# What Happened??



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Admin- If you think this is too much please feel free to move or delete. It isn't a nice story and I hope maybe someone can shed some light on theories of what could have been done differently. I say I lost my dog to genetic and medical issues. Wish I just knew for sure.

This is, at this point, water under the bridge for us. I've tried to move on, and I largely have and I have largely forgiven myself for anything I may have done wrong..but I just feel the need to talk about it for final closure I guess. 

5 years ago or so I adopted my last GSD Alvin when he was 3 to 4 months old. He was gorgeous. Dumped out on the street in Newark NJ, was very clean so wasn't strayed for very long. Most likely not even a day. Newark PD saw him trotting down the street and got him into the shelter right away. He was ferried out of Newark (all the good ones are) and wound up at a shelter run by family friends of mine. They knew I was looking for a potential SD candidate for a flight risk boy I had (I still have the boy, he does not fly away anymore thank God). 

He was monorchid, and had pano. Transient limping all legs. Totally reeks of a BYB who figured between having one testicle and being lame, he didn't sell. IDK, just a hunch.

Anyway, I won't go too much into the SD adventure as it is largely irrelevant. He washed out by 2, we knew that it was likely, but we loved him anyway and he was our family dog (1 of 3). 

The main reason he washed out was because he was such an effusive greeter of people he never saw before in his life. Everyone was his best friend, best in the world.Spent 1000s of dollars on trainers. He was also a food thief (albeit a friendly one) He was not able to ignore other friendly people when we were out, so that was that. Didn't have the work drive or the attention span, but my LORD he was a stubborn dog.. His basic OB was good. Recall, stay..all impeccable. If someone looked at him though he would full body wiggle with his ears back and pay attention to them rather than us (he would not run up to them..like I said, his OB was good).

Alright, so family dog. He was a headstrong dog, but also had a protective streak. It was like someone put 3/4 Lab brain in his head mixed with 1/4 GSD and sometimes the GSD showed. 

He adored my children. He adored other dogs (played too rough with ones his size though). He adored our 3 rats and groomed them as they climbed all over him(did I mention low prey drive?) 

The ONE thing he would do that concerned me, that the trainer agreed with me, but that no family or friends would take seriously...was his DEMAND for affection when you walked in.It was bullying. He was making you greet him first and body blocking you from even saying hi to the kids before he got his fill. We tried for 2 years to correct that behavior but he was so stubborn about it. I would leash him or crate him when I was expecting people, and they would say I was mean ...whatever. I dealt with it.

Had a life change in 2015, was divorced. One big Mastiff went to a best friend, one dog stayed with my ex, and I kept Alvin. So he was an only dog for 2 years before his demise. Got my own home in 2016. Got a 2nd dog about 5 months before it all went bad. They always got along great.

His first bite was appropriate. I was having my carpets steamed and working from home with Alvin and my youngest who was 4 at the time and has CP. I closed myself in my office while he worked on my carpets, with my son and dog. He opened the door without knocking to ask me a question and knocked the baby. He went to grab the baby's arm to keep him from falling, and Alvin bit up his arm. Lots of punctures. Happened so quickly. I didn't get sued, just covered bills, thank goodness. 

Then things started getting weird. He would not let certain people leave the house. People he knew for his life. Mostly small women. My son's therapist who he knew for years. He would circle and whine and snap his teeth and block the door. He loved them , knew them for years. Totally new behavior (he is about 3 years old at this point) So upon the sitter telling me about this, new rule. He has to be crated when i am not home to watch the behavior. Now, this dog wailed in his crate. Never went away, that wailing in crate behavior. So you just had to deal with it for hours if need be. Wasn't a great situation.

I finally observed the behavior...and yeah he was suddenly herding people. Ok...contacted trainer who said what I already knew. He needs to be crated if I am not there. I was his only boss, the only person who he didn't over do it with with the mauling affection. He was my running partner and checked with me when he heard something outside. We were partners , but I was boss and I was the only person who he would "kind of" listen to. 

Next thing that happened...my aunt who he was very familiar with was visiting. She was getting her coat and gloves to go and he started pulling his moves like he was not going to let her leave. I was supervising, I instructed her to ignore him, walk past him, move him out of your way if needed. My bad. I should have leashed him and corrected him, but I guess a part of me wanted to see the fullness and nature of the behavior. Well, the fullness was she opened the door with one hand, and he aggressively bit the other other hand. She has on thick suede shearling lines gloves. Her knuckles and hands were badly bruised. Blueberries, big ones. That would have been stitches had she not been protected.

