# Possible parvo - advice needed please (cross posted)



## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

I cross posted this in the health and wellness forum as well, but I'm posting here also to reach out to those who may not frequent there but can still offer advice. If this is against the rules, I apologize to the admin. Just looking for help. 

I have put a partial deposit down on a GSD puppy from a reputable breeder. Pups were ready to come home on Thanksgiving, my breeder agreed to keep ours one extra week as my daughter's birthday is Saturday and it's a surprise for her. First pup that went home was home three days and showed symptoms - that family under breeders advice took him immediately to the vet. Parvo positive. The next day, one of her remaining puppies seemed to be showing signs, so she took him in and he tested positive also. She immediately took her remaining puppies to her vet - she must have a great relationship with him because he took in 6 puppies for IV's and quarantine on Thanksgiving day. All her puppies received one parvo vax at about the 5-6 week mark(though I know one vax isn't enough). They have been in quarantine since Thursday evening and all are responding well to IV and treatment and are energetic according to report fromr vet. My breeder is devastated, she has been breeding GSD's for over 10 years and has never had this happen with any other litter. I have so many questions, so here goes. 

- I don't have experience with parvo but I do fully understand it's highly contagious and a b#%*h to kill, if you even can. I'm assuming that my puppy is most likely positive. I have multiple neighbors all around me with dogs, friends whom I visit with dogs, and am around my brother's two adult dogs *constantly*. I can't imagine exposing _*any*_ of them to this regardless of if they've been vaccinated or not. Is this enough to just stop right here and not bring this puppy home?

- If my puppy is positive, but recovers fully, should I expect her to suffer any effects from this long term? Not asking as if any of you are vets, I know I will asking my own vet these same questions. Asking for your personal experiences with any possible long term parvo effects. 

- When she first told me what was happening, it seemed that she automatically assumed I would not want the dog anymore, which is very confusing to me because that would never be my initial reaction. After she realized I wasn't going to immediately say "thanks but no thanks" she has continued to keep me diligently updated and is nothing but grateful for my support. I have driven 4 hours round trip and visited this puppy twice already since she was born. I have been communicating with this breeder asking questions and just getting to know her since before the dam of this litter was even pregnant. Needless to say, this puppy hasn't been just a mere "thought" to me just because I don't have her physically at home yet. BUT... now I'm just at a loss for what to do. SHOULD I be saying "thanks but no thanks"? Personally, my heart is heavy that this has happened to these poor puppies, and because I know the breeder is heartbroken, but if I do not end up taking the dog, I know I will be ok - it would be a completely different story if the puppy was already home and my daughter and son were attached and this happened. They know nothing of it as it was going to be a surprise. 

- If this puppy recovers and I do bring her home, I know there is a time period where I would _*still*_ have to quarantine her from other dogs no matter what. In your experience, will this hurt her in terms of socialization? I keep reading about how that "window" is important when they are young. 

- I have left a message with her vet to call me to speak to him directly and see what the outlook is. At this point I know she is just trying to make sure all these puppies live. She cares nothing about the money as she obviously has already told me I will receive the deposit I have already paid back in full, has agreed to pay the first puppy's vet bill to that family, and is currently incurring the expense of SIX in a vet hospital quarantine with IV's, multiple meds, and testing. I really respect that about her professionally and emotionally, but i don't know if that validates in any way bringing this puppy home. 

- I spoke to my vet about the situation. His exact words were he "wouldn't be in a hurry" to accept a dog with parvo, and that even if we do decide to bring her home he would want to see clear fecals, second parvo vax, and full recovery of appetite and the original intestinal distress, among other things. We talked about some of these other topics I have mentioned and he really just seemed 50/50 about it, but definitely not enthusiastic. He is of the mind that if you are paying a price for an animal from a reputable breeder, it needs a clean bill of health and should be included in the contract(which it is). 

- Are you all out there laughing at me because I'm just completely an idiot for even considering the thought of accepting this puppy at all? If I am, I need to know. My sentimental animal lover side doesn't want to let go. 

