# Pet insurance comparison



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I'm down to these three plans

Pet Plan
Embrace
Healthy Paws

Anyone have any input on any of these?

Thanks!


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

Go with Healthy Paws. Exc. company.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I read that. They were rated one of the best. Do you have them? Have you had to use it?

I know Pet Plan is good but it looks like Healthy Paws and Embrace are better and have better customer service?

btw...still waiting on pics of those blue pups!


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

I used to have petplan. They raised the prices and i've got a pretty healthy dog, so i just ended up dropping it. I think it was costing me around $600 per year (with 20% copay and $8k max per incident per year). At those prices, I figured I might as well take my chances and just pay as needed.

When I did have to use it, which was hardly ever, I didn't have any complaints. I was paid back within a few weeks and customer service was good. It's not cheap though, but insurance never is for anything.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

One ACL costs me $5000 total. Then there are the two growths removed. I understand the deductible on Pet Plan is per incident and not per year? Embrace and Healthy Paws are per year?


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## Lucy Dog (Aug 10, 2008)

Jax08 said:


> One ACL costs me $5000 total. Then there are the two growths removed. I understand the deductible on Pet Plan is per incident and not per year? Embrace and Healthy Paws are per year?


That's when insurance comes in handy - with the big stuff. 

From what I remember, Pet Plan does per incident and per year. Once the year is up, the max resets.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

I have both Healthy Paws and Trupanion on several dogs. Some puppy buyers have Healthy Paws also. Healthy Paws has been WONDERFUL about everything. No problems in a couple years. One dog had a very expensive dance with Lyme and they covered it cheerfully, no weaseling out of anything. Very fair- no secret loopholes that they find once you've already given the vet the go-ahead, thinking they'll pay it. 

Deductible is per year, just like human insurance. I have high coverage/low deductible. Premiums haven't increased much. They've cut me some sizeable checks....$3700 for my poisoned Chihuahua...got the money within days and phone call to see how he was doing.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Thanks Jen! Good to know!


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## huntergreen (Jun 28, 2012)

there was thread on this a year or so ago done by some one in the insurance business. if i remember correctly it was pretty informative with a cost benefit analysis. it would be worthwhile to dig up.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Yes, I know. They say nothing about Embrace and very little about Healthy Paws.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

After much research, I find that pet insurance is not worth it unless it is on a dog/puppy that has not ever been to the vet or has had zero wrong with it. The pre existing conditions leave lots of room for them to deny a claim. My sister is going through this right now with her cat. The cat is limping, vet finds nothing, my sister is still concerned 2 weeks later and goes to another vet. Cat is diagnosed with cancer in that leg and insurance won't cover it, because its considered pre existing because the limp started two wks prior. Even though it wasn't diagnosed its not covered. The same goes for a torn ACL, if it happens once its pre existing and will not be pre existing any longer after 12-18 months with no symptoms. If the dog has icky poop in its record and them a month later the dog is diagnosed with irritable bowel syndrome a month later, its not covered. And the list goes on and on....


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## pets4life (Feb 22, 2011)

i got trupanion and i got it before my dog had any allergy condition 

I still dont know if it is worth it as i pay 55 a month!

They keep raising the monthly bill and even raised it just because i changed cities? I feel i have to keep it now that my dog has problems but if it is added up I dont know if i even saved anything.,


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## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

I'm still trying to decide if it's worth it, for my next dog. 

I've been trying to compare the companies also to see which would be best if I do get insurance. So far Trupanion seems like one of the better options, Embrace and Pet Plan also looked pretty good. Embrace was more expensive and less customizable, and they had different ways of doing the deductible. 
One plus for Trupanion is they don't have a yearly limit or lifetime limit on how much they'll pay. So far almost all the others I've looked at that had good reviews did have various limits. Some of them have different levels and you can pay more to get a higher yearly limit. 
One thing I found about Embrace, if you have their insurance already but later want to "upgrade" your coverage for example by decreasing your deductible, then any medical condition your dog had before you did that will be considered pre-existing. 
I need to check which other companies do this. Trupanion says they don't. 

I also noticed some of the companies have a 6 month waiting period on any orthopedic conditions, which means if they develop any orthopedic problems before 6 month after you register those would be considered pre-existing and not be covered.

