has to prove that you did not fulfill your part of the deal. And it will cost her money.

Coming onto the property and removing the dog would be considered theft here, and possibly grand theft, depends on the value of the object stolen, the dog in this case.

Here is the thing. A breeder does not want to go through the process of selling you dog all over again. She wants the dogs in good homes and to stay in a good home. She will get a terrible reputation if she is taking dogs she sold back without good cause and reselling them for a profit. 

Breeders care about the puppies they whelp. They raise them for a couple of months and care what happens to them, they may feel responsible for them long after they leave the nest. Some breeders add a clause, right to first refusal. That is, you cannot rehome the dog without first contacting the breeder and giving them an opportunity to buy back the dog. This is done to protect the dog. The breeder may be in a better position to find a suitable home for the dog, and to keep track of the dog.

If I signed a contract, I would abide by the terms in the contract, however unenforceable they seem to me. If I agreed not to rehome, sell, give away a dog, then I would not do it. But I would probably not sign such a contract. 

If you pay x amount for a dog, and the breeder does not co-own the dog, then you should be able to sell the dog.


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## sitstay (Jan 20, 2003)

I am not a breeder, but I do rescue and always place my fosters with a contract. I do set out in the contract the required living conditions for the dog. The new owner(s) read and review and we go over every condition in detail before anyone signs anything.

What did the contract you signed say? As long as you're keeping the dog in compliance with the contract, why worry about the dog being taken from you? If the dog were to be taken from you by the breeder, as long as you are in compliance with the contract, wouldn't you be able to call the police and have the stolen dog returned to you? Without a signed contract to back the breeder up, wouldn't taking the dog be theft?

If you signed a contract where you agreed not to "give away, gift or sell" the dog, then you should abide by the terms of the contract you signed and you shouldn't do any of those things. If the contract that you signed doesn't say that, why worry about not being able to do it?
Sheilah


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## PaddyD (Jul 22, 2010)

Can't the breeder send you another copy of your agreement? Or is the breeder any enemy combatant ?! 

Caveat Emptor


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

> I am told this agreement states we are also unable to give away, gift or sell our dog. Should this occur, the registration and animal immediately revert back to being owned by the breeder and must be returned immediately at our expense to the breeder for disposal as breeder sees fit. After hearing about this situation myself and my SO are gravely concerned about our dog should we try any of the above.


Are you planning on giving your dog away or selling it? If not, then you have nothing to worry about. It's very standard that breeders want the dog to be returned to them if you're unable or unwilling to keep it for any reason, and they find a more suitable home for it.

Do you have factual details about the circumstances where the two previous dogs were taken back by this breeder? If you truly have concerns about this breeder basically stealing your dog, then don't let it outside without supervision.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

The way I'm taking this, you are concerned the breeder may have "stolen" your contract and may try to take your dog from you? For the specific purpose of gaining profit?

Your breeder should have retained a copy of the contract when it was signed by all parties. There should be no reason for them to take your. I would contact the breeder, explain you misplaced your contract and would like a copy of it.

I don't see how a breeder can just come in and take the dog without grounds, proven in court. As Sue stated, if the contract specifically stated the dog could not be kept in a certain circumstance and they found it was then that is grounds. But they would still have to prove it in court.


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## koda00 (Apr 27, 2009)

I signed a contract pretty much like what your saying. I had no problem with it at all. In fact, the contract was a plus for me with our breeder. To me it showed how much they value the life of pups/dogs they breed and care for. If you've done nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about


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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

If the buyer registers the dog in her name through AKC - and then the seller (breeder) takes the dog back, the dog remains registered in the buyers name, correct? The breeder can't request AKC to change the ownership of the dog with out the buyers consent, right?


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Lilie said:


> If the buyer registers the dog in her name through AKC - and then the seller (breeder) takes the dog back, the dog remains registered in the buyers name, correct? The breeder can't request AKC to change the ownership of the dog with out the buyers consent, right?


This would be my guess but I don't know how CKC works in Canada where the OP lives!


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## angelas (Aug 23, 2003)

That sounds like a standard clause in any good breeder's contract that I've read. One that I completely agree with.

As to how enforceable it is? I don't know. Dogs are property and once its sold the buyer owns it and may do with it as they please. Not many judges would rule in favor of the breeder unless there is over powering evidence of neglect/abuse.


