# Post-castration swelling



## rad10

So here's my story...

My 1 year old GSD was castrated last week. The vet kept him over night and we picked him up the following afternoon. When they sent him home, his scrotum was at least the same size as it was before the castration, if not a little bigger, and there was a fair bit of bruising (maybe 20-30% of his scrotum looked bruised). I crated him that evening with the e-collar on and most of the next day, just to restrict activity, and after that I started letting him wander around the living room - but no playing and if he started getting wound up he went back in the crate. We rearranged our furniture so that there was no place for him to go that I couldn't see him from where I was working on the couch, and if I so much as went to pee or fill a glass of water the e-collar went back on. I was bound and determined not to let him lick that site or do too much.

The next day I went to look at his site and noticed that the bruising was spreading, now we were up to about 50%, and it was a little more swollen. But he was acting fine - good appetite, friendly, seemed totally oblivious to the fact that anything had happened and kept giving me those sad eyes, not understanding why I wouldn't play with him. No signs of infections or anything. So then I took him out to pee, looked away for a minute to readjust my glove, and he'd launched himself into a nearby snowbank.  He managed to either scrape off the scab over the incision on the snow or something and he was dripping bloody fluid all over (not just blood). After about an hour when I was just starting to consider the emergency vet it stopped. After that, I started icing it for 5-10 minutes or so a few times a day.

That was 2 days ago. Now, It's about twice the size it was, and is 100% black and blue. The site itself still looks fine to me, it's no warmer than his normal skin temp, no pus or discharge and no redness other than the purply red of the bruises, but he was acting in so much pain today that he didn't sit down for 2 hours. He just stood there panting and whining, and when he started trying to sit he'd yip and bolt forward and look behind him like he thought someone had kicked him in the butt. Needless to say I drove him straight to the vet the earliest time they get him in today.

Vet takes a look at it and kind of freaked out on me. Said that it was absolutely _not_ normal swelling, it was a complication, and it was infected. She told me that I let him do too much activity, and that he was probably licking it when I wasn't paying attention. She asked me how long it had been swollen like that - saying it didn't even look like he'd been castrated. I said that it was swollen when I picked him up from the surgery (at least to the size it had been before i dropped him off) and she kind of snapped at me saying, "It did not look like that when he left here" (I didn't say it did, let me finish grrr). But that it had been getting steadily more swollen and more bruised since then, and told her about the one jump into the snow bank.

She gave him antibiotics, two pain medicines, and I'm supposed to be doing warm compresses on his scrotum every couple hours. He's also restricted to the crate for the next two days (this should be fun), and is supposed to be in the e-collar 24/7, even when he's eating. And if it's not showing improvement in 2 days she's taking him back for surgery to drain it.

So tonight I tried to do a warm compress on it, and the second I even touched his scrotum (literally the second, there was no pressure at all) he screamed. That's the best word I can think for it, it was a noise I'd never heard from him before. I tried again a few hours later (After another pain pill) and got the same response. I'm not sure what to do now, the warm compresses don't seem to be an option. The poor boy's in so much pain, and hating being crated like this, and I'm feeling like a rotten dog-mom.

I don't know what to do other than hope the antibiotics and crating works before he has to have more surgery... I just hate this...


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN

This is what is difficult in post-surgery instruction - what pet owners think is limited, is not, in many cases. I tether, crate, leash potty after surgeries. I use an e-collar, shirts, boxer shorts so they can't get to the incision. The one time I wasn't strict, there was a good sized seroma (female spay), but no infection. 

Did you test the temp of the warm compress on the inside of your wrist? 

Dogs do learn that if they react, you will stop with the compress. If the compress is a reasonable temp, and you are only gently touching it, then I would report to the vet as soon as they open this morning. And I would call anyway with an update. 

I also take cell phone pics of incisions when I get home, and daily, so I have a record of what things look like. I would start doing that now. 

Do not feel bad about crating and the collar. I've had dogs on 6 weeks of crate rest after big surgeries - and did not feel bad for a second that they were in there - they needed that time to heal and rest, from the inside out.


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## JakodaCD OA

This happened with one of my males, he decided to take a flying race around my yard and boom, his scrotum swelled up bigger than it was originally. 

My vet said it sometimes happenswith older dogs especially, hard to tie off all those vessels or something or othr..Anyhow, they aspirated it, (no surgery required), drained it off, and yes warm/cold compresses.

I also agree in taking pictures...

