# Having trouble picking a breeder in PNW...



## OregonNative (Jan 13, 2015)

Hi all, 

I'm having a heck of a time finding a decent breeder here in the PNW (Washington/Oregon area). I'm currently living south of Portland, OR, and I've noticed a few breeders up here in the PNW (Sherman Ranch, Zimmerhoff, Vom Holtzberg, etc). The problem is, I don't know anything about these breeders and was hoping for some feedback. It's tough picking a breeder! 

Above all, I'm looking for an addition to the family. I have a wife and 1 year old son and I want this pup to have a stellar temperament. I also do search and rescue up here in Oregon, and want a good woods companion. Even outside of search and rescue, I want a friend that can go running, hiking, fishing, camping, etc with me. I love the outdoors and my wife isn't always interested in the idea of going on frequent 12-18 mile hikes in the rain/snow, or winter camping. This would be my first GSD, and my main attraction to the breed is it's energy, loyalty, and ability to be trained. I know my pup won't be going on SAR missions, or long hikes for quite some time (needs to grow up!), but knowing that the breed would excel in these activities down the line puts it on the top of my list.

I have no interest in showing, but I would love to get into some dog based sports/training classes. 

If anyone can give me some suggestions on locating a suitable breeder that breeds for temperament and health up here in the PNW, I'd be very grateful. I'd be willing to travel a reasonable distance (Seattle, Central California, etc) to find the right pup/breeder. 

Thanks!


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## OregonNative (Jan 13, 2015)

Zimmerhoff looks promising, but maybe a more experienced eye would help. Here is their website. 

ZimmerHoff German Shepherds | German Shepherd Breeder in Oregon - Puppies for sale


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

Are you planning to train this dog to do SAR? Have you asked your teammates where they got their dogs from?


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## Bramble (Oct 23, 2011)

Have to spoken to or visited any of them? If not do it. Get on the phone and ask questions, and they should have lots of questions for you. Find their dogs health tested, titled, what their puppy contract covers, ect... Go meet them and their dogs. 

With Zimmerhoff I don't see any info about health testing, and only a few basic titles, not even sure they work their dogs at all. The first thing that strikes me about the website is that THEY HAVE PUPPIES and not only that a RARE OPPORTUNITY! Not something I like to see since it seems to me like they are trying to attract people who want a puppy right now. " Our German Shepherds dams and sires have lineage from both East and West Germany. Many dogs in the lineage are international champions. " Don't like that bit either, sounds like they are buying dogs with well known lines and breeding them, not testing and proving the dogs they have. To me they look like pet breeders. You could probably get an okay pet, but you may not. I doubt they really know their lines and are just breeding whatever the current market wants. 

Personally if I am going to be giving someone over a thousand of my hard earned dollars it is going to be someone who knows the breed and knows their dogs.


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## OregonNative (Jan 13, 2015)

gsdsar said:


> Are you planning to train this dog to do SAR? Have you asked your teammates where they got their dogs from?


I would like to train my pup to do SAR, but my primary focus is on having a family dog/hiking companion. I'm still in training for my SAR team and as far as I know, no one else has a dog. I believe there is a K9 team, but I don't know any of them unfortunately. I could get called out to a remote location, and I would like to be able to take my pup along with me. Additional SAR training is a bonus, but not my primary concern. 

I'll see if I can get into contact with the K9 team and get some information from them. All advice is welcomed!


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## OregonNative (Jan 13, 2015)

Bramble said:


> Have to spoken to or visited any of them? If not do it. Get on the phone and ask questions, and they should have lots of questions for you. Find their dogs health tested, titled, what their puppy contract covers, ect... Go meet them and their dogs.
> 
> With Zimmerhoff I don't see any info about health testing, and only a few basic titles, not even sure they work their dogs at all. The first thing that strikes me about the website is that THEY HAVE PUPPIES and not only that a RARE OPPORTUNITY! Not something I like to see since it seems to me like they are trying to attract people who want a puppy right now. " Our German Shepherds dams and sires have lineage from both East and West Germany. Many dogs in the lineage are international champions. " Don't like that bit either, sounds like they are buying dogs with well known lines and breeding them, not testing and proving the dogs they have. To me they look like pet breeders. You could probably get an okay pet, but you may not. I doubt they really know their lines and are just breeding whatever the current market wants.
> 
> Personally if I am going to be giving someone over a thousand of my hard earned dollars it is going to be someone who knows the breed and knows their dogs.


