# To neuter or NOT to neuter!?



## bob_barker (Dec 31, 2013)

We have made our decision on whether we are going to neuter Bob Barker or not. 

BUT I want to hear everyone's reasoning why they think you should.... Or should not neuter. 



And we have decided to opt out of the neuter and deal with the headache when the girls come in heat. 

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## LoveEcho (Mar 4, 2011)

I'm fairly sure this discussion is older than the one about whether the chicken or the egg came first- and there's about 10,000,000 threads about it  

It really all comes down to the level of responsibility one is willing to deal with, and it being a personal choice. My next male will be left intact until at least two years because I believe the research shows there are more risks with early neutering, and I am able to properly manage an intact animal. Others might feel that the research shows that there are more health risks to leaving them intact, or not want to deal with the responsibility. It really all boils down to personal beliefs and lifestyle preferences. As long as people do the research to try and make an informed decision, that's all we can really ask for.


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Here are my thoughts on neutering. 

I think if you are a responsible adult and can keep your male from getting a female pregnant, you should wait until your dog is at least 18 months before neutering. I personally prefer to neuter between 18-24 months.

If you can and want to keep your dog intact forever, that is fine with me. I just choose to neuter because I hate balls, lol, I also never want to make a mistake and end up with a pregnant dog.


----------



## bob_barker (Dec 31, 2013)

LaRen616 said:


> I just choose to neuter because I hate balls, lol, I also never want to make a mistake and end up with a pregnant dog.[/FONT]


LOL!!! "I hate balls" 

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Ace GSD (May 30, 2014)

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/basic-care/462009-neuter-not.html

Here ya go Bob


----------



## Shade (Feb 20, 2012)

I really think it's a personal decision and there are so many factors that are PRO/CON that there's no absolute right answer. 

Personally, I don't need or want an intact dog whether it be male or female. I have no intentions of ever breeding and a good sound dog is a good sound dog regardless of whether it is intact or not.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Since you are asking for reasoning, I think it's natural. Neutering is not natural. For me it is unnecessary surgery that removes glands that produce hormones that balance the dog's systems the way nature intended. The glands are for more than reproduction. They affect growth and other stuff as well. In fact, I am not sure that we really know how much they affect the whole of the dog. So if it ain't broke, why fix it?


----------



## ILGHAUS (Nov 25, 2002)

My vet had told me that he would recommend to his clients two different things.

1) Those who he was not positive that they would be responsible -- neuter early

2) Those who he was positive would be responsible -- wait until the male was at least 24 months of age before neutering or not neuter at all.

Out of my last three males 2 were neutered shortly after reaching 24 months of age and the 3rd was still intact at the age of 12 when he passed away.

My next male, who will be used among other things, will also be trained for Assistance Mobility. 

*If* I decide to neuter him, he will be at least 24 months old and x-rays taken to make sure his growth plates are closed.
*If* I decide on a canine vasectomy, he will be at least 24 months old.
I may just decide to leave him intact without either of the above.


----------



## scuba_bob (May 5, 2008)

I kept my dog intact, there was a report out of the UK showing that neutering or spaying lead to health issues down and the road, I believe thyroid was a very common issue with dogs that were neutered or spayed. My male doesn't try to hump my leg like my last neutered dog would do or show any dog or male on male aggression, a vet tried to get me to neuter him young and told me both of these things will happen if I didnt. Neutering and spaying is big business for vey office, I believe in North America it makes up a huge part of the business, I want to say it was about 60%.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I think that pet ownership has come a long way. When I was a kid, the dog was pretty much an ornament in the back yard. New puppies were exciting and people would take them to the vet and get them shots. But as that excitement wore off, the next time they saw the vet would be when they were 13 or 14 years old and at death's door. I think at that time, vet schools were pushing vets to get the speuter in before the honeymoon period was over, and thus maximize their profits while preventing each of those dogs from reproducing themselves many times over.

