# Yeast/Anti-Itch Diet



## gibby913 (Dec 21, 2013)

Hi folks,

I've got a two year old Christmas baby GSD with severe allergies that have been confirmed by blood tests. He is currently on allergy shots to help with his external allergies like grass and certain trees.

I've modified his diet with Purina One Beyond to avoid wheat, corn, peas, potatoes and pretty much all starches (tests confirm he's allergic to almost all of them). In addition he is allergic to pork.

He also is suffering from a chronic yeast issue that leaves him very itchy and with black scaley hairless skin (from itching I suppose).

I've been suggested by many two switch him to a raw food diet but I'm weary for fear of malnutrition and possible salmonella poisoning (vet advised against it do to salmonella and other possible illnesses related to raw feeding). They suggested cooking the meats first but not including bones (after cooking they splinter)

I'm looking for some serious guidance here. Im looking to help my pride and joy Panzer get better and lead a full happy life. If raw food diet is the ticket I'm all for it. With my dog being sick as he is with this chronic yeast/itchy skin problem, how should I start him off?

Can someone provide a list of what Raw Meaty Bones are considered for each source of protein (i.e. chicken, beef, etc.) I'd like the same detailed list for muscle meat and the last category as well please.

Should I use supplements to help prevent malnourishment from a raw meat diet?

My GSD weighs about 70 pounds give or take 5 pounds, is 2 years old, and due to this skin condition he isn't very active right now.....(He has no hair on roughly 40% of his body maybe more and its been below 20 degrees here for well over a few months......) The best I can do so he doesn't get sick is throw the ball with him for an hour or so in the house but there isn't that much room for him to really run and be truly active. I suppose it's more for his spirits if anything else.......Please help! My GSD looks like he's miserable!!!!

Thanks guys for all your help.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

This isn't responsive to your question exactly but...

Are you supplementing with organic, unrefined coconut oil? (Good antifungal supplement that reportedly helps with yeast.)

Are you regularly using an antifungal/antibacterial shampoo like Ketachlor (ketoconazole and chlorhexidine 2.3%)? 

My vet told me Ketachlor baths are step one in battling nasty yeast on the skin of foster dogs -- we have to bathe at least once a week, and with some dogs twice a week, in this medicated shampoo, but it does work--slowly. It relieves the itching almost immediately and improves the smell immediately too! After a few weeks, the pink skin emerges and you see less and less black. The hair regrows too. You have to keep on it though. 

Here it is (note that a prescription from your vet is required):
Ketochlor Shampoo Rx

There are a few other brands with similar products but you want to look for both of these active ingredients.

Here it is:
Ketochlor Shampoo Rx


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

there is a lot of advice for the chronic fungus problem already in the OPs other thread http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/health-issues/384578-severe-itchiness-baffles-vet.html

why did this baffle the vets though?

anyway -- raw food is an excellent choice . 
you are going to have to give this dog a good source of probiotics , the higher the bacterial strains the better . This will displace the bad and replace a good gut colony of beneficial bacteria . Takes time . 
Digestive enzymes and probiotics together can help heal leaky gut .

Adding Olive leaf powder is an excellent anti fungal . 

as said in the other thread , this is going to be a detox situation . Help the liver , nettles or milk thistle . Lots of good clean water - no chlorine or fluoride . The dog may look worse in his detox period . The dog may have loose stools , urinate more , have gas , and appear fatigued . The coat will be shed so will look shabby , skin will be renewed .
If the Herxheimer's is too much , take a day off , or cut back . The system is overburdened with the die-off -- period also known as the healing crisis. 
Spirulina and Chlorella help with the detox - chelation 
Topically quality coconut oil and even with a drop of lavender or oregano , both being anti fungal , is soothing . Vetericyn combats external fungus and bacteria , and is soothing , while contributing to new skin regeneration.


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## gibby913 (Dec 21, 2013)

I only mentioned the skin issue because the person who told me I should make a thread in here to change diets, said to specify the skin issue so I wouldn't be told to give them yogurt and such.

