# gsd lunging at other dogs



## jakeleo09 (Jul 27, 2010)

my gsd is 4-5 years old and is a great dog in every way except when she is out on a walk on leash she lunges and barks at other dogs. her heckles go up and she there is no way of distracting her at all. ive tried treats, bottles etc and nothing works. she went to classes and got on well with the other dogs. once she is off leash and with dogs she is fine, no aggression whatsoever but on lead she is like a different dog. anyone know of any way to cure this?
thanks


----------



## debbiebrown (Apr 13, 2002)

i think the key is to catch her before she is reacting in full mode.......watching her body lauguage and getting her focus off the other dog.......once they are in full reacting mode its to late.......
food want work if she is already focusing and lunging at the other dog, etc.

you can set things up slowly at safe threshold distances so both you and the dog have control. it takes alot of time, but something that can be worked with.


----------



## ckat916 (Jun 9, 2010)

Yes, its called a "correction." I know some people don't agree with Leerburgs training methods *BUT* when a dog is aggressive to the pointing of biting I think "physical" corrections is needed. If you aren't willing to do this then you need to walk the other way when another animal is present. 

We took in a 3 year old GSD. We were her 3rd home. She's a great dog, super smart and friendly except with other dogs, especially little ones! When Lucy would see another dog, even from afar, she'd get aggressive and give the evil death stare. When they'd approach closer she would try anything and everything to pull away from me. 

There were a few occasions where she was very close to biting them. We're talking an inch or two. Anyways, I was very lucky her collar stayed on. For awhile if we saw other dogs I'd keep my distance or walk the opposite way. I'd even loop the leash around my dog's neck like a choke collar (groomer taught me that) just incase she got any ideas. 

Anyways, I tried the *"touchy feely"* approach but this was way too *dangerous.* I considered myself to be a capable male adult (former Jarhead and in Law Enforcement), but when this 60 lb dog goes crazy she's like a 180 lb man. So after watching the Leerburg video on Dominant Aggressive Dogs, I gave Lucy a correction just like he did (use the leash and pull her back) I started low, which she totally ignored. I then gave her a 2nd correction at level 7/8 pulling her back a few feet into a down position. She yelped but at that moment I had her instant attention. 

Now where I differ from Leerburg is that I gave her a Reward marker the instant she looked at me and not the other dog. I praised her and showed her I was more interesting than the other dog. I learned this from my obedience trainer *"let the leash be the bad guy not you."* Leerburg says most dog owners won't give a hard correction, but instead just give little annoying ones. He tells you to correct the dogs behavior not to nag the dog. I know people here think his methods are *"mean"* or *"cruel"* but he clearly states that giving a correction higher than necessary is abuse.

With that said Lucy now listens to me. I haven't given her a hard corrections since that one time. I may have to give her a low or medium correction once in awhile (near small dogs) but she quickly remembers to behave. She now enjoys the dog park and plays with my friends dog. She can still get aggressive but now listens to voice commands and will recall. 

Lastly, I never used a choke or prong collar, but not I use a prong collar per the trainer. Tonight at obedience class Lucy decided to go after a little dog, but after she pronged herself (lunging after the other dog) she changed her mind. So really, I didn't have to do anything. 

**Leerburg does warn that some Dominant Agressive Male Dogs can turn on there handler if given a hard corrections and recommends a choke collar or a professional trainer.

Here's a link Leerburg put in the video

http://leerburg.com/pdf/theoryofcorrections.pdf


----------



## debbiebrown (Apr 13, 2002)

it all depends on what kind of dog your working with determining what kind of correction you use in a situation like this........the wrong correction can certainly make things worse........

if your working with a less confident dog other methods need to be used.......


----------



## JakodaCD OA (May 14, 2000)

some dogs are much more reactive ON leash vs OFF leash. 

What I see "going" for you, is she is fine off leash I'd rather have a reactive dog ON leash and a friendly off leash dog. than vice versa.

I agree with debbie in that, you have to anticipate it before it happens, , have you got a friend with a dog (a calm dog) you can practice with? definately turn around and leave, work on getting that focus BEFORE it happens. See if you can define the distance before a reaction sets in,,that distance is your starting point, work on closing that distance with no reactions. If you get a reaction, back up to the point where there is no reaction. 

