# Potty Training Nightmare!



## Princey009

Our 5 month old GSD refuses to potty train. We've crate trained her, disciplined her, rationed her food and water, kept an eye on her, and nothing changes. She is outside A LOT! We would take her out and she would spot pee(mark) and come back inside and completely empty. When she does potty inside and I catch her, I will throw a fit as to deter her from continuing what she is doing. That does not change her mind about it. We figured moving to a new home would stop it because her "smell" wasn't in this house compared to our last. She made it 4 days without going in the house. 4 days! Now she is back to going everywhere inside. I'm at wits end. I do not want to get rid of her, I do not want her to be strictly outside, but something has to give. I've tried just about everything. I feed and water her outside, leave her outside for an hour or 2 and will bring her in, then she pees. This started 4 days after moving in. If it doesn't stop soon, she has to go. She is outside more and more each day but I would like her to be more inside with us and kids. 

Any advice would be great! 


Please help.


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## breyer08

I'd start all over. Take her outside on a leash only. Do not let her outside loose by herself, because you won't be able to know if she has gone to the bathroom or not. Every few hours, take her outside on a leash and tell her "go potty". Be sure to take some treats with you. When she does go, immediately tell her "good potty!!" and give her a treat and lots of affection, then take her back inside. Do not let her alone in the house or out of your sight while she is potty training. By letting her run around unwatched, you will end up missing some of her signs that she needs to go to the bathroom. If you keep a very strict routine and watch her like this, it shouldn't take her long to catch on.


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## paulag1955

breyer08 said:


> I'd start all over. Take her outside on a leash only. Do not let her outside loose by herself, because you won't be able to know if she has gone to the bathroom or not. Every few hours, take her outside on a leash and tell her "go potty". Be sure to take some treats with you. When she does go, immediately tell her "good potty!!" and give her a treat and lots of affection, then take her back inside. Do not let her alone in the house or out of your sight while she is potty training. By letting her run around unwatched, you will end up missing some of her signs that she needs to go to the bathroom. If you keep a very strict routine and watch her like this, it shouldn't take her long to catch on.


This.

Also, has she been vet checked? Are you using an enzymatic cleaner like Nature's Miracle to clean up the accident sites?


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## wyoung2153

Agree with what's already been said.. basically what you are saying is that she doesn't go potty in her crate right? That's where I would keep her if she didn't go potty outside or you can't watch her. Take her out.. on a lead like stated and treats and all that.. if she still doesn't go, immediately put her in her crate for about 10 minutes, and try again. once she has gone potty, you can let her off the lead and play or whatever outside and bring her inside and do what you have to do to never let her out of your sight; if that means tying her to you.. the so be it. I would say give that about 2-3 weeks for it to take effect. But you have to be on a strict routine so she knows exactly when she is going outside. 

I understand your frustration but I think that should really help and I hope you don't have to rehome her for not potty training. How long have you had her?


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## Princey009

*Piper*

She does not go in the same spot when she pees. We do keep an eye on her. This morning she came up beside me in the kitchen while I was cooking and out of nowhere, squats. I had my eye on the food so I didn't catch it. She is never un supervised. I cannot keep watch on her 24/7 and she is always beside me. ( I also have a 1 year old daughter and 3 year old son. 

Anywho, she has been checked with vet, all shots, poo tests, pee tests, groomed regularly, etc. So Idk..


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

She needs to go to a second vet. Let me go see if I can find the good link...

Prevously normal vulva now showing signs of skin folding...is this unusual? 
Blue22 

A Sweet Little Rescue Girl (GSD-Huskyish)

Okay - not sure if those will help...first has a good article on all sorts of things that can be wrong with the dogs, especially the girls. 

Second one is a good example of needing second (and third and fourth) opinions. Vet 1 thought regular incontinence after a spay (like a spay that had happened 1 day prior...zoiks), Vet 2 thought kidney failure and recommended putting her down, Vet 3 was just an email consultation and she came up with 2 good possibilities and when Vet 4 was able to see her in person immediately he knew what was wrong. But the dog was almost PTS for no reason...which obviously is not the case here, but shows that sometimes if things seem off, you have to keep going. 

Some dogs - especially ones from pet stores/puppy mills are REALLY hard to house train. Where is she from?

Sometimes the UTI doesn't show up without a culture - not sure if they did a clean bladder tap or you brought a sample in, and sometimes things can be missed...if the sample is mishandled, too old, etc.

And welcome to the board!


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## LaneyB

If you leave her outside for an hour or two then you don't actually see her go? I would follow the advice others have given, and keep her in the crate more. Take her out and stay with her until she goes, then make a big deal and give treats. After she goes then she can have some supervised time in the house out of the crate. 

I also don't scold for accidents in the house. If I saw our puppy getting ready to go, or actually starting to go then I would say "NO!" and grab him and take him outside, then really praise him once he went outside. I have read if you throw too big of a fit they might not understand why, and might be afraid to go in front of you (even outside).


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## Princey009

*Piper*

We have had her since she was 8 weeks. We have done everything imaginable to potty train. Crate, taking her out every 15 min, leaving her outside, disciplining, praising, etc. She WILL NOT pee in her crate. She did not pee in our house for 4 days, then it happened again and now it's been 2 days in a row. Once per day, once on first floor, once on 2nd floor.


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## wyoung2153

IDoes it seem more frequent? When she "marks" does she usually do a lot or just a tiny bit? My girl was about 4 months and she was peeing in the house a lot too.. and when she would go outside she would, what I thought, "mark" and when I took her to the vet they said she didn't have a UTI but gave her meds anyway because the symptoms all pointed that direction. After she finished her meds I was able to potty train her pretty easily.


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## Princey009

wyoung2153 said:


> IDoes it seem more frequent? When she "marks" does she usually do a lot or just a tiny bit? My girl was about 4 months and she was peeing in the house a lot too.. and when she would go outside she would, what I thought, "mark" and when I took her to the vet they said she didn't have a UTI but gave her meds anyway because the symptoms all pointed that direction. After she finished her meds I was able to potty train her pretty easily.


I can call our vet and get the meds to be on the safe side..


