# Swallowing RMB whole



## ceardach (Apr 11, 2008)

I'm switching Taedyn to a raw diet, and the bones have got me worried. This evening I gave her a chicken leg and chicken thigh. She chewed the thigh in half, and swallowed each half whole. Then she bit a chunk of meat off the leg, and swallowed the rest of the leg whole.

That means she has a whole leg bone sitting in her stomach. Is this OK? Can she really digest that? Should I do more to prevent her from doing that?

... Some medical horrors are running through my head.

She's not a gulper, and in fact is pretty good about making sure she only swallows food (like avoiding pills and rocks even with other food in her mouth). It appears as though she is swallowing the thigh and leg whole out of impatience, mostly. She chews on it a bit, but it doesn't really break up after a bit, and then she just swallows the whole darn thing!


----------



## tracyc (Feb 23, 2005)

You could try feeding larger pieces (like the leg and thigh attached together) which would force her to reduce it to swallowable pieces. 

Or feed smaller pieces--chunks you're comfortable with her swallowing as is. 

Or try feeding it frozen. That will slow down some dogs and force them to chew it. 

I understand your concern. Two of mine gulp their raw food too. Fanny and Ellie barely chew anything. Only Luca chews his food. My experience has been: if they can swallow it, they can digest it. Otherwise, it comes back up for more chewing. 

Took me a long while to get comfortable with that. I still cringe a bit when Fanny swallows a whole chicken wing! But nothing bad has ever happened here. Dogs don't really have teeth that grind food into mush like people's teeth do. Their teeth only need to reduce their food into hunks they can swallow. 

Watch Taedyn (and her poop) to make sure everything seems okay for the next day or so. I think it will be. I always watch mine when they eat, just in case something would happen and I need to do something (what, I don't know.) Again, I never have had to...but I still don't leave them alone to eat. 

Perhaps as she gets more used to the raw diet and it isn't such an exciting new thing she'll slow down.


----------



## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

I give Dante his turkey necks frozen to make him chew them up a bit better.











> Quote:Otherwise, it comes back up for more chewing










First time freaked me out. Ok, I'm still







ing at how you put that


----------



## Crookedcreekranch (May 27, 2008)

Does this dog eat alone or with other dogs? I've found they will gulp things whole if they fear another dog is going to go after their food. 

Are they so.. hungry they are gulping? How many times a day do you feed? If only once that could be an issue.


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: Luca_stlOr try feeding it frozen. That will slow down some dogs and force them to chew it.


This is how I feed Sasha as she gulps and doesn't chew her food very well. Penny is the opposite so she gets her meals thawed.



> Originally Posted By: Luca_stlOtherwise, it comes back up for more chewing.


I find this to be true although I wouldn't want this happening on a regular basis as it concerns me regarding perforation on its way back up. Especially with the bonier bones.


----------



## tracyc (Feb 23, 2005)

> Quote: Originally Posted By: Luca_stl: Otherwise, it comes back up for more chewing.
> 
> I find this to be true although I wouldn't want this happening on a regular basis as it concerns me regarding perforation on its way back up. Especially with the bonier bones.


I agree. Regurgitation with any frequency needs to be addressed. 

I only mention it as nature's built in "reboot" for when something does go down in too large a hunk. 

My gulpers don't have to re-chew things often at all. They swallow it, I'm astonished, then they digest it and it's forgotten.


----------



## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

> Quote:
> then they digest it and it's forgotten.


Really? Camper is a very slow, meticulous chewer. But sometimes, (ok, if Zamboni is moving in for a closer look.), he tends to eat faster. 

Then, I may see small chunks of bone...well, on the other end...

Out of sight for a while. But never quite forgotten.


----------



## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

So.. if the knobby end of a turkey drum bone comes up for an instant replay the next morning.. will the dog just get used to digesting bone hunks after a while? Does their body kind of adapt in time to handling bones better?


----------



## GrandJan (Aug 11, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: BrightelfSo.. if the knobby end of a turkey drum bone comes up for an instant replay the next morning..


If the bone comes “up” the next morning, it’s not an instant replay. It will come up right away if it needs to be chewed again. If it comes “out” the next morning, it’s still okay – it was digested enough to pass through.



> Originally Posted By: Brightelf…will the dog just get used to digesting bone hunks after a while? Does their body kind of adapt in time to handling bones better?


Pretty much. If you notice, Grimm will start to drool a little before he eats. This starts the process for digestion. It gets the stomach juices flowing, and then the stomach takes over the rest. You will be surprised how quickly he will adapt to the new food.


----------



## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

Jan, thanks for the reply. Grimm sometimes vomited the knobby end the next morning. Just hoping that will not be an issue after a while on all raw.

Ceardach, how is Taedyn doing on the raw diet now?