While I do think corrections have their place, I think you can try working on this other ways first. I would also find someone who has a calm non confrontational dog to walk with ..


----------



## debbiebrown (Apr 13, 2002)

i agree with Diane, you need to work on focus and threshold before harrsh corrections, not working on these things before any harsh corrections is not going to solve the problem.........going right to harsh corrections can definitely backfire with some..i'd rather do a practical positive training approach than use harsh corrections that could immediately make the issue worse........

i also agree that you should find a friend or someone who has a non reactive dog to practice with and walk with, that does wonders..........setting up these types of controlled situations allows you the handler and the dog more success, since you can work in a controlled manner..........


----------



## MaggieRoseLee (Aug 17, 2001)

Great training method just found in a video to TEACH our dog to listen and focus on us before they react:


----------



## jakeleo09 (Jul 27, 2010)

thanks for your replies. i dont see how turning away is helping the problem. i have been on many walks where i have done this and ive walked for miles then had to turn and go all the way back. it just means that she is pulling me backwards to see the other dog all the time and given the chance she would still bark so i dont think its a solution, not for tara anyway.
in the area where i live you are not allowed to have your dog off leash so walking off leash is not an option really unless i drive her away to somewhere else. but really just the short walks in between are driving me nuts. i shall watch the video. i get the feeling she needs a fright to get her to listen as ive tried everything else.


----------



## ccpoisonivy (Aug 7, 2010)

My dog displays dominant/aggressive behavior toward other dogs. I keep her in a heel when we are walking and break her focus on the other dogs (sometimes I still need to put her in a sit and stand with her between my legs, not holding her, just being over her). My behaviorist showed me a safe way to be her dominant (how to put her into a "lay" without being stupid about the amount of force). If a dog has a pack leader, they are psychologically less likely to try to dominate other dogs if their leader has done it first. 

After doing this training, she will watch other dogs while on our walks, and not react unless the other dog is being aggressive/dominant. What are the other dogs doing? Are they staring at her? Are they getting into dominant stances? Is your dog naturally submissive? If so, when off the leash, she has a "flight" option. When you leash her to you, she may feel she only has fight left and that is why she is becoming that way.

Just a few thoughts. With everything I've been through, I've read a ton of books and watched a LOT of different shows. I think you have to tailor your teaching to your dog's issues/personality. My dog wears a prong no-choke collar. Both of them do. They have never had any issues and it helps control them on walks. They figured out that pulling against the lead causes a pinch and not pulling doesn't. Read a lot, figure out what the root issue is and tailor to that.


----------



## London's Mom (Aug 19, 2009)

I have been experiencing the same problem with London now that he is 90 lbs and 20 months old. It is all I can do to hold him back. When I see another dog approaching, I pull him into a driveway, make him "sit/stay" and stand directly in front of him so he is forced to focus on me. I have been having more and more difficulty with him. 

It is SO frustrating because I still have been taking him to Intermediate Dog Obedience once a week. He is perfect in class: knows and performs all commands, plays with the other dogs at the end of class, allows other people to approach him and pet him.

My trainer said that it was a territorial thing going on with him here around our 'hood. Geez, I wish he would chill out. It does help to have him on his gentle leader only because it is the only way I can constrain him when he gets in a frenzy.

My last male GSD was the same way and he NEVER got over this behavior. With London, I have been trying SO hard to make him a "neighborly" GSD. Is it possible, or am I fooling myself????


----------



## Chicagocanine (Aug 7, 2008)

ckat916 said:


> Yes, its called a "correction." I know some people don't agree with Leerburgs training methods *BUT* when a dog is aggressive to the pointing of biting I think "physical" corrections is needed. If you aren't willing to do this then you need to walk the other way when another animal is present.


I would definitely not recommend someone to try Leerburg's type methods on their own (with no trainer) when dealing with aggression issues/leash reactivity! Those type of methods can seriously backfire and result in a dog who is MORE aggressive rather than less. 
These type of methods suppressed the behavior at the time but ultimately caused my GSD to escalate her leash reactivity. She learned to associate seeing other dogs on leash with the prong corrections and became much more reactive as well as losing her confidence. When I removed all physical corrections and instead worked on making positive associations with other dogs and reward for calm behavior, I was able to greatly improve her behavior, rather than suppressing it with corrections (which doesn't change the association or solve the core problem.)


