# Separation Anxiety - Destructive - Cone Alternative to Crate?



## chpurc (Jul 9, 2014)

Ok so my 2 yr old GSD has separation anxiety. Before you guys say he needs more exercise .. i'll literally take him to the dog park for 2hrs, to the point of exhaustion .. go out for the night and my couch cushions will be ripped to shreads. At this point i've accepted it and just crate him while i'm gone.

2 days ago I got him fixed .. so i've been using the cone so he doesn't mess up his stitches.

I've realized that he literally can't get into anything .. because if he does he hits it with the cone.

What if I got him a comfortable one (like below) and just put it on him when I'm gone?


----------



## Mary Beth (Apr 17, 2010)

I can understand why you would be consider that, but I suggest you check with your vet when you take him in to have his stitches removed about continuing to wear a cone for regular periods.


----------



## chpurc (Jul 9, 2014)

Mary Beth said:


> I can understand why you would be consider that, but I suggest you check with your vet when you take him in to have his stitches removed about continuing to wear a cone for regular periods.


I'm confused .. is there a health risk with fabric around his neck?

Isn't it better than sitting in a crate?


----------



## LoveEcho (Mar 4, 2011)

What makes you think he has SA and isn't just being destructive because he's opportunistic? Are there any other behaviors that indicate an anxiety issue? 

Thinking about my own dog with SA, he would simply hurt himself... if he was loose in the house, he would freak out, smash into things with the cone, get it caught on something.... the crate is a much safer alternative.


----------



## chpurc (Jul 9, 2014)

LoveEcho said:


> What makes you think he has SA and isn't just being destructive because he's opportunistic? Are there any other behaviors that indicate an anxiety issue?
> 
> Thinking about my own dog with SA, he would simply hurt himself... if he was loose in the house, he would freak out, smash into things with the cone, get it caught on something.... the crate is a much safer alternative.


Another anxiety example .. on those days i take him to the dog park .. when we come home he's very calm on the couch or my bed or whatever

Then i have some people over, he gets anxious .. in their face, constantly wanting attention, etc...


----------



## BoyOhBoy!! (Apr 30, 2015)

I have to admit, when I first read this post, I LOL'd (oh, the cone memories!). Being a rescue mom, I've had a lot of pets in cones because the first order of business in rescue is getting the animal spayed/neutered. 

So yes, at first, they are goofy little dogs trying to get to toys, food, whatever - and are stopped short by the cone. But the longer it is on them, the more pitiful they get, in my opinion. 

A crate, on the other hand, if properly introduced, is a great way to protect your furniture AND your dog. 

As far as whether or not your dog has anxiety, have you had him evaluated for this? If not, I'd start logging events you deem as examples of his anxiety and share it with your vet. In the 2nd example you have provided of symptoms of anxiety, I see a dog (whether tired or not) who is exhibiting bad manners which you, as his owner, should have control over. 

Mom to Remi


----------



## Dunkirk (May 7, 2015)

I don't think it would be kind, e.g. having an itch he couldn't get to. Similar experience to a human having a cast with an itch you can scratch. I think long term he wouldn't be a happy dog.


----------



## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

The softer cones can prevent them from licking things on the body, but are not strong enough to not bend and cave. They are not the hard plastic cone your dog is probably wearing post neuter. 

I have to say, I think this is not a good idea. It's a bandaid. Not treating the actual issue. 

How often does he get exercise to the point of exhaustion? How much mental exercise does he get? What kind of training have you done with him? How old is he? Is he calm in the crate?


----------



## LoveEcho (Mar 4, 2011)

chpurc said:


> Another anxiety example .. on those days i take him to the dog park .. when we come home he's very calm on the couch or my bed or whatever
> 
> Then i have some people over, he gets anxious .. in their face, constantly wanting attention, etc...


This doesn't sound like anxiety, it sounds like a young dog who is excited and stimulated by visitors. 

Regardless, it's not a good idea. As gsdsar said, it's a bandaid. IF it is anxiety (and I don't think it is), you're still not addressing that issue. If it's opportunistic destruction (much more likely), a cone isn't going to do much to stop him and is going to pose a possible danger...and you're still not addressing the issue. A dog park for two hours may make him tired for a little bit, but it's generally not enough exercise for a GSD if that's all he's getting. How about training?


----------



## chpurc (Jul 9, 2014)

LoveEcho said:


> This doesn't sound like anxiety, it sounds like a young dog who is excited and stimulated by visitors.
> 
> Regardless, it's not a good idea. As gsdsar said, it's a bandaid. IF it is anxiety (and I don't think it is), you're still not addressing that issue. If it's opportunistic destruction (much more likely), a cone isn't going to do much to stop him and is going to pose a possible danger...and you're still not addressing the issue. A dog park for two hours may make him tired for a little bit, but it's generally not enough exercise for a GSD if that's all he's getting. How about training?


How much exercise is enough? At the dog park there could be up to 20 dogs, and a LOT of room to run. If he's not running with dogs, i'm throwing tennis balls .. i'm estimating he gets 3-4 miles of running in that 1-2 hours

Not trying to be sarcastic but does every GSD owner have them run marathons?


----------



## The Wild Bunch (Jun 17, 2015)

Treading lightly because I am new.

It isn't always just plain "exercise" that is needed. 

Good structured training with you as the leader is what will show your dog what is acceptable behavior. Even if you run the energy out at the park or run a marathon, if when you get home your dog is unclear on what the boundaries are, and what is expected of him, he will behave how he wants. 

Perhaps he needs to "place" when you have guests and then be introduced on your terms when you are ready (and likely on a leash). 

Dogs should work for everything they do/get. He will be a happier and generally more relaxed dog if he lives the life of "nothing in life is free".


