# Game over: Los angeles most pedigree exemptions to mandatory neuter to be removed



## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

The Neuter Nutbags have finally gone full *****. They have almost sealed up every exemptions to the mandatory neuter ordinance with this latest round of legislation. This garbage is just another feather in the cap of the government having lost complete control over everything. No wonder this once great state is in such financial disarray. 

Read Here: The nuts and the bolts of it is, unless your dog is participating in a Conformation show, none of the other categories like Agility, Obedience, can be show exemptions. Which means, you neuter your dog. 

AKC News - Los Angeles to Consider Mandatory Spay/Neuter on 2nd Impound & Breeder Restrictions on June 18 - Your Opposition Needed!

I spoke with the CARPOC.COM people today via email and they told me that since the animal rights groups pretty much run the ordinances and that there isn't much hope that this will not pass.


_



The ordinance that will remove the breeding permits and intact dog permits for working dogs is not yet finalized... it has one more hearing (reconsideration) before it is. However, L.A. City, as far as animals are concerned, is run by animal rights groups and their followers. There hasn't been much hope that this ordinance will not be passed.

You can bypass it by having your dog enter conformation shows (Is he from American lines?), because those dogs are still allowed to be intact. 

If Florence doesn't contact you soon, please email me and we'll exchange a few emails in order to get you up to date on this situation, the best we can.

Click to expand...

_Here's the nail in the coffin piece of what I read on the AKC site.



> *Eliminate the current exemption for dogs that have earned, or if under 3 years of age, is actively being trained and in the process of earning an agility, carting, herding, protection, rally, hunting, working, or other title from a registry or association approved by the Department.* The report from the Board of Animal Services Commission indicates that few exemptions have been provided under this section, but they expressed concern about the qualifying guidelines for the registries and the fact that are no accepted professional standards or licensing procedures for animal training that can be used to validate an exemption request.


Absoute garbage.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

It is total garbage. And this is why I do not like to see the law in Ohio. Once they make a stupid law, then they revise it. 

I suppose you can enter a conformation show. I mean, unless your dog isn't registered, you can enter. You may not win, but the law is not requiring wins in conformation, just an entry.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

I agree. An easy way around it, enter your dog into a dog show. It does not say they have to win. 

**word removed so removing comments about the word** 


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## Msmaria (Mar 2, 2013)

Yep, I've already had them after me to neuter Dexter or I pay the fine. Right now I am using the fact that my vet won't spay until 6 months. Dexter only has a few weeks left. . What bothers me are the people that don't follow the law and register their dogs, the city does nothing about. 

I hope you find away to not neuter your dog.


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## Carriesue (Aug 13, 2012)

Wow, glad I live in San Diego county! Hope it doesn't work his way here.


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

Msmaria said:


> Yep, I've already had them after me to neuter Dexter or I pay the fine. Right now I am using the fact that my vet won't spay until 6 months. Dexter only has a few weeks left. . What bothers me are the people that don't follow the law and register their dogs, the city does nothing about.
> 
> I hope you find away to not neuter your dog.


The problem is they are dysfunctional. Before we even got our dog we called the city to make sure that there was a "fine" to pay and it's ok. They said, "sure you can just pay 80 dollars a year and its ok, you can license the same as anyone else" Well, we go down to the facility and the guy in there with the animal control badge was #1 a complete ass to us, and #2 told us that there is no exception and the dog must be neutered. I left.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

Be the voice! I wouldn't sit quietly if this was happening in my community. If you make waves the boat will rock. Do it respectfully and with guns loaded full of information. Your representatives are voted into office aren't they?
There is no reason to sit back and let this type of legislation pass without at least a fight.

I've read Anne's(vandal) posts about frustrations and her input with the laws in CA and it must be an uphill battle, but at least you know you didn't let something go thru without standing up for what you believe. The laws that are passed will set a precident for others to model after/which isn't a good thing.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I think everyone is looking at this from the responsible dog owner point of view. The government doesn't see that responsibility point of view when they are putting government money into shelters that are way over populated and that money can be used elsewhere. Yes I'm sure some tax payer money goes to shelter, but that alone is not going to keep them running. The government has to figure out a way to save money and if that means everyone has to neuter their pets to prevent more pets then that is what they feel they need to do. I can only hope one day that so many animals don't have to die and while its sad the government has to intervene, it almost necessary because obviously there are a lot of irresponsible pet owners out there, based on the number of dogs in the shelters. I neuter my dogs, but even if I didn't I would really take what they are trying to do into consideration and not look at it as them controlling us, they are controlling the population that they are paying for.


