# Aack, help please, need to order meat :-)



## Contrary (Jun 12, 2013)

I think I'm overthinking all this, but here goes. I guesstimated a 70lb adult weight for our puppy (I'll find our her parents' weights and refine that before she comes home) and came up with roughly 1.4lbs a day, about 42-45lbs a month.

I stumbled across a good deal on chicken yesterday, so we bought quite a bit and then early this morning discovered I'm part of a local co-op's Yahoo group, yay! (I joined it last month, I must have missed my group acceptance in the move)

So, our baby will be 9.5 weeks, female, when we get her at the end of the month. I plan to start with chicken and then introduce the other proteins.

What I seem to be having the biggest issue with is what is edible bone for her. Are there any safe beef bones?

Yesterday, I got probably 50lbs of wings, boneless breasts and tenderloins, and chicken legs. (Mostly bought for the human kids, but wondering if any can be used for puppy, I may be able to turn this into a somewhat steady source.) I know wings are not good, and they're already breaded for human buffalo wings. Are the legs safe? (I know leg quarters and halves are ok, but not sure about just legs)

And, here is what I can get through the co-op:

40 LBS CHICKEN NECKS OR BACK $21.00
40 LBS CHICKEN BREAST BONE IN $47.00
5 LBS CHICKEN LIVER $5.00
20LBS CHICKEN WINGS 2-10 BAGS $28.00
20 LBS PET MIX $19.00 
20 LBS TURKEY 2-10LBS ROLLS GROUND NO BONE $28.00
5 LBS BUFFALO MIX NO BONE $4.75
2 LBS BUFFALO HEART & KIDNEY GROUND $5.00
2 LBS BUFFALO LIVER CHOPPED $5.00
5 LBS GROUND NECKS $6.25
4 LBS PRIMAL BEEF OR SARDINE/TURKEY $18.00
4 LBS PRIMAL CHICKEN $16.00
5 LBS TRIPE $11.00 


Are necks and/or backs ok? I'm planning to order:

30lbs beef heart (I think it's available for $39 for a 30lb box)
40lbs chicken breast
5lbs chicken liver
20lbs turkey
10lbs buffalo mix no-bone
4lbs buffalo heart and kidney
4lbs buffalo liver
And then a box of either backs or necks, if those are ok.

I think what I'm understanding is 80% protein, 10% bone, 5% liver, 5% other organs, is that a good starting point? I know ground isn't great, I'll supplement the chicken & beef hearts with pork/beef from the grocery, and probably use the ground for stuffing toys (Kong, etc), and maybe to introduce new proteins until I can source whole cuts.

Anyway, any advice would be greatly appreciated, I need to get this order placed because they order tomorrow and pick up Monday, so I don't have a lot of time to decide. I guess my biggest question is what do I do about bone!


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

don't order any beef or other mammal bones unless it is young lamb or rabbit. 
My balance is 55% raw meaty bones(usually there is meat on them, as in chicken leg 1/4's or turkey necks) 40% muscle meat, including green tripe and 5% organ meat. 
Adjust your portions according to growth spurts and how your puppy feels, don't be so regimented on the weight of the meal. I fed pups 3x's per day which is harder to adjust portion size and balance, so don't worry if you are over or under the balance. 
Hearts are really rich, so be careful using those alone for treats. I'd rather add heart to the meal(muscle meat portion) and add a meat grind to a kong or make up a peanut butter/honey/yogurt/coconut oil blend frozen into a kong. I make that blend and pour it into ice cube trays for supplementing every few days.
Instead of chicken liver, I'd try to get calves liver, more nutritious!
At the age of your pup, I'd get chicken necks first, instead of backs, feed those as the rmb's for now/they are easy to chew and digest for a puppy.


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## Contrary (Jun 12, 2013)

Thank you! I ended up calling the lady who runs the co-op, and she helped a great deal. She feeds everything ground (and has for 15 years), but I was leaning more toward prey/Frankenprey, so I'll have to keep looking for more sources as time goes by. I figured out that it'll only be a couple of weeks after I get our puppy until another meat run is made, so I ordered:

40lbs chicken necks (will take backs if necks aren't available)
30lbs turkey necks
40lbs chicken breast w/ bone
20lbs turkey rolls (10lb rolls)
5lbs green tripe

A couple of other questions if you don't mind.

Puppy will be 9.5 weeks when I pick her up, she's currently eating the breeder's custom kibble. I'm picking her up on a Saturday, and she has a vet appointment Monday (raw-friendly vet, YAY!) and WILL get puppy shots. WHEN should I transition to raw? If not right away (Saturday night?), could I give her a little of the green tripe starting Saturday (for the probiotics)?

I am planning to start with chicken...are turkey and chicken close enough to be interchangeable? (I ordered the ground turkey to use in the Kong, etc...should I grind some chicken to use in them at first until I introduce turkey?) When can I introduce chicken liver? (Trying to figure out what to do for training treats, for my last GSD I used a liver brownie type recipe, but it had flour and I think cornmeal in it, obviously I'm trying to avoid grains with this little one, so I need to figure out treats, so I can either buy or make them before I pick up the little one. Was thinking of trying to dehydrate chicken liver and breaking it up for training treats?)

