# My GSD is Annoying the Heck Outta Me



## Lady Badlands (Mar 31, 2009)

We adopted a 1.6 month old WGSD in January from a family that just couldn't deal with him. They had 5 other dogs, and they were afraid this guy would have killed their daughter's tiny Chihuahua because he plays rough and has huge paws. They only had him three weeks. He'd had two owners before that. 

She had no papers for him and didn't know anything about his vaccine history, etc. He's really a very sweet puppy, but he's 100 pounds and is just annoying as heck. Romeo is super jealous of my 5 year old Lab/Pointer mix, Juliette. If I pet her, he comes over and sticks his face in front of hers. And later, he'll play rough with her, chewing on her ears, which scares me. If she doesn't want to play, which is most of the time, he barks at her continuously.

I walk him for at least an hour every morning and I've been training him not to pull the leash. He's learned "sit" "stay" "halt" "down" "come." We can't let him off the leash on our farm because he runs away (he was neutered last month). He barks and runs toward neighbors cows, horses, cats. I have to keep him on a leash cuz if he runs away and then ends up attacking a farmer's livestock, they might shoot him. What a huge liability he is right now. I don't know if he'll attack the animals, but he pulled the leash out of my hand one day, almost ripped my shoulder off, and just tore at my friend's horse. Thank heaven he couldn't fit through the gate or we don't know what would have happened.

He's never been exposed to farm animals. I think he was an inside house dog or a backyard dog. He jumps on me and I'm working on that. But when I'm sitting, he takes his huge paw and thumps it down on me. I tell him "no" and push it off. He does it again and again and again and again. I have to get up and get loud. 

I've never had a male dog nor have I ever had a GSD. Can anyone help me figure out how to deal with this guy? I can't even leave to take a weekend class because I can't leave him at my friend's with the way he acts toward his farm animals. And this farmer will, in no way, walk him an hour every day. He's too busy. He loves dogs and loves to dog sit, but Romeo needs some intense training before I can leave him.

Help!


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## GranvilleGSD (Mar 28, 2007)

Looks like he was allowed to do whatever he pleased in his previous home. I'm sure somebody here can give you some good advice.

My advice, look for some local dog training classes, this will help him learn respect, and how to behave on a leash, and to come when called. It will also help to build the bond between you.


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## Ocean (May 3, 2004)

I'm sure you meant 16 mo., not 1.6 mo.
Try http://www.germanshepherddog.com/
This GSD needs more exercise, physical and mental activity and socialization w/farm animals. Also, an outdoor kennel or dog run w/running room.
There are all sorts of organized training activities for dogs like yours: agility, obedience, tracking, schutzhund. What you might end up with might depend more on where you live and what's available within driving distance.
Also, you need to learn how to play intense games w/your GSD using a toy or toys. Will he chase a toy and hold it in his mouth? If he can retrieve, you can play 2 kong games with him.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

gosh this guy has been bounced around ALOT already at his young age. i am no training expert (lots here tho, you've come to the right place), so only from a lifetime of experience with the german shepherd dog i'll just say...patience, consistency, firm limits. more patience. thank you very much for giving this boy some stability.


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## k9sarneko (Jan 31, 2007)

I sounds like this over grown baby ( and he is still a baby) is out of control due to absolutly no grounding over the first part of his life. He has no idea where his place is in life, in the pack and in a home. While you are doing well teaching the basic commands I would take him all the way back to the beginning and start to imprint him again in his place in the world. This will give him a level of security, increase the bond with you and make him more controlable.

Sounds good right, but I bet you are thinking "OK but how do I do that?" Well, here it goes.

1. establish a routine. Same thing every day. Up at the same time, walks, obed. training, feeding time.

2. Practice NILF. He gets nothing from you without giving you something. Sit to eat, to get leashed ect. You decide everything. When he gets lovings and when they stop, play time and when it stops. You take the control out of his paws, he doesn't really want it anyway. I always say with the GSD there can only be one pack leader, since he has never had a stable leader he has taken on that role. You need to calmly and firmly establish yourself in this role.

3. Lots and lots of exercise, tired dog = happy well behaved dog.

4. Get some professional help. Get someone who knows and has worked with german shepherds, I'm afraid he is not a petsmart case. 

5. Its going to be a tough few months with him but I think you will be happy with the results. Stay calm, stay consistant and stay patient.

Good luck, I hope this helps, and thank you for rescuing this baby and giving him a chance.


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## darga19 (Mar 4, 2009)

Great post Sharon!

Just a few things to add:

Even more than your lab, GSDs need a ton of exercise. Sounds like you've got a decent start with the 1 hr walk every day, but unfortunately he'll need more than that. Otherwise, as you've seen, he'll find other outlets like barking and chasing farm animals (although without proper socialization to the animals he'll probably chase them anyway







)

Good start by teaching him basic commands, but as others have said, he'll need to get enrolled in a good obedience school to learn better behavior. Sounds to me like he hasn't really had many rules or boundaries in the past. Also, more-so than your lab, GSDs need solid, consistent, and fair leadership. Otherwise you'll continue to have a bit of a problem on your hands.

