# Gorgeous, injured GSD male in Kill facility, Los Angeles County



## SouldogIsBack

This unneutered male age unknown has been at the Los Angeles County Animal Control pound since Nov 25/2015. Injured left foreleg. Not sure how much time he has left. Posting! https://www.facebook.com/savingcars...1850219654287/512876992218273/?type=3&theater

This DOG - ID#A4900361

I am described as a male, black and brown German Shepherd Dog

The shelter thinks I am about 1 year and 10 months old.

I have been at the shelter since Nov 25, 2015.

For more information about this animal, call:
Los Angeles County Animal Control - Carson at (310) 523-9566
Ask for information about animal ID number A4900361


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## Magwart

Ugh. That's got a rep as a very high-kill shelter, or at least it used to when I lived there. You might share him to Westside German Shepherd Rescue and German Shepherd Rescue of Los Angeles on Facebook, if he hasn't already been shared. He's not the only purebred, nice-looking dog in Carson, sadly. There are SO many good dogs in So Cal shelters.


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## newlie

Poor baby.


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## Fodder

not that it lessens his need but if he came in on the 25th, they don't include weekends and holidays as part of the stray hold, he may not be available until tomorrow.

although full (when aren't they), with that leg injury, I'd be surprised if Westside weren't already on it!

very handsome boy!!


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## Stonevintage

I agree, found the Los Angeles area shelters a year ago online. I must say- I grew up in that area, but have lived all over the US since then. IT REALLY IS an artificial society growing up there. EVERYTHING is disposable because NOTHING can be allowed to really get thru to you or it will eat you alive....

IMO- the rat race there, you are on the roads commuting 2+ hours every day, your trying to raise a family, violent crime happens every day around you - it's just a big black sewer. Some, try to being a noble dog (GSD) into the picture. But, their lives are so crunched - they don't even have an hour a day calm for themselves.

It's a disaster waiting to happen.... IMO this breed requires the greatest amount of time with their owner.... and we - should be broadcasting that fact..... rather than saying it's of to crate them for 10-12 hours a day.

These people in pressure cooker cities and jobs have been lead astray IMO by GSD supporters - and THIS is the result..... you are not doing the breed any favors by convincing the "cubical guy and cubical wife" to get a GSD and try to make a "cubical dog"...... death for many GSD's that never got a chance is the result.......


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## MineAreWorkingline

Stonevintage said:


> I agree, found the Los Angeles area shelters a year ago online. I must say- I grew up in that area, but have lived all over the US since then. IT REALLY IS an artificial society growing up there. EVERYTHING is disposable because NOTHING can be allowed to really get thru to you or it will eat you alive....
> 
> IMO- the rat race there, you are on the roads commuting 2+ hours every day, your trying to raise a family, violent crime happens every day around you - it's just a big black sewer. Some, try to being a noble dog (GSD) into the picture. But, their lives are so crunched - they don't even have an hour a day calm for themselves.
> 
> *It's a disaster waiting to happen.... IMO this breed requires the greatest amount of time with their owner.... and we - should be broadcasting that fact..... rather than saying it's of to crate them for 10-12 hours a day.*
> 
> These people in pressure cooker cities and jobs have been lead astray IMO by GSD supporters - and THIS is the result..... you are not doing the breed any favors by convincing the "cubical guy and cubical wife" to get a GSD and try to make a "cubical dog"...... death for many GSD's that never got a chance is the result.......


One of the saddest things I ever saw written, could have even been on this forum, was a person nearing retirement age, and were starting their research on buying and owning a working line German Shepherd. They planned on retiring at sixty five and felt that they would finally have the time to properly devote to a dog.


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## SouldogIsBack

Thanks for the tip, have shared this info with both of those GSD rescues. Noticing people posting on the FB link, saying they'll take him, but it means CALLING THE FACILITY AND PULLING THE DOG...
Watching for updates...what a heartbreak. Beautiful working lines GSD. So young, too.


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## Magwart

There are a lot of crazies that comment on those "urgent shelter dog" posts on FB about wanting to foster or adopt -- and they do nothing....or they adopt and turn out to be hoarders. They do it just to get attention as "rescue heroes" on FB, not realizing how dangerous those posts are in driving away people who might actually be able to help but mistakenly think the dog is now safe. I tend to believe none of those "I'll take him" posts on FB until a reputable rescue is involved, or a freedom pic is posted.

This dog honestly needs pledges since he's probably injured. Rescues are all so cash-strapped that seeing "just one more" that's likely to need $500-$1000 in care can be a really hard decision, if there aren't pledges.


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## MayzieGSD

Magwart said:


> This dog honestly needs pledges since he's probably injured. Rescues are all so cash-strapped that seeing "just one more" that's likely to need $500-$1000 in care can be a really hard decision, if there aren't pledges.


How do you pledge?


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## Magwart

People pledge by commenting in the dog's FB thread. It looks like he's got $70 in pledges, but it's not enough. 

I recommend that you limit pledges only to 501(c)(3) rescues, not random hoarders--you don't want to create incentives for sketchy hoarders to pull dogs! You can say something like "I pledge N dollars to a reputable 501(c)3 rescue that pulls and posts a freedom pic." Then, if all goes well, the rescue eventually posts something like "XYZ Dog Rescue pulled the dog this afternoon. Here's the freedom pic of the dog leaving. We are a 501(c)(3) charity. Please send your pledges via Paypal to [email protected]. If you provide an email address through Paypal, we'll send a donation confirmation letter electronically for your tax files." They may message you on FB to follow-up too. At least, that's how I've usually seen it done. 

Today's Giving Tuesday. Maybe it's a good day to ramp up support for him.


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## SouldogIsBack

Pledged $100 for Westside or GSD Rescue of L.A. to save him. Have to do something here.


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## SouldogIsBack

He is due to be destroyed tomorrow, December 2 / 2015


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## llombardo

I called Westside and emailed his info. They are completely overwhelmed. The first step is to get the dog medical. This particular rescue flies dogs out of state. They feel it's risky because they don't know if it will work or not, but they do it. I can't at this time afford to fly a dog(just paid for a major surgery) but if someone is willing to fly him out, they could very we'll have a great dog. 

She also said that dogs with injuries never see the owners because of costs and recently they had a $6000 schutzhund trained import brought in. It's a crazy and sad world for some of these dogs


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## LuvShepherds

There are two rescues in Orange County if anyone has connections there. They are larger than Westside and can take more dogs.


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## newlie

I will pledge but it may have to be when I get off from work. I will also share on Facebook to see if I can ramp up some donations there...


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## SouldogIsBack

SouldogIsBack said:


> Pledged $100 for Westside or GSD Rescue of L.A. to save him. Have to do something here.





LuvShepherds said:


> There are two rescues in Orange County if anyone has connections there. They are larger than Westside and can take more dogs.


Can you post their websites / contact info?


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

I will pledge tonight,cant access FB here at work.


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## Sunflowers

That looks like a senior to me...


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## Fodder

Home - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County

Coastal German Shepherd Rescue, Adopt puppies in Orange County and All of Southern California

Southern California German Shepherd Rescue | Adopt a friend for life!

Home - Second Chance German Shepherd Rescue


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## yuriy

SouldogIsBack said:


> Pledged $100 for Westside or GSD Rescue of L.A. to save him. Have to do something here.


I'll match that with another $100USD. Don't have Facebook so I can't comment on there, but whoever does is welcome to do so on my behalf.

Can someone local hit the phones to local shelters?


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## yuriy

yuriy said:


> Can someone local hit the phones to local shelters?


I meant Rescues. Someone that can pull the dog out and just needs the funds.


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## SouldogIsBack

yuriy said:


> I'll match that with another $100USD. Don't have Facebook so I can't comment on there, but whoever does is welcome to do so on my behalf.
> 
> Can someone local hit the phones to local shelters?



Bless you for the pledge! I've sent urgent emails to three of those rescues, Ocean is full and not accepting any more dogs. If someone wants to call them as well that would be awesome. Praying this isn't the last night for this beautiful GSD.


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## SouldogIsBack

Here is a vid of this beautiful boy, he seems very mellow and obviously confused. https://www.facebook.com/savingcarsonshelterdogs/videos/512883748884264/?hc_location=ufi


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## SouldogIsBack

Just got an email from Coastal German Shepherd Rescue, they will not pull dogs from the Carson facility. Orange County GSDR has written and want to know re his temperament with kids / dogs / other pets / and health issues. Wish I knew. Sent them the vid. Hoping....


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## MayzieGSD

I will also pledge $100. I don't really want to post to fb but will commit to it if someone else can


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## SouldogIsBack

MayzieGSD said:


> I will also pledge $100. I don't really want to post to fb but will commit to it if someone else can


Awesome, so great to see this goodwill and generosity. I just heard from Maria of GSR of Orange County, they are going to try and extend his time as they need to temp test him. Fingers crossed the facility agrees!


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## MayzieGSD

SouldogIsBack said:


> Awesome, so great to see this goodwill and generosity. I just heard from Maria of GSR of Orange County, they are going to try and extend his time as they need to temp test him. Fingers crossed the facility agrees!


Fingers crossed. Poor guy. His face reminds me of my Bruno! I'd even foster him if I could but I am guessing he has to go to a rescue locally and we can't just fly him here.


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## yuriy

There's a woman in the FB comments that is trying to adopt him, but is not getting much cooperation from the shelter. Very frustrating to read that. If anyone close to LA can pull & temporarily foster the dog, it sounds like that woman will happily adopt him ASAP.


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## llombardo

yuriy said:


> There's a woman in the FB comments that is trying to adopt him, but is not getting much cooperation from the shelter. Very frustrating to read that. If anyone close to LA can pull & temporarily foster the dog, it sounds like that woman will happily adopt him ASAP.


It took me a week to get Midnite out of a kill shelter. It was very frustrating and all I could do is pray they didn't destroy him before I could get him.


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## SouldogIsBack

yuriy said:


> There's a woman in the FB comments that is trying to adopt him, but is not getting much cooperation from the shelter. Very frustrating to read that. If anyone close to LA can pull & temporarily foster the dog, it sounds like that woman will happily adopt him ASAP.


Yes it's definitely frustrating to read...she's in Indiana though so it would require some doing. And then there's the issue re hoarders...and people who say they'll adopt and don't show...gets pretty messy


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

I didn't see a place to pay my pledge . How do I do it.


