# My Pup's Story and A Warning About Forced Exercise



## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

I'm new here, so I'm not sure where to post this. I hope I'm in the right place.

I've seen some people asking about jogging with their puppies, so I thought I would post our guy's story.

I found him on Craigslist. One of those ads that makes you concerned for the fate of the dog. Those we-have-to-get-rid-of-him-as-soon-as-possible ads. I wasn't particularly looking to get another dog. We had suddenly lost a wonderful 3 year old female to cancer a few months before and I wasn't sure I wanted another dog. But I wasn't happy about this ad, so I pursued it. My husband and I met one of the owners at a gas station that was about half way between our homes and we bought the dog, who was 6 months old at that time.

He's long-haired and we didn't realize how thin he was until we got him home. We also didn't realize he was totally nuts about water, and that he was lame, until we got home with him. 

I tracked down the breeder, who was livid at the situation, and found that he is very well bred, his mother being imported pregnant from Europe. I wanted to know if any of his issues might have been genetic, since our vet had diagnosed him with diabetes insipidus, which turned out to be incorrect. His issues, however, were all man-made.

We learned that this little guy was owned by a couple who were totally clueless about this pup, and who didn't seek the help they needed. They never increased the amount they were feeding him from the time they got him at 9 weeks. They also didn't know how to housebreak him, so they severely limited his water intake. To add more insult to that, they jogged him 2 miles a day.

After getting his diet and water issues straightened out, and watching him continue to limp, we finally found a vet who specializes in lameness in dogs. We found out that his joints had survived the exercise program, thank goodness, but his tendons hadn't. He has serious soft tissue damage to one shoulder and less soft tissue damage to both elbows. That shoulder is noticeably smaller than the other, with very little muscular development. He's been protecting it for most of his life. The only treatment is rest, and it's very challenging to keep a young dog quiet, as you can imagine. 

He just turned one year old and he's still limping with most every step. There has been some slight improvement, and we are holding out hope that he will eventually get over this, but it will take months more. 

He is a wonderfully happy dog, except when we have to restrain him from playing with the other dogs. It's heartbreaking, and we feel he is being deprived of his entire puppyhood. Hopefully, he will get through this and can some day run and jump with the others.

I wanted to post this to let others know that it's not a good idea to force your puppy to exercise. There is a chance that the nutritional condition he was in at the time contributed to the damage this puppy is dealing with, but I would not take the chance of jogging with any young dog. It's just not worth the risk.

Thanks for reading this saga, and please wish us luck with this much too long confinement for an incredibly forgiving puppy.


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## Gretchen (Jan 20, 2011)

Thank you for posting and for your patience and persistence in restoring your dog's health and well being. About a year ago I saw a man running his GSD pup (about 5-6months) next to him on a bicycle. I tried to catch up to him to tell him to stop, but he was too far ahead.

We also had very nice neighbors that were clueless about dog ownership. They had a Rott mix, huge male about 125lbs. They were in their 50's and decided they should get back in shape. I remember one day the husband came home and was so proud he jogged 5 miles with the young Rotty. After a year the humans looked fabulous but the dog was only 2 and his front legs and shoulders were weak and soar from jogging next to his owners. We used to care for him and he could barely get up into my small low to the ground sedan.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks for your reply. I hate to hear of other stories like the ones you mentioned. But I suppose there is no shortage of clueless pet owners. I guess we all were at some point. I wish the animals didn't have to pay the price for that. 

I know these people meant no harm to this dog. They were very nice folks. But I wish they had never bought a dog, and hope they never do again, at least not without informing themselves first.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

you can feed to repair damage to cartilage and tendons . Provide anti oxidant rich food, anti inflammatory rich food , provide natural Vitamin C and A and omega 3 , bone broth, provide glucosamine and chondroitin (bone broth) , MSM and other sulfur rich foods , l cysteine found in eggs and whey , foods which provide minerals such as magnesium , sources of the B vitamins , clean protein , egg shell membrane , and hydration -- coconut water is excellent .
proteolytic (papain / bromelain ) and digestive enzymes -- collagen (once again from bone broth) or an additional Knox gelatin. However , do read the package for the ingredients in Knox -- bone sourced collagen as in the original Knox is not so easy to find --- lot of it is now sea-plant agar agar based .
a diet can help prevent damage and a diet can help repair ligaments and cartilage .