An outdoor kennel is a good idea, but for inside the house, if you haven't already, I'd recommend getting a crate and beginning crate training. Here's an article with some details just in case you aren't familiar or haven't used one in the past:

http://www.hsus.org/pets/pet_care/our_pe...e_training.html

As far as his paw on you you were mentioning, you really need to establish yourself as the leader in the relationship with Romeo. Once you do that, he'll be more respectful. Just remember to stay calm. Standing tall is good, but I'd try to refrain from "getting loud" as that may just enhance his excitement. He's probably looking for a reaction out of you.

Be very patient and consistent. Structured exercise and mental activities. Firm and fair leadership. It may take a little while but stick with it and you'll have yourself a great companion. Good luck!


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## Martie (Jun 3, 2008)

Great post, Sharon!

Our Otto was like this - and worse. We adopted him from our local shelter where they said he was picked up as a stray with a pack of dogs in another state and transported here. 

He would do "fly-by's", snapping in our faces, body slamming, uncontrollable "zooming" in the house, mouthing/nipping, feet on us, jumping on us - it was AWFUL! We had never dealt with a dog like this before. Yelling only escalated the behaviors.

No one seemed to be able to help us (we were not on this list then). People said he was aggressive, dominant or just plain crazy.

After much reading, discussion about our commitment, and lots of scary times, we went to work on providing LOTS of exercise, trained him in basic obedience and instituted strict NILIF. We saw glimmers of hope very quickly and things improved steadily over a few months' time.

As the madness subsided, we learned he was exactly as you described, Sharon. He needed structure and to understand how to communicate with us. Along with training him, we trained ourselves to think first of what we wanted him to do instead of what he was currently doing. Telling him "No" - or "Cut it out" meant nothing to him and increased his insecurity.

He's a great dog today - smart as a whip - very high-energy - and a really loving, loyal companion. With just a little work, consistency and patience, your dog will get there, too, Lady Badlands! There is so much training experience on this list to help along the way.

Thank you for giving him a home and a chance to fit in and be a great family member.


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## Lady Badlands (Mar 31, 2009)

Wow, I'm overwhelmed with emotion at the generosity of all of you. I can't thank you enough for caring and for sharing your knowledge with me. Today it is terribly windy and snowy and this is the first day I don't want to go outside. I'll have to figure out what to do with Romeo today exercise-wise. He's whining a bit now and I know he'll need to do his toileting soon. Brrrrr!

I'd love to know how to play with Romeo. What kind of games will engage him? I know he's really smart and I feel like such a dummy trying to figure out how to play with him. I have a kong, but I haven't gotten my healthy treats delivered yet. I'm very hesitant to use peanut butter and other types of foods as kong treats. He's on a pretty strict BARF and B+ food diet. He had some kind of drippy infection, bad breath, and yellow stained teeth when I got him. He also drank out of the toilet, so I know that at least one of his owners gave him water this way. Yuck!

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide about mind-engaging games. BTW, he's 16 months, not 1.6 months--LOL! Sorry!

Blessings!


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

Hide n seek is a great indoor game to play (during the rainfest here we played this like crazy with Anna). DH would hide, I'd tell Anna "go find daddy!" and off she'd go! You can also do this by hiding toys or treats like chicken or food. 

Work on some new tricks, something just for fun, like shake, high five (or touch), going in a circle, going through you're legs (if you're tall enough!







), etc.

We play fetch with a squeaky ball in the house, that's fun if you have the room. This would probably also be a good time to work on the "leave it" command...a true godsend and IMHO the most valuable command you can teach. 

Anna loves to play, but usually after doing some training she's zonked! It wears her little brain out!


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## Lady Badlands (Mar 31, 2009)

Thank you. That is great advice about games. Could I ask you a question about how to play those games when you have another dog? Every time I start to play fetch with Romeo in the house, Juliette comes and wants to play. And I find that it just really gets in the way. If I leave her upstairs with the door closed, I think I'm doing some kind of emotional damage to her. She's been our dog for almost 5 years and in comes this gigantic bear of a dog, wild thing that he is, takes over her space, her "parents", everything. Romeo was probably not the best dog to rescue considering his energy level and hers (she's low maintenance to the extreme). But, I love this guy, too!

Thanks!


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## GSDBESTK9 (Mar 26, 2002)

When I want to play or do obedience with one of my dogs, I put the other ones away. Either in their crates or I put them in their "bedroom" with a bone and close the door.


