# Sad News about Emma - Severe hip dysplasia



## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

Even though I did my homework and saw the certifications on both parents, Emma has severe hip dysplasia - both sides. 

Early in the week she was favoring her right hind leg a bit, so I made an appointment. I thought she might have bruised it while playing fetch. She is just 7 1/2 months. Needless to say I am extremely devastated.

They will have an orthopedic look at the x-rays next week and advise, but both options the vet knew of are very expensive, which I cannot afford. She is doing fine today and in no pain, and right now seams healed up and her old rambunctious self. 

Vet did feel some inflamation and poping so took the x-ray. The ball sockets are very shallow and flattened. Even I could look and see that something was not right. Vet went over food - I'm good there, and her weight is excellent, 68 lbs this morning.

They have her on Novox for the next week, and I need to keep her activity level down, especially jumping. Walks are OK though

No more tug ever - her favorite past time, and I need to control her jumping. She can do her other normal activities.

Can folks advise me on living with a dog with this condition and refer me to good information.

Any advice too?

Thanks - Keith


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

sorry to hear especially on such a young dog

Some dogs can live a long life with HD, others can't I'm sure a number of factors come into play. I also think it depends on the severity.

Have you thought about applying for Care Credit?


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

What is Care Credit?

Emma just came up with her tug and wanted to play. I had to say No several times. Now she is looking at me with very sad eyes.

I wonder if I still can do a bit of tug if she does not pull. A lot of time it is just with her front end, shaking her head, trying to work the tug away. I'll give the vet a call a bit later.

Ill take her for a walk now - hopefully that will cheer us both up.


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## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Sorry about the bad news  That must be really devastating. 

I wouldn't get too far ahead of yourself till you hear the orthos advice. I would also get a copy of the xrays, or take a picture of them yourself, and post them here (perhaps in the xray/see hips subforum?). That sub forum or the general health one might get you better responses.


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## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Why no tug? I'm not sure that I see where that would be bad for hips? If you can swim her that is great low impact on joints exercise.

Care credit is a low to no interest credit card for medical expenses. If she needs a procedure or surgery this can help you space it out over time with little to no interest.

What does your breeder say?


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

Breeder is no longer available. He got into the candy during the drug search training with his dog. His ex-girlfriend is concerned too as she has a female she wanted to breed. I was not going to breed Emma anyway (she is spayed), but wanted to do agelity and field work with her for fun. Hopefully we can still do that.

As for tug, Emma engages her back hips strongly to pull. Vet does not want that severe action going on. Yesterday I noticed she was not doing it as strong as normal - she usually pulls me out of the chair. Now I know why.

I don't want to aggravate the problem, so I am trying to learn of activities we can still do. I want her to heal up and will try and talk to the orthopedic vet Tuesday when he is in town.

That's the other issue - the orthopedic specialist that can treat this are 4 to 8 hours away.


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## K.Creek (Apr 7, 2013)

POWERSCOL said:


> Even though I did my homework and saw the certifications on both parents, Emma has severe hip dysplasia - both sides.
> 
> Early in the week she was favoring her right hind leg a bit, so I made an appointment. I thought she might have bruised it while playing fetch. She is just 7 1/2 months. Needless to say I am extremely devastated.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry for your news  my Sadie is 15 mos and was just diagnosed with severe hip dysplasia as well...try and stay positive, lots of good information on here and great support!


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

www.carecredit.com you apply for an amount , many doctors/vets accept it . It's rather like a credit card, mostly with no interest for a certain period of time...

WOrth it to have one in cases of emergency.


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

Thanks folks. I'm still upset and in a bit of shock, Now I am paranoid every time she jumps off the deck, or runs around the house or yard. She seems fine and normal and maybe I just need to go with the flow and tackle the problems down the road if they come up. A few minutes ago she had the zoomies around the yard when I let her out to potty. I guess if it does not bother her I should not worry

I feel suckered by the breeder, but then think if she was with someone else would she get the care and love I will give her. Ill try and update later when I hear more.

Right now she is sleeping under my chair,

Thanks again


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## BoTaBe (May 2, 2013)

I'm sorry for your news, too. BUT: She's only 7,5 months old, right? So it might be possible that she "grows out" of it!
Several people who had a bad "diagnosis" for their couple of month old GSD got a better result when they did the x-rays again after their dog was fully grown.
So that just means that it's not a definite result at this age, I'd definitely get new x-rays when she's about 15 months old! 
Fingers crossed that everything turns out to be ok!