Where and what should I get for probiotics and how much should I give him? Ive been using unrefined coconut oil (really hard almost like wax) to rub on his skin....Is this okay? And where do I get all of the other items? Are they purchased through the vet?


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

coconut oil is like butter -- warm it up just a little and you will have liquid 
the skin issue is pretty central to the problem . That is your symptom. Disbiosis is your cause. What is being recommended is your solution. 
nothing wrong with yogurt if it is plain , no sugar of any sort , preferably whole 3.25 % not the zero % . Fat is needed to take benefit of calcium . Generally yogurt is not a strong factor for probiotics . KEFIR is much better . 
Another important additive is MSM , an organic sulfur , which regulates the pH , is a natural pain killer , helps new skin and hair production, helps with detox and other benefits.

vet (especially one who was baffled) won't have these -- go to the health food store , check out Dogs Naturally Magazine which has many good articles and products in the on line shop Dogs Naturally Magazine


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## kbella999 (Jan 6, 2012)

I just changed to a different probiotic and this one seems to make a huge difference. It is called Proviable-DC. Changing to a raw diet would be beneficial to your dog even if he didn't have skin issues. Vets always use the scare tactics of you getting samonella. Just make sure you wash your hands afterwards. I use vinegar water to clean my counters. The only people I've heard of getting samonella from dog food are the ones that feed kibble. Good luck and I hope your pup gets better. Here is a link to the Proviable-DC Amazon.com: Proviable DC for Cats and Dogs, 80 Capsules: Pet Supplies


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/show-me-pictures/228834-show-me-your-dogs-dinner-4.html
^^^Lots of RAW dog food pics on here (some kibble w/toppings, but ignore those)

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/show-me-pictures/197501-show-me-those-vicious-raw-fed-dogs.html
^^^Laurie and the Gang started this thread (again for visual and variety), you can click on her link to get to RAW dog ranch for ratio's

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/health-issues/191277-help-us-please-skin-yeast.html
^^^ This is a member (Nyx) who came here, like you, with same issue, massive hair loss, blackened skin (also on the hamster wheel of conventional treatment) and at a loss as to what to do...

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...-raw-barf-update-testimonial.html#post3887210
^^^This is their updated thread...I believe it was 3 months later


This can be resolved. Hang in.

Oh, and the reason for no yogurt is it is a milk product, lactic acid is a sugar...at this time and with 40% hair loss...cold turkey (like quitting smoking) from carbs to battle a systemic yeast condition.

This includes treats too BTW.


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

*gibby913:* I am sorry that Panzer is having such a hard time with allergies. My first GSD had severe allergies and now Nikki has them too so I know how frustrating this is.

Your vet is right to be concerned about bacteria in raw meat (see attached file). 

http://www.tufts.edu/vet/nutrition/resources/raw_meat_diets.pdf

If you are determined to feed a raw diet there are ways to make sure the diet is balanced. Monica Segal formulates all my diets and I believe she has a chapter in her book "K9 Kitchen" that walks you through the steps on how to balance a diet but you might want to double check on that.

The Allergy Problem

You could try a dehydrated food like "The Honest Kitchen" if he can tolerate the ingredients since these diets are balanced. I think only one of their formulas requires the addition of meat.

Is Panzer being treated by a dermatologist or by your primary vet? Here are some articles that you might find interesting:

Food Allergy | Dermatology for Animals - Part 1

Good luck :hug:


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## Momto2GSDs (Mar 22, 2012)

Yes, please go raw!

Something else to consider:
What about thyroid issues concerning yeast?

