# Puppy Home Alone 12 hours , 3 days a Week



## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Hello everyone,

We are planning on buying a GSD puppy soon. We currently have a Chihuahua puppy about 9 years old.

Due to our work schedule on 3 days a week the puppy will be home alone by himself.

Is this safe for the puppy to be home alone for 12 hours?

Puppies can not hold pee/poop in this long, right?

Perhaps there is a very big size crate/gate for him to play in while we are away. And I buy him some toys.

If this help for my scenario, I am planning putting the GSD in Basic and Advance Obedience Training School for 4-8 weeks to assit with training. 


Thank you


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

I would say you can't realistically expect to housetrain a puppy who is left alone 12 hours a day. You'll have to have someone come in multiple times (and A LOT when it's little; I'm not sure that'd be realistic). Our adults can go 12 hours without going out but we don't do that - would you want to go 12 hours without peeing? I sure wouldn't. 

And that's without the exercise/enrichment/training the puppy will need that you won't be able to give it when it's gone that long.


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## Honey Maid (Dec 25, 2020)

Do you have a REAL secure fenced yard, in a decent neighborhood?? What worked for me, when I was still working, I had a back porch I could leave open, and a real secure, wood fenced yard. I was able to leave my puppy in the back yard, and if the weather turned inclement she could go into the back porch. Now, that was in 1987, when people did not steal dogs out of back yards. I can't remember if I was on 8 hour shifts or 12's back then.


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

The thing with 12 hour shifts, is they really turn into 13-14 hours away because of commute. I have had my dogs alone for times like that, but not regularly. They were kinda spaz when I did. Mine were also older. I wouldn’t say it’s unsafe, depending on the dog and how it’s kept. There are kennel dogs kept outside longer than that. It’s something I would avoid if at all possible.


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## Baileyshuman (Apr 26, 2021)

Maybe you could try daycare for the days you are working?

My pup is 6 months and we tend not to leave him for more than four hours. That being said, we're going out for seven hours tomorrow (our longest trip so far). As a young puppy, Bailey had to be taken out every two and a half hours, so might not be great for a little pup.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Find a reliable house sitter/dog walker who can come in several times a day to let the dog out and play.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Twelve hours is a lifetime for a pup. I would say that is unfair and unrealistic. I have left adult dogs alone for that long and longer when necessary but I certainly did not make a habit of it. I would not do it to a pup. An 8 hour work day is one thing, people work but come on.
So a 12 hour shift, an hour at least in commute time, sleeping and eating. Where does the pup fit in?


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

My friend has a pack of dogs and works 12 hr shifts. When they were each puppies, she used a trusted dog person to take them all out and showed the sitter how to work with the dogs to get in some extra training. The up side is that she has 3-4 days off every week so she actually has more time with her dogs than most people who work 5 days a week. Sometimes she works nights so the dogs are asleep while she is at work and don’t need a sitter. They adapted to her schedule,


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## Buckelke (Sep 4, 2019)

Not to be unkind, but a puppy needs supervision and attention along with training. You would be keeping a feral animal and find it almost impossible to live with for that few hours you would be spending with it Perhaps it is just not a good time to get a dog. Think of the dog instead of what you want.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Not always. My friend has a SAR and a therapy dog. All German Shepherds.


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

NO, your puppy can't hold it for 12 hours. I wouldn't expect an adult dog to hold it for that long. Think about how many trips you make to the bathroom in 12 hours.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I gave a puppy to my sister, whose household has 3 adults and 2 fourteen year olds. Of course fourteen year olds don't drive and have all kinds of extra-curriculars. The adults have businesses together and I think all three are have professional work schedules (so 60 hours/week minimum). My sister works from home almost entirely, but the girls are hers, so she is the one that has to cart them here and there. The pup is getting different time from each of the people and it is working out. However, the pup has already eaten two socks (2 vet visits) and a toy -- the toy did come out on its own, but even so. Leaving a pup for 12 hours with toys may not be such a good idea. A pup that is bored, will often develop undesirable, even destructive and self-harming behaviors. Some have chewed on their bodies and tails, and if that gets bad people have had to amputate the tail. A GSD without a tail is really sad. You have to have a plan going into this this thing, and the plan cannot include a baby-pup being alone for 12 hours. It is way too long.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Thank you all very very much. 

Yes, 3 days out of the week the wife and I leave home at 6am and do not pull up to the house until 6pm. So we will be gone for 12 hours. 

I will talk to my daughter or a very trusted friend or neighbor to come in and let the puppy out side. Or bring the puppy to a sitter on these 3 days we are away.

Perhaps I can build a doggy door for the back yard door and secure the back year very very well with seal fence and a Ring Cameras for burglars. PETSAFE Plastic Door, Medium - Chewy.com

I think the doggy door will be a good idea and my daughter stopping by to let the puppy out when we are away those days will work. 

But I need to get this arranged before buying the puppy. You all are correct, I can not leave the dog alone for 12 hours, it is too long. 


Thank you all and I welcome more advice for our situation.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

If I were a breeder I wouldn't sell a pup with this amount of time being alone. Why not get a healthy adult with good bladder and bowel control?


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

A doggy door is NOT going to train your puppy to go outside to do its business! They don't learn this on their own, they need to be taught, and this takes close supervision.


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## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

darrell107 said:


> I will talk to my daughter or a very trusted friend or neighbor to come in and let the puppy out side. Or bring the puppy to a sitter on these 3 days we are away.


Can't stress enough that it isn't just access to the outdoors to potty that your puppy needs early on, it's engagement and play and direction! So, if you have somebody that can provide that on the days you have to work, and the rest of the time you're committed to doing that, it can work. Otherwise, you will have problems. And they won't be your puppy's doing. 

Can you time things to take some vacation time when the puppy comes home initially? That would definitely help!

The point is, puppies when young need input. They are sponges! The habits they develop early stick. Bad or good...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

A doggy door is a good thing, but I would suggest a kennel within your secured back yard. Privacy fencing around the yard, and a kennel on concrete within your back yard. This is why and it still may not work entirely. If your pup is alone and bored, it will go out there looking for anything interesting. And it will cry, and bark, and carry on. Dogs are pack animals, they are raised in a litter, and they are not good at being alone. Privacy fencing will block the view to neighboring activities and, more importantly, block the view of your puppy from brats and thieves. Hopefully. Also, it is pretty easy to look for wear and tear on a kennel, but a yard, it is hard to maintain the entire fence line if your pup is home all day digging. Your pup gets out and becomes road-pizza -- happens. The meter reader comes through and opens your gate, you don't know it and put the dog in his in/out for the day, and road-pizza -- happens. Much better to have a kennel within your secure back yard so that even if a latch is not totally secured, and he gets out of it, he is still in the yard. And one day in the yard, may not be enough for him to find a way out of your fencing. It's an added line of security. But if you just put him in the yard itself, and he barks at kids going by, they will taunt him, and some will throw stones at him, or run a stick along the fencing. 

On the inside you will need an x-pen that will keep him in that area near his doggy door, so he does not eat the couch and everything else that isn't nailed down. Socks. Toys. This is good stuff to have even if you are home. He has his in/out when you are busy doing stuff. But when you take him out, you can use the whole yard with him. So 3 days a week he goes to daycare or Grandma's or somewhere, and the rest of the time, he has a safe place when you don't have your eyes glued onto him, and you give him tons of attention when he is out, and it may work out.


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## poconoman (Dec 7, 2020)

Sorry, a GSD is not for you right now. There has to be someone there at all times. The pup needs to bond with you and be trained. You cannot expect to learn by itself. Like a human child, they need to be raised and taught. Like Wolfy Dog said, a reputable breeder would not sell you a pup in those time settings. Think of the pup's best interest. If you don't, you're being cruel and the pup will resent you AND you'll have tons of behavior problems. 

You've been warned.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Would it be possible to stagger your and your spouse's schedules? Could you work alternate days and not the same ones? That way someone would always be home with the pup.

Eight hours is too long for a puppy. Twelve is out of the question.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Honest truth, this is a terrible situation to bring a puppy into, the definition of disaster waiting to happen. And no one has even asked what if there's an issue between the GSD and your tiny Chihuahua?

DON'T get this dog while you have this work situation, it's a perfect recipe for am untrained large and destructive, perhaps dangerous dog. You'll be here in tears in a few weeks. It's not just wrong for every puppy but the worst breed to try this with; they can be ticking time bombs when "raised" this way. jmo, don't even think about it.


