# Apartment breed restrictions...



## Hauhet (Aug 9, 2014)

So.. I am currently living in a place that allows German Shepherds and they are flipping every apartment and the entire place has just gone down hill... My roommate and I found a house that would allow us to keep my Shepherd (move in date Sept 1st). That couple was moving to Australia for work. Well, their visas didn't get approved so I we can't move in. We had a mad dash to find a place and I remembered finding a total of two places in my city that allowed German shepherds.. One being the one I live in now. 

I called the other place which is pretty nice and they just recently added GSD to their no breed list..(with some of the other ones being grandfathered in). We looked and looked for another place and no luck. So we went back there and I told them my dog was a belgian/czech mix. I feel awful about this and I know it's wrong... So before I get criticism... I know... 

My GSD is a bi-color and mostly black... Except for his paws. So, my question is.. Do you think he will pass as what I said? Has anyone else ran into a similar situation? I hate the idea of certain breed and breed owners being ostracized and I'm just trying to find a decent place to live and be able to keep my dog. My dog has gone through a handful classes when he was a puppy and is an amazing dog. Granted... I know that means nothing for commercial renters... 


Thoughts?


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## Isen87 (May 22, 2014)

I have gone through the same problem year after year. It seems that more and more apartment complexes are adding german shepherds to their breed restrictions. I got really frustrated with one complex because they would allow Dutch shepherds to live on the premises but not my german shepherd. The way it was explained to me is that it isn't the complex themselves that are saying no it's the insurance companies that insure the property and the tenants that is saying no. I don't know if that is true but it made more sense.
I am not sure if lying about your dogs breed is the best way to go though. If you are found out they can evict you for false information so be careful. I had to move in with my boyfriends sister just to keep my babies. Keep looking and ask around your area. Some private owners of condos don't have breed restrictions. Hope you you find something soon.


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## Ace GSD (May 30, 2014)

They will ask vet report and pic of your dog


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Is there a rental agency that can help you find a place in your area? It might be worth a small fee to let someone else with experience do the work for you.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Do you have a picture of your dog?


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Do a Google search on using the terms "search for apartments" and put your city name in there. See if an agency or a website pops up. Then search on Yelp and Google for complaints.

Other terms:

"Pet friendly" "big dogs allowed" "German Shepherds allowed"


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## Hauhet (Aug 9, 2014)

So I guess I should add some info. 

Yes i worked with a rental agency and the place I live at now is the only place that allows them. Other than houses... I am in a really tight situation so I went ahead and signed the lease. My roommate was pressured to find a place soon with how much he travels. 

I did have him dropped off at the vet by my ex girlfriend a few months ago (neuter) and they wrote him down as a belgian Shepherd. (I don't know if it's because they restricted gsd and was doing me a solid... Or couldn't tell a difference).


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## Hauhet (Aug 9, 2014)

Here's a pic of him. His hair is a little longer right now. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/v341hl231thr9n0/2013-12-17 15.43.56.jpg


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Have you tried Craiglist? I don't see how you can disguise this dog as a non-GSD.


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## kburrow11 (Jan 31, 2014)

If all else fails, you can get a letter from your doctor saying your dog is an Emotional Support Animal for you, and by law, under the Fair Housing Act, any apartment complex has to let you keep him, breed restrictions not withstanding. Even if they have a no-pets of any kind allowed policy.

Not saying it's the best solution, but it is a solution. You can look up sample letters, and get your doctor to sign one. It shouldn't take that long either.


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## sarahp (May 24, 2014)

I went through all of this this summer trying to find a place to live with my puppy I hadn't yet brought home. I was set to pick up my puppy in a week and move in 3 days after. Deposits paid in full to the apartment complex as well as my new baby. The day I picked up my little one we got a call from our apartment complex saying they were mailing our deposit back, our lease has been terminated and we needed to find a new place to live. THAT day they had changed their breed policy to include gsd's and were currently evicting the 3 families that already lived there with shepherds and they would be gone by the end of that day. In the same boat as you, it was one of the ONLY two complexes in a college town that allowed shepherds. 



kburrow11 said:


> If all else fails, you can get a letter from your doctor saying your dog is an Emotional Support Animal for you, and by law, under the Fair Housing Act, any apartment complex has to let you keep him, breed restrictions not withstanding. Even if they have a no-pets of any kind allowed policy.
> 
> Not saying it's the best solution, but it is a solution. You can look up sample letters, and get your doctor to sign one. It shouldn't take that long either.