So OK well that is messed up!

Next thing (and this all happened within 8 months by the way)..he started inexplicably attacking puppies and elderly dogs that he KNEW for a time even! Except for our other dog. They were good. Always. But, he rolled and ripped fur and skin on an elderly dog, female, he had known for years. So now nobody can watch him for me, he has to be crated when I am not home, and off to the vet we go.

SNAP panel, thyroid, vitamin panel...almost 2K on vet tests. NOTHING off. Nothing.

Ok, back to training. Working hard, but things continue to deteriorate.

Now another new thing- he has always put on a show when someone approached our vehicle. Well, he started doing it to me and other people he knew. I could get out of the truck, go to the side window, look at him and say "hey boy!" and he would go full Cujo looking as if he didn't recognize me. Ok at this point something bad is happening and I don't know what. Outside of the truck he was normal towards me.

He also had ears that were driving him nuts. No infection, no yeast, multiple vets checked. His head would tilt and he would shake his head constantly. Check again..nothing. It would come and go and ever time it came, vet visit.

Then one day my poor son, who was his favorite buddy in the family, who he slept with for 5 years, who he shared waffles with when i wasn't looking, dropped a cookie. I was standing RIGHT there thank God. My son (who has autism) had called to me to help him plug in his laptop. He had the laptop. charger, and cookie. Now, before we blame the cookie- I had 5 years of ZERO food related aggression. The kids would feed him when I wasn't looking. He loved them, he would steal from an unattended plate but would never steal it from them. My son dropped the cookie. Alvin was...triggered. He looked at the cookie, looked at my son, and lunged at him. Wasn't interested in the cookie.

His eyes were round, that I remember. All teeth out. He latched onto my son's arm. I kicked him hard in the ribs and he turned on me. I will never forget the way he looked at me. He looked like that posture a wolf takes when something approaches his kill. It was scary, I thought he was going to go at me and my kids were going to watch me get attacked by a loved family dog. I screamed his name in despair in a pleading kind of way, and he "clicked off" and looked immediately miserable. 

I grabbed my son and he had 2 rows of 3 puncture wounds. Rear teeth. Great.

I called my father to come get him and temporarily bring him to his, so I could think safely about what the heck to do. The things I did next I did because I did not want him to spend 10 days in a depressing shelter quarantine before being put down.I contacted K9 handlers I know. Given the history nobody would touch it. 

So, Vet. Only we could do was an MRI? To see if there was a tumor? 5,000 dollars around here. 4k for a CT scan. And then what if they found something? Brain surgery? I wasn't going to do that.

To make matters worse, I had only networked to K9 and law enforcement I knew. Maybe a handler with no kids could see what was what? Of course the answer was no, but not before one of them put it out on FB and of course his plea went viral. Without all the details..just "dog bit kid with autism, will be destroyed". I should have ignored it but it was hard to, and reading the comments hurt.

Anyway, I put him down. Beautiful 5 year old boy, and I put him down. Gut wrenching. I have put down sick and elder dogs that I have loved, but this was the first one with a big question mark. And he was so fit and gorgeous.

What else could I have done? In hindsight I feel like vision and hearing was becoming an issue ..not recognizing me in the truck, and his ears bothering him - ringing maybe? Do dogs become mentally ill? Do they get early dementia? Could it have been genetic?

I just don't ever want it to happen again. We are starting new with a new pup raised in a puppy raising home with a lot of kids. with excellent breeding. 

Any thoughts and heck any criticism on this is welcome. Like I said, I don' EVER want to make any mistakes that may have been made, again.


----------



## tim_s_adams (Aug 9, 2017)

Wow, what a heart wrenching story! Sorry this had to happen, but honestly I don't see where you had much choice. If a mistake was made I suppose in hindsight not leashing and correcting him before he bit your aunt could be seen in retrospect as a mistake, but it didn't sound to me like you could reasonably have expected him to bite her, so even that seems more unfortunate than error. Putting down a dog is never easy. But this dog had become dangerous to you and your children. If ever there is a good reason to do so, this is it. You and your children have to come first...

Again, so sorry you had to go through this. It's possible, maybe, with unlimited resources his "problem" could have been diagnosed and fixed. But it's even more likely that it would not have been fixable, so his life wouldn't have been saved. Try to find some peace from that last point, you did nothing wrong.