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## Northof60 (Feb 15, 2009)

I would fuss the other dog and play with her a lot too. That way she won't feel left out. Just do it separately at the moment.
Just my gut reaction. I am no expert.


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

I guess I've lucked out cause Duncan just kinda lays there and watches, sometimes he'll get up and play too, but he's never been a ball drive/fetch kinda dog. 

Last night he just laid next to me so I could pet him and throw the ball for Anna. He was in hog heaven!


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## Lady Badlands (Mar 31, 2009)

Wow, this has been such an overwhelming experience. Nothing like my 5 year old mutt. I guess you could call GSD's high maintenance? Well, least mine. Thanks!


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

High maintenance for the first few years. They're so smart and natural born manager dogs. If they aren't trained right as little pups, they'll try to manage your life. Not that you can't fix it. Lots of school for this bad boy!


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## Mary Jane (Mar 3, 2006)

Hi, 

just a tiny remark


> Originally Posted By: Lady Badlands But when I'm sitting, he takes his huge paw and thumps it down on me. I tell him "no" and push it off. He does it again and again and again and again. I have to get up and get loud.


Your big puppy thinks that you're playing with him. He paws and you respond-it's great fun. To stop this, turn your body away from him and ignore him, or quietly get up and walk away. (At least for a while) you have to be the one to initiate and terminate play.

It's nice that he wants to play.

MJ


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## Lady Badlands (Mar 31, 2009)

That's great information, MJ. I'd been under the impression that the paw was a dominance sort of move. It's changed alot for me now knowing that he wants to play. And that I have the choice as to whether or not I want to play at that moment. 

Thanks for the tips. They are really helpful.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

Yeah, you've entered a whole new world -- and welcome to it









Do spend separate time with both dogs. Work on making one sit while you pet the other. If it's really difficult, use the crate. What your boy needs to learn is that you decide how the attention is doled out and when. It's not his decision. I actually also use the back yard this way, since mine are indoor dogs. I control who is in the yard and when. Because mine don't play nice with each other, rarely are they in the backyard together unsupervised.

So, what you are calling jealousy, you might also interpret as control. Romeo is trying to control who gets what affection when. He needs to learn that he is not in charge of that. Be careful what labels you put on it. Thinking of it as jealousy will elicit a different response from you, than if you thought of it as control. It might be a fine line, but in determining how to train Romeo, think structure and leadership.




> Originally Posted By: Lady BadlandsIf I pet her, he comes over and sticks his face in front of hers. And later, he'll play rough with her, chewing on her ears, which scares me. If she doesn't want to play, which is most of the time, he barks at her continuously.


When he gets rough, tell him to stop the behaviour that you don't like. I do that with mine, since my other dog is 33 pounds. When they play too hard, I say enough, and send them both to lay down. If one dog is _clearly _harrassing the other, I tell that dog enough and make her leave him (it's usually the little dog in our case that barks at the GSD).



> Quote: He barks and runs toward neighbors cows, horses, cats. I have to keep him on a leash cuz if he runs away and then ends up attacking a farmer's livestock, they might shoot him. What a huge liability he is right now. I don't know if he'll attack the animals....


You probably won't be able to work with him around the animals until you get some control in the house and around Juliette. But if you can walk at a distance, and slowly start getting him accustomed to the sights and smells of the animals at a distance, that is a start. That will take awhile.



> Quote: He jumps on me and I'm working on that. But when I'm sitting, he takes his huge paw and thumps it down on me. I tell him "no" and push it off. He does it again and again and again and again. I have to get up and get loud.


I think it was mentioned above, for the jumping, turn your back towards him, or walk into him and invade his space. The back thing usually works better. 

As for the paw, I've found they respond better if you tell them what you want them to do, rather than what you don't want them to do. I use "no" very rarely. Enough, leave it, watch me, etc., are all more specific commands. What do you want him to do? No, then tell him to go play with his ball (hide a ball in a blanket and tell him to go find it?), or go lay down in his place, or whatever you want him to be doing instead of slapping his paw in your lab.

ETA: great point about the paw and wanting to play, and how it's often misrepresented as a "dominance" thing. That's because many folks say that if you do what the dog wants, then the dog is being dominant. As long as you make the decision when to end the game, and you stick with that decision, you're in good shape.

Particularly having a GSD, you will hear a lot about "dominance" and you have to be the leader, show you are in charge, etc. Be careful how you interpret that. It's not a battle of egos, but it is about structure and firm and fair leadership.


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## Lady Badlands (Mar 31, 2009)

Wow, Lisa, thank you so much. I can't tell you how helpful this is. Things that stand out for me, from what you wrote, is that my two may never really become good buddies and the difference between jealousy and control. I never thought about it that way. Very helpful. Also, appreciate the comments on the farm animals. I need to get control here in the house first. I do walk him past those animals almost every day to get him used to them. He's getting better but has a ways to go.

