# What exactly is the physiology of getting GSD ears to stand-up?



## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Some of you may know that I am trying to get my GSD's ears to stand. I have had her ears taped-up for a while but when I take them off they stand for a few hours then fall back down.

Some questions...

1. How exactly does the cartilage in the ear get stronger or stiffer?

2. Can ears stand-up overnight? meaning could I have her ears up and then a month from now her ears simply stand on their own because of cartilage getting stronger?

3. What other tips does anyone have? I plan on taping her ears till the end of the year and if they don't stand, then fine, but as long I am trying I want to give it my best shot.

:smile2:


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Is this the dog you bought at one year of age with floppy ears?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Like we told you before, at the age you got her getting her ears to stand was a long shot. If they had been taped at 6 months, they might stand.

Ears are genetic. Thin ears don't stand as well. Large, heavy, ears don't stand as well.


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## LuvShepherds (May 27, 2012)

It’s not going to happen.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

If they are not standing by now, they never will.
I would stop messing with the ears, because once you start irritating them and getting ear infections, it’s a nightmare, really.


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Jax08 said:


> Like we told you before



Well "We told you you so" isn't exactly helpful or useful.

I talked to my breeder and she said that since the tips are standing and her ears stand sometimes it is still possible they might go up. She also said my GSD isn't done growing physically, after she examined her and although late, up to 18 months old is still not too late to tape her ears. I still think my GSD could put on a good 15lbs as well.

I'm thinking about giving her shark cartilage supplements as I've read that helps. Any thoughts on that?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I didn't say "We told you so". Perhaps read the rest of the sentence.


Maybe you should consult with the breeder again. Good Luck.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

Who is the breeder who told you that?
I think she’s selling you a load of baloney.
Your GSD’s weight looks fine. GSDs should be slender with a nice tuck, not fat. Their joints will do much better with less weight to stress them.


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Sunflowers said:


> Who is the breeder who told you that?
> I think she’s selling you a load of baloney.
> Your GSD’s weight looks fine. GSDs should be slender with a nice tuck, not fat. Their joints will do much better with less weight to stress them.


I'm aware that I was probably told what I wanted to hear, but that being said her ears aren't totally hanging either. That is why I am interested in what exactly is going on in her ear to make them stand up or not. 

Also she is very very long in body. When she stands up on her hind legs she might be around 6' that is why I think she can still gain some healthy weight.


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## 514parts (Dec 3, 2018)

It sounds like you have already gotten your answers here. As a casual observer I think that you have a good looking dog there. I would just let her ears do their thing and enjoy her. 
Good luck with whatever you decide.


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

514parts said:


> It sounds like you have already gotten your answers here.



Well, the question I asked before was whether or not floppy ears were considered a health problem rather than a cosmetic issue. Since I am having her ears taped-up for the next couple of months I was hoping I might get some tips or advice for this final stretch. I guess if her ears don't stand I will just give her up to the local shelter.



Just kidding. I would have gotten her ears up or ears down anyway. Others in the forum did convince me, along with my breeder, that I might as well try to tape her ears and see if they are prone to standing so that is what I am doing. I am not asking for snarky comments or to just let it go. I was just hoping for some helpful last-minute advice which I'll apparently have to google. 

See! she looks fine with ears half-up anyway...


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## BigOzzy2018 (Jan 27, 2018)

Her ears will never stand. Love her for who she is no matter what her ears do. I am sure you will. 
I think your breeder is not being honest with you about the ears standing as well


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

OP I have moved your thread to the Ears Up forum.... perhaps you will find your answers in some of the other posts here. There is even a member who had success with a 14 month old - at least at the time of their post. Best of luck.


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## Springbrz (Aug 13, 2013)

I don't know if they will stand or not. I have never had to tape ears but I don't care for the method you are using. It's not a natural shape for the cartilage to be pulled so narrow as you have them. I think a manufactured ear form that mimics the natural shape of the ear would be better. Just my thoughts...