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

I have also used bells on the door with harder to train dogs. I have trained a Schipperke mix with one and I have a dog with a brain injury who took 7.5 months - but she mostly did poop in the house, which honestly is easier to clean up w/a smaller dog! With her, the weirdest thing worked - I told her if she stopped pooping in the house she could sleep out of her crate at night and she stopped. ???? Then 2 weeks later, she had an accident and that night went in her crate at bedtime without me saying she had to (I had said so earlier when it happened, just uh oh, guess you have to sleep in your bed tonight). Freaky, right? After 7 months of trying all sorts of things...that worked?


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## wyoung2153

I think that would be a good idea. It won't hurt her. I would really consider doing the crate time more frequently until she gets the idea. literally no time out of the crate unless you can 100% watch her and that's only when she has gone potty outside. She shoudl start connecting the dots that when she goes potty outside she gets a lot more freedom. I know it must be difficult with the 2 little ones running around too. So try not to lose hope! By goly, she will potty train! She just seems to be a little more stubborn unfortunately. But great advice was given so far.. be positive my friend!


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## chelle

I don't think she's necessarily being stubborn -- I think she has no idea what you want from her. You haven't made it understandable at all.

She cannot be unsupervised in the house. Every potty error in the house is your error -- not hers. Quit with the "throwing fits" thing when you catch her. Instead, swoop her up, saying "no potty! We potty outside!" and get her outside and say "Ok, let's go potty" all happy like and all business at the same time. Wait for her to go and praise, praise, praise. From what you have said, you've totally skipped this exceedingly important part!!!!!!!!!

You say you're busy and can't keep eyes on her all the time. Well, then you won't housebreak the dog. It is that simple. It isn't that hard to tether her to you so that eyes ARE on her all the time. Or, as someone said, crate when eyes can't be on.

Again, catch her in the act but don't be mean about it -- perhaps dramatic, and use the word potty to associate things. She may need to have a leash on in the house so if you swoop her up as she's in the act, once outside, she can't run all over the place and you're in control. Outside repeat, we're going to go potty. You have to tie things together for her. 

If you missed a mistake, smack yourself upside the head and leave her alone. Every missed pee/poo in the house sets you back days to your goal. If you can be hard core on top of this for two weeks, I'll bet you will see dramatic improvement. You can't skip steps and you can't just leave the dog outside more and more and more because you think you can't watch her inside. To rehome her because you can't put the required effort into it is kind of sad, but that'd be better than trying to rehome a one-year old that still eliminates in the house.

Good luck.


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## robk

I can't give you advice but I understand your frustration. Over the years I have had a lot of dogs but only have had one dog that I could not house break. She was well over 6 months and would still just go where ever she wanted. It never occured to me that she could have a medical issue. At that time, I lived in an appartment and ended up rehoming her to someone with a yard. I was sad to see her go but it was better for the both of us. 

Good luck with your girl. I hope you get it figured out.

Rob


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## Tulip

*More Advice*

You have been given lots of great advice, I hope things improve soon! I'm currently potty training my 8 week old GSD pup Kody. He is under 100% constant supervision and if I can't watch him, I put him in the crate. When I was potty training my yorkie a few years ago, we were in a bigger house so it wasn't as easy to keep an eye on her. I kept her leashed in the house at all times and took her out every hour or two, acre eating, drinking, and napping, whenever I saw her sniffing around in circles. If she went accident free for two weeks, she got free run of the house. If she has just one accident, back on the leash for two weeks. I also tied a bell to the door and took her paw and tapped the bell with it every time before we went out. Once she went potty, she got a treat and TONS of praise. She was potty trained within a couple months (Yorkies can be pretty stubborn about potty training btw).


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## Princey009

Ok, let me say it again. I HAVE TRIED ALL OF THE ABOVE. Or Below. She is supervised but for christs sake, I turn my head for 2 seconds and shame on me. I don't think so. According to you, I need to keep her in a kennel 24/7 unless she is tied to my hip, or outside. 

My fits also came from a well known trainer. They are not little temper tantrums like you would think. We have done the praising, for weeks. We've done treats, Hotdogs, everything under the sun. We have stopped her mid stream, scooped her up, taken her out. She will then squat for 2 seconds, then come back in and empty on the carpet. We've cleaned. We've moved! there is no smell of hers or others because of the new carpet. 

I'm not particularly fond of snooty remarks. SO thanks but no thanks miss Chelle. Smack yourself upside the head for being a over criticizing person. Not appreciated. Not every dog is the same. I have had plenty of dogs. Plenty of different breeds. This one is by far the worst potty training pup I've had. 



chelle said:


> I don't think she's necessarily being stubborn -- I think she has no idea what you want from her. You haven't made it understandable at all.
> 
> She cannot be unsupervised in the house. Every potty error in the house is your error -- not hers. Quit with the "throwing fits" thing when you catch her. Instead, swoop her up, saying "no potty! We potty outside!" and get her outside and say "Ok, let's go potty" all happy like and all business at the same time. Wait for her to go and praise, praise, praise. From what you have said, you've totally skipped this exceedingly important part!!!!!!!!!
> 
> You say you're busy and can't keep eyes on her all the time. Well, then you won't housebreak the dog. It is that simple. It isn't that hard to tether her to you so that eyes ARE on her all the time. Or, as someone said, crate when eyes can't be on.
> 
> Again, catch her in the act but don't be mean about it -- perhaps dramatic, and use the word potty to associate things. She may need to have a leash on in the house so if you swoop her up as she's in the act, once outside, she can't run all over the place and you're in control. Outside repeat, we're going to go potty. You have to tie things together for her.
> 
> If you missed a mistake, smack yourself upside the head and leave her alone. Every missed pee/poo in the house sets you back days to your goal. If you can be hard core on top of this for two weeks, I'll bet you will see dramatic improvement. You can't skip steps and you can't just leave the dog outside more and more and more because you think you can't watch her inside. To rehome her because you can't put the required effort into it is kind of sad, but that'd be better than trying to rehome a one-year old that still eliminates in the house.
> 
> Good luck.


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## LaneyB

Does she only go on the carpet? We had problems with our English bulldog going on carpet (or if we had any rugs on the wood floor).


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## wyoung2153

Not trying to get in the middle, but I do not think that Chelle was intending to be snooty but instead seeing a solution to your proposed problem and I have to agree with her.. as do many others I'm sure but won't say it, to rehome for a potty training issue is sad indeed which is, I'm sure why a lot want to help because it would be a poor excuse to rehome a dog. Chelle has a lot of good advice to give on this forum as do so many others. take everything with a grain of salt. She had some good things to say there.

