# What’s happened to GSD’s, or is it just me?



## Joys (Nov 6, 2017)

I had two GSDs growing up. One registered, one not. They were both sweet, protective, and intelligent. They weren’t aggressive or destructive, other than a few holes in the backyard. 

My dog is nothing like them. She requires a lot of exercise. 2-3 mile walks, several 30 minute play sessions with fetch, tug, all out running. She attends obedience class and we practice several times a day. She gets tons of attention. But she still tries to dig a hole in the couch and pull up the hardwood flooring.

But from what I read in my GSD Facebook group, my dog is good! Every single day people have issues like “my dog killed my cat”, “my dog is snapping at children”, “my dog killed 12 chickens” “my dog bit my MIL in the face”......
To make it worse, the people in the group act like this is normal GSD behavior!
Since when?!?! 

What happened to the GSDs of my youth?


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Maybe any hard stuff like training is glossed over in your memory as often happens in our youthful memories? We had GSDs my whole time as a child. Pax was my favorite. I thought they were perfect, use to read them stories at night. Off leash trained, no issues I can remember. And these were dog had in the 70s when " large boned German Sheps" for sale in the newspaper were all the rage. Now, 40 years later I hear about how Pax bit a lot of people, and Sauron counter surfed incorrigibly, couches destroyed, some had to be locked in bedroom for company. I don't remember any of that. I just remember all my best friends that would protect me from the bad guys, and as far as I was concerned were all bred from the same stock as Max the Bionic dog. God, I feel old lol


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## Joys (Nov 6, 2017)

I feel old, too! Lol
That could be the case with the first one.It was in the 70s. 
But I was about 17 with the second one and remember him well.


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## Dainerra (Nov 14, 2003)

A lot of it is people who simply aren't training their dogs. And a lot is still selective memory. There was only 7 years between Singe and Kaylee and there is a huge disconnect in my brain when I try to remember "was it like this last time??" 
And there is always a difference in personal perspective. My husband remembers Rayden as the perfect puppy, never potty in the house and never destroyed a thing. I know that he was incredibly easy but still destroyed his share of things. My husband remembers Singe as being the spawn of Satan as a puppy while I remember him as being a handful but not bad. More mischievous puppy being a pain in the rear.


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## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

One could argue children are less behaved these days too lol. Is it breeding? Or us as parents of kids and dogs?


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

My First GSD was over 20 years ago. I thought as a pup he was horrible. We couldn't get house training at all. I thought crating was cruel. So I left him in my kitchen. Every day he took everything not nailed down and put it into the middle of the room and added a touch of his own or two. The destruction was phenomenal. The insanity -- doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome, was also phenomenal. One day, the puppy that I waited for, that I wanted all my life, that I was so excited to have, ate my couch. 

He ate it. 

That landed him outside on a chain. 

Every day I would come home and my kitchen would not be destroyed. But my dog would turn around and around over the 20' radius of this chain, and would be covered in mud. I would feed him and water him, but I did not bring him in and do anything with him. 

Then, he would break his chain. And I would find him when I got home, and fix his chain. But one time, he got into the road and shattered his leg. I took him to the vet, and putting a rod in his leg was out of the question. I did not have that kind of money. 2k was beyond my ability at that time. But the vet said to crate him for 8 weeks, letting him out twice a day to potty and it would heal. It did. Crooked. And he had pain in it for the rest of his life. I probably should have let her amputate it. 

But I learned that crates were not all that evil, and the boy became an indoor dog again. He was a tough dog, but not bad. He was scary around children. A friend brought two little girls to my house, and I let him out, and he looked at them, they were about 2 and 3, and he growled menacingly. We put him away. I couldn't put him in training at that point because the leg was bad. 

He was ok for several years. I knew how to manage him, and we got along ok. But the leg pained him, and his fuse became shorter. He came close to biting my sister. One day, while being aggressive with my young bitch, I corrected him strongly and he bit me. I ended up putting him down. He was 7 and in a lot of pain, I thought he was dangerous. Looking back on it, most of his problems I created. And he showed incredible bite-inhibition. It was communication. Yes three of my fingers were bleeding, but he could have done a lot of damage had he wanted to. 