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## SouldogIsBack

Maria asked me if I would spread the word re this rescue desperately needing funds, if GSD lovers could vote daily for the rescue, they stand to be awarded $20,000. Vote every day until and including Dec 20 / 2015. This rescue saves over 400 gsds a year, extremely busy folks! Here is the voting page btw Shelter Details - Shelter Challenge


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## SouldogIsBack

Daisy&Lucky's Mom said:


> I didn't see a place to pay my pledge . How do I do it.


People are pledging on the FB thread, if you designate it towards the GSR of Orange County it will encourage others! If they wind up saving this boy you can contact them directly afterwards, they are an accredited 503 organization :hug:


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## yuriy

Daisy&Lucky's Mom said:


> I didn't see a place to pay my pledge . How do I do it.


My understanding is that we need to wait for someone to pull the dog (on their own expense), and once that happens, the people who pledged would do a PayPal transfer of whatever amount they promised to the person who pulled the dog. In other words, there's nothing/noone to transfer funds to at this moment.


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## SouldogIsBack

yuriy said:


> My understanding is that we need to wait for someone to pull the dog (on their own expense), and once that happens, the people who pledged would do a PayPal transfer of whatever amount they promised to the person who pulled the dog. In other words, there's nothing/noone to transfer funds to at this moment.


Correct! Maria of GSR of Orange County is working on this case now, to see if she can extend his time until someone can get over there to temp test him. So far they are the only rescue involved in this one. And they are definitely in need of funds so yes, if they pull this gsd absolutely it is time to help them! Will post as soon as I hear more from Maria!


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## MayzieGSD

SouldogIsBack said:


> Correct! Maria of GSR of Orange County is working on this case now, to see if she can extend his time until someone can get over there to temp test him. So far they are the only rescue involved in this one. And they are definitely in need of funds so yes, if they pull this gsd absolutely it is time to help them! Will post as soon as I hear more from Maria!


Is she aware of the pledges that have been made?


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## SouldogIsBack

Yes! We're now emailing back and forth so she knows everything.


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## MayzieGSD

SouldogIsBack said:


> Yes! We're now emailing back and forth so she knows everything.


:thumbup:


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## yuriy

SouldogIsBack said:


> Yes! We're now emailing back and forth so she knows everything.


Good to hear. Keep us updated!


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## Magwart

Please post your pledges *on the dog's FB post*, so that the rescues can see the tally. It's very important that it's all there, not here as the rescue won't be checking there. 

Pledges should not be paid until a rescue posts a freedom pic and there's confirmation the dog has left the building! As I posted above, my recommended wording to post to FB is something along the lines of:
"I pledge N dollars to a reputable 501(c)3 rescue that pulls and posts a freedom pic." 

That way it's clear you aren't offering money to entice the nutty hoarders.


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## newlie

Daisy&Lucky's Mom said:


> I didn't see a place to pay my pledge . How do I do it.


Hey Daisy, you click on the link at the beginning of the thread which will take you to the pups's Facebook page and put it in the comments there. Magwart says to word it like "I pledge N dollars to a reputable 501(c)3 rescue that pulls and posts a freedom pic." and you don't pay until he is pulled.

I just pledged $50.


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

I voted for Orange County and I will pledge tonight 70.00. Got busy and worked late.


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## SouldogIsBack

Awesome re the pledges! Got a message from Maria of GSR of Orange County, she spoke with the vet at Carson and they will be performing surgery on this boy's leg today. Fingers crossed there are no complications. GSROC is working to extend his time at the facility which is great news and will be checking him out for eval. So he has a little longer!


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## cranster

Is there any news on this guy?
I haven't stopped thinking about him since seeing this yesterday....

edit: just saw the post above me! sending all our positive vibes his way!


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## MayzieGSD

SouldogIsBack said:


> Awesome re the pledges! Got a message from Maria of GSR of Orange County, she spoke with the vet at Carson and they will be performing surgery on this boy's leg today. Fingers crossed there are no complications. GSROC is working to extend his time at the facility which is great news and will be checking him out for eval. So he has a little longer!


Awesome news!


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## Sunflowers

Any more news? 
Why does he need surgery?
What is his age? Also, where do we send $ to help if we don't have Facebook?


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## MayzieGSD

Sunflowers said:


> Any more news?
> Why does he need surgery?
> What is his age? Also, where do we send $ to help if we don't have Facebook?


He has some sort of leg injury (red bandage in the pic).
They said he is about 1 year 10 months.
It sounds like we cannot send the money until a rescue group frees him?


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## Sunflowers

MayzieGSD said:


> He has some sort of leg injury (red bandage in the pic).
> They said he is about 1 year 10 months.
> It sounds like we cannot send the money until a rescue group frees him?


I seriously doubt he is that young. Look at his gray chin, eyes, and eyebrows.

I see the bandage, just wanted to know specifics.

Thanks, though.


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## MayzieGSD

Sunflowers said:


> I seriously doubt he is that young. Look at his gray chin, eyes, and eyebrows.
> 
> I see the bandage, just wanted to know specifics.
> 
> Thanks, though.


He looks younger in this pic but does have grey on his chin - but both my dogs had that by 2 years!










1 year 10 months sounds like an odd guess. If they are just guessing.


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## middleofnowhere

Don't go on grey in the chin to determine a sheps age - my 2 yo has frosting already.


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## Sunflowers

MayzieGSD said:


> He looks younger in this pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1 year 10 months sounds like an odd guess. If they are just guessing.


Awwwww.... Yes he does!:wub:
Poor baby.

Or maybe whoever surrendered him told them the exact age.


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## llombardo

He is very gentle in the video they have of him too


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

FB page says he was adopted.Anyone know if its true?


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## yuriy

Daisy&Lucky's Mom said:


> FB page says he was adopted.Anyone know if its true?


Fantastic news! Hope he's got a great new home.

I checked out Orange County GSR's website. I heard CA had a GSD overpopulation problem, but wow. Close to 90 GSDs at this rescue alone! Too bad they don't do out of state adoptions - could have been an option for me in a few months (thinking about +1'ing the pack).


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

yuriy said:


> Fantastic news! Hope he's got a great new home.
> 
> I checked out Orange County GSR's website. I heard CA had a GSD overpopulation problem, but wow. Close to 90 GSDs at this rescue alone! Too bad they don't do out of state adoptions - could have been an option for me in a few months (thinking about +1'ing the pack).


 I'm hoping and praying its true and that he has been adopted


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## MayzieGSD

yuriy said:


> I checked out Orange County GSR's website. I heard CA had a GSD overpopulation problem, but wow. Close to 90 GSDs at this rescue alone! Too bad they don't do out of state adoptions - could have been an option for me in a few months (thinking about +1'ing the pack).


That is crazy. Around here you very very rarely see a GSD at the humane society - they are like 90% pits.

Great news if he got adopted!


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## llombardo

yuriy said:


> Fantastic news! Hope he's got a great new home.
> 
> I checked out Orange County GSR's website. I heard CA had a GSD overpopulation problem, but wow. Close to 90 GSDs at this rescue alone! Too bad they don't do out of state adoptions - could have been an option for me in a few months (thinking about +1'ing the pack).


Westside rescue does do out of state adoptions. She told me they fly dogs out all the time. They have lots of GSDs, she says they are way overloaded. They get dogs with papers too that people can't handle. I asked if breeders are contacted and she said that lots of the time they are from out of state and its more of a hassle for these people to get them back to the breeder. She is the one that just adopted out a GSD imported from out of the country worth a good amt of money. The person paid $6000 for the dog and gave it to a rescue.


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## Sunflowers

llombardo said:


> She is the one that just adopted out a GSD imported from out of the country worth a good amt of money. The person paid $6000 for the dog and gave it to a rescue.


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## yuriy

llombardo said:


> Westside rescue does do out of state adoptions. She told me they fly dogs out all the time. They have lots of GSDs, she says they are way overloaded. They get dogs with papers too that people can't handle. I asked if breeders are contacted and she said that lots of the time they are from out of state and its more of a hassle for these people to get them back to the breeder. She is the one that just adopted out a GSD imported from out of the country worth a good amt of money. The person paid $6000 for the dog and gave it to a rescue.


Yup, saw them, too. They will definitely be a consideration when the time is right.


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## MineAreWorkingline

MayzieGSD said:


> That is crazy. Around here you very very rarely see a GSD at the humane society - they are like 90% pits.
> 
> Great news if he got adopted!


Same here, it is sad they don't do out of state adoptions. They could save so many more by sending them to areas that rarely have GSDs. Even if they could reach local shelters and send them there. Our kill shelters are always importing dogs from out of state.


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## MineAreWorkingline

Sunflowers said:


>


I agree, who pays $6,000.00 for a dog then dumps it when they could easily sell it? Something is fishy with that one.


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## Magwart

MineAreWorkingline said:


> I agree, who pays $6,000.00 for a dog then dumps it when they could easily sell it? Something is fishy with that one.


Not at all. It's shockingly common. People with a lot of money buy expensive things just because they can. Then they have a baby and suddenly worry the dog won't be gentle enough, even though it's never been aggressive, because they're experiencing that "new-parent melt-down" when they bring the infant home from the hospital. Or their job changes and they now spend 3/4 of their time traveling. Or the toddler develops a dog allergy. Or the adolescent dog eats the Louis XIV chair and takes a pudding-dump on the hand-woven silk rug....then the spouse says, "It's the dog or me,"... so the dog goes. Sometimes they need it gone immediately, so immediate surrender is easier than waiting to sell it. Other times they want us to do the hard work of finding a good home -- reference checks, home visits, etc., so that they don't have to worry about where the dog ends up. And then there are the rare ones who prefer rescue because they don't want to have to deal with "the public" to sell the dog. They surrender it to rescue, with a story about how special and expensive it is, and drive home telling themselves they did a good deed for the rescue by giving the rescue such a quality dog. 