Like I mentioned before get the meds incase that is really a problem and the UTI just didn't show up, happened to my dog, could happen to yours. Second YES she is saying if you can't watch your dog 24/7 have them tied to you or in the crate. It is a very successful method. It's annoying sometimes, I admit but I have yet to find a situation or story where that hasn't work. And because you got so reactive to that I am going to assume that is one thing you have not tried yet. So why not give it a shot. It's not cruel to the animal, it's not going to harm her and she won't be peeing anywhere because you will either be right there with your eyes on her or she will be in her crate.


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## Princey009

She goes on tile too. Everywhere


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## Princey009

I have tried it. She has had a leash on in the house, she has lived in the kennel. She has been gated when not in the kennel. I have tried it all religiously. It is not "sad" to re home a dog because of it's faults. It could be a good thing for both parties. Like I said, I do not want to rehome her but if something doesn't change soon, I will pull the plug. Shes had 3 months of being worked with in many different ways. Like I said, I've tried everything. I've listened to a lot of good points. Nothing sways her though.


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## wyoung2153

Just curious, how long have you given any particular training technique a shot?


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## Princey009

wyoung2153 said:


> Just curious, how long have you given any particular training technique a shot?


3 weeks normally. She is still crated a lot. If she is not crated, she is outside. That has been day to day because she is not getting the picture. Crate or outside. I will see her pee outside(She has not had a poo accident in awhile) When I see her, I'll bring her in, and she will pee, right beside me. and just look at me and put her head down and sulk away.


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## FlyAway

That sounds like my girl. (Her picture is in my avatar.) It took 16 months. Yes, that's correct. That puppy was oblivious to anything I tried to do with her for the first year. Even my older dog, now deceased, would walk in front of her and pee to show her how it is done. Of course, she is perfect now that she has aged. I hope yours figures it out soon. 



Princey009 said:


> Our 5 month old GSD refuses to potty train. We've crate trained her, disciplined her, rationed her food and water, kept an eye on her, and nothing changes. She is outside A LOT! We would take her out and she would spot pee(mark) and come back inside and completely empty. When she does potty inside and I catch her, I will throw a fit as to deter her from continuing what she is doing. That does not change her mind about it.


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## wyoung2153

What do you do when she pees inside? When I had my female pup, the breeder warned me that for whatever reason, female pups tend to not fully empty when they pee the first time, that they need to go a couple times. Not sure how true that is, but it might behoove you to wait until she pees a second time out there.


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## chloesmama2

First thing I would comment on is that this is the first pure bred German Shepherd that we have ever had.
I have had several dogs before and always had an easy time potty training. My GSP mix that I had potty trained in two days (female) My male lab/Springer it took about 3 weeks, but he did have Parvo 3 days after we got him too, so that made it a little more complicated. Our GSP now took a few months. I never thought we were going to get her potty trained either and we tried everything that we had tried before. I always praised her and never scolded but we still had problems.
She finally go it though and she has had no accidents since.
They are very smart and very stubborn. Ours loves praise and if you ever scold her she is ruined for everything the whole day. She is so sensitive about things,
I would say stay with it. Try to not scold and PRAISE, PRAISE, PRAISE. 
Good Luck


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## Princey009

wyoung2153 said:


> What do you do when she pees inside? When I had my female pup, the breeder warned me that for whatever reason, female pups tend to not fully empty when they pee the first time, that they need to go a couple times. Not sure how true that is, but it might behoove you to wait until she pees a second time out there.


When she pees inside, majority of the time we just clean it up. Not a word or we'll say bad potty. Sometimes I'll try to get her attention while doing it and yell and put her outside. 

There have been times when she was disciplined in the past. Like I said, nothing works.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Princey009 said:


> Ok, let me say it again. I HAVE TRIED ALL OF THE ABOVE. Or Below. She is supervised but for christs sake, I turn my head for 2 seconds and shame on me. I don't think so. According to you, I need to keep her in a kennel 24/7 unless she is tied to my hip, or outside.
> 
> My fits also came from a well known trainer. They are not little temper tantrums like you would think. We have done the praising, for weeks. We've done treats, Hotdogs, everything under the sun. We have stopped her mid stream, scooped her up, taken her out. She will then squat for 2 seconds, then come back in and empty on the carpet. We've cleaned. We've moved! there is no smell of hers or others because of the new carpet.
> 
> I'm not particularly fond of snooty remarks. SO thanks but no thanks miss Chelle. Smack yourself upside the head for being a over criticizing person. Not appreciated. Not every dog is the same. I have had plenty of dogs. Plenty of different breeds. This one is by far the worst potty training pup I've had.


All of this would make me want to take a look at a health issue beyond the UTI (though what wyoung said I agree with - after getting a culture). Getting into doing a bladder tap and culture with an ultrasound, blood work, MAYBE an x-ray but having a really good exam of her parts (*by a vet who knows what they are looking at* - that poor dog I posted about was almost KILLED after vets 1 and 2 "helped" her, though most times it is not that deadly) and seeing if things are working right or not. There are so many reasons a dog can have trouble with housetraining - from physical things to where they were from (mills and pet stores or were not started in housetraining before 8 weeks - I can't remember where she came from) and then, frankly, there are dogs that have less sensation and are not quick enough to catch it - think of the complicated thing that not pissing YOUR pants really is...

Kidneys slowly fill...bladder, somewhere in there your brain has to kick in, tubing, sphincter, lots of places and parts for a problem either physically or with catching the urge. It is harder for us to pick up when we are younger and older, same with them! We already had the wait til you're 40 and sneeze discussion yesterday!

Also, hate to see you getting all upset - Chelle is using a phrase used here often. No big deal! We forget sometimes that others haven't seen it!


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## wyoung2153

What did your veet say about it when you asked?? 

I would say consistency has to be the key here. maybe even for more than 3 weeks. What are you currently doing right now? like what technique are you doing or is it a whatever sort of attitude because you are annoyed (not judging believe me, I have been there, lol) Just getting and idea of where you are at right now. She sleeps in her crate at night right? And can hold it all through the night?

