# leerburg training methods..



## ardavis324 (Jan 14, 2008)

What do you guys think of it? I subscribed to the podcast so lately I have been listening to his articles on my way to and from work. He makes a point in every article to explain how he has been raising dogs for many many years and how his advice is effective. What do you all think of his methods? 

http://leerburg.com/articles.htm


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## Sheppy (Nov 13, 2004)

The board search function is a wonderful resource. 

Click on 'Search'. It's just to the left of 'FAQ' near the top of your screen. 

You will find a number of threads on 'Leerburg'


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## Bounette White (Apr 14, 2008)

i have belonged to that forum for years and years. i really respect the opinions and their experience with training and knowledge of the breed. my only con for them is they can be a little too hard core at times. there seems to more of a love for working the dog than the love of dogs itself, 
if you want good info. and reputable advice it is a great place to go to though. they have great great training articles, and help articles with puppies and adult dogs. i like the place alot.


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## Bounette White (Apr 14, 2008)

i don't know what i'm doing wrong but i can't find any leerburg in the search function.


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## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

I incorporate much of Leerburg's training philosophies into Janka's rearing. 

I respect much of what he has to offer, because it makes sense, it works and he obviously learned and re-learned through the years he spends with his dogs.

But I do not follow it like a canine bible. I take what works for us, and ignore the rest. Like what gsd&mal crazy said, it tends to gear too much towards raising a serious working dog.

I own a few of his videos, and recently ordered 'Preparing my dog for the helper' ... pretty excited! But his written articles are pretty thorough and you can glean quite a lot from them.

Here is a start ... 
http://www.leerburg.com/articles.htm


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## big_dog7777 (Apr 6, 2004)

There is some very good information, and some not so good information on training on that site. Take what you like and works, and ignore the rest. Just like Stig mentioned above, as long as you don't think it's a Bible or anything you're good.


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## cgarrity (Apr 22, 2008)

A lot of great information on that site. If you subscribe to the forums you'll note that a number of the folks that routinely post there seem to follow Frawley like he's the Messiah and never question anything he says, even if it hasn't worked for them. I like the training portion of the site. They are a bit over-the-top on the all raw diet stuff, which a whole slew of people on that site seem to have continuing problems with by the way, and also some of the "no vaccines no matter what" philosophies. He has a lot of great articles on there and I have a few of the DVDs. Definitely geared toward working dogs but some great advice for basic obedience for household pets too.


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## GrandJan (Aug 11, 2006)

> Originally Posted By: CMGThey are a bit over-the-top on the all raw diet stuff...


If 'over-the-top' = knowledgeable, then yes, _extremely_ over the top.


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## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

I think their take on raw is very well-rounded and informative, and they have many published works on the raw diet to support their philosophies. 

When my pup first came home, I use their advice as a base. 

And they did have a HUGE disclaimer in their articles on feeding raw for readers.

I have not seen any problems with the regular raw feeders on the forum. Usually it's those who are new to raw with the questions and problems.

Like with any professional, we can listen to them and learn from them. But it doesn't mean we follow word for word. The key here is to always use our common sense along with our requirements to tailor our needs.

[edit: Leerburg does have a list of high quality kibble for those who do not want to feed raw.]


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## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

I think he's another good resource BUT pretty much like ALL trainers you need to use your own brain. background and experience to fit it into your life (or not).


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## AbbyK9 (Oct 11, 2005)

There is a ton of very good advice on the Leerburg website that I frequently point people to, particularly the articles on dog parks, fitting a prong, and ground work.

However, I like to read the Leerburg site (and any other trainer's book or website) with an open mind. What worked for them may not work for me and my dog. I take the bits that work for me and don't take the bits that don't.


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## Timber1 (May 19, 2007)

I do not agree with all Ed's methods, and he is very opionated. 

But my son, who has two yellow labs has corresponded with Mr. Frawley directly, and the guy has been very helpful.

On balance, form your own opinion, then take the good from Leerburg, and discard what you do not agree with.


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## Mai (Mar 31, 2008)

Timber1 as a new person in dog training I am just curious to know what methods you don't agree with?


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## Chloedancer (Mar 13, 2008)

Hey Stig, let me know how you like that DVD "Preparing My Dog for the Helper". I am comtemplating purchasing it. 

Also would like the one on drive and focus. Do you have that one?

I feel he has good resources and it wouldn't hurt to have a few on his DVD's to help along with the training I am already involved in. My trainers and SchH group all like him.


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## big_dog7777 (Apr 6, 2004)

I have both DVD's, and they are pretty good. I say pretty good and not amazing because they are not an overall training guide or anything for SchH. Both of them are different parts of a Bernhard Flinks seminar, and will help develop a young dog. Bernhard is am amazing teacher, if you can get to a seminar GO because the video's are about 5% of what he does for a seminar. Out of the two, I like the drive and focus one a little better.


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## Timber1 (May 19, 2007)

Wow, a good and very opened ended question. As I said before the Leerburg stuff is very good, and he has been helpful to my son. 

However, Ed Frawley trains dogs for police amd military work. My understanding is you can no longer purchase a dog from Leerburg. 

I tend to think a military dog, a police dog and a schH high end dog are trained much differently then a companion dog. Suffice it to say when I enrolled Timber, my European GSD in an attack/protection class, it was a mistake, because I bought Timber to be a companion. Timber would neither jump on anyone nor play tug of war. Please don't misunderstand, he is protective.

I am now adopting rescue GSD's. Some label some of these rescues as aggressive or mean. I have found quite the opposite. For the most part, they are shy and fearful. And most of Ed's training methods do not apply to these rescue's.

