# How not to reinforce barking in the crate...



## TankGrrl66 (Jun 29, 2010)

I'm afraid I have been doing this wrong. 

From what I have been told, when my puppy barks in her crate...I am supposed to:

Ignore it-she will just move from barking to SHRIEKING. She also flipped when I put a towel over the crate. It just won't stop! Or am I not waiting enough?

Ignore it, wait for her to be quite a few moments and then let her out - It has been working so far, but I have only had her since Saturday! I thought she was doing very well, but now she is getting clingy and probably developing a bond. I am assuming this is why I have hit this snag. But also, I fear that I am reinforcing her behavior.

When she barks, I will walk down the hallway as quiet as I can. I will wait at the door to the room she is in until she stops. I usually wait at least 20 seconds...as long as I can. Am I reinforcing this? Or am I just teaching her to wait? Because after I enter the room, I will slowly go to open the crate to make sure she stays quiet. This has worked so far.

But today she has taken to shrieking as soon as I open the door. If I just leave and shut the door again, she becomes hysterical. She will bark at me as I stand there, waiting for her to be quiet. Once she is quiet (right around the time my skull is about to split from her very high pitched bark:crazy, I let her out. 

How long do I have to wait before I let her out? How do I NOT reinforce her barking? I have been waiting for at least 15 seconds...is this too short? too long? just right? 

Sorry for the long post...I just wanted to explain as best I could, and make sure I am doing everything right.


**She has stuff to chew on and play with when she is in there. Sometimes she just wants OUT more, apparently


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

Earplugs.

The shrieking is annoying, but she's NOT dying. You have to be more stubborn than she is. Just wait for the hysterics to stop--15 seconds is great--before you let her out. It sounds like you're doing everything right, she is just testing you.

Be patient, keep doing what you're doing, and did I mention earplugs?


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## Bikecafe (Jun 11, 2011)

I am getting a pup in a few days and you are scaring me  (even though I have had a GSD before).

But yeah, you just have to out last the pup (hopefully). Otherwise, it will just get worse.

Good luck


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## Elaine (Sep 10, 2006)

Why is she crated when you are up and about and why you are creeping down hallways to sneak up on her? This doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

You should be crating her at night in your bedroom and, yes, you let her cry - all night for days if necessary. You do get up several times to take her out to potty and then put her right back. If you can't watch her, like if you need to take a shower, then put her in her crate. When you are done, go and let her out - no sneaking around, just walk right up. Wait until there's a moments break in the crying and let her out. It's very hard on them to crate them while you are up and moving around the house. I don't do that except for very brief times like taking a shower.

These are clingy dogs, that's normal. I haven't been in the bathroom without supervision since the 80's.


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## Veronica1 (Jun 22, 2010)

Elaine said:


> I haven't been in the bathroom without supervision since the 80's.


  Love it! 

How old is your pup? 

Is there a reason you need to shut the door where she's crated? Maybe she would do better if she could see/hear/smell you?

When we first brought Panzer home, at about 7 weeks old, he would cry, yip & scream at night in his crate. I would wait about 7 or 8 minutes and get him out. Sometimes he needed to go potty, sometimes he was hungry, sometimes he just needed to play for a few minutes. Then I'd put him back and go back to bed. It didn't take too long before he could go several hours and then the whole night. I'd put him in his crate, give him a treat and walk away.

As he got several months older, and was potty trained, we would keep him in our bedroom (not in the crate) with the door shut. Now he is not crated at night and has freedom of the house, but almost always is either on the bed or at the foot of the bed on the floor.

Sounds to me like you're in the normal part of crate training. Keep being consistent and it will get better. Depending on her age, she's just like an infant.


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## TankGrrl66 (Jun 29, 2010)

Elaine said:


> Why is she crated when you are up and about and why you are creeping down hallways to sneak up on her? This doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
> 
> You should be crating her at night in your bedroom and, yes, you let her cry - all night for days if necessary. You do get up several times to take her out to potty and then put her right back. If you can't watch her, like if you need to take a shower, then put her in her crate. When you are done, go and let her out - no sneaking around, just walk right up. Wait until there's a moments break in the crying and let her out. It's very hard on them to crate them while you are up and moving around the house. I don't do that except for very brief times like taking a shower.
> 
> These are clingy dogs, that's normal. I haven't been in the bathroom without supervision since the 80's.