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

The contract _terms_ sound reasonable to me. Unfortunately, there are some real nutzzz in this world, some who are jerks & *shudder* those who are both. A nutso jerk, whether buyer or seller, can make life an unmitigated helllll for the other party. I hope that's not the situation with this breeder. 

RA, if it's in your contract that you're not to give away, gift or sell our dog, you should abide by what you've agreed to. Terms that are onerous to you s/b settled prior to purchasing your pup, & not questioned or disputed later. 

IF you're concerned the breeder will unfairly reclaim your dog, do not let him outside unattended EVER.

Some years back, a Missouri West Highland Terrier breeder discovered that one of her Iowa buyers was keeping the bitch outside & had bred her. This was a violation of her contract, which stated the bitch was to be kept in the house & wasn't to be bred. 

The breeder tried to reclaim the bitch with the assistance of LE, but met massive indifference as it's a civil not a crminal matter. The breeder hopped the fence, took the bitch & returned to Missouri. The Iowa owner tried to file charges & met massive indifference b/c it was a contractual dispute, not a criminal matter. 

IMO, the breeder was absolutely in the right in that particular situation. I applauded her chutzpah. However, she did not prevail b/c she was *right*. She prevailed b/c the matter was outside the purview of LE. Consequently they didn't care who had the dog or what the contract said.


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## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

So far we have been unable to get the pup's actual papers, its now been almost seven months of every excuse you can think of. When I phoned CKC in October the litter was still unregistered. I phoned between Christmas and New Years to discover said litter was now registered but in breeders name only. To date I have had nothing sent/given to me via the breeder. I am gravely concerned as all I have is a dated bill of sale but the microchip and papers both say he is registered in The BREEDERS name.
As far as the other two puppies, one person was never given a bill of sale and the other one has no documentation either as the person had only one more payment to make but was always given excuses why receipts were not forthcoming. Party buying puppy on terms had only one more payment to make when seller confiscated puppy and has since resold dog.
So I take it that it is a case of he said, she said.
This is frustrating me to no end. 
Makes the hair on the back of my head stand up! 
So far breeder is flat out denying any involvement in the disappearing contract, has no intentions of providing another one, so only by memory can I abide by the "contract"
Kinda leaves me in a no win situation doesn't it
How can you follow the rules if you don't know what they are and they keep changing to suit the "breeder" HMMMMMMM
'Any further thoughts or suggestions???
Needless to say our next puppy buying experience will be elsewhere and hopefully without the pitfalls this one has been.


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## angelas (Aug 23, 2003)

Call the CKC and make a complaint against the breeder. If you are sold a purebred you are entitled to papers. Unless there is a clause in your contract that states the dog has to be altered before the owner receives them you should have them in hand by now.


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## ZebsMommy (Dec 4, 2010)

I would demand papers and a copy of the contract. Was this a BYB? Just curious. When I bought Zeb from the breeder I was handed AKC registration (for me to do it my name) and everything. This whole things sounds crazy.


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

There seem to be a multitude of red flags here. Again, NEVER leave your pup outside unattended. If possible, when taking him out have have another person with you. 

Keep copies of any & all correspondence. Document as much as you can of this saga. As Angelas suggested, file a complaint against the breeder with the CKC. Also, make several copies of the dated bill of sale. Secure them with several people &/or multiple places as it appears this is the only documentation you currently have proving that you purchased him.

Djibouti's litter was AKC registered in the breeder's name while individual pups were AKC registered to the respective owners. I'm not familiar with the CKC, but I'd think it would be similar. I was given the registration forms when I picked him up & it was then up to me to register him if I chose to do so.

Despite your justifiable frustration remain calm, level headed, professional & pleasant at all times. (I'm a notorious hot head & have slooowly learned it's a huge turn off to people. Regardless of how *right* my position is, when I lose it, people only perceive the moltenwaves of anger I'm giving off.)


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## novarobin (Oct 4, 2007)

I am assuming the dog is paid for in full. If so, in Canada, the dog is now your property. She cannot lawfully "repo" the dog. It would be considered a theft. 
She can attempt to sue for breach of contract if she wishes. The outcome of a civil suit can be monetary, declaratory or injunctions.
http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/dept-min/pub/just/08.html

The two that may apply here are the following monetary and declaratory. 
Monetary is obvious, she is seeking compensation. 
Declaratory settles things like dispute over property. I am not sure this would apply here since there is no dispute over who owns the dog, simply that you are not following the contract. Of course, this may depend on wording of the contract. 
If the contract is worded in a way that would allow for repossession of ownership, it is certainly going to require she prove that you have breached that clause. In civil court, decisions are based on a balance of probabilites as opposed to beyond a reasonable doubt in Criminal court. 
I suspect there may be an issue with what exactly not properly caring for the dog is. If the breeder didn't explicitly lay it out, she may have difficulty in court as well. 

