# i think i may have to get rid of our GSH



## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

can someone please help...we have a beautiful GSD, she is about 7 yrs old, and has always been untrainable. 

she has a very aggressive personality, she bullies our lab around mercilessly.

she will not listen to our commands, on the occasions where she attacked other dogs, we were right there and would yell at her, grab her and try to pull her off, and she was frenzied is the only word that comes to mind.

she has yet to attack a human, but we have 2 small children and I am a little afraid of what she might do in the future.


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## Winkin (Feb 21, 2007)

Have you had her since she was a puppy?


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

yes, since she was 5 weeks old


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## ShatteringGlass (Jun 1, 2006)

Have you talked to any professional dog trainers in your area? That would be my first step.


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

we bought her from a breeder, we tried to train her her, took her to classes, she learned all the commands, and was a star in class, but put her in an uncontrolled setting and it is chaos.


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

our vet told us that she may have psychological problems, have you ever heard of such a thing?


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

In my experience vets, even good vets, are not good with canine behavior. You'd think they would be but they're not. It's just not something that vet school deals with. 

These all sound like training issues not dog issues. You need a good behaviorist in your area who can do an evaluation?


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Talk to a GOOD professional trainer or perhaps a good dog behaviorist if there is one available. They can be invaluable in deciphering a dogs behavior and also how to modify it!


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

Talk to a GOOD professional trainer or perhaps a good dog behaviorist if there is one available. They can be invaluable in deciphering a dogs behavior and also how to modify it!


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

I don't really think that is going to be an option. We have lived with this dog for nearly 7 years, she has attacked our lab, who we have also had since she was 7weeks old, to the point where there was blood. We have 2 very small children. There is a point where my family has to be my number one concern. We have tried several different trainers, we have had consultations and sessions with private trainers since she was a puppy. The only thing that has ever worked was a training collar that used electricity. Which in my mind doesn't change the behavior, only prevents it.


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

The fact that you've had her 7 years and she hasn't bitten anyone is pretty good evidence that these are behavioral problems not medical problems. The fact that an e-collar worked is further evidence that this is a training issue. If that worked, there are other approaches that would work as well. 

Nothing you're describing is unfixable if the owners want to fix it - but it will definitely take getting some quality professional help.


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

any ideas on why she would maul her kennel mate so badly?

oh yes, she did bite my husband once, on the face, nearly took his nose off. they were wrestling around on the ground, and it quickly went from fun to not so fun. After that incident we cut out the rough play completely.


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

So she's 7 yo, has she always been like this? By bully do you mean hard play/pestering or attacks? Is the lab older or younger?

When you talk about "attacking other dogs" were they out in a social setting? Was there anything that might have triggered it? Was she socialized as a pup with other dogs?

Sorry for so many questions but it will help in understanding the problem.


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

There are any number of reasons. Without knowing more about the context it would be impossible to hazard a guess. Based on the little info in the two situations you just described it sounds like she gets overstimulated and/or scared in high contact situations, but again, not really enough info to say.


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## littledmc17 (Apr 9, 2008)

Personally I think you and your husband need to exercise her more, train her even more
there are NO bad dogs only bad owners
My lab sounds like your GSD and when we got her she had NO training at all played hard and sometimes she is head strong but we have her under control 
you have had her 7 years come on now that is wrong do something for her and get a trainer


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

we bought our GSD in november when she was 5wks old, and we got our Lab the following April when she was only 7 weeks old. we have had both dogs since they were tiny. They grew up together. In the last few years she has become terribly aggressive towards The Lab. She has always been the alpha female, but lately, she is scary. The first time it happened was when a friend was playing fetch with the 2 of them, they both love it, and usually the GSd retrieves the ball, only because the Lab yields to her every time. The friend was petting the Lab, and the GSD came over and attacked the Lab, and scared us all pretty bad, drew blood on the Lab. The last time it happened my brother in law was playing with both of them, petting them talking to them, and the shephard turned on the Lab and bit her so hard, I thought the Lab might bleed to death, she filled an entire bath towel with blood, and it was all over my deck. I was so upset, i separated them for weeks!