*From Vet Pet Health: *"*Thyroid hormone is also involved in skin and coat health. *Hypothyroid dogs will often lose hair on their bellies, the backs of their legs, and on their sides. They are not itchy, but the hair just doesn't grow properly leading to thin coated or even bald areas. Their skin is often thicker than normal, and sometimes darkened, as a result of the hypothyroidism. These dogs have *more problems controlling skin yeast organisms*, which are a natural part of a dog's skin flora. They will have more problems with a greasy and often stinky coat/skin, and sometimes will develop full blown skin and ear yeast infections."
*
*
*From the Dane Lady*: "It is my opinion, after working with hundreds of cases over many years, that when we are trying to re-balance the system and reduce the yeast/fungus levels in the gut, we have a much higher success rate when the thyroid is working properly. Now the problem is that yeast die-off, known as mycotoxins, actually can destroy the thyroid gland, which is the master lock to the whole glandular system (endocrine system). This is why having an current and accurate thyroid test done *is critical* to a successful re-balancing of the yeast overgrowth in the digestive tract. 
Most veterinarians do not do a complete thyroid panel (*5 panel test*), nor do they know how to recognize a low normal test. I feel it is of utmost importance that you get a thyroid test analyzed by Dr. Jean Dodds at www.hemopet.com. I feel so strongly about this that I often will not do a consultation until pet owners have this thyroid test done before our consultation. Go to hemopet.com and click on services. You will note Dr. Dodds has 4 sections with instructions and forms for you to print out and take to your vet. Your vet will draw the blood and mail it to her laboratory and she will send you the accurate results. *She does a complete Thyroid Antibody Panel which includes T4, Free T4, T3, Free T# and a TGAA (thyroglobulin autoantibody) test. *
I really don't recommend going by your vets blood test. But if you have already gone to your own vet and they have run a T-3 and T-4 - look at the numbers, if they are in the middle (50%) range, it is considered low for the giant breeds and you must treat with thyroid meds. You must insist on it. In fact, if your dog is a large/giant breed and it comes back in the middle range say 1-10 and it reads a 5 on your dog, it means it needs to be treated with meds. Ideally a large/giant breed needs to be _above _the 50% range and on small active dogs it needs to be even higher than that - say on 1-10 range it would need to be a 7-8!"

This is what it says at Dr. Dodd's website:
_"HEMOLIFE, provides the most comprehensive diagnostic profiles for detecting and interpreting autoimmune thyroiditis and hypothyroidism, with our specialized reference ranges. We use novel, 'green' non-RIA technology never offered before in veterinary medicine (patent pending). The Thyroid Antibody Panel (Thyroid 5™) is comprised of T4, Free T4, T3, Free T3 and TGAA. No other diagnostic laboratory offers this technology or provides clients with the detail, personal assessment, and recommendations offered by Dr. Dodds and her staff."_


If this were my baby, I'd insist that your vet send the blood work to Dr. Dodds (not a lab) for this specific test! "Thyroid Profile 5 or 5 PLUS" is $160.00 at Hemopet. Hemopet 
Hemopet Hemolife Thyroid Testing
https://my.imatrixbase.com/clients/14145/documents/Hemolife_Literature/FAQs_Thyroid_Diag_Rx.pdf
https://my.imatrixbase.com/clients/...hyroid_Disease_and_Autoimmune_Thyroiditis.pdf
Hemopet Hemolife Diagnostics T4:FT4 Ratio

Moms


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Some info for you to read

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/health-issues/203826-candida-yeast-overgrowth.html

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...lly-itchy-pets-immunoglobulin-deficiency.html


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

Carmen explains it on her website (if you click on carmspack in her signature line and go to her site, drop down list of nutraceuticals she produces...Sundae Sunday has this paragraph below...)

*70% of immune health resides in the digestive system*. Improper digestion and nutrient malabsorption allows large undigested protein molecules to escape into the blood stream where they are perceived as hostile invaders. *The immune system responds on alert with a defensive attack mode. This creates histamines and an inflammatory response which we lump under “allergies”.* The entire immune system is involved
though. *The pancreas is taxed, the adrenals are exhausted, the thyroid is depleted*, joints get inflamed, the bowel becomes irritated, and there is a systemic problem with pathogenic bacteria and fungus getting out of balance and causing further physical damage. This is aging and may lead to greater problems, including cancer.

Now if you factor treating not just the skin, but the endocrine system (pancreas, adrenals, thyroid - kidneys are also involved, insulin regulation - pancreas)...It has to start with the digestive system and what goes in it...

Honest kitchen is NOT a food for your dog at this time it contains vegetables that are high in carbohydrates (sweet potato, apples etc.) Although it does have many good nutrients (organic kelp, alfalfa - I think)...

