# feelings on this pedigree? Rackwitz-Meute?



## ls19 (Jul 21, 2010)

wondering if anyone has insight on what to expect from Quiena von der Rackwitz-Meute ?

Quiena von der Rackwitz-Meute pedigree information - German shepherd dog

working lines, purportedly out of Austria, but I'm not familiar with these names -- 

thanks!


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## JKlatsky (Apr 21, 2007)

Not a pedigree expert by any stretch of the imagination but my dogs are bred on Mink like this dog and they also have Crok. Generally very high prey drive with a low threshold and good aggression. Without knowing the other dogs in the pedigree though it's hard to say how strong the influence is. 

Mink's fairly famous West German Working lines. Leerburg used dogs bred on Mink often and there's a write up on him there. 

Mink vom Haus Wittfeld


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

The father's father Duarto is a dog who I've seen behind some very nice performing dogs--he goes back to some extremely nice old-line producers: Cliff Wolfendobel, Caro Allerswald, Grando v Schloss Veitenstein, and Wanko vd Maarue.

The father's mother is Karthago kennels, and goes back to the excellent Crok (huge grips, excellent prey drive, handler-hardness) and Xando v Karthago, and she is linebred 2-3 on one of the top bitches in working lines--Afra v Stoppenberger Land.

So this top half of the pedigree goes to back to excellent West German working bloodlines--some of the older lines that were more common in the 80s and 90s.

On the bottom half of the pedigree, the mother goes back to DDR bloodlines, with 3 of the 4 grandparents being DDR lines. The 4th line goes back to the strong West German working lines of Mink (Crok's sire) through Lindenhalle kennels. Compare Nora v Lindenhalle's pedigree to that of the famous producer Jago vd Lindenhalle.

All in all, this is a very nice pedigree that shows that a fair amount of thought went into this breeding. Also, this female is completely free of Fero (which is not to say that Fero is not a great dog to see in a pedigree, but it sure is nice to see a female without Fero, opening up a lot of Fero-bred males as breeding options or even allowing breeders to keep Fero-free bloodlines), and some of the other recently popular stud dogs and breeding crosses (Yoschy-Nick, for example; or Fero-Mink), instead going back to some of the less overbred great dogs of the last 30 years.

Christine


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Oh! I knew I'd seen Duarto somewhere--Quiena's mom is a littermate to Casch's father--

Compare: Cäsch vom Salztalblick pedigree information - German shepherd dog

Casch is an extremely powerful male with a lot of drive and some significant handler hardness. Got so he would NOT tolerate the harsh corrections he was receiving from his handler and ended up being retired from competition early. Some of that handler hardness no doubt comes down from Crok, but in Casch, I suspect that the very hard Sid vh Gremm also plays a factor.


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## Rei (Oct 10, 2008)

"Quinny" is my pup's dam. 

Qodiak vom HausReid pedigree information - German shepherd dog

I had the privilege of meeting this wonderful bitch when I visited the kennel she is now owned by (vom HausReid) and watched a quick demonstration of her obedience. 



JKlatsky said:


> Generally very high prey drive with a low threshold and good aggression.


This sums it up nicely.

I am in contact with two other forum members with pups out of the same breeding (Quinny x Flax/Nirko v HausReid) and they are all drivey dogs who would be good for sport. Hard dogs with strong prey drive, great temperament, and great nerves.



BlackthornGSD said:


> Oh! I knew I'd seen Duarto somewhere--Quiena's mom is a littermate to Casch's father--
> 
> Compare: Cäsch vom Salztalblick pedigree information - German shepherd dog
> 
> Casch is an extremely powerful male with a lot of drive and some significant handler hardness. Got so he would NOT tolerate the harsh corrections he was receiving from his handler and ended up being retired from competition early. Some of that handler hardness no doubt comes down from Crok, but in Casch, I suspect that the very hard Sid vh Gremm also plays a factor.


Actually, Quitte's (Quinny's dam) sire, Drago v Mainos, is littermate to Casch's dam, Daisy v Mainos. So it's the other way around  But the description is very accurate.


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Rei said:


> Actually, Quitte's (Quinny's dam) sire, Drago v Mainos, is littermate to Casch's dam, Daisy v Mainos. So it's the other way around  But the description is very accurate.


Oops. That'll teach me to try to post at 3 am.


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## Zahnburg (Nov 13, 2009)

BlackthornGSD Quote about Casch: "Got so he would NOT tolerate the harsh corrections he was receiving from his handler and ended up being retired from competition early"
Now Christine this is simply not true. The fact of the matter is that Casch's handler and OWNER took Egon to trial and returned home to find that Casch had been stolen. The reason that Casch could not be shown any longer has nothing to do with the dog, only with the inabilities of the person who currently has possesion of him.


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

Zahnburg said:


> BlackthornGSD Quote about Casch: "Got so he would NOT tolerate the harsh corrections he was receiving from his handler and ended up being retired from competition early"
> Now Christine this is simply not true. The fact of the matter is that Casch's handler and OWNER took Egon to trial and returned home to find that Casch had been stolen. The reason that Casch could not be shown any longer has nothing to do with the dog, only with the inabilities of the person who currently has possesion of him.


I'm not going to get in an argument about this. The person who currently has Casch was not responsible for him being removed from the possession of the person who was training him and is only involved as someone who was asked to provide the dog a safe, caring, low-stress retirement home.

I do know that Casch is a dog who is quick to take offense at a correction or perceived correction and he *will* come at any human who he thinks caused him pain, which was my point in my previous post.


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## Zahnburg (Nov 13, 2009)

Christine,
I understand the point of your post. I am not looking to argue either, and I will agree completely that Casch is more dog than some can handle.
The true tragedy of the situation is that Casch's abilities to contribute to the breed, via reproduction, will not be realized because of this tangled web that has been woven, in no small part, by the the current posseser of Casch. 
In my opinion, the most correct thing that could be done is to return Casch to his rightful owner, as per the SV,USA and AKC, so that his potential as a stud can be fully realized.


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