# Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?w/Rhaya's Post



## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Just a reminder to go along with Rhaya's important reminder! 

PLEASE CHECK REFERENCES BEFORE YOU PUT A DOG ON A TRANSPORT!!!

Do you KNOW where your dog is going???
Here is a "heart-warming" story about a "rescuer" who recently saved a deaf Great Dane. In her own words:
"How I got lucky with this boy, I'll never know. I just happened to be glancing at all the Pet Classifieds Listings and saw an add [sic} with four simple words in the entire bio section of the classified - "3 1/2 y/o White Dane DEAF". I guess it was my calling. I contacted the owner Friday morning and picked him up yesterday afternoon. Another successful rescued pup! Now, I just hope to meet up with the rest of you that have deaf dopey danes! He's a gem, just not so good on his feet, as he's still clumsey [sic]."
Best Wishes, Jennie & Apollo

Here is a photo she posted of her new baby:









Two weeks later, here is a picture of the same dog at the kill shelter where he was dumped by his "rescuer". (This boy has been pulled and is safe.)









As it turns out, Jennie is a 16 year old girl. And her name isn't even "Jennie". She has been trawling the internet looking for all kinds of animals from owner surrenders, shelters with low pull fees, unsuspecting rescues. She made up an identity and a story and used the internet. Everyone just took her at her word. Apollo is not the only dog she has "adopted" and dumped. Many animals she has obtained were brought to her door by rescue transporters-INCLUDING GERMAN SHEPHERDS off this board. How could this happen? How could a 16 year old obtain dogs and rodents and birds that she has subsequently thrown out like garbage? Easy. No one checked her references. No one asked her for an application. No one checked. Please think about where you are sending the animals you rescue - they depend on you.

How many others that we don't know about have met this same fate or worse? 

PLEASE CHECK REFERENCES AT THE VERY LEAST BEFORE YOU PUT A DOG ON A TRANSPORT!!!


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## ThreeDogs

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

OMG That's horrible!!

What could she possibly get out of doing something like this?

Makes me sick to think of how she treated the animals while she had them.


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## Strongheart

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Sounds like a Class B dealer in the making. Shudder!


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## ebrannan

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

That does indeed make me shudder too. It also makes it tough for people like me who occasionally do a personal rescue. Yes, most of the foster dogs that have been in my home and currently are, are VGSR dogs. However, I have rescued three dogs on my own in the past year. There have been more in the year's before. All three are in wonderful homes ... one adopted by an approved VGSR adopter with the donation going to VGSR, one adopted by their referrals page with the donation going to VGSR, and one adopted by a courtesy post through Blue Ridge BC rescue, with the donation going to them. Anyone who adopts a dog from me goes through, application, references and home check. 
Some people think I'm a little over-the-top, investing my own money into the rescued dog and then adopting him/her out with their donation going to the rescue ... but I'm a firm believer in everything you do comes back to you, so therefore, I would much rather save a dog than buy a dress, which I don't wear anyway.


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## CampPappy

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

AMEN LIZ!
You get back what you give out. I have monies set aside that just goes to the dogs. I spend my own money and encourage people to donate to the rescue itself. Those people who think you're over the top, just don't get it and never will. Or they will say....it's just ONE dog....there's thousands out there. Well then, I made a difference one dog at a time. Keep doing what your doing and check, check and double check referrences!
I'm with you on the dress....I'd rather go to the hardware store than the mall!


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## katieliz

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

another over-the-topper here. tractor supply and home depot are my favorite stores lately. have to get up and running to foster, a little quicker than planned after a receiving rescue suddenly had no room after the holiday, but not a problem...i've seen for a while here that what's really needed are fosters, and i'm gonna be one of those one-at-a-timers. an over-the-topper, one-at-a-timer, that's me!


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## Myamom

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Was this Kenya/Melissa/Missy? 

I remember doing a transport and meeting the woman doing the next leg who promptly full in love with the dog we were transporting. She hugged and kissed the dog...and looked up at me and said..........."I hope she's not going to a kill shelter"...........................


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Probably was her. 

I think this topic has made people understandably uncomfortable. 

You need to know exactly where you are sending a dog-be it individual, rescue, shelter-like North Shore, etc. 

We all-those of us who have done home checks-know the difference between paper and correspondance, posts on a message board, and the reality of an actual placement. 

And sometimes even with the home checks, we're wrong! I know I have been. But I know that the relationship that develops during the homecheck increases the likelihood that the dog will be safely returned to you should a problem occur.


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## Myamom

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Is this recent Jean? Meaning...she's still "busy"......

I was tracking her intensely...but hadn't heard anything in a while...

If this is recent....I will contact Tammy Grimes again...who I was working with to stop this person once and for all. We have the police dept. involved...


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## Jazzstorm

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

<span style="color: #3333FF">I received an e-mail about a month ago. It told of several people who pose as transporters. They are actually selling animals for research or work for the reserach facilities. SCARY! </span>


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## dd

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Good point. There are lots of "Jennies" out there - people who "just want to help" but who don't stand up to scrutiny if someone would only scrutinise them. People were thrilled with "Jenny" because she was "saving" so many dogs - but no one knows where most of those animals ended up - in breeding outfits, in labs, in kill shelters... She's not the only one out there. Check out the rescue you are helping to get a dog - preferably have someone visit them. Check out your transporters. Make sure you are saving a dog and not sending him to a fate worse than death.

Something else to consider - like the hoarder example given on this board, "Jenny" didn't actually do anything illegal. She asked for the dog, she was given the dog, and once he was her property she disposed of him as she saw fit. So please, especially when doing long distance adoptions and rescues, think twice and check three, four, five times before you make a decision on behalf of an animal that can't speak for itself.

dd


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## KAKZooKpr

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Some of you may know that I'm involved in ACD Rescue. Last night a lady I know that is part of a new Rescue in the Carolinas asked me if I knew anything about a woman that has offered to transport a rescued dog. She got a weird feeling from the e-mails and forwarded them to me, I got the same uneasy feeling. This woman claims to be on a national transport list. The lady trucker will be driving from FL to MN, but she has given no info on time frame, vehicle license, etc. Claims that things are still up in the air as to what vehicle she will be driving, etc. I have the woman's first name only. I told my Rescue friend that I would not feel comfortable with this person unless she got references from people she personally trusted vouching for her. She feels the same as did another person she has questioned. The dog will travel from SC to Atlanta to meet the transport (proposed plan). 

If anyone can help verify info, please feel free to PM me. I don't want to put a name out in error.

Thanks,
Kristina


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## dd

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

That's unusual. One thing you could do is check with Operation Roger, which is an official truckers' network for transport and see if they have heard of her. Personally, I wouldn't give her an animal based on the lack of info provided.

dd


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## KAKZooKpr

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Thanks dd, I just heard from my friend. She sent a long letter to the woman stating concerns and asking for more info. The woman wrote back saying she couldn't make the run due to weather concerns. So, it looks like they will be filling a more traditional transport with more trusted people.

The whole thing just seemed "off".

Kristina


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Bump and adding Rhaya's warning to make sure that people aren't focusing on a past case, but looking at bettering the way things are done now and in the future-because unfortunately, just getting rid of one problem does not mean that others will not try...
Reposting guidelines by request...

The Urgent Rescue forum is often the last hope for many rescues. It’s a place where emotions run high and haste is essential. That combination provides the energy necessary to save many Shepherds. Unfortunately, it also provides an opportunity for exploitation. There are some that visit this area only to exploit the animals and rescuers. Sadly there have been and continue to be cases were caring members have been deceived. This deception has cost some of our members a few dollars and some animals their lives. 

Please remember the anonymous nature of the internet. Before you offer your financial help or surrender one of these animals, please ask yourself – What do I really know about this person? 

So often rescue is about trust. It’s disheartening that there are those that will abuse that trust. Use caution and do a little research before you place your trust in people you know little about. 

Hare are some warning signs: 

1. Members without rescue representation who offer to foster or adopt multiple dogs within a short time period, pregnant dogs, or litters of pups. 

2. Members who have fostered or adopted dogs from the rescue forums in the past, but have no current information on the disposition of those dogs. Goes double for those who have fostered or adopted dogs that ended up in questionable circumstances (lost, PTS without a viable explanation, not spayed/neutered, surrendered to shelters, given away to irresponsible owners). 

3. Members who decline home visits from rescue organizations. 


Here are some tips to help authenticate: 

1. The PA (Potential Adopter) MUST be approved by a local rescue group. Doesn't HAVE to be a Shepherd rescue groups but I would recommend a herding or working breed group. 

2. PA must provide work reference, vet reference and trainer reference. 

3. PA must agree to a home check (again - by a local rescue group). 

Thank you, 
Rhaya 

Top


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

I just read another thread where people were going to help transport a dog without any mention of the above, to someone they "know" on this board. Not yelling, just reminding, to please be careful. 

I would hope if I ever offered for a dog for myself personally, people would question me, get my references, vet check, home check, regardless of my (eek) number of posts or what I purport to do with my dogs. Besides that I would hope someone would stop me due to the number of dogs I have!









I don't know if it would be too direct to start posting those threads as an example here but I really think people need to review this information almost daily. Imagine "helping" to get a dog to a life of pain and suffering just to "save" them. It happens. 

I realize I am nag-tastic on this, but it just makes my jaw drop to see it happen time and time again.