I haven't personally spoken or visited any of these breeders yet. I'll reach out to multiple breeders in the area and see if I can get some answers and maybe even setup a visit. Thanks so much for all the excellent advice!


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## Bramble (Oct 23, 2011)

Good luck. Websites can be deceiving. Anyone can make a site look very professional, but doesn't mean they can back it up with actual knowledge. Websites can also be fronts for puppy brokers who can make it appear that they own the dogs and pups, but actually don't. If a breeder won't let you visit them or insists on meeting somewhere else move on. Good chance there is something they are trying to hide. Also if they are pressing you for a deposit on a puppy for whatever reason move on. A reputable breeder won't push a sale, they don't need to, most will have waiting lists for their current and up coming litters.


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

OregonNative said:


> I would like to train my pup to do SAR, but my primary focus is on having a family dog/hiking companion. I'm still in training for my SAR team and as far as I know, no one else has a dog. I believe there is a K9 team, but I don't know any of them unfortunately. I could get called out to a remote location, and I would like to be able to take my pup along with me. Additional SAR training is a bonus, but not my primary concern.
> 
> I'll see if I can get into contact with the K9 team and get some information from them. All advice is welcomed!



If you're interested in SAR and doing some training already and want to possibly work your dog in SAR I would be finding the K9 team and talk to them, possibly start training with them. You'd want to start with them before you get your dog anyway, so it might be the way you might want to think about. I might be wrong, but I don't think with SAR teams you can just bring your dog along unless it is a SAR dog. Too much liability for your team if they bring their pets along.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

I've seen dogs(know) from these breeders. Capable of doing sport, or service work: 
Neumond K9
SentinelHarts German Shepherds


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

I don't know how often or if there will be a litter coming up soon but I do know of some breedings going on using my lines as foundation.

Theirs is a program to provide dogs for specialized work . Nothing fancy. No websites .
Very well known through their record with the working dog community.

they go into SAR - wilderness and urban, LE , Medical alert , certified therapy dogs, specialized detection -- 

super sniffers -- long line of them ---

same "lines" on east coast doing exactly the same thing . Deliberate , not a fluke.

Portland/Cottage Grove area of Oregon


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## BrodyRoo (Aug 10, 2016)

onyx'girl said:


> I've seen dogs(know) from these breeders. Capable of doing sport, or service work:
> Neumond K9
> SentinelHarts German Shepherds


Second Neumond. I've met a number of her dogs and they are fabulous - fun to watch work and phenomenal temperaments. If I was looking for a puppy, she'd be my first stop.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

BrodyRoo said:


> Second Neumond. I've met a number of her dogs and they are fabulous - fun to watch work and phenomenal temperaments. If I was looking for a puppy, she'd be my first stop.


the video on the Neumond site --- black dog would not out ---- some expletives from the decoy
dog growly -- dog sensitive to handler approaching - flinches -- on initial aggressive moves by decoy (arm swinging) dog deaks to the side - avoidance - rather than driving in -- prey dog 







the person is looking for a SAR candidate


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

carmspack said:


> the video on the Neumond site --- black dog would not out ---- some expletives from the decoy
> dog growly -- dog sensitive to handler approaching - flinches -- on initial aggressive moves by decoy (arm swinging) dog deaks to the side - avoidance - rather than driving in -- prey dog
> 
> 
> ...


That video you embedded is a Dutch Shepherd in Illinois?


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

but it came up when I went to the Neumond site ?


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

carmspack said:


> but it came up when I went to the Neumond site ?


Shelby(owner of Nuemond) has ties with Bill Kulla's kennel, where the video was shot.... this is a comment on the youtube video that may explain why there was no out.
"Published on Sep 19, 2013
no out command; this was his first time on the suit and i recorded from the first grip. crazy drive for the ball. he was xrayed w/o sedation and didnt give the techs any problems at all."


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

I just looked at a pedigree on one of hte sites listed (from another poster) and could NOT believe the pedigree I linked out to on a current litter.....