K.I.S.S. ~ Keep It Simple Silly
Monica Segal may be helpful if your dog has kidney disease or pancreatitis as these diets require modifications in proteins and fats...but there is a BIG price tag attached to here advice.

Read Nyx threads. And Search Laurie's sight.

Also, don't get caught up in the RAW is dangerous...Think about dogs burying a bone only to dig it up at a much later date, or high priced steak that has been "aged" for __ amount of days - for human consumption!

If really, really concerned...toss the food in a drizzle of ACV...this will kill off bacteria. However, the dogs gut is more acidic then ours - designed to eat RAW, the stomach acids will kill of that scary bacteria.

I have forgot to refrigerate my dogs food...I take out next days food in AM to thaw on counter all day...when thawed I put in fridge overnight and remove an hr. before feeding to bring to room temp. Sometimes I forget to put back in the fridge...so it has sat out for 24hrs. (just to be clear I am not suggesting this is o.k - just that it has happened)...no problems. The difference between human and animal (carnivore)


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

yogurt is a milk product , but, the very act of fermentation changes the "sugars" into lactate . The sugars are consumed by the bacteria.
Yogurt in its making uses lactobacillus acidophilus --- a probiotic which inhibits fungal growth . This found as a major ingredient in probiotic formulae. 
Having the sugars converted allows many lactose intolerant people to enjoy plain , greek/Balkan yogurt. 
All my dogs get goat milk whey and they dive into it -- especially good in hot summer months .

of course yogurt is not essential but I do think there are benefits , as long as you have plain , natural , no sweetener of any kind 

kefir is also a "milk" by product , fermented , and this is very healthful
the problem can be resolved


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

*gibby913: *One thing you have to remember is that the majority of advise given over the internet/forums comes from people that have absolutely *NO* veterinary/medical background. 

Lots of misinformation just gets repeated over and over until people are convinced it is true. Just because they read it in some magazine or someone's website doesn't mean it's correct. 

Anyway, I hope you get it all figured out and that your boy gets better real soon.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

apples - interesting -- organic apple peel - source of phenolic acids , which are anti microbial , anti fungal, anti inflammatory. Working on something that will include organic apple peel as an ingredient!


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

Interesting article on yeast and food allergies:

Yeast Overgrowth in Dogs


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

OP - as was stated above...NONE of us are medical personnel.

I can only attest to doing a Candida detox and the result I personally had with skin issues. Also, there are probiotics specific to skin health.

While I always think you should have a vet diagnose, I also have had good success with SOME natural remedies. Candida being one of them.  It's just something to look at and research on your own.


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## GatorBytes (Jul 16, 2012)

Heidigsd said:


> *gibby913: *One thing you have to remember is that *the majority of advise given over the internet/forums comes from people that have absolutely NO veterinary/medical background.
> *
> Lots of misinformation just gets repeated over and over until people are convinced it is true. Just because they read it in some magazine or someone's website doesn't mean it's correct.





Heidigsd said:


> Interesting article on yeast and food allergies:
> 
> Yeast Overgrowth in Dogs


 Veterinary/medical is what got this dog in the condition it is in in the first place.
Written word by those who have experienced success where conventional medicine has failed needs no degree and speaks volumes for what diet change can AND will do.

Medicine is sick care
Food is health care


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Heidi you would be surprised at how many dogs with yeast and skin problems do not get help through conventional veterinary treatment .


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

in addition , Heidi , there are branches of veterinary which are not the traditional or convenitional but are holistic which use biological medicine, treating each as a unique individual , trying to resolve a problem by getting to the root cause , and not just as a symptom or a disease.
Best solution is integrative - using the wisdom of each where appropriate . 
Western medicine is unparalleled when it comes to diagnosis and immediate or acute care, surgery . 

Alternative medicine --- . Disease prevention is a benefit .


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

carmspack said:


> in addition , Heidi , there are branches of veterinary which are not the traditional or convenitional but are holistic which use biological medicine, treating each as a unique individual , trying to resolve a problem by getting to the root cause , and not just as a symptom or a disease.
> Best solution is integrative - using the wisdom of each where appropriate .
> Western medicine is unparalleled when it comes to diagnosis and immediate or acute care, surgery .
> 
> Alternative medicine --- . Disease prevention is a benefit .