----------



## chpurc (Jul 9, 2014)

I understand what you are saying...

But for destructive behavior when I'm not home ... how do I correct that if I'm not there? By the time I get home and something is destroyed .. that memory is long gone.


----------



## The Wild Bunch (Jun 17, 2015)

I know it sometimes feels cruel to crate our dogs, but if it is for safety because your dog gets into trouble while you are out, than the crate if the best alternative. Read here.... http://smartdoguniversity.com/dog-training-ask-the-trainer-when-can-i-get-rid-of-the-crate/


I felt guilty too and purchased a doubled sized crate. It is twice as tall and wide as the large GSD crate and my alpha male can stand up, sit up, turn circles, keep his pillows, etc. without being cramped. 

As an alternative you could take him to doggie day care if your finances allow it or hire a pet sitter to come in during the day. 

Ultimately though you might just have a younger more curious GSD who gets into trouble while you are out. Imagine if he eats a remote or something and chokes on it, you would feel terrible. That is way worse than the crate.


----------



## KPK (Jan 28, 2015)

chpurc said:


> I understand what you are saying...
> 
> But for destructive behavior when I'm not home ... how do I correct that if I'm not there? By the time I get home and something is destroyed .. that memory is long gone.


If he is crated while your not home there will be no destruction You can not correct this while your not there however crating while you are not there will teach him to settle down and relax in a safe place.You can leave a frozen stuffed Kong in there to keep him busy for the first hour or so after you leave.This will get him in the habbit of chewing his toy after you leave to relieve his anxiety in the future.


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

The original proposed solution fabric collar...kind of had me speechless??? The Op has so much to learn!

Enrolling in a basic obedience class would be a good first step and I highly recommend this site and start here:

Solid K9 Training

There are pod cast and a weekly radio show. "Everything" you need to know can be found there...look under free advise!

Crate training is there also if you have questions still ask here! But that site will give you basic foundation of knowledge!


----------



## chpurc (Jul 9, 2014)

Guys, thanks for the responses .. but he is VERY crate trained. I don't consider it cruel at all to put him in there .. but i would rather have an alternative for him to be free. 

I go home everyday to let him out and walk him .. so he's rarely in there for more than 4 hours

But yes I have tried leaving him out of the crate before and boom .. i come home to a chewed remote, leather couch ripped up, etc... you know the deal

I don't know how I could possibly discipline him if I'm not there??


----------



## SkoobyDoo (Oct 7, 2014)

4 hours in a crate at a time is not too much. 
You can't discipline him when you're not there. Just crate, exercise well when you're home, and train with him to stimulate his mind. Just running is not going to stimulate his mind and make him think.

Give him a very sturdy kong while you're away, feed him his meals in the kong toy so he has something to do while in there!


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

chpurc said:


> ... how do I correct that if I'm not there? By the time I get home and something is destroyed .. that memory is long gone.


WOW your kinda all over the map! The "cone thing" was kinda...insane!

But "this" question was "spot on!" At the point your at now? You've lost the window of opportunity!

You've already done the first part because a "Pro" would tell you "crate train your dog!: You've done that so job well done there!


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

chpurc said:


> Another anxiety example .. on those days i take him to the dog park .. when we come home he's very calm on the couch or my bed or whatever
> 
> Then i have some people over, he gets anxious .. in their face, constantly wanting attention, etc...


Why the “Place” Command is So Important and Your Dog Should Know It! - TheDogTrainingSecret.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIGq_5r0DeE

Train that and it "will" solve your "company issue!" But as I say, keep "Dog Parking" your dog on a regular basis, will make your job harder!

And if your dog gets attacked...you'll be here with a "my dog is reactive on leash" thread! Happens all the time...just saying.


----------



## Stonevintage (Aug 26, 2014)

I always blocked my puppies off in the laundry room. It's safe and nothing they could chew. Always had plenty of toys soft and hard to play with. It worked.


----------



## SkoobyDoo (Oct 7, 2014)

A friend of mine had a lab with Separation anxiety, the crate was in the laundry room! The dog got out of the crate, and tore the sheetrock off the walls and ate that and insulation! 
A determined dog can find a way to destroy just about anything!


----------



## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

SkoobyDoo said:


> A friend of mine had a lab with Separation anxiety, the crate was in the laundry room! The dog got out of the crate, and tore the sheetrock off the walls and ate that and insulation!
> A determined dog can find a way to destroy just about anything!


Well that is less than helpful! But AFAIK this dog has no issues with the crate??

He would just "prefer" not to need to use one but at the "moment" has no choice.


----------



## Dev_DeCoste (Jun 1, 2015)

A cone can help with preventing him from messing with the stitches. A friend of mine had a GSD that she tried the fabric cone on and he learned how to bend it just right so that he could still do what he wanted.. Just something to be mindful of. 

Properly crate training the pup will help not only with preventing destructive behavior while gone (because he's locked up) but also help with anxiety a little as the proper way to crate train is to teach them that it's their safe place to go where no one will bother them.

Also, my pup has very bad SA (I'm his at least 4th home in his 9 months of existence) to the point where he couldn't be left alone even outside on his lead. it was kind of funny, I'd walk away and he would freak out but once I'm within reach and watching him he just ignored me and happily wandered around.. Anyway.. I recently got him a Thunder Shirt to see if it would help and it definitely has. While I wouldn't call it a miracle fix, he certainly isn't at 100% better, it has helped a lot. He used to pace around the apartment all the time, get into uncontrollable barking fits and be very destructive of seemingly everything BUT his toys... Now, with the shirt, he's much more mellow, pulls on the leash less and sleeps far more. Oh, and is pretty good in his crate too. This is after only 2 days, though. Still more time is needed to assess the real impact.


----------