----------



## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

I suspect he had a brain tumor. Nothing you could have done. I'm sorry you had to go through all this.


----------



## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

It definitely sounds like an internal / physical and likely untreatable problem.You did the best you could.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Thanks all. I feels good to talk about it.


----------



## Findlay (Jan 8, 2015)

Such a sad story. 
Something really serious must have gone wrong...I mean medically. 
For such a great dog to change so drastically. 

You mentioned Dementia. And Nurse Bishop mentioned a brain tumor. 

You had a lot of happy years. 
You did all you could for that poor dog. He was sick. 
And it had to have been devistatibg for you to make that final decision.

You did what any good mother would do, You put the safety of your family first. 
It was kind of you to put him to sleep. 

Take care.


----------



## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

Gosh, that is such a sad story. When I hear of cases like this, it makes me think that dogs can have psychological disorders just like people can. It doesn’t sound to me like there was anything else you could have done. I could manage dog aggression. I could crate my dog around non-family members. But if my dog was biting my kids, that is something I could not tolerate. Hard as it was, I think you did the right thing. I think the odds of it happening again are slim.


----------



## Armistice (Oct 12, 2017)

I feel it could've been some sort of canine cognitive disorder which is like Alzheimer's or dementia

Regardless of what it was, I think you did the right thing to protect yourself and others around you as the issue was only getting worse with not even a hint of diagnosis


----------



## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

This same thing happened to a mutt dog of mine. He was born in my hands in a foster litter: well trained, socialized and sweet. I knew him from day one. At the age of 7 he started attacking dogs he had always known (a female Belgian Tervuren who was peeing on a walk), then his own pack members, one of them a 14 year old fragile cripple Whippet. He also became terrified of me. This was a clicker trained dog who really never had to be punished since he was so dutiful. Nothing helped; animal behaviorist, meds, full blood panel; nothing. One day he looked at me with this green glow in his eyes when I put his food down and it looked like he was going to take my face off any moment. That's why I decided to have him put down vs spending thousands of $$s for a situation that wasn't going to change anyways.
OP, I know the doubt afterwards but it was the best decision to prevent worse. You had more patience than I had.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

Why is this even a question? Your son comes first. You cannot keep a dangerous dog with a child that already has issues. It sounds like two children that are endangered because of the dog. Passing this onto another home, another family, without kids, well that just gives the dog more opportunities to rake up more GSD bites. You give the dog to someone who has no kids and explain the dog's issues, but will they, if they need to re-home. 

No, it is far kinder to take the dog to the vet and have him put down. 

You did what you could to find a treatable medical issue to explain the behavior. Sometimes, it isn't there. It doesn't mean that it isn't physical. It means they cannot identify anything. 

Could the dog have a form of epilepsy or rage syndrome? Maybe. 
Could the dog have a genetic weakness in nerve that caused inappropriate aggression? Maybe. 
Could the dog have acquired something that affected his behavior, like a vaccine reaction? Maybe. 
Is it possible that when the family structure changed, the dog did not accept your leadership, without your husband backing you up? Some dogs, if they feel their owner cannot protect them, they need to protect themselves, and protect their people. They do not trust the decision maker, so they make their own decisions and they usually aren't good ones? Maybe. 

Maybe a combination of the above. Bottom line is, it doesn't matter. A dog needs to be wired a certain way for him to bite a family member, especially a child. And however those wires crossed, I believe it is in the make-up of the dog. The handling/life changes could make the inner flaw apparent. 

As hard as I am sure it was, you did the right thing. No amount of agonizing over the decision or how it came to be will change the fact that the dog had to be put down.


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Genetics happen. We like to blame a physical cause because we want something tangible to grasp at but often there just isn't one. You did the right thing. There are always what ifs and maybes but the bottom line is he had 3 unprovoked bites. With the last being on his own family.

You would have been irresponsible to rehome him. And, IMO, cruel because he wouldn't have understood or you don't know how the other person would treat him. At 3 years old, he hit mental maturity and that is when the problems started. I highly doubt this was a health issue to start then and carry on for years after.

Sometimes, the kindest thing we can do is release them from whatever demons are in their head.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Thank you so much everybody. I do know I did the right thing. It just feels good to map it out, helps with closure.

He ALWAYS had issues, but they were never aggression issues until things went bad. That is another aspect that makes it so hard. As I told people that knew him, they would say "AAAAAAlvin?!?!?! No way!". Yeah, way.