If it were me I would do this. (assuming there are no health issues) Start fresh and new and from the beginning like you just brought her home. New attitude included, they know when you are annoyed as I'm sure she senses. She's is crated 100% of the time. YES i mean that. The only time she is allowed out is to go potty, on a leash while you take her out and say "go potty!" let her go and praise praise praise! take her off the lead and play with her for a few minutes.. she may go again while you are out there.. if she does.. praise praise praise. Then go inside. If not, go inside anyways. In the crate she goes unless you are going to play with her inside or can give her a chew and actually eyes on watch her. Be honest with yourself. If you are cooking dinner, you cannot watch her. In the crate. If you are dealing with your children, you cannot watch her, in the crate she goes. It will be tough for a few days maybe a week until everyone gets used the routine. If you start feeling a little more comfortable, allow her out of the crate on a long lead while you are doing things. If she has an accident. Start back at square one.. crate all the time. Take her out every couple hours. She is 5 months so she should be able to go a good couple hours without anything. If she hasn't pooped in the house in a while, that tells me that she has some sort of idea. Now you might have over used the word "no" with her due to all the frustration and it may no longer mean anything to her. Introduce a new command. I had to change to "no, Ma'am" with my girl and she new I meant business. If she makes a mess or you catch in mid stream, say "no, ma'am" in a stern voice, grab her and put her outside. Watch to see if she goes then praise preaise praise.. play play play.. then in the crate. 

I once puppy sat for 2 months.. this dog repeatively pooped in my house. Not peed, just pooped.. and good lord I would be so angry. I yelled at him and always put him right outside. Well because I yelled at him and scared the crap out of him, pun intended , he woudn't even go outside.. or would for a minute then go right when he got in. The method above is what I did to break him of it. It worked really well. Initially I had to hide when i put him outside so he couldn't see me and when he went, got really excited and played with him and made it like he won the gold medal! It took time, it was really super annoying, I felt like I was a horrible person, and it was really inconvenient. But it worked.


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## [email protected]

My dog(now almost 8 months of age) is just like that and I understand where you're coming from. We are still trying our best to train him but it just seems he just wouldn't understand no matter what you do or say. I also agree that not all dogs are the same, it might take some dogs days and some maybe years. Everyone here has good points and as you've stated before, if none of them work, I would bring her to a professional dog trainer or maybe even a doggy daycare for a couple days and see how she does. And maybe ask them for advice. So far thats all I know and hope it helps. Good luck


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## chelle

Princey009 said:


> Ok, let me say it again. I HAVE TRIED ALL OF THE ABOVE. Or Below. *She is supervised but for christs sake, I turn my head for 2 seconds and shame on me. I don't think so. According to you, I need to keep her in a kennel 24/7 unless she is tied to my hip, or outside.*


No, I don't think you've tried it all considering two of the most important aspects are things you're really fighting against:

1 -- Keep eyes on ALL the time. (so you can bust in the act) AND 
2 -- Be outside WITH her to PRAISE when she goes.

Repeat.



Princey009 said:


> *My fits also came from a well known trainer.* They are not little temper tantrums like you would think. We have done the praising, for weeks. We've done treats, Hotdogs, everything under the sun. We have stopped her mid stream, scooped her up, taken her out. She will then squat for 2 seconds, then come back in and empty on the carpet. We've cleaned. We've moved! there is no smell of hers or others because of the new carpet.


A "well known" trainer advises having "fits"? I think I'd fire that trainer. 

Maybe I am misunderstanding you -- praising when? When she goes outside? **While* she is going?* Great! Then, you say, she comes inside and pees... well fine, scoop her up and do it again! 12 more times! 

A vet check/testing is always advisable but you've also said she never goes potty in her crate. Sounds like a smart pup to me -- she knows not to soil "her" area. She seemingly doesn't see the home as "her" area yet. If she had a medical issue, it would seem she would soil the crate also.



Princey009 said:


> I have tried it. She has had a leash on in the house, she has lived in the kennel. She has been gated when not in the kennel. *I have tried it all religiously*. *It is not "sad" to re home a dog because of it's faults.* It could be a good thing for both parties. Like I said, I do not want to rehome her but if something doesn't change soon, I will pull the plug. Shes had 3 months of being worked with *in many different ways*. Like I said, I've tried everything. I've listened to a lot of good points. Nothing sways her though.


"Many different ways" could be a problem -- there is a lack of consistency and some serious mistakes that have been made. (Again, ruling out a health issue.) I am just trying to imagine trying to housebreak any pup in the way you've described things, and I absolutely can't see it working at all. (Yelling, fits, leaving her outside alone, leaving her unsupervised...) 

I have one dog that took me double the time to housebreak -- a stubborn girl, that one. I thought I'd go nuts by the time I claimed her housebroken, but I stayed the course with supervision and praise. All the freezing mornings praying for a dog to pee just so I could praise her... ugh... not a good time. Last winter time dog I'll ever have, but whatever.



Princey009 said:


> 3 weeks normally. She is still crated a lot.* If she is not crated, she is outside.* That has been day to day because she is not getting the picture. Crate or outside. *I will see her pee outside*(She has not had a poo accident in awhile) *When I see her, I'll bring her in, and she will pee, right beside me. and just look at me and put her head down and sulk away*.


She isn't getting the picture because you're not painting it for her.

How do you honestly expect to potty train her if she is either crated or outside? You say you "see her pee outside" so you are not right there to praise. That is SO IMPORTANT. 

When I'm housebreaking, I "set the pup up" to "fail." Give pup plenty of water and wait.. knowing it won't be long.. just so I can get the opportunity to do that rather dramatic (but kind) scoop up and outside trip, where I can praise, praise. Then back inside once the job is done so pup realizes that was what going outside was all about.

If you continue to leave her either outside or crated only, she will not housebreak herself.

Peeing right beside you, and putting her head down is about the frown she is surely seeing on your face -- not that she understands she is doing wrong. (Again, ruling out a medical issue.)



Princey009 said:


> When she pees inside, majority of the time we just clean it up. Not a word or *we'll say bad potty*. Sometimes I'll try to get her attention while doing it and *yell and put her outside*.
> 
> *There have been times when she was disciplined in the past*. Like I said, nothing works.


