# Have got lazy on RAW...



## Dannay (Oct 31, 2006)

Just a little background, then will post our situation and will ask our question.

We started feeding our dogs raw about 3 years ago now, with my last german shepherd and our other dog. We used to live in SC and found it very easy to find various suppliers to give them different variety in their diet. Our old GSD passed away and we moved to Roanoke, VA in the same time frame.

Now we have 2 beautiful GSD pups (who are now 15 months) and have been RAW fed since 10 weeks. They look fantastic, their coat is very glossy and they look very healthy. However, one of them has suffered from Pano over the last few months, and they both appear to be fairly lethargic (which is odd because they are from a very reputable breeder and their parents are both working dogs).

Over the past few months (4-5 to be exact) we've found it more and more difficult to get variety into their diet, for various reasons (one of them being our laziness to travel a very long distance, because of other situations in our life right now). As such, they've mostly been on a diet of Chicken Leg Quarters.

Do you think I could have caused any harm by not giving them ample variety (or even a balanced raw diet) over the last few months? I know that they are still growing and I want to be sure I haven't caused any permanent problems.

Thanks for reading.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I think you already know your answer, just posting here for some support?
IMO, you need to give more than chicken for a balanced diet. No green tripe? Omega's are important, too. Do you give any supplements w/ their chicken? Even if you don't want to travel for variety, you can have food sent to you thru different raw suppliers on the net.


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## Dannay (Oct 31, 2006)

Yeah, I guess I am looking for a little support, a little reassurance, and perhaps some good ideas (like yours) of other ways to get food that would give a good variety. Do you know of any web resources where I might be able to get other things, such as green tripe?

We were giving Missing Link supplement, and were looking into Vertex to give that instead.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

With the raw diet the idea is to have balance over time - but that doesn't mean months.

I doubt you have done any serious harm since they did have the variety during their crucial development time frame (roughly up to 12 months) BUT you DO need to change their diet.

Try searching Yahoogroups to see if there's a raw feeding group in your area. They will know where to find the supplies you need.

If you have to travel long distances, buy a freezer and do the trip only once a month.

If none of those are options - switch to kibble (a good one).

You need more than tripe and vitamin supplements with the chicken to make a balanced diet.


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## Dannay (Oct 31, 2006)

Thanks for the reply. I have looked around Yahoo Groups but cannot find any raw feeding groups within this area. Seems strange, since you'd think we'd have a lot of butchers/meat purveyors in the area, but are having trouble. Are you aware of anywhere that does mail order frozen meats?

I want to avoid going to kibble, but I do want to make sure that they have the correct nutrition.


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## gsdlove212 (Feb 3, 2006)

I have had some success getting some stuff on freecycle. It is usually fresh game (hog or deer), but I have also gotten beef (fresh) and some freezer burned cuts that people need to clear out and would have thrown away otherwise. Might not hurt to check into, just make sure that you check it all over and that you feel confident the meat is safe. In my little rural area, I do not have concerns, but that may be different for you.


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## Dannay (Oct 31, 2006)

Thanks for the idea of Freecycle, never used that before









I just found topqualitydogfood.com (they are in MD but can ship to VA) and they have a "Beef Mix" which includes the following things. Do you think this would be good to add to the Chicken Leg Quarter (RMB) as the muscle + organ component?

A coarse ground mix containing:
Beef from Coleman beef and Meyer beef
Bison (Organic from Canada)
Salmon (Chilean)
Beef Liver (Coleman)
Beef heart (Coleman)
Beef Kidney (Coleman)
Turkey (koch organic)
Chicken rib bones (Bell & Evans)
Chicken legs (bell & Evans)
Icelandic Lamb (with Bones) 
A little bit of sea bass


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## angelaw (Dec 14, 2001)

looks good to me!! obviously would depend on amt of kidney and liver.


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## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Just because you don't or can't feed lots of variety, or if you simply believe like me that variety doesn't equal balance, that doesn't mean that you cannot build a balanced diet. You need to know what is in the chicken quarters you are feeding and what is missing and supplement the difference either with supplements or different foods that contain the missing nutrients.

I explain myself in more detail in the thread below, scroll up to the top

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1008028#Post1008028

My first thought regarding the laziness is a lack of potassium. My crew meets their potassium requirements through boiled white potatoes which also provides them with magnesium and a small amount of carbs to use as quick energy. Bananas and no salt substitute are also good sources. Could also just be the approaching heat.


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## LuvWorkingGSDs (Aug 24, 2008)

I too am in VA (not Roanoke, but not super far either). I haven't found a good raw feeding group around here (except for those that feed pre-made which I won't do), so I do most of my shopping at the grocery stores for now. 

I buy things like beef heart, kidney and tongue at reasonable prices and stock up on pork when it goes on sale for around 88 cents or so. I also have found that certain stores have 'manager's special' meat sections where they markdown older meat. My dog certainly doesn't care if the meat is a little ripe, so I try to take advantage of that as well. Sometimes I can find big hunks of beef roast for under a dollar a pound even.

It takes more work keeping an eye on the weekly flyers at groceries and then stocking up when a good sale comes up, but most of the time I don't pay more than a dollar a lb (and it certainly averages out to less than that).

My dog's diet only consists of chicken, turkey, beef and pork with a good fish oil supplement and seameal for now, but it is working very well for her. (and I have the excellent blood test results to prove it!)


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## Dannay (Oct 31, 2006)

I haven't found any beef heart or anything like that at the stores around here







Where are you shopping might I ask? Maybe i'm missing out on something very simple!!

I have been trying to stick to the "managers special" too, but haven't found a good store, except for Kroger occasionally on chicken.