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

Bo> dogs don't grow out of HD


There are things you can do tho, muscle building which would be alot of swimming/low impact. Get her on a good supplement, check out laser therapy/acupuncture, find a good doggie PT ..

I read back on some of your old posts (OP) and when you first got her, you said she was from a BYB? And that you were willing to roll the dice. 

Unfortunately, no matter where a puppy comes from, no one can predict the future when it comes to hip/elbow status, we can only hope to stack the deck in our favor.

Hoping she will live a long pain free life...* If you, I might consider re xraying when she's around 2 after growth plates close just to keep up with changes if any and know where you stand with her..


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## shepherdmom (Dec 24, 2011)

My advice get a second opinion and a third if necessary from someone not associated with the first vet. It is my understanding that DX before 1 year on HD is not very accurate. 

Many years ago At 6 months my GS was DX with HD on both sides...we went ahead and did the surgery on what he said was the worst side. Later a different vet had to go back and fix the screw up as the first guy left bone spurs. She never had a problem with the other side. Never had to have the surgery on the other side. She lived until 13. I think we and my poor girl got screwed by that first vet.


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

JakodaCD OA said:


> Bo> dogs don't grow out of HD
> 
> 
> There are things you can do tho, muscle building which would be alot of swimming/low impact. Get her on a good supplement, check out laser therapy/acupuncture, find a good doggie PT ..
> ...



I agree. Yes it was a BYB, but he had the paprer work there, so all seemed good. I even contacted the sire on his information. Working K9 excellent and good ratings. Lesson learned - I will never use a BYB again.

The vet indicated when I called her back with questions that the orthopedic may be recommending supplements, etc and a proper exercise program. She indicated that Emma still has a lot of growing to do and the situation could improve. They need to get the joint swelling down first and probably better quality x-rays from the local hospital. The vet also indicated that even with perfect hips and elbows on the mated pair, this still can happen. 

Also if I remember right my current trainer also does PT work. If not I believe there is another trainer that does rehab/PT work in the area. There was an artical in the paper where she worked with a dog that lost the use of its back legs after being hit by a car. It now uses a cart to hold up the hind end

What hurts most is Emma keeps bringing the tug to me, so we play soft tug where it is just her mouth and front end. As soon as she starts to indicate she wants to tug with the back end I stop the game and redirect to her ball or squeaky snake. Even then I keep the movements light.

Emma seams fine and happy - running and playing in the yard.


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## TrickyShepherd (Aug 15, 2011)

Geez, that really sucks. I'm sorry you got this news. I think it's almost everyone's fear when raising a GSD..... when you get to the point of xraying, it's like torture waiting for results.

I have 2 dogs with HD. One severe, one mild. I have them on really good kibble, and supplements to help their joints out. Most important for us is glucosamine. Also swimming a really great work out for a dysplatic dog. That will tire them out, it's fun, it will build muscle and relieve the pain, and it won't do any damage to the hips. We were lucky that although Zira's is severe, we are able to just use supplements, watch her activity level, and exercise her appropriately for now. We have a savings account building money for what we know will come eventually. I'm not sure about Duke yet, but she will almost most definitely need surgery... so we're preparing for that at a pace we can afford. For now, home care keeps her comfortable. She doesn't seem to have any issues for the most part.

It's devastating, but at least it's not a death sentence. Most dogs will react to treatment fairly well, and still live a good normal life. I know it's hard to hear though. It really is upsetting. I wish you both the best with the road ahead. 

(As a side note: Definitely get other evaluations! Before doing anything crazy like surgery it's wise to have 2-3 opinions on her xrays. Even if your vet is awesome and well trusted. Everyone's human: mistakes can happen, bad judgments are possible... or even something can be missed. Other's ideas and opinions can really open up more paths.)


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

how about getting a kong type toy, fill it with treats, let her work on that? may relieve some of her boredom( Poor puppy


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## CAR83 (Jul 3, 2013)

My friend has a dog that is almost 13 now and had to have surgery when he was a little puppy too. I know it's hard, but your puppy will be okay!! Google dog financial assistance, that may help. Care Credit has saved my animals many times. And I'm not sure what the Schoep Legacy Foundation does- but John Unger loved his dog and started this foundation after his photo went viral. The story makes me cry every time! But poor Schoep passed away this week What a great owner though! And I hear that foundation provides assistance, but that's all I know.


