# Could she actually be a bi-color?



## jaggirl47

OK, the older Leyna gets, the more tan she is getting on her body. She was completely black when I got her. Tell me what you think from some of the pics of her tan coloration.

She has tan "tarheels". They go up the back of both front legs starting at the back of the paw to her elbow.




































She also has tan starting on her back legs.



























She also has tan between all of her toes, front and back.










I am just wondering because I know GSD pups can change so much. Is it just possible for her to be a very dark bi?


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## ZAYDA

Personally I think you have a very black dog with a little tan but not BICOLOR. HOW OLD IS SHE?


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## jaggirl47

Thanks. 

She is a very dark black everywhere else. She also has very dark eyes to go with it. I will get some stacked pics this weekend of her.

I was just curious though because she just started getting the tan a few weeks ago. I didn't know if it may be because it's winter or if it's because she now actually has her adult fur or what. She will be 7 months on the 16th.


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## gsdraven

Does she have tan around her anus under her tail? 

If not, she is likely a black dog with bleed through.


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## jaggirl47

She has started to get a little tan around the anus as well as the inner portion of her thighs. I just didn't want to post pics of the areas. lol Trying to give my baby a little modesty.


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## gsdraven

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/general-information/145670-curious-about-coat-patterns.html Have you read this thread? It has some good information on blacks vs. bicolor. I'm sure there are others if you search.

Is she from a breeder? What did they say she was?


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## Lesley1905

I thought Brody was a bi color as well...turns out everyone thinks hes a melanistic black and tan...I agree after looking at pictures! There coats change so much while they are a puppy so its hard to tell sometimes!


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## jaggirl47

She is officially listed and registered as a black. And she was....until a few weeks ago.  I don't know if it may be because she now has her adult coat...or if it is from the winter coat..or if she is just showing tan and will keep it.

More because I am curious than anything else.


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## onyx'girl

I would also say she is a black with bleed thru. Are there any Bi's in her pedigree? If not then black would be her color for certain.


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## jaggirl47

onyx'girl said:


> I would also say she is a black with bleed thru. Are there any Bi's in her pedigree? If not then black would be her color for certain.


 
There are alot of bi-colors in her pedigree, as well as alot of black an some sables.

Here is her pedigree:

SBD Posejpal's Leyna - German shepherd dog


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## robinhuerta

My opinion FWIW....she's a black GSD.


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## jaggirl47

robinhuerta said:


> My opinion FWIW....she's a black GSD.


Your opinion is worth something .

She is my brat either way so her color doesn't really matter much either way. :wub:

I was just looking at her this morning and noticed it was getting more pronounced so I thought I would ask.


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## onyx'girl

Looking at those pedigree pics, there is one that could be a bi-color-Fatyma(she was kinda fatty looking!, though the face has tan and the legs aren't real pigmented, I'd almost say b&t. 
I would think she is a black anyway as she is just starting to show color. From what little I know Bi's have a bit of color at birth.


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## jaggirl47

onyx'girl said:


> Looking at those pedigree pics, there is one that could be a bi-color, though the face has tan and the legs aren't real pigmented, I'd almost say b&t.
> I would think she is a black anyway as she is just starting to show color. From what little I know Bi's have a bit of color at birth.


I was thinking that too about bi's, but I don't really have a full understanding of the colorations yet. I am trying to figure it out.

She does have line breeding on Held vom Ritterberg who looks to be a bi:
V Held vom Ritterberg - German shepherd dog

and Bero, who is a bi:
Bero vom Friedersdorfer Flur - German shepherd dog

Fatyma z PS looks like a bi too:
Fatyma z PS - German shepherd dog

However, I don't know lol. This coloration stuff is confusing!


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## jaggirl47

onyx'girl said:


> Looking at those pedigree pics, there is one that could be a bi-color-Fatyma(she was kinda fatty looking!, though the face has tan and the legs aren't real pigmented, I'd almost say b&t.
> I would think she is a black anyway as she is just starting to show color. From what little I know Bi's have a bit of color at birth.


