# Where can I find the best puppy?



## thedognewbie (Jul 26, 2015)

Hiya, I was wondering where can I find the best place to get a dog? Certainly not pet stores because they use puppy mills, shelters won't really give me what I want, and breeders are just too expensive. Any alternatives?


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## Fun (Jul 16, 2015)

I just got a puppy, this sticky was very helpful to get started!

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/choosing-breeder/137533-things-look-responsible-breeder.html


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## thedognewbie (Jul 26, 2015)

Well even though that was helpful I have other plans right now so I can't spend my money on a breeder


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

You could try a rescue. But honestly, if you have other plans right now you might want to wait. Puppies can be very expensive in the first year.


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## wyoung2153 (Feb 28, 2010)

Sabis mom said:


> You could try a rescue. But honestly, if you have other plans right now you might want to wait. Puppies can be very expensive in the first year.


This. I'm sorry but I have to agree. It is a lot and if you already know you have plans that will limit your finances, you might be better off waiting until you are in a stable enough situation to afford the right breeder.


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## thedognewbie (Jul 26, 2015)

Okay, I definitely phrased that wrong let's just say I'm not willing to spend that much money on the actual dog. I meant I wanted to save some money for stuff like obedience classes, food, and vet trips because everyone knows a breeder wants to bleed you dry. Plus the "plans" I mentioned won't hold me back from getting a dog it'll just make it a bit tougher.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

thedognewbie said:


> Okay, I definitely phrased that wrong let's just say I'm not willing to spend that much money on the actual dog. I meant I wanted to save some money for stuff like obedience classes, food, and vet trips because everyone knows a breeder wants to bleed you dry. Plus the "plans" I mentioned won't hold me back from getting a dog it'll just make it a bit tougher.



No offense but the "actual dog" is the most important part. Save your money. But a dog from a responsible breeder that will give you life time support. 

Spend the money on the dog. Plain and simple.


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## Debanneball (Aug 28, 2014)

Go to a rescue, they have purebred GSD's..maybe not a puppy, who knows.. Also, one thing to think about when purchasing a puppy _*you get what you pay for!*_. Buying from a breeder will be a sure thing health wise, and the breeder will always be there to help you. And, a rescue will let you know everything you need to know about a particular dog. Good luck


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

thedognewbie said:


> Okay, I definitely phrased that wrong let's just say I'm not willing to spend that much money on the actual dog. I meant I wanted to save some money for stuff like obedience classes, food, and vet trips because *everyone knows a breeder wants to bleed you dry*. Plus the "plans" I mentioned won't hold me back from getting a dog it'll just make it a bit tougher.


 You have been talking to the wrong breeders. Most of the ones I have spoken to are barely, if at all, breaking even.

I have planned on $1500 for a pup, plus shipping. That gets me a solid, well breed pup from health tested parents. Not top of the line breeding probably, but good.
If you want SL it's going to be more, so what is it you are looking for?

I can tell you that my 'free' pup cost me in excess of $5000 in vet bills in her first year.


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## Augustine (Nov 22, 2014)

I never thought very highly of breeders until I actually got my GSD. I couldn't afford a proper one and ended up buying from a BYB. I am *extremely* lucky that my girl has turned out great thus far, but I have to keep an extra eye on her, get her hip x-ray'd, etc. because I don't know anything about where she came from and I don't know if there are any possible health issues that I should expect.

so while there are definitely A LOT of shady breeders out there, you really, truly do get what you pay for when you buy a purebred dog.

I always thought it was about "purity" nonsense (you know, those people that look down on mutts) but no, it's about health. Especially with popular breeds that have been ruined because of BYBs.

If you don't want to buy from a breeder, then find a nice rescue or shelter. Though bear in mind that even if the dog is healthy at the time, you have no clue what kind of history the dog has, so a genetic illness could pop up at any time.


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

I'd save up. Spending good money on the "actual dog" should be your first priority. 

I look at it this way:
I spent $20,000 on a MINI Cooper that I planned on having less than 10 years. 
I spent $1600 on a computer that I plan on having less than 3 years. 
I spent $1500 on each dog that I hope to have at least 10 years. 

Seems like a really good investment of your money to spend so little to potentially have a companion for many years.


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## wyoung2153 (Feb 28, 2010)

thedognewbie said:


> Okay, I definitely phrased that wrong let's just say I'm not willing to spend that much money on the actual dog. I meant I wanted to save some money for stuff like obedience classes, food, and vet trips because everyone knows a breeder wants to bleed you dry. Plus the "plans" I mentioned won't hold me back from getting a dog it'll just make it a bit tougher.


