# OMG. My GSD killed little dog



## cagal

I'm so upset. My GSD was in the back with me and my neighbour was dogsitting another neighbours chihuahua. Hunter saw it and took off like a shot. We don't have fencing between about 5 houses and the dog was in a sort of "no mans land" that's city property but runs behind all our houses. He's always hated that little dog and had I known he was out there would never have taken him outside. I'm just sick over it. I truly believe my dog saw the other as a rabbit. He's always barking at them, coyotes and deer in the back. He's never been aggressive with people One bite and it was over.


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## scarfish

man


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## cagal

My neighbour is also (understandably) upset but she doesn't blame my dog. Worse yet the owners are away for two weeks but we are going away before they get back. I did file a report with the city immediately


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## gsdsar

Your poor neighbor. How horrible. Have they been called? I
Ugh. I can't even imagine. 

I hope you will take steps now to prevent your dog from being able to leave your property again. A leash or a fence.


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## cagal

The owners are out of country and my neighbour doesn't want to call I don't have number. The reason
we don't have a fence is when we moved in they all begged us not to put one in. I'm sorry now we didn't. No one else has a pet for all the houses without fencing


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## cagal

Hindsight is always great. My neighbour didn't want me to call the city but it was the right thing to do. I feel so awful!


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## Thecowboysgirl

I had a dog who was capable if this, was prey drive only as he was not dog aggressive at all. Mine never killed another dog (or injured), but it was due to constant vigilance. If I took him into a vet waiting room that was too small he wore a basket muzzle. I was waiting in a waiting room once, him laying at my feet, and a lady walked in with two micro yorkies. I saw him lock on (the predatory stare). Whipped his muzzle out and put it on him even though they were across the room. The lady says "oh he wouldn't hurt fluffy". Oh yes he would. He was a killer, not messing around straight for the throat and kill shot. He killed lots of non dog animals and once went after my neighbor's BT, same situation as you, he saw it in the field next to my house and went for it, not realizing it was a dog. Difference was he was e collar trained and wearing it therefor I was able to stop him. That was before I knew just what a killer he was, he was not offleash in areas like that e collar or not after I knew.

You have a responsibility now that you know what your dog is capable of, not to let him offleash , or un muzzled in an area where he might get a small animal on leash.


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## cagal

Agreed. I think a fence is order despite what the other neighbours want. BTW he's ALWAYS on leash on walks and I always make sure we give other owners healthy distance for the dogs I know he dislikes. This was in my back yard and a really unfortunate set of circumstances. I'm not trying to justify - I just was truly not expecting another dog out back when I know none of my neighbours have one.


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## carmspack

good fences make for good neighbours

put up a kennel enclosure where the dog will be at al time
when outdoors and not on some sort of long line

terrible situation

the dogsitting neighbour also should have taken precautions , a kennel to
pop the dog into --- 

when you do a favour like this you have extra responsiblity


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## T-Bone'sMamma

So sorry this happened, for all people and dogs involved  The dog sitting neighbor really needs to inform the owners- I know you can't make them though. I hope your local dog ordinances don't categorize him now as dangerous ? ((Hugs))


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## cagal

We'll see. If the owners make a dog bite complaint then it goes from there. My other neighbours are freaked out but the general consensus is the owners probably won't complain. The dog was very old and sick and the owner was delaying euthanasia so the neighbours that know them well are thinking they may be pissed off but will let it go at same time. I don't really know them unfortunately. If they choose not to put in a complaint then the whole thing ends from an "official" point. I just hate that everyone assumes dog aggression means people aggression despite fact hunter had been in the backyard with them, their grandkids etc for 7 years with absolutely no interest in people. He simply does not like small animals and I knew that. As I noted, had I known the other dog was out, never in a million years would I take hunter outside. That's what makes it even worse for me - it could have been avoided.


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## HappyFurKid

I'm so sorry that you're having to go through this. It has to be extremely stressful for everyone involved. A hug doesn't seem enough, but it's all I can think to do right now. ***Hugs***


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## lorihd

just horrible for the owners that are coming back from vacation. My dog is small dog aggressive, I cannot leave her off leash, there are deer, cats, bird, squirrels etc, all of which she views as prey. I'm sorry this happened, must be sick about it, leash the dog from now on, or get a fence, you just cant trust the dog not to attack a small critter.


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## cagal

Thanks - I'm just sick about it! I can't even look at my dog right now even though I know he can't help it. He has super high prey drive. It's not his fault - it's mine. 30 seconds if inattention lead to this.

Edit - I meant thanks for the hugs.


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## Stonevintage

Sorry this happened.... If this was surprise - it wouldn't be to me.... on either side....

There is "most of the pet population" that thinks all is good after a while... but when dogs don't get along - regardless of size- it's a time for precautions/barriers and preventative measures. This was a predictable possible outcome and it came to be. You had pre warning of the problem and both parties chose to ignore it...

IMO - it was never a matter of IF, but WHEN.... Everyone wants their dog to run as free as possible....In most cases - this does not work.


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## wolfy dog

That is awful. Technically both dogs were at fault for not being on their own property, is that right? Was the Chihuahua leashed?


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## ZABDI SHAMAR

I'm so sorry. I know it has to be awful to have that guilt. I would put fence up. Also make it dig proof at bottom. If he likes small animals even a fence may not be enough if he can dig under it. I got cement around privacy fence just put in...mine like to be with me constantly so they really don't hang out outside alone in back yard. I did though add cement because I was paranoid of any issues...my neighborhood is full of young kids and although my 3 dogs are kid proof( I have 6 kids) I did not want them getting out and someone complaining. 

Learn from it and sincerely apologize to dogs owner. I am sure they will be upset but may be ok because how you have handled it and show compassion maybe offer to make a donation in pets name to local dog shelter. 

Hang in there...


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## middleofnowhere

Junk happens. I'm sorry for everyone concerned. Upsetting for all three parties concerned and the dog has no idea why everyone is distraught.
Hoping for the best outcome - that the owners are forgiving, that nothing more rotten happens, that you find a solution to your yard that keeps everyone happy.


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## Stonevintage

I would really love to hear that the OP is going to put a fence up as a responsible owner of a larger breed dog.

I would really love to hear that in the next few posts.....


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## cagal

Yes a fence will be going in. The ironic part is all my immediate neighbours will be more angry that the fence is going up. I believe some would hope we'd get rid of the dog but that's not going to happen - one used to complain that our former lab left "pee spots" on our lawn (only ours - he was very old and couldn't go far). Even when this dog was a puppy he came over and asked if we were going to allow him to pee on the lawn since it brought down property values. I kid you not. The actual dog sitter neighbour said she'll plead with the owners not to proceed with charges. She feels as bad as I do but she also knows our dog very well and knows he would never hurt a human. She's very close to the owners.