----------



## valb (Sep 2, 2004)

Jake, what kind of treats are you using? I find "high value"
ones work best in this sort of situation. Ones that you don't
let her have any other time. I used little bits of chicken breast,
but whatever your girl goes for would work. Even try bouncing
a tennis ball in front of her, or handing her her favorite squeaky
toy, rope tug, whatever. Make her think you are more interesting
to be concentrating on than the other dog. (That video seems
pretty good ideas, to me!)


----------



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

Years and years ago I tried using physical corrections on a dog that was on-leash reactive to other dogs. I put on a prong collar and started walking him around other dogs. Every time he went off I gave him a correction. I was NOT being touchy-feelly with him - I was giving him increasingly stronger corrections until he became so frustrated he turned and nailed me on the leg.

I learned several things that day. More force is NOT always the best answer and if a dog gets worked up enough they are going to let it out - SOMEHOW.

The key is to NOT let them get worked up.

So, you need to learn your dogs current threshold. How close can other dogs get before she reacts.

Take her out for a walk and when you see another person with their dog approaching you stop and watch YOUR girl.

You are looking for the SUBTLE signs of her getting herself worked up. Tensing the body. Ears going up and forward. Mouth closing.

These things will all happen long before she starts lunging or her hackles go up.

When the SUBTLE signs occur - THAT is her threshold. That is how close she can be to another dog before YOU have to start getting her attention back on you.

Once she is in full red zone - lunging, barking, etc. - the best you can do is get her away from the situation as quickly as possible.

Ok, now you know her threshold - let's say it's about 100 feet. Take her out for a walk and as soon as another dogs get to about 100 feet from her you start working on getting her attention on you.

I'm not talking offering her pieces of her kibble or dry dog bones and telling her to Watch You or any other basic commands.

I am talking high-pitched voice calling her name (Girly! Girly! Girly! Girly!) and laughing. I'm talking stuffing pieces of cooked chicken in her mouth and UBER praising her as she looks away from the dog to you.

I'm talking 'over the top, yes - you'll look like a crazy person, she won't be able to take her eyes off you' attention getting!!

After a few sessions you should be able to tone down your actions and still be able to get her attention on you.

You will be teaching her that when other dogs approach her YOU are going to turn into a treat-dispensing crazy person that is a TON OF FUN!

After more and more sessions you will get to the point where she will pass another dog and look at you and all you need to do is say "Gooood girl!" and keep going.


----------



## Dawn (Jun 23, 2010)

I am having the exact same problem latley with Raven. She knows all her commands..on recall training she is doing fantastic but if a dog goes by when we are walking her watch out all **** breaks loose. I am working with her and using a choke collar now instead of her regular collar. She is great walking otherwise, no pulling etc...just when a dog goes by.
Now what makes it worse is I have a neighbor at the end of my block with 2 large hound mixes, saturday I had just started my walk with Raven and the woman who owns these two hounds comes down around the corner. Her house is on the corner so part of her yard was on the road I was on with Raven and the other part of her yard is on the other street she was originally on. Her one hound starts jumping and barking at Raven and of course Raven goes right back at him. I am doing every command ...leave it..etc.. at this point forget it..because she looks right at me and says I am going this way to get to my driveway and walks within 5 feet of Raven. I could barely hold her back. My neighbor could have gone through her front yard to her driveway and avoided all this but made a nice day out with Raven horrible.


----------



## kwvining (Jun 8, 2009)

ckat916 said:


> Yes, its called a "correction." I know some people don't agree with Leerburgs training methods *BUT* when a dog is aggressive to the pointing of biting I think "physical" corrections is needed. If you aren't willing to do this then you need to walk the other way when another animal is present.
> 
> We took in a 3 year old GSD. We were her 3rd home. She's a great dog, super smart and friendly except with other dogs, especially little ones! When Lucy would see another dog, even from afar, she'd get aggressive and give the evil death stare. When they'd approach closer she would try anything and everything to pull away from me.
> 
> ...