This was the route we were thinking about going when the above story I just described happened ^^. However, I have actually had two psychiatrists for the last two years with multiple documented "illnesses" and it still would NOT have been an easy process to get him registered as an ESA. Even if I wanted to do my 14 year old cocker spaniel, getting either of them certified was going to be a super long process for me. Maybe it's a case by case but I don't know of any one that has an ESA who had an easy time getting it done. Of course getting the vest and the certification card would be easy to get ahold of, I'm sure you could pass off as one, bending the rules a bit. This was definitely an idea we had though. I have two friends who have support animals who live in apartment complexes under these same circumstances, one pit and one shepherd, who have had an extremely hard time within their neighborhood dealing with the stigma that a "mental illness" carries that people assume from seeing an ESA. It's ridiculous but one friend has been deemed "the crazy" by neighbors and people will literally cross the street to the opposite sidewalk to avoid her and her ESA. Even though she doesn't use a vest and the community managers are sworn with confidentiality, word got out somehow. This is the one reason that stopped me from registering either one of my dogs, not the time it took but the way that people perceive these animals. 
But YES, if it's your very last resort and you literally have no where else to go, this is an option. There might be a quicker way to get it through the system than the ways I went. Good luck with the search! I know the pain 
Rambling a bit because I'm lacking sleep and the "ESA and mental illness" stigma always ruffles my feathers a bit! Haha


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## DaniFani (Jan 24, 2013)

I don't know who told you he was a bicolor, he's as typical a black and tan saddle back as they come(maybe a blanket back). Good luck, finding a house is much easier than an apartment, imo.


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## Pax8 (Apr 8, 2014)

If you get a chance to get him his CGC, some insurances will make exceptions. When I was looking for apartments, this opened up two options for me that wouldn't have been possible before. Both complexes had GSD's on their restricted list, but if you provided the CGC certification to the insurance companies, they would make an exception for the dog. Something to ask around about.


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## kburrow11 (Jan 31, 2014)

@sarahp

I got a letter for my GSD stating she's an ESA. It wasn't a long process (took about 1 week to get the letter I needed) and all I had to do was provide a copy of the letter to my apartment manager so they could have it on file. As far as I know, for an ESA, you don't need a vest or ID card (but that may vary from state to state). She's in training to be an actual service dog for me, but in my state, in-training animals aren't given the rights of a full service dog or ESA as far as housing is concerned. So in order to have her in my apartment, I got the letter stating she was an ESA which covers her until she's done with her service dog training, which will be another 1 1/2 years.

The reason our experiences were so different is probably a state/apartment complex difference thing.

Also, pretty much any site/company that offers to register your ESA or service animal is a scam. Under ADA law, there is no registration process required (part of the reason why people with legitimate needs have been having more problems, since people buy the fake registration and badges and vests to pass off their pets as service dogs). For ESAs, all that is required is a letter from your doctor or therapist stating that the animal helps you in some emotional, mental, or psychological way (even mild anxiety counts). ESAs however, only count for housing and flights. You can't take them into public places like stores and restaurants because they are considered service animals.



> Emotional Support Animals
> Many individuals—both with and without disabilities—derive emotional support and comfort from dogs and other animals that are not specially trained to perform specific tasks directly related to a psychiatric disability.
> The ADA considers such “emotional support animals” to be distinct from psychiatric service dogs, and treats them differently. The ADA does not grant emotional support dog owners the same right of access to public places that it gives to individuals who use psychiatric service dogs. That means that under the ADA, a movie theater, for example, must allow psychiatric service dogs to accompany their owners into the movie auditorium but can refuse to admit individuals with emotional support dogs.
> The Difference Between a Psychiatric Service Dog and an Emotional Support Dog
> ...


Psychiatric Service Dogs & Emotional Support Animals: Access to Public Places & Other Settings | Nolo.com

Emotional Support Animals | Service Dog Central

These are just a few things to give you information, if you choose to go the ESA route


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

kburrow11 said:


> If all else fails, you can get a letter from your doctor saying your dog is an Emotional Support Animal for you, and by law, under the Fair Housing Act, any apartment complex has to let you keep him, breed restrictions not withstanding. Even if they have a no-pets of any kind allowed policy.
> 
> Not saying it's the best solution, but it is a solution. You can look up sample letters, and get your doctor to sign one. It shouldn't take that long either.