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## cagal

Wolfe dog - both were off property in a wildlife corridor that runs behind all properties. My neighbour went to throw some compost there and decided to take the little dog with her. It's about 100m (30yards) from the end of our backyard. I stupidly thought my dog was running to greet her then saw something small on the ground and realized too late it was the little dog. It all literally happened in 30 seconds.


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## Jenny720

It sounds like you have swell neighbors. Who would not opt for privacy and safety for their pets/kids with a fence??? Sad this happened. I hope this ignites some changes in your neighborhood. Little dogs are very vulnerable to so many things environmental/animals- accidents happen -but care takers need to know this.


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## Jax08

I would talk to a lawyer and be prepared. I'm sorry this happened. We encourage people that come on here with dog bites and other incidences to report it. If I were the dog owner, I would want to make sure this didn't happen to another dog. So you should be prepared for that.


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## wolfy dog

Cagal, also you can be proactive and immediately muzzle train your dog to show goodwill and hopefully prevent action against you. I hate these neighborhood groups that don't allow fencing. it is just for the looks not for living safely. Can you plant a hedge that will block your dog's initial view?


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## WateryTart

Stonevintage said:


> Sorry this happened.... If this was surprise - it wouldn't be to me.... on either side....
> 
> There is "most of the pet population" that thinks all is good after a while... but when dogs don't get along - regardless of size- it's a time for precautions/barriers and preventative measures. This was a predictable possible outcome and it came to be. You had pre warning of the problem and both parties chose to ignore it...
> 
> IMO - it was never a matter of IF, but WHEN.... Everyone wants their dog to run as free as possible....In most cases - this does not work.


What a kind and helpful post. I'm sure the OP feels much better after reading it. :frown2:


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## Galathiel

It was a horrible thing that happened. Were we supposed to downplay or make light of it? What can you say that would make it 'better' ? Nothing really. A dog died. Offending dog obviously was used to running off its property. Wasn't recalled.

I would be very upset if I was the owner of the dog that was killed.


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## WateryTart

Galathiel said:


> It was a horrible thing that happened. Were we supposed to downplay or make light of it? What can you say that would make it 'better' ? Nothing really. A dog died. Offending dog obviously was used to running off its property. Wasn't recalled.
> 
> I would be very upset if I was the owner of the dog that was killed.


If that's directed at me, I'm not suggesting at all we make light of it. It's horrifying. I'm sure the OP feels sick about it. 

And because I'm sure any decent human being would feel sick about it, I can't bring myself to want to kick her while she is down. I'm sure I'd feel very differently if that was my small dog, but from here, I just can't make myself want to. Lecturing after the fact just doesn't hit the "kind" and "helpful" checkboxes for me.


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## Sabis mom

cagal said:


> Thanks - I'm just sick about it!* I can't even look at my dog right now even though I know he can't help it*. He has super high prey drive. It's not his fault - it's mine. 30 seconds if inattention lead to this.
> 
> Edit - I meant thanks for the hugs.


This needs to stop. Your dog is a dog, a large dog with jaws intended to destroy things. 
He did nothing wrong and while I don't mean to point fingers the blame lies with you as a human, not with the dog who was being a dog. I know your head gets this and again it is not my intention to engage in the blame game, but your heart needs to catch up to your head. It is up to you to ensure that this never happens again, we can humanize them all we want but we cannot blame them for not following our code of ethics.


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## Thecowboysgirl

OP, someone else already suggested part of this but, if you are able to begin construction on a fence, buy a quality basket muzzle and get busy training your dog before the owners of the dead dog come back, I would. 

If they report it and AC comes out to see you and you are already in the process of making sure this never happens again via meaningful physical precautions I would think that would make an impression.

What do you know about your dog and fencing? Make sure you are putting up something that will absolutely hold him, and not with spaces bigger than 2x4 so he cannot reach through or another small dog reach through


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## cagal

WateryTart said:


> If that's directed at me, I'm not suggesting at all we make light of it. It's horrifying. I'm sure the OP feels sick about it.
> 
> And because I'm sure any decent human being would feel sick about it, I can't bring myself to want to kick her while she is down. I'm sure I'd feel very differently if that was my small dog, but from here, I just can't make myself want to. Lecturing after the fact just doesn't hit the "kind" and "helpful" checkboxes for me.


Of course I feel sick about it! He killed a little dog and it's completely my fault. I didn't realize the dog was there or I would have called him back. I thought he was just going to my neighbor who he knows extremely well. He was used to her husband calling him over all the time so this was not something new for him. They knew and allowed him on their property. By the time I figured it out it was too late. It was so fast. All over in 30 seconds and he did drop the poor dog on command but obviously that was way too late. One bite was all it took for a 10 lb dog.


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## cagal

wolfy dog said:


> Cagal, also you can be proactive and immediately muzzle train your dog to show goodwill and hopefully prevent action against you. I hate these neighborhood groups that don't allow fencing. it is just for the looks not for living safely. Can you plant a hedge that will block your dog's initial view?




It would be difficult with just a hedge. We back onto a green space that's very shady so hard to grow things. And to clarify about the fencing, it's not an association that decides. It was the 7 original neighbours mutually agreeing not to put them up fro 30+ years so when we moved in 11 years ago, they asked if we would leave it that way. I was thinking of a muzzle any way even though it's actually not required in our area for DA until a charge is filed. They don't quarantine or take steps if people aren't involved until the owner files a charge then it has to go to the court of justice for their recommendations taking into account all the circumstances. The animal control officer took all the information and said wait until the owner returns and then cross that bridge if they complain. If they don't, the file is considered closed. Either way, there will be a fence and a muzzle now.


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## Jax08

I think a fence is the way to go. If he's not left outside alone, a 5' fence should be fine. And they have some very nice fences. Will cost you a bit more but maybe the neighbors won't object as much?

My concern with a hedge would be that you won't know what's on the other side and the dog will smell/hear long before you can see.


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## Stonevintage

Glad to hear you're doing a fence. Safety always trumps aesthetics. The fencing now required doesn't look that great around swimming pools but it's a little easier for people to understand the need.... and you have the need. Just do it and the neighbors will just have to get over themselves and realize you're not doing it for yourself but to protect a possible recurrence with their pets now or in the future....

There's lots of great fencing options out there. If you google "Fence styles images" you'll get lots of examples. this search will bring up just the images from all over the net so you can quickly scan them and only open the website of the styles you like - many do the job and look pretty darn good too:smile2:


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## middleofnowhere

This is not in direct response to any one particular post 

-I'm again extending my sympathy to everyone directly involved -- the board, not so much. Crap happens, the OP is on it. Please quit throwing rocks. (We are all in glass houses) I wish for the best for her, her neighbors and her dog for a "best" outcome.for this sad situation.


