# I'm OVER it...stupid calcium



## TankGrrl66 (Jun 29, 2010)

I mean this in a frustrated but nonetheless humorous tone...okay, more humorous 

I am very over trying to find a dog food that not only works great w/my adult dogs but with my puppy as well. How hard can this be? Buying two different things seems ok, but I don't really have the room and it is expensive. I am really looking at it as an option though.

I feel bad feeding my puppy an adult dog food. She eats her own  and anything else if given the chance, and her growth is behind other puppies her age. This makes me think she has some sort of deficiency.

I fed my dogs taste of the wild, and everything was just fantastic! no skin problems, shiny coats, no cow pies, no itchiness, and full of life. The feed store I get it at doesn't gouge my eyes with the price. The puppy did great on it too. But I read that it would mean bad things for my 5mo puppy's growing bones, and many experienced posters here advised against it (with good reason!). 

When can I switch back to TOTW? 

I switched to Chicken Soup after that, the adult dog formula. There was a noticeable change, with both my males getting this wierd buildup on their skin and hot spots within the past few weeks. The puppy does good on it though. 

Now I want to try this brand 'Healthwise'. Seems pretty good for the price. I liked the ingredients and I bought a bag of it. It has 1.4% calcium though, which apparently means my puppy is going to explode with HD and bone deformities. 

I do take that info seriously...but then again:
Why don't wolf puppies get crippling HD? 
Why don't raw fed pups get HD and all that? 
How superior are these little brown pieces of overpriced wonder that are kibbles?

Sorry if I sound rantish. I'm just so frustrated with this! 

I really hope this Healthwise brand works. I went through the 35lb CS bag in less than a month. I have also considered trying Diamond Naturals. Thanks for reading...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Since I want nothing to do with Diamond, I would not feed Taste of the Wild or Chicken Soup to any of my dogs or puppies. But, lots of dogs do fine on them. 

I do not feed puppies grain free kibble. Others feed raw to puppies with no issues, but I think that there is more to the grain-free to those kibbles. I would feel comfortable feeding a raw or home-made diet to a puppy, but not a grain free kibble. 

Dogs are not wolves. Not really. Wolves living in the wild are NOT what we have. Not really. For one thing the selection process on who is bred is much more stringent than even the most quality of breeders. One of our dogs might not have a symptom of mild or moderate hip dysplasia, but if that dog was following game for survival, it would break down most likely. It would probably not be the leader dogs of the pack. And bitches do just as much hunting as dogs. They are also kept very lean, all muscle, so the better to bring down game. They are not wild wolves, it is really as simple as that. A line of wolves with a crippling defect would die out in the wild.


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## sable123 (Jul 11, 2010)

Perhaps someday there will be some science that truly backs the internet hysteria on calcium, but right now there isn't a food on the market that even remotely compares to the very few studies out there. Many of those studies link bone problems to obesity rather than calcium. Injury at a young age is probably responsible for a good portion of these problems.

Without the hysteria there is no market for specialized large breed products, just remember that. Same for the hysteria about grains, without it no need for GF foods, right?

To this day, no official body or body or research has been able to put an upper limit on calcium.


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## Redhawk (Jul 8, 2011)

Someone, or several people, will beat me with a broomstick or a worse weapon for saying this, but frankly I believe most of the science on dog food is just put out there so people will think its such a complicated matter that they can't feed dogs actual food, they must go through the scientists to feed. It's called.... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Really, most people don't even research their HUMAN children's diet's as much as their dog's diet. that should say something.

