# How many of you own a dog like mine?



## Cferg (8 mo ago)

First time poster here long time lurker. To start I don’t own a shepherd I have a 20 month old female Doberman. I came here because your forum has alot more active posters and owners that align with my training style and overall attitude of owning a dog. No offense to the fur baby crowd.
Now about my dog Stassi. I got her at 10weeks old from a breeder. Not a great one. But I have to admit I learned a lot about what I want in my next breeder after owning my current dog. I started immediately training after I got her. Mainly focus and engagement work along with general house manners and crate training. Mostly positive for the first 6 months or so. I’m self employed so I was feeding through training for the probably the first year 3 meals a day. At 4 months old I started training 5-6 days a week early morning at lowes soon as they opened [email protected] ,on my way to work. Mainly focus training and reinforcing the freeshaped obedience behaviors we did at home. Also the few people that were there was good for distance socialization and distractions when asking for obedience.
Stassi was never a very social pup. She tolerated people but rarely approached them for a pet. Then at 4 or 5 months old she had a bad interaction with someone. Trying to keep this story short my wife was in the garage with our dog on a leash. Neighbors small dog got off leash came running into our garage. My dog had no problem with the dog. But the owner was screaming and yelling for his dog. He even fell down on his way running into the garage on the snow and ice. You can imagine the little dog is running around barking with him swiping at it trying to grab it. And my dogs reaction to the guy? Let’s just say it was the first time she used her big girl bark. 
I know this event isn’t the reason my dog became reactive and dislikes people other than my family. It was just the first event that put her over her threshold.
After that event if someone came within her bubble of 10 feet or so she would be reactive and aggressive. Unless someone is on my property or comes up to the vehicle. Then it’s on sight. She is 95% with the leave it command if I see someone coming to the house before she does. 
So after a year of keeping her under obedience when out and about maintaining her focus on me. And staying under threshold. We are able to go into stores without a leash. Just the ecollar for a safety net. I can get helped from store employees talk to other customers and my dog will tolerate people in her space. Now people at my house is kind of another story. She is way more edgy and on guard. I have to keep a little more space between her and guests.
Now for the last seven days we have been out in front of my vacation house. For hours at a time, I make her stay on her place while out there. And if someone comes up and talks to me she will maintain her place command but will grumble and low growl. But won’t break it. 
Now for the situation that happened recently that bothers me. Me and the family went down to the lake with our dog. I had her on leash we walked for awhile. She was wearing her ecollar. So I decided to let her off leash. I gave her the break command and took the leash off. She ran around us for a little bit almost getting the zoomies. Then took off like a laser towards 3 twenty something males. I totally failed as an owner/handler she charged then circled barking at them. With some pretty forward aggression little more teeth out than she might usually display when barking at someone. I recalled her back and apologized to the guys. 
So I guess my question is does anyone have a dog that can relate to my situation? Meaning a dog that they can have good control over. But left to her own decisions. Would be a total nightmare?
Sorry for the long post. I can answer any questions about her general temperment, environmentals, or how she reacts in situations. Or if you have anymore questions or need clarification on exactly what I’m getting at. Just ask


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## herojig (Apr 3, 2013)

Well, I live in a world far far away, and all I have to offer is that _dog will be dog - or a trained and well-behaved dog._ Nothing sounds unusual for the breed and an apparent lack of socialization your dog suffers with humans. Dog will protect the pack (only) in this situation. Show your dog a reason to love ALL humans. And personally, I don't think an e-collar does that. Dog is not dumb, he knows who made that thing.


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## banzai555 (Sep 2, 2019)

Sounds exactly like Willow. 

Home and away are two different situations. At home, she will bark at anyone who approaches. If she's not leashed or restrained she will charge people, most notably the mailman delivering a package to my house a few months ago, for which I apologized profusely. 

On walks or otherwise away from home, she will tolerate people coming up to us, but she is not friendly. She doesn't want people to pet her or even look at her, and if they do, she may low-growl and skulk away. Sometimes she will approach people to sniff them but if they try to pet her she'll shrink away. But I can have her with me in public spaces, leashed or not, and as long as I tell people to leave her alone, everybody's fine. 

When I have people in my home, she's definitely uncomfortable. I usually have to put her in my bedroom until the visitors are settled, or she'll growl and bark at them. Once they're settled, I can let her out to meet people---she definitely wants to know who these people are in her home, and is usually okay with it, eventually, though still not super happy about it. Then if that person goes outside and comes back in, the whole charade starts all over again. 