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## sebrench

Gosh, I'm so sorry this happened. I'm sure you feel horrible. At least, he did not bite a person. If the little dog was unleashed and unattended, then I would think its owners (or caregivers, in this case) were at least partly responsible. Owners of small breeds may be held less accountable because their dogs are not as capable of inflicting damage, but they should be aware of their dog's vulnerability. I owned a 6 lb papillon once, and I was always vigilant, even when walking him on leash, b/c I was a aware that a large dog could harm him, even without actually meaning to. Anyway, I think you will like having a fence. We just fenced part of our field because of occasional loose dogs, ect. It's wonderful to let the dog out without having to survey the yard first. I hope everything works out!


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## Stonevintage

Op - I have been through this experience and on your end with a previous dog I owned several years ago. I felt very cold toward my dog too for a while. It was not an anger at her - (she was protecting pups and a stray came onto our property) the 2nd time was also when a stranger to her brought his female dog into our yard when I was at work strictly against my repeated warnings. Anyway, it was not anger at her or myself really. I understood these things can happen but never really had to confront the harsh reality before.

This part will pass and you will be able to put it behind you when the dust settles. I would agree to get a basket muzzle and start training right away so all can see that you are promptly and responsibility taking care of the problem.


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## cagal

I think I am going to stop posting now. I simply cannot deal with this emotionally any more. This is on top of a close family member being diagnosed with breast cancer last week. Sometimes life can just hand you a big pile of sh$$. I will post an update (good or bad) when I know the outcome as everyone here has taken the time to participate in a discussion about this truly terrible thing. Thanks for everyone's input and especially to those who were exceptionally kind - I truly appreciate it.


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## Heartandsoul

Cagal, I'm sorry this happened. You must be beside yourself, but for what it's worth, I want to thank you for having the courage to post it as it has driven in my own need to get our fence up asap. We have the stock.

Is your dog normally dog aggressive when you are walking in public? If the answer is "no" then I don't understand why you would start using a muzzle. If yes, but he listens while on leash, I still wouldn't understand. 

I think that your dog needs you to advocate. Getting him use to a muzzle, fine. I'm not minimizing what happened, but it happened off leash. You are going forward and correcting that. 

Also, sorry but, bunk to your neighbor for not contacting the owner. I think he/she realizes who was ultimately responsable for that dog and they don't want to face the owners. It does not paint a good character picture. If I were the owner and knew other dogs roamed loose in the sitters yard, I would be directing most of my emotions at the sitter and would be furious if not told right away.

Advocate for your dog so he does not get "labeled".

Thank you again for your courage.


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## Hineni7

I'm sorry this happened and the stress you are under... The dog may have passed way more quickly due to its frail state as opposed to a healthy and/or younger dog.. Never a good feeling, and honestly, I think most dog owners have all had an experience where they felt bad and regretted (hindsight) an action or inaction, after the fact.... An electric fence might be middle ground for you and your neighbors.. That and really solidifying a recall and 'out' command that stops your dog when they first start to bolt towards something... 

Again, very sorry for this... And I know, that if I were the dece4dogs owner, I would at first be shocked and mad.. I also would realize the extingent circumstances, the age and health of my dog and the reaction of the dog owner (you).. For me, all the information given would allow me to grieve over my dog (which I would either way.. At that size, a hawk or eagle could have done the same thing just as quickly.. It shouldn't have been left unattended especially at that age and health issues, imo) but also let go of any anger towards (you)... But that is me, and I tend to be very rationale and quick to put into perspective the whole picture... Will keep you in prayer.. 

Final thought... Try to let go of the resentment towards your dog... Hard, I know, but necessary as it doesn't recognize what it did wrong... I had a high prey drive dog who would 'hock' my horses... Grabbed and held a foals back leg.. Just held it... Madee sooooo mad.. Worked like the Dickenson to control him and get him respectable.. But I had to let go of the anger first in order to help him.. Funnel his prey drive into another outlet which helped immensely, and really lowered his desire to 'herd' the horses..


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## Heartandsoul

cagal said:


> I think I am going to stop posting now. I simply cannot deal with this emotionally any more. This is on top of a close family member being diagnosed with breast cancer last week. Sometimes life can just hand you a big pile of sh$$. I will post an update (good or bad) when I know the outcome as everyone here has taken the time to participate in a discussion about this truly terrible thing. Thanks for everyone's input and especially to those who were exceptionally kind - I truly appreciate it.


I was typing when you posted this so I did not see it. sending good thoughts to you and your loved one.


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## carmspack

I just thought of this -- maybe a little late , but better late than never.

If you cannot erect a physical fence then why not put an electric fence , inivisible fence along your property line.
It won't keep other dogs out -- but that is their problem for not being under control.

It will keep your dog in taking away liability . Of course you want to teach your dog not to rush and attempt to chase dogs or wildlife or kids playing in the corridor.

Maybe put the invisible fence some 5 feet from the actual property line (don't know your yards dimensions).
That gives you more of a safety buffer.

as another poster said the little dog could have been prey to a hawk . Could have been prey to a coyote or any other dog . It wasn't particularly responsible for them to be so casual - especially with a dog that they did not own .

my thoughts for your family member - hope for a good outcome


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## MoxyPup

My heart goes out to you. I know this is hard to deal with and I am sorry you have to go through this.


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## Susan_GSD_mom

Thecowboysgirl said:


> I had a dog who was capable if this, was prey drive only as he was not dog aggressive at all. Mine never killed another dog (or injured), but it was due to constant vigilance. If I took him into a vet waiting room that was too small he wore a basket muzzle. I was waiting in a waiting room once, him laying at my feet, and a lady walked in with two micro yorkies. I saw him lock on (the predatory stare). Whipped his muzzle out and put it on him even though they were across the room. The lady says "oh he wouldn't hurt fluffy". Oh yes he would. He was a killer, not messing around straight for the throat and kill shot. He killed lots of non dog animals and once went after my neighbor's BT, same situation as you, he saw it in the field next to my house and went for it, not realizing it was a dog. Difference was he was e collar trained and wearing it therefor I was able to stop him. That was before I knew just what a killer he was, he was not offleash in areas like that e collar or not after I knew.
> 
> You have a responsibility now that you know what your dog is capable of, not to let him offleash , or un muzzled in an area where he might get a small animal on leash.


My female Jade is exactly the same--murder in her eyes whenever she sees another dog, even through the window. We manage, actually MICROmanage her always, no fail.

Susan


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## Susan_GSD_mom

cagal said:


> I think I am going to stop posting now. I simply cannot deal with this emotionally any more. This is on top of a close family member being diagnosed with breast cancer last week. Sometimes life can just hand you a big pile of sh$$. I will post an update (good or bad) when I know the outcome as everyone here has taken the time to participate in a discussion about this truly terrible thing. Thanks for everyone's input and especially to those who were exceptionally kind - I truly appreciate it.


So very sorry you are going through all of this. And the cancer--it can be beat. I care for my sister, who is ten years cancer free now. Encourage her as much as you can, she needs support now, tears not so much, be strong for her.

Susan


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## scarfish

the owners should've been notified. that's like losing a kid to people that love their dog. besides it would've given them time to cool down before returning.