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## Sue F

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

I got Remington off this board, and I was still put through vet checks, references, etc...no home check since I had recently adopted through a rescue and they vouched for me, but I was pleased to see all that happen. Makes me feel better too!


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## melonyjhsn

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Hmm.... Something that I like to do is PM people when I see something off or know there is something funny going on. It only takes a second and the few times I've felt the need to do it, I have gotten a positive response from the other end. Just pass on the facts, and see what happens. People want to help the cause and many are still learning the best ways to get the job done.


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## dd

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

bump


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## artisgsd

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

...and a good person is not going to mind or be offended if you require they be checked out - if anything, they'll be understanding and thankful.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

HA! Found Rhaya's warning in this post!!!!


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## Myamom

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

THANKS Jean!!


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## dd

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

Can we get a sticky on this post? By one of the all-powerful moderators?

dd


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

More:

From pupresq-
Ditto to what several have said - I'm glad Annie will get another chance. In all likelihood it's her last chance, I hope you and your wife will both exercise every possible precaution to make sure that it counts. 

This is not directed at Rob, but at this thread (now where is my soapbox?)

I agree that sometimes people on this board are harsh, insulting, insenstive, whatever. But I really didn't see it at all on this thread. You're much more likely to encounter it in the chat section. Here people spoke the truth as they saw it - and I don't see anyone was disputing that truth. If that truth was hard for some to hear, well, that's because those are hard truths to have to live with. Rescuers live with them every day. We make life and death decisions all day every day. We turn away many more dogs than we could ever hope to save and we do it knowing what will happen when we say no. And every single pair of pleading eyes that you can't help takes another little piece of you with them. 

As Jean and dd mention - it is not rescue's job to sugar coat reality so that others can fail their dogs and then go home happy. This goes way beyond Rob, and I will say that I personally am very sick and tired of hearing people talk about dumping their dog for one reason or another and then go on to "legitimize" their action by saying "oh, but it's okay, I gave her to a really nice rescue! It's not like I took her to the shelter or something." 

I wish I could make them understand that "a nice rescue" is made up of people, people with no more extra resources or time or energy than they have, only different priorities. It is not easier for us to care for 5 dogs or 10 dogs or 15 dogs than it would be for anyone else. When we do it, we make the same sacrifices that anyone else would. We do it because we prioritize the dogs. Rescue is not a hobby. It is very rewarding but it is not fun. It is not analogous to breeding, schutzhund, or any of the other dog-related activities that are covered by this board. There is not a rescuer out there who would not joyfully chose to do something else with her time and money if only there were no more homeless animals for whom there was no other hope. 

I wish I could explain to those people that when you surrender your dog to rescue you are taking what should be your burden and placing it on the back of others and an overburdened system and expecting them to bear it instead of you.

I wish I could explain that when you have a common breed like a GSD and you surrender your dog into rescue, a dog dies. Not your dog this time, but the shelter dog who would have gotten that coveted foster spot that your dog is now in. 

I wish I could explain that when you adopt a puppy and then return it as an adult, several dogs die. Not yours again, but the dogs who might have been saved, fostered, and placed, in the time that your now much less adoptable dog sits in that foster home because it's harder to place.

I wish I could help people understand that when you breed a dog, for every person who gets one of your dogs who might have rescued one already here, a home is lost and a dog dies. For every dog that you sell who is bred, that cycle continues and we lose a little more ground in the struggle against pet overpopulation. 

Please do not ask those of us who live with these realities day in and day out to dishonor the dogs we daily watch die cold and alone on a concrete floor by pretending that they all made it out and will live happily ever after in "a home in the country with plenty of room to run." 

We live with these realities and we expect others, especially those that contribute to them, to be able to face up to them as well.


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## middleofnowhere

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

You have some very good points.

Now will rescue have the perspective to step back and evaluate how they expend their resources? That pathetic case - so cute but so many health issues, so injured - how many resources is that going to take from the healthy, uninjured animal? Indeed, how many healthy animals could be helped in place of the one that demands so much?

Sure, lets transport that dog across the country because the adopter has fallen for the dog on the opposite coast and, well, yes they want the dog but they won't pay for transport. What else are they not going to pay for? Why doesn't the adopter look locally? Is it that they fear being tugged too many ways when they walk into the pound? It's a darned tough market. You face what your situation is locally if you do that. You know that those you walk out without may not ever get out. 

My local humane society is always full. They're full because they step up for abuse cases -- and the unabused or what? underabused? get euthanized. So if you are a dog -- of course you hope your luck holds and you don't need another home. you hope things work out as a puppy. if you are healthy at the pound, you hope you find another home quickly. if you don't, maybe the true good luck would then come in "break a leg" as in be injured. Then you would go to the humane society where they screen their applicants... and euthanize no treatable case. It's not awful there. You might end up spending a lot of time in a crate with a little one on one daily. You might be there for months. They try hard. You don't get hit or kicked. You get vet care. You get some daily attention. You get food. People bring stuff to use for bedding and toys and treats. It's not awful there.

Rescues face rotten decissions daily. Who to take, who to turn away, what parameters to use for adopters.


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## pupresq

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*



> Quote: Now will rescue have the perspective to step back and evaluate how they expend their resources? That pathetic case - so cute but so many health issues, so injured - how many resources is that going to take from the healthy, uninjured animal? Indeed, how many healthy animals could be helped in place of the one that demands so much?


This is definitely something rescues deal with every day and it's a weird and complicated process. Sometimes people try to boil it down to basic arithmetic but it goes way beyond X number of dollars for Y number of lives saved. And the money spent on hard luck cases often doesn't always exist (and so therefore can't get taken away) from healthier dogs. Often the dogs for which you get the donations are the ones that are most pathetic. Ironically, the most injured dog at a shelter may have a better chance at life than any one of the perfectly healthy but common other dogs because the hard luck dog is the one that will appeal to people. Sometimes it makes sense to me, sometimes it doesn't, but who am I to tell people which dogs are worth helping and which are not? 

And money is just one factor - even more important IMO is foster space. I could rescue two perfectly healthy Shepherd mixes tomorrow and still have them, unplaced, a year from now. So even though I love Shepherd mixes, I'm constantly turning them away because of all the other dogs I won't be able to help if I take them. 

But in other cases, yes, the money you spend treating heartworms or parvo is money you don't have for preventative and vaccines for the shelter that might have prevented those situations in the first place. On the other hand, part of your creedo may be doing whatever is necessary for the dogs in your care (it is mine). Another group may feel like treating those things is wrong because it takes the money from other things. There's really no right answer to that one and it's all a balancing act. 

Sometimes people make comments that imply that it's my (or rescue's) "job" or obligation to do things in some other way. I'm open to suggestions, I just don't like being told that we "should" euthanize a dog or not help a dog we want to help because that money could be spent in some other way. There's ALWAYS going to be another way to spend the money. You do the best you can. There is no way for me to save them all and I can only do what I can do. I have a soft spot for seniors. Other people are suckers for a particular coat or color. If purebred rescues want to pull purebred rescues with issues over mixes without them, that's their prerogative. No rescuer is obligated to do more than they are doing. No rescuer is obligated at all - except for the obligations we put on ourselves (but man, those are doozies!







) We are not the ones who put the dogs there, we are only doing our best to help. 



> Quote:Rescues face rotten decisions daily. Who to take, who to turn away, what parameters to use for adopters.


You got that right.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

* This is a post from pupresq * 

just wanted to share with people a situation has come to light in Kentucky today: 

http://www.wlextv.com/global/story.asp?s=7998033

This is a well-known rescuer in this area. She has taken in many dogs including German Shepherds. Obviously the rescue community in this area has been abuzz with this all day. 

Here are some of the things I've heard people say: 

"But she seemed so nice!"
"She was always so helpful!" 
"I appreciated that she was always willing to take dogs"
"I saw her paperwork and that looked fine"
"But she had a really nice website" 

(http://www.animal-assist.org/dogs.html if you're interested)

From what we've been able to determine today, she and her husband were making their income selling the dogs they "rescued." At least 40 dogs were found dead and the number is larger every time they update the story. Starving dogs were feeding on the dead. Over 100 dogs and counting have been found on the property in deplorable conditions. 

Tonight Kentucky and beyond is littered with broken hearts of shelters, rescuers, and transporters who thought they were helping dogs to a better of life and instead helped deliver them into a living ****. 

Those of us, me included, who saw some red flags and refused to send her dogs but did nothing further to sound the alarm will have to live with that for the rest of our lives. 

This kind of situation IS WHY YOU HAVE TO CHECK EVERYTHING!!!!!!!!! Please please please!!! And why rescue is not the time to be quiet, deferential, polite, and not ask questions. Know where you're sending that dog. Be a busybody. When you see somebody not checking, help them out. Get involved. What happened today is not a once in a blue moon occurence, in fact it's all too common as people learn to exploit the Internet. 

Basic home visits and vet checks would have revealed what this person was up to. 

I imagine mods will probably want to move this to the general rescue section but I thought it was important to post it here first because I am hoping more people will see it this way. 

You cannot afford to assume the best about people in rescue. You don't have to be cynical but you've GOT to be careful. A dog's life depends on it.


