# Harness or collar?



## critterlady (Mar 20, 2014)

I am working on leash training with Zeus, I started out using a harness, but we went to puppy kindergarten last night and the trainer told me to use a collar instead. He pulls on both, but seems worse on the collar, I want to make sure I am using the right thing to ensure his success, any input would be greatly appreciated, thanks!!

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## DJEtzel (Feb 11, 2010)

If I'm working with a puppy, I train them on what I ultimately want them to walk on, and I walk them to get it out of the way on whatever is easiest (that is not the same as the ultimate).

So I may take a dog on a walk and let them pull sometimes to get it over with, on a harness or prong collar. But I want him to walk great on a flat collar, ultimately, so when I take time to train the loose leash walking, I clip the leash to the flat collar so that he learns that the collar is absolutely never ok to pull in- because I have the time to reinforce/stop during training if he decides to, whereas he is allowed to pull in the harness because I don't have time to do training that moment.

Make sense?


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## Serbrider (Jan 30, 2014)

I am using a collar for Arya. I did however just buy a harness today, which I won't be using to walk her, but for her to wear during training/work/out in public. The leash won't be connected to it, but it'll eventually (once I order/make them) have patches with "in training" and then a separate one for "therapy dog" once she passes her test at a year old. She won't be wearing the harness when we're at the park having fun or on a general day/time out... but I'm wanting to train her that when she's wearing the harness, she really needs to focus on me and it's "more important" than normally.

But for everyday walking, whatever you feel comfortable with, in either you are still training loose leash walking.


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## Bequavious (Mar 9, 2013)

I like what DJEtzel was saying about his method, but I wanted to add that if your dog is a hard puller, a flat collar puts the most pressure on the throat. Martingales, slip collars, and prongs distribute the pressure of the pull around the entire neck, and harnesses generally put all of the pressure on the chest. Now since he's a young puppy, he's probably not strong enough to do any serious damage (especially since you're working on training him) but I just figured I'd throw that out there just in case


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## critterlady (Mar 20, 2014)

So if I use a collar, should I use something such as a martingale or one of the others mentioned?

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## Serbrider (Jan 30, 2014)

I don't personally because I don't have a puller and I don't live near a pet store where I could easily go buy one in my spare time (could order, but haven't had the need to), but it is a great thing for dogs who try to start pulling, or to avoid the "slip and gone" moves.


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Check here post 8.  
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/general-behavior/431289-new-dog-very-challenging.html


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

How old is your puppy?

I only like harnesses on my younger pups and that's whats on Osin now.

Only later when they are too big for me to handle and the 'real' obedience starts do I use a training collar in classes (or when training). 

Can be hard on a young pups neck if you use a collar and they are really pulling.


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## wyoung2153 (Feb 28, 2010)

I personally am not a fan of the harness for a puller.. because IME it has encouraged the pulling and they tend to have more power with it. 

I like flats and prongs. Right now we use both. Before the prong it was a flat and he did moderately well after training with it. Simple stop when pulled until he sat by me and then continue walking, then stop whenhe pulls, repeat.. some aren't that simple and that was SO annoying to do but in the end it worked for us, once he got the idea that he didn't get to pull to go on walks.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

wyoung2153, for ADULT dogs, I'm all on board with NOT liking a harness (unless it's the no pull type).

But for puppies, a regular flat collar has that same amount of force wrapped right around their poor necks while they figure out the training or when just out for a walk. 

Heck, my puppy can pull away on her harness and I have no trouble teaching and holding her and am certainly not getting dragged around. I'll move onto the 'no pull' harness for general getting around when she is bigger/stronger. And if she's 6+ months old and I need to start moving to the prong for classes then I'm fine with that too....


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## critterlady (Mar 20, 2014)

Zeus is almost 15 weeks old. When I started walking him on the collar instead of the harness he pulled to the point he choked himself a couple times, he doesn't pull as bad now, but still does, he's highly distracted, he loves to chase leaves.

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## wyoung2153 (Feb 28, 2010)

MaggieRoseLee said:


> wyoung2153, for ADULT dogs, I'm all on board with NOT liking a harness (unless it's the no pull type).
> 
> But for puppies, a regular flat collar has that same amount of force wrapped right around their poor necks while they figure out the training or when just out for a walk.
> 
> Heck, my puppy can pull away on her harness and I have no trouble teaching and holding her and am certainly not getting dragged around. I'll move onto the 'no pull' harness for general getting around when she is bigger/stronger. And if she's 6+ months old and I need to start moving to the prong for classes then I'm fine with that too....


Definitely can see that actually!

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## nktigger99 (Aug 22, 2006)

I am doing both.....a regular step in harness and a flat collar. I tried the easy walker and she did not like it. 

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## Bequavious (Mar 9, 2013)

MaggieRoseLee said:


> wyoung2153, for ADULT dogs, I'm all on board with NOT liking a harness (unless it's the no pull type).
> 
> But for puppies, a regular flat collar has that same amount of force wrapped right around their poor necks while they figure out the training or when just out for a walk.
> 
> Heck, my puppy can pull away on her harness and I have no trouble teaching and holding her and am certainly not getting dragged around. I'll move onto the 'no pull' harness for general getting around when she is bigger/stronger. And if she's 6+ months old and I need to start moving to the prong for classes then I'm fine with that too....



Yes, this! The main purpose for prongs and head halters and front clip harness, etc. is that these tools give the person more leverage over strong dogs. A regular harness gives the dog the most leverage, but with a little pup they're still quite easy to control.

My earlier point about the various collars was simply that a lot of people think a flat collar is the safest option for their strong pulling dog, but it can actually be one of the most damaging.


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## augerk (Aug 31, 2013)

For my shepherd/lab mix I use a gentle leader. It works fantastic!!! It does however take a while for them to get used to because it goes around their snout, but it lets them know you are in control when you walk. 


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