 
Maybe that's why her name is Fatyma lol.

She looks prego in the pic though.


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## onyx'girl

I thought so too, or just had a litter...her name fit whatever the case!


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## Deuce

She looks like a Black German Shepherd to me


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## Chris Wild

Black with bleed through. Tan markings on the feet and legs sometimes develop on solid blacks as they grow. Doesn't make them a bi-color. Though the way to know for certain is as simple as checking the anal vent. On bi-colors that area will be tan. On a solid black it will be black.


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## jaggirl47

Hey Chris! I was hoping you would jump in. I was reading the other post with your dogs and bleed through.

I will see if I can get Leyna to stay still enough to get a booty pic.


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## lhczth

Held actually was not a BI. Just a very well blanketed b/t. I can't see Bero well enough, but he is listed as just a b/t. I think Fatyma is a BI, but my settings make the photo not as clear as I would like (more speed, but not good photo quality) and she is not in my database.


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## jaggirl47

OK, here are the booty pics. 

They are not the best, but she was looking at me like I lost my mind. lol


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## JakodaCD OA

all I can say is poor Leyna LOL, does she know your posting pics of her butt on the net? LOL


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## jaggirl47

JakodaCD OA said:


> all I can say is poor Leyna LOL, does she know your posting pics of her butt on the net? LOL


 
She was looking at me like I lost my mind! :silly:


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## NarysDad

Kendra, Her sire Faust has the same thing on the legs and does have this on his behind also. I always thought it was bleed thru until reading some of the posts here. Now with her Dam Pandora, she had just developed bleed thru almost 2 years ago this spring, but doesn't have any color around her behind. I purchased Faust when he was 7 yrs old and he had his color already so I don't know when he developed it. 

I know that Car Policia & Titus z Pohranicni Straze were black dogs and as for Bero and Held their pictures really are not good enough quality to see well.

Pandora comes from Faro Policia which is a black sable and her dam Lena Ceperkov was black As for Lena's sire and dam I have no photo's of them to determine what color they were.


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## jaggirl47

NarysDad said:


> Kendra, Her sire Faust has the same thing on the legs and does have this on his behind also. I always thought it was bleed thru until reading some of the posts here. Now with her Dam Pandora, she had just developed bleed thru almost 2 years ago this spring, but doesn't have any color around her behind. I purchased Faust when he was 7 yrs old and he had his color already so I don't know when he developed it.
> 
> I know that Car Policia & Titus z Pohranicni Straze were black dogs and as for Bero and Held their pictures really are not good enough quality to see well.
> 
> Pandora comes from Faro Policia which is a black sable and her dam Lena Ceperkov was black As for Lena's sire and dam I have no photo's of them to determine what color they were.


 
I tried to do a search for pics of them and google disappointed me. 
I was reading Linda Shaw's description and I can't tell, but it makes me wonder.

3. Rich Bicolour, Melanistic Bicolour, faded bicolour.
Typically, the bicolour is a black dog with tan points much the same as a doberman. It is in fact the same gene. A very dark one with a strong black mask and much extension of the black may appear to be solid black, with a black undercoat and only some tan shading on the feet. Theoretically, bicolours always show tan around the vent, but I have seen a virtually black dog with just enough tan around the vent (and between the toes) to suspect that it was a bicolour, but not enough to be sure. However, a pale bicolour can look strikingly like a black sable, showing much black over a light grey undercoat, with tan or grey over the nape of the neck and along the harness lines, and black markings on the legs and feet. These dogs have the genetics for fading of the black mantle, and while they can still appear dark to the eye, will produce colour fading. 
Illustrated Standard of the German Shepherd Dog, COLOR & PIGMENT

It's so confusing. I may see if I can have her tested to find out what the genetics say.


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## SchDDR

Ask Karen.


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## jaggirl47

SchDDR said:


> Ask Karen.


 
hehe I plan on picking her brain tomorrow. Either way, when she goes in to get her prelim xrays in March, I am going to have blood sent off to test what her genes are.