Sorry this is so long winded. I'm just at a loss. It's not about the money to me though it should be... and yet it shouldn't be about the emotions and it is... I'm just torn. Thank you for taking the time to read this. Any _*honest*_ advice is greatly appreciated, Im a big girl, I can take it. :wink2:

Attached some pics - the day I first met her @ 4 weeks old, me and the hubs with her @ 6 weeks, and a pic of her and one of her brothers. :wub:


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## Steve Strom (Oct 26, 2013)

I wouldn't bring the pup home. It may sound harsh, but there can be long term effects from parvo I wouldn't want to deal with and like your vet alluded to, I don't want to chance bringing it into my home and property. I'm not laughing at you at all, its a tough thing to happen.


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## CatChandler (Jul 25, 2016)

If you've already visited the pup a couple times, there is a chance you already brought the virus home on your shoes/clothes/hands etc, and it's virtually impossible to kill. Lasts 7-10 years or maybe longer. So I would say it would be irresponsible to bring a DIFFERENT puppy home and risk infecting it before it's had its set of 3/4 shots. I mean the chances are probably very small, but it would be heartbreaking to go through that with a different puppy. If anything you would need to get an adult dog (older than 8 months) who's already been vaccinated for parvo.

One good thing is once a pup survives parvo, it has lifelong immunity.

If you are set on taking this pup, I would ask the breeder to hold it for 4 weeks after he/she has recovered from the parvo. That way you can be sure your pup doesn't have any lasting effects, like heart or brain damage.

That's a horrible situation and I'm very sorry, just try to calm down and take it one step at a time. You don't have to decide anything today, or tomorrow. This is an important decision and I'm sure you realize it's more important than surprising your kids at this point.

I do think maybe you should talk to a different vet, this is important enough that you'd want to get second and third opinions.


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## stepkau (Jan 4, 2016)

Great looking pup! Hopefully she can make a full recovery. I don't have any Pravo experience to share but just an observation/opinion: you found yourself a quality breeder.. Some breeders might do a cost benefit analysis and quietly have the litter euthanized and removed from their website.. As you know already there are going to be costs associated with these pups now and possibly later down the road.. Also, your breeder is going to have difficulty finding GOOD homes for these pups. 

Would I want to take home a puppy with Pravo or suggest it? Nope, but then again I don't have the cutest pictures ever of me and my puppy like you do.. 

Not an easy decision, I wish you the best..


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## CatChandler (Jul 25, 2016)

I don't know how to edit my original reply, but I just re-read your post... after your puppy comes home, he would have been tested to make sure he is not shedding the live parvo virus in his stool so after you get him, you would not need to worry about infecting your friends and neighbors' dogs (they are vaccinated HOPEFULLY so this wouldn't be an issue anyway).


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

I'm in tears reading this. Thank you so much for your kind understanding. From what I gather, the last time I visited the puppy, it was almost a full 3 weeks before the first dog showed symptoms and I *think* the incubation window is 7-10 days but I could be wrong. So hopefully I'm in the clear as far as that goes. Not that at this point I want to even think of bringing another puppy home, but that's just going to be another decision at some later point in time. 

She did agree that it would absolutely be best and she was all for keeping the dog until or through Christmas/New Year's to ensure health if we make the decision to go ahead and take her. I've just never been in a situation quite like this so it's hard for me to know what the best thing to do is.


CatChandler said:


> If you've already visited the pup a couple times, there is a chance you already brought the virus home on your shoes/clothes/hands etc, and it's virtually impossible to kill. Lasts 7-10 years or maybe longer. So I would say it would be irresponsible to bring a DIFFERENT puppy home and risk infecting it before it's had its set of 3/4 shots. I mean the chances are probably very small, but it would be heartbreaking to go through that with a different puppy. If anything you would need to get an adult dog (older than 8 months) who's already been vaccinated for parvo.
> 
> One good thing is once a pup survives parvo, it has lifelong immunity.
> 
> ...


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

Thank you, and I know to this breeder it isn't about the cost as she took them straight to her vet and all 6 are on the 4th day of quarantine care, IV treatment, etc... she said her vet is very honest, and probably wouldn't have even made an attempt unless he knew he could save all of them.