When he went viral in the FB GSD pages..as an aside, those FB pages are awful altogether. The advice is awful, the people are nasty. Funny, I was so sick of politics on FB so I joined like 5 GSD groups so I would see things I liked when I scrolled. Yeah, no..this was worse than politics lol. Anyway, his picture and story I sent to a few police officers wound up on FB (they were only trying to help by reaching out to their K9 peers but then you know how that goes). A small blurb and pic went viral about how he bit the family's autistic child and was now going to be destroyed. So he became a "cause". I know I should not have read, but people were saying awful things that kids with autism shouldn't be around animals, would I kill my kid if he accidentally hurt a sibling blah blah blah. 

It didn't end there. "Rescues" started reaching out to me. They were willing to "give him a chance". Well, I would just reply and say "thanks, but it isn't up to you..I don't know how you got your info but I will only rehome to a LEO or Military K9 handler who has no children, no elderly parents, no other dogs, and who rarely is around any of those vulnerable types" That person doesn't exist, I knew that, but I tried. A guy called me from Washington State (Im in NJ) and just says, hi, I'll take the dog, I'll pay to ship him here. Uhhh...huhuhu...no. I told him IF he was a K9 handler, IF he would fly out here and spend time with me meeting him, IF he could prove his credentials and identity, I'd consider it. Well, he wasn't a K9. Just a guy named Walter who saw Alvin on FB (yes my phone number was included in the post on FB. Grrrr).

Anyway, like I said it is helping me to at least talk about it, because I haven't at all. We had to go full Vatican with this dog before putting him down. I got him from AHS, family friends of mine involved. The director, did not want to let us have Alvin as a puppy. She was concerned about the autism with the boys. She was concerned that if he didn't make SD I would..what? Give him away? She knew how close I was to her other employees and that they KNEW I would NEVER do that. Anyway, we did not want them to find out. Number one, she would feel vindicated about autism and dogs not mixing. No matter what she was told about the circumstance she would be convinced the dog spent a life of torture with an autistic kid poking his eyes and pulling his tail (which was so far from what my son is like with animals, he is more gentle than normal kids). My friends at the shelter would have had years of "I told you so". Number two- by contract if I wasn't keeping him they are suppose to get him back. He would have spent 10 days in quarantine in a shelter, confused, before being put down. I was not going to let that happen. OR worse, maybe they would have felt bad for him, knowing his sweet side, not believed it was unprovoked, and back doored him into another home with no kids. Then maybe all would be fine and well until he had another episode that a lot of people who knew him didn't truly believe he was capable of. 

So like WHEEEEW it is relieving to talk about this. My daughter, 11, lost the love of her life. She thought Alvin was a God. It shook her foundations. I explained to her it was medical, he was mentally ill (to which she replied like Uncle Mike?? lol if you don't laugh you'll cry). I really don't want her to feel like a trusted family pet typically changes that way. I mean they can (obviously) but I wanted her to realize it almost never happens. I don't want her to be afraid of dogs. She was asking if it was her fault because she paid attention to the new dog. Heartbreaking when you have to reassure and sooth them through that. It wasn't the other dog. Alvin thought the new puppy was FOR him when we got him. They were together for months without incident. Alvin had a very nurturing side as a dog. He use to groom the pup. He use to groom the rats. He loved kittens. Explaining all that to my kid was brutal. 

My little Staffy was traumatized after that happened. He was from a rescued discarded litter, the litter went to foster together, and all pups were adopted. He came to my home an instantly bonded with Alvin. Once Alvin was gone, Ruger's fear issues started. I thought it was PTSD or something (he was a witness of the incident and hid under the upstairs bed for hours afterwards). But then as the weeks and months went on it got worse. Would not go into the yard alone. Would hide in his crate when people came over. Then one week I dog sat for my ex. Bo, boxer mix. Ruger completely came out of his shell. Was brave and happy when Bo was around. Then when Bo went back to my ex..Ruger went back to fraidy cat. OK WE NEED A 2ND DOG!! I was going to wait awhile, but Ruger needed a big brother.

All the rescues turned me down because I put down an animal for "behavioral issues". When they heard autism...I think they assumed the dog bit because he had a hand flapping kid in his food bowl or something. The only one I was approved for was by a friend of mine, and she knew about Alvin, agreed with my decision, and knew my kids were golden. BUT she didn't have anyone that was a good fit for our home. 