This is not true. If the insurance doesn't cover the dog they do not have to let you live there. Landlords and owners are not required to get additional insurance or look elsewhere to get the coverage.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

http://servicedogcentral.org/conten...ions related to reasonable accommodations.PDF


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## kburrow11 (Jan 31, 2014)

llombardo said:


> This is not true. If the insurance doesn't cover the dog they do not have to let you live there. Landlords and owners are not required to get additional insurance or look elsewhere to get the coverage.


Like I said, it might vary from state to state. Where I live, state law attaches breed restrictions to pet restrictions. In my state, an ESA is allowed, even if the animal is a breed restricted animal.

Fair Housing Council of Oregon - Service Animals


> It doesn't matter what you call them (service animal, assistance animal, therapy animal, companion animal, aide animal, working animal, etc.)





> Generally, you may not restrict the breeds of assistance animals but in very narrow circumstances


In Oregon they can't restrict breeds unless there is *literally* no other insurance available without the restriction. And that's only if an investigator has found that to be true, not if the housing complex has just said it. And if the investigator has found that the insurance company has a history of refusing coverage because of that breed, regardless of whether the occupants owning that breed have them as an assistance/support animal, the investigator can have the company brought before the Department of Justice under violation of civil laws regarding disability discrimination. Not sure about other states.


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## Hauhet (Aug 9, 2014)

When his hair was shorter it was all black almost. The base of the tan hair on his stomach is black. So there is just a little tan on his paws and neck. 

This apartment does seem fairly laid back... And it's huge (400 apartments). They once allowed German Shepherds and I saw a couple walking around that were grandfathered in. So I'm hoping I go unnoticed. One... Most people who do own dogs won't rat other people out. And two... People who don't own dogs may not notice the difference between Shepherd breeds or may not know that the breed is even restricted. . I'm going to send in the vet papers I have that say he's a belgian Shepherd and his training certificates. Hopefully then if someone does say something, they can reference that paperwork and it will end there. 

If there is a witch hunt... I'll remove him from my place and take him to a friend's and spend the next month looking for a new home. But I highly doubt that will happen. I think many commercial companies just want to fill a slot. If I had a pit bull which may, cause panic among certain people.... I would understand that. But I don't think people would make a fuss about GSD, akita, Chow, etc. Unless they were attacked by one at some point. 

I'm also living on the edge of the property... So that way when I take him out on a run, I'll immediately be outside of the place in a different neighborhood.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

kburrow11 said:


> Like I said, it might vary from state to state. Where I live, state law attaches breed restrictions to pet restrictions. In my state, an ESA is allowed, even if the animal is a breed restricted animal.
> 
> Fair Housing Council of Oregon - Service Animals
> 
> ...


What I posted is a federal thing and that over rides state and includes all states. Unless they, meaning the inspector can find a comparable insurance cost wise, it isn't happening. The owner is not obligated to spend more money on insurance for someone to live there. The only good thing is that the restricted breed list differs amongst states for insurance companies.


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## Hauhet (Aug 9, 2014)

llombardo said:


> What I posted is a federal thing and that over rides state and includes all states. Unless they, meaning the inspector can find a comparable insurance cost wise, it isn't happening. The owner is not obligated to spend more money on insurance for someone to live there. The only good thing is that the restricted breed list differs amongst states for insurance companies.




Yeah but don't I need to have diagnosed depression? Looking at this link... Doesn't look like I do? http://www.nsarco.com/emotional-support-confirmation.html

But I'm no expert. I may do that as a backup plan if anyone throws a fit about it. I technically am not lying because without my dog... I'd be pretty **** depressed.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Hauhet said:


> Yeah but don't I need to have diagnosed depression? Looking at this link... Doesn't look like I do? http://www.nsarco.com/emotional-support-confirmation.html
> 
> But I'm no expert. I may do that as a backup plan if anyone throws a fit about it. I technically am not lying because without my dog... I'd be pretty **** depressed.


I'm sure you have to have something. But it doesn't matter what a person has, if the insurance company doesn't cover that breed and the property owner would have to pay more to get that coverage then the dog is not allowed period.