The list I posted isn't accurate anymore, the lady who runs the co-op explained some of the changes. Chicken liver isn't available, beef hearts aren't consistently available. Calf liver is $3/lb in a 6lb package. The pet mix is whole chicken pieces/organs WITHOUT bone (ie isn't a ground mix).

They have an 80/20 ground beef, boneless/skinless chicken breasts, turkey necks, chicken thighs with bones, turkey tails (huh?), ground pork.

Can you share the proportions you use for the PB/honey/yogurt/Co oil?

Thanks so much for allt he advice, I'm slowly coming out of panic mode! (I know I have a couple weeks til puppy, but we're still unpacking from the move, sick toddler, still buying puppy stuff...and I'm tired of trying to figure out what I'm gonna feed this little girl! Now I know we're going raw, and I'm feeling a bit more confident that I can do it right LOL)


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

You can transition the pup to raw right away. I'd have ordered more tripe though! I give a heaping spoonful of green tripe daily. And it is great to add during the transition phase. Full of digestive enzymes and probiotics.

As far as the yogurt/coconut oil blend, I just do equal parts of everything to make up about 2 cups total. .... melt the coconut oil first> 
I microwave 1/2 filled pyrex or measuring bowl water to boiling and then put a glass 2 or 3 cup measuring cup with some organic raw coconut oil into the larger one. As it melts I add in the peanut butter, local raw unpasturized honey and mix it until everything blends and cools some. Then I fold in the yogurt. 
Because the yogurt is cold, the coconut oil blend will start solidifying so mix fast and pour into ice cube trays. After those freeze, I pop them out and put in ziplock baggie. I give one cube daily or for a mid day snack.


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## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Your puppy should have no problems with chicken necks and backs. The thighs and legs might be a bit much for her - see how she does.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

I start feeding split fryers and whole chickens cut up to my puppies around 7 weeks. What I do is crush the bones in the legs and thighs a bit to help the pups. I do the same with turkey necks when I feed them to the younger pups.


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## Contrary (Jun 12, 2013)

Thanks everyone! I'm going to plan to start raw around August 1st, may discuss it with the vet, depending on *how* raw friendly he is. I'll start giving little bit (we cannot decide on a name lol) green tripe as soon as we get home. I'm guessing a heaping spoonful is 1-2 ounces at the most? If so, the next co-op run will be mid-August, so I should have plenty of the green tripe to get me through until then. If by chance I run out beforehand, that is one of the items the kennel has all the time, so I can just go get more and not have to wait for co-op day. (The people who run the co-op own a kennel and sell various pet feeds, as well, they keep a decent amount of raw stuff in stock.)

Hubby and I checked prices in the commissary and Walmart today. Strangely enough the commissary here doesn't sell chicken liver??? (Very strange, we've used about 10 others in his career and they've all had it. I asked a butcher about it, but all the poultry is stocked by a vendor, so she wasn't sure about whether it's just out or not stocked. We did not see a price tag for it, though.)

I can get your everyday cuts at the commissary, of course, plus beef heart, kidneys, liver, and tongue (though I probably won't buy tongue, it was rather expensive.) They were cheaper on chicken thighs, but the co-op is cheaper on boneless/skinless breasts and for bone-in breasts. The co-op has 80/20 ground beef for about half the price of the commissary. 

Anyway, will start visiting the ethnic groceries soon to see if I can find a good source/price for beef hearts. Sooo glad things are falling into place easily.

Kinda funny, hubby has been pretty anti-raw for the animals, but he didn't bat an eye when I told him I would be coming home with 135lbs of meat that had to be thawed and portioned for the puppy. His only worry was that we would harm puppy by thawing and refreezing it. Said he hated to spend all this money on a puppy only to kill it with bad meat LOL. He has some concerns about making sure she gets the right nutrients, but otherwise seems very pleased with the co-op prices and didn't have anything negative to say at all. (I expected some guff about not really giving him a veto option, because he has been pretty strong in saying he didn't want to do raw when it came up in conversation.)


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## chellebonnette (Jul 15, 2013)

*Looking for raw also*

Contrary,

Can you please share where you are purchasing your raw food. Our supplier out here is really lacking customer service lately 

THANKS!! Michelle


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## Contrary (Jun 12, 2013)

chellebonnette said:


> Contrary,
> 
> Can you please share where you are purchasing your raw food. Our supplier out here is really lacking customer service lately
> 
> THANKS!! Michelle


Are you in the Springs? I'm getting it through a co-op, which is run by Countryside. I'm still trying to get a handle on what all they can get, but I know they purchase from Harvest Foods in Denver, and from Red Bird (not sure where that is). They carry green tripe from California, and ground beef, ground pork, and I can't remember what else.

I haven't really had time yet to check for local sources. I see several RF'ers on Craigslist here, so I thought about emailing them for sources locally. I also have a list of places around the state I got from the Colorado Carnivores group owner.

Here's a link to the Countryside co-op: Countryside_Group : Countryside Co-Op


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