I've also read a lot of them will raise their fees over and over so you end up paying a lot more than your original rate.

I can't remember if I looked into Healthy Paws or not, I'll have to check.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

huntergreen said:


> there was thread on this a year or so ago done by some one in the insurance business. if i remember correctly it was pretty informative with a cost benefit analysis. it would be worthwhile to dig up.



That was me that did that.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Jax08 said:


> Yes, I know. They say nothing about Embrace and very little about Healthy Paws.


Im pretty sure I ripped those two apart somewhere on the numerous pet insurance threads that show up


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

pets4life said:


> i got trupanion and i got it before my dog had any allergy condition
> 
> I still dont know if it is worth it as i pay 55 a month!
> 
> They keep raising the monthly bill and even raised it just because i changed cities? I feel i have to keep it now that my dog has problems but if it is added up I dont know if i even saved anything.,


Trupanion bases their rates on cost of care in your area. That is why it changed when you moved. It can go up and down based on that.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

Trupanion weaseled out of paying a very legitimate claim based on a TYPO from the vet. The vet even wrote a letter correcting their mistake, corrected the original notes, and they still denied the claim in an appeal process. They accidentally typed "2 months" instead of "2 days" so Trupanion said it was pre-existing, despite the vet's repeated apology for a typo on their form. 

Additionally, they will arbitrarily decide not to cover an intact animal's claim if they decide it may have been prevented by the animal being spayed or neutered. Example, my 7yr old APBT is intact, therefore, were he hit by a car, they may, at their discretion, decide not to pay his claim because of their belief that if he were neutered, he'd not have been in the road. 

Or, if another dog attacked us on a walk, none of my intact dogs would be covered (at their discretion) because they believe spayed or neutered dogs would not have been such a target for attack. 

Healthy Paws has no such loopholes. Healthy Paws was founded by someone who used to work for Trupanion, so they've taken many of Trupanion's weaknesses and fixed them. 

I have ZERO complaints about Healthy Paws. And yes, it just makes good common sense to get insurance when they're puppies, before you have a bunch of pre-existing conditions! I got my Chi from the local animal shelter and they've never given me hard time about his lack of history. When there was a question about a liver issue being pre-existing, they wrote me a letter stating that they would pay this claim, but until he had been cleared of any underlying liver issue, they could not pay future liver-related claims. I thought that was VERY fair. He had a reaction to milbemycin, then presumably ate a poisoned mouse and had to have transfusions. Thus, twice, his liver was suspect and they paid the second claim. The first time, I didn't have the insurance, so to me, that's more than fair.


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## pets4life (Feb 22, 2011)

did u switch then vom?


did u ever ague with tru> ? over stuff?


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## volcano (Jan 14, 2013)

I made 20 bux at 1-2 poker tonight= better odds than pet insurance. Insurance is a scam. When you pay for insurance youre planning on it paying you more than the payments- It aint gonna happen and theyll go on vacation and build huge buildings with your money. Same as at the casino except there I have better odds.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

Let's see, Volcano...

My Chi costs $37/mo. How many months do I have to pay that to equal the $3700 they paid out on one weekend ER stay? If I'd canceled it after the claim, I'd have only paid that premium about 5 times. I'd say that's a **** of a bargain!

How about the surgery for my imported puppy? That was $4500 and his premium was $41/mo. Again, help me with the math here, Volcano...he was 6 months old when he had the surgery, so I paid $44, 4 times. Not sure, but I think I got the better deal. 

Premiums are cheap when they're puppies. Get the coverage, get the ortho coverage in case of trouble or injuries, and cancel that coverage when their hips and elbows are certified or xrayed clear, and keep the basic coverage for accidents and illnesses. 

OR- start your own savings plan instead of insurance. But no one wants to be at the vet w/a serious problem and forced to pts because they can't afford to fix it. 

My premiums are also based on 90% coverage and only a $75 deductible- the premiums are obviously lower if you opt for less coverage.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

pets4life, yes, I argued. Still arguing, matter of fact. I gave the dog away and I'd really like the new owners to have coverage...and I'd really like the $4500 they owe me for pre-approving it and then denying it, and denying it again, after an appeal one of their employees urged me to complete.