Definitely misinformed on this one, that or you have had the wrong experiences. For the actual dog, you get what you pay for.. sometimes you get lucky, or maybe you rescue, but like anything you get what you put into it. True reputable breeders don't want to "bleed you dry" They are not in this business for the money. The cost you pay for your dog typically goes directly back to replenishing the vet bills, food, etc of having the litter. You are thinking of a back yard breeder, who yes, is in it for the money. That's where you find your cheap pricing and poorly bred dogs. 

If you want a good solid dog, find a reputable breeder that breeds for purpose, not money. I would expect to pay anywhere from $1000-$2000. Average for a good breeder seems to be $1500 in the states.. I paid $1000 for Titan but bought him in Germany. Not including shipping if you are out of state. This is where you should start when thinking about money spent. The other stuff will come, but this is the most important investment when it comes you getting your puppy.. the rest are accessories... important accessories albeit, but accessories none the less.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

thedognewbie said:


> Okay, I definitely phrased that wrong let's just say I'm not willing to spend that much money on the actual dog. I meant I wanted to save some money for stuff like obedience classes, food, and vet trips because everyone knows a breeder wants to bleed you dry. Plus the "plans" I mentioned won't hold me back from getting a dog it'll just make it a bit tougher.


I take exception to this. It may be true of a puppy mill or even a BYB, but a good breeder is not out there trying to bleed you dry. That's just an offensive thing to say, not to mention totally ignorant.


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## dogfaeries (Feb 22, 2010)

I've only bred one litter (with my breeder), and I can tell you it was not a money maker, LOL. After all the vet expenses (progesterone testing, ultrasound, etc) and feeding and worming and vaccinations for the puppies (not to mention that Carly ate enough for 3 dogs when she was nursing, and the dog food bill literally tripled), there was very little profit (I had enough to buy a new blow dryer). I didn't even add in the approximately $5000 I spent to show her to her championship. I guess some people see what price the breeder charges, and then multiply that by the number of puppies, and think they are making a fortune.

Any you know what? If a responsible breeder can make a little money, then they should. You can't imagine the actual time that is put in with raising a litter. I won't even go into all that.

Anyway, end rant


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

thedognewbie said:


> Okay, I definitely phrased that wrong let's just say I'm not willing to spend that much money on the actual dog. I meant I wanted to save some money for stuff like obedience classes, food, and vet trips because *everyone knows a breeder wants to bleed you dry. *Plus the "plans" I mentioned won't hold me back from getting a dog it'll just make it a bit tougher.


You obviously have no idea how much money it takes a good breeder to title and test good breeding stock. To do the proper health testing. To raise the breeding stock. To whelp and raise the litters.

Breeders are NOT getting rich. Most aren't even breaking even.


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## G-burg (Nov 10, 2002)

> where can I find the best place to get a dog? *Certainly not pet stores because they use puppy mills, shelters won't really give me what I want, and breeders are just too expensive. Any alternatives*?



Maybe try Craig's List? Might be some people on there giving dogs away!


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

I'm not sure why you think shelters won't have what you are looking for, if you are just looking for a pet dog. The last big national survey done of shelter dogs found around 25% of them were purebred. 

Anyway, there's a difference between adopting from a shelter ("dog pound") and a breed rescue.

You _can _find young GSDs (and, yes, even puppies) in breed rescues, depending on the area and part of the country. You are much more likely to find them in the South, California, and Texas. You are probably less likely to find them in northern areas. Some rescues will adopt out of state; others will not.

In my area, the most common age we see in rescue is adolescence -- right about the time the "cute" puppy someone bought gets huge and starts destroying the house. Lately, we've been pulling lots of 4 to 6-month-old dogs. Our shelters will euthanize anything, even the young ones (and entire litters), so the number of young dogs surrendered is a serious problem for us. 

If you wonder why we have so many, keep in mind the areas I mentioned are warm enough to have "year round puppy season," have very low rates of spay/neuter, have large demographics that are very poor and breed dogs for subsistence income, and have been underfunding animal control and sheltering programs for decades. In my area, there are tons of people with WL dogs who breed them either for extra income or to "make back" their cost of buying the dog, so we see lots and lots of young WL dogs in shelters (whatever they can't sell and get tired of feeding will be surrendered to the shelter).

If you can't spend $1500 on a puppy, apply to get one through rescue. Realize that not everyone gets approved, and your ability to care for, train, and afford a young GSD will likely be evaluated. If $1,000 vet bills scare you, getting pet insurance in place when the dog is young would be a good idea, as this is an expensive breed to own. You'll likely get a dog that's been fostered in someone's home, house trained, and received some foundation in house manners and basic obedience. If you adopt through a good rescue, you'll also get good post-adoption support.