I saw a litter with a 3 -3 linebreeding on a male from the infamous crossing of Sven and Sindy.........sigh.........yes - everyone likes that dark dark sable, big boned, big headed medium to low drive with little prey drive but civil dog for companion homes..........but do breeders do ANY research??? Do they understand WHAT they are asking for doing a linebreeding? So many assume that all linebreeding is wonderful........sigh


be very careful when buying a companion pup that the breeder UNDERSTANDS their pedigrees, the history and what has been produced from the lines.....VERY VERY careful!


Lee


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I sent you a PM


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I am also leery of breeders who use their own one stud to all females.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

wolfy dog said:


> I am also leery of breeders who use their own one stud to all females.


I am as well....I guess the OP could look into breeders further to see their total program and not just what is on a website. 
I only suggested breeders in that area that I've seen dogs from, they are stable in temperament and versatile in what they are doing. 
As for the other one I linked, I know it is a kennel that produces many dogs, I personally like a smaller hobby breeder, but again, the dogs I've seen are decent and healthy.....hunt drive, prey drive and nerve is good.
I wouldn't take a pup from just any breeding, I would look at the pedigrees before committing regardless.


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## OregonNative (Jan 13, 2015)

I've reached out to Neumond. I'll reach out to others as well. Geez, it's tough and stressful finding a breeder. 

I feel like I'm filtering through so much "fluff", to find a reliable breeder with healthy stable lines. I know it's well worth the research, but not being experienced with GSDs I feel incredibly lost. 

Thanks for all the advice guys.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

OregonNative said:


> I've reached out to Neumond. I'll reach out to others as well. Geez, it's tough and stressful finding a breeder.
> 
> I feel like I'm filtering through so much "fluff", to find a reliable breeder with healthy stable lines. I know it's well worth the research, but not being experienced with GSDs I feel incredibly lost.
> 
> Thanks for all the advice guys.


good luck! It is hard when you don't know what you don't know. Neumond trains and titles her dogs and also does board and train/titles for others. She is a trainer first, breeder second(even though breeding is a serious task which she does not take lightly) if that makes sense. It does help to make breeding decisions when actually working your own stock to see their strengths and weaknesses to make better breeding decisions. If you are fairly local to her, ask if you can observe the club training, even if you aren't into IPO, you can learn about the breed by observing.


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## OregonNative (Jan 13, 2015)

Would a USCA member/AKC breeder be something to look for?


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

Possibly. But you still need to do your homework.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

OregonNative said:


> Would a USCA member/AKC breeder be something to look for?


Not necessarily, some breeders may be DVG members because USCA clubs are far and few between in some areas. AKC is just a breed registry, doesn't mean anything other than you can trace the pedigree. The NW region of the USCA is so dispersed that clubs are far, trials are hard to find within a days drive. Yet it is odd that one WA club is included in the Mid East region so their trials may not be announced locally if you live in the actual area of that club.


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

Personally, I think you'd learn more by hanging out and seeing what kind of interaction she'd let you have with them. I don't really think the training would be all that helpful in this case. Will the sire play with you, retrieve a ball for you? Will the dam hang out, let you calmly pet her? Are they friendly and confident with you there?


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## Julian G (Apr 4, 2016)

Have you ever had a GSD before? I would get a nice stable working line dog who's parents were raised in the house and are proven good family companions. I would not get a show line dog. I know of a great one but they are not located in the PNW. You would have the pup shipped to you. But they breed GREAT dogs who are members of the family as well as have the drive to work. The breeder is also a joy to work with and takes all the time to match the dog with the right family.


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

Depending on what kind of dog sports you're looking at there are some very good show line breeders. If you want a dog sport like IPO, then I would go with a working line. If you're looking at obedience or rally, a good show line would also work. You'd do best looking for breeders who are active in the sport you are looking at doing with your own dog.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

Try this kennel. They have beautiful dogs with many accomplishments.
German Shepherd Breeders | Vom Banach K9


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

LuvShepherds said:


> Try this kennel. They have beautiful dogs with many accomplishments.
> German Shepherd Breeders | Vom Banach K9


It doesn't say anywhere that they work with them, just breed the purchased titled dogs? I always wonder which breeder would give up his/her sound breeding titled dogs to another breeder? I am not criticizing, just wondering about that. I guess if the references are good, that counts as well. I personally would prefer my breeder to work with the breeding dogs, especially as a resource when my pup grows up.