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

vom Eisenherz said:


> Let's see, Volcano...
> 
> My Chi costs $37/mo. How many months do I have to pay that to equal the $3700 they paid out on one weekend ER stay? If I'd canceled it after the claim, I'd have only paid that premium about 5 times. I'd say that's a **** of a bargain!
> 
> ...


:thumbup:

Volcano: I already broke down on another thread how much I have paid in premiums and how much Petplan has paid for Nikki's health issues. They never give me a problem and her issues are for life. Premiums do go up and I don't know how they figure the increases. If my premium went up to $200 a month it would still be worth it for us.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

vom Eisenherz said:


> Let's see, Volcano...
> 
> My Chi costs $37/mo. How many months do I have to pay that to equal the $3700 they paid out on one weekend ER stay? If I'd canceled it after the claim, I'd have only paid that premium about 5 times. I'd say that's a **** of a bargain!
> 
> ...


You are lucky it worked out this way. It doesn't for most people. There is way to much wiggle room for pre existing clauses to come into play. Since my golden just had issues with his stomach, undiagnosed, I was told that if any diagnostic stuff that comes later will be considered pre existing. It's wrong and stupid IMO. There is no way that something undiagnosed should ever be considered pre existing. With 5 dogs insurance would be about 2600 a year. Even with a couple emergencies this year I was still under that in costs with mine and everything wrong with them makes stuff pre existing for insurances purposes.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Hey people!! It would be nice to be able to have my question answered. The question was NOT "do you think, in your opinion, that insurance is worth it" 

The question was...



> I'm down to these three plans
> 
> Pet Plan
> Embrace
> ...


Thank you to Jen and Paul who actually gave input on the insurances listed.

If you want to discuss why you shouldn't get insurance, please start your own thread instead of hi-jacking this one.


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## Heidigsd (Sep 4, 2004)

Jax08 said:


> Hey people!! It would be nice to be able to have my question answered. The question was NOT "do you think, in your opinion, that insurance is worth it"
> 
> The question was...
> 
> ...


Perfect example why I don't contribute to this board hardly anymore. Rude People!


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Heidigsd said:


> Perfect example why I don't contribute to this board hardly anymore. Rude People!


This wasn't even a controversial question. It's not like I asked "I'm going to breed my 9 mth old shelter bitch to a soft eared male with HD that my neighbor Bubba has. What colors do you think the puppies will be?"

Either you have experience with these insurances or you don't.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

vom Eisenherz said:


> pets4life, yes, I argued. Still arguing, matter of fact. I gave the dog away and I'd really like the new owners to have coverage...and I'd really like the $4500 they owe me for pre-approving it and then denying it, and denying it again, after an appeal one of their employees urged me to complete.


Pet insurance falls under property and casualty. You may be able to file a complaint under the states insurance commission for that P and C. I would also file a complaint with the Attorney generals office. File one in your home state and in the state where the main offices are.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

llombardo, what company??? Sorry, Jax08, to further hijack, but I want to know...

I don't think I'm "lucky." A person with one pet dog is lucky. I have 8 insured dogs. I think I do *a lot* of research and then make careful decisions based on my experiences and research. I have too many dogs with happy insurance stories to be considered "lucky." 

I have dogs on my insurance roster that are co-owned and don't even live with me. I've had enough good experiences WHEN UTILIZED IN AN INTELLIGENT FASHION, ie, not adding a 8 yr old dog onto a policy when the dog's had allergies its whole life, that I want my pups to stay on it when they leave, if at all possible. Look at all the trouble puppies get into. Premiums go up unrelated to what YOUR dog uses- it's typically geographic and based on an average for the breed. 

I had one of my last litters signed up. The family canceled it, not wanting to pay $44/mo for something they "probably" wouldn't use. A week later, he got into slug poison and they spent nearly $5,000 to save his life. If they'd kept the insurance, they'd have paid $500, plus the $88 for 2 months of premiums. He's a healthy 18 month old now...and they've almost got the vet paid off. 

Working dogs aren't like 'regular' dogs- when they do something, they do it big! I never, ever, want to have to deprive one of treatment for financial reasons.


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## vom Eisenherz (Feb 13, 2012)

Kr16, thanks for the tip! That's at the very least, something to mention to them in my next discussion. 