I once got a fantastic adolescent WGSL dog who came from the Santa Barbara pound, through GSR of Los Angeles (Burbank). Someone there had once paid a lot of money for her from a breeder, but that meant didley-squat on her last day in a kill shelter. If the rescue hadn't come for her that day, she'd have been dead at 5 PM--even though she was a sweet dog, under 2 years old. Even in Louisiana (not a wealthy state!), we've had young dogs surrendered even though they had pedigrees thick with well-known European kennel names -- I remember one owner had a new significant other who was allergic to dogs, so his two dogs went to rescue to appease the significant other....even though he'd paid over $2,000 for each dog. When he handed over the leashes, he was seeing about $4500 walk away.

It happens way, way more often than people not involved in rescue would believe. Right now, there's a run of WL dogs in shelters because dark sables have become trendy, and novice owners realize about 6 months in that the dog is ruining their life...so sometimes they quietly dump it rather than make the embarrassing call to the breeder that they failed. Foster homes that can handle high-drive, adolescent WL dogs are few and far between -- that's a skill-set that could save a lot of lives.


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## llombardo

MineAreWorkingline said:


> I agree, who pays $6,000.00 for a dog then dumps it when they could easily sell it? Something is fishy with that one.


It happens all the time, people just don't care. I can bet a hefty sum that my dog Midnite is one of those dogs. Everything about him screams well bred, but he ended up in a kill shelter at 6 months or so because he is a working line GSD that mouthed the kids because he wasn't taught any different. I would LOVE to meet the people that dumped him, I would have a few choice words to say before I proudly walked away with MY dog.


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## MineAreWorkingline

Magwart said:


> Not at all. It's shockingly common. People with a lot of money buy expensive things just because they can. Then they have a baby and suddenly worry the dog won't be gentle enough, even though it's never been aggressive, because they're experiencing that "new-parent melt-down" when they bring the infant home from the hospital. Or their job changes and they now spend 3/4 of their time traveling. Or the toddler develops a dog allergy. Or the adolescent dog eats the Louis XIV chair and takes a pudding-dump on the hand-woven silk rug....then the spouse says, "It's the dog or me,"... so the dog goes. Sometimes they need it gone immediately, so immediate surrender is easier than waiting to sell it. Other times they want us to do the hard work of finding a good home -- reference checks, home visits, etc., so that they don't have to worry about where the dog ends up. And then there are the rare ones who prefer rescue because they don't want to have to deal with "the public" to sell the dog. They surrender it to rescue, with a story about how special and expensive it is, and drive home telling themselves they did a good deed for the rescue by giving the rescue such a quality dog.
> 
> I once got a fantastic adolescent WGSL dog who came from the Santa Barbara pound, through GSR of Los Angeles (Burbank). Someone there had once paid a lot of money for her from a breeder, but that meant didley-squat on her last day in a kill shelter. If the rescue hadn't come for her that day, she'd have been dead at 5 PM--even though she was a sweet dog, under 2 years old. Even in Louisiana (not a wealthy state!), we've had young dogs surrendered even though they had pedigrees thick with well-known European kennel names -- I remember one owner had a new significant other who was allergic to dogs, so his two dogs went to rescue to appease the significant other....even though he'd paid over $2,000 for each dog. When he handed over the leashes, he was seeing about $4500 walk away.
> 
> It happens way, way more often than people not involved in rescue would believe. Right now, there's a run of WL dogs in shelters because dark sables have become trendy, and novice owners realize about 6 months in that the dog is ruining their life...so sometimes they quietly dump it rather than make the embarrassing call to the breeder that they failed. Foster homes that can handle high-drive, adolescent WL dogs are few and far between -- that's a skill-set that could save a lot of lives.


I guess a lot of that depends on the area. It just doesn't happen around here. Last time I saw anything like that was about three years ago where a young man had a quality dog and he got diagnosed with terminal cancer. He had no problem getting a friend to take his dog in because these are not the kind of dogs found in shelters around here. Heck, you won't even find a backyard bred GSD in these shelters.


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## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> It happens all the time, people just don't care. I can bet a hefty sum that my dog Midnite is one of those dogs. Everything about him screams well bred, but he ended up in a kill shelter at 6 months or so because he is a working line GSD that mouthed the kids because he wasn't taught any different. I would LOVE to meet the people that dumped him, I would have a few choice words to say before I proudly walked away with MY dog.


Your Midnite does not strike me as a workingline. He appears to be maybe an American line with some chow.


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## llombardo

B


MineAreWorkingline said:


> Your Midnite does not strike me as a workingline. He appears to be maybe an American line with some chow.


We can agree to disagree. There is no doubt that he is a full blooded GSD(with a high prey and ball drive)and has been evaluated as such by qualified trainers and people that have many years of experience with the breed. But I will throw that into our next conversation for giggles! Thanks for your opinion. 

You seriously think this dog has chow in him?


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## Stonevintage

Magwart said:


> Not at all. It's shockingly common.
> It happens way, way more often than people not involved in rescue would believe. Right now, there's a run of WL dogs in shelters because dark sables have become trendy, and novice owners realize about 6 months in that the dog is ruining their life...so sometimes they quietly dump it rather than make the embarrassing call to the breeder that they failed. Foster homes that can handle high-drive, adolescent WL dogs are few and far between -- that's a skill-set that could save a lot of lives.


This is reality. It's trendy and that area of the US is all in to "trendy". The local Humane Society where I live participates in the flights from LA. Regulations failed about 6 months ago and in one plane load of small lap dogs distemper came in. Shut our Humane Society shelter down for 90 days and also another shelter 50 miles North. Many dogs and puppies died. 

GSD's are very rare to come up for adoption here. In a personal conversation with the director a couple of months ago - after she asked what breed I owned - she paused and said "they are one of the most difficult dogs to train". So - I know why our shelter never has any GSD's offered, most obviously with the directors attitude - they are not "selected" for the no kill shelter.... makes me sick. For the last 6 years, it's full of nothing but PB's and Chihuahuas. No one wants them - so placement is almost non-existent - so, there's maybe one or two dogs that are taken in per month - because they have this ageing population, year after year - that the "director" favors....


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## llombardo

Stonevintage said:


> This is reality. It's trendy and that area of the US is all in to "trendy". The local Humane Society where I live participates in the flights from LA. Regulations failed about 6 months ago and in one plane load of small lap dogs distemper came in. Shut our Humane Society shelter down for 90 days and also another shelter 50 miles North. Many dogs and puppies died.
> 
> GSD's are very rare to come up for adoption here. In a personal conversation with the director a couple of months ago - after she asked what breed I owned - she paused and said "they are one of the most difficult dogs to train". So - I know why our shelter never has any GSD's offered, most obviously with the directors attitude - they are not "selected" for the no kill shelter.... makes me sick. For the last 6 years, it's full of nothing but PB's and Chihuahuas. No one wants them - so placement is almost non-existent - so, there's maybe one or two dogs that are taken in per month - because they have this ageing population, year after year - that the "director" favors....


So do you think if it was a different director there would be a different selection of dogs? Or at the very least more getting adopted so more could come in?


----------



## Stonevintage

llombardo said:


> So do you think if it was a different director there would be a different selection of dogs? Or at the very least more getting adopted so more could come in?


Yes I absolutely do. I did not want to buy my GSD. I wanted to adopt. None available and I check into their website every few month still just to see. I have to say, they are set up to inherit my estate (whatever's left) and I'm ready to call the board of directors and telling them they lost it because of what they are allowing at this shelter.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> B
> 
> We can agree to disagree. There is no doubt that he is a full blooded GSD(with a high prey and ball drive)and has been evaluated as such by qualified trainers and people that have many years of experience with the breed. But I will throw that into our next conversation for giggles! Thanks for your opinion.
> 
> You seriously think this dog has chow in him?


Yes, I do, not a lot, maybe a quarter Chow, build is a touch heavy, and his coat is a bit thick, something about the shape of his head is a bit off too.

I have seen many dogs of different breeds and mixes that have high prey and ball drive. I have also seen German Shepherds and workinglines lack in those areas. High prey / ball drive is not indicative of breed or line.


----------



## Susan_GSD_mom

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Yes, I do, not a lot, maybe a quarter Chow, build is a touch heavy, and his coat is a bit thick, something about the shape of his head is a bit off too.
> 
> I have seen many dogs of different breeds and mixes that have high prey and ball drive. I have also seen German Shepherds and workinglines lack in those areas. High prey / ball drive is not indicative of breed or line.


I think you're way off. I have had PB GSDs with heavier coats than Midnite's, built just as square and heavy-boned, and there is nothing wrong with his head. Just as you have seen variations in drives, there are also variations in coat and conformation. Nothing about him says anything but GSD.

Susan


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

Susan_GSD_mom said:


> I think you're way off. I have had PB GSDs with heavier coats than Midnite's, built just as square and heavy-boned, and there is nothing wrong with his head. Just as you have seen variations in drives, there are also variations in coat and conformation. Nothing about him says anything but GSD.
> 
> Susan


Everybody is entitled to their opinion. I think he is part Chow.


----------



## BowWowMeow

Please keep this thread focused on the dog that needs rescuing. You can discuss guesses about personal dog's lines elsewhere. 

I hope this dog has made it into a reputable rescue.


----------



## llombardo

BowWowMeow said:


> Please keep this thread focused on the dog that needs rescuing. You can discuss guesses about personal dog's lines elsewhere.
> 
> I hope this dog has made it into a reputable rescue.


I agree and I hope so to


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

BowWowMeow said:


> Please keep this thread focused on the dog that needs rescuing. You can discuss guesses about personal dog's lines elsewhere.
> 
> I hope this dog has made it into a reputable rescue.


Exactly, the topic should have never been brought up. Let's stay focused on the dog in need.


----------



## newlie

I got an email this morning, (because of my pledge on Facebook) that he had been adopted on 12/2.


----------



## llombardo

newlie said:


> I got an email this morning, (because of my pledge on Facebook) that he had been adopted on 12/2.


By a person or a rescue?


----------



## newlie

I got the impression it was by a person, but the email didn't really give any details. I hope it's by someone who will treat him right.I thought I read where he was supposed to have surgery on his leg Friday, I hope that is still going to happen..


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

Newlie thanks . Im glad you got an email . I was hoping and praying that he would be safe and out of the shelter.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

Great news! Just curious, does the new owner, if a private person, still get the pledges to help towards the surgery?


----------



## LuvShepherds

I'm glad he was adopted.


----------



## Magwart

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Great news! Just curious, does the new owner, if a private person, still get the pledges to help towards the surgery?