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## Bramble (Oct 23, 2011)

wolfy dog said:


> It doesn't say anywhere that they work with them, just breed the purchased titled dogs? I always wonder which breeder would give up his/her sound breeding titled dogs to another breeder? I am not criticizing, just wondering about that. I guess if the references are good, that counts as well. I personally would prefer my breeder to work with the breeding dogs, especially as a resource when my pup grows up.


Me too! I think a breeder that trains and works their dogs is going to have a better understanding of their dogs than someone who just buys already titled dogs. They are going to see first hand how their dog reacts in a variety of situations, and to the stress of training and competing.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

and here I thought that SAR ability was a top requirement ! (quote)

" I also do search and rescue up here in Oregon, and want a good woods companion. Even outside of search and rescue,........... I know my pup won't be going on SAR missions, ...................knowing that the breed would excel in these activities ......"

and yet I recommend a person who is a retired military person, a retired k9 handler , qualified to train and certify (regular basis) SAR and LE enforcement dogs , medical alert dogs, PTSD / and therapy dogs for veterans and others,
US Coast guard, businesses etc etc etc . and no one has even asked one question.

here are litters where both parents have earned their chops . Sire a commendable LE PD working a full career and able to do public relations - then after retirement bought back by the trainer because he adored him -- retrained and quickly certified as wilderness SAR because tracking is in his blood . 
The dam narcotic certified , her sister a SAR dog, their littermates and grandparents virtually all of them, working in some specialized detection , law enforcement .

in the blood .

Here is a BIG problem in the breed. There are some outstanding GSD's (and yes other breeds too) that are out in the real working world . 

They are practically anonymous.

You won't have exposure to them in the IPO fields. You hope that you WON'T have to have personal exposure to them because then you would be in trouble some way or the other.

When they hit the evening news, or the papers , everyone ews and awes and loves them . 

And that's it folks.

The fate of the working dog.


quoting ms Wolfstraum "I just looked at a pedigree on one of hte sites listed (from another poster) and could NOT believe the pedigree I linked out to on a current litter.....


I saw a litter with a 3 -3 linebreeding on a male from the infamous crossing of Sven and Sindy.........sigh.........yes - everyone likes that dark dark sable, big boned, big headed medium to low drive with little prey drive but civil dog for companion homes..........but do breeders do ANY research??? Do they understand WHAT they are asking for doing a linebreeding? So many assume that all linebreeding is wonderful........sigh


be very careful when buying a companion pup that the breeder UNDERSTANDS their pedigrees, the history and what has been produced from the lines.....VERY VERY careful!"

so I am going to bow out on this one - too passionate 

good luck


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

wolfy dog said:


> It doesn't say anywhere that they work with them, just breed the purchased titled dogs? I always wonder which breeder would give up his/her sound breeding titled dogs to another breeder? I am not criticizing, just wondering about that. I guess if the references are good, that counts as well. I personally would prefer my breeder to work with the breeding dogs, especially as a resource when my pup grows up.


I know someone who bought one of their dogs and it was awesome. I've heard from other people online that it is a great kennel and the dogs coming out of it are titled. I didn't visit them, as I found what I wanted somewhere else, but they were on my list based on the personal recommendation.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

My Nix is a Vom Banach dog. And is awesome. Great hunt drive, social, easy to live with. 

I liked that she has been breeding her female line for a while. 

As for buying a titled male, if the handler has no interest in breeding the male and is looking to rehome so they can bring in a new dog to compete with and they can make money on the sale of the dog to a good home, I see no issue with it. Friend of mine is the "retirement" home for a world competitor dog. Very very nice dog, handler needed a trusted place for his partner as he was bringing up a new competition dog. 

All that said, Julie can be really difficult to get a hold of. Really difficult.