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

Agreed on the fight, but no one knew about it until just now. I stay pretty in tune with the legislation and this fell right out of a tree. The cut off date for input and hitting back was June 18th. This is one of those things that they are trying to shove through I'm sure. I guess the US Congress isn't the only ones to try and make things happen fast for the agenda. 

Truly unbelievable.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

onyx'girl said:


> Be the voice! I wouldn't sit quietly if this was happening in my community. If you make waves the boat will rock. Do it respectfully and with guns loaded full of information.


The problem with this is that there are pros and cons to everything and there is no one way that is the right way. Its now about the government funds that go to the shelters. I doubt anyone is going to win against that argument. They don't want to spend there money on that anymore and they have found a way to prevent unwanted pets.


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

Llombardo, I agree with you. The problem is that these kinds of laws have been debunked to them for so long that the folks that fight the legislation even wonder if anyone hears them. Mandatory neuter laws did nothing for pet populations in many areas. There have been tons of fights. They don't listen. They don't want to hear the facts. It's the new war on drugs. No one wants to understand it at the legislation level. I've done quite a bit of research and I am just open jawed that it all falls on deaf ears.


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## gsdsar (May 21, 2002)

It's seems a bit like gun control to me. The lawful citizens, that register/license their dogs/guns are not the problem. It's the ones that don't. And they won't neuter anyway. 

Not trying to be political. It just seems that the lawful responsible owners take on the burden of those that aren't. 


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

The core of the point that is made is that the low lifes and poor people who cant afford it, just don't do it. Enforcement is a joke. The irresponsible dog owners don't give a darn about the law. Only the people who want to live by the law neuter their dogs. They're responsible. Their animals are not out wandering the streets. Thats why it doesn't work. The responsible people dont let their dogs run loose because they're responsible. LOL


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Uhm, tax payers, both individual and corporate fund the government. It is all government monies. Our shelter is privately run on donations, and gets no government funding, save when the dog warden (government employee) houses a stray there for the required number of days. 

But our area does not have mandatory speuter here.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

selzer said:


> Uhm, tax payers, both individual and corporate fund the government. It is all government monies. Our shelter is privately run on donations, and gets no government funding, save when the dog warden (government employee) houses a stray there for the required number of days.
> 
> But our area does not have mandatory speuter here.


Right the tax payers fund the government and the government decides where that money goes. Generally you can find this break down, which can include schools, roads, etc. So they are taking money away from the schools to fund shelters full of animals because people were not responsible. Most bigger cities or towns, the animal shelters are not privately run. I can't think of one shelter in my area that is private, rescues are, but not shelters and there are lots of shelters. They cut the workers because money was tight, so now there is not even enough people to care for the animals. They can't pick and choose who is not responsible, so everyone falls under one group. This country is going broke and they need to be able to use the funds more efficiently and that is what they are trying to do. If they bothered to do the follow through with everyone their plan might work and if it works it will spread through the country.


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## KZoppa (Aug 14, 2010)

You can put in a petition to fight. Despite the deadline to fight it. Elected officials are still elected.


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

Government in general in this country is completely defunct, unaccountable, and completely corrupt. It's no different at the state and county level. Misappropriation and scandals are abound. The cockroaches are running for the dark corners as everyone freaks out that it's all crashing down.

Oh well, no need to make this political, everyone with two eyes and brain can see how badly these public servants have screwed up our country.


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

and thread over


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

Why thread over? Did I miss something?


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

Oh I think I see.

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...9-policy-regarding-political-discussions.html

I got news for you, the state of politics is horrible for animals right now and it should be discussed. Yes, right here. Discussed to the point of inciting people to do something because they're mad about it.

Are they saying that because a member of the forum discusses politics in a sub forum that is specifically labeled to post controversial political dog affairs, the moderators are going to lock the thread? The whole sub forum is dedicated to discussing political actions and affecting dog affairs.