It's tough, yeah. It sucks to not have a super-social-friendly dog, but at the same time...she's a German shepherd! And yours is a Doberman! They're not _supposed _to be friendly with strangers; they're supposed to be watchful guardians, loyal to their families. Sounds like your dog's breeding wasn't the best--neither was mine--and my impression from reading about other people's dogs on this forum is that solid breeding can avert the worst of the reactivity, meaning a dog might not be thrilled about people in their home but they'll be stable and accepting if you tell them to be. The fact that your dog won't break "place" even when sorely tempted, to me, is awesome. 

Anyway, it sounds like you can keep up the training and some of this might also resolve a bit as she matures...she's 20 months, basically a teenager. Willow is almost 6 and I've more or less accepted how she is, taking my victories when I can and managing the things I can't train out of her.


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## Bknmaizey (Sep 16, 2019)

You can’t generalize from the one experience with those 3 guys, but obviously not a good sign to take off and encircle them. Obviously there is more going on.

If I let my dog off leash like that she’d happily take off and chase things based on prey drive (including children most likely) but she wouldn’t chase after a stranger just to antagonize them (I wouldn’t be so quick to call it aggression but maybe a stranger-danger fight or flight response (fight in this case) coupled with possessiveness in your presence). I’ve never let that happen and we’re not yet working on off-leash training in public so I can’t speak from experience on that. If you have the ecollar proofed and it worked, at least you have that going for you.

You probably want to get a trainer and spring for some sessions to get a professional assessment and then to work on that specific situation with their support. At that age, she’s young but not so young that it’s allowable. If you can’t nip it in the bud, then it might curtail your ability to allow her off-leash.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

I can relate. My shepherd is genetically fearful of people and left to his own devices would put on a big noisy show for anyone near our property line. When he was younger he would react out in public too.
I may be misunderstanding how you keep him under threshold, because it reads more like he's being flooded with stimulus which would be stressful all of the time. He's under your control but never actually feels safe.
What worked well for my particular dog was lots of exposure at a good distance. When I did stop to interact I would have him sit then stand in front of him so he learned to relax and not worry about contact with a stranger. This worked so well if I was gabbing away for longer than a minute or two he would plop down and nap,lol.
At home I used to have him behind a gate to observe but not interact when we had visitors. When it was obvious he was chill the gate was removed so he could mingle if he chose. Eventually he decided visitors indoors were not scary at all. He continues to be very territorial outdoors and wears an e collar so I can feel confident to call him back when a critter or a human has the audacity to breach the perimeter. I can't remember the last time he was stimmed.When I see him perk up I call him back and toss him a ball and praise him, then either have him lay down or we'll walk away in the opposite direction.
Having your dog in place for hours? Seems stress/anxiety inducing to me.What I would do with my particular dog is to walk him around the boundaries while he sniffed around and spend some time playing interspersed with some obedience. Just getting relaxed,comfortable, and feeling safe there.
So anyway, I put a lot of thought into immediately stopping the adrenaline surge and what position or activity was calming for him. A person with more experience than I could've got faster results, but no regrets as I learned so much from my boy.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

herojig said:


> Well, I live in a world far far away, and all I have to offer is that _dog will be dog - or a trained and well-behaved dog._ Nothing sounds unusual for the breed and an apparent lack of socialization your dog suffers with humans. Dog will protect the pack (only) in this situation. Show your dog a reason to love ALL humans. And personally, I don't think an e-collar does that. Dog is not dumb, he knows who made that thing.


Most people wouldn’t describe taking a puppy around hundreds or thousands of people before they are a year old. An apparent lack of socialization. The only situation I can think of that would’ve exposed my dog to more people is if I lived in a downtown urban environment and didn’t own a car. 
I’ve marked and rewarded her for being neutral in thousands of situations and corrected her for not being also. I’m quite clear what is desired from her. But I’m just taken aback by the fact if I let her do what she wants she chooses aggression immediately.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

dogma13 said:


> I can relate. My shepherd is genetically fearful of people and left to his own devices would put on a big noisy show for anyone near our property line. When he was younger he would react out in public too.
> I may be misunderstanding how you keep him under threshold, because it reads more like he's being flooded with stimulus which would be stressful all of the time. He's under your control but never actually feels safe.
> What worked well for my particular dog was lots of exposure at a good distance. When I did stop to interact I would have him sit then stand in front of him so he learned to relax and not worry about contact with a stranger. This worked so well if I was gabbing away for longer than a minute or two he would plop down and nap,lol.
> At home I used to have him behind a gate to observe but not interact when we had visitors. When it was obvious he was chill the gate was removed so he could mingle if he chose. Eventually he decided visitors indoors were not scary at all. He continues to be very territorial outdoors and wears an e collar so I can feel confident to call him back when a critter or a human has the audacity to breach the perimeter. I can't remember the last time he was stimmed.When I see him perk up I call him back and toss him a ball and praise him, then either have him lay down or we'll walk away in the opposite direction.
> ...