EVERYONE- be VERY cautious about notes your vet makes and make sure they're accurate before submitting. They're only human- typos happen! It can cost YOU.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

If you guys do a search I did all this research already on all these companies. 

I have asked the admins numerous times to let me do a sticky on this.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I did spend significant time searching. Both on here and on google and I did not see a single post from you on Healthy Paws or Embrace. if you have that thread handy, please post it.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Found it in a link buried in a thread
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/basic-care/159747-health-insurance-opinions.html

However, it still says very little about Embrace or Healthy Paws so doesn't do me a whole lot of good.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Jax08 said:


> Found it in a link buried in a thread
> http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/basic-care/159747-health-insurance-opinions.html
> 
> However, it still says very little about Embrace or Healthy Paws so doesn't do me a whole lot of good.



I looked at healthy paws last night and ripped apart the policy. I didn't see anything I didn't like. I even priced out my new pup. I did not even look at what I am paying on Petplan to compare costs.

I have had such good luck with Petplan I would be reluctant to switch. 

I would never do truepanion since I have not fixed either of my dogs. If you add the rider it doubles the price. A really good thing about True is they have vets that can get instant approval so you do not have to lay out money.

Embrace I may have looked at a while back. I can revisit that


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Embrace

This clause wild keep me away from them unless its a new pup. 

12 months wait is ridiculous for minor things. Skin problems are part of that 12 month if they had something already.

Also way to expensive for what they give in my zip code. 

Pre-existing Conditions That Embrace Considers Curable
If your cat or dog has had any of the following prior to enrolling in an Embrace plan any related recurrence will be excluded for 12 months from the date of the last episode:

Respiratory infections
Urinary tract/bladder infections
Vomiting, diarrhea, and other gastrointestinal disorders
Other curable conditions

If your pet's medical history shows no further episodes subsequent to this then, at our discretion, we will reinstate coverage for these conditions.

If your pet has been diagnosed with a disease of an anatomical area where the underlying cause was undetermined any diagnosis of the same area within 12 months would not be covered. For example gastritis and colitis are both general diagnoses of inflammation, but do not get at the cause of the disorder.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Embrace is almost double the price as Healthy Paws and Pet Plan for the same monetary coverage (90%/$500). Trying to get my hands on a full policy from Healthy Paws. The only thing on their website is a list of exclusions.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Jax08 said:


> Embrace is almost double the price as Healthy Paws and Pet Plan for the same monetary coverage (90%/$500). Trying to get my hands on a full policy from Healthy Paws. The only thing on their website is a list of exclusions.


http://www.healthypawspetinsurance.com/PolicyDocuments/Sample Policy.pdf


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Yes. That is exactly what I have already read.


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## Msmaria (Mar 2, 2013)

I looked at health insurace last month and end up buying healthy paws, mostly because it would allow my 14 yr old dog. Most of the other plans wouldnt allow senior dogs or like trupanion an unspayed dog. (I do have a 500 deductable on her though). Healthy paws just seemed the best fit and was only 118 a month for all 3 of my dogs. I havent used it yet so I cant comment on claims and it wont cover my dogs hip dysplasia because its already been diagnosed. What I like about health paws was it its lifetime coverage. I had VPI years back and didnt like it much. Before you decide make sure to review their policy on diagnosed illnesses, some insurances only coverr that year they are diagnosed and then will not cover that same illness the next year.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Ok...just got off the phone with Healthy Paws.

Sport Dogs are covered. As long as the activities are recreational. Working dogs have exclusions.

Alternative therapies are covered as long as they are recommended by the vet as a medical necessity.

Exam fees are not covered. Preventative care is not covered. (Vaccines, Heartworm)

All diagnostic and treatment for illness or accident is covered at the level you chose.

Reimbursement is actual vet bill, not "allowed" fee.

ACL's- if the animal has been previously diagnosed prior to coverage or during the waiting period, neither leg is covered. If the animal is diagnosed after the waiting period then both legs are covered. (I've read at least one other plan that considers the second ACL a pre-existing condition)

HD - is pre-existing if diagnosed in the first 12 months.

Meds are covered for accident/illness.