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## 4dognight

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

OK I am a little late on this but I agree with everyone. I would want my references checked out. I do foster for a few rescues and have good references. I always have said come to my house talk to my neighbors. Here is my vets number. I just recently started back fostering for my local GSD group and have always vol for them, events. HV etc but did not foster for 4 years I had to go through the whole process. The president of my group said don't take it personally. I did not because I have nothing to hide, except some dog hair and dust bunnies There are always folks that have evil intentions for our rescue dogs and we all have to be careful.....


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

http://ozarksfirst.com/content/fulltext/?cid=46781

http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_Animal_Rescue_in_Polk_County_363_Animals_Now_Safe_22082.html

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hxB4EiNVgnZPjRYZhLWsnv8VB99AD92H22DO0

More than 360 domestic and farm animals, many of them emaciated, injured and suffering from mange and parasites, were rescued Tuesday from a filthy southwest Missouri property where they were hoarded and bred, authorities said.

The owner of the property was charged with child endangerment because six children, ages 1 to 11, also had been living in what authorities described as an unbelievable scene: 12 to 15 house trailers stacked to the ceilings with junk, trash and debris, crawling with cockroaches. The only water source was a bunch of garden hoses strung together.

"These homes are not fit for anyone to live in," human or animal, Polk County Sheriff Steve Bruce said.

The 363 animals include more than 70 dogs and more than three dozen cats, plus donkeys, rabbits, ducks, chickens, and exotic fish. The Humane Society of Missouri and Polk County also found 12 to 15 dead rabbits, dogs, cats, and poultry.


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## katieliz

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

well, there just seems to be no end to these situations. sometimes when you begin to ask questions potential rescues/adopters just disappear. no matter, if you cannot satisfy my requirements to check you out, no dog i am helping will go anywhere near you. period.


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## ILGHAUS

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

And yet we still have people even on this board who can not understand why people want to know what rescue or group a dog is going to go to.


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## katieliz

*Re: Do You Know Where That Dog is Going?*

must be because they aren't educated about the subject, and don't know the reality of what's out there. sometimes people can be incredibly naive about the goings on in the world. SO MANY people have absolutely no idea about the amish puppy mills, or the buckeye dog auction, bait dogs, hoarding...and when you first come here to the urgent section it can be SO EASY to get carried away, if you are a good person, and do want to help...i wish there was a way that when new people do come to the urgent section they could have "mentors"...possibly not practical or possible, but it would be good if newbies could get some input from some of those who've been here a while. oh, and another thing...i wish there was a way that if you want to participate in the urgent section, you have to register more extensively, maybe with details not visible to to everyone, but somewhere in a registry that would be useable to all other's in that section. everyone who works the urgent board should be required to be TOTALLY TRANSPARENT.


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## Timber1

Do you know where your rescue is going --- Yes, without exception.

But my group has always arranged for the transport, and every single dog has been placed with a rescue person, a vet's or in severe aggression cases a trainer that works with us.

Frankly, I was suprised to hear that some of the so-called rescue dogs actually end up in a worst place then where they started from.


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## bdanise1

i wish there was a way that if you want to participate in the urgent section, you have to register more extensively, maybe with details not visible to to everyone, but somewhere in a registry that would be useable to all other's in that section. everyone who works the urgent board should be required to be TOTALLY TRANSPARENT. 

This is a great idea. I still see on the urgent boards people helping to pulls dogs and not sure where they are going.

I have pm person to ask questions and the answer were very vauge.
So I will not help. When I have asked how or where the dogs is Etc. again very vague answers.

It would be great if we could posted as suggested what rescue we are with or rescue we have wroked with.

I am new here less than a year.I would expect people to ask me question. I would want them to, I am very transparent.
I would hope the members who have been here a while would give me suggestions and input.


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## daniella5574

I agree Brigiette. I dont like when I ask a question because I MAY be able to help someone and get told that they dont have to answer to anyone on the board. On the contrary-we are supposed to be a team here. No rescue against rescue, people feeling they dont have to tell the details of the dogs life, etc... The cattiness I sometimes see is very discouraging. I also will not work with someone unless I know exactly who they are, who they are working with and where the dog is going. That is the way it should be for the sake of the dogs.


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## CindyM

"everyone who works the urgent board should be required to be TOTALLY TRANSPARENT. "

What does that mean?


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## Jazy's mom

A rescue should be willing to provided references, copies of adoption contracts/ adoption policies and welcome a home visit. If anyone offers to helps a rescue with a pull, fostering or transport, then they should be able to ask for these things from the rescue so they can decide for themselves if the rescue is one they fell comfortable working with.

Also this should go both ways. I am sure that most reputable rescue would require references and a home visit from any new fosters or volunteers.


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## TESS

Or maybe most people are doing the right things and trying to help. May be you are so jaded by the several horror stories you do not see that your accusatory and suspicious behavior makes your more damaging to the dogs and improving their conditions then many who are out there intent on hurting them.
Interesting thoughts. Except no one is adopting from you nor asking you to help if you don't want to do so - if you do not want to then don't and if you have questions then ask them without pulicizing your unfounded beliefs a person is your own worst fears and sounding like the person who is supposed to answer is condemned to your fears until they prove otherwise. It is ill-educated, damaging and uncivil.
While you MIGHT, and I say might because I will bet most of you have not seen any such thing first hand, have seen some bad things aren't you perpetuating it by refusing to see the many many many good things? Aren't you stifling the help because you believe good things only when you drag people through the mud first?
I have not seen all that many people on this board INCLUDING YOU do what it is you are so adamant - to the point of arrogant - about demanding from everyone else. And you wonder why people want nothing to do with responding to certain of you. Who died and left you in charge exactly? With this level of behavior on the part of some - I really feel more sorry for the dogs.
Tess


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## daniella5574

Tess, EVERYONE here on this board has gone through the same level of questioning and wondering when no one knows who they are. MYSELF included. yet I never presumed to think I shouldnt have to be transparent and give the necessary info that was asked of me. The only arrogance I have seen is your responses to well meaning questions.


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## pupresq

Hi Tess,

I work with a group that represents several rural shelters and sends dogs to quite a few different rescue groups and with many different transporters. We ask these questions of everyone. We expect others to ask these questions of us. It takes a relatively short amount of time to supply the information and a similarly small amount of time for us to process it. If this process can keep even one dog out a bad situation, I think it's worth doing. 

I've been in rescue a long time and I've discovered that bad rescue situations - as well as bad adopters, are not the one-in-a-million chance, nor the single bad apple that spoils the barrel, they're _common_. They are so common that no one truly concerned with animal welfare should _ever_ send dogs out on a hope and a prayer that things will be fine. Giving people the benefit of the doubt in your personal life is one thing, but when a helpless animal is depending on you to make sure things are okay, then checking up and making sure is something you simply have to do. 

I would hope that other people do the same things in other aspects of their lives when the stakes are also high. For example, I would never in a million years hire a babysitter for my child off the Internet, with no questions asked. I would never employ someone to work for me without doing reference checks. Doing rescue is the same kind of thing. You hope for the best, but you also try to make responsible decisions for the animals depending on you. 

I have undergone the same kind of questioning on this board and I welcome it! Any time I offer to help hold or transport an animal for a new group, I would hope that people want to call my vet, want to insure that I am who I say I am. I have nothing to hide and lives are on the line here. If someone tells a lie on the chat section, well, they lied, but no big deal. If someone tells a lie on the urgent board, it could literally kill a dog. I think that's what is meant for the need for transparency in rescue operations. 

Hope that helps!


----------



## Avamom

There is no MIGHT have seen bad things when it comes to the rescue world. I see EVERYDAY the horrible things people do to dogs, I can show you pictures, introduce you to dogs damaged by said people, and tell you stories I saw *first hand*. 

Many times damage to the dogs comes from people with good intentions, the people who take in too many dogs b/c they feel sorry for them and love them but don't know when to stop and can't handle them financially or medically or just basic socialization and handling. They can be individual citizens or rescue's...<u>no one is above question</u>. And there are things worse than death for dogs, if you don't believe that, take a look at any number of pictures on DogsDeserveBetter's website or google Michael Vick...all real stories and real dogs!

I have been to countless home visits of people who SOUNDED great and said all the right things only to go to their house and they be nothing they said they were. I have been to a home to adopt a dog and found a lab chained and penned outside that they never mentioned...I would have never known and my foster would have ended up in that same pen had I not asked more questions and demanded a home visit. That family not only didn't get my dog, they signed the other unwanted dog over to me and I went home with her.

It is very naive for anyone to think that everyone who is trying to help dogs should be trusted and helped with no questions. There are nasty people out there in this internet world, who can be anyone they want to be on the computer. There are also well meaning people who don't know the first thing about rescue who will criticize and get defensive when people who do this every day ask what should be simple questions. I'm sorry if anyone thinks this is jaded...but its reality. I still think most people are good hearted and mean well, but I still am going to ask people questions before working with them and I expect them to do the same of me. 

Rhaya's post is about being careful and knowing who you are helping and where that dog is going...it is well thought out and important guidelines everyone should be following. 

Many people know each other off the board and have worked together and are already vetted so they can appear to be working together and helping each other without questions...but no one should be offended if anyone asks who they are or what rescue they work for. If we all have the dog's best interest at heart and not our own feelings or ego then everyone should be open for questions and <u>hopefully</u> everyone asking is asking in a respectful way, as they should.


----------



## Avamom

Great explanation pupresq (we were posting at the same time, LOL)! I'm sure you won't mind me sharing this...but the first time I worked with her she asked for my references and I asked for hers, even though we publicly work with known rescues....its just a smart practice.