And the pictures make it even harder for me... we already have a little joy and so much time invested with the breeder communicating back and forth. sigh.....


stepkau said:


> Great looking pup! Hopefully she can make a full recovery. I don't have any Pravo experience to share but just an observation/opinion: you found yourself a quality breeder.. Some breeders might do a cost benefit analysis and quietly have the litter euthanized and removed from their website.. As you know already there are going to be costs associated with these pups now and possibly later down the road.. Also, your breeder is going to have difficulty finding GOOD homes for these pups.
> 
> Would I want to take home a puppy with Pravo or suggest it? Nope, but then again I don't have the cutest pictures ever of me and my puppy like you do..
> 
> Not an easy decision, I wish you the best..


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I would not refuse the pup. What I would do is have the breeder hold on to the pup(since they already have a contaminated area) for about two weeks after its first solid normal stool and no vomiting. Doing it this way will not put any dogs in danger in your area or home. You can confirm this with a good vet. You don't bring anything home from the breeders other then the puppy.


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## Pan_GSD (Oct 2, 2016)

what a sad thing to happen especially during the holidays...
those puppies look amazing, would have been great if they never caught the virus and joined your family

if i were you, i would not take those dogs in....
just too much hassle and heartache

but it really must be miserable for the breeder
im assuming almost all other potential buyers cancelled their orders. what's gonna happen to the pups..... but that's not on the buyers, nor the breeder really
it's just misfortune...


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

If the puppy survives, then it will need a home. If you are willing to give him a home, it will most likely be a great pet and companion for you. 

Bleach kills parvo. Parvo will last on surfaces in your home (that are not bleached) for up to 2 years I think. Outside for 6 months. So, ask your vet for how long after the pup has recovered from parvo that the pup will shed the disease. Keep the puppy in a place where there are hard surfaces that can be washed with bleach/water. I think you have to put the bleach water down, for 10 minutes and then rinse. You can do this with your shoes as well. 

If you have ever gone to a shelter, you might have brought parvo home. Parvo is nasty, but if dogs are vaccinated, they rarely get it -- adult dogs. It is hard on puppies. This is why a lot of breeders will not let people visit until after the puppy has had shots. But the first shots don't often work anyway, as the pup might be still under the dam's immunity. People will go puppy shopping, go to shelters and other breeders and then to the breeder, and if a breeder doesn't specifically ask you not to do this, then chances are someone did do this, and brought the parvo with them. 

When you bring your puppy home, don't take him anywhere until he is unlikely to shed the disease. The disease is not shed by holding him, but through feces. So be militant about picking up and disinfecting, and you should be ok.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Just some info...

Parvovirus can be shed in the feces 3-4 days after infection with the virus, which is generally before clinical signs of illness appear. The virus will also be shed in the feces for approximately 10-14 days post-recovery from clinical signs of infection.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

The pups were vaccinated when they were 5 weeks old? That could be the cause of this infection as a vaccination that young can undo the maternal antibodies that they get through the mother's milk. I know this doesn't change the situation. I personally would not get a pup from this litter. it is tough emotionally but you have to look 12 years down the road for possible problems. If you leave the pup with the breeder all this time, will the breeder take care of early training etc?


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

Call me a sap. I'd take the puppy. If, like you said, the breeder is willing to keep the puppies to ensure they have no long lasting health issues, I'd do it.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

wolfy dog said:


> The pups were vaccinated when they were 5 weeks old? That could be the cause of this infection as a vaccination that young can undo the maternal antibodies that they get through the mother's milk. I know this doesn't change the situation. I personally would not get a pup from this litter. it is tough emotionally but you have to look 12 years down the road for possible problems. If you leave the pup with the breeder all this time, will the breeder take care of early training etc?


The way I understand it is a little different. The pups are under the dam's immune system until her immunity wears off. We don't know when that happens. So if your dam was properly protected from parvo, the pups would not get parvo until that maternal immunity wears off. If they are vaccinated while that is still in effect, the mother's antibodies kill off the virus and the puppies immature immune system does not build antibodies of its own, so the vaccine was actually useless in protecting the puppy. Let's say the mother's immunity wore off at 7 weeks and someone came in to look at the puppies after puppy shopping. Now the puppies are vulnerable. The mother's immunity has worn off, and the first set of shots did nothing to build up their own system. 2nd set of shots are not due until 8 or 9 weeks. I don't think vaccinating them affects the maternal immunity. It just doesn't give them the opportunity of building their own immunity. The mother's immunity will fall off anyway. 

