# Missing hair spots on her ear - what could they be?



## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

I've noticed in the last few weeks she's been scratching her ears a bit more than usual, and when I looked at them closely, I see (both are like this, though the other's not as bad) that there are spots without hair about the size of your pinky fingernail.

For a few days, I sprayed them with Vetericyn Wound and Infection Control, but it's made no difference. This is the first time ever she's gotten this, so I'm stumped.

A couple of months ago she got spayed, and right after it, developed a hot spot on a cheek (it had pus leaking too though, and these are totally dry) , which we treated with some stuff from the vet (antibiotics I believe as well as some Vetericyn), and the hair had fallen out, but was fine in a few weeks. That's the closest thing to this I've seen.

Thanks for any help. Hoping to avoid a vet visit! Pic attached below.
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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

I would get them scraped at the vet. My neighbor's GSD had the same thing and it turned out being sarcoptic mange. It could also possibly be an allergy, but I would rule out the other first.


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

Blimey... Thanks for the input. Been going to the vet every freakin' few months it seems for one thing or the other...

I'll look up this mange thing to see what i can find. So it's not something you can leave for a week or two and see if it resolves itself?


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

No, if it is mange you have to treat it. Sarcoptic mange is also highly contagious to people and can cause scabies.

If it is a food allergy, you will need to change the food.


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

Thx. Will get her in soon then. Shouldn't be a food thing as her diet hasn't changed. Or could a one off feeding of some snack (we occasionally give her a bit of our food) cause this?


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## ChancetheGSD (Dec 19, 2007)

I would be worried about mange before food allergies. Given that it itches it could very well be sarcoptic mange which can get ugly quickly (Google "Sarcoptic Mange" and click images to see what it can and will become left untreated) and spread to other pets and people. Skin scraping would be my first step before anything else!


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

Lotus99 said:


> A couple of months ago she got spayed, and right after it, developed a hot spot on a cheek (it had pus leaking too though, and these are totally dry) , which we treated with some stuff from the vet (antibiotics I believe as well as some Vetericyn), and the hair had fallen out, but was fine in a few weeks. That's the closest thing to this I've seen.
> 
> Thanks for any help. Hoping to avoid a vet visit! Pic attached below.


How old is she?...Was she spayed, vaccinated and given fle/heartworm prevention within 6 months of each other? Was she given rabies vax. at/around same time as spay? Was she given 5 in 1 shot or leptosporosis.

What food is she eating? What table scraps? Have you had her thyroid tested?

My dog lost his fur on the backs of his ears from scratching every year for the first 4 yrs. I had him.

Always started in Oct. and as the fall winter season progressed, so did the itching.

Come May it stops...as seasons change, it can affect certain organs, and if the organs are struggling with enviro. toxins and other things like vaccines, the adjuvants in them (mercury, formaldhyde, aluminum), the pesticides (heartworm/flea treatments), anesthesia from the surgery, the hormone changes and then the abx. post surgery....then you have to factor in processed food...this is likely a symptom of toxicity.

If you want to test for mange, take your thumb and forefinger and rub together along the ear margins (edges) to the tip, if mange the back leg will start kicking like you hit the sweet spot


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

She was only spayed two months ago, at the age of 1.5 years. She got her rabies shot a year ago, and when they did the spay, they tested her titre dp/v levels, and she was fine, so she didn't get anything else. Unless the vet has missed something, all her shots should be up to date.

I actually came across the home test (like you say, running your fingers along the ear) which is supposed to be 95% accurate, and got nothing. She maybe scratches her ears a few times an hour. I'd think with this mange stuff, she'd be scratching it a lot more frequently?

I wonder if it's just some wierd food thing, or other thing, like you say, seasonal itch. She's been doing it a few weeks, and if it was mange, it should have gotten a lot worse by now I'd think? The only change I'd say is the little spots have grown in number on her ear in a few weeks. So like there's 5 of them now on one ear.

She's otherwise healthy, exercises well, eats raw almost all the time (other than a meal of kibble occasionally) and the scraps only amount to a couple of leftover tablespoons of food here and there.

So I'm thinking it's probably not mange, but what the heck is it... And a $70 vet bill. If they test it, they need to check the scrapings under a microscope - and I wonder if a lab charge would be on top of the vet visit too... That's why I didn't want to just jump the gun and panic.

Do healthy dogs, who live indoors almost all the time, living in urban areas, get mange? I want to see if I can assign a probability to this...


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

I think it's related to the spay.