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## Cat Mom Adopts German Boy (Jan 4, 2021)

A GSD puppy is a FULL time job. Literally 24 hours at first. They need your guidance and direction at all times. What you put in, effort wise, is what you'll get back in return. Therefore if half the time this pup is alone or just being managed, you'll have a literal wild animal on your hands. It's a disaster waiting to happen. Aside from that, it's really unfair to this pup who will have so much potential but will likely just become a problem and realistically rehomed.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

wolfy dog said:


> If I were a breeder I wouldn't sell a pup with this amount of time being alone. Why not get a healthy adult with good bladder and bowel control?


Hello wolfy, 

Thanks for that statement. A breeder will be in right to ask me this as well. I am glad I brought up the question.

This is a good idea as well to buy a healthy adult for our scenario. Even adoption will be a viable thing to do.


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## Clipper (May 7, 2021)

darrell107 said:


> Thank you all very very much.
> 
> Yes, 3 days out of the week the wife and I leave home at 6am and do not pull up to the house until 6pm. So we will be gone for 12 hours.
> 
> ...


When I did home visits for GSD rescues, doggie doors would render potential adopters ineligible, unless they agreed to remove them.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

tim_s_adams said:


> Can't stress enough that it isn't just access to the outdoors to potty that your puppy needs early on, it's engagement and play and direction! So, if you have somebody that can provide that on the days you have to work, and the rest of the time you're committed to doing that, it can work. Otherwise, you will have problems. And they won't be your puppy's doing.
> 
> Can you time things to take some vacation time when the puppy comes home initially? That would definitely help!
> 
> The point is, puppies when young need input. They are sponges! The habits they develop early stick. Bad or good...


Hello tim_s_adams, 

Thank you for the input and comments. Very helpful. One thing to add is I do have a 10 year old Chihuahua the puppy can engage with as well. 

Yes, when I first get puppy, I do plan to take off work for about 10 days to be fully engaged with the puppy during those days. 

I welcome any more advice and comments from everyone. 

Thank you,


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

I would never, ever leave a chihuahua alone with a GSD puppy. That's just asking for trouble and could easily result in a seriously injured or dead small dog. It can happen if you are standing right next to them. It's not that the pup would be aggressive, but they play rough and don't know any boundaries at that age. Their pouncing on a small dog in play can be a major disaster.

This situation just sounds worse and worse to me. Please consider adopting an adult if you have to get another dog. And maybe consider a different breed.


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## Sitz&Platz (Oct 20, 2012)

I'll give you a little background on what we have done with our puppies in the past, and why I wouldn't recommend leaving a puppy at home by itself. A bit long, but hopefully it helps.

We had to leave 2 of our puppies alone during the day after we got them, and I was also working 3 days a week with both of them. One was 12 weeks old when we got her, and I was able to take the first 2 weeks off. I was leaving home at 8 am, coming back at noon for a potty break and walk, and my husband was getting home before 4 pm. It wasn't ideal, but we made it work.

A few years later we got another puppy (my now almost 9 year old GSD), we were gone for 10+ hours a day, I was still working 3 days, my husband was working 5 days per week. We got Dexter at almost 9 weeks, and after spending the first 2 weeks with him, it was back to work for me, and our dogs had a safe space in the airconditioned garage with access to the backyard. Again, we made it work. I do want to add that our puppies were always with the another older dog and never completely alone. Dexter stayed with our Maltese, and there was never an issue. I understand people's valid concerns when it comes to leaving small dogs with large dogs, but our Maltese has never been around small dogs, and there has never been a problem.

We currently have a 22 week old GSD puppy, I now own my own business and work from home permanently. Let me start by saying that there is a huge difference between a 12 week old puppy and an 8 week old puppy that's still tripping over its own feet. Even one week makes a difference in very young puppies regarding their development. Tony, our current GSD puppy is very different from Dexter. They're both smart, but Tony is a very curious guy, and has no understanding of caution, fear, or what could potentially be a dangerous situation. One day we were playing in the yard and he found a snake. Luckily I was there and it wasn't a venomous snake. Then he got his head stuck in the fence when I turned around for one second. Again, luckily I was there to cut him out of the metal fence. Another time his head got stuck under the wooden gate on our patio while I looked away for a second. I don't want to bore you with more examples, but luckily I was there for all of his shenanigans, able to help. But I do ask myself, what if I hadn't been there to rescue him?

When we were in the market for our first GSD, I contacted one breeder, told her that I was was away 3 days a week for 10 hours, and she refused to sell me a puppy. I remember being really upset, I mean REALLY upset, because I knew that I was a great and responsible dog owner and what in the world was that person thinking? We ended up getting our GSD from a different breeder at that time, but fast forward to today, and I will be the first person to tell you that the breeder was right and I was wrong. It all worked out because of Dexter's personality and because we were very lucky.

Puppies require a lot of work, supervision, training, and sleepless nights, and an 8 week old puppy is just like a baby. Knowing what I know now, I would always get a dog that's 6 months old or older if I still had to work outside the house. I know that most people have to work and can't stay at home with their dogs, and having been on both ends of the coin, I don't judge people for their decisions. But I do think that it's important to think about possible dangers and consequences when deciding to leave a very young puppy by itself for hours at a time. Going for an older puppy will be a lot easier for you and the dog.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

poconoman said:


> Sorry, a GSD is not for you right now. There has to be someone there at all times. The pup needs to bond with you and be trained. You cannot expect to learn by itself. Like a human child, they need to be raised and taught. Like Wolfy Dog said, a reputable breeder would not sell you a pup in those time settings. Think of the pup's best interest. If you don't, you're being cruel and the pup will resent you AND you'll have tons of behavior problems.
> 
> You've been warned.


Hello poconoman, 

Thank you so much for your respectful honesty. No, please be blunt as I want to be fair to my puppy and his upbringing and my wife. 

So even if just 3 days a week gone for 12 hours a day, the GSD puppy is not recommended for me?

Can you please explain a bit more why this part you stated "There has to be someone there at all times." ? 

Thank you, I am just learning.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Hello Everyone, 

If this helps our situation, I am planning on putting the GSD in Basic and Advance Obedience Training School for 4-8 weeks to assist with training. 

Please let me know if its still a bad idea for me with this extra training. I really appreciate it and trying to do the responsible thing for myself, breeder , and GSD puppy. If I have to wait, or consider another option, I have to do it.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

I am very surprised how few people actually said this is not a good idea.

You have a nine-year-old Chihuahua (or 10-year-old, depending on which post I read from you ) and you want to bring a large, active, powerful, difficult working breed dog into your home and intend to leave it alone for 12 hour stretches.

You believe the old Chihuahua can engage with the puppy.

What could go wrong?

Bluntly: this is a terrible idea. If you need another dog, get another Chihuahua, a GSD is difficult for those of us who work from home, and have all the time in the world to devote to the dog, I just don’t see how it could work in your situation.

What gave you the idea to get a GSD in the first place?

I’m having a difficult time believing this post is on the up and up.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

selzer said:


> A doggy door is a good thing, but I would suggest a kennel within your secured back yard. Privacy fencing around the yard, and a kennel on concrete within your back yard. This is why and it still may not work entirely. If your pup is alone and bored, it will go out there looking for anything interesting. And it will cry, and bark, and carry on. Dogs are pack animals, they are raised in a litter, and they are not good at being alone. Privacy fencing will block the view to neighboring activities and, more importantly, block the view of your puppy from brats and thieves. Hopefully. Also, it is pretty easy to look for wear and tear on a kennel, but a yard, it is hard to maintain the entire fence line if your pup is home all day digging. Your pup gets out and becomes road-pizza -- happens. The meter reader comes through and opens your gate, you don't know it and put the dog in his in/out for the day, and road-pizza -- happens. Much better to have a kennel within your secure back yard so that even if a latch is not totally secured, and he gets out of it, he is still in the yard. And one day in the yard, may not be enough for him to find a way out of your fencing. It's an added line of security. But if you just put him in the yard itself, and he barks at kids going by, they will taunt him, and some will throw stones at him, or run a stick along the fencing.
> 
> On the inside you will need an x-pen that will keep him in that area near his doggy door, so he does not eat the couch and everything else that isn't nailed down. Socks. Toys. This is good stuff to have even if you are home. He has his in/out when you are busy doing stuff. But when you take him out, you can use the whole yard with him. So 3 days a week he goes to daycare or Grandma's or somewhere, and the rest of the time, he has a safe place when you don't have your eyes glued onto him, and you give him tons of attention when he is out, and it may work out.


Thank you selzer for the input. 