In my experience, breeders often write up contracts that they cannot enforce. Usually, there is no need to act on these clauses. 
Many breeders now include a penalty clause, as in failing to neuter as per the contract is a penalty of $1000. The breeder could sue for that penalty if the party failed to provide proof of neutering, and would be successful. 

As for requiring the dog go to her first if you decide to sell it, that is pretty typical. It is something I like to see from a breeder and I have no issue with the clause. 

Bottomline is she can't just come and take your dog without at least going through a court proceeding (and even then, I highly doubt she would be successful). If she does, I would immediately notify the authorities. Like someone else suggested, start keeping documentation of everything that is going one. Request a copy of the contract.


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## novarobin (Oct 4, 2007)

RubyTuesday said:


> The contract _terms_ sound reasonable to me. Unfortunately, there are some real nutzzz in this world, some who are jerks & *shudder* those who are both. A nutso jerk, whether buyer or seller, can make life an unmitigated helllll for the other party. I hope that's not the situation with this breeder.
> 
> RA, if it's in your contract that you're not to give away, gift or sell our dog, you should abide by what you've agreed to. Terms that are onerous to you s/b settled prior to purchasing your pup, & not questioned or disputed later.
> 
> ...


I don't disagree with what the breeder did. 
But both parties did have another recourse, civil court. 
I understand why the breeder didn't want to go that route, as it would be costly in time. 
The owner likely didn't care enough to spend the money and time to pursue it civily. 

Its not that LE doesn't care, it is that they do not have the authority to act on it. Civil matters are civil matters.


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## Lesley1905 (Aug 25, 2010)

I agree, it's nice to see that your breeder cares about their pups and will do what is needed to keep them safe.


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## novarobin (Oct 4, 2007)

RA'S Mom said:


> So far we have been unable to get the pup's actual papers, its now been almost seven months of every excuse you can think of. When I phoned CKC in October the litter was still unregistered. I phoned between Christmas and New Years to discover said litter was now registered but in breeders name only. To date I have had nothing sent/given to me via the breeder. I am gravely concerned as all I have is a dated bill of sale but the microchip and papers both say he is registered in The BREEDERS name..


Possession is still 9/10ths of the law. You have proof you paid for the dog. You have the dog. You have vet bills, etc. 
Document all of the attempts you make to obtain the proper paperwork and complain to the CKC. 




RA'S Mom said:


> As far as the other two puppies, one person was never given a bill of sale and the other one has no documentation either as the person had only one more payment to make but was always given excuses why receipts were not forthcoming. Party buying puppy on terms had only one more payment to make when seller confiscated puppy and has since resold dog.
> So I take it that it is a case of he said, she said..


The buyer should know better than to pay amounts of money with no receipt given immediately. 

IF you notice, I stated I assumed your dog was paid for in full. If not, it changes the game. The owner does have an ability to repossess the dog, although it should still be through legal means. 




RA'S Mom said:


> How can you follow the rules if you don't know what they are and they keep changing to suit the "breeder" HMMMMMMM
> 'Any further thoughts or suggestions???
> Needless to say our next puppy buying experience will be elsewhere and hopefully without the pitfalls this one has been.


 
The rules can't change. If there is a civil suit she will need to provide the original document with both signatures on it. 
Yes, you can't remember exactly, but the rules aren't changing, they are still the ones you agreed to.


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

> Bottomline is she can't just come and take your dog without at least going through a court proceeding (and even then, I highly doubt she would be successful). *If she does, I would immediately notify the authorities*.
> _(bolding added)_


Your absolute best course is to not permit this to happen. 

It's unlikely she wants to take you to court. The outcome is iffy & it's a huge PITA. Conversely, you too should avoid that scenario. IF she managed to purloin your dog, LE might treat it as they did here with the Westie, ie point out it's really a 'contract dispute' & advise the respective parties to hash it out in court. Rarely a good idea. Often a gawdawful idea. Protect yourself & your dog & avoid that by accompanying him at all times when he's outside. There's some truth to that tired old adage _'Possession is 90% of the law'_.


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

> But both parties did have another recourse, civil court.