Baldness and Hormone-Related Skin Disorders in Dogs | petMD

Look into Evening Primrose Oil as an omega supplimental oil


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## GatorDog (Aug 17, 2011)

You should have a vet do a scraping to see if it is mange or not.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

My neighbor's dog had sarcoptic like this for 3 months until I finally talked her into taking the dog for a skin scrape. Somehow it never spread, but it was 100% sarcoptic under microscope.


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

Hmmm... I'd like to think it's related to the spay of two months ago, but that would mean hormone therapy? Yikes! Or like the other poster said, some weird seasonal thing hopefully. 

She's on Salmon Oil daily, it doesn't have the same supplements I take it as this Evening Primrose oil?

The odd thing is if this article's correct, How to Identify Mange on Dogs: 5 steps - wikiHow, the do it at home test of scratching the ear should be 95% accurate, and she doesn't exhibit any symptoms when I scratch her ear. Plus, sarcoptic mange it says causes intense itching. As I've said, she does it a few times an hour maybe.

I guess the only way to know for sure is have a vet check it out... If I do, I'll post back for sure. I'll post an update anyway in a while if we don't go.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

n cases of hairloss like this, it is always better to get a skin scrape than to guess and take different suppliments. Sarcoptic mange is itchy because the females burrow into the skin to lay their eggs. If your dog is scratching several times an hour, you need to get it checked.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

Lotus99 said:


> The odd thing is if this article's correct, How to Identify Mange on Dogs: 5 steps - wikiHow, the do it at home test of scratching the ear should be 95% accurate, and she doesn't exhibit any symptoms when I scratch her ear. Plus, sarcoptic mange it says causes intense itching. As I've said, she does it a few times an hour maybe.


I'm sorry, but that is one of the most laughable things. Can a dog try to itch it's ears if you rub them? Yes. However, mine do that when I clean their ears out as well. I honestly do not see how that has a 95% accuracy when all dogs are completely different. I would trust this about as much as I trust my mother in law.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

Lotus99 said:


> Hmmm... I'd like to think it's related to the spay of two months ago, *but that would mean hormone therapy*? Yikes! Or like the other poster said, some weird seasonal thing hopefully.
> 
> She's on Salmon Oil daily, it doesn't have the same supplements I take it as this Evening Primrose oil?


May just mean she is out of balance right now...suppliments can bring back into balance, as well, season changes affect hormones, so may only need to be considered as season change "approaches"...there are many EFA's...you just hear about 3 (mostly),6,9.

Borage oil is another.

You can apply some Raw cold pressed organic coconut oil to the backs of the ears, will sooth dryness and prevent bacterial infection. Can also use to treat the inside (clean with) to treat yeasts, bacteria and smother ear mites. This may also be a mild case of yeast infection, so if the vet is going to do a scrape, then insist on a yeast smear too. Yeast is also related to hormonal imbalance. You may also consider giving the coconut oil in her feed...1 tsp/10lbs of body weight...but not all at once...work up over a month. This will help from the inside out


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

jaggirl47 said:


> I'm sorry, but that is one of the most laughable things. Can a dog try to itch it's ears if you rub them? Yes. However, mine do that when I clean their ears out as well. I honestly do not see how that has a 95% accuracy when all dogs are completely different. I would trust this about as much as I trust my mother in law.


 
It's the exact test my once conventional vet used 30+ yrs in the business...he was the owner of the practice (and a drug promoter) and determined no mites based on it...he wanted to use steroids...I refused.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

GatorBytes said:


> May just mean she is out of balance right now...suppliments can bring back into balance, as well, season changes affect hormones, so may only need to be considered as season change "approaches"...there are many EFA's...you just hear about 3 (mostly),6,9.
> 
> Borage oil is another.
> 
> You can apply some Raw cold pressed organic coconut oil to the backs of the ears, will sooth dryness and prevent bacterial infection. Can also use to treat the inside (clean with) to treat yeasts, bacteria and smother ear mites. This may also be a mild case of yeast infection, so if the vet is going to do a scrape, then insist on a yeast smear too. Yeast is also related to hormonal imbalance. You may also consider giving the coconut oil in her feed...1 tsp/10lbs of body weight...but not all at once...work up over a month. This will help from the inside out


I'm sorry, but the OP needs to take his dog to the vet to get a diagnosis. If this dog actually has something contagious to humans and instead of treating it properly he is doing at home hormone therapy, that puts both the dog and owner in jeopardy.


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## jaggirl47 (Jul 18, 2009)

GatorBytes said:


> It's the exact test my once conventional vet used 30+ yrs in the business...he was the owner of the practice (and a drug promoter) and determined no mites based on it...he wanted to use steroids...I refused.