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## SchDDR

When I was looking at that pup of Jean's, Jean and I were both saying solid black.
It was Karen who caught the hint of bicolor at 4 weeks old.

A year later, that dog is a very gorgeous bicolor. 

[Whatever Leyna is, I love that little hellraiser.]


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## jaggirl47

SchDDR said:


> When I was looking at that pup of Jean's, Jean and I were both saying solid black.
> It was Karen who caught the hint of bicolor at 4 weeks old.
> 
> A year later, that dog is a very gorgeous bicolor.
> 
> [Whatever Leyna is, I love that little hellraiser.]


Well, you do know her "affectionate" name is brat. lol
I figured I would bring it up tomorrow after tracking when Karen can get a good look at her. When you see her again in the morning, you will be able to see how pronounced it has gotten since last week.


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## jaggirl47

Leyna has changed even more overnight. The tan is now starting to come up on the front of her front legs.
Is it possible to go from what we thought was a black pup to bicolor at 6 months?


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## ctemp

*Bi-color*

Miss Jagirl, as mentioned before, if there are tan hairs around the anus of an otherwise black pup, it is not going to be a black GSD, but a bi-color or, rarely, a sable. 

This color shows up immediately or within minutes after whelping, so if you purchased your pretty girl from a breeder, and you ordered and paid for a black GSD, you need to have a serious conversation with that breeder. I understand the pup is registered as a black? Did the breeder register the pup?

Best of luck with your little girl.


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## jaggirl47

ctemp said:


> Miss Jagirl, as mentioned before, if there are tan hairs around the anus of an otherwise black pup, it is not going to be a black GSD, but a bi-color or, rarely, a sable.
> 
> This color shows up immediately or within minutes after whelping, so if you purchased your pretty girl from a breeder, and you ordered and paid for a black GSD, you need to have a serious conversation with that breeder. I understand the pup is registered as a black? Did the breeder register the pup?
> 
> Best of luck with your little girl.


 
First off, she always was all black...until recently. Even at our club today it was a noticable change from last week.
Second, I didn't purchase a pup because of her color. I purchased her because she was the perfect match for me and what I am training her for.
As far as the registration, the litter was registered and I did the individual registry.
And finally. she could be a black with some bleed through or she could be a very dark bi-color. No way to know until I get her tested for her genetics.
Either way, I could care less what color she is. She could be orange for all I care. She would still be the same brat girl that she is now. This was only out of curiosity.


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## onyx'girl

I wonder why the drastic color change. A black will not bleed thru so quickly?
Have you changed her diet or anything? As she is only 6 months, I find it kind of unusual.


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## jaggirl47

onyx'girl said:


> I wonder why the drastic color change. A black will not bleed thru so quickly?
> Have you changed her diet or anything? As she is only 6 months, I find it kind of unusual.


 
I have never had a black GSD before so I really don't know about the bleed through. I have not changed her diet, schedule, nothing.

She started getting tan between her toes when she was around 11 or 12 weeks. I didn't see any other areas with tan. Was it possible for me to miss it? Sure. Could it be because she is losing her puppy coat and getting her adult coat? Yes. Who knows. Until I get her tested I will just keep watching her. 

I hope SchDDR comes on tonight and writes what she saw because it is noticable now.


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## NarysDad

ctemp said:


> Miss Jagirl, as mentioned before, if there are tan hairs around the anus of an otherwise black pup, it is not going to be a black GSD, but a bi-color or, rarely, a sable.
> 
> This color shows up immediately or within minutes after whelping, so if you purchased your pretty girl from a breeder, and you ordered and paid for a black GSD, you need to have a serious conversation with that breeder. I understand the pup is registered as a black? Did the breeder register the pup?
> 
> Best of luck with your little girl.


This litter was born black and even at the time of shipping Leyna out to Jaggirl she was black. I have been in contact with her since this has come up unlike some breeders that stick their heads in the sand the first time problems arise. 

Although it is rather strange that you come here and decide to make this your first post

Sorry Kendra I just needed to clear the air before things started to get out of hand.