Then she comes across a dog that was in animal control and going to be put down. One of those URGENT ones. A little pit mix with a dented head and an unknown history. Took Ruger to meet him. Went well. I got attached, started dog nesting..called my trainer to say "incoming, let's make a home visit appointment!" ...and she proceeded to BEG me not to take in a dog with unknown history, especially not a stray 60 pound pit mix from Paterson NJ. She was right. I called the rescue and backed out. I was again heartbroken, my daughter was heartbroken. We had him named...Trap for Trapezoid, because that is how his head was shaped. The trainer was right though. He was an unknown and while sweet as can be they can change over a week or two once in a home. Especially when they have had nothing, they can get everything is mine syndrome. 

He was still rescued and is sweet as can be, but is working though severe separation anxiety. Would have been out of my skill set. He is with an experienced foster home that has rehabilitated a lot of dogs, and keeps the ones that they are never comfortable rehoming. So at least he wasn't destroyed and has a future.

Seeing him in someone's home on FB though, after I got attached, was again heartbreaking for me and my daughter. Told my friend who is a K9 Handler about it all and she says...I know someone who will hook you up with a great GSD. Called them, and we talked. They had a beautiful 5 month old that had been raised in a puppy raising home with the intention to go on to do work (his pedigree is on my siggy). He was raised from 8 weeks to 24 weeks around 6 kids ages 6 to 16. Had his 3 or 4 basics basics down (sit down stay here). He stole my heart and I was like TAKE MY MONEY lol

I have spent weeks filtering the posts I put on FB from people who would judge me getting another GSD after what happened, the adopt don't shop warriors, and any employees of the shelter who would then ask where is Alvin? The other day my Dad told me, hey, just live your life. What is the worse that can happen? They will never adopt out another dog to you? Right. So they all know now. And my rescue friends are notably silent on his pics, because I ....bought.....huhhhh!....a dog.

Then I came here, and bragged about our new boy Valor. And now I have told the Alvin story, and now I feel so much better. Thank you all for understanding and being supportive. 

few pics of my boy Alvin. See you at the bridge buddy and you will be your old self again.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

A few of him younger:


----------



## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

I am do sorry you experienced all that. Unfortunately, people think every animal can, and should, be saved. They've never experienced what you have and think the issue is either training or nurturing while completely discounting genetics.


----------



## GettingToKnowGSDs (Oct 25, 2017)

I just read this entire thread and it made me tear up and I had to respond. I'm sorry you had to deal with that and I can imagine the fear you had for your children. I'm no GSD expert (see my name lol) but mother to mother...you did the right thing. 

I had a badly bred (more than likely a BYB), weak-nerved, poorly socialized terrier for over ten years and she was a nightmare to keep safe around others and she was only 15 pounds. She loved me though and I loved her. But I can't fathom dealing with her issues in a GSD with small kids, which is also why I'm shopping instead of adopting. It's really okay, do what is best for you and your family. 

I also wanted to share with you that my father experienced a dog that wasn't 'right' either. This was a well-bred dog, coming from titled hunting dog lines, and a Labrador. Labrador - one of the most friendly dogs on the planet. But even from the very beginning something wasn't right with him. My dad has trained a lot of titled retrievers in his lifetime and he couldn't figure it out. I'm talking owner aggression. The second time he went full out after my mother was the end of it. Later, he found out that another puppy from the SAME litter who went to a friend of his had to also be put down for similar behavior!! Something genetically went wrong in that litter.


----------



## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

The one thing I have learned from cases like these, if you are facing this heart wrenching decision, is to NOT bring it out in the open but stick with your trainer and vet. Maybe a good friend can be of support but everyone else has their own opinion and they always "know what's best". There is a Dutch saying:"the best navigators stand on the dock".


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

It is sad, but reassuring, to hear other's stories. I have known people that have put down dogs because the growled at kids, or reacted to a kid pulling its tail, cornering in when they clearly didn't want interaction etc. So I can see why people assume. I knew a friend who has a collie mix with no bite hx..her 3 year old niece was poking at the dog's anus while I was there and the dog was curling its lip. Well, yeah. Then the dog had a marrow bone, the kid went to take it, and the dog gave a warning shot nip to the cheek. That is just poor management of kids around dogs. 