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

Have you had her thyroid checked? She's at an age where low thyroid is common. I still think the majority of her problems are training issues but being low thyroid will definitely make a dog with some aggression much more aggressive and easily riled up.


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

You know what, i did not come on this forum to be bad mouthed...I know how to be a good owner. She is an outside dog and excises all day! we take them to the beach, and wear them them out completely, and in case you forgot to read the earlier posts, exactly how many trainers are enough for me to not be a good owner???

just wondering....thanks


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## cleodosia (Sep 4, 2009)

pupresq...I never thought to get her thyroid checked. Thanks for the idea!


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

We had a similar issue with our female GSD at about your dog's age. She is a good dog with a lot of training but she's always been on the "edgy" side. When her thyroid got low she was like someone with crazy PMS - she kept snarling and snapping at the other dogs and had a hair trigger. There are a couple different thyroid tests, so you want to make sure you get the most conclusive work done to really make sure what you're dealing with.

Hopefully that'll be the problem - it means daily pills but they're cheap and easy and will at least bring your dog back to the level where she used to be and make further training and modifications easier.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

oh yeah...thyroid...definitely get that checked. Our oldest boxer was getting quite aggressive and it was thyroid. Riley's Mom could tell you some stories also.


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## aubie (Dec 22, 2008)

Sorry, more questions!









When you say outside, is she outside in a kennel/yard all day and is she with the lab or are they apart? Do you do any other exercise other than her being in the yard? Fetch or even mental exercise like obedience training/learning tricks?

It almost sounds like the problems arise when the lab is getting attention from someone, then she goes into something almost like resource guarding, or guarding the thing that gives her attention. How much time do you spend with her a day? 

I know I sound like a popquiz man, just trying to figure out the puzzle.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

This thread might be of some help

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=554900&page=1&gonew=1#UNREAD


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

get a grip! no one called you a bad owner - these folks are only trying to help!

BTW, sometimes it takes a while to find an effective pro trainer - in my area there are really no qualifying reqs for trainers - anyone can hang out a shingle, so to speak!

So maybe it might help if you can find a good one - ask your vet or maybe there might be a breed or an obedience club or two in your area to check with.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

BTW a little off topic but Why does a low thyroid increase a dogs aggressivness?


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## pupresq (Dec 2, 2005)

It doesn't necessarily. In a lot of dogs it just makes them fat, cold, and sluggish. But in other dogs it can make them extremely "sharp" and reactive to things. I don't know the actual biology of why it does that but my guess would be something to do with altering the endocrine system biology - maybe altering the way dogs are producing and processing things like stress hormones?


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## Elaine (Sep 10, 2006)

You have two bitches in the same house? There is a reason for the saying bitch fight and why it is generally not recommended to do that. There are many threads on this and just because your dog is aggressive to your other bitch, does not have any relation to her being aggressive to people.


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## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

If you brought your dog home at 5 weeks old, she missed out on a lot of important socialization skills that are learned from their littermates and mom between 5-8 weeks old. If she is missing these skills she may have trouble relating or communicating with other dogs or can exhibit aggression, fear and/or frustration.


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## BJDimock (Sep 14, 2008)