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## pupresq

Yours too! I think you're exactly right - anyone who is checking quickly discovers how important checking really is. It is reality - there are an awful lot of bad situations out there for dogs and cats to wind up in, and, sadly, there are well meaning people sometimes responsible for putting them there. 

And yes! I do not mind you sharing, as it's exactly what should be happening - you and I had been quite friendly and chatty on the board for a long time, but the first time we actually were going to work on a dog together we swapped references and info. No offense taken! That's how it should be.


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## Remo

Even though I am the current president of a fairly large, fairly well known rescue group, I just got checked out when I offered to do a home visit for a dog who was in NJ who was being adopted in VA. 

Did I mind? Not a bit! 

I too have seen first hand, (far too many times) of what can happen to these poor creatures who depend on us get them to a better life. 

We owe it to these dogs to make sure than nothing bad happens to them again once they are in our care.


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## Allie

I have no idea why someone who is pulling dogs from shelters would not want to make everything open and provide references, home visits from other reputable rescues. There are so many situations exposed on almost a daily basis of hoarding, selling dogs that were rescued, etc. that it would seem readily apparent why people who would to know where dogs are going and to check references. 

When I "adopted" my Allie, I had two home visits from the person I got her from, a joint visit to my vet with the person and continued follow up. I was not offended but rather glad that Allie's guardian was so protective. 

We have to speak for those who cannot speak for themselves and ensure that we are doing our best to protect them. 

I readily admit I cannot afford to do rescue nor am I situated to even go to shelters due to physical limitations. However, that does not stop me from being concerned and caring for the animals.

ML


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## Kaitadog

> Originally Posted By: Tess Phila PA While you MIGHT, and I say might because I will bet most of you have not seen any such thing first hand, have seen some bad things aren't you perpetuating it by refusing to see the many many many good things?


The problem with this is that if you don't take precautions, and no matter how many wonderful things have happened, you're still dealing with a *life*. One mistake in judgment can lead to years of suffering for a dog. While the chances of it happening are slim in most cases, not many people are willing to take that chance.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

And I think the other question that needs to be asked to prove the importance of the question of where is that dog going is...

Where did that dog come from?

Because each of these dogs came from somewhere. And could end up back in a shelter or awful situation again if careful screening is not employed.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

An "older" headline-a little less than a month ago. 

Do you know where you are sending dogs? 



> Quote:HOARDER EMERGENCY IN COLUMBIA, KY - MORE THAN 300 ANIMALS AND WE NEED HELP
> 
> On Friday 2/20 Clean Slate *<u>Animal Rescue </u>*in Columbia was raided. An estimated more than 300 dogs, cats, and farm animals were in danger of euthanization by the county. UR_KY had been investigating this rescue as well. It appears to be a situation where a rescuer went over the line into hoarding. Most of the animals have mange or other injuries and illnesses.
> http://www.urky.org/Emergencies_.html


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Another rescue: Pendragwn Chow Chow Rescue

http://www.whptv.com/news/local/story/Animal-cruelty-charges-to-be-filed/Fiz_5g_AqkSOe2NTkNGFBw.cspx



> Quote:The Humane League says people have been complaining of lots of barking and horrible smells coming from the home, but didn't have enough information to issue a search warrant, until now.
> 
> The Humane League of Lancaster County has been working non stop since yesterday's rescue to find homes for these dogs, some were in such bad shape they had to be euthanized. The League calls this a very sad situation - especially because the woman caring for these animals loved the dogs but took in too many and became overwhelmed.
> 
> 92 dogs were rescued from the East Lampeter Township home Tuesday afternoon from what the humane league calls deplorable conditions, two of the animals were found dead.
> 
> Kerry Flanagan, V.P. of Operations
> “It was a very upsetting scene, dogs in crates stacked two high. There was fecal matter built up in some areas a few feet deep. The smell was overwhelming when you walked in it hit you like a wall.”
> 
> The victims were all chows and chow-mixes ranging from puppies to seniors. The dogs were transported Tuesday night to the Humane League, some doubled up in cages, some laying still - emotionally and physically broken. One dog had two broken legs. His buddy next door suffers from mange, a parasitic infestation of the skin. He's also emaciated and starved.
> 
> The Humane League says the neglect was unintentional by the rescue organization Pendragon Chow Chow Rescue operated by Terri Roby.
> 
> “This is just somebody whose love for animals got out of control...”
> 
> CBS 21 News could not get in touch with Roby but we spoke to a source close to the situation who says Terri is a great person who just couldn't say no. She was getting calls from shelters across the country begging for help in finding homes for these dogs. The situation got out of control.
> 
> Flanagan:
> “She was very upset she was very apologetic and we were very sad at the situation. We think her heart was absolutely in the right place.”
> 
> It's unclear how long all 90 of the dogs had been living in the home but the Humane League says the dead dogs had been decaying--clearly laying there for some time. The Humane League says animal cruelty charges are expected to be filed next week as well as a charge of operating an illegal kennel.


Breaks my heart that these extremely clean, wonderful dogs with such intelligence were in these conditions. 









Ask yourself this BEFORE you help someone here get a dog-do you know how many dogs they have? Has anyone been there? Do you get frequent follow ups? How many dogs have they pulled? Where are those dogs? Just because it looks like people are sending someone dogs - have you checked them out yourself? 

Do you know where that dog is going? That is the difference between a dog being truly rescued, and a dog just being sent from possible death to a living death. 

I hope people read and really GET this thread. I really do. 

* <span style='font-size: 14pt'><span style='font-family: Arial Black'>Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms5cclLewYk&feature=channel_page</span></span> * 

And it doesn't have to be that bad to be bad enough.


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## cork2win

Is there a references section anywhere on this site? A list of people's user names, and a place to rate or comment about actual personal dealings with this person? Their experience, references, etc? Wouldn't that be a good idea, if it doesn't already exist?


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Not GSDs, but...



> QuoteEARBORN, Mich. — Police on Friday found about 150 dead dogs packed in freezers in the basement of a Michigan house littered with feces and trash where more than 110 live dogs, mostly Chihuahuas, were rescued this week.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/07/24/150-dogs-found-dead-in-fr_n_244614.html

Who knows if they just kept breeding or if he got them from places, but...again a cautionary tale and why sending dogs to people and rescues that haven't been home checked and thoroughly checked out is so dangerous. 

On the side of one article:


> Quote: June 2009: Royal Oak police seized 33 dogs from a warehouse in Royal Oak that a Birmingham woman operated as the Itsy Bitsy Dog Rescue.


http://www.freep.com/article/20090724/NE...heal-at-shelter

And that:
http://www.freep.com/article/20090710/NEWS03/90710022/17-dogs-from-warehouse-get-new-homes


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Dogs seized at Salina "rescue shelter"
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2009/10/dogs_seized_at_salina_rescue_s.html
By Charles McChesney / The Post-Standard 

October 06, 2009, 10:30PM










Three of the 31 dogs seized from Mallory Paetow of 115 Pinkerton St. look at a visitor to the SPCA. 


Salina, NY - Thirty-one dogs and puppies were taken from a Salina home this evening. Eight have already been euthanized by the CNY SPCA because they were too ill to be saved. 
Paul Morgan, head of the SPCA said he and two other animal cruelty officers went to the home of Mallory Paetow, 24, at 115 Pinkerton St. and found the dogs caged in the basement.
Morgan said Paetow told him she had sold some 125 to 150 dogs in the last year.

"Basically, she was running a kennel," he said.

Paetow was charged with three misdemeanors under state agriculture laws. She's charged with failing to provide proper shelter, food or medical care for the animals.

The dogs, from month-old puppies to dogs as old as 1 1/2 years were to be evaluated by veterinarians, Morgan said. None of the dogs would be available for adoption immediately, Morgan said.


--------------------------------------------
Prior to the seizure an email warning had been issued, but not soon enough for the dogs in her care, or the 125-150 dogs sold to non-screened buyers in the past year. 



> Quote: We have received bad feedback on this rescue in Liverpool NY. Reports include more than 50 pups held in an unfinished basement (seen first hand); selling pups on site at Home Depot and listing them on craigslist; reports of bad holding conditions in her home. Her site says dogs leave there s/n, unless they are too young (and it appears she only pulls puppies). It does say she uses a voucher system. She pulled 35 or so puppies out of KY shelters in the last week or so. PLEASE, IF YOU ARE A SHELTER SENDING TO HER, THINK TWICE. GET VET REFERENCES. TALK TO RESCUES IN HER AREA. We could not find her registration as an animal rescue. This does not mean she has ill intent. She may just be a novice. BUT that does not excuse selling puppies on the spot at Home Depot or on craigslist. Please be careful.


I am not sure how she got to use the NYS Ag vouchers...