Very good input. My back yard is wood fence. I was not planning on letting him roam outside in the back yard while we are not home. 

It seems like my biggest problem or challenge is being away for 3 days week , 12 hours each day.

I agree with the play pen while we are at home.


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## Cat Mom Adopts German Boy (Jan 4, 2021)

Sunflowers said:


> I am very surprised how few people actually said this is not a good idea.
> 
> You have a nine-year-old Chihuahua (or 10-year-old, depending on which post I read from you ) and you want to bring a large, active, powerful, difficult working breed dog into your home and intend to leave it alone for 12 hour stretches.
> 
> ...


Actually I counted 16 people saying this is a bad idea in one way or another. I would call that most.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sunflowers said:


> I am very surprised how few people actually said this is not a good idea.
> 
> You have a nine-year-old Chihuahua (or 10-year-old, depending on which post I read from you ) and you want to bring a large, active, powerful, difficult working breed dog into your home and intend to leave it alone for 12 hour stretches.
> 
> ...


Hello Sunflowers,

Thank you for the response. This is serious post for sure. I've always wanted a GSD or Labrador the past 7 years, but work had me busy. I love dogs as boy, but career and kids took a bit time away from me. I did have a yellow Labrador from 2010 - 2013, but he passed. I initially wanted another yellow Labrador, but just recently changed my want to GSD.

I am happy we are having this conversation to give me a dose of reality. I am still learning the GSD, so everyone here is definitely helping.

Question:

After a year, does the GSD still require full time attention daily?

Thank you,


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Cat Mom Adopts German Boy said:


> A GSD puppy is a FULL time job. Literally 24 hours at first. They need your guidance and direction at all times. What you put in, effort wise, is what you'll get back in return. Therefore if half the time this pup is alone or just being managed, you'll have a literal wild animal on your hands. It's a disaster waiting to happen. Aside from that, it's really unfair to this pup who will have so much potential but will likely just become a problem and realistically rehomed.


Hello Cat Mom Adopts German Boy, 

Thank you for the input. 

When the GSD turns 1 years old and older, is it still a full time job? Would it matter if if we are away for 12 hours a day, 3 days a week. 

I am just asking to get educated, so I understand my challenges and problem. From what I am reading and comprehending from everyone is that my current situation will NOT work for a GSD puppy and highly discourage and not good idea. 

Lol, wish I can retire from work for 2 years and then come back.


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## jarn (Jul 18, 2007)

Re: the chihuahua and the puppy...we have a ~25lb beagle. Not SMALL, but not big. Agis is not the size of a full-grown GSD (he's a mix) but he's around 54lbs and all muscle. He and Xerxes (our beagle) played together when Agis was young happily. Then Agis got bigger, and he continued played rowdy (like a GSD is likely to do), but there was a real size imbalance. We had to really supervise for months on months on months; though Agis did figure out he was not to play with Xerxes. Months later he came to the 'play gently' conclusion on his own, and they play well together, but we still supervise and they are not left alone together. And that's only a 54lb to 25lb difference. Nothing like what you're contemplating, that will be so much worse, especially if they're alone together during those 12 hour days. And a 9 or 10 year old dog will not have matching energy levels. 

A year old GSD puppy requires a lot of exercise...and training (which I know you've said you'd do...but you need to work on it every day, and how will you do it when you're away for 12 hour days on those days?). If Agis had been left alone for 12 hours 3 days a week at a year old...we would have had a nightmare on our hands. As it is he's enough of a handful, and I'm home every day (and my husband is home two days a week). 

I've been working from home due to COVID (started when he was around 6 or 7 months old; prior to that we had a dog walker come in 2x/day and between my husband's schedule and mine someone was home 3 days a week - days we were gone because my husband works retail and sometimes have a late shift he'd be alone for a couple of hours at most) but I still do stuff with him (multiple training and exercise sessions) throughout the day. Agis has done three different training classes, but doing obedience work is lifelong and so is exercise (just an FYI). 

Luc (GSD) I adopted when he was 4 and 'calmer' but he still had 10k/day walks and 5-10k/day runs. Every free moment was doing things with Luc. His longest run topped out at 40k, and his longest non-stop hike 60k (the bugger started to run at the end; I was like 'Give me a break, I'M tired). Probably not all GSDs exercise that much, but they can, is the point.


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## Sitz&Platz (Oct 20, 2012)

@darrell107, why do you want a GSD? What is it that attracts you to the breed? What's your plan once you get the dog, training, walking, play schedule on your work days and your off days? How much time do you want to devote to your dog(s)?


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

darrell107 said:


> Hello Sunflowers,
> 
> Thank you for the response. This is serious post for sure. I've always wanted a GSD or Labrador the past 7 years, but work had me busy. I love dogs as boy, but career and kids took a bit time away from me. I did have a yellow Labrador from 2010 - 2013, but he passed. I initially wanted another yellow Labrador, but just recently changed my want to GSD.
> 
> ...


A GSD is mature at 3, and well behaved, IF you train a lot during the first 3 years.
Still requires a lot of attention, yes, daily. 
This is a breed that needs lots of interaction. It’s not a breed that you can leave home alone, come back from work and sit on the couch and watch TV with the dog. I would strongly suggest you visit some clubs and look at some German Shepherds and talk to real life owners who can give you an education on the breed.
Choosing a dog based on looks is not enough, you have to know the reality of owning one.


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

Potty training:

did the pup?
Just wake up, take it out 
just eat, take it out
just drink, take it out 
been 20 minutes since last trip, take it out.

The well behaved GSD of your dreams take lots of work and that starts with a good foundation while it is a pup. Building a bond and trust is key and will be very hard to near impossible with your schedule.

Most adult dogs let puppies get away with behaviors that would cause a fight If an adult dog did the same. Many senior dog do not have the patience and will not tolerate puppy behavior. It can be very stressful for the senior dog and lead to fights. GSD pups have a huge amount of energy, are clumsy, play rough, and love doing annoying things to get a reaction, it is a lot fun and entertaining to them. Your small dog should never be left alone with the pup, pup needs supervision to keep from being a brat.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sitz&Platz said:


> @darrell107, why do you want a GSD? I like the GSD alpha look and their intelligence. I have always wanted one as I am not a very social person. I love dog parks and parks and long drives. The dog will join me. I have a strong passion for dogs and have consider shelter volunteer work in the future.  What is it that attracts you to the breed? I have not owned a GSD since I was about 9 years old which was 30 years ago, but always loved their loyal and bold look. And protective nature. What's your plan once you get the dog, training, walking, play schedule on your work days and your off days? My working days are Monday thru Thursday. I leave the house at 6am and do not return home until 6pm. Friday thur Sunday, I am off work. For training, I was going to put puppy in 4-8 weeks obedience school and private sessions for me and wife. Play time and walk time will be on Monday thru Thursday will be 6:30pm to 7:30pm. This will extend as needed at night if needed. On my wife off days during the week, she will also dedicate a 1 hour for play time if more hours is needed. Friday thru Sunday - multiple hours throughout the day as I am off work How much time do you want to devote to your dog(s)? Monday through Thursday 1-2 hours a day. Friday through Sunday about 3 hours or more as I am home often. Please let me know if more questions. I am learning and planning.


Hello Sitz&Platz, 

I answer your questions in red


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sunflowers said:


> A GSD is mature at 3, and well behaved, IF you train a lot during the first 3 years.
> Still requires a lot of attention, yes, daily.
> This is a breed that needs lots of interaction. It’s not a breed that you can leave home alone, come back from work and sit on the couch and watch TV with the dog. I would strongly suggest you visit some clubs and look at some German Shepherds and talk to real life owners who can give you an education on the breed.
> Choosing a dog based on looks is not enough, you have to know the reality of owning one.


Thank you Sunflowers for the response. 

Is my response to Sitz&Platz honestly enough time to dedicate attention to GSD daily?

I will visit my dog park near by and talk to some GSD owners.

I appreciate any other advice or comments.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

drparker151 said:


> The well behaved GSD of your dreams take lots of work and that starts with a good foundation while it is a pup. Building a bond and trust is key and will be very hard to near impossible with your schedule.


Thank you drparker151 for the response.

Just asking for my learning, what is the best time commitment for someone who wants to properly own a GSD?

From the comments, to own GSD, the owner must not have a Full-Time job (or retired from work) or just work from home.