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## wyominggrandma

I also agree that the owners NEED and SHOULD be told of their dogs death... Not a pleasant conversation at all, but it is their right. If the dog had been boarded at a reputable clinic or boarding facility they would have been notified... Maybe the person who was supposed to be taking care of dog doesn't want to tell owners because she is afraid she won't get paid whatever she was supposed to be paid for taking care of this dog.
It will also give them time to calm down and think rationally before they face the person taking care of dog and face the OP.


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## pets4life

Hey we live in the same city and i have seem the same situation happen. PM me if you need advice. You are going to be faced with a lot of things now. I can try to help you as much as I can. I also have a certified dog behaviourist living right near the big square mall who may help, like he has helped before. Let me know if you need any advice or help.


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## stepkau

prayers for all involved.


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## cagal

Hi 
I have an interim update. Animal control came today and we discussed the situation. I explained what happened and she said it was obviously a mistaken identity by the dog but unfortunately they would likely have to issue a muzzle order (which we're fine with). She assessed the dog and said he definitely would not be euthanized for this. Her words were "I walked in your house as a complete stranger in a uniform and he didn't even bark". So the dog won't need to be seized and assessed. She said the muzzle order will most likely be munucipal so it's permanent (again that's ok; at least he'll be alive). Not likely they will charge under provincial dog owners liability act as we had absolutely no complaints with the city on file, the drog is mature and our vet gave a very good character reference for him. So relieved as we were worried they would charge and we'd have to go to trial. This will also frost the cookies of the absolute a$$hole neighbour who wasn't even a witness but was advocating for euthanasia simply because he doesn't want the dog peeing on our lawn and ruining his vista fron two houses away. The jerk even complained that the poor little dog my neighbour was watching was peeing to close to his property. Seriously?WTF? The dog was 7 lbs. The AC officer basically said he wasn't a witness so had zero say and should mind his own business!


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## cagal

Sorry for typos - I was just so relieved we wouldn't lose the dog (not drog lol). Can I get some good muzzle recommendations? We walk a lot and for significant time. I was looking at Baskerville ultra maybe?


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## Thecowboysgirl

I got one from Fordogtrainers.com, a wire basket muzzle that is very deep, allowing dog to open his mouth and pant well. This was a must bc I was training mine in FL and if he couldn't pant he would die.

I also saw a biothane one on Leerburg recently that I though looked good, lightweight, looks pretty comfortable.

You can get a baskerville at any pet store but i have not been super pleased with how these fit my long nose gsds and I don't feel they allow panting as well as my wire basket, which if you have to use this while walking your dog will be important


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## Nigel

Glad it's working out as well as it can be. I don't know about the whole assessment process, but I'm glad she did well, 2 of my 4 would have most likely barked. The cranky neighbor needs to relax, if it's not happening on his property then he should shut his pie hole.


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## Stonevintage

What a relief for you. So glad that is out of the way. It's a little slow here today - you should get recommendations on a muzzle soon but you might want to start a new thread so that what you need info on is in the title. I know muzzles are lightweight and fairly comfortable for dogs now - not the old wire baskets they used to be. :smile2:


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## Stonevintage

Here's a Leerburg video on proper muzzle fit. Hope it helps.


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## scarfish

i want to know what the owners said or did. do they even know yet?


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## cagal

They know and at first were ok and said they understood but jerk neighbour spoke to daughter who was completely hostile to me (fair enough). Me and my neighbour were to call Friday but they wouldn't answer the phone and AC said the daughter called them asking a lot of questions including about lawsuits. I will remind my neighbour that the little dog bit her grandson more than once and that a settlement for a dog biting a person is way more than for the death of a dog. Hate to do it but I offered to replace with a puppy or make a donation to humane society but the offer was obviously not well received. They'll be unpleasantly shocked to find best the can get is value of dog which I bet for a 13 yo sick chihuahua is provably a lot less than what I would have offered.


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## cagal

Nigel said:


> Glad it's working out as well as it can be. I don't know about the whole assessment process, but I'm glad she did well, 2 of my 4 would have most likely barked. The cranky neighbor needs to relax, if it's not happening on his property then he should shut his pie hole.


Haha. AC officer actually got quite angry when I told her. She couldn't believe it - basically called him a jerk. I think it went a really long way that I self reported. The officer even chatted about her own GSD. Apparently it's very rare - but I still say it was the right thing to do.


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## cagal

Stonevintage said:


> What a relief for you. So glad that is out of the way. It's a little slow here today - you should get recommfendations on a muzzle soon but you might want to start a new thread so that what you need info on is in the title. I know muzzles are lightweight and fairly comfortable for dogs now - not the old wire baskets they used to be. :smile2:


Thanks for suggestion - I started new thread!


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## cagal

Thecowboysgirl said:


> I got one from Fordogtrainers.com, a wire basket muzzle that is very deep, allowing dog to open his mouth and pant well. This was a must bc I was training mine in FL and if he couldn't pant he would die.
> 
> I also saw a biothane one on Leerburg recently that I though looked good, lightweight, looks pretty comfortable.
> 
> You can get a baskerville at any pet store but i have not been super pleased with how these fit my long nose gsds and I don't feel they allow panting as well as my wire basket, which if you have to use this while walking your dog will be important


Thanks for input. I was looking at wire as well. After 20+ years of owning dogs this is all new territory to us


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## cagal

I forgot to add the daughter outright lied to my face (and my neighbour) saying she'd seen our dog running loose all, "the time". She's never been near my backyard and it's not visible from the street. She doesn't even live with her parents. My neighbour was furious!!!! I might add our dog is ALWAYS on leash on walks so she can't say he was ever loose on the street. she was just repeating what dirtbag neighbour said. He had the gall to take her to where it happened to tell her how it went down when he wasn't even there. He also apparently starting showing her internet articles where they had seized and destroyed dogs that had killed little dogs. Well at least I no longer have to be nice to him to keep the neighbourhood peace. One word and I'll tell him to stick it up his you know what. My neighbour also called him out on it. He's meddled and caused so much trouble and this isn't the first time.


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## Stonevintage

It's never a positive to have neighbors divide and take sides...in this case - was it the neighbor in charge of care for the little dog that is defending you? If not, what's their take?


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## Stevenzachsmom

cagal said:


> I forgot to add the daughter outright lied to my face (and my neighbour) saying she'd seen our dog running loose all, "the time". She's never been near my backyard and it's not visible from the street. She doesn't even live with her parents. My neighbour was furious!!!! I might add our dog is ALWAYS on leash on walks so she can't say he was ever loose on the street. she was just repeating what dirtbag neighbour said. He had the gall to take her to where it happened to tell her how it went down when he wasn't even there. He also apparently starting showing her internet articles where they had seized and destroyed dogs that had killed little dogs. Well at least I no longer have to be nice to him to keep the neighbourhood peace. One word and I'll tell him to stick it up his you know what. My neighbour also called him out on it. He's meddled and caused so much trouble and this isn't the first time.