She wasn’t on place for hours. Sorry I should’ve been a little more descriptive. I would have her off when I was interacting with her. I would put her on place if people were walking by or if I was sitting down and didn’t have as much control over her or watching her.
I have worked with a trainer. She actually boards my dog also for me. She agrees that my dog is environmentally pretty sound for as switched on as she is. She likes to go out and about. There has been very few situations or places she looks uncomfortable with and I never force her in into them. I’ll remove her. She likes to go out and about. It’s not just a context based thing of having training equipment or treats. She’ll go to lowes gladly with just the leash to stop in and grab something. 
Her guarding or protecting is self rewarding. She enjoys it. Even my trainer that has seen her have a reaction agrees that she’s not stressed by it and gets some joy out of it. That’s another thing I’ve been pondering. What is a healthy outlet for that state of mind. Like a dogs prey drive that is stimulated by bicycles you can throw a ball for them. But when my dogs in the State of mind of wanting to bark at someone. She is kind of blue balled for a lack of a better term. I can mark and reward her with a treat for the desired behavior of not reacting. But there is nothing to redirect that energy into. Do you have any ideas?


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## Apex1 (May 19, 2017)

Tug?


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## CeraDean (Jul 9, 2019)

I think some people have to accept that it’s genetics and that the issue isn’t a lack of socialization or insufficient training. I know it can be a hard thing to comprehend that it isn’t a failing of the handler when many people think it’s all in how the dog is raised and trained.

I can relate, not to the extent of your dog, but not every dog likes strangers and some dogs enjoy being pushy jerks. Many dogs don’t make good choices on their own. So give the dog a very black and white life, little to no decisions. Feedback, not just commands. And exposure under threshold, like Dogma suggested. Hope for maturity  
Sounds like you are mostly doing that.

It’s possible that schutzhund or bitework would fill that outlet you are talking about. Not sure if it would help with behavior, but it might help with discretion and teach the dog when it’s appropriate to act in that way.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

The couple of times my young dog successfully rushed a human he also was quite proud of himself. His reaction is out of fear and the joy is from driving away the object of fear.You and your trainer believe it's over excitement? If that's true then you can put your heads together and figure out how to extinguish the impulse immediately when he begins to "load up". Timing would be crucial.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

Apex1 said:


> Tug?


No she has no interest in the tug in these situations. With the prey drive and my kids running around screaming and bicycles it works really well. Like I mentioned she will take food but it doesn’t relax her. 
Here is a description of a situation in what state of mind she is in. If the pool guy is over or another service type person. She will alert bark stop when I tell her to. And then calmly ring her doorbell to go outside whining and low growling while watching the guy. She’s not looking to avoid the person.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

As was said above, the most important thing is to accept the genetics, the hand you have been dealt, and work with that.
Given the information you provided, I would simply not let her off leash. If you want to take your girl out, she should be under your control and on leash at all times. As you have seen, e-collar cannot stop her.
Also, very important: we require pics 😁😁


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

dogma13 said:


> The couple of times my young dog successfully rushed a human he also was quite proud of himself. His reaction is out of fear and the joy is from driving away the object of fear.You and your trainer believe it's over excitement? If that's true then you can put your heads together and figure out how to extinguish the impulse immediately when he begins to "load up". Timing would be crucial.


Oh, I don’t think it isn’t fear based. The number of dogs that react to strangers that isn’t based in fear is very far and few between. So you are basically discussing and debating over percentages and degrees of how much is fear based.
I have gotten pretty good on reading her and stopping anything. I heard from someone that when you are consistently predicting how your dog is going to react to stimuli. That you have a pretty good understanding of your dogs overall temperment.


dogma13 said:


> The couple of times my young dog successfully rushed a human he also was quite proud of himself. His reaction is out of fear and the joy is from driving away the object of fear.You and your trainer believe it's over excitement? If that's true then you can put your heads together and figure out how to extinguish the impulse immediately when he begins to "load up". Timing would be crucial.