I took a good look at Pepsi ( Leyna's litter mate)today and found tan between her toes, but she doesn't show any color on any other part of her body. Then I went out to Faust and Pandora's runs and checked out Faust first and found bleed thru on the backs of his legs and around his anal area also. He was breed surveyed in the Czech Republic and was listed as a black.

Now after looking over Pandora as I stated before she had developed bleed thru only on the backs of her legs and not around the anal area. I will be making a call to AKC to find out what should be done about the color she was registered as and will let you know what they had said


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## jaggirl47

NarysDad said:


> This litter was born black and even at the time of shipping Leyna out to Jaggirl she was black. I have been in contact with her since this has come up unlike some breeders that stick their heads in the sand the first time problems arise.
> 
> Although it is rather strange that you come here and decide to make this your first post
> 
> Sorry Kendra I just needed to clear the air before things started to get out of hand.
> 
> I took a good look at Pepsi ( Leyna's litter mate)today and found tan between her toes, but she doesn't show any color on any other part of her body. Then I went out to Faust and Pandora's runs and checked out Faust first and found bleed thru on the backs of his legs and around his anal area also. He was breed surveyed in the Czech Republic and was listed as a black.
> 
> Now after looking over Pandora as I stated before she had developed bleed thru only on the backs of her legs and not around the anal area. I will be making a call to AKC to find out what should be done about the color she was registered as and will let you know what they had said


 
Chuck, I wouldn't worry about that person. We both know who it was.

Now, onto what you wrote lol. This isn't a problem. This is just me noticing new colors on the brat. But then, I talk to you so much you know how I stay on top of any changes in her and update you constantly. 

By the way, Leyna sends a bite your way. lol


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## SchDDR

jaggirl47 said:


> I hope SchDDR comes on tonight and writes what she saw because it is noticable now.


 You're fired. 

It is really, really dramatic.
I didn't even feel like I was looking at the same pup.

Same obnoxious, mouthy ****-raiser, but where the heck did all that tan come from? She has more tan between her toes than my sable!

She went from a jet-black dog, to a dog with pronounced tan between the toes, on her legs, and the vent. To look at her right now, without any other knowledge of her, I'd say a black dog with bleed through- but knowing that this has cropped up literally within a matter of weeks, with the most pronounced changes happening within DAYS [I just saw this pup 7 days ago, for chrissakes!]... 

I hardly know what to think. If she continues on at this rate, she will have the *appearance* of a bicolor, regardless of what she is genetically, that's for sure.


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## NarysDad

That is just to funny to hear this, as I have never heard of a black dog turning to a Bi color 6 months later although I have seen some things with this breed that made me wonder. If you would see Leyna's littermate you would have thought they were twins up til now...lol


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## jaggirl47

SchDDR said:


> You're fired.
> 
> It is really, really dramatic.
> I didn't even feel like I was looking at the same pup.
> 
> Same obnoxious, mouthy ****-raiser, but where the heck did all that tan come from? She has more tan between her toes than my sable!
> 
> She went from a jet-black dog, to a dog with pronounced tan between the toes, on her legs, and the vent. To look at her right now, without any other knowledge of her, I'd say a black dog with bleed through- but knowing that this has cropped up literally within a matter of weeks, with the most pronounced changes happening within DAYS [I just saw this pup 7 days ago, for chrissakes!]...
> 
> I hardly know what to think. If she continues on at this rate, she will have the *appearance* of a bicolor, regardless of what she is genetically, that's for sure.


No, you're fired. Haha
On a side note.....I got some good pics of Danke today. I will have a disc for you next week.


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## LaRen616

My Sinister was solid black until he was 7-8 months old. He got silver between his toes, some light silver on the back of his legs and silver by his butt. He also has some red hair under his belly but you cant really see it unless the sun is hitting it. He looks solid black until you start examining him.


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## Whiteshepherds

I think you need to post a close up of her face to offset the close up shots of her butt. Only seems fair.