The when-I-can't-watch-her part is why she is really in her crate. I put her in there when I cannot keep an eye on her. But she still carries on if I put her in the crate and then leave. 

Or for example, she kept trying to rip up the clothes while I was doing laundry yesterday. I tried redirecting with a toy, but she is already not falling for that one anymore! 

lol I just re-read that and it does sounds odd! The reason I sneaked (?) back to the door is bc I don't want her to cry and then hear me come down the hallway to let her out. I don't want her to make that connection, then REALLY start to go nuts once she knows I am at the door. Maybe I am overthinking that one... :crazy:

She has been out more now that our younger male is more accepting of her and they can all mingle now. 

Yeah. I'm getting earplugs...not just for me, but for the whole family LOL

**So far she has been sleeping in her crate through the night. She just wakes up before 7 am...


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## TankGrrl66 (Jun 29, 2010)

Freestep said:


> Earplugs.
> 
> The shrieking is annoying, but she's NOT dying. You have to be more stubborn than she is. Just wait for the hysterics to stop--15 seconds is great--before you let her out. It sounds like you're doing everything right, she is just testing you.
> 
> Be patient, keep doing what you're doing, and did I mention earplugs?



This was refreshing...Thanks!

Oh, and she is VERY stubborn :hammer:


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## rblanshan (Jun 23, 2011)

Crate training is fantastic for the exact reasons you stated. I just got my female 2 weeks ago. She is housetrained, but was used to hardwood floor...and since we have carpet, I think she is confusing it with grass. Not too bad though, she's 1 1/2 yrs. old and only had a few accidents. If I can't watch her, she goes in her kennel. Really helps. However, I have to put a blanket over her kennel. If I don't, she will cry, whine and bark. If a blanket is over it, she's as quiet as a mouse. Just keep putting her in her kennel with her toys, and get the earplugs. Give her a treat when she goes in there. But stick with it...have some patience and take a deep breath, because I bet she can get pretty loud! Good luck!


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## cwmia (Jul 6, 2011)

I had 2 crates. One in my bedroom and another in a location where she was still part of everything. I covered it so it was like a "den" but she never felt like she was abandoned. If I couldn't move the crate I would use a baby gate across a hallway and leave the door open. I also put the baby gate across the bathroom door. We were both in the bathroom and I'd be in the shower. I've never been alone since.
cw


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

TankGrrl66 said:


> Because after I enter the room, I will slowly go to open the crate to make sure she stays quiet. This has worked so far.
> 
> But today she has taken to shrieking as soon as I open the door. If I just leave and shut the door again, she becomes hysterical. She will bark at me as I stand there, waiting for her to be quiet. Once she is quiet (right around the time my skull is about to split from her very high pitched bark:crazy, I let her out.


If you leave and shut the door and she becomes hysterical, don't give in. Instead of shutting the door, you can turn your back on her and wait--that may keep her from panicking.

If I am working with a puppy on crate training and they start fussing as I go to let them out, I start by turning my back. If noise continues, I take a step away, then another, until I am out of sight--once I am out of sight, I need about 20 seconds of quiet to bring me back. 

If the noise stops while I am in still sight and back to the dog, I will turn and face the dog. For every, say, 3 seconds the dog is quiet, I will take a step toward the dog; noise makes me turn my back and then if it continues, I start stepping away. 

This takes some time and patience! But the idea is that noise drives me away, silence brings me closer. Make sure you don't open the crate when the dog is fussing or hitting the door or floor with her feet.

There is no set amount of time--you have to have a feel for what your dog can handle and what will work best. You want the dog to succeed in bringing you to the crate, so if the dog can only be quiet for 2 seconds in between steps forward, only require 2 seconds. But you want to be able to gradually extend the timing.

In addition, I highly recommend looking into Susan Garrett's Crate Games to help teach your dog that the crate is a good place and that self restraint is a good thing.