I definitely think it’s fear based. I mean how many dogs that don’t like other humans isn’t fear based. Those dogs are very far and few between. When we talk about dogs like this we are generally arguing about degrees of severity. Not the underlying cause.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

Sunflowers said:


> As was said above, the most important thing is to accept the genetics, the hand you have been dealt, and work with that.
> Given the information you provided, I would simply not let her off leash. If you want to take your girl out, she should be under your control and on leash at all times. As you have seen, e-collar cannot stop her.
> Also, very important: we require pics 😁😁


Thanks for the advice I accept her. I mean I have gotten to this point. I haven’t put her down yet. She is a handful I’m sure she would have been completely out of control in most households. The lady that boards her. Will board any dog as long as they aren’t dog aggressive. The lady boards two working sport malinois and she says my dog is between those two in drives and thresholds.
And as far as being off leash when would you test the waters? I had one incident in the last year that I described in my post. I take her out and about a lot. Today alone I’ve taken her into 3 different businesses and it’s only 11am. So you can imagine how many interactions I’m having in just a month. I’m not being snarky I’m genuinely asking for your criteria when you would be comfortable?


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Cferg said:


> Oh, I don’t think it isn’t fear based. The number of dogs that react to strangers that isn’t based in fear is very far and few between. So you are basically discussing and debating over percentages and degrees of how much is fear based.
> I have gotten pretty good on reading her and stopping anything. I heard from someone that when you are consistently predicting how your dog is going to react to stimuli. That you have a pretty good understanding of your dogs overall temperment.
> 
> I definitely think it’s fear based. I mean how many dogs that don’t like other humans isn’t fear based. Those dogs are very far and few between. When we talk about dogs like this we are generally arguing about degrees of severity. Not the underlying cause.


No debate here.I interpreted the one post incorrectly. If your dog likes tugs I know there are videos from Michael Ellis, Larry Krohn, Ivan B. all about rewarding and redirecting with tugs.The very simplest explanation is correct to get the dog out of the surge of fear/anxiety then give him something else to do that's rewarding.The best case outcome would be if the dog habitually starts checking himself then looks to you for a rewarding activity.


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## CactusWren (Nov 4, 2018)

It only took one off-leash incident (attacking a tiny white poodle, but it wasn't harmed), for me to realize that Jupiter would always need to be on-leash. He has barked at workers who come in our house and even grabbed a bit of shirt once. Bottom line, Jupiter needs to be physically controlled. Many dogs do.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

dogma13 said:


> No debate here.I interpreted the one post incorrectly. If your dog likes tugs I know there are videos from Michael Ellis, Larry Krohn, Ivan B. all about rewarding and redirecting with tugs.The very simplest explanation is correct to get the dog out of the surge of fear/anxiety then give him something else to do that's rewarding.The best case outcome would be if the dog habitually starts checking himself then looks to you for a rewarding activity.


I purchased Michael Ellis’s reactivity course a lot of good stuff in it. I implement most of it. I wish the tug or ball would work as a reward. Because it works beautifully for the unwanted prey stimulation. 
Working some obedience for treats gives her something to do but it doesn’t scratch the itch. If that makes sense. 
She does look to me for guidance. But her bad incident was my fault I gave her the release command. Granted she wasn’t fixated on the group when I released her but still. She wouldn’t have charged them if I kept her under obedience. She even bypassed other people on her way to the 3 guys.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

CactusWren said:


> It only took one off-leash incident (attacking a tiny white poodle, but it wasn't harmed), for me to realize that Jupiter would always need to be on-leash. He has barked at workers who come in our house and even grabbed a bit of shirt once. Bottom line, Jupiter needs to be physically controlled. Many dogs do.


Just for scale and perspective how many situations was your dog unleashed with other dogs before the attack. And when he nipped at the worker same question? Was it the 1st time 10 times or was it 100 or more maybe even a 1000?


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

CeraDean said:


> I think some people have to accept that it’s genetics and that the issue isn’t a lack of socialization or insufficient training. I know it can be a hard thing to comprehend that it isn’t a failing of the handler when many people think it’s all in how the dog is raised and trained.
> 
> I can relate, not to the extent of your dog, but not every dog likes strangers and some dogs enjoy being pushy jerks. Many dogs don’t make good choices on their own. So give the dog a very black and white life, little to no decisions. Feedback, not just commands. And exposure under threshold, like Dogma suggested. Hope for maturity
> Sounds like you are mostly doing that.
> ...