Pre-diagnosed illnesses. I used Pano as an example. What she said was if the Pano was successfully treated and it reoccurred 3 months later it is not pre-existing, it's a new case and covered. My next example was Pano and 6 mths later a pulled groin muscle. Same symptoms, different diagnosis. She stated the vet records would be reviewed and as there was a different diagnosis it would be covered.

Pre-existing per their sample police is any illness/condition diagnose prior to policy effective date. 

Cost does not increase with the age of the dog. Cost will be adjusted for inflation and historically it has been 0-12%.

Now to fully review Pet Plan


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Jax08 said:


> Ok...just got off the phone with Healthy Paws.
> 
> Sport Dogs are covered. As long as the activities are recreational. Working dogs have exclusions.
> 
> ...



Reimbursement is as written in the policy and as always written to protect the insurance company.

*This policy shall not cover amounts charged by the treating veterinary clinic that are greater than the 
treating veterinary clinic’s standard or published charges.*


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## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Jax08 said:


> Ok...just got off the phone with Healthy Paws. . . . .
> Now to fully review Pet Plan


Jax did you ever decide on a plan? I have Blaze on Pet Plan but my mom was just asking me last night what I thought of Healthy Paws. . .


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I did get the Healthy Paws plan. Hvae not had to use it! I hear more and more good things about them all the time so glad I chose them.


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## Angelina03 (Jan 9, 2012)

Healthy Paws is what I have. I've had a few claims. Quite happy with them. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## natalie559 (Feb 4, 2005)

Great- thanks!


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Natalie - the selling points for me were

1. Yearly deductible not per incident
2. If an acl blows out they will cover the second which many will not do.
3. they will cover HD if NOT diagnosed in the first year.

I spent quite a bit of time on the phone asking questions and I see more and more good reviews coming out about Healthy Paws.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I have Healthy Paws and it paid for itself already after DDog was diagnosed with Pano.
Fast payment and good service.


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## Ubermother (Aug 22, 2010)

WOW! Thank you for this thread. 

I to am considering HealthyPaws and Embrace. Trupanion was thrown to the side when one of the members (sorry I forgot your un, you deserve so much credit for posting this!) said that if a dog develops endocrine type cancer and he/she was fixed after yr 1 it wouldn't be covered. 

Does anyone know if HP or E has the same clause?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

HealthyPaws has no clauses that I know of other than they won't cover anything that is pre-existing (meaning in existence BEFORE the policy came into effect) AND HP will cover both knees if an ACL tears. Most insurances will cover the one but not the other. HP will cover HD if not diagnosed in the first year. And I think HP is hte only one with a yearly deductible instead of a deductible per incident. I also think Embrace is twice the cost of HP but at may have been a different insurance.


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## Ubermother (Aug 22, 2010)

Thank you.

Since she hasn't had an exam in about 14months, do you think I should take her in for an examination first or buy the insurance first? I can request a health history review but they do need a current exam.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

How old is she? Do they require an exam first??


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

If thye don't require an exam, I would buy the insurance, wait the required amount of time for the policy to take affect and then take them in.

FYI - no policy covers yearly exams or vaccinations. But if they should find a medical condition during the exam the meds and testing would be covered. HP does not cover office exam charges.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

A lot of policy's cover yearly exams and vaccinations. They are usually the bad companies that offer that since they hardly cover anything else. The good real companies do not. There are only 4 worthy pet insurance companies and some real pathetic ones.

If you want to get blood work covered just say your dog is sick. Get your vet on board with all this. I get a full blood panel once a year at least on both my dogs. Be careful what gets put in that chart since they ask for it for claims.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

This is a bad clause in healthy paws since I did lower my deductible and co insurance and raised my max on my dog with just a phone call.

7) You are entitled to increase your pet’s deductible level and/or increase your pet’s coinsurance amount 
at any time. This request must be made in writing and will become effective the month following approval 
by us. *You may apply to lower your pet’s deductible level and/or decrease your pet’s coinsurance
amount provided that your pet has not previously filed a claim with us.* This request must be in writing and 
will become effective the month following approval by us

*This is also not great*

d. Illness related to hip dysplasia that occurs or recurs within the first twelve (12) months following the
pet policy effective date.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Ubermother said:


> Thank you.
> 
> Since she hasn't had an exam in about 14months, do you think I should take her in for an examination first or buy the insurance first? I can request a health history review but they do need a current exam.



