# Opinions about breeders.



## GSDWVU (Jul 30, 2012)

I have recently started to look for a good breeder in the MD, WV, PA area, and would like some feedback on a few that I have shown interest in so far. I am just looking for a pet/companion so agility/schutzand/SAR are not important to me. My main concern is to find a healthy dog with a stable temperamant who will be fairly low energy. I am also not looking to spend more than $1500. I have been interested mostly in the working lines due to the price, but my main concern is to find a breeder whom I can trust and rely on for advice. Here are my favorites so far:

West Virginia German Shepherd breeder with quality DDR pups.

Applejack K9 Academy - Working German Shepherds, puppies, boarding, & training in Maryland

Welcome to Blackthorn Working German Shepherds

Diamond Shepherd Kennels | Breeding, Boarding, Training

Johnson-Haus German Shepherd Breeder/Dog Trainer, Frederick Maryland


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## qbchottu (Jul 10, 2011)

I like Blackthorn and Johnson-Haus. Christine and Carolina/Dennis Johnson are all members here. You could send them a PM to learn more.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

Blackthorn is a reputable working line breeder, she is on this forum. I feel comfortable recommending her, but I'm not sure what her puppy prices are or if they fit into your budget.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Jessica (Jprice) has a Johnson-Haus puppy. You could PM her and ask for her input. Personally, Johnson-Haus is on my short list. 

There are many recommendations on this thread also
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/choosing-breeder/185707-east-coast-working-line-breeders.html


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## rshkr (Feb 9, 2012)

pet/companion/ low energy and you want a working line GSD?
goodluck...


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## GSDWVU (Jul 30, 2012)

I have had german shepherds in the past, so I am okay with their energy levels. However, all of them were from rescues, so its hard to compare them to a specific line. The dogs that I have previously owned could run for hours and required a lot of exercise, but they had an "off switch" and were very calm indoors. Am I wrong for thinking that can find something similar in the working lines? Or should I look into different lines?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

GSDWVU said:


> I have had german shepherds in the past, so I am okay with their energy levels. However, all of them were from rescues, so its hard to compare them to a specific line. The dogs that I have previously owned could run for hours and required a lot of exercise, but they had an "off switch" and were very calm indoors. Am I wrong for thinking that can find something similar in the working lines? Or should I look into different lines?


No. You are fine. You can find exactly that in working lines.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

of the ones you listed, I am only familiar with johnsonhaus and blackthorne and wouldn't hesitate to take a dog from either of them

Sucherquelle has beautiful dogs but I am not familiar with them


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## GSDWVU (Jul 30, 2012)

After speaking with the breeder, Sucherquelle is one that I really like so far. She breeds DDR lines, which I am not really familiar with. How do they compare to the working lines at Johnson-Haus or Blackthorne? Her prices are also a little different. They read:

_Limited registration..no guarantee...$1000.00
Full registration...hip guarantee....$1200.00
Exceptional ....hip guarantee....$1500.00_ I am guessing that the exceptional vs. the full registration is just based off of the x-rays of the hips?​


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## Shade (Feb 20, 2012)

Delgado's a WL and has a good off switch and he's very managable in the house. He goes on two thirty minute structured walks and a 1-1.5 hour off leash /flexi playtime in a offleash park. Right now he's high energy because he's still very puppy at 6 months but he's calming more and more as he grows. He'll probably end at medium energy which is exactly what I asked for

Just be clear with your breeder on your needs and hopefully they'll have a good match for you.


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## Shade (Feb 20, 2012)

GSDWVU said:


> After speaking with the breeder, Sucherquelle is one that I really like so far. She breeds DDR lines, which I am not really familiar with. How do they compare to the working lines at Johnson-Haus or Blackthorne? Her prices are also a little different. They read:
> 
> _Limited registration..no guarantee...$1000.00
> Full registration...hip guarantee....$1200.00
> Exceptional ....hip guarantee....$1500.00_ I am guessing that the exceptional vs. the full registration is just based off of the x-rays of the hips?​


Personally I don't like the fact there's no guarantee on ALL puppies and that there's a price difference between the full registration and exceptional

JMO


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

ddr 'are' working lines/ east german working lines. I'm assuming she has straight east german lines, whereas, and correct me if I'm wrong, christine and carolina use west german working lines within their breeding program.

Some say the ddr lines take longer to mature (I agree), can be more stubborn (I have never had a problem with stubborness).