I am quite aware of holistic veterinarians but thanks for pointing it out. 

The first so called "holistic vet" I was introduced to almost killed my first GSD with her nonsense. People have to decide what's best for their animals and go from there. 

I wish the OP lots of success with whatever she decides to do


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## cci058 (Nov 18, 2011)

I went to He!! and back with our furbaby and so called "allergies." l was at my wits end. Lets just say, I agree 100% with GatorBytes and Carmspack. Conventional medicine did NOTHING for our dog, just made her worse. I did my own research, started raw and after 3 patient months, our GSD turned into the vibrant, healthy and happy pup she was meant to be. Raw changed and SAVED her life. BEST decision we EVER made and we will never go back. no issues since we started raw and its been 2 years. The info Moms provided is also VERY helpful and those same articles got me started on my research. I highly recommend then. Healing for your pup is going to have to start from the inside, in the gut. best of Luck to you!!


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

Apple cider vinegar is supposed to be good for yeast infections and itchy skin. You can put some in a spray bottle. Spray a little on your dog and see if it helps. I don't see where it would hurt. If he has any broken skin, you can mix the ACV with water first.


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## rainy5 (Mar 25, 2013)

I am new here but I myself and my brother both have celiacs and we had a yeast overgrowth. His was so bad he couldn't have a bowel resection. They had ran out of antibiotics and every time he went off the last one the infection outside his bowel would get to bad to operate. I gave him some local wildflower honey and makuna honey and he took organic garlic chopped up everyday. He started it for three days before he stopped the antibiotic and for two week and made it to a surgery date finally and had it resectioned and is doing fantastic. His doctors at the hospital said they couldn't believe it worked. The garlic kills the yeast overgrowth and the honey is antifugal and antibacterial. I used the honey for my dog when she had coccidia. I didn't give her garlic cause I have read you shouldn't. Here is what I found for our dog that and us that was key gluten free no gmo's. I believe the over use of antibiotics in our foods or in the animals like beef chicken etc. hormones and antibiotics then they are killed and used in the dog food and our food. Once I went gluten free and organic and non gmo after a year. No more yeasts issues. also no milk. Only kefir yogert. I was so sick. Once I went gluten free it stopped. I saw doctors at hup, jefferson, temple. finally I found one that had these ideas and organic and non gmo gluten free is the way to go to get rid of yeast. It is the same for dogs I buy our dog non gmo gluten free food and her yeast with kefir yogert and blueberries etc. A 1/4 teaspoon food grade de for the coccidia and coccidia was gone. yeast took a few month of gluten free gmo free kefir and cranberries power and honey. I had to boost her immune system. Your gut and a dogs gut is your health. They are doing fecal bacteria replacement for some people cause cipro will wipe out all good bacteria and bad from birth. It is bad stuff. Antibitotics are used to much by vets and in animals we use for feed for dogs and us. Basically go as healthy and organic non gmo as you can for you and your dogs. If you need to go gluten free for the dog. It helped ours. I know dogs are different than humans. HtH I agree carmspack is right the other supplement recommendations I didn't know I could use for the dog safely. They do work on adults and be careful of the yeast die off to fast.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

rainy5 you may be interested in a book by Brenda Watson - Gut Solution Gut Solutions: Natural Solutions to Your Digestive Problems: Brenda Watson, Leonard Smith, Stephen Holt, Susan Stockton: 9780971930926: Amazon.com: Books

coconut flour has several healthful benefits -- anti fungal being one of them 

are you aware of Usnea?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

RE: manuka honey.

directly from the leading researcher on the affects of manuka honey regarding taking for internal issues...he said the concentration by the time it got to the gut would be so low that it would have no affect to treat internal bacteria.

I think the email is on my work computer and will look for it later.

It will work if it is UMF16 or higher when used topically. The infectious disease specialist recommended it for my daughter for MRSA. She said she has seen it do amazing things that western meds won't touch.