With the experience I have now, the dog would have never been to that extent. If I had to make that decision again, I would have amputated the leg. He would have been fine with three, much less pain. I wouldn't have gotten a puppy when I was working full time and going to college full time. But I did. Got to live with that. 

I now have GSDs that are awesome with kids, all of them, babies. They are easy to train, easy to manage. I had another great teacher in the young bitch that I had when I still had Frodo. She taught me how to communicate with dogs. I said she was half-human. What a great bitch. She broke my heart when she passed on. That was 8 years ago give or take, and I think about her every day. 

With each dog, I have learned more. I have had a string of great dogs. They have good temperaments, that match me, though they are not all the same. I trust them around anyone. I can let my nieces go out and give them all food on their own. I can take them anywhere. 

I think that there are dogs out there that have poor temperaments. But I think it is more a problem that folks these days don't know how to raise and treat dogs. They confuse them with little people. They do not respect them for the dogs that they, which is an order of being that on its own right is awesome. A dog can make a great friend, a great companion, a great watch dog, a great dog, but a dog can only be an awful human substitute. It isn't fair to them. And it causes a lot of issues. 

We forget how much of a pain puppies can be. My puppies do not eat my couch now, because I do not give them unsupervised access to my couch until I feel they are trustworthy, and then a little longer. It is not because the current crop is so much better, but because I know more, my body knows more. I have realistic expectations for puppies and dogs. 

I think that there are no short cuts to learning how to raise a dog. The first dog is going to have its set of issues as we stumble through learning. Having had dogs as a child isn't equal to knowing how to raise and train dogs. The dogs of our childhood had others often in charge of the dog, and a family dynamic that was different even if the responsibility for the dog was largely on us. Not the same. And some of us have raised pups that are easy, biddible, willing followers, who absorb our clumsiness and do just fine. That doesn't make the next dog a bad dog because it requires a different personality, a different level of attention to detail, different management. 

As long as we continue to blame the dogs for lack of/poor training and poor behavior, we don't grow. I think way too many folks today are unable to accept the responsibility for the failures in their dogs. I think in spite of us, we do learn from dog to dog. I think we are far more limited by our own selves than we are by our dogs though.


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## camperbc (Sep 19, 2017)

Joys said:


> But from what I read in my GSD Facebook group, my dog is good! Every single day people have issues like “my dog killed my cat”, “my dog is snapping at children”, “my dog killed 12 chickens” “my dog bit my MIL in the face”......
> To make it worse, the people in the group act like this is normal GSD behavior! Since when?!?! What happened to the GSDs of my youth?


Yes, this bugs me to no end! I cannot get over the hundreds of horror stories that I have read on various forums, FB groups, etc. where people seem to almost _enjoy_ telling the whole world how terribly misbehaved their dogs are! They actually think that it is cute or funny, and is to be _expected_, and that there is nothing that can be done about to it! Like it's perfectly normal to have your GSD eat/destroy everything under the sun and continuously act out. Well no, it is most definitely *NOT* normal, acceptable behaviour!! Come on folks, GSDs are about the most intelligent dogs out there, so why then, are SO many people seemingly incapable of teaching them the most very basic rules, like what they can and cannot chew on, for instance. Nothing pi$$es me off more than to hear someone say that there is nothing anyone can do about it. Sheesh, I am no rocket scientist, but I had my Sheba trained within a week or two of getting her, to know between right and wrong. I don't need to "dog-proof" my house, because she knows what is considered out of bounds. I think what it boils down to is that these days most people are so wrapped up in their busy lives that they are just not taking the time required to train their dogs, and it is such a shame. And as someone else mentioned, all you have to do is look at the poor behaviour and lack of respect in kids these days, to see that things have indeed changed a great deal in how we raised our kids a couple decades ago. It is as if there are no longer any rules, no boundaries... kids will be kids. Dogs will be dogs. So tell me, how can we expect our dogs to be well behaved, if they are not taught any boundaries? 