Um, just liking that for you telling him to stick it up his you know what. Kinda hope you actually get a chance to do that. What a stress reliever that would be. :grin2:


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## Jenny720

"They'll be unpleasantly shocked to find best the can get is value of dog which I bet for a 13 yo sick chihuahua is provably a lot less than what I would have offered."

You can't place a value in $ signs on a pet even if the dog is 13 (chihuahuas are known to live up to 20 yrs old) Just saying not a good attitude to have it could make waves. You can understand having empathy the people not wanting to take any money. 
I would not talk to your neighbor about the bad things -like biting their grandchild - the deceased dog did- it will just come back to haunt you. Your neighbor is just interested in causing more trouble. The best thing would use that money and enjoy your rotten trouble making neighbors face when you put up a fence. I'm glad your dog is not in any major trouble and is working out. This to will pass.


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## Stonevintage

I'm sad to see the turn this thread's taken. OP checks out, very sorry and scared for what's happened, can't continue conversation. Then, back and it's anger and pitting neighbor against neighbor... It's just pretty ugly. I would rather take the AC report and adhere to it and keep my mouth shut.. The End.


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## cagal

Stonevintage said:


> It's never a positive to have neighbors divide and take sides...in this case - was it the neighbor in charge of care for the little dog that is defending you? If not, what's their take?


She is 100% behind me and is very upset the owner won't even talk to her after 30 years of friendship. She said if she had to choose, she'll choose me much as she loves us both. I'm so grateful to her for being so supportive that I can never even express how much it's meant to me. She feels just terrible as well about all this but also knows our dog and knows it was all a terrible accident. Incindentally, my neighbour on the other side also said they were comfortable with Hunter and would not be interested in pursuing anything. It is sad that now there is a big rift between neighbours. Although I wonder if the neighbours that the jerk harasses and bullies may not find this the catalyst to tell him to buzz off and mind his own business fron now on. My neighbour the sitter told him off after 30 years of putting up with his BS!


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## cagal

Stonevintage said:


> I'm sad to see the turn this thread's taken. OP checks out, very sorry and scared for what's happened, can't continue conversation. Then, back and it's anger and pitting neighbor against neighbor... It's just pretty ugly. I would rather take the AC report and adhere to it and keep my mouth shut.. The End.


I am now having to defend myself against a possible lawsuit. - the AC officer gave me the heads up. I was more than willing to make financial amends as well as deal with the immediate issues with the dog and try to move on. But I will not have someone come to my house and lie about my dog to help their case. The one neighbour actively advocating to have dog euthanized has bullied and interfered in the neighbourhood for many years. He has left a note on my front step telling me I needed to paint my deck when he can't even see it. I mind my own business and take care of my property but I'm tired of having him constantly feeling he has the right to cross over property lines to start tell me he doesn't like how I take care of my house, or my lawn isn't green enough or the dog has peed on our own property. I am very sorry my neighbour is caught in this and all I really want is for the owner to know she is a wonderful person and had been a very good friend to them. She did not report their dog bit her grandson on more than one occasion in the spirit of that friendship but she may now also be sued as she was watching the dog. I was more suggesting she remind them of this. This poor lady lost her son a few years ago and her husband before Christmas. All she wanted was the chance to talk to the owner as she went away as well today. I've only dealt with the sitter and my other neighbour and that was just make sure they were ok with the dog. No accusations or badmouthing on my part all over the neighbourhood.I am on this forum to vent my frustration in a "private" way although it's a public forum.


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## Thecowboysgirl

In my experience this sort of drama never ends well....has a tendency to escalate.

If I were OP, with a dog who has done something legitimately awful...I would be inclined to try and make peace in any way possible, apologizing, no longer saying anything gossipy or inflammatory no matter whether the other person has done something bad or not. Its about keeping your side of the street clean. Get that fence up yesterday.

I don't think you can keep your side of the street TOO clean when your dog just killed someone else's dog


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## cagal

Jenny720 said:


> "They'll be unpleasantly shocked to find best the can get is value of dog which I bet for a 13 yo sick chihuahua is provably a lot less than what I would have offered."
> 
> You can't place a value in $ signs on a pet even if the dog is 13 (chihuahuas are known to live up to 20 yrs old) Just saying not a good attitude to have it could make waves. You can understand having empathy the people not wanting to take any money.
> I would not talk to your neighbor about the bad things -like biting their grandchild - the deceased dog did- it will just come back to haunt you. Your neighbor is just interested in causing more trouble. The best thing would use that money and enjoy your rotten trouble making neighbors face when you put up a fence. I'm glad your dog is not in any major trouble and is working out. This to will pass.



Ok - I am now cooling off and agreed I have flown off the handle. Lots of stress between this and my MIL and leaving on vacation. This is the best advice. I know there isn't a value on a pet. I guess I just wanted to acknowledge and try to make amends in a tangible way as well as personally apologizing. Unfortunately a fence will not stop that neighbour from causing trouble. But I'm about 15 years younger than him so I can probably wait him out as to who moves first lol.


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## cagal

Thecowboysgirl said:


> In my experience this sort of drama never ends well....has a tendency to escalate.
> 
> If I were OP, with a dog who has done something legitimately awful...I would be inclined to try and make peace in any way possible, apologizing, no longer saying anything gossipy or inflammatory no matter whether the other person has done something bad or not. Its about keeping your side of the street clean. Get that fence up yesterday.
> 
> I don't think you can keep your side of the street TOO clean when your dog just killed someone else's dog


Agreed!agreed! And agreed. I'm seeing a lawyer to get ready against a lawsuit but will take the high road (again) with the troublemaker. I just truly hope the owners give me and the sitter the chance to apologize personally. I don't want or need any more trouble in my life.


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## Thecowboysgirl

The right fence will keep neighbor off your property, that is something.

I was accused of my dogs "running at large" by an anonymous call to AC years ago. Bad joke, if my dogs were missing or not in my sight I would be frantically looking for them. I *think* it may have been because I would chuck balls into the vacant lot by our house since our yard was too small. They retrieved like most GSDs retrieve, bee linr to the ball and bee line back to get it thrown again. But they were offleash so technically loose. 

Didn't you say you play with this dog offleash in the yard all the time? Probably the basis of the "running loose" comment.

Thing is, once everybody is mad and watching, every little thing is getting reported and it only goes downhill from there


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## cagal

I'm just going to take my lumps and move on. Too much energy wasted on this. But in fairness, the owners daughter stated she personally saw my dog running loose all the time all the time which is untruthful to say the least. I understood her anger and hostility due to the situation but I'm not one prepared to accept lies particularly now the word "lawsuit" has entered the mix.