The answer is always in the written policy so its yes and no lol. Its get one within 15 days of getting the policy or 12 months prior if the dog is under six. If its over six do not get this company since they will never cover HD.

I would get one before and cover the knees and hips in the examination and get it in writing they are all good. 



This is from Healthy paws

5) LIMITATIONS
*a. A pet less than six (6) years of age on the date of enrollment must have undergone a complete 
clinical examination. The exam must have taken place either in the twelve (12) months prior to the 
pet policy effective date, or within fifteen (15) days following the pet policy effective date. A pet six *
(6) years of age or greater on the date of enrollment must have undergone a complete clinical 
examination within thirty (30) days prior to the pet policy effective date, or within fifteen (15) days 
following the pet policy effective date. Your failure to submit your pet to a complete clinical 
examination may void the policy. If the policy is voided, the policy premium will be refunded.
b. For pets six (6) years of age or greater on the date of enrollment, no coverage shall apply for illness
related to hip dysplasia.
c. For working pets, no coverage shall apply for any condition resulting from activities related to 
racing, breeding, law enforcement, guarding or for any commercial use.


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## Ubermother (Aug 22, 2010)

Jax08 said:


> If thye don't require an exam, I would buy the insurance, wait the required amount of time for the policy to take affect and then take them in.
> 
> FYI - no policy covers yearly exams or vaccinations. But if they should find a medical condition during the exam the meds and testing would be covered. HP does not cover office exam charges.


She's 4. They need to see an exam within 12 months prior to coverage or they require one within 30 days.


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## Ubermother (Aug 22, 2010)

kr16 said:


> The answer is always in the written policy so its yes and no lol. Its get one within 15 days of getting the policy or 12 months prior if the dog is under six. If its over six do not get this company since they will never cover HD.
> 
> I would get one before and cover the knees and hips in the examination and get it in writing they are all good.
> 
> ...


Ok good. LOL! Good suggestion on her hips and elbows too. Thank you.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Ubermother said:


> Ok good. LOL! Good suggestion on her hips and elbows too. Thank you.


I would for real get the hips xrayed since this company has a 12 month HD waiting period. That to me is not good unless you are sure the hips are perfect, especially with a 4 year old. This wouldn't concern me with a puppy. Although I am sure we have some posters here who have had HD in a young dog.


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## Ubermother (Aug 22, 2010)

We just took our girl to the vet and he did a thorough exam. He wrote in BIG *BOLD* lettering that her hips and elbows are good. He said he'd be happy to do an x-ray if they want one but he said in his experience with Healthy Paws and PetPlan they take the touch exam as word. I'm going to get all her records and submit them for their review to see if they see anything that they consider a pre-existing condition. I decided on Healthy Paws. 

This site was very helpful NEW Pet Insurance Review - comparison of VPI, ASPCA, etc. and down on the very bottom there is a filter for reviews for GSD owners. It really helped to see what other owners were saying. 

Thanks again for all the great advice. This forum has really been helpful over the last 4 years.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Ubermother said:


> We just took our girl to the vet and he did a thorough exam. He wrote in BIG *BOLD* lettering that her hips and elbows are good. He said he'd be happy to do an x-ray if they want one but he said in his experience with Healthy Paws and PetPlan they take the touch exam as word. I'm going to get all her records and submit them for their review to see if they see anything that they consider a pre-existing condition. I decided on Healthy Paws.
> 
> This site was very helpful NEW Pet Insurance Review - comparison of VPI, ASPCA, etc. and down on the very bottom there is a filter for reviews for GSD owners. It really helped to see what other owners were saying.
> 
> Thanks again for all the great advice. This forum has really been helpful over the last 4 years.


The xray advice was for you to be sure about the hips, not the insurance company. You now have a 12 month HD waiting period on the hips. 

The more people who sign up with this company the more feedback we can get. They are still a very new company.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

There would be a 12 month waiting period anyways and you don't pay extra for hip coverage with Healthy Paws so it really doesn't matter. It's all part of the policy for the same price. so the dog is 4. She waits a year and xrays the hips, she's still within the 6 yr window. If she took the xray now and it shows HD, then NOTHING for HD is covered because it would be pre-existing.