----------



## JeanKBBMMMAAN

No idea if she adopted or purchased these animals but she got them from somewhere (in addition to neighbors' pets possibly):



> Quote: L.I. Pet Abuse Suspect Ran "Animal Concentration Camp" The Long Island woman suspected of torturing and killing about 20 dogs before burying them in her backyard forced her children to take part in her animal "concentration camp," according to her son. "It was a concentration camp for the animals," Doug McDonough, the eldest of suspect Sharon McDonough's seven children, told WCBS. "My sisters and me, we got the end of it, too." Doug — who tipped off the animal rescue TV show Rescue Ink, which in turn alerted the Suffolk County SPCA — told the Post that the abuse would begin shortly after his 43-year-old mother brought a pet into her Selden home. "She would buy the dog, treat it like it was the greatest dog in the world for a few days, then they would sit in the cage until she decided to kill them. It was a power trip."
> 
> In what the Suffolk County SPCA chief considers one of the worst cases of animal abuse that he has scene in 25 years, investigators have already unearthed the remains of almost two dozen dogs from the backyard, and discovered a shepherd mix, a beagle mix, an Italian greyhound, a cocker mix, a pug, and a cat living in deplorable conditions inside.


http://gothamist.com/2009/11/09/long_island_pet_cemetery_was_an_ani.php


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

http://www.wkrg.com/raw_news/article/hum...8-2010_2-42-pm/



> Quote: Humane Society Rescues 100 Dogs From Hayden Home
> WKRG.com
> 
> 
> by (AP) HAYDEN, Ala.
> Published: Fri, January 08, 2010 - 1:20 pm CST Last Updated: Fri, January 08, 2010 - 2:42 pm CST
> 56 Views |Short URL: http://wkrg.com/628913
> 
> Hayden, Alabama - Officials have rescued more than 100 dogs from a Hayden home where they were being kept in cramped and dirty conditions without protection from freezing temperatures.
> 
> Scotlund Haisley tells the Huntsville Times in a Friday story that he's relieved to know the dogs are starting out 2010 "on the road to becoming cherished family members."
> 
> Haisley is senior director of Emergency Services for the national Humane Society.
> 
> The property owner had rescued the dogs and attempted to adopt them out, but became overwhelmed and did not have the proper resources to care for the canines.
> 
> The Humane Society is removing the animals and housing them at an emergency shelter set up in a vacant part of the Greater Birmingham Humane Society.
> 
> ___
> 
> Information from: The Huntsville Times, http://www.al.com/huntsville


More: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=hayden%2C+alabama+100+dogs&btnG=Search&aq=f&oq=&aqi=


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## daniella5574

Jean these posts just anger me so much, I cannot believe what people do to animals, sick sick people.







I cannot stress enough how important it is to check people out thoroughly-not just to send animal after animal to people that come on here claiming to be a good rescue. Especially in light of the email I recieved this past week about a "rescuer" (which has not been the first email about that "rescue") thank God I trust my gut instincts when I feel something just "isnt right", its proved to be true.


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## Lauri & The Gang

Another one. I saw them post all the time on Craigslist:



> Quote:Authorities seize 31 dogs from Oak Creek shelter
> 
> By The Associated Press
> 
> Posted: Jan. 9, 2010
> 
> More than 30 Jack Russell Terriers have been removed from an Oak Creek animal shelter where authorities say the dogs were mistreated.
> 
> Oak Creek police acting on an anonymous tip responded to First Friends Animal Rescue. They allegedly found dogs with open sores and filthy fur.
> 
> The 31 dogs were taken to Milwaukee Area Domestic Animal Control Commission.
> 
> The director there is Melanie Sobel. She tells WTMJ the dogs lapped up food and water as though they hadn't been fed for a long time. She says many had sores on their paws and fur soaked in urine.
> 
> A message left Saturday with First Friends Animal Rescue was not immediately returned.
> 
> Oak Creek police say they're seeking charges that include mistreatment of animals.


http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/81074577.html


----------



## JeanKBBMMMAAN

> Quoteead animals lead to arrest of Wolcott man and woman on animal cruelty charges
> By Charley Hannagan / The Post-Standard
> January 15, 2010, 6:56AM
> 
> Wolcott, NY -- New York State Police accused a man and woman Thursday of cruelty to animals after investigators found three dead animals and more than a dozen animals that were dehydrated, underfed and suffering from intestinal parasites at their Wolcott home and property.
> 
> State police accused David L. Swan, 62, and Virginia E. Swan, 36, of 11580 Ridge Road, Wolcott, of eight counts of misdemeanor cruelty to animals and one count of endangering the welfare of a child.
> 
> The investigation began after state police received a report of a horse in poor condition.
> 
> State police and the Wayne County Animal Cruelty investigators found one of two horses on the property was emaciated. One of the barns contained a dead goat and dead duck.
> 
> Two dogs in a barn suffered from extreme emaciation and dehydration, and a third dog found in a kennel behind the barn was emaciated and dehydrated too.
> 
> The occupants of the trailer home denied investigators access. After getting a search warrant, investigators said they found a home with floors covered in animal feces and infested with cockroaches.
> 
> They also found 11 dogs and two cats inside the trailer suffering from various levels of neglect. Another dog was found dead in an old dog food bag stored in a bedroom.
> 
> Despite medical efforts, one dog died 12 hours after it was removed.


http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2010/01/dead_animals_lead_to_arrest_of.html

Phone screening won't catch that.


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## Betty

Thank you for posting these. It reminds me to not take any short cuts when placing a puppy.


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## Prinzsalpha

No but a homevisit would.


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## 4dognight

I am never afraid to give folks my info My vets Number , my rescue references,personel references, even talk to my neighbors. I helped get cindy and doug (and little oliver) out of douglasville GA Even though the GSD's went to a rescue I work for. I sent the people who helped pull Cindy the spay info. That way folks know I follow through The one rescue I work for redid HV and references on me because I had not fostered for them in a while and moved to a new address. Folks from rescue had been to the house but new info had to be obtained I said bring it on  I am never afraid to let anyone check my references I would be more upset if they did not.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Exactly Myoung!

I think she got these back?
*Allegedly Abused Dogs Moved to New Wis. Shelter
MILWAUKEE (AP) -- More than 30 Jack Russell Terriers have been removed from a Milwaukee-area animal shelter where authorities say the dogs were mistreated.*



> Quote: MILWAUKEE (AP) -- More than 30 Jack Russell Terriers have been removed from a Milwaukee-area animal shelter where authorities say the dogs were mistreated.
> 
> Oak Creek police acting on an anonymous tip responded to First Friends Animal Rescue in Oak Creek. They allegedly found dogs with open sores and filthy fur.
> 
> The 31 dogs were taken to Milwaukee Area Domestic Animal Control Commission.
> 
> The director there is Melanie Sobel. She tells WTMJ the dogs lapped up food and water as though they hadn't been fed for a long time. She says many had sores on their paws and fur soaked in urine.
> 
> A message left Saturday with First Friends Animal Rescue was not immediately returned.
> 
> Oak Creek police say they're seeking charges that include mistreatment of animals.


http://www.wsaw.com/home/headlines/81077492.html


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## pupresq

Sadly, with the Internet facilitating the long distance transfer of dogs, this kind of thing just gets more and more common. And bad situations with private adopters are even more common. Too often well-meaning people and desperate shelters send dogs off to horrible situations without knowing it. I wish more people understood that when someone asks questions - and for references and home visits - that it's not a personal attack, there are real and legitimate reasons.


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## gsdcentral

About 60 of those dogs from Hayden came to us in Montgomery. Most of them are shy, most of them large breed mixed dogs. We have been in the process of evaluating them and processing them and sending some up for adoption. Some had heartworms some didn't. This is the reason I'm not taking any more dogs in for a while. I don't want to be on the news for having my animals seized because I had too many. I'm working on placing the rescues I have that are adoptable and beefing up the ones that need some extra TLC. I've got work that needs to be done in the yard and the house.

We are trying very hard at the shelter to send to reputable rescues. We've had interest on two chows from a woman who it turns out works closely with the Pendragwyn folks, and I believe the restraining order against them taking more dogs expired this month. Then we were suggested to try another chow rescue which has also just recently shut down. NOw we're working with another group to get them to safety.


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## gsdcentral

Don't forget TEARS in Birmingham, which was also just shut down. This place has been a train wreck for years yet they keep taking in dogs and cats and other animals and begging for money. The shelter I now work for sent at least two GSDs to them that I had a commitment for from a reputable rescue, one was very special needs and had bonded with the other one so the shelter asked that they go together. As soon as they got to TEARS the healthy one was shipped off to somewhere else. Two weeks later TEARS asked me if I could take the other one. I told them yes and when we were trying to negotiate a meeting place/time, they made the comment that she had finally approached the foster mom so maybe one more week and she'd be better and they could get her in a vehicle. I reminded them that SOMEBODY put her in a vehicle and got her to Birmingham from Montgomery. They got their feelings hurt and wouldn't let me take the dog. Last I heard she was living in a pen in someone's back yard (a dog that was terrified of people because of a tramautic incident) because she was scared to go in the house.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang

Another one to add to the list:

Stolen dogs NOT stolen 


http://www.timesnews.net/article.php?id=9019992



> Quote:The woman at the center of an alleged dognapping and attack at a Johnson City dog school has been arrested for filing a false police report.
> 
> The owners of the business, Cool School for Dogs, 3548 West Market Street, have also been charged with animal cruelty.
> 
> According to a press release from Johnson City Police, Ashli Thomas, 25, of 2806 Newbern Drive, has been arrested and charged with filing a false report. Police say Thomas admitted that she made the story up because she had left the dogs unattended and had not been caring for them properly.
> 
> Thomas and the owners of the business, Brad Josselyn and Tamara Josselyn, were also charged by Washington County Animal Control with eight counts of animal cruelty.
> 
> Police added that Thomas is in the Washington County Detention Center under a $5,000 bond. Her arraignment is scheduled for Friday in Washington County General Sessions Count.
> 
> The press release provided no further information regarding the Josselyns, or the location and conditions of the dogs.
> 
> Police were called to the business Tuesday at about 4 a.m., in response to a reported burglary. Thomas said she was sleeping in the business when awakened by the dogs barking. She went to investigate and told police she saw a white male attempting to steal the dogs.
> 
> According to a police report on the incident, Thomas was stabbed by the man in her right side. The report said five stitches would be needed to close her minor wound.
> 
> Thirteen Dobermans were allegedly stolen, with a "substantial reward" offered for their return.
> 
> Check back for more information as it develops.