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## cagal

Ok I'll make one last post for today after reading the comments.. I'm keeping my own mouth clamped going forward. You are all correct - this is unnecessarily escalating and I want it to stop now. Sometimes it's easy to get carried away in the emotion of it all but I need to be a grown up and responsible owner and move on. Thanks for being the voice of reason. We sometimes cant see that we ourselves are acting like jerks (which I'll admit I was definitely starting to and I didn't like what I saw when I retread some of my posts as I'm not a mean or vindictive person and now I'm ashamed that I started to act like the one neighbour ai was venting about). I should have listened to my neighbour who said be careful about casting stones unless you're sure you don't have your own sins. Great advice from a wonderful person.


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## Jenny720

I'm sure you are in defense mode but also to be aware to make no waves in this situation. I'm sure the family with the chihuahua will eventually come around but they are grieving right now and are flooded with all kinds of emotions - devistation, hurt, anger. so I think you are expecting much and so is the sitter/friend. I'm sure they are trying to keep emotions in check and will be their bridge to cross. 

I also hope the dog sitter now knows to pick up any little dog in their care when a larger dog is headed in their direction. You are doing things right my protecting your dog but if your neighbors decide to get another chihuahua or small dog down the road and the young pup escapes or gets out (all a possibility) or any other neighbors small dog and this happens again -as no fence was put up in your yard this would not be a accident the second time around. A fence will protect your dog. I'm really surprised that was not a request from a/c. Putting up a fence right after this accident would also help you in any kind of defense, if needed, as you went above and beyond what was requested from a/c.

Sorry no more posts. We all have gotten ourselves in trouble when venting.


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## Stonevintage

It's all good OP. I would have got wrapped up in it too. We are human. 

If you feel like you're going to loose it over this issue, come here and vent... we'll help you verbally punch out that lying neighbor's daughter>>.


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## WIBackpacker

@cagal It might be wise to remove your location from your profile and perhaps omit details in future comments. If your neighbor decides to pursue this further (via the legal system or otherwise) your comments posted here are public and not difficult to find via a Google search. If they were printed and read aloud in front of others, it might not be helpful to your cause.


I mean this in a kind way, I wish you the best. The internet leaves a permanent, public, trail of evidence, for good or bad.


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## cagal

Good lord. I got so wrapped in this then went back to look at posts. Toooooo much detail. too bad they don't allow edits to posts. Some sites do.


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## scarfish

it's not a big deal. the facts are already known. as long as you told the truth 100% to AC this thread means nothing.


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## cagal

scarfish said:


> it's not a big deal. the facts are already known. as long as you told the truth 100% to AC this thread means nothing.[/QUOTE
> 
> Good point and I always try to be truthful! But it was still a good reminder to be careful of posting on the Internet :hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer:


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## WIBackpacker

cagal said:


> Good point and I always try to be truthful! But it was still a good reminder to be careful of posting on the Internet :hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer:


Good plan. One of my mentors used to tell me, "If you wouldn't want it printed out, hung on the wall, and read in front of a jury and your grandmother, don't write it in an email and don't post it on the internet." I have to remind myself of this, from time to time. 


Hope the rest of your week goes well.


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## stepkau

Prayers and thoughts are with you and hunter, your dog sitting neighbor, and the owners of the little dog.. Seems like you are on the right track.. Fence + taking the high road + ignoring trouble-making neighbor.. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail but having legal counsel is probably a good idea.


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## InControlK9

Glad you get to keep your dog.


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## cagal

A somewhat ugly update but upside dog is fine and still with us. So we ended up with muzzle order (not a biggie - can't change the fact of what happened) but while we were away, the owner pre-wrote a witness statement for the dog-sitter with a lot of misinformation in it and stood over her to make her copy and sign it. Fortunately the sitter recanted and did her own statement with the truth which is all I ever asked for. Also, jerk neighbor who wasn't a witness at all put in a false witness report and, get this, claimed I told him the dog was getting vicious and I was thinking of putting him to sleep anyway. What a piece of s**t that guy is. He doesn't know I know - I think he thought it would be his dirty little secret. Finally, the owner went to the local paper which got picked up in a bunch of other cities with her story for which neither me nor the "dog-sitter" were interviewed. Coincidentally the paper was not delivered to either of our houses for that edition although it's there every other week making more recycling. Owner conveniently forgot to mention her own darling little dog bit the dog-sitter's grandchild at least three times which is actually an offence that could require destruction of the dog. Upside, other neighbours who didn't have whole story got it and even though want dog muzzled as they have two small dogs, are saying now hello to me and my dog. I've also seen other dog owners I know and they've said hi. Some others turn and run away with their dogs - oh well, if that's how you want to live, so be it. Lying jerk is hiding out - I haven't seen him in over a month YAY. I now just walk the dog with my head up - yes, he did an unfortunate thing but we've followed the law and done the right things at the end of the day and will make sure it never happens again.


End of story (I hope).:smile2:


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## Stevenzachsmom

So sorry you have had to deal with all of this. What a bunch of jerks. It was a tragic event, but you have been responsible throughout. Shame on people for lying. Lying jerk neighbor has made life very awkward for himself. May he forever stay in hiding. lol!


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## cagal

I've asked the moderator to delete the post - I was trying to edit as it's too negative and ran out of time! But thanks


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## Nigel

cagal said:


> I've asked the moderator to delete the post - I was trying to edit as it's too negative and ran out of time! But thanks


Don't worry about the edit, theres enough stress of having to get past the incident itself, add in the drama from those on the sidelines and it's understandable.


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## tunez33

cagal said:


> I've asked the moderator to delete the post - I was trying to edit as it's too negative and ran out of time! But thanks


happy to hear that your dog is okay. Did you get the fence put up?


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## cagal

Contractor is working on it - dog is NOT even allowed out on deck right now. Only goes outside on leash and muzzled but we walked him three times a day anyway. Contractor was actually there today spraying painting outline and arranging for utilities to check before we dig. We were on vacation for some of the intervening time.


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## BOSKY

Does this just happen or is this poor training and management on the OP's part? 

My GSD is almost six months old. Any suggestions to prevent this type of behavior?


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## tunez33

cagal said:


> Contractor is working on it - dog is NOT even allowed out on deck right now. Only goes outside on leash and muzzled but we walked him three times a day anyway. Contractor was actually there today spraying painting outline and arranging for utilities to check before we dig. We were on vacation for some of the intervening time.


Ah great, i would make one recommendation metal posts! I redid my entire fence a few months ago over the course of 2 days. The house i bought had an old wooden fence, posts and fence was rotted. It goes up in no time, never have to worry about the posts rotting again and when the panels are bad unscrew that section and replace! It's also really easy to do it yourself. This photo is pre staining so it doesn't look all that good haha!


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## cagal

All metal chain link - 5'. He's only ever out with us and not for extended periods so jumping is not an issue. Interesting though that survey shows neighbour has encroached by about 2'! However she's been so kind we are going to leave fence over where it makes sense. The fence will come out eventually when the dog passes anyway - it's only for his sake/safety we are installing it. Once he's gone we won't get another (not because of this - DH already caved on getting this dog and that was the deal :|)


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## dogma13

BOSKY said:


> Does this just happen or is this poor training and management on the OP's part?
> 
> My GSD is almost six months old. Any suggestions to prevent this type of behavior?