Any hormone imbalence will change a dogs temperment. With thyroid, we often see dogs that get lethargic and gain weight, but occasionally, we see the dogs who get overreactive, and become hyper aggressive.
Another training question for you, and I don't want it to come over badly. (I have had a very Alpha bitch twice. The first one I didn't do such a great job with)
Do you spend time with her every day, reinforcing what she does in classes? (Alone.)
Here is my feeling. (Thyroid, and other medicle issues aside), it sounds like you have a strong Alpha who feels she is over you. 
I understand your concerns with your kids. I really do. If I felt like I couldn't control a dog, then my kids and the dog would Never interact.
If you are really willing to work on this, then nothing in her life is free from now on. Feed times... Feed the lab first, and make her go to a safe spot. (crate.....)
Time outside...whichever dog you choose to go out, goes out first.
Be sure you are ready to instantly reward any behavior she does to your liking!
Make her do obiediance training at random times. 
Keep in mind that you are NOT taking away her positon in the pack, but you are reinforcing your own.
A behaviorist, or trainer in your area that will come to your home and work in your enviroment would be a huge help.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Ok, you have a couple things going against you.

First, you got the Shepherd WAY too young. Puppies learn valuable life lessons from their siblings and Dan between 5 and 8 weeks of age. Things like bite inhibition, dog social skills and more.

Second, you have two females. The majority of the time having two females is a VERY bad idea - especially if it is JUST the two females.

Possible third - you say the Shepherd is an outside dog.:



> Quote:She is an outside dog


Being outside all day does NOT mean they automatically get enough exercise. And you need to exercise their MIND as well as their body.

Do a Google search on NILIF. It stands for Nothing In Life Is Free. It is a way of teaching a dog good behavior that is non-confrontational.

One word of note - unless you bring the dog IN the house and make it an integral part of the family there really isn't much you can do to reshape the behaviors.


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## BJDimock (Sep 14, 2008)

I will add just one more thing!
I have a pack of 4 bitches and one male.
They co exist very happily(with the occasional snarks, but no horrible issues, on the female side.)
It can be done. (Yes, I have a breeding female in the mix.)


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## BJDimock (Sep 14, 2008)

One more question!!!!
Are they spayed?


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## SunCzarina (Nov 24, 2000)

Dog on dog aggression does not equal dog on human aggression.



> Originally Posted By: cleodosiashe has yet to attack a human, but we have 2 small children and I am a little afraid of what she might do in the future.


My bitch is the Queen of Mean, if I let her, she would tear the head off another dog who looked at her the wrong way. She knows I don't tolerate brawling so you wouldn't believe the amount of aggravation she takes from my younger male before she snaps and stuffs him into a wall or a recycling bin.

My kids, however, she might herd them around and occasionally tackle one of them for being too wild. Bite them, never, those are her babies and pity the fool who touches her babies on her watch (lol yeah the A Team is on the retro channel again!)


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## Effie325 (Aug 19, 2009)

Slightly off topic, but are GSDs known for female on female aggression? I've had many dogs and countless fosters (including several female GSDs and Salukis and Goldens at once in a fairly small house at the time- this was the better part of a decade ago) and I've never had a problem. The Saluki bitches would bicker mildly now and then, but they were rescued from deplorable, starving conditions and were all old and grouchy. 

For the original poster- I don't think you're a bad owner. I just think you sound frustrated and at a loss. Almost like you want someone to validate your position. Only you know your dog, and if a dog was endangering my son or my other dogs, I would definitely not keep it. However, I feel, like some other posters, that your dog has a lot of potential. It's too late to repair the young age at which she was adopted, but it's not too late to check her thyroid, enlist the help of a trainer (a better, or different trainer- even a great trainer may not be the best match for YOUR dog. Keep searching!).

Have her examined. Separate her from the Labrador when possible, and follow your gut. You obviously care about her, or you wouldn't be here


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: Effie325Slightly off topic, but are GSDs known for female on female aggression? !).


Yes!!!!


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## BlackGSD (Jan 4, 2005)

Your dog is NOT "untrainable"!

You said yourself:



> Quote:...took her to classes, she learned all the commands, and was a star in class,.......


Taking them to classes is GREAT. BUT you need to keep up with the training at home for the LIFE of the dog. Not just take them to class and that's it.

I really hope you seperate her from the Lab before one of them ends up dead. (I am NOT just being "dramatic", things like this can and DO sometimes happen.) THere was a post on this very forum a few months ago from someone that left their 2 females alone together outside. When they came home, they discovered that one had killed the other.

