# guilt



## SuzyE (Apr 22, 2005)

Jazmin died in may and I still can't think of her w/o crying.I still try and find a way to let go of the guilt of amputating her leg and all the terrible post op we went thru. I feel like I put her thru [heck] Even though I didn't have a choice but to amputate or put her down and I didn't know it would be the worst case scenario I STILL feel guilty. I miss her so much. My ex and my kid don't want to talk about her much. No one knows the horror I went thru alone-sleeping with her in a pool of blood, everything-stuff you guys don't want to know about and NEVER thought I could do. She had 9 great years of being treated like a stuffed animal (seriously she was a DIVA)and six months of cancer and I want to just remember her BEFORE the cancer.
If I could have just one memory w/o crying...Jazmin would be at my side consoling me...these Shepherds want to go for a walk...


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## Kayos and Havoc (Oct 17, 2002)

I am so sorry........


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## onyx'girl (May 18, 2007)

you've had more than your share of pain losing Jazmin and Cesar. I hope in time, the memories will make you smile and laugh out loud from them. 
You should_ not_ feel guilty, you did what was best and you didn't know what the outcome would be. 
The worse thing is, you went thru it alone. 
Cancer sucks to say the least, I hope there will someday be a quick cure so there is no more suffering.


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## LJsMom (Jan 6, 2008)

I'm very sorry. Like Jane said, cancer sucks.


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## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

This is one of the "costs" of having GSD's - the pain of losing them!

it never goes away but time will ease it and the happy memories will remain.


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## JeanKBBMMMAAN (May 11, 2005)

You gave Jazmin the very best chance that you could. She gave you everything she could to stay with you. It should have worked out, it really should have. I would have done the same thing as you did for my dog. 

Do they not want to talk about her because of the last few months? You know we are always here for you. 

I bet she is still at your side, Suzy. I am sure she is thankful for her wonderful life and having had every opportunity she needed. 

I don't know if it will help, because it's an odd source, but an animal communicator I saw said that they want to stay beyond what we often think is their time.


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## Skye'sMom (Jul 11, 2004)

I am one of those who encouraged you to do the amputation - I have a tripod with the original surgery when he was less than 1 week old and a reconstruction at 7 years.

I never in my life would have wished on you what you went through with Jazmin. Her circumstances were so different than any I have heard about.

Every time I see you post, I too feel guilt. I encouraged you based on my dog's recovery. I expected Jazmin to have some discomfort, then continue on for years. 

I am so sorry for what you both went through. We make decisions based on what we feel to be best for our dogs since they can't help themselves.

I don't think you should feel any guilt for your choices for Jazmin based on all you heard of the process. You were so good to her and for her.

I think of you and Jazmin often. I am so, so sorry.


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## middleofnowhere (Dec 20, 2000)

How would you have felt if you had put her down without the amputation? If you were me, you would be wondering if you shouldn't have done that amputation. Hindsight doesn't count. It doesn't tell you what will happen in the future. It just tells you what happened in the past. The odds came out crappy for you.

Right now, I'm still trying to figure out my horse. She recovered (for the most part) from eye surgery but now she's lame on the forehand. We're trying to figure that one out. A 32 year-old mare has incurred a humongous vet bill and it isn't over yet. If I could figure out for sure what's going on with her feet, I would do something else. And we are doing something else anyway but it might not be doing the job. She came out of surgery in fine fettle. Problems developed later. I don't know if she is going to recover with the front end or not. Sure wish I could see the future so I'd know whether to put her down now or keep plugging away. I don't know the future. Maybe I should put her down now. But I'm going to keep trying instead.
The odds might come out crappy for me, too. I don't see any point in beating myself up about it.


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## Sashmom (Jun 5, 2002)

Hi Suzy







I went thru the same guilt thing with Sash. I felt like I had overlooked symptoms but at the time, when I had him out the Vets I was so worried about his ear problems I forgot to ask the Vet I thought he was just getting senile
yes, I wish my last night with Sash couldve been nicer and it took a long time for me to get over how awful it was. But ts been over a year now and I promise you it does get better with time. I can think of Sash and funny stuff he did now and not so much remember the awful end. 
I really think you did at the time what you thought the best for Jazmin. 
All in all, while we had them I think Sash and Jazmin had pretty nice lives and that should make us feel good, Jazmin was a Diva well, Sash was KING around here lol he my heart dog. I think of him all the time.