OK, rant over. I'm pretty certain that someone will step right in here and say that I must be exaggerating when I say that my puppy never gets into anything she isn't supposed to... or if she is, then I must be abusive toward my dog. Or whatever. But I can assure you that with a bit of effort you do not have to just _accept_ that your dog will eat the neighbours, or chew your couch and carpets to pieces, or steal food from your countertop. They simply need to learn right from wrong... just as we used to instill in our children... way back when people actually cared. 

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland


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## Heartandsoul (Jan 5, 2012)

I think the difference between now and "way back when" is that we are at an age where littereally the whole world is at our fingertips. The only bad news about dogs that I remember as a kid was the news via word of mouth. Newspapers and tv did not report puppies eating couches. Also, bad news or need for help with bad issues tends to get more attention.

That said, growing up in my neighborhood, my only experience with GSDs is the one that ran after my brother and sunk his teeth into his thigh. My next personal experience was with dh (at the time my bf) GSD who was always loose. Basically a good dog but he did have his issues. 

I do remember a mix that I'm pretty sure was part GSD (long coated). He was the only dog in the neighborhood who was tied up and not allowed to roam. His name was Joker. None of us neighborhood kids would go near him. I think being tied up all the time did not help his temperment. 

And just to balance the scale, there was a beautiful collie that had a tendency to chase kids and nip, our own beagle that roamed and at least every other week dad had to go looking for him.. And then there were the two little mixes that hated each other and always getting into it with each other.


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

1st, which FB group are you in? The ones I've been part of would never allow posts like that. 

2nd, when I brought my big-boy home as a pup I was always amazed when people said, "is that a German Shepherd? Are you going to train him?" to which I answered, "of course I'm going to train him! He's a German Shepherd!"


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## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

I got my first GSD in 1998 or '99. He was a wonderful dog, but he was dog-aggressive. We worked through it, but there were lots of places I couldn't, or wouldn't, take him because of that issue. And I didn't entirely trust him around non-dog-savvy people. 

My friends growing up had badly behaved dogs. There was a very sweet boxer who used to jump up on everyone and escape the house and refuse to be caught. That same friend also had a crazy springer spaniel who behaved the same way. Another friend had a GSD that I admired who used to drag his owners down the street. He bolted from a door one day and was killed by a car. 

I'm not having any real problems with my current GSDs. Most of the credit for that goes to the breeders. Maybe I am also a more experienced handler now. 

As someone mentioned earlier, I think that social media probably makes it much easier for us to hear about dogs who are having problems. We can hear from dog-owners all over the country and even the world whereas prior to the internet we only heard from friends and acquaintances. 

I also think there are many less desirable places to get GSDs, which may make it more likely to get a puppy that develops behavioral or health issues. I don't know if there are more bad breeders now than in the past. Most people (at least among my co-workers and acquaintances) search on Craigslist for a puppy or choose a breeder who charges less than the going-rate. These breeders aren't likely to title, test or train their dogs in anything. I'm sure you can get an excellent pup that way, but I think it increases the odds of ending up with a basket case.


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## WIBackpacker (Jan 9, 2014)

Heartandsoul said:


> I think the difference between now and "way back when" is that we are at an age where littereally the whole world is at our fingertips. The only bad news about dogs that I remember as a kid was the news via word of mouth. Newspapers and tv did not report puppies eating couches. Also, bad news or need for help with bad issues tends to get more attention.


Yes! 

And there's a permanent record of the naughty dog, when it gets written and hurled out into Spacebook-land.

If you meet a friend for coffee and vent about how your puppy chewed up your boots, only one person hears about a naughty dog.

If you log in and post on Facebook about how your puppy ate your boots, hundreds of people hear about a naughty dog. Or more.


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## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

Dang, I missed the editing window. 

I also think it is possible that people back in the day were more likely to keep their dogs outside. I know that my husband grew up in a family where the dogs and cats were not indoor pets. His parents grew up on a farm where it was the norm to keep animals outside. An outside pet, of course, doesn't have to learn not to chew up the couch or the carpet, and perhaps has fewer restrictions and more room to exercise. If you get a working breed, keep it cooped up without exercise, don't provide structure, and put little effort into training it can lead to trouble, I think.