I am trying to understand how other GSD owners dedicate the required time for their GSD with a full time job.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

I worked 15-18 hours a day when my current dog was a wee pup, and had two other dogs plus some other ones. Neighbors, co workers, my boss and the company payroll manager all pitched in. It helped that I was a dog handler so I had the freedom and means to take her with me. I also had the best nanny dog on the planet. 
Even with all that help it was a task, and the impact on our relationship was real. That came slamming home when my old girl died leaving a confused and lonely young dog with a grieving owner.
Does my dog love me? Of course she does, but this road we walk could have been so much easier if I had put the time and energy into her as a pup. 
As far as the Chi? No way, no how. Not today, tomorrow or anytime would I leave a GSD pup alone with a Chi. Mature dogs with a known relationship maybe, but a pup is asking for a problem. One pounce, one grab, one juvenile tantrum and it's over. 
If you are **** bent on a GSD find a good foster based rescue and adopt an adult, like a 5 or 6 year old adult.


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

You do not have enough time for a GSD pup. Instead take the time you have off Friday through Sunday to volunteer, work with GSD rescue, visit GSD clubs and watch what training is required. Find a nice older GSD to adopt. Our first GSD was from a GSD rescue group. 

After he passed I really wanted a GSD puppy. But knew I couldn’t dedicate the time needed while I worked. So we waited until I retired to get a puppy.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

darrell107 said:


> I am trying to understand how other owners dedicate the time with a full time job.


To this point, I am dedicated to my dogs. That means less sleep, shorter showers, less lounging around and no time out away from my dog. I work, and I hang out with the dog. The most social interaction I have had in the last year was visiting the lady delivering my dogs food. It was awesome, great time, great person. Dinning out is take out in the car or a picnic in the woods. No drinks with co workers, no sleeping in.


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

darrell107 said:


> Thank you drparker151 for the response.
> 
> Just asking for my learning, what is the best time commitment for someone who wants to properly own a GSD?
> 
> ...


Wake up two hours early everyday to work, bond and train with the pup, come home at lunch To spend time with the pup. Get home and spend an hour with the pup. After dinner spend an hour with the pup. Before bed spend another 90 minutes with the pup. Mid morning and mid afternoon have someone stop by to take pup out and play with it.

The time spent with pup listed above is not sitting in a room whit it while it is in a cage or pen. That is time you are actively engaged and focused on the puppy, longer than listed is even better. Just playing and bonding at first and then adding training as it gets older.

oh, this every day, rain, snow, your sick, doesn’t matter, every freaking day.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sabis mom said:


> I worked 15-18 hours a day when my current dog was a wee pup, and had two other dogs plus some other ones. Neighbors, co workers, my boss and the company payroll manager all pitched in. It helped that I was a dog handler so I had the freedom and means to take her with me. I also had the best nanny dog on the planet.
> Even with all that help it was a task, and the impact on our relationship was real. That came slamming home when my old girl died leaving a confused and lonely young dog with a grieving owner.
> Does my dog love me? Of course she does, but this road we walk could have been so much easier if I had put the time and energy into her as a pup.
> As far as the Chi? No way, no how. Not today, tomorrow or anytime would I leave a GSD pup alone with a Chi. Mature dogs with a known relationship maybe, but a pup is asking for a problem. One pounce, one grab, one juvenile tantrum and it's over.
> If you are **** bent on a GSD find a good foster based rescue and adopt an adult, like a 5 or 6 year old adult.


Hello Sabis mom,

Thank you for your story and your advice. I did not know young GSD puppy are that playful and could harm the chihuahua I currently have. My chihuahua can be grouchy sometime like a old man, he likes his peace and only wants to play about 20 minutes a day. 

If you can do over again, how many hours would you dedicate a day to GSD?


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## lrodptl (Nov 12, 2009)

Not fair to the dog,period.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

darrell107 said:


> Hello wolfy,
> 
> Thanks for that statement. A breeder will be in right to ask me this as well. I am glad I brought up the question.
> 
> This is a good idea as well to buy a healthy adult for our scenario. Even adoption will be a viable thing to do.


I think you can be more at ease with an adult. The only breed that comes to mind who is happy with these long hours alone would be a retired Greyhound as long they have a couch


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

drparker151 said:


> Wake up two hours early everyday to work, bond and train with the pup, come home at lunch To spend time with the pup. Get home and spend an hour with the pup. After dinner spend an hour with the pup. Before bed spend another 90 minutes with the pup. Mid morning and mid afternoon have someone stop by to take pup out and play with it.
> 
> The time spent with pup listed above is not sitting in a room whit it while it is in a cage or pen. That is time you are actively engaged and focused on the puppy, longer than listed is even better. Just playing and bonding at first and then adding training as it gets older.
> 
> oh, this every day, rain, snow, your sick, doesn’t matter, every freaking day.


Thank you drparker151, 

My job is far from the house, so I will not have time to come home during lunch to come home with the pup. So I would have to depend on my wife during her days off to bond and train with the pup on her days off. Yes, I may not have enough time during the week days during these first 3 years due to those long work hours 3 days a week. After work would be good. I will think about this longer. And get some more knowledge. Especially since having the chihuahua will require supervision while noone is home.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

wolfy dog said:


> I think you can be more at ease with an adult. The only breed that comes to mind who is happy with these long hours alone would be a retired Greyhound as long they have a couch


Thank you so much wolfy, 

You think adopting a GSD would be more favorable for our situation due to working hours? I do plan to spend alot of time with the GSD while not working and on off days. But it is like looking owning a GSD puppy right now is not in my, my wife or GSD pup best interest from the comments.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

drparker151 said:


> You do not have enough time for a GSD pup. Instead take the time you have off Friday through Sunday to volunteer, work with GSD rescue, visit GSD clubs and watch what training is required. Find a nice older GSD to adopt. Our first GSD was from a GSD rescue group.
> 
> After he passed I really wanted a GSD puppy. But knew I couldn’t dedicate the time needed while I worked. So we waited until I retired to get a puppy.


Thanks drparker151,

I will heavily consider a adopting a nice older GSD to adopt. Perhaps, I start a new thread for right GSD to adopt for our situation. And work with GSD rescue on my time off work as a volunteer as well.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sabis mom said:


> So a 12 hour shift, an hour at least in commute time, sleeping and eating. Where does the pup fit in?


Hello Sabis mom, 

I do not work 12 hour shift. I work 9 hour shift, but my job commute is far. So I leave home at 6am and do not return home until 6pm.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

darrell107 said:


> And work with GSD rescue on my time off work as a volunteer as well.


This is a good start. I would call them, and even if all they need is transport, you can still see GDSs, familiarize yourself with them, and talk to people who know all about them.

You say all you have is Monday through Thursday 1-2 hours a day. Friday through Sunday about 3 hours.
This is not enough.

Your post mentioned looks and more looks. Those looks come with a lot of dog, and in the wrong hands they become a disaster.

Do call the rescues and volunteer.
This will also show you how many are dumped and why.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

A lady who used to live in the basement apartment when I owned the kennel had a Shiloh shepherd (they are mostly GSD blood, but extra large). It did not get along well with her miniature pinscher.

As long as she was able to supervise, things went okay. Then, she went away on vacation for a couple of days, while I looked after the dogs. The Shiloh attacked the mini-pin, seriously injuring it. She blamed me for this happening, so the next time she went away, I made sure the mini-pin was kept separate from her other dogs. There had been a second attack of the mini-pin in the meantime, breaking its leg. Again, she blamed the person looking after her dogs. (Not me, this time.) 

The day after she got back home, all her dogs (3 Shilohs and the mini-pin) ran to the door when someone knocked. The Shiloh that didn't like the mini-pin grabbed it. One shake and it was dead. 😥

I have to admit I took great delight in hearing her say that it was entirely her OWN fault...

Don't let this happen to you. Large dogs often see small dogs as prey, especially if they bark a lot, which is one thing the mini-pin tended to do.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

My older Whippet hated the GSD pup to the core and decided to move into her dog sitter's home with her other older Whippets.
OP, don't give up on your dream of owning a GSD. Just wait until the right time. I waited two decades to find the right one.


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## Lexie’s mom (Oct 27, 2019)

Lexie is a pup from Craigslist, but she is like a unicorn of GSDs. The easiest dog that I’ve ever had. I had dogs since 1982 but she is our 1st GSD. I work from home and basically I was getting up around 5 am for a while and now I got used to it, can’t sleep, I get up early even now when kids are out of school and when Lexie is almost 2y.o and kind of looks like me in the morning.. do I have to go potty... I want to sleep!) I was also supervising her most of the day-that helped tremendously as far as not destroying the house, not chewing on anything, not chasing cats etc. I can not even imagine coming back from work and dealing with a high energy pup that needs exercises and a messed up house! You have no ideas what are you signing yourself for! Older mellow dog is a way to go.