I mean my at the time 3 year old fell off the couch onto Alvin a few years ago, then when trying to stand again stepped on Alvin's junk. Alvin wailed, but got up and went over and started kissing my son's face. This is NOT a dog that anyone would have expected this from :/

I've subsequently looked up a lot on genetics. I posted an article somewhere here about mapping the genome for dogs. They found the defective gene that makes dogs overly overly friendly. It is on the same locale as the human gene that gives humans syndromes where they are overly friendly to strangers and usually also mentally retarded. Interesting stuff, when it isn't happening in your own life that is.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

wolfy dog said:


> The one thing I have learned from cases like these, if you are facing this heart wrenching decision, is to NOT bring it out in the open but stick with your trainer and vet. Maybe a good friend can be of support but everyone else has their own opinion and they always "know what's best". There is a Dutch saying:"the best navigators stand on the dock".


That is EXACTLY what I did. Didn't ask the internet. Didn't ask my mom or my friends. That is why I was upset when someone posted it on FB. Was keeping it close to the vest. Good advice, and I hope others read it here.


----------



## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

OP, he was a gorgeous dog and looking at the pictures when he was still safe,( I assume), something bad must have happened in his brain. He looks well loved. Better safe at the Rainbow Bridge than being left out in the new owner/rescuer's yard on a chain because he couldn't be handled.
If it helps, here is another anecdote. In that same foster litter was a puppy that was adopted by the no-kill shelter that I fostered them for. I got one pup back 9 months old who had bitten a two year old in the face. I was happy to take her back as I considered them all 'my puppies', hoping to rehab her. However, none of my dogs wanted anything to do with her and they were used to new dogs coming and going as fosters. An animal behaviorist evaluated her as plain dangerous. She would bite up the leash, trying to get to me! A puppy that I raised for 9 weeks!
A tough as it was, it was out of love that I had her put down to prevent her from a life of misery. The shelter was furious but....being no-kill, they didn't want her back but rather leaving this job to someone else to save their no-kill status. Ugh! That's why I took her, without telling them anything.After she got the tranquilizer shot, she slept in my arms for half an hour so she could experience peace before dying (thanks to an understanding vet) and I had a chance to enjoy my puppy for a while but crying my heart out of course. 
These stories break open old wounds and I never forget these poor souls. OP, heal well, I know exactly how it feels.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

wolfy dog said:


> OP, he was a gorgeous dog and looking at the pictures when he was still safe,( I assume), something bad must have happened in his brain. He looks well loved. Better safe at the Rainbow Bridge than being left out in the new owner/rescuer's yard on a chain because he couldn't be handled.
> If it helps, here is another anecdote. In that same foster litter was a puppy that was adopted by the no-kill shelter that I fostered them for. I got one pup back 9 months old who had bitten a two year old in the face. I was happy to take her back as I considered them all 'my puppies', hoping to rehab her. However, none of my dogs wanted anything to do with her and they were used to new dogs coming and going as fosters. An animal behaviorist evaluated her as plain dangerous. She would bite up the leash, trying to get to me! A puppy that I raised for 9 weeks!
> A tough as it was, it was out of love that I had her put down to prevent her from a life of misery. The shelter was furious but....being no-kill, they didn't want her back but rather leaving this job to someone else to save their no-kill status. Ugh! That's why I took her, without telling them anything.After she got the tranquilizer shot, she slept in my arms for half an hour so she could experience peace before dying (thanks to an understanding vet) and I had a chance to enjoy my puppy for a while but crying my heart out of course.
> These stories break open old wounds and I never forget these poor souls. OP, heal well, I know exactly how it feels.


Thank you so much for sharing, it means a lot to me. I am very sorry you went through it too <3


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

This is the last pic I took of him. He did start to look...IDK, different.


----------



## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

Definitely looks like altered mental status. What a change. It would have been interesting to do a necropsy on the nervous system. You did the right thing. He couldn't have lived like that, he wasn't happy anymore. You gave him many good years.


----------



## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

I think he does look different. His eyes in the earlier pictures looked more open to the world. This last picture shows more closed up, wary almost. Or is it imagination? It is heartbreaking to read about this.


----------



## sebrench (Dec 2, 2014)

Alvin sure was a handsome boy. He doesn't look like the typical backyard bred GSD (to my very inexpert eye). It would be interesting to know who the breeder was. I hope that you are able to remember the good times you shared with him instead of the bad. From the photographs you shared, it looks like you have had many happy memories with him. 