Keeping to less than a dollar per lb would be great, since we have 3 teethy mouths to feed! Thanks for the reply


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## ahlamarana (Sep 22, 2008)

A google search for "custom butcher roanoke va" brings up Custom Meats Inc in Blacksburg, VA. Maybe you could give them a try? Phone is listed as 540-951-8292.


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## LuvWorkingGSDs (Aug 24, 2008)

I buy a lot of stuff at Food Lion. The one we have here tends to have some of the weirder stuff. They don't always have it all at once, but it usually changes every week or so.

I also get stuff sometimes at Kroger, Giant or Harris Teeter, but more so when they have a good sale.


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## JerzeyGSD (Jun 26, 2008)

You know, I don't think raw diets are all that popular in VA. I cannot find a butcher that sells scrap meat anywhere. Jerzey is on a diet of mostly chicken quarters and ground beef too just because it's basically impossible to find any variety! 



> Originally Posted By: LuvWorkingGSDsI too am in VA (not Roanoke, but not super far either). I haven't found a good raw feeding group around here (except for those that feed pre-made which I won't do), so I do most of my shopping at the grocery stores for now.
> 
> I buy things like beef heart, kidney and tongue at reasonable prices and stock up on pork when it goes on sale for around 88 cents or so. I also have found that certain stores have 'manager's special' meat sections where they markdown older meat. My dog certainly doesn't care if the meat is a little ripe, so I try to take advantage of that as well. Sometimes I can find big hunks of beef roast for under a dollar a pound even.
> 
> ...


This basically sums up how I am doing things... exactly.


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## JerzeyGSD (Jun 26, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: DannayI haven't found any beef heart or anything like that at the stores around here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Do you have a Harris Teeter? While I find that Kroger is generally cheaper, Teeter tends to have some kind of chicken (bone-in) on sale fairly often. Although, Kroger tends to have a better "manager's special" section. Too bad Jerzey can't eat pork, which seems to always be part of the "special!" 

I am just amazed at how similar our problem is! I'm not too far from Roanoke and there is just nothing here! Ugh!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

This e-mail was sent to me, I am sure the owner would not object to me forwarding the info: May be the answer to your raw woes, and give a job to someone that enjoys sales! It is from a raw distributer here in MI who is expanding to the east coast: 

4880 Hudson Rd.
Osseo, Michigan 49266
616.371.1170 8:00AM-5:00PM

Taylor Pond Farms 
Updates and News June 2009

Dear Jane ,

Change -- it is one of the toughest things there is. Many of you are experiencing change in your lives right now and can relate. Our reason for changing started more than a year ago when we experienced the unprecedented rise in gas prices, the freezer problems and the move to a new plant. Since we drive as much as 6,000 miles per month or more per month the cost of fuel is a huge factor in our business. 

Almost a year ago we started the transition from group deliveries, home deliveries to a distributor and store based business. While it still requires that we drive some it is much less. Now with two drivers it will be even less. 

The month of May was the end of a journey that has watched us start as rabbit farmers and transition through to manufacturing pet food. While it has by no means being an easy road it has been fun for the most part and while we are nervous about what is next we are also very optimistic as you have continued to support us even in these trying economic times. 

Starting in June we will make a variety of changes, we will switch packaging, labeling, and even sizes on some items. We have also eliminated a large part of the product sizes that we carry. We will also start delivering our products in a freezer truck to stores and distributors through out the Midwest and East coast. Stores and distributors located outside of the Midwest will receive theirs by frozen carrier unless other arrangements have been made. 

We will also be adding several new distributors and store locations which I will email you about separately in the next few days. These changes along with the equipment we brought in to speed things up will hopefully allow us to ship product faster and more on time. The past two month 88% of distributor orders were delivered on time or early.

Working with stores and distributors and being off of the road will allow us to focus more on customers service and a lot less on which highway we are on and how many hours we are scheduled to be on the road that day. Just in the last month I have finished three books on the road - at least it was productive time.

We are actively seeking distributors and sales people so if you have an interest in either please contact me at via the website and I will get in touch with you to discuss the opportunities. 

After all the challenges of last summer -- sky high fuel bills, freezer problems, moving to a new plant, rising raw material prices, raw material shortages I was not always sure that we would make it this far. I'm glad we did though and look forward to working with the distributors and stores on improved packaging and deliveries.


Thanks you for your support and patience,


Peter Moolhuizen

A Michigan Company that continues to grow!



Opportunities



We have three opportunities for you if you are interested.

1: We are actively looking for people that have sales experience and are familiar with raw feeding. We are looking for people east of the Mississippi. If you like the freedom of being your own boss give us a call or send us an email.

2: We are actively looking for Distributors that want to grow their business and have a believe that nothing will stand in their way. If you want to be your own boss and have cold storage space available that can handle at least 1,000# get in touch with us either via email or phone. 

3: The last one is for those of you involved in dog shows -- our refrigerated tuck is available on the weekends and Barb and I would like to attend as many shows as we can here in the Midwest. We would bring the truck and products with us along with brochures and treats. 




Chicken Special for June

Every month we offer an product at a great price so check with your distributor to see what the special is. This month it is Ground Chicken. Either 1# - 2# or 5#. 

Specials coming in the future are Tripe and Venison.....Stay tuned...


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Anyone interested in associating with Taylor Pnd Farms please PM me.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

I found this info - don't know how close any of these are to Roanoke but it's worth a look:

http://www.manta.com/mb_43_C3_47/food_processing/virginia


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: onyx'girlWe will also start delivering our products in a freezer truck to stores and distributors through out the Midwest


i like the sound of that if it means there will be a Taylor Pond Farms distributor closer to most people.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I would say they are soliciting sales people~those who want to invest in a fridge truck and freezer that will hold 1000#.


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