The fact that the dogs have lived together for years means NOTHING.


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## amjrchamberlain (Mar 8, 2005)

I think you've gotten sound advice here. It might be hard to hear, I agree with the poster above who said that it sounds like you are looking for someone to validate you and say, "yes it is ok for you to "get rid" of your GSD". 

But, I believe you owe it to your girl to try to find her quality help so that she can remain in your family. If you need a trainer/behaviorist referral, you are welcome to ask and I'm sure we can find someone in your area who is qualified to help you. 

I'm not saying you are a "bad owner", actually, I don't think anyone has said that here (if they did, I missed it). 

Please let us know what we can do to help.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

I think you want to get rid of the shepherd. 

I agree completely with what Laurie said. 

The shep was too young and missed the part of litter socialization where they learn how to interact with other dogs. 

Then you put in another bitch about six months younger. 

So you have two bitches that are approximately the same age. 

With two small children, no way were you able to put the time into training and socializing two young puppies properly. 

Spaying bitches removes hormones that can actually calm things, however, when the hormones are raging, either when they are coming into heat or when they are in heat, you can have some heightened issues. 

You have found that rough play is not a good idea, but the dog has reached seven years old and still does not listen and has pretty much taken the leadership role because it was free for the taking.

And yet you let a cousin(?) take both dogs out and play a game of fetch with two bitches. This RAMPS them up. The lab defers to the more dominant bitch understanding her doggy place. The human feels sorry for the lab and pets and makes a fuss over it. The dominant bitch attacks the lower ranking bitch BECAUSE of the attention the human gave it. 

No. you really do not want your dogs to act like this. If the lab is inside when the shep is an outside dog, that may increase animosity. 

My suggestion is to keep the two bitches completely separated at this point. Bring them inside and make them a part of the family. Practice Nothing IN LIFE IS FREE with BOTH bitches. Increase exercise -- no they do not get exercise just because there is a field out there. You need to go out there and wear them out, one at a time, throwing a ball or something, then take her for a walk, and do some training. Get her into training classes. My guess is that this is aggression toward a pack member and may not be aggression toward any dog she sees. She has had classes before, and while it is possible that she is dog aggressive, it is certainly not a given. 

A seven year old dog should have a complete check up with blood work and mention thyroid in particular because if they don't they may not bother. However, there are certainly enough things going on that there does not need to be a medical reason. 

Read up on leadership, nothing in life is free, Collene McCollough (not sure of the spelling) but she seems very good. There are others. You do not want to act aggressively to this dog to get the upper hand, instead you want to be in charge of the goodies, the food, the outside, the pets, the good places. You want to block with your body and go through small areas first. You want to impress that you are indeed the leader. 

What I am suggesting is a change in lifestyle and frankly, not everyone is up to it. People give up senior dogs and there are simply not a waiting list of potential owners for these used pets. It is a crappy thing to do, to raise a dog from a puppy and then give up on her when she is getting on in years. If you must do this, if you really cannot commit to changing your approach to this dog, than please find a shepherd rescue for her instead of just dropping her at a shelter. 

Her breeder is a Back yard breeder at best, and a puppy mill at worst. I do not think there will be any help there. Good breeders do not let puppies go at five week. 

If the bite to your husband happened when she was a mature bitch, then it is possible that a rescue may not be willing to work with her. It sounds like it was playing that got out of hand. I would provide as much information as possible about the incident. 

I do not think your dog is hopeless, untrainable, dog aggressive, sick, psychologically flawed, or bad. I think that she was not well matched to her owners, and that some work on your part can literally turn her completely around. 

I also think that if she and the lab both understand the order of things, people can cause a lot of problems trying to even things up. 