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

I don’t know I think on here is where I hear the gsd is most defective. I always heard of bad stories back in the day of with gsds my best friend got severely mauled by one over 30 years ago so I don’t really know. I have heard of good stories. They do have quite a reputation which has not been spun in only
Recent years on social media. They also have a good reputation. There are ranges in personalities /temperament among a litter. Important people look for what they can handle. A breed with natural aggression so any issues can be arise for many different reasons. With a dog who is naturally protective, has natural aggression, who is strong and althletic with healthy amounts of energy and where sometimes they are smarter then most people makes it for not the easiest of breeds for many people who have a busy life style.


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## Joys (Nov 6, 2017)

car2ner said:


> 1st, which FB group are you in? The ones I've been part of would never allow posts like that.
> 
> 2nd, when I brought my big-boy home as a pup I was always amazed when people said, "is that a German Shepherd? Are you going to train him?" to which I answered, "of course I'm going to train him! He's a German Shepherd!"


Dedicated German Shepherd Owners. 
Last night there was a post about a 3 year old GSD which has suddenly started snapping at children. I suggested getting that dog to a trainer/behaviorist immediately. 
People argued that there’s no reason to run out and spend money on a trainer when the dog is PROBABLY resource guarding and just doing what GSDs do. 
Did I mention the poster has a baby on the way?!?!?
Many people told the poster to separate toys and things from the dog when he’s around children and don’t worry about it. 
But I worry about the damage a GSD can do to a kid and predatory drift.
Did I mention this dog is going to be around a baby???
One of the women arguing with me has a pic on her profile of her GSD snarling and barking at her because he is angry with her. She thinks it’s funny!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Dogs from the past weren't treated as furry babies either, nor did they have be dressed up for Halloween. They were probably stricter trained without being fed treats until they puked on the way home from the feel-good-only classes. Many roamed the neighborhood and had a fun social life. The ones who were mean, were killed and there weren't any dog whisperers or doggy shrinks to help them. But on the other hand, being bitten was not a big deal since all the bites I have known about then were more of a warning to us kids. At least this is what I remember about the dogs in my childhood.


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## camperbc (Sep 19, 2017)

car2ner said:


> 1st, which FB group are you in? The ones I've been part of would never allow posts like that.


Well, let's see... 

- German Shepherd Owners (34,000 members) 

- I love German Shepherds VIP (14,000 members) 

- German Shepherd World (18,000 members) 

- German Shepherd Training and Puppies (35,000 members) 

- German Shepherd Training 101 (31,000 members) 

- German Shepherd Owners - The Sequel (20,000, members) 

- German Shepherd Dedicated Owners (104,000 members) 

All of the groups listed above show an endless amount of posts about how it is just "accepted" that these dogs will destroy everything they can sink their teeth into, and _"haha, there is nothing to be done about it, as this is normal GSD behaviour." _ Comments like _"Haha, my dog just ate the interior of my brand new car, but it was my fault for taking him out in the car... Oh, well, I just had to laugh..."_ Really. Good Grief! Train your dog or don't get one in the first place. 

Here is a typical thread about people who, for the most part, have become apparently completely OK with their dogs destroying everything in sight. Last time I looked there were several hundred comments:

https://m.facebook.com/groups/16130341987?view=permalink&id=10156519280106988

In fact the only two FB groups that I know, that have not made a habit out of making GSDs look like the stupidest animals on the planet, are German Shepherds NL (Canada) and German Shepherds Canada. 

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland


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## voodoolamb (Jun 21, 2015)

It's not just GSDs... It's all breeds.

Cultural shifts in what constitutes responsible dog ownership leaves a very large percentage of the general dog population under exercised, under stimulated and over micro-managed. 

Much of the "acting out" is a result of frustration and/or anxiety.


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## Joys (Nov 6, 2017)

car2ner said:


> 1st, which FB group are you in? The ones I've been part of would never allow posts like that.
> 
> 2nd, when I brought my big-boy home as a pup I was always amazed when people said, "is that a German Shepherd? Are you going to train him?" to which I answered, "of course I'm going to train him! He's a German Shepherd!"





camperbc said:


> Well, let's see...
> 
> - German Shepherd Owners (34,000 members)
> 
> ...


