# UKC or AKC?



## amjrchamberlain

For someone who is completely new to Conformation, which Kennel Club will be most new handler friendly? I hear UKC is the most owner-handler friendly...just want to check with you seasoned pros.









Also, if someone gets the time, would you mind looking over Willow in the Critique section of the board and tell me how you think she would do in UKC (assuming that the above is correct)? 

I want us to just go have fun, but it'd be nice if we had a shot at winning! LOL 

Thanks.


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## umzilla

UKC conformation shows do not allow pro handlers - and yes, from all accounts they are more laid back and fun. There is minimal grooming allowed, as it seems the purpose is to judge the dog, not the handler or the groomer. You should still do a nice presentation of your dog, however.







I would recommend UKC as not only a place to start, but a nice registry overall. There is alot to do within UKC.

I'll look at the pictures you posted - but I'd say enter, have fun, and enjoy your dog! 

Christine


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## SouthernBelle

I agree. Its hard to handle your own Shepherd in AKC and get anywhere, especially if you are new to conformation in general.
Some people can do it and do it well, but it comes with alot of politics and whos who, like everything else.
Although, I have met some super nice, friendly and helpful people in AKC. It helps to have a really nice dog, then you can get "accepted" easier. IMO.


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## MaggieRoseLee

I've heard that when you start you puppy, and at the lower levels, owner handled dogs (with some handler tips and classes prior to the trial) can do well in AKC.

It's when the dog gets older and it's more competitive that the professional handler helps. Their additional knowledge of what dogs live where (the competition!) and what type of dog a certain judge prefers can make a big difference.


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## SouthernBelle

> Originally Posted By: MaggieRoseLeejudge prefers .


Is'nt that sad... the standard kinda gos out the window if the judge dosnt like the coat color or the dogs type.........

Some Sables have a tough time, and that is a dominent gene, meaning it should show up more had it not been bred out....


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## arycrest

> Originally Posted By: AngelaMOFor someone who is completely new to Conformation, which Kennel Club will be most new handler friendly? I hear UKC is the most owner-handler friendly...just want to check with you seasoned pros.
> 
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I am NOT a "seasoned pro" but I found that the UKC shows are very owner/handler oriented (no pro handlers). The shows are relaxed, the people are usually willing to help a newcomer, answer questions, etc. When I was showing Slider, complete strangers took him in the ring for me and he did well regardless of who was holding the lead.

AKC conformation titles mean more to most people, but if that doesn't upset you, I highly recommend that you show with UKC.

And as an extra bonus, at UKC shows you see breeds of dogs not found in AKC sanctioned shows - in some ways UKC shows are very similar to rare breed shows like ARBA.


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## Andaka

> Quote:Is'nt that sad... the standard kinda gos out the window if the judge dosnt like the coat color or the dogs type.........
> 
> Some Sables have a tough time, and that is a dominent gene, meaning it should show up more had it not been bred out....


Judges are people first. And each person has their own interpretation of the standard. And personal preferences. And 
often dogs are not places for some reason other than the obvious. 

I was judging a match and in walked this beautiful sable bitch. I was in LOVE! That is, until she started to gait around the ring. She had a dip in her back. So I put up a different dog. And the handler came out of the ring muttering about the stupid judge that didn't like sables! I stopped him before he got too far away and explained to him that I likes sables, and that his bitch was very nice, except for the dip in her back -- and I am very picky on backs because of my working dog background. Her loss had nothing to do with her coat color.

That said, there are those judges, especially in the all-breed ring, that prefer a German Shepherd Dog to be black and tan. It is your job to know who they are.


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## SouthernBelle

I have always been told, if you dont like/ understand the judges decision, if you see their not busy, ask them about the decision. Sometimes it's completely different than you think.

I have had 1 class that I thought our not being placed was coat color... and we have been beat by ALOT of black and tans. I noticed that the judge never once looked at Camo in the line up or while they were going around the ring. I did not ask b/c I was having a pissy moment LOL!


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## mkennels

ukc shows is the way to start out first to see if you like handling and once you get good and want to try akc then go for it but at small shows first, the bigger the show the more politics there is in akc. I do both and I owner/handle mine right now i do more ukc than akc but still do both every year. the main thing is if you don't have fun then don't do it, you have to enjoy it plus if conformation isn't the way to go ukc does other things as well


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## VKristallaugen4

I would definitely start out UKC, AKC is harsh world for GSD!! Fun, but harsh!! LOL


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## CMorton

I wish we had some UKC shows close to us, it sounds as if they are a good way for people to get introduced to the sport of conformation and have a pleasant experience.
AKC shows can be hard on some people, unfortunately.


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## SouthernBelle

Haha! Funny that you mention that.... Camo had to decide if he wanted to go to the UKC shows in Hickory NC this weekend and possibly get his Ch. title or go to our clubs specialty in Charlotte.... You know what we decided, but it stinks because we really wanted to try for the UKC.. maybe next time.