Here's a list of breed rescues by state:
http://www.agsra.com/listings.html


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

I also want to add that you should avoid the temptation of "cheap" litters--$500 puppies in the newspaper, on CL, Hoobly, etc. Those people are the source of all my woes with their multiple litters a year, not caring who they sell to, not vetting their pups, dumping the "extras" that don't sell or get sick at the shelters, etc. Some of them are really just small-scale puppy mills. 

Sometimes people tell me they "rescued" a pup by getting it out of one of those situations by buying it -- nope! They just made it worth that person's while to continue doing what he or she is doing and enabled it to continue by paying them.

As far as far as I'm concerned there are two ethical ways to get a purebred dog. You can get one from a rescue or shelter, or you can get one from a good breeder who is putting the time and money into their genetics for the benefit of breed. That's it. There's really no middle ground.


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## WateryTart (Sep 25, 2013)

Magwart said:


> As far as far as I'm concerned there are two ethical ways to get a purebred dog. You can get one from a rescue or shelter, or you can get one from a good breeder who is putting the time and money into their genetics for the benefit of breed. That's it. There's really no middle ground.


I would tend to agree with you. At least, that's how I've made my dog-acquiring decisions.

I can see, though, how someone might be unable to spend the money for a puppy from a good breeder but still want a purebred puppy. Here, at least, if you want a purebred puppy, your choice is a breeder and that's it. I know it's different where you are. I can't speak to other breeds, but for a GSD pup, your choices are good breeder or not-so-good breeder. The puppies don't show up in rescue. They just don't. And if they do, they're mixes.

I still stick to "you get what you pay for" and would only buy from a good breeder. But part of me kind of feels uncomfortable with the implicit idea that only the relatively affluent can obtain a purebred puppy, and everyone else is left with fewer options. On the other hand, that's implying that rescue dogs are less, and some would argue that's a problematic assumption as well. Though here, the genetics probably ARE of a lower quality if you find a puppy in rescue - they just are, because the people with dogs who have good genetics are either not breeding them or they're honest to goodness breeders. But you can flip that around to then the BYB puppies probably don't have great genetics and you're still paying $200-800 for them. So I don't know. I can see several sides to this one and I know it's only making sense in my head.

I still tend to agree with you, but I feel like I have to remind myself that it's very easy for me to say that because I could afford to purchase the pup of my choice, and not everyone can. Something about that kind of assertion makes sense, and I think you're right, but it's not without its own problematic implicit assumptions.


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## thedognewbie (Jul 26, 2015)

First of all, I'd like to say thanks to the info you guys have provided me about breeders and shelters . Second of all I'm sorry if I offended any of the breeders in this thread, It's just that when I search online for breeders in my area 1 puppy costs 3000+.


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## Persinette (Jan 31, 2015)

thedognewbie said:


> First of all, I'd like to say thanks to the info you guys have provided me about breeders and shelters . Second of all I'm sorry if I offended any of the breeders in this thread, It's just that when I search online for breeders in my area 1 puppy costs 3000+.


If you're wiling to ship or drive, you can find a very well bred pup for less. A well bred pup (not champion show prospect or internationas sport prospect potential, but still a fantastic pet/companion/working animal) should run you around $1200-1800. Shipping via air usually costs around $400. Total, you'd be looking at around $1600-2200. Still pricey, but certainly less than $3000.

With that price tag comes (or should): health guarantees of some sort, health testing, life long support of the breeder, titles that show the dog's temperament and ability to work and/or conformation, and being paired with a pup that has the right temperament/energy level for your needs.

Long term, it will almost certainly be cheaper than many other options because what you will save in veterinary care for genetic health problems and corrective training costs potentially, (beyond the norm) for temperament problems that can lead to fearful aggressive biting/reactivity.

As others have stated, many rescues will ship out of state and have nice quality purebred GSD. Then you'd be looking at around a $50-200 adoption fee (includes specter, shots, etc.) and $200-400 shipping fee.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

thedognewbie said:


> First of all, I'd like to say thanks to the info you guys have provided me about breeders and shelters . Second of all I'm sorry if I offended any of the breeders in this thread, It's just that when I search online for breeders in my area 1 puppy costs 3000+.


get out to some clubs and actually meet dogs and their owners...they can suggest breeders to you. While you are saving for a puppy research this breed, and the different lines. This link has some great information on the breed, worth spending some time reading. German Shepherd Guide - Home


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

Yes, those prices can really give people a case of sticker shock! 
I remember getting my rottie mix from the local SPCA. She was 350$, and that was a huge amount of money in my mind. But I felt that the money was going to support the SPCA, and support the work they do. So I gladly paid that amount for a stray of no know background, because the money was going into something I beleived in. 