Unbelievable. I like the woman who said her dog ate a chair in a hotel room! Did she not crate her out of control darling when she wasn’t there or just stand by and laugh while he did it?


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## dave2336 (Dec 27, 2017)

I must admit, after reading about all of the GSD problems on here and FB pages I was concerned when we brought a GSD puppy home. After 6 weeks with this dog and spending time at my son's house, he has an adult GSD, I'm no longer concerned. These are awesome animals! Smartest dog I've ever seen, loyal to a fault, impossibly obedient. Our 6 week pup was house broke in one day, although I did have some issues with him wanting pee indoors when it was raining. Bite aversion training was maybe 2 days? Yes, he has lots of energy and is occasionally obnoxious ( I caught him sneaking a sock out of the laundry room today). But, all puppies are like that.


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## monster (Aug 16, 2015)

Heartandsoul said:


> I think the difference between now and "way back when" is that we are at an age where littereally the whole world is at our fingertips.


Bingo!

There weren't sexual predators either back then? Today, 24 hour news and social media need stories to fill the space, so guess what? Everything under the sun gets posted and since most on this site are dog people they notice all the dog stories. I can recall incidents from my childhood of dogs biting people, a GSD jumping a fence and breaking her chain to chase down a poodle that had teased her to then eat the poodle in front of it's owners, dogs tearing up yards, and dogs just being dogs. I don't recall being able to tell you about Suzie's lemonade stand in Iowa getting shut down because she didn't have the right paperwork.


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## truckola (Nov 3, 2013)

I think it follows the Media credo "If it Bleeds, It Leads" people don't write about their dog being good, its not very interesting. How interesting is it when I say I called Pepper and she came?


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## camperbc (Sep 19, 2017)

truckola said:


> I think it follows the Media credo "If it Bleeds, It Leads" people don't write about their dog being good, its not very interesting. How interesting is it when I say I called Pepper and she came?


Not sure I am buying into the premise that the success stories are just not interesting enough to report. The 600 or so people on the link I posted above are not making this stuff up; I have no doubt that these dogs really ARE destroying everything they can... I doubt that they would all be on there bragging about whose dog has caused the most damage, if it were not so. But the whole mindset that "it's OK and is to be expected", is utterly bizarre to me. On the two other FB groups in which I said I have not seen this type of nonsense, there are in fact a great many owners talking about how well their dogs behave, with the emphasis on the importance of proper training. And a LOT of people do in fact find the "good" stories interesting, including me. 

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

As someone else posted earlier, dogs used to be treated like dogs. They were expected to behave and they were trained. The training wasn't always the best, but they were expected to behave. Mom was also home more. Now we have fur babies and dogs are often treated as furry humans and kids (heck, look at the spoiled indulged kids being raised). They are left home alone for 8-10 hours a day, bored, confined with only walks and ball play (which rarely stimulates the mind). Some are even sent off to doggy daycare where they get to still just play and have fun with other dogs, no real rules, no real boundaries. Why should they behave at home? G** forbid we correct them or use adversives to train or expect them to behave. That's cruel. That's wrong. We are infringing on their rights. </sarc>

Add to that the changes in breeding, trying to change the breed to satisfy a market instead of expecting the market to adjust to the breed. Breeders getting farther and farther away from the foundation and intent of the breed as seen in many of the old and now ruined working breeds. 

I could go on.....


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## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

monster said:


> Heartandsoul said:
> 
> 
> > I think the difference between now and "way back when" is that we are at an age where littereally the whole world is at our fingertips.
> ...


Very true. As a kid I sure can tell you many bite stories of just neighborhood dogs loose all the time going after kids in the streets. Stories I heard of dogs dumped on the side of the highway because they chewed the living room couch. So many pregnant dogs running around. Better or worse? I don’t think my kids can tell all those stories of what I have seen but sure looking on Facebook can tell you the same story not sure people changed that much. Couches cost a lot more money though.