"Government legislation, breed ban issues, news stories, etc..."

It would be pretty impossible to discuss government legislation without someone developing a political opinion on the legislation or the bodies implementing such legislation.

I look at the internet as a place where freedom of speech should be protected, so if a forum wants to censor it's members, I wouldn't care to participate in it any how. A forum is nothing short of a bunch of people meeting in a forum to have discussion. A virtual town square. As in real life things will be said that others do not like. If someone censored me for political statements in a political forum on animal rights I'd never visit that site again.

Mods feel free to ban me.

If I get banned it was great speaking to you all.

Thanks!!


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## Konotashi (Jan 11, 2010)

As long as the topic stays on this particular subject, then there's not a problem. Threads get locked when it swerves into politics in general, which was what your last post was steering toward.... 

It seems like PETA and HSUS are getting what they want. I've been sending letters to reps about a recent ploy to ban snakes (they're trying to ban ball pythons, for crying out loud) and all these laws are absolutely ridiculous. 

This will do nothing to help the over population problem. 

Enforce the laws that are already in place - stop making new ones. Geez.


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## Fade2Black (Apr 30, 2012)

Idiots. The only thing that should be subject to a mandatory neutering is politicians.......


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## Msmaria (Mar 2, 2013)

Like I've said before. There are so many people here in my area that have dogs that are having puppy's. I moved here 6 months ago from a city that did not mandatory neuter ( in the 8 years I lived there never saw anyone with puppies on my block) . Since I've lived here 3 people have had dogs with puppies on my block alone. One was where I got dexter from when she had to move and couldn't take her dogs. Two others are pit bull owners. I'm not saying these people are bad people, but I am saying that they are not following the law. Yet because I am responsible and register my dogs I have to neuter my my GSD before 4 months. In some places that's called pediatric neutering. 
I know the speuter advocates are for controlling population of dogs and I understand why they do it. I have volunteered at rescues before. I see what happens to these wonderful animals. But there has to be some common sense here and give the dogs a chance to grow before requiring neutering at such a young age. If the law continues on the path its on, even the law abiding citizens are going to stop registering their dogs and the city will lose even more revenue from registration fees.


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## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

I agree, as long as the topic STAYS on topic, it won't be removed, when you start dragging govt this and govt that into, it's going to get shut down.

And the NAME calling, or references to, need to stop. I don't care how fired up anyone is, ****** is VERY offensive. 

So keep it to the subject simple as that.

And I agree, if one is so 'fired up' about what's going on, start a petition, get out there and let your voice be heard.


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## Gwenhwyfair (Jul 27, 2010)

I totally agree with you this is wrong but for the sake of clarity two things:

Cali is actually doing fairly well budget-wise these days and really the budget issues aren't at all related to stupid people. Secondly this is LOCAL gov't and people need to get out and exercise their civic duty and fight this!

Again agree with you that this is totally wrong and we all need to be on guard that our local gov'ts do not start trying to pull this stuff on us. 




ImJaxon said:


> The Neuter Nutbags have finally gone full *****. They have almost sealed up every exemptions to the mandatory neuter ordinance with this latest round of legislation. This garbage is just another feather in the cap of the government having lost complete control over everything. No wonder this once great state is in such financial disarray.
> 
> Read Here: The nuts and the bolts of it is, unless your dog is participating in a Conformation show, none of the other categories like Agility, Obedience, can be show exemptions. Which means, you neuter your dog.
> 
> ...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

It is easier to fight a law before it is enacted than it is to get it repealed, the same is true with taxes. Right now areas that are using government monies to run shelters/pounds, can be subject to government interference when it comes to those reasons that dogs land in pounds. 

Government interference costs money. So, the mandatory spay/neuter can in fact be voluntary as you voluntarily obey the mandatory law. And you run a risk-assessment to figure out what happens if you are caught. Luckily the prison system is so over-loaded that you are not going to find yourself next to Bubba telling him that you are in for not getting your dog fixed in time. So if you are caught you will be fined. Great. But what happens to the dog? They aren't going to euthanize it, but they may sieze the dog and speuter it at your cost, or make a court order that you have the dog speutered by a set date -- that might not be acceptable to you, and therefore, you need to find a loophole. 