Realistically, the other course wasn't feasible due to the distances involved. Frankly, I think this is something sellers, including puppy sellers, often understand much better than buyers. Most contracts simply aren't worth enforcing in terms of the time & money required if buyer & seller are in different states, or even different cities. A contract is often worth as much as the other party's word is worth, which is why (IMO), character is important in these transactions.



> Its not that LE doesn't care, it is that they do not have the authority to act on it. Civil matters are civil matters.


I agree. Actually, I loved the way the buyer took refuge in that, only to find that it backfired & bit her in her snarky tush.


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## novarobin (Oct 4, 2007)

RubyTuesday said:


> Realistically, the other course wasn't feasible due to the distances involved. Frankly, I think this is something sellers, including puppy sellers, often understand much better than buyers. Most contracts simply aren't worth enforcing in terms of the time & money required if buyer & seller are in different states, or even different cities. A contract is often worth as much as the other party's word is worth, which is why (IMO), character is important in these transactions.


 
Exactly!
Far too many people just write up a contract and feel it is enough to protect them and their dogs. It isn't.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

angelas said:


> Call the CKC and make a complaint against the breeder. If you are sold a purebred you are entitled to papers. Unless there is a clause in your contract that states the dog has to be altered before the owner receives them you should have them in hand by now.


This is great advice!


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

I'd rather buy a dog from someone I trusted with no contract than get one from someone I couldn't trust with the world's best contract. IF I need to enforce the contract, something has gone seriously awry...Which is why I want to deal with people that are honest, knowledgeable, reasonable & SANE.


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## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

How do you communicate with someone who has blocked facebook contact, e-mail and phone contact, outside of sending a registered letter??
That is the current situation.
I think I will have to follow up with CKC to see what avenues of recourse I have.
Yes, the dog was paid for at the time of pick up and I insisted on a documented bill of sale, breeder said oh don't worry I will send you one with your registration to which my reply was either I get a bill of sale now or I don't pay you nickle one and you get to keep the puppy, hindsight being what it is I should have walked at that exact moment and would have purchased a different dog from a different breeder and would likely not be dealing with this crap 7 months later.


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## novarobin (Oct 4, 2007)

RA'S Mom said:


> How do you communicate with someone who has blocked facebook contact, e-mail and phone contact, outside of sending a registered letter??
> That is the current situation.
> I think I will have to follow up with CKC to see what avenues of recourse I have.
> Yes, the dog was paid for at the time of pick up and I insisted on a documented bill of sale, breeder said oh don't worry I will send you one with your registration to which my reply was either I get a bill of sale now or I don't pay you nickle one and you get to keep the puppy, hindsight being what it is I should have walked at that exact moment and would have purchased a different dog from a different breeder and would likely not be dealing with this crap 7 months later.


Send a registered letter. Even better. More documentation. Phone calls can be difficult to prove. Emails can get lost. 

Definitely follow up with the CKC.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

This bothers me. 

The scenario where the seller found the buyer was not living up to her end of the agreement, and called in the authorities who did nothing. I probably agree that it is a civil matter, and she would have to go to small claims court to reclaim the dog and enforce the contract.

Instead, she hops the fence and STEALS the dog. 

The dog was property however disputed. She stole property from another person's home -- that IS criminal. For law enforcement to do nothing about that, well, it sounds like lazy law enforcement. 

For example, if I buy a garden tractor, and do not pay for the service contract on it. They cannot send Bevis and Butthead to my home to snag the garden tractor. 

The only difference is people who reposses vehicles. I think though that they do have to go through some type of legal mess to go through with car snatching. 

Running out and checking up on our puppies and repo'ing them if we feel like we failed to make a good choice in the first place, I do not care if Animal Planet likes that kind of crap with Pit-boss, it is very likely it would get you or me in a world of trouble, even a criminal conviction.

And I really do not know what the AKC does about things like that. Whether they frown upon it. But papers go with the dog -- supposed to anyhow. And if you repo the dog, unless you sneak in and steal the paperwork too, and then forge it if it has already been sent in, and THAT would be penalized big time with the AKC. 

So while we paint the lady as some type of modern Rambo dog hero, she is really a theif. And she may have gotten away with it. Maybe they weren't too keen to bother with extradition since she crossed state lines, but wouldn't that be fun if she was over there for a show and ended up being arrested on a warrant. 

Whatever. 