Of all the gsd's I've had, the ones that were working lines were DDR, love em

If they are near you, go visit them, dont limit yourself tho, go visit as many as you are able to make an informed decision


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

GSDWVU said:


> _Limited registration..no guarantee...$1000.00
> Full registration...hip guarantee....$1200.00
> Exceptional ....hip guarantee....$1500.00_ I am guessing that the exceptional vs. the full registration is just based off of the x-rays of the hips?​


Never heard of such a thing...email the breeder and ask what is "covered" and what isn't. Seems a little insane. I can understand the Limited/No guarantee to the Full Registration/Hip...but what is the next level? Hip xrays can't be done until tey are a year for prelim and 2 years for OFA so it's not based off the hip xrays.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

could be and I am just guessing here,,Full may be a 2 year hip guarantee, Exceptional may be longer???


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## Jag (Jul 27, 2012)

I have never understood the whole "limited registration" thing. It seems fishy to me. I also don't think you should have to pay more to have a hip guarantee. I don't see too much of a difference between those two and going with a dog off Craigslist, etc.  I'm not a breeder, but if I was I wouldn't play around with registration rights nor would I even have an option of no hip guarantee... unless, of course, I was breeding dogs that I thought could have bad hips (like that would happen).


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

Jag said:


> I have never understood the whole "limited registration" thing. It seems fishy to me. I also don't think you should have to pay more to have a hip guarantee. I don't see too much of a difference between those two and going with a dog off Craigslist, etc.  I'm not a breeder, but if I was I wouldn't play around with registration rights nor would I even have an option of no hip guarantee... unless, of course, I was breeding dogs that I thought could have bad hips (like that would happen).


Limited registration stops people from potentially breeding their dogs with the breeder's kennel name and registering them. Nothing wrong with a limited registration - nothing fishy at all. It's very common practice.

Now the hip guarantee vs no hip guarantee isn't too common. That's something I've never heard before. You typically either get one or you don't.


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## Jag (Jul 27, 2012)

OK.. let me see if I understand this. If I bought a dog from X kennel and then I bred that dog.. the "limited registration" only prohibits me from putting "X kennel" on the papers of the pups? I don't know why anyone would do that anyway... if they were going to be breeding, wouldn't they want their own kennel name on the papers? The pedigree would show "X kennel" anyway. The female I bought years and years ago was "limited registration" and I was told I wasn't allowed to breed her (at all) unless I paid more money to get "full registration". Now, I didn't care because I had her spayed anyway. However, wanting more money for "full registration" didn't make sense to me. If it's about not wanting their kennel name used, then why allow it if you give them more money?? :help:


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

No, the limited registration prevents you from registering the litter with the AKC. Most working line breeders do not charge more for full registration, they make you prove that the dog is worthy of breeding by testing, OFA"s and sometimes titles.


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

That's the whole point with limited registrations... it prevents you from breeding AND registering the dog altogether. There are no papers showing the kennel's name in the pedigree because you can't register a litter if either the sire or dam only has limited registration. Both parents need full registrations to register that litter.

A breeder can very easily change a limited registration to a full registration at anytime once their requirements are met. Most reputable breeders will do this once health clearances are done and titles are received - each has their own criteria. It has nothing to do with money - at least with the good breeders.


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## GSDWVU (Jul 30, 2012)

So if you have no plans to breed the dog, then it makes no difference whether it's fully registered or limited?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

GSDWVU said:


> So if you have no plans to breed the dog, then it makes no difference whether it's fully registered or limited?


That's right.  It doesn't change the pedigree, the ownership. But in the all the websites I've stalked...I"ve never seen a breeder charge a less amount for registration. I have seen less amount for guarantee/no guarantee on one site.


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

GSDWVU said:


> So if you have no plans to breed the dog, then it makes no difference whether it's fully registered or limited?


I believe you need full registration to show the dog in certain events too.

For most cases, limited registrations are more than enough.


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## Beau (Feb 12, 2012)

GSDWVU said:


> After speaking with the breeder, Sucherquelle is one that I really like so far. She breeds DDR lines, which I am not really familiar with. How do they compare to the working lines at Johnson-Haus or Blackthorne? Her prices are also a little different. They read:
> 
> _Limited registration..no guarantee...$1000.00
> Full registration...hip guarantee....$1200.00
> Exceptional ....hip guarantee....$1500.00_ I am guessing that the exceptional vs. the full registration is just based off of the x-rays of the hips?​


I really don't like all this tiered pricing. Kinda reminds of a used cars salesman. (No offense to anyone who sells/sold cars. I've done it as well, so I know what I'm inferring here.)