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## Leon big boy (Feb 1, 2017)

On training, I do not really appreciate these trainings that condition the dog too much. The poor animal looks like an android, without a life of its own. I Just gave to Leon and Lady basic training, to come, to go, to sit, to give the paw, to stop, to enter the kennel, to go to do needs, etc. They are very intelligent, sometimes seem to guess what I'm wanting because I give commands so simple and they seem to perfectly understand what I want.


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## cdwoodcox (Jul 4, 2015)

Just like everything else in today's world the stupid get the most attention. The people not the dogs. The dogs are just doing what they are allowed.


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

lhczth said:


> As someone else posted earlier, dogs used to be treated like dogs. They were expected to behave and they were trained. The training wasn't always the best, but they were expected to behave. Mom was also home more. Now we have fur babies and dogs are often treated as furry humans and kids (heck, look at the spoiled indulged kids being raised). They are left home alone for 8-10 hours a day, bored, confined with only walks and ball play (which rarely stimulates the mind). Some are even sent off to doggy daycare where they get to still just play and have fun with other dogs, no real rules, no real boundaries. Why should they behave at home? G** forbid we correct them or use adversives to train or expect them to behave. That's cruel. That's wrong. We are infringing on their rights. </sarc>
> 
> Add to that the changes in breeding, trying to change the breed to satisfy a market instead of expecting the market to adjust to the breed. Breeders getting farther and farther away from the foundation and intent of the breed as seen in many of the old and now ruined working breeds.
> 
> I could go on.....


Exactly! Everything you wrote is truth!


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

My dad is almost 76, so 69 years ago, he was playing with a neighbor's GSD, in the neighbor's yard, with a big stick. He was throwing the stick for the dog and they were having a good time. He decided to put the stick behind his back. The full-grown GSD lept up to get the stick that he could see and closed his teeth around my dad's head. Now that is a total accident. Complete accident. But an accident that stuck with my father for life, and he was not going to have a GSD. My mother put her foot down and they got Cujo. 

Back in the seventies we lived in a side street in Cleveland. On the corner was a gas station. They kept a pair of GSDs. There was King and Queenie. And there was Prince and Duchess I think. Anyway, these dogs were kept at a gas station that had a nice sized grassy lot, but no fence. One day King took a chunk out of my brother's leg while he walked along the sidewalk on his way home from school. He was about ten. Nobody got sued. There wasn't any repercussions. I don't know that my parents were all that aware of it. Maybe they just weren't too concerned because boys will be boys. In the 90s my little sister was bitten by a friend's Rottweiler, and had a shunt put in her chest. My dad was ticked. No one was sued, and I don't know that my dad ever talked to the owner. But the dog was euthanized, which was too bad. The dog was chained, and my sister called to her friend that she was going to pet the dog, and the friend may not have heard as he was going in to drop off books. And the dog ended up dead. 

It is a different world in a lot of ways. I think people were not as freaked out about dog bites way back when. In fact when my dad was a young man, he drove a truck for a baker. The boss told him, "If a dog bites you, clean it. If a kid bites you, go to the ER." 

I think we have to be uber careful with our critters in today's climate. I don't know about the rest of ya'all, but I can't afford a lawsuit. Yes, I have home-owner's insurance, but a claim from a dog bite will probably mean being cancelled. And then it is scramble for insurance. And, then it might mean the GSD in question must go, and maybe even all of them. We have to be uber careful because there is a lot at stake.


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## Bentwings1 (May 29, 2017)

Here is a little statistic I got off the Internet recently.

Dog training

The statistic depicts the number of dogs in the United States from 2000 to 2017. In 2017, a total of about 89.7 million dogs lived in households in the United States as pets. In comparison, some 68 million dogs were owned in the United States in 2000.

According to a recent American Pet Product Association National Pet Owners Survey, four percent of the dogs in the U.S. take a training class.Feb 5, 2015


Only Four percent get some training. No wonder almost every dog you see has no training. Any wonder why virtually every dog is reactive to something. 

If the statistic carries over to GSD and only 4% get any training, this means there is virtually no thought is given to temperament or innate behavior for breeding. It’s no wonder at all that the breed has gone down hill for a long time. Holds true for all dogs too. 

