# Slow to Mature: Exactly what is it? and how does it affect your training plan?



## ponyfarm (Apr 11, 2010)

I read about how some lines are "slow to mature". What does this mean exactly? If your dog is slow to mature do you go slower with training? Maybe work only on basics until they seem ready, and not rush things.

Reason I am asking is Max is seven months old and obviously a very bright young man. I just feel like he is goofy, and uncoordinated yet. We do obedience class twice a week and he trys to go along with the program but I swear he can hardly walk a straight line when he looks at me!..lol He still wants to do the "puppy sit"..slouch one hip. He does not seem overly bored with the program, more like a kid who trips over themselves and has bad handwriting.!!

One the other hand, at this age my collie was flitting about like a butterfly , able to rub his stomach and pat his head at the same time. Here is Max's pedigree for reference. .
Max Von Zahnderhaus - German Shepherd Dog
as I guess some lines are known for being slow to mature. I dont know about his..as I am very much a beginner in pedigrees. I also included a picture of him just so you can see how goofy he is! So, how have you all handled a dog like this, and how did you judge when to ask for more?


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

It can mean different things. I have one dog that was slow to mature, physically though as a more serious dog he was very mature mentally early on. Pan was the opposite, he is slow to mature mentally, meaning he thinks and acts a lot like a puppy at two years old. The implications in training are mostly to do with protection work. He is still developing aggression and protective instincts.


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

My GloryB is, and I'm not kidding, about 1 year behind in training from where Bretta was. Seemed like mostly mentally, but also a bit physically.

For me, once I realized what was going on, I needed to lower the expectations I had because GloryB was starting to shut down and not enjoy training. 

ATTITUDE is the more important for engagement and training. Considering that learning can be a challenge and difficult for our dogs to think thru....I need to remember that each dog is different and pay attention to the one that's in front of me rather than compare to other dogs in the past.

Watching how my dog is loving training (or not) and progressing in training (or not) is key. So if we need to slow down, continue to use tons of play/treats in the mix so we can keep up training, then that's just fine.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

For me "slow to mature" has mainly to do with when the dog is ready to do protection work and when the dogs starts to express its social aggression/fight drive. Since I want maturity before I do protection work I tend to wait until the dog is ready, maybe pulling them out and doing a little to see where they are. 

I have never faced maturity issues in obedience or tracking though maybe the boys did take a bit longer.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

most of what you describe has to do with his movement , his physical ungracefullness -- and that has to do with his conformation.


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## wildo (Jul 27, 2006)

ponyfarm- you might want to check out the Andy Maly Vah thread. Many of Andy's offspring, and particularly the Wildhaus "G" litter (according to the owners who posted in that thread) were slow to mature. I asked about that particular statement here:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...1856-andy-maly-vah-prodegy-2.html#post2470913


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## ponyfarm (Apr 11, 2010)

carmspack said:


> most of what you describe has to do with his movement , his physical ungracefullness -- and that has to do with his conformation.


 Ok..so you are saying he is a clutz, a ground-pounder.lol..I can live with that! Funny thing..his sister is a little sports car model.

Love, love him anyway.


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## wildo (Jul 27, 2006)

how much body awareness stuff have you done with Max? Is he aware of his back feet? How well can he compress, and how is his balance? I would suspect body awareness, balance, and coordination work would have a profound impact on his ability to walk in a straight line while looking at you. You might also check out PuppyPeaks Month 2 Week 4 "Down" to see SG shaping Swagger into a sphinx down, and dealing with rolling onto one hip.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

there is SO MUCH training that you can do that does not look like training, does not feel like training, yet it is. Training is not synonymous with drill and routine . Make the dog think it out. look at the "Nickolas" thread -- you can have the dog advance in leaps and bounds and then tie it all together , in the end coming out with a better dog who is bonded and enjoys work (because it is like play)


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

yeah , his conformation has a big effect . Look how he sits - he slouchs on one hip - because his front legs are short - and he has more rear , yet with a straight stifle -- His back is lower than his croup - when he moves his rear end is probably at an angle out of line from the shoulder so he can step under his mid section while his front doesn't move enough to get out of the way -- so he probably crabs or runs on an angle. Can't help it , this is a function of his conformation, which is why he can't walk a straight line http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=1353416
Don't ask perfection - he can't give it , but he can give attention and compliance -- I would do lots and lots of other things which engage his willingness , promote pleasure in working and getting beautiful fast and reliable responses. Then see if he evens out a bit in his conformation and makes him less gangly.


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## jourdan (Jul 30, 2012)

I have no advice but you have a beautiful pup!


Sent from my iPhone using PG Free


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## ponyfarm (Apr 11, 2010)

carmspack said:


> there is SO MUCH training that you can do that does not look like training, does not feel like training, yet it is. Training is not synonymous with drill and routine . Make the dog think it out. look at the "Nickolas" thread -- you can have the dog advance in leaps and bounds and then tie it all together , in the end coming out with a better dog who is bonded and enjoys work (because it is like play)


I am enjoying your Nickolas thread very much! I appreciate you chiming in as I respect your opinion.

We do our "training" in fun ways, clicker, treats, run,tug, try it again. Your comments are much appreciated and his movement is accurately described. He is so willing to try things for me tho! He does give nice focus in class and our trainer uses Max as the demo dog. He has a very nice, laid back temperament. I am one to let the dog dictate what avenue we take, so he may not be an agility dog, but he sure can participate in Rally and AKC Obedience, and dock diving etc. 

Wildo..we have done some body awareness.mainly go to perch. He has a very difficult time moving on his forehand. He can spin both ways,(entire body.) We also have been working on jump cavaletti to work on his co-ordination..just over pcv pipe on the ground..Susan Garret style!

So we do a little bit at a time. He can do a sphinx down and hold it for a short time. Last night in ob class we got some good tips on how to help him sit straight..not letting him plump on his hind end but stay up just a touch untill he gets new muscle memory. He was fine learning that as good treats were involved. I am thinking one of those body awareness balls would help him.

Lesson for me here is that Max is going to be way different to train than my collie! But, I love a project and I love the advice given here. Open for more!


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