# Advice and Suggestions



## Gwyllgi (Aug 16, 2017)

Hi, I am looking into purchasing a GSD pup or young adult in 2018.

I have owned GSD's since 1983, from rescues to show line shepherds. My late father had owned GSD's since 1938, so you could say that my families life revolved around the GSD. I said good bye to my last shepherd in 2010, and then work took me over seas for several years. I have now returned home and would like to have another shepherd in my life.

I am looking into working lines either DDR / Czech / WGWL or other East European working lines. As my previous shepherds have been show lines, I know nothing of the working lines.

The dog would live indoors but have access to an enclosed kennel 6' H x 4'W x 8'L run, should I need to house when we have a lot of visitors. The temperament must be excellent as young children visit quite regular; the children will be taught how to behave and respect the dog.
There is small male dog living in the house, so I have to keep that in mind.

I have worked in the past in rescue kennels and have dealt with breeds other than the GSD such as APBT, Akitas, Malinoises, Rottweilers and Dobermans. I currently work with scent detection dogs that are very high energy.

I would have the dog trained in family protection and I would like to do IPO if possible, however I work week ends and most comps are on the week end. I am interested in doing tracking or possibly scent detection.

I want a dog that will work but switch off when needed

The dog would be exercised for 3hrs in the morning and 3 hrs in the evening as an adult, as a pup the exercise would be adjusted for the pups bone development. The exercise will consist of long hikes, frisbee and ball games, during those times the pup will receive obedience and socialization skills. Once or twice a week I will take him/her to hydro therapy.

One of my colleagues has KNPV dogs and will advise on protection work.

What advise could you offer me when choosing the right pup or what would you suggest for me from the above criteria?

Thank you so much.


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## Mary Beth (Apr 17, 2010)

I would suggest to begin by looking into the differences between showline and working line. When you have decided on the type of puppy you want, then to start finding a breeder.

An overview of the breed types:

German Shepherd Breed Types: Which is Right for You?

Older threads on the differences of working line and showline:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/finding-right-puppy/614890-working-line-vs-show-line.html

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/finding-right-puppy/611018-working-vs-show-line-family-dog.html

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...9114-better-choice-working-show-line-gsd.html

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...rsonal-experience-owning-working-vs-show.html


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## Gwyllgi (Aug 16, 2017)

Mary Beth said:


> I would suggest to begin by looking into the differences between showline and working line. When you have decided on the type of puppy you want, then to start finding a breeder.


I have no interest in show lines, I am looking into working lines. I would like to know the differences between DDR, Czech, West German working lines and other European working lines. 

From what I have been told is that the WGWL are the crème de la crème of the working lines and have very high prey drives.

Just looking for more opinions from people who have working lines.


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## Sam2084 (Aug 14, 2017)

Need expert opinion. I'm posting head shot of two puppies. Can someone tell me whether they'll be long coat or stock coat. I'm just curious and can't wait for 6 weeks. They are presently 2.5 weeks. They have curls in hair. And appear to be fluffier. Anxiously waiting for ur opinion.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

ask the breeder 

is it that important?

what are the parents?


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## Sam2084 (Aug 14, 2017)

carmspack said:


> ask the breeder
> 
> is it that important?
> 
> what are the parents?


Father is long coat mother is stock coat. It's my home kept pair. Coat isn't that important. I'm just curious.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Hey Sam, you stole the OP's thread!


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## Sam2084 (Aug 14, 2017)

wolfy dog said:


> Hey Sam, you stole the OP's thread!


Really. Dint know. Newbie issues. Was my first post. Anyhow still waiting for someone to give some opinion on wat I have asked.


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## Tennessee (Apr 13, 2017)

If you know how to train a working dog, you have a buddy with extensive experience to help you with bitework and you're willing to give a dog 6 friggin hours of work a day, I can't see you ending up with any dog you couldn't handle. 

Short of going to Europe you're probably not going to get a pure DDR or Czech line dog. I wouldn't say WGWL's are the premier dog anymore, I believe that title would go to DDR/Czech crosses or WGWL/Czech crosses or a blend of all three lines. But that's a gross generalization as I'll get to in a moment. 

After the wall fell, American WL breeders were able to get outstanding dogs for CHEAP from former Eastern Bloc countries. And naturally that's where things have stayed to some degree, German's are significantly more wealthy and particular about THEIR breed. 

Hopefully many others will chime in here, but from what I've read and seen DDR dogs were meant to be fixed position guard dogs (think two fences in the Berlin Wall serving as their kennel). They were often intentionally starved to make them meaner, and they were expected to be vicious and more independent of their handlers. They are also larger and bulkier as they would have to hold down a highly motivated person trying to escape, potentially on their own for some time until a handler could reach them to assisst. This was also IN Germany, they had an established program with many many dogs to choose from, so being a fast developing dog wasn't a major concern. They'd rather hold the dog back longer to get the size and traits they wanted, they could afford to. 

Czech line dogs were used mainly to assist the border patrol in preventing Eastern Bloc citizens from escaping across the border into West Germany or Austria. An area of mountains and deep forests. They also didn't have the same established breeding program and it was largely the efforts of one man who set up the Z Pohranicni straze kennels and hand selected the breeding pairs to develop the ideal dog. Naturally you can guess how the dogs would be different from their DDR counterparts, smaller, faster, develop sooner, more biddable less aggressive, etc etc.

Also both lines above are usually darker coated than a traditional GSD and are more often than not Sable in color.

WGWL are traditional GSDs used for military, police, and sport dog training. They were far less regulated in their breeding programs (total state control will do that LOL) so you'll typically see more variation in temperaments compared to someone breeding more true to type of the other two mentioned. 

Now I said all of that just to be helpful and answer your specific question to the best of my knowledge, but for the most part *MOST OF THE ABOVE MEANS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING*. The wall fell nearly 30 years ago, there could be 15 or more generations between an original DDR or Czech dog and what you end up buying. They could have been cross bred a million different ways. 

Just start a new thread and ask for recommendations on breeders and use the excellent descriptors you used in your post, but add max cost, and the farthest distance you'll accept a dog from. That will be much more helpful in your search.


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## Gwyllgi (Aug 16, 2017)

@Tennessee:
Thank you for your reply, it was very thorough and just what I was looking for.

I will take your advice and ask for recommendations about breeders.


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