Read from the beginning to get an accurate picture of the circumstances.


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## Nigel

BOSKY said:


> Does this just happen or is this poor training and management on the OP's part?
> 
> My GSD is almost six months old. Any suggestions to prevent this type of behavior?


I'd say there are a lot of gsds who are capable of this and it only takes one small error in judgement for it to happen. Best to train them and continue training them for their lifetime. A rock solid recall or leave it can be a life safer.


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## cliffson1

We must never forget that "our" GS is a dog, and dogs are animals not humans, not furry people, ......so it is always our responsibility to be vigilant over them once they are allowed access to another environment. Jmo


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## llombardo

Nigel said:


> I'd say there are a lot of gsds who are capable of this and it only takes one small error in judgement for it to happen. Best to train them and continue training them for their lifetime. A rock solid recall or leave it can be a life safer.


I know my dogs well and I don't trust the 2 male GSDs ever around smaller dogs. They play rougher and I've seen it escalate pretty easily. I have a beagle right now that they won't ever have contact with, no matter how much they wag their tails and try to play with him. They are way to big for him and his movement is like prey for them. The female GSD has a high prey drive but she has always liked small dogs and she is fine with the beagle, but I still stand over them and supervise.


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## cagal

Just a quick thanks for letting me vent here! I have kept my mouth clamped in "real life" as I just want to move on with life so this forum is the only real outlet for my frustrations as to how it all played out (especially as a lot of it happened while I was away).


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## stepkau

cagal said:


> Just a quick thanks for letting me vent here! I have kept my mouth clamped in "real life" as I just want to move on with life so this forum is the only real outlet for my frustrations as to how it all played out (especially as a lot of it happened while I was away).


You are venting here, I am learning.. It's Win/Win.. Thanks for not deleting the post. Every GSD owner should understand what can happen in a split second.


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## cagal

So - things did NOT calm down yet. I just wanted to move on but crazy neighbour two houses away just won't stop. So we are STILL trying to put fence in but neighbours on both sides were away for extended time so this had dragged on interminably as utility locates actually expired! In between all this, the nut job is shouting at me for putting in fence and generally aggravating everyone. He says I'm wrecking his view and then very graciously suggested we could easily put up a dog pen between my house and my immediate neighbour (which would not only be incredibly inconvenient for me and my neighbour but on a hill so inhumane to say the least). It would be comical if not so sad. But YAY at long last fence will be started Friday weather permitting. 

Bad news is dog is now sick. Poor guy got abcess in anal gland and is also dripping blood from penis (two unrelated issues as far as we can tell). We are hoping is prostatic disease and not something more serious. If prostatic we will likely have to neuter but he should be ok if that's the issue. Vet is running cultures which should be ready tomorrow and we are on antibiotics for the anal gland. *Sigh* please keep your fingers crossed for us that's it's not anything truly serious or life threatening. He's truly a wonderful dog and I'm just heartsick about his health issues.

You just couldn't make this whole story up if you tried?


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## Nigel

Sorry to hear the drama from the neighbor continues and for the current health problems with your boy. Hopefully he will be on the mend quickly and the weather holds out for your fence.


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## Deb

My thoughts and prayers for Hunter that all is well soon. I hope things quiet down with your neighbor. I had one from h-e-double hockey stick for several years. Oh, the stories I could tell! He would vacillate between feuding with me and then my neighbor, back and forth. We're the only ones on the road. He was always careful to do it when I wasn't home, going after my kids. He finally went too far. He was out on his tractor drunk as a skunk and my daughter went down the drive to get the mail. He threatened her life, yelling how he was going to kill all of us one night. What he didn't know was my other neighbor's grandson was in the bushes recording him on his cell phone. His wife came up to complain a few days later because the entrance to my property wasn't nice or 'pretty' enough and I should put used tires along the entrance and fill them in with flowers. She had bought the old tires for me to use and they would be delivered the next day. After all, with nothing out there I was bringing down their property value! I calmly told her if she didn't get her husband under control I was going to the sheriff's department. She said 'oh no, he won't really do it, he just talks big.' I said fine, he can then talk big in prison because it's against the law here to threaten a minor and a mandatory two years in prison, especially as he threatened a 16 year old girl and it was recorded. Hmm, he suddenly got a job offer in Hawaii and they left three weeks later.


So I know what it's like to live with the constant harassment from a neighbor and it's not fun. Keep keeping your head up and remember they belittle themselves when they act like they do.


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## cagal

Thanks so much for the support. I'm sure Friday will bring new frontiers of drama but I'm not getting sucked in (just to vent here?). I didn't say anything during the shouting episode and tried to walk away but he actually followed me around the perimeter of my yard. My contractor was there and stepped in for me. He said he's used to neighbours acting up when fences are involved! I feel now more like the fence will be a godsend to keep the crazy out rather than the dog in. 

Hunter is actually quite active right now so antibiotics seem to be helping but he's dripping a lot more blood today than the last two which is concerning me quite a lot but doesn't seem to be bothering him. I may need doggy diapers. Thank goodness we don't have carpeting (all tile and hardwood do easy to clean up).


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## Stevenzachsmom

You poor thing. You have certainly been through an awful lot. Yes! That fence is going to be wonderful. Praying for your boy. Please keep us posted.

Hugs!


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## Julian G

llombardo said:


> I know my dogs well and I don't trust the 2 male GSDs ever around smaller dogs. They play rougher and I've seen it escalate pretty easily. I have a beagle right now that they won't ever have contact with, no matter how much they wag their tails and try to play with him. They are way to big for him and his movement is like prey for them. The female GSD has a high prey drive but she has always liked small dogs and she is fine with the beagle, but I still stand over them and supervise.


Hi, I have been housing my brother's GSD recently. I use him as a deterrent because we had a break in attempt recently. Well I notice on walks, he goes wild for little dogs. I consider myself experienced but I'm in a bit of a pickle. He notices bigger dogs but doesnt really act aggressive at them. He notices cats but doesnt go after them. He goes after squirrels and if he sees a small dog he **** near looks like he wants to kill them, barking, lunging. I usually socialize my pups with other dogs from an early age but it's impossible to find people to let me socialize an 85 lb GSD with their little yorkie. It's weird because he's on his best behavior at the vet's office (they all usually are). 
I'm thinking if I should just work on desensitizing him with a toy, clicker, and treats but he just goes wild at the sight of a small dog. My brother told me that when he was a pup he used to get barked at a lot by smaller dogs for some reason and he might be traumatized by that and there might be no fixing this, wondering what you would do in this situation.


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## Dainerra

I'd work on just having him ignore them. work on leave it and an "enough" command to be quiet. Focus on keeping his attention on you. Socializing to little dogs doesn't mean that he has to greet them. It just means that he has to learn how to behave around them and that there is no reason to go crazy.