I think I will refrain from joining the GSD groups that are sometimes advertised on my FB page. It doesn't sound like they are very wise or supportive. Anyone who would ask if you would "kill your kid if he accidentally hurt a sibling," isn't worth your time. My dogs are my best friends and I consider them members of my family...but no, I would not risk the safety of my kids for my dogs. Not in a million years. I wouldn't rehome the dog and risk someone else's children either. There are horror stories in the news everyday about dog-bites and maulings. No one wants to be a part of those statistics. That doesn't make the decision any less heartbreaking. I can imagine how hard it would be to explain to the kids. 

Anyway, your Alvin looks a lot like my Asher. I would be devastated.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

wolfy dog said:


> I think he does look different. His eyes in the earlier pictures looked more open to the world. This last picture shows more closed up, wary almost. Or is it imagination? It is heartbreaking to read about this.


Yes, something did change about him. His expression. With no other immediate life changes. We had been in the new house 4 months, had a new pup for a few months too. He adjusted to all that fine. Was 2 years after the divorce. It will puzzle me to the end of my days. Some type of demylenizaton? Like M.S? Things started agitating him..little things I'm remembering now as I organize this thread and my head. He had started whining when people were plugging things into the wall for some odd reason? 



sebrench said:


> Alvin sure was a handsome boy. He doesn't look like the typical backyard bred GSD (to my very inexpert eye). It would be interesting to know who the breeder was. I hope that you are able to remember the good times you shared with him instead of the bad. From the photographs you shared, it looks like you have had many happy memories with him.
> 
> I think I will refrain from joining the GSD groups that are sometimes advertised on my FB page. It doesn't sound like they are very wise or supportive. Anyone who would ask if you would "kill your kid if he accidentally hurt a sibling," isn't worth your time. My dogs are my best friends and I consider them members of my family...but no, I would not risk the safety of my kids for my dogs. Not in a million years. I wouldn't rehome the dog and risk someone else's children either. There are horror stories in the news everyday about dog-bites and maulings. No one wants to be a part of those statistics. That doesn't make the decision any less heartbreaking. I can imagine how hard it would be to explain to the kids.
> 
> Anyway, your Alvin looks a lot like my Asher. I would be devastated.


DON'T join those groups!! Don't read them. Don;t you go there lol There was one in particular called straight backed german shepherds (all lower caps like that). Ooof that one was bad. I have to kill that one and the rest. They make me SMH way too much. Then you go down the hole of trying to participate in the interest of the animal..you just see things like "tug makes them vicious" and you have people asking "is this aggression?" with a video of a toddler stroking a GSDs head while he growls long and a low growls. And people answering "oh no that is purring". Mind bending. 

You know, Alvin definitely did not look like a BYB. He was found on Spring St in Newark NJ which is a burnt out drug dealer ridden pit. I thought maybe someone breeding for junkyard dogs (they are still a thing there). But my trainer said same as you. However, monorchid..one testicle..a good breeder would not sell or breed him. He needed that one nut though. He never fully matured it seems. My trainer felt he looked WGSL even though not a lot of red in him. She felt he was stolen. That is actually how I stumbled on this forum. I wanted to make triple sure nobody was looking for the dog I was taking in. No microchip, no tattoo ..it never all did add up.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

This is from when I picked him up at the shelter:


----------



## Nurse Bishop (Nov 20, 2016)

I don't know why so many people spend so much time on 'faceboof' and social media. I opend an account briefly then closed it because I am interested in the opinions of random strangers. It was a waste of my time and of my lifetime. In general, I endorse crispy reality. Go outside and involve oneself in the real world. For the past week I have been teaching Inga to lead a pony. Yesterday I taught Inga to pick up which ever foot I point to. I suppose Germanshepherds.com is like a social media. At least no feelings hurting is allowed here.


----------



## selzer (May 7, 2005)

He was a beautiful dog. You did the right thing. Don't go through a rescue, find a good breeder. It will not guaranty you perfect health or even temperament, but that is what all decent breeders ought to be trying to acheive. With small kids, you need a dog that has a great temperament. If you want another GSD.