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

I think the one thing I see in what little I know of working sport dogs is there are a number of people who buy trained dogs and work them and breed them. But how much do they know the pedigree? And I don't mean just to the dogs listed on the pedigree, but the siblings, aunts and uncles. When you're breeding from your own 'line' you know those answers. You know only three of eight puppies were exactly what you were looking and breeding for. (And I'm just throwing out numbers) The general working dog public only knows of the three that are out there working and seen. What about the other five? Why were they not able to do it? No one ever seems to wonder or question this. Because these same traits can come down through the dogs that did make it. You can buy a dog and know the pedigree, the dogs in it. But do you know the whole pedigree? The dogs and bitches laterally? Some breeders are good at matching up puppies to what a buyer wants or expects. But I think those who breed and train their own dogs have a much better idea of what a puppy is going to grow up to be, increasing the odds the buyer will get what he is looking for. And I'm not talking about line breeding, but breeding with knowledge of the whole pedigree, the strengths and weaknesses that are in each line of each dog. When you buy a trained dog, do you know all this? If you didn't train him or her yourself, do you know the quirks, the real ins and outs of the dog? Do you know where the littermates are and why? I don't know. I'm just throwing out there what I've learned from years of breeding. (Not working lines)


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## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

Many times the other pups from " good" breeding were able to work or do it, they just went into home that was not interested in working or showcasing their dog.


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

cliffson1 said:


> Many times the other pups from " good" breeding were able to work or do it, they just went into home that was not interested in working or showcasing their dog.



Good point. You don't always have all the right buyers at the right time. But there were also possibly pups that didn't have the 'right stuff' as well, correct? I think those dogs are just as important to know in a pedigree.


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## SentinelHarts (May 7, 2011)

There are all sorts of breeders, those who are passionate about one sport specifically tend to have specific traits they seek to produce. Breeders who work to produce dogs that excel in multiple venues will have a different set of ideals in what they look for in a dog and what they are looking to produce. This can be said for breeders producing show dogs, dogs for service work, dogs for therapy, dogs for odor detection and or tracking etc. You can further convolute this by becoming lineage specific or preferring specific aesthetic qualities. 


I have learned that what might be the "perfect dog" for one person, is absolutely not for the next. Your abilities, knowledge and experience and investment of time will play a big part in what/who your dog becomes.


I suggest sorting out in your own mind what qualities you desire, and being very realistic with yourself about how much time and effort you will devote to the training of your dog. Should you get a dog that has great potential and then fall short on your end, the dog may end up unfulfilled and seeking an outlet for their higher drive and intelligence- Keep in mind that some of the qualities that make a dog really great at search and rescue may not be ideal for a dog that is to be a family companion dog - including high hunt drive, high food or toy drive and being bidable but determined etc. Once you are sure of these things, you are in a good position to be looking at breeders (Making no assumptions as to where you are at in this process) Know what your minimum criteria is, a good place to start is that all dogs in the pedigree have passing orthopedics / hips & elbows. What other health testing is important to you. What level of performance achievement do you want to see on the pedigree? Share with these breeders your goals and ask if they have a litter or puppy they think will be suitable to your needs. If they say yes, ask them why they feel that way- The breeder should be able to tell you the strengths and weaknesses of each parent and what they are trying to produce by pairing the two.


In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with a breeder buying a dog that has training or even titles. It helps the breeder to do some work with the dog to get a understanding of that dog individually. I disagree with those who says it is "Easy to buy a dog that has already titled and go out and compete with it". It is NOT EASY, that dog is not bonded to you- does not know your body language and it takes months upon months to build that with a dog- even a dog who already knows what to do- it knows what to do for its trainer. 


As far as lineage goes, Ask questions, read up on the dogs in those pedigrees and research what other offspring of potential parents have achieved/ and how is their health. Questions beyond pass or fail - like what do you think was the reason the dog got a particular OFA rating? - Shallow sockets, remodeling, luxation and how will the hips on dog A pair up with the dog B. Linebreeding is not necessarily bad (in-breeding is frowned upon) For a breeder who is an East German Lineage enthusiast, some specific names are present in nearly every living dog today which makes it hard to avoid linebreeding. 


do google searches of potential breeders for feedback both positive and negative


You will want a good relationship with your breeder, having a good feeling from the start is important- well thought out questions will facilitate discussion and give you a better idea of what you want. 