----------



## GrandJan (Aug 11, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: BrightelfGrimm sometimes vomited the knobby end the next morning.


Not sure about this, Patti - I've never had it happen.

Hopefully Tracy or Natalie will check in and help you out.


----------



## tracyc (Feb 23, 2005)

I've never had anything come up hours later. I've only ever had an instant upchuck once or twice---and this was clearly just a case of a hunk too big to go down. 

I haven't ever found any undigested bone in the poop. (Not that I'm out there leading a forensic team...but I know you raw feeders know what I mean.) 

But if I had to guess, Grimm's turkey knob barf is evidence of the same principle. If it won't go down, it comes back up. In this case, delayed reaction. 

I think this is all part of the adaptation each of us have to make based on individual observation with each dog. For example, I just know that Fanny will swallow a whole wing unchewed. So if she's getting a chicken wing, I whack it into several pieces that I know will go down without incident. A leg, I know she will have to at least gnaw in half herself, so she can have the whole thing. She can't do pork necks at all, so she doesn't get those. 

If Grimm barfs the turkey knob every time, then that's his thing. Either mash it for him, or cut it off and throw it away.


----------



## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Patti when I first fed Penny chicken quarters she would often give me back the knobby end the next morning. I don't remember the time frame, perhaps a month or so, but she did quit this before it became too concerning. I believe that it just took a bit more time for her to be able to digest this particular part of the bone.


----------



## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

Thank you for the input Jan, Tracy and Natalie! I will give it some time, and if it still always comes back up, I'll start whackin'.


----------



## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: Luca_stlI haven't ever found any undigested bone in the poop. (Not that I'm out there leading a forensic team...but I know you raw feeders know what I mean.)



What I usually find looks like the end piece of the leg, where you snap off the foot from the leg when you're butchering a chicken (those of you raised on farms & ranches know what I mean)...I guess this is what Patti means by the knobby end? It's not much, but it's there. 

The thing is, since Luca isn't a SIBO boy, Tracy doesn't have the pleasure of analyzing poop at nearly the level of detail that some of us do...







But then again, he doesn't get to do the Happy Poop Dance either. 

It's a matter of balance.


----------



## Brightelf (Sep 5, 2001)

We need dancing poop-sign bananas!


----------



## DianaM (Jan 5, 2006)

Renji seems to take the chicken quarter, divide it in half, crunch the bones in a couple of places, then down the hatch like a gator swallowing a zebra leg. He only throws up bile and that's just because he's hungry. His poops are great. I figure that carnivores are designed to tear flesh apart and crunch bone down enough to swallow the prey item ASAP, so chewing is not truly part of their repertoire. Herbivores sit around and chew, carnivores just rip n' gulp. Your mileage may vary and what works for my dog may not work for your dog.


----------



## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

> Originally Posted By: 3K9Mom
> 
> 
> > Originally Posted By: Luca_stlI haven't ever found any undigested bone in the poop. (Not that I'm out there leading a forensic team...but I know you raw feeders know what I mean.)
> ...


Dante will sometimes poop through Turkey vertebrae....Where's that dancing poop banana again?


----------



## ceardach (Apr 11, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: BrightelfCeardach, how is Taedyn doing on the raw diet now?


Well, it hasn't been that long. I've been giving her occasional all raw meals here and there, but I only just now actually went out and got a week's worth of food. I have noticed absolutely nothing out of ordinary previously.

I fed her a pre-made frozen meal instead of the non-frozen one I had put aside. It did make her chew a lot, however, once she separated a piece she still just swallowed it whole. The end of the leg was sticking out of the frozen mass, and she just chopped the bone in half to break it off and swallowed it whole! 

I suppose if she's not the only one swallowing these things whole, perhaps I should just not worry and let her do her thing.


----------



## DancingCavy (Feb 19, 2001)

Risa has been known to crunch a chicken thigh once and then down the hatch it goes (she's a 45-lb Mutt). I really wish she wouldn't since then I get on the 'watch and make sure' alert. So far, we haven't had a problem.

On occasion, she will urp up some undigested bone the next day after a bone-heavy meal. It used to happen more frequently but now it's just a once-in-a-while deal.

The only time I've noticed bone shards in her poop has been when she's ill with SIBO which causes malabsorption/digestive problems. Otherwise, if it goes it okay it comes out okay.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)




----------



## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

LOL @ Lauri!

OK that smiley is the winner for 2008. How could I have missed it?


----------



## Barb E (Jun 6, 2004)

> Originally Posted By: Lauri & The Gang


----------



## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

There it is! I lost him in my hard drive somewhere! 

See what you're missing, Tracy?!?


----------



## tracyc (Feb 23, 2005)

Right now I'm doing that dance (and the pee pee dance) whenever Ellie does it outside! Nevermind consistency. I'm focused on location.


----------