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## Buckelke (Sep 4, 2019)

even adult GS's require a lot of supervision. Because they are intelligent and curious they can get into a lot of trouble on their own. 
"I want to go out now" can translate to the door frame getting ripped off. Or," I'm bored" can lead to counter surfing or couch dismantling. They can open doors and climb. It's like having a 2 year old child that will never grow up. We are home full time so there is always someone to annoy (can we go out and play?) (Can I have a cookie?) (etc.). My husband is threatening to get Duke a collar that says, "I do dumb things". Jake ate remotes and a cell phone (try calling your boss and telling him the dog ate your cell phone, it's only funny until they have to replace it.) We just go with the knowledge that the dog is smarter than the owner. He is, you know...


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Buckelke said:


> even adult GS's require a lot of supervision. Because they are intelligent and curious they can get into a lot of trouble on their own.
> "I want to go out now" can translate to the door frame getting ripped off. Or," I'm bored" can lead to counter surfing or couch dismantling. They can open doors and climb. It's like having a 2 year old child that will never grow up. We are home full time so there is always someone to annoy (can we go out and play?) (Can I have a cookie?) (etc.). My husband is threatening to get Duke a collar that says, "I do dumb things". Jake ate remotes and a cell phone (try calling your boss and telling him the dog ate your cell phone, it's only funny until they have to replace it.) We just go with the knowledge that the dog is smarter than the owner. He is, you know...


Agreed! At almost 11 years old Shadow is still crated when I am gone. Not because she is bad but because she is curious and makes scary choices, like climbing up on the fridge to see what I put in the cupboard or chasing the reflections of the shiny things along the pass through.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

darrell107 said:


> I am trying to understand how other GSD owners dedicate the required time for their GSD with a full time job.


i don’t get puppies.


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## Buckelke (Sep 4, 2019)

i _don’t get puppies. _

Us neither. Duke was the first puppy in a very long time, and the shelter had him as 2 years old and 90 lbs - an average adult male. But he turned out to be "much younger" as the vet observed when she looked in his mouth. He was challenging. But today he's housebroken and reasonably well behaved. We would have preferred an older dog, but we're the odd customer at the shelter. Elke was listed as 8 years old and she is older (graying). She is also the best behaved girl. Never gives us any trouble. There is a lot to be said for taking an older dog.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

I waited 9 years for the right time to get my pup. I wouldn't trade that time for 143 puppies. 

I think you should do it right or not do it at all.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

Fodder said:


> i don’t get puppies.


I totally love puppies. Their Jello brains and willingness to learn. I love it.

I will only take on a puppy when I have 8 hours a day to commit to said puppy. That's a real number. Every
available moment, I spend with the puppy. 

My 14 month old puppy was off leash in a bar for 3 hours tonight. You don't get there without serious commitment.

I almost always recommend getting an adult dog. A good pup is a serious commitment in time, energy and work.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Everyone wants puppies, but adult dogs are generally easier. Generally. But when you do get a puppy it is sure nice to have a good solid adult dog that can help raise the pup.

I work full time, am single, live alone, and commute to work. Right now, it is only 45minutes each way. But around 10-12 years ago, it was 3 hours a day. It is amazing what young people can do. I used to drive home from work, grab whoever wasn't currently in heat, and rush to training classes about 40 minutes away. And, I titled dogs (plural) that year. Joy was a baby puppy when I was working at GE (1.5 hours away, each way). I took her through Star puppy, twice, basic obedience, puppy agility, Canine Good Citizen, Rally classes, and conformation classes her first year, and titled her before she was two.

I could do this, because Joy was in with her mother until her mother presented me with Bear and her litter when Joy was about 10 months old. Then Joy was on her own, but in a kennel near her dam. Leaving a GSD all alone for 12 hours is terrible, but they can be left with an older dog if you are certain that that is going to work out, and that is hard if you aren't experienced with dogs and with your lines and with the individual dog. Mother-daughter teams do work for me. Usually opposite sex dogs work out well. But it can also be a disaster. When I got Kojak, I brought Jenna (Joy's dam) with me to the airport to pick him up, and when we got home, in he went with her and that was that. But Jenna was an old brood bitch, who had been housed with her puppies for up to 3 years.

If you join a GS club, chances are you are going to be meeting breeders and people heavy into sport with multiple dogs, and often kennel setups. GSDs are intelligent, yes, but they do adapt. I have never seen a German Shepherd show "resentment" as someone suggested. When you take your puppy home, it knows only its dam and littermates and the breeder, after a few days it adjusts to its new surroundings, and does not know that some people spend all day with their puppy. It's brain doesn't work that way. If it is alone as much as you are thinking, it probably will develop nuisance behaviors. So, we have to find a way to reduce the number of hours it has to be on its own. 

If you and your wife could shift your work schedules so that one leaves later in the morning and one gets home signifcantly earlier in the evening. Or if you could get a job closer to home. (With the cost of gasoline, now's the time.) I do agree that bringing in a puppy when you have work schedules that are brutal is asking for trouble.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Hello everyone, 

Thank you all for the recommendations for me. Please keep the opinions, recommendaitons, and advice coming for me and my situation. The more opinions I am recieving the better educated I am and I make a really good decision if everyone is saying the same thing. 

Right now, from what I gather from everyone the census is Do not get a Puppy, and consider adopting older GSD. 

Question please:

1. Is getting an older GSD safe with my older chihuahua?

Thank you very much


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

darrell107 said:


> . Is getting an older GSD safe with my older chihuahua?


That is why I said a foster based rescue. A good foster will have a better idea about compatibility. Fair warning, if your Chi is like most, and you are typical of Chi owners be prepared to seriously up your management! Allowing snarky, pushy, territorial behavior will set you up for failure.


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## Sunsilver (Apr 8, 2014)

Buckelke said:


> even adult GS's require a lot of supervision. Because they are intelligent and curious they can get into a lot of trouble on their own.
> "I want to go out now" can translate to the door frame getting ripped off. Or," I'm bored" can lead to counter surfing or couch dismantling. They can open doors and climb. It's like having a 2 year old child that will never grow up. We are home full time so there is always someone to annoy (can we go out and play?) (Can I have a cookie?) (etc.). My husband is threatening to get Duke a collar that says, "I do dumb things". Jake ate remotes and a cell phone (try calling your boss and telling him the dog ate your cell phone, it's only funny until they have to replace it.) We just go with the knowledge that the dog is smarter than the owner. He is, you know...


When the younger of my two dogs got to a certain age, I was able to leave them both uncrated when I was out. Well, one day I was visiting my brother's family in another city, and was gone much longer than usual, because we watched a couple of movies. This is what greeted me when I got home!

I had 2 plastic bag tubes attached to the cupboards in the kitchen for storing grocery bags. They got into the bags, and there was not a single bag that didn't have a hole in it! Since I used the bags for garbage and picking up dog poop, it was a bit of a problem until I was able to replenish my supply!


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

darrell107 said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> Thank you all for the recommendations for me. Please keep the opinions, recommendaitons, and advice coming for me and my situation. The more opinions I am recieving the better educated I am and I make a really good decision if everyone is saying the same thing.
> 
> ...


depends on the temperament of *both* dogs... how they’re introduced and managed. you mentioned your chi was grumpy.... so it’s not all on the GSD. i would say a puppy is more at risk of annoying or accidentally hurting your chi, if things go wrong with an adult, the intent may be different.

a foster based rescue or a breeder with an older dog is certainly the way to go, but being left alone 12hrs a day isn’t going to sound favorable to either so be prepared for that. use the comments section on applications and make sure you have an alternative plan for support.

for what it’s worth, all of my GSD have been rescues and have been good with dogs of all sizes. that said, Keystone would be tolerant of a small dog snarling at him, Gia not so much. so appropriate matching / compatibility and accountability for the chi, is all very important!


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## drparker151 (Apr 10, 2020)

darrell107 said:


> Question please:
> 
> 1. Is getting an older GSD safe with my older chihuahua?
> 
> Thank you very much


It increases the odds of success as the right older GSD will be calmer, and not constantly hassle to other dog to play. A lot will also depend on your current dog. 

A GSD specific rescue can help you determine if your dog would be able to handle it.

after we had Rocco, adult GSD we got from a rescue group, for a while he decided one of his jobs was enforcer of dad’s rules. If our rat terrier kept barking after I yelled quit, the GSD would flatten him to the ground with a big paw slap on the shoulders. It did stop the barking😆

So an adult GSD might not be aggressive but it could show it’s displeasure with a big paw slap, how would your current dog react to that?