----------



## thegooseman90 (Feb 24, 2017)

Sad story. And I feel for your son too. That had to have been pretty traumatic for him to be bitten that way. It's interesting to see the outward change in the dog. He went from a vibrant and masculine dog to dark and insecure looking. To me it sounds like a genetics issue. One of those "loose screw" dogs you hear about on here from time to time. You did your best but as you discovered it wasn't something you could throw time and money at to fix. You did the right thing for your family and really for the dog as well. On a brighter note I remember seeing your pedigree and I'd feel very confident that you won't have these issues with this current pup. So you should have many good years and memories still ahead


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

selzer said:


> He was a beautiful dog. You did the right thing. Don't go through a rescue, find a good breeder. It will not guaranty you perfect health or even temperament, but that is what all decent breeders ought to be trying to acheive. With small kids, you need a dog that has a great temperament. If you want another GSD.


Yes, thanks so much for the kind words, support and advice, all of you. Selzer, you bet I went with known lines this time. His pedigree is linked in my siggy. I feel pangs of guilt as I do just the little things with him. Like he jumped in my truck to take the kids to school this a.m...and he did that GSD unique whimper when "his" kids were leaving and running into the building. It is suppose to still be Alvin there doing that. It is getting better though, each day, and posting here has been a long overdue relief. Thank you everyone


----------



## Jenny720 (Nov 21, 2014)

I saw this thread on a recent thread and read this before. A very handsome boy. A heartbreaking story interesting to see the decline. Yeah I think i read Facebook group pages -twice can’t even go on their no patience for that and I’m crazy patient. . It is interesting about his ears and the shaking of his head. Very possible brain infection, tumor, rage syndrome, dementia some kind of cognitive disorder. He sounded like he really loved his family and but brain was turning to mush. I’m sure Alvin is greatful and always watching over you and your family. He sounds like the type of dog that not would not want to live life like that on a major decline and the last thing he would want to become is a danger to his family.


----------



## CometDog (Aug 22, 2017)

Thanks for the kind words  

I've learned quite a bit about genetics since getting involved in IPO. I'll never know if it was medical (like a brain tumor or infection), dementia, or just a genetic unsoundness that was waiting there for maturity to trip it. 

I think it was some sort of illness..the shape of his eyes changed, his head carriage changed. Now looking back at pictures you could nearly story book the physical change as well. Sad.

He will always be the dog that makes me roll my eyes at people when they say "you can rescue for 250, why pay 2500".Both categories of dog is an unknown entity. Either can rack up 1000s in vet bills regardless of where you got them from. And, if you rescue the unknown is higher, thus chances of illness are higher. I am all for rescue, I've rescued my share and I just placed a GORGEOUS black GSD with a wonderful family. He was heartworm positive but worth saving. HOWEVER it is the "save your money" aspect/propaganda that I hate from the Adopt or else crowd. Yeah, because my rescues have cost me 1000s...several 1000s. Alvin's issues, English Mastiff with Lyme disease that became chronic, very early onset of diabetes of a terrier, and the good old hip dysplasia. Things you usually don't deal with when you buy from a reputable and not cheap breeder, when you start with an 8 week old pup who gets great vet care from the chute.


----------



## mike4625 (Apr 25, 2018)

Sorry you had to go through this experience, he was such a pretty dog. I think you made the right decision.


----------



## SuperG (May 11, 2013)

The greater good should always be served.........no matter how difficult or emotionally charged we make the choice.




SuperG


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 16, 2018)

I think you did everything possible for everyone involved, and you did exactly what you had to. I'm not surprised that you still agonize over it, because this is very much like circumstances some of us have faced with mentally ill family members. We don't euthanize mentally ill people (not here in the US, anyway), but we still have to navigate conflicts with family members over them, we have to agonize over what agencies to call and arrange interventions, and decide when we're going to stop putting up with the chaos they bring into our lives.

Essentially you went through that same process- with a dog. 

It doesn't matter what the cause of the inappropriate aggression was. You didn't cause it. I don't think there'd have been any way to fix it, just a lot of very expensive attempts to try. And your son may have been in danger while you tried. 

I hope that this was the last such experience you'll have and that all of the dogs you'll have with you going forward will be blessings that can grow old with you!


----------



## Chip Blasiole (May 3, 2013)

You might want to research rage syndrome in dogs. It is not that common and GSDs have a higher incidence of it than some other breeds.


----------



## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Also check out Rabies Vaccinosis. I think that this caused my dog's demise as I described in the first page of this thread.


----------



## dojoson41 (Oct 14, 2018)

*testing*

hate to ask but did you donate himto science to see if they could find out if it was medical problem that couldbe treated and helped reconized in the future?


----------