 
I never said it couldn't work, but I would not trust it for an at home diagnostic tool. Like I said, my dogs scratch when I clean their ears out. That doesn't mean they have mange, it means they are scratching at the ear I am cleaning.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

jaggirl47 said:


> I'm sorry, but the OP needs to take his dog to the vet to get a diagnosis. If this dog actually has something contagious to humans and instead of treating it properly he is doing at home hormone therapy, that puts both the dog and owner in jeopardy.


The op can do noted as well and on top of...once they go to the vet. they need to determine a cause for treatment course.

Dog is scratching, may have scratched off the mites, they won't be found and the vet may suggest doing ivermectin treatment "just in case" which is wrong. Steroids would be wrong as they do not treat the cause and will exacerbate the issue.

And canine mites are self limiting on humans - about two weeks, they don't reproduce and spread...a soak in goldenseal tea will take care of the itch (in humans)...oh, OP...that would also help the itchy ears...1 bag per cup boiling water, bring to room temp and cleanse with that, then put on coconut oil


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

*Update*

So we took her into the vet, and strangely enough, she didn't know what it was...  She took quite a few scrapings of her ear, and two other spots we discovered issues with (which I'll explain below), and looked under the microscope there, but didn't see anything strange.

Before going in, while washing her with a medicated Shampoo (Hexadene by Virbac), I felt a rough spot on her ski, on her back, like 6 inches away from her tail. When looking closer, the hair was coming off in clumps, and the skin was sort of old and yellow and mushy, like a scab that's sitting in water for an hour... It is about an inch wide and two inches long. In the days since all the hair fell out and we washed it, the skin has gone a dark brown colour.

And on top of that, we noticed a few dried up blood clots on her head, as if she was bitten by some huge mosquito. They weren't just surface scabs - they were raised like pimples.

The vet initially suspected ringworm for the back, but the initial microscope viewing in her office didn't show it, so now the samples have been sent it to grow cultures to see if anything shows up, and if not, apparently, the next step is to do a skin biopsy... 

So $400 in at this point, and we still know nothing... We're treating it by rubbing Tinactin on the spots and spraying Vetericyn and adding DMG immune booster liquid in her food.

At least it's not expanding to other parts of her body at this point and is localized, though seems like 3 different issues (ears, head and patch on back).

Would anyone get a second opinion or have ideas what each could be?
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## Lilie (Feb 3, 2010)

It sorta reminds me of 'rain rot' on a horse. What type of insects is your dog around? We have bot flies that will do something like that to your dog's ear & head, but doesn't cause the large wound like the one pictured on your last picture. However, the vet would have seen that in the scraping.


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## Courtney (Feb 12, 2010)

I'm sorry your going through this with your girl...so hard to pinpoint.

Glad they are sending cultures out...should take 2 weeks (ringworm is still in question). It almost seems like somesort of fungal infection, could also be a secondary bacterial infection...is she scratching alot?

Autoimmune and being a GSD....were there any conversations about lupus (although typically seen with discolored skin/white)?

Just random thoughts...


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

I would go to a vet dermatologist. They see in one day what a GP vet probably sees in 6 months. It's a shortcut and can save time, money, pain/misdiagnosis for the dog. https://www.acvd.org/locator/locations.asp?ctry=Canada You have a lot of the testing started already so that will help.


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## Courtney (Feb 12, 2010)

Lilie said:


> It sorta reminds me of 'rain rot' on a horse. What type of insects is your dog around? We have bot flies that will do something like that to your dog's ear & head, but doesn't cause the large wound like the one pictured on your last picture. However, the vet would have seen that in the scraping.


Good observation!

I really like this product and have had success using it when we go hiking on the hotter months.


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

We live in the city, in Vancouver, so Pacific Northwest area, which rains a lot. Though when we get back from walks, we dry her, and she's an indoor dog too. Very few insects and stuff I'd say. A few walks in local parks/woods, but nothing too special.

That Pro-Tect spray seems like the Vetericyn Wound and Skin Care spray I've been using on her, so I'll keep at it. But Vetericyn doesn't seem to have the anti-fungal properties Pro-Tect has. At least that's where Tinactin will help hopefully.