Saying "bad potty" after the fact is less than useless. She doesn't tie that together. Why try to get her attention as you're cleaning it? Do you really think a puppy can reason to the point that she understands you are cleaning up her mess and that's a bad thing? She doesn't!!!!!!! And then you yell and put her outside?? Honestly, does that sound reasonable to you?

The "discipline" you've done in the past is likely hampering your efforts now. She sounds like she's totally confused.



JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> Also, hate to see you getting all upset - Chelle is *using a phrase used here often*. No big deal! We forget sometimes that others haven't seen it!


Yes. That's all that was. That's what I told myself housebreaking any dog if they didn't get caught in the act. Give myself a good V8 smack upside the head -- my bad!


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## llombardo

I had a heck of a time training mine. I posted on here a couple times trying to get ideas. After being completely frustrated, I took a time out and wouldn't you know it, something clicked and she hasn't had an accident for several months. She was about 6 months old before she was completely trained, I will say that I didn't get her until she was 3 months and I'm positive that if I had her from the beginning she would have been much easier to train.


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## Cassidy's Mom

Princey009 said:


> When she pees inside, majority of the time we just clean it up. Not a word or we'll say bad potty. Sometimes I'll try to get her attention while doing it and yell and put her outside.


_Put_ her outside or _take_ her outside? Putting her outside is teaching her nothing. And yelling at her isn't teaching her anything either. The two key elements of potty training are preventing accidents as much as possible, so 100% "eyes on" the puppy when she's in the house, or else she's confined in her crate, AND, just as important if not more so, is rewarding as many successful potties outdoors as possible. If she's out there doing her business and you're not right there with her telling her what a wonderful and amazing puppy she is and giving her a little treat _every single time_, then the process is just going to take longer. She's not making that association if she's doing her business on her own.

Yes it can be time consuming. Yes it can be frustrating. My husband always loses patience with the process and ends up wanting me to just put the puppy outside for awhile rather than running him/her out every half hour in the evening when we're trying to watch TV, but if puppy ends up pottying all by him/herself then I've missed an opportunity to reinforce that pottying outdoors is a good thing that will earn a reward. 

Halo took about 3 months to potty train, longer that Dena & Keefer, and we got her at 10 weeks old, so she was about the age of your puppy. It seemed like forever, so I know what you're going through. But I stuck it out and things finally got better. 

I do think Jean is right though, it would be worthwhile to rule out a health issue.


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## Ambrola

If I catch my puppy peeing I whip his hinny, and take him outside! I think we make all this to complicated.


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## chelle

Ambrola said:


> If I catch my puppy peeing I whip his hinny, and take him outside! I think we make all this to complicated.


Please do not "whip" his "hinny." Counterproductive.