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Fodder said:


> OP I have moved your thread to the Ears Up forum.... perhaps you will find your answers in some of the other posts here. There is even a member who had success with a 14 month old - at least at the time of their post. Best of luck.



Thank You! I didn't know there was another subforum for such a specific issue. I guess that's both good and bad...LOL. 

Also like the member with the 14 month old, I am applying a similar method. Apparently the shape and the light weight are good to get the ears stronger. Hopefully it works for me too.










@Fodder - Thanks again..prolly gonna read every thread!


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Hey everyone reading this! There is a lot of good information in other threads. One person STARTED taping his GSDs ears at 14 months and had success however he taped them for 6 months. Here is an answer I found to the question I asked about ear physiology which I thought may be helpful.
_
i started to read up a bit about cartilage and healing times, from what i read cartilages take a real long time to heal due to having a deprived blood supply, which means that nutrients that help in healing are not readily obtainable._


So it would seem that getting them strong is a long process and most importantly you have to be diligent in taping otherwise the creases in the ear or cartilage will always "re-injure" itself. I think it makes a lot of sense to examine the ear for any out of sync crease and try to tape them with moleskin + adhesive. I will be checking my GSDs ears out more extensively after I remove the current ear-inserts. The insulation foam starts to get very soft over time so it always has to have a fresh roll in there.

Something else my breeder told me is that the tips were stiff & up which is a good sign....if down is a sign that taping might not work. My dog's ears crease in the middle so I need to focus on that. I plan on keeping that middle part rigid for quite a while longer than 2 more months. But as the dog grows his ears will get slowly incrementally stronger. 

Anyways good luck everyone!

p.s. It is very common to use insulation foam as well


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

MORE INFO

https://www.justanswer.com/dog-health/98pto-heard-possible-inject-calcium.html


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## Frisco19 (Aug 12, 2019)

Hey Lauren, I know this isn't what you want to hear or an answer to your science question, but I have seen a lot of GSD's in my day. Those ears aren't going up. They don't even show support at the base. When ears are in the puppy stage of going up and down due to teething, you can still see they are strong at the base, they sometime are up but out or sideways. I went through the anxiety of this between 3-5 months of up and down. I did lots of things even though I knew they were going to pop and they did with vigor and they aren't going down. Gelatin in the food, chicken necks, lots of bone, benebones. An adult with sometimes up or up for a little while because you taped them probably means they aren't staying up. It's genetic and unfortunately it just wasn't meant to be. I get it though, a GSD with ears down doesn't look the same, but I would love her or him no matter what and I know you will. They just look really weak. Good luck.


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Frisco19 said:


> Hey Lauren, I know this isn't what you want to hear ...



Thanks. 

Funny thing is I never thought it was imperative until I started taping them. But I figure as long doesn't hurt to try for a few more months at least. Like sometimes she raises them on her own like if there is a knock at the door or something. I have a feeling that her ears were compromised because she slept in a crate all her life before I got her. Her breeder told me that it wasn't common with her dogs (of course what would I expect her to say?). 

There are some amazing results in this ears-up forum from what I've read. I don't know though. I'm probably going to move towards the less noticeable, moleskin brace inside her ears and then just wait it out. 

What are your thoughts on her tips staying rigid though? Will that rigidity go down towards the base of her ears?? Also even with her ears taped-up people have asked me what kind of dog she is. I think the sable colour really throws people off. Oh well....


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## Frisco19 (Aug 12, 2019)

Lauren Kelly said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Funny thing is I never thought it was imperative until I started taping them. But I figure as long doesn't hurt to try for a few more months at least. Like sometimes she raises them on her own like if there is a knock at the door or something. I have a feeling that her ears were compromised because she slept in a crate all her life before I got her. Her breeder told me that it wasn't common with her dogs (of course what would I expect her to say?).
> 
> ...