While I don’t have a GSD today, I did in the past. My SCH dog was from an old line of German working dogs. Both parents were SCH 3 titled and regerstered with the SV in Germany. I got him as an 8 week old pup. He began puppy training almost immediately. He lived in the house full time untill about a year and a half old. He much preferred to stay in his kennel in the back yard. The yard was securely fenced so he was free to roam the yard. The kennel was left open so he could go in at his leisure. He often rested on the roof of the dog house. About the only time he came in the house was when it got very cold or rained for days. Even then he rested by the patio door. We had two young boys in diapers then and when he did come in the house, he often curled up with them when they slept while we watched TV. 

Yes, he got into mischief as a young dog. He peeled up a ten foot section of the family room carpet and shredded it one afternoon while we we gone. Another day he destroyed the family room love seat seat, stripping every bit of upholstery off it then chewed up the oak frame. Quite an afternoon’s work! He met us at the door with the big smile that only GSD’s have. I knew enough then that punishment of dogs was something they really don’t understand. He didn’t really like posing for the camera so I had him sit in the wreckage of the couch and took some pictures. That was his “ bad dog” punishment. I dont have these pictures any more....thanks to hurricane Hugo. 

We trained nearly every day of his life, he loved going tracking, going to the obedience field or going to the protection training areas. Often the young boys went with me to the training fields. He would jump into the back of the station wagon and watch while I changed diapers on the kids. It was funny. He could go from very rough protection training to calmly watching me change the kids. He would herd the kids in the back yard and often stood watchfully close to them if my wife scolded the kids for something. 

You don’t see this type of GSD very often now days. Recently I went to a GSD club training session. There were about 50 dogs trying to do some type of training. At least people were trying, I have to give credit for this. Nearly every dog was having problems barking, jumping on people, reactive to other dogs, even young dogs. I’m no expert conformation judge but I didn’t see a single one that didn’t have serious structural faults. Some waddled because they were grossly over weight others were thinner than my Aussie. I don’t think any could do the 12 1/2 mile SCH AD run.
I stayed for about an hour then sadly went home. 

Picture of my Aussie stealing the tooth paste. Some times she just likes to tease me. LOL

Byron


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## car2ner (Apr 9, 2014)

it's not just GSDs, it is not just Facebook. Even Animal Planet had a show called Bad Dog (or something like that). People were delighted to laugh and cringe while their pets did stupid stuff. One small dog would poop all over the boy friend's belongings when he came over. They laughed at that and even gave the behavior a cute name. Would they have done that if it were a St. Bernard or Dane? 

There is a woman in Colorado, a trainer, trying to get e-collars, choke collars and prong collars banned.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

car2ner said:


> it's not just GSDs, it is not just Facebook. Even Animal Planet had a show called Bad Dog (or something like that). People were delighted to laugh and cringe while their pets did stupid stuff. One small dog would poop all over the boy friend's belongings when he came over. They laughed at that and even gave the behavior a cute name. Would they have done that if it were a St. Bernard or Dane?
> 
> There is a woman in Colorado, a trainer, trying to get e-collars, choke collars and prong collars banned.


Wouldn't it be great if at the last moment they changed the name to Bad Dog Owners. 

I think that is why I liked "It's Me or the Dog." The woman was obnoxious, but the people were like the Jerry Springer Crowd of dog owners. And you could always expect an aside by Victoria with her crazed look of a astonishment. 

We need more of that. People need to know it is flipping crazy to feed your dog from a fork at its spot at the table. Sorry. They aren't family members folks, they are your family's pet. They may be your own pet. But they are not your fur babies. You do not have skin-kids and hairy, four-legged kids. You have a dog or dogs, and your children come first. 

We love them, we make sure their needs are met. We even make life-decisions with them in the equation, but they are not family. They are pets, critters. And to put human expectations onto them, is disrespectful to them. It's like dressing up monkeys or apes. It does not make them humans. They may be intelligent. But if they are intelligent, they wouldn't want to be humans -- that is arrogant thinking. It is like, we love you so much, we are making you an honorary human -- uhm, no thanks, I mean humans pretty much suck, not all of them, but enough of them, lying, cheating, sneaking, stealing, corrupt, mean-spirited, bat-shoot crazy. Being a dog is perhaps not as thrilling and exciting or privileged, but it is honest. 