I like your idea of telling him what I want him to do instead of just a "No" when he puts his paw in my lap. 

One thing that comes to mind while I'm trying to recap (and I'm going to go back and read the post again and again) is that when I'm petting Juliette and Romeo comes running over, he stands between me and Juliette. He's so big and she's on the other side of him. Right there at that moment, I don't know what to do to rectify the situation. I should be able to pet her when I want and not be afraid of his intervention. Any suggestions?

Thanks a million.


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## Ocean (May 3, 2004)

Lady Badland, I think you're going to be a wonderful owner of the best breed in the world - the GSD! Yes, they are high maintenance and not for casual dog owners, but they give back a hundredfold.
The basic idea to exercise GSDs both mentally and physically is don't try to make it too easy for them. Its like asking someone with a PhD to do basic arithmetic.
Even just eating, if they have to work for it, that helps. So you are now in the beginning of training him. Food is of course a good training reward. Then when you actually feed, instead of a simple bowl put the food in a hard container that he'll have to roll around to get the food out, etc. Kongs work well here too.
Even the highest drive dog can get enough exercise if the dog retrieves. You can make up all sorts of retrieve games that's only limited by your imagination.
Him preventing you from petting your old dog is not good. He's trying to control your movement. Basic thing about dog social hierarchy:the dominant one controls movement.
If you are strong enough, simply push him out of the way gently. Most dogs will get out of the way if you firmly nudge them with your knee. (For really reluctant ones, stepping on their feet works for sure.) Make this a regular practice, for example if he is sitting or lying down across your path, make him get up and move out of your way. Its your way of sending him signals that the canine world understands, who is the boss.
In people communication, it might be rude but not in dog language. It simply says in dog language, "I'm your boss, and you get out of my way every time I'm moving around." Its not mean at all.
Some dogs are naturally submissive and don't need this conversation, but other dogs need to have the conversation.


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## phgsd (Jun 6, 2004)

I would teach Romeo a "place" command so you can send him away when he gets in your space like that. I have beds in the corners of the rooms we spend the most times in and when a dog is driving me nuts I will point to the bed and tell them "Go." Some people use the command "Place" but it doesn't matter what word you use.

If I push one of mine away she just comes back harder  Depends on the dog. But the place command always works very well for getting a dog out of your face.


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## Ocean (May 3, 2004)

Since Ladybadlands is new with the dog, I suggest she make the dog move out of her way and see how the dog reacts. Ideally, the dog simply moves out of the way. 90% of the issue with dogs like these is just an owner who acts very confident and doesn't doubt herself. People who are not that authoritative in their communication style with people sometimes need to become more authoritative with strong dogs.
Teaching a place command is redirecting the behavior and if a dog responds to that, that w/d be preferable than getting into a fight with a dog who simply refuses to budge or growls when forced to do so. That's not happened in this case. However, if it gets to that point, the owner is facing a very basic "who'll be the boss" question which requires a good trainer present to go over the issues and not something I w/d recommend fixing over the Internet.


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## LisaT (Feb 7, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: Lady Badlands...One thing that comes to mind while I'm trying to recap (and I'm going to go back and read the post again and again) is that when I'm petting Juliette and Romeo comes running over, he stands between me and Juliette. He's so big and she's on the other side of him. Right there at that moment, I don't know what to do to rectify the situation. I should be able to pet her when I want and not be afraid of his intervention. Any suggestions?


I'm glad I could help









That long body is tough to deal with sometimes!!! There are several options, mentioned above,...

Teach him to go to a place while you pet her, or give him a "down" on the spot and make him lay down while you pet her, or similarly a sit. Teach him the word "back up", etc.

While he's learning those things, you might have to use a body block -- stand up and just place yourself between him and Juliette, backing up into him, facing her, probably using your leg to back him up. Pet her, and when you are done, turn to him with a brief pet and a "good boy", and then leave him alone. Be aware though that this is not a push or shove -- you are pretending he isn't there, because that is your space, and it is a nudge (okay, maybe a firm nudge).

The "body block" is dog talk and you are essentially doing to him what he is trying to do, take control of the space. It's an incredibly effective tool in a number of situations, particularly when he gets real pushy.


ETA: Most likely, eventually, the dogs will become bonded. Maybe not "best friends", but bonded pack members. Both of mine would be fine being solo dogs, and at first they tolerated the other with a few rough spots, and now they really are bonded and want to be together. The toughest part is when they teach each other bad habits


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## roxy84 (Jun 23, 2007)

nothing more to add except thanks for giving Romeo some stability in his life. i think that will go a long way in itself in addition to all the great advice you've been give. he has been bounced around alot in his short life. it doesnt sound like any problems that cant be managed by you. him getting a little older wont hurt either. at 16 months, he definitely still has some puppy left in him.

btw, romeo looks gorgeous. can we see some pictures


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