I'm not quite sure what the rigidity of the tips means to the overall process. Also, surprisingly, lots of people ask everyone what kind of dog their GSD is. It's so strange and so obvious.


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## MineAreWorkingline (May 2, 2015)

Lauren Kelly said:


> Hey everyone reading this! There is a lot of good information in other threads. One person STARTED taping his GSDs ears at 14 months and had success however he taped them for 6 months. Here is an answer I found to the question I asked about ear physiology which I thought may be helpful.
> _
> i started to read up a bit about cartilage and healing times, from what i read cartilages take a real long time to heal due to having a deprived blood supply, which means that nutrients that help in healing are not readily obtainable._
> 
> ...


I don't know the exact physiology of ears going erect but from the quote you posted, I highly doubt that there is a correlation. A puppy's ears are not down because of damage to cartilage of the ears but due to the cartilage being softer at that age. The cartilage hardens as a process of maturation, a change in the body's chemistry in response to endocrine changes. As others have posted, ears can genetically have weak cartilage and if that is the cause, there isn't anything you can do about that short of surgery.


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## Kazel (Nov 29, 2016)

Lauren Kelly said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Funny thing is I never thought it was imperative until I started taping them. But I figure as long doesn't hurt to try for a few more months at least. Like sometimes she raises them on her own like if there is a knock at the door or something. I have a feeling that her ears were compromised because she slept in a crate all her life before I got her. Her breeder told me that it wasn't common with her dogs (of course what would I expect her to say?).
> 
> ...


We have a female shepherd that is your average saddleback with nice red pigmentation. Upright ears and all of that. However she is at the bottom of the standard(which not going to lie it is very handy having her a bit smaller). Before she started graying up people would ask me how old she was. When I said 3 years old people couldn't believe it and said she must be mixed with something because german shepherds aren't that small. Never mind that she is within standard because people are used to seeing large shepherds. So I wouldn't worry too much about others comments because a lot of people know very little about dogs even if they own them.


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## Lauren Kelly (Feb 27, 2016)

Frisco19 said:


> Those ears aren't going up. They don't even show support at the base.


Well I took out her foam inserts today and they went back to being down pretty soon thereafter. Thing is I read these other stories of success and it makes me wonder if its just a matter of more time. A german shepherd breeder also told me since the ears are thin there is a better chance that they will stand, another breeder told me before 18 months but obvs way earlier would have been better.

I don't want to keep subjecting her to the inserts and glue if it won't work but can't make sense of what I am reading in the other 'ears up?" threads. Why do you think it is not worthwhile please be specific.

Thanks.


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## atomic (Mar 28, 2016)

I think some of these success stories are so far and few in between, maybe you shouldn’t let them raise your hopes so high it will be the case for you. Is it really so bad if her ears don’t stand? My GSDs ears have stood since he was nine weeks old, never even a teepee phase and I have had a number of people ask me if he is a mix. There are so many types of GSD it’s not unusual for your average joe to not recognize all of them. Conversely I also have a Doberman GSD mix and his ears are all over the place, I never bothered with them and let them do their own thing. I love him just as much and believe me nobody thinks of him as silly looking. Well, maybe sometimes lol.


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## Fodder (Oct 21, 2007)