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks for your input and advice. 

We cook for our dogs and feel like he's on a very good diet. I'm sure there is always room for improvement, though, so I appreciate your suggestions. I will look into those. He's been on a Glucosamine/Condroitin supplement since we picked him up. 

It took us almost a month to get him over his obsession with water. He drank all we put out, and then couldn't control himself, even peeing in his sleep when he tried to nap. That would wake him up, so he wasn't getting much rest, and of course, we weren't either. He got upset if he saw another dog drinking "his" water. 

We finally had to limit his intake in order to get him housebroken, and to get him to eat, since he filled up on water and refused food. And we were all exhausted, constantly taking him outside, and his not able to sleep. We gave him 3 times the recommended amount of water for his age and weight, spread throughout the day. After 3 and a half weeks of that, when he eventually left a very small amount in the bowl, we were able to fill the water bowls and leave them out. He still drank more than usual, but wouldn't gorge on it like he had before. He now pays very little attention to water, except to play in it.

He's had a tough start, but we are hoping it will only get better from here.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

glucosamine should be paired with MSM .


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## Bridget (Apr 5, 2004)

I am so glad you have him and are taking such good care of him. Thank you.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks for that info. We had him on MSM as well, but our new vet says that it isn't really necessary to combine Glucosamine with anything else. According to him, the current studies have found that the really significant thing is the Glucosamine.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks, Bridget, for your comment. I'm really glad I stumbled onto him, for his sake, and I feel like we are the lucky ones to have him in our family. He's a very special dog, very silly and playful, making us laugh every day. Even with all his problems, and the original vet advising us to send him back, we never had any doubts about keeping him. And through it all, he's never been the least bit depressed. He just wants to do it all, with gusto, in spite of his pain. He's a great example for us to try to follow.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Wow, what a sad story. Sounds like he ended up in the right place though. I hope with your loving care he'll overcome the damage done by his previous owners and end up being the healthy dog he deserves to be. 

Can you post some pictures? I have longcoats too - love them!


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## Ellimaybel (Mar 16, 2014)

I have faith and confidence that you are doing everything right in your power to heal him and help him. Obviously he does too and that's why he is such a great dog. The water thing will pass in time, as he learns that he will never want for anything again. Best of luck to all of you.


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## BowWowMeow (May 7, 2007)

Sorry to hear about your pup but glad you have him now. Please look into the info that Carmen provided. I adopted Rafi at age 1.5 and he came to me with soft tissue damage to his shoulder. I put him on a raw diet and lots of supplements and his shoulder healed.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks to all who replied to our pup's story. I will most definitely check out every suggestion made. This little guy is obviously much more than we had anticipated we were getting into, and we can use all the help we can get. He's so much better now, it's just that infernal limp that we are all dealing with now.

Debbie, I will see if I can figure out how to post some pictures of him when I have the chance.

Ruth, how long did it take your dog's shoulder to heal? I sometimes think we will never get there.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Pawsed said:


> Thanks for that info. We had him on MSM as well, but our new vet says that it isn't really necessary to combine Glucosamine with anything else. According to him, the current studies have found that the really significant thing is the Glucosamine.


supplements and chemistry of food is sort of my thing.
One day picking up my order of glucosamine , a gentleman in the shop said to me , "you do know you should be combining that with MSM " to which I replied "I know !" . He could not have known that my MSM order had come the prior week . He started with some highly technical explanation.

Wish I had more time - wish he had more time -- next time I'll ask for the name and contact information to continue the conversation. I was told he was chief developer of formulations , a Vet dvm, for animal formulae.

There is a synergy that happens when glucosamine (uptake) and MSM are combined AND full real Vitamin C should be in the equation also.


quote from another source----
"The Sum Is Greater Than the PartsGlucosamine/MSM combo formulations have also been designated effective at synergistically enhancing joint function in clinical studies over the years. In one such study‚ a total of 118 subjects were randomized into one of four groups for 12 weeks: glucosamine (500 mg three times daily)‚ MSM (500 mg three times daily)‚ the combination of glucosamine and MSM‚ or a placebo treatment. Glucosamine alone and MSM alone were shown to enhance joint function‚ while the combination was found to be even more effective‚ by both subjective and objective measurements."\


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks Carmen. I guess I should put him back on the MSM. 

