# Not sure if I should continue Penny on RAW feeding



## mandiah89 (Jan 18, 2013)

So after Penny's incident last week, Im not sure if I should continue RAW feeding. I want to because its really the only thing Penny will eat, but I'm nervous that it was feeding her RAW that caused her to get an infection. The vet told me "feeding RAW is a ticking time bomb", but they also said that its undetermined how she got the infection and her intestines to get messed up. 

I feel like no matter if I put her back on kibble or keep going with RAW I will be doing something bad for her. Has anyone run into major problems with RAW and their dogs getting infections? Do you think me feeding her RAW could have given her the issues with her intestines and giving her an infection? Maybe I had the ratios wrong? I was doing 45% RMB 50% MM and 5% OM but then I saw that it should be 80% MM 10%RMB and 10%OM so maybe I was giving her to much bone and that could have done some damage?

Any advice would be great thanks


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## Wolfgeist (Dec 4, 2010)

Your veterinarian is trying to scare you into feeding kibble, which makes me believe the vet isn't very trust worthy. I just feel tired of the constant backlash over raw from uneducated veterinarians. 

Honestly, I haven't had any issues feeding raw. Hunter as gotten a few bacterial infections in his life, thanks to living in a dog friendly apartment building with a bunch of people who don't pick up after their dogs and don't care if their sick dogs interact with healthy dogs. Never had an issue feeding raw, and none of my clients have ever had an issue feeding raw.


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## Ravena (May 19, 2013)

I feed my 6month girl raw, and I only had one problem, which was when I added in new proteins too fast, which caused some serious firebutt for a few days. Totally my fault.

I would definitely continue with the raw, but her system is going to be sensitive after that infection, so maybe go back to the beginning and add in chicken for 2 weeks, then turkey, then pork etc. My girl is about to hit her seventh week on raw (had to restart after the firebutt episode as her system was out of whack) and we haven't started her on more than tiny slivers of organ meat. 
I've followed this guide (except for my screw-up, which was motivated by testing for allergies) and its worked great.

How to get started feeding a Prey Model Raw Diet - Raw Chat - PMR Articles - articles - Prey Model Raw

My vet was cautiously open to the idea of raw, which is refreshing compared to many docs, but I boarded my girl for the first time with their kennels last week, and he said he was obsessed with the nurses feeding her her bone-in meat - he watched every meal. Said he couldn't believe how well she ate with no choking or problems with the bones. Sometimes it takes time to adjust when you've been told 'facts' by kibble companies for your whole career.


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## Momto2GSDs (Mar 22, 2012)

Hi Mandiah!
You are doing the very best thing you can do for a dog!
That being said, sometimes adjustments have to be made as I had to do many times with our first GSD and raw feeding.
What you could do for a time, is to slightly cook it, or add several drops of Grapefruit Seed Extract to some water, and pour over food (or douse it)to neutralize the bacteria. You can even use Silver Colloidal for a short time.Then, when you feel she has been doing well with no upsets for a time, and has totally adjusted to the raw diet, just go back to raw. Pork is a very rich meat and one of my dogs' never did well on it, but as long as I had it specifically ground by the butcher and the fat didn't exceed about 7% she did fine. Just make sure that it has been frozen for at least 7 days. This is also true with wild game.

The MOST important thing is the gut! I posted the following for someone else this morning:
65% of disease begins in the gut. Dogs' were designed to get live enzymes from the fresh prey that they killed. Their pancreas only produces a certain amount of enzymes (they didn’t need a lot b/c they ate live foods) and if they are not getting the enzymes they need from their prey’s guts and entrails, they have to get it from somewhere to be able to digest, absorb, and assimilate their food PROPERLY. Not having enough enzymes to do this can create mal-digestion and or mal-absorption in some dogs. The dog may end up only partially digesting its food in the stomach, and partially fermenting it in the gut and not absorbing all the nutrients and vitamins in the food. The dry kibble or the canned foods we feed are cooked at high temperatures so they are depleted of their enzymes and are therefore not living foods. This causes the pancreas to over tax itself trying to keep up, which can eventually weaken it allowing toxins to build up in the system. This is a key time for issues like yeast, pancreatitis, epi, diarrhea, bad breath, doggy order, *allergies*, arthritis, *skin issues* and a compromised immune system (to name a few), take hold. Many pet foods get a lot of their “protein” from grains instead of from meat. The dogs system was not designed to digest the complex proteins in grains so this is why a “grain free” diet is better for those dogs with issues. A raw diet would be the best. Also, popular pet foods have wheat, corn or fish meal in them which most likely has been contaminated with Mycotoxins, which are toxins from mold and fungi. Another thing is that most “plant products” today are Genetically Modified (GMO’s) *which create inflammatory conditions. *And, there are some Bacteria’s called Endotoxins which are not destroyed during the cooking process of kibble. Pet food manufacturers *do not test for these toxins*. These are things that can also weaken or compromise the gut and/or immune system. *A dogs’ gastrointestinal system protects them from allergens.* Since 70% of the immune system lies in the digestive tract, a dogs’ immune system HAS to be functioning properly to fight off the allergens and other invaders. That is why *Digestive Enzymes and Probiotics *are so very important to your pets.