Ah well.

We need more of people mirroring that it is crazy to allow inappropriate biting, pulling, pooping, chewing, etc.


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## 1stDaughter4Legs (Jan 8, 2015)

I decided to log on and see what people are talking about. I suddenly feel so blessed listening to all of you talk about the bad things that are going on with GSD’s online. I haven’t experience that my girl is three years old now(together since 9 wks) She doesn’t dig in the trash, tear up anything(except her x-mad gift wrapping), ruin couches, scratch walls, eat scrap food bits off of the floor. I can literally put my plate of food on the floor next to her and she wouldn’t touch it. Maybe cuz she eats and all raw diet. She gets her raw chicken bones, raw beef bones that she gets to crack and break them and she’s Not aggressive. The only time she may growl is when I put her dinner down she will come and get me and make me stand there so she can growl and then she’ll start eating but if I leave the room she’ll come and pull me back to kitchen. I can still reach down and pick up her food even with her growling and walk around with it she won’t do anything but growl. She loves tiny dogs, cats and chickens and our neighbors giniy fowl. Also every single person in the world I wish she was more standoffish at sometimes but I wouldn’t trade her for anything. We do soaratic training now a days but not as much as she needs it. If she is not tired I don’t get to go to bed because we have to play for at least 20 minutes before she can relax too! I guess I got a great Breeder or something.


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## CEMC (May 2, 2020)

Thirty five years ago I bought a Doberman puppy from a "back yard breeder". That little puppy was a far cry from being a show winner but after owning a significant number & variety of very good dogs (I've never known a bad one) he remains the BEST dog I have ever owned or known. 
A few people bred their females to him & I usually gave the pick of the litter to a friend I thought would appreciate and care for a fine dog. I met with one of those friends recently (many years after the puppy I gave him passed on) & he told me that after losing his beloved dog he bought show-quality Dobermans hoping they would be even better. He admitted that although he paid a lot of money for some of these dogs not one came close to matching that "backyard bred" Dobie I gave him for nothing.
The point is that when you breed for beauty alone eventually that is all you are going to get. Just like it's unwise to marry the most beautiful woman or handsome man you meet it is equally unwise to expect a dog that has been bred for several generations exclusively for looks to excel in other aspects that are much more important.
I agree that news travels much faster these days but much more significant is the fact that people today are so much more vane and instead of looking for a dog that is best suited for a particular purpose they look for a dog that they can best impress other people with. There's a big difference between the two.


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## WNGD (Jan 15, 2005)

GSD aren't for everyone, even for many who already own them.
I thought it was interesting to read what a couple of still active members wrote a few years ago:



wolfy dog said:


> Dogs from the past weren't treated as furry babies either, nor did they have be dressed up for Halloween. They were probably stricter trained without being fed treats until they puked on the way home from the feel-good-only classes. Many roamed the neighborhood and had a fun social life. The ones who were mean, were killed and there weren't any dog whisperers or doggy shrinks to help them. But on the other hand, being bitten was not a big deal since all the bites I have known about then were more of a warning to us kids. At least this is what I remember about the dogs in my childhood.





lhczth said:


> As someone else posted earlier, dogs used to be treated like dogs. They were expected to behave and they were trained. The training wasn't always the best, but they were expected to behave. Mom was also home more. Now we have fur babies and dogs are often treated as furry humans and kids (heck, look at the spoiled indulged kids being raised). They are left home alone for 8-10 hours a day, bored, confined with only walks and ball play (which rarely stimulates the mind). Some are even sent off to doggy daycare where they get to still just play and have fun with other dogs, no real rules, no real boundaries. Why should they behave at home? G** forbid we correct them or use adversives to train or expect them to behave. That's cruel. That's wrong. We are infringing on their rights. </sarc>
> 
> Add to that the changes in breeding, trying to change the breed to satisfy a market instead of expecting the market to adjust to the breed. Breeders getting farther and farther away from the foundation and intent of the breed as seen in many of the old and now ruined working breeds.
> 
> I could go on.....


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