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## CMorton

Yeah, I went to the UKC website and saw the Hickory one. Really not too far away, about 2 1/2 hours from our place. That's do-able for next time.
Can't wait for this weekend!!!


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## dOg

Interesting thread...
been wondering why there isn't more about UKC everywhere online.

USA doesn't allow UKC dogs because it isn't FCI...but I just figured that out over the weekend. 

Does anyone else care to express any commentary on UKC ?
There is so little about it anywhere, if you have any experience,
or opinions, please share!


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## denwil2007

There's just not enough advertisement. 
And there aren't enough shows. I can go to at least five AKC shows within 45 minutes of my house, and 15-20 all breed and specialty shows within two hours drive. 

I haven't found a single UKC show in Ohio. I would gladly go if there were more shows.


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## CMorton

I agree, I would like to go to a UKC show, just not many of them relatively close by.


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## dOg

I've heard some good things about the shows and judges, like
less politics, more personable critiques, but never been to either
a show nor a SDA venue training session:

<span style="color: #3333FF">ukc site</span> 

<span style="color: #3333ff">wiki</span> 

<span style="color: #3333ff">affiliate</span>


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## umzilla

I just posted about SDA in the "Schutzhund 1936" thread in the Schutzhund section. SDA is Service Dogs of America, and the titles are the working sport for UKC (ie. UKC Dog Sport is "SDA.") These protection titles are recognized in UKC pedigrees. I posted about what you can expect in some of the protection titles.

I see you're in Michigan - there will be SDA events in Michigan, and of course Premier has conformation, Dog Sport, and everything else UKC...Where are you? Some of these might be in easy driving distance. 

Christine


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## SouthernBelle

Christine, 
That is very interesting. I read your post in the Sch thread and went on the UKC site. Thanks for posting that info! Too bad UKC has very little in my area. I really want to title Camo in UKC conformation.


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## umzilla

Sent you a PM.

Christine


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## Ceph

There's a big show in Hickory this weekend - I am driving a few hours south to go to it - it's the Carolina Classic







If you are interested in coming I know of a few GSD people who are going to be there - and it's not too hard to get a UKC TL number if you dont have a registration with them yet









showing in the UKC is a blast - I adore it. I like the people and so far I havent seen any really icky dogs - but I only show once a month or so.

~Cate


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## SouthernBelle

Cate, I wont be at this one as we have our Charlotte specialty, but I do plan to visit Hickory in the future. Good luck BTW... I have a Sheltie friend that will be attending it. GO HERDING DOGS!!!


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## Andaka

> Quote: I haven't found a single UKC show in Ohio. I would gladly go if there were more shows.


I just went to the UKC website and found several shows in Ohio. There are no Missouri shows, but there seem to be several in Illinois and Indiana, so maybe I'll check them out.


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## denwil2007

The ones in OH aren't all breed conformation shows, there obedience or some other breed specialty. No gsd's.


At $3.30 a gallon, Ill and Ind. are a bit of a stretch for me


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## VKristallaugen4

There is not enough UKC shows in my area either, I would LOVE to start there and learn to owner handle. I personally would love to complete at least one Champion from the Bred By class, maybe someday


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## SouthernBelle

ME TOO GIRL!!! I am hoping to get that conquered one day!


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## VKristallaugen4

Maybe we'll be there together.......


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## SouthernBelle

With our SABLES


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## VKristallaugen4

Definitely with our SABLES!!!


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## Xeph

Hey, I'll be there with a couple of sables myself!


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## SouthernBelle

Woo Hooo!! Bring em' on... the more the merrier!!


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## denwil2007

We need more sables in the ring. Just think of Joelle's Alvinnnnn, Marquis Blonde Bomshell...


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## SouthernBelle

I agree. I can only think of ...maybe one other Sable that we have been in the ring with..... out of all of the shows we have been to.

I, personally, like being the "black sheep" LOL! People tend to remember Camo. Hes kinda hard to miss


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## CMorton

I LOVE sables, I have 2 of them myself , a mother and a daughter. 
The daughter is darker pigmented than the mother, but mother is better in temperament and soundness, and conformation.
Daughter has more drive, but less nerve.
Gotta love a great sable!!


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## denwil2007

Sorry to hijack the post. UKC sounds like a good idea, and if you have conformation shows close go for it.


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## SouthernBelle

> Originally Posted By: CMortonI LOVE sables, I have 2 of them myself , a mother and a daughter.
> The daughter is darker pigmented than the mother, but mother is better in temperament and soundness, and conformation.
> Daughter has more drive, but less nerve.
> Gotta love a great sable!!


I didnt know you had sables?? I cant find your site.


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## CMorton

Both my boy Bahstun's parents are sables ) 
I have a 1/2 sister of his who is sable.
I'm trying to figure out why my site is not up, thanks for letting me know.


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## mkennels

Anyone going to Chesterfield, VA UKC show on the 18-20th of this month?


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