My GSD began showing aggression towards other dogs when on our walks. He never shows it when off-leash, but when he is on leash and sees another dog on leash, especially if they are coming up from behind, he simply wants to kick the other dog's butt. He weighs 110 lbs and was becoming almost uncontrollable even with a prong collar. Our vet said to smack the dog under the chin, pull him up close on the leash, and scold him severely as soon as the early signs of coming aggression were seen. It has worked beautifully. I hate the idea of hitting the dog, but when even leash corrections don't work, there isn't much left in the arsenal. But it worked surprisingly good. We had one "session" using this technique, and now, he goes on alert when other dogs approach, but now he doesn't go into aggressive mode.


----------



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

kwvining said:


> Our vet said to smack the dog under the chin, pull him up close on the leash, and scold him severely as soon as the early signs of coming aggression were seen.


I'm sorry but your vet is an idiot.

That is a good way to risk having your dog redirect to YOU.

There is NO good reason to use physical force when redirection works just as well and runs NO risk of the dog biting you.


----------



## kwvining (Jun 8, 2009)

Your method of second guessing the dog's behavior seems to me like it leaves open the possibility that the dog will attack someone if they come up on you at a moment that you are unaware of their approach. Since this worked, and the dog has stopped acting this way entirely after only one severe scolding, I would say my idiotic vet gave me a method that worked. I'll take good results any day. BTW, our "vet" is a zoologist who is a professor at Texas A&M, and a very accomplished individual who just finished a long career at NASA before going into academia, hardly an idiot. Aggressive behavior is an utterly unacceptable situation, and that it is unacceptable, has to be communicated to the dog in a clear manner.


----------



## gsdraven (Jul 8, 2009)

Nothing about the credentials you listed for your "vet" make him/her a credible dog behaviorist. So while this person may be an intelligent individual, they still are still an idiot for telling you to use agression to correct aggression. It's just not going to work long term and is a good way to have the dog redirect its aggression at you.


----------



## trish07 (Mar 5, 2010)

kwvining said:


> My GSD began showing aggression towards other dogs when on our walks. He never shows it when off-leash, but when he is on leash and sees another dog on leash, especially if they are coming up from behind, he simply wants to kick the other dog's butt. He weighs 110 lbs and was becoming almost uncontrollable even with a prong collar. Our vet said to smack the dog under the chin, pull him up close on the leash, and scold him severely as soon as the early signs of coming aggression were seen. It has worked beautifully. I hate the idea of hitting the dog, but when even leash corrections don't work, there isn't much left in the arsenal. But it worked surprisingly good. We had one "session" using this technique, and now, he goes on alert when other dogs approach, but now he doesn't go into aggressive mode.


Sorry to tell you this, but I think your vet is stupid and should continu to be a vet instead of trying to be a behaviorist.

How do you think your dog interprete your act? To him, each time he sees another dog = getting punch. Does it help him to feel comfortable around other dogs on leash? Not sure....there is nothing fun to him.

You are lucky he didn't redirect his agression on you....

I don't blame you though...you asked for help, but unfortunatly you didn't get the proper one.

Phenix was doing exactly the same. At first, we used the Cesar Millan's method, which was to touch the dog when you notice the first signs of agression (ex. hackles up). The only thing it did was to accentuate the fear and anxianty, it was worst than ever.

Than, we met our behaviorist who show us how to manage Phenix without physical corrections.

She used threats and play. You need to be patient with this. Your dog aint gonna change the next day.

Each time Phenix was barking at an other dog, we were changing direction and tried to pass near the dog again, and again, and again. As soon as he was showing relaxation or good behave, we were rewarding him with threats or by play. For some dogs, threats aren't important enough to use in those situations, but each dog loves to play  You need to distract him as soon as he shows signs, it shows him that other dogs arent dangerous, that it is fun to meet new dogs. New dog = threats or = play.

If you made a situation like this uncomfortable to your dog, he will probably never change his mind toward other dogs.


----------



## JudynRich (Apr 16, 2010)

Mia was having the same problem and we nearly resolved it with "look at me" and treats...now Bella has started this and pack mentality set it. Last week the two of them lunged at a little dog (also on leash). They were horrible and it must of looked awful this 5 foot lady holding back these two GSDs...luckily it was a neighbor who knows we are working on this with both dogs...Bella will be a tough case since she is not treat driven.