I really appreciate all the help I've been given here. Thanks for sharing your knowledge with a new member.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

thanks -- but a big thanks to you for helping out the pup --- hydration is very important . A sign of dehydration is crepitus , which I learned about one record breaking hot summer working in landscape design , and not having proper hydration (head aches and CREPITUS) . When using the staircase my knees made a sound like corduroy pants rubbing together or sand paper rubbing together -- lesson learned. 

Hydration is important for waste removal and cushioning The Importance of Hydration and Movement | Melbourne Natural Therapies


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## HOBY (Aug 12, 2013)

Has the VET mentioned aquatic therapy? Thanks for your post and your hard work. Your story is a good argument for when a young pup/dog stops, let him rest.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Yes, he has. I'm not sure about that right now, though. We feel like he would be using those tendons just as much in swimming as in running, just without the concussion. We are thinking of waiting until he gets somewhat sounder before taking him to aquatic therapy. What is your opinion?

My major reason to post was to let people know that puppies can suffer serious damage when exercising with their owners. I know that most people here advise against doing that, but I saw no one post who had personal experience with a pup that had a negative result of that exercise. I wanted to let people know that there can be problems created that can take a lifetime to recover from. Anyone who has or has had tennis elbow understands what I'm saying. It may get better and go away for a while, but if you stress it again, it can easily come back, just as bad as ever. It's very difficult to truly recover from.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

It might be worth asking the vet whether a few months of Adequan injections might be worth exploring. They are normally something we think about for senior dogs with arthritis, but maybe they'd help here?

There are many, many threads about them on the boards. They are similar in idea to glucosamine, but much more intensive therapy. It sends nourishment into the synovial fluid to be distributed by the body to the joints, to rebuild and protect cartilage. They are deep intramuscular injections -- with a loading dose (2x week, usually), then stepped down to biweekly or monthly for as long as needed. They're not inexpensive, but they have helped many senior dogs. I can't help but wonder if a few months of them wouldn't help your pup. I don't have any experience using them in young dogs -- your vet could look into it for you. 

Product Description - Novartis Animal Health US, Inc.
Adequan - posssibly an answer for dogs with joint damage


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks for your suggestion and thoughts about helping this guy. This pup's joints are perfect, for which we are very grateful. His x-rays are beautiful, if that can be said of x-rays. It's his tendons that are the problem. It seems that a tincture of time is the best thing for him. He has to stop stressing those tendons so that they can have a chance to heal. So he has to move that shoulder as little as possible, which is actually not possible at all, so progress is very slow.

Believe me, I wish there were some magic pill or shot we could give him, but it just doesn't seem to exist. We have him on glucosamine to try to insure he doesn't develop any joint problems in the future, not to try to cure his tendon damage.


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## Alice13 (Feb 21, 2014)

I know this guy who bought a gsd pup and took it for long jogs (on the road). The dog soon was diagnosed with HD and had to be put down. Later on they bought another pup and didn't let the poor thing run or have any form of exercise at all. That one died of heart attack. And then he gave up.
Glad to know that your dog is now in a safe place where he can grow properly.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

tendons and cartilage can take a longer time to heal than bone....Carmen knows her stuff on the supplement end of things.....I had a bad bad accident 2 years ago and the ligament tendon damage was horrific....still not 100% maybe never will be.....

It sounds like you are on the right path....glad he is doing so well.....swimming definitely is a wonderful exercise for his problems.....

Adequan is a joint lubricant supplement....it may be helpful just for overall well being

Lee


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

I'm sorry to hear of your injury. I hope you will continue to improve with time.

We are fairly well acquainted with tendon injuries in animals, having spent most of our working lives in the horse industry. We have just never encountered it in our dogs before now.

You might be interested in this website: Tendinosis.org Home

There is lots of great information there. On re-reading the treatment section, we are thinking that it might be best to take this guy off of the glucosamine/condroitin he is getting until he gets over this problem. It might actually be doing more harm than good at this point. I'll do some more research, though, before making a definite decision.