It is not so common to find a compliment out here on the internet un accompanied by some form of criticism- 


There are some great breeders here in the area, If you want to provide a little more information about the above items- you might get some more detailed responses- let us know when you find the right puppy for you 


Camilla
SentinelHarts German Shepherds


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## SentinelHarts (May 7, 2011)

Quote:
Originally Posted by *wolfy dog* View Post 
_It doesn't say anywhere that they work with them, just breed the purchased titled dogs? I always wonder which breeder would give up his/her sound breeding titled dogs to another breeder? I am not criticizing, just wondering about that. I guess if the references are good, that counts as well. I personally would prefer my breeder to work with the breeding dogs, especially as a resource when my pup grows up._
Bramble - Me too! I think a breeder that trains and works their dogs is going to have a better understanding of their dogs than someone who just buys already titled dogs. They are going to see first hand how their dog reacts in a variety of situations, and to the stress of training and competing. 




To answer your question (s)- I am a USCA and DVG member. I am actively training and trialing - next trial is in 2 weeks- Dec 9 & 10 (with my big boned, big headed, dark pigmented, High Drive, Balanced and clear headed East German Lineage male). I worked a Police K9 from 2007-2011 and received my Handler Training at the Lackland AFB K9 training facility in Texas. I am a member of Way Out West Schutzhund Club USCA and Wild West DVG Club. I have trialed 3 different dogs in 5 trials since September of 2015.


Dexter- V Darius vom Grauen Schlund is MY DOG and remains registered to me. I have multiple collected and stored breedings on him. He is 8 years old and still very agile. I allowed my good friends to take him to Michigan with them so they could learn from working him about the sport of Schutzhund. Dexter has good, proper training and loves to work. It seemed to be also in his interest to be able to continue to work and trial (until a time comes when he can no longer) My friends will be coming to watch my home and kennel in just a few weeks while my husband and I take a vacation and Dexter will come with them. He is on loan to them on a preset term and will come back to us by summer of next year.
In the event that you have further questions, please feel free to email me directly- at my kennel name at gmail.com


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## Hineni7 (Nov 8, 2014)

Carmspack ~ I am late to this thread but am very interested in the breeder to whom you reference... I am hoping spring next year to bring a new SAR (dual purpose ideally trailing /HRD) prospect home... I have a breeder I know and like the pups but am always looking.. I am very 'real world' oriented.. No slam to IPO meant, but it doesn't reflect real world conditions well at all, and I want proven progeny in those situations.. So, if you don't mind pm'ing me I would appreciate it


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## Sweet Stella (Feb 7, 2018)

OP,

What breeder did you end up going with? I'm in Portland and just starting the search for my next GSD, which will be a male. Zimmerhoff's dogs caught my eye as well as I'm a sucker for Czech line Shepherds. I'm close by, so am going to meet with them this week and get a feel for the operation and meet his breeding stock. 

That said, I plan to meet with a few breeders before making a decision. I've worked in the local GSD rescue scene for years, so to be honest I usually only hear horror stories in regards to breeders in the area, and my current female GSD is a rescue, but given my wife and I are trying to have our first baby, I'd like to raise up a pup this time around to ensure he has proper structure from the jump, so I'm trying to do my homework and approach this with an open mind.

I'd be interested in hearing anything you learned from your search. Thanks!


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## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

You could contact the Rose City Working Dog Association. They could direct you to breeders of good GSDs in your area. 
About


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## Roark (Jan 18, 2019)

Sweet Stella, did you come across any good breeders that you would recommend? I live in the Portland area as well and am trying to find a few great breeders....Thanks for your help!


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## johnpsz (Jan 1, 2019)

Roark said:


> Sweet Stella, did you come across any good breeders that you would recommend? I live in the Portland area as well and am trying to find a few great breeders....Thanks for your help!


I'm interested too, if anyone has any recommendations or first hand experience with breeders in this area, much appreciated.


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## Laura (Mar 23, 2010)

Look at Kistha Haus GSDs in Lower Lake, CA. DDR shepherds that can do anything that you wish. We have two.....Kim Haegely is the name of the breeder...she charges reasonable prices for her dogs.


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