If you used my wording or something like it, then absolutely *not* -- since it was contingent on a pull by a 501(c)(3) rescue. This is exactly why I recommend limiting pledges to reputable rescues -- these public shelters do no screening on private adopters, so it could be someone truly amazing, or a hoarder. There's no way to know.


----------



## Magwart

I want to give huge kudos to SouldogIsBack for helping to network this dog by starting a thread here that inspired many here to get involved. It's been a long time since I've seen these sort of posts mobilize some action for a dog in need on this board, and it's really heartening to see it happening again. 

I know you haven't been posting much, SouldogIsBack, but I'm glad you're on the rescue board! Great job starting this thread!


----------



## MayzieGSD

Magwart said:


> I want to give huge kudos to SouldogIsBack for helping to network this dog by starting a thread here that inspired many here to get involved. It's been a long time since I've seen these sort of posts mobilize some action for a dog in need on this board, and it's really heartening to see it happening again.
> 
> I know you haven't been posting much, SouldogIsBack, but I'm glad you're on the rescue board! Great job starting this thread!


:thumbup:


----------



## llombardo

Magwart said:


> I want to give huge kudos to SouldogIsBack for helping to network this dog by starting a thread here that inspired many here to get involved. It's been a long time since I've seen these sort of posts mobilize some action for a dog in need on this board, and it's really heartening to see it happening again.
> 
> I know you haven't been posting much, SouldogIsBack, but I'm glad you're on the rescue board! Great job starting this thread!


It is an eye opener. I understand what rescues deal with, but when Westside told me that their vet bills were over $100,000.00 last year, it makes you think.


----------



## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

Magwart said:


> I want to give huge kudos to SouldogIsBack for helping to network this dog by starting a thread here that inspired many here to get involved. It's been a long time since I've seen these sort of posts mobilize some action for a dog in need on this board, and it's really heartening to see it happening again.
> 
> I know you haven't been posting much, SouldogIsBack, but I'm glad you're on the rescue board! Great job starting this thread!


:thumbup::toasting: Thanks SouldogisBack


----------



## MayzieGSD

llombardo said:


> It is an eye opener. I understand what rescues deal with, but when Westside told me that their vet bills were over $100,000.00 last year, it makes you think.


I wouldn't have guessed there could be so many purebred dogs needing help. Around here our shelters are no-kill and purebred dogs are snapped right up. (except maybe pits.)

I am thinking to just donate my $100 to the rescue then. Or is it better to wait for another dog who needs help and donate to that dog specifically?


----------



## Magwart

It all depends. If you like being directly involved in a "save," then you might target it at particular dogs. 

If you want to build a relationship with a particular rescue that you like, any rescue would be thrilled to receive your donation. Just make sure it's a legally-recognized 501(c)(3) charity -- you can check the IRS website here: https://apps.irs.gov/app/eos/ .


----------



## WIBackpacker

MayzieGSD said:


> I wouldn't have guessed there could be so many purebred dogs needing help. Around here our shelters are no-kill and purebred dogs are snapped right up. (except maybe pits)


Agree 100% (unsurprising since we're probably "neighbors" in a general sense).

It would seem that this board could be an excellent way to network to northern and/or suburban GSD lovers that simply never see this type of situation close to their own home, so the scope of the rescue crisis isn't understood. I mean that sincerely.


----------



## Sunflowers

Wish we knew where he is and who took him...


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

WIBackpacker said:


> Agree 100% (unsurprising since we're probably "neighbors" in a general sense).
> 
> It would seem that this board could be an excellent way to network to northern and/or suburban GSD lovers that simply never see this type of situation close to their own home, so the scope of the rescue crisis isn't understood. I mean that sincerely.


We do understand the rescue crisis in other areas. We don't understand the reluctance to get these dogs into homes that would love to have them. There are always risks, and I have seen too many "well placed" rescues fail in homes through no fault of the dog / cat. It can be a crap shoot. Sometimes a good enough home is exactly that, good enough, not the best, but certainly one surpassing death.


----------



## llombardo

I don't think the need is understood. Go to petfinder and type in German Shepherd. I don't even think those numbers include all shelter dogs. It's thousands and thousands of dogs that once had a home and now have nothing. The numbers are staggering.


----------



## yuriy

Magwart said:


> I want to give huge kudos to SouldogIsBack for helping to network this dog by starting a thread here that inspired many here to get involved. It's been a long time since I've seen these sort of posts mobilize some action for a dog in need on this board, and it's really heartening to see it happening again.
> 
> I know you haven't been posting much, SouldogIsBack, but I'm glad you're on the rescue board! Great job starting this thread!


+1. Well done.



MineAreWorkingline said:


> *We don't understand the reluctance to get these dogs into homes that would love to have them.* There are always risks, and I have seen too many "well placed" rescues fail in homes through no fault of the dog / cat. It can be a crap shoot. Sometimes a good enough home is exactly that, good enough, not the best, but certainly one surpassing death.


That part has always bugged me about rescues. Many of them have such utterly stupid, black & white requirements that they disqualify 90% of potential owners without giving them the time of day. And the whole "submit an application before we give you any information about the dog" routine is very frustrating, too. That's like being forced to apply for a job without knowing what the job entails!


----------



## llombardo

yuriy said:


> +1. Well done.
> 
> 
> 
> That part has always bugged me about rescues. Many of them have such utterly stupid, black & white requirements that they disqualify 90% of potential owners without giving them the time of day. And the whole "submit an application before we give you any information about the dog" routine is very frustrating, too. That's like being forced to apply for a job without knowing what the job entails!


How many times do people here say that it's best for a breeder to pick the pup for the prospective owners? There is an application process for breeders even if it's not on paper. It's the same with rescues, they might have a dog better suited for a person then the one that was picked. They are doing what has worked to get them to have successful adoptions.


----------



## Jax08

Just a note, with sadness....

Before this board was bought out by the current owner, the rescue section was very active. A good portion of my posts came from posting dogs and bumping them up. A thread like this was the NORM, not exception.

Shortly after the buyout, the tone of the board changed and the rescue people went elsewhere, many started using facebook. Facebook now seems to be the major networking tool.


----------



## Magwart

yuriy said:


> the whole "submit an application before we give you any information about the dog" routine is very frustrating, too. That's like being forced to apply for a job without knowing what the job entails!


There isn't enough person-power to go around, so they're trying to focus on the people serious enough to put in an app.

If you saw what comes in as applications, you would understand why they want to know who they're talking to. More than half of them I see are downright horrifying -- e.g., wanting to put a dog on a chain, last one died of heartworms, or last one was hit by a car because "it didn't listen and stay by the house" on their unfenced property so they "need one that listens better," etc. People who train dogs by hitting them a shoe. Vet references who reveal the last dog hadn't had annual check-ups in 4 years or who convey they think the person doesn't take care of their pets. You're thinking "most" applicants are like you -- they're not. I wish I could post a pile of examples of applications so that you'd understand. 

They're trying to weed out people so that they know they're talking to ones like you who are good owners, and serious, and not wasting time talking to the rest because there aren't enough minutes in the day to talk to everyone...so they're trying to find a way to focus on people likely to be successful adopters.

Add to that that even our small rescue probably gets 5-10 requests for phone calls per day. People stay on the phone forever. Who has time to do that? The same 3-4 volunteers who all have full-time real jobs also go to shelters, run dogs to vets, foster, train other fosters, talk to applicants, arrange meet and greets, do home checks, do post-adoption support, pay rescue bills, maintain records, etc. They would have to spend a Saturday on the phone...instead of working with the people who submitted great apps. Remember most of us work full time, have families, personal dogs, foster dogs and do this in our "spare" time....so limiting phone inquiries is a way of maintaining sanity. 

Many rescues will answer *specific* email questions about dogs though, since we can do that at 2AM after all the other work is done. The hard ones to deal with are the _hundreds _of "I like this dog, tell me more" inquiries from people clicking on every Petfinder bio that catches their fancy. Those tend to get form responses. If you send them an email that's specific, chances are much higher you'll get a specific reply.


----------



## LuvShepherds

Jax08 said:


> . A thread like this was the NORM ... Facebook now seems to be the major networking tool.


That is true everywhere. I work in the message board industry and forums all over have been replaced with Facebook and other social media. I don't know why, I don't use Facebook.


----------



## yuriy

Jax08 said:


> Just a note, with sadness....
> 
> Before this board was bought out by the current owner, the rescue section was very active. A good portion of my posts came from posting dogs and bumping them up. A thread like this was the NORM, not exception.
> 
> Shortly after the buyout, the tone of the board changed and the rescue people went elsewhere, many started using facebook. Facebook now seems to be the major networking tool.


Buyouts by VerticalScope tend to have that effect on forums. I've watched several forums go downhill from the second VerticalScope got involved. 

Facebook is also losing ground big time. Many people are leaving or not using it the way they used to. I left it earlier this year.



Magwart said:


> There isn't enough person-power to go around, so they're trying to focus on the people serious enough to put in an app.
> 
> If you saw what comes in as applications, you would understand why they want to know who they're talking to. More than half of them I see are downright horrifying -- e.g., wanting to put a dog on a chain, last one died of heartworms, or last one was hit by a car because "it didn't listen and stay by the house" on their unfenced property so they "need one that listens better," etc. People who train dogs by hitting them a shoe. Vet references who reveal the last dog hadn't had annual check-ups in 4 years or who convey they think the person doesn't take care of their pets. You're thinking "most" applicants are like you -- they're not. I wish I could post a pile of examples of applications so that you'd understand.
> 
> They're trying to weed out people so that they know they're talking to ones like you who are good owners, and serious, and not wasting time talking to the rest because there aren't enough minutes in the day to talk to everyone...so they're trying to find a way to focus on people likely to be successful adopters.
> 
> Add to that that even our small rescue probably gets 5-10 requests for phone calls per day. People stay on the phone forever. Who has time to do that? The same 3-4 volunteers who all have full-time real jobs also go to shelters, run dogs to vets, foster, train other fosters, talk to applicants, arrange meet and greets, do home checks, do post-adoption support, pay rescue bills, maintain records, etc. They would have to spend a Saturday on the phone...instead of working with the people who submitted great apps. Remember most of us work full time, have families, personal dogs, foster dogs and do this in our "spare" time....so limiting phone inquiries is a way of maintaining sanity.
> 
> Many rescues will answer *specific* email questions about dogs though, since we can do that at 2AM after all the other work is done. The hard ones to deal with are the _hundreds _of "I like this dog, tell me more" inquiries from people clicking on every Petfinder bio that catches their fancy. Those tend to get form responses. If you send them an email that's specific, chances are much higher you'll get a specific reply.