My contract is pretty simple and mostly outlines what I agree to do. The way I look at it, I do not want anything in my contract that I cannot enforce. And, I have a reputation to uphold that matters. Buyers have that on us. There is no internet list of funky dog owners to stay away from and there should be. 

A crappy dog owner database, that we can pull up and check before we sell a dog.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

RA'S Mom said:


> How do you communicate with someone who has blocked facebook contact, e-mail and phone contact, outside of sending a registered letter??
> That is the current situation.
> I think I will have to follow up with CKC to see what avenues of recourse I have.
> Yes, the dog was paid for at the time of pick up and I insisted on a documented bill of sale, breeder said oh don't worry I will send you one with your registration to which my reply was either I get a bill of sale now or I don't pay you nickle one and you get to keep the puppy, hindsight being what it is I should have walked at that exact moment and would have purchased a different dog from a different breeder and would likely not be dealing with this crap 7 months later.


This is so weird. You had this lady in your home, as a guest, and she has blocked you from her facebook, phone, and e-mail???

That is weird. Good breeders like to hear about their dogs. Sometimes we have people giving us regular updates, and sometimes people never call, and are like oh yeah, when we call them. And generally we want to talk to them.


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## RubyTuesday (Jan 20, 2008)

Selzer, I loved the irony of the whole civil matter, contract dispute argument coming back at the errant buyer. I don't remember all the details, it's been a looong time, but I think breeder & buyer co-owned the bitch, in which case she can't 'steal' her b/c they both own her.

Frankly, draconian measures would not have been necessary, nor could they have succeeded, if she'd kept the bitch as a house dog as she'd contracted to do. Iowa is an especially lousy place to keep dogs outside due to the extreme weather we 'enjoy'. As bad, perhaps worse, these backyard dogs are rarely given the attention, training & companionship they need.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

selzer said:


> This is so weird. You had this lady in your home, as a guest, and she has blocked you from her facebook, phone, and e-mail???


I'm stuck on this point too. When was she a guest? And why? Was she checking up on the dog? Why did you have your contract out when she was there?

Something smells here...she sounds like a con artist.


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## Zoeys mom (Jan 23, 2010)

If you still have the bill of sale for said puppy and puppy is microchipped you can prove your bill of sale is for that puppy. The bill of sale date will be after the microchip's registration date so again you can prove you purchased the puppy from this specific breeder. Take a copy of the bill of sale and microchip information and mail it to the CKC asking for a registration as well as register your dog in your name in your area through the county. They should honor your bill of sale and register the puppy since the litter is already registered anyway and then it will be in your name.

I would also send a registered letter to this breeder asking her to do the same outlining you are the legal owner and legally require the registration papers. That way if she ever did just come steal the pup you have proof you own the dog and she refused to give you the appropriate documentation


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## Quinnsmom (Dec 27, 2008)

Sent you a pm with contact information at the CKC.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

I would NOT every let this person in your home again, and I would NOT ever leave the puppy outside unattended.


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## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

Jaxo8
She was in our home late this summer to visit and see Ra the puppy. I had no qualms about having the visit but while here she asked to use my bill of sale to make another one as she said she liked the wording of mine, I said no problem, grabbed my envelope with my documents, pulled out my bill of sale for her and stupidly left the envelope on the counter beside her.
I sadly did not discover the missing contract until I was contacted by the second party who had their dog taken,and she had asked me if I had a puppy contract, I told her I did,
as she wanted to verify what was in it. I went to get it and lo and behold it was missing!
This is like being caught in a bad soap opera with more twists and turns than a body can almost follow.
So how can you abide by a contract you don't have a copy of, can't seem to get another one, and have to follow it??
I don't know why, but since this all blew up I have this sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. Although there was a bright note today, one of our members was kind enough to send me some information to follow up on, that may put me in touch with a body at CKC that may be able to help me sort this out.
Thank you so much, you know who you are.
I will follow up with CKC to see what my options are but no one likes to live under a fear of threat.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Wow...definitely something fishy going on there. Even the request is odd. Did she go into the other people's homes as well? I might even contact the police and see what you can do about the 'stolen' contract. To bad you can't prove it.

If there was no contract between the breeder and the other puppy owner's, then how did she get the puppy back? She would have to prove it even came from her to begin with. Are there microchips? Whose name is it registered in?


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## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

Well all the puppies had microchips but they are all still in her name! which is frustrating because I have been told until the registered papers are in our name, it stays in the breeders name So trying not to be paranoid where does that leave me and my dog??