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## Tbarrios333 (May 31, 2009)

Sorry, but I put my puppy in the crate when I can't watch her and when she is driving me nuts. I am patient, but her high pitched play bark grates on my ears. Eventually, instead of flipping out, I put her in the crate until I can collect myself. 
Nothing wrong with a puppy being in the crate while you're out and about. As long as you're giving exercise, training, and socialization; you're doing fine.
My pup was also very bad at screaming in her crate and she doesn't anymore. Only let her out when she is completely calm. I've never tried (I think I will soon), but there are also crate games you can play to build their confidence/impulse control. 
Don't sneak around the house while she's in the crate either. Make lots of noise; she has to get used to it.

ETA: I agree with Christine's method. I've done it and it helps.


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## vhowell7 (Jul 4, 2011)

Good thread, I guess I just need patience.... I got 4 hours sleep last night due to a yippping/crying dog...

My puppy has been home for a week (11 weeks old now) and we are working on both crate training and separation anxiety. She was doing real well the first week -we spent lots of time with her during the day, then after supper we would walk her, play with her, do potty time then crate at 10 pm and she would sleep/be quiet until 5:30 am ( we get up at 5:30 anyways).

But she became a velcro dog by the end of the week, and would become real agitated when I would leave the room ( gee,I have to take a shower, ya know!) I tried to get the other family members to watch her, but no, she wanted me. as long as she could see me she was fine...

Then I got a dog trainer to come in, and he suggested doing 3 or 4 crate times during the day to get her used to in the fall when school starts up again. (I'm home full time now). She whined alot, then would settle down, so I would let her out when quiet, etc. But when I began the daytime crateing, she got VERY loud and whining at night. No more quiet dog! So I have tried the cover, a Kong filled with some treat, a night light, etc. at night and still she sings and howls for hours. 

Please let me know if I am doing something wrong here!:help:


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## Tbarrios333 (May 31, 2009)

If she's only been home for a week it's way too soon to expect her not to cry. 
It took my pup at least 3 weeks before she was consistently quiet in the crate when it was time for bed. Longer to be quiet when I left the room and I'm not sure how long I've had her now.. maybe close to 2 months, but when she's in the mood she'll still cry if I leave the room. 
Just have to give it time.


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## Cortiz07 (Aug 3, 2015)

*I just adopted a 1 year gsd who was never socialized*

My dog was never socialized and never walked, I have a gentle leader on her and she is fine when we go on walks and seems to not be vicious when it's on. On the other hand without the leader on she is a monster. Does anyone have any good advice to help stop the barking and also introducing her to my small chi-weenie. FYI she was hard handled by her previous owner and does know her commands


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## Chip18 (Jan 11, 2014)

I just posted these "Sit on the Dog" and the "Place Command:"
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/7130001-post14.html

And I'll add one more:
Separation Anxiety? I?m not seeing it at my Place! – Solid K9 Training

If it's good enough for Jeff (the Pro's)...it's good enough for me!


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## 1stpuppy (Oct 23, 2015)

My dog is only grate in the morning for about 7 hours because my husband works at night and is sleeping days she is only 9 weeks old and has been with us for 1 week and a day. 
I am trying to potty train her when I get home from work which is 5:30 pm which is hard. I do not know what to do anymore and my husband doesn't want her any longer


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## T-Bone'sMamma (Mar 3, 2012)

1stpuppy said:


> My dog is only grate in the morning for about 7 hours because my husband works at night and is sleeping days she is only 9 weeks old and has been with us for 1 week and a day.
> I am trying to potty train her when I get home from work which is 5:30 pm which is hard. I do not know what to do anymore and my husband doesn't want her any longer


Hi, I'm sorry to hear you are having problems, but 7 hours is a LONG time for a little 9 week old puppy. She isn't soiling out of laziness, but out of sheer necessity. Is it possible you could hire someone to let her out at some point in the day? 

9 weeks, y'all are just getting started and if frustration is already so high you're at your wits end and hubby already wants to get rid of her... Maybe that is actually for the best. She is a completely innocent baby who's entire world just got flipped upside down. She has no idea what happened to her parents and/or siblings, what happened to the home she knew for her entire life until a week ago. She doesn't know what is expected of her. Everyone in the family needs to be on board in showing her love and patience. If that isn't possible, think about responsibly rehoming her and soon, while someone else can step in in her very early life and give her what she needs to develop correctly.


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