# Question about appropriate calcium level for 9 1/2 Weeks GSD



## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

I have a 9 and a 1/2 weeks old female german shepherd puppy, she is very active and healthy, Some people suggested that calcium is good for puppies, so yesterday I bought "Beaphar Bone Builder" powder for her, which contains Calcium and Phosphorus. My question is does my puppy really need this "Beaphar Bone Builder" powder?

This is her diet (mostly)
Morning - 1 cup Pedegree Puppy with small cooked fishes + 5 grams of "Canny Boost"
Noon - 1 cup Rice with small cooked fishes
Evening - 1 Vitamin B plus E tablet
Night - 1 cup Rice with small cooked fishes

I read almost all of the threads (Feeding Puppies, Does my puppy really need calcium tabs, etc...) about calcium diet still no clue, can I give here a small amount of "Beaphar Bone Builder" powder daily? I wanted some opinion regarding this. Please guide me through


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

She needs to be eating kibble for every meal.The fish is a good idea,but the rice doesn't have much in the way of nutrients for her.The kibble has sufficient calcium already.


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

dogma13 said:


> She needs to be eating kibble for every meal.The fish is a good idea,but the rice doesn't have much in the way of nutrients for her.The kibble has sufficient calcium already.


Kibble not available in Sri lanka.I just want to know, can i add small amount of Bone Bbuilder with the food?


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## Bearshandler (Aug 29, 2019)

It would be easier to say if you posted the foods actual foods. When you say pedigree puppy I think of kibble. 1 to 2 percent calcium is ideal If I remember correctly. I’d be careful adding calcium supplements since that can cause issues as well.


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## dogma13 (Mar 8, 2014)

I'm afraid I don't have much knowledge about home cooked diets.Hopefully someone can chime in that does.1%-2% calcium is correct.More protein in the diet would be good also some green vegetables.Eggs with the shells are a good source of protein and calcium if you can get them.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

I would just feed the Pedigree puppy food that you have, with some extra fishes -- no supplements needed as it's already complete and contains calcium. The key for puppies is the calcium-to-phosphorus ratio, and the ratio is already correct in a food meeting nutritional regulations in the U.S. or Europe if you are feeding the appropriate amount daily for its weight (on the back of the bag). If you add calcium, the ratio will no longer be correct, and you will be feeding an imbalanced diet (and invite problems with your puppy's growth). Puppy nutrition is something that I wouldn't play with -- a decent food is your best insurance that you have the nutrients covered.


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

Bearshandler said:


> It would be easier to say if you posted the foods actual foods. When you say pedigree puppy I think of kibble. 1 to 2 percent calcium is ideal If I remember correctly. I’d be careful adding calcium supplements since that can cause issues as well.


Here I attached the pedigree puppy food,


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

dogma13 said:


> I'm afraid I don't have much knowledge about home cooked diets.Hopefully someone can chime in that does.1%-2% calcium is correct.More protein in the diet would be good also some green vegetables.Eggs with the shells are a good source of protein and calcium if you can get them.


Thank you


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

Magwart said:


> I would just feed the Pedigree puppy food that you have, with some extra fishes -- no supplements needed as it's already complete and contains calcium. The key for puppies is the calcium-to-phosphorus ratio, and the ratio is already correct in a food meeting nutritional regulations in the U.S. or Europe if you are feeding the appropriate amount daily for its weight (on the back of the bag). If you add calcium, the ratio will no longer be correct, and you will be feeding an imbalanced diet (and invite problems with your puppy's growth). Puppy nutrition is something that I wouldn't play with -- a decent food is your best insurance that you have the nutrients covered.


I can't afford Pedigree puppy food"" for 3 times a day. thats why i'm feeding her with the fish. I can buy whole 2 weeks of fish for just $1.