I love the tip on going to a vet dermatologist though, thanks! :wild: Hadn't even crossed my mind! I wondering why our vet would suggest a skin biopsy as the next step if the cultures show nothing. The dermatologist I called thought the same (they usually do them when there's a lump or something). When the cultures come back, unless something definitive is in there, I'm going to ask to be referred to the local dermatologist, as they deal with this stuff all day long.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

as a proactive step in case it is mange you can use this shampoo Defendex Amazon.com: Defendex All-Natural Flea, Tick, and Mange Shampoo for Dogs and Cats. Homeopathic Pet Shampoo Naturally Washes Away Flea, Tick, Mange and Scabies Infestations. Addresses All Stages of Life Cycle Including Eggs. 1 Bottle - Direct from Manu

great for fleas , ticks , scabies..... I have recommended this before to forum members and they were happy with the results.

I use it for "found" animals (meaning dumped on my doorstep) , they get a good shampoo before coming in - very safe , good for dogs, horses , and cats and that is saying something about safety since cats have such a thin skin.


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## k9carrie (Oct 22, 2012)

My shepherd had strange "blisters" that came up on his ears. He also lost the hair in these spots. I tried fly relellant & anti fungal to no avail. The spots slowly cleared up with cortizone cream. Never another problem. Good luck!


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

We're using the Hexadene shampoo by Virbac right now, which seems to be good for skin conditions such as ringworm, which is what's suspected right now, and are waiting for the culture to grow and confirm. It says it is to be used as "an aid in the treatment of superficial skin conditions caused by bacteria, fungi, ringworm, and yeasts which may be sensitive to the action of chlorhexidine."

Our vet looked at the scrapings under a microscope while we were there, and from what I understand, should have shown the mange mites, which she said she doesn't have.

Hopefully this culture will indicate what it is, and it turns out to be ringworm so then we can treat it. I hate not knowing what it is and just waiting... The area of her skin also doesn't correspond to what ringworm looks like, which further makes it a mystery... 

But then we'll still be left with the question of why she got it in the first place, as that typically happens only to dogs with suppressed immune systems, and I'd have hoped that's not the case with her as she's so well taken care of...


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

can you post a picture which would show her full body condition?


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## 4TheDawgies (Apr 2, 2011)

could it be ring worm?


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

> Our vet looked at the scrapings under a microscope while we were there, and from what I understand, should have shown the mange mites, which she said she doesn't have.


Sarcoptic isn't' always found on scrapes.


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

carmspack said:


> can you post a picture which would show her full body condition?


I could do so tonight, though her coat's perfectly fine everywhere else. I practically went over every inch of her with my bare hands when washing her last week (not gloved, so I could feel every little thing), except for her stomach. It's literally the 3 areas I've described, so very localized. What would you like to see?



4TheDawgies said:


> could it be ring worm?


That's what the vet suspects / hopes. She used a black light in her office, but it didn't show anything, though it's not totally conclusive, which is why we've sent off for cultures to develop.



msvette2u said:


> Sarcoptic isn't' always found on scrapes.


But I hear that it's very itchy, and she hardly itches herself, except on the head (the little blood clots) when she was doing a few times an hour (before I got the cone on her). Every time the little things on her head would heal and scab over, she'd scratch them off again, hence the cone.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

When you scratch her ears (the edges) does her hind leg try to scratch?


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

msvette2u said:


> When you scratch her ears (the edges) does her hind leg try to scratch?


No...  I read about that tip in the Wiki article. The lab did a cytosis(?) test already with the scrapings, and the results came back with nothing. But I'd hope if a simple case of mange was what is going on, they should have figured it out by now.


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## msvette2u (Mar 20, 2006)

You'd be surprised


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## Lotus99 (Apr 22, 2011)

A one year update: So about a month ago, to my surprise, she started itching more than usual, and when looking over her, I found another dead patch of hair again on the back, just above her tail. Pretty close to where it was last year. I was blown away it had come back almost exactly to the year. Nothing on her ears though.

I figured maybe it's like GatorBytes above said happens to her dog every year, at the same time, and it's something to ignore.

So we went in to the vet anyway, as she was due for her annual, and we were checking her out, and looked under her belly as well, as I had seen some scabs there, and then we see this little black flea running across her tummy!

So the vet now thinks that it's a flea bite that she's allergic too, and most likely, last year was the same thing, though oddly enough, we ran all these tests on her and took scrapes and checked for fleas, but nothing showed up. She said though unless you get lucky and the flea is picked up in the scrape, it is hard to pick up in the tests.

So we put her on two doses of Advantage II, and I will proactively give her two doses next year in early September, which is when flea season here starts. I think it makes sense, as last year, we ended up putting her on two doses of Revolution, which is for both sarcoptic mange and fleas, and the problem did seem to clear up after, come to think of it.

So it seems at least the mystery is solved! Phew!


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