If they keep the pups for another 2-4 weeks it will not hurt them at all. Getting a pup at 8 weeks, 10 weeks, 12 weeks -- no problem. You will still bond with the puppy, etc. And a pup of good temperament really does not need all that "early training." Early training is done basically to try to mask poor temperament, and the issues that arise from it. A confident puppy does not need to walk on different surfaces and so on and so forth. Puppies go home all the time at 10-12 weeks old, and are just fine. 6 months? That could be a little more interesting, but even then they will be fine for the most part. Remember that people take dogs home from shelter environments, out of abusive situations, and those dogs bond with their new people and manage just fine if we don't sabotage them. 

Actually, it will be better if you wait until after the holidays to bring the puppy home anyway. What's a month? The puppy will not be transported, still recovering into the hustle and bustle of the holidays. And it won't be just another toy, among the many that loses it's fun after Christmas. 

Best to wrap up a bowl and some dog toys, and an age-appropriate book about caring for your puppy, and explain that you will bring the puppy home after new year's, when everything is back to normal.


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## CarrieJo (Oct 1, 2016)

First of all let me admit I have not read the entire thread.

Second my husband and I bought a puppy once that when I took her to the vet she tested positive for parvo. The breeders took her back and immediately put her on an iv and everything. When she was completely recovered they offered the pup back to me. We said no. It is one of the things in my life I wish I would have done differently. I never thought she was showing signs and she "recovered so quickly" I believe after doing research years later that the vet got a false positive and I wish I would have got her back. She was a beautiful collie pup. Don't even remember who the breeders where but I really believe looking back it was a false positive. 

No one really tells people about the false positives, vaccine side effects, and other things vaccines can cause. JUST MY OPINION. That being said the parvo deal is a very seriously deadly disease that will kill a puppy so very quick. Parvo and distemper scare the mess out of me. And besides rabies is the only vaccines I give my dogs. I also do not believe in vaccinating a dog every year. NOPE too many and too much on the dog's immune system. So I usually go for a few puppy shots (parvo and distemper) and of course the law required rabies, but usually around a year I might give them a booster of the vaccine but nothing but rabies from then on.


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

Breeder told me that she had one person tell her they no longer wanted the puppy and she has already refunded them. She said as far as she knows everyone else is still willing to bring their pup home given a clean bill of health, stools and appetite back to normal, etc. Regardless whatever money she would have made off this litter is long gone now as this is _*day 6 *_of vet hospital quarantine and IV care for remaining 6 puppies. Not about the money to her, she just wanted to save them all. So far, not one has been lost....


Pan_GSD said:


> what a sad thing to happen especially during the holidays...
> those puppies look amazing, would have been great if they never caught the virus and joined your family
> 
> if i were you, i would not take those dogs in....
> ...


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

Thank you and my vet told me the same concerning the false positives. In this case I don't even know if my pup tested positive, I think they have been under the assumption that due to the super contagious nature of the virus and the fact that all puppies were still being housed together with their litter and their mother, that they all would come up positive - as if one gets it, they are all most likely to get it.


CarrieJo said:


> First of all let me admit I have not read the entire thread.
> 
> Second my husband and I bought a puppy once that when I took her to the vet she tested positive for parvo. The breeders took her back and immediately put her on an iv and everything. When she was completely recovered they offered the pup back to me. We said no. It is one of the things in my life I wish I would have done differently. I never thought she was showing signs and she "recovered so quickly" I believe after doing research years later that the vet got a false positive and I wish I would have got her back. She was a beautiful collie pup. Don't even remember who the breeders where but I really believe looking back it was a false positive.
> 
> No one really tells people about the false positives, vaccine side effects, and other things vaccines can cause. JUST MY OPINION. That being said the parvo deal is a very seriously deadly disease that will kill a puppy so very quick. Parvo and distemper scare the mess out of me. And besides rabies is the only vaccines I give my dogs. I also do not believe in vaccinating a dog every year. NOPE too many and too much on the dog's immune system. So I usually go for a few puppy shots (parvo and distemper) and of course the law required rabies, but usually around a year I might give them a booster of the vaccine but nothing but rabies from then on.