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## Jenny720

I'm so happy you are putting a fence up. Your neighbor is just being a bully and will get over it part of the drama of having neighbors. I hope your dog's health is going to be okay keep us posted.


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## GatorBytes

I hope the troublesome neighbour and your dogs sudden health issue are not related. Peeing blood? That is scary 


I too have had my share of A-hole neighbours. When I lived in an apartment I had this douche who would antagonize G as he passed my door. He would rattle his keys or bags. If he walked their dogs he would allow them to stop at my door and sniff at the threshold...This would send G over the top. His daughter and wife used to come over. He hated this and would call 20x to harass her. Once the daughter was leaving her apt as I was coming in from walk. G barked at her for attention to which she obliged. He called AC citing my dog "menaced" his daughter. They came out, interviewed my other neighbours and building manager. G got props from everyone! as AC was leaving, I happened to be coming up drive with G...Muzzled as he always was once we came on the property (and in elevator), and as told to AC by all....She turned her attention to the neighbour who's dog's were not licensed....He threatened her, threatened the woman he complained to over the phone....Told her he was going to go down there and kill them all. Told my super he was going to put a bullet in my dogs head and told me too that he was going to kill him. They lived 1 door down and across.
Needless to say, if he wasn't afraid of AC or uttering death threats, then he was dangerous.
I rolled paper towels and duct taped them around the perimeter of my door and installed a door sweep on the exterior with foam tape to fill any gaps that he may have been able to inject anti freeze or something.
I lived in a perpetual state of anxiety.


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## Suki's Mom

We moved into one of those "no fences" neighbourhoods six years ago (not because of any bylaws, just nobody had one). The previous owner had a dog who was never allowed on the lawn, because of "pee stains". We bought the house because of the huge yard and we wanted Suki to be able to use it.


First thing we did when we got the keys was have a six foot chain link fence put in, with nice wrought iron gates on either side. We didn't ask the neighbours and paid for it ourselves. Now, quite a few other yards have fences. You never know, your fence may just be the start of a whole new trend


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## Deb

Suki's Mom said:


> We moved into one of those "no fences" neighbourhoods six years ago (not because of any bylaws, just nobody had one). The previous owner had a dog who was never allowed on the lawn, because of "pee stains". We bought the house because of the huge yard and we wanted Suki to be able to use it.
> 
> 
> First thing we did when we got the keys was have a six foot chain link fence put in, with nice wrought iron gates on either side. We didn't ask the neighbours and paid for it ourselves. Now, quite a few other yards have fences. You never know, your fence may just be the start of a whole new trend



When we moved to MI we rented in a neighborhood like this. No one had fences. It was a three dog limit. The owner was after us to buy the house and it was a HUGE property. The next door neighbor was so friendly, had a son the same age as ours and they played across the two properties all the time. Since it wasn't fenced I walked my collie and used expens out the basement door, which you had to be on top of to see from the way the layout of the house was. One morning I have the dog warden show up. I had one too many dogs. Since the fourth one was just a puppy I didn't get fined. Turned out the 'friendly' neighbor called them as he didn't want any of my dogs going potty on our back lawn as he didn't want his son to lose any playing ground for football and long throws. 


We moved and bought a house out in the country AFTER I talked to the three neighbors I'd have. One was a retired Elkhound show breeder, the second's brother raised and showed GSDs and the third was an elderly couple who loved dogs and only asked that I bring mine over to visit them often. It was a wonderful three and a half years there.


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## cagal

Julian G said:


> Hi, I have been housing my brother's GSD recently. I use him as a deterrent because we had a break in attempt recently. Well I notice on walks, he goes wild for little dogs. I consider myself experienced but I'm in a bit of a pickle. He notices bigger dogs but doesnt really act aggressive at them. He notices cats but doesnt go after them. He goes after squirrels and if he sees a small dog he **** near looks like he wants to kill them, barking, lunging. I usually socialize my pups with other dogs from an early age but it's impossible to find people to let me socialize an 85 lb GSD with their little yorkie. It's weird because he's on his best behavior at the vet's office (they all usually are).
> I'm thinking if I should just work on desensitizing him with a toy, clicker, and treats but he just goes wild at the sight of a small dog. My brother told me that when he was a pup he used to get barked at a lot by smaller dogs for some reason and he might be traumatized by that and there might be no fixing this, wondering what you would do in this situation.


Honestly after all we went through a muzzle is safest. It will protect little furries but also you and your boy. Hunter is a great dog with people and most other dogs but has super high prey drive and lesson was learned the hard way. We always keep him on leash in public and he's obedient but man the sight of a cat or rabbit or the wrong small dog and then look out! He doesn't care for the muzzle but is getting used to it and it's way better than the alternative of either giving him away or worse. I've tried distraction but he's a big uneutered male and that's how he's wired.


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## Julian G

cagal said:


> Honestly after all we went through a muzzle is safest. It will protect little furries but also you and your boy. Hunter is a great dog with people and most other dogs but has super high prey drive and lesson was learned the hard way. We always keep him on leash in public and he's obedient but man the sight of a cat or rabbit or the wrong small dog and then look out! He doesn't care for the muzzle but is getting used to it and it's way better than the alternative of either giving him away or worse. I've tried distraction but he's a big uneutered male and that's how he's wired.


It's not really the biting I am afraid of, if he does get close to a dog, he doesn't bite or snap ever. He just has this reaction to small dogs that sends him into a frenzy, he looks like a rabid dog barking and lunging. The people walking their dogs run for their lives, I don't blame them. I want to stop this behavior. I'm probably over-thinking this, I know I need a prong collar. I just wanted to try a different method this time.


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## cagal

That might work but unfortunately where we live, even lunging and barking can lead to an attack complaint. I've learned more about our laws than I ever wanted and also how much they don't favour the dog owner. A prong collar might work; we used one for a very short time but it was only for very gentle reminders. Generally he's great on leash (like 99.99%of time). Unfortunately the .001% is not good. Sorry I can't be more helpful but sounds like we have different issues.


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## cagal

As a follow up, x-rays came back relatively good. The issue is pretty much confirmed as prostate disease. We will have to get him neutered but he should be fine. Much less blood today as anti-biotics are kicking in but vet says it's only a matter of time before it recurs and the prostate is already squishing his colon a bit so constipation problems are inevitable. At least we know it's not life threatening which is a huge relief. And fence posts are going in as I am typing .


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## cagal

Hi everyone. Surgery was a week ago and everything seems to be healing up well. Poor baby had to keep relatively quiet for a week so couldn't understand why we wouldn't play with him. Fence is almost done - just one gate missing a latch but tomorrow at long last will be DONE. We have a nice, safe yard for him. Just one more hurdle at court this week and hopefully we can all move on 
with our lives. Thanks so much for everything - support, suggestions and smacks upside the head when I deserved them


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## Stevenzachsmom

Thank you for checking in. Praying all goes well with that last court hurdle. Then you can relax and enjoy your boy in your nice fenced yard. So glad the surgery went well.


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