Nowadays, though, it seems that even average pet owners are hanging out at vet clinics a lot moreso than in the old days. I really don't think that there is the concern that people will never neuter or spay if they wait. It is true that dogs can reproduce before they are fully mature, mentally or physically, so there is that. But I don't think vet clinics stand to lose that much by encouraging customers to wait until a critter is 12 months, 18 months, or even 2 years old.


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

LaRen616 said:


> ...because I hate balls, lol...


Like soccer balls? Or footballs? Baseballs? Basketballs? Other balls?

I'm so confused.


----------



## Sri (Apr 25, 2013)

LaRen,

do you play league of legends? Curious where you got the name Draven . He was my favorite champion when I was playing.


----------



## Ace GSD (May 30, 2014)

Draven is OP ! Someone in this forum name the puppy Ezreal


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

I'll just copy/paste my own comment from one of my other dog forums; this one if from itsahuskything.com. Maybe I'm getting old, but I find myself retyping the same answers over and over to help people and add input across various boards. Now I'm just copy/pasting to save time in my old age; either that or I'm becoming lazy. Ha!



> I had done all of the research on neutering and narrowed it down to holding off until Paw Paw was 2 years old so he was fully grown and his growth plates had sealed. I had Nara spayed at 11 months, right before her first heat, as my research revealed that her chances for cancer go up by 4% if you wait until after the first heat to spay. That was 4% too much for me. So with Nara out of the way, I didn't have to worry about oops litters at home. I made the appointment to fix Paw Paw at his 2 year mark, and when I went in for the pre-appointment, our holistic vet asked me why I was neutering him. He ran through a checklist of questions, and my answers were NO to all of them. So again he asked me "why do you want to neuter him?" I was dumbfounded. I was there to pay $300-400 for this surgery, and he was telling me he didn't want my money. He wanted what was best for my dog. He then explained to me why it was holistically/medically/scientifically better to leave Paw Paw intact, and I agreed with his explanations of keeping Paw Paw's bodily system whole and complete.
> 
> Now I have 4 dogs, and all 3 boys are intact. I have no plans to neuter them after doing my research and trusting my holistic vet. Paw Paw has no aggression issues with his pack, no overall behavioral issues, has never been allowed to chase dogs in heat, isn't an escape artist, and doesn't do anything else that people try to link to an intact dog problem. If you read a lot of comments about this, you will see where dogs that had "problems" before their neuter sometimes had them after as well, so it is not always a full proof plan, and the cons of neutering Paw Paw outweighed the pros. I consider myself an ultra-responsible dog owner, but I guess I just assumed it was the right thing to do because "everyone is doing it!" Where have I heard that before?!? Ha.
> 
> I will say that, what is right for me and my dog isn't necessarily right for you and your dog, and that should go for everyone on here who comments. You have to do your own research and keep your mind open to hear from all sides, not just "both" sides (as there are more than 2 sides), and figure out what would work best in your individual situation for you and your dog. I almost got swept up in the "just because" mindset without realizing that there were other options out there that would benefit us more.


----------



## bob_barker (Dec 31, 2013)

counter said:


> I'll just copy/paste my own comment from one of my other dog forums; this one if from itsahuskything.com. Maybe I'm getting old, but I find myself retyping the same answers over and over to help people and add input across various boards. Now I'm just copy/pasting to save time in my old age; either that or I'm becoming lazy. Ha!



Thank you!! What a great response!


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

bob_barker said:


> Thank you!! What a great response!


You're welcome! And my wife loves Bob Barker due to his animal rights activism. I love him for his cameo with Adam Sandler in Happy Gilmore. Hehe. "The price is wrong, bitch!" Methinks he was calling him a female dog.


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

counter said:


> ...this one if from itsahuskything.com...


This one IS from...not IF. Ugh. Need more coffee!


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Ugh! Bob Barker is a PETA person. I don't really like animal rights activists much. Anyone would think, what a neandrethal not to promote something that is for animals. But PETA is not so much for animals as they against humans. And, if they succeed in what they want, there will be no pet ownership at all. So, if you like owning a dog, you should probably give PETA and organizations like them the heave-ho.