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

wolfy dog said:


> The pups were vaccinated when they were 5 weeks old? That could be the cause of this infection as a vaccination that young can undo the maternal antibodies that they get through the mother's milk. I know this doesn't change the situation. I personally would not get a pup from this litter. it is tough emotionally but you have to look 12 years down the road for possible problems. If you leave the pup with the breeder all this time, will the breeder take care of early training etc?


Pups were vaccinated at some point around the 5-6 week mark. I don't know the exact date but I know she gives them the first set of shots at or right before 6 weeks - before meaning like, a day or two.


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## Deb (Nov 20, 2010)

If the puppies are under day 6 of iv, then it's not a false positive. I nursed countless puppies through parvo many years ago when I ran the foster care and hot line for two parishes. There is an odor that is unmistakable. You never forget it. The puppies are very sick and it takes quite a while to bounce back if they make it through it. The ones I was able to follow a while were fine as adults. But it all depends on the care they received and how early it was detected. It sounds like this litter was caught early and is getting excellent care. Once the puppies are cleared the vet should be able to run panels and check levels to see how they are doing.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

Deb said:


> If the puppies are under day 6 of iv, then it's not a false positive. I nursed countless puppies through parvo many years ago when I ran the foster care and hot line for two parishes. There is an odor that is unmistakable. You never forget it. The puppies are very sick and it takes quite a while to bounce back if they make it through it. The ones I was able to follow a while were fine as adults. But it all depends on the care they received and how early it was detected. It sounds like this litter was caught early and is getting excellent care. Once the puppies are cleared the vet should be able to run panels and check levels to see how they are doing.


I worked at a vet during one of the largest outbreaks of parvo. The vet(in this case the breeder too)is playing it safe because of the exposure(time frame) They are giving the IV to keep them strong. It is a serious disease and to stay one step ahead to give them the best shot possible, this is a very good proactive way to treat a litter of pups.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

To the original question about risk for ADULT, VACCINATED dogs....

Depending on the strain (there IS a vaccine-resistant strain in circulation), yes, the adults can possibly still get parvo, but it's not the same kind of illness. My experience was that it caused a 48- to 72-hour round of diarrhea and vomiting that self-corrected without the same kind of intensive, critical-care intervention needed for pups. The reason I know this is that we once had an adult parvo carrier (asymptomatic) come out of a shelter into a foster home, and we believe that dog transmitted the vaccine-resistant strain to the foster-family's vaccinated dogs. Their fully vaxed older-adolescent got it the worst (vomiting, diarrhea), and the senior dog had only mild symptoms (maybe loose poop, at most) -- all were OK a few days later.

As for recovery, keep in mind that once this puppy survives the virus and gets clear fecals, you will still have a weakened puppy needing additional nurturing to get strong and healthy. It will be a long road to rebuilding its immune system. It's doable and worth the effort -- it will be a different ownership experience than acquiring a solid, healthy pup though.


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## graciesmom (Jun 10, 2006)

Jazz is a parvo survivor. Picked up her at the breeders at 8 weeks and not five days later tested positive for parvo. So although my case is not exactly the same as yours , it's enough. She survived, but as Magwart said above, the parvo weakened her and it has been a long road rebuilding her immune system. Jazz will be 3 years in approximately two weeks. She's been a challenge in terms of feeding and has major allergies. Is this a result of the parvo? I don't know, but it's possible. 


I think Magwart captured it best .... "keep in mind that once this puppy survives the virus and gets clear fecals, you will still have a weakened puppy needing additional nurturing to get strong and healthy. It will be a long road to rebuilding its immune system. It's doable and worth the effort -- it will be a different ownership experience than acquiring a solid, healthy pup though."


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

@Magwart & @graciesmom - this is my biggest fear. She says her vet is confident they will not have any long-term issues and would have told her that going in. Her vet was confident they were catching it very early, enough to ensure no damaging effects. My vet said that it is different on a dog-to-dog basis, each dog's immune system is going to react differently to parvo and any lingering effects they have will be different. Although he did also say that it is true that the earlier the virus is caught and the better care they receive - the more likely they are to make a full recovery without having any long-lasting damages. It just seems like it's so up in the air at this point. I don't know what to do.