I figured it was something like that, and it's something I can understand, but there has to be some sort of middle ground. Every rescue has their own application form, their own process, their own requirements, etc. I haven't filled a single one out and I'm already feeling frustrated. 

It would be much easier if there was a common application that could be filled out once and then sent & re-sent to different rescues, but that would require multiple (all?) rescues getting on board with the idea.

I've heard that rescues are overwhelmed with applicants numerous times, but then I see rescue sites with 90+ available dogs and have to wonder what's going on. How many of those dogs could have been placed in good homes had the process of adoption been a little more lenient?

I've come across local rescues that simply refuse to talk to you if you're away from home for 8 hours per day; 7 is fine, but at 8 hours you become flat-out unsuitable to own a dog. A friend was trying to adopt a dog, and as he (like most people) worked an 8-hour day, plus commutes, he was away from home for about 10 hours per day. He was more than willing to have the dog at daycare, have sitters come in and walk the dog, etc. etc. Nope. Flat out refusal to even discuss it. That's how people end up being driven to a breeder.


----------



## newlie

[*QUOTE=yuriy;7437754]
I've come across local rescues that simply refuse to talk to you if you're away from home for 8 hours per day; 7 is fine, but at 8 hours you become flat-out unsuitable to own a dog. A friend was trying to adopt a dog, and as he (like most people) worked an 8-hour day, plus commutes, he was away from home for about 10 hours per day. He was more than willing to have the dog at daycare, have sitters come in and walk the dog, etc. etc. Nope. Flat out refusal to even discuss it. That's how people end up being driven to a breeder.[/QUOTE]
*
That's a shame, Yuriy, I never ran into anything like that.

Both of my experiences with rescues were wonderful. I found both my dogs on Petfinder, my yellow lab through the Cincinnati Lab Rescue and Newlie through a rescue group in Kentucky. I asked more questions about Newlie, partly because there was more information about Max listed on Petfinder and also because I wanted to be as sure as I could about Newlie's temperament, particularly around children. Both times I filled out an application and gave references, including a vet reference, and was happy to do so. Max was in a foster home and we drove to Cincinnati to meet him and brought him home the same day. Newlie's rescue group was coming to town anyway to bring some of their other dogs up to Feeders Supply to try to find homes for them so we met them at Feeders and brought Newlie home. With both rescues, we signed a paper saying that if for any reason the adoption didn't work out, we would give them back. We also paid a reasonable fee (around $250 or so) which would go toward helping other dogs, so was well worth it. I also think that most people involved in rescue discourage the whole "free to a good home" thing because it tends to bring out the nightmare applicants, those who want dogs for dogfighting, lab research, or to put on a chain and throw a scrap at them every now and then. 

I agree that sometimes even less than ideal homes are better than being euthanized. But I would think they would be in the minority, most rescues have more dogs on their hands than they know what to do with and so surely wouldn't turn away somebody for trivial reasons. Both of the applications we filled out asked whether we had a fenced yard, which we do, and if we didn't, how were we going to keep the dog safe. They also asked about whether the dog was going to be primarily in the house or in the yard. (I don't know what they would have said if we had answered "in the yard.") My husband and I both are on the older side and neither rescue questioned our ability to handle the dogs. My husband was already severely disabled when we went to get Newlie and nobody said anything about that either.


----------



## SouldogIsBack

Ok so excellent news, the awesome crew of GSROC pulled him yesterday afternoon post surgery. VERY serious leg injury, infection, this boy will take some time to stabilize. Please please please if you could go to the GSROC site and honour your pledges they will need every cent we can send them. Am going to post the two pics Maria sent me, first showing his leg, and second with him in the getaway car. So amazing. And look at the light in his eyes! Here is the GSROC site. Also click on their contest link as they are really trying to win the $20,000 to help fuel the cost of what they are doing. Vote everyday! Takes 2 seconds! Thank you GSROC! Home - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County


----------



## yuriy

newlie said:


> That's a shame, Yuriy, I never ran into anything like that.


Perhaps the local rescues' policies are a bit more draconian than the ones across the US. Hopefully. 



SouldogIsBack said:


> Ok so excellent news, the awesome crew of GSROC pulled him yesterday afternoon post surgery. VERY serious leg injury, infection, this boy will take some time to stabilize. Please please please if you could go to the GSROC site and honour your pledges they will need every cent we can send them. Am going to post the two pics Maria sent me, first showing his leg, and second with him in the getaway car. So amazing. And look at the light in his eyes! Here is the GSROC site. Also click on their contest link as they are really trying to win the $20,000 to help fuel the cost of what they are doing. Vote everyday! Takes 2 seconds! Thank you GSROC! Home - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County


What a horrible injury photo. Sure hope he can fully recover. 

Glad to hear GSROC pulled him. Just donated the pledged amount via their site.


----------



## llombardo

Do they know what caused the injury?


----------



## SouldogIsBack

Magwart said:


> I want to give huge kudos to SouldogIsBack for helping to network this dog by starting a thread here that inspired many here to get involved. It's been a long time since I've seen these sort of posts mobilize some action for a dog in need on this board, and it's really heartening to see it happening again.
> 
> I know you haven't been posting much, SouldogIsBack, but I'm glad you're on the rescue board! Great job starting this thread!


Oh thanks so much Magwart that boy just broke my heart, he reminded me of my old boy Darwin! I used to be heavily involved in the rescue boards here back in the day (2002 - 2004) and posted under the name Souldog :hug: Can see there are still a few folks here from then, but yes social media seems to be the way now. But this boy compelled me to work a thread! By the way....I just posted an update! He was not adopted! GSROC pulled him yesterday...I nagged them lololol and told them they had support coming to them if they could just step in....and they got him post surgery....see my post and the pics of him YAY! :hug::hug::hug: This is what rescue is all about! I do hate the nagging part but just could not stop thinking about his face. Haunting.


----------



## SouldogIsBack

yuriy said:


> Perhaps the local rescues' policies are a bit more draconian than the ones across the US. Hopefully.
> 
> 
> 
> What a horrible injury photo. Sure hope he can fully recover.
> 
> Glad to hear GSROC pulled him. Just donated the pledged amount via their site.


 Awesome! Yuriy thank you so much for honouring your pledge. I had to wait to post until I had the final info and by then the rumour mill had him adopted! He's got a ways to go before that happens! I hope people see these posts and find a way to help this rescue. They are buried in work and expense. Bless them!


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> I don't think the need is understood. Go to petfinder and type in German Shepherd. I don't even think those numbers include all shelter dogs. It's thousands and thousands of dogs that once had a home and now have nothing. The numbers are staggering.


What makes you think that people have not gone on Petfinder and googled rescues to see the magnitude of the problem? Do you have any clue how many homes try to adopt these animals but they aren't made available? 

I saw one incident where no less than five people wanted to adopt a death row animal only to be turned down because they were out of state. As money pledges rapidly grew for this animal, the shelter was too quick to make this animal rescue only. When there was no money, the local public was welcome to adopt. That's a crock.


----------



## newlie

His poor leg! Oh my goodness, it looks terrible.

I am relieved that he is with a rescue. I was so afraid that maybe he had ended up with some psycho who would mistreat him. I will go on their site and redeem my pledge in a bit.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

yuriy said:


> +1. Well done.
> 
> 
> 
> That part has always bugged me about rescues. Many of them have such utterly stupid, black & white requirements that they disqualify 90% of potential owners without giving them the time of day. And the whole "submit an application before we give you any information about the dog" routine is very frustrating, too. That's like being forced to apply for a job without knowing what the job entails!


I agree 100%. It discourages people from applying when all they need is a quick answer to know whether a dog may not qualify as a good match for their home.



Magwart said:


> There isn't enough person-power to go around, so they're trying to focus on the people serious enough to put in an app.
> 
> If you saw what comes in as applications, you would understand why they want to know who they're talking to. More than half of them I see are downright horrifying -- e.g., wanting to put a dog on a chain, last one died of heartworms, or last one was hit by a car because "it didn't listen and stay by the house" on their unfenced property so they "need one that listens better," etc. People who train dogs by hitting them a shoe. Vet references who reveal the last dog hadn't had annual check-ups in 4 years or who convey they think the person doesn't take care of their pets. You're thinking "most" applicants are like you -- they're not. I wish I could post a pile of examples of applications so that you'd understand.
> 
> They're trying to weed out people so that they know they're talking to ones like you who are good owners, and serious, and not wasting time talking to the rest because there aren't enough minutes in the day to talk to everyone...so they're trying to find a way to focus on people likely to be successful adopters.
> 
> Add to that that even our small rescue probably gets 5-10 requests for phone calls per day. People stay on the phone forever. Who has time to do that? The same 3-4 volunteers who all have full-time real jobs also go to shelters, run dogs to vets, foster, train other fosters, talk to applicants, arrange meet and greets, do home checks, do post-adoption support, pay rescue bills, maintain records, etc. They would have to spend a Saturday on the phone...instead of working with the people who submitted great apps. Remember most of us work full time, have families, personal dogs, foster dogs and do this in our "spare" time....so limiting phone inquiries is a way of maintaining sanity.
> 
> Many rescues will answer *specific* email questions about dogs though, since we can do that at 2AM after all the other work is done. The hard ones to deal with are the _hundreds _of "I like this dog, tell me more" inquiries from people clicking on every Petfinder bio that catches their fancy. Those tend to get form responses. If you send them an email that's specific, chances are much higher you'll get a specific reply.


Nobody is disputing this, but rescues need to understand when they take the time to reply that somebody needs to fill out an application to get information on a dog when all you needed to know before things go any further was whether this dog was good with cats, it just doesn't make sense. Personally, I believe most rescue's applications are way too invasive and if I am going to permit an invasion of privacy to that degree, I want to know up front the answer to an all too simple question before I proceed.