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Jax08 said:


> There would be a 12 month waiting period anyways and you don't pay extra for hip coverage with Healthy Paws so it really doesn't matter. It's all part of the policy for the same price. so the dog is 4. She waits a year and xrays the hips, she's still within the 6 yr window. If she took the xray now and it shows HD, then NOTHING for HD is covered because it would be pre-existing.



Xrays are not my expertise but doesn't a hip xray show a possibility of a bad hip coming down the road? It would not be diagnosed as HD at the time.

If it did, you do not get this company. That can be misplaced as a record so you wouldn't have a pre existing condition. 12 months is a long time for something of that magnitude. I luckily have not dealt with the issue. I do know its expensive to get fixed.

This is not like human health insurance where you medical records get reported to the M.I.B. Its like your credit report its the medical information bureau. Amazing that's allowed to due to Hippa laws but it does. 

Anyhow it is sometimes easy to hide a pre existing condition with pets.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

It could show the formation of arthritis or wear/tear. but if you got an xray then it is diagnosed and considered pre-existing so why would you want to xray before getting insurance? If it's not diagnosed then it's not pre-existing. So she waits the allotted time (for which she is not paying anything since it's all part of the policy) and then gets xrays at any point past the time.

HD is HD. It's not arthritis, it's not normal wear and tear on the joints, it's the formation of the hip socket that is going to be the same at 1 yr as 4 yrs as 6. The only thing that will change is wear on the bone and formation of arthritis. Jax was diagnosed with mild HD at 1. The only thing that has changed is arthritis forming.

If her dog has HD serious enough to warrant immediate attention then she would have already seen the problems. 

So, my question to you is, why would you xray and take the chance on it being diagnosed prior to getting insurance? Then no insurance is going to cover it. What insurance out there covers a pre-diagnosed condition?


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## kr16 (Apr 30, 2011)

Jax08 said:


> It could show the formation of arthritis or wear/tear. but if you got an xray then it is diagnosed and considered pre-existing so why would you want to xray before getting insurance? If it's not diagnosed then it's not pre-existing. So she waits the allotted time (for which she is not paying anything since it's all part of the policy) and then gets xrays at any point past the time.
> 
> HD is HD. It's not arthritis, it's not normal wear and tear on the joints, it's the formation of the hip socket that is going to be the same at 1 yr as 4 yrs as 6. The only thing that will change is wear on the bone and formation of arthritis. Jax was diagnosed with mild HD at 1. The only thing that has changed is arthritis forming.
> 
> ...



The short answer was for my own knowledge on the xray to see what may be coming since an exclusion applies. Its not all documented for the insurance company to see. 

I will only give that answer off the record on the pre existing and not in public view.

I am curious to see how healthy paws rerates after each renewal year. I just redid mine today. Hard to get a clear view since they are new. 

I hope to get some more input on them. I do like them from what I see. I also have a few minor issues, nothing major. I do not like the HD waiting period. I also do not like not being able to lower my deductible or co pay. That is minor since they have no maximums on payouts. Overall I like them. They are a very young company, so time will tell.


I get pmed a lot on companies and get asked every time based on today who I would choose.

I would still today get petplan over them.


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## kiya (May 3, 2010)

I have Trupanion for Lakota. She tested positive for Lyme's & erlichia in May. Just for the record I sent the vet bill to Trupanion figuring it needs to be in her file. They sent a questionnaire to my vet. I was also asked if I followed recommended flea/tick preventative I said I use the Seresto flea/tick collar. They also asked if I gave her the Lyme vaccine, which she actually did get last year or maybe the year before I also said there is no erlichia vaccine. Anyway I had to take Lakota in for 3yr rabies last night and my vet said she didn't send back the questionnaire because she needed to do an actual exam. Fine no problem. Then she brought up annual vaccines which I told her Trupanion said if I don't get annual vaccines those diseases will not be covered, fine.
I am disappointed I kind of got a little attitude from my vet about the vaccines but Lakota is 4-1/2 now she had all puppy, 1 year boosters that's it for her.
Trupanion did send me notice that a percent was put to my deductible.
I am not worried about the little things but if something serious happened I'm hoping they pay when it really counts.


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