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## Msmaria (Mar 2, 2013)

The ortho vet I saw this week recommended Adequan for my 6 month old. Twice a week for 4 weeks then once a week for 2 weeks. Also starting Dasaquin or cosequin . He said it helps to stop cartilage breakdown and may even help my pup to build cartilage . It's worth asking your vet about it. It's pricey though at $80 a shot. I've read you can do it yourself. my vet recommend intramuscular because he said it yields the best results. 
I hope your pup gets better. It's very scary finding out about their joints and chd


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## BoTaBe (May 2, 2013)

shepherdmom said:


> My advice get a second opinion and a third if necessary from someone not associated with the first vet. It is my understanding that DX before 1 year on HD is not very accurate.
> 
> Many years ago At 6 months my GS was DX with HD on both sides...we went ahead and did the surgery on what he said was the worst side. Later a different vet had to go back and fix the screw up as the first guy left bone spurs. She never had a problem with the other side. Never had to have the surgery on the other side. She lived until 13. I think we and my poor girl got screwed by that first vet.


Yes, that's what I meant to say, too! X-rays before 12/15 months aren't always accurate and they are still growing with 7,5 months. Maybe it won't look that bad if you do another x-ray in a couple of months...
Does she swim? Another good way of building muscle which could be helpful...


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

She does not swim yet. I posted about her first experience in the water in another post. I will be taking her to the lake again today.

She is her rambunctious self this morning, even bringing me her leash - a first. We went for a short walk. (I'm hurting from cleaning carpets all day yesterday)

Thanks for the support. Ill be asking about the shots. I give them all the time to my horses so hopefully they will let us do it at home.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

"He said it helps to stop cartilage breakdown and may even help my pup to build cartilage . "

more than one way to accomplish this. Vitamin C , antioxidants help and protect cartilage from being damaged -- and many things contribute to repair and build collagen / cartilage/ ligaments. - non drug , whole food sourced - multi benefits to over all health


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## volcano (Jan 14, 2013)

Ive heard of breeders "bragging" about a 12.5% dip dysplasia rate. There is no such thing as dysplasia free lines.


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## Msmaria (Mar 2, 2013)

carmspack said:


> "He said it helps to stop cartilage breakdown and may even help my pup to build cartilage . "
> 
> more than one way to accomplish this. Vitamin C , antioxidants help and protect cartilage from being damaged -- and many things contribute to repair and build collagen / cartilage/ ligaments. - non drug , whole food sourced - multi benefits to over all health



Would like to hear more. Is this the bone soup?


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

Thanks folks. I am trying to get the x-rays so I can post. They were emailed to the expert last week (did not see when he was up). Per vet the only recourse at this time is full replacement. She is not pushing, but it is bad enough the reconstructive will not work, She is not my normal vet (I have a call into him - was on vacation during the injury)

What puzzles me is Emma is showing no sign of pain whatever. She is her normal self, chasing the ball and soft tug, Today she must have done 6 laps around the yard at a full run ( back legs going between the front legs together) during her potty break and would not stop even when called. She is hopping on and off the deck ( one step to the ground) even with the steps right there. Only once in a while I notice a shift as she sits down. Her sit varies from perfect (both legs symmetrical at her side) to sloppy ( one leg tucked under and one out to the side) She is not favoring one side or the other.

I need more information on the supplements. vet recommended glucosamine, but at a lower dose than what I can find at the store. I take this myself. Is there a difference between Human brands and pet brands? I get the Sam's bottle that has condroiten too. Thoughts?

She is on Perina Pro large breed puppy which several vets here say is good. I am not sold on the no corn/etc brands. Her litter mate is on one of the speciality brands and is 20 lbs lighter. I also free feed and per the vet her weight is perfect. In fact she does not want her any leaner.

So what else food wise should I be doing. I will ask about the Adequan tomorrow and post the x- rays when I get them. That will be a challenge for me to figure out how to do 

Thanks for all the help


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

just wanted to say, dogs are "stoic", some have a high pain tolerance and you wouldn't know anything was wrong with them otherwise.

Good luck with Emma, I'm glad she feels good now


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## kbella999 (Jan 6, 2012)

My girl Rusti had a treatment called Prolotherapy done on her about 10 days ago. I saw an improvement after 2 days and it continued to get better. We will go back for 2 more treatments each 3 weeks apart. A holistic vet did it for me. It may or may not help your situation but wanted to pass along the info since I had not ever heard of it until a couple weeks ago.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

Msmaria said:


> Would like to hear more. Is this the bone soup?


Gatorbytes posted her recipe for it in this thread:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...ernatives-work-your-senior-2.html#post2537926

She explained that it extracts collagen from the chicken frames. I've subsequently read that there is a theory that it's really the hyaluronic acid (connected to the Type II collagen) that is doing the heavy lifting in helping heal joints from the inside. Interesting stuff.


