# Lovely GSD but a runner (pic included for cuteness factor)



## valkener (Jul 27, 2011)

We have a 16-month-old male, still in tact. He is well behaved and has strong protective instincts. He can do many tricks and is good with people, including children.

However, he is also very stubborn sometimes and likes to test us. In the past months he ran away twice. The first time I was taking the trash out and he snuck past me and ran, ignoring my shouts. Half an hour later my wife found him roughly 2 miles away next to a busy street. I cried because I knew how lucky I was to still have him.

He's been pretty much been on leash-only walking since then, but he ran off at a dog park (not fenced in) once more. I was lucky enough to catch him quickly and scolded him immediately.

We don't want this to happen again, it's too risky. We would like him to be able to walk off-leash though, but we're not sure how to train him not to run - or if he runs, to stop in his tracks and come back.

I understand it's a conflict of his prey drive and will to please us, but we're very dedicated. He has been through obedience training and done very well there; he graduated at the top of his class . He is a good walker (not perfect though).

Any suggestions how we can best help him? We were thinking of getting a shocker colar for emergencies, and also so we have a way to immediately correct his behavior because he is fast.

here is a picture:


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## Bear L (Feb 9, 2012)

I've been told that an e-collar may help. My dog doesn't have one yet but that's something I contemplate for later so I don't have to worry about her going after some wildlife when we go hiking. I know there are people with e-collar here on the forum, maybe they will chime in.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

How much exercise/training is he getting?

How is his recall?


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## billsharp (May 3, 2011)

You're going to have to teach him to come to you when he is off leash. This starts by teaching him to come to you off leash in an enclosed place where he cannot run away until he understands what come means. Sit him and then step back 2 feet. Tell him to "come" and reward him. Do this over and over until he understands (1) what "come" means he is to do, and (2) that when he does this he will always get a reward (that isn't true, but he won't know that).

Once he gets it, move farther away, and repeat the process. Once you are ready to take him outside of the enclosed place use a long line so he can't run away. Same process; make him sit and stay, and reward him for coming. Mix in distractions, etc., as he becomes more confident. Start skipping the reward randomly so he loses focus on it and begins to respond just because he knows it is what you want him to do.

Once you have this down cold for the full length of the lead you can try him outside AND off-lead. If he is solid this should not make a difference. If he has bonded with you and wants to please you and understands, he should stay and come on command.

This process could take several weeks or some months, doing it daily. You can't train for hours per day because the dog gets tired and unresponsive. 

He will have to learn that there is more reward for him in coming to you (treat, praise) than in running away to explore the world.

The ecollar would only be used as a "super-long" line--a way to keep him in check if you have him out off-leash and he does not immediately respond to a "come" recall. However, you MUST read and follow the directions on how to use the ecollar or your training will be counterproductive. Your statement that you want to use the ecollar for "emergenies" sounds like you might have the false impression that if you just put a collar on him you can shock him if he runs off and he'll magically come back. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The ecollar is ONLY to be used after he has been trained to know what your commands mean, and to understand that the correction from the ecollar means he is to follow that command.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

You could train /30ft. lead


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## valkener (Jul 27, 2011)

Thank you so much for the detailed responses. Our dog knows and follows all the basic commands (komm, sitz, platz, bleib) and he follows them well. We do practice him coming and he does well 95% of the time. Admittedly, sometimes he choses not to come, especially when distracted in a dog park. In this case we do not let him get away with it but keep calling him until he comes (we do realize that ideally it would only take 1 call, which in most cases it does).

So as far as I understand your advice, the ecollar comes into place once he understands all the command. Our dog is at this point, but he in some cases, like when there are other dogs, he choses not to follow them. 

Are there any sources that I can read up on how to use an ecolor. Also, we're gonna keep practicing the things mentioned above more, but he really does know all these commands and understands them.


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## billsharp (May 3, 2011)

Good, you're way ahead of the game. 

Search on this site for ecollar, shock collar, etc. You'll hit several threads with discussions. There are basically two gurus whose methods of ecollar use are discussed and debated here, and those threads will have links to their sites.

The collars usually come with a great booklet and training video that explains the process and proper and improper uses. You should have no trouble if you do your homework. I have found the ecollar to be a great adjunct training tool. Good luck!


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## valkener (Jul 27, 2011)

Thanks, I will use the search function.

Last, any recommendations for a particular ecollar? On amazon they have plenty ranging from $60 to $400.


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## doggiedad (Dec 2, 2007)

i would teach my dog to "come" with distractions.
i wouldn't depend on a device for his recall. i used
the dog park as a training tool. i use to train in the parking
lot moving closure to the enclosure as my dog learned.
i did a lot of training along the fence of the dog park.
once he followed his commands along the fence i moved
inside the dog park and trained. the dog park is a great
training tool.