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## Dainerra

I must say, this has been the FUNNIEST thing I've read since I don't know when...


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## BlackthornGSD

Fun thread. 

My theory is that the recessive black gene in GSDs is actually more of a melanistic gene, like the gene that would cause a black jaguar. It's a gene for heavy distribution of melanin, which would be why one gene for black causes heavier coverage of black on a dog. Two genes for black cause even heavier coverage, so much that the dog appears solid black. This sort of explanation of the recessive black gene makes it much more understandable that you might have a bicolor with such heavy black coverage the dog appears black; or also that you might perhaps have a black dog who has bleedthrough of the tan that is overlaid by the black.

If the dog had the gene for dominant solid black (as in a black lab), then as I understand it, it would mean that all hairs on the body are black--there are NO brown hairs. There might be white--but that is from the white spotting gene. So that would create an expectation of a "solid black" dog that actually is one solid color. But that is not the black gene that we (generally) see in the GSDs.


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## Chris Wild

Tan around the anal vent can develop as a part of bleed through.

If she were a bi-color, it would have been there at birth. If it is just developing recently, then she is black with bleed through.

While this amount of bleed through at this age isn't common, it's not unheard of either. This isn't something that always waits until adulthood to happen. I've seen quite a bit of bleed through on pups as young as a year, enough that I'd have questioned upon seeing them if they were very melanistic bi-colors if I hadn't known indeed that they were genetically solid blacks.


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## boeselager

My imports are registered as solid black, but do have tan hair between their toes. That is the Only place where they have tan though. Their mother is black/tan and their father is black, but they have a lot of black/tans in their pedigree. I guess I would only worry if she continues to get more tan and she is registered as a black. That would be my only concern about the registration.


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## Dainerra

Chris, very interesting information. So, unless the tan is there at birth, the dog is considered a black? And nothing uncommon about getting tan around the vent when the adult coat comes in?

I know that their colors can change so much!


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## Chris Wild

Dainerra said:


> Chris, very interesting information. So, unless the tan is there at birth, the dog is considered a black? And nothing uncommon about getting tan around the vent when the adult coat comes in?
> 
> I know that their colors can change so much!


Yes, genetically the dog IS a black. Just some blacks don't have complete pigment expression so there is some bleed through.

In the 4 solid blacks we have owned, we've seen both. 2 that were all black, never developed any tan anywhere. One is now 6 and the other 11 and both are solid black. 2 others that developed bleed through. Della's started around a year old, she's now 5 and has quite a bit of tan on her feet and legs. Though still not enough that anyone would question her being bi-color. Kali, who we lost last year, didn't start developing bleed through until 5 years old and by 8 or so almost did look like a bi-color with tan not only on her feet and legs but also around the vent and little spots on her chest and belly. All are genetically solid black, but not all solid blacks are always solid black.


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## lhczth

I agree with Christine. That might also explain why black to black to black for many generations seems to produce blacker blacks. Personally I don't believe a true black gene exists in our breed and if it does it is extremely rare. In horses the only thing considered black is a solid black with no bleed through. Any shading or brown coming through and they are no longer considered black (though there are two types of blacks, fading and non fading). 

My black male has tan between his toes, up the back of his front legs and on the inside of his back. He is a breeding between a black and a b/t dog that carries black. We have another black in our club that has even more bleed through and tan now around his anus. He is by a black X a dark sable that carries black. Another black (1/2 sister to my male) only has a tiny bit of tan between a couple of toes. She is by a heavily blanketed (melanistic) b/t that carries black X the b/t that carries black.


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## BlackthornGSD

lhczth said:


> I agree with Christine. That might also explain why black to black to black for many generations seems to produce blacker blacks. Personally I don't believe a true black gene exists in our breed and if it does it is extremely rare. In horses the only thing considered black is a solid black with no bleed through. Any shading or brown coming through and they are no longer considered black (though there are two types of blacks, fading and non fading).