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## sarahp (May 24, 2014)

kburrow11 said:


> @sarahp
> 
> I got a letter for my GSD stating she's an ESA. It wasn't a long process (took about 1 week to get the letter I needed) and all I had to do was provide a copy of the letter to my apartment manager so they could have it on file. As far as I know, for an ESA, you don't need a vest or ID card (but that may vary from state to state). She's in training to be an actual service dog for me, but in my state, in-training animals aren't given the rights of a full service dog or ESA as far as housing is concerned. So in order to have her in my apartment, I got the letter stating she was an ESA which covers her until she's done with her service dog training, which will be another 1 1/2 years.
> 
> ...


Huh that is fascinating I guess it does differ from state to state. I went through one of my psychiatrists and according to him it would take about a month to go through the paperwork and get an identification card for the dog. Maybe this is where states differ? Could also be apartment complexes or doctors offices that require different things? I haven't looked into it far enough to see whether or not it's required in my state, just kinda trusted my avenues and doctors. There are two men that come into my psych's office with their ESA's who went through a long process of letters. The one friend with the shepherd also had to have an ID card for her dog as was "required" by the apartment complex and also so he can travel on airlines with her. I'm working on getting Atti ESA "official" so he can accompany me on my college campus because that's where half of my problems show their ugly face. I have thought about getting him in training to be a PSA but haven't looked into it farther. There are some situations where it could be extremely helpful for me if he could preform certain tasks to help me out but I'm not sure that he's cut out for it. Might be something that happens down the road with a different dog. I'm getting by just fine right now but I know that the support of an animal would make life a million times easier in certain situations. 
Thanks for the info! I haven't done much research in the area, I've just based my knowledge in my experiences and what I've been told. I guess if I'm going to go down that road I should do some searching around


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## TigervTeMar (Jan 4, 2014)

when I moved to a new area in May I had a very, very difficult time finding a place that took large dogs. most places said no dogs, the rest had a firm weight limit. I asked a vet tech for advice and she gave me the name of the place I'm living in now. They also had a weight limit my guy was way over but the owner has a white GS and took a liking my guy and let us stay.

so my advice would be to call up or visit vet offices and talk to the staff. most of them will have pets and several are probably renting. good luck!


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## sarahp (May 24, 2014)

Hauhet said:


> Yeah but don't I need to have diagnosed depression? Looking at this link... Doesn't look like I do? http://www.nsarco.com/emotional-support-confirmation.html
> 
> But I'm no expert. I may do that as a backup plan if anyone throws a fit about it. I technically am not lying because without my dog... I'd be pretty **** depressed.


Yes, technically you do have to have *something* but that something is very loosely outlined by the ADA. It's not set out as the only people who qualify for an ESA are people who have "major depression, social anxiety or PTSD." It's outlined solely as whether or not that animal gives you emotional support, from my understanding. That's where an ESA and a PSA differ. An ESA doesn't require the dog to actually have any knowledge or special skills and doesn't have a set list of "illnesses" for the owner. If a doctor signs the paperwork, you have an ESA. but there are different laws and protections for each type of service animal and ESA's aren't given much of anything. The fine print may vary state to state. I know I can take an ESA into classes on my college campus but in other states or even schools you may not be able to. Worth looking into, especially what llombardo stated about the insurance companies of each apartment complex. One might allow it and another might not.


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## Hauhet (Aug 9, 2014)

TigervTeMar said:


> when I moved to a new area in May I had a very, very difficult time finding a place that took large dogs. most places said no dogs, the rest had a firm weight limit. I asked a vet tech for advice and she gave me the name of the place I'm living in now. They also had a weight limit my guy was way over but the owner has a white GS and took a liking my guy and let us stay.
> 
> so my advice would be to call up or visit vet offices and talk to the staff. most of them will have pets and several are probably renting. good luck!




Thanks for the info! I went ahead and signed a lease with this place. It's been next to impossible to find a place... Even houses tend to stay within their homeowners insurance. I do have renters insurance and I've never had issues with my dog. So I expect the apt to look the other way as long as he isn't causing issues (which he wont).


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Hauhet said:


> Thanks for the info! I went ahead and signed a lease with this place. It's been next to impossible to find a place... Even houses tend to stay within their homeowners insurance. I do have renters insurance and I've never had issues with my dog. So I expect the apt to look the other way as long as he isn't causing issues (which he wont).


My mom lost her coverage on her house when they found out she had a Rott. That is about the time I found out insurance companies have a breed restriction list. She lived in a single family home and the dog was never an issue , but they somehow found out about it and dropped her after many years of being with them.


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