Ed is great with high end dogs, and perhaps saying I disagree with his training methods is a bit off post. However, if I was going to select a high end companion dog, or a rescue, I would seek advice elsewhere.


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## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

> Originally Posted By: Chloe DancerHey Stig, let me know how you like that DVD "Preparing My Dog for the Helper". I am comtemplating purchasing it.
> 
> Also would like the one on drive and focus. Do you have that one?
> 
> I feel he has good resources and it wouldn't hurt to have a few on his DVD's to help along with the training I am already involved in. My trainers and SchH group all like him.



Hi,

I will certainly PM you once I have a chance to review the DVD.

As for the Drive and Focus, it was informative for me. I am very new at this sport, and it teaches good exercises to help prep your dog. 

But as John of ZeusGSD said, it is a building block for SchH, or any sport really, but it is certainly isn't a comprehensive educational tool for the sport. It's a good side exercise, but nothing beats attending the meetings and trials. 

Regards,
Rei

[edit: the members of our local club also know of him and have his DVDs too. they also recommended Balabanov as well. i haven't really looked into him, although i have heard of his name in the past.]


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## raysmom (May 22, 2004)

I've looked through his site, and the part that scared me was the section about "Extremely Handler Aggressive Dogs" and the Dominant Dog Collar - he talks about lifting the dog 4 ft off the ground by the lead/collar until they pass out and then lets them lay there until they regain consiousness and then start again.

http://www.leerburg.com/746.htm

I realize he's talking about a very specific problem dog, and that he's very experienced trainer - but if someone were to read through the site and decide to try it themselves, in the wrong hands, this maneuver could be deadly, I would think.


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## big_dog7777 (Apr 6, 2004)

That exact article and method has been discussed at great length here. No, that is not for someone extremely experienced and the right dog and even then there is a debate on whether to use that method or not.


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## The Stig (Oct 11, 2007)

Like I, and others have chimed in, when researching for any information, be it dog training or child-rearing or whatever, one must always use common sense while absorbing new advise and information.

If it appears counter-productive or at least does not pertain to one's particular case, just leave it.

Unfortunately, I have seen many people who simply take in what is available and not process it properly to judge whether it works for them or not.

~ Rei


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## Sarah'sSita (Oct 27, 2001)

I wouldn't rely totally on what Leerburg or anyone else has to say in regards to training your dog. Use common sense. Mr. Frawley borrows alot from other trainers and incorporates it into his own method.(Don't we all do that anyway?) He's a human, not a dog-training Messiah. He is also a business man....
I bought his VHS of Basic Dog Obedience in 2003 with Tom Rose made a while back. Didn't like it, too much force, maybe the updated ones a re better. Flinks tapes are good, but I also preferred Ivan's tapes. 

I seldom get my training info from his message forum. I get it from training my dog with the club I belong to.


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## IliamnasQuest (Aug 24, 2005)

You have to take what's on the Leerburg site with a huge grain of salt, and don't do anything unless you are truly comfortable with it.

Any person who has a complete bias against certain breeds is not the best person to go to for advice, in my opinion. For example, his page on chows tends to brand them all with a very aggressive image. He recommends "helicoptering them" with a prong collar, as I remember. He feels that all chows should be trained with prong or shock. It's obvious to me (as someone who trains and titles chows in performance events and has a chow that is a certified therapy dog) that Frawley has a great deal to learn about dogs in general, even if he touts himself as an expert with the dogs he personally trains.

If you want to train your dog as a companion, there are great methods out there that help you build a wonderful relationship. Finding a good positive-based trainer in your area will help you tremendously, too.

Melanie and the gang in Alaska


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## Cooper&me (Dec 18, 2007)

The best dvd I got there was 8 weeks to 8 months. Every new pup owner should have it. It is great.
I also like building drive and focus.
some of the others were more infomercials.
I definately like Mr. Fawley and his site. With every site/method take what works for you and move on.

I agree also with raw food being the best and also with his stand on vaccinations.
I even like that he is opinionated but I married someone almost his equal but in the horse world so I guess it is my type.


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## dOg (Jan 23, 2006)

I think there some good and some bad in any forum, and any business has it's schtick too. 

I also think the best teacher is your dog!


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## nitetrane98 (Feb 23, 2008)

I'd be a little careful about picking and choosing specific methods from one trainer's program and co-mingling with them with others to make a homogenized version for your dog. It's quite obvious that Leerburg is geared toward the high-end dog. While some techniques are applicable to all dogs, others are best suited for different temperament types and the desired ultimate outcome. What I'm trying to say is Leerburg seems to be a system that builds on previous training steps and methods. To simply eliminate a step because of a personal aversion to the method won't work IMO. For instance, doing the drive building and then wondering why the clicker won't control him when he's in high gear. 
And always remember that the only thing two trainers agree upon is that the third one is wrong.


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## Amaruq (Aug 29, 2001)

> Originally Posted By: Chris08I'd be a little careful about picking and choosing specific methods from one trainer's program and co-mingling with them with others to make a homogenized version for your dog.


But quite honestly, this is exactly how I train my dogs and how many others have trained their dogs. I read a LOT and incorporate what will work for me and my dogs and what we are working towards. It all really depends on what your goals are for your dogs.


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## lhczth (Apr 5, 2000)

Rug is right. This is how good trainers train. I always say that my obedience (or tracking, etc) is a little of this person's, a little of that's and a whole lot of me. When you train and work with animals (of any sort) over many years you pick things up from different people, use what works for you and store the rest just in case it might work for a dog you don't have right now. Of course you also throw away stuff that you know you would NEVER use.


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