This is my first time ever hearing 18 months.
This is also my first time ever hearing of “success” at 14 months (assuming that posters dog still has erect ears).
I directed you to the Ears Up, mostly, to see if you could find more information regarding the physiology of why some ears go up and some don’t.
The 14 month old was just an interesting, anecdotal case.
I personally do not believe your dogs ears will stand.
In general, IF both ears have gone up when a puppy is young, then fall or “dance” during teething (4-6 months), then there is a good chance they’ll go back up.
If this does not happen by 6 months, a lot of people will tape.
But here’s the catch - we can’t prove that taped ears wouldn’t have gone up on their own. Therefore, we don’t know for sure that taping even works.
A lot of people figure there is no harm in trying. I don’t like the word harm. In most cases it’s fine.... in other cases you may get erect ears that stand crooked, or sink at the base, or they’re wrinkled in appearance, etc.
Down ears are not created equal.
They can look and act very different. 
Different sizes and shapes and thickness and location of the creases.
Not all will go up.
That 14 month olds ears may not have resembled your dogs ears.
Genetics plays a huge part!
Some pups get their ears butchered by playmates and never get fun chews or supplements and sleep every night with their ears pressed against a crate - and their ears still stand.
I prefer erect ears. So much so that one of the reasons I love rescuing older pups is because their ears are already up and I don’t have to worry about any of this.


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## Frisco19 (Aug 12, 2019)

Lauren Kelly said:


> Well I took out her foam inserts today and they went back to being down pretty soon thereafter. Thing is I read these other stories of success and it makes me wonder if its just a matter of more time. A german shepherd breeder also told me since the ears are thin there is a better chance that they will stand, another breeder told me before 18 months but obvs way earlier would have been better.
> 
> I don't want to keep subjecting her to the inserts and glue if it won't work but can't make sense of what I am reading in the other 'ears up?" threads. Why do you think it is not worthwhile please be specific.
> 
> Thanks.


I'm not sure I said taping is not worthwhile, I actually don't know anything about taping as I've never needed it. I can't weigh in on taping, but the whole concept of it seems hoaky. I think it's genetics 90% of the time and 10% of the time it's injury related if it's one ear and not both. If both are down at this point, I think I would call it a day. You can try the things you saw in other posts like adding more bone to the diet. I'm sorry again, I know you want them up, I would too. I'd love him all the same, but I would be bummed.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Sunflowers said:


> It has become crystal clear that this bothers you a lot and will always bother you.
> Your breeder sold you a floppy-eared dog, and lied that you could fix a situation she know darned well was a lost cause.
> Continuing to glue and tape this poor dog’s ears will do nothing but put the dog through unnecessary discomfort and cause you more disappointment.
> If it means so much to you, return the dog to the breeder and get a GSD with erect ears.


She didn't buy this dog from a breeder. She got this dog a few weeks ago from the original buyer. The breeder didn't lie to her. She suggested that it was possible for the ears to come up with taping. The breeder did not make any promises. We told the OP that she could try taping but it was a long shot.

It's in a previous thread where she was considering the dog.


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## Sunflowers (Feb 17, 2012)

OK, my previous post is deleted.


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## Pawsed (May 24, 2014)

I'm a firm believer in the idea that ears will come up on their own or they won't. I really don't like messing with them. If they don't stand, it's no big deal to me. Of course I like the look of upright ears, but the dog is the same dog, ears up or down.

My neighbor has a husky/GSD whose ears have never stood. With those parents you would think they would have easily come up, and right away. But this year, at the age of 4!, one of them stood, all on it's own. The other will now sometimes come up, too, and nothing has ever been done to help them. 

I think that must be a record. I've never heard of any other dog taking that long, and his other ear may never come up for good. But one is up all the time now, which I think is pretty remarkable, and they have done this with no taping or help of any kind. 

In my opinion, I would not tape those ears. Let the dog be the dog it is destined to be. You might be surprised one day to find those ears erect all on their own, but the chances of that happening, in my opinion, are slight. Love the dog you have, no matter what the ears do.


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## T'Challa! (Dec 4, 2019)

Lauren Kelly said:


> Some of you may know that I am trying to get my GSD's ears to stand. I have had her ears taped-up for a while but when I take them off they stand for a few hours then fall back down.
> 
> Some questions...
> 
> ...


I guess its cool if they stand up but regardless of that, he is your pup for LIFE. Ears shouldn't really matter he is meant to be a companion not a aesthetic thing, if I were you I wouldn't worry about it! I have also heard of ears going up after a year old so its still possible.


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