I really believe emotional factors affecting the endocrine system can have as big effect or more on dog's health than food. I would say just feed a decent food they do well on and stop stressing about it and you should be OK, and since dogs sap up their owner's emotions, they will be healthier as well. You don't even want to know about the health effects of sustained adrenaline and cortisol production in YOUR body! Might as well be time to take out a will and start planning your dogs future custodian if you keep stressing so much about their food


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## jprice103 (Feb 16, 2011)

What about TOTW Sierra Mountain? It has the lowest calcium of all the formulas (although it only states "as fed", so I don't know if that is the min or max). It is Cal 1.6 and Phos 1.0, as opposed to High Prairie, which is Cal 2.1 and Phos 1.4. Might be an option until your pup is old enough to switch to adult food. This is what I have my 8 month old on now (for the past month), as her large growth spurts are pretty much over. We are watching her closely, and she is gaining only about 1/2 lb per week, if that. I figure the slightly higher calcium than some of the LBP formulas is no different than people feeding pups this age some yogurt each week. I will wait to switch her to the other TOTW formulas until she hits a year, though...just to be on the safe side.


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## koda00 (Apr 27, 2009)

My puppy was on TOTW straight from the breeder and has done excellent. 7 mths now. My 1.5 y/o i switched from Blue Buffalo to TOTW and also doing excellent.


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## BlackthornGSD (Feb 25, 2010)

The studies regarding damaging amounts of calcium were studying amounts near 3%. 1.4% should be just fine for a puppy.

I'm feeding Earthborn grain-free that I buy online and the dogs are doing fantastic on it and the calcium level is around 1.3%.


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## carmspack (Feb 2, 2011)

Redhawk said:


> Someone, or several people, will beat me with a broomstick or a worse weapon for saying this, but frankly I believe most of the science on dog food is just put out there so people will think its such a complicated matter that they can't feed dogs actual food, they must go through the scientists to feed. It's called.... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
> 
> Really, most people don't even research their HUMAN children's diet's as much as their dog's diet. that should say something.
> 
> I really believe emotional factors affecting the endocrine system can have as big effect or more on dog's health than food. I would say just feed a decent food they do well on and stop stressing about it and you should be OK, and since dogs sap up their owner's emotions, they will be healthier as well. You don't even want to know about the health effects of sustained adrenaline and cortisol production in YOUR body! Might as well be time to take out a will and start planning your dogs future custodian if you keep stressing so much about their food


 

beat you with a broomstick ! I would love to shake your hand !

I bought a box of Dog World magazines going back to the early 1900's -- . I saw the first adverts for kibble . The approach was to undermine the confidence of the dog owning public , and to stroke them when they adopted kibble , appealing to their greater sophistication and intelligence. And the rest is history.


Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs


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## Redhawk (Jul 8, 2011)

"...appealing to their greater sophistication and intelligence"

BINGO! 

Other than sex (probably hard to sell a dog food on the concept), ego sells!

I would like to see a dog food though, that when I feed it to my dog, I get more sexy. That would be da bomb! 

Come to think of it... I think my current dog food is working quite well


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## neiltus (Mar 10, 2011)

what about nature's variety prairie? I feed it to pup and adult 19yo


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## s14roller (Nov 18, 2010)

I don't think there's a need to be that paranoid...think about how many shepherds (or other large breed dogs) out there whose owners don't know or read about the calcium levels, etc. I'd argue most are fine. 

We're probably talking about a very incremental difference if anything.


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## RedCrown (Feb 23, 2005)

sable123 said:


> Perhaps someday there will be some science that truly backs the internet hysteria on calcium, but right now there isn't a food on the market that even remotely compares to the very few studies out there. Many of those studies link bone problems to obesity rather than calcium. Injury at a young age is probably responsible for a good portion of these problems.
> 
> Without the hysteria there is no market for specialized large breed products, just remember that. Same for the hysteria about grains, without it no need for GF foods, right?
> 
> To this day, no official body or body or research has been able to put an upper limit on calcium.



What do you make of this study? 

Hormonal regulation of calcium homeostasis in two breeds of dogs during growth at different rates

To the OP- I personally wouldn't kill yourself worrying about it. Unless you are feeding a giant breed, I would just try to keep the calcium percentage under 2% until at least a year. I didn't pay attention to any of that when I was raising Friday, and she was on Timberwolf Organics with no problem.


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