I used to feel like you did about 'pure breed' dogs, and 'breeders', but as I got involved into the dog world (training, performance), I got to see the bigger picture, and set about to educate myself on the subject. I never thought I would ever BUY a dog, let alone pay over 1000 dollars for one, but when I decided I wanted a pure-bred GSD for Schutzhund (IPO), I started saving up my money to buy one from a good breeder. 

German Show lines can go for the prices you are seeing in your google searches. Working lines somewhat less, in the 1000 to 2000$ area. Not sure what American Show lines go for? I think they are comparable to the Working lines in price? 

I agree with all the posters above, and specifically Magwart who gave you some very good information. Also agree with NOT buying a cheap pup to get it out of a bad situation and calling it a 'rescue' - that is only being part of the problem of BYB's and Puppy mills. As soon as the breeder gets their money, they will just continue breeding poor, sickly dogs because they can get money for them. For those who say "Well, couldn't just leave the poor thing there", yes you can. If the pups don't sell, they will be dumped at the shelter. THEN you can adopt one and TRULY rescue the puppy, the breeder is not likely to try to get another litter if they can't sell any of their puppies. And if the situation is THAT bad, call the authorities to investigate. But under no circumstances should anyone ever rationalize thier purchase of such a pup.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

what is your location??? There are places with pretty decent breeders where the economy is such that pups with European lines can be found for $800-1000 - have just seen some litters in Ohio, WVA and one "oops" litter in NJ (probably no papers on that one coz male was too young for AKC parameters)

Lee


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## wyoung2153 (Feb 28, 2010)

thedognewbie said:


> First of all, I'd like to say thanks to the info you guys have provided me about breeders and shelters . Second of all I'm sorry if I offended any of the breeders in this thread, It's just that when I search online for breeders in my area 1 puppy costs 3000+.


SO much to learn  Do some good research on breeders and rescues and if you give a general location, people here could help guide you to some also!


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## thedognewbie (Jul 26, 2015)

This thread can now be ended, I have found a shelter with very good reviews on yelp and they even have their own website along with a couple pups.


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## Longfisher (Feb 28, 2013)

Sabis mom said:


> You could try a rescue. But honestly, if you have other plans right now you might want to wait. Puppies can be very expensive in the first year.


Never take on a rescue GSD dog or puppy if you're not extremely familiar with not only the breed, but also, rescuing them. They're not just a handful but two handfuls when they're completely well-bred and totally sane and well adjusted. When they're a total unknown and maybe abused (more likely just genetically unsound and dangerously aggressive) they're your worst nightmare.

Find a good breeder. Pay what the going price is for a quality puppy from a good blood line and get a health guarantee. Rescues are nothing but trouble and they'll especially be trouble for someone who doesn't know this breed.

LF


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## thedognewbie (Jul 26, 2015)

The "newbie" in my name just means i have some experience with dogs not that I don't know anything about them, in fact I have spent many a time reading about the german shepherd.


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## Persinette (Jan 31, 2015)

Longfisher said:


> Never take on a rescue GSD dog or puppy if you're not extremely familiar with not only the breed, but also, rescuing them. They're not just a handful but two handfuls when they're completely well-bred and totally sane and well adjusted. When they're a total unknown and maybe abused (more likely just genetically unsound and dangerously aggressive) they're your worst nightmare.
> 
> Find a good breeder. Pay what the going price is for a quality puppy from a good blood line and get a health guarantee. Rescues are nothing but trouble and they'll especially be trouble for someone who doesn't know this breed.
> 
> LF


I don't think it's fair to say rescues are nothing but trouble. Yes, there are unsound (mentally and health wise) rescue dogs that need special homes, but there are also great animals in rescue.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

River says, "What a bunch of nonsense to say I'm nothing but trouble."









Etta says, "I know, dude. I'm just a baby. And a stinkin' sweet one!"











Stitch says, "Check me out with my down-stay in my foster home! I'm a rock star."










Zeus says, "Yeah, but I got fluffy ears. My ears and I are rocking my obedience class too."











Puppies pulled from kill-shelters in the summer of 2015 by Red Stick German Shepherd Rescue. A very loved bunch of "trouble makers" indeed!


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