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## Karin (Jan 4, 2008)

I'm so sorry you're going through this, Suzy. When our last dog died of cancer, we were racked with guilt too. Could we have done more? Should we have done things differently? Should we have let her go sooner? For many months, we couldn't think about her without feeling sad, guilty, and most of all, just missing her like crazy.

But it DOES get better in time. Eventually, we were able to look at her pictures and talk about her, and remember the good times, not the awful feelings of how her life ended.

I'm sorry that you don't have anyone in your family who wants to talk about this. Keep going to the "The Recovery Process" thread here on the forum (I saw that you posted there a few times already). It is such a good place to share your thoughts and feelings with people who really understand and care about what you're going through. 

Be kind to yourself and know that you did what you thought was best for Jazmin. You couldn't predict what would happen. Jazmin had a wonderful life with you, and one day, that's what you'll remember instead of the pain of her last days.


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## SuzyE (Apr 22, 2005)

thank you all so much. This was very hard on my vet also who after 26 yrs of being of vet said "I only read about these kind of scenarios in vet school." he tried and tried and tried and 5 post ops later she died of an infection. It did seem unfair to all of us. I have never met such a kind and caring vet ever-and I have met A LOT of vets. I got an email from someone here encouraging me to look thru life pics of jazmin to remind myself of her life.Let's see... 80% of the pics of her she is in the waterbed, where she loved the most. That's where she died too and a lot of times I think about how I was holding her and saying I love you I love you and how rare it is for ANYONE to die like that.
I know it will get better and God help anyone dealing with the "C" word.
Thanks again folks. and thanks to the Michigan Humane society for finding and saving my little jewel
PS BONNIE, no one could have predicted all that.Please don't feel that you gave me bad advice. I could not put her down at the time of amputation, she was totally normal other than her tumor. i would rather be tortured thru all that and have her die with me.


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## Qyn (Jan 28, 2005)

> Originally Posted By: SuzyE i would rather be tortured thru all that and have her die with me.


I also encouraged you Suzy, and I remember seeing the posts of Jazmin weeing post-op and looking quite comfortable and I was sure everything would be okay. 

I think is normal to feel guilt when anything like this happens but really you are only "guilty" of caring and trying your best for a loved friend. That version of guilt is a badge of honour. You will eventually only remember the wonderful moments of Jazmin's life and realise that despite giving her every chance, Jazmin's illness had weakened her ability to recover and no-one can foresee that result.

Hugs







and please let go of the feelings of guilt - I am certain Jazmin would not want you to carry this undeserved burden.


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## SuzyE (Apr 22, 2005)

It is embarrassing to say this but Jazmin used to console ME during all of this. She was a therapy dog and always had this Florence Nightingale thing going on. So I would be sobbing and she would be patting me on the leg and throwing her head on me. Yeah, Cesar Millan would be proud of all that-NOT. Paige and Travis got walked during that 6 months and that was it, my life centered around Jazmin. Honestly it is no wonder they weren't upset over her passing. I let them in the room to see her and mins later they ran back to the other room to get the cookie on the floor before the other one got it. paige was OVER IT!
Jazmin is ok I know. She told me when it was over.I have to respect that.


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## Ilovealldogs (Nov 17, 2006)

I am so sorry that you're going through this. I too have guilt from making the decision to euthanize my dog in March who was near her natural death due to cancer. I cry often and life has forever changed for me.

You mentioned looking through pictures of Jazmin. Maybe you can make a scrapbook of your favorite pictures of her. I did that of my dog just recently and I am glad I did. It was somewhat painful to look through all the old pictures, but it also helped emotionally.


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## DnP (Jul 10, 2008)

> Originally Posted By: IlovealldogsYou mentioned looking through pictures of Jazmin. Maybe you can make a scrapbook of your favorite pictures of her. I did that of my dog just recently and I am glad I did. It was somewhat painful to look through all the old pictures, but it also helped emotionally.


I did that too after Dakota's passing. It really helped to look through the pictures of him as he grew up and older. I know there were times I cried so hard that I had to push away from the picture for fear of ruining them. But in the end, when I got it done, it was uplifting.

You are on your own timeline for mourning/grieving Jazmin and find that place of peace when you think about her and your decisions. It took me a good two years to get there. I feel badly that you don't have folks in close proximity to help you grieve/talk to. I was lucky enough to have my family and friends to help me through the toughest of times. I recommend you keep posting on the board with your feelings. It helps to talk to folks who have been though similar situations or just folks who understand what you are going through.


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## tuco (Sep 14, 2009)

In my many years with large numbers of dogs, there is one thing I have definitely learned.
Dogs are very receptive. A dog knows what their caretaker feels.