Apparently the doggies day care place was boarding some of the rescues dogs. From the rescue's website:

http://www.caninehoperescue.org/



> Quote:Our rescue has experienced a great tragedy. Someone broke into the Cool School For Dogs Puppy Dog Day Care and stole many of the rescue dogs that were being cared for there. There were mostly Dobermans taken and 3 other smaller dogs, in total 13 dogs.


----------



## Jazy's mom

Yes, the rescue community in East TN received a very big blow today and I think for many people it was an eye opener. 

These dogs have been plastered all over every local tv station, FB and all the local animal related message boards. I know of a fellow rescuers that started looking up Class B dealers in the area in the hopes that maybe they were sold for money to one of these dealers. Needless to say, many people are very upset right now about being lied to and mislead.


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## Jax08

Amy...can you please let dobermantalk know anything that might come up. I know many members are sick over it.

fyi...there is a shepherd mix missing as well.


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## katieliz

so no one "stole" the dogs? where have the dogs that are "missing" gone?


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## Jax08

nobody seems to know yet.


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## Betty

OMG


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Everyone who participates in any way in this board, in the rescue section, needs to read this thread - first post only even, because he explains everything:

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1334439&page=1&fpart=1


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Good morning rescue people. Do not send people you do not know information on dogs available in their area if those dogs do not have any rescue backing or screening processes to protect them. IF they are an approved adopter through a rescue you have talked to and want to adopt, that's one thing, but randomly sending dogs to people who you do not know, have never approved is poor practice. 

My boyfriend George Clooney and I were just discussing this the other day. Anyone can make up anything on the internet. 

Please, just read that very first post in that thread above. That will help us to understand why we should do what we should do.


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## Betty

Aha! I just knew George was stepping out on me.............

I'm going to give Brad a call and cry on his shoulder.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Now is your chance Betty. I talked to him last night when he called George and things are NOT good. 

BTW, Angelina is looking to adopt a rescue GSD from each continent, I am sure she'd be a good home - she's rich.


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## TG

Just don't let her have Rocco or then I would really be envious!


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

NEVER!!!!!


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## moei

I'm not sure this is appropriate here, but the lyrics fit







(please move if necessary)

http://www.cowboylyrics.com/lyrics/paisley-brad/online-22297.html


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## Jax08

I think that song is very appropriate. 

Jean...you can't have the cute rescue dude and George Clooney!!







You have to choose! Maybe you could have a contest and keep whichever one the dogs take down.


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## Betty

<clearing throat>

*What* cute rescue guy?

Does George know?


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## kshort

Betty,
The guy who rescued the dog from the water in California last week... This thread will enlighten you!

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1337654&page=0&fpart=1


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

> Quote: 100 animals rescued from 1-bedroom upstate NY home
> 
> Posted at: 02/04/2010 10:51 AM | Updated at: 02/04/2010 11:02 AM
> 
> WHEC-TVA central New York animal welfare group is hoping the public will adopt some of the 100 animals rescued from a one-bedroom rural home.
> 
> Officials at the Tompkins County SPCA say the rescue of dozens of dogs, cats, rats, guinea pigs and chinchillas is straining resources at the Ithaca-based organization's shelter, which was already full when the animals were removed from the home last week.
> 
> Investigators say the animals were being kept in unsanitary, overcrowded conditions at a home in Brooktondale, 10 miles southeast of Ithaca. Authorities say several dead animals were found on the property.
> 
> Officials say the animals were being kept by a person who was a self-scribed "animal rescuer."
> 
> Investigators haven't released the person's name.


http://www.whec.com/news/stories/s1400592.shtml?cat=565


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1334439&page=1&fpart=1


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Another one from another post:


raysmom said:


> *Here is a prime example of why we need to be careful when we send a dog to "rescue". This "rescue", Humane Sanctuary, was raided recently and around 100 dogs were seized. They were found living in deplorable conditions, along with some cats, chickens, ducks and horses.*
> 
> *Here is a link to the story - THE PHOTOS ARE GRAPHIC - and the first photo is of a GSD.  The dogs are now at the Trumbull County pound, which I believe is a kill shelter.*
> 
> *Sickening.*
> 
> http://www.canineadvocatesofohio.org/HumaneSanctuary/Index.htm


More: 
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/287631 
"Deplorable conditions, filth, feces and animals living in there including two dead dogs that the others dogs were feeding off of because they were hungry,"

http://www.tribtoday.com/page/content.detail/id/533640.html?nav=5021


> Dr. Rufus Sparks said walking around Kathy Witzman's property was "like running a gauntlet" because of the number of dogs tied up outside her Gustavus farmhouse."The cats couldn't do it. The ducks couldn't do it. We could barely walk around out there," Sparks said Monday from the undisclosed location where 162 dogs were housed following a raid Friday at Witzman's home at 5175 state Route 87.
> In addition to the dogs, 18 cats, two horses, several geese, ducks and chickens were confiscated from the home.
> Sparks, a veterinarian at Town & Country Veterinary Hospital in Howland, is one of about 10 local veterinarians assisting the Animal Welfare League with medical assessments and care of the animals. He said two dogs died since Friday.
> Barb Busko of the Animal Welfare League said nearly all of the dogs have some kind of medical problem, whether it's dehydration or open sores. Two dogs were in a separate room, one just hours away from giving birth and another due within several days.


Thank goodness:


> A woman who found two stray dogs searched the Internet for somewhere to take them and found Witzman, who billed herself as a humane sanctuary, she said.
> "When she saw the conditions the animals were kept in, she contacted the sheriff's office. That phone call kicked off this process," Busko said.


Pleads innocent: http://www.vindy.com/news/2010/feb/19/woman-pleads-innocent-to-animal-cruelty/?newswatch


> BROOKFIELD — Judge Ronald Rice of Eastern District Court ordered Kathy Witzman of Gustavus to stay away from animals until a criminal case charging her with cruelty to animals and open dumping is complete.
> He also ordered that close to 200 animals taken from her home on state Route 187 on Friday and Saturday become the property of the Animal Welfare League of Trumbull County, which is caring for them at several undisclosed locations.
> The league says the ruling will allow it to begin finding permanent homes for the animals, though it’s possible some will have to be euthanized.
> During a Thursday hearing, Witzman, 58, operator of Humane Sanctuary Inc. for the past 14 years, pleaded innocent to the two charges and was released on a personal-recognizance bond, meaning at no cost.
> She told Judge Rice she would try to come up with $2,250 in bond money by Monday to retain the rights for a month to three dogs she believed would not fare well under the care of the Animal Welfare League because of their aggressive tendencies.
> “I wish I could keep them all. I just can’t afford the bond,” she said tearfully after the hearing.
> Witzman said she realizes her home “wasn’t the Ritz” but thinks that her house, a barn and the backyard where she kept the 162 dogs, 15 cats, 14 chickens, five ducks and two horses kept alive a lot of animals that otherwise would be dead.
> “It was a farm setting. This isn’t a million-dollar facility,” she said of the home authorities raided Friday, finding filthy conditions in the house, and dogs that reportedly were not being fed, watered or kept in a humane manner.
> Witzman said she accepted dogs from all over Ohio and didn’t turn away breeds thought to be aggressive, such as pit bulls or bull dogs.
> Witzman ran a “no kill” shelter, which doesn’t euthanize dogs for having aggressive tendencies, she said.
> The raid put Witzman in the Trumbull County jail briefly and sent her 97-year-old mother to the hospital. It came about because a woman from Cleveland “ingratiated herself” at Witzman’s home and then brought other people there who thought dogs should not live outside during the winter, Witzman said.
> Witzman said she believes the dogs — most of them living in cages or chained to dog houses in Witzman’s backyard or in a barn — were better off there than dead.
> She added that she and her helpers distributed 160 pounds of dog food every day and water to every dog every day — a statement that Deputy Harold Firster of the Trumbull County Sheriff’s office disputes. Firster said he believes the dogs went long periods without food or water.
> Witzman said some of the dogs were thin but only because they came to her that way. She said the two dead dogs found in the house were alive when she left but were attacked and partially eaten by other dogs because of the commotion in the house Friday.
> Sean O’Brien, an assistant Trumbull County prosecutor, said that if Witzman is convicted on the animal-cruelty charge, one of the possible terms of her probation is that she be prohibited from being around animals for up to five years. Witz-man’s next hearing in Eastern District Court is March 4.
> Witzman said she first started her animal sanctuary in Suffield Township, Portage County, 14 years ago and moved to Gustavus in 2001.
> Barbara Busko, Animal Welfare League president, said Witzman’s desire to help animals is sincere, but Witzman apparently was unable to accept that there are limits to what she can do. Unlike other no-kill shelters that refuse to accept dogs beyond a certain number, Witzman apparently refused to turn any animals away and “got overwhelmed.”