Used car for sale:

No registration..no tires $1000.00
Registration..no tires $1200.00
Registration..with tires $1500.00

I get the Limited vs. Full registration price differentiation. 

But a true, honest good breeder should always guarantee hips. 

Offering a price with no guarantee seems like a very slippery slope to me.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Lucy Dog said:


> I believe you need full registration to show the dog in certain events too.
> 
> For most cases, limited registrations are more than enough.


As far as I know, it's only AKC conformation.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

GSDWVU said:


> So if you have no plans to breed the dog, then it makes no difference whether it's fully registered or limited?


That's correct, it makes no difference. The dog is still registered in your name as a purebred GSD. The only thing you can't do on a limited registration is breed the dog. 

Actually, I am not sure if you can participate in AKC conformation events on limited reg, but you can still do AKC obedience, CGC, agility, SchH, etc.


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## KatsMuse (Jun 5, 2012)

GSDWVU said:


> After speaking with the breeder, Sucherquelle is one that I really like so far. She breeds DDR lines, which I am not really familiar with. How do they compare to the working lines at Johnson-Haus or Blackthorne? Her prices are also a little different. They read:
> 
> _Limited registration..no guarantee...$1000.00
> Full registration...hip guarantee....$1200.00
> Exceptional ....hip guarantee....$1500.00_ I am guessing that the exceptional vs. the full registration is just based off of the x-rays of the hips?​


IMO, if this is the one you really like...go with it.

Sounds like they will be available/ willing to help with advice or questions you may have in the future.
That relationship is extremely important and can be invaluable!

At minimum, I would go with the full registration and hip guarantee though. ...or higher. Just my opinion. (Limited registration means no conformation events and it's too soon to know for sure what you may want to do with your pup or it's possibilities in the future)


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## SpookyShepherd (Oct 12, 2010)

Kinda late to the party, but wanted to put in my $.02. I have an absolutely fantastic Blackthorn puppy who has truly been a wonderful addition to our family. Christine has been beyond helpful when we've had questions about Piper. She really listened to who we are as a family and what we wanted to do with our dog, then helped us to select the best match. She sells hers on limited registration. I'm not completely familiar with all her requirements for full since we spayed Piper, but I believe the dog needs to have health and temperament testing as well as working titles of some sort (OB, rally, agility, herding, SchH, etc.). If you have a chance, please get in touch with Christine and meet her dogs... it sealed the deal for us! She's very conscientous about what she's breeding in both health and temperament soundness. Can't recommend Blackthorn dogs enough!


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## WVGSD (Nov 28, 2006)

Hello from West Virginia!! I just got a GSD puppy in West Virginia and I sent you a private message.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Limited registration - I am thinking that this is for those pups which may be pet only for some reason, destined to be spayed/neutered , not bred . Limited registration still allows them to compete in obedience (?).
Now should the owner want to breed the dog is presented back to the breeder who goes over the dog with a fine tooth comb to see if what they were questioning is resolved (may have been a size issue , or overbite, undershot - ). If it has then they remove the restrictions and the person pays for the upgrade .


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## holland (Jan 11, 2009)

not always I don't have to pay for an upgrade -just have to title the dog-Limited registration does also prevent you from showing in the akc show ring-personally I wouldn't buy a dog if I had to pay for an upgrade-lol


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Hip "guarantees" are more common here than in Europe. Not everyone expects them and accepts that there are risks in buying puppies. They do their research and then take that risk. They also may be looking at a specific litter that meets their needs and don't want to be tied to a breeder if something goes wrong. The few breeders I know that will go this route and the friends that have chosen to do this paid 1/2 the normal price and not just a couple of hundred less.

One friend who did this ended up with a dog with very loose hips at prelims. The breeder, though not obligated, took the pup back and refunded my friend's money.


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## Andaka (Jun 29, 2003)

"Paying for the upgrade" may just be paying AKC for the change in registration status.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

I know some breeders who give "rebates" on their pups if you get a title on them... so say you put a CD on the dog, you get $100 back. Earn a SchH1, you get $250, and so on. In fact one breeder I know refunds the entire puppy price if you earn a ScH3. Not a bad deal!


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## CelticGlory (Jan 19, 2006)

I think from reading other tier breeders websites "exceptional" would be your show/breeding/working dog prospects, "Full" is show/breeding, but may not be that good for working. I have seen this for Rottweilers as well,other tier breeders for both breeds go further though with their pricing.


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