# Breeder Question



## david8017 (Dec 15, 2017)

Ive got a question, especially for any breeders out there. 
My son picked out the puppy he wanted from a certain breeder. We payed the deposit and said the puppy would be ready to pick up in about a month. 5 days before we were going to pick the dog up, the breeder calls and says the puppy has died. My 9 year old is heartbroken. 
They are apologetic and let us know they have another dog that will give birth in a month or two. Then we would have to wait another couple months to take the puppy home. My son cant wait that long so we find another puppy from a different breeder.
We ask for our deposit back and the original breeder says nope, we dont refund deposits for any reason.

Is this standard operating procedures? It doesnt seem right at all. I get it if we backed out of the deal, but the puppy we chose died


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

It is common, it isn't right. The pup died. You did not back out of the deal and should get your money refunded.


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## Castlemaid (Jun 29, 2006)

Many breeders have a policy that in case they cannot deliver a puppy as promised (your case being a perfect example), then your deposit is moved to a puppy in the next available litter. Not all breeders do it this way, but many do. When you put your deposit down, did you sign a contract? Anything in writing on paper or on their website that explains this policy? 

If there is something in writing, then you agreed to the terms when you put your deposit down. 

For some breeders, a "non-refundable" deposit is just that - non-refundable under any circumstances (the contract or the website should specify). Some breeders will refund a deposit under special circumstances. In your situation, some breeders would refund you. But it comes down to the written policy, and the good-will of the breeder. 

If there has never been anything in writing, then you are at the mercy of the breeder's whims. If the breeder refuses to refund your deposit, standard policy or not, there is not much you can do about it. You can walk away and consider the lost deposit as an education tax.


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## Shepdad (Oct 24, 2017)

I know this isn't the question, but having a good talk with a 9 year old to explain why sometimes people do have to wait 3 months for something they would love for the next 12 years, might not be a bad thing.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

If I were in that predicament I would offer a full refund .

If I were in your situation I would NOT rush to the next available pup to meet some timeline.

were you totally satisfied with the breeder , with the dogs they had , with the care they gave their
animals and with the communication and relationship that you had with them

if you signed a non-refund though? takes two to make a contract -- understand before what you
are entering in to .


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## NerdicEclipse (Feb 20, 2017)

Shepdad said:


> I know this isn't the question, but having a good talk with a 9 year old to explain why sometimes people do have to wait 3 months for something they would love for the next 12 years, might not be a bad thing.


This all the way.

But like others have said, if there was a contract in place and you signed it, you're stuck. If there wasn't, you're left with whatever they feel like doing.

In the future, if there's no contract, draw one up and have them sign it with you. If they won't and you don't feel right, move along. If they have a contract and you're unhappy with the terms, try to negotiate it. If they won't, move along.

It's unfortunate and it's not right, but it happens sadly.


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## wolfstraum (May 2, 2003)

It is unusual to have an 8 week old puppy die.....did she explain???

Yes - deposits are generally non refundable - but there are always parameters for that condition....if there is no puppy for you in the litter, IMO the breeder should return the deposit.....if you back out the week before you are to pick up the pup, then you lose the deposit or have it transferred to another litter....in the case of a child and a dead puppy - it is pretty heartless to take that position.....and if it were me, I would not want to deal with the breeder or get a pup from them. I would request a refund from them, in writing, and state that they could not fulfill the contract by providing a puppy from the litter on which you placed a deposit. I would even consider filing against them with a magistrate to get the deposit back...

So sorry your son is disappointed....

Lee


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Well, I would not purchase a puppy from the current breeder. They did not deliver on the puppy that was selected. Things happen, and sometimes a puppy dies. But for the breeder to not restore your deposit to you, non-refundable or not, that is unethical. 

The non-refundable deposit is set up so that if you go to another breeder, after promising to purchase a pup from the first breeder, the first breeder then has to scramble to find a suitable home for the puppy in question. You lose your deposit. And you should. If the breeder cannot produce the puppy that you paid a deposit on, it should be a choice to wait for the next litter or to get your deposit back. Of course, if they have a contract that says, at their discretion, they may refund the deposit or offer a puppy from a future litter. 

Depending on what you signed, legally, you may not have a leg to stand on.


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## david8017 (Dec 15, 2017)

sorry i havent responded earlier. 
Im not sure if my wife signed the contract. She probably did. Either way, I think its a very shady practice. Apparently, it was a genetic problem (according to her). The puppy went downhill when it was taken off its mothers milk. One lived but my sons died.

My son has waited for years for a german shepherd (we waited until we were ready not my son...lol), so a few more months wasnt an issue. We started searching for other breeders because the whole situation seemed sketchy. After a little more research on the breeder and the deposit issue, Ive come to the conclusion that we might have dodged a bullet even though we lost the deposit

Lesson learned. We should have asked more questions. Still, I think it shows her character....


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Actually, there are a lot of lessons to be learned, that are learned here. Reading and agreeing to a contract and all of its provisions might be one. Another is for your son, and that is in nature, critters die and it is very sad, but we cannot always make things the way we want for them to be. Live critters will most likely break your heart. It isn't better not to have them at all though. There are many explanations when a young critter dies and crushes our hopes. Sometimes it is just the nature of things. This pup had something seriously wrong, maybe MegE that did not allow the sustenance to get through this puppy. And he was lost. Very sad. And yes, if the puppy had this issue, it is probably in her lines, and it is likely that another puppy could have the problem. I think that the only good thing is that it's symptoms do show up when they start eating solid food, and you could most likely get a decent pet without this condition from them. But the pup would probably be a carrier. Which would be no problem if you do not intend to breed him. 

Be that as it may be. It is the ethics that we are at odds with, really. And No, I would not want to do businsess with her.


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## delro (Nov 15, 2017)

Even if you did sign a contract I would imagine a person with some honor would say "hey this is really unfortunate and sad, I am willing to give your deposit back due to the circumstances" 

Or maybe the breeder is used to producing pups that may die? I have no idea.

In any case you should probably meet other breeders and see how you feel about them and eat the deposit  

Good Luck - that is really sad to hear.


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## Aly (May 26, 2011)

Unless you signed a contract explicitly specifying that deposits were nonrefundable, there are other options that you can pursue. (Well, one school of thought holds that you could do that even if you had signed such a contract --- but that's a separate issue). For example, you could seek a judgement against this 'breeder' in Small Claims Court (or whatever it's called where you live). Different states/communities have varying laws about this option, but it's something that you could pursue. 

Aly


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## david8017 (Dec 15, 2017)

selzer said:


> Actually, there are a lot of lessons to be learned, that are learned here. Reading and agreeing to a contract and all of its provisions might be one. Another is for your son, and that is in nature, critters die and it is very sad, but we cannot always make things the way we want for them to be. Live critters will most likely break your heart. It isn't better not to have them at all though. There are many explanations when a young critter dies and crushes our hopes. Sometimes it is just the nature of things. This pup had something seriously wrong, maybe MegE that did not allow the sustenance to get through this puppy. And he was lost. Very sad. And yes, if the puppy had this issue, it is probably in her lines, and it is likely that another puppy could have the problem. I think that the only good thing is that it's symptoms do show up when they start eating solid food, and you could most likely get a decent pet without this condition from them. But the pup would probably be a carrier. Which would be no problem if you do not intend to breed him.
> 
> Be that as it may be. *It is the ethics that we are at odds with, really. And No, I would not want to do businsess with her.*


This is where im at


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