This is comparative to spanking a child for something they do not know is the wrong thing to do. It's simply unkind and shows a lack of understanding & patience for the process on the part of the owner, IMHO. Accuse me of making it overly complicated, but I think you can also unknowingly damage the bond of owner to pup in this process. 

~~~~

There is simply no reason to be cruel or abusive in potty training. For the life of me, I cannot understand why anyone could ever get mad at their dog for peeing in the house during housebreaking. I really feel the owner should be mad at themselves -- not the dog!?! The dog is trying to learn something foreign, why do people get so mad that it takes some time to teach this??

I have never found housebreaking all that difficult -- I've found it *tedious* more than anything. That diligence for a month or two pays off very well, though. It's only a month or so, folks.


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## stealthq

Couple of thoughts.

1) Like JeanKBBMMMAAN said, definitely don't rule out a medical problem yet. Lots of times a UTI or bladder infection doesn't show up in the culture. I've had a dog with an obvious problem cultured multiple times only to have the infection show up on the 5th, 6th go 'round.

2) You said she is not emptying completely when you take her out. OK, then you need to observe her carefully when she goes. Estimate how much she pees to empty - mentally add up the amount inside and outside. Then, when you take her out, do it on a leash. Pick a spot that is her potty spot and take her there every time. Now the important part. If she does not pee enough that you think she is empty, stay out with her for awhile and see if she'll finish. If not, into a crate for a bit then back out to potty. Repeat until you are convinced she is empty. Praise, of course when she goes.

3)



Princey009 said:


> Ok, let me say it again. I HAVE TRIED ALL OF THE ABOVE. Or Below. She is supervised but for christs sake, I turn my head for 2 seconds and shame on me. I don't think so. According to you, I need to keep her in a kennel 24/7 unless she is tied to my hip, or outside.


As you mentioned previously, dogs are different. I hate to tell you, but some puppies seem to wait for that 2 seconds you turn your head and that is when they will go. If you have one of those, you must watch 100% of the time until they are fully trained. No turning your head. No half-watching TV, taking care of kids, etc. Puppy must be in arm's reach at all times, in a crate, or carried. If this is the type of puppy you have, and your life is not such that you can't find time to do this (and with two very young kids I can understand where that could be the case), then you will get nowhere.


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## Princey009

*Piper*

I do believe she pees inside on purpose. Just saying. She will do good for awhile. A few days, and then she will pee outside, then come inside and pee after about 15 minutes. I've noticed watching her more that she spot pees alot. Sniff sniff, pee, sniff sniff, pee. All over the yard. She did that at our old place too. I have had plenty of males to know what she is doing. Also a few females who did it. Mainly Sharpei's though.... 

When she does pee outside, she gets rewarded by play or hotdogs, praise.etc. She can and will be inside without peeing. She has done it the past few days. No accidents so far. We have a routine now where she will be in for 30-1 hour, then go out for 20. All day. I have spanked her butt and I assure you, she has not held a grudge. I have also kicked her butt outside all day for peeing inside. I do have patience, but patience will only hold out for so long when it has been 4 months of routines and cleaning. Tweaking them to fit her and none working. To each their own. 

And for the record..... Kids do know what they do wrong. I have 2 under the age of 4 and the oldest will tell you what he does wrong before you even ask. They are a **** of a lot smarter then what we give them credit for.


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## doggiedad

stop spanking your dog. putting your dog in the yard
all day long doesn't teach her a thing. i read this somewhere,
"when your dog isn't doing what you want you have to
stop and ask yourself what am i doing wrong".



Princey009 said:


> I do believe she pees inside on purpose. Just saying. She will do good for awhile. A few days, and then she will pee outside, then come inside and pee after about 15 minutes. I've noticed watching her more that she spot pees alot. Sniff sniff, pee, sniff sniff, pee. All over the yard. She did that at our old place too. I have had plenty of males to know what she is doing. Also a few females who did it. Mainly Sharpei's though....
> 
> When she does pee outside, she gets rewarded by play or hotdogs, praise.etc. She can and will be inside without peeing. She has done it the past few days. No accidents so far. We have a routine now where she will be in for 30-1 hour, then go out for 20. All day.
> 
> >>>> I have spanked her butt and I assure you, she has not held a grudge. <<<<
> 
> >>>> I have also kicked her butt outside all day for peeing inside.<<<<
> 
> I do have patience, but patience will only hold out for so long when it has been 4 months of routines and cleaning. Tweaking them to fit her and none working. To each their own.
> 
> And for the record..... Kids do know what they do wrong. I have 2 under the age of 4 and the oldest will tell you what he does wrong before you even ask. They are a **** of a lot smarter then what we give them credit for.


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## Lilie

doggiedad said:


> stop spanking your dog. putting your dog in the yard
> all day long doesn't teach her a thing. i read this somewhere,
> "when your dog isn't doing what you want you have to
> stop and ask yourself what am i doing wrong".


Great advice, Doggiedad!


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## Magwart

Ambrola said:


> If I catch my puppy peeing I whip his hinny, and take him outside! I think we make all this to complicated.


_Fantastic _method to teach the dog to be afraid to go potty in front of you _anywhere_, and to refuse to go potty on a leash when you are standing next to it. Also a fantastic way to teach a dog to pee and poop in secretive corners of the house because you have taught it to _hide from the human_ when pottying needs to be done or its hiney will be whipped. If your dog instead believes going outside makes good stuff happen and makes you the happiest human that ever lived, life is a lot easier.


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## starburst

It sounds to me like you are overwhelmed and maybe re-homing this pup would indeed be the best option for this pup ans your family.

You have very young children so I know how busy you can be 

But when it has gotten to the point where you are physically punishing the pup , leaving it outside all day as a punishment etc... In my humble opinion , maybe the dog would be better off in a home where she would get the attention she needs to be potty trained .

I do have to commend you for coming on here and asking for help.


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## msvette2u

> According to you, I need to keep her in a kennel 24/7 unless she is tied to my hip, or outside.


Exactly this. THIS is the only way you will housebreak the puppy. Hitting, smacking, rubbing noses, throwing fits, etc. WILL NOT WORK. 

Where is this puppy located? If you're interested in giving her up, it might be best.


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## Alrod

Lots of good advice here (minus the hitting & yelling). If this is not a medical issue that can be fixed, I would make it an outside dog especially if you don't have the patience needed to train the dog properly. A house smelling like dog pee is very unpleasant and unhealthy. Although after a while your nose may grow accustomed to the smell, I promise you that your house guests are smelling it right away.


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## Nico Pico

If a health issue is definitely ruled out, I have to agree with all who have said that this puppy doesn't have the slightest idea what you expect of it. If you don't have the time or patience to devote to this puppy, maybe you should think about re-homing her, for everyone's benefit.


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## msvette2u

Where is this puppy located?


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Princey, sent you a PM!


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## chelle

Princey009 said:


> I do believe she pees inside on purpose. Just saying. She will do good for awhile. A few days, and then she will pee outside, then come inside and pee after about 15 minutes. I've noticed watching her more that she spot pees alot. Sniff sniff, pee, sniff sniff, pee. All over the yard. She did that at our old place too. I have had plenty of males to know what she is doing. Also a few females who did it. Mainly Sharpei's though....
> 