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## CarrieJo (Oct 1, 2016)

llombardo said:


> I worked at a vet during one of the largest outbreaks of parvo. The vet(in this case the breeder too)is playing it safe because of the exposure(time frame) They are giving the IV to keep them strong. It is a serious disease and to stay one step ahead to give them the best shot possible, this is a very good proactive way to treat a litter of pups.





I agree with you hydration is so very important it can mean the difference between life and death. I really think it is good to have extra hydration because when I was breeding birds it was the most important factor along with warmth for a baby bird. Depending on the age of the bird was whether I gave warm water (or very diluted baby food) first and then incubator for warmth if baby was old enough I might just add some water to him/her while leaving him/her with the mom kinda a gut feeling you learn to go with for each situation. I also learned it was always better to have all the babies together because being isolated was harder on the baby and less chance of survival. Friend of mine would if she had to pull a healthy baby by itself she would put a stuffed animal for it to snuggle up to. 

I also learned that even properly medicated antibiotics where not good but probiotics gave the babies a much better chance.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

lalabug said:


> @Magwart & @graciesmom - this is my biggest fear. She says her vet is confident they will not have any long-term issues and would have told her that going in. Her vet was confident they were catching it very early, enough to ensure no damaging effects. My vet said that it is different on a dog-to-dog basis, each dog's immune system is going to react differently to parvo and any lingering effects they have will be different. Although he did also say that it is true that the earlier the virus is caught and the better care they receive - the more likely they are to make a full recovery without having any long-lasting damages. It just seems like it's so up in the air at this point. I don't know what to do.


Do you know if these pups actually have parvo or if they were being treated because of exposure?

I actually brought a stray in a few years ago that had parvo. I did not know it and his new owner covered all the costs. I offered because I felt bad. I had 2 older vaccinated pups that were around the dog and never got it. 

I have also seen the strain where midfle aged dogs got it whether they were vaccinated or not.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

There are no guaranties when you bring a living being into your family. You can pass up a recovered parvo pup because you are worried about lasting effects, only to get a dog that passes away at 2.5 years from bloat, or that gets epilepsy at 2 years, or suffers from EPI. And 12 years from now, you might run into one of the owners of these puppies, and they are still fine. I am not saying that that is what will happen, I am just saying that it could be the case. GSDs will break your heart one day. Some sooner, some later.


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

llombardo said:


> Do you know if these pups actually have parvo or if they were being treated because of exposure?
> 
> I actually brought a stray in a few years ago that had parvo. I did not know it and his new owner covered all the costs. I offered because I felt bad. I had 2 older vaccinated pups that were around the dog and never got it.
> 
> I have also seen the strain where midfle aged dogs got it whether they were vaccinated or not.


I know for a fact that two out of the eight original litter were positive - I think at that point both the vet and the breeder were just immediate in taking the proactive and preventative steps to protect the remainder because of the likelihood that they would be positive. As of now that is all I know. 

I shudder to think that even if other people's dogs are vaxxed - they could possibly get infected by contact with my pup because of the different strains of the virus. That is one of the MAIN reasons we are struggling so much with this... I am with my brother's two adult dogs constantly and because of the amount of people living in proximity to me with dogs... it's such a hard call knowing whether or not if this pup fully recovers will she consistently shed this virus for the rest of her life and possibly infect others?


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

selzer said:


> There are no guaranties when you bring a living being into your family. You can pass up a recovered parvo pup because you are worried about lasting effects, only to get a dog that passes away at 2.5 years from bloat, or that gets epilepsy at 2 years, or suffers from EPI. And 12 years from now, you might run into one of the owners of these puppies, and they are still fine. I am not saying that that is what will happen, I am just saying that it could be the case. GSDs will break your heart one day. Some sooner, some later.