Are you confident in your vet? I'm kinda surprised she didn't decide to just try and aspirate it to relieve some of the pressure? 

and I agree with Jean


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## huntergreen

if there was swelling when you picked him up, why not point this out to the vet? yes e collar stays on 24/7. i would ask about IV antibiotics at this point. sounds like you didn't completely understand the post op instructions/


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## rad10

JeanKBBMMMAAN said:


> This is what is difficult in post-surgery instruction - what pet owners think is limited, is not, in many cases. I tether, crate, leash potty after surgeries. I use an e-collar, shirts, boxer shorts so they can't get to the incision. The one time I wasn't strict, there was a good sized seroma (female spay), but no infection.
> 
> Did you test the temp of the warm compress on the inside of your wrist?
> 
> Dogs do learn that if they react, you will stop with the compress. If the compress is a reasonable temp, and you are only gently touching it, then I would report to the vet as soon as they open this morning. And I would call anyway with an update.
> 
> I also take cell phone pics of incisions when I get home, and daily, so I have a record of what things look like. I would start doing that now.
> 
> Do not feel bad about crating and the collar. I've had dogs on 6 weeks of crate rest after big surgeries - and did not feel bad for a second that they were in there - they needed that time to heal and rest, from the inside out.
> __________________



That's the thing, except for the one jump into the snow bank, I followed their activity instructions. He only went out on the leash. The care sheet says "no running, jumping, stairs, or rough housing". He was confined to a small area of the living room with me where I could constantly have eyes on him, and any time I couldn't directly look at him his e-collar went on. They didn't tell me to crate him for the first day, I just thought it would be best to be safe. I had no reason to believe that him walking around the livingroom would be bad, and that was ALL I let him do. And yeah, the one jump probably was enough to do some damage, but it was getting worse before that. 

The compress definitely wasn't too hot. It was just a washcloth run under hot water, by the time I got it to him I wasn't even sure it was warm enough to do any good, anyway. 

I had been taking pictures since the day after. I even called the vet the day before I brought him in and asked about the swelling and they said that it was normal for his scrotum to swell, and that gravity would make it swell more, too, just to keep watching the incision, and as long as the incision looked fine and he was acting normal (at the time he was) he didn't need to come in. 

I know that it's important and necessary, I just wish he'd stop howling. He's got too much energy. 




huntergreen said:


> if there was swelling when you picked him up, why not point this out to the vet? yes e collar stays on 24/7. i would ask about IV antibiotics at this point. sounds like you didn't completely understand the post op instructions/


I did, they said swelling of the scrotum post-op was normal. Actually the sheet they gave me with post-op instructions doesn't even list scrotal swelling as a reason to call, only swelling at the incision site. I did completely understand the post-op instructions, you may know what you've done or what your vet has told you in the past, but you don't know what my vet told me... I was more strict than the instructions say to be, except for that one jump - which I'm already kicking myself for glancing away, but I can't do anything about it now. 

Also, she said that he has to go back under anesthesia to aspirate it - that's what I meant by another surgery.


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## SummerGSDLover

I am so sorry you and your dog are going through this. You have sufficiently reinforced my decision to not fix my pup. At least not for a long time. Good luck. Please keep us updated on what happens. 

*-*Summer*-*


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## JakodaCD OA

Well swelling is normal, but not swelling that is bigger than what you started with..

I imagine the vet doesn't want to try and aspirate without sedation, mine was a very easy dog to work on so he didn't require sedation


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## TAR HEEL MOM

I have sent over close to 2000 dogs to be either spayed or neutered since my time at the shelter. They go to a clinic in another town and we pick them up the next day. I have only seen about 4 or 5 serious complications in that time. We almost never use an e-collar. We only do if we observe them licking. They go back in their kennels and we take them outside to potty. We limit exercise and all exposure to water (bathing/swimming) until the glue has sufficiently set (at least 5 days.) One of the worst we saw was one of the few dogs that got stitches and he had a reaction to the stitch material. In 99.9 % of our dogs you wouldn't know by the next day that they had even had surgery. The point of all of this is to say that I can't figure out why I hear so many scary tales of things gone wrong. We use a high volume spay/neuter clinic which has vet students doing surgeries and yet we have such a lower incidence of negative occurences. I just wonder about the competency of many vets out there..........


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## huntergreen

rad10, my comment was not meant to upset you. for some reason i didn't finish my sentence which should have included "or the post op instructions were not made clear to you". it is also possible there was nothing you could have done to prevent this.


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## BowWowMeow

I'm sorry your dog is having such terrible complications! The last foster I had neutered had a little swelling but not that much and I didn't keep him crated. I kept him quiet but did take him for short leash walks several times a day. 

It sounds like there is something else going on. especially if the site was very swollen when you picked him up: perhaps an allergy to the stitches or something else? 

I hope he improves quickly!


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## rad10

Update: 
I called the vet today about him not tolerating the warm compresses and long story short my husband ended up taking him back in today. The vet who actually did the surgery was there and looked at him and said he was very concerned, and he'd never seen anything like this before. He added prednisone (which is making keeping him calm even more fun), and said if it wasn't showing improvement by tomorrow he wanted to do surgery and completely remove his scrotum. I guess he thinks it's full of blood. I'm not sure why he wouldn't try to aspirate it before doing that...which is definitely what the other vet at the clinic had said they'd do. I didn't hear about this until after the vet had closed so I'll call and talk to them tomorrow. 