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## Magwart (Jul 8, 2012)

Pedigree Puppy is formulated to provide all the nutrients a growing puppy needs when fed at a certain amount (the ration recommended on the back of the bag). If you feed less than that, your pup will be getting less of some of the micronutrients and minerals, even if you feed it enough carbohydrates and protein (rice and fish) -- so it will likely have a deficient diet. 

Formulating a homemade diet for a growing pup is VERY difficult. It's even hard for adult dogs. There's a recipe generator run by a university veterinary nutritionist in the U.S. called BalanceIT.com that looks at ingredients for ADULT dogs (they do not formulate recipes for puppies). Just for fun, I put in 2 kinds of fish (fresh water catfish and ocean cod), white rice, and a few common fruits and vegetables that might perhaps be available in Sri Lanka.

It generated the following but noted that there are still 11 nutrient deficiencies even with all of this! All of this STILL requires buying the supplement from BalanceIt.com to solve the 11 nutrient deficiencies for an ADULT -- and it's STILL not enough for a growing puppy!

I don't want you to use this recipe. I just want to illustrate how much is required to formulate a home-made diet for a dog -- ALL of this was what they come up with to get it CLOSEST to complete, so that adding their supplement would make it "enough." Without their supplement, it's not enough (and their supplement is fairly expensive). 

Example of an INCOMPLETE adult diet that requires adding supplementation:

(12)Balance IT® Canine (2.5 g/tsp)15.6 g6 1/4teaspoon



(1)Fish, catfish, channel, farmed, cooked, dry heat102.8 g3 5/8oz(2)Fish, cod, Pacific, cooked, dry heat (may have been previously frozen)170.1 g6oz(3)Rice, white, long-grain, regular, cooked (BalanceIT.com)217.2 g1 3/8cup(4)Butter, without salt21.3 g1 1/2tbsp(5)Oil, soybean, salad or cooking16.3 g3 5/8tsp(6)Carrots, raw15.2 g1/8of a cup strips or slices(7)Peas, green, cooked, boiled, drained, without salt20.0 g1/8of a cup(8)Spinach, cooked, boiled, drained, without salt45.0 g1/4of a cup(9)Peppers, sweet, green, raw34.5 g3/8of a cup, sliced(10)Mangos, raw20.6 g1/8of a cup pieces(11)Bananas, raw18.8 g1/8of a cup, sliced


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

The diet your puppy is on is VERY unbalanced. You can't just add bone powder or egg shells. Egg shells are not a complete source of calcium and minerals. I used egg shells for a dog that had kidney failure because there is no phosphorus. 

If you continue with this diet you will have a puppy with malformed bones. 

Here are the guidelines for the United STates for dog food.


https://www.aafco.org/Portals/0/SiteContent/Regulatory/Committees/Pet-Food/Reports/Pet_Food_Report_2013_Midyear-Proposed_Revisions_to_AAFCO_Nutrient_Profiles.pdf



You can see the percentage for growing dogs. But then you have to factor in yours is a large breed dog so adjust the calcium/phosphorus ratio accordingly. Balancing a diet isn't easy. I would suggest you figure out how to afford to feed your dog a good food while you research how to create a balanced meal from foods you can afford. Because if you can't afford to feed yoru dog, you sure can't afford the vet bill to fix the messed up leg bones from a poor diet.


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

Magwart said:


> Pedigree Puppy is formulated to provide all the nutrients a growing puppy needs when fed at a certain amount (the ration recommended on the back of the bag). If you feed less than that, your pup will be getting less of some of the micronutrients and minerals, even if you feed it enough carbohydrates and protein (rice and fish) -- so it will likely have a deficient diet.
> 
> Formulating a homemade diet for a growing pup is VERY difficult. It's even hard for adult dogs. There's a recipe generator run by a university veterinary nutritionist in the U.S. called BalanceIT.com that looks at ingredients for ADULT dogs (they do not formulate recipes for puppies). Just for fun, I put in 2 kinds of fish (fresh water catfish and ocean cod), white rice, and a few common fruits and vegetables that might perhaps be available in Sri Lanka.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the very brief explanation about the diet plan. now only I Understood, still i'm doing research on how to met the balanced homemade diet. BalanceIT.com website is very helpful though. Thanks again


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

Jax08 said:


> The diet your puppy is on is VERY unbalanced. You can't just add bone powder or egg shells. Egg shells are not a complete source of calcium and minerals. I used egg shells for a dog that had kidney failure because there is no phosphorus.
> 
> If you continue with this diet you will have a puppy with malformed bones.
> 
> ...