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I wonder if a rescue approves of this schedule. I was not approved for a nice spayed female because our fence was 5 ft high and we had an intact 12 year old Whippet male. But I was home most of the day, was a professional pet dog trainer, live rural but no, not good enough. Adopting a foster kid would have been easier. Be prepared for pages of questions.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Safe?
This depends on so many factors.
Behavior of the Chi, temperament of the GSD, and your training and management ability.

If I were you, I’d let the Chi live out its life in peace, and wait until you have time to devote to a GSD.
I know that’s not what you want to hear, but waiting will ensure success. 
What you have right now is far from ideal and we don’t want you back in a few months saying you are tearing your hair out.


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## patches (Nov 5, 2013)

People can and do work 3 12 hour shifts and raise GSD puppies. I am very suprised to see the number of people on this thread stating that doing such is cruel or impossible. I work 3 12 hour shifts and am off 4 days a week. I prefer this compressed schedule for many reasons, and I think my dogs enjoy and benefit from the extra days off. When my dogs were puppies, I took 1-2 weeks off to spend time with them and focus on house breaking, routines, etc. I wake up early, exercise/feed the dogs before I leave, and have someone let the dogs out 1-2 times during the day when I am gone. I come home, play with the dogs/exercise them, and then we relax. I am off more days than I work, and we do plenty of things together on my days off. My dogs are well exercised, well trained, perfectly happy and content. My dogs are 5 & 7 years old now and were active in sports most of their life until recently. It is a lot of work, and it is a lifestyle, but it certainly can be done. Oh, and they also live with a resident chiweenie, who is 10 years old, without issues.

I am not saying that the OP's situation is right for a GSD puppy, but there are other variables other than the work schedule. OP, be realistic in the demands of a puppy and a working dog. You need to come up with an arrangement to have the puppy let out and worked with during your work day. If you are committed to training and working with your dog every day, even on long work days, then it can work. As for the Chi, this will require lots of training and management, but yes GSD puppies can learn to live peacefully with small breed dogs.


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

wolfy dog said:


> I wonder if a rescue approves of this schedule. I was not approved for a nice spayed female because our fence was 5 ft high and we had an intact 12 year old Whippet male. But I was home most of the day, was a professional pet dog trainer, live rural but no, not good enough. Adopting a foster kid would have been easier. Be prepared for pages of questions.


I was declined by the Dutch Shepherd rescue because I didn't have a fence. I commented that I didn't have a fence in Afghanistan, or at Vohne Liche Kennels where I was currently a trainer, but alas, my home was not acceptable lol.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

David Winners said:


> I was declined by the Dutch Shepherd rescue because I didn't have a fence. I commented that I didn't have a fence in Afghanistan, or at Vohne Liche Kennels where I was currently a trainer, but alas, my home was not acceptable lol.


Ha, ha, it made me check out breeders before giving up and guess what? I found Deja's!


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

patches said:


> People can and do work 3 12 hour shifts and raise GSD puppies. I am very suprised to see the number of people on this thread stating that doing such is cruel or impossible. I work 3 12 hour shifts and am off 4 days a week. I prefer this compressed schedule for many reasons, and I think my dogs enjoy and benefit from the extra days off. When my dogs were puppies, I took 1-2 weeks off to spend time with them and focus on house breaking, routines, etc. I wake up early, exercise/feed the dogs before I leave, and have someone let the dogs out 1-2 times during the day when I am gone. I come home, play with the dogs/exercise them, and then we relax. I am off more days than I work, and we do plenty of things together on my days off. My dogs are well exercised, well trained, perfectly happy and content. My dogs are 5 & 7 years old now and were active in sports most of their life until recently. It is a lot of work, and it is a lifestyle, but it certainly can be done. Oh, and they also live with a resident chiweenie, who is 10 years old, without issues.
> 
> I am not saying that the OP's situation is right for a GSD puppy, but there are other variables other than the work schedule. OP, be realistic in the demands of a puppy and a working dog. You need to come up with an arrangement to have the puppy let out and worked with during your work day. If you are committed to training and working with your dog every day, even on long work days, then it can work. As for the Chi, this will require lots of training and management, but yes GSD puppies can learn to live peacefully with small breed dogs.


No need to be surprised. We were replying specifically to the OP, based on the info given.

OP stated that all he has devote to the dog is Monday through Thursday 1-2 hours a day. Friday through Sunday about 3 hours, that he likes the look of the GSD, and thought the puppy could engage with a 10-year-old Chi.
Or 9-year-old, depending on which post you read.
I am still not convinced this is on the up and up.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Prospective owners who "just love the look of a GSD and always wanted them" should ask them selves re their home and work situation; would you get a Pitbull? Would you get a Rottweiler? Would you get a Doberman?

You might just gat any or all of them in a German Shepherd. And once again to the OP, your situation is far from ready for a GSD pup. I think you're getting the message but are trying to talk yourself into it still.....don't


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## David Winners (Apr 30, 2012)

At least they don't want a husky


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

David Winners said:


> At least they don't want a husky


"I always wanted a husky....i have no idea why he's always running away"


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

drparker151 said:


> It increases the odds of success as the right older GSD will be calmer, and not constantly hassle to other dog to play. A lot will also depend on your current dog.
> 
> A GSD specific rescue can help you determine if your dog would be able to handle it.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the response drparker151. Perhaps I should bring my chi when time to meet older GSD


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sunflowers said:


> Safe?
> This depends on so many factors.
> Behavior of the Chi, temperament of the GSD, and your training and management ability.
> 
> ...


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

patches said:


> People can and do work 3 12 hour shifts and raise GSD puppies. I am very suprised to see the number of people on this thread stating that doing such is cruel or impossible. I work 3 12 hour shifts and am off 4 days a week. I prefer this compressed schedule for many reasons, and I think my dogs enjoy and benefit from the extra days off. When my dogs were puppies, I took 1-2 weeks off to spend time with them and focus on house breaking, routines, etc. I wake up early, exercise/feed the dogs before I leave, and have someone let the dogs out 1-2 times during the day when I am gone. I come home, play with the dogs/exercise them, and then we relax. I am off more days than I work, and we do plenty of things together on my days off. My dogs are well exercised, well trained, perfectly happy and content. My dogs are 5 & 7 years old now and were active in sports most of their life until recently. It is a lot of work, and it is a lifestyle, but it certainly can be done. Oh, and they also live with a resident chiweenie, who is 10 years old, without issues.
> 
> I am not saying that the OP's situation is right for a GSD puppy, but there are other variables other than the work schedule. OP, be realistic in the demands of a puppy and a working dog. You need to come up with an arrangement to have the puppy let out and worked with during your work day. If you are committed to training and working with your dog every day, even on long work days, then it can work. As for the Chi, this will require lots of training and management, but yes GSD puppies can learn to live peacefully with small breed dogs.


Hello patches, 

I appreciate the feedback. lol, you are the only one in favor of situation.


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## finn'smom (Oct 4, 2019)

I work 12hr shifts and have raised two puppies on that schedule, rotating days and nights... upside to this is the amount of days off, downside was always having someone reliable to step in when I couldn't. I have great, trusted, dog loving friends - with their help I was able to get through the puppy stages. I live one block from where I work, and I use my breaks and lunches to run home and let the dog out - ALWAYS - he's two now and I still do it. It's not fair to just leave him for that long, but raising a puppy and working 12hr shifts can be done... and by great friends I mean over and above great, they didn't just go let him out to pee - I would receive pictures at work of my puppies on great adventures with said friends and their dogs once they were old enough. You need to set up the right network of friends or professionals to assist if you cannot get home numerous times per day yourself. Best of luck


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

The thing is, you’re not just raising a puppy.
You’re raising a DOG.
And when that dog becomes an adolescent, he will be a handful, and if you don’t have several hours to devote to training and discipline and giving him something to do, you will have a neurotic, undisciplined, frustrated dog who will take out his frustrations on your house and on you. Possibly on your poor old Chi, too.
No matter how many sad and crying emojis you post, I still maintain that you should wait. My husband and I decided we wanted a German Shepherd in 1986. We got one in 2012. I was no longer working full-time, I was at home but it was still quite a challenge. In fact, it was difficult, I will not lie.

Just because people post that it can be done doesn’t mean that it is the ideal situation for you.
Even though many people tell you how difficult it is, you won’t understand it until you are in that situation.
When I was working your schedule I had a Tibetan Spaniel, and I would still rush home for lunch every day to take him out. I had exactly the time that you have right now to devote to a dog, and I cannot imagine, having raised 2 Shepherds now, adding one when I was at that phase of my life.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

OK I got through 20 posts ....maybe this has already been suggested but hey, here's my take on it.