----------



## pac liter (Jul 22, 2010)

Some people think that the entire world should adopt their solution, just because it worked for their situation. Their solution conforms to their views of the world/mother-nature and makes them feel good about themselves.

They resort to name calling if somebody has different results or disagrees. 

They feel so stronly self righteous, they believe they can resolve any dog aggression issues over the internet. 

After all they have owned 10 family pet dogs in their life time; they must know everything about dogs. 


If you have a red zone aggressive dogo argentino that has tasted blood and prefers it to anything on earth, simply redirect their aggression with praise/play/ and food. It will work 100% and they will eventually be safe around new bornes. 

After all man created the problem and only pure positive training can correct it. 

Now all joking aside, what if it doesn't work? Pure positive rhetoric will only carry you so far, especially when a dog is headed for an early departure. I think most sensible dog owners would prefer this approach. Problem is that it is not effective for every situation. 

Everybody jumped on the guy's vet, for the chin slap technique, when it worked. What he tried pure positive redirection and it didn't work. Should he just have put his dog to sleep?


----------



## Lauri & The Gang (Jun 28, 2001)

pac liter said:


> Some people think that the entire world should adopt their solution, just because it worked for their situation. Their solution conforms to their views of the world/mother-nature and makes them feel good about themselves.


No. *I* just happen to think that a person should start with the LEAST aversive method of training when working with a dog.

It might not work but it sure won't HURT anything (like the dog).



pac liter said:


> They resort to name calling if somebody has different results or disagrees.


No. *I* said their vet was an idiot because they WERE an idiot. I will retract my comment if they tell me that the vet has a degree in animal behavior AND spent at least a couple hours observing their dog IN the environment where the reactions occur.



pac liter said:


> They feel so stronly self righteous, they believe they can resolve any dog aggression issues over the internet.


No. *I* gave a method of WORKING with the dog - not curing it. I don't think anyone here ever claimed "THIS will cure your dog of their aggression."



pac liter said:


> After all they have owned 10 family pet dogs in their life time; they must know everything about dogs.


Actually, many of the people on this board are VERY 'advanced' dog owners. Some that train dogs for LEO, some that breed and train for Schutzund or SAR.



pac liter said:


> If you have a red zone aggressive dogo argentino that has tasted blood and prefers it to anything on earth, simply redirect their aggression with praise/play/ and food. It will work 100% and they will eventually be safe around new bornes.


So far NONE of the examples posted in this thread were THAT bad.

If anyone had a dog like the one you described and they had been to a qualified behaviorist AND followed their protocol and still had issues - I would either suggest never taking the dog off their own property and never allowing anyone to come onto their property OR I would advise euthanizing the dog.



pac liter said:


> After all man created the problem and only pure positive training can correct it.


No-one here said that ONLY positive methods would fix the problem.

But why start with a sledgehammer when a regular old hammer might just do the job as well? And it will not cause any more problems if it doesn't and you DO need the sledgehammer. What have you wasted? Just a bit of your time.



pac liter said:


> Now all joking aside, what if it doesn't work? Pure positive rhetoric will only carry you so far, especially when a dog is headed for an early departure. I think most sensible dog owners would prefer this approach. Problem is that it is not effective for every situation.




No, it's not 100% guaranteed to work for all dogs. But it * doesn't hurt to try it first*.

If someone tried the method I suggested, TRULY tried it and it failed - I would then suggest they get a qualified behaviorist to observe them and their dog to determine what WOULD work. 
 


pac liter said:


> Everybody jumped on the guy's vet, for the chin slap technique, when it worked.




I will never EVER advise anyone for ANY reason to use their hands on their dog for anything punitive. Dogs should never have to FEAR the human hand - period.




pac liter said:


> What he tried pure positive redirection and it didn't work. Should he just have put his dog to sleep?


Actually - he never mentioned WHAT he tried before taking his vets advise (other than collar corrections).