If a dog is being worked or cared for by a person who is just doing it for pay, the dog can feel it.

I guarantee that "Jazmin" knew, and felt just how much she was loved. Even if she was Ill, she still knew you were doing the best for her. She always knew she was loved.

Don't feel guilty for giving "Jazmin" the greatest gift you could bestow.


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## WiscTiger (Sep 25, 2002)

Suzy, Jazmin loved ou and you loved her, that is the most important thing to remember. You know life would be so different if we had a crystal ball to look into to tell us what the future was going to be. But alas we don't so we do the best that we can with the knowledge that we have at the time. Some days life doesn't seem fair. 

I have this that I think about. God gave us these great creatures to take care of, but we feel it is unfair or we are cheated because they are really only with us for a short time of our lives. But god knew that there would be many many more great creatures needing great homes than there are great homes. So really he just loans us these dogs to take care of and then sends us the next one when he feels we are ready.

Val


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

Oh Suzy. It seems that we can't win, doesn't it? If we don't do everything we can, then we lose our beloved dogs. If we do, 99% of the time, everything turns out fine. But sometimes, it doesn't, and we're left looking backward wondering "if only I had done X" but knowing that X wasn't an option either.

I have no answers for you, my friend. I have simply learned what a wise member of this board told me the day after Camper died from unknown complications from surgery: He would not want you to suffer like this. Stop doing this to yourself. 

I knew she was right. And every time I started to excoriate myself, I told myself, this is the last thing Camper would want. He hated it when I cried or was upset. He would have done ANYTHING to stop me from being in this much pain. 

So, I'll tell you the same thing. The last thing Jazmin would want is for you to suffer like this. When you feel the overwhelming feelings start to seep through, remind yourself of that. Repeat it over and over. She was a diva, but she adored you. She would never want you to suffer, especially because of her. 

We can't really understand why bad things happen, especially to good dogs like Cesar and Jazmin. But I do understand that they loved their owner very much, and devoted themselves to making her happy. Live their example for their sake, if not your own.


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## 3K9Mom (Jun 12, 2006)

I''d like to add a caveat to my last post: 

If you really feel like you can't interrupt your thoughts at all -- I mean, if you seriously can't, and you're having nightmares about the blood and such -- then it's possible that you may be experiencing more than grief and guilt, but something significant arising from such traumatic events. In that case, I would suggest speaking to someone with some professional training. 








Suzy. 

You'll remain in my thoughts.


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## LDB158 (Jan 25, 2010)

I share the same feelings that you do, except not under the same circumstances. I feel like I let my baby go too soon or just gave up on her. I put my Trixie down, she also had cancer. But I can't help but stop to think, why couldn't I have tried the medications anyway. I know the vet said they may not have worked because she wasn't eating very much, but maybe I could have given her something she couldn't have resisted to eat. The vet also wanted to put her on something for her seizures, but she wasn't breathing very well, and the medication could have caused her breathing to depress even more. I still wish I would have tried more for her. I feel like I did the right thing ending her suffering, but I just wonder, like I said. I just posted a post in the 'in memory' board too of her. 

I just put her down a couple of days ago, so I am still very very very upset. And now I have tears all over my laptop since I'm thinking about all of this again. It was the hardest decision I have ever made, and I just hope it was the right one. I just keep telling myself she died in my arms, instead of in her sleep not in my arms (which may have happened with her breathing the way she was).


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## SuzyE (Apr 22, 2005)

ahh Speedy's mom, I'm sorry.Myself I have never actually seen a dog live a lot longer with cancer treatment, cancer is really something else. I actually amputated my dog's leg because of cancer. I used to cry in HER arms, seriously.
I think given the info you posted that you did the right thing. The hardest part is to remove the guilt. I don't care how messed up/old a dog is I have never seen a client put a dog down that didn't feel guilty.It just seems to go with the process.
I don't know if you have other dogs but I usually put more energy into them. I had a young dog die of a heart attack a few yrs back and the very day I took my other dog to the dog park.
I still "talk" to Jazmin and apologize to her. I know she is so sick of that. Jazmin was a therapy dog, she hated emotional pain more than anything. I have lost two dogs in very very dramatic waysthat took a huge toll on me. BUT those two dogs lived the best life ever with me. Jazmin was seriously the most spoiled dog ever.
It takes a long time to find peace. It would be so nice if everyone loved their dogs as much as we all do here.