I believe that this dominant black gene is now back in the breed via Russian show dogs. Take a look at this pedigree, the line of solid blacks going back, the likelihood that he will produce black in the breedings that have been done with him, the number of solid black progeny, and even the likelihood that he or his siblings would have been black.

12V UA,12V RUS Vogerland Shaytan - German shepherd dog


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## selzer

Puppy pornography -- I never thought I would see it about coat color though...

And here I am thinking that people with solid colored dogs do not have all the coat changes to worry about. Now I am thinking solid color dog people have more in a way. I mean, we expect to see tan parts. We just do not know how much tan will come out at the end of the day.


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## robinhuerta

Christine,
I really like that dog Shayton...I actually looked into importing a solid black female from him.
My biggest concern is he is a solid black from a b/t & black parent....but his pedigree is primarily b/t....
Being a solid black from predominately SLs....I asked if the dog has DNA registered with the SV....I have not received a reply.
I would love to import something from him in the future.....but I would need some form of proof of DNA with lineage. (what I have read about the black gene, causes me to be a little skeptic and cautious).
*I think he is absolutely handsome!


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## PaddyD

Do 2 colors make a bi-color? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
My black and tan has a lot of silver on her, is she a tri-color?


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## onyx'girl

A bi-color is genetic, one of the dogs has to carry the gene for it to show.


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## NarysDad

This has been a rather learning experience with this litter. Jaggirl's Leyna has so much color, but her littermates don't. Faust has about the same on his legs and around his anus area also and was breed surveyed overseas as a black. Now her litter mate Pepsi has color only between her toes and their dam Pandora was jet black when I purchased her and @ 4 yrs old developed bleed thru


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## jaggirl47

I think regardless that I am going to have her genetics tested. Then I can actually find out if she is A+B+C or whatever.  I think I will just have the vet draw the blood when she goes in March for her prelim xrays.
As far as the tan around her anus, I never noticed it before. It is possible to have missed it and it is possible that she may have just popped up with it.
Either way, black, bi-color, green, blue...it's all pretty interesting and I am learning alot.
When I get her tests done, I will post them in this section.

And, as requested.....the brat's beautiful face.


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## BlackthornGSD

Is there DNA color testing in GSDs? If so, where from?


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## Whiteshepherds

jaggirl47 said:


> And, as requested.....the brat's beautiful face.


She's a lot prettier on this end.


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## jaggirl47

BlackthornGSD said:


> Is there DNA color testing in GSDs? If so, where from?


VetGen - Veterinary Genetic Services

Here is the price list:
https://www.vetgen.com/documents/Price List Sorted by Breed.pdf

And a really good explanation:
VetGen: Veterinary Genetic Services - Canine - List of Services - Coat Color

And yes, she is much cuter from the tooth end :wub:


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## BlackthornGSD

jaggirl47 said:


> VetGen - Veterinary Genetic Services
> 
> Here is the price list:
> https://www.vetgen.com/documents/Price List Sorted by Breed.pdf
> 
> And a really good explanation:
> VetGen: Veterinary Genetic Services - Canine - List of Services - Coat Color
> 
> And yes, she is much cuter from the tooth end :wub:


Oh, very cool. Looks like they don't yet distinguish between what we GSD people know as the black and tan and the bicolor patterns, although, from what I've read, current thinking does separate them.

It will be interesting to read what you find out after doing the testing.


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## jaggirl47

BlackthornGSD said:


> Oh, very cool. Looks like they don't yet distinguish between what we GSD people know as the black and tan and the bicolor patterns, although, from what I've read, current thinking does separate them.
> 
> It will be interesting to read what you find out after doing the testing.


It won't be for a couple more months, but I am very curious. I plan on doing the tests for e, mask, Ay, and a.


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## NarysDad

Kendra I will let you know what AKC says tomorrow about what should be done about the coloring in the registration papers


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## SchDDR

Whiteshepherds said:


> She's a lot prettier on this end.


Isn't she though?

Just don't try to give her a kiss. She's a little alligator.

Whatever color she is, she's a really nice pup.