Thanks for all the responses, guys. I'm just... frustrated. I know that complications happen - sometimes even with the best post-op care. But I did my very best to do everything they told me to; I was even more restrictive than they told me I needed to be... they said the e-collar was optional, unless he kept trying to lick it, that I didn't need to crate him as long as he wasn't trying to run and jump and stuff. I crated him the first day and periodically after that whenever he was looking the slightest wound up. He's had the e-collar on any time I wasn't looking directly at him. I'm positive he wasn't licking it. He's been out only a short leash, no tug, no fetch, no running, no playing, I haven't even taken him on short walks. And the first thing the vet (that I'd never seen before) says to me is that I clearly had been allowing too much activity and that's why this happened. *sigh* oh well. I guess I just hope the swelling goes down fast so he can avoid another surgery


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## llombardo

My golden got fixed yesterday. I picked him up, the dog was not the least big groggy and ready to get into everything . I tried letting him out of the crate and he just won't be calm. I noticed some redness today and I don't like the coloring at all, but I don't see to much swelling and that is what I'm suppose to be watching for per the emergency vet I called today. They recommended cold compresses. I wish they would have given him tranquilizers because he hasn't really rested since he's been home. He sits in his crate giving me dirty looks and pulling anything he can into the crate. He is driving me nuts and I'm sure by Saturday I will be back at the vet with him. I have had several dogs fixed, but he is by far the worst. He has a blow up collar on, so he can't lick.


http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=161282&stc=1&d=1389251688


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## rad10

llombardo said:


> My golden got fixed yesterday. I picked him up, the dog was not the least big groggy and ready to get into everything . I tried letting him out of the crate and he just won't be calm. I noticed some redness today and I don't like the coloring at all, but I don't see to much swelling and that is what I'm suppose to be watching for per the emergency vet I called today. They recommended cold compresses. I wish they would have given him tranquilizers because he hasn't really rested since he's been home. He sits in his crate giving me dirty looks and pulling anything he can into the crate. He is driving me nuts and I'm sure by Saturday I will be back at the vet with him. I have had several dogs fixed, but he is by far the worst. He has a blow up collar on, so he can't lick.


Aw, poor boy! I'm definitely familiar with the dirty looks! I hope yours starts healing quickly and without complication. I know for mine, putting a sheet over his crate so he can't see out helps him calm down, if you're sure he can't lick you might try that if you haven't. 

As for mine, the vet's called me 3 times before 8am. Apparently they're all very concerned. He decided he doesn't want to do the ablation unless it's getting necrotic, though, so I'm going to watch him one more day since it doesn't seem any bigger and if it's not going down tomorrow they're going to do some light sedation wrap it really tight to see if that brings down the swelling...


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## huntergreen

rad10, did you tell the vet about the jump into the snowbank? might change their course of action.


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## rad10

huntergreen said:


> rad10, did you tell the vet about the jump into the snowbank? might change their course of action.


Yes. I described it to the vet who did the surgery, who told me that that really shouldn't have caused this type of response.


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## rad10

Ok, it looks like the swelling's gone down since yesterday (though it's definitely darker, and I couldn't get the same angle in the picture), but I'm paranoid it's just wishful thinking. If anyone's willing would you check the attached photos and let me know what you think?


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## huntergreen

wow, looks like they didn't remove the testicles. does it seem less sore than before, warm to the touch? most likely fluid build up, i would want to know why. i might even check with another vet hosp.


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## rad10

huntergreen said:


> wow, looks like they didn't remove the testicles. does it seem less sore than before, warm to the touch? most likely fluid build up, i would want to know why. i might even check with another vet hosp.


I know 

The vet who did the surgery thinks it's filled with blood. I told him everything we'd done since he came home and he said I did everything right and he doesn't know what's causing this. I asked about a possible reaction to the sutures and he said he used the same sutures for every dog he's ever neutered and never had a reaction, but there's no way to know for sure.

He doesn't seem to be in quite as much pain as before, though the tramadol's probably helping with that, too. It's no more warm than his normal skin temp.


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## SummerGSDLover

I would get a second opinion. Poor baby. 

*-*Summer*-*


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## Stosh

Stosh had some swelling as well and my vet recommended hydrotherapy- which amounted to gently spraying the area with water for 20 mins twice a day. It's a lot of time but 10 mins won't do any good. It was during the summer so I used the hose. It helped quite a bit. Also walking on a lead for about 10 mins at a time eased the swelling.


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## rad10

Stosh said:


> Stosh had some swelling as well and my vet recommended hydrotherapy- which amounted to gently spraying the area with water for 20 mins twice a day. It's a lot of time but 10 mins won't do any good. It was during the summer so I used the hose. It helped quite a bit. Also walking on a lead for about 10 mins at a time eased the swelling.


