# Pedigree question - inbreeding?



## HankGSD (Oct 28, 2010)

Recently I was looking at Hank's pedigree and noticed his grandfather on his sire's side and his great-grandfather on his dam's side are the same dog. So in other words, his Dad's dad is also his Mom's grandfather.

I am really not that concerned, but is that considered inbreeding or is it common practice? For all I know, other dogs in his lineage may be blood-related in some way as well. 

I am just curious about this. I would post a link to his pedigree but I can't seem to find it anywhere online when searching by his name or registration number.


----------



## cliffson1 (Sep 2, 2006)

All depends on the dog and the purpose.Should be an excellent balanced dog who has been shown to produce few negative recessives and brings a lot of needed traits to the table.


----------



## HankGSD (Oct 28, 2010)

Thanks for the reply. Your information makes a lot of sense, and Hank's breeder produces some fantastic dogs, so she definitely knows what she is doing.

Does anyone know how I access his pedigree online? Do I have to enter the information myself on Pedigree Database? Is there any cons to doing that? 

I found a picture of one of Hank's relatives, probably an uncle, and I nearly fell out of my chair. If I hadn't known better, I would have sworn it was a picture of my dog, and I'd like to think I'd know my dog anywhere!!


----------



## Andaka (Jun 29, 2003)

You will have to start his pedigree on PDB, but after his sire and dam (and they may be inthere as well) you will probably not have to enter the entire pedigree. Just depends on what dogs are already in there. I entered all of my American show ine dogs in there.


----------



## HankGSD (Oct 28, 2010)

Hank von Stonehill - German Shepherd Dog

I entered his pedigree (fortunately some of his ancestors were already there). If anyone is interested in taking a look that would be great.


----------



## bocron (Mar 15, 2009)

Some pretty tight linebreeding there.

For example your dog is 2-3 on Baron Trooper von Stonehill. Generally when a breeder is doing close linebreeding there is a trait they are looking to stress. Since I don't see any titles or ratings on any of the dogs listed in the linebreedings I don't know why they would double up on a specific dog in this way. If you click on the 6 generation pedigree you go back to some WGSL(West German Show Line) dogs and also a bunch of blanks.


----------



## SpicyBulldog (Jul 23, 2011)

Uncle to niece would be considered inbreeding. With a COI of 12.5% however that isn't a full uncle because the dams dad and the sire are only half brothers. So its not that tight. Though there is other Inbreeding/linebreeding.


----------



## HankGSD (Oct 28, 2010)

Wow, this is all way over my head. 

I sure appreciate everyone's comments though! Keep 'em coming!


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

It is a 2-3 line breeding on Baron Trooper. I would hope he is a good dog, one of the only that has his hip rating listed. We do not have all the information here. There may be good reasons for this. 2-3 is considered acceptable in Germany to breed on. 

In Winifred Strickland's book, The German Shepherd Today, she claims that the sire of the sire, is the grandsire of the dam, is common type of breeding. 

I certainly would not worry about it. It looks like your dog is a showline dog, and they may not be as into the pedigree database as working lines tend to be, it can also be pet lines, and you have some German show line dogs back there, so it looks like an interesting mixture. 

We do not know why they chose to line breed closely on Baron. You might call the breeder and ask a little about that dog. If they know, it may be good information to have.


----------



## HankGSD (Oct 28, 2010)

Thanks, Selzer, I always find your posts very informative.

My pedigree from the AKC itself says Hank's sire was rated OFA25G and dam was rated OFA28E. If "G" means good then most all of his ancestors were rated good.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Good, it looks like. The full number would be a little longer, kind of like OFA2569M25GPI, where the 2569 is the number of the German Shepherd tested, the M would be male (or F for female), the 25 was the age in months, the G for Good, and the PI for Permanent Identification. I am doing that out of my head so and pulling the numbers out of the air, so I could have made a mistake. But I guess the pedigree just tells you the rating and how old the dog was in months. 

It sounds like the breeder is not really keeping up the pedigree database, and not all do. It is good that they are paying attention to hips. You can look the dogs themselves by their names up at Orthopedic Foundation for Animals, and see if they are doing elbows or anything else, though I think elbows would show up on the pedigree, I have not looked at one in a while. Usuallly the Pedigree would say OFA25G OFA25EL-normal or something like that. I can't remember. Losing brain power...


----------



## HankGSD (Oct 28, 2010)

I don't think the breeder did anything with the Pedigree Database; I think a few other owners of dogs from her lines put their dogs' information in, and I had to fill in most of the stuff for Hank's relatives from his AKC pedigree. Baron Trooper was already in the database, as was Maxamillion and I think Lady Tessa was already there, too. My breeder doesn't have a web site, do advertising, or anything by email. I guess she is busy focusing on the dogs! 

Thanks for the link to the OFA web site!


----------