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## LDB158 (Jan 25, 2010)

Suzy, thanks for your response. I'm very sorry for what you had to go through too. I do have another dog, my 5 yo Shepherd. The day I got home, I cried my eyes out with him on the couch. I cried even harder when he got up and was running around the house whining. I think he was trying to find her. I let him sleep in my bed with me the other night, which he's never done before. He prefers sleeping in his crate for some reason. Needless to say, all my attention is going on him.


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## selzer (May 7, 2005)

SuzyE, 

I put Dubya down in January, one year ago. I suffer from guilt as well, but that is because I chose not to put him through a painful surgery and wonder now if I should have done more to prolong his life. 

I remember the posts about your girl. You loved her and gave her your best shot at providing for her medical needs. It just wasn't meant to be. 

But if you had chosen not to amputate, you may very well be feeling guilt now anyway. 

I think that guilt is ok in the sense that it can encourage us not to make the same decision again, but beyond that, it is unhelpful. If you were facing that same scenario with another dog, you may make the same decision, due to the numbers of dogs that improve and have a quality of life afterwards. I may make the same decision again. I don't know. 

Perhaps guilt is just a part of the grieving process. 

I am sorry. Since we do not have a crystal ball, we have to make decisions without knowing the outcome. In hindsight some of these decisions we would have reversed, but that is a shouldve, wouldve, couldve response that keeps us buried in negative feelings. 

I think if you are honest with yourself, you will have to agree that you did what you thought was best for your dog at the time, given the information you had.


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## Bridget (Apr 5, 2004)

I am so sorry for your pain. You did the best you could for her, with the information that you had. Don't beat yourself up. Jazmin was well loved.


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## VegasResident (Oct 4, 2006)

Guilt and pain can never be avoided when you are the one that has to put your baby to sleep. you will always feel that you are too early or too late. You will always question whether you should have done what you did or not have done enough. 

With my dog I questioned whether I was too early with her cancer. She had an inoperable tumor that had swollen up her hind are. Due to immune system issues we did not want to do any surgery because she would experience non healing surgical wounds that would takes months to try and heal. So in this case we preempted what we knew would be great suffering. The opposite of you.

After I had my baby put to sleep, I questioned everything even wishing I had never taken her to the first vet visit where they found the tumor and inflamed it through the examination. I questioned whether I should have tried harder. I questioned whether I should have done this or that. I questioned myself and whether I had made a wrong decision. My heart tore in two wishing I had her back and tried more things, maybe debulking, maybe chemo...maybe maybe maybe. 

As you can see, the guilt can exist no matter which side of the fence you do end up on.

Re-living it over and over can tear you apart. 

What I an trying to say is that no matter what it hurts. No matter what we feel guilt. And that is normal. That is being human.

We kick ourselves for waiting too long or maybe not waiting long enough. We question whether we caused too much suffering or did not allow enough to justify our decision.

There are just a few things that you should always remember:

1. Our dogs, our babies, live in the moment. They do not live for the future or regret the past like humans do. They do not look back and question your decision. The decisions you make are in their best interest and they will love you always no matter what.

2. This is an important one that a counselor told me. Guilt is normal. Good people feel guilt. Only people that do not care do not feel guilt. Know that you are feeling it because you are a good person and you loved your dog more than life.

3. Regret - Regret is normal. For either doing what you did or not doing what you think you should have. 

In the end, recognize you are a human and as such you make human decisions. And because we are human we have the ability to go back and evaluate them. Hindsight is a unique skill set that has a double edged sword and is what creates guilt.

My baby has been gone a little over three months now and though the good days are more than the bad, there are times I wish I could go back and change some of the things I did. But I cant. I have to accept that.

Your baby knows you did what you did because you loved her more than life. She will not hold what happened, what you could not predict, against you. You must do the same.

You need to talk about it, work through it and work to the realization that we are only human and we do for our animals what we think is best. 

They know it, God knows it and some day you will know it.

the pain will get less. Sometimes it will come back and hurt so much. But it will dull. Until then and through that, come here often.


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## ThorDog (Feb 12, 2010)

VegasResident said:


> Guilt and pain can never be avoided when you are the one that has to put your baby to sleep. you will always feel that you are too early or too late. You will always question whether you should have done what you did or not have done enough.
> As you can see, the guilt can exist no matter which side of the fence you do end up on.
> .


I could not have said it better. I don't think we ever stop questioning our decision to put one of our four legged children to sleep. All I can say is time is a healer. Only time can lessen the pain and the nice thing about it is that the good times start to be remembered more than the bad.:hug: huge hugs.