I know and I saw your other post... I am truly so, so sorry for the loss of Mufasa. <3


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## Stevenzachsmom (Mar 3, 2008)

lalabug said:


> I know for a fact that two out of the eight original litter were positive - I think at that point both the vet and the breeder were just immediate in taking the proactive and preventative steps to protect the remainder because of the likelihood that they would be positive. As of now that is all I know.
> 
> I shudder to think that even if other people's dogs are vaxxed - they could possibly get infected by contact with my pup because of the different strains of the virus. That is one of the MAIN reasons we are struggling so much with this... I am with my brother's two adult dogs constantly and because of the amount of people living in proximity to me with dogs...* it's such a hard call knowing whether or not if this pup fully recovers will she consistently shed this virus for the rest of her life and possibly infect others?*


I am certainly not an expert on parvo, but surely survivors don't shed the virus forever. I have never heard of that.

You have to make the decision that is best for you. No one can do that for you. I am in complete agreement with Sue. We are talking about 'life' and there are no guarantees. I accepted a puppy once, with known health issues. Yes, the dog died, when she was 3 1/2 years old. It sucked. I can honestly say I have no regrets. We lived a lifetime together in those 3 1/2 years.

All the best, whatever you decide.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

lalabug said:


> I know for a fact that two out of the eight original litter were positive - I think at that point both the vet and the breeder were just immediate in taking the proactive and preventative steps to protect the remainder because of the likelihood that they would be positive. As of now that is all I know.
> 
> I shudder to think that even if other people's dogs are vaxxed - they could possibly get infected by contact with my pup because of the different strains of the virus. That is one of the MAIN reasons we are struggling so much with this... I am with my brother's two adult dogs constantly and because of the amount of people living in proximity to me with dogs... it's such a hard call knowing whether or not if this pup fully recovers will she consistently shed this virus for the rest of her life and possibly infect others?


No she will not shed the virus forever, a couple weeks once the stool is firm and vomiting stops. They are generally immuned to the disease for the rest of their life. 


You need to find out if the dog that is yours even has it. She might not.you might be worried for nothing.


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## lalabug (Oct 20, 2016)

Annnd we have lost one. One of the male puppies didn't make it. As of now my girl is still doing good, responding to treatment well. Guess we're def not out of the woods yet...


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## CrystalJ (Jul 9, 2016)

My dog had parvo as a puppy (and the rest of his litter died from it) but if it is caught early enough the puppy (assuming it will recover) can live a long and normal life. My dog is fine and his immune system is fine he had parvo when he was just over 8 weeks old and is 11 years now and still going strong. The vet will not release the puppies until they are no longer shedding the virus. 
I would take the puppy home.
You will not spread it to the other dogs in your neighbourhood for a number of reasons
1. you aren't taking a sick puppy home
2. you aren't going to allow other dogs to eat your puppies feces (which is how it is transmitted)
3. you can keep you puppy isolated from other dogs until she is fully recovered (I would wait a month to be safe)

Dogs who have had parvo are good dogs and if it is being treated there is no reason not to take the puppy


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

CrystalJ said:


> My dog had parvo as a puppy (and the rest of his litter died from it) but if it is caught early enough the puppy (assuming it will recover) can live a long and normal life. My dog is fine and his immune system is fine he had parvo when he was just over 8 weeks old and is 11 years now and still going strong. The vet will not release the puppies until they are no longer shedding the virus.
> I would take the puppy home.
> You will not spread it to the other dogs in your neighbourhood for a number of reasons
> 1. you aren't taking a sick puppy home
> ...


Misinformation.
Parvo is spread through direct and indirect contact. Pups with no symptoms can still carry and spread the virus. It is exceedingly rare for adult dogs to ever become symptomatic but they still carry and spread the virus.


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## CrystalJ (Jul 9, 2016)

*Parvo facts*



Sabis mom said:


> Misinformation.
> Parvo is spread through direct and indirect contact. Pups with no symptoms can still carry and spread the virus. It is exceedingly rare for adult dogs to ever become symptomatic but they still carry and spread the virus.


 @Sabis mom I'm a vet tech if the adult/ recovered dogs constantly carried and shed the virus they would be euthanized as they would pose too great of a risk to the population. It is transmitted through ingestion of feces infected with the virus.

I've attached copies of my notes on both types of parvo.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

CrystalJ said:


> @Sabis mom I'm a vet tech if the adult/ recovered dogs constantly carried and shed the virus they would be euthanized as they would pose too great of a risk to the population. It is transmitted through ingestion of feces infected with the virus.
> 
> I've attached copies of my notes on both types of parvo.