Thanks for the suggestion. He has dissolvable sutures, and I don't think I could that without soaking the incision so I think that's a no-go for us right now, unfortunately. I'm glad it helped you though


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## vom Eisenherz

Just more and more drugs, huh? Why would they not aspirate it or just remove the scrotum? 

Prednisone is very useful but can be VERY dangerous. I would seriously question the skill of a vet who botches something like this (or even performs it on a 1yr old large breed in the first place!) and then just throws more and more meds at it without knowing exactly what the heck happened in the first place. Unacceptable, imo. 

I'd get a totally un-related opinion, if you haven't done so already. Too bad that you have to worry about doctors and vets playing CYA.


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## Sunflowers

vom Eisenherz said:


> I would seriously question the skill of a vet who botches something like this (or even performs it on a 1yr old large breed in the first place!)


At what age would it be acceptable in your opinion, if performing a neuter on a one year old large breed is questionable?


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## LifeofRiley

Has your dog been tested for Von Willebrand’s Disease?

I ask because you mentioned excessive bruising post procedure and your vet seems to think the swelling might be due to excessive bleeding.


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## readaboutdogs

I would wonder about being allergic to the dissolvable stitches. I had a skin cancer removed and turned out I had a reaction to those type of stitches! The incision was about 5 inches and was all puffy and infected like! They shot cortisone into the incision and gave me antibiotics. Pieces of the "tread" still comes to the surface 6 months later. It is kinda rare but not really when you google it. They couldn't really do anything else for it, just had to wait it out. When hooch was fixed they used glue on the outside and that seemed to take longer to heal too, with my other dogs they never had a problem. Hope they can at least try to aspirate first help maybe.


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## llombardo

My pups resemble your dogs(looking at pictures)not as dark yet. I took him back to the vet today and they called it slight bruising, but were not concerned. When I called the e vet they explained the blood going into the sac as something that could happen. Try calling an e-vet and see what they say.


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## huntergreen

the steroid should be reducing the swelling by now. if by three today it is not clearly smaller, less swelling, take him back to the vet. if they can't give more concrete answers try an evet or another vet. my concern is there is active bleeding in the scrotum.


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## rad10

huntergreen said:


> the steroid should be reducing the swelling by now. if by three today it is not clearly smaller, less swelling, take him back to the vet. if they can't give more concrete answers try an evet or another vet. my concern is there is active bleeding in the scrotum.


When I checked it today it was about half the size it was when we first took him in. The meds are definitely working.


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## OriginalWacky

rad10 said:


> When I checked it today it was about half the size it was when we first took him in. The meds are definitely working.


How is your pup doing today? Hopefully things are finally getting back to normal for you.


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## rad10

OriginalWacky said:


> How is your pup doing today? Hopefully things are finally getting back to normal for you.


Better, I think. His scrotum is down to about half the size it was before he was neutered, and he's acting a lot perkier. But he's started this thing where when he pees he kind of starts and stops and starts again, and the stream looks a lot weaker than normal - but the color's good. I'm going to call the vet again in the morning, I'm not sure if it could be a med side effect or a uti or whether I should be worried or not...


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## BowWowMeow

I'm glad that the swelling is going down. If there's a change in his pee stream then I would definitely call the vet. Has he been doing that since the surgery or did it just start?


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## rad10

BowWowMeow said:


> I'm glad that the swelling is going down. If there's a change in his pee stream then I would definitely call the vet. Has he been doing that since the surgery or did it just start?


Just started. And yes, I'm planning to call in the morning.


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## wolfy dog

Make sure before the vet tries another medicine or antibiotics, just to try....there is no bleeding internally that presses on / compromises the urethra. I would take him to another vet. I am so sorry for you and your dog.
So here, neutering is not as easy as it is always portrayed to be. Please keep us posted.


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## BowWowMeow

Yes, I was thinking that something was pressing on the urethra as well.


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## huntergreen

that can be caused by narcotic, are you still using pain med ?


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## rad10

huntergreen said:


> that can be caused by narcotic, are you still using pain med ?


He was on tramadol, but I haven't given him any today, he hasn't seemed in any pain.


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## Sunflowers

I am too outraged to comment on this thread about the vet.
Give that poor boy some ear scratches for me.


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## huntergreen

rad10,,, in people this drug is called ultram. in people, it can affect the prostrate of older guys. no idea if it would affect a dog in this way. it can also cause excessive thirst. first be alert for the inability to pee, distended ab and will feel bloated to the touch and will be painful to the touch. my working theory would be his urinary tract is inflamed including the prostrate due to the surgery. the med may have added to this, should only become an issue if he is unable to pee. should pass.


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## BowWowMeow

Updates on your dog?


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