I’ve thought about finding someone to evaluate her for bitework. But I want to be really careful about finding the right person. I don’t want someone that would agree to work her just because they want to work a dog.


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## Wunderwhy6 (Nov 29, 2020)

Cferg said:


> I’ve thought about finding someone to evaluate her for bitework. But I want to be really careful about finding the right person. I don’t want someone that would agree to work her just because they want to work a dog.


If you find a solid, all-breed club with supportive people who are actively competing (successfully) in schutzhund, this will not be an issue. They work dogs every time they are on a field and there is no novelty in working one more. However, this would provide a potential outlet for your dog and provide additional training for yourself. A good bitework trainer is not only teaching the dog how to bite and stay in the fight, but how to control themselves in the midst of arousal and drive.

Editing to add that in the clubs I am thinking of, they will expect you to compete as well should you choose to stay with them beyond trying it out.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Cferg said:


> Working some obedience for treats gives her something to do but it doesn’t scratch the itch. If that makes sense.


It makes sense. I'm not sure having an outlet in an organized sport would carry over into how he feels about people in everyday life. But it very well could, by building confidence and learning impulse control.It wouldn't hurt to explore it further. Hopefully someone with experience in that will chime in.What do think @Bearshandler? Or @Jax08?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Dogs in bite sports need to be stable. They can not be reactive and nervy. They need to be stable and turn it on and off. A dog aggressive dog - you can get away with by putting super obedience on them. Even then, we've seen some very bad attacks.

A human aggressive dog? That is aggressive out of fear? hmmmm.... not cool. I would not teach a dog like that how to bite properly. That dog's teeth should never make contact with a human.

You can put your dog into many sports that do not involve direct interaction with other people. Obedience, scent work, dock diving. 

The path for this dog as a pet and member of your household is black and white rules and obedience. It sounds like there is some nerve and then an incident at the age they typically react anyways. I don't tolerate the reactions. They get a correction and a big reward for proper behavior. But they all seem to start reacting about 4-5 months. I look at them like temper tantrums in a toddler. So the puppy reacted and it probably wasn't handled effectively so it's escalated.

I do not read anything in the original post to make me think this is a problem dog. This is simply a dog that has humans who need a good trainer....a good balanced trainer who can teach them when to correct and how to immediately reward for the correct behavior. Obedience and rules. It's not magic  It just needs some hands on from a trainer to help you get hte timing of it all correct and how to be fair and clear.

So where are you located so we can recommend trainers to you?


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

Wunderwhy6 said:


> If you find a solid, all-breed club with supportive people who are actively competing (successfully) in schutzhund, this will not be an issue. They work dogs every time they are on a field and there is no novelty in working one more. However, this would provide a potential outlet for your dog and provide additional training for yourself. A good bitework trainer is not only teaching the dog how to bite and stay in the fight, but how to control themselves in the midst of arousal and drive.
> 
> Editing to add that in the clubs I am thinking of, they will expect you to compete as well should you choose to stay with them beyond trying it out.


Thank you for the affirmation and insight.


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## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

First of all, welcome to the forum! I love Dobermans, and yes we do want pictures!

In reading your initial post, I personally would say that your puppy's reaction to the neighbor chasing his dog was perfect! Just what you (or I, in this case!) would want to see!

That being said, though I read over your post several times, it is unclear to me when the incident with the 3 20-something men that you mentioned occurred. Was it back then or just recently or somewhere in between? Did she blow off recall to get to them, or did you not recall her until after she'd reached them?
Was the ecollar employed at all in that case?

In any event, she's now 20 months old and presumably still not comporting herself the way you'd like her to, so my question is, what training have you done to - not just control her outbursts - teach her what it is you want her to do? And on that topic, what is it exactly that you'd like her to do, both at home and away?


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

Jax08 said:


> Dogs in bite sports need to be stable. They can not be reactive and nervy. They need to be stable and turn it on and off. A dog aggressive dog - you can get away with by putting super obedience on them. Even then, we've seen some very bad attacks.
> 
> A human aggressive dog? That is aggressive out of fear? hmmmm.... not cool. I would not teach a dog like that how to bite properly. That dog's teeth should never make contact with a human.
> 
> ...