Good luck. I really hope you can do right by your girl. This is totally not her fault, and I think that is the first thing you need to understand.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

maybe hard to hear but all very good advice. i also hope you do right by this dog, tho the feeling that comes thru your words is that you've already made up your mind what you want to do. i would surely not listen to the vet who said she had psychological problems. if you really want that accurately assessed, it should be done by a behaviorist. not a trainer a behaviorist, there is a difference. wishing for the best for your girl.


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## zyppi (Jun 2, 2006)

I believe you would not have posted if you didn't want to help this dog. Good for you,

Sounds like this situation is a bit overwhelming right now.

!st, take a deep breathe and know that you are in charge. Just believing that goes a long way in training/controlling a dog. They read your confidence.

2nd, know that Labs and GSDs are very different. Both bright but the GSD will need more mental stimualtion. It can be as simple as a one on one session - say 10 to 15 minutes twice daily where you put the dog through simple exercises such as sit, down, stay etc... set up in such a way that your dog obeys and gets rewarded ( a treat or a heartfelt 'good dog/ will do). You'd be amazed at the controf and confidence that wiil give you in a very short time.

I wouldn't jump to conclusion that dog on dog agression would morf into any thing more.

Example with husband sounds like overstimulation and possibly inappropriate play.

Good luck.


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## Riley's Mom (Jun 7, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: cleodosiawe bought our GSD in november when she was 5wks old, and we got our Lab the following April when she was only 7 weeks old.


Part of the problem is that you're getting dogs that are to young to be away from Mom and siblings. Five weeks is RIDICULOUSLY young and just begging for behavior problems. During the last few weeks pups learn from Mom and from siblings about behavior and both your dogs got shorted in that department.

I must have missed something. You've had the dog for seven years and have small children so the kids are not new on the scene and now after all this time you're looking to get rid of the dog? I'm lost. It sounds like efforts at training were there, but just not enough nor enough consistency. At 7, your dog should be slowing down due to normal aging. What am I missing?

I really think that getting rid of the dog is not fair to the dog. This dog has lived w/you for 7 years and from a way to young age. These issues should have been addressed much earlier in her life and been continuous for the length of her life.

However, if you're not willing and able to provide what the dog needs on a consistent loving basis then I would say to rehome her to someone who really wants her and has the time, energy and desire to give her what she needs. It sounds like you have way to much going on at your house to deal properly with her and a little bit like you'd like to not have to deal with her anymore.


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## GSDElsa (Jul 22, 2009)

OK. I’m by no means a dog or German Shepherd (this is our first GSD) expert, but I think I might be able to lay some things out for you to help you understand why, from the moment you got her, how the chain of events of her life led to this behavior. If any of the trainers or breeders feel I’m saying something in error, correct me.

I am not (nor is anyone else) trying to say “you’re a bad owner” by brining up these things, but I’m sure a lot of us feel that you need to understand how your situation got to this point to be able to help your dog possibly overcome this aggression issue.

First, obviously rule out any health issues such as thyroid.

Here’s the chain of events, in order as I understand them:
As others have said, your dog was WAY too young when she was brought home. Those extra 3 weeks are crucial for dogs to learn socialization and to be taught correct behavior. As the personality develops, mom and other littermates are there round-the-clock to make sure everyone is behaving in an acceptable manner. Your dog lost over 500 hours of this natural training and development right off the bat. This does not make you a horrible person, but makes you an uneducated dog owner to take her home this early. It DOES, in my opinion, make the breeder out to be a horrible person.

Second mistake was getting a second dog when she was only 6 months old. Again, makes you uneducated, and I feel that a good breeder would never have sent one of their dogs to a home with another female that was only 6 months old. And, I also think your second dog came home a good week too early as well, but it’s better than 5 weeks. So, that breeder has 2 strikes against them. From what I understand, the best time to introduce a second dog in the mix is when the 1st is a good year old, well-trained, and completely reliant on you. When you get more than 1 dog together when they are that young, they begin to rely on one another and focus on one another too much, and you become background noise without ever really being able to establish that PEOPLE are the LEADERS. You might be part of the pack, but they don’t think of you as the top dogs. 