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

selzer said:


> Ugh! Bob Barker is a PETA person. I don't really like animal rights activists much. Anyone would think, what a neandrethal not to promote something that is for animals. But PETA is not so much for animals as they against humans. And, if they succeed in what they want, there will be no pet ownership at all. So, if you like owning a dog, you should probably give PETA and organizations like them the heave-ho.


I used to be a "PETA person" when I was new to veganism/vegetarianism/animal rights 20 years ago. I happened to be stationed at a Naval base near PETA HQ, which is down in Norfolk, VA, so my vegan friends and I would go there on the weekends to assist with organized protests and shop in their cruelty-free store. I loved it at the time. Loved being surrounded by like-minded people. I dated a girl who was one of the supervisors at PETA. I remember being at their HQ building and all of the staff were allowed to bring their pets to work, so it was like a zoo, with off leash dogs and cats running all over the place. It was cute. You could go there and love on and play with all of the pups and cats.

Over time, I started becoming aware of the negative press that followed PETA. I think a lot of what they do (or did) is good, like infiltrating slaughterhouses to secretly record what really goes on behind closed doors. But yeah, I know a lot more that I don't like now about PETA than what I knew or did like back then. I haven't supported them in 15 years. Not sure what they're up to now. Don't really care either. I'd rather volunteer at animal shelters these days.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

counter said:


> I used to be a "PETA person" when I was new to veganism/vegetarianism/animal rights 20 years ago. I happened to be stationed at a Naval base near PETA HQ, which is down in Norfolk, VA, so my vegan friends and I would go there on the weekends to assist with organized protests and shop in their cruelty-free store. I loved it at the time. Loved being surrounded by like-minded people. I dated a girl who was one of the supervisors at PETA. I remember being at their HQ building and all of the staff were allowed to bring their pets to work, so it was like a zoo, with off leash dogs and cats running all over the place. It was cute. You could go there and love on and play with all of the pups and cats.
> 
> Over time, I started becoming aware of the negative press that followed PETA. I think a lot of what they do (or did) is good, like infiltrating slaughterhouses to secretly record what really goes on behind closed doors. But yeah, I know a lot more that I don't like now about PETA than what I knew or did like back then. I haven't supported them in 15 years. Not sure what they're up to now. Don't really care either. I'd rather volunteer at animal shelters these days.


I probably wouldn't have posted that if I realized we were discussing someone's user name. But, I think a lot of stuff begins with excellent intentions, but becomes corrupted in time and changes in leadership and public mood. I also think a lot of people support and fund these organizations without realizing what their true agenda is. Giving to the end user is usually always better, the money that way goes to where it is needed and is used for what the giver intended. And giving the gift of time, volunteering, etc, supports and makes things better for the critters. There are so many ways to make things better for critters without becoming extreme.


----------



## robk (Jun 16, 2011)

A single intact dog is easy to manage. However, I have an intact male and and intact female and right now my female is in standing heat. What a PTA! I have to play musical dogs and my male has not eaten in 4 days. All he does is whine and scratch at the doors and pace and pant. Its so ANNOYING! The things I put up with to stick to my convictions. I am finding my resolve against spaying and neutering weakening right now.


----------



## Sri (Apr 25, 2013)

Ace GSD said:


> Draven is OP ! Someone in this forum name the puppy Ezreal




:thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## bob_barker (Dec 31, 2013)

selzer said:


> I probably wouldn't have posted that if I realized we were discussing someone's user name. But, I think a lot of stuff begins with excellent intentions, but becomes corrupted in time and changes in leadership and public mood. I also think a lot of people support and fund these organizations without realizing what their true agenda is. Giving to the end user is usually always better, the money that way goes to where it is needed and is used for what the giver intended. And giving the gift of time, volunteering, etc, supports and makes things better for the critters. There are so many ways to make things better for critters without becoming extreme.