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## mego (Jan 27, 2013)

I use human glucosamine / chondritin supplements with my dog so there shouldnt be much a difference at all.I break the human pills in half and feed one half each day


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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

Mego - I now have her on the same. I put the folowing post up but no response http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/health-issues/316362-picking-right-surgeon.html#post4001434

The second specialist has also said the TPO may also be an option pending and exam by him. I am awaiting prices and information on after surgery care. I must be a realist on what my limits are being retired. I know this may offend some folks, but sorry. I would hope that If I am in the same serious situation my family would not prolong the pain and suffering.

Folks what I an being told is following the TPO she will be confined to the crate for 6 weeks !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Only out time would be for potty breaks under very strict supervision. They also mentioned a sling, so it appear she may be very confined for a period of time. Based on what I have gathered from information on the web, this is going to be very stressful and painful on her.

*Has anyone been through this and what do I need to know?* I am trying to make an informed decision here, Do I put Emma through this pain and confinement, or do I make her comfortable to where pain management no longer works and then make that decision no one ever wants to make..

Please -I really need help here. Thanks in advance.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

POWERSCOL said:


> Mego - I now have her on the same. I put the folowing post up but no response http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/health-issues/316362-picking-right-surgeon.html#post4001434
> 
> The second specialist has also said the TPO may also be an option pending and exam by him. I am awaiting prices and information on after surgery care. I must be a realist on what my limits are being retired. I know this may offend some folks, but sorry. I would hope that If I am in the same serious situation my family would not prolong the pain and suffering.
> 
> ...


I have never personally gone through this, but I've heard that the surgery is a good thing. 6 weeks of confinement doesn't even begin to compare to a full life of love that she can offer you. She will not feel like moving for a while and the time will go by fast. Its the best thing to do for her.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Have you searched for other threads on here about HD or TPO? There are a lot. 

Very briefly: I've had 2 dogs with HD, one with severe bilateral HD, diagnosed as a young dog. She lived to be almost 12 and died of something unrelated. I got her a total hip replacement on one side at age 5 and otherwise managed it with supplements and exercise. 

Rafi has HD and all kinds of other joint problems. He is on a raw diet, is kept very lean (you can see 2 or 3 of his ribs), gets a minimum of 4 miles in walks per day and often more like 6 miles and gets a lot of supplements. He is doing really well, you would never know he had a problem, much less about 5 problems. 

HD is totally manageable, absolutely not a reason to pts.


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## rgrey (Jul 30, 2013)

Magwart said:


> Gatorbytes posted her recipe for it in this thread:
> http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...ernatives-work-your-senior-2.html#post2537926
> 
> She explained that it extracts collagen from the chicken frames. I've subsequently read that there is a theory that it's really the hyaluronic acid (connected to the Type II collagen) that is doing the heavy lifting in helping heal joints from the inside. Interesting stuff.



Just to throw out there, I make the same thing (saved up chicken carcasses and bones from roasts, ect, or buy chicken feet; sometimes I get chicken wings on sale just for stock making) and make stock for everyone in the house. Its really helped my husband's knee and joint issues, he no longer 'clicks' when he walks. 

I've also gotten beef knuckles/hocks (or saved up rib and roast bones) and made beef stock; and pigs feet for pork stock. Very tasty, and the stock makes a great base for soups and stews, and makes the BEST risotto!


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## FoxyMom (Feb 9, 2013)

POWERSCOL said:


> She is on Perina Pro large breed puppy which several vets here say is good. I am not sold on the no corn/etc brands. Her litter mate is on one of the speciality brands and is 20 lbs lighter. I also free feed and per the vet her weight is perfect. In fact she does not want her any leaner.


Did you mean Purina Pro? I'm surprised no one else has jumped on that. Purina is not a good food in the least. I highly suggest switched her diet. Someone else can probably give you the names of high quality kibble (we feed raw.) 

It seems like you are being very proactive with your pup. I wish you the best! 




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## POWERSCOL (Jan 3, 2013)

Yes Purina Pro Plan Large breed puppy. All the vets and even the specialist say it is good. Emma is also right on track weight wise - over 70 lbs now at 8 months.

When she was much younger I had her on Purina 1 but tried her on Chicken Soup brand, and Blue Buffilow. Both gave her runny stools real bad. I switched her over gradually too. After talking with my vet he suggested the Pro Plan. Got a sample from the store and she loved it. loose stools cleared up within a couple of days.

I am still researching what to do about the HD. I need to find someoen locally that can do Radiograph X rays? Not sure what is so special, but specialist needs them to makes a final decision.


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