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## rainy5 (Mar 25, 2013)

Yes, thank you I am aware of coconut flour and sugar and we use it when we make homemade gluten free pizza dn bread for my family. Thank god I no longer have trouble. I will look into the book. Thank you carmspack. I love to read and learn anything I can. Always reading and trying to learn new things. We use the higher numbers in the makuna honey. When we use it. It works great for mrsain hospitals. My husband is a medic and he had a patient with it in her bones. They took her to a inner city teaching hospital here in center city Pa. I use the makuna sparely because I don't want a resistance to it if we need it really bad. I don't know if you can get one or not. I am not aware of usnea? I google it. I will read more about it. I love using natural first. 

My son is six and has never been on antibiotics and he had his first cold this year. I breast fed him and then he went onto organic veggies for two years then we added organic meat. Not alot just for protein. The exception of his celiacs from my family history. He has been nothing but healthy. The peditrician is amazed. He has never had a kid never on an antibiotic at six. He is a chop peditrician. All my older kids had more than one by his age. I was determined to make a change for the better. It worked.


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## Nyx (Sep 25, 2012)

Gibby and Panzer,

I have posted to you previously in your other thread. 

I understand that you want to do the VERY best for your Panzer and that you have exhausted every treatment option the Vet has given you. 

And I know that the Veterinarian and Vet Techs are trained professionals.

But they have no idea what the process for making commercial kibble is. (Does any one truly?)

And I can't say that the commercial kibble is sub standard or processed too much for real dietary needs of canines.

But I can attest to the change in my dog. So can my Vet.

I can tell you what I fed my dog and I can tell you exactly what my dog suffered.

And I can tell you what I tried. And I can tell you what I changed.

And I can tell you how Dante is now.

Even show you a picture, but, not having the past images does not help you.

I can tell you I am not promoting any products, brand name, vet or any supplement.

I just wanted my dog to be healthy and happy.

And Now I want to help any one who has a dog suffering similar symptoms.

GatorBytes, Carmen and Mom helped me so much. I have to give them much gratitude for my Dante, because he has never met them but his health has greatly improved by my knowing them(through this site).


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Gibby,

I have no veterinary or medical background. What I DO have is 15+ years of experience feeding a raw diet to my dogs.

I've fed over 2 TONS (that's 4 THOUSAND POUNDS) of raw meat and bones to my dogs. Dogs that ranged in age from 4 weeks to 15 years.

I've fed pregnant bitches and I have weaned 4 litters of puppies (Chinese Cresteds) directly to raw - never tasted kibble. I just finished raising a foster puppy (Pit bull) - bottle fed from Day 3 and then weaned to raw.

I even fed raw while I was going through Chemotherapy for Breast Cancer. My husband took over the actual handling of the raw meat when my blood count would get too low but otherwise I still handled the dogs every day.

My dogs, nor myself or my husband, have EVER gotten sick from the meats my dogs eat. And I don't always feed "fresh" meats - sometimes something sits out a little too long but I don't care ... nor do the dogs.

So, 15+ years and four THOUSAND pounds of raw meat handled ... if Salmonella was such a great risk we would have encountered it by now (statistically speaking).

Also, I have raised Mauser (5 yr old GSD) and Kaynya (6 yr old Chinese Crested) on raw since 8 weeks of age. Spike, Fuego, Clark, Wasabi and Puppa-T (all Chinese Cresteds) have been raw fed since birth (weaned directly to raw). Winnie, our Corgi mix, was switched to raw when she was about a year old. She's coming up on 16 years now.

Neke, Tessa, Remi, Riggs and Tazer were all switched early in their lives. They all lived into double digits.

Feeding a nutritionally sound raw diet is not difficult. It's no harder than feeding yourself or a child. There's 3 basic food groups - Raw Meaty Bones, Muscle Meat and Organ Meat. Feed a variety of protein sources, throw in a basic dog multi-viatmin if you are really worried and you are done!


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## Nyx (Sep 25, 2012)

And Laurie too. 


Well what they offered me in help, and if they are that considerate for a dog they don't know... I think that makes them great folks in general.


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