Here are some great ones:
*Digestive Enzymes by Carmspac on this blog: Sunday Sundae: Contact her and she can explain how to use it: 
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...carmspack.html 
*Digest All Plus: this is a combination of Digestive Enzymes and Probiotics: 
The Wholistic Pet
*For Pets Probiotic: 
Pet Probiotics | Optimal Digestive Health for Pets - Mercola.com
*Digestive Enzymes: Healthy Pets Digestive Enzymes for Optimal Digestion - Mercola.com

Holistic vets promote a raw diet BUT most agree that raw fed dogs should be given additional supplements to keep them healthy. The dog is not eating a "fresh kill" so therefore vital nutrients are lost. I mix my own according to Dr. Karen Becker's recipe from her raw diet book, but here is one that you might want to look at: Animal Essentials Herbal Multi Vitamin for Cats & Dogs-Daily Vitamins, Minerals and Antioxidants 

Hope this helps!
Moms


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## Muskeg (Jun 15, 2012)

My GSD had a bleeding stomach ulcer from feeding raw- lost a lot of blood. I don't feed her raw any more and she hasn't had a problem since.

I think raw is a great diet but I also think modern slaughterhouses are disgusting places full of disease. If you were raising your own meat organically or hunting wild game for your pet, bacteria wouldn't be as big of an issue. Although worms and other issues might. But, raw isn't necessarily the best choice for every dog or every owner.

There are some high quality commercial diets out there, and also pre-packaged raw type diets. Anecdotally, the longest lived, healthiest dogs I know ate fairly low-quality kibble their entire lives- of 15 to 17 years...


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I was going to switch mine about a year ago. None of them care for it. I have never seen a whole group of dogs eat raw meat slower then my dogs. Robyn got really sick with an infection and they couldn't figure it out. There wasn't a test that wasn't ran. I backed off raw and knock on wood no more mysterious illnesses. I do give them duck necks and beef heart every now and then as a treat. I agree that the places where meat comes from are probably not the cleanest. At least cooking it might help get some of the bacteria out of there.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I think feeding ANYTHING, a dog can be ok on it or not. 

I feed kibble but supplement with raw/or if I feed salmon, it's poached..I haven't had an issue, but like I said with anything, one dog may do fine on it, others won't..

I don't think there is a 'right' answer.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

You have to do what you feel is right for your dog.

I have fed raw for over 14 years. Have raised countless puppies and weaned 6 litters to raw. I have not had any digestive issues caused by raw feeding and very few health issues, period, over the years.


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## bga (Jan 30, 2013)

There are plenty of high quality kibbles out there. At the very least, you could give one a try and see if it solves the problem. If it works then problem solved. If it doesn't, then you will know diet isn't the issue.


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## Lesber2004 (Aug 14, 2013)

You should be able to do 3 days a week raw meat,that's what I do,the other 4 days they eat Nature Domain from Costco(turkey meal and sweet potato)



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## Shonya (Oct 12, 2012)

Kibble is a highly processed food, no matter how many nutritious-sounding ingredients are in it. This would be the equivalent of your never eating fresh vegetables, fruits or meats. Humans who eat this way have much higher rates of chronic illness and cancer. 

It took me awhile to get used to the idea of feeding raw, but after watching the suffering of my last GSD with SBO and IBD, I now also believe this contributed to an earlier death (the other factor was vaccinations). The more I read and hear about raw, the more I read and hear about healthier, longer-lived dogs. 

My new puppy that's coming in December will have already started on raw and I will continue with that. The idea does seem counterintuitive with respect to bacteria and pathogens, but if you're able to provide healthier sources of meat, the risk is quite low. Of course this is expensive, so not everyone can do it. We all try to do the best we can for our dogs, and in an era where pet food companies fund your vet's education and research is tainted by its funding source, it's not always easy to separate fact from fiction. There is some risk in any method you choose. It's a matter of weighing those risks and deciding which path you believe will give your dog the lowest.


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## Harry and Lola (Oct 26, 2013)

I've just started feeding my 2 GSDs raw in the morning (about 400g of meat like chicken mince, lamb mince, kangaroo and 3 chicken necks), then about 12 hours later I feed them grain free salmon based dry kibble & a probiotic soaked in very warm water for 30 to 40 minutes then add a bit of goats milk on the top.

Previously they were feed the dry kibble with a bit of raw meat or can of sardines mixed in both morning and night.

So after 5 days I have noticed that by separating the dry and raw by 12 hours their stools have been reduced from 3 to 4 a day to 2 a day and they seem very content. 

My male has EPI so I am concerned about the dry fermenting and causing bacteria, at this stage I will monitor thier progess.


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