 Central Valley California about an hour south of Fresno.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

Here’s some pics


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

She a beautiful dog. My neighbor always had Dobermans. Only one was HA and that was directed toward her son. She never knew why as he didn’t live there and barely saw the dog. Keep working with the trainer and keep her on leash around strangers.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

tim_s_adams said:


> First of all, welcome to the forum! I love Dobermans, and yes we do want pictures!
> 
> In reading your initial post, I personally would say that your puppy's reaction to the neighbor chasing his dog was perfect! Just what you (or I, in this case!) would want to see!
> 
> ...


The incident with the men recently happened. She smoked the ecollar totally blew it off. I really screwed the pooch, I didn’t catch her in time. I’m pretty good at controlling her. Just didn’t see that coming. My fault 100%
What I really want for her is to settle when I tell
her leave it. Usually with guest I shake hands and it seems to help. But I still have to keep her under obedience for quite awhile. Also with situations at my house I will do some nose work “find it” games and that seems to help her settle also. 
My intent with my first post was to see how many dogs are out there. That have a strong obedience foundation. But would still be a total ass if left to their own choices.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

Cferg said:


> My intent with my first post was to see how many dogs are out there. That have a strong obedience foundation. But would still be a total ass if left to their own choices


Haha!Mine would


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

First, I think you have to understand the differences in the breeds. Yours was bred to be a personal protector. She should fire up differently than a GSD. So I'm not sure what I do with my dogs will work on your dog.

I think all dogs when left to make their own choices could be total asses. Lol I'm sure mine could. We have big dogs with big teeth which makes big responsibility. 

@Bearshandler. Any trainers in that area that you know of?

If we don't know trainers, we can still direct you to working dog clubs. Often the training directors are professional dog trainers.


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## CactusWren (Nov 4, 2018)

Cferg said:


> Just for scale and perspective how many situations was your dog unleashed with other dogs before the attack. And when he nipped at the worker same question? Was it the 1st time 10 times or was it 100 or more maybe even a 1000?


Well... we went to the dog park every day for about five months and he never messed with anyone. Then, at about 9 months, he had several incidents where he would nip puppies, so we stopped going to the dog park. Since then, he had the white dog incident and, actually, another incident at another off-leash place. And there has sometimes been lunging/barking on walks, although--not usually, and usually he doesn't start it. Don't know if any of this is helping...

As far as the grabbing the guy's shirt, that is the first and only time he has snapped at anyone. However, he has barked at several HVAC guys who have been in our house. Generally, he is rather barky at the door and then usually accepts people eventually, but he is not really a fan of strangers in the house.

BTW--just saw the pics--that is a fine-looking animal!


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

Haven’t read all of this. About an hour away is Joel Monroe.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

Bearshandler said:


> Haven’t read all of this. About an hour away is Joel Monroe.


Joel Monroe’s facility is probably a little over 2 hours north of me.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Cferg said:


> Joel Monroe’s facility is probably a little over 2 hours north of me.


I would contact him and either get a recommendation from him for someone closer or make a few trips to work with him until you get a handle on it.


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## Cferg (8 mo ago)

LuvShepherds said:


> She a beautiful dog. My neighbor always had Dobermans. Only one was HA and that was directed toward her son. She never knew why as he didn’t live there and barely saw the dog. Keep working with the trainer and keep her on leash around strangers.


Thanks she is a looker. She is a 62lb spitfire that’s 26 inches tall. Most people that are used to fat dogs, guess that she is 80-90lbs. She is medium boned by Doberman standards.


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## peachygeorgia (Oct 5, 2021)

She's beautiful, very solid girl😍

Also, thankful for this thread, Charlie isn't reactive or anything until it comes to people near our property, probably just genetically territorial like Dogmas boy, from what I've read about him. Fine with people in the house, crowded stores, not reactive at all, etc, but if someone is on or near our property, and he's off leash he can definitely turn into a different dog, hopefully purchasing a good quality e collar to proof that soon, until then, off leash privileges are lost around our house.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Cferg said:


> Joel Monroe’s facility is probably a little over 2 hours north of me.


I would make that trip. Joel has a very good reputation and experienced with working dogs. 2 hour trip once every 3 weeks to a person in the know is far more beneficial than once a week with an average pet trainer.

BTW - your girl is gorgeous.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Cferg said:


> My intent with my first post was to see how many dogs are out there. That have a strong obedience foundation. But would still be a total ass if left to their own choices.


All of them 😄😄


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