When I had puppies when I was working -- managed to have a week or two off when they first came home. Then I came home at noon for a few weeks. So having someone who can take the pup out a couple of times during that 12 hours away for the first couple of months would be good. 
Adult dogs can last that long, but a pup needs more attention. This is a beyond house training requirement. 

Good luck with your pup.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

No need to put a pup through this; bottom line. 
Bad timing, bad situation, disastrous results likely


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## BigOzzy2018 (Jan 27, 2018)

darrell107 said:


> Thank you so much wolfy,
> 
> You think adopting a GSD would be more favorable for our situation due to working hours? I do plan to spend alot of time with the GSD while not working and on off days. But it is like looking owning a GSD puppy right now is not in my, my wife or GSD pup best interest from the comments.


Rescues will not be keen on letting you adopt because you are not home enough even for a a young adult. It can take up to 3 months for a rescue to adjust to a new home. Plus you don’t know what issues the rescue dog will come with. Training never ends no matter what age. Rethink about getting another dog until you have a lot more time for the dog.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Sunflowers said:


> The thing is, you’re not just raising a puppy.
> You’re raising a DOG.
> And when that dog becomes an adolescent, he will be a handful, and if you don’t have several hours to devote to training and discipline and giving him something to do, you will have a neurotic, undisciplined, frustrated dog who will take out his frustrations on your house and on you. Possibly on your poor old Chi, too.
> No matter how many sad and crying emojis you post, I still maintain that you should wait. My husband and I decided we wanted a German Shepherd in 1986. We got one in 2012. I was no longer working full-time, I was at home but it was still quite a challenge. In fact, it was difficult, I will not lie.
> ...


Hello Sunflowers, 

I really appreciate your honesty, and I agree with you. I will have to wait and considering adopting an older GSD for my situation. We will not have the time to dedicate due to our situation to little puppy.

Very insightful and glad I took the time to get others input.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

BigOzzy2018 said:


> Rescues will not be keen on letting you adopt because you are not home enough even for a a young adult. It can take up to 3 months for a rescue to adjust to a new home. Plus you don’t know what issues the rescue dog will come with. Training never ends no matter what age. Rethink about getting another dog until you have a lot more time for the dog.


Hello BigOzzy2018, 

Thank you for the response. I appreciate it.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

OP, realize that any GSD, no matter how young or old, craves time with their families. A rescue dog may not even be able to stay home alone.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

wolfy dog said:


> OP, realize that any GSD, no matter how young or old, craves time with their families. A rescue dog may not even be able to stay home alone.


Thank you wolfy dog for the input.


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## Tara_Bosch (Dec 4, 2020)

darrell107 said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> We are planning on buying a GSD puppy soon. We currently have a Chihuahua puppy about 9 years old.
> 
> ...





darrell107 said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> We are planning on buying a GSD puppy soon. We currently have a Chihuahua puppy about 9 years old.
> 
> ...


No. Just no. The puppy needs/deserves more from you. Please reconsider that this is not the right time for a puppy. Maybe consider adopting or rescuing an adult GSD. Even then, it would need access to the outside at least once a day via a pet sitter or dog walker. Please reconsider! Very glad you reached out for advice.


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## Willow81 (Aug 16, 2019)

Well... I work 4 days a week 10 hours a day. So it is do-able. But, I also live 5 minutes from work and am able to come home to let Dogmeat relieve himself 2 to 3 times a day during my work hours. You also have to understand that your dog will expect your undivided attention when you are home and if he gets bored he will almost definitely destroy things. Dogmeat is well trained and hasn't been in a cage since he was about 5 months old (now 2 years old) and he let's me know when he's bored and needs new toys and games. I also have 3 teenage children to help take care of him. Also, No dog on this planet can hold his pee 12 hours! And if your puppy is stuck in a cage it will have to sit in poop and pee for many hours till you get home. In my opinion, gsd are too emotional to be ignored for an extended amount of time. You could be setting yourself and your possible new puppy up for failure.


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## agustD (Apr 25, 2018)

As someone that has worked 12hr shifts and has had a GSD puppy, it’s entirely possible. The ideal world does not exist. Most people are not going to be able to supervise a puppy all day everyday. There were aspects of raising a puppy that were different working a couple long days a week, but I find I have vastly more time with my dogs than people that work normal 8 hr shifts. I have four whole days I can spend with my dogs and when they were young, that meant the world. I had days where we could make many trips out for socialization and training and bonding. Four days a week I’m by them 24/7.

Now, on the nights I did work 12hrs and had a puppy… I didn’t get much sleep. I tried to take naps. Exercise, play, potty train… so the puppy was tired when I left for work that night. Then the puppy would sleep MOST of the shift.

My two GSDs have been so easy to potty train. The one when I wasn’t working was trained in seemingly one day. The other, when I worked 12hrs, came to me knowing to use a puppy pad. This is what I recommend. If you TRULY can not find someone to come let the puppy out, then this is what I did. I have someone that always lets my dogs out midway through my shift, so they only have to hold it six hours. I also have a camera to check up on them throughout the night while I work.

I trained my puppy to use the puppy pad when it was down. If I was sleeping or working, the puppy pad was down and she would use it.

She came at 8 weeks old trained to use the puppy pad, but you might have to spend some time training your puppy to realize it’s an option. Now when I got my puppy, I took two weeks off and worked a lot of half shifts the first month or two. Spent my lunches running home to check on them and let them potty. The puppy pad was a good tool if utilized properly. Don’t get rid of it too early if you use it.

Having a puppy and 12hr shifts is very doable!! Is it easy?? No!! Will you get a ton of sleep on your work days? Not as much… but I think is people that work 12hr shifts already expect as much. There’s lots of planning and puppy proofing, cameras, puppy pads.

Unlike the people working 8hr shifts, you’ll have four days a week with nothing but time to enjoy your puppy. Make the most of it!!


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

Willow81 said:


> Well... I work 4 days a week 10 hours a day. So it is do-able. *But, I also live 5 minutes from work and am able to come home to let Dogmeat relieve himself 2 to 3 times a day during my work hours.*


to be clear, _your_ situation is doable. not the OP’s....


Willow81 said:


> Also, No dog on this planet can hold his pee 12 hours!


this is also incorrect. not ideal or advisable, especially long term but every single one of my dogs have shown it’s possible. i live on Earth.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

Fodder said:


> i live on Earth.


If I ever get back that way I will visit. Lol

Yup, all my dogs CAN/COULD hold it for 12 hours. I just find it really rude to ask them to, not to mention unhealthy.


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## tcass (Sep 26, 2014)

Honey Maid said:


> Do you have a REAL secure fenced yard, in a decent neighborhood?? What worked for me, when I was still working, I had a back porch I could leave open, and a real secure, wood fenced yard. I was able to leave my puppy in the back yard, and if the weather turned inclement she could go into the back porch. Now, that was in 1987, when people did not steal dogs out of back yards. I can't remember if I was on 8 hour shifts or 12's back then.


We have a doggie door and a fenced front yard 100 x 80. Most days he's left for about 5-6 hours and he does fine. past couple of days have been unique due to the wife being out of town and he has been alone about 12 hours. Today is the last day of that. He did fine but i felt bad about it. Glad it is over and back to normal schedule.


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## Maxine222 (May 25, 2020)

The puppy may dig its way out of the yard
get into other things outside. As far as toys, puppy must be monitored chewing or playing with anything you give him. German Shepherd will miss their people and can become sad or frightened with unknown or unexplored places. Are you close enough where you work to get home to relieve your pup and check in with him? Or MAYBE bring the dog to your workplace using the crate there? Maybe your workplace will help and let you take time to get home. I was a pre school teacher and I did bring my puppy in a few times, into my classroom. Also brought the dog in with permission for show and tell! Helped with introducing my puppy to children. She adores them. I WISH YOU GOOD LUCK and hope it all works out for you. But it will at times get stressful for you and your dog will feel your stress, so it may be wise to wait until you have a solid plan in place for your new gsd puppy.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

OP has already decided to wait.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Sunflowers said:


> OP has already decided to wait.





Sunflowers said:


> OP has already decided to wait.


And absolutely the correct decision. No one should bring a puppy into a bad situation just because it's possible on a rare occasion. Doesn't mean it's a healthy or preferable situation if you have a choice at all.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

WNGD said:


> And absolutely the correct decision. No one should bring a puppy into a bad situation just because it's possible on a rare occasion. Doesn't mean it's a healthy or preferable situation if you have a choice at all.