> When she does pee outside, she gets rewarded by play or hotdogs, praise.etc. She can and will be inside without peeing. She has done it the past few days. No accidents so far. We have a routine now where she will be in for 30-1 hour, then go out for 20. All day. *I have spanked her butt* and I assure you, she has not held a grudge. *I have also kicked her butt outside all day for peeing inside. I do have patience*, but patience will only hold out for so long when it has been 4 months of routines and cleaning. Tweaking them to fit her and none working. To each their own.
> 
> And for the record..... Kids do know what they do wrong. I have 2 under the age of 4 and the oldest will tell you what he does wrong before you even ask. They are a **** of a lot smarter then what we give them credit for.


This is just plain sickening.

You spank her butt.

You kick her butt outside.

You compare your dog to human children.

You do not have enough patience, whether you think you do or not.

You even say she's been doing better with a slightly better structured situation, but then complain about things without even taking note of the improvement over a better STRUCTURE -- which I believe has been a huge part of your issue all along.

I hope you can re-home the dog. Soon.

It is pretty clear you have some true resentments towards this dog and I don't believe anything positive can come of this. An adult human reducing themselves to *hitting* a dog because they cannot deal with keeping a strict schedule is akin to a preschooler hitting the child next to him because they took his crayon. Complete immaturity.


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## msvette2u

Chelle - there's folks across the nation doing this right now. I mean. It's quite prevalent and extremely sad, this belief that dogs think like people and can actually learn from things like what the OP describes.

To the OP - since what you've done so far isn't working, it's time to try new methods (what folks have recommended here) or else give up the dog.
I'm praying you relinquish to a rescue who can work with her, and spay her prior to placement.
If you are in the Pacific NW we can bring her into our rescue here in WA. If not, I pray there's one close to you who will make room.


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## Saige

*potty training nightmare*

I too have a potty training issue--my nearly 6 month old female, spayed GSD has been peeing in her crate since we got her at the age of 9 wks. I will preface my remarks here by saying that she has had UTIs and been on meds and is now completely clear! However, she still pees in her crate. I will take her out she'll pee and then I'll put her in her crate and 1- 1 1/2 hrs later she's peed in the crate. Today I took out her bedding so that she could sit in it hoping that it would bother her--nope, not at all bothered! I'm at a lose as to what to do. I am a stay at home dog mom and have done everything I've done with my previous 5 GSDs but nothing is working. I am crazy diligent about taking her out many many times a day and she most always peeps. Any suggestions? She does hold it from say 10 pm till 5 or 6 am., but I do withhold water from about 7 pm in the evening. I'm about ready to pull out my hair--and it's not puppy pee any more it reeks!


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## Bear L

wyoung2153 said:


> What do you do when she pees inside? When I had my female pup, the breeder warned me that for whatever reason, female pups tend to not fully empty when they pee the first time, that they need to go a couple times. Not sure how true that is, but it might behoove you to wait until she pees a second time out there.


My female did this in her younger days. I'd see her pee, then again in a different spot right after. Or pee, then sniff sniff, pee again. She wasn't fully trained till... 5 months? She got the idea at 4 months but she has to go so often and me being not eyes on her 100% she will just go if I don't recognize her sign of wanting to go. She was the kind that has to go often. No health issues, just small bladder I guess. At 6 months, she still had to go about once a hour or so. Can sleep thru the night, just drinks and wants to go often. I dealt with it since that's a bodily function that I thought is just the way she's made. At 9 months now, she's good and solid. Would even hold a diarrhea... I thought she was just been whinny. Ignored her. Took her out later and she went immediately. 

To the OP - if she's healthy, with maturity she will get better if you will just let her grow into it and give her consistent guidance by taking her out frequently, showing her where to go and make it not a stressful event for either of you. Be patient... as you'd be with a child. They take time to learn things and some longer than others. I's like learning how to ride a bicycle, some takes longer but once learned, it's learned.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

Saige said:


> I too have a potty training issue--my nearly 6 month old female, spayed GSD has been peeing in her crate since we got her at the age of 9 wks. I will preface my remarks here by saying that she has had UTIs and been on meds and is now completely clear! However, she still pees in her crate. I will take her out she'll pee and then I'll put her in her crate and 1- 1 1/2 hrs later she's peed in the crate. Today I took out her bedding so that she could sit in it hoping that it would bother her--nope, not at all bothered! I'm at a lose as to what to do. I am a stay at home dog mom and have done everything I've done with my previous 5 GSDs but nothing is working. I am crazy diligent about taking her out many many times a day and she most always peeps. Any suggestions? She does hold it from say 10 pm till 5 or 6 am., but I do withhold water from about 7 pm in the evening. I'm about ready to pull out my hair--and it's not puppy pee any more it reeks!


Did they do a culture to see if she was clear? My female gets UTIs and they tend to last a while, so we culture at the end to make sure it's all gone. My aunt too, come to think of it!

PS - again, wanted to reiterate I sent a PM to the OP if you see it - let us know if you need help finding them.


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## jang

I think you are overwhelmed--new house , little kids and a dog that just won't learn things your way..nowhere have you declared your love for this dog..You are damaging him and you really need to think about rehoming him--I am sorry for what you are going through, but the time has come for you to do the right thing by the dog..


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## stealthq

Saige said:


> I too have a potty training issue--my nearly 6 month old female, spayed GSD has been peeing in her crate since we got her at the age of 9 wks. I will preface my remarks here by saying that she has had UTIs and been on meds and is now completely clear! However, she still pees in her crate. I will take her out she'll pee and then I'll put her in her crate and 1- 1 1/2 hrs later she's peed in the crate. Today I took out her bedding so that she could sit in it hoping that it would bother her--nope, not at all bothered! I'm at a lose as to what to do. I am a stay at home dog mom and have done everything I've done with my previous 5 GSDs but nothing is working. I am crazy diligent about taking her out many many times a day and she most always peeps. Any suggestions? She does hold it from say 10 pm till 5 or 6 am., but I do withhold water from about 7 pm in the evening. I'm about ready to pull out my hair--and it's not puppy pee any more it reeks!


Some puppies don't seem to care much about being in their own mess. Many times it's something learned when they're very little, one of the reasons it's important for breeders to be on top of keeping the litter as clean as possible. My last dog was this way when he was a puppy. My breeder was good about keeping the sleeping/nesting area clean, but didn't clean the play area until play time was done so my pup learned that it's OK to play in poop or pee. Great.

It makes potty training a nightmare. For puppies like this, there's no relying on the puppy to give you any kind of signal, and the crate is no help whatsoever. In fact, it almost creates a bigger problem because subconsciously you're thinking "puppy's in the crate, it's safe" and you're less likely to be diligent. I was terribly guilty of this. The only way I got my puppy trained was to figure out how frequently he had to go, and anticipate him. 

To start, I was taking him out every 45min during the day, and 3 times overnight. When we finally got to a week with no accidents, I increased the time and waited for another week with no accidents. Rinse and repeat. Keep in mind that every time puppy has an accident you need to shorten the time and re-set the week.

If I remember correctly, Casey was finally potty trained around 7mos. old and once he was, he was bullet-proof. The last month was a real pain because he'd only have an accident once a week or so, so I'd just start to feel good about things, get a little careless, and oops . It helped to teach Casey to ring some bells I rigged on the door to tell me he needed to go. It seemed to help "I should not go inside, I should go outside" into his doggy brain.