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## billsharp (May 3, 2011)

This is the only one I've used, we like it because it is dependable, simple, and inexpensive at $150.

Academy - SportDOG Brand® FieldTrainer® Electronic Dog Collar


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

If the dog runs away and you finally get him and you scold him immediately, what incentive is there for the dog to come back on his own?


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## WVGSD (Nov 28, 2006)

When I used an e-collar on my female that would jump my fence, it did zero good. I was hitting the button, yelling her name and NO, and she still jumped my five foot chain link fence every chance that she could. We finally ran a line of electric wire at the top of the fence and it only took one time for her to hit it and decide that she did not really need to go over the fence. 

If your dog is chosing to go for a run, I doubt that a shock collar is going to make him want to return to you.


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

I have used my remote successfully in getting my dog to return, but this is only employed when the dog is advanced in training, he knows and executes a reliable recall and I run into a competing motivation like a deer in the woods, and he blows me off....now its time for him to learn that I have a thirty foot leash even when he is off leash....lol..... and he still gets praised when he gets back like he did it without the remote's help.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

cliffson1 said:


> If the dog runs away and you finally get him and you scold him immediately, what incentive is there for the dog to come back on his own?


:thumbup: You're violating rule #1 about training a recall - you never, ever, EVER scold your dog for coming to you, no matter how long it took, no matter how mad or frustrated you are. Coming to you is ALWAYS good, being near you is ALWAYS good.


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## Bear L (Feb 9, 2012)

Cassidy's Mom said:


> :thumbup: You're violating rule #1 about training a recall - you never, ever, EVER scold your dog for coming to you, no matter how long it took, no matter how mad or frustrated you are. Coming to you is ALWAYS good, being near you is ALWAYS good.


I've a question about this. A GSD trainer who also breeds GSDs, taught the class that when a GSD wanders away and doesn't mind your recall, he advised to go get the dog calmly, put the prong on, then correct the dog all the way back to where he was suppose to be. 

I struggle with understanding what's the right way to teach recall. I give it treats when the dog comes back but then wouldn't that just make the dog think it's ok to run away, because it'll always come back to treats? I also understand you don't want the dog to not want to come. But how do you balance the two? Or you don't?


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## ponyfarm (Apr 11, 2010)

Bear L said:


> I've a question about this. A GSD trainer who also breeds GSDs, taught the class that when a GSD wanders away and doesn't mind your recall, he advised to go get the dog calmly, put the prong on, then correct the dog all the way back to where he was suppose to be.
> 
> I struggle with understanding what's the right way to teach recall. I give it treats when the dog comes back but then wouldn't that just make the dog think it's ok to run away, because it'll always come back to treats? I also understand you don't want the dog to not want to come. But how do you balance the two? Or you don't?


You should be more fun and exciting to be with..so the dog doesnt want to "run away". When I let my dogs off leash, they only go so far , and then they run back to check to check in. I did this thru leash training, with treats/fav toys when they come back to me. If they dont come back when I call, then they wear a long line and when they are putzing around I call them and we treat/play then off we go again. Has worked well for me as I am able to call them off wildlife so far..lol


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## blackshep (Aug 3, 2012)

In my obedience class, we were told to NEVER use your recall word unless you are 100% certain the dog will come. That means right now, don't use that word if he's off leash. And since his recall isn't 100%, he should never be off leash in an unfenced area IMO.

You need to make yourself exciting so the dog will come to you, rather than whatever is attracting him at that moment. Carry treats or a toy that he loves and really love him up when he comes when called.


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## Olivers mama (Oct 13, 2010)

Val,

I have seen that ecollars, in the wrong hands, can be devastating.

Check out Lou Castle's thread here on his forum, or his website: loucastle.com Sgt Castle has been successfully training all types of dogs for years using ecollars. There's no one else I would trust with my dog's well-being.


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## x0emiroxy0x (Nov 29, 2010)

I would address him slipping out the door from behind you....

Do you make him sit before going outside? Do you make him sit WHILE the door is being opened, and even for a few seconds after it is opened? 

To train Rocky to not run out the door, I would tell him sit and stay. I would open the door a few inches. If he stayed sitting, he got praised (I NEVER used treats for this because I expect him to do it with or without treats, and the reward is going outside) The second he stood up, the door got shut and I said "NO". Then we started again  and again  and again  and again  ... until he learned that he was not stepping outside the door until I told him he could.

I packed for a camping trip recently and (I live in an apartment) I packed everything, put it at the front door, opened the front door, and carried everything piece by piece to the car and packed it to the car. Rocky sat at the front door and did not move his butt, even to peek around the corner to see me (he did cry and howl if I took too long between trips though)

I would definitely train him to respect you going through ANY door first and not barrel in front of you. When I open the bedroom door, Rocky sits and waits for me to go through first. That took a bit of training. 

Good luck!


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