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

But you have your original bill of sale that she signed, correct?


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## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

At least I have that! Phew!!!!


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Do not leave the dog outside unattended ever. 

If the dog remains in the breeder's name, and the microchips are in the breeder's name, I think she might come in and try to take the dog back. It sounds rediculous for anyone to do, but their are nutjobs out there.


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## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Is there a way to have a microchip removed without surgery?


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## irongrl (May 24, 2010)

This might sound crazy, but is it possible to get a restraining order to keep her from coming near your home?


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

arycrest said:


> Is there a way to have a microchip removed without surgery?


Probably not, but you can have another one inserted. Halo's original chip stopped working, and we had to re-chip her. It was discovered when I was having her OFA prelims done - they tried to find her "permanent ID" for the form, and nothing came up. They did another x-ray at the area of the chip and you could see it but it looked like it was cracked, possibly from my dogs playing roughly with each other. (NO, they never do THAT!!! ) 

I contacted the company I'd registered the chip with and gave them the new chip number. I think in this case it would be worthwhile to do another microchip.


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## Zoeys mom (Jan 23, 2010)

The bill of sale alone trumps the chip anyway since the date of sale will be later than the original chip's registry. You can already prove you own the dog I wouldn't be overly concerned from a legal standpoint. Follow up with the CKC, write a registered letter to the breeder explaining your need for the contract and papers, and be done with it


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## RA'S Mom (Sep 12, 2010)

Believe me I look forward to closing this chapter and moving on! In fact I have learned some valuable lessons and will be much wiser on the next puppy we look at.
I simply need to say a huge THANK YOU to all for the great suggestions and support. It has really helped to ease the situation and has helped me deal with it far better than I might have on my own!:hug::hug::hug::hug::hug:
I was very thankful to have found this site and lurked, learning
an amazing amount of knowledge that can only come from people who have been there, done it and caring enough to share with others who might not otherwise make it without all the info this site holds.
May each of you, your furkids and family be blessed in 2011


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## trudy (Aug 25, 2008)

OK, I am also in Can, not a breeder, but will share some info about the CKC, they are slow and inefficient. The breeder has the litter registerded and all pup sare in her name is teh litter registration, now she must do each individually. Yep I have heard of time delays, long ones, 

All good, reputable breeders want the pups back if you can't keep them they don't want to hear that their pup was sold, and sold, and given away or dumped in the pound. They want to know where their pups are and how they are doing. You mentioned the 2 she took back hadn't been paid in full, maybe they also hadn't bothered with vets and shots, amybe they skimped on food and training. I don't know and there are always 2 sides and most people only tell their side with the slant they want. 

Phone or drop in at the breeders home, you know where she lives and ask, nicely, why you are blocked on facebook, I can tell you I have lost friends on facebook and neither blocked the other just didn't show up one day, so we re-friend each other, . If you signed a contract, you read it and did agree with it and if you are keeping your dog in great condition and care, you have nothing to worry about. The microchip should have your contact info, address, phone number, etc. The vet has your records and knows your chip number and that is all you should have, don't panic. Talk to the breeder, get the facts, and call the CKC and ask if there are things going through and why the hold up, if it is their issue, not the breeders. 

Good luck, please contact me privately if you have any concerns I could help you with, I don't breed but have had dogs for a very long time and am very good friends with numerous breeders. Take pics, and please share, we love pics


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## Hundguy (Apr 30, 2003)

Actually with the bill of sale you should be able to contact the chip company and change the ownership of the dog into your name. Then everything will be in your name and I would then file a ridiculous small claims case against her for the papers and or a full/part refund of $$$ due to no papers. Also if she denies the contract stuff than there must be no contract and you have no obligations to her.. I think you will then have the records of the court showing the dog is yours papers or no papers!!!!


The wait and see game is not smart with a scamm artist, you have to be pro-active!


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## ZAYDA (Apr 22, 2010)

Of course I just skimmed through this but is this breeder local. You do know where to find her correct. Maybe an in person visit is in order even if you just pretend to be bringing another customer to her. 

It seems you are most concerned they may come back for the puppy so as mentioned do not leave her unattended. If by some chance you dog goes missing you know right where to go anyway. good luck


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## Jax's Mom (Apr 2, 2010)

Can you PM me the kennel or their name?
I know of a few that sound similar that use other people's CKC memberships because they've been banned by the CKC themselves.


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