Governments are great with loopholes. There is usually a loop hole. Enter your dog in conformation. Come with your dog and make a complete fool of yourself, not knowing what they mean by each instruction, but at the end of the day, your dog is a conformation competitor, and you don't need to neuter him. 

Most places require dogs to be licensed, some places require rabies vaccinations to get the license. Ours requires it, but does not require to see it, or to record the rabies number. I suppose that vets in your locale might issue a speuter-number or certificate that must be provided when you purchase you license. That I think would be the cheapest way to ensure compliance with the law. I mean, they do not notch the ears when they spay or neuter a dog like they do with feral cats. So their really is no way of telling if the dog is speutered or not -- yes and they do have neuticals, so a dog might be neutered and not appear to be neutered.

This is a law I would have to practice civil disobedience with. But if I was going to do that, I would research it up, down, and inside out, and know all of the risks of doing so.


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## LARHAGE (Jul 24, 2006)

llombardo said:


> Right the tax payers fund the government and the government decides where that money goes. Generally you can find this break down, which can include schools, roads, etc. So they are taking money away from the schools to fund shelters full of animals because people were not responsible. Most bigger cities or towns, the animal shelters are not privately run. I can't think of one shelter in my area that is private, rescues are, but not shelters and there are lots of shelters. They cut the workers because money was tight, so now there is not even enough people to care for the animals. They can't pick and choose who is not responsible, so everyone falls under one group. This country is going broke and they need to be able to use the funds more efficiently and that is what they are trying to do. If they bothered to do the follow through with everyone their plan might work and if it works it will spread through the country.


I'm sick of this notion that the money would go to schools, isn't that what the lotterys were supposed to be for? I am thankful I don't live in L.A. County, because the reality is the money generated in LA. County is only used to fund the excessive out of control pensions, the roads in L.A. County are an absolute joke, I bailed from there years ago.


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## GSD2 (Jan 27, 2012)

Oh my!! Did I read that correctly?!? They will impound your dog if they are intact!? You can have your dog back after the hearing, and of course the impound fees are paid. OMG I am going to have to read that closer when I have more time, it just can't be.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

What I want to know is, how are they going to enforce this? Will they have people going door to door checking for testicles? Or are cops going to stop everyone walking their dog? Will you have to carry paperwork from a vet everywhere you go, or do they issue a spay/neuter tag?

Depending on how it is enforced, I could see how this could be a form of BSL because testicles and nipples are obvious on shorthaired dogs like, oh, Pit Bulls, while on GSDs and Border Collies, it's not so in-your-face. Anyone walking their Pit Bull or Bully breed in public is going to be accosted at some point if they have their full anatomy swinging in the breeze. On dogs like GSDs, and dogs with long hair, the anatomy doesn't attract attention--you'd probably need paperwork to tell if a female was intact or not.

This seems like a method to rid the area of Pit Bulls, or at least intact Pit Bulls. Which, honestly, doesn't seem like a bad idea on the face of it--seems every ne'er-do-well around here has a Pit Bull, and I rarely see one without testicles or sagging teats. Every day there are ads in Craigslist selling Pit Bull puppies and the shelters are full of them. I don't know why the Pit Bull culture thinks that every single dog must be bred. 

But this isn't an APBT forum, so enough of that--while the legislation seems like a good idea on the face of it, it's a slippery slope, as we all know. Problem is, John Q. Public doesn't understand just how slippery it is.


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## hunterisgreat (Jan 30, 2011)

Conformation show's trump working titles? Oh... geez...

I will continue preparing for the eventual collapse of this country lol


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Freestep said:


> What I want to know is, how are they going to enforce this? Will they have people going door to door checking for testicles? Or are cops going to stop everyone walking their dog? Will you have to carry paperwork from a vet everywhere you go, or do they issue a spay/neuter tag?
> 
> Depending on how it is enforced, I could see how this could be a form of BSL because testicles and nipples are obvious on shorthaired dogs like, oh, Pit Bulls, while on GSDs and Border Collies, it's not so in-your-face. Anyone walking their Pit Bull or Bully breed in public is going to be accosted at some point if they have their full anatomy swinging in the breeze. On dogs like GSDs, and dogs with long hair, the anatomy doesn't attract attention--you'd probably need paperwork to tell if a female was intact or not.
> 
> ...