I will be the first one to admit I have a far from perfect home for any dog. Someone should probably take my dog away. 
It works because I dedicate EVERY freaking second to making it work! I get by on no sleep, I never socialize away from home and I deliberately and at huge cost make it possible. Everything in my life revolves around my dog. Work, home, clothes, furniture. Most folks want a dog to add to their life, not rule it.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Sabis mom said:


> I will be the first one to admit I have a far from perfect home for any dog. Someone should probably take my dog away.
> It works because I dedicate EVERY freaking second to making it work! I get by on no sleep, I never socialize away from home and I deliberately and at huge cost make it possible. Everything in my life revolves around my dog. Work, home, clothes, furniture. Most folks want a dog to add to their life, not rule it.


Yup , my comment was specifically towards what I consider the OP's less than desirable situation for a puppy. Again, good decision on their part.

Poster: "I always wanted a GSD, they look so cool but I can't really afford to feed a puppy, should I get one"?

Other posters:
No
No
Of course not
Are you crazy?
No
Why would you?
Absolutely not!
No
That's sort of abusive
No
No
I didn't feed a puppy for a week once and it survived just fine....resource guards and kidney trouble and doesn't engage well with me, that's all

Original poster: "Thanks, so it can be done, I think I'll get a puppy"


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

@WNGD Right? People look at me all the time and say "well your dog is just fine". She is fine because I sacrifice everything to make sure she is. She is my world and there is nothing I will not give up to keep her happy and healthy.
In general if you work full time, are in school full time, can barely afford rent, or live in an apartment DON'T GET A DOG!
Of course there are people who can pull it off, and the degree of success will vary. The members of this forum are not your average owners for the most part.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

My family says I spend way too much time with the dogs, but then again, I am the ONLY ONE who feeds, grooms, bathes, exercises, and treats whatever ailments they have and get.

My other dog, the Tibetan Spaniel, required almost nothing. He also required far fewer trips to the vet. In fact, I didn’t really see the vet until that dog turned 15. He lived to 18.5.

GSDs are for those who understand that, as with kids, their needs must be met even when you don’t feel like it. And GSDs have far more needs than other breeds, whether it’s type of food, training, exercise requirements, or health problems.

David says that if his dogs get the zoomies in the late evening, he gets dressed and goes out with them so they can run like lunatics until they’re tired. Definitely not for people who just want to come home and relax. If you work, your GSD is home all day, bored out of his mind, and when you walk in that door, he’s ready to go.
A leisurely stroll while looking at your phone will not suffice. And taking him to the dog park in hopes of draining his energy there will likely end in disaster.

Thinking of buying a second GSD so they can play together and leave you alone?
Nope.
They will BOTH sit outside, looking in, ears up, waiting for your lazy butt to come out and interact with them.

You have to want that GSD more than you want your relaxation time. I cannot count the number of times I’ve longingly looked at that sofa on my way out with the dogs.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Sunflowers said:


> My family says I spend way too much time with the dogs, but then again, I am the ONLY ONE who feeds, grooms, bathes, exercises, and treats whatever ailments they have and get.
> 
> My other dog, the Tibetan Spaniel, required almost nothing. He also required far fewer trips to the vet. In fact, I didn’t really see the vet until that dog turned 15. He lived to 18.5.
> 
> ...


I haven't started a day in 30 years without being outside within 3 minutes of waking, half the time I'm in the woods still half asleep :0)

Rain, sleet, shine, freezing cold, ice. Never missed a day. Sick, not feeling like it, not really into it ..... doesn't matter. Then again, it's the best part of my day....


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

WNGD said:


> I haven't started a day in 30 years without being outside within 3 minutes of waking, half the time I'm in the woods still half asleep :0)
> 
> Rain, sleet, shine, freezing cold, ice. Never missed a day. Sick, not feeling like it, not really into it ..... doesn't matter. Then again, it's the best part of my day....


Yup.
Many times I’m out there, before coffee, toothbrush in one hand, poop bag in the other, kicking the ball for them.

But as I’m doing it, I look at them and think they’re the best dogs in the world!


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## Loulou50 (Jul 29, 2021)

I am not being unkind here but realistic , as others have said you really need to reconsider. GSD puppies and adults get bored without stimulation and will find their own if not provided and will be destructive, not to mention the toilet problem. Any pup needs lots of time ,but GSD need more than most. When given the right amount of time and effort and training they are wonderful dogs. Please do not get a GSD , I say that with the kindest intention , it just wouldn't be fair and I could pretty much put money on the fact that you will likely regret it and the pup ends up at best been sold on at worse destroyed through no fault of its own. I wouldn't even advise leaving an adult dog for that long .


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Tara_Bosch said:


> No. Just no. The puppy needs/deserves more from you. Please reconsider that this is not the right time for a puppy. Maybe consider adopting or rescuing an adult GSD. Even then, it would need access to the outside at least once a day via a pet sitter or dog walker. Please reconsider! Very glad you reached out for advice.


Thank you so much Tara_Bosch. I am glad I reached out for advice as well.


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## darrell107 (Sep 30, 2008)

Willow81 said:


> Well... I work 4 days a week 10 hours a day. So it is do-able. But, I also live 5 minutes from work and am able to come home to let Dogmeat relieve himself 2 to 3 times a day during my work hours. You also have to understand that your dog will expect your undivided attention when you are home and if he gets bored he will almost definitely destroy things. Dogmeat is well trained and hasn't been in a cage since he was about 5 months old (now 2 years old) and he let's me know when he's bored and needs new toys and games. I also have 3 teenage children to help take care of him. Also, No dog on this planet can hold his pee 12 hours! And if your puppy is stuck in a cage it will have to sit in poop and pee for many hours till you get home. In my opinion, gsd are too emotional to be ignored for an extended amount of time. You could be setting yourself and your possible new puppy up for failure.


Thank you for the reply Willow81. I appreciate the response. It is just me and my wife.

We do not work 5 minutes away from home. We work nearly 40 minutes away. And no-one will be home to let the puppy or the adopted GSD outside. 

I will talk to the wife about a dog walker or pet sitter to walk or play with GSD during the day while we are gone. 

But we will hold off on GSD puppy for now for sure until our time commitment and situation changes. Especially with the other 9 year old chi.


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## Willow81 (Aug 16, 2019)

Sabis mom said:


> If I ever get back that way I will visit. Lol
> 
> Yup, all my dogs CAN/COULD hold it for 12 hours. I just find it really rude to ask them to, not to mention unhealthy.


I must give Dogmeat WAY too much water then! At like the 6 hour mark he's doing the "pee dance". He usually has to go out once in the middle of the night to pee too. Perhaps he has a weak bladder 🤔.


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## Willow81 (Aug 16, 2019)

Fodder said:


> to be clear, _your_ situation is doable. not the OP’s....
> 
> this is also incorrect. not ideal or advisable, especially long term but every single one of my dogs have shown it’s possible. i live on Earth.


Fair enough... I'm not always on Earth


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## Bebe (Apr 17, 2011)

Why are you even getting a puppy if you are working 12/3 shifts? A puppy need potty training, play WITH YOU time, cuddles, hearing your voice, being touched an a myriad of other needs that won't be met by you or even someone stopping by to let the poor thing out. Maybe a better option for you would be to adopt an adult GSD. In my heart of hearts, I truly believe what you would be doing is neglect and emotionally cruel to a puppy that has been in the world weeks or months. I can't even imagine why you are entertaining the thought of a puppy. Puppies sleep a lot but not 12 hours. I have had dogs all my life and I would never, ever try this no matter what your good intentions are. You are not available enough for a puppy. Please consider an adult adoption. PLEASE.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

Bebe said:


> Why are you even getting a puppy if you are working 12/3 shifts? A puppy need potty training, play WITH YOU time, cuddles, hearing your voice, being touched an a myriad of other needs that won't be met by you or even someone stopping by to let the poor thing out. Maybe a better option for you would be to adopt an adult GSD. In my heart of hearts, I truly believe what you would be doing is neglect and emotionally cruel to a puppy that has been in the world weeks or months. I can't even imagine why you are entertaining the thought of a puppy. Puppies sleep a lot but not 12 hours. I have had dogs all my life and I would never, ever try this no matter what your good intentions are. You are not available enough for a puppy. Please consider an adult adoption. PLEASE.


I think he's already said twice that he's re-thought getting a puppy. The right decision


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