I'm not a supporter of PETA in the least. I gave him the name Bob Barker because let's face it, PETA bs aside.... Who doesn't love The Price is Right!? 

RobK that's the day that I'm dreading, when I have a bitch that comes in. I don't mind playing music dogs I have been dealing with that for 20 years growing up. Bob has never been around anyone in heat yet, and from what I hear ( correct me if I'm wrong) gsds will stop at nothing to reach their loves :s


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

counter said:


> Like soccer balls? Or footballs? Baseballs? Basketballs? Other balls?
> 
> I'm so confused.


Other balls. :laugh:


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

Sri said:


> LaRen,
> 
> do you play league of legends? Curious where you got the name Draven . He was my favorite champion when I was playing.


Nope.

Draven is named after Eric Draven from the movie "The Crow."

His name used to be Draco and it didn't fit him, I wanted to name him something different but still be close to his old name so he wouldn't get confused and I love the movie "The Crow" so there you go.


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

LaRen616 said:


> Other balls. :laugh:


 
Ohhhhh, right!...gotcha...TENNIS BALLS! Now I get it!! I knew I would figure it out eventually.


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

counter said:


> Ohhhhh, right!...gotcha...TENNIS BALLS! Now I get it!! I knew I would figure it out eventually.


Lol. 

Bingo!


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

LaRen616 said:


> Lol.
> 
> Bingo!


BIG FUZZY TENNIS BALLS!!!

No!? Golf balls?

What's wrong with balls? Didn't you say you wanted babies one day? Well, guess where those balls come in handy!? That's right, in making dem bay-bees! They're oh so warm and furry and wrinkly! What's not to like about them?!? No, no, no, not the balls...THE BABIES!!! Git yo mind outta da guttah grrrrrl!


----------



## LaRen616 (Mar 4, 2010)

counter said:


> BIG FUZZY TENNIS BALLS!!!
> 
> No!? Golf balls?
> 
> What's wrong with balls? Didn't you say you wanted babies one day? Well, guess where those balls come in handy!? That's right, in making dem bay-bees! They're oh so warm and furry and wrinkly! What's not to like about them?!? No, no, no, not the balls...THE BABIES!!! Git yo mind outta da guttah grrrrrl!


LOL! Ewww.

I know what they do but they are still gross.


----------



## Ace GSD (May 30, 2014)

Oh ny gawd this is turning into testicle thread


----------



## counter (Feb 20, 2009)

Ace GSD said:


> Oh ny gawd this is turning into testicle thread


I was talking about fuzzy tennis balls. What are you talking about? Gutter too?


----------



## Ace GSD (May 30, 2014)

counter said:


> I was talking about fuzzy tennis balls. What are you talking about? Gutter too?


hm..idk... ( whistle and walk away )


----------



## bob_barker (Dec 31, 2013)

You guys are too funny


----------



## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

I am considering not spaying even though I originally was going to spay my GSD at 2 years....well, 2 years is here and I'm thinking of keeping her intact for another 2 years or so.

Recently, I had conversations with 3 vets regarding the pros and cons of sterilizing a dog and I was not swayed to go through with the procedure. Perhaps this is common knowledge to many here but I did not know that Europeans do not spay and neuter their dogs nearly as often as Americans do.

I am somewhat under the impression the main emphasis to sterilize dogs in the USA is purely based on the rationale of preventing more dogs showing up in shelters and many being euthanized...rather than what is healthiest for the animal.

I will continue to research the topic, trying to keep an open mind regarding spay/neuter but my number one priority is the health of my dog and to date, I am not convinced my dog is better served by having her spayed.

SuperG


----------



## arycrest (Feb 28, 2006)

Definitely NOT a PETA fan but LOVE The Price is Right and Bob Barker (haven't watched it except the first few times and didn't like Drew Cary). 

Anyway, I've been happy having my last two boys get a vasectomy ... will continue to do so if/when I get another fellow!!!


----------