The website: http://humanesanctuary.com/dogs4adop.aspx

Scary because they say on it:


> The Humane Sanctuary, Inc. requires an application and a home visit.


Because of that...would I have thought them okay to send a dog to?


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Just wanted to make sure Rosa saw this here.


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## shilohsmom

Many thanks Jean. Great place to put this.


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## Myamom

Do you know who you are pulling for?
Do you know who you are transporting for? 
A very powerful reminder to check out who you are helping...........
just one dog . . . Floppy&apos;s story


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## Melina

I read the initial, first post...And I understand what this girl did was sick and wrong, but I'm not sure I understand her motive behind doing what she did? I skimmed through the rest of the posts to see if I could figure it out, but I still think I'm missing something.

Was she thinking she could handle animal after animal, then gave them up to shelters? Was she somehow trying to make money off them? (Though I don't know how she would giving them up to shelters). Why exactly was she doing what she was doing? Forgive me if the answer is blatantly obvious, I just am not understanding why. What she was doing is _not_ okay, I just don't know what her reasoning for doing it is.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

I believe she was making money. And if they weren't profitable, turning them into the shelters.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Just bumping this up for new members to read.



> The Urgent Rescue forum is often the last hope for many rescues. It’s a place where emotions run high and haste is essential. That combination provides the energy necessary to save many Shepherds. Unfortunately, it also provides an opportunity for exploitation. There are some that visit this area only to exploit the animals and rescuers. Sadly there have been and continue to be cases were caring members have been deceived. This deception has cost some of our members a few dollars and some animals their lives.
> 
> Please remember the anonymous nature of the internet. Before you offer your financial help or surrender one of these animals, please ask yourself – What do I really know about this person?
> 
> So often rescue is about trust. It’s disheartening that there are those that will abuse that trust. Use caution and do a little research before you place your trust in people you know little about.
> 
> Hare are some warning signs:
> 
> 1. Members without rescue representation who offer to foster or adopt multiple dogs within a short time period, pregnant dogs, or litters of pups.
> 
> 2. Members who have fostered or adopted dogs from the rescue forums in the past, but have no current information on the disposition of those dogs. Goes double for those who have fostered or adopted dogs that ended up in questionable circumstances (lost, PTS without a viable explanation, not spayed/neutered, surrendered to shelters, given away to irresponsible owners).
> 
> 3. Members who decline home visits from rescue organizations.
> 
> 
> Here are some tips to help authenticate:
> 
> 1. The PA (Potential Adopter) MUST be approved by a local rescue group. Doesn't HAVE to be a Shepherd rescue groups but I would recommend a herding or working breed group.
> 
> 2. PA must provide work reference, vet reference and trainer reference.
> 
> 3. PA must agree to a home check (again - by a local rescue group).
> 
> Thank you,
> Rhaya


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

http://www.capemaycountyherald.com/artic...dogs+found+dead
Video on link



> GOSHEN -- An animal cruelty investigation is underway at the home of Dawn Scheld, 46, of 737 Goshen Road. Law enforcement officers with the state S.P.C.A. raided the home at 10 a.m., armed with a search warrant.
> 
> Six dogs were found buried in the backyard; officers said they stopped digging because they had enough evidence to charge her.
> 
> Fifty seven sick and malnourished dogs were being kept in unconscionable conditions inside a home covered with fecal matter and urine. Dogs were also housed outside, their pens were covered in feces. Their water was frozen and little evidence of food could be found.
> 
> The dogs are receiving emergency medical attention from a veterinarian who responded to the scene.
> 
> Sheld was arrested when she came home this afternoon. She is being charged with causing the death of animals. Officials said additional charges will be filed at the conclusion of their investigation. Sheld is lodged in the Cape May County Jail on $50,000 full cash bail. Official's said she had recently returned from North Carolina with five more dogs.


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## pupresq

Important reminder for everyone who re-homes animals and yet more evidence on the importance of home visits and reference checks.

Police Arrest Man In Cat Torture Case - Louisville News Story - WLKY Louisville

Very very sad.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

I am going to lock this. Please take this discussion to another thread - start a new one on this topic if you wish. This thread has too much important information from the dogs' point of view to get into a back and forth.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Bumping this - know where dogs (and donations too) are going!


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Bump!

Please do everything in Rhaya's post before sending a dog to anyone you internet know.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Should have done a home check:



> ASHTABULA– Tammy Dondorfer can barely stand the sight.
> Over the past couple months, she has helped rescue 30 dogs in a case of animal hoarding. The situation is only getting worse.
> “We realize a lot of them were missing a lot of hair, so there was definitely disease running through there,” said Dondorfer, the animal welfare director at the Ashtabula County Animal Protective League. “There were a few that were thin. They were housed five to six per kennel.”
> In December, the APL got a tip that a county resident was housing about 40 dogs outside of his home. She said the area breeder became overwhelmed with the responsibility.
> While most of the dogs were well-fed, Dondorfer said their health was deteriorating.
> “All the dogs are being treated for sarcoptic mange, which is a zoonotic disease,” she said. “That means it can transfer to humans, so we have to be careful when we’re bringing the animals in.”
> Mange is a mite which often causes itching and skin infection, Dondorfer said. Many dogs had bloody and scabby bodies as a result.
> The infections can take months to treat – time the APL cannot afford.
> “We only have room for 80 dogs, and we’re already at capacity, so by bringing in more dogs, it’s straining the already tight resources that we have,” said Dr. Irene Fiala, Vice President of the Board of Directors at the APL.
> The APL seized 15 dogs in December and another five last week.
> Some animals have struggled to survive.
> Dondorfer said one collie had such poor teeth, they will need to be removed. Another dog, named Isis, battled skin infections and has a hole in its leg.
> Although many of the dogs are unhealthy, Dondorfer said the county has not pressed charges against the person responsible.
> “He is cooperating,” she said. “We thought we would try to go in, get the worst case scenarios first and try to keep working out something that we just keep going back until we get everybody.”
> Until then, Dondorfer said her goal is to rehabilitate the dogs that have been neglected and to help them – among the many others – find a home.
> The Ashtabula County Animal Protective League is located at 5970 Green Road in Ashtabula.
> The APL is open 1 to 6 p.m. on Tuesday, Thursday, Friday and Saturday. It is also open 1 to 5 p.m. on Sunday.


APL Rescues Hoarded Animals | FOX8.com ? Cleveland news & weather


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Imagine sending your foster there and finding out after the fact: 


> ENGLEWOOD - 30 animals, including, dogs, cats, and birds have been rescued after living in squalor inside an Englewood home.
> Volunteers with Englewood Animal Rescue Sanctuary (EARS) took the animals, which are now being prepared for foster families and adoptions. There are 20 cats, 7 dogs and 3 birds.
> "This is one of the worst cases we have ever seen," said Bobbi Austin with EARS.
> The pets were living inside the home on Kilborne Avenue. An elderly woman owns the house. Volunteers say the home is in deplorable shape. All of the animals were full of fleas when they were discovered. Also discovered were some dead animals, including a parrot, hamster, fish, and ferret.
> "It was like her family. What I cannot understand is how she could let them starve to death," said Austin.
> Volunteers found out about the case from one of the homeowner's friends. The friend did not want to be identified, but she told us something had to be done.
> "Am I proud of what I did? In a way, yes. I want these animals to have a good life like her. I want them to be happy and healthy, just like I want her to be," said the homeowner's friend.
> The homeowner is currently in the hospital suffering from a broken wrist and some respiratory problems, according to her friend. She is said to be upset over her pets being taken away.
> "Right now, the pets are going to be put aside so we can evaluate them. Eventually, they will go up for adoption. Since we are a no kill, they will all be adopted one way or another," said Austin.
> If you would like to learn how you can adopt one of the animals, or become a foster parent, please contact EARS at, (941) 475-0636. The Sanctuary is also looking for volunteers and funding to support the new additions.


Animals rescued from Englewood hoarding situation - Sarasota News | Mysuncoast.com and ABC 7: 7 South Newsroom


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Former board member:



> animal rescue
> Dogs
> dog news
> animal abuse
> 
> In what seems to be a recurring issue across the nation, yet another dog "rescue" organization has been busted for issues involving neglect and abuse.
> According to Friday's WPVI News, after several complaints were made to the mayor, officials in Marcus Hook, Pa., raided a woman's home and seized upwards of 30 dogs.
> The woman, Terry Silva, who is a lawyer, is said to operate the Sixth Angels Shepherd Rescue Inc.
> The information on the rescue organization's website states that the agency is a non–profit corporation in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.
> According to the news publication, the "rescue" is not licensed or certified by the state.
> The Pennsylvania SPCA describes the woman running the fake rescue as a hoarder, and they allege that she has a history of hoarding.
> Officials who worked to remove the dogs from the building, located on West 10th Street, describe filthy conditions - so much so that after the animals were removed, the unit was condemned.
> Click here to watch video clip.