I understand that if you have a cropped or docked breed and you drive through PA, you had better be able to show that the dog was cropped or docked at a licensed vet.


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## DaniFani (Jan 24, 2013)

Gosh, it seems like California is turning into it's own crazy little country.....and yes, citizens are leaving in droves. It's doing great things for the economies in us surrounding states ;-)


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## DaniFani (Jan 24, 2013)

hunterisgreat said:


> Conformation show's trump working titles? Oh... geez...
> 
> I will continue preparing for the eventual collapse of this country lol


Bahahahaha! So true!


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

selzer said:


> I understand that if you have a cropped or docked breed and you drive through PA, you had better be able to show that the dog was cropped or docked at a licensed vet.


Seriously? Now you have to get crop/dock papers from your vet? How in the world does THAT work, especially with a second- or third-hand dog? Tail docking is done at 3 days of age, long before pups go to new homes--the puppy buyer has to ask the breeder for some kind of tail docking paperwork, I guess? What if you are adopting a docked dog through a shelter or rescue, or you find one as a stray?


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

selzer said:


> I understand that if you have a cropped or docked breed and you drive through PA, you had better be able to show that the dog was cropped or docked at a licensed vet.


WHAT??? lol

I have two boxers, one cropped and docked. The other docked. The first was docked by a retired cop. I'm sure the second was not docked by a vet. I've had dobie's that were cropped and docked.

I've lived in PA for over 20 years and have never heard of such a thing.


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## JackandMattie (Feb 4, 2013)

I would also wonder how this will be enforced. Quite often legislation is introduced without accompanying budget for enforcement, which means its basically useless law. Some group's political agenda, but has little actual effect. 

I feel perfectly comfortable calling myself a law abiding citizen, even while I might ignore some inane laws that are unenforced. I'm a responsible pet owner, but personally I would ignore this one as long as I could afford the penalties and retain control over my property... My dogs. 

Some laws just need to be challenged and overturned. Some of us are very fortunate to live in the US, where that is still a possibility. 


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Freestep said:


> Seriously? Now you have to get crop/dock papers from your vet? How in the world does THAT work, especially with a second- or third-hand dog? Tail docking is done at 3 days of age, long before pups go to new homes--the puppy buyer has to ask the breeder for some kind of tail docking paperwork, I guess? What if you are adopting a docked dog through a shelter or rescue, or you find one as a stray?


Those were all arguments about the law, for one thing people traveling to dog shows from out of state would have to carry the certificate they may not even have on their person.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Jax08 said:


> WHAT??? lol
> 
> I have two boxers, one cropped and docked. The other docked. The first was docked by a retired cop. I'm sure the second was not docked by a vet. I've had dobie's that were cropped and docked.
> 
> I've lived in PA for over 20 years and have never heard of such a thing.


*







Update Aug. 26, 2009:Â Â Pennsylvania Governor Edward G. Rendell* today signed into law H.B. 39. 
*"*_Last October, Pennsylvania took a big step forward in shedding its label as the â€˜Puppy Mill Capital of the East.’ Today, that law is working and giving hundreds of dogs the opportunity to be adopted and have a better life with a loving family,_" said Governor Rendell,Â "_More work remains, however, and that is why I’m signing this legislation today_."
The new law establishes penalties for dog owners who engage in the following procedures on their own dogs:Â 


 Cropping, trimming or cutting off an ear;
Debarking by cutting or injuring the vocal cords;
Docking or cutting off the tail of a dog over five days of age;
Surgically birthing a dog; and
Removing the dewclaws from a dog over five days of age.
 *"*_H.B. 39 clearly defines painful and inhumane procedures on dogs by anyone other than a licensed vet as animal cruelty_," said the Governor. "_Until now, these cruel practices could be carried out by dog owners without proper training and without supervision by a licensed vet, which could lead to long-term injury, pain and, in some cases, death to these defenseless animals."_
*The dog’s owner must keep a record of the surgery, including the vet who performed it, as well as the location and date where the surgery was performed.* The law further protects dogs by making it a 3rd degree felony to steal an animal for the purpose of dog fighting.
Suspected unlicensed kennels can be reported through the Bureau of Dog Law Web site: http://www.agriculture.state.pa.us/agriculture/cwp/view.asp?a=3&q=126843 or by calling the Dog Law Tip line at 1-877-DOGTIP1.
*For a look at criticism of H.B. 39…..*



there was a lot of discusson on this a couple of years ago.