----------



## MayzieGSD

SouldogIsBack said:


> Ok so excellent news, the awesome crew of GSROC pulled him yesterday afternoon post surgery. VERY serious leg injury, infection, this boy will take some time to stabilize. Please please please if you could go to the GSROC site and honour your pledges they will need every cent we can send them. Am going to post the two pics Maria sent me, first showing his leg, and second with him in the getaway car. So amazing. And look at the light in his eyes! Here is the GSROC site. Also click on their contest link as they are really trying to win the $20,000 to help fuel the cost of what they are doing. Vote everyday! Takes 2 seconds! Thank you GSROC! Home - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County



Happy to hear he was taken by the rescue! Just went and voted and donated the $100!


----------



## llombardo

MineAreWorkingline said:


> What makes you think that people have not gone on Petfinder and googled rescues to see the magnitude of the problem? Do you have any clue how many homes try to adopt these animals but they aren't made available?
> 
> I saw one incident where no less than five people wanted to adopt a death row animal only to be turned down because they were out of state. As money pledges rapidly grew for this animal, the shelter was too quick to make this animal rescue only. When there was no money, the local public was welcome to adopt. That's a crock.


I think you don't have a clue. Do you know why out of state adoptions are denied or not something done regularly? They fail miserably and the dog ends up in the shelter in the next state. Most shelters would rather the dog goes to a rescue where screening is probably more accurate. As a last resort they may opt to go through the general public to save the dog and hope for the best. The shelter is not getting any of the money pledged, it goes to the rescue pulling the dog. There is no monetary reason for the shelter at all.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

newlie said:


> [*QUOTE=yuriy;7437754]
> I've come across local rescues that simply refuse to talk to you if you're away from home for 8 hours per day; 7 is fine, but at 8 hours you become flat-out unsuitable to own a dog. A friend was trying to adopt a dog, and as he (like most people) worked an 8-hour day, plus commutes, he was away from home for about 10 hours per day. He was more than willing to have the dog at daycare, have sitters come in and walk the dog, etc. etc. Nope. Flat out refusal to even discuss it. That's how people end up being driven to a breeder.*


*
*
That's a shame, Yuriy, I never ran into anything like that.

Both of my experiences with rescues were wonderful. I found both my dogs on Petfinder, my yellow lab through the Cincinnati Lab Rescue and Newlie through a rescue group in Kentucky. I asked more questions about Newlie, partly because there was more information about Max listed on Petfinder and also because I wanted to be as sure as I could about Newlie's temperament, particularly around children. Both times I filled out an application and gave references, including a vet reference, and was happy to do so. Max was in a foster home and we drove to Cincinnati to meet him and brought him home the same day. Newlie's rescue group was coming to town anyway to bring some of their other dogs up to Feeders Supply to try to find homes for them so we met them at Feeders and brought Newlie home. With both rescues, we signed a paper saying that if for any reason the adoption didn't work out, we would give them back. We also paid a reasonable fee (around $250 or so) which would go toward helping other dogs, so was well worth it. I also think that most people involved in rescue discourage the whole "free to a good home" thing because it tends to bring out the nightmare applicants, those who want dogs for dogfighting, lab research, or to put on a chain and throw a scrap at them every now and then. 

I agree that sometimes even less than ideal homes are better than being euthanized. But I would think they would be in the minority, most rescues have more dogs on their hands than they know what to do with and so surely wouldn't turn away somebody for trivial reasons. Both of the applications we filled out asked whether we had a fenced yard, which we do, and if we didn't, how were we going to keep the dog safe. They also asked about whether the dog was going to be primarily in the house or in the yard. (I don't know what they would have said if we had answered "in the yard.") My husband and I both are on the older side and neither rescue questioned our ability to handle the dogs. My husband was already severely disabled when we went to get Newlie and nobody said anything about that either.[/QUOTE] End quote



A lot of rescues won't adopt out unless somebody is home all day.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> I think you don't have a clue. Do you know why out of state adoptions are denied or not something done regularly? They fail miserably and the dog ends up in the shelter in the next state. Most shelters would rather the dog goes to a rescue where screening is probably more accurate. As a last resort they may opt to go through the general public to save the dog and hope for the best. The shelter is not getting any of the money pledged, it goes to the rescue pulling the dog. There is no monetary reason for the shelter at all.


I never said the shelter gets the money, I was quite clear when I said the rescues did. 

I think you don't have a clue when you speculate that just because an adoption is done out of state that it almost guarantees the adoption will be a failure. Rescues that do out of state adoptions usually work hand in hand with rescues that are located in that state ensuring just as valid a screening process is performed as if it were done in state.


----------



## llombardo

MineAreWorkingline said:


> I never said the shelter gets the money, I was quite clear when I said the rescues did.
> 
> I think you don't have a clue when you speculate that just because an adoption is done out of state that it almost guarantees the adoption will be a failure. Rescues that do out of state adoptions usually work hand in hand with rescues that are located in that state ensuring just as valid a screening process is performed as if it were done in state.


I'm not speculating. I have worked with rescues and I deal with them all the time. Out of state adoptions are a crapshoot. If a problem arises it becomes difficult for them to get the dog back and that dog is at risk. Their goal is to try to get the best home possible so they don't ever see the dog back. There is so much work that goes into rescue and if one is not involved there is no way to ever understand the blood, sweat and tears. These rescues have their hands full with the dogs they have, it becomes super time consuming to try to coordinate between two rescues cross country. It not always time they have, when there is 10 people volunteering and hundreds of dogs, applicants and events to handle.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> I'm not speculating. I have worked with rescues and I deal with them all the time. Out of state adoptions are a crapshoot. If a problem arises it becomes difficult for them to get the dog back and that dog is at risk. Their goal is to try to get the best home possible so they don't ever see the dog back. There is so much work that goes into rescue and if one is not involved there is no way to ever understand the blood, sweat and tears. These rescues have their hands full with the dogs they have, it becomes super time consuming to try to coordinate between two rescues cross country. It not always time they have, when there is 10 people volunteering and hundreds of dogs, applicants and events to handle.


Yes, you are speculating. I have worked with rescues for decades and still do. In state adoptions are just as much a crap shoot as out of state. People are people whether they live in Idaho or Ohio. You are preaching to the choir about what is involved in rescues. 

You would be better served asking somebody their experience rather than assuming and speculating that they must have less experience than you based solely on a different opinion.


----------



## llombardo

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Yes, you are speculating. I have worked with rescues for decades and still do. In state adoptions are just as much a crap shoot as out of state. People are people whether they live in Idaho or Ohio. You are preaching to the choir about what is involved in rescues.
> 
> You would be better served asking somebody their experience rather than assuming and speculating that they must have less experience than you based solely on a different opinion.


Well I guess the same goes for you? Or are you special? I never said you were speculating, but you outright said I was, so I guess that is ok? I never said in state adoptions were not a crap shoot, but they are preferred over out of state., so much so that most rescues state right on their website they don't do out of state, some even give a radius. You have your experiences and I have mine. I don't see a problem with how rescues operate or what their application process is. I agree with the rules they have and procedures they follow.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> Well I guess the same goes for you? Or are you special? I never said you were speculating, but you outright said I was, so I guess that is ok? I never said in state adoptions were not a crap shoot, but they are preferred over out of state., so much so that most rescues state right on their website they don't do out of state, some even give a radius. You have your experiences and I have mine. I don't see a problem with how rescues operate or what their application process is. I agree with the rules they have and procedures they follow.


Telling somebody they are speculating when they are speculating, is not an insult, telling somebody they are clueless is. I stated my experience differed from yours, I never stated your experience was wrong.

I really don't care whether you agree with their rules or not. I am entitled to disagree and that does not give you the right to insult.


----------



## Chip18

So now folks are getting bent out of shape because some rescues don't do out of state adoptions?? When does the "madness" end?? 

"This" dog did get help, "eyes on the prize" as it were.


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## llombardo

Chip18 said:


> So now folks are getting bent out of shape because some rescues don't do out of state adoptions?? When does the "madness" end??
> 
> "This" dog did get help, "eyes on the prize" as it were.


I know right? It's not like there aren't hundreds of dogs in every state, town or county where the potential owner lives.


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## SouldogIsBack

So they've named this beautiful boy Mahogany, he is now posted on their Urgent Care page  SO great to see the pledges coming through, anything helps right now, they are overwhelmed with over 90 GSD's in their rescue and we all know how much the vet bills can be on top of everything else.
Hope I wasn't over the top on this thread, it was intense and also frustrating waiting for updates when I knew they'd saved him, only to see false rumours circulating that he'd been adopted...was worried the thread might lose traction in terms of fundraising, as part of the reason the rescue went ahead was on the faith that pledges would help fuel their effort. Anyhow, I tip my hat to these people in the trenches, it is an endless battle, trying to put a dent into this massive, heartbreaking problem. Thanks all for your goodwill and support for this particular dog...apparently he's a really sweetie too, so hopefully he will find an awesome forever home. Looks like this rescue has managed to place over 400 gsd's yearly for some time now. Amazing...absolutely amazing. Here's the link, donate if you can! Ok I'm getting off the soapbox....for now!  Dogs Currently Hospitalized - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County


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## newlie

I just donated my $50 and asked that it go for surgery on Mahogany's leg, if possible.


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## MayzieGSD

llombardo said:


> I know right? It's not like there aren't hundreds of dogs in every state, town or county where the potential owner lives.


Sure if you don't care what breed. I can tell you for sure there aren't hundreds of german shepherds in Wisconsin up for adoption. From what I've seen, the ones that are available are snapped up really quickly. 

That said, I did adopt from a rescue here.


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

Just donated to Mahogany.


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

I feel a little guilty I have had 4 rescues but three were part of a courtesy listing from out of state,Baltimore MD and Raliegh County West Virginia.All three were through this forum.Our pound is full so I post and I have a box started with bleach,detergent and dryer sheets and the plan is to purchase some beds. I think you do what you can. Right now i cant take another dog or foster but I need to getback into transport or something.