Neglected dogs seized from hoarder posing as a rescuer - National Dogs | Examiner.com


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

More - dogs were sent there:



> *Delco bust highlights fake rescue issue*
> 
> *POSTED:* Sunday, February 24, 2013, 11:13 AM
> *Amy Worden, Inquirer Staff Writer  *
> 
> *UPDATE* - We have learned that in November 2010 a property used by Silva to house dogs was raided by the PSPCA after complaints of unsanitary conditions and sick dogs and a caretaker was charged. Also, Silva was issued a state kennel license in 2009 and it was renewed through 2012, despite numerous violations, including poor record keeping and failure to possess health certificates from dogs transported from other states. It is unknown if her license was renewed for 2013. The address listed for Silva's kennel was 1617 JFK Blvd., Philadelphia, which is the Suburban Station building.
> When humane society officials raided the Delaware County law office of *Terry Silva* on a grungy block in Marcus Hook on Friday, they pulled out 28 malnourished German Shepherds and shepherd mixes, including a puppy, a pregnant female and one dog so old and sick it had to be euthanized.
> "They were very, very thin," said *Wendy Marano, *spokeswoman for the Pennsylvania SPCA. The good news: Silva surrendered the dogs and they will be available for foster and adoption, she said.
> The building
> Nine years ago Silva was on top of the world, winning a $317,000 settlement in a dispute involving the Chichester School district where she was solicitor. Then 43, she was described in an Inquirer profile as tenacious and detail-oriented.
> The media attention the Villanova-trained attorney has gotten ever since has been far from laudatory.
> In April 2010 Silva was cited in connection with an illegal dog transport bringing dogs from a North Carolina shelter to her organization, Sixth Angel Shepherd Rescue. Silva was charged with purchasing dogs in a public place. The driver of the transport van was cited for housing animals in filthy cages and 17 dogs were seized by humane officers.
> In a second case that year, PSPCA officers raided and cited a caretaker, Steve Alston, who was operating a kennel for Sixth Angel. An investigation began after complaints of unsanitary living conditions and dogs not receiving vet care. entered into a consent decree in which he agreed that the animals at the property were living in unsanitary conditions and were being denied veterinary care.
> Silva sued the Pennsylvania SPCA and the Bureau of Dog Law Enforcement in both cases. At least one lawsuit is still pending in federal court, Bengal said.
> Silva's website says she started her animal rescue to honor the 9/11 search dogs who worked at the World Trade Center, and says her rescue was licensed by the state.
> Since then Silva has been cited multiple times by local authorities for barking dogs and operating rental properties without a permit.
> Now she faces multiple counts of animal cruelty. Her Petfinder page, that on Friday showed eight healthy-looking dogs for adoption, was swiftly taken offline.
> The ABC news story of the Friday raid below shows dogs being removed from the two-story building where Silva had her law offices. Zoning inspectors immediately condemned as unfit for human habitation.
> "Every place in the building was covered with urine and feces," said George Bengal, the PSPCA's director of humane law enforcement. He said some dogs were found crammed in crates and others locked in different rooms.
> In the ABC news report, the anchor and reporter express amazement that an animal hoarder could masquerade as a rescue.
> Truth is, it happens all the time. In the last week alone, four hoarders pretending to be rescues have been exposed in the region and animals removed, said* Libby Williams*, whose website PetWatchNJ tracks fake rescues.
> Driving the fake rescue business is desperation among shelter operators in the South and Appalachia where cash-starved dog pounds are forced to euthanize large numbers of animals, there is little access to spay/neuter services and pet owners allow their unaltered animals to roam.
> In the past several years in Pennsylvania and South Jersey, authorities have busted numerous pseudo "rescues" many claiming to help save animals facing death in southern shelters.
> Authorities in multiple states have removed hundreds of sick and injured animals from so-called rescues among them, *Faithful but Forgotten* in Fayette County and* Tiger Ranch*, one of the nation's worst cat hoarding cases, near Pittsburgh. Just last month *Dawn Scheld,* who ran *SOS CanineRescue and Rehabilitation* in Cape May County NJ, was sentenced for animal cruelty two years after authorities removed 60 sick and injured dogs and other animals.
> Terry Silva told her website readers that the mission of her rescue was to help address the "plight of the southern dog" and to promote the German Shepherd as a family dog. She writes:
> _We believe that God will judge a man by that which he chooses in his life to treat as trash _


Delco bust highlights fake rescue issue


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Why do a home check?



> Good Samaritan Discovers Dog Hoarding in Marfa Neighborhood, 3 Dogs Dead 2/26/13
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Felicia Bolton
> [email protected]
> CBS 7 News Reporter
> February 26, 2013
> 
> MARFA, TX - Today Marfa residents are speaking out on nearly two dozen dogs barricaded inside tight quarters with unsanitary living conditions.
> 
> A good deed turned into a nightmare, once a samaritan found dead dogs inside the home and more than 20 animals locked in rooms.
> 
> Tyler Spurgin says he was helping a neighbor going out of town. But when he arrived to feed his neighbor's dogs; he was left in shock after what he found.
> 
> “He let me know that I was going to need to go in through the window in order to get inside his trailer. Because he has all the doors barricaded. I did that and I found the condition inside really horrible," said Marfa resident Tyler Spurgin.
> 
> Spurgin discovered 20 dogs living in their own feces, trapped in cages and without any food or water.
> 
> “We kind of always knew he kept a lot of dogs. When Tyler came home on Friday night, after coming here, he was visibly shaken by what he found when he came into the property,” said Surgin’s wife Lena Hill.
> 
> Among the mess, the couple says they discovered three dead dogs. It’s a tragedy they immediately informed police about.
> 
> “The next Saturday morning, I went directly to the sheriff’s department to file the complaint,” said Spurgin.
> 
> The Presidio County Sheriff's Department says there is little they can do about the situation now, because they are waiting for their animal services officers to return from vacation.
> 
> Until then the couple says they will be caring for the pets and trying to keep them alive.
> 
> We tried contacting the owner of the dogs; however he did not answer our phone calls. Tyler and Lena say they've been out of contact with the owner for 2 days now.


CBS 7 - Your Eye on West Texas


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Pet-Abuse.Com - Home


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

"Sanctuary"



> More than 130 dogs saved from a hoarder in California two weeks ago need to be saved again -- but only rescue groups can save them now.
> 
> The dogs were seized from Rainbow's End Animal Sanctuary in Apple Valley on June 18, where they had been living in one large pack for years without proper food, medical care or human interaction, San Bernardino County Animal Care and Control officials said.
> 
> Some dogs had to be euthanized for health reasons. The rest can only be released to rescue groups because of the costly and extensive medical care and behavior work they need. For the same reason, most rescue groups may only be able to take one or two dogs, said Doug Smith, the supervising animal control officer at the Devore Animal Shelter, about 60 miles east of Los Angeles.


More than 130 dogs rescued from hoarders wait to be saved again | Fox News


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

NewsSun.com



> SEBRING -- The odor coming from 4315 Lakewood Road in Sebring was so bad it could be smelled from the road, and the first deputies on scene Saturday thought there might be a dead body inside the home.
> Instead, deputies found 22 adult cats, five kittens and 18 dogs in "deplorable" condition. The animals were malnourished, infested with fleas and covered in feces. Several of them were near death.
> 
> 
> 
> One dog's flea infestation was so bad, deputies reported, that it was impossible to tell what color the dog's skin was without removing fleas, which had literally eaten holes in the dog's skin.
> 
> 
> 
> The entire home -- including the garage -- was full of animal feces, according to a Highlands County Sheriff's Office report, to the point where it was impossible to determine what the surface of the floor was.
> 
> 
> 
> Many of the animals had mange, the report said. Three of the dogs were so malnourished they couldn't walk. Other were locked in crates that were too small for them to stand up and turn around.
> 
> 
> 
> Some of the animals' food and water bowls contained large amounts of feces, which appeared to be several weeks old, and some of the animals had resorted to consuming the feces to survive, deputies reported.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Former board owner's warning - this is what to do if people come on the board (KNOWN OR UNKNOWN) trying to get dogs:



> The Urgent Rescue forum is often the last hope for many rescues. It’s a place where emotions run high and haste is essential. That combination provides the energy necessary to save many Shepherds. Unfortunately, it also provides an opportunity for exploitation. There are some that visit this area only to exploit the animals and rescuers. Sadly there have been and continue to be cases were caring members have been deceived. This deception has cost some of our members a few dollars and some animals their lives.
> 
> Please remember the anonymous nature of the internet. Before you offer your financial help or surrender one of these animals, please ask yourself – What do I really know about this person?
> 
> So often rescue is about trust. It’s disheartening that there are those that will abuse that trust. Use caution and do a little research before you place your trust in people you know little about.
> 
> Hare are some warning signs:
> 
> 1. Members without rescue representation who offer to foster or adopt multiple dogs within a short time period, pregnant dogs, or litters of pups.
> 
> 2. Members who have fostered or adopted dogs from the rescue forums in the past, but have no current information on the disposition of those dogs. Goes double for those who have fostered or adopted dogs that ended up in questionable circumstances (lost, PTS without a viable explanation, not spayed/neutered, surrendered to shelters, given away to irresponsible owners).
> 
> 3. Members who decline home visits from rescue organizations.
> 
> 
> Here are some tips to help authenticate:
> 
> 1. The PA (Potential Adopter) MUST be approved by a local rescue group. Doesn't HAVE to be a Shepherd rescue groups but I would recommend a herding or working breed group.
> 
> 2. PA must provide work reference, vet reference and trainer reference.
> 
> 3. PA must agree to a home check (again - by a local rescue group).


I will also add that the people doing the checks should not be friends of or related to the person.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Reminder :bump: to review the above.


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