----------



## oldno43 (Feb 13, 2010)

When I first started working with dogs 30yrs ago in the service we were quite heavy handed with correction. Over the years I have met with other trainers and have seen many methods all much less physical than the way I was taught. That said Take a look at yourself as other animals approach, do you get tense from the anticipation of "What you expect to happen" most handlers once a dog lunges tend to prepare for trouble they shorten up on the leash pulling the dog close to their sides thus putting the dog on alert. Find a trainer who is willing to work with you in controled situations, often people he may have helped in the past I don't think it's ever too late to make these corrections but it will take time and "Consistancy" on your part. Just my opinion.


----------



## codmaster (Aug 5, 2009)

I feel your pain. Baron, our 2 1/2 yo male GSD, also sometimes will act up with other dogs when we are out - sometimes he does and sometimes he doesn't hardly notice other dogs. Usually in his case it is big male dogs or dogs who act aggressively (little terriers usually) who will trigger his response. We are working with an animalbehaviorist and i think it is getting better. basically what she recommended was to walk toward the other dog until you can see a reaction (ears go forward, mouth closed and generally he "tightens" up, at that point before he actually reacts with a bark, growl or lunge you turn him and get his attentionand give him a treat or two or three. Then once he is back under control you turn him and start back toward the other dog and repeat it over and over as many times as you can.

Seems to wotk as he is getting better but slowly.

I would reccomend that you see if you can get to see a real dog behaviorist.


----------



## JudynRich (Apr 16, 2010)

(!) I watched the little video on page one of this thread and thought it was worth a shot. Success! I used chopped up beef hot dogs and both Mia and Bella did great. We saw a new dog this morning and we left the path and went out about 20 feet on the grass and started the "surprise game"...even little "treat-resistant" Bella went for it. Mia looked up once at the other dog, but went back to looking for the treat when I said "surprise"!


----------



## EchoGSD (Mar 12, 2010)

I'm working with a vet behaviorist for Echo on this issue...she said it was important to determine the type of aggression being demonstrated: is it dominance aggression or fear aggression? The handling of the two types of aggression is very different...a fearful dog may become more fearful (and more unpredictable) with corrections, but a dominant aggressive dog may not respond well to anything other than a clear show of leadership. Good Luck; I know I'll need it as I try to get Echo's behavior under control.


----------



## Kriller (Aug 11, 2010)

My now 11 month old GSD used to have the same exact problem. Completely harmless but she looked and sounded very scary. Ive come to realize a lot of people are really freaked out my GSDs. Well where I live nearly every dog on the trails are off leash so it got to be very stressful taking her on them. I contacted a trainer near me that uses e-collar training and now she is a happy, mostly off-leash pup! E-collar (when used correctly!!!!) is very effective and POSITIVE training tool that I have had a lot of success with. Unfortunately a lot of the dogs where I live have absolutely no manners (no thanks to the freakin owners) and will rush her and get in her face. When I see a dog approaching I instantly have her heel but these dogs will rush her which she doesn't like, understandingly. Sometimes she'll still bark but I tell her off and she will hush up pretty quick. Nothing like when I had her on a prong collar and she would lunge and bark uncontrollably. I really don't understand why people let their dogs rush up to strange dogs like that. You don't know how they are going to react.


----------



## Ucdcrush (Mar 22, 2004)

EchoGSD said:


> I'm working with a vet behaviorist for Echo on this issue...she said it was important to determine the type of aggression being demonstrated: is it dominance aggression or fear aggression? The handling of the two types of aggression is very different...a fearful dog may become more fearful (and more unpredictable) with corrections, but a dominant aggressive dog may not respond well to anything other than a clear show of leadership. Good Luck; I know I'll need it as I try to get Echo's behavior under control.


So, which does Echo have? If it's dominance aggression, how will it be treated?

I have read on another forum that a guy let the dog lunge, whilst wearing a prong collar, and when he lunged, the owner grabbed the leash firmly and gave a crank and a "leave it" command. Apparently that strong correction worked for him, and his dog no longer thinks of lunging as a pleasant option.

And anyone who has read Koehler has read about a dog who lunged at other dogs, he was allowed to lunge, but the handler would go the other way swiftly, which corrected the dog for lunging and taught it to keep an eye on the owner.

I'm curious about leash frustration, which it seems can be separate from aggression (dominance or fear or whatever). The dog wants to approach the other dog, and whines/lunges towards it. It seems that if the lunging or other wild display of the dog is NOT due to fear, a correction may be OK.