Also, the female issue is a problem…dogs (GSD’s a lot!) have problems with same sex living situations. They see the same sex animal as competition in a way, and dominance and aggression can come out. Again, it can work out, but you have to be very proactive about the situation. Our recently-adopted GSD is a VERY VERY dominant female. Unchecked, I could easily see it turning into a battle of the girls. However, she’s been fine with all the girls she’s met-from equally as dominant to super-submissive (funny, everyone we know has female dogs!). Why? Because she KNOWS she cannot get away with anything. From day 1 she was expected to behave a certain way in ALL her activities. She is with us at all times except when we’re at work, so we can constantly make sure she’s acting in an acceptable manner. This discipline at home has paid off tremendously with dog interactions. She’s dominant and under-socialized, but when we “ehhhh” her when she’s with another dog for getting to be “too much”, you better bet that’s all it takes for her to back off. If she gets attitude and doesn’t listen, play time is temporarily over and she has to go into a down stay. BUT…she’s being supervised. She’s not running around in the backyard with these dogs for hours with her dominant behavior unchecked. 

Third mistake is making them outdoor dogs and that this constitutes exercise. I will say that there ARE dogs and people that have healthy relationships when they are outdoor dogs…but it’s not easy and takes a lot of work. First problem with this situation is that you are not around to supervise and correct when bad behavior happens. They are in the backyard/kennel together at all times. Your GSD likely began her aggression with her “kennelmate” in the backyard. Since they didn’t see you as the leader because of their ages when you brought them together and the fact they weren’t separated and supervised, the dominance went uncorrected. GSD’s are working dogs bred to be with HUMANS. They crave being part of the family and having a job to do. They want to follow you around the house and yard, watching over their people. This is what is in their genes. Beyond their intelligence, there is a reason why they are used in so many human-related service tasks. They need constant interaction and stimulation. Many a GSD has gone bad because of boredom (ie owners thinking being in the backyard all the time is constant exercise). Stick a pack on her and take her hiking. Give her things to find on the hikes. Do down stays on leash where one person hides and the other has the leash and have her search for you. Pretend she has a very important job to do.

From what you have described, your dog is obviously smart. Probably too smart. Smart, dominant, under-socialized dogs easily can decide that THEY are boss. It sounds like that is exactly what your girl has done.

I think you need to find a very good trainer who specializes in large breed behavioral issues. Just because you have gone to a lot of trainers doesn’t mean they were good, or that you constantly followed through on what you learned. 

As far as the specifics beyond that, I’ll leave that up to the people that have had more experience dealing with these kind of behavioral issues. I do hope that you understand that going back and telling you “you shouldn’t have don’t that” is not trying to bash you and trying to accuse you of being a bad owner. It is trying to help you understand how it got to the point that your dog behaves in this manner. Yes, mistakes were made, but no good things will come about unless there are some major changes. In my opinion, this starts with becoming house dogs that are constantly under your watchful eye.


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## Riley's Mom (Jun 7, 2007)

GSDElsa - right on, Baby! Excellent information and very well put. They are not bad owners, but they are uneducated and there are many things they can do to make their situation better. There have been some really good suggestions. It's to late to change how the dogs came to live there and at what age, but there is plenty can be done even now.


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## Mary Jane (Mar 3, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: cleodosia we have 2 small children and I am a little afraid of what she might do in the future.


One tiny remark: if you have the time and patience to follow the good suggestions provided here (and that's a big IF), then what your dog might do in the future is BECOME THE BEST FRIEND OF YOUR SMALL CHILDREN.

I hope it works out for everybody in your family.


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## jfisher (Dec 29, 2005)

Glad to see the OP keeping up with the situation and taking into consideration all this helpful info he's been given...









I may be in kind of a "mood" right now, but I think that poor dog's fate was already decided from the first post the OP made...