You should read you own notes. Old though they may be.
Dog to dog contact. Inhalation. And because it survives outside a host aka hardy in the environment it can easily be transferred into an area by humans.
I did not say dogs that have recovered carry the virus. I said infected non symptomatic dogs are still capable of spreading it.


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

One of my worst fears when I worked with dogs with parvo was bringing it home to my own. I scrubbed my hands all the way up my arms, I changed clothes and shoes before I came home. It is a very easy disease to pick up.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

llombardo said:


> One of my worst fears when I worked with dogs with parvo was bringing it home to my own. I scrubbed my hands all the way up my arms, I changed clothes and shoes before I came home. It is a very easy disease to pick up.


That's the reason I don't put young pups on the vet's office floor. I bring my own rug to put on the table and put it in a plastic bag when done, holding puppy awkwardly under my arm (sorry puppy!).When going back to the car, pup in the crate and I spray my shoes with bleach water, put them in a plastic bag and change shoes. Before I go to the vet with an unvaccinated pup I call to make sure there hasn't been a Parvo dog in the clinic for a while. If it were that case, I would have the pup vaccinated in my car.


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## Shooter (Nov 19, 2016)

selzer said:


> There are no guaranties when you bring a living being into your family. ...... GSDs will break your heart one day. Some sooner, some later.


Your statement just hit me upside the head. I recently lost my GSD AND best friend. Devistating is the only way to describe the loss. Soon to be starting over with a new pup. My wife has asked me and I have ask myself if I can ever do this again. The GSD bond is worth the pain at the end but dang the heartbreak is real.


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## CrystalJ (Jul 9, 2016)

Sabis mom said:


> You should read you own notes. Old though they may be.
> Dog to dog contact. Inhalation. And because it survives outside a host aka hardy in the environment it can easily be transferred into an area by humans.
> I did not say dogs that have recovered carry the virus. I said infected non symptomatic dogs are still capable of spreading it.


Oh I definitely misunderstood what you were saying. I thought you were trying to say recovered adult dogs still carry and spread the virus. For sure dogs can have it an be asymptomatic.

I think we can both agree tho that there is no reason for her not to adopt a recovered puppy once the vet says it is no longer shedding the virus.

And yes if the virus (typically in feces or aerosolized feces) gets on a person it can be easily transmitted which is why the symptomatic puppies are kept in isolation.


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## Sabis mom (Mar 20, 2014)

I would not pay for a parvo pup. 

There can be long term health issues that may or may not be a problem. My Dane suffered from stunted growth and the parvo may or may not have aggravated an existing health issue. 
Kidney issues are common as are other health issues.


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## wolfy dog (Aug 1, 2012)

Sabis mom said:


> I would not pay for a parvo pup.
> 
> There can be long term health issues that may or may not be a problem. My Dane suffered from stunted growth and the parvo may or may not have aggravated an existing health issue.
> Kidney issues are common as are other health issues.


I would forgo on the entire litter even if I was offered the pup for free. There are too many things that can go wrong when you start with a healthy pup even. I wonder if a pet insurance would cover this pup.


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## Pan_GSD (Oct 2, 2016)

hello lalabug,

just checked back to the forum because i was curious about the status of your dog purchase.
it seems that you still haven't come to a decision and the litter's medical condition hasn't improved.

i think you need to make a firm decision and just stick with it
i read every posts on this thread and everyone has different opinions
and since you have a kind heart, you feel guilt and worry about possible infection to other dogs in your family and neighborhood, and also don't want to feel like "abandoning" your new dog

in my opinion, this indecision won't help you even if you end up getting the dog, cured or not
you will constantly be in worry about the virus
in your picture, i don't know if that's your boyfriend or husband, but i would ask him for a final verdict, and just stick with it

my vote is "pass"
whatever your choice may be, good luck to you
and good luck to the remaining pups


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## Pan_GSD (Oct 2, 2016)

wolfy dog said:


> I wonder if a pet insurance would cover this pup.


it would be existing condition so doubt it


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## llombardo (Dec 11, 2011)

I don't see why insurance would not cover a parvo pup. Personally I've never dealt with or known a pup to have issues later on, but even if they did, there is NO WAY to prove anything is caused by the Parvo disease months or years later.


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