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

SouldogIsBack said:


> So they've named this beautiful boy Mahogany, he is now posted on their Urgent Care page  SO great to see the pledges coming through, anything helps right now, they are overwhelmed with over 90 GSD's in their rescue and we all know how much the vet bills can be on top of everything else.
> Hope I wasn't over the top on this thread, it was intense and also frustrating waiting for updates when I knew they'd saved him, only to see false rumours circulating that he'd been adopted...was worried the thread might lose traction in terms of fundraising, as part of the reason the rescue went ahead was on the faith that pledges would help fuel their effort. Anyhow, I tip my hat to these people in the trenches, it is an endless battle, trying to put a dent into this massive, heartbreaking problem. Thanks all for your goodwill and support for this particular dog...apparently he's a really sweetie too, so hopefully he will find an awesome forever home. Looks like this rescue has managed to place over 400 gsd's yearly for some time now. Amazing...absolutely amazing. Here's the link, donate if you can! Ok I'm getting off the soapbox....for now!  Dogs Currently Hospitalized - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County


I personally think keeping this thread alive and getting interest from all over in helping this little boy is why it happened . Got involved a few times in these threads and what you did is how dogs get saved. Thanks Souldogisback.:happyboogie:


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## MayzieGSD

llombardo said:


> 5,393 ADOPTABLE GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG DOGS NEAR MADISON, WISCONSIN


lol yeah right. There are not 5,393 german shepherds in Wisconsin up for adoption. What is the definition of near? I'm not talking surrounding states. Actually in Wisconsin. Or mixed breeds that shelters call a gsd-mix (even though it looks nothing like a gsd). How many are pure bred and actually IN Wisconsin?


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## llombardo

MayzieGSD said:


> lol yeah right. There are not 5,393 german shepherds in Wisconsin up for adoption. What is the definition of near? I'm not talking surrounding states. Actually in Wisconsin. Or mixed breeds that shelters call a gsd-mix (even though it looks nothing like a gsd). How many are pure bred and actually IN Wisconsin?


Not sure, there are 360 pages of dogs that are in Wisconsin and some that are at the Illinois border. I seen quite a few nice looking pure breds.


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## llombardo

There are some really nice looking ones in Indiana and Chicago. I hate looking at that stuff. Animal Control in Chicago gets a lot of stray GSDs all the time. It's so sad.


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## MaggieRoseLee

Facebook page says he's been adopted...on 12/2

https://www.facebook.com/savingcarsonshelterdogs/videos/512883748884264/?hc_location=ufi



SouldogIsBack said:


> Ok so excellent news, the awesome crew of GSROC pulled him yesterday afternoon post surgery. VERY serious leg injury, infection, this boy will take some time to stabilize. Please please please if you could go to the GSROC site and honour your pledges they will need every cent we can send them. Am going to post the two pics Maria sent me, first showing his leg, and second with him in the getaway car. So amazing. And look at the light in his eyes! Here is the GSROC site. Also click on their contest link as they are really trying to win the $20,000 to help fuel the cost of what they are doing. Vote everyday! Takes 2 seconds! Thank you GSROC! Home - German Shepherd Rescue of Orange County


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## MayzieGSD

llombardo said:


> There are some really nice looking ones in Indiana and Chicago. I hate looking at that stuff. Animal Control in Chicago gets a lot of stray GSDs all the time. It's so sad.


Yes, I did see a lot more in the Chicago area back when I was looking (last year)


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## newlie

Are there other things we can do together to help or advocate for GSD's in shelters or in vulnerable positions where they have no one to speak for them? I like the feeling of being part of a team and there IS strength in numbers....


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## MineAreWorkingline

Chip18 said:


> So now folks are getting bent out of shape because some rescues don't do out of state adoptions?? When does the "madness" end??
> 
> "This" dog did get help, "eyes on the prize" as it were.


Chip, dogs (and cats) are being euthanized while there are homes for them. Sometimes, the only problem is that these homes are out of state. Doesn't that bother you? There are shortages of dogs in many areas, I have seen others post the same on this forum. There have been threads started on this forum by others lamenting the lack of adoptable dogs in shelters, yet dogs are dying. You don't view that as a problem?



llombardo said:


> I know right? It's not like there aren't hundreds of dogs in every state, town or county where the potential owner lives.


Your speculations again fall short of reality. There are NOT hundreds of dogs in every state, town or county where potential owners live. Just because YOUR neighborhood has a pet overpopulation problem does not reflect the state of the rest the country. It only means that is your experience where you live and your experience does not reflect that of others and where they reside.

I live just outside a very large city. Two weeks ago our highest kill shelter had three Pit Bulls and one mixed breed. PERIOD. That does not by any means constitute an overpopulation problem. That very same shelter has been bringing in dogs from other states for years. There is a dire shortage, and has been for years, of adoptable dogs in city shelters in my area.

Reality and the truth just don't coincide with your wild speculations about others and where they live. There is no need for insulting insinuations towards others based on intolerance to facts.


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## MineAreWorkingline

MayzieGSD said:


> Sure if you don't care what breed. I can tell you for sure there aren't hundreds of german shepherds in Wisconsin up for adoption. From what I've seen, the ones that are available are snapped up really quickly.
> 
> That said, I did adopt from a rescue here.


Thank you!

The same can be said where I live.


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## llombardo

newlie said:


> Are there other things we can do together to help or advocate for GSD's in shelters or in vulnerable positions where they have no one to speak for them? I like the feeling of being part of a team and there IS strength in numbers....


It's a catch 22. The ones that probably need the most help are the ones in the shelters that aren't pulled by rescues. They don't even make it to the adoption floor. There are just so many fosters available and just so many dogs. At the same time, rescues can't pull dogs from shelters if they don't have available fosters or space.


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## Daisy&Lucky's Mom

newlie said:


> Are there other things we can do together to help or advocate for GSD's in shelters or in vulnerable positions where they have no one to speak for them? I like the feeling of being part of a team and there IS strength in numbers....


I agree.I try and look at the rescue and courtesy listings but when I hear about Chicago and LA and all GSDs that are there. I wonder how canI help.


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## llombardo

MineAreWorkingline said:


> Chip, dogs (and cats) are being euthanized while there are homes for them. Sometimes, the only problem is that these homes are out of state. Doesn't that bother you? There are shortages of dogs in many areas, I have seen others post the same on this forum. There have been threads started on this forum by others lamenting the lack of adoptable dogs in shelters, yet dogs are dying. You don't view that as a problem?
> 
> 
> 
> Your speculations again fall short of reality. There are NOT hundreds of dogs in every state, town or county where potential owners live. Just because YOUR neighborhood has a pet overpopulation problem does not reflect the state of the rest the country. It only means that is your experience where you live and your experience does not reflect that of others and where they reside.
> 
> I live just outside a very large city. Two weeks ago our highest kill shelter had three Pit Bulls and one mixed breed. PERIOD. That does not by any means constitute an overpopulation problem. That very same shelter has been bringing in dogs from other states for years. There is a dire shortage, and has been for years, of adoptable dogs in city shelters in my area.
> 
> Reality and the truth just don't coincide with your wild speculations about others and where they live. There is no need for insulting insinuations towards others based on intolerance to facts.


I don't believe I was talking to you? So there would be no need for you to respond. Let's just agree to disagree and move on. I really just don't want to deal with you period.


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## llombardo

Daisy&Lucky's Mom said:


> I agree.I try and look at the rescue and courtesy listings but when I hear about Chicago and LA and all GSDs that are there. I wonder how canI help.


You would not believe some I come across. I'll be honest, I've removed lots of groups from my facebook because they post these dogs, then another post pops up for that dog to rest in peace. It makes me sick go my stomach. I just can't tolerate it well


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## Magwart

MAWL, you seem to have no interest in actually adopting from any rescue, so I'm not sure why you taunt the volunteers who do the hard work on rescue threads. Is the goal just to stir the pot and tweak people? In hopes you're operating in good faith, I'm thus going respond one last time, then I'm done.

There are LOTS of rescues and shelters that adopt out of state. (It was already posted here that Westside flies dogs!) Every rescue I know adopts to people who work full time. It really seems like you're just making generalizations without much involvement in the rescue world.

Adopting dogs sight-unseen to people on the other side of the country IS risky. Some rescues have figured out the logistics (Labs4Rescue, Echo Dogs, the national Mal rescue are some that come to mind that I've had contact with). Others haven't figured out the logistics because they don't have the person power. A lot of us in the trenches are so overwhelmed just to keep up with the flood of daily dogs and issues (second full time job here!) that setting up a national network just isn't feasible from a time perspective. It would take an experienced logistics expert to do it -- transport coordination isn't for rookies, and the rescues that do it well tend to have someone who has no full-time real job and can work full-time on this stuff for free. It's not nearly as trivial a thing as you think it is, MAWL. I've done occasional out-of-state adoptions, and they take 5x more time to do well--even when we find a rescue partner to do the home check (which isn't always feasible). I've also pulled dogs from afar for an approved local adopter who saw a special dog far away (in California) that they wanted to adopt through us--we flew a dad-gum Panda shepherd out of California for a good adopter here, because the dog had enough pledges to fly, and we happened to have a great local foster there to do the shelter assessment and the 10-day quarantine, vetting, and get a health certificate. That was a hugely time-intensive project--and we just got really lucky that all the pieces fell together that time.

As for finding rescues up north:

In Wisconsin, White Paws GSR does good work: White Paws German Shepherd Rescue, Wisconsin
They have 3 currently available on their site. If they're like most rescues, there are a few more getting vetted not yet ready for listing, so they may have more than that. To find local rescues, please look at a RESCUE LISTINGS BY STATE - The American German Shepherd Rescue Association, Inc. .

I can't recommend that anyone invest a lot of time in becoming a FB networker though. There are so many better things to do. We honestly get inundated with hysterical "please go pull this dog" emails. A lot of those are coming from England right now. Sometimes the dog is 5 hours away, and I've got 6 local dogs who aren't on FB with ticking clocks, that I have already personally evaluated. Many of my local shelters don't allow their "urgent" dogs to be posted to FB, so the networkers who send me the shrill messages have no idea what's in my local shelters. The FB networking isn't useful to most rescues UNLESS it's raising money for care and transport, as this one did -- THAT is the key.