Does anyone know of studies done on dog tendon issues and glucosamine, not people studies? I'm sure there are great similarities, but maybe there are some differences as well.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

carmspack said:


> you can feed to repair damage to cartilage and tendons . Provide anti oxidant rich food, anti inflammatory rich food , provide natural Vitamin C and A and omega 3 , bone broth, provide glucosamine and chondroitin (bone broth) , MSM and other sulfur rich foods , l cysteine found in eggs and whey , foods which provide minerals such as magnesium , sources of the B vitamins , clean protein , egg shell membrane , and hydration -- coconut water is excellent .
> proteolytic (papain / bromelain ) and digestive enzymes -- collagen (once again from bone broth) or an additional Knox gelatin. However , do read the package for the ingredients in Knox -- bone sourced collagen as in the original Knox is not so easy to find --- lot of it is now sea-plant agar agar based .
> a diet can help prevent damage and a diet can help repair ligaments and cartilage .


 x 2!!!


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

Thank you for rescuing him!


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

I appreciate your willingness to help. Thank you.

Please check out the website I posted, Tendinosis.org, particularly the section on treatment.

The information you quoted is great for joint problems, which he doesn't have, but according to the studies they reference on that website, glucosamine actually promotes the development of the wrong type of collagen for tendon repair. It may not be the best thing for this dog.

I'm still looking into that and don't want to make a hasty decision. But now I'm wondering if glucosamine is the right choice for him.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thank you. I didn't realize that was actually what I was doing at the time! But it turns out that my feelings about the ad were correct. He was in the wrong situation. I'm glad we were in the right place and time to be able to take him.

I often wonder how many other dogs out there are like him, with people who think they are doing the right things, but are so far off base. Way too many, I'm sure.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Here's a picture taken in February. I hope this works. He loves that stuffed dog and grabs it every evening to take upstairs to bed with him.


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## NancyJ (Jun 15, 2003)

Thanks for the link....it will help ME! I have ongoing issues with a peroneal tendinosis in my foot due to structural defect with my foot.

Now, I will say that a procedure (*available to rehab vets*) that did wonders for me was ultrasound. That said, I understand, it is also one that requires a very skilled practitioner as you can burn the periosteum of the bone.

I was advised to gentle controlled exercise ....... mainly stretching and strength and it is very painful...so I feel for your dog.....Hope you will keep this thread updated with progress. 

People need to understand that bones and supporting structures are no where near developed until growth is more complete. Thanks for the warning; maybe you will have saved another dog from a similar fate. I can see linking to this thread in the future the next time someone talks about running a young pup for miles on asphalt.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks so much for posting your advice and understanding my goal in putting up this pup's story. I do hope it can help other dogs to avoid his issues. It is so unfair that he can't really be a puppy.

I'm sorry you have tendons problems, too, and I hope you can find some relief from your pain. I know it's a long and difficult journey.

Thanks for the information on ultrasound. I'll check into that.


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## HOBY (Aug 12, 2013)

"Yes, he has. I'm not sure about that right now, though. We feel like he would be using those tendons just as much in swimming as in running, just without the concussion. We are thinking of waiting until he gets somewhat sounder before taking him to aquatic therapy. What is your opinion?"

Aquatic therapy takes pressure off the joints, ligaments and tendons to move freely. Body weight pressure is reduced. If left to no motion muscles weaken and tendons lose their elasticity. Does your boy like the water? If so take him to a lake or what ever [no fast moving water yet] go out to about where he starts to float and hold his under body in a comfortable manor. If he will relax you will be giving him therapy. Check with your VET first and good luck.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thank you for your help. This one loves the water. The vet did recommend taking him swimming, in a lake or pool, and told us there is an aquatic therapy center for dogs in town if we don't have access to the other options. I'm sure this pup would enjoy that and it would give him a chance to work off some of the energy he's storing up, and to maintain some muscle strength.

It's impossible to keep him completely still, of course. He's kept loose in the house and we take him out on a leash, even though he has lots of room to run free where we live. We are trying to keep him from running and jumping and exerting himself too much. But he is still a puppy and it's hard to convince him to take it easy on himself. He doesn't seem to care that it hurts.


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## Cassidy's Mom (Mar 30, 2003)

Wow, he's absolutely gorgeous! :wub:


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

Thanks, Debbie. We think so, too!


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