Even fearful dogs can make the association between a behavior like lunging and an unpleasant result, which should decrease lunging.


----------



## EchoGSD (Mar 12, 2010)

With Echo it's definitely fear aggression. She's always been a submissive dog, but always calm and collected. I could (and did) take her everywhere. Recently in her training class there have been a few really aggressive dogs; I first noticed her anxiety building in the training gym. From there it has escalated (thanks to my inaction) into her growling and going on the offensive whenever she's in a situation where she can't leave (like on leash, or in a class, or at a social gathering with other dogs, etc.). We're working on counter-conditioning to build her confidence, lots of Jolly Routine to distract before anxiety heightens, and then eventually some desensitization if all goes well. She's still really sweet and mostly trustworthy, so we're tying to get this under control before the negative responses become ingrained behavior.


----------



## SusiQ (Jul 27, 2007)

My Raven also behaves like this on lead. If I see that she notices another dog approaching and her body language begins to change, I immediately shorten the lead and give her a command to "leave it!" I will repeat this once or twice, and she usually responds positively; however, if she does not, I do give her a leash correction (I use a prong collar on walks) - VERY rarely have I had to give her more than a mild correction. It does seem to work for her.


----------



## fgshepherd (Sep 1, 2010)

Dawn, I really feel your pain about the neighbor who could have walked away with her dog and saved you the grief. I recently adopted a GSD who has had no formal training. I'm training him at night, trying to avoid other dogs for now, and this man with two large dogs saw us training (it was obvious we weren't just strolling in the cul-de-sac) and my dog flipped out, i'm holding him back, so this guy comes even CLOSER with his two giant dogs! Uggghhhh....some people!!!


----------



## Rastasdad (Sep 26, 2010)

*Corrections backfiring*

I have the same problesm with my 20 month old, Rasta. She is completely fine in a dog park - never a problem. She seems a little submissive even. But on the leash - holy moly - especially early in the walk, if we encounter another dog she goes nuts. I have a prong collar and the corrections don't really work. She's a different dog and she simply cannot control herself. Corrections get some recognition but its not even close to solving the problem. In fact, when she is in this mode and I get in front of her to try to obstruct her vision she has taken some snaps at me. So I'm going to us the cooked chicken and over-the-top praise approach at first sign of reactive response. She loves chicken more than anything so I'm optimistic.

My only question is do you use the same approach if you want to stop your dog from barking when other dogs walk by the house? I have that problem too, and its just as bad as if I was walking her. Today she actually got out when two other big white dogs were walking by and she got aggressive with those dogs- I guess you would call it fighting, though no one was hurt and when I got out there (10 seconds later) she stopped and came to me immediately. I verbally scolded her and she looked at me with those beautiful eyes, put her ears down, and said "I'm sorry Daddy". She didn't really talk, but you know what I mean.  Do I give her chicken in this scenario too when she starts barking and goes nuts at a passing dog? 

Thanks!
John


----------



## Melina (Feb 20, 2010)

kwvining said:


> My GSD began showing aggression towards other dogs when on our walks. He never shows it when off-leash, but when he is on leash and sees another dog on leash, especially if they are coming up from behind, he simply wants to kick the other dog's butt. He weighs 110 lbs and was becoming almost uncontrollable even with a prong collar. Our vet said to smack the dog under the chin, pull him up close on the leash, and scold him severely as soon as the early signs of coming aggression were seen. It has worked beautifully. I hate the idea of hitting the dog, but when even leash corrections don't work, there isn't much left in the arsenal. But it worked surprisingly good. We had one "session" using this technique, and now, he goes on alert when other dogs approach, but now he doesn't go into aggressive mode.



Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've heard that when using physical corrections as such on a dog, they may learn to "hide the warning signs" (Staring, slow swish of the tail, growling, barking, etc.) and then you're left with a loaded canon that may go after another dog without any notice? I'm sure it's easier to see this as a result of those physical corrections off leash, but would it not be the same principal even on? Suppose you were to assume the aggressive behavior had been eliminated, approached another dog on a walk, then found out your dog was just hiding their initial signs of fear? Could be a very bad situation...


----------