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## Liesje (Mar 4, 2007)

"Engaging in" those procedures and owning a cropped or docked dog are not the same thing.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Liesje said:


> "Engaging in" those procedures and owning a cropped or docked dog are not the same thing.


True, but unless you can prove who and when the dog was cropped or docked, well, how do you satisfy the law. It says here that dog owners have to have documentation where and when the dog had the procedure done. 

Of course things may have changed in the past 4 years.


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## Konotashi (Jan 11, 2010)

What happens if you are able to prove/find out that your dog is likely to have an adverse reaction to anesthesia? 
Do you still have to risk your dog's life and have it speutered? 

I know this is exceedingly rare, but some people opt for blood tests before hand to see if their dog is going to be at a higher risk. Some people find out the hard way that their dog has adverse reactions, but sometimes their dog is lucky enough to pull through. What if you have one of those rare dogs??

What if you had your dog neutered but had those stupid neuticles put in, but didn't think to keep the paperwork? Don't remember where you had it done? (I find it amazing how many people don't remember what their vet's name is/where the vet's office is). Do you still have to get your dog 'neutered' even though he's technically neutered?

There are so many 'what ifs' with a law like this, it's not even funny! 

And like I mentioned before... speuter isn't the problem. All the law abiding citizens are the ones that are likely not contributing to the overpopulation problem right now, as it is. The over-population problem is an EDUCATION ISSUE.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

For GSDs, you really should do bloodwork to check for VonWilbrands Disease, and maybe other clotting disorders. I am not sure if they will still neuter but will just provide clotting agent. Not sure about the anesthetic. Maybe there are medical exemptions.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

There is a huge leap from this....a law designed to protect dogs from butchers to cheap to take puppies to a vet to have procedures done...



selzer said:


> *
> 
> 
> 
> ...



...to this. Saying that if you are DRIVING thru PA with a cropped or docked dog that you have to have proof. I have never once been asked for proof that Banshee's ears were done by a vet or that either her tail or Sierra's were docked by a vet. Or any dobie I fostered. My friends own rottie's. Again, they've never had to provide proof that the tails were docked by a vet.



> Originally Posted by *selzer*
> _I understand that if you have a cropped or docked breed and you drive through PA, you had better be able to show that the dog was cropped or docked at a licensed vet._


_


_


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Jax08 said:


> There is a huge leap from this....a law designed to protect dogs from butchers to cheap to take puppies to a vet to have procedures done...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am just relaying what was being said at the time the law was passed at my GSD club. People own GSDs and other breeds, they show both. The people were saying that national specialties would not be held in PA because people would not be able to provide proof of where their dogs ears and tails were done. 

Maybe it is a leap. I could care less. I chose the GSD in part because the are au natural, and need neither clothing, or docking or cropping or clipping to be beautiful. But I remember what the others were saying and how the law is written, they can ask you for evidence of where the dog was cropped or docked.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

Konotashi said:


> I know this is exceedingly rare, but some people opt for blood tests before hand to see if their dog is going to be at a higher risk.


It's actually not that rare--many breeds are known to have a sensitivity to anesthetics, and many folks do have bloodwork done prior to spay/neuter, especially on older dogs.

By the way (sorry off topic), am I the only one who can't stand the word "speuter"? Nothing personal to anyone who has used the term, but it bothers me for some reason. I know that it uses fewer keystrokes than "spay/neuter", but it just sounds goofy when you say it out loud. I generally despise made-up words like "irregardless" or "Labradoodle", and I guess this fits into the same category. Plus, it sounds to me like a word that HSUS or PETA would make up. And I once knew a dog named "Spooter", always thought it was a funny name.

I mean, we could use a word like "alter" to refer to both spay and neuter, or really, any word that isn't a goofy sounding made-up word. 