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## jaggirl47

SchDDR said:


> Isn't she though?
> 
> Just don't try to give her a kiss. She's a little alligator.
> 
> Whatever color she is, she's a really nice pup.


 
Awww, thank you. Gues what she did tonight? A really good job heeling.


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## NarysDad

SchDDR said:


> Isn't she though?
> 
> Just don't try to give her a kiss. She's a little alligator.
> 
> Whatever color she is, she's a really nice pup.


And her litter mate here is just like her minus the extra coloring. This litter has been quite a learning experience though


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## Chris Wild

I've often wondered if recessive black didn't work on background color in the same manner Christine mentioned, such as would be seen in black leopards, jaguars, etc...

Though the simple genetic concept of low or incomplete penetrance causing a dog to not exhibit the gene fully would also explain bleed through in some blacks and allow for the recessive to work the way everyone has always assumed it does.

Both would explain why black to black breedings produce blacker blacks with less likelihood of bleed through.

While interesting, I really don't think it matters. As far as registration papers, neither AKC nor anyone else is going to give a hoot if a dog registered as black has some tan on it that developed later. If anything, I think color on registration papers should for research and breeding purposes as accurately as possible reflect the genotype of the dog, regardless of whether phenotype fully matches that. In otherwords, if a dog is genetically black, whether it has some bleed through or not it should be registered as black.


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## Dainerra

Chris, would the same idea be used for Red/Black vs Black/Tan? Rayden's sire was a R/B and his mother a B/T - all the litter save one was B/T. By the time they were 2, however, the lone Red/Black pup was actually lighter tan than the others. 

The breeder said that it's not uncommon (though they usually don't lighten THAT much) and that all you can go by is what color they are when they are born.


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## Chris Wild

As far as black/red vs black/tan this is a different situation than black vs bi-color.

Both black/tan and black/red are from a genetics standpoint the same. Both are black/tan. The only difference is in hue of the tan pigment, some being more red, others more cream. Just like my blue eyes may be a different shade of blue from someone else's, but from a genetics standpoint we are both blue eyed, not brown or hazel. Same thing with the dogs, the *color* of the dog is still black/tan. Honestly, for AKC to have all the different variants on black/tan on their registration forms is incorrect from a genetics standpoint. They don't represent different colors, any more than a blanket pattern and saddle pattern are different colors. All are black/tan and it would not be incorrect to register them as such.

Whereas black and bi-color are two separate colors with very different genetics.


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## Dainerra

got you! I thought that they were different, since they were different options. So they are actually the same, just different shades of tan.

Love days when I actually learn something.


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## jaggirl47

One thing that has interested me over this past week of constant reading is that there are many GSD's that are thought to be genetically black. However, once tested they are actual bi-colors with a heavier masking gene causing them to look like they are black.
All of this has been extremely interesting and a total learning process for me. Like I said before, I really don't care what her color is. I am going to do the genetic testing though because I really am curious now.


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## BlackthornGSD

jaggirl47 said:


> One thing that has interested me over this past week of constant reading is that there are many GSD's that are thought to be genetically black. However, once tested they are actual bi-colors with a heavier masking gene causing them to look like they are black.
> All of this has been extremely interesting and a total learning process for me. Like I said before, I really don't care what her color is. I am going to do the genetic testing though because I really am curious now.


That's interesting--where'd you read this?


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## jaggirl47

BlackthornGSD said:


> That's interesting--where'd you read this?


 
The first mention I saw was by Linda Shaw on her description of the color standard. So, I started digging more into it. When I get a few extra minutes, I will do another search and find the links again.


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## dukethegsd

Duke is a bi color he has a black belly tan legs tar heels and toe penciling with tan eyebrows and two tan spots on his cheeks almost that like a rottie or doby. he was the same at 8 weeks when i got him also he has tan under the tail. i had a black and tan shepherd after Samson past i did a little browsing on the internet and seen a bi color had no idea that gsd's came in this color i thought this is beautiful so i found one that was well bread good hips, temperament, and overall health best dog i have ever had.


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