The big GSRs in So Cal have scaled into huge operations, but I assure you that even your small, local GSRs are probably operating with similar metrics. The one I co-founded is tiny -- under 50 dogs a year --but vetting costs are at $20,000 year to date. (And that number doesn't include the GSD puppy used as a bait dog that we just saved, since we don't have the bill yet.) We're not unusual. These are all pretty "normal" numbers for a rescue that's doing things right by getting good vetting, not shying away from sick and injured dogs with good temperaments, etc. Adoption fees don't come close to covering all that's needed. Money is what it all comes down to.

A national transport system to get dogs to northern GSRs from So Cal and the Gulf Coast would be an AMAZING project, if it could be solved. Transport is really, really hard though. The challenges are profound.

For example, I have Chicago GSD rescue contacts who've offered to help me place dogs up there. I'd do it if I could figure out how, but it's much, much harder than just putting dogs on transport. I can't in good conscience send fresh-from-the-shelter dogs from the South with circulating microfilariae (HW+) up there....as the microfilariae could move into the mosquitoes population there and infect other dogs, in places where HW prevention isn't widely used. Over 50% down here are HW+ and microfilariae + year-round. Even in winter when there are no northern mosquitoes out, HW treatment costs a lot more up there than it does down here. We don't have the foster home space or money to treat dogs and send them up there (deeply discounted treatment = $500 + *3 months* of kennel rest in a foster home) - in that time, I could adopt them out here, and have the HW treatment finished off in the adoption home. Setting aside the lack of anywhere to put those dogs for 3 months, commercial ground transport is over $300. Volunteer transport with big dogs tends to result in dogs getting lost at rest stops, or worse -- the history of volunteer transport is pretty sketchy. Air transport, well, you know -- a $150 varikennel, and a $400 ticket. It would cost at least $1000 per dog, with the vetting, all in. With a typical $300 adoption fee, we'd have to come up with $700 per dog to make that happen. Plus a lot more if we had to board the dog for lack of foster homes. 

I know certain people not involved in rescue think we're all stupid, crazy, lazy, etc. That perception has been expressed on this forum many, many times over the last few years. These problems have been thought about for YEARS in the rescue world. Lots of solutions have been attempted -- some work for some groups because they have the right person-power and skill-set, and others fail spectacularly because they don't have the right skill-set. After a few years in rescue, most of us learn our limits -- and stick to what we do well, avoiding what we know we can't do well.


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

llombardo said:


> I don't believe I was talking to you? So there would be no need for you to respond. Let's just agree to disagree and move on. I really just don't want to deal with you period.


No you weren't speaking to me, but you were addressing my comment so there was a need for me to respond. 

Perhaps you should agree to disagree and move on because I really don't want to deal with you either.


----------



## newlie

Magwart, so you think if we had a group on the forum that was interested in working together, fund-raising or a national transport system might be good projects. I guess lobbying for changes in legislation might be another thought. I know these things sound huge, they do to me too, but nobody ever accomplished anything by not trying.


----------



## MayzieGSD

Magwart said:


> As for finding rescues up north:
> 
> In Wisconsin, White Paws GSR does good work: White Paws German Shepherd Rescue, Wisconsin
> They have 3 currently available on their site. If they're like most rescues, there are a few more getting vetted not yet ready for listing, so they may have more than that.


I'm aware of the different rescues in Wisconsin. I was just trying to point out how different the situation is here than in LA. When I wanted to adopt a dog a year ago, I had a hard time finding one! And I didn't just look at rescues, I also looked on craigslist and at the humane society... for several months without luck. So White Paws has three dogs on their site - one of which is a mix, the other two need to be an only dog (deal breaker for me because I already had one). Maybe they have some unlisted ones but I wouldn't have known that. Anyway, I am all set now


----------



## MineAreWorkingline

Magwart said:


> MAWL, you seem to have no interest in actually adopting from any rescue, so I'm not sure why you taunt the volunteers who do the hard work on rescue threads. Is the goal just to stir the pot and tweak people? In hopes you're operating in good faith, I'm thus going respond one last time, then I'm done.
> 
> There are LOTS of rescues and shelters that adopt out of state. (It was already posted here that Westside flies dogs!) Every rescue I know adopts to people who work full time. It really seems like you're just making generalizations without much involvement in the rescue world.
> 
> Adopting dogs sight-unseen to people on the other side of the country IS risky. Some rescues have figured out the logistics (Labs4Rescue, Echo Dogs, the national Mal rescue are some that come to mind that I've had contact with). Others haven't figured out the logistics because they don't have the person power. A lot of us in the trenches are so overwhelmed just to keep up with the flood of daily dogs and issues (second full time job here!) that setting up a national network just isn't feasible from a time perspective. It would take an experienced logistics expert to do it -- transport coordination isn't for rookies, and the rescues that do it well tend to have someone who has no full-time real job and can work full-time on this stuff for free. It's not nearly as trivial a thing as you think it is, MAWL. I've done occasional out-of-state adoptions, and they take 5x more time to do well--even when we find a rescue partner to do the home check (which isn't always feasible). I've also pulled dogs from afar for an approved local adopter who saw a special dog far away (in California) that they wanted to adopt through us--we flew a dad-gum Panda shepherd out of California for a good adopter here, because the dog had enough pledges to fly, and we happened to have a great local foster there to do the shelter assessment and the 10-day quarantine, vetting, and get a health certificate. That was a hugely time-intensive project--and we just got really lucky that all the pieces fell together that time.
> 
> As for finding rescues up north:
> 
> In Wisconsin, White Paws GSR does good work: White Paws German Shepherd Rescue, Wisconsin
> They have 3 currently available on their site. If they're like most rescues, there are a few more getting vetted not yet ready for listing, so they may have more than that. To find local rescues, please look at a RESCUE LISTINGS BY STATE - The American German Shepherd Rescue Association, Inc. .
> 
> I can't recommend that anyone invest a lot of time in becoming a FB networker though. There are so many better things to do. We honestly get inundated with hysterical "please go pull this dog" emails. A lot of those are coming from England right now. Sometimes the dog is 5 hours away, and I've got 6 local dogs who aren't on FB with ticking clocks, that I have already personally evaluated. Many of my local shelters don't allow their "urgent" dogs to be posted to FB, so the networkers who send me the shrill messages have no idea what's in my local shelters. The FB networking isn't useful to most rescues UNLESS it's raising money for care and transport, as this one did -- THAT is the key.
> 
> The big GSRs in So Cal have scaled into huge operations, but I assure you that even your small, local GSRs are probably operating with similar metrics. The one I co-founded is tiny -- under 50 dogs a year --but vetting costs are at $20,000 year to date. (And that number doesn't include the GSD puppy used as a bait dog that we just saved, since we don't have the bill yet.) We're not unusual. These are all pretty "normal" numbers for a rescue that's doing things right by getting good vetting, not shying away from sick and injured dogs with good temperaments, etc. Adoption fees don't come close to covering all that's needed. Money is what it all comes down to.
> 
> A national transport system to get dogs to northern GSRs from So Cal and the Gulf Coast would be an AMAZING project, if it could be solved. Transport is really, really hard though. The challenges are profound.
> 
> For example, I have Chicago GSD rescue contacts who've offered to help me place dogs up there. I'd do it if I could figure out how, but it's much, much harder than just putting dogs on transport. I can't in good conscience send fresh-from-the-shelter dogs from the South with circulating microfilariae (HW+) up there....as the microfilariae could move into the mosquitoes population there and infect other dogs, in places where HW prevention isn't widely used. Over 50% down here are HW+ and microfilariae + year-round. Even in winter when there are no northern mosquitoes out, HW treatment costs a lot more up there than it does down here. We don't have the foster home space or money to treat dogs and send them up there (deeply discounted treatment = $500 + *3 months* of kennel rest in a foster home) - in that time, I could adopt them out here, and have the HW treatment finished off in the adoption home. Setting aside the lack of anywhere to put those dogs for 3 months, commercial ground transport is over $300. Volunteer transport with big dogs tends to result in dogs getting lost at rest stops, or worse -- the history of volunteer transport is pretty sketchy. Air transport, well, you know -- a $150 varikennel, and a $400 ticket. It would cost at least $1000 per dog, with the vetting, all in. With a typical $300 adoption fee, we'd have to come up with $700 per dog to make that happen. Plus a lot more if we had to board the dog for lack of foster homes.
> 
> I know certain people not involved in rescue think we're all stupid, crazy, lazy, etc. That perception has been expressed on this forum many, many times over the last few years. These problems have been thought about for YEARS in the rescue world. Lots of solutions have been attempted -- some work for some groups because they have the right person-power and skill-set, and others fail spectacularly because they don't have the right skill-set. After a few years in rescue, most of us learn our limits -- and stick to what we do well, avoiding what we know we can't do well.


No disrespect for your efforts, but I don't recall making any personal attacks on you or the rescue you are involved with. In fact, I remember not so long ago mentioning a dog in need to you. Seems strange I would do that if I felt you or your rescue weren't qualified, legitimate or respectable.

This is supposed to be about the dogs. I don't know why you think I am taunting any volunteers because I speak for the dogs that are dying when it doesn't have to be. As I stated earlier, our kill shelter does have people transporting dogs from out of state by van and having dogs flown in, all by volunteers, not to mention volunteers from this area going across state lines to bring back dogs from other high kill shelters. I think we are seeing some aspects of rescue from different viewpoints based on location and supply of dogs, and of dog breeds, and therein lies the difference and the frustration.

Maybe a lot of what you are hearing is not only frustration and dismay, but skepticism. I have seen too much with too many rescues over the years, and if the truth that I have posted causes you to feel taunted, I apologize, but I will not retract the facts that I have posted or my experiences. 

I quit dog rescue after many years because my area is flooded with Pit Bulls and I choose not to work with the breed. I still am active with cats. You can call that inexperience if you choose, it really does not matter to me.

You don't know of any rescue that does not adopt out to homes where somebody is not home all day, but I do, unless they have changed their policies in recent years. 

Kudos to you and your efforts to place dogs, they truly are admirable but they don't reflect the efforts of all dog rescues. Some are good, some not so much. 

You are correct that I am not seriously looking to adopt at this time, and not in the future, but thank you for referencing those rescues.


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## MaggieRoseLee

Now now everyone... OFFICIAL MODERATOR HAT ON ......

no personal attacks and truthfully I'd just let this entire thread end. It was about the URGENT rescue of a GSD in need, and that dog is now safe.

Lets all be adults and move along. Right?


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