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## Saige

*potty training nightmare*

Yes they did do a culture and it came back negative. I've tried most everything you guys have mentioned. Nothing really seems to work. Her breeder did keep all 11 puppies in a kennel with a raised bed and they did pee and poop on paper. They both worked so they were alone for the day. I've been diligent with taking her out, so many times a day, but I do need to shower every now and then so that requires being in the crate, which she is feed in and doesn't mind, but none the less pees in! Hopefully as one of you mentioned maturity and patience will do the trick! I'm still open to ideas. A tech at the vet mentioned using something like a tennis ball that she loves as a treat after she is good outside, but just doing that today all she does is stand at the door wanting to get to the ball! I don't think that's the right approach.


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## Bear L

I think she's used to going inside her crate and maybe her crate is now too scented with it.

Maybe try:

1. When in crate, give her something to do like a bullystick that's safe for you to feel comfortable enough for her to have alone while you go do something for a moment. Or leave her in a secure area outside. Before my dog learn to go outside, I could tether my dog to me all day and she'd still pee in front of me unless she's busy sleeping, eating or playing. 

2. Don't crate her anymore if she's very bad in crates. I don't know how bad this is, if it's a every now and then accident, or quite frequent. If quite frequent, I'd try an ex-pen or something else that disassociate the crate = pee idea. 

3. Make it a positive event. I know it's frustrating, I've wanted to just pretend my dog doesn't exist for a while whenever she pees 2 ft in front of me just when I thought she got it. it's ok to let her know it's not ok when you catch her in the act but don't linger there too long and be quick to praise her when she finishes it outside. If you didn't catch her, just ignore it (and scream in a different room). My trainer told me that to be a dog trainer, you need to be somewhat bipolar - be quick to correct and quick to praise once they fix their mistake. Your dog may be confused or just haven't gotten it and it can stress the dog out not knowing why you're so upset. It just hasn't click for her yet.


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## Princey009

*Piper*

I am so glad that all of you think I am abusing my pup and think I do not have patience. I have spoken with many trainers here in OHIO. YES I AM IN OHIO FOR THOSE WHO ARE SO DANG CURIOUS. We have tried quite a few methods. A swat on the butt does not hurt. To each their own. HOLY CRAP DON'T CALL PETA ON ME OR CPS FOR SWATTING BUTTS!! oh AND --- (Yes I can compare to my pup TO my kids because she is like one of my kids) but hey, none of you care about that. I am damaging her. Poor pitiful thing that gets love from all of us, very expensive CANIN food, tons of toys, and training. Pathetic. You are a bunch of Ridiculing people. I will go elsewhere for advice and constructive criticism. 

And from the get go, I said I don't want to get rid of her... (In other words, I love this da*n dog, she won't stop pi**ing in the house no matter what training, I'm at my wits end, I need help.) no that's not love at all. 

I came here for help, not bashing. Thanks EVERYONE!!! Greatly appreciated.


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## msvette2u

Then lay your ego aside and do right by the dog. 
Dogs aren't kids and do not learn the same.


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## chelle

Saige said:


> I too have a potty training issue--my nearly 6 month old female, spayed GSD has been peeing in her crate since we got her at the age of 9 wks. I will preface my remarks here by saying that she has had UTIs and been on meds and is now completely clear! However, she still pees in her crate. I will take her out she'll pee and then I'll put her in her crate and *1- 1 1/2 hrs later* she's peed in the crate. *Today I took out her bedding so that she could sit in it hoping that it would bother her--*nope, not at all bothered! I'm at a lose as to what to do. I am a stay at home dog mom and have done everything I've done with my previous 5 GSDs but nothing is working. I am crazy diligent about taking her out many many times a day and she most always peeps. Any suggestions? She does hold it from say 10 pm till 5 or 6 am., but I do withhold water from about 7 pm in the evening. I'm about ready to pull out my hair--and it's not puppy pee any more it reeks!


You might want to start a new thread so this one doesn't get convoluted and people can focus on just your pup.

Sounds like she's just used to peein in the crate. The UTI's she went thru sort of "forced her" into it. Be absolutely SURE you are cleaning each incident with enzyme cleaner - NOT an ammonia based, household cleaner. Very important! 

Take all bedding out. None of mine get bedding in their crates.. When they were younger, they'd pee on it, now, if they get bored, they'll chew it up. Sorry for them, they get the plastic crate bottom only. As far as the wet bedding "bothering her," get rid of this notion. This is applying human logic to a dog and doesn't work. This could actually make it far worse -- make her more and more accepting of a situation most dogs would really not like. Just remove the bedding.!

You said an hour and a half -- so -- now only leave her in an hour. The more successful potty events outside you can have with praise for each one puts you ahead. 

Again, you should really start your own thread explaining what you've tried and your routines to get the best feedback!

Good luck!!!!




Princey009 said:


> I am so glad that all of you think I am abusing my pup and think I do not have patience. I have spoken with many trainers here in OHIO. YES I AM IN OHIO FOR THOSE WHO ARE SO DANG CURIOUS. We have tried quite a few methods. A swat on the butt does not hurt. To each their own. HOLY CRAP DON'T CALL PETA ON ME OR CPS FOR SWATTING BUTTS!! oh AND --- (Yes I can compare to my pup TO my kids because she is like one of my kids) but hey, none of you care about that. I am damaging her. Poor pitiful thing that gets love from all of us, very expensive CANIN food, tons of toys, and training. Pathetic. You are a bunch of Ridiculing people. I will go elsewhere for advice and constructive criticism.
> 
> And from the get go, I said I don't want to get rid of her... (In other words, I love this da*n dog, she won't stop pi**ing in the house no matter what training, I'm at my wits end, I need help.) no that's not love at all.
> 
> I came here for help, not bashing. Thanks EVERYONE!!! Greatly appreciated.


Sorry you feel that way. Well, not that sorry. I have no tolerance for humans that hit dogs in an attempt to train the dog, much less in an attempt to train a pup.

You appear deaf when it comes to suggestions. You don't want to follow the best of suggestions that many have offered -- eyes on dog, schedule, no physical punishment, etc.

You want to do it your way and make it work and all anyone has said, (and not one person on your thread has agreed with your methods,) that you need to look at this thing differently and do things differently. You don't want to. Why did you make the post??

You come across as quite indignant and angry that folks won't support you hitting your dog. You are indeed on the wrong forum if you think anyone is going to back that.

You can purchase the best of everything for the dog -- just as some humans buy the best of everything for the children -- but without the time, patience and structure, it all fails. Buying great toys and food doesn't automatically make you a great owner. I don't know what trainers you refer to would support you hitting your dog during potty training. I'd fire them.

If you REALLY want to potty train this dog, re-read this thread many times. Seriously, just do it. Search this forum on housebreaking and you'll see the same advice over and over and over again and NONE of it will involve physical punishment! It will ALL advise constant eyes on pup. Let the ego calm down and just... read. For the sake of the pup you say you love, just do it!



msvette2u said:


> Then lay your ego aside and do right by the dog.
> Dogs aren't kids and do not learn the same.


Yes.


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## Meisha

I too have a problem with my dog peeing in her crate. We have a 7 month old female that we thought was potty trained, however, in the last week, she has started peeing in her crate again. When she was 6 weeks old, we discovered she had a UTI. After treating the first one, she ended up with 2 more before she was 4 months old. Currently, she is clear of any infection. I have been giving her probiotics once a week and am wondering if I shouldn't be giving it to her daily? I have had 2 other GSDs and they were so easy to potty train. Anybody have any ideas? I am getting so frustrated with this problem! We are letting her out every hour during the day, to potty and that makes no difference. Please help!!!:help:


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