I understand, most of the people (90%) in my country feed their dog with 100% homemade food. its very usual here in Sri Lanka. I feed my puppy three times a day (one time puppy food and 2 times homemade food). The info you shared here is very useful, I really appreciate it. I do my best to feed my puppy with the balanced food.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Esme said:


> I understand, most of the people (90%) in my country feed their dog with 100% homemade food. its very usual here in Sri Lanka. I feed my puppy three times a day (one time puppy food and 2 times homemade food). The info you shared here is very useful, I really appreciate it. I do my best to feed my puppy with the balanced food.


Make a spreadsheet. You can use the USDA site to pull nutritional info for most foods. 


FoodData Central



Search for the food you want, for example "green beans fresh" or "green beans frozen" "sardines raw" "beef heart raw"

And a list will come up where you can download spreadsheets with all the data. You will need to do a conversion on the "serving" size to Oz or grams (whichever you use) to input into your spreadsheet.

Once you have the diet close to the guidelines, then you need to find the deficiences and order supplement. I use a coffee grinder. Just toss in the capsules and grind, then put there a small strainer to catch the capsule pieces. Figure out how much to give per day and add it to the food. It might be easier to make a week's worth of food up and mix it all together.


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## R_i_c_k_y (May 19, 2020)

im feeding my 4 month old pup 2 times royal canin maxi puppy 
and one time homemade food (white rice and chicken breast) and still i think the deit is imbalanced 
so i add 5ml of calcium and phosphorus tonic in correct ratio with homemade food

can someone suggest some homemade food so that i can remove the supplements


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

R_i_c_k_y said:


> im feeding my 4 month old pup 2 times royal canin maxi puppy
> and one time homemade food (white rice and chicken breast) and still i think the deit is imbalanced
> so i add 5ml of calcium and phosphorus tonic in correct ratio with homemade food
> 
> can someone suggest some homemade food so that i can remove the supplements


Please make your own threads so the OP can get the information they asked for.


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## Jax08 (Feb 13, 2009)

Esme said:


> I understand, most of the people (90%) in my country feed their dog with 100% homemade food. its very usual here in Sri Lanka. I feed my puppy three times a day (one time puppy food and 2 times homemade food). The info you shared here is very useful, I really appreciate it. I do my best to feed my puppy with the balanced food.



When you start figuring out the diet, make sure you don't just add veges/leafy greens without paying attention to the nutrients. For instance, spinach is high in Vit A and calcium. And I've found that diets taht do 80% meat/10% bone /10% organ meat are wayyyyyy to high in Vit A, Calcium and phosphorus. Bone has a LOT of phosphorus in it. You can order straight bone meal to mix with meat to get the right calcium/phos ratio. This really isn't hard, you just have to pay attention.


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## Esme (Jul 6, 2020)

Jax08 said:


> When you start figuring out the diet, make sure you don't just add veges/leafy greens without paying attention to the nutrients. For instance, spinach is high in Vit A and calcium. And I've found that diets taht do 80% meat/10% bone /10% organ meat are wayyyyyy to high in Vit A, Calcium and phosphorus. Bone has a LOT of phosphorus in it. You can order straight bone meal to mix with meat to get the right calcium/phos ratio. This really isn't hard, you just have to pay attention.


Too much of info i'm getting from this thread specially from you. Thank you very much, currently I'm creating a diet chart for my puppy girl.


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