/rant

I don't mean to insult anyone who has used the term, as my hatred of it could merely be a personal issue on my part. If I'm the only one who feels this way, please ignore me and carry on.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Freestep said:


> It's actually not that rare--many breeds are known to have a sensitivity to anesthetics, and many folks do have bloodwork done prior to spay/neuter, especially on older dogs.
> 
> By the way (sorry off topic), am I the only one who can't stand the word "speuter"? Nothing personal to anyone who has used the term, but it bothers me for some reason. I know that it uses fewer keystrokes than "spay/neuter", but it just sounds goofy when you say it out loud. I generally despise made-up words like "irregardless" or "Labradoodle", and I guess this fits into the same category. Plus, it sounds to me like a word that HSUS or PETA would make up. And I once knew a dog named "Spooter", always thought it was a funny name.
> 
> ...


Language is living, and the coining of new words and phrases is actually on going. This is why they did something in Latin -- not sure what (maybe the latin mass, or translating the Bible into Latin), but the language was considered dead -- no one was currently using that language in every day life, so it could not be corrupted. 

So really, every word and a lot of internet (well, there's one internet) chat acronyms and words, like prolly, and LOL, and WTF, TGIF, and peeps, are all just another form of how the language continues to evolve. I guess what I am saying is that you are fighting an uphill battle.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

selzer said:


> So really, every word and a lot of internet (well, there's one internet) chat acronyms and words, like prolly, and LOL, and WTF, TGIF, and peeps, are all just another form of how the language continues to evolve. I guess what I am saying is that you are fighting an uphill battle.


Oh, I know. It sucks being the grammar police.

But words that are deliberate misspellings to make them sound phonetic in casual conversation? Like "prolly", "wanna", or "gonna"? That doesn't bother me, I use those terms myself. And I've gotten over acronyms like "WTF" or "LOL" to some degree, they are handy when texting. It's the mashing of two words together to make a new "word" that bothers me. Like the aforementioned "irregardless". I've become so famous in my hate of that word that my friends use it on purpose just to infuriate me. 

Who started "speuter", does anyone know? It sounds to me like an HSUS invention.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Irregardless to your discomfort with the compounding of words, like aforementioned, it is still done. I found irregardless in the dictionary and guess what? I means exactly the same thing as regardless. That is why English is such an interesting language and probably a bear to people for whom it is a second language. 

I think speuter is used as much by the anti-speuter crowd as the pro-speuter crowd. I kind of like that term, where I hate deliberate misspellings like prolly. Speuter sound like the act of vomiting and it sounds like putting forth a ton of information that is either hateful or incorrect. And in my opinion, the propaganda about spaying and neutering, is often based on untruths -- like behavioral reasons to neuter, ie. if you do not neuter him, he will constantly try to dominate you and everyone in the house; or medically, ie. the woman who went off demanding whether I wanted my dog to get cancer. She was spewing about how my dog would get cancer and die if I did not neuter him. And a lot of the stuff, that is not quite as extreme is just taken for granted, like the dog will roam if you don't neuter him, or he will be sexually frustrated if he is not nuetered. 

It is all a bunch of barf in my opinion, so the combination of words kind of works for me. 

I am not sure who made it up though.


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## Freestep (May 1, 2011)

selzer said:


> Irregardless to your discomfort


RAWR!!  



> I kind of like that term, where I hate deliberate misspellings like prolly. Speuter sound like the act of vomiting and it sounds like putting forth a ton of information that is either hateful or incorrect.


Interesting how we all have our pet peeves and they're all different--that's why I can't really get mad at people for using certain terms, made-up words, misspellings, improper grammar, etc. 

I guess I sometimes type like I speak, so I use phonetic spellings like "prolly" in casual conversation, and it doesn't bother me when others do, but I have to know it's deliberate--I'd prolly die if someone actually thought it was spelled that way.

Speuter does sound like the act of vomiting--perhaps the onomatopoeia of the term is fitting, as the word makes me want to vomit.


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## ImJaxon (Jan 21, 2013)

What I'm really wondering is how all of the folks in Schutz clubs are going to handle this BS. I know for a fact that they don't want to enter their dogs in Conformation shows to get around this. All of LA County is now adopting this stupid Law..


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