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## SuzyE (Apr 22, 2005)

you guys always have great posts. It IS getting easier. i don't know how many times I told the sky "I'm sorry I was trying so hard to save your life." I don't know if I ever fought anything so hard in my life as i fought that darn cancer.In the end it was an infection that took her.It was a humbling experience to be sure.To anyone dealing with recent dog death or illness my heart is with you.


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## VegasResident (Oct 4, 2006)

SuzyE said:


> you guys always have great posts. It IS getting easier. i don't know how many times I told the sky "I'm sorry I was trying so hard to save your life." I don't know if I ever fought anything so hard in my life as i fought that darn cancer.In the end it was an infection that took her.It was a humbling experience to be sure.To anyone dealing with recent dog death or illness my heart is with you.


Suzy _ I cant tell you how many times I told the sky :im sorry I did not try hard enough to save your life". Maybe I should have done more treatments to extend your life those extra few weeks or months. I tried so hard to keep her from suffering that in the end I felt like I had betrayed her that way. It has taken me a while to realize that she loved me to those last seconds and still does and for me to realize I was a human trying to make a superhuman decision.

How we wish they could tell us when it is okay to stop or when it is okay to continue. But we dont know. I waited too long with my Labrador I had a hose try to run water through her mouth and fed her with a syringe and I had to carry her to my car on her last day. With my Shepherd I was so scared of her suffering from an inoperable tumor that was already swelling and causing pain that I made the decision trying to see the ultimate pain she would be facing and was already in pain and scared.

It would not matter either way. Guilt is a part of loving a being so much that their pain is yours. Loving so much is a part of being someone worthy of taking care of another life, a creature who is dependent on your from start to end.

Over time you will find you tell stories of your baby to others and yes, someday be able to recount the end without collapsing into tears. You will have your private time when you cry in the dark because you miss them so much or that hurt comes back something aweful. This is okay.

If you are spiritual...pray. Sometimes I pray to be able to see my baby in my dreams and many times this is answered and I crunkle her ears like I did in life.

Either way, know you are human, you are okay and we are here for you.


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## Jelpy (Nov 8, 2009)

There is a story that after God had created the Earth and placed mankind in charge of its care. After awhile though, some of the humans went to God and told him that while they were honored, they felt no passion for the job. So God took asked them to take charge of the plants of the earth, to see to the sewing and tending and reaping of them and Mankind took to the job with enthusiasm. But after awhile some of the humans returned and again said that the plants, while beautiful, were not something they could feel close to; and they asked:
 "Is there nothing else that we can watch over?'
God shook his head, only to have one of the humans point excitedly at the animals walking by and ask, 
"What about those? They are so beautiful, and seem noble and good."
God frowned and answered "They are; but unfortunately they are flawed. Their lives will be many times shorter than yours and when they die the pain of their loss will take part of your heart . Are you willing to care for them, knowing such pain will come?'
And the Humans gathered up the animals and said joyfully, "Yes! Such love is worth the price! We agree!"
And God watched them rush off, knowing sadly that until they lost their pets, they would not understand the price. But God took pity on the humans who chose to open themselves to such pain and he granted them a gift. When their pet died, the hole it left in their heart would not remain empty, but would left open to be filled with love from another pet who would come in time. In this way, the more they lost, they more ability to love and be loved they would gain. And thus were they blessed by grief.


Jelpy


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## Burns0716 (Feb 4, 2010)

This brings tears to my eyes.. I am so so sorry for your loss. No one should ever have to go through that..especially alone..however, it is a wonderful memory that you were there for her.. you should always remind yourself of the good. And try to remind yourself that ALL her suffering is gone, which is what we all want for our beloved babies who are in pain. *hugs*


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## VegasResident (Oct 4, 2006)

Jelpy said:


> There is a story that after God had created the Earth and placed mankind in charge of its care. After awhile though, some of the humans went to God and told him that while they were honored, they felt no passion for the job. So God took asked them to take charge of the plants of the earth, to see to the sewing and tending and reaping of them and Mankind took to the job with enthusiasm. But after awhile some of the humans returned and again said that the plants, while beautiful, were not something they could feel close to; and they asked:
> "Is there nothing else that we can watch over?'
> God shook his head, only to have one of the humans point excitedly at the animals walking by and ask,
> "What about those? They are so beautiful, and seem noble and good."
> ...


thank you for this. I know that someday my life and heart will be ready for another little furball and I will again care for the best little creature of God


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