-Jackie


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

don't think it's your "mood" at all, the energy of the op's words is quite clear. no surprise they've not been back.

many blessings sent out to the dog.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

Sounds like someone who wanted a magic bullet or else approval for "getting rid" of the dog. Sounds like a dog that could have a lot of drive and could have been great in the right situation.


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## katieliz (Mar 29, 2007)

well thank you to everyone who spent so much time writing here to give the op some absolutely great opinions, suggestions, and advice. someone will read it and benefit, i'm sure!


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## Mandalay (Apr 21, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: Riley's Mom However, if you're not willing and able to provide what the dog needs on a consistent loving basis then I would say to rehome her to someone who really wants her and has the time, energy and desire to give her what she needs. It sounds like you have way to much going on at your house to deal properly with her and a little bit like you'd like to not have to deal with her anymore.


I kind of got this feeling, too. I dont think she wanted to work through the issues with this dog. This is going to mean that this dog is either going to live its life away from its family or remain in a stressful situation. I would not normally tell someone to give up a dog after 7 years, but I hope this dog ends up in a situation where people understand, love and are willing to work with it.


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## Puddincat (Dec 14, 2008)

The training needs to be continued throughout life. I also think the problems start with poor socialization/bad breeders with pups removed from mom so young. I wish you all the best, great advice was given here. I hope you decided to keep your dog and work with her to help her be the best dog she can be.


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## Réa538 (Mar 25, 2021)

cleodosia said:


> I don't really think that is going to be an option. We have lived with this dog for nearly 7 years, she has attacked our lab, who we have also had since she was 7weeks old, to the point where there was blood. We have 2 very small children. There is a point where my family has to be my number one concern. We have tried several different trainers, we have had consultations and sessions with private trainers since she was a puppy. The only thing that has ever worked was a training collar that used electricity. Which in my mind doesn't change the behavior, only prevents it.


Firstly, so sorry to hear of your struggle! A GSD can be very scary if they are unpredictable. My one question that I havent seen asked yet....sorry if I missed it...how much exercise does your dog get? All animals require excercise and mental stimulation but GSDs more than labs or other more docile breeds. That is almost more important than training. If there is not enough excercise....and I mean, drain all the energy till they are ready to sleep activities, not just leisurely walks around the neighborhood....their brains will never enter a calm state of mind and problem behaviors start. You may also try a weighted pack or saddle bags so a regular walk around the neighborhood is more challenging! Hope this helps, and good luck!


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## Réa538 (Mar 25, 2021)

Réa538 said:


> Firstly, so sorry to hear of your struggle! A GSD can be very scary if they are unpredictable. My one question that I havent seen asked yet....sorry if I missed it...how much exercise does your dog get? All animals require excercise and mental stimulation but GSDs more than labs or other more docile breeds. That is almost more important than training. If there is not enough excercise....and I mean, drain all the energy till they are ready to sleep activities, not just leisurely walks around the neighborhood....their brains will never enter a calm state of mind and problem behaviors start. You may also try a weighted pack or saddle bags so a regular walk around the neighborhood is more challenging! Hope this helps, and good luck!


It appears you already talked about excercise, sorry I missed that!


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## Lexie’s mom (Oct 27, 2019)

This is a thread from 2009!


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## herojig (Apr 3, 2013)

Lexie’s mom said:


> This is a thread from 2009!


Ha! This stuff is haunting with the algos they use to send out emails and compose newsletters and whatnot. Here I am thinking about a dog that can't be cured (or can he?) and he's been dead for years. Wtf. Its bad enough that I had to face the reality that yes, some GSDs can't be fixed to suit everyone, but in the 20 years of working with dogs here in Nepal, I've never seen that case, unless rabies or other extreme calamity was involved. Certainly not for a groomed pet. But if I were to take this site